Speaker 1: Today we're plunging into well, one of the most persistent
and frankly wild narratives out there in the secret space program.
Speaker 2: World Project Pegasus.
Speaker 1: Exactly, Project Pegasus, and these truly astonishing claims from Andrew
Bassiago about time travel. Just picture this for a second.
You're six years old. Suddenly you're not in your own
time anymore. You're transported over one hundred years into the past.
You find yourself standing in this muddy field, soldiers around civilians,
and you're about to witness one of history's most iconic
speeches firsthand.
Speaker 2: It sounds like science fiction, doesn't it. But this is
just one piece of a much bigger puzzle. We're looking
at today. Claims of a secret government program making this possible,
not just for one kid, but supposedly for many, sending
them through time even believe it or not, to other planets.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a lot. So our mission today is to
really take a deep dive into this whole collection of accounts, reports, investigations, yeah,
all detailing this alleged gleandestine project supposedly.
Speaker 2: Born out of this desperate technological race, right, We're going
to explore its alleged origins. These startling experiments they supposedly.
Speaker 1: Ran, and the totally mind bending claims from the people
who say they were part of it.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and crucially, we need to critically examine the evidence
or lack thereof, and the counter arguments presented in the
sources we've looked at.
Speaker 1: Right, The goal here is to help you navigate these
frankly astonishing claims and try to figure out what, if anything,
actually stands up to scrutiny.
Speaker 2: So where do we start? Not in some high tech lab,
funnily enough.
Speaker 1: No, we start in a hotel room, New York City,
nineteen forty three.
Speaker 2: That's right, January seventh, nineteen forty three, Nicola Tesla. I
mean everyone knows the name visionary, inventor genius.
Speaker 1: Size alone, Room three three, twenty seven, New Yorker hotel.
Speaker 2: And what happens next is key to this whole narrative.
Within hours of his death, government agents FBI reportedly they
seal the room.
Speaker 1: They confiscate everything. Yeah, eighty boxes apparently packed with his ideas,
his inventions, decades of research gone.
Speaker 2: There's the twist, or the claimed twist, when Tesla's belongings
were supposedly returned to his family later twenty of those
boxes were allegedly.
Speaker 1: Missing, vanished, and adding fuel to that fire. The f
mits to this day admits it holds classified Tesla documents
they won't release.
Speaker 2: So the theory goes, these missing files may be containing
revolutionary tech. They supposedly became the seed for dozens of
black projects over the next fifteen years.
Speaker 1: We're talking weather modification, directed energy, even mind control tech. Yeah,
all supposedly stemming from these lost Tesla papers.
Speaker 2: Now, let's layer in the historical context mid century America, right,
there was this feeling of technological superiority. We had the bomb,
the transistor.
Speaker 1: We thought we were unbeatable scientifically speaking.
Speaker 2: Until nineteen fifty seven October.
Speaker 1: Fourth Sputnik, that little metal ball circling the Earth.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the size of a beach ball, launched by the Soviets.
The shock, the humiliation here in the US, it was.
Speaker 1: Immense because if they could put that in orbit, they could.
Speaker 2: Put a nuclear warhead anywhere on Earth. That was the fear,
a very real fear.
Speaker 1: President Eisenhower didn't waste any time.
Speaker 2: Nope, swift response. He creates ARPA Advanced Research Projects Agency
later becomes DARPA, and their job simple mandate prevent any
more technological surprises like Sputneck stay ahead of the Soviets
no matter the cost, and the funding was essentially unlimited.
Speaker 1: A blank check. But even with all that money and
brain power, the US was still apparently losing the space race.
Speaker 2: By the early sixties, the Saturn rocket program, the one
meant to get us to the Moon, was years behind schedule.
In sixty three, desperation starts creeping in, and.
Speaker 1: This is where the story loves back to Tesla. The
claim is that DARPA scientists, looking for an edge, any edge,
started digging deep into those confiscated files, again.
Speaker 2: Hoping for some forgotten genius, some breakthrough, and according to
these accounts, in nineteen sixty eight, they hit the jackpot.
Speaker 1: They supposedly found plans for a teleportation device based on Tesla's.
Speaker 2: Which leads us straight into Project Pegasus and the supposed
location for all this.
Speaker 1: Yeah, get this the basement of the Curtis Right building
in Woodridge, New Jersey. But not just any basement.
Speaker 2: Level, no, apparently one floor deeper than any of the
official blueprints showed a hidden sub basement.
Speaker 1: So picture this space, windowless concrete room, buzzing fluorescent lights.
Maybe that weird smell of ozone and burnt metal they describe.
Speaker 2: Huh huh. And the device itself not some massive, complex
machine like you'd imagine.
Speaker 1: No, apparently, just two gray metal pillars eight feet tall,
standing about ten feet apart, copper coils connecting them.
Speaker 2: That's it deceptively simple looking. But the claim about how
it worked is, well, it's out there.
Speaker 1: It didn't plug into the main power grid, right right.
Speaker 2: The story is it tapped into Tesla's theorized zero point energy,
this idea that empty space isn't empty at all, but
teeming with this boundless energy.
Speaker 1: Mainstream physics acknowledges zero point energy as a theoretical concept,
but harnessing it like this that's pure speculation or you know,
fringe theory.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, but in this narrative it's the power source. They
claimed there was enough energy in an empty coffee cup
to boil all the Earth's oceans. The device supposedly tap that.
Speaker 1: Okay, so let's get to the tests. March twelve, nineteen
sixty eight, the alleged first activation.
Speaker 2: The team doctor Harold Agnew, doctor Sterling Colgate, three technicians.
They fire it.
Speaker 1: Up at first nothing, then this deep vibration starts in
the pillars, you can feel it in your chest.
Speaker 2: Supposedly, and the air between the pillars starts shimmering like
heat haze off a road. But here's the weird part.
Speaker 1: Temperature drops like significantly sixty degrees fahrenheit down to forty
ice starts forming on the concrete wall.
Speaker 2: ColdFusion, no, something else entirely, And then the pencil experiment.
Speaker 1: Right, Doctor Colgate supposedly tosses a regular pencil between.
Speaker 2: The pillars and it just vanishes.
Speaker 1: Gone. A few seconds later, it drops from the ceiling, but.
Speaker 2: It's changed, massively changed. The yellopaint is now dark brown,
the metal band is corroded, the wood is cracked brittle,
like it aged decades in just seconds.
Speaker 1: Which naturally leads to the terrifying.
Speaker 2: Question what would it do to a person?
Speaker 1: And apparently they decided to find out. The volunteers were
young military physicists.
Speaker 2: Seemed simple enough on paper, Step between the pillars, enter
the energy field, pop out at the destination.
Speaker 1: First destination Sandia National Labs, New Mexico, eighteen hundred miles away.
Speaker 2: Lieutenant Morrison, twenty six years old, steps in, vanishes, never arrives.
He just ceased to exist. According to the.
Speaker 1: Account, God, oh my god. Okay, so volunteer number.
Speaker 2: Two, Lieutenant Farley, thirty one, He does make it to
New Mexico, but the transfer took thirty.
Speaker 1: Seconds, and in those thirty seconds.
Speaker 2: He aged thirty years, appeared with white hair, papery skin, collapsed,
and died essentially of old age.
Speaker 1: Right there, This is horrific. So they recalibrated, right, tried
something closer.
Speaker 2: Yeah, third test destination just one floor up, ten feet away.
Local jump Lieutenant Hutchkins steps.
Speaker 1: Through and the result even worse, somehow.
Speaker 2: Unbelievably worse. He arrived in pieces, but not physically ripped apart,
separated in time.
Speaker 1: What does it even mean?
Speaker 2: His legs materialize first, then maybe thirty seconds later, his
torso appeared, his arms minutes after that. His heart arrived
before his lungs could function with it, Brain signals going
to limbs that weren't there yet were already gone. Medics
could do nothing.
Speaker 1: Just unthinkable.
Speaker 2: Out of the first fifteen volunteers, the story goes, only
three survived the initial tests, and all three went completely insane.
Speaker 1: Like Private Anderson nineteen years old.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he came back physically okay, but just screaming, screaming
about the space between someplace where time moved sideways, where
he felt himself dying and being born over and over.
He apparently never spoke a coherent word again.
Speaker 1: So faced with his utter catastrophe, what did they do?
Speaker 2: Doctor Agnew, analyzing the failures, supposedly saw a pattern. The
younger the subject, the less year the negative effects. Morrison
was twenty six, Farley thirty one, Anderson only nineteen.
Speaker 1: So the theory became.
Speaker 2: Adult consciousness was too rigid, too formed. It shattered under
the temporal stress, but children's minds still developing more plastic.
Speaker 1: They thought children could bend without breaking.
Speaker 2: That seems to be the horrifying logic presented in these accounts,
which leads to the next ethical nightmare.
Speaker 1: A DARPA contractor, Raymond Bossiago, who was reportedly involved from the.
Speaker 2: Start, volunteers his own son, Andrew Bosiago, six years old.
Speaker 1: Despite you'd hope massive reservations, the military allegedly decided this
was the way forward. They needed subjects, and adults weren't
volunteering after what happened.
Speaker 2: So they turned to children, which brings us to Andrew
Bossiaga's alleged first major mission.
Speaker 1: Gettysburg, Yeah, Nomber nineteenth, eighteen sixty three, the day of
Lincoln's address.
Speaker 2: He claims he'd done a few shorter jumps before Santa
fe As grandparents' house in Ohio, kind of practice runs,
but this was the big one.
Speaker 1: He described state into this vortal.
Speaker 2: Tunnel, Yeah, his term vortex plus portal, presumably, And then
suddenly his feet are in cold, squishy mud.
Speaker 1: He's wearing this itchy oversized Union soldier's uniform, smells like
old wool manure smoke.
Speaker 2: Pushing through this crowd of dirty, tired looking soldiers and civilians.
The ground is all churned up, rusty colored mud from
the battle that just happened there.
Speaker 1: And he makes his way to the platform, uh, and
sees him Abraham Lincoln, tall, tired, shoulder.
Speaker 2: Slumped, and Lincoln starts speaking the Gettysburg address and the
six year old kid is supposedly standing there one hundred
and five years in the past.
Speaker 1: And then he says, there's a flash a camera, someone
took a picture.
Speaker 2: This reported success Andrew's a parent. Ability to handle the
jump allegedly kicked the program into high gear.
Speaker 1: Darpest starts recruiting more kids.
Speaker 2: Through defense contractors military families looking for specific traits high intelligence,
physical resilience, and this undefined quality they called temporal flexibility
mines that could adapt.
Speaker 1: The training sounds, intense physical stuff, meditation, memorizing historical layouts,
learning how to blend.
Speaker 2: In and get this for dangerous missions. These kids, the cronats,
as they were supposedly called, were given cyanide.
Speaker 1: Capsules cyanide for children.
Speaker 2: That's the claim, utterly chilling if true. Around one hundred
and forty kids supposedly made it through training, formed into
teams for different era.
Speaker 1: And Baciago says he went back to Gatysburg multiple times yes.
Speaker 2: And on his fourth trip, he claims he saw himself,
a younger version from an earlier jump, standing in the
same spot, wearing the same uniform. He saw his past self,
he claims he did, said the younger Andrew looked terrified,
and he the older Andrew watching, felt like reality itself
was incredibly fragile at that moment.
Speaker 1: Wow and other cronots reported weird stuff too.
Speaker 2: Apparently, a girl named Sarah supposedly met three versions of
herself at Pearl Murder. Another kid, Mark claimed he saw
himself die at the Battle of Antietam, but then somehow
changed the past to survive, which led them to conclude
that Tesla's tech wasn't just time travel, it was accessing
the multiverse, different timelines, different realities.
Speaker 1: Okay, this is already incredibly hard to wrap your head around.
But the story doesn't stop there, does it. It goes interplanetary.
Speaker 2: It does. By nineteen eighty, the claim is Project Pegasus
was upgraded. Now it could bend space as well as
time space travel.
Speaker 1: This wasn't just Darba anymore, right. A joint venture Ralph M.
Speaker 2: Parson's company, Lockheed skunk Works, Hughes Aircraft, the CIA all
supposedly involved in this new phase.
Speaker 1: And the new facility, the jump rope.
Speaker 2: Hidden in plain sight supposedly nine to ninety nine North
Suplvida Boulevard, El Sagondo, California, look like a normal office building.
Speaker 1: But inside there was this elevator.
Speaker 2: With a secret button. Sequence you press it, the elevator
wall supposedly dissolve and boom. You're not just going up
a floor, You're somewhere else entirely like Mars. Like Mars.
Andrew Basciago claims he made his first jump there when
he was.
Speaker 1: Nineteen required more training.
Speaker 2: I assume, oh yeah, three weeks of ten survival training
college of the Siskius, apparently learning about thin atmospheres, extreme temperatures,
using some kind of handheld weapons, stun heat kill settings.
Speaker 1: And the survival odds weren't great.
Speaker 2: According to the instrictors. Bosiago quotes Stark, of ninety seven
thousand people supposedly sent to Mars over the years, only
seven thousand were said to have lived longer than a
five years.
Speaker 1: So what did Bosiago say Mars was like?
Speaker 2: Not the NASA version, definitely not. He claimed there were
places with breathable air, indigenous life, what kind of life?
He described, things like pleasosaurs, those long necked marine reptiles.
Somehow on Mars tarantula is the size of cars and tall,
thin humanoid beings with large heads and black eyes, and.
Speaker 1: The mission goal why send teenagers to face car sized tarantulis.
Speaker 2: The Soviets there established contact with this alleged Martian civilization,
cold Gorgo's interplanetary.
Speaker 1: And Basiago claims he wasn't alone on these Mars missions.
Speaker 2: No, he was part of a team, and he names,
including most famously a lanky college student from Columbia University
named Barry Setro.
Speaker 1: Who the world now knows as Barack Obama. Okay, that
claim is extraordinary, to put it mildly, Is there any
corroboration for this Mars stuff?
Speaker 2: Well, Bossiago isn't the only claimant. Two others, William Stillings
and Bernard Mendez, independently came forward. They also claimed to
be part of this Mars program.
Speaker 1: And they confirmed the details the training, the jump room,
the alien I.
Speaker 2: Reportedly confirmed those elements. Yes, and crucially, both Stillings and
Mendez also stated independently that Barry Obama was part of
their Mars training group.
Speaker 1: Three people claiming Obama was secretly teleporting to Mars as
a college student. It's a lot to take.
Speaker 2: In, it absolutely is. But perhaps the strangest piece of
alleged corroboration didn't come from another supposed participant. It came
from Art Bell, the.
Speaker 1: Late night paranormal radio legend Coast to Coast.
Speaker 2: Am exactly king of that world, known for being open
minded but also a sharp interviewer, Bossiago on his show
multiple times, and.
Speaker 1: On one show, Bossy Igo teased a big reveal.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he called it a quantum bomb show, said it
would prove his story.
Speaker 1: What was it?
Speaker 2: He dropped this seemingly minor detail. He said, on November
fifth of nineteen seventy one, we participated in an advanced
kronizer probe from ITT Defense Communications in Nutley, New Jersey,
a kronaser being some kind of time viewing tech.
Speaker 1: In his narrative Itt Defense Communications, Nutley, New Jersey, November
nineteen seventy one.
Speaker 2: The radio went silent for a beat. Then art Bell
comes back on and his voice is apparently thick with emotion.
Speaker 1: What did he say?
Speaker 2: He confesses live on air that he Art Bell had
worked for ITT in Nutley, New Jersey around that exact
time as a technician checking waveguide equipment for a secret
government project. He knew nothing about.
Speaker 1: Wow, that's specific a direct, unprompted hit on a really
obscure detail.
Speaker 2: It seemed incredibly powerful at the time. A spontaneous confirmation
from an unexpected source.
Speaker 1: Okay, so we have these anecdotal accounts, the Art Bell moment.
What about physical evidence? Basiago mentioned that photo from Gettysburg.
Speaker 2: Right, the Lincoln photo. For almost a century, historians looked
for a confirmed photo of Lincoln actually at the Gettysburg
address ceremony found.
Speaker 1: Nothing until nineteen fifty two.
Speaker 2: An archivist Josephine Cobb is going through Civil War glass
plate negatives at the National Archives and she finds it.
Lincoln on the platform, faintly visible in a crowd shot,
huge historical fine would she notes something else? Yes, Down
on the foreground, off to the side, there's a small boy,
maybe six or seven years old, dressed in a Union
bugle boy type uniform.
Speaker 1: Okay, maybe not that unusual for the time. Kids did
wear military style sometimes.
Speaker 2: Perhaps, but this kid was alone, no parent in sight,
looked kind of lost, and there are anomalies like what
his haircut. Historians noted it looked very modern, like a
nineteen seventies cut, not eighteen sixty three. And his shoes
they were clearly adult sized shoes, way too big for him.
Speaker 1: Oversized shoes, modern haircut alone Gettysburg.
Speaker 2: And Andrew Baciago claims, that's me, that six year old
me on my first mission.
Speaker 1: Okay, so we've laid out this incredible, sprawling story teleportation,
time travel cornernot children, Mars, colonies, Obama art Bell the photo.
Now we need to do what we set out to do.
Deconstruct it.
Speaker 2: Right, let's separate verifiable fact from well from the claims.
There are elements grounded in reality.
Speaker 1: Here, like Tesla's files being confiscated.
Speaker 2: Yes, that happened, the government took them in nineteen forty three,
and yes, some FBI files on Tesla remained classified. That's documented.
Speaker 1: We also know the government did research things like remote feeling.
Project Stargate is.
Speaker 2: Real, and top remote viewers like Joe McMoneagle did claim
to see things like ancient Martian civilizations. That's on record.
Speaker 1: And tragically, we also know the US military and CIA
did conduct horrific, unethical experiments on unwitting subjects, including children
like an mk ultra testing drugs, psychological manipulation. That's documented history.
Speaker 2: So the idea of secret projects, the government, secrecy, even
unethical experimentation, that's not the unbelievable part.
Speaker 1: No, the unbelievable part starts with the science they claim
was used.
Speaker 2: Exactly. The physics as described in these accounts just doesn't
align with known science at all.
Speaker 1: Tesla's radiant energy work was aimed at wireless power transmission, right,
not teleportation.
Speaker 2: Correct, and teleporting a human we've achieved quantum teleportation for
tiny particles, sure, but a whole person, the energy required
would be astronomical, more than an exploding star.
Speaker 1: So the idea they just plug this machine into a wall.
Speaker 2: Socket is physically impossible based on everything we understand. It's
orders of magnitude beyond comprehension, let alone a standard power outlet.
Speaker 1: And then there's the movement problem.
Speaker 2: The cosmic positioning. Yeah, Earth spins it orbits the Sun.
The Sun orbits the galactic center. The galaxy is moving.
If you jump through time even a few seconds without
calculating all of that motion perfectly, you.
Speaker 1: Wouldn't land back on Earth materialize in empty space miles
away precisely.
Speaker 2: The calculations required would be unbelievably complex, assuming it's even possible.
And the terminology they use a made up word and
phrases like quantum displacement, quantum holographic destabilization. They sound science y,
but physicists say they're basically meaningless jargons strung together.
Speaker 1: What about the cronavisor that sounds like something specific.
Speaker 2: It is, but the concept actually originated much earlier, with
an Italian Benedictine monk named Pellegrino or Netti in the
nineteen fifties, he claimed he built a device to see
the past and watched Roman plays in Christ's Crucifixion.
Speaker 1: And was that claim ever verified.
Speaker 2: No, it was pretty thoroughly debunked as a hoax. So
Bossiago using that term links back to an already discredited idea.
Speaker 1: Okay, beyond the science, what about inconsistencies within Bosiago's own story?
Speaker 2: There are quite a few pointed out by critics. He
claims Donald Rumsfeld rand Project Pegasus from nineteen sixty nine
to nineteen seventy two.
Speaker 1: Szfeld's documented career.
Speaker 2: Shows him working in domestic policy, then heading the Office
of Economic Opportunity, later ambassador to NATO, nowhere near Darpou
or running secret teleportation projects. It just doesn't match the historical.
Speaker 1: Record and the Art Bell confirmation that seems so powerful.
Speaker 2: It did, but the catches. Art Bell had actually written
about his time working at ITT in Nutley, New Jersey
in his nineteen ninety eight autobiography The Art of Talk.
Speaker 1: Ah, so that information was already public knowledge before Bossiago
revealed it on the show.
Speaker 2: Correct, it means Bossiago could have simply read Bell's book
and incorporated that detail to create that bombshell moment, It
doesn't necessarily mean he had inside.
Speaker 1: Knowledge, and his story is apparently shifted over time.
Speaker 2: Critics point to changes in details across different interviews and writings.
The year he was recruited, exactly how many trips to Gettysburg,
the number of kids involved, specific dates for the Mars jumps.
These kinds of inconsistencies raise red flags.
Speaker 1: And the Mars story itself. There's a weird timeline issue
there too, isn't there? Yes.
Speaker 2: In two thousand and eight, Andrew Basiago published a lengthy
paper titled The Discovery of Life on Mars. But his
evidence wasn't his alleged personal experience.
Speaker 1: What was it?
Speaker 2: It was based entirely on analyzing NASA rover photos, pointing
out shapes he interpreted as artifacts and creatures in the
blurry images.
Speaker 1: So he wrote a whole paper based.
Speaker 2: On photos years before he publicly claimed he'd actually been
to Mars multiple times via a jump room and scene
life firsthand.
Speaker 1: Why would you analyze fuzzy photos if you had eyewitness accounts,
including your own.
Speaker 2: That's the logical disconnect. Critics highlight it suggests the jump
room story might have been added later to bolster their
earlier claims based on photo analysis.
Speaker 1: It all seems to fit a broader pattern you sometimes
see in these narratives, doesn't it.
Speaker 2: It shares similarities with other secret space program whistleblower accounts
often claimant's allege involvement in multiple fantastic programs, time travel,
alien wars, advanced tech.
Speaker 1: And there's often the element of memory suppression or recovery.
Speaker 2: When inconsistencies are pointed out, a common explanation is that
memories were wiped or suppressed and are only now slowly returning,
which makes the claims difficult to definitively disprove.
Speaker 1: And unfortunately, there's often a monetization aspect.
Speaker 2: Many of these individuals build careers around their stories, paid
speaking gigs, workshops, books, podcasts. They sometimes even claim intellectual
property rights over concepts like the Dark Fleet or specific narratives,
treating their alleged experiences as marketable assets.
Speaker 1: Which inevitably makes you question the motives. But putting aside
the inconsistencies and potential motives, why do these stories resonate
so strongly with people? What's the appeal?
Speaker 2: I think it taps into something incredibly deep and universal
in the human psyche. It's the desire for a second.
Speaker 1: Chance, isn't it the ultimate do over?
Speaker 2: Exactly? We all have regrets, mistakes made, words said and anger,
opportunities missed, people we've lost, who wouldn't want to go
back and fix something, save someone, say goodbye properly.
Speaker 1: Time travel stories offer that fantasy that maybe, just maybe
the rigid rules of time aren't so rigid after all,
there's a loophole.
Speaker 2: It's a powerful hope. But the reality is regret lives
in the past. It's a memory and dwelling on it,
wishing things were different.
Speaker 1: It just steals the joy from today, doesn't it, and
dims the potential for the future.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, The real second chance isn't about rewriting history in
some secret lab. It's about accepting what happened, learning from it,
and deciding to move forward differently.
Speaker 1: Now. Your second chance start the moment you stop looking
back and decide to focus on today, on what you
can control.
Speaker 2: That's the real time machine. We all possess the present moment.
It holds infinite possibilities, but only if we're actually present
for it looking forward.
Speaker 1: So, whether you believe any part of the Project Pegas's story,
whether these accounts hold up or completely fall apart under scrutiny,
Their persistence tells us something important about ourselves, that.
Speaker 2: Deep human yearning to control time, to revisit, to explore
the ultimate unknown.
Speaker 1: But maybe the most profound journey isn't through some shimmering
curtain or vortal tunnel. Maybe it's the journey within, acknowledging
that the most powerful tool we have for shaping our
future is right here, right now, the present, offering endless
possibilities if we just choose to look forward