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Speaker 2: This is the Baseline discussing the hot button topics of
Speaker 2: the NBA. Welcome everybody, your tune to the Baseline Cali
Speaker 2: Warrenshaw discussing the hot button topics.
Speaker 1: Of the NBA. Ah the dog days of summer.
Speaker 2: Man, it's hot, it's humid, and it's actually quiet, you know,
Speaker 2: after the.
Speaker 1: Fever of.
Speaker 2: Free agency frenzy, you know, it's got to be at
Speaker 2: least a moment for us to kind of like take
Speaker 2: a breath, right, So I think we're in that period
Speaker 2: right now where everybody is taking a moment, taking a breath,
Speaker 2: and then we'll you know, raise our eyebrows up and
Speaker 2: then say, oh, crap, it's media day. Oh crap, it's
Speaker 2: you know, it's so ta's again. So you know it's
Speaker 2: but it's a good time, especially to to kind of
Speaker 2: gather your bearings, especially with the blitz of everything that's
Speaker 2: been going on, you know, previously the last few weeks.
Speaker 2: And as always, when we go ahead and roll at
Speaker 2: the red carpet. To my right hand man www dot
Speaker 2: shaw sports dot netpickhun the P and T. My man
Speaker 2: is one shot repping out of Fort Florida to Florida.
Speaker 2: What's good, brother, man? How you doing back up in
Speaker 2: the joint? Brother?
Speaker 1: Taking my fresh off a little mini vacation myself as
Speaker 1: the NBA world is all like everyone's you know in
Speaker 1: Europe or you know, in the in the Caribbean, or
Speaker 1: whatever case may be. Luckily I live in a place
Speaker 1: where a lot of people come to vacation. But I
Speaker 1: went up the coast and took me a couple of
Speaker 1: days back. But we're back here, man, and ready to
Speaker 1: rock with the baseline as always, power packs show ready
Speaker 1: for folks to rock.
Speaker 2: And roll with absolutely man. So this is also a
Speaker 2: good opportunity for us to to kind of, you know,
Speaker 2: navigate things a little bit differently. I know everybody is
Speaker 2: you know, salivating, waiting, you know, impatiently to start talking
Speaker 2: about new players, new faces and new places. You know,
Speaker 2: get ready for the previews already, you know, pre talking
Speaker 2: about you know, who's gonna hoist the trophy and everything
Speaker 2: like that.
Speaker 1: Settle down.
Speaker 2: There'll be plenty of time to do that, right Like,
Speaker 2: the NBA will not disappoint in giving us fodder for
Speaker 2: for for talk. Okay, So, but we wanted to take
Speaker 2: a little bit of a different approach, and you know,
Speaker 2: this kind of goes the way of how our minds
Speaker 2: kind of work in this part of the offseason, right Like,
Speaker 2: because they're players who are a part of this free
Speaker 2: agency frenzy that really didn't get a lot of press,
Speaker 2: they didn't get a lot of conversation of. But I
Speaker 2: think you me shaw like and maybe even our listeners
Speaker 2: might think differently about whether or not, you know, we
Speaker 2: want to make sure that these guys don't get overlooked
Speaker 2: because I do think that them being in new destinations
Speaker 2: and new places may actually have an impact on whether
Speaker 2: or not the teams that they're going to be playing
Speaker 2: for and why they got them is going to put
Speaker 2: put them in the best position possible for them to
Speaker 2: make that run. Right, So we're going to highlight our
Speaker 2: buy and sell feature with guys who we know there
Speaker 2: needs to be some level of Hoop redemption, and we're
Speaker 2: going to be on that buy and sell mode about
Speaker 2: are we completely buying it? Are we all in on
Speaker 2: the fact that this them being in this situation, this
Speaker 2: circumstance with this team is the right fit. Are we
Speaker 2: selling out on the idea that even if they're going
Speaker 2: to be there, they're not really the ones right, Like
Speaker 2: it's going to take something else and whatever it is
Speaker 2: that they're going to probably bring to the table might
Speaker 2: not be enough for whatever those expectations might be. And
Speaker 2: I know that there's a long list, but we're just
Speaker 2: highlighting guys that we feel like didn't get enough conversation
Speaker 2: or talk. But we thought that the move itself was
Speaker 2: signifying something for what these teams are trying to put
Speaker 2: position themselves prepare themselves to do. So we'll let you
Speaker 2: know what those guys are. And as always, we appreciate
Speaker 2: everybody for hopping on board with us this week. Be
Speaker 2: sure to get the my Manshaw as sports. I'm sorry
Speaker 2: at D warrant. Shall I keep forgetting that man? Now
Speaker 2: that you're official and you put the D in front
Speaker 2: of your name, it's just you know, yeah, you're you're, you're,
Speaker 2: You're so Hollywood that man, like I almost have to
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: One day, one day, one day, I'm you know, trying
Speaker 1: to put it into existence. As I speak.
Speaker 2: You let me know when I got clearance to to
Speaker 2: then put the the game Face League because I thought
Speaker 2: game Face Lead was already good.
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Speaker 2: let's get right into it, man, this is our buyer
Speaker 2: sell mode regarding you know, players that we reel like.
Speaker 2: You know, listen, the move is made. They're part of
Speaker 2: the conversation, but they deserve a little bit of talk, right,
Speaker 2: And the whole idea is do we buy or sell
Speaker 2: on some of these players because quite frankly, the reason
Speaker 2: why they didn't get talked about is the likelihood is
Speaker 2: they had a pretty disappointing season or for whatever reason
Speaker 2: where they were playing or who they were playing with,
Speaker 2: they just did not perform to the level that I
Speaker 2: think would have impacted them for why they were brought.
Speaker 1: There to begin with.
Speaker 2: Now that's not to say that these guys are trash
Speaker 2: or these you know, their season, their careers or anything
Speaker 2: like that. But we do think that there is an
Speaker 2: opportunity of hoops redemption because now you start looking at
Speaker 2: what these guys are expected to come and do for
Speaker 2: these teams, and the idea is that if they're able
Speaker 2: to do it at a high level, most certainly they
Speaker 2: will bounce back and perform at the level we've always
Speaker 2: expected them to be. So I'll let you start it off, Shaw,
Speaker 2: Who are you starting with for our conversation of buy
Speaker 2: or sell hoops redemption?
Speaker 1: So I'm actually going to go with somebody who's not
Speaker 1: in a position who's going to be all that impactful
Speaker 1: in terms of team winning. Right, this team is resetting
Speaker 1: the table for what they want to do. And we
Speaker 1: talk about this every now and then. Sometimes a great
Speaker 1: move is understanding, like, hey, understanding that you're not going
Speaker 1: to be great and it's time to like, let's try
Speaker 1: to develop some young talent. Get as much talent as
Speaker 1: we can here tank air quotes, so to speak. But
Speaker 1: you know, try to get yourself in positions for great
Speaker 1: lottery picks. And I'm talking right now. I'm looking at
Speaker 1: the Washington Wizards, and I think they did a really
Speaker 1: good job over the course of this summer to reset
Speaker 1: their roster, right and just say, you know, bring in
Speaker 1: a bunch of young dudes. And one of the young
Speaker 1: guys who I think I'm really excited to see if
Speaker 1: he really is as good as people say he is
Speaker 1: or he thinks he is, is Cam Whitmore. This is
Speaker 1: a prime opportunity for Kim Whitmore to truly truly ball
Speaker 1: out now with the Washington Wizards. Young Core. Obviously Carrington
Speaker 1: is there. You got Star there as well. I mean
Speaker 1: even Core kisper to lesser degree coming off the bench.
Speaker 1: Whatever right they got was Thomas from from Texas. This
Speaker 1: Washington team is like kind of loaded with you know,
Speaker 1: young guys, and you just don't quite win. Everybody's going
Speaker 1: to be But I'm looking for Whitmore to kind of
Speaker 1: go out here and be kind of like this alpha,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, because he's going to be
Speaker 1: a little bit of a veteran presidence if you will,
Speaker 1: or I guess is what. He's thirty or fourth year
Speaker 1: in the NBA, but I think he's somebody who really
Speaker 1: knows he can score the basketball and whether or not
Speaker 1: he could do that in a way that's not just
Speaker 1: kind of empty calories. It's something that we will ultimately
Speaker 1: want to see here. But wit More's primed to have
Speaker 1: a really breakout year in terms of his statistical performance.
Speaker 1: But can it translate to somebody into something that the
Speaker 1: Washington which will want to kind of keep around, not
Speaker 1: just kind of a bridge to like their next iteration.
Speaker 1: But is he a pseudo building piece as like, Hey,
Speaker 1: you know what, this is a nice, complimentary guy who
Speaker 1: can get you a lot of points, can rebound a
Speaker 1: little bit as well too. I'm really excited for the year.
Speaker 1: Can Moore should happen Washington?
Speaker 2: So I would be excited for him. I think my
Speaker 2: question to you Shaw is will the maturity catch up
Speaker 2: with the untapped potential?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 2: And I often say to myself when I look at
Speaker 2: some of these guys who they have been highly touted,
Speaker 2: they've been highly recognized. Maybe when they came in they
Speaker 2: were a wildcard project by their previous organizations. Somehow something
Speaker 2: has not synced in. And I'm not blaming the player.
Speaker 2: It could certainly be the situation, the circumstance. It could
Speaker 2: be the development system that they were involved in. Something
Speaker 2: just hasn't clicked with Cam Whitmore. And you get to
Speaker 2: a point, especially when a player who is now fully
Speaker 2: baked in. He's no longer like you know, a one
Speaker 2: year rookie or anything like that. This is someone who's
Speaker 2: baked in, already understanding the nuances of how he's going
Speaker 2: to have to make himself successful. I am often scared
Speaker 2: when I see situations like this For a guy like
Speaker 2: Cam Whitmore, I'm not liking him to a Jordan Poole,
Speaker 2: But what I'm saying is is that, like Jordan Pool
Speaker 2: was someone where that opportunity was there for him because
Speaker 2: he played on a mature roster and positioned himself well
Speaker 2: to be a key player to help the Golden State
Speaker 2: Warriors win that championship. Cam Whipmo has never had that opportunity.
Speaker 2: Now he has an opportunity to go to an organization
Speaker 2: that's been mired in mediocrity and even less than that
Speaker 2: for quite some time, and whenever they try to bring
Speaker 2: in premier players or future players, it just never seems
Speaker 2: to it never seems to click or resonate that this
Speaker 2: is an opportunity where it's not even just about your
Speaker 2: personal steps. You could literally be responsible for revitalizing a franchise,
Speaker 2: an organization, and the belief and the hope that they
Speaker 2: can actually be a sustainably good team, something where it's
Speaker 2: more than just getting a long term contract but also
Speaker 2: becoming an attractive destination for free agents, for coaches who
Speaker 2: want to be involved in this and see that potential.
Speaker 2: Some of these guys just don't understand that. And to
Speaker 2: your point, y'all, like we've seen the glimpses of when
Speaker 2: Cam Whitmore, when he's on one, what he could really
Speaker 2: look like?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 2: Can he do that now knowing that this is basically
Speaker 2: an open canvas? Right, Like he has an opportunity to
Speaker 2: be Picasso in a situation where everything around him is
Speaker 2: either mired in ugliness or is not attractive enough for
Speaker 2: people to actually buy into the idea that you know,
Speaker 2: this is a place where guys really should want to
Speaker 2: stand out, show out and make something of it. And
Speaker 2: I think people get lost into the wins and lost
Speaker 2: his aspect of it as well too. But what I'm
Speaker 2: just looking for is if Cam Whitmore's that premiere of
Speaker 2: a player, if he's that person that a lot of
Speaker 2: people believed and if he was in the right situation,
Speaker 2: could have clearly been a Number one kind of guy
Speaker 2: or whatever the case.
Speaker 1: May be.
Speaker 2: What better way for you to be able to do
Speaker 2: that than in a place where nobody has any expectations
Speaker 2: for you to succeed. Nobody has any expectations that the
Speaker 2: Wizards are going to be a is going to be
Speaker 2: a playoff or play in bound team. But if you
Speaker 2: help improve, if you help elevate even the roster of
Speaker 2: guys that are around you, and you didn't stand out,
Speaker 2: you don't even have to be an All Star, but
Speaker 2: you've got to be in a position where you're having
Speaker 2: like an impact. I think that to me is what
Speaker 2: I'm looking for more than anything with Cam. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 2: and he's a guy who can get you twenty easy
Speaker 2: right his pir thirty six or you know, gets somewhere
Speaker 2: I think at twenty three or I think twenty three
Speaker 2: is first year and twenty one last year. Houston just
Speaker 2: took a leap that was in somewhat in some ways
Speaker 2: unexpected and they just didn't need him. So I credit
Speaker 2: the Rockets for putting him in a position where he
Speaker 2: would I'll have an opportunity to get some run like
Speaker 2: he should be competing for big time minutes there And
Speaker 2: I said, I think I said Thomas before, but obviously
Speaker 2: Tree Johnson who they drafted, but along with.
Speaker 1: Johnson, and you know, whether or not to keep McCollum
Speaker 1: or not or whatever. Like, there's gonna be a lot
Speaker 1: of guys maybe trying to bite at the apple and
Speaker 1: take some shots. What's going to be the Rold delineation
Speaker 1: on this team. I'm not quite sure what that is
Speaker 1: just yet right now as we're you know, in August,
Speaker 1: but I'm interested to see and whether wit Moore is
Speaker 1: a guy who you know, gets thirty minutes a night,
Speaker 1: whether that is a starter or coming up the bench.
Speaker 1: I think he's just gonna have opportunity to get minutes
Speaker 1: in gedible And now, as you alluded to, is he
Speaker 1: an empty calories guy or is he somebody who can
Speaker 1: really help you for the short term and potentially the
Speaker 1: mid term and long term future of the Washington Wizards.
Speaker 1: That remains to be seen. I think we'll know a
Speaker 1: lot after this year, whether or not the Wizards choose
Speaker 1: to pick up year four and five you know, for
Speaker 1: him on that rookie contract, or whether or not they're
Speaker 1: like all right, we've seen enough, you know, kind of
Speaker 1: like they did with Jordan Pool in two years, Like
Speaker 1: you know, well, we're good on that. This is not
Speaker 1: quite the dude, but I'm rooting for campbet More obviously
Speaker 1: slipped in the draft a couple of years ago. He's
Speaker 1: got a lot of you know, a lot of uh,
Speaker 1: he's got a lot to prove, He's got a big
Speaker 1: chip on his shoulder, and I think he's somebody who
Speaker 1: will be able to have a really big season in Washington.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree with you there. I think there's definitely
Speaker 2: opportunity for him to have an awesome season, right how
Speaker 2: and what that translates to, you know, again, I think
Speaker 2: it's just going to be the big question as it
Speaker 2: pertains to the roster that he's playing around like that
Speaker 2: he'll be surrounded by, right, there's some potential, really really
Speaker 2: good players there. Will the chemistry be there, right with
Speaker 2: Bob Carrington and you know Sorr and those guys, Like
Speaker 2: if they can figure out a way, well, yeah, if
Speaker 2: they could figure out a way like and listen, they
Speaker 2: could very much do like what did you did? You
Speaker 2: know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Like, there's an opportunity there.
Speaker 2: I'm not saying that that Whitmore is anything like Kay Cunningham,
Speaker 2: but what I'm saying is Kay Cunningham put in that
Speaker 2: work because he understood the importance of being that draft
Speaker 2: lottery pick, being among one of the best players in
Speaker 2: that draft being selected, and he already understood the history
Speaker 2: of what's been going on with the Detroit Pistons, and
Speaker 2: I think that lent itself for him to be fast
Speaker 2: tracked into why people believe so heavily into the turnaround
Speaker 2: for the Detroit Pistons. And so that's what I mean, Like,
Speaker 2: if this is an opportunity for Kim Whitmore to kind
Speaker 2: of show us, it doesn't have to be getting those
Speaker 2: twenty points easy. Like we know that if you're getting
Speaker 2: the minute, you're gonna get the opportunities, you're gonna get
Speaker 2: the shots. But if you're somebody who's really not within
Speaker 2: the flow of the potential of the guys that are
Speaker 2: around you, it meant that you never bought into that anyway,
Speaker 2: So you're just trying to get yours and that's not
Speaker 2: gonna help the Washington Wizards.
Speaker 1: E yeah, all right, all right, well you give us
Speaker 1: here your first guy here, you know, enough Cam Wetmore
Speaker 1: talk a room for young fella, But who you got,
Speaker 1: See who's your first guy on this line?
Speaker 2: So the first person I want to talk to talk
Speaker 2: talk about is ironically enough, I wasn't. I was on
Speaker 2: offense about bringing him up. But I do think that
Speaker 2: it's important that we do have this conversation about Lonzo
Speaker 2: Ball and Lonzo Ball being a part of the Cleveland Cavaliers.
Speaker 2: I really don't know if people really understand it like
Speaker 2: this is the Cleveland Cavaliers really really really rolling the
Speaker 2: dice here and pushing their chips in on addressing the
Speaker 2: depth that they didn't have access to with a legitimate
Speaker 2: point guard, and also acknowledging that this isn't about, you know,
Speaker 2: anything regarding Darius Garland. I think, of anything, it's about
Speaker 2: recognizing that they need Darius Garland in whatever capacity that
Speaker 2: he's available to without stretching him thin, especially through his
Speaker 2: young career, and basically enabling the Cleveland Cavaliers that still
Speaker 2: have depth in their in their second and second unit
Speaker 2: and having a guy like Lonzo Ball on that roster.
Speaker 2: But to me, the thing that I think really stands
Speaker 2: out more than anything when I think about Lonzo Ball,
Speaker 2: when I think about the Ball brothers, Lonzo Ball, to me,
Speaker 2: reflected the most of the most successful of the brothers
Speaker 2: arguably right like where he went. He actually did have
Speaker 2: an impact when he was healthy, and it's just terrible
Speaker 2: that the injuries have just completely ravaged what we could
Speaker 2: have potentially seen in his career. But this is an
Speaker 2: opportunity where maybe the organization, maybe being under the Cleveland Cavaliers,
Speaker 2: they are going to properly utilize him and put him
Speaker 2: in the best positions possible where we see the maximum
Speaker 2: potential without stretching him to the point where he's not
Speaker 2: He's not going to be available when it really matters
Speaker 2: the most, when we really wanted to have this opportunity
Speaker 2: of seeing the you know, the greatness that's within life
Speaker 2: Lonzo Ball as to what he can do, and this
Speaker 2: is a great situation for him. I do think and
Speaker 2: believe that there's a hoop predemption storyline to this because
Speaker 2: we've been doing this all all throughout the Balls brothers careers,
Speaker 2: right like, we've been giving them chance after chance after
Speaker 2: chance after chance. There comes a point where we just
Speaker 2: we stop with all of this. Right, it's no longer
Speaker 2: the father, it's no longer about LaMelo, It's not all
Speaker 2: about Leangelo. This is about Lonzo, and if Lonzo recognizes
Speaker 2: that he has a window where he can be successful,
Speaker 2: and it's with a team that has been in the
Speaker 2: playoffs the last three years. He has to be one
Speaker 2: of the reasons why they're now taking that next step,
Speaker 2: which is ultimately getting to the Eastern Conference Finals, ultimately
Speaker 2: getting to the NBA Finals. He has to be an
Speaker 2: important reason for them to do that. And this is
Speaker 2: what I'm looking forward to when I speak about Lonzo
Speaker 2: Ball because due the years, we've been deprived of the
Speaker 2: opportunity of what he can actually bring to the table
Speaker 2: for the team, for the teams that he's played for.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, he's got to stay healthy first and foremost,
Speaker 1: but I think the acquisition of bringing him in behind Garland,
Speaker 1: who himself was banged up, is going to be I
Speaker 1: think hopefully a nice one two combo that they can
Speaker 1: continue to get play creation when Garland is off the floor,
Speaker 1: because then when Garland's out, it kind of defaults to
Speaker 1: Donovan Mitchell, who obviously can do it, but it's still
Speaker 1: better served playing off the ball and again as a
Speaker 1: secondary creator, not having to be a primary for any
Speaker 1: kind of like a six minute trench just because Garland
Speaker 1: is off the floor. So that allows Lonzo to be
Speaker 1: able to do that. And if you believe this three
Speaker 1: point shooting has improved in the way that we saw
Speaker 1: it kind of last year and then obviously before he
Speaker 1: got injured for those last couple of years, then that's
Speaker 1: somebody as well too. If Donnavan is driving, he's kicking
Speaker 1: out or Mobley's getting double team, same thing. Somebody who
Speaker 1: can hit a open three, especially if it's some of
Speaker 1: the wings and the corners. I don't know that he's
Speaker 1: going to have any kind of blow byability right now,
Speaker 1: and if he's going to be able to raise the
Speaker 1: floor for them on the fast riag side, but he's
Speaker 1: still bringing a steady force, is going to make smart
Speaker 1: decisions for them, and that's what this Cavaliers team need.
Speaker 1: And I think when you talk about the depth, that
Speaker 1: really is something that he's being brought here to do
Speaker 1: in a real way. They lost Ti Jerome obviously they
Speaker 1: choose not to, you know, resign him in that capacity,
Speaker 1: so he's not gonna be able to provide the scoring punch.
Speaker 1: I would imagine that Jerome did, I think at times.
Speaker 1: But again that play creation and then a little bit
Speaker 1: of defense as well too, should make a lot of
Speaker 1: sense for this Cavaliers team that definitely needs something else
Speaker 1: on that bench from when it comes to the backcourt spot, right,
Speaker 1: like they're they're pretty rocket and rolling when it comes
Speaker 1: to the front court, but that backcourt was a little
Speaker 1: iffy of Goaling and Donovan weren't really weren't always at
Speaker 1: their best because Sho's had a down year as well,
Speaker 1: to Carrol Sivert was in and out leverts obviously no
Speaker 1: longer on the roster. Where the case of b second
Speaker 1: year with DeAndre Hunter and now hopefully with a full
Speaker 1: year with him, see what he'll be able to do
Speaker 1: with that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So when it comes to Linzo, I'll just make this,
Speaker 2: you know, point real quick. You know, last year, he
Speaker 2: really you know, he played about thirty five games, right,
Speaker 2: obviously injury ridden, only averaged about twenty two minutes, right,
Speaker 2: only averaging around three and a half sisper game. And
Speaker 2: I was just curious, you know, from your perspective, Shaw,
Speaker 2: when you look at the statistics, you know, and and
Speaker 2: the skill set of a guy like Lonzo Ball, I
Speaker 2: think that Lonzo Ball actually will help out guys like
Speaker 2: Sam Merril and guys like DeAndre Hunter, you know, what
Speaker 2: I mean, Like, he doesn't necessarily have to be scoring
Speaker 2: the basketball, so we don't have to worry about that
Speaker 2: part of it. But his ability to to distribute, his
Speaker 2: ability to hit guys you know, in spots and spaces
Speaker 2: and things of that nature, I think is so critical
Speaker 2: and to me, it's what continues to give Kenny Atkinson options,
Speaker 2: you know, and the ability to plug and play and
Speaker 2: mess with the roster a little bit more rather than
Speaker 2: only relying on certain guys when they're streaking, you know
Speaker 2: what I mean, and that that isn't necessarily the case.
Speaker 2: He knows his best players are going to be the
Speaker 2: ones that are going to have to step up to
Speaker 2: that next level, but he definitely needs the floor general
Speaker 2: rules to get those guys those opportunities in those spots.
Speaker 2: To me, what do you think should be the one
Speaker 2: thing that you want to see as an on an
Speaker 2: uptick that gives you the confidence for Lonzo for Lonzo
Speaker 2: Ball to have that kind of season that you alluded to.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think it's just it has to. It
Speaker 1: begins to starting meet with the health. Is he on
Speaker 1: the floor, it is he available? Right?
Speaker 2: So the number of games played.
Speaker 1: Right, right? I think he'll mention five. I mean, I
Speaker 1: didn't realize that, you know, Laryn ANSWER's back on this
Speaker 1: roster as well. But I think you know somebody who
Speaker 1: will be able to fill the lob. I think to
Speaker 1: Alan Mobley and maybe even Nansen, whatever minutes he's able
Speaker 1: to get. And then also you know, play create and
Speaker 1: and play off, you know, off the pick and roll,
Speaker 1: you know, and hit guys on the corners and in
Speaker 1: the wings, you know when he is trying to drive
Speaker 1: to the basket. Don't know what his floyd's looking like
Speaker 1: these days, but that's a shot that I think he'll
Speaker 1: have to be able to hit offensively, and just whether
Speaker 1: or not he's able to impact them defensively in a
Speaker 1: way that's not negative. Like I said before, I really
Speaker 1: like the overall edition. Ironically, I don't want to get
Speaker 1: too down the road of you know, kind of like
Speaker 1: it's kind of your land the cause theories. But our
Speaker 1: guy Gerald on Rick Mhorn, they were talking on serious ExM.
Speaker 1: I think when it announced early in the summer, they're like,
Speaker 1: this could be maybe the Koban Cavaliers are not all
Speaker 1: that excited about keeping Garland and could Lonzo Ball be
Speaker 1: the replacement clearly Garland's a better player than the Lonzo ball, right,
Speaker 1: But it's like they were saying, could Garland then be
Speaker 1: the Conda do it to a trade that gets an
Speaker 1: even more depth and letting Lonzo kind of be maybe
Speaker 1: the lead guard in that situation. I don't know, as
Speaker 1: it'll seem a little far fetch at the time. A
Speaker 1: guy Gerald, you know, Rick, like they you know, they
Speaker 1: do they do some they do some real fun stuff
Speaker 1: I think on the weekends there. But it was an
Speaker 1: interesting take at the time. I think Gerald specifically was saying,
Speaker 1: and while I wasn't necessarily buying that, I could see
Speaker 1: where he could come up with the narrative, so to speak.
Speaker 1: But I think they made this move in essence to
Speaker 1: have both of them, especially for this year, to see
Speaker 1: if they can make a deeper run of the Eastern Conference.
Speaker 2: Finally, absolutely, you're tuned to the baseline Cali warren Shaw
Speaker 2: discussing the hot button topics of the NBA coming up
Speaker 2: sew and I will dig into another set of players
Speaker 2: who we are on the buyer sell bandwagon of hoops redemption.
Speaker 2: Don't want to miss it here on the baseline, we
Speaker 2: are back Calie Warrenshaw Baseline NBA podcasts, and we're doing
Speaker 2: our buy or sell edition of Hoops Redemption. Guys that
Speaker 2: didn't get a lot of press, pub talk or conversation,
Speaker 2: but we do think that the moves made might speak
Speaker 2: a little bit more about whether or not this is
Speaker 2: an opportunity for these guys to either be you know,
Speaker 2: applauded or lauded when it's all said and done with
Speaker 2: with what they should be contributing for their new teams.
Speaker 2: All right, y'all, So let me go ahead, and I'll
Speaker 2: start with my number two in this conversation, And this,
Speaker 2: to me is one that definitely flew under the radar,
Speaker 2: but I'm gonna speak to it because I was a
Speaker 2: little surprise at how off of season it was for
Speaker 2: Contavious Caldwell Pope. And you know, when I think about,
Speaker 2: you know, who he is as a player, what he's
Speaker 2: meant over the last three four years. It's been kind
Speaker 2: of interesting to me because guy teams that are bringing
Speaker 2: in contables calledwell Pope know what they're bringing him for,
Speaker 2: and he knows what he's being brought in for. And
Speaker 2: since winning the championship for the Denver Nuggets, Okay, it
Speaker 2: just feels like something is a little bit off, right.
Speaker 2: He's not as defensively sound as he was coming off
Speaker 2: that season to help them win that championship. His three
Speaker 2: point shooting has not been, you know, as consistent, has
Speaker 2: actually been on a down tick, right, And even this
Speaker 2: even last year with what happened with the Orlando Magic,
Speaker 2: and I was watching those playoff games, he just seemed
Speaker 2: to be doing a lot more talking than actually helping
Speaker 2: the Orlando Magic basically lean a lot more into what
Speaker 2: made them who they were. And I'm not saying it
Speaker 2: was his fault. What I'm just saying is that it
Speaker 2: just seemed a little out of character with what you
Speaker 2: come to know when you think about KC Peak And
Speaker 2: so to me, him now being with the Memphis Grizzlies,
Speaker 2: I find it interesting because I think where a lot
Speaker 2: of people are on this perception that the Memphis Grizzlies
Speaker 2: are selling out because they got rid of Desmond Bain.
Speaker 2: I do believe that they still believe that they have
Speaker 2: an inside chance, like any of the teams in the
Speaker 2: Western Conference to make a play. And you only bring
Speaker 2: a veteran guy on here if you truly believe that
Speaker 2: he can work with John Moran. He can work with
Speaker 2: Jaren Jackson Junior and if nothing else, elevate them to
Speaker 2: play even better defensively without compromising what you were getting
Speaker 2: from the play of Desmond Baine. Now he's not your replacement,
Speaker 2: but what I'm saying is is that you obviously are
Speaker 2: bringing him to the table knowing that he can help
Speaker 2: bring contribution to what the MEMPHISUS could potentially do, especially
Speaker 2: as a starting three and d kind of guard on
Speaker 2: that roster.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I'm not so sure that he will start.
Speaker 1: I think you know where we're at a CACP at
Speaker 1: this stage's career. It's it's the quintessential solid veteran guy
Speaker 1: who doesn't really hurt you too much. His expectations in
Speaker 1: Orlando were too lofty for his proverbial station. They just
Speaker 1: didn't and he didn't have the same juice there because
Speaker 1: he also didn't have a lot of play creation.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: You come off, you know, playing with Joker, and then
Speaker 1: you know, while bon Carol and Wagner are cool and all,
Speaker 1: that's not the same level of play region even Jalen sungs.
Speaker 2: Kind of that, well, don't move the same way.
Speaker 1: It's you know, he's just not there not talking about
Speaker 1: the same situation, so he was just slightly miscast. While
Speaker 1: while nobody said the signing was bad, everybody thought there
Speaker 1: was going to be more and I think he himself
Speaker 1: expected to be maybe more productive in that situation. Now
Speaker 1: you go into Memphis, well, sure he'll have an opportunity
Speaker 1: to start, but I don't know that he will especially
Speaker 1: Jandle Wells is as good as we think he is.
Speaker 1: Right and now they also brought the aforementioned in our
Speaker 1: previous segment tied Roman too this situation. So KCP is
Speaker 1: going to have to earn those minutes. But the one
Speaker 1: thing he knows that he's going to be a good
Speaker 1: pro and that's something I think you definitely want to
Speaker 1: make sure you have alongside. You know, John Morant. You
Speaker 1: know John Morant had that last year where Derek Rose
Speaker 1: and Marcus Smart where nothing really kind of really seemed
Speaker 1: to mention that. But you can continue to have that
Speaker 1: great presence. But we're here to talk about the actual
Speaker 1: basketball and I'm maybe not as convinced as I'm not
Speaker 1: saying that you are, but I'm not sure he has
Speaker 1: as much juice left to be as impactful. While I
Speaker 1: think John can get him some good shots as well too,
Speaker 1: even Jared Jackson to a lesser degree, although we know
Speaker 1: Jared Jackson isn't really playing the cost all that much. KCP,
Speaker 1: I think is going to be productive, but not and
Speaker 1: I think in a really difference making way.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think where my concern comes into play is
Speaker 2: you're not going to be able to change what KCP
Speaker 2: has evolved into in being the quality player that he
Speaker 2: has been. Right, he is someone that operates better when
Speaker 2: the ball comes to him rather than him actually establishing
Speaker 2: anything from a guard level perspective. And that's probably the
Speaker 2: reason and that's definitely a reason why you got Ti Jerome, right, Like,
Speaker 2: you have that kind of dynamic person who can get
Speaker 2: the ball, he can you know, create on his own.
Speaker 2: And you know, when John Moran is off the floor,
Speaker 2: he tied Jerome and in many respects, I think can
Speaker 2: figure out a way to get the ball to other
Speaker 2: playmakers as well too. I think to your point, where
Speaker 2: I'm at when it comes to what KCP can bring
Speaker 2: to the table is is there has to be accountability
Speaker 2: for when the Memphis Grizzlies are not sound defensively, right,
Speaker 2: And I go back to what I was saying a
Speaker 2: little bit earlier that what was so out of character
Speaker 2: last year when it came to KCP is he wasn't
Speaker 2: even solid defensively as much as I think he could
Speaker 2: have been. Now, I don't know if it's because because
Speaker 2: of the fact that the way that Jamal Mosley had
Speaker 2: the team set up in how they play defense maybe
Speaker 2: made him look slower or made him look like he
Speaker 2: just wasn't, you know, meshing or fitting in.
Speaker 1: And I'm not.
Speaker 2: Saying that he is. He's still a quality defender, and
Speaker 2: I think that it's imperative that what he can bring
Speaker 2: to the table for the Memphis Grizzlies as far as
Speaker 2: defending goes, is gonna is gonna be catamount because you're
Speaker 2: if you're gonna, you're gonna, you're gonna thrust Jalen Wells
Speaker 2: into that situation. You're telling you're telling me that you
Speaker 2: believe that he's gonna be able to hold his own
Speaker 2: against the best two guards or guards in the Western Conference,
Speaker 2: which is still very guard heavy, And I don't know
Speaker 2: if I buy that completely, which is why having a
Speaker 2: table was Calbo Pope allows a little bit more flexibility,
Speaker 2: especially when you recognize that Wells may get into foul
Speaker 2: trouble or Morant get into foul trouble, and you need
Speaker 2: a heady, savvy defender like KCP.
Speaker 1: That part of it I.
Speaker 2: Want to make sure is still intact. Or Wilson, what
Speaker 2: was the point of you bringing him onto this roster
Speaker 2: if you didn't that he was capable of still holding
Speaker 2: his own against some of the better guards that are
Speaker 2: still in the Western Conference, right?
Speaker 1: I mean, and I think you know, it's interesting when
Speaker 1: we bring it up that way, because I think, you know,
Speaker 1: even looking most projective lineups have him as I was
Speaker 1: starting two, and Jailing Wells as a starting three, right,
Speaker 1: So maybe it's it's kind of an honest you Jaron
Speaker 1: Jackson at the four and Zach Ede at the five, right,
Speaker 1: so it should be cacp's starting job to lose. But
Speaker 1: I think where I'm going to shift the conversations some
Speaker 1: is are we thinking about what he needs to be
Speaker 1: able to do offensively in that Memphis system? Or is
Speaker 1: it more from can he be a defensive leader? Right?
Speaker 1: And it's not always the blocks and the steels or whatever,
Speaker 1: but it's just the stops, you know, or filtering guys
Speaker 1: into help with Jaron Jackson. And now you know, Zach
Speaker 1: Need is a gargantuan you know at the rim, so
Speaker 1: is he going to be able to help them from
Speaker 1: that lens and then mature the Memphis defense in a
Speaker 1: way that we've always kind of expected them to be,
Speaker 1: like this really great, great defensive team. And they showed
Speaker 1: some signs even the last couple of years, but they
Speaker 1: fell a little bit, they said a little bit last
Speaker 1: year when the change their entirety of their offense and
Speaker 1: hire all those new coaches, and we want to see
Speaker 1: if they can get that defensive identity back. That's why
Speaker 1: I think ACP probably still can be impactful. But if
Speaker 1: you're looking for him to be, you know, a forty
Speaker 1: percent three point shooter or whatever the case to be
Speaker 1: and giving you fifteen to sixteen in a game, I
Speaker 1: don't know that that KCP is still there for Memphis,
Speaker 1: but that doesn't mean he can't be helpful, especially defensively.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So I mean, so we're buying our selling.
Speaker 1: I'm well, you're buying I'm I'm a little bit more dubious.
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna situation i'd be interested.
Speaker 2: How are you taking my credit card?
Speaker 1: And listen, you you know what, it's years of podcasting
Speaker 1: with you, and I understand, like you're a KCP guy,
Speaker 1: you know, and there's nothing wrong with that. I think
Speaker 1: there's very reason. There's a lot of reasons to be
Speaker 1: KCP Guy's had a fabulous overall career and he's you know,
Speaker 1: he's helped in almost.
Speaker 2: Then he has a good acronym.
Speaker 1: I like KCP. Well you know that that works for it.
Speaker 1: Who do you have? Uh, I'm going to I'm going
Speaker 1: to jump to somebody who is, for continuity's sake, let
Speaker 1: me go with a current nugget. As you're talking about
Speaker 1: a former nugget, and this is not somebody a lot
Speaker 1: of people are going to give two wiggis about, you know,
Speaker 1: shout out to health the Skelter. But Yona's Valente this.
Speaker 1: While I know he was slirting with the opportunity, you know,
Speaker 1: to kind of go overseas after he got traded from Sacramento,
Speaker 1: I think he has I know he has a great
Speaker 1: opportunity to play winning basketball and really be on a
Speaker 1: big stage with the Denver Nuggets playing behind playing behind Jokich.
Speaker 1: I don't know how much, how many minutes they'll actually
Speaker 1: get together that that remains to potentially be seen if
Speaker 1: there'll be some kind of like wonky lineups where then
Speaker 1: you know, you play those two bigs. But Valentiunis is
Speaker 1: somebody who plays at least, you know, seventy seventy two
Speaker 1: games each year, generally very healthy and very productive, especially
Speaker 1: up from the rebounding side. I'm not going to call
Speaker 1: a bunch of plays for him, but he can post up,
Speaker 1: you can hit like you know that kind of like
Speaker 1: little turnaround or wherever the case would be. He's got
Speaker 1: a decent mid range shot. Not a great defender when
Speaker 1: it comes to blocking shots, but everybody's a very very
Speaker 1: big body, and I think as much help as you
Speaker 1: can give, you know, NICOLEA Jokic at this stage here
Speaker 1: where you don't want to continue to just wear him
Speaker 1: down forty forty five minutes a night, especially in the
Speaker 1: regular season, Valentinos can soak up a lot of those
Speaker 1: minutes and be very, very very impactful for them, especially
Speaker 1: when it comes to getting some post production in a
Speaker 1: way that they haven't had when Joker goes on the bench.
Speaker 1: So I'm looking for volunteers to play winning basketball this season.
Speaker 2: You know, one of the things that I really appreciate
Speaker 2: about the Nuggets doing this is they knew getting Yonis
Speaker 2: Valentiunas was not to get them a Jokic like, right Like,
Speaker 2: if they really wanted to get a Jokic like they
Speaker 2: get they did try to get you know, use of
Speaker 2: nurkids that ain't gonna work. Right There weren't many people
Speaker 2: out there that you're going to be able to get
Speaker 2: to do and replicate what Nicola Jokic brings to the
Speaker 2: table as far as the game of basketball. But you
Speaker 2: can get players who if they play next to a
Speaker 2: guy like Jokic, or they play for a guy like Jokic,
Speaker 2: you're gonna get the maximum of what their abilities that's
Speaker 2: allowed them to do. And with Valentiunis, and what I
Speaker 2: appreciate mostly than anything about him is he's grown to
Speaker 2: be the bully on the block and he's embraced that,
Speaker 2: he's accepted that. And sometimes that's exactly what the Denver
Speaker 2: Nuggets needed. Man. Sometimes they needed another level of toughness.
Speaker 2: They needed another level of of you know, bravado in
Speaker 2: them that is not filtered through what your Jokic gives
Speaker 2: you just because of his statistics and you know how
Speaker 2: he loves to move the basketball. Valentinas can move the basketball.
Speaker 2: He just isn't going to shoot the ball like Jokic, right,
Speaker 2: But Valentiunis can get the ball to guys. He can
Speaker 2: definitely set those picks that you always expected from Jokic.
Speaker 2: If nothing else, he actually gives another dimension to what
Speaker 2: we've been starving from Jamal Murray and how he is
Speaker 2: as a guard supposed to help accentuate the offenses in
Speaker 2: different ways. And part of that is because there's too
Speaker 2: much dependency on what Jokic has been doing and the
Speaker 2: ball going through Jokic so much so I think having
Speaker 2: a guy like Valentiunis, while again to your point, is
Speaker 2: going to eat up a lot of Yokic minutes. What
Speaker 2: I also I am appreciating about is this is now
Speaker 2: going to put that challenge back on the Nuggets to say,
Speaker 2: we have these different dynamic players. They all don't have
Speaker 2: to be like Jokic. Let's start maximizing what these guys
Speaker 2: can actually bring to the table. So it can really
Speaker 2: help diversify what the Denver Nuggets have been lacking over
Speaker 2: the last couple of years. It's basically made them a
Speaker 2: one trick pony because they know that the moment Jokic
Speaker 2: comes off the floor, the Nuggets have no imagination in offense,
Speaker 2: they have no imagination in shot selection, they have no imagine.
Speaker 2: It's like they're completely lost. But a guy like Valentnis
Speaker 2: who spent years playing for so many different teams and
Speaker 2: it's made his way into getting people to understand, I
Speaker 2: can give you what you need. You just need to
Speaker 2: tell me. He to me can be a very solid
Speaker 2: player to your point, Shaw in helping to diversify the
Speaker 2: Denver Nuggets being the perennial powerhouse team again as always
Speaker 2: yeah and again.
Speaker 1: In an age where we want everybody to shoot and
Speaker 1: big men to shoot or whatever. He's he's not doing
Speaker 1: it right. Balance youing, this is a two point bucket getter,
Speaker 1: Like that's what it's going to be. Like eighty nine
Speaker 1: or ninety one percent of his shots are within sixteen
Speaker 1: feet in below. Like he is not out there out
Speaker 1: here just jacking up. And I don't know if the
Speaker 1: Nuggets will ask him to, you know, try to stretch
Speaker 1: and do the corner three or something like that. But
Speaker 1: this's has not been his game. But as somebody who's
Speaker 1: going to be able to definitely get you some baskets, yeah,
Speaker 1: in the post and you'll catch again. I think they
Speaker 1: will be sometimes where they can play together. But I
Speaker 1: think more importantly it's just so that you'll Kitch's minutes
Speaker 1: can come down some you know, in the regular season,
Speaker 1: and while Joker's never really shrunk her for efficiency so
Speaker 1: to speak, we might even see some more efficiency as
Speaker 1: a result of not having to play, you know, those
Speaker 1: exhaustive minutes that we've seen, you know, in years past.
Speaker 1: As the Knuggers have really rutooled their roster. Obviously they
Speaker 1: got Bruce Brown back as well too. But I think
Speaker 1: valentiunis in this light, I think he's gonna be happy
Speaker 1: that he didn't get he didn't go to Europe, right
Speaker 1: and having a chance to really compete at the highest
Speaker 1: level for I think really one of the first times
Speaker 1: is in his NBA career, right like he's he was
Speaker 1: in Memphis, he was in Toronto, he was in New Orleans,
Speaker 1: and none of those situations I think were really they
Speaker 1: were really contenders, and others are legitimate contenders. And I
Speaker 1: think we may see valentunas as some of his best
Speaker 1: ball coming in a backup role.
Speaker 2: Absolutely your tune to the baseline Cali Warrenshaw discussing the
Speaker 2: hot button topics of the NBA. Coming up, we're doing
Speaker 2: part three of our Buyers Sell Hooper's Redemption.
Speaker 1: You don't want to.
Speaker 2: Miss it, man, We got we got two more interesting
Speaker 2: names to throw out there, and so you want to
Speaker 2: figure out whether or not we're buying a selling on them.
Speaker 2: Got you gotta hang with us, man, you're catching us here.
Speaker 2: Callie warren Show, don't go anywhere. We're back Calie Warrenshaw
Speaker 2: based on NBA podcast and we're doing our Buyer Sell
Speaker 2: Hoops Redemption edition.
Speaker 1: So we went.
Speaker 2: Through four right, got another two to do, Shaw, So
Speaker 2: who do you have on your on your on your list?
Speaker 1: And so I'm gonna if this is maybe not going
Speaker 1: in the in the method of the exercise, because this
Speaker 1: is not somebody who I think is poised to have
Speaker 1: a great season. But I'm hoping I'm wrong because I
Speaker 1: like him as an individual. But there's a lot of
Speaker 1: controversy about the move. And that's actually Miles Turner going
Speaker 1: to the Milwaukee Bucks. A lot was talked about Dame
Speaker 1: Lillard being stretched and waved as a result of acquiring
Speaker 1: Miles Turner, but not a lot of conversation was talked
Speaker 1: about Miles turner actual fit with with Milwaukee in that
Speaker 1: Giannis is clearly a better basketball player and a Hall
Speaker 1: of Fame player that Tyre's Haliburn is not at the
Speaker 1: stage up I think at this currently, I think Miles
Speaker 1: is going to find life very very different on this
Speaker 1: Milwaukee team than he did the last couple of years
Speaker 1: playing a light song haliburtn. Giannis is a different type
Speaker 1: of creator than than Haliburn is, and like he gets
Speaker 1: his baskets, you know, very very differently, he creates his
Speaker 1: assists very very differently. Turner is going to have to
Speaker 1: be an effective and I mean an effective knockdown jump
Speaker 1: shooter you know in this Bucks offense that I don't
Speaker 1: know that he's quite capable of. While we've seen stretches
Speaker 1: where he's been hot and we know the defense will
Speaker 1: be there, I'm just not sure about the fit offensively
Speaker 1: with this Bucks team. And it will start to come
Speaker 1: up when you talk about, well, we're basically essentially paying
Speaker 1: whatever it is, like fifty two million dollars to have
Speaker 1: for the right to Miles Turner, because we're not paying name,
Speaker 1: but we're still paying, you know, the waiting part of
Speaker 1: that salary, and that in the contract that Turn essentially signed,
Speaker 1: that's going to make Turn like this forty eight million
Speaker 1: dollar player that quite frankly, I don't know if if
Speaker 1: fiscally he can live up to that. However, he is
Speaker 1: going to do everything in his power. I know Doc
Speaker 1: will do everything in his power as well too to
Speaker 1: put him in positions to be successful. But you have
Speaker 1: to also wonder about the play creation. The table setting
Speaker 1: of a Kevin Porter junior is kind of like the
Speaker 1: lead point guard there Cole Anthony as a backup guy there.
Speaker 1: We know Yannas is full to kind of the fact
Speaker 1: of point guard. But that really puts Miles Turner in
Speaker 1: a in a kind of a compromising situation where his
Speaker 1: jump shot needs to be almost knocked down for this
Speaker 1: contract air quote contract or the money that's going be
Speaker 1: pailed out for the rights to him to actually be
Speaker 1: worth it. So I'm a little little worried for Miles
Speaker 1: in that regard, but he's again he's an amazing individual.
Speaker 2: It's just got a lot on his plate this upcoming season. Listen,
Speaker 2: this is a very unusual circumstance and I think the
Speaker 2: added pressure of him signing with arguably arrival right to me,
Speaker 2: think kind of speaks you know, more to what is
Speaker 2: taking place. Right Obviously in his mind he doesn't see
Speaker 2: things in that light, right, Like he's in that that
Speaker 2: maybe that part of that generation where that won't have
Speaker 2: any kind of impact whatsoever about what it is that
Speaker 2: he wants to contribute. He could have already had maybe
Speaker 2: one foot out the door, recognizing you know, hey, I
Speaker 2: only have so many years left for me to give
Speaker 2: the best of what I can give. And at the
Speaker 2: same time, I only have so many opportunities or teams
Speaker 2: on the table that still have an outside or inside
Speaker 2: chance to make a run for a chip.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: So it's to your point, it's it's all kind of interesting,
Speaker 2: you know when we talk about a guy like Miles Turner,
Speaker 2: no question, and you know we've had our conversations. We've
Speaker 2: even had Miles Turner on our show quite some time ago, right, Like,
Speaker 2: he to me kind of gives me the flashes of
Speaker 2: what I would you know, would still would love to
Speaker 2: have seen for most of our bigs now in the
Speaker 2: current you know, NBA, and he's had to evolve in
Speaker 2: a way that's allowed him to be sustainable in the
Speaker 2: style of his play, especially playing for the Indiana Pacers.
Speaker 2: So now he's going to have to pivot and do
Speaker 2: that for the Milwaukee Bucks and do that. Nixon arguably
Speaker 2: one of the greatest power you know, one of the
Speaker 2: great power forwards that's going to ever play this game
Speaker 2: of basketball. So you know, in a way he was
Speaker 2: a part that that person would have been his his rival.
Speaker 2: That's the person where if he was as generational as
Speaker 2: a Yiannis was, we would be talking about these matchups
Speaker 2: between him and the Milwaukee Bucks when he was playing
Speaker 2: as a pacer. But it never evolved in that kind
Speaker 2: of way. It never happened that kind of way. I'm
Speaker 2: wondering how that influence is going to have for Miles
Speaker 2: Turner in this iteration.
Speaker 1: Because.
Speaker 2: That's what I was hoping for, right, I was hoping
Speaker 2: that he would have been that person that's elevated saying,
Speaker 2: you know, among the bigs, we are we are the behemoths, right,
Speaker 2: we are the what do they call it is Godzilla
Speaker 2: versus King Kong, right, king of the monsters. They arguably
Speaker 2: could have been the King of the Monsters in the
Speaker 2: Eastern Conference and now what he has, what he's bringing
Speaker 2: to the table is to help supplement elevating the Milwaukee
Speaker 2: Bucks back to that level of conversation where we're buying
Speaker 2: into them being legit contenders, right, and it not just
Speaker 2: being legit contenders solely on what Yannis does, but it's
Speaker 2: clearly going to have to be on what moles Turner
Speaker 2: contributes for the Milwaukee Bucks. And that's just a different
Speaker 2: conversation and a different dynamic altogether.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, and it's funny because you look at
Speaker 1: them on paper, and Miles and Brook are very similar
Speaker 1: in terms of like there are points per game, even
Speaker 1: in some ways the way they play. Both really good
Speaker 1: rim defenders, you know, always in the leaders if you
Speaker 1: in terms of blocks, they both shoot about five to
Speaker 1: six threes a game, shoot about thirty five well somewhere
Speaker 1: between thirty five and forty percent. But their offensive systems
Speaker 1: have been very, very different. So while the statistical production
Speaker 1: is very very close in Trump's of comparison, and that's
Speaker 1: where I think Milwaukee maybe got a little intoxicated. It's like, oh,
Speaker 1: we got our Brook Lopez replacement, you know, younger version,
Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 2: I think they I think they're I think they're trying
Speaker 2: to I think they're trying to re you know, do
Speaker 2: this again. I think they're you know, when brook Lopez
Speaker 2: came to the Milwaukee Bucks and played next to Jannis,
Speaker 2: that was a resurgence of brook Lopez and his career
Speaker 2: and the numbers that he put up defensively. You know,
Speaker 2: first it started more offensively, but when they won the championship,
Speaker 2: it was the combination of the numbers that he provided
Speaker 2: both offensively and defensively, and that just continued a couple
Speaker 2: of years more until he now is you know, in greed,
Speaker 2: you know, going to to the Los Angeles Clippers. I
Speaker 2: almost feel like the Milwaukee Bucks are just like, let's
Speaker 2: rerun this project one more time, you know, you know,
Speaker 2: this is how we created brook Lopez. And maybe that
Speaker 2: is something about Giannis that you know, we saw this
Speaker 2: with Bobby Portos as well too, which is why he
Speaker 2: legitimately became a great backup as well. There's something about
Speaker 2: playing next to Gianni's maybe in some regards that might
Speaker 2: actually accentuate what's been, you know, hidden under the crevices
Speaker 2: of Miles Turner's greatness. Maybe that's what will happen over
Speaker 2: the next couple of years, and you know, maybe we're
Speaker 2: having this conversation about the Milwaukee Bucks being legitimate contenders
Speaker 2: again because of what he's now going to be able
Speaker 2: to do next to Jannis than what he was doing
Speaker 2: all by himself.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, we will will absolutely see. I mean, Bobby
Speaker 1: Porters is there as well too. Obviously, there's like it's
Speaker 1: a different cast of characters there and different coaching and
Speaker 1: different offensive set. So how Miles will integrate into this,
Speaker 1: we just don't know. Again, I thought it was worth
Speaker 1: bringing up because when you look at the numbers, very comparable,
Speaker 1: you know, Turner's younger, et cetera, et cetera. I just
Speaker 1: don't know if it's going to be the same thing
Speaker 1: that every that that the Bucks are hoping for. And
Speaker 1: I know Miles was anxious to get the bag and
Speaker 1: you know Kuters are forgetting it. But will the production
Speaker 1: be there in the way that the Bucks needed to
Speaker 1: be where he can have a season worth leaving the Indiana.
Speaker 2: Pacers for absolutely You're tuned to the baseline Cali Warrenshaw
Speaker 2: discussing the hot button topics of the NBA. Do Shaw,
Speaker 2: you know, I want to blame you because I had
Speaker 2: my third all lined up ready to go, and then
Speaker 2: you hit me with the MPG card. And now and listen,
Speaker 2: any strays I gave you? I gave an extensive list.
Speaker 2: I gave an extensive list of a ton of people,
Speaker 2: and then we have this conversation off the air and
Speaker 2: then you hit me with that. Well, you know, it
Speaker 2: is an interesting topic to have, So any strays, any
Speaker 2: any collateral damage.
Speaker 1: You got to own this one, bro, you got it.
Speaker 2: I'm with you, Hey, Antherony Simons is lucky. I'm just anyway,
Speaker 2: So my final by ourself is going to be you know,
Speaker 2: Michael Porter Jr. Now listen, everybody who's heard me seems
Speaker 2: to think I got a grudge with this kid.
Speaker 1: I don't. I really don't.
Speaker 2: I Actually, when we first started talking about Michael Porter Junior,
Speaker 2: I've said, I, you know, totally like this guy. He's
Speaker 2: he's his untapped potential. He is a diamond in the rough.
Speaker 2: The Denver Nuggets may have struck gold with this kid,
Speaker 2: and listen, bye bye. If you really look at it holistically,
Speaker 2: he is definitely part of that team that won the championship.
Speaker 2: He was directly responsible for elevating the ability for the
Speaker 2: Denver Nuggets to shoot the basketball, you know, reasonably well, right,
Speaker 2: But where I think things fell short And I don't
Speaker 2: know if it's just the style, the system, the coach,
Speaker 2: whatever it is. You could clearly tell over the last
Speaker 2: couple of years that Michael Porter Junior needed a different
Speaker 2: change of play like pace, he needed different scenery, he
Speaker 2: needed to be in a different circumstances situation. Wait right now,
Speaker 2: you look at his numbers, statistically legitimate numbers. Man average
Speaker 2: thirty three minutes per game, almost nineteen eighteen, nineteen points
Speaker 2: per game, seven rebounds to assist, shot fifty percent from
Speaker 2: the floor, thirty nine point five percent for three, which
Speaker 2: is only point five percent for what he basically, you know.
Speaker 1: Gives you.
Speaker 2: You know, I'm sorry, he's the zero point four percent
Speaker 2: from what he gives you in his career from shooting
Speaker 2: the three. So what do we make of him now
Speaker 2: going to the Brooklyn Nets. Well, if if Michael Porter
Speaker 2: Junior thought that him going to the Denver Nuggets was
Speaker 2: as a key piece to elevating the Nuggets, winning them
Speaker 2: a championship and things of that nature, and then you
Speaker 2: see the emergence of a guy like Yoki choose to
Speaker 2: become a three time MVP. If Michael Porter Junior really
Speaker 2: believes in his skills, at what better way for you
Speaker 2: to come out and you know, quiet the naysayers shut
Speaker 2: people down then by going out there to Brooklyn and
Speaker 2: ultimately balling balling out and giving Jody Fernandez in company
Speaker 2: a reason for them to be like, I like where
Speaker 2: we're going with this. I like the direction of what
Speaker 2: we can potentially get from a guy like Michael Porter
Speaker 2: Junior with the roster that we have, he can clearly
Speaker 2: be a standout kind of guy. So that being said,
Speaker 2: does he have the passion to want to do that?
Speaker 2: Does he have the desire to want to do that?
Speaker 2: Because I'm gonna tell you this right now, Shaw, you
Speaker 2: don't get too many circumstances like what he's got right now.
Speaker 1: Where the the bank is open.
Speaker 2: The bank is literally open, the nets are playing with
Speaker 2: house money, right So there's really no reason why he
Speaker 2: can't go ball out. His numbers can still have an impact.
Speaker 2: They're not zero calories. He can have an impact if
Speaker 2: he really really wants to.
Speaker 1: Well. As we record, he is the loan adult the
Speaker 1: room when it comes to offensive production there's literally nobody
Speaker 1: on this roster right now, and I would trust this
Speaker 1: for the basketball on a regular basis. There's rumors Cam
Speaker 1: Thomas might eventually come back because he's not finding what
Speaker 1: he likes on the open market. So if Cam comes back,
Speaker 1: then great, Well you have two guys who in essence
Speaker 1: are kind of could be potential chuckers. That said, Michael Porter,
Speaker 1: his counting stats are good, right, forty three point shooter
Speaker 1: for his career, you know, seven plus rebounds a game,
Speaker 1: you know, for his career. Like, this is a guy
Speaker 1: who can play basketball, but he's had the lap of
Speaker 1: luxury playing alongside you know, Nikola jokicch for a very
Speaker 1: long time. Now, what happens when you are the guy
Speaker 1: that defense is key in on every single night, there's
Speaker 1: nobody that there's nowhere for you to hide, so to speak.
Speaker 1: Defense is recorded, like, yo, well this is this is
Speaker 1: only guy I got, so let's stop him. They're not
Speaker 1: worried about Terrence Man, you know, going off, or Noah
Speaker 1: Colney or like, it's just like, this is not disrespect
Speaker 1: to the Brooklyn roster. The roster is very intent on
Speaker 1: trying to tank and get better draft picks. So now
Speaker 1: Michael Porter Junior becomes the lead guy, and yeah, he
Speaker 1: could have a season where he gets twenty five a
Speaker 1: game or whether the case would be, But what will
Speaker 1: the efficiency look like? Well, he's still be able to
Speaker 1: shoot fifty percent from the floor and forty percent from
Speaker 1: three as he's just gonna get touch upon touch on touch.
Speaker 1: I don't know, you know, is he somebody who'll be
Speaker 1: able to raise the ceiling of some of the other
Speaker 1: guys around him? That will be something I will really
Speaker 1: be watch. I want to see it. I mean, it
Speaker 1: can happen when you're like kind of like the lead guy. Right,
Speaker 1: there's a difference, like there's a there's there you can
Speaker 1: see the folk on the road and an offensive set
Speaker 1: almost like every play is like, all right, is this
Speaker 1: the best shot? Or is this the best shot? Because
Speaker 1: it gets me? Right? Do I? Or do I kick
Speaker 1: it to whitehead or whatever the be on the floor.
Speaker 1: You don't know if he has that kind of decision making. Yeah,
Speaker 1: do you know when that will happen? Shaw?
Speaker 2: When the Brooklyn Nets are playing on primetime games? Like
Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying like that to me is
Speaker 2: when I think those questions would be answered for me
Speaker 2: that level of elevation, right, because the Brooklyn Thats have
Speaker 2: been starving for that. They try to get that out
Speaker 2: of Michale Bridges, they try to get that out of
Speaker 2: Cam Johnson, right. And so these are good solid players,
Speaker 2: but these are good solid players within the cast, and
Speaker 2: what they bring to the team collectively can help stand out.
Speaker 2: I think Michael Porter Junior has always been the kind
Speaker 2: of guy where he wants to stand out. He wants
Speaker 2: to stand out on the bright lights. He definitely was
Speaker 2: not going to do that in the shadows of Jamal
Speaker 2: Murray and Nikola Jokic and his style of basketball while
Speaker 2: within the flow.
Speaker 1: It's kind of like what Papovich did.
Speaker 2: With Kawhi Leonard, you know what I'm saying, Like Malone
Speaker 2: did to Porter, what Papovich kind of did to.
Speaker 1: To Kawhi Leonard.
Speaker 2: And when Kawhi Leonard had his moment, his opportunity, he
Speaker 2: snatched that decision out of the Spurs and Papovich's you
Speaker 2: know pocket, so to speak. This you don't have to
Speaker 2: worry about that for Michael Porter Junior because Jody Fernandez
Speaker 2: can only depend on what Michael Porter Junior ultimately keeping it.
Speaker 2: Even if Camp Thomas comes back, that doesn't matter. What
Speaker 2: matters to me is what version of Michael Porter Junior
Speaker 2: during those primetime games you play the Boston Celtics, when
Speaker 2: you play against the New York Knicks, when you play
Speaker 2: against or when you're playing in the in the Emirates
Speaker 2: Cup tournament, right when you're given an opportunity for you
Speaker 2: to put on a performance, to put on a show,
Speaker 2: will you be able to do that? Because if you ever,
Speaker 2: if you've ever asked me Shaw, the thing that has
Speaker 2: always bothered me about the upside and the potential of
Speaker 2: Michael Porter Junior is that style that he plays where
Speaker 2: he could just chuck the you know, the living daylights
Speaker 2: out of it was a detriment to the Denver Nuggets
Speaker 2: when that wasn't what was needed. But in this situation,
Speaker 2: if he's gonna do all that chucking and he's making shots,
Speaker 2: that's gonna put him on a different platform because he's
Speaker 2: in a market that's gonna love that. It's gonna embrace that,
Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying, Because nobody's gonna tell him differently.
Speaker 2: There's nothing that's gonna counter that aspect of it. So
Speaker 2: it'll be interesting to see if he's gonna be that
Speaker 2: kind of person on the lights and it succeed, because
Speaker 2: if not, he's just going to be another player. Using
Speaker 2: the Brooklyn nets as is a gateway for us to
Speaker 2: recognize he's a good shooter, he's a quality player, but
Speaker 2: he needs to be in a system where those type
Speaker 2: of things mask and don't necessarily stand out to be
Speaker 2: a detriment to me.
Speaker 1: Well, it's going to be a really unique year for
Speaker 1: him and the opportunities that are presented to that. I
Speaker 1: don't know if Brooklyn is looking to keep him around
Speaker 1: or if they would look to try to deal m
Speaker 1: He does obviously have a hefty, hefty salary attached to him,
Speaker 1: but at the same time, again, they have no other
Speaker 1: guy who can score like legitimately that you're even consistently
Speaker 1: concerned about. So unless they bring Thomas back, you know,
Speaker 1: this is Michael Porter's show to kind of run and
Speaker 1: let's see what he's able to do with it. You know,
Speaker 1: in this whatever it is, season, half a season, or whatever,
Speaker 1: it's all Tomate ends up being the one thing that
Speaker 1: he has going for him.
Speaker 2: Shaw he played seventy seven games last year, so he
Speaker 2: was healthy for the year, which I think is a
Speaker 2: good thing. I'm hoping that even for that, that the
Speaker 2: Brooklyn Nets don't overuse him, right, like they solely dependent
Speaker 2: on him. Thirty three minutes, I think is decent. I
Speaker 2: think that if he's playing and he is your number
Speaker 2: one guy, thirty three minutes is really kind of pushing
Speaker 2: it for a guy like Porter. So it'll be interesting
Speaker 2: to see that that style, that version, that usage of Porter,
Speaker 2: he can sustain that this year, then what was actually
Speaker 2: given to him, what he did for the Denver Nuggets
Speaker 2: last year.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't think his mens will well up too much.
Speaker 1: Maybe a minute or two. While he played like thirty
Speaker 1: three thirty four last year, maybe he's at thirty four
Speaker 1: to thirty five. I think he much alluded to like
Speaker 1: it's a usage. He took thirteen point six shots. He's
Speaker 1: been averaging between eleven and thirteen and a half shots
Speaker 1: for the last four years, like kind of like after
Speaker 1: that second year and he was just like, oh he'll
Speaker 1: catches that. Dude, he's kind of fallen back. But you
Speaker 1: could always probably like feel it kind of bubbling under
Speaker 1: the surface, like this guy wasn't here, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean. But he knew he could not that. So
Speaker 1: I give him a lot of credit for playing the
Speaker 1: role that he needed to play in Denver, you know,
Speaker 1: after especially after he got the contract. I think that
Speaker 1: was part of it. Probably too, they paid him when
Speaker 1: they didn't really need to, kind of overpaid him when
Speaker 1: they didn't need to. But he's played a significant role
Speaker 1: and played a master ball in them, you know, winning
Speaker 1: an NBA championship a few seasons ago. But now it's
Speaker 1: kind of make or break. So in that thirty three
Speaker 1: thirty four minutes, do his shots go up to eighteen
Speaker 1: to twenty? I would say probably yes. And you want
Speaker 1: to you know, in that with those extra shot attempts
Speaker 1: and that usages that will be coming.
Speaker 2: Wait, show you heads and your bets on that one.
Speaker 1: Yeah, hit yeah, looking over under, definitely taking the over.
Speaker 2: Somebody get this man the black card. My man wants
Speaker 2: he wants to go broke on that one.
Speaker 1: I'm not at it though. I mean, if you're looking
Speaker 1: around and again I feel like I'm throwing shade. But
Speaker 1: in terms of like the experience, in terms of being
Speaker 1: like scores in the NBA, there's nobody else on that
Speaker 1: roster that has that like the most next most accomplished
Speaker 1: guy I guess is Terrence man Ah cool, you know,
Speaker 1: like let's see.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, listen, there's no question he's gonna be
Speaker 2: averaging somewhere around twenty four, you know points, twenty five
Speaker 2: points per game.
Speaker 1: Easy.
Speaker 2: But again, it'll be interesting when the bright lights the
Speaker 2: big market you know games, when they take place. You know,
Speaker 2: is that type, is that person that guy you know,
Speaker 2: Michael Porter Jr. Gonna be ready to go, ready to
Speaker 2: you know, show up and show out. And I think
Speaker 2: that is what I'm gonna be most interested in seeing
Speaker 2: because listen, man, you play a few years on a
Speaker 2: on a very it's it's kind of like what we're
Speaker 2: talking about right now with them with Klay Thompson, right Like,
Speaker 2: there has to be a happy medium because even you
Speaker 2: as a player, when you're on a when you're a
Speaker 2: certain you know, you read certain milestone certain parts of
Speaker 2: your career, you also have to recognize even when a
Speaker 2: team pays money, a ton of money to bring you on,
Speaker 2: it isn't always just necessarily for what it was that
Speaker 2: you were doing, what you you know, made you so
Speaker 2: successful to the previous team. It's also about what you
Speaker 2: could potentially do for the rest of the team, and
Speaker 2: so to me, I just think it's interesting in what
Speaker 2: way will Michael Porter Junior, you know, kind of lend
Speaker 2: himself to this Brooklyn Nets team and lend himself to
Speaker 2: his career arguably right moving forward, because I think this
Speaker 2: is what always has been the elephant in the room,
Speaker 2: you know, of what needed to be addressed and answered.
Speaker 2: Does he does he throt can he thrive on his own?
Speaker 2: Or was it that he just never realized how grateful
Speaker 2: he should have been playing next to you know, Jamal
Speaker 2: Murray and Nikola Jokic and really elevating himself in a
Speaker 2: way where what he was doing was for the better
Speaker 2: of the team and and and helping the team win
Speaker 2: more than what they were able.
Speaker 1: You know, to to do.
Speaker 2: Not to take away from what they have done, but
Speaker 2: I just think that he's always been the X factor
Speaker 2: guy that never really lived up to what I think
Speaker 2: he could have potentially have been, and now is the
Speaker 2: opportunity for him to actually prove that part of it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, kudos to Michael Porter Jr. Let's see what Miles
Speaker 1: Turner can also do as well. To two guys maybe
Speaker 1: or maybe a little bit doubtful about how they'll perform
Speaker 1: in their new situations, but all the opportunity in the
Speaker 1: world for them to be successful. We're not ruining against
Speaker 1: anybody on the baseline.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I want to see these guys succeed, man, Yeah, absolutely,
Speaker 2: But I want to see these guys succeed absolutely, man,
Speaker 2: like I you know, from the days that we remember
Speaker 2: when they first came, when they walked onto that podium,
Speaker 2: shook hands. You know, there are different people now in
Speaker 2: different situations circumstances, and that to me is the part
Speaker 2: of the of the allure of what we're looking forward
Speaker 2: to when it comes to this upcoming season.
Speaker 1: And and I and I'm all for it.
Speaker 2: So you sir, all right, man, great show as always, Man,
Speaker 2: good stuff. You know, I appreciate you, uh you know,
Speaker 2: not putting me in the red uh with with my
Speaker 2: buy or sell. And you know, for anyone who knows
Speaker 2: who the money man is between the both of us,
Speaker 2: you're looking at that dude right there.
Speaker 1: That's why he is the Warrenshaw because I get out
Speaker 1: of here anyway. We shout out to guys we didn't
Speaker 1: get a chance to touch on. And you know Anthony
Speaker 1: simons 'angel, Russell Duncan Robinson. Obviously Katie is going to
Speaker 1: be covered exhaustively, so we know that joring to Pool
Speaker 1: City Bay, Dylan Brooks and Jalen Green use of dar
Speaker 1: kitsch as well to Brook Lopez, we alread talk about
Speaker 1: Bradley Beale from the Clippers side. So some other guys too,
Speaker 1: you know that should be intriguing watches for how they
Speaker 1: land in some new places. But you know these are
Speaker 1: our top six, our sinisor six so to speak, and
Speaker 1: we'd love to hear who some of Europis are here
Speaker 1: from upcoming abusis.
Speaker 2: Absolutely Once again, we'd like to thank you and us
Speaker 2: for hopping off board with us this week for the baseline.
Speaker 2: Kelly warren Shaw, we appreciate you guys, thanks for joining us.
Speaker 1: You know where to find this man.
Speaker 2: We got another one locked up, ready loaded to go,
Speaker 2: so we'll catch up with you next time