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Speaker 1: Welcome to this edition of The High Strangers Factor, copyrighted

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on the Paranormal UK Radio Network. I am Steve Ward

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along with Susie bass Steele Andie Mercer is unable to

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be with us tonight. The High Strangers Factor was created

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by Steve Ward and Addie Mercer a little over half

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a decade ago, and we have always pursued the mysteries

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of the unknown with interesting guests. Well, Susy, I guess

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it's just you and me tonight. So I'd like to

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tell people that we are like beacons on a fog

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shrouded night. I think I stole that from.

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Speaker 2: Larry King, but that's very cinematic. I like the imagery

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of that.

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Speaker 1: So please remind people who you are and how they

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can find out about you and your work.

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Speaker 2: So I am sometimes called the Pucklogy Whisperer. You can

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find me on YouTube under that, and I deal mostly

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with puckologies, the little people in the Bridgewater Triangle. It

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does take right now a blood sacrifice to summon me.

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But if you I do still take Puckwogy sightings. You

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can go to Puckwoges dot blogspot dot com and use

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the contact form there. If you have one for me?

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Speaker 1: Have you gotten anything recently? Any reports?

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Speaker 2: Now in the last few months. I got a pretty

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decent one that I'm actually hoping to run past our

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guest tonight and get his take on it, because there

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was some interesting things that went along with that one.

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Speaker 1: Oh, very good. Well, let's introduce our guest. Doctor Simeon

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Hine is the author of Black Swan Ghosts. A sociologist

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encounters witnesses to unidentified aerial craft, their occupants, and other

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elements of the multiverse. This book, now in its second edition,

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is filled with eighteen original witness cases from those brave

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enough to come forward and tell us what they've seen,

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including former NASA, former government intelligence and aerospace workers, retired

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Air Force pilots, and many others. He also wrote Opening Minds,

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A Journey of Extraordinary Encounters, Crop circles, and Planetary Intelligence,

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over twenty years ago. His most recent book is Dark Matter, Monsters, Cryptids, Ball, Lightning,

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and the Science of Secret life Forms. This book examines

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the science and witness accounts behind mysterious cryptid encounters and

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voting Bigfoot. Why are these creatures often associated with orbs,

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sudden temperature changes, and electronic interference Sime and welcome to

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the show. Welcome to the High Strangers Factor.

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Speaker 3: Thanks Steven Susie, thanks for having me here today.

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Speaker 1: Well, heck, you know, I don't even know where to begin.

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I was it's been a little while since I've read

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Dark Matter Monsters. It needs another reading or two because

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it's for me. It's it's pretty, it's very revolutionary. I mean,

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your your ideas, you're just can you got kind of

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summarize a little bit for people that are not familiar

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with that book. What you know how you compare the

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phenomena of cold fusion and and paranormal phenomena.

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Speaker 3: Oh well thanks, uh yeah, that it was a very

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challenging book to write. I got the idea from doing

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a long term investigation into what's called cold fusion. It

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has other names, low energy, nuclear reaction, current energy transformations.

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I got involved with the big foot side of it

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from my remote viewing students in Colorado. I've been teaching

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remote viewing in Colorado since nineteen ninety seven. I first

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learned it in ninety six and the Colorado Natives would

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tell me their Bigfoot encounters. And this is over a

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couple decades, and you know, I'm as thick as anyone else,

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so it didn't really sink in.

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Speaker 2: Silence your phones please, Yes, how unprofessional, Steve.

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Speaker 1: No kidding. And what stunby is There's a name on

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here I've never seen before.

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Speaker 3: So that's kind of small. That's typical. Maybe it's indrid

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cold or something like this.

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Speaker 1: Well, you know, somebody just just wished me a happy

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indrid cold day today.

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Speaker 3: Oh, there you go, there you go. So so I

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you know, I heard about Bigfoot not I had seen

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the Patterson Gimblin film in the seventies as part of

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a preview to a movie that I went to as

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a teenager. So I was aware of the Bigfoot idea,

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but growing up in New York in the East Coast,

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it wasn't something that I ever heard anyone ever talk about.

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Not once. Can I remember anyone ever talking about anything

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even related to these topics. So when I went out

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west for graduate school, and I mean Grover Krantz was

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just upstairs for me at WSU where I went got

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my PhD, Pullman Washington, who was one of the main

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academics to first start studying bigfoot. I didn't know him,

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but I mean it was sort of around. The topic

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was around, but I guess for me it was encountering

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people who had had encounters and then you know, like

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a lot of curious people. I just went to some

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conferences and I talked to people at those conferences, and

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I was really astounded Steve to hear of these electromagnetic

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effects being around Bigfoot, which for me were very reminiscent

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of what I had seen studying crop circles in the UK.

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The remote viewing subject led me to crop circles just

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because that's the type of target people would occasionally want

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to do. People like to use RB to investigate the unknown.

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So I went on some crop circle tours and then

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kept getting involved in the topic, leading tours myself there

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for a number of years until very recently. And so

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I had seen these were electromagnetic effects, and I sought

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around Bigfoot witnesses, and the lecturers at these conferences talked

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about the same thing and more. They talked about transparencies,

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sparkly lights, or they talked about strange, even strange kind

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of pique effects objects moving around in the presence of

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these creatures inside their vehicles, and this really hooked me

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into the whole Bigfoot encryptied topic was just my experience

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in the crop circle scene. Batteries and cameras fail. So

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I knew that vortex type circular patterns, even in wheat,

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could have these nonordinary electromagnetic effects, but to hear it

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happening around what were allegedly biological entities really through my

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mind for a loop. And I've been really you know,

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it's just kind of a curious person studying it ever since.

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And that's was sort of the genesis of dark matter monsters.

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Was what do we see around bigfoot cryptid encounters that

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we see around other paranormal encounters, around UFL encounters. You

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mentioned my book Black Swan Goes. Is there some sort

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of underlying reality that informs all of these topics that

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we've never really talked about? And I thought, I can

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see some connections here, and that became the basis of

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dark matter monsters.

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Speaker 1: I know that initially, UH, cold fusion was very controversial,

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and the people that were discovering it were laughed at

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and said that they were faking it and making it up.

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Uh is it pretty much accepted?

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Speaker 3: Now?

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Speaker 1: Where does the where does this line now cold fusion

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in the realm of science? And and the acceptance.

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Speaker 3: No, it's a good question, Steve, and yeah. They Fleischmann

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and Ponds, the two researchers at the University of Utah,

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were really pilloried by the academic community. Their university wanted

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them to hold a press conference so they could the

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university could get the patent rights to the process. Fleischmann

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and Ponds didn't want to do this. As you know,

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in academia, the normal route is to go through a

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peer reviewed published paper, and the university pushed them to

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hold a press conference, which other people found kind of,

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you know, a little on the garish side. Normally, you

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don't hold press conferences in science unless you're at the

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very end of the research and you can finally announce something.

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So they received a lot of hostility from the research community,

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which I don't think was very well deserved. They didn't

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call it cold fusion. Other people called it cold fusion.

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It's not really cold fusion. We don't have neutrons fusing

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at room temperature. And this is the problem intellectually a

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lot of physicists and electrochemists had with the process. Nonetheless,

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it is a real process. There is something going on there.

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It's been reproduced thousands of times by different labs around

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the world. It has a newer name called low energy

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nuclear reaction, and there's another name coherent energy transformation, since

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it seems to have something to do with coherent matter,

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something akin analogis to a laser like that, but with

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atoms of material. And I think, based on our own

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Department of Energies interest in the subject, particularly a company

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called Proton twenty one Labs from Kiev, Ukraine, which I'm

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told that they actually absorbed into the DOE program, that

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this is an established process that does really work. We've

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had many other researchers, Ken Schulers, who worked with hal

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put Off in the remote Viewing program, also in ASAP,

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the government a UFO program that went till about twenty

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eleven I believe twenty twelve, later replaced by a TIP.

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There have been a number of researchers Takiyaki Matsumoto who've

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learned about recently, who did a lot of really detailed

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experimental analysis of the process. It is a real process.

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It creates transmutation, new elements and steve. It creates a

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lot of effects that in my mind are seen around

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Bigfoot crypted encounters, which is why I think there is

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a connection there and other states of matter, hence the

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connection to dark matter. But I have to add one

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element here, which is important. The government often encourages us

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to laugh at topics that the government doesn't want to

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be known more widely by the public because it's part

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of classified special access programs. So there's a second component

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here we need to look at. Is if it is

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something that doesn't really have much science behind it, why

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has DOE invested a lot of resources into what we

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call cold fusion. Google attempted to replicate it recently for

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I think for a costum by fourteen million dollars, but

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they didn't quite do it the way other people have

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replicated it. They didn't get the same results. So it's

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still a controversial subject. But I think if you take

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the time to look at the research and the research

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tradition in this area, going back to Fleischmann Pondsen even earlier,

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and looking at Russian Soviet research, you're getting pretty much

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the same type of effect every time. At one of

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the conferences, I heard from a researcher from Italy, Vittorio Violante,

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from EENEA, the top Energy research government lab in Italy,

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and he told us point blank they had reproduced cold

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fusion numerous times. They hadn't quite got it to the

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point where it was a sustainable reaction that could be

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put into technology that would generate unlimited energy. But they

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had seen the excess heat. They were convinced it's real.

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It's just a very challenging reaction to get going. It's

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more akin like a musical symphony, where all the notes

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have to be in tune, and if something's out of tune,

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the reaction will stop. That's my way of thinking of it.

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And so, just like any early technology or scientific discovery,

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it's going to get a lot or ridicule because people

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who are already established, like in hot fusion, the hot fusion,

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tokmac reactors, cern big government funded projects to the tune

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of billions of dollars. They don't want any competitor coming

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along that can do this on a tabletop for a

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few hundred bucks. Right. So, in my mind, just as

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a sociologist, there are multiple reasons why other scientists ridicule it,

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and it has nothing to do with the veracity of

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the process. It has to do with people protecting their turf.

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You had this happened to Michael Faraday and James Kirk

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Maxwell too, by the way, with the invention of electromagnetism.

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Their opponents at the time, and we were just talking

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about this a few minutes to go suzzy about being

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interviews and who's interviewing you? And so their opponents at

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the time were the Newtonians back in the eighteen hundreds

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who didn't want to accept the idea of fields. They

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were into direct interactions the way Newton thought of it, reaction,

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force and reaction like a complementary process. The Newtonian laws

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of physics that describe how particles interact and physical things

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interact without fields, just through some sort of gravitational interaction.

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But the electromagnetic view of the world helped create radio,

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It created television, electronics, the internet, iPhones, other types of phones.

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I mean, it's everywhere in our lives now. But the

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people that could have accepted it at the time were

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hostile to it. So we shouldn't take the hostility of

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other researchers to cult fusion is any indication of whether

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the results are real or not. Similarly, with these types

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of topics that we like to talk about here, bigfoot cryptids,

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UFO is paranormal. People have their own turf established and guys,

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I've seen this happen in our own subject area. People

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kind of claked take a claim on a certain explanation,

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and they will be very hostile to other researchers that

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you would say, Hey, you guys are in the same field.

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How come you know nobody wants to share their turf.

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And it's no different between science and people that study

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weird science, Like I like to study fringe science because

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the fringe science today of today becomes the science factor tomorrow. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I know Matsumoto has been pretty controversial and he's been

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met with some opposition, but I found it interesting in

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Dark Matter Monsters, you talk about the micro black holes

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in the microball.

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Speaker 3: Lightning right right.

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Speaker 2: In the Bridgewater triangle you see. I don't know if

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you would you would want to call it ball lightning.

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But we have orbs a lot, and people always like

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to call them swamp gas. I have seen swamp gas,

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and I have seen one of these orbs. We call

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them Taypewonka's here. One is a ball of energy and

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it's distinctly different. And that part of the book reminded

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me very much of my experience and other experiences that

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I've heard about. But another thing that happens there, and

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I think it was Ken Shoulders that talked about this,

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there is this large like shadow figure, darker than than blackness.

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He's described as it's always seen with those those balls

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of lights. So can you can you speak a little

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bit more about the microball lightning and those types of theories.

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Speaker 3: No, excellent question, Sudie. I mean you're really capturing the

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heart of what the argument is here, which is that

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these phenomena of orbs ball lightning, microball lightning, hes dollin lights,

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lights that are seen over paranormal hotspots, bradshar Ranch, Marley Ranch,

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Skinwalker Ranch. People have looked into this. Highly qualified physicists

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have looked into this. And I'm mentioning the work of

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like David Freiberger of Stanford Linear Accelerator Center DOE funded,

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and he calls them mobile luminous objects, and he says

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they are all part of the same family of objects.

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There may be variations, and it doesn't exclude the idea

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that there's some intentionality or consciousness that seems to be

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associated with some of these objects. The way they move around.

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They really seem intelligent, but the physical explanation of how

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they exist seems to come down to some sort of

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variation of Maxwell's equations that our modern science hasn't looked

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at very much, because we're used to basically electric electric

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currents with some magnetic charge, and these are more magnetic

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entities with some electric components, so they're like magneto electric.

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That's just one explanation. Freiberger called the basis of all

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these objects vortons, like a vortex mixed with a magnetic element.

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But you're absolutely right. Takiyaki Matsumoto believed that's what he saw,

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and he was an experimental physicist, so he had these

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photo emulsions. He did tons of underwater spark discharges and

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recorded these little glowing things moving along the wires, which

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he believed was the basis of what at the time

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was called ColdFusion. Ken Shoulders, like you're mentioning, also did research.

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He did it more with pulse discharged devices. He was

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a micro electronics specialist. He believed he was also looking

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at micro ball lightning, and you're right, he did shoulders.

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And I just did a video of this for my

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YouTube channel that I uploaded yesterday or Friday, and he

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argued that this created a dark world, that there are

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dark versions of these orbs and ball lightning that you

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won't see but could be in the space you're in.

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And Shoulders went as far as to suggest that their

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life forms based on this dark ball lightning, hence one

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of the connections to dark matter. It's not the only

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way to get to dark matter. There's also these atomic

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processes with relevantutrinos and so forth a type of dark matter.

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But Ken Shoulders extrapolated on what he saw. And this

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is someone that worked for ARPA. He worked for SRI.

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He worked on allegedly some classified programs to create micro

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electronics for government systems that are now in all of

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our phones the way electronics micro electronics is put together

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on a circuit board. He was the one who imagined

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that this led to other types of life forms that

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are in the same space around us, but slightly decoupled

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from us. So if you do see them, if they

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do make their way into our reality, SUSI, they're going

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to look a bit weird. They could look dark, transparent

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because they changed the speed of light through permittivity. Permittivity

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is going lower with these objects micro ball lightning to

301
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ball lightning. Lower permittivity leads to a blue shifting, so

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they might look bluish and they might look blurry. So

303
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there's a range of characteristics that when I looked at

304
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it again, Steve, going back to your question, I said,

305
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this sounds like paranormal phenomena at least it's things that

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I've experienced taking pictures and crops circles, having them come

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out blurry, blurry, blurry, like what is this crop circle

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doing to my freaking camera and other people's cameras. And

309
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then you often hear this as an accusation against researchers

310
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who take pictures of Bigfoot or have seen Bigfoot and

311
00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:26,079
give us very detailed descriptions. There pictures come out blurry looking,

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or they say the creature looked blurry or was transparent

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in banded sections. And then how many ghost photos have

314
00:21:35,240 --> 00:21:38,960
we seen that look blurry? And then Steve, I'm reading

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00:21:39,039 --> 00:21:42,799
the researcher of some of these Russian cold fusion researchers

316
00:21:42,799 --> 00:21:45,079
I'm thinking of I am Shock paranov as one of

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them who created these kind of ball lightnings using a

318
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Mobius strip. It was a very ingenious way of slamming

319
00:21:51,759 --> 00:21:54,440
electrons together with a mobia strip, like you know, the

320
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the esher thing where it flips over and it's like

321
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this infinite loop you can build electronically. And he said

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they found a blue mist being emitted from their cold

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fusion reactors and their photos came out blurry, and he

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photographed these dark, blotchy spots which looked to me like

325
00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:23,000
the types of things that people have seen. You're familiar

326
00:22:23,039 --> 00:22:27,079
with these witnesses who have seen these dark orbs, and

327
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they talked about it at Skinwalker Ranch James Lukaski Skinwalker's

328
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at the Pentagon. I even asked Jay Stratton about this

329
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once he was at a conference and I just said, Jay,

330
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are you talking about black ball lightning? Remember these orbs

331
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that frightened them or whatever that dark thing was on

332
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the path that you know, they did want to sleep

333
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with the lights on after seeing this thing. It invoked

334
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a fear response right as they got closer back, as

335
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they backed off, the fear feeling went away. Sounds electromagnetic,

336
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doesn't it, uh? And he said, well, it could be,

337
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or maybe that's just the way your brain's interpreting it.

338
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We don't really know what it is. But these are

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kind of connections, guys that I think you can make

340
00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:11,559
between these subjects. Now, I'm not saying I'm inherently right.

341
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I could be wrong. There could be another explanation for

342
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all of this, but it just seems based on my

343
00:23:17,160 --> 00:23:20,279
experience in the time I've been on Earth, of all

344
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the subjects I've been exposed to, including as a kid

345
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building electronic kits from Radio Shack and heath get when

346
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I was like, you know, ten ten years old, just

347
00:23:29,839 --> 00:23:34,480
for fun, there's too many connections here to ignore the

348
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sudden temperature changes that people get around all types of

349
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paranormal phenomena, including UFOs, the electronics failure, the time loss,

350
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the sense of mental confusion. I'm suggesting that these are

351
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connected because they're coming from some underlying related phenomena. If

352
00:23:56,519 --> 00:23:58,920
it's something else, I'm happy for someone else to suggest

353
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an alternative. But to me, it seems like a ball lightning,

354
00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:08,039
dark matter type phenomena, just based on all of this

355
00:24:08,119 --> 00:24:11,279
other research where the cold fusion researchers say the room

356
00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:14,960
got suddenly cold, as I mentioned, Shaq Paranhoff was another

357
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,599
saying the pictures came out blurry. Just it sounds to

358
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me like something very similar. So to go back to

359
00:24:20,400 --> 00:24:23,359
your questions, as he's kind of long winded answer those

360
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types of orbs, you could make the argument, I mean,

361
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there could be some other explanations, but you could make

362
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the argument that they're all variations. They're part of the

363
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same family of mobile luminous objects, which are based on

364
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another type of Maxwellian symmetry, a fractal basis. We can

365
00:24:44,559 --> 00:24:47,559
go into what that is that's closed in that goes

366
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concentrates rather than the normal types of electromagnetism from radio

367
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and radio emissions that were used to that spreads out

368
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this sort of concentrates and it built and it goes

369
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down to the quantum level. That generates a lot of

370
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energy from that type of compression.

371
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Speaker 2: Any idea why that would happen more frequently in one area?

372
00:25:09,839 --> 00:25:14,400
I know earthquakes can sometimes cause ball lightning. That wasn't

373
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the case when I saw that orb. Actually that was

374
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the first thing I checked, was for seismic activity. But

375
00:25:22,160 --> 00:25:25,400
is there something that could make that happen in nature

376
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spontaneously or happen more often in certain areas?

377
00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:32,039
Speaker 3: Now that's another great question. It's something I puzzled over

378
00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:35,960
for years. Why these certain areas. If the ideas I'm

379
00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:40,000
telling you were true, why isn't it spread out evenly

380
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over the planet. You don't generally see balls a light

381
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coming up your street, though people do sometimes, But I

382
00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:49,079
mean these seem to be concentrated in certain areas. I

383
00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:52,119
think it has to do with the particular types of

384
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:58,000
crystals and chemical elements in the soil that generate static charges.

385
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:03,400
Those static charge is under certain conditions, can create as

386
00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:06,119
you mentioned a few moments ago, Susie, the ken shoulders

387
00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:10,079
like charge separation the basis of all of his work.

388
00:26:10,799 --> 00:26:15,039
Charge separation leading to these exotic vacuum objects. You call

389
00:26:15,039 --> 00:26:19,440
them the electron for texas the different names for this.

390
00:26:19,559 --> 00:26:23,119
But we're talking about static electricity. Okay, let's break it down,

391
00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,240
keep it simple at the high school level. We're talking

392
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:29,599
about types of static, long lived types of static. You

393
00:26:29,680 --> 00:26:31,799
see this when you walk across a rug, or you

394
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:34,200
touch your pet, or even see it on the sheets

395
00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:36,640
at night, certain types of sheet materials on your bed

396
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:39,960
in the dark, you'll see those little sparkles. That's what

397
00:26:40,039 --> 00:26:43,240
we're talking about. When it sustains itself on a longer

398
00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:47,039
term basis, it can form its own containment field. And

399
00:26:47,079 --> 00:26:51,799
become a long lived plasmoid. So to answer your question,

400
00:26:52,759 --> 00:26:56,440
based on my research, places like skin Walker Ranch in

401
00:26:56,480 --> 00:26:59,079
the San Luis Valley, where I spent some time recently

402
00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:01,880
at the Nippy twenty five conference, which is open to

403
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:05,720
the public next year. By the way, if you do

404
00:27:05,759 --> 00:27:09,880
your research into the soils of those areas, you have

405
00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:12,839
a lot of guilsonite its Skinwalker. You have a lot

406
00:27:12,839 --> 00:27:19,319
of silica in San Luis Valley. If my theory is right,

407
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:24,039
you should have some type of mineral in those soils

408
00:27:24,079 --> 00:27:29,519
that's conducive to building up static and charge separation. Silica

409
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,640
builds up one type of charge separation. I believe it's

410
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:37,839
the positive type gilsonite. The negative type gilsonite being one

411
00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:44,119
of the major elements in asphalt. It's a very I

412
00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:46,160
have some of it around her. It's a very lightweight,

413
00:27:46,319 --> 00:27:49,559
dark material that is used in asphalt. But it also

414
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:53,680
creates a lot of static and charge separation. In Simeon's

415
00:27:53,759 --> 00:27:55,759
view of this, and I'm happy for it to be

416
00:27:55,799 --> 00:28:01,319
proven wrong, this is caused by a normally high concentration

417
00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:05,119
of some mineral in the area that leads to these

418
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:08,559
charge clusters. Exotic vacuum objects and I'm not reducing this.

419
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:10,799
Don't think I'm a reductionist. He're just trying to explain

420
00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:12,960
this way. I'm saying this leads to other types of

421
00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:16,079
life forms being there. That's what we're talking about, is

422
00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:18,880
some type of life forms like that type of charge

423
00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:21,960
and they live around it. Maybe it's like a food

424
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:26,640
for them or their energy source. They cluster around this

425
00:28:26,759 --> 00:28:30,079
type of static. I've seen the ball lightning too, Susie,

426
00:28:30,079 --> 00:28:33,240
in the crop circles, because we detected a lot of

427
00:28:33,279 --> 00:28:37,279
static around those crop circles with our trek twenty one

428
00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:40,480
meter from a company in Medina, New York that sells

429
00:28:40,519 --> 00:28:46,359
these mobile static charge detectors, and we detected really vast

430
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:50,839
changes in static in some of these crop circles. And

431
00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:53,359
you also see these orbs around the crop circles. So

432
00:28:54,200 --> 00:28:57,759
kind of putting it all together, in my view, this

433
00:28:57,839 --> 00:29:00,680
is a result of charge clusters building up in certain

434
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:05,720
parts of the planet and life forms and other types

435
00:29:05,759 --> 00:29:07,960
of things. We don't even have the vocabulary to describe

436
00:29:08,079 --> 00:29:11,079
what these are. They look some of them look flesh

437
00:29:11,119 --> 00:29:13,160
and blood. I'm willing to go there, yeah, with bigfoot

438
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:15,559
in others, but there are other aspects of bigfoot that

439
00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:21,400
don't fit, just a purely physical model without the quantum mechanics.

440
00:29:22,079 --> 00:29:24,359
So that's what I think, Susie, I mean, what do

441
00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:26,359
you think do you do you think there's another reason?

442
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:28,880
Could be the history of the area, you know, civil

443
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:35,279
war battlefields, lots of mayhem and destruction and violence leaving

444
00:29:35,599 --> 00:29:37,839
souls behind. I don't know. There could be other reasons too.

445
00:29:38,359 --> 00:29:40,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, I've always felt it had it was some kind

446
00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:46,640
of energy based, whether it's energy from humans, Like they

447
00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:50,920
say lay lines are popular in England, but a lot

448
00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:54,799
of them are the paths in between two churches, So

449
00:29:54,839 --> 00:30:00,000
you'd have people walking these these lines for centuries, right,

450
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:03,880
So like the imprint of the energy from those people's

451
00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:12,400
may have created the lay lines. I don't like the

452
00:30:12,599 --> 00:30:19,240
battlefield or the Native American curse theories at all because

453
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:23,400
the entire country would be haunted and have all this activity.

454
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,839
Speaker 3: True, the entire country had a lot of.

455
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:31,200
Speaker 2: Violence, Yeah, absolutely, like.

456
00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:36,319
Speaker 3: Exterminated just to get at the Native Americans food support.

457
00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:40,279
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. But I mean from what you're saying,

458
00:30:40,319 --> 00:30:44,880
it does kind of make sense. Like humans co habitat

459
00:30:45,000 --> 00:30:48,720
like near freshwater sources, rivers and things like that, So

460
00:30:48,759 --> 00:30:53,960
maybe these things are just living near whatever their energy sources.

461
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:57,480
Speaker 3: Sus. Another great point. I was reading freaking Science magazine.

462
00:30:57,480 --> 00:31:00,200
I love Science magazine, been reading it for three decades

463
00:31:00,839 --> 00:31:03,920
ver since grad school. There was an article about how

464
00:31:04,079 --> 00:31:10,960
streams and waterways create natural charge separation just from the

465
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:17,160
colliding water molecules against rocks and moving along the riverbeds

466
00:31:17,279 --> 00:31:21,960
and the water molecules create charge separation. So maybe that's

467
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:25,079
why we're attracted to streams and water flows. There's a

468
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:28,680
kind of a charge there. Maybe, Hey, guys, maybe we're

469
00:31:29,279 --> 00:31:32,279
getting energy from that too without even knowing it. It's

470
00:31:32,279 --> 00:31:35,559
like subconsciously we like to be around energized areas with

471
00:31:35,599 --> 00:31:37,000
a lot of charge clusters.

472
00:31:37,359 --> 00:31:39,960
Speaker 2: And I have like an ongoing joke at work that

473
00:31:40,759 --> 00:31:43,240
if we need to come up with a solution of something,

474
00:31:43,319 --> 00:31:45,519
I say, okay, I'll think of it when I'm doing

475
00:31:45,559 --> 00:31:48,400
dishes tonight or when I'm in the shower tomorrow. It's

476
00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:50,400
always when I'm touching water, I get good ideas.

477
00:31:50,559 --> 00:31:53,039
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a really good point. Yeah, because I get

478
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:55,759
ideas in the shower too, and doing dishes, just like

479
00:31:55,759 --> 00:31:59,319
you're doing running water. I never thought of that. Hey,

480
00:31:59,319 --> 00:31:59,799
we're making some.

481
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:02,079
Speaker 2: Pres here figuring stuff out.

482
00:32:02,559 --> 00:32:05,119
Speaker 3: We were really figuring something out. I think what you're

483
00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:07,160
talking about has something to do with it. I think

484
00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:11,680
there's a physical component, a chemical component. But that doesn't

485
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,599
mean what we're talking about is really easy to understand.

486
00:32:14,599 --> 00:32:16,319
We're not going to explain it all away and just

487
00:32:16,319 --> 00:32:19,960
be on MPR with some sort of glib reporting. Oh

488
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:23,440
we explained ghosts. It's just some sort of static charge,

489
00:32:23,559 --> 00:32:27,359
you know. No, let's take the shoulders point of view.

490
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:33,640
He called them dark organizations with ghostly properties coming out

491
00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:37,960
of black ball lightning. Okay, black evos, the micro ball lightning.

492
00:32:38,759 --> 00:32:44,559
Even Takiyaki Matsumoto, who you mentioned, just most meticulous researcher.

493
00:32:44,559 --> 00:32:46,799
I mean, he took notes on everything. Bob Greener went

494
00:32:46,839 --> 00:32:49,519
over there part of the MFMP Martin Flischer a memorial

495
00:32:49,559 --> 00:32:54,839
project to Masimota passed away last year and to collect

496
00:32:54,839 --> 00:32:57,079
all of his papers and bring everything back in all

497
00:32:57,119 --> 00:32:59,839
his videotapes, and it was every letter he ever got

498
00:32:59,839 --> 00:33:02,599
for many researcher. He had made notes. Just in crouble,

499
00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:07,319
he called it. He said he could see micro black

500
00:33:07,359 --> 00:33:11,680
holes in the filming ulsion, these dark spots. I don't

501
00:33:11,759 --> 00:33:14,240
know if that's literally what they are, but they're really

502
00:33:14,319 --> 00:33:18,680
weird looking, completely black spots in the middle of his

503
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:24,799
little cold fusion experiments again that he did with wires underwater.

504
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:29,680
So so it's a it's a very good question whether

505
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:36,200
this leads to another realm of life. That's what I

506
00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:38,680
think is going on. I mean, I don't think any

507
00:33:38,759 --> 00:33:41,559
hard scientists would want to go in that direction because

508
00:33:41,559 --> 00:33:45,839
it the giggle factor and everything else that you alluded

509
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:48,680
to Steve at the beginning. I mean, this is sort

510
00:33:48,680 --> 00:33:52,640
of what keeps people from having the courage to go

511
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:56,720
off in new directions unfortunately. I mean the education I

512
00:33:56,839 --> 00:33:59,920
had guys going to, as I mentioned to Susie, was

513
00:34:00,160 --> 00:34:03,519
Lean and then Hampshire College and Amherst. These were very

514
00:34:03,559 --> 00:34:09,039
independent thinking institutions that taught me at least to evaluate

515
00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:13,760
arguments and look at other possibilities and consider the evidence,

516
00:34:14,199 --> 00:34:17,760
and that the conclusion you may come up to is

517
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:22,559
not a popularity contest. You just follow the data. You

518
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:28,800
follow the logic. Doesn't mean it's instantaneously apparent, but over

519
00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:31,400
years of looking at subjects and you keep seeing the

520
00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:34,239
same pat you just follow it. Now, maybe people are

521
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:37,320
going to think it's weird, but I mean tough because

522
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:41,320
everything that's ever been invented is seemed pretty weird, you know,

523
00:34:41,639 --> 00:34:47,880
Nikola Tesla Marconi. Think of all these inventors in the past.

524
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:53,440
There was an inventor who invented radio, who detected radio

525
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:59,280
waves in his lab, Thomas Hughes before Hertz, Heinrich Hurtz,

526
00:34:59,519 --> 00:35:04,719
who's edited with inventing the idea radio. An American came

527
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:08,239
up with it, and people laughed at him, said, you

528
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:14,239
can't have invisible energy waves. It's an They called it imponderable.

529
00:35:15,199 --> 00:35:20,280
Even temperature was laughed at ponderable. That's what's so beautiful

530
00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:23,320
about the history of science. Everyone's always laughed at anything

531
00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:26,880
that's now just basic part of our lives. So if

532
00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:30,000
they're laughing now, that means it's real. In my view,

533
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:32,159
I mean, it's a good chance you're on the right track.

534
00:35:32,199 --> 00:35:36,000
That's what you're looking for, is the ridicule, the hostility,

535
00:35:37,559 --> 00:35:43,000
the negativity, the sheer arrogance that tells you what you're

536
00:35:43,039 --> 00:35:45,360
on the right path. You're really hitting a nerve because

537
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:49,960
that's a mammalian defense against a new worldview. So I

538
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:54,639
look for that as a reaction to my research, as

539
00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:58,880
a sign of being on the right track. It may

540
00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:01,360
not make you the most popular person in the universe.

541
00:36:01,400 --> 00:36:04,480
But you have the satisfaction of waking up every day

542
00:36:04,599 --> 00:36:07,880
knowing you're really getting into the thick of what's going on,

543
00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:09,960
and that is its own reward, just to feel like

544
00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:14,719
you're really dealing with reality, even if almost everyone else

545
00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:17,519
you know in your life and people you know that

546
00:36:17,639 --> 00:36:20,679
you know don't get it, don't want to go that direction.

547
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:27,960
Every scientists who's done anything new Einstein. People laughed at Einstein.

548
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:31,239
When I was in the stats at Wesleyan one time, Susy,

549
00:36:31,559 --> 00:36:35,800
I came across a book one hundred scientists prove Einstein wrong.

550
00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:40,880
One hundred scientists against Einstein. We don't remember a single

551
00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:44,639
one of those scientists anymore. It was one paper after another.

552
00:36:44,719 --> 00:36:46,800
I wish we didn't have cell phones back then. I

553
00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:50,079
wish I could have taken a picture of that. Those

554
00:36:50,159 --> 00:36:52,639
guys are galas sort of like, oh, we know better

555
00:36:52,719 --> 00:36:56,719
than that foolish guy with his you know, relativity theory,

556
00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:01,800
and that's what it's like. It's really tough. So I, guys,

557
00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:03,519
I don't know. I kind of relish it, but that's

558
00:37:03,559 --> 00:37:05,760
just me. Go ahead laugh.

559
00:37:09,000 --> 00:37:11,679
Speaker 1: One of the one of the first paranormal books you

560
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:16,360
read was the Mockman Prophecies by John Keele, And of course,

561
00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:21,320
uh uh Kiel recognized early on the high strangeness about

562
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:23,159
all this, and he was trying to come to grips

563
00:37:23,159 --> 00:37:28,239
with uh. He kind of hypothesized a super spectrum and

564
00:37:28,239 --> 00:37:31,360
and that you know, do you see uh? And and

565
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:34,239
another thing about his uh you know, he he was

566
00:37:34,960 --> 00:37:38,360
kind of uh, kind of vague about what was really

567
00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:41,760
going on, suggested, I guess some kind of intelligence or

568
00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:45,239
whatever that would somehow interface with us. But he also

569
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:49,039
seemed to suggest that we uh co created some of this,

570
00:37:49,639 --> 00:37:54,639
that uh, some of these manifestations throughout time would change

571
00:37:54,679 --> 00:37:59,400
shape and so forth depending on the sort of the

572
00:37:59,440 --> 00:38:04,679
mass conciousness. Do you see any parallels with dark matter

573
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:08,320
monsters and some of Keel's ideas.

574
00:38:08,760 --> 00:38:11,760
Speaker 3: No, that's a that's a really great question, Steve. You know,

575
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:13,960
Keel was one of the first books ever read on

576
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:18,199
this subject, and that was as a teenager. Just I

577
00:38:18,199 --> 00:38:20,159
don't know how I came across it, but there it was.

578
00:38:20,960 --> 00:38:24,360
I mean those books were chilling. Yeah, they still give

579
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:29,000
me the chilse just thinking about it. And I think

580
00:38:29,039 --> 00:38:31,800
it must have sunk in deep into my mind and

581
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:35,679
emerged later as dark Matter monsters after Because you know,

582
00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:38,199
it's not something I thought about, Steve, It's not something

583
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:41,800
I every day, John Keele. It kind of receded, as

584
00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:45,199
you know, we're all concerned with our professional lives going

585
00:38:45,199 --> 00:38:49,760
through academia. I never heard anyone mention any of this anywhere,

586
00:38:50,519 --> 00:38:54,320
no one. It was just not something that people talked

587
00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:56,760
about in the circles that I grew up in back

588
00:38:56,800 --> 00:39:00,280
on the East Coast, in those types of schools and

589
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:02,920
those types of high schools and everything. It was very

590
00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:05,360
kind of preppy, if you know what I mean, And

591
00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:10,079
the people did not go in this direction. They were

592
00:39:10,159 --> 00:39:15,239
really concerned about their future careers, even in college. But

593
00:39:16,039 --> 00:39:19,360
I think Keel was on the right track because he's

594
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:22,400
suggesting to us that this is some sort of part

595
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:25,239
of life on Earth that we don't understand very well.

596
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:28,719
It doesn't have to be extraterrestrial, right something in Jacques

597
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:35,760
vallet point he's stressed many times the UFO researcher, computer inventor,

598
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,119
the apparently the guy that invented one of the people

599
00:39:38,159 --> 00:39:43,719
invented the Internet, Jacques Palai. But yeah, it's part of

600
00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:46,800
our reality, and I think, you know, you see references

601
00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:52,079
to this throughout history, even going back to the Bible,

602
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:56,920
in my case, the Old Testament. I've heard rabbis I've

603
00:39:57,079 --> 00:40:02,320
been in contact with talk about this supernatural world, about

604
00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:05,119
the Creator creating this at the same time as the

605
00:40:05,119 --> 00:40:07,519
physical world. For some reason, you and I are more

606
00:40:07,559 --> 00:40:10,559
in this physical one, or at least that's what we're

607
00:40:10,599 --> 00:40:13,880
aware of. But I think Keil was on the right track,

608
00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:16,559
and I do have a short Keel story for you.

609
00:40:16,719 --> 00:40:18,960
We were once having this type of conversation in a

610
00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:23,719
pool at a remote viewing conference in Clearwater, Florida. Held

611
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:26,199
was sponsored by Lin Buchanan and a bunch of us

612
00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:27,920
who had been trained with him. So we showed up

613
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:30,320
in Clearwork and we're hanging out in the pool. I'm

614
00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:34,119
hanging out with some other r veers and one of

615
00:40:34,119 --> 00:40:36,519
the women I'm talking to We're start talking about exactly

616
00:40:36,559 --> 00:40:40,840
that John Keel, the phone ringing, disconnecting, the phones ringing

617
00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:45,920
that were disconnected the movie. So okay, we all go

618
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:48,320
to bed. I go back to my motel room. At

619
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:50,840
about three am. The phone starts ringing and there's no

620
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:54,280
one there, and it's just a very strange sound on

621
00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:56,360
the other side of the phone, and I hung up

622
00:40:56,599 --> 00:41:00,639
and it rings again, and I'm thinking, what are the odds?

623
00:41:00,719 --> 00:41:03,719
I mean, here we are talking about that whole genre,

624
00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:07,760
and my phone's ringing and there's no one I can hear.

625
00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:09,880
There's no one there. It's just static. It's not like

626
00:41:09,920 --> 00:41:12,199
breathing or anything. It's just it's just like a dead

627
00:41:12,559 --> 00:41:14,599
It's like a signal, but there's no person on the

628
00:41:14,599 --> 00:41:16,960
other end of the line. So I pulled the phone

629
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:20,599
out of the wall. I pulled the phone out of

630
00:41:20,599 --> 00:41:23,400
the wall. Guys just going back. I mean, I'm thinking,

631
00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:25,719
I'm thinking, John Keel right there, how real is this?

632
00:41:25,840 --> 00:41:28,360
And I went to check with the you know, the

633
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:30,440
front desk the next day and they said, no, those

634
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:32,679
calls have to be routed through us. It's not an

635
00:41:32,719 --> 00:41:36,679
automatic system. We have to rout the calls. We don't

636
00:41:36,679 --> 00:41:40,159
need record last night of any calls coming to your room. So,

637
00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:45,000
I mean, other researchers have talked about this. Mark Macy,

638
00:41:45,159 --> 00:41:49,039
you know, he did this instrumental transparent communication. It's kind

639
00:41:49,039 --> 00:41:55,519
of another version of this with spirits deceased people. When

640
00:41:55,559 --> 00:41:58,880
he asked the phone company about this, they said, it's

641
00:41:58,920 --> 00:42:01,480
not coming through our phone, LI and it's originating in

642
00:42:01,559 --> 00:42:06,440
your phone. These made recordings of these calls with deceased people,

643
00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:09,519
people that he knew, other people knew who passed on,

644
00:42:09,760 --> 00:42:14,519
and they're calling back allegedly and they said, no, it's

645
00:42:14,559 --> 00:42:18,400
originating in the phone, which is very keel like. So yeah,

646
00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:22,400
I think there. I haven't looked at John Kill's work recently.

647
00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:24,159
I probably should reread it, and I know he has

648
00:42:24,199 --> 00:42:27,480
other books that I didn't read, but it's along the

649
00:42:27,519 --> 00:42:33,280
same lines. What I'm doing is suggesting an aspect of physics,

650
00:42:33,679 --> 00:42:38,320
condensed matter physics that helps us move a little farther

651
00:42:38,480 --> 00:42:42,519
down the road, physics that we already accept that seems

652
00:42:42,559 --> 00:42:45,119
to me in a not very difficult way to fit.

653
00:42:46,239 --> 00:42:49,400
Another researcher that's looked into this a little bit, Gerald

654
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:53,679
Pollock from University of Washington, Seattle, with a fourth state

655
00:42:53,719 --> 00:42:57,920
of water. That water has another phase that we're not

656
00:42:58,039 --> 00:43:01,960
familiar with, a sort of liquid crystal phase between solid

657
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:06,840
and liquid, and it has some strange properties and explains

658
00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:10,000
why hot water freezes faster than cool water, and why

659
00:43:10,039 --> 00:43:14,480
you get wisps of vapor trails over your coffee when

660
00:43:14,519 --> 00:43:18,039
a gas normally just disperses, or even why do clouds

661
00:43:18,079 --> 00:43:20,119
stay up in the sky. Given how heavy water is.

662
00:43:20,159 --> 00:43:22,920
Have you ever carried water? How's it staying up there?

663
00:43:23,519 --> 00:43:26,159
So he explains this in the fourth state of water,

664
00:43:26,199 --> 00:43:28,119
and he created one idea. I just want to mention

665
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:33,840
this vortex cooling. I mean, when he talked about vortex cooling, like, okay,

666
00:43:33,920 --> 00:43:38,360
I'm paying attention now, certain structures absorb heat. That's how

667
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:41,039
where they get their energy from their self organizing. It

668
00:43:41,079 --> 00:43:45,440
just sounds very similar to a lot of phenomena that

669
00:43:45,559 --> 00:43:50,519
we study about why these lifeforms cool their environment. Is

670
00:43:50,599 --> 00:43:56,400
they're literally deriving energy from their environment. And I think

671
00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:58,440
that's what Pollack is talking about. So Steve, to answer

672
00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:02,760
your question, you know, I think Kiel was on the

673
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:06,840
right track. I think there's a physical chemical aspect to

674
00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:10,719
it that hasn't been explored very much, just because people

675
00:44:10,840 --> 00:44:13,679
generally don't want to go in that direction and risk

676
00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:18,079
their career, you know, risk their tenure and popularity with

677
00:44:18,159 --> 00:44:21,559
their colleagues going into the spooky wookie stuff. But I

678
00:44:21,599 --> 00:44:24,760
think that's where you know, the prizes are here, is

679
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:28,679
to why do people experience this? What are they experiencing

680
00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:31,679
Instead of saying, oh, they're hallucinating, it's so yeah, Susy

681
00:44:31,760 --> 00:44:36,239
swamp gas, right, that stuff is not swamp gas. It's cool,

682
00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:40,559
it's cool to the touch. That's not anything burning. It's

683
00:44:40,559 --> 00:44:44,519
not like methane. We have to go beyond that. We've

684
00:44:44,519 --> 00:44:48,360
had half a century at least of these ridiculous explanations

685
00:44:48,360 --> 00:44:52,320
for these phenomenona. Again, Steve, going back to original question earlier.

686
00:44:53,119 --> 00:44:55,880
The government's done its job for some weird reason, to

687
00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:58,719
try to promote all of the hoax theories around this

688
00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:02,199
and the conventional explanations. I mean, they funded a lot

689
00:45:02,239 --> 00:45:06,840
of people like Donald Menzel. Yeah, psychops and all these

690
00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:11,920
debunkers and debunking organizations. You kept, you know, scoffers. It's

691
00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:16,159
just scoffing. And I don't think that's It's not a

692
00:45:16,199 --> 00:45:17,360
good use of our money anymore.

693
00:45:17,400 --> 00:45:24,199
Speaker 1: Okay, Uh, Susie, you had a particular question for a summon.

694
00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:27,039
I didn't want you to lose that.

695
00:45:27,960 --> 00:45:31,639
Speaker 2: Yeah. So Steve and I were talking earlier and I

696
00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:37,800
was telling him there has been this new factor I've

697
00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:42,880
been noticing in a pocology sightings and I haven't heard

698
00:45:42,920 --> 00:45:47,840
it before. It is only then people I've directly spoken

699
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:51,679
to and had the chance to ask questions too. There

700
00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:57,519
was a while back where I was fascinated by the

701
00:45:57,880 --> 00:46:03,800
smells involved in sightings. So I started asking people did

702
00:46:03,840 --> 00:46:08,000
you smell anything when this happened. The answer I keep

703
00:46:08,039 --> 00:46:09,960
getting is they smelled ozone?

704
00:46:10,599 --> 00:46:11,119
Speaker 3: Right right?

705
00:46:12,199 --> 00:46:15,280
Speaker 2: Have you noticed that as well?

706
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:19,599
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, that totally fits with the ideas we're talking

707
00:46:19,599 --> 00:46:23,639
about here. One of the byproducts of cold fusion letter

708
00:46:23,800 --> 00:46:26,000
is sulfur an ozone.

709
00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:30,239
Speaker 2: So sulfur is another one not with Pucklin, yes, but

710
00:46:30,719 --> 00:46:31,599
paranormal a lot.

711
00:46:31,719 --> 00:46:35,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, there's that whole book, The Brimstone deceit by.

712
00:46:37,480 --> 00:46:40,079
Speaker 1: Is it Cutching Cutching, Joshua Cutching.

713
00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:43,679
Speaker 3: Yeah. He goes through case after case where people had

714
00:46:43,760 --> 00:46:49,119
the smells that to me is a transmutational process. This

715
00:46:49,320 --> 00:46:54,039
is like again, purely physical evidence of transmutation going on,

716
00:46:55,199 --> 00:47:00,480
and ozone sulfur are the result of oxygen sixteen going

717
00:47:00,480 --> 00:47:03,840
to sulfur thirty two. It even fits what we know

718
00:47:03,920 --> 00:47:09,360
how chemical reactions work. Oxygen turns to sulfur in certain conditions,

719
00:47:09,400 --> 00:47:13,320
and where you have transmutation going on, you know, when

720
00:47:13,360 --> 00:47:16,199
these entities are here, these life forms, whatever you want

721
00:47:16,239 --> 00:47:21,519
to call them, you get those smells left behind, sulfur

722
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:28,400
like smells ozone like smells which againstests novel electromagnetic processes

723
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:36,159
going on, and oxygen oxygen fusing two other elements that

724
00:47:36,559 --> 00:47:42,440
no scientists would argue can't happen. So yeah, that those

725
00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:46,760
types of smells that you get around these phenomena, even

726
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:53,320
bigfoot ball lightning. You read the literature, people get those

727
00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:56,880
sulfur type smells, ozone smells. It's the same thing around

728
00:47:56,960 --> 00:48:00,800
certain types of ghost encounters, certain types of cryptids of

729
00:48:00,840 --> 00:48:05,519
course UFOs. To me, that suggests again without being reductionist, here,

730
00:48:05,679 --> 00:48:13,440
just a wide range of phenomena associated with transmutation, nucleonic synthesis, alchemy,

731
00:48:14,559 --> 00:48:18,519
a room temperature alchemy. When we were talking about Newton before,

732
00:48:18,840 --> 00:48:24,679
that was his you know, his real pet idea. That's

733
00:48:24,719 --> 00:48:26,760
what he loved as much as anything else, was the

734
00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:30,880
idea of alchemy. And it looks to me, based on

735
00:48:30,960 --> 00:48:35,519
the research of these companies again Proton twenty one Labs

736
00:48:35,559 --> 00:48:40,519
and other researchers, you can even do it through sonic

737
00:48:40,679 --> 00:48:45,440
ultrasonic sound waves. You get this transmutation of elements. You

738
00:48:45,639 --> 00:48:48,360
end up producing different elements in the periodic table, and

739
00:48:48,360 --> 00:48:48,960
one of them miss.

740
00:48:48,840 --> 00:48:54,000
Speaker 2: Silver, and that's why they can kind of pop in

741
00:48:54,079 --> 00:48:58,760
and out because it's transmutation, there's some kind of reaction happening.

742
00:49:00,039 --> 00:49:03,599
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think the transmutation is a sort of a

743
00:49:03,639 --> 00:49:08,679
side reaction from this. What we're talking about here is

744
00:49:08,800 --> 00:49:15,320
coherent matter. It's a step past plasma. It's what some

745
00:49:15,400 --> 00:49:18,880
of us think ball lightning and microball lightning are is.

746
00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:24,039
It's where the atomic particles are coherently related to the

747
00:49:24,039 --> 00:49:27,480
other particles in frequency and temperature. You could think of

748
00:49:27,519 --> 00:49:32,320
it like a laser or flocks of birds, murmerations of birds,

749
00:49:32,360 --> 00:49:34,280
all kind of a wave and the way you look

750
00:49:34,320 --> 00:49:37,280
like a wave moving across the sky. That's an analogy

751
00:49:37,320 --> 00:49:42,159
for coherent matter. Lockeed Martin has a patent in using

752
00:49:42,199 --> 00:49:46,559
coherent matter to generate non local effects. They use the

753
00:49:46,599 --> 00:49:49,679
analogy of a laser, but a million times more powerful.

754
00:49:50,079 --> 00:49:52,880
So one of the effects of this coherency is for

755
00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:56,880
elements to come apart and then recombine in other ways

756
00:49:57,800 --> 00:50:03,280
oxygen reassembling into So it's something we were taught guys

757
00:50:03,280 --> 00:50:05,840
in school. Is impossible. You know that it was just

758
00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:09,800
this sort of medieval idea of alchemy that's a type

759
00:50:09,800 --> 00:50:11,840
of mysticism. But I think if you look at the

760
00:50:11,880 --> 00:50:17,519
research from this research tradition. You get a lot of elements,

761
00:50:18,320 --> 00:50:22,800
a lot of researchers showing different chemical elements appearing in

762
00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:29,639
their experiments. Marc Leclair's another one. These are really serious researchers.

763
00:50:30,400 --> 00:50:34,039
In some cases they've worked with the government. They've shown

764
00:50:34,119 --> 00:50:37,280
us that you get all these different elements in the

765
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:43,199
periodic table, all the way lighter elements, and they get heavier.

766
00:50:43,280 --> 00:50:44,960
I mean, this could be one of the reasons why

767
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:48,800
it's classified. I mean, you start getting into radioactive elements too.

768
00:50:49,880 --> 00:50:52,039
So yeah, you can produce all these elements and the

769
00:50:52,039 --> 00:50:54,960
one we would smell would be the sulfur smell. So

770
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:58,760
it seems to me susy. My understanding of it is

771
00:50:58,760 --> 00:51:02,760
that these coherent energy transformations. One of the effects that

772
00:51:02,800 --> 00:51:07,239
this has been going on is transmutation of elements. And

773
00:51:07,400 --> 00:51:09,480
another one is that you can look for, at least

774
00:51:09,480 --> 00:51:12,800
at a microscopic level, are called strange tracks. Go figure

775
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:16,239
strange tracks. There are little hopping marks in a photo

776
00:51:16,239 --> 00:51:21,440
emulsion of a ball lightning microbolt spinning around, moving through

777
00:51:21,480 --> 00:51:24,239
the emulsion as it kind of gyrates around, it leaves

778
00:51:24,280 --> 00:51:30,679
these little tracks. It's called strange track. Those are two

779
00:51:30,840 --> 00:51:35,159
of the symptoms of this sort of process. So this

780
00:51:35,199 --> 00:51:36,840
would be one sort of experiment we could do in

781
00:51:36,880 --> 00:51:40,039
these paranormal hotspots. If we had photo emulsions there, would

782
00:51:40,079 --> 00:51:43,599
we find these strange tracks on if we looked under

783
00:51:43,639 --> 00:51:46,480
an electron microscope later, would we get more of that

784
00:51:46,559 --> 00:51:50,800
versus a controlled control sample with less paranormal activity. Just

785
00:51:50,840 --> 00:51:53,480
an interesting experiment to do to see if this is

786
00:51:53,559 --> 00:51:54,039
right or not.

787
00:51:54,719 --> 00:51:57,000
Speaker 2: Yeah. So I'm not going to get into my feelings

788
00:51:57,039 --> 00:52:00,000
about Ed Lorraine Warren, but that just took me back

789
00:52:00,440 --> 00:52:03,039
when I was in middle school. I read The Demonologist,

790
00:52:03,639 --> 00:52:06,480
which is the book that Ed Warren wrote, and he

791
00:52:06,599 --> 00:52:12,360
talks about seeing this dark black ball like misty ball

792
00:52:12,559 --> 00:52:17,400
forming in the corner and then smelling sulfur. Yeah, maybe

793
00:52:17,679 --> 00:52:19,679
that was what you get.

794
00:52:20,159 --> 00:52:24,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, you get this around orbs and micro ball lightning

795
00:52:24,960 --> 00:52:28,159
and even ball lightning that comes out of thunderstorms. You

796
00:52:28,199 --> 00:52:30,480
know that ozone smell you get out of thunderstorms. You

797
00:52:30,519 --> 00:52:33,119
get that out of ball lightning too, even after the

798
00:52:33,159 --> 00:52:35,440
thunderstorm is left. You know, se people see I say,

799
00:52:35,559 --> 00:52:37,920
they see this ball lightning hopping towards them. I mean

800
00:52:37,960 --> 00:52:41,239
they seem to hop down the road coming towards them

801
00:52:41,360 --> 00:52:44,119
or wherever they're I've spoken to people that have seen

802
00:52:44,119 --> 00:52:47,239
this hiking in the Tetons, and it just gemes. It

803
00:52:47,320 --> 00:52:49,679
sort of trundles down the path towards you, like it's

804
00:52:49,719 --> 00:52:53,280
a physical thing, and it leaves behind that smell, that

805
00:52:53,400 --> 00:52:58,360
ozone type smell, which suggests a highly energetic process, not

806
00:52:58,440 --> 00:53:01,639
necessarily a high temperature. So we're not talking about swamp.

807
00:53:01,679 --> 00:53:04,360
You're not gonna beat anything physically burning. We're talking about

808
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:10,880
something emitting microwaves, radio waves, electromagnetic energy made. Those things

809
00:53:10,960 --> 00:53:14,320
can produce heat, but the object itself is cool. But

810
00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:19,239
that transmutation definitely leaves some symptoms behind. If people were

811
00:53:19,280 --> 00:53:23,360
interested in studying this, you know, we could do experiments

812
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:25,800
where we would see is this happening? Or am I wrong?

813
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:27,960
Do you not get this in these things? Is there

814
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:30,360
another cause? The only one way to find out is

815
00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:33,280
to do some experiments. But you do get this in

816
00:53:33,320 --> 00:53:39,360
the cold fusion, lener realm a lot so and cryptids too,

817
00:53:39,440 --> 00:53:43,840
you know, pick your cryptid, dog man, bigfoot, puguages. People

818
00:53:43,960 --> 00:53:47,920
sometimes say they get those sulfur smells left behind. That's

819
00:53:47,960 --> 00:53:52,599
where you get the brimstone, you know, devils and brimstones

820
00:53:52,599 --> 00:53:57,800
and all this. I think that historical literature tells us something.

821
00:53:58,679 --> 00:54:00,679
Speaker 1: Yeah, but they do seem to be some kind of

822
00:54:01,119 --> 00:54:05,320
life form. I mean people talk about having telepathic communication

823
00:54:05,920 --> 00:54:06,559
with Bigfoot.

824
00:54:06,639 --> 00:54:11,039
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, that's another effect mind speak. Yeah, I've spoken

825
00:54:11,079 --> 00:54:12,199
to people who have had this happen.

826
00:54:13,559 --> 00:54:17,199
Speaker 1: Actually, Ron Moorehead's daughter was Ronda, I believe was. She

827
00:54:17,360 --> 00:54:20,679
was at a Bigfoot conference several years ago and she

828
00:54:20,719 --> 00:54:24,519
got up spontaneously and talked about the bizarre experiences that

829
00:54:24,599 --> 00:54:27,000
she was having when she was out with her father

830
00:54:27,079 --> 00:54:31,920
and the Sierra Nevadas. And one time she was in

831
00:54:32,000 --> 00:54:35,320
the tent and she started getting these telepathic communications and

832
00:54:35,320 --> 00:54:38,000
they were asking her, who are you? Who's that man

833
00:54:38,079 --> 00:54:41,000
you're with? And so she was actually having a conversation

834
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:44,039
with him, and she's very credible.

835
00:54:44,119 --> 00:54:46,960
Speaker 3: So you're saying, Ronda Morehead, I.

836
00:54:47,159 --> 00:54:50,920
Speaker 1: Don't know what her last name is daughter, Yeah, yeah,

837
00:54:50,960 --> 00:54:52,639
her daughter, but I don't know if she has a

838
00:54:52,679 --> 00:54:53,440
married namer.

839
00:54:53,840 --> 00:54:56,559
Speaker 3: So that brings up a lot of other interesting effects here,

840
00:54:56,679 --> 00:54:59,000
like mine speak. We haven't gotten into that, but that's

841
00:54:59,000 --> 00:55:01,639
a big component this. Even people that didn't believe in

842
00:55:01,639 --> 00:55:05,840
Bigfoot have experienced the mind speak. You listen to these

843
00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:10,679
different podcasts Sasquatch chronicles others. People say it can sound

844
00:55:10,719 --> 00:55:14,480
like even like a robotic computerized voice talking in their head.

845
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:18,440
At least that's how your brain interprets the sight the signal.

846
00:55:18,880 --> 00:55:23,119
And yeah, people experience this sort of mind speak. They

847
00:55:23,159 --> 00:55:26,920
get it before the contact. It's a very interesting component.

848
00:55:27,360 --> 00:55:32,800
Another aspect of this is strange sounds in and around

849
00:55:32,920 --> 00:55:36,960
these areas, but their coherent sounds fits with coherent matter.

850
00:55:37,039 --> 00:55:40,719
You're gonna get coherent sound. They're directional sounds. In other words,

851
00:55:41,199 --> 00:55:43,360
one person could hear it and the other won't, and

852
00:55:43,400 --> 00:55:46,199
they'll wonder within their head like you're saying or not.

853
00:55:46,320 --> 00:55:49,559
But there's another explanation is it was directed like a

854
00:55:49,679 --> 00:55:55,239
laser beam of light, but with sound at a certain

855
00:55:55,280 --> 00:55:58,559
direction and people on the other direction don't hear it.

856
00:56:00,039 --> 00:56:03,599
Speaker 1: Asked the questions about crop circles, Yeah, I read your

857
00:56:03,639 --> 00:56:05,719
book when I heard joy I must have been on

858
00:56:06,159 --> 00:56:10,119
art Bell many years ago promoting opening minds, and I

859
00:56:10,159 --> 00:56:13,760
think that was the first time, I mean I didn't

860
00:56:13,800 --> 00:56:15,679
know much about crop circles. I think it was the

861
00:56:15,679 --> 00:56:20,159
first time I read an account where people would actually,

862
00:56:20,320 --> 00:56:23,480
you know, go out and meditate and create these things overnight.

863
00:56:23,880 --> 00:56:26,480
Now you talked about some of the strange phenomena that

864
00:56:26,599 --> 00:56:30,920
shows up. Is it true that some of the high

865
00:56:30,960 --> 00:56:35,719
strangeness occurs with crop circles that seem that that are

866
00:56:35,760 --> 00:56:38,800
made by humans and others that seem to be made

867
00:56:38,800 --> 00:56:42,280
through some kind of a paranormal agency. Did they both

868
00:56:42,400 --> 00:56:45,320
have a high strangeness attached to them?

869
00:56:46,360 --> 00:56:49,559
Speaker 3: Yes, they do. In my view. That was part of

870
00:56:49,559 --> 00:56:51,920
the reason of writing Opening Minds was that was our

871
00:56:51,960 --> 00:56:55,840
surprise finding is when we started making them. You know,

872
00:56:55,840 --> 00:56:59,360
when we started paying farmers and using their fields, we

873
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:03,880
would get some of those same effects in our electronics,

874
00:57:04,039 --> 00:57:07,079
and sometimes people would come in there later and get

875
00:57:07,239 --> 00:57:10,800
similar types of effects. We later just put up signs

876
00:57:10,840 --> 00:57:13,280
saying this is man made, the farmer has been paid,

877
00:57:13,480 --> 00:57:16,320
and people didn't believe us. They would say, there's no

878
00:57:16,360 --> 00:57:18,880
way you could have made this, and why are we

879
00:57:19,000 --> 00:57:22,679
getting these word effects? That was the big mystery to

880
00:57:22,719 --> 00:57:25,639
me for so many years, is why a man made

881
00:57:25,679 --> 00:57:28,400
information would do that. But if you look at the again,

882
00:57:28,519 --> 00:57:31,280
vortex cooling, a lot of these crop circles are based

883
00:57:31,320 --> 00:57:36,360
around vortex patterns. They're going to act like waveguides and

884
00:57:37,079 --> 00:57:39,920
change the frequencies of the energy that's just in the

885
00:57:39,960 --> 00:57:45,880
background creates concentrations of static, just like any vortex based

886
00:57:46,039 --> 00:57:49,079
shape would in a field. And it doesn't mean that

887
00:57:51,039 --> 00:57:56,159
ones weren't made by UFOs or other means. I've spoken

888
00:57:56,199 --> 00:58:02,320
to witnesses. I've seen discs flattened feel at least in areas.

889
00:58:03,599 --> 00:58:06,280
It's in one of the witnesses in Black Swan Ghosts.

890
00:58:06,719 --> 00:58:09,320
You can see her interview on the Blackswan ghost dot

891
00:58:09,360 --> 00:58:12,760
com website. I put up the interviews. This is Louise Vovis.

892
00:58:13,119 --> 00:58:17,400
Other people have seen weird interactions between flying discs, UFOs

893
00:58:17,440 --> 00:58:20,800
and fields, so those exist too. But the people that

894
00:58:20,840 --> 00:58:25,519
had attempted to imitate that seem to have created, you know,

895
00:58:25,599 --> 00:58:29,480
other types of effects, maybe the same effects by virtue

896
00:58:29,519 --> 00:58:32,639
of the shape. Now, the traditional crop circle researchers did

897
00:58:32,639 --> 00:58:34,920
not want to hear this. They didn't want man made

898
00:58:35,119 --> 00:58:41,159
circles intermixing with their alien made circles. Again talking about

899
00:58:41,199 --> 00:58:43,559
rigid mindsets here, and I used to be in that

900
00:58:43,639 --> 00:58:45,920
camp too. I would have thought, oh, humans can't do that.

901
00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:49,800
That's what I used to say, based on what we

902
00:58:49,840 --> 00:58:53,400
had heard. But what we had heard wasn't totally accurate.

903
00:58:53,519 --> 00:58:56,039
Humans could do this. We went out with them at

904
00:58:56,119 --> 00:58:59,960
night and watched them work, and they could do this.

905
00:59:00,159 --> 00:59:03,599
It's something you get better at with practice. You can

906
00:59:03,639 --> 00:59:06,320
do it in a few hours of darkness, with walkie

907
00:59:06,360 --> 00:59:09,559
talkies and some lasers you can get straight lines and coordinated.

908
00:59:10,000 --> 00:59:12,679
But these researchers too, I mean, these circle makers were

909
00:59:12,719 --> 00:59:16,840
also researchers. They thought something very spooky was going on

910
00:59:16,840 --> 00:59:19,440
once they made these circles, so they called it. Some

911
00:59:19,519 --> 00:59:23,480
of them called it natural magic. They didn't consider it hoaxing.

912
00:59:23,519 --> 00:59:26,599
They thought it was a type of natural magic out

913
00:59:26,639 --> 00:59:31,280
in nature. And that's the view that I you know,

914
00:59:31,360 --> 00:59:34,119
eventually accepted too, that the human made ones have some

915
00:59:35,360 --> 00:59:40,599
really strange components. As you heard with Art Bell when

916
00:59:41,119 --> 00:59:43,960
those interviews, and he was a good interviewer, Steve, you

917
00:59:44,239 --> 00:59:47,440
heard some of those interviews, I mean that we create

918
00:59:47,519 --> 00:59:50,039
vortex patterns and put smoke over them and things. So

919
00:59:50,239 --> 00:59:53,079
he actually he could kind of see this a little bit.

920
00:59:53,079 --> 00:59:54,559
But yeah, that's my point of view on it, Steve,

921
00:59:54,679 --> 00:59:58,719
is that both types have interesting effects. They certainly affect

922
00:59:58,760 --> 01:00:03,920
our cameras, batteries, electronics, and again I'm making the argument

923
01:00:03,960 --> 01:00:06,639
that these are all fundamentally some of the same effects

924
01:00:06,719 --> 01:00:09,960
no matter what type of phenomena you're looking into some

925
01:00:10,039 --> 01:00:12,239
of the same effects. I'm not saying it's all one

926
01:00:12,360 --> 01:00:16,000
hundred percent the same thing. Again, it's not reductionism. I'm

927
01:00:16,039 --> 01:00:21,239
just saying there's some parallels based on the electro dynamics

928
01:00:21,320 --> 01:00:28,599
of vortex based structures. Interacting with electromagnetic spectrum creates charge

929
01:00:28,599 --> 01:00:34,159
clusters and some of the permittivity shifting effects of charge

930
01:00:34,159 --> 01:00:37,679
clusters that affects your electronics, whether it's made by people

931
01:00:37,760 --> 01:00:42,000
or it's some other entities showing up. I mean Bigfoot.

932
01:00:42,039 --> 01:00:43,800
I think of all that hair they have, that very

933
01:00:43,840 --> 01:00:46,480
fine hair be very good for creating static charge. People

934
01:00:46,559 --> 01:00:52,199
have seen them glowing. They glow blue. People have seen

935
01:00:52,639 --> 01:00:56,079
not just their eyes, I mean their body looks glowing.

936
01:00:56,119 --> 01:00:58,480
Blood sounds to me like charge clusters.

937
01:00:59,239 --> 01:01:04,480
Speaker 1: Now you viewed some crop circles the source or we

938
01:01:04,559 --> 01:01:06,320
have what what have you found?

939
01:01:07,880 --> 01:01:10,760
Speaker 3: Well, some of them did have a mysterious origin, I mean,

940
01:01:10,840 --> 01:01:13,280
and we can back that up with that book by

941
01:01:14,840 --> 01:01:21,159
uh the Secret History of Crop Circles, right, uh, which

942
01:01:21,280 --> 01:01:24,039
goes into who is the who is the author of

943
01:01:24,079 --> 01:01:26,199
the Secret History of Crop Circles?

944
01:01:26,039 --> 01:01:28,760
Speaker 1: It's not Scilla, is that Freddy Silla?

945
01:01:29,400 --> 01:01:33,559
Speaker 3: No? No, Freddy uh No, not it's not Freddy uh,

946
01:01:33,880 --> 01:01:37,039
it's well whatever. It's the secret history of crop circles.

947
01:01:37,119 --> 01:01:40,039
It's been reprinted. It goes into the history of crop

948
01:01:40,079 --> 01:01:44,159
circles going back hundreds of years, and they've been around,

949
01:01:44,559 --> 01:01:46,800
you know, for a long time, and they are associated

950
01:01:46,800 --> 01:01:53,119
with ball lightning, vortex plasmas, plasmoids. People have seen witnessed this,

951
01:01:53,519 --> 01:01:56,400
But it doesn't mean that the bigger, more precise looking

952
01:01:56,440 --> 01:02:00,599
ones didn't have a human hand in it. I mean

953
01:02:00,679 --> 01:02:04,000
there was a time when that kind of bothered me too,

954
01:02:04,079 --> 01:02:06,519
like other researchers, like because you had really staked your,

955
01:02:07,639 --> 01:02:10,599
you know, your reputation on the idea that this wasn't

956
01:02:11,039 --> 01:02:14,840
human reproducible. But that was not correct. Humans are more

957
01:02:15,199 --> 01:02:18,960
innovative than you think. They create art in ways that

958
01:02:19,199 --> 01:02:22,039
is not always obvious. And there was a time in

959
01:02:22,199 --> 01:02:25,559
history where people didn't share information like they do nowadays.

960
01:02:25,599 --> 01:02:29,000
We live in a culture nowadays where people share information.

961
01:02:29,800 --> 01:02:35,000
You're reviewed, published papers and research, and it's all available online.

962
01:02:35,719 --> 01:02:37,960
You can research to your heart's condemn It hasn't always

963
01:02:37,960 --> 01:02:40,079
been like that. There was a time when people kept

964
01:02:40,079 --> 01:02:42,840
this stuff kind of concealed, and the crop circle tradition

965
01:02:43,199 --> 01:02:45,920
had more of that going on like a secret field art.

966
01:02:46,840 --> 01:02:50,519
So it's understandable that people couldn't believe that humans could

967
01:02:50,519 --> 01:02:53,079
make it. But there was a time when people use

968
01:02:53,159 --> 01:02:56,519
something called the camera obscura to create very new types

969
01:02:56,559 --> 01:03:01,840
of paintings that have perspective in them and so forth

970
01:03:02,239 --> 01:03:04,119
that no one quite understood how they did it for

971
01:03:04,159 --> 01:03:08,039
a while. So it's in the nature of art to

972
01:03:08,079 --> 01:03:10,199
have a level of secrecy to it. I think we

973
01:03:10,280 --> 01:03:12,679
saw that in the in the crop circles also, but

974
01:03:12,719 --> 01:03:17,960
that secret history of crop circles is a good start

975
01:03:18,159 --> 01:03:21,320
to show you how there are diverse causes of crop circles.

976
01:03:21,360 --> 01:03:23,559
There are different causes, not just one thing.

977
01:03:24,440 --> 01:03:28,400
Speaker 1: So yeah, I guess they used to call them double twists,

978
01:03:28,880 --> 01:03:32,840
the things. They have different names for them, very circles, Yeah,

979
01:03:33,000 --> 01:03:35,079
very circles, of course, and that's even.

980
01:03:34,960 --> 01:03:37,320
Speaker 3: Used in the scientific literature. Seve there was an article

981
01:03:37,360 --> 01:03:41,480
about fairy circles in the deserts of Namibia. Well, it

982
01:03:41,519 --> 01:03:44,199
could cause these circles to show up, and there was

983
01:03:44,639 --> 01:03:49,679
forgot what the explanation was, certain types of micro organisms

984
01:03:49,719 --> 01:03:54,320
growing there or something that that sort of conventional explanation.

985
01:03:54,519 --> 01:04:01,880
But yeah, double circles, fairy circle, they have had different

986
01:04:02,000 --> 01:04:08,880
names over over the years, Susie.

987
01:04:10,519 --> 01:04:13,920
Speaker 2: I'm taking it all in. I'm still I think I'm

988
01:04:13,960 --> 01:04:19,079
on board with you know, Tuckwadgies are the East Coast

989
01:04:19,239 --> 01:04:24,199
version of what's forming over in the Pacific northwest over there.

990
01:04:24,360 --> 01:04:26,119
We don't we have had it. We did have a

991
01:04:26,119 --> 01:04:28,360
big foot sighting this year in Connecticut, though.

992
01:04:28,800 --> 01:04:33,519
Speaker 3: Yeah, you did, you did. There were some in Westchester.

993
01:04:33,559 --> 01:04:36,079
I've been back there to New York. I've heard about

994
01:04:36,119 --> 01:04:41,199
some happening in Westchester too, tree structures. People had some

995
01:04:41,320 --> 01:04:44,880
video allegedly of something standing there next to the tree structure.

996
01:04:46,280 --> 01:04:48,840
So maybe a changing. But that's interesting, Susie that the

997
01:04:48,840 --> 01:04:52,519
Pugwadgies aren't East Coast thing, because there is a Native

998
01:04:52,559 --> 01:04:57,719
American term for them called the bug wass. Yes, Northwest

999
01:04:57,760 --> 01:05:01,000
coast literature. But the case is, I've read about them.

1000
01:05:01,360 --> 01:05:04,119
Were like, you're saying, we're on the East coast.

1001
01:05:04,760 --> 01:05:05,000
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1002
01:05:05,440 --> 01:05:09,599
Speaker 2: I actually I did talk to somebody in Washington State

1003
01:05:09,760 --> 01:05:13,920
that had a little person sighting, but they seemed different,

1004
01:05:15,800 --> 01:05:20,840
Like what I hear here is they're less physical here

1005
01:05:21,480 --> 01:05:25,599
than I hear of from people in other areas. But yeah,

1006
01:05:25,679 --> 01:05:30,079
every every tribe and every country has some kind of

1007
01:05:30,360 --> 01:05:31,000
little people.

1008
01:05:31,719 --> 01:05:33,280
Speaker 3: The Oregon has its own brand.

1009
01:05:34,159 --> 01:05:34,400
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1010
01:05:35,199 --> 01:05:39,679
Speaker 3: People have described them in their airbnbs, you know, and

1011
01:05:39,760 --> 01:05:43,719
as you know, they are not They are not always

1012
01:05:43,800 --> 01:05:48,199
nice and playful. They have a wicked sense of humor.

1013
01:05:49,760 --> 01:05:52,960
They can be really unpredictable from my reading.

1014
01:05:53,559 --> 01:06:00,559
Speaker 2: From so from my perspective, it is reactive abuse. So

1015
01:06:00,800 --> 01:06:05,400
if you are going into their woods and messing things up,

1016
01:06:06,760 --> 01:06:10,360
you're you're dealing with the consequences of your action. I

1017
01:06:10,360 --> 01:06:13,519
don't think they are inherently evil or out to get people,

1018
01:06:14,320 --> 01:06:16,199
but they just defund themselves.

1019
01:06:16,599 --> 01:06:18,679
Speaker 3: Right right, right right. They're very capable.

1020
01:06:19,440 --> 01:06:22,800
Speaker 2: Yes, and just because you're little doesn't.

1021
01:06:22,440 --> 01:06:27,199
Speaker 3: Mean the Native Americans I spoke who said they are

1022
01:06:27,519 --> 01:06:32,320
they are the fearsome ones. Forget the big foot them.

1023
01:06:32,519 --> 01:06:33,679
Speaker 2: It's the same with humans.

1024
01:06:34,199 --> 01:06:40,920
Speaker 3: Really. Yeah, it's uh. Maybe someday we'll have alexography of

1025
01:06:41,000 --> 01:06:43,360
all these different types of beings out there in the

1026
01:06:43,440 --> 01:06:46,800
regions they inhabit, and we'll understand why some of them

1027
01:06:46,840 --> 01:06:51,000
are more East coast or West coast, or based in

1028
01:06:51,159 --> 01:06:57,199
Oregon or wherever. Yeah, each region has its own its

1029
01:06:57,280 --> 01:06:59,679
own types of creatures, doesn't it.

1030
01:07:00,760 --> 01:07:04,800
Speaker 1: Absolutely Yeah, that's that's really uh, it's really interesting. But

1031
01:07:04,840 --> 01:07:07,280
it's uh, you know, you try to wrap your head

1032
01:07:07,320 --> 01:07:10,960
around us. I mean you that it's it's it's uh,

1033
01:07:11,000 --> 01:07:15,360
it's accompanied by this really bizarre phenomenon which we may

1034
01:07:15,400 --> 01:07:18,360
have begin to have an explanation for, but then to

1035
01:07:18,400 --> 01:07:21,519
think of them as, uh, you know, they are apparently

1036
01:07:21,599 --> 01:07:25,480
some kind of a life form, and uh, that's it's

1037
01:07:25,519 --> 01:07:28,800
just really hard to uh to get to get a

1038
01:07:28,840 --> 01:07:31,719
grasp on that, to try and figure out how they

1039
01:07:32,000 --> 01:07:34,679
how it all interfaces with reality.

1040
01:07:36,039 --> 01:07:38,239
Speaker 3: Yeah. I think a lot of it, Steve comes down

1041
01:07:38,320 --> 01:07:40,840
to our own ego as humans, just thinking where the

1042
01:07:40,920 --> 01:07:44,480
be all and end all of creation, where the high point.

1043
01:07:45,079 --> 01:07:47,679
I just think our ego doesn't want to think of

1044
01:07:47,840 --> 01:07:51,599
other types of beings caught with comparable abilities that have

1045
01:07:51,679 --> 01:07:57,159
a different morphology and structure to them. It's a type

1046
01:07:57,239 --> 01:07:59,880
of I don't know where this kind of bigotry comes from.

1047
01:08:00,079 --> 01:08:03,599
Is it biological or or what or just how we've

1048
01:08:03,639 --> 01:08:10,079
been raised. Those are all possibilities, but we're prejudiced towards humans,

1049
01:08:10,159 --> 01:08:14,840
thinking that we have some sort of privileged place in

1050
01:08:14,880 --> 01:08:22,640
the universe, and it predisposes us not to want to

1051
01:08:22,720 --> 01:08:26,520
talk about other types of life. That's my view of it,

1052
01:08:27,640 --> 01:08:32,159
because why would you get the same types of encounter experiences.

1053
01:08:33,159 --> 01:08:38,720
People experience all types of these entities in these regions

1054
01:08:38,800 --> 01:08:42,359
for decades and hundreds of years, and going back thousands

1055
01:08:42,399 --> 01:08:50,039
of years in Native American literature and stories about these

1056
01:08:50,119 --> 01:08:55,479
beings and entities. No, I don't think it's just something

1057
01:08:55,560 --> 01:09:02,640
that's I don't think it's just imagination or a misidentification

1058
01:09:02,760 --> 01:09:06,680
of ordinary animals. I think there's I think if they

1059
01:09:06,720 --> 01:09:09,199
really exist, and we just haven't grown up enough to

1060
01:09:10,199 --> 01:09:13,800
just accept that there's just different type of life out there.

1061
01:09:14,199 --> 01:09:18,439
Look at even regular biological animals, there's often great resistance

1062
01:09:18,640 --> 01:09:22,000
to believe in giant squid. At one time, the mountain gorilla.

1063
01:09:22,520 --> 01:09:26,560
It was discovered by the Romans, then forgotten about again,

1064
01:09:26,880 --> 01:09:30,840
and when modern researchers discovered the mountain gorilla, people didn't

1065
01:09:30,840 --> 01:09:36,520
believe it. So there is just this tendency not to

1066
01:09:36,720 --> 01:09:41,680
want to look into new species. And again you have

1067
01:09:41,720 --> 01:09:45,279
to look at the institutional biases for researchers not to

1068
01:09:45,439 --> 01:09:51,359
want to have attention go to newer sorts of phenomena.

1069
01:09:52,039 --> 01:09:56,600
When they've staked their life in one type of form,

1070
01:09:56,760 --> 01:10:00,640
they probably don't see any benefit to themselve else of

1071
01:10:01,920 --> 01:10:08,039
looking into these creatures. But the consistency of the reports,

1072
01:10:08,279 --> 01:10:11,520
it's so incredible from one person to another. And people

1073
01:10:11,560 --> 01:10:13,359
don't talk about this a lot, so they don't even

1074
01:10:13,359 --> 01:10:16,760
have any basis for knowing what they've seen. But when

1075
01:10:16,800 --> 01:10:21,960
you read their accounts, there's a lot of consistency. And

1076
01:10:22,000 --> 01:10:24,760
it's not just because in my view, because the brain

1077
01:10:25,119 --> 01:10:27,880
is the same brain, so they're seeing the same things.

1078
01:10:27,920 --> 01:10:30,359
I think they're really you know, just like we go

1079
01:10:30,479 --> 01:10:33,279
out and see the same types of trees and birds

1080
01:10:33,319 --> 01:10:36,800
and have similar descriptions, that's what they're seeing with these

1081
01:10:36,840 --> 01:10:39,279
types of life, these types of life that are just

1082
01:10:39,399 --> 01:10:44,039
more transient, and it takes a lot of maturity as

1083
01:10:44,079 --> 01:10:47,359
a person to accept that things could exist that you

1084
01:10:47,399 --> 01:10:51,840
can't control, that you weren't taught about, that you don't

1085
01:10:51,880 --> 01:10:56,159
completely understand. To me, it's just human arrogance that always

1086
01:10:56,199 --> 01:10:59,399
wants to believe it's right, and you know nothing to

1087
01:10:59,439 --> 01:11:01,960
see her folks move along that that's what your brain

1088
01:11:02,039 --> 01:11:04,520
wants to do, and it's supported by the types of

1089
01:11:04,520 --> 01:11:09,399
school systems we have. People really are not encouraged to

1090
01:11:09,399 --> 01:11:12,119
be curious. But if you really take the time to

1091
01:11:12,359 --> 01:11:16,000
listen to these witnesses on your favorite podcast, read books

1092
01:11:16,600 --> 01:11:21,319
that they've written. Even Ron Moore House Siera sounds. Look

1093
01:11:21,359 --> 01:11:23,600
how flipped out Ron is. I've talked to him a

1094
01:11:23,640 --> 01:11:27,279
couple of times, and he's been on my YouTube channel.

1095
01:11:27,359 --> 01:11:30,239
I've met with him at conferences. I mean, what he's

1096
01:11:30,279 --> 01:11:33,119
talking about, he didn't even believe it. But he's got

1097
01:11:33,159 --> 01:11:37,560
the tape tapes, the recorders. It's recording these chattering sounds.

1098
01:11:38,000 --> 01:11:40,119
You can't see them, and they're right there and you

1099
01:11:40,159 --> 01:11:44,119
don't see Nobody saw them. They're right outside your hunting instructure.

1100
01:11:44,239 --> 01:11:46,680
But you peek your head out, there's nothing there, but

1101
01:11:47,560 --> 01:11:50,479
everyone's hearing it, recorders hearing it. So yeah, it may

1102
01:11:50,479 --> 01:11:53,600
not be easy to understand, but nobody said that the

1103
01:11:53,680 --> 01:11:58,439
universe came with this money back guarantee. That's supposed to

1104
01:11:58,479 --> 01:12:00,680
be easy to understand. Who said it was easy to

1105
01:12:01,439 --> 01:12:04,399
said it's easy to understand. That's some sort of fiction

1106
01:12:04,600 --> 01:12:07,600
we grew up around. It's not easy to understand. But

1107
01:12:08,039 --> 01:12:09,920
if you're you know, you don't have to. But if

1108
01:12:09,960 --> 01:12:11,600
you want to take the time to look into it,

1109
01:12:11,640 --> 01:12:14,399
you're going to come across stuff that's you don't know

1110
01:12:14,439 --> 01:12:17,840
what it is. Nobody knows what it is. There isn't

1111
01:12:17,840 --> 01:12:20,800
anyone who knows what it is. I'm sorry, it's just

1112
01:12:20,840 --> 01:12:22,640
where you end up. And we just have each other

1113
01:12:23,000 --> 01:12:27,079
to have conversations like this, people who experienced these things,

1114
01:12:29,359 --> 01:12:32,399
and that's how we'll finally piece it together and science

1115
01:12:32,439 --> 01:12:35,239
once again will have shown us that it's incapable of

1116
01:12:35,279 --> 01:12:39,079
adapting to new data. Which is what Thomas Kon sort

1117
01:12:39,119 --> 01:12:43,720
of suggested in his you know, his book about revolutions

1118
01:12:43,760 --> 01:12:47,399
in science and new paradigms. It is nobody wants to

1119
01:12:47,479 --> 01:12:50,359
go to a newer version of reality. Everyone wants to

1120
01:12:50,399 --> 01:12:53,039
stick with what's comfortable. That's where we're at with it.

1121
01:12:53,359 --> 01:12:55,079
So those of us that are interested have to keep

1122
01:12:55,119 --> 01:12:59,319
forging ahead and do our best and let the chips

1123
01:12:59,319 --> 01:13:00,199
fall where they will.

1124
01:13:01,439 --> 01:13:04,119
Speaker 1: And before we wrap it up, could you say a

1125
01:13:04,119 --> 01:13:07,159
little bit about black Swan ghosts. Tell us what a

1126
01:13:07,279 --> 01:13:08,920
black Swan event is.

1127
01:13:10,079 --> 01:13:15,840
Speaker 3: Yes, you know, I wrote this book because just being

1128
01:13:15,880 --> 01:13:20,439
in the subject matters. Initially just remote viewing and then

1129
01:13:20,479 --> 01:13:24,840
going to UFO conferences, I had encountered so many people

1130
01:13:24,920 --> 01:13:29,319
who said, I've never told anyone this, but and these

1131
01:13:29,359 --> 01:13:35,319
are people that had worked in the government intelligence agencies, biologists, NASA,

1132
01:13:36,319 --> 01:13:39,039
and they had seen things and it led me to

1133
01:13:39,079 --> 01:13:43,079
believe that this was something that wasn't very rare after all,

1134
01:13:43,319 --> 01:13:46,439
but it was rare to our awareness. Black Swan events

1135
01:13:46,479 --> 01:13:49,840
are events that are statistically improbable but have a very

1136
01:13:50,000 --> 01:13:56,119
large impact once they do happen, and it's something that's

1137
01:13:56,159 --> 01:13:58,960
not easy to talk about because maybe there's no reference

1138
01:13:59,039 --> 01:14:04,680
for it. In Boulder, Colorado, where I've lived for a

1139
01:14:04,760 --> 01:14:08,439
long time, we had this flood in twenty thirteen that

1140
01:14:08,640 --> 01:14:11,039
was like one of these five hundred year floods or

1141
01:14:11,039 --> 01:14:13,760
one thousand year floods. Someone was certain had ever no

1142
01:14:13,760 --> 01:14:17,279
one alive had ever seen anything like this. Maybe it

1143
01:14:17,319 --> 01:14:19,720
was a Native American lore, but there wasn't any living

1144
01:14:19,760 --> 01:14:22,279
person who had ever seen this before. It's hard to

1145
01:14:22,319 --> 01:14:25,359
imagine it raining continuously for a week, the types of

1146
01:14:25,399 --> 01:14:28,560
flooding that can happen in an area that's not used

1147
01:14:28,600 --> 01:14:33,119
to that. So it just I mean, it just reached havoc,

1148
01:14:33,359 --> 01:14:37,159
just like hurricanes can do. But this was unpredictable. This

1149
01:14:37,199 --> 01:14:39,520
is the sort of same type of thing with UFOs,

1150
01:14:40,079 --> 01:14:42,199
And I would say these types of topics we're talking

1151
01:14:42,239 --> 01:14:45,119
about in this interview, there are topics that if they

1152
01:14:45,199 --> 01:14:51,159
went to the forefront and we had them discussed more openly,

1153
01:14:51,399 --> 01:14:54,600
would lead to a kind of ontological shock of our

1154
01:14:54,640 --> 01:14:57,760
whole culture. That's why I call it a black Swan event.

1155
01:14:57,840 --> 01:15:01,840
It doesn't seem believable to the average person now, but

1156
01:15:01,960 --> 01:15:05,960
if enough evidence came forward and the credible people testified

1157
01:15:06,000 --> 01:15:10,880
in front of Congress, people with really impeccable credentials, and

1158
01:15:10,920 --> 01:15:13,600
I know some of these people haven't come on public yet,

1159
01:15:13,640 --> 01:15:16,319
and I know what they could be telling us, you

1160
01:15:16,359 --> 01:15:18,399
would have a different view of reality when they were

1161
01:15:18,439 --> 01:15:22,319
done testifying. And we've had these witnesses come forward in

1162
01:15:22,359 --> 01:15:25,119
these hearings recently. So basically, stee If I encountered a

1163
01:15:25,119 --> 01:15:28,560
lot of witnesses, missile security guards, people who had never

1164
01:15:28,720 --> 01:15:30,560
told their story, and I just found them and we

1165
01:15:30,600 --> 01:15:34,680
sat down with a tape recorder and I put a

1166
01:15:34,680 --> 01:15:37,199
lot of these videos on the Blackswan ghost dot com site.

1167
01:15:37,239 --> 01:15:38,720
You can go to the videos I put up the

1168
01:15:38,760 --> 01:15:42,600
original videos. You can listen to these people. They are

1169
01:15:43,000 --> 01:15:46,000
people that have great stories to tell, but because of

1170
01:15:46,039 --> 01:15:49,239
this fear of ridicule and the giggle factor, we don't

1171
01:15:49,279 --> 01:15:51,039
hear this. I bet there are a lot more people

1172
01:15:51,079 --> 01:15:56,039
out there like this, So I think it's exciting as

1173
01:15:56,119 --> 01:15:59,960
this information becomes more public. I think people gradually feel

1174
01:16:00,279 --> 01:16:03,720
that it's okay to talk about it, and maybe we'll

1175
01:16:03,760 --> 01:16:09,239
hear from witnesses who've seen these sorts of things are handled,

1176
01:16:09,319 --> 01:16:13,359
wreckage and so forth, maybe even really first class Bigfoot

1177
01:16:13,359 --> 01:16:16,399
witnesses that we haven't heard from yet, right, that really

1178
01:16:16,399 --> 01:16:18,640
would put the subjects on the matter. Wouldn't that be exciting?

1179
01:16:19,920 --> 01:16:22,439
I think put in uphas the whole subject matter of

1180
01:16:22,520 --> 01:16:24,239
cryptid life forms.

1181
01:16:23,880 --> 01:16:26,039
Speaker 1: You know, non or I think it has changed a

1182
01:16:26,039 --> 01:16:29,159
little bit, I mean with the the amount of TV

1183
01:16:29,239 --> 01:16:32,119
shows and so forth. I was. I actually I work

1184
01:16:32,159 --> 01:16:36,159
at the Mothman Museum and they actually pay me to

1185
01:16:36,199 --> 01:16:40,439
do that, to talk to people answer questions. Don't tell

1186
01:16:40,439 --> 01:16:42,479
my employer, Jeff Wonnsley, that I would do it, I

1187
01:16:42,479 --> 01:16:45,720
would pay him. But I was. I was sitting on

1188
01:16:45,720 --> 01:16:48,560
the bench out front one time and I was talking

1189
01:16:48,600 --> 01:16:51,680
to a lady that grew up there, and she said,

1190
01:16:51,920 --> 01:16:55,920
you know, back in the old days, boy, if you

1191
01:16:56,000 --> 01:17:00,600
had an experience, you just kept your mouth shut. And

1192
01:17:00,640 --> 01:17:05,760
you know from reading the John Keel that the Scarberrys

1193
01:17:05,800 --> 01:17:09,199
and the Balance, the other other witnesses that came forward

1194
01:17:09,199 --> 01:17:13,319
at the time, the ridicule that they suffered. Yeah, I think.

1195
01:17:13,399 --> 01:17:15,439
I mean, there's still a lot of that, but it

1196
01:17:15,479 --> 01:17:20,039
does seem like people can come forward a little easier

1197
01:17:20,239 --> 01:17:21,760
these days and tell their story.

1198
01:17:21,800 --> 01:17:24,079
Speaker 3: I think so. I think it's because of shows like

1199
01:17:24,119 --> 01:17:28,279
this one and others like this. We're having a dialogue

1200
01:17:28,600 --> 01:17:33,640
online and you can watch it now, load it up

1201
01:17:33,640 --> 01:17:38,199
into your favorite podcast app YouTube. There are ways to

1202
01:17:38,199 --> 01:17:41,920
get this information, and you can consume the information in

1203
01:17:42,000 --> 01:17:45,760
the privacy of your car or your home, and you

1204
01:17:45,800 --> 01:17:49,359
don't worry about that as much as when everything kind

1205
01:17:49,399 --> 01:17:54,319
of came over a couple central channels. So my prediction

1206
01:17:54,600 --> 01:17:57,479
is it's going to evolve rapidly. Steve, this is how

1207
01:17:57,520 --> 01:18:00,319
it starts. It starts with a trickle, but it comes

1208
01:18:00,319 --> 01:18:03,640
a flood. Once you take your finger out of the

1209
01:18:03,760 --> 01:18:06,920
dyke that's holding up the whole thing and the leak starts.

1210
01:18:07,760 --> 01:18:10,960
The dam can come down pretty quickly. We've seen this

1211
01:18:11,039 --> 01:18:14,520
politically in different countries over the decades. Things can change

1212
01:18:14,560 --> 01:18:18,760
faster than you would expect, and it would be like

1213
01:18:18,880 --> 01:18:22,239
your sand castle's collapsing in the water rushing in when

1214
01:18:22,239 --> 01:18:23,920
you were a kid on the beach, in the whole

1215
01:18:23,960 --> 01:18:26,399
area that you had been That's what I see happening

1216
01:18:26,439 --> 01:18:30,760
here because there's because linking it back to the scientific

1217
01:18:30,840 --> 01:18:34,640
progress we could be making just this sense of integrity

1218
01:18:34,720 --> 01:18:38,199
of having a realistic understanding of the multiverse or universe

1219
01:18:38,199 --> 01:18:40,920
that we live in right just that I think natural

1220
01:18:41,000 --> 01:18:43,800
human desire to have a kind of accurate sense of

1221
01:18:43,840 --> 01:18:47,520
what's around us. I think that trumps all this conditioning

1222
01:18:47,600 --> 01:18:51,640
we've had to avoid the spooky wookie woe stuff, you know.

1223
01:18:52,319 --> 01:18:54,359
I mean in physics, what did they call it, shut

1224
01:18:54,439 --> 01:18:57,680
up and calculate. That's what the quantum physicists told us.

1225
01:18:57,840 --> 01:19:01,079
It was called shut up and they experienced too. Don't

1226
01:19:01,119 --> 01:19:04,880
talk about foundations and implications, just do your measurements. I

1227
01:19:04,960 --> 01:19:07,239
think that's yeah. I think it's changing, and I think

1228
01:19:07,279 --> 01:19:10,960
we can look forward to seeing more discussion about this.

1229
01:19:11,279 --> 01:19:13,960
I've seen it even in the cold fusion articles that

1230
01:19:14,000 --> 01:19:19,520
have come out in mainstream scientific journals recently about cold

1231
01:19:19,520 --> 01:19:24,239
fusion in geological processes deep in the earth creating volcanoes.

1232
01:19:24,720 --> 01:19:28,279
As you were saying before, Susie earthquakes, that could be

1233
01:19:28,359 --> 01:19:31,319
a Lener based process. And where's all that magma coming

1234
01:19:31,359 --> 01:19:35,560
for what's heating it? It could be a Lenner process

1235
01:19:35,640 --> 01:19:40,520
that's created People have argued this. So I think gradually

1236
01:19:40,600 --> 01:19:42,199
you do see this change, and I think that's the

1237
01:19:42,239 --> 01:19:44,039
time we're living in. Makes it very exciting to be

1238
01:19:44,079 --> 01:19:45,279
around right now.

1239
01:19:46,399 --> 01:19:48,960
Speaker 1: Well, please tell us about where to find your books,

1240
01:19:49,159 --> 01:19:52,479
your YouTube channel, and how people can get a hold

1241
01:19:52,520 --> 01:19:52,680
of you.

1242
01:19:54,119 --> 01:19:57,239
Speaker 3: Oh thanks, Well, dark Matter Monsters has its own website,

1243
01:19:57,319 --> 01:20:03,479
Darkmattermonsters dot com, lacks vun dot com, Opening Minds dot info,

1244
01:20:04,199 --> 01:20:10,680
Planetary Intelligence dot com. You can go to my log

1245
01:20:10,760 --> 01:20:15,039
site new crystalmind dot com. I post everything there, and

1246
01:20:15,079 --> 01:20:17,000
I have a new Patreon site where I kind of

1247
01:20:17,560 --> 01:20:21,439
very post things for members right before I put them

1248
01:20:21,479 --> 01:20:23,119
up on YouTube for people that want to see the

1249
01:20:23,159 --> 01:20:24,960
latest stuff I'm working on. I want to have a

1250
01:20:25,000 --> 01:20:28,840
little more communication and my YouTube channel. People are welcome

1251
01:20:28,880 --> 01:20:31,800
to check out my YouTube channel. And if you look

1252
01:20:31,800 --> 01:20:34,399
at my sites, you'll see I have like free mini

1253
01:20:34,600 --> 01:20:37,560
RV classes. You know, you don't even need to take

1254
01:20:37,600 --> 01:20:39,920
some training. I put up seven videos how to do it.

1255
01:20:40,840 --> 01:20:43,439
Just put your email in. You can go through, you know,

1256
01:20:44,520 --> 01:20:48,560
about two hours of training or so that I just

1257
01:20:48,600 --> 01:20:51,359
put up with a real target at the end, so.

1258
01:20:51,800 --> 01:20:55,159
Speaker 1: That'd be great. I have dabbled with remote viewing a

1259
01:20:55,159 --> 01:20:59,760
little bit, had some minor success, but I'm a kind

1260
01:20:59,760 --> 01:21:03,159
of that wants to know things. You know. Of course,

1261
01:21:03,760 --> 01:21:05,960
the stuff that I would be seeking out that probably

1262
01:21:06,000 --> 01:21:08,479
I wouldn't be able to get feedback. I'd be looking

1263
01:21:08,520 --> 01:21:12,520
at places on Mars or whatever that and who knows,

1264
01:21:12,640 --> 01:21:13,680
you know, if it's real.

1265
01:21:13,560 --> 01:21:16,800
Speaker 3: Or not right right, We have a group that meets

1266
01:21:16,840 --> 01:21:18,840
once a month, or anyone wants to join. Our group

1267
01:21:19,760 --> 01:21:23,800
meets on second Sunday every month, and if you just

1268
01:21:23,840 --> 01:21:26,720
go to my website you'll find the RV Zoom group.

1269
01:21:27,000 --> 01:21:29,000
We have had a big foot Zoom group too that

1270
01:21:29,039 --> 01:21:32,199
people are welcome to join, but that's on a bit

1271
01:21:32,239 --> 01:21:34,119
of a hiatus just because I was kind of busy

1272
01:21:34,159 --> 01:21:36,520
for the past year. But we did that for over

1273
01:21:36,560 --> 01:21:39,600
two years. Had the most amazing witnesses join our group

1274
01:21:40,600 --> 01:21:44,439
and tell us different sightings. You guys know the types

1275
01:21:44,479 --> 01:21:47,279
of things that are out there, different sightings of different things.

1276
01:21:47,279 --> 01:21:50,000
And they would say, I've never talked about this before,

1277
01:21:50,039 --> 01:21:51,880
but I know about your group. I want to share

1278
01:21:52,880 --> 01:21:56,039
and I don't even have the vocabulary to describe what

1279
01:21:56,119 --> 01:21:58,600
they saw. But it was living, that's all. We'll say.

1280
01:21:58,640 --> 01:22:02,560
It was living and could speak to them. So there's

1281
01:22:02,600 --> 01:22:04,920
a lot more out there and you know the final

1282
01:22:04,960 --> 01:22:08,199
word here, Steve. People should follow their curiosity and what

1283
01:22:08,239 --> 01:22:11,279
they see with their own eyes, and don't necessarily believe

1284
01:22:11,319 --> 01:22:14,560
what you've been told, follow your experiences, do your research,

1285
01:22:15,520 --> 01:22:17,399
and that'll help us all move forward with this.

1286
01:22:19,039 --> 01:22:21,439
Speaker 1: Well, it's really been great to have you here and

1287
01:22:21,479 --> 01:22:22,800
I hope you'll come back sometime.

1288
01:22:23,000 --> 01:22:25,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, i'd be happy to you. Thanks a lot, Steven Sizzy.

1289
01:22:25,000 --> 01:22:27,560
Speaker 1: It's been a lot of fun and now I'm going

1290
01:22:27,640 --> 01:22:31,279
to do my classic close out here. It's not very classic,

1291
01:22:31,319 --> 01:22:35,039
but it is a close out. The High Strangest Factor

1292
01:22:35,119 --> 01:22:38,319
was created by Staveboard and Andy Mercer and it's copyrighted

1293
01:22:38,319 --> 01:22:41,199
on the Paranormal UK Radio network. I want to thank

1294
01:22:41,239 --> 01:22:44,760
Irene Alan Block, Mark Johnson and Andy Mercer are fearless

1295
01:22:44,840 --> 01:22:47,960
leaders at the network. Andy is also producer for the

1296
01:22:48,000 --> 01:22:52,319
show and composed the closing theme. Brian Zeller proposed the

1297
01:22:52,399 --> 01:22:56,479
opening theme. You can also hear me weekly on Mac

1298
01:22:56,520 --> 01:23:01,800
Maloney's Military X Files on this same network. Andy Mercer

1299
01:23:02,000 --> 01:23:05,319
Susie Basti Leni will be backed with another installment of

1300
01:23:05,359 --> 01:23:09,039
The High Strangest Factor and I am Steve Ward, a

1301
01:23:09,119 --> 01:23:13,039
displaced Michigander deep in the Ohio Valley, living on the

1302
01:23:13,079 --> 01:23:16,760
same road that Mothman chased cars in the middle sixties

1303
01:23:17,039 --> 01:23:20,760
in Point Pleasant. We'll see you all again in a fortnight.

1304
01:23:21,520 --> 01:23:22,000
Speaker 3: Take care