Speaker 1: What is going on? Clippers fans? Welcome to season four,
episode eight of Clips and Dip. I am Chuck Buckler,
joined by Adam Osland and a wonderful new background from
Eric Boie. Thank you so much. Eric. If you can't
see the full thing, we'll share it out. Everyone can
use it for whatever they want. William Updyke is at
the theater. He is getting cultured after watching the Clippers
game last night. I don't blame him. We are Clips
and Dip. Thank you for hanging out. If you want
to watch us, you can find us at YouTube dot
com slash at Clippers podcast. Today we're gonna be talking
the three and four start, as well as previewing the
incredibly shorthanded Clippers against the kind of shorthanded Suns they're
getting greenback. Dylan Brooks will be out. We'll get to
all that. Adam, how are you doing, my friend?
Speaker 2: I'm okay, a little bit frustrated with this little start
by the Clippers once again this season, but these are
the cards that we've been dealt and they got to
make the most of it and somehow find a way
to win the next two games against Phoenix.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they do have kind of it's not a back
to back, but it's away and a home against the
Suns or the day in between. The Clippers sit at
three at four, they remain banged up. Kawhi has an
ankle injury. He is out for the game against the
Suns on the sixth. Not ideal. I thought Beal looked
good against the Thunder or not against the Thunder his
game on Monday, I thought the activity was nice. But
now we have Kawhi out, which is not ideal.
Speaker 2: No Kawhi and Beale missing last game, and this Clippers
team without James Harden as well tomorrow for personal reasons.
So I tweeted this out a little bit earlier. But
we're about to see what Chris Paul has left. And
I know he's been struggling so far this season, but
that's been strange to me because he was moving so
well in the preseason. It makes me want to believe
that he's just processing the speed of the game that
everybody's playing at right now in the regular season, and
guys are moving really fast out there, and.
Speaker 1: Well they'll be so fat.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, the fastest pace since like the seventies, everybody's
playing at and hopefully physically. He still has enough left
to help this team. But he and Bogie are going
to be big for the game.
Speaker 1: Yeah we will. We will need them for sure. Turnovers
are destroying no real transition for this uh. Turns are
destroying anything that this Clippers team can build right now.
I think this is from Justin Russo. Last night against
the Thunder was the third time in seven games if
the Clippers have allowed thirty plus points off turnovers, the
rest of the NBA has done that a combined five times.
Speaker 2: Is not ideal, especially considering all the offseason talk and
the T shirts and get the f back. But coach
Lou kind of point out that, you know, postgame, we
just can't turn it over because we're too old to
be able to get back and stop some of these
transition points. And they have not been sound with the basketball,
and that's really disappointing so far, considering last season when
they started off the year slow and they were turning
the basketball over, well, they had to run everything through
James Harden, right, but when Kawhi came back, the turnovers
were cut down to like thirteen or less. And Kawhi
has been there for six of the seven games and
they're still having them right now. What I worry about
I worry about.
Speaker 1: It too, and the nature of them, you know, live
ball turnovers those are one thing. You know, sometimes it's
been some ill advised passes by whoever has the ball,
and then but we're they're turning the ball over on
inbounds plays, like we're like, there's some things like when
when ty I know people have Tyler's in the hot
seat after seven games and I know people kind of
laughed when he was like, we just need to pass
it to the open guy. I think when it comes
to inbounds plays, I'm with TYLERO on this one, Like,
it's not there's no amount of coaching to tell whoever's
inbounding the ball, hey, don't throw it, you know what
I mean, Like in that particular instance, Yeah, the guy's
got a.
Speaker 2: Lot in I very much do not put turnovers on
the coaching staff. I've been screaming about this the last
week or so. It's like, guys, they don't come out
with a game plan to turn the basketball over on
the players.
Speaker 1: Hand with the pam cooking spray before we get out there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and now everyone's back to Zubas can't hold onto
the ball. I I do think there's something to the
teams playing so fast this season, and for an older
team like this, it could be jarring and everybody's picking
them up. And we saw it. It really started that
fourth quarter last season of that game against the Golden
State Warriors, where they picked them up full court, they
got into them, they pressed them, and they had twelve
turnovers in that fourth quarter. And other team's picked up
on that. And now with everyone doing that more anyways,
game to game, well, it's more of a focal point
when you're taking on a team that really struggles in
that area. With the Clippers.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's I mean, other than just turnovers being
advantageous in general, if you're the other team in the NBA,
like you said, once the ball is turned over, that's
a transition opportunity, and the Clippers constantly find themselves on
the wrong end of that through various reasons. Age. You know,
it's just like we knew. It's not a surprise if
you kind of followed this team in the offseason. A
lot of people are like, well, transition defense is probably
gonna be kind of an issue based on their age.
It's just so much harder when they make it more
difficult on themselves with not focusing or whatever other word
we can use for some of these turnovers.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it could be early season chemistry issues, just
getting up to speed and trying to mesh with whatever
guys are available each night. Right now. There's a lot
of different variables you can look at, but bottom line
is they have to clean it up to some degree.
We're talking thirteen or less that that should be the number.
And you know, they had zero in the first quarter
against Okay s And it's no surprise that they got
up by thirteen. Okay, maybe it was a little bit
of a surprise, no surprise. It was their best quarter
when they didn't turn the ball over at all, and
then had eight turnovers in the second quarter and we're up.
I wanted the half. I think I had five or
six more in the third, and then the game got
away from them pretty quickly with a seventeen zero run
by Okay.
Speaker 1: See. Yeah, they finished with eighteen or nineteen that game.
Again after the scoreless first quarter for turnovers. I mean,
I think that's probably been my biggest frustration with the
team because it is such a frustrating problem too from
a fan perspective, because you're like, why are you doing
that obvious? You know what I mean, Like, it's like
all you can say is they just have to pay
more attention and fix it. Like there's no drills at
this point to be like throw it like this, you know,
Like I can see why people are frustrated.
Speaker 2: Part of it is age, and part of it is
the way the game's being played. Teams are pressuring more
the ball pressure, They're not giving you much airspace. They
are trying to get more possessions out there. So it
is something that the league is leaning into that is
in particularly weakness for this Clippers team, or in particular
a real weakness for this Clippers team that everybody's trying
to get better at, not just to screw the Clippers,
but it just so happens. That's it's just the Clippers
struggled with I don't know, asked Pablo.
Speaker 1: I feel I'm not asking. I'm not coming within one
hundred feet of Bablo. It is funny, too, kind of
to your point, Remember how much they'd struggle against the
Rafters last year. A young team that's built on running
and possession and possession and possession and it was like, okay, great,
like we're seeing what this is going to become and
it's out. You know, the Grizzlies are trying to do
it to some extent with varying degrees of success over
there with their personnel. But yeah, I love that point
of like this is what the league is kind of
harshly transitioning.
Speaker 2: Towards more of it's directly aimed at the Clippers weaknesses.
It's like bringing in the second apron and hurting them
by taking away there's no but it's just it's unfortunate
that it's trending in a direction that definitely does not
help the Clippers due to their age and the age
specifically of their ball handlers and point guards out there,
So they have to be more in tune with it.
They have to adjust themselves and just be better. And
the hope is that you've had some real hard lessons
and teams that are some of the best at turning
you over already, and maybe that will make them better
as they go along here because they've been put through
some real drills here when it comes to happen to
figure out ways to hold on to the basketball and
get better.
Speaker 1: What I'm hearing is the Clippers need to not only
eliminate the aprons and the salary cap, we also need
to eliminate the shot clock. We need to be like
those six states that don't use the shot clock in
high school basketball anymore, or something like that, and we'll
be fine. Let's talk starters a little bit. I was
looking at some lineups and a glaring issue kind of
tying together the turnovers and transition defense. Harden Beale, Kawhi,
Derek Jones and Zoo had played sixty three minutes together,
the most of any lineup so far this season as
of when I look this up earlier today. They're shooting
fifty eight percent from the floor forty four percent from three. However,
three to two assist, a turnover ratio one hundred and
twenty one, offensive rating, one hundred and thirty two defensive
rating for the starting five right now, which is not good.
Speaker 2: Offensive ratings good, oh one of the offensive rating, well,
I mean there are like the plus here. The thing
they're chasing is, okay, how do we figure out to
get this group to start games faster? Because Coach Lou
brought this up, I think before the heat game, actually
saying that within the first seven minutes, you know, the
worst defense in the league, and then after that they're
one of the best the rest of the ball game.
And so they're getting off to these slow starts, and
we saw it against the Miami Heat. Down twelve two,
he stuck with the starting lineup. One of the questions
that I thought about asking him last night was how
close he was to making a change to the starting
lineup after the first time out when they were down
twelve to two, But he stuck with it and they
went on a sixteen to three run when they came
back in. So they they just look like they're not
ready to play to start games. And I don't know
if that is an age thing, a bad habit thing
that goes back years, because there's a lot of different factors.
Like they were ready last year, right, they were definitely
better they had I think their net rating in first
quarters was thirteen. Last year they were thirteenth, So they
weren't amazing, but they were much better than this And defensively,
I think they were like eighth on that and to
start to start games. Yeah, And I was looking through
some of the defensive rating stuff I think late last
night and there's really.
Speaker 1: Never a good idea to be looking at defensive rating
stuff late at night.
Speaker 2: Well in particular the quarters, and you look at first
quarter and I think they're bottom three in defensive rating.
They're twenty six there. But it's not like it gets
that much better, drastically better. Second quarters. They're let's see here,
this is coming in after last night twenty second. So
it's not like they go from you know, a bottom
five defensive rating in the first quarter to being a
top five defensive rating in the second or the third quarter.
Third quarter, they're still twenty second. Fourth quarter, though, they
were better, and let's see what they are now, sixteenth
I think coming into last night's game, which you can
kind of yeah, that's skewed the numbers. I think they
were top ten in the fourth quarter, which tells me
that maybe some of it is like, yeah, they are
just not in tune to start ball games, and they
eventually starting to tighten the screws a little bit defensively
by the end of the game, maybe because that was
their best and is their best defensive rating the fourth quarter.
But I worry about we talked about this coming into
the season. The big biggest concern was Bradley Beal being
on a minutes restriction and being banged up to start
the year to where he plays the first two games
but then gets hurt in a different way with the
lower back injury. Right, and we'll see if he's still
on a minutes restriction or how long have a minutes
restriction tomorrow because they're gonna need him more than usual
against his former team in Phoenix without Kawhi, without James Harden.
Is he still on a twenty minutes restriction after not
playing the back to back now playing against Okay, see,
I don't know, but it's just it's another season where
it's a team that is limping out of the gates
to start where they don't have everybody fully healthy, to
where you can test out different lineups and really get
a decent sample size and understanding of what you have
to work with. Tuca her shadow got me this time, because.
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you want to see Adams Cats, uh, you
can watch this at YouTube. I love that it's on
your desk. That's awesome. YouTube dot Com, Shacklipper's podcast Watch
Adams Cats.
Speaker 2: Maybe coach Lou said last night, you know, Joey Lynn
asked him, I think the second question post game was
about the progress you're making when it comes to evaluating lineups. Yeah,
and he basically said, like, we haven't really gotten there
because Bradley Beal's on a mini restriction and now Kauhai
is out a game. So now it kicks the can
down the road. It sets them back from being able
to say, hey, here's a clean ten game sample size.
This is what you have to work with, and it
gives you a built in excuse. And I'm not saying
they're making it. It is fair to say they haven't
really gotten a fair shake with this group because of
all these different factors. But it means you're pushing back
making adjustments to a later date. And therefore, let's say,
regardless of if guys were healthier on a minister restriction,
this lineup just wasn't going to work, even if they
were everybody healthy and in ideal spots. Well, we're gonna
take longer to figure that out now, because it sounds
like they're gonna take their time and really be patient.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he said ten to fifteen games and the rotation
will be cut down from ten to nine, which I
don't and I mean this in a that would be
great if that were possible, But I don't think right
now we're gonna see that within ten to fifteen games,
just because we got and this was before the Kawhi
ain't so like it, and you can't. I know, people
want to just plug in a guy for a game
and see how it goes, right, Like, why isn't John
Collins starting? That's the thing. We've heard a bunch and
it's like, hey, I get the frustration, but like you said,
we haven't even had the fully healthy starting lineup for
more than four games or whatever. It is like, we can't.
You can't put the cart in front of the horse
when the horse is not even shoot yet or whatever
metaphor I'm trying to say here. That was actually pretty good,
but that was not bad.
Speaker 2: You gotta put the bit in the horse's mouth.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you can't put the cart before Yeah, the players
are the spurs. The backups are the cart. But you
know what I mean, it's just it's roster crunch it
like we would learn. And this isn't to take anything
away from how great of a start to the season
John Collins has had, because not a single Clippers fan
is upset with John Collins and what he's done so far,
starting him for a game and being like, well that
was pretty good with a bunch with you know, when
guys who aren't going to be starting in that lineup
means nothing in the grand scheme of the team's success
right now.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but to your point of, well, it was going
to be ten to fifteen games, but now that they
haven't gotten a healthy sample size of these guys, that's
it going to be fifteen to twenty five games to
figure this out. How long is it going to take
to get there? When does the sense of urgency kick in? Yeah?
That was something that Tilmara Zarli kind of ask coach
Lou pregame, can you afford to experiment and go through
this process because of the Western Conference? And Coach Lou
made it clear there and I thought this was big
that Bradley Beal is a starter for us. Yeah, it
didn't equivocate. That is sly set in stone. So Bradley
Beal's not going anywhere. So if everybody is like, we
want done and and Collins in the starting lineup, take
out DJ take out Bradley Beal looks like it best.
There's only one spot available and that's DJs. And to
be fair, DJ has been really damn good to start
this season. This is not on him.
Speaker 1: DJ and Collins have been like the two most consistent players.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and James aside from the turnovers, has been their
best players. But yeah, been their best player. Yeah, those
two have been great. So how do you come to
DJ and be like, hey, I'm sorry, we got to
take you out even though you're off to the best
start maybe of your career in a season. And it
looks like he's knocking down threes at a higher rate.
We'll see how that holds up. He's slashing getting to
the basket. I really like what we've seen from him.
But does it work long term? And how much time
do they have to figure this out? It's another game
tomorrow where they're not going to be able to get
much data all when it comes to the starting lineup.
What they go with tomorrow could be a one off
type of game, just like it was against ok See and.
Speaker 1: Maybe Saturday too, right, Like, it's not a back to back,
but it's there's only one day off. You know.
Speaker 2: When Kawai came when that quaid news came out that
he was going to miss the game yesterday. I was
still hopeful that okay, but this is a back to back,
so maybe he was going to miss it anyways. And
now that he's not missing the game against the Suns
where they have a day off in between, and now
he's had a couple of days off that first game
against them on Thursday, that leads me to think it's
a little bit more concerning at least that he's out
for another game, because I could make the argument that
he probably shouldn't be playing back to backs anyways, regardless
of the ankle tweak. Agreeable that we said that back
in twenty twenty four when his knee swelled up out
of nowhere at the end of the season. I said,
then I don't think he should play it back to
back the rest of his career, with how injury prone
he has been. Solutely, you could have thought, well, well,
they're just being overly cautious, and maybe it gives them
an excuse not to play him on a back to
back because he tweaked the ankle late in the game
against the Miami Heat. But that doesn't seem like it's
it's the case because now he's missing the next game.
Speaker 1: And Tyleru initially when asked about it, and this I'm
not saying, this is a concrete diagnosis. His phrasing was,
we're gonna know in a couple of days. So it
was like that to me was like, Oh, he's missing
one for sure, because that's the nature of the What
does law Murray say? The nice thing about the NBA
is you always have a chance to bounce back very
quickly from your last performance. That to me was like, oh,
so it's at least yeah, I hope he plays on Saturday.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, this is just one of them to start
seven and three at worse with this schedule, this may
be the easiest ten game stretch of the season and
blowing it. They are gotta be honest about it, like
they could they could have a twenty five and six
stretch or something like that coming up. But because of this,
it could still cost them a top three seed.
Speaker 1: Well and they I mean, look at last year. They
went fourteen and three, fifteen and two over the last seventeen.
Speaker 2: Eighteen and three, the last twenty one yeah too, not
be playing. Yeah, they had to win that final game
against Golden State the play in to stay out of
the play in Pseudo playoff type of game, so I
play in off. Yeah, this is significant to me. I
think the Clippers mindset is still as long as we're
healthy by the time the playoffs starting, we're not in
the plan will be fine no matter who we play,
not as it, love it or hate it. That could
be where we are. That's what it's felt like in
the past, and I don't see that changing with the
things are going right now.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I felt we're gonna get into the game preview
just a few But we love zoo Bots on this podcast.
We championed him even before we started this podcast. All
three of us have been zoo heads. Someone made a
very funny joke on Twitter. I was like, oh, Zoo's
touch looks a little rough to start the season around
the basket, and someone said, yeah, it must have been
that ten pounds. He like, he said, this touch must
have weighed ten pounds. Very funny joke, very well played.
But what's going on is that just a rhythm thing?
Is like, he's not an old guy who needs to start.
He didn't play as much summer basketball because Croatia, for
the first time in their history, didn't qualify for the
EuroBasket and he has played a lot better after the
EuroBasket summers. But I hope he gets into gear soon man,
because we love him as a safety valve. But if
it's not as sharp as it usually is when they're
in the current kind to run a form they are,
it's a little more glaring and he gets the unfair
criticisms of he sucks now or whatever.
Speaker 2: Last night was the first game in a while where
I put blame on a visa Zubots, because they actually
did try to feature him starting the third quarter. He
got a hook shot, they kept trying to go to him.
Some of it ended in turnovers by him or just missshots. Now,
he was not nearly good enough against Okac, and I
think their only chance of winning that game was somebody
else had to get it going because you had James
Harden in the first quarter, Collins in the second quarter.
Who's going to be the next guy to help out
in the group project to try to keep them afloat.
Speaker 1: And annoys Zoo.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and there they are. They're still the best defense
right now in the league by like four points per
one hundred possessions. They've been elite, and that's why they're
undefeated because actually the first six games of the season.
They started, they were the worst shooting three points team
in the West the first six games, and then they
went off.
Speaker 1: It was like twenty one.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they went off against the Pelicans, and then they
obviously shot well against us last night, and I think
it's almost like, what was it forty eight percent or
something them three, But their defense kept him, kept him
in it. The Clippers, meanwhile, is the opposite of that.
Their defense last season kept them in it, and right
now it's like twentieth. But Abasta Zubots like that was
a big opportunity for him, and he was not nearly
good enough and deserves criticism for that performance. I don't
say that very often the beats of Zubots, because most
of the time it's everybody else not getting him involved enough. Now,
maybe when you bring up rhythm and timing like he's
been in single digit shot attempts the last three games.
Seven shots against the Pelicans, nine against Miami, three last night,
the three excuse me eight last night, made three of
them last night I will put on him because they
were trying to get him the basketball. He wasn't force
full enough. He had turned off. But the two games prior,
I was still like, what are we doing here? Are
we going to get a beats? Zubas a little bit
more involved? So did did that hurt his timing coming
into a game where he would have more usage out
there last night? I don't know, but he still has
had a twenty one point game against Portland with eight boards.
He had nineteen granted a lot of that game after
Utah was already up big in game one. There's nothing
wrong with his movement, there's nothing wrong with he hasn't
forgotten right he had to shoot right handed and left
handed hook shots. He's just as skilled as ever. It's
just it's just a slow start for maybe a variety
of reasons.
Speaker 1: I want to talk about Chris Done in some of
the depth in a sec. But Toe Mayer Azari, wonderful
beat reporter, just posted a twenty minute super cut on
Twitter of for those of you complaining about Tylu and
the coaching staff. Here are the Clippers one hundred and
twenty turnovers through seven games this season. Please tell me
which ones the coaching staff could have meled with or prevented.
Holy shit, till Mary, Hell, Yeah, that's hilarious. What a
lunatic super cut to make I love that.
Speaker 2: It's facts. I've been screaming about this people on people
in the chat going off about this is on the
coaching staff, and it's like, what these careless turnovers are
on them? Yeah, I'm I'm very happy he did this.
That is.
Speaker 1: That's so funny all right? Depth wise, John Collins, I mean,
no notes, what a wonderful sarcus is Chris Dunn your guy,
your defensive identity guy. They gotta find more minutes for him.
Tyler's talked about it. God is there such a big
difference when he is on the floor. And this is
a credit to how good he is as well, like
he I don't know what anyway, contract wise, the man
should be paid more money. But it's a weird problem.
Speaker 2: Some people were thanking God that he wasn't in the
starting lineup to start off this season. Now we're asking
for him back in.
Speaker 1: Like I I'm not formally asking for him back then.
Speaker 2: Well, you may get there eventually. I think Chris Nunn
is there is a different spirit and energy when he's
out there on the floor defensively, And I haven't checked
the numbers and all the lineup data when he's out
there and how their defense looks. I probably should, but
it's still I feel like not even checking these things
or carrying that much till ten games typically totally because
against one game swings things so quickly with the numbers.
But against Phoenix, they're down ten in the first quarter,
he comes in, has two steals right away, completely changed
the trajectory of that game to get them their first win.
Against Miami, say thing in the second half where it
looked like it was getting away from them. They eventually lost,
and he played twelve straight minutes and coach lu took
him out maybe around the four or five minute mark
of the fourth quarter, But from the end of the
third to the star of the fourth where he had
an inbound steal to start the fourth for a layup,
it's just so plainly obvious how good he is and
how inspiring he is defensively for this team. But again,
what are you gonna do? DJ's played well, You're gonna
take him out for Chris Dunn to start right now?
Seven games in. Obviously, Chris Dunn got to start last
night out of necessity because they're missing Kawhi, they're missing
Bradley Beal. But I just I think they are overly
reliant on him and his competitiveness out there on the court,
because a guy who probably shouldn't have to play much
more than twenty five minutes, like you shouldn't have to
look to him like if your identity. And that's why
I asked coach lup pregame, because last season he said
so many times, we have to play like he does,
we have to play like Chris Dunn, and their identity
might be wrapped up, and they followed his lead and
he started a ton of games last season. I don't
know what it came out to, but are they missing that?
Do they not recognize themselves to start games because Chris
Dunn isn't out there after he started so many last year.
I don't know.
Speaker 1: It's kind of like how Batoum was such a nice starter.
So I was just looking at just NBA Fantasy Labs
on off individual net rating differences with Chris Dunn. Every
single player who plays meaningful minutes so far has a
negative net rating when Chris Dunn is off the court.
Bogie's plus three, Chris Paul and Brook Lopez are plus
like seventeen. But those lineups, which we'll talk about them
in a second's not good either, But like when he's
off the court, it seems like most of the regular
guys aren't playing as well. I've liked that Bogie looked
more confident versus the thunder, which I think opens things
up for the Clippers now that he's had some more
time to get back. He made a great feed to Zoo,
kind of a he like drove and like Jump made
the decision hit Zoo, So like I liked the comp
he's kind of if he has another good game, which
we'll need him to have against the Suns, I think
Bogie can be put in the on the upswing category
of clips.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I like, I'm not trying to, you know, find
too many silver linings in a game they lost by nineteen.
Speaker 1: Sure, but there's not a lot.
Speaker 2: They probably maximized. I don't know their talent they had
available in that game for the most part, just being
up at the half and brilliant was tight till the
last three minutes of the third quarter. Yeah, but Bogie
came out and hit a three right away, just green light,
I'm shooting this thing, just let it fly. That was
good to see, and he brought it into the front
court a lot. Yeah, for James Harden to get him
off ball to not make it his taxing, and he
did so pretty successfully. So both those things were really
good to see more aggressive offensively. Where are they gonna
need him tomorrow? This has to They're gonna have to
get a big game from him if they're gonna have
a chance against Phoenix.
Speaker 1: Last pairing, and then we'll get into the preview. I
was looking at the two man lineup data with Chris
Paul and brook Lowpins. They have played seventy one minutes
together minus twenty net rating. Lopez can hit the three,
We've seen that. If he's not doing that, it's just card.
I'm not you know, there's no again, seven games in,
I'm assuming this will get better. There's no tangible solutions
right now. Even someone was tweeting at us that Yanick
should get some run and I was like, okay, well,
let's let's not make that switch yet.
Speaker 2: I think people have reduced brook low Pez to just well,
if he's not hitting threes, what is he doing. He's
still a good rim protector. Did you see the two blocks?
He hadn't shade and sharp in the Portland game? Like
he still is defending the rim. That second unit just
hasn't come together. If if Harden or Kawhy aren't out
there with that second unit, they have been getting destroyed. Yeah,
so it's been brutal, especially because they looked so good
in the preseason. And I guess you got to throw
out everything you see in the preseason because none of
it is translated for this Clippers team and Vets.
Speaker 1: Like it makes sense that a team of Vets would
crush the preseason, you know what I'm saying, Like, it's
like they've done this, some of them twenty times, so
they know what guys are trying to do. But yeah,
it's uh and again seven games. I'm not saying I'm
not concerned, but I'm also not willing to say let's
give Yannick some burn and let's change a starting lineup.
That it's fair to be frustrated that we haven't seen
them all healthy, but the way to fix that is
not wholesale changes.
Speaker 2: Yeah, a lot of this is guys playing better, valuing
the basketball, not being as careless with it. Check out
the toe mare mix.
Speaker 1: It's like, how long do you think that took him?
Speaker 2: Sorry you could sort through, Yeah, it took some time.
That's good work. But I'm not giving up on Broke
Lopez because he at least went four to four from
three last night, I think after going three for his
last seventeen or something like that from three the four
games prior. So he needs that shot, he needs that confidence.
But there is something to okay. If the league is
playing faster, your backup center is going to be asked
to do more as well. When it comes to playing
against up tempo teams. I'm not saying everybody's like the
Indiana Pacers when they were a whole with Tyrese Haliburt
in the first round series, and I'm not going to
put a ton into that because they were able to
play Brook off the court at times. It's like, yeah,
they could do that to a lot of centers without
was playing in the finals. Yeah, Tyree's doesn't do his
achilles in Game seven, they might be champions. So you
just can't. There are certain guys that you have to
have faith in and confidence in their body of work
and say, and not just body of work. Just look
at last season for the last two years, him and
CP three. The reason I'm not giving up on Chris
Paul is because I just saw him play a two games. Now,
sometimes it can go really quick for older guys, But
I'm not willing to say that after seven games, Nor
am I able to say that for Brook Lopez, who
played seventy nine games I think last season and played
thirty minutes a game from Milwaukee.
Speaker 1: I might say it after fifteen games for Chris Paul's specifically,
but we'll we'll cross that bridge when we get to it.
Speaker 2: Well, if we are, then they got real issues. Hopefully
Bogie's playing well, because yeah, they need one of these
guys to be good this season, to at least be
adequate at that position.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and this is also a reminder of when before
the season started, when people were like, let's make a move.
We got enough depth, Like this is why you have
that enough depth, because shit happens, for lack of a
better term, right, like you can never have enough enough debt,
Like I don't know how else to say it, Like.
Speaker 2: I really think a lot of it is guys being
a little bit shell shocked with how fast the league
is getting. That has happened seemingly overnight, Like there's so
t The fastest team last season was playing at one
O three pace. Now there's a few teams at one
oh six I can't remember, but now there's there's like
ten teams playing at one O three or faster right
right now. So then even the lower teams are playing
a little bit faster than they were last season. And
I'm hoping this is gonna slow down. I don't see
it carrying throughout the entire eight ten game season this way,
but for the Clipper's sake, they could use a little
bit of regression with the pace that's going on in
this league. Oh and by the way, like okay, see
came into last night's game, I think bottom eight in pace,
not like they were playing as fastest pace, but selectively
when you turned the basketball over, they can get out
and run real quick and make you pay.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So last year the top five paces, yeah, Grizzlies
one oh three point seven, Bulls one oh three point six,
Hawks one oh three point four, Wizards one O two. Uh,
Oklahoma City Thunder one oh one.
Speaker 2: Basically, so there's one great team in there, right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, great call. And this year you have, uh, well,
the Bulls are obviously the best team in the NBA
this year. If you want to think, if you want
to let's let's revisit both teams records in twelve games
you were at Yeah, Heat one oh six, Pace, Wizards
one oh five, Blazers one oh five, MAVs one oh four,
Grizzlies one oh three, Hornets one oh three. Yeah, Like,
it's a way also for teams that don't have very
good outside shooting to compensate.
Speaker 2: So they played two of those teams in the Heat
and Blazers. They beat one, They probably should have beat
the other if it's not for all the turnovers into
thirty seven points. I I don't think they're that far
away from getting this thing to click in when they're
healthy is the caveat The problem is they ain't gonna
be tomorrow. Are they going to be on Saturday? I
don't know. So you talk about cleaning up the turnovers
and coach Lou mentioned pregame that they're the fourth best
offense in the league when they don't turn it over, Well,
we're still not getting a good look at who this
Clippers team can be in a game tomorrow because it's
not the usual guys. So can they really build off
of that even if they win? What does it mean
long term?
Speaker 1: What is the takeaway. We're gonna talk about Clippers versus
Suns coming up after this quick audio break. If you're
listening to us, if you want to watch us not
have to deal with the audio breaks, find us at
YouTube dot com at Clippers Podcast Suns preview times two
kind of because they play on Thursday and Saturday. Coming
up after these ads in three to one.
Speaker 2: Welcome back in it's Clips and Zip. He's Chef Mokler.
I'm Adam Mosland. It is episode eight nine eight, season four,
eight of season four maybe nine. Good be with you, guys.
Clippers are three and four not great in that department.
Currently episode nine, Clippers have a home and home against
Phoenix starting tomorrow in Phoenix and into a dome on
Saturday night. All right, Chuck, we're gonna talk about this
Phoenix Suns team and what they could do against the Clippers.
Did you buy a chance to see their pace that
they're playing with as you look through the top ten?
Speaker 1: I did not. All I know is that there's no choir.
James Harden and Jalen Green is back, and I don't
feel in an incredibly good place about this game. After
the injury report.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was a kick to the pants. So Phoenix
is middle of the pack pace wise, they're fifteenth.
Speaker 1: Where are the Clips?
Speaker 2: The Clippers are twenty eight. Again, pace will necessarily correlate
with wins, like the Rockets are twenty ninth. San Antonio
is twenty seventh. They're five and one. The Rockets are
four and two. Okayse's twenty six, they're eight. No, I don't.
I don't want people to think that the faster you play,
the better you are. That's obviously not the case. With
the Washington Wizards being second in pace and one and six.
Thirtieth is Boston they're three and five.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's a wonky team.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they're you know, they're figuring things out.
Speaker 1: Who do we think starts this game? Beal should be
good to go? So are for Sures? I think are
Bradley Beal of eats zubot S Derek Joones JUNI.
Speaker 2: I will say Collins, all right, before I say Collins.
Speaker 1: Say because there's done Bogie Collins CP three and with
Kawhi and hardened out, I'm like, it could be any
of these two. These got like.
Speaker 2: You would think it's going to be one of the
Guards and Collins. But because no Bogie has started.
Speaker 1: That's the only reason I say it is because when bull.
Speaker 2: Lean Bogey right, Not that I fully on board, but
Bogie Bogee. Collins so done and CP three are still
coming off the bench together.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that leaves the bench so small though.
Speaker 2: It'll be them we're out to. Yeah, they're gonna, They're
gonna stagger some of this, and the Sons are without
their number one defender dealing the villains out.
Speaker 1: I think. So he's missed their last five games. Let
me look up there.
Speaker 2: Did you get hurt against the Clippers? Actually was it? Yeah,
he didn't play last night and they're lost to the
Golden State Warriors one eighteen to one oh seven up
in San Francisco. So they had Royce O'Neill.
Speaker 1: Yep Son's injury, partner's Clippers, Jalen Green probable, Dylan Brook's
core muscle strain out.
Speaker 2: They had last night Roys O'Neill, Ryan Dunn, Mark Williams,
Grace and Allen Devin Booker. Uh So Jalen Green's starting.
He could start for Grace and Allen. He could start
for Ryan Dunn, maybe Royce O'Neill. I don't think Grace,
Allen was starting earlier in the season. I don't think
that was that was Dylan spot because I made so
that could be Jalen Green spot. Yeah either way. Uh
so it's it's Jalen Green's first game? Is he and
beyond minutes restriction to possibly match the Bradley Beale minute restriction.
Speaker 1: Which is like twenty Now maybe it goes up tomorrow.
Speaker 2: But yeah, twenty. It's Binge twenty. I man, they could
really use it to be excited, but coach lu stress,
we're gonna bring him along slowly. I get it. Like,
first of all, when we came into the season, a
lot of us were saying, Hey, I like this. They
have a point of attack defender and Derek Jones Junior
out there to keep that identity. I'm all for that.
And the theory and idea of Bradley Beal raising their
ceiling versus what they had last year is only gonna
happen if he's doing it and fitting in with the
starters and playing his brand of basketball. Like they have
to make that fit and that's how you get the
highest ceiling in peak with this team probably, so I
get why they're chasing that. You have to that. It
makes sense. Are you going to take your lumps along
the way right now with him in and out and
on a minister restriction the three or four as I'm getting,
And I'm not saying that's the only reason. And it's
not like Bradley Beal is not accountable for how many
turnovers to toll marriages posted seventy six.
Speaker 1: Excuse me, I was fifty six seventy six.
Speaker 2: To act like it's one issue or one guy is
going to solve this when so many guys are not
on the same page right now, that's overly simplistic. So
I'm not trying to put this on. It's the Bradley
Beal piece and they can't make it fit. And if
they just had him healthy, or if they had somebody
else in there, this Clippers team is firing on all cylinders.
That's not it. Because we've seen all types of different
lineups and they're all turning the ball over.
Speaker 1: Right like the personnel switch is not. Yeah, it's horrible
right now, it's yeah. We did Harden and Kauai combined
for fifty seven when we played the Suns earlier this
year and absolutely smoked them. But they won't be there.
One thing I'm looking for from this game. If there
was a game for Eviza Zubats to really put his
stamp on the beginning of the season twenty and ten
in this Sun's game would feel phenomenal and is doable.
Speaker 2: It's it's overdue with the Vica Zubas having this performance
and being featured now. Not having James Harden to help
get him the basketball is a problem. But you know,
him and Bogey have had a connection going back to
when Bogey came in last season a little bit, and
Bogey found him last night for a nice speed. That
could be another reason that he's starting in this ballgame.
But hey, it could be CB three. I have no idea,
who knows, but they're gonna have to find ways. But
Tom could be big. Also, he makes great entry passes. Yeah,
they have to get him involved or you're gonna lose
the game. Like you're not gonna win this game probably
if beats Zubats doesn't have a twenty ten type.
Speaker 1: Of night, and bal probably has to have twenty two, right.
Speaker 2: If he's only playing twenty minutes for sure? Yeah, yeah,
I don't know. I he has to be efficient and
impactful when he's out there. How for however many minutes.
I like that, And he's playing his former team and
they're probably gonna boo the hell out of him. They
will that to Phoenix, I don't think, so, I don't
like it won't be majority booze if there are boos.
Speaker 1: And he's been there's been a franchise in between, you know.
Speaker 2: Like, yeah, he's already I'm back. He's already returned. And
reportedly it was between them and the Clippers this past summer,
so it seemed like he was on good terms with them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know. Phoenix. Phoenix sucks. All of Phoenix sucks.
Gotta control the turnovers with this one, the Suns averaged
the third most per game in the league from when
I made this breakdown.
Speaker 2: So if we're fourth most, I think we're the most.
Speaker 1: So if we can just I guess, take advantage of
their inevitable maybe turnovers and we don't turn it over
nineteen times in this game, I would like our chances more.
Speaker 2: Phoenix is fifth in steals at about ten per game.
The Clippers are third and ten point three. So what
you're asking for is reasonable.
Speaker 1: Always reasonable asks here.
Speaker 2: The other one is the turnover battle.
Speaker 1: When even by one. You don't even blow them out
in the turnover battle. Let's just win it. Let's win
it by the smallest of margins. The other one in
this one. Free throws. The Sons do not take a
lot of free throws. They're like third to last in
free throw attempts per game, and defending without fouling has
kind of been an issue for the Clippers. So I'm
hoping we don't give them more than what they're used
to at the line.
Speaker 2: Can we go over the starting lineup one more time?
Speaker 1: Ours are the Sons.
Speaker 2: The Clippers, So for sures, what.
Speaker 1: I put for for sure is Bradley Beal. Aviatz you
bouts Derek Jones jun Because I don't think they want.
I think Derek Jones Jr. Is kind of seen as
the Bradley Beal. He's a starter for us peace right now.
I wonder there play the Twin Towers.
Speaker 2: I was actually think thinking would they go smaller with
Bogie and done so done and could guard because they're
not that big Phoenix, so they could have guys to
guard Booker and James.
Speaker 1: Green Point right like Booker's effectively.
Speaker 2: He's averaging thirty one per game. If you have CP
three or Bogie out there to start, he's gonna be
hunting them. Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 1: Tough spot. When you have two starters out hot take,
it's difficult.
Speaker 2: To make that their two best players. Yeah, because I.
Speaker 1: Was thinking three guard too, Like I was like, well,
if you have Donn and Derek Jones junior out there,
that's phenomenal for the defense with Zoo, right, you have
levels of great defense there.
Speaker 2: They need at least two ball handlers.
Speaker 1: Right, And I don't think they'll start Collins. I love
John Collins. Is not a knock on him. I don't.
I'm not saying he won't start at some point, but
they've made it clear that, Like I think through their
road so far that Collins is a bench guy right now,
which is not bad. He's been phenomenal for this team.
Speaker 2: I also would point out, like I see some of
what the coaching staff mentioned when law Murray said that
he heard that Collins was a little bit behind with
where they wanted him to be with the offense. Yeah,
I think he had five turnovers last night for a
guy that doesn't handle the ball much. Yes, he had
five turnovers. So for everyone just looking at hey had
seventeen points in twenty five minutes. He had five of
their nineteen turnovers, and he's not a ball handler.
Speaker 1: I think Van Gundy told him to turn it over
five times, Is that right? I think that's what he's just.
Speaker 2: He's executing the game plan, is executing the game play. Well,
we'll see that on tape in Tomares mix.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, Van Gunny's going turn it over, turn it over.
That's a great point about Collins's turnovers because again, phenomenal
hustle guy. We need him in transition. But yeah, the
turnovers not ideal. Lopez have to play because if Zoo
gets featured heavy, I don't know, man, like, this is
gonna be a uh interesting this. I hope for the
Clipper's sake that this is a slog of a game.
This cannot get out and run. If this is a
get out and run game, I don't like that at all.
We're down two guys anyway, I don't care which two
guys were down. You're down to regular rotation guys, and
you put this Clippers team on the track. That's tough.
Speaker 2: No, they're not equipped for that type of basketball, especially
right now with the guys who are going to be out.
We need them. We need them to execute their offense
to hit shots so they can set their defense. And
they can do that in the half court when they're
not turning it over. But again, it's going to be
when the system is not there and James Harden, who
creates the best looks for this Clippers team, even that
is going to be difficult just getting good shots. So
Zoo is going to have to be fed early and offense,
and he's gonna have to demand the ball and he's
gonna have to be aggressive and play to his size
and finish and really get in his bag. It can't
be like last game where they tried to get him
going in the third quarter. It's gonna be three of
the first five possessions he's touching the basketball of the block.
Speaker 1: We got to see that they had to play they
drop a couple years ago or it was like, we're
getting Zoo the first bucket. That's what we got to see.
We saw it for Marcus Morris back in the day.
We've seen it for guys before, but we know that
there's one for Big Zoo. Let him shoulder some of that, and.
Speaker 2: It's it's Mark Williams. It's Nick Richards is the big man. Uh,
the guy out of Duke that they drafted. He hasn't
played the last He had a d n P last
time out.
Speaker 1: Malik whatever.
Speaker 2: Yeah, tough to pronounce the name, but he was the
tenth pick in the draft.
Speaker 1: People really like him.
Speaker 2: I thought.
Speaker 1: I've seen Suns fans be like, where is he?
Speaker 2: Everybody is mad at their coach for something, no matter
who your coach is, Jones, They're mad. They're mad at this.
Speaker 1: City shouldn't exist. The only reason it exists because the
air conditioning was inbedded. Oh okay, any other notes before
we do our player of the game pick, which everyone
is on the table for. By the way, when there's
two starters out, anyone can be player of the game.
Do you have any other notes before our most important
player of the game, because everyone knows the eighth game
of the season is where shit gets figured out.
Speaker 2: Yeah, don't let Devin Booker go for seventy. It has happened.
I agree, although they lost that game. So if he
goes for seventy and the Clippers still win.
Speaker 1: Up seventy, yeah, were they at home too?
Speaker 2: I will say it was a road game in Boston.
Speaker 1: When people were discrediting the seventy I was like, it's
still seventy point. It's still pretty sick.
Speaker 2: It was like his second season two. They all took
a team Pixer afterwards. It's pretty historic, super young.
Speaker 1: Yeah, pretty cool. Okay, who is your player of the
game for the Clippers? We do not pick for the opposing.
Speaker 2: Team, since you're asking me first, I gotta go big Zoo.
I just don't know how they win this game if
he's not giving you twenty twelve couple of blocks. We
were good on the getting his free throws.
Speaker 1: Like we were the first half of the Thunder. We
were setting good screens, we were dominating.
Speaker 2: The boards like they also were missing a lot, so
some of the defensives rebounds were like, oh, yeah, they're missing.
Speaker 1: I hope you grabbing that. Yeah, Zoo's a good pick.
I think I gotta go. I know that Bradley Oil
is on a minister restriction. I agree that he needs
to be efficient. I'm going Derek Jones Junior. He's gonna
be called on to do more defensively, I think, and
if he can put up twenty efficiently, like you mentioned
about the OKAC game, right, we needed someone else to
put in that work for the group project and we
didn't really get it. I think Derek Jones Jr. Can
be that guy. I don't know who's doing the heavy lifting.
It's gonna go zoo Derek Jones Jr. And then like
h Bradley Beal hopefully with an efficient twenty four. That's
a lot now that I say it.
Speaker 2: This is an opportunity for him to get a green
light and not have to worry about deferring to James
or to Kawhi Leonard or just trying to fit in
type of thing. No, you be aggressive. You're going up
against your former team. There's probably some bad blood there.
Go get him, Yeah, go get him. It's also Derek
Jones's former team too, and he said after their first
win over Phoenix this season that there was a little
something more to it.
Speaker 1: Who is Will picking.
Speaker 2: Bogie Bogie or CP three.
Speaker 1: Let's go CEP three will pick CP three officially.
Speaker 2: Officially on the record show.
Speaker 1: We should have a stenographer. We should up for every
pot who's taking notes for this.
Speaker 2: Eric's on it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, that wraps things up. We're gonna do
a happy hour, hopefully happy hour stream at five pm
on Friday at YouTube dot com as Akliber's podcast. We'll
put the audio out to again, could be Sad Hour,
depending what happens, but we'll talk about the game against
the Suns. Probably a full pod on Sunday to talk
the upcoming Clippers games and reviews. Help. You can review
us at Spotify, iTunes, deezer, wherever you're getting your podcasts.
We always appreciate the reviews. Adam seven games in. People
are feeling down. We need one positive thing for these
Clippers fans.
Speaker 2: You're forcing me to.
Speaker 1: Contraction.
Speaker 2: They started three and four last year, they still won
fifty games. I think it's I think it's pretty simple.
Hearts they didn't have Falai to start off last season
with healthy Anyways, there it is, there, it is. We're
hyping positivity, extreme positivity.
Speaker 1: I love that extreme positivity. Is there were three and
four last year. Let us know how you're feeling Actlippers pod.
I am at Chuck Makler on Twitter. He is follow
Adam a, listen to him on the radio, be nice
to him in the chat on Clippers Talk, and we'll
see y'all on Friday. Here is to a win tomorrow
against the Suns and as always let's go clips