Speaker 1: Today, I want to tell you about a journey that
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Speaker 1: I was a kid, I've heard tales of bigfoot and
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Speaker 1: As I grew older and read more about the paranormal,
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Speaker 2: Today.
Speaker 3: Hey everybody, this is Left Striving Yes, yes, I know
Speaker 3: aka Survivor Man, and you're listening to Brian on Sasquatch Odisty.
Speaker 1: Hey there, and welcome back to Sasquatch Odyssey. Thank you
Speaker 1: so much for clicking play. It is Sunday. I hope
Speaker 1: you've had an amazing weekend. We have a phenomenal show
Speaker 1: lined up for you. But as always, I want to
Speaker 1: start by inviting you. If you've had an encounter and
Speaker 1: you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an
Speaker 1: email you get me at Brian at Paranomoworldproductions dot com.
Speaker 1: Can head over to the website, check it out, become
Speaker 1: a member there and help support the show. I tease
Speaker 1: this back on Wednesday. This is the audio from the
Speaker 1: Texas Bigfoot Research Conservancy conference out there in Texas from
Speaker 1: back in twenty thirteen.
Speaker 4: It is a.
Speaker 1: Phenomenal lineup that they have on this amazing roundtable discussion,
Speaker 1: and I brought it to you today because it's so
Speaker 1: interesting to me that we're talking eleven years ago some
Speaker 1: of the discussions around DNA and evidence and the things
Speaker 1: that we're going on back then are still up for
Speaker 1: discussion today, and I think it's a really cool opportunity
Speaker 1: for us to look at what's happening today versus back
Speaker 1: in twenty thirteen with some of these juggernauts in the
Speaker 1: bigfoot community. So I think you're really going to enjoy this.
Speaker 1: But fortunately you don't have to take my word for it.
Speaker 2: All you have to.
Speaker 1: Do is sit back, relax and enjoy the show.
Speaker 5: Hey there, it's Brian. What you're going to hear today
Speaker 5: is something a little different. This is the panel discussion
Speaker 5: that followed the recently concluded Texas Bigfoot Conference in Fort Worth, Texas.
Speaker 5: On the panel were Josh Gates, Kathy Strain, Alton Higgins,
Speaker 5: Lyle Blackburn, Bill Muns, Darryl Collier, Jeff Meldrum, and me.
Speaker 5: We were moderated by Mike Mays, who blogs as the
Speaker 5: Texas krypted Hunter on the Internet. This is basically questions
Speaker 5: that were submitted by the audience, so we cover a
Speaker 5: wide range of topics. I thought it was very entertaining.
Speaker 5: My thanks to the North American wood A Conservancy for
Speaker 5: letting me put this out.
Speaker 2: Hope you enjoy it. Here it is My name's Mike Days.
Speaker 6: I'm a member of the board of directors groups formerly
Speaker 6: now and as the tv RC are.
Speaker 2: Now the North American Wooded Conservancy.
Speaker 6: You had the opportunity throughout to day to fill out
Speaker 6: one of these cards with questions of the pane, off
Speaker 6: of the speakers, and for members of the group. So
Speaker 6: I'm just going to go through them, some addressed specifically
Speaker 6: to an individual, summer to the whole panel. So we'll
Speaker 6: just keep going right now, mister Gates, is personalness for you.
Speaker 2: You gets a warm zone.
Speaker 6: It says what situation has been the most threatening to
Speaker 6: you during your filming destination truth.
Speaker 7: We get the roof rip off of an airplane in
Speaker 7: flight in Romania. That is usually my goats and answer
Speaker 7: for that, when you are flying in a plane and
Speaker 7: suddenly you are outdoors.
Speaker 2: Something as general at your flight.
Speaker 8: So I think that was probably our nat to Chernobyl.
Speaker 2: Probably it's at both sides of that remains to be seen.
Speaker 2: That's going to be a long time for decades. I
Speaker 2: think that's a pretty satisfactory answer. Roof or it's off plane.
Speaker 2: No way to compete to an answer, dude, all.
Speaker 6: Right, this one's addressed to the entire panel. So of
Speaker 6: anyone that feels strong about it, please take a stab
Speaker 6: in this. What do you think is the strongest reason
Speaker 6: no one has been able to produce any physical proof
Speaker 6: that the Sasquatch exists.
Speaker 5: I'm not gonna say I have after you answered this,
Speaker 5: but I want to differentiate between proof and evidence. There's
Speaker 5: evidence that something can be, and then there's proof that
Speaker 5: something can be. And no, we don't have proof, but
Speaker 5: we have a lot of evidence. That evidence comes in
Speaker 5: the form of footprints, that evidence comes in the form
Speaker 5: of photographs, that it comes in the form of viable hairs.
Speaker 5: It sounds none of these things are proof, but they
Speaker 5: are all evidence that there's something there.
Speaker 3: I was just gonna say they any gooble accounts thatts
Speaker 3: Vulman methods as well.
Speaker 2: It may not be the most reliable, but it.
Speaker 3: Is a vulner Methodence, why don't be a difference.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm guessing here.
Speaker 6: But I'm going to assume what they were really after
Speaker 6: is why no physical remains.
Speaker 2: That sort of thing. Anybody elaborate on that.
Speaker 9: If this is an analogy of an answer, it's really
Speaker 9: is something that I was actually talking with two ladies
Speaker 9: that they're sitting there now. Last night at the smaller
Speaker 9: meetings we had, I was talking about how there are
Speaker 9: these like brain teaser puzzles, as little twined uses a metal.
Speaker 9: You pick it up and you try to unhook the
Speaker 9: two pieces of metal if you can play with it
Speaker 9: for hours and you can't make it work, and then
Speaker 9: somebody comes along and says, just twist it and you
Speaker 9: slide it.
Speaker 2: And it's solved.
Speaker 9: And you watch them do that, and you wonder, why
Speaker 9: didn't you see it those hours you were trying to
Speaker 9: untangle these two square the little pieces of metal. For
Speaker 9: myself personally, all big the phenomenon, I know, it's a mystery.
Speaker 9: I don't have an explanation for it. Why there isn't
Speaker 9: more advancement, physical remainings and things like that, I have
Speaker 9: no explanation for. And it does confound me because I
Speaker 9: know Patty's real, and there's got to be more of them,
Speaker 9: and if there's more of them sentilily, there's got to
Speaker 9: be evidence. And I don't know why, but I have
Speaker 9: a feeling it's like this analogy of this little brain
Speaker 9: teaser puzzle. We're looking at it, we're looking at it,
Speaker 9: and we're looking at it. We're trying to we're trying
Speaker 9: and trying, and it's not working because there's one little
Speaker 9: twist that we don't yet understand.
Speaker 2: And I think when we underst.
Speaker 9: Stand it, suddenly the evidence will start appearing, and then
Speaker 9: when we look back on it, we'll realize we just
Speaker 9: didn't see one part of the puzzle.
Speaker 8: Now, exactly what the part is we won't know until.
Speaker 9: We see it, of course, but there's one little piece
Speaker 9: of the puzzle missing, and when we have that one piece,
Speaker 9: the physical evidence will start showing up.
Speaker 8: We'll know where to look, we'll know what it is,
Speaker 8: we know.
Speaker 9: How to determine it, we'll know how to separate it
Speaker 9: from something that's faked, and once we reach that point,
Speaker 9: suddenly it'll all become clear why we had so much
Speaker 9: trouble finding the evidence before. So for me personally, that
Speaker 9: would be how I would.
Speaker 2: Look at it.
Speaker 9: Answering that question. We know it's a mystery, we know
Speaker 9: we haven't figured it out yet, we're just missing one
Speaker 9: little bit of the pieces, and when we have it,
Speaker 9: it'll all come together and we'll be able to entangle
Speaker 9: the mystery effortlessly.
Speaker 2: That's my shot.
Speaker 10: I would just add that's very true, and if you
Speaker 10: apply that particular way. Part of that equation isn't necessarily
Speaker 10: a mystery than just a lack of information. Some of
Speaker 10: that information we actually have. We have physical evidence in
Speaker 10: the form of hair. There's no question that something is
Speaker 10: shedding hair that continues to define attribution to any commonly
Speaker 10: known qualify and ven Bear's remarkable resemblance to human and
Speaker 10: other primary hair. We've been stumped because of a set
Speaker 10: of circumstances associated with the very nature of that hair.
Speaker 10: In trying to derive DNA from those samples, it's proved
Speaker 10: very challenging. Now technologies have advanced, Like I said, while
Speaker 10: unfortunately I think the water is far too muddy with
Speaker 10: the Melb Kitchen study to salvage anything from that situation.
Speaker 10: At a moment, I'm very hopeful that doctor Brian sites
Speaker 10: techniques of digestion and the illusion of DNA from problematic
Speaker 10: troubling hairs. So here's the simple explanation is, if I
Speaker 10: weigh background hair is dead, the Libby dividing cells are
Speaker 10: at the follicle at the root.
Speaker 2: Most of the hair that.
Speaker 10: Is shed naturally has a quiescent or an inactive follicle.
Speaker 10: When you find hair in your brush or in your drain,
Speaker 10: in your shower.
Speaker 2: That's hair that.
Speaker 10: Is simply falling out because the follicle has shrunk up
Speaker 10: and the hair slips out and then a new shaft
Speaker 10: begins to grow. That's happening all the time with you
Speaker 10: and other animals. So much of the hair that's found
Speaker 10: out in the environment doesn't have a clump of rapidly
Speaker 10: dividing growing cells that it's root.
Speaker 2: So we rely on the.
Speaker 10: Cells that are stacked up in the central core or
Speaker 10: modulla in order to derive hair. But some animals have
Speaker 10: an a cellular modula, a core that is essentially hollow,
Speaker 10: that has no stacked of dead cells. So all you
Speaker 10: have is a shaft which is the tusks the remains
Speaker 10: of dead cells stacked together with very little DNA.
Speaker 2: Is any dnare, but recent.
Speaker 10: The advances have improved the probability of getting DNA out
Speaker 10: of that very barren hair shaft, and those techniques are
Speaker 10: being employed by doctor seishin of those thirty hair samples
Speaker 10: that he has.
Speaker 2: Hopefully something will put the forthcoming.
Speaker 10: But as far as other physical remains of a corpse,
Speaker 10: it's really not that mysterious. If you talk to people
Speaker 10: who are familiar with the circumstance of the fate of
Speaker 10: remains of animals in the wild, it's not really surprising
Speaker 10: we haven't found the remains of a very rare, very large,
Speaker 10: very long lived animal, an animal that would be at
Speaker 10: the top of its food chain, would have no natural predators,
Speaker 10: a population for which I definitely be a.
Speaker 2: Very rare event. And when it.
Speaker 10: Occurs, since it occurs naturally, those individuals secure themselves off
Speaker 10: and out of the way place I often site. We
Speaker 10: had a cat one time who got in a fight
Speaker 10: with a neighbored cat and he got the worst of it,
Speaker 10: and he disappeared, and he was gone. We thought, I'm
Speaker 10: not a sign of it for three days until the
Speaker 10: fourth day he emerged from under the master bedroom a
Speaker 10: bed where he'd been hiding, licking his wounds all that time.
Speaker 2: So animals will do that when they're old, when they're increditive, when.
Speaker 10: Death is near, they tend to secrete themselves off somewhere
Speaker 10: unless they're taken by a pretator. And then secondly, you
Speaker 10: combine that fact, the natural history fact with the organic
Speaker 10: or biologic and eight biologic factors of the environment which
Speaker 10: we find them, which is principally wet coniferous forests, oftentimes
Speaker 10: in the city northwest in volcanic soils, both of which
Speaker 10: contribute tremendously to an acidic environment. Bone is made up
Speaker 10: of alkhol and materials, and a citic environment's quickly decomposing.
Speaker 2: So what the chewers and gnawers.
Speaker 10: And pack brats go and carry off is quickly deteriorated
Speaker 10: and dispatched by the physical elements of the environment.
Speaker 2: To I often point to.
Speaker 10: The fact that we have a day a giant tape
Speaker 10: on the order of Bigfoot that occupied eastern China for
Speaker 10: a million and a half years.
Speaker 2: I think about that a million and a half years.
Speaker 10: And yet for that entire tenure we have watch to
Speaker 10: show for it, and that two jaws and about a
Speaker 10: thousand isolated teat, all of which are found in Karst
Speaker 10: caves in Limestope caves, where they had then carried five porcupines.
Speaker 10: Now in China, porcupines are only below the Yellow River.
Speaker 10: There are caves in the northern part of China, but
Speaker 10: there are no Gigantiisicus fossils from there. Because you're missing
Speaker 10: one of the two critical elements to concentrate the skeletal remains.
Speaker 2: You're missing the porcupine.
Speaker 10: If it weren't for the action that cork, fine, we
Speaker 10: wouldn't know nothing about this gigantic thousand pounds eight that
Speaker 10: persisted for a million and a half years in China.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of biases in the environment.
Speaker 10: There's a lot of reasons why we don't necessarily have
Speaker 10: remains of the sepot.
Speaker 7: I was gonna say everything that Jeff said.
Speaker 2: You wouldn't said it much better. That's what I had
Speaker 2: to that.
Speaker 3: The other element that was necessary for that was that
Speaker 3: humans d declined the grave reception that there is this
Speaker 3: grand search for this species.
Speaker 2: That is not the case. It's never been the case.
Speaker 2: There's just not a.
Speaker 3: Huge amount of people that are out searching for this end.
Speaker 3: Go to the Big Thicket National Preserve in Salad States,
Speaker 3: ask them for a permanent to conduct big Foot re
Speaker 3: search and see what they tell you from we know
Speaker 3: first end because this happened to us. So there's just
Speaker 3: the search is not there. There are many people doing
Speaker 3: this and it's never been that way. Benjamin Radford talks
Speaker 3: about all these people Benjamin Rappords have known skeptic talks
Speaker 3: about all these people throughout the last four or five
Speaker 3: decades that have conducted this great search. But when I
Speaker 3: asked him to tell me who these people are, can
Speaker 3: never listen. That's another reason there's no funding, and there
Speaker 3: really is not any sort of coordinated search.
Speaker 2: Statistically speaking, nobody's looking for bic clar nobody.
Speaker 5: You've got fifty people in the NAWAC, half of which
Speaker 5: are going on a regular basis of doing it. That's
Speaker 5: fifty people. Maybe there's another one hundred people in the
Speaker 5: state of Texas didn't as much.
Speaker 2: As we are.
Speaker 5: I don't think there's anything more than that. So why
Speaker 5: don't you find it? Because statistically speaking, nobody's looking for one.
Speaker 11: More reason, I think that, yes, why I think there's ignorance.
Speaker 11: Not to be consulting, but I think it's very likely
Speaker 11: that there have been people who have stumbled across the
Speaker 11: skeletal remains of a dem You wouldy, but you have
Speaker 11: to have someone who recognizes the significance of what they're seeing,
Speaker 11: and was it the skull or something the bones that
Speaker 11: they say that. I don't think that the vast majority
Speaker 11: of people would recognize the significance of the bones.
Speaker 2: Saying, oh, big animal is dead.
Speaker 12: And I think people underestimating the animal as well, and
Speaker 12: that plays into it. People have this perception it's a big, lumbering,
Speaker 12: slow creature. That's entirely untrue if you look at some
Speaker 12: of the more incredible reports. But these guys are seeing
Speaker 12: these animals are highly intelligent. They're very fast, you're efficient,
Speaker 12: and and they want to get out of site and
Speaker 12: they can. How the way says, oh, everybody's got a
Speaker 12: cell phone camera, how hard wouldn't be to get a picture?
Speaker 12: I'm like, do you walk through the woods with your
Speaker 12: cell phone out like this? Try to get your cell
Speaker 12: phone out and take a picture. It takes a few seconds.
Speaker 12: By then this anile's gone and it's moved into the woods.
Speaker 12: You're up against a small population. It needs a very
Speaker 12: rare sighting. When you won the lottery you get to
Speaker 12: see it, it's two or three seconds. You don't have
Speaker 12: time to respond that bass. So it's not as easy
Speaker 12: as people think. Even though we do have technology and
Speaker 12: stuff on our side, we're still at a disadvantage against
Speaker 12: them in their own territory.
Speaker 5: One last thing I just saw on the point of
Speaker 5: the camera. You can do this at all. This is
Speaker 5: a little Hoole experiment. If you've got a kid, it's
Speaker 5: perfect for that because they can be your big flub.
Speaker 13: Right.
Speaker 2: What you can do is you can have a camera
Speaker 2: sitting on.
Speaker 5: The table next to you, have it turned off because
Speaker 5: they're probably not gonna leave your camera turnout all the time,
Speaker 5: and have them does a random moments run out from
Speaker 5: behind a ouch or something, and how many times.
Speaker 2: They do that before you actually get a picture, and how.
Speaker 5: Long they have to be visible to you before you
Speaker 5: grab your camera on, pull it up, focus and pull
Speaker 5: a picture. And is everything we've experienced. These sightings happen
Speaker 5: in moments, they're over in seconds. You're talking about something
Speaker 5: that has to go on for ten, fifteen, twenty seconds.
Speaker 5: Those kind of encounters just don't happen.
Speaker 2: Or they happen so frequently. Is to be just not
Speaker 2: that that's every marking, especially here in the day. And
Speaker 2: then of course you have delight exactly right right, you
Speaker 2: have devil likes.
Speaker 6: Well, I should point out that's probably the only kind
Speaker 6: of research that should practice on your children. There's one
Speaker 6: basically directed in our group. With as many rock running
Speaker 6: incidence as we've experienced during operations, endurance and persistence are
Speaker 6: there any plans to put up cameras around the cabin
Speaker 6: and the surrounding close by areas?
Speaker 2: If so, could you go into that? And if not,
Speaker 2: why not?
Speaker 3: Between two thousand and six and two thousand thirteen we
Speaker 3: invested roughly fifty thousand dollars and the best cameras at
Speaker 3: our Commercion move out.
Speaker 2: I will tell you now, we have zero pictures of this.
Speaker 2: That's one of the things we don't know. We don't know.
Speaker 3: Incredible good luck on their behalf, in credible bad luck
Speaker 3: on our behalf.
Speaker 2: Maybe they are wary of cameras. Alpha coyote males tend
Speaker 2: to be.
Speaker 3: There's some recent studies to show that maybe it's a
Speaker 3: combination of camera technology is still not where it needs
Speaker 3: to be.
Speaker 2: And I could send that with some authority. Because I've
Speaker 2: watched a black.
Speaker 3: Bear for two minutes stand and just move around, sniff
Speaker 3: between three RECONINGX cameras right in the center of me.
Speaker 2: I'm not the only one that saw it.
Speaker 3: Milke masers there, Todd's six hundred dollars cameras.
Speaker 2: Three six hundred dollars cameras. You get so many pictures
Speaker 2: we got in that black bear.
Speaker 3: Zero with that, instances where we walk in front of
Speaker 3: the cameras to change the cameras out and the camera
Speaker 3: doesn't get a picture of us. So we're very frustrated.
Speaker 3: But I will tell you that we've sold almost.
Speaker 2: All of our cameras. We've only got a few lift.
Speaker 3: Now we're looking at some sort of surveillance system, a
Speaker 3: passive surveillance system. It's not triggered by ideed, it's not
Speaker 3: triggered by motion, it's constantly going. Hopefully that provide some footage,
Speaker 3: but as many there are a number of us who
Speaker 3: don't believe footage is to do the trick signs requires
Speaker 3: its best.
Speaker 5: What we would have used the cameras for is to
Speaker 5: understand how they're moving around the cabin. We know they're
Speaker 5: out there, we know they're moving around, whether it's a
Speaker 5: cabin or temp or whatever. In this case, it's a
Speaker 5: pick structure, so we get attach cameras to it. We
Speaker 5: need to know how they're doing it. It's part of
Speaker 5: what's going to ultimately solve this mystery that we're looking
Speaker 5: at different systems. Of course, we have problems out there
Speaker 5: with electricity. We've got all kinds of sort of environmental issues.
Speaker 5: If it's a rough environment, so it has to be
Speaker 5: a harder unit. So it's not going to be the
Speaker 5: cheapest the one you're going to get off the shelf.
Speaker 5: But we are looking at that technology and hopefully successful
Speaker 5: confidence will allow us to pike something like that.
Speaker 3: We invested last year Robbers Persistence. We invested in a
Speaker 3: really hot dollar I was going to say, a solar
Speaker 3: power generation system. I gotta tell you a the three
Speaker 3: days we were ready to keep that thing at the
Speaker 3: river into.
Speaker 2: The crea because it just it.
Speaker 3: Wasn't keeping up with our power requirements. We couldn't keep
Speaker 3: the stuff charged. We couldn't keep our own personal cameras charge,
Speaker 3: we couldn't keep audio of would be charged. So it's
Speaker 3: quite a challenge in an environmental dad, and you're on
Speaker 3: a shoe string budget and you're trying to keep everything
Speaker 3: operating in the image, it's quite a challenge.
Speaker 5: I was going to say that the one way we
Speaker 5: could raise money is by field testing pables stuff like that.
Speaker 5: We had one of these things that looked up to
Speaker 5: a solar thing. The battery was full charger. I plugged
Speaker 5: my computer and in it was suck a drying meat
Speaker 5: and it was gone, Yeah, we're on the laptops out
Speaker 5: with being canned. Electricity is a huge challenge for us
Speaker 5: out there.
Speaker 6: I point out too, we're operating in an area where
Speaker 6: we know there are mountain mins. We've never gotten one
Speaker 6: picture of a mountain line either, and they do exist. Okay,
Speaker 6: mister Gates says, it's for you if you ever realized
Speaker 6: you were being intentionally host and so what did you
Speaker 6: do about it?
Speaker 7: Only once we did a story on the Lizard Band
Speaker 7: of South Caroline, South Caroline, and I am here to
Speaker 7: tell you that I found believing the lizard Man.
Speaker 1: So stay tuned for more sasquatch out to see. We'll
Speaker 1: be right back after these messages.
Speaker 8: Well, it was, I mean, a really interesting thing.
Speaker 7: We we went there and we started talking to all
Speaker 7: these different people in the story find it became clear,
Speaker 7: at least to me, it became clear what had happened.
Speaker 8: And then it became very clear off camera what what
Speaker 8: it happened.
Speaker 7: It fell to the end, like doing an expose on Bishop,
Speaker 7: South Carolina, which has a kind of geeking out a.
Speaker 8: Little bit of tourism and stuff. Office I think Jimmy
Speaker 8: retired share Oh you're listen. Truth Trus somewhat solicite, true
Speaker 8: Tree dwn Tree.
Speaker 2: Zi, Yeah, it's truth Dale.
Speaker 8: Yeah.
Speaker 7: That was the only time that I think we knowing
Speaker 7: we were being played a little bit, But in the
Speaker 7: end it felt like it didn't.
Speaker 8: Really seem like a nice thing could do to tear
Speaker 8: the story down.
Speaker 10: I was advited to be an expert consultant on another story,
Speaker 10: a similar story at the same place, but a different dog,
Speaker 10: fum Manry. They provided me with pictures of this footprint.
Speaker 10: If you haven't seen it, it's this strange multilobed thing
Speaker 10: that ends in three segmented toes, radiate out and then
Speaker 10: have these very sharp claw marks. So I had enough
Speaker 10: time to prepare, so I put together a little float
Speaker 10: book that had some basic introduction about, first of all,
Speaker 10: the reduction of digits in animals that become more and
Speaker 10: more cursorial or adapted to running, that moved from having
Speaker 10: their heel on the ground planted grade to digital grade
Speaker 10: to ungular grade.
Speaker 2: And I showed how an animal that.
Speaker 10: Had only three toes would not have a black foot
Speaker 10: and it would be unprecedented. I even had a whole
Speaker 10: litany of illustrations of claw marks bare claw marks on trees,
Speaker 10: blck bear claw marks in clay, et cetera, especially once
Speaker 10: in clay, were interesting.
Speaker 2: Showed the anatomy of the.
Speaker 10: Claw with its ungule and subungule, and how it has
Speaker 10: this kind of hollowed out very underneath, and it has
Speaker 10: a very distinctive pattern.
Speaker 2: In the way which in claws.
Speaker 10: So flipped through and explained it almost to the good retired sheriff,
Speaker 10: and I pointed out, I said, well, honestly, these opes
Speaker 10: like claw marks at all. They were made by a
Speaker 10: boy knife. I said, I have to say, I'm just
Speaker 10: afraid that there's no credibility to this. And he just
Speaker 10: looks at me with this a big old sudden smile
Speaker 10: and said, thank you very much.
Speaker 2: So I'm for your cou I really appreciate. And then
Speaker 2: later over in the corner of the producers are sitting
Speaker 2: there trying to stifle their their laughter, and they came
Speaker 2: up to me afterwards. He said, oh, no, that's great.
Speaker 2: You did a great job.
Speaker 10: He said, we already knew it was all hosed, and
Speaker 10: the fellow of the debuty who was responsible for making
Speaker 10: the tracks that already admitted it to us, and the
Speaker 10: guy that claimed the trim on the car and didn't
Speaker 10: shoot up the river to port who in jail so
Speaker 10: he couldn't contend appear on the namp. It was either
Speaker 10: the neighbor's dog or a raccoon and then shoot up
Speaker 10: in the grill. So I was like, I was entertainment.
Speaker 2: Then you're right.
Speaker 10: Apparently the sheriff had gone around town and said, okay,
Speaker 10: just go along with the story.
Speaker 2: Right for tourists, he was a lizard.
Speaker 7: Man parade, one of the food branks get a local bravery,
Speaker 7: and he can't.
Speaker 6: Experience with the sheriff who I didn't believe my story
Speaker 6: for once, but it's okay.
Speaker 2: Kathy, is this for you?
Speaker 6: Is there any evidence of tool use a big foot
Speaker 6: similar to that that you've seen chimpanzees, or possibly even
Speaker 6: more advanced tool.
Speaker 2: Use than that, not be anybody's identified.
Speaker 14: I spend three days in areas and I took the
Speaker 14: loved them around the area. Actually didn't see any artifacts
Speaker 14: at all, even human made artifacts except for one strange
Speaker 14: possible petroglyph. But there was no evidence of any kind
Speaker 14: of grass use or state modification or anything like.
Speaker 6: That except for rocks themselves and whatever they hit the
Speaker 6: treats with their tools.
Speaker 2: Maybe you could just what would be a loose definition
Speaker 2: of a tool.
Speaker 6: What constitutes just a stick on the ground versus being
Speaker 6: a tool of some kind.
Speaker 14: It needs to be modified, and simply picking up a
Speaker 14: rock and flinging them together it's not modified or using
Speaker 14: them two objects, not changing them in any way. It's
Speaker 14: not enough to prove that you have the function of
Speaker 14: a line to mangels. I'm not saying they do or don't.
Speaker 14: I don't know, but I didn't see anything like that.
Speaker 2: I know at one.
Speaker 14: Point, Peace of Firewood had moved from the dead patio
Speaker 14: and was moved over to an area and laid against
Speaker 14: a tree. And when they demonstrated the firewood up against
Speaker 14: the tree and made the exact same sound of a
Speaker 14: tree knock that people have been hearing.
Speaker 2: So that's very clever.
Speaker 14: But they didn't modify in itself in order to create
Speaker 14: the tool.
Speaker 3: If Kathy would be if they tore a limb off
Speaker 3: of the tree and used that deep the tree, would
Speaker 3: that be the modification you're talking about.
Speaker 14: It would be primitive enough. They trying to create something.
Speaker 14: They didn't just pick it up off the ground, use.
Speaker 4: It, throw it back down.
Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, doctor Meldrid this was for you.
Speaker 6: I'm assuming this is referring to one of the Monster
Speaker 6: Quest episodes that you peered in. Is are you going
Speaker 6: back to the cabin where you had the most big
Speaker 6: foot action, rocks were thrown, etc.
Speaker 10: After the episode in which the rocks were thrown at
Speaker 10: the cabin, did go back, but it was a very
Speaker 10: different set of circumstances.
Speaker 2: We were a little bit earlier in the season that
Speaker 2: spring was unseasonably cool, and.
Speaker 10: People had commented as well as we drove up through Minnesota,
Speaker 10: the blueberry festivals were all crank.
Speaker 2: They were going to have to.
Speaker 10: Actually truck blueberries up from the sound because they hadn't
Speaker 10: runten yet. It had an impact on us because but
Speaker 10: we got upen to Central Ontario, the understory, which was
Speaker 10: about twenty to forty percent blueberry, it weren't even in
Speaker 10: flower yet and so there.
Speaker 2: Was no right fruit.
Speaker 10: As a result of that coolness and low productivity, there
Speaker 10: was a very little wildlife activity, just had a sense
Speaker 10: of being deserted. So after days and days we had
Speaker 10: all these rand schemes of these observation tents, blackouts and things.
Speaker 2: Surveyance cameras attached to every corner of the cabin.
Speaker 10: Nothing was happening, And then it happened that one of
Speaker 10: the pilots stopped in to pick up some fuel and
Speaker 10: he said, oh yeah, there was just a story on
Speaker 10: the radio that there was exciting grassy and arrows down
Speaker 10: on the reservation, which was about two hundred and fifty
Speaker 10: miles southwest of US. With the little Afterloving crew, we
Speaker 10: would pulled up steaks and we went in the south
Speaker 10: went and investigated that.
Speaker 2: It was a very good, very credible visual.
Speaker 10: Contact by an elderly woman and her adult daughter who
Speaker 10: were on their way up to pick blueberries.
Speaker 2: They were right been there. There was a big clear
Speaker 2: cut area that had overgrown blueberries.
Speaker 10: And it was due forourns luscious growth I've seen on
Speaker 10: the way out. They had a signing and saw this
Speaker 10: creature walking down the road as soon as he saw
Speaker 10: the car, and it just veered off the road into
Speaker 10: the brush. Her adult son came up that afternoon to
Speaker 10: the approximate area and found some tracks which he made
Speaker 10: a cast of.
Speaker 2: They turned out to be bare unfortunately, And I do.
Speaker 10: Think based on interview about the two women that their
Speaker 10: story was very credible.
Speaker 2: There were bear tracks all over the place. You couldn't
Speaker 2: help it.
Speaker 10: Stumble on bear tracks because they were attracted to their
Speaker 10: blueberries as well.
Speaker 2: I just chalked it up to the fact that he
Speaker 2: stopped the.
Speaker 10: First tracks he found, which happened to be there, and
Speaker 10: there was an old overstep print that gave the impression
Speaker 10: of any long ended sasquash track.
Speaker 2: It was very easy to point out that the characters
Speaker 2: that distinguished it, and.
Speaker 10: I'm asked this repeatedly in followed upon that episode. They
Speaker 10: did send some of the evidence, some of the tissue
Speaker 10: that was collected on the first episode for a follow up.
Speaker 10: By that time the results came back as bacteriative DNA.
Speaker 10: There was no private the evening to be extracted.
Speaker 2: I was amazed that they got anything in the first line.
Speaker 2: I actually mentioned any whether.
Speaker 10: That might have been some an intamination due to the
Speaker 10: extensive handling of the smiths. And you have to realize
Speaker 10: that Screwmore was leaning up against the cabin out in
Speaker 10: the elements.
Speaker 2: For two years before we examined it, so it had
Speaker 2: been exposed as well. And whether the elements the u
Speaker 2: uraniation of the sunlight, I didn't expect them to find anything.
Speaker 10: I don't think there's any magical about that cabin, and
Speaker 10: I have no plans to go back because just I think.
Speaker 2: That every once in a while, once.
Speaker 10: In a blue moon, they get lucky because some of
Speaker 10: the animals they're conditioned.
Speaker 2: They have this unusual habit there.
Speaker 10: When the tenants check out in the cabin, rather than
Speaker 10: carry out all the perishable foods, there's actually a post
Speaker 10: sign right there by the refrigerator that says, throw all
Speaker 10: your perishables, bread, vegetables, fruit out behind the outhouse, which
Speaker 10: is about fifty sixty yards behind the cabin at the
Speaker 10: edge of the forest. It would take long to condition
Speaker 10: a few animals bears and baby sash watching the scene.
Speaker 10: When you hear a float plane go by, that means
Speaker 10: that in the next day or two, there's going to
Speaker 10: pee a whole schmort it's worn out behind the mountain.
Speaker 2: Us, so let's go check it out. I've had people
Speaker 2: suggest that.
Speaker 10: They wanted to rend the cabin through the entire summer.
Speaker 10: I hope you like to fish, because you're going to
Speaker 10: have a lot of time on your edge.
Speaker 2: You can't go anywhere in that terrain.
Speaker 10: It's just extremely thick jungles, crevice and crack and filled
Speaker 10: with Moss and you could see us a couple of
Speaker 10: shots on the documentary where I'm walking out to foot
Speaker 10: up the camera and just about bringing my legs that
Speaker 10: be hit a popple.
Speaker 2: It travels security quite both Tom the legs portages. It
Speaker 2: was interesting place. The next one is for mister Mounds.
Speaker 2: If push came to show, could you or someone else
Speaker 2: have created Patterson Gimlin footage? And it's a part too.
Speaker 2: What is the earliest known use of a costume skin.
Speaker 10: That could stretch and compress in a special effects field
Speaker 10: that you're aware of.
Speaker 9: It's marginal if a perfect Patty could be done today.
Speaker 2: The head is still problematic.
Speaker 9: It's small and the only thing we can do we
Speaker 9: wh make a mask is to add to the head
Speaker 9: of a human being, So we.
Speaker 8: Try to make something looks smaller by adding somewhere else.
Speaker 2: I had kids bigger.
Speaker 9: Pattie's head is remarkably small in compact for her body,
Speaker 9: but it's very non.
Speaker 2: Human and it's form with a heavy braw ridge and
Speaker 2: the heads.
Speaker 8: On a straight back, So that part of Patty probably still.
Speaker 9: Couldn't be done today with any of the technology that
Speaker 9: we have. Get it any human and get it to
Speaker 9: look right. The rest of the body could be done.
Speaker 9: It would certainly not be easy. It would take a
Speaker 9: remarkably talented person or team of people, because actually there
Speaker 9: are very few makeup artists who actually can do everything
Speaker 9: start to finish. Nowadays, almost everything is done by teams
Speaker 9: of specialists. When sculps, when molds, when cast figure finishes,
Speaker 9: when does the erwork, one trims and.
Speaker 2: Pain set, one does the pain job it's on.
Speaker 9: So it's actually rather rare for even one person to
Speaker 9: have a complete skill set. But if they were to
Speaker 9: attempt it today, even with all the material advances more
Speaker 9: sophisticated than what was in nineteen sixty seven, I would
Speaker 9: have to say, the head is still all but impossible.
Speaker 9: If you really are talking about getting the right size
Speaker 9: and the right shape, and do look at what we
Speaker 9: see in the film, I'd still say, there's your stumbling book.
Speaker 9: Everything else i'd pointed out presentation. We could probably work
Speaker 9: around it today and somehow make it work, But it
Speaker 9: wouldn't be easy. To take a remarkable amount of skill.
Speaker 9: But the head, the head stole problem.
Speaker 8: I have no solution for, and trust me, in the
Speaker 8: last five years.
Speaker 2: Every day I went to that picture I've said, okay,
Speaker 2: it's a host. How would I do it?
Speaker 9: And I keep drawing the black That'd be my question
Speaker 9: number one. I don't think anybody can figure out how
Speaker 9: to make the head the shape and size that it
Speaker 9: is in proportionable body. In terms of materials, all of
Speaker 9: the new materials, the stretch materials. In terms of stretch fur,
Speaker 9: there are a lot of resonance compounds now that could
Speaker 9: produce some breast across thesis that has the motion that
Speaker 9: you saw where then you're using it extensively on.
Speaker 2: Going to call Norwood.
Speaker 9: When he made it, Eddie Murphy play himself as well
Speaker 9: as his fat girlfriend and full body soup was made
Speaker 9: out of these residant compounds of Ejping Company makes. They
Speaker 9: were remarkable in terms of the labbiness and there were
Speaker 9: responsiveness of practice. So those things are available now, but
Speaker 9: those rest of compounds didn't even start being introduced until
Speaker 9: the late eighties, didn't become well refined until the nineties.
Speaker 9: The stretch fur that you would need to do anything
Speaker 9: that would be close to what we see on patty.
Speaker 9: National Fiber Technology developed it roughly around nineteen eighty four,
Speaker 9: introduced it to the motion picture industry thereabouts and started
Speaker 9: to become successfully popular in the middle of the late eighties,
Speaker 9: which is almost twenty years too late. In nineteen sixty seven,
Speaker 9: materials weren't there. That is a big strike against fun
Speaker 9: impossibility of true costume back then. But even if we
Speaker 9: were to try it today, the head is a problem.
Speaker 9: I really haven't given it a lot of thought. I
Speaker 9: still have a kind a solution for it, unless you
Speaker 9: can find somebody who's really I had to break into
Speaker 9: the business and doesn't mind having a massive at bodomy
Speaker 9: in order to get into that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's about it.
Speaker 12: A lot of people probably know that Philip Morris claims
Speaker 12: to have made the suit that Roger Patterson used because
Speaker 12: he was a makro of costumes. Guerrilla Costume actually interviewed
Speaker 12: Philip Morris about this and challenged him.
Speaker 2: On some of the aspects, but suffice to.
Speaker 12: Say, they tried to recreate the suit, even blow of heart,
Speaker 12: Philip Morris trying himself in which they were going to air.
Speaker 2: I believe it was on National Geographic.
Speaker 12: So we made this new suit that was supposed to
Speaker 12: be just like what he was making then, although it
Speaker 12: didn't look anything like the gorilla costumes he was making
Speaker 12: back in the sixties. But in that film they were
Speaker 12: gonna air him. This was going to blow the whole thing.
Speaker 12: It looks so horrible that they do a documentary right
Speaker 12: up to the point where they're going to show you
Speaker 12: his new, brand new suit. It's going to disprove the
Speaker 12: whole thing. They showed a Patterson film because the thing
Speaker 12: looked so bad. They looked bad, so it's a TV show.
Speaker 2: It's entering.
Speaker 12: They end up showing the patch of films. So these
Speaker 12: will say. Even Philip Morris, who claimed he made the suit,
Speaker 12: could not even reproduce the suit in recent times.
Speaker 2: And no one's been able to show us that suit either.
Speaker 15: He told me he knows where the suit is. It's
Speaker 15: in the hand of some He wouldn't give me a name.
Speaker 15: I said, man, you show me the suit, we can
Speaker 15: solve it right now. He said, maybe sometimes that person
Speaker 15: wants to come.
Speaker 12: Forward, but so far they don't show me the suit.
Speaker 2: Okay. This one is a question for Brian Brown and
Speaker 2: doctor Meldrum.
Speaker 6: Is the taking of a specimen necessary to prove the
Speaker 6: existence of Bigfoot to science, and if so, do you
Speaker 6: advocate the taking of sid.
Speaker 2: Specimen I'll go first.
Speaker 5: I'm not a scientist, but I can speak to what
Speaker 5: I have learned and try to answer this question myself.
Speaker 5: I think that it is possible to prove the existence
Speaker 5: of an animal without taking a specimen. I think that
Speaker 5: the problem is when you go beyond that no, to say,
Speaker 5: let's just get there are issues with DNA there, as
Speaker 5: I touched on and mean in my presentation, you have
Speaker 5: to have a problemnance in that DNA.
Speaker 2: What is the chain of custody of the in DNA?
Speaker 2: Some DNA, depending on how you got it, has a
Speaker 2: shelf life Scott for example one.
Speaker 5: And that doctor Bellman talked about that you have to
Speaker 5: get that preserve at the certain amount of time. So
Speaker 5: what happens is when you move away from that, you
Speaker 5: start finding yourself in a smaller circle of opportunity. But
Speaker 5: while I'm not going to say it's impossible to establish
Speaker 5: the species any other way, I will say that the
Speaker 5: most efficient one to take me through and through the
Speaker 5: taking of a type specimen. I'd also say, from what
Speaker 5: I understand, I think Professor Homer speak to this better
Speaker 5: than I can. The of those very rare cases where
Speaker 5: animals have been listed through not taking the specimen. Ultimately
Speaker 5: a specimen was taken. There must be a type specimen.
Speaker 5: That's just how it works. So even if you can
Speaker 5: establish an animal without the type specimen, eventually it will
Speaker 5: be taken, whether it may find a dead one or
Speaker 5: they go and make it dead one.
Speaker 2: That's how it works, and it probably won't just be one.
Speaker 2: That would be my answer. Are the conventions of zoological taxonomy.
Speaker 10: A type is required, and that needs to be a
Speaker 10: body or a diagnostically significant portion of the body. However,
Speaker 10: there has been discussion in the literature, in the conservation literature,
Speaker 10: and I'm particularly aware of issues.
Speaker 2: Involving primates, where authors.
Speaker 10: And papers have argued that, given the endangered status of
Speaker 10: so many newly discovered species of prime, that perhaps we
Speaker 10: should move beyond the sort of Victorian era and ethic
Speaker 10: off shoot first and asked questions later, and except as
Speaker 10: a type specimen of voucher sample.
Speaker 2: Of DNA that is an accession in the museum. So
Speaker 2: that debate is ongoing.
Speaker 10: It certainly is not established and sasquatch, may you know
Speaker 10: you have, Doctor Psykes is successful and some novel DNA
Speaker 10: sequences are clearly incredibly demonstrated while there isn't a standard
Speaker 10: against which to compare those, we can't compare sequences based
Speaker 10: on various traits. We can establish what it's nearest neighbors are,
Speaker 10: we can establish where it fits into the phylogenetic tree.
Speaker 2: But I just ask a good question.
Speaker 8: Let's say you did actually body an oppifuerity a defend.
Speaker 3: Yourself, whatever you have, what would you do with the
Speaker 3: why now shot get narrowed around you have?
Speaker 2: Depending on your circumstances.
Speaker 10: I mean, if you're able to get assistancy in and
Speaker 10: alert the necessary authorities or whatever, well, who would be
Speaker 10: the necessary.
Speaker 2: That's a good question.
Speaker 10: If you're a conspiracy theorist, then maybe you don't want
Speaker 10: to contact the devote my fishing game, and so you
Speaker 10: may want to go to a trust in academic contact
Speaker 10: and work through those channels. If you're in a situation
Speaker 10: where you can't you know, it's remotes and you can't
Speaker 10: or you don't feel you're safe to remain there with
Speaker 10: the body, and I'd say get a portable chunk of it.
Speaker 10: And in the case of diagnostic, because you have a
Speaker 10: lot of tissue, obviously that's gonna be the creative things
Speaker 10: that will be the DNA, but a job that has
Speaker 10: molar teeth on it. Traditionally the morbology molar teeth that
Speaker 10: has been the basis as much as primary taxonomy. You
Speaker 10: could certainly establish a novel species and it's entities with
Speaker 10: that type of a specimen.
Speaker 2: Take at that point, no recent message.
Speaker 3: We've drawn up in photocologies for that situation. We're gonna
Speaker 3: leave with the minimum of the head. That's the fair
Speaker 3: minimum what we're gonna leave with. And then we have
Speaker 3: a set of photovols. We have drawn up a list
Speaker 3: of context, set of actions.
Speaker 2: That we're can take. That's what we're working toward.
Speaker 5: You just consider the logistical challenge of moving an hunder
Speaker 5: pound massive flesh right, and then it's gonna be difficult.
Speaker 2: But now we have in place equipment that you use
Speaker 2: them as big animals. So the facility, we know.
Speaker 5: What we're going to do when it happens. The only
Speaker 5: question is how much of it can we get out,
Speaker 5: and that really depends on where it is. Then it
Speaker 5: depends on other environmental factors. We've worked through many scenarios.
Speaker 5: You come up with plants and continuity plans because you
Speaker 5: know that things aren't going to work up the way
Speaker 5: you think they are.
Speaker 2: But we've thought it through a lot.
Speaker 9: Actually from a question just a moment ago. It inspired
Speaker 9: me to once ask Jeff question, with the DNA anything, Okay,
Speaker 9: let's say you get.
Speaker 2: A hair or a drop of blood.
Speaker 9: Let's say it hare, for example, comes back unknown prime,
Speaker 9: but it still has a DNA sequence that could be identified.
Speaker 9: So you could basically start it out and say this
Speaker 9: unknown primate has this DNA ventnor let's say you have
Speaker 9: a second hair or some.
Speaker 2: Other biological aspect, drop of blood or something.
Speaker 9: Like that, and the DNA pattern comes back matching the
Speaker 9: previous sample.
Speaker 2: Say it's the same species as.
Speaker 9: I mean, he just wondering if there were enough re
Speaker 9: occurrences of that same unknown pattern to say it is
Speaker 9: a species and there are multiple biological examples of it.
Speaker 9: Do you think that might be sufficient to get a
Speaker 9: recognition of species. It could potentially. I mean, in fact,
Speaker 9: we've done.
Speaker 10: That exercise with the hair based on its own morphology
Speaker 10: back when it first struck up an acquaintance with doctor
Speaker 10: Fahrenbach and we were comparing notes and ideas.
Speaker 2: One of the things that I said to him, we have.
Speaker 10: All these independent analyzes and hair that have come back
Speaker 10: as unknown.
Speaker 2: But if these are.
Speaker 16: Coming from a single species, those characteristics that are distinguishing
Speaker 16: these samples preventing them from being attributed to any known species,
Speaker 16: must be consistent.
Speaker 2: So let's go back and look at some of those reports.
Speaker 10: We actually dug back in content some of the labs
Speaker 10: and found published reports in obecure places, and they were
Speaker 10: remarkably consistent. It was suggesting that there were independent hair
Speaker 10: samples that defied attribution, that all had a consistent suite
Speaker 10: of characteristics.
Speaker 2: That he united them with one another. Now we're almost
Speaker 2: to a point.
Speaker 10: I've been working with Hender, and since he's now in retirement,
Speaker 10: he has more fun looking through his telescope than he
Speaker 10: does through microscope these days. But we're working on putting
Speaker 10: together a fine paper to summarize his work and what
Speaker 10: I have done since his retirement, in order on the
Speaker 10: basis of the morphology, because being an anatomist, as opposed
Speaker 10: to be lectary biologists, you can't just simply ignore.
Speaker 17: The morphology in lieu of wanting to have a DNA.
Speaker 17: The morphology says somebody's hair exists, and they're from some
Speaker 17: anem And if we can't put our finger on it
Speaker 17: right now.
Speaker 2: That suggests that there's some novel and love there.
Speaker 10: We will be working on that that published and hopefullully
Speaker 10: that will be a first day. But as far as
Speaker 10: the DNA, as far as DAN is establishing the identity
Speaker 10: of establishing the reality of the species, for most skeptics
Speaker 10: out there, it's going to take a specimen on the
Speaker 10: slab in front of them before they'll acknowledge, because even
Speaker 10: with DNA it becomes indirect.
Speaker 2: If you have a published sequence of numbers, you don't
Speaker 2: have a photograph of the physical remains of a creature
Speaker 2: of any type. So they'll always given the what.
Speaker 10: They perceive as the extraordinary nature of this phenomena, this proposition,
Speaker 10: they'll want the utmost inevidence to establish its.
Speaker 5: The truth is the NAWAS is a conservation group and
Speaker 5: this is not an academic.
Speaker 7: Question for us.
Speaker 2: We're not trying to figure out a new, a normal
Speaker 2: way of establishing species.
Speaker 5: If you look at burial surveillance and photography of the
Speaker 5: wild areas in this country, you see what's happened in
Speaker 5: them over the past several decades. We don't have a
Speaker 5: lot of time, so we're not trying to come up
Speaker 5: with the most interesting way of establishing this exotic new
Speaker 5: priming in North America.
Speaker 18: We're trying to.
Speaker 2: Establish the priming North America so we can do our job.
Speaker 5: Which is to conserve them and their environment. The most
Speaker 5: efficient way to do that is to bring back a
Speaker 5: body or a piece of body.
Speaker 2: There may be other ways, and if.
Speaker 5: We happen upon one of those ways in the course
Speaker 5: of our work, for instance, the blood samples that we've
Speaker 5: turned on the rock.
Speaker 2: If that had done it, we would have been thrilled,
Speaker 2: we would have been done.
Speaker 5: But the fact is, if we have a mission and
Speaker 5: that's the desert the animal in this environment, the most
Speaker 5: efficient way to do that, and we believe there is
Speaker 5: a clock and ticking, the most efficient way to do
Speaker 5: that is to bring inspessive.
Speaker 8: So y'all advocate killing it, and what y'all are saying.
Speaker 2: I absolutely do. Think about a live specimen. Take a
Speaker 2: lot of specimal.
Speaker 8: Take a hole next to the cabin and they're walking.
Speaker 1: Mind.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I can figure out when to do it.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Sure. Conservation is not about individuals. Conservations about populations of animals.
Speaker 2: Conservationists are interested in an entire population of the species.
Speaker 3: That's what conservations all about Doctor Melvin talked about it
Speaker 3: the old way of shooting first, asking questions later. But
Speaker 3: if there's still many wild al bologists, say Brian Ronald
Speaker 3: Ree examples this morning of wild biologists who said, you
Speaker 3: must have a type specie. It's unpleasant for some people
Speaker 3: with that is just the way it's You got to
Speaker 3: have a type specimen for all intents and purposes.
Speaker 12: Right now, this is the Texas Unicorn in Conference.
Speaker 2: That's what this is to most of the world.
Speaker 3: And until there can be a body lying on this
Speaker 3: date to present to science, academia and the world, we
Speaker 3: may as well be talked about lepracauns and unicorns and minotaurs.
Speaker 2: And that's just the hartful truth.
Speaker 1: But what are you.
Speaker 8: Implying what they never got.
Speaker 13: About it?
Speaker 2: I think if I got read and scat maybe there's
Speaker 2: a question back in the l was for the life
Speaker 2: and taking out in alpha male Kevin's who's going through.
Speaker 3: The survivability if if the population cannot sustain the loss
Speaker 3: of one individual, it's doomed.
Speaker 2: Anyone sh understand?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 19: My question is the people involved in world and lives
Speaker 19: to talk with marsh and I know there are complications
Speaker 19: with the traderations of trend guards that is there getting
Speaker 19: eight discussion tranquilize Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, sure, completely sure of the With regard to the Alma.
Speaker 5: Mail question, this is a group of individuals and based
Speaker 5: on our observations, we don't know for sure, but based
Speaker 5: on our observations, we believe that there are multiple animals
Speaker 5: and we also believe that in case it is driven
Speaker 5: by an alpha mail, their social structures are surrounding an
Speaker 5: alpha male. There are probably other animals based on our
Speaker 5: observations that are in our beliefs, there are other animals
Speaker 5: that will step up. So it isn't that if we
Speaker 5: take one we're destroying twelve. We don't think that's sames.
Speaker 5: Secondarily with regards to tranquilizers or tricky business, but this
Speaker 5: is a technology that's been developed for animal husband for
Speaker 5: tranquilizing animals that are in pens that you know how
Speaker 5: much they weigh and exactly how much seener did you use.
Speaker 5: What would likely happen in the case of us using
Speaker 5: a tranquilizer gun is either we missed the thing entirely
Speaker 5: because you don't have the same velocity of a tranquilizing
Speaker 5: earth to do a let slow.
Speaker 2: Nothing would happen, or we'd hit the thing and it
Speaker 2: would run off.
Speaker 5: Then either get a little queezy and then get mad
Speaker 5: at us because we made it sick, or it would
Speaker 5: fall asleep peacefully and we don't know where it is
Speaker 5: so we can't pick it up, or it would die
Speaker 5: because we gave it too much sutive. Again, we're not
Speaker 5: saying there is no other way. We're saying that we
Speaker 5: have a mission to fulfill and we're trying to accomplish the.
Speaker 2: Most efficient way of doing them. We don't have unlimited resources.
Speaker 2: And the other thing that we looked at with tranquiser
Speaker 2: technology is expensive.
Speaker 5: The rifles are expensive, and the stuff you put in
Speaker 5: them is expensive, and to your point, a lot of
Speaker 5: it has to be refrigerate.
Speaker 2: So it sounds great. I mean, maybe we can to
Speaker 2: dig a hole. Then you follow me, bet.
Speaker 5: An eight hundred pound, pissed off, eight foot tall thing
Speaker 5: in a hole. The hole has to be sixteen feet
Speaker 5: deep just to keep it from coming out and killing you.
Speaker 2: Right, and then what do you do with it?
Speaker 7: Right?
Speaker 2: What do you can you just fill and pass it
Speaker 2: back up?
Speaker 7: You know?
Speaker 2: Not all these things that just logistically are And I
Speaker 2: have a very good friend. Sometime you may be aware
Speaker 2: of it.
Speaker 5: Who said, you're just writing the easy way out, and
Speaker 5: there's a difference between ease and efficiency, and that's really
Speaker 5: what it works out.
Speaker 9: I like that, and had just one in the Breeze
Speaker 9: thing about tranquilization question. My background in the movies, I've
Speaker 9: worked very extensively, not just with people. Then I've probably
Speaker 9: done more makeup effects on animals than any other makeup
Speaker 9: artists in Hollywood.
Speaker 2: On one particular film, you might know it.
Speaker 9: It was called Beastmaster, Mark Singer and Tanya roberts Nade.
Speaker 2: Around Aby three.
Speaker 9: There's a big black giant leverard in there, which is
Speaker 9: nothing more than a tiger who has dyed black. Ralph
Speaker 9: Elfer was the owner of the animals. We had four
Speaker 9: tigers that we were.
Speaker 2: Going to use.
Speaker 9: I was on the team that dyed the tigers black.
Speaker 9: We use three boxes of Lady Claral number one black
Speaker 9: to do each tiger. We started with the first one,
Speaker 9: which is a tiger name assaulted him. He was about
Speaker 9: three hundred three hundred fifty pounds thereabouts. He was their
Speaker 9: best tiger. I'd even go on a cage with him myself.
Speaker 9: I'd walked him and everything. He was an amazing tiger.
Speaker 9: But the two veterinarians who were there, and these are
Speaker 9: both exotic animal veterinarians, they.
Speaker 8: Looked at him in his cage and said, yeah, he looks.
Speaker 9: Like he's about three fifty, and they set their tranquilizer
Speaker 9: does for that, tranquilized him, put him down, dyed in black,
Speaker 9: and we only found out afterwards they had over tranquilized him.
Speaker 9: He never fully came back up. He lingered for about
Speaker 9: two weeks and he died. This was their best tiger.
Speaker 9: He was truly a wonderful cats. I literally know him personally.
Speaker 9: But the tragedy was that even with two trained veterinarians
Speaker 9: who do exotic animals and an animal right there ten
Speaker 9: feet away from you, did you try and engage so
Speaker 9: you can calculate the method of the dosage of the tranquilizer.
Speaker 2: You get it off, you'll lose the animal or it
Speaker 2: won't go down enough.
Speaker 8: It's that deling. So the idea to looking at a
Speaker 8: beast and saying, hey.
Speaker 2: Look it's pretty good.
Speaker 9: Let's use fifty ccs and you'll load it in the
Speaker 9: gun and you shoot on your chances of being the
Speaker 9: right amount of tranquilization to be effective.
Speaker 2: I give it about one percent.
Speaker 8: Alright, looks so easy on TV.
Speaker 5: This is the point though, good I was gonna make
Speaker 5: and then we can wrap this up. For my analogy
Speaker 5: around this is for people who don't know anything about
Speaker 5: firearms and not as a gun is a gun, right,
Speaker 5: I have a gun, so I can shoot anything and
Speaker 5: kill it.
Speaker 2: The reality is, of course the twenty two is different,
Speaker 2: but they're not all the same.
Speaker 5: All these other alternatives, for instance, tranquilization with technology is complicated.
Speaker 5: We don't know anything about that, and the amount of
Speaker 5: money and time we would spend buying all this stuff
Speaker 5: trial and error.
Speaker 2: And then probably not getting anything again. Anyway, it's outside
Speaker 2: of what we can do.
Speaker 5: And again to to put an escamation point on it
Speaker 5: or a conservation group, we're trying to achieve a goal,
Speaker 5: and every day that we don't is a day that
Speaker 5: our goal may be unachievable. We're one day closer to.
Speaker 2: That goal, and we're going to get there the most
Speaker 2: efficient way we can. We're not going to go there
Speaker 2: in a straight line. There's another way we'll do it,
Speaker 2: but we're going to get the most efficient way we can.
Speaker 1: And stay tuned for more Sasquatch out to see. We'll
Speaker 1: be right back after these messages.
Speaker 2: Very good, Josh Gabs.
Speaker 6: How do you choose your next investigation site and where
Speaker 6: are you going to go next?
Speaker 7: We loowe for first and foremost places where there are
Speaker 7: good stories that are recent and relevant. We don't want
Speaker 7: to go investigate a cryptive that nobody claims to have
Speaker 7: seen in the last thousand years.
Speaker 2: We're not going to go over a dragon.
Speaker 7: We want to go to a place where we can
Speaker 7: meet people that have had current experiences. I think from
Speaker 7: a storytelling perspective, if you look at it from the
Speaker 7: chief nicle, if you're a viewer of a destiny, it's
Speaker 7: true that you don't necessarily believe in creature acts. But
Speaker 7: I can introduce you to a credible same person who
Speaker 7: has a really compelling story about an encounter. That's a
Speaker 7: compelling way in for many of our viewers. So we
Speaker 7: want to go to a place where there is a
Speaker 7: good story. That's a shame because it would be more
Speaker 7: fun to go to tropical islence and just pick a
Speaker 7: fun places to go to. But really, for us, it's
Speaker 7: about something that feels like it has some.
Speaker 2: Heat on it. Do you have it put into where
Speaker 2: you're going.
Speaker 7: No, we do all that ourselves, So it's a very
Speaker 7: small number of people that makes the show. One of
Speaker 7: the cheats in the show is that it looks like
Speaker 7: we go do our investigation and fly away home to
Speaker 7: talk to Jeff here.
Speaker 8: You know't do that.
Speaker 7: We typically leave Los Angeles and we will stay in
Speaker 7: the field for two to three months filming, and we'll
Speaker 7: usually go all the way around. Then when we come
Speaker 7: back and we film all those expert interviews at the end,
Speaker 7: it's just like, you know, possible. So when we try
Speaker 7: to create a route, it's about finding those good stories,
Speaker 7: but it's also about tying them together in and around
Speaker 7: the world to hear that makes sense. You don't want
Speaker 7: to have too many up and downs. You don't want
Speaker 7: to go from Tierra del Fuego, I said, northern Europe,
Speaker 7: because you have to try to create a route that
Speaker 7: works within the TV production as well. So we design
Speaker 7: that and then we march up to Sci Fi. Iwas
Speaker 7: speak in a couple bucket list things in there if
Speaker 7: I can, and we see what they like and what
Speaker 7: they respond to, and we take it from there.
Speaker 8: But it's really a group effort of trying to figure
Speaker 8: out the places that we want to go.
Speaker 2: You know where you're going to do next.
Speaker 8: I don't, I was saying earlier.
Speaker 7: I just finished up I'm producing this new series, and
Speaker 7: so now we're just getting back into the conversation of
Speaker 7: destination ture they go where I'd like to go. I'd
Speaker 7: like to go to Tibet's an area in MLAs that
Speaker 7: we haven't visited yet. There's a little bit more leniency
Speaker 7: with the paranormal stories because there's usually good ghost stories everywhere.
Speaker 8: I have this list of things that I march up
Speaker 8: there every year.
Speaker 7: Every year I say, let's go to a rack you do,
Speaker 7: like a set downs haunted palace story, and they're like, no,
Speaker 7: we're not going to a rap I wanted to do
Speaker 7: like a Titanic Russians in versible ghost investigation.
Speaker 2: Expensive It turns.
Speaker 8: Out we've got our wish list and some of those
Speaker 8: have come true.
Speaker 2: You know, Antarctic trip that.
Speaker 8: We could have been on there for a long time,
Speaker 8: and then we finally got the channels to invest in that.
Speaker 7: It's a combination of kind of wishless stuff, but more
Speaker 7: is driven by recent stories and.
Speaker 6: This next questions addressed basically to group and pursuers. There
Speaker 6: are many side teams that are never documented have come.
Speaker 6: There are not more cameras running by the researchers themselves.
Speaker 6: I've sent that needs even maybe on them as in
Speaker 6: a GoPro.
Speaker 2: Or something like that.
Speaker 5: Oh, I thought that I had to go Goro strapped
Speaker 5: my head this summer and gave me the worseetic my
Speaker 5: entire life.
Speaker 2: There's a way to do it if you're on the
Speaker 2: TV show and I know that Josh.
Speaker 5: Shows this with the articulated thing and all that, but
Speaker 5: then it's looking at the person. We've spent some time
Speaker 5: thinking about putting cameras on our people so that we
Speaker 5: can film what they're seeing. And again there's some issues
Speaker 5: with that too. One of it's keeping everything charged. Electricity
Speaker 5: is a huge roleel for us, keeping all the batteries
Speaker 5: going and keeping it with the cameras filled with cards.
Speaker 5: And in fact Ken Helmer he had to go pro
Speaker 5: on his head because he wanted to do this. This
Speaker 5: is a big of a curse. He had a brief siding,
Speaker 5: he had a side in it, but he saw he
Speaker 5: saw it twice. They came out and went back again,
Speaker 5: and he's like I got a camera on my head
Speaker 5: and the camera had died like fifteen minutes before he
Speaker 5: saw office because he'd been sitting in the blind all
Speaker 5: day along.
Speaker 2: With his nan camera on his head and the battery
Speaker 2: gone it. Because that's what they do. We are doing.
Speaker 5: I plan on having the camera back to my dead
Speaker 5: again this summer, and anybody else who will do it
Speaker 5: ton't have a camera strap to their.
Speaker 2: Head too, But it's it's not as symbol again. It's
Speaker 2: just strapping a camera you're in and seeing the whole world.
Speaker 2: It's difficult.
Speaker 7: We've played around with I think every portable camera we
Speaker 7: can find our destination truth that we disassembled them when
Speaker 7: we actually have been fortunate enough to work with the
Speaker 7: NBC News crew in New York since they're part of
Speaker 7: the NBC University family, and they developed all sorts of
Speaker 7: really neat little four cameras and hidden cameras for police
Speaker 7: investig the journalists and stuff. The problem was looking out
Speaker 7: as opposed to looking inward with anything that's infrared.
Speaker 8: If we're talking about at.
Speaker 7: Night, is it's very hard to generate enough throw so
Speaker 7: that the camera sees anything. It's fine when you're looking
Speaker 7: back and your subject is always two feet from the
Speaker 7: camera that sets on that swing arm that looks back
Speaker 7: at us. But when you turn that camera around at night,
Speaker 7: it doesn't matter. If you modify our go pros to
Speaker 7: let them run in infrared. You have to use such
Speaker 7: an enormous amount of infrared light unless you walk up
Speaker 7: to a tree to see anything out in open space,
Speaker 7: and that infrared light is visibly.
Speaker 8: See it, it's very sort of distracted for wildlife.
Speaker 7: The night vision is still the best solution for looking forward,
Speaker 7: and we use acidscopes and military rate stuff which we
Speaker 7: mount to our cameras, and it's bulky and it's big,
Speaker 7: and it's expensive and it's finny.
Speaker 2: Ease to it.
Speaker 7: It's not all that easy to work with nine camera
Speaker 7: guys on the Show of Hate working with these atto
Speaker 7: scopes because they do light out in the night and
Speaker 7: you can see a.
Speaker 8: Lot, but they're big cameras that you need to walk around.
Speaker 7: But they do use a lot of how infrared has
Speaker 7: come a long way, but night vision it's still unless
Speaker 7: you're working with extremely high end stuff.
Speaker 8: Even that it's not hyper important.
Speaker 2: I thought I had it all figured out two years ago.
Speaker 5: At night I found maybe the best civilian grade night
Speaker 5: vision that you can get what's it called the Mini fourteen,
Speaker 5: And I've paid extra for the really good bowl because
Speaker 5: apparently how this stuff works is these sensors come out
Speaker 5: when they come.
Speaker 2: Down the line, and they're all within a range of
Speaker 2: being good, better and best. I paid answer for that
Speaker 2: where they go to.
Speaker 5: And I paid an astoundingly stupid amount of money for
Speaker 5: this thing because I'm like, I'm going to see a
Speaker 5: thighood with this then, and I was just because it
Speaker 5: They also said.
Speaker 2: You can thread into a camera. It's hard to do that.
Speaker 5: The stuff that none of this stuff is designed to
Speaker 5: work together right, And so I've got this beautiful piece
Speaker 5: of night.
Speaker 2: Vision equipment that's absolutely just lights up the night. But
Speaker 2: the dark is still dark.
Speaker 5: A shadow is still a shadow, and you can't see
Speaker 5: everything even with that stuff.
Speaker 2: It helps, but instant, it's not imperfect. What about thermal
Speaker 2: therd ble is an order and I get too more expensive.
Speaker 5: I actually think that there's a couple of technologies that
Speaker 5: are coming down the line that may help us future.
Speaker 2: Thermal is one of them.
Speaker 5: It's getting cheaper. It's night vision used to be a
Speaker 5: car or a night vision unit, and now.
Speaker 2: It's like a bold joking car or a night vision unit.
Speaker 2: So it's getting cheaper and more accessible.
Speaker 5: But the two other things thermal as it becomes more inexpensive,
Speaker 5: and they are getting more expensive, but even the cheapest
Speaker 5: passable one is three or four thousand dollars at this point.
Speaker 5: The other thing that I was just south by Southwest
Speaker 5: and I sat in the panel about and I sat listening.
Speaker 5: I wasn't an out of chanel about drone technology and
Speaker 5: EIY drone technology and what you can do and what
Speaker 5: you're allowed to do and what the government doesn't want
Speaker 5: you to do, but mounting the camera packages to drones,
Speaker 5: and how that technology is becoming more and more inexpensive,
Speaker 5: and these things are almost autonomous. You draw a box
Speaker 5: on a map, it stays in that box. That's really
Speaker 5: exciting stuff. It's outside our ability at this point, but
Speaker 5: I honestly think we're five years away and being able
Speaker 5: to ploid drones in our research area.
Speaker 2: Of course, doctor Melderns is working on a project that's
Speaker 2: a very similar to that.
Speaker 3: Attention and as a nonprofit organization, that's what your money
Speaker 3: and coming to this conference goes to.
Speaker 2: It's a five on Wednesday, three. We're required by the
Speaker 2: federal government.
Speaker 3: Wore every opinion that back in to the mission state,
Speaker 3: and that's why we're doing You're talking about eternals, servevance systems,
Speaker 3: the more technology to help.
Speaker 12: So you're doing a good thing by coming here in
Speaker 12: delpas I have a course uned.
Speaker 18: And the changes that jo'll are doing internally into change
Speaker 18: the changes to conservicy. Do you have a pro call
Speaker 18: should someone, let's say they have acts built and shot with,
Speaker 18: do you have a prom to call a hotline or
Speaker 18: a set up in the place that you can.
Speaker 13: Actually walk into average person how to harvest that tissue
Speaker 13: and how to store it, preserve it or get somebody
Speaker 13: here so that this is nothing you need to.
Speaker 12: Do with go with have our website and to have
Speaker 12: it be the quickest way to antactis.
Speaker 3: The only thing that would change about our protocol and
Speaker 3: the collection of a specimen would be the collector if
Speaker 3: it were of a hundred who shot one and the
Speaker 3: contact us. We would like to handle it the same
Speaker 3: exact way, except.
Speaker 2: The originator the collector would be different. Of course, we
Speaker 2: would have to have the acquiescence of that verse must
Speaker 2: have fall through with the protocol of it. But it
Speaker 2: would largely be the same thing, the exception of who
Speaker 2: originated it.
Speaker 5: So as your question, yeah, okay, right, I just want
Speaker 5: to say I've always went on a hot lot.
Speaker 2: I want that red ball, and I might ask.
Speaker 8: It would never stop writing?
Speaker 2: How would be so awesome?
Speaker 14: Can you?
Speaker 2: Okay, we're queerly running out of town, so we'll make
Speaker 2: this the final question. What's the scariest thing you've ever
Speaker 2: encountered in the woods?
Speaker 14: Honestly, when you're all doing chronological service and you in
Speaker 14: their trip wires, that's I'm more.
Speaker 8: A great man than of anything else where.
Speaker 9: Is that.
Speaker 2: I won't say Josh's.
Speaker 11: Mobilizations, I'm going to hear really loud and close prolonged globalization,
Speaker 11: so that can be pretty intimidating.
Speaker 10: I guess I'd have to say that there were times
Speaker 10: when we were using a tentage that wasn't modified side,
Speaker 10: and that feeling of being inside a little bitty tent
Speaker 10: and not knowing what's literally two feet.
Speaker 2: Away from you, rushing against the rain fly, that was
Speaker 2: a little bit unnerving.
Speaker 9: I don't have a part of an experience in the
Speaker 9: outdoors quote unquote, I've been a city boy all my life.
Speaker 9: The only scary thing that I actually can recall is
Speaker 9: drunken humans.
Speaker 8: That scary.
Speaker 12: I mean, I can think of a few scary times.
Speaker 12: Sometimes it's what you don't see. It can really scare
Speaker 12: you and your imagination can take over. One time, I
Speaker 12: was out here in Tyler, Texas, and I had a
Speaker 12: girlfriend that had a lot of land down there, and
Speaker 12: we drove up and down the roads at night, and
Speaker 12: I'm generally not scared of anything. We would go, so
Speaker 12: these areas a lot of old graveyards out there. I
Speaker 12: wasn't afraid of ghosts or anything. And we were in
Speaker 12: graveyards and that's spooky. I was walking up really towards
Speaker 12: the back and we didn't really have any flashlights. There
Speaker 12: was enough moonlight, but it was pretty dark. You couldn't
Speaker 12: see very far. And there was a lot of trees
Speaker 12: on this overgrown area the graveyard. And walked up to
Speaker 12: this back fence. It was surrounded by a chainley fence.
Speaker 12: I stood there and there was something over there and
Speaker 12: I just heard this low grunt or a growl. I
Speaker 12: couldn't tell if that creature was four feet long or
Speaker 12: eight foot tall. I don't know what it is, but
Speaker 12: at that point I thought we've done our looking around
Speaker 12: in this.
Speaker 2: And I ended up right out of there. I never
Speaker 2: saw what it was. It was very scary because I couldn't.
Speaker 5: See what it was a serious thing that's ever happened
Speaker 5: to me. It actually didn't happen to me. It happened
Speaker 5: to Barker Clerk. It was a story that it was
Speaker 5: a retelling in the video, and I was on that team.
Speaker 5: But when that actually happening, I had the other radio
Speaker 5: that was the one he was calling when he called
Speaker 5: for help, and I was too far away, and I knew.
Speaker 5: The scariest part was I knew he needed an assistance
Speaker 5: and I could not get to him. And the people
Speaker 5: who were closer than him did not have a radio,
Speaker 5: did not know he needed it. So that was the
Speaker 5: scariest thing.
Speaker 2: I was not danger but he was. And as I
Speaker 2: was trying to get their assassins, I could.
Speaker 5: I heard his gunshots, I heard him fire, and I
Speaker 5: knew that something very serious has.
Speaker 2: Happening and I could not help him. That was the
Speaker 2: scariest things that ever.
Speaker 7: Happened to me.
Speaker 3: And I have three things September two thousand and five,
Speaker 3: out a Niggins an hour in a ten and we
Speaker 3: heard something mere feet from us that sented like five
Speaker 3: hower monkey that.
Speaker 2: Was jim feet tall. I was extremely unnerved that situation.
Speaker 3: Then last year when I saw the individual referred to
Speaker 3: was over eight, that was not unnerved until Rick hays
Speaker 3: came back and Rick Hayes attempted to replicate the movement
Speaker 3: of Overra. And it was at that point that I
Speaker 3: realized the the extreme silence of this individual, because when
Speaker 3: I first saw her, lady.
Speaker 2: Have a favor of reference.
Speaker 3: When Rick came and tried to stand where he walked,
Speaker 3: Rick's five to nine, and this thing just swarfed me.
Speaker 2: And I got really unnerved at that point.
Speaker 3: And then later on Mike mas and this is another team.
Speaker 3: Mike Maize and I were sitting out in front of
Speaker 3: the cabin and it was about ten o'clock. This was
Speaker 3: the last night of Operation Resistance.
Speaker 2: We were winding in down. We're gonna close the operation down.
Speaker 3: Mike Maze are sitting Mike Maize and I are sitting
Speaker 3: there at the canfire.
Speaker 2: It's pretty quiet about like this, and all of a
Speaker 2: sudden we hear.
Speaker 20: This massive boulder just must have been choppings in the
Speaker 20: creek behind us, which is flat there's no mountain, there's
Speaker 20: no there's nowhere for a rock to dislodge involve because
Speaker 20: behind this is probably one hundred yards.
Speaker 3: The thought occurred to me, if this thing can pick
Speaker 3: up a rock that size, there's gonna tell.
Speaker 2: Him if it decides to do that to this cabin.
Speaker 2: And we're in here, lying inside of the cab. The
Speaker 2: wheel struck furing.
Speaker 3: And we've been there eight days, so you're already fatigued,
Speaker 3: so all these physiological problems, you're having your struggle wallings
Speaker 3: as well, and then when you hear this mincing on
Speaker 3: both we've talked their tails between our legs.
Speaker 2: We went into the cabin and it was a long night,
Speaker 2: the dicing night.
Speaker 7: And I don't have a lot of comfort around snakes
Speaker 7: at night. And it's places where we have been where
Speaker 7: there are buried, dangerous snakes and we're clomping around and
Speaker 7: that camera guy's walking backwards and all those kind of things.
Speaker 7: We've been very lucky on Destination Truth. We've had a
Speaker 7: couple of very close calls with the snakes at night.
Speaker 7: We had a pit viper one night that was in
Speaker 7: a tree at eye level that kind of came out
Speaker 7: with my camera guy went past, and that kind of
Speaker 7: stuff is scary because we don't have this big off camera,
Speaker 7: say a gay crew there, and that.
Speaker 8: Gets scary when you're in very remote places.
Speaker 12: God, it's an episode where your camera got got gang
Speaker 12: in the field that seeing like y'all you But he
Speaker 12: jolted about that one.
Speaker 8: But that was certainly his sarious night.
Speaker 7: I think sure he was really chicken up by that.
Speaker 7: I had a camera guy on's haunted forest thing we did,
Speaker 7: who is a not a paranormal believer at all, camera
Speaker 7: guy out there and do a job.
Speaker 8: And something happened to him and he claims he got
Speaker 8: knock off his feet.
Speaker 7: I've worked with him for years and I've never seen
Speaker 7: him so much just say anything about the paranormal. And
Speaker 7: he was crying and really scary. It's amazing that people
Speaker 7: just something just happens in your whole world.
Speaker 2: Resident. I think that's it all right. I guess I'd
Speaker 2: like to make them see now and thank you very much.
Speaker 5: And this is probably the best attended defects his big
Speaker 5: book conference in that six or seven years, and maybe
Speaker 5: the best intended whenever we're not real sure we don't
Speaker 5: have felling stone tablets for the old days.
Speaker 2: But anyone, thank you so much for not making.
Speaker 3: It's going to each success, they say, you don't gotta
Speaker 3: go home, but you can't stay.
Speaker 8: A lot of.
Speaker 2: World open.
Speaker 21: Sid steps.
Speaker 2: Chart this chart, that chart.
Speaker 4: Everything came right back, right back for joy, for me
Speaker 4: and enjoy staying right there.
Speaker 2: You come in right away.
Speaker 21: Still still sass stars, still.
Speaker 4: Don't doubts, still
Speaker 21: Steps us stassssss