Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to get right
back to the Michael Thomas interview with the OIG investigators.
Question are you aware of any issues with the camera
system in the shoe on August tenth, twenty nineteen. Thomas,
no question. No. Did you know if any of them
weren't recording? Thomas? I don't know. Question No. And you
never spoke with anybody about the camera system Thomas, No question.
Did someone live monitor you all when you're in the shoe? Thomas?
I don't know. Question you don't know. Do you know
if someone is live monitoring the range of these tears? Thomas,
I don't know. Question you're not sure? Thomas, I'm not sure.
I don't think so. Question do you know how like
camera systems are set up, what they're appointing at, and
what they're supposed to be covering? Thomas? I don't. Because
some of the tears have cameras. I mean some of
the cells have cameras. I don't know. Question when you
say some have cameras, Thomas, I couldn't tell you. Question
would that be just like ten South and then ten
South lower are the ones that have cameras? Thomas, No,
because some of the other tiers, some of the other
cells have cameras inside redacted question. Some of the other
cells do have cameras in them? Thomas, yes. Question, aside
from ten South and ten South Lower Thomas, yes. Question. Okay,
what's the purpose of that? Thomas, I don't know. Just
when I came here, they had cameras. Question. Okay, so
not outside of their cells, but in their cells Thomas,
inside of the cell yes question. Was there a camera
inside of Epstein's cell Thomas. I don't know if his
tier particularly have cameras, but I do know some of
the tiers actually do have besides ten South lower G tier.
If I'm not mistaken, it's either G or H, but
I think it's G. Yeah, G besides G and ten South. Yeah,
some of the other cells do have cameras in them. Question. Okay,
anything that you know that would capture the inside of
Epstein's cell area Thomas, No, not inside his cell question No, Thomas,
if he doesn't have a camera inside his cell. Question Okay,
I'm going to move on to the next section. This
is about sleeping. Do you recall sleeping in the shoe
on August tenth, twenty nineteen, between the hours of twelve
am and approximately six thirty three am. Thomas, I recall
dozing off from here and there? Yes, I do. Question.
Do you recall how long you were asleep? Thomas? No,
I don't question. Do you recall if Noel also slept
on her shift? Thomas? I don't. No, I don't question.
So you don't know how long she was asleep for Thomas,
I don't know. Question. Okay, were you and Noel seated
next to each other on August tenth, twenty nineteen, Thomas,
If you're saying seated like how me and he gets
cut off? No, we're not seated like that. Question. How
far away were you? Thomas? Maybe a foot two feet apart.
I mean it's not too far. But we're just sitting
like right adjacent and next to each other. It's like
how it is it's like an L shape. Question Okay,
But I mean you're sitting with one another Thomas. Yeah. Question,
you're not like touching, but you're sitting with one another
in the same area, but like one person is facing
one way and another person is facing another way. Question Okay,
And you don't recall seeing Noel actually sleeping. Thomas, No,
I don't recall her sleeping. Question And you did those off?
You did sleep, but you don't remember about how long Thomas,
I do not. Question was it about two hours? Does
that sound about right? Thomas? I really couldn't tell you.
Question Okay. Do you know if you were both asleep
at the same time? Thomas, I don't know. Question. Did
you discuss like, hey, I'm going to sleep st Thomas, No,
we did not. Question No, okay, no discussions were had.
Are you authorized to sleep during your shift in the shoe? Thomas, No,
you're not. Question Okay. Is that policy that you're not
allowed to sleep? Like, how do you know that you're
not authorized to sleep? Thomas, You're just not allowed to
sleep at work. I don't know if it's policy or not.
Question okay. And you knew at the time obviously, Thomas, yeah,
question okay. And just to go back, you know at
the time you had you knew that you were falsifying
those records at the time of the rounds counts and
those count slips on August ninth, when you were actually
certifying that you knew that you're incorrectly certifying them Thomas
the count slip. Question, Yeah, Thomas, yes. Question. Okay, have
you ever fallen asleep previously while on duty at the
MCC Thomas, I probably have. Question yeah Thomas, yeah. Question
is that kind of like understood if you work that
shift that you kind of can doze off? Thomas, no answer,
no question. Is it a lot less active during the
hours of twelve am? Thomas? I mean, of course everybody's
asleep at that time. All inmates are asleep at that time,
but it's a lot nobody is no interaction or anything
like that. So, I mean sometimes you get bored and
you know, I mean, you can sleep through that. You
just nod a little bit. It's happened with me a
few times. But I mean I do get up from
time to time and try to drink and definitely got
a case of red Bull on hand from now on.
Question Okay, what about Noel? Have you worked with her
in the past? Thomas, I don't remember. Maybe I have.
I don't know exactly. I've been here fourteen years. Question,
so do you recall her sleeping in the past? Thomas, No,
I don't. Question what about other people that you work with?
Do you recall other people that would also sleep Thomas, No,
I can't recall it if they were sleeping or not redacted.
Question you are just taking ownership for yourself. You know
you fell asleep, but he gets cut off by Thomas.
That's it. Question Okay? Did Noel ever tried to wake
you up when you were sleeping? Thomas? I don't recall
question No Thomas, No, I don't think so. Question did
anyone report that you know of? Did anyone contact you
to try to wake you up? If people were watching
you on the cameras, did anybody say hey, wake up?
Or did Noel ever say hey, you've got to wake up? Thomas?
No question. No. Where is the CEO required to be
during their shift in the shoe? Is it just all
over the area Thomas? Yeah, question just walking around just
within the shoe Thomas, it's just with just guess in
the shoe, well some other you're required to be inside
the shoe. Question is there always two people required to
be in the shoe at all times? Can there ever
be one person left alone in the shoe? Thomas, I've
seen when it's been one person. If I'm not mistaken,
it's required for us to be I think a minimum
of two question. Okay, so if you need to actually
leave the shoe during that shift when there's only two
people there, what do you do if two people are
supposed to be there, do you have to call and
see if someone else can come and replace you? Question?
If you're talking about like for emergencies, maybe of course
somebody has to replace you. And maybe that could be
just shorthanded and you just left alone. But I know
sometimes we used to have to count next door. We
used to go count nine the ninth floor, so it
just varies. Question. Okay, so do you have like a
certain amount of time that you're allowed to leave one
person alone, Like, for instance, if you've got to go
and get help with the count, are you allowed to say, hey,
I'll be right back, and you get like a ten
minute window or anything like that. How does that work? Thomas?
I don't know if it's a particular number or anything
like that, but if you're going to go count eight,
or if you're going to count ten and then you're
going to count nine, that's no particular time question. Okay, Thomas,
you know what I mean. People walk different and I
probably walk faster than say mister Redaktid or yourself where
some people might be walking fast. As far as I know,
there's no particular set time. Question. So you already said
you didn't leave the shoe on August tenth. Did you
know if Noel left the shoe at all on August tenth? Thomas,
I don't recall. I don't remember. I don't remember. Question.
You just know that you were there the whole time, Thomas.
If I didn't count ten, I don't know if I
counted ten or not. I don't remember if I counted
ten or not. Question. Now, if you count ten, is
that considered leaving the shoe, because isn't that count part
of the shoe? Thomas, I've seen. That's a different number,
it's a different floor. You're not inside the shoe, you're
inside ten South, which which is a totally different place. Question. Okay,
but you don't have to go through like control and
all those door locks. That's all kind of within the
general shoe area, Thomas. Control has to pop the door. Question. Oh,
they do have to pop the door, Thomas. They do
have to pop the door for you to get inside.
Sam processed. You take the phone off the hook, You
ring the officer inside the control and he has to
pop the door, and then once you're out, once control
pops that outer door, the officer inside has to open
up the inner door. Question Okay, so it's its own
separate unit. Thomas. It's its own separate unit, just like
any say, if I go to he gets cut off.
So there's two officers at twelve and six thirty Thomas
cuts him off. No, it's one officer up there. Question
there's only one officer up there, Thomas. It's one officer
up there, So that's why somebody has to go up
there and count. Question Okay, is it always twelve am
to eight am? One of the people that are in
the shoe always has to assist ten South Thomas. Most
of the time they assist ten South, and sometimes more
often than not, they have to assist nine North as well.
Question okay, and what's nine North Thomas, the unit across
the hall. Question is that also like a special housing
unit type of situation? Thomas? No, it's a regular housing unit.
Question Okay, but you don't know if that's against policy
or not. Thomas. I don't know if it's against policy
if you're just helping out because you're shorthanded. Question sure, Thomas,
short handed. Then question, all right, are you guys authorized
when you're in the shoe to be able to access
the computers for your own personal reasons? Like are you
allowed to do Internet searches and things like that limited
personal use? Thomas, I don't know if you are or
aren't authorized or not. But I don't know if it's
unauthorized or not. Question you're not even sure, Thomas, I'm not. Question.
They don't talk to you about like what you can
and can't do. Thomas. I know you're locked. You can't
just shoot, search Facebook or YouTube and those things are
not allowed on those types of computers redacted. Oh, okay,
you're not allowed to do like email or like Facebook. Thomas.
You can't do any of that stuff, and you can't
access as far as I know, you can't access your
own personal email. You have the job email and everything
like that, and that's about it. Question Are you allowed
to do like regular internet searches though, and things like that? Thomas,
I really don't know. Question no, Thomas, No. Question Do
you recall using the Internet on August tenth? Thomas, I
wrote my name and it says, yeah, I recall using
the Internet at the time. Question Okay, do you remember
what you were searching for? Thomas? On it says motorcycle?
Question motorcycles? All right, but do you know if that
was authorized or not authorized? Thomas? I don't know. Question,
So you're not sure? Okay? Are you aware if Noel
was also utilizing the computer? Thomas, I don't know what
she was on. Question No, But do you know if
she was using the computer? Thomas, Yeah, if she was,
I don't know. Like I said, we're facing two totally
different directions. Question sure. Do you know where you were seated,
what desk you were seated at? Where you happen to
be seated at the o C desk? Thomas, there's no
specifically this is the OIC station and this is somebody
else here. It's not labeled that way. Question all right.
The reason why I ask, I'm told that there was
a sign on the OIC's desk that said Epstein is
required to have a cell mate. So I was told
that the OIC had like a specific desk. Do you
call recall seeing that sign? Thomas? No question on any
of the computer or desk areas, Thomas, I don't question
that Epstein's required to have a cell mate. Thomas no,
I don't all right. We're going to wrap up right
here and in the next episode dealing with the topic,
we're gonna pick up where we left off. All the
information that goes with this episode can be found in
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