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<v Speaker 1>Let's say good morning now to ABC's I'm getting back

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<v Speaker 1>and forth with ABC's and KFI is Joel Larsgard, the

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<v Speaker 1>host of How To Money on KFI every Sunday from

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<v Speaker 1>noon to two morning.

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<v Speaker 2>Joel, morning, I'm from wherever you want me to be, Amy, Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>Well you're from New York City, right right? Okay, So

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<v Speaker 1>let's first talk since we're talking about money, and a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of people and their kids and their grandkids have

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<v Speaker 1>student loans, and how is that all going to shake

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<v Speaker 1>out with everything that's happening with the gutting of the

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<v Speaker 1>Department of Education.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that's a good question. The Wall Street Journal just

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<v Speaker 2>published an article early this morning basically talking about the

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<v Speaker 2>Trump administration's intent to get rid of the Department of Education,

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<v Speaker 2>whether or not they have Congress's help. And that's the

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<v Speaker 2>thing is typically to eliminate a federal you know, what's

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<v Speaker 2>something like the Department of Education, a department, a federal department.

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<v Speaker 2>It takes an act of Congress, and Congress, as we know,

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<v Speaker 2>doesn't do much these days, and so the Trump administration

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<v Speaker 2>is saying, we're going to try to do it on

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<v Speaker 2>our own. There are lawsuits flying back and forth. How

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<v Speaker 2>this shakes out is anybody's guests. But at least the

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<v Speaker 2>intent of the executive order that the President announced was

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<v Speaker 2>to severely reduce the scope at the Department of Education

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<v Speaker 2>that's already happening, and then to have other federal agencies

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<v Speaker 2>take over some of those duties. So it looks like

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<v Speaker 2>the Small Business Administration might take over student loans. How

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<v Speaker 2>that's going to shake out, I mean, there's already been.

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<v Speaker 2>Anybody with student loans knows that working with their servicer

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<v Speaker 2>is a massive pain. We've had just severe issues from

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<v Speaker 2>the companies that the government partners with, the contracts with

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<v Speaker 2>to service student loans, and it just feels like everybody

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<v Speaker 2>with student loans right now is just in this massive limbo.

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<v Speaker 2>They were told right that they don't pay your loans

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<v Speaker 2>for three and a half years. Forgiveness is on the way.

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<v Speaker 2>Forgiveness then didn't pan out. I just feel like, man,

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<v Speaker 2>I feel that my heart goes out to anybody with

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<v Speaker 2>student loans right now, because where things go from here,

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<v Speaker 2>we'll keep an eye on it. But it's just it's

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<v Speaker 2>hard to it's hard to spell out, and it's hard

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<v Speaker 2>to say, yeah.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, here's a question or a thought Joel, Like one

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<v Speaker 1>of the things that Dose's doing and making these cuts

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<v Speaker 1>and all that stuff that they said they're discovering like

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<v Speaker 1>super old antiquated systems where you have departments that don't

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<v Speaker 1>talk to each other. So maybe the hope is, whether

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<v Speaker 1>it happens or not, is that they can sort of

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<v Speaker 1>figure it out, because you said getting the student loans

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<v Speaker 1>is a pain in the butt, so maybe they can

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<v Speaker 1>figure out how to fix the system too.

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<v Speaker 2>Well. I mean that that would be awesome. And it's

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<v Speaker 2>clear that there are some antiquated government systems and that

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<v Speaker 2>there is like when they talk about waste, fraud and

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<v Speaker 2>abuse and government, the vast majority of Americans when you

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<v Speaker 2>look at polling, believe that that exists. The way Dog

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<v Speaker 2>goes about it attacking some of that quote unquote waste

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<v Speaker 2>fraud and abuse, and whether or not some of the

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<v Speaker 2>things are cutting actually fall under those monikers, like that's

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<v Speaker 2>another question. Yeah, And it's also going to be interesting

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<v Speaker 2>to see when you when you kind of look at

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<v Speaker 2>since the advent of the Department of Education, well, has

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<v Speaker 2>it had the impact that it was supposed to have?

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<v Speaker 2>And I don't know that it has. So when you

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<v Speaker 2>look at how much we spend as a country per student,

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<v Speaker 2>and when you look at test scores that just have

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<v Speaker 2>deteriorated year after year after year, and where we stand

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<v Speaker 2>internationally in some of the rankings, in particular in science

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<v Speaker 2>and math. We were much more internationally competitive from a

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<v Speaker 2>student basis in the nineteen seventies. So eliminating the Department

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<v Speaker 2>of Education, people are making it sound like, oh, this

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<v Speaker 2>is this is going to torch the education system in

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<v Speaker 2>the country. The reality is the Department of Education only

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<v Speaker 2>fund something like eight to ten percent of state and

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<v Speaker 2>local schools and so sending it back to the schools

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<v Speaker 2>and having less Department of Education and less federal oversight

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<v Speaker 2>in terms of how states do education. I don't know

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<v Speaker 2>that that's a bad thing.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, all right, Let's move on to something that everybody

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<v Speaker 1>has come to know and love, and that is door Dash,

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<v Speaker 1>and DoorDash is putting up a new payment option.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So this is something that when I saw it,

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<v Speaker 2>I mean tearstream streamed down my face and easy.

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<v Speaker 1>Joel's going crazy.

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<v Speaker 2>No, I know, I'm pulling my hair out like sackcloth

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<v Speaker 2>and ashes because door dash is saying, hey, you can

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<v Speaker 2>split your little fast food delivery up into four easy

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<v Speaker 2>payments via Klarna. Now, if you're if you're ordering your food,

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<v Speaker 2>and to me, this is what feels like the culmination,

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<v Speaker 2>but it probably isn't of buy now, pay later for

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<v Speaker 2>literally everything. I'm sure it's going to go into more

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<v Speaker 2>even more places, but I don't really use these food

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<v Speaker 2>delivery apps because every meal that you buy, if you

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<v Speaker 2>get it delivered. Sure it's convenient, but it's going to

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<v Speaker 2>cost you more. So the fact that it's that people

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<v Speaker 2>are gonna even split up those payments. You're gonna order

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<v Speaker 2>a twelve or fourteen dollars meal or something like that,

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<v Speaker 2>and then you're gonna split it up over the course

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<v Speaker 2>of four months makes zero sense to me.

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<v Speaker 1>Four months, Like, why would anybody in their right mind

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<v Speaker 1>do that.

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<v Speaker 2>They even have something called Klarna pay Later, which means

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<v Speaker 2>you kick the can down the road even further, and

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<v Speaker 2>then you can pay a fee to pay even later

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<v Speaker 2>than that, And so I think it's something. It makes

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<v Speaker 2>me think of the frog in the pot of water

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<v Speaker 2>that just like steadily gets warmer. And I don't know

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<v Speaker 2>if this is actually true, if it's just an old

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<v Speaker 2>wives tale, but like the frog boils to death if

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<v Speaker 2>it stays in the water. This is kind of how

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<v Speaker 2>we are as consumers. We're getting used to all of

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<v Speaker 2>these methods of payment that just reduce the friction, and

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<v Speaker 2>I think the friction is actually a good thing for us.

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<v Speaker 2>It's like, do I have the money to buy the burger?

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<v Speaker 2>If I don't, then I probably shouldn't. I should cook

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<v Speaker 2>at home. And maybe that sounds like it's not empathetic

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<v Speaker 2>or something like that, but I just I think it's

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<v Speaker 2>really important to think before you use bye now, pay

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<v Speaker 2>later on anything. But in particular, when we're talking about

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<v Speaker 2>these smaller purchases, using buy now, pay later to break

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<v Speaker 2>up just a meal delivery to your house, it just

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<v Speaker 2>to me, it feels almost dystopian in nature, and it's

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<v Speaker 2>hard for me to stomach.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I just I totally agree with you. Like, again,

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<v Speaker 1>a twenty dollars meal. I've never seen a fifteen dollars

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<v Speaker 1>door dash meal. I've only used a couple of times,

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<v Speaker 1>and it was always like stupid expensive because of all

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<v Speaker 1>the fees. But yeah, spreading it out over four months,

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<v Speaker 1>what are you thinking? And then do you do that

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<v Speaker 1>every week and out all of a sudden you have

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<v Speaker 1>four months later You're like, how do I owe two

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<v Speaker 1>thousand dollars, right.

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<v Speaker 2>And the thing is, the more we kick the can

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<v Speaker 2>down the road on a bill that we have to pay, right,

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<v Speaker 2>typically fees or interest add up. But on top of that,

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<v Speaker 2>it's it's harder to budget. I want people to pay

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<v Speaker 2>for the things that they're buying, Like, I'm down with

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<v Speaker 2>credit cards as a method of payment, but I don't

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<v Speaker 2>want you to buy more than you can afford, and

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<v Speaker 2>I don't want you to overextend yourself. So you can't

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<v Speaker 2>pay that credit card bill on time and in full.

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<v Speaker 2>By now pay later. It just kind of blurs the

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<v Speaker 2>lines and people start using it and then they're like, oh,

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<v Speaker 2>how much do I owe? What's what's my BNPL you know,

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<v Speaker 2>payment amount this month, and we become payment buyers, just

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<v Speaker 2>like we have become when it comes to buying a car.

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<v Speaker 2>We're payment buyers these days. And to me, that's the

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<v Speaker 2>real nefarious part of buying now pay later and splitting

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<v Speaker 2>up payments like this is that we just kind of

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<v Speaker 2>become used to the monthly payment instead of like deciding

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<v Speaker 2>whether or not we're comfortable with the overall amount of

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<v Speaker 2>the purchase to begin with.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, so proceed with caution. And if you'd like to

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<v Speaker 1>proceed with getting lots more great advice on how to money.

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<v Speaker 1>You can listen to Joel Larsguard every Sunday, it's noon

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<v Speaker 1>to two how to Money with Joel Larsguard. You can

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<v Speaker 1>also follow him and at how to Money Joel. Thank you, Joel.

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<v Speaker 2>Thanks Amy