1 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:20,320 Speaker 1: And we are back with another edition of the Federalist 2 00:00:20,399 --> 00:00:23,920 Radio Hour. I'm Matt Kittle's senior elections correspondent at The 3 00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:28,399 Federalist and your experienced Shirpa on today's quest for Knowledge. 4 00:00:28,879 --> 00:00:31,719 As always, you can email the show at radio at 5 00:00:31,719 --> 00:00:35,920 the Federalist dot com, follow us on x at FDR LST, 6 00:00:36,520 --> 00:00:39,600 make sure to subscribe wherever you download your podcast, and 7 00:00:39,719 --> 00:00:43,039 of course to the premium version of our website as well. 8 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:47,000 Our guest today is Stuart Whitson, Senior director of Federal 9 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:51,880 Affairs at the Foundation for Government Accountability. We discussed today 10 00:00:52,039 --> 00:00:56,560 the age of accountability in government. Stewart, thanks so much 11 00:00:56,560 --> 00:00:59,039 for joining us in this edition of the Federalist Radio Hour. 12 00:01:00,039 --> 00:01:01,359 Speaker 2: Thanks for having me on AM. 13 00:01:01,399 --> 00:01:05,519 Speaker 1: I overstating that the age of accountability in government is 14 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:10,200 are we making America American government at least accountable again? 15 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:14,239 Speaker 2: I think that's absolutely right. I think as President Trump 16 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:17,560 would characterize it, we are definitely entering a golden era 17 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:21,760 or America when it comes to accountability. The DOGE effort 18 00:01:22,159 --> 00:01:25,439 obviously a lot of the things that DOGE is uncovering 19 00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:29,920 already are some things that had already surfaced. There's some 20 00:01:29,959 --> 00:01:32,400 things that other people had flagged in the past, but 21 00:01:32,439 --> 00:01:34,120 it just was never able to get the kind of 22 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:38,599 attention and energy behind it to actually not just identify 23 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:42,040 the wasteful spending, but do something about it. And so 24 00:01:42,120 --> 00:01:45,000 I think that's what's so great about the DOGE effort, 25 00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:48,640 about President Trump's leadership behind it, is things are actually 26 00:01:48,640 --> 00:01:50,719 getting done and Americans love it. 27 00:01:51,439 --> 00:01:57,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, the polling does show it, indeed that Americans as 28 00:01:57,239 --> 00:02:00,920 opposed to what the left, the Democrat Party is saying, 29 00:02:01,959 --> 00:02:08,479 that Americans are beside themselves. They're tearing their clothes over 30 00:02:08,759 --> 00:02:15,080 federal bureaucrats being sent packing, that foreign aid to absolutely 31 00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:21,960 criminally insane programs is being ended. Now, you spoke before 32 00:02:22,199 --> 00:02:27,199 the DOGE committee last month. It was the House Oversight 33 00:02:27,319 --> 00:02:33,240 Committee's subcommittee on Delivering on Government Efficiency, and you said 34 00:02:33,439 --> 00:02:37,000 some interesting things. First and foremost, I always love the 35 00:02:39,199 --> 00:02:42,319 facts the updates of what DOGE is doing the Department 36 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:48,159 of Government Efficiency. But more than anything, you said the 37 00:02:48,199 --> 00:02:52,000 next target should be medicaid, noting that one out of 38 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:58,240 every five dollars is an improper payment, costing US taxpayers 39 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:02,680 more than a trillion dollars perhaps over the next ten years. 40 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:04,120 How did we get here? 41 00:03:05,280 --> 00:03:08,000 Speaker 2: Well, I think there's kind of a confluence of factors 42 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:10,240 that came together, but if you want to go back, 43 00:03:10,400 --> 00:03:13,719 it would really have started during the Obama administration. And 44 00:03:13,759 --> 00:03:16,919 so basically what they did is they tried to transform 45 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:21,080 what it historically been a program medicaid program for the 46 00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:24,479 truly needy. What they've tried to do is push as 47 00:03:24,520 --> 00:03:28,039 many able bodied people as they can onto the program 48 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:31,840 to kind of create a type of government dependency. And 49 00:03:31,879 --> 00:03:34,840 so under the Obama administration, what we saw is new 50 00:03:34,879 --> 00:03:39,479 regulations that basically made it harder for states to kick 51 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:42,800 people off the program who are ineligible for the program. 52 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:44,639 And so what does that mean. It's people that either 53 00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:47,879 earned too much money to be on the program, people 54 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:52,000 that maybe have died, people that may be trying to 55 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:55,639 collect the program in multiple states. And so what they 56 00:03:55,680 --> 00:03:58,800 did is they put these requirements said, you know, states 57 00:03:58,840 --> 00:04:01,599 can't check more than one per year to make sure 58 00:04:01,599 --> 00:04:05,400 people are still eligible, and they suspended some other rules. 59 00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:09,520 Fast forward, Trump administration came in, obviously knocked those rules down, 60 00:04:09,639 --> 00:04:12,879 tried to bring some accountability back to the program. Then 61 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:18,160 COVID hit, and so when COVID hit, massive amounts of 62 00:04:18,199 --> 00:04:21,240 money went in to a number of different programs to 63 00:04:21,319 --> 00:04:24,319 try to help, you know, because basically the government pushed 64 00:04:24,319 --> 00:04:27,639 a lot of people out of the workforce overnight, and 65 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:29,560 so that push, a lot of people got pushed into 66 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:31,800 the program that maybe shouldn't have been in the program 67 00:04:32,360 --> 00:04:36,120 because states primarily weren't able, you know, to monitor the 68 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:39,639 programs and make sure only eligible people were there. But 69 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:41,600 then once they got in the program and Biden came 70 00:04:41,639 --> 00:04:45,240 into office, then he exacerbated the problem through a number 71 00:04:45,279 --> 00:04:47,839 of actions. And one of the biggest things he did 72 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:53,439 was a thing called the Medicaid Streamlining Rule. And so basically, 73 00:04:53,480 --> 00:04:56,079 in the nutshell, what that rule did is it created 74 00:04:56,079 --> 00:05:00,199 this new requirement for the states that prohibited things like 75 00:05:00,519 --> 00:05:03,800 in person or phone interviews to verify that people are 76 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:05,480 actually eligible for the benefit. 77 00:05:05,759 --> 00:05:06,240 Speaker 1: Amazing. 78 00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:12,079 Speaker 2: It also did this it required these quote reconsideration periods 79 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:15,399 for people that are deemed ineligible. So even when the 80 00:05:15,399 --> 00:05:18,079 states would identify people that they knew didn't belong on 81 00:05:18,079 --> 00:05:21,560 the program, the Biden administration would require them to keep 82 00:05:21,600 --> 00:05:25,000 them on the program anyway, wow, to make to do 83 00:05:25,079 --> 00:05:28,160 a reconsideration to make sure that was accurate. But get 84 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:31,639 this all this together, the Congressional Budget Office, which actually 85 00:05:31,639 --> 00:05:34,759 has a record of underestimating the cost of government programs. 86 00:05:35,199 --> 00:05:38,959 But even they estimate that that rule alone cost taxpayers 87 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:43,839 two hundred and twenty four billion dollars. Wow, the next decade. 88 00:05:44,519 --> 00:05:50,199 Speaker 1: That's that is That is criminal waste, That is criminal 89 00:05:50,319 --> 00:05:54,959 abuse of what this program was intended for. Isn't this 90 00:05:55,279 --> 00:05:59,720 just really I'm asking a question. I think I know 91 00:05:59,720 --> 00:06:02,279 the game answer too, But isn't this really just the 92 00:06:02,319 --> 00:06:06,560 attempt of the Obama heights and the Biden folks to 93 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:10,839 socialized medicine, make a nationalized socialized medicine system? 94 00:06:11,439 --> 00:06:15,160 Speaker 2: Absolutely, I mean, there's no other explanation as to why 95 00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:18,639 they would try to push so again, able bodied people 96 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:21,800 onto a program that's designed to benefit you know, truly 97 00:06:21,839 --> 00:06:27,879 needy folks, elderly disabled, children in extreme poverty. And so 98 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:31,680 instead of helping those groups, they're pushing, you know, the 99 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:34,439 twenty year old who's sitting on the couch plane xbox 100 00:06:34,439 --> 00:06:40,360 all day, pushing them onto medicaid and basically discouraging them 101 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:42,879 from entering the workforce at the same time. So there's 102 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:45,720 a number of problems that creates besides just draining the 103 00:06:45,759 --> 00:06:46,720 Medicaid program. 104 00:06:47,959 --> 00:06:53,120 Speaker 1: So how did Doge highlighting all of this waste and 105 00:06:53,399 --> 00:06:57,560 folks like you government watchdogs saying, hey, we need to 106 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:01,240 change this. How did this become, at least according to 107 00:07:01,279 --> 00:07:06,040 the left in this country, President Trump going after medicaid 108 00:07:06,079 --> 00:07:10,000 for the people who really need it, cutting medicaid as 109 00:07:10,199 --> 00:07:12,319 they say, well. 110 00:07:12,199 --> 00:07:17,000 Speaker 2: I think it's basically for the left, they're being asked 111 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:21,000 to defend an indefensible position. And what's that. It's there's 112 00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:25,560 all this litany of wasteful spending, uh there, as you 113 00:07:25,600 --> 00:07:29,439 described it, and rightfully so criminal, you know, handing out 114 00:07:29,480 --> 00:07:32,519 of medicaid benefits that actually is hurting the program. And 115 00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:35,399 so the left is caught between a rock and a 116 00:07:35,439 --> 00:07:39,360 hard place. They can either admit that the President's right. 117 00:07:39,759 --> 00:07:42,879 They can admit that this wasteful spending is happening. But 118 00:07:42,959 --> 00:07:46,279 if they do so, that creates two political problems for them. 119 00:07:46,360 --> 00:07:48,519 One is it makes it harder, you know, with the 120 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:51,319 mid when the mid terms come up, to recognize that 121 00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:54,439 the president was right and he fixed a problem. But 122 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:57,800 it also is a tacit admission on their part that 123 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:01,600 all this waste, fraud, and abuse has and when it 124 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:05,199 happened on their watch. And so I think that's the problem. 125 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:07,920 And so and that's why you see, even with the litany, 126 00:08:08,399 --> 00:08:10,399 you know, you know, you can rattle off the list, 127 00:08:10,439 --> 00:08:13,720 whether it's the thirty two thousand dollars Transgender comic Book 128 00:08:13,759 --> 00:08:18,439 to Peru, another one, this one from yesterday, Additional Institutes 129 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:23,399 of Health seven hundred thousand dollars grant to study cannabis 130 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:28,959 use among quote sexual minority, gender diverse individuals. And so 131 00:08:29,279 --> 00:08:31,680 all this litany of way, I don't even know what 132 00:08:31,720 --> 00:08:34,679 that is, but I don't either all and I don't 133 00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:38,080 think they do. All this list though, is problematic. And 134 00:08:38,240 --> 00:08:40,679 then it actually creates a third problem. And that's the 135 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:43,039 problem that you know, we're just scratching the surface here 136 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:47,039 of but it is the corruption. So right now, DOGE 137 00:08:47,039 --> 00:08:51,240 has uncovered massive amounts of wasteful spending, stuff that any 138 00:08:51,279 --> 00:08:53,799 American no matter what political party they're from, they can 139 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:56,720 look at it on its face and know it's harmful, 140 00:08:56,919 --> 00:09:01,399 wasteful spending. But they haven't gotten yet to the corruption. 141 00:09:01,879 --> 00:09:03,440 And so you know we're going to find that too, 142 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:06,360 where it's you know, who are these groups that are 143 00:09:06,399 --> 00:09:10,320 receiving this grant? Are there any connections between the people 144 00:09:10,799 --> 00:09:12,960 you know who are running these groups and folks in 145 00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:15,919 the Biden administration who approve the funding. Are there any 146 00:09:16,039 --> 00:09:18,799 kind of kickbacks going back to the you know, to 147 00:09:18,840 --> 00:09:21,080 the Democratic Party? And so I think the left knows this, 148 00:09:21,879 --> 00:09:23,720 They know this is all coming down the pike, and 149 00:09:23,759 --> 00:09:26,799 so they're kind of scrambling to back up a little 150 00:09:26,799 --> 00:09:30,559 bit on your question. So why so aggressive against medica, 151 00:09:30,639 --> 00:09:33,639 you know, Medicaid? Uh, this is kind of classic. So 152 00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:37,480 there's a big bill coming up called the Reconciliation Bill 153 00:09:37,559 --> 00:09:40,159 that they're going to pass in Congress, and one of 154 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:44,720 the areas that they're you know, so in order to 155 00:09:44,759 --> 00:09:47,039 extend the Trump tax cuts and do a bunch of 156 00:09:47,080 --> 00:09:49,240 other good policy, they also want to cut a bunch 157 00:09:49,240 --> 00:09:53,159 of wasteful spending. And so the instructions for that big 158 00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:57,960 bill have told the Energy and Commerce Committee, which oversees Medicaid, 159 00:09:58,399 --> 00:10:00,840 to find eight hundred and eighty bill million dollars worth 160 00:10:00,879 --> 00:10:05,039 of savings to be part of that package. And so 161 00:10:05,159 --> 00:10:08,759 they've so Republicans have already found a huge list of 162 00:10:08,799 --> 00:10:11,639 great things just like that that Biden's you know, Medicaid 163 00:10:11,679 --> 00:10:13,840 streamlining rule. Like I said, if you get rid of that, 164 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:16,759 you get a ton of savings just from that alone. 165 00:10:16,759 --> 00:10:19,200 And so you can easily reach that eight hundred and 166 00:10:19,200 --> 00:10:22,440 eighty million dollar figure without touching benefits at all, without 167 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:26,240 even cutting benefits, actually benefits would still grow. And so 168 00:10:26,279 --> 00:10:28,279 the Left is panicking, and what they're doing is they're 169 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:32,080 basically just lying to the American people and trying to 170 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:35,720 condense Americans that, you know, in order to reach those 171 00:10:35,799 --> 00:10:38,480 cuts that they're going to go after these programs. But 172 00:10:38,519 --> 00:10:40,360 it's just inherently untrue. 173 00:10:40,759 --> 00:10:43,720 Speaker 1: There it is, there it is. But before we get 174 00:10:43,759 --> 00:10:46,519 back to that, I just want to say, as you 175 00:10:46,759 --> 00:10:50,039 as you noted, soon we're going to start taking a 176 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:54,360 look at a closer look at the corruption, who was involved, 177 00:10:54,399 --> 00:10:58,559 who made these decisions, And I might suggest that based 178 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:03,360 on the seven hundred hundred thousand dollars grand program that 179 00:11:03,399 --> 00:11:07,720 you mentioned before, how these decisions were made, And it 180 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:11,240 would seem to me that a lot of these decisions 181 00:11:11,279 --> 00:11:16,799 were made while people were very high on some sort 182 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:24,879 of drug that that absolutely distorted their sense of reason, rationality, proportion. 183 00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:28,360 You can't look at some of these programs and say 184 00:11:29,279 --> 00:11:34,799 these were decisions based on good mental health. That said, 185 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:37,399 let's go back to the medicaid situation. 186 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:39,120 Speaker 2: Can I add some today? 187 00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:40,080 Speaker 1: Yeah? Absolutely. 188 00:11:40,279 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 2: I also think it's just a dereliction of duty. Yeah, 189 00:11:43,559 --> 00:11:46,440 it's not being so when you're spending other people's money, 190 00:11:46,879 --> 00:11:50,200 you don't care the same about yours, And sure lack 191 00:11:50,240 --> 00:11:52,919 of being a good steward of taxpayer money. And then 192 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:55,480 the other thing I'd say besides and I grew, but 193 00:11:55,519 --> 00:11:57,559 I agree with your point. The other the other thing 194 00:11:57,639 --> 00:12:01,240 is the timing of the funding. And so people heard 195 00:12:01,240 --> 00:12:04,440 about this in the media and Lee Zelden's doing a 196 00:12:04,440 --> 00:12:07,759 great job at EPA uncovering this, but they literally this 197 00:12:07,919 --> 00:12:12,679 was a Biden person characterizing it as throwing gold bars 198 00:12:13,080 --> 00:12:16,600 off the ship as it's And so that's the other 199 00:12:16,639 --> 00:12:19,519 thing is how much of this wasteful spending came in 200 00:12:19,559 --> 00:12:22,960 the waning days of the Biden administration after the election. 201 00:12:23,159 --> 00:12:26,080 So they knew Biden, the Biden administration knew they were 202 00:12:26,159 --> 00:12:29,080 out of power. They knew that starting January twentieth that 203 00:12:29,200 --> 00:12:31,159 President Trump was going to come in and that they 204 00:12:31,159 --> 00:12:34,200 would all need to find new jobs. How much of 205 00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:38,679 this funding was pushed to benefit NGOs that many of 206 00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:42,720 these folks are ultimately going to land jobs in So 207 00:12:42,759 --> 00:12:45,120 that's where you're going to see a lot of corruption. 208 00:12:46,919 --> 00:12:48,960 Speaker 1: That is to me, and it goes back to the 209 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:53,159 whole Medicaid issue. When you have the facts of the matter, 210 00:12:53,679 --> 00:12:57,679 you have this reconciliation bill to be able to pay 211 00:12:57,879 --> 00:13:03,720 for tax cuts that American absolutely deserve. They deserve their 212 00:13:03,759 --> 00:13:08,440 money back, particularly after what we've been talking about, and 213 00:13:08,480 --> 00:13:11,799 they have for a long time, and they should well 214 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:15,360 into the future. But you know, the whole position of 215 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:20,000 the left, the Democrat Party, which is screaming over basically, 216 00:13:20,360 --> 00:13:22,519 and please correct me if I'm wrong, what they're screaming 217 00:13:22,600 --> 00:13:27,639 over with this streamlining situation under the Biden administration is 218 00:13:28,159 --> 00:13:33,320 their argument is the twenty year old playing xbox is 219 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:35,480 going to lose his Medicaid? 220 00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:36,279 Speaker 2: Is that? 221 00:13:36,399 --> 00:13:39,000 Speaker 1: I mean, is that really what? That's what the hill 222 00:13:39,039 --> 00:13:40,000 that they're dying on. 223 00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:45,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, and well, the argument they're making is untrue. They're 224 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:47,679 trying to make it seem as if benefits are going 225 00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:51,480 to be taken from the truly needy. Yeah, and which 226 00:13:51,519 --> 00:13:55,000 is inexcusable because it's actually the total opposite. You know, 227 00:13:55,000 --> 00:13:57,440 when you have a program that has a finite amount 228 00:13:57,440 --> 00:14:00,679 of dollars invested in it, if you were the able 229 00:14:00,720 --> 00:14:03,840 bodied people off of that program and encourage them to 230 00:14:03,879 --> 00:14:05,799 go back into the workforce where they can get their 231 00:14:05,799 --> 00:14:09,600 own health insurance that frankly is better quality and more 232 00:14:09,639 --> 00:14:12,200 suited for them individually. But when you get them out 233 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:16,320 of that entitlement program, that frees up resources and dollars 234 00:14:16,399 --> 00:14:19,480 for the truly needy. And so that's the great irony 235 00:14:19,559 --> 00:14:23,639 here is they are actually hurting the very people that 236 00:14:23,639 --> 00:14:26,480 they're claiming they're trying to help. And so, and this 237 00:14:26,519 --> 00:14:28,240 is what I don't need to tell you this too, 238 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:30,960 is when they have the left wing corporate media on 239 00:14:31,039 --> 00:14:34,320 their side as well, they can just re you know, 240 00:14:35,679 --> 00:14:39,240 hit the same false narrative and the same false talking 241 00:14:39,279 --> 00:14:42,360 point over and over and over, and it just convinces 242 00:14:42,399 --> 00:14:44,600 everyday Americans, you know, like most Americans don't know the 243 00:14:44,639 --> 00:14:48,200 difference between Medicare or Medicaid. They just you know, think 244 00:14:48,240 --> 00:14:50,360 about benefits for healthy people. And so if they hear 245 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:54,240 that same talking point all day long from the corporate media, 246 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:56,639 then then they start to believe it. And so that's 247 00:14:56,960 --> 00:14:58,799 that's what the left is gambling on, is they can 248 00:14:58,919 --> 00:15:03,159 use that to sway public opinion. But I don't think 249 00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:03,840 that's going to work. 250 00:15:08,159 --> 00:15:13,120 Speaker 1: Our sponsor today addresses a major concern, identity theft. If 251 00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:17,320 you're worried about keeping your personal information secure. We've got 252 00:15:17,519 --> 00:15:22,080 just the solution, introducing in Cognate, your digital shield that 253 00:15:22,200 --> 00:15:27,600 stands guard against even the most sophisticated online threats. Whenever 254 00:15:27,639 --> 00:15:31,440 you shop online, start a digital subscription, or download an app, 255 00:15:31,879 --> 00:15:34,840 you end up releasing personal information which can be sold 256 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:39,720 or worse yet stolen. 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And I want to 273 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:49,200 talk about that, but that's the word, isn't it entitlement? 274 00:16:49,279 --> 00:16:54,039 And that's entitlement programs you're entitled to this, which first 275 00:16:54,039 --> 00:16:57,840 and foremost is problematic, and it comes it comes as 276 00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:02,440 a loaded word because people who are really deserving, who 277 00:17:02,519 --> 00:17:07,400 have fallen through the cracks. We have the vast majority 278 00:17:07,400 --> 00:17:10,480 of Americans who said, yeah, I can see helping out 279 00:17:10,559 --> 00:17:14,440 for a time, particularly in a transitional period, to help 280 00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:18,880 people get back to where they need to be. What Americans, 281 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:21,319 of course, are sick of is the sense of entitlement 282 00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:24,640 that comes from expanding medicaid to people who truly do 283 00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:27,160 not deserve it, who are able bodied that can go 284 00:17:27,240 --> 00:17:30,559 out and work. And so that ties into that accountability 285 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:34,319 question what you're talking about with the accomplice media over 286 00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:37,799 and over again, they are pushing these narratives in these 287 00:17:37,799 --> 00:17:42,599 stories of the person who's about to lose their health 288 00:17:42,640 --> 00:17:47,279 care under the mean, nasty Trump and Republicans in Congress 289 00:17:48,119 --> 00:17:51,359 couldn't be further from the truth for people who really 290 00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:56,119 need these programs. As you mentioned, but will they ultimately 291 00:17:56,200 --> 00:18:00,960 be successful? Where do things stand on the accountabilit front 292 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:07,680 for not only the liberal politicians, but for their water 293 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:12,039 carriers in the so called mainstream media. 294 00:18:12,160 --> 00:18:15,720 Speaker 2: So I think in recent years really with I mean, 295 00:18:15,759 --> 00:18:18,400 and honestly it's it's Elon Musk keeps coming back to 296 00:18:18,440 --> 00:18:23,319 the forefront. But his purchase of Twitter changed the world 297 00:18:23,359 --> 00:18:25,680 for the left wing media and started to you know, 298 00:18:25,759 --> 00:18:29,480 revolutionize the way people get information. And so I think 299 00:18:29,519 --> 00:18:32,920 the left are still operating off the old playbook that 300 00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:35,160 if the corporate if they can get the corporate media 301 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:38,759 to all sing from the same you know, left wing hyminal, 302 00:18:39,279 --> 00:18:41,880 that they could just kind of pull the wool over 303 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:44,440 the eyes of Americans and kind of do whatever they 304 00:18:44,480 --> 00:18:47,400 want to do. But with social media now with other 305 00:18:47,759 --> 00:18:51,759 you know, the Federalists leading the way on giving you know, 306 00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:55,839 accurate reporting and in depth, you know, investigative reporting that 307 00:18:55,880 --> 00:18:59,720 people couldn't have had access to before. The average American 308 00:18:59,799 --> 00:19:03,279 just you know, has the truth at their fingertips and 309 00:19:03,319 --> 00:19:05,720 ways they didn't. And so I think at the end 310 00:19:05,759 --> 00:19:10,359 of the day, there because you know the other you know, 311 00:19:10,359 --> 00:19:13,519 in a backup too, we're on the side or right 312 00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:16,200 on this so we are on the winning side. This 313 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:20,279 isn't a winning argument for them if all the facts 314 00:19:20,279 --> 00:19:21,880 can get in front of Americans and so I do 315 00:19:21,960 --> 00:19:25,119 I think with the way media has changed, I think 316 00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:27,119 Americans are going to get those facts in front of 317 00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:28,759 them and so, and they're going to be able to 318 00:19:28,839 --> 00:19:32,440 kind of neutralize this effort by the left and minutes 319 00:19:32,519 --> 00:19:34,880 parachize what Republicans are trying to do. 320 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:38,559 Speaker 1: Our guest today is Stuart Whitson, Senior director of Federal 321 00:19:38,599 --> 00:19:42,200 Affairs at the Foundation for Government Accountability. As we talk 322 00:19:42,279 --> 00:19:47,079 about the age of accountability in the federal government at 323 00:19:47,079 --> 00:19:50,559 the very least, you said something very interesting at last 324 00:19:50,599 --> 00:19:55,559 month's House Oversight Committee Subcommittee on Delivering on Government Efficiency. 325 00:19:56,759 --> 00:20:03,519 You said that we need to ensure entrenched partisan bureaucrats 326 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:08,680 don't stand in the way of reform. Personnel is policy. 327 00:20:08,759 --> 00:20:10,880 I thought that was very well put. I think it 328 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:14,200 gets to the heart of the matter of the Trump administration. 329 00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:19,680 The president looking at these entrenched bureaucrats who have forever 330 00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:24,839 stood in the way of good, you know, good governance, 331 00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:33,039 of being respectful of the taxpayers' money. But the courts, 332 00:20:33,880 --> 00:20:38,799 the leftist led courts, are blocking that. Where does this 333 00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:41,480 fight go from here, well. 334 00:20:41,319 --> 00:20:43,599 Speaker 2: I think, you know, and that's kind of predictable. That's 335 00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:45,799 one thing the left has always been good at is 336 00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:48,720 using the courts to try to get in the way 337 00:20:49,119 --> 00:20:52,519 of good policy change. And so this is where, you know, 338 00:20:52,599 --> 00:20:54,640 kind of in my testimony a point I was trying 339 00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:58,200 to really hammer home is, you know, everything that the 340 00:20:58,279 --> 00:21:02,319 president is doing through the dose effort is great. Cutting 341 00:21:02,319 --> 00:21:07,240 wasteful spending, identifying the wasteful spending is great. Removing in 342 00:21:07,319 --> 00:21:09,440 trench bureaucrats that will get in the way of this 343 00:21:09,559 --> 00:21:12,920 change is great. But the problem is anything the president 344 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:17,880 does through executive action can be undone by executive action 345 00:21:18,039 --> 00:21:21,039 by a future intration. Yeah, the courts can get in 346 00:21:21,079 --> 00:21:23,599 the way. They can you know, they can slow roll 347 00:21:23,880 --> 00:21:26,160 things that I think is are inevitable. So I think 348 00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:30,599 a lot of these legal challenges eventually the Trump administration 349 00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:32,559 is going to be able to win. But the left, nos, 350 00:21:32,599 --> 00:21:34,759 it's kind of a long game. They can drag this 351 00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:37,720 out long enough and get past you know, that first 352 00:21:37,759 --> 00:21:40,720 one hundred days, which are crucial for any administration, that 353 00:21:40,759 --> 00:21:43,119 they can you know, prevent a lot of good things 354 00:21:43,359 --> 00:21:46,079 from happening. And so I think so my point I 355 00:21:46,119 --> 00:21:48,240 was hammering, hon, is this is where Congress needs to 356 00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:51,160 come in and try to codify some of these things. 357 00:21:51,319 --> 00:21:53,920 You know, give the president some power to be able 358 00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:56,759 to do things that I think everyday Americans would agree to. 359 00:21:57,240 --> 00:21:59,920 You know, the president should be able to fire unproductive 360 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:06,440 or in subordinate employees. Federal employees shouldn't have more protection 361 00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:10,640 than employees in private sector or employees and other you know, 362 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:13,839 even in Congress, people that work for members of Congress 363 00:22:13,839 --> 00:22:17,240 are at will. They can be fired if they're insubordinate 364 00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:20,279 or if they don't show up to work. So what 365 00:22:20,319 --> 00:22:23,000 we've kind of over time this you know, federal workers 366 00:22:23,039 --> 00:22:27,240 have been given this special protection that what it does 367 00:22:27,319 --> 00:22:30,640 is it allows them to entrench themselves and become resistant. 368 00:22:31,079 --> 00:22:33,240 And one of the things too, I kind of mentioned 369 00:22:33,279 --> 00:22:38,759 in my testimony as well, is the federal workforce is 370 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:44,559 so disproportionately part of one political party, the Democrat Party, 371 00:22:44,599 --> 00:22:47,400 that when they try to entrench, when you put these 372 00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:50,480 kind of protections on them, That's why it causes so 373 00:22:50,559 --> 00:22:53,920 much problems for Republicans is they're coming in, you know, 374 00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:58,240 to a new administration and it's literally populated with people 375 00:22:59,039 --> 00:23:01,799 all of the opposite part. So it's just extremely difficult 376 00:23:01,839 --> 00:23:02,839 to get anything done. 377 00:23:03,799 --> 00:23:08,160 Speaker 1: I think a lot of Americans, this American included, want 378 00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:13,400 to know why. I'm talking to you from the Des Moines, 379 00:23:13,519 --> 00:23:17,039 Iowa area, and this state has seen a lot of 380 00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:20,680 job cuts in recent months at one of its keystone 381 00:23:21,039 --> 00:23:26,880 manufacturing employers. That's a deer in company, hundreds of jobs lost. 382 00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:33,720 You know, families' lives disrupted. Where were the Democrat politicians 383 00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:37,920 with their signs and their protests and their weeping and 384 00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:42,160 their gnashing of teeth over those private sector jobs? Why 385 00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:46,519 is it just the all of this show for these 386 00:23:47,039 --> 00:23:54,519 federal employees who have enjoyed really an insulated safety of 387 00:23:54,599 --> 00:23:56,720 employment for such a long time. 388 00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:01,440 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, the simple answers, it's because it's their base, 389 00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:04,039 you know, a lot of these voters. By one of 390 00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:06,640 my colleagues, Hayden de Bloyce, did a study that we 391 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:11,079 published recently that showed kind of what is the political 392 00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:15,359 makeup of federal employees and real quick before I mentioned that, 393 00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:18,000 so you know, here's a fact. Eighty four percent of 394 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:22,079 political donations from federal employees went to Kamala Harrison twenty 395 00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:26,440 twenty four. And so that's not surprising to people. You know, 396 00:24:26,440 --> 00:24:29,640 they know that. But what's interesting his study found he 397 00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:32,359 looked at federal executive branch employees and just said, what 398 00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:35,640 is their actual political makeup? And he found that they 399 00:24:35,839 --> 00:24:40,319 Democrats have a thirty point advantage over Republicans in terms 400 00:24:40,519 --> 00:24:44,240 of identification. But what's crazy is if you go to 401 00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:48,359 the DC area, it rises from thirty point average advantage 402 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:53,039 to forty And if you shift focused to just the 403 00:24:53,039 --> 00:24:59,799 welfare agencies, it rises to nearly sixty six zero six 404 00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:03,400 percentage point favor to Dems. And so that's why when 405 00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:06,200 you see so these groups, these welfare agencies, if they're 406 00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:09,880 getting you know, mass firings, that is all that is 407 00:25:09,920 --> 00:25:12,359 their base, and so that's why they're coming to their defense. 408 00:25:14,519 --> 00:25:17,599 But look, you're right on to you know, this is 409 00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:20,680 something that private industry faces all the time, you know, 410 00:25:20,839 --> 00:25:25,640 routinely to run an efficient, you know, organization, you have 411 00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:28,319 to come in and kind of look and say, you know, 412 00:25:28,519 --> 00:25:32,039 do we still need these functions we needed before? Is 413 00:25:32,079 --> 00:25:35,720 there any redundancy within the company? Are there you know, 414 00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:39,680 two different departments that are essentially doing the same job 415 00:25:40,279 --> 00:25:43,319 as one another, Should we you know, combine those together? 416 00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:46,880 And so all these kind of things that everyday Americans understand. 417 00:25:47,079 --> 00:25:49,480 Of course, this is what you have to do, you know, 418 00:25:49,559 --> 00:25:53,559 to keep a business competitive. On the federal government side, 419 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:56,480 they don't worry about this. And the reason they don't 420 00:25:56,519 --> 00:26:00,200 worry about this is is there's an efficiency or you know, 421 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:03,160 if they're they have a mission they were supposed accomplish 422 00:26:03,200 --> 00:26:06,160 and they failed to accomplish it. Their solution is always 423 00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:10,480 the same, more money, right, more resources, give them more employees. 424 00:26:10,799 --> 00:26:12,680 And so what happens is over time, so they're not 425 00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:15,519 they don't have the market forces, you know, pushing on 426 00:26:15,559 --> 00:26:17,680 the government. And so what does that mean. It means 427 00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:21,880 over time, it naturally grows and expands. And I saw this. 428 00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:24,960 I spent a decade in the FBI before I joined 429 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,880 the Foundation for Government Accountability, and you could see like 430 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:29,799 even I you know, and for the most part, the 431 00:26:29,839 --> 00:26:33,559 FBI was a you know, pretty efficient and well run organization. 432 00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:38,200 But the sprawl and growth, I mean you could see 433 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:41,039 it yourself. Like even buildings that were in the DC 434 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:44,119 area that you know, so they're in the same area, 435 00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,599 but they're separate buildings, you would see the same missions 436 00:26:47,799 --> 00:26:51,400 start to pop up in those two separate buildings, and 437 00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:54,400 so and That's just one example, but that's going on 438 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:56,920 across the government. And so that's what's so great about 439 00:26:56,920 --> 00:26:59,680 the Doze effort about what the president's doing, is he 440 00:26:59,759 --> 00:27:02,880 really is, you know, we've been on a reckless spending 441 00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:05,920 spree for the last four years, and so if we're 442 00:27:05,960 --> 00:27:08,160 going to get control of our government and our budget, 443 00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:10,279 we have to come in and look at all this 444 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:13,000 stuff and try to fix it. And so and I 445 00:27:13,000 --> 00:27:17,559 think because of the entrenched bureaucracy, in a sense, the 446 00:27:17,559 --> 00:27:20,720 president's hand is kind of forced to do these more 447 00:27:20,839 --> 00:27:25,440 aggressive you know, removal of federal employees in areas. Then 448 00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:27,839 you might you know that as you you know, some 449 00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:31,079 people characterize it as more of a hatchet versus a scalpel. 450 00:27:31,759 --> 00:27:33,680 It's I think the president in a sense is kind 451 00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:35,880 of forced to go with that route because of the 452 00:27:36,039 --> 00:27:37,480 entrenched bureaucrats. 453 00:27:38,279 --> 00:27:40,079 Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't doubt that at all. And you raise 454 00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:42,839 a good point with all of the sprawl, with the 455 00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:47,680 have never ending growth of the federal government in one 456 00:27:47,759 --> 00:27:55,119 particular area of the country. This is a big country. Uh, yes, 457 00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:58,599 we know. And the question is do we need to 458 00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:04,240 continue to have a all of these agencies, these many 459 00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:08,240 unaccountable agencies and do they need to operate in one 460 00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:13,519 centralized location and with that, ultimately, is that good governance 461 00:28:13,839 --> 00:28:16,440 to have them all in one centralized location. 462 00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:20,519 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think it's not. And I think especially 463 00:28:20,559 --> 00:28:25,000 when that one centralized location is so predominantly part of 464 00:28:25,079 --> 00:28:28,519 one political party, Because what happens is if you put 465 00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:32,319 these agencies in the heart of an area like DC, 466 00:28:33,119 --> 00:28:36,720 then all the support employees, the employees that actually run 467 00:28:36,759 --> 00:28:41,039 that the headquarters building, if you will, they're all drawn 468 00:28:41,079 --> 00:28:42,920 from the local population because they have to be able 469 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:45,519 to commute to the building. What you do is you 470 00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:50,559 populate that entire agency, you know, the permanent folks, with 471 00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:53,960 people of just one political party, and then that the 472 00:28:54,039 --> 00:28:56,720 leadership is kind of coming in and out, like most 473 00:28:56,759 --> 00:28:59,359 of the leadership in an organization like the fbii're on, 474 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:01,640 they call them t whys, and so they're kind of 475 00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:03,599 coming into headquarters for a little bit and moving to 476 00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:06,559 another assignment. And so you create this kind of permanent 477 00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:10,359 culture within the headquarters element that leans very far to 478 00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:13,039 one political party. So it just makes sense to kind 479 00:29:13,039 --> 00:29:15,640 of push those out. And again, the great advantage if 480 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:19,000 you do something like this, you know, the drain the 481 00:29:19,039 --> 00:29:22,759 swamp type movement where you're moving all these headquarters elements out. 482 00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:26,160 It also gives you this moment to pause and say, 483 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:29,000 do we need this group? You know, this unit we're 484 00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:32,519 about to move to Huntsville, Alabama? Should we move them? 485 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:35,400 Do we already have someone else doing that job somewhere? 486 00:29:35,759 --> 00:29:39,200 Is this function even needed anymore? And that's not an 487 00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:41,920 indictment on the people, you know, all the You know, 488 00:29:42,079 --> 00:29:44,839 certainly some of the people need to be removed quickly, 489 00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:47,400 but there may be solid people that are in a 490 00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:50,799 department that just isn't needed. And so what do you do. 491 00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:53,400 You get rid of that department and you find a 492 00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:56,200 home for those good people. You put a hiring freeze, 493 00:29:56,519 --> 00:29:58,920 you don't hire any new people, and you find the 494 00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:02,200 good people another spot they can land so they can 495 00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:05,319 do great work. You know, The solution isn't to just 496 00:30:05,440 --> 00:30:08,599 keep that unit going that's serving no purpose, that's not 497 00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:11,400 good for the country or good for the people. And 498 00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:14,640 then the other thing is an area like DC is 499 00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:18,279 what it's expensive? Right? Yeah, it costs a lot of 500 00:30:18,359 --> 00:30:22,440 money to put a building and to have people traveling 501 00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:25,000 in and out of DC. Why not put it, you know, 502 00:30:25,079 --> 00:30:27,680 somewhere else where. The cost of living is a little 503 00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:30,240 lower and where it's you know, just more efficient for 504 00:30:30,279 --> 00:30:36,839 the government. So Elon Musk and Doge need help. 505 00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 3: The Watchdot on Wall Street podcast with Chris Markowski. Every 506 00:30:40,039 --> 00:30:42,759 day Chris helps unpack the connection between politics and the 507 00:30:42,799 --> 00:30:45,359 economy and how it affects your wallet. Doge is only 508 00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:49,200 highlighting the spending problems, but Congress controls the per strings. 509 00:30:49,319 --> 00:30:52,720 Congress needs to follow through and step up to control 510 00:30:52,839 --> 00:30:55,519 this spending or we'll be back where we started. Whether 511 00:30:55,519 --> 00:30:57,480 it's happening in DC or down on Wall Street, it's 512 00:30:57,480 --> 00:30:58,559 affecting you financially. 513 00:30:58,640 --> 00:30:59,160 Speaker 1: Be informed. 514 00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:01,039 Speaker 3: Check out the watch Dog on Wall Street podcast with 515 00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:04,400 Christomercwski on Apple, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. 516 00:31:07,319 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 1: Well to the politics of it, it's effective. The electoral map. 517 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:16,079 Look at Virginia. Virginia is you know, a somewhat a 518 00:31:16,119 --> 00:31:19,519 battleground statement. It's been taken over by the left in 519 00:31:19,599 --> 00:31:25,279 so many ways because all of those liberal Democrat positions 520 00:31:25,279 --> 00:31:30,119 in the federal government. Maryland is the same way. You know, 521 00:31:30,319 --> 00:31:32,920 it could be certainly a much more competitive state in 522 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:37,440 the electoral map. But you know, it's amazing how much 523 00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:41,160 politics has played into this. Power has played into this, 524 00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:46,200 and that is why we have seen so much resistance 525 00:31:46,359 --> 00:31:51,359 to change. Ultimately, this should all be done for the 526 00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:57,599 best interest of the people of this country, and unfortunately 527 00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:02,240 a lot of the growth and development in government, expansion 528 00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:06,240 in government has been done for the sake of political power. 529 00:32:06,799 --> 00:32:10,759 Speaking of which I know that the Foundation for Government 530 00:32:10,759 --> 00:32:15,480 Accountability has done some excellent work, particularly on the legal front, 531 00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:20,319 on the whole notion of Biden Bucks Executive Order fourteen 532 00:32:20,519 --> 00:32:24,640 zero one nine, as it is officially known under former 533 00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:29,039 President Joe Biden. This was, as you have noted, as 534 00:32:29,119 --> 00:32:33,279 you have found through some very arduous work on this 535 00:32:33,359 --> 00:32:37,519 front legal work, that this was nothing more. It was 536 00:32:37,599 --> 00:32:43,119 billed as expanding access to voting. Sounds all nice and 537 00:32:43,799 --> 00:32:47,119 democracy base, but really what it was was a massive 538 00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:49,640 get out the vote machine for the left and the 539 00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:58,079 Democrat Party. The President rightly immediately rescinded that executive order 540 00:32:58,279 --> 00:33:02,559 because of the many problems it faced constitutionally for one thing, 541 00:33:03,279 --> 00:33:08,200 to federalize get out the vote efforts. But how much 542 00:33:08,359 --> 00:33:12,559 of the DOGE efforts do you think will come through 543 00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:17,480 in looking at the sweetheart deals for all of these 544 00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:19,720 NGOs under Biden Bucks. 545 00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:24,279 Speaker 2: I think that'll definitely come into play. And I think 546 00:33:24,559 --> 00:33:27,279 the other thing I would say too, so the organization 547 00:33:27,319 --> 00:33:30,119 I work for, the Foundation for Government Accountability, we actually 548 00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:33,240 sued the Department of Justice, as you know, because I 549 00:33:33,279 --> 00:33:35,720 know you've you've reported a lot on the on the 550 00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:38,880 Biden Bucks and on the our lawsuit as well and others. 551 00:33:39,519 --> 00:33:41,839 H but we sued the Department of Justice to get 552 00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:44,359 to the bottom of what you know, they were doing 553 00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:48,119 and other organizations were doing to help carry out that EO. 554 00:33:49,079 --> 00:33:53,400 Our lawsuit is still moving forward, and so obviously we're confident, 555 00:33:53,559 --> 00:33:57,039 you know, with the new administration that's devoted to transparency, 556 00:33:57,640 --> 00:33:59,359 that we're going to be able to help get some 557 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:02,440 of the answer we'd sought from what the Biden administration 558 00:34:02,599 --> 00:34:05,200 was doing behind closed doors to help carry out this 559 00:34:05,319 --> 00:34:09,039 unconstitutional and illegal order. That we're going to be able 560 00:34:09,159 --> 00:34:12,679 to get some of that information and help promote transparency 561 00:34:12,679 --> 00:34:17,559 around that. As you rightfully noted, President Trump on day 562 00:34:17,639 --> 00:34:22,760 one rescinded that EO, which is pretty amazing and I 563 00:34:23,199 --> 00:34:26,400 love it because you know, the left always accuses the 564 00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:30,320 right of doing what they do U and so literally 565 00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:34,400 one of his first acts was to get the federal 566 00:34:34,400 --> 00:34:38,679 Executive Branch out of the business of elections, which he 567 00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:40,840 totally He could have just used that same program that 568 00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:43,159 Biden tried to use to try to keep himself in power. 569 00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:45,480 And what did President Trump do. No, on day one, 570 00:34:45,519 --> 00:34:48,400 he literally he rescinded that and called it out for 571 00:34:48,519 --> 00:34:49,000 what it was. 572 00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:52,280 Speaker 1: That's that's a stewart. That's a very important point that 573 00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:55,239 I think is lost. And you know, I've I've written 574 00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:57,760 on that, and I think I didn't hammer that point 575 00:34:57,800 --> 00:35:02,920 home enough. The President could continue this and use this 576 00:35:04,159 --> 00:35:08,639 at least constitutionally suspect executive order for the benefit of 577 00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:13,039 himself and for his fellow Republicans, but he said no, 578 00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:21,039 this was an absolutely unconstitutional order and it definitely benefited 579 00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:24,719 one political party and that's not what the federal government 580 00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:26,000 should be in the business of doing. 581 00:35:27,119 --> 00:35:29,840 Speaker 2: That's absolutely right, and so the good and so that's 582 00:35:30,039 --> 00:35:32,280 the big point it too, is I feel like that 583 00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:37,000 threat has been neutralized, at least temporarily. But the key 584 00:35:37,079 --> 00:35:41,559 now is accountability. And so if there are employees still 585 00:35:41,599 --> 00:35:45,199 within federal agencies, you know, burrowed in who are trying 586 00:35:45,239 --> 00:35:47,559 to help carry that out, I think it's important to 587 00:35:47,639 --> 00:35:50,320 identify those folks and make sure the new leadership that 588 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:53,039 has come in knows you know, who those folks are 589 00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:57,840 and and you know removes them, you know, through proper 590 00:35:58,119 --> 00:36:02,000 means from the from the agencies. But also just to 591 00:36:02,079 --> 00:36:04,880 let future administrations know too that if you do this 592 00:36:05,039 --> 00:36:08,199 kind of stuff, if you just ignore the Constitution and 593 00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:11,519 you try to do something as unprecedented as the buyind 594 00:36:11,559 --> 00:36:14,760 Bucks executive order was, that there's going to be accountability. 595 00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:17,280 So that's so we're trying to continue to do that 596 00:36:18,039 --> 00:36:20,679 and we'll definitely keep you posted on any new developments 597 00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:21,199 on that front. 598 00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:25,519 Speaker 1: That's great because that has been so vital to you know, 599 00:36:25,639 --> 00:36:28,480 waking up the American people to the political operation that 600 00:36:28,599 --> 00:36:31,639 was entrench that the taxpayers are paying for. They shouldn't 601 00:36:31,679 --> 00:36:34,119 have to pay for this stuff. It was the same 602 00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:39,920 argument with Zuckbucks, of course twenty twenty. It's just it's 603 00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:43,360 more massive, certainly with federal tax payer dollars. These were 604 00:36:43,599 --> 00:36:50,239 leftist groups, again, like in Zuckbucks, entrenched in government offices, 605 00:36:50,519 --> 00:36:57,400 pushing voter registration mobilization to targeted liberal audiences. If that 606 00:36:57,679 --> 00:37:03,760 isn't a prop an election integrity problem, I don't know 607 00:37:04,079 --> 00:37:06,599 what is. We just have a few minutes left and 608 00:37:06,679 --> 00:37:09,679 you you brought up the fact before that before you 609 00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:16,159 joined the Foundation, you were you served in the FBI 610 00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:21,360 as a supervisory special agent leading a large section in 611 00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:24,840 the FBI's Directorate of Intelligence. I wanted to get your 612 00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:27,199 take as you've observed it. What do you think about 613 00:37:27,199 --> 00:37:30,440 the changes coming to the FBI with a new director, 614 00:37:30,519 --> 00:37:37,119 Cash Pattel, and what the FBI is attempting to do 615 00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:41,840 in terms of reforming an agency that has quite frankly, 616 00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:44,559 gotten quite a black eye over the last several years. 617 00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:49,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, I know, there's no question that the FBI has broken. 618 00:37:50,679 --> 00:37:54,480 And it's not just you know, leadership changes that needed 619 00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:57,920 to be made or structural changes or other things like that, 620 00:37:58,320 --> 00:38:01,599 but it's also a loss of trucks. And so that 621 00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:05,320 is what's you know, as a former FBI agent that 622 00:38:05,440 --> 00:38:07,480 was kind of most you know, painful to hear is 623 00:38:08,039 --> 00:38:11,199 the amount of trust that Americans have lost in the 624 00:38:11,199 --> 00:38:14,559 Federal Bureau of Investigation. And so and I'm so, you know, 625 00:38:14,639 --> 00:38:18,760 obviously we need you know, an ordination of laws. You know, 626 00:38:18,800 --> 00:38:21,639 we need you know, ordered liberty. We can't have one 627 00:38:21,679 --> 00:38:24,320 without the other. And so it's just so important to 628 00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:27,639 have a federal law enforcement agency that that is not 629 00:38:27,679 --> 00:38:30,440 only world class and great at what it does the 630 00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:34,199 way the FBI is, but equally important, it has to 631 00:38:34,239 --> 00:38:37,360 be one that's trusted by the American people. And so 632 00:38:37,559 --> 00:38:40,480 I think the selection of Cash Betel as an next 633 00:38:40,519 --> 00:38:44,079 director was like, I can't think of a better choice, 634 00:38:44,679 --> 00:38:48,119 because I think he brings this wealth of past experience, 635 00:38:48,199 --> 00:38:50,320 not just as a prosecutor, not just you know, on 636 00:38:50,360 --> 00:38:54,239 the national security side with Department of Defense, UH and 637 00:38:54,599 --> 00:38:58,519 ODE and I and other agencies, but also as a 638 00:38:58,559 --> 00:39:02,079 former defense attorney. So I feel like that's a unique 639 00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:05,920 background to come in and kind of understand, you know, 640 00:39:06,559 --> 00:39:10,079 maybe better than a lot of others, you know, the 641 00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:14,440 danger of when you know federal agents at times, you know, 642 00:39:14,519 --> 00:39:18,159 can go beyond their power when the government can. I 643 00:39:18,159 --> 00:39:21,039 also think he's someone that the president trusts. I think 644 00:39:21,079 --> 00:39:23,920 that's important. But I do think he's someone that the 645 00:39:23,960 --> 00:39:27,719 American people like the most, especially the folks you know 646 00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:30,760 on the conservative side, will really trust that if he 647 00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:34,880 comes back and says, I looked into something, there's nothing here, 648 00:39:35,199 --> 00:39:38,000 you know, this is fine, They're going to believe him 649 00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:40,039 when he says that, because they're going to also see 650 00:39:40,119 --> 00:39:45,480 him do things that you know, the UH that the 651 00:39:45,559 --> 00:39:47,679 typical type of person you would see appointed to this 652 00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:50,400 position wouldn't be willing to do. And so the truth 653 00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:52,280 of the matter is like, you've got to do a 654 00:39:52,320 --> 00:39:55,159 lot of things to fix the FBI, but to earn 655 00:39:55,199 --> 00:39:57,440 them that, to re earn the trust of the American people, 656 00:39:57,559 --> 00:39:59,599 you have to do even more. And so that's going 657 00:39:59,639 --> 00:40:03,440 to require sweeping structural changes, sweeping changes to the leadership. 658 00:40:04,639 --> 00:40:06,800 And I feel like he's he's I can't think of 659 00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:07,840 someone better to do it. 660 00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:13,000 Speaker 1: So what about those those Epstein Finals they coming out? 661 00:40:13,480 --> 00:40:16,679 Speaker 2: Oh, I'm sure, I without a doubt. I think anything 662 00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:20,119 that can be released will be released. But that's a 663 00:40:20,159 --> 00:40:22,519 good example too. There may be some things in there 664 00:40:22,559 --> 00:40:26,880 where if it's gonna reveal the identity of a victim, 665 00:40:27,079 --> 00:40:29,679 for instance, I think Cash Pattel is going to be 666 00:40:29,679 --> 00:40:31,519 the type of person that's going to make sure that 667 00:40:31,559 --> 00:40:34,400 doesn't happen, and so you're not going to see so. 668 00:40:34,639 --> 00:40:38,400 But but anything that can be released will uh. And 669 00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:40,800 then and I should say to you know, that decision 670 00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:44,039 will ultimately fall in the Attorney General what gets released. 671 00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:47,400 So I'm sure she's driving that, but saying, you know, 672 00:40:47,440 --> 00:40:50,400 I would sing her praises the same way i'd sing, 673 00:40:51,039 --> 00:40:53,880 uh the new director Patel's praises. So I think I 674 00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:55,280 think the FBI is going to be in good hands, 675 00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:56,559 but it's not gonna He's not gonna be able to 676 00:40:56,599 --> 00:40:59,559 write the ship overnight. And I and I think he, 677 00:40:59,639 --> 00:41:02,360 maybe more than anyone else, is going to face the 678 00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:06,559 same kind of challenge from the entrenched bureaucrats that could resist. 679 00:41:07,199 --> 00:41:09,880 And so that's not to say so ninety nine percent 680 00:41:10,039 --> 00:41:13,159 of the agents and support staff and analysts that work 681 00:41:13,159 --> 00:41:16,000 there are great, amazing people, But all it takes is 682 00:41:16,039 --> 00:41:18,920 that one percent, you know, to get in the way 683 00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:23,440 to slow roll. I mean, you saw the blatant active insubordination, 684 00:41:23,760 --> 00:41:27,480 and then you know in the newspapers with the gentleman 685 00:41:27,559 --> 00:41:30,400 in New York saying it's time to dig in. You 686 00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:33,280 know that kind of in subordination. It's it's easier to 687 00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:35,280 get rid of because you see it right away. But 688 00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:37,199 the other is, you know, he's going to give an 689 00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:40,599 order and try to do a change, and there's going 690 00:41:40,639 --> 00:41:44,159 to be entrenched folks that think they're doing what's best 691 00:41:44,199 --> 00:41:46,519 for the for the agency who are going to just 692 00:41:46,599 --> 00:41:49,360 resist his order. And so I think over time he's 693 00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:51,519 going to figure out who those people are and replace 694 00:41:51,559 --> 00:41:54,280 them with people that will get the job done. But 695 00:41:55,119 --> 00:41:56,480 it's going to be It's not going to be an 696 00:41:56,480 --> 00:41:58,480 easy task to do, but I think he's up for it. 697 00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:00,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, you've really answered this quest question. I just wanted 698 00:42:00,960 --> 00:42:03,519 to expound upon it just a little bit more. It's 699 00:42:03,519 --> 00:42:08,280 a big agency and there are a lot of really 700 00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:12,119 good and talented men and women still working in that agency. 701 00:42:12,239 --> 00:42:14,519 But it doesn't take much to corrupt an agency. So 702 00:42:14,559 --> 00:42:16,920 the question is how many more Peters Strucks are there 703 00:42:17,480 --> 00:42:19,280 in the FBI. I know you haven't been there in 704 00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:25,800 a while, but is this something that runs deep in 705 00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:26,440 the FBI? 706 00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:29,639 Speaker 2: Yeah, I wouldn't say, but this kind of goes back 707 00:42:29,679 --> 00:42:32,239 to a point we were talking about earlier. This is 708 00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:35,920 the danger with putting headquarters in d C. I think 709 00:42:36,039 --> 00:42:38,039 DC is the kind of place that in I don't think. 710 00:42:38,320 --> 00:42:40,159 I don't know Peter's stock at all, so I don't 711 00:42:40,159 --> 00:42:42,440 know what he was ever like, I never met him, 712 00:42:43,159 --> 00:42:45,119 but I feel and so I don't think he falls 713 00:42:45,119 --> 00:42:47,840 into this category. But other people could be good solid 714 00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:50,599 agents and good solid people and could come to DC 715 00:42:51,320 --> 00:42:53,280 and just be kind of ruined by that environment. 716 00:42:54,039 --> 00:42:56,840 Speaker 1: Most are not many politicians are, that's for sure. 717 00:42:57,079 --> 00:42:59,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, but I think you come out here and I 718 00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:01,760 think well intentioned people could be looking for their next 719 00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:05,760 job or their next thing, and so again, and yet 720 00:43:05,800 --> 00:43:09,480 another reason to just move that out of DC where 721 00:43:09,480 --> 00:43:12,599 you can. You still would need some headquarters people there 722 00:43:12,639 --> 00:43:14,559 so they can be accountable to the President, and be 723 00:43:14,559 --> 00:43:18,519 accountable to the Attorney General, be accountable to Congress. So 724 00:43:18,599 --> 00:43:21,320 you would need people there to be able to do that, 725 00:43:21,440 --> 00:43:24,280 But most of the support functions and all that, there's 726 00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:25,960 just no reason for them to be in DC. 727 00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:31,719 Speaker 1: Accountability is here, More accountability is coming. That's the promise, 728 00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:36,519 and we've seen the Trump administration the President deliver on that. 729 00:43:37,039 --> 00:43:40,559 And I'm very interested, as a lot of Americans are, 730 00:43:40,599 --> 00:43:43,639 and seeing where all of this goes. Thanks to my 731 00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:48,000 guest today, Stuart Witson, Director Senior Director of Federal Affairs 732 00:43:48,119 --> 00:43:51,320 at the Foundation for Government Accountability, Sir, thank you so 733 00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:53,840 much for joining us, Thanks so much for having me. 734 00:43:53,840 --> 00:43:57,000 You've been listening to another edition of the Federalist Radio Hour. 735 00:43:57,360 --> 00:44:00,519 I'm Matt Kittle, senior elections correspondent at the Better List. 736 00:44:00,599 --> 00:44:03,880 We'll be back soon with more. Until then, stay lovers 737 00:44:03,880 --> 00:44:06,880 of freedom and anxious for the fray,