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Speaker 2: Now PW Torch and Spreaker bring you the Wade Keller
Speaker 2: Pro Wrestling Podcast. It's time for this week's Interview Classic,
Speaker 2: where Wade Keller Interview is one of Pro Wrestling's newsmakers.
Speaker 3: Ten years ago.
Speaker 1: This week, I interviewed Nick Aldus, the current WWE SmackDown
Speaker 1: GM and he was in a very different place in
Speaker 1: his career. At that point, he was ambitious but often frustrated.
Speaker 1: As a longtime member of T and A, he wrestled
Speaker 1: as Magnus. He talked about missed opportunities. He talked about
Speaker 1: Dixie Carter, Eric Bischoff, Hulk Hogan, and his aspirations for
Speaker 1: his future. I think if we told him ten years
Speaker 1: ago what his future would be, he'd be pretty happy.
Speaker 1: I don't know if he aspires to wrestle more or
Speaker 1: would rather be a wrestler rather than in a suit
Speaker 1: playing the role of an executive, but I think he's
Speaker 1: had a pretty good stretch of time and landed in
Speaker 1: a pretty good place. So let's get to it. Here
Speaker 1: are his thoughts on his career up to that point.
Speaker 1: It originally live streamed on July fifteenth, twenty fifteen, and
Speaker 1: it is today's Wade Keller Pro Wrestling Podcast Interview Classic
Speaker 1: for Saturday, July twelfth, twenty twenty five. Welcome to dp
Speaker 1: w Torch Live Cast. I am Wade Keller, editor and
Speaker 1: publisher of the Pro Wrestling Torch weekly newsletter since nineteen
Speaker 1: eighty seven, and also pwtorch dot com, the website and
Speaker 1: the free pw torch app available in the Apple App
Speaker 1: Store and androids Google Play Store.
Speaker 3: It is free.
Speaker 1: Just search pw torch and download a phone. I also
Speaker 1: host the pw torch Live cast on Tuesdays and Thursdays,
Speaker 1: neither of which is today. I am switching days with
Speaker 1: Pat McNeil. This week he will be interviewing Hurricane Shane Helms,
Speaker 1: a frequent and good guest on Pat McNeil's Wednesday live cast,
Speaker 1: but it's which is to Thursday this week, So if
Speaker 1: you tuned in expecting head mc neil, we'll tune in
Speaker 1: tomorrow five thirty Eastern two thirty Pacific live. I get
Speaker 1: this question a lot too. You do not have to
Speaker 1: listen live to hear our show, so if you do
Speaker 1: listen live, obviously you can listen on demand later. If
Speaker 1: you listen on demand, we welcome live listeners, especially if
Speaker 1: you participate with phone calls and you contribute to the program.
Speaker 1: Today's guest, and it is Wednesday, July fifteenth, twenty fifteen,
Speaker 1: is going to be Magnus also known as well my
Speaker 1: real name Nick all this, so Magnus from TNA will
Speaker 1: be joining me momentarily here on the PW Torch live cast. First,
Speaker 1: I want to take a moment to thank Bruce Mitchell
Speaker 1: for filling in for me.
Speaker 3: Yesterday.
Speaker 1: I was dealing with a sick cat, Boom the Boom
Speaker 1: the cat was laid to rest yesterday. He was getting
Speaker 1: sick over the last couple of weeks. He was about
Speaker 1: fifteen sixteen years old, and say goodbye to a good
Speaker 1: friend who had been a mascot and guarded my office
Speaker 1: against mice for real sometimes and was always on the lookout.
Speaker 3: Was in a cardboard box, curled up.
Speaker 1: On my desk For the majority of my deadlines and
Speaker 1: my hard work at my computer here, putting in long hours.
Speaker 1: I could count on Boom keeping me company a lot
Speaker 1: of the time curled up in his box. He had
Speaker 1: a great life, seemed like a two year old cat
Speaker 1: up until two or three or four weeks ago when
Speaker 1: things just didn't seem quite right about him, and he
Speaker 1: had pretty aggressive kidney cancer in both kidneys, and so.
Speaker 3: His wonderful life came to an end yesterday.
Speaker 1: So I wanted to dedicate today's show to Boom the Cat,
Speaker 1: who was a part of this show in ways that
Speaker 1: none of you probably knew, because he often listened to
Speaker 1: me while I did the podcast and occasionally corrected my grammar.
Speaker 1: Bruce Mitchell hosted for me yesterday, had a really good
Speaker 1: conversation with Jason Powell from Pro Wrestling dot Net, and
Speaker 1: I encourage you to check out that show if you
Speaker 1: haven't heard it yet. Bruce talked also about a tremendous
Speaker 1: weekend that I had over the weekend with UH in Waterloo,
Speaker 1: Iowa at the Dan Gable Wrestling Museum and the George
Speaker 1: Tragels Luths Pro Wrestling Hall of Fame ceremony. I was
Speaker 1: inducted into the Hall of Fame with the Jim Melby
Speaker 1: Excellence in Wrestling Reporting Award. It was a great honor
Speaker 1: to be part of that weekend and UH and UH,
Speaker 1: I just I can't, I can't say enough about what
Speaker 1: a tremendous experience that was. And so many, so many
Speaker 1: people that I met who I had corresponded with over
Speaker 1: the years, so many Torch readers. It was great meeting uh,
Speaker 1: Jim Melby's daughter, and I mean the table of dignitaries
Speaker 1: that we were that I was able to Bruce and
Speaker 1: I were able to enjoy the company of during the
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame banquet on Saturday was amazing, I mean
Speaker 1: truly amazing. So I just think all all of you
Speaker 1: PW Torch Life Cast listeners and the pros and Torchs
Speaker 1: newsletter subscribers and PW Torch VIP members for coming up
Speaker 1: and saying hi. I know a few of you said
Speaker 1: specifically you drove or flew out just to see my induction,
Speaker 1: So thank you. It was a culmination of nearly twenty
Speaker 1: eight years of hard work and dedication and a lot
Speaker 1: of help from a lot of people. Jim Melby, whom
Speaker 1: the Journalism Award is named after, was one of the
Speaker 1: early people when I started the newsletter who corresponded with
Speaker 1: me were fellow Minisodans, and he offered me help, offered
Speaker 1: to help me with with history or contacts. There were
Speaker 1: so many people who are generous, and Jim Melby was
Speaker 1: among them, a historian and somebody who I got to
Speaker 1: know a lot better through a really nice conversation with
Speaker 1: his daughter that Bruce Mitchell and I had after the
Speaker 1: Hall of Fame ceremony on Saturday night. Another you know
Speaker 1: that Dan Gable Wrestling Museum in Waterloo, Iowa should be
Speaker 1: on every pro wrestling fan, every prossing fans bucket list,
Speaker 1: every wrestler's bucket list. What an amazing job Kyle Klingman,
Speaker 1: the director of the museum, and everybody involved in that
Speaker 1: have done over the past dozen or so years putting
Speaker 1: together a tremendous museum.
Speaker 3: I mean, this is first class.
Speaker 1: It's an accredited museum, it's got its own building, it's
Speaker 1: got its own signage, there's an incredible memorabilia and history,
Speaker 1: a great lobby, and thanks to Paul Shamberger, an amazing mural.
Speaker 1: When you walk in in the lobby, there's a lounge,
Speaker 1: there's a merchandise area you can buy DVDs and books
Speaker 1: and t shirts, a front desk. They're open money through
Speaker 1: Friday and also weekends by appointment. And I will say this,
Speaker 1: Waterloo's probably not on most people's top ten list of
Speaker 1: places to visit in the United States on a vacation.
Speaker 1: But if you're a pro wrestling fan and it's centrally
Speaker 1: located and it's a nice small town, I mean there's
Speaker 1: some great The Laughing Tree Cafe with organic farm to
Speaker 1: table options was really progressive and the woman who runs
Speaker 1: that he lives was just fantastic. Makes homemade hummus and
Speaker 1: homemade red lentil soup. And I know Bruce liked the
Speaker 1: chicken sandwich that he got. And then there's a great
Speaker 1: Thai restaurant, a great Italian restaurant on Newman's Paradise. Cafe
Speaker 1: is vintage and has great breakfast food. The Ramadas staff
Speaker 1: were tremendous and accommodating. It's just it's a cool place
Speaker 1: to spend a day or two or three days. Their
Speaker 1: next convention, I believe, is July fourteenth through sixteenth next year,
Speaker 1: and I am going to become an advocate for spreading
Speaker 1: the word about this museum it deserves. I think it
Speaker 1: deserves more tension than it gets, at least from the torch,
Speaker 1: and it will get that going forward. I was very
Speaker 1: impressed by everything and everybody. It was great to meet
Speaker 1: Larry the x Henning. When I walked up to him
Speaker 1: and introduced myself and shook hands, he made my night
Speaker 1: by saying, You've got a pretty strong handshake for a
Speaker 1: tull skinny guy.
Speaker 3: So that that was pretty cool.
Speaker 1: Jumping Jim Breunzel, Baron von Rashki and Larry the Axe
Speaker 1: Henning rat at a banquet table for the Hall of
Speaker 1: Fame ceremony, and it was very special being able to
Speaker 1: give my speech and have three wrestlers who were on
Speaker 1: the first wrestling show I ever saw in person. May tenth,
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty one at the Saint pal Civic Center Old
Speaker 1: Time Atmosphere, vern Gania against Nick Bockwinkle, a WA Heavyweight
Speaker 1: Championship match main event, The Crusher against Jesse the Body
Speaker 1: Mantura in a posed down Kurt Henning against Adrian Adonis
Speaker 1: before he was adorable, This was when he was a
Speaker 1: tough Brooklyn guy. If Kurt could last ten minutes with Adrian,
Speaker 1: Larry the Axe got five minutes with Adrian to beat
Speaker 1: him up. Baron von Rashki against Big John Studd and
Speaker 1: a Lose Release Town match. Baron won, Big John Studd lost,
Speaker 1: And boy didn't make an impression on me that Big
Speaker 1: John Studd cried on his way out of the ring.
Speaker 1: He was so sad that he had to leave town
Speaker 1: and that Baron beat him. Despite skeptics, this ten year
Speaker 1: old thought wrestling had to be real. Actually I think
Speaker 1: it was nine going on ted that this nine year
Speaker 1: old dot Wrestling had to be real if if John
Speaker 1: stud was crying over losing a match. So anyway, very
Speaker 1: special week I wrote an article in this week's Progressing
Speaker 1: Torch newsletter detailing the whole experience, the whole weekend, and
Speaker 1: Kurt Angle was there to accept for a special ceremony
Speaker 1: to accept a ring for some of his accomplishments. Dan Gable,
Speaker 1: one of the greatest athletes of all time in any sport,
Speaker 1: was also present and I just I was thrilled to
Speaker 1: meet him and get my picture taken with him. You
Speaker 1: can see photos from the weekend. I put a ton
Speaker 1: up on my Facebook page. You can just search Wade
Speaker 1: Keller in Facebook and find me. You'll see my face
Speaker 1: on the profile pick or you can also follow me
Speaker 1: on Twitter at the.
Speaker 3: Wade Keller at the Wade Keller.
Speaker 1: Our guest today is Magnus and I'm going to get
Speaker 1: to him right after this note from our our sponsor.
Speaker 1: I do want to add that our phone number is
Speaker 1: six four six seven nine to two weight. If you
Speaker 1: are interested in part dissipating in today's show by asking
Speaker 1: Magnus a question, you can hop on the phone lines
Speaker 1: and press one on your touchdown phone the number again
Speaker 1: at six four, six, seven, one nine eight two eight.
Speaker 1: I see uh that Magnus is online and we'll be
Speaker 1: going to him in just a moment.
Speaker 3: I do want to know though, that the.
Speaker 1: PW Torch Live Cast is brought to you by Progressling Torch.
Speaker 1: A free audiobook awaits you. You can support us on
Speaker 1: Patreon and get these shows with ads and plugs remove,
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Speaker 1: cents a month. Check it out patreon dot com slash
Speaker 1: PW torch VIP. That's patreon dot com slash PW torch
Speaker 1: vip and you can also upgrade to other tiers and
Speaker 1: receive even more benefits through Patreon. All right, let's I'll
Speaker 1: bring in our special guest today on Interview Wednesday. This
Speaker 1: is Magnus Nick All this Magnus. Welcome to the p
Speaker 1: ww Torch Live Test.
Speaker 4: Thanks Wade. I was terrified that I wasn't like, I
Speaker 4: didn't know if you knew I was hero or not.
Speaker 4: I was, Oh, I realized like that we didn't have
Speaker 4: any you know that we didn't. I just got your
Speaker 4: messages about like how to dial it on it and
Speaker 4: I and I and I suddenly realized like, no, we
Speaker 4: hadn't even talked about it, so I just I just
Speaker 4: dialed in. Yeah, And I was sitting there I could
Speaker 4: listen to it, and I was like, does he knows
Speaker 4: on the Hero or like, I don't even know if
Speaker 4: he knows on Hero or not. So glad that you
Speaker 4: knew because I was sitting there again and I wonder
Speaker 4: if I'm just going to listen to the whole show and.
Speaker 1: No, no, if I did see your number on the
Speaker 1: switchboard right before you messaged me, so that that worked
Speaker 1: out well.
Speaker 3: Well.
Speaker 1: Thanks for taking time to talk to us today. Appreciate
Speaker 1: your time. The The first thing that I want to
Speaker 1: talk about is is uh, some current events. But then
Speaker 1: I also want to get into your background a little bit,
Speaker 1: and while also take phone calls, and we've got email
Speaker 1: questions coming into Just a reminder. P W Torch Live
Speaker 1: cast at gmail dot com is the email if you
Speaker 1: want to send us a question. If you're listening live
Speaker 1: and for some reason you can't call in or are
Speaker 1: shy about calling in, But you do have a question
Speaker 1: for Magnus PW Torch Live cast at gmail dot com.
Speaker 1: If you're listening to us live, if you're listening to
Speaker 1: us on demand, you can still send a question, but
Speaker 1: you can't.
Speaker 3: We can't go back in the time machine and ask it.
Speaker 3: All right, Nick?
Speaker 1: And as far as court events go, should I call
Speaker 1: you Nick or Magnus at whatever?
Speaker 4: Nick? Yeah?
Speaker 3: Absolutely, I figured that might be the case. Nick, TNA.
Speaker 1: On the last pay per view, you gave it a
Speaker 1: cut of promo live on pay per view, essentially saying
Speaker 1: this was the end that that you were leaving the company.
Speaker 3: You had a.
Speaker 1: Memorable match with James Storm a TNA Life or a
Speaker 1: TNA Original also essentially part of his departure.
Speaker 3: Did you who?
Speaker 4: Uh?
Speaker 1: I heard there was maybe a little bit of blowback
Speaker 1: for being as blunt as you were on that promo.
Speaker 3: I was glad that you did it.
Speaker 1: I thought that it showed, if it showed, that you
Speaker 1: had an attachment and an investment in what you had
Speaker 1: done in TNA, And it seemed like it was kind
Speaker 1: of an emotional moment for you.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: My first actual question to you is how did it
Speaker 1: feel kind of saying goodbye to TNA live on pay
Speaker 1: per view like that after your years there and what
Speaker 1: it's meant to you.
Speaker 4: It was it was cool. Yeah, I made the decision
Speaker 4: to do it. There was no blow back or at
Speaker 4: least not that you know. And I think that's just
Speaker 4: one of those things where like people just like to,
Speaker 4: you know, this is a thing, and I know that
Speaker 4: you know, you uh, you know, you know, you are
Speaker 4: a part of a of a you know, your sources
Speaker 4: and stuff like that, and I get that. But I
Speaker 4: think what happens a lot is that people in the
Speaker 4: business who decide to you know, give sort of quote
Speaker 4: unquote information to you know, to the journalists and stuff.
Speaker 4: I think a lot of the time they just based
Speaker 4: it on what they what on the on the perception.
Speaker 4: So I think that's probably one of those situations where
Speaker 4: like a bunch of guys probably just you know, assumed
Speaker 4: that there might be so then they went, oh yeah,
Speaker 4: I think there was, and there was none. Like in fact,
Speaker 4: when I did that promo, because we did it live
Speaker 4: like like I literally did the plumo and then walked
Speaker 4: and then went to go position and then at the
Speaker 4: go position, alf Snow was there and Big and Matt
Speaker 4: Commett and they all said, that's one of the best
Speaker 4: promos you've ever done, like thank you, that was great
Speaker 4: like that, you know what I mean. They loved it.
Speaker 4: So I don't know, you know, so that that so
Speaker 4: let's let's get that out of the way right away.
Speaker 4: I loved the I loved the match. You know, it
Speaker 4: was I mean, it was very physically taxing, you know
Speaker 4: what I mean. It was like I was feeling it
Speaker 4: for about a week after and yeah, it's uh think
Speaker 4: is that we we agreed to part ways or you know,
Speaker 4: or I had made the decision that I didn't want
Speaker 4: to discuss another contract and I wanted to move on.
Speaker 4: But it was very amicable. So it was like I said,
Speaker 4: you know, let's like here's the thing. Everyone you you know,
Speaker 4: and you know, or at least you know, the vast
Speaker 4: majority of the audience who are going to be buying
Speaker 4: aDNA paper view it's sort of fans that would know
Speaker 4: this stuff. So I said, so why don't we why
Speaker 4: don't we just go there? It's very very rare in
Speaker 4: the business you get chance to actually, you know, do
Speaker 4: something real, get you know, and I believe that the
Speaker 4: best stuff always comes from from a real place, and
Speaker 4: I said, this is a real place, but let's let's
Speaker 4: take it from there. And I think that's one of
Speaker 4: the reasons why it was you know what, it was.
Speaker 1: Memorable, you know what I mean, absolutely, no, no, it
Speaker 1: definitely was. I thought it was also kind of touching
Speaker 1: and memorable with all that James Storm has been through
Speaker 1: that as he was walking to the stage after the match,
Speaker 1: he kind of turned, even as a heel with a
Speaker 1: pretty intense angle with you on television storyline wise leading
Speaker 1: up to that match. You know, I think couldn't help
Speaker 1: it turn around and salute the fans who obviously, like
Speaker 1: you said, those who were even in attend. It's kind
Speaker 1: of new that that was might be the end in
Speaker 1: line for him too, that that hul clam of versary
Speaker 1: event gave off a vibe of not really awake. That's
Speaker 1: overstating it, but kind of like a graduation party at
Speaker 1: high school where you're or college graduation you're kind of
Speaker 1: seeing some friends maybe for the last time. Was did
Speaker 1: you get that vibe at Slamiversary among more than just
Speaker 1: say you and James in terms of this feels like
Speaker 1: it's the end of something.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, absolutely I did. I don't know if
Speaker 4: I you know, I mean, I think, you know, for me,
Speaker 4: it's difficult to say whether that was just a distorted
Speaker 4: view things because it was the end for me. But yeah,
Speaker 4: and I think that honestly, I think considering you know,
Speaker 4: I think considering that, you know that by by then
Speaker 4: that the audience in Orlando, whether it had been every
Speaker 4: single typing or not, that's that, you know. But some
Speaker 4: of them potentially have been through like five days of wrestling,
Speaker 4: you know, which Randy Fan is a lot, you know
Speaker 4: what a meaning the day, and yet the feeling was,
Speaker 4: you know, there was there was definitely a different kind
Speaker 4: of feeling in there. And obviously I've wrestled in that
Speaker 4: so many times. You can just tell when there's a
Speaker 4: different kind of vibe going on, and that was definitely
Speaker 4: one of those days. You know. Yeah, I you know,
Speaker 4: I I hope that I hope that they pulled through
Speaker 4: and that you know, that they like they like they
Speaker 4: have so many times before when people have written them
Speaker 4: off and written their obituary. But I, you know, and
Speaker 4: I hope they can pull it off. But for me,
Speaker 4: it was like I wanted to just make it clear
Speaker 4: that you know, but this for me, I you know,
Speaker 4: I'm very serious, and I said, like, I think that
Speaker 4: the end of you know, the end of my run
Speaker 4: with TNA, and I was and I you know, I'm
Speaker 4: very grateful for everything that's done, and I'm very grateful
Speaker 4: to the fans that sort of invested in me, because,
Speaker 4: you know, you build a relationship with the audience, and
Speaker 4: that's one of the things I think, as as as
Speaker 4: performers that both James and I were trying to get
Speaker 4: across to people with like, you know, especially considering the
Speaker 4: sort of circumstances of who maybe T and A has
Speaker 4: sort of hung their hat on recently. We were just
Speaker 4: kind of like, look, you know that this is our
Speaker 4: way of saying, like one, follow this and to like,
Speaker 4: you know, you can't just manufacture this overnight, like you
Speaker 4: developed a trust and a relationship with the audience, and
Speaker 4: you know, and I should know better than anybody, because
Speaker 4: I came in with all of that stigma of being like,
Speaker 4: you know, a chosen one, a guy who you know,
Speaker 4: you know, didn't have a lot of you know, didn't
Speaker 4: really have a track record, you know, and I had
Speaker 4: to like fight and scratch for every single bit of
Speaker 4: respect I've ever got from any audience. So it's like,
Speaker 4: you know, for me, it was, it was it didn't
Speaker 4: mean well to me. And James has been there since
Speaker 4: day one, He's seen a lot of ups and downs.
Speaker 1: You know what went in your decision to finally end
Speaker 1: your relationship with TNA.
Speaker 4: That's a very expensive question, as I'm sure you got. Well,
Speaker 4: the truthful answer is that, if I'm honest with myself,
Speaker 4: I had made a promise to myself a long time ago,
Speaker 4: probably well over a year ago, that when this contract
Speaker 4: came up, I was not going to take another one
Speaker 4: regardless you know, whether whether you know, whether it was
Speaker 4: financially you know, applaudible or not. And that's saying a
Speaker 4: lot considering I have a nine month old son, you
Speaker 4: know what I mean? I had said privately to a
Speaker 4: few people, you know, some of my best friends and
Speaker 4: obviously Mickey and a few others, I said, like, when this,
Speaker 4: you know, when my contract comes up this time, like
Speaker 4: that's it, Like I'm not sticking around again, like you know,
Speaker 4: anever you know, and a lot of guys you know
Speaker 4: who like you know, close to me, were like I
Speaker 4: think they you know, they weren't really you know, I
Speaker 4: think that they thought themselves like okay, you're saying that now,
Speaker 4: but you know, but I yeah, that's truthfully I had Okay, sorry,
Speaker 4: I had truthfully made that decision, you know, like I
Speaker 4: and I think that there were a lot of different
Speaker 4: things that had gone into it, and there was and
Speaker 4: then there was like one or two very specific instances.
Speaker 4: I'm not sure if I'm ready at this point yet
Speaker 4: to to sort of to fully talk about what they are,
Speaker 4: but you know, but they all kind of just center
Speaker 4: around me feeling a little bit disrespected at times, and
Speaker 4: so then and kind of thrown under the bus a
Speaker 4: little bit by you know, considering that I had worked
Speaker 4: so hard to get to the position I was in
Speaker 4: and then we was just kind of kind of easily discarded,
Speaker 4: you know, like in sort of unfortunate circumstances, like from
Speaker 4: that position and that and that was a situation where
Speaker 4: to me, I just said, like, you know, I'm twenty
Speaker 4: eight years old, like I've only got you know, I
Speaker 4: don't I don't have plans to be wrestling well into
Speaker 4: my forties, you know, I want to be I've got
Speaker 4: a lot of other things I want to do, you know,
Speaker 4: in the business, but also in life. And you know,
Speaker 4: I want these years, you know, to mean something and
Speaker 4: I don't. And I think it might be time for
Speaker 4: me to see if there's other places where I can
Speaker 4: make it mean something.
Speaker 5: Need an extra dose of positivity in your wrestling podcasts,
Speaker 5: will come join me Alan fourrel Over in the Progress
Speaker 5: Paradise at Ptero Torch VIP as we mask on the
Speaker 5: bright side of wrestling and focus on some of the
Speaker 5: great matches and shows from around the world, be it
Speaker 5: the US, Japan, Europe or Mexico. There's always a place
Speaker 5: for wrestlings past in the Paradise too, and we've done
Speaker 5: fun historical shows such as the We Love Liger series
Speaker 5: celebrating the glorious career of Juician Thunderliger and I was
Speaker 5: there when shows where our guests will join me to
Speaker 5: talk about a classic bout that they were in attendance for.
Speaker 5: We love variety and you can expect lots of it
Speaker 5: at the Progress Paradise. Detailed PW Torch VIP subscription information
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Speaker 5: our ad free VIP mobile site see you in the Paradise.
Speaker 3: During your time with TENA.
Speaker 1: Obviously, last year, after they went on, they tried the
Speaker 1: experiment to take Impact live and Dixie Carter was on
Speaker 1: the show. She was very optimistic about the possible impact
Speaker 1: that it would have on TNA to go live every
Speaker 1: other week with Impact. It would be expensive to go
Speaker 1: on the road, but that was Hulk Hogan's you know idea, Hey,
Speaker 1: if we go we go live on the road, We're
Speaker 1: going to meet these people live. Is the key being
Speaker 1: outside of the Impact zone as a key. She felt
Speaker 1: that that was going to get him to the next level.
Speaker 1: And it didn't. But it did kind of break the bank.
Speaker 1: It broke the budget. It was an expensive move, and
Speaker 1: it just it just didn't produce what I think Dixie
Speaker 1: and Hogan and and everybody who was in on that
Speaker 1: decision and in favor of it thought, and that led
Speaker 1: to without getting two into the details, and I've heard
Speaker 1: various versions of you know how this all happened behind
Speaker 1: the scenes, but a lot of bell tightening when it
Speaker 1: came to the budget, I assume that you were kind
Speaker 1: of part of that roller coaster ride of.
Speaker 3: T and A having not they weren't.
Speaker 1: They were never, you know, just handing out huge contracts
Speaker 1: like Eric Bischoff in the Monday Night wore nitro Era.
Speaker 1: But there were some night you know, guys were making
Speaker 1: some good money for a few years there. Last year,
Speaker 1: did you kind of get the sense, either from yourself
Speaker 1: or what you're hearing in the locker room that this
Speaker 1: just isn't a place where you can earn a full
Speaker 1: This might not be a place long term where you're
Speaker 1: going to earn a good, full time living. And when
Speaker 1: you combine that with some of the restrictions within the contracts,
Speaker 1: it started to become more appealing for a lot of
Speaker 1: guys to leave, especially after AJ did.
Speaker 4: Yes, most of what you said there was pretty accurate.
Speaker 4: I can only speak to me, and I can say
Speaker 4: that I may make more money every year consecutively into
Speaker 4: and and and while okay, you know, obviously you always
Speaker 4: think that maybe you've deserved a slightly about a dollar amount,
Speaker 4: I can honestly say that the last contract that the
Speaker 4: contract I just you know, just just that just expired
Speaker 4: for me, was in terms of compensation and in terms
Speaker 4: of the actual clauses, in terms a very very good contract,
Speaker 4: you know, very fair. You know it was six figures.
Speaker 4: Was I making millions? No, not even close, not even like,
Speaker 4: not even high six figures, but it was. But it
Speaker 4: was a very nice especially considering the schedule. Like and
Speaker 4: I made a point when my son was born to
Speaker 4: you know, to to reach out to Dixie and to
Speaker 4: Bob Ryder and to say, you know, just you know,
Speaker 4: I want you to know how much I appreciate the
Speaker 4: fact that, like i've you know, I can sit at
Speaker 4: home and and you know, and watch my son grow
Speaker 4: up and sort of be here for all of this
Speaker 4: and get this very nice check every two weeks. I'm
Speaker 4: very appreciative of that. And I know and I will
Speaker 4: always appreciate that, so, you know, I and and again
Speaker 4: for me, I think that the whole thing about you know,
Speaker 4: this is the thing about contract is that guys talk
Speaker 4: about sometimes it's just seed by people who aren't you know,
Speaker 4: signed to them, that somehow like all contracts are same,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean, And that people forget the
Speaker 4: fact that each contract is subject to a negotiation, right
Speaker 4: so it's like, you know, I can't like it's it's
Speaker 4: one of those things where sometimes it's a bit too
Speaker 4: generalized and people go, oh, yeah, oh, they're not doing
Speaker 4: those kind of contracts anymore so, and I'm sitting there thinking, well,
Speaker 4: I've got a contract that has a way and that,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean, and this and that, and
Speaker 4: like I can only speak for me obviously, I can't
Speaker 4: divulge any of that, but I will say this that
Speaker 4: one of the things that I made a slightly I
Speaker 4: did negotiate, like I did accept a slight like I
Speaker 4: came down a little bit on on the dollar amount
Speaker 4: in exchange for having a clause where it was like
Speaker 4: guaranteed for two years, you know what I mean, where
Speaker 4: it was like there was a note you know that
Speaker 4: were they couldn't release me. There was no way they
Speaker 4: could just because that's the problem with most contractors that like,
Speaker 4: regardless of what it says on it, that at any
Speaker 4: point they can just go, I just decided to release
Speaker 4: you from this, like you know, you like here in
Speaker 4: ninety days, like you and I didn't have that, you
Speaker 4: know what I mean. I was aware, I knew exactly
Speaker 4: what I was going to make for you know, for
Speaker 4: two years, so that like that, you know that like
Speaker 4: at the end of the day, each contract is an
Speaker 4: individual business negotiation. We're all independent contractors, and I you know,
Speaker 4: and and and you know, I had other nice little
Speaker 4: sort of things in there too, like my hotels were
Speaker 4: covered and things like that. So you know, for me,
Speaker 4: it was like an extremely what I considered to be
Speaker 4: an extremely fair deal, you know, based on what I
Speaker 4: think my market value is, particularly to the UK market,
Speaker 4: but also you know, based on my years that I'd
Speaker 4: put in there and my tenure, you know what I mean.
Speaker 4: So like I don't I don't. I know that there
Speaker 4: were a lot of guys who are you know, who
Speaker 4: signed contracts that to me, I would never have signed,
Speaker 4: you know, But that actually is more of a problem
Speaker 4: than than the office than that the company necessarily doing
Speaker 4: some help typing, no doubt they had to do, because
Speaker 4: you're right, going live and going on the road and
Speaker 4: all that was an astronomical expense. Like I don't think
Speaker 4: people have any idea like what what kind of numbers
Speaker 4: you know, I heard I heard some numbers. It just
Speaker 4: would you know that you just you know that I
Speaker 4: suddenly just went this can't be sustainable, and it wasn't,
Speaker 4: you know, I think that hit well. The one thing
Speaker 4: I will say is that from a content standpoint, I
Speaker 4: do believe that that period where we went on the
Speaker 4: road doing like the one live and one tapes and
Speaker 4: all that, I do think that it was a success
Speaker 4: in terms of content. I do think that that was
Speaker 4: probably when we created like the you know, the best
Speaker 4: content TNA has created in quite a long time. Like
Speaker 4: for me, it certainly provided a lot of memorable things,
Speaker 4: Like I think that back then is when if you
Speaker 4: looked at the show back then, it was very comfortable
Speaker 4: to any other wrestling show that was out there, you know,
Speaker 4: in terms of quality, Like I think back to the
Speaker 4: Bow the Glory Series in twenty thirteen, you know in
Speaker 4: Saint Louis, like where I wrestled Bobby Rude earlier in
Speaker 4: the night and then AJ in the finals, Like that's
Speaker 4: one of my favorite nights in the business. You know.
Speaker 4: I think about all the stuff that the main event
Speaker 4: Mafia like in Vegas, and you know, and I think that,
Speaker 4: you know, that wouldn't have had the same feel at
Speaker 4: all if it be all in the impacts on. So
Speaker 4: I do think from an artistics standpoint was just not
Speaker 4: from a financial one. I mean, you know, sometimes you
Speaker 4: go to make that take that risk. But yeah, perhaps
Speaker 4: they probably should have maybe realized it a little sooner
Speaker 4: than they did.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like, I wasn't against the move in the sense of, okay,
Speaker 1: if you're if you're going to gamble and go for
Speaker 1: big growth. I mean that, you know, Ted Turner Eric
Speaker 1: Bischoff made a gamble. You know, they gambled, but Ted
Speaker 1: had a lot more money to gamble, or he was
Speaker 1: willing to gamble more money, and it paid off because
Speaker 1: they had that the background of having been on TBS
Speaker 1: for so many years, and the roots of that company
Speaker 1: and the fan base and especially in the Southeast, but
Speaker 1: not only in the Southeast, and the ability to just
Speaker 1: go after all this talent at a time and in vincment.
Speaker 1: Mannon was kind of not resting on his laurels, but
Speaker 1: stuck in a certain pattern of how to present television
Speaker 1: so that all worked out. TNA wasn't trying to leap
Speaker 1: frog WWE with that move in a way that would
Speaker 1: make this big splash on a major network like TNT.
Speaker 1: They were on a smaller networks, solid network, but a
Speaker 1: smaller network like Spike, but they were just trying to
Speaker 1: close the gap a little bit and like you said,
Speaker 1: create an environment that was a little more dynamic. But
Speaker 1: it wasn't this innovation like Nitro was. But I still
Speaker 1: thought at the time I could understand Dixie's rationale for it,
Speaker 1: but it seemed like one of those things where pretty
Speaker 1: quickly it was clear the theory that while just having
Speaker 1: a more major league look quote unquote at these arenas
Speaker 1: and different a new crowd every night, it just wasn't
Speaker 1: translating quick enough into a turnaround. So if they weren't
Speaker 1: willing to stick with it for three years spending a
Speaker 1: half a million or more on extra production costs every month,
Speaker 1: they shouldn't have done it in the first place, because
Speaker 1: it's not something that would really have an effect probably
Speaker 1: probably in three or four months.
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, I would agree with that assessment. And I
Speaker 4: think that's probably you know, that echoes a lot of
Speaker 4: the sentiments of a lot of the guys you know
Speaker 4: that were around at the time. I think a lot
Speaker 4: of us was saying, you know, because you know, that
Speaker 4: would inevitably be, you know, be a sort of a
Speaker 4: discussion that would happen a lot in the cause you know,
Speaker 4: tells the stuff. And I would always just say like, yeah,
Speaker 4: you know, at the end of the day, like I'd
Speaker 4: rather have a job than than wrestling in different arenas
Speaker 4: all the time. You know, I don't know, like I
Speaker 4: don't know whether maybe the perception was that there was
Speaker 4: more money available than perhaps those guys realized, you know,
Speaker 4: maybe they sort of got maybe I always feel like there,
Speaker 4: I mean, this is just my instinct. I don't know
Speaker 4: that I always got the feeling that they thought maybe like, hey,
Speaker 4: you know, like there and the energy's got deep pockets, brother,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean. And it was like and
Speaker 4: I think they thought that if they just started kind
Speaker 4: of going for it and and digging, that there to
Speaker 4: be more and more and more, and and it's my
Speaker 4: understanding that at some point they just went nope, you're
Speaker 4: cut off, like yeah, and that was that's just my
Speaker 4: impression of it. I don't know any of this stuff,
Speaker 4: but you know, yeah that that's seems to the impression.
Speaker 4: And then it was and then and again to your point,
Speaker 4: we all just sort of felt like we would have
Speaker 4: rather that you reinvest, you know, that if you were
Speaker 4: going to invest that kind of capital we would have
Speaker 4: rather that you invested it in, you know, like more
Speaker 4: promotion and creating more brand awareness, you know, and and
Speaker 4: more advertising, because we were the guys who are having
Speaker 4: to go to the live events and be a block
Speaker 4: away from the building and people be like, hey, you're
Speaker 4: magnus and we'll be like, yeah, like what are you
Speaker 4: doing here? You know, and you know, because because because
Speaker 4: all of it, all of the all of the time
Speaker 4: and resources were just we're just so so dedicated to
Speaker 4: TV that it was just you know that it was
Speaker 4: from the talent standpoint, it could be frustrating at times.
Speaker 1: Thanks for downloading today's show. Take it to the next
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Speaker 1: the bonus content and the ad free listening experience. PW
Speaker 1: Torch dot Com, slash Go VIP. Dixy was on this
Speaker 1: show before the or after the move was announced to
Speaker 1: Destination America and when she was in the midst of
Speaker 1: the Discovery Network conventions and that big TV convention she
Speaker 1: was at on the Lonch right before the launch, or
Speaker 1: actually the day after the launch, the day after the debut.
Speaker 1: She hadn't seen the first show yet, so it was
Speaker 1: a day after the first show aired, So I'm just
Speaker 1: kind of putting a timestamp in my head on this.
Speaker 1: And it was interesting because what you just said was
Speaker 1: similar to what a caller said. They called in said
Speaker 1: to Dixie. You know, hey, you came to my town.
Speaker 1: I knew about it because of the Torch or the
Speaker 1: Internet or Twitter or something like that. You know, but
Speaker 1: I live in this town and nobody who's a wrestling
Speaker 1: fandos the show is here and at Dixie if I
Speaker 1: remember right. And I won't get too difficult details because
Speaker 1: it was months ago, but the impression I got is
Speaker 1: her her reaction gave a sense that she was quite
Speaker 1: happy with the job that her local event promotion department
Speaker 1: such as it is, did and that she felt this
Speaker 1: fan just happened to miss it or this caller it
Speaker 1: was an aberration. Yet we heard that over and over,
Speaker 1: So I use that as an anecdote, and you can
Speaker 1: expand on that if you want. But to add to
Speaker 1: the question, clearly, from talking to you here for twenty
Speaker 1: plus minutes so far on the show, you're one of
Speaker 1: the guys who is it doesn't show up, say tell
Speaker 1: me what to do, and you do it, and then
Speaker 1: you're off doing something else. You're thinking about, you're talking about.
Speaker 1: You're invested in the health and the future of the
Speaker 1: company you're working for, and you're part of the circle
Speaker 1: of guys who are and rest of the companies do
Speaker 1: better when they have them. As one of those people
Speaker 1: who was in TNA for so long, what was there
Speaker 1: in your mind a biggest missed opportunity or a biggest
Speaker 1: door that was open that that was not seized Along
Speaker 1: the way. You touched on putting money into brand awareness,
Speaker 1: but talk about that a little bit too. The missed
Speaker 1: opportunities that maybe you saw that you talked about with other.
Speaker 4: Guys, well, I don't know uh. I mean, there were
Speaker 4: definitely a lot of missed opportunities. I think that for me,
Speaker 4: I can say this now because I'm not there, you know,
Speaker 4: but I have always said, I always said I would,
Speaker 4: you know, do my best to not just leave and
Speaker 4: just completely bury you know, the company, because they're just
Speaker 4: burying myself, you know, because at the end of the day,
Speaker 4: it's the only point of reference me. You know. I
Speaker 4: just Jeff and I just did Jericho's podcast a couple
Speaker 4: of days ago, and I said that the exact thing
Speaker 4: to Chris that you know, but it's the only point
Speaker 4: of reference, and you said, they're burying it. You're really
Speaker 4: just burying yourself because everyone's like, well, you know, you're
Speaker 4: the one who was there, you know. But with that
Speaker 4: being said, I like to your point, I'm student of
Speaker 4: the game, but also try to try to always be
Speaker 4: tried to stay as a bressed as they could have
Speaker 4: all the all of the operations in the company, because
Speaker 4: at the end of the day, I was invested, like
Speaker 4: I want, you know, I was invested in everything, you know,
Speaker 4: trying to get a handle on every element of it.
Speaker 4: And I would have long conversations with Bob Ryder, who
Speaker 4: by the way I think is that the absolute lifeblood
Speaker 4: of the company, like he's you know, the main reason
Speaker 4: why is it's still in existences. He's the only guy
Speaker 4: who's available twenty four to seven and is always working.
Speaker 4: To that point, I think there were a number of
Speaker 4: people in the office internally who didn't necessarily have that
Speaker 4: same work ethic. And I'm trying to choose my words
Speaker 4: carefully when I say this, but there were a lot
Speaker 4: of guys in Nashville who, to me, I just got
Speaker 4: the impression that they thought this is a really great
Speaker 4: this is such a great gig, Like we just you know,
Speaker 4: we're like, all we have to do is do this
Speaker 4: and this and this and and you know, and the
Speaker 4: rest of the time we can you know, this is great.
Speaker 4: We just get to hang around with wrestlers or like
Speaker 4: whether they were fans or not, you know, it was
Speaker 4: it just seemed to me like a lot of guys
Speaker 4: were just treating it like a bit of a vacation.
Speaker 4: And I'm trying and again I'm trying to be nice
Speaker 4: when I say that, but at the end of the day,
Speaker 4: you know, I have to call it like I see it,
Speaker 4: And I said this, I even said this to Dixie
Speaker 4: because I cared about her and I care about the company.
Speaker 4: And I was very grateful to Dixie because you know,
Speaker 4: she gave me a nice living for for a number
Speaker 4: of years. And I said, there are a lot of
Speaker 4: people here who are taking you for a ride, like
Speaker 4: and you need to you know, you that you need
Speaker 4: to start dropping some heads off around here and like
Speaker 4: getting some people, you know, getting these people like to
Speaker 4: take notice. And and she didn't want to hear it,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean, that's that's that's that's the
Speaker 4: that's the blunk reality of it. But you know, at
Speaker 4: some point and and here's the thing, and and the
Speaker 4: evidence in the fact that there would there would be
Speaker 4: guys who would come in who were really dynamic and
Speaker 4: like really had a passion to the business but also
Speaker 4: had an aptitude for it and the acumen to make
Speaker 4: happen and implements them on a business level. For example,
Speaker 4: there was a guy who who called Raphael who came
Speaker 4: in who had worked at w W E was you know,
Speaker 4: very was a really good blend of of you know,
Speaker 4: academically you know, smart, like you know, educated, but also
Speaker 4: you know, had a bit of that New York kind
Speaker 4: of street smart about him. It was very dialed into
Speaker 4: the business, very smart, very forward thinking, very progressive, and
Speaker 4: he just would hit roadblock after roadblock, you know, with
Speaker 4: with trying to implement new ideas and and and he
Speaker 4: he left to the and he was a guy who
Speaker 4: was like because unfortunately you can't escape this sort of
Speaker 4: political stuff and wrestling. Like as soon as I became
Speaker 4: the champion, I suddenly was like very aware of like
Speaker 4: there were camps, you know, like I'd never really I'd
Speaker 4: never I would hear about this stuff and I would
Speaker 4: kind of observe it and get a kick out of
Speaker 4: watching it, but obviously never really been involved with it
Speaker 4: until like right before I won the title. In when
Speaker 4: I was champion, it was suddenly it was like, these
Speaker 4: guys are in my camp, and like these guys are
Speaker 4: in so and so it was camp, you know what
Speaker 4: I mean. There were like definitely people who were like
Speaker 4: trying to work, you know, against you. I mean, it's
Speaker 4: just the way. It's always going to be that way.
Speaker 4: It's stupid, but at the end of the day, that's
Speaker 4: that's the business, right. Brassiel was one of the guys
Speaker 4: to me I could always trust and we would go
Speaker 4: to live events, and he would always make a point
Speaker 4: to say to me, hey, last time we were in
Speaker 4: this town, you know, in time last year, the house
Speaker 4: was this much. This time it's this much.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 4: You know, these are TNA live events talking about. So
Speaker 4: we're talking about the difference in like, you know, a
Speaker 4: couple of hundred. But at the end of the day,
Speaker 4: he would always make a point to save me. Hey, camp, Like,
Speaker 4: numbers are up from last time. Numbers are up from
Speaker 4: last time, you know what I mean, every single time,
Speaker 4: and the like, you know, last time the house was
Speaker 4: x amount. This time it's x amount. It's about eighteen percent.
Speaker 4: You know, he would always make it because he came
Speaker 4: from that wwe uh you know sort of mentality where
Speaker 4: they you know, they're very dialed into all that stuff.
Speaker 4: And he and he would always make a point to
Speaker 4: keep me aware of all that stuff. And you know,
Speaker 4: and I would go to him and say, hey, you know,
Speaker 4: why don't we do this and why don't we do that?
Speaker 4: Like the boys have always said, you know about like
Speaker 4: why don't we have like wrap scring trucks, or why
Speaker 4: don't we have this or you know, and all this.
Speaker 4: You know that there's a there's a really good like
Speaker 4: in the Northeast. You're like, oh, there's all these there's
Speaker 4: these great independent promoters who could draw like two or
Speaker 4: three thousands, you know, like why don't we work with them? Like,
Speaker 4: why don't we work with them on some stuff? Yeah,
Speaker 4: like you know, deal with them with like the street
Speaker 4: teams and stuff like that. And it would always just
Speaker 4: these after a while, Like the problem is of that
Speaker 4: stuff is that these these suggestions and these things would
Speaker 4: just flow up into the atmosphere and after a while
Speaker 4: and I would see all these guys had been there
Speaker 4: longer than I had, like like Bobby Roots and like
Speaker 4: Eric Young's and again have great aptitude of the business,
Speaker 4: and they would have this kind of like they'd see
Speaker 4: me doing all the stuff, and that you could tell it.
Speaker 4: I was just thinking, you're wasting your time, you know
Speaker 4: what I mean? Wow, I would and I would sit
Speaker 4: there go and like, oh, we have to you know,
Speaker 4: let's god book to someone about it. And they'd be
Speaker 4: like all right, you know, but it's not going to
Speaker 4: go anywhere. And unfortunately that is the that's the long
Speaker 4: and short of it, and that's why you know they
Speaker 4: had Jeff Jareck is too.
Speaker 6: In twenty twelve, NXT transitioned into the developmental system and
Speaker 6: ultimately the brand you see today. On the Torch VIP
Speaker 6: podcast NXT Eight Years Back, we'll be taking a weekly
Speaker 6: look at this page in NXT's early history.
Speaker 7: Join Kelly Wells and me Tom Stout from PWT Talks
Speaker 7: NXT every Saturday as we go eight years back to
Speaker 7: the d to track NXT's rising talents and why they
Speaker 7: did or didn't work out, exclusively for PW Torch VIP members.
Speaker 1: So you you were the uh you were like the
Speaker 1: young college student protesting government policies. And then there were
Speaker 1: other guys who were the professors who had bet seen
Speaker 1: every generation do it. No changes happened, just going you
Speaker 1: know your way. You know, it's it's great, you care,
Speaker 1: we need that, but you know, don't expect change.
Speaker 4: Basically yeah, yeah, you know. It was like for me,
Speaker 4: this is this is I mean, I just thought of
Speaker 4: this while we were talking. But I guess, you know,
Speaker 4: some of the some of your observations have sort of
Speaker 4: made me look at it in a slightly different way.
Speaker 4: But I would say that CNA was always looking for
Speaker 4: the one big like macro change. When to me, it
Speaker 4: would have been a series of micro changes that really
Speaker 4: needed to happen. If that makes sense.
Speaker 3: No, No, it totally does.
Speaker 4: Yeah it did.
Speaker 1: It seemed like they were always swinging for the fences
Speaker 1: instead of trying to get singles, doubles or you know,
Speaker 1: get the basis loaded for an RBI single. It was
Speaker 1: these big, expensive, all or nothing type grand stands or
Speaker 1: big plays.
Speaker 4: Yeah, right right to me, that's what That's not an
Speaker 4: entrepreneurial approach. Like I like to think that I have
Speaker 4: a little bit of an entrepreneurial kind of spirit and ability,
Speaker 4: and that's actually one of the reasons why I'm really
Speaker 4: enjoying working with Jeff on this deal, because it's like
Speaker 4: being in on the ground floor. Like Jeff's allowing me
Speaker 4: some lastitude and some flexibility to sort of explore some
Speaker 4: of some things on my end from an entrepreneurial standpoint.
Speaker 4: You know, he's giving me some some responsibilities here and
Speaker 4: there to sort of, you know, to do things on
Speaker 4: an entrepreneurial level. I can't really expand too much on
Speaker 4: that at this point, but you know, you start to
Speaker 4: sort of see it as we as we progress here,
Speaker 4: and it sort of coming up. But it's like, you know,
Speaker 4: there was only this thing in DNA of like, you're
Speaker 4: you're just a wrestler, you know. Mm hmmm, hey wrestler,
Speaker 4: you know, like don't you worry about that? You just
Speaker 4: worry about putting your boots on and you know, having
Speaker 4: your match, and like we'll we'll worry about the business
Speaker 4: side of things, and it's like we'd be there, No,
Speaker 4: we're worried about the business because we you know, all
Speaker 4: of everything. One of us had to exist as an
Speaker 4: independent entity prior to coming here, which meant we had
Speaker 4: to you know handle you know, we have we had
Speaker 4: to balance our books, you know what I mean, if
Speaker 4: we don't make up, if we don't, if we don't,
Speaker 4: we don't have our stuff in line, like we you know,
Speaker 4: we don't make our house payment next month, so we
Speaker 4: don't make our car payment, you know. And so obviously
Speaker 4: we're all entrepreneurs in that respect, so like, you know,
Speaker 4: we should And that was always the thing, whereas like
Speaker 4: sometimes it was there was definitely this thing of like, oh,
Speaker 4: you know, you're just a wrestler, you know, and that
Speaker 4: was that, you know, and there was time and Jeff
Speaker 4: obviously doesn't have that mentality because that generation guy obviously
Speaker 4: was arrest with a very successful one, you know, and
Speaker 4: and now is on the business side of things. So
Speaker 4: there's definitely you know, he's more open minded as to
Speaker 4: not to say that he's going to listen to everybody,
Speaker 4: but he's going to listen and you know, be the objective.
Speaker 4: You know, when he listens to people didn't put his.
Speaker 1: Dad, Jerry, I consider one of my mentors I've done
Speaker 1: had Probably he's probably.
Speaker 3: The top five of people I've had.
Speaker 1: Conversation in terms of time on the phone talking about
Speaker 1: the industry and learning about things. Jerry jared his dad
Speaker 1: is probably on the top five list, and it's probably
Speaker 1: one hundred plus hours on the phone in the nineties
Speaker 1: and since Jerry, Jeff learned from him and observed him,
Speaker 1: knew what was knew the knew how to balance the books.
Speaker 1: And he gets criticized for it because he made good money. Well,
Speaker 1: a lot of guys were not Jerry.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: I confronted Jerry with that and some Torch Talk interviews
Speaker 1: I did with him in the nineties, and he made
Speaker 1: his case for it. You know, He's like, I could
Speaker 1: be doing a lot of things, making a lot a
Speaker 1: lot of money and I chose to make a lot
Speaker 1: of money in pro wrestling, and I would not have
Speaker 1: done it if I couldn't make a lot of money.
Speaker 1: But I created a place for guys to get feet wet,
Speaker 1: get some experience, and no one was forced to work here.
Speaker 1: But in the end I would be open with the books.
Speaker 1: Here's a percentage I'm giving you. Here's what you meant
Speaker 1: to the gate, not a lot compared to say Jerry Lawler,
Speaker 1: bild Undie, Austin Idel and you can take it or
Speaker 1: leave it, but we're going to give you a chance,
Speaker 1: essentially to be an apprentice to some very some veteran
Speaker 1: guys and make a name for yourself, so you become
Speaker 1: one of those guys who draws at the gate. Jerry
Speaker 1: was roblunt with me about that. Not everybody liked Jerry's
Speaker 1: pay approach, but the business aspect of it was, I'm
Speaker 1: not going to a town unless I'm going to walk
Speaker 1: away with a bag with some money in it. That's profit.
Speaker 1: And you know that was an approach. Jeff learned that,
Speaker 1: and I think he can bring that approach to global force.
Speaker 1: Bruce Mitchell wrote a col him in the Pros and
Speaker 1: Torch newsletter several weeks ago applauding Jeff for being the
Speaker 1: one guy out there who, from the beginning of launching
Speaker 1: a promotion did the one thing where you're guaranteed to
Speaker 1: make money, which is sell some shows to minor league
Speaker 1: baseball stadium stadiums and you know, run on a budget
Speaker 1: where you walk away with a bag of cash that
Speaker 1: counts as profit and all your guys got paid. So
Speaker 1: right that that approach, that contrast to Hena Nick.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and Jeff is also you know, it's interesting what
Speaker 4: you said about promoting, because I think that you would
Speaker 4: find that, you know, that runs a very close parallel
Speaker 4: to Ian. Again, I can't speak for him because I
Speaker 4: don't I don't know the man, but it sounds, you know,
Speaker 4: from everything I've studied and listened to secondhand, third hand,
Speaker 4: it sounds very parallel to a lot of them, you know,
Speaker 4: to a lot of descriptions of the way Vindrick Man
Speaker 4: handled business. And then then you go back you look
Speaker 4: at who who Vince had lined up, you know, to
Speaker 4: to to sort of steer the ship if he was
Speaker 4: going to go to jail, you know, And it was Gerry,
Speaker 4: I believe, so you know, it was Yeah, so it's
Speaker 4: like and and Jeff not only has all of that,
Speaker 4: you know, and from from Jerry and then from his
Speaker 4: grandmother who was was one hundred percent sort of financial
Speaker 4: you know, so a bookkeeper, you know, in the in
Speaker 4: the business, but also he learned, he's he's also learned
Speaker 4: from the mistakes that today, Yeah, which is which is
Speaker 4: almost more valuable.
Speaker 3: Absolutely absolutely.
Speaker 1: I want to phrase this carefully because I think you
Speaker 1: can genuinely answer it the way that I'm phrasing it,
Speaker 1: whether it is fair or unfair. How would you generalize
Speaker 1: the locker room of wrestler's opinion of Dixie Carter as
Speaker 1: a boss and as a head of that wrestling company.
Speaker 4: I'd probably venture to say that my opinion of Dixie
Speaker 4: is probably fairly reflective of most of the analytical, sort
Speaker 4: of objective guys in the locker room, which is, she's
Speaker 4: a sweetheart of a person, got an absolute heart of gold,
Speaker 4: but it is too easily, too easily manipulated, you know too,
Speaker 4: and like the her ambition is taken advantage of and misguided.
Speaker 4: And for me, perhaps the one thing she's always lacked
Speaker 4: is that survival mentality, because you know, she doesn't necessarily
Speaker 4: relate to you know, the idea of not being able
Speaker 4: to pay a bills that might be a little harsh,
Speaker 4: but that always seemed to be That was always that
Speaker 4: always seems to be my impression, you know, was that
Speaker 4: that was the one thing she always seemed to lack,
Speaker 4: which was always why there seemed to be these sort
Speaker 4: of huge, these huge, expensive kind of moves, because to me,
Speaker 4: it always just seemed to be reflective of someone who
Speaker 4: you know, it wasn't necess like they weren't they weren't
Speaker 4: bet in the farm, you know what I mean, Yeah,
Speaker 4: like they you know, it was kind of I don't
Speaker 4: want to say playing with house money, but it was
Speaker 4: sometimes that was the way that it came across. But
Speaker 4: you know, to me, that the biggest thing was that
Speaker 4: she was just too easily led, like to you know,
Speaker 4: too many people took advantage of her still or too
Speaker 4: many people are still taking advantage of her.
Speaker 1: I would say, I've gotten the impression even anecdote you
Speaker 1: said earlier, and many many other examples of interviews and
Speaker 1: talking to people, that everything you said about Dixie reflects
Speaker 1: what I've heard about her too. So I'm just backing
Speaker 1: that up in terms of, hey, that didn't that you're
Speaker 1: answered in shock me like, oh, I've never heard that before,
Speaker 1: you know that, But it was really well stated, and
Speaker 1: I think is one of the big issues that teenage
Speaker 1: running too over and over again. The other thing with Dixie,
Speaker 1: and again I think you had an anecdote earlier that
Speaker 1: backs this up is once she does make a decision,
Speaker 1: whether she's swayed or otherwise, you she doesn't accept challenges
Speaker 1: to that point of view or that line of thinking
Speaker 1: particularly well. It's like once that decision is made, I've
Speaker 1: gotten the impression from her, we don't want to talk
Speaker 1: about it anymore. I don't want to hear contrary opinions
Speaker 1: to it. This is the plan. We're going with it,
Speaker 1: and we're going to see what happens. And sometimes it
Speaker 1: seems like maybe that I don't know if dude, diligence
Speaker 1: is a word, but being able to listen to a
Speaker 1: lot of different points of view and based on knowledge
Speaker 1: of the industry and like you said, kind of that
Speaker 1: survival instinct process and evaluate which ideas are good ones
Speaker 1: and which ones are just a waste of money. So
Speaker 1: I guess my short question is do you think sometimes
Speaker 1: Dixie makes the decision and sticks to it, but hasn't
Speaker 1: sought out counter perspectives to process first.
Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean.
Speaker 4: That's difficult for me to go in on because I
Speaker 4: only I mean, I haven't been privy to too many
Speaker 4: of those discussions. I have been privy to some, and
Speaker 4: they have you know, there were times towards the end
Speaker 4: of my run there where you know, I was afforded
Speaker 4: to sort of the respect to be us sit in
Speaker 4: on some things and to sort of, you know, give
Speaker 4: my opinion on stuff, and I would, I would honestly
Speaker 4: give it. I mean I did always do that, and
Speaker 4: I don't know, I I do perhaps get the impression
Speaker 4: that she kind of would go into these things with
Speaker 4: an idea of what she wanted to do already, and
Speaker 4: then you know, nine times out of ten, would that
Speaker 4: would still be the result coming out. But then that's
Speaker 4: that's probably the same of you know, the thing can
Speaker 4: be said of most bosses. I would, I would venture.
Speaker 1: To say, anytime you're watching ww E Raw or SmackDown
Speaker 1: or AEW Dynamite in particular, send us an email if
Speaker 1: you've got thoughts on the show or a topic you
Speaker 1: want us to address, or a question for us Wade
Speaker 1: Kellor Podcast at pw torch dot com. Wade Keller Podcast
Speaker 1: at pew torch dot com. If there's anything else going
Speaker 1: on in pro wrestling that you want us to address
Speaker 1: on our main podcast during our mailbank segments, that same
Speaker 1: email applies Wade Keller Podcast at pw torch dot com.
Speaker 1: We invite that interaction. Let us know what you think
Speaker 1: of what we're saying, and let us know what you
Speaker 1: want us to talk about and ask us specific questions.
Speaker 1: Wad Kellor Podcast at pw torch dot com. There comes
Speaker 1: a point where you make a decision and you just
Speaker 1: got to go with it. You can't sit here and
Speaker 1: second guess at a million more times.
Speaker 4: You got to make that right. That's right, that's that's
Speaker 4: that is true, Like there is that that is you
Speaker 4: know that is valid. I was going to get to
Speaker 4: that was that you know that you know at the
Speaker 4: end of the day, once you do make a decision,
Speaker 4: you do have to stick with it, whether it you
Speaker 4: know it was right or wrong, because and and the
Speaker 4: funny thing is is that I would actually, when you
Speaker 4: look back at it, to me, the timeline of TNA
Speaker 4: from when I got there, which is interesting because when
Speaker 4: I came in in two thousand and nine was arguably
Speaker 4: the peak of TNA's performance in terms of expenditure, to
Speaker 4: attendances and ratings. But you know, the one thing that
Speaker 4: perhaps to me was the fundamental issue when one of
Speaker 4: the reasons why I decided to leave was that I
Speaker 4: felt like they'd lost they'd lost the trust of their
Speaker 4: poor audience because they'd because they've made too many changes,
Speaker 4: too many like resets, And to me it was like,
Speaker 4: you know, after like a reset every now and then
Speaker 4: is exciting. A reset, you know, three times a year
Speaker 4: starts giving the message of like we don't know what's
Speaker 4: you know, like we don't know what you want. Like
Speaker 4: even if people can't necessarily even if casual fans aren't
Speaker 4: necessarily articulated that way, immediately like subconsciously, you know, they
Speaker 4: start to get that vibe and I think, you know,
Speaker 4: Eric Bishop and Holk Hogan is showing up and saying, hey,
Speaker 4: we know you guys really liked that excited ring and
Speaker 4: these excivision guys, but you don't want that anymore. Like
Speaker 4: we're tearing up this format like this, you know, like
Speaker 4: you know, I'll say this being money in the British
Speaker 4: Invasion have been a really good, steady part of t
Speaker 4: and age business for the majority of two thousand and nine.
Speaker 4: You know, we'd told some compelling stories, we've been entertaining feud,
Speaker 4: We've been like consistently one of the you know, the
Speaker 4: highlights of the live events all over the world. We
Speaker 4: were advertised for that Monday night shot up, but we
Speaker 4: weren't put so they advertised beer money versus the British Invasion,
Speaker 4: you know, and then the first thing I see of
Speaker 4: it is them going like tearing up the format. So essentially,
Speaker 4: you know, in a lot of ways, it was like, hey,
Speaker 4: here's all these like towns that you the audience have
Speaker 4: invested all your you know that you've invested your time in,
Speaker 4: and you know you believe in and you're in it,
Speaker 4: you know, and you've and you've still given your standard
Speaker 4: driven to screw them like you know, and you don't
Speaker 4: want them. You want all these guys that we you know,
Speaker 4: we're going to tell you who to like and to me.
Speaker 4: I really believe that was the beginning of reset after
Speaker 4: reset of like we're going to the sixth side room,
Speaker 4: We're going to a fourth sighted ring. Then we're going
Speaker 4: back to a six sided ring, and we're going live.
Speaker 4: We're not going like we're going Mondays, We're going Wednesdays,
Speaker 4: We're going Thursdays, you know, Friday, you know. And it
Speaker 4: was just like I just started going like we got
Speaker 4: we gotta pick a day and stick to it. We
Speaker 4: gotta pick a time and stick to it. And you know,
Speaker 4: we got to pick a roster and stick to it.
Speaker 4: You know, like like there's a little things like changing the name,
Speaker 4: you know, impact wrestling. Is it P and A or
Speaker 4: is the Impact wrestling? Like like who chairs at the
Speaker 4: end of the day, Like changing the name of it
Speaker 4: now is not everyone's still going to say T and A.
Speaker 4: No one's gonna you know, all of us could say that,
Speaker 4: all of us, all of us are saying that at
Speaker 4: the time, we're going like they're too late to change
Speaker 4: it now. Everyone's still going to say T and A
Speaker 4: ten years down the line, fast forward to five years
Speaker 4: down the line, Sure enough, T and A, you know
Speaker 4: what I mean. And it was just it seemed like
Speaker 4: a lot of decisions were just made on the whim
Speaker 4: of like one guy, whether it be Hugan or Eric
Speaker 4: or you know, Bruce or whoever had Dixie's ear at
Speaker 4: the time, and unfortunately, you know, there was some It's
Speaker 4: funny really because like, you know, a lot to me,
Speaker 4: a lot of the sort of a lot of the
Speaker 4: sort of snakes turned on each other a little bit too,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean, Like there was there was
Speaker 4: like this seemed like there was a lot of regime changes.
Speaker 4: And I don't know for sure, but it's the word
Speaker 4: was that a lot of the time they were sort
Speaker 4: of screwing each other over. You know, this guy would
Speaker 4: maneuver to get rid of this guy, and then he'd
Speaker 4: get moved out because someone else behind, you know, And
Speaker 4: and it's to me, it was it was it always
Speaker 4: just seemed to be a race to see who could
Speaker 4: get uh, you know, in Dixie's ear. And then it
Speaker 4: was like and and then the one consistent thing of
Speaker 4: every new boss, it always seemed like the one thing
Speaker 4: they were trying to do more than anything was moved
Speaker 4: Dixie away from the talent and from everyone as far
Speaker 4: away as possible, you know. Like for me, I always
Speaker 4: made I always made the decision on the advice of
Speaker 4: guys like Kevin Nash, you know, like Kevin Nash would
Speaker 4: say to me, Hey, when it comes to money. You know,
Speaker 4: who's who's signed your contract and who signs your checks Dixie,
Speaker 4: So you deal with Dixie. That was always like the
Speaker 4: and that was the way I always approached it because
Speaker 4: he had said that was the way he always had,
Speaker 4: you know, he had always approached things with you know,
Speaker 4: with Vince strickmaner though with you know, and then later
Speaker 4: on with you know, with WWI and stuff. So I
Speaker 4: always took the same mentality, and like, I can't tell
Speaker 4: you the amount of like blowback I got from, you know,
Speaker 4: from different like talent relations guys for that, because when
Speaker 4: it came time for a contract, I would always just
Speaker 4: be like, I need to have this. I'm gonna have
Speaker 4: this conversation with Dixie, you know, and they'd be like, no, no, no,
Speaker 4: you don't need to talk to you need to talk
Speaker 4: to me, And I go, no, no, I don't, you know,
Speaker 4: And and like I wasn't trying to be a troublemaker
Speaker 4: or anything like that. I was just you know, And
Speaker 4: but there was always that there was always that feeling
Speaker 4: that they were just they were always just trying to
Speaker 4: keep her away from everything as much as possible so
Speaker 4: that essentially they could be the boss you know like
Speaker 4: they would they you know, for like I'd say this
Speaker 4: more about the current boss than any other before as well,
Speaker 4: that like this seems to be more like more enamored
Speaker 4: with just being like in charge than really sort of
Speaker 4: actually making difference. It's more about just like being in
Speaker 4: charge and like being the boss and having you know,
Speaker 4: people underneath them and stuff. I don't know, it could
Speaker 4: be wrong, but that was always impression I got. But ultimately,
Speaker 4: after just sort of seeing all these different resets and
Speaker 4: changes and you know, it just there was always seem
Speaker 4: to be like a completely new philosophy. After a while,
Speaker 4: I just went, I, you know, like I like this,
Speaker 4: this is these aren't This isn't a stable isn't a
Speaker 4: stable place anymore, you know, and I need to get
Speaker 4: out while I can and you know, be somewhere where
Speaker 4: like I'm not in this constant state of worry. Like
Speaker 4: I just did an interview with Jason Powell before before
Speaker 4: I talked to you, and I said, like I wasn't
Speaker 4: I'd never really I said this in like my Rolling
Speaker 4: Stone interview and a few other places too, and I
Speaker 4: said about how it felt like a one hundred pounds
Speaker 4: weight had been lifted off my back. But honestly, that
Speaker 4: really is true. And the only reason I talked about
Speaker 4: it is I really didn't expect that to be the case.
Speaker 4: Like I really wasn't, Like I really didn't. I knew,
Speaker 4: you know, because I knew it was coming. I knew
Speaker 4: I was going to tell him I didn't want to stay,
Speaker 4: and you know, we would wrap up business at the
Speaker 4: pay per view, and in the end, they had ended
Speaker 4: up having me tape a couple of things, you know,
Speaker 4: so like the last thing is like, you know, still
Speaker 4: a couple of weeks away, but whatever. I just but
Speaker 4: I do remember just being genuinely surprised at how relieved
Speaker 4: I was when I got off the phone. I remember,
Speaker 4: like we we talked and we agreed to, you know,
Speaker 4: wrap up business the right way and everything like that.
Speaker 4: Got off the phone, and you know, it was big
Speaker 4: and like Mickey was there and I and she looked
Speaker 4: me in and I said, that's it. I did it,
Speaker 4: you know, and she just went that's it, and I
Speaker 4: went yeah, and it was like I had this like
Speaker 4: this this st like like you know, I teared up,
Speaker 4: but not in like a not in a sad way,
Speaker 4: but just in like it suddenly was like this huge
Speaker 4: release of tension because it was just always another worry.
Speaker 4: It was always like there was always something new, you know,
Speaker 4: and from the talent standpoint, it was just like it
Speaker 4: was it weighs you down because like you said earlier,
Speaker 4: like I'm one of those guys who's like invest and
Speaker 4: it was it was such a relief to just think, like,
Speaker 4: you know, it's not my cross to bear anymore, you know,
Speaker 4: with a real relief.
Speaker 1: Do you expect And as the attitude from Slammiversary in
Speaker 1: that last set of tapings is, is there just kind
Speaker 1: of a sense among the wrestlers that it's ending at
Speaker 1: the end of September, even if that word has not
Speaker 1: been officially stated and talent has been told on that
Speaker 1: infamous conference call, you know, legally we can't say anything.
Speaker 1: Is the working assumption this company's done after the next
Speaker 1: tapings with.
Speaker 4: Some people for sure, Yeah, I don't. I don't know.
Speaker 4: I you know, I in some ways, one one of
Speaker 4: the things I'm most proud of with my time there
Speaker 4: was that to what in the last couple of years
Speaker 4: and guys like great talents like Eddie Edwards and Davey
Speaker 4: Richards to come in and like you know, guys like
Speaker 4: that coming from different places, and you know, a lot
Speaker 4: of the sort of younger guys who was always or
Speaker 4: guys in the sort of mid to late twenties who
Speaker 4: were really starting to kind of mature and become you know,
Speaker 4: really good, really good performers in their own right. I
Speaker 4: sort of became this kind of go to kind of
Speaker 4: guide almost like you know, I won't want to say
Speaker 4: like a leader or anything like that, but but certainly
Speaker 4: like there was, there was, there were some of the
Speaker 4: younger guys especially, were more comfortable coming to me to
Speaker 4: sort of get my take on on things than going
Speaker 4: to say Joe or you know, or somebody like that
Speaker 4: who really was a leader, you know, and so and
Speaker 4: so I saw, you know, after a while, I sort
Speaker 4: of became this, you know this for a certain group
Speaker 4: of guys, or became like this little bit of a
Speaker 4: of a barometer, you know, because they'd be like, well,
Speaker 4: you've seen you know, things that looked really bleak, and
Speaker 4: then they've sort of come out from then you see
Speaker 4: that things that look really good, and you know so
Speaker 4: but yeah, I always said to those guys, the truth
Speaker 4: is is that t and ay, I know that they
Speaker 4: say it as like as a bit of a defense mechanism.
Speaker 4: But it is true that they have almost from day
Speaker 4: one there they're you know, people have been writing their
Speaker 4: obituary like that is true, and they have always found
Speaker 4: a way, you know, so there is always that you
Speaker 4: always got to keep that in the back pocket. But
Speaker 4: I would say that, you know, I've had this conversation
Speaker 4: with guys who are much more qualified to talk about
Speaker 4: it than I am. You know that this time around,
Speaker 4: I've got to say it doesn't it does. It does
Speaker 4: feel different, It doesn't have the same like it does.
Speaker 4: There is a different field at this time. I think that,
Speaker 4: you know, I mean, someone will someone will say it,
Speaker 4: so it may as well be me. But I will
Speaker 4: say this that there was a very telling moment for
Speaker 4: me when you know, Dixie wasn't present at the Slammiversary
Speaker 4: pay per view, and that said a lot to me,
Speaker 4: Like that was a very telling thing to me, like
Speaker 4: because you know, considering the circumstances that you know, and
Speaker 4: you know, for like for for for me and then
Speaker 4: apparently for James, you know, and for and for aries,
Speaker 4: you know, it was it was interesting to me that
Speaker 4: that she wasn't there. But whatever, why no no, that's
Speaker 4: what I'm saying. I don't know why I didn't. You know,
Speaker 4: I'm not I'm not in love with myself enough to
Speaker 4: to really, you know, to go out of my way
Speaker 4: to find out you know, you know, well I weren't
Speaker 4: you there for my last match, but you know, but
Speaker 4: but it was interesting to me, you know, considering that,
Speaker 4: and it was ironic to me that this is the truth,
Speaker 4: this is a shoot. I didn't know. I didn't know
Speaker 4: about all that stuff. But Jeff, it was very much.
Speaker 4: That was very last minute. You know, I had already
Speaker 4: sort of you know, shook you know, shook his hands,
Speaker 4: you know, and said, yep, you know, whatever you need
Speaker 4: me for, Like I'm there, you know what I mean,
Speaker 4: I'm in as far as Global is concerned. So it
Speaker 4: was just very interesting. It was very It was sort
Speaker 4: of telling to me that, you know, I went out
Speaker 4: there and even though it was my last day, and
Speaker 4: I'll say this like, oh, Hevna was the ref you know,
Speaker 4: for for our match, which which was great lovel You know,
Speaker 4: he actually lives like five minutes away from me now
Speaker 4: and I go to his house and get eggs because
Speaker 4: he has a chicken. So you're going to get free
Speaker 4: eggs from him. So I love him for that. And
Speaker 4: he sent me and said, he goes, you're gonna like
Speaker 4: you're are You're going to dive off the Are you
Speaker 4: going to dive off like go off the top, like
Speaker 4: to the floor through a table And I go yeah.
Speaker 4: And he's like, why are you doing that? Don't do that.
Speaker 4: It's your last you know, it's your last day. Like
Speaker 4: I'll get her on your last day. I said, no, oh,
Speaker 4: I'm doing it because it's my last day, you know
Speaker 4: what I mean, Like because it's it's like if I
Speaker 4: can't go out here and like you know, put myself
Speaker 4: through all of that or you know, through all of
Speaker 4: that punishment, you know, for the sake of entertaining the
Speaker 4: audience and telling them a story that you know that
Speaker 4: hopefully they won't forget, you know, and giving them what
Speaker 4: I thought was you know, was a serious you know,
Speaker 4: it was a few real memorable moments and you know,
Speaker 4: a story that I'm very proud of. So if I
Speaker 4: can't do that on my last night, you know, after
Speaker 4: six years of like earning their trust, then like I
Speaker 4: should you know, I don't deserve it, you know what
Speaker 4: I mean? And that was. I believed that, and I
Speaker 4: but I also looked at it as a way to say,
Speaker 4: don't mourn, don't mourn me, you know what I mean,
Speaker 4: Like this is I'm really on, Like I'm like I'm
Speaker 4: moving forwards, you know. And I and it was like
Speaker 4: almost like for me, I said, like, this is a
Speaker 4: at the end of the day, every time you're on television,
Speaker 4: whether it's for fifteen seconds or fifteen minutes, that's a
Speaker 4: that's an that's a commercial for your services. And I said,
Speaker 4: this is a you know, this is my way of
Speaker 4: showing everybody like if you know, if I'm being paid right,
Speaker 4: which I was, you know, I will, I will give
Speaker 4: you everything, you know what I mean, And I would
Speaker 4: be happy to do it, and I'll you know, and
Speaker 4: we you know, did you know obviously it was a
Speaker 4: pay per view and the time restrictions and stuff. I
Speaker 4: wish that had been able to take a bit more
Speaker 4: time at the end there of the afterbook, because you
Speaker 4: know what, like you saw little glimpses of it, you know,
Speaker 4: the emotion there, but like people you know that there
Speaker 4: were tears when people were crying in the audience, you know,
Speaker 4: because they knew like there was you know, there are
Speaker 4: people there with her every day, every single time, you know,
Speaker 4: and they and they knew it, and it meant a
Speaker 4: lot to those people, it meant a lot to me.
Speaker 8: Longing for some nostalgia, or maybe you want to learn
Speaker 8: some wrestling history, don't miss the Nineties Past cast every
Speaker 8: Friday on the PW Torch Daily Cast feed. Alex and
Speaker 8: Patrick will transport you thirty years into the past by
Speaker 8: taking you through the Torch issue from that very weak
Speaker 8: follow news from the WWF and WCW and all the
Speaker 8: happenings from across the wrestling industry in real time as
Speaker 8: The Torch reported it thirty years ago. That's the Nineties
Speaker 8: Pass cast every Friday on the PW Torch Daily Cast feeds.
Speaker 1: As you've been talking, this email just came in. William
Speaker 1: Darren Pohle says, how does Dixie have a heart of
Speaker 1: gold but still allow production workers to go unpaid and
Speaker 1: talent to.
Speaker 3: Be paid late. I've heard this a lot.
Speaker 1: I understand the question, but I don't necessarily think the
Speaker 1: two things are as contradictory, even though on the surface
Speaker 1: it does seem contradictory. But I'm curious what you have
Speaker 1: to say to that in terms of the way TNA
Speaker 1: operates with those late checks.
Speaker 4: All I can say is I can only speak for
Speaker 4: my own experience and say that, well, yes, I did
Speaker 4: guess few that were that were late. It certainly wasn't
Speaker 4: more than like a half a dozen, and with the
Speaker 4: exception of maybe one or two, they were always very
Speaker 4: upfront about it. I can also say, however, that you know,
Speaker 4: and I'm not saying I'm not telling this story to
Speaker 4: try and make myself look like some kind of master
Speaker 4: or anything like that, but I will I did you know,
Speaker 4: And this again just a sort of shows that I'm
Speaker 4: you know that I was. I did my best to
Speaker 4: be a company guy. I had a conversation a while back.
Speaker 4: It was right after I won the title, actually, because
Speaker 4: I took that seriously as to be like a you
Speaker 4: know a little bit of a of a leader. I
Speaker 4: you know, had heard about some of the sort of
Speaker 4: financial issues maybe in some of the guys having late
Speaker 4: checks and stuff. So I called uh the office and
Speaker 4: called Dean the CFO, and said, hey, look, I don't
Speaker 4: you know, I don't need to know any in and outs.
Speaker 4: I'm just saying to you, if there's ever a if
Speaker 4: there's ever a where there's a bit of a cash
Speaker 4: flow issue and you need to hold guys checks. You know,
Speaker 4: please put mine at the bottom of the pile, you
Speaker 4: know what I mean, Like you pay every you know,
Speaker 4: pay like pay the guys who like pay the guys
Speaker 4: like Spud and stuff who are on like starving artists contracts,
Speaker 4: you know who like really need you know, who need
Speaker 4: that check, you know what I mean? Because that was
Speaker 4: that was that was after I had a conversation with
Speaker 4: Spud and he was just kind of like, you know,
Speaker 4: he was concerned because it was you know, because he
Speaker 4: was sort of paid per show and stuff. I made
Speaker 4: a point to say to them, make sure you have
Speaker 4: like take care of all those guys first and like
Speaker 4: and all I ask is that you just call me
Speaker 4: and let me know, because I, like, I can go
Speaker 4: a few weeks, you know what I mean, Like I
Speaker 4: don't I don't live outside my means or anything like that.
Speaker 4: So it was like, I can you know, I can
Speaker 4: deal with it, It's no big deal, but just just
Speaker 4: be upfront with me. And to their credit, they always were,
Speaker 4: you know, there was a few instances where they said, hey,
Speaker 4: check's going to be you know, check's going to be
Speaker 4: a week late, you know, really sorry, you know, and
Speaker 4: I'd be like, yeah, sure, you know, so so like
Speaker 4: I can't. I can only speak to me like and
Speaker 4: so you know, I do. I do know. As an issue,
Speaker 4: I've heard some of this stuff about the production guys
Speaker 4: and all that, but I don't know too much about that,
Speaker 4: like in depth, and honestly, like, you know, I don't
Speaker 4: really I'm not sure I really want to engage in
Speaker 4: too much conversation about all that, because it's like, you know,
Speaker 4: at the end of the day, they don't have to
Speaker 4: show up like that. That's I know, that sounds like
Speaker 4: a bit of a sort of roofless like wrestling coromot,
Speaker 4: I think to say. But it's like, you know, if
Speaker 4: you're not getting paid and you know you're that upset
Speaker 4: about it, then don't show up.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: In the of course of conversation, we talked about a
Speaker 1: lot of the kind of resets. Again, I have sticked
Speaker 1: a card a couple of years ago on the show
Speaker 1: on our first appearance. If somebody's wearing a TNA T
Speaker 1: shirt and a WWE fan bumps into them and says,
Speaker 1: what's that, Oh, that's TNA and they go, well, why
Speaker 1: are you a TNA fan? Why don't you? Are you
Speaker 1: not a w W fan? What makes you a TNA fan?
Speaker 1: Because w W is my favorite? What do you want
Speaker 1: that T and A fan's answer to be? And yeah, no, no,
Speaker 1: what we're gonna say it?
Speaker 4: Yeah, Well I could have answered that question maybe two
Speaker 4: or three years ago. I can't ask that question now,
Speaker 4: and that that swer and that and that in a
Speaker 4: way does answer your question, if that makes sense, because
Speaker 4: to me, I feel like the brand lost its identity
Speaker 4: it used to be and some of that is to
Speaker 4: do where it used to be. Where to me, I
Speaker 4: would have said, T and A is where you go.
Speaker 4: If you want to see innovative interringaction, you want to
Speaker 4: see a range of performers, you know, big, small, you know,
Speaker 4: you want to see like uh and you know, an alternative,
Speaker 4: like a real alternative, like a good combination of like
Speaker 4: established name guys and up and coming guys and guys
Speaker 4: who were considered within the genre to be very good,
Speaker 4: you know, who had hadn't necessarily had a national stage
Speaker 4: up to that point, meaning like you know, I'm going
Speaker 4: back years now talking about like the early days of
Speaker 4: like Joe and AJ and jay Lee's or and guys
Speaker 4: like that. But you know, now I can't add to
Speaker 4: that question because you know, at the end of the day,
Speaker 4: there's a lot of guys being very heavily promoted into
Speaker 4: you and a who were you know, who were part
Speaker 4: of the w w E system, some who didn't even
Speaker 4: make the main roster. So it's like whether or not
Speaker 4: they were guys who deserved to or not. The fact
Speaker 4: is that, you know, it's still that message, it's still
Speaker 4: that brand, you know, brand awareness issue, and we all
Speaker 4: make those choices when we sign a contract, for example,
Speaker 4: you know the thing that you've heard it, everyone's heard it.
Speaker 4: There's always that thing of oh, you know, it's you
Speaker 4: don't like TNA guys, you know, the TNA stigma and
Speaker 4: everything like that. Like if there is, you know, that's
Speaker 4: up to them, that's their prerogative. Like I have to
Speaker 4: live with that because I made a choice to sign
Speaker 4: with TNA back at twenty one years old, you know
Speaker 4: what I mean. I wasn't good enough for ww back
Speaker 4: then anyway, so it wasn't a big deal. But it's like,
Speaker 4: but the fact is that you know I made that choice.
Speaker 4: You know, you know, you make your bed, you gotta
Speaker 4: lie in it, and it's and that's the same with
Speaker 4: with a you know, with a guy who sort of
Speaker 4: i'll say this, I did, used to get really pissed off.
Speaker 4: There were there were a number of guys who showed
Speaker 4: up at TNA after being let go from the WWE
Speaker 4: developmental System. There were some guys like Bram who came
Speaker 4: in with awesome attitude and I spoke and I knew
Speaker 4: that anyway, because he legitimately is my best friend. I
Speaker 4: legitimately said, if you can't miss with this guy, like
Speaker 4: he's gonna you know, he's brilliant, right and he's you know,
Speaker 4: and I think that that's been proven. I think that,
Speaker 4: you know, as a limit for him. But there were
Speaker 4: some guys who showed up having been let go by
Speaker 4: the ww developmental system and just acted like they were
Speaker 4: doing us all this huge favor, you know what I mean,
Speaker 4: and like really rubbed some of us the wrong way.
Speaker 4: Like yeah, and I've never been one of those guys
Speaker 4: who's big on like the locker room respect and all
Speaker 4: that stuff, Like I don't care about all that stuff
Speaker 4: too much, but I do believe in respect, you know
Speaker 4: what I mean? And I would see there some guys
Speaker 4: that showed up and fairly recently who I didn't even
Speaker 4: know they've been in WW developmental you know, like like
Speaker 4: that's that's that's you know, and I watched everything. I
Speaker 4: didn't even know they had been there, and they're strutting
Speaker 4: around like they've you know, like they're doing everyone this
Speaker 4: huge favor and that you know, like they're going to
Speaker 4: be the answer to all our present that like, oh
Speaker 4: everyone should know who I am. Like, to me, that
Speaker 4: was unacceptable, you know, and I would and there weren't
Speaker 4: times where I would speak up about it and be like,
Speaker 4: you know what, like you need to be a bit
Speaker 4: more grateful, you know, and and like but unfortunately that
Speaker 4: I believe has sort of become a little bit of
Speaker 4: the status quo now is. But like, hey, we'll you know,
Speaker 4: well we'll just wait for we'll let w W train
Speaker 4: these guys and then any of the runoffs will grab
Speaker 4: their TV ready, you know, Like, and that to me
Speaker 4: is not a viable that's not a viable where to compete,
Speaker 4: you know, and especially especially when there is so so
Speaker 4: much great talent like of like all over the world,
Speaker 4: like killing it on the indies now more than ever.
Speaker 4: And it's like it's almost like some of these independent
Speaker 4: promotions are so good now, it's like it's almost like
Speaker 4: a disservice to call them indis, you know, And and
Speaker 4: like when when it's more exciting to me to think
Speaker 4: and I can go and do whatever shows I want,
Speaker 4: Like I just you know, me and Mickey just agreed
Speaker 4: to go and do a show for ICW. I'm so
Speaker 4: pumped about doing that. Like those guys are those guys
Speaker 4: are just doing like such amazing stuff up in Scotland,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean. We're doing a show for
Speaker 4: PCW in in Blackpool in August and England what without
Speaker 4: a question, one of the best English promotions there is
Speaker 4: when it talks about the UK. There are so many
Speaker 4: great promotions right now where pro South side PCW. You know,
Speaker 4: progress Like it's like, you know, when you're more excited
Speaker 4: about that because you know about who you might get
Speaker 4: to work with and stuff, because I'm looking at who
Speaker 4: I've got to work with, you know, when I go
Speaker 4: to work and I'm going like hmm, well, you know, obviously,
Speaker 4: if I get to work with Bobby Rude, I'm going
Speaker 4: to be the happiest guy in the world, because he's
Speaker 4: the best in the business. But you know, if I
Speaker 4: have to with this guy, you know, like like the
Speaker 4: latest guy who's just been brought in, who's you know,
Speaker 4: especially when he's not even grateful, you know, and not
Speaker 4: giving me the respect like based on you know, what
Speaker 4: I've done to this company, like and the sort of
Speaker 4: the trust and the you know, the sort of a
Speaker 4: claim that I fill up with the audience. Not having
Speaker 4: that great marketing machine behind me, Like, that's not that's
Speaker 4: not something I'm looking forward to that much. Yeah, that's
Speaker 4: just that was that was a big part of my decision.
Speaker 1: We're about to go to a commercial break. Why lessen
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Speaker 1: yourself to a streamlined ad and plug free list experience
Speaker 1: with a VIP or Patreon membership. I was very much
Speaker 1: in favor of your getting a big push once you
Speaker 1: weren't twenty one in green anymore, you know. I mean,
Speaker 1: I thought that you had a lot going for you.
Speaker 1: I think I think that this last hour plus is
Speaker 1: evidence that I would enter into that in terms of
Speaker 1: a thoughtful, intelligent viewpoint on the business and that right
Speaker 1: balance of caring about the company, but not caring about
Speaker 1: the politics, not wanting to get wrapped up in that,
Speaker 1: not being into the gossip machine and that kind of thing,
Speaker 1: but keeping your ears open enough to know what's going
Speaker 1: on in the company. And I think that's all important. However,
Speaker 1: my question is take you out of the equation as
Speaker 1: best you can. I'm curious if there's two or three
Speaker 1: or four guys during your years in TNA where you
Speaker 1: think TNA would have been successful going all in with
Speaker 1: them because program I mean, look at USC, I mean
Speaker 1: last Saturday night star driven pay per view. McGregor's going
Speaker 1: to shatter some pay per view numbers. Probably he's gonna
Speaker 1: be in the very top top five list of pay
Speaker 1: per view drafts for that company. Personality combined with skill
Speaker 1: and credibility. Ron A Rousey, same thing, Chuck Lidell, I mean,
Speaker 1: go in UC history is same thing the NBA. I mean,
Speaker 1: people don't tune in to see the Cleveland Cavaliers. They
Speaker 1: tune in to see Lebron James on the Cleveland Cavaliers.
Speaker 1: So my question is, and I've made I've been an
Speaker 1: advocate for TNA, whether they made the right decision or
Speaker 1: not go with someone go all in defind the company
Speaker 1: as when you tune into TNA, it's your privilege to
Speaker 1: watch this guy who's the best in the business be featured.
Speaker 3: So with that as the setup for.
Speaker 1: My listeners, my question to you is are there one,
Speaker 1: two or three guys that you would have given your
Speaker 1: vote for if you were out of the equation at
Speaker 1: that moment in time during your span in TNA.
Speaker 4: Back in the day beer Money. First of all, they
Speaker 4: were a heart attack that he and A created. Like
Speaker 4: the only thing I would say about that is that
Speaker 4: obviously there was always going to be a point for
Speaker 4: those two guys where they were going to have that
Speaker 4: desire to be single stars, and they both deserved it,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean. Yeah, But like to me,
Speaker 4: I got there, and I you know, I showed up
Speaker 4: in TNA in two thousand and nine, the very beginning
Speaker 4: two thousand and nine. Ker Angle was there, Mick Foley
Speaker 4: was there, Kevin Nash was there, book If he was there,
Speaker 4: Scott Steiner was there.
Speaker 3: The thing was there.
Speaker 4: However, Beer Money were the guys who every time they
Speaker 4: went out. I was going like, Wow, these guys are over,
Speaker 4: you know what I mean. And I was get to
Speaker 4: work with them, and I was going like, and you know,
Speaker 4: when you work with the with the most overact and
Speaker 4: it makes you that much better. So then I would go,
Speaker 4: now I'm starting to get this. And that was how
Speaker 4: I got such a crash course honestly, you know, with
Speaker 4: such early on, because I was like, this makes me
Speaker 4: better because now I have the responsibility of going, these
Speaker 4: are the most over guys on the show, so I
Speaker 4: have to buy proxy, you know, do everything I can
Speaker 4: to have them. Was heat, you know, as part of
Speaker 4: the British invasion to to you know, to make this
Speaker 4: you know, to obviously to get the most out of
Speaker 4: this act. You know, So that would be one AJ
Speaker 4: obviously it is you know, is another you know I
Speaker 4: think that with AJ, it was like, you know, it
Speaker 4: was there were times where the where where it was
Speaker 4: the case, you know, and then and then it would
Speaker 4: sort of like that identity crisis thing would come in
Speaker 4: again where it would be like then it would be
Speaker 4: you know, then they would sort of then it would
Speaker 4: spread it again between like you know, established same guys
Speaker 4: and stuff. Joe would be obviously another. I just think
Speaker 4: for me, the thing that was WW doing it really
Speaker 4: well now, which but they were, you know, perhaps they
Speaker 4: weren't necessarily doing it as well. At the time when
Speaker 4: I was observing a lot of this was a you know,
Speaker 4: C and A had this great opportunity with having having
Speaker 4: like a handful of like four or five really really
Speaker 4: talented rustlers who were really based around the match that
Speaker 4: it was like you had these rivalries that were just
Speaker 4: sort of sitting on deck, you know. So it was
Speaker 4: like Joe and Kah, you know, was a great rivalry,
Speaker 4: but we could have got you know, they could have
Speaker 4: got so much more mileage out of it. And then
Speaker 4: and then and there were a number of ones like
Speaker 4: that where to me it was like, you know, I
Speaker 4: stopped back and I looked at it, and I thought,
Speaker 4: you know, I realized, like i'd met all like all
Speaker 4: those years I was there, Like my first real significant
Speaker 4: like series of matches with someone was with Joe after
Speaker 4: we've been attack teams, you know what I mean, Like
Speaker 4: they just didn't they just never married anyone. It was
Speaker 4: always just like it was always just kind of everyone
Speaker 4: was interchangeab apart from the main event storyline, and you know,
Speaker 4: I you know, I think that it's about to answer
Speaker 4: your question about like who who I would have sort
Speaker 4: of built the you know, built the franchise around. I
Speaker 4: guess it would have been certainly Bobby Rude goes in there,
Speaker 4: you know, whether it's part of beer money or as
Speaker 4: an individual. I'm trying to think now, you know, as
Speaker 4: some other guys who I think maybe you know, didn't
Speaker 4: sort of. I don't know, Like it's a difficult question
Speaker 4: because there's there's so many talent that came through, and
Speaker 4: it's sometimes it's like you forget some of them even
Speaker 4: but I think that, you know, I think there were
Speaker 4: times where where it was it was you could have
Speaker 4: very like for example, I'll use me as an example,
Speaker 4: even though you asked me not to, but like when
Speaker 4: I had the title, for example, you know, I was
Speaker 4: I was for the most part of that front. I
Speaker 4: was working with Joe and we were absolutely carrying the
Speaker 4: you know, we we we were doing. It was absolutely
Speaker 4: enough for the live events, you know what I mean? Yeah,
Speaker 4: But for whatever reason, whether it be politics or or
Speaker 4: just you know, or a decision or a lack of
Speaker 4: faith or whatever it was, they always there was, you know,
Speaker 4: every every now and then I would show up and
Speaker 4: it would be tables match with like mister Anderson and
Speaker 4: Bully Ray you know, oh, we can't decide whether to
Speaker 4: put that on last for you and Joe on last.
Speaker 4: And I was like, I'd be like, what you can decide?
Speaker 4: What you mean is someone's someone else is trying to
Speaker 4: tell you know what I mean, someone else is trying
Speaker 4: to tell you like that, you know. And and to me,
Speaker 4: I never got involved in any of that, said, hey,
Speaker 4: do whatever you want, you know, I said, if you said,
Speaker 4: you tell me that me and Joe for the World
Speaker 4: titled can't like you know, isn't solid enough to go
Speaker 4: on last, then then you know what might even do
Speaker 4: in here. And that was where all this stuff started
Speaker 4: to come out, like oh, he's you know, he's rubbing
Speaker 4: people the wrong way. And I said no, I'm just
Speaker 4: I'm just stating, you know, the same thing that anybody
Speaker 4: should if they're put in that position, and that was
Speaker 4: and that was ourselves.
Speaker 3: The TNA.
Speaker 1: The letters conjure up certain feelings and emotions, and you
Speaker 1: acknowledged it in that Slammiversary interview. You know or like
Speaker 1: for I can't remember the offers for better or for worse?
Speaker 1: You know, TNA, you know, or people will say, God knows,
Speaker 1: people have said a lot that kind of thing. What
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people have noticed is if
Speaker 1: you take somebody really cool and you drop them in TNA,
Speaker 1: their cool factors somehow went down a lot of the time,
Speaker 1: maybe the majority of the time. Even more so, you
Speaker 1: had examples of guys as soon as they left TNA,
Speaker 1: You're like they were unleashed. They had a swag or
Speaker 1: to them. The Young Bucks CM Punk to maybe not
Speaker 1: great example, so they were never pushed a lot in TNA,
Speaker 1: but there's an X factor there that there's a certain
Speaker 1: type of fan who looks at them. They did with
Speaker 1: Punk and he made it to the top. And the
Speaker 1: Young Bucks today are two guys who walk down the
Speaker 1: street and they if you're not a wrestling fan, you
Speaker 1: wouldn't think twice about them. You think, oh, a couple
Speaker 1: of cocky kids, you know whatever. But there's something magical
Speaker 1: about them that people who like the follow the indie
Speaker 1: scene are rapidly for them. TNA seemed to not be
Speaker 1: able to look.
Speaker 3: At aj Styles.
Speaker 1: I mean, my god, what he's done in the last
Speaker 1: year and a half and the.
Speaker 4: Way that he's He's a megastar in.
Speaker 1: Japan, megastar, and there's this wind under his sales now
Speaker 1: of confidence that I'm my own guy. And so I
Speaker 1: want to tie that into something you said earlier too,
Speaker 1: which is TNA management has an approach that treats the
Speaker 1: wrestlers as, hey, you're here, you're getting paid, do what
Speaker 1: we tell you, shut up, stay.
Speaker 3: Out of our way.
Speaker 1: Maybe that's too Maybe that's too blunt and too harsh.
Speaker 1: I don't know, but is there something about the way
Speaker 1: that TNA operates, something at the core of what TNA
Speaker 1: is as an organization that does undermine that outlaws spirit
Speaker 1: that I would say a few guys got across in TNA.
Speaker 1: Jane Storm certainly at times, did a handful of others,
Speaker 1: But for the most part, it seems like there's something
Speaker 1: about the way that TNA operates is designed, the setting,
Speaker 1: it all kind of comes together to undermine the seampunk
Speaker 1: young buck uh what what aj styles had in him?
Speaker 1: And it doesn't really get a chance to flourish and
Speaker 1: and and connect with an audience in that cool quotient
Speaker 1: way that TNA always comes fall short on. Is there
Speaker 1: something there and is there even a solution that's fixable?
Speaker 4: Yeah, there is definitely some of that, and I think
Speaker 4: that what it boils down to. And it's kind of
Speaker 4: again going back to I always said that when after
Speaker 4: Jeff Jarrett left or was removed, you know, there was
Speaker 4: a there was a lack of balance, you know, there
Speaker 4: was there was that lack of balance of that straight
Speaker 4: up wrestling promote the mentality of hey, I don't care
Speaker 4: if he fits into a box or not. He's getting
Speaker 4: over right. Yeah. But you know, but after that, without that,
Speaker 4: there always seem to be this thing of like you're
Speaker 4: we've you know, we've predestined you to be this position
Speaker 4: for us, you know, and luckily for me, you know,
Speaker 4: I was always one of those guys who, you know,
Speaker 4: it's probably because I'm like six four and you know,
Speaker 4: decent physique, you know, all the rest of it. I
Speaker 4: am a good talker, you know, people that was like it.
Speaker 4: It seemed like it was predestined to me that you
Speaker 4: know that there was always a chance I could be
Speaker 4: at the World Champion, right, But there were other guys
Speaker 4: who it wouldn't matter if they'd if every single person
Speaker 4: in the building was wearing their shirt and you know,
Speaker 4: doing their stuff, that it that it, you know that
Speaker 4: they they still would have been in like the six
Speaker 4: minute you know, third match or something.
Speaker 3: Kevin Owens or Daniel Bryant.
Speaker 1: I mean, I can't imagine at most of the time
Speaker 1: TNA management to people in power would have looked at
Speaker 1: a Kevin Owens and and given a second thought to him.
Speaker 1: Hohle Cogaan and Eric Bischoff probably wouldn't have yet ww's
Speaker 1: lightning it.
Speaker 3: Then he's kind of taking it. But yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 3: I wanted to interject that because.
Speaker 4: I am and that's pretty much it. And I think
Speaker 4: some of that goes back to the identity crisis that
Speaker 4: they talked about before, which is that one minute they
Speaker 4: want to be one minute they want to be this,
Speaker 4: and then they want to be the underdogs, like you
Speaker 4: can't be you know, you can't be the underdog and
Speaker 4: then also be this like where this big corporate you know,
Speaker 4: like it was that that and that you know that,
Speaker 4: yeah you got to you know that that and that
Speaker 4: ultimately to me was like I don't. I felt like
Speaker 4: I was starting to go through an identity crisis because
Speaker 4: I was starting to go like what am I? You
Speaker 4: know like, and I realized that it was because I
Speaker 4: was and like you said, like you know, now that
Speaker 4: I've left, it's like I do feel like free again,
Speaker 4: but you know it's I'm still kind of I'm still
Speaker 4: like working out of the of the mud a little bit,
Speaker 4: if that makes sense. Like I'm still you know, like
Speaker 4: I just did these first live events for the Jeff
Speaker 4: and I worked like Tomaso Champer on one of them,
Speaker 4: and I worked with Congo Kong on the others, and
Speaker 4: it was like, you know, I have to say, like
Speaker 4: I came in a little bit like with a little
Speaker 4: bit of that comfort zone kind of act, you like,
Speaker 4: now we'll just do this and we'll do that, you
Speaker 4: know what I mean, And then like I start going,
Speaker 4: you know what, like I got to start thinking, you know,
Speaker 4: I got to start like putting my thinking cap on
Speaker 4: a bit here again because you know, it's up to
Speaker 4: me again, like the powers in my hands to sort
Speaker 4: of make it work.
Speaker 1: You're not as much a cog in a machine that's
Speaker 1: going its direction no matter what. So you feel like, hey,
Speaker 1: if I put my thinking cap on, I can make
Speaker 1: a difference and I can grow and I can. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it's not fruitless.
Speaker 4: And I'm very and I'm very much in a perier
Speaker 4: and we we I know, like we have to wrap up,
Speaker 4: like I'm really you know, I know, like but I
Speaker 4: you know, I will say this, like to sort of
Speaker 4: wrap up, like I do feel like I'm you know,
Speaker 4: in a period of growth now and I'm like very
Speaker 4: excited about what I'm going to get to do now,
Speaker 4: you know, in the in the in the next few months,
Speaker 4: and I'm excited about it. And I hope that, you know,
Speaker 4: I hope that anyone who's sort of invested their time
Speaker 4: in me uh t and a you know, continues to
Speaker 4: do that, you know, wherever, you know, where else they
Speaker 4: end up because you know, because I think, you know,
Speaker 4: you're going to you're going to see some you know,
Speaker 4: you are going to see some growth and you're going
Speaker 4: to see I mean I'm like, I'm twenty eight, Like
Speaker 4: I'm I'm I have a peaked, so I don't think
Speaker 4: I have you know, And I'm and I'm really I'm
Speaker 4: really excited about where we go next, you know, and
Speaker 4: and and what other sort of possibilities lie ahead from me.
Speaker 3: Absolutely.
Speaker 9: I'm Kelly Wells, host of the seven Star podcast, the
Speaker 9: new ongoing Torch show covering the world of New Japan
Speaker 9: pro wrestling. We'll drop new episodes as major shows and
Speaker 9: noteworthy events dictate, and I'm Chris Lansdow join us as
Speaker 9: we covered an ever changing landscape of New Japan as
Speaker 9: they navigate an era with.
Speaker 4: No lack of talent.
Speaker 8: But I really need to create some new starts.
Speaker 10: You can stream the new seven Stop podcasts now from
Speaker 10: Pro Wrestling Talk.
Speaker 1: I want to interject this. We've had callers, some have
Speaker 1: dropped off. I did not want to break up the
Speaker 1: flow of this conversation. I'm not going to apologize to
Speaker 1: our listeners. I think this has been a good interview
Speaker 1: and I didn't want to break up the flow nick
Speaker 1: with people asking random questions of over place. It'd be
Speaker 1: great if it works to have you on again down
Speaker 1: the line, where we do open it up to callers.
Speaker 1: And I tackled some of these emails too, because this
Speaker 1: was a really good, I think, productive and fascinating discussion
Speaker 1: on TNA from someone who's been there a long time.
Speaker 3: That was care a lot.
Speaker 1: Do you want to get in any plugs for anything Twitter?
Speaker 1: Upcoming events, anything that you want to plug? I want
Speaker 1: to have time to do that also on this.
Speaker 4: Broadcast, Yes please. Tomorrow my fitness book officially goes on
Speaker 4: sale at digital and pre order on It's actually available
Speaker 4: now for pre order like Amazon, Barnes and Noble all
Speaker 4: all that good stuff, but it officially goes on sales
Speaker 4: for downloads like Kindle, Nook, all the e readers and
Speaker 4: all that stuff tomorrow. It's called The Superstar Body. It's
Speaker 4: not a bodybuilding book. It's not just like a you know,
Speaker 4: meatheads to Zo book. It's a very real world, practical
Speaker 4: approach to you know, to getting in better shape and
Speaker 4: being you know, and having whatever kind of body you want,
Speaker 4: whether you want econor McGregor body, or you want a
Speaker 4: Rob Terry body. But there's there's there's the input from
Speaker 4: all kinds of great people, including Kurt Angle, who was
Speaker 4: really generous at this time, like broat some really great
Speaker 4: stuff for it, like as far as like training, intensity,
Speaker 4: mental visualization, stuff like that, top quality trainer Nick Rlik
Speaker 4: from from Baltimore who's worked with a lot of NBA players,
Speaker 4: NFL players, and stuff like that. Guys from like CEO
Speaker 4: of Natural Stack Supplements like Rob Terry's contributed, Brooks contributed
Speaker 4: for the Girls, Mickey contributed, and stud Uh, just just
Speaker 4: loads of different really great guys. So it's not just
Speaker 4: the it's you know, the whole sort of series of
Speaker 4: knowledge and and trial and error and stuff from a
Speaker 4: whole group of guys you know, who really know this stuff.
Speaker 4: So if anyone's interested in getting in better shape and
Speaker 4: the Superstar Body, it's available order and download as from tomorrow.
Speaker 3: Who is the book aimed at?
Speaker 1: Is it aimed at high school athlete or thirty something
Speaker 1: dad and wants to get in shape? Or what's the
Speaker 1: target market for it? Who should who should take interest
Speaker 1: in this?
Speaker 4: I mean obviously, you know, I'm assuming it's mainly going
Speaker 4: to be sort of young males. However, you know, I
Speaker 4: have really made it as much effort as I can to,
Speaker 4: you know, to make it as universal as possible. So
Speaker 4: that's why I've had been put for some girls and
Speaker 4: from like Kurt, Kurt specifically speaks about training like into
Speaker 4: his forties, you know, and and how to sort of
Speaker 4: you know, and help and how to sort of adapt,
Speaker 4: you know, going forward, and really a lot of it
Speaker 4: is kind of an interesting point because a lot of
Speaker 4: it is really just about, like it's not about a
Speaker 4: certain technique for one person or another. It's like you'll
Speaker 4: see all these magazines, most of them are just a
Speaker 4: thing full of commercials. The book is more about these
Speaker 4: are the like fundamental black and white facts that you need,
Speaker 4: like throw all this other stuff away, all this you know,
Speaker 4: because best I will just contradict yourself. One week you'll say,
Speaker 4: you know, eat more fat, and then matually you'll say,
Speaker 4: don't eat fat, and then you know what I mean,
Speaker 4: all this kind of stuff. This is more about like
Speaker 4: these are this is these are fundamental. If you know
Speaker 4: this stuff, you will be in shape like period, you know.
Speaker 4: And if you want to start experimenting with some of
Speaker 4: the more of that like fadly type stuff, then sure,
Speaker 4: go ahead. But if you've you know, but if you
Speaker 4: really want to fundamentally be in shape, this is the
Speaker 4: stuff you need to know, like cut, cut through the craft,
Speaker 4: this is this stuff.
Speaker 1: And if people want to buy that book, go to
Speaker 1: PW torch dot com slash Amazon.
Speaker 3: You can do that right away.
Speaker 1: I'll put a link up to the book on that page.
Speaker 1: And if if people anytime any books anytime or listen
Speaker 1: to shop Amazon, if you start at PW torch dot
Speaker 1: com slash Amazon and you click on our link to
Speaker 1: take you to the Amazon page, we get a commission
Speaker 1: on those sales. A lot of people, a lot of
Speaker 1: hosts out there doing that. We appreciate those of you
Speaker 1: who choose to do it through our portal. And I'll
Speaker 1: put a banner link up for your books so people
Speaker 1: get right to that page also.
Speaker 4: That'd be awesome. Thank you. And Uh And as far
Speaker 4: as I'm concerned, like my my website is Nickolli dot
Speaker 4: com and you can email me for bookings and appearances
Speaker 4: and all that good stuff, Nick at nick Allgus dot com.
Speaker 3: Very very good.
Speaker 1: Uh And Nick, do you expect to be a big
Speaker 1: part of global force in uh months and years ahead
Speaker 1: or is this kind of you're dipping your toe in
Speaker 1: the water to.
Speaker 4: See I'm willing to be as big as what's more
Speaker 4: above it as I need to be. But right now
Speaker 4: I'm very much dialed in, you know, and I'm and
Speaker 4: I'm and and again you'll see in the in the
Speaker 4: coming weeks that I'm getting involved in a lot of stuff,
Speaker 4: you know, on a lot of different levels, and I'm
Speaker 4: very excited about it.
Speaker 3: Nick, thanks for generous time today. I mean it. I'd
Speaker 3: love to have you back.
Speaker 1: There's so much territory uncovered, but I think this was
Speaker 1: I'm glad we stayed pretty focused and went in depth
Speaker 1: on on the teen a journey that you were on.
Speaker 4: Thank you so much, all right, thanky you bet, Thank.
Speaker 3: You listeners for joining us here today.
Speaker 1: I was Nick all this known as Magnus and tnah
Speaker 1: fascinating behind the scenes look from the perspective of inambitious, intelligent,
Speaker 1: driven wrestler who wanted to see things get better. And
Speaker 1: I do apologize to our callers for on hold and
Speaker 1: and those who sent an email questions, but I felt
Speaker 1: this was one of those cases where I wanted to
Speaker 1: let it Nick talk and continue, and I had so
Speaker 1: many follow up questions. Are the things that he said
Speaker 1: that we just stayed focused on that theme and introduced
Speaker 1: new ones into it, but we will have him on
Speaker 1: again if if, if he is willing, and it sounds
Speaker 1: like he is, so I thank all of you again
Speaker 1: for joining me today, thank you for your support of
Speaker 1: this show. As I said, last month was our second
Speaker 1: month ever. Best month was either March or April, you
Speaker 1: know around rest many a time. But we even beat
Speaker 1: either April or March two in June, you know, I mean,
Speaker 1: go figure. So the growth just continues. We're doing two
Speaker 1: to three times the listenership a year ago and three
Speaker 1: to four times two years ago, three years ago.
Speaker 3: It's just it's great.
Speaker 1: I appreciate everybody out there continuing to spread the word.
Speaker 1: We're proud of the job that we do here. There's
Speaker 1: a whole diverse set of hosts doing different formats, a
Speaker 1: lot for you to choose from, but it is a
Speaker 1: daily call in live pro wrestling. Cent Prick Show, the
Speaker 1: only one out there that it has this kind of
Speaker 1: reporter's approach to it, an independent approach to covering pro wrestling,
Speaker 1: and it seems to have struck a chord with the audios.
Speaker 1: So we really appreciate that. If you want to get
Speaker 1: even more in depth this the live caster, there's a
Speaker 1: lot of five live casts a week, sometimes six on
Speaker 1: pay per view Sundays. A lot of content here, but
Speaker 1: the vast majority of what we do, and especially what
Speaker 1: I do, is at PW Torch dot COM's VIP website,
Speaker 1: and it's an ad free web site which features a
Speaker 1: weekly newsletter. I just put this week's newsletter up with
Speaker 1: a long story about my weekend in On that note,
Speaker 1: I will sign off for today, Pat McNeil tomorrow with
Speaker 1: Hurricane Shane Helms, and then Bruce Mitchell and Travis Bryant
Speaker 1: back on Friday. Big thanks to Bruce again for hosting
Speaker 1: with Jason Powell yesterday. By the way, the VIP after
Speaker 1: show after yesterday's program featured and I'm not kidding, Bruce
Speaker 1: Mitchell and Jason Powell talking about me for thirty six
Speaker 1: minutes trying to embarrass me. There were some nice things
Speaker 1: they said too, but they yeah, it was all about
Speaker 1: Actually Bruce told a story that was embarrassing for him too,
Speaker 1: So it was it was a really fun show. I
Speaker 1: enjoyed listening to it after the fact yesterday it was
Speaker 1: a this is your life weight Keller type of thing
Speaker 1: with two of my better friends in life, not just
Speaker 1: in Pro Wrestling, Bruce Mitchell and Jason Powell sharing some
Speaker 1: some some weaighte Keller stories, the blue Panther mask story,
Speaker 1: the the suit incident with Bruce Mitchell. That a practical
Speaker 1: joke we played that Jason and I played on Bruce
Speaker 1: at one point, and so much more so. If you
Speaker 1: are not a VIP member when you sign up, I
Speaker 1: point you towards yesterday's VIP after show with Bruce and
Speaker 1: Jason for a fun look behind the scenes at the
Speaker 1: Torch operations over the years and the personalities who put
Speaker 1: out the Torch product. All Right, that does it for
Speaker 1: me for today. Thank you everybody, and unto next time.
Speaker 1: This is PW Torch editor Wad Keller signing off. Invite
Speaker 1: you to email the show with feedback or questions or comments.
Speaker 1: That email address is Wade Keller Podcast at pwtorch dot com.
Speaker 1: That's Wadkeller Podcast at PW torch dot com. Also welcome
Speaker 1: your feedback on Twitter. You can follow us on Twitter
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Speaker 1: That's at PW Torch and at the Wade Keller.
Speaker 10: Searching for more great pro wrestling to bok then join
Speaker 10: me Jason Powell host them the three weekly Pro Wrestling
Speaker 10: Boom Podcast. Each week, you'll hear the latest news and
Speaker 10: analysis from me and my team at pro wrestling dot
Speaker 10: Net along with other pro wrestling media members. Plus, the
Speaker 10: Pro Wrestling Boom Podcast features long form interviews with notable
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Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to our podcast. Did you know we
Speaker 1: also have a website, pwtorch dot com. Daily news updates, editorials,
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Speaker 5: Meet an extra dose of positivity in your wrestling podcasts.
Speaker 5: Will come join me Alan fourrel Over in the Progress
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Speaker 5: great matches and shows from around the world, be it
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Speaker 1: One way that you can help us sustain our schedule
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Speaker 3: Thank you so much.
Speaker 6: In twenty twelve, NXT transitioned into the developmental system and
Speaker 6: ultimately the brand you see today. On the Torch VIP
Speaker 6: podcast NXT Eight Years Back, we'll be taking a weekly
Speaker 6: look at this page in NXT's early history.
Speaker 7: Join Kelly Wells and me Tom Stout from PWT Talks
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