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<v Speaker 1>We were not broken men. We were betrayed, overcome by

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<v Speaker 1>cruel odds, but undismayed. Out of the fog of treachery,

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<v Speaker 1>we came in regiments and companies, or one by one.

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<v Speaker 1>We stood half dazed, then look upon the sea, and

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<v Speaker 1>in the glory of the setting sun, amongst those rosy clouds,

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<v Speaker 1>beyond the foam, we dreamed that we could see the

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<v Speaker 1>shores of home. That is Dunkirk nineteen forty by Dorothy

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<v Speaker 1>Emily Stevenson. And that is a somber poem for a

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<v Speaker 1>somber movie, and some might say a somber podcast. Ashley,

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<v Speaker 1>this might be the most unique of all of Christopher

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<v Speaker 1>Nolan's movies, Dunkirk twenty seventeen, not Dunkirk nineteen forty, when

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<v Speaker 1>actually Dunkirk happened, but Dunkirk twenty seventeen. A lot of

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<v Speaker 1>people described this as the most documentarian of Christopher Nolan's films,

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<v Speaker 1>Like the events just sort of happened, they don't. There's

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<v Speaker 1>not a lot of narrative flair here. There's just sort

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<v Speaker 1>of is we are sort of filming events, and we

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<v Speaker 1>are letting you experience them however you like to experience them,

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<v Speaker 1>which we said in some of our previous Nolan Club

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<v Speaker 1>episodes was sort of the weakness of previous episodes when

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<v Speaker 1>Nolan is trying to show you how to feel or

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<v Speaker 1>tell you how to feel instead of show you how

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<v Speaker 1>to feel. Let me ask you, do you think he

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<v Speaker 1>was successful with this movie, Like I mean with that

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<v Speaker 1>tone of just like you know, just sort of doing

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<v Speaker 1>a narrative documentary.

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<v Speaker 2>The irony being that the movie that we saw previous

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<v Speaker 2>to this from him being Interstellar, actually opens with real documentary.

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<v Speaker 1>Footage from Ken Burns and.

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<v Speaker 2>Somehow does impact nearly the impact of Dunkirk. I do

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<v Speaker 2>think that is a key to why this is incredibly effective,

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<v Speaker 2>because we are watching these characters go through these emotions,

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<v Speaker 2>and so for me, at least, my emotional residence with

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<v Speaker 2>with the story is sympathetic to them as opposed to

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<v Speaker 2>because I'm being told that love is the answer, even

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<v Speaker 2>though love is always the answer.

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<v Speaker 1>Of course, yeah, there's no love is the answer in Dunkirk.

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<v Speaker 1>It seems it seems like the only answer of Dunkirk

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<v Speaker 1>is don't get in the damn boat. Yeah, stay out

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<v Speaker 1>of the water. Like I feel bad for I'm not

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<v Speaker 1>gonna remember the main actor's name here, white finn Whiteheads

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<v Speaker 1>whose character's name is Tommy, who I don't even know

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<v Speaker 1>if you hear Tommy the.

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<v Speaker 2>Entire I don't think most of these characters we hear

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<v Speaker 2>their names.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, except for like Barry Keegan. Yeah, I feel like

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<v Speaker 1>watching him the entire movie is just it could almost

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<v Speaker 1>sort of be a comedy of errors, where like every

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<v Speaker 1>time you think he's going to get away from Dunkirk,

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<v Speaker 1>he fails.

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<v Speaker 2>Can I tell you, I don't even really like this

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<v Speaker 2>main character.

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<v Speaker 1>And of Tommy that we didn't know was named Tommy, yeh, yeah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know Tommy the player who plays pinball.

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<v Speaker 2>No, he sure pays plays a median pinball. I don't

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<v Speaker 2>even feel any particular gratitude that this character survives the film. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>spoilers for a nine year old movie, But I do

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<v Speaker 2>think that that is a strength of the film is

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<v Speaker 2>they don't tell you, They do not editorialize at any point,

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<v Speaker 2>and people behave nobly, and they behave very poorly throughout,

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<v Speaker 2>and at no point are you being told that you

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<v Speaker 2>have to feel good because this person has survived, or

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<v Speaker 2>you have to feel bad because this person hasn't survived.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's really a fifty to fifty. There's even a

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<v Speaker 2>character at the end of the film that, as you

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<v Speaker 2>said when we were watching it, you have to assume

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<v Speaker 2>is a pow if he survives at all, Yes, and

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<v Speaker 2>you know, and that's you know, a harrowing thing to

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<v Speaker 2>be confronted with.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, it's interesting for Dunkirk. For me, it's one

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<v Speaker 1>of these things where I think, like the best war movies,

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<v Speaker 1>it doesn't try to be like war is bad or

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<v Speaker 1>war is great. Yeah, is wrong on both ends, of course.

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<v Speaker 1>It more is just trying to put the POV in

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<v Speaker 1>the people that were there, and just trying to get

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<v Speaker 1>you to experience and think how terrible it would have

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<v Speaker 1>been if you were one of those people there and

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<v Speaker 1>that situation that because you know, it always is that

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<v Speaker 1>the war is hell. Yeah, no matter which way you

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<v Speaker 1>put it, war as hell.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's either that or it's the glory of battle, right, That's.

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<v Speaker 1>What I'm saying. Is war so great that we are

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<v Speaker 1>the good guys and there is there are no good

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<v Speaker 1>guys in war. There are no bad guys in war.

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<v Speaker 1>It's wars hell. Yeah, It's kind of a terrible event

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<v Speaker 1>that should never happen, no matter what we do, but

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<v Speaker 1>it just seems to keep happening. And what also seems

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<v Speaker 1>to keep happening is our podcast We Won't Die.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh.

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome the Geek History Lesson.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Jason, as we brought out towards six hundred episodes,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm Ashley Victoria Robinson. Welcome to your Mind University because

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<v Speaker 2>you have stumbled onto the podcast where a TV writer

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<v Speaker 2>from Kansas and a comic book writer from Canada deep

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<v Speaker 2>dive into the big questions of pop culture. And welcome

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<v Speaker 2>because you've come to a podcast within a podcast, because

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<v Speaker 2>this is Nolan Club, where we are celebrating and exploring

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<v Speaker 2>the works of Christopher Nolan in order leading up to

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<v Speaker 2>the release this summer of the Odyssey, and we have

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<v Speaker 2>finally come to I would say one of the more

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<v Speaker 2>longer awaited installments in Nolan Club. Done Kirk. So, if anyway,

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<v Speaker 2>if you're listening to Geek History Lesson extra, you know this,

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<v Speaker 2>And if you're not, then I mean, what are you

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<v Speaker 2>doing with your life? Hell?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, exactly guy? Screw you?

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<v Speaker 2>Uh?

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<v Speaker 1>Hell with you? Is what I said.

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<v Speaker 2>It's over on our Patriots Support podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>That's that's why you're not coming over there. It's fine.

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<v Speaker 1>I understand everybody. Look not everybody isn't a great economic

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<v Speaker 1>status right now, just like World War Two. It's fine,

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<v Speaker 1>but over there. Well with you, we have been doing.

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<v Speaker 2>Jason and I periodically check in and we rank Christopher Nolan's.

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<v Speaker 1>Movies as we're.

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<v Speaker 2>Series, and we bully our guests who come onto the

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<v Speaker 2>extra to do that as well.

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<v Speaker 1>It's been really.

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<v Speaker 2>Fun and I have consistently with Dunkirk in my top three,

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<v Speaker 2>and you have scoff set me multiple times. So for me,

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<v Speaker 2>this is a long awaited revisit because I was interested

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<v Speaker 2>to see if if it would hold up as well

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<v Speaker 2>as I've only seen it once before when we originally

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<v Speaker 2>saw the film, and I think and I was interested

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<v Speaker 2>to see what your opinion is. So for me, this

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<v Speaker 2>has been long awaited in sort of our Lore of

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<v Speaker 2>Nolan club, I'm excited to talk about this today.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, well, let's top into our real brief tencent origin

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<v Speaker 1>of Dunkirk from twenty seventeen by Christopher Nolan. But before

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<v Speaker 1>we can give that, well, we have to get a

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<v Speaker 1>ten cent origin on Operation Dynamo, which is the Dunkirk

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<v Speaker 1>evacuation from because this is based on a real event,

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<v Speaker 1>so from May twenty six to July fourth in nineteen

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<v Speaker 1>forty in Dunkirk, France, right on the English Channel. More

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<v Speaker 1>than three hundred and thirty eight thousand Allied soldiers were

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<v Speaker 1>evacuated during the Second World War in the north of France.

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<v Speaker 1>Basically large numbers of Belgium, British and French troops were

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<v Speaker 1>cut off and surrounded by German troops during the six

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<v Speaker 1>week Battle of France. Interesting enough, many people considered this

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<v Speaker 1>to be the greatest blunder that Adolf Hitler committed in

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<v Speaker 1>the entirety of World War II, because the Halt order

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<v Speaker 1>on May twenty third was issued by Gerd van Rundstalt,

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<v Speaker 1>who was a commander of Army Group A, and he

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<v Speaker 1>was the one that decided to stop the German armies

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<v Speaker 1>from a completely obliterating the British, French and Belgium troops

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<v Speaker 1>and just basically let the Luftwaffe the Air Force, to

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<v Speaker 1>you know, pick them off like birds. And this allowed

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<v Speaker 1>the British to hastily assemble a fleet of over eight

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<v Speaker 1>hundred vessels and rescue the troops, basically becoming the miracle

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<v Speaker 1>of Again. Historians consider this to be one of Adolf

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<v Speaker 1>Hitler's greatest mistakes. And some people think that if the

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<v Speaker 1>Germans had just marched on through Germany would have actually

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<v Speaker 1>land invaded the land of Britain because they never got there. Yeah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>they you know, they blitz creaked him like crazy. But

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<v Speaker 1>people think Germany would have actually landed troops on English

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<v Speaker 1>soil and possibly.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, the channel is not that big, yeah, and.

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<v Speaker 1>You can almost see it. They say that many times

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<v Speaker 1>during the movie.

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<v Speaker 2>People have swam across it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, So I mean, don't do that. What a

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<v Speaker 1>stupid thing. Don't swaw a crossing the ship. Well, I

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<v Speaker 1>actually think it's one of the brilliant lines in the

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<v Speaker 1>movie that they keep repeating. Like Kenneth Brown, I think

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<v Speaker 1>starts it off where they say, you like you can

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<v Speaker 1>almost see how you almost see home? But so that

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<v Speaker 1>is the real miracle of Dunkirk now. The film of

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<v Speaker 1>Dunkirk directed by Christin Nolan, written by christ Nolan, produced

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<v Speaker 1>by Emma Tom Thomas his wife, starring Fione Whitehead, Tom

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<v Speaker 1>Fin white Head, Fin Whitehead, Tim Glon, Karney, Jack Loud

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<v Speaker 1>and Harry Styles, Anerwin Barnard, James Darcy, Barry Keegan, Kenneth

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<v Speaker 1>bron A Killian Murphy, Mark Rylance Inane, Tom Hardy himself,

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<v Speaker 1>cinematography by Hoyt van Hoytema again and music by Hans Zimmer.

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<v Speaker 1>This had a budget of one hundred million and had

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<v Speaker 1>a box up as a five hundred and forty nine

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<v Speaker 1>million was considered to be the highest grossing World War

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<v Speaker 1>Two movie of all time. Intel Oppenheimer made a billion.

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<v Speaker 2>Dollars barely a World War Two movie, barely Oh by Bye,

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<v Speaker 2>by proximity circumstance only so.

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<v Speaker 1>The idea of this film came to Christer Nolan in

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<v Speaker 1>the nineties when he sailed across the English Channel following

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<v Speaker 1>this route Oh Wow with his wife Emma Thomas. He

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<v Speaker 1>actually considered improvising the entire film and just like seeing

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<v Speaker 1>what would happen, and then Emma Thomas, luckily is a

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<v Speaker 1>good produceranism you need a script. The script of this

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<v Speaker 1>was seventy six pages, half the length of Christ nolancause

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<v Speaker 1>you gotta realize most Christ Nolan films are three hours long.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, this movie I actually thought was in the

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<v Speaker 2>three hour club. And then we paused it at one

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<v Speaker 2>point and it was like, oh, this is a reasonable

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<v Speaker 2>l length film.

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<v Speaker 1>Like most of Nolan's films that is told from three perspectives.

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<v Speaker 1>We have the Land, which takes place over the entire

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<v Speaker 1>one week of the miracle Dunkirk. We have c which

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<v Speaker 1>is one day of action, and then we have the Air,

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<v Speaker 1>which is one hour. Yeah. Now I think the Air

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<v Speaker 1>is stretched a little bit. I think it's longer than

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<v Speaker 1>an hour, although they keep looking back to his watch.

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<v Speaker 1>I just don't think I believe that everything of all that,

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<v Speaker 1>all those events take place in one hour. But you know, hey, whatever.

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<v Speaker 1>But Nolan basically wanted to structure the film completely from

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<v Speaker 1>the pov of the characters, and decided to base it

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<v Speaker 1>on no real soldiers that participated in the event, and

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<v Speaker 1>to also cast a majority of young and at that

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<v Speaker 1>time young and upcoming British actors so that nobody would

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<v Speaker 1>sort of steal the spot, like like in in a

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<v Speaker 1>list actor.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so he said, let me cast Harry Styles. Yeah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>no one's gonna notice Harry Styles.

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<v Speaker 1>And then well there was one of Harry styles first

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<v Speaker 1>acting roles though. Yeah. So again it's the other thing

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<v Speaker 1>is like Dunkirk is England's Alamo, if that makes any

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<v Speaker 1>sense to which is interesting. But you know, this is

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<v Speaker 1>gonna be a difficult one to talk about, I think,

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<v Speaker 1>because this is so documentary, like it is so much

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<v Speaker 1>in you know. I mean, we begin the movie with

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<v Speaker 1>Tommy Again, I did not know his name was Tommy.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sure they say it one time and one time only, trying.

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<v Speaker 1>To wander around the streets because he just wants to

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<v Speaker 1>take a poop. He needs to take a poop.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, he's with his homies and they're getting shot at

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<v Speaker 2>and they run and then he kind of comes upon

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<v Speaker 2>the beach. I mean, he's the only one who survives well.

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<v Speaker 1>And he comes upon Now this character's named Gibson who's

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<v Speaker 1>burying a body. Yeah, and Gibson's sort of also shell

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<v Speaker 1>shocked as well, and they're sort of walking around and

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<v Speaker 1>things like that, and they sort of like bond and

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<v Speaker 1>they're all trying to figure out a way to get

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<v Speaker 1>off of Dunkirk because of basically the evacuation. There's these

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<v Speaker 1>giant lines. You know, he is to think about, what

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<v Speaker 1>do you think about World War two movies always having

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<v Speaker 1>scenes on the beach, you know, like because you're the

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<v Speaker 1>most famous scene of Samon Priory Ryan is also a beach. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean when you're dealing with France in Italy.

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<v Speaker 2>A lot of it is coastal, right. My grandfather was

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<v Speaker 2>involved in World War two and he was involved in

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<v Speaker 2>the most Canadian famous Canadian battle on a beach, which

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<v Speaker 2>is Juno Beach. I think it's just a matter of

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<v Speaker 2>geography really. Then I think it's nice and easy to

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<v Speaker 2>shoot on because now they're just beaches. Now you just

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<v Speaker 2>go to France and you can just hang out on

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<v Speaker 2>these beaches and it's kind of wild.

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<v Speaker 1>Also, I think you did shoot this actually on the

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<v Speaker 1>beach evacuation happened. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>I also think from a narrative perspective, when you bring

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<v Speaker 2>water into a situation, you add a physical level of

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<v Speaker 2>discomfort that we can all relate to. We all know

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<v Speaker 2>what it's like to have wet shoes, we all know

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<v Speaker 2>what it's like to have wet pants, we all know

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<v Speaker 2>what it's like for the wind to be blowing, for

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<v Speaker 2>it to be cool. It adds a physical level of

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<v Speaker 2>discomfort that your audience can understand in a way that

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<v Speaker 2>most audience members can't understand what it's like to go

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<v Speaker 2>to war. So I think from a film perspective, I

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<v Speaker 2>think it's clever.

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<v Speaker 1>Actually, do you think the three narrative storylines work in

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<v Speaker 1>this movie because they rarely intersect. They the ones that intersect,

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<v Speaker 1>or is basically the air in the sea like the land,

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<v Speaker 1>only intersects at the very very end of the movie.

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<v Speaker 2>Are arguably because we see Killian Murphy.

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<v Speaker 1>In the like see him. We do see him in

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<v Speaker 1>the lane. We see him. Do you see him in

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<v Speaker 1>the land?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, very briefly, I hear you. I like them, and

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<v Speaker 2>I like that their timeline sort of don't converge too obviously.

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<v Speaker 2>I think a lesser director would have all of would

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<v Speaker 2>have like these three men, you.

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<v Speaker 1>Would put their thumb on the scale and be like look, look.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, they would all like you would have Killian Murphy,

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<v Speaker 2>Finn Whitehead and Tom Hardy like embrace and weep in

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<v Speaker 2>each other's arm.

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<v Speaker 1>Doesn't care if you don't put it together.

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<v Speaker 2>No, and you don't need it. And I think it's

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<v Speaker 2>quite clear from like maybe the second or third time

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<v Speaker 2>we switch that were not all in the same timeline,

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<v Speaker 2>but we are rushing toward some sort of logger like

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<v Speaker 2>I don't I don't think it's particularly I don't think

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<v Speaker 2>it's meant to be a huge obfuscation from the audience

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<v Speaker 2>I do find it effective. I do want to shout

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<v Speaker 2>out in the land storyline, when Gibson and Tommy are

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<v Speaker 2>first trying to get on a boat and they take

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<v Speaker 2>a corpse and they're trying to fake their way on,

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<v Speaker 2>they're stopped by a warrant officer who was played by

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<v Speaker 2>Bridgerton's own bisexual disaster Luke Thompson.

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<v Speaker 1>And as we watched it, I was like, Hey, that's.

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<v Speaker 2>Benedict from Bridgerton. So you'd made that comment earlier that

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<v Speaker 2>it was sort of all these up and coming actors,

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<v Speaker 2>and now that it's been nine years and a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of them have up and came, I was like, Oh,

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<v Speaker 2>I recognize him. Oh I recognized Jack Loaden. I recognize

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<v Speaker 2>all these people that I didn't recognize when we were

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<v Speaker 2>initially watching it playing these kind of like minimal parts

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<v Speaker 2>in the film as well.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I also recognize that we have to take a

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<v Speaker 1>quick commercial break and we're going to be right back

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<v Speaker 1>talking about your favorite World War Two buddies right for

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<v Speaker 1>this GHL, we're back talking about Nolan's heroes. The Lovable movie,

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<v Speaker 1>where so many Allied soldiers behind enemy lines in nineteen

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<v Speaker 1>forty are trying to get to Britain.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Remember remember when they dug the hole in the scene

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<v Speaker 1>and I cannot believe that they dug the hole. They

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<v Speaker 1>went under the fence and then they came up right

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<v Speaker 1>into Colonel Clink's office. Can you believe at all?

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<v Speaker 2>Literally, no idea what you were doing? Right?

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<v Speaker 1>The Hogan's Heroes references. All the fifty year olds love it.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I've definitely seen an episode of that. I've never

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<v Speaker 2>seen Hogan's Heroes for a single second of my entire life.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a it's a show that would not be made

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<v Speaker 1>now at all.

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<v Speaker 2>It's about, yeah, where the Nazis are like the goofy

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<v Speaker 2>bad guys.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Yeah, Well it's it's about a bunch of Americans

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<v Speaker 1>in a pow camp and they keep escaping through hijinks,

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00:16:49.480 --> 00:16:52.440
<v Speaker 1>right through hygiens yep, and they keep getting caught and

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<v Speaker 1>Colonel Clink is just like, oh, hol again, you did

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<v Speaker 1>it again.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, we all work through our trauma in different ways.

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<v Speaker 1>And yeah, any ran for several seasons.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there's there's not as much digging of holes, and

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<v Speaker 2>there's more like getting on enough boats in Dune.

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<v Speaker 1>There's a lot of Another alternate title of this movie

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<v Speaker 1>is Karen back again. You can't get on a boat. Yeah, yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>the unnamed Tommy keeps getting in a boat. We also

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<v Speaker 1>got to talk about what is the name of Tom

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<v Speaker 1>Hardy's Again, I don't know the names of any Farrier.

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<v Speaker 1>We do.

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<v Speaker 2>Hear his name his his brother, Pilot Collins toward the

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<v Speaker 2>end is like get him Ferrier, get them, So his

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<v Speaker 2>name is Ferrier.

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<v Speaker 1>So Ferrier. Tom Hardy shows up as one of the

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<v Speaker 1>airplane pilot, the Spitfire pilots, because you know, he did

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<v Speaker 1>some amazing forehead and eye acting in the Dark Knight Rises,

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<v Speaker 1>so Nolan brought him back to do the same thing

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<v Speaker 1>again in Dunk.

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<v Speaker 2>You pointed out something really interesting when we were watching

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<v Speaker 2>this that these characters who are you know, the these

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<v Speaker 2>the World War One flying aces and and and the

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<v Speaker 2>guys who are doing these jobs and for the RAF

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<v Speaker 2>and stuff. Even the LUFTWAFFA planes are very new at

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<v Speaker 2>this They are I think you said, they're basically driving

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<v Speaker 2>cars in the sky. They are up there on a

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<v Speaker 2>literal wing and a prayer. They're doing all the.

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<v Speaker 1>Small planes have only been in existence for about twenty

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<v Speaker 1>two years at this point. Yeah, So to put that

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<v Speaker 1>into reality, that is almost the amount of time that

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<v Speaker 1>well a little bit longer now, Yeah, that people have

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<v Speaker 1>the general populace have been dealing with email. Yeah at

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<v Speaker 1>this point. Yeah, that's how new planes are in this movie. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>And I thought that that was a really brilliant observation

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<v Speaker 2>because obviously, and this would have been true at the time,

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<v Speaker 2>of course, but for the sake of the film, like

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<v Speaker 2>these are the guys at the top of their game,

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<v Speaker 2>which is why spoiler alert, they both survive at least

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<v Speaker 2>to the end of the movie and ultimately achieve their goals.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's why I think these two characters are the

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<v Speaker 2>easiest to root for other than Mark Ray Lansen Coo

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<v Speaker 2>sort of the most uncomplicated because everything that they're that

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<v Speaker 2>they do is purely is pure heroism.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, one of the I think the most brilliant pieces

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<v Speaker 1>of writing that happens in this movie, yeah, is with

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<v Speaker 1>the Tom Hardy storyline, because in the other two storylines

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<v Speaker 1>on the land, we keep seeing Tommy. He gets on

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<v Speaker 1>one boat, it sinks, he gets on another boat, it sinks,

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<v Speaker 1>he gets on another boat, it sinks. Yeah, he can't

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<v Speaker 1>get away. And then the Mark Rylance, who is the

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<v Speaker 1>civilian mister Dawson. Yeah, so he's one of the civilians

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<v Speaker 1>that been you know, and you know he is traveling

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<v Speaker 1>to Dunkirk, and most of his storyline is just getting

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<v Speaker 1>to Dunkirk. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Beautifully shot and really love all those scenes on the boat.

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<v Speaker 1>And both storylines. There is not a classic film ticking clock,

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<v Speaker 1>but for Tom Hardy there is. There is because his

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<v Speaker 1>fuel gage is broken, and so about every fifteen minutes

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<v Speaker 1>he is saying, what's your feel, what's your feel? And

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<v Speaker 1>he's like, I'm down to this, I'm down to fifteen gallons.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm down to fourteen gallons. And you see Tom Hardy

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<v Speaker 1>literally writing down the ticking clock, so that there is

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<v Speaker 1>sort of this tension of like, oh crap, when is

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<v Speaker 1>Tom Hardy gonna run out of fuel?

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<v Speaker 2>You also get the moment because Collins one of there's

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<v Speaker 2>I think there's two other guys with him. Initially one

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<v Speaker 2>of them gets shot down right off the bat and

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<v Speaker 2>then it's Ferrier and Collins for a while. Collins winds

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<v Speaker 2>up ditching into.

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<v Speaker 1>The ocean and Tom Hardy thinks he's dead, and.

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<v Speaker 2>Tom Hardy thinks he's dead, and then Tom Hardy there's

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<v Speaker 2>a moment a couple scenes after that where you watch

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<v Speaker 2>him and no one says it. It's all in the acting.

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<v Speaker 2>It's really all in the eyes. You watch his character

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<v Speaker 2>Ferrier make the decision like I either turn back or

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<v Speaker 2>I'm landing on the beach and it is what it is,

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<v Speaker 2>or I'm ditching right outside the beach, and it is

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<v Speaker 2>like you watch him have that swell of heroism.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a brilliant piece of eye acting because he sees

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<v Speaker 1>a bomber, a German bomber in his rear view mirror. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>and it is the idea because I assume what I

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<v Speaker 1>assume it is is I assume he is heading back

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<v Speaker 1>towards England. Yes, and so he sees the German bomber

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<v Speaker 1>behind him and then yeah, you see him sort of

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<v Speaker 1>do the struggle and then he turns the plane around. Yeah.

400
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<v Speaker 1>And it is one of those things where like if

401
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<v Speaker 1>he turns the plane around, he screwed.

402
00:21:16.319 --> 00:21:19.759
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because even if he lands, he is you know,

403
00:21:20.039 --> 00:21:22.720
<v Speaker 2>as you said, he's probably gonna get picked up if

404
00:21:22.799 --> 00:21:25.240
<v Speaker 2>he lands. First of all, if he lands successfully, and

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<v Speaker 2>they make a bit of a meal out of the

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<v Speaker 2>landing sequence. Although I find it very beautiful and very emotional,

407
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<v Speaker 2>but yeah, it's it's one of the only moments of

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<v Speaker 2>pure heroism that we really get in the whole This

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00:21:36.640 --> 00:21:38.440
<v Speaker 2>movie does a really good job at being like, there's

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<v Speaker 2>no good guys and there's no bad guys, but it's

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<v Speaker 2>a really brave thing.

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<v Speaker 1>Well again, it's one of the This is why this

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<v Speaker 1>is such a hard movie to talk about, because it's

414
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<v Speaker 1>just there. There's not a lot of meat in these characters,

415
00:21:49.920 --> 00:21:55.759
<v Speaker 1>and we don't really know about really any of the

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<v Speaker 1>stuff that's happening any more than the soldiers do.

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<v Speaker 2>Will you get the barest I think this is cleverly

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<v Speaker 2>done too, where it's inserted. You get them barrass amount

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<v Speaker 2>of exposition from James Darcy and Kenneth Brown at the

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<v Speaker 2>two officers, and we only see them, i think in

421
00:22:09.680 --> 00:22:12.160
<v Speaker 2>four seed five scenes in the whole film, and we

422
00:22:12.200 --> 00:22:14.480
<v Speaker 2>cut to them every once in a while where it's like, well,

423
00:22:14.519 --> 00:22:16.839
<v Speaker 2>why aren't why are we waiting on all these boats?

424
00:22:16.880 --> 00:22:20.039
<v Speaker 2>Why isn't Churchill sending the full forces? And it gives

425
00:22:20.079 --> 00:22:22.920
<v Speaker 2>us a little bit of like historical context as to

426
00:22:23.160 --> 00:22:25.640
<v Speaker 2>why they're just sitting ducks here in the first place.

427
00:22:25.720 --> 00:22:29.359
<v Speaker 2>And I think Nolan, compared to what we talked about,

428
00:22:29.359 --> 00:22:31.960
<v Speaker 2>it Interstellar, where it is so overbloated.

429
00:22:31.319 --> 00:22:31.839
<v Speaker 1>In the script.

430
00:22:31.880 --> 00:22:34.359
<v Speaker 2>He shows such restraint in where he chooses and how

431
00:22:34.359 --> 00:22:36.720
<v Speaker 2>he chooses to give us information throughout this film.

432
00:22:37.000 --> 00:22:46.759
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, he intentionally said when writing this that he in sorry,

433
00:22:47.000 --> 00:22:49.400
<v Speaker 1>I really badly messed up the same like just by Dunkirk,

434
00:22:49.440 --> 00:22:54.119
<v Speaker 1>I messed up. I got blown up. He intentionally wrote

435
00:22:54.119 --> 00:22:57.440
<v Speaker 1>as little dialogue as possible. Yeah, Hardy's do you know

436
00:22:57.480 --> 00:22:59.599
<v Speaker 1>how many lines of dialogue Tom Hardy has in this movie?

437
00:22:59.680 --> 00:22:59.799
<v Speaker 2>No?

438
00:23:00.319 --> 00:23:05.119
<v Speaker 1>Ten? Wow, he only has ten lines of dialogue. You

439
00:23:05.160 --> 00:23:05.640
<v Speaker 1>think you get that.

440
00:23:05.640 --> 00:23:09.559
<v Speaker 2>Script and you're like, Helly, I can memorize this in

441
00:23:09.599 --> 00:23:10.000
<v Speaker 2>an hour.

442
00:23:10.279 --> 00:23:14.680
<v Speaker 1>Well you tell me, actor, Like, I honestly think I

443
00:23:14.680 --> 00:23:19.240
<v Speaker 1>can only think about like how many days he was

444
00:23:19.240 --> 00:23:21.240
<v Speaker 1>probably sitting on that cockpit. Oh he would have been.

445
00:23:21.480 --> 00:23:23.640
<v Speaker 2>This would have been a long shoot from Yes, I think.

446
00:23:23.440 --> 00:23:27.640
<v Speaker 1>About Look left, Tom, look right, Tom. Yeah, look for Lauren.

447
00:23:27.759 --> 00:23:30.000
<v Speaker 2>Tom, be concerned, Tom Hardy.

448
00:23:30.039 --> 00:23:31.240
<v Speaker 1>You spotted something in your mirror.

449
00:23:31.319 --> 00:23:33.720
<v Speaker 2>Considering he plays a bunch of thugs and tough guys,

450
00:23:33.839 --> 00:23:37.839
<v Speaker 2>Tom Hardy is a very emotional actor and is very

451
00:23:37.960 --> 00:23:41.079
<v Speaker 2>very good at emoting at us, it kind of reminds

452
00:23:41.119 --> 00:23:45.759
<v Speaker 2>me it's interesting, this is much easier to do on stage,

453
00:23:45.799 --> 00:23:49.960
<v Speaker 2>I think. But in the musical Hamilton, the King George

454
00:23:50.039 --> 00:23:54.400
<v Speaker 2>character has nine minutes on stage in a three hour musical.

455
00:23:54.880 --> 00:23:58.319
<v Speaker 2>Everyone knows that character. That character is iconic. You know,

456
00:23:58.440 --> 00:24:01.480
<v Speaker 2>if you're good and then material you're given is there,

457
00:24:01.640 --> 00:24:03.799
<v Speaker 2>you can do a little with a lot and uh,

458
00:24:03.839 --> 00:24:07.559
<v Speaker 2>you know, to sort of, I guess drive to the point.

459
00:24:07.920 --> 00:24:12.559
<v Speaker 2>This movie literally makes me weep. And a lot of

460
00:24:12.599 --> 00:24:17.359
<v Speaker 2>it is Tom Hardy's like his from from the time

461
00:24:17.440 --> 00:24:19.640
<v Speaker 2>he arrives and he runs out of fuel till the

462
00:24:19.720 --> 00:24:21.119
<v Speaker 2>end of the film. A lot of it is on

463
00:24:21.200 --> 00:24:24.160
<v Speaker 2>his character. I just I find it. I find it

464
00:24:24.279 --> 00:24:27.119
<v Speaker 2>so like beautiful and so sad in he's performing.

465
00:24:27.200 --> 00:24:29.680
<v Speaker 1>If there were two hero characters in this movie, yeah,

466
00:24:29.680 --> 00:24:31.599
<v Speaker 1>I don't argue that there are. But if there were

467
00:24:31.599 --> 00:24:34.519
<v Speaker 1>two characters in this movie, it's Kenneth Brown and Tom Hardy. Yes,

468
00:24:34.599 --> 00:24:35.079
<v Speaker 1>in the in.

469
00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:39.319
<v Speaker 2>The traditional uh these are the war hero senses because

470
00:24:39.480 --> 00:24:40.599
<v Speaker 2>they also give Keneth Brown.

471
00:24:40.480 --> 00:24:41.160
<v Speaker 1>And I like this moment.

472
00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:43.559
<v Speaker 2>It's a touch sacrain for the rest of the film.

473
00:24:43.720 --> 00:24:45.079
<v Speaker 2>But I like the moment at the end where he

474
00:24:45.079 --> 00:24:47.079
<v Speaker 2>says to James Darcy, I'm gonna wait for the French

475
00:24:47.839 --> 00:24:50.759
<v Speaker 2>because he's been quite callous up to that point, and

476
00:24:50.759 --> 00:24:53.160
<v Speaker 2>we're trying to soften him a little bit, and Kenth Brown.

477
00:24:53.119 --> 00:24:55.319
<v Speaker 1>Is so good. The only moment of the movie that

478
00:24:55.319 --> 00:24:58.759
<v Speaker 1>seems rightly to me it is it is definitely you

479
00:24:58.960 --> 00:25:00.960
<v Speaker 1>and kind of betrays the spirit of like I think,

480
00:25:01.000 --> 00:25:03.079
<v Speaker 1>what the rest of dunk Dunkirk If if there was

481
00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:05.480
<v Speaker 1>any weakness, I would give that movie. It is that moment.

482
00:25:05.599 --> 00:25:08.319
<v Speaker 2>Let me ask you this, then, counterpoint, because we talked

483
00:25:08.319 --> 00:25:11.680
<v Speaker 2>about mister Dawson as played by Mark Rylance again in

484
00:25:11.720 --> 00:25:14.279
<v Speaker 2>a film with Keneth browna arguably the two finest actors

485
00:25:14.279 --> 00:25:16.519
<v Speaker 2>of their generation to the finest actors working.

486
00:25:17.680 --> 00:25:19.759
<v Speaker 1>We haven't talked about the boys who are with him.

487
00:25:20.359 --> 00:25:24.480
<v Speaker 2>Do you do you not find the moment where Peter

488
00:25:24.640 --> 00:25:27.279
<v Speaker 2>goes to the town newspaper to write the obituary. You

489
00:25:27.279 --> 00:25:28.400
<v Speaker 2>don't find that rightly?

490
00:25:28.720 --> 00:25:31.519
<v Speaker 1>Well, let's a little a little flourish at the end. No,

491
00:25:31.599 --> 00:25:33.440
<v Speaker 1>because I feel that set up. So let's let's talk

492
00:25:33.440 --> 00:25:37.119
<v Speaker 1>about it escaping right today. Yeah, So we have Mark Rylance,

493
00:25:37.200 --> 00:25:42.960
<v Speaker 1>he's a civilian Bodhist. His son is as Peter.

494
00:25:43.079 --> 00:25:46.039
<v Speaker 2>He's played by Tom Glynn Carney, who you may recognize

495
00:25:46.039 --> 00:25:47.920
<v Speaker 2>from being King Eggon and hou's the.

496
00:25:47.920 --> 00:25:51.039
<v Speaker 1>Direct and then who who is Barry Keagan playing George? Okay,

497
00:25:51.039 --> 00:25:54.279
<v Speaker 1>so George. So George is not Mark Rylance's son. He's

498
00:25:54.319 --> 00:25:56.079
<v Speaker 1>just even know they have the same color hair. A friend,

499
00:25:56.160 --> 00:25:58.319
<v Speaker 1>he's a guy. I think he works with them. Yeah,

500
00:25:58.519 --> 00:26:02.000
<v Speaker 1>uncle boy. They have sort of been conscripted to go

501
00:26:02.000 --> 00:26:04.359
<v Speaker 1>to Dunkirk, and so he takes off and then George

502
00:26:04.359 --> 00:26:08.160
<v Speaker 1>comes with them, and we should talk about that. This

503
00:26:08.240 --> 00:26:12.200
<v Speaker 1>is this is a very unique thing about Dunkirk. There

504
00:26:12.279 --> 00:26:16.640
<v Speaker 1>are two stories of cowardice in this movie. So the

505
00:26:16.640 --> 00:26:19.799
<v Speaker 1>biggest one is Tommy's entire storyline, the main guy that

506
00:26:19.799 --> 00:26:23.480
<v Speaker 1>we're falling across the beach. He literally spends the entire

507
00:26:23.559 --> 00:26:26.640
<v Speaker 1>movie just trying to get the hell away. He doesn't

508
00:26:26.640 --> 00:26:30.279
<v Speaker 1>care who he betrays to do that. And then eventually

509
00:26:30.279 --> 00:26:33.720
<v Speaker 1>he gets confronted with this idea of like, will you

510
00:26:33.799 --> 00:26:34.920
<v Speaker 1>betray your morals?

511
00:26:35.279 --> 00:26:35.720
<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

512
00:26:35.799 --> 00:26:40.079
<v Speaker 1>Will you kill an innocent person to get away? Or

513
00:26:40.319 --> 00:26:43.160
<v Speaker 1>and he says and he says no, He says no,

514
00:26:43.759 --> 00:26:46.559
<v Speaker 1>he no, no, He fights. Harry Styles is the one

515
00:26:46.559 --> 00:26:48.640
<v Speaker 1>that says yeah, but he doesn't stop them. But the

516
00:26:48.720 --> 00:26:51.839
<v Speaker 1>problem is is that they get killed anyway because the

517
00:26:51.839 --> 00:26:54.279
<v Speaker 1>boat gets fired. So that's beyond the point. But the one,

518
00:26:54.480 --> 00:26:58.680
<v Speaker 1>the other one that is very harrowing is we basically

519
00:26:58.720 --> 00:27:00.720
<v Speaker 1>want we see this point where we see Kelly and

520
00:27:00.799 --> 00:27:03.480
<v Speaker 1>Murphy get fished out of the water. Yeah, and he

521
00:27:03.599 --> 00:27:06.680
<v Speaker 1>is some sort of colonel. He's very shell shocked. Ye.

522
00:27:06.880 --> 00:27:09.319
<v Speaker 1>And also like that he finds out that Mark Randlan

523
00:27:09.319 --> 00:27:11.640
<v Speaker 1>and civilian boat's going back to Dunkirk, and he says,

524
00:27:12.640 --> 00:27:15.000
<v Speaker 1>I turn around, I'm not going back. I'm not going back.

525
00:27:15.240 --> 00:27:18.480
<v Speaker 1>In the course of not selling down, he pushes Barry

526
00:27:18.839 --> 00:27:20.880
<v Speaker 1>Barry Keegan down the stairs.

527
00:27:20.720 --> 00:27:22.319
<v Speaker 2>He doesn't even do it on purpose, He just sort

528
00:27:22.319 --> 00:27:23.240
<v Speaker 2>of throws.

529
00:27:22.920 --> 00:27:25.119
<v Speaker 1>Him off of he overreacts.

530
00:27:25.160 --> 00:27:27.680
<v Speaker 2>Yes, but I just want in case anyone's not seen it,

531
00:27:27.720 --> 00:27:29.200
<v Speaker 2>I don't want you to think he does not intentionally

532
00:27:29.240 --> 00:27:29.720
<v Speaker 2>push this point.

533
00:27:29.759 --> 00:27:32.119
<v Speaker 1>Now you haven't watch Dunkirk and you're listening to this podcast,

534
00:27:32.160 --> 00:27:34.960
<v Speaker 1>what the hell you will do? People do watch Dunkirk.

535
00:27:34.960 --> 00:27:37.119
<v Speaker 1>It's a great movie. God, I don't know how would

536
00:27:37.119 --> 00:27:38.559
<v Speaker 1>you even know what the hell we're talking about. At

537
00:27:38.559 --> 00:27:42.880
<v Speaker 1>this point, we've all done it. And Barry Keegan dies, Yeah,

538
00:27:42.960 --> 00:27:44.839
<v Speaker 1>because at the back of his head open. Yeah, to

539
00:27:44.880 --> 00:27:47.079
<v Speaker 1>the point where, like Harry Styles later gets on this

540
00:27:47.160 --> 00:27:49.680
<v Speaker 1>boat and they're like leave George alone and he goes

541
00:27:49.720 --> 00:27:53.400
<v Speaker 1>he's dead, mate, Yeah, so be careful. So when we

542
00:27:53.440 --> 00:27:55.440
<v Speaker 1>first saw this in theaters, you asked me what I

543
00:27:55.519 --> 00:27:59.440
<v Speaker 1>thought about, you know, because I'm a war veteran. Well yeah,

544
00:27:59.720 --> 00:28:04.799
<v Speaker 1>a little, but like you, you did the thing, not

545
00:28:04.839 --> 00:28:05.440
<v Speaker 1>like these boys.

546
00:28:06.559 --> 00:28:08.720
<v Speaker 2>Look we're not it's apples and oranges. Yeah, but I mean,

547
00:28:08.799 --> 00:28:11.039
<v Speaker 2>you know you and you are one of very few

548
00:28:11.079 --> 00:28:14.640
<v Speaker 2>people I know who have done the thing. So I

549
00:28:14.640 --> 00:28:17.880
<v Speaker 2>didn't know if you would have a different perspective on

550
00:28:17.880 --> 00:28:22.000
<v Speaker 2>one on the stories of they're presented as stories of cowardice,

551
00:28:22.079 --> 00:28:23.759
<v Speaker 2>even though like I'll say, this is my full chest,

552
00:28:24.160 --> 00:28:27.519
<v Speaker 2>that would be me. Yep, I think that's most people.

553
00:28:27.680 --> 00:28:29.440
<v Speaker 2>There's I didn't say that yet it may be like, yes,

554
00:28:29.480 --> 00:28:31.480
<v Speaker 2>you would be. I'm sorry, No, no, I didn't take I

555
00:28:31.519 --> 00:28:32.119
<v Speaker 2>didn't take it that.

556
00:28:32.559 --> 00:28:35.759
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's like agreeing with your point. You know. I've

557
00:28:35.799 --> 00:28:38.079
<v Speaker 1>always heard the thing there that that everyone's a coward

558
00:28:38.119 --> 00:28:38.720
<v Speaker 1>in a Foxhall.

559
00:28:38.839 --> 00:28:41.440
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, there's no there's no atheist in a Foxhall.

560
00:28:41.319 --> 00:28:44.759
<v Speaker 1>No atheist in a Foxhall. There's no cowards on a foxhall. Yeah.

561
00:28:45.279 --> 00:28:49.039
<v Speaker 1>You know, people, your animal ins thinks take over and

562
00:28:49.079 --> 00:28:51.519
<v Speaker 1>you do crazy things. I think that's the reason. That's

563
00:28:51.519 --> 00:28:55.799
<v Speaker 1>where I like. I like the Tommy scene where they

564
00:28:55.839 --> 00:28:59.279
<v Speaker 1>go into this trawler and they they're high, they're hiding

565
00:28:59.279 --> 00:29:01.599
<v Speaker 1>and they're hoping high tied would carry her out. And

566
00:29:01.640 --> 00:29:03.799
<v Speaker 1>then they find out that the guy that he saw

567
00:29:03.839 --> 00:29:07.680
<v Speaker 1>on the beach was this Frenchman because they originally think

568
00:29:07.720 --> 00:29:09.799
<v Speaker 1>he's a German spy and then he's a Frenchman. He

569
00:29:09.839 --> 00:29:12.880
<v Speaker 1>does anything, Yeah, and then Tommy like defends him. Harry

570
00:29:12.880 --> 00:29:15.279
<v Speaker 1>Styles is like ready to murder the guy. And then

571
00:29:15.279 --> 00:29:18.160
<v Speaker 1>because they're making noise anyway, the Germans blow them full

572
00:29:18.160 --> 00:29:22.079
<v Speaker 1>of bullets. So the ship's gonna sink anyway. Yeah, you know,

573
00:29:22.400 --> 00:29:26.519
<v Speaker 1>it's it. There is if there is any sort of

574
00:29:26.680 --> 00:29:31.720
<v Speaker 1>narrative thing in this, it is this idea where like

575
00:29:32.119 --> 00:29:38.680
<v Speaker 1>there is a subtle, subconscious thing of Tommy's cowardice could

576
00:29:38.720 --> 00:29:43.519
<v Speaker 1>be being punished because every obstacle that could get in

577
00:29:43.599 --> 00:29:46.559
<v Speaker 1>Tommy's way gets in Tommy's way. I mean, he's on

578
00:29:46.640 --> 00:29:49.680
<v Speaker 1>three different ships that sink, and you know there are

579
00:29:49.759 --> 00:29:52.160
<v Speaker 1>a lot of ships that sank during Dunkirk. But there

580
00:29:52.680 --> 00:29:54.839
<v Speaker 1>if there's any piece of this that, yeah, as a

581
00:29:54.880 --> 00:29:57.759
<v Speaker 1>little might be subconscious, right, really, yeah, it might be

582
00:29:57.839 --> 00:29:59.000
<v Speaker 1>that well, if you can.

583
00:29:59.119 --> 00:30:01.960
<v Speaker 2>If you consider that in the opening sequence, he's running

584
00:30:01.960 --> 00:30:03.559
<v Speaker 2>with his I don't know if it would be a

585
00:30:03.559 --> 00:30:06.000
<v Speaker 2>squad or a platoon, or he's running with his squad.

586
00:30:06.559 --> 00:30:07.880
<v Speaker 1>They all get mowed down.

587
00:30:08.279 --> 00:30:13.359
<v Speaker 2>He does nothing, drops his gun to defend these his brothers,

588
00:30:13.359 --> 00:30:15.920
<v Speaker 2>and you know, however you want to call his colleagues,

589
00:30:16.000 --> 00:30:21.599
<v Speaker 2>how you want to think about it, he just runs. So, yeah,

590
00:30:21.720 --> 00:30:25.519
<v Speaker 2>is is this his karma for that?

591
00:30:25.720 --> 00:30:28.799
<v Speaker 1>Or is that too? Is that too hoity toity?

592
00:30:28.880 --> 00:30:32.480
<v Speaker 2>And is it just like this is horrible and this

593
00:30:32.519 --> 00:30:35.119
<v Speaker 2>is how everyone acts because it is so horrible because

594
00:30:35.119 --> 00:30:36.440
<v Speaker 2>it's an impossible situation.

595
00:30:37.960 --> 00:30:41.319
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I you know, war as hell, Yeah I do. Mash.

596
00:30:41.400 --> 00:30:43.160
<v Speaker 2>Mash really really nailed it.

597
00:30:43.480 --> 00:30:46.920
<v Speaker 1>Mash did really nailize it. You know, we're gonna make

598
00:30:46.960 --> 00:30:49.240
<v Speaker 1>the rest of this podcast episode about Mash, but we're

599
00:30:49.240 --> 00:30:55.160
<v Speaker 1>gonna do that would be the first time right after this, GHL,

600
00:30:55.200 --> 00:30:57.839
<v Speaker 1>we're back Nolan Club or we might be turning this

601
00:30:57.920 --> 00:31:04.240
<v Speaker 1>into Mash club because oh, sad is painless. It brings

602
00:31:04.319 --> 00:31:11.839
<v Speaker 1>on many change. All Right, again, this is a hard

603
00:31:11.839 --> 00:31:13.000
<v Speaker 1>movie to talk about it It's hard.

604
00:31:13.039 --> 00:31:14.240
<v Speaker 2>Look, it's hard when.

605
00:31:15.680 --> 00:31:17.079
<v Speaker 1>This movie is a vibe.

606
00:31:17.160 --> 00:31:22.680
<v Speaker 2>Yeah again, you described this as one of the biggest budget.

607
00:31:23.039 --> 00:31:24.400
<v Speaker 1>Art films ever made.

608
00:31:24.680 --> 00:31:29.680
<v Speaker 2>I think that's accurate, but I don't think it's It's

609
00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:31.640
<v Speaker 2>not like French New Way, which I know drives you

610
00:31:31.680 --> 00:31:37.559
<v Speaker 2>in particular a little mad. It's not it's not art

611
00:31:37.640 --> 00:31:42.519
<v Speaker 2>for art's sake. It is driving at something. It is emotional,

612
00:31:42.680 --> 00:31:47.839
<v Speaker 2>it is arresting and effective. I think the Killian Murphy

613
00:31:47.839 --> 00:31:52.359
<v Speaker 2>Mark Rylance stuff is so effective because it's very sad that,

614
00:31:52.519 --> 00:31:55.400
<v Speaker 2>like the character is played by Barry Keegan, George is

615
00:31:55.440 --> 00:31:58.039
<v Speaker 2>like this boy from a small town who wasn't good

616
00:31:58.039 --> 00:32:00.960
<v Speaker 2>at school, who works as a fisherman, whose dream is

617
00:32:01.000 --> 00:32:02.759
<v Speaker 2>to one day do something good enough to be in

618
00:32:02.759 --> 00:32:03.079
<v Speaker 2>the paper.

619
00:32:03.160 --> 00:32:04.640
<v Speaker 1>He's like, it's he's.

620
00:32:04.200 --> 00:32:06.599
<v Speaker 2>A small He's a small man with small dream. And

621
00:32:06.640 --> 00:32:08.160
<v Speaker 2>I'm not saying that it's a bad way to live

622
00:32:08.240 --> 00:32:10.119
<v Speaker 2>or anything like that, but that's how he's presented.

623
00:32:09.759 --> 00:32:10.920
<v Speaker 1>To us as a character.

624
00:32:12.039 --> 00:32:15.079
<v Speaker 2>He is, Yeah, I might be tall about him. And

625
00:32:15.119 --> 00:32:19.599
<v Speaker 2>then and then Killian Murphy in his own grief, who

626
00:32:19.680 --> 00:32:23.839
<v Speaker 2>is a colonel, kills him by accident five to seven. Well,

627
00:32:23.880 --> 00:32:26.640
<v Speaker 2>he's okay, so that means he's five to five. Let's

628
00:32:26.720 --> 00:32:27.079
<v Speaker 2>be real.

629
00:32:27.240 --> 00:32:30.079
<v Speaker 1>Apparently a ways, approximately one hundred and fifty nine pounds.

630
00:32:30.960 --> 00:32:35.079
<v Speaker 2>Sure, Jan, Look, I've met a lot of male actors

631
00:32:35.160 --> 00:32:37.559
<v Speaker 2>whose IMDb says they're five to seven, and we see

632
00:32:37.599 --> 00:32:40.079
<v Speaker 2>eye to eye, and I know how tall Ashley is anyway,

633
00:32:40.519 --> 00:32:43.440
<v Speaker 2>and then Kelly Murphy's character accidentally kills him. And what's

634
00:32:43.440 --> 00:32:47.240
<v Speaker 2>so brilliant about that is I feel bad for Barry

635
00:32:47.319 --> 00:32:51.480
<v Speaker 2>Keegan and I feel bad for Killian Murphy's character because

636
00:32:51.480 --> 00:32:55.640
<v Speaker 2>it's like it's it's it's hurt people, hurt people writ large,

637
00:32:56.440 --> 00:32:58.359
<v Speaker 2>I think across the whole film, and I think that's

638
00:32:58.400 --> 00:33:02.519
<v Speaker 2>why you can get away with the cool sideway shots

639
00:33:02.759 --> 00:33:09.160
<v Speaker 2>of the fighter planes, like the Artier moments, because it

640
00:33:09.200 --> 00:33:11.519
<v Speaker 2>has this emotional core at its center.

641
00:33:12.279 --> 00:33:15.240
<v Speaker 1>Nolan said this, and I think he's absolutely right, and

642
00:33:15.240 --> 00:33:17.119
<v Speaker 1>it's an interesting perspective where he said that he did

643
00:33:17.160 --> 00:33:20.279
<v Speaker 1>not want this to be like other war films where

644
00:33:20.279 --> 00:33:24.839
<v Speaker 1>you cut away to Churchill and other leaders in a

645
00:33:24.920 --> 00:33:27.599
<v Speaker 1>war room. He only wanted to show the war from

646
00:33:27.640 --> 00:33:29.720
<v Speaker 1>the perspective war. Another technique that he is is we

647
00:33:29.799 --> 00:33:33.160
<v Speaker 1>do not technically see any Germans in this movie, except

648
00:33:33.200 --> 00:33:36.000
<v Speaker 1>for the out of focused Germans that point rifles at

649
00:33:36.039 --> 00:33:37.119
<v Speaker 1>Tom Hardy at the very end.

650
00:33:37.599 --> 00:33:43.039
<v Speaker 2>I also appreciate that a lot of war films and

651
00:33:43.079 --> 00:33:46.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm not saying this isn't true, but want to do

652
00:33:46.920 --> 00:33:52.359
<v Speaker 2>the visceral body horror for the sake of it, and

653
00:33:52.400 --> 00:33:54.599
<v Speaker 2>we don't get that here, even though we do get

654
00:33:54.640 --> 00:33:59.519
<v Speaker 2>horrific injury and death throughout. I think Nolan is like

655
00:34:00.480 --> 00:34:04.160
<v Speaker 2>too much of a class act to go down that route.

656
00:34:04.240 --> 00:34:06.799
<v Speaker 2>And I don't find this any less harrowing than some

657
00:34:06.839 --> 00:34:07.799
<v Speaker 2>of the films that do that.

658
00:34:08.480 --> 00:34:10.360
<v Speaker 1>So you know, the one thing I will say about

659
00:34:10.400 --> 00:34:15.559
<v Speaker 1>this is that, especially off of Interstellar, is that I'm

660
00:34:15.760 --> 00:34:19.320
<v Speaker 1>glad that Nolan sort of took a breath of fresh

661
00:34:19.360 --> 00:34:24.400
<v Speaker 1>air and kind of just like really stripped everything back,

662
00:34:24.480 --> 00:34:31.880
<v Speaker 1>because I worry that if he had made Dark Knight Rises,

663
00:34:32.880 --> 00:34:40.280
<v Speaker 1>then Interstellar, then Tenant. Yeah, I think maybe in director jail.

664
00:34:40.960 --> 00:34:43.280
<v Speaker 1>I think he might be in director jail. But then

665
00:34:43.360 --> 00:34:47.239
<v Speaker 1>also I think if we were going into like, you know,

666
00:34:47.320 --> 00:34:50.039
<v Speaker 1>the same odyssey, I think I think you and I

667
00:34:50.119 --> 00:34:54.280
<v Speaker 1>would be having a completely different conversation where I think, ah,

668
00:34:54.360 --> 00:34:56.239
<v Speaker 1>you and I are still hopeful for it for sure,

669
00:34:56.320 --> 00:34:59.559
<v Speaker 1>and I think we would. I think instead the conversation

670
00:34:59.599 --> 00:35:01.360
<v Speaker 1>would be like we'd be like, oh boy, this is

671
00:35:01.360 --> 00:35:03.519
<v Speaker 1>not gonna be good. This is gonna be good.

672
00:35:03.360 --> 00:35:07.039
<v Speaker 2>Because because because one of the things that I hope

673
00:35:07.079 --> 00:35:12.079
<v Speaker 2>he takes from Dunkirk forward into the Odyssey is this

674
00:35:12.199 --> 00:35:15.559
<v Speaker 2>level of restraint. I think this film is an exercising

675
00:35:15.639 --> 00:35:20.199
<v Speaker 2>restraint on on every level, which is why I think

676
00:35:20.280 --> 00:35:23.800
<v Speaker 2>Tennant is an over correction back the other one.

677
00:35:23.920 --> 00:35:25.639
<v Speaker 1>I said this to you where we were watching the movie,

678
00:35:25.639 --> 00:35:27.920
<v Speaker 1>that I have a feeling that the battle scenes in

679
00:35:27.920 --> 00:35:30.039
<v Speaker 1>the Odyssey are going to be very inspired by this. Yeah,

680
00:35:30.239 --> 00:35:32.679
<v Speaker 1>I'm a feeling they're going to be very silent. I

681
00:35:32.679 --> 00:35:34.079
<v Speaker 1>think they're going to be very visible.

682
00:35:34.079 --> 00:35:35.800
<v Speaker 2>Oh my god, Jason, it's another beach too.

683
00:35:35.960 --> 00:35:38.800
<v Speaker 1>Yep. And I think I think he's just gonna let

684
00:35:39.000 --> 00:35:41.760
<v Speaker 1>I think. I think all of the Trojan war scenes

685
00:35:41.800 --> 00:35:44.239
<v Speaker 1>are gonna be like Dunkirk. I think he's just going

686
00:35:44.280 --> 00:35:47.440
<v Speaker 1>to show you, like I think, I think no one

687
00:35:48.079 --> 00:35:51.320
<v Speaker 1>is going to give us the experience, the actual real experience,

688
00:35:51.360 --> 00:35:52.800
<v Speaker 1>which I haven't really felt in a lot of movies

689
00:35:52.840 --> 00:35:56.599
<v Speaker 1>since like Braveheart. Yeah, where you're just in this mob

690
00:35:56.679 --> 00:36:00.880
<v Speaker 1>of people and you're lucky if you can even figure

691
00:36:00.920 --> 00:36:05.079
<v Speaker 1>out that the guy next to you is on you

692
00:36:05.480 --> 00:36:07.000
<v Speaker 1>might as well just keep stabbing.

693
00:36:07.239 --> 00:36:11.039
<v Speaker 2>I also wonder if he's gonna you criticize the selective

694
00:36:11.119 --> 00:36:13.079
<v Speaker 2>use of silence in the Batman v.

695
00:36:13.159 --> 00:36:15.039
<v Speaker 1>Baane fight. Uh huh, I do like it.

696
00:36:15.079 --> 00:36:17.039
<v Speaker 2>I think it goes on for too long because we

697
00:36:17.119 --> 00:36:20.880
<v Speaker 2>have another selective use of silence in There's quite a

698
00:36:20.960 --> 00:36:23.400
<v Speaker 2>lengthy sequence where Tom Hardy's landing the plane on the

699
00:36:23.440 --> 00:36:26.360
<v Speaker 2>beach and he has to manually pump down the landing gear,

700
00:36:27.199 --> 00:36:30.840
<v Speaker 2>which I think is really a beautifully shot, really emotional

701
00:36:30.920 --> 00:36:34.119
<v Speaker 2>moment where he is resigning himself to his fate.

702
00:36:34.159 --> 00:36:35.679
<v Speaker 1>But he's so good at his job.

703
00:36:36.039 --> 00:36:38.159
<v Speaker 2>He and he he has accomplished this with such a

704
00:36:38.159 --> 00:36:42.639
<v Speaker 2>plumb he even lands perfectly with no fuel, and that

705
00:36:42.679 --> 00:36:45.960
<v Speaker 2>whole sequence is done in complete silence, And I wonder

706
00:36:46.000 --> 00:36:48.719
<v Speaker 2>if he's going to transpose that into some of the

707
00:36:48.840 --> 00:36:50.159
<v Speaker 2>Trojan war sequences.

708
00:36:50.920 --> 00:36:53.239
<v Speaker 1>A lot of this movie also was shot with natural light.

709
00:36:53.280 --> 00:36:55.280
<v Speaker 1>There's very few scenes that actually have film lighting in

710
00:36:55.280 --> 00:36:55.599
<v Speaker 1>this movie.

711
00:36:55.639 --> 00:36:57.599
<v Speaker 2>I would love to know which scenes have film lading.

712
00:36:57.599 --> 00:36:59.960
<v Speaker 1>Okay, I would imagine it's all the scenes inside the ship.

713
00:37:00.599 --> 00:37:02.320
<v Speaker 2>Oh, where you would need a film later there would

714
00:37:02.360 --> 00:37:04.239
<v Speaker 2>be you know what, I think you.

715
00:37:04.199 --> 00:37:09.119
<v Speaker 1>Might have nailed that. Yeah. There's also no women in

716
00:37:09.159 --> 00:37:11.880
<v Speaker 1>this entire world. There's a couple of there's no main women,

717
00:37:11.960 --> 00:37:12.519
<v Speaker 1>main characters.

718
00:37:12.559 --> 00:37:14.639
<v Speaker 2>Now, there's a couple of nurses who have about do life.

719
00:37:14.760 --> 00:37:18.400
<v Speaker 1>There's a couple of ladies. You know, let's let's just

720
00:37:18.440 --> 00:37:21.239
<v Speaker 1>get link. Is there is there an actor in this

721
00:37:21.320 --> 00:37:22.239
<v Speaker 1>that stands out to you?

722
00:37:23.639 --> 00:37:25.480
<v Speaker 2>I will say everyone is at the top of their game.

723
00:37:25.679 --> 00:37:26.239
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

724
00:37:26.360 --> 00:37:28.320
<v Speaker 2>I would say I definitely have a pick for who

725
00:37:28.360 --> 00:37:32.400
<v Speaker 2>I think is the worst actor in this. But that

726
00:37:32.480 --> 00:37:36.880
<v Speaker 2>being said, I don't think they're particularly bad. I think

727
00:37:38.199 --> 00:37:46.719
<v Speaker 2>best actor just for you, it's Mark Rylance. Mark Rylance

728
00:37:47.079 --> 00:37:52.400
<v Speaker 2>gives such a real and grounded performance, and there's a

729
00:37:52.480 --> 00:37:58.199
<v Speaker 2>couple real moments of empathy and emotion. He reveals that

730
00:37:58.800 --> 00:38:01.760
<v Speaker 2>you see one of his sons throughout the film, and

731
00:38:01.800 --> 00:38:04.760
<v Speaker 2>he reveals that he had another son who was in

732
00:38:04.800 --> 00:38:05.480
<v Speaker 2>the First.

733
00:38:05.239 --> 00:38:07.079
<v Speaker 1>World War who died no no, no.

734
00:38:07.119 --> 00:38:08.840
<v Speaker 2>Who sorry, he was in the Second World War who died.

735
00:38:08.880 --> 00:38:12.199
<v Speaker 1>He died in the first three months. That's right of war.

736
00:38:12.440 --> 00:38:17.920
<v Speaker 2>And and it's it's just a he just it's not

737
00:38:17.960 --> 00:38:20.480
<v Speaker 2>a very emotional performance, but you can feel the tidal

738
00:38:20.519 --> 00:38:23.760
<v Speaker 2>wave of emotion that he's holding back when he says

739
00:38:23.840 --> 00:38:28.360
<v Speaker 2>that I think Mark Rylance probably gives blow for blow

740
00:38:28.360 --> 00:38:30.480
<v Speaker 2>the best performance in this film. I also think Tom

741
00:38:30.519 --> 00:38:32.480
<v Speaker 2>Hardy it is just I think it's one of his

742
00:38:32.480 --> 00:38:34.800
<v Speaker 2>best roles. I think he's like phenomenal in this Is

743
00:38:34.800 --> 00:38:36.639
<v Speaker 2>there an actor for you who really stands out?

744
00:38:36.679 --> 00:38:37.920
<v Speaker 1>I mean I think it's Mark Rylance.

745
00:38:38.000 --> 00:38:38.199
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

746
00:38:38.280 --> 00:38:40.480
<v Speaker 1>I don't think there is a weak performance here. I

747
00:38:40.920 --> 00:38:44.280
<v Speaker 1>really don't, because, like I don't don't think there are

748
00:38:44.440 --> 00:38:50.159
<v Speaker 1>enough really scenes that there aren't really a lot of

749
00:38:50.199 --> 00:38:54.159
<v Speaker 1>moments where it would allow a weak performance to show out.

750
00:38:54.280 --> 00:38:58.079
<v Speaker 2>I just wish Tom Harry Styles knew that you don't

751
00:38:58.119 --> 00:39:00.760
<v Speaker 2>have to yell all of your lines to that you're angry.

752
00:39:00.880 --> 00:39:03.039
<v Speaker 1>Oh, it's interesting. I disagree with that completely. I think

753
00:39:03.039 --> 00:39:04.519
<v Speaker 1>Harry Styles is just fine in this movie.

754
00:39:04.599 --> 00:39:07.000
<v Speaker 2>I think he's fine, but I think he is not.

755
00:39:07.639 --> 00:39:09.480
<v Speaker 2>He's not, but I think compared to every I think

756
00:39:09.519 --> 00:39:11.880
<v Speaker 2>he is the worst actor in this movie. But I

757
00:39:11.880 --> 00:39:14.039
<v Speaker 2>think compared to everyone else, I think he's the weakest

758
00:39:14.039 --> 00:39:16.280
<v Speaker 2>one for sure. But I don't think he's bad. Yeah,

759
00:39:16.320 --> 00:39:19.760
<v Speaker 2>but he spends a lot of time yelling everybody out there.

760
00:39:19.800 --> 00:39:22.119
<v Speaker 2>If you want, you just shouts out there.

761
00:39:22.719 --> 00:39:24.760
<v Speaker 1>If you go to our Patreon Patreon dot com slash

762
00:39:24.760 --> 00:39:26.679
<v Speaker 1>Shahan and jw I I n we will record you know,

763
00:39:26.679 --> 00:39:28.960
<v Speaker 1>we record these episodes way ahead of time, way on

764
00:39:29.119 --> 00:39:31.800
<v Speaker 1>order and stuff like that. We're gonna be doing a

765
00:39:31.800 --> 00:39:35.719
<v Speaker 1>live reaction to the new Odyssey trailer that Christopher Nolan

766
00:39:35.800 --> 00:39:37.960
<v Speaker 1>has debut in the lay show. Now, if you're listening

767
00:39:38.000 --> 00:39:40.800
<v Speaker 1>to this at Dunkirk's airtime, you're like, wait a minute,

768
00:39:40.840 --> 00:39:42.920
<v Speaker 1>that trailer came out a month ago. Yeah, yeah, that's right.

769
00:39:43.159 --> 00:39:45.559
<v Speaker 1>So you're gonna go back in the feed and you're

770
00:39:45.559 --> 00:39:48.719
<v Speaker 1>gonna find that there's two GHL extras in a row.

771
00:39:48.800 --> 00:39:50.480
<v Speaker 1>We gave you. We gave you a bonus, and if

772
00:39:50.480 --> 00:39:52.159
<v Speaker 1>there's not a GHL extra this week, you can get over.

773
00:39:52.199 --> 00:39:54.519
<v Speaker 1>It's fine. Yeah, but uh, we wanted to be timely.

774
00:39:54.519 --> 00:39:56.840
<v Speaker 1>He wanted to be ahead of time. And there you go.

775
00:39:56.920 --> 00:39:58.719
<v Speaker 1>So head on over there, get that, Go over to

776
00:39:58.760 --> 00:40:01.119
<v Speaker 1>our exclusive discord, go over and listen to some bonus

777
00:40:01.159 --> 00:40:03.719
<v Speaker 1>episodes and stuff like that, and get our live reaction

778
00:40:03.800 --> 00:40:11.280
<v Speaker 1>on the Odyssey trailer. Ashley, beyond the film stuff, I

779
00:40:11.400 --> 00:40:16.599
<v Speaker 1>just really, what what other lessons do you think he

780
00:40:16.719 --> 00:40:21.119
<v Speaker 1>is taking from this movie on into the Odyssey.

781
00:40:21.559 --> 00:40:24.480
<v Speaker 2>I think we're gonna see I think we're seeing a

782
00:40:24.519 --> 00:40:28.320
<v Speaker 2>lot of how Odysseus is gonna be in this movie.

783
00:40:28.679 --> 00:40:31.480
<v Speaker 1>We expand that a little bit. So this is a

784
00:40:31.559 --> 00:40:31.920
<v Speaker 1>this is a.

785
00:40:31.920 --> 00:40:33.920
<v Speaker 2>Jason emanphrase that I'm gonna steal.

786
00:40:34.159 --> 00:40:37.519
<v Speaker 1>Okay know that you did this? Yeah?

787
00:40:37.920 --> 00:40:38.960
<v Speaker 2>Well maybe, don't you know?

788
00:40:39.320 --> 00:40:40.760
<v Speaker 1>Uh? Okay.

789
00:40:41.920 --> 00:40:45.800
<v Speaker 2>Odysseus is the greatest war vet He's.

790
00:40:45.679 --> 00:40:47.480
<v Speaker 1>The greatest war veteran. He's the most famous war veteran

791
00:40:47.519 --> 00:40:49.119
<v Speaker 1>of all. Yeah.

792
00:40:49.559 --> 00:40:55.559
<v Speaker 2>And I think looking at how these characters, like this

793
00:40:55.639 --> 00:41:00.119
<v Speaker 2>is a movie of trauma. Everyone's trauma is relative, well,

794
00:41:01.039 --> 00:41:03.800
<v Speaker 2>it's active, well even down to like Peter who is

795
00:41:03.960 --> 00:41:07.440
<v Speaker 2>watching Lance's son, who watches his friend die in front

796
00:41:07.440 --> 00:41:09.760
<v Speaker 2>of him as they are trying to save people's lives, right, Like,

797
00:41:09.800 --> 00:41:13.400
<v Speaker 2>everyone is at a different point in their grief process.

798
00:41:14.320 --> 00:41:17.360
<v Speaker 2>And I think we're going to see a lot of

799
00:41:17.400 --> 00:41:22.639
<v Speaker 2>that transposed onto Odysseus specifically, but the other characters throughout

800
00:41:23.000 --> 00:41:25.719
<v Speaker 2>the odyssey. I think the behavior of those characters is

801
00:41:25.719 --> 00:41:28.480
<v Speaker 2>going to be closer to the characters in Dunkirk than

802
00:41:28.519 --> 00:41:32.119
<v Speaker 2>in any of the other Nolan than like Arthur an

803
00:41:32.159 --> 00:41:36.880
<v Speaker 2>Inception or Batman or whatever, even though all of Nolan's

804
00:41:36.960 --> 00:41:39.920
<v Speaker 2>characters do carry a trauma. Again, he loves a dead wife,

805
00:41:40.039 --> 00:41:41.960
<v Speaker 2>loves a dead wife or a dead girlfriend.

806
00:41:43.519 --> 00:41:45.159
<v Speaker 1>How's he gonna get around that in the aud's no

807
00:41:45.199 --> 00:41:46.000
<v Speaker 1>dead wife in the aut.

808
00:41:46.199 --> 00:41:50.800
<v Speaker 2>Well, there's the dead husbands in the Yeah warm, Yeah,

809
00:41:50.840 --> 00:41:53.440
<v Speaker 2>exactly that take that. Yeah, this is gonna be this

810
00:41:53.519 --> 00:41:54.599
<v Speaker 2>real feminist term to.

811
00:41:54.599 --> 00:41:57.599
<v Speaker 1>Get around that. Nolan, He's like, they all.

812
00:41:57.440 --> 00:42:01.800
<v Speaker 2>Make it back. Fine. I think he's definitely going to

813
00:42:01.880 --> 00:42:03.320
<v Speaker 2>take that. I think, like I said, I think he's

814
00:42:03.360 --> 00:42:08.440
<v Speaker 2>gonna take the selective use of silence. I also think,

815
00:42:08.480 --> 00:42:10.079
<v Speaker 2>and you and I have sort of touched on this

816
00:42:10.119 --> 00:42:12.800
<v Speaker 2>in various theories add nauseum here in Nolan Club. But

817
00:42:12.880 --> 00:42:17.920
<v Speaker 2>I think we're gonna get the criss crossy timelines. And

818
00:42:17.960 --> 00:42:21.280
<v Speaker 2>I don't know if it's gonna be the one hour,

819
00:42:21.480 --> 00:42:23.840
<v Speaker 2>one day, one week, but I think it's gonna be.

820
00:42:24.039 --> 00:42:26.320
<v Speaker 2>I think it's gonna be not dissimilar to this.

821
00:42:26.519 --> 00:42:29.039
<v Speaker 1>Actually, I think you're exactly right. I think the biggest

822
00:42:29.039 --> 00:42:32.039
<v Speaker 1>thing is is that I have a feeling that the

823
00:42:32.199 --> 00:42:36.039
<v Speaker 1>editing style of this movie, yeah, is the editing of

824
00:42:36.079 --> 00:42:36.599
<v Speaker 1>the Odyssey.

825
00:42:36.760 --> 00:42:39.320
<v Speaker 2>Like, if it's the exact thing, then the one hour

826
00:42:39.360 --> 00:42:42.679
<v Speaker 2>will be the Telemachus storyline, the one day will be

827
00:42:42.760 --> 00:42:44.920
<v Speaker 2>him washing up on Ithaca, and the one.

828
00:42:44.800 --> 00:42:46.320
<v Speaker 1>Week will be his journey back.

829
00:42:47.480 --> 00:42:50.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, it'll be it'll be like some version of.

830
00:42:50.199 --> 00:42:53.400
<v Speaker 1>That, and he will. Like in this movie, there's several

831
00:42:53.440 --> 00:42:56.320
<v Speaker 1>points where we hop into the other storyline. Yeah, and

832
00:42:56.360 --> 00:42:58.760
<v Speaker 1>sometimes just the way the editing is, you don't really

833
00:42:58.800 --> 00:43:01.480
<v Speaker 1>realize that you have, yeah, like teke you a couple

834
00:43:01.519 --> 00:43:03.400
<v Speaker 1>of character or like a piece.

835
00:43:03.199 --> 00:43:04.360
<v Speaker 2>Of dialogue, lets you know.

836
00:43:04.519 --> 00:43:05.039
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

837
00:43:05.119 --> 00:43:09.840
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there's no like subtitles being like ten am Tuesday, or.

838
00:43:09.760 --> 00:43:14.199
<v Speaker 1>Even clear visual distinct like like shooting and collar versus

839
00:43:14.199 --> 00:43:15.440
<v Speaker 1>black and white. Yeah.

840
00:43:15.519 --> 00:43:19.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like like oh look now we're in the snowbass,

841
00:43:19.320 --> 00:43:21.400
<v Speaker 2>so we're definitely one more level down.

842
00:43:21.559 --> 00:43:25.119
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, an inception. All right, So really quickly before

843
00:43:25.159 --> 00:43:27.360
<v Speaker 1>we get to our ratings here, I want to ask

844
00:43:27.400 --> 00:43:29.239
<v Speaker 1>you Ashley that there's something you told me before this

845
00:43:29.320 --> 00:43:33.440
<v Speaker 1>podcast is so you told me about how this movie

846
00:43:33.480 --> 00:43:35.599
<v Speaker 1>sort of connected to a thing from Black Hawk down

847
00:43:35.639 --> 00:43:35.880
<v Speaker 1>for you.

848
00:43:36.280 --> 00:43:41.239
<v Speaker 2>Oh yeah, yeah, You're going to save this, yeah until

849
00:43:41.400 --> 00:43:44.679
<v Speaker 2>after our messages and we'll be right back after this.

850
00:43:46.280 --> 00:43:51.480
<v Speaker 1>GHL, We're back talking about No End Club. Dunkirk is here.

851
00:43:52.119 --> 00:43:53.519
<v Speaker 2>Great soundtrack, by the way.

852
00:43:53.400 --> 00:43:58.199
<v Speaker 1>Dunkirk might be the most like the Odyssey that we've

853
00:43:58.199 --> 00:44:02.519
<v Speaker 1>ever predicted. Yeah. Actually, talking about other war movies, an

854
00:44:02.559 --> 00:44:04.480
<v Speaker 1>old favorite of mine is Black Hawk down. It's a

855
00:44:04.519 --> 00:44:06.280
<v Speaker 1>very movie that makes me very emotional. I think it's

856
00:44:06.280 --> 00:44:08.199
<v Speaker 1>one of the best war movies ever made. And when

857
00:44:08.280 --> 00:44:10.280
<v Speaker 1>after we watched this, actually you said that there was

858
00:44:10.320 --> 00:44:11.880
<v Speaker 1>a piece of black Hawk down or it was a

859
00:44:11.880 --> 00:44:15.239
<v Speaker 1>piece of Dunkirk that reminds me connected to back down somehow,

860
00:44:15.519 --> 00:44:16.840
<v Speaker 1>and you said you were like, I will tell you

861
00:44:16.920 --> 00:44:19.360
<v Speaker 1>on the podcast. Well, if you're on the podcast, time

862
00:44:19.480 --> 00:44:19.840
<v Speaker 1>is now.

863
00:44:20.000 --> 00:44:22.840
<v Speaker 2>The thing that Jason is not struggle with is we

864
00:44:22.880 --> 00:44:25.760
<v Speaker 2>watch the films and then because we're yappers, I know, shockers,

865
00:44:25.800 --> 00:44:27.559
<v Speaker 2>two people who have done a podcast for twelve years,

866
00:44:28.320 --> 00:44:29.599
<v Speaker 2>we want to talk about it right away.

867
00:44:29.679 --> 00:44:30.039
<v Speaker 1>M hmm.

868
00:44:30.360 --> 00:44:31.840
<v Speaker 2>And I often have these thoughts that I'm like, i

869
00:44:31.840 --> 00:44:33.920
<v Speaker 2>should just say this for the podcast so that I'm

870
00:44:33.960 --> 00:44:35.639
<v Speaker 2>not repeating myself and you can have like a more

871
00:44:35.679 --> 00:44:38.480
<v Speaker 2>authentic reaction to it. So, you know, as I was

872
00:44:38.679 --> 00:44:42.480
<v Speaker 2>weeping in the last twenty minutes, So this film, I'm

873
00:44:42.480 --> 00:44:49.800
<v Speaker 2>a real mark for any war movie because obviously my

874
00:44:50.000 --> 00:44:54.119
<v Speaker 2>dad was an officer, you were a soldier. It makes

875
00:44:54.159 --> 00:44:56.239
<v Speaker 2>me like real, it makes me real sad to think

876
00:44:56.239 --> 00:44:59.199
<v Speaker 2>about those things happening to people that I care about,

877
00:44:59.239 --> 00:45:03.039
<v Speaker 2>like you know, because I have basic human empathy, so

878
00:45:03.280 --> 00:45:04.960
<v Speaker 2>I watched Black Hawk Down with you for the first

879
00:45:04.960 --> 00:45:07.079
<v Speaker 2>time because I never I'd never seen it before. And

880
00:45:07.679 --> 00:45:08.480
<v Speaker 2>the scene in Black.

881
00:45:08.320 --> 00:45:11.119
<v Speaker 1>House also starring Tom Hardy, yeah, very.

882
00:45:11.000 --> 00:45:14.719
<v Speaker 2>Young Darry also starring out of Prince Hector Abanas in

883
00:45:15.000 --> 00:45:17.559
<v Speaker 2>this well and also Prince Paris because Orlando Bloom is in.

884
00:45:17.599 --> 00:45:19.000
<v Speaker 1>That as well. Just to tie it all back to

885
00:45:19.039 --> 00:45:21.719
<v Speaker 1>the odysty for you, uh uh.

886
00:45:22.760 --> 00:45:26.400
<v Speaker 2>The scene that makes me cry and that is when

887
00:45:26.440 --> 00:45:29.360
<v Speaker 2>the helicopter goes down. I know one of the one

888
00:45:29.400 --> 00:45:31.760
<v Speaker 2>of the actors in that scene is Jamie Costerwaldo of

889
00:45:31.800 --> 00:45:32.840
<v Speaker 2>Game of Thrones.

890
00:45:32.519 --> 00:45:34.880
<v Speaker 1>Fame, and I'm Michael Bean I think.

891
00:45:34.760 --> 00:45:36.639
<v Speaker 2>And one of the one of them is injured and

892
00:45:36.679 --> 00:45:40.119
<v Speaker 2>so the other two guys decide to stay with him

893
00:45:40.159 --> 00:45:42.199
<v Speaker 2>and then spoiler alert, they all die because that is

894
00:45:42.239 --> 00:45:43.199
<v Speaker 2>what happens, because it's.

895
00:45:43.119 --> 00:45:44.800
<v Speaker 1>Based on a real hohistorical event, just like just like

896
00:45:45.199 --> 00:45:46.039
<v Speaker 1>Kirk exactly.

897
00:45:47.000 --> 00:45:49.440
<v Speaker 2>And I just think it is I'm gonna get emotional

898
00:45:49.519 --> 00:45:51.760
<v Speaker 2>talking about this. I just think it is like such

899
00:45:51.760 --> 00:45:55.280
<v Speaker 2>a brave thing to do that for you know, your

900
00:45:55.280 --> 00:45:57.639
<v Speaker 2>brother in arms or however you want to think about that.

901
00:45:57.719 --> 00:45:59.719
<v Speaker 1>And do you feel the same about Tom Hardy?

902
00:45:59.239 --> 00:46:02.559
<v Speaker 2>I like, it's why it makes me cry, and like

903
00:46:02.599 --> 00:46:04.639
<v Speaker 2>watching him land on the beach and I'm just like,

904
00:46:05.960 --> 00:46:08.159
<v Speaker 2>I could never do that, and I just think it

905
00:46:08.239 --> 00:46:10.760
<v Speaker 2>is like this incredible. I think it's like such a

906
00:46:10.800 --> 00:46:13.000
<v Speaker 2>beautiful act of bravery and humanity.

907
00:46:13.079 --> 00:46:16.039
<v Speaker 1>I'm so sorry that I'm getting emotion fun on it.

908
00:46:16.920 --> 00:46:20.239
<v Speaker 2>I don't think I've ever like cried cry all the

909
00:46:20.239 --> 00:46:24.159
<v Speaker 2>podcast before, but it just it just.

910
00:46:24.119 --> 00:46:24.960
<v Speaker 1>Really gets to me.

911
00:46:25.039 --> 00:46:29.079
<v Speaker 2>And I don't I don't know if that's because I

912
00:46:29.119 --> 00:46:30.480
<v Speaker 2>know I couldn't do that and I would just be

913
00:46:30.519 --> 00:46:32.599
<v Speaker 2>a coward. I don't know if that's like again my

914
00:46:32.599 --> 00:46:36.360
<v Speaker 2>my personal relationship to people in the military, but like,

915
00:46:37.440 --> 00:46:39.480
<v Speaker 2>I think it is just such like a beautiful, brave,

916
00:46:40.079 --> 00:46:43.760
<v Speaker 2>unimaginable thing to do, to just be that selfless, and

917
00:46:43.840 --> 00:46:47.800
<v Speaker 2>it's so beautifully filmed in this movie that like even

918
00:46:47.840 --> 00:46:51.320
<v Speaker 2>though it's obviously like horrific and petrifying, and then you

919
00:46:51.800 --> 00:46:55.400
<v Speaker 2>had the gall to be like and he's a probably

920
00:46:55.480 --> 00:46:58.039
<v Speaker 2>doesn't survive. I was like, don't.

921
00:46:57.840 --> 00:47:00.880
<v Speaker 1>Say that about I don't think I said he probably

922
00:47:00.880 --> 00:47:04.440
<v Speaker 1>doesn't survive, Like he's definitely best. He's a p O

923
00:47:04.559 --> 00:47:07.599
<v Speaker 1>W right, you know, best if they don't shoot him,

924
00:47:07.639 --> 00:47:08.239
<v Speaker 1>that's what I mean.

925
00:47:08.480 --> 00:47:10.320
<v Speaker 2>Or yeah, if they don't like, we don't see it

926
00:47:10.400 --> 00:47:12.000
<v Speaker 2>because he's not a real person. But we don't see

927
00:47:12.000 --> 00:47:13.400
<v Speaker 2>that in the film, right, We just see them kind

928
00:47:13.400 --> 00:47:13.920
<v Speaker 2>of come up on it.

929
00:47:14.039 --> 00:47:17.400
<v Speaker 1>More than likely he goes to war a prisoner of war.

930
00:47:17.599 --> 00:47:20.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, but it just it really reminded me of that

931
00:47:20.320 --> 00:47:22.920
<v Speaker 2>moment in Black Hawk Down because I just think it's

932
00:47:22.960 --> 00:47:24.960
<v Speaker 2>like the bravest thing you and the most selfless thing

933
00:47:25.000 --> 00:47:29.880
<v Speaker 2>that you can do in that circumstance. It just makes

934
00:47:29.880 --> 00:47:34.440
<v Speaker 2>me really emotional. So sorry everyone to cry. You know,

935
00:47:34.599 --> 00:47:37.159
<v Speaker 2>it's a thing where you know, but I think that

936
00:47:37.280 --> 00:47:38.719
<v Speaker 2>speaks to why this is a great This is the

937
00:47:38.719 --> 00:47:40.880
<v Speaker 2>only Christopher Nolan movie that makes me cry.

938
00:47:41.079 --> 00:47:47.679
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I haven't seen The Odyssey yet. You're gonna make

939
00:47:47.760 --> 00:47:48.920
<v Speaker 1>a ball.

940
00:47:48.960 --> 00:47:51.039
<v Speaker 2>You know what, Bill Irwin deserves to make me cry,

941
00:47:51.079 --> 00:47:52.519
<v Speaker 2>because that man is a genius. You know.

942
00:47:53.119 --> 00:47:55.159
<v Speaker 1>If there's any if there's any movie that we've already

943
00:47:55.159 --> 00:47:58.239
<v Speaker 1>talked about on Geekish Lesson, it should be this one.

944
00:47:58.280 --> 00:48:00.079
<v Speaker 1>And thank you for being vulnerable and sharing me that

945
00:48:00.199 --> 00:48:03.440
<v Speaker 1>moment and everybody emotions are great And don't make fun

946
00:48:03.480 --> 00:48:07.639
<v Speaker 1>of Ashley or I'll come beat you up. But you know,

947
00:48:08.599 --> 00:48:11.360
<v Speaker 1>the thing I think works about that is that you know.

948
00:48:12.639 --> 00:48:14.280
<v Speaker 1>It's the thing I said to you we watched this movie,

949
00:48:14.320 --> 00:48:17.840
<v Speaker 1>is that War two might be one of the last

950
00:48:17.880 --> 00:48:21.760
<v Speaker 1>conflicts in our history where we actually thought there were

951
00:48:21.800 --> 00:48:25.639
<v Speaker 1>good guys and bad guys, because the real answer is

952
00:48:25.639 --> 00:48:27.280
<v Speaker 1>is that there are new good guys or bad guys

953
00:48:27.320 --> 00:48:29.199
<v Speaker 1>in any war. Yeah, you said that at the beginning.

954
00:48:29.400 --> 00:48:32.079
<v Speaker 1>Everybody is wrong. Yeah, because honestly, war is one of

955
00:48:32.119 --> 00:48:33.519
<v Speaker 1>those stupidest things we could ever do.

956
00:48:33.679 --> 00:48:36.239
<v Speaker 2>Ye, we don't need to solve our problems like that exactly.

957
00:48:36.599 --> 00:48:43.840
<v Speaker 1>And it is that thing where you know, the Germans

958
00:48:43.840 --> 00:48:50.199
<v Speaker 1>in those planes are just as good of guys as

959
00:48:50.239 --> 00:48:53.679
<v Speaker 1>Tom Hardy. They are also people protecting their homewands.

960
00:48:53.360 --> 00:48:55.400
<v Speaker 2>Doing the best that they can, trying to keep their

961
00:48:55.440 --> 00:48:56.199
<v Speaker 2>families alive.

962
00:48:56.280 --> 00:48:59.679
<v Speaker 1>It's also wipe, I'm wiping aside the Hitler stuff. We

963
00:48:59.719 --> 00:49:02.000
<v Speaker 1>all know the Hitler was a pretty bad guy. But

964
00:49:02.159 --> 00:49:05.000
<v Speaker 1>also you have to realize that, like on every side,

965
00:49:05.039 --> 00:49:08.840
<v Speaker 1>there's always a soldier that is doing it to defend

966
00:49:08.880 --> 00:49:12.119
<v Speaker 1>their home. So there were also German soldiers. And I

967
00:49:12.119 --> 00:49:16.800
<v Speaker 1>also know as well that falling orders is not a defense.

968
00:49:17.360 --> 00:49:19.280
<v Speaker 1>It has been proven in many war crimes. But anyways,

969
00:49:22.039 --> 00:49:24.079
<v Speaker 1>I think the reason why the Tom Hardy moment connects

970
00:49:24.119 --> 00:49:28.079
<v Speaker 1>with you is just because we want to assume that

971
00:49:28.239 --> 00:49:31.760
<v Speaker 1>in wars, and we've seen this in moments of history

972
00:49:32.719 --> 00:49:38.559
<v Speaker 1>time and time again, where that is a person putting

973
00:49:38.599 --> 00:49:45.480
<v Speaker 1>the welfare of the group above themselves. It is where

974
00:49:46.800 --> 00:49:50.639
<v Speaker 1>the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the one. Yeah,

975
00:49:51.559 --> 00:49:55.719
<v Speaker 1>and it's rare when we see a person commit to that. Yeah.

976
00:49:55.880 --> 00:49:58.159
<v Speaker 2>It reminds me to bring up another great or movie

977
00:49:58.440 --> 00:50:03.400
<v Speaker 2>of Desmond Doss in Hexa Rich Yeah, yeah, where you're like,

978
00:50:03.400 --> 00:50:04.760
<v Speaker 2>what a perfect expression of.

979
00:50:04.800 --> 00:50:07.960
<v Speaker 1>And and he did that without a weapon. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

980
00:50:08.199 --> 00:50:09.280
<v Speaker 1>and that's a real event too.

981
00:50:09.360 --> 00:50:12.159
<v Speaker 2>And I think that that is when we think of

982
00:50:12.199 --> 00:50:14.960
<v Speaker 2>the idea that there is glory and heroism and war

983
00:50:15.119 --> 00:50:17.400
<v Speaker 2>that I think that's what I think, that's what we're

984
00:50:17.440 --> 00:50:20.760
<v Speaker 2>all imagining, Yeah, is being able to do something like that.

985
00:50:21.320 --> 00:50:23.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you know, so I'm glad that that moment really,

986
00:50:24.119 --> 00:50:25.039
<v Speaker 1>it does, it does.

987
00:50:25.880 --> 00:50:27.599
<v Speaker 2>It's a great actor in a great movie.

988
00:50:28.039 --> 00:50:33.039
<v Speaker 1>Let's get to Yeah. The Nolan Club rating here of

989
00:50:33.239 --> 00:50:37.800
<v Speaker 1>Dunkirk based on a scale of one to five, where

990
00:50:37.840 --> 00:50:41.800
<v Speaker 1>would you put Dunkirks being the best one being the worst?

991
00:50:41.880 --> 00:50:45.840
<v Speaker 1>I mean it's a five, you know.

992
00:50:46.039 --> 00:50:48.840
<v Speaker 2>I'm we'll talk about this when we whenever we redo

993
00:50:48.840 --> 00:50:51.679
<v Speaker 2>our rankings, probably probably during the last Nolan Club.

994
00:50:54.079 --> 00:50:56.920
<v Speaker 1>This movie is not a fun movie, but.

995
00:50:57.000 --> 00:51:02.239
<v Speaker 2>I think objectively, for me, this might be his best movie. Again,

996
00:51:02.280 --> 00:51:07.599
<v Speaker 2>it draws the strongest emotional reaction from me, and that

997
00:51:07.719 --> 00:51:10.320
<v Speaker 2>is sort of how I judge the quality of things.

998
00:51:10.960 --> 00:51:13.400
<v Speaker 2>I think. I just think this movie's phenomenal from start

999
00:51:13.440 --> 00:51:17.559
<v Speaker 2>to finish. Even when I think Harry Styles is yelling

1000
00:51:17.599 --> 00:51:19.480
<v Speaker 2>a bit too much, I can forgive it.

1001
00:51:19.519 --> 00:51:22.639
<v Speaker 1>I think it's so I think it's so interesting you

1002
00:51:22.679 --> 00:51:24.679
<v Speaker 1>focused on Harry Harry Styles because I don't think he's

1003
00:51:24.679 --> 00:51:25.960
<v Speaker 1>anywhere near as bad as you think.

1004
00:51:26.440 --> 00:51:28.880
<v Speaker 2>I don't think he's bad, but I think he's definitely

1005
00:51:28.960 --> 00:51:32.679
<v Speaker 2>the worst actor in this film. Jason, one out of

1006
00:51:32.719 --> 00:51:36.400
<v Speaker 2>five bregos. How many bregos are you giving? Dunkirk?

1007
00:51:37.320 --> 00:51:40.239
<v Speaker 1>So fun to say this has definitely gone up in

1008
00:51:40.239 --> 00:51:40.880
<v Speaker 1>my estimation.

1009
00:51:41.000 --> 00:51:44.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, yeah, which is fair. And you're also your opinions

1010
00:51:44.039 --> 00:51:45.079
<v Speaker 2>are allowed to change.

1011
00:51:45.199 --> 00:51:49.159
<v Speaker 1>Yes, imagine that, Yes, in your appreciation of media and

1012
00:51:49.199 --> 00:51:51.920
<v Speaker 1>stuff like that. I think I think this is a

1013
00:51:52.000 --> 00:51:55.239
<v Speaker 1>solid four. I don't think it's a perfect movie.

1014
00:51:55.280 --> 00:51:59.079
<v Speaker 2>What keeps it from being a five for you? And

1015
00:51:59.119 --> 00:52:01.400
<v Speaker 2>you could not have an ant, sir, that's that's completely funny.

1016
00:52:01.440 --> 00:52:04.559
<v Speaker 1>The dryness of it. It is dry because it is

1017
00:52:04.639 --> 00:52:08.320
<v Speaker 1>specifically that it feels more like a documentary than a film.

1018
00:52:08.639 --> 00:52:13.920
<v Speaker 1>That is it. I think you know, and I here's

1019
00:52:13.960 --> 00:52:17.199
<v Speaker 1>the thing. I don't think Nolan is the director to

1020
00:52:17.400 --> 00:52:20.800
<v Speaker 1>do this. But if you take the same movie, the

1021
00:52:20.880 --> 00:52:24.719
<v Speaker 1>same plotlines, the same structure, give it a just like

1022
00:52:24.719 --> 00:52:27.360
<v Speaker 1>I talked about with The Bane and Batman Flight, give

1023
00:52:27.360 --> 00:52:30.199
<v Speaker 1>it a bit of dramatic flair, and I think you

1024
00:52:30.239 --> 00:52:32.519
<v Speaker 1>have a perfect five. I think you might have one

1025
00:52:32.519 --> 00:52:35.840
<v Speaker 1>of the greatest movies I've ever seen because you didn't

1026
00:52:35.880 --> 00:52:38.000
<v Speaker 1>do that. I think it's a four. He's not an

1027
00:52:38.039 --> 00:52:41.920
<v Speaker 1>emotional director. He's not. He is not. He is a technical,

1028
00:52:42.280 --> 00:52:46.400
<v Speaker 1>is a tactician, scientific director, and he's very good at it.

1029
00:52:47.239 --> 00:52:49.400
<v Speaker 1>And I and I it's it's it's the whole reason

1030
00:52:49.400 --> 00:52:51.159
<v Speaker 1>why I was like, we need to do Nolan Club

1031
00:52:51.159 --> 00:52:54.800
<v Speaker 1>because again, the Odyssey is still an odd choice for

1032
00:52:54.880 --> 00:52:57.159
<v Speaker 1>Christopher Nolan well.

1033
00:52:56.800 --> 00:53:00.320
<v Speaker 2>For numerous reasons. And don't worry, friends, we're brewing. We're

1034
00:53:00.360 --> 00:53:03.239
<v Speaker 2>ruting some honesty stuff that's not just the movie for you.

1035
00:53:04.880 --> 00:53:08.199
<v Speaker 2>First of all, the Odyssey is poetry, and the Odyssey

1036
00:53:08.679 --> 00:53:13.079
<v Speaker 2>and the Iliad Against and the Aenea are very very

1037
00:53:13.119 --> 00:53:16.800
<v Speaker 2>deeply emotional stories, deeply deeply deeply emotions.

1038
00:53:16.360 --> 00:53:19.679
<v Speaker 1>And they're fantasy, and fantasy is not you know again,

1039
00:53:19.880 --> 00:53:22.360
<v Speaker 1>like this is his I'm excited. I'm excited to see

1040
00:53:22.440 --> 00:53:26.719
<v Speaker 1>this is his strength. No, I remember, I remember because

1041
00:53:26.719 --> 00:53:29.039
<v Speaker 1>you know, when we can't even feel this in the podcast, like,

1042
00:53:29.079 --> 00:53:31.119
<v Speaker 1>you know, we talked about Darknight Rises and the problems, right,

1043
00:53:31.480 --> 00:53:34.079
<v Speaker 1>and we've talked about Interstellar the problems that we had

1044
00:53:34.079 --> 00:53:37.159
<v Speaker 1>with it, and and it is this thing where it's

1045
00:53:37.199 --> 00:53:41.679
<v Speaker 1>just like the technical parts of both of those movies

1046
00:53:41.760 --> 00:53:43.400
<v Speaker 1>are freaking amazing.

1047
00:53:43.559 --> 00:53:45.760
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, those movies aren't bad movies, which is why I

1048
00:53:45.800 --> 00:53:48.760
<v Speaker 2>think we sort of feel frustration because we're like, you're

1049
00:53:48.960 --> 00:53:50.679
<v Speaker 2>so close to getting there.

1050
00:53:50.760 --> 00:53:55.159
<v Speaker 1>But the emotional moments are not quite Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

1051
00:53:55.800 --> 00:53:59.639
<v Speaker 1>And it's interesting because I remember walking away from this

1052
00:53:59.639 --> 00:54:04.000
<v Speaker 1>movie that theaters and thinking like, oh wow, if Christopher

1053
00:54:04.039 --> 00:54:08.840
<v Speaker 1>Nolan sort of just becomes I'm gonna tell stories about

1054
00:54:08.920 --> 00:54:13.360
<v Speaker 1>real people and in sort of my style, I'm in

1055
00:54:13.920 --> 00:54:16.079
<v Speaker 1>Because again, I think Dunkirk is a solid four movie.

1056
00:54:16.119 --> 00:54:17.760
<v Speaker 1>And I also say that, you know, because we have

1057
00:54:17.800 --> 00:54:18.840
<v Speaker 1>an upcoming one as well.

1058
00:54:18.960 --> 00:54:19.199
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

1059
00:54:19.360 --> 00:54:22.159
<v Speaker 1>I think Oppenheimer is a solid movie. I really think

1060
00:54:22.159 --> 00:54:24.599
<v Speaker 1>Oppenheimer's a solid movie, you know, so like it is,

1061
00:54:25.159 --> 00:54:29.079
<v Speaker 1>it's interesting where I wonder I'm very curious to know

1062
00:54:29.360 --> 00:54:32.079
<v Speaker 1>what he's going to do after the Odyssey. Like I'm

1063
00:54:32.119 --> 00:54:34.039
<v Speaker 1>wondering because like he's sort of I'm like, is he

1064
00:54:34.119 --> 00:54:36.519
<v Speaker 1>going to continue this trend where like, is the next

1065
00:54:36.559 --> 00:54:40.320
<v Speaker 1>movie after the Odyssey going to be a historical non

1066
00:54:40.400 --> 00:54:44.000
<v Speaker 1>fiction movie again? Because he's done that, He's done, He's

1067
00:54:44.000 --> 00:54:48.960
<v Speaker 1>a We've done Dunkirk Tennant Oppenheimer Odyssey. The Odyssey is

1068
00:54:48.960 --> 00:54:52.000
<v Speaker 1>not nonfiction. Oppenheimer is a noth Oh.

1069
00:54:51.920 --> 00:54:54.559
<v Speaker 2>Sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry sorry. Well,

1070
00:54:54.639 --> 00:54:57.599
<v Speaker 2>it'll be interested if he gets beaten over the head

1071
00:54:57.599 --> 00:54:59.440
<v Speaker 2>to do to the Iliad.

1072
00:54:59.559 --> 00:55:02.400
<v Speaker 1>I don't think he'll do it, Nolan. I here's my thing.

1073
00:55:02.920 --> 00:55:05.559
<v Speaker 1>I think The Dark Knight Rises has cured no one

1074
00:55:05.639 --> 00:55:06.760
<v Speaker 1>of ever doing a sequel. Ever.

1075
00:55:06.800 --> 00:55:12.119
<v Speaker 2>Again, he didn't technically a prequel. He didn't what the

1076
00:55:12.119 --> 00:55:13.679
<v Speaker 2>Iliad comes before the Odyssey.

1077
00:55:13.800 --> 00:55:15.360
<v Speaker 1>Oh. I was like, I thought you were saying the

1078
00:55:15.440 --> 00:55:20.000
<v Speaker 1>Dark Knight Rises. Oh no, no, no, no about yeah.

1079
00:55:20.079 --> 00:55:22.199
<v Speaker 2>Remember when Batman fought Made and he broke his.

1080
00:55:22.199 --> 00:55:28.639
<v Speaker 1>Back beforeman begins. No, I you know, like I think

1081
00:55:28.880 --> 00:55:30.719
<v Speaker 1>because he did not want to do The Dark I

1082
00:55:30.719 --> 00:55:32.480
<v Speaker 1>hear you, I hear I don't think. I don't think

1083
00:55:32.519 --> 00:55:34.880
<v Speaker 1>we'll ever catch Christoph Noland doing a sequel ever again.

1084
00:55:34.960 --> 00:55:35.440
<v Speaker 2>Probably not.

1085
00:55:35.800 --> 00:55:38.719
<v Speaker 1>So I'm very curious where I'm like, Okay, what is

1086
00:55:38.719 --> 00:55:41.840
<v Speaker 1>he going to announce a historical nons I hear you, Yeah,

1087
00:55:42.159 --> 00:55:44.679
<v Speaker 1>and what what and what probably said during World War Two? Again?

1088
00:55:45.000 --> 00:55:48.960
<v Speaker 1>You know, like what is his next World War two

1089
00:55:49.000 --> 00:55:51.320
<v Speaker 1>movie gonna be? Or is he finally going to move

1090
00:55:51.360 --> 00:55:53.800
<v Speaker 1>into the Korean War? You know? Or are we going

1091
00:55:53.840 --> 00:55:55.679
<v Speaker 1>to get the Christopher Nolan Vietnam movie?

1092
00:55:55.960 --> 00:55:56.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

1093
00:55:56.480 --> 00:55:59.320
<v Speaker 1>You know, like what what is his you know? Well

1094
00:55:59.360 --> 00:55:59.920
<v Speaker 1>or what do you go for?

1095
00:56:00.000 --> 00:56:02.920
<v Speaker 2>The back? Like he's an Englishman, so yeah, somewhere in

1096
00:56:02.960 --> 00:56:04.199
<v Speaker 2>English history, right.

1097
00:56:04.400 --> 00:56:06.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, like I don't know, you know, like here's the

1098
00:56:06.400 --> 00:56:12.800
<v Speaker 1>crazy thing. What would Christopher Nolan American Revolution movie look like?

1099
00:56:13.559 --> 00:56:17.400
<v Speaker 1>Or no thinking about this, no, Christopher Nolan, Okay, here's

1100
00:56:17.400 --> 00:56:21.159
<v Speaker 1>the thing, help me out with this event? Sure? What

1101
00:56:21.320 --> 00:56:25.199
<v Speaker 1>was the historical event where the Spanish Armada came over

1102
00:56:25.239 --> 00:56:27.519
<v Speaker 1>to England? Yeah? That had just been and they burn

1103
00:56:27.559 --> 00:56:29.840
<v Speaker 1>all the ships with Queen Elizabeth. Yeah, yes, I will

1104
00:56:29.880 --> 00:56:31.079
<v Speaker 1>imagine Christopher Nolan doing that.

1105
00:56:31.320 --> 00:56:33.679
<v Speaker 2>Imagine him doing the Battle Lagenore, which was supposed to

1106
00:56:33.719 --> 00:56:35.760
<v Speaker 2>be the final battle between England.

1107
00:56:35.440 --> 00:56:38.400
<v Speaker 1>And the Battle of Hayes. Theats the battle, Yeah, like

1108
00:56:38.519 --> 00:56:41.039
<v Speaker 1>is the ad? Is the honesty? Christopher Noland? Like buckling

1109
00:56:41.119 --> 00:56:42.159
<v Speaker 1>up for the Battle of Hastings.

1110
00:56:42.239 --> 00:56:44.320
<v Speaker 2>Honestly, he screw it. Just give him Henry the fourth,

1111
00:56:46.079 --> 00:56:48.719
<v Speaker 2>Henry the fifth, give him, give him the sat give

1112
00:56:48.719 --> 00:56:50.239
<v Speaker 2>me the same Chrispin's Day speech.

1113
00:56:51.039 --> 00:56:52.280
<v Speaker 1>Let's do it well.

1114
00:56:52.239 --> 00:56:54.760
<v Speaker 2>Do do the tutors and give me the big fat.

1115
00:56:54.559 --> 00:56:57.480
<v Speaker 1>Henry the eighth. I deserve. Okay, So here's the okay. Yeah,

1116
00:56:57.480 --> 00:57:01.320
<v Speaker 1>because okay, let's go down that route. Yeah. No. One

1117
00:57:01.880 --> 00:57:05.280
<v Speaker 1>has said in the past that sometimes he picks his

1118
00:57:05.320 --> 00:57:09.440
<v Speaker 1>movies as sort of testing grounds yeah for future movies.

1119
00:57:09.760 --> 00:57:12.760
<v Speaker 1>Like he specifically said that he waited on making Dunkirk

1120
00:57:13.159 --> 00:57:17.599
<v Speaker 1>because he felt that he had to make a big

1121
00:57:17.719 --> 00:57:20.480
<v Speaker 1>enough movie where he felt comfortable making a war movie.

1122
00:57:20.559 --> 00:57:23.119
<v Speaker 2>I think it's incredibly inteligent of him. Can you imagine

1123
00:57:23.119 --> 00:57:24.880
<v Speaker 2>if he tried to do this ten years earlier, well

1124
00:57:24.920 --> 00:57:25.639
<v Speaker 2>after Momento.

1125
00:57:25.800 --> 00:57:27.400
<v Speaker 1>He also said that because he was going to make

1126
00:57:27.400 --> 00:57:29.760
<v Speaker 1>Inception after a Momento crazy, And then he basically said

1127
00:57:29.760 --> 00:57:31.119
<v Speaker 1>that he was like I need to be a good

1128
00:57:31.199 --> 00:57:33.400
<v Speaker 1>enough director to make big movies. So let me ask you,

1129
00:57:33.440 --> 00:57:39.840
<v Speaker 1>this is the Odyssey his testing ground for another realist

1130
00:57:39.880 --> 00:57:44.599
<v Speaker 1>like a you're talking about a historical battleground movie. Yeah,

1131
00:57:44.719 --> 00:57:48.519
<v Speaker 1>that'd be neat you know, like, I don't know, I'm curious,

1132
00:57:48.559 --> 00:57:51.280
<v Speaker 1>like I would be interested in that if the Odyssey

1133
00:57:51.320 --> 00:57:55.400
<v Speaker 1>is great? Yeah, yeah, you know, he's proven to me,

1134
00:57:55.559 --> 00:57:59.239
<v Speaker 1>he's proven himself that he can do historical nonfiction really well.

1135
00:57:59.280 --> 00:58:01.320
<v Speaker 1>Like his style I think really works for that.

1136
00:58:01.559 --> 00:58:04.000
<v Speaker 2>I think so because it has to be a little

1137
00:58:04.079 --> 00:58:05.280
<v Speaker 2>dry and a little removed.

1138
00:58:05.400 --> 00:58:09.840
<v Speaker 1>Yeah yeah, yeah, I don't know. Interesting. Yeah, all right, everybody.

1139
00:58:09.880 --> 00:58:11.519
<v Speaker 1>If you're also interested in more, you can listen to

1140
00:58:11.559 --> 00:58:15.920
<v Speaker 1>this podcast on Spotify and Apple Podcasts and all those places. Actually,

1141
00:58:15.920 --> 00:58:17.199
<v Speaker 1>where can they find us on social media?

1142
00:58:17.320 --> 00:58:20.760
<v Speaker 2>You can find us all over socials at geek history lesson.

1143
00:58:21.280 --> 00:58:22.800
<v Speaker 1>Actually, where can they find you on social media?

1144
00:58:22.840 --> 00:58:26.280
<v Speaker 2>You find me everywhere at Ashley V. Robinson, Jason. Where

1145
00:58:26.280 --> 00:58:28.119
<v Speaker 2>can we find you on the socials?

1146
00:58:28.280 --> 00:58:31.079
<v Speaker 1>I'm at John and JW. I in when I decided

1147
00:58:31.119 --> 00:58:33.480
<v Speaker 1>to post, and now it's time for what have we

1148
00:58:33.599 --> 00:58:36.159
<v Speaker 1>learned today? Well, folks, we've learned that if you're going

1149
00:58:36.239 --> 00:58:38.239
<v Speaker 1>to get on a boat and be saved by a war.

1150
00:58:38.320 --> 00:58:41.920
<v Speaker 1>Make sure it's piloted by Mark Rylance. Yeah, exactly, trust

1151
00:58:42.000 --> 00:58:44.280
<v Speaker 1>in Mark Rylance. And if you're going to have a

1152
00:58:44.320 --> 00:58:48.119
<v Speaker 1>plane be flown around, make sure it's flown by Tom Hardy. Yeah,

1153
00:58:48.199 --> 00:58:51.679
<v Speaker 1>especially if he's wearing a mask, because definitely, if there's

1154
00:58:51.719 --> 00:58:54.119
<v Speaker 1>one person in charge of that plane, it's burned.

1155
00:58:55.079 --> 00:58:56.800
<v Speaker 2>He crashed a plane and then he flew one with

1156
00:58:56.840 --> 00:58:58.039
<v Speaker 2>great skill.

1157
00:58:58.159 --> 00:59:02.000
<v Speaker 1>He redeemed himself. Yeah, rash that plane into Ireland and

1158
00:59:02.079 --> 00:59:04.079
<v Speaker 1>then he and then he made sure he landed it

1159
00:59:04.119 --> 00:59:06.239
<v Speaker 1>perfectly in France, Ireland.

1160
00:59:06.239 --> 00:59:10.280
<v Speaker 2>Astan Kack I think it was his Becka's name, but

1161
00:59:10.320 --> 00:59:11.760
<v Speaker 2>it's definitely the Irish Shells.

1162
00:59:11.960 --> 00:59:17.159
<v Speaker 1>No better pilot than bird. Thank you all for listening

1163
00:59:17.159 --> 00:59:20.480
<v Speaker 1>to this very somber episode and lovely episode of Dunkirk

1164
00:59:20.559 --> 00:59:21.079
<v Speaker 1>g h L.

1165
00:59:21.280 --> 00:59:24.239
<v Speaker 2>I'm Jason Edman, I'm actually Victoria Robinson and Professor Jason.

1166
00:59:24.239 --> 00:59:28.280
<v Speaker 1>Would you please dismiss the class classes now dismissed soldiers