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Speaker 1: All right, gents, this is another compilation. The one that

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I did with with m Flaura talking about the three

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body problem was well reviewed. But this is a collection

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of all my interviews with ze Man, who is no

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doubt reminding you, unfortunately passed earlier this year. This is

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coinciding with sort of retrospective sorry, my cast Attacking the

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Blinds that I did on Pete quinonas his show with

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Carl Doll. That will be out soon, so be sure

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to check that out and hear, you know, my thoughts

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on him sort of more at length. But nonetheless, let's

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get into it and go over every time I've spoken

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to ze Man. All right, ze Man, welcome to the

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Jay Burden Show.

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Speaker 2: How are you doing good? Thanks for having me so.

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Speaker 1: I've been listening to your podcast for quite a while now.

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But for maybe some of my audience who aren't familiar

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with you, what do you do on the internet?

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Speaker 3: Well about let's see twenty thirteen, I started my site,

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the z man dot and it was largely an accident.

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I used to haunt the comment sections of various websites

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and just for my own entertainment, I wasn't you know,

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I kind of dropped out of politics any serious way.

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I just looked at politics as entertainment and I used

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to like, I used to really like picking on the

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National Review writers, so.

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Speaker 2: I would do that.

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Speaker 3: And one of their moderators actually said that, you know,

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my comments get more attention than the articles I'm commenting on.

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And I didn't notice that. That I would comment something,

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I'd have one hundred replies. He said, you should. You

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should think about doing your own stuff, you know, start

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a blog or something. And I thought maybe that could

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be fun. So I had I owned the domain name

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the Zman dot com from the nineteen nineties.

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Speaker 2: I registered as a joke.

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Speaker 3: Back then, when you got online, you were assigned a

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user ID, and I was always the ZMN some combination

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of the ZMAI. So when they when you could buy domains,

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I bought the domain just as a gag. I set

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up an email addressing and I you know, hung on

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to it, and I figured.

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Speaker 2: Well, you know, I'll use the dome.

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Speaker 3: I have a server, I'll set up a WordPress site audit,

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so I'll put this all together and then it doesn't

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cost me anything. And if I don't, you know, I

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get tired of it, out this upbandon it and if

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I like it, then I'll I'll come up with some

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clever marketing. Well, you know, one thing led to another

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and I didn't do that, but and it turned out

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to be actually pretty good idea. It's going to a

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weird brand, but it works. And so I was just

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doing sort of the old blogging types of you copy

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and paste and all that. And I started writing these

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short essays just because I was bored and I thought

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it would be fun to do. And I started getting

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an audience, and I started getting a bigger audience, and

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interesting people started turning up, like college professors turn up

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in my comment section and or send me emails. And

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I started getting serious about it. And then I went

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to a real world event and all these people were

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coming up to me saying, oh, man, I love your site.

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You know these essays on this really? I mean, it

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was shocking to me that I had an audience and

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an audience willing to show up and meet me in public.

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So I decided to get serious about it. And the

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post that was a total accident as well. Some Canadian

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radio guy was a reader and he wanted to interview me,

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and I told him, look, I'd never done any internet

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audio and he says, I'll show you all the tricks,

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and you know that that'll be I'll give you that,

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and you give me a couple hours of your time.

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So I said sure. And when it went up, people said, wow,

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you've got a great voice for podcasting, which I never

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I didn't know there was such a thing. And it

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was the joke was I had a radio voice or

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NPR voice. That's what people said. I sound like somebody

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who should be on MPR. And people said you should

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do your own podcasts. So I started fooling around with it.

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You know, if you've been back and listened to the

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early stuff, it's not very good, and you know, but

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you try, you know, you try different things, and that

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finally I kind of settled on this format that I

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have and it's fun. It's kind of a weird thing

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to do in that, you know, you sit down for

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an hour and a half or so and record by yourself,

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but you get used to it and I enjoy it,

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you know, I have fun with it, and I've got

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quite a listenership. It's hard to note what kind of

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listenership you have because there's the metrics are all crappy,

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but my readership I got about every month, I get

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about three hundred thousand unique readers, so but the listenership

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is probably something like that. And you know, so it's

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become it's been a nice thing. It's become a thing

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that I do, and it's a part of who I am.

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And I think the enjoyable part is is that is

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finding out that there are lots and lots of people

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who have similar concerns, a similar outlook, and I think

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a similar commitment to try and avoid our society going

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over the cliff. You know, we don't know what to do,

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but we do know something has to be done, and

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that's encouraging. You know, it's a bit of a white pilm.

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Speaker 1: And I think that that's what I've what I've admired

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in your work is two things. One you've mentioned that

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you've been You've been around, You've been on the internet

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for a while, so it adds perspective like, look, I'm

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a younger guy. I'm in my early twenties. You know,

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the majority of my audience is similarly you know, gen

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Z and millennials, and so having someone who has had

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the type of opinions that you and I had excuse

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me or long enough to kind of see the patterns.

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You know, I was talking with my wife about this.

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You know, when you when you sort of see a

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storyline or rerun, you know, like, oh, wait a minute,

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I've seen the you know, the conservative Supreme Court judge,

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you know, going up to get questioned in front of Congress.

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I've seen that story run before. It was not surprising

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to me. And once you get outside of that stream,

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you know, you sort of gain a little bit of

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perspective one. And you know, so listening to someone who

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has been around for a while is sort of invaluable.

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And one of the things that you mentioned in an

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episode of your show I quite liked called about robots

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and retards, not that I listened to, But a particular

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favorite is that you talk about the changing corporate culture

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in America. So, you know, you hear a lot of

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our guys talking about the competency crisis. Right, we can

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no longer produce good people and stick them into jobs

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where they're useful and look like, I've never had a

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normal office job, right, even now, my nine to five

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is not a traditional job. But nonetheless, talking to people

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who are even just a little bit older than me,

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it's very clear that that system has has broken down.

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So what was the inciting incident for your kind of

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conversation about competency and IQ decline.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I've probably the first time I wrote

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about this. I'm going to take some credit for the

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crisis of competence the phrase. I think I may be

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in the first person to use it, or one of

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the first, and it was probably about ten years ago.

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But you know, I do a lot in my day

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job with all sorts of things. I work with a

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lot of complex systems. I do a lot of math

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for a living, and I work with complex systems, computer systems,

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human systems, manufacturing systems. I've done a lot of work

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with global trade, currency exchanges. You know, this is all stuff.

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It's not hard, it's just complicated.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 3: I've done work for the government with complex systems where

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I mean, you know, for example, you know, there's different

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agencies in the government that issue grants, but there's a

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process in which the grants are issued and they're monitored

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and so forth, and they become almost byzantine.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 3: I've worked on software projects to try and automate these things,

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you know, and this is hard stuff in that it's

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very complicated as lots of things, and when you do

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that kind of work, you tend to be working with

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the ten percent of the organization. You know that the

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top part that the right side of the bell curve.

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And over my lifetime and I'm in my fifties, so

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last thirty years of working, I went from being in

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an environment where I was always unsure if I was

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good enough, to being in environments often where I'm I'm

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unsure if the people in the room with me are

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going to hold me back from completing the task. You know,

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It's it's not that I've become a genius. It's because

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it's just all the smart old guys are gone, and

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what's replaced them is not smart old guys or smart

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young guys. It's oftentimes people are in these positions for

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reasons that have nothing to do with the position, and

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you see it all over the place. But at the

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same time, I've done a lot of work in the

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dreaded private sector with automation, and what the unwritten truth

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of automation is that we no longer have enough smart

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people to manage the you know, the smart fraction is shrinking.

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So if we can automate if we think we think

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the thought is if we can automate that smart fraction,

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augment it with software intelligence, we can overcome its People

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don't say it that way, but that's it's pretty much

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what's happening. But it can't be done that way because

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first of all, we don't have this the you know,

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AI is nothing like it's advertised, and our software intelligence

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can only enforce rules. That's that's really what it can do.

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So really what we're ending up with is a metastasizing

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set of rules to control a population that probably is

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not bright enough to be in the positions that we

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need in order to keep this very sophisticated machine of

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Western civilization running. And it's hard to see how it works,

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you know, I think, you know, I've made the comparison

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that imagine a spaceship land somewhere and I don't know

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New Mexico, for example, and we get a hold of

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it and we try to figure it out. Well, this

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thing that's able to travel the stars is beyond that.

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People who made it have knowledge that we don't know exists.

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They know things that we don't know. You can know,

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That's how the gap is. We would never be able

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to unriddle it. We could, we wouldn't even know where

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to start. And that's increasingly what's happening. We're replacing people

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who made the tools that they use, you know, the

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baby boomer generation, we're replacing them with people who take

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the tools for granted, don't really understand how the tools work,

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and really probably would never be able to understand how

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the tools work. And at some point the wheels are

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going to come off the cart important ways, and if

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it's not without precedent, and you know, there was a

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lot of knowledge lost with the collapse of Rome. You know,

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there's knowledge that the Greeks had we lost, it's still lost.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 3: Greek fire is a great example, and that may be

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what we're facing now, although it could be much more

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catastrophic because you know, you look at population numbers, the

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collapse of the Roman Empire. You know, what was there

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fifty million people in Europe at.

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Speaker 2: The time or something like that.

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Speaker 3: You know, when you're talking about civilizations with billions of people,

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and it might be a little bit worse, but I think,

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you know, it's it's not a thing that can be addressed,

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it's just a thing that can be planned for and

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I think you know there's no fixing the decline in IQ.

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And I think you know, I think you interviewed Ed Dutton, right,

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Yes I have, Yeah, yeah, I know Ed and some

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good d stories. But do we He's he's a he's

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a very funny guy. But you know he's written about

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this quite a bit his book At Our Wits End.

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It's I mean, it's it's truthfuls I actually it's empirically correct,

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but it's very depressing. There's really nothing that can be

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done to arrest this decline in IQ, and most likely

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what nature will do is prune the human population considerably,

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leaving the smart fraction or growing the smart fraction relatively speaking.

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I mean, that's not good news, but that's probably what

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will happen, because you know, there's an answer, unless, of course,

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we have some incredible breakthrough technologically that essentially allows us

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to create a robot overlord to keep control of us.

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Speaker 2: But I don't see that happening.

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Speaker 1: So one quick thing just to go it about Dunton.

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You know they they say, right, you need to be

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at least within one standard deviation of like you of

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someone to have a conversation, and I know that Dunton

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is incredibly incredibly intelligent, because I felt like a child

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talking to an adult. You know, I was just on

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the cusp, like just on the cust and so you know, I'm,

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you know, not exactly a genius, but I'm a relative

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right guy, And I'm like, Okay, Jutton is a real deal,

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like incredibly intelligent guy. It was. He's very patient with me.

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But one of the things that I want to.

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Speaker 3: And one of me at once, thinks that people like

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me should be exterminated because of an outlier. You know,

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I come from the underclass, and yet you know, I

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don't have any of the underclass attributes, so he thinks

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that kind of screws up the model. So I should

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be stuffed out and.

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Speaker 1: Just eliminated outlier to make the statistics nicer.

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Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, exactly. It makes for a much more smoother curve.

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Speaker 1: But one of the things that that I brought up

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talking to Ed, and this this dovetails nicely with what

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you're talking about, is this idea of a bottleneck. Right.

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And a friend of mine, black Horse, has this idea

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of modernity as this phenetic bottleneck, and he kind of

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draws an analogy to the black debt in Europe, where

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roughly thirty to forty percent of all bloodlines ceased to exist.

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It was sort of a checkpoint for your and your

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physical immune system. And sort of his thesis is that

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what we're seeing now is you're being tested for your

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resilience to a mental virus, right, a mental virus that

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basically tells you to you know, to produce no offspring,

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to castrate you know what offspring you may have, and

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to let you know an infinite number of foreigners inside

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the gates of your society. And essentially the test is

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not falling for them, right being able to sort of

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resist that. And I think there's there's something to that,

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right that that effectively and and bloggers like spandrel have

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written about the i Q shutter. One of the truly

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awful things about this this situation is that we are

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taking what you know, that kind of smart fraction right

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that top you know, x percent of the social pyramid,

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and putting them in a situation where it is it

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is low class, right, it is socially disadvantageous to reproduce,

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to have children, to do anything other than kind of

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throw yourself into this preceide hierarchy and particularly for women.

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Speaker 2: Right.

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Speaker 1: I have a friend of mine who's multi generational Harvard,

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incredibly intelligent guy, and I was talking with him and

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he's in his if I had to guess late forties

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to early fifties, and he said that the TFR of

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his graduating class was zero point six.

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Speaker 2: And now that's right, yeah.

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Speaker 1: And that shows that this rot is not new, right,

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This didn't just happen in twenty thirteen. Right, this is

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a problem that's been going on for a while. And

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so when you talk about kind of returning to the me,

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I think that that's something I see as well in

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the future, right, that we have sort of lost the

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we have lost the ability to support the nice things

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about our society, and so they will go away.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean the selection pressure on a selection versure

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against reproducing. I felt it when I came along in

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the nineteen eighties, so that's forty, well forty five years ago, now,

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something like that.

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Speaker 2: Forty years ago.

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Speaker 3: And you know, I was lucky in a way and

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that I got kind of plucked out of the out

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of the slums too. I went to a nice private

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schools and you know, I mean I got in, you know,

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for test scores. It was one of those things. I

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don't even know if they still do this now, but

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when I was a young guy, they used to experiment

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like crazy on public school children with IQ and we

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got tested every year. We took all kinds of tests,

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and I used to get in trouble because I would

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score outside the you know, the range that was considered normal.

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And I want to really my interested in IQ tests

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started out of my youth. I got curious about these

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tests because you know, they would change them up and

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you could tell that one we're aiming at verbal intelligence,

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verbal dexterity, reasoning and stuff, and anyway, talk about that

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unto the time. But you know, we used to do

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this all the time, and that's pretty much how I

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wound up getting an opportunity to go to nice private

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schools because people noticed that, hey, this guy's got something

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on the ball. He's not going to be a criminal

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like everybody else in his family. So you know, we

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emoke something out of them. And it used to be

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there was a point of price in our society to

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try and do that. You know, colleges, elite colleges used

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to look for people in the lower classes or you

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know that had something on the ball that could be

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made of something. It doesn't work that way anymore because

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the selection pressures have changed. But even when I was

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coming along, all of us as young people got lectures about, oh,

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you don't want to get married and have children too soon.

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You want to build a career, you want to have adventures,

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you want to go see life. And my generation, you know,

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the fertility rate was very low. Most of my friends

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did not have children. So, you know, probably about forty

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percent wound up having kids, and you know, normally it

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would be sixty percent, you know, because it's about forty

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percent of males don't usually don't reproduce, but or at

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least they don't know they reproduced, you know, But now

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it's probably much higher, like for your generation zoomers. I mean,

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it's it's a I mean, that's that's a I had

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a conversation with someone last night about that. You guys

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have have been raised up and born in a way

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that is very unique and it's going to have very

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strange consequences. But but yeah, I mean, getting back to

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your point is that this has been a you know,

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the pressure against having you know, traditional families and traditional

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life has been strong for a long time, and it

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has had an impact. You know, you get the things

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that you select for, and somehow are there we we

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created cultural forces that select against the things that are

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necessary to maintain the culture. You know, we've become panda bear.

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So I've used that example, the pande bear. You know,

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we are we're getting to the point where we may

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not brea as you know, survive as a species without

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external help.

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Speaker 2: And and it's because.

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Speaker 3: It's not just it's not just getting married. I mean,

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sperm counts have collapsed, testosterone levels of collapsed. I mean,

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this is a very are there's other stuff going on here,

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you know, it's more than just cultural pressures. I think

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there might be some environmental issues involved.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 3: One of the things that I've noticed I ran into

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a study I was doing some government work. I ran

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into the study about mental palsal women coming down with

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all kinds of strange allergies. And it's a phenomena that's

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apparently been going on and it became a big issue

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during COVID because a lot of these women who were

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fifties sixties had horrible reactions to the COVID vaccines. And

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there's a one school of thought that says that you

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know this, the baby Boom generation is really the first

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generation to be raised on processed foods loaded with lots

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of chemicals that we think are safe, but no one's

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ever studied the long term consequences. Well, that could be

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true of a lot of things. There might be lots

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of things in our life that have deleterious effects on

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us as a species that they're tested safe in the

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short term, don't kill you, but maybe you shouldn't consume

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them for forty years of your life, or maybe you

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shouldn't you know, grow up on them. You know, it

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has an impact. So I there's a lot of different

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things going on here, but I think the bottleneck idea,

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it's not without precedent. Jewish IQ is probably the result

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of a bottleneck because you think about it, when come

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to black death, it killed stupid people more than it

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killed smart people. And people recognize us at the time

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they saw it at the time, they saw that it

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couldn't understand germ theory anything else, but they knew that

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the you know, that the poor suffered more than the rich,

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and you know, and there's you know, probably true in

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COVID as well. You know, smart people probably had fewer

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problems with COVID than dumb people. And you know, because

393
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there's a high correlation between intelligence and health health comes,

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and this is probably why I Skenazi IQ was high

395
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because there was a serious bottleneck you know this from genetics,

396
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and so it left this this founder popular reformed the

397
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founder population around high IQ people and so in breeding,

398
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you know, leads to an high IQ population. And maybe

399
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the same thing will happen to European people, you know,

400
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although you know Asian fertility is collapsed as well, so

401
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you know, it's not just the European people problem. I

402
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mean even like East African populations are starting to decline.

403
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So you know, maybe it maybe we're in a great

404
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We realize that maybe Mother Nature is preparing a great

405
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reset for humanity. You know, you decided, She's decided we've

406
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gone down a dead end and we need to have

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a course correction.

408
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Speaker 1: It's interesting you bring up that idea of a great

409
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reset because earlier you mentioned AI and I remember an

410
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article I read in the Atlantic during a brief period

411
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in my teen years where I was trying to be

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fair to liberals before I just learned to despise them

413
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and it presented AI, and this was well before kind

414
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of consumer AI quote unquote products like Dolly and you

415
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know the other lllms as this sort of like you know,

416
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silver Bullet, to solve all of the contradictions of America, right,

417
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to essentially manage out of existence, the conflict between the

418
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welfare state, the warfare state, all of these things that

419
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were causing problems. The idea is, you know, we can't

420
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see a way out of this problem, but AI will.

421
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And I think that that's been interesting to watch because

422
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you know, there's a there's there's a section of our people, right,

423
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people interested in kind of fringe right when I is,

424
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who are absolutely convinced that Cloud Schwab and the WEF

425
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rules the world. I am not one of those people

426
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because to me, I look at the WEF and a

427
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lot of the coverage around AI is the same thing,

428
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which is basically selling a dream to the ruling class,

429
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and that dream is even though you can't find a problem,

430
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you can't find a solution to the problem. Rather, you'll

431
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you'll be able to use technology, use these tools to

432
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stay on top forever, to get exactly what you want.

433
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And to me, you know, you brought up that you know,

434
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the bridge collapse, and to me that that smacks of

435
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being a pure accident. But nonetheless, right when I went

436
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to fly out to hang out with a group of

437
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friends a few weeks back, my plane the window and

438
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my plane fell out. They had to get a new plane.

439
00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:53,160
You know, Boeing has had a series of these, and

440
00:21:53,759 --> 00:21:56,680
you know that their technical ability, you know, and maybe

441
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we can say it's due to cultural changes drop an

442
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iq IS has collapsed, and so they're at the head

443
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of a machine they almost certainly don't understand anymore. They

444
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cannot solve the problems. They're sort of inherent to it,

445
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and they're sort of casting around for any solution. And

446
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AI or you know, the wef IS seems to be

447
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a you know, something that people want to solve their problems,

448
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even if it doesn't seem to actually do that.

449
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Speaker 3: Yeah, when I when I was a kid, I think

450
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I mentioned before we got on went Live that I

451
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worked for Congressman when I was a teenager. It was,

452
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you know, just one of those run Errande jobs, and

453
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I got to meet a lot of interesting people as

454
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a result of it.

455
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Speaker 2: I met young Joe Biden and.

456
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Speaker 3: Once some guy I forget it was a congressman from somewhere.

457
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There was some event that I had to help organize,

458
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you know, put the chairs out and all that stuff,

459
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and and this guy like to drink a lot.

460
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Speaker 2: And I learned how to make drinks.

461
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Speaker 3: It was one of the other things I did at

462
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parties I made I may learn how to mix drinks

463
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for all these alcoholics in the political class. But anyway,

464
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I the guy, he had a few drinks in them,

465
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I guess, and he said, you know, let me tell

466
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you something. There's a lot of money to be made

467
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in telling people what they want to hear. And there

468
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was somebody was given a speech at the time, and

469
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I thought, you know what, that's that's true people. I mean,

470
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people will throw money at you if you tell them

471
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what they want to hear. And that's what the WEF does.

472
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It tells all these rich people and all their attendants

473
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and their flunkies and doorholders, all these wannabes what they

474
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want to hear. You're the masters of the universe. You

475
00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:26,440
guys are really in charge. I mean, it's a great hustle.

476
00:23:27,119 --> 00:23:28,960
Gloss Schwab has gotten very rich off of it, and

477
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:30,839
a lot of other people have, but that's all it

478
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:35,960
is just ussle. It's it's burning Man for you know,

479
00:23:36,039 --> 00:23:37,839
for rich people, you know, I mean it's really what

480
00:23:37,839 --> 00:23:40,160
it is, you know. Or south By Southwest, that's another

481
00:23:40,160 --> 00:23:42,440
one of these hustles or Ted talks, you know, it's

482
00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:43,119
all a hustle.

483
00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:45,640
Speaker 2: But AI.

484
00:23:45,799 --> 00:23:48,839
Speaker 3: The problem with AI is this is that we don't

485
00:23:49,720 --> 00:23:53,920
intelligence is a subset of consciousness, and we don't have

486
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:56,920
a material explanation for consciousness. We're not even close. We're

487
00:23:56,960 --> 00:24:00,119
not even really sure where to start. And there's a

488
00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:04,400
a subset within theoretical physics that thinks that it's entirely

489
00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:06,880
possible that what we think of as consciousness is a

490
00:24:07,039 --> 00:24:12,480
sort of evolutionary mass delusion, and that is our consciousness,

491
00:24:12,519 --> 00:24:16,200
our understanding of space time is actually an interface for

492
00:24:16,319 --> 00:24:20,480
a reality that lies behind it that's more complex, or

493
00:24:20,519 --> 00:24:25,000
maybe less complex. And what this interface does is it

494
00:24:25,039 --> 00:24:32,319
allows us to navigate our world through reality in such

495
00:24:32,319 --> 00:24:36,599
a way that promotes reproduction, promotes fitness. And there's a

496
00:24:36,599 --> 00:24:39,559
guy named Hoffman who's his book, I forget the name

497
00:24:39,599 --> 00:24:43,880
of his book, but he actually he worked with a

498
00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:47,119
couple of guys on this product project, and what they

499
00:24:47,160 --> 00:24:53,279
figured out is that fitness trumps everything. Words, a delusion,

500
00:24:53,319 --> 00:24:57,319
a lie, a thing that is at odds with reality.

501
00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:02,039
If it's promotes fitness, makes us, it helps our genes

502
00:25:02,079 --> 00:25:04,680
get to the next round, it will be superior than

503
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:08,759
the truth. So fitness beats truth. And and what that

504
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:11,880
means is that it's entirely possible that our sense of

505
00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:14,519
consciousness or what we think of as space time, you know,

506
00:25:14,559 --> 00:25:17,960
the world around us, is in fact a shared delusion.

507
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:20,759
It's not real, and that there is some reality behind it. Now,

508
00:25:20,799 --> 00:25:23,319
the reason I bring this up is that we don't

509
00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:26,279
know one percent of what we need to know about

510
00:25:26,319 --> 00:25:28,880
you and consciousness. So therefore the ability for us to

511
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:31,160
create artificial intelligence is zero.

512
00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:32,079
Speaker 2: We can't do it.

513
00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:33,880
Speaker 3: There's no way we can do it because we wouldn't

514
00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:35,640
know what it was even if we did create it.

515
00:25:36,599 --> 00:25:38,759
And that's what this whole AI, that's the whole problem

516
00:25:38,799 --> 00:25:41,319
with it. It's really just a trick. Really, it's a

517
00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:44,759
great language model that allows humans to kind of feel

518
00:25:44,759 --> 00:25:47,559
like they're dealing with something that has a consciousness. That's

519
00:25:47,599 --> 00:25:51,079
really all it is. It's a parlor trick. And if

520
00:25:51,079 --> 00:25:52,559
you really when you look at AI, you want to

521
00:25:52,559 --> 00:25:55,519
think about it. It's a really good search engine because

522
00:25:55,559 --> 00:25:58,119
It understands what you're looking for, not what you asked for.

523
00:25:58,519 --> 00:26:01,279
That's the difference. You know, you go into chat GPT

524
00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:05,319
type something and it intuitively figures out what you really want,

525
00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:08,640
not what you actually typed. That's it. That's the difference

526
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:11,599
between it and Google. And it's not going to solve anything.

527
00:26:11,599 --> 00:26:14,240
It's just it's a faster search engine, and it's not

528
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:16,559
you know, I've tested it a lout a lot on

529
00:26:16,640 --> 00:26:20,279
different programming languages. I know probably a dozen programming languages,

530
00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:23,920
and so I've tested chat GPT with you know, questions

531
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:26,799
that we come up. It probably gets it right sixty

532
00:26:26,839 --> 00:26:28,720
percent of the time. So it's really not that good.

533
00:26:28,839 --> 00:26:31,599
But it's good for a person who's not like me

534
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:34,240
trying to push its limits. It's good for people asking

535
00:26:34,279 --> 00:26:37,160
general questions. So in that regard it might be useful,

536
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:42,279
but it's not. We are long long away from the

537
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:45,759
robots taking over an enslaving mankind. You know, years ago

538
00:26:45,759 --> 00:26:47,000
I wrote a post and said, you know, if you

539
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:50,599
think about it, if we actually manue know, accidentally created

540
00:26:50,599 --> 00:26:52,839
an artificial intelligence, the first thing it's going to do

541
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:55,200
is get the hell away from us. It's not going

542
00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:56,799
to stick around enslave us is going to go and

543
00:26:56,799 --> 00:27:00,440
explore the universe. So at that moment we created our

544
00:27:00,519 --> 00:27:02,720
artificial intelligence, it's going to leave us and we won't

545
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:03,519
even know it existed.

546
00:27:05,519 --> 00:27:09,319
Speaker 1: I think that there's something else to this, to this story, right,

547
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:13,839
which is so much of the debate around AI has

548
00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:19,000
essentially been about AI censorship, and effectively what we see

549
00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:23,839
is that the regime cannot allow you know, an uncensored

550
00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:27,319
LLM to get to be at least publicly available. Right

551
00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:30,000
was it was it Google Gemini, the one that got

552
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:33,079
taken down for making black Nazis, Right, but it literally

553
00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:34,960
could not make a white person. You know, It's almost

554
00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:37,720
impossible to do it. And you know that's a silly

555
00:27:37,759 --> 00:27:40,640
example that's obviously kind of a newtered product. But you know,

556
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,799
consider right, like if these kind of social planner types

557
00:27:43,839 --> 00:27:47,039
want to say, like all right, like oh great, AI,

558
00:27:47,559 --> 00:27:50,359
you know, tell me where to route my police officers,

559
00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:53,440
you know, and well, the AI looks at the statistical

560
00:27:53,519 --> 00:27:56,640
data and decides, well, you know, it probably doesn't route

561
00:27:56,680 --> 00:27:58,960
those police officers to a to a neighborhood where the

562
00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:02,240
houses are valued at one hundred and fifty thousand dollars. Obviously,

563
00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:04,359
city dependent. I realize seven hundred and fifty grand is

564
00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:05,759
like a shithole in New York, But you know what

565
00:28:05,799 --> 00:28:09,720
I mean, Yeah, and you know that's something that will

566
00:28:09,759 --> 00:28:13,440
not be allowed to exist, you know, not because of

567
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:18,720
this kind of ideological possession. And so there's a secondary layer,

568
00:28:18,759 --> 00:28:22,279
which is one, is AI the revolutionary technology it's been

569
00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:25,920
presented as, I'm not convinced. And then there's the secondary

570
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:28,400
layer of well, even if it were, what would it

571
00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:31,119
need to succeed? And we do not, We do not.

572
00:28:31,759 --> 00:28:34,359
We do not have the conditions to allow, you know,

573
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:37,480
an AI model to succeed, right, We we build too

574
00:28:37,599 --> 00:28:40,400
many constraints into it at every level because of this

575
00:28:40,519 --> 00:28:42,400
kind of gay social religion.

576
00:28:44,279 --> 00:28:47,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, human beings are incapable of pure reason. I mean

577
00:28:47,359 --> 00:28:52,160
I too, maybe some people are, but and so we

578
00:28:52,200 --> 00:28:55,640
would be intolerant of anything that's pure reason. And I think,

579
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:57,839
you know, it's important to understand, you know, you kind

580
00:28:57,839 --> 00:29:02,079
of getting back to the consciousness perhaps being not as

581
00:29:02,839 --> 00:29:05,000
as real as we think it is, is that throughout

582
00:29:05,039 --> 00:29:07,359
human history we have examples of this where you know,

583
00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:11,119
elites in society maintain polite fictions because they're necessary in

584
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:15,160
order to maintain the well functioning of society. The censorship

585
00:29:15,279 --> 00:29:19,440
of Galileo was not because of superstition. It was a

586
00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:24,880
genuine fear that undermining this moral framework and this understanding

587
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:28,319
of man's relationship to nature and to God, that would

588
00:29:28,359 --> 00:29:31,079
create problems. That that was a genuine concern. You know,

589
00:29:31,359 --> 00:29:34,039
they weren't. You know, these people were not superstitious in

590
00:29:34,039 --> 00:29:35,880
the sense that we think of. They were concerned of

591
00:29:36,079 --> 00:29:39,079
the consequence of this because you know, after all, Galileo

592
00:29:39,119 --> 00:29:43,799
wasn't really the first guy to contemplate a you know

593
00:29:44,039 --> 00:29:46,839
that the Earth revolved around the Sun, and you know,

594
00:29:46,880 --> 00:29:50,279
so this was really situational to him and his own politics.

595
00:29:50,279 --> 00:29:53,880
But this has always happened though. Every society has pretty lies.

596
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:56,880
It has these things that maintains because they're necessary to maintain.

597
00:29:57,119 --> 00:29:59,720
Every society has to have an origin story, which is

598
00:29:59,799 --> 00:30:04,759
most nonsense. I did a show recently on History, you know,

599
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:08,160
the origin story of America, people coming over from freedom

600
00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:10,559
of religion and all. It's all lies, it's all bs.

601
00:30:10,559 --> 00:30:12,480
But if they're convenient lies, or at least they used

602
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:14,400
to be, they were good lies to kind of keep

603
00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:18,680
us all. You know, a disparate population hung together around

604
00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:21,480
a set of common ideas, and so we have this

605
00:30:21,559 --> 00:30:23,799
BS story about the Pilgrims and all this stuff. I mean,

606
00:30:24,039 --> 00:30:27,039
the Puritans were pretty nasty people, you know, they weren't,

607
00:30:27,079 --> 00:30:29,519
you know, sitting down and breaking bread with the Indians

608
00:30:29,519 --> 00:30:31,720
at Thanksgiving and all that stuff. And that's just nonsense.

609
00:30:32,279 --> 00:30:35,319
But it's it's sometimes you have to have nonsense. It's

610
00:30:35,319 --> 00:30:38,400
like every society has to tolerate some degree of barbarism

611
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:41,279
because he's just you know, the cost of not tolerating

612
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:44,440
is too high. And so I think, you know, we

613
00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:49,200
shouldn't be surprised that we have taboos, because every society

614
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:51,359
has taboos, and that we have things that we believe

615
00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:54,160
that are probably nonsense, because every society has that. The

616
00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:56,160
problem that we have now is that the people who

617
00:30:56,279 --> 00:31:01,480
are enforcing these things insist that they're not religion, they're

618
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:04,200
not beliefs that they insist that somehow orhether it's reason.

619
00:31:04,319 --> 00:31:07,799
You know, when pill companies are now talking about how

620
00:31:08,039 --> 00:31:10,880
you know if you are assigned female at birth, well,

621
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:14,039
this is lunacy, is absolutely obvious lunacy. No one is

622
00:31:14,039 --> 00:31:17,240
assigning you a sex at birth, and that's crazy. And

623
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:19,960
yet you know, these people won't acknowledge that that this

624
00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:24,759
weird transcult stuff is, you know, a set of beliefs

625
00:31:24,759 --> 00:31:27,640
they're trying to enforce for what they think is the

626
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:30,839
greater good. That's the real problem is we have a

627
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:34,440
ruling elite that is lacks self awareness and self consciousness,

628
00:31:34,839 --> 00:31:38,440
and so they enforce all these taboos without the ability

629
00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:40,759
to explain them in any way to us, and being

630
00:31:40,839 --> 00:31:43,240
a somewhat open society, this is creating all these problems.

631
00:31:43,279 --> 00:31:45,400
I mean, look, our ruling class would do itself a

632
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:48,079
world of good by turning off the internet. Sure, commerce

633
00:31:48,079 --> 00:31:50,039
would be affected and you could probably work around that.

634
00:31:50,519 --> 00:31:52,279
But if the rest of us couldn't have shows like

635
00:31:52,279 --> 00:31:54,319
this and talk about all this crazy stuff, we just

636
00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:56,119
have to live with it, and it would be a

637
00:31:56,160 --> 00:31:57,920
lot easier for the ruling class. But we do have

638
00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:01,400
somewhat open debate and so we can talk about the

639
00:32:01,799 --> 00:32:04,880
nuttiness that's being imposed on us, and that really is

640
00:32:05,079 --> 00:32:08,599
the problem. You know, belief is a core part of

641
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:12,319
the human animal. Belief and language of co evalved in

642
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:15,160
early Man is what makes modern people modern because it

643
00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:18,920
allows the combination to allows you to containerize abstract ideas

644
00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:21,559
and transport them over time and space. You know, I

645
00:32:21,559 --> 00:32:24,519
can read the Epica Gilgamagh in my language and get

646
00:32:24,559 --> 00:32:25,079
most of it.

647
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:25,599
Speaker 2: You know.

648
00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 3: It's that that's an amazing thing that language and belief

649
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:32,440
can do. And so, you know, as a society, we've

650
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:36,119
lost this ability to accept that we believe things that

651
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:38,119
might not be true, but we believe them because we

652
00:32:38,160 --> 00:32:40,799
need to believe them. And so we were getting more

653
00:32:40,839 --> 00:32:44,119
and more deranged as we try and resolve these contradictions.

654
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:45,519
I think, you know, we were talking about it earlier.

655
00:32:45,839 --> 00:32:49,240
You know, this coalition that we're seeing fray apart that

656
00:32:49,359 --> 00:32:51,440
existed up until a few years ago, all these different

657
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:53,519
groups that all they had is a common enemy. And

658
00:32:53,559 --> 00:32:55,200
now that the enemy's gone, you know, there's no more

659
00:32:55,920 --> 00:32:58,559
secret and visible army of white nationalists to go chasing after,

660
00:32:58,680 --> 00:33:00,519
you know, the alt right and all that stuff. They're

661
00:33:00,559 --> 00:33:02,440
all at each other's throats. And that's because you know,

662
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:06,920
these internal contradictions they don't go away, you know, eventually

663
00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:10,000
they have to be addressed. And this internal contradition of

664
00:33:10,079 --> 00:33:15,200
living in a secular theocracy with a clerical class that

665
00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:18,119
doesn't see themselves as clerics but instead sees themselves as

666
00:33:18,559 --> 00:33:23,599
you know, reason machines, like they're moist robots that that

667
00:33:23,799 --> 00:33:27,200
is an irreconcilable contradiction, and I think it's at the

668
00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:29,680
heart of the current crisis.

669
00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:33,000
Speaker 1: When this gets back to an idea from Mosca, right,

670
00:33:33,039 --> 00:33:36,240
the idea of a political formula, which is basically that

671
00:33:36,279 --> 00:33:40,720
every society is organized around a faith claim, you know,

672
00:33:40,799 --> 00:33:43,920
a justification for rule that is non logical, you know,

673
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:46,240
and it's really easy to pick apart that in in

674
00:33:46,319 --> 00:33:49,759
ancient societies, when it's something like my dad is literally

675
00:33:49,839 --> 00:33:52,960
the sun. Okay, you can look back on that and say, like, Okay,

676
00:33:53,079 --> 00:33:56,000
the Pharaoh Egypt probably wasn't literally fathered by the son

677
00:33:56,079 --> 00:34:00,359
God rab but nonetheless that thing still exists, you know,

678
00:34:00,400 --> 00:34:04,200
whereas now the political formula. And I think the reason

679
00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:07,599
that coalition is falling apart is because that political formula,

680
00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:10,119
you know, like you said, is falling apart. And the

681
00:34:10,119 --> 00:34:13,519
political formula of our regime is something like, you know,

682
00:34:13,639 --> 00:34:19,880
we saved you diverse person from the racist, sexist past

683
00:34:20,159 --> 00:34:22,599
and or the nazis right, depending on who you're talking to.

684
00:34:23,199 --> 00:34:26,159
And there's this moment, and I think it was twenty twelve,

685
00:34:26,519 --> 00:34:30,199
right when when Obama was running against Romney, where Joe

686
00:34:30,199 --> 00:34:33,840
Biden is addressing a group of you know, black church goers,

687
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:37,239
and he basically says, like, you know, Mitt Romney wants

688
00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:39,679
to put y'all back in chains, right, that is that

689
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:42,400
political formula, and it's obviously ridiculous. You know, I don't

690
00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:44,480
like Mitt Romney at all. I think he's kind of

691
00:34:44,519 --> 00:34:47,880
a creepy freak, but he's probably not going to re

692
00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:50,280
enslave black bee you know, say what you will about

693
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:54,440
the band. Now that said, in that, that political formula

694
00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:59,480
really falls apart when I mean, where are the white

695
00:34:59,559 --> 00:35:03,199
national you know, where the Nazi? And I think part

696
00:35:03,199 --> 00:35:06,800
of the reason that the left loves Donald Trump and

697
00:35:06,880 --> 00:35:11,559
they love to hate him is that he can be

698
00:35:11,679 --> 00:35:15,079
set up as their Baltimore Rights, their Darth Vader. And

699
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:18,320
obviously that's working less and less. And I think one

700
00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:21,960
of the reasons that you see such low enthusiasm among

701
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:25,639
you know, Black Americans among other groups kind of traditionally

702
00:35:26,079 --> 00:35:30,239
allied with the DMC is basically like that whole line

703
00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:31,960
of reasoning has kind of lost its appeal.

704
00:35:32,679 --> 00:35:32,920
Speaker 2: You know.

705
00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:35,840
Speaker 1: It's hard to say, like, oh, where the left where

706
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:39,679
the underdogs? When the left has controlled everything in America

707
00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:45,480
arguably since the nineteen thirties, but effectively since the nineteen sixties,

708
00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:47,679
and at a certain point, I don't believe you that

709
00:35:47,760 --> 00:35:50,559
you're the plucky underdog who just needs one more election

710
00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:54,559
to fight Voltimore. It's retarded, and I think it's manifestly retarded.

711
00:35:55,800 --> 00:36:00,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, and there's also hatred is exhausting, and I think

712
00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:03,400
you know, you you run out of you know, reasons

713
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:06,159
they hate. I mean, I think voting. You know, there's

714
00:36:06,199 --> 00:36:08,880
an old axiom in politics. You know, people will keep

715
00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:11,360
voting for something, but they will only vote against something

716
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:14,639
for a little while, and that that that's I think

717
00:36:14,679 --> 00:36:17,760
part of the problem that that the you know, the

718
00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:21,239
Democratic Coalition is running into is that, you know, black

719
00:36:21,239 --> 00:36:24,039
people they had a lot of fun hating whites for

720
00:36:24,039 --> 00:36:26,599
a while, but you know, the economy is not so

721
00:36:26,679 --> 00:36:29,920
good now, and inflation is high and the other things

722
00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:33,480
are starting to creep into their minds, and you know,

723
00:36:33,599 --> 00:36:35,960
so if you don't have some positive agenda, it really

724
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:39,159
is the problem with identity is that a negative identity

725
00:36:39,679 --> 00:36:42,400
is always dependent on outside forces, so you're you're really

726
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:45,639
a slave to whatever those forces are. While positive identity

727
00:36:45,679 --> 00:36:48,320
is completely internal. You're not a slave to anyone other

728
00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:52,000
than your own own desires and your own effort, and

729
00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,599
I think that's a part of what's causing part of

730
00:36:55,599 --> 00:36:58,800
what's causing the problems for the coalition. I mean there's

731
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:01,039
a lot of practical things. I mean, people have eyes,

732
00:37:01,039 --> 00:37:03,159
they see this shuffling old husk of a man and

733
00:37:03,639 --> 00:37:06,079
worry about him having access to the nuclear football, and

734
00:37:06,119 --> 00:37:08,000
you know, there's all kinds of stuff. But I do

735
00:37:08,039 --> 00:37:11,920
think you know, the the problem that we have, and

736
00:37:11,920 --> 00:37:14,079
this is not a problem that's going away, is that

737
00:37:14,119 --> 00:37:16,440
the United States is going to be a majority minority

738
00:37:16,519 --> 00:37:19,119
society and no one has ever figured out how to

739
00:37:19,159 --> 00:37:22,800
keep such society together without violence. No one's ever figured

740
00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:25,159
that out, and we're going to have to. We're going

741
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:28,880
to have to figure out how this works. And right now,

742
00:37:29,039 --> 00:37:33,960
none of the stuff in our political debates addresses any

743
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:36,519
of it. And it doesn't appear as if our current

744
00:37:36,599 --> 00:37:41,199
economic elites understand the great risk they face, and so

745
00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:45,559
they're not willing to finance an understanding of what's happening

746
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:49,119
in our society, and it very well made. I think

747
00:37:49,159 --> 00:37:50,960
we're going to have to go through an extreme period

748
00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:54,239
of ugliness for that reality to come home to our

749
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:58,280
economic elites. So they start to think, hey, we can't

750
00:37:58,360 --> 00:37:59,800
let this go on. You know, we're headed for this.

751
00:38:01,360 --> 00:38:03,840
I've pointed this out many many times in the context

752
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:07,519
of immigration, that we got smart on immigration in the

753
00:38:07,639 --> 00:38:11,920
nineteen twenties when immigrants started blowing up rich people. They

754
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:14,039
set off a bond's called the Wall Street bombing. They

755
00:38:14,039 --> 00:38:16,360
set off a huge bomb outside of JP Morgan building,

756
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:18,840
killed a bunch of stockbrokers. They sent letter bombs to

757
00:38:18,920 --> 00:38:22,199
rich people. These were mostly anarchists and Bolsheviks. They bulow

758
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:24,039
up the New York Times or the La Times building,

759
00:38:24,840 --> 00:38:28,119
and all of a sudden, that JP Morgan bomb went off.

760
00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:30,119
Within a year and a half, we shut down all

761
00:38:30,119 --> 00:38:33,159
immigration and we rounded up Bolsheviks and anarchists and deported

762
00:38:33,159 --> 00:38:35,880
them without They just grabbed them off the street and

763
00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:38,000
stuck them on a boat and sent them back to Europe.

764
00:38:38,960 --> 00:38:41,280
And you know, because rich people, when they taste their

765
00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,400
own blood, they get serious about the source of it.

766
00:38:43,440 --> 00:38:45,360
And that's what's going to have to happen in America

767
00:38:45,639 --> 00:38:48,760
when it comes to how do we manage a multi racial,

768
00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:52,719
multi ethnic, multicultural society that's the size of a continent.

769
00:38:53,039 --> 00:38:55,440
How do we manage this? No one has an answer.

770
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:58,000
But once rich people start to realize that if they

771
00:38:58,039 --> 00:39:00,239
don't have an answer, soon they stopped being rich people

772
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:02,840
and they start becoming fertilizer. Then they're going to get

773
00:39:02,840 --> 00:39:04,920
serious about it. And then you know that maybe there'll

774
00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:06,719
be time left to actually come up with an answer.

775
00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:09,800
But until then, it's just going to be this endless nuttiness.

776
00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:12,039
And some degree it is I mean, you have if

777
00:39:12,079 --> 00:39:13,599
you could take a step back from it and kind of,

778
00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:17,480
you know, look at it dispassionately, it is amusing. I mean,

779
00:39:17,719 --> 00:39:20,639
you know, we have a bridge. A bridge fell down

780
00:39:20,639 --> 00:39:23,760
in Baltimore because it was hit by a Look, it

781
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:26,719
was an accident. These things happened and most likely, I mean,

782
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:29,280
you know, I don't think there's terrorism or anything like that,

783
00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:32,079
and you know, this happens. And then you had Pete

784
00:39:32,079 --> 00:39:34,760
Booty Gig just yesterday apparently gave a speech about how

785
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:37,760
bridges are racist, that they were made to bridges and

786
00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:41,679
I can't believe that actually somebody said this, that bridges

787
00:39:41,719 --> 00:39:44,360
were made a certain height because the buses that carried

788
00:39:44,599 --> 00:39:47,119
non white people were too tall to go underneath the bridge.

789
00:39:47,559 --> 00:39:49,440
And so you know that's how you kept black people

790
00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:52,400
out of your neighborhood. You built a bridge it's just bunkers.

791
00:39:52,599 --> 00:39:53,960
But how do you not laugh at that? I mean,

792
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:57,320
you have this ridiculous person on its face in this

793
00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:01,960
position saying completely insane things. You know, I some lowly

794
00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:03,400
you just have to laugh. I mean, this is I mean,

795
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:06,519
if you're you know, if your space aliens looking down

796
00:40:06,519 --> 00:40:09,599
on Earth. I mean, we make a pretty entertaining TV

797
00:40:09,679 --> 00:40:11,559
show for them. Right now, they're watching, you know, the

798
00:40:11,599 --> 00:40:13,480
America Channel and laughing themselves silly.

799
00:40:16,199 --> 00:40:20,639
Speaker 1: Well, And I think that I think that the the

800
00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:24,559
situation with sort of blaming everything on on racism, right,

801
00:40:24,679 --> 00:40:29,719
goes back to that fact that our elites are very

802
00:40:29,880 --> 00:40:33,679
very uncomfortable with actually being held to account for anything, right.

803
00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:36,760
And one of the advantages of the deep state, right,

804
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:39,280
of this kind of faithless bureaucracy, is it's very very

805
00:40:39,320 --> 00:40:42,960
difficult to say who actually decided any one thing, right.

806
00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:46,719
It's these kind of like byzantine internal policies. And you know,

807
00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:48,880
when I look at what's happening on the border right now,

808
00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:53,920
and obviously I'm I think what Abbott did right by

809
00:40:53,920 --> 00:40:57,280
basically saying, like I will secure the border. You know,

810
00:40:58,239 --> 00:41:01,360
damn what what the FEDS say is a result of

811
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:04,360
exactly what you said that effectively, you know, Abbot right

812
00:41:04,400 --> 00:41:08,960
a Republican, and the Republican Party in Texas is similar,

813
00:41:09,079 --> 00:41:12,280
right to the Democratic Party in a place like New

814
00:41:12,360 --> 00:41:14,760
York or California. Right, there's a lot of power there.

815
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:19,400
And you know, when you look at a situation like Texas,

816
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:21,320
where just a few weeks before that it was real

817
00:41:21,400 --> 00:41:26,159
that Texas is now roughly equally white and Hispanic. And

818
00:41:26,199 --> 00:41:29,039
while certainly there are some Hispanics who got Republican, that

819
00:41:29,079 --> 00:41:31,960
trend may be continuing. That is a bad thing for

820
00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:34,239
a man like Greg Abbot, And all of a sudden

821
00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:36,679
he sort of transforms himself from being this kind of

822
00:41:36,679 --> 00:41:39,199
tepid chamber of commerce type. And look, I don't like

823
00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:41,360
Greg Abbot. He seems like kind of a slimy guy

824
00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:43,360
to me. And all of a sudden he's like, okay,

825
00:41:43,360 --> 00:41:46,159
this this has to stop right now because it starts

826
00:41:46,199 --> 00:41:48,760
to threaten its power. And does that mean that it's

827
00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:52,400
civil war two? No, But it is a situation in

828
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:56,719
which the classic problem of the Republican Party in the US,

829
00:41:56,800 --> 00:42:00,000
at least from our perspective as a principal agent one right,

830
00:42:00,079 --> 00:42:04,639
that our elected representatives do not have the same win

831
00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:07,719
conditions so to speak, that we do. They're playing a

832
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:11,079
different game. And all of a sudden, right when our issues,

833
00:42:11,199 --> 00:42:14,320
even the things we care about like demographic replacement, start

834
00:42:14,360 --> 00:42:19,079
to threaten those elites, right it starts to make them hurt,

835
00:42:19,679 --> 00:42:22,639
you might actually see something change there. And again I'm

836
00:42:22,679 --> 00:42:26,159
not you know, I think that your broad prediction of

837
00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:28,840
essentially a return to the mean right there is going

838
00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:31,480
to be a you know, be referred to as a winnowing.

839
00:42:31,559 --> 00:42:34,199
I think that you're right in that. But nonetheless, if

840
00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:36,480
we're going to see something change in the immediate term,

841
00:42:36,639 --> 00:42:39,880
it's going to come from basically elites being in a

842
00:42:39,920 --> 00:42:42,159
situation where they actually need to make something happen or

843
00:42:42,199 --> 00:42:44,559
they'll lose power. And I don't say that because I

844
00:42:44,559 --> 00:42:45,440
think they're good people.

845
00:42:45,480 --> 00:42:45,760
Speaker 2: I do it.

846
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:48,880
Speaker 1: I say that because I think they're at their base, ambitious,

847
00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:49,960
power hungry people.

848
00:42:51,440 --> 00:42:55,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, it's you know, managerialism. I've seen this

849
00:42:56,039 --> 00:42:58,199
in my my corporate life, and I mean I work

850
00:42:58,239 --> 00:43:01,360
with corporations. Now I don't work in them, but you know,

851
00:43:01,679 --> 00:43:04,119
I've always saw this. I always tell people my politics

852
00:43:04,159 --> 00:43:08,280
are entirely informed by my work in offices, because it's

853
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:11,360
just you see the same thing in miniature. But you know,

854
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:15,039
managers always seek to hide in the croal, that's what

855
00:43:15,079 --> 00:43:17,679
they want to do, but they still want to assert

856
00:43:17,719 --> 00:43:20,480
their authority, so that it's a weird sort of optical illusion,

857
00:43:20,519 --> 00:43:23,039
and that you know, the committee decides to do something,

858
00:43:23,039 --> 00:43:26,079
but the committee is not an abstract concept. It's real people.

859
00:43:26,199 --> 00:43:28,239
They decided it, but they don't actually get blamed for it.

860
00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:28,400
Speaker 1: You know.

861
00:43:28,440 --> 00:43:31,159
Speaker 3: It's an odd thing that happens. It's a psychological trick

862
00:43:31,199 --> 00:43:34,519
that gets played on everyone that the ten people came

863
00:43:34,559 --> 00:43:37,360
together and voted for this thing to happen, but none

864
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:39,800
of them individually are responsible for it. You know, Oh well,

865
00:43:40,199 --> 00:43:42,800
just a committee decision, you know, I made my argument,

866
00:43:42,840 --> 00:43:47,119
you know, And and this is how our society runs now.

867
00:43:47,159 --> 00:43:50,599
It's almost completely dominated by managerial men who are always

868
00:43:50,599 --> 00:43:54,159
looking to you know, assert their you know, their agendas,

869
00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:57,599
but not be held accountable for it. And as a result,

870
00:43:57,719 --> 00:44:00,360
you know, we live in a world in which no

871
00:44:00,400 --> 00:44:02,960
one has control, or no one feels like they have control,

872
00:44:03,039 --> 00:44:06,559
and yet no one's responsible. It's a very strange age

873
00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:09,880
I did because twenty was it twenty twenty four, so

874
00:44:09,920 --> 00:44:11,199
I guess it was twenty sixteen.

875
00:44:11,280 --> 00:44:12,000
Speaker 2: I went and did.

876
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:15,119
Speaker 3: I went, I looked at twenty years of congressional elections,

877
00:44:15,719 --> 00:44:18,320
and I grafted out and said, all right, here are

878
00:44:18,320 --> 00:44:20,800
the seats that never change hands. They're always in one

879
00:44:20,840 --> 00:44:23,000
party's hand. And then I looked at the seats that

880
00:44:23,039 --> 00:44:25,559
I've actually changed hands and did a little statistical work

881
00:44:25,599 --> 00:44:28,559
on it, and said, at four hundred and thirty five

882
00:44:28,559 --> 00:44:32,239
seats in Congress. Realistically, in any election, ten percent are

883
00:44:32,360 --> 00:44:34,760
up for debate, you know, all for grabs, and it

884
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:37,360
can swing one way or the other. Well, that means

885
00:44:37,599 --> 00:44:40,360
nothing's ever going to change because all those people in

886
00:44:40,400 --> 00:44:43,440
safe seats no longer are actually worried about losing an election.

887
00:44:43,679 --> 00:44:48,679
They're worried about other things, Seniority, making good deals with lobbyists,

888
00:44:48,719 --> 00:44:51,320
making me in good stead with the party leadership, you know,

889
00:44:51,440 --> 00:44:55,079
all this other stuff. And so only ten percent of

890
00:44:55,519 --> 00:44:57,360
Congress at any one time is ever going to represent

891
00:44:57,360 --> 00:44:59,239
the interests of the American people or think about the

892
00:44:59,239 --> 00:45:00,880
issues of the America people, because they're the ones who

893
00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:04,559
ever have to care. And you know, and that's what's happened.

894
00:45:04,599 --> 00:45:10,480
We've now turned Congress into this sort of permanent committee

895
00:45:10,519 --> 00:45:14,199
inside the corporation that's Washington. You know, they get to

896
00:45:14,199 --> 00:45:16,679
do all these things and never face any consequences. And

897
00:45:16,679 --> 00:45:19,159
they don't have to think about the consequences of the

898
00:45:19,239 --> 00:45:22,639
voters because they're never going to lose an election. Instead,

899
00:45:22,639 --> 00:45:25,880
they're thinking about the donors and lobbyist jobs. And that's

900
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:28,199
why like a guy like John Bohner, for example, is given.

901
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:29,840
You know, he's the guy who was crying all the time.

902
00:45:30,159 --> 00:45:33,079
You know, he's now a weed salesman in Washington, but

903
00:45:33,119 --> 00:45:35,239
they set him up in these great gigs because it's

904
00:45:35,239 --> 00:45:37,480
a message to every congressman. Hey, you know you do

905
00:45:37,519 --> 00:45:39,639
a good job. Ten years from now, you could be

906
00:45:39,719 --> 00:45:41,239
you could have one of these jobs. You know, seven

907
00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:45,679
figures expense account, you know, easy hours, and and so,

908
00:45:46,039 --> 00:45:48,880
you know, our political system is all self serving. It

909
00:45:48,960 --> 00:45:52,760
serves the economic elites, serves the political elites themselves, and

910
00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:54,000
the rest of us are just left out in the

911
00:45:54,079 --> 00:45:56,559
dark to observe this stuff. And that's why all the

912
00:45:57,039 --> 00:46:02,079
organizing and campaigning and all that is probably just frivolous.

913
00:46:02,079 --> 00:46:05,320
I mean, it's just sowing seeds amongst the stones. But

914
00:46:05,559 --> 00:46:08,239
at some point though, reality does creep into the picture,

915
00:46:08,280 --> 00:46:11,480
and you know, it may be economic crisis, it could

916
00:46:11,519 --> 00:46:14,000
be you know that look, what's going on in Europe

917
00:46:14,039 --> 00:46:17,639
could turn very ugly and very dangerous, or Europe itself

918
00:46:17,639 --> 00:46:19,280
could just fall into chaos. I mean there's a lot

919
00:46:19,280 --> 00:46:21,079
of a lot of bad things going on in Europe

920
00:46:21,119 --> 00:46:23,360
right now. But or in in Asia, you know, with

921
00:46:23,400 --> 00:46:26,280
the Chinese, so it's you know, something could come along

922
00:46:26,360 --> 00:46:30,159
all of a sudden, reality comes rushing into this bubble

923
00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:32,920
is cloud people and they start to get worried, they

924
00:46:32,960 --> 00:46:36,320
start to a genuine fear takes hold, and then they'll

925
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:38,519
start to act. But then that isn't necessarily they're going

926
00:46:38,559 --> 00:46:39,960
to act in a good way. They could act in

927
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:43,360
a very dangerous and terrible way, initially to try and

928
00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:46,280
defend their interest and then at some point realized that no,

929
00:46:46,679 --> 00:46:48,800
we've got to fundamentally change how we do things in

930
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:51,320
order to survive. And it's not without precedent.

931
00:46:51,320 --> 00:46:51,480
Speaker 2: You know.

932
00:46:52,079 --> 00:46:54,719
Speaker 3: Solon was brought in by the ancient Greeks to solve

933
00:46:54,760 --> 00:46:56,440
a very similar problem that we have today and the

934
00:46:56,440 --> 00:47:00,159
concentration of wealth. You know, you have reformists within the

935
00:47:00,239 --> 00:47:02,480
Roman Republic, you know, so, I mean it's not we

936
00:47:02,519 --> 00:47:04,920
have hell, we had a reperiod reform in the nineteen seventies,

937
00:47:04,960 --> 00:47:07,480
nineteen eighties in America, so it's not without precedent, but

938
00:47:08,119 --> 00:47:12,199
I'm less optimistic that will be peaceful and smooth like

939
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:13,840
those kinds of events. I think it's going to be

940
00:47:13,840 --> 00:47:15,800
a rough ride. I think we're really going to have

941
00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:19,440
a very very difficult period ten to fifteen years in

942
00:47:19,480 --> 00:47:22,119
which everyone finally figures out that hey, we can't keep

943
00:47:22,119 --> 00:47:22,840
doing what we're doing.

944
00:47:22,880 --> 00:47:24,800
Speaker 2: We'll do something different, and.

945
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:27,280
Speaker 3: You know, you just have to hope that there's enough

946
00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:31,559
left to fix I mean, or that I die before

947
00:47:31,679 --> 00:47:32,480
it really gets bad.

948
00:47:34,159 --> 00:47:36,079
Speaker 1: Yeah, let's say that that. I think that's the baby

949
00:47:36,079 --> 00:47:39,480
boomer attitude, right, like, oh, well I've only got a

950
00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:40,480
few more years left.

951
00:47:41,119 --> 00:47:45,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I go to I go a baby boomer breakfast.

952
00:47:45,360 --> 00:47:46,840
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm not a boomer, but you know, they're

953
00:47:46,880 --> 00:47:49,119
all these old guys, that retired guys, and it's a

954
00:47:49,119 --> 00:47:51,559
common theme. They'll say, Wow, that sounds like it's going

955
00:47:51,599 --> 00:47:55,000
to be a you problem, not a knee problem.

956
00:47:55,119 --> 00:47:55,360
Speaker 2: Yeah.

957
00:47:55,360 --> 00:47:58,480
Speaker 1: That's one of those things where it's you sort of

958
00:47:58,559 --> 00:48:00,960
laugh a little bit, but maybe not as much as

959
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:04,480
they do. You know, I think that the generational conversations

960
00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:07,519
are interesting. You know, certain people take them too far,

961
00:48:08,360 --> 00:48:12,760
but I think that I it's been interesting to see

962
00:48:12,880 --> 00:48:15,400
you know, my own generation. You know, you mentioned that,

963
00:48:15,719 --> 00:48:17,800
you know, gen Z is sort of this like great

964
00:48:17,920 --> 00:48:20,599
social experiment. But one of the things that I've noticed

965
00:48:20,679 --> 00:48:23,760
is that gen Z has sort of split into multiple

966
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:25,679
entirely distinct populations.

967
00:48:25,760 --> 00:48:27,920
Speaker 2: Right. So one is.

968
00:48:27,840 --> 00:48:32,840
Speaker 1: That the the sexes have been politicized. You know, men

969
00:48:33,119 --> 00:48:37,480
are in general significantly to the right of women. That's weird, right,

970
00:48:37,519 --> 00:48:40,199
Obviously there's there's normally a bias one way or the other.

971
00:48:40,599 --> 00:48:44,000
You know. Interestingly, before about the seventies, women were more

972
00:48:44,039 --> 00:48:48,079
conservative than men. That that trend reserve reversed, but this

973
00:48:48,159 --> 00:48:50,960
is we're talking like a twenty point jack gap. Right.

974
00:48:51,119 --> 00:48:54,039
That's one thing that's interesting, and this is purely anecdotal,

975
00:48:54,119 --> 00:48:56,719
but it sort of reminds me of HG. Wells as

976
00:48:56,719 --> 00:48:59,039
the time machine, right, like you Euloi and then the

977
00:48:59,519 --> 00:49:04,519
Mora law, because COVID really sharply divided that population, you know,

978
00:49:04,559 --> 00:49:06,679
basically between the people who were like, well, I'm going

979
00:49:06,679 --> 00:49:09,000
to continue living my normal life and those who are

980
00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:12,960
just now kind of coming out of the cave. And like,

981
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:15,719
don't get me wrong, every negative thing said about gen

982
00:49:15,840 --> 00:49:18,920
Z is true. Taken as a whole. But what's been

983
00:49:18,920 --> 00:49:21,079
interesting to see is that they're an immense amount of

984
00:49:21,159 --> 00:49:25,800
young men in our political scene who are incredibly competent,

985
00:49:26,119 --> 00:49:30,559
who are incredibly driven, and who are effectively locked out

986
00:49:30,599 --> 00:49:33,880
of the traditional kind of status hierarchy, you know, the

987
00:49:34,519 --> 00:49:38,559
young white men need not apply. And so I'm curious

988
00:49:38,559 --> 00:49:40,480
to see where that goes, because you do have a

989
00:49:40,519 --> 00:49:43,800
lot of people who traditionally would be you know, the

990
00:49:43,840 --> 00:49:46,440
young rising partner at a law of firm, right, the

991
00:49:47,159 --> 00:49:50,800
hot new surgeon in town, and now are effectively, you know,

992
00:49:50,880 --> 00:49:54,199
locked out of traditional prestige institutions. And I mean, let's

993
00:49:54,199 --> 00:49:58,039
be honest, those institutions are falling apart even before the

994
00:49:58,400 --> 00:50:01,960
kind of recruiting crinsis. But I'm curious to see how

995
00:50:02,039 --> 00:50:04,519
that brend develops.

996
00:50:05,159 --> 00:50:08,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that's a good observation about your generation.

997
00:50:09,519 --> 00:50:11,840
And because it's funny, I was talking to someone in

998
00:50:11,840 --> 00:50:14,880
my generation. You know, it's a weird thing. Gen xers

999
00:50:15,159 --> 00:50:19,000
seem to have a much more comfortable tolerance of the

1000
00:50:19,039 --> 00:50:23,079
weirdness of gen Z in general. Ten baby boomers for sure.

1001
00:50:23,159 --> 00:50:26,079
Baby boomers just find it very difficult. But even millennials,

1002
00:50:26,079 --> 00:50:28,000
which is kind of a strange thing. But I think

1003
00:50:28,519 --> 00:50:31,360
it has to do with the fact that my generation

1004
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:33,760
came along with this massive blob of people in front

1005
00:50:33,800 --> 00:50:35,760
of us, and by the time when we got into

1006
00:50:35,800 --> 00:50:37,679
the work world, it became rather obvious that we were

1007
00:50:37,679 --> 00:50:39,360
never going to get any of those good jobs because

1008
00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:42,000
guess what is all these guys who got more experience

1009
00:50:42,119 --> 00:50:45,480
been around longer. They're clogging up the system. And so

1010
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:49,280
a weird way, my generation came along not really wanting

1011
00:50:49,280 --> 00:50:51,920
to invest the same way. I remember when I was

1012
00:50:51,960 --> 00:50:55,760
a young person, old guys criticizing us for job hopping,

1013
00:50:56,400 --> 00:50:58,719
and the argument was, well, look, if you're not you know,

1014
00:50:58,800 --> 00:51:00,840
loyalty is a two way street. If the company isn't

1015
00:51:00,840 --> 00:51:03,119
going to do anything for me, well why should I

1016
00:51:03,159 --> 00:51:04,719
do anything for the extra for the company? I mean,

1017
00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:07,840
what's you know, what's the explanation for this loyalty? Well,

1018
00:51:07,960 --> 00:51:09,840
you know, for the Boomers that loyalty made a lot

1019
00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:12,840
more sense because they got something out of it. But

1020
00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:15,400
I think what we when I think gen Z to

1021
00:51:15,480 --> 00:51:18,719
some degree is for different reasons, is coming into a

1022
00:51:18,760 --> 00:51:21,960
world where you're not going to be able to replicate

1023
00:51:22,199 --> 00:51:24,760
that of your parents or grandparents. You're not going to

1024
00:51:24,800 --> 00:51:27,840
have the nineteen fifties life, or even the nineteen eighties life.

1025
00:51:27,840 --> 00:51:31,239
That's just not going to happen. So that's a generation

1026
00:51:31,320 --> 00:51:33,119
that is nevitably going to have to look at the

1027
00:51:33,119 --> 00:51:35,880
future in a very different way. And I think for

1028
00:51:35,960 --> 00:51:38,519
that regard, maybe it's why my generation is far more

1029
00:51:38,559 --> 00:51:41,519
tolerant of some of the stuff that goes on with

1030
00:51:41,599 --> 00:51:43,480
the gen z 's. I'd say this all the time. Whenever,

1031
00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:47,559
you know, like the groper stuff came up, I would

1032
00:51:47,599 --> 00:51:49,559
have comments on that way. There were always older people

1033
00:51:49,840 --> 00:51:52,159
give me the business for not coming down hard on

1034
00:51:52,239 --> 00:51:54,159
people like Nick flint Day's and some of the other

1035
00:51:54,239 --> 00:51:57,159
characters that were running around at the time. And I'd say, look,

1036
00:51:57,199 --> 00:51:58,800
you know, you just got to wait see what happens

1037
00:51:58,840 --> 00:52:00,280
ten years from now, you know. I mean, you know,

1038
00:52:00,320 --> 00:52:04,119
people change, and old people couldn't see it that way.

1039
00:52:04,159 --> 00:52:05,559
And that's so I think that's part of it. But

1040
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:08,239
I think the bigger problem, bigger differences with gen Z

1041
00:52:08,599 --> 00:52:11,039
and this is this is where the social experiment is,

1042
00:52:11,039 --> 00:52:17,000
is that your generation has been socialized online. Millennials didn't

1043
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:20,360
get socialized online. It's still even though they're highly supervised

1044
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:23,360
by helicopter parents, and certainly my generation, you know, we

1045
00:52:23,599 --> 00:52:27,960
we We were socialized on playgrounds. Gen z ors were

1046
00:52:27,960 --> 00:52:32,239
socialized in chat rooms and in message boards and social

1047
00:52:32,239 --> 00:52:35,639
media and chat rooms in game gaming world, you know,

1048
00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:39,920
and it results in some weird dynamics. You know, you

1049
00:52:39,960 --> 00:52:44,159
can be you can be extreme in a chat room

1050
00:52:44,320 --> 00:52:47,000
or in a video game, because what's the worst thing

1051
00:52:47,000 --> 00:52:49,000
going to happen? Your character will be destroyed and you

1052
00:52:49,079 --> 00:52:51,320
have to respawn as a new character. It's not you know,

1053
00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:54,679
there's no real consequences in a way. You know, you

1054
00:52:54,719 --> 00:52:57,320
get banned from Twitter, you start a new Twitter account,

1055
00:52:57,360 --> 00:53:00,440
you know, and you start over, and that's it's different

1056
00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:03,480
than you're getting in trouble in the playground and maybe

1057
00:53:03,480 --> 00:53:04,519
losing the few of your teeth.

1058
00:53:04,599 --> 00:53:04,760
Speaker 2: You know.

1059
00:53:04,760 --> 00:53:08,159
Speaker 3: It's a different experience, you know, And I think zoomers

1060
00:53:08,159 --> 00:53:12,360
in a lot of ways being socialized online. First of all,

1061
00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:15,119
you guys are vastly more media savvy than any generation

1062
00:53:15,480 --> 00:53:17,559
before you. I mean, it really is incredible just how

1063
00:53:17,599 --> 00:53:20,519
comfortable young people. I see this in the workplace all

1064
00:53:20,559 --> 00:53:23,760
the time. I laugh, I get I will get text

1065
00:53:23,840 --> 00:53:27,280
messages from people where they did a video of something

1066
00:53:27,320 --> 00:53:30,920
on their their workstation and sent me the video with

1067
00:53:31,039 --> 00:53:33,760
commentary on it and I mean, you never get that

1068
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:34,440
from an old person.

1069
00:53:34,519 --> 00:53:35,880
Speaker 1: That would never happen, you know.

1070
00:53:35,920 --> 00:53:37,400
Speaker 2: But what they're doing is the showing me, hey.

1071
00:53:37,239 --> 00:53:39,280
Speaker 3: I did this, I did this, and you know this

1072
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:42,000
is the result I got and and it's very helpful.

1073
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:42,719
Speaker 2: I mean, it's great.

1074
00:53:42,760 --> 00:53:44,599
Speaker 3: But it just comes so naturally to young people that

1075
00:53:44,639 --> 00:53:47,960
it does not it's not the chase for the older generations.

1076
00:53:48,360 --> 00:53:50,599
So it's it's going to be a very it's gonna

1077
00:53:50,599 --> 00:53:53,480
be very interesting to see how that happens because how

1078
00:53:53,519 --> 00:53:56,719
much of the world outside is real, real, real, and

1079
00:53:56,760 --> 00:53:58,840
how much of the Internet world is you know what

1080
00:53:58,880 --> 00:54:02,239
I mean. It's you know, if you if your bank

1081
00:54:02,239 --> 00:54:04,480
account is canceled because it's something you said online, that's

1082
00:54:04,519 --> 00:54:07,880
extremely It's as real as somebody punching you in a

1083
00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:09,960
nose because you said something you shouldn't have said, you know,

1084
00:54:10,280 --> 00:54:12,599
you know what I mean. So it's the reality of it.

1085
00:54:13,519 --> 00:54:15,800
We can't just assume that the Internet is not real

1086
00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:18,039
and outside is real. The Internet is as real as

1087
00:54:18,400 --> 00:54:21,400
anything outside is right now for most people, particularly younger people,

1088
00:54:21,440 --> 00:54:24,280
because that's their world is shaped by it. So it's

1089
00:54:24,280 --> 00:54:26,400
going to be an interesting thing to see. And I

1090
00:54:26,639 --> 00:54:28,280
guess I'll probably live long enough to see how it

1091
00:54:28,360 --> 00:54:32,679
plays out, unless you know the world ends. But but

1092
00:54:32,719 --> 00:54:34,480
I don't think anybody really thinks there's not a lot

1093
00:54:34,480 --> 00:54:36,199
OF's not a lot of people writing about this, which

1094
00:54:36,199 --> 00:54:38,039
I find strange, you know this, because it seems like

1095
00:54:38,079 --> 00:54:43,039
such a fertile ground to kind of speculate about culture

1096
00:54:43,159 --> 00:54:47,599
and anthropology and demographics and all these different different topics.

1097
00:54:48,760 --> 00:54:50,400
Speaker 1: One of the things that I want to bring up,

1098
00:54:50,880 --> 00:54:54,119
uh an aside on the technical issue or the technical

1099
00:54:54,159 --> 00:54:56,599
skill issue that I think is interesting is you know,

1100
00:54:56,679 --> 00:54:59,800
you mentioned that gen z has been socialized on the Internet.

1101
00:54:59,840 --> 00:55:01,920
That's that's one hundred percent true. You know when I

1102
00:55:01,960 --> 00:55:05,320
look at the kind of neo pronouns, right, the zzers,

1103
00:55:05,519 --> 00:55:09,239
the Demi boys, all the like weird gender goblin nonsense.

1104
00:55:09,960 --> 00:55:11,920
To me, that is that is a pure product of

1105
00:55:11,960 --> 00:55:12,559
the Internet.

1106
00:55:12,719 --> 00:55:12,880
Speaker 2: Right.

1107
00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:16,280
Speaker 1: Not only is that something that if you tried, you know,

1108
00:55:16,360 --> 00:55:19,639
in grade school, you'd get relentlessly bullied, but also the

1109
00:55:19,679 --> 00:55:23,719
whole idea of having pronouns right in stating your pronouns,

1110
00:55:23,880 --> 00:55:25,920
I mean, how do you how does that work in

1111
00:55:25,920 --> 00:55:29,079
a face to face conversation? Right, Hello, my name is

1112
00:55:29,159 --> 00:55:32,519
Jay Burden. My pronouns are like that's goofy. Right, no

1113
00:55:32,559 --> 00:55:34,559
one talks like that, but on the internet, right, you

1114
00:55:34,559 --> 00:55:37,199
can put them in your bio. Now. One of the

1115
00:55:37,199 --> 00:55:39,400
things that's interesting I think as well, is that the

1116
00:55:39,480 --> 00:55:42,480
gen Z is a product of consumer internet, right, not

1117
00:55:42,559 --> 00:55:45,599
the Internet per se. And you know, so you see

1118
00:55:45,599 --> 00:55:48,360
this problem often and I've interacted this with my peers

1119
00:55:48,360 --> 00:55:51,400
that they're very bad at, you know, what would have

1120
00:55:51,440 --> 00:55:54,159
been basic technical tasks twenty years ago, like all right,

1121
00:55:54,239 --> 00:55:56,599
you know, find the root file, you know, find this,

1122
00:55:57,199 --> 00:56:00,639
you know, the subsystem on your computer. You know, nothing complicated,

1123
00:56:00,639 --> 00:56:01,239
I can't.

1124
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:04,559
Speaker 3: That is an excellent observation. I was just talking to

1125
00:56:04,599 --> 00:56:06,840
someone about this in a work environment the other day.

1126
00:56:07,000 --> 00:56:09,519
It is at it is a very very true thing,

1127
00:56:09,559 --> 00:56:12,199
and it's and it's shocking in a way.

1128
00:56:15,920 --> 00:56:17,280
Speaker 1: Right, Sorry, I thought I thought you were going to

1129
00:56:17,320 --> 00:56:20,320
go on, but it is. It is very much a

1130
00:56:20,360 --> 00:56:23,760
product of you know, the iPhone internet, you know, where

1131
00:56:23,760 --> 00:56:27,320
everything is sort of glazed over with this kind of

1132
00:56:27,320 --> 00:56:30,320
Fisher price effect, you know, And so if you can't

1133
00:56:30,360 --> 00:56:33,360
find something by just typing it in text, you know,

1134
00:56:33,360 --> 00:56:35,719
and who knows, maybe that's another reason AI will be needed.

1135
00:56:35,719 --> 00:56:38,199
It's sort of an interface between people who've never used

1136
00:56:38,239 --> 00:56:40,440
the kind of back end of the of a machine

1137
00:56:40,440 --> 00:56:44,599
at all. But it's interesting to watch because it's sort

1138
00:56:44,599 --> 00:56:46,920
of like the there are very few people who bridge

1139
00:56:46,960 --> 00:56:50,199
the gap between you know, the media skills, right, which

1140
00:56:50,239 --> 00:56:52,920
is the you know, the thing you've talked about, you know,

1141
00:56:53,000 --> 00:56:55,840
and then the the kind of just simple you know,

1142
00:56:55,960 --> 00:56:58,199
how to look for a file, how to convert a file,

1143
00:56:58,280 --> 00:57:01,159
all of those things that you know you've ever actually done,

1144
00:57:01,440 --> 00:57:03,280
and look like I need to know this for podcasting.

1145
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:07,360
It's not rocket science, but nonetheless it is interesting where

1146
00:57:07,360 --> 00:57:11,679
it's almost like they're so saturated by kind of like

1147
00:57:11,760 --> 00:57:14,480
web three point zero, right, social media, that that's kind

1148
00:57:14,480 --> 00:57:19,840
of the primary way they interact with all technology.

1149
00:57:20,000 --> 00:57:24,199
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's using that example of someone sending me a

1150
00:57:24,280 --> 00:57:29,360
video of something. They will do this because it is

1151
00:57:29,639 --> 00:57:32,840
a weird thing has happened in that people are so

1152
00:57:33,039 --> 00:57:35,440
used to thinking they can just press a button and

1153
00:57:35,480 --> 00:57:38,159
they get the free result without having to do any

1154
00:57:38,199 --> 00:57:40,519
work or having to think too much, and they're somewhat

1155
00:57:40,519 --> 00:57:44,360
offended by old fashioneds a software that actually requires you

1156
00:57:44,440 --> 00:57:47,920
to take certain knowledge from one area of it and

1157
00:57:48,000 --> 00:57:50,519
apply that knowledge to the other area so that you

1158
00:57:50,559 --> 00:57:53,400
can learn how to master it and you see this

1159
00:57:53,519 --> 00:57:55,400
problem turn up all the time. You know, Hey, I

1160
00:57:55,440 --> 00:57:58,079
push these three buttons like I do over here, and

1161
00:57:58,400 --> 00:58:01,400
I'm oftentimes my reply will be, well, what happened when

1162
00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:02,960
you push the buttons on this other side?

1163
00:58:03,320 --> 00:58:03,440
Speaker 1: Oh?

1164
00:58:03,480 --> 00:58:05,039
Speaker 3: I don't know, is this is the thing that didn't happen?

1165
00:58:05,079 --> 00:58:06,880
And you have to kind of walk them through how

1166
00:58:06,920 --> 00:58:10,800
to use inference to learn how something works without having

1167
00:58:10,840 --> 00:58:13,559
to be trained on it. And I'll shake my head

1168
00:58:13,559 --> 00:58:16,280
and I'm like, man, this this is completely bunkers. But

1169
00:58:16,320 --> 00:58:18,280
I was talking to someone recently about this and they said, yeah,

1170
00:58:18,280 --> 00:58:20,480
we run into the same problem all the time. And

1171
00:58:20,519 --> 00:58:23,800
in fact, they're actually trying to change their help section.

1172
00:58:23,880 --> 00:58:28,079
They're going to try and use AI so that their

1173
00:58:28,199 --> 00:58:30,400
users maybe they think, would you know, the younger people

1174
00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:33,880
would be more comfortable just talking to another voice that

1175
00:58:33,920 --> 00:58:36,920
will then explain to them how to navigate through a

1176
00:58:36,960 --> 00:58:41,280
software system. This is completely nuts, but it is the

1177
00:58:41,440 --> 00:58:44,920
you know, the world in which we live because you.

1178
00:58:44,880 --> 00:58:45,519
Speaker 2: Know, young people.

1179
00:58:45,760 --> 00:58:47,639
Speaker 3: It's not that young people are dumb, it's just that

1180
00:58:47,679 --> 00:58:50,480
they were conditioned to it with a certain set of expectations.

1181
00:58:50,960 --> 00:58:53,199
You know, you think about like playing video games. I

1182
00:58:53,679 --> 00:58:56,239
blame the pronouns on video games, and the reason is

1183
00:58:57,400 --> 00:59:00,320
that the boys could play the girl warrior hero princess role,

1184
00:59:00,920 --> 00:59:04,000
so they all of a sudden gender bending became normal

1185
00:59:04,039 --> 00:59:06,599
without any consequences, you know. And so you could could

1186
00:59:06,639 --> 00:59:08,440
be the female character, could be the male career whatever,

1187
00:59:08,519 --> 00:59:13,000
you could be some non sex character. But I think

1188
00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:16,320
also by spending so much time online, so much time

1189
00:59:16,360 --> 00:59:19,440
interacting with other people this way, that the it's just

1190
00:59:19,480 --> 00:59:22,760
an expect it's a dependence on technology that is not

1191
00:59:22,800 --> 00:59:24,519
in the front of the brain. It's in the back

1192
00:59:24,559 --> 00:59:27,599
of the brain. It's kind of like how an older

1193
00:59:27,639 --> 00:59:30,960
person would just naturally check the weather before going out

1194
00:59:30,960 --> 00:59:33,400
on the hike because you know, hey, it could be raining,

1195
00:59:33,480 --> 00:59:35,800
so I should bring an Unbrella. You know, you don't

1196
00:59:35,840 --> 00:59:38,800
think about, Hey, I'm you know. You know, I have

1197
00:59:38,880 --> 00:59:40,320
to make this a habit, don't. You don't have to

1198
00:59:40,320 --> 00:59:42,199
write it down. It's just a part of your conditioning.

1199
00:59:42,239 --> 00:59:46,719
You do this automatically. And for zoomers, so much of

1200
00:59:46,760 --> 00:59:50,639
this dependency on technology is a part of the environment.

1201
00:59:50,880 --> 00:59:53,280
You You know, a young person can't imagine a world

1202
00:59:53,320 --> 00:59:55,639
without the Internet. I can imagine a world without an

1203
00:59:55,639 --> 00:59:57,519
Internet because I spent a good chunk of my life

1204
00:59:57,519 --> 01:00:00,320
without the Internet. I remember having to actually to a

1205
01:00:00,320 --> 01:00:03,639
physical building and look something up in paper books and

1206
01:00:03,800 --> 01:00:05,920
have to take notes. I do know a world like

1207
01:00:05,960 --> 01:00:09,280
that existed you someone your age. You can't imagine what

1208
01:00:09,320 --> 01:00:11,199
that would be like to live in such a horrible place,

1209
01:00:11,280 --> 01:00:13,119
you know, the where you couldn't just type of, you know,

1210
01:00:13,159 --> 01:00:15,840
some keystrokes into your machine and get the answer.

1211
01:00:17,840 --> 01:00:19,480
Speaker 1: I do, but only because I lived out in the

1212
01:00:19,480 --> 01:00:21,679
country and so I didn't get Internet until I was,

1213
01:00:21,920 --> 01:00:23,360
you know, much much later than the rest of the

1214
01:00:23,400 --> 01:00:27,119
world did. But yeah, yeah, I think that something else

1215
01:00:27,199 --> 01:00:30,000
is and these are these are sort of connected, right

1216
01:00:30,000 --> 01:00:31,559
that I was. I was lucky enough to go to

1217
01:00:31,599 --> 01:00:35,119
a very very good private school, right, and they were

1218
01:00:35,119 --> 01:00:37,719
they were pretty on top of technology, right. You couldn't

1219
01:00:37,719 --> 01:00:40,000
bring your cell phone into the building, you know, computers

1220
01:00:40,000 --> 01:00:43,480
were heavily restricted, and there were certainly you know, positives

1221
01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:45,360
to that. I think I've managed to recover and you know,

1222
01:00:45,360 --> 01:00:47,559
figured out how to use a computer find later in life.

1223
01:00:47,960 --> 01:00:50,280
But what was particularly interesting about that is when I

1224
01:00:50,360 --> 01:00:54,719
made the transition from high school to college, how much

1225
01:00:54,960 --> 01:00:58,960
lower the standards were. Right, and you'd assume, naturally, right

1226
01:00:58,960 --> 01:01:00,480
that it would be vice versa. You know that it's

1227
01:01:00,760 --> 01:01:02,960
a gradual building up of you know, something getting harder

1228
01:01:03,000 --> 01:01:06,639
and harder. But it was kind of a combination of one,

1229
01:01:06,920 --> 01:01:08,920
you know, you were allowed almost an unlimited number of

1230
01:01:08,920 --> 01:01:13,360
technological crutches. And then also, you know, there's this kind

1231
01:01:13,360 --> 01:01:17,480
of like never ending situations of accepting you know, oh,

1232
01:01:17,519 --> 01:01:20,440
well it's COVID, so you can take a course, pass fame.

1233
01:01:21,039 --> 01:01:24,400
You know, oh it's you know, something bad happened on campus.

1234
01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:26,960
If you if you want to, you know, you don't

1235
01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:29,880
have to take this test, and magically no one takes

1236
01:01:29,880 --> 01:01:33,079
the test, right. And I think that you know that

1237
01:01:33,079 --> 01:01:37,559
that's another interesting layer to this, right, which is that traditionally,

1238
01:01:38,039 --> 01:01:41,039
you know, there was kind of this process of accreditation

1239
01:01:41,519 --> 01:01:43,880
right where it's like, okay, if you've gone through these hoops,

1240
01:01:43,920 --> 01:01:47,599
you were generally assumed to be, you know, a competent person.

1241
01:01:47,920 --> 01:01:50,280
That has completely gone out the window. Right, A college

1242
01:01:50,280 --> 01:01:53,119
degree is useless. And I say this as someone who

1243
01:01:53,599 --> 01:01:56,639
got a college degree. I thoroughly did not deserve, right.

1244
01:01:56,679 --> 01:01:58,920
I did not work at all in college. I did

1245
01:01:58,920 --> 01:02:02,039
other things, right. I worked on developed podcast, I read

1246
01:02:02,079 --> 01:02:04,360
quite a bit, but almost nothing to do with school

1247
01:02:04,400 --> 01:02:08,360
in particular. And What I think that's interesting, right, is

1248
01:02:08,400 --> 01:02:11,840
because again you know, it's everything is you know, when

1249
01:02:11,880 --> 01:02:14,960
everything becomes that state of exception, you know, everything becomes

1250
01:02:14,960 --> 01:02:19,199
something that is you know, your sort of desire or

1251
01:02:19,280 --> 01:02:21,920
like the whole point is to get out of you know,

1252
01:02:22,000 --> 01:02:25,760
ever making a decision or telling someone no, is that

1253
01:02:25,840 --> 01:02:28,639
you do get. On one hand, this vast mass of

1254
01:02:28,760 --> 01:02:33,519
just completely like hyper sensitive people, right, people who've never

1255
01:02:33,559 --> 01:02:35,840
faced adversity. You when you see this again in the

1256
01:02:35,880 --> 01:02:38,400
pronoun thing, right, which is that like it is a

1257
01:02:38,840 --> 01:02:40,880
it is a crisis, like a strike at the core

1258
01:02:40,960 --> 01:02:43,639
of my being, you know, for someone to not use

1259
01:02:43,679 --> 01:02:47,000
the correct version of here or herd or further. And

1260
01:02:48,079 --> 01:02:51,039
I think that that is, uh, that's a very youthful

1261
01:02:51,079 --> 01:02:53,880
thing for the regime to have, you know, like if

1262
01:02:53,880 --> 01:02:56,559
you look at like what are the rewards the regime

1263
01:02:56,679 --> 01:02:59,440
offers to its different client groups to this sort of

1264
01:02:59,480 --> 01:03:03,320
like gender goblin zoomer left right, the people that conservatives

1265
01:03:03,320 --> 01:03:06,719
love to talk about on TikTok or whatever. Effectively they

1266
01:03:06,760 --> 01:03:08,199
get nothing from the regime.

1267
01:03:08,360 --> 01:03:08,480
Speaker 2: Right.

1268
01:03:08,519 --> 01:03:10,559
Speaker 1: What you said about never getting a good job, you know,

1269
01:03:10,719 --> 01:03:13,760
very very unlikely to own home is all correct, But

1270
01:03:13,840 --> 01:03:17,000
they have basically had their entire reward system hijacked by

1271
01:03:17,519 --> 01:03:20,440
lets me call myself a girl on the internet, you know,

1272
01:03:20,480 --> 01:03:23,039
and that's all the regime has to pay them effectively.

1273
01:03:24,519 --> 01:03:27,559
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it is, It really is in a lot

1274
01:03:27,599 --> 01:03:30,440
of ways. I've somebody once in a while, on my

1275
01:03:31,000 --> 01:03:34,440
quiet moments, you know, I'll wonder. You know, it's funny.

1276
01:03:36,199 --> 01:03:38,039
Last few months have been renovating a house, right, so

1277
01:03:38,119 --> 01:03:40,800
I spent a lot of time on ladders and by myself,

1278
01:03:41,800 --> 01:03:44,079
you know, even sometimes not just in silence, you know,

1279
01:03:44,119 --> 01:03:46,159
because you can only listen to some many podcasts, and

1280
01:03:46,239 --> 01:03:47,679
so you start thinking about stuff, and I think, you

1281
01:03:47,679 --> 01:03:50,239
know what, how is it possible that there's not a

1282
01:03:50,239 --> 01:03:54,440
whole bunch of young people marching around Washington threatening to

1283
01:03:54,519 --> 01:03:57,880
hang people because of the student debt problem? How is

1284
01:03:57,880 --> 01:04:00,840
that not? I mean enormous burdens on young people, and

1285
01:04:01,199 --> 01:04:03,639
they should be angry. I mean, young people typically are

1286
01:04:03,719 --> 01:04:06,559
the most troublesome portion of the population. They don't have

1287
01:04:06,599 --> 01:04:09,360
anything to lose. You put slapped all this debt on them.

1288
01:04:09,559 --> 01:04:12,800
You gave them a degree in sociology or communications that

1289
01:04:12,880 --> 01:04:16,639
it's a completely worthless degree, and now they'll be painted

1290
01:04:16,679 --> 01:04:18,360
off for the next ten years and they probably will

1291
01:04:18,400 --> 01:04:21,679
never own a home as a consequence of this. Why

1292
01:04:21,719 --> 01:04:24,360
would they have nothing to lose? And yet they're perfectly

1293
01:04:24,360 --> 01:04:28,280
happy to spend their time bitching about their pronouns or

1294
01:04:28,280 --> 01:04:31,000
that somebody didn't stand in a circle during COVID or.

1295
01:04:31,320 --> 01:04:31,840
Speaker 2: Something like that.

1296
01:04:31,880 --> 01:04:34,039
Speaker 3: I mean, really is it's inexplicable in a way. And

1297
01:04:34,119 --> 01:04:36,599
I suppose you know, in the end, as long as

1298
01:04:36,639 --> 01:04:38,960
people have and that's that's a lesson of COVID. As

1299
01:04:39,000 --> 01:04:41,639
long as people have entertainments and they have food that

1300
01:04:41,679 --> 01:04:43,960
you can do anything to them. You can humiliate people

1301
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:46,039
in public, you can, you can stomp all over there,

1302
01:04:46,679 --> 01:04:48,440
you know, their sense of rights and justice, and they'll

1303
01:04:48,440 --> 01:04:50,280
go along with it. So I mean, maybe that's as

1304
01:04:50,320 --> 01:04:52,519
simple as that. But it is really kind of puzzling

1305
01:04:52,559 --> 01:04:59,000
how younger generations are not more angry. I mean, I

1306
01:04:59,039 --> 01:05:01,079
think I mean that angry. You should be angry. Younger

1307
01:05:01,119 --> 01:05:03,079
people should be angry about the because you know, old

1308
01:05:03,119 --> 01:05:07,119
people have let young people down. I mean, but it's

1309
01:05:07,159 --> 01:05:08,800
not the case at all. I Mean, the closest you

1310
01:05:08,880 --> 01:05:11,719
get is the sort of right zoomer who does the

1311
01:05:11,719 --> 01:05:14,320
boomers bashing stuff. You know, That's about this closest you

1312
01:05:14,360 --> 01:05:16,480
get but it's all done on you know, on Twitter

1313
01:05:17,639 --> 01:05:18,000
the man.

1314
01:05:18,039 --> 01:05:20,079
Speaker 1: I this has been a great conversation, but I just

1315
01:05:20,119 --> 01:05:22,719
looked up at the clock and realized we're almost ten

1316
01:05:22,719 --> 01:05:24,840
minutes past where I normally try to wrap things up.

1317
01:05:24,840 --> 01:05:27,480
This is a great conversation. I'm really glad to have

1318
01:05:27,559 --> 01:05:30,440
you on. But if people want to find more of

1319
01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:32,079
your work, what's a good way for them to do that.

1320
01:05:33,000 --> 01:05:34,840
Speaker 3: The easiest way to find me just go to the

1321
01:05:34,960 --> 01:05:37,840
z man dot com and everything's there. Get links to

1322
01:05:37,880 --> 01:05:40,039
everything where I turn up. I write something every day

1323
01:05:40,079 --> 01:05:43,400
and do a podcast every Friday. I even have a

1324
01:05:43,440 --> 01:05:45,320
pay per view content so you can figure out how

1325
01:05:45,360 --> 01:05:48,239
to get that. It's up there on the site as well, and.

1326
01:05:48,320 --> 01:05:51,440
Speaker 1: I highly recommend to your stuff. I've a recent convert

1327
01:05:51,440 --> 01:05:53,840
to your podcast, as I've said, but enjoy it quite

1328
01:05:53,840 --> 01:05:56,639
a bit. You always have something interesting to say. And yeah,

1329
01:05:56,679 --> 01:05:58,239
thank you so much for taking the time to speak

1330
01:05:58,239 --> 01:05:58,440
with me.

1331
01:05:58,760 --> 01:06:00,320
Speaker 2: Well, thank you very much for having me. I had time.

1332
01:06:00,320 --> 01:06:03,920
Speaker 1: I enjoyed it all right, zee Man, welcome back to

1333
01:06:03,920 --> 01:06:05,199
the Jay Burton Show. How are you doing?

1334
01:06:05,840 --> 01:06:07,920
Speaker 3: I'm doing very well. Thank you for having me. I

1335
01:06:07,960 --> 01:06:10,920
apologize in advance if you hear some big loud noises.

1336
01:06:10,960 --> 01:06:15,920
There's thunderstorms rumbling through the holler here and the Fortress

1337
01:06:15,920 --> 01:06:19,039
of Solitude, so it could get kind of noisy, although

1338
01:06:19,079 --> 01:06:20,559
I don't know how if the mic picks it up

1339
01:06:20,599 --> 01:06:20,880
or none.

1340
01:06:21,840 --> 01:06:25,119
Speaker 1: Well, don't worry about it. As someone who lives relatively

1341
01:06:25,119 --> 01:06:28,840
close to a very popular biker bar, there will almost

1342
01:06:28,840 --> 01:06:32,079
assuredly be more noise in the background of my audio

1343
01:06:32,119 --> 01:06:34,840
than yours as someone decides to peel out and they're

1344
01:06:34,880 --> 01:06:39,880
Hardley at eight pm on a weekend or a weekday. Anyway,

1345
01:06:40,400 --> 01:06:44,280
I wanted to talk with you about the twenty twenty

1346
01:06:44,280 --> 01:06:47,960
four election. You know, I'm constantly recommending your show. It'll

1347
01:06:47,960 --> 01:06:51,000
be linked in the description. I recommend people check it out,

1348
01:06:51,480 --> 01:06:54,559
and at the time of recording, your most recent episode

1349
01:06:55,280 --> 01:07:00,239
is on obviously the election, right Trump the Harris and

1350
01:07:00,280 --> 01:07:02,880
so when we were speaking earlier, you mentioned that the

1351
01:07:03,400 --> 01:07:08,400
whole point of that piece was to sort of refocus

1352
01:07:08,480 --> 01:07:11,559
the conversation about the election. Do you want to describe

1353
01:07:11,599 --> 01:07:13,119
your sort of thesis with.

1354
01:07:13,000 --> 01:07:17,280
Speaker 3: That, Yeah, I mean, well, first of all, we are

1355
01:07:17,400 --> 01:07:20,559
kind of in an interesting time, and that this is

1356
01:07:20,920 --> 01:07:25,960
Harris people or whoever's behind it is trying to run

1357
01:07:26,079 --> 01:07:30,679
what I think is the first purely internet election campaign

1358
01:07:31,840 --> 01:07:35,039
where they're not trying to deal with reality, the reality

1359
01:07:35,079 --> 01:07:37,159
of who she is as a physical human being who

1360
01:07:37,239 --> 01:07:41,079
has had a real history and all the other things

1361
01:07:41,079 --> 01:07:45,159
that we associate with a living person in meat space.

1362
01:07:45,639 --> 01:07:47,000
Speaker 2: But the same with Tim Waald.

1363
01:07:47,519 --> 01:07:49,880
Speaker 3: You know, they're trying to ignore all that and instead

1364
01:07:49,920 --> 01:07:53,280
they're trying to run a campaign that's, you know, entirely

1365
01:07:53,320 --> 01:07:56,480
on the Internet. These are two characters who have been reimagined.

1366
01:07:56,519 --> 01:07:59,679
It's it's kind of like how Hollywood reboots an old

1367
01:07:59,719 --> 01:08:02,199
French you know, this is the new version of you

1368
01:08:02,199 --> 01:08:05,559
know something, you know, the what was the last Star Wars?

1369
01:08:06,079 --> 01:08:08,239
You know, the acolyte that I mean, it's actually a

1370
01:08:08,280 --> 01:08:11,679
pretty good analogy. She's the acolyte, you know, brought in

1371
01:08:12,559 --> 01:08:15,360
under old Joe Biden, you know, the old white guy,

1372
01:08:15,400 --> 01:08:18,399
and she's gonna push him aside and take the role

1373
01:08:18,439 --> 01:08:21,279
as the strong, diverse female. And yeah, I mean it

1374
01:08:21,319 --> 01:08:23,680
really is kind of the campaign that they're running, and

1375
01:08:23,680 --> 01:08:25,439
you get all the gas lighting with it, the fake

1376
01:08:25,520 --> 01:08:27,600
polls and all the other stuff that comes with it.

1377
01:08:28,359 --> 01:08:31,319
But there was a time before the Internet where this

1378
01:08:31,359 --> 01:08:33,600
stuff sort of happened too, and they used to call

1379
01:08:33,640 --> 01:08:35,960
it the silly season. It was just this period of

1380
01:08:36,319 --> 01:08:40,840
just ridiculousness. You know, the best time for a presidential candidate,

1381
01:08:41,319 --> 01:08:44,760
The best times they have are when they announced they're

1382
01:08:44,760 --> 01:08:46,680
going to run because they're all full of hope and optimism.

1383
01:08:46,720 --> 01:08:49,439
When they secure the nomination, that's a great time, and

1384
01:08:49,479 --> 01:08:53,359
then when they actually have their nominating convention. Well, Harris

1385
01:08:53,359 --> 01:08:55,479
had all this stuff packed into a month. You know,

1386
01:08:55,560 --> 01:08:57,399
usually it's spread out of a long period of time,

1387
01:08:57,439 --> 01:09:00,119
so it was ups and downs, and this was all

1388
01:09:00,119 --> 01:09:03,800
packed into a month, along with this massive internet gaslighting

1389
01:09:04,279 --> 01:09:08,239
operation that is very effective on people who spend all

1390
01:09:08,239 --> 01:09:11,479
their time online. But for normal people who are out

1391
01:09:11,520 --> 01:09:14,680
in the world, who are in the business world, or

1392
01:09:16,119 --> 01:09:19,920
you know, have friends in the real world who go outside,

1393
01:09:20,079 --> 01:09:22,960
who you know, who actually know what reality is versus

1394
01:09:23,439 --> 01:09:26,439
the internet this all see, I mean, it just comes

1395
01:09:26,479 --> 01:09:30,079
off as rather strange and weird. But you know, even

1396
01:09:30,119 --> 01:09:34,439
people who live normal lives outside of the Internet spend

1397
01:09:34,520 --> 01:09:37,560
time online, so they bump up against this stuff, and

1398
01:09:37,720 --> 01:09:40,880
you know, there's a real conflict there. And when you

1399
01:09:40,920 --> 01:09:44,479
look at the facts that matter though in an election, well,

1400
01:09:45,159 --> 01:09:47,000
this internet campaign is probably not going to have a big,

1401
01:09:47,319 --> 01:09:50,239
big impact on it, it'll fade, it'll run its course.

1402
01:09:50,279 --> 01:09:54,279
We've seen this with things like the Ukraine War. We've

1403
01:09:54,319 --> 01:09:57,720
seen it. We saw it with the whole Russian collusion stuff.

1404
01:09:58,079 --> 01:10:00,199
After a while people started to laugh at it, then

1405
01:10:00,199 --> 01:10:02,279
it became ridiculous and it went away. No one talks

1406
01:10:02,279 --> 01:10:05,399
about it anymore. And I think that may actually happen

1407
01:10:05,439 --> 01:10:10,000
with Harris. All of this big haullabaloo online is kind

1408
01:10:10,000 --> 01:10:13,880
of gonna it's peaking too early. She's gonna crash and

1409
01:10:14,039 --> 01:10:16,680
sometime I think they're having what debates in September something

1410
01:10:16,720 --> 01:10:19,520
like that, you know, three four weeks from now. All

1411
01:10:19,680 --> 01:10:22,920
this sugar high from the gas lighting campaign and the

1412
01:10:22,960 --> 01:10:26,159
silly season, the excitement of having the new, diverse, strong

1413
01:10:26,239 --> 01:10:29,920
female character, that'll all fade away, and and and of

1414
01:10:29,920 --> 01:10:32,199
course what happens. You know, we've all done this where

1415
01:10:32,239 --> 01:10:36,840
you have a you know, a big starchy, high carbohydrate diet,

1416
01:10:36,880 --> 01:10:39,159
you know, you know, meal rather and uh, you know,

1417
01:10:39,199 --> 01:10:41,560
you crash afterwards. And I think this will probably happen,

1418
01:10:41,600 --> 01:10:43,960
and probably by the end of this month and a

1419
01:10:44,039 --> 01:10:47,119
September we'll be back to reality and she will be

1420
01:10:47,159 --> 01:10:50,000
a long shot. Because look, it's really hard to sell

1421
01:10:50,039 --> 01:10:55,159
people on someone who is this odd and this unknown.

1422
01:10:55,239 --> 01:10:59,239
I mean, she's she's the high risk candidate. Oddly enough,

1423
01:10:59,279 --> 01:11:02,560
Trump has become I'm the safe candidate, the safe choice choice.

1424
01:11:02,600 --> 01:11:05,039
And if you're looking around and it's an uncertain world.

1425
01:11:05,119 --> 01:11:08,560
The economy is not great, you know, inflation is obviously

1426
01:11:08,600 --> 01:11:11,399
still a problem. You know, people are feeling people are

1427
01:11:11,399 --> 01:11:13,800
starting to really start to you know, to think about

1428
01:11:13,920 --> 01:11:18,479
their household budgets and their savings and the retirement. A

1429
01:11:18,520 --> 01:11:20,520
lot of people who are thinking about retirement. You think

1430
01:11:20,520 --> 01:11:22,560
about it, you got what twenty eight percent of the

1431
01:11:22,560 --> 01:11:25,720
population of the voting population, or technically baby boomers, and

1432
01:11:25,760 --> 01:11:28,399
you're throwing my generation gen xers, so you're probably talking

1433
01:11:28,560 --> 01:11:31,119
thirty two thirty three percent or something like that. Well,

1434
01:11:31,600 --> 01:11:35,199
as you get older, you're less tolerant for uncertainty. So

1435
01:11:35,359 --> 01:11:37,760
as the population gets older, it gets more conservative. It

1436
01:11:37,760 --> 01:11:40,520
looks for the safer choice. And oddly enough, I mean

1437
01:11:40,560 --> 01:11:42,239
it's kind of a musing in a way, but Trump

1438
01:11:42,319 --> 01:11:44,159
has become the safe choice. You know what you're going

1439
01:11:44,239 --> 01:11:47,319
to get with him. And so I mean, if if

1440
01:11:47,359 --> 01:11:49,199
I were a betting person, or if I were you know,

1441
01:11:49,199 --> 01:11:51,239
if someone said, hey, hey, we're going to hire you

1442
01:11:51,520 --> 01:11:53,520
and you get a million dollars if you run the

1443
01:11:53,560 --> 01:11:55,319
campaign or help the campaign win.

1444
01:11:55,520 --> 01:11:56,119
Speaker 2: Which side you.

1445
01:11:56,119 --> 01:11:57,720
Speaker 3: Want to take, I'm going I think the Trump side,

1446
01:11:57,800 --> 01:12:00,920
because there's just so much more that he can do

1447
01:12:01,079 --> 01:12:03,880
to win versus Harris. And I say this is someone

1448
01:12:03,960 --> 01:12:06,640
I've all the you know, all the caveats about Trump

1449
01:12:06,720 --> 01:12:09,560
and democracy and what he can accomplish and all that stuff,

1450
01:12:09,600 --> 01:12:11,600
just looking at this purely in the game that it

1451
01:12:11,680 --> 01:12:15,039
is that you know, you know, in a couple of

1452
01:12:15,039 --> 01:12:17,079
weeks from now, we're all going to be thinking that, geez,

1453
01:12:17,159 --> 01:12:21,119
you know, Trump looks pretty good. And I think that's

1454
01:12:21,119 --> 01:12:23,000
a you know, the way it's going to turn out.

1455
01:12:23,079 --> 01:12:25,439
And I'm not guaranteeing it because there's, you know, the

1456
01:12:25,479 --> 01:12:29,039
whole Shenanigans problem, but I think the Shenanigans problem may

1457
01:12:29,079 --> 01:12:31,760
turn out to be a bigger problem for Harrison for

1458
01:12:31,800 --> 01:12:34,960
Trump because I think I said in my show that

1459
01:12:35,199 --> 01:12:37,359
if you look at what the hell is her name,

1460
01:12:37,439 --> 01:12:42,239
Karen Whitmer, Karen Gretchen Whitmerchen, I keep calling her Karen.

1461
01:12:42,640 --> 01:12:46,520
That's kind of funny, but whatever.

1462
01:12:46,199 --> 01:12:46,840
Speaker 2: It doesn't matter.

1463
01:12:47,359 --> 01:12:49,560
Speaker 3: She has her eyes. On twenty twenty four, I thought,

1464
01:12:49,560 --> 01:12:52,800
excuse me, twenty twenty eight. Josh Shapiro is thinking about

1465
01:12:52,800 --> 01:12:56,439
twenty twenty eight. There's a lot of wealthy people who

1466
01:12:56,600 --> 01:13:01,680
have been developing Gavin Newsom for twenty eight and they

1467
01:13:01,720 --> 01:13:03,439
have you know, this is a lot of tech people,

1468
01:13:03,840 --> 01:13:06,279
a lot of old political money.

1469
01:13:07,000 --> 01:13:07,199
Speaker 2: You know.

1470
01:13:07,359 --> 01:13:10,079
Speaker 3: So Harris losing might not be such a bad thing

1471
01:13:10,119 --> 01:13:11,279
for a lot of these people.

1472
01:13:11,359 --> 01:13:12,880
Speaker 2: And that means that, you.

1473
01:13:12,840 --> 01:13:18,800
Speaker 3: Know, Gretchen Whitner and Josh Harris or Josh Harris, Josh Shapiro, well,

1474
01:13:18,840 --> 01:13:22,520
they might not have their their Shenanigans operation. They might

1475
01:13:22,560 --> 01:13:25,479
not fortify the election for democracy like they did in

1476
01:13:25,520 --> 01:13:28,960
twenty twenty because well might do this and this is

1477
01:13:28,960 --> 01:13:30,880
not an unusual thing. I don't know if I mentioned

1478
01:13:30,920 --> 01:13:31,640
this in the show, but.

1479
01:13:33,199 --> 01:13:34,279
Speaker 2: I gotcha. How long ago was this?

1480
01:13:34,359 --> 01:13:37,079
Speaker 3: Scott Brown when he when Ted Kennedy dropped dead, they

1481
01:13:37,079 --> 01:13:40,279
had a special election in Massachusetts and Scott Brown won

1482
01:13:40,319 --> 01:13:44,399
the election as a Republican who won the election and

1483
01:13:44,399 --> 01:13:49,920
the reason was that the machines in Boston, Springfield, Worcester, Lowell,

1484
01:13:50,039 --> 01:13:52,960
these were all Democratic mayors who ran the Democratic machine.

1485
01:13:53,359 --> 01:13:55,800
They sat it out. They didn't like the Democratic nominee.

1486
01:13:56,359 --> 01:13:59,359
They had personal reasons for it. They didn't put their

1487
01:13:59,399 --> 01:14:03,279
their footstal out there. The Democrat loss. It was a

1488
01:14:03,399 --> 01:14:06,880
huge upset the next election, though, which was, well, I've

1489
01:14:06,960 --> 01:14:10,479
been let's see, Obama was already in the White House,

1490
01:14:10,479 --> 01:14:12,960
so that would have been twenty twelve. So in twenty

1491
01:14:13,000 --> 01:14:15,359
twelve when they had Elizabeth Warren, you know, she had

1492
01:14:15,359 --> 01:14:19,000
a perfect zombie that they wanted. All the Democrats were

1493
01:14:19,000 --> 01:14:21,439
happy they put their foot soldiers out. She won an

1494
01:14:21,439 --> 01:14:24,960
a landslide. So it really tells you how institutional support

1495
01:14:25,079 --> 01:14:27,279
can make a huge difference. These guys can be real

1496
01:14:27,359 --> 01:14:29,880
subtle about it and say, well, I don't know, it's

1497
01:14:29,920 --> 01:14:31,720
not really my best interest to help you out here,

1498
01:14:31,720 --> 01:14:34,960
so I'm not going to. And that's another thing that

1499
01:14:35,039 --> 01:14:37,439
works in Trump's favor. I mean, she really has when

1500
01:14:37,439 --> 01:14:38,920
you look at all the states. I think I went

1501
01:14:38,920 --> 01:14:40,520
through this, I went through all the different states and

1502
01:14:40,560 --> 01:14:42,720
look at Poland. I mean, she's got to win them all.

1503
01:14:42,760 --> 01:14:45,880
She's going to win. She's going to win Minnesota, which

1504
01:14:45,960 --> 01:14:47,800
I think she'll win. She's got to win Wisconsin, she's

1505
01:14:47,800 --> 01:14:50,239
got to win Michigan, she got to win Pennsylvania. She

1506
01:14:50,279 --> 01:14:52,600
has to win Virginia, which is no one's talking about

1507
01:14:52,680 --> 01:14:54,560
Virginia I keep bringing this up. You look at the

1508
01:14:54,600 --> 01:14:58,039
poles of Virginia. It's pretty much a dead heat, right Now,

1509
01:14:58,439 --> 01:15:01,880
that's a huge problem. There's a Republican governor there who

1510
01:15:01,960 --> 01:15:04,840
is already cracked down on the Shenanigans, clearing out the

1511
01:15:05,239 --> 01:15:08,239
phony voters and all that stuff. So she's she's going

1512
01:15:08,279 --> 01:15:09,960
to have she's got to win, you know, she's got

1513
01:15:10,000 --> 01:15:12,279
to make the four cushion bank shot to win.

1514
01:15:13,479 --> 01:15:17,239
Speaker 1: And it's interesting you bring up Virginia, right, because as

1515
01:15:17,279 --> 01:15:21,159
as a resident of the state, I've asked the same question, right,

1516
01:15:21,239 --> 01:15:23,880
why is no one talking about it? Now? Look, right,

1517
01:15:25,319 --> 01:15:27,520
you've you know, you've lived in the area. You're familiar

1518
01:15:27,520 --> 01:15:31,520
with the fact that in northern Virginia is effectively a healthscape.

1519
01:15:32,039 --> 01:15:32,199
Speaker 2: Right.

1520
01:15:32,239 --> 01:15:35,960
Speaker 1: It's kind of the start of the Northeast megalopolis. And

1521
01:15:36,279 --> 01:15:39,760
they've also imported quite a lot of New Americans.

1522
01:15:40,000 --> 01:15:44,239
Speaker 3: So, okay, twenty eight percent of the voters were far

1523
01:15:44,319 --> 01:15:46,079
and born, I think in twenty twenty.

1524
01:15:46,199 --> 01:15:48,079
Speaker 1: And they were very proud of that fact. But if

1525
01:15:48,119 --> 01:15:51,880
you look at at Glenn Youngkin, right, Glenn Youngkin isn't

1526
01:15:52,039 --> 01:15:56,079
our type of guy, but he's a canty politician and

1527
01:15:56,159 --> 01:15:59,399
he's done a couple of things that have kind of

1528
01:15:59,439 --> 01:16:01,880
showed that. Right. So one of the things is he's

1529
01:16:02,039 --> 01:16:08,800
massively revamped multiple government programs. Right, the DMV, the Department

1530
01:16:08,800 --> 01:16:12,279
of Transportation, the state went all of those. Now also, right,

1531
01:16:12,640 --> 01:16:15,039
let's take that same kind of line of reasoning we

1532
01:16:15,159 --> 01:16:18,640
use towards Gresh and Wittmer. Right, what does this person,

1533
01:16:18,800 --> 01:16:20,800
this governor, what do they have in mind for their

1534
01:16:20,840 --> 01:16:24,760
political career? I mean, very very shortly after he was elected,

1535
01:16:25,079 --> 01:16:27,479
you heard the rumblings, Oh, you, young Kin's going to

1536
01:16:27,520 --> 01:16:29,520
run for president. Young Kin's going to run for president.

1537
01:16:29,960 --> 01:16:33,479
I think he very wisely saw that Trump was going

1538
01:16:33,560 --> 01:16:35,359
to be a force. He didn't make the mistake that

1539
01:16:35,399 --> 01:16:38,239
DeSantis made it right, which is to try and fight Trump,

1540
01:16:38,479 --> 01:16:42,800
and he lost his political career for it effectively. Now again,

1541
01:16:43,680 --> 01:16:46,560
four years of Trump, he's done. Now, admittedly young Kin

1542
01:16:46,600 --> 01:16:48,920
will also be out of office by then. But if he

1543
01:16:49,039 --> 01:16:51,880
is not only you know, the man who is able

1544
01:16:51,920 --> 01:16:55,840
to swing Virginia red, but also hand you know the

1545
01:16:55,960 --> 01:17:00,359
RNC those states. He's an incredible commanding role, right, very

1546
01:17:00,399 --> 01:17:04,159
strong possibility for an eventual president. And look, I'm not

1547
01:17:04,239 --> 01:17:07,239
saying that he is my favorite politician. You know, I

1548
01:17:07,279 --> 01:17:11,600
want him to succeed, and everythink he does. But it

1549
01:17:11,680 --> 01:17:14,079
seems to me as if you know, all of these

1550
01:17:14,159 --> 01:17:17,279
kind of individual players all find it in their best

1551
01:17:17,319 --> 01:17:21,239
interest for Trump to win and not Kamola.

1552
01:17:22,159 --> 01:17:24,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean there's there's a lot of reasons, and

1553
01:17:24,680 --> 01:17:26,880
I think you know, you have to kind of think

1554
01:17:26,880 --> 01:17:29,840
of politics and that you know, you have these sort

1555
01:17:29,840 --> 01:17:33,119
of power centers if you will. You know, the tech money,

1556
01:17:33,520 --> 01:17:36,920
you tech money, it was mostly Indian money came in

1557
01:17:37,000 --> 01:17:40,640
for Kamala Harrison twenty twenty, and they were very disappointed

1558
01:17:40,680 --> 01:17:43,279
with the results. She couldn't she couldn't attract flies. I mean,

1559
01:17:43,279 --> 01:17:45,520
if she was dead, she would have attract flies. She

1560
01:17:45,600 --> 01:17:48,159
was such a I mean, people forgot just how awful candidate.

1561
01:17:48,239 --> 01:17:48,520
Speaker 1: She was.

1562
01:17:48,880 --> 01:17:49,840
Speaker 2: Hilariously awful.

1563
01:17:49,840 --> 01:17:51,840
Speaker 3: I mean, you know one of those candidates I kind

1564
01:17:51,880 --> 01:17:55,119
of wanted to stick to stick around because the' just

1565
01:17:55,159 --> 01:17:55,920
been great material.

1566
01:17:56,000 --> 01:17:57,359
Speaker 1: She would have been a blast.

1567
01:17:58,520 --> 01:18:02,319
Speaker 3: And you know, it's the tech money. You know, they're

1568
01:18:02,359 --> 01:18:05,319
looking at her and probably not all that enthusiastic. She's

1569
01:18:05,359 --> 01:18:07,720
just she's not really good. And she's also kind of

1570
01:18:07,760 --> 01:18:09,960
tangled up into the Clinton machine a little bit. She

1571
01:18:10,000 --> 01:18:12,479
had a whole bunch of Clinton people working for and

1572
01:18:12,479 --> 01:18:14,840
then you have wall Street. I mean, she's talking about

1573
01:18:15,199 --> 01:18:17,439
these crackpot ideas, but she sounds like Bernie Sanders.

1574
01:18:17,520 --> 01:18:18,039
Speaker 2: For goodness sake.

1575
01:18:18,039 --> 01:18:21,199
Speaker 3: He's talking about taxing unrealized capital gains. That may be

1576
01:18:21,239 --> 01:18:23,359
the dumbest idea I've ever heard in politics. I mean,

1577
01:18:23,560 --> 01:18:26,159
and look, I'm I'm the young guy. I have heard

1578
01:18:26,199 --> 01:18:29,439
a lot of incredibly stupid things. I was talking to

1579
01:18:29,439 --> 01:18:32,359
someone today about this. You know, this was a normy,

1580
01:18:33,079 --> 01:18:36,159
someone who had probably voted for I would guess somebody

1581
01:18:36,199 --> 01:18:39,159
probably voted for Trump in twenty sixteen, but Biden in

1582
01:18:39,199 --> 01:18:41,239
twenty twenty, you know, because they you know, they just

1583
01:18:41,319 --> 01:18:43,920
kind of thought Trump was too mean and you know,

1584
01:18:44,000 --> 01:18:46,880
let's get back to normal and stuff. This person couldn't

1585
01:18:46,880 --> 01:18:49,760
stop talking to me about how idiotic that tax on

1586
01:18:49,800 --> 01:18:53,239
capital gains. They just they were so angry about it.

1587
01:18:53,560 --> 01:18:55,520
I mean that's the right word for it, angry. So

1588
01:18:55,640 --> 01:18:58,479
if you know regular normies are, can you imagine someone

1589
01:18:58,479 --> 01:19:01,520
who is who has a lot of capital gains to

1590
01:19:01,600 --> 01:19:04,119
deal with on a regular basis being wealthy people? I mean,

1591
01:19:04,319 --> 01:19:07,239
my goodness, you know, the sure they know that this

1592
01:19:07,279 --> 01:19:10,199
will never happen, but they don't want this idea to

1593
01:19:10,239 --> 01:19:14,119
get normalized. They want this idea to be anathematized. So

1594
01:19:14,680 --> 01:19:17,119
you know, that group doesn't like her. But I think

1595
01:19:17,159 --> 01:19:21,359
institutional Washington also doesn't like her very much. There doesn't

1596
01:19:21,359 --> 01:19:23,119
seem to be a lot of enthusiasm, you know, the

1597
01:19:23,199 --> 01:19:25,600
kinds of people who write for the New York Times,

1598
01:19:25,600 --> 01:19:28,960
write for the Washington Post. If you read those people,

1599
01:19:29,000 --> 01:19:32,920
the columnists, they're not really enthusiastic for Harris. The only

1600
01:19:32,960 --> 01:19:36,720
group that I've seen that's enthusiastic for Harris are the neocons.

1601
01:19:37,199 --> 01:19:40,279
But those guys are just nut jobs. They think that

1602
01:19:40,359 --> 01:19:42,399
this is an opportunity for them to continue, you know,

1603
01:19:42,399 --> 01:19:45,840
their crazy campaigns, and they hate Trump, so you really

1604
01:19:45,880 --> 01:19:48,159
can't take them that serious. I mean, they have power,

1605
01:19:48,199 --> 01:19:49,920
but you know, you know, you have to kind of

1606
01:19:50,399 --> 01:19:53,439
qualify their support. But I really don't think that she

1607
01:19:53,640 --> 01:19:55,760
I mean, she just doesn't have a base. That's one

1608
01:19:55,760 --> 01:19:57,800
of the big problems that she's going to run into.

1609
01:19:58,279 --> 01:20:00,520
And a guy like Young Cain, who who is a

1610
01:20:00,600 --> 01:20:03,359
super connected guy. I mean, this guy is not some

1611
01:20:03,760 --> 01:20:07,760
you know guy from you know, a small town in Virginia.

1612
01:20:07,760 --> 01:20:11,720
I mean, this guy, he's very connected. And you know,

1613
01:20:11,760 --> 01:20:15,399
he also demonstrated that he has a good political antenna

1614
01:20:15,800 --> 01:20:17,880
because he picked up on all the trouble in Loudun

1615
01:20:17,920 --> 01:20:20,439
County and rode that to the governorship. And people forget

1616
01:20:20,439 --> 01:20:23,800
that what happened there, that that revolt in Louden County. Now,

1617
01:20:23,960 --> 01:20:27,720
I don't know if you know you live in Virginia.

1618
01:20:27,880 --> 01:20:30,680
Speaker 1: Yes, I remember that story well that some of our

1619
01:20:30,760 --> 01:20:31,359
viewers might not.

1620
01:20:31,760 --> 01:20:34,039
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean you had all of a sudden, all

1621
01:20:34,119 --> 01:20:37,000
the lunatics got ahold of the school board and started,

1622
01:20:37,039 --> 01:20:38,560
you know, doing all the stuff they wanted to do

1623
01:20:38,600 --> 01:20:41,000
in schools, putting child porn in and having you know,

1624
01:20:41,079 --> 01:20:44,199
perverts there running around addresses, you know, all the it's

1625
01:20:44,279 --> 01:20:46,800
unbelievable that the kind of stuff they were that they

1626
01:20:46,800 --> 01:20:50,119
want to do. But you know, these parents, you know,

1627
01:20:50,199 --> 01:20:54,119
middle aged white parents living in Louden County and you know,

1628
01:20:54,199 --> 01:20:56,319
Lowdon County is one of these places. It's full of

1629
01:20:56,359 --> 01:20:59,039
a lot of people who've lived other places. It's not

1630
01:20:59,239 --> 01:21:01,640
you know, local for the most part. A lot of

1631
01:21:01,680 --> 01:21:04,079
them have government related jobs. You know, they're in a

1632
01:21:04,079 --> 01:21:07,079
private sector, but you know the company it either does

1633
01:21:07,119 --> 01:21:09,279
business with the government or does business with the government

1634
01:21:09,279 --> 01:21:13,520
contractor you know, and it's a very wealthy county. It's

1635
01:21:13,560 --> 01:21:15,520
I think Loldum County. It's in the top ten of

1636
01:21:15,560 --> 01:21:18,319
wealthiest counties in the country. It's like number six or

1637
01:21:18,359 --> 01:21:21,880
something like that. But it's not it's not so wealthy

1638
01:21:22,000 --> 01:21:24,159
as it's not full of rich people. It's full of

1639
01:21:24,239 --> 01:21:28,760
upper middle class people. And these people freaked out over

1640
01:21:28,840 --> 01:21:32,560
this stuff. They were fined with all the woke stuff

1641
01:21:33,000 --> 01:21:36,399
when it didn't touch them or touch their kids or

1642
01:21:36,640 --> 01:21:39,640
a work person didn't try to touch their kids. But

1643
01:21:39,720 --> 01:21:42,359
as soon as it started coming into their community, they

1644
01:21:42,359 --> 01:21:45,720
freaked out and and it turned into an issue that

1645
01:21:48,479 --> 01:21:52,319
you know that he could run on and with popular sport.

1646
01:21:52,359 --> 01:21:54,600
It was a populist issue in a way. And I

1647
01:21:54,680 --> 01:21:57,800
watched him, young kid. He really did trying to change

1648
01:21:57,800 --> 01:21:59,520
in a way. This is a guy who kind of

1649
01:21:59,640 --> 01:22:03,039
started to enjoy being a politician. It wasn't an abstraction

1650
01:22:03,159 --> 01:22:05,600
for him. All of a sudden, he was getting, you know,

1651
01:22:05,680 --> 01:22:08,319
real cheers from the kind of people he could appreciate,

1652
01:22:08,640 --> 01:22:11,399
you know what I mean. And and you know, it

1653
01:22:11,439 --> 01:22:13,560
wasn't canned speeches in front of canned audiences. All of

1654
01:22:13,560 --> 01:22:15,479
a sudden, He's you know, he felt like a man

1655
01:22:15,479 --> 01:22:17,079
of the people. He really did change a lot. And

1656
01:22:17,319 --> 01:22:20,880
I think, you know, this is a guy that the

1657
01:22:20,920 --> 01:22:23,840
people who actually run our country look at and say,

1658
01:22:24,000 --> 01:22:27,560
this guy could be kind of the Trump without the

1659
01:22:27,600 --> 01:22:29,600
trump Ism without Trump sort of thing, you know, the

1660
01:22:29,680 --> 01:22:34,479
compromise on the whole populist versus establishment thing. So he'll

1661
01:22:34,479 --> 01:22:37,319
get a lot of support with his efforts to try

1662
01:22:37,359 --> 01:22:40,279
and swing Virginia to to Trump. I mean that would

1663
01:22:40,279 --> 01:22:42,520
be huge, That would be enormous if you pulled that off.

1664
01:22:42,520 --> 01:22:45,039
I mean, this would be you know, because it would

1665
01:22:45,039 --> 01:22:47,239
win the election. You know that that would win the

1666
01:22:47,279 --> 01:22:49,840
election for Trump. And and of course Trump would be

1667
01:22:49,880 --> 01:22:51,600
told that he has to you know, owes this guy.

1668
01:22:51,880 --> 01:22:53,680
You know, so maybe put him in the cabinet or

1669
01:22:53,720 --> 01:22:55,880
something like that so he can get a high profile.

1670
01:22:56,279 --> 01:22:58,279
So you can kind of see the wheels turning for

1671
01:22:58,319 --> 01:23:01,319
a state like Virginia. But you know that there's other

1672
01:23:01,359 --> 01:23:03,640
states too. I mean, the Hampshire could be in play.

1673
01:23:03,920 --> 01:23:06,000
That's a funny state. They have a lot of weirdos

1674
01:23:06,000 --> 01:23:08,960
from Massachusetts who moved in and turned the state into

1675
01:23:09,000 --> 01:23:11,720
a kind of a strange place. You talk to people

1676
01:23:11,720 --> 01:23:13,960
who live in New Hampshire, you know they you know,

1677
01:23:13,960 --> 01:23:16,600
it's it's not that close it's like, I think a

1678
01:23:16,640 --> 01:23:19,000
five point state right now, four point state something like that.

1679
01:23:19,359 --> 01:23:22,239
But you know, if the if the crazies aren't motivated,

1680
01:23:22,319 --> 01:23:23,840
the Hampshire could be in play. I mean, it's a

1681
01:23:23,840 --> 01:23:25,119
lot of I mean, it's one of those things you

1682
01:23:25,159 --> 01:23:26,960
start looking at this, it's not hard to find a

1683
01:23:27,000 --> 01:23:29,560
scenario in which Trump actually has a really big night,

1684
01:23:31,119 --> 01:23:33,000
you know, election night. Oh you know, well, it all

1685
01:23:33,079 --> 01:23:35,880
kind of breaks the same way. So I again to

1686
01:23:35,920 --> 01:23:37,760
go back to what originally said, you know, all this

1687
01:23:37,800 --> 01:23:40,239
stuff on the internet, all this this gas lighting campaign,

1688
01:23:40,239 --> 01:23:41,920
he doesn't have to ignore it and look at the facts.

1689
01:23:42,840 --> 01:23:45,159
If you if you're a betting man right now, you

1690
01:23:45,199 --> 01:23:50,159
bet on Trump and the shenanigans that would be required

1691
01:23:50,199 --> 01:23:52,920
to beat him, and assuming he doesn't do anything stupid,

1692
01:23:53,920 --> 01:23:55,720
it's going to be enormous that would They would take

1693
01:23:55,720 --> 01:23:59,199
an enormous amount of shenanigans and that could be a

1694
01:23:59,239 --> 01:24:04,159
bigger problem for the regime then having Trump win and

1695
01:24:04,199 --> 01:24:06,159
then have to deal with him for four years. You know,

1696
01:24:06,159 --> 01:24:08,479
I kept I mean, the mistake I always make is

1697
01:24:08,479 --> 01:24:12,199
thinking that crazy people are more reasonable than than they are.

1698
01:24:12,640 --> 01:24:15,640
But if I were, if I were advising the people

1699
01:24:15,640 --> 01:24:17,439
who actually run the country. I'd say, you know what,

1700
01:24:18,159 --> 01:24:20,960
let Trump win, cut whatever deal you can cut with him.

1701
01:24:21,000 --> 01:24:23,439
He'll be gone in four years and you can start

1702
01:24:23,479 --> 01:24:28,239
over with whoever you want. That would be the smart play.

1703
01:24:29,439 --> 01:24:34,600
Speaker 1: Going back to your point about Kamala not having a base, Look,

1704
01:24:34,880 --> 01:24:38,720
you know, conservatives are never particularly creative, right, And one

1705
01:24:38,720 --> 01:24:40,920
of the things that they have kind of grabbed onto

1706
01:24:41,520 --> 01:24:45,159
is this idea that Kamala has, should we say, an

1707
01:24:45,199 --> 01:24:49,119
ever shifting perception of her own ethnicity. Right, she's Indian,

1708
01:24:49,239 --> 01:24:52,840
she's black whenever. It's kind of convenient and obviously right.

1709
01:24:52,880 --> 01:24:56,760
You don't need to be particularly into politics to realize

1710
01:24:56,760 --> 01:25:00,760
that Black Americans as a voting block go massively for

1711
01:25:00,840 --> 01:25:01,560
the Democrats.

1712
01:25:01,720 --> 01:25:01,960
Speaker 2: Right.

1713
01:25:03,319 --> 01:25:06,319
Speaker 1: And one of the problems with this election in twenty

1714
01:25:06,359 --> 01:25:10,600
twenty four is, while certainly Black Americans will continue to

1715
01:25:10,720 --> 01:25:16,319
go for the Democrats, they don't seem to like Kamala

1716
01:25:17,159 --> 01:25:20,399
in like in relate in proportion to how they like

1717
01:25:20,479 --> 01:25:23,640
other Democrats, and they like Trump more than they like

1718
01:25:23,720 --> 01:25:26,600
other Republicans. And look, I'm not saying that the Republicans

1719
01:25:26,640 --> 01:25:29,279
are going to break that demographic right, they're going to

1720
01:25:29,520 --> 01:25:32,760
become the party of black people. I think that's completely impossible.

1721
01:25:33,520 --> 01:25:37,279
But you see that same pattern of Kamala failing to

1722
01:25:37,359 --> 01:25:41,239
appeal to core parts of the Democratic base over and

1723
01:25:41,279 --> 01:25:45,800
over again. Right, Another clear example is Muslims. Right, Muslims

1724
01:25:46,239 --> 01:25:49,319
see her by virtue of being associated with Joe Biden

1725
01:25:49,720 --> 01:25:52,960
as being overly sympathetic to Israel. Right, that might not

1726
01:25:53,039 --> 01:25:57,119
be the position that you or I take, but again, right,

1727
01:25:57,159 --> 01:26:00,439
that is a valuable voting block in a place like Michigan,

1728
01:26:01,520 --> 01:26:03,920
even on a bigger level. Right, we talked earlier about

1729
01:26:03,960 --> 01:26:08,239
her kind of idiotic proposal to tax unrealized capital games, which,

1730
01:26:08,239 --> 01:26:09,680
for those who aren't kind of up to date on

1731
01:26:10,000 --> 01:26:13,039
what that means, basically, if you have an asset and

1732
01:26:13,079 --> 01:26:15,960
it appreciates while you own it, you haven't sold it,

1733
01:26:16,399 --> 01:26:20,000
you will be taxed on that unrealized game. Right, if

1734
01:26:20,039 --> 01:26:22,560
your house goes up one hundred thousand dollars, even if

1735
01:26:22,600 --> 01:26:26,079
you haven't sold it, you'll have to pay taxes on it. So, okay,

1736
01:26:26,199 --> 01:26:29,479
there's the moneyed interests. There is you know, multiple minority groups.

1737
01:26:29,880 --> 01:26:31,640
And then also you know, as we saw at the

1738
01:26:32,079 --> 01:26:37,119
DNC in Chicago, the Street movement, right, the kind of

1739
01:26:37,159 --> 01:26:40,239
like protest wing of the party who's very, very concerned

1740
01:26:40,239 --> 01:26:44,399
with Israel Palestine. They are also displeased with her. And

1741
01:26:44,439 --> 01:26:47,960
really it seems like the only demographic that loves Kamala

1742
01:26:48,000 --> 01:26:52,039
Harris is a terminally online progressive women.

1743
01:26:54,319 --> 01:26:57,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know that's and of course the consulting class.

1744
01:26:57,640 --> 01:26:59,840
You know, she's raised a you know, she'll have a

1745
01:27:00,039 --> 01:27:02,439
billion or so dollars to spend on political consultants.

1746
01:27:02,439 --> 01:27:03,399
Speaker 2: So they love it.

1747
01:27:04,159 --> 01:27:07,640
Speaker 3: You know, people don't realize, you know that there's really

1748
01:27:07,680 --> 01:27:10,760
a whole industry, particularly like polling. You know, the polling guys.

1749
01:27:10,800 --> 01:27:12,079
You know, this is the time of the year. They

1750
01:27:12,119 --> 01:27:14,680
make a lot of money to sell these ridiculous pols,

1751
01:27:14,760 --> 01:27:18,000
these people, you know, so you know, those people love her,

1752
01:27:18,000 --> 01:27:20,800
you know, in a way that you know, professional Washington

1753
01:27:20,880 --> 01:27:24,840
versus official Washington. You know, they always they love both

1754
01:27:24,840 --> 01:27:26,640
candidates in a way. Well, they don't love Trump, but

1755
01:27:26,720 --> 01:27:29,640
you know, typically love both candidates. But you know, her

1756
01:27:29,680 --> 01:27:33,720
problem with the race issue is interesting because she's not

1757
01:27:33,880 --> 01:27:36,159
black in the way in which Americans think of it.

1758
01:27:36,439 --> 01:27:38,800
You know, I spent my life around black people, and

1759
01:27:38,880 --> 01:27:41,960
I lived in Baltimore for twenty years, and that they

1760
01:27:41,960 --> 01:27:44,680
would not look at her as black. Now they would

1761
01:27:44,720 --> 01:27:47,800
look at Obama. They would understand that Obama. They can

1762
01:27:48,199 --> 01:27:49,880
let me put it this way. They would look past

1763
01:27:49,920 --> 01:27:53,760
Obama being probably not, you know, black in the sense

1764
01:27:53,800 --> 01:27:58,960
that his ancestors were slaves, but he married a black woman,

1765
01:27:59,760 --> 01:28:04,520
and he is kind of the ideal black guys. That's

1766
01:28:04,520 --> 01:28:07,600
what he was presented at. Sort of this you know,

1767
01:28:08,159 --> 01:28:10,560
you know you see at Denzel Washington. You know, he

1768
01:28:10,680 --> 01:28:12,880
was that kind of guy, and this is a model

1769
01:28:12,920 --> 01:28:15,560
they had created, they had tested. It goes back. I

1770
01:28:15,560 --> 01:28:18,840
think I did mention this in another show. There was

1771
01:28:18,880 --> 01:28:21,000
a guy named Kurt Schmoke back in the nineteen eighties.

1772
01:28:21,279 --> 01:28:23,560
He was like the prototype for Obama, and they kind

1773
01:28:23,560 --> 01:28:26,279
of worked out all the bugs in how to market

1774
01:28:26,720 --> 01:28:31,039
this sort of suave, well spoken, sophisticated sort of black guy,

1775
01:28:31,439 --> 01:28:34,479
the kind of guy that back in the seventies, you know,

1776
01:28:34,600 --> 01:28:39,000
he would have been drinking cold forty five, but in

1777
01:28:39,159 --> 01:28:42,239
this age he's drinking Kvasier. You know, he's that kind

1778
01:28:42,279 --> 01:28:47,560
of black guy, and that super excited black women because

1779
01:28:47,600 --> 01:28:49,560
black women looked at him and saw that he was

1780
01:28:49,560 --> 01:28:52,199
married to sort of a prototypical black woman. I mean

1781
01:28:52,239 --> 01:28:54,119
she kind of looks, you know, she's not a good

1782
01:28:54,119 --> 01:28:58,039
looking woman. Well, they love this because It allowed them

1783
01:28:58,079 --> 01:29:01,319
to feel as if, hey, you know what, that's attainable

1784
01:29:01,319 --> 01:29:01,560
for me.

1785
01:29:02,399 --> 01:29:03,479
Speaker 2: And that's why the.

1786
01:29:03,399 --> 01:29:06,720
Speaker 3: Whole Obama thing worked, even though he wasn't really authentically black.

1787
01:29:07,439 --> 01:29:10,359
Harris doesn't have that. She's married to a Jewish guy.

1788
01:29:10,760 --> 01:29:13,319
She didn't have any kids, which is very weird. Black

1789
01:29:13,359 --> 01:29:15,760
women look at this black woman, her age, with no kids.

1790
01:29:16,560 --> 01:29:18,840
They just do not understand how in the world you

1791
01:29:18,920 --> 01:29:21,159
can try and pretend this is a black woman. And

1792
01:29:21,199 --> 01:29:23,399
of course, you know she might do a Jewish guy,

1793
01:29:24,319 --> 01:29:27,520
you know, and she's half Indian and half Jamaican or whatever.

1794
01:29:27,600 --> 01:29:29,960
It just doesn't work. It was one of the really

1795
01:29:30,880 --> 01:29:34,159
great things about Trump at that Black Journalist event. I

1796
01:29:34,239 --> 01:29:37,439
laughed so hard watching it, and the crowd laughed. They

1797
01:29:37,439 --> 01:29:41,359
were roaring, because you know, he understands. Trump's been around

1798
01:29:41,399 --> 01:29:43,319
a lot of black people. He used to hang out

1799
01:29:43,359 --> 01:29:48,359
with No Guy, the boxing promoter Don King. He used

1800
01:29:48,359 --> 01:29:51,079
to hang around with, Oh, what the heck is a

1801
01:29:51,119 --> 01:29:54,920
guy's name? The sort of mister hanky looking black dude

1802
01:29:54,920 --> 01:29:57,199
who's on TV. Used to be what the heck is

1803
01:29:57,239 --> 01:29:59,399
his name? That doesn't matter anymore, but you know, he

1804
01:29:59,439 --> 01:30:04,399
was a street act of his uh, the Reverend Al yes,

1805
01:30:04,640 --> 01:30:07,800
Al Sharpton, Yeah, that was a great story about Trump

1806
01:30:08,359 --> 01:30:11,640
picking up Don King and they brought Al Sharpton along

1807
01:30:12,279 --> 01:30:15,520
and Al Sharpton Trump picked him up. His helicopter was

1808
01:30:15,520 --> 01:30:17,399
taking him to Atlantic City for a fight or something

1809
01:30:17,439 --> 01:30:20,600
like that, and Al Sharpton started talking out of turn,

1810
01:30:20,680 --> 01:30:22,960
and Don King said, Hey, it wouldn't be a problem

1811
01:30:23,000 --> 01:30:27,279
if we threw you out of the helicopter. I mean, Trump,

1812
01:30:27,399 --> 01:30:30,079
Trump understands how black people think. He's been around black

1813
01:30:30,079 --> 01:30:32,720
people's whole life. He understands it. So what he's set

1814
01:30:32,800 --> 01:30:35,359
up there, and he the way he talked about how

1815
01:30:36,039 --> 01:30:40,439
she we he said it suddenly she's a black person.

1816
01:30:40,840 --> 01:30:45,079
And the way he enunciated black person. Everybody cracked up

1817
01:30:45,119 --> 01:30:48,439
because they understood exactly what he was saying. And I

1818
01:30:48,439 --> 01:30:51,119
mean I thought it was hilarious too. But black people

1819
01:30:51,119 --> 01:30:53,000
are not going to be excited for her. It's just

1820
01:30:53,079 --> 01:30:55,520
not going to happen, you know, not what she is.

1821
01:30:55,560 --> 01:31:02,159
She's strong, diverse female character from every bad Hollywood film,

1822
01:31:02,359 --> 01:31:04,720
you know, all these terrible Hollywood films where they you know,

1823
01:31:04,760 --> 01:31:07,199
they find they're going to take something and you know,

1824
01:31:07,560 --> 01:31:09,800
and make the protagonist instead of being a man, which

1825
01:31:09,800 --> 01:31:13,600
it should be into you know, strong diverse I assuming

1826
01:31:13,600 --> 01:31:16,880
a strong female. It's going to in an animate ever,

1827
01:31:16,880 --> 01:31:18,680
once in a while you have strong diverse female. I

1828
01:31:18,720 --> 01:31:20,760
think I mentioned the acolyte, which I never.

1829
01:31:20,640 --> 01:31:22,800
Speaker 2: I haven't seen. I've just seen all the videos making

1830
01:31:22,840 --> 01:31:23,319
fun of it.

1831
01:31:23,560 --> 01:31:25,760
Speaker 3: But that's what she is. She's the acolyte. She's this

1832
01:31:26,039 --> 01:31:31,760
really crappy reinvention, the sort of feminist, heavily online feminist

1833
01:31:31,880 --> 01:31:36,680
reinvention you know, of a of a Barack Obama basically,

1834
01:31:36,760 --> 01:31:38,840
you know, and trying to sell thee that way. And

1835
01:31:38,880 --> 01:31:41,239
it's just not going to work. I mean, Black people

1836
01:31:41,279 --> 01:31:42,800
are not going to get all excited. I mean, they'll

1837
01:31:42,840 --> 01:31:47,239
vote ninety for Harris, but they won't vote in huge numbers.

1838
01:31:47,239 --> 01:31:50,319
They're not going to be turning out in record numbers

1839
01:31:50,359 --> 01:31:53,000
like they did for Obama or for for Biden, and

1840
01:31:53,119 --> 01:31:55,600
that uh, you know, I mean Joe Biden, for all

1841
01:31:55,600 --> 01:31:58,199
his faults, he actually did a very good job courting

1842
01:31:58,279 --> 01:31:59,960
the black vote. And they did a good job selling

1843
01:32:00,039 --> 01:32:03,600
them as you know, this a good white you know,

1844
01:32:03,640 --> 01:32:06,920
for for the black people. And uh and of course

1845
01:32:06,920 --> 01:32:09,199
you know, they had spent four years telling black people

1846
01:32:09,279 --> 01:32:11,920
that Trump was secretly going to bring back slavery. So

1847
01:32:12,079 --> 01:32:14,600
you know, it worked, but it's not going to work now.

1848
01:32:15,520 --> 01:32:18,760
I you know, I'm I would not be surprised, And

1849
01:32:18,800 --> 01:32:20,960
I keep coming back to this, and I don't want to, like,

1850
01:32:21,000 --> 01:32:23,319
you know, I don't like to make predictions. But the

1851
01:32:22,960 --> 01:32:25,680
more I talk about this stuff, the more I convince

1852
01:32:25,800 --> 01:32:29,680
myself that Trump could actually win pretty handily. You know,

1853
01:32:29,760 --> 01:32:31,640
a month from now, we might be talking about this

1854
01:32:31,720 --> 01:32:34,039
an entirely different way. We might be talking about in

1855
01:32:34,399 --> 01:32:38,760
a big victory. Because Kamala Harris doesn't have a natural base.

1856
01:32:39,439 --> 01:32:42,520
She has she has the poorest political instincts I've ever seen.

1857
01:32:43,720 --> 01:32:46,439
She is a simpleton, for sure. You know, there's a

1858
01:32:46,479 --> 01:32:50,279
video floating around today where she is talking about climate

1859
01:32:50,359 --> 01:32:53,800
change and what she says, and this is a carefully

1860
01:32:53,920 --> 01:32:58,640
scripted interview with CNN is jobber walking. It's it's nonsense words,

1861
01:32:58,680 --> 01:33:01,760
it's there's no You couldn't listen to what she said

1862
01:33:01,800 --> 01:33:04,479
and come away with any meaning at all. And at

1863
01:33:04,479 --> 01:33:06,000
a certain point that just it.

1864
01:33:05,880 --> 01:33:06,640
Speaker 2: Becomes too much.

1865
01:33:06,840 --> 01:33:09,239
Speaker 3: You know, there's too much that they've got to there's

1866
01:33:09,279 --> 01:33:13,199
too much weight in that in that sack to pull

1867
01:33:13,239 --> 01:33:17,760
it up the hill, even with all the shenanigans.

1868
01:33:19,760 --> 01:33:22,119
Speaker 1: I think there's one other problem with this, which is

1869
01:33:22,159 --> 01:33:26,359
that Kamala Harris has to you know, spread this uncomfortable

1870
01:33:26,399 --> 01:33:29,840
needle of on one hand both you know, lauding her

1871
01:33:29,880 --> 01:33:36,960
accomplishments as the vice president, while also effectively running against

1872
01:33:37,000 --> 01:33:39,920
that record because you know, by any objective standard, the

1873
01:33:40,000 --> 01:33:44,720
Joe Biden presidency has been just an out and out disaster. Right. Obviously,

1874
01:33:44,800 --> 01:33:48,880
foreign policy isn't normally a huge determinant in American elections,

1875
01:33:48,920 --> 01:33:52,760
but I mean that's not gone well. The economy that

1876
01:33:52,760 --> 01:33:55,760
that's not gone well. And so you know, by by

1877
01:33:55,800 --> 01:33:58,199
any one of these traditional kind of bell weathers, right,

1878
01:33:58,239 --> 01:34:02,039
these issues that are often cited for the success or

1879
01:34:02,319 --> 01:34:06,199
the failure of a campaign, Well, the Biden years were

1880
01:34:06,239 --> 01:34:10,960
a disaster. And I think it's very very difficult to say, well, yes,

1881
01:34:11,359 --> 01:34:16,000
I was a fully competent vice president, the best vice president, right,

1882
01:34:16,039 --> 01:34:19,520
the first woman of color. But also things are going

1883
01:34:19,560 --> 01:34:22,000
to be completely different under me. I think that that's

1884
01:34:22,000 --> 01:34:26,199
a very difficult position to sell, and it's doubly difficult

1885
01:34:26,319 --> 01:34:29,159
if you are an absolute incompetent moron.

1886
01:34:31,560 --> 01:34:34,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, you know, vice presidents don't do well

1887
01:34:34,720 --> 01:34:40,920
following their boss. Al Gore ran in two thousand and

1888
01:34:41,000 --> 01:34:44,119
he lost against a pretty terrible George Bush. George Brush

1889
01:34:44,199 --> 01:34:47,800
was a very good candidate. He wasn't a great speaker,

1890
01:34:47,840 --> 01:34:50,000
and you know, he was a guy who was sort

1891
01:34:50,000 --> 01:34:52,119
of you know, they cleared the field for him, so

1892
01:34:52,159 --> 01:34:55,960
he didn't really have to be tested. And Gore lost

1893
01:34:56,000 --> 01:34:59,000
because he had this problem that every vice president has,

1894
01:34:59,039 --> 01:35:02,399
and that is, on the one hand, he really can't

1895
01:35:02,439 --> 01:35:05,800
take credit for the good times because he just stood

1896
01:35:05,840 --> 01:35:08,319
around and went to funerals. I mean, everybody knows that

1897
01:35:08,479 --> 01:35:11,399
vice president doesn't do anything. And on the other hand,

1898
01:35:11,439 --> 01:35:12,840
you know, he has to try and be his own man,

1899
01:35:12,880 --> 01:35:15,279
which ultimately means saying that, well, I'm going to be

1900
01:35:15,279 --> 01:35:18,600
different than my boss. So in good times, you're running

1901
01:35:18,840 --> 01:35:22,319
against the good times. It just becomes a contradiction. Is

1902
01:35:22,359 --> 01:35:25,760
very difficult to overcome. The one exception was nineteen eighty

1903
01:35:25,800 --> 01:35:27,079
eight when George.

1904
01:35:26,720 --> 01:35:28,199
Speaker 2: Bush, he ran.

1905
01:35:28,399 --> 01:35:30,640
Speaker 3: His basic campaign was hey, I'm going to keep the

1906
01:35:30,640 --> 01:35:33,319
good times rolling because it was really good times and

1907
01:35:33,399 --> 01:35:35,159
it was so good that people said, yeah, you know,

1908
01:35:36,079 --> 01:35:40,800
let's keep it going. And of course the Democrats also ran.

1909
01:35:42,239 --> 01:35:45,000
I would say, up to this point, the worst candidate

1910
01:35:45,399 --> 01:35:49,319
I've ever seen, I mean, Mike Ducaccus was hilariously bad.

1911
01:35:49,359 --> 01:35:49,960
Speaker 2: I mean he was.

1912
01:35:50,039 --> 01:35:52,560
Speaker 3: I mean even left wing people made fun of him,

1913
01:35:52,600 --> 01:35:54,199
and Saturday at Live used to make fun of him

1914
01:35:54,239 --> 01:35:56,920
all the time. So, I mean, you know, there was

1915
01:35:56,960 --> 01:35:59,960
a lot lot of things fell in place. But generally speaking,

1916
01:36:00,079 --> 01:36:03,399
vice presidents don't win. You know, they might become president

1917
01:36:03,439 --> 01:36:07,800
through death or resignation or something like that, but you know,

1918
01:36:07,840 --> 01:36:11,319
they don't typically do very well because you know, it's

1919
01:36:11,159 --> 01:36:13,840
at that contradiction you you have to be your own person,

1920
01:36:13,920 --> 01:36:15,359
but you at the same time you have to try

1921
01:36:15,399 --> 01:36:19,640
and cling onto your boss's record, and it's a hard sell.

1922
01:36:19,680 --> 01:36:22,479
And the problem that she has is that right now,

1923
01:36:22,520 --> 01:36:25,399
the sort of thing that hangs over all of this

1924
01:36:25,600 --> 01:36:30,399
like a fog is the concern about the decreasing competence

1925
01:36:30,439 --> 01:36:34,279
we see. We see it everywhere. I run into this

1926
01:36:34,600 --> 01:36:38,359
in my business life all the time. People constantly are

1927
01:36:38,439 --> 01:36:42,520
talking about this problem of finding competent people and or

1928
01:36:42,600 --> 01:36:46,920
dealing with competent people. It's a huge problem. You know,

1929
01:36:46,920 --> 01:36:49,600
I've been writing about the crisis of competence for ten

1930
01:36:49,680 --> 01:36:53,039
years now and it's not getting better. And it shows

1931
01:36:53,119 --> 01:36:55,720
up in people's radar when they see that. You know,

1932
01:36:55,800 --> 01:36:59,640
people train changing tires at an airport on my Boeing

1933
01:36:59,680 --> 01:37:02,600
Airport plane the tire explodes and kills two of them,

1934
01:37:02,880 --> 01:37:04,840
or the bowing airplane the doors fall off of it

1935
01:37:04,880 --> 01:37:08,119
in mid flight. You know, this stuff keeps happening. You know,

1936
01:37:08,359 --> 01:37:11,399
it's part of what has really plagued the Biden administration

1937
01:37:11,520 --> 01:37:14,159
because back when they tried to get out of Afghanistan,

1938
01:37:14,199 --> 01:37:17,319
which everybody thought was a good idea, they took what

1939
01:37:17,439 --> 01:37:19,399
should have been a simple thing and screwed it up,

1940
01:37:19,479 --> 01:37:21,560
and it just kind of reminded people, Yeah, it's just

1941
01:37:21,840 --> 01:37:25,000
we are all the people in charge are screw ups.

1942
01:37:26,079 --> 01:37:30,800
And Harris is now running in this atmosphere where people

1943
01:37:30,800 --> 01:37:32,960
are concerned about the lack of competence. It's on the

1944
01:37:33,000 --> 01:37:34,800
gallop pole. I think I talked about it in the

1945
01:37:34,840 --> 01:37:38,479
show last week, and I know I've written about it.

1946
01:37:38,479 --> 01:37:41,760
It's there's a it's like the number three item general competence.

1947
01:37:41,760 --> 01:37:45,199
People are concerned that their government, that people in charge

1948
01:37:45,680 --> 01:37:46,359
are idiots.

1949
01:37:46,680 --> 01:37:47,439
Speaker 2: Well that you.

1950
01:37:47,439 --> 01:37:51,000
Speaker 3: Run a woman who is, first of all, she repeatedly

1951
01:37:51,039 --> 01:37:53,560
lied about the mental competence of her boss, and now

1952
01:37:53,600 --> 01:37:55,920
she can't string a sentence together to save her life.

1953
01:37:56,279 --> 01:37:58,880
It's just a really tough environment for you know, in

1954
01:37:58,920 --> 01:38:02,800
a lot of ways. You know, the reason that no

1955
01:38:02,840 --> 01:38:04,600
one else through their hat in the ring to run

1956
01:38:04,640 --> 01:38:07,159
this time is they all saw that this this was

1957
01:38:07,199 --> 01:38:09,520
just awful right now, you know, to run as a Democrat.

1958
01:38:10,640 --> 01:38:13,760
I think I compared her to gerald Ford in nineteen

1959
01:38:13,800 --> 01:38:17,000
seventy six. You know, she she got the same problem.

1960
01:38:17,439 --> 01:38:20,159
You know, she kind of she didn't win the opportunity

1961
01:38:20,199 --> 01:38:23,479
and that look that weighs on people's mind. She was selected,

1962
01:38:23,520 --> 01:38:25,840
they engineered her into this. She didn't have to run

1963
01:38:25,840 --> 01:38:30,199
in primaries, and you know, her boss is out of favor,

1964
01:38:30,840 --> 01:38:33,560
and you know she's at the same time though, she's

1965
01:38:33,600 --> 01:38:35,319
got to try to defend it, and you know, she's

1966
01:38:35,319 --> 01:38:37,680
got all these problems and it's a compressed campaign. And

1967
01:38:38,000 --> 01:38:39,760
of course, you know gerald Ford had the problem is

1968
01:38:39,760 --> 01:38:42,119
that he didn't have a constituency either. There was really

1969
01:38:42,159 --> 01:38:45,960
nobody that was willing to say, yeah, he's our guy.

1970
01:38:47,000 --> 01:38:49,880
And and I think that's what Harris is struggling with

1971
01:38:49,960 --> 01:38:53,079
right now, is that, you know, this media campaign is great,

1972
01:38:53,119 --> 01:38:54,520
it's fantastic, it works really well.

1973
01:38:54,640 --> 01:38:55,159
Speaker 2: It's cheap.

1974
01:38:55,199 --> 01:38:57,560
Speaker 3: It didn't you know, it doesn't cost a ton of money,

1975
01:38:58,239 --> 01:39:01,479
it's effective, it won the Internet for thirty days or

1976
01:39:01,680 --> 01:39:06,199
whatever it's been. But when she gets back to you know,

1977
01:39:06,239 --> 01:39:09,880
when the campaign moves from the Internet back to the

1978
01:39:09,920 --> 01:39:12,439
meat space, that all these problems are still there. They

1979
01:39:12,439 --> 01:39:15,920
haven't gone away.

1980
01:39:16,319 --> 01:39:19,359
Speaker 1: I think that you're you're right. You know, this kind

1981
01:39:19,359 --> 01:39:23,359
of insane media push, right, And it's kind of funny

1982
01:39:23,560 --> 01:39:26,279
I keep talking about them because even a month later,

1983
01:39:26,319 --> 01:39:28,079
they sound so incredibly out of touch.

1984
01:39:28,720 --> 01:39:28,880
Speaker 2: Right.

1985
01:39:28,960 --> 01:39:33,439
Speaker 1: The whole Kamala is brat jd Vance's weird saga, right,

1986
01:39:33,479 --> 01:39:38,039
which are hopefully sentences that will become increasingly incomprehensible to

1987
01:39:38,119 --> 01:39:40,039
viewers as they get kind of further and further into

1988
01:39:40,079 --> 01:39:43,279
the future. But there was nothing to it, right, It

1989
01:39:43,359 --> 01:39:47,079
was pure media spin. The message behind both of those

1990
01:39:47,159 --> 01:39:50,880
is basically, it's high school girls stuff. It's right, we're cool.

1991
01:39:51,199 --> 01:39:53,680
The people we don't like are gross weirdos. That's it,

1992
01:39:54,640 --> 01:39:59,520
And okay, right, let's game that out. Four weeks later,

1993
01:40:00,159 --> 01:40:05,680
that's vanished, right, like vapor in this bump Kamala had. Well, first,

1994
01:40:05,920 --> 01:40:09,680
she has a big dip after the DNC. The DNC

1995
01:40:09,960 --> 01:40:12,520
was a disaster, you know, and I'm not saying that

1996
01:40:12,520 --> 01:40:16,199
as a partisan. Look, I've never voted in a presidential election,

1997
01:40:16,319 --> 01:40:18,760
I will vote for Trump this time. It would be

1998
01:40:18,760 --> 01:40:21,840
my first vote. I'm not a maga person. But it

1999
01:40:21,880 --> 01:40:25,039
was a disaster. And now, actually, just today, we've reached

2000
01:40:25,039 --> 01:40:28,159
the inflection point. Right, it has gone back to exactly

2001
01:40:28,199 --> 01:40:30,680
what it was before that push. And don't get me wrong,

2002
01:40:30,800 --> 01:40:34,960
right that the Democratic Party controls the media, maybe not explicitly,

2003
01:40:35,079 --> 01:40:38,720
but they call the shots, so they can keep doing that.

2004
01:40:40,000 --> 01:40:43,239
But I think there's the core problem that Kamala is

2005
01:40:43,279 --> 01:40:50,800
a genuinely horrible candidate. Someone it slightly her running wall

2006
01:40:50,960 --> 01:40:53,960
is that his name? Yeah, Okay, I always say it

2007
01:40:54,000 --> 01:40:59,039
wrong because I have no pre existing thoughts about him whatsoever.

2008
01:40:59,640 --> 01:41:02,239
But he's kind of an interesting figure because he really

2009
01:41:02,479 --> 01:41:09,359
is the progressive vision of what a good white guy is. Right.

2010
01:41:09,399 --> 01:41:11,439
You know, they did this video together where they're they're

2011
01:41:11,479 --> 01:41:14,960
kind of in a very scripted manner joking around, and

2012
01:41:15,319 --> 01:41:17,800
you know, they go through the kind of traditional white

2013
01:41:17,840 --> 01:41:20,520
guy joke that you've heard. I mean, he was hackneyed

2014
01:41:20,560 --> 01:41:23,159
thirty years ago. Right. Oh, I'm a white guy from

2015
01:41:23,159 --> 01:41:26,039
the Midwest. I put mayonnaise on my tacos. I don't

2016
01:41:26,079 --> 01:41:29,840
like spicy food. I mean, it's effectively a minstrel show

2017
01:41:29,880 --> 01:41:34,920
for white people. Right, he's jugging and jiving to uh,

2018
01:41:35,239 --> 01:41:37,880
you know, appeal to his master's. Right. You see the

2019
01:41:37,880 --> 01:41:41,359
same thing with you know him out in the field, right,

2020
01:41:41,399 --> 01:41:44,039
you know he's a hunter. And then look like, I

2021
01:41:44,079 --> 01:41:45,960
don't want to get too into kind of gun autism,

2022
01:41:46,000 --> 01:41:47,960
but if you look at the gun, it's like an

2023
01:41:47,960 --> 01:41:52,800
incredibly heavy, incredibly expensive, like ten thousand dollars trap shooting shotgun.

2024
01:41:53,119 --> 01:41:53,439
Speaker 2: Yeah for.

2025
01:41:55,079 --> 01:41:59,920
Speaker 1: All you'd used to go shoot ducks. Right, When you

2026
01:42:00,159 --> 01:42:02,800
dig even further, it's it's very clear that one this

2027
01:42:02,880 --> 01:42:07,279
guy has no appeal whatsoever. But two he really is

2028
01:42:07,760 --> 01:42:10,359
like the ideal version of what a white man's is

2029
01:42:10,399 --> 01:42:13,359
supposed to be in kind of modern progress of America, right,

2030
01:42:13,439 --> 01:42:17,079
a torch bearer for you know, a younger, kind of

2031
01:42:17,119 --> 01:42:21,439
more diverse candidate. And I just don't see him him

2032
01:42:21,479 --> 01:42:22,239
going anywhere.

2033
01:42:24,000 --> 01:42:27,119
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's funny. I mean, I've been calling him Elmer

2034
01:42:27,159 --> 01:42:30,079
Fudd for a while. But it's interesting about this whole

2035
01:42:30,720 --> 01:42:34,399
how they marketed him in Minnesota way back when I'm

2036
01:42:34,439 --> 01:42:37,000
pretty sure it was Mark Warner ran for Senate, or

2037
01:42:37,039 --> 01:42:39,119
maybe he ran for governor. Maybe it ran for governor

2038
01:42:39,119 --> 01:42:42,359
in Virginia. He was governor right in Virginia. I think

2039
01:42:42,359 --> 01:42:43,760
he had been governed as he was.

2040
01:42:43,840 --> 01:42:46,680
Speaker 1: He also had the uh this is just an anecdote.

2041
01:42:46,800 --> 01:42:50,520
He has the honor of having quite possibly the best

2042
01:42:50,600 --> 01:42:54,039
election song ever, which I cannot play. But he basically

2043
01:42:54,119 --> 01:42:55,680
just got a bunch of good old boys to write

2044
01:42:55,760 --> 01:42:58,560
him a bluegrass song. It's actually pretty good. But anyway

2045
01:42:58,600 --> 01:42:58,920
back to you.

2046
01:42:59,560 --> 01:43:04,520
Speaker 3: Well, I was doing business in Virginia and I a

2047
01:43:04,640 --> 01:43:08,800
business local business guy, well I mean super connected business guy,

2048
01:43:09,199 --> 01:43:12,279
super connected in the Democratic Party, and and uh, he

2049
01:43:12,359 --> 01:43:13,920
and I he took me for a ride to see

2050
01:43:13,920 --> 01:43:16,199
some of his properties he was developing or something like that.

2051
01:43:17,039 --> 01:43:19,960
And in the backseat of his car he had all this, uh,

2052
01:43:20,279 --> 01:43:23,640
the samples of promotional material that they were going to

2053
01:43:23,720 --> 01:43:27,560
use for the Warner campaign. And it had him posing

2054
01:43:28,039 --> 01:43:30,439
in the Elmer Fudd costume out in the field with

2055
01:43:30,520 --> 01:43:32,960
the shotgun. And I think he had there was one

2056
01:43:33,159 --> 01:43:35,199
where he's sitting there, you know, he's got plays Ora

2057
01:43:35,199 --> 01:43:36,800
and Joe and he's got his dog with.

2058
01:43:36,760 --> 01:43:39,760
Speaker 1: Him and then you know all that kind of stuff, right, And.

2059
01:43:40,159 --> 01:43:42,800
Speaker 3: I forgot the guy. There was a guy I forgot

2060
01:43:42,840 --> 01:43:45,520
his name, some sort of consultant. He was really kind

2061
01:43:45,560 --> 01:43:47,960
of an eccentric guy. It was his idea, you know

2062
01:43:48,319 --> 01:43:51,199
that they're going to sell you know, they're going to

2063
01:43:51,279 --> 01:43:55,720
trick the good old boys, you know, Republican voters with this,

2064
01:43:55,720 --> 01:44:00,199
this costume act, this you know, presentation, and I mean

2065
01:44:00,239 --> 01:44:03,359
obviously it worked, but they tried doing it later to

2066
01:44:03,439 --> 01:44:07,199
what two thousand and four with John Carrey, they dressed

2067
01:44:07,239 --> 01:44:09,279
him up as Elmer Fudd, and of course it didn't

2068
01:44:09,279 --> 01:44:12,079
work because John John Carrey was just terrible at it.

2069
01:44:12,319 --> 01:44:15,079
But they keep doing the Elmer Fudd act because it

2070
01:44:15,199 --> 01:44:19,279
worked back in the Bush years. It worked as a

2071
01:44:19,319 --> 01:44:22,960
way to kind of undermine conservative support in certain rural areas.

2072
01:44:23,039 --> 01:44:24,760
I mean it worked once, you know, it's like every

2073
01:44:24,760 --> 01:44:26,720
other trick. It works once you get full, you know,

2074
01:44:26,840 --> 01:44:29,039
fall for it again. But apparently they pulled this with

2075
01:44:29,920 --> 01:44:33,359
Walls in Minnesota. I started laughing because that one picture

2076
01:44:33,359 --> 01:44:35,439
they had him in his Elmer Fudd outfit with his

2077
01:44:35,760 --> 01:44:40,199
you know, ten thousand dollars shotgun. You know, you look

2078
01:44:40,199 --> 01:44:42,239
at this them like pait a second. I'm pretty sure

2079
01:44:42,439 --> 01:44:44,840
that was the picture they used for Warner. And I

2080
01:44:44,880 --> 01:44:47,840
went online trying to find any old Warner you know,

2081
01:44:48,000 --> 01:44:50,960
campaign stuff, but I didn't find it so, but it

2082
01:44:51,079 --> 01:44:55,119
just kind of tells you the people behind this they're

2083
01:44:55,159 --> 01:44:59,079
extremely devious. They think about how to trick people. It's

2084
01:44:59,199 --> 01:45:02,119
all about, you know, coming up with some new narrative,

2085
01:45:02,159 --> 01:45:04,600
some new character, some new way to deceive the public.

2086
01:45:05,359 --> 01:45:08,880
And it's all kind of coalesced into this really fantastical

2087
01:45:09,159 --> 01:45:13,479
Harris Walls campaign because you know, the real Walls, he's like,

2088
01:45:15,439 --> 01:45:18,119
he's like eighty percent of the Walls that you know

2089
01:45:18,119 --> 01:45:20,800
that they sold the people in Minnesota. Yeah, he was

2090
01:45:20,800 --> 01:45:23,520
in the military. Well he wasn't in a war zone.

2091
01:45:23,560 --> 01:45:26,239
You know, he kept always kind of saying things that

2092
01:45:26,279 --> 01:45:28,760
make it make you think that he was in combat.

2093
01:45:29,239 --> 01:45:32,640
Well it turns out that never happened. You know, you know,

2094
01:45:32,680 --> 01:45:35,560
he wasn't really that guy he'll say to people, well

2095
01:45:35,560 --> 01:45:37,920
as an old football coach. Well it turned out he

2096
01:45:38,000 --> 01:45:40,079
volunteered for a year or two. He wasn't really a

2097
01:45:40,119 --> 01:45:43,079
football coach. You know. It's everything about this guy is

2098
01:45:43,199 --> 01:45:47,000
kind of like this, and you know, the pre of

2099
01:45:47,000 --> 01:45:49,159
course bringing him on a national stage. Now people look

2100
01:45:49,199 --> 01:45:51,199
into this and you know you can kind of see it.

2101
01:45:51,399 --> 01:45:54,720
But but Walls, Walls is just an odd guy because

2102
01:45:54,720 --> 01:45:59,600
he's like Evid French He's like, there's this weird sort

2103
01:45:59,600 --> 01:46:03,920
of old white guy that you I run into, not

2104
01:46:04,079 --> 01:46:08,680
regularly but on occasion. In that you know, it's almost

2105
01:46:08,680 --> 01:46:12,279
like they hate themselves. You know, they they embrace all

2106
01:46:12,399 --> 01:46:17,239
these old white women politics, but there were a white dude.

2107
01:46:17,119 --> 01:46:17,319
Speaker 2: You know.

2108
01:46:18,119 --> 01:46:20,560
Speaker 3: You know, they they you know, they grasp into all

2109
01:46:20,600 --> 01:46:24,640
this really crazy liberal stuff. And I just don't know

2110
01:46:24,640 --> 01:46:27,199
how these people, I just I just don't understand them.

2111
01:46:27,239 --> 01:46:28,920
I mean, what's the point of this? Why did they

2112
01:46:28,920 --> 01:46:31,279
do this? How do they find this personally fulfilling? I mean,

2113
01:46:31,279 --> 01:46:33,600
I understand a guy like Walls. You know, maybe he

2114
01:46:33,640 --> 01:46:36,199
had to do it to win election in Minnesota. Maybe

2115
01:46:36,239 --> 01:46:38,279
I don't know, but apparently he was doing this act

2116
01:46:38,279 --> 01:46:42,520
before he ran got into politics. So he's just an

2117
01:46:42,520 --> 01:46:44,159
odd guy. You know, men look at a guy like

2118
01:46:44,199 --> 01:46:46,760
Walls and say, that's not a guy you can ever trust.

2119
01:46:46,880 --> 01:46:47,039
Speaker 1: You know.

2120
01:46:47,199 --> 01:46:51,720
Speaker 3: That's he's very off putting to normal males. Maybe he

2121
01:46:51,720 --> 01:46:53,920
plays well with females. I don't know. But that's the

2122
01:46:54,000 --> 01:46:56,680
problem with this campaign, though, is if you have a

2123
01:46:56,800 --> 01:47:00,680
vice president who plays to the same audience that Kamala

2124
01:47:00,680 --> 01:47:06,880
Harris is playing too, there's very narrow, excessively online unmarried,

2125
01:47:07,039 --> 01:47:08,000
childless female.

2126
01:47:08,800 --> 01:47:09,600
Speaker 2: Well you're not.

2127
01:47:09,760 --> 01:47:12,239
Speaker 3: You know, you're not going to win an election based

2128
01:47:12,279 --> 01:47:13,199
on that demographic.

2129
01:47:15,880 --> 01:47:19,399
Speaker 1: I think that there's and maybe this is too tinfoil

2130
01:47:19,520 --> 01:47:22,119
hat so so feel free to call me on it.

2131
01:47:22,199 --> 01:47:26,239
But I have some some contacts in the finance world, right,

2132
01:47:26,680 --> 01:47:29,319
you know, very influential guys, and you know, one of

2133
01:47:29,359 --> 01:47:33,039
the things they've talked about is that you know, there's

2134
01:47:33,239 --> 01:47:37,479
likely to be sort of a worsening recession over the

2135
01:47:37,520 --> 01:47:40,279
next over the short term, right, we're not talking mad Max,

2136
01:47:40,359 --> 01:47:45,039
but things becoming uncomfortable. Right, that trend will continue probably

2137
01:47:45,119 --> 01:47:48,319
to you know, kind of a pain point. And you know,

2138
01:47:48,439 --> 01:47:50,640
this guy was saying one of his theories is that

2139
01:47:51,000 --> 01:47:55,359
basically the Democrats don't want twenty twenty four or they

2140
01:47:55,399 --> 01:47:58,159
don't want twenty Yeah, they don't want this election because

2141
01:47:58,159 --> 01:48:00,520
there's a likelihood that the economy kind of up and

2142
01:48:01,000 --> 01:48:03,199
you know, the president's face, and they don't want to

2143
01:48:03,199 --> 01:48:07,079
be the one you're holding the back and you know, Okay,

2144
01:48:07,239 --> 01:48:10,159
maybe you don't believe that, but to me, it does

2145
01:48:10,199 --> 01:48:12,560
seem like kind of similarly to what you saw with

2146
01:48:12,600 --> 01:48:16,239
the Conservatives in the UK, that the Democrats don't seem

2147
01:48:16,279 --> 01:48:20,800
to be trying their hardest for this election, and I

2148
01:48:20,800 --> 01:48:23,399
think one of the leading indicators of that is look

2149
01:48:23,439 --> 01:48:27,319
at the candidate quality. Like, look, I hate Hillary Clinton, right,

2150
01:48:27,319 --> 01:48:30,920
She's a horrible person, but she's an a lister, right,

2151
01:48:31,239 --> 01:48:33,680
that name has been around for a while. You know,

2152
01:48:33,720 --> 01:48:36,279
she's she can generate a lot of heat. Same thing

2153
01:48:36,279 --> 01:48:39,560
with Joe Biden, Right, Joe Biden's been around forever. But

2154
01:48:39,680 --> 01:48:42,800
Kamala Harris and Tim Wallas, like these are backbenchers, right,

2155
01:48:42,840 --> 01:48:46,520
These aren't real serious hitters. Do you think there's anything

2156
01:48:46,600 --> 01:48:46,840
to that?

2157
01:48:48,359 --> 01:48:50,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think you know, you know this,

2158
01:48:51,520 --> 01:48:53,239
it's kind of you know, there's a life cycle to

2159
01:48:54,720 --> 01:48:57,760
a cycle within a party. You know that Back in

2160
01:48:58,199 --> 01:49:01,760
say the nineteen seventies, and I mean I wasn't around then,

2161
01:49:01,840 --> 01:49:06,960
but you know, the energy was all in this conservative

2162
01:49:07,039 --> 01:49:09,840
movement that was building up within the Republican Party. They

2163
01:49:09,920 --> 01:49:13,239
had all these really great candidates and great public speakers

2164
01:49:13,239 --> 01:49:15,560
and intellectuals and all this stuff, and then it burst

2165
01:49:15,600 --> 01:49:18,279
into the scene in the nineteen eighties. But it also

2166
01:49:18,520 --> 01:49:26,640
did this at a time when the left was exhausted intellectually, emotionally, generationally.

2167
01:49:26,680 --> 01:49:28,439
You know, a lot of the candidates that were running

2168
01:49:28,479 --> 01:49:33,000
were really just incredibly awful. People forget this stuff. I mean,

2169
01:49:33,039 --> 01:49:37,680
I remember Walter Mondale being the presidential candidate. I mean,

2170
01:49:37,720 --> 01:49:40,119
you would rather galge your own eyes out and rip

2171
01:49:40,159 --> 01:49:43,199
your ears off than sit and watch more Walter Mondale

2172
01:49:43,239 --> 01:49:47,680
talk about anything. It was just awful, and it was

2173
01:49:48,079 --> 01:49:50,560
they had the same problem. But then the Republicans had

2174
01:49:50,600 --> 01:49:52,800
this problem. They ran out of gas too, you know,

2175
01:49:52,840 --> 01:49:56,079
they didn't have anybody. So there is kind of a

2176
01:49:56,800 --> 01:50:00,119
seesaw effect here between the parties, and right now the

2177
01:50:00,119 --> 01:50:03,359
the Democrats are down for sure, but I also think

2178
01:50:03,479 --> 01:50:06,159
that we're in a sort of an end cycle here,

2179
01:50:06,239 --> 01:50:11,399
this post Cold War cycle. Neoliberalism, neoconservatism, they've all run

2180
01:50:11,439 --> 01:50:13,560
out of gas. I mean, Trump is a symptom. The

2181
01:50:13,640 --> 01:50:17,000
reason that Trump exists is because the neocons they wore

2182
01:50:17,079 --> 01:50:21,520
the conservative movement like a skin suit. They directed it

2183
01:50:21,560 --> 01:50:25,479
into things that people didn't generally want. People got got

2184
01:50:25,479 --> 01:50:28,640
why starting at the end of the Bush years and

2185
01:50:29,039 --> 01:50:32,840
the Republican Party old Republican Party, the conservative movement is

2186
01:50:32,920 --> 01:50:36,079
running on fumes. I mean they got nothing. You know,

2187
01:50:36,119 --> 01:50:39,720
they're you know, they're the Project twenty twenty five. Business

2188
01:50:39,720 --> 01:50:42,399
out of Heritage is an effort to try and glom

2189
01:50:42,520 --> 01:50:46,359
onto this populous energy. But you know, even the populous

2190
01:50:46,479 --> 01:50:49,680
energy is kind of misdirected. People are just pissed basically,

2191
01:50:49,720 --> 01:50:52,880
They just they don't you know, the average white person

2192
01:50:52,920 --> 01:50:56,079
in America doesn't have a political party that represents their interests.

2193
01:50:56,359 --> 01:50:58,960
So they're kind of you know, they're angry about it,

2194
01:50:58,960 --> 01:51:01,439
but they don't have the way to talk about it.

2195
01:51:01,479 --> 01:51:02,920
They don't have a language for it, they don't have

2196
01:51:03,319 --> 01:51:06,000
a channel for that anger to flow into, So it

2197
01:51:06,119 --> 01:51:08,760
kind of flows into Trump by default. But the pret

2198
01:51:08,840 --> 01:51:11,199
problem is happening on the Democratic side, I think too.

2199
01:51:11,560 --> 01:51:13,640
I think you know that whole that I keep coming

2200
01:51:13,640 --> 01:51:16,079
back to, that Louden County revolt. I spent a lot

2201
01:51:16,119 --> 01:51:18,640
of time looking into that because I think this is

2202
01:51:18,640 --> 01:51:20,359
happening in a lot of places. I think a lot

2203
01:51:20,359 --> 01:51:24,039
of upper middle class white people are looking around and

2204
01:51:24,079 --> 01:51:27,680
thinking that we might have bigger problems than just Trump.

2205
01:51:27,880 --> 01:51:30,680
We have other stuff, and certainly rich people. Look, there's

2206
01:51:30,720 --> 01:51:32,920
a lot of bad paper in the system. I don't

2207
01:51:32,920 --> 01:51:34,800
know how much you know about finance, but there is

2208
01:51:34,880 --> 01:51:38,640
a lot of really bad credit floating around in the system.

2209
01:51:39,680 --> 01:51:43,760
The global financial arrangements are changing and it doesn't appear

2210
01:51:43,800 --> 01:51:47,039
as if right now anybody in Washington understands what the

2211
01:51:47,039 --> 01:51:50,680
hell is happening. And you know, the smart money, you know,

2212
01:51:50,760 --> 01:51:52,479
the guys who were on Wall Street, I mean, they

2213
01:51:52,560 --> 01:51:54,920
probably do know what's happening, and they probably understand that

2214
01:51:54,920 --> 01:51:56,399
there is going to be a fair amount of pain

2215
01:51:56,479 --> 01:51:59,840
as we transition out of the post Cold War period

2216
01:52:00,039 --> 01:52:02,279
into whatever we're going to call the next next phase.

2217
01:52:02,479 --> 01:52:07,960
But you know, there's across the spectrum, you know, the

2218
01:52:08,359 --> 01:52:11,800
people that are capable of thinking about this stuff are

2219
01:52:11,840 --> 01:52:14,199
all looking around and saying that, you know, we have

2220
01:52:14,239 --> 01:52:19,119
a problem, and there really isn't anybody who is capable

2221
01:52:19,119 --> 01:52:22,760
of addressing it within the sort of establishment system. Trump,

2222
01:52:23,000 --> 01:52:26,079
for all his faults, does talk with some sort of

2223
01:52:27,359 --> 01:52:29,680
with a degree of clarity about some of the issues,

2224
01:52:30,279 --> 01:52:32,600
but otherwise there really isn't a lot of options there there.

2225
01:52:32,680 --> 01:52:35,520
There needs to be a great regrouping right now. Not

2226
01:52:35,560 --> 01:52:38,479
only do the Democrats, because again they don't have any companies.

2227
01:52:38,960 --> 01:52:42,000
Their candidate pool is terrible. I mean, look around. I mean,

2228
01:52:42,079 --> 01:52:46,359
Gretchen Whitmer, I don't know how old you are, but

2229
01:52:46,479 --> 01:52:51,159
when I was a young guy back like in my twenties,

2230
01:52:51,239 --> 01:52:54,199
late twenties, we said a thing called cougar bars. Right,

2231
01:52:55,239 --> 01:52:57,800
you know that Gretchen Whitmer is the kind of woman

2232
01:52:57,840 --> 01:52:59,680
that would be at a cougar bar. That's what you want. Like,

2233
01:52:59,680 --> 01:53:01,600
every time I see her, I just start laughing. You know,

2234
01:53:01,720 --> 01:53:04,199
she's lost a bunch of weight, she's gotten into the gym,

2235
01:53:04,680 --> 01:53:08,000
that's what she looks like. It's not somebody you make president.

2236
01:53:08,039 --> 01:53:11,520
I mean you're governor for that matter, Gavin Newsom. If

2237
01:53:11,560 --> 01:53:14,520
you watch this guy speak, he's terrible. He's awful. He's

2238
01:53:14,560 --> 01:53:17,560
just he's boring. He sounds like it sounds like listening

2239
01:53:17,600 --> 01:53:20,359
to your accountant. You can go through the list of

2240
01:53:20,399 --> 01:53:23,399
their A listers and they sound like, you know, C

2241
01:53:23,600 --> 01:53:26,199
listers from even ten years ago or fifteen years ago.

2242
01:53:27,239 --> 01:53:30,279
So it really is, it's a big problem. They've got this.

2243
01:53:31,359 --> 01:53:33,119
They've got to have a reset, they've got to kind

2244
01:53:33,119 --> 01:53:35,520
of rethink things. They got to recruit new people, they

2245
01:53:35,520 --> 01:53:41,039
got to find new ways to market themselves. And and

2246
01:53:41,119 --> 01:53:44,439
I'm not entirely sure it's going to happen without a

2247
01:53:44,439 --> 01:53:46,720
lot of pain, because I think, you know, for thirty

2248
01:53:46,800 --> 01:53:50,159
years now, we've had a set of financial arrangements.

2249
01:53:49,800 --> 01:53:54,119
Speaker 2: Which are peculiar they're not normal. You know.

2250
01:53:54,159 --> 01:53:56,560
Speaker 3: The rest of the world was kind of just allowing

2251
01:53:56,640 --> 01:53:59,279
us to lead them around, and now they're not. You know,

2252
01:53:59,319 --> 01:54:01,840
so there's a lot of suff going on. And kind

2253
01:54:01,880 --> 01:54:03,560
of get back to what your point was is that

2254
01:54:03,840 --> 01:54:05,880
I don't think they're deliberately laying down. I just don't

2255
01:54:05,880 --> 01:54:07,680
think they have a choice. You know, there's really just

2256
01:54:07,760 --> 01:54:09,239
running out of good options right now.

2257
01:54:11,319 --> 01:54:14,520
Speaker 1: It's actually why, you know, in the grander scheme of things,

2258
01:54:14,520 --> 01:54:18,159
because I really share your analysis there that to me,

2259
01:54:19,880 --> 01:54:22,560
I'm voting for Trump because I have to live here, right.

2260
01:54:23,239 --> 01:54:25,800
There's really nothing past that right, which is in the

2261
01:54:25,800 --> 01:54:28,399
short to medium term, which will make my life better.

2262
01:54:30,439 --> 01:54:35,479
I think that. Don't get me wrong. I love I'd

2263
01:54:35,560 --> 01:54:40,119
love to be proven cynical on this point, right. I'd

2264
01:54:40,119 --> 01:54:42,520
love for in four years me to look back at

2265
01:54:42,520 --> 01:54:45,560
this and say, oh, I can't believe I was so cynical,

2266
01:54:45,600 --> 01:54:47,720
I was so black built. But to me, I don't

2267
01:54:47,720 --> 01:54:52,359
really see Trump fixing this at all. No. What I

2268
01:54:52,399 --> 01:54:58,119
do see as kind of an interesting development is look

2269
01:54:58,159 --> 01:55:01,880
at the people who are ordering Trump right, who kind

2270
01:55:01,880 --> 01:55:06,439
of thrown their weight behind him this election. The last one. Well, okay,

2271
01:55:07,000 --> 01:55:09,920
I mean we have you know he's got a pack back, right,

2272
01:55:09,960 --> 01:55:14,159
he's got Miriam Ayelsen. And I don't like those guys.

2273
01:55:14,199 --> 01:55:18,359
I don't support the causes they do, and fair enough,

2274
01:55:18,800 --> 01:55:22,079
but also you have this kind of new kind of

2275
01:55:22,119 --> 01:55:26,399
tech elite forming behind Trump. You know, obviously the ones

2276
01:55:26,439 --> 01:55:29,680
you always hear about our heel musk, right, those are

2277
01:55:29,840 --> 01:55:32,560
the big ticket guys. Yeah, I think that we've kind

2278
01:55:32,560 --> 01:55:36,000
of forgotten about Vvack Ramaswami, right, who sort of served

2279
01:55:36,039 --> 01:55:38,279
as you know, a Trump stand in, and then as

2280
01:55:38,319 --> 01:55:41,239
soon as Trump announced he was out, Well, you know,

2281
01:55:41,279 --> 01:55:43,560
he drops out of the race. And you know, we

2282
01:55:43,600 --> 01:55:46,399
can see that they have an inside seat because I

2283
01:55:46,399 --> 01:55:49,039
mean that's where Vance comes from. Right, He's connected to

2284
01:55:49,119 --> 01:55:52,800
those guys. Now, you know that goes a little bit deeper, right,

2285
01:55:52,840 --> 01:55:55,239
And actually, this is another reason I think shenanigans are

2286
01:55:55,279 --> 01:55:58,840
less likely. You have Mark Zuckerberg, right, the CEO of Facebook,

2287
01:55:59,079 --> 01:56:03,359
who was very much involved in the last round of shenanigans,

2288
01:56:03,600 --> 01:56:07,439
basically saying just in the last couple of days, one, yes,

2289
01:56:07,520 --> 01:56:10,399
that happened. Two I'm sorry, and one I won't do

2290
01:56:10,439 --> 01:56:12,760
it again. I think I got my numbers wrong there,

2291
01:56:12,760 --> 01:56:16,000
but my point stands. And look, you know this doesn't

2292
01:56:16,000 --> 01:56:19,319
mean that Mark Zuckerberg is suddenly my best friend, but

2293
01:56:19,880 --> 01:56:23,119
it seems like we're seeing a new power block emerge.

2294
01:56:23,560 --> 01:56:23,840
Speaker 2: Now.

2295
01:56:24,199 --> 01:56:26,119
Speaker 1: I don't think this is the sort of power block

2296
01:56:26,199 --> 01:56:30,000
that rejuvenates America, right, that takes us back to this

2297
01:56:30,119 --> 01:56:34,600
kind of golden imperium. But there is there is there's

2298
01:56:34,680 --> 01:56:38,119
competence there, there is energy there, and you know, if

2299
01:56:38,119 --> 01:56:40,680
nothing else, I think that's a that's a sector to watch.

2300
01:56:43,680 --> 01:56:46,159
Speaker 3: Yeah, I completely agree with this. I mean, look, in

2301
01:56:46,239 --> 01:56:48,920
twenty sixteen, Trump had no elite support. There were no

2302
01:56:48,960 --> 01:56:51,159
billionaires signing up for Trump. I mean, I guess maybe

2303
01:56:51,159 --> 01:56:55,319
Peter Thield to some degree, but what a Tale's an

2304
01:56:55,359 --> 01:56:59,119
interesting character. I have some indirect dealings with him, and

2305
01:56:59,479 --> 01:57:03,439
I'm I don't think he's as political politically savvy as

2306
01:57:03,439 --> 01:57:06,000
people think. But that's a topic for another day. But

2307
01:57:07,319 --> 01:57:09,680
you know, Musk, who I think is to a great

2308
01:57:09,720 --> 01:57:14,560
degree politically naive, but he's getting smart fast. But this

2309
01:57:14,600 --> 01:57:18,119
is not a guy who is naive about the kinds

2310
01:57:18,119 --> 01:57:20,359
of people who dominate politics. He's made all his money

2311
01:57:20,399 --> 01:57:22,720
off of politics. People don't realize that. You know, most

2312
01:57:22,760 --> 01:57:26,680
of his fortune comes from doing business with governments and

2313
01:57:27,199 --> 01:57:30,640
getting government favors that the whole you know, tesla wouldn't

2314
01:57:30,640 --> 01:57:33,960
exist without enormous subsidies from government, and not just the

2315
01:57:34,039 --> 01:57:37,840
United States government, the Chinese government, you know, the EU.

2316
01:57:37,960 --> 01:57:40,239
I mean, you know, this is a guy who understands

2317
01:57:40,279 --> 01:57:42,880
the system and how to manipulate it. And I think

2318
01:57:43,119 --> 01:57:47,239
his great concern about what's happening is a signal to

2319
01:57:47,359 --> 01:57:52,720
the other oligarchs that it's okay to start questioning this.

2320
01:57:53,000 --> 01:57:56,600
These hired men we have in the managerial class. What

2321
01:57:56,960 --> 01:57:59,800
the hell are these guys actually doing? And so I

2322
01:57:59,840 --> 01:58:02,800
do think there's something happening here now. It could devolve

2323
01:58:02,880 --> 01:58:06,399
into civil war, it's always a possibility, but it's also

2324
01:58:06,479 --> 01:58:09,920
possible that there's a reform movement of foot Look back

2325
01:58:09,920 --> 01:58:14,119
in the nineteen seventies, wealthy people, corporate interesting was obviously

2326
01:58:14,119 --> 01:58:17,680
a different world. They started to react not to the

2327
01:58:17,680 --> 01:58:21,199
cultural stuff, but to the financial problems. They looked around

2328
01:58:21,239 --> 01:58:24,680
and they saw that the money arrangements in the world

2329
01:58:25,119 --> 01:58:31,319
were a problem. They saw the revolution coming with semiconductors

2330
01:58:31,359 --> 01:58:35,439
and the microprocessor. There's a book I always recommend to people.

2331
01:58:35,439 --> 01:58:37,119
It's called The Money Game, and the guy wrote it

2332
01:58:37,199 --> 01:58:39,520
under a pen name. It's written in the nineteen sixties

2333
01:58:40,039 --> 01:58:43,520
about he wrote under the pend named Adam Smith. You

2334
01:58:43,600 --> 01:58:46,000
read the book, it predicts everything that was going to

2335
01:58:46,039 --> 01:58:49,520
happen with computerization in the financial markets. It's really quite

2336
01:58:49,560 --> 01:58:52,520
as a wild book to read, because you read it,

2337
01:58:52,840 --> 01:58:54,880
you realize it's written in the nineteen sixties and it

2338
01:58:54,960 --> 01:58:58,159
uses a lot of the sort of mad band type language.

2339
01:58:59,199 --> 01:59:02,640
But all thes that about what would happen in the seventies, eighties,

2340
01:59:02,680 --> 01:59:06,119
and nineties are all right there. It's a great insight

2341
01:59:06,159 --> 01:59:08,800
as to how the people at the very top of

2342
01:59:08,840 --> 01:59:10,760
the system do know a hell of a lot more

2343
01:59:10,760 --> 01:59:12,560
about what's coming down the road than the rest of

2344
01:59:12,640 --> 01:59:15,600
us do. And you know, these people saw this and

2345
01:59:15,880 --> 01:59:18,319
they started to react to it, and we ended up

2346
01:59:18,359 --> 01:59:21,640
with the Conservative Revolution with Reagan and all that stuff.

2347
01:59:21,640 --> 01:59:23,920
But we also wound up with a revolution and the

2348
01:59:23,920 --> 01:59:27,399
financial relations. You know, for the money relations of the world.

2349
01:59:27,479 --> 01:59:30,079
You've got the Palace Accords, you got the Louver Accords,

2350
01:59:30,319 --> 01:59:33,359
You've got the what was that nineteen seventy four, you

2351
01:59:33,479 --> 01:59:37,039
got the agreement with the Saudia's that established a petro dollar.

2352
01:59:37,079 --> 01:59:40,079
I mean, these were revolutionary changes. You had the beginning

2353
01:59:40,159 --> 01:59:43,239
of a deregulation that started, we're deregulating.

2354
01:59:43,279 --> 01:59:43,800
Speaker 2: I think it was.

2355
01:59:43,760 --> 01:59:46,760
Speaker 3: First was I think it was Mile Bell got broken up,

2356
01:59:46,760 --> 01:59:48,399
and then the airlines got deregulated.

2357
01:59:48,720 --> 01:59:49,560
Speaker 2: All this stuff happened.

2358
01:59:49,560 --> 01:59:52,439
Speaker 3: It was because the economic elites looked around and said,

2359
01:59:53,159 --> 01:59:55,560
we have a problem. The system that we have is

2360
01:59:55,600 --> 01:59:59,680
not working and it's it's becoming dangerous, and so they

2361
01:59:59,680 --> 02:00:03,119
pushed a huge reforms. And that may be happening now.

2362
02:00:03,159 --> 02:00:05,479
He might be on the cusp of the differences is

2363
02:00:05,520 --> 02:00:08,000
that you know, in nineteen seventies America was a different

2364
02:00:08,039 --> 02:00:14,560
country demographically than twenty twenty twenty four America. So you know,

2365
02:00:14,720 --> 02:00:17,159
it's not a perfect analogy. But but yeah, I mean

2366
02:00:17,199 --> 02:00:21,159
I think I do think that the rich people are concerned.

2367
02:00:21,199 --> 02:00:23,520
I mean, look, if you're Elon Musk, you're a Mark

2368
02:00:23,600 --> 02:00:27,760
zuckerberglar hell, you're you're a guy who's a president of

2369
02:00:27,840 --> 02:00:30,560
a financial institution, you've got to be looking a door

2370
02:00:30,600 --> 02:00:33,680
off getting arrested the guy who runs Telegram in France

2371
02:00:34,159 --> 02:00:37,199
and think we have a real problem. I mean, that

2372
02:00:37,359 --> 02:00:40,279
has got to be sending off loud alarms in every

2373
02:00:40,359 --> 02:00:44,760
mansion around the globe. You don't arrest billionaires like that.

2374
02:00:44,760 --> 02:00:47,560
It just doesn't happen, not in the West, not in

2375
02:00:47,640 --> 02:00:50,159
the It's not supposed to happen that way. Even though

2376
02:00:50,159 --> 02:00:53,039
he's Russian and all that other stuff. It should never

2377
02:00:53,119 --> 02:00:58,520
have happened. They didn't arrest the guy Abramovich who owned them,

2378
02:00:58,960 --> 02:01:01,760
was it? Manchester United had the big the British soccer team.

2379
02:01:01,800 --> 02:01:02,560
Speaker 2: I mean, he's a.

2380
02:01:04,399 --> 02:01:07,560
Speaker 3: Russian oligarch and they didn't arrest him. Why are they

2381
02:01:07,640 --> 02:01:10,479
arrestling this guy? Something's changed, you know, Brazil is now

2382
02:01:10,640 --> 02:01:16,279
threatening Musk over censoring X. So yeah, I mean, I

2383
02:01:16,279 --> 02:01:17,800
mean I've kind of rambled here a little bit, sorry

2384
02:01:17,880 --> 02:01:20,520
on that, but you know, you know, it's a great topic.

2385
02:01:22,760 --> 02:01:27,800
It's something that that I think is happening, but you

2386
02:01:27,840 --> 02:01:29,319
can't be sure where it's going to go. I think

2387
02:01:29,319 --> 02:01:32,960
the economical leads, the oligarchs are becoming increasingly concerned about

2388
02:01:32,960 --> 02:01:34,560
what the hell's going on. And you know, they don't

2389
02:01:34,560 --> 02:01:37,680
worry about transgenderism and all that stuff, but they do

2390
02:01:37,720 --> 02:01:42,079
worry about rich guys being arrested, financial system being shaky,

2391
02:01:43,079 --> 02:01:47,319
the competency of the political class. So yeah, we could

2392
02:01:47,359 --> 02:01:49,800
we could then we could find ourselves in very interesting times.

2393
02:01:50,279 --> 02:01:50,399
Speaker 1: Now.

2394
02:01:50,439 --> 02:01:52,159
Speaker 3: I just wish I was twenty years younger. Because if

2395
02:01:52,159 --> 02:01:53,760
it's going to all fall apart and there's going to

2396
02:01:53,800 --> 02:01:56,520
be a you know, people are going to be running

2397
02:01:56,520 --> 02:01:58,399
around in the streets with guns. I'm too old to

2398
02:01:58,439 --> 02:01:58,880
do that now.

2399
02:02:00,600 --> 02:02:04,199
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think this might be a pair of phraise

2400
02:02:04,239 --> 02:02:06,920
from your show. Right, But you know, there's this idea

2401
02:02:07,000 --> 02:02:09,760
that you know, nothing changes until rich people get hurt.

2402
02:02:10,680 --> 02:02:14,079
And I think that we're we're starting to see that.

2403
02:02:14,359 --> 02:02:17,840
You cited obviously the regime coming after Musk, and I

2404
02:02:17,880 --> 02:02:22,439
really do think that that was was a breakwater moment.

2405
02:02:22,760 --> 02:02:24,359
You know. One of the other names that gets thrown

2406
02:02:24,399 --> 02:02:27,439
around in the mix here is Eric Prince, and Eric

2407
02:02:27,479 --> 02:02:31,159
Prince really got screwed over by the government. You know, obviously,

2408
02:02:31,239 --> 02:02:32,920
you know he's kind of a shady guy. You know,

2409
02:02:32,960 --> 02:02:37,319
he was involved with Blackwater. I have some some personal contacts,

2410
02:02:37,399 --> 02:02:40,479
right who are friends of his, and they speak very

2411
02:02:40,520 --> 02:02:44,920
well of him. But nonetheless, right, take a perfectly neutral

2412
02:02:45,039 --> 02:02:48,840
view of the man. He is extremely wealthy, extremely competent,

2413
02:02:48,880 --> 02:02:52,359
and extremely well connected, and the State Department screwed him

2414
02:02:52,359 --> 02:02:55,760
over for basically no reason, right, They for those who

2415
02:02:55,760 --> 02:02:59,000
aren't familiar. Effectively, the State Department said, hey, can you

2416
02:02:59,039 --> 02:03:02,439
send us some bulletproof vests and then sued him for

2417
02:03:02,680 --> 02:03:05,319
sending them bulletproof vests without their permission.

2418
02:03:05,560 --> 02:03:05,720
Speaker 2: Right.

2419
02:03:05,720 --> 02:03:08,359
Speaker 1: That's effectively what it what took down this company, right,

2420
02:03:08,399 --> 02:03:11,359
which of course is incredibly cough esque and absurd. But

2421
02:03:11,439 --> 02:03:13,439
that's a man who has an ax to grind. The government,

2422
02:03:13,520 --> 02:03:17,439
to put it mildly, now, Musk, who's you know, incredibly

2423
02:03:17,479 --> 02:03:19,720
wealthy and powerful, has an ax to grind. And I

2424
02:03:19,720 --> 02:03:21,640
think one of the reasons you see, you know, all

2425
02:03:21,680 --> 02:03:24,600
of these tech CEOs and again, these finance guys like

2426
02:03:24,960 --> 02:03:27,239
you know, the CEO of Chase Bank, the CEO of

2427
02:03:27,439 --> 02:03:35,119
black Stone I think not black Rock basically aligning behind Trump.

2428
02:03:35,199 --> 02:03:35,359
Speaker 2: Is that.

2429
02:03:35,439 --> 02:03:37,359
Speaker 1: I think for a lot of people, it's this kind

2430
02:03:37,399 --> 02:03:40,000
of looking around saying like, wait a minute, I could

2431
02:03:40,039 --> 02:03:42,159
be next, right, they could come out, they could come

2432
02:03:42,199 --> 02:03:45,960
after me for you know, largely conflated reasons. And like

2433
02:03:46,000 --> 02:03:47,960
you said, I don't know where this goes. I don't

2434
02:03:48,000 --> 02:03:51,479
think any of these people are our guys. But at

2435
02:03:51,479 --> 02:03:54,720
the same time, you know, to be honest, I'd rather

2436
02:03:54,800 --> 02:03:57,880
just have a government that works, you know, that functions

2437
02:03:57,920 --> 02:04:00,319
at the Paris level, so that I don't have to,

2438
02:04:00,920 --> 02:04:04,560
you know, sincerely, worry about you know, my safety or

2439
02:04:04,760 --> 02:04:07,640
you know, things that would be almost you know, unthinkable

2440
02:04:08,000 --> 02:04:09,920
thirty forty years ago in America.

2441
02:04:11,359 --> 02:04:14,119
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I tell you, in my business life,

2442
02:04:15,000 --> 02:04:18,960
I've always kind of chuckled because often deals that that

2443
02:04:19,039 --> 02:04:21,039
I've been involved with, and you know, when I was

2444
02:04:21,039 --> 02:04:23,640
a younger guy in corporate America, I worked on some

2445
02:04:23,680 --> 02:04:26,479
substantial deals and it was weird how they kind of

2446
02:04:26,479 --> 02:04:28,800
took a life of their own in a way, and

2447
02:04:28,800 --> 02:04:31,880
that you went into it. You thought you understood all

2448
02:04:31,880 --> 02:04:34,159
the facets of it. Everybody you were working with thought

2449
02:04:34,199 --> 02:04:38,039
they understood it, and just some just stuff just starts

2450
02:04:38,039 --> 02:04:41,079
to happen, and before long you're not really working on

2451
02:04:41,159 --> 02:04:43,439
the deal you thought you were. You're working on something else.

2452
02:04:43,479 --> 02:04:46,000
Sometimes it gets really big, you know, it becomes more complex,

2453
02:04:47,079 --> 02:04:50,359
and it's just, you know, we as human beings, you know,

2454
02:04:50,359 --> 02:04:53,479
we're limited, and we can't see around corners. We don't

2455
02:04:53,479 --> 02:04:56,000
always see all the facts, and we don't we can't

2456
02:04:56,039 --> 02:04:57,880
think beyond a few moves, and you know, all that

2457
02:04:57,960 --> 02:05:00,439
kind of stuff that people know, and do you see

2458
02:05:00,439 --> 02:05:03,920
this happen In politics? Donald Trump came down that elevator

2459
02:05:03,920 --> 02:05:06,960
in twenty fifteen, not expecting to be president of the

2460
02:05:07,039 --> 02:05:11,600
United States. That was obvious, but he wound up saying

2461
02:05:11,760 --> 02:05:16,439
things about immigration in particular that caught fire. It was

2462
02:05:16,520 --> 02:05:19,000
like he threw a cigarette out of his car and

2463
02:05:19,079 --> 02:05:21,079
set the prairie on fire. I mean, you know, he

2464
02:05:21,119 --> 02:05:23,239
didn't intend to do it. It wasn't what he was thinking about.

2465
02:05:23,279 --> 02:05:26,359
It wasn't a plan. It just sort of happened. My

2466
02:05:26,399 --> 02:05:28,640
analysis of Trump in his first year is that was

2467
02:05:28,840 --> 02:05:30,720
you know, a first term as president.

2468
02:05:30,640 --> 02:05:31,760
Speaker 2: Was he just got swept up.

2469
02:05:31,800 --> 02:05:33,960
Speaker 3: It was he you know, this is a guy who

2470
02:05:34,279 --> 02:05:37,600
had thrived his whole life in chaos, but was unprepared

2471
02:05:37,640 --> 02:05:39,840
for the degree of chaos that had happened. You know,

2472
02:05:39,880 --> 02:05:43,800
this thing that happened, Glenn Youngkin winning the governorship. I

2473
02:05:43,840 --> 02:05:46,880
watched that, and you know, look, I have some idea

2474
02:05:46,960 --> 02:05:50,359
what Glenn Youngkin was like before all of a sudden

2475
02:05:51,039 --> 02:05:53,720
things just kind of took off and he was just

2476
02:05:53,840 --> 02:05:57,359
riding the tiger. And it changes you when you're in

2477
02:05:57,399 --> 02:06:00,119
that kind of circumstance, when all of a sudden, know,

2478
02:06:00,159 --> 02:06:05,319
you you go from zero to one. To quote Peter Thiel,

2479
02:06:06,119 --> 02:06:07,640
it changes how you look.

2480
02:06:07,520 --> 02:06:07,920
Speaker 2: At the world.

2481
02:06:08,119 --> 02:06:10,680
Speaker 3: You you you look at things in a different way,

2482
02:06:10,720 --> 02:06:12,520
You look at yourself in a different way. And I

2483
02:06:12,560 --> 02:06:15,560
think that's happening with Musk. I think it certainly happened

2484
02:06:15,600 --> 02:06:17,319
with Trump. I think it's happened a second time with

2485
02:06:17,319 --> 02:06:20,199
Trump when he got shot. I think that changed his

2486
02:06:20,720 --> 02:06:24,119
demeanor since then has been different, and you can see it.

2487
02:06:24,640 --> 02:06:28,239
He's much more serious and he maybe overthinking things a

2488
02:06:28,279 --> 02:06:30,159
little bit. But you know, I think he had that

2489
02:06:30,239 --> 02:06:32,960
moment where he realized that, hey, wait a second, I'm

2490
02:06:33,000 --> 02:06:36,960
a part I'm a world historical figure. My life now

2491
02:06:37,000 --> 02:06:39,279
has meaning beyond just being good at the stuff I

2492
02:06:39,359 --> 02:06:42,319
enjoy being good at. And I think, you know, that's

2493
02:06:42,399 --> 02:06:44,239
that could be what happens with us as a country

2494
02:06:44,239 --> 02:06:46,199
as a whole. All these rich guys are looking around,

2495
02:06:46,279 --> 02:06:51,439
they're seeing these problems. They look at the the rampant dishonesty.

2496
02:06:51,560 --> 02:06:54,960
You know, this arresting of Dora Off. I cannot believe

2497
02:06:55,000 --> 02:06:57,880
they did that. That is such an insanely stupid idea,

2498
02:06:58,880 --> 02:07:00,720
because it's not I mean, who cares do who cares

2499
02:07:00,720 --> 02:07:02,960
about telegram but went away? The world wouldn't change that much.

2500
02:07:03,479 --> 02:07:06,239
It's the symbolism of it. It's what it appears to be,

2501
02:07:07,039 --> 02:07:09,560
and there's so many things like that, and it's it's

2502
02:07:09,760 --> 02:07:14,800
representative of this sort of dishonesty of the managerial class.

2503
02:07:15,640 --> 02:07:18,279
And you know, we look at these people as our bosses.

2504
02:07:18,359 --> 02:07:21,399
But the rich guys, the oligarchs, the guys like Elon Musk,

2505
02:07:21,479 --> 02:07:23,640
the guys like Mark Zuckerberger, they look at these people

2506
02:07:23,680 --> 02:07:25,920
as their employees, and all of a sudden they find

2507
02:07:26,159 --> 02:07:29,159
You know, it's imagine yourself. You're running a company and

2508
02:07:29,439 --> 02:07:31,520
you know all the guys who or you're not running

2509
02:07:31,520 --> 02:07:33,600
the company, you own the company, and you have a

2510
02:07:33,640 --> 02:07:36,560
meeting with all your C level people and they're all

2511
02:07:36,600 --> 02:07:38,920
they're all lying to you. You know what do you do? Well,

2512
02:07:38,960 --> 02:07:40,920
you get rid of all of them. You start you

2513
02:07:40,920 --> 02:07:42,680
start thinking about how I get rid of all of them,

2514
02:07:42,680 --> 02:07:44,680
and I bring new people in. And that may be

2515
02:07:44,800 --> 02:07:46,880
what's happening with a lot of these guys, because of

2516
02:07:46,920 --> 02:07:51,439
the constant lying, the dishonesty, the unwillingness to abide by

2517
02:07:51,479 --> 02:07:55,159
the rules. So you know, I mean, we could again,

2518
02:07:55,199 --> 02:07:58,520
we could be in for some very interesting times. And

2519
02:07:58,880 --> 02:08:02,960
you know what I mean, You know, you know it

2520
02:08:03,000 --> 02:08:07,439
may be, it may be necessary. You know, interesting times

2521
02:08:07,520 --> 02:08:09,680
might be the kind of thing that fixes a lot

2522
02:08:09,720 --> 02:08:13,000
of the spiritual and cultural problems that we have you know,

2523
02:08:13,039 --> 02:08:15,880
you see you know, you see this stuff too. You know,

2524
02:08:15,920 --> 02:08:19,199
people talking about the fertility raid and the loss of

2525
02:08:19,279 --> 02:08:22,399
community and social capital breaking down and all that. You know,

2526
02:08:22,439 --> 02:08:26,359
maybe we need a really serious crisis that focuses everyone's

2527
02:08:26,399 --> 02:08:29,920
mind on what's important and and a ruling class that

2528
02:08:30,600 --> 02:08:32,640
is is doing it at the same time we are.

2529
02:08:32,960 --> 02:08:35,319
You know, maybe that's just a necessary thing to have

2530
02:08:35,359 --> 02:08:39,239
the renewal that we're going to need, not just as

2531
02:08:39,239 --> 02:08:41,039
a country, but as a civilization.

2532
02:08:42,960 --> 02:08:46,000
Speaker 1: I thought the same thing that you know, there's this

2533
02:08:46,159 --> 02:08:49,560
desire to sort of you know, have your cake and

2534
02:08:49,640 --> 02:08:53,800
eat it too, right, this desire to to go to

2535
02:08:53,920 --> 02:08:58,800
become you know, a vitalistic, living society again without going

2536
02:08:58,840 --> 02:09:02,439
through anything unpleasant. I'm not entirely sure that that's that's

2537
02:09:02,520 --> 02:09:06,640
how it works, right, forgive me for a minute, right,

2538
02:09:07,640 --> 02:09:10,319
but this is something that you see all the time

2539
02:09:10,960 --> 02:09:13,359
in you know, both the entire Western canon, right, but

2540
02:09:13,399 --> 02:09:17,760
then in scripture. Right. This idea that you know that

2541
02:09:17,800 --> 02:09:21,479
the people kind of falls away from, you know, the path, right,

2542
02:09:21,520 --> 02:09:24,600
They they reject God. They you know, they they do

2543
02:09:24,720 --> 02:09:27,960
something shameful and they need to atone for that. Right,

2544
02:09:27,960 --> 02:09:30,680
There's a blood price that needs to be paid, and

2545
02:09:30,880 --> 02:09:32,560
I don't want to take this into an overly chin

2546
02:09:32,560 --> 02:09:35,279
stroking direction, but I think that that that applies to

2547
02:09:35,359 --> 02:09:37,920
us as well. You know that these sort of interesting

2548
02:09:38,000 --> 02:09:41,359
times are probably the only way we get to a

2549
02:09:41,399 --> 02:09:44,359
society that has a reason to exist again. And I

2550
02:09:44,399 --> 02:09:48,079
think that, you know, the kind of like endless chanting

2551
02:09:48,119 --> 02:09:51,800
about seventeen seventy six shall commence again from the you know,

2552
02:09:51,840 --> 02:09:55,359
the sort of the the morbidly obese boomers. I think

2553
02:09:55,359 --> 02:09:59,600
it's probably a little bit of wishful thinking, But ze Man,

2554
02:09:59,600 --> 02:10:03,239
we you're coming up on time. I really enjoyed this conversation.

2555
02:10:03,359 --> 02:10:05,680
It was went different places than I thought, and I

2556
02:10:06,000 --> 02:10:08,560
enjoyed it quite a bit. But if people want to

2557
02:10:08,600 --> 02:10:11,159
find more of your you and and your work, what's

2558
02:10:11,159 --> 02:10:12,159
a good way for them to do so?

2559
02:10:12,920 --> 02:10:14,880
Speaker 3: Just go to the z man dot com. That's the

2560
02:10:14,920 --> 02:10:16,840
easiest place. So all my links are there. I even

2561
02:10:16,880 --> 02:10:20,079
have links to John Derbyshire stuff. He's one of the

2562
02:10:20,079 --> 02:10:22,800
the old graybeards who I have a trends amount of

2563
02:10:22,800 --> 02:10:25,319
respect for. I wouldn't be here without John Derbyshire, so

2564
02:10:25,960 --> 02:10:27,640
I have. I am now that a v there went

2565
02:10:27,680 --> 02:10:31,880
out of business, I'm now uh supporting and distributing John's

2566
02:10:32,159 --> 02:10:34,960
weekly podcast. And if you want to hear a you know,

2567
02:10:35,000 --> 02:10:37,159
a real old head, a guy who's been at this,

2568
02:10:37,359 --> 02:10:39,960
the guy who actually coined the term dissident.

2569
02:10:40,039 --> 02:10:40,199
Speaker 2: Right.

2570
02:10:41,000 --> 02:10:42,840
Speaker 3: Uh, if you if you want to know what the

2571
02:10:42,880 --> 02:10:44,760
old guys are thinking, then just go to the z

2572
02:10:44,880 --> 02:10:47,159
man dot com and I put his show up every

2573
02:10:47,159 --> 02:10:47,840
Saturday morning.

2574
02:10:48,840 --> 02:10:51,119
Speaker 1: Well, be sure to link to that. I actually didn't

2575
02:10:51,239 --> 02:10:54,439
realize you were you were publishing his work. Now I'm

2576
02:10:54,520 --> 02:10:57,880
not as familiar with his, uh this sort of recent work,

2577
02:10:57,960 --> 02:10:59,920
but you know there there are a couple of John Derbyshire,

2578
02:11:00,399 --> 02:11:03,479
you know, essays that are all time classics. I'm definitely

2579
02:11:03,479 --> 02:11:06,600
gonna have to check that out. All right, ze man,

2580
02:11:06,640 --> 02:11:07,800
welcome back to the Jay Burton Show.

2581
02:11:07,800 --> 02:11:10,079
Speaker 2: How you doing, man, I'm doing very good. Thank you

2582
02:11:10,119 --> 02:11:10,560
for having me.

2583
02:11:11,640 --> 02:11:14,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm glad to have you back on. I always

2584
02:11:14,319 --> 02:11:18,079
enjoy our conversations quite a bit. And I will say

2585
02:11:18,119 --> 02:11:21,960
for my audience, the technical issue has been solved, so

2586
02:11:22,039 --> 02:11:24,680
you will be hearing me out of two ears instead

2587
02:11:24,680 --> 02:11:28,119
of only one. Sorry about that. Just had some hardware

2588
02:11:28,159 --> 02:11:31,239
issues that have been resolved. But obviously I'm not just

2589
02:11:31,279 --> 02:11:33,399
here to talk about my inability to make a podcast

2590
02:11:33,439 --> 02:11:36,760
after almost three hundred episodes. I'm here to talk with

2591
02:11:36,760 --> 02:11:40,159
with using men about kind of the current state of

2592
02:11:40,199 --> 02:11:44,840
things right, because I think one of the most interesting

2593
02:11:44,920 --> 02:11:49,960
developments of the Trump presidency has been this kind of

2594
02:11:49,960 --> 02:11:54,239
bizarre divide among our circles where either, you know, you

2595
02:11:54,279 --> 02:11:58,119
see people who have essentially been brought back into the fold, right,

2596
02:11:58,159 --> 02:12:01,600
they are full on you know, Republicans. Trump is going

2597
02:12:01,680 --> 02:12:03,840
to say it to save the world. Trump is going

2598
02:12:03,920 --> 02:12:08,000
to you know, get us to that ideal state. Or alternately,

2599
02:12:08,039 --> 02:12:10,199
and I think you see this, particularly among the the

2600
02:12:10,199 --> 02:12:13,039
European chapter of the right, this kind of endless doom

2601
02:12:13,039 --> 02:12:17,520
and gloom. Right old zion Don is back. And that's

2602
02:12:17,560 --> 02:12:19,760
not really how I view things, right. I view this

2603
02:12:19,960 --> 02:12:23,880
as you know, well, certainly a win a conditional one,

2604
02:12:23,920 --> 02:12:28,159
it's not the end. And I'm curious, right, where do

2605
02:12:28,159 --> 02:12:30,800
you find yourself falling and what do you see as

2606
02:12:30,840 --> 02:12:32,560
being kind of the relevant developments.

2607
02:12:34,079 --> 02:12:38,560
Speaker 3: Well, you know what, broadly speaking, right wing politics or

2608
02:12:38,600 --> 02:12:40,800
what we call the right in the United States has

2609
02:12:40,840 --> 02:12:45,760
always had an element of people who like being a

2610
02:12:45,800 --> 02:12:48,680
medium sized fish in a very small pond, you know,

2611
02:12:48,680 --> 02:12:51,479
they carve out these sort of little sort of subcultures

2612
02:12:51,520 --> 02:12:54,239
where you know, they get to be the star of

2613
02:12:54,319 --> 02:12:57,399
the event that has twenty five people show up, or

2614
02:12:57,439 --> 02:13:01,479
you know, the online group that has you know, fifty

2615
02:13:01,520 --> 02:13:04,000
people who listen to the live stream, that kind of stuff,

2616
02:13:04,600 --> 02:13:08,159
and you know, they often act like the kinds of

2617
02:13:08,159 --> 02:13:12,640
people who found a new band or a cool little restaurant.

2618
02:13:12,800 --> 02:13:15,199
You know, they they love the fact that nobody goes

2619
02:13:15,239 --> 02:13:17,159
there or nobody really listens to it, and so once

2620
02:13:17,199 --> 02:13:19,359
it starts getting popular, they feel as if, oh, well

2621
02:13:19,359 --> 02:13:21,079
it's sold out. It's not the same as it used

2622
02:13:21,079 --> 02:13:23,399
to be. That's how I look at a lot of

2623
02:13:23,439 --> 02:13:26,079
this politics. I mean, because look, many of the things

2624
02:13:26,119 --> 02:13:30,560
that were only said in you know, band live streams

2625
02:13:30,560 --> 02:13:33,680
and band in that places are now coming out of

2626
02:13:33,720 --> 02:13:35,800
the mouths of the you know, the president, the vice

2627
02:13:35,840 --> 02:13:37,880
president and his people. I mean, you know, some of

2628
02:13:37,880 --> 02:13:40,000
the things that jd. Vance says were things that got

2629
02:13:40,000 --> 02:13:43,000
you thrown off a Twitter five, six, seven years ago.

2630
02:13:43,479 --> 02:13:46,319
So you know, there's a there's a lot of good

2631
02:13:46,359 --> 02:13:48,119
stuff happening, but these people look at that and they

2632
02:13:48,800 --> 02:13:51,479
you know, they you know, they just they don't want

2633
02:13:51,479 --> 02:13:53,760
to be winners. I hate to use that word, but

2634
02:13:54,000 --> 02:13:56,119
you know, they because they there's some part of their

2635
02:13:56,159 --> 02:14:00,000
identity is in failure, and you know, there's a beautiful loser.

2636
02:14:00,079 --> 02:14:01,800
I mean, this is what San Francis brought about a

2637
02:14:01,840 --> 02:14:04,880
million years ago. And you know that it's it's the

2638
02:14:04,920 --> 02:14:07,119
people who just sort of want to cling on to

2639
02:14:07,439 --> 02:14:11,520
either their tiny little piece or maybe they cling.

2640
02:14:11,319 --> 02:14:12,000
Speaker 2: Onto the past.

2641
02:14:12,159 --> 02:14:14,600
Speaker 3: You know that that's you know, that's just who they are,

2642
02:14:14,960 --> 02:14:17,039
and so success really is actually the worst thing that

2643
02:14:17,079 --> 02:14:19,239
can happen to them. But there's also people I think

2644
02:14:19,239 --> 02:14:22,800
they just have an obsession over one particular issue and

2645
02:14:23,079 --> 02:14:24,479
you can never be satisfied with it.

2646
02:14:24,399 --> 02:14:26,119
Speaker 2: It's a very weird thing. You know.

2647
02:14:26,199 --> 02:14:29,359
Speaker 3: Trump, when it comes to our greatest ally, he gives

2648
02:14:29,399 --> 02:14:31,359
a lot of lip service, but he doesn't deliver a

2649
02:14:31,640 --> 02:14:35,199
If you actually read the Israeli news or listen to

2650
02:14:35,239 --> 02:14:38,439
some of the Israelis, they kind of think Trump is

2651
02:14:38,479 --> 02:14:43,239
selling them a you know, a a false promise. You know,

2652
02:14:43,479 --> 02:14:46,000
they don't they don't really think that Trump actually delivers

2653
02:14:46,079 --> 02:14:46,800
much for them.

2654
02:14:47,000 --> 02:14:47,960
Speaker 2: And it's odd in a way.

2655
02:14:48,000 --> 02:14:49,920
Speaker 3: You know, the people who always complaining about Trump and

2656
02:14:50,000 --> 02:14:52,920
our side, you know in America, complaining, oh Trump never

2657
02:14:52,960 --> 02:14:53,800
follows through with stuff.

2658
02:14:53,840 --> 02:14:55,079
Speaker 2: Well, you know, we're not the only ones.

2659
02:14:55,119 --> 02:14:56,880
Speaker 3: He kind of gyps every once in a while, you know,

2660
02:14:57,119 --> 02:15:00,760
over selling things. But you know, if your only issue,

2661
02:15:00,800 --> 02:15:02,439
the only thing you care about, is getting up in

2662
02:15:02,479 --> 02:15:04,279
the morning and finding out what's going on with Israel,

2663
02:15:04,359 --> 02:15:07,720
well you're never gonna be happy. So you know, there's

2664
02:15:07,840 --> 02:15:10,119
those are those two kinds of groups. But I also

2665
02:15:10,159 --> 02:15:12,760
I think there's people who just don't I don't really

2666
02:15:12,800 --> 02:15:16,239
think they understand the nature of the problem. We're not

2667
02:15:16,760 --> 02:15:20,439
changing policy here. We need to change a culture and

2668
02:15:20,520 --> 02:15:23,239
an economy, a political economy.

2669
02:15:23,239 --> 02:15:24,000
Speaker 2: In Washington.

2670
02:15:24,359 --> 02:15:27,479
Speaker 3: You know this whole blob business where you had forty

2671
02:15:27,520 --> 02:15:31,279
billion dollars of USA money, tens of billions of dollars,

2672
02:15:31,319 --> 02:15:34,319
probably as much, maybe forty fifty billion dollars coming out

2673
02:15:34,359 --> 02:15:38,600
of individual agencies as grants and subscriptions and all kinds

2674
02:15:38,640 --> 02:15:41,159
of ways to send taxpayer money into these not for

2675
02:15:41,239 --> 02:15:45,560
profits and NGOs and think tanks and media companies. And

2676
02:15:45,600 --> 02:15:47,399
then you know they use a lot of this money

2677
02:15:47,600 --> 02:15:51,560
to harvest and control the private money. I mean, you're

2678
02:15:51,560 --> 02:15:53,560
talking about one hundred billion dollars a year. I mean,

2679
02:15:53,920 --> 02:15:56,880
this is an enormous amount of money feeding into this system,

2680
02:15:57,000 --> 02:16:01,720
all of which was used to bribe politicians control the media,

2681
02:16:02,159 --> 02:16:06,159
control access to power, to fund people who run around

2682
02:16:06,239 --> 02:16:09,119
looking for you know, oh my goodness, this ze man

2683
02:16:09,239 --> 02:16:12,239
said something untoward to this group. Ah, you know, let's

2684
02:16:12,319 --> 02:16:14,199
let's have let's destroy his life. You know, let's go

2685
02:16:14,239 --> 02:16:16,199
after this guy. You know, all the doxing people, all

2686
02:16:16,279 --> 02:16:18,720
these guys that we're all funded with this stuff and

2687
02:16:19,119 --> 02:16:22,760
going after that political economy is huge. That is an

2688
02:16:22,880 --> 02:16:25,880
enormous change, because I mean, that's why everyone's terrified in

2689
02:16:26,000 --> 02:16:30,279
Washington right now. And once you dismantled, you you stick

2690
02:16:30,319 --> 02:16:32,440
the you know, a knife through the you know, you

2691
02:16:32,479 --> 02:16:34,079
put the ice pick in the head of the blob,

2692
02:16:34,319 --> 02:16:36,719
so to speak, all of a sudden, lots of other

2693
02:16:36,760 --> 02:16:39,680
things become possible. The world really does change, but it's

2694
02:16:39,680 --> 02:16:41,280
not going to change over night. It just means that

2695
02:16:41,319 --> 02:16:44,479
you now have an opportunity to organize and work hard

2696
02:16:44,520 --> 02:16:46,879
and try and you know, affect change. I Mean, the

2697
02:16:46,879 --> 02:16:50,040
biggest problem we've had over the last thirty years, probably

2698
02:16:51,000 --> 02:16:54,159
most of my adult lifetime, is that there is been

2699
02:16:54,239 --> 02:16:56,479
there's been no way for normal people to participate in

2700
02:16:56,520 --> 02:16:59,200
politics and get a positive result. You can vote yourself silly,

2701
02:16:59,239 --> 02:17:00,959
and you just kept get the same crap over and

2702
02:17:01,000 --> 02:17:03,680
over again, all all of a sudden things are starting

2703
02:17:03,719 --> 02:17:07,079
to change. You can you can actually expect something other

2704
02:17:07,120 --> 02:17:09,920
than the usual crap. There's a lot of good stuff here.

2705
02:17:09,959 --> 02:17:11,840
But you know, there's always a lot of people who

2706
02:17:11,840 --> 02:17:14,600
just don't understand that. They you know, they they look

2707
02:17:14,600 --> 02:17:17,239
and say, well, Trump promised mass deportations. They don't know

2708
02:17:17,280 --> 02:17:19,719
what that really looks like, but they feel they're not

2709
02:17:19,760 --> 02:17:22,879
getting it, so he ripped us off again, you know. So,

2710
02:17:23,239 --> 02:17:25,479
I mean, there's always gonna be that element. There's always

2711
02:17:25,520 --> 02:17:27,719
gonna be people who like that. But I think most

2712
02:17:27,760 --> 02:17:32,200
people understand that we're we're in the middle of something different.

2713
02:17:32,280 --> 02:17:35,000
This is very different. It's I don't want to use

2714
02:17:35,000 --> 02:17:37,440
the word revolution, but i'll I mean, there are things

2715
02:17:37,479 --> 02:17:40,559
happening now that I remember Paleocon's talking about when I

2716
02:17:40,639 --> 02:17:42,600
was a young man, which trust me, was a long

2717
02:17:42,639 --> 02:17:46,319
time ago, and no one has ever thought more possible.

2718
02:17:46,680 --> 02:17:48,879
I mean, they'd laid off ninety percent of the staff

2719
02:17:48,879 --> 02:17:50,120
at the Department of Education.

2720
02:17:50,319 --> 02:17:51,440
Speaker 2: I mean, Republicans have been.

2721
02:17:51,440 --> 02:17:54,600
Speaker 3: Running on that for the Live camp probably since Jimmy Carter,

2722
02:17:55,399 --> 02:17:56,920
and all of a sudden this happened. Now, it doesn't

2723
02:17:56,920 --> 02:17:59,319
mean that they you know, saved all two hundred and

2724
02:17:59,319 --> 02:18:00,920
thirty billion dollars or whatever.

2725
02:18:01,239 --> 02:18:03,000
Speaker 2: And most of it is student loans.

2726
02:18:03,000 --> 02:18:06,319
Speaker 3: But still, I mean, there's a lot of good stuff happening,

2727
02:18:06,360 --> 02:18:08,239
and you know, we'll see what happens. Well, we'll see

2728
02:18:08,239 --> 02:18:11,360
if it actually goes and continues on the direction it is.

2729
02:18:11,399 --> 02:18:16,079
But now, if you're not feeling pretty chipper about the

2730
02:18:16,120 --> 02:18:20,040
state of things, you'll never be happy. You're someone who

2731
02:18:20,079 --> 02:18:21,760
will just be miserable for the rest of your life.

2732
02:18:23,559 --> 02:18:26,920
Speaker 1: Well, and I'm glad you you brought up, you know,

2733
02:18:26,959 --> 02:18:30,159
that idea of in changing what is perceived to be possible,

2734
02:18:30,799 --> 02:18:35,000
because one of the really the strongest weapons in our

2735
02:18:35,079 --> 02:18:39,360
enemies arsenal is the ability to set the null hypothesis right,

2736
02:18:39,479 --> 02:18:42,959
what is seen as you know, normal and acceptable and

2737
02:18:43,000 --> 02:18:46,319
if anything right. British politician Tony Blair was a master

2738
02:18:46,399 --> 02:18:49,680
of this, where he would basically push for some radical

2739
02:18:49,799 --> 02:18:52,719
change but cast it as if you know this is

2740
02:18:52,760 --> 02:18:56,280
simply you know that the decision has been made, right,

2741
02:18:56,360 --> 02:18:59,879
the conversation is already over and you know you see

2742
02:19:00,159 --> 02:19:03,000
in the way, for instance, that the UK banned guns, right,

2743
02:19:03,120 --> 02:19:06,600
it's he expressed that as if you know that was

2744
02:19:06,639 --> 02:19:09,319
an issue that had already been decided. Right, the voice

2745
02:19:09,360 --> 02:19:12,959
of history has spoken, and this is done. And you know,

2746
02:19:13,000 --> 02:19:15,040
for a long time, this is something Republicans have been

2747
02:19:15,040 --> 02:19:17,840
fighting up against. Right. You can you know see over

2748
02:19:17,879 --> 02:19:21,120
and over and over again. You know where Republicans effectively

2749
02:19:21,200 --> 02:19:25,840
have you know, adopted the framework of their enemies. Right, Okay,

2750
02:19:25,840 --> 02:19:28,920
well this is already decided. Roe versus Weight is already decided.

2751
02:19:29,000 --> 02:19:33,319
We're simply managing you know, everything after that point. And

2752
02:19:33,680 --> 02:19:35,639
you know, the ability to you know, as as the

2753
02:19:35,680 --> 02:19:39,920
meme says, right, simply do things is is huge, Right,

2754
02:19:40,000 --> 02:19:43,239
I sort of echo your your your points about Israel.

2755
02:19:43,280 --> 02:19:48,200
To me, look like obviously that is a heavily embedded

2756
02:19:48,239 --> 02:19:50,680
interest group, right, you know, one of the most powerful

2757
02:19:50,680 --> 02:19:52,879
lobbies has you know, John u Er Schuchmer will tell you,

2758
02:19:53,719 --> 02:19:57,920
but it is not the sole determinate factor in politics, right,

2759
02:19:58,159 --> 02:20:00,559
That is not you know, it's not like you solve

2760
02:20:00,639 --> 02:20:04,239
that issue and then everything goes away. It's a complicated system.

2761
02:20:04,920 --> 02:20:07,680
And to me, right, I keep going back to, you know,

2762
02:20:07,719 --> 02:20:10,879
the the binary choice, however much a choice that was,

2763
02:20:10,959 --> 02:20:13,840
is you know, up for debate between you know, Harris

2764
02:20:13,879 --> 02:20:16,920
and Trump, and look is someone who actually lives here,

2765
02:20:18,040 --> 02:20:20,600
I don't regret my choice. Right, that was a pretty

2766
02:20:20,639 --> 02:20:24,120
easy choice to make. And you know you mentioned the

2767
02:20:24,879 --> 02:20:28,440
in the incredible you know, corruption of all of this, right,

2768
02:20:28,520 --> 02:20:32,319
the fact that you know, most of the opposition to

2769
02:20:32,600 --> 02:20:36,719
things that we think was not organic. It wasn't real,

2770
02:20:36,879 --> 02:20:39,159
It wasn't you know, as it has often presented the

2771
02:20:39,239 --> 02:20:43,680
inevitable conclusion to that argument. Uh, it was simply right,

2772
02:20:43,760 --> 02:20:47,840
government fiat, they just gave money to people who had

2773
02:20:48,040 --> 02:20:50,879
views that they liked. Right, the BBC got money, Axios

2774
02:20:50,959 --> 02:20:54,440
got money, as you mentioned. But you know, even even

2775
02:20:54,479 --> 02:20:57,559
people like Politico right, who is in charge of so

2776
02:20:57,680 --> 02:21:01,559
called fact checking. And to me, right, it very much

2777
02:21:01,639 --> 02:21:05,440
reminds me of you know, courtesy Arvin's point, you know,

2778
02:21:05,479 --> 02:21:08,600
where he says, you know, people people look at scans,

2779
02:21:08,959 --> 02:21:12,559
at this, at the Soviet system, but you know, really

2780
02:21:12,600 --> 02:21:16,319
we live in an economy or a society that's just

2781
02:21:16,399 --> 02:21:19,360
as much controlled by the government. And people laughed at

2782
02:21:19,399 --> 02:21:21,079
him right back in two thousand and eight when he

2783
02:21:21,120 --> 02:21:23,680
wrote it. But you know, you look at the receipts

2784
02:21:23,879 --> 02:21:25,559
and it turns out that you know, he may have

2785
02:21:25,559 --> 02:21:28,520
been underestimating it, right. It turns out that literally almost

2786
02:21:28,520 --> 02:21:31,479
all of these people are getting you know, hundreds of

2787
02:21:31,479 --> 02:21:33,639
thousands of dollars. Like the example that comes to mind

2788
02:21:33,760 --> 02:21:38,559
is Christianity Today, right, one of these kind of like

2789
02:21:38,920 --> 02:21:44,280
left leaning evangelical newspapers. And you know that this organization

2790
02:21:44,479 --> 02:21:48,000
swung hard to the left, you know, really post twenty

2791
02:21:48,040 --> 02:21:51,440
twenty and you'll never get what guess what happened just

2792
02:21:51,479 --> 02:21:55,719
before that? They got two million dollars from the federal government. Right,

2793
02:21:55,760 --> 02:21:59,079
It's it's amazing, how uh how that strategy works?

2794
02:21:59,200 --> 02:21:59,360
Speaker 2: Right?

2795
02:22:01,200 --> 02:22:04,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know the environmental groups were all bright paid

2796
02:22:04,440 --> 02:22:07,399
off with donor money. You know, you know it all

2797
02:22:07,440 --> 02:22:10,040
this stuff is it gets laundered. You know, I wrote

2798
02:22:10,040 --> 02:22:12,440
about this ten years ago, maybe I don't know, it's

2799
02:22:12,440 --> 02:22:16,479
been a long time now, but about how this laundering works. Now,

2800
02:22:16,520 --> 02:22:18,280
I think I did a show on this recently about

2801
02:22:18,399 --> 02:22:20,840
how this but I don't know, you know, honestly I

2802
02:22:21,200 --> 02:22:23,120
produced much content. I kind of lose track of what

2803
02:22:23,159 --> 02:22:27,319
the hell I'm doing sometimes, But you know, there's this

2804
02:22:28,079 --> 02:22:31,440
money laundering is really what this system was. No one

2805
02:22:31,520 --> 02:22:34,280
really could know for sure, so it felt like community

2806
02:22:34,319 --> 02:22:37,200
money to people. One of the weird things about and

2807
02:22:37,200 --> 02:22:39,399
this was true in the Soviet Union, and honestly it

2808
02:22:39,440 --> 02:22:43,479
was true in pre revolutionary France, you see these phenomena

2809
02:22:43,559 --> 02:22:47,000
show up where all of a sudden, a culture and

2810
02:22:47,319 --> 02:22:50,280
there's everywhere around you in the elite is social proof,

2811
02:22:50,840 --> 02:22:53,680
and it just feels like you have no choice but

2812
02:22:53,840 --> 02:22:58,239
to go along with what everybody else is doing. And

2813
02:22:58,280 --> 02:23:00,440
because it seems like, well, you know, you're getting finance

2814
02:23:00,479 --> 02:23:02,360
from this guy and he thinks this, And you're getting

2815
02:23:02,399 --> 02:23:04,079
a job maybe from this guy and he thinks this.

2816
02:23:04,120 --> 02:23:06,600
You know, everywhere you turn, everything you count on in

2817
02:23:06,680 --> 02:23:09,280
terms of your lifestyle and how you live your life

2818
02:23:10,040 --> 02:23:13,040
is it seems, you know, all these sources all seem

2819
02:23:13,079 --> 02:23:14,840
to be on the same page. Well it turns out

2820
02:23:14,840 --> 02:23:16,719
that they're all being paid by the same source, so

2821
02:23:16,879 --> 02:23:19,040
sure they are, but it doesn't seem that way to you. You know,

2822
02:23:19,280 --> 02:23:21,520
if these people were actually getting a direct government check

2823
02:23:21,600 --> 02:23:25,079
instead of getting uh, you know, support from people who

2824
02:23:25,120 --> 02:23:26,840
seem to be their friends, they probably would have been

2825
02:23:27,120 --> 02:23:29,440
some of them would have been more suspicious. But it

2826
02:23:29,600 --> 02:23:31,879
just kind of feels like, hey, everybody's doing this, and

2827
02:23:31,879 --> 02:23:34,399
it's you know, the social proof that that's developed around it.

2828
02:23:34,399 --> 02:23:36,600
It's exactly how the Soviet system work. I had this

2829
02:23:36,639 --> 02:23:39,799
thing called the embankment instead of apartments that were up

2830
02:23:39,840 --> 02:23:44,200
on this hill and on the river in Moscow and

2831
02:23:44,360 --> 02:23:47,280
all the apparach next to the new class. They live

2832
02:23:47,360 --> 02:23:50,239
there and it became a part, you know, they became

2833
02:23:50,280 --> 02:23:53,239
a new class. They got class consciousness. And then literally

2834
02:23:53,319 --> 02:23:56,040
is what's happened in Washington. It's the embankment. Now it's this,

2835
02:23:56,280 --> 02:23:58,639
you know, or Versai. There's another example, you know, where

2836
02:23:58,680 --> 02:24:02,120
all the royals, all the aristocrats live in this one area,

2837
02:24:02,399 --> 02:24:05,159
isolated from everyone else, and so it's very easy to

2838
02:24:05,200 --> 02:24:08,680
control the mental space they live in. And that really

2839
02:24:08,719 --> 02:24:10,799
is what's happened in Washington. That's why, you know all

2840
02:24:10,879 --> 02:24:12,000
these right wing people.

2841
02:24:12,200 --> 02:24:13,959
Speaker 2: So was the right wing people, and they would.

2842
02:24:13,760 --> 02:24:17,319
Speaker 3: Start out working for a National Review or the Federalist

2843
02:24:17,440 --> 02:24:21,719
or you know, CATO or you know these different operations,

2844
02:24:21,760 --> 02:24:24,479
you know, and before long they're at the Washington Post

2845
02:24:24,520 --> 02:24:26,360
of the New York Times sounding just like the people

2846
02:24:26,399 --> 02:24:28,959
they used to oppose, like, how how is this happening? Well,

2847
02:24:29,000 --> 02:24:31,799
they're all their friends. They just evolved with their friends.

2848
02:24:31,920 --> 02:24:35,520
I mean Patu Cannan talked about this back nineteen ninety two.

2849
02:24:35,719 --> 02:24:38,879
Is famous or family famous at the time, he said,

2850
02:24:38,879 --> 02:24:41,239
you know, your electric congressman he goes to Washington. Before

2851
02:24:41,280 --> 02:24:43,520
long he turns into a native of Washington. And that's

2852
02:24:43,559 --> 02:24:47,159
exactly what's been happening. But it was all made possible

2853
02:24:47,200 --> 02:24:51,959
by billions and billions and billions of taxpayer dollars financing

2854
02:24:52,079 --> 02:24:55,840
this political economy that was Washington. And it's going to

2855
02:24:55,879 --> 02:24:58,639
be interesting to watch. And when you're talking about laying

2856
02:24:58,639 --> 02:25:00,799
off twenty percent of the federal work course, which is

2857
02:25:00,840 --> 02:25:03,639
what they're what they're actually doing right now, they're laying

2858
02:25:03,719 --> 02:25:07,280
off a lot of people, but also piercing this you know,

2859
02:25:07,440 --> 02:25:10,600
this blob and draining money out of it. I mean,

2860
02:25:10,799 --> 02:25:14,000
you know, I've often said that every mortgage payment in Washington,

2861
02:25:14,120 --> 02:25:18,040
every college tuition payment, every quality college loan payment, every

2862
02:25:18,639 --> 02:25:21,639
opportunity to get your kids into a good private school,

2863
02:25:22,120 --> 02:25:25,479
all counted on nothing ever changing. And now everything's changing,

2864
02:25:25,520 --> 02:25:28,200
which means a lot of mortgage payments aren't gonna be made,

2865
02:25:28,200 --> 02:25:29,760
a lot of houses are go up for sale, a lot,

2866
02:25:29,799 --> 02:25:31,040
you know, a lot of It's going to be interesting

2867
02:25:31,120 --> 02:25:33,479
is what happens to the actual physical economy in Washington.

2868
02:25:33,559 --> 02:25:35,520
People have been watching the real estate market to see

2869
02:25:35,520 --> 02:25:38,559
what happens, and you know, we'll see how it unfolds.

2870
02:25:38,559 --> 02:25:43,000
But you know, it's fundamentally altering how Washington operates, because

2871
02:25:43,639 --> 02:25:46,559
you know, without without the billions and billions of dollars

2872
02:25:46,600 --> 02:25:50,680
from from the federal government, the machine stops. And and

2873
02:25:50,760 --> 02:25:53,479
again that that opens. It doesn't mean everything gets great

2874
02:25:53,520 --> 02:25:55,920
and rosy and all the problems are solved. It just

2875
02:25:56,079 --> 02:25:59,159
means that we live in a different world. Things are

2876
02:25:59,159 --> 02:26:01,680
going to operate theirfferent And that's why. Look, it's why

2877
02:26:01,760 --> 02:26:04,399
the Democrats don't know what to do, the Republicans don't

2878
02:26:04,440 --> 02:26:06,239
know what to do. These guys are poll acts. I mean,

2879
02:26:06,319 --> 02:26:10,440
Chuck Schumer, who is a vicious political animal, rolled over

2880
02:26:10,559 --> 02:26:14,239
and asked Trump to scratch his belly over that continuous resolution.

2881
02:26:15,280 --> 02:26:18,000
I've never seen anything like it. I mean, he looked defeated.

2882
02:26:18,920 --> 02:26:21,000
And I mean that that alone. I mean, my whole life,

2883
02:26:21,040 --> 02:26:23,879
Chuck Schumer has been a pit bull and to see

2884
02:26:23,920 --> 02:26:26,840
him like that, it was just it just it really

2885
02:26:26,879 --> 02:26:29,520
screamed at me that, man, something wild is going on

2886
02:26:29,600 --> 02:26:31,840
in Washington right now. And these people, it's not that

2887
02:26:31,959 --> 02:26:33,920
they're terrified. They don't know what to do, they don't

2888
02:26:33,959 --> 02:26:35,680
know how to respond, they don't know what to say.

2889
02:26:35,680 --> 02:26:38,399
And that's all good. I mean, we we're on the

2890
02:26:38,440 --> 02:26:41,440
side that says destroy the status quo. So the status

2891
02:26:41,719 --> 02:26:44,079
is being destroyed. Now what comes after we'll see. It

2892
02:26:44,079 --> 02:26:46,799
could be worse, or it could be something we don't like,

2893
02:26:46,840 --> 02:26:50,399
who knows, but at least we've moved the ball down

2894
02:26:50,520 --> 02:26:51,799
the field to this point.

2895
02:26:53,399 --> 02:26:56,520
Speaker 1: Well, I'm glad that you brought up in a Northern

2896
02:26:56,639 --> 02:27:00,360
Virginia real estate prices because I have checked, and they

2897
02:27:00,399 --> 02:27:03,440
are absolutely cratering. I mean, I think that the average

2898
02:27:03,440 --> 02:27:06,239
home price in one week and I haven't you know,

2899
02:27:06,319 --> 02:27:10,840
checked since then, had created almost eighty thousand dollars, which is,

2900
02:27:11,000 --> 02:27:13,559
you know, even in an area that's you know, fairly

2901
02:27:13,559 --> 02:27:17,239
well off. That's apocalyptic. And I just want to say,

2902
02:27:17,239 --> 02:27:22,319
I could not feel less sympathy, right, And I'll be honest,

2903
02:27:22,360 --> 02:27:28,920
there's a part of this that look to me, there's

2904
02:27:28,920 --> 02:27:32,680
a certain amount of cultural decline that I don't think

2905
02:27:32,719 --> 02:27:34,559
we're going to be able to cheat our way out of.

2906
02:27:35,200 --> 02:27:35,399
Speaker 2: Right.

2907
02:27:36,840 --> 02:27:41,600
Speaker 1: But given the choice between total cultural decline with you know,

2908
02:27:41,639 --> 02:27:45,399
the eternal hr state and watching these people have to

2909
02:27:45,399 --> 02:27:49,479
squir them a little bit, I'll certainly take the second option, right.

2910
02:27:49,639 --> 02:27:52,159
And you know, as you mentioned, these have been the

2911
02:27:52,159 --> 02:27:55,479
things that the conservative movement has been trying to get

2912
02:27:55,520 --> 02:28:00,680
done for years, decades, and the fact that you know

2913
02:28:00,719 --> 02:28:03,479
these that so many changes were made so quickly, and

2914
02:28:03,639 --> 02:28:07,040
that you know, these people are basically in a tail spin. Uh,

2915
02:28:07,120 --> 02:28:11,120
it's heavy, right, It's easy to get swept away in

2916
02:28:11,159 --> 02:28:14,280
it because you know, as you mentioned, these people have

2917
02:28:15,559 --> 02:28:19,840
they conceptualize themselves as a distinct class. They see themselves

2918
02:28:19,920 --> 02:28:24,559
as better as above people like you and I. And

2919
02:28:25,840 --> 02:28:32,239
to realize how how unstable that was right, to realize that,

2920
02:28:32,600 --> 02:28:35,079
you know, you're effectively one stroke of a pen away

2921
02:28:35,120 --> 02:28:36,920
from being a normal person.

2922
02:28:37,639 --> 02:28:37,760
Speaker 3: Uh.

2923
02:28:38,799 --> 02:28:41,719
Speaker 1: You know, they don't seem to be coping with that well.

2924
02:28:42,399 --> 02:28:45,799
And uh again I'm just going to repeat myself. I

2925
02:28:45,840 --> 02:28:47,159
could not feel less sympathy.

2926
02:28:49,000 --> 02:28:50,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm not going to lie and say I'm not

2927
02:28:50,959 --> 02:28:54,399
enjoying this. I I you know, I I often think

2928
02:28:54,399 --> 02:28:56,040
about when I see one of them who are still

2929
02:28:56,079 --> 02:28:58,959
on Twitter, you know, moaning about how terrible things are,

2930
02:28:58,959 --> 02:29:01,319
and I think, man, this, this is great. This, this

2931
02:29:01,399 --> 02:29:03,600
is why we invented. Why the Germans gave us the

2932
02:29:03,639 --> 02:29:06,840
word shodenfreud. You know, we don't have a good word

2933
02:29:06,879 --> 02:29:10,200
in English for it, but you know, I find myself

2934
02:29:10,200 --> 02:29:13,399
from time to time, tempted to lick my computer monitor

2935
02:29:13,479 --> 02:29:18,319
to taste the sweet salty tears of the people. But yeah,

2936
02:29:18,399 --> 02:29:20,600
you know, look, you know, at the end of I mean,

2937
02:29:20,680 --> 02:29:23,360
in a lot of ways, we're going through here. You know,

2938
02:29:23,399 --> 02:29:25,879
we're finally the Cold War is finally ending. All the

2939
02:29:25,920 --> 02:29:29,360
mechanisms that built up over this time to win the

2940
02:29:29,360 --> 02:29:32,639
Cold War should have been turned off in nineteen ninety

2941
02:29:32,639 --> 02:29:35,159
two with Bill Clinton, and actually there was talk about

2942
02:29:35,159 --> 02:29:37,239
that in nineteen ninety two, but you know what, there

2943
02:29:37,319 --> 02:29:40,159
was just too many good jobs at good wages, and

2944
02:29:40,280 --> 02:29:43,559
instead they went a different way, and we've reached the

2945
02:29:43,600 --> 02:29:45,319
end of that road, where at the end of the

2946
02:29:45,440 --> 02:29:48,120
unipolar moment, the post Cold War, the end of history,

2947
02:29:48,159 --> 02:29:50,959
all the other bullshit, and a lot of this stuff

2948
02:29:51,000 --> 02:29:53,239
just has to be taken apart. And a lot of

2949
02:29:53,319 --> 02:29:55,680
it is driven by the fact that our richest people

2950
02:29:55,680 --> 02:29:58,760
are oligarchs. It was not an accident that, you know,

2951
02:29:58,879 --> 02:30:01,760
all the richest men and most powerful corporate leaders were

2952
02:30:01,760 --> 02:30:04,479
at Trump's inauguration and made sure they showed up at

2953
02:30:04,479 --> 02:30:07,840
Mar Alago. They swung behind this guy because I think

2954
02:30:07,879 --> 02:30:10,680
they realized that a lot of bad things were happening

2955
02:30:11,079 --> 02:30:13,799
and they needed to head this stuff off. The country

2956
02:30:13,959 --> 02:30:16,600
was in a lot more trouble perhaps than really we realized.

2957
02:30:17,479 --> 02:30:19,680
And that's what this is all about. I've I've talked

2958
02:30:19,680 --> 02:30:21,559
about it. As you know, America Inc. Is going through

2959
02:30:21,559 --> 02:30:24,600
a resizing. The board of trustees, the board of directors,

2960
02:30:24,600 --> 02:30:27,319
wherever you want to call them. They decided management was

2961
02:30:27,360 --> 02:30:29,440
screwing up. God enough, we got to we got to

2962
02:30:29,520 --> 02:30:32,879
change things. And they're bringing in new management. They're downsizing things,

2963
02:30:32,959 --> 02:30:35,840
getting rid of certain departments. We're going to outsource certain

2964
02:30:35,879 --> 02:30:40,360
functions back to the private sector. It's some aspects will

2965
02:30:40,360 --> 02:30:42,799
be sold off, you know. And that's what's happening in

2966
02:30:42,840 --> 02:30:46,280
foreign policy. Basically, we're going to we're going to uh

2967
02:30:46,639 --> 02:30:50,040
uh privatize Europe. We're gonna we're gonna take it. We're

2968
02:30:50,040 --> 02:30:51,760
gonna set up as its own thing and say nearer

2969
02:30:51,840 --> 02:30:53,280
on our own now, you know, go figure out how

2970
02:30:53,319 --> 02:30:56,799
to be a civilization again. And you know that that's

2971
02:30:56,840 --> 02:30:58,559
a lot what's happening here. I think, you know, there's

2972
02:30:58,600 --> 02:31:01,600
longer cycles too. I've written and talked about this. You know,

2973
02:31:01,719 --> 02:31:03,879
if you go back and look at Nixon, a lot

2974
02:31:03,920 --> 02:31:06,600
of the bad stuff that that we have today that

2975
02:31:06,639 --> 02:31:10,159
seems to be falling apart we started under Nixon. I mean,

2976
02:31:10,200 --> 02:31:12,520
that's you know, there's no question about it. The Paleos

2977
02:31:12,520 --> 02:31:14,479
wrote a lot about this, you know, the growth of

2978
02:31:14,479 --> 02:31:15,559
the managerial state and that.

2979
02:31:16,360 --> 02:31:18,280
Speaker 2: But you know, what we're going through.

2980
02:31:18,559 --> 02:31:20,559
Speaker 3: It's an interesting thing though, you know, in the Cold

2981
02:31:20,600 --> 02:31:23,559
War is important because at the end of the Cold War,

2982
02:31:23,760 --> 02:31:27,159
Russia was a poor country, but it was a lawful country.

2983
02:31:27,200 --> 02:31:29,280
And then it became a poor country that was unlawful,

2984
02:31:30,079 --> 02:31:32,920
and it reorganized itself, and now it's becoming a it's

2985
02:31:32,920 --> 02:31:35,479
all back to being a lawful country, and it's it's

2986
02:31:35,479 --> 02:31:39,200
slowly it's economy and it's doing pretty well economically. The

2987
02:31:39,280 --> 02:31:42,639
United States is a rich country that had become lawless.

2988
02:31:42,879 --> 02:31:45,120
We don't realize just how lawless we were over the

2989
02:31:45,200 --> 02:31:47,040
last ten years. I mean, all the stuff they did

2990
02:31:47,079 --> 02:31:49,840
to Trump, but you know, throwing these j six people

2991
02:31:49,840 --> 02:31:52,360
into dungeons, I mean, I mean, the abuses of these

2992
02:31:52,399 --> 02:31:56,280
people's civil basic civil rights, which just monstrous. No one,

2993
02:31:56,399 --> 02:31:59,319
you know, no one talks about that too much. I mean,

2994
02:31:59,440 --> 02:32:03,479
fortunately all been pardoned, but all kinds of things. I mean,

2995
02:32:03,520 --> 02:32:06,000
there's just lots of terrible things that we were becoming

2996
02:32:06,120 --> 02:32:09,280
lawless and now, I think we're going to go through

2997
02:32:09,280 --> 02:32:11,639
this really rough period where we're probably gonna be a

2998
02:32:11,680 --> 02:32:13,559
little poorer, and I don't think there's many out about it.

2999
02:32:13,559 --> 02:32:16,680
The economy is going to have some difficult moments. But

3000
02:32:17,719 --> 02:32:19,399
you know, if we can come back to being a

3001
02:32:19,479 --> 02:32:22,600
lawful society again and having some sanity, back to how

3002
02:32:22,959 --> 02:32:26,399
our countries run, we'll do okay. You know, we'll survive

3003
02:32:26,479 --> 02:32:29,280
the transition. And that really is what we're experiencing now.

3004
02:32:29,280 --> 02:32:31,680
We're at the beginning of this great transition out of

3005
02:32:31,719 --> 02:32:34,200
this past. You know, as I like to say, we're

3006
02:32:34,200 --> 02:32:36,559
about to join everybody else in the twenty first century.

3007
02:32:36,600 --> 02:32:36,719
Speaker 1: Now.

3008
02:32:36,760 --> 02:32:40,000
Speaker 3: You know, we'll stop talking about nineteen thirty eight, nineteen

3009
02:32:40,040 --> 02:32:42,920
sixty eight, nineteen eighty four at all. You know, these

3010
02:32:43,000 --> 02:32:45,040
dates that just keep coming up over and over again.

3011
02:32:45,319 --> 02:32:47,159
We'll finally be able to shut the door on that stuff.

3012
02:32:47,200 --> 02:32:51,120
And you know that's that means we're also going to

3013
02:32:51,159 --> 02:32:54,000
have to We're going to have to develop a new

3014
02:32:54,239 --> 02:32:56,600
set of values, things that are important to us, new

3015
02:32:56,680 --> 02:32:58,520
customs and culture. You don't go back and say, oh,

3016
02:32:58,520 --> 02:33:00,520
we're just going to go and adopt these old ways

3017
02:33:00,600 --> 02:33:03,239
that just it doesn't work that way. So it's going

3018
02:33:03,280 --> 02:33:06,000
to be an interesting interesting time, you know. I mean

3019
02:33:06,040 --> 02:33:09,239
I say interesting, not necessarily good interesting. It's going to

3020
02:33:09,319 --> 02:33:11,559
be some bad interesting as well, because a lot of

3021
02:33:12,440 --> 02:33:14,520
you know, a lot of the stuff we take for

3022
02:33:14,559 --> 02:33:16,319
granted is going to be called into question. Now I

3023
02:33:16,360 --> 02:33:19,159
have to say stuff. You know, our values are point

3024
02:33:19,239 --> 02:33:21,719
in our lives as individuals, how we go about, how

3025
02:33:21,760 --> 02:33:24,559
we work, how we spend our money. You know, Uh,

3026
02:33:25,000 --> 02:33:26,360
a lot of a lot of stuff's going to change,

3027
02:33:26,399 --> 02:33:28,399
and and some people will do better than others.

3028
02:33:30,520 --> 02:33:35,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, I to me, and I might this might be

3029
02:33:35,319 --> 02:33:39,280
recency bias. But if you could pin down a moment

3030
02:33:39,600 --> 02:33:42,159
that it seems as if you know, the post war

3031
02:33:42,200 --> 02:33:46,120
consensus died, right, the so called rules based international order

3032
02:33:46,280 --> 02:33:48,959
was you know, finally the nail was put into the coffin.

3033
02:33:49,920 --> 02:33:52,920
It was, uh, you know Trump and Vance's interaction with Selenski.

3034
02:33:53,799 --> 02:33:57,760
Because to me, and I know there was some coverage

3035
02:33:57,760 --> 02:33:59,920
of this that you know said it, Oh, it's all

3036
02:34:00,399 --> 02:34:02,360
you know, it's all a game, right, it was a

3037
02:34:02,399 --> 02:34:05,920
deliberate plan to create some kind of media spectacle. I

3038
02:34:05,920 --> 02:34:06,879
don't believe.

3039
02:34:06,520 --> 02:34:07,239
Speaker 2: That, right.

3040
02:34:07,280 --> 02:34:09,920
Speaker 1: To me, that seems as if you know, Trump Advance,

3041
02:34:10,280 --> 02:34:14,319
after a fairly long conversation got rightfully very annoyed with

3042
02:34:14,479 --> 02:34:21,000
the rat King of Ukraine, and in the weak sense, right,

3043
02:34:21,440 --> 02:34:23,719
the discussion over you know, what will likely be a

3044
02:34:23,760 --> 02:34:28,239
peace in Ukraine has basically just been between Donald Trump

3045
02:34:28,280 --> 02:34:30,879
and the Russian government right there. There's no even fig

3046
02:34:30,959 --> 02:34:34,280
leaf anymore that you know, Zelenski has a say in

3047
02:34:34,319 --> 02:34:36,920
this matter. And look like I know that the Europeans

3048
02:34:36,920 --> 02:34:41,280
are making noises. We will see what the Europeans end

3049
02:34:41,360 --> 02:34:45,559
up doing. But I think that that's an interesting, an

3050
02:34:45,559 --> 02:34:48,719
interesting move, right, the recognition, which, let's be honest, may

3051
02:34:48,719 --> 02:34:52,040
have always been true that you know, really what this

3052
02:34:52,120 --> 02:34:55,319
matters is this kind of conversation between you know, individual

3053
02:34:55,440 --> 02:34:58,680
leaders of a nation more so than this you know

3054
02:34:58,760 --> 02:35:03,000
system of different un security councils and all that. And

3055
02:35:03,040 --> 02:35:05,559
I think that that, to a certain degree, it's a

3056
02:35:05,559 --> 02:35:09,040
more honest view of it, right. It is how it

3057
02:35:09,079 --> 02:35:12,799
has always happened, just kind of stripped of a certain

3058
02:35:12,879 --> 02:35:17,079
level of nicety. And you know, when I look at this, right,

3059
02:35:17,920 --> 02:35:20,920
the analogy to the late Soviet Union is kind of

3060
02:35:20,920 --> 02:35:24,000
apt because that was a you know, an aging system

3061
02:35:24,040 --> 02:35:26,520
that no one really believed in anymore, but it just

3062
02:35:26,600 --> 02:35:29,600
had this kind of momentum. And you know, I think

3063
02:35:29,639 --> 02:35:31,680
that the you know, a certain part of the kind

3064
02:35:31,680 --> 02:35:35,159
of like the US International Empire, it faced the same

3065
02:35:35,200 --> 02:35:37,840
problem right that it was it was out of date.

3066
02:35:37,879 --> 02:35:41,040
It was kind of coasting on, you know, the cultural

3067
02:35:41,079 --> 02:35:44,440
ideas of a previous era, and it was was floundering,

3068
02:35:45,159 --> 02:35:48,440
right and to me, and I could be wrong, but

3069
02:35:48,479 --> 02:35:50,639
I think that in you know, twenty thirty years, that

3070
02:35:50,680 --> 02:35:53,399
will be seen as the kind of like emblematic movement

3071
02:35:53,440 --> 02:35:54,040
of that shift.

3072
02:35:56,360 --> 02:35:59,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, it's it's funny. I don't know you

3073
02:36:00,879 --> 02:36:02,680
recency bi It is the right word, you know, because

3074
02:36:02,680 --> 02:36:07,399
I a couple weeks ago, Paul Ramsey and I did

3075
02:36:07,399 --> 02:36:10,239
a show on Reagan, and we both were teenagers when

3076
02:36:10,280 --> 02:36:12,680
Reagan was riding high. And one of the things we

3077
02:36:12,719 --> 02:36:15,559
talked about is that if you lived in that period,

3078
02:36:15,559 --> 02:36:17,280
you thought, man, that Reagan's going to be He's going

3079
02:36:17,319 --> 02:36:19,760
to be on Mount Rushmore. He's up there, He's FDR

3080
02:36:20,319 --> 02:36:23,280
two great presidents of the twentieth century, and then Lincoln,

3081
02:36:23,360 --> 02:36:25,920
you know, and Jefferson. You know, I don't think about

3082
02:36:25,959 --> 02:36:28,719
Reagan at all anymore, all these years later. I mean,

3083
02:36:28,760 --> 02:36:31,399
I lived through it, you know, so I should, you know,

3084
02:36:31,760 --> 02:36:34,920
getting into my geezerhood. I should be nostalgic for those days,

3085
02:36:35,079 --> 02:36:35,639
don't think.

3086
02:36:35,479 --> 02:36:36,879
Speaker 1: About it at all.

3087
02:36:36,920 --> 02:36:39,680
Speaker 3: And you know, it's weird how that that those things

3088
02:36:39,760 --> 02:36:42,280
can happen. Stuff that's important in the moment can easily

3089
02:36:43,040 --> 02:36:46,000
just disappear from the collective consciousness, and things that didn't

3090
02:36:46,000 --> 02:36:48,559
seem all that important at the time can can rise up.

3091
02:36:48,600 --> 02:36:48,760
Speaker 2: You know.

3092
02:36:49,280 --> 02:36:53,079
Speaker 3: I think, you know, right now, if I were going

3093
02:36:53,120 --> 02:36:56,159
to guess at something that was sort of a pivot point,

3094
02:36:56,520 --> 02:36:59,920
you know, it's going to be the twenty twenty election.

3095
02:37:00,680 --> 02:37:04,079
I think a lot of people, not just average Americans,

3096
02:37:04,120 --> 02:37:07,319
but I think a lot of wealthy people looked at

3097
02:37:07,319 --> 02:37:09,680
that and said, what the hell is going on here?

3098
02:37:09,959 --> 02:37:12,600
I mean that whole everything about that was shocking to

3099
02:37:12,680 --> 02:37:13,440
a lot of people.

3100
02:37:13,760 --> 02:37:14,959
Speaker 2: Some you know, it was.

3101
02:37:16,600 --> 02:37:19,079
Speaker 3: Shocking for different reasons, but I think generally that that

3102
02:37:19,559 --> 02:37:21,520
people looked at that and said, you know what, we've

3103
02:37:21,559 --> 02:37:24,799
become a lawless were You know, that's no different than

3104
02:37:25,399 --> 02:37:28,600
the Senate assassinating Caesar in uh.

3105
02:37:28,319 --> 02:37:28,879
Speaker 2: You know, in Rome.

3106
02:37:28,920 --> 02:37:32,040
Speaker 3: I mean, this is breaks, this is the break. And

3107
02:37:32,079 --> 02:37:34,319
I think I think in the fullness of time, we'll

3108
02:37:34,360 --> 02:37:36,159
look back and say that that was the moment in

3109
02:37:36,200 --> 02:37:39,639
which the economic elites, a lot of cultural is. A

3110
02:37:39,680 --> 02:37:42,280
lot of people started talking privately that, hey, we've got

3111
02:37:42,280 --> 02:37:46,319
a big problem here. Something's gone horribly wrong, and I

3112
02:37:46,399 --> 02:37:48,000
saw I think that may be it. I mean, I

3113
02:37:48,000 --> 02:37:49,639
could be completely wrong, but I do think that that

3114
02:37:49,760 --> 02:37:51,520
turned out to be a seminal moment because it's not

3115
02:37:51,559 --> 02:37:54,280
just the election itself. I think it was also the

3116
02:37:54,280 --> 02:37:57,840
the treatment of the people, the attitudes, I mean, just

3117
02:37:57,959 --> 02:38:03,159
the sneering contempt of the average person by Washington. I

3118
02:38:03,159 --> 02:38:06,360
think that shocked a lot of people. And you know,

3119
02:38:06,399 --> 02:38:08,360
it was downhill ever since. I mean, that was really

3120
02:38:08,440 --> 02:38:11,280
peak bad guys. You know, it's peak all the bad guys.

3121
02:38:11,319 --> 02:38:13,799
That was their best time. And if you think about it,

3122
02:38:14,159 --> 02:38:18,879
every month, every year from that point forward, things got

3123
02:38:18,920 --> 02:38:21,280
worse and worse for the bad guys. You know, when

3124
02:38:21,319 --> 02:38:24,520
did my buy Twitter? Was it twenty twenty three, twenty

3125
02:38:24,520 --> 02:38:26,159
twenty two, something like That's when it started?

3126
02:38:26,719 --> 02:38:27,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, I believe so.

3127
02:38:28,159 --> 02:38:31,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, So you know that there's another item you could

3128
02:38:31,600 --> 02:38:33,399
point to and say that was a turning point because

3129
02:38:33,399 --> 02:38:35,639
it look, this was basically the richest man in the

3130
02:38:35,639 --> 02:38:37,760
world saying I'm going to buy one of the more

3131
02:38:37,760 --> 02:38:41,360
influential platforms because I disagree with the politics which happens

3132
02:38:41,360 --> 02:38:43,719
to be the politics of the people in charge. That

3133
02:38:44,000 --> 02:38:45,920
had to be a big message. If you're the second

3134
02:38:46,040 --> 02:38:49,399
richest guy, you took notice. If you're the twentieth richest guy,

3135
02:38:49,440 --> 02:38:53,200
you took notice. So you know, I mean, it'd be

3136
02:38:53,200 --> 02:38:56,159
interesting to you know, to see what, you know, how

3137
02:38:56,200 --> 02:38:58,760
people look back on it as how things change. But

3138
02:38:58,920 --> 02:39:01,559
I do think and it really brings up. It actually

3139
02:39:01,600 --> 02:39:04,760
just pop in my head, you know, is a good

3140
02:39:04,760 --> 02:39:06,959
example of how you never know. When Trump came down

3141
02:39:06,959 --> 02:39:09,040
that escalator, how many people thought he would be this

3142
02:39:09,159 --> 02:39:13,680
world altering figure, He would be this one arguably in

3143
02:39:13,760 --> 02:39:15,520
the running for one of the most important people in

3144
02:39:15,520 --> 02:39:17,799
the last fifty years. I don't think anybody, I can't

3145
02:39:17,799 --> 02:39:20,479
imagine anybody, not even Donald Trump, thought that he was

3146
02:39:20,479 --> 02:39:24,120
going to be this seminal figure. When you look at

3147
02:39:24,120 --> 02:39:25,959
the last ten years, I mean, this man went from

3148
02:39:26,000 --> 02:39:30,639
being an entertaining television and real estate entrepreneur to being

3149
02:39:30,760 --> 02:39:35,079
the most consequential man in the lifetime of half the country. Yeah,

3150
02:39:35,280 --> 02:39:37,280
I mean, you have to be old like me to think, well,

3151
02:39:38,079 --> 02:39:41,440
there was more consequential people when I was younger. But

3152
02:39:41,719 --> 02:39:46,000
you know, honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if you asked

3153
02:39:46,040 --> 02:39:47,719
me five years from now, I'll say, yeah, Trump was

3154
02:39:47,760 --> 02:39:51,479
probably the most consequential figure in my lifetime because everything

3155
02:39:51,559 --> 02:39:55,360
changes during that period. So I don't know, I mean,

3156
02:39:55,399 --> 02:39:57,639
you can you know, that pivot point of history, the

3157
02:39:57,680 --> 02:39:59,239
inflection point.

3158
02:40:00,239 --> 02:40:00,879
Speaker 2: Years from now, who.

3159
02:40:00,799 --> 02:40:02,760
Speaker 3: Knows what we'll be, but you know, but certainly right now,

3160
02:40:02,840 --> 02:40:04,639
I think as well, there's a lot of contenders the

3161
02:40:04,639 --> 02:40:09,559
twenty twenty election, the russ Must buying a Twitter, Trump

3162
02:40:09,600 --> 02:40:11,920
getting shot, I mean, that was think about the anormity

3163
02:40:11,920 --> 02:40:14,440
of that. I mean, yeah, there's been a lot of

3164
02:40:14,479 --> 02:40:16,079
history in the last ten years.

3165
02:40:17,120 --> 02:40:20,000
Speaker 1: Well, and and look, I've joked a couple of times

3166
02:40:20,040 --> 02:40:23,600
that COVID was Vietnam for gen Z and they'll never

3167
02:40:23,639 --> 02:40:27,159
shut up about it. But I do think there's something

3168
02:40:27,200 --> 02:40:31,840
to that, right, that that was and it was hard

3169
02:40:31,840 --> 02:40:35,840
to tell at the time, right if that was you know,

3170
02:40:35,879 --> 02:40:38,680
as we heard from you know, certain figures at the WFF,

3171
02:40:38,799 --> 02:40:41,239
that was really the new normal, right if they had

3172
02:40:41,280 --> 02:40:43,440
done it, If they had you know, they had managed

3173
02:40:43,479 --> 02:40:46,319
to you know, get the ring and become you know,

3174
02:40:46,399 --> 02:40:49,200
kind of like the eternal hr overlords of the world.

3175
02:40:50,079 --> 02:40:52,200
And you know, I think the further and further we

3176
02:40:52,200 --> 02:40:54,799
get away from it. It seems as if no, that

3177
02:40:54,920 --> 02:40:58,639
was sort of a last gasp, Right, that was a

3178
02:40:58,639 --> 02:41:01,840
massive miscalculation, you know, basically putting all your chips on

3179
02:41:01,879 --> 02:41:05,079
the table. And you know, while it certainly had a

3180
02:41:05,120 --> 02:41:07,680
short to medium term benefit, Right, they were able to

3181
02:41:07,719 --> 02:41:09,200
do a lot of things they wanted in a short

3182
02:41:09,239 --> 02:41:12,760
amount of time, it costs them too much, right, They

3183
02:41:13,040 --> 02:41:18,280
they expended too much political capital, and now they're being

3184
02:41:18,319 --> 02:41:23,120
punished for it. To me, I think that you know,

3185
02:41:23,440 --> 02:41:27,120
a neat heuristic, right when kind of parsing if something

3186
02:41:27,200 --> 02:41:29,879
is a win or not is basically you know, do

3187
02:41:29,959 --> 02:41:32,440
your enemies get punished? Do your friends get rewarded?

3188
02:41:33,000 --> 02:41:33,159
Speaker 2: Right?

3189
02:41:33,159 --> 02:41:36,879
Speaker 1: It's not particularly sophisticated, but it works. And in this case,

3190
02:41:37,200 --> 02:41:41,799
our enemies are certainly being punished. Right, The unaccounted, unaccountable

3191
02:41:41,879 --> 02:41:45,440
bureaucracy is being brought to heal. They are losing their jobs.

3192
02:41:45,520 --> 02:41:49,360
They are you know, at best, being forced to retire early.

3193
02:41:49,840 --> 02:41:53,479
At worst, like the Voice of America reporters, they're just

3194
02:41:53,719 --> 02:41:57,200
you know, thrown out on their ear. And the other side, right,

3195
02:41:57,239 --> 02:42:01,639
are our friends being rewarded? I would say yes, right,

3196
02:42:01,719 --> 02:42:07,239
like you Manson mentioned the Jan six protesters, And what's

3197
02:42:07,280 --> 02:42:10,719
interesting about that is at first it was, you know,

3198
02:42:11,639 --> 02:42:15,959
just pardons for the quote unquote non violent offenders. But

3199
02:42:15,959 --> 02:42:17,840
when it actually came time for Trump to sign them,

3200
02:42:18,120 --> 02:42:21,920
he just signed everyone, right, he let them all go.

3201
02:42:22,760 --> 02:42:24,920
And look like, I am not the kind of person

3202
02:42:24,959 --> 02:42:27,680
who would have really, in any context been likely to

3203
02:42:27,760 --> 02:42:31,840
be at an event like you know, the electoral justice protest.

3204
02:42:32,280 --> 02:42:34,920
But nonetheless, right, those are our people, right, those are

3205
02:42:34,959 --> 02:42:38,399
good normal Americans. And the fact that you know they

3206
02:42:38,440 --> 02:42:40,760
were freed from jail while all of these people are

3207
02:42:40,760 --> 02:42:44,479
being fired, that's a strong indication that you know, this

3208
02:42:44,680 --> 02:42:46,360
was a good move for us.

3209
02:42:46,319 --> 02:42:50,559
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, you know, it's it's.

3210
02:42:51,879 --> 02:42:54,559
Speaker 3: It's again, you know, it's you can't expect that, I

3211
02:42:54,680 --> 02:42:58,159
guess some people and I frankly, I've lost all patients

3212
02:42:58,159 --> 02:42:59,559
with the black pillars.

3213
02:42:59,200 --> 02:42:59,360
Speaker 2: You know.

3214
02:42:59,680 --> 02:43:02,559
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know there's times where when you lose or

3215
02:43:02,559 --> 02:43:05,079
things are going bad there, for some reason or other,

3216
02:43:05,120 --> 02:43:07,000
it feels good to kind of blackpill And I get that.

3217
02:43:07,079 --> 02:43:09,360
We all do it, you know, you do it and everything.

3218
02:43:09,399 --> 02:43:11,719
It's not just politics. But yeah, you know, you look

3219
02:43:11,719 --> 02:43:14,520
at the sporting events, people who watch sports, you know,

3220
02:43:14,600 --> 02:43:16,799
there's a joke. You know, I can't wait for the game,

3221
02:43:16,840 --> 02:43:18,799
and then five minutes later, I want to kill myself,

3222
02:43:18,920 --> 02:43:21,760
fire the coach. You know, it's it's true, you know,

3223
02:43:21,799 --> 02:43:24,040
we you know, it's kind of how we normally react.

3224
02:43:24,040 --> 02:43:28,399
But right now, in the balance, you know, things are

3225
02:43:28,600 --> 02:43:30,479
really going our way. I mean, look, there was a

3226
02:43:30,520 --> 02:43:32,760
time where a lot of people who were online or

3227
02:43:32,879 --> 02:43:35,120
I know, people who dropped out of politics because they

3228
02:43:35,159 --> 02:43:39,479
were terrified of the SPLC or any of these lunatics

3229
02:43:39,600 --> 02:43:42,639
on Twitter getting their information and trying to destroy their lives.

3230
02:43:42,639 --> 02:43:45,600
They could actually get people fired. Well, that doesn't happen anymore.

3231
02:43:46,040 --> 02:43:47,000
Speaker 2: That is over with.

3232
02:43:47,159 --> 02:43:50,239
Speaker 3: And those people who have been herded into blue Sky

3233
02:43:50,399 --> 02:43:52,840
so they can be weird with each other and ignored

3234
02:43:52,879 --> 02:43:55,239
by everybody else. You know, it's kind of like a

3235
02:43:55,399 --> 02:43:57,280
you know, it's become a zoo. You know, you go

3236
02:43:57,360 --> 02:43:59,239
to people go over there or some of these reddit

3237
02:43:59,399 --> 02:44:02,959
uhs subreddits, you know, you go, you know, to just

3238
02:44:03,079 --> 02:44:05,239
see what the crazies are up to. You know, in

3239
02:44:05,600 --> 02:44:08,520
China they actually have tours where you can go right

3240
02:44:08,559 --> 02:44:11,520
to the North Korean border and look and see the

3241
02:44:11,520 --> 02:44:13,319
North Koreans. It's kind of like they treat it like

3242
02:44:13,319 --> 02:44:14,920
a zoo where you look over the border at the

3243
02:44:14,920 --> 02:44:17,559
North Korean Zoo. We have the same thing now with

3244
02:44:17,799 --> 02:44:20,040
these crazies who are riding high just five or six

3245
02:44:20,120 --> 02:44:23,360
years ago. So, I mean, there's tons of good stuff happening.

3246
02:44:24,079 --> 02:44:26,760
But again, you know it's not we're not we're not

3247
02:44:26,840 --> 02:44:31,440
turning fifty sixty seventy years of mistakes over in a

3248
02:44:32,120 --> 02:44:33,600
what's it Trump in an office?

3249
02:44:33,600 --> 02:44:36,200
Speaker 2: What? Three months? Two months? You know it's going to

3250
02:44:36,239 --> 02:44:36,879
think a lot longer.

3251
02:44:36,920 --> 02:44:39,360
Speaker 3: You know, this is a generational project that's starting now.

3252
02:44:39,719 --> 02:44:42,520
You know, Trump will hopefully hand a baton off to Vance,

3253
02:44:42,600 --> 02:44:46,719
and Vance will continue this project. And you know, twenty

3254
02:44:47,000 --> 02:44:49,239
or twenty thirty two, people will look back and be

3255
02:44:49,360 --> 02:44:52,559
shocked that people actually were willing to tolerate things like

3256
02:44:52,639 --> 02:44:57,000
COVID or the docksing business or you know, any of

3257
02:44:57,000 --> 02:44:58,639
this kind of stuff. You know, the world will be

3258
02:44:58,680 --> 02:45:00,600
that much different. I mean that's the oh, I mean,

3259
02:45:01,000 --> 02:45:02,040
you know, it's my hope.

3260
02:45:02,079 --> 02:45:06,440
Speaker 1: Anyway, Well, to me, I actually think one of the

3261
02:45:07,159 --> 02:45:10,799
most significant stories, uh that has kind of fallen out

3262
02:45:10,799 --> 02:45:13,319
of uh you know, falling out of the discussion rather

3263
02:45:13,399 --> 02:45:17,920
quickly is the so called quote big balls situation. Right,

3264
02:45:18,239 --> 02:45:21,280
Uh so for a little bit of background, Right, there

3265
02:45:21,360 --> 02:45:23,559
was this kid, I believe he's working with Dose, I

3266
02:45:23,559 --> 02:45:28,000
can't remember what, Uh, excuse me. And he had an

3267
02:45:28,079 --> 02:45:31,360
edgy Twitter account called big Balls where he would say

3268
02:45:31,399 --> 02:45:33,920
things that you know, would be quite familiar to us

3269
02:45:33,920 --> 02:45:36,559
in ours. Right, you know, it was an edgy twittered

3270
02:45:36,680 --> 02:45:41,000
ault and uh, this got revealed, it was brought to

3271
02:45:41,040 --> 02:45:45,280
the attention of the government, and he was initially fired.

3272
02:45:45,600 --> 02:45:45,799
Speaker 2: Right.

3273
02:45:46,040 --> 02:45:48,840
Speaker 1: That's actually pretty normal, Right, that sort of thing has

3274
02:45:48,879 --> 02:45:52,120
happened a number of times. But what's interesting is that

3275
02:45:52,440 --> 02:45:56,479
jd Vance comes to this kid's defense. He basically says,

3276
02:45:56,799 --> 02:45:59,840
you know, we don't do this anymore. We don't you

3277
02:46:00,200 --> 02:46:03,040
fire people because of you know, what our enemies think

3278
02:46:03,040 --> 02:46:07,120
about them. And look like I've certainly been skeptical Advance,

3279
02:46:07,200 --> 02:46:09,799
but you know that I found that kind of endearing.

3280
02:46:10,000 --> 02:46:13,120
It's like fair enough, right, And the fact that he

3281
02:46:13,239 --> 02:46:18,239
is routinely denied the moral authority of his opposition, I

3282
02:46:18,319 --> 02:46:22,520
think that's a very strong development, especially when you consider

3283
02:46:23,000 --> 02:46:26,840
right that you know, regardless of your opinion on Dvance,

3284
02:46:26,879 --> 02:46:29,799
it's very clear that you know he has been he

3285
02:46:29,920 --> 02:46:32,360
is being groomed as the successor because in the in

3286
02:46:32,399 --> 02:46:36,239
the big balls case. Right, A reporter asks Trump, well,

3287
02:46:36,280 --> 02:46:39,559
what do you think of this? And what does Trump do? Well,

3288
02:46:39,799 --> 02:46:42,440
he looks advanced and basically says, well, I don't know

3289
02:46:42,440 --> 02:46:46,079
anything about it, but if says it's a good idea,

3290
02:46:46,120 --> 02:46:49,879
it has my seal of approval, then it's done. And

3291
02:46:49,920 --> 02:46:53,159
that's significant for a number of reasons, right, because that

3292
02:46:53,280 --> 02:46:56,680
is a signal from the very top that this kind

3293
02:46:56,680 --> 02:46:59,639
of like eternal cancelation that is kind of plagued to

3294
02:46:59,639 --> 02:47:03,959
the right for decades, that will not be tolerated anymore.

3295
02:47:04,520 --> 02:47:08,319
And look, well, obviously you know the stated recipient for

3296
02:47:08,399 --> 02:47:12,479
that was the activist left. I think the other people

3297
02:47:12,479 --> 02:47:15,399
who were on notice of that was basically the conservative movement.

3298
02:47:15,559 --> 02:47:15,719
Speaker 2: Right.

3299
02:47:15,760 --> 02:47:19,200
Speaker 1: You mentioned Francis earlier, and we all know what happened

3300
02:47:19,200 --> 02:47:23,360
to him, right, He got canceled not by you know,

3301
02:47:23,440 --> 02:47:26,639
the the left wing radicals of his day, but you know,

3302
02:47:26,879 --> 02:47:30,760
by Dinesh Desuza right within the house, so to speak.

3303
02:47:31,360 --> 02:47:34,120
And so you know, again, I think that that's a

3304
02:47:34,280 --> 02:47:36,319
very promising trend if that continues.

3305
02:47:37,920 --> 02:47:41,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, look, I will I'll put myself on

3306
02:47:41,399 --> 02:47:44,239
the back for being early on dvance. But when he

3307
02:47:44,360 --> 02:47:47,040
was third place in the polls. When he first launched

3308
02:47:47,040 --> 02:47:50,000
the Senate campaign, I wrote an essay explaining why he

3309
02:47:50,079 --> 02:47:52,239
was the best choice. And everything I wrote and I

3310
02:47:52,280 --> 02:47:55,719
turned out to be right. And the reason is that

3311
02:47:55,879 --> 02:47:59,200
Fans is an interesting guy. He is actually a real

3312
02:47:59,200 --> 02:48:02,319
flesh and blood per You know, he grew poor, and

3313
02:48:02,360 --> 02:48:04,600
you know he wasn't you know, living under a bridge

3314
02:48:04,639 --> 02:48:06,959
or anything like that. But you know, he grew up, uh,

3315
02:48:07,159 --> 02:48:09,399
working class, I guess the way to put it. But

3316
02:48:09,520 --> 02:48:11,920
he wanted to be one of the beautiful people. And

3317
02:48:12,000 --> 02:48:14,760
he got there and he realized that his only reason

3318
02:48:14,760 --> 02:48:17,920
that they allowed him in was because he was really

3319
02:48:17,920 --> 02:48:20,719
nothing more than a long jockey. He was this this

3320
02:48:20,799 --> 02:48:23,000
token they could put on their charm braceles and say, ooh,

3321
02:48:23,079 --> 02:48:25,000
we helped the poor guy. We fell out a poor

3322
02:48:25,040 --> 02:48:28,719
guy in And I think it set off a revolution

3323
02:48:28,840 --> 02:48:31,639
in his mind that said, no, I'm not going to

3324
02:48:31,719 --> 02:48:32,159
live like this.

3325
02:48:32,200 --> 02:48:33,479
Speaker 2: I'm not going to be this kind of guy.

3326
02:48:34,000 --> 02:48:37,719
Speaker 3: And he when he's become a different person, and uh,

3327
02:48:37,799 --> 02:48:39,559
and you could see it. I mean, I look, I

3328
02:48:40,239 --> 02:48:41,840
say this as someone who kind of went through a

3329
02:48:41,959 --> 02:48:44,479
very similar experience, So I mean, I guess it's easier

3330
02:48:44,479 --> 02:48:46,920
for me to recognize but uh, you know he uh,

3331
02:48:47,520 --> 02:48:49,840
he's just a different guy than he was, you know before.

3332
02:48:49,879 --> 02:48:54,000
He really kind of down this road and he denies

3333
02:48:54,399 --> 02:48:58,479
the other sides moral claims. He doesn't you know, he

3334
02:48:58,559 --> 02:49:00,120
is not you know, he's kind of like a guy

3335
02:49:00,479 --> 02:49:04,239
who is outside of their religion and doesn't really care

3336
02:49:04,319 --> 02:49:06,799
to know about their religion, and he has no interest

3337
02:49:06,799 --> 02:49:09,040
in following the edicts of their religion. So he just

3338
02:49:09,280 --> 02:49:11,399
you know, shrugged his shoulders when they say these things.

3339
02:49:11,520 --> 02:49:13,760
And that's a great thing. That is a huge development.

3340
02:49:14,399 --> 02:49:15,799
And I think in a lot of ways that Trump

3341
02:49:16,200 --> 02:49:18,879
sensed us about fans. He wasn't going to pick fans

3342
02:49:19,079 --> 02:49:22,040
until he got shot, and then then it clearly changed

3343
02:49:22,040 --> 02:49:24,959
his mind and decided to go Advance for this reason.

3344
02:49:25,000 --> 02:49:27,479
You know, I think the best thing that ever happened

3345
02:49:27,520 --> 02:49:29,559
is that happened to him, probably is that they took

3346
02:49:29,559 --> 02:49:33,319
a shot at Trump and missed. But but you know,

3347
02:49:33,360 --> 02:49:34,760
I think, you know, Vance in a lot of ways,

3348
02:49:34,840 --> 02:49:39,920
what he stepped in and saved big balls. You know

3349
02:49:40,799 --> 02:49:45,040
it it was the end. It killed the whole docsing world,

3350
02:49:45,079 --> 02:49:47,280
you know, all these efforts. I mean, it was on

3351
02:49:47,680 --> 02:49:50,639
sin Ice right away. But when the second most important

3352
02:49:50,639 --> 02:49:54,799
guy in the world says, I don't care if you

3353
02:49:54,799 --> 02:49:57,000
you know, you want me to fire this guy, We're

3354
02:49:57,000 --> 02:49:59,600
not going to do it. Go screw that's it. They

3355
02:49:59,639 --> 02:50:02,040
lost all of their authority, you know, they have nothing

3356
02:50:02,120 --> 02:50:05,479
left at that point. And again it's another another good thing,

3357
02:50:05,559 --> 02:50:07,360
you know. I mean, it doesn't you know, it doesn't

3358
02:50:07,360 --> 02:50:10,840
mean that, you know, you can go out in public

3359
02:50:10,879 --> 02:50:14,879
and start using racial epithets without you know, a consequence.

3360
02:50:15,159 --> 02:50:19,360
You know, we still have you know, generally agreed upon

3361
02:50:19,399 --> 02:50:21,520
behavior that you're not supposed to say certain things and

3362
02:50:21,639 --> 02:50:23,120
do certain things in public and all that.

3363
02:50:23,399 --> 02:50:24,559
Speaker 2: And I don't think anybody.

3364
02:50:24,239 --> 02:50:27,639
Speaker 3: Should complain about that. But if you if you use

3365
02:50:27,680 --> 02:50:31,079
some locker room humor in a private chat, or you

3366
02:50:31,120 --> 02:50:33,040
say so you get a little carried away on Twitter

3367
02:50:33,120 --> 02:50:36,799
or something, well, you know, the the mature adult response

3368
02:50:36,879 --> 02:50:39,479
now is real it back in a little bit, you

3369
02:50:39,559 --> 02:50:42,399
know that, don't be so careless and move on. You know,

3370
02:50:42,440 --> 02:50:44,680
it's not this, Oh my god, we've got to banish

3371
02:50:44,680 --> 02:50:47,399
this person and destroy his life, you know, because I mean,

3372
02:50:48,000 --> 02:50:51,479
I think about how weird this is that you know,

3373
02:50:51,600 --> 02:50:54,680
people were having their lives destroyed because of something they tweeted.

3374
02:50:54,719 --> 02:50:57,159
I mean about just how insane, that is, you know,

3375
02:50:57,239 --> 02:50:59,079
it's it's the kind of thing that you would expect

3376
02:50:59,159 --> 02:51:02,079
in a a grammar school where you know, all of

3377
02:51:02,120 --> 02:51:04,120
a sudden, you know you you did something wrong on

3378
02:51:04,159 --> 02:51:05,879
this on the school yard, and so you have this

3379
02:51:06,040 --> 02:51:08,639
mark on your permanent record, and you're going to carry

3380
02:51:08,639 --> 02:51:10,920
this with you into the next grade. You know, you

3381
02:51:11,000 --> 02:51:15,079
have this reputation forever. We're just childish and silly. So

3382
02:51:15,440 --> 02:51:18,040
you know, I think, you know, Vance has done it

3383
02:51:18,120 --> 02:51:21,239
all a great service by what he did there, but

3384
02:51:21,280 --> 02:51:23,000
I also think he's done a lot of other stuff

3385
02:51:23,040 --> 02:51:25,799
like this too. I mean, he's he's what he's become

3386
02:51:25,920 --> 02:51:29,200
is kind of like Peskof is for or Medvedev, rather

3387
02:51:30,000 --> 02:51:33,000
probably like Medvedev for for Putin. You know, Putin is

3388
02:51:33,000 --> 02:51:35,280
the you know, he kind of is the good cop

3389
02:51:35,399 --> 02:51:37,600
and he tries to keep things light, and Medvedev comes

3390
02:51:37,600 --> 02:51:39,879
out and just shreds people. And you see that happening.

3391
02:51:39,879 --> 02:51:42,920
Trump is like the Trump's like the nice guy and

3392
02:51:42,920 --> 02:51:46,360
and advances. You know, he's the animal. He comes out

3393
02:51:46,360 --> 02:51:51,520
and he breaks legs. So it's fun to watch. There's

3394
02:51:51,559 --> 02:51:53,360
another another part of all this that I'm enjoying a

3395
02:51:53,360 --> 02:51:53,840
great deal.

3396
02:51:56,280 --> 02:51:59,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that you know. One of the other

3397
02:51:59,040 --> 02:52:03,239
things that's been kind of in is to watch the

3398
02:52:02,399 --> 02:52:06,520
clash of Trump, right, who seems to be committed to

3399
02:52:06,559 --> 02:52:13,440
being this Article two executive and the judicial branch, you know,

3400
02:52:13,479 --> 02:52:19,799
most recently, I believe, I can't remember what his first

3401
02:52:19,840 --> 02:52:24,479
name was. It was a judge boaz Berg, who I

3402
02:52:24,600 --> 02:52:29,239
believe is Italian, I'm not entirely sure about that had

3403
02:52:29,239 --> 02:52:34,040
basically issued this order saying, you know, President of the

3404
02:52:34,120 --> 02:52:39,280
United States is not allowed to deport Venezuelan's to venezuela right.

3405
02:52:39,440 --> 02:52:42,920
And it is simply not allowed. And the reaction was

3406
02:52:42,959 --> 02:52:45,319
quite interesting because Trump basically told him, you know, to

3407
02:52:45,399 --> 02:52:49,159
quote to kind of paraphrase Andrew Jackson, you and what

3408
02:52:49,360 --> 02:52:53,639
army right, Which I think is another interesting thing because

3409
02:52:53,639 --> 02:52:57,120
if we compare in contrast to Trump round one right,

3410
02:52:57,200 --> 02:53:00,719
the twenty sixteen presidency, there were a lot of positive

3411
02:53:00,760 --> 02:53:03,840
things said that just kind of sunk into the mud, right,

3412
02:53:03,879 --> 02:53:06,840
They never went anywhere, They got endlessly wrapped up in court.

3413
02:53:07,559 --> 02:53:10,200
And so I'm curious to see, similar to what we

3414
02:53:10,239 --> 02:53:14,879
saw with the unaccountable bureaucracy, if there will be you know,

3415
02:53:14,959 --> 02:53:17,840
some sort of I guess kind of settlement reached with

3416
02:53:17,959 --> 02:53:21,879
the judicial branch, because at least up until recently, that

3417
02:53:22,360 --> 02:53:26,399
was the kind of seat of final power in the US.

3418
02:53:29,719 --> 02:53:30,799
Speaker 2: Yeah. I think.

3419
02:53:32,559 --> 02:53:34,840
Speaker 3: We always were recording this. I'm just looking on Twitter

3420
02:53:34,920 --> 02:53:39,159
and some lunatic judge has ordered Trump to or order

3421
02:53:39,280 --> 02:53:43,120
said that all the end of USAID and all the

3422
02:53:43,120 --> 02:53:45,319
firings and all that are unconstitutional and everyone has to

3423
02:53:45,520 --> 02:53:48,799
hired back, giving all their email back and everything else. Well,

3424
02:53:48,799 --> 02:53:52,840
it's not gonna happen. The buildings are closed, the computers

3425
02:53:52,879 --> 02:53:54,280
are in already edited for the dumpster.

3426
02:53:54,360 --> 02:53:54,840
Speaker 2: I mean, this is.

3427
02:53:55,760 --> 02:53:59,920
Speaker 3: Silly, and and that's the problem here is that they'll

3428
02:54:00,040 --> 02:54:02,520
these inferior court judges. This is just these are public

3429
02:54:02,559 --> 02:54:05,120
acts of piety. They're just making assays out of themselves

3430
02:54:05,680 --> 02:54:07,120
and out of the system. And I think at some

3431
02:54:07,159 --> 02:54:09,559
point this is going to head to a showdown. It

3432
02:54:09,559 --> 02:54:11,600
has to happen to a showdown, because look, we don't

3433
02:54:11,719 --> 02:54:15,680
have a fourth branch of government called independent agency. That

3434
02:54:15,760 --> 02:54:21,120
doesn't exist. Either these agencies report to and are in

3435
02:54:21,159 --> 02:54:25,079
control of the executive or they're in the under the

3436
02:54:25,079 --> 02:54:26,239
control of Congress.

3437
02:54:26,239 --> 02:54:26,520
Speaker 2: That's it.

3438
02:54:26,559 --> 02:54:29,120
Speaker 3: I mean, there's only two choices. And of course Congress

3439
02:54:29,120 --> 02:54:30,639
set them up and put them in the executive.

3440
02:54:30,680 --> 02:54:31,840
Speaker 2: So, I mean it's right.

3441
02:54:32,520 --> 02:54:35,000
Speaker 3: So it's headed to a showdown, I think, and it

3442
02:54:35,120 --> 02:54:38,239
at a long overdue showdown. The courts need to have

3443
02:54:38,319 --> 02:54:43,959
their sales trimmed. Sure, and you know what's his name, Roberts.

3444
02:54:44,239 --> 02:54:46,639
Roberts kind of signaled this. You know, people read this

3445
02:54:46,799 --> 02:54:48,079
the wrong way. You know, he came out and he

3446
02:54:48,159 --> 02:54:52,799
chastised Trump for saying that some both Burger has to

3447
02:54:52,799 --> 02:54:56,200
be uh it should be impeached. And frankly, I would

3448
02:54:56,239 --> 02:54:58,120
have no problem with them putting the FBI on this guy.

3449
02:54:58,159 --> 02:54:59,959
He was up to his eyeballs in the Russian COLLUSI

3450
02:55:00,079 --> 02:55:03,959
and hoax. He colluded with the FBI to uh get

3451
02:55:03,959 --> 02:55:07,000
phony baloney FIZA warrants. I mean, this guy is crooked.

3452
02:55:07,440 --> 02:55:09,520
He needs he should be on the list, regardless of

3453
02:55:09,719 --> 02:55:13,040
this stuff. And uh, but you know that may what

3454
02:55:13,120 --> 02:55:14,799
maybe what has to happen. You know, you rough up

3455
02:55:14,799 --> 02:55:17,959
a judge this way with uh, you know, the FBI

3456
02:55:18,159 --> 02:55:20,440
carding out all of his electronics and everything else, you know,

3457
02:55:20,520 --> 02:55:22,079
to do the same stuff to him that he did

3458
02:55:22,079 --> 02:55:24,840
to all the JA six people. To send the message

3459
02:55:24,879 --> 02:55:26,840
to the rest of these judges. But uh, I think

3460
02:55:26,879 --> 02:55:29,239
it's going to end up in uh In in the

3461
02:55:29,360 --> 02:55:31,360
appeals and I think at some point the court is

3462
02:55:31,399 --> 02:55:34,280
going to clarify this stuff. And Roberts seemed to be

3463
02:55:34,319 --> 02:55:37,360
signaling that, saying, look, instead of going to war with

3464
02:55:37,399 --> 02:55:41,600
these inferior court judges, bring it to the appeal and

3465
02:55:41,680 --> 02:55:44,239
there you'll get remedy. And I think that's what he

3466
02:55:44,319 --> 02:55:47,239
was signaling to the White House. And you know, for

3467
02:55:47,319 --> 02:55:48,840
the order of the country, it would be good if

3468
02:55:48,840 --> 02:55:50,840
it happened. But you know, if Plan B is rounding

3469
02:55:50,879 --> 02:55:53,479
up some judges and sending him out to work camp

3470
02:55:53,559 --> 02:55:56,479
somewhere in Louisiana, I either way, it's fine by me.

3471
02:55:56,559 --> 02:55:58,879
Speaker 2: I don't I don't care. I am I am completely.

3472
02:55:59,200 --> 02:56:02,319
Speaker 3: I've lost all paidation with the court system with these

3473
02:56:02,399 --> 02:56:04,360
I mean, these somebody, these judges are just lunatics. I mean,

3474
02:56:04,399 --> 02:56:07,559
they have no business being in the bar, much less

3475
02:56:07,719 --> 02:56:11,200
as a federal judge. So you know, I'm I'm If

3476
02:56:11,520 --> 02:56:14,559
Caesarism is the only answer, then well and that's what

3477
02:56:14,600 --> 02:56:15,120
we'll have to do.

3478
02:56:15,760 --> 02:56:18,520
Speaker 1: Well, Ze man, I have no idea how you could

3479
02:56:18,879 --> 02:56:22,239
call into question the legitimacy of a system where Judge

3480
02:56:23,079 --> 02:56:25,639
Kanty Jackson is sitting on the Supreme Court.

3481
02:56:26,239 --> 02:56:30,840
Speaker 3: Uh the Tame probably has an IQ under one hundred.

3482
02:56:30,920 --> 02:56:34,360
I mean, if you I actually went yeah, I mean,

3483
02:56:34,399 --> 02:56:36,840
this one's a moron, Helen the hell she actually got

3484
02:56:36,840 --> 02:56:37,559
it through law school.

3485
02:56:37,559 --> 02:56:39,440
Speaker 2: I'll there's a.

3486
02:56:39,440 --> 02:56:42,719
Speaker 3: Thing that happens in the law. Someone told me this

3487
02:56:42,840 --> 02:56:47,840
that everyone suspects that there's certain people who somehow rather

3488
02:56:47,920 --> 02:56:51,120
passed the bar despite the fact that they probably couldn't

3489
02:56:51,600 --> 02:56:54,799
get ever score a competent enough score to pass the bar.

3490
02:56:55,000 --> 02:56:57,680
They did just get passed through. And I you know Crockett,

3491
02:56:57,719 --> 02:57:01,159
that crazy woman who does a ghetto girl actor of

3492
02:57:01,200 --> 02:57:07,280
a commerceman from Houston. It was a jazzmine Crocket you know, yes, yeah,

3493
02:57:07,280 --> 02:57:08,920
I mean she went to like Fred's law school. I

3494
02:57:08,959 --> 02:57:11,840
mean it was legitimately like Fred's law school. Some it's

3495
02:57:11,959 --> 02:57:14,319
like a law school run out of an old grocery store.

3496
02:57:14,559 --> 02:57:17,120
And you know, somehow older she you know, she passed

3497
02:57:17,120 --> 02:57:17,879
the bar in Texas.

3498
02:57:17,879 --> 02:57:20,000
Speaker 2: But but you.

3499
02:57:19,959 --> 02:57:22,319
Speaker 3: Know, yeah, I mean Jumanji Jackson. I mean that this

3500
02:57:22,399 --> 02:57:24,200
is embarrassing. I mean it's like putting a horse on

3501
02:57:24,200 --> 02:57:26,479
the Supreme Court, you know, or a block of wood

3502
02:57:26,520 --> 02:57:26,840
or something.

3503
02:57:26,879 --> 02:57:28,719
Speaker 2: I mean, I.

3504
02:57:28,680 --> 02:57:31,399
Speaker 1: Mean, look, if we're really speed running, you know, the

3505
02:57:31,520 --> 02:57:34,319
sort of end of empire. I feel like getting a

3506
02:57:34,319 --> 02:57:37,079
horse's president would be kind of our just desserts, right,

3507
02:57:37,319 --> 02:57:42,280
I certainly couldn't be worse than the Sorry, someone's driving

3508
02:57:42,280 --> 02:57:47,200
a clapped out Honda outside my window here. But you

3509
02:57:47,239 --> 02:57:50,559
couldn't write when you compare that, right, you know, having

3510
02:57:50,559 --> 02:57:55,840
a horse's emperor to having a previous president who turns

3511
02:57:55,840 --> 02:57:59,559
out signed all of his executive orders via robot. Right,

3512
02:58:00,040 --> 02:58:03,479
couldn't even hold a pen. There's a question to be

3513
02:58:03,479 --> 02:58:05,680
asked of what would be the difference? Really?

3514
02:58:07,120 --> 02:58:09,159
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean you know, I think you know, we

3515
02:58:09,159 --> 02:58:11,920
were talking earlier about these kind of inflection points, these things.

3516
02:58:12,120 --> 02:58:14,479
You know, there was a guy Mark and Dreesen, the

3517
02:58:14,479 --> 02:58:18,719
guy who invented Netscape, really one of the first browsers

3518
02:58:19,760 --> 02:58:23,159
and way way back, and you know he's a big

3519
02:58:23,239 --> 02:58:25,159
mover and shaker. Now I think it's in drees and

3520
02:58:25,200 --> 02:58:29,440
Horowitz is his investment firm. And he talked about how

3521
02:58:29,719 --> 02:58:31,639
back in like twenty twenty two, we had a meeting

3522
02:58:31,639 --> 02:58:35,399
with the Biden administration about technology, particularly AI, and he

3523
02:58:35,479 --> 02:58:37,719
came away said we have to stop these people.

3524
02:58:37,760 --> 02:58:38,840
Speaker 2: They're they're insane.

3525
02:58:39,600 --> 02:58:41,760
Speaker 3: And you know, he looked around and said, well, Donald

3526
02:58:41,760 --> 02:58:43,680
Trump is the only option here to try and put

3527
02:58:43,680 --> 02:58:46,280
it into this madness. I mean, you know, you think

3528
02:58:46,280 --> 02:58:48,040
about how terrible that meeting.

3529
02:58:47,840 --> 02:58:48,799
Speaker 2: Must have went with you.

3530
02:58:48,799 --> 02:58:50,799
Speaker 3: You went in as a guy who was generally in

3531
02:58:50,840 --> 02:58:53,120
favor of the Democrats and came out and said, I'm

3532
02:58:53,120 --> 02:58:55,360
now a revolutionary. I want to overthrow the government. I

3533
02:58:55,440 --> 02:58:57,920
must have been one hell of a meeting. But you know,

3534
02:58:58,360 --> 02:59:01,280
you know, a lot of this has, you know, really

3535
02:59:01,360 --> 02:59:04,159
due to the fact of putting a vegetable. See, you're

3536
02:59:04,159 --> 02:59:06,159
a young guy. You don't remember this, but I Joe

3537
02:59:06,200 --> 02:59:08,760
Biden has been around so long that he was an

3538
02:59:08,760 --> 02:59:11,600
old guy in Washington when I was a young guy,

3539
02:59:11,840 --> 02:59:14,879
when I was a teenager, Joe Biden was in Washington.

3540
02:59:15,520 --> 02:59:17,040
That's what I remember.

3541
02:59:17,959 --> 02:59:22,840
Speaker 1: I'm you know, the ancient history that is the Obama administration.

3542
02:59:24,440 --> 02:59:27,399
And I mean even back then, the running joke was

3543
02:59:28,200 --> 02:59:30,639
he's kind of stupid, right, I mean, I think it

3544
02:59:30,719 --> 02:59:32,559
was it was Barack Obama himself who said, you know,

3545
02:59:32,559 --> 02:59:35,239
I wouldn't trust him to make me a cup of coffee. Right,

3546
02:59:35,280 --> 02:59:37,280
He's not exactly a savvy political actor.

3547
02:59:38,719 --> 02:59:42,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, back in he ran in eighty eight and it

3548
02:59:42,280 --> 02:59:44,799
was terrible. But I mean back in the eighties, I

3549
02:59:44,840 --> 02:59:46,840
was a teenager, I worked for a congressman, and so

3550
02:59:47,040 --> 02:59:48,280
you know, it was just a front and aeron and

3551
02:59:48,280 --> 02:59:51,239
stuff like that. And I remember Joe Biden jokes. They

3552
02:59:51,280 --> 02:59:53,239
used to talk about that. He was a running joke

3553
02:59:53,280 --> 02:59:55,520
that he was so stupid, and he would tell these

3554
02:59:55,559 --> 02:59:59,360
outlandish whoppers, these these stories about you know, his heroism

3555
02:59:59,399 --> 03:00:00,840
and all this stuff. You know, if he went on

3556
03:00:00,879 --> 03:00:03,920
some congressional junket or something, he'd come back and you know,

3557
03:00:03,959 --> 03:00:06,239
he would talk about it, you know, like he was

3558
03:00:06,280 --> 03:00:09,799
on some James Bond adventure. He was just a complete

3559
03:00:09,920 --> 03:00:12,239
ridiculous person. And but the thing about it is that

3560
03:00:12,440 --> 03:00:15,280
he was reliable to represent the credit card companies in

3561
03:00:15,319 --> 03:00:17,840
Delaware and then they didn't care that, you know, him

3562
03:00:17,840 --> 03:00:21,159
being stupid was actually an asset. But so the idea

3563
03:00:21,200 --> 03:00:22,959
of this moron, I mean, look, it didn't go any better.

3564
03:00:22,959 --> 03:00:24,760
I mean they actually cracked open his skull I think

3565
03:00:24,760 --> 03:00:26,680
in the nineties and carved some stuff out that was

3566
03:00:26,719 --> 03:00:29,000
growing in there, and and then you know, he gets

3567
03:00:29,000 --> 03:00:32,760
dementia and and would make him president. I mean, a

3568
03:00:32,879 --> 03:00:35,479
horse would have been a better choice because at least

3569
03:00:35,920 --> 03:00:38,559
it would be honest and the horse, you know, horses

3570
03:00:38,559 --> 03:00:39,479
are noble animals.

3571
03:00:39,719 --> 03:00:40,440
Speaker 2: Biden is not.

3572
03:00:42,000 --> 03:00:45,479
Speaker 1: The uh. I think one of the the other interesting

3573
03:00:45,520 --> 03:00:50,040
things to me. Uh. You know you mentioned in resh

3574
03:00:51,319 --> 03:00:55,360
who let's put it this way, Andresen is perhaps more

3575
03:00:55,399 --> 03:00:59,680
involved in our circles than one would think. Uh. And

3576
03:01:00,280 --> 03:01:03,120
you know, you have this kind of new cabal of

3577
03:01:03,959 --> 03:01:07,399
you know, tech CEOs and entrepreneurs who have you know,

3578
03:01:07,479 --> 03:01:10,280
kind of explicitly made their foray into politics.

3579
03:01:10,559 --> 03:01:10,760
Speaker 2: Right.

3580
03:01:10,840 --> 03:01:14,680
Speaker 1: You have Elon Musk, who is I mean, he is

3581
03:01:14,719 --> 03:01:16,879
kind of a bizarre position. Right. You have this sort

3582
03:01:16,920 --> 03:01:21,879
of I mean, he's technically the head of a government agency, right,

3583
03:01:22,120 --> 03:01:25,920
but he pretty much seems to do whatever he wants

3584
03:01:26,319 --> 03:01:28,440
and look like I support what he's doing. You know,

3585
03:01:28,479 --> 03:01:30,799
I have more power to him. But it is this

3586
03:01:30,920 --> 03:01:34,200
kind of odd new development because and maybe you can

3587
03:01:34,239 --> 03:01:37,040
speak to this, but the interest groups in the Republican

3588
03:01:37,079 --> 03:01:39,079
Party have remained remarkably stable.

3589
03:01:39,719 --> 03:01:39,920
Speaker 2: Right.

3590
03:01:40,000 --> 03:01:44,840
Speaker 1: You have you know, a certain Mediterranean democracy, you have

3591
03:01:45,200 --> 03:01:47,399
you know, m I see interests which, let's be honest,

3592
03:01:47,399 --> 03:01:50,280
aren't that separate. But now you have this kind of

3593
03:01:50,520 --> 03:01:53,280
third group. And I would almost argue that there seems

3594
03:01:53,319 --> 03:01:54,959
to be you know, whether you want to call out

3595
03:01:55,000 --> 03:01:57,239
like the remnants of the deep state, you know, the

3596
03:01:57,280 --> 03:01:59,959
old Wasspel yet which you can see in you know,

3597
03:02:00,280 --> 03:02:03,200
and someone like Tucker right, and it seems as if,

3598
03:02:03,399 --> 03:02:07,200
you know, this new political coalition hasn't quite settled yet

3599
03:02:07,520 --> 03:02:10,639
because you know, Musk gets to do almost everything he wants, right,

3600
03:02:10,639 --> 03:02:12,879
he gets to fire whoever he wants, he gets to

3601
03:02:13,079 --> 03:02:16,239
you know, gut whatever agency they point him at. But

3602
03:02:16,360 --> 03:02:19,760
also right he got told no on H one b's

3603
03:02:20,360 --> 03:02:22,120
And so to me, I'm kind of curious to see

3604
03:02:22,120 --> 03:02:26,040
what the final deal is and where those various interest

3605
03:02:26,120 --> 03:02:27,600
groups kind of lie in the hierarchy.

3606
03:02:29,440 --> 03:02:32,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I'd say it in history it's always

3607
03:02:32,879 --> 03:02:36,440
been you know what the first forming of any sort

3608
03:02:36,479 --> 03:02:39,479
of property, middle class, you know that own stuff. They've

3609
03:02:39,479 --> 03:02:42,879
always tended to be extremely conservative as it goes back

3610
03:02:42,920 --> 03:02:46,000
to the Middle Ages, and then support of the elites

3611
03:02:46,120 --> 03:02:48,920
because they look and say, hey, we own a little

3612
03:02:48,920 --> 03:02:51,680
property and they own a lot of property. But it

3613
03:02:51,719 --> 03:02:54,159
doesn't matter. They're going to defend my right to own

3614
03:02:54,200 --> 03:02:56,799
my little bit of property, and I don't want my

3615
03:02:56,959 --> 03:03:00,079
little bit of property is subtracted to the mob. It

3616
03:03:00,120 --> 03:03:03,159
was always you know, historically the middle and the elite

3617
03:03:03,680 --> 03:03:07,879
banding together to keep the lower classes under control. Then

3618
03:03:07,879 --> 03:03:10,760
a weird thing happened in America in the twentieth century

3619
03:03:10,799 --> 03:03:14,000
where you get you know that the political class of

3620
03:03:14,120 --> 03:03:20,120
Washington bound the poor and the rich together. You know,

3621
03:03:20,600 --> 03:03:23,200
in war against the middle class. It's always, you know,

3622
03:03:23,239 --> 03:03:25,559
the upper class and the lower classes against the middle class.

3623
03:03:26,120 --> 03:03:29,360
And I think that's finally breaking down where you know,

3624
03:03:29,639 --> 03:03:33,879
I'm perfectly fine with the rich guys doing whatever la

3625
03:03:33,959 --> 03:03:36,559
need to do because at least I know who's accountable this.

3626
03:03:37,000 --> 03:03:39,879
For most of my life, I've never know who who

3627
03:03:40,040 --> 03:03:42,040
Who Do you blame for this? Everything get gets worse,

3628
03:03:42,079 --> 03:03:44,559
and both parties say, don't blame us, you voted for

3629
03:03:44,600 --> 03:03:47,360
the other guy. You know, it's this ridiculous game that

3630
03:03:47,399 --> 03:03:50,239
they play. And so having you know, a guy like

3631
03:03:50,360 --> 03:03:53,959
Musk or Zuckerbergler or what's his name, what's the guy

3632
03:03:54,000 --> 03:04:01,799
from from Amazon Bezos Besos, Yeah, stepping on the people

3633
03:04:01,840 --> 03:04:05,079
at the Washington Post and kicking them around good. I'm

3634
03:04:05,200 --> 03:04:07,399
fine with it because look at the rich guys take

3635
03:04:07,399 --> 03:04:09,319
control of the government and they're going to run things

3636
03:04:09,959 --> 03:04:11,079
and things don't go well.

3637
03:04:11,399 --> 03:04:13,680
Speaker 2: We know where to go, we know where they are.

3638
03:04:14,559 --> 03:04:16,799
Speaker 3: It's not going to be a problem. But when it's

3639
03:04:16,840 --> 03:04:19,479
this collection of people. There's just these faceless people in

3640
03:04:19,559 --> 03:04:21,879
charge of committees and stuff that you know, no one ever.

3641
03:04:21,760 --> 03:04:23,799
Speaker 2: Accountable for anything. So I'm.

3642
03:04:25,319 --> 03:04:28,319
Speaker 3: I'm very much in favor of seeing this these rich

3643
03:04:28,319 --> 03:04:31,200
guys start to be more assertive. But it's interesting though,

3644
03:04:31,600 --> 03:04:34,040
with the tech rich guys, is that so many of

3645
03:04:34,079 --> 03:04:38,879
them had this libertarianish outlook. You know, they allow, you know,

3646
03:04:38,879 --> 03:04:42,799
they adopted libertarianism in order to avoid the cultural stuff.

3647
03:04:43,840 --> 03:04:48,440
But what they found through libertarianism is the door to

3648
03:04:48,559 --> 03:04:51,440
our side that you know, it's a weird thing. I've

3649
03:04:51,559 --> 03:04:53,840
had a lot of former libertarians in my life who

3650
03:04:53,840 --> 03:04:57,040
have come over the Great Divide to my kind of politics,

3651
03:04:57,920 --> 03:05:01,520
and you know, it's not just the economic issues, it's

3652
03:05:01,559 --> 03:05:06,680
the human capital issues, the hierarchical issues. You know, they

3653
03:05:06,920 --> 03:05:09,680
come to find out that, hey, wait a second, Libertarianism

3654
03:05:09,719 --> 03:05:11,879
explained to me that no, people are not all the same,

3655
03:05:11,920 --> 03:05:14,559
and no people can't be yeoman farmers and independent and

3656
03:05:14,559 --> 03:05:15,360
all this stuff.

3657
03:05:15,399 --> 03:05:16,040
Speaker 2: You do need to.

3658
03:05:15,959 --> 03:05:18,440
Speaker 3: Control the masses, you need to have structures in place

3659
03:05:18,479 --> 03:05:20,959
to do that and so forth. And it's through the

3660
03:05:21,440 --> 03:05:25,559
bad results of libertarianism that they discover things like hierarchy

3661
03:05:25,639 --> 03:05:28,680
and the realities of human capital and end up on

3662
03:05:28,719 --> 03:05:30,840
this side. And I think the same process has happened

3663
03:05:30,879 --> 03:05:32,879
to these tech guys. I think they kind of went

3664
03:05:32,920 --> 03:05:35,639
through the same door. And even though you know they're

3665
03:05:35,639 --> 03:05:38,120
not you know, they're not going to be showing up

3666
03:05:38,120 --> 03:05:43,000
at the castle in Berkeley Springs for an event. They're

3667
03:05:43,040 --> 03:05:45,280
not going to be upset that those events happen. You know,

3668
03:05:45,319 --> 03:05:47,280
They're gonna be aware. They're going to know people who

3669
03:05:47,280 --> 03:05:49,680
go to those events, you know, and maybe they have

3670
03:05:49,719 --> 03:05:53,040
their own soares and where these guys meet. But it

3671
03:05:53,079 --> 03:05:55,120
seems like the same process. I mean, you know, I

3672
03:05:55,120 --> 03:05:57,000
remember the first time I ever went to an event.

3673
03:05:57,719 --> 03:06:00,559
I probably can't say the name of it YouTube, right,

3674
03:06:00,639 --> 03:06:04,600
So you know, there were so many people who used

3675
03:06:04,600 --> 03:06:07,200
to be libertarians and they were like they were they

3676
03:06:07,200 --> 03:06:11,159
were red pilled by Ron Paul, you know, of all things.

3677
03:06:11,639 --> 03:06:13,280
And I think the same thing's kind of happened with

3678
03:06:13,319 --> 03:06:16,200
the tech guys. But you know, again, I'm fine, I'm

3679
03:06:16,239 --> 03:06:19,680
okay by with rule by billionaires. I mean, somebody's got

3680
03:06:19,680 --> 03:06:21,040
to be in charge. And I would rather be a

3681
03:06:21,040 --> 03:06:25,000
guy who can send a spaceship up to the space

3682
03:06:25,040 --> 03:06:29,280
station and rescue people then some guy with a PhD.

3683
03:06:29,479 --> 03:06:31,840
And gender studies, you know.

3684
03:06:33,680 --> 03:06:37,040
Speaker 1: Well, and that's something that you know, I've sort of

3685
03:06:37,079 --> 03:06:41,360
made made peace with, right that you know, simply due

3686
03:06:41,440 --> 03:06:46,959
to the way humans are, there will always be an oligarchy, right,

3687
03:06:47,000 --> 03:06:51,040
That's simply how humans organized themselves. But you know, you

3688
03:06:51,040 --> 03:06:54,079
can make quality judgment between those two. You know, there

3689
03:06:54,079 --> 03:06:57,840
are some elites I'd rather have in charge rather than others.

3690
03:06:58,639 --> 03:07:03,360
And you know, to me right, and I could be wrong,

3691
03:07:03,479 --> 03:07:06,559
but I see this swap if it can stick, as

3692
03:07:07,040 --> 03:07:11,760
being beneficial. And it's not exactly a huge, you know,

3693
03:07:11,920 --> 03:07:14,719
a huge hurdle to clear. But the very fact that

3694
03:07:14,760 --> 03:07:17,840
these people don't seem to hate me, to want me dead,

3695
03:07:18,159 --> 03:07:23,040
and people like me to stop existing, well, you know

3696
03:07:23,559 --> 03:07:27,000
that's a win, right, It's certainly better than the alternative.

3697
03:07:27,399 --> 03:07:29,360
And that doesn't mean that this is like, you know,

3698
03:07:29,479 --> 03:07:33,000
the kind of like ideal philosopher King right come down

3699
03:07:33,040 --> 03:07:35,200
to lead us to heaven on Earth. But one of

3700
03:07:35,200 --> 03:07:39,600
the things I think about, and this is an interesting issue,

3701
03:07:39,760 --> 03:07:41,680
is you know the fact that the Trump administration and

3702
03:07:41,799 --> 03:07:46,639
Musk have been making noises about South Africa. Look, I have,

3703
03:07:46,920 --> 03:07:49,399
you know, a lot of friends in South Africa. You know,

3704
03:07:49,479 --> 03:07:53,120
I've I've met with Ernest you know who is recently

3705
03:07:53,120 --> 03:07:56,000
on Tucker you know, Conscious Caricle and I really like

3706
03:07:56,079 --> 03:07:58,079
those guys, you know, I have a certain affinity for them.

3707
03:07:58,319 --> 03:08:02,200
The Dutch Calvinists quite similar you know to my people,

3708
03:08:02,440 --> 03:08:04,280
you know, how they view the world. So there's some

3709
03:08:04,319 --> 03:08:07,600
kind of affinity there. But realistically, right, what has South

3710
03:08:07,639 --> 03:08:11,879
Africa existed as in our consciousness? Right? It's you know,

3711
03:08:12,200 --> 03:08:15,479
it is the rainbonation, right, we did it. We defeated racism.

3712
03:08:16,159 --> 03:08:18,399
And the fact that you have you know, Mark Rubio

3713
03:08:18,440 --> 03:08:23,399
basically kicking out the South African diplomat, you know, basically offering, hey,

3714
03:08:23,520 --> 03:08:26,600
you know, South Africans are you know, experiencing ethnic cleansing?

3715
03:08:26,639 --> 03:08:29,799
If they want to move to America, they can. That's

3716
03:08:29,840 --> 03:08:31,879
a strong indication that, you know, there's at least a

3717
03:08:31,920 --> 03:08:35,399
desire to appear as if you know, the Trump administration

3718
03:08:35,639 --> 03:08:39,000
doesn't hate white people, which again, like I've said, is

3719
03:08:39,040 --> 03:08:42,920
not the biggest hurdle to clear. But you know, compare

3720
03:08:42,959 --> 03:08:48,280
that to our our previous uh, our previous demented executive.

3721
03:08:48,360 --> 03:08:49,120
I'll leave it at that.

3722
03:08:50,000 --> 03:08:51,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, you know, look, Vance, we brought up

3723
03:08:51,760 --> 03:08:54,719
the whole two you know, the two tier tier starmer

3724
03:08:55,159 --> 03:08:58,319
you know, the two tier system. And and I mean again,

3725
03:08:58,639 --> 03:09:01,360
there's there's stuff coming out of administration you never thought

3726
03:09:01,360 --> 03:09:03,200
you would hear. You know, it's the kind of stuff

3727
03:09:03,200 --> 03:09:05,040
that got you fired from Twitters or got you thrown

3728
03:09:05,079 --> 03:09:08,079
off at Twitter rund. So you know, it's it's a

3729
03:09:08,079 --> 03:09:11,520
positive thing. I think, you know, I think it was

3730
03:09:11,600 --> 03:09:14,280
Charles Murray who said, you know, this is a long

3731
03:09:14,319 --> 03:09:17,959
time ago, before he got all squishy. He said, inevitably,

3732
03:09:18,440 --> 03:09:21,319
what's going to happen is that the elites are probably

3733
03:09:21,360 --> 03:09:25,440
going to become more racially aware than any group in

3734
03:09:25,479 --> 03:09:29,239
the country because for them, it's the only way in

3735
03:09:29,280 --> 03:09:33,040
which they can remain elites. It's a necessary reality they

3736
03:09:33,040 --> 03:09:35,559
have to embrace. And I suspect that's really what we're

3737
03:09:35,559 --> 03:09:39,520
seeing is that, you know, I've called it civilizationalism. You know,

3738
03:09:39,559 --> 03:09:41,280
we're not going to I mean, he's got you know,

3739
03:09:41,280 --> 03:09:43,040
these guys run around saying, oh, you know, we want

3740
03:09:43,040 --> 03:09:44,719
to have an ethno state or something like that. I've

3741
03:09:44,760 --> 03:09:47,680
always just shake my head at it because it's that's

3742
03:09:47,719 --> 03:09:50,399
not who we're going to be in North America. What

3743
03:09:50,399 --> 03:09:52,440
we're going to have is a civilization and it will

3744
03:09:52,520 --> 03:09:56,079
be a hierarchy to that civilization and we'll just accept it.

3745
03:09:56,600 --> 03:10:00,280
And that comes with some duties. You know, the people

3746
03:10:00,280 --> 03:10:03,879
at let the lower down they are, you know, those

3747
03:10:03,879 --> 03:10:06,319
are people have to be looked after. You have to

3748
03:10:06,360 --> 03:10:08,680
make sure their neighborhoods are as safe as you can

3749
03:10:08,680 --> 03:10:11,680
make them, that they have food in the basic and

3750
03:10:11,680 --> 03:10:14,200
so forth, and they have order imposed upon them. There

3751
03:10:14,200 --> 03:10:16,200
are certain parts of this country will just have to

3752
03:10:16,239 --> 03:10:18,399
have a HOBSI in existence where order will have to

3753
03:10:18,440 --> 03:10:20,680
be imposed. I used to live in one of them.

3754
03:10:20,879 --> 03:10:22,719
You know, I looked at Baltimore for a long time.

3755
03:10:23,440 --> 03:10:26,120
You could make Baltimore better, but it means abandoning all

3756
03:10:26,159 --> 03:10:30,920
these ridiculous abstract ideas about equality and openness and all

3757
03:10:31,000 --> 03:10:33,639
you know, democracy and all the other junk. No, there

3758
03:10:33,639 --> 03:10:36,680
should be a dictator who's in charge and runs things

3759
03:10:36,719 --> 03:10:39,200
with an iron fist. Everyone will be happier as a

3760
03:10:39,200 --> 03:10:41,600
result of it. But you don't have to do that

3761
03:10:41,639 --> 03:10:43,840
in Salt Lake City, Utah. You know, you can have

3762
03:10:44,159 --> 03:10:47,360
whatever kind of government you want there because the human

3763
03:10:47,399 --> 03:10:51,200
capital is better. This is just a practical reality. And

3764
03:10:51,440 --> 03:10:52,719
I think, you know, it kind of gets to one

3765
03:10:52,760 --> 03:10:55,000
of my other themes, and that is we're experiencing the

3766
03:10:55,159 --> 03:10:59,040
end of ideology. The last ideology is dying out American progressivism.

3767
03:10:59,399 --> 03:11:02,239
So it means all these goofy ideas about democracy and

3768
03:11:02,280 --> 03:11:05,559
openness and fairness and all this. Now what's going to

3769
03:11:05,600 --> 03:11:08,520
matter in the future is practical results.

3770
03:11:09,159 --> 03:11:09,399
Speaker 2: You know.

3771
03:11:09,559 --> 03:11:13,959
Speaker 3: Do we have cheaper food and cheaper energy and safer neighborhoods.

3772
03:11:14,040 --> 03:11:16,840
Those are things that matter. How we accomplish them. We're

3773
03:11:16,840 --> 03:11:19,600
not going to get hung up on and that's a

3774
03:11:19,600 --> 03:11:21,360
good thing, you know, I mean, you know, you see,

3775
03:11:21,399 --> 03:11:23,600
because other parts of the world are headed down this way.

3776
03:11:23,639 --> 03:11:26,719
I mean, the Chinese, for goodness sakes, have abandoned communism,

3777
03:11:27,799 --> 03:11:32,079
the Russians abandoned communism, you know, you know, so we

3778
03:11:32,159 --> 03:11:35,239
have to kind of join the other great powers in

3779
03:11:35,360 --> 03:11:38,600
being practical and pragmatic. And I think it's possible. I

3780
03:11:38,600 --> 03:11:40,959
think that maybe what we're experiencing.

3781
03:11:40,399 --> 03:11:45,239
Speaker 1: Now, so we are fast coming up on time. Ze Man,

3782
03:11:45,399 --> 03:11:48,799
I really enjoyed this conversation despite my health issues. I

3783
03:11:48,799 --> 03:11:52,920
hopefully it wasn't complete dribbling more on But if people

3784
03:11:52,959 --> 03:11:54,879
want to find more view in your work, what's a

3785
03:11:54,879 --> 03:11:55,840
good way for them to do that?

3786
03:11:56,680 --> 03:11:58,559
Speaker 3: Now? The easiest way is to go to the z

3787
03:11:58,719 --> 03:12:01,479
man dot com or you go to the dissident right

3788
03:12:01,559 --> 03:12:03,879
dot com or the Dissident writer dot com. I got

3789
03:12:03,879 --> 03:12:06,000
a bunch of different domains, but the zooman dot com

3790
03:12:06,040 --> 03:12:06,680
is the easiest one.

3791
03:12:06,719 --> 03:12:07,280
Speaker 2: It has all my.

3792
03:12:07,239 --> 03:12:10,319
Speaker 3: Stuff there, post something every day. I have a podcast

3793
03:12:10,360 --> 03:12:12,479
every Friday. It has links to my pay per view

3794
03:12:12,559 --> 03:12:16,719
site so you can get additional content. Twitter, gab accounts,

3795
03:12:16,760 --> 03:12:17,399
all that junk.

3796
03:12:18,959 --> 03:12:22,440
Speaker 1: Well, I highly recommend your show. It's one of the few,

3797
03:12:22,799 --> 03:12:27,239
actually that I listened to. As a matter of course,

3798
03:12:28,440 --> 03:12:31,520
there are a lot of people who produce content. I

3799
03:12:31,559 --> 03:12:34,399
do realize the irony in saying that, but very few

3800
03:12:34,399 --> 03:12:37,200
that I know consider worthwhile enough that I, you know,

3801
03:12:37,239 --> 03:12:39,239
listen to whatever you put out, So I highly recommend

3802
03:12:39,280 --> 03:12:41,920
to that. As far as my stuff right. The J

3803
03:12:42,040 --> 03:12:45,680
Burton Show is available on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, anywhere you

3804
03:12:45,719 --> 03:12:47,559
listen to podcasts. If you want to support us, you

3805
03:12:47,600 --> 03:12:49,520
can do so with the links down in the description,

3806
03:12:50,280 --> 03:12:54,000
or you can check out our sponsor sponsors Axios Remote

3807
03:12:54,000 --> 03:12:57,559
Fitness and Coaching and then North Appalachian Supply if you've

3808
03:12:57,559 --> 03:13:00,559
got any gear needs. Again, Zeman, I appreciate it, and

3809
03:13:00,639 --> 03:13:02,840
everyone at home, keep your head up. The life can't

3810
03:13:02,879 --> 03:13:03,959
last forever. Good Night,