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<v Speaker 1>Wow, can you believe it? The year has come to

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<v Speaker 1>an end, and now we are into the Christmas season,

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<v Speaker 1>and uh, it is getting colder. The sun's setting much sooner.

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<v Speaker 1>And you know, when the sun goes down early, even

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<v Speaker 1>though it's like five o'clock, I want to go to bed.

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<v Speaker 1>I just equate darkness to sleepy time. And so it's

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<v Speaker 1>a challenge to get much done after that five o'clock hour.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's also festive and it's a time to meet

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<v Speaker 1>with friends and family. You know, one of my favorite drinks,

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<v Speaker 1>and I'm not a big brandy person, but if you

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<v Speaker 1>ever had an egg nug brandy with the cinnamon or

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<v Speaker 1>nutmeg on the top, oh my god, those are addicting.

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<v Speaker 1>All of a sudden, you're down too, and you're wondering

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<v Speaker 1>why you can't walk straight because of the brandy. But

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<v Speaker 1>boy do they taste good. Oh my god, brandy egg nug.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh my god. It's time for all the big goods

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<v Speaker 1>and the cakes and the pastries and the candies. Oh god.

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<v Speaker 1>I really enjoy the festivities of Christmas because it's a

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<v Speaker 1>chance to get together with family and it's fun to reminisce. Hey,

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<v Speaker 1>this is Cliff, your host of Earth Ancients, and the

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<v Speaker 1>year is coming to an end, but we have quite

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<v Speaker 1>a month for you to consider and to enjoy episodes

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<v Speaker 1>to the end of the month, and it's time to

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<v Speaker 1>be thinking about how the year went. And it was

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<v Speaker 1>a good year for us here Earth Ancients and for Destiny,

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<v Speaker 1>and the special editions of Earth Ancients have been fun too.

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<v Speaker 1>So I want to mention that if you are reading

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<v Speaker 1>or have watched a video or a lecture of an

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<v Speaker 1>author or a presenter that you think would be a

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<v Speaker 1>good fit for Earth Ancients, I'd love to hear from you.

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<v Speaker 1>I really would send me an email. Send it to

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<v Speaker 1>Earth Ancients, the number four, the letter you at gmail

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<v Speaker 1>dot com, and I'll take it under suggestion because I

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<v Speaker 1>occasionally will get an email from someone who says, hey,

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<v Speaker 1>have you heard of this person? And I mean, there's

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<v Speaker 1>no way I can possibly know everybody, And you know,

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<v Speaker 1>it doesn't have to be somebody who's a published author.

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<v Speaker 1>We take a lot of researchers who have discovered something

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<v Speaker 1>about the ancient past, about history, and obviously if it

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<v Speaker 1>doesn't fit with Earth Ancients, it might fit with Destiny,

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<v Speaker 1>because remember Destiny is the little sister to Earth Ancients.

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<v Speaker 1>When you look at destiny, these are stories episodes where

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<v Speaker 1>we're looking at our ancestral past, and that means you know, meditation, healing, wellness,

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<v Speaker 1>and then the paranormal where you're having psychic awareness, the

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<v Speaker 1>Akashik records that we talk about a great deal and

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<v Speaker 1>everything in between. So you might be surprised if we

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<v Speaker 1>find a suggestion from someone might end up on destiny.

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<v Speaker 1>So think about that. Send me an email Earth Ancients

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<v Speaker 1>the number four the letter you at gmail dot com

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<v Speaker 1>and we'll definitely get back to you. Today's program is

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<v Speaker 1>with our friend the Chilean historian Raphael Eisman, and it

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<v Speaker 1>is regarding a historian who just passed away. She's an

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<v Speaker 1>Ecuadorian historian, Ruth Rodriguez Sudemayer, who wrote a number of

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<v Speaker 1>books that were not in English. So this is why

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<v Speaker 1>I wasn't aware of her work. But she was an

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<v Speaker 1>ancient prehistory historian and found a number of records in

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<v Speaker 1>stone tablets. And it's a fascination to Raphael because he's

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<v Speaker 1>also a scholar of early prehistory before we have records,

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<v Speaker 1>and what he found through her work is that prior

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<v Speaker 1>to our history, there were six different ancient writing systems,

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<v Speaker 1>and they included cuneiform, which are those stone tablets we see,

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<v Speaker 1>I should say, excuse me, there are clay tablets that

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<v Speaker 1>we see in the Middle East. Sumerian Babylonian hieroglyphics was

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<v Speaker 1>another type, and we see that with Maya picturegraphs with

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<v Speaker 1>certain South American civilizations. But there's other types of written

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<v Speaker 1>communication that go way, way, way, way way back in history.

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<v Speaker 1>And some of the other things that we'll discuss today

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<v Speaker 1>are just fascinating and really touch on mass migrations. And

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<v Speaker 1>this is a problem for archaeologists today. They simply cannot

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<v Speaker 1>contend with the idea that ancient people migrated from Europe, Africa, Australia, China,

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<v Speaker 1>perhaps even Japan to the Americas. They just can't conceive

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<v Speaker 1>of it. And I remember the great Mayanist Michael Cole,

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<v Speaker 1>when asked why the Southeast Asian the Khmer pyramids look

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<v Speaker 1>so similar to many of the Guatemalan Maya pyramids. In fact,

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<v Speaker 1>some of them will look like Aztec pyramids. And my

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<v Speaker 1>thought was, well, there was a master blueprint of some

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<v Speaker 1>kind that they were given on the engineering, because when

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<v Speaker 1>you build a pyramid, you have heavy stone foundations and

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<v Speaker 1>then you stack the stones in such a way that

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<v Speaker 1>it supports itself. Well, that's an engineering feat. You just

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<v Speaker 1>don't do that randomly. And he summarily just dismissed it.

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<v Speaker 1>He says, we just don't believe that it's possible. And

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<v Speaker 1>this is the issue, This is the issue that we

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<v Speaker 1>have with the academic world, is that they, with their

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<v Speaker 1>own eyes can't conceive of pyramids being similar. Now Ed

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<v Speaker 1>Barnhardt is a little more flexible, but he still falls

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<v Speaker 1>in line with the traditions of academic science, which is,

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<v Speaker 1>if it's been talked about for one hundred and fifty years,

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<v Speaker 1>there's no breakthroughs that would that would change their minds.

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<v Speaker 1>And this is a huge problem. Now, what I do

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<v Speaker 1>and I really appreciate Ed Barham by the way, what

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<v Speaker 1>I do have to say is that they and he

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<v Speaker 1>even admits it, we only we know less than one

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<v Speaker 1>percent about the Maya. And I always say this is

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<v Speaker 1>that you know, it's not even Maya, is not even

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<v Speaker 1>the name of the true name of the people. It's

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<v Speaker 1>a name that the Spanish gave the Native Americans, the

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<v Speaker 1>indigenous people that they discovered when they landed in the Americas.

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<v Speaker 1>So anyhow, I think you're going to enjoy today's program.

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<v Speaker 1>Raphael's coming to us from Ukraine where he's studying and

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<v Speaker 1>researching for a new book. So it's a good connection though.

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<v Speaker 1>I think you'll like it. So today's program is Echoes

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<v Speaker 1>of an Unknown History, and my guest is Raphael Heisman.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, it used to be that you take a

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<v Speaker 1>photograph and you frame it and you put it up

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<v Speaker 1>on your wall, on your desk, or on a table

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<v Speaker 1>to have a memory, have a thought, have a feeling

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<v Speaker 1>about a past event. That's all changed now it's all

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<v Speaker 1>that can actually digitize hundreds of photographs and videos and

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<v Speaker 1>have it on one framed presentation. What if you could

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<v Speaker 1>Cyber Monday deal is the best of the year, so

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<v Speaker 1>order now before it ends. Support the show by mentioning

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<v Speaker 1>us at checkout. I was recently looking at an article

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<v Speaker 1>in Ancient American magazine and our friend, the Chilean historian

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<v Speaker 1>Raphael Heisman, had written an article called Echoes of the

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<v Speaker 1>Unknown History the American Origins of civilization, and I thought

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<v Speaker 1>to myself, this is fascinating. And then on top of that,

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<v Speaker 1>Wayne may the publisher, sent me an email said, Cliff,

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<v Speaker 1>you have to have Raphael on the program to talk

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<v Speaker 1>about this. And this article centers around a researcher from Ecuador.

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<v Speaker 1>Her name was she just passed away. Her name was

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<v Speaker 1>Ruth Rodriguez Sodo Mayor. And not only did she write

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<v Speaker 1>one book, but she actually did intensive research using ancient

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<v Speaker 1>document and stone tablets that are first of all unknown

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<v Speaker 1>but priceless. So we have Raphael coming to us today

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<v Speaker 1>from would you believe? Ukraine? I was just joking with him.

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<v Speaker 1>He's coming to us from war Tarn, Ukraine. Because why

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<v Speaker 1>because there's amazing museums there.

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<v Speaker 2>And he has.

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<v Speaker 1>Hey, Raphael, welcome back to Earth. Ancients, man, how you

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<v Speaker 1>doing what's going on in Ukraine? Thanking so much from

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<v Speaker 1>the invitation?

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<v Speaker 2>You know, I love to be part of of the ancients,

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<v Speaker 2>And yes at the present moments, I mean Ukraine, yes,

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<v Speaker 2>and studying a lot of things here as well. And yes,

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<v Speaker 2>you have talked about our ultra Gregos Toto Matior, which

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<v Speaker 2>was an amazing researcher from Ecuador and g opened up

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<v Speaker 2>field of research that I have seen two in history,

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<v Speaker 2>which is a little bit of a you know, but

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<v Speaker 2>I would do all. We can talk about this now.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, let me just ask you, how did you get

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<v Speaker 1>into Ukraine? Uh as as a foreigner? I mean are

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<v Speaker 1>they allowing foreigners?

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<v Speaker 2>In course there's people from it all in the world here,

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<v Speaker 2>I would say, I don't know, but yeah, I always

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<v Speaker 2>this is my second time in Ukraine. The first time

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<v Speaker 2>that was last year, and I've always come from Poland,

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<v Speaker 2>you know.

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<v Speaker 1>Via Poland.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Interesting, Yeah, we'll have to ask you some other time

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<v Speaker 1>about it. Talk about Ruth's research. Was she I mean,

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<v Speaker 1>you're right that she is a librarian, but she was

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<v Speaker 1>also an ancient researcher of history.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, let me tell you, Rudroor. She was a librarian

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<v Speaker 2>from Ecuador, from Guayaquio in I I understand, she studies

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<v Speaker 2>who were in some universities, some academic institutions in Madrid,

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<v Speaker 2>and then she stayed. She actually spent most of her

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<v Speaker 2>life in faint and she was very interested into the ancient,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, ancestral parismanic world. And in Madrid, we had

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<v Speaker 2>this amazing, amazing a museum, uh Bouselle the Last Americas,

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<v Speaker 2>the America's Music, that contains a huge collection of you know,

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<v Speaker 2>like objects and archeological artifacts. And I don't go Ruth

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<v Speaker 2>telling you a lot how she got into this, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>and she started to quote really some of the symbols,

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<v Speaker 2>some of the messages that were what where the other

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<v Speaker 2>you know, uh, in these archaeological artifacts. So what she

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<v Speaker 2>did isolate them, you know, these these symbols, these ancient

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<v Speaker 2>sacred alphabets, into you know, our world. That's what basically

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<v Speaker 2>was what I would did you know?

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<v Speaker 1>So the that museum is that museum, uh filled with

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of the Spanish items they brought back from America.

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<v Speaker 2>Totally totally It's like America.

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<v Speaker 3>It's I have no idea. I think I feel like

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<v Speaker 3>four or five hours there. It's huge, huge, Yeah, got

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<v Speaker 3>a lot of wonderful things.

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<v Speaker 2>Is that I do not I do not think that

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<v Speaker 2>most of the archeologists and anthropologists from South America are

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<v Speaker 2>aware of you know, there's there are amazing, amazing objects there.

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<v Speaker 2>You know.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so you write in your article that after fourteen

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<v Speaker 1>ninety two, which is when Christopher Columbus was in the

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<v Speaker 1>America's history, was manipulated by the Church. What does that mean?

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<v Speaker 2>I was just talking about this subject, I would say,

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<v Speaker 2>one hour, two hours ago. How can we even come

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<v Speaker 2>up with the idea that Columbus or whoever quote discover

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<v Speaker 2>America clear archaeological evidence in the America of Chinese presence

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<v Speaker 2>of African presses of the vikings? So how does it work?

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<v Speaker 2>So at one point, uh, there was some sort of

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<v Speaker 2>agreement and uh it was a state that you know,

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<v Speaker 2>America was discovered and that had a political and religious goal,

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<v Speaker 2>that is the conquest, you know, and through that you say, okay,

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<v Speaker 2>we're gonna have this, We're gonna startlish things, and everything

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<v Speaker 2>would be you know fresh nim and I must say,

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<v Speaker 2>having a European background. It's very hard for me to

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<v Speaker 2>understand how this so called clash of the world, you

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<v Speaker 2>know there is the Western world in the Native American

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<v Speaker 2>world would deal with each other. That is, I'm from

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<v Speaker 2>one day to another, everything really changed. You know, we

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<v Speaker 2>had the Aztecs. And I'm not idealizing any ancient cyberalization

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<v Speaker 2>at all or any culture. I'm just I'm a historian,

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<v Speaker 2>so my my, my video. But it is just as

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<v Speaker 2>if I were a photographer South America and the same thing.

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<v Speaker 2>So you have people that came from Europe, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>and they just destroy everything, absolutely everything. And if you

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<v Speaker 2>think from from a point of view of history, and

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<v Speaker 2>that's the first m layer of our world, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>a geographical unity, uh, then fire through sword, we have

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<v Speaker 2>a religious level. Then you have an economical level, and

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<v Speaker 2>then you have eighteenth century, nineteenth century, and then you

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<v Speaker 2>have twenty century, and then we have what our modern world.

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<v Speaker 2>So for me, it's some strange so old like to

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<v Speaker 2>see how it looks like if it was all programmed

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<v Speaker 2>sort to say, you know, and that's why I questioned

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<v Speaker 2>this concept of fourteen ninety two, like fourteen eighty two

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<v Speaker 2>as a quote that discoverage America because, as I say,

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<v Speaker 2>we have.

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<v Speaker 4>Evidence, we have archeological aliens throughout the Americas Eastern coast,

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<v Speaker 4>Western codes of the presence of our cultures, you know,

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<v Speaker 4>in our continents.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>So what was Ruth's interest in prehistory, because that's what

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<v Speaker 1>her her specialty is pre ETI delivery deliveral history.

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<v Speaker 2>The pre the pre flawed. Yes, Ruth, Well, she got,

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<v Speaker 2>she got very I would say she got. Her focus

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<v Speaker 2>was on the the tradition of the white gods, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>of this white population that she saw herself in Ecuador,

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<v Speaker 2>in in Rule and Bolivia. All the sources such as

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<v Speaker 2>Feliber you know, this great historian, and I think I think,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm not sure if it's like that, but I think

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<v Speaker 2>a mindstone for her point of view was her meeting

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<v Speaker 2>with Qui Morrids. I don't know if you're familiar with f. Morrits. Morrigs,

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<v Speaker 2>he was a researcher from Hungary who became very famous

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<v Speaker 2>because he was one of the well discoverers of the

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<v Speaker 2>Tigers case, you know, in Evador. So he had access

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<v Speaker 2>to this metal libraries, you know, and actually he wrote

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<v Speaker 2>a book about that, The Origins of European people was

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<v Speaker 2>in South America, and I think that's one of the

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<v Speaker 2>fields of study that Ruth took, you know, and Devil.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know if you are aware of all these

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<v Speaker 2>field of you know, studying that I'm Morrits indeed, and

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<v Speaker 2>then you know Ruth was part of No.

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<v Speaker 1>I wasn't familiar with him. Did you say, did you

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<v Speaker 1>say metal documents or metal books?

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<v Speaker 2>Yes, yes, I'm talking about dios case, you know, which I.

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<v Speaker 1>Never heard about metal Is this something that was discovered

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<v Speaker 1>decades ago? Metal books?

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<v Speaker 2>Yes? Actually, Eric from Denikim was studying partially that. And

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<v Speaker 2>I understand that Neil Armstrong also there, you know, and

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<v Speaker 2>that's a sacred sighting necuator and well both fun Morris

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<v Speaker 2>and Ruth, you know, the where familiar We did knowledge

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<v Speaker 2>that some of these Indian tribes that have access to dowels,

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<v Speaker 2>to these metal plakes, you know, have communicated them. So yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>I think that was one of these one of these

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<v Speaker 2>starting points, I may say, of of Ruth for the

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<v Speaker 2>development to all here you know studies and you know,

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<v Speaker 2>all her research.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, you know it's funny because when I was reading

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<v Speaker 1>your article whatever her books says that the Americas were routinely.

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<v Speaker 5>HUH settled with foreigners, either Europe or Middle East or

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<v Speaker 5>AH Slovenia and those places that are different now.

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<v Speaker 1>One of the things that she writes is that the

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<v Speaker 1>what was it? She says that Nordic migrations or Nordic

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<v Speaker 1>navigators who came to America called it the white man's land.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, that that's way, way, way much later. It's interesting

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<v Speaker 2>because this is a point that I did talk to

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<v Speaker 2>I wrote after we met, I would say that was

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<v Speaker 2>twenty or nine or twenty ten. In my dream. I

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<v Speaker 2>started to explain what my filter research was, and I

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<v Speaker 2>talked to her about Francisco moreno about there being the

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<v Speaker 2>rather about our post Lasky. It would teach Robert Or

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<v Speaker 2>and heat for which UH are scholars we've spoken about before,

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<v Speaker 2>and they all acknowledged a single fact that in America

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<v Speaker 2>before the UH indigenous groups, there was a white race.

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<v Speaker 2>And that's something we can't we can prove now through archeology.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, UH and Ruth have these oral sacred traditions

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<v Speaker 2>from Ecuador. And you know, she was telling me about

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sorry about all this, and it was kind of

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<v Speaker 2>like like our field over search match and that's how

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<v Speaker 2>we came up with, you know, there's we must do.

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<v Speaker 2>And she she I must say, she told me Cliff,

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<v Speaker 2>she has written, I think she said, like a five

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<v Speaker 2>or six pages encyclopedia about symbols of these ancient white

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<v Speaker 2>races of Americas, right, you know, And I'm like, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>how are we gonna have ever be you know, how

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<v Speaker 2>is it gonna be possible to publish this because it's

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<v Speaker 2>like huge, huge, you know. And I think she started

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<v Speaker 2>to publish some of her studies a couple of years later.

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<v Speaker 2>You know. Yes, well, I think I think that your

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<v Speaker 2>film research is very important because she's not you know,

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<v Speaker 2>she here here here m hmm, the line of her

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<v Speaker 2>of your of your field research. Yet she's based on

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<v Speaker 2>archeological research, on on uh sources from the colonial times

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<v Speaker 2>or even in the conquest about this white population in

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<v Speaker 2>the America. It's it's not a part of what we

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<v Speaker 2>know in many stream history. And that's something that I

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00:27:39.359 --> 00:27:44.200
<v Speaker 2>must say, like like common fields that wish happen.

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<v Speaker 1>You know. One thing that I thought was interesting is

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<v Speaker 1>that she talks about stone books. Yes, but in your

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<v Speaker 1>article you're not very specific. Are these books that were

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<v Speaker 1>available in libraries or were they translations from the Stone books.

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<v Speaker 2>No, she's she's talking that they're there there. For example, Cliff,

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<v Speaker 2>she she she uh talked a lot about these Taia

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<v Speaker 2>skid metal plates, and then she said, all the set

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<v Speaker 2>of petrobriges that we have uh throughout Americas are some

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00:28:38.480 --> 00:28:43.200
<v Speaker 2>kind of library. But the knowledge of them, the knowledge

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<v Speaker 2>of the seamos, are very difficult to you know, like

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<v Speaker 2>to try to translate.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, amazing, uh to my listeners. There is unfortunately

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<v Speaker 1>no English version of her books. In fact, raps working

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00:29:00.880 --> 00:29:04.359
<v Speaker 1>on getting some of them translated, so perhaps in the

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<v Speaker 1>next couple of years we'll see these books. But it's

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00:29:07.400 --> 00:29:12.200
<v Speaker 1>almost amazing. It's out of sight what the implications are.

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<v Speaker 1>She presents information that the Maya we're seafaring people, that

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<v Speaker 1>they went to India, and this is why we see

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<v Speaker 1>the term Maya so frequently in uh Hindu culture.

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<v Speaker 2>Cliff, if I might something to what you have just said.

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<v Speaker 2>For me as a historian, it's very surprising to see that.

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<v Speaker 2>For example, Uh, the scientific research develop by Francisco Moreno,

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00:29:57.559 --> 00:30:01.519
<v Speaker 2>you know, from Argentina has never been translated into any

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<v Speaker 2>other language, just in Spanish. He Uh, I think I'm

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<v Speaker 2>I'm positive we have spoken about things. He sent.

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<v Speaker 6>Scouts that he fought the Partagonia to France in the

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<v Speaker 6>nineteenth century, and it was the poor broad rap for

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<v Speaker 6>Pinard specialist French specialists of Scout status.

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<v Speaker 7>Uh.

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<v Speaker 2>They told him these skulls belong to the nervn dolls,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, and the nerdentals are the basis of the Europeans,

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<v Speaker 2>that is, of the white people. That was in the

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<v Speaker 2>nineteenth century. Then you have Roberto ram He, you know,

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<v Speaker 2>he claimed that the white ray escape from a guard

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<v Speaker 2>you know article yes, yes, And we have all this

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<v Speaker 2>traditional of the white gods and the vida coaches in

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<v Speaker 2>South America and the highlands in Brazil, you know. So

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<v Speaker 2>what I want to get to is that it's so

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<v Speaker 2>fascinating for me as a historian, I must say, so

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<v Speaker 2>to see how all these knowledge, you know, not not

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<v Speaker 2>a theory, but studies based upon field research, has been

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<v Speaker 2>one way or the other ignored by men, streams, follers,

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00:31:37.000 --> 00:31:44.519
<v Speaker 2>and today they are practically you know, unknown for for

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<v Speaker 2>for for the public in general.

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<v Speaker 1>You know what I'm saying, We're going to take a

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<v Speaker 1>short commercial break to allow our sponsors to identify themselves

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<v Speaker 1>and We will returned shortly with my guest today, Raphael Eisman,

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<v Speaker 1>coming to us from Ukraine discussing the works of Ruth Rodriguez,

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00:32:09.519 --> 00:32:18.279
<v Speaker 1>Sider Mariar Echoes of the Unknown History. Will be right back.

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00:32:22.720 --> 00:32:28.519
<v Speaker 7>There's that telling must do holding on You need for

360
00:32:28.920 --> 00:32:37.039
<v Speaker 7>time trip somewhere in the world. This takes don't well,

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00:32:37.200 --> 00:32:41.720
<v Speaker 7>I guess so what if this man Jack but the

362
00:32:41.880 --> 00:32:48.599
<v Speaker 7>North was telling so zachn Wait, don't bring that old

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00:32:48.720 --> 00:32:51.880
<v Speaker 7>book because he's awful.

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<v Speaker 1>I had the perfect gift for you. In twenty twenty six,

365
00:33:04.359 --> 00:33:08.000
<v Speaker 1>the seventh annual Grand Egyptian Tour. Not only is this

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00:33:08.160 --> 00:33:13.279
<v Speaker 1>tour sponsored by saboteurs are friends Mohammad and his wife

367
00:33:13.759 --> 00:33:18.559
<v Speaker 1>Noha Imbrahem, but the tour is roughly half off the

368
00:33:18.599 --> 00:33:22.359
<v Speaker 1>typical price of a twelve day tour. We're going to

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00:33:22.400 --> 00:33:26.319
<v Speaker 1>see not only the one billion dollar Grand Egyptian Museum,

370
00:33:27.039 --> 00:33:30.119
<v Speaker 1>We're also going to see the megaliths of ancient Egypt,

371
00:33:30.200 --> 00:33:36.880
<v Speaker 1>including the Pyramids, the Sphinx, temples galore, and an opportunity

372
00:33:36.960 --> 00:33:40.559
<v Speaker 1>to see sites that are typically not available to the public.

373
00:33:41.079 --> 00:33:43.920
<v Speaker 1>This is considered a diplomatic tour because it's five star

374
00:33:44.000 --> 00:33:49.039
<v Speaker 1>across the board, including boat trip, on the Nile, wonderful hotels,

375
00:33:49.480 --> 00:33:54.200
<v Speaker 1>air conditioned buses, and food and beverages to your delight.

376
00:33:55.000 --> 00:33:57.640
<v Speaker 1>Everything is included once you get to Cairo, and this

377
00:33:57.839 --> 00:33:59.640
<v Speaker 1>is not to be missed. For all the details go

378
00:33:59.680 --> 00:34:03.880
<v Speaker 1>to earth at ancients dot com, forward slash tours, give

379
00:34:03.920 --> 00:34:07.839
<v Speaker 1>yourself the gift of a lifetime. Jonnis and Cairo, April

380
00:34:07.920 --> 00:34:12.880
<v Speaker 1>twenty eighth through May tenth. My guest is Raphael Eisman.

381
00:34:13.000 --> 00:34:18.559
<v Speaker 1>He is discussing a historian, Ruth Rodriguez Sodemyr and her

382
00:34:18.679 --> 00:34:21.599
<v Speaker 1>book Echoes of the Unknown History. This is a look

383
00:34:21.679 --> 00:34:27.480
<v Speaker 1>at prehistory before the Greeks, the Romans, perhaps even the Sumerians.

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00:34:34.360 --> 00:34:39.519
<v Speaker 1>You know, it's interesting because what she's writing about corresponds

385
00:34:39.599 --> 00:34:45.639
<v Speaker 1>with the Hindu Yugas, and she says, these earlier, earlier

386
00:34:45.800 --> 00:34:49.960
<v Speaker 1>people are part of the Sachia and Tretep periods, which

387
00:34:50.039 --> 00:34:54.400
<v Speaker 1>is the gold the Golden and the Silver period. Do

388
00:34:54.519 --> 00:34:56.840
<v Speaker 1>we have a sense of how far along it's like,

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00:34:57.159 --> 00:35:00.199
<v Speaker 1>twenty thousand years ago, twenty eight thousand years ago, how

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00:35:00.239 --> 00:35:03.440
<v Speaker 1>many how many years ago is it in prehistory?

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<v Speaker 2>It's pre history. I was just talking about this today

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00:35:11.280 --> 00:35:17.239
<v Speaker 2>with some scholar here. What's the antiquity of Chile. You know. So,

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00:35:17.360 --> 00:35:22.440
<v Speaker 2>I have Monte Birdy that was studied by American archeologist

394
00:35:22.840 --> 00:35:30.159
<v Speaker 2>Tom Dillahey. And when he stayed through archaeological study that

395
00:35:30.599 --> 00:35:35.400
<v Speaker 2>Monte Birdy, you south of Chile, was thirty years old.

396
00:35:36.199 --> 00:35:42.880
<v Speaker 2>All the theological community went against him, you know. So.

397
00:35:43.320 --> 00:35:49.840
<v Speaker 2>And and if you think thirty years ago, it's just yesterday. Now,

398
00:35:50.719 --> 00:35:55.280
<v Speaker 2>I think it was one or two years ago. I

399
00:35:55.360 --> 00:36:02.360
<v Speaker 2>cannot go. There was this archaeological study that you know,

400
00:36:03.559 --> 00:36:12.320
<v Speaker 2>they studying, Ah, I would say twenty six twenty five

401
00:36:12.519 --> 00:36:21.159
<v Speaker 2>or something burreal sites of South America and most of them,

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00:36:21.679 --> 00:36:26.760
<v Speaker 2>most of them had nerdental DNA. And so far we

403
00:36:26.920 --> 00:36:31.519
<v Speaker 2>understand the Netherlands were never in the so called New World.

404
00:36:31.920 --> 00:36:39.079
<v Speaker 2>How can you explain that? So that's what I'm saying, America. Yes,

405
00:36:39.559 --> 00:36:46.039
<v Speaker 2>and this is what we are trying to, you know, study,

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00:36:46.159 --> 00:36:49.159
<v Speaker 2>And that's one of the reasons why I'm here. I

407
00:36:49.320 --> 00:36:54.360
<v Speaker 2>got to the uh this is breaking news. I'm going

408
00:36:54.480 --> 00:37:01.760
<v Speaker 2>to the Natural History Museum of Tea. Just awesome, it's great,

409
00:37:01.800 --> 00:37:06.159
<v Speaker 2>it's wonderful. And we have on display right now a

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00:37:06.320 --> 00:37:13.719
<v Speaker 2>very small part of the college. Yes, I would say

411
00:37:14.000 --> 00:37:21.440
<v Speaker 2>most of the stone tool technology on this plane. It's

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00:37:21.519 --> 00:37:24.679
<v Speaker 2>a very sane way. We haven't children, can you explain that?

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00:37:25.239 --> 00:37:29.920
<v Speaker 2>In the paralytic age? So what are we talking about here?

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00:37:30.239 --> 00:37:38.480
<v Speaker 2>We're talking about at this age time we have absolutely

415
00:37:38.840 --> 00:37:46.199
<v Speaker 2>other seeing levels of water of course, you know, so

416
00:37:47.639 --> 00:37:52.599
<v Speaker 2>I think I think about ten eleven, twelve thousand years

417
00:37:52.639 --> 00:37:59.400
<v Speaker 2>ago back we we cannot really know what was going on.

418
00:38:00.239 --> 00:38:04.920
<v Speaker 2>That's the milestone of time when all what we know

419
00:38:05.000 --> 00:38:12.719
<v Speaker 2>about mythology, you know, that is ancient history became mythology,

420
00:38:13.400 --> 00:38:19.000
<v Speaker 2>and we've started from that point on, you know, consider

421
00:38:19.800 --> 00:38:24.360
<v Speaker 2>archaeological findings as history. Yet I must insist on this.

422
00:38:24.599 --> 00:38:32.199
<v Speaker 2>How can we explain the similarities the parallel stone tool

423
00:38:32.239 --> 00:38:35.199
<v Speaker 2>technology of I don't know, a country like Ukraine with

424
00:38:35.280 --> 00:38:40.280
<v Speaker 2>a country like Chile. Yeah, questions, I know, we won't

425
00:38:40.440 --> 00:38:44.800
<v Speaker 2>have the answers. And that's the best part of it.

426
00:38:46.000 --> 00:38:50.519
<v Speaker 1>M Yeah, it's really hard, you know, it's funny. It's

427
00:38:50.639 --> 00:38:53.320
<v Speaker 1>very hard to come up with dates. And the other

428
00:38:53.480 --> 00:39:00.000
<v Speaker 1>thing that Ruth in her writing criticizes is carbon fourteen days.

429
00:39:01.679 --> 00:39:06.360
<v Speaker 1>She says it's not shouldn't be anxious to say explain that?

430
00:39:06.960 --> 00:39:10.239
<v Speaker 1>Why is she so against carbon dating?

431
00:39:11.440 --> 00:39:21.280
<v Speaker 2>Well, Ruth, I must still a very very important thing.

432
00:39:21.599 --> 00:39:22.480
<v Speaker 6>I I I.

433
00:39:24.280 --> 00:39:26.960
<v Speaker 2>I think this is the first time I'm gonna talk

434
00:39:27.000 --> 00:39:29.480
<v Speaker 2>about this. I had a chance to talk to Ruth

435
00:39:29.679 --> 00:39:35.519
<v Speaker 2>last year. I visited her in in.

436
00:39:39.079 --> 00:39:39.280
<v Speaker 1>Ah.

437
00:39:40.199 --> 00:39:44.519
<v Speaker 2>I cannot remember the name of the place where she

438
00:39:45.039 --> 00:39:49.599
<v Speaker 2>she lived, eating in the north part of Latred and

439
00:39:50.440 --> 00:39:54.480
<v Speaker 2>we spoke about three hours or so and.

440
00:39:57.119 --> 00:39:57.440
<v Speaker 1>Mhm.

441
00:39:57.960 --> 00:40:03.239
<v Speaker 2>She said, this, Raphael, all what we know about history

442
00:40:03.639 --> 00:40:08.119
<v Speaker 2>it has been written by Christians, by Catholics, so they

443
00:40:08.159 --> 00:40:12.360
<v Speaker 2>cannot come up with pre fulled cultures. We cannot come

444
00:40:12.440 --> 00:40:16.360
<v Speaker 2>up with pre flooded civilizations because that's at a book.

445
00:40:16.920 --> 00:40:17.079
<v Speaker 1>You know.

446
00:40:17.960 --> 00:40:25.679
<v Speaker 2>She was very, very clear, and she's like, oh, abspute

447
00:40:25.880 --> 00:40:37.960
<v Speaker 2>all the methods we have for measuring our history. I manipulated.

448
00:40:39.679 --> 00:40:43.239
<v Speaker 2>She said something that kind of reminds me of hands

449
00:40:43.360 --> 00:40:47.400
<v Speaker 2>four big girls Glacis slogany. She's like, our species, it's

450
00:40:47.920 --> 00:40:52.239
<v Speaker 2>millions of years old, and that's why in ancient times

451
00:40:52.320 --> 00:40:55.519
<v Speaker 2>and our ancestors talk about this old age where there

452
00:40:55.639 --> 00:40:59.760
<v Speaker 2>was some sort of paradise, you know, but it it

453
00:41:00.639 --> 00:41:07.360
<v Speaker 2>was really beyond our chronology, you know, And I must uh.

454
00:41:07.960 --> 00:41:13.559
<v Speaker 2>She started to you know, study, for example, the Hindu

455
00:41:13.719 --> 00:41:17.280
<v Speaker 2>is tradition of what such a juga or the Indo

456
00:41:17.880 --> 00:41:23.920
<v Speaker 2>German tradition of the Open Age, and in South America especially,

457
00:41:24.679 --> 00:41:30.199
<v Speaker 2>I came up with this source of Alcano, you know,

458
00:41:30.360 --> 00:41:36.840
<v Speaker 2>talking about the some sort of Golden age as well

459
00:41:37.280 --> 00:41:42.039
<v Speaker 2>in the midst time, how a white lived with people

460
00:41:42.360 --> 00:41:46.400
<v Speaker 2>in a typty all would refer to. In the very

461
00:41:46.599 --> 00:41:54.119
<v Speaker 2>first beginning, there was this, you know, Golden age. So

462
00:41:54.800 --> 00:41:58.239
<v Speaker 2>Ruth talked about that, but she said, like it was

463
00:41:58.360 --> 00:42:05.599
<v Speaker 2>not a Golden Age but silver age where these women

464
00:42:06.840 --> 00:42:09.480
<v Speaker 2>priesthood was ruining, you.

465
00:42:09.519 --> 00:42:16.239
<v Speaker 1>Know, interesstem. Why do you think she's down on the church?

466
00:42:16.400 --> 00:42:21.400
<v Speaker 1>Is that because they're manipulating the narrative of the ancient

467
00:42:21.519 --> 00:42:25.960
<v Speaker 1>past and they don't want they want their own version

468
00:42:26.000 --> 00:42:26.920
<v Speaker 1>of the ancient past.

469
00:42:30.480 --> 00:42:41.679
<v Speaker 2>Well, I mean because they destroyed, they most of the

470
00:42:42.440 --> 00:42:47.400
<v Speaker 2>vestiges of the civilization of the white gods. You know,

471
00:42:48.840 --> 00:42:57.199
<v Speaker 2>they burned the code excess in Central America. They destroyed

472
00:42:57.440 --> 00:43:05.400
<v Speaker 2>absolutely everything. They were on life hands talking about boot

473
00:43:05.559 --> 00:43:09.159
<v Speaker 2>and blah and blah blah blah. On the other hand,

474
00:43:10.039 --> 00:43:15.559
<v Speaker 2>they were, as she said me, they were the worst sceners,

475
00:43:16.159 --> 00:43:21.320
<v Speaker 2>you know, and he actually referred like most of the

476
00:43:21.800 --> 00:43:25.639
<v Speaker 2>feel of these phrases where let speak, all.

477
00:43:32.039 --> 00:43:35.920
<v Speaker 1>One thing she writes about is that there is an

478
00:43:36.000 --> 00:43:42.360
<v Speaker 1>indication of six writing systems in prehistory and she lists

479
00:43:42.440 --> 00:43:52.239
<v Speaker 1>them as geomegnanuh, geometric math or uri, cuneiform, hieroglyphics which

480
00:43:52.320 --> 00:44:01.719
<v Speaker 1>is the Maya picture graphs, phonetic writing or Aztec, and cryptographic.

481
00:44:02.760 --> 00:44:05.719
<v Speaker 1>Six different types of writing.

482
00:44:07.239 --> 00:44:14.840
<v Speaker 2>And that that was a your theory, mm hmm. At

483
00:44:14.880 --> 00:44:22.159
<v Speaker 2>one point she came up with this project that we

484
00:44:22.239 --> 00:44:30.599
<v Speaker 2>should uh travel through out Americas and record and she said, RAPHI,

485
00:44:30.760 --> 00:44:38.320
<v Speaker 2>we have to record absolutely every single sign on the rocks. Yeah.

486
00:44:38.559 --> 00:44:45.280
<v Speaker 2>She had this wonderful brain view about you know, all

487
00:44:45.519 --> 00:44:48.599
<v Speaker 2>our past and I'm like, what we need? What we

488
00:44:48.800 --> 00:44:52.280
<v Speaker 2>need like ten years to do that, a lot of resources,

489
00:44:52.840 --> 00:44:59.119
<v Speaker 2>and you know, almost like a possible. She's like, that's

490
00:44:59.159 --> 00:45:00.960
<v Speaker 2>something we have to do. That's what they would have

491
00:45:01.039 --> 00:45:14.119
<v Speaker 2>to talk, Yes, she she I sort of divided this, yeah,

492
00:45:14.440 --> 00:45:22.159
<v Speaker 2>like medical groups, you know, and in another thing, but

493
00:45:22.440 --> 00:45:28.079
<v Speaker 2>I don't want to meet. She also at one point

494
00:45:28.199 --> 00:45:36.679
<v Speaker 2>to that and a lot of the pre Columbian artifacts

495
00:45:36.719 --> 00:45:42.679
<v Speaker 2>and ologists should be watched, uh with a mirror, you know,

496
00:45:46.199 --> 00:45:54.000
<v Speaker 2>right to to to see the opposite side of it. Actually, yes,

497
00:45:54.760 --> 00:46:01.480
<v Speaker 2>kind of like Leonardo da Vinci, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, well,

498
00:46:02.000 --> 00:46:07.719
<v Speaker 2>you know ancient world. Uh, in the in the European tradition,

499
00:46:08.079 --> 00:46:15.760
<v Speaker 2>of course, Americas and ancient a forgotten the the symbols,

500
00:46:17.239 --> 00:46:22.719
<v Speaker 2>the science, the art in general. It's it's a metaphor.

501
00:46:23.840 --> 00:46:26.320
<v Speaker 2>So how do you get you to that? You have

502
00:46:26.480 --> 00:46:29.639
<v Speaker 2>to know the codes, you have to know the symbolism,

503
00:46:30.519 --> 00:46:35.000
<v Speaker 2>you have to know the meanings of of of the science,

504
00:46:35.079 --> 00:46:38.199
<v Speaker 2>of the figures of these objects to understand what's going

505
00:46:38.280 --> 00:46:41.440
<v Speaker 2>on there, you know. Yeah.

506
00:46:43.039 --> 00:46:43.159
<v Speaker 4>Uh.

507
00:46:43.840 --> 00:46:46.960
<v Speaker 1>One thing that was of interest personally to me is

508
00:46:47.039 --> 00:46:51.840
<v Speaker 1>that she said that you're a corners of who was

509
00:46:51.960 --> 00:46:56.719
<v Speaker 1>the main translator of the Mayan hieroglyphs. Didn't take the

510
00:46:56.920 --> 00:47:01.400
<v Speaker 1>bulk of the spiritual science which is a part of

511
00:47:01.480 --> 00:47:04.960
<v Speaker 1>the mining culture, and what we see in the hieroglyphics

512
00:47:06.039 --> 00:47:10.280
<v Speaker 1>are just part of the language. And I couldn't believe

513
00:47:10.360 --> 00:47:16.400
<v Speaker 1>that he was following some personal Uh, he was editing

514
00:47:17.519 --> 00:47:19.599
<v Speaker 1>the decipherment of these hieroglyphs.

515
00:47:22.000 --> 00:47:34.559
<v Speaker 2>Well, I I I I remember now following your ideas, Gliff,

516
00:47:37.400 --> 00:47:42.960
<v Speaker 2>I have the chance to meet to know a shaman

517
00:47:43.119 --> 00:47:50.599
<v Speaker 2>in the song. She lived right hand from the out tradition,

518
00:47:50.960 --> 00:47:54.880
<v Speaker 2>you know, and there was there was a lot of

519
00:47:55.039 --> 00:47:59.440
<v Speaker 2>things she told me, you know, in a very well

520
00:47:59.639 --> 00:48:09.480
<v Speaker 2>it's a very way, in a secret way. So I

521
00:48:09.679 --> 00:48:14.760
<v Speaker 2>think we have to understand that all these.

522
00:48:16.320 --> 00:48:16.719
<v Speaker 8>Mhmm.

523
00:48:17.199 --> 00:48:24.480
<v Speaker 2>Well, when you stand today, phychological messiges, as symbols, as signs,

524
00:48:24.880 --> 00:48:30.840
<v Speaker 2>as you know, the these icons of the pretty spanic

525
00:48:30.880 --> 00:48:40.400
<v Speaker 2>pre Columbian world are in fact coded uh knowledge, you know.

526
00:48:41.239 --> 00:48:46.280
<v Speaker 2>And in some occasions there is a possibility to you know,

527
00:48:46.440 --> 00:48:49.639
<v Speaker 2>for as fast to communicate, but then at the same time,

528
00:48:50.000 --> 00:48:54.400
<v Speaker 2>a lot of times there's no chance at all. So

529
00:48:55.920 --> 00:48:59.639
<v Speaker 2>I think this is the case. I I think Ruth

530
00:49:00.760 --> 00:49:08.639
<v Speaker 2>tried and wanted to communicate some of this amazing world

531
00:49:08.719 --> 00:49:13.800
<v Speaker 2>which having Americas, you know, Yet not all of that

532
00:49:14.800 --> 00:49:19.159
<v Speaker 2>was or is possible, because it's got to do with

533
00:49:20.039 --> 00:49:26.920
<v Speaker 2>sacred traditions you know, that are still living at police

534
00:49:27.000 --> 00:49:31.000
<v Speaker 2>in South America. So I can tell you right.

535
00:49:32.039 --> 00:49:37.239
<v Speaker 1>She highlights Tiyunaku in Bolivia as one of the great

536
00:49:37.400 --> 00:49:44.239
<v Speaker 1>Prediluvian cities, and we know from Posnanski he dated that

537
00:49:44.440 --> 00:49:47.159
<v Speaker 1>city that I think wasn't it twenty eight thousand years

538
00:49:47.199 --> 00:49:57.280
<v Speaker 1>old or older? Perhaps, But she remarks that that has

539
00:49:57.360 --> 00:50:00.679
<v Speaker 1>a lot more to tell us that ancient city. We've

540
00:50:00.719 --> 00:50:02.760
<v Speaker 1>only scratched the service about those people.

541
00:50:04.239 --> 00:50:08.639
<v Speaker 2>Well, that that's the thing which scratched the surface of things.

542
00:50:11.360 --> 00:50:16.320
<v Speaker 2>As you know. I'm part of the ACA Choreographical Exploring Team.

543
00:50:17.079 --> 00:50:19.559
<v Speaker 2>We were there a couple of years ago. In a

544
00:50:19.800 --> 00:50:28.760
<v Speaker 2>previous expedition. Some of the members, some of the speleologists,

545
00:50:29.440 --> 00:50:36.320
<v Speaker 2>went down AH in the Agapana Pyramid in it's a

546
00:50:36.480 --> 00:50:40.280
<v Speaker 2>old system. Now this is this is this is this

547
00:50:40.480 --> 00:50:43.239
<v Speaker 2>is like in recent years, you know, a couple of

548
00:50:43.360 --> 00:50:47.840
<v Speaker 2>years ago if you study, if you read h this

549
00:50:47.920 --> 00:50:56.280
<v Speaker 2>isn't the studies UH developed by Edmund kiss It's German

550
00:50:56.519 --> 00:51:02.559
<v Speaker 2>archeologists back in the nineteen thirties. He claims that Yah

551
00:51:02.599 --> 00:51:08.559
<v Speaker 2>Whena was also an underground city. That's something that's very

552
00:51:08.760 --> 00:51:18.679
<v Speaker 2>very important to understanding antiquity of this civilization. Paus Nanski

553
00:51:19.440 --> 00:51:25.119
<v Speaker 2>talks about a right a range of eighteen twenty two,

554
00:51:25.280 --> 00:51:31.519
<v Speaker 2>twenty three years old. Yet and kids goes even further

555
00:51:32.119 --> 00:51:37.239
<v Speaker 2>in his like not him in lacial cosmoony is able

556
00:51:37.480 --> 00:51:43.440
<v Speaker 2>to establish the antiquity, you know, it goes beyond our chronology,

557
00:51:48.599 --> 00:51:52.360
<v Speaker 2>something that happens usually and this is something for example,

558
00:51:52.440 --> 00:51:59.840
<v Speaker 2>I could tell I was studying with sights in archaeological

559
00:52:00.039 --> 00:52:05.519
<v Speaker 2>sight in Ukraine and you have one spot and you

560
00:52:05.679 --> 00:52:12.440
<v Speaker 2>have seven layers, seven different cultures UH in the same

561
00:52:12.960 --> 00:52:17.679
<v Speaker 2>geographical spot. Mm hm, that's the very same thing that

562
00:52:17.800 --> 00:52:23.719
<v Speaker 2>took place in Tjiavanaco. You have Tiaguanaco, the primitive Tjiavannaco.

563
00:52:23.880 --> 00:52:32.960
<v Speaker 2>You have certain type of UH people, then you have others,

564
00:52:33.519 --> 00:52:38.199
<v Speaker 2>and then you have I would say, what five six,

565
00:52:38.360 --> 00:52:43.559
<v Speaker 2>seven layers the same thing, you know, and and UH thing.

566
00:52:44.400 --> 00:52:51.159
<v Speaker 2>Whenever will have another world wide catastrophe, people are gonna

567
00:52:51.159 --> 00:52:53.800
<v Speaker 2>go back to Tiaguanaco and they're gonna start to live

568
00:52:53.880 --> 00:52:56.880
<v Speaker 2>again there and we're gonna have another level and that's

569
00:52:56.960 --> 00:53:00.199
<v Speaker 2>gonna happen everywhere in the world. Yeah, and then you

570
00:53:00.320 --> 00:53:04.559
<v Speaker 2>started to make archeological thinking, you start to make archeological stylis,

571
00:53:04.960 --> 00:53:07.719
<v Speaker 2>and you'll be like, oh, this is so amazing. Have

572
00:53:07.840 --> 00:53:13.119
<v Speaker 2>different skulls here. Yeah, and that has happened, I would say,

573
00:53:13.360 --> 00:53:17.480
<v Speaker 2>throughout the world. And that's something that for me so

574
00:53:17.920 --> 00:53:23.559
<v Speaker 2>fascinating because that tells you about you know, why certain

575
00:53:23.679 --> 00:53:30.000
<v Speaker 2>places are sacred. Why do they have people vow and

576
00:53:30.159 --> 00:53:36.679
<v Speaker 2>vow and and and populate and repopulate you know. Yeah,

577
00:53:37.960 --> 00:53:38.239
<v Speaker 2>why do.

578
00:53:38.400 --> 00:53:43.880
<v Speaker 1>Archaeologists have so much trouble with prehistory? H and and

579
00:53:44.679 --> 00:53:48.880
<v Speaker 1>when when places like Tiu and Aku come up we

580
00:53:48.960 --> 00:53:52.280
<v Speaker 1>don't see any major university research there because it's such

581
00:53:52.320 --> 00:53:55.760
<v Speaker 1>an anomaly. I think they do so want to go there.

582
00:53:55.880 --> 00:54:03.159
<v Speaker 2>But Rick found then again once told me something that

583
00:54:03.360 --> 00:54:05.119
<v Speaker 2>has been really a guideline.

584
00:54:05.440 --> 00:54:05.559
<v Speaker 7>Uh.

585
00:54:05.880 --> 00:54:09.599
<v Speaker 2>He's like, we have two types of thinkers. We have

586
00:54:09.960 --> 00:54:14.840
<v Speaker 2>scientific thinkers and we have religious thinkers, and they both

587
00:54:15.239 --> 00:54:19.840
<v Speaker 2>are in the center of history. So you have on

588
00:54:19.960 --> 00:54:27.480
<v Speaker 2>one hand scientists that think that we understand the fact

589
00:54:28.280 --> 00:54:31.800
<v Speaker 2>we're in this evolutionary process, we are at the very

590
00:54:32.000 --> 00:54:37.719
<v Speaker 2>pop of it. And then you have religious as scientists

591
00:54:37.920 --> 00:54:41.039
<v Speaker 2>or religious scientists that think that we are at the

592
00:54:41.159 --> 00:54:45.360
<v Speaker 2>center of creation. So when when you have these two

593
00:54:45.800 --> 00:54:50.239
<v Speaker 2>concepts and you apply and you focusing to be a

594
00:54:50.440 --> 00:54:53.199
<v Speaker 2>field ground, you have to have these two concepts to

595
00:54:53.400 --> 00:54:56.719
<v Speaker 2>understand what's around you. And that doesn't make sense, you know.

596
00:54:57.960 --> 00:54:59.159
<v Speaker 2>What I mean is that.

597
00:55:02.480 --> 00:55:03.000
<v Speaker 7>This is my.

598
00:55:05.840 --> 00:55:12.760
<v Speaker 2>Understanding that once you establish a theory, the vestiges are

599
00:55:12.840 --> 00:55:16.679
<v Speaker 2>going to follow your theory. Whenever it's got to be

600
00:55:16.800 --> 00:55:20.559
<v Speaker 2>the other way around. So you have a table and

601
00:55:20.719 --> 00:55:25.440
<v Speaker 2>you have read in the history inside the frame of

602
00:55:25.519 --> 00:55:29.760
<v Speaker 2>a table, you know, and then someone else comes and tells, you,

603
00:55:30.199 --> 00:55:35.000
<v Speaker 2>I have this piece that doesn't fit in your table.

604
00:55:35.360 --> 00:55:38.719
<v Speaker 2>What are you going to do. That's what happens here

605
00:55:38.800 --> 00:55:42.480
<v Speaker 2>in Ukraine, that's what happens in America. That what happens

606
00:55:43.119 --> 00:55:47.039
<v Speaker 2>everywhere in the world. You know, Uh, there are so

607
00:55:47.519 --> 00:55:55.000
<v Speaker 2>many examples, I know, so many examples of what we

608
00:55:55.280 --> 00:55:59.559
<v Speaker 2>say it is for bidding archaeology, for biding history, for

609
00:55:59.679 --> 00:56:02.360
<v Speaker 2>bidding Why because it doesn't see, it's not that we

610
00:56:02.480 --> 00:56:04.599
<v Speaker 2>are making it up. It's not because we want to

611
00:56:04.639 --> 00:56:10.039
<v Speaker 2>be sensationalists at all. It's just because these are objects,

612
00:56:10.199 --> 00:56:15.119
<v Speaker 2>these are frames, these are fields that are part are

613
00:56:15.239 --> 00:56:18.800
<v Speaker 2>part of our past, are part of our history, yet

614
00:56:19.800 --> 00:56:20.719
<v Speaker 2>they do not fit.

615
00:56:22.199 --> 00:56:24.559
<v Speaker 1>Okay, to take a short commercial break to allow our

616
00:56:24.639 --> 00:56:29.159
<v Speaker 1>sponsors to identify themselves, and we will return shortly with

617
00:56:29.320 --> 00:56:33.440
<v Speaker 1>my guest today, Raphael Heisman, coming to us from Ukraine.

618
00:56:35.159 --> 00:57:27.599
<v Speaker 1>Will be right back. My guest today is Raphael Eisman.

619
00:57:27.719 --> 00:57:31.719
<v Speaker 1>He has written a new article on a historian from Ecuador,

620
00:57:32.159 --> 00:57:36.559
<v Speaker 1>Ruth Roriguez Sodomyor, who discovered a great deal of ancient

621
00:57:36.719 --> 00:57:45.159
<v Speaker 1>history and unknown texts. But I mean, why are they

622
00:57:45.239 --> 00:57:48.480
<v Speaker 1>so inflexible, Because you know, it's almost like they have

623
00:57:48.599 --> 00:57:51.000
<v Speaker 1>to see something written on the damn wall for them

624
00:57:51.039 --> 00:57:54.920
<v Speaker 1>to go beyond four thousand BC. They keep saying the

625
00:57:55.039 --> 00:57:59.480
<v Speaker 1>Maya started around three thousand years old.

626
00:58:00.800 --> 00:58:04.239
<v Speaker 2>Come on, let's think about for example, in South America,

627
00:58:04.360 --> 00:58:06.239
<v Speaker 2>let me tell you something. In Chile, you have this

628
00:58:07.199 --> 00:58:14.840
<v Speaker 2>lay Indigena indigenous law. You know that allows well indigenous people.

629
00:58:14.960 --> 00:58:20.559
<v Speaker 2>I don't know how you would define to be indigenous.

630
00:58:20.760 --> 00:58:24.840
<v Speaker 2>You know, modern times and a lot of rights, and

631
00:58:24.960 --> 00:58:29.559
<v Speaker 2>that's great, and that's good. Yet if you go on, say, okay,

632
00:58:29.719 --> 00:58:38.400
<v Speaker 2>let's go through the archeological strata. You know before before

633
00:58:38.599 --> 00:58:42.199
<v Speaker 2>indigenous people, you have other people. You have another population,

634
00:58:43.039 --> 00:58:46.119
<v Speaker 2>so why would they be considered to be the pueblos

635
00:58:46.280 --> 00:58:49.480
<v Speaker 2>or hilarious states Lative Americans.

636
00:58:51.119 --> 00:58:55.960
<v Speaker 9>In the States say, I think Kenetic men, you know, yeah,

637
00:58:57.920 --> 00:59:01.880
<v Speaker 9>my biggest maybe tell you something here.

638
00:59:01.880 --> 00:59:06.119
<v Speaker 2>And in Ukraine we have we have nere than, we

639
00:59:06.239 --> 00:59:08.920
<v Speaker 2>have a home more actives, we have a Mosabian sapiens

640
00:59:09.679 --> 00:59:15.119
<v Speaker 2>who is the first? How do we define their theological information?

641
00:59:16.440 --> 00:59:21.599
<v Speaker 2>And that in twice And that's the hardest part of it.

642
00:59:22.239 --> 00:59:27.079
<v Speaker 2>A political concept. I'm not talking about politics, but it

643
00:59:27.239 --> 00:59:34.800
<v Speaker 2>implies politics. So you know what saying, Yeah, the Americas

644
00:59:35.000 --> 00:59:38.960
<v Speaker 2>we were talking about fourteen ninety two, it's a political

645
00:59:41.440 --> 00:59:48.400
<v Speaker 2>like strategy. Yeah, Spanich, they knew there was something beyond

646
00:59:49.679 --> 00:59:54.039
<v Speaker 2>the ocean, the non ocean. You know. The Vikings knew

647
00:59:54.360 --> 01:00:00.719
<v Speaker 2>the every every ancient sailor culture knew about amer maybe

648
01:00:00.800 --> 01:00:07.840
<v Speaker 2>in all eat America, you know. But at one point

649
01:00:07.920 --> 01:00:11.559
<v Speaker 2>they say, oh, okay, this spinage drum. We have to

650
01:00:11.760 --> 01:00:15.800
<v Speaker 2>write history. We have to write history, and let it

651
01:00:15.880 --> 01:00:21.159
<v Speaker 2>be know we have discovered America. That's a Joel.

652
01:00:21.719 --> 01:00:25.159
<v Speaker 1>I'm having a problem right now because I'm writing a

653
01:00:25.320 --> 01:00:30.840
<v Speaker 1>chapter about the Great Migration to the Americas and specifically

654
01:00:31.719 --> 01:00:35.000
<v Speaker 1>the early formation of what the people we call it

655
01:00:35.079 --> 01:00:39.159
<v Speaker 1>a Maya. And in my studies and another a number

656
01:00:39.239 --> 01:00:45.519
<v Speaker 1>of other researchers and authors, some of them academics, believe

657
01:00:45.599 --> 01:00:49.679
<v Speaker 1>there was a great crossing, a migration of people to

658
01:00:49.960 --> 01:00:54.480
<v Speaker 1>present day Mexico who eventually became the people we know

659
01:00:54.639 --> 01:00:58.639
<v Speaker 1>as the Maya and the Aztecs. But if you ask

660
01:00:58.960 --> 01:01:03.760
<v Speaker 1>an archaeologist, what they're thinking is, even though they've had

661
01:01:04.119 --> 01:01:07.760
<v Speaker 1>research of people, you know, able to cross the ocean

662
01:01:07.880 --> 01:01:12.039
<v Speaker 1>and read boats, they just can't formulate an idea like that.

663
01:01:12.239 --> 01:01:15.639
<v Speaker 1>They can't accept it. And it's just insane.

664
01:01:17.360 --> 01:01:20.760
<v Speaker 2>It is the same. It is insane. And this is

665
01:01:20.920 --> 01:01:24.039
<v Speaker 2>like going to a psychologist. This is going to like

666
01:01:24.800 --> 01:01:29.559
<v Speaker 2>any single professional we know of everyone's going to give

667
01:01:29.559 --> 01:01:39.360
<v Speaker 2>you a different answer. Yeah, you know, and I say,

668
01:01:39.960 --> 01:01:44.480
<v Speaker 2>what we have to do, Let's go and read their sources.

669
01:01:44.760 --> 01:01:48.360
<v Speaker 2>The friend is, you know what the conquista boris what

670
01:01:48.519 --> 01:01:57.360
<v Speaker 2>they missions wrote, because even though they had you know, filter,

671
01:01:58.239 --> 01:02:04.199
<v Speaker 2>of course, most of the time they will be writing

672
01:02:04.360 --> 01:02:09.199
<v Speaker 2>what there is. So what's the problem with today main

673
01:02:09.519 --> 01:02:14.039
<v Speaker 2>string historians, when it's film archeologists, it's that they have

674
01:02:14.199 --> 01:02:18.159
<v Speaker 2>to feed the pattern. But back in in in the

675
01:02:19.400 --> 01:02:22.239
<v Speaker 2>time of the conguest in the time of the colonial

676
01:02:23.880 --> 01:02:29.440
<v Speaker 2>of the colony, they were just writing. Of course everything

677
01:02:29.519 --> 01:02:39.079
<v Speaker 2>can be subjected to you know, to interpretation, yet there

678
01:02:39.320 --> 01:02:44.519
<v Speaker 2>they were like eye witness, you know, to a lot

679
01:02:44.559 --> 01:02:50.239
<v Speaker 2>of things. So for me, that's that's a very important field. Yeah.

680
01:02:50.760 --> 01:02:56.960
<v Speaker 1>I've been into small Mexican museums in Yucatan and there

681
01:02:57.079 --> 01:03:00.519
<v Speaker 1>was one in Cancun, and this is like one of

682
01:03:00.559 --> 01:03:03.800
<v Speaker 1>the first times I went to Mexico, like nineteen ninety

683
01:03:03.960 --> 01:03:08.599
<v Speaker 1>six or something, and in this museum was a small

684
01:03:08.719 --> 01:03:18.800
<v Speaker 1>woman and a man wearing Japanese kimonos and they you know,

685
01:03:19.079 --> 01:03:23.199
<v Speaker 1>the reason I love going to Latin American museums is

686
01:03:23.320 --> 01:03:27.599
<v Speaker 1>they're not editing history like the Americans or Western culture.

687
01:03:28.119 --> 01:03:31.679
<v Speaker 1>If you go to American museums, they don't want to

688
01:03:31.800 --> 01:03:36.519
<v Speaker 1>show things that make you think about or question history.

689
01:03:37.880 --> 01:03:40.639
<v Speaker 1>And this is my big problem with a migration to

690
01:03:40.760 --> 01:03:46.360
<v Speaker 1>Mexico by the early people is that there are African centric,

691
01:03:47.239 --> 01:03:54.519
<v Speaker 1>Asian centric, Middle Eastern centric people carved in reliefs and

692
01:03:54.679 --> 01:04:02.960
<v Speaker 1>sculptures and paintings on pottery. They're not Indian. There from

693
01:04:03.000 --> 01:04:06.679
<v Speaker 1>other cultures other parts of the world, and that's the proof.

694
01:04:08.239 --> 01:04:10.960
<v Speaker 1>But you can't get an archaeologist to agree with that.

695
01:04:11.079 --> 01:04:15.840
<v Speaker 1>They just simply are trained away from having original thinking.

696
01:04:18.599 --> 01:04:26.519
<v Speaker 2>This come on, It's like, it's like, uh, this is history.

697
01:04:27.400 --> 01:04:33.599
<v Speaker 2>You know today we're facing world wide migrations everywhere. No,

698
01:04:34.079 --> 01:04:40.639
<v Speaker 2>that's true, right, so uh think about Uh, this is

699
01:04:40.719 --> 01:04:43.679
<v Speaker 2>something that I have said to people Chile, like in

700
01:04:44.480 --> 01:04:48.400
<v Speaker 2>one thousand years from now, someone is gonna be like, oh,

701
01:04:49.599 --> 01:04:53.880
<v Speaker 2>you know this are complete stoptories in Chile. And how

702
01:04:54.039 --> 01:04:57.480
<v Speaker 2>did they look like, Oh they were like from a

703
01:04:57.679 --> 01:05:02.719
<v Speaker 2>continent called Europe in one dozen years is not going

704
01:05:02.800 --> 01:05:06.159
<v Speaker 2>to exist. How how would they look like, Oh they

705
01:05:06.239 --> 01:05:09.039
<v Speaker 2>were like why and they were this and they give

706
01:05:09.119 --> 01:05:11.239
<v Speaker 2>me what. I have no idea how it's gonna be

707
01:05:11.840 --> 01:05:14.440
<v Speaker 2>and someone is gonna be like, yeah, this is a myth,

708
01:05:16.000 --> 01:05:19.000
<v Speaker 2>you know, and they're gonna go and they're gonna probably

709
01:05:19.199 --> 01:05:23.920
<v Speaker 2>dig up, you know, European scars. But the population in

710
01:05:24.079 --> 01:05:27.760
<v Speaker 2>one dozen years from now, it's gonna be totally different. Yeah,

711
01:05:28.239 --> 01:05:31.159
<v Speaker 2>I hear exactly, And that's what happened. You know, when

712
01:05:31.239 --> 01:05:37.760
<v Speaker 2>we're studying now today twenty twenty five South America. Why

713
01:05:38.280 --> 01:05:40.639
<v Speaker 2>and this is something that I wanted to bring up

714
01:05:40.760 --> 01:05:43.440
<v Speaker 2>because we have been talking about food dated sitting up

715
01:05:43.760 --> 01:05:46.639
<v Speaker 2>of my Europe. When she's talking about this white laities

716
01:05:46.719 --> 01:05:50.239
<v Speaker 2>in America, You're like, why is she talking about She's

717
01:05:50.320 --> 01:05:53.199
<v Speaker 2>talking about a metaphorce. She's talking about a symbol of

718
01:05:53.280 --> 01:05:57.360
<v Speaker 2>the sun of no, no, no, You go and you

719
01:05:57.639 --> 01:06:05.800
<v Speaker 2>find distructations, you know, Yet these traditions go back twelve thirteen,

720
01:06:05.920 --> 01:06:11.480
<v Speaker 2>fourteen years ago, you know, before the indigenous people came

721
01:06:11.599 --> 01:06:18.000
<v Speaker 2>up pumping our continents. And that's it. He's thorty that

722
01:06:19.239 --> 01:06:21.800
<v Speaker 2>took place, and that's a history that's happening, and that's

723
01:06:21.840 --> 01:06:24.079
<v Speaker 2>a story that will happen again.

724
01:06:24.880 --> 01:06:29.559
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, as we come to the conclusion of our time together, Raphael,

725
01:06:30.239 --> 01:06:36.679
<v Speaker 1>what do you think Ruth Rodriguez Sotimmor will contribute to

726
01:06:37.039 --> 01:06:43.039
<v Speaker 1>ancient history. Unfortunately, she's only published in Spanish and we

727
01:06:43.159 --> 01:06:46.760
<v Speaker 1>don't know how far she's been distributed. The other thing

728
01:06:46.920 --> 01:06:50.360
<v Speaker 1>that you make a very big point on number of

729
01:06:50.440 --> 01:06:53.760
<v Speaker 1>her books haven't been published. They've only been written but

730
01:06:53.920 --> 01:06:54.639
<v Speaker 1>not published.

731
01:06:54.719 --> 01:06:54.880
<v Speaker 7>Right.

732
01:06:56.280 --> 01:07:02.039
<v Speaker 2>Yes, that's something that I that I told to her.

733
01:07:03.079 --> 01:07:05.840
<v Speaker 2>I'm like, Ruth, you have written like I don't know,

734
01:07:06.519 --> 01:07:10.039
<v Speaker 2>I would say three books at least, and you have

735
01:07:10.199 --> 01:07:15.480
<v Speaker 2>been published like ten. She's like, yes, I have to,

736
01:07:15.920 --> 01:07:21.320
<v Speaker 2>you know, work on some details and this one has

737
01:07:21.400 --> 01:07:24.119
<v Speaker 2>got to do this, and blah blah blah. And I'm like, Ruth,

738
01:07:24.840 --> 01:07:30.760
<v Speaker 2>I understand, but we cannot lose time. And yes she did.

739
01:07:30.920 --> 01:07:37.400
<v Speaker 2>She didn't publish some in Madrid. She had this encyclopedia

740
01:07:38.840 --> 01:07:42.639
<v Speaker 2>I think five bonis or something. She showed me some

741
01:07:42.880 --> 01:07:50.519
<v Speaker 2>of the manuscripts, huge, huge, you know, and well I

742
01:07:50.679 --> 01:07:58.239
<v Speaker 2>have to I have to, you know, I think how

743
01:07:58.360 --> 01:08:04.360
<v Speaker 2>we can haveing published, of course in Spanish, of course

744
01:08:04.840 --> 01:08:13.440
<v Speaker 2>in Elish, because I would say, I would say, believe

745
01:08:13.559 --> 01:08:16.600
<v Speaker 2>like history is not about the answer, spirits to do

746
01:08:17.399 --> 01:08:20.680
<v Speaker 2>more with the questions, you know, like the same thing

747
01:08:20.880 --> 01:08:27.239
<v Speaker 2>that I have spoken here with Ukrainian pathologists. How come

748
01:08:27.399 --> 01:08:31.319
<v Speaker 2>you have the same don't do technology in Ukraine, sains

749
01:08:31.479 --> 01:08:38.279
<v Speaker 2>done too, you know, industry or technology in Chile. Yeah,

750
01:08:39.319 --> 01:08:43.239
<v Speaker 2>we won't have the answers. But what I think it's

751
01:08:43.279 --> 01:08:49.079
<v Speaker 2>the most important thing and questions. So that's the same

752
01:08:49.199 --> 01:08:55.520
<v Speaker 2>thing for me in relation with what Ruth did. And

753
01:08:55.600 --> 01:08:59.920
<v Speaker 2>I think she she was such a great spirit on focus,

754
01:09:00.039 --> 01:09:06.720
<v Speaker 2>seeing on you know, performing on all these amazing work

755
01:09:07.600 --> 01:09:13.800
<v Speaker 2>on you know, rescuing or traditions, symbols, traditions, you know,

756
01:09:14.399 --> 01:09:18.359
<v Speaker 2>and saying this is what we have to understand.

757
01:09:18.600 --> 01:09:20.199
<v Speaker 1>And she was so so.

758
01:09:22.199 --> 01:09:26.920
<v Speaker 2>Clear, at least every time she spoke to me on

759
01:09:27.479 --> 01:09:32.359
<v Speaker 2>the fact that you know, we cannot be easy going,

760
01:09:32.640 --> 01:09:35.840
<v Speaker 2>we cannot be afraid. We have to speak out loud,

761
01:09:36.079 --> 01:09:40.439
<v Speaker 2>you know, the truth about our history, about who were

762
01:09:40.520 --> 01:09:46.800
<v Speaker 2>the first Americans, all the tradition about the wife gods,

763
01:09:46.880 --> 01:09:53.800
<v Speaker 2>and how they spread the knowledge and civilization throughout the

764
01:09:53.800 --> 01:10:01.319
<v Speaker 2>Americas and then how they expand to Asia and you know, Europe,

765
01:10:01.800 --> 01:10:04.960
<v Speaker 2>and the most amazing thing I must say, it's like

766
01:10:06.720 --> 01:10:09.720
<v Speaker 2>this is Gruth, you know. But that's the same thing

767
01:10:09.840 --> 01:10:18.319
<v Speaker 2>that Francisco Moreno talk about, Emitvillia, the Rada, Roberto Rankeefo,

768
01:10:19.119 --> 01:10:23.680
<v Speaker 2>our landscape kiss. So this is not just like a

769
01:10:23.760 --> 01:10:29.560
<v Speaker 2>guess of growth, you know, like the view you know,

770
01:10:29.960 --> 01:10:35.880
<v Speaker 2>the perspectives that different scholars have them our history.

771
01:10:36.560 --> 01:10:41.800
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, now she route passed away. Uh was it last

772
01:10:41.920 --> 01:10:43.279
<v Speaker 1>year or this year?

773
01:10:43.479 --> 01:10:48.720
<v Speaker 2>No? No, no, April this year, this year?

774
01:10:49.560 --> 01:10:54.439
<v Speaker 1>And did she give you permission to publish her books

775
01:10:54.560 --> 01:10:55.800
<v Speaker 1>or what was your arrangement?

776
01:10:56.000 --> 01:10:56.039
<v Speaker 6>No?

777
01:10:56.279 --> 01:11:00.439
<v Speaker 2>No, not all her books. She gave me the mission

778
01:11:00.520 --> 01:11:07.199
<v Speaker 2>to publish two or three books, haven't my folders?

779
01:11:07.880 --> 01:11:08.000
<v Speaker 7>Uh?

780
01:11:08.560 --> 01:11:13.560
<v Speaker 2>Yeah? And and and I will do you know, the publishing,

781
01:11:13.720 --> 01:11:20.000
<v Speaker 2>because that's a way that I think part of her

782
01:11:20.439 --> 01:11:21.520
<v Speaker 2>a lifetime work.

783
01:11:21.920 --> 01:11:24.399
<v Speaker 1>You know, it's going to be non so she has

784
01:11:24.479 --> 01:11:28.319
<v Speaker 1>all the graphics and the and the photographs and the

785
01:11:29.239 --> 01:11:31.760
<v Speaker 1>images that are ready to go.

786
01:11:32.079 --> 01:11:36.000
<v Speaker 2>And well, of course this interview article that was published

787
01:11:36.000 --> 01:11:39.600
<v Speaker 2>into American magazine.

788
01:11:40.159 --> 01:11:45.880
<v Speaker 10>You know, yeah, it's ah, I would say, like an

789
01:11:45.960 --> 01:11:50.359
<v Speaker 10>approach of course of of what she of what what

790
01:11:50.520 --> 01:11:51.640
<v Speaker 10>she was doing.

791
01:11:51.960 --> 01:11:54.960
<v Speaker 1>You know, it's too bad that we didn't get to

792
01:11:55.039 --> 01:11:58.560
<v Speaker 1>meet her while she was alive. You know, I mean

793
01:11:58.680 --> 01:12:00.800
<v Speaker 1>I didn't know that she was right in these books,

794
01:12:01.600 --> 01:12:04.279
<v Speaker 1>and of course I don't. I think she's very rare

795
01:12:04.680 --> 01:12:12.560
<v Speaker 1>somebody who's writing the the prehistory according to those who

796
01:12:12.680 --> 01:12:16.520
<v Speaker 1>laid down the the the information, you know, it's like

797
01:12:16.680 --> 01:12:17.399
<v Speaker 1>pretty amazing.

798
01:12:17.560 --> 01:12:25.359
<v Speaker 11>I think she she was no to some specific people

799
01:12:25.439 --> 01:12:30.119
<v Speaker 11>in Ecuador do some very specific.

800
01:12:29.760 --> 01:12:35.319
<v Speaker 2>Circles also in uh in my dread in Spain, I

801
01:12:35.880 --> 01:12:39.720
<v Speaker 2>I I have the same feeling, you know, And I

802
01:12:40.720 --> 01:12:44.399
<v Speaker 2>told her we have to bring all her research into

803
01:12:44.960 --> 01:12:51.680
<v Speaker 2>you know, why the audience because you might agree or

804
01:12:51.840 --> 01:12:58.119
<v Speaker 2>not right on on what she's researching or on what

805
01:12:58.279 --> 01:13:03.680
<v Speaker 2>she's doing, but the ideas the field of the research

806
01:13:04.840 --> 01:13:14.039
<v Speaker 2>was fascinating. So yeah, ah, I I think I think

807
01:13:14.199 --> 01:13:22.640
<v Speaker 2>that she might have a congress in angering, you know.

808
01:13:22.960 --> 01:13:28.720
<v Speaker 2>But nevertheless, it's also very like limited, you know. So

809
01:13:29.199 --> 01:13:35.079
<v Speaker 2>I think that one of the amish we should devil

810
01:13:35.720 --> 01:13:41.239
<v Speaker 2>be to have her research translated into English, you know,

811
01:13:41.520 --> 01:13:45.720
<v Speaker 2>so you cannot read can study all what she was doing.

812
01:13:47.560 --> 01:13:51.960
<v Speaker 1>Ruth Rodriguez Sotimior and we were talking today about an

813
01:13:52.039 --> 01:13:56.640
<v Speaker 1>article the Refrael wrote called Echoes of the Unknown History

814
01:13:56.760 --> 01:14:01.680
<v Speaker 1>the American Origins of Culture. And I'm going to put

815
01:14:01.800 --> 01:14:04.600
<v Speaker 1>this article on the Facebook page. You can read it

816
01:14:04.760 --> 01:14:07.920
<v Speaker 1>and it's tear I entirety.

817
01:14:08.520 --> 01:14:08.920
<v Speaker 11>There we go.

818
01:14:10.640 --> 01:14:14.279
<v Speaker 1>And I want you to also, uh check this out

819
01:14:14.359 --> 01:14:21.039
<v Speaker 1>because Raphael has inserted a number of excellent photographs that

820
01:14:21.960 --> 01:14:26.279
<v Speaker 1>parallel a lot of the writings from Ruth's work. So Raphael,

821
01:14:26.479 --> 01:14:30.800
<v Speaker 1>thank you. I appreciate you being on the program and

822
01:14:33.359 --> 01:14:35.720
<v Speaker 1>keep in touch regarding these books because I'd love to

823
01:14:35.800 --> 01:14:39.720
<v Speaker 1>see one or two of them in English. And uh,

824
01:14:40.319 --> 01:14:42.680
<v Speaker 1>I know, I don't know how many of you've already seen.

825
01:14:44.640 --> 01:14:48.079
<v Speaker 1>I think you mentioned one was published in Madrid, so

826
01:14:48.479 --> 01:14:50.600
<v Speaker 1>that's Spanish. You can read that. But if it's a

827
01:14:51.000 --> 01:14:53.359
<v Speaker 1>do you read Italian? If it's an Italian.

828
01:14:54.520 --> 01:15:00.920
<v Speaker 2>No, I mean only Spanish.

829
01:15:01.640 --> 01:15:07.640
<v Speaker 1>Only Spanish, okay, all right, so yes, all right, all right,

830
01:15:07.720 --> 01:15:12.159
<v Speaker 1>Well listen, man, I appreciate it. You're you're a world traveler,

831
01:15:12.319 --> 01:15:19.239
<v Speaker 1>You're you're braver than me to be in Ukraine. So okay, yeah,

832
01:15:19.640 --> 01:15:24.079
<v Speaker 1>thanks man, stay in touch, Thank you, Cleif, thank you,

833
01:15:25.359 --> 01:15:28.479
<v Speaker 1>and we'll be watching, of course anytime I want to

834
01:15:28.520 --> 01:15:36.319
<v Speaker 1>be there. Okay, thank you. I didn't mention that Raphael

835
01:15:36.479 --> 01:15:39.880
<v Speaker 1>is having a book published by Inner Traditions, one of us,

836
01:15:39.960 --> 01:15:45.039
<v Speaker 1>my publisher, and he's also in the works of translating

837
01:15:45.199 --> 01:15:49.520
<v Speaker 1>a number of Ruth's unpublished books. Apparently she has a

838
01:15:49.600 --> 01:15:55.000
<v Speaker 1>whole encyclopedia of five books of ancient prehistory that he's

839
01:15:55.039 --> 01:15:57.600
<v Speaker 1>in the process of translating. I can't wait to get

840
01:15:57.640 --> 01:16:01.119
<v Speaker 1>my hands on that because there's so much in that

841
01:16:02.119 --> 01:16:10.079
<v Speaker 1>information regarding the Maya, and it really is. And the

842
01:16:10.159 --> 01:16:12.159
<v Speaker 1>other thing about it is that she supports all her

843
01:16:12.279 --> 01:16:18.439
<v Speaker 1>research with documents references. It's not just you know, native

844
01:16:18.479 --> 01:16:21.840
<v Speaker 1>traditions or oral traditions. In fact, most of it is

845
01:16:21.880 --> 01:16:26.680
<v Speaker 1>written documents that she was able to collect. And it's

846
01:16:26.760 --> 01:16:32.279
<v Speaker 1>wonderful that we have this opportunity to see other perspectives

847
01:16:33.039 --> 01:16:38.039
<v Speaker 1>of our ancient past. We just cannot depend on Western

848
01:16:38.199 --> 01:16:45.399
<v Speaker 1>you know, us European archaeologists, historians as the gatekeepers of

849
01:16:45.479 --> 01:16:48.279
<v Speaker 1>this knowledge. And this is why I have such a

850
01:16:48.319 --> 01:16:54.079
<v Speaker 1>fascination for the Maya, because they are misunderstood, misclassified, and

851
01:16:54.279 --> 01:16:57.760
<v Speaker 1>much of the data is repressed. A tremendous amount of

852
01:16:57.880 --> 01:17:02.720
<v Speaker 1>data is repressed. And when I say repressed, it's like

853
01:17:03.199 --> 01:17:08.560
<v Speaker 1>oral traditions are not considered valid, shamanistic theories and what

854
01:17:08.680 --> 01:17:10.800
<v Speaker 1>they call dake. If you don't know what a daykeeper is,

855
01:17:10.800 --> 01:17:17.199
<v Speaker 1>a daykeeper is a calindrical scientists calendar watcher that are

856
01:17:17.399 --> 01:17:25.720
<v Speaker 1>trained to follow the various seasons through skywatching the planets

857
01:17:26.680 --> 01:17:33.279
<v Speaker 1>and changing seasons and such. We don't consider daykeepers. You

858
01:17:33.319 --> 01:17:37.560
<v Speaker 1>don't read about daykeepers in any academic journal because it's

859
01:17:37.640 --> 01:17:42.840
<v Speaker 1>considered fluff. But these are the guys who set things

860
01:17:42.920 --> 01:17:46.680
<v Speaker 1>in motion. The daykeepers are you know, look up Daatekeepers

861
01:17:46.720 --> 01:17:49.079
<v Speaker 1>and see the definition of it. It's pretty These guys

862
01:17:49.119 --> 01:17:52.960
<v Speaker 1>are pretty bright people, very much in tune with the earth.

863
01:17:53.119 --> 01:17:57.159
<v Speaker 1>So I'm hoping to learn more about Root's work in

864
01:17:57.239 --> 01:18:02.439
<v Speaker 1>the coming months, years, and so on. So there you go.

865
01:18:06.079 --> 01:18:10.039
<v Speaker 1>If you're enjoying Earth Ancients Destiny Earth Ancients Special Edition

866
01:18:10.119 --> 01:18:14.039
<v Speaker 1>in the Archives, please consider becoming a subscriber. For as

867
01:18:14.079 --> 01:18:16.680
<v Speaker 1>little as five dollars a month, you can support the

868
01:18:16.760 --> 01:18:19.560
<v Speaker 1>work we do here on this podcast, and of course, we,

869
01:18:20.079 --> 01:18:23.359
<v Speaker 1>like other businesses, have bills to pay, and your subscription

870
01:18:23.560 --> 01:18:26.640
<v Speaker 1>really makes a difference. To become a subscriber, go to

871
01:18:26.760 --> 01:18:32.960
<v Speaker 1>patreon dot com, forward slash Earth Ancients and subscribe. We

872
01:18:33.079 --> 01:18:35.640
<v Speaker 1>have a number of wonderful guests. We have a library

873
01:18:35.920 --> 01:18:40.399
<v Speaker 1>of digital books from many of our guests. All you

874
01:18:40.439 --> 01:18:42.960
<v Speaker 1>gotta do is download them and they land on your

875
01:18:43.479 --> 01:18:46.239
<v Speaker 1>desktop as a PDF and you can enjoy them in

876
01:18:46.279 --> 01:18:50.199
<v Speaker 1>the comfort of wherever you're in wherever you're city. Again.

877
01:18:50.279 --> 01:18:52.600
<v Speaker 1>To become a subscriber, go to Patreon. That's p A

878
01:18:52.840 --> 01:18:56.520
<v Speaker 1>t r e o N dot com, forward slash Earth

879
01:18:56.560 --> 01:19:01.119
<v Speaker 1>Ancients and subscribe. All right, that's it for this program.

880
01:19:01.199 --> 01:19:04.279
<v Speaker 1>I want to thank my guest today, Raphael Eisman, coming

881
01:19:04.319 --> 01:19:07.600
<v Speaker 1>to us from Ukraine. As always, the team of Galtor,

882
01:19:08.399 --> 01:19:14.920
<v Speaker 1>Mark Foster and Feya, our Pakistani video editor. You guys

883
01:19:15.239 --> 01:19:18.439
<v Speaker 1>rock all right, take care of you well and we

884
01:19:18.560 --> 01:19:19.920
<v Speaker 1>will talk to you next.

885
01:19:19.800 --> 01:20:18.800
<v Speaker 8>Time about eighty d looking about eighteen

886
01:20:20.880 --> 01:20:22.760
<v Speaker 1>Sucking at eighty