WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 1>Found dead on the beach. Police say she died of suicide,

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<v Speaker 1>but her family thinks someone out there knows what happened.

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<v Speaker 1>What do you do when in your heart you don't

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<v Speaker 1>believe your daughter could take her own life, but investigators

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<v Speaker 1>won't listen and facts are more than mysterious. Today we're

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<v Speaker 1>covering the Scottish case of Annie Boyesen. Good morning. The

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<v Speaker 1>following podcast cemeterial for a mature audience listener, just question

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<v Speaker 1>that much.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, I'm Nicol, I'm Ben, and you are listening to

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<v Speaker 2>Wicked and Grim.

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<v Speaker 1>A true crime podcast. Welcome, what's up?

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<v Speaker 2>We're here and I'm falling asleep.

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<v Speaker 1>Ben is so freakin tired that I don't even know

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<v Speaker 1>if he's going to make it through this podcast.

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<v Speaker 2>To be honest, I don't know what's with me today,

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<v Speaker 2>but I'm just like I could curl up in a

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<v Speaker 2>ball for about a week.

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<v Speaker 1>You're literally a bump on a log right now.

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<v Speaker 2>Pretty much pretty much. But I'm going to survive through this.

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<v Speaker 2>I think I got it.

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<v Speaker 1>You're going to just have to You're going to just

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<v Speaker 1>do it.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, then tell me a story and keep me awake.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, something exciting is that it's Rumen eggnog season.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh okay, that is exciting.

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<v Speaker 1>That is freaking a good season.

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<v Speaker 2>You made me my first Rummen eggnog yesterday, which was delicious.

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<v Speaker 1>And I went through a phase I remember where I

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<v Speaker 1>didn't drink eggnog.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, you thought eggnog was like horrendous and I was

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<v Speaker 2>like that was that? What the fuck?

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<v Speaker 1>I feel like I might have gotten ill or something,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe drank a bunch and then got sick like a

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<v Speaker 1>flu or something. And then yeah, but then.

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<v Speaker 2>I was like, no, you need to add rum to it, like, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>I can hop on this.

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<v Speaker 1>Bandwagon's actually good because yeah, I was doing almond old,

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<v Speaker 1>which is just not the same. It's not the same. No,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm sorry for all you dairy intolerance people. I apologize, okay,

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<v Speaker 1>And we have to wish everyone a happy Thanksgiving in

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<v Speaker 1>the US.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean it's a little bit behind now, we're late,

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<v Speaker 2>but happy related Thanksgiving, Yeah to all our our Southern

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<v Speaker 2>brethren down there.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. And then it was Black Friday and it's Cyber Monday,

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<v Speaker 1>and I just looked and I have a serious problem.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah you do.

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<v Speaker 1>I apparently am subscribed to so many things that I

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<v Speaker 1>got fucking like one hundred and twenty five emails today

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<v Speaker 1>on Cyber Monday, which is a problem.

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<v Speaker 2>That is a serious problem, And honestly, I'm not.

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<v Speaker 1>Surprised that is a problem.

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<v Speaker 2>You need to fix that. You got some unsubscribing to do.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's what I'm going to be doing after this podcast,

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<v Speaker 1>because that actually makes me like slightly ill.

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<v Speaker 2>Yep.

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<v Speaker 1>And I didn't even buy anything today, so it's not

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<v Speaker 1>like I need any of those.

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<v Speaker 2>I bought something today.

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<v Speaker 1>I bought stuff on Black Friday, but I didn't today.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I didn't buy Black Friday stuff. I did buy

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<v Speaker 2>one thing today.

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<v Speaker 1>What did you buy?

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<v Speaker 2>A teeny tiny point setup?

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, we'll actually have to boast a photo because we

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<v Speaker 1>have like last year we had a mini Christmas tree

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<v Speaker 1>just on our counter, and this year we up leveled

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<v Speaker 1>and I have also have a mini Christmas tree and

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<v Speaker 1>a mini point set it and it's the cutest thing

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<v Speaker 1>I've ever seen in my whole life.

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<v Speaker 2>It's like the most tiny home appropriate decorations I have

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<v Speaker 2>ever seen.

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<v Speaker 1>It actually is. It makes me so happy, so happy.

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<v Speaker 2>We're getting festive up in this beach.

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<v Speaker 1>That's gotta wake your ass up getting festive.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, as long as Mariah Carey doesn't like

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<v Speaker 2>boot me in the back. I think I'll slowly wake up.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh man, But then that would just be like I'd

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<v Speaker 1>pay money to see that Mariah Carey kick me in

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<v Speaker 1>the back things. Yeah, that would be such a sight.

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<v Speaker 2>Wow.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, okay, we have one more topic to discuss.

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<v Speaker 2>What's that one? More?

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<v Speaker 1>You can? You can? You can start this one.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't even know the time. You've got the notes today?

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<v Speaker 1>The Wicked Box, the Wicked Boxes.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so we did a giveaway a couple of months

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<v Speaker 2>ago on the Wicked Box. We've put together some cool stuff,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, a little box and did a giveaway.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it was quite a giveaway, epic.

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<v Speaker 2>Treasure hunt thing. We're doing it again, not just yet.

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<v Speaker 2>We're looking for around Christmas time. We're going to have

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<v Speaker 2>two that we're going to give away this time.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, we've ordered some supplies for it.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, and as of right now, we have absolutely no

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<v Speaker 2>idea how we're going to give them away, So we

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<v Speaker 2>got to start planning that out too. I don't know

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<v Speaker 2>if we're going to go it was quite in depth

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<v Speaker 2>as we did before.

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<v Speaker 1>That's what I was just going to say. Should we

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<v Speaker 1>go in depth or should we just like, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>make it a bit easier.

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<v Speaker 2>We'll figure it out.

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<v Speaker 1>We could do one of each or something. We'll see,

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<v Speaker 1>we'll see.

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<v Speaker 2>But yeah, just want to let you guys know what

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<v Speaker 2>that's coming down the pipe. You ordered some stuff for

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<v Speaker 2>it the other day, and it's going to be pretty dope.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, that's exciting. I mean everyone was pretty pumped. It

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<v Speaker 1>was a cool box. It was filled with stuff i'd want.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, I mean, who wouldn't want a wicked box?

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<v Speaker 2>It sounds pretty wicked to.

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<v Speaker 1>Me, sound dope?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 2>What are you out for a case for us? Today?

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so today we're talking about the mysterious death of

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<v Speaker 1>Annie Boyesen, and I hope I am saying that right.

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<v Speaker 1>I apologize to Annie if I'm not, but I'm not

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<v Speaker 1>Swedish and I did look it up and that that's

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<v Speaker 1>how I'm going to say it in my my Canadian

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<v Speaker 1>American accent.

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<v Speaker 2>You're Canadian and American.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know what I am?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean we technically are North American.

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<v Speaker 1>Sorry, there you go.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, just American has been the adopted nickname for the

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<v Speaker 2>United States, you know.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, okay, so and a mysterious one. It is like, wow, wow, wow, Wow.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, I do know a little bit about this case

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<v Speaker 2>because I almost did it at one point.

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<v Speaker 1>You did, actually, and then I stole it.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, thanks for that. Sorry, but it's a good one.

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<v Speaker 2>So I'm going to buckle up my proverbial seat belt

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<v Speaker 2>here and uh click, I'm ready to go. Okay, I'm

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<v Speaker 2>buckled in.

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<v Speaker 1>So it's one of those stories that's going to stick

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<v Speaker 1>with you. Every time something happens, it just leaves you

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<v Speaker 1>feeling like there's no way they could get any stranger,

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<v Speaker 1>yet it does.

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<v Speaker 2>Can you say it one more time? Just really relaxed

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<v Speaker 2>that any time was real, like abrupt jump in okay.

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<v Speaker 2>So just you're talking to me and you're just like, oh, okay, yeah, okay, okay.

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<v Speaker 1>So every time something happens in this case, it just

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<v Speaker 1>leaves you feeling like there's no way things could get stranger,

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<v Speaker 1>yet it does.

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<v Speaker 2>It does. Interesting.

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<v Speaker 1>It's wild. It's bizarre.

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<v Speaker 2>No, some of the stuff I do know about it, it

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<v Speaker 2>is wild. It is bizarre. Yeah, I have a feeling

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<v Speaker 2>there's gonna be a lot more to it that that's

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<v Speaker 2>gonna blow my mind. I'm excited for this one.

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<v Speaker 1>I think you'll learn some things. So Annie was born

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<v Speaker 1>in Sweden in nineteen seventy five. She was half Hungarian.

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<v Speaker 1>At five foot eight, she had an athletic build and

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<v Speaker 1>was a Swedish beauty. So she had blonde hair and

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<v Speaker 1>blue eyes.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, I can, like quite literally like picture her picture

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<v Speaker 2>in my mind. Actually.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and even before I had picked and researched this case,

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<v Speaker 1>like I had recognized her photo too.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh you have seen her photo?

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<v Speaker 1>I have? Yeah, Okay, So I mean I think it's

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<v Speaker 1>like a fairly well known case, really it is.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a pretty big one. Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So, so she seemed to be an absolutely incredible person

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<v Speaker 1>as well. She played in a band. She loved nature

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<v Speaker 1>and being outdoors and absolutely loved Rugby. Also, something that's

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<v Speaker 1>super impressive in my books, she spoke a total five

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<v Speaker 1>different languages.

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<v Speaker 2>That is boss vibes right there. Yeah, holy shit, I

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<v Speaker 2>can barely speak English.

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<v Speaker 1>I know. I feel like around here we can barely

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<v Speaker 1>speak one language. So I'm just like in awe. It's

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<v Speaker 1>actually my buck list one day to learn a second language, though,

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<v Speaker 1>I think I would like to try that.

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<v Speaker 2>Which language would you learn?

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know. I'd have to pick one because I'd

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<v Speaker 1>want to pick one and then go to that area

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<v Speaker 1>and like, you know, practice it. But I mean they

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<v Speaker 1>would probably be like wow, well, I mean.

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<v Speaker 2>Of course if it's not your native language, it's not

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<v Speaker 2>you can just come up and roll out and be like, yo,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm doing this flawlessly for the first time ever. It's

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<v Speaker 2>not the expectation.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Sometimes I think like Spanish, but then I'm like,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe something different. I don't know what about you Japanese Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>I was thinking you're going to say that, but I

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<v Speaker 1>want to Japanese really.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey, huh, well, I mean I did. I did martial

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<v Speaker 2>arts as a kid, right, so there was that Japanese

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<v Speaker 2>kind of culture behind the martial arts. And then I'm

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<v Speaker 2>a big, like anime fan, I want to go to

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<v Speaker 2>Japan one day, and it's just yeah, it's Japanese wholeheartedly.

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<v Speaker 2>Boom done.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. I would love to go to Japan too, Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>So another big passion for Annie was Scotland. She spent

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of time in Scotland in two thousand and

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<v Speaker 1>four and absolutely fell in love with the country. That

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<v Speaker 1>is also a place we would like to visit.

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<v Speaker 2>Yes.

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<v Speaker 1>She immersed herself in the country and got to know

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<v Speaker 1>the people, in the culture and also the countryside through

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<v Speaker 1>her many long hikes around historical sites.

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<v Speaker 2>Jealous, I want to do that.

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<v Speaker 1>I know well you have like Scottish in yea a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit right?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? Freedom?

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<v Speaker 1>No, sorry, but Annie had. She had a tough time

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<v Speaker 1>being able to get a permanent residency permit and had

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<v Speaker 1>to leave Scotland in August of two thousand and four.

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<v Speaker 1>Annie didn't give up, though, she knew without a doubt

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<v Speaker 1>where she wanted to be, and she went back and

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<v Speaker 1>forth between Scotland and Sweden a few times before she

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<v Speaker 1>finally landed back in Scotland for good the next year

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<v Speaker 1>in two thousand and five, she made a home for

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<v Speaker 1>herself in Edinburgh, and all that stood between her and

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<v Speaker 1>knowing for sure that she could stay in the place

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<v Speaker 1>that she had fallen in love was, of course, finding

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<v Speaker 1>a job.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, I'm sorry. I'm a little bit distracted because my

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<v Speaker 2>parents had gone to Scotland before and they I know it.

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<v Speaker 1>Because I was like, did I say something wrong?

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<v Speaker 2>No, it's the way you said Edinburgh, and I'm trying

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<v Speaker 2>to think they said that they could the people there

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<v Speaker 2>at the locals knew that they were Canadian because the

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<v Speaker 2>way they said Edinburgh and I'm trying to remember if

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<v Speaker 2>it's because anyone from the state says Edinburgh. I'm trying

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<v Speaker 2>to I don't know sure if to get it backwards.

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<v Speaker 1>I did listen to something. I can't remember what they said,

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<v Speaker 1>but yeah, there was different, different and wrong ways to

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<v Speaker 1>pronounce it, and I think it was Edinburgh Borough or Edinburgh.

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<v Speaker 1>I can't remember.

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<v Speaker 2>I believe Edinburgh is the correct way to say it.

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<v Speaker 1>There was two correct ways to say Is there two?

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<v Speaker 2>Okay?

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<v Speaker 1>From what I saw anyway, But well, shit, anyone.

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<v Speaker 2>Who's from Scotland or knows, we need to know what's

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<v Speaker 2>the correct way. What's the correct pronunciation? Is it Edinburgh? Edinburgh?

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<v Speaker 2>What is it? Are we just way off base here.

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<v Speaker 1>And way off who knows?

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<v Speaker 2>I'm pretty sure it's Edinburgh.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay. So back to Annie. She needed to find a job, right,

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<v Speaker 1>you got to make that chetta chetta cheese. Annie kept

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<v Speaker 1>at it, trying everywhere she could to find that last

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<v Speaker 1>missing piece of the puzzle. But there's only so many

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<v Speaker 1>hours of the day that you can dedicate to jaw hunting,

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<v Speaker 1>fair enough, and Annie wanted to make the most of

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<v Speaker 1>every minute she had. I think we can all vouch

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<v Speaker 1>basically how was Austin. Job hunting is like it actually

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<v Speaker 1>kind of sucks.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's sure. It's like one of the worst things ever.

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<v Speaker 1>I feel like it's it's horrible.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I could literally have a billboard with three four

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<v Speaker 2>different job options in front of me and I'd be like, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>I haven't found any jobs today.

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<v Speaker 1>I do think writing the cover well, no, it's all

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<v Speaker 1>just shit. Never mind, I was gonna say that writing

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<v Speaker 1>the cover letter is the worst, but also, like, the

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<v Speaker 1>interview is pretty horrific too.

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<v Speaker 2>I honest, interviews are fucking bullshit for the most part.

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<v Speaker 2>They ask you the most ridiculous questions that don't pertain

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<v Speaker 2>to the job usually and don't mean anything. People usually

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<v Speaker 2>know what you're trying to ask them, so I'll just

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<v Speaker 2>give you a false answer anyways.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, well, if you're good at thinking, I'm like on

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<v Speaker 1>your feet like that. Yeah, So why don't listen to

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<v Speaker 1>Ben's advice?

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<v Speaker 2>There's good things about interviews, don't get me wrong. You

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<v Speaker 2>can definitely get a feel for a person, but it

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<v Speaker 2>can be someone can totally manipulate that whole system as well. Well.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and then there's some people who are just really

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<v Speaker 1>nervous and stuff, so their true colors won't be shining

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<v Speaker 1>through right.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So so for the time being, she was able to

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<v Speaker 1>collect unemployment from Sweden though, which she gave her a

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<v Speaker 1>bit of breathing room in her new life. And when

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<v Speaker 1>she wasn't busy looking for a job, you could usually

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<v Speaker 1>find Annie in one of her many favorite spots, which

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<v Speaker 1>were outside in the countryside where she did all those

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<v Speaker 1>long hikes around local historical sites and landmarks. Right.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, honestly, I thought that was like a cafe or

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<v Speaker 2>something at first, one of her favorite spots outside on

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<v Speaker 2>the countryside. It sounds like a cafe name or something.

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<v Speaker 1>Or like a little cottage.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah you know what I mean. Yeah, it took me

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<v Speaker 2>a second to realize. Oh, like, no, literally in the countryside.

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<v Speaker 1>Or you could find her at the swimming hall where

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<v Speaker 1>she regularly swam to keep herself fit, or at the

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00:12:37.720 --> 00:12:41.759
<v Speaker 1>local rugby club. Annie had a really big passion for rugby,

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<v Speaker 1>and spending time at the club gave her the opportunity

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<v Speaker 1>to have a drink, unwind and make friends with the locals.

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<v Speaker 2>Nice.

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<v Speaker 1>I like that. She kind of seemed like she just

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<v Speaker 1>like immersed herself.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, she wasn't afraid to kind of go to those yees.

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<v Speaker 1>And I really like that. So and this tactic actually

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00:12:58.559 --> 00:13:01.480
<v Speaker 1>quickly paid off for her. Was kind and friendly, and

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00:13:01.519 --> 00:13:04.039
<v Speaker 1>before she knew it, she was getting invited to all

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00:13:04.080 --> 00:13:07.200
<v Speaker 1>sorts of events and parties and was making all sorts

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00:13:07.240 --> 00:13:10.240
<v Speaker 1>of new friends, even though she'd only been back in

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00:13:10.279 --> 00:13:13.559
<v Speaker 1>the country for a few months. Good for her, Good

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00:13:13.559 --> 00:13:18.519
<v Speaker 1>for Annie. Some you know, the grass ain't always greener though.

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<v Speaker 1>Of course, here we go.

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<v Speaker 2>Here's where the tables turn my how the turntables?

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00:13:23.279 --> 00:13:25.279
<v Speaker 1>I know, and I'm always like hesitant. I'm like, this

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00:13:25.360 --> 00:13:27.080
<v Speaker 1>sounds so nice, but we got to go to a

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00:13:27.159 --> 00:13:30.759
<v Speaker 1>dark place. So something wasn't quite right though, and her

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00:13:30.759 --> 00:13:32.879
<v Speaker 1>friends and family were starting to pick up on it.

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<v Speaker 1>She started to sound a bit troubled in phone conversations,

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<v Speaker 1>saying she had to take care of something, had a

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<v Speaker 1>decision to make that might be life changing.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh.

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<v Speaker 1>On Thursday, December one, first, she had a conversation with

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00:13:48.200 --> 00:13:51.480
<v Speaker 1>her mother, who shared that her family was, you know,

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00:13:51.639 --> 00:13:54.879
<v Speaker 1>a bit worried and growing concerned about her, to which

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<v Speaker 1>she responded, You'll have to respect this, but I have

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00:13:58.960 --> 00:14:02.720
<v Speaker 1>to take care of myself. That same night, Annie made

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00:14:02.759 --> 00:14:05.600
<v Speaker 1>a call to one of her friends in Sweden, telling

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00:14:05.639 --> 00:14:08.000
<v Speaker 1>her that she was heading out to a party later

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00:14:08.039 --> 00:14:10.519
<v Speaker 1>that night. She didn't give her a lot of detail

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00:14:10.799 --> 00:14:13.320
<v Speaker 1>other than she was really looking forward to it. They

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00:14:13.399 --> 00:14:16.120
<v Speaker 1>chit chatted for a little bit before Annie said that

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00:14:16.200 --> 00:14:18.639
<v Speaker 1>she had to go go so that she could get

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<v Speaker 1>ready for the party, and the two hung up. But

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00:14:21.279 --> 00:14:24.919
<v Speaker 1>no witnesses ever came forward in regards to this party,

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00:14:25.799 --> 00:14:29.399
<v Speaker 1>and that was the last time Annie's friend or her

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00:14:29.440 --> 00:14:31.240
<v Speaker 1>family ever heard from her.

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00:14:31.840 --> 00:14:34.960
<v Speaker 2>So there's no witnesses to come forward from party to

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00:14:35.000 --> 00:14:35.559
<v Speaker 2>saying she was.

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00:14:35.519 --> 00:14:37.919
<v Speaker 1>There, there was even a party, or that it ever happened.

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00:14:37.960 --> 00:14:39.039
<v Speaker 2>Okay, gotcha.

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00:14:39.240 --> 00:14:43.159
<v Speaker 1>So unless no one just came forward but you heard

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00:14:43.360 --> 00:14:48.919
<v Speaker 1>someone would I don't know so. Because on December or sorry, Sunday,

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00:14:48.960 --> 00:14:51.960
<v Speaker 1>December fourth, a man out walking his dog on a

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00:14:51.960 --> 00:14:55.759
<v Speaker 1>beach in the Preswick Bay found the body of a

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00:14:55.799 --> 00:15:01.759
<v Speaker 1>thirty year old woman, that woman being Annie. The police

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00:15:01.840 --> 00:15:04.360
<v Speaker 1>rushed to the scene to investigate, but it was quickly

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00:15:04.399 --> 00:15:09.200
<v Speaker 1>determined by them that Annie had committed suicide.

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00:15:09.440 --> 00:15:11.120
<v Speaker 2>I have a really bad joke you want to make.

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00:15:12.879 --> 00:15:14.159
<v Speaker 1>I don't think we should make a joke.

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00:15:14.279 --> 00:15:17.159
<v Speaker 2>No, I know, that's the thing. It's like, all respect

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00:15:17.200 --> 00:15:19.600
<v Speaker 2>to Annie, but I also at the same time do

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00:15:19.720 --> 00:15:21.720
<v Speaker 2>hope that the police kind of ran up to your

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<v Speaker 2>and was like Annie, are you okay?

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00:15:23.000 --> 00:15:26.200
<v Speaker 1>Oh are you okay? Sorry, Okay, that's not as bad

348
00:15:26.320 --> 00:15:30.399
<v Speaker 1>and it's about you, okay, yeah, Actually all poor Annie.

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00:15:30.440 --> 00:15:33.240
<v Speaker 1>I feel so bad for her, I know. So after

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00:15:33.279 --> 00:15:35.600
<v Speaker 1>they went through the steps of identifying the body as

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00:15:35.639 --> 00:15:39.360
<v Speaker 1>being Annie, family back in Sweden got the call that

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00:15:39.399 --> 00:15:44.399
<v Speaker 1>their beloved daughter Annie was gone. That right there, to me,

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00:15:44.960 --> 00:15:47.240
<v Speaker 1>is like almost a reason to just never have kids,

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00:15:47.240 --> 00:15:50.320
<v Speaker 1>because I couldn't imagine what kind of of like loss

355
00:15:50.360 --> 00:15:51.840
<v Speaker 1>that feels to you.

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00:15:52.159 --> 00:15:55.159
<v Speaker 2>Having your child, Like get that phone call that you're,

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00:15:55.480 --> 00:15:57.360
<v Speaker 2>holy shit passed away.

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<v Speaker 1>I just couldn't imagine.

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00:15:59.039 --> 00:16:02.799
<v Speaker 2>It's like take a night, carve out your heart and stomach.

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00:16:02.879 --> 00:16:06.639
<v Speaker 1>Yeah wow yeah, but I mean, what's the saying, better

361
00:16:06.679 --> 00:16:08.679
<v Speaker 1>to have loved and lost than never to have loved

362
00:16:08.720 --> 00:16:09.000
<v Speaker 1>at all?

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00:16:09.200 --> 00:16:10.879
<v Speaker 2>Oh shit, you're getting deep on us.

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00:16:11.120 --> 00:16:11.559
<v Speaker 1>Wow.

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00:16:11.879 --> 00:16:12.240
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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00:16:12.360 --> 00:16:14.240
<v Speaker 1>I mean someone actually said that quote to me the

367
00:16:14.320 --> 00:16:18.159
<v Speaker 1>other day. So that's why I was remembered it because

368
00:16:18.200 --> 00:16:20.519
<v Speaker 1>I was just like, God, like our animals even worth it,

369
00:16:20.519 --> 00:16:23.559
<v Speaker 1>because like, I'm still pretty upset about Mika, right and so,

370
00:16:24.080 --> 00:16:25.960
<v Speaker 1>and now we have rippling and I'm like God, I'm

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00:16:25.960 --> 00:16:27.679
<v Speaker 1>gonna have to do this again, like, is it even

372
00:16:27.720 --> 00:16:29.600
<v Speaker 1>worth it? But it's totally worth it because to not

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<v Speaker 1>love is that's not a life.

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00:16:31.360 --> 00:16:34.039
<v Speaker 2>No, definitely not so so.

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00:16:34.159 --> 00:16:36.279
<v Speaker 1>A loss and a sudden one, as in the case

376
00:16:36.320 --> 00:16:40.480
<v Speaker 1>of Annie, are always a shock. But Annie's deemed suicide

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00:16:40.919 --> 00:16:44.000
<v Speaker 1>sent her family and friends into a huge state of disbelief,

378
00:16:44.720 --> 00:16:47.000
<v Speaker 1>so much so that they actually called the police right

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00:16:47.039 --> 00:16:49.960
<v Speaker 1>away and told them that there was no way that

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00:16:49.960 --> 00:16:54.600
<v Speaker 1>Annie could have committed suicide. The police, however, disagreed.

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00:16:55.320 --> 00:16:56.720
<v Speaker 2>I'm curious on these details.

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00:16:57.559 --> 00:17:00.440
<v Speaker 1>There's a lot of details. This is. Yeah, I don't

383
00:17:00.440 --> 00:17:02.039
<v Speaker 1>even know where I am in this case right now,

384
00:17:02.080 --> 00:17:05.640
<v Speaker 1>but we're just getting started. So when investigators examined the

385
00:17:05.680 --> 00:17:09.480
<v Speaker 1>scene and Annie's body on that cold December morning, they

386
00:17:09.519 --> 00:17:13.039
<v Speaker 1>found everything they needed to rule it a suicide. In

387
00:17:13.119 --> 00:17:16.799
<v Speaker 1>their opinion, She allegedly looked as though she had drowned

388
00:17:17.359 --> 00:17:20.240
<v Speaker 1>and her body was covered in sand and seaweed, telling

389
00:17:20.279 --> 00:17:26.480
<v Speaker 1>investigators that she died at sea. She had an unexplained

390
00:17:26.880 --> 00:17:31.039
<v Speaker 1>depression in the skin, small areas of bruising to the

391
00:17:31.119 --> 00:17:36.200
<v Speaker 1>right temple, scratched abrasion on the left arm, and two patterned,

392
00:17:36.480 --> 00:17:40.519
<v Speaker 1>roughly square contoosed areas on the right arm. This is

393
00:17:40.559 --> 00:17:43.880
<v Speaker 1>kind of like coming from the autopsy, okay, but police

394
00:17:43.960 --> 00:17:48.119
<v Speaker 1>believed these minor injuries suggested that she had been hit

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00:17:48.160 --> 00:17:50.880
<v Speaker 1>by things in the water and her body was dragged

396
00:17:50.920 --> 00:17:54.599
<v Speaker 1>across the beach in the tide, which I mean it

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00:17:54.680 --> 00:17:55.160
<v Speaker 1>could be.

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00:17:55.680 --> 00:17:57.880
<v Speaker 2>I'm wondering. I'm not too sure on how like the

399
00:17:57.880 --> 00:18:00.240
<v Speaker 2>science of the body is, but I'm not so non

400
00:18:00.279 --> 00:18:01.200
<v Speaker 2>postpartem bruising.

401
00:18:01.480 --> 00:18:03.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you could tell the thing is like you could

402
00:18:03.359 --> 00:18:04.240
<v Speaker 1>tell if they were.

403
00:18:04.119 --> 00:18:07.559
<v Speaker 2>Happened after Yeah, I know someone would be able to tell.

404
00:18:07.839 --> 00:18:08.440
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

405
00:18:08.519 --> 00:18:12.440
<v Speaker 2>I'm also really leary about someone committing suicide by drowning,

406
00:18:12.519 --> 00:18:16.599
<v Speaker 2>not to say doesn't happen usually if it's a water suicide,

407
00:18:16.599 --> 00:18:19.440
<v Speaker 2>it's jumping off of something into the water and it's

408
00:18:19.599 --> 00:18:20.359
<v Speaker 2>the impact.

409
00:18:20.960 --> 00:18:23.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, okay, and so was there and then you think

410
00:18:24.000 --> 00:18:24.319
<v Speaker 1>there'd be.

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00:18:24.319 --> 00:18:28.119
<v Speaker 2>A Marx Yeah, oh yeah. No. Once you jump at

412
00:18:28.160 --> 00:18:30.240
<v Speaker 2>water from a certain height, it's like you're hitting concrete.

413
00:18:30.440 --> 00:18:35.039
<v Speaker 2>You'd be breaking bones and shit. Was there a location around,

414
00:18:35.119 --> 00:18:37.000
<v Speaker 2>you know, that would have been of heights that someone

415
00:18:37.000 --> 00:18:39.680
<v Speaker 2>could have jumped off for suicide in a scenario like this.

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00:18:40.519 --> 00:18:44.400
<v Speaker 1>Not that I exactly know about, but I do mention

417
00:18:44.559 --> 00:18:48.200
<v Speaker 1>here later the investigator stuck to their theory that Annie

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00:18:48.240 --> 00:18:51.680
<v Speaker 1>had committed suicide either by jumping off a cliff or

419
00:18:51.720 --> 00:18:54.319
<v Speaker 1>walking out into sea and drowning, and they simply close

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00:18:54.400 --> 00:18:54.839
<v Speaker 1>the case.

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00:18:55.000 --> 00:18:58.440
<v Speaker 2>I can't see someone who went swimming for recreation to

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00:18:58.480 --> 00:19:01.160
<v Speaker 2>walk out to sea to drown. I can see someone, yeah,

423
00:19:01.200 --> 00:19:02.960
<v Speaker 2>does not have swimming skills to do that.

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00:19:02.960 --> 00:19:06.079
<v Speaker 1>Because that's one thing, yeah, and the other. Okay, I'm

425
00:19:06.400 --> 00:19:08.240
<v Speaker 1>going to be kind of going back and forth here

426
00:19:08.240 --> 00:19:11.960
<v Speaker 1>because we're jumping ahead. But she had like her belongings

427
00:19:11.960 --> 00:19:13.519
<v Speaker 1>were very close to her body.

428
00:19:14.400 --> 00:19:15.000
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

429
00:19:15.200 --> 00:19:17.839
<v Speaker 1>So like the fact that she says she jumped off

430
00:19:17.839 --> 00:19:20.640
<v Speaker 1>a cliff, like there's no way that everything would just

431
00:19:20.799 --> 00:19:22.240
<v Speaker 1>end up kind of in the same place.

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00:19:23.240 --> 00:19:26.880
<v Speaker 2>So I'm going to go back to that swimming theory

433
00:19:26.920 --> 00:19:30.000
<v Speaker 2>if you don't mind, sure, Okay. So there was an

434
00:19:30.079 --> 00:19:32.960
<v Speaker 2>interview I watched off someone who survived jumping off the

435
00:19:32.960 --> 00:19:36.160
<v Speaker 2>Golden Gate Bridge, like the odds are stupid thin of

436
00:19:36.200 --> 00:19:39.519
<v Speaker 2>that survival happening. And he said the moment he let go,

437
00:19:39.799 --> 00:19:43.599
<v Speaker 2>he regretted it. He regretted jumping, but he survived. And

438
00:19:43.680 --> 00:19:47.400
<v Speaker 2>anyone who survived something like that, they regret it the second.

439
00:19:47.440 --> 00:19:50.119
<v Speaker 1>I think a lot of people do yes, like hangings

440
00:19:50.160 --> 00:19:53.960
<v Speaker 1>and yeah, and they can't, they can't fix what happened. Yeah.

441
00:19:54.039 --> 00:19:57.400
<v Speaker 2>So I can't see someone with swimming skills going out

442
00:19:57.400 --> 00:20:00.799
<v Speaker 2>into the water just wading out from the beach purposely

443
00:20:00.839 --> 00:20:05.839
<v Speaker 2>drowning themselves, because your reaction, potentially regret instincts, would cause

444
00:20:05.839 --> 00:20:08.440
<v Speaker 2>you to start swimming to the surface and save yourself.

445
00:20:08.960 --> 00:20:12.319
<v Speaker 2>I think the only way that primarily the only way

446
00:20:12.759 --> 00:20:15.599
<v Speaker 2>that would be a suicidal option is if someone doesn't

447
00:20:15.640 --> 00:20:17.680
<v Speaker 2>have the skills to save themselves and they're in too

448
00:20:17.759 --> 00:20:20.039
<v Speaker 2>deep and they can't it's too late to turn back.

449
00:20:20.200 --> 00:20:22.039
<v Speaker 1>But the other thing is the water would be hella

450
00:20:22.119 --> 00:20:26.000
<v Speaker 1>cold too, but still you'd probably have the opportunity to

451
00:20:26.000 --> 00:20:28.400
<v Speaker 1>swim back, yeah and save yourselves.

452
00:20:28.480 --> 00:20:30.839
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. I mean up here in Canada, we swim in

453
00:20:30.839 --> 00:20:33.720
<v Speaker 2>hell of cold water. Lots. Yeah, Like people do the

454
00:20:33.720 --> 00:20:35.559
<v Speaker 2>polar bear dip. They jump in cold water and they

455
00:20:35.559 --> 00:20:37.079
<v Speaker 2>turn around and swim back, no problem.

456
00:20:37.160 --> 00:20:39.559
<v Speaker 1>I've always wanted to do that too, but I hate

457
00:20:39.640 --> 00:20:41.720
<v Speaker 1>being cold, So I just don't think it's gonna happen

458
00:20:41.759 --> 00:20:42.440
<v Speaker 1>for anyone curious.

459
00:20:42.480 --> 00:20:44.920
<v Speaker 2>In the polar bear dip. That's literally they cut holes

460
00:20:44.920 --> 00:20:47.240
<v Speaker 2>in in winter and you jump in and.

461
00:20:47.359 --> 00:20:50.400
<v Speaker 1>Lots of times it's on New Year's Day, like January first,

462
00:20:50.599 --> 00:20:52.119
<v Speaker 1>it's like how you're ringing in your new year.

463
00:20:52.160 --> 00:20:54.519
<v Speaker 2>Yeah that so it's like minus thirty three celsius in

464
00:20:54.559 --> 00:20:57.839
<v Speaker 2>the air, So not cool. Anyways, that's my rant on

465
00:20:57.880 --> 00:20:59.960
<v Speaker 2>why I think she did not wade into the water.

466
00:21:00.319 --> 00:21:02.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I mean, we'll see what you think at the

467
00:21:02.799 --> 00:21:05.359
<v Speaker 1>end of what happened here. Like, there's quite a few things.

468
00:21:05.359 --> 00:21:09.039
<v Speaker 1>So one thing that I'm just backing up a little bit.

469
00:21:09.160 --> 00:21:11.960
<v Speaker 1>She had an uncast check for three hundred pounds on

470
00:21:12.079 --> 00:21:15.359
<v Speaker 1>her and most of her longing belongings, like I was saying,

471
00:21:15.559 --> 00:21:18.119
<v Speaker 1>were either found on her or in her backpack, which

472
00:21:18.160 --> 00:21:21.160
<v Speaker 1>had been washed up only a few meters away from

473
00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:24.400
<v Speaker 1>her body, suggesting that this wasn't a robbery gone wrong,

474
00:21:24.839 --> 00:21:31.000
<v Speaker 1>but also suggesting it probably wasn't her jumping off a

475
00:21:31.039 --> 00:21:35.519
<v Speaker 1>cliff and all her belongings just magically landing next to

476
00:21:35.519 --> 00:21:35.839
<v Speaker 1>each other.

477
00:21:35.920 --> 00:21:37.759
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, they would have probably been still at the top

478
00:21:37.799 --> 00:21:40.119
<v Speaker 2>of the cliff. Yeah, she would have taken them off,

479
00:21:40.160 --> 00:21:41.880
<v Speaker 2>put them there or something, or they would have been

480
00:21:41.880 --> 00:21:43.559
<v Speaker 2>just scattered out in the water. Yeah, one of the

481
00:21:43.599 --> 00:21:46.559
<v Speaker 2>two exactly, or left at her apartment or who knows where.

482
00:21:47.240 --> 00:21:51.519
<v Speaker 1>Okay, so because the investigators pretty much deemed that this

483
00:21:51.680 --> 00:21:54.440
<v Speaker 1>was a suicide, like right off the get go, really right,

484
00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:58.319
<v Speaker 1>They did not call a forensic team to the scene,

485
00:21:58.359 --> 00:22:02.000
<v Speaker 1>they didn't few witnesses, and they just left it at that.

486
00:22:02.160 --> 00:22:04.279
<v Speaker 1>So there was a lot of things that they probably

487
00:22:04.279 --> 00:22:07.240
<v Speaker 1>should have done or should have collected or but in

488
00:22:07.279 --> 00:22:10.079
<v Speaker 1>their mind it's like they arrived and they just were like,

489
00:22:10.440 --> 00:22:11.559
<v Speaker 1>she committed suicide.

490
00:22:11.799 --> 00:22:15.559
<v Speaker 2>See, an investigation should be issued to detern in something

491
00:22:15.599 --> 00:22:15.880
<v Speaker 2>like a.

492
00:22:15.839 --> 00:22:19.920
<v Speaker 1>Suicide, regardless of how obvious it looks, because I mean

493
00:22:19.960 --> 00:22:22.559
<v Speaker 1>lots of times, as we know, people are setting up

494
00:22:22.599 --> 00:22:26.240
<v Speaker 1>other people or yeah, or what right, Like, there's.

495
00:22:26.039 --> 00:22:29.200
<v Speaker 2>That's the purpose of an investigation, right to find answers,

496
00:22:29.759 --> 00:22:30.400
<v Speaker 2>especially when.

497
00:22:30.319 --> 00:22:33.359
<v Speaker 1>The family is just so adamant too. But I mean,

498
00:22:33.440 --> 00:22:36.279
<v Speaker 1>if they didn't collect things right off the bat, they

499
00:22:36.319 --> 00:22:38.799
<v Speaker 1>before the family was even notified, like what are they

500
00:22:38.839 --> 00:22:43.119
<v Speaker 1>going to do? Yeah, But Annie's family, in their gut,

501
00:22:43.559 --> 00:22:47.000
<v Speaker 1>like I've been saying, did not believe Annie would commit suicide,

502
00:22:47.400 --> 00:22:49.559
<v Speaker 1>and they couldn't shake the feeling that there was something

503
00:22:49.559 --> 00:22:52.880
<v Speaker 1>else going on. They knew that Annie had planned on

504
00:22:52.960 --> 00:22:55.480
<v Speaker 1>coming back to Sweden pretty close to the date that

505
00:22:55.519 --> 00:22:58.960
<v Speaker 1>she had been discovered. She actually already had an appointment

506
00:22:59.000 --> 00:23:01.720
<v Speaker 1>with her hairdresser for the following Monday, and it was

507
00:23:01.759 --> 00:23:06.400
<v Speaker 1>sad or Sunday when she was found. Okay, so like Monday,

508
00:23:06.480 --> 00:23:09.759
<v Speaker 1>she had plans to get her hair done in a Sweden.

509
00:23:12.039 --> 00:23:14.400
<v Speaker 2>Huh, it doesn't sound like someone who's buck made suicide.

510
00:23:14.519 --> 00:23:18.519
<v Speaker 1>And she was found with books in her backpack that

511
00:23:18.559 --> 00:23:22.599
<v Speaker 1>needed to be returned to a library in Sweden, and

512
00:23:22.640 --> 00:23:25.680
<v Speaker 1>she had paid her rent. So none of that was

513
00:23:25.720 --> 00:23:27.960
<v Speaker 1>consistent with someone who had planned on taking their own

514
00:23:28.000 --> 00:23:30.559
<v Speaker 1>lives or on their own life. And they told the

515
00:23:30.599 --> 00:23:35.880
<v Speaker 1>investigators just that. Yeah, But when they realized that Scottish

516
00:23:35.960 --> 00:23:39.039
<v Speaker 1>police weren't going to look into Any's case any further,

517
00:23:39.640 --> 00:23:42.759
<v Speaker 1>her family and friends back in Sweden began looking into

518
00:23:42.839 --> 00:23:45.880
<v Speaker 1>anything and everything that they could find to help explain

519
00:23:46.400 --> 00:23:49.000
<v Speaker 1>what happened to her, and they had a pretty good

520
00:23:49.000 --> 00:23:52.119
<v Speaker 1>idea of where to start. So just to briefly touch

521
00:23:52.160 --> 00:23:55.359
<v Speaker 1>on that, though, I think it can often be a

522
00:23:55.440 --> 00:23:58.359
<v Speaker 1>shock when a loved one does take their own life,

523
00:23:58.359 --> 00:24:02.000
<v Speaker 1>and it's not often expected, right, But then on the

524
00:24:02.039 --> 00:24:04.240
<v Speaker 1>other hand, when you have a gut feeling you need

525
00:24:04.279 --> 00:24:06.920
<v Speaker 1>to listen. You do need to listen to that, and

526
00:24:06.960 --> 00:24:11.000
<v Speaker 1>they found many things that would question whether Annie actually

527
00:24:11.039 --> 00:24:14.079
<v Speaker 1>committed suicide or not. And that's what I'm going to

528
00:24:14.079 --> 00:24:14.799
<v Speaker 1>start touching on.

529
00:24:14.920 --> 00:24:16.480
<v Speaker 2>Okay, let's hear it. I'm curious.

530
00:24:16.920 --> 00:24:19.920
<v Speaker 1>So in the week leading up to her death, Annie

531
00:24:19.960 --> 00:24:23.799
<v Speaker 1>had complained about meeting someone at the local rugby club

532
00:24:24.240 --> 00:24:27.559
<v Speaker 1>who had rubbed her kind of the wrong way. She'd

533
00:24:27.559 --> 00:24:30.519
<v Speaker 1>only met him a few times, but after each encounter,

534
00:24:30.920 --> 00:24:33.200
<v Speaker 1>she'd later be on the phone, either talking to her

535
00:24:33.240 --> 00:24:36.519
<v Speaker 1>parents or her friends about this guy who just didn't

536
00:24:36.920 --> 00:24:39.079
<v Speaker 1>want to seem to like take the hint that she

537
00:24:39.200 --> 00:24:40.599
<v Speaker 1>wasn't interested, gotcha.

538
00:24:40.720 --> 00:24:42.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, one of those guys.

539
00:24:42.240 --> 00:24:43.240
<v Speaker 1>One of those guys.

540
00:24:43.559 --> 00:24:47.440
<v Speaker 3>Persistence sometimes that does it pays off, but you have

541
00:24:47.480 --> 00:24:50.279
<v Speaker 3>to do it in not a creepy ass way. Yeah,

542
00:24:50.000 --> 00:24:53.640
<v Speaker 3>there's a right and a wrong way to have persistence.

543
00:24:53.680 --> 00:24:55.680
<v Speaker 2>There you go, that's perfect way of putting it.

544
00:24:55.880 --> 00:24:59.880
<v Speaker 1>So the guy was Martin Leslie, a pretty prominent ru

545
00:25:00.039 --> 00:25:03.039
<v Speaker 1>ugby player from New Zealand who was in scott who

546
00:25:03.079 --> 00:25:06.960
<v Speaker 1>was in Scotland to play a match with Hotland. Like

547
00:25:07.000 --> 00:25:09.000
<v Speaker 1>you said that, I know, I actually pronounced that really weird,

548
00:25:09.039 --> 00:25:12.960
<v Speaker 1>But Scotland Scotland. I just changed the name of Scotland. Sorry.

549
00:25:13.960 --> 00:25:15.880
<v Speaker 1>Some people probably announce it like that potent.

550
00:25:16.200 --> 00:25:17.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

551
00:25:17.079 --> 00:25:20.119
<v Speaker 1>So, with everything we know about Annie, chances are she

552
00:25:20.160 --> 00:25:24.160
<v Speaker 1>would have initially been really stoked that a professional rugby

553
00:25:24.160 --> 00:25:26.599
<v Speaker 1>player wanted to buy her a drink, like she had

554
00:25:26.599 --> 00:25:28.880
<v Speaker 1>a type, and like a rugby player would have been

555
00:25:28.960 --> 00:25:29.480
<v Speaker 1>her type.

556
00:25:29.680 --> 00:25:32.359
<v Speaker 2>Fair enough. Yeah, I mean honestly, if a professional rugby

557
00:25:32.400 --> 00:25:34.519
<v Speaker 2>player wanted to buy me a drink, I'd be like, dude,

558
00:25:35.119 --> 00:25:37.279
<v Speaker 2>I mean, no, homo, but let's do this thing.

559
00:25:37.960 --> 00:25:41.119
<v Speaker 1>Oh my gosh. You'd be like, yeah, let's chat. Yeah,

560
00:25:41.200 --> 00:25:42.599
<v Speaker 1>let's hear your life story.

561
00:25:42.759 --> 00:25:44.640
<v Speaker 2>I mean I might be like, you know what, no, homo,

562
00:25:44.720 --> 00:25:46.839
<v Speaker 2>but I'll try anything once. So who knows?

563
00:25:47.039 --> 00:25:48.880
<v Speaker 1>Wow, says the married man.

564
00:25:49.240 --> 00:25:51.720
<v Speaker 2>I mean yeah, I got nothing.

565
00:25:51.960 --> 00:25:53.359
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you're right here.

566
00:25:53.400 --> 00:25:53.720
<v Speaker 2>Sorry.

567
00:25:55.480 --> 00:25:59.039
<v Speaker 1>But that excitement changed relatively quickly to her trying to

568
00:25:59.119 --> 00:26:02.319
<v Speaker 1>avoid Martin. She had told family and friends on the

569
00:26:02.400 --> 00:26:05.279
<v Speaker 1>phone that he was really pushy and he kept trying

570
00:26:05.279 --> 00:26:07.480
<v Speaker 1>to get her to drink, even when she told him

571
00:26:07.480 --> 00:26:09.880
<v Speaker 1>that she didn't want to and made it clear that

572
00:26:09.920 --> 00:26:11.519
<v Speaker 1>she wasn't even interested in him.

573
00:26:11.680 --> 00:26:13.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, he sounds like a douche canoe.

574
00:26:13.400 --> 00:26:17.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and he seemed to be somewhat stalking at oh

575
00:26:18.119 --> 00:26:21.640
<v Speaker 1>because she would run into him. Around town, including the

576
00:26:21.640 --> 00:26:24.880
<v Speaker 1>swimming hall one time when she was there like to

577
00:26:24.920 --> 00:26:27.880
<v Speaker 1>work out, but she had never seen him there previously.

578
00:26:28.880 --> 00:26:31.400
<v Speaker 1>Annie ended up telling her friend later that this guy

579
00:26:31.519 --> 00:26:35.319
<v Speaker 1>was nothing but a sexual predator, which are pretty big

580
00:26:35.359 --> 00:26:38.440
<v Speaker 1>ass words, no kidding, So she didn't knock at a

581
00:26:38.440 --> 00:26:39.440
<v Speaker 1>good vibe from this guy.

582
00:26:39.880 --> 00:26:40.720
<v Speaker 2>Wow, all right.

583
00:26:41.559 --> 00:26:44.200
<v Speaker 1>These phone calls were among the first things that popped

584
00:26:44.200 --> 00:26:48.160
<v Speaker 1>into Annie's family in friends' heads when Annie was discovered dead.

585
00:26:48.559 --> 00:26:51.880
<v Speaker 2>To be fair, if I may, yeah, of course there

586
00:26:52.119 --> 00:26:54.960
<v Speaker 2>it could have very well been coincidence. Maybe he was just, hey,

587
00:26:55.000 --> 00:26:56.160
<v Speaker 2>I need to work on my cardio on it she

588
00:26:56.319 --> 00:26:57.160
<v Speaker 2>starts swimming.

589
00:26:57.079 --> 00:26:58.759
<v Speaker 1>Because he is from New Zealand.

590
00:26:58.960 --> 00:27:03.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, exactly, So maybe it could very well be coincidence. Yeah,

591
00:27:03.599 --> 00:27:06.200
<v Speaker 2>And maybe her perception of him is that he's a

592
00:27:06.240 --> 00:27:09.839
<v Speaker 2>sexual predator. But where she's getting she's going off her gut.

593
00:27:10.119 --> 00:27:13.119
<v Speaker 2>Maybe he's just trying to be nice, trying to be persistent,

594
00:27:13.119 --> 00:27:15.400
<v Speaker 2>but he's just coming off creepy who knows.

595
00:27:15.200 --> 00:27:19.559
<v Speaker 1>Right, which some people do come across creepy, yeah, meaning.

596
00:27:19.400 --> 00:27:22.240
<v Speaker 2>To be I'm not saying he wasn't a sexual predator.

597
00:27:22.279 --> 00:27:24.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm just saying we don't know for sure.

598
00:27:24.920 --> 00:27:28.480
<v Speaker 1>Well, and I'm not throwing this guy's name like what we.

599
00:27:28.599 --> 00:27:31.119
<v Speaker 2>Eat to the ground, bagging his name in the mud.

600
00:27:31.200 --> 00:27:35.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there you go, because I'll will just just wait, okay, okay.

601
00:27:35.759 --> 00:27:39.720
<v Speaker 1>So they the family notified the Scottish police, telling them

602
00:27:39.720 --> 00:27:42.599
<v Speaker 1>to look into Martin Leslie and saying that he could

603
00:27:42.640 --> 00:27:44.880
<v Speaker 1>have had something to do with Annie's death and that

604
00:27:44.960 --> 00:27:47.680
<v Speaker 1>he may have been stalking her, and the place did

605
00:27:47.720 --> 00:27:51.319
<v Speaker 1>agree to like look into this. They went about asking

606
00:27:51.319 --> 00:27:54.359
<v Speaker 1>in the places where Annie usually spent her time, especially

607
00:27:54.440 --> 00:27:57.799
<v Speaker 1>the rugby club, looking for Martin Leslie, but they hit

608
00:27:57.920 --> 00:28:02.359
<v Speaker 1>dead end after dead end until they decided that enough

609
00:28:02.640 --> 00:28:06.440
<v Speaker 1>was enough and reached out to him through the contacts

610
00:28:06.480 --> 00:28:09.839
<v Speaker 1>on his rugby team and their PR team in New Zealand.

611
00:28:10.920 --> 00:28:15.880
<v Speaker 1>In almost minutes, investigators in Scotland were in contact with Martin,

612
00:28:16.359 --> 00:28:19.759
<v Speaker 1>who simply shook his head and said that he was

613
00:28:19.759 --> 00:28:25.799
<v Speaker 1>in New Zealand at the time he was allegedly stalking Annie. Oh,

614
00:28:25.880 --> 00:28:29.119
<v Speaker 1>the investigators were able to confirm with his team that

615
00:28:29.160 --> 00:28:32.440
<v Speaker 1>Martin had been with them this whole time and he

616
00:28:32.519 --> 00:28:36.000
<v Speaker 1>was cleared of any suspicion. But this only left Annie's

617
00:28:36.000 --> 00:28:38.359
<v Speaker 1>family and friends even more confused.

618
00:28:38.480 --> 00:28:41.880
<v Speaker 2>So who was this douche canoe? Yeah, so he's just

619
00:28:42.000 --> 00:28:45.799
<v Speaker 2>claiming to be this dude basically. Okay, I'm betting that

620
00:28:45.880 --> 00:28:49.599
<v Speaker 2>he was. Whoever this is was already eyeing up Annie

621
00:28:49.640 --> 00:28:53.400
<v Speaker 2>prior to learned her type and approached her after weeks

622
00:28:53.440 --> 00:28:54.359
<v Speaker 2>of already watching her.

623
00:28:54.799 --> 00:28:58.839
<v Speaker 1>I think so too. Yeah, yeah, which I mean, so

624
00:28:59.000 --> 00:29:01.200
<v Speaker 1>I guess she didn't actually know what he looked like

625
00:29:01.319 --> 00:29:01.799
<v Speaker 1>or anything.

626
00:29:02.640 --> 00:29:03.440
<v Speaker 2>What year was this?

627
00:29:03.519 --> 00:29:05.279
<v Speaker 1>Around two thousand and five?

628
00:29:05.519 --> 00:29:08.599
<v Speaker 2>Okay, so pre most social media?

629
00:29:08.839 --> 00:29:12.240
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, but I mean here, just wait, so I'm going

630
00:29:12.319 --> 00:29:14.200
<v Speaker 1>to touch on this a little bit. Here. They were

631
00:29:14.240 --> 00:29:18.200
<v Speaker 1>all certain that Annie had spoken about meeting him. He'd

632
00:29:18.240 --> 00:29:21.839
<v Speaker 1>given her details about his life, his family, and his

633
00:29:22.440 --> 00:29:25.880
<v Speaker 1>career that all checked out with information that did fit

634
00:29:26.160 --> 00:29:28.079
<v Speaker 1>the real Martin Leslie.

635
00:29:27.960 --> 00:29:30.400
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Well, there still was Internet at this time, it

636
00:29:30.519 --> 00:29:31.920
<v Speaker 2>just wasn't yeah prevalent.

637
00:29:31.640 --> 00:29:34.599
<v Speaker 1>Right, So this person had like research. He was probably

638
00:29:34.640 --> 00:29:37.119
<v Speaker 1>a fan of Martin Leslie and Shelby, to be honest.

639
00:29:37.240 --> 00:29:38.960
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, And it wouldn't be that hard to do a

640
00:29:39.079 --> 00:29:41.400
<v Speaker 2>Google search and figure out who he was. And he

641
00:29:41.480 --> 00:29:44.119
<v Speaker 2>knew that she was into rugby players, looked up who

642
00:29:44.119 --> 00:29:46.319
<v Speaker 2>it was. Maybe he was a fan and knew exactly

643
00:29:46.359 --> 00:29:49.079
<v Speaker 2>who he pick. But his research was like that's who

644
00:29:49.079 --> 00:29:49.599
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to be.

645
00:29:50.039 --> 00:29:52.680
<v Speaker 1>Yeah for her, which is y as fuck.

646
00:29:53.200 --> 00:29:53.720
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

647
00:29:54.400 --> 00:29:57.680
<v Speaker 1>So, according to the official timelines, there was no way

648
00:29:57.759 --> 00:30:01.640
<v Speaker 1>that Martin and Annie could have ever met, especially in Scotland.

649
00:30:01.799 --> 00:30:05.960
<v Speaker 1>Scotland the assumed week in Scotland, I keep saying that funny. Hey,

650
00:30:06.079 --> 00:30:07.920
<v Speaker 1>it wasn't that bad that time. Scotland.

651
00:30:08.119 --> 00:30:11.279
<v Speaker 2>It's like Newfoundland in Canada, it's Newfoundland, but if you

652
00:30:11.319 --> 00:30:13.279
<v Speaker 2>actually read it, it's new found Land.

653
00:30:13.799 --> 00:30:13.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

654
00:30:13.960 --> 00:30:15.640
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, but we say it Newfoundland.

655
00:30:15.839 --> 00:30:18.240
<v Speaker 1>English is weird. See anyone that has to learn English,

656
00:30:18.279 --> 00:30:21.680
<v Speaker 1>I feel like it's just like fucked fucked. It's because

657
00:30:21.759 --> 00:30:24.079
<v Speaker 1>like there are literally things said the same way but

658
00:30:24.200 --> 00:30:26.160
<v Speaker 1>spelt differently. Oh yeah, Like it could be spelt three

659
00:30:26.599 --> 00:30:28.559
<v Speaker 1>ways differently, but it's said the same Yeah.

660
00:30:28.599 --> 00:30:29.799
<v Speaker 2>Where are they there over there?

661
00:30:29.839 --> 00:30:31.720
<v Speaker 1>And then you have to use them in different contexts

662
00:30:31.720 --> 00:30:36.079
<v Speaker 1>like there yeah, Oh my gosh. Anyway, now that's making

663
00:30:36.119 --> 00:30:36.720
<v Speaker 1>me sweat.

664
00:30:36.880 --> 00:30:39.319
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I who ever has to learn our shitty language,

665
00:30:39.319 --> 00:30:42.279
<v Speaker 2>we are sorry. It's a whole fucking gong.

666
00:30:42.160 --> 00:30:46.480
<v Speaker 1>Show, it actually is. So Annie's family and friends were

667
00:30:46.519 --> 00:30:49.759
<v Speaker 1>then left wondering if someone was lying or if there

668
00:30:49.839 --> 00:30:53.359
<v Speaker 1>was maybe something else going on, and they became even

669
00:30:53.440 --> 00:30:56.000
<v Speaker 1>more determined to get to the bottom of the story.

670
00:30:56.119 --> 00:30:59.599
<v Speaker 1>Like gosh, I couldn't even imagine from across the seas

671
00:30:59.839 --> 00:31:01.799
<v Speaker 1>they They all did their best to try and collect

672
00:31:01.839 --> 00:31:05.599
<v Speaker 1>all the information they could about Annie's final days, but

673
00:31:05.720 --> 00:31:09.519
<v Speaker 1>more often than not, they ended up hitting roadblocks and

674
00:31:09.559 --> 00:31:12.119
<v Speaker 1>not in the places you'd usually expect to find them

675
00:31:12.160 --> 00:31:17.400
<v Speaker 1>in any investigation, like the road Yeah, because a roadblock

676
00:31:17.640 --> 00:31:18.359
<v Speaker 1>A roadblock.

677
00:31:18.519 --> 00:31:19.400
<v Speaker 2>Sorry, bad pun.

678
00:31:19.680 --> 00:31:21.839
<v Speaker 1>That was a bad pun. I was like, I don't

679
00:31:21.839 --> 00:31:25.119
<v Speaker 1>even know how to like make this seem funnier. Sorry,

680
00:31:25.319 --> 00:31:27.519
<v Speaker 1>that was what was going on in my head. How

681
00:31:27.519 --> 00:31:29.680
<v Speaker 1>do I make Ben's bad jokes seem funnier?

682
00:31:29.799 --> 00:31:33.319
<v Speaker 2>You just like cringed at me mid podcast. Love it?

683
00:31:35.039 --> 00:31:39.039
<v Speaker 1>Oh love you, babe, Love you too, Okay. So, hoping

684
00:31:39.079 --> 00:31:42.000
<v Speaker 1>to prove and verify some of the calls Annie had

685
00:31:42.039 --> 00:31:45.319
<v Speaker 1>made to them to talk about her life and the

686
00:31:45.440 --> 00:31:49.039
<v Speaker 1>now unidentified man she met just the week before her death,

687
00:31:49.839 --> 00:31:52.599
<v Speaker 1>her family reached out to her phone provider to get

688
00:31:52.640 --> 00:31:58.480
<v Speaker 1>the information on her call history, but they got nothing. Instead.

689
00:31:59.039 --> 00:32:01.119
<v Speaker 1>When they looked at the list to people that Annie

690
00:32:01.119 --> 00:32:04.440
<v Speaker 1>had been in contact with that week, every single one

691
00:32:04.480 --> 00:32:07.519
<v Speaker 1>of their names was missing, which simply didn't make any

692
00:32:07.559 --> 00:32:11.519
<v Speaker 1>sense from her phone. Yeah, there was no record of

693
00:32:11.640 --> 00:32:14.599
<v Speaker 1>phone calls White. This was through her phone to the

694
00:32:14.599 --> 00:32:20.400
<v Speaker 1>phone company phone provider. Oh wow from apparently Yeah. Yeah.

695
00:32:20.680 --> 00:32:23.279
<v Speaker 1>Her friend family and friends knew for a fact that

696
00:32:23.319 --> 00:32:26.000
<v Speaker 1>they had all been in contact with Annie several times

697
00:32:26.039 --> 00:32:29.000
<v Speaker 1>that week, but the phone records were suddenly telling a

698
00:32:29.160 --> 00:32:33.799
<v Speaker 1>very different story. Wow, which is really messed up.

699
00:32:34.839 --> 00:32:37.240
<v Speaker 2>That is fucking intense. Holy shit.

700
00:32:37.599 --> 00:32:39.440
<v Speaker 1>That would be like us phoning tell Us and I

701
00:32:39.480 --> 00:32:42.079
<v Speaker 1>think basically and them just having no record that we

702
00:32:42.119 --> 00:32:43.279
<v Speaker 1>made any calls.

703
00:32:43.599 --> 00:32:46.119
<v Speaker 2>Or Shaw not to say that we use tell Us,

704
00:32:46.200 --> 00:32:48.519
<v Speaker 2>because if tell Us wants us to say we use them,

705
00:32:48.559 --> 00:32:50.039
<v Speaker 2>they'd have to sponsor us.

706
00:32:50.480 --> 00:32:58.960
<v Speaker 1>Oh my gosh, Okay, where the hell am I know? Okay,

707
00:32:58.960 --> 00:33:01.920
<v Speaker 1>So the Scottish police took a look at those phone

708
00:33:01.920 --> 00:33:05.319
<v Speaker 1>records too, and it did nothing to push them into

709
00:33:05.359 --> 00:33:08.759
<v Speaker 1>investigating the case any further, of course, right, it didn't

710
00:33:08.839 --> 00:33:12.720
<v Speaker 1>change their minds about determining Annie's death as suicide, and

711
00:33:12.839 --> 00:33:16.480
<v Speaker 1>instead they turned around and said that the data they

712
00:33:16.599 --> 00:33:19.440
<v Speaker 1>had and the story Annie's family and friends were telling

713
00:33:19.519 --> 00:33:23.400
<v Speaker 1>them didn't add up, because apparently, to the phone records,

714
00:33:23.720 --> 00:33:26.559
<v Speaker 1>Annie hadn't made or received any phone calls in the

715
00:33:26.640 --> 00:33:29.240
<v Speaker 1>last three days leading up to her death, but.

716
00:33:29.200 --> 00:33:31.200
<v Speaker 2>The family would be able to provide their call history,

717
00:33:31.359 --> 00:33:31.920
<v Speaker 2>you would.

718
00:33:31.720 --> 00:33:35.480
<v Speaker 1>Think so, right, Yeah, I don't know, but I think

719
00:33:35.680 --> 00:33:38.759
<v Speaker 1>the police were just like, it seemed like they're just

720
00:33:38.799 --> 00:33:43.240
<v Speaker 1>not even what's the word receptive. Yeah, they weren't even

721
00:33:43.319 --> 00:33:45.079
<v Speaker 1>They're just like, this case.

722
00:33:44.920 --> 00:33:47.720
<v Speaker 2>Is closed, okay, They're just kind of brushing it off me, like, yeah.

723
00:33:47.759 --> 00:33:52.640
<v Speaker 1>Brushing it off. Yeah. So this completely knocked Annie's family,

724
00:33:52.680 --> 00:33:54.720
<v Speaker 1>who at this point just felt like they were finding

725
00:33:54.759 --> 00:33:58.000
<v Speaker 1>this huge or fighting this huge uphill battle and the

726
00:33:58.000 --> 00:34:01.279
<v Speaker 1>Scottish police had no interest in hearing any opinions and

727
00:34:01.319 --> 00:34:04.680
<v Speaker 1>they didn't agree with their own. Fuck, but their daughter

728
00:34:04.799 --> 00:34:07.880
<v Speaker 1>was dead and they still had no answers to explain why.

729
00:34:08.119 --> 00:34:08.880
<v Speaker 2>That's brutal.

730
00:34:10.119 --> 00:34:12.639
<v Speaker 1>Annie's mother then came up with the idea to have

731
00:34:12.679 --> 00:34:16.639
<v Speaker 1>a look at Annie's email account okay okay, hoping that

732
00:34:16.719 --> 00:34:20.039
<v Speaker 1>something would be in there that could potentially bowl the

733
00:34:20.079 --> 00:34:23.320
<v Speaker 1>case wide open. But when she logged into Annie's account

734
00:34:23.320 --> 00:34:26.719
<v Speaker 1>and opened her mailbox, it was wiped. It was again

735
00:34:26.840 --> 00:34:31.360
<v Speaker 1>completely cleared. Wow, just like her phone records, Annie's entire

736
00:34:31.440 --> 00:34:38.239
<v Speaker 1>mailbox incoming and outcoming, everything gone. Wow. But I mean, okay,

737
00:34:38.360 --> 00:34:41.599
<v Speaker 1>that one some people do actually like are like pretty

738
00:34:41.599 --> 00:34:44.559
<v Speaker 1>obsessed with clearing their inbox. Like I'm my freaking inbox

739
00:34:44.639 --> 00:34:47.360
<v Speaker 1>right now is has seventeen hundred on read messages, which

740
00:34:47.440 --> 00:34:51.079
<v Speaker 1>oh god, people would just barf god.

741
00:34:51.239 --> 00:34:54.079
<v Speaker 2>I get to a hundred and then I have to

742
00:34:54.079 --> 00:34:54.880
<v Speaker 2>go and clear shit.

743
00:34:55.360 --> 00:34:58.400
<v Speaker 1>Well, I got one hundred and twenty five messages today,

744
00:34:58.480 --> 00:35:00.800
<v Speaker 1>so I clearly have to start some describing to shit.

745
00:35:00.960 --> 00:35:05.559
<v Speaker 1>No kidding, but anyway, I do think the inbox being

746
00:35:05.599 --> 00:35:08.000
<v Speaker 1>cleared makes kind of sense to me, But the oat

747
00:35:08.039 --> 00:35:10.360
<v Speaker 1>box doesn't necessarily make sense because I don't know if

748
00:35:10.360 --> 00:35:11.280
<v Speaker 1>people really.

749
00:35:11.599 --> 00:35:14.159
<v Speaker 2>That's not something that's generally cleared because.

750
00:35:13.960 --> 00:35:16.400
<v Speaker 1>You kind of almost want to keep that. Yeah, So

751
00:35:17.639 --> 00:35:21.360
<v Speaker 1>no one could figure out why and why any and

752
00:35:21.400 --> 00:35:23.920
<v Speaker 1>all the information that should have been very black and

753
00:35:23.960 --> 00:35:29.320
<v Speaker 1>white and usually key evidence in investigations kept coming up blank.

754
00:35:29.519 --> 00:35:32.519
<v Speaker 2>Oh I can tell you why, because someone fucking deleted it.

755
00:35:32.679 --> 00:35:36.079
<v Speaker 1>I know, because it was It wasn't just like fuzzy

756
00:35:36.159 --> 00:35:38.960
<v Speaker 1>like it was just like entirely missing this shit, right.

757
00:35:39.159 --> 00:35:43.599
<v Speaker 1>So that was until Annie's best friend connected a few

758
00:35:43.639 --> 00:35:46.639
<v Speaker 1>dots that took this case to a whole new level.

759
00:35:46.760 --> 00:35:49.960
<v Speaker 2>Shit, I am on the edge of my seat.

760
00:35:50.039 --> 00:35:53.639
<v Speaker 1>So her friend's name was Maria. She found an American

761
00:35:53.840 --> 00:35:59.440
<v Speaker 1>investigative journalist by the name of Christina Borjesin, who wrote

762
00:35:59.480 --> 00:36:03.199
<v Speaker 1>several highly critical articles about American policies.

763
00:36:03.400 --> 00:36:05.039
<v Speaker 2>Way she had the same last name as Annie.

764
00:36:05.199 --> 00:36:05.400
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

765
00:36:05.480 --> 00:36:06.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh, was it like a sibling?

766
00:36:07.559 --> 00:36:10.719
<v Speaker 1>Just wait, okay, you can just wait.

767
00:36:10.800 --> 00:36:13.079
<v Speaker 2>Sorry, will you? It just seemed like you're going to

768
00:36:13.159 --> 00:36:15.000
<v Speaker 2>just blow past the same last name.

769
00:36:15.079 --> 00:36:18.440
<v Speaker 1>Oh I'm not blown past that. So the coincidence of

770
00:36:18.480 --> 00:36:21.920
<v Speaker 1>both Annie and Christina sharing a last name can be

771
00:36:22.400 --> 00:36:25.880
<v Speaker 1>overlooked at first, like people share the same last name. Yeah,

772
00:36:25.920 --> 00:36:28.519
<v Speaker 1>But a lot more than just a family name ties

773
00:36:28.599 --> 00:36:33.280
<v Speaker 1>these two younger women together. Annie's middle name was Christina,

774
00:36:33.880 --> 00:36:38.320
<v Speaker 1>so she was Annie Christina Boriesin. And the last article

775
00:36:38.400 --> 00:36:43.239
<v Speaker 1>that American journalist Christina Borrijesen wrote about involved Scotland and

776
00:36:43.360 --> 00:36:48.639
<v Speaker 1>one particular place in Scotland, the Prestwick Airport. The article

777
00:36:48.760 --> 00:36:55.079
<v Speaker 1>investigated and criticized Scotland for allowing American planes caring criminals

778
00:36:55.119 --> 00:36:58.280
<v Speaker 1>on their way to places where they could legally torture

779
00:36:58.559 --> 00:37:03.920
<v Speaker 1>for information to and refuel in this airport, the same

780
00:37:04.000 --> 00:37:07.239
<v Speaker 1>airport that Annie traveled back and forth in Sweden, or

781
00:37:07.480 --> 00:37:10.159
<v Speaker 1>back and forth to Sweden from and the airport that

782
00:37:10.280 --> 00:37:13.320
<v Speaker 1>was only a mile from where Annie's body was found,

783
00:37:14.760 --> 00:37:17.840
<v Speaker 1>and we'll bounce back to more about Christina shortly. I'm

784
00:37:17.840 --> 00:37:20.239
<v Speaker 1>going to leave you hanging here off for foxx sakes,

785
00:37:20.679 --> 00:37:24.760
<v Speaker 1>But first, Annie had allegedly visited the airport the day

786
00:37:24.800 --> 00:37:28.079
<v Speaker 1>before her body was found, So we're kind of like

787
00:37:28.159 --> 00:37:30.639
<v Speaker 1>going to December third, right now.

788
00:37:30.760 --> 00:37:31.159
<v Speaker 2>Okay.

789
00:37:31.719 --> 00:37:35.239
<v Speaker 1>Annie was found on Sunday, December fourth, so it can

790
00:37:35.280 --> 00:37:37.639
<v Speaker 1>be assumed that she was at the airport on December

791
00:37:37.639 --> 00:37:40.960
<v Speaker 1>third to catch a flight home. I don't know if

792
00:37:41.000 --> 00:37:44.880
<v Speaker 1>Annie's family knew exactly when she was coming home, but

793
00:37:45.400 --> 00:37:49.480
<v Speaker 1>we do know they were expecting her sometime around this time. Gotcha, Yeah,

794
00:37:50.199 --> 00:37:52.719
<v Speaker 1>And she had her appointment with her hairdresser on Monday,

795
00:37:52.840 --> 00:37:56.639
<v Speaker 1>library books to return, and she had her passport.

796
00:37:56.199 --> 00:37:58.880
<v Speaker 2>With her and a check for three.

797
00:37:59.280 --> 00:38:04.559
<v Speaker 1>Three hundred pounds sorry pounds. She went to the Central

798
00:38:04.559 --> 00:38:07.639
<v Speaker 1>station where she tried to take money out of an

799
00:38:07.639 --> 00:38:10.440
<v Speaker 1>ATM twice. I think she tried to take a hundred

800
00:38:10.440 --> 00:38:14.280
<v Speaker 1>bucks first and then fifty bucks, but both times she

801
00:38:14.320 --> 00:38:16.719
<v Speaker 1>didn't have enough money in her account for the transaction

802
00:38:16.840 --> 00:38:20.280
<v Speaker 1>to go through. The leading theory is that Annie was

803
00:38:20.320 --> 00:38:22.199
<v Speaker 1>trying to get money out so that she could buy

804
00:38:22.239 --> 00:38:25.280
<v Speaker 1>her plane ticket back home. And remember she had this

805
00:38:25.400 --> 00:38:28.599
<v Speaker 1>uncash check for three hundred pounds on her So why

806
00:38:28.599 --> 00:38:30.880
<v Speaker 1>didn't she cash the check if she didn't have enough

807
00:38:30.920 --> 00:38:33.960
<v Speaker 1>money in cash to buy her plane ticket?

808
00:38:34.199 --> 00:38:36.159
<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean, if you cash a check at an ATM,

809
00:38:36.199 --> 00:38:38.079
<v Speaker 2>it's going to be held for like three to five days.

810
00:38:38.239 --> 00:38:39.880
<v Speaker 1>It could, but I think if you like go in

811
00:38:40.000 --> 00:38:43.880
<v Speaker 1>you can probably get the funds. Maybe they were closed, yeah,

812
00:38:43.880 --> 00:38:45.960
<v Speaker 1>but if she's at the airport. She wasn't at the

813
00:38:46.000 --> 00:38:48.079
<v Speaker 1>airport and she went to the bank, OK, gotcha. So

814
00:38:48.119 --> 00:38:51.639
<v Speaker 1>she was like at these ATMs, but she was unsuccessful

815
00:38:51.960 --> 00:38:55.119
<v Speaker 1>in getting money. So then Annie caught the bus from

816
00:38:55.199 --> 00:38:58.480
<v Speaker 1>the central station and headed straight to the airport, where

817
00:38:58.519 --> 00:39:02.519
<v Speaker 1>she was caught on CCTV footage. According to the footage,

818
00:39:02.639 --> 00:39:06.280
<v Speaker 1>Annie was at the airport a total five minutes before

819
00:39:06.320 --> 00:39:10.320
<v Speaker 1>she left, taking a totally different route. She didn't try

820
00:39:10.400 --> 00:39:12.960
<v Speaker 1>to buy a ticket, She didn't really do anything. She

821
00:39:13.000 --> 00:39:17.519
<v Speaker 1>sort of arrived at the airport and then left. Huh.

822
00:39:17.719 --> 00:39:21.000
<v Speaker 1>Camera showed her leaving the airport through the short stay

823
00:39:21.079 --> 00:39:25.280
<v Speaker 1>car park, suggesting that she planned on walking back into

824
00:39:25.320 --> 00:39:28.840
<v Speaker 1>town instead of taking the bus. And it was it

825
00:39:28.880 --> 00:39:32.039
<v Speaker 1>was this or sorry and this is where things got

826
00:39:32.440 --> 00:39:35.880
<v Speaker 1>tricky again, Like it's just we're just all over our

827
00:39:35.880 --> 00:39:41.239
<v Speaker 1>place here. Her family stated that the CCTV from the

828
00:39:41.239 --> 00:39:45.840
<v Speaker 1>airport showed images of Annie looking angry, like she did

829
00:39:45.880 --> 00:39:50.119
<v Speaker 1>not look happy, so they speculated if maybe she was

830
00:39:50.199 --> 00:39:53.920
<v Speaker 1>perhaps planning to meet someone there and they didn't show

831
00:39:55.639 --> 00:39:57.920
<v Speaker 1>And this is a side note that I haven't mentioned yet.

832
00:39:58.360 --> 00:40:02.280
<v Speaker 1>One thing is that before Annie died, she had mentioned

833
00:40:02.320 --> 00:40:05.159
<v Speaker 1>to her dad that she was going to get married.

834
00:40:05.599 --> 00:40:07.000
<v Speaker 1>But that's all we know about that.

835
00:40:07.239 --> 00:40:10.719
<v Speaker 2>Now. You just dropped this fucking bomb on us. Yeah, okay, okay,

836
00:40:10.760 --> 00:40:11.400
<v Speaker 2>what the fuck?

837
00:40:11.599 --> 00:40:14.079
<v Speaker 1>So I think some people are like, maybe she was

838
00:40:14.920 --> 00:40:17.320
<v Speaker 1>going to be meeting her future husband at the airport

839
00:40:17.360 --> 00:40:19.119
<v Speaker 1>and like they were going to be going home together,

840
00:40:19.199 --> 00:40:20.360
<v Speaker 1>but then he didn't show up.

841
00:40:20.920 --> 00:40:24.119
<v Speaker 2>But she only waited five minutes. That's not that people

842
00:40:24.119 --> 00:40:25.480
<v Speaker 2>are going to wait a lot longer than five.

843
00:40:25.599 --> 00:40:30.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, you would unless they had messaged her or something.

844
00:40:30.599 --> 00:40:34.320
<v Speaker 2>Right, Yeah, but I mean two thousand and five phones

845
00:40:34.360 --> 00:40:35.719
<v Speaker 2>weren't as prevalent then.

846
00:40:36.400 --> 00:40:38.480
<v Speaker 1>I think in two thousand and five you still had

847
00:40:38.480 --> 00:40:41.159
<v Speaker 1>a phone. We were in high school and we had phones.

848
00:40:41.239 --> 00:40:44.079
<v Speaker 2>I didn't have a phone in high school. My parents

849
00:40:44.119 --> 00:40:47.039
<v Speaker 2>didn't have cell phones on. I got my first phone,

850
00:40:47.039 --> 00:40:48.960
<v Speaker 2>I think in two thousand and seven.

851
00:40:49.480 --> 00:40:51.599
<v Speaker 1>Really, I'm like pretty certain I had a phone in

852
00:40:51.599 --> 00:40:54.639
<v Speaker 1>two thousand and five, two thousands. I got a flip phone.

853
00:40:54.840 --> 00:40:59.239
<v Speaker 2>I got my first the old school Nokia phone when

854
00:40:59.239 --> 00:41:03.239
<v Speaker 2>I got my first job at that sawmill, because I

855
00:41:03.320 --> 00:41:04.920
<v Speaker 2>was on call and I needed a way to make

856
00:41:04.920 --> 00:41:07.079
<v Speaker 2>sure I was available for a call. And that's when

857
00:41:07.079 --> 00:41:07.719
<v Speaker 2>I got my phone.

858
00:41:08.280 --> 00:41:11.079
<v Speaker 1>Honestly, those were the good old days. Yeah, because the

859
00:41:11.119 --> 00:41:14.360
<v Speaker 1>fact that you just have to be readily fucking available

860
00:41:14.840 --> 00:41:18.000
<v Speaker 1>at any moment now sucks for anyone all the time,

861
00:41:18.360 --> 00:41:24.400
<v Speaker 1>Like sucks. Yeah, that's my ted talk. Okay, So back

862
00:41:24.400 --> 00:41:27.760
<v Speaker 1>to the airport. According and this kind of gets a

863
00:41:27.760 --> 00:41:30.119
<v Speaker 1>little bit confusing, so I'm trying to like word it

864
00:41:30.199 --> 00:41:33.559
<v Speaker 1>so it's not But according to the time stamps, Annie

865
00:41:33.599 --> 00:41:37.039
<v Speaker 1>could have only reached the area she was spotted going

866
00:41:37.079 --> 00:41:40.320
<v Speaker 1>into the airport to when she was seen leaving, the

867
00:41:40.400 --> 00:41:43.480
<v Speaker 1>exact time frame that the time stamp on the footage

868
00:41:43.480 --> 00:41:48.079
<v Speaker 1>said she had if she had been running. Oh, but

869
00:41:48.159 --> 00:41:52.039
<v Speaker 1>the footage shows Annie carrying her bag and walking completely normal,

870
00:41:53.880 --> 00:41:56.400
<v Speaker 1>And people had gone back and like tried to redo

871
00:41:56.440 --> 00:41:59.039
<v Speaker 1>this and yeah, to do to get to where she was,

872
00:41:59.079 --> 00:42:00.360
<v Speaker 1>you had have been like running.

873
00:42:00.119 --> 00:42:02.199
<v Speaker 2>From like basically gate to gate sort of thing, right,

874
00:42:02.280 --> 00:42:03.880
<v Speaker 2>kind Oh yeah, wow.

875
00:42:04.320 --> 00:42:07.920
<v Speaker 1>So Annie left the airport at fifteen fifteen, and, according

876
00:42:07.960 --> 00:42:11.800
<v Speaker 1>to more CCTV analysis, was believed to be seen again

877
00:42:11.840 --> 00:42:16.079
<v Speaker 1>at sixteen oh five at Station Road. Then they can

878
00:42:16.119 --> 00:42:19.960
<v Speaker 1>only say believe because the footage doesn't actually show the

879
00:42:20.000 --> 00:42:23.440
<v Speaker 1>woman's face, but she has the same backpack as Annie,

880
00:42:24.039 --> 00:42:26.119
<v Speaker 1>and that was enough for the place to determine that

881
00:42:26.159 --> 00:42:29.559
<v Speaker 1>it was Annie. So the thing is like they're just

882
00:42:30.079 --> 00:42:33.360
<v Speaker 1>assuming shit, Yeah, they are, like a lot of people

883
00:42:33.360 --> 00:42:35.880
<v Speaker 1>have the same backpack. They don't make one of something.

884
00:42:36.079 --> 00:42:37.800
<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

885
00:42:37.840 --> 00:42:41.719
<v Speaker 1>So, just twenty minutes after Annie was supposedly at Station Road,

886
00:42:42.760 --> 00:42:46.159
<v Speaker 1>two men reported seeing someone standing on the beach. The

887
00:42:46.199 --> 00:42:48.920
<v Speaker 1>person had their hood up, and the men couldn't say

888
00:42:48.920 --> 00:42:51.239
<v Speaker 1>if it had been a man or a woman, only

889
00:42:51.320 --> 00:42:55.239
<v Speaker 1>that they seemed to be standing eerily still while staring

890
00:42:55.239 --> 00:42:58.480
<v Speaker 1>out at the water. The men left the person alone

891
00:42:58.519 --> 00:43:01.360
<v Speaker 1>and continued their walk along the beach, but when they

892
00:43:01.360 --> 00:43:04.920
<v Speaker 1>were on their way back, this person was still standing there,

893
00:43:05.199 --> 00:43:10.199
<v Speaker 1>just watching the water. The investigators determined from the report

894
00:43:10.440 --> 00:43:13.199
<v Speaker 1>that this person was Annie and this was her amping

895
00:43:13.280 --> 00:43:14.960
<v Speaker 1>herself up to commit suicide.

896
00:43:15.079 --> 00:43:18.920
<v Speaker 2>Fuck that. I'm sorry. I've sat there watching water lots.

897
00:43:19.119 --> 00:43:20.760
<v Speaker 1>I know what if you were just like a and

898
00:43:20.800 --> 00:43:22.440
<v Speaker 1>they had no idea if this person was like a

899
00:43:22.440 --> 00:43:26.079
<v Speaker 1>man or woman or yeah, I freaking love the ocean,

900
00:43:26.280 --> 00:43:28.239
<v Speaker 1>so I could stand there for a while and just watch.

901
00:43:28.400 --> 00:43:32.360
<v Speaker 2>Could you imagine if it's like everyone who just stood

902
00:43:32.360 --> 00:43:36.599
<v Speaker 2>there watching a scenic landscape of some sort was just

903
00:43:36.639 --> 00:43:40.559
<v Speaker 2>assumed that they're about to commit suicide. Yeah, Like, I'm

904
00:43:40.599 --> 00:43:42.920
<v Speaker 2>pretty sure that's damn near the fucking opposite. When I'm

905
00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:45.199
<v Speaker 2>like I need to get out of this like depression state.

906
00:43:45.239 --> 00:43:47.280
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to go look at something and relax.

907
00:43:46.920 --> 00:43:49.000
<v Speaker 1>You know, yeah, and just like, oh man, how can

908
00:43:49.039 --> 00:43:51.519
<v Speaker 1>I get out of the situation. You're going to go

909
00:43:51.559 --> 00:43:54.440
<v Speaker 1>to somewhere that's really beautiful and just take some deep

910
00:43:54.480 --> 00:43:57.239
<v Speaker 1>breasts and just like try to get back get back

911
00:43:57.239 --> 00:43:58.559
<v Speaker 1>on your groove exactly.

912
00:43:59.119 --> 00:44:02.800
<v Speaker 2>So, so I no, I do not subscribe to that. Yeah,

913
00:44:02.880 --> 00:44:04.719
<v Speaker 2>yeah at all.

914
00:44:04.920 --> 00:44:08.039
<v Speaker 1>So what exactly was Annie doing that day? And had

915
00:44:08.039 --> 00:44:10.760
<v Speaker 1>the footage at the airport been altered or was there

916
00:44:10.800 --> 00:44:14.079
<v Speaker 1>something missing from it all together? Had Annie been there

917
00:44:14.119 --> 00:44:16.079
<v Speaker 1>to try to buy a ticket, or had she been

918
00:44:16.119 --> 00:44:19.639
<v Speaker 1>there for some other reason? Now to bounce back to

919
00:44:19.760 --> 00:44:25.599
<v Speaker 1>Christina Bouryessin. There's two theories there, the first one being

920
00:44:26.119 --> 00:44:31.480
<v Speaker 1>that Annie herself was actually Christina.

921
00:44:32.360 --> 00:44:34.280
<v Speaker 2>Okay, wait, what so.

922
00:44:34.119 --> 00:44:41.119
<v Speaker 1>That Annie was actually this writer Christina. That's like, that's

923
00:44:41.159 --> 00:44:44.760
<v Speaker 1>one very far out theory that some reports do say.

924
00:44:44.880 --> 00:44:48.320
<v Speaker 1>I don't. I don't technically believe that, but they're saying

925
00:44:48.360 --> 00:44:51.400
<v Speaker 1>these two people were actually the same person and that

926
00:44:51.519 --> 00:44:54.519
<v Speaker 1>Annie was actually like a journalist writing these stories.

927
00:44:54.679 --> 00:44:57.400
<v Speaker 2>Okay, but do they know who Christina is today?

928
00:44:58.039 --> 00:45:00.400
<v Speaker 1>Yes, I believe they do. So I don't think that

929
00:45:00.400 --> 00:45:02.719
<v Speaker 1>that theory makes any sense, but I did read it,

930
00:45:02.719 --> 00:45:04.119
<v Speaker 1>so I was like, I'm gonna put it in here.

931
00:45:04.320 --> 00:45:06.719
<v Speaker 2>Okay, yeah, I'm pretty sure the family would be like, yeah,

932
00:45:06.760 --> 00:45:07.559
<v Speaker 2>that's not our daughter.

933
00:45:07.760 --> 00:45:11.320
<v Speaker 1>So the more common theory, though, is that this was

934
00:45:11.360 --> 00:45:14.760
<v Speaker 1>a case of mistaken identity and this makes sense to me,

935
00:45:15.320 --> 00:45:19.199
<v Speaker 1>and that Annie was mistaken to be Christina, and being

936
00:45:19.239 --> 00:45:21.880
<v Speaker 1>that Christina had written an article on a pretty hot

937
00:45:21.960 --> 00:45:27.679
<v Speaker 1>topic involving politics, perhaps security services believed Annie was in

938
00:45:27.719 --> 00:45:33.239
<v Speaker 1>Scotland to investigate the airport. Yeah, and she attracted some

939
00:45:33.400 --> 00:45:35.280
<v Speaker 1>unwonted attention that went south.

940
00:45:35.480 --> 00:45:40.440
<v Speaker 2>Oh snap, Yeah, that's very plausible, actually, can I can

941
00:45:40.480 --> 00:45:41.280
<v Speaker 2>totally see that.

942
00:45:41.679 --> 00:45:45.719
<v Speaker 1>If only Annie's file offax could be found, which from

943
00:45:45.719 --> 00:45:47.599
<v Speaker 1>what I can tell, is just like a planner. I

944
00:45:47.639 --> 00:45:49.119
<v Speaker 1>don't know if you heard that file.

945
00:45:48.920 --> 00:45:51.960
<v Speaker 2>Offax, No, can't say.

946
00:45:51.639 --> 00:45:53.519
<v Speaker 1>I think, yeah, I think it might be kind of

947
00:45:53.519 --> 00:45:56.880
<v Speaker 1>from over there. So her file of flax and fleece

948
00:45:57.079 --> 00:46:00.559
<v Speaker 1>jacket were the only two items missing from Annie's bay.

949
00:46:00.599 --> 00:46:03.480
<v Speaker 1>Within her file of flax, Annie would have kept all

950
00:46:03.559 --> 00:46:07.719
<v Speaker 1>her documentation together, her id, her money, and more importantly,

951
00:46:07.760 --> 00:46:10.480
<v Speaker 1>Annie used it to keep detailed notes about her days,

952
00:46:11.360 --> 00:46:14.639
<v Speaker 1>so her travel plans, maybe even contact information for this

953
00:46:14.719 --> 00:46:19.719
<v Speaker 1>mysterious man who called himself Martin Leslie. Okay, the folder

954
00:46:19.800 --> 00:46:23.079
<v Speaker 1>was believed by Annie's family to have the answers to

955
00:46:23.199 --> 00:46:27.920
<v Speaker 1>many unknown questions, but unfortunately it was never discovered. But

956
00:46:28.000 --> 00:46:31.599
<v Speaker 1>it was also never really searched for. Like they kind

957
00:46:31.599 --> 00:46:33.679
<v Speaker 1>of thought they should have got the coastguards or something

958
00:46:33.719 --> 00:46:35.840
<v Speaker 1>to search within the waters for this, but like nothing

959
00:46:35.880 --> 00:46:39.360
<v Speaker 1>like that happened. Fuck Okay, So now the last thing

960
00:46:39.400 --> 00:46:42.599
<v Speaker 1>we'll basically touch on is Annie's body being returned to

961
00:46:42.639 --> 00:46:46.039
<v Speaker 1>Sweden so her family could bury her there. Yeah, they

962
00:46:46.079 --> 00:46:48.239
<v Speaker 1>were finally able to get their hands on some physical

963
00:46:48.280 --> 00:46:51.960
<v Speaker 1>evidence to prove that their daughter didn't commit suicide. This

964
00:46:52.320 --> 00:46:56.400
<v Speaker 1>was their hope. The first thing was that the Swedish Undertaker.

965
00:46:56.519 --> 00:46:57.280
<v Speaker 1>Do you know what that is?

966
00:46:57.719 --> 00:46:59.039
<v Speaker 2>Well? I know what an undertaker is.

967
00:46:59.119 --> 00:47:01.920
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So if you're not familiar with the term, I wasn't.

968
00:47:02.239 --> 00:47:07.280
<v Speaker 1>An undertaker is basically like a funeral home operator, so

969
00:47:07.360 --> 00:47:09.440
<v Speaker 1>someone who prepares bodies for burial.

970
00:47:09.679 --> 00:47:12.320
<v Speaker 2>I learned what an undertaker was at a really young age.

971
00:47:12.480 --> 00:47:15.159
<v Speaker 1>Really, I had never heard of Edward referred to that.

972
00:47:15.239 --> 00:47:17.400
<v Speaker 2>Well. As a kid, I watched a bit of wrestling.

973
00:47:17.480 --> 00:47:19.119
<v Speaker 2>There was a wrestler named the Undertaker.

974
00:47:19.360 --> 00:47:20.880
<v Speaker 1>Oh my god, what.

975
00:47:20.840 --> 00:47:21.840
<v Speaker 2>It was because of him.

976
00:47:22.519 --> 00:47:25.360
<v Speaker 1>I'm not like a huge fan of wrestling, but that's

977
00:47:25.440 --> 00:47:28.280
<v Speaker 1>a terrific name for a wrestler, isn't it? Like it

978
00:47:28.320 --> 00:47:29.599
<v Speaker 1>doesn't actually get better than Yeah?

979
00:47:29.840 --> 00:47:32.639
<v Speaker 2>He was. He was like super goth and badass.

980
00:47:32.719 --> 00:47:33.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah wow.

981
00:47:34.320 --> 00:47:35.679
<v Speaker 2>There was times he would like come out in a

982
00:47:35.760 --> 00:47:36.800
<v Speaker 2>coffin and shit.

983
00:47:36.719 --> 00:47:40.159
<v Speaker 1>Wow wow, like really went with that title?

984
00:47:40.239 --> 00:47:41.280
<v Speaker 2>Oh fuck, yeah he did.

985
00:47:41.440 --> 00:47:45.519
<v Speaker 1>Okay, So the Undertaker now I just can't think of

986
00:47:45.559 --> 00:47:49.199
<v Speaker 1>this without thinking of that. Took one look at Annie's

987
00:47:49.239 --> 00:47:52.639
<v Speaker 1>autopsy report and said the injuries stated in the report

988
00:47:53.039 --> 00:47:56.199
<v Speaker 1>did not match with what they were seeing on her body.

989
00:47:56.960 --> 00:47:59.840
<v Speaker 1>They claimed she had several bruises that seemed to be

990
00:48:01.039 --> 00:48:03.920
<v Speaker 1>incurred while she was still alive, which the autopsy in

991
00:48:03.920 --> 00:48:08.519
<v Speaker 1>Scotland hadn't recorded. Even when taking bruising and discolouration that

992
00:48:08.599 --> 00:48:11.679
<v Speaker 1>happens after death into account, they couldn't see why the

993
00:48:11.719 --> 00:48:14.960
<v Speaker 1>massive bruise on the side right arm and behind the

994
00:48:15.000 --> 00:48:18.639
<v Speaker 1>ear that was larger than described hadn't been included in

995
00:48:18.719 --> 00:48:21.960
<v Speaker 1>the report or looked at at looked into it all.

996
00:48:24.800 --> 00:48:28.559
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I fucking I said it at the beginning. I'm sorry,

997
00:48:28.599 --> 00:48:30.840
<v Speaker 2>I basically did. What did you say with those bruises?

998
00:48:30.840 --> 00:48:32.920
<v Speaker 2>I was really suspect to those bruises, Okay, you know

999
00:48:32.960 --> 00:48:35.119
<v Speaker 2>the importance of them in like bruce mortem or whatever.

1000
00:48:35.880 --> 00:48:38.719
<v Speaker 1>So I mean, and the thing is, like, I hope

1001
00:48:38.880 --> 00:48:43.239
<v Speaker 1>the undertaker would know so much, but then also it

1002
00:48:43.519 --> 00:48:48.000
<v Speaker 1>would they have. It's not like a like a autopsy. Yeah, yeah, right.

1003
00:48:48.840 --> 00:48:52.320
<v Speaker 1>So these findings only gave Annie's friends and family new

1004
00:48:52.360 --> 00:48:55.719
<v Speaker 1>hope that her case maybe could be reopened right.

1005
00:48:55.840 --> 00:48:59.840
<v Speaker 2>And deemed not a suicide. But no, really, no fuck.

1006
00:49:00.760 --> 00:49:04.360
<v Speaker 1>The family even reached out to the Swedish police so

1007
00:49:04.400 --> 00:49:07.239
<v Speaker 1>their own police, and begged for help with trying to

1008
00:49:07.239 --> 00:49:11.360
<v Speaker 1>figure out what happened to Annie. And noo sympathetic Swedish

1009
00:49:11.360 --> 00:49:14.119
<v Speaker 1>police told Annie's family that there was no way they

1010
00:49:14.119 --> 00:49:18.480
<v Speaker 1>could launch a separate investigation into Annie's death without jeopardizing

1011
00:49:18.800 --> 00:49:23.119
<v Speaker 1>Sweden's relationship with a foreign company. Our country. What the

1012
00:49:23.159 --> 00:49:24.199
<v Speaker 1>fuck's in the country.

1013
00:49:24.440 --> 00:49:27.519
<v Speaker 2>Okay, I mean I can I can totally understand.

1014
00:49:27.679 --> 00:49:30.159
<v Speaker 1>I can kind of understand that too, but gosh, his

1015
00:49:30.320 --> 00:49:31.559
<v Speaker 1>family just is like.

1016
00:49:33.360 --> 00:49:33.719
<v Speaker 2>Fucked.

1017
00:49:34.000 --> 00:49:38.159
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, Like there's closure nothing. Yeah. And that's basically that

1018
00:49:38.320 --> 00:49:42.840
<v Speaker 1>the Scottish people certainly wanted answers, almost as much as

1019
00:49:42.880 --> 00:49:44.519
<v Speaker 1>that as Annie's family did.

1020
00:49:44.800 --> 00:49:47.039
<v Speaker 2>Well, I'm sure everyone does so much.

1021
00:49:46.880 --> 00:49:51.280
<v Speaker 1>So that anonymous person had placed a plaque on Preswick

1022
00:49:51.360 --> 00:49:56.920
<v Speaker 1>Bay that read Annie Boyesen born January seventh, nineteen seventy five,

1023
00:49:57.480 --> 00:50:01.000
<v Speaker 1>found dead December fourth, two thousand and five. Her loved

1024
00:50:01.000 --> 00:50:04.599
<v Speaker 1>ones never found out how or why a blot on

1025
00:50:04.639 --> 00:50:06.639
<v Speaker 1>Scotland's reputation for fairness.

1026
00:50:07.119 --> 00:50:07.599
<v Speaker 2>Wow.

1027
00:50:08.159 --> 00:50:11.199
<v Speaker 1>And that's so that's a plot that's there or plague

1028
00:50:11.320 --> 00:50:16.480
<v Speaker 1>or yeah, plack plaque. Wow, good thing we're wrapping up here.

1029
00:50:16.519 --> 00:50:18.039
<v Speaker 2>It's no kidding roller coaster.

1030
00:50:18.880 --> 00:50:22.920
<v Speaker 1>So since Annie's death, her mother hasn't given up. She can't.

1031
00:50:23.079 --> 00:50:27.079
<v Speaker 1>She's campaigned relentlessly for official for an official inquest into

1032
00:50:27.159 --> 00:50:31.960
<v Speaker 1>her daughter's death, including presenting a three thousand signature petition

1033
00:50:32.079 --> 00:50:35.079
<v Speaker 1>to the Scottish Parliament at the end of twenty thirteen.

1034
00:50:35.920 --> 00:50:39.079
<v Speaker 1>In regards to Scotland, she said, this is a beautiful

1035
00:50:39.119 --> 00:50:43.199
<v Speaker 1>country with lovely and caring people. Please do not leave

1036
00:50:43.280 --> 00:50:47.360
<v Speaker 1>them and our family with all these unanswered questions. All

1037
00:50:47.400 --> 00:50:51.800
<v Speaker 1>we want is a fatal accident inquiry into Annie's mysterious death.

1038
00:50:52.360 --> 00:50:55.519
<v Speaker 1>Please let us know why Annie had to die in

1039
00:50:55.519 --> 00:51:00.920
<v Speaker 1>the country she loved. Apparently too, there's a documentary in

1040
00:51:00.960 --> 00:51:04.039
<v Speaker 1>the works to cover any story. I came across a

1041
00:51:04.039 --> 00:51:06.960
<v Speaker 1>few articles from this past summer stating that a new

1042
00:51:07.320 --> 00:51:11.559
<v Speaker 1>four part series on the case called Body on the

1043
00:51:11.599 --> 00:51:14.599
<v Speaker 1>Beach is being made. I couldn't find the details on

1044
00:51:14.639 --> 00:51:18.360
<v Speaker 1>when it was expected to be released, but apparently it

1045
00:51:18.400 --> 00:51:21.360
<v Speaker 1>will present new evidence on the case. So if we

1046
00:51:21.440 --> 00:51:24.320
<v Speaker 1>hear anything in regards to it, we will definitely letch

1047
00:51:24.440 --> 00:51:27.840
<v Speaker 1>you know. Oh yeah, so that's that.

1048
00:51:28.639 --> 00:51:29.840
<v Speaker 2>Wow, Okay, that's cool.

1049
00:51:30.599 --> 00:51:33.920
<v Speaker 1>So what do you think, So basically we have suicide?

1050
00:51:34.159 --> 00:51:38.000
<v Speaker 1>I mean we do. She was going through some She

1051
00:51:38.079 --> 00:51:40.960
<v Speaker 1>did seem like she was going through something, right.

1052
00:51:40.800 --> 00:51:45.239
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, But I mean when some people aren't always open

1053
00:51:45.239 --> 00:51:47.559
<v Speaker 2>about their emotions and what they're going through. The people

1054
00:51:47.599 --> 00:51:49.280
<v Speaker 2>can be very private able they.

1055
00:51:49.119 --> 00:51:51.159
<v Speaker 1>Can, and they can and some people are very good

1056
00:51:51.159 --> 00:51:51.840
<v Speaker 1>at hiding showing.

1057
00:51:51.880 --> 00:51:55.280
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so that could have simply been I mean, she

1058
00:51:55.320 --> 00:51:58.079
<v Speaker 2>potentially was getting married, so it could have been that

1059
00:51:58.159 --> 00:51:59.800
<v Speaker 2>she was just really trying to be quiet about this

1060
00:52:00.119 --> 00:52:01.719
<v Speaker 2>not say anything when she got home, which is why

1061
00:52:01.760 --> 00:52:02.599
<v Speaker 2>she seemed weird.

1062
00:52:03.280 --> 00:52:04.840
<v Speaker 1>Like it could have been a surprise or something.

1063
00:52:04.960 --> 00:52:09.039
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so it could have been something positive, even who knows, right, Yeah,

1064
00:52:09.400 --> 00:52:13.360
<v Speaker 2>My full theory is I do think that her and

1065
00:52:13.440 --> 00:52:17.320
<v Speaker 2>Christina got mixed up, and I think whoever this was,

1066
00:52:19.039 --> 00:52:24.039
<v Speaker 2>this mysterious individual, this sexual predator as she labeled them,

1067
00:52:24.519 --> 00:52:28.079
<v Speaker 2>was behind it. I think there was at least two individuals,

1068
00:52:28.239 --> 00:52:32.880
<v Speaker 2>one that was corroborating with them, who was the potential fiance,

1069
00:52:33.519 --> 00:52:36.280
<v Speaker 2>and then the second individual who was the potential sex predator.

1070
00:52:37.159 --> 00:52:40.480
<v Speaker 2>I think they were corroborating thinking she was Christina trying

1071
00:52:40.480 --> 00:52:43.360
<v Speaker 2>to get within her life and get to the right

1072
00:52:43.400 --> 00:52:46.880
<v Speaker 2>point in time where they could dispose of her because

1073
00:52:46.920 --> 00:52:50.920
<v Speaker 2>of potentially what she could do for their business or

1074
00:52:50.920 --> 00:52:53.760
<v Speaker 2>whatever their business may be, or what they're involved with.

1075
00:52:54.599 --> 00:52:58.039
<v Speaker 2>So they wanted to get rid of her for any

1076
00:52:58.079 --> 00:53:02.000
<v Speaker 2>potential trouble she may caused not realizing they had the

1077
00:53:02.000 --> 00:53:06.159
<v Speaker 2>wrong person. They may have gotten rid of her and

1078
00:53:06.280 --> 00:53:08.239
<v Speaker 2>realized it was the wrong person, and we're just trying

1079
00:53:08.239 --> 00:53:10.039
<v Speaker 2>to cover their tracks on being like, oh shit, we

1080
00:53:10.119 --> 00:53:12.280
<v Speaker 2>got the wrong person. Or they could have just gotten

1081
00:53:12.360 --> 00:53:14.599
<v Speaker 2>rid of her and covered their tracks regardless and clean

1082
00:53:14.679 --> 00:53:17.519
<v Speaker 2>their hands of it realized later after the fact. But

1083
00:53:17.559 --> 00:53:20.880
<v Speaker 2>either way, I think two or more individuals were involved

1084
00:53:21.960 --> 00:53:27.119
<v Speaker 2>confused her with the wrong person, and she was subject

1085
00:53:27.199 --> 00:53:30.920
<v Speaker 2>to just a misfortunate understanding.

1086
00:53:31.599 --> 00:53:35.159
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I know, because it seems a lot of even

1087
00:53:35.199 --> 00:53:38.360
<v Speaker 1>the investigations, and it all just seems a little fishy,

1088
00:53:38.519 --> 00:53:41.239
<v Speaker 1>like that they're not digging in deep and just things

1089
00:53:41.239 --> 00:53:46.119
<v Speaker 1>are are not I don't know, I'm like things are

1090
00:53:46.119 --> 00:53:50.559
<v Speaker 1>being covered up almost not saying that the investigators are

1091
00:53:50.559 --> 00:53:54.559
<v Speaker 1>doing that, but something is fishy, and in this whole thing, I'm.

1092
00:53:54.400 --> 00:53:57.679
<v Speaker 2>Not sold that it's a government conspiracy kind of cover

1093
00:53:57.840 --> 00:54:01.360
<v Speaker 2>up the police or hiding something. I'm not sold on

1094
00:54:01.400 --> 00:54:07.199
<v Speaker 2>that because people all over just don't do their job

1095
00:54:07.320 --> 00:54:09.800
<v Speaker 2>on a day to day basis, no matter the fucking role.

1096
00:54:09.960 --> 00:54:12.719
<v Speaker 2>People get complacent, they become desensitized to their job, and

1097
00:54:12.760 --> 00:54:15.920
<v Speaker 2>they almost just don't care anymore. So I'm not convinced

1098
00:54:15.960 --> 00:54:21.400
<v Speaker 2>that it's someone's covering something up. I'm thinking that someone's like, Eh,

1099
00:54:21.480 --> 00:54:23.920
<v Speaker 2>it's suicide. They're just convincing theirselves at suicide and they're

1100
00:54:23.960 --> 00:54:26.400
<v Speaker 2>just washing their hands of it. Yeah, and now that

1101
00:54:26.920 --> 00:54:29.760
<v Speaker 2>new evidence is coming out, they just have to stand

1102
00:54:29.760 --> 00:54:31.800
<v Speaker 2>their ground on it and be like, no, we stand

1103
00:54:31.840 --> 00:54:35.280
<v Speaker 2>by what we said. It's suicide. Let's be over this

1104
00:54:35.400 --> 00:54:38.320
<v Speaker 2>and move on. But they just it's such a misunforce

1105
00:54:38.480 --> 00:54:42.800
<v Speaker 2>a miss. It's such an unfortunate situation that this oversight

1106
00:54:42.920 --> 00:54:45.559
<v Speaker 2>on whoever made that call, it keeps coming back to

1107
00:54:45.599 --> 00:54:47.679
<v Speaker 2>haunt them, and they just have to keep holding their ground.

1108
00:54:48.079 --> 00:54:52.280
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. And what's super unfortunate is that the family, I mean,

1109
00:54:52.280 --> 00:54:54.760
<v Speaker 1>this was in two thousand and five and they have

1110
00:54:54.920 --> 00:54:58.239
<v Speaker 1>not gotten any answers and they're trying, like this just

1111
00:54:58.320 --> 00:55:02.559
<v Speaker 1>must be exhausting to them, like exhausting and just so sad.

1112
00:55:03.559 --> 00:55:05.840
<v Speaker 1>So I feel like this case was kind of all

1113
00:55:05.880 --> 00:55:10.320
<v Speaker 1>over the place, and it's so much information, but it

1114
00:55:10.400 --> 00:55:12.519
<v Speaker 1>was also one that I felt like should be out there.

1115
00:55:12.559 --> 00:55:16.199
<v Speaker 1>And I really really hope this documentary comes out and

1116
00:55:16.239 --> 00:55:21.719
<v Speaker 1>that maybe it has does have new new findings, and

1117
00:55:21.760 --> 00:55:24.599
<v Speaker 1>that maybe that this can be closed because that would

1118
00:55:24.599 --> 00:55:25.119
<v Speaker 1>be amazing.

1119
00:55:25.239 --> 00:55:27.840
<v Speaker 2>Oh, it would be. And the difficult thing with like

1120
00:55:28.239 --> 00:55:31.920
<v Speaker 2>mysterious or unknown cases that don't have an answer. We

1121
00:55:32.000 --> 00:55:36.119
<v Speaker 2>don't know what happened, so there's no real storyline to follow.

1122
00:55:36.599 --> 00:55:38.800
<v Speaker 2>It's just pick all the information we can and put

1123
00:55:38.800 --> 00:55:42.679
<v Speaker 2>it in best chronological order. Yeah, so sometimes it seems

1124
00:55:42.679 --> 00:55:45.119
<v Speaker 2>all over the place because that's that's all we have.

1125
00:55:45.440 --> 00:55:48.480
<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Well, I mean her final days they were it

1126
00:55:48.599 --> 00:55:52.440
<v Speaker 1>was very mysterious, like what was going on? And then

1127
00:55:52.840 --> 00:55:55.519
<v Speaker 1>I think things she seemed like she was places where

1128
00:55:55.559 --> 00:55:59.800
<v Speaker 1>she wasn't and yeah, because the investigation wasn't really super thorough.

1129
00:55:59.880 --> 00:56:02.840
<v Speaker 1>So I was just I don't know, this case is

1130
00:56:02.880 --> 00:56:05.239
<v Speaker 1>going to actually haunt me a little bit because like I.

1131
00:56:06.039 --> 00:56:10.079
<v Speaker 2>Can see that. Yeah, yeah, fair enough, Okay, well done

1132
00:56:10.119 --> 00:56:11.719
<v Speaker 2>on that. If you guys want to go check out

1133
00:56:11.760 --> 00:56:13.760
<v Speaker 2>our social media's or anything, all of our links are

1134
00:56:13.760 --> 00:56:15.920
<v Speaker 2>in the description of this podcast. We got Patreon, we

1135
00:56:15.960 --> 00:56:17.960
<v Speaker 2>can head over support us get some behind the scenes

1136
00:56:18.000 --> 00:56:21.280
<v Speaker 2>content and exclusive episodes that come out last day of

1137
00:56:21.320 --> 00:56:25.519
<v Speaker 2>every month. We just created a new discord chat, so

1138
00:56:25.559 --> 00:56:27.679
<v Speaker 2>you can head over to Patreon and get signed up

1139
00:56:27.719 --> 00:56:30.159
<v Speaker 2>and join us on discord. We can just chat with

1140
00:56:30.239 --> 00:56:33.280
<v Speaker 2>us on a day to day basis. I just actually,

1141
00:56:33.360 --> 00:56:36.920
<v Speaker 2>even while Nicole was doing this podcast, I just uploaded

1142
00:56:36.920 --> 00:56:38.519
<v Speaker 2>a photo of our dog, Ripley sleeping.

1143
00:56:38.840 --> 00:56:40.880
<v Speaker 1>Wow, that's why you were on the phone, That's why.

1144
00:56:40.760 --> 00:56:42.199
<v Speaker 2>I was on my phone. Well, she was sleeping, she

1145
00:56:42.239 --> 00:56:44.960
<v Speaker 2>was curled up, and she had her little stuffed beer bottle.

1146
00:56:45.480 --> 00:56:47.360
<v Speaker 2>It looked like she was passed out from just drinking

1147
00:56:47.440 --> 00:56:50.199
<v Speaker 2>too much. Soe yea, I can get that sort of stuff.

1148
00:56:50.480 --> 00:56:52.159
<v Speaker 2>But of course, no pressure. If you just want to

1149
00:56:52.159 --> 00:56:54.519
<v Speaker 2>be here chatting with us as you listening to the

1150
00:56:54.559 --> 00:56:57.440
<v Speaker 2>podcast as totally cool too. We appreciate it just the

1151
00:56:57.559 --> 00:57:01.719
<v Speaker 2>same we do. Yeah, anything else, I think that's it.

1152
00:57:02.000 --> 00:57:03.039
<v Speaker 1>I think that's totally it.

1153
00:57:03.119 --> 00:57:06.119
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, all right, Well, we appreciate you guys being here,

1154
00:57:06.480 --> 00:57:09.880
<v Speaker 2>and until next episode, stay wicked.