WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.600 --> 00:00:05.080 This is not a very spy centric song. This is 2 00:00:05.120 --> 00:00:08.919 like a loud song. I want spy shit, dude, there 3 00:00:09.000 --> 00:00:20.480 we go, there we go. Give me some sixties spy 4 00:00:20.679 --> 00:00:25.239 stuff going, give me in the mood, give my vibes. Right, 5 00:00:25.920 --> 00:00:32.000 you know what I'm saying. Now, what I'm saying. Welcome 6 00:00:32.039 --> 00:00:36.799 to another late night stream. Today we're going to focus 7 00:00:36.920 --> 00:00:44.520 on problems in Protestanism and why Protestantism is false overallhem 8 00:00:46.759 --> 00:00:52.920 but we will also be welcoming calls from Catholics, Mormons, Charismatics, 9 00:00:53.039 --> 00:00:58.799 you name it. Any group that has various theological positions 10 00:00:58.880 --> 00:01:03.479 is welcome to call in that they take issue with. Right, 11 00:01:06.159 --> 00:01:09.120 if you feel like you would like to set me straight, 12 00:01:10.159 --> 00:01:15.359 tonight is your knight. You can call it. And yeah, 13 00:01:15.359 --> 00:01:19.560 if you want to talk about all the classic issues PSA, 14 00:01:19.760 --> 00:01:24.319 blah blah blah, we'll let you do it. I will 15 00:01:24.319 --> 00:01:30.239 also kind of intermittently comment on other topics issues clips 16 00:01:30.599 --> 00:01:36.760 relevant to today, including Wes huff coming at me right 17 00:01:36.840 --> 00:01:40.040 or as I should say, running away, not coming at me, 18 00:01:40.799 --> 00:01:49.120 going away from me, because the Protestants as a whole, 19 00:01:50.519 --> 00:01:56.159 it seems, are actually on the run. We've seen both 20 00:01:56.400 --> 00:02:01.079 DAWA and the Roman Catholics sphere pretty much collapse in 21 00:02:01.159 --> 00:02:08.039 terms of their apologetic approach. Dhahwa pretty much died last 22 00:02:08.120 --> 00:02:16.520 year when we did the sam Shamun Fresh and Fit 23 00:02:16.599 --> 00:02:22.360 debate with Hikikachu and he Jaws. We've not seen any 24 00:02:22.439 --> 00:02:26.120 significant debate challenges. Jake's done a few debates. Jake's pretty 25 00:02:26.159 --> 00:02:34.120 much the last of the Muslim debaters, and as I predicted, 26 00:02:35.039 --> 00:02:38.400 Rouslan has run from the debate. Although he admitted four 27 00:02:38.439 --> 00:02:40.280 times he wanted to do one, it was willing to 28 00:02:40.319 --> 00:02:46.000 do one. Now he demands I publicly apologize to his 29 00:02:46.159 --> 00:02:52.800 satisfaction and repent to him. I think Ruslan's got him 30 00:02:52.840 --> 00:02:56.520 and God mixed up. Like Rouslan seems to think that, 31 00:02:56.840 --> 00:02:59.719 as he named his channel, you can bless God, as 32 00:02:59.800 --> 00:03:02.840 of Godd needs a blessing or has some lack. Ruslan 33 00:03:02.879 --> 00:03:07.280 believes people w need to repent to him. Uh No, dude, 34 00:03:07.800 --> 00:03:11.439 I don't know what you're talking about. Rouselan believes that 35 00:03:12.000 --> 00:03:15.479 people should defer to him. He calls the shots when 36 00:03:15.560 --> 00:03:20.159 it comes to flexing channels, and I don't believe any 37 00:03:20.240 --> 00:03:25.039 of it. So I'm an atheist when it comes to Ruslanianism. 38 00:03:25.680 --> 00:03:31.680 I do not recognize the existence of Ruslan's spiritual auth already. 39 00:03:31.919 --> 00:03:35.120 So tonight is not mainly Ruslan as a topic, though 40 00:03:35.159 --> 00:03:40.879 I want to talk some about everybody's favorite Protestant apologist 41 00:03:41.280 --> 00:03:43.560 or what's left of him, who also now will not 42 00:03:43.599 --> 00:03:49.199 debate anyone. He is also removed himself from any debates. 43 00:03:49.280 --> 00:03:50.879 In fact, I don't even really think he did, like 44 00:03:50.879 --> 00:03:55.319 maybe one or two and they weren't even really Maybe 45 00:03:55.319 --> 00:03:56.639 he did more and I'm just not aware of it. 46 00:03:56.680 --> 00:04:00.280 But Galvin Orland and his interesting background when it comes 47 00:04:00.319 --> 00:04:04.360 to his dad, and the relationship to Christianity today, which 48 00:04:04.400 --> 00:04:06.680 I think is very sus So we're going to talk 49 00:04:06.719 --> 00:04:09.879 about some of that and the evangelical not just the 50 00:04:09.919 --> 00:04:17.800 griff sphere, but the sus sphere. Who is behind these people, 51 00:04:17.839 --> 00:04:22.839 who's funding these people? Does Christianity today have that kind 52 00:04:22.839 --> 00:04:26.120 of fed connection? Of course it does, of course it does. 53 00:04:26.360 --> 00:04:29.920 So we're gonna be talking about some of that today. 54 00:04:31.120 --> 00:04:37.240 The sort of evangelical mouthpiece of the Pentagon and the 55 00:04:37.279 --> 00:04:41.120 CIA establishment, much like we discussed for many, many years, 56 00:04:41.160 --> 00:04:44.639 way before Queen Kwondas did it. We talked about groups 57 00:04:44.839 --> 00:04:51.720 like TPUSA or evangelical ministries like Campus Crusade. Essentially being 58 00:04:51.879 --> 00:04:55.759 arms of the military industrial complex. They began actually out 59 00:04:55.759 --> 00:04:57.439 of the Pentagon if you don't know that, that's the 60 00:04:57.480 --> 00:05:02.199 actual history of campus crusade, and a plethora of evangelical 61 00:05:02.680 --> 00:05:09.040 groups actually do have a very close connection to cutouts, fronts, etc. 62 00:05:09.480 --> 00:05:13.680 You saw, for example, all over the news today vindicating myself, 63 00:05:14.560 --> 00:05:17.759 who's talked about this also for over ten years, radical 64 00:05:17.800 --> 00:05:24.000 fringe groups right like the neo in groups, the Christian 65 00:05:24.040 --> 00:05:28.680 identity groups which were essentially behind Eloheim City and the 66 00:05:28.800 --> 00:05:34.800 McVeigh event. We've talked about many cults having connections to 67 00:05:35.040 --> 00:05:41.040 intelligence agencies, shady suss funding and lo and behold, turns 68 00:05:41.040 --> 00:05:46.519 out we are vindicated. The allegations of the Department of 69 00:05:46.680 --> 00:05:54.680 Justice today are that multiple fake right wing entities were 70 00:05:54.720 --> 00:05:59.360 not just informed with or excuse me, infiltrated with informants, 71 00:05:59.360 --> 00:06:04.040 but we're actually run by significant amounts of money, including 72 00:06:04.040 --> 00:06:07.680 in the millions of dollars to a host of fake 73 00:06:07.920 --> 00:06:11.480 right wing front groups. In this case, it was not 74 00:06:11.720 --> 00:06:14.439 directly the FBI or the FEDS per se running in 75 00:06:14.480 --> 00:06:17.759 this case, it was the SPLC. Now, the SPLC has 76 00:06:17.839 --> 00:06:22.519 included large backing from George Soros, JP Morgan Chase, George 77 00:06:22.600 --> 00:06:26.480 Clooney and Open AI. So all of these mega leftist 78 00:06:26.639 --> 00:06:29.560 entities have obviously put significant amounts of money over the 79 00:06:29.639 --> 00:06:33.480 years into the Southern Poverty Law Center, which has then 80 00:06:33.680 --> 00:06:39.160 utilized that money to help fund and control the fake opposition. 81 00:06:39.439 --> 00:06:42.879 We have been saying this actually for twenty years, back 82 00:06:42.879 --> 00:06:45.800 to the Big Nine event, because we argued back then 83 00:06:46.439 --> 00:06:55.480 that the groups that were used, such as al Qaeda, 84 00:06:55.959 --> 00:07:00.439 had a long time Western intelligence relationship and sort of 85 00:07:00.439 --> 00:07:05.000 cut out proxy status on record. Same with the nineteen 86 00:07:05.079 --> 00:07:07.759 ninety three event, and with many terror events. Not necessarily 87 00:07:07.879 --> 00:07:12.079 every every event, but in many cases that was the case. 88 00:07:12.439 --> 00:07:15.120 And now we've seen also explicitly, as I told people 89 00:07:15.120 --> 00:07:18.720 in twenty seventeen, I would not go to Charlottesville. That 90 00:07:18.800 --> 00:07:22.319 would be a massive fed honey trap situation. I told 91 00:07:22.319 --> 00:07:25.040 people on live streams at the time not to do it. 92 00:07:25.920 --> 00:07:29.600 Lo and behold, who's vindicated? I am. I knew what 93 00:07:29.639 --> 00:07:32.079 I was talking about. Do you think I just make 94 00:07:32.160 --> 00:07:35.560 these things up. I've been reading about these subjects for 95 00:07:35.720 --> 00:07:38.600 over twenty years. All the books that you see behind me, 96 00:07:39.000 --> 00:07:41.720 they're not just a set piece. I'm not like Michael 97 00:07:41.759 --> 00:07:43.399 Lofton with a bunch of fake books behind me that 98 00:07:43.439 --> 00:07:45.800 I've never touched. I actually read the books. You see 99 00:07:45.800 --> 00:07:49.120 all the sticky notes. I don't just stick them in 100 00:07:49.160 --> 00:07:51.800 there to make it look like i've read them. I 101 00:07:51.920 --> 00:07:55.120 read these books, and I have for over twenty years. 102 00:07:56.600 --> 00:07:58.920 And it's not just the domain of co intel and 103 00:08:00.360 --> 00:08:03.319 espionage and all that kind of stuff and geopolitics. I 104 00:08:03.360 --> 00:08:06.240 also read the theology books. Those books are also very 105 00:08:06.240 --> 00:08:11.160 well read. So that's ultimately why people don't want to 106 00:08:11.199 --> 00:08:14.800 come over here and have civil formal debates. It has 107 00:08:14.839 --> 00:08:17.959 nothing to do with my jokes or a four letter 108 00:08:18.000 --> 00:08:22.040 word here and there. That's all ploy that's all smoke 109 00:08:22.079 --> 00:08:24.959 and mirror's excuse. And they know that. They know that 110 00:08:25.040 --> 00:08:29.920 because we have organized countless formal civil debates all over 111 00:08:29.959 --> 00:08:34.279 the place with Muslims, with atheists, with cult leaders, et cetera. 112 00:08:34.399 --> 00:08:37.480 You name. It very easy to set up a debate, 113 00:08:37.840 --> 00:08:42.200 it's not hard. But these are all pearl clutching excuses 114 00:08:42.600 --> 00:08:46.639 to not interact. And I don't care whose channel it's on. 115 00:08:46.759 --> 00:08:49.240 It doesn't have to be on rous Lawn channel. In fact, 116 00:08:49.279 --> 00:08:51.360 I don't ever want to go on Rousselann channel. I 117 00:08:51.399 --> 00:08:53.840 don't care about Rousselance channel. So I told them I'll 118 00:08:53.840 --> 00:08:57.080 debate you on a tiny channel with no followers. That way, 119 00:08:57.320 --> 00:08:59.879 everybody can see that we're not doing it for the click, 120 00:09:00.279 --> 00:09:03.080 although I think Ruslan definitely does it for the clicks. 121 00:09:03.080 --> 00:09:06.799 For example, we notice that these people's standards are never 122 00:09:06.879 --> 00:09:11.240 applied consistently. When Rouslan said that he will not interact 123 00:09:11.279 --> 00:09:14.960 with people that are toxic or whatever other such nonsense 124 00:09:15.000 --> 00:09:18.000 he said, notice that it doesn't apply to the very 125 00:09:18.000 --> 00:09:19.679 thing he said about me. Though, I only want to 126 00:09:19.679 --> 00:09:23.879 debate people with bigger channels. I just debated Captain Crackrock twice. 127 00:09:24.440 --> 00:09:27.080 He has a much smaller channel than me. I'm debating 128 00:09:27.120 --> 00:09:29.320 a Protestant pastor in a couple of weeks who has 129 00:09:29.480 --> 00:09:33.000 basically no Internet following. We're doing it all modern day debate. 130 00:09:33.320 --> 00:09:37.360 So no, I don't just debate people formally with a 131 00:09:37.440 --> 00:09:40.559 large following, although everybody in the sphere would like to 132 00:09:40.600 --> 00:09:44.200 debate a larger following person because it gives him exposure. 133 00:09:44.240 --> 00:09:47.519 So he's acting like this is some thing unique to 134 00:09:47.639 --> 00:09:51.960 just me, And here he is wanting to interact, begging 135 00:09:52.000 --> 00:09:55.320 for nick flints, attention and clout so that he can 136 00:09:55.360 --> 00:09:58.840 get a bigger channel and a bigger presence. Looking at him, 137 00:09:58.879 --> 00:10:01.240 the very thing he said is all. So he basically 138 00:10:01.320 --> 00:10:04.879 is projecting everything that he does. Is what he accuses 139 00:10:04.879 --> 00:10:08.039 me of because he assumes that we the same, we 140 00:10:08.120 --> 00:10:10.000 get the same mind fram we ain't the same. 141 00:10:10.080 --> 00:10:10.279 Son. 142 00:10:10.960 --> 00:10:13.200 I don't care about your flex and I don't care 143 00:10:13.200 --> 00:10:14.000 about your channel. 144 00:10:14.279 --> 00:10:17.559 But it's interesting that our audiences overlap. But I'm here 145 00:10:17.600 --> 00:10:19.080 for it. I'm here for it. As long as long 146 00:10:19.080 --> 00:10:21.279 as he's willing to have a conversation, I'm here for it. 147 00:10:21.279 --> 00:10:23.320 I got I got no, I got no gripes with 148 00:10:24.360 --> 00:10:26.519 having a conversation with him. But it's it's interesting that 149 00:10:26.559 --> 00:10:27.039 our audience. 150 00:10:27.080 --> 00:10:29.519 Oh wait, those audiences don't overlap. What the hell are 151 00:10:29.519 --> 00:10:32.960 you talking about? That audience ain't watching your dumb ass 152 00:10:33.039 --> 00:10:37.600 What are you talking about? Nonsense? Yeah, Rouselm is a narcissist. 153 00:10:37.600 --> 00:10:39.840 I'm gonna show you his stupid ass churches, his fake 154 00:10:39.879 --> 00:10:43.279 business churches. Sermon. Remember bragging about his sermons the other day? 155 00:10:43.679 --> 00:10:46.600 You realize, so just preached like three sermons of my church. 156 00:10:46.600 --> 00:10:49.320 So you realize I've just preached sermons as if anybody 157 00:10:49.320 --> 00:10:51.840 cares about your stupid sermons, as if we're impressed by that. 158 00:10:52.360 --> 00:10:58.039 Oh oh dude, was that business church, and he was sermonize, 159 00:10:58.039 --> 00:11:00.720 oh shit, I better back down. I better showed this. 160 00:11:00.840 --> 00:11:03.120 I'll put I better put some respect on this man. 161 00:11:04.279 --> 00:11:08.360 Now his actual church, which he publicly says for you people, 162 00:11:08.720 --> 00:11:11.080 he's dog should to be dogs. He publicly talks about 163 00:11:11.080 --> 00:11:13.399 his church on his podcast. He mentioned in his last 164 00:11:13.440 --> 00:11:16.360 video people probably didn't catch it because it's such a 165 00:11:16.360 --> 00:11:18.799 stupid ass name for a church. You probably thought he 166 00:11:18.879 --> 00:11:22.279 was talking about his R and B group or his 167 00:11:22.480 --> 00:11:26.279 hip hop group when he said, I go to Rhythm Church. Yes, 168 00:11:26.440 --> 00:11:28.799 that's right, it's called Rhythm Church. You can't make this 169 00:11:28.960 --> 00:11:35.639 up based around lame ass beats. So here he is 170 00:11:36.440 --> 00:11:39.399 at Rhythm Church. He preaching up there to Rhythm Church. 171 00:11:39.480 --> 00:11:39.679 Doll. 172 00:11:42.000 --> 00:11:46.080 I like how Rhythm Church, by the way, has a podium, 173 00:11:46.440 --> 00:11:51.559 an ugly ass damn corporate style chair, a computer and 174 00:11:51.600 --> 00:11:54.519 that's it. But they also put a little bit of 175 00:11:55.120 --> 00:11:58.679 image free stained glass windows to make it look churchy. 176 00:11:58.759 --> 00:12:01.840 Do hey, look, this looked too much like an AMN lecture. 177 00:12:01.879 --> 00:12:04.799 Hall put a little bit of stained glass up in 178 00:12:04.879 --> 00:12:07.559 here to make it a little bit of churchy. Yes, 179 00:12:07.600 --> 00:12:10.120 it's called Rhythm Church. You can't make this up. Okay, 180 00:12:10.399 --> 00:12:14.080 So this is what rus lines right, he was. This 181 00:12:14.159 --> 00:12:17.720 is what he was all bragging about. Do flexing. You realize, 182 00:12:17.720 --> 00:12:20.360 well just preached three times looking about church, right, you 183 00:12:20.399 --> 00:12:24.120 realize I am a preacher. I'm not joking. To check 184 00:12:24.159 --> 00:12:29.039 this out. Let's see this. Let's see this awesome mad 185 00:12:29.159 --> 00:12:31.200 cap sermonizing. 186 00:12:31.320 --> 00:12:31.480 Right. 187 00:12:31.480 --> 00:12:36.360 Hell, all right, one more time. Give it up for 188 00:12:36.399 --> 00:12:38.679 the amazing worship team. 189 00:12:38.879 --> 00:12:42.639 Everybody who so dudes preaching wearing a T shirt for 190 00:12:42.679 --> 00:12:45.480 his book. And you're trying to tell me it's not 191 00:12:45.559 --> 00:12:51.799 business church now, he said, imagine the apostles thinking of 192 00:12:51.840 --> 00:12:55.639 the Orthodox Church was the true church. The Apostles and 193 00:12:55.720 --> 00:12:59.559 their church looks nothing like the accretions of the Orthodox Church. 194 00:12:59.639 --> 00:13:04.000 Roussel It says, Meanwhile, Rouse line, God, a damn uh 195 00:13:04.879 --> 00:13:09.200 looks like a a damn factory worker back there on 196 00:13:09.399 --> 00:13:14.000 bass guitar. We got a we got a farm boy 197 00:13:14.080 --> 00:13:19.639 back there on bass guitar. Rooselin's got a a T 198 00:13:19.799 --> 00:13:29.200 shirt for his book doing sermons now. Clearly, Rhythm and 199 00:13:29.240 --> 00:13:32.120 Blues R and B Church. Clearly R and B Church 200 00:13:32.360 --> 00:13:35.639 is what the Apostles had in mind. You're trying to 201 00:13:35.679 --> 00:13:39.320 tell me Peter wasn't over there busting it down like 202 00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:45.320 Prince right. You tell me Peter wasn't over there doing 203 00:13:45.360 --> 00:13:48.799 a little bit of I'll be sure you tell me 204 00:13:48.879 --> 00:13:54.919 that the Apostles didn't set up Rhythm Church. So the 205 00:13:55.039 --> 00:13:59.080 dude calling us out of line with the post Apostolic 206 00:13:59.120 --> 00:14:05.600 fathers the first century goes to rapper Rhythm Church and 207 00:14:05.679 --> 00:14:10.279 wears t shirts about his book up on a stage, 208 00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:16.000 no altar, a stage. Yes, that's clearly the true shirt. 209 00:14:17.440 --> 00:14:19.039 It's serving behind the scenes. 210 00:14:19.120 --> 00:14:22.519 So how many guys know where we've been parked in 211 00:14:22.559 --> 00:14:24.799 the last years, all of twenty twenty five? 212 00:14:24.799 --> 00:14:27.759 What book have we've been in? That's right? And I 213 00:14:27.799 --> 00:14:28.639 was looking. 214 00:14:28.639 --> 00:14:32.360 At last week at what was talked about in Acts 215 00:14:32.399 --> 00:14:34.200 this week, and I said, Jeff, this is this is 216 00:14:34.240 --> 00:14:34.679 really good. 217 00:14:34.679 --> 00:14:36.080 I want to I want to preach this part. 218 00:14:36.200 --> 00:14:38.200 Oh he going back to the origins of the church 219 00:14:38.279 --> 00:14:43.320 br the Book of Acts. Right. Let me ask you 220 00:14:43.360 --> 00:14:47.360 a question, Roseline, Where in the Book of Acts do 221 00:14:47.480 --> 00:14:52.639 you see a bass guitar? Where do you see a stage? 222 00:14:54.720 --> 00:15:02.279 This man up on stage, this is the grifter over 223 00:15:02.320 --> 00:15:07.080 here trying to say that we aren't Apostolic and this 224 00:15:07.279 --> 00:15:09.919 is the church his his dumb ass is at And 225 00:15:10.000 --> 00:15:12.720 Jeff said, now, bro, oh, look they do have a 226 00:15:12.720 --> 00:15:15.720 stained glass that does have an image. Okay. I was 227 00:15:15.720 --> 00:15:18.360 getting a little nervous because I was like, they just 228 00:15:18.399 --> 00:15:22.159 got stained pretty colors. Well they got one image. Okay, 229 00:15:22.159 --> 00:15:23.879 so we're at least not iconoclast. 230 00:15:25.320 --> 00:15:29.000 I got this. I want it for myself. I said, 231 00:15:29.039 --> 00:15:31.480 all right, so we're gonna do something fun. We're gonna 232 00:15:31.480 --> 00:15:34.360 we're actually gonna Last week, do you remember where where 233 00:15:34.360 --> 00:15:35.360 Paul was an action? 234 00:15:36.159 --> 00:15:36.559 Where was he? 235 00:15:36.840 --> 00:15:39.720 Yeah, he went over to Rhythm Church. Paul went over there. 236 00:15:39.720 --> 00:15:42.559 Punks pod people don't know. Paul was a damn beat boxer. 237 00:15:43.480 --> 00:15:50.399 Paul could be box at best with the best of them. 238 00:15:57.279 --> 00:16:06.960 Gospel Church, Gospels Church, That's what the Apostles was up to. 239 00:16:07.120 --> 00:16:11.360 Son traveling through the church in ephsis So we're gonna. 240 00:16:11.120 --> 00:16:14.240 Spile in the book of CS. Let me ask you 241 00:16:14.320 --> 00:16:14.840 a courtion. 242 00:16:15.519 --> 00:16:20.200 Stay in Ephesians today, and we're gonna talk about something 243 00:16:20.240 --> 00:16:21.720 that I think is so relevant. So if you turn 244 00:16:21.759 --> 00:16:24.360 your bibles to Ephesians chapter one with me. 245 00:16:24.879 --> 00:16:28.240 Why they got sadass piano music playing while he talking. 246 00:16:31.639 --> 00:16:34.919 I ain't going on somebody's low ass number stream. I 247 00:16:34.919 --> 00:16:37.840 ain't going on his dumb stream. Those people can call 248 00:16:37.879 --> 00:16:42.320 in here I'm not going on a two hundred one 249 00:16:42.720 --> 00:16:47.279 subscribers stream. Why are you wasting my time? 250 00:16:49.200 --> 00:16:49.399 Then? 251 00:16:49.440 --> 00:16:53.240 Boys? Is all in the orbit? Then a bunch of 252 00:16:53.360 --> 00:16:57.240 gay orbiters of roost lines. You think I'm gonna go 253 00:16:57.279 --> 00:17:00.960 on gay orbiter rouse lines people's stream. No, they can 254 00:17:01.000 --> 00:17:03.360 come over here. By the way, I'm doing them a 255 00:17:03.399 --> 00:17:06.200 favor because all they want is a clip farm. All 256 00:17:06.200 --> 00:17:10.880 they wants attention them dummy stream about me every two weeks. 257 00:17:11.400 --> 00:17:12.880 So no, I'm not giving them what they want. But 258 00:17:13.000 --> 00:17:14.359 although I will give them what they want because they 259 00:17:14.359 --> 00:17:17.880 can come over here and they can call in and 260 00:17:17.960 --> 00:17:19.799 they can get their dumb clips. That's all they do. 261 00:17:20.319 --> 00:17:24.319 Y'all not realize that people just want clips. You think 262 00:17:24.359 --> 00:17:29.039 I'm scared that dude called in. I asked him to 263 00:17:29.079 --> 00:17:32.279 call in and debate me on Intercession of the Saints, 264 00:17:32.319 --> 00:17:36.400 and he did so. How am I scared? You're about 265 00:17:36.400 --> 00:17:38.960 to just get booty. You're wasting everybody's huh, y'all are 266 00:17:38.960 --> 00:17:40.799 just scared because I'm making fun of your dumb cult 267 00:17:40.880 --> 00:17:45.960 leader ruse Line r u Se ruse Line and his 268 00:17:46.160 --> 00:17:49.519 dumb uh Rhythm and Blue R and B. 269 00:17:49.720 --> 00:17:56.880 Church Ephesians, Chapter one, Chapter one, Verse three, I'm reading 270 00:17:56.880 --> 00:17:57.519 out of the NIV. 271 00:17:57.640 --> 00:18:00.200 It says, Oh, praise be to. 272 00:18:00.160 --> 00:18:02.960 Be over there in the n IV. He over there 273 00:18:02.960 --> 00:18:05.319 in that n I b right. He ain't got the 274 00:18:05.400 --> 00:18:10.119 KGB Bible. He ain't got the KGV Bible. He got 275 00:18:10.119 --> 00:18:14.839 the NIB Bible. Yo. You got the NIB, bro, you 276 00:18:14.920 --> 00:18:18.319 got that Pigeon Bible, or you got a e Bonics Bible. 277 00:18:19.000 --> 00:18:19.160 Yo. 278 00:18:19.240 --> 00:18:22.400 I think we need to send Ruslana e Bonics Bible. 279 00:18:22.759 --> 00:18:24.599 Then maybe his dumba ass could read it. 280 00:18:24.799 --> 00:18:29.000 God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has 281 00:18:29.119 --> 00:18:32.920 blessed us in the heavenly realms with Averyka. 282 00:18:33.079 --> 00:18:37.359 Now, I'm not doing a performative, fake ass prayer. We've done. 283 00:18:38.680 --> 00:18:41.200 Get that gay crap out of my face, dude, with 284 00:18:41.359 --> 00:18:43.839 this performative prayer. I wish I had known all this 285 00:18:44.000 --> 00:18:52.279 before I even went on his cringe ass podcast. Also 286 00:18:52.839 --> 00:18:56.559 to change the subject to get over here to the calls. 287 00:18:57.160 --> 00:19:00.480 We did have some. I had a couple people reaching 288 00:19:00.480 --> 00:19:03.880 out to Doug Wilson. I didn't do it. It's another person 289 00:19:03.960 --> 00:19:08.160 that organized an event with me a year ago, and 290 00:19:09.119 --> 00:19:12.000 he's reached out to Doug Wilson, he says in multiple 291 00:19:12.039 --> 00:19:17.079 emails and Originally there was a planned potential discussion and debate. 292 00:19:18.200 --> 00:19:20.759 It started, I want to say, maybe six months ago, 293 00:19:21.000 --> 00:19:23.000 and I was busy at the time, and I said, 294 00:19:23.319 --> 00:19:25.160 why don't we see if you could get you know, 295 00:19:25.319 --> 00:19:27.279 father Deacon to do it. I've got a little bit 296 00:19:27.319 --> 00:19:29.440 too much going on right now to do a debate 297 00:19:29.480 --> 00:19:33.759 with Doug Wilson, although we did also try in that 298 00:19:33.880 --> 00:19:36.759 three way debate with me and Tim Gordon and the 299 00:19:36.799 --> 00:19:39.920 Lower Lodge dude. Originally the Protestant was going to be 300 00:19:39.960 --> 00:19:42.680 Doug Wilson, but I don't know if he canceled or 301 00:19:42.720 --> 00:19:45.039 just didn't want to do it, or they just never 302 00:19:45.079 --> 00:19:49.279 got into say, But then it turned into a potential 303 00:19:49.319 --> 00:19:54.000 other debate with FDA that never came to fruition. So 304 00:19:54.079 --> 00:20:03.680 I told the guy, I said, hey, Tingu says, I 305 00:20:03.720 --> 00:20:09.920 sent you a message on picture app to my Instagram. Uh, basically, 306 00:20:10.000 --> 00:20:12.279 I want to say that I'm grateful and for you 307 00:20:12.359 --> 00:20:14.680 bringing me back to the faith after running from it. 308 00:20:14.759 --> 00:20:17.119 If you read my message, I greatly be appreciated. God 309 00:20:17.160 --> 00:20:17.680 bless you all. 310 00:20:17.680 --> 00:20:17.799 Well. 311 00:20:17.839 --> 00:20:21.759 Thank you Tingu. He sends a big old fat Hunters 312 00:20:21.759 --> 00:20:23.799 one hundred dollars superch. I appreciate it. I didn't know 313 00:20:23.839 --> 00:20:28.079 that you can't say the word instagram. That's odd. I 314 00:20:28.160 --> 00:20:35.359 didn't know, crash Meta says. When Rouselan was asked about 315 00:20:35.359 --> 00:20:37.319 why he won't debate Jay but he would talk to 316 00:20:37.400 --> 00:20:40.039 Nick Flints, he says, because Nick Quintus is a pagan. 317 00:20:40.759 --> 00:20:43.359 Rouselan is just insane, dude. This dude is just cra 318 00:20:43.559 --> 00:20:46.519 I mean, none of the shit he says actually even 319 00:20:46.559 --> 00:20:49.160 makes it. I figured out that, Like, there's no point 320 00:20:49.200 --> 00:20:51.799 in even trying to make sense of what Rouselan's thinking 321 00:20:51.839 --> 00:20:54.519 is saying. I think he's just crashed out for real, 322 00:20:54.839 --> 00:20:57.279 Like I think there's something else going on. I mean, 323 00:20:57.319 --> 00:21:00.400 everybody wants to overuse this term crash out. I think 324 00:21:00.440 --> 00:21:02.720 something weird is going on with Rusalom. I don't know 325 00:21:03.519 --> 00:21:07.400 since their Hypocrette says, step aside Apostolic Church, we got 326 00:21:07.480 --> 00:21:09.480 Rhythm Church up in here, boy, That's what I'm saying. 327 00:21:10.599 --> 00:21:13.519 How do we know the original Apostolic Church wasn't Rhythm church? 328 00:21:14.160 --> 00:21:18.880 Can you prove it wasn't exactly exactly? You can't? Can you? There? 329 00:21:18.920 --> 00:21:22.599 We go? Of course you can, But I'm being silly. 330 00:21:23.319 --> 00:21:25.640 I mean, this is the dude that has the gumption 331 00:21:26.799 --> 00:21:30.279 to talk about how we are the ones that departed 332 00:21:30.319 --> 00:21:34.000 from the early church. Dude that goes to damn rhythm 333 00:21:34.000 --> 00:21:54.359 and blues church. Wait, Walter Schmidt, what's up? I'm mute, 334 00:21:55.920 --> 00:21:57.119 Walter Schmidt. I'm mute. 335 00:21:58.559 --> 00:22:02.880 Hey, j Yeah, how do I sound? Can you tell me? 336 00:22:03.480 --> 00:22:05.279 You sound sexy and amazing? 337 00:22:06.480 --> 00:22:07.400 That's good to hear it. 338 00:22:07.440 --> 00:22:09.799 The thing is, I want to do spaces myself and 339 00:22:10.680 --> 00:22:12.000 I'm kind of figuring. 340 00:22:11.680 --> 00:22:15.200 This stuff out with the equipment. But yeah, I just 341 00:22:15.240 --> 00:22:18.319 wanted to say hi. I'm I'm I don't really want 342 00:22:18.359 --> 00:22:21.759 to debate you. I pretty much agree with everything you say. 343 00:22:22.599 --> 00:22:25.000 Okay, Yeah, stuff with Rustlin is crazy. 344 00:22:25.599 --> 00:22:27.880 I'm glad that it finally is coming out. 345 00:22:27.960 --> 00:22:31.160 I never really watched him, but that guy is really weird. 346 00:22:32.039 --> 00:22:34.720 It's something it's it's something weird going on for sure. 347 00:22:35.160 --> 00:22:35.440 Yeah. 348 00:22:35.680 --> 00:22:40.960 Yeah, no, but yeah, I just wanted to say hi. 349 00:22:41.119 --> 00:22:46.759 And you know, it's really interesting to see how well the. 350 00:22:46.799 --> 00:22:49.480 Different spirit in the Orthodox. 351 00:22:49.119 --> 00:22:53.559 Apologetics, the Catholic apologetics, the Protestant apologetics, the Muslims. 352 00:22:54.720 --> 00:22:56.880 The Orthodox are the only one that have like a 353 00:22:57.240 --> 00:23:01.119 warrior spirit, like never liked ever. 354 00:23:01.440 --> 00:23:03.640 Yeah, well, all the other ones are gay. The rest 355 00:23:03.640 --> 00:23:05.920 of them are gay. They even are. I mean, the 356 00:23:05.920 --> 00:23:07.880 Proston churches are pretty much all gay. 357 00:23:09.160 --> 00:23:12.400 Yeah, I mean literally, even I saw what happened with 358 00:23:12.480 --> 00:23:13.359 you and Nick frent Is. 359 00:23:13.359 --> 00:23:15.079 It's such a shame. I mean, you had a great 360 00:23:15.160 --> 00:23:17.920 debate back then, and I watched it a couple of 361 00:23:18.000 --> 00:23:21.240 years ago, and I thought it was very interesting. I mean, 362 00:23:21.759 --> 00:23:24.480 it was very cordial on both sides. 363 00:23:24.519 --> 00:23:29.039 But now he's like scared and I like Nick flint Is, 364 00:23:29.119 --> 00:23:30.880 He's like an interesting guy. 365 00:23:31.000 --> 00:23:34.359 He's he's pushing the boundaries all that. 366 00:23:34.480 --> 00:23:37.640 But it's such a shame that he just doesn't want 367 00:23:37.680 --> 00:23:39.720 to interact with you. 368 00:23:39.920 --> 00:23:40.119 Well. 369 00:23:40.200 --> 00:23:42.960 I mean, Nick said the other day on one of 370 00:23:42.960 --> 00:23:46.599 his streams, I just saw the clip that Vatican two 371 00:23:46.720 --> 00:23:50.119 did go off the rails. So that's really just admitting 372 00:23:50.920 --> 00:23:52.720 the thing I've been trying to convey to him for 373 00:23:52.759 --> 00:23:59.640 ten years. So, Bruce, what's up? Thank you for that call? 374 00:23:59.720 --> 00:24:07.480 Dog said it. Bruce, how you doing? Go ahead? What's up? 375 00:24:08.519 --> 00:24:08.680 Hey? 376 00:24:08.720 --> 00:24:08.880 Man? 377 00:24:09.079 --> 00:24:10.240 I really been listening to a lot. 378 00:24:10.359 --> 00:24:11.440 Re release really. 379 00:24:11.240 --> 00:24:12.599 Helped me out with a lot of things. 380 00:24:12.680 --> 00:24:15.440 I'm a Protestant right now, but I'm trying to figure 381 00:24:15.480 --> 00:24:16.759 out there's two things. 382 00:24:16.960 --> 00:24:20.119 I don't know what's more interesting to you. I've said 383 00:24:20.160 --> 00:24:20.799 a union people. 384 00:24:20.839 --> 00:24:24.279 So to share Toeman or pre subpositional apologetics and the 385 00:24:24.359 --> 00:24:26.160 Canon scripture, which one's more. 386 00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:27.000 Interesting to you? 387 00:24:27.160 --> 00:24:29.319 Either one is fine, all right, So. 388 00:24:29.319 --> 00:24:31.799 Let's first talk about like the Cannon descripture and pre 389 00:24:31.839 --> 00:24:35.400 substantional apologetics. Why do you think it is, like you're 390 00:24:35.599 --> 00:24:37.880 you're a student of Boston Seminary and. 391 00:24:37.880 --> 00:24:40.519 Obviously well read on Van Hill, right, Well, why do 392 00:24:40.559 --> 00:24:41.759 you think it is that they missed this? 393 00:24:43.960 --> 00:24:46.319 Well, there are several reasons. I mean, they were not, 394 00:24:48.279 --> 00:24:54.039 to my knowledge, even familiar with anything from Orthodox Christian 395 00:24:54.079 --> 00:24:57.039 theology at all. It's really only been in this last 396 00:24:57.359 --> 00:25:01.559 several years that you know, Orthodox christianities theology presidence has 397 00:25:01.640 --> 00:25:05.599 even been kind of out there. I mean one of 398 00:25:05.599 --> 00:25:09.960 the first books was in the two thousands, right where 399 00:25:09.960 --> 00:25:14.759 you had I forget that guy's names, Daniel McClellan or 400 00:25:14.839 --> 00:25:19.160 mcmc something, and he wrote a book about Orthodox pros 401 00:25:19.160 --> 00:25:21.759 and Catholic views and he was like an evangelical guy. 402 00:25:21.839 --> 00:25:24.359 And that was in the early mid two thousands, and 403 00:25:24.400 --> 00:25:26.160 that was kind of one of the first books that 404 00:25:26.200 --> 00:25:29.559 even exposed a lot of people in the West. So 405 00:25:29.880 --> 00:25:32.359 Bonson dying in the late nineties or whatever, and Van 406 00:25:32.480 --> 00:25:34.880 till earlier than that. I mean, they just weren't even 407 00:25:34.880 --> 00:25:36.119 familiar with the in the stale. 408 00:25:37.400 --> 00:25:40.519 Logical problem here with regard to the lens by which 409 00:25:40.559 --> 00:25:44.880 they you'll effectively get caught by begging the question using 410 00:25:44.880 --> 00:25:46.880 the scripture that I'm able to justify the use of 411 00:25:46.920 --> 00:25:48.160 the scripture in the first. 412 00:25:47.920 --> 00:25:53.559 Place, Well, it's I mean, they're the ones that pioneered 413 00:25:53.559 --> 00:25:56.759 the idea that it's an argument for an entire paradigm. 414 00:25:57.000 --> 00:25:58.880 And if you're going to go that line of argument, 415 00:25:59.000 --> 00:26:01.880 then the paradigm needs to make sense. It can't just be, 416 00:26:03.319 --> 00:26:06.759 you know, something grounded in a book. It's got to 417 00:26:06.799 --> 00:26:10.160 be more than that, because the book itself comes from 418 00:26:10.240 --> 00:26:13.200 a paradigm, from a miliu, from a community. So I 419 00:26:13.240 --> 00:26:18.400 think that they missed, for example, there's certain metaphysical implications 420 00:26:18.839 --> 00:26:21.079 that go along with TAG that relate to the Trinity. 421 00:26:21.200 --> 00:26:22.839 That's something that I pushed quite a bit of the 422 00:26:22.880 --> 00:26:26.720 last ten years. So in other words, you could say 423 00:26:26.759 --> 00:26:29.160 that they worked in trans in augmentation. But if their 424 00:26:29.160 --> 00:26:34.119 conception of the deity was sufficiently heterodox and wrong, then 425 00:26:34.160 --> 00:26:35.960 the argument is only going to go so far. If 426 00:26:36.000 --> 00:26:41.480 you're saying that the Christian God is the foundation of morals, ethics, 427 00:26:41.480 --> 00:26:45.240 and metaphysics, a human morals, bismology, metaphysics, So you better 428 00:26:45.240 --> 00:26:48.160 have the right doctrine of God. So I think, combined 429 00:26:48.240 --> 00:26:54.240 with other Reformation distinctives like the doctrine told depravity and 430 00:26:54.279 --> 00:26:57.160 that there's you know, perpetual noetic effects of sin that 431 00:26:57.279 --> 00:27:01.039 constantly sort of put you in a a spiral of 432 00:27:01.079 --> 00:27:04.000 never having the type of certitude the tag allegedly is 433 00:27:04.000 --> 00:27:07.200 supposed to give you. People highlighting and bringing these points 434 00:27:07.200 --> 00:27:10.200 to the four for many many years, which were ignored. 435 00:27:10.200 --> 00:27:12.400 For example, I highlighted, I highlighted a lot of these 436 00:27:12.480 --> 00:27:16.119 arguments and points to John Frame and to Douglas Jones 437 00:27:16.119 --> 00:27:18.519 from the Wilson circles years ago, and a lot of 438 00:27:18.519 --> 00:27:21.480 those people would just try to ignore it. So again 439 00:27:21.519 --> 00:27:24.880 I think there's many things going on. Also, Protestantism is 440 00:27:24.920 --> 00:27:27.480 a form of prelust. It's a it's a situation where 441 00:27:28.480 --> 00:27:32.680 you you, you are the real arbiter of everything and 442 00:27:32.720 --> 00:27:35.920 you're the one that decides over everyone else. And although 443 00:27:35.960 --> 00:27:38.680 it claims that it's scripture, it's not. It's really you 444 00:27:38.759 --> 00:27:40.960 and scripture and you're the final arbiter. 445 00:27:42.200 --> 00:27:44.559 Yeah, that's been the problem I've been coming up against 446 00:27:44.599 --> 00:27:47.240 as well, and thanks for that man. 447 00:27:47.480 --> 00:27:50.240 And so going forwards, the PSA issue at stake an 448 00:27:50.279 --> 00:27:53.680 issue I feel like there's either a semantic issue or 449 00:27:53.720 --> 00:27:57.240 a literal theological issue where it seems as though people 450 00:27:57.279 --> 00:28:00.799 that are proponents of substitutionaryatment. 451 00:27:59.839 --> 00:28:02.200 Are creating a third category of Christ. 452 00:28:03.119 --> 00:28:05.599 I don't know if that makes sense, but they're basically 453 00:28:05.640 --> 00:28:08.319 saying that he doesn't actually have the same nature we have, 454 00:28:08.839 --> 00:28:11.519 and therefore he can't be a substitute because his nature 455 00:28:11.599 --> 00:28:14.759 is without sin, but ours is the noetic effects of sin. 456 00:28:15.160 --> 00:28:17.680 And so I don't see how that's an actual substitute 457 00:28:17.880 --> 00:28:21.680 if indeed he is a substitute, and he must be 458 00:28:21.839 --> 00:28:24.200 the same as us in some sense, at least the 459 00:28:24.279 --> 00:28:25.640 human side of his nature. 460 00:28:26.039 --> 00:28:30.200 Right, there's multiple problems, multiple problems going on there. First 461 00:28:30.240 --> 00:28:32.960 of all, I'm not heard of Protestant saying this. I'm 462 00:28:33.000 --> 00:28:36.559 not saying that they haven't said that, but usually and 463 00:28:36.720 --> 00:28:39.000 usually they say that Christ does have the same nature 464 00:28:39.000 --> 00:28:42.880 as us, and that's why he's able to, you know, 465 00:28:43.079 --> 00:28:46.519 to die in our place as a substitute. But the 466 00:28:46.599 --> 00:28:51.039 fact that he assumes a sinless human nature doesn't mean 467 00:28:51.039 --> 00:28:52.880 that it's not the same nature as ours, because sin 468 00:28:52.960 --> 00:28:55.640 isn't something that's Sin isn't a nature, And that's another 469 00:28:55.799 --> 00:28:59.279 mistake Protestants make. Sin is a deprivation of grace or 470 00:28:59.279 --> 00:29:01.359 an act of a will against the good. It's not 471 00:29:01.400 --> 00:29:04.720 a state of being. It's not an ontological status. So 472 00:29:04.759 --> 00:29:07.079 they're actually being Manichean if they think that sin has 473 00:29:07.079 --> 00:29:09.400 ontological existence or evil has existence. 474 00:29:10.319 --> 00:29:11.640 Yeah, so it doesn't fit together. 475 00:29:11.680 --> 00:29:16.960 Well if they say that man's nature is indeed painted entirely. 476 00:29:17.000 --> 00:29:19.680 Yeah, it's Manichein. That would be Manichean. That we mean 477 00:29:19.680 --> 00:29:23.000 God creates evil natures, which doesn't make sense because evil 478 00:29:23.000 --> 00:29:27.440 doesn't have a nature. Evil is a privation or a 479 00:29:27.480 --> 00:29:32.559 predatory act against nature. So for us, evil is the 480 00:29:32.599 --> 00:29:34.680 act of the will against the good. It's not a 481 00:29:34.680 --> 00:29:37.799 thing that has being or substance. But they collapse nature 482 00:29:37.799 --> 00:29:39.839 into person. So that's how they get the idea that 483 00:29:39.880 --> 00:29:42.960 we're all damned and atom because our whole nature is 484 00:29:43.200 --> 00:29:48.319 quote a sin nature that is inherently guilty of sin, 485 00:29:48.559 --> 00:29:51.119 because we're children of atom. That's why they think infants 486 00:29:51.119 --> 00:29:54.160 are damned. That we don't believe them, So then. 487 00:29:54.160 --> 00:29:56.759 You don't adhere to the doctrine of original sin, at 488 00:29:56.799 --> 00:29:58.240 least you wouldn't articulate it that way. 489 00:29:58.240 --> 00:30:00.079 What you call it ancestral then. 490 00:30:00.400 --> 00:30:04.720 And that's to distinguish between the deprivation that results from 491 00:30:04.880 --> 00:30:08.160 Adam's sin, whereby we are deprived of grace. That's not 492 00:30:08.279 --> 00:30:12.839 the same thing as having actual guilt, which you accrue 493 00:30:13.279 --> 00:30:16.759 when you commit a sin. So infants don't commit actual 494 00:30:16.839 --> 00:30:18.799 sins because they don't have the use of their reasoning 495 00:30:18.799 --> 00:30:21.720 to act against God's will. That's why James says that 496 00:30:21.880 --> 00:30:25.039 sin when it gives birth and it is assented to, 497 00:30:26.519 --> 00:30:29.319 he says evil when it is when it gives birth, 498 00:30:29.359 --> 00:30:31.279 when it times with the passions and the concupis sense, 499 00:30:31.720 --> 00:30:33.920 when it's assented to it, he says it's a sin. 500 00:30:34.000 --> 00:30:37.160 So he actually specifies that it's not the desires that 501 00:30:37.200 --> 00:30:39.960 themselves are the sin. It's the assent of the will 502 00:30:40.079 --> 00:30:46.759 to an illicit or disordered desire. And what Protestants do 503 00:30:46.920 --> 00:30:50.480 and have done since the Reformation, due to a misunderstanding 504 00:30:50.480 --> 00:30:53.680 of Romans five, is that they think that our nature 505 00:30:53.720 --> 00:30:56.240 itself is a sin, and they think it's a state 506 00:30:56.279 --> 00:30:58.319 of being, But it can't be a state of being 507 00:30:58.359 --> 00:30:59.359 when it's a deprivation. 508 00:31:01.720 --> 00:31:04.880 Yeah, so they've gotten the power totally wrong. 509 00:31:05.599 --> 00:31:08.240 That and there is no real ontology and Protestantism correct. 510 00:31:09.359 --> 00:31:10.279 Yeah. 511 00:31:10.359 --> 00:31:13.359 So as far as like book recommendations might go for 512 00:31:13.519 --> 00:31:16.119 this particular issue with regards to the Union, what might 513 00:31:16.160 --> 00:31:20.359 you recommend outside of course like no Chalcedonian Council and 514 00:31:20.440 --> 00:31:22.240 canons or you know the story. 515 00:31:22.319 --> 00:31:23.720 No, I can tell you exactly what you need to read. 516 00:31:23.720 --> 00:31:26.200 You need to read uh st Cyril of Alexandria and 517 00:31:26.240 --> 00:31:28.960 the Christological Controversy because when I read that book and 518 00:31:29.000 --> 00:31:31.799 I understood that Jesus is a divine subject and that 519 00:31:31.880 --> 00:31:34.759 there's no human hypostasis in Christ, it led me to 520 00:31:34.880 --> 00:31:39.079 understand fully why there could never be a PSA. 521 00:31:40.720 --> 00:31:43.119 This seems to me to like undercut the entire the 522 00:31:43.279 --> 00:31:44.039 entire West. 523 00:31:44.200 --> 00:31:47.799 If that's true, probably, I mean it doesn't just begin 524 00:31:47.880 --> 00:31:50.480 with you know, Lutheran Calvin. Uh it goes back to 525 00:31:50.640 --> 00:31:52.359 Anselm and satisfaction theory. 526 00:31:52.480 --> 00:31:55.519 So yeah, yeah, yeah, the legal theory as well, all 527 00:31:55.640 --> 00:31:56.400 that sort of work. 528 00:31:57.119 --> 00:31:58.599 Absolutely well. 529 00:31:58.720 --> 00:32:01.480 Well, thanks a lot, Jamen, that's the luck to you. 530 00:32:01.519 --> 00:32:02.640 I appreciate all that you do. 531 00:32:02.839 --> 00:32:07.000 Yeah, anytime. Also, I would say there's another side accessory 532 00:32:07.000 --> 00:32:08.920 book that would help. That's good and that's written by 533 00:32:08.920 --> 00:32:14.039 a Lutheran guy, and it's called Harvest of Medieval Theology 534 00:32:14.799 --> 00:32:19.319 from Gabriel Auckham, Akham and Bile to Luther ific at 535 00:32:19.319 --> 00:32:21.839 the exec title. But he's a Lutheran who wrote about 536 00:32:21.839 --> 00:32:25.200 the fact that you have to be a nominalist philosophically 537 00:32:25.279 --> 00:32:30.240 to have Luther's doctrine of justification in PSA. And if 538 00:32:30.400 --> 00:32:35.960 you can point out that successfully that I think you can, 539 00:32:36.160 --> 00:32:39.640 that the ancient and medieval world or the ancient and 540 00:32:39.680 --> 00:32:44.319 Patristic world was not nominalist, then that means that Luther's 541 00:32:44.359 --> 00:32:50.680 doctrine is impossible in the first one thousand years of Christianity. 542 00:32:51.000 --> 00:32:53.680 I think Luther is just an obnstadium monk, right, So 543 00:32:53.920 --> 00:32:54.759 how did he be wrong? 544 00:32:57.000 --> 00:32:59.799 Well, I mean, I know you're joking, but I mean, 545 00:33:01.880 --> 00:33:03.319 I mean, even if I'm just saying, even if we 546 00:33:03.400 --> 00:33:06.400 granted that Luther was right in some of the critiques 547 00:33:06.400 --> 00:33:10.599 of Rome, it's like, yeah, but what But if Luther's 548 00:33:10.960 --> 00:33:14.440 argument of how we are changing from a state of 549 00:33:14.920 --> 00:33:18.400 divine wrath to a legal state of divine grace, if 550 00:33:18.440 --> 00:33:23.160 it's dispositional, that requires a certain philosophical framework called nominalism, 551 00:33:23.160 --> 00:33:27.000 which divorces the essence of things from the names given 552 00:33:27.039 --> 00:33:29.440 to them. And so Luther made use of Oakham and 553 00:33:29.480 --> 00:33:33.119 Gabriel Bile to figure out how God could call someone 554 00:33:33.240 --> 00:33:35.680 righteous when they're in fact an actuality wicked, and he 555 00:33:36.480 --> 00:33:39.440 uses nominalism in the philosophical system. According to Haiko Oberman, 556 00:33:39.559 --> 00:33:42.799 very famous Lutheran scholar and historian to say that this 557 00:33:42.880 --> 00:33:46.480 is how Luther did it. He uses this systemic approach. Now, 558 00:33:47.480 --> 00:33:49.839 if nobody in the first thousand years a Christianity was 559 00:33:49.880 --> 00:33:54.000 a nominalist, which is what's required for a purely legal 560 00:33:54.039 --> 00:33:59.680 status justification, then we know that Paul, Saint Paul in 561 00:33:59.680 --> 00:34:04.240 the Church Fathers aren't teaching anything like Luther. Yeah, yeah, that. 562 00:34:04.240 --> 00:34:05.000 Seems to the. 563 00:34:06.480 --> 00:34:06.720 Well. 564 00:34:06.720 --> 00:34:08.199 Thanks a lot, man, I really appreciate it. 565 00:34:08.199 --> 00:34:11.079 Absolutely. Yeah, keep keep reading and keep searching. You you're 566 00:34:11.119 --> 00:34:16.559 on your way to orthodoxy. Robotic, what's up? No, I'm 567 00:34:16.559 --> 00:34:21.480 not going on his channel, so stop asking me. I'm 568 00:34:21.480 --> 00:34:26.360 talking to the chat robot, you know what I mean. Oh, yes, sir, Hey, 569 00:34:26.400 --> 00:34:30.559 thanks for having me. I'm can you speak up a 570 00:34:30.559 --> 00:34:32.440 little bit. I can barely hear you speaking to the mic. 571 00:34:33.400 --> 00:34:36.360 Oh sorry, can you hear me there now a little bit? 572 00:34:37.280 --> 00:34:37.400 Uh? 573 00:34:37.719 --> 00:34:39.199 Sorry, shoot. 574 00:34:39.679 --> 00:34:44.440 Yeah, just talk into the to the mic, dude, you 575 00:34:44.440 --> 00:34:44.719 hear me? 576 00:34:44.800 --> 00:34:44.960 Now? 577 00:34:46.239 --> 00:34:48.880 We'll try go ahead at that. 578 00:34:50.559 --> 00:34:52.559 Yeah, I'm I'm. 579 00:34:52.480 --> 00:34:58.199 Not the folks you were talking about. And I can't 580 00:34:58.199 --> 00:35:00.199 even hear you. Dude, I don't know what what kind 581 00:35:00.199 --> 00:35:02.440 of a micro are you using? Dude? 582 00:35:02.320 --> 00:35:07.199 Yeah, it's like my boozy earphones. 583 00:35:07.400 --> 00:35:08.119 I'm sorry. 584 00:35:08.280 --> 00:35:09.840 Let me Uh, I might have a bit. 585 00:35:10.480 --> 00:35:12.119 I can hear you a little better now, but you 586 00:35:12.199 --> 00:35:14.119 just need to talk directly into the mic. We can 587 00:35:14.119 --> 00:35:18.639 barely hear you, all right, Sorry about that. Well, now 588 00:35:18.639 --> 00:35:22.760 you're far away and I can't hear you. So yeah, 589 00:35:22.760 --> 00:35:25.079 I don't know what's happened, and I really am not really. 590 00:35:26.400 --> 00:35:26.719 Shoot. 591 00:35:26.920 --> 00:35:28.639 Uh can you hear me? 592 00:35:28.719 --> 00:35:28.880 Now? 593 00:35:29.679 --> 00:35:34.880 We'll try. Oh yeah, I'm. 594 00:35:35.079 --> 00:35:37.360 I'm a Protestant. I listened to a lot of the 595 00:35:37.440 --> 00:35:38.280 content at the shore. 596 00:35:39.280 --> 00:35:43.480 Think it's really good, and I'm honestly. 597 00:35:43.280 --> 00:35:43.800 Just trying to. 598 00:35:45.239 --> 00:35:47.079 I mean, I can't. I'm sorry, man, I can't hear you. 599 00:35:47.119 --> 00:35:48.679 Try to get to a good mic. It's just we 600 00:35:48.719 --> 00:35:51.440 can't even hear you. You're there and then you're gone 601 00:35:51.480 --> 00:35:55.039 for like five seconds and then you're back. So try 602 00:35:55.039 --> 00:35:57.079 to find a good mic. No, I'm not going to 603 00:35:57.119 --> 00:36:01.440 some randos fifty person in live stream? Why would I 604 00:36:01.480 --> 00:36:04.599 do that? I'm doing my live stream. I'm not If 605 00:36:04.599 --> 00:36:06.719 they want a clip farm, they can come be on 606 00:36:06.760 --> 00:36:10.760 this stream. Smokey, what's up? Stop asking me? Or I'm 607 00:36:10.760 --> 00:36:18.079 just going to boo you smoky? 608 00:36:18.880 --> 00:36:20.239 Yes, that's try. 609 00:36:22.079 --> 00:36:24.679 How's it going, good man? What's on your mind? 610 00:36:25.480 --> 00:36:28.079 Good I just wanted to see if you would give 611 00:36:28.119 --> 00:36:30.880 me just less than sixty seconds to present an argument 612 00:36:31.239 --> 00:36:33.639 to justify going and having a chat with Moler. 613 00:36:35.360 --> 00:36:38.360 Well you want the debate about me going to his stream? 614 00:36:38.880 --> 00:36:41.079 Well, not a debate, just to presenting an argument. 615 00:36:41.119 --> 00:36:43.000 Well, if you're presenting an argument, that's a debate. What 616 00:36:43.960 --> 00:36:46.199 if you're presenting an argument, then that's part of a debate. 617 00:36:46.320 --> 00:36:50.920 So that's right. If they want to dude, if they 618 00:36:50.960 --> 00:36:52.639 want to clip, if they want a clip farm, they 619 00:36:52.639 --> 00:36:53.960 can just hop on here right now. 620 00:36:55.039 --> 00:36:58.159 Well yeah, but I mean, Jay, that's that's not really 621 00:36:58.159 --> 00:36:59.000 fair what they want to do. 622 00:36:59.039 --> 00:36:59.719 And you're the king of. 623 00:36:59.719 --> 00:37:01.960 Clip Why is that not from channels. 624 00:37:01.599 --> 00:37:03.519 To do that for you? So, I mean you know 625 00:37:03.559 --> 00:37:05.840 it's all a clip farm. It all grows a brand, right. 626 00:37:06.679 --> 00:37:09.199 Oh So now now you know the motives and I'm 627 00:37:09.280 --> 00:37:09.960 just clip for me. 628 00:37:11.079 --> 00:37:14.119 Well, I mean, you do encourage channels to build off 629 00:37:14.159 --> 00:37:16.079 of clips of things that you've done in the past, 630 00:37:16.119 --> 00:37:17.440 and debates and things like that. 631 00:37:17.599 --> 00:37:19.639 I know you do that for a reason. 632 00:37:19.440 --> 00:37:21.280 Because you like to get your name out there and 633 00:37:21.320 --> 00:37:23.760 your interactions so people can see your talents and your 634 00:37:23.840 --> 00:37:24.400 numbers grow. 635 00:37:24.679 --> 00:37:26.760 I'm not faulting you for it. It's playing the game. 636 00:37:27.280 --> 00:37:29.000 And did I fault them? I said, if they want 637 00:37:29.039 --> 00:37:30.400 a clip farm, they can come over here. 638 00:37:31.559 --> 00:37:33.000 Well, I understand that. 639 00:37:33.119 --> 00:37:35.280 It's just I don't understand why you wouldn't want to 640 00:37:35.280 --> 00:37:37.320 go ahead and expose yourself to their audience. 641 00:37:37.360 --> 00:37:39.679 Concurrently, I've already been already. 642 00:37:40.440 --> 00:37:43.000 I've already why you wouldn't just want to do that, 643 00:37:43.079 --> 00:37:45.480 and they promised they wouldn't mute you at all. 644 00:37:45.559 --> 00:37:46.639 Would you give them. 645 00:37:46.440 --> 00:37:48.400 The same part implying that I'm going. 646 00:37:48.320 --> 00:37:50.280 To go on over and he'll give you a piece 647 00:37:50.280 --> 00:37:50.639 of Spaci. 648 00:37:50.880 --> 00:37:53.800 Get out of here. Shut up, you're not you're talking 649 00:37:53.840 --> 00:37:55.199 over me. No, I'm not going to go over there 650 00:37:55.239 --> 00:37:57.280 because I don't want to go over there. And I 651 00:37:57.360 --> 00:38:00.760 already had the debate with them and they did it 652 00:38:00.800 --> 00:38:03.039 on there. There's no reason why they can't call in 653 00:38:03.079 --> 00:38:07.480 here and also stream it on their thing. The same 654 00:38:07.519 --> 00:38:10.800 thing applies to them, Goober. If they want to call in, 655 00:38:12.519 --> 00:38:15.360 they can call in on their phone and they can 656 00:38:15.400 --> 00:38:18.360 continue live streaming do like I'm doing in ghetto style. 657 00:38:18.440 --> 00:38:21.159 They can hold the phone up to the freaking microphone 658 00:38:21.840 --> 00:38:23.360 I don't have. I'm not going to hook up the 659 00:38:23.400 --> 00:38:26.400 stream yard and then hook all of that up into obs. 660 00:38:26.480 --> 00:38:28.360 I'm just not doing all that. I'm doing my stream 661 00:38:28.760 --> 00:38:32.039 and I'm not giving these dudes. I don't respect these dudes. 662 00:38:33.000 --> 00:38:37.039 I'm not giving them the attention that they want on 663 00:38:37.199 --> 00:38:40.400 their channels. But they can clip anything they want and 664 00:38:40.440 --> 00:38:44.679 they can call in here and continue their stupid stream. Errol, 665 00:38:44.719 --> 00:38:47.880 what's up? No, it's not the movie review mall or 666 00:38:47.920 --> 00:38:50.519 it's a dude that nobody even follows. It's these are 667 00:38:51.039 --> 00:38:53.800 the lowest tier protests are They're worst things that need God. 668 00:38:55.320 --> 00:38:56.800 This is all this is is that they want to 669 00:38:56.960 --> 00:39:02.000 That's why they stream about me every week. And they're 670 00:39:02.079 --> 00:39:04.000 rouse Lin's bought buddies, so they want to come on. 671 00:39:04.159 --> 00:39:07.079 They want to make a big stint get attention. That's 672 00:39:07.079 --> 00:39:11.239 why I'm not doing it. Errol, what's up, hey, j 673 00:39:11.440 --> 00:39:13.320 how's it going? That was up? 674 00:39:15.039 --> 00:39:15.280 Yeah? 675 00:39:15.360 --> 00:39:20.320 I just want to call I really been appreciate your content. 676 00:39:20.360 --> 00:39:23.400 That actually kind of brought me back into being a 677 00:39:23.440 --> 00:39:27.800 Christian gunn from being a former atheist, in no small 678 00:39:27.840 --> 00:39:31.559 part due to your tag formulation. I just wanted to 679 00:39:31.599 --> 00:39:33.840 run a quick question on the argument by you. 680 00:39:34.199 --> 00:39:38.199 Okay, sure, so as I understand it, it's. 681 00:39:38.159 --> 00:39:41.880 Kind of an important premise is the impossibility of the 682 00:39:41.880 --> 00:39:44.199 contrary world view? 683 00:39:44.639 --> 00:39:46.880 My question is if you. 684 00:39:47.519 --> 00:39:53.280 Consider something like platonism, so so say the atheist just 685 00:39:53.280 --> 00:39:59.079 assumes things like logic or the existence of the external world, 686 00:40:00.159 --> 00:40:04.239 or the past, all the different transcendental categories as brute facts, 687 00:40:05.880 --> 00:40:07.039 why would why? 688 00:40:07.119 --> 00:40:08.079 Why is that? 689 00:40:08.639 --> 00:40:10.559 Why can't they do that? I guess why is that 690 00:40:10.840 --> 00:40:14.400 impossible for them to do? The way I think about is, 691 00:40:14.679 --> 00:40:18.679 you know, a divine mind is a more parsimonious explanation 692 00:40:18.760 --> 00:40:22.599 because they're all interrelated transcendental categories. But why is it, 693 00:40:23.239 --> 00:40:26.559 you know, necessarily wrong for the atheists to just, you know, 694 00:40:27.280 --> 00:40:30.719 assume all these like this grab bag of brute facts. 695 00:40:32.599 --> 00:40:35.480 Well, first of all, just assuming a grab bag of 696 00:40:35.800 --> 00:40:40.280 brute facts wouldn't respond to the objections that tag makes. 697 00:40:40.320 --> 00:40:43.199 I mean, we're not just giving a negative impossibility. The 698 00:40:43.199 --> 00:40:47.639 contract critique we're also presenting a positive list of our 699 00:40:47.719 --> 00:40:50.519 beliefs in our worldview that includes a bunch of metaphysical 700 00:40:50.639 --> 00:40:54.119 and ethical and historical ideas. So there's two world views 701 00:40:54.119 --> 00:40:57.719 that are in comparison and that are being contrasted in 702 00:40:57.800 --> 00:41:02.239 the argument. So brute assertions don't give us any kind 703 00:41:02.280 --> 00:41:06.440 of explanatory power justification. If they can put forward brute 704 00:41:06.440 --> 00:41:09.119 facts in a debate, then so can you. So just 705 00:41:09.199 --> 00:41:12.239 saying that there's all these things therefore that's my basis. 706 00:41:12.559 --> 00:41:14.320 That doesn't tell me that I ought to believe those 707 00:41:14.360 --> 00:41:16.320 things or why those things are true. That's just saying 708 00:41:16.320 --> 00:41:18.280 that they are that you're just asserting things. So in 709 00:41:18.320 --> 00:41:22.960 the same way just saying well, I'm a platonist or whatever, like, 710 00:41:22.960 --> 00:41:26.840 there's so many problems in platonism in terms of basic 711 00:41:26.960 --> 00:41:29.760 level contradictions. And you can go look up the critiques 712 00:41:29.760 --> 00:41:33.079 that we've done a platonism that for an atheist. By 713 00:41:33.119 --> 00:41:35.119 the way, how could atheist be a platonist? Right? Like 714 00:41:35.159 --> 00:41:38.519 an atheist atheists aren't platonists typically there could be one, 715 00:41:38.599 --> 00:41:43.639 I suppose, But now he's going to switch from being 716 00:41:43.639 --> 00:41:45.840 an atheist as saying, well, but there's all these immaterial 717 00:41:45.920 --> 00:41:50.239 forms well, in Plato's conception, the immaterial forms really don't 718 00:41:50.239 --> 00:41:53.519 have or it's very difficult for him to explain what's 719 00:41:53.559 --> 00:41:57.840 in common between the immaterial eternal ideal form and the 720 00:41:58.360 --> 00:42:04.000 material changing tempore things that the forms, the things that 721 00:42:04.039 --> 00:42:07.639 are copied from the forms. Right, So there's a dialectical 722 00:42:07.679 --> 00:42:12.400 tension between the realm of ideas and perfect stasis versus 723 00:42:12.519 --> 00:42:16.400 the realm of flux and change. So just saying that 724 00:42:19.519 --> 00:42:22.239 doesn't justify it. It's not an argument to just assert that, 725 00:42:22.400 --> 00:42:24.320 to just say that, well, what if it's brute facts, 726 00:42:25.360 --> 00:42:27.039 then if they do that, you can say, okay, well 727 00:42:27.079 --> 00:42:30.280 then God's a brute fact. So like you have to understand, 728 00:42:30.360 --> 00:42:33.760 like in a debate, people have if they can do that, 729 00:42:33.800 --> 00:42:34.239 you can do that. 730 00:42:34.320 --> 00:42:34.480 Right. 731 00:42:34.480 --> 00:42:37.639 That's why fallacies matter. It's pointing out what you what 732 00:42:37.679 --> 00:42:40.280 you can't do. It's like we're playing chess and somebody 733 00:42:40.320 --> 00:42:42.320 just knocks over all the piece and says I win. Well, 734 00:42:42.320 --> 00:42:43.800 then I can knock all over all the piece and 735 00:42:43.840 --> 00:42:46.800 say I win. It's it's it's defeats the whole purpose 736 00:42:46.840 --> 00:42:48.440 of a debate. Hank, what's up. 737 00:42:50.719 --> 00:42:50.920 There? 738 00:42:50.960 --> 00:42:53.840 These people are not even they're they're not debaters. Did 739 00:42:53.880 --> 00:42:57.000 These are like low tier need god level people who 740 00:42:57.000 --> 00:43:00.199 are just looking for some attention because they're in these 741 00:43:00.480 --> 00:43:04.039 here and they try to are. They stream about me 742 00:43:04.079 --> 00:43:08.039 every week, bitching and complaining, pearl collectioning about four letter words. 743 00:43:08.199 --> 00:43:09.239 It's the lowest tier stuff. 744 00:43:09.239 --> 00:43:09.360 Man. 745 00:43:09.360 --> 00:43:13.480 You guys are not even You're not missing anything. And 746 00:43:13.519 --> 00:43:15.719 they're never gonna call in because they can't act. They 747 00:43:15.719 --> 00:43:23.280 don't know anything. What's up, man, Hank, Hank, what's up? 748 00:43:28.719 --> 00:43:30.760 And all I hit their dumb audience coming over here, 749 00:43:30.800 --> 00:43:32.239 trying to bait me to come over. I'm not going 750 00:43:32.239 --> 00:43:32.639 over there. 751 00:43:35.840 --> 00:43:36.719 Hey, Jake, can you hear me? 752 00:43:38.159 --> 00:43:40.079 Hey man, It's been a while since I called in. 753 00:43:40.199 --> 00:43:40.960 I've been busy. 754 00:43:41.000 --> 00:43:45.599 I've been getting ready for my tour and my album's dropping. Dude, 755 00:43:45.920 --> 00:43:47.320 I just wanted to say, Man, I just want to 756 00:43:47.320 --> 00:43:51.199 call and say I finally found a un orthodox church 757 00:43:51.280 --> 00:43:55.440 man that you know. I've been attending, man, and it's 758 00:43:55.480 --> 00:43:56.880 all been things to guys like you, man. 759 00:43:56.920 --> 00:43:58.880 So I just want to call and say. 760 00:43:58.639 --> 00:44:01.519 Thank you, man, God Blas, thank you appreciate that. I 761 00:44:01.559 --> 00:44:03.599 thought he was joking. I thought you meant like you 762 00:44:03.599 --> 00:44:06.519 you were, you were pretending that you were like Ruslawn. 763 00:44:06.639 --> 00:44:12.000 But I appreciate it. Yeah, okay, I oh you were joking. Okay, 764 00:44:12.119 --> 00:44:19.000 never appreciate that, man, Hank. What's up, dude, dude? These 765 00:44:19.000 --> 00:44:21.880 people are there. It's I'm telling you man, they're just 766 00:44:21.960 --> 00:44:26.679 coming up with drama to get attention. They couldn't. They 767 00:44:26.679 --> 00:44:29.199 wouldn't last five minutes in a real discussion. We already 768 00:44:29.199 --> 00:44:32.320 debated them. We had a forty minute debate on the 769 00:44:32.320 --> 00:44:36.920 Intercession of the Saints with him a year ago. I'm 770 00:44:36.960 --> 00:44:38.880 not going on their dumb stream yard stream. They can 771 00:44:38.880 --> 00:44:41.119 call in here and they can keep streaming, and they 772 00:44:41.119 --> 00:44:44.199 can clip it all they want. I don't care. I'm 773 00:44:44.199 --> 00:44:45.800 not going to end my stream and go on their stream. 774 00:44:45.840 --> 00:44:59.719 What's up, Mandlson, what's up? Go ahead? 775 00:45:01.199 --> 00:45:06.679 Okay? I have a question from a local Orthodox church. 776 00:45:07.280 --> 00:45:09.519 How would I were are some key signs to know 777 00:45:09.679 --> 00:45:14.239 that they're engaging in. 778 00:45:12.480 --> 00:45:19.400 Any level of pedadoxy I guess. 779 00:45:19.800 --> 00:45:21.840 I mean the key signs would be like, are they 780 00:45:21.880 --> 00:45:24.880 teaching a humanism? Are they teaching pro gay stuff? Are 781 00:45:24.880 --> 00:45:28.440 they teaching I mean, are they teaching anything that's against 782 00:45:28.639 --> 00:45:32.280 the you know, the creed or basic Christian morals? Usually 783 00:45:33.119 --> 00:45:35.320 they don't, you know, these kinds of groups don't just 784 00:45:35.360 --> 00:45:38.400 begin with something like we believe a pollinarianism, and we 785 00:45:38.440 --> 00:45:40.440 don't believe that Christ is fully human. That they're not 786 00:45:40.480 --> 00:45:43.599 gonna do it that way. They're gonna, you know, act 787 00:45:43.719 --> 00:45:47.360 like there's nothing wrong with being skittles, you know, that 788 00:45:47.440 --> 00:45:49.559 kind of stuff. So, I mean, that's usually the things 789 00:45:49.599 --> 00:45:53.280 that fall first, and then you get the heresies to 790 00:45:53.320 --> 00:46:01.920 back that up. Ortho, what's up? Yeah, it's funny how 791 00:46:01.920 --> 00:46:06.199 no Protestants will even call in a debate anymore, nor 792 00:46:06.239 --> 00:46:07.440 will the Muslims. What's up? 793 00:46:07.480 --> 00:46:07.639 Man? 794 00:46:08.159 --> 00:46:12.599 We're telling you, what's up? My man? 795 00:46:13.320 --> 00:46:17.840 I think I know exactly why those Protestants don't want. 796 00:46:17.679 --> 00:46:20.400 To debate you, okay, was that they're racist. They don't 797 00:46:20.400 --> 00:46:21.440 want to talk to a black man. 798 00:46:22.400 --> 00:46:23.159 That's what I'm saying. 799 00:46:23.400 --> 00:46:27.960 And exactly because and I showed what you truly looked 800 00:46:27.960 --> 00:46:28.960 like as a black man. 801 00:46:29.159 --> 00:46:32.360 I think they're just scared of you for showing they prejudiced. Right, 802 00:46:32.400 --> 00:46:35.320 these white boys, these white boys over here, is prejudice 803 00:46:35.320 --> 00:46:38.519 when it comes to a real bipop queen. They want 804 00:46:38.559 --> 00:46:42.920 to play games with all these uh, you know, all 805 00:46:42.920 --> 00:46:49.719 of these phone e mcs. What's up? Uh, yuppie, appreciate that. 806 00:46:49.840 --> 00:46:59.400 Appreciate that Hello, Yeah, can you hear me? 807 00:46:59.400 --> 00:46:59.639 All right? 808 00:46:59.760 --> 00:47:00.000 Yes? 809 00:47:00.079 --> 00:47:02.079 Are cool? Man? 810 00:47:02.519 --> 00:47:04.079 I just kind of wanted to come on and say 811 00:47:04.119 --> 00:47:07.239 thanks man for the content that you make, because a. 812 00:47:07.159 --> 00:47:08.719 Lot of it is really eye opening. 813 00:47:08.960 --> 00:47:11.840 So I'm a Roman Catholic and I have been for 814 00:47:12.000 --> 00:47:17.599 probably I don't know, eight issu years now, and a 815 00:47:17.639 --> 00:47:19.440 lot of the stuff on the papacy they kind of 816 00:47:19.480 --> 00:47:23.039 don't really they don't really teach you the primary sources 817 00:47:23.559 --> 00:47:25.039 when you're getting into this stuff, you. 818 00:47:24.960 --> 00:47:28.679 Know, yeah, I know I went through that, yeah. 819 00:47:28.400 --> 00:47:32.280 Man, So it's like having an identity crisis over here, 820 00:47:32.360 --> 00:47:37.039 you know. And I just kind of wanted to ask, like, when. 821 00:47:36.840 --> 00:47:38.559 You were a Roman Catholic and you were. 822 00:47:38.440 --> 00:47:45.639 First getting these little sprinkles and bits of contradictions and 823 00:47:45.880 --> 00:47:48.840 like you know, Vatican One and Vatican two and actually 824 00:47:48.840 --> 00:47:52.159 reading the primary sources, Like, how did that make you feel? 825 00:47:52.440 --> 00:47:53.079 You know what? I mean? 826 00:47:56.280 --> 00:48:02.599 It was difficult. It was challenging. It was you know, 827 00:48:02.719 --> 00:48:06.960 paradigm shift shifting. I mean it was you know, because 828 00:48:07.000 --> 00:48:10.000 I was very serious about rob falsism. I was into 829 00:48:10.000 --> 00:48:14.519 Catholic apologetics. I was serious about driving hours to go 830 00:48:14.519 --> 00:48:18.239 to Latin mass I mean it was it was hard. Uh, 831 00:48:18.360 --> 00:48:22.239 It wasn't easy, but leaving it was best decision ever made. 832 00:48:22.440 --> 00:48:23.519 I would never go back to that. 833 00:48:25.079 --> 00:48:28.519 Yeah, I mean it's I'm trying to get there, you know, 834 00:48:28.639 --> 00:48:31.360 like I'm having trouble sort of letting go. 835 00:48:33.360 --> 00:48:35.599 Man, Like, what are the are you? Is it like 836 00:48:35.679 --> 00:48:38.320 part of your heritage and culture usually just that kind 837 00:48:38.360 --> 00:48:38.800 of stuff. 838 00:48:39.599 --> 00:48:44.199 Yeah, it is, so, I actually was. 839 00:48:44.519 --> 00:48:47.639 You know, I had like a break in my family 840 00:48:47.719 --> 00:48:50.639 from the Catholic Church, from my like through my parents 841 00:48:51.320 --> 00:48:55.000 because they were Protestants, but like, our heritage is TechEd 842 00:48:55.000 --> 00:48:59.239 Italian primarily, so you know, all of our ancestors and stuff. 843 00:48:58.960 --> 00:49:02.639 Were Catholic, so it is like a cultural thing. 844 00:49:02.679 --> 00:49:04.880 You know, our grandparents all that, we grew up with 845 00:49:05.440 --> 00:49:06.239 them being Catholic. 846 00:49:06.400 --> 00:49:09.000 So I mean we are I am kind of bound 847 00:49:09.079 --> 00:49:09.400 up in that. 848 00:49:09.480 --> 00:49:12.599 But man, well listen, you're gonna find if you go 849 00:49:12.719 --> 00:49:17.480 visit Orthodox Church and Orthodox Divine Liturgy, you're gonna find 850 00:49:18.119 --> 00:49:21.000 a new family that will help replace what you feel 851 00:49:21.000 --> 00:49:24.400 like might be missing family wise. I can guarantee you 852 00:49:24.480 --> 00:49:26.440 that as long as you find a decent church, which 853 00:49:26.519 --> 00:49:31.280 you know it's not too hard. But you know, when 854 00:49:31.320 --> 00:49:36.960 I left Rome in two thousand and eight nine, somewhere 855 00:49:36.960 --> 00:49:41.039 in there. You know, I had several Roman Catholic friends, 856 00:49:41.519 --> 00:49:43.760 and I think I've maintained maybe one or two of those, 857 00:49:44.320 --> 00:49:49.239 but I've gotten much better friends. So you'll find better friends. 858 00:49:51.039 --> 00:49:54.519 So just go check out the community icono what's up? 859 00:49:55.039 --> 00:49:57.079 And then I'll go to the Protestant person here, mister 860 00:49:57.440 --> 00:50:00.000 s or whatever. Hey man. 861 00:50:00.039 --> 00:50:03.119 And I was just wondering if the cult meeting got 862 00:50:03.719 --> 00:50:04.719 postponed for tonight? 863 00:50:05.480 --> 00:50:08.960 The cult meeting? It did? Did you you? If you 864 00:50:09.000 --> 00:50:14.719 didn't wear your Hawaiian shirt vestiments, you're not allowed to 865 00:50:14.760 --> 00:50:18.119 come back to the cult anymore, because, as Rouselan says, right, 866 00:50:18.360 --> 00:50:20.840 Miamivice is cult aesthetics. 867 00:50:21.280 --> 00:50:22.760 I got you and one more thing. 868 00:50:23.239 --> 00:50:25.199 Someone told me that in order to get a debate 869 00:50:25.239 --> 00:50:28.000 with Ruslan, first, you've got a bot five. 870 00:50:27.880 --> 00:50:29.280 Of his prayer journals. 871 00:50:29.480 --> 00:50:32.000 Apparently there's just thousands of them sitting in a storage 872 00:50:32.000 --> 00:50:32.960 of being in California. 873 00:50:33.079 --> 00:50:36.800 So there's a lot and a bunch of Blessed God 874 00:50:36.840 --> 00:50:38.599 T shirts too. So if you don't get a T 875 00:50:38.719 --> 00:50:43.079 shirt and a prayer journal, the T shirt you saw 876 00:50:43.119 --> 00:50:45.800 him preaching in, uh, he won't have anything to do 877 00:50:45.880 --> 00:50:47.960 with you. So yeah, you got to get that merch 878 00:50:48.079 --> 00:50:53.519 dog mister s or should I say missus? 879 00:50:54.280 --> 00:50:54.440 Hell? 880 00:50:54.440 --> 00:50:57.920 Well, m yeah, so do you have a valid argument 881 00:50:57.960 --> 00:50:59.440 for pros as falls? 882 00:51:01.400 --> 00:51:05.440 Sure? It's uh not taught in the New Testament or 883 00:51:05.440 --> 00:51:06.320 by the Church fathers. 884 00:51:07.760 --> 00:51:08.679 Wait, what do you think about it? 885 00:51:08.800 --> 00:51:11.760 Argument has I guess I don't know. I don't I've 886 00:51:11.800 --> 00:51:14.599 never had any logic class. I don't know anything about validity. 887 00:51:14.639 --> 00:51:15.480 You'll have to teach me. 888 00:51:15.719 --> 00:51:16.039 You don't know. 889 00:51:19.360 --> 00:51:20.440 No, I don't tell me if. 890 00:51:20.280 --> 00:51:22.719 The premises necessarily and tell the conclusions that. 891 00:51:22.719 --> 00:51:23.079 You have that. 892 00:51:24.119 --> 00:51:27.039 Yeah, so Protestanism is false because it's not taught the 893 00:51:27.039 --> 00:51:28.960 New Testament. It's not taught by the Church fathers. There 894 00:51:28.960 --> 00:51:33.639 you go, Okay, what Sanfranchie, you tell me why Protestantism 895 00:51:33.719 --> 00:51:35.719 is true. 896 00:51:36.280 --> 00:51:37.679 These guys are plundering already. 897 00:51:38.639 --> 00:51:41.000 Well, there's nothing. I don't have to put it. 898 00:51:41.360 --> 00:51:44.039 If it's the case that it necessarily doesn't follow from 899 00:51:44.079 --> 00:51:44.960 the premises. 900 00:51:45.320 --> 00:51:47.519 Valid do you have an argument or you're just gonna 901 00:51:47.559 --> 00:51:51.400 talk bullshit? So you don't have an argument? Yeah, the 902 00:51:51.519 --> 00:51:54.119 argument I don't have to put I don't have to 903 00:51:54.159 --> 00:51:56.679 put it into I'm not putting it into a syllogism 904 00:51:56.719 --> 00:51:58.199 because I don't want it. I don't have to for you. 905 00:51:58.320 --> 00:52:02.280 So Protestantism is protestant is, Protestantism is not taught in 906 00:52:02.320 --> 00:52:06.880 the Yeah, Protestantism is not. Protestantism is not taught in 907 00:52:06.920 --> 00:52:09.800 the New Testament. Protestantism is not taught in the New Testament. 908 00:52:09.800 --> 00:52:13.800 Therefore it's false. Wow, that's the argument. 909 00:52:14.519 --> 00:52:15.639 That's a claim. 910 00:52:16.800 --> 00:52:20.599 No, it's an argument. You can dispute it now, that 911 00:52:20.639 --> 00:52:21.639 actually is an argument. 912 00:52:23.840 --> 00:52:24.000 No. 913 00:52:24.000 --> 00:52:27.639 No, we all agree that we have to we have 914 00:52:27.719 --> 00:52:31.440 to stop interrupting me. Stop interrupting me. We all agree, 915 00:52:31.920 --> 00:52:34.599 we all we all agree that we have to follow 916 00:52:34.599 --> 00:52:38.719 the New Testament. The New Testament does not teach Protestanism. Therefore, 917 00:52:38.719 --> 00:52:42.599 protestist is false. There's your there's your syllogism. No, that's 918 00:52:42.599 --> 00:52:47.119 a syllogism. The Protestant is the New Testament is true. 919 00:52:47.440 --> 00:52:53.800 Here's here. Here is the syllogism. Protestantism is true. Excuse mean, 920 00:52:53.880 --> 00:52:56.159 the New Testament is true. Protestanism is not taught in 921 00:52:56.159 --> 00:53:01.119 the New Testament, therefore it's false. Okay, what's the I 922 00:53:01.159 --> 00:53:03.000 don't All I have to do is give you a syllogism. 923 00:53:03.400 --> 00:53:09.960 Understandogisms need like infant is the syllogism invalid? Is the 924 00:53:09.960 --> 00:53:14.920 syllogism invalid? Yeah, how is it invalid? How is it invalid? 925 00:53:15.880 --> 00:53:18.880 Given that it doesn't have what? How is this? That 926 00:53:18.920 --> 00:53:22.880 doesn't tell me that it's invalid? No, it doesn't. It's 927 00:53:22.920 --> 00:53:27.440 a it's a valid syllogism. You don't agree, so you're 928 00:53:27.440 --> 00:53:29.440 just trolling. You don't even have an argument. You don't 929 00:53:29.480 --> 00:53:32.000 have an argument. I gave you a syllogism. I gave 930 00:53:32.000 --> 00:53:34.880 you the very thing you asked for. How is it 931 00:53:34.920 --> 00:53:37.320 not valid? What is it violate? What does it value? 932 00:53:37.800 --> 00:53:41.079 What does it violate? What does it violate? 933 00:53:41.760 --> 00:53:41.920 Good? 934 00:53:41.960 --> 00:53:42.079 Good? 935 00:53:42.119 --> 00:53:44.400 Good? What law does it violate? 936 00:53:45.360 --> 00:53:45.880 What law? 937 00:53:46.119 --> 00:53:48.480 He can't about. 938 00:53:48.800 --> 00:53:52.719 The syllogism is valid. You wanted a syllogistic form of it, 939 00:53:53.400 --> 00:53:59.000 so that was nothing. The New Testament is true. Protestantism 940 00:53:59.079 --> 00:54:02.000 is not taught in the New Testament. Therefore Protestants is false. 941 00:54:02.760 --> 00:54:05.760 That's the argument. Now you can disagree with it. That's 942 00:54:05.800 --> 00:54:08.400 not invalid. What's up, man? 943 00:54:12.559 --> 00:54:12.920 Hello? 944 00:54:14.199 --> 00:54:14.679 What's up? 945 00:54:16.199 --> 00:54:16.360 Hey? 946 00:54:16.440 --> 00:54:16.679 Jay? 947 00:54:17.559 --> 00:54:19.519 I just wanted to say I appreciate what you do 948 00:54:19.639 --> 00:54:20.119 so much. 949 00:54:21.639 --> 00:54:23.280 My brother is super chatted earlier. 950 00:54:23.320 --> 00:54:25.280 I'm a CD of human in the Orthodox Church. 951 00:54:25.480 --> 00:54:29.679 And Cliff Connectel is coming to my school tomorrow. 952 00:54:29.960 --> 00:54:31.880 Yeah, I answered that super chat earlier today. 953 00:54:32.719 --> 00:54:35.639 Yeah, I just wanted to follow up on like specific 954 00:54:35.719 --> 00:54:38.440 question and if there's anything you would add and how 955 00:54:38.519 --> 00:54:42.960 you think you'd respond if solo scripture is true, how 956 00:54:42.960 --> 00:54:45.679 do you know which books are scripture without appealing to 957 00:54:45.800 --> 00:54:48.360 the authority of the early Church that you don't accept 958 00:54:48.400 --> 00:54:48.960 as binding. 959 00:54:51.440 --> 00:54:53.199 Sure, I mean there's a lot of different ways you 960 00:54:53.199 --> 00:54:55.039 could go about that line of argument. That would be fine. 961 00:54:56.079 --> 00:54:57.960 Okay, sweet, let's go. 962 00:54:58.679 --> 00:55:00.960 Thanks j Yeah, by the way, I don't even think 963 00:55:00.960 --> 00:55:03.159 that guy. I think that that sounds like an atheist. 964 00:55:03.199 --> 00:55:06.239 That's an atheist trying to pretend that he is a Protestant, 965 00:55:06.360 --> 00:55:09.039 because no Protestant would argue some stupid line of argument 966 00:55:09.079 --> 00:55:14.559 like that key tone. 967 00:55:18.280 --> 00:55:21.280 Hello, what's up? Hey? 968 00:55:21.840 --> 00:55:22.360 What's up? 969 00:55:22.480 --> 00:55:22.679 Jay? 970 00:55:23.360 --> 00:55:27.239 So you know, some of my friends came up to 971 00:55:27.280 --> 00:55:30.239 speak to Malert and they were like pressing him, and 972 00:55:30.320 --> 00:55:32.960 this guy Mallard just wants to keep saying you blocked him, 973 00:55:33.440 --> 00:55:33.800 and you. 974 00:55:33.840 --> 00:55:37.000 Know that, Yeah, he's unblocked right now, so he can 975 00:55:37.000 --> 00:55:40.800 come in here. He's running right, He is unblocked, so 976 00:55:40.880 --> 00:55:42.239 that he could come if he wants to. But I 977 00:55:42.320 --> 00:55:43.679 knew he's not gonna come. 978 00:55:44.519 --> 00:55:46.400 Okay, because pretty much. 979 00:55:46.440 --> 00:55:48.280 I went on as like you know Panel of twice 980 00:55:48.440 --> 00:55:53.079 and you know he just won't come up. Is it unbelievable? 981 00:55:53.079 --> 00:55:54.760 Wait? What won't come up? What do you mean it's panel? 982 00:55:55.679 --> 00:55:55.960 Uh? 983 00:55:56.199 --> 00:55:57.719 He keeps saying, like you know, it's like you know 984 00:55:57.840 --> 00:56:01.039 him is a roving guy in Christian King JP, and 985 00:56:01.079 --> 00:56:03.320 they're just like talking about like, oh they're help me, Jada, 986 00:56:03.360 --> 00:56:05.679 I won't come way here, like and then talking about 987 00:56:05.679 --> 00:56:07.119 you're just scared of them, like J. 988 00:56:08.719 --> 00:56:12.960 I already debated their idiot, their idiot, but buddy JP uncut, 989 00:56:13.320 --> 00:56:15.280 Why would I be scared of them if I already 990 00:56:15.280 --> 00:56:17.199 debated the dude? They did the exact same thing a 991 00:56:17.280 --> 00:56:20.079 year ago. They're just doing this to get attention, and 992 00:56:20.159 --> 00:56:22.079 they there's no reason why they can't call in right 993 00:56:22.119 --> 00:56:25.599 here and continue streaming and clip farm whatever they want. 994 00:56:25.920 --> 00:56:27.599 No, I agree, you destroy them, but like why is 995 00:56:27.679 --> 00:56:28.880 calling like on your phone or something? 996 00:56:28.960 --> 00:56:30.639 Just make them look embarrassing. 997 00:56:30.199 --> 00:56:31.840 Because I'm on my phone right here with you. What 998 00:56:31.840 --> 00:56:32.559 are you talking about? 999 00:56:33.199 --> 00:56:34.800 No, but you can just like switch over and destroy 1000 00:56:34.840 --> 00:56:35.440 and we'll quick right. 1001 00:56:36.840 --> 00:56:39.199 I don't want to. They can call in here. I've 1002 00:56:39.239 --> 00:56:41.440 already given them a platform. 1003 00:56:42.159 --> 00:56:43.800 Just keep asking them all right, see jack. 1004 00:56:47.840 --> 00:56:53.119 Uh not going on their stream for one, I'm not 1005 00:56:53.320 --> 00:56:56.800 giving them what they want. I don't bow to them. 1006 00:56:56.840 --> 00:56:59.360 They don't. It's like Rouselan say, you don't summon me, 1007 00:56:59.800 --> 00:57:07.960 You don't summon me. Listen. I don't go on all 1008 00:57:08.000 --> 00:57:11.079 the other streams. I do an open callin stream where 1009 00:57:11.119 --> 00:57:13.719 you can call into me for people who have no following. 1010 00:57:13.960 --> 00:57:17.760 A bunch of low tier need god level goobers. I 1011 00:57:17.800 --> 00:57:19.400 don't have to go, and I'm not giving you a 1012 00:57:19.400 --> 00:57:21.480 formal debate. You can call in here. 1013 00:57:23.280 --> 00:57:25.119 Ye uh huh. 1014 00:57:25.519 --> 00:57:27.519 You know I have a question about I know you're 1015 00:57:27.559 --> 00:57:28.760 keep eating questions. 1016 00:57:28.440 --> 00:57:31.239 But why why are you always sound like you're about 1017 00:57:31.239 --> 00:57:34.159 to laugh? Why why are you acting like you? Why 1018 00:57:34.159 --> 00:57:39.000 are you always about to laugh? Questions you? Okay, why 1019 00:57:39.039 --> 00:57:40.920 are you about to laugh? What's funny that you were 1020 00:57:40.920 --> 00:57:41.679 getting blocked? 1021 00:57:41.760 --> 00:57:44.639 But can you can you keep singer and boss telling. 1022 00:57:44.800 --> 00:57:49.280 You he's unblocked to come here, That's what I'm saying. 1023 00:57:49.559 --> 00:57:51.679 So I'm asking why does he keep the building? When 1024 00:57:51.719 --> 00:57:52.280 did that happen? 1025 00:57:53.079 --> 00:57:55.239 I always blocked these gobers, and then I unblocked them 1026 00:57:55.239 --> 00:57:56.719 if I want them to come to debate, which I 1027 00:57:56.719 --> 00:57:58.360 know they're not going to do, but I unblock them 1028 00:57:58.360 --> 00:58:00.199 so that they can come to Bate. I block all 1029 00:58:00.199 --> 00:58:02.480 the people that won't come to Bate. That's always been 1030 00:58:02.599 --> 00:58:05.000 that's always been my mode of operation, and I'm gonna 1031 00:58:05.039 --> 00:58:06.639 keep doing it and I don't care whether you'll like 1032 00:58:06.639 --> 00:58:12.320 it or not. All right, smart uh huhm hm ek, 1033 00:58:12.519 --> 00:58:16.239 what's up? These call her as? This is all his 1034 00:58:16.360 --> 00:58:19.679 dumb audience. And you see the level of his audience. 1035 00:58:19.760 --> 00:58:22.199 This is what you get in these people's audience. This 1036 00:58:22.320 --> 00:58:25.320 is the this is the orbiters of Ruslan. Okay, they're 1037 00:58:25.360 --> 00:58:28.559 even lower tier than Ruslan, which is hard to imagine, 1038 00:58:29.000 --> 00:58:31.719 but that's who these people are. They're trying to get 1039 00:58:31.719 --> 00:58:33.239 me to go. I'm not going on there, so you're 1040 00:58:33.239 --> 00:58:33.920 just wasting your time. 1041 00:58:34.000 --> 00:58:34.159 E K. 1042 00:58:34.320 --> 00:58:36.599 What's up? Hey, man? 1043 00:58:37.280 --> 00:58:38.119 I don't know if you saw it. 1044 00:58:38.199 --> 00:58:42.159 Yesterday, Rachel Wilson posted on x it's like compilation of Ruslan, 1045 00:58:42.440 --> 00:58:45.280 basically like saying he's it was like early on in 1046 00:58:45.360 --> 00:58:49.000 his career, and he's like, I'm trying to monetize my audience, man, 1047 00:58:49.119 --> 00:58:50.639 trying to make like seven figures. 1048 00:58:50.679 --> 00:58:56.000 Yeah I should I played it yesterday. Yeah we should 1049 00:58:56.039 --> 00:59:00.840 go back to that. Let's see, and everybody's like, no, 1050 00:59:01.000 --> 00:59:02.000 that ain't fair to him? 1051 00:59:02.039 --> 00:59:02.199 Do that? 1052 00:59:02.239 --> 00:59:04.280 Ain't fear to him? Why is it not fair to him? 1053 00:59:04.360 --> 00:59:08.199 If he's still doing what he said he was gonna 1054 00:59:08.199 --> 00:59:13.440 do it, no fear of him. Y'all just dumb and 1055 00:59:13.480 --> 00:59:16.320 you fell for a grifter and you don't want to 1056 00:59:16.360 --> 00:59:21.199 admit it. Sunken calls fallacy. I know I shared that. 1057 00:59:21.280 --> 00:59:27.320 Where's it at? Oh? 1058 00:59:27.360 --> 00:59:27.920 Here here? 1059 00:59:27.960 --> 00:59:32.639 I think uh Alex Soren shared it too. Let's see. 1060 00:59:32.639 --> 00:59:41.239 This is it who believes is dumb wigger grifter? Right here? 1061 00:59:41.239 --> 00:59:43.599 This is so stupid O way, I've never seen this 1062 00:59:43.639 --> 00:59:44.719 stuff until recently. 1063 00:59:45.320 --> 00:59:46.239 I got the following. 1064 00:59:46.320 --> 00:59:49.159 I got twenty eight two hundred thousand on TikTok two. 1065 00:59:50.320 --> 00:59:53.079 Listen to this, bro, I got that following, dog, I 1066 00:59:53.119 --> 00:59:55.880 got twenty eight k, Bro, I. 1067 00:59:55.840 --> 00:59:57.920 Got the following, I got twenty eight thousand. I got 1068 00:59:57.960 --> 01:00:01.280 two hundred thousand on TikTok that five hundred thousand. How 1069 01:00:01.280 --> 01:00:02.760 do I monetize these people? 1070 01:00:02.880 --> 01:00:05.360 You know what I mean? How do I monetize these people? 1071 01:00:05.920 --> 01:00:10.559 And through covetousness, shall they with feigned words make merchandise 1072 01:00:10.639 --> 01:00:11.519 of money? 1073 01:00:12.559 --> 01:00:16.480 I like shoes and I like money. 1074 01:00:16.719 --> 01:00:19.360 And you got to figure out what what is your 1075 01:00:19.360 --> 01:00:21.400 product going to be what can you sell people? 1076 01:00:22.000 --> 01:00:24.239 That's the actual question, right. 1077 01:00:24.280 --> 01:00:26.119 So we can puts the foot around and we can say, oh, 1078 01:00:26.280 --> 01:00:28.119 like I want to have a ministry and I want 1079 01:00:28.119 --> 01:00:29.480 to do this and I want to do that, right, 1080 01:00:29.559 --> 01:00:32.880 But what we're really asking is like, how do I 1081 01:00:32.920 --> 01:00:34.880 build a business? 1082 01:00:35.039 --> 01:00:40.800 I don't really care, damn Son, this is so amazing. 1083 01:00:40.800 --> 01:00:41.480 I would have thought it. 1084 01:00:41.599 --> 01:00:45.400 AI care about how many followers I have. I need 1085 01:00:45.440 --> 01:00:48.199 those metrics to an extent for the for the credibility 1086 01:00:48.280 --> 01:00:50.760 of them. But I'm more thinking, what is my bank 1087 01:00:50.800 --> 01:00:52.199 account going to look like in the next two to 1088 01:00:52.239 --> 01:00:52.679 three years. 1089 01:00:52.719 --> 01:00:54.400 I need I need seven figures. I need I need, 1090 01:00:54.440 --> 01:00:55.119 I need seven figures. 1091 01:00:55.440 --> 01:00:57.760 I would love to be in a position someday where 1092 01:00:58.199 --> 01:00:59.719 I just have fu money. 1093 01:01:00.159 --> 01:01:00.280 Bro. 1094 01:01:00.440 --> 01:01:02.519 I got the following, I got twenty eight thousand. I 1095 01:01:02.519 --> 01:01:04.039 got two hundred thousand on TikTok. 1096 01:01:05.360 --> 01:01:09.079 It's with Griff Maxon over here. And it's amazing because 1097 01:01:09.519 --> 01:01:11.760 he ain't even shy about it. He just opened lots 1098 01:01:11.760 --> 01:01:14.880 of Back in the day, you know, TV preachers will 1099 01:01:14.880 --> 01:01:17.320 be a little more covert about it, you know what 1100 01:01:17.360 --> 01:01:19.519 I'm saying. They was now It's just like no, I 1101 01:01:19.639 --> 01:01:22.320 just I'm straight up. Just here, get that get paid doll, 1102 01:01:22.800 --> 01:01:28.079 the stack stacks doll. Yes, this is real. I mean 1103 01:01:28.159 --> 01:01:30.519 unless somebody made an AI short, this is real. 1104 01:01:31.760 --> 01:01:34.039 How do I monetize these people? You know what I mean? 1105 01:01:34.199 --> 01:01:36.000 How do I monetize these people? 1106 01:01:36.559 --> 01:01:41.239 And through covetousness, shall they, with feigned words make meschandise 1107 01:01:41.320 --> 01:01:44.360 of you whose judgment now have a long time linger 1108 01:01:44.320 --> 01:01:44.639 with not. 1109 01:01:45.400 --> 01:01:46.320 I like shoes. 1110 01:01:48.519 --> 01:01:55.519 I like shoes, freaking gay as hell, dude shoes. The 1111 01:01:55.679 --> 01:02:01.000 women like shoes. That's a feminine thing, Toby, what's up 1112 01:02:04.039 --> 01:02:08.119 those that I like shoes? I like heels, I like 1113 01:02:08.239 --> 01:02:11.880 my slip on Jordan's what. 1114 01:02:14.360 --> 01:02:15.320 Uh? 1115 01:02:18.400 --> 01:02:21.639 Just before I ask my question asman, thank you because 1116 01:02:22.039 --> 01:02:25.639 similar to the guy a couple of guys before, I 1117 01:02:25.719 --> 01:02:28.480 used to be a heavy atheist, like an anti theist, 1118 01:02:28.559 --> 01:02:31.239 and then I started watching your stuff and you've helped me. Uh, 1119 01:02:31.719 --> 01:02:33.519 definitely convert to Christianity. 1120 01:02:34.559 --> 01:02:34.800 Cool. 1121 01:02:35.559 --> 01:02:38.239 My question was on the on tag? Could I run 1122 01:02:38.280 --> 01:02:38.599 it byke? 1123 01:02:40.440 --> 01:02:42.440 I mean we're not really doing tag tonight. I mean, 1124 01:02:42.440 --> 01:02:44.280 can you just come that back next time with that 1125 01:02:44.400 --> 01:02:48.000 tonight's topics or Catholicism and Protestantism. So I'm not trying 1126 01:02:48.000 --> 01:02:50.599 to be a douchebag. It's just I want to sit 1127 01:02:50.679 --> 01:02:54.639 here for twenty minutes explaining philosophical stuff. I'm not being rude, 1128 01:02:54.639 --> 01:02:59.039 it's just it's Protestant, Catholic, Mormon stuff tonight. I'm just 1129 01:02:59.159 --> 01:03:01.679 I don't have the energy for tag tonight, Stallion. What's up? 1130 01:03:04.880 --> 01:03:07.480 As soon as I start explaining a bunch of philosophical stuff, 1131 01:03:07.480 --> 01:03:10.559 it's going to go from seventeen hundred to eight hundred? 1132 01:03:11.519 --> 01:03:12.599 What's up? Man? And you? 1133 01:03:13.719 --> 01:03:16.719 That was good. 1134 01:03:17.000 --> 01:03:20.159 I was just appear to ask when looking at Eastern Catholics, 1135 01:03:21.360 --> 01:03:23.239 and by the way, I'm like, I'm with you. I'm 1136 01:03:23.320 --> 01:03:29.079 round and more Certism, you know, I'm more Orthodox sympathetic, 1137 01:03:29.599 --> 01:03:32.000 you know, so when looking at us, I live in 1138 01:03:32.119 --> 01:03:34.599 an area with a lot of Eastern Catholics, and so 1139 01:03:34.679 --> 01:03:37.840 they try to pos it like, you know that they 1140 01:03:37.880 --> 01:03:40.519 are I mean they, I mean they are essentially Eastern 1141 01:03:40.639 --> 01:03:42.079 Orthodox by communion with Rome. 1142 01:03:42.119 --> 01:03:44.280 But isn't that just the catchlin two? Like, is isn't 1143 01:03:44.280 --> 01:03:45.519 that just the double amy on them? You know? 1144 01:03:46.039 --> 01:03:50.559 It is? It's an even worse uh position to be in. 1145 01:03:50.639 --> 01:03:54.360 And it's also an obvious refutation of the Roman Catholic system, 1146 01:03:54.400 --> 01:03:57.920 because how can you have competing theologies and confessions of 1147 01:03:57.960 --> 01:04:01.760 faith when everybody admits that the church has one confession 1148 01:04:01.760 --> 01:04:04.199 of faith, so how can there be too? How can 1149 01:04:04.239 --> 01:04:06.639 you be in a church that believes in the phillyoquay 1150 01:04:06.639 --> 01:04:07.679 and also rejects it. 1151 01:04:08.400 --> 01:04:11.639 Yeah, and I just want to confirm if I'm to 1152 01:04:11.719 --> 01:04:17.079 be baptized Orthodox, what's the stance on marrying an Unorthodox, 1153 01:04:17.199 --> 01:04:20.280 marrying a Catholic or marrying and you know, what is 1154 01:04:20.320 --> 01:04:20.920 the stance on that? 1155 01:04:20.960 --> 01:04:23.679 You know, that's a decision that you will suss out 1156 01:04:23.719 --> 01:04:28.159 with your spiritual father, that will be decided canonically. That's 1157 01:04:28.159 --> 01:04:30.199 not something I can really tell you. I mean, there 1158 01:04:30.280 --> 01:04:35.039 is there are allowances through economia for marriage to people 1159 01:04:35.039 --> 01:04:37.840 who are not well Orthodox, but it's not wise, it's 1160 01:04:37.880 --> 01:04:40.679 not recommended. But that's something that you know, you'd have 1161 01:04:40.719 --> 01:04:43.039 to take that up with them, with the people that 1162 01:04:43.079 --> 01:04:47.360 will bring you in. Drake, what's up? Yeah, I'm trying 1163 01:04:47.360 --> 01:04:49.320 to monetize them. People don't following. 1164 01:04:49.360 --> 01:04:51.360 I got twenty eight thousand, I got two hundred thousand 1165 01:04:51.480 --> 01:04:53.559 on TikTok hundred thousand. 1166 01:04:53.760 --> 01:04:55.400 How do I monetize these people? 1167 01:04:55.519 --> 01:04:56.039 You know what I mean? 1168 01:04:56.159 --> 01:04:58.000 How do I monetize these people? 1169 01:04:58.519 --> 01:05:01.360 And through covetousness, shall they with feigned? 1170 01:05:01.519 --> 01:05:01.559 What? 1171 01:05:01.960 --> 01:05:04.639 By the way, where are the Protestants calling out Ruslan 1172 01:05:04.880 --> 01:05:08.960 for this stuff? And uh? People are saying in the chat, 1173 01:05:09.000 --> 01:05:12.400 which I still haven't gone and sussed this out, but 1174 01:05:13.280 --> 01:05:17.559 they were saying that Rouslan was a leftist or leftist 1175 01:05:17.599 --> 01:05:23.360 sympathetic for many years calling out people like Bryson Gray. 1176 01:05:24.639 --> 01:05:27.400 So I imagine that. Imagine those two idiots in a 1177 01:05:27.480 --> 01:05:33.400 room together right calling out Bryson Gay. Uh, because Bryson 1178 01:05:33.480 --> 01:05:37.119 Gay was too political. I mean, I'm not in a 1179 01:05:37.159 --> 01:05:39.800 maga cult either. I don't have a problem criticizing and 1180 01:05:39.880 --> 01:05:42.360 rejecting all kinds of things from Trump, which we've done 1181 01:05:42.519 --> 01:05:47.039 consistently for the whole time. But I mean, wasn't it 1182 01:05:47.079 --> 01:05:49.199 funny in Rousselan's video He's like, I don't care about 1183 01:05:49.199 --> 01:05:51.039 Epstein and what all he's up to. Well, you ought 1184 01:05:51.039 --> 01:05:52.559 to care about Epstein because it has to do with 1185 01:05:53.159 --> 01:05:58.000 the stranglehold that evangelical Zionism has on the entire country. 1186 01:05:58.519 --> 01:06:01.760 So it doesn't matter what's up man, Yo. 1187 01:06:01.760 --> 01:06:03.440 Jay appreciate you. 1188 01:06:03.559 --> 01:06:06.960 And I see alex Is in the voice chat debating, 1189 01:06:07.280 --> 01:06:10.559 I think it's important. I'm a Baptist background acquiring the 1190 01:06:10.679 --> 01:06:14.880 Orthodoxy through the arguments you presented and Alex had presented. 1191 01:06:15.079 --> 01:06:17.199 I just want to call it real quick because I'm. 1192 01:06:17.039 --> 01:06:18.559 Sure you have a video about it. But do you 1193 01:06:18.559 --> 01:06:22.800 have any recommendations on books about worship, how the Early 1194 01:06:22.880 --> 01:06:26.760 Church worship, how it's connected to Old Testament worship. 1195 01:06:27.119 --> 01:06:29.280 We have a whole documentary that we made. It's called 1196 01:06:29.719 --> 01:06:33.159 Christian Worship and the Old Testament at Orthodox Shahada channel. 1197 01:06:33.599 --> 01:06:36.960 The documentary recommends several books like Williams and Anstall's book 1198 01:06:37.079 --> 01:06:40.039 on the Temple and the Synagogue Liturgy being the basis 1199 01:06:40.039 --> 01:06:44.480 for the Orthodox Liturgy, and Hugh Weybrew's book Byzantine Liturgy. 1200 01:06:44.519 --> 01:06:55.800 But thank you for the call, Austin. What's up? Austin? 1201 01:06:55.840 --> 01:06:58.639 What's up you over there? R? And B Church? He 1202 01:06:58.719 --> 01:07:03.840 dropped off Taylor, child of the Most High. Whenever I 1203 01:07:03.920 --> 01:07:06.880 see that, I know I'm in trouble. I'm a child 1204 01:07:06.880 --> 01:07:08.719 of the Most High. What's up? 1205 01:07:08.840 --> 01:07:09.000 Man? 1206 01:07:09.880 --> 01:07:10.559 Are you a woman? 1207 01:07:11.679 --> 01:07:11.880 Yeah? 1208 01:07:11.920 --> 01:07:12.440 I'm a woman. 1209 01:07:13.400 --> 01:07:15.960 I was wondering when you think about women in apologetics 1210 01:07:16.880 --> 01:07:20.320 because the multiple women like Phoebe in the propheta Sannah 1211 01:07:20.559 --> 01:07:22.559 who I share the Gospel in the Bible. 1212 01:07:22.880 --> 01:07:23.559 What do you think. 1213 01:07:23.400 --> 01:07:25.719 About that, Well, that was during a time when there 1214 01:07:25.800 --> 01:07:28.920 was ongoing divine revelation. So if the Holy Spirit shows 1215 01:07:28.920 --> 01:07:31.400 to speak through a woman or a prophet to us, 1216 01:07:31.440 --> 01:07:34.480 he can do that. But that doesn't mean that women 1217 01:07:34.519 --> 01:07:36.320 are called to that in the history of the church, 1218 01:07:36.360 --> 01:07:38.480 and that's why women are typically not in that role. 1219 01:07:40.679 --> 01:07:42.199 But they share the good news with Paul. 1220 01:07:43.800 --> 01:07:47.079 Did you not hear what I said? I mean, you 1221 01:07:47.119 --> 01:07:49.320 can share the Gospel and you can convert people. That 1222 01:07:49.320 --> 01:07:51.480 doesn't mean you're called to be an apologist. 1223 01:07:52.679 --> 01:07:53.000 Okay. 1224 01:07:53.000 --> 01:07:55.559 And when you issue with Bryson, why'd you call him gay? 1225 01:07:56.920 --> 01:08:00.239 He's an anti trinitarian, insane, heretic. What are you talking about? 1226 01:08:00.280 --> 01:08:02.840 You don't think that trinity is a fundamental deed of 1227 01:08:02.880 --> 01:08:05.400 Christ or fundamental doctions of Christianity. 1228 01:08:06.280 --> 01:08:06.920 I do, But I. 1229 01:08:06.840 --> 01:08:09.480 Think that's like, you know, going beyond what's written and 1230 01:08:09.519 --> 01:08:10.400 causes division. 1231 01:08:10.480 --> 01:08:12.639 You know, how could it be? 1232 01:08:13.679 --> 01:08:16.079 He says, do not feel beyond what's written and divide? 1233 01:08:16.119 --> 01:08:20.520 You know, basically have divisions, So. 1234 01:08:20.760 --> 01:08:23.720 How can I doesn't John saying one, John two that 1235 01:08:23.760 --> 01:08:28.079 if you deny Christ, you're anti Christ. Absolutely, So it's 1236 01:08:28.119 --> 01:08:30.479 not going beyond what's written to say that denying the 1237 01:08:30.520 --> 01:08:32.199 deity of Christ makes your Antichrist. 1238 01:08:34.479 --> 01:08:38.600 But you cannot deny deity without accepting trinity because one thing, like, 1239 01:08:38.680 --> 01:08:41.079 for example, to say Christ is eternal. 1240 01:08:41.319 --> 01:08:45.079 With the Father, you can, yes, it is. What are 1241 01:08:45.079 --> 01:08:48.000 you talking about? So you're not a child? You're not 1242 01:08:48.039 --> 01:08:51.880 even that does? How does that mean? He's not divine? 1243 01:08:52.399 --> 01:08:56.680 I mean does my does? Are you a polytheist? How 1244 01:08:56.680 --> 01:08:57.880 many divinities you worship? 1245 01:08:59.119 --> 01:08:59.239 No? 1246 01:08:59.359 --> 01:09:02.119 But he said, like, why is it even a father 1247 01:09:02.159 --> 01:09:03.840 and a son? If the father didn't create the son? 1248 01:09:03.880 --> 01:09:05.199 He said, I proceeded from the Father. 1249 01:09:05.600 --> 01:09:09.279 Yeah, that's it, said, I came from That's eternal generation. 1250 01:09:09.560 --> 01:09:11.960 It's not a where do you get creation? It says 1251 01:09:12.000 --> 01:09:14.199 probably fifty times a New Testament. The son is not 1252 01:09:14.239 --> 01:09:18.119 a creature. Where do you get that? He's a creature? 1253 01:09:20.760 --> 01:09:24.399 It talks about in Psalms two seven, like I will proclaim. 1254 01:09:24.000 --> 01:09:25.680 The words decree on. 1255 01:09:25.560 --> 01:09:28.439 This day I have forgotten the Yeah, that's any that's 1256 01:09:28.439 --> 01:09:31.920 an eternal begotten. That's an eternal begetting. Because John one 1257 01:09:32.000 --> 01:09:38.800 says he's the only begotten God monoganies theos but begotten 1258 01:09:38.840 --> 01:09:43.119 at what point eternally begotten? Do you think that if 1259 01:09:43.119 --> 01:09:45.640 I had a son? Would he said, have the same 1260 01:09:45.720 --> 01:09:52.319 nature as me. Yeah, okay, okay. Is God uncreated the Father? 1261 01:09:53.760 --> 01:09:54.000 Yes? 1262 01:09:54.119 --> 01:09:56.399 Okay. So if he, if he has a son, wouldn't 1263 01:09:56.399 --> 01:10:01.000 the son have the same nature? Yes, But but he's yes, 1264 01:10:01.039 --> 01:10:02.319 but he's what. 1265 01:10:03.319 --> 01:10:04.359 But he's not the prime mover. 1266 01:10:04.399 --> 01:10:06.560 A logic would say, there must be a prime mover. 1267 01:10:06.520 --> 01:10:07.319 And I'll be the father. 1268 01:10:07.399 --> 01:10:10.840 Right, What does that have to do with eternal generation? 1269 01:10:10.960 --> 01:10:13.319 He could be the prime mover and eternally prime move 1270 01:10:13.399 --> 01:10:15.600 a son as his offspring. 1271 01:10:16.439 --> 01:10:17.960 Is there multiple prime movers? 1272 01:10:19.159 --> 01:10:21.960 The father is in this argument the prime mover. The 1273 01:10:22.039 --> 01:10:24.479 son is what's moved. But it's an eternal moving. 1274 01:10:26.239 --> 01:10:28.520 But it says in this day, on this day, I 1275 01:10:28.520 --> 01:10:29.079 have begotten. 1276 01:10:29.600 --> 01:10:32.239 That means eternal generation. And the way that we know 1277 01:10:32.319 --> 01:10:34.720 that is John One where he says in the beginning 1278 01:10:34.800 --> 01:10:36.159 was the word the word was good with God, the 1279 01:10:36.159 --> 01:10:36.920 word was God. 1280 01:10:39.680 --> 01:10:39.840 Yeah. 1281 01:10:39.840 --> 01:10:41.520 I mean you already admitted this when you said that 1282 01:10:41.600 --> 01:10:43.840 the father's nature is uncreated and the son has the 1283 01:10:43.880 --> 01:10:46.399 same nature. So there you go. You you yourself said it. 1284 01:10:47.920 --> 01:10:50.760 Okay, I just think the words device of like transarianism. 1285 01:10:50.760 --> 01:10:53.800 But that's well, who even put the Bible together? So 1286 01:10:53.840 --> 01:10:55.079 what do you what do you you don't. I don't 1287 01:10:55.079 --> 01:10:55.600 even grant that you. 1288 01:10:55.600 --> 01:10:55.800 Have the. 1289 01:10:57.279 --> 01:10:59.399 We don't necessarily we don't know who put the Bible together. 1290 01:11:00.479 --> 01:11:01.960 We don't know who put the Bible together. 1291 01:11:03.199 --> 01:11:04.880 Yeah, who put the Code Exeneticus together? 1292 01:11:04.920 --> 01:11:07.800 I mean, that's not the Bible. That's one textual tradition. 1293 01:11:07.840 --> 01:11:09.880 That's not the Bible. Who put the New Testament together 1294 01:11:10.239 --> 01:11:12.319 with the Old Testament in the first thousand years of 1295 01:11:12.319 --> 01:11:15.600 the church. You don't know who created the Why are 1296 01:11:15.640 --> 01:11:18.119 you asking me a different question? How does that ask? 1297 01:11:18.239 --> 01:11:20.520 That's not an answer. That's a textual tradition. You don't 1298 01:11:20.520 --> 01:11:21.800 know the difference beween a textual tradition. 1299 01:11:21.840 --> 01:11:25.680 They can in a scripture, but the Code Exeneticus has 1300 01:11:25.720 --> 01:11:26.680 all the books. 1301 01:11:27.279 --> 01:11:29.880 That is a textual tradition. It's not a canon. 1302 01:11:33.119 --> 01:11:34.800 Well then, I mean, what if you don't subscribe to 1303 01:11:34.840 --> 01:11:37.000 a canon, you subscribe to the textual tradition. 1304 01:11:40.039 --> 01:11:41.720 How do you know that's the right textual tradition? 1305 01:11:44.359 --> 01:11:47.880 The same reason that the squirrels preserve the Old Testament. 1306 01:11:49.319 --> 01:11:53.159 Totally irrelevant, nothing to do, irrelevant. Okay, you don't even 1307 01:11:53.239 --> 01:11:56.039 understand this isn't irrelevant. It doesn't even relate to what 1308 01:11:56.079 --> 01:11:58.279 I'm talking about. How do you know what the books 1309 01:11:58.279 --> 01:12:02.079 are in the Bible is appealing to the dec He's 1310 01:12:02.079 --> 01:12:04.520 WROA has nothing to do with that, Austin, what's up? 1311 01:12:08.119 --> 01:12:11.239 That's why women shouldn't be in an apologetics? You, you, yourself, 1312 01:12:11.279 --> 01:12:14.399 are the argument for why women can't do apologetics. You're 1313 01:12:14.399 --> 01:12:20.680 not made for that. What's up? Conn, I've what's up? 1314 01:12:21.039 --> 01:12:25.680 This other guy can't get in here? Hello? 1315 01:12:26.039 --> 01:12:26.920 Can you hear me? M hm? 1316 01:12:28.640 --> 01:12:32.720 So I was a Catholic seminarian for two years and 1317 01:12:33.439 --> 01:12:37.000 one of my Greek Orthodox friends brought up Luminingen Tim's 1318 01:12:37.039 --> 01:12:41.159 sixteen to me, and as a Catholic in good faith, 1319 01:12:42.319 --> 01:12:44.560 I'm willing to admit I can't argue it and say 1320 01:12:44.560 --> 01:12:46.800 that Muslims and Catholics worship the same God. 1321 01:12:47.279 --> 01:12:51.560 Good, So you have some discernment. So yeah, So. 1322 01:12:51.880 --> 01:12:55.159 I've asked various priests and other theologians that I know, 1323 01:12:56.079 --> 01:12:58.479 and the main arguments I hear are like it's like 1324 01:12:58.560 --> 01:13:02.920 these cope arguments, like I'm usually told Christians, Jews, and 1325 01:13:03.000 --> 01:13:04.479 Muslims all worship the same God. 1326 01:13:04.880 --> 01:13:07.479 You know that's not true, or I'll hear. 1327 01:13:07.479 --> 01:13:10.640 It doesn't matter what the church father said here in 1328 01:13:10.800 --> 01:13:14.119 this portion, because it was a different time period, and 1329 01:13:14.159 --> 01:13:17.840 it's like, that's not true. So I'm writing a letter 1330 01:13:17.880 --> 01:13:21.079 to a Catholic theologian and apologist that I personally know. 1331 01:13:21.399 --> 01:13:25.279 He's like, he's actually gonna know about it. So I'm 1332 01:13:25.319 --> 01:13:28.119 just curious if there's any resources that you would recommend. 1333 01:13:28.920 --> 01:13:29.119 Yeah. 1334 01:13:29.159 --> 01:13:34.960 Yes, it's called First John okay and chapter yeah, chapter two, 1335 01:13:35.039 --> 01:13:37.880 which says that if you deny the Son, you're Antichrist. 1336 01:13:38.359 --> 01:13:41.359 Now again, remember in the watch the debate that we 1337 01:13:41.399 --> 01:13:47.880 did with Trent Doherty h and whatever that other guber's 1338 01:13:47.920 --> 01:13:50.560 name is. And you'll notice in that debate, I asked 1339 01:13:50.560 --> 01:13:52.479 Trent Doherty, I say, so, you're telling me that Jake 1340 01:13:52.520 --> 01:13:55.680 and the Muslim metaphysician who has explicitly rejected the Trinity, 1341 01:13:56.359 --> 01:14:00.199 that he still worships the same God even though Muslim 1342 01:14:00.319 --> 01:14:05.000 explicitly say Allah is not a father. That right there 1343 01:14:05.039 --> 01:14:07.399 will show you. And I think that shows everybody how 1344 01:14:07.399 --> 01:14:09.760 absurd the line of argumentation is for these guys, because 1345 01:14:09.760 --> 01:14:12.880 they will actually still stress, no, he still worships the 1346 01:14:12.920 --> 01:14:16.479 same God. Keep in mind, too, there's ambiguity about the 1347 01:14:16.560 --> 01:14:20.279 term worship and if Atican two had restricted their language 1348 01:14:20.319 --> 01:14:23.920 to saying something like Muslims Christians and Jews all perhaps 1349 01:14:24.159 --> 01:14:27.840 reference or intend to reference the same entity or object 1350 01:14:27.960 --> 01:14:30.920 that could be one thing, but they mistakenly use or 1351 01:14:30.960 --> 01:14:34.640 perhaps not mistakenly use the word worship. Worship is not 1352 01:14:34.680 --> 01:14:38.359 the same thing as mental, notional recognition, or reference. Worship 1353 01:14:38.399 --> 01:14:40.600 has to do with what God lays down to what 1354 01:14:40.640 --> 01:14:44.279 he accepts. God does not accept Muslim and Jewish worship. 1355 01:14:44.319 --> 01:14:47.039 And that's something that we're told multiple times in New 1356 01:14:47.079 --> 01:14:49.159 Testament when Paul writes the Book of Hebrews and says 1357 01:14:49.199 --> 01:14:51.520 that it's a dead religion, and Judaism is not going 1358 01:14:51.560 --> 01:14:54.399 to commend you to God through dead rituals and things 1359 01:14:54.439 --> 01:14:56.279 that are fulfilled in the Church and in Christ. So 1360 01:14:57.880 --> 01:15:02.800 Rabbinic judaism is not the worship of the One True God. 1361 01:15:02.800 --> 01:15:04.399 And you can read the Gospel of John two, of 1362 01:15:04.479 --> 01:15:07.279 John five through nine where Jesus argues with the Pharisees 1363 01:15:07.319 --> 01:15:10.399 that he is the I Am of Exodus and that 1364 01:15:10.520 --> 01:15:12.319 the only that no one comes to the Father but 1365 01:15:12.439 --> 01:15:15.239 through him, and you do not have the Father because 1366 01:15:15.439 --> 01:15:19.439 they do not have him. So Jesus himself repeats the 1367 01:15:19.479 --> 01:15:24.840 same message of first John two. Yeah, that's what I 1368 01:15:24.880 --> 01:15:27.119 that's what I was writing about. So I mean I 1369 01:15:27.199 --> 01:15:31.479 found some things from Chrysostom. Yeah, Chrystm says Muslim. 1370 01:15:32.039 --> 01:15:36.920 I don't want to make a context error by in 1371 01:15:37.039 --> 01:15:39.920 putting Muslims where Jews are, but I feel like it 1372 01:15:40.039 --> 01:15:40.760 kind of makes sense. 1373 01:15:42.039 --> 01:15:44.399 It's the same line of argumentation. I mean, in fact, 1374 01:15:44.399 --> 01:15:47.800 it's even worse for the Muslim argument because Muslims explicitly 1375 01:15:47.840 --> 01:15:51.000 reject that God is a father. Yeah, and Jews at 1376 01:15:51.039 --> 01:15:53.319 least admit God as a father. So, and I'm not 1377 01:15:53.359 --> 01:15:55.159 saying that that makes it the same reference. I'm just 1378 01:15:55.159 --> 01:15:57.840 saying it's even more removed from the Jewish position because 1379 01:15:57.880 --> 01:16:01.239 of an explicit rejection of father and son in Islam. 1380 01:16:01.239 --> 01:16:03.920 So it's just preposterous to still say, oh, but it's 1381 01:16:03.920 --> 01:16:07.000 still the same Why, well, it's the same word again. 1382 01:16:07.039 --> 01:16:13.680 It's all just terrible arguments. Zaiah, what's up? You crowed 1383 01:16:13.720 --> 01:16:29.880 a move? Mary on Friday? You marry what's up? I'm 1384 01:16:29.920 --> 01:16:45.399 mute three? What's up? Three clocks? I mute three clocks? 1385 01:16:48.239 --> 01:16:51.960 Hey, Jay, thanks for taking the question. 1386 01:16:52.439 --> 01:16:56.880 I was curious if you could provide what you think 1387 01:16:57.000 --> 01:16:58.840 the best steel man. 1388 01:16:58.680 --> 01:17:03.479 For the papacy is and how you would refute it. 1389 01:17:14.319 --> 01:17:20.960 I mean, I don't maybe supposedly the papacy would give 1390 01:17:21.000 --> 01:17:25.840 you decisions on disputed matters. Maybe that's the strongest argument 1391 01:17:25.880 --> 01:17:29.119 that they have, and the reputation would be that that 1392 01:17:29.159 --> 01:17:32.319 doesn't actually seem to be the case. I mean, we 1393 01:17:32.399 --> 01:17:35.560 have massive lack of clarity for the last seventy years 1394 01:17:35.560 --> 01:17:39.039 in the Roman Catholic world on theology and morals. So 1395 01:17:39.359 --> 01:17:42.800 the supposed you know, sales pitch that the papacy will 1396 01:17:42.840 --> 01:17:47.039 give us unity, certitude, clarity, and preservation of the faith 1397 01:17:47.439 --> 01:17:50.359 falls apart in the last seventy years. So Zio, what's up? 1398 01:17:58.159 --> 01:17:58.600 What's us? 1399 01:18:00.279 --> 01:18:00.479 Hey? 1400 01:18:00.760 --> 01:18:01.680 Thanks for taking a question. 1401 01:18:01.760 --> 01:18:05.439 I had a few questions. You know, I've been watching 1402 01:18:05.439 --> 01:18:08.600 you debate for a while. I haven't really seen you 1403 01:18:08.720 --> 01:18:12.039 lose a theological debate. Really haven't seen you lose a 1404 01:18:12.039 --> 01:18:12.680 debate at all. 1405 01:18:14.279 --> 01:18:15.159 I am an Eastern. 1406 01:18:15.000 --> 01:18:17.960 Orthodoge Christian, and I mean I just had like a 1407 01:18:17.960 --> 01:18:18.520 few questions. 1408 01:18:18.520 --> 01:18:19.560 One of them is personal. 1409 01:18:20.359 --> 01:18:22.239 I don't know if you're cool with answer and answering that. 1410 01:18:22.840 --> 01:18:25.920 I don't care, okay, And I have. 1411 01:18:25.920 --> 01:18:27.359 Also had a theological question. 1412 01:18:29.359 --> 01:18:31.640 Do you think that saying the N word is holy 1413 01:18:31.960 --> 01:18:33.279 and rooted in good faith? 1414 01:18:33.760 --> 01:18:35.520 Can you tell me why? They tell me why? The 1415 01:18:35.600 --> 01:18:41.720 N word is a bad word. Well for me, now 1416 01:18:41.760 --> 01:18:43.520 why is it bad? Now for you? I don't ask you. 1417 01:18:43.560 --> 01:18:45.800 For you, why is it bad? What are the bad words? 1418 01:18:45.840 --> 01:18:46.840 And how do we know what they are? 1419 01:18:47.800 --> 01:18:48.000 Well? 1420 01:18:48.000 --> 01:18:48.920 I think it can be. 1421 01:18:50.680 --> 01:18:53.039 Like I guess, it can be kind of defined as 1422 01:18:53.079 --> 01:18:56.680 an idol or careless way of speaking. 1423 01:18:57.800 --> 01:19:03.520 So all idol speech includes what every joke is also 1424 01:19:03.960 --> 01:19:07.479 part of that? No, definitely not. Well why would a 1425 01:19:07.520 --> 01:19:08.960 joke not be part of idle speech? 1426 01:19:10.680 --> 01:19:12.840 Because I think that a joke is coming from a 1427 01:19:12.840 --> 01:19:14.119 different place in heart. 1428 01:19:15.319 --> 01:19:18.720 So now it's motives that didn't that determine it? Well, 1429 01:19:19.920 --> 01:19:21.600 but you said that you said the in word. Now 1430 01:19:21.640 --> 01:19:23.279 you said the in word itself was bad. 1431 01:19:23.880 --> 01:19:26.359 My marguement would be that it's not building you up 1432 01:19:26.520 --> 01:19:30.680 in your spirit, coming from the Eastern Orthodox perspective. 1433 01:19:31.560 --> 01:19:35.760 So and my question again is exact same question, because 1434 01:19:35.800 --> 01:19:39.319 you moved the goalpost to say that it's the word itself, 1435 01:19:39.399 --> 01:19:42.560 the in word, because you said, well, it's idle speech. Well, 1436 01:19:42.640 --> 01:19:44.840 jokes are idle speech And you're like, no, it has 1437 01:19:44.880 --> 01:19:46.239 to do with the motives. Well, how do you know 1438 01:19:46.279 --> 01:19:48.560 the motives? So which one you're you keep shifting as 1439 01:19:48.640 --> 01:19:51.680 to what makes it bad by the way. You don't 1440 01:19:51.680 --> 01:19:54.680 you understand like twenty different black people gave me inward passes. 1441 01:19:54.800 --> 01:19:56.920 Right, that's cool, that's cool. 1442 01:19:57.079 --> 01:19:57.479 How is it? 1443 01:19:57.520 --> 01:19:57.760 Well? So? 1444 01:19:57.800 --> 01:19:59.359 How so? How am I bad? If it's cool? 1445 01:19:59.399 --> 01:20:01.399 Now, it's cool, it's cool. 1446 01:20:01.680 --> 01:20:04.079 I was really just asking you, what like if you 1447 01:20:04.199 --> 01:20:07.680 think that saying the N word is holy and rooted 1448 01:20:07.720 --> 01:20:08.359 in good faith? 1449 01:20:08.399 --> 01:20:11.319 That was my original. Okay, sure, I just wanted to 1450 01:20:11.319 --> 01:20:14.560 get your goodbye. Yeah, you go point out and show 1451 01:20:14.600 --> 01:20:17.239 how holy you are. Everybody else somewhere else, Mendoza, what's up? 1452 01:20:19.319 --> 01:20:21.840 Go ask h Brosi why he gave me so many 1453 01:20:21.880 --> 01:20:24.359 inward passes? What's up? Man? Mendoza? 1454 01:20:25.880 --> 01:20:26.199 A J. 1455 01:20:26.439 --> 01:20:30.279 Doyer, this is Ruth Blawn's bar bro I mean hair 1456 01:20:30.399 --> 01:20:32.359 dresser and all the broccoli cook king. 1457 01:20:32.600 --> 01:20:34.760 Hey, y'o yo, you got a little bit of cheese 1458 01:20:34.760 --> 01:20:35.880 to add to that broccoli. 1459 01:20:36.840 --> 01:20:38.520 My brother Paum was on a shadow. 1460 01:20:38.520 --> 01:20:39.039 What's you want? 1461 01:20:39.119 --> 01:20:39.239 Bro? 1462 01:20:39.960 --> 01:20:42.399 I just we know Rouselan is all about that cheddar. 1463 01:20:44.680 --> 01:20:47.720 That's that money, dog, that's that money, bro J Doyer? 1464 01:20:47.760 --> 01:20:51.800 Can you put it to a syllogistic Sylogilly with the 1465 01:20:52.439 --> 01:20:55.520 why Protestantism and Ruthlan and faking. 1466 01:20:55.279 --> 01:21:04.279 Great I can't, bro, I guess I gotta retuire. Yeah, 1467 01:21:04.520 --> 01:21:09.039 what can you explain how using the in word is holy? 1468 01:21:11.520 --> 01:21:12.600 I guess I'm not holy. 1469 01:21:12.800 --> 01:21:15.319 So there we go, exposed. 1470 01:21:15.439 --> 01:21:17.680 Dude, nobody cares about this shit anymore. People don't care 1471 01:21:17.720 --> 01:21:21.399 about the four letter words and grandstanding and pearl clutching 1472 01:21:21.479 --> 01:21:23.960 about all of that. That's just so gay, dude, and 1473 01:21:24.039 --> 01:21:27.840 I don't care anymore. I don't care at a certain point, man, 1474 01:21:27.920 --> 01:21:30.920 after years and people just attack you NonStop over everything. 1475 01:21:31.000 --> 01:21:35.279 And I said, again, this is the same stuff. Remember 1476 01:21:35.319 --> 01:21:40.520 when Sam Shamoun and his buck buddy William Albrick tried 1477 01:21:40.560 --> 01:21:44.039 to get me because somebody went in his chat calling 1478 01:21:44.119 --> 01:21:47.319 scam Shamou a sand inward and they tried to say 1479 01:21:47.359 --> 01:21:50.319 it was me, which is probably them a bunch of snakes, 1480 01:21:50.880 --> 01:21:53.439 just some random ass dude in Streamyard, like I'm on 1481 01:21:53.560 --> 01:21:55.680 stream Yard while I'm on my live stream and I'm 1482 01:21:55.720 --> 01:21:57.560 in I mean, it's just retarded, like I'm not ever 1483 01:21:57.640 --> 01:22:02.920 going on their streams. And meanwhile, then then scam Shamou, 1484 01:22:03.079 --> 01:22:05.359 now he doesn't have a problem saying all these words, right, 1485 01:22:05.880 --> 01:22:09.239 I mean, imagine Sam Shamun trying to call people out 1486 01:22:09.359 --> 01:22:15.199 for words that's crazy. I'm the emperor of Xantheum. I 1487 01:22:15.279 --> 01:22:18.960 have at least twenty four inward passes, which I use 1488 01:22:19.239 --> 01:22:25.680 is very selectively in choice situations. And I don't care 1489 01:22:25.760 --> 01:22:27.199 whether you're like or not. I don't care what you think. 1490 01:22:27.239 --> 01:22:31.239 What's up? Man? Listen? The only way to do media, 1491 01:22:31.560 --> 01:22:33.840 The only way to handle this stuff is to not care. 1492 01:22:34.239 --> 01:22:37.439 You have to not care. You can't hand look at 1493 01:22:37.439 --> 01:22:40.199 what happens when you do freak out, You have a 1494 01:22:40.239 --> 01:22:44.359 meltdown like Rusline. What's up, man, Hey, Jake and Hearn. 1495 01:22:47.159 --> 01:22:51.399 I listened to your debate a long time ago, but 1496 01:22:51.439 --> 01:22:54.880 I listened to it recently again yesterday with erky. 1497 01:22:54.640 --> 01:22:56.439 Bar that you had uh huh. 1498 01:22:56.479 --> 01:22:59.199 And one of the points that you had to keeat 1499 01:22:59.199 --> 01:23:01.279 over and over again because he didn't understand it was 1500 01:23:01.920 --> 01:23:05.159 your rejection of classical foundationalism and how he kept on 1501 01:23:05.239 --> 01:23:09.079 asking you what does he have to point towards in 1502 01:23:09.199 --> 01:23:12.479 history in order to prove like people infallibility or people 1503 01:23:12.600 --> 01:23:18.359 jurisdiction and stuff like that. I guess, how are we 1504 01:23:18.399 --> 01:23:20.239 supposed to look at history? And how do we use 1505 01:23:20.279 --> 01:23:25.319 that coherence type of argmentation to look at historical data? 1506 01:23:27.119 --> 01:23:28.840 That well, the main point The main point of that 1507 01:23:28.920 --> 01:23:32.279 response was, you know, Eric's whole approach was, let me 1508 01:23:32.359 --> 01:23:36.800 stack up all of these supposed evidences for a strong 1509 01:23:37.000 --> 01:23:40.000 papal perspective, and then isn't it likely that this would 1510 01:23:40.039 --> 01:23:42.560 tip over into Vatican one? And I said, I don't 1511 01:23:42.560 --> 01:23:46.239 even grant that, because at a systemic level, if there's 1512 01:23:46.279 --> 01:23:49.359 one dogmatic contradiction that disproves the whole system. So it's 1513 01:23:49.520 --> 01:23:52.880 just an easier, quicker way to go about the apologetics 1514 01:23:52.880 --> 01:23:56.279 because the old way apologetics was done back when, you know, 1515 01:23:56.319 --> 01:23:58.840 it was like the last decade or so of Roman 1516 01:23:58.840 --> 01:24:02.800 Catholics versus protest It was always this quote mind war 1517 01:24:02.920 --> 01:24:05.239 back and forth of well, here's all my quotes that 1518 01:24:05.239 --> 01:24:07.880 the church fathers don't think that it's Peter and Matthew sixteen, 1519 01:24:08.000 --> 01:24:12.119 and here's this over here, the exegesis of this passage. 1520 01:24:12.239 --> 01:24:16.359 And it was just endless throwing quotes back and forth, 1521 01:24:16.399 --> 01:24:19.720 which never gets you anywhere. So how about a quicker way. 1522 01:24:19.840 --> 01:24:22.199 Just like if we're debating an atheist, I'm gonna tear 1523 01:24:22.279 --> 01:24:24.479 the whole foundation out from under them by going after 1524 01:24:24.520 --> 01:24:27.560 the presubpositions and assumptions. I do the same thing with 1525 01:24:27.560 --> 01:24:30.600 the Roman Catholic. If there's one dogmatic contradiction, the entire 1526 01:24:30.720 --> 01:24:34.000 system fails, and they never understand this because they don't 1527 01:24:34.039 --> 01:24:38.520 think systemically. Then once they get it, it clicks. And ironically, 1528 01:24:38.520 --> 01:24:40.880 in that very debate, I think I'm going for a memory, 1529 01:24:40.880 --> 01:24:43.119 but I think Abara said something like, if you could 1530 01:24:43.159 --> 01:24:47.920 show a dogmatic contradiction, I'd have to admit that is false. Well, 1531 01:24:47.920 --> 01:24:50.239 that's what I'm That's the whole point of why we're 1532 01:24:50.239 --> 01:24:53.600 not going to argue. Look, because if you go that approach, 1533 01:24:54.479 --> 01:24:57.319 it never goes anywhere. You're going to be throwing scholars 1534 01:24:57.359 --> 01:24:59.840 back and forth. It's the same debate that's a stupid, 1535 01:24:59.840 --> 01:25:02.800 a debate about who's got the right miracles. It's never 1536 01:25:02.840 --> 01:25:05.279 going to prove anything. The Protestant's going to sit there 1537 01:25:05.319 --> 01:25:08.399 forever and not believe Fatima, and you're gonna sit there 1538 01:25:08.399 --> 01:25:10.600 forever trying to prove Fatima as a miracle, and it's 1539 01:25:10.640 --> 01:25:13.279 not going to go anywhere. So what's really at root 1540 01:25:13.800 --> 01:25:18.800 is our interpretive frameworks about how we understand the world, 1541 01:25:19.000 --> 01:25:22.800 and thus miracles, for example, whether they're even possible is 1542 01:25:22.840 --> 01:25:25.840 determined by your presuppositions. So the whole debate is always 1543 01:25:25.840 --> 01:25:31.680 presuppositional unless you're specifically debating some topic that's more political 1544 01:25:31.880 --> 01:25:34.520 or you know, ethical, like is abortion wrong or something 1545 01:25:34.560 --> 01:25:36.119 like that, But even that's going to probably go back 1546 01:25:36.159 --> 01:25:39.880 to presupposition. So because I was in the Roman Catholic 1547 01:25:39.960 --> 01:25:41.840 system for a long time and I lived it and 1548 01:25:41.880 --> 01:25:45.239 I tried to argue for it, I understand how they think, 1549 01:25:45.319 --> 01:25:49.439 and I've identified the specific mistake, which is foundationalism, and 1550 01:25:49.479 --> 01:25:51.399 they're always going to go back to that, whether it's 1551 01:25:51.439 --> 01:25:54.199 Tomism or whether it's the way they approach apologetics and 1552 01:25:54.239 --> 01:25:58.399 the papacy and stacking up all these evidences supposedly because 1553 01:25:58.399 --> 01:26:00.640 they have a very naive approach. They have a pre 1554 01:26:00.720 --> 01:26:04.720 modern approach to metaphysics, and evidence is in brute facts. Well, 1555 01:26:04.720 --> 01:26:07.560 if there's not brew facts, then that whole thing fails. 1556 01:26:08.119 --> 01:26:11.319 And you'll notice they actually already kind of believe that. 1557 01:26:11.680 --> 01:26:14.359 When it comes to their debates with Protestants about the 1558 01:26:14.399 --> 01:26:18.600 persepecuted scripture, they'll all argue that scripture actually isn't perspicuous. 1559 01:26:18.760 --> 01:26:22.079 Scripture actually has to be interpreted, and sometimes it's very complex, 1560 01:26:22.119 --> 01:26:26.439 it's very difficult and requires systemic level thinking. Oh okay, well, 1561 01:26:26.439 --> 01:26:29.680 then guess what the rest of other things are that way. 1562 01:26:30.000 --> 01:26:32.680 The rest of the worldview is that way. Metaphysics is 1563 01:26:32.720 --> 01:26:37.319 that way, history is that way. There aren't brute facts 1564 01:26:37.359 --> 01:26:38.760 in history that we just all will, I guess we 1565 01:26:38.800 --> 01:26:42.720 all agree that. You know, Council of Constructinople three said this. 1566 01:26:43.439 --> 01:26:45.840 Now everybody's debating the Council of concept a Noble three 1567 01:26:45.840 --> 01:26:50.520 and what it means. There's gigantic decades long, perhaps centuries long. 1568 01:26:50.920 --> 01:26:54.560 Who's that, Martin Jugi. Martin Jugi spent years arguing that 1569 01:26:54.720 --> 01:26:59.640 Constantinople three teaches tomism. It's a prototomistic interpretation of Jesus 1570 01:26:59.640 --> 01:27:05.640 to deny the energies. So again, at every angle, what's 1571 01:27:05.680 --> 01:27:14.479 the root assumption here? Route factuality, evidentialism, and foundationalism. So 1572 01:27:14.680 --> 01:27:17.279 if I undercut all of that, and that was part 1573 01:27:17.319 --> 01:27:19.039 of what the whole Trent Hornaby was about when I 1574 01:27:19.119 --> 01:27:21.880 debated him on natural theology, I'm like, this whole system 1575 01:27:21.920 --> 01:27:25.840 is built on a very naive you know, ancient medieval 1576 01:27:25.920 --> 01:27:29.520 perspective on metaphysics and laws of logic is just givens. 1577 01:27:29.960 --> 01:27:32.359 But we live in a modern world that doesn't grant 1578 01:27:32.399 --> 01:27:35.279 that anymore. So I'm just going to say to Ericabar 1579 01:27:35.399 --> 01:27:39.079 or anybody else, like, why should I build up a 1580 01:27:39.119 --> 01:27:42.760 thousand stacks of evidences? Look at his whole papacy book. 1581 01:27:42.760 --> 01:27:45.319 It's like five hundred boring ass pages trying to build 1582 01:27:45.399 --> 01:27:49.000 up a bunch of evidences when all I need is 1583 01:27:49.039 --> 01:27:52.319 one contradiction in dogma and the whole system is false. 1584 01:27:53.840 --> 01:27:57.119 I don't think they understand systemic thinking, which is ironic 1585 01:27:57.199 --> 01:28:01.039 because they believe in systems like the Tomistics system. But 1586 01:28:01.119 --> 01:28:04.880 the Tomistic system is essentially a foundationalist system. It's built 1587 01:28:04.920 --> 01:28:07.600 on natural theology and a form of foundationalism, and you know, 1588 01:28:07.600 --> 01:28:11.640 Aristilian just sort of givens Well, people don't believe that anymore. 1589 01:28:11.680 --> 01:28:13.760 The whole world has moved on past that, So you're 1590 01:28:13.800 --> 01:28:16.720 gonna need an apologetic that answers the modern world. You 1591 01:28:16.760 --> 01:28:20.439 can't just reassert Tomism as if it's a given. I mean, 1592 01:28:20.479 --> 01:28:27.520 it's this is like, duh, dude, Christ Seeker, what's up? Man? 1593 01:28:31.000 --> 01:28:33.640 I'm you hey? 1594 01:28:33.760 --> 01:28:34.319 Can you hear me? 1595 01:28:36.680 --> 01:28:36.880 Hey? 1596 01:28:37.600 --> 01:28:40.640 Why is Protestantism false in your opinion? 1597 01:28:42.279 --> 01:28:43.960 Well, I'll say what I said to the guy a 1598 01:28:44.000 --> 01:28:47.399 minutor ago. Protestantism is not taught in the New Testament, 1599 01:28:47.439 --> 01:28:49.119 and it's not taught by the people who put the 1600 01:28:49.119 --> 01:28:53.039 New Testament together. Therefore, it's false. 1601 01:28:55.199 --> 01:29:03.039 Did Apostolic succession cease great schism or did that continue 1602 01:29:03.079 --> 01:29:03.680 in the. 1603 01:29:03.520 --> 01:29:04.520 Roman Catholic Church? 1604 01:29:05.880 --> 01:29:07.920 Well, as an Orthodox person, no, we don't believe it 1605 01:29:07.920 --> 01:29:10.000 continued in the Roman Catholic Church. They schismed. 1606 01:29:12.039 --> 01:29:17.159 Oh really, I didn't know that. Huh. 1607 01:29:18.279 --> 01:29:23.279 I mean Apostolic succession presupposes the Apostolic Faith. Rome departed 1608 01:29:23.319 --> 01:29:26.720 on multiple counts from the Apostolic Faith, and the Orthodox 1609 01:29:26.760 --> 01:29:29.520 Church believes that it has Apisolic succession and not Rome. 1610 01:29:33.239 --> 01:29:35.680 Any heresy or schism makes you no longer a part 1611 01:29:35.680 --> 01:29:38.800 of Apostolic succession. Doesn't matter how many hands you had 1612 01:29:38.880 --> 01:29:42.000 laid on you. It's not some mechanical thing like a 1613 01:29:42.079 --> 01:29:44.800 some sort of ritual magic. If you lose the faith, 1614 01:29:44.840 --> 01:29:50.760 then you're not an Apostolic succeed succeed or I see. 1615 01:29:52.640 --> 01:29:59.199 So what allows us to access God's energies? 1616 01:30:00.720 --> 01:30:04.760 God himself? God himself has condescended to be present and 1617 01:30:04.800 --> 01:30:07.439 imminent in the world in various modes. Whether it's the 1618 01:30:07.439 --> 01:30:10.680 incarnation the second person that God had becoming a child, 1619 01:30:11.159 --> 01:30:16.079 growing up defeating death, or whether it's the divine energies 1620 01:30:16.239 --> 01:30:19.359 that are ever present throughout the world. Those are all 1621 01:30:19.439 --> 01:30:22.399 condescensions of God to meet us. As Basil says in 1622 01:30:22.399 --> 01:30:23.520 the letter two thirty four. 1623 01:30:24.960 --> 01:30:31.359 Okay, you answered who, but like what gift does God? 1624 01:30:31.920 --> 01:30:32.039 Oh? 1625 01:30:32.119 --> 01:30:34.319 I mean, I guess you're asking grace? I guess is 1626 01:30:34.359 --> 01:30:39.880 the answer to your question. Grace is the uncreated energies 1627 01:30:39.880 --> 01:30:40.960 that we participate in. 1628 01:30:42.319 --> 01:30:45.119 And what allows us tax has that grace. 1629 01:30:45.760 --> 01:30:48.079 God allows us to I don't understand your question. 1630 01:30:49.760 --> 01:30:50.800 Well with the whole like. 1631 01:30:51.600 --> 01:30:56.640 Faith alone, doctrine and Protestantism, I'm seen it as the 1632 01:30:56.680 --> 01:31:00.640 gift of faith is what allows us to add access 1633 01:31:00.800 --> 01:31:06.119 God's grace, his uncreated love, glory, all of it. 1634 01:31:07.399 --> 01:31:09.880 Yeah, but Jesus says, this is the work of God 1635 01:31:09.920 --> 01:31:11.640 that you believe on him whom he has sent. So 1636 01:31:11.720 --> 01:31:13.840 faith is a work too according to Jesus. 1637 01:31:17.359 --> 01:31:23.680 Faith is a work by Jesus. Is that what Sheesus said, This. 1638 01:31:23.560 --> 01:31:26.439 Is the work of God that you believe in Him 1639 01:31:26.600 --> 01:31:31.279 whom he has sent. Thus faith is also a work 1640 01:31:31.520 --> 01:31:38.760 according to Jesus. Yeah, not of our own, well, not 1641 01:31:38.920 --> 01:31:41.479 of your own in the sense of being only from you. 1642 01:31:41.560 --> 01:31:44.479 But you do work with God at all points. Paul says, 1643 01:31:44.479 --> 01:31:47.000 I'm a co worker with Christ. It is God's power 1644 01:31:47.039 --> 01:31:49.880 at work in me and through me. So that doesn't 1645 01:31:49.920 --> 01:31:51.920 mean that you lose your own will because God is 1646 01:31:51.920 --> 01:31:54.159 at work in you. It's a both and it's ay synergy. 1647 01:31:55.840 --> 01:31:56.079 Right. 1648 01:31:57.720 --> 01:32:03.000 Do you think there's a harmonization between synergism and monogism? 1649 01:32:03.239 --> 01:32:13.159 There? No monarchism is a monothelite heresy literally elaborate on that. Yeah. 1650 01:32:13.199 --> 01:32:17.039 The fifth and sixth Ecumenical Councils ended up producing disputes 1651 01:32:17.079 --> 01:32:21.159 with the Oriental Churches, which led to a debate about 1652 01:32:21.199 --> 01:32:24.439 whether in Christ there's one energy that has to overcome 1653 01:32:24.479 --> 01:32:28.600 and supplant or take over the human will and energy 1654 01:32:28.600 --> 01:32:31.119 in Christ, or whether there's a synergy between the two 1655 01:32:31.159 --> 01:32:34.399 wills at all times. And the Orthodox Church teaches, according 1656 01:32:34.399 --> 01:32:37.880 to the six Secumentical Council that in Christ there's a 1657 01:32:37.920 --> 01:32:41.600 perfect synergy between the natural will and energy in Christ's 1658 01:32:41.640 --> 01:32:44.239 humanity and the natural will and energy in Christ's divinity. 1659 01:32:44.720 --> 01:32:48.680 So that affects our view of anthropology and sateriology to 1660 01:32:48.800 --> 01:32:51.560 mean then that human beings at all points and times 1661 01:32:52.000 --> 01:32:55.159 still have a natural human will and energy proper to 1662 01:32:55.279 --> 01:32:58.720 their nature. That at every point, whether it's beginning to 1663 01:32:58.760 --> 01:33:02.760 believe repenting the whole life of sanctification. All of those 1664 01:33:03.239 --> 01:33:07.640 phases include a human will and energy. 1665 01:33:08.279 --> 01:33:08.720 Gotcha. 1666 01:33:09.359 --> 01:33:13.279 But at the end of the day and humility it's 1667 01:33:13.319 --> 01:33:14.319 all by God. 1668 01:33:14.800 --> 01:33:16.880 That like monarchistic element. 1669 01:33:18.359 --> 01:33:20.319 Where is where? Where is the monogism there? 1670 01:33:23.279 --> 01:33:25.920 Well, it's all God at the end of the day. 1671 01:33:27.800 --> 01:33:28.600 And humility. 1672 01:33:29.960 --> 01:33:44.720 Okay, all right, you win. You're humble. Guapo? What's up? Gapo? 1673 01:33:44.800 --> 01:33:45.279 What's up? 1674 01:33:46.600 --> 01:33:46.960 What up? 1675 01:33:47.000 --> 01:33:47.640 J How are you doing? 1676 01:33:49.439 --> 01:33:51.800 You notice that guy as already asked, Oh, he must 1677 01:33:51.840 --> 01:33:54.239 die or must be a fed because I don't concede 1678 01:33:54.279 --> 01:33:57.760 his moral high ground. It's about the black dude talking 1679 01:33:57.760 --> 01:33:59.079 about the N word. What's up? Man? 1680 01:34:00.479 --> 01:34:00.960 Can you hear me? 1681 01:34:01.000 --> 01:34:01.239 Hello? 1682 01:34:01.720 --> 01:34:02.800 Yeah? 1683 01:34:02.920 --> 01:34:04.840 Well, first of all was I was. 1684 01:34:04.720 --> 01:34:07.479 Inquired about worthotoxy for two years and I recently converted 1685 01:34:07.479 --> 01:34:11.359 this Easter. I wanted to ask you, do you have 1686 01:34:11.399 --> 01:34:15.720 any advice on helping parents convert? Because my mom is 1687 01:34:15.720 --> 01:34:18.359 a non denominational and she really doesn't get the whole 1688 01:34:18.439 --> 01:34:20.680 gist of Orthodoxy even if I were to explain it 1689 01:34:20.720 --> 01:34:20.960 to her. 1690 01:34:22.439 --> 01:34:24.840 I mean, I wouldn't try to debate and explain it 1691 01:34:24.880 --> 01:34:26.600 to my parents. I would try to be a good 1692 01:34:26.600 --> 01:34:30.000 son and become a responsible adult, and that will be 1693 01:34:30.079 --> 01:34:33.199 some of the best type of evidence and argumentation to 1694 01:34:33.359 --> 01:34:36.319 help convince your mom. You're never going to convince your 1695 01:34:36.359 --> 01:34:38.960 your parents by debating them. Don't try it. It's a 1696 01:34:39.000 --> 01:34:41.159 huge mistake I made in my twenties. Don't even waste 1697 01:34:41.159 --> 01:34:43.720 your time trying it. You're going to convert them through 1698 01:34:44.079 --> 01:34:48.199 whether they're proud of you becoming immature adult electric? What's up? 1699 01:34:58.720 --> 01:35:00.600 Have you forgiven on mobile electric? 1700 01:35:00.640 --> 01:35:06.039 I'm you, Hey, Jay, it's an honor. 1701 01:35:06.159 --> 01:35:08.520 Thanks a lot for having the MIC. I've seen your work. 1702 01:35:08.920 --> 01:35:11.640 Super excited to talk to you. Thanks a lot for 1703 01:35:11.720 --> 01:35:18.359 your time. I wanted to ask you a couple of questions. 1704 01:35:19.640 --> 01:35:23.640 What would you advise for someone who has a belief 1705 01:35:23.680 --> 01:35:24.119 in God? 1706 01:35:24.199 --> 01:35:26.359 But how do you cross that bridge to face? 1707 01:35:27.239 --> 01:35:31.039 And what do you think about death and dying and 1708 01:35:31.119 --> 01:35:33.359 like what happens to you in the afterlife? 1709 01:35:37.119 --> 01:35:40.439 I would say, go visit an Orthodox church and experience 1710 01:35:40.479 --> 01:35:44.720 all of that in the first person. And I believe 1711 01:35:44.720 --> 01:35:49.039 that when we die, we have a particular judgment and 1712 01:35:49.039 --> 01:35:51.800 then we have a return of the soul to God 1713 01:35:51.880 --> 01:35:55.239 sometimes called the toll houses, and we don't know the 1714 01:35:55.279 --> 01:35:59.720 specifics of all that. We may kind of be around 1715 01:36:00.479 --> 01:36:04.800 the grave and so forth. His father sur from Rose 1716 01:36:04.800 --> 01:36:08.479 says in his book Soul after Death, Life, the soul 1717 01:36:08.520 --> 01:36:13.520 after death, and then we return to God. So how 1718 01:36:13.920 --> 01:36:16.840 that works out, we don't know the specifics. But and 1719 01:36:16.880 --> 01:36:19.920 then at the resurrection we are all rejoined to our 1720 01:36:19.960 --> 01:36:22.479 bodies at the end of time, at the general resurrection 1721 01:36:22.960 --> 01:36:25.560 for the Great White Throne judgment. So those are the 1722 01:36:25.680 --> 01:36:29.960 and then we enter into the eternal resurrected new heavens 1723 01:36:29.960 --> 01:36:34.439 and new Earth. Or we have rejected God and we 1724 01:36:34.520 --> 01:36:40.359 experience God as torment. Not that God torments people, but 1725 01:36:40.399 --> 01:36:43.760 they God has experienced as torment. Ethan, what's up? 1726 01:36:52.079 --> 01:36:55.359 What's that dogth? 1727 01:36:56.840 --> 01:37:02.560 You owe me a COUCHI suit Ethan? Hey, So I 1728 01:37:02.560 --> 01:37:04.479 have an agnostic and. 1729 01:37:05.840 --> 01:37:11.439 Eastern Orthodox inquiring background, and as fate happened, I also 1730 01:37:11.520 --> 01:37:16.920 inquired at a foreign Baptist church recently made mistake because well, 1731 01:37:16.960 --> 01:37:18.159 maybe not a mistake. 1732 01:37:17.840 --> 01:37:19.760 But once I learned a little bit more. 1733 01:37:19.600 --> 01:37:23.239 About the theology, I was horrified, frankly, and I think 1734 01:37:23.279 --> 01:37:26.159 I've absorbed some of the assumptions of Eastern. 1735 01:37:26.119 --> 01:37:32.159 Theology, which is why I reacted so negatively to reform theology. 1736 01:37:32.279 --> 01:37:35.159 And I was wondering if you could kind of steal 1737 01:37:35.239 --> 01:37:40.239 man A couple of positions and present how that could 1738 01:37:40.239 --> 01:37:44.279 possibly gel with the Gospel and adjust. 1739 01:37:43.920 --> 01:37:48.760 God, namely that God would only elect certain humans and 1740 01:37:49.079 --> 01:37:52.279 not give us proper free will or give us a 1741 01:37:52.319 --> 01:37:55.800 fake free will in which we can't actually choose him 1742 01:37:55.920 --> 01:38:01.439 until He regenerates us through grace. I can't understand how 1743 01:38:02.159 --> 01:38:05.960 these Calvinists can believe that a just God would create 1744 01:38:06.680 --> 01:38:10.399 certain humans just to be condemned, which is the extension 1745 01:38:10.520 --> 01:38:11.159 of that view. 1746 01:38:11.319 --> 01:38:14.199 Yeah, I can tell you how. It's called theological voluntarism, 1747 01:38:14.239 --> 01:38:16.479 and it's one of the sort of attendant ideas to 1748 01:38:16.680 --> 01:38:20.159 absolute divine simplicity. So when I was a Calvinist, the 1749 01:38:20.239 --> 01:38:23.119 reason I thought this was because I just sort of 1750 01:38:23.159 --> 01:38:27.239 defaulted to thinking, well, God is the ultimate creator and 1751 01:38:27.359 --> 01:38:30.279 sovereign being, and so that must mean then that he's 1752 01:38:30.359 --> 01:38:34.840 also the ultimate determiner of what is right and wrong. Right, 1753 01:38:34.960 --> 01:38:37.680 so that would mean that, well, if God did create 1754 01:38:37.720 --> 01:38:40.680 somebody to damn them, you can't say God can't do that, 1755 01:38:40.720 --> 01:38:44.079 because God can do anything that he wants. So because 1756 01:38:44.680 --> 01:38:46.840 I was kind of a without knowing that, you know, 1757 01:38:46.880 --> 01:38:48.399 when I first became a Calvinist, I didn't know what 1758 01:38:48.399 --> 01:38:52.520 theological voluntarism was. I didn't realize that. Well, that's a 1759 01:38:52.520 --> 01:38:54.600 position that's kind of goes back to William of Auckham. 1760 01:38:54.640 --> 01:38:57.119 Even though he wasn't a Calvinist, he had this voluntaristic 1761 01:38:57.119 --> 01:39:00.039 position and Calvindary states it explicitly, which is that but 1762 01:39:00.479 --> 01:39:03.239 God's will is his essence, and this God can will 1763 01:39:03.319 --> 01:39:06.680 whatever he wants. And so there's not a nature that 1764 01:39:06.800 --> 01:39:11.239 corresponds or of the good, or created natures that correspond 1765 01:39:11.319 --> 01:39:16.119 to the divine nature. Right, So, because there's no created 1766 01:39:16.199 --> 01:39:19.600 natures that reflect the divine nature, God's nature thus has 1767 01:39:19.680 --> 01:39:24.319 no things or categories that restrict or bind it, and 1768 01:39:24.359 --> 01:39:26.920 so it has to be completely unbounded. The divine will 1769 01:39:26.960 --> 01:39:30.760 has to be completely unbounded. And that was my presubposition 1770 01:39:30.880 --> 01:39:34.720 about what divine sovereignty had to mean. So, because I 1771 01:39:34.760 --> 01:39:39.880 had that perspective, that under was underlying my readings of 1772 01:39:39.920 --> 01:39:42.039 all the texts. Right, so when I would read Ephesians 1773 01:39:42.079 --> 01:39:45.520 one two, or when I would read Romans nine, or 1774 01:39:45.560 --> 01:39:48.079 you know, various other passages to talk about divine sovereignty, like, 1775 01:39:48.119 --> 01:39:50.760 my assumption is, oh, well, then that must mean that 1776 01:39:51.600 --> 01:39:54.319 you know, the elect are the fixed number of people 1777 01:39:54.319 --> 01:39:56.960 that were chosen forth the foundational world because God's all knowing, right. 1778 01:39:58.199 --> 01:40:00.920 But as you you learn more, and as you get 1779 01:40:00.920 --> 01:40:05.399 a little more sophisticated, I think, with understanding philosophical distinctions 1780 01:40:05.399 --> 01:40:09.079 that end up being pretty necessary for theology, you realize 1781 01:40:09.079 --> 01:40:12.880 that there's some pretty big problems with theological voluntarism, and 1782 01:40:13.000 --> 01:40:15.079 you realize, well, wait a minute, you know what I 1783 01:40:15.119 --> 01:40:18.399 thought was a Reformation debate. They already had this debate 1784 01:40:18.399 --> 01:40:20.439 in the Middle Ages, right, and this was the debate 1785 01:40:20.520 --> 01:40:23.960 over how many angels can dance on the head of 1786 01:40:24.000 --> 01:40:27.520 a pen. That was a real theological debate because it 1787 01:40:27.640 --> 01:40:30.520 related to the question of which I think Aukham raised, 1788 01:40:30.560 --> 01:40:33.680 which was if God wanted to, could he immediately just 1789 01:40:33.800 --> 01:40:36.520 damn all the blessed that are in heaven? And if 1790 01:40:36.560 --> 01:40:38.600 you're a theological voluntariers, you have to say, well, yeah, 1791 01:40:38.640 --> 01:40:42.600 because God's will is the ultimate determiner of good, and 1792 01:40:42.680 --> 01:40:45.119 so God willed too he could actually change what the 1793 01:40:45.159 --> 01:40:48.039 good is. Right, you can begin to see how well 1794 01:40:48.079 --> 01:40:50.000 actually this is moving more than more in the direction 1795 01:40:50.199 --> 01:40:54.680 of like Islam. And then again you get more sophisticated, 1796 01:40:54.720 --> 01:40:57.520 you learn more, you realize, oh, wait a minute, why 1797 01:40:57.560 --> 01:41:02.520 does sovereignty have to mean a absolute divine simplicity level 1798 01:41:02.560 --> 01:41:05.560 position that equates the divine will to the divine essence, 1799 01:41:05.680 --> 01:41:11.399 and thus the divine will becomes an essential determining cause. So, 1800 01:41:11.479 --> 01:41:14.520 for example, it didn't occur to me that God could 1801 01:41:14.560 --> 01:41:22.159 create a world where there are multiple secondary causes, right, 1802 01:41:23.399 --> 01:41:25.720 And if you think I think about Islam, Islam has 1803 01:41:25.720 --> 01:41:29.239 the exact same position with what's called occasionalism. And if 1804 01:41:29.279 --> 01:41:33.920 you're a Calvinist and you're looking into why Calvinism is wrong, 1805 01:41:34.439 --> 01:41:37.119 I highly recommend, at least if you want to approach 1806 01:41:37.119 --> 01:41:39.960 from a philosophical perspective. Our good buddy Lewis over at 1807 01:41:40.800 --> 01:41:45.640 Orthodox Shahada made a very overlooked video that really flew 1808 01:41:45.760 --> 01:41:49.279 under the radar. It was a very I think it's 1809 01:41:49.279 --> 01:41:52.640 because it was so kind of metaphysically oriented that most 1810 01:41:52.640 --> 01:41:59.359 people kind of found it difficult. But I think if 1811 01:41:59.359 --> 01:42:01.439 you have a little bit of philosophical knowledge, it won't 1812 01:42:01.439 --> 01:42:05.039 be too difficult. And it's uh. When we were doing 1813 01:42:05.079 --> 01:42:07.600 a lot of Muslim debates, we were encountering and dealing 1814 01:42:07.680 --> 01:42:19.840 with the sunny argumentation about occasionalism where's it at? And 1815 01:42:19.880 --> 01:42:31.800 it actually ends up being another excellent way to refute Calvinism. 1816 01:42:31.920 --> 01:42:34.079 Am I said, did I misspell occasionalism? I know what's 1817 01:42:34.079 --> 01:42:34.399 on here. 1818 01:42:34.520 --> 01:42:47.560 Let's see. 1819 01:42:48.079 --> 01:42:52.439 So for those that don't know, the classic Sunny position 1820 01:42:52.800 --> 01:43:01.800 is the idea that that God all law cannot allow 1821 01:43:01.880 --> 01:43:06.079 for secondary causes, so there can be creaturely causes. Right, 1822 01:43:06.560 --> 01:43:08.600 So when we say that God is the original cause, 1823 01:43:08.640 --> 01:43:11.039 the first cause, the direct cause, et cetera of the 1824 01:43:11.079 --> 01:43:14.720 creation of the world or whatever. In the Islamic conception, 1825 01:43:16.239 --> 01:43:20.359 they would say that if you allow for secondary causes, 1826 01:43:20.439 --> 01:43:25.600 you're actually detracting from Allah's all powerfulness or his sovereignty. 1827 01:43:26.560 --> 01:43:29.279 And why that is I don't know, Like why could 1828 01:43:29.319 --> 01:43:31.520 it not be? It's just an arbitrary assumption, right, Like 1829 01:43:31.560 --> 01:43:34.960 why could it not be the case that maybe being 1830 01:43:35.079 --> 01:43:39.520 all powerful also includes a being that can create secondary causes, 1831 01:43:39.560 --> 01:43:44.319 you see, So it's just sort of an assumption. Where 1832 01:43:44.399 --> 01:43:49.800 is Lewis's here, It is classical Islam's unusual metaphysics. And 1833 01:43:50.079 --> 01:43:53.000 this is Lewis's excellent documentary. It only got ten thousand 1834 01:43:53.079 --> 01:43:55.119 views and Lewis put like a million hours into this 1835 01:43:56.119 --> 01:44:01.960 poor video. But this also refuse it's calvinism. If you 1836 01:44:02.000 --> 01:44:05.439 watch this video and you understand it, it actually refutes 1837 01:44:05.479 --> 01:44:08.359 Calvinism too. So here we are. We had twenty two 1838 01:44:08.399 --> 01:44:11.279 hundred live and then we dropped to fifteen hundred as 1839 01:44:11.319 --> 01:44:13.840 soon as I started talking about metaphysics. So notice how 1840 01:44:13.880 --> 01:44:17.039 people just flee like the mirror mention of metaphysics. Do 1841 01:44:17.079 --> 01:44:19.479 people just run, dude, They're just run for the hills. 1842 01:44:20.600 --> 01:44:22.640 I don't understand why so many people just have no 1843 01:44:22.720 --> 01:44:27.239 attention span and they're so just freaked out or like 1844 01:44:27.279 --> 01:44:30.039 they're just like you mentioned a philosophical term and your 1845 01:44:30.119 --> 01:44:33.760 your audience literally just immediately cuts in half. It's always 1846 01:44:33.760 --> 01:44:35.920 been that way. It's crazy. You mentioned mention, a book 1847 01:44:36.119 --> 01:44:40.560 mentioned literary analysis. Boom, two thirds are gone. Doe, they 1848 01:44:40.640 --> 01:44:47.600 hit the freaking door. They out this mother, So there 1849 01:44:47.600 --> 01:44:51.239 you go. This refutes Calvinism as well, because these are 1850 01:44:51.239 --> 01:44:57.720 the metaphysical assumptions of Calvinism, absolutely identical to Sunni Islam. 1851 01:44:57.760 --> 01:45:01.520 And I remember when I was to read the Puritans, right, 1852 01:45:01.520 --> 01:45:05.159 I remember reading one time Jonathan Edwards in his sermons 1853 01:45:05.239 --> 01:45:09.000 actually making occasionalist arguments. He said that for God to 1854 01:45:09.039 --> 01:45:13.760 be all powerful, he actually must at every millisecond destroy 1855 01:45:13.840 --> 01:45:18.039 and recreate the world, otherwise there would be other causes, 1856 01:45:19.199 --> 01:45:22.239 and thus God would not be the immediate direct cause. Right, 1857 01:45:22.680 --> 01:45:25.119 So even though Calvinists give, as this guy said when 1858 01:45:25.119 --> 01:45:28.359 he called in a verbal credence to quote free will, 1859 01:45:29.880 --> 01:45:32.159 it's not really free will because it's all still the 1860 01:45:32.239 --> 01:45:35.520 direct divine decree that is the cause of every event. 1861 01:45:35.760 --> 01:45:39.520 Well that's the Muslim position, dude, That's literally the Islamic 1862 01:45:40.000 --> 01:45:44.560 sunny occasionalist position. And it's really absurd if you think 1863 01:45:44.600 --> 01:45:47.920 about it. So it's like, I'm not even the same 1864 01:45:48.079 --> 01:45:52.479 Jay from two seconds ago. Right, And by the way, 1865 01:45:52.520 --> 01:45:55.399 why is it one second or why is it one millisecond? 1866 01:45:55.640 --> 01:45:58.840 I mean, wouldn't it also be every nanosecond? It's just absurd. 1867 01:45:59.000 --> 01:46:02.680 It's like just stupid stuff. And I mean you're not 1868 01:46:02.720 --> 01:46:05.399 even going to find Muslims who even understand this, like 1869 01:46:05.920 --> 01:46:08.359 maybe Jake, Like Jake is probably the only Muslim that 1870 01:46:08.399 --> 01:46:14.920 can even talk about metaphysics. So so yeah, so that 1871 01:46:14.960 --> 01:46:17.680 also works for a few Calvinism and the assumptions that 1872 01:46:17.880 --> 01:46:20.399 underlie the reading of a text. So notice right there, 1873 01:46:20.800 --> 01:46:25.199 you see that texts aren't self interpreting, like Calvinists and 1874 01:46:25.199 --> 01:46:33.159 Protestants think, texts are replete with ambiguity and their theory 1875 01:46:33.239 --> 01:46:37.479 laden and if texts are theory laden, then so are miracles, 1876 01:46:37.760 --> 01:46:42.159 so are evidences. So we need a paradigm, and we 1877 01:46:42.199 --> 01:46:46.000 all have a paradigm through which we interpret the evidence 1878 01:46:46.079 --> 01:46:49.680 is the facts, the texts, the miracles, the events, et cetera. 1879 01:46:51.760 --> 01:46:54.720 Hopefully that's a helpful explanation. And that was my thinking 1880 01:46:54.720 --> 01:46:56.119 when I was a Calvinist. I was like, well, I'm 1881 01:46:56.159 --> 01:46:58.279 just trying to follow the clear meaning of the scriptures. 1882 01:46:59.159 --> 01:47:01.840 And I wanted to say, you know, I may not 1883 01:47:02.159 --> 01:47:04.720 like the idea that God creates people for damnation, but 1884 01:47:04.760 --> 01:47:07.159 who am I to challenge God? Right? And I thought 1885 01:47:07.159 --> 01:47:08.720 that was the line of argument that Paul had in 1886 01:47:08.800 --> 01:47:12.880 Romans nine. But then later on I remember being challenged. 1887 01:47:13.039 --> 01:47:17.640 Even this was even during the when the Presbyterians were, 1888 01:47:17.760 --> 01:47:20.680 when Doug Wilson was first having his sect, when he 1889 01:47:20.720 --> 01:47:24.560 first created his CREC. I was in the Presbyterian circles 1890 01:47:24.600 --> 01:47:29.439 at that time, and the schism happened because Doug Wilson, 1891 01:47:30.039 --> 01:47:31.720 By the way, it wasn't because he was Orthodox, but 1892 01:47:32.199 --> 01:47:36.560 they started posing points that would actually lead eventually lead 1893 01:47:36.560 --> 01:47:38.760 a lot of people into Orthodox here Catholicism. What they 1894 01:47:38.800 --> 01:47:41.399 started saying things, well, wait a minute, Paul's letters and 1895 01:47:41.439 --> 01:47:44.640 Ephesians are not written to the elect They're written to 1896 01:47:44.680 --> 01:47:48.800 an actual visible community at Ephesus. And when that clicked 1897 01:47:48.800 --> 01:47:50.560 with me, I was like, wait a minute, well, that 1898 01:47:50.560 --> 01:47:53.199 would mean he's calling the whole visible community the predestined. 1899 01:47:53.800 --> 01:47:59.359 So then my visible invisible split a Nestorian ecclesiology started 1900 01:47:59.399 --> 01:48:02.680 falling apart. Even way back then when I was listening 1901 01:48:02.720 --> 01:48:06.640 to Doug Wilson and what was called the Auburn Avenue Conference, right, 1902 01:48:07.399 --> 01:48:10.399 a bunch of these Presbyterian OPC and PCA pastors did 1903 01:48:10.399 --> 01:48:13.680 this conference under this I forget the guy's name who 1904 01:48:14.159 --> 01:48:19.159 hosted the conference, but they argued for collective identity of 1905 01:48:19.199 --> 01:48:22.359 the church with those types of texts, and they already 1906 01:48:22.399 --> 01:48:26.000 for paido communion. And this was a huge deal in 1907 01:48:26.039 --> 01:48:31.079 the Presbyterian world because Presbyterianism was so adamant about you know, 1908 01:48:32.319 --> 01:48:35.359 paido baptism but not paido communion, just a really bizarre, 1909 01:48:35.439 --> 01:48:37.880 sort of arbitrary position. And they started challenging that and 1910 01:48:37.960 --> 01:48:39.920 arguing that, hey, maybe there's actually a biblical case for 1911 01:48:40.600 --> 01:48:44.520 paido communion. And then you start saying you start moving 1912 01:48:44.560 --> 01:48:47.079 into thinking, well, wait a minute, if there's a biblical 1913 01:48:47.119 --> 01:48:49.840 case for that, and a historical case. Then is there 1914 01:48:49.880 --> 01:48:53.439 a biblical historical case for baptismal regeneration? You see how 1915 01:48:53.439 --> 01:48:56.800 the dominoes begin to fall. So those were all definitely 1916 01:48:56.840 --> 01:48:59.680 elements that led me out of Calvinism a long time ago, 1917 01:49:00.079 --> 01:49:02.079 and I wasn't ready for Orthodox yet. I just went, 1918 01:49:02.159 --> 01:49:04.800 you know, straight into Rome because I thought, I thought, 1919 01:49:04.840 --> 01:49:06.600 back in two thousand and three, it was just sort 1920 01:49:06.600 --> 01:49:10.039 of you're either Protestant or your Orthodox, I mean, or 1921 01:49:10.079 --> 01:49:12.439 your Catholic. Right, there was that for most people even 1922 01:49:12.479 --> 01:49:16.479 at that time. You know, you had Bonson debating Jerry Madditis, 1923 01:49:16.520 --> 01:49:20.880 you had Scott Hahnd debating James White and Protestant people. 1924 01:49:23.760 --> 01:49:27.199 You had Catholic apologists like Dave Armstrong and whoever else, 1925 01:49:27.960 --> 01:49:29.840 and that was really all there was. Right. Nobody knew 1926 01:49:29.880 --> 01:49:33.880 about Orthodox apologists, you know, Perry Robinson wasn't known yet. 1927 01:49:33.920 --> 01:49:37.439 He was blogging perhaps, but there wasn't a big visible 1928 01:49:37.479 --> 01:49:42.039 presence like there was for the Catholic Protestant debate, which 1929 01:49:42.039 --> 01:49:47.159 had been going on for centuries obviously. So anyway, I'm rambling, 1930 01:49:47.159 --> 01:49:48.479 but Elijah was something. 1931 01:49:52.760 --> 01:49:55.960 Yell, hey, gil uh. 1932 01:49:56.159 --> 01:49:58.279 So I had a I had a question that I 1933 01:49:58.319 --> 01:50:01.439 was really hoping that Paul deacon In and I should 1934 01:50:01.439 --> 01:50:01.960 be on here for. 1935 01:50:01.960 --> 01:50:04.840 A bit, but i'll i'll just shoo shoot the shot. 1936 01:50:04.880 --> 01:50:09.039 Anyways, So is it a dense tag question, because we've 1937 01:50:09.079 --> 01:50:11.560 had several people trying to get like I'm trying to 1938 01:50:11.600 --> 01:50:17.359 do Protestant versus Orthodox mainly here. Is it a tag question? No, 1939 01:50:17.399 --> 01:50:17.680 it's not. 1940 01:50:18.479 --> 01:50:22.039 It's a it's a scism great skills in question. 1941 01:50:22.560 --> 01:50:22.880 Okay. 1942 01:50:25.359 --> 01:50:30.680 So now I'm going to preface my my question with 1943 01:50:31.000 --> 01:50:36.159 saying that I am about the furthest person from an ecumenist. 1944 01:50:36.359 --> 01:50:39.439 Okay, I am like it's the opposite of that. 1945 01:50:39.680 --> 01:50:40.039 Okay. 1946 01:50:40.199 --> 01:50:43.640 But there's one little thing that I'm kind of just 1947 01:50:43.680 --> 01:50:46.720 like wondering about, and I'm kind of confused about, which 1948 01:50:46.760 --> 01:50:50.119 is in the history of the Great Schism, It's it's 1949 01:50:50.159 --> 01:50:57.439 pretty evident that the schism isn't actually like a clean overnight. 1950 01:50:58.119 --> 01:51:00.960 Yeah. I've made this argument for ten years, right, it 1951 01:51:01.039 --> 01:51:03.880 takes a few centuries for this to really like work 1952 01:51:03.920 --> 01:51:05.479 its way out, right. 1953 01:51:06.039 --> 01:51:08.399 So one of the things that I'm you know, one 1954 01:51:08.399 --> 01:51:10.560 of the things I'm kind of saying is that with 1955 01:51:10.640 --> 01:51:15.520 the other patriarchates besides Constantinople, it took even them kind 1956 01:51:15.560 --> 01:51:19.119 of a little bit of time to recognize a schism, 1957 01:51:20.319 --> 01:51:22.920 you know, push away to Rome saying they're not part 1958 01:51:22.920 --> 01:51:23.359 of the church. 1959 01:51:23.439 --> 01:51:27.399 Right, So, so I guess my question is that some of. 1960 01:51:27.319 --> 01:51:35.000 The post schism Roman Catholic saints that are like immediately 1961 01:51:35.119 --> 01:51:38.319 after the schism. I guess I'm just kind of wondering, like, 1962 01:51:39.640 --> 01:51:43.239 is there a reason why even if the other Patriarchids 1963 01:51:43.279 --> 01:51:46.199 are still communion with Rome for a long time after 1964 01:51:46.239 --> 01:51:50.039 that schism, Like, why wouldn't some of those. 1965 01:51:49.960 --> 01:51:52.079 Roman Catholic saints right afterwards not be. 1966 01:51:53.720 --> 01:51:56.159 People that would have some grace or maybe they would 1967 01:51:56.199 --> 01:51:57.399 be recognized as a saint. 1968 01:51:57.600 --> 01:52:00.199 Like I'm just kind of curious on how that would work. 1969 01:52:01.399 --> 01:52:03.000 Yeah, I don't think we don't know. I mean, I 1970 01:52:03.000 --> 01:52:05.159 think the one thing about Orthodoxy is that we're happy 1971 01:52:05.159 --> 01:52:07.199 at times to say, you know, we leave that up 1972 01:52:07.239 --> 01:52:09.960 to God. We don't have to make judgments about every 1973 01:52:10.000 --> 01:52:12.840 single post schism saint. Obviously, I want to hope that 1974 01:52:13.199 --> 01:52:17.199 everybody makes it, you know what I mean. But you 1975 01:52:17.199 --> 01:52:21.439 know there's ambiguity too because we don't exactly know their 1976 01:52:21.479 --> 01:52:25.039 status or how much they did and didn't know. Right. 1977 01:52:25.119 --> 01:52:29.319 So for example, you know, Thomas Beckett, right like was 1978 01:52:29.359 --> 01:52:33.119 Thomas Beckett believing in the double eternal hypostetic procession while 1979 01:52:33.159 --> 01:52:36.000 he was a famous you know, Roman Catholic martyr in England, 1980 01:52:36.720 --> 01:52:39.159 and I think he's post schism. I want to say, 1981 01:52:39.159 --> 01:52:39.399 what is he? 1982 01:52:39.479 --> 01:52:39.520 Like? 1983 01:52:39.560 --> 01:52:43.680 Eleven hundreds? I mean, but maybe we don't have enough 1984 01:52:43.880 --> 01:52:47.640 writings to know did he one h a percent understand 1985 01:52:47.720 --> 01:52:51.039 or even know what the Council b Lion said. So 1986 01:52:51.760 --> 01:52:55.760 that's why many cases it's just sort of ambergurity, as 1987 01:52:55.920 --> 01:52:58.520 jesse Lei Peterson was saying, I mean to me, that 1988 01:52:58.560 --> 01:53:04.479 makes sense, right, It's like for us, like you know, 1989 01:53:04.520 --> 01:53:09.000 there was that ambigurity period where Saint Isaac the Syrian 1990 01:53:09.800 --> 01:53:13.319 his group ended up being in communion with the Orthodox 1991 01:53:13.920 --> 01:53:17.520 Church at that certain point, and thus we can say 1992 01:53:17.560 --> 01:53:21.079 he was a saint. But you know, unless there's like 1993 01:53:21.720 --> 01:53:25.079 some sort of like explicit evidence where okay, well they're 1994 01:53:25.079 --> 01:53:29.359 actually saying And there's another point to make too. When 1995 01:53:29.399 --> 01:53:31.439 all the Coptics got mad at me because I was 1996 01:53:31.479 --> 01:53:34.119 saying that we can't add their martyrs to our calendar, 1997 01:53:34.159 --> 01:53:37.399 It's like we're not saying that God can't you know, 1998 01:53:37.479 --> 01:53:39.399 extend grace to them and make them part of the 1999 01:53:39.439 --> 01:53:41.840 mystical body. We don't know that. In fact, I hope 2000 01:53:41.840 --> 01:53:43.880 that he does. I hope that all those people are 2001 01:53:43.920 --> 01:53:46.840 in heaven. We don't want anybody to be damned. But 2002 01:53:46.880 --> 01:53:48.319 it doesn't mean that we have to accept them in 2003 01:53:48.359 --> 01:53:51.199 the calendar, right, And that's I think the confusion here 2004 01:53:51.239 --> 01:53:53.760 is that people leave this element out and they just 2005 01:53:53.840 --> 01:53:57.720 assume that, oh, well, you know, you got to say 2006 01:53:57.720 --> 01:54:00.119 that the Coptic martyrs are saints. Well, saint for us 2007 01:54:00.279 --> 01:54:02.359 means that they're going to be in the calendar. And 2008 01:54:02.399 --> 01:54:04.640 that's not something that we want to extend to everybody, 2009 01:54:04.680 --> 01:54:08.279 and we don't want to have, you know, angles by 2010 01:54:08.279 --> 01:54:12.600 which people could exploit this for acumenism. So hopefully that 2011 01:54:12.720 --> 01:54:16.239 makes sense. But I think when you read the literature, 2012 01:54:16.279 --> 01:54:23.760 for example, about the the course of the debate from 2013 01:54:23.800 --> 01:54:26.159 the time of say Maximus all the way up to Florence, 2014 01:54:26.439 --> 01:54:31.119 that's like almost that's eight hundred years of figuring out, Okay, 2015 01:54:31.119 --> 01:54:33.920 what do you guys mean, Well, here's what we mean, right, so, 2016 01:54:34.560 --> 01:54:37.520 and it doesn't get dogmatized in the West until Lyons 2017 01:54:37.560 --> 01:54:41.239 in Florence. So I'm happy to extend as much a 2018 01:54:41.359 --> 01:54:45.079 charity throughout that period. So let's say, when was so 2019 01:54:45.279 --> 01:54:51.760 Thomas Beckett was martyred like a century after the schism right, 2020 01:54:52.600 --> 01:54:56.560 and he died before even the council Lions, So you know, 2021 01:54:58.039 --> 01:55:00.399 and I would say even if he was recy a 2022 01:55:00.960 --> 01:55:05.840 Phillyoquay Creed, you know, the same Aximus says, there's ambiguity 2023 01:55:05.840 --> 01:55:07.479 in what they mean by that. Now, I think it's 2024 01:55:07.520 --> 01:55:12.000 wrong to recite a Philioquay Creed. But do we have 2025 01:55:12.079 --> 01:55:14.720 to say that this guy didn't give his life for Christ. No, 2026 01:55:14.800 --> 01:55:20.039 because there's no explicit, identifiable means by which we can say, Okay, 2027 01:55:20.079 --> 01:55:23.319 this guy was actually a heretic. Right, unless there is 2028 01:55:23.319 --> 01:55:25.520 some unknown treatise that I don't know about where Thomas 2029 01:55:25.560 --> 01:55:30.439 Beckett is defending, you know, the phillyoquay or so maybe 2030 01:55:30.439 --> 01:55:32.319 there is. I don't know, but I'm just giving an 2031 01:55:32.359 --> 01:55:36.439 example from somebody that pops into my head. So but 2032 01:55:36.920 --> 01:55:39.239 I could be wrong about that. I'm not a I'm 2033 01:55:39.279 --> 01:55:41.680 not an expert in this period of the twelfth century. 2034 01:55:41.760 --> 01:55:43.319 So Kevin, what's something? Man? 2035 01:55:52.000 --> 01:55:52.560 All right? Dad? 2036 01:55:52.920 --> 01:55:53.359 That work? 2037 01:55:53.439 --> 01:55:56.800 I just have myself, ag did you have a question. 2038 01:55:58.319 --> 01:56:02.399 I just want to respond to the guy who asked 2039 01:56:02.399 --> 01:56:04.920 about the cannon question, who said he was going to 2040 01:56:05.079 --> 01:56:06.319 debate protest. 2041 01:56:06.399 --> 01:56:07.880 That is a great I learned. 2042 01:56:07.640 --> 01:56:09.640 A lot from you on that one, though, promise it 2043 01:56:09.840 --> 01:56:11.720 has been able to answer. 2044 01:56:11.399 --> 01:56:15.079 That for me yet, like how do we know you 2045 01:56:15.119 --> 01:56:18.000 know who wrote the books or who gave us the cannon? 2046 01:56:18.479 --> 01:56:21.479 But I also thoroughly agree with what you said about 2047 01:56:21.520 --> 01:56:22.560 not debating. 2048 01:56:22.159 --> 01:56:25.479 Your parents because my dad were a non denom. 2049 01:56:25.359 --> 01:56:28.279 Pastor and I've tried it to and dude, it's just yeah, 2050 01:56:28.399 --> 01:56:31.560 at least, uh, just terrible stuff in the family and 2051 01:56:31.640 --> 01:56:33.319 it's not what Christ wants. 2052 01:56:33.319 --> 01:56:35.479 I don't think no, and your parents, You're never going 2053 01:56:35.520 --> 01:56:37.640 to convert your family members that way. They're the people 2054 01:56:37.640 --> 01:56:40.000 that cleaned your diapers up. They're not going to listen 2055 01:56:40.039 --> 01:56:44.039 to your theological you know, gibbering and jabbering for hours. 2056 01:56:44.079 --> 01:56:45.760 They don't. They don't care about that. Toby, what's up? 2057 01:56:46.319 --> 01:56:46.479 Uh? 2058 01:56:47.000 --> 01:56:50.199 I would say there are some, you know, exceptions to 2059 01:56:50.239 --> 01:56:53.720 that rule. I mean, if they ask you specifically, hold 2060 01:56:53.720 --> 01:56:57.199 on a second, If your parents ask you specifically, you know, hey, 2061 01:56:57.279 --> 01:56:59.960 what is the theological understanding the Orthodox Church on the filial? 2062 01:57:00.560 --> 01:57:02.520 Then yeah, you got to answer them when you shouldn't 2063 01:57:02.520 --> 01:57:05.039 give give an answer. But you know, just don't debate 2064 01:57:05.079 --> 01:57:07.119 your parents. Don't try to get everybody at you know, 2065 01:57:07.439 --> 01:57:11.439 Thanksgiving dinner, you know, arguing over essence, inergy station or 2066 01:57:11.479 --> 01:57:12.239 something like that. What's that? 2067 01:57:12.399 --> 01:57:14.279 Man? Hi, how are you? 2068 01:57:15.760 --> 01:57:16.560 I'm Golod, what's up? 2069 01:57:17.439 --> 01:57:17.520 Uh? 2070 01:57:17.720 --> 01:57:17.920 Yeah? 2071 01:57:18.000 --> 01:57:23.479 My question is so I'm a like just inquiring into 2072 01:57:23.520 --> 01:57:28.520 Catholicism and Orthodoxy. And my question was I'm slightly leading 2073 01:57:28.560 --> 01:57:33.000 towards Orthodoxy and I was just wondering what is probably 2074 01:57:33.039 --> 01:57:36.079 the best church father to go through straightaway to read 2075 01:57:36.359 --> 01:57:40.680 to become more knowledgeable about Orthodoxy. 2076 01:57:42.920 --> 01:57:45.079 Well, I think one of the best routes you could 2077 01:57:45.079 --> 01:57:49.520 take patristically is to read the Cappadocians, and you'll see 2078 01:57:49.640 --> 01:57:54.359 that it's very different from what you get in Augustine. So, uh, 2079 01:57:55.479 --> 01:57:57.720 the capital and the reason the capp Dotions matter so 2080 01:57:57.840 --> 01:58:01.560 much is that for the Orthodox we hold an ecumenical 2081 01:58:01.560 --> 01:58:06.600 council above any individual church father. Right, So as Augustin, 2082 01:58:06.680 --> 01:58:09.079 as good as he was, like, if his theology is 2083 01:58:09.079 --> 01:58:12.720 not accepted at the ecumenical council that defines the Trinity, 2084 01:58:13.199 --> 01:58:14.920 then he's not going to have the same status for 2085 01:58:15.000 --> 01:58:18.520 us as the Cappadocians would. So if Cappadocian theology is 2086 01:58:18.560 --> 01:58:22.479 accepted at Constantinople one and It is then clearly Basil 2087 01:58:22.520 --> 01:58:25.199 in the Holy Spirit, the theological orations of Saint Gregory 2088 01:58:25.439 --> 01:58:29.680 nazian Zeus and Saint Gregorissa's of various rieties, particularly you know, 2089 01:58:29.800 --> 01:58:31.600 against Eunomius. But I'm not going to tell you to 2090 01:58:31.640 --> 01:58:33.479 read Against Eunomius because it's going to be one of 2091 01:58:33.479 --> 01:58:35.920 the most difficult books that you'll read. I would say 2092 01:58:35.920 --> 01:58:39.680 focus on Basil and the Holy Spirit, Basils against Eunomius 2093 01:58:40.199 --> 01:58:43.079 and Sant Gregor not sianzras Is theological Orations, because they 2094 01:58:43.119 --> 01:58:48.159 will give you the best introduction to the Orthodox Catholic 2095 01:58:48.199 --> 01:58:51.520 mindset on the Trinity and the hyposthetic property, the Father 2096 01:58:51.560 --> 01:58:54.239 being the sole cause, all of which is really just 2097 01:58:54.920 --> 01:58:58.680 very different from the speculative ideas that Augustin comes up 2098 01:58:58.720 --> 01:59:01.960 with from Neo Plaianism and from Plotinus's and neod It's 2099 01:59:01.960 --> 01:59:04.319 about how to try to defend phillyoquay and that kind 2100 01:59:04.359 --> 01:59:07.560 of stuff. So and again, people who are the Latinizers 2101 01:59:07.600 --> 01:59:10.079 like they act like the latinizing is just this issue 2102 01:59:10.079 --> 01:59:13.239 that deals with like psa or something latinizing. It also 2103 01:59:13.399 --> 01:59:19.840 includes things like Augustine literally cribbing multiple sections of the 2104 01:59:19.880 --> 01:59:24.079 fourth or fifth in ead to prove the phillyoquay. So 2105 01:59:24.119 --> 01:59:27.840 it's like they don't even realize how deep that that goes. 2106 01:59:28.000 --> 01:59:30.000 And that's just not part of what we do, Like 2107 01:59:30.079 --> 01:59:32.960 we're not into that. And Augustin himself said he would 2108 01:59:32.960 --> 01:59:36.399 submit his book to the judgment of the Universal Church. 2109 01:59:36.520 --> 01:59:37.760 By the way, he didn't say I'm going to send 2110 01:59:37.800 --> 01:59:40.239 it to Rome, because Rome is the final arbiter. He said, 2111 01:59:40.279 --> 01:59:43.279 the Universal Church can decide, and the Universal Church said, 2112 01:59:43.319 --> 01:59:47.079 we affirm the Cappudocian teaching. So there you and the 2113 01:59:47.119 --> 01:59:50.800 Cappudocan teaching is clearly not the same as the Augustinian teaching. 2114 01:59:51.760 --> 01:59:53.960 You don't have to go very far in on the 2115 01:59:54.000 --> 01:59:58.920 Trinity and the Cappadocians to see that. Well, Emmanuel says, 2116 01:59:58.960 --> 02:00:01.840 this may not be hambergurity, but it might cover it. 2117 02:00:02.079 --> 02:00:07.680 Thank you. He sends fifty Mexican pesos for ambiguity, Anthony 2118 02:00:07.760 --> 02:00:13.159 or something. I thought it was like three in the morning. 2119 02:00:13.159 --> 02:00:17.199 It's only midnight, so we're doing good. What's up man, Hey. 2120 02:00:17.159 --> 02:00:19.680 Jay, thanks for posting this. 2121 02:00:21.039 --> 02:00:28.119 Kurt Kurt Mormon inquiring into Orthodoxy, Good and Divine Liturgy, 2122 02:00:29.159 --> 02:00:33.439 pamful of Times, and a couple of services during Holy Week, 2123 02:00:35.960 --> 02:00:37.600 So well, one. 2124 02:00:38.039 --> 02:00:43.000 I just love your your prayers and prayers from your community. 2125 02:00:43.159 --> 02:00:45.079 I got a wife and five kids that are all 2126 02:00:45.199 --> 02:00:48.680 very very Mormon still and not interested at all. 2127 02:00:49.159 --> 02:00:51.119 Uh and uh, you. 2128 02:00:51.079 --> 02:00:53.479 Know and exploring anything outside of it. 2129 02:00:54.720 --> 02:00:57.119 And UH for me right now, what. 2130 02:00:57.119 --> 02:01:00.439 I'm struggling with because you know, coming from the paradigm 2131 02:01:00.439 --> 02:01:04.880 of Mormonism and praying about you know what's true and 2132 02:01:04.920 --> 02:01:08.079 getting the indigestion and you know, burning the bosom and 2133 02:01:08.439 --> 02:01:12.119 you know that being the confirmation, all the confirmation you 2134 02:01:12.159 --> 02:01:18.760 need to know something is true. As I study Orthodoxy 2135 02:01:19.000 --> 02:01:24.079 and attend, I'm really really skeptical of my feelings. I've 2136 02:01:24.159 --> 02:01:27.000 kind of gone, you know, almost a complete other direction 2137 02:01:27.119 --> 02:01:30.880 where I'm so afraid of preless that I don't I 2138 02:01:30.920 --> 02:01:33.000 don't want to trust that you know, I'm having a 2139 02:01:33.039 --> 02:01:36.720 good experience or I'm feeling peaceful here because I don't 2140 02:01:36.760 --> 02:01:39.159 want to be deceived by by any of those feelings. 2141 02:01:39.239 --> 02:01:43.239 So how what what advice can you give me on 2142 02:01:43.680 --> 02:01:47.760 council that how to guess how to navigate that? And 2143 02:01:49.720 --> 02:01:51.720 you know, I'm not necessarily looking for how do I 2144 02:01:51.760 --> 02:01:54.960 know it's true? I think that probably just maybe comes 2145 02:01:55.000 --> 02:01:59.159 to me over a long experience and you know, going 2146 02:01:59.199 --> 02:02:01.439 to divine edery and doing more study. 2147 02:02:01.560 --> 02:02:05.800 But how do I not shut off? 2148 02:02:05.920 --> 02:02:09.720 I guess those good you know, feelings and things that 2149 02:02:09.800 --> 02:02:13.199 might be coming from from God versus you know. 2150 02:02:14.800 --> 02:02:18.760 Yeah, yeah, I think again, like the experience. You just 2151 02:02:18.800 --> 02:02:22.560 have to judge the feelings and the experiences by the 2152 02:02:22.680 --> 02:02:27.720 Orthodox theological tradition and also in concert with your spiritual father. Right, 2153 02:02:27.760 --> 02:02:29.840 So when you've got Orthodox, you'll have a person that 2154 02:02:29.880 --> 02:02:32.479 will be kind of like the person that you bounce 2155 02:02:32.520 --> 02:02:33.760 those kinds of questions off. 2156 02:02:33.880 --> 02:02:34.039 Right. 2157 02:02:34.079 --> 02:02:35.800 So if you feel like, oh, you know, I had 2158 02:02:35.840 --> 02:02:37.880 this dream and I feel like God's moved me to 2159 02:02:37.920 --> 02:02:41.279 do this, and that you'll bounce that off of other people. 2160 02:02:41.920 --> 02:02:44.520 And you know, Orthodoxy has those checks and balances at 2161 02:02:44.520 --> 02:02:48.560 the firewall, which you know, like these evangelical charismatic sects 2162 02:02:48.560 --> 02:02:50.680 and groups they don't have that. So they're very very 2163 02:02:50.760 --> 02:02:54.439 much prime, uh you know, candidates for the creation of 2164 02:02:54.520 --> 02:02:57.760 cults because people start thinking like, you know, and Lee 2165 02:02:57.800 --> 02:02:59.920 does that, Oh, Jesus and Mary are talking to me, 2166 02:03:00.039 --> 02:03:02.640 and I'm actually the new Mary because I had this 2167 02:03:02.840 --> 02:03:05.039 vision in the infirmary and all this kind of stuff, 2168 02:03:05.039 --> 02:03:09.399 and I'm the new female savior. Feminist Jesus and all 2169 02:03:09.399 --> 02:03:12.640 this insanity. Right, that's all an extreme example of her delusions. 2170 02:03:12.640 --> 02:03:16.199 But it's exactly what I'm saying. It's like, there's no 2171 02:03:16.439 --> 02:03:20.640 guard rails for that type of an attitude. And even 2172 02:03:20.680 --> 02:03:24.439 though she's an extreme version of the charismatic stuff, it's 2173 02:03:24.479 --> 02:03:26.680 a it's a it's the point is it still stands. 2174 02:03:26.760 --> 02:03:26.840 Right. 2175 02:03:26.920 --> 02:03:29.600 It's like in Mormonism, people forget Mormonism is also a 2176 02:03:29.680 --> 02:03:33.920 charismatic faith that they believe in ongoing public revelation. Some 2177 02:03:33.960 --> 02:03:37.880 of the Mormon schisms and sex believe in like glossalalia 2178 02:03:38.000 --> 02:03:43.720 and and new interpreting of tongues and all kinds of nonsense. 2179 02:03:43.880 --> 02:03:48.760 So so I think if as long as you're bouncing 2180 02:03:48.760 --> 02:03:51.319 it off of your spiritual Father and you're within the 2181 02:03:51.840 --> 02:03:56.399 the guard rails that are established, you don't have to 2182 02:03:56.439 --> 02:04:00.319 worry about you know, I'm not going to be sieved 2183 02:04:00.399 --> 02:04:04.000 or something like that, Right, I think I think we're 2184 02:04:04.039 --> 02:04:04.800 the most sort of