Speaker 1: Weirding Way Media.
Speaker 2: Welcome to episode one hundred and thirty six of the
Speaker 2: Film Youmentaries podcast. This is your host, Jamie Benning. A
Speaker 2: bit different to usual. This is not going to be
Speaker 2: an interview episode. This is going to be a bit
Speaker 2: of a rambler episode. But I thought it was about
Speaker 2: time I gave you an update on our trip to
Speaker 2: Martha's Vineyard. We did in June to continue to shoot
Speaker 2: our Joe Al's documentary, which we've been working on since
Speaker 2: twenty twenty two. So the project kind of really began
Speaker 2: when I interviewed Joe for the podcast this podcast back
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty one, and Joe is known for Jaws
Speaker 2: and close encounters, but what became apparent to me when
Speaker 2: I was interviewing him is that there's so much more
Speaker 2: to his life and career. So we thought, you know,
Speaker 2: in the same vein as the interviews I did with
Speaker 2: Dave Barkley, the puppeteer, Robert Watts and Evil Power, the
Speaker 2: producers that my friend and cameraman Patrick Tindall, and I
Speaker 2: decided that maybe Joe was worth the same treatment. So
Speaker 2: like a thirty minute short documentary. Now we always say
Speaker 2: we have the most fun of all the jobs we
Speaker 2: do in a year. When we do these little projects,
Speaker 2: it's always great to you know, go and visit these
Speaker 2: people and talk to them about their long careers, both
Speaker 2: off and on camera, create friendships, and also find out
Speaker 2: things that maybe aren't out there in the public domain,
Speaker 2: things that would interest us if we saw them in
Speaker 2: a documentary or you know, read them in an article
Speaker 2: or or heard them in a podcast. So back in
Speaker 2: March twenty twenty two, we traveled over to Los Angeles.
Speaker 2: We managed to get a bit of money together to
Speaker 2: go out and see Joe, and on the way over
Speaker 2: on the plane, we were kind of laughing with each
Speaker 2: other about, you know, how do we get ourselves into
Speaker 2: these situations, and that we hope that Joe, you know,
Speaker 2: still had some stuff from his career. And when we
Speaker 2: went to visit Evoor a couple of years prior, he
Speaker 2: had some old annotated scripts from Alien and Blade Runner,
Speaker 2: and they were annotated with some Ridley grams, and he
Speaker 2: had some bits from two thousand and one, some of
Speaker 2: the patches and a piece of the fabric from the spacesuits,
Speaker 2: from the astronauts' suits, and he had like the tape
Speaker 2: of the things you see in them monitor display in
Speaker 2: both Alien and Blade Runner. They recycled those, so you know,
Speaker 2: we were hoping that Joe would have some stuff too.
Speaker 2: So we arrived in Los Angeles, we booked ourselves into
Speaker 2: a crappy motel with all of our gear, chained it
Speaker 2: all up with bicycle locks and put it in an
Speaker 2: awkward place so that hopefully nobody would steal it, and
Speaker 2: we drove over to the north west of Hollywood to
Speaker 2: go and see Joe, and as we pulled up at
Speaker 2: his house, he was standing leaning up against his car,
Speaker 2: you know, instantly recognizable there he is, said, Baddie, you know,
Speaker 2: in this kind of enthusiastic voice, and immediately he was
Speaker 2: super welcoming. It was just so welcoming. And at this time,
Speaker 2: when was it, It was like, yeah, So March twenty two.
Speaker 2: We were still COVID testing then, and we'd done multiple
Speaker 2: tests leading up to the trip. We did one I
Speaker 2: think I did one on the plane, and then we
Speaker 2: did one that morning to make sure that we were
Speaker 2: still negative. And we said to Joe, you know that
Speaker 2: we've got masks. He said, no, no, don't worry. You've
Speaker 2: shown me that you've done tests. And then negative, come in,
Speaker 2: make yourself at home. And we went into the house
Speaker 2: and we met his lovely wife, Jerry, and his daughter,
Speaker 2: and I think our cousin was there visiting, and we
Speaker 2: met the dog, and immediately we just felt at home.
Speaker 2: You know, they made us feel very welcome, and the
Speaker 2: house is full of like amazing character, just like you'd
Speaker 2: ex back from somebody who's an artist and a production designer.
Speaker 2: And to cut a long story short, it was apparent
Speaker 2: that he did have a lot of things in his
Speaker 2: possession from his career, including blueprints, storyboard sketches, photographs. There
Speaker 2: were like polar or continuity polaroids, and it was apparent immediately,
Speaker 2: you know, Paddy and I kind of looked at each
Speaker 2: other and silently communicated, this is not going to be
Speaker 2: a thirty minute documentary. This could be a feature. And
Speaker 2: we've always talked about maybe trying to do a feature
Speaker 2: at some point. So over the next five days we
Speaker 2: interviewed Joe. We've got some amazing stories. We got, you know,
Speaker 2: the kind of ones that he often would tell on
Speaker 2: the podcast, but we got also stories that we never
Speaker 2: thought we'd hear, and we saw some of those incredible
Speaker 2: items that we never expected to see as well. And luckily,
Speaker 2: Joe's a bit of a hoarder. He's kept so much
Speaker 2: of his artwork, so much of what connects him to
Speaker 2: those films. They're kind of like these physical memories, you know,
Speaker 2: this kind of living history. While we were there, I
Speaker 2: also managed to get permission to shoot at the Academy Museum,
Speaker 2: right next to Bruce who's hanging there from the ceiling.
Speaker 2: And to have Joe stood there in front of that
Speaker 2: shark telling us about his experiences. It was a proper,
Speaker 2: you know, spine tingling moment. So fast forward to March
Speaker 2: twenty twenty three, we managed to get out to la
Speaker 2: again thanks to the fact that Paddy was already out
Speaker 2: there working. He had his kit with him, and it
Speaker 2: was a matter of me getting over there, paying for
Speaker 2: my flights and the hotels and stuff. And again we
Speaker 2: spent time with Joe, but we also visited his colleague
Speaker 2: and friend, Roy arbergast special effects wizard down in Arizona.
Speaker 2: That was like a twelve hour round trip, but so
Speaker 2: worth it. We interviewed Dennis Prince, Joe's biographer, Taylor Hackford,
Speaker 2: who's a director Joe worked with. He's married to Helen Mirren,
Speaker 2: and we interviewed him in their back garden in Hollywood.
Speaker 2: We went to visit Greg Nicotero his creature shop. He's
Speaker 2: a friend of Joe's and says that Joe was a
Speaker 2: big inspiration to him and also a huge Jaws fan.
Speaker 2: And we also went to see Jeffrey Kramer, star of
Speaker 2: Jaws and Jaws two, at his house in la He
Speaker 2: was very welcoming and accommodating and fun to be around.
Speaker 2: And we went up to northern California to interview Kevin Pike,
Speaker 2: another special effects wizard who Joe employed on Jaws. Nice
Speaker 2: story behind that as well, which he may have heard
Speaker 2: on the podcast before, which started off Kevin's career. He
Speaker 2: famously went on to build a DeLorean fall back to
Speaker 2: the future. At the time up in northern California, it
Speaker 2: was very snowy. He'd been snowed in in his log cabin.
Speaker 2: I think we're the first We were the first visitors
Speaker 2: that he had for a couple of weeks. So the
Speaker 2: project was basically getting bigger and bigger, but we still
Speaker 2: knew we had a ton of work to do, and
Speaker 2: you know, people take six months to a year to
Speaker 2: do these things working in full time, and really at
Speaker 2: that point we'd only just had two weeks on it.
Speaker 2: So at that time we'd only really had two weeks
Speaker 2: to work on it. We've gathered some amazing footage, some
Speaker 2: amazing views as a wonderful b roll, but you know,
Speaker 2: we're always trying to push to the next step. Now
Speaker 2: I can't remember the order of things, but no, I
Speaker 2: can't remember things the order of things exactly. I'm doing
Speaker 2: this off the top of my head. But we did
Speaker 2: do a Kickstarter campaign where we hoped to raise eighty
Speaker 2: thousand pounds I.
Speaker 3: Think it was.
Speaker 2: I think we got forty two forty three, but I
Speaker 2: don't know if you know. But with kickstars, if you
Speaker 2: don't reach your goal, you don't get any of it.
Speaker 2: So you know, that eighty thousand figure was a number
Speaker 2: we've kind of worked out roughly what we'd need. I mean, actually,
Speaker 2: if you want a proper audio mix on a documentary
Speaker 2: for a cinema release, you could pay double that just
Speaker 2: for the audio mix. So I thought eighty gram was
Speaker 2: the reasonable amount we could really have done with that
Speaker 2: forty two thousand, But no, we didn't get it, But
Speaker 2: you know, we carried on so in twenty twenty four,
Speaker 2: we were working on editing, We were putting comps together,
Speaker 2: just getting a feeling of what was missing, what else
Speaker 2: did we need to do. We spoke to some editors
Speaker 2: and producers. We had a bunch of meetings with producers
Speaker 2: who said they could probably sell it, but the message
Speaker 2: was that we really needed to finish it first. You know,
Speaker 2: gone other days where one of the big streamers would
Speaker 2: say yes to a concept and give you money up front.
Speaker 2: So it was on us to try and push on
Speaker 2: as much as we could, you know, and it can
Speaker 2: be complicated sometimes. You know, Paddy works away, I'm working
Speaker 2: in the UK, we're not He lives.
Speaker 3: In Northern Ireland.
Speaker 2: I live in London, and we're both trying to co
Speaker 2: direct this and we both got our own ideas and
Speaker 2: we've both got our kind of joint ideas of what
Speaker 2: the film should be. So it's very difficult to kind
Speaker 2: of push it forward in any great leaps. But we
Speaker 2: did make some really good progress putting like a reel
Speaker 2: together to try and share internally, and we've had some
Speaker 2: amazing reactions from people in the industry saying they love
Speaker 2: it and they wish they could do more. To help
Speaker 2: and all this kind of stuff, but it does mean that,
Speaker 2: you know, the feel of the piece, the feel of
Speaker 2: the documentary is something that we've managed to communicate to people,
Speaker 2: and yeah, it really felt like, you know, it definitely
Speaker 2: had legs, which was a which was a great thing.
Speaker 2: Patty and I had always talked about the fiftieth anniversar
Speaker 2: of Jaws maybe as a point where we could try
Speaker 2: and release the documentary, but that was back in twenty
Speaker 2: twenty two that we were saying that, and it became
Speaker 2: apparent that we were not going to reach that and
Speaker 2: probably it's probably probably a good thing because there's loads
Speaker 2: of draw stuff being done for the fiftieth and the
Speaker 2: documentary about Joe could easily been buried. La rom Bouseureau
Speaker 2: had that Jaws at fifty documentary coming out. There's all
Speaker 2: the celebrations going on, the Academy Museum stuff, So we
Speaker 2: kind of knocked that idea on the head. But what
Speaker 2: we did think that is, if Joe is going to
Speaker 2: go to the vineyard for the fiftieth, we have to
Speaker 2: be there, you know, to to shoot kind of Joe's legacy.
Speaker 2: Really in our minds, it was the part of the
Speaker 2: documentary that would allow us to talk about Joe's legacy
Speaker 2: and how fifty years later the film is still loved,
Speaker 2: still adored, people are visiting all of.
Speaker 3: That kind of stuff.
Speaker 2: So it became apparent that I just wasn't going to
Speaker 2: be able to afford to do this. The flights alone
Speaker 2: were looking expensive. Then you've got to hire a car,
Speaker 2: and then you've got the ferry, and then you've got
Speaker 2: accommodation on the island, and the island is a very
Speaker 2: expensive place to be. You know, once you're on the island,
Speaker 2: they kind of got you. Everything just costs that a
Speaker 2: little bit more. I hadn't been there previously, but Paddy had,
Speaker 2: and that was one of the things he came back with,
Speaker 2: you know that if you have money in your pocket,
Speaker 2: they'd find a way to get it out for pocket.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so I wasn't going to be able to do this.
Speaker 2: Paddy was talking about going there as as a punter,
Speaker 2: you know, just as a fan, but it's so difficult
Speaker 2: for me. I've got you know, I've got three kids,
Speaker 2: ones about to go to university. At this point. It's
Speaker 2: a very expensive way to live. It's not like I've
Speaker 2: got huge amounts of disposable income. So yeah, I just
Speaker 2: knew I wasn't going to be able to do it.
Speaker 2: I've got three kids and a mortgage, and I've already
Speaker 2: plowed quite a few thousand pounds into this, you know,
Speaker 2: we both have, So with a matter of weeks to go,
Speaker 2: I just thought I'll do a gofund me and see
Speaker 2: what happens. And incredibly, within a couple of days it
Speaker 2: had reached two thousand pounds. But whilst you know, we
Speaker 2: were the days were ticking by. The accommodation prices a
Speaker 2: math as vinyl were increasing exponentially, particularly in Egatam where
Speaker 2: we would need to stay, which is where Joe was
Speaker 2: going to be based, and the fiftieth anniversary event organized
Speaker 2: by Michael Fortcher.
Speaker 3: Was going to be there as well.
Speaker 2: But it was kind of apparent that this amount on
Speaker 2: go Funny was ticking up and up and up, and
Speaker 2: within a week he got up to five thousand pounds
Speaker 2: I think it was, which meant it was now entirely possible.
Speaker 2: Michael Fortcher, who's doing the fiftieth event, kindly offered us
Speaker 2: at access to his event at the Wolf Pub, where
Speaker 2: Joe was going to be and Greg was going to
Speaker 2: be Greg Nikota and Jeffrey Cram and Jeffrey Vorhes who
Speaker 2: was the kidna kid in the film, and a bunch
Speaker 2: of other people associated with Jaws. So after that five
Speaker 2: thousand pounds was reached, we booked our flights. We booked
Speaker 2: the car we needed to find. Actually that's right, because
Speaker 2: the ferry tickets, the car ferry tickets had sold out,
Speaker 2: so then we had to book the car rental in
Speaker 2: Martha's Vineyard, but then find a way to get from
Speaker 2: Boston to Martha's Vineyard. Flights were just ridiculous. From Boston
Speaker 2: to Martha's Vineyard, they were like five hundred dollars each,
Speaker 2: maybe five hundred pounds each. So we ended up getting
Speaker 2: a car down from Boston Airport to Woodshole where the
Speaker 2: ferry is, and we booked that. Then accommodation had gone
Speaker 2: up even more. There was a hotel in Encatown, the
Speaker 2: only one left that had places, was charging nine hundred
Speaker 2: dollars a night for a room, and that was for
Speaker 2: a single. So as again the gofunding amount kind of
Speaker 2: was ticking up towards the seven thousand pound mark, we
Speaker 2: booked this house in Edgartown, which is more money than
Speaker 2: I've ever spent on a piece of accommodation for a holiday,
Speaker 2: let alone for a shoot like this. But thankfully, because
Speaker 2: of the amazing generos t you know, we were able
Speaker 2: to book that and it was going to be a
Speaker 2: great base where we had hopefully somewhere to interview people.
Speaker 3: If that was the case, or.
Speaker 2: You know, if we wanted our kit all kind of
Speaker 2: laid out, we needed more than a hotel room.
Speaker 3: I also had to buy some audio kicks.
Speaker 2: I wanted to make sure that the audio side of
Speaker 2: things was really kind of autotype for this shoot. And
Speaker 2: so I think for that two three hundred pounds that
Speaker 2: was raised, every single penny was spent. I even spent
Speaker 2: some more of my own money, and Penny spent some
Speaker 2: more of his. But the incredible generosity of people had
Speaker 2: just been amazing, you know, the faith that people had
Speaker 2: put in us to make this film. Some were friends,
Speaker 2: some were family, some were people that have followed me
Speaker 2: on the film Youmentary's Quest for many years, some of
Speaker 2: people who listened to the podcast. Some were people I
Speaker 2: sort of tangentially knew via my association with my love
Speaker 2: of film, And honestly, it was quite emotional. I was
Speaker 2: quite moved to see how many people are putting in
Speaker 2: money in, even a few strangers. People I had no
Speaker 2: idea who you were. Must have came across the project
Speaker 2: and decided to put money in. Amazing, So thank you.
Speaker 2: I'm going to say thank you probably several times through
Speaker 2: this Ranby podcast episode. I've since found out the bad news,
Speaker 2: which is I'm probably going to be taxed on that income,
Speaker 2: so I also need to find twenty percent of it back,
Speaker 2: which is going to be a bit of a struggle.
Speaker 2: But that side will figure that out when it becomes
Speaker 2: you know, really it should only be taxed on it
Speaker 2: when it becomes a commercial prospect, and at the moment
Speaker 2: it is not a commercial prospect. You know, when it sells,
Speaker 2: if it sells, No, when it sells, then it's commercial, right,
Speaker 2: So hopefully I can figure my way around that. But yeah,
Speaker 2: without that incredible generosity, to go from zero to being
Speaker 2: able to do what we wanted to do within that
Speaker 2: short period of time was just kind of mind blowing,
Speaker 2: and honestly it still hasn't quite landed in my brain
Speaker 2: yet just what we managed to pull off. So I
Speaker 2: quickly got a scheduled together of interviews and you know,
Speaker 2: a shot list and the time we were going to
Speaker 2: spend with Joe and where we were going to take
Speaker 2: him because he had commitments. He was on the island
Speaker 2: for this fiftieth event with Michael Forlcher, so he had
Speaker 2: commitments there. Each night he had one at the Martha's
Speaker 2: Vineyard Museum where he was doing a podcast, and then
Speaker 2: he had some book signing in Edgar Town in the
Speaker 2: bookshop there for his Designing Jaws book and the new
Speaker 2: biography by Dennis Prince that was just out at that time.
Speaker 2: But we had, you know, some key things we wanted
Speaker 2: to do with Joe. So on that Wednesday I headed
Speaker 2: up to Easthrow Airport to meet Paddy and we headed
Speaker 2: to Boston. We arrived about four o'clock I think that day,
Speaker 2: and we picked up We met up with the taxi
Speaker 2: transfer guide to get to woods Hull where you catch
Speaker 2: the ferry to Martha's Vineyards, and we arrived very late.
Speaker 2: The traffic was rubbish and we managed to squeeze on
Speaker 2: to the very last ferry that night, and there was
Speaker 2: one point where we thought going to have to stay
Speaker 2: in woods Hole, but no, we managed it and with
Speaker 2: our seven bags between the two of us, just four hands,
Speaker 2: but seven bags. Because we've got all the kit, tripods, cameras, lenses,
Speaker 2: you know, our clothing, all that kind of stuff. We
Speaker 2: got on as foot passengers. There was a lot of
Speaker 2: balancing and wrangling going on with all this gear, and
Speaker 2: by the time we landed in Martha's vineyard it was
Speaker 2: gone eleven, I think. So by the time we got
Speaker 2: to our house it was nearly midnight, and then it
Speaker 2: was raining and the code wouldn't work, so I had
Speaker 2: to ring the guy who was managing it and all
Speaker 2: a bit of a fath but we got in and
Speaker 2: the house was great, a couple of bedrooms, a nice
Speaker 2: bit of space to put all the kits out, because
Speaker 2: what we realized is we needed to stay kind of agile,
Speaker 2: and yes we did have these things that we wanted
Speaker 2: to do, but what if an opportunity came up. We
Speaker 2: wanted to be able to kind of pounce. So we
Speaker 2: had all the kit was built by Paddy, that's his
Speaker 2: area of expertise. While I was kind of ringing around
Speaker 2: trying to sort things out. So on that first morning
Speaker 2: we went to the local diner and edgar Town. It
Speaker 2: was about a twenty five minute, twenty minute walk into Edgartown,
Speaker 2: and when you arrive, you just, you know, you instantly
Speaker 2: realize you're kind of in the film, you know. I've
Speaker 2: looked at that film so many times, having made Inside
Speaker 2: Jaws as well as this project. And you walk around
Speaker 2: and you've got those picket fences and the boarded houses,
Speaker 2: and it was a gorgeous sunny morning as well. So
Speaker 2: we went into the diner and we waited for our friends,
Speaker 2: and after a few minutes of perusing the menud, we
Speaker 2: were starving by this point. Joe and Jerry and his
Speaker 2: bark for Dennis came in and Dennis's wife as well,
Speaker 2: and it was all hugs and kisses and handshakes and
Speaker 2: lots of big smiles, and everyone was happy to see
Speaker 2: each other again and embark on this next little bit
Speaker 2: of the adventure. Joe was on good form, cracking a
Speaker 2: couple of jokes at the table, and on that first
Speaker 2: day it was difficult not to be kind of a
Speaker 2: bit rudderless because we were just trying to work out
Speaker 2: what we could do, you know, And Michael kindly invited
Speaker 2: us to the Jaws fiftieth event for the guests before
Speaker 2: the actual sort of signing and Q and A event
Speaker 2: was happening the following night, so we went to see
Speaker 2: Joe and Jeffrey and I.
Speaker 3: Don't think Greg was there yet. With Jeffrey voorhe's the kid.
Speaker 3: The kid was there.
Speaker 2: Marty Milner, who also worked on the movie as a
Speaker 2: construction guy. I think he was the first hire on
Speaker 2: the movie.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: Super grateful to Michael Fulture for that opportunity. We didn't
Speaker 2: end up shooting anything at that fiftieth event. It was
Speaker 2: kind of too crowded and too busy, and you know,
Speaker 2: we had a big camera gear and stuff. But we
Speaker 2: were able for one of those nights to use it
Speaker 2: as a bit of a base and you know, touch
Speaker 2: base with Joe and talk about what we could do,
Speaker 2: you know, in the following days. And that first evening
Speaker 2: we walked around egg a town down by the dark,
Speaker 2: and we bumped into a few people who were wearing
Speaker 2: Jaws T shirts and had a chat with a couple
Speaker 2: of people who actually recognized me from my filmingmentaries from
Speaker 2: years ago. And we had a nice long chat on
Speaker 2: the road and we were talking about the documentary, and yeah,
Speaker 2: the atmosphere was just kind of electric there because everybody
Speaker 2: was there for that common reason that, you know, that
Speaker 2: love of the movie. And it was really warm and
Speaker 2: really welcoming, friendly atmosphere. So from that Thursday to the
Speaker 2: Monday when we left, we did not stop. You know,
Speaker 2: we woke up, we went to the diner. Some days
Speaker 2: we met Dennis and Joe and Jerry, and other days
Speaker 2: we just ate and we jumped in the car and
Speaker 2: we went shooting. We shot some color in Edgar Town
Speaker 2: with Joe and without Joe. He was due over at
Speaker 2: the museum for part of a podcast with Michael Smith,
Speaker 2: and then we later joined them at the museum and
Speaker 2: Joe was still in the middle of his podcast, and
Speaker 2: we were told by the museum that we couldn't shoot there,
Speaker 2: despite having contacted them earlier and it being a possibility.
Speaker 2: You know, they wanted money up front, and we just
Speaker 2: weren't able to spend any more money, and it was
Speaker 2: quite a bit of money, and we were trying to
Speaker 2: explain the city situation that we were just there with
Speaker 2: Joe and we just needed a couple of shots, but
Speaker 2: they just weren't interested. But they were pretty accommodating and
Speaker 2: letting us go and see the exhibition there, which was cool,
Speaker 2: and then later on we were able to shoot in
Speaker 2: the Orca interior replica that was outside that was created
Speaker 2: by a very friendly guy named Court Carino. We met
Speaker 2: him and his lovely wife, who got very emotional because
Speaker 2: we managed to introduce Court to Joe. Joe had just
Speaker 2: walked out after the podcast and he came to meet us,
Speaker 2: and there we were at this Orca interior which was
Speaker 2: based in another building just across the lawn from the
Speaker 2: main museum, and Court was kind of blown away. He
Speaker 2: got to show Joe, you know, the guy who'd originally
Speaker 2: found the warlock that turned into the Orca, and show
Speaker 2: him around and Court let us sit in there. Oh yeah,
Speaker 2: I bumped into my longtime online friend Charles de Lauza, Rica,
Speaker 2: who if you don't know, he has been a guest
Speaker 2: on this a couple of times this podcast. He was
Speaker 2: Ridley scott right hand man, behind the scenes guy for
Speaker 2: many many years and a filmmaker and director in his
Speaker 2: own right.
Speaker 3: So it's great to see him.
Speaker 2: And we got to sit in the Orca, me, Paddy
Speaker 2: and Charles and then Joe sating there having a chat
Speaker 2: with Court, the guy who created who rebuilt this interior
Speaker 2: and talk about you know, the aging of it and
Speaker 2: all the items in the in the cabin and ask
Speaker 2: Court why he was doing it, and you know it's
Speaker 2: going to be Court's office actually, which is quite funny. Anyway,
Speaker 2: Court was a super nice guy and his wife, who
Speaker 2: really did get emotional. We had a big hug and
Speaker 2: she was so grateful that the opportunity just to meet
Speaker 2: Joe was there for Court. She could see what it
Speaker 2: meant to him, and it was just a great atmosphere.
Speaker 2: Just it was a total loving, honestly at yours loving.
Speaker 2: So as each day passed, we continued our ritual of
Speaker 2: visiting the diner, working our way through the menu, making
Speaker 2: notes in our pads about the day ahead, what we
Speaker 2: could do, what we couldn't do, what we wanted to do,
Speaker 2: and what we hoped to do. And so during that
Speaker 2: five days that we were there, we ended up in
Speaker 2: the famous town hall. By stroke of luck, we bumped
Speaker 2: into somebody who invited us in and we shot in there.
Speaker 2: We took Joe to Mnemshire where Quint's Shack was built,
Speaker 2: and you know that plot is still empty, and Joe
Speaker 2: took us up the hill like oh, I went up
Speaker 2: here fifty one years ago and we just followed him
Speaker 2: with a camera and we got these just so charming,
Speaker 2: these moments with Joe just walking up the hill looking
Speaker 2: for the spot where Joe originally looked down on that
Speaker 2: really charming fishing village and chose it as the location
Speaker 2: and suggested it to Stephen. We were right there, you know,
Speaker 2: with Joe, with the man who did it. Fifty one
Speaker 2: years later, we went to the Fourth of July Beach,
Speaker 2: the Jaws Bridge, that book signing that was talking about
Speaker 2: the Egg of Town bookshop, and it was great to
Speaker 2: see Joe. You know, he always turns it on. He's
Speaker 2: really charming and as is Dennis.
Speaker 3: You know, they do it. They're like a great little
Speaker 3: duble act.
Speaker 2: So interviewed Marty Milner, the guy who I said worked
Speaker 2: on construction, very eccentric character.
Speaker 3: We interviewed Charles de la.
Speaker 2: Za Rica, who is really good at kind of putting
Speaker 2: the movie landscape with the context a context of the documentary,
Speaker 2: and they're talking about the film culture at the time
Speaker 2: and just where the movie business was, and it's a
Speaker 2: good setting for some of Joe's stories.
Speaker 3: So yeah, it's great to.
Speaker 2: Finally meet Charles like in person and hang out with
Speaker 2: him and some of his friends that he was staying
Speaker 2: there with. He was there just as a fan, and
Speaker 2: now he's part of a documentary, which I couldn't be
Speaker 2: happy about, honestly. We also hung out with two guys
Speaker 2: who were making a documentary about Jeffrey Voorhees. That was
Speaker 2: good fun. They were nice guys. And we're also accompanied
Speaker 2: by one of Patty's friends who we'd known since they
Speaker 2: were kids and who was a Jaws fan. And he
Speaker 2: come down for a few days and was soaking up
Speaker 2: the atmosphere and just enjoying the fact that he got
Speaker 2: to meet all these Jaws folks. You know, we were
Speaker 2: kind of his VIP ticket. We're also lucky enough to
Speaker 2: bump into Laurent Bouceau. I just interviewed him the week before,
Speaker 2: two weeks before for the podcast about his Jaws at
Speaker 2: fifty and he was just sitting on this bench out
Speaker 2: the back of the fiftieth anniversary venue and we took
Speaker 2: him down to the dock just where Richard Drapus's character
Speaker 2: arrives in the movie, and we interviewed Laurent, and yeah,
Speaker 2: it was great to sort of soak up some of
Speaker 2: that enthusiasm that was going on around the around the
Speaker 2: island at the time. And I'm very grateful to Laurent
Speaker 2: for giving us his time as well. He's a great
Speaker 2: filmmaker and a really good guy. That was one of
Speaker 2: the very few evenings actually where we had a bit
Speaker 2: of bound time for some food and a drink and
Speaker 2: a laugh, and the rest of the time we were
Speaker 2: just putting our kit together, disassembling it, transferring footage from
Speaker 2: cars to laptops, charging Mike's, sorting out everything for the
Speaker 2: next day. It was pretty full on, but it was
Speaker 2: just pure Lynn, you know. I also have to say
Speaker 2: that throughout this Jerry has been fantastic. She used to
Speaker 2: be a production manager and an assistant to Taylor Hackford,
Speaker 2: and she's been great at making lots of connections, including
Speaker 2: Taylor Hackford when we were there in twenty twenty three,
Speaker 2: and helped us with the Academy Museum where we shot
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty two, and then she managed to chat
Speaker 2: to Richard Drafus's manager. I asked if we could get
Speaker 2: you know, like twenty five minutes half an hour with
Speaker 2: Richard beforehand, we kind of decided that perhaps we didn't
Speaker 2: need Richard for the documentary because you know, his experience isn't.
Speaker 3: Hugely related to Joe's work.
Speaker 2: But if we you know, we were there, he was there,
Speaker 2: if we could get him to talk about Joe, that
Speaker 2: would be fantastic. So a few days into the trip,
Speaker 2: I got a text from his manager saying, yes, you
Speaker 2: can have Richard for twenty five minutes, pick a location
Speaker 2: and let us know he has to be before this
Speaker 2: time because he has to be at the fiftieth event.
Speaker 2: So thankfully we were able to shoot at a friend's
Speaker 2: house on the island, and we set up in the
Speaker 2: driveway of this house, nice little quiet road, picket fences
Speaker 2: and all that, because I had such a nice little
Speaker 2: background where you could see like you know, those paneled houses.
Speaker 2: You know, it really felt like Amity. Well it was,
Speaker 2: you know. So me and Paddy and Charles and some
Speaker 2: of his friends were pacing around for a little while
Speaker 2: waiting for Richard to arrive, and then suddenly there he was.
Speaker 2: You know, he got out of the car. You know,
Speaker 2: he's not a young man anymore. We're all getting old.
Speaker 2: But you know, as soon as you see him smile,
Speaker 2: there's absolutely no doubt that you're looking at Richard Dreyfus,
Speaker 2: you know. And I have to say it was a
Speaker 2: bit of a buzz, you know, probably the biggest name
Speaker 2: I've ever interviewed. I'm sure it is. I'm sure it
Speaker 2: must be. And then he sat down and his manager
Speaker 2: had said that he'd been talking about Joe on the
Speaker 2: drive over and they had a good couple of stories.
Speaker 2: So we sat him down, we miked him up, and
Speaker 2: we started the interview. Now, you know, Richard has these
Speaker 2: stories and over the years he's talked about, you know,
Speaker 2: the Shark is not working and all of that stuff
Speaker 2: with Robert Shaw. But we really wanted him to becaus
Speaker 2: in on Joe's contribution, you know, picking Eggo Town and
Speaker 2: his first reactions when he arrived as an actor. What
Speaker 2: does that do being in an environment like that, or
Speaker 2: walking into Quince Shack for the first time seeing what
Speaker 2: Joe and his colleagues are built. But Richard really wanted
Speaker 2: to talk about Robert Shaw. So for the first half
Speaker 2: of the interview, maybe more, he was talking about his
Speaker 2: reactions to Robert Shaw, and I was kind of constantly
Speaker 2: trying to get back on track. But Richard really wanted
Speaker 2: to say these things, and he wanted us to hear them,
Speaker 2: so I'm kind of editing in my head, and actually
Speaker 2: we've got a good few minutes of him talking about
Speaker 2: stuff that is related to Joe, not only on Jaws,
Speaker 2: but about close encounters as well, which of course they
Speaker 2: both worked on. Sometimes these older guys they do go
Speaker 2: off piece. You know, they've got their kind of repertoire
Speaker 2: and they have to run through that first. I wish
Speaker 2: we had a bit more time with Richard. Unfortunately he
Speaker 2: had to go, and I was a little bit disheartened when,
Speaker 2: you know, I couldn't steer him back towards the subject
Speaker 2: of Joe out. But you know, it's not every day
Speaker 2: you get to interview a bit of a cinema legend, really.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's Richard Bloody Dreyfuss sat there in front
Speaker 2: of me, smiling at me and engaging with me, and
Speaker 2: there is some great stuff that we got. You know,
Speaker 2: some of it isn't good for the documentary, but the
Speaker 2: release he signed says I can use that footage on
Speaker 2: my podcast on my YouTube channel, So look out for
Speaker 2: that stuff coming in the future as well, you know.
Speaker 2: So looking back at the trip as a whole. I mean,
Speaker 2: it's incredible that we even got there. There was a
Speaker 2: point where I was just saying that I just can't
Speaker 2: afford to do it. I just can't go. I couldn't
Speaker 2: justify it. But to make the trip, actually make it,
Speaker 2: actually go there, and to have all of that kindness
Speaker 2: and warmth in those donations to the GoFundMe, it's just incredible.
Speaker 2: People's incredible generosity and that trust and that love I
Speaker 2: felt from people who were just willing to part with
Speaker 2: the hardened cash to see this project progress to the
Speaker 2: next step. You know, we boarded the very that last
Speaker 2: day and there was Joe and Jerry and in the
Speaker 2: queue and a bunch of other fans we could see
Speaker 2: wearing T shirts and it was just a bit of
Speaker 2: a whirlwind. We had not stopped working. We just didn't
Speaker 2: have downtime. We were constantly working. I don't even remember
Speaker 2: going to bed at night, honestly, I just remember I
Speaker 2: was asleep before my head hit the pillow.
Speaker 3: I think.
Speaker 2: And each morning, just wake up, grab a coffee in
Speaker 2: the house, go through our routine, go to the diner,
Speaker 2: work on what we were going to do. So none
Speaker 2: of this, I mean, I still don't think it has
Speaker 2: really landed in our minds yet, just what we were
Speaker 2: able to achieve on the island, and also just the
Speaker 2: experience of just being there in a place where they
Speaker 2: shot Jaws, you know, fifty one years ago, back in
Speaker 2: nineteen seventy four, and be there with Joe and Dennis
Speaker 2: and Jeffrey and Marty and Richard and all of those
Speaker 2: people who were there back then making this film, just
Speaker 2: doing a job. You know, they had no idea that
Speaker 2: it was going to take off to be this incredible
Speaker 2: worldwide blockbuster and industry defining movie. You know, we've made
Speaker 2: so many friends along the way, But sitting on this ferry,
Speaker 2: you know, holding our tripods and cameras and sound gear
Speaker 2: and miscellaneous cables being rocked by the gentle waves, we
Speaker 2: kind of looked at each other, Paddy and I, and
Speaker 2: we just couldn't compute how cool an experience it had been.
Speaker 2: Each time we see Joe and Jerry, you know, that
Speaker 2: bond gets stronger and the trust gets stronger.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: One of the things about this project is that we
Speaker 2: really have kind of fallen in love with Joe and
Speaker 2: Jerry and his daughter and their dog, and we kind
Speaker 2: of have this responsibility to make the film. You know,
Speaker 2: Joe is eighty nine. None of us are getting any younger,
Speaker 2: and we really want to get this finished, to be
Speaker 2: able to show Joe and to have this as a
Speaker 2: mark of his legacy and for his family and future
Speaker 2: generations to be able to, you know, appreciate what Joe
Speaker 2: did and for the fans to see what an amazing
Speaker 2: career he had. I'm sure this part of show that
Speaker 2: things come on. Guys, bloody, get on with it. You've
Speaker 2: been doing this for four years because he is one
Speaker 2: of those guys, you know, always forging ahead. He's always
Speaker 2: looking to the next project or the next part of
Speaker 2: the project. Maybe less so now he's retired, but he
Speaker 2: still has that in him, you know, that shark like
Speaker 2: attitude of keep swimming forward. And we take inspiration from that,
Speaker 2: you know, nudging the project forward little by little. But
Speaker 2: this Martha's Vineyard Trip had been a huge leap forward.
Speaker 2: It really had. You know, there's that saying that you know,
Speaker 2: the more you know, the more you realize what.
Speaker 3: You don't know.
Speaker 2: And the more we create this film, the more we
Speaker 2: realize how much more we have to create. But that
Speaker 2: just spurs us on you know that wonderful footage of
Speaker 2: Joe walking around Martha's vineyard to you know, him dipping
Speaker 2: into a drawer and pulling out and Escape from New
Speaker 2: York storyboard in his house, and the story is about
Speaker 2: Disney and Jews two and Jaws three and working with
Speaker 2: John Carpenter. You know, there's still a lot of work
Speaker 2: to do, and there's still funds to be raised. But
Speaker 2: our next target is to get some money in the pot,
Speaker 2: to be on standby, to be able to take an
Speaker 2: opportunity when it arises. And what we're doing is we're
Speaker 2: going to try and get Dean Coundy, the cinematographer who
Speaker 2: worked on Escape from New York, John Carpenter who directed
Speaker 2: Escape from New York, and starman Joe who worked on
Speaker 2: both of those. Leah Thompson, who Jaws three was her
Speaker 2: first film and she, you know, she saw Joe at
Speaker 2: convention a few years back and get with a big
Speaker 2: hug and said, this is the man that got me
Speaker 2: in the movies. But the big one, Steven Spielberg himself,
Speaker 2: We're going to try and get. We've got connections to
Speaker 2: all of these people in some form or another, and
Speaker 2: I'm going to try and attack that from multiple angles.
Speaker 2: You know, maybe if Steven's over here in the UK,
Speaker 2: we can get him, then maybe we can go to
Speaker 2: La again, you know, if we can raise the funds,
Speaker 2: and it certainly won't be as expensive as the Martha's
Speaker 2: Vineyard trip, because you know, you can find somewhere cheap
Speaker 2: to stay in La. We could even crash at Joe's
Speaker 2: I'm sure if we needed to. But wouldn't it be
Speaker 2: great to just get Stephen and Joe on camera just
Speaker 2: talking about old times. It's kind of been a bit
Speaker 2: of a dream of ours since since we started the project.
Speaker 2: So I have kind of relaunched the go fund me
Speaker 2: over the last week or so. There's a bit of
Speaker 2: a drip feed of money coming in maybe I think
Speaker 2: about one hundred pounds so far, which is great, again
Speaker 2: thanks to everybody's generosity, But we really do need your
Speaker 2: help again because you know, studios aren't going to do this.
Speaker 2: It's fans that are going to do this. And we
Speaker 2: haven't got an endless pot of money, and I'm sure
Speaker 2: you haven't either, But just a little donation, if enough
Speaker 2: of you give a little donation, that could mean that
Speaker 2: we could get out there we could interview Stephen and
Speaker 2: Dean and Leah and John and it would just bring
Speaker 2: so much to the project. So if you want to
Speaker 2: have a look at gofund me, just search for gofund
Speaker 2: me and Joe out and I'll leave it in the
Speaker 2: show notes as well the link to that. I'd be
Speaker 2: super grateful if you consider contributing to the documentary again
Speaker 2: or for the first time. If there's anybody out there
Speaker 2: as well that wants to be involved outside of the
Speaker 2: go fund me, as maybe an executive producer who's got
Speaker 2: a bigger donation that we could talk about, then yeah,
Speaker 2: give us a shout. Info at filmnumentaries dot com. That's
Speaker 2: the email address you can reach me on. I should
Speaker 2: also say good news that one of the editors that
Speaker 2: we were chasing, who's a mutual friend of ours, we
Speaker 2: spoke to him for the first time a couple of
Speaker 2: years ago. I think about the project and how we'd
Speaker 2: love to have him involved, but unfortunately he's just too
Speaker 2: busy to work. He's great, he's a great editor, great guy,
Speaker 2: and thankfully he has plenty of work. But what he
Speaker 2: has done is suggested a edit assistantly work with who
Speaker 2: really wants to make the leap to features, and he's
Speaker 2: willing to kind of get the project in some shape
Speaker 2: for us, So we've recently sent him the drives. He's
Speaker 2: getting it all in the avid and transcribed, and yeah,
Speaker 2: we're really excited to see what he's going to put together.
Speaker 3: It's great to have him involved.
Speaker 2: And the that I was talking about as well is
Speaker 2: going to work with us editorially, but just not do
Speaker 2: the editing because he wants to see the project made
Speaker 2: as well. And it's just this mutual love we have
Speaker 2: for you know, this subject, and it's people like us
Speaker 2: that are going to do it. Like I said before,
Speaker 2: there's nobody else going to make this documentary, so we
Speaker 2: need to do it and we need your help. So
Speaker 2: if you can help, be super grateful. It's amazing to
Speaker 2: think back at you know, at the start, back in
Speaker 2: twenty twenty one, when I interviewed him and then us
Speaker 2: visiting la in March twenty twenty two, the idea of
Speaker 2: getting Spielberg and Carpenter and Kundy and Thompson would have
Speaker 2: seen completely out the realms of what we're able to achieve.
Speaker 2: But now we've got I think something like fifteen interviews
Speaker 2: in the bag. Oh there's one I didn't mention. Actually,
Speaker 2: when we're in Martha's vineyard. You remember the girl who
Speaker 2: shouts shark shark, shark, shark in the pond, Well, that
Speaker 2: was Joe's girlfriend at the time. He was dating her
Speaker 2: whilst he was on the island. You know, that was
Speaker 2: his private life. But we did interview her and a
Speaker 2: bit of a reunion between the two of them when
Speaker 2: we were at Michael's event and they talked about some
Speaker 2: of those experiences.
Speaker 3: That was cool.
Speaker 2: But yeah, getting Spielberg and co. Would have been totally
Speaker 2: out of the realms of something that we thought we
Speaker 2: could achieve. But we've got those fifteen interviews in the bag,
Speaker 2: and we're getting some wonderful feedback from that trailer that
Speaker 2: we're sharing internally. The reason we're sharing it internally, by
Speaker 2: the way, is because we don't have copyright for public
Speaker 2: posting of that of that trailer because it uses copyright
Speaker 2: music and visuals.
Speaker 3: But we just want to.
Speaker 2: Share it with people internally in the industry to get
Speaker 2: some feedback and to show people the quality of the
Speaker 2: thing we're putting together. And I have to say, each
Speaker 2: time I watch it, if I have a couple of
Speaker 2: weeks away from from it, I go back to it
Speaker 2: and I'm like, wow, I want to see that. And
Speaker 2: that's what continues to spare us on. You know, this
Speaker 2: is what we want to see, and have really embraced
Speaker 2: this kind of idea from both personal point of view
Speaker 2: and also for the documentary itself, about making your own luck.
Speaker 2: You know, Joe was able to maneuver his way up
Speaker 2: and through the industry pretty quickly out of particular jobs
Speaker 2: where it would have been difficult to get to the
Speaker 2: next rung of the ladder, and he sort of skipped
Speaker 2: the rungs of the ladder. And I like that idea
Speaker 2: of making your own luck. You know. I've had a
Speaker 2: pretty amazing couple of years with now writing for Lucasfilm
Speaker 2: and visiting Skywalker Ranch and go to Martha's Vineyard, interviewing
Speaker 2: Richard Dreyfuss, and you know, so many highlights that are
Speaker 2: there because we've just kind of made it happen. We've
Speaker 2: made our own luck along with the you know, the
Speaker 2: generosity of people who follow what I do.
Speaker 3: It's just been great.
Speaker 2: So I'm hoping that next year or so that we
Speaker 2: are going to have a documentary to show you folks,
Speaker 2: you might take longer than that.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 2: I can't put a date on it yet because it
Speaker 2: depends on so many things. It depends on raising these
Speaker 2: extra funds getting back to LA. Who knows what's going
Speaker 2: to happen in the next year or so. But if
Speaker 2: you'd like to contribute, check the gofund me and the
Speaker 2: show notes, visit for me inimentaries dot com. Keep an
Speaker 2: eye on Jamie SWB on Twitter or x film youmentories
Speaker 2: on Instagram of Facebook. Yeah, and thanks for listening to
Speaker 2: this little bonus ramblier episode. And I'll be back twice
Speaker 2: each month, two episodes each month of the podcasts as
Speaker 2: you would normally expect it with some interviews. I've got
Speaker 2: some great ones lined up in the coming months. I'm
Speaker 2: going to be going under the knife in the next week,
Speaker 2: so I'm going to be out for the count for
Speaker 2: a good week or so. They're recovering. But yeah, I'll
Speaker 2: make sure that the two episodes a month are going.
Speaker 2: So if you want to support that as well, Patreon
Speaker 2: dot com, forward slash Jamie Benning and yeah, I look
Speaker 2: forward to hearing some feedback from you and hope you
Speaker 2: can join me for the next episode of the Film
Speaker 2: Your Entries podcast.
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