WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.040 --> 00:00:02.919 What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the 2 00:00:02.919 --> 00:00:05.839 Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to keep the 3 00:00:05.879 --> 00:00:09.240 conversation about Leslie Groff going and we're going to take 4 00:00:09.240 --> 00:00:11.800 a look at the three to zero two report that 5 00:00:11.880 --> 00:00:18.239 she gave to the FBI. Federal Bureau of Investigation. Leslie 6 00:00:18.280 --> 00:00:21.679 Groff date of birth redacted was interviewed pursuing to a 7 00:00:21.679 --> 00:00:25.760 proffer agreement at thirty nine Broadway, Suite sixteen ten, New York, 8 00:00:25.800 --> 00:00:29.920 New York. Present for the proffer was Groff's attorney, Michael Backner. 9 00:00:30.399 --> 00:00:34.520 Also present for the proffer was an assistant United States Attorneys 10 00:00:34.560 --> 00:00:39.159 redacted and redacted, along with special Agent redacted. After being 11 00:00:39.159 --> 00:00:43.439 advised of the identity of the above listed individuals and 12 00:00:43.520 --> 00:00:46.560 the nature of the interview, Groff provided the following information. 13 00:00:47.200 --> 00:00:50.520 Groff is in retirement along with her husband. Groff has 14 00:00:50.520 --> 00:00:54.359 a redacted son. Groff enjoys exercising and listening to books 15 00:00:54.359 --> 00:00:58.799 on tape. Groff resigned in July twenty nineteen from working 16 00:00:58.840 --> 00:01:02.679 for Jeffrey Epstein. Groff had started working for Epstein in 17 00:01:02.719 --> 00:01:05.840 February of two thousand and one. Graff attended college in 18 00:01:05.879 --> 00:01:10.680 North Texas and is a UTD graduate. Groff lived in Texas, 19 00:01:10.959 --> 00:01:13.359 then met a man who lived in New Jersey, which 20 00:01:13.400 --> 00:01:16.280 caused her to move to the area. Groff worked for 21 00:01:16.359 --> 00:01:19.480 nine years at an office supply company. Groff then divorced. 22 00:01:20.000 --> 00:01:23.799 Groff then worked at Nordstrom. Groff met her current husband 23 00:01:24.040 --> 00:01:27.200 at a triathlon. Groff was still working at Nordstrom at 24 00:01:27.239 --> 00:01:29.920 the time. Groff wanted to be an event planner and 25 00:01:29.959 --> 00:01:31.920 thought Wall Street would be a great place to work 26 00:01:32.599 --> 00:01:36.400 a headhunter. Russell found a resume on Monster. Groff was 27 00:01:36.439 --> 00:01:38.680 looking at a job to work for the Knicks, but 28 00:01:38.840 --> 00:01:41.920 it was taken. Groff met with Russell and he told 29 00:01:41.959 --> 00:01:44.439 her that there was a job to organize one man's life. 30 00:01:44.840 --> 00:01:48.959 This man was Epstein, a Manhattan socialite. Graff had never 31 00:01:49.000 --> 00:01:52.719 heard of Epstein before this. Groff interviewed for the position. 32 00:01:52.959 --> 00:01:57.200 Groff interviewed with redacted redacted, who was Glenn Maxwell, Maxwell's 33 00:01:57.200 --> 00:02:00.359 assistant at the time. Then Groff interviewed with maxim Well 34 00:02:00.480 --> 00:02:03.200 before interviewing with Epstein. The next day, when he was 35 00:02:03.239 --> 00:02:07.200 in town, Groff interviewed at four fifty seven Madison on 36 00:02:07.239 --> 00:02:10.039 the fourth floor. This location was part of a palace. 37 00:02:11.039 --> 00:02:14.080 Groff was in the front office before going to Epstein's office. 38 00:02:14.439 --> 00:02:16.879 Groff met with all three people on the same day. 39 00:02:17.599 --> 00:02:20.240 It was a normal interview about being an executive assistant. 40 00:02:20.879 --> 00:02:23.719 During the interview, the phone kept bringing. Epstein would talk 41 00:02:23.840 --> 00:02:26.759 then hang up. It seemed to be a very vibrant office. 42 00:02:27.520 --> 00:02:30.439 Groff had to sign a non disclosure agreement. If Groff 43 00:02:30.479 --> 00:02:33.960 spoke about business people, which Groff thought included Les Wexner, 44 00:02:34.560 --> 00:02:37.439 she would owe him one hundred thousand dollars. Groff had 45 00:02:37.479 --> 00:02:40.719 never seen anything like the non disclosure agreement before working 46 00:02:41.000 --> 00:02:43.919 for Epstein. Groff had her own office in the back. 47 00:02:44.280 --> 00:02:47.879 Others that worked at the office were two attorneys, an assistant, 48 00:02:47.879 --> 00:02:51.360 a trader, a travel assistant redacted or redacted or redacted 49 00:02:51.400 --> 00:02:54.719 and redacted. Maxwell came in and out of the office. 50 00:02:54.800 --> 00:02:58.240 Epstein did not work a nine to five schedule. Epstein 51 00:02:58.280 --> 00:03:01.159 gave Groff pages, including a call, who he wanted to 52 00:03:01.199 --> 00:03:05.400 see and the appointments. Groff had to reorganize and shift 53 00:03:05.439 --> 00:03:08.800 things at the time. Groff made all the phone calls, 54 00:03:09.039 --> 00:03:12.560 including calling the driver, chef, and other people. Groff had 55 00:03:12.599 --> 00:03:16.039 two phones on her desk. It was hectic. Grof was 56 00:03:16.080 --> 00:03:19.520 told that mistakes were not tolerated. It was challenging, but 57 00:03:19.599 --> 00:03:23.400 Graff like that. Sometimes Graff went home in tears sometimes 58 00:03:23.400 --> 00:03:26.479 for messing up his day. Graff felt it was pretty 59 00:03:26.520 --> 00:03:30.759 incredible to see all the people Epstein dealt with in politics, television, etc. 60 00:03:32.120 --> 00:03:35.520 Graff felt wow. Prior to working for Epstein, she never 61 00:03:35.560 --> 00:03:38.960 knew people who On the plane Graff found out about 62 00:03:39.000 --> 00:03:43.120 Maxwell's father in life. Grof felt like Epstein and Maxwell's 63 00:03:43.120 --> 00:03:46.680 lives were the lifestyle of the rich and famous. Graff 64 00:03:46.719 --> 00:03:48.719 described getting into the office. She would have to go 65 00:03:48.840 --> 00:03:52.039 in through the palace and go straight through the hotel portion. 66 00:03:53.000 --> 00:03:56.840 The left side was where Epstein's office was located. Groff 67 00:03:56.840 --> 00:03:59.919 thought on the fourth floor was where the office was located. 68 00:04:00.520 --> 00:04:02.840 There were other businesses in the building. They had a 69 00:04:02.919 --> 00:04:06.360 view of the Fifth Avenue Cathedral. Once off of the elevator, 70 00:04:06.520 --> 00:04:09.319 there was a desk for the receptionist. Groff could not 71 00:04:09.479 --> 00:04:12.840 remember if this was there the day she left. After 72 00:04:12.919 --> 00:04:15.560 going straight, there would be a large office for two 73 00:04:15.599 --> 00:04:20.079 accountants and the trader. The accountant was Eric Ganey, who 74 00:04:20.120 --> 00:04:23.720 had an assistant accountant, Bella Cline. The trader was Harry Beller. 75 00:04:24.160 --> 00:04:27.000 The person who was Epstein's assistant would be at the 76 00:04:27.160 --> 00:04:30.839 receptionist desk. Someone was always there and it changed over time. 77 00:04:31.360 --> 00:04:36.720 There was redacted, redacted, redacted, redacted, and redacted. The controller 78 00:04:37.199 --> 00:04:41.199 was a mad Hanna. When Ganey left, he was replaced 79 00:04:41.199 --> 00:04:44.480 by Richard Kahn. To the right of the office where 80 00:04:44.480 --> 00:04:48.160 the attorneys Darren Endyke and Jeff Schantz. Straight back was 81 00:04:48.199 --> 00:04:52.360 Groff's office. Towards the left was Epstein's office, and towards 82 00:04:52.360 --> 00:04:55.600 the right was a desk for Maxwell and a assistant redacted. 83 00:04:56.639 --> 00:05:01.439 Lauren Quitner was an assistant the attorneys. There was a 84 00:05:01.480 --> 00:05:05.560 desk for redacted, which changed or redacted redacted. When Redacted left. 85 00:05:06.399 --> 00:05:10.000 Epstein wanted an estate manager, which kept turning over. There 86 00:05:10.040 --> 00:05:12.360 were a lot of people in the office. They first 87 00:05:12.360 --> 00:05:15.839 started building Maxwell's house. After her house was built, she 88 00:05:16.000 --> 00:05:19.279 moved her and her assistant to her house. Maxwell was 89 00:05:19.360 --> 00:05:21.600 maybe at the office once a week and brought her 90 00:05:21.600 --> 00:05:26.480 dog Max. Full time employees, including the attorneys, Quitner, redacted, 91 00:05:27.079 --> 00:05:29.839 and the people in the front office. Groff worked nine 92 00:05:29.879 --> 00:05:32.480 to five Monday through Friday for the first couple of years. 93 00:05:32.879 --> 00:05:35.560 Groff then became pregnant and had a son and was 94 00:05:35.600 --> 00:05:38.680 off for about three to four months. Redacted took over 95 00:05:38.759 --> 00:05:42.439 while Groff was out on maternity leave. Approximately a year 96 00:05:42.439 --> 00:05:46.240 and a half later, Maxwell's assistant left and Redacted moved 97 00:05:46.240 --> 00:05:49.920 back to being her assistant. Groff started a job share 98 00:05:50.279 --> 00:05:54.720 where she worked Tuesday, Wednesday, and Thursday, and redacted worked 99 00:05:54.759 --> 00:05:58.240 Monday and Friday. Epstein would leave New York Friday and 100 00:05:58.319 --> 00:06:01.240 return Monday night. Epstein wanted Groff the to do the 101 00:06:01.319 --> 00:06:04.839 call list. Epstein called in the morning to schedule business 102 00:06:04.839 --> 00:06:09.600 meetings architects, designers. When Grof would think he was done, 103 00:06:09.959 --> 00:06:12.160 he decided he'd want to do it all over again. 104 00:06:12.759 --> 00:06:15.399 Groff remembered seeing an invoice of a carpet for an 105 00:06:15.439 --> 00:06:19.079 airplane that was more than she made back then. Groff 106 00:06:19.120 --> 00:06:23.560 did not use email. Epstein called constantly. Epstein told her 107 00:06:23.560 --> 00:06:26.480 to call a certain individual, then he would want an 108 00:06:26.519 --> 00:06:30.680 immediate call back. Grof relaid messages, make and break appointments, 109 00:06:30.879 --> 00:06:36.160 and contact houses. Groff would have Jojo sit outside certain locations, 110 00:06:36.519 --> 00:06:39.360 but he did not like. People would come, eat, but 111 00:06:39.439 --> 00:06:44.319 he would not. Epstein would not like wasting time. The 112 00:06:44.360 --> 00:06:47.560 first time Epstein laid into Grof was when she moved 113 00:06:47.600 --> 00:06:50.560 an appointment and forgot to tell the other person. Epstein 114 00:06:50.600 --> 00:06:52.920 did not let it go. Groff ruined his whole day, 115 00:06:53.399 --> 00:06:56.560 saying he can't get that time back. Graff would tell 116 00:06:56.560 --> 00:06:59.360 the pilot when Epstein wanted to leave. For example, Graff 117 00:06:59.360 --> 00:07:01.959 would tell the pilot he would want to leave tomorrow 118 00:07:02.000 --> 00:07:05.319 at four to Palm Beach. Graff did not make airline 119 00:07:05.319 --> 00:07:10.079 reservations at the time. Redacted made those reservations. Then Epstein 120 00:07:10.160 --> 00:07:13.720 told Groff to tell Redacted to make the reservations. A 121 00:07:13.720 --> 00:07:17.279 lot of people traveled on Epstein's plane. Epstein might tell Groff. 122 00:07:17.480 --> 00:07:20.000 The lingo he used was do you need a ride? 123 00:07:20.360 --> 00:07:22.759 Graff would call and ask if he wanted friends, then 124 00:07:22.800 --> 00:07:25.800 Groff would call them. The pilot Larry needed to know, 125 00:07:26.199 --> 00:07:30.120 Groff would ask Epstein, then she would relay that information 126 00:07:30.199 --> 00:07:33.759 to Larry. Sometimes Epstein told Groff who was traveling with him, 127 00:07:34.000 --> 00:07:37.079 and other times he told Larry himself. Groff talked with 128 00:07:37.079 --> 00:07:41.439 Epstein when he was away. Epstein often traveled with Maxwell. 129 00:07:43.360 --> 00:07:46.079 The first year, Redacted traveled often with them as well. 130 00:07:46.519 --> 00:07:50.160 Then Redacted traveled with them. The assistants traveled with Epstein. 131 00:07:50.639 --> 00:07:54.000 Ted Meister was on a plane a lot. He liked 132 00:07:54.040 --> 00:07:57.160 to go to Palm Beach. Maxwell and Redacted, we're usually 133 00:07:57.160 --> 00:08:01.399 on the plane with Epstein, Maxwell traveled quite a bit. 134 00:08:01.600 --> 00:08:04.680 Groff thought Maxwell did her own thing. Groff was not 135 00:08:04.759 --> 00:08:08.199 Maxwell's assistant and did not see her as much. Maxwell 136 00:08:08.279 --> 00:08:11.560 was a big part of Epstein's life. Maxwell introduced Epstein 137 00:08:11.600 --> 00:08:14.199 to a lot of people in her circle. This was 138 00:08:14.199 --> 00:08:18.759 Groff's perception, because Groff knew her background. Groff's impression was 139 00:08:18.800 --> 00:08:23.000 that she knew that was how Epstein met Royalty through Maxwell. 140 00:08:23.279 --> 00:08:26.240 Maxwell did not talk to Groff. Groff never had a 141 00:08:26.240 --> 00:08:30.920 normal conversation with Maxwell or Epstein. Maxwell told Groff she 142 00:08:31.000 --> 00:08:35.240 was not to engage in frivolous conversation with Epstein. If 143 00:08:35.279 --> 00:08:38.279 Groff bought movie tickets for Epstein, she was not allowed 144 00:08:38.279 --> 00:08:41.559 to ask if he liked the movie. The next day. 145 00:08:41.720 --> 00:08:43.519 Groff did not have a lot to do with the 146 00:08:43.519 --> 00:08:47.679 Clinton trip. Maxwell dealt with the details. Groff perception was 147 00:08:47.720 --> 00:08:50.639 that Maxwell knew Clinton first, but Groff did not know 148 00:08:50.720 --> 00:08:55.159 for sure. Groff recalled conversations with Maxwell in the beginning, 149 00:08:55.480 --> 00:08:59.279 probably around Groff's first week. Maxwell told her you're here 150 00:08:59.320 --> 00:09:02.440 to work. Maxwell told her that Epstein did not need 151 00:09:02.480 --> 00:09:05.720 extra conversation and that she was not allowed to fratnize 152 00:09:05.799 --> 00:09:08.639 on the phone. That the people she spoke to were 153 00:09:08.639 --> 00:09:12.039 Epstein's friends, not Groff's friends, and Graff found this similar 154 00:09:12.039 --> 00:09:15.679 to Wall Street and that she could not fratnize. Groff 155 00:09:15.759 --> 00:09:18.360 was asked to go to a party. This was probably 156 00:09:18.399 --> 00:09:21.480 within the first month of working for Epstein. Graf went 157 00:09:21.519 --> 00:09:24.200 to the party with her husband, who knew other Wall 158 00:09:24.240 --> 00:09:28.440 Street people. Epstein found out and torched her. The following monday, 159 00:09:28.840 --> 00:09:31.559 Epstein told Groff he was going to fire her, but 160 00:09:31.639 --> 00:09:35.000 put her on probation instead. Groff had to keep herself 161 00:09:35.080 --> 00:09:38.440 totally separate. It made sense to Groff, so she never 162 00:09:38.480 --> 00:09:41.960 did it again. From the beginning, massage was a part 163 00:09:41.960 --> 00:09:45.919 of Epstein's day. There were normal appointments. Groff thought Maxwell 164 00:09:45.960 --> 00:09:48.519 told her that Epstein had to have a massage every day. 165 00:09:49.000 --> 00:09:52.679 Redacted and redacted trained Groff too, but Groff thought Maxwell 166 00:09:52.720 --> 00:09:56.080 told her that it was presented like it was totally normal. 167 00:09:56.360 --> 00:10:00.039 Redacted and redacted had been there prior to Groff. No 168 00:10:00.080 --> 00:10:02.879 one seemed like it was out of the ordinary. Graff's 169 00:10:02.960 --> 00:10:06.240 job was to make appointments to Groff. Making massage appointments 170 00:10:06.519 --> 00:10:09.120 was just another appointment that she had to make for Epstein. 171 00:10:09.840 --> 00:10:12.600 Epstein would call Groff in the morning and say something 172 00:10:12.720 --> 00:10:14.720 like call redacted and see if she can do a 173 00:10:14.759 --> 00:10:18.679 massage at four. Epstein would then call Groff every fifteen minutes. 174 00:10:19.480 --> 00:10:22.440 If Groff told Epstein that she could not get redacted, 175 00:10:22.600 --> 00:10:25.519 he would tell Graff to call someone else. There was 176 00:10:25.559 --> 00:10:28.840 a directory of contacts, not just massage people. Anyone could 177 00:10:28.879 --> 00:10:32.360 go in and update the list. Everyone had access. It 178 00:10:32.399 --> 00:10:35.759 was just kept on the computer in an old, antiquated system. 179 00:10:36.240 --> 00:10:38.600 Groff thought it was just a file on the computer. 180 00:10:38.840 --> 00:10:42.159 They used PCs, not Apple computers. They had a message 181 00:10:42.159 --> 00:10:44.840 sheet and directory. There was an it guy who came 182 00:10:44.879 --> 00:10:48.360 every so often if they had computer problems. When Grof 183 00:10:48.399 --> 00:10:51.200 was told to call someone, she would pull the phone 184 00:10:51.240 --> 00:10:54.600 number from the directory. Epstein gave Groff a name and 185 00:10:54.720 --> 00:10:57.080 phone number, but if the person had been around for 186 00:10:57.120 --> 00:11:00.120 a while, the number would be in the computer. For 187 00:11:00.200 --> 00:11:03.360 massages in New York at Epstein's residence, Groff scheduled for 188 00:11:03.480 --> 00:11:06.559 New York. Graff thought she may have scheduled massage for 189 00:11:06.600 --> 00:11:09.159 Epstein's pom Beach residence, but it was not as much. 190 00:11:09.879 --> 00:11:12.759 When Epstein left New York and took an assistant with him, 191 00:11:13.000 --> 00:11:15.799 the assistant took over the daily things in Palm Beach, 192 00:11:15.840 --> 00:11:20.000 New Mexico, and Paris. Groff had a call list every 193 00:11:20.120 --> 00:11:22.759 day of people she had to call for Epstein outside 194 00:11:22.759 --> 00:11:25.159 of New York. Graff did not know who scheduled the 195 00:11:25.200 --> 00:11:29.600 massage appointments. Graff did not recall specifically making appointments outside 196 00:11:29.639 --> 00:11:32.639 of New York, but stated that it was possible. Graff 197 00:11:32.679 --> 00:11:37.360 definitely made appointments in New York. Grot that Maxwell made 198 00:11:37.360 --> 00:11:40.559 an extra book. Groff described the book as super thick 199 00:11:40.759 --> 00:11:43.480 that was printed in a larger type to see. It 200 00:11:43.519 --> 00:11:47.039 was a little black book. Maxwell had them printed and bound. 201 00:11:47.679 --> 00:11:49.799 Graff thought she wanted to have them on the plane 202 00:11:50.480 --> 00:11:53.559 or next to the phones. Groff recalled seeing one on 203 00:11:53.600 --> 00:11:57.440 her desk. The black books were around. There was one 204 00:11:57.480 --> 00:12:00.200 on Groff's desk when she first started working there. They 205 00:12:00.200 --> 00:12:03.600 were next to Epstein's phones on the desk. Groff did 206 00:12:03.600 --> 00:12:06.600 not know why she associated the books to Maxwell. They 207 00:12:06.600 --> 00:12:10.200 were there before Groff worked there. Groff thought that the 208 00:12:10.200 --> 00:12:13.240 books had been updated. Graff did not know where they 209 00:12:13.240 --> 00:12:16.240 were printed. Graff did not use the books. She used 210 00:12:16.240 --> 00:12:19.559 a computer. Groff thought the books were everywhere, but maybe 211 00:12:19.759 --> 00:12:22.440 not in the accounting office. The books were at his 212 00:12:22.519 --> 00:12:25.279 homes they were on the desk and rooms. There were 213 00:12:25.320 --> 00:12:27.600 a lot of important people in the books and their 214 00:12:27.639 --> 00:12:33.159 phone numbers, including politicians, actors, Wall Street individuals, and royalty. 215 00:12:33.320 --> 00:12:36.120 Groff was not supposed to take the book home. Graff 216 00:12:36.159 --> 00:12:39.360 thought that the book fizzled out. It made sense that 217 00:12:39.399 --> 00:12:41.879 Epstein wanted them next to the phones. It was a 218 00:12:41.919 --> 00:12:45.600 tool for contacts. The book went away, but Graff did 219 00:12:45.600 --> 00:12:49.399 not know when this happened. They changed over to Mac computers. 220 00:12:50.600 --> 00:12:53.759 Epstein wanted to keep things simple. Epstein wanted a list 221 00:12:53.759 --> 00:12:57.279 of dentists, scientists, etc. Graft did not think that she 222 00:12:57.480 --> 00:13:00.600 was there when the directory was first made, but she 223 00:13:00.720 --> 00:13:04.799 was not sure. Maxwell was an office manager and had 224 00:13:04.840 --> 00:13:08.840 stationary made. Maxwell may have asked redacted to have them made. 225 00:13:09.279 --> 00:13:12.399 Groff thought maybe she was assuming that Maxwell made them 226 00:13:12.960 --> 00:13:15.360 Agent note. At this point in the interview, Groff was 227 00:13:15.360 --> 00:13:18.440 shown a document with a list of names and contact information. 228 00:13:18.879 --> 00:13:23.080 This document is attached in one a Graff advised, this 229 00:13:23.159 --> 00:13:26.720 looks like people he'd contact. Groff did not recognize this 230 00:13:26.759 --> 00:13:29.480 specific document, but it looked like something Groff could have 231 00:13:29.559 --> 00:13:32.840 typed up. Graff recognized the names on the document. It 232 00:13:32.879 --> 00:13:35.840 seemed typical of when Epstein with travel a word document 233 00:13:35.960 --> 00:13:39.519 possibly could have been Groff, who copied and pasted from 234 00:13:39.559 --> 00:13:43.080 the directory to word using a Mac computer. Grof could 235 00:13:43.080 --> 00:13:45.440 copy and paste, but she did not think she could 236 00:13:45.440 --> 00:13:49.000 copy and paste a word using the older computers. The 237 00:13:49.159 --> 00:13:53.639 list of people's names and numbers was constant. Agent note. 238 00:13:53.799 --> 00:13:57.159 Groff was shown a document titled messuses. This document is 239 00:13:57.200 --> 00:14:00.759 attached in one A. Graff advised that this document looked 240 00:14:00.879 --> 00:14:03.360 like something that would definitely be in the office that 241 00:14:03.440 --> 00:14:07.200 Epstein asked to be put together. There were other documents 242 00:14:07.200 --> 00:14:10.720 made for architects, et cetera. Graff advised this document did 243 00:14:10.720 --> 00:14:14.039 not look familiar. Groff did not recall making this document, 244 00:14:14.320 --> 00:14:16.799 but stated she was not saying that she did not 245 00:14:16.919 --> 00:14:21.399 create it. Graff advised the document looked old. Groff recognized 246 00:14:21.399 --> 00:14:24.679 the names. To Groff, this was just another list. Graff 247 00:14:24.720 --> 00:14:27.360 recalled having to make a list of all the ted 248 00:14:27.399 --> 00:14:30.759 speakers when she started. The list printed out would be 249 00:14:30.799 --> 00:14:33.399 more for Epstein to take with them. Groff used the 250 00:14:33.440 --> 00:14:36.960 directory more agent note. Groff was shown a document with 251 00:14:37.000 --> 00:14:41.480 the title massuses from January. This document is attached in 252 00:14:41.559 --> 00:14:45.600 one A. Groff's first thought was that jan men January 253 00:14:45.840 --> 00:14:48.759 new user on the document was not significant to Groff. 254 00:14:49.000 --> 00:14:52.879 The document stated last saved by Leslie Groff. Graff advised, 255 00:14:52.879 --> 00:14:55.039 this look like a list that she could have put together. 256 00:14:55.440 --> 00:14:58.720 This was definitely something Epstein would have wanted. It looks 257 00:14:58.759 --> 00:15:01.600 like something Groff could have done, but she cannot recall 258 00:15:01.639 --> 00:15:05.080 this specific list. Groff made a lot of lists. If 259 00:15:05.080 --> 00:15:07.879 Epstein traveled out of town, he would want to see people. 260 00:15:08.200 --> 00:15:11.080 Sometimes he would tell Groff to add new people. He 261 00:15:11.120 --> 00:15:13.480 went to Harvard, he would want a list of professors 262 00:15:13.960 --> 00:15:15.799 he would want to talk with while he was there. 263 00:15:16.320 --> 00:15:19.919 When Groff would call the schedule massage appointments, she would 264 00:15:19.919 --> 00:15:23.240 say something like, high redacted, how are you. Mister Epstein's 265 00:15:23.240 --> 00:15:25.200 in New York and he's wanting to know if you 266 00:15:25.240 --> 00:15:28.039 can give him a massage at four. The phone calls 267 00:15:28.080 --> 00:15:31.080 were short and to the point. A lot of times 268 00:15:31.080 --> 00:15:34.360 when Groff called, the females were at casting calls and 269 00:15:34.399 --> 00:15:36.960 they would not know how long they would be there, 270 00:15:37.240 --> 00:15:39.679 so they would have to call Groff back. When Epstein 271 00:15:39.679 --> 00:15:42.440 would call back for his massage, he would tell Groff 272 00:15:42.480 --> 00:15:45.559 to forget that one and call redacted. Groff would call 273 00:15:45.600 --> 00:15:49.120 someone else and sometimes have to leave a message. Sometimes 274 00:15:49.200 --> 00:15:53.399 Groff heard street noises in the background. Groff called females 275 00:15:53.559 --> 00:15:57.960 and mel massuse. Groff distinctly remembered females being on casting 276 00:15:58.000 --> 00:16:01.600 calls because it was annoying because she wanted to get 277 00:16:01.759 --> 00:16:04.120 on with her day and could not because she had 278 00:16:04.120 --> 00:16:08.120 to schedule a massage appointment. Scheduling massage appointments was around 279 00:16:08.159 --> 00:16:12.200 one percent of Groff's job. Groff left a lot of messages. 280 00:16:12.679 --> 00:16:15.960 People would not answer their phones. Sometimes people call Groff 281 00:16:16.039 --> 00:16:18.960 asking to see Epstein for a massage. Everybody wanted to 282 00:16:19.000 --> 00:16:22.679 see him anytime Groff called someone, not just massage people. 283 00:16:23.000 --> 00:16:26.600 People just jumped to meet with Epstein. Graff thought that 284 00:16:26.639 --> 00:16:29.679 Epstein was a money manager. His biggest client was Wexner. 285 00:16:30.080 --> 00:16:32.440 Groff knew this from the beginning because of the non 286 00:16:32.480 --> 00:16:35.600 disclosure agreement she had to sign. Graff thought that Epstein 287 00:16:35.679 --> 00:16:38.960 had other clients. Graff thought Epstein was doing some trades. 288 00:16:39.559 --> 00:16:42.679 Epstein would tell Groff to get someone he did not 289 00:16:42.799 --> 00:16:45.440 have the number of a trader. Groff had anxiety trying 290 00:16:45.480 --> 00:16:48.480 to get a trader. Epstein did a lot with politics. 291 00:16:49.039 --> 00:16:52.440 Epstein was a generous person who gave to charity tables 292 00:16:52.639 --> 00:16:57.440 and wanted to be anonymous. Epstein seemed very busy. Epstein 293 00:16:57.480 --> 00:17:00.759 had an interest in decorating. Groff was ful by the 294 00:17:00.799 --> 00:17:04.160 contacts he had all over the world. Graff was impressed 295 00:17:04.160 --> 00:17:07.279 by that Groff had to learn how to dial overseas numbers. 296 00:17:08.200 --> 00:17:12.200 Maxwell was an office manager. This was how Groff was 297 00:17:12.200 --> 00:17:16.119 introduced to Maxwell. Maxwell was Epstein's best friend. Graff saw 298 00:17:16.160 --> 00:17:19.039 Epstein torch Maxwell at times. He was angry with her. 299 00:17:19.440 --> 00:17:23.079 Epstein got mad at his attorneys in the office. Sometimes 300 00:17:23.079 --> 00:17:25.920 Maxwell left with her head down. Graff did not like 301 00:17:25.960 --> 00:17:29.079 hering Epstein yell at chance, but he did not walk 302 00:17:29.119 --> 00:17:33.599 out defeated. Epstein and Maxwell were confidants. Graff knew Epstein 303 00:17:33.599 --> 00:17:36.599 built maxwell Or house. Graff thought redacted told her this 304 00:17:37.880 --> 00:17:40.920 it was just bought and under construction. Graff thought that 305 00:17:40.920 --> 00:17:43.799 Epstein and Maxwell were boyfriend and girlfriend. They were very 306 00:17:43.839 --> 00:17:47.440 care free. They did not spend every moment together. Groff 307 00:17:47.440 --> 00:17:50.359 thought that Epstein cared for Maxwell and she cared for him. 308 00:17:50.599 --> 00:17:53.480 Epstein and Maxwell did not live together. Graff did not 309 00:17:53.640 --> 00:17:56.759 know where Maxwell was living while her house was being built. 310 00:17:57.359 --> 00:18:00.640 When Graft first started Maxwell help with the rules, Maxwell 311 00:18:00.680 --> 00:18:03.839 told her that when Epstein calls Groff to give requirements. 312 00:18:04.039 --> 00:18:07.480 If Graft did not understand something, to stop them then 313 00:18:07.759 --> 00:18:09.880 and do not wait until the end, because it'll make 314 00:18:09.880 --> 00:18:13.400 Epstein mad. Epstein was famous for talking under his breath 315 00:18:13.440 --> 00:18:17.480 and mumbling. Graff did not have normal conversations with Maxwell. 316 00:18:18.319 --> 00:18:20.680 Graff did not talk to Maxwell about her wedding or 317 00:18:20.720 --> 00:18:23.240 when she was pregnant. Maxwell would come and go from 318 00:18:23.240 --> 00:18:26.839 the office and bring her dog into the office. Maxwell 319 00:18:26.880 --> 00:18:29.279 had her own driver. There was a guy who was 320 00:18:29.279 --> 00:18:32.240 the driver and a girl who was the maid. Looking back, 321 00:18:32.279 --> 00:18:36.079 Graff did not know how much managing Maxwell actually did. 322 00:18:36.440 --> 00:18:39.680 When Maxwell's house was being built, that was her priority. 323 00:18:40.000 --> 00:18:44.039 Maxwell was in the office next to Groff Agent note. 324 00:18:44.160 --> 00:18:47.000 At this point the interview, Groff was shown a black book. 325 00:18:47.319 --> 00:18:50.359 This book is one A nine in case file seventy 326 00:18:50.400 --> 00:18:56.599 two mm dash eleven three three two seven. Graff advised 327 00:18:56.599 --> 00:18:58.400 that this book did not look like the one that 328 00:18:58.480 --> 00:19:02.319 she saw. The one Groff saw had larger writing. It 329 00:19:02.359 --> 00:19:05.119 was the same size, but the one she remembered had 330 00:19:05.119 --> 00:19:08.160 a thicker binding. Graff thought it was probably the same 331 00:19:08.200 --> 00:19:12.039 information inside. This information would have been in the directory 332 00:19:12.480 --> 00:19:16.119 to Groff's recollection. It looked the same, Graff recalled the 333 00:19:16.160 --> 00:19:20.839 directory was alphabetical. Groff did not have conversations with Maxwell 334 00:19:20.880 --> 00:19:24.720 about massages. Groff worked nine to five. Epstein did not 335 00:19:24.799 --> 00:19:29.000 contact Groff on the weekends. Graff remembered Maxwell called Bella, 336 00:19:29.279 --> 00:19:32.720 who was from Russia, about the KGB. Maxwell had to 337 00:19:32.799 --> 00:19:36.839 check every invoice. Maxwell smiled and was happy, except when 338 00:19:36.880 --> 00:19:40.519 Epstein got upset with her. Maxwell talked to everybody. It 339 00:19:40.599 --> 00:19:43.920 seemed business related. For a Dacta traveled with Maxwell on 340 00:19:43.920 --> 00:19:48.839 Epstein's plane. Epstein and Maxwell were volatile. One moment Epstein 341 00:19:48.920 --> 00:19:51.240 would be screaming and the next he would be down 342 00:19:51.279 --> 00:19:55.160 to business. Maxwell tended to carry it and leave. Groff 343 00:19:55.160 --> 00:19:58.039 thought the whole office seemed happy, like the employees were 344 00:19:58.039 --> 00:20:01.119 happy and it was a nice place to work. Sometimes 345 00:20:01.200 --> 00:20:04.799 Groff was asked to messenger money for massages, and sometimes 346 00:20:04.880 --> 00:20:07.920 Jojo took money for the massages to give to people. 347 00:20:08.359 --> 00:20:12.359 Epstein sent everything by messenger. Epstein sent things fed x. 348 00:20:13.559 --> 00:20:16.119 Groff got the money from accounting and would pay someone 349 00:20:16.160 --> 00:20:19.240 around one hundred. Groff would type a message to Bella. 350 00:20:19.519 --> 00:20:23.039 Groff thought Bella had the petty cash box. Bella put 351 00:20:23.079 --> 00:20:26.079 money in an envelope, then it would be put in 352 00:20:26.119 --> 00:20:29.240 a messenger box. Jojo or a messenger would pick it up. 353 00:20:29.920 --> 00:20:32.359 This did not happen all the time, but rather some 354 00:20:32.480 --> 00:20:34.920 of the time. No one ever came to the office 355 00:20:34.920 --> 00:20:38.759 to pick up money except Jojo or the manager. Groff 356 00:20:39.000 --> 00:20:43.039 never went to Epstein's house until twenty thirteen, Groff went 357 00:20:43.079 --> 00:20:47.200 to Epstein's island. Groff was at a wedding on Tortola. 358 00:20:47.559 --> 00:20:50.480 Epstein told Groff she should go to the island. Epstein 359 00:20:50.559 --> 00:20:53.799 was not on the island when she went. Miles Alexander 360 00:20:54.000 --> 00:20:57.799 and Kathy Alexander fed Groff and her husband lunch. Then 361 00:20:58.039 --> 00:21:01.559 they went back on a trip with her husband to London. 362 00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:05.000 Epstein said they could stay at his guest room in Paris. 363 00:21:05.400 --> 00:21:07.480 They stayed there a couple of nights and went back 364 00:21:07.519 --> 00:21:10.759 to London. Groff did not go to the New Mexico Ranch. 365 00:21:11.160 --> 00:21:15.319 Groff did not travel with Epstein. All right, folks, Well, 366 00:21:15.799 --> 00:21:19.039 there's Leslie Groff's three point two proffer with the FBI 367 00:21:19.160 --> 00:21:21.880 agents in her own words, and I wonder how that's 368 00:21:21.920 --> 00:21:24.599 going to compare with what she says to Congress later on. 369 00:21:24.920 --> 00:21:27.480 And as soon as those transcripts are available, we'll get 370 00:21:27.559 --> 00:21:30.759 those added to the catalog. All the information that goes 371 00:21:30.799 --> 00:21:34.440 with This episode can be found in the description box. 372 00:21:34.680 --> 00:21:37.880 What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the 373 00:21:37.880 --> 00:21:41.160 Epstein Chronicles. Now, I know this might come as a 374 00:21:41.200 --> 00:21:46.119 surprise to you, but Jeffrey Epstein and Glenn Maxwell didn't 375 00:21:46.119 --> 00:21:48.640 operate this enterprise on their own. They had a lot 376 00:21:48.680 --> 00:21:51.200 of help along the way. And one of the people 377 00:21:51.440 --> 00:21:55.759 that was most integral to the operation, at least logistically speaking, 378 00:21:56.359 --> 00:21:58.839 was Leslie Groff. And one of the vehicles that was 379 00:21:58.960 --> 00:22:02.759 used to make these travel arrangements to book these flights 380 00:22:03.400 --> 00:22:06.200 to get these girls into a position where they can 381 00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:10.160 be abused was the American Express Black Card. And this 382 00:22:10.319 --> 00:22:12.920 is exactly why they never wanted to follow the money trail. 383 00:22:13.599 --> 00:22:15.720 They know if they follow the money trail, where it 384 00:22:15.799 --> 00:22:18.039 ends up, and it doesn't end up in a place 385 00:22:18.400 --> 00:22:21.079 where you and I are moving on. Instead, if they 386 00:22:21.079 --> 00:22:23.200 were to release the money trail and we all saw 387 00:22:23.200 --> 00:22:25.519 where all this money was going, where it was coming from, 388 00:22:25.680 --> 00:22:28.440 I think that people would take to the streets. And 389 00:22:28.480 --> 00:22:31.559 I truly believe that because people are still under the 390 00:22:31.559 --> 00:22:35.599 impression that this was just a human trafficking ring, but 391 00:22:35.720 --> 00:22:38.480 it was so much more than that. And while of 392 00:22:38.519 --> 00:22:41.920 course the girls and women who were harmed. They were 393 00:22:41.960 --> 00:22:45.839 harmed the most, and they have the biggest grievance, But 394 00:22:45.920 --> 00:22:48.319 that doesn't mean that the rest of us haven't been 395 00:22:48.359 --> 00:22:51.640 shit on by these people and haven't been treated badly, 396 00:22:53.359 --> 00:22:57.680 and they continue to do it day after day brazenly. Now. 397 00:23:00.000 --> 00:23:01.839 We least had some shame back in the day and 398 00:23:01.920 --> 00:23:04.279 tried to hide their cover ups, but now they're just 399 00:23:04.359 --> 00:23:07.119 running one in plain sight all the while just laughing 400 00:23:07.160 --> 00:23:10.640 in your face and giving you double middle fingers. And 401 00:23:10.759 --> 00:23:13.759