Speaker 1: This is Kathleen Martin.
Speaker 2: You're listening to UFO Headquarters. And thank you Kathleen Martin,
Speaker 2: good friend of our show and a wonderful, wonderful person
Speaker 2: for bringing us in there with Linda Zimmermann. And case
Speaker 2: you didn't know, you're listening to UFO Headquarters. And I
Speaker 2: am reluctantly here today back in the USA from Finland,
Speaker 2: sad to report. I wanted to stay, but I was
Speaker 2: overridden by the wife and child.
Speaker 1: So here I am. Go back, Mike, go back.
Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe next year.
Speaker 1: You need a summer place there.
Speaker 2: I do, I do, So that's that's what I was thinking.
Speaker 1: So let's start a GoFundMe. So everybody please send Mike
Speaker 1: your spare change and we'll try to get him a
Speaker 1: place there so he can be happy.
Speaker 2: Especially you know somewhere in the Lake region where the
Speaker 2: mosquitoes are are really wonderful.
Speaker 1: Well, every every nice place comes with a price, yes,
Speaker 1: and the little red biting ants, but oh not special.
Speaker 2: I could put up with that, I think. Okay, I
Speaker 2: think I'll learn to live with it.
Speaker 1: All right, Well we have completely digressed already.
Speaker 2: Man, that happens. But we have a we have a
Speaker 2: pretty fun show because occasionally Linda likes to put together
Speaker 2: some stuff in never not tell me, just to see
Speaker 2: how I react to it. And I like those shows
Speaker 2: because I like going in blind and hearing the information
Speaker 2: essentially just as our listeners are hearing it. So I
Speaker 2: kind of like that it's almost putting myself in the
Speaker 2: shoes of our audience. So I'm looking forward to this
Speaker 2: one because I never know what's coming.
Speaker 1: No, no one ever knows what's coming. Bob tells me
Speaker 1: that every day, I never know what you're up to.
Speaker 1: So before we get to our episode of Muhammad Ali
Speaker 1: and the Octogenarian, which I believe no UFO podcast has
Speaker 1: ever been titled before, I do have a case that
Speaker 1: someone contacted me and said, would you have an interest
Speaker 1: in a nineteen seventy five case, which sounded fabulous. I
Speaker 1: said absolutely, so he sent back I could paraphrase, but
Speaker 1: it was so well written that I'm just going to
Speaker 1: read a couple of pages here. We will call him
Speaker 1: Joe because he's still active in some organizations and there is,
Speaker 1: unfortunately still a stigma. So this is anonymous Joe nineteen
Speaker 1: seventy five. I was twenty four years old that mid
Speaker 1: November night The overall experience from start to finish lasted
Speaker 1: about fifteen minutes. A friend and I were driving from
Speaker 1: New Canaan, Connecticut via Route one twenty three through Vista,
Speaker 1: New York, then on to West Lane to Ridgefield, Connecticut.
Speaker 1: At about seven forty five pm. We were on a
Speaker 1: fairly long stretch of west Lane. At about the halfway point,
Speaker 1: we saw a cluster of green lights about a quarter
Speaker 1: of a mile ahead on the right, seemingly just above
Speaker 1: tree top level. We thought the pilot seemed to be
Speaker 1: running a little low, especially at night, but presumed the
Speaker 1: pilot was headed to Danbury Airport. Shortly thereafter, the group
Speaker 1: of lights split into two groups, one crossing over to
Speaker 1: the left side of the road, and the remainder still
Speaker 1: headed off toward Danbury and out of our line of sight. Meanwhile,
Speaker 1: back on the left side of the road there was
Speaker 1: a lot of woods. The lights had formed into a
Speaker 1: line of three or four green lights that moved back
Speaker 1: and forth, closer and farther to us, as if working
Speaker 1: a grid pattern, with the line of lights not changing
Speaker 1: its point of direction, as if a helicopter was moving
Speaker 1: forward and back. At this point we became shall I say,
Speaker 1: intrigued by what we were seeing, but not ready to commit.
Speaker 1: I stopped the car, turned off the engine, and we
Speaker 1: got out of the car. We heard no sounds, got
Speaker 1: back in the car. The thing that we were seeing
Speaker 1: now went off in the direction of Ridgefield, exactly where
Speaker 1: we were headed. West Lane. Came up to a t
Speaker 1: intersection where we turned right, still on track with it,
Speaker 1: and still on west Lane. Soon after, the road goes
Speaker 1: down into a small valley. The terrain rises to a
Speaker 1: ridge line off to the left side of the road.
Speaker 1: It is at this point that we were able to
Speaker 1: see the silhouette of a teacup and saucer shaped object
Speaker 1: lying just above the ridge line. We came up on
Speaker 1: the other side of the little valley and into an
Speaker 1: s turn, and we and the craft have now converged
Speaker 1: at the closest point. We are just barely out of
Speaker 1: the turn when I pulled over, stopped the car, turned
Speaker 1: off the engine, and we exited the car. The craft
Speaker 1: is now hovering over the backyard of a house across
Speaker 1: the street. Through a bay window, we can see mom, dad,
Speaker 1: and two kids having coffee and conversation. Meanwhile, while this
Speaker 1: thing is silently hovering over their backyard. It's less than
Speaker 1: two hundred feet away and probably no more than two
Speaker 1: hundred feet in the air. My buddy said, turn on
Speaker 1: your hazard lights. I hit the switch and the lights
Speaker 1: started to flash. In response, the craft moved in a
Speaker 1: little closer and started to flash a bank of white
Speaker 1: lights around its rim. Frankly, we did not know whether
Speaker 1: to defecate or lose our eyesight, which just might be
Speaker 1: one of the best lines in all of ufology cases. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so a little unnerving there, But let me get back.
Speaker 1: So what did we see? A tea cup and saucer
Speaker 1: configuration about sixty feet in diameter, about thirty to thirty
Speaker 1: five feet from its undercarria to the top of its
Speaker 1: pointy tip. It had a black circle on the underside
Speaker 1: that appeared to be the same diameter as the base
Speaker 1: of the superstructure. The rest of the underside looked like
Speaker 1: brushed aluminum or brushed steel. There was a row of
Speaker 1: lights around the rim. I seemed to think I recollect
Speaker 1: opaic windows, but I'm not one hundred percent sure on that.
Speaker 1: After standing there, stunned, I turned off my flashers. The
Speaker 1: craft ceased flashing its lights at us, moved back over
Speaker 1: the backyard, and then started to well drift slowly back
Speaker 1: toward Route one twenty three, southerly back toward Vista as
Speaker 1: it disappeared over the trees. Remember that other bunch of
Speaker 1: lights that was headed toward Danbury, Let's not forget them.
Speaker 1: As the first craft was moving out of sight, a
Speaker 1: second one appeared, following in the wake of its companion.
Speaker 1: This one was of the same configuration, same black center,
Speaker 1: but with a brushed copper finish and about two thirds
Speaker 1: the size of the first one. And then they were
Speaker 1: gone when we got to the meeting. That was the
Speaker 1: reason for our being out in the first place. We
Speaker 1: were like a couple of gibbering idiots, and we took
Speaker 1: a fair amount of guff for it. What have you
Speaker 1: been smoking? Nothing? What have you been drinking nothing? I
Speaker 1: was still pretty fried from this when I got home.
Speaker 1: My wife had a hard time believing me at first.
Speaker 1: I do have a lively imagination, and I'm adept at
Speaker 1: making up stuff and being convincing about it. But fortunately
Speaker 1: I only use my powers for good. But when I
Speaker 1: told her that throughout this whole thing, there was not
Speaker 1: a sound other than the occasional sighing of the breeze
Speaker 1: through the leafless trees. The next day, I called Danbury Airport,
Speaker 1: nothing on radar. I called the Lewisborough and Ridgefield Police,
Speaker 1: nothing reported. I called the Ridgefield Newspaper. Nothing reported, But
Speaker 1: would you like to come up and talk to us
Speaker 1: about your experience? Which we did. By then a few
Speaker 1: days had passed and I began to doubt myself, but
Speaker 1: I got over that. I still see them in my
Speaker 1: mind's eye. How could I not? And I guess that's
Speaker 1: how we got here. Also, I contacted Muffon and filled
Speaker 1: out of a form, and there's an epilogue. I've always
Speaker 1: considered myself to be kind of hip from his years
Speaker 1: as a musician, a little street wise, not prone to scams,
Speaker 1: but acknowledge a certain naivete. So about six months after
Speaker 1: the story appeared in the Ridgefield Paper, I get a
Speaker 1: call from a guy purporting to be from the National Inquirer.
Speaker 1: He's seen the story and wants to talk to me
Speaker 1: about it. He came to interview me where I worked.
Speaker 1: I gave him chapter in verse, even made a sketch
Speaker 1: for him. I confess to being surprised to hear from him.
Speaker 1: We see what we saw seemed tame kind of stuff
Speaker 1: for what the National Inquirer prints. Anyway, there never was
Speaker 1: any printed Inquirer story. Finally, after about thirty years, it
Speaker 1: dawned on me, this guy was not from the National Inquirer,
Speaker 1: probably some Alphabet agency looking to see what I had
Speaker 1: or hadn't seen. So so thanks again for contacting me
Speaker 1: about this. Anything else you want to ask or know,
Speaker 1: contact me. If not, just keep looking up I do.
Speaker 1: What do you think that is?
Speaker 2: First of all, what a great detailed description and explanation,
Speaker 2: and the moment he started describing the National Inquirer thing,
Speaker 2: first thing that popped in my head was that's not
Speaker 2: a reporter. That's definitely not a reporter. And it just
Speaker 2: seemed to me, you know, and I know that they're sensationalist,
Speaker 2: and but you know, to have them come and never
Speaker 2: run this story, not even to you know, if it
Speaker 2: was really their reporters, I'm sure they would have added
Speaker 2: a lot to it, you know.
Speaker 1: They would have, right, and they had a sketch. I mean,
Speaker 1: it certainly would have filled up about half a page.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I mean I used to love reading the
Speaker 2: National Inquirer for all those those goofy things like that
Speaker 2: they printed and you never knew what was real, you know.
Speaker 2: But yeah, well government agency. I mean that's a great cover. Though,
Speaker 2: Hey from the NOWER more likely more likely to talk
Speaker 2: to that guy than Hey, I'm from uh, you know,
Speaker 2: the US Langley. Yeah, I'm a I'm in a dark
Speaker 2: suit from a very important secret agency and I can't
Speaker 2: tell you about it. But would you like to talk
Speaker 2: to me? You don't have much of a choice here,
Speaker 2: you know. So a great cover, great way to get info.
Speaker 2: And yeah, I'd like to know who that who that
Speaker 2: person was and what did they do with that information?
Speaker 1: Yeah, but to see not one but two craft and
Speaker 1: he did an I you know, of course I came
Speaker 1: back with all kinds of questions and one of them,
Speaker 1: could you do with sketch? And he did a great
Speaker 1: uh rendering, and I was I was glad he did
Speaker 1: because I was a little confused by the tea cup
Speaker 1: and saucer. Imagine it's more of more of if you
Speaker 1: took a tea cup and turned it upside down on
Speaker 1: a saucer. So it was a saucer with a superstructure
Speaker 1: with windows around it. And then, which was a great observation,
Speaker 1: this black circle on the bottom of each craft. He
Speaker 1: even noted it was the same diameter as the superstructure.
Speaker 1: I mean, it was terrific. And then when you know
Speaker 1: we've we did that show, be careful what you ask
Speaker 1: for people signaling UFOs with lights, he puts on his
Speaker 1: hazard lights. This thing moves closer and starts flashing its lights. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I would be a little anxious at that point.
Speaker 2: Yeah. That the beginning of his of his story too,
Speaker 2: talking about the way it was moving in a grid pattern.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm.
Speaker 2: The cop and meat goes to, you know, grid searching.
Speaker 2: Was it looking for something? Was it intentionally following a
Speaker 2: grid pattern for a reason? Like was it something they
Speaker 2: were looking for or someone someone was there a you know,
Speaker 2: that sounds very purpose driven versus just sort of moving
Speaker 2: around in the air, like, you know, describing as grid.
Speaker 2: That just hit me like, okay, that to me implies
Speaker 2: that they're looking for something. They're searching for something here. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I did come back, obviously with a bunch
Speaker 1: of questions. I was hoping maybe his friend would want
Speaker 1: to talk. But he doesn't remember the same amount of detail,
Speaker 1: but of course he remembers it. And one of the
Speaker 1: things I said, you know, we hear this all the time.
Speaker 1: People have a sighting and then they never talk about
Speaker 1: it for like ten twenty thirty years. So I said,
Speaker 1: did you talk about it or did you stop talking
Speaker 1: about it? And he replied it was hard for it
Speaker 1: not to be a regular topic of conversation for quite
Speaker 1: some time. While we don't talk about it much anymore,
Speaker 1: every November it comes up, especially with it coming up
Speaker 1: on fifty years next year. So this is right, fifty
Speaker 1: years later, and you know, here's like a new case essentially,
Speaker 1: you know, bringing this, bringing this case. And I asked,
Speaker 1: did it change him in some way? Some people become fearful,
Speaker 1: some people become more open creative? He said, the only
Speaker 1: change it made in my life is that it confirmed
Speaker 1: for me what I had already been open to. It
Speaker 1: didn't make me fearful. It left me stunned, but not fearful.
Speaker 1: My wife and I discussed whether it made me more creative.
Speaker 1: My creative outlets have always been varied theater, music, art writing, humor,
Speaker 1: broad imagination, and a willing and this is my favorite line,
Speaker 1: and a willingness to entertain the possibility of impossible things.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I'd say it made an impression.
Speaker 2: Yeah, on him. That's a life life changing events as
Speaker 2: it we hear from a lot of people.
Speaker 1: Consistently, and this was direct communication. He puts on his hazard,
Speaker 1: it reacts, he turns them off, it stops flashing in back.
Speaker 1: So I mean that is conscious direct communication, right, and.
Speaker 2: Love there's intelligence behind.
Speaker 1: It, right, And I love where he says, I can
Speaker 1: see through the picture window, there's the you know, there's
Speaker 1: the family sitting there talking, and there's basically you know,
Speaker 1: you could just hear it in his mind, there's this
Speaker 1: freaking UFO out of your house. How do you not
Speaker 1: know this? But it was silent, and why should they
Speaker 1: know it was there?
Speaker 2: Right right? Unless they look out the window there. Yeah. Great,
Speaker 2: I'm gonna start looking at my windows a bit more.
Speaker 1: I need a big skylight so I can always have
Speaker 1: my eyes to the sky. So thank you, Joe. That
Speaker 1: was one of my favorite case descriptions. So well done,
Speaker 1: and thank you.
Speaker 2: That was just excellently written and just we're really really
Speaker 2: appreciative that you shared it with us and felt comfortable
Speaker 2: enough to share it with us.
Speaker 1: That's yeah, And people people still contact me. I know
Speaker 1: you've finished writing your books. Well, we'll see about that.
Speaker 1: But you know, are you still interested in collecting cases? Oh? Hell, yes, yeah,
Speaker 1: I just want to hear more and more so, so yes.
Speaker 1: So why don't we take our first break before we
Speaker 1: get to the rest of our episode Hudson River Radio
Speaker 1: dot com.
Speaker 3: Hudson River Radio dot com.
Speaker 2: Your mom likes us, and we're back after that short break,
Speaker 2: and Linda, before we move on to the meat and
Speaker 2: potatoes of today, Just to sort of touch upon Joe's story,
Speaker 2: any of our listeners out there that want to share
Speaker 2: their story, please feel free. And if you want, you know,
Speaker 2: your identity protected, you want anonymity, spit that word out
Speaker 2: that is respected one hundred and million percent, So you know,
Speaker 2: if you feel comfortable enough to share your story but
Speaker 2: don't want your name out there, whatever your request is,
Speaker 2: we're going to honor it. But we know there's stories
Speaker 2: out there that people haven't shared and we would love
Speaker 2: to hear them. Now's the time get it out there,
Speaker 2: because other people may have had similar experiences around the
Speaker 2: same exact time, in the same exact area as you,
Speaker 2: and maybe like, wait a minute, I was I was
Speaker 2: on that road on that that time and remember something
Speaker 2: like that, So please feel free get them out there,
Speaker 2: get those stories out there. And you know, if it's
Speaker 2: your name, you're worried about where confidentiality is everything? So yeah,
Speaker 2: press that. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And there's been quite a lot of sightings around Ridgefield
Speaker 1: and dan Berry, I mean, and Innora, especially in the eighties.
Speaker 1: But I love this seventy five and even earlier one.
Speaker 1: And you know, as soon as I read this, I
Speaker 1: went to Google Maps and he was very specific. You
Speaker 1: can trace that road, you can drive that road, and
Speaker 1: I know there's a lot of people like me who
Speaker 1: like to actually drive the path or walk the path
Speaker 1: of so you really help you get an idea of
Speaker 1: the sighting area. So yes, please, everyone keep sending, keep
Speaker 1: those cards and letters coming, as they used to say.
Speaker 1: All right, so let's get to our meat and potatoes,
Speaker 1: as Mike says, first of all, where we're going to
Speaker 1: do the Mohammed al Li story. Now, I need to know,
Speaker 1: Mike and Brian, what is your level of boxing knowledge
Speaker 1: before I continue this anything.
Speaker 2: Well, I know who Muhammad Ali is and I got
Speaker 2: like my socks knocked off in the police academy boxing. Okay, same.
Speaker 1: That same with you, okay, Okay, Well I might as
Speaker 1: well digress right away before I get into this. I
Speaker 1: used to Boxing used to be a much bigger things
Speaker 1: as Bruella as it was, you know, two men standing
Speaker 1: there knocking each other senseless. In the seventies, eighties, nineties,
Speaker 1: I think it was a lot more popular. And my
Speaker 1: dad had been a boxer in the Marine Corps because
Speaker 1: just being a regular marine isn't tough, and you know
Speaker 1: that doesn't make you tough enough. You've got to be
Speaker 1: a boxer in the Marine Corps. So as a little kid,
Speaker 1: I remember he had a punching bag set a couple
Speaker 1: of bags set up, and as a little kid, I'd
Speaker 1: put on his big punching gloves, boxing gloves, and I
Speaker 1: was probably the only little kid in kindergarten who knew
Speaker 1: to protect myself with my left hand and come up
Speaker 1: with a devastating right hook, which probably didn't get me
Speaker 1: too far in class, but I was ready. I was ready.
Speaker 1: So yeah, and Muhammad Ali, he just transcended the sport.
Speaker 1: I found him to be obnoxious, but a lot of
Speaker 1: people liked him. He just talked and talked and talked
Speaker 1: and bragged, and you know, he was a showman, so
Speaker 1: it was hard to take him seriously with anything. But
Speaker 1: in this case he was serious about UFOs and he
Speaker 1: had a number of sightings, and one of them was
Speaker 1: in Central Park in New York City. He used to
Speaker 1: do when he was training. He'd go jog in Central
Speaker 1: Park at like four or five in the morning, and
Speaker 1: which wasn't the safest plate not safe now but in
Speaker 1: the seventies. But yeah, I pity the fool who tried
Speaker 1: to mug Muhammad Ali.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's almost like every time he went out, like please.
Speaker 1: Please, Yeah, yeah, he was that person would get knocked
Speaker 1: to Brooklyn. So I'll just read his statement. I happened
Speaker 1: to look up just before dawn, as I often do
Speaker 1: while running, and there, hovering above us was this brilliant
Speaker 1: light hanging as if by an invisible thread. Where have
Speaker 1: we heard that so many times? At first I thought
Speaker 1: it was a beacon projected from a helicopter, but moments
Speaker 1: later a similar object passed in front of us. I
Speaker 1: brought it to the attention of my trainer, who was
Speaker 1: standing nearby. We watched them come from behind the skyline
Speaker 1: and move slowly across the sky for at least fifteen minutes.
Speaker 1: The best I can describe the sighting is to say
Speaker 1: they were just round and big. This is no joke.
Speaker 1: All of my friends here saw it. Actually, I've seen
Speaker 1: them many times before. I've had sixteen sightings total to date,
Speaker 1: many times in the early morning hours. If you look
Speaker 1: up in the sky, you can see them playing tag
Speaker 1: between the stars, really high up. I've had a good
Speaker 1: number of sightings myself. The closest one happened when a
Speaker 1: cigar shaped ship hovered briefly over a car. I was
Speaker 1: a passenger in one night, driving north on the New
Speaker 1: Jersey Turnpike. What a sight it was. We could see
Speaker 1: the shadow made by the UFO as it passed over
Speaker 1: the pavement of the road in the light of the
Speaker 1: full moon. What an amazing image that is a UFO
Speaker 1: casting a shadow in moonlight. Before I could blink my eyes,
Speaker 1: this light had come down toward the mountains until it
Speaker 1: hovered right above the valley. Here. I knew I couldn't
Speaker 1: be dreaming. Sure enough, it was still there. This had
Speaker 1: to be one of those big ships they talked about.
Speaker 1: The UFO was streamlined and shaped sort of like a cigar,
Speaker 1: but blunt on both ends. I couldn't see any windows
Speaker 1: or anything, but I'm certain there must have been people
Speaker 1: on board. That's a great account. This is so unalie
Speaker 1: like no exaggeration. What he is serious about this subject.
Speaker 2: I have seen the video clips of him, you know,
Speaker 2: hyping up fights and like you said, he was a
Speaker 2: showman and and a fantastic boxer. I don't know much
Speaker 2: about it, but watching them boxes just I mean amazing.
Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, hearing this compared to his normal you.
Speaker 1: Know, float like a butterfly and sting like a.
Speaker 2: This is this is almost like another person, yes, different,
Speaker 2: a different person here.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is the serious guy. So if you want
Speaker 1: to see him talking about this, there's go to YouTube.
Speaker 1: Put in Muhammad Ali Johnny Carson UFO And in seventy
Speaker 1: three he was on Johnny Carson with Ken Norton. I
Speaker 1: don't know if you've heard of Ken Norton, fabulous boxer.
Speaker 1: They I've pinned down the date because on the show
Speaker 1: they say that Norton won the first fight, which I
Speaker 1: think was March of seventy three. He actually broke Ali's jaw,
Speaker 1: splintered it and the fight continued round after it. Can
Speaker 1: you imagine having a broken jaw and the force of
Speaker 1: those punches, We'd all be hospitalized or dead. So this
Speaker 1: was right before the second fight September of seventy three,
Speaker 1: which Ali won by a split decision. I mean, I'm
Speaker 1: just going to tell you this because you know, if
Speaker 1: I'm talking about it, I'll give you all the information.
Speaker 1: And then in seventy six they met for the third
Speaker 1: time and Ali won by unanimous decision, which was one
Speaker 1: of the biggest scandals. I mean, I defy anybody to
Speaker 1: watch that fight and say that Ali won. In fact,
Speaker 1: Ali even said I honestly thought he beat me. It
Speaker 1: was but politics. Ali was hugely popular. It was moreation
Speaker 1: advantageous to the boxing association to have Ali be the
Speaker 1: world champion. So a great injustice. But anyway, so he
Speaker 1: comes on. Ken Norton's already on the set and they're
Speaker 1: in their bathrobes and slippers, you know, like their fight.
Speaker 1: It's like a couple days before the fight, and so
Speaker 1: Johnny Carson's expecting we're going to talk fights, and Ali
Speaker 1: sits down and he says, Tolly, we look serious. What's
Speaker 1: going on?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 1: And He's like, I've been studying UFOs. You know that
Speaker 1: there are UFOs out there flying around unidentified objects. Well
Speaker 1: you should hear the audience bursts out laughing, this is
Speaker 1: so funny to them, and he's not. He is serious,
Speaker 1: and he says, I'm serious. He said they've been seeing
Speaker 1: a bunch over Georgia. I've seen them at night. And
Speaker 1: so he said he had photos, he had films, people
Speaker 1: have sentim, had sent him stuff. And he's like, why
Speaker 1: isn't anyone talking about it? Why isn't the government doing anything?
Speaker 1: Fifty years ago? The same story we have all this.
Speaker 1: So Johnny Carson says, well, come on, you know, why
Speaker 1: haven't they landed, Why haven't they made contact? And Allie says,
Speaker 1: they probably think they can get no sense out of
Speaker 1: the people here. So bravo, perfect answer. And Carson said, well,
Speaker 1: why should anybody, How could anybody believe? He said, anybody
Speaker 1: who's got eyes should believe. So good for him, you know, now.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, I was just going to say, and that
Speaker 2: be on Johnny Carson, one of the you know, the
Speaker 2: pre eminent shows to get on right before a fight
Speaker 2: with your opponent, where you have the opportunity to be
Speaker 2: the showman that you want to be. Exactly to focus
Speaker 2: on Ufoss, there's to me that bolsters that credibility.
Speaker 1: Yeah, of Cordy do that. Yeah, of course, skeptics say
Speaker 1: he did get punched in the head for a living,
Speaker 1: but he was You have to see his demeanor. He
Speaker 1: he was serious. And you know you're out, Uh well
Speaker 1: you cops should know. You're out at all hours of
Speaker 1: the night. You see things, not meaning they're all, you know,
Speaker 1: alien spacecraft, but there's strange things going on in the sky.
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, between what he saw in Central
Speaker 1: Park and then on the Jersey Turnpike, like you said,
Speaker 1: you have eyes, you'll believe.
Speaker 2: So I wonder what became of the photos and stuff
Speaker 2: that he had that people were sending there.
Speaker 1: I don't know, I know, I hope.
Speaker 2: Is there a repository of his papers or a collection
Speaker 2: somewhere like so many you.
Speaker 1: Know, that's an awfully good question. That is an awfully
Speaker 1: good question. If we have anybody in the audience who
Speaker 1: has any connection to Muhammad Ali's family, yeah question, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: let's see what we can we can find. But yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, somebody, like you said, of his caliber, this
Speaker 1: was his moment to do his clown routine and hype
Speaker 1: up the fight and all at and he sits down
Speaker 1: and says, Look, I'm serious, I'm talking UFOs. Carson's like, oh, great,
Speaker 1: great fight talk we're having here.
Speaker 2: Well, because you can imagine that the show Carson wanted, right,
Speaker 2: you know, the the excitement, the audience was obviously waiting
Speaker 2: for it. That's why they're laughing at the beginning. So
Speaker 2: for him to deliver something completely opposite.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and he made quite a few other other statements,
Speaker 1: but yeah, I love to follow up on that if
Speaker 1: anybody has any connections. So that is our Mohammad Ali portion,
Speaker 1: and we will get to the octagenarian part after this
Speaker 1: short break. This is Hudson River Radio dot com.
Speaker 3: Hudson River Radio dot com.
Speaker 2: We are back and it has to be the I
Speaker 2: don't know that I've ever heard anyone talk about Mohammad Ali,
Speaker 2: and before I did not hear. I didn't know about it.
Speaker 1: This is okay, good.
Speaker 2: I love them shows that I'm hearing this story as
Speaker 2: you're telling it, just like everybody else is that I'm
Speaker 2: sitting here in my mind, it's just like, well, first
Speaker 2: of all, who would call him a liar to his face? Yeah,
Speaker 2: you have to be stupid, But again, it doesn't sound like, yes,
Speaker 2: he's a showman, but he had a particular style. Again,
Speaker 2: I've seen the videos of him, you know, hyping and
Speaker 2: dancing around, and especially before fights.
Speaker 1: And in the middle of fights. In the one of
Speaker 1: the Norton fights, in the middle he's making faces and
Speaker 1: the crowds chanting alley and he's clowning to the crowd
Speaker 1: in the middle of a fight. It's so yeah, So
Speaker 1: this was so out of character. This was the real Ali,
Speaker 1: not the showman Ali talking right.
Speaker 2: That's that. That's kind of what I was trying to
Speaker 2: get to is that the person that was talking on
Speaker 2: Johnny Carson and talking about this was the real the
Speaker 2: real man behind who was Muhammad?
Speaker 1: Al Right, right, Okay, so let us get on to
Speaker 1: I may have mentioned some of this on some other shows.
Speaker 1: You know how many years we've been doing this show,
Speaker 1: but I know I haven't read done the whole episode.
Speaker 1: So many years ago, I was in Oh boy, howd
Speaker 1: to be? Over ten years ago, I was giving a
Speaker 1: talk somewhere in Connecticut, one of the I've estimated roughly
Speaker 1: I've done a thousand lectures across the country, so I
Speaker 1: don't remember the exact location of all of them. So
Speaker 1: one of these thousand lectures. I was in Connecticut and
Speaker 1: this woman named Joan eighty four years old. She comes
Speaker 1: to the talk and she hands me an envelope and
Speaker 1: she says, this is this is my story, these are
Speaker 1: my sightings, and I want you to have this. And
Speaker 1: I'm like fabulous. So what I you know, I was
Speaker 1: very excited to see. I had no idea what I
Speaker 1: was going to read. And I was stunned. We have
Speaker 1: talked about the nineteen fifty two flap over Washington, d C.
Speaker 1: She saw it. She was there an eye witness. I
Speaker 1: spoke with an eyewitness, Okay, to the fifty two flap
Speaker 1: over d C.
Speaker 2: Which is I did not know that. Yeah, you had
Speaker 2: spoken to an eyewitness.
Speaker 1: Yes, So she said that at the time, she was
Speaker 1: a retired school teacher. When I met her, she was
Speaker 1: going to college at Fredericksburg, Virginia, which we were both
Speaker 1: familiar with. She said one evening she and her friends
Speaker 1: were driving to Washington, d C. Not far from there,
Speaker 1: and quote, many many UFOs were dancing all over the
Speaker 1: DC skies and what's one of the main skeptics things, Oh,
Speaker 1: they were it was just radar anomaly, temperature and version. No,
Speaker 1: they She and her friends physically saw lighted craft, as
Speaker 1: she described dancing over the skies of DC. So all
Speaker 1: you skeptics suck on that, am I allowed to say that.
Speaker 1: I am so tired of skeptics telling people what they
Speaker 1: didn't see when they know damn well what they did see.
Speaker 1: So I just love that, And she said that. Years later,
Speaker 1: she read about the incident over the Capitol. She said,
Speaker 1: but what never seems to be mentioned in the sighting
Speaker 1: and the sightings reports is that UFOs were seen throughout
Speaker 1: Virginia in the Washington, DC area that night. So it
Speaker 1: wasn't just over the Capitol. It was all throughout the area.
Speaker 1: And she knows because she was there. So what a
Speaker 1: great way to start your you know.
Speaker 2: Absolutely So.
Speaker 1: Then, in the summer of nineteen sixty three, she and
Speaker 1: her family are at their beach house in Fairfield, Connecticut.
Speaker 1: She says, I was sleeping on the second floor porch,
Speaker 1: which was closed in, and was awakened by a metallic
Speaker 1: sounding hum. I looked into the sky and saw a
Speaker 1: very bright object spinning. The lights were more white than yellow,
Speaker 1: but it was definitely not the moon. It was too
Speaker 1: close to me. I looked up police reports. The next
Speaker 1: day nothing. The next night, about three am, I was
Speaker 1: again awakened, but this time there was no hum. I
Speaker 1: felt forced to look straight ahead and saw the same
Speaker 1: object far far away. I stared at him and was
Speaker 1: shocked it appeared so far away. Then it zoomed out
Speaker 1: into distant space within two or three seconds. I was
Speaker 1: then convinced it was a UFO because it was within
Speaker 1: It was a spot within two or three seconds. This
Speaker 1: is tremendous and what's the key word there? She felt
Speaker 1: forced to look. How many times do we hear? I
Speaker 1: was oddly compelled for some reason. I felt I had
Speaker 1: to go outside. Yes, yeah, so, she says. I was
Speaker 1: in my early thirties at the time, and I told
Speaker 1: my parents and the brother and my brother they listened,
Speaker 1: but that was all. So basically didn't believe her, which
Speaker 1: is frustrating. You know, she's thirty year old school teacher.
Speaker 1: I think she knows what she's she's seeing, so she's However, However,
Speaker 1: events would happen to both my parents years later that
Speaker 1: made them believers. In the early nineteen eighties at their
Speaker 1: home in Fairfield, my mother was in the garden fall
Speaker 1: weeding and it was getting dark. She came in breathless
Speaker 1: and frightened and said, Jony, I now believe you. A
Speaker 1: flying saucer came over the treetops, stopped and flew away.
Speaker 1: So Joni was shocked and obviously delighted, because you know,
Speaker 1: don't you love it? Do you just live for the
Speaker 1: moment when skeptics see something that scare the crap out
Speaker 1: of them, and then they become the biggest advocates for UFOs.
Speaker 1: I don't care what anybody says. I saw it and
Speaker 1: you should believe it too. Yeah, so that's not the
Speaker 1: end of the store. Her mother described the craft as
Speaker 1: a cigar shape with blinking multi colored lights. It moved
Speaker 1: very slowly and silently and was very low. As remarkable
Speaker 1: as it was for her mother to admit what she
Speaker 1: had seen, the very next night, her adamantly stubborn father
Speaker 1: was to have the shock of his life. Oh bring
Speaker 1: it on, My serious minded father came in hurting, as
Speaker 1: he had been so shocked by what he had seen
Speaker 1: he had fallen backwards into the rose bushes. Karma's a bitch,
Speaker 1: isn't it. He was scared, white as a ghost, and
Speaker 1: spoke very little about the UFO that had just come
Speaker 1: over the backyard. He went into the bathroom. When he
Speaker 1: came out, I questioned him, but he said he would
Speaker 1: never ever talk about it, and he was frightened. I
Speaker 1: respected my parents and never brought up this subject again.
Speaker 1: What a shame.
Speaker 2: And you know what I'm thinking here is what are
Speaker 2: the what if these are the sightings? She remembers, because
Speaker 2: how often have we heard that when people have a sighting,
Speaker 2: all of a sudden, it seems they start to either recall,
Speaker 2: wait a minute, I had this, or it becomes the
Speaker 2: first of many sightings. And the same thing with the
Speaker 2: parents is that generational aspect that we see a lot
Speaker 2: of where the parents finally admit, yeah, you know, I
Speaker 2: used to see things. Maybe they were hiding it, repressing it,
Speaker 2: and oh it happens all the time, didn't want to
Speaker 2: confront it. And then of course Mom's in the garden
Speaker 2: pulling weeds, and and whatever happened to dad to have
Speaker 2: two different, you know, three different, very different reactions to
Speaker 2: similar I mean, we don't know what Dad saw, but
Speaker 2: three different people reacting to encounters with UFOs reacting very differently,
Speaker 2: in the father's experience being something we can assume was
Speaker 2: terrifying to him.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because he absolutely did not believe in this. Obviously
Speaker 1: it was he was stubborn, It didn't exist, and suddenly
Speaker 1: it's hovering over your head. Well, yes, fall back in
Speaker 1: the rose bushes and deal with it. But it was
Speaker 1: actually in the paper the next day. There were articles
Speaker 1: in the Bridgeport Post speaking about the cigar shaped ufo
Speaker 1: with twinkling colored lights in the Trumble, Connecticut area, and
Speaker 1: it was exactly as her mother had described it. So
Speaker 1: you'd think the father would say, all right, my wife
Speaker 1: saw it. A whole bunch of other people saw it.
Speaker 1: I can talk about it. But yeah, we don't know.
Speaker 1: We don't know what that was. But wait, we're not
Speaker 1: finished with this octagenarian who had sightings spanning over sixty years.
Speaker 1: So it was around twenty twelve. She's in her eighties
Speaker 1: at this point. She was visiting her nephew in Washington
Speaker 1: State and they had been out for the day. They're
Speaker 1: headed home between nine and eleven PM near Lake Washington
Speaker 1: in the Bellevue Redmond area. I don't know Washington at all,
Speaker 1: do either of you?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 1: Okay, she said, when again, here we go. Something made
Speaker 1: her look out the passenger window again, this silent compulsion
Speaker 1: to do something some thought put in her mind. She
Speaker 1: said that she looked through the passenger window back into
Speaker 1: her right in an unnatural position, so she had to
Speaker 1: twist and contort. She said, there was one extremely brilliant
Speaker 1: low light following the car. It was low and slow,
Speaker 1: and there was no noise at all. It could not
Speaker 1: be a plane or a helicopter. I told my nephew,
Speaker 1: and he believed me and said, this only happens to
Speaker 1: you so well, and her parents and her friends and
Speaker 1: everything else. So but she had as if this wasn't
Speaker 1: the most wonderful collection of recollections in her life, she
Speaker 1: had one more little surprise for me. She said that
Speaker 1: the family house where she grew up was haunted because
Speaker 1: how many times again high strangeness they get, strangeness of
Speaker 1: all kinds. She said. It wasn't until her she knew
Speaker 1: it because she was seeing But it wasn't until her
Speaker 1: father passed away that her mother confirmed that she had
Speaker 1: also seen ghosts in the house. I guess the father
Speaker 1: didn't want anybody to talk about it, which is something
Speaker 1: so remarkable and unnerving, and you need it would be
Speaker 1: nice to be able to talk to it with family
Speaker 1: members and confirm you're all experiencing the same thing. It
Speaker 1: would have been helpful. But yeah, so high strangeness manifesting
Speaker 1: in many different ways to people who have life long encounters.
Speaker 1: And she finished up her written account with, so here,
Speaker 1: I am telling you my history totally true. All that
Speaker 1: I wrote is one hundred percent true. And there's no
Speaker 1: way I could be untrue to myself and lie. And
Speaker 1: that is She would be about ninety two now. I
Speaker 1: don't know if she is still with us, but thank
Speaker 1: you Joan for that tremendous This account is in my
Speaker 1: Hudson Valley UFO's Best Evidence book if you want to
Speaker 1: read the whole account. But wow, and that she took
Speaker 1: the time. I don't know how far she had to drive,
Speaker 1: but she took the time to write all that out
Speaker 1: and at eighty four years old, drove who knows how
Speaker 1: long to find me to give this to me. So
Speaker 1: now I can share it with everybody, and these experiences
Speaker 1: are not lost. They're now part of the record.
Speaker 2: And it's so great that she did because she could
Speaker 2: have never had written it down, never passed it on,
Speaker 2: and she could have taken all this with her if
Speaker 2: she you know, is in fact gone. So now that
Speaker 2: that's preserved, that she had the encounters that her famili's had,
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, great to be able to talk to
Speaker 2: her and tease more information out.
Speaker 1: Oh I know, I know, but just to you know,
Speaker 1: if you don't know ufology, this isn't a big deal.
Speaker 1: But to us to talk to someone who saw the
Speaker 1: fifty two that is one of the prime cases that
Speaker 1: is on the pantheon, you know, the probably the the
Speaker 1: Mount rushmore of UFO case than to talk to someone
Speaker 1: who confirmed there were many of them all over the
Speaker 1: sky and all over the area. It's just, well, that's
Speaker 1: why we do what we do, because people like this
Speaker 1: come along and make our UFO day.
Speaker 2: Yes, and she really checked a lot of boxes with
Speaker 2: the yeah, the encounters and then of course the hauntings
Speaker 2: growing up, which just they go hand in hand sometimes, so.
Speaker 1: Yeah, lots of times and all kinds of strange things.
Speaker 1: So so good for her. You know, clearly it was
Speaker 1: something that they didn't want to talk about in the family,
Speaker 1: but she grew out of that and realized this was
Speaker 1: too important to to not share. So there we have it.
Speaker 1: Anything else, Mike.
Speaker 2: No, I think I think that was a lot for today.
Speaker 2: I think we really we hit it, you know, from
Speaker 2: different angles. But and I think it gives our listeners
Speaker 2: something to walk away from and look at, especially the
Speaker 2: I know, I'm going to go watch the Muhammad Ali
Speaker 2: footage from Carson mm hmmm. Because the best way to
Speaker 2: to you know, ascertain anybody's truthfulness is to watch them,
Speaker 2: to look at their face, facial expressions, their demeanor, and
Speaker 2: how they conduct themselves. And you know, I want to
Speaker 2: see that for myself, and you know, I want to
Speaker 2: hear that audience reaction change from laughter to oh this
Speaker 2: guy serious? And again I wish I'm going to do
Speaker 2: a little digging. Maybe we can find out if maybe
Speaker 2: his his pace, you know, personal papers collection we're donated
Speaker 2: to a library somewhere or university. I don't know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is a great idea. I didn't I didn't
Speaker 1: think of that.
Speaker 2: Maybe buried in a box somewhere in an archive, or
Speaker 2: his photographs or notations. Wouldn't be great to get your
Speaker 2: hands on those.
Speaker 1: Oh oh, anybody has any idea, please please let us
Speaker 1: know so.
Speaker 2: We will be we will be making a road trip
Speaker 2: if there are.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and speaking of road trips, if you're anywhere in
Speaker 1: the Ridgefield, Connecticut area, you know, listen to this episode
Speaker 1: again and write down the path of the and you
Speaker 1: can trace that path of you know that those two
Speaker 1: guys went on in seventy five, and who knows, maybe
Speaker 1: you'll see something here for what you wish for, right, Yeah,
Speaker 1: just don't flash your lights at it, please please, unless
Speaker 1: you like getting scared.
Speaker 2: All right, So, I guess we'll just remind everybody that
Speaker 2: if you are new to our channel here UFO Headquarters,
Speaker 2: we encourage you to go back and binge listen to
Speaker 2: the many many years worth of awesome, awesome podcasts and
Speaker 2: the wealth of information that are contained in them. If
Speaker 2: you have been with us for whether it's one episode
Speaker 2: or a million, now really thank you and appreciate that
Speaker 2: you listen to us. You take the time out of
Speaker 2: your schedule to listen to our podcast. We really appreciate
Speaker 2: it because if it wasn't for people listening, we wouldn't
Speaker 2: be doing this program and we wouldn't be bringing this
Speaker 2: information to you. So a big shout out to everybody
Speaker 2: out there who takes the time to listen to us.
Speaker 2: Hey listen, if you like our show, tell a friend,
Speaker 2: Tell a family member, put the podcast on at work,
Speaker 2: and encourage everybody else to aren't listening to it, whatever
Speaker 2: it is, you know, spread the word because we need
Speaker 2: to continue to get that information out there and spread
Speaker 2: the word about the phenomenon going on right over our heads.
Speaker 2: So until next time, keep your eyes on the sky.
Speaker 3: Puts in rear radio dot com a favorite among shut
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