Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to the show. I'm Martin Willis, your host,
Speaker 1: and we have a great show for you this evening.
Speaker 1: I met our guest, Scott Guerin, out at Contact in
Speaker 1: the Desert, and he was hanging out with a future
Speaker 1: guest coming up, Jeff Nucicelli, who will be coming up sometime,
Speaker 1: I believe it's the first or second week in October.
Speaker 1: That'll be another great show. Tonight's guest has a book
Speaker 1: that's called Hiding in Plain Sight, and it's a book
Speaker 1: about Objects that he's seen in the upper atmosphere and
Speaker 1: has documented and filmed and taken pictures of. And so
Speaker 1: just a couple of things upcoming here. Next week, I
Speaker 1: have Rich Hoffman on Tuesday. But this coming Thursday, I
Speaker 1: do have a show and it's going to be Grant Lovick.
Speaker 1: It's going to be on at the regular time, Thursday
Speaker 1: at 8 p.m. However, I'm not sure if I'm going
Speaker 1: to be available or not. I'm going to be on
Speaker 1: a plane, I do believe, at that time. and heading
Speaker 1: to the MUFON symposium. And so if you happen to
Speaker 1: be out there, please do look me up. All you
Speaker 1: have to do is reach out to me through my website, podcastufo.com.
Speaker 1: There's a contact form right there. And while you're over there,
Speaker 1: check out the blog. We have blogs every week. And
Speaker 1: this week is another great one from our longtime blogger,
Speaker 1: Charles Lear. And that's called UFO Landing Reports and Unique.
Speaker 1: Trace Evidence in Ontario, Canada. So make sure you check
Speaker 1: that out. And while you're over there, if you want
Speaker 1: an ad-free experience, there's a couple of ways you can
Speaker 1: do that. You can watch the show live, always here
Speaker 1: on YouTube, Facebook, and Twitter. And you can also go
Speaker 1: over to Patreon and just for $ 2 or more a month,
Speaker 1: you can get an ad-free experience for audio on any
Speaker 1: audio player. They have a full setup for that over there.
Speaker 1: So I do hope to see some people at the
Speaker 1: MUFON event coming right up. And then we'll be back
Speaker 1: and at it. We have some great guests coming up.
Speaker 1: I know that I do believe that next Thursday will
Speaker 1: be Philip Mantle. He's always a he's a British longtime
Speaker 1: UFO researcher. And I think I've had him on the
Speaker 1: show for almost 14 years, something like that off and on.
Speaker 1: And so, yeah, check that out next Thursday. That'll be
Speaker 1: right here. on wherever you are watching live, or it
Speaker 1: will be an audio podcast as well. So time to
Speaker 1: bring in my guest. Scott, welcome.
Speaker 2: Hey, Martin. Glad to be here.
Speaker 1: Glad to have you. And it was really, was that
Speaker 1: your first time at Contact in the Desert? Yes. Yeah.
Speaker 1: What a fun event that is, isn't it?
Speaker 2: That was a great time. I'm looking forward to the
Speaker 2: next one.
Speaker 1: Yeah, me too. I know this is That was my
Speaker 1: second one. And I just plan on going every single year.
Speaker 1: I was just, I don't want to miss it. But yeah,
Speaker 1: Nick Pope, who we lost months ago, used to call
Speaker 1: that the burning man of UFOs. I thought that was
Speaker 1: well put. And not really that far from there.
Speaker 2: Good description.
Speaker 1: And so at some point I want to talk to
Speaker 1: you because I had mentioned as I was announcing you
Speaker 1: upcoming on my show that you also had quite an
Speaker 1: experience where you fell out of the sky, basically over
Speaker 1: 3000 feet. And here you are, you're still here today.
Speaker 1: That's quite a miracle. But we'll talk about that a
Speaker 1: little bit later on. So how did you get interested
Speaker 1: in the UFO topic to begin with?
Speaker 2: I guess as far as the topic itself, certainly a
Speaker 2: wide area to that and began probably in childhood with
Speaker 2: television shows from Lost in Space, Star Trek, My Favorite Martian,
Speaker 2: I Dream of Jeannie, all those things that kind of
Speaker 2: alluded to extraterrestrial or outer space. And then there were
Speaker 2: reports now and then about the UFO being sighted. And
Speaker 2: so there was always a little bit of interest that way,
Speaker 2: and then the, just the idea that it was always
Speaker 2: possible just because of the indoctrination through, through the TV
Speaker 2: shows that were there. Over the years, I didn't always
Speaker 2: think about it, busy with life, busy with, once I
Speaker 2: got older, working, and then later in, in the Air Force,
Speaker 2: and I had certainly an interest in things that I
Speaker 2: saw in the air, and always paying attention, thinking that
Speaker 2: maybe someday I'll see something. A few years later, the
Speaker 2: shows come out with ancient aliens and things like that
Speaker 2: and unsolved mysteries and really more interest when those type
Speaker 2: of things would come on. And then at a time
Speaker 2: when I was working overseas with talking to one of
Speaker 2: my friends and we'd talk about the different things that
Speaker 2: were shown and I'd always say, man, nobody ever gets
Speaker 2: a good picture. Everything's always blurry. And I was like,
Speaker 2: one of these days I'm going to get I'm going
Speaker 2: to see something. I'm going to get pictures. I always,
Speaker 2: from then on, I always kept the cameras with me
Speaker 2: just about probably 98, 99% of the time. It was
Speaker 2: always sometimes when I couldn't have it for different reasons, but,
Speaker 2: and then I had it with me when I was
Speaker 2: in Panama city beach, Florida, and saw something that I
Speaker 2: didn't know what it was. I couldn't identify it as
Speaker 2: a normal aircraft or helicopter and, Something weird that I thought.
Speaker 2: And so I started taking pictures. And that's later after
Speaker 2: different attempts to find out what it was through different
Speaker 2: UFO organizations. And I'm going to publish a book with
Speaker 2: it and see where it goes from there and share
Speaker 2: my story that way.
Speaker 1: And how's that gone for you? How's the book? Has
Speaker 1: the book been well-received?
Speaker 2: I think it's been well-received. I've had a lot of
Speaker 2: people that have spoken to me one-on-one since the book
Speaker 2: and said, hey, I saw this and I didn't know
Speaker 2: what it was. I never told anybody. People, I saw something.
Speaker 2: It's a range. Some people talk about they saw something
Speaker 2: come out of the water. They didn't know what it was.
Speaker 2: Other people talk about seeing something in the air. As
Speaker 2: far as reception that way, people that have spoken to
Speaker 2: me they liked it i'm sure not everybody does and
Speaker 2: as far as i say how it's been receptive in
Speaker 2: sales i wouldn't say it's a blockbuster or anything like
Speaker 2: that but it keeps plugging along.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah what's up it's hard to get first of
Speaker 1: all to capture anything and for you just to have
Speaker 1: done that a few times i think is really something
Speaker 1: because i have to tell you when i had I
Speaker 1: didn't have a situation like you where I would think
Speaker 1: that I would, I'm that way now. I could grab
Speaker 1: my phone out of my pocket and film something quickly.
Speaker 1: But when I had my first, when I had my
Speaker 1: UFO sighting at first in 2007, if I had a
Speaker 1: phone next to me, of course they didn't have that
Speaker 1: ability at that time, or much of an ability for pictures.
Speaker 1: But if I had a camera next to me, I
Speaker 1: would not have thought to pick it up and film
Speaker 1: or take pictures. I just, Just it wouldn't occur to
Speaker 1: me because I was in the moment. What is this thing?
Speaker 1: That type of thing.
Speaker 2: So I get it. Yeah. So in that sense, I
Speaker 2: did when I first saw it and looked at it.
Speaker 2: It's not an aircraft. It's not a helicopter. I had
Speaker 2: my phone right there and was quick to get it
Speaker 2: and take pictures and video. And I did that probably
Speaker 2: snapped off probably about 30 pictures right away with that.
Speaker 2: And then I set it down and then I picked
Speaker 2: up like, a regular camera, 35 millimeter camera with a
Speaker 2: zoom lens and started taking pictures. Cause I had that
Speaker 2: with me as well. And that, when I say keep
Speaker 2: my camera with me, that's what I'm talking about. Not
Speaker 2: just my phone. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And the phones today are much better. The newer phones
Speaker 1: that will actually zoom because the old phones, when you'd zoom,
Speaker 1: it would be all distorted and you just couldn't get it.
Speaker 1: But the new ones are, they're much more capable of
Speaker 1: doing that. But yeah, to have a real good camera
Speaker 1: with you with a zoom lens, that makes a difference.
Speaker 1: So I actually have some of those pictures up and
Speaker 1: I had grouped some of them together just to show
Speaker 1: our audience. And also, if you're listening to this audio,
Speaker 1: I will have the images in the show notes. All
Speaker 1: you have to do is click the show notes that
Speaker 1: are inside of the right inside the text of this show.
Speaker 1: So this one is I do believe this one was.
Speaker 1: One you have on your book, right? This particular one? Yes.
Speaker 1: And I wasn't sure if you were able to see
Speaker 1: that or not, but now on these, these pictures here,
Speaker 1: what are these two that we're looking at right here?
Speaker 2: To tell you exactly what it is. I don't know
Speaker 2: what it is. So I know you've taken them out
Speaker 2: of sequence there a little bit. I don't know what
Speaker 2: the one on the left is from a 1012. So
Speaker 2: that is a section of it that looks like it's
Speaker 2: an eye. of the craft. There's one on each side
Speaker 2: of it. And when I used a filter on it,
Speaker 2: I was able to see different areas in the object.
Speaker 2: And this is one of them that came out that
Speaker 2: just looked very odd to me. It could be natural
Speaker 2: or it could be something that was machined. I'm sorry.
Speaker 2: Sorry about that. That's all right. Yep. Put it on
Speaker 2: do not disturb, but that doesn't matter. I guess some
Speaker 2: people are still going to come through, but I just
Speaker 2: thought that was odd in there. It looks, it's very
Speaker 2: weird in the section of it where I say it
Speaker 2: looks like an eye. The other picture that you had
Speaker 2: up was that object 112 that changed the Very distracting.
Speaker 2: It changed into, it went from that object 112, so
Speaker 2: that next picture of the team. And so it's doing
Speaker 2: some type of change. I don't know what it's doing
Speaker 2: other than to say it's transforming itself like a metamorphosis.
Speaker 2: I don't know exactly what it is, what it's doing.
Speaker 2: And then after that circular shot, Then it came out,
Speaker 2: and a few seconds later, back into a shape that
Speaker 2: was very similar to the one it started in. Okay.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry I have these out of sequence. I'm just
Speaker 1: looking to see if I can find the original.
Speaker 2: That's okay. Those are more in sequence than I thought.
Speaker 2: Just to see that one section of it threw me
Speaker 2: for a section versus the whole picture. That was good.
Speaker 1: I see. Okay. All right. And were these taken, you
Speaker 1: said 2000, did you say 2012? 2012. What are the
Speaker 1: spans of all these pictures that you've taken?
Speaker 2: These were taken in 2019.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 2: And the span is about a three-hour section of time
Speaker 2: over the course of three hours. They're all in sequence
Speaker 2: of that three-hour time that I was able to see it.
Speaker 1: Oh, I got it. I got it. And the video
Speaker 1: as well?
Speaker 2: Yes.
Speaker 1: Oh, so this was all one sighting? Yep. Okay, but
Speaker 1: this is what's really strange is when I put up
Speaker 1: these pictures, these were part of it as well? Yes.
Speaker 2: Oh, wow.
Speaker 1: That is weird how it could have changed as much
Speaker 1: as it did. And how about this one right here?
Speaker 1: Is this, this is showing, and I was wondering if you,
Speaker 1: if it was just filters that you used to see this?
Speaker 2: Yes. I think that is picture 1065. When I took
Speaker 2: the picture, I could see the object with my glasses
Speaker 2: I was wearing. But sometimes when I was not wearing
Speaker 2: the glasses, I could not see it. So I was
Speaker 2: wearing the glasses, which I should have probably put them
Speaker 2: in front of the lens of the camera. But wearing
Speaker 2: the glasses, I could see it through the lens finder
Speaker 2: and I took a picture. When I downloaded the pictures,
Speaker 2: all it showed was a blue sky. I knew that
Speaker 2: I had taken a picture of the object, so I
Speaker 2: thought since I was able to see it with my
Speaker 2: polarized sunglasses, which are filters in itself, and our eyes,
Speaker 2: like our ears, have a limited range of frequencies that
Speaker 2: we hear and see, I thought I could probably put
Speaker 2: filters over the picture. and maybe be able to see
Speaker 2: it like I did with my glasses and eventually I
Speaker 2: was able to find it on filters and it's that
Speaker 2: very light circular object the arrow is pointing to which
Speaker 2: when you look in the video you can see the
Speaker 2: object itself go through those transformations and it goes into
Speaker 2: that circular shape disappears and then it comes back into
Speaker 2: visibility so That is what that is right there.
Speaker 1: And these images here are different filters or things that
Speaker 1: you used?
Speaker 2: A couple of them have filters on them, yeah. The
Speaker 2: two on the top right do not have a filter
Speaker 2: on them.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I combined all these together just because of the
Speaker 1: limited space that I have, so I'm sorry if they're
Speaker 1: not in order of any type.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So one of the, one of the, the, the,
Speaker 2: the order I thought was important for several of them
Speaker 2: was to note that was the object itself that was
Speaker 2: in a shape. Then it went through the transformation and
Speaker 2: then it came back in, in a similar shape. So
Speaker 2: that was why when I see them in that order.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah. So I apologize for that. It's the, the
Speaker 1: program that I have here, I just can't get them
Speaker 1: up that many pictures. It just does not have the capability.
Speaker 1: But I did get the video. I don't know. Would
Speaker 1: you like me to play that now? Sure.
Speaker 2: I'll see how it comes up.
Speaker 1: And also anyone in chat that's in there, if you
Speaker 1: have any questions for the guests, just make sure you
Speaker 1: put them in all caps and I'll try to get
Speaker 1: to them. Here we go with this. So this starts
Speaker 1: out for slow motion here. And so would you have
Speaker 1: any guess at all about how far up this was
Speaker 1: far away from you? It would just be a guess.
Speaker 2: I thought it was a couple of miles away, maybe 5,000
Speaker 2: feet high, 10,000 at times when it was moving around.
Speaker 2: And I've heard people say, well, could you see something
Speaker 2: like that? And I said, what I saw initially was
Speaker 2: the bright shining part of it, which is you can
Speaker 2: think about in a survival situation, many people are saved
Speaker 2: by using a mirror. shining it at the sun and
Speaker 2: flashing it to an aircraft passing overhead. And that could
Speaker 2: be 5, 10, 15 miles away. You could see these flashes.
Speaker 2: So that's what I saw initially. And then I started
Speaker 2: videoing it and taking pictures of it.
Speaker 1: Yep. Some of this is your handshaking, I believe.
Speaker 2: Oh, that little bit right there was handshake, yes.
Speaker 1: Yep. Now, is this with the better camera of the
Speaker 1: two that you had with you? Yes. And so you
Speaker 1: took this and this is where you got the stills from?
Speaker 1: You enlarged and you got the stills from?
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 1: No? A whole different thing?
Speaker 2: All the still pictures were taken separately as a separate
Speaker 2: image of each picture.
Speaker 1: I see. Okay. And So once you took those, that's
Speaker 1: when you started looking at them, you could see that
Speaker 1: the thing was morphing and changing and all that?
Speaker 2: Yes. I could see I was doing that with my eyes.
Speaker 2: Something weird was happening to it, but I couldn't see
Speaker 2: the detail until I zoomed in on it.
Speaker 1: And was there anyone else there with you also seeing this,
Speaker 1: or were you by yourself?
Speaker 2: I was by myself in the We're in the hotel.
Speaker 2: I was on a balcony. But there were many people,
Speaker 2: ground level. None of them were looking up that I
Speaker 2: could see.
Speaker 1: Oh, really?
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of times that, I don't know, I've had.
Speaker 1: I was on the back of a boat in Miami
Speaker 1: and thought I was seeing a UFO. Ended up being,
Speaker 1: I think it was a plane pulling a banner and
Speaker 1: just the angle of it. It looked like this thing morphing.
Speaker 1: And I took video of it. And I was saying
Speaker 1: to other people around me, look at that, look at
Speaker 1: that over there. And they're like, all right, buddy, go away.
Speaker 2: I did it. And there's some things look weird. And
Speaker 2: when you try to take pictures and identify them, but
Speaker 2: nobody's identified it yet. If they haven't come forward or
Speaker 2: I suspect somebody, person or agency or whatever group may
Speaker 2: have seen these things before, may be aware of them.
Speaker 2: but nothing has officially been identified.
Speaker 1: Has anyone suggested that it might be like a partially
Speaker 1: inflated mylar?
Speaker 2: I've heard that a few times, but what happens to
Speaker 2: a partially inflated mylar?
Speaker 1: It inflates the higher it goes. Really, the gas expands,
Speaker 1: and they usually break in the upper. They usually expand
Speaker 1: and pop, basically, what happens.
Speaker 2: And then what?
Speaker 1: Then it would just come down.
Speaker 2: They stayed up there for three hours.
Speaker 1: Oh, three hours.
Speaker 2: Wow. Wow.
Speaker 1: And what was the wind like that day? Do you
Speaker 1: remember anything like that?
Speaker 2: At the surface level, it seemed to be mild. But
Speaker 2: when you get into altitudes, it's hard to say. Different layers.
Speaker 1: That's right. That's right.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: That's really interesting. And I'm glad you were able to
Speaker 1: share that and get that out there and move on.
Speaker 1: And you said you reported it a couple of different places? Yes.
Speaker 2: Did i think it's a national ufo organization i made
Speaker 2: a report that was public became public knowledge because i
Speaker 2: saw it was picked up on on other websites had
Speaker 2: posted it and posted some of the video that i
Speaker 2: have out on youtube and that was the british earth
Speaker 2: and aerial mystery society was the first website organization that
Speaker 2: I saw had it. They speculated that it was a
Speaker 2: crypto creature. I had never personally thought about creatures, crypto creature,
Speaker 2: or any type of biologic being And our atmospheres are
Speaker 2: flying around in outer space until then. But then I
Speaker 2: thought about it and why couldn't it be true? I
Speaker 2: think that's certainly a possibility.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I have a audio blog that I put out
Speaker 1: in a blog written by Charles Lear that has to
Speaker 1: do with that exact same thing. People claiming over the
Speaker 1: years that these things could be alive in the atmosphere. And,
Speaker 1: and yeah, check that out on our YouTube channels there.
Speaker 1: That I can't remember exact creatures in the sky, I
Speaker 1: think it's called. So this is we have a couple
Speaker 1: of questions here. How steady was the directional movement of
Speaker 1: the object?
Speaker 2: It's hard to say directional movement since it stayed in
Speaker 2: the relatively the same section of the sky that I
Speaker 2: was looking at. But the fast movement of it was
Speaker 2: when it was transforming itself, as you see in the
Speaker 2: video and then. It's certainly stable on its own. I
Speaker 2: don't perceive it to be unstable. I just perceive it
Speaker 2: to be doing something that I don't know what it's doing.
Speaker 1: And so sometimes it would stop and then you could
Speaker 1: see the movement. It's kind of hard to tell on
Speaker 1: the video. It looks like it's moving in the video.
Speaker 1: And then, but it would stop, would it hover for
Speaker 1: a while and then move again? That type of thing?
Speaker 2: Yes. And so some of that movement, when... The object itself,
Speaker 2: when you look at the pictures, you look at the video,
Speaker 2: you can see that those bright areas, at first I
Speaker 2: thought they were lights blinking, but when you look at
Speaker 2: the pictures, you can see it's not an ordinary light.
Speaker 2: It's part of the skin of the object. And it's
Speaker 2: moving to me like an octopus or a cuttlefish would
Speaker 2: move the colors around on its skin. Those bright areas
Speaker 2: are small, they're large, they move around, and then it
Speaker 2: seems that they consume it, and then it spins at
Speaker 2: a tremendous high rate of speed, like that other picture
Speaker 2: you saw, number 13, looked like a large donut. And
Speaker 2: then it disappears, like it's a solid object, and it's
Speaker 2: just so fast, not even a second, and then it
Speaker 2: comes back into view, and it's in a new shape, multispectral.
Speaker 1: It is an intriguing, that's perfectly round circle right there.
Speaker 1: That's something. And did it eventually go away?
Speaker 2: Eventually, yeah.
Speaker 1: And how did it leave? Did it go quickly or slowly?
Speaker 2: Very quickly. I was not going to be able to
Speaker 2: stay there all day where I was because I had
Speaker 2: an event that I was going to that evening. And
Speaker 2: I remember thinking, like, I hope this object goes away
Speaker 2: pretty soon. I'm going to be late. I'm going to
Speaker 2: stay here all day looking at it. And then it
Speaker 2: just faded right in pretty quickly, just went right out
Speaker 2: of sight.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: There's another question here. Do you think it was from
Speaker 1: Elgin Air Force Base? Did that cross your mind? That
Speaker 1: would have to be some type of experimental craft or
Speaker 1: something if it was.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's Eglin. Is that how it's pronounced down there?
Speaker 1: Oh, I'm sorry.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's all right. That's all right. Not a problem.
Speaker 2: But anything's possible there. Eglin's not the only base in
Speaker 2: the Panhandle. The Panhandle has a lot of military activity,
Speaker 2: probably one of the largest, if not the largest by landmass,
Speaker 2: what would be considered base property, hundreds of thousands of
Speaker 2: acres where they do all kinds of experiments out there.
Speaker 2: And I was actually closer to Tyndall Air Force Base
Speaker 2: than I was to Eglin Air Force Base. So anything's possible.
Speaker 2: I would want usually experiments and things like that. Maybe
Speaker 2: I've never noticed them before, but that was something that
Speaker 2: would be highly classified in nature. I don't think they
Speaker 2: generally test them over populated areas along there, although they
Speaker 2: could get up in that. Eglin Air Force Base or
Speaker 2: up in the National Forest up there, and they're not
Speaker 2: as populated, but they're still. You've got the middle of
Speaker 2: the day populated areas. Testing grounds for those ultra-secret projects
Speaker 2: are generally considered to be somewhere over the desert, one
Speaker 2: of the secret bases out there, which Area 51 was
Speaker 2: long associated with experiments like that. So anything's possible.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, that's right, yeah. So this person wanted to
Speaker 1: know what you thought about the files. I don't know
Speaker 1: if you looked into them, about all the video files
Speaker 1: that are released and documents, things like that. I want
Speaker 1: your opinion, what you think about it.
Speaker 2: I think that what's being released is mostly all information
Speaker 2: that's already been released over the years or recently. There's
Speaker 2: really no groundbreaking findings. proof of anything that's been released
Speaker 2: other than you do have officials. You had President Obama
Speaker 2: a couple of years ago, and he said, hey, there's
Speaker 2: something out there, something up there, and we don't know
Speaker 2: what it is. So that's disclosure right there, but just
Speaker 2: not seeing something that's an actual craft or object or
Speaker 2: humanoid or non-human intelligence. I think when it's time to
Speaker 2: be released, it will, and the probably the government won't
Speaker 2: have full control of it. It'll be apparent to everybody
Speaker 2: when it happens.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've often wondered about that, if this is going
Speaker 1: to be like a controlled situation or what they really
Speaker 1: know and don't know. Hopefully we'll find out eventually here.
Speaker 1: So this is from Chief Von Beef. Thanks for the question. Scott,
Speaker 1: given your pararescue background, did the weather balloon explanation ring
Speaker 1: true to you at the time or did your training
Speaker 1: make you question it?
Speaker 2: When I heard it, it did not ring true at all.
Speaker 2: Look at that. That's been the common, maybe the common,
Speaker 2: one of the very common explanations is the things we
Speaker 2: see are weather balloons. If you can go online and
Speaker 2: you can Google pictures of weather balloons.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've seen them.
Speaker 2: You can see a lot of different amazing shapes of
Speaker 2: weather balloons, but they don't change shape. They don't disappear.
Speaker 2: They stay in a fixed shape. So I didn't think
Speaker 2: that at all. I've been part of releasing smaller weather balloons,
Speaker 2: just small round ones out with combat control team members
Speaker 2: and some of the things we've done there when we're
Speaker 2: out in the field or wherever it might be and
Speaker 2: getting weather data and releasing the smaller weather balloons, which
Speaker 2: I did not think that this was in any way,
Speaker 2: shape or form, anything that I'd ever had a part
Speaker 2: of as a balloon. And I just thought it was
Speaker 2: a brush off to me to be told that it
Speaker 2: was a weather balloon and where that came from. I
Speaker 2: know Martin, if you've read my book or not, but
Speaker 2: I detail my whole story in there. And that part
Speaker 2: of it was early on when I took these pictures.
Speaker 2: And then I downloaded them to my laptop a few
Speaker 2: weeks later. And I saw the object much clearer. And
Speaker 2: I thought, wow, this is weird. This is like nothing
Speaker 2: I've ever seen before. I don't know what it is.
Speaker 2: But it might possibly be a government project. And my
Speaker 2: thought was, I'm not going to release it if it is.
Speaker 2: I've been in the military 22 years. I'm a patriot,
Speaker 2: all that kind of stuff, where it's like, hey, if
Speaker 2: we got a secret project, I don't want anybody but
Speaker 2: our own government to be aware of it. So I
Speaker 2: contacted one of my friends, military, active, still active, told
Speaker 2: them what was up, going on. They could say, I
Speaker 2: can see you're pretty excited about it. Send me some pictures.
Speaker 2: I'll get them to an analyst and find out what
Speaker 2: this is. I said, great. A few weeks later, I
Speaker 2: got word back. My friend said, contact. The analyst said
Speaker 2: that they don't know what it is. I think, okay,
Speaker 2: this is a highly trained military analyst that doesn't know
Speaker 2: what this is. So, but they will send them, they're
Speaker 2: going to send them to another agency that has a
Speaker 2: better capability to analyze pictures. And I said, great, that'd
Speaker 2: be great. We'll find out what it is. And I
Speaker 2: don't know who that was. And I don't know which
Speaker 2: agency it was. I never asked and said, all right,
Speaker 2: that's great. and if it was something that came back
Speaker 2: and said, yep, this is classified, and you have signed
Speaker 2: previous NDAs for your job and things you've been involved in,
Speaker 2: and we want you to sign another one, I would
Speaker 2: have done it, but a couple weeks later, I get
Speaker 2: back word that from whoever analyzed them said that it's
Speaker 2: a weather balloon, and when I heard that, I thought, man,
Speaker 2: that's just the same brush off that everybody gets.
Speaker 1: I think it's like the number one, someone just wrote
Speaker 1: in the chat, the number one, it's in the number
Speaker 1: one debunk column is the weather balloon.
Speaker 2: Then I reached out. It's okay. Nope. They don't care. Obviously,
Speaker 2: if it's a weather balloon, they're going to tell me
Speaker 2: that they don't care what I do with them. So
Speaker 2: I reached out to a few different people that were
Speaker 2: well-known in the UFO community. And the one person that
Speaker 2: I went back and forth with was Nick Pope. We
Speaker 2: communicated about these pictures and we had a little in
Speaker 2: common ground because I was stationed in England, two of
Speaker 2: my assignments. And I was at Woodbridge and right there
Speaker 2: at Rendlesham Forest. So we talked about that a little bit.
Speaker 2: And I sent him some pictures and he said, he
Speaker 2: didn't know what it was. I said, I don't know
Speaker 2: what to do with them. He said, you should submit
Speaker 2: a report to MUFON and other organizations. And I did.
Speaker 2: And I also, in the back of my mind, knowing
Speaker 2: that these reports will never go anywhere. And I'm thinking
Speaker 2: the only way to get this out is to publish it.
Speaker 2: So it is my report in my own, I don't
Speaker 2: know what it is. I'm just taking pictures and writing
Speaker 2: what I see and what I think it might be
Speaker 2: or might be doing. I don't know. It's all guesses.
Speaker 2: But Nick said, yeah, get it out there. Maybe somebody
Speaker 2: will come out of the woodwork that knows what it is.
Speaker 2: And so that's what I did. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Let's see. This is another question here from Dr. Richard.
Speaker 1: Can't lightweight materials be carried high into the sky by
Speaker 1: the air currents? Yeah, but they're not going to be
Speaker 1: flying off fast. That's the difference right there. So, in
Speaker 1: my opinion of the story you're telling me, if this
Speaker 1: thing took off fast, then that kind of makes all
Speaker 1: those theories, including a weather balloon, just fall apart, really.
Speaker 2: Certainly, lightweight things, other things can be blown into the
Speaker 2: air by the wind, but When the wind stops, they
Speaker 2: fall to the ground or they just continue to blow away.
Speaker 2: This didn't do that.
Speaker 1: And how long did you, could you repeat how long
Speaker 1: was this in the air that you were there watching it?
Speaker 2: On my sighting, it could have been there longer before
Speaker 2: I first noticed it. But over the time I saw
Speaker 2: it was about three and a half hours.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a long time to see something in one area.
Speaker 1: A long time. If it was something just drifting in
Speaker 1: the wind or whatever, it would have been gone forever.
Speaker 1: within 20 minutes, really, realistically, I would think. I'm no expert,
Speaker 1: but I'm just thinking that makes sense that it would
Speaker 1: be gone pretty quickly. And wow, so that's a long time.
Speaker 1: And that's a lot of patience because I've heard other
Speaker 1: people say that they have, my producer's mother, they were
Speaker 1: all watching this UFO and she just got bored and
Speaker 1: walked in the house. That's what people do a lot
Speaker 1: of times.
Speaker 2: Looking back on it, I had my focus on a
Speaker 2: couple other things that day where I had my goal
Speaker 2: set for the pushups. I had a goal for the year,
Speaker 2: so I didn't want to get too far behind and
Speaker 2: end up making up 10 or 20,000 pushups in a day.
Speaker 2: I was focused on my pushups, and then I was
Speaker 2: also preparing for a presentation that evening. So I would
Speaker 2: do a set of pushups, and then I was kind
Speaker 2: of preparing to go over a little bit of my
Speaker 2: rehearsing process. for the night's presentation and extemporaneous speaking. A
Speaker 2: lot of rehearsal goes into that. And so when I
Speaker 2: was doing pushups and I caught that light, that flash,
Speaker 2: that bright object, and then I looked up, I watched it,
Speaker 2: realized it wasn't, started taking pictures, but my focus did
Speaker 2: not stay on that object. Looking back, I wish it
Speaker 2: had have stayed there and I could have put the
Speaker 2: pushups off for another day. and just focus more and
Speaker 2: taking more video and more pictures and everything like that.
Speaker 2: But so I do a set of pushups. I see it. Oh,
Speaker 2: it's still there. I'll take more pictures. I do a
Speaker 2: set of pushups. Oh, it's still there. Take more pictures.
Speaker 2: Do a set of pushups. Go rehearse. Oh, it's still
Speaker 2: out there. Take more pictures. And so that went on.
Speaker 2: And then later, I was like, I got to take
Speaker 2: a shower. I took a shower. 30 minutes later, oh,
Speaker 2: it's still out there. I took a few more pictures.
Speaker 2: And then this went on during that time period, like
Speaker 2: say three, three and a half hours. And so I
Speaker 2: didn't give it the full attention that I wish I
Speaker 2: had have given to it. Hindsight looking back, it's like, man,
Speaker 2: if I ever see that again, take pictures until I
Speaker 2: run out of battery or disk space. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was out last year, I was out at Mount
Speaker 1: Shasta and they had an object like that. I think
Speaker 1: it was for a whole hour. And everybody was outside
Speaker 1: taking pictures of it. And it was in the local
Speaker 1: newspaper and all that. I have a picture somewhere of it.
Speaker 1: But it was just like an orb just floating there.
Speaker 1: And it looked almost like a moon, that bright during
Speaker 1: the day, bright white, just sitting there. It's so bizarre.
Speaker 1: But I'm glad that you did that. You took the
Speaker 1: time to at least document what you saw. And like
Speaker 1: you said, I don't know if anyone will ever know
Speaker 1: what it really was or not, but There are sightings
Speaker 1: in that area. The Gulf Breeze is not that far
Speaker 1: from there where there was all those sightings. And some people,
Speaker 1: there's some part of that that may have been some
Speaker 1: hoaxing going on. I don't really know 100% of that
Speaker 1: particular case, the Gulf Breeze. There's stories about that both ways.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of controversy about that. But I know
Speaker 1: that in Florida in general, there's a lot of sightings.
Speaker 1: Part of that has to do with the nice weather
Speaker 1: and people out a lot of it. time, but was
Speaker 1: this object actually over the water itself?
Speaker 2: No, it was inland probably, you know, how many miles?
Speaker 2: I don't know, five miles, 10 miles inland. When I
Speaker 2: saw it, it was not over the water.
Speaker 1: Ah, okay. All right. Here's a question here for you. Scott,
Speaker 1: what did you learn from the photos that you didn't
Speaker 1: realize while you were watching the object?
Speaker 2: So the photos, being able to enlarge it and study
Speaker 2: it and seeing more detail in there and seeing the
Speaker 2: more detail that I have with the photos itself, I
Speaker 2: lean toward this object being biological under some type of
Speaker 2: intelligent control. maybe of its own intelligent control or an
Speaker 2: outside source controlling it. But it just appears to me
Speaker 2: to have on certain pictures, eyes, a mouth, and it's
Speaker 2: really weird in that sense. So I didn't learn what
Speaker 2: it was. I don't know what it was. It's just
Speaker 2: what I see and what I might perceive. And I'm
Speaker 2: not to say that you look at everything, you see
Speaker 2: a face and everything, but I've seen large creatures on
Speaker 2: different documentaries from three or four, five, six, seven, eight
Speaker 2: miles deep. And they have these huge eyes and all
Speaker 2: these different characteristics to them, fluttering wings and things like that.
Speaker 2: And I think that resembles what this object is doing
Speaker 2: at certain times. And even in closer to the surface,
Speaker 2: you catch a 800 pound creature. blue marlin and it's
Speaker 2: got an eye that's half as big as your head practically.
Speaker 1: Right yep i was just looking to see if i
Speaker 1: could find any information on the sky creatures audio blog
Speaker 1: that's out there but i can't right now so let's
Speaker 1: talk let's shift gears because i think this is fascinating
Speaker 1: that you're here today with what happened to you can
Speaker 1: you tell everyone exactly what happened when you were skydiving.
Speaker 2: Military we didn't always call it skydiving even though that
Speaker 2: certainly may have been what it was and we would
Speaker 2: go we would go out to other drop zones and
Speaker 2: to our on our skydiving stuff the incident you're talking
Speaker 2: about was a parachute accident that i was involved in
Speaker 2: 1987 i was my job in the air force as
Speaker 2: a pararescue man combat rescue is the main mission but
Speaker 2: humanitarian missions around the world oceans mountains jungles everywhere but
Speaker 2: In the military, with the focus being what it is
Speaker 2: with combat, we have an alert teams that we're on
Speaker 2: call for different incidents around the world, whether it's combat
Speaker 2: related or not. And at the time I was attached
Speaker 2: to a SEAL team in Virginia Beach and we were
Speaker 2: in an alert status, but we were going out to
Speaker 2: do a, we called it a fun jump. And that
Speaker 2: meaning that we were not jumping with hundreds of pounds
Speaker 2: of gear on our body. And it was in the daytime.
Speaker 2: So it was going to be a nice, easy jump
Speaker 2: just to stay in the local area and conduct training.
Speaker 2: We jumped out of a Marine CH-46 helicopter at 13,000 feet.
Speaker 2: Our plan was to free fall to 3,500 feet. And
Speaker 2: whatever formation we had grouped up into, we were going
Speaker 2: to break it off, fly away from each other, and
Speaker 2: open our parachutes. So I did that. This was my
Speaker 2: 90th parachute, my 90th parachute jump. And I felt very comfortable,
Speaker 2: able to fly to and away from other people and
Speaker 2: link up and whatnot in the air. And so I
Speaker 2: opened my canopy. Again, I don't remember any of this.
Speaker 2: This is just going off of what I've done my
Speaker 2: previous 89 times. I remember, I remember jumping. And so
Speaker 2: the normal procedures for our parachutes that we were wearing
Speaker 2: at the time, we had a deployment handle that was
Speaker 2: in a little pocket right here. And you reach in,
Speaker 2: you grab the handle, you pull it away from you.
Speaker 2: The pilot chute pops out and the parachute opening sequence.
Speaker 2: And once the parachutes open, First thing that you do
Speaker 2: is you reach up and grab risers, looking for your
Speaker 2: steering toggles, and you're looking up to make sure that
Speaker 2: the canopy's open and functioning properly. Sometime in that opening sequence,
Speaker 2: there was another jumper still above me in free fall,
Speaker 2: unable to turn away and avoid hitting me, and he
Speaker 2: balled up in a cannonball position and crashed through the parachute,
Speaker 2: destroyed the parachute, Knocked me unconscious, shattered my skull. And
Speaker 2: then I went the rest of the way. I think
Speaker 2: I had two cells. It was a canopy with cells.
Speaker 2: I think there were nine cells in that particular canopy.
Speaker 2: And there were two remaining open, which really didn't do
Speaker 2: anything but spin me in a fast circle and estimated
Speaker 2: that I hit the ground at about 100 miles an hour. God. Wow.
Speaker 1: And you don't remember any of it. Any of this
Speaker 1: really to speak of?
Speaker 2: No, none of the accident itself. I don't remember any
Speaker 2: of that. I don't remember jumping. I don't remember that
Speaker 2: part on the ground. And only a couple of days later,
Speaker 2: coming to at the ICU, intensive care section there at
Speaker 2: Portsmouth Naval Hospital.
Speaker 1: In Virginia. What was the, what was the ground like
Speaker 1: at that, where you landed?
Speaker 2: It was a frozen shrub area. I didn't land on
Speaker 2: a tree. I landed on the ground, but it was,
Speaker 2: there were trees around. It wasn't a, it wasn't a
Speaker 2: clearing for the helicopter to land and they didn't have
Speaker 2: a rescue hoist on that helicopter. So they loitered in
Speaker 2: the air as long as they could and they left
Speaker 2: and later they had to call a life flight. So
Speaker 2: we landed on the ground about a mile away from
Speaker 2: the drop zone. Another pararescue on the ground, Larry Hikamoto.
Speaker 2: And we were, him and I, he and I were
Speaker 2: taking turns. pulling the rescue part of it where we
Speaker 2: had to have a medic on the ground and so
Speaker 2: he was on the ground I was jumping and so
Speaker 2: the two guys that got to me were two of
Speaker 2: the Navy SEALs and they started the sequence of actions
Speaker 2: that ultimately saved my life and took about an hour
Speaker 2: for them in a makeshift litter out of some small
Speaker 2: saplings they cut down and poncho liner that somebody had
Speaker 2: and dragged me out to a clearing, life flight was
Speaker 2: called in and I got a life flight ride to Portsmouth.
Speaker 2: So I had mentioned, you asked me what I remember.
Speaker 2: So that I told, like I'm talking, that memory right
Speaker 2: there is my conscious memory. On the helicopter, I don't
Speaker 2: remember jumping. I remember standing up and then in ICU.
Speaker 2: So my unconscious memory between them was at the time
Speaker 2: of the accident, And I don't realize it's an accident.
Speaker 2: I'm not really sure what's going on. But I'm hovering
Speaker 2: above my body. But I'm not in my body. It's
Speaker 2: very weird. But somehow I'm able to look down at
Speaker 2: my body. I see the guys coming in. I see
Speaker 2: them trying to take care of me. I'm disassociated with it.
Speaker 2: It really doesn't affect me. I'm not interested in that
Speaker 2: anymore at that point. And I'm surrounded by a light,
Speaker 2: a white light, a soft white light, like if you're
Speaker 2: going to go romantic, 40 watt light bulb, you're embraced
Speaker 2: in it. And it was really, it just felt good.
Speaker 2: I felt loved. Looking back, I know that was energy.
Speaker 2: It was energy where we were all connected. But I
Speaker 2: also realized that there was a very bright area above me.
Speaker 2: And in that light, it was so bright, I could
Speaker 2: see three figures that were standing there. And I knew telepathically,
Speaker 2: somehow I knew that I was going to them and
Speaker 2: that they were there to meet me. And I was
Speaker 2: going to them, which is weird. I'm not walking, I'm
Speaker 2: not running, I'm not in my body. But I look
Speaker 2: at it as there was a transition because I feel
Speaker 2: like I'm in my body, but I'm not in my body.
Speaker 2: And once I got really close to them, I thought,
Speaker 2: I'm going to get to see who it is because
Speaker 2: I know them and I want to see who it is.
Speaker 2: I know them, but I don't know who it is.
Speaker 2: And I heard that voice that said, it's time to
Speaker 2: go now. And it seemed like a second very quickly,
Speaker 2: I'm sure. I had a million thoughts in my head.
Speaker 2: I turned away from that light, which is weird because
Speaker 2: it's not physically turning, but I'm turning away from the
Speaker 2: light and it's like, God, I'm not ready to go yet.
Speaker 2: And then that's the last part I remember there. And
Speaker 2: then I wake up in the hospital. Wow.
Speaker 1: I wasn't expecting this. This is really amazing. Really amazing.
Speaker 1: I've heard of so many accounts of these near-death experiences,
Speaker 1: and I believe them. There's so many amazing things. Like
Speaker 1: you said, you saw those people coming to you and
Speaker 1: all that. People say that so many times over and over.
Speaker 2: I don't know if they were people. Could have been people.
Speaker 2: I perceived it. All I could see was the figures.
Speaker 2: So I don't know, but it felt like it.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: And that's amazing that you survived, really. It's just, and
Speaker 1: as we talked about off air, who knows if you
Speaker 1: were awake and falling, if you would have tensed up
Speaker 1: when that could have been, that could have been your
Speaker 1: end right there.
Speaker 2: And if any of your listeners, anybody likes country music,
Speaker 2: my good buddy, retired, medically retired pararescueman Donovan Chapman, he
Speaker 2: was injured in Afghanistan and He's wrote a song. He's
Speaker 2: got some songs. He's got a lot of songs out there,
Speaker 2: Donovan Chapman. And it's called God, I'm Not Ready to
Speaker 2: Go Yet.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's totally amazing story. Like I said, I wasn't
Speaker 1: expecting it. And I really appreciate you telling us that.
Speaker 1: And I'm just going to take one quick look here.
Speaker 1: And the book, I'm going to have your book in
Speaker 1: the link in the show notes. So anyone that wants
Speaker 1: to check that out, you'll be able to buy it.
Speaker 1: Is it on Amazon? I can't remember.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 1: Yep. It's on Amazon. Okay. So that link will be
Speaker 1: in the show notes and just a couple of comments here.
Speaker 1: Thank you for your service. And talking about bent waters
Speaker 1: there and just real quickly. And, oh yeah, here's the
Speaker 1: question I had for you when I was hearing you
Speaker 1: talk to all that whole thing. This person here wanted
Speaker 1: to know, did it change the way you look at
Speaker 1: risk and things like that? But I wanted to know also,
Speaker 1: did you ever dive? Did you ever parachute again? After that?
Speaker 2: Yep. Just over 500 more times.
Speaker 1: Oh my God.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: You kind of remind me of this guy that I
Speaker 1: had on here called Scott Cassell. He was, he's has 20,000
Speaker 1: hours under the water. He's been on a rebreather more
Speaker 1: than any Navy SEAL. And he's the first one to
Speaker 1: film a giant squid in the wild. And he's was
Speaker 1: on shark week and all that, but he had a
Speaker 1: USO encounter. But anyway, you remind me of him. He's,
Speaker 1: There's a certain breed of people that are just extremely hardy.
Speaker 1: And when you're telling them, talking about doing all those
Speaker 1: pushups and things like, wow, superhuman.
Speaker 2: I'm an average guy. The guys I work with, there's
Speaker 2: a lot of above average guys. I just struggle to
Speaker 2: keep up with them. You know, the jobs, the special ops,
Speaker 2: especially full of them. I saw one question. You scroll
Speaker 2: through there. Someone said their father had served in Vietnam and.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I'm going to pull that back up again
Speaker 1: if I can.
Speaker 2: Those guys definitely didn't get the credit they deserve for
Speaker 2: everything they did. Definitely heroes over there. Yes. Yeah.
Speaker 1: It was very hard for them when they came back. Oh, yeah.
Speaker 2: In Bentwater. Yeah. That was the sister base to a
Speaker 2: wood bridge there at Bentwaters. And the Rendlesham Forest was
Speaker 2: right there around there. Yeah, those guys definitely, they deserve
Speaker 2: a lot more credit than they got for what they did.
Speaker 2: And gals, a lot of women too. Exactly.
Speaker 1: Okay. Thank you so much, Scott. It's been a real pleasure.
Speaker 1: Enjoy talking to you tonight.
Speaker 2: All right. Thank you, Martin.
Speaker 1: All right. Take care. All right, everyone. So we'll be back.
Speaker 1: Just remember this Thursday is Grant Lovick. I will be,
Speaker 1: I'll be in the air, so I will not be
Speaker 1: in chat during that. It's pre-recorded and ready to go.
Speaker 1: So it's a great conversation. So make sure you check
Speaker 1: that out. Next Tuesday is Rich Hoffman. So thank you
Speaker 1: all for being here. I appreciate your questions, everything in chat.
Speaker 1: And we'll see you next time. And remember to keep
Speaker 1: your eyes to the sky.