Speaker 1: Welcome to episode five sixty six of five and Dive.
Speaker 1: It is Monday of July twenty seventh. I'm your host,
Speaker 1: Craig Gold, soon joined as usual by Patrick Dubuque and
Speaker 1: Jeffrey pattern Nostro. We had a weekend. Do we have
Speaker 1: any weekend? Banter?
Speaker 2: Did I do? This weekend? Always a good time? And
Speaker 2: I was just like, it's been one hundred and five
Speaker 2: degrees basically every day and will continue to be one
Speaker 2: hundred and five degrees every day this week. So I
Speaker 2: just don't want to leave the house basically.
Speaker 1: Yeah, understandable. Patrick. Are you still right now? Are you
Speaker 1: still deck?
Speaker 3: I am still deck the decks?
Speaker 2: So Patrick, I have a question about the deck at
Speaker 2: this point. I don't know how you value your own time.
Speaker 3: Oh not very well? Apparently.
Speaker 2: Why didn't you hire someone to do the deck?
Speaker 3: Oh? Yeah, I value my time. Uh. The thing about
Speaker 3: sweat equity is that when you don't have any money,
Speaker 3: the calculation has become incredibly easy. Sure, so, no, it's
Speaker 3: almost done all I have to do.
Speaker 2: I'm I am, But I don't need help budgeting.
Speaker 3: No, I don't anticipate. I didn't anticipate in needing a
Speaker 3: third coat it needed a third coat, and so now
Speaker 3: I have half of a coat. I need to put
Speaker 3: a coat on half the deck. But everything's back on
Speaker 3: it all the all the you know, the furniture that
Speaker 3: we never use is back on the deck.
Speaker 1: It's just not in the places you need.
Speaker 3: No, No, I did. I did the half of the
Speaker 3: deck where everything goes, and I haven't done the half
Speaker 3: of the deck where in the middle where people walk.
Speaker 3: So so three four more hours tops.
Speaker 1: Okay, I can't I can't wait.
Speaker 3: I know, I can't wait either. My arm hurts like
Speaker 3: it's it's sore. My arm is sore ye, and it's like, luckily,
Speaker 3: you know, I'm right handed, so it's not a heart attack.
Speaker 3: Otherwise I'd be constantly worried.
Speaker 2: Abou See, this is one of the advantages of being
Speaker 2: from a bowling family and bowling since I was six
Speaker 2: years old. I just have an entire network of contractors,
Speaker 2: electricians pluing. Oh, I thought, No, I get people. I
Speaker 2: make a phone call, I buy a bottle of whiskey
Speaker 2: to have it there for after. Whatever gets done gets done.
Speaker 1: For my part, I went to my first DC United
Speaker 1: soccer game. You did the weekend first MLS scam ever
Speaker 1: out you field. Very nice. Everyone has had told me that,
Speaker 1: and uh, really quite nice. I got a ninety eighth
Speaker 1: minute penalty on Vaar. They had to They did not
Speaker 1: call it on the field, had to eventually go to
Speaker 1: the screen. A bunch of people threw bottles down on
Speaker 1: the field too. It was it was a little round
Speaker 1: easy there. Yeah, but they got the pen. I sent
Speaker 1: you the video, Jeff, you reviewed it. I mean easy
Speaker 1: as you.
Speaker 2: Like, good pen No stutter step, just picked up the corner.
Speaker 1: Goalie, guess right, but he just yeah, I had conviction
Speaker 1: on it, and yeah it was. It was a great time.
Speaker 1: So that was That was my weekend. That was my bank.
Speaker 1: Shall we just get into the show?
Speaker 2: Sure?
Speaker 1: All right? Our first segment because I'm free falling. I'm
Speaker 1: not going to sing it. I'm free I'm free falling
Speaker 1: it and I do know the reference. Yes, I apologize
Speaker 1: the Marlins. We discussed them either last literally ago. I'm guessing, well, no, right,
Speaker 1: but I think last one too. No, I guess we
Speaker 1: just did the Jays and Cardinals last time. But the
Speaker 1: time before that, I think we also discussed the Marlins
Speaker 1: in the midst of like a six game losing stream. Well,
Speaker 1: it's twelve. They've doubled it. Boy, I guess it's good
Speaker 1: to have clarity.
Speaker 3: Sure, I mean they they've lost twelve in a row,
Speaker 3: and they are how many backgree three out?
Speaker 1: Right now? It's the Yeah, I mean it's I guess
Speaker 1: it's not that clear, but it is absolutely.
Speaker 2: It's clear.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean they've manufactured some pretext right right, like oh,
Speaker 1: you're only three games out, but also you're the Marlins,
Speaker 1: and that's not a shot at the Marlins specifically, like
Speaker 1: as the team, but like in terms of how they
Speaker 1: want to operate, they didn't. They didn't want to. They
Speaker 1: preferred to No, I don't. I'm sure if you I
Speaker 1: don't know what they're gonna sell.
Speaker 2: If you put the Golden lasso around Peter Bendix, I'm
Speaker 2: sure he is not right. He's upset, like this is
Speaker 2: our contra available now, and what's not particularly.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would well, I would think so.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like we've gone from maybe two weeks ago when
Speaker 2: the Marlins were ten games over to being like okay,
Speaker 2: like the only starters traded might be two Mets arms
Speaker 2: and tom me Yuki Sigano, to like, now, okay, maybe
Speaker 2: that you know the Tigers have faded a little bit,
Speaker 2: so Google might be there. The Angels are at least
Speaker 2: talking about det Meurs and Soriano, and the Marlins may
Speaker 2: have faded enough. But Contra is available, so it does
Speaker 2: make the pitching market a little more interesting theoretically.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah, I don't know. I agree
Speaker 1: on on al Contra. I think that would make a
Speaker 1: lot of sense. I also don't know. I don't even
Speaker 1: know how you value it at this.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't. I mean I would say, if you
Speaker 2: look at what Curtis Mead just went for and we
Speaker 2: will in a minute, do you think about save your Edwards?
Speaker 2: Do you think about Auto Lopez? You think about Sinel
Speaker 2: hasmen that good? But do you think about like some
Speaker 2: of your young cost controlled in fielders.
Speaker 3: Well, Craig bar is looking only trade for one.
Speaker 2: Of them, so they still want to stop apparently.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I mean, I guess you can say you
Speaker 1: think about it. I don't know how you scale up, yeah,
Speaker 1: need to? I mean, like, okay, they've both broken out,
Speaker 1: but Lopez is a premium defender at a premium position.
Speaker 2: Me Meat is none of those things, the opposite of
Speaker 2: those things.
Speaker 1: Closer to a Butcher at a non premium position, right,
Speaker 1: he might be.
Speaker 2: Yes, I mean if you play out a Lopez at
Speaker 2: second base, which you can in the Marlins have in
Speaker 2: the past, the defensive gap between him and me at
Speaker 2: that position is significant.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean you're you're probably talking about literally the
Speaker 1: top of the scale, and yes, somewhere related to the bottom.
Speaker 2: You got to use the whole scale. And here it is. So,
Speaker 2: I mean they have like they can trade a legal
Speaker 2: trade fluchet, right, they have relievers they can move to
Speaker 2: as sort of.
Speaker 1: A Michael Peterson is one of their best relieverers, and
Speaker 1: you could move. You can.
Speaker 2: You can't trade, I mean you can, but you can't
Speaker 2: pitch in the cold or apparently in Miami, so.
Speaker 3: You really have to.
Speaker 1: San Diego needs to come home.
Speaker 2: I mean, like Contra is a big one here, right,
Speaker 2: Like that's the.
Speaker 1: I think that's right.
Speaker 2: That's like they're like if they are, we'll get to
Speaker 2: this when we get to the we're not really when
Speaker 2: we talk about Tigers at least entertaining interests on schoobl
Speaker 2: But like, once you make the decision to trade O Contre,
Speaker 2: you just trade everything at that point, right, because you're
Speaker 2: not really, But I.
Speaker 1: Guess the point is, like, what is every No, Look,
Speaker 1: you they can actually trade Edwards and Lopez and that
Speaker 1: could be everything, but like then you're legitimately starting over,
Speaker 1: and I don't think that may be.
Speaker 2: And it's like not a particularly deep system and position
Speaker 2: players either. And again I don't think, Look, will Attawalpez
Speaker 2: be this good next year? Probably not, but like he'll still.
Speaker 1: I think he's I think he's good.
Speaker 2: Trade Like, you're not going to lose a ton of
Speaker 2: trade value holding him for another year.
Speaker 1: Well he hit three forty, probably not. Will will he
Speaker 1: be a good player? I think so it might look
Speaker 1: I don't even know that. I think he'll be as
Speaker 1: as quote unquote bad, as as average as this I'm
Speaker 1: gonna say, but like it might be more like the
Speaker 1: Michel Garcia arc, right where he had that breakout and
Speaker 1: everyone thought thinks, oh, this guy is legit, and I
Speaker 1: think he is legit. And he's been a little bit
Speaker 1: down from from that this He's been fairly down from
Speaker 1: that this year, but is still in the range of like,
Speaker 1: this is a good player still that that might be
Speaker 1: more of what that arc.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean it's in some ways it's a
Speaker 2: there's an old poker analogy metaphor. I guess like once
Speaker 2: you once you put your chips all in, it doesn't
Speaker 2: matter what order the cards come out on. Come in
Speaker 2: and come out in like they're two games under a
Speaker 2: five hundred. I think we would have thought they were
Speaker 2: two games under five hundred at this point as a team,
Speaker 2: and just it's come out in an unusual order.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Now, is that I've never had a good grasp on
Speaker 1: what I.
Speaker 2: Don't I don't think it's might be an aphorism, yeah,
Speaker 2: Patrick Patrick.
Speaker 3: Uh, Okay, we don't know. I mean I almost is it. No,
Speaker 3: I think it's more of a maximum.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we'll go that.
Speaker 1: All right, let's move on speaking of Patrick to the Mariners.
Speaker 1: What are we speaking of Patrick?
Speaker 3: The Mariners?
Speaker 1: The Mariners scratched one victory out in their series against
Speaker 1: the Rangers, mitigating some damage.
Speaker 2: It could have been worse, could have been worse.
Speaker 1: They are eight and eleven thus far in July, two
Speaker 1: four game losing streaks. They've worked one three game win streaking.
Speaker 2: There may he get harder to have than I.
Speaker 1: Was gonna say. Lack of clarity.
Speaker 3: I swear to God Logan Gilbert every time I look
Speaker 3: at a pitching line, it's five and a third inning,
Speaker 3: three three ear in runs, and he has a three
Speaker 3: point four ERA, And I don't understand how it happens
Speaker 3: because I know I would hear it if you like
Speaker 3: pitch seven shut out, So it.
Speaker 1: Must be just like, I don't even know what line.
Speaker 3: What is the most anonymous pitching line for Loger Gilbert
Speaker 3: to have. I guess it would be like six, six
Speaker 3: and two. I guess just having a budget runs.
Speaker 1: You know, I think six and two is too good.
Speaker 1: I think you got six and a third three three earned.
Speaker 2: There's the problem is he is a three point four R.
Speaker 2: So it's like when the individual samples like it's got
Speaker 2: to be like once you go some yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: He's averaging five and five and two thirds and two
Speaker 3: basically that's it.
Speaker 2: Isn't that low. I feel like Gilbert generally has worked
Speaker 2: pretty deep into games.
Speaker 1: That's historically.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's averaging just over six a game. So I
Speaker 3: don't know, it's it's just weird. None of these pictures
Speaker 3: are as good as.
Speaker 2: They should be, right, and the lineups terrible.
Speaker 1: The Mariners are the only team in the division with
Speaker 1: a positive run differential here we go. I don't know
Speaker 1: that that matters. I mean, it's like the difference.
Speaker 2: It's like just like one of these teams are good.
Speaker 1: The Rangers. The Rangers are minus running five and the
Speaker 1: Mariners are plus twelve. That's not a it's both not
Speaker 1: think it's easy easily swamped.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they are.
Speaker 1: The Mariners are a game and a half back of
Speaker 1: the Rangers.
Speaker 2: I mean, look, I think on talent, say the line Craig,
Speaker 2: the Mariners are.
Speaker 1: The best team in this division. I don't know that
Speaker 1: that matters. Like we can talk about on talent. We're
Speaker 1: in July, late July.
Speaker 2: What's cow Rally's current ops plus?
Speaker 3: Right, And that's what I was going to say, right, Yeah,
Speaker 3: I mean I'm gonna have to write about this, I
Speaker 3: think at some point. But like, we've never seen this.
Speaker 3: We've never seen this happen before. Like a guy going
Speaker 3: from a fifty home run season to this. There's only
Speaker 3: been one fifty home run season in baseball history that
Speaker 3: was followed up by ball.
Speaker 1: Yeah, sixty home run season, just yeah, I know, I know.
Speaker 3: We could do sixty. It's even what was a shorter list, sixty.
Speaker 3: It's Roger Merris getting a one twenty eight ops plus
Speaker 3: for fifty home runs. We had Chris Davis having one
Speaker 3: like bad season where he like he was in ninety seven,
Speaker 3: Like he had a ninety.
Speaker 2: Seven understand and I know Brandy Brady, and.
Speaker 3: He was good. He was also like a one to
Speaker 3: twenty eight or something. He just had eighteen home runs
Speaker 3: and a bunch of doubles. Uh No, Like, we've only
Speaker 3: had one time in baseball history where somebody was below
Speaker 3: league average just offense, and he was, and Chris Davis
Speaker 3: was at that point still a decent defensive first baseman
Speaker 3: and was worth one and a half wins. Contra always
Speaker 3: got some catching up to do to get to one
Speaker 3: and a half wins in the sense that I don't
Speaker 3: think it's possible he makes it is.
Speaker 1: Are have you looked at ours in terms of his
Speaker 1: his framing dropping off that way?
Speaker 3: No, his framing is actually still extremely strong. He's I
Speaker 3: think the second I think we have him as the
Speaker 3: second best framer in the league, behind him Dingler, which
Speaker 3: is funny because probably on a rate basis, he's been
Speaker 3: better than Dingler because he's.
Speaker 2: He's just turned from to Patrick Bailey.
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, essentially, except somehow uglier plate appearances.
Speaker 1: I mean he's at one point one war Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's almost all.
Speaker 2: Some of this is probably the injury, but also he
Speaker 2: was not hitting before the injury.
Speaker 3: It was not its been a while since the injury.
Speaker 1: Do your see Plus has him at ninety three, which
Speaker 1: is both an insane drop off from last year and
Speaker 1: and frankly the year before, and also dramatically better than
Speaker 1: his actual production.
Speaker 2: They're gonna like his process generally. I think the problem
Speaker 2: is I.
Speaker 1: Didn't look at that. Have you looked at his ninetieth.
Speaker 2: Ev No, But it's something I actually have.
Speaker 1: Would you look I have it? Do you know what
Speaker 1: it is? I don't know. I want to guess.
Speaker 2: One O seven.
Speaker 1: It's one of six?
Speaker 2: Yeah, like again like yeah, I mean, look.
Speaker 1: Which is slightly above average?
Speaker 2: Yeah, And look he's extremely optimized obviously, Like that was
Speaker 2: his whole thing last year.
Speaker 1: Launch launch angle, real high twenty five.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that's getting up to the that's what
Speaker 2: he does. It is that's also getting a little too high.
Speaker 1: Yes, I agree, Oh, I absolutely agree.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, he's not the only issue here, No, but
Speaker 2: he's you know, the look, I don't think you were
Speaker 2: counting on him having a sixty home run season again,
Speaker 2: but you're probably counting on him being like twenty twenty
Speaker 2: four cow Rally.
Speaker 1: Yes, another problem here, Josh Naylor. Yeah, yeah, this was
Speaker 1: everything we Look, I loved the acquisition last series, a
Speaker 1: good fit for the park and blah blah blah. But
Speaker 1: like they made that deal very quickly, and I think
Speaker 1: we all thought, boy, that's that's a lot for Josh Naylor.
Speaker 2: So I will say on rally, looking in the data, like,
Speaker 2: there's not He's always chased a lot. He's still chasing
Speaker 2: a lot. His you know, ninetieth is down a mile
Speaker 2: and a half over last year. Max is down five.
Speaker 2: Now that doesn't like, does it really matter that he's
Speaker 2: clustering between one oh six and one ten, then one
Speaker 2: seven and one fifteen. It's on a MAX kind of
Speaker 2: it might be it might be indicative of the way
Speaker 2: that's gonna tweak. Yeah, yeah, I think. But the big
Speaker 2: difference here might be the reason for the lost MACS velocity.
Speaker 2: His swing speed is down a mile and a half.
Speaker 1: That's per hour there you are, and.
Speaker 2: A seven seven percent swing right, And look, he's got
Speaker 2: a very long swing. He has one of the longest
Speaker 2: swings in baseball, which is fine when you know you're
Speaker 2: half long swing a mile and a half off.
Speaker 1: Just not to be too sicky, are you using the
Speaker 1: the MLB definition of long swing? I mean it's like
Speaker 1: it where where he makes contact.
Speaker 2: Yes, but it's still like I mean, yes, but it
Speaker 2: is still a lot.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it is visually. I'm just kind of curious.
Speaker 1: Was I was just curious?
Speaker 2: Yeah, And again like he's had little like his his
Speaker 2: swing decisions haven't been quite as good. His own contacts
Speaker 2: gone down a couple of points.
Speaker 1: So there's like other there's big stuff and little stuff.
Speaker 2: The big stuff and little stuff. That's all. I mean, Like,
Speaker 2: you don't go from twenty twenty five to twenty twenty
Speaker 2: six without put those things happening, I assume, But I
Speaker 2: don't know how much of it is, you know, a
Speaker 2: one year blip, and how much of it is well,
Speaker 2: you know, he is a catcher. He is he's got
Speaker 2: to be. He thirty now, I mean it is twenty nine,
Speaker 2: so the catcher about to turn thirty. You know, like that's.
Speaker 1: You know, we like you asked before you played one hundred, yeah,
Speaker 1: seventy five games, and you've.
Speaker 2: Asked before a lot you're in the early in the pod, Like,
Speaker 2: have you ever seen this before? I thought you were
Speaker 2: going to go with like catchers and like the first
Speaker 2: one that comes to mind for me is Jonathan Lucroy
Speaker 2: when it just went went like really, now, look, the
Speaker 2: framing is still pretty good. Like I think the athleticism
Speaker 2: is for what it is, isn't that different. But like
Speaker 2: that's the like with catchers. Man, like he did play
Speaker 2: a lot of games, he did get banged up this year.
Speaker 2: I would accept some sort of bounce back, but sometimes
Speaker 2: it just doesn't happen when you're a thirty year ol
Speaker 2: catcher and they probably need to figure out a way too,
Speaker 2: you know, d HM Moore going forward and like getting.
Speaker 3: Having a backup better than the jorcer. Yeah, probably on
Speaker 3: the priority list, it's not in the system.
Speaker 1: So no, I think one of the wild look, and
Speaker 1: they're not that far out of a playoff spot. They're
Speaker 1: they're right around five hundred, they're two games under, So
Speaker 1: it's all going to be a mixed bag. But like
Speaker 1: if you if you had told me you're going to
Speaker 1: get this season from Randy or Rose Arena in this
Speaker 1: season from Dominic can Zone, I would have said oh yeah, that's.
Speaker 2: The problem is that all that's literally all guy, I know.
Speaker 1: It's it's well, you know, like Julio has been fine.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he just hasn't had the second half Julio yet maybe.
Speaker 1: The right but this is a frankly better than first
Speaker 1: half Kenny, right, So.
Speaker 3: But j Crawford is at the end of the line.
Speaker 1: No, I mean, look, they they made a big move
Speaker 1: for Brendan Donovan. Yep, we I know I bring this up.
Speaker 1: And he's been very good when he's healthy. He's not
Speaker 1: been available.
Speaker 2: He's played twenty five games this year out of yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, the Sugert and whatever they played.
Speaker 1: So that's that's a big piece missing. But also like
Speaker 1: Brendan Donovan shouldn't be the big piece. He's a he's
Speaker 1: a good gap filler, right, And I'm not I'm not
Speaker 1: trying to be derogatory, like I think he's a really
Speaker 1: good player, but he is like a really high quality
Speaker 1: lineup lengthener, not your centerpiece, right.
Speaker 2: I mean, the the problem is they are so they
Speaker 2: are starting to fire this next generation of top position
Speaker 2: player prospects. Young and Amerson are gonna be the first two.
Speaker 2: They're gonna have more coming down line, and like Young
Speaker 2: has been fine.
Speaker 3: Young is also like the most easily the best position
Speaker 3: player prospect they've graduated since. I mean, yeah, you would
Speaker 3: think they're bringing a munch of position players.
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh no, yeah, like Emerson is a better
Speaker 2: prospect than Young.
Speaker 3: But yeah, you have two years of runway too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and like it's there are I did not predict
Speaker 2: the hit tool going like this. I figured if he
Speaker 2: was struggling a little bit, it would be like hitting
Speaker 2: an empty two forty not what this is. But you know,
Speaker 2: this is something they can work itself out.
Speaker 3: Right, And this is like if there's any comfort in this,
Speaker 3: this this is exactly how cold Young's rookie year winning.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, sure, but I think I think if you think,
Speaker 2: I mean, that's not but also are only if you
Speaker 2: guys are only getting to you know, one hundred and
Speaker 2: ten ops plus, Like that's not enough. And yeah, Young
Speaker 2: is a good I don't think Young this is good
Speaker 2: a defender a second basis is d rs. But yeah,
Speaker 2: a good defender. It wouldn't be enough.
Speaker 1: It would be enough if cal Rawley, Yeah, if Leo
Speaker 1: get is one twenty five instead of one ten ops
Speaker 1: plus and and if Randy or Reserina and Dominic Canzone
Speaker 1: are gonna hit like this, it would absolutely be enough.
Speaker 1: But that's this is the thing is like it's a
Speaker 1: little bit like when people do their fantasy teams and
Speaker 1: take all the high risk, high reward guys and you
Speaker 1: get the mixed back and ultimately it's like, no, those
Speaker 1: the rewards don't actually weigh, you know, outweigh all the
Speaker 1: risks you took. You end up middle of the field,
Speaker 1: you know, middle of the pack. Excuse me, And yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean when you need everything to go right.
Speaker 2: Right right, And this is this is a really bad
Speaker 2: bench too. So like if any of these guys get design, yeah, like.
Speaker 3: The Poto puts together a terrible bench because he won't
Speaker 3: need them because he's so he's so great at putting
Speaker 3: a line up together that why would you even need
Speaker 3: a bench? Why? Which is why you have Victor Rob
Speaker 3: Blaze can like not hitting again. Like it's been a
Speaker 3: while now since Relays had there's like two hundred good
Speaker 3: plate appearances. They got him a contract extension, Rob Resn
Speaker 3: like Rob rath Snyder is this is very funny from
Speaker 3: Mariners Fance because this is Tommy Listella. This is like
Speaker 3: the Mariners seem to manage to find the guy whose
Speaker 3: career just bottoms out every time they're looking for a
Speaker 3: bench bat.
Speaker 2: They did this with Ryan Bliss too. It's like the
Speaker 2: prospect version of it.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, they just need you gotta trade Rob rath
Speaker 1: Snyder back to the Red You just at this point.
Speaker 2: You just don't handed bat anymore.
Speaker 1: I don't like a problem. He's a bench bat. It
Speaker 1: should be Okay.
Speaker 3: It's weird with the ref Snyder thing, right.
Speaker 2: Because defensive second basement than Curtis Meade.
Speaker 1: Snyder. Yeah, we're starting a conversation.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean they did this last year with Rowdy Tell's.
Speaker 3: They did it the year before with who was it
Speaker 3: the year before the Maybe they didn't have one year before,
Speaker 3: but they always seem to sign a veteran to a
Speaker 3: one year deal. It's just a turner, I guess.
Speaker 2: I don't know if this is a funny Rowdy tell
Speaker 2: his story.
Speaker 3: Mitch Hannagher again and Mitch Channiger again was one of
Speaker 3: them the DH before. He was Mitch Garver, the backup catcher.
Speaker 3: They they always seem a J.
Speaker 1: Pollock is a good.
Speaker 3: Yeah. They always seem to sign these these veterans. Tommy
Speaker 3: Listella is like the patrons saying to them.
Speaker 2: Are they going to get Jones next year?
Speaker 3: And there's never a good explanation for why they fail
Speaker 3: other than just them being Tommy Listell. It's really easy
Speaker 3: in retrospect to go, oh, yeah, you signed Tommy Listella
Speaker 3: and he was bad because he's Tommy Lastella. But he's
Speaker 3: only bad because you signed Tommy Listella. You know, the
Speaker 3: sliding doors were timing thesis to be an angel or
Speaker 3: something is probably guess about three years in his career
Speaker 3: or something. They kill everyone. It's weird and like you can't.
Speaker 1: Right, but they have to. They have to play the park, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, like so I don't know, I don't know.
Speaker 2: You say that. I know people say that, like baseball
Speaker 2: players aren't recognizable, but they're not like you know, you
Speaker 2: wouldn't take see if you're walking down the street. I
Speaker 2: was doing video recently, just I wasn't I was working
Speaker 2: a picture and I just saw this guy come to
Speaker 2: a play and like that's rowdy tells like without immediately look,
Speaker 2: I would know.
Speaker 1: Look there's guys you have capital all caps, ye face
Speaker 1: and rowdy tails is one of them. I would also
Speaker 1: recognize Ronald Bellisario anywhere. Okay, I would recognize that face anywhere. Uh, well,
Speaker 1: we are on the Mariners. There was a note that
Speaker 1: Emerson Hancock is available.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, I'm not. I assume this is for some
Speaker 2: sort of I guess people call them challenge trades, but essentially.
Speaker 1: This is a version of the meaning it's going to be.
Speaker 2: It's going to be an arm for a bat probably, right,
Speaker 2: that's probably the like a young, good cost controlled bat
Speaker 2: that maybe you know, I don't know what you think
Speaker 2: about Hancock at this point, but.
Speaker 1: He's I think he's a good picture.
Speaker 2: He's a good picture, right, So you're going to get
Speaker 2: like a three?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Maybe, yeah, you would start him in a playoff fare.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think I guess I don't think he's
Speaker 2: different that different from I guess he's not that different
Speaker 2: Connelly Early.
Speaker 1: Well, we'll get to we'll get that.
Speaker 2: But I'm just saying like, yeah, yeah, but yeah, he's
Speaker 2: got understand much control. Yeah, he's got four years of control,
Speaker 2: so four plus. So they trade him now, so yeah,
Speaker 2: I think you could get.
Speaker 1: I think they need to get someone better than Curtis
Speaker 1: me sure.
Speaker 2: But also I think.
Speaker 1: We'll get there.
Speaker 2: I guess you could do this way. I mean, I
Speaker 2: guess you could do it literally with the Nats if
Speaker 2: you wanted to. But like, there's there's going to be
Speaker 2: a small number of teams that are willing to do
Speaker 2: this kind of swamp because like, if you're the Cubs,
Speaker 2: you could actually use Emmerson Hancock, But like.
Speaker 1: I don't think I don't think they could get because
Speaker 1: I think they're in a different position team wise. But like,
Speaker 1: is this like Auto Lopez? Sure? I was thinking, like
Speaker 1: what's a challenging trade in that they're both in a
Speaker 1: breakout year. Yeah, there's more risk on on Hantock just
Speaker 1: as a pitcher, So I don't think it's quite even, right.
Speaker 1: I also don't think the Marlins given the station there
Speaker 1: in right, I want to put all their risks in
Speaker 1: a in a picture bass, right.
Speaker 2: Especially after what happened with white and smelling this year. Right,
Speaker 2: So I I I just wonder how this works. Like
Speaker 2: the White Sox kind of makes sense in a way
Speaker 2: because they have like do you want to trade Emerson
Speaker 2: Hancock for Miguel Vargus. I don't think about megl Vargus
Speaker 2: hitting that park either versus Sorry, just a rate field
Speaker 2: but like, like, like Colson Montgomery has low key not
Speaker 2: been great this season, and they have other shortstop options,
Speaker 2: Like could would you trade Emerson Hancock for Colson Montgomery?
Speaker 2: Like sing it out loud, it sounds really weird, right.
Speaker 1: I don't think either team would do that.
Speaker 2: Right, That's the thing, right, Like you get when you're
Speaker 2: doing the Hancock trade, you end up with a scenario
Speaker 2: where you don't think I'd like a lot of the trades.
Speaker 2: I'm going to say out loud, like, I don't think
Speaker 2: either team would do that. I could see the Marlins
Speaker 2: doing it. It's gonna be very highly like, I mean, yeah,
Speaker 2: it's a different way.
Speaker 3: It's a different type of team like situation, Like the
Speaker 3: Potterys and Diamondbacks could both use Hancock and neither of
Speaker 3: them has anybody in that type of mode to trade, right.
Speaker 2: I think part of the problem too, is if you're
Speaker 2: the Mariners, like, yeah, get the best controlled hitter you
Speaker 2: can get for Hancock, but you kind of don't want
Speaker 2: to add another infielder to that mix either, just another
Speaker 2: you're a Donovan like so now you only look at
Speaker 2: outfielders and.
Speaker 1: They wouldn't do it. Patrick, But I think you could
Speaker 1: talk me a noted skeptic, although I mean like I
Speaker 1: like them, but whatever her older Predoma mm hmmmmmm. Now
Speaker 1: now he's by reference where he's a three win player already.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think p Doma's too.
Speaker 1: He's a league average bat and you know, and yeah
Speaker 1: in T mobile, Yeah that's dropping.
Speaker 2: I mean it's just like he is that just like
Speaker 2: Fancy Cole at this point, though maybe maybe right well,
Speaker 2: the thing is like, but that is.
Speaker 1: Not I don't know. I don't think Arizona would do it.
Speaker 1: I think he made too big a name for himself
Speaker 1: last year, and like, look.
Speaker 2: They don't really they don't really like the Diamondbacks still
Speaker 2: have designs on competition and like we'll need I guess
Speaker 2: I could try to play Jordan. Jordan lul are healthy
Speaker 2: right now, I assume the answer that question.
Speaker 3: Is now almost I.
Speaker 2: Would say they don't have another short stop.
Speaker 1: But this is also going to sound weird because it's
Speaker 1: it's just dealing with a fantasy, okay, But a deal
Speaker 1: that would make sense for the Mariners would be like
Speaker 1: if Kobe Mayo was good, He's not.
Speaker 2: Good, sure, I reckon if Jordan's was healthy.
Speaker 1: If Kobe Mayo was good hand, Like this version of
Speaker 1: Hancock and that version of Kobe Mayo would be a
Speaker 1: very interesting challenge trade matchup for both of those orders, right,
Speaker 1: Like that would be the kind of thing that would
Speaker 1: make sense. I recognize everyone he's not and it's.
Speaker 2: Not to be clearly not good, but like he.
Speaker 1: Does have the power to play in T mobile and
Speaker 1: that would be you know, and then you could you
Speaker 1: could flex Brendan Donovan around even more whenever he's healthy.
Speaker 1: That kind of thing. But like that that's a fact,
Speaker 1: which I guess is what you're talking about a little
Speaker 1: bit with Coulson Montgomery.
Speaker 2: But like, yeah, I just don't think I like, the
Speaker 2: White Sucks are not creative in that particular way like
Speaker 2: they would really and actually creative. They're they're going to
Speaker 2: be more risk averse in these kind of trades, right
Speaker 2: the team that literally is adding Osier Katie.
Speaker 3: The other thing is that like I don't know, I mean,
Speaker 3: it would end the the terrible piggyback situation that's been
Speaker 3: going on. But the Red Socks were able to take
Speaker 3: it early because they have Patrick Sanderbal basically pitching like
Speaker 3: as well as Lily was. This is going to be
Speaker 3: Louis Castillo and he is not pitching as well, Like
Speaker 3: they're gonna the Marriers are gonna feel it.
Speaker 1: Well, that's that's interesting. The thing I read something on
Speaker 1: this rumor popping up and and it was basically like,
Speaker 1: if you would have thought the Mariners would trayed someone,
Speaker 1: it would be lose Castillo. But obviously there's mark.
Speaker 2: Want to get something back. I mean that you want
Speaker 2: to get.
Speaker 1: Something back, but I also don't know that. So the
Speaker 1: actual the problem is their reputation as a as a
Speaker 1: pitching dev or a little bit cuts against them in
Speaker 1: this way. And then I think breakout, they have a
Speaker 1: breakout arm who they're suddenly willing to deal. What does
Speaker 1: that tell you, ma.
Speaker 2: I mean that just that could be something. It could
Speaker 2: be nothing, sure, but it could be decided.
Speaker 1: Other side of the deal. You have to ask it,
Speaker 1: and that makes it harder, right. I absolutely agree they
Speaker 1: might just be trying to be like, let me, let
Speaker 1: us get something real in return for a real piece.
Speaker 1: But all the time, if this, if they're willing to
Speaker 1: deal this guy, what does that telling you?
Speaker 2: I mean, they've said before that Gilbert and Kirby have
Speaker 2: been available and the sort of scuttle butt was that
Speaker 2: they just wanted too much for them. So it's possible
Speaker 2: that Han Kong is available and they just end up
Speaker 2: wanting too much. If it were me, like I make
Speaker 2: this trade, I'm like, we're calling up Kate Anderson. Let's
Speaker 2: go like that what they're going to do? Yeah, calculus here,
Speaker 2: we're just calling up Kat Anderson?
Speaker 1: Who else? Could you.
Speaker 2: Don't limit yourself? So like the Rays are off, they're capable,
Speaker 2: they don't have the piece to send back. Is the problem.
Speaker 1: They're trying to get scooble Man.
Speaker 2: I know, but they don't know if they if they
Speaker 2: want to make the major if they want to right,
Speaker 2: if the Mariners want a major league hiter back, which
Speaker 2: I assume they do, I don't think they want not Carsonians.
Speaker 2: The Rays have junior Cameronaro who they are not straight.
Speaker 2: And then I mean t Mobile can't hurt Chandler Simpson. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: I don't like you.
Speaker 1: You mentioned do you think that Nationals could be interested
Speaker 1: on the pitching front? But I don't really know who
Speaker 1: you're going, Like, I think C. J. Abram is going
Speaker 1: to command more.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it is too. I think the and
Speaker 2: look the Mariners have other like the Mariners could include
Speaker 2: like Michael Royal right or Dolon and Cell Stean right
Speaker 2: to send an infielder back. I think Royal is playing
Speaker 2: some outfield for some reason. But like that, like, I.
Speaker 1: Think they could sure where you place. I don't think
Speaker 1: Seattle is going to want to play C. J. Abrams
Speaker 1: what they've been willing to put up with.
Speaker 2: So honestly about the Nationals, I'm probably just extended C.
Speaker 2: J Abrams at that I would know.
Speaker 1: I agree he might end up in center field, which
Speaker 1: I think is fine. Yeah, I just I don't know
Speaker 1: who who else?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 2: Milwaukee, Milwaukee, Milwaukee certainly has options to send back right.
Speaker 1: But not quite the major league contributor options the like
Speaker 1: tested ones.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess that's probably they have.
Speaker 1: They have a number of up the middle guys who
Speaker 1: are close to major league ready whatever. But you know,
Speaker 1: if the Mariners are trying to do a challenge trade
Speaker 1: that doesn't sell on the season.
Speaker 2: Right and they look they shouldn't because I don't actually
Speaker 2: believe in the Rangers.
Speaker 3: So I will say, I will say to Poto, I'm
Speaker 3: sure it's just looking at Cooper Pratt's contract shamed envy.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't. I will say we should move on
Speaker 1: because there's two more teams in this segment alone, But
Speaker 1: I I I don't know that they have the piece
Speaker 1: to send back. It would be interesting the Cardinals could
Speaker 1: really use a controllable arm, like like Hancock. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't know that there's a great fit throwing back,
Speaker 1: but that would be like something that is both moderately
Speaker 1: for this year but absolutely part of the future for them.
Speaker 1: I mean like yeah, I mean Lars Newbar is not enough, right,
Speaker 1: like you you run into you run into that issue certainly.
Speaker 1: But I think the Cardinals would be interested in Hancock.
Speaker 1: And this also might be a thing where you end
Speaker 1: up with a three team trade. I think you're.
Speaker 2: Gonna end Emerson Emerson Hancock for Jordan Walker.
Speaker 1: Oh, I don't think they're training.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think Mason Wins more likely.
Speaker 2: Honestly, why would you why would you try?
Speaker 1: Got you got JP Crawford at home?
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, I three years, three years of control.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, Mason win is hitting two
Speaker 1: thirty eight three.
Speaker 3: Eight, he is, It's not it's not that good. He
Speaker 3: has hit better.
Speaker 1: I get where you're coming from.
Speaker 2: Patrick, Okay, it's not like Mariners fans haven't watched Brendan
Speaker 2: Ryan before.
Speaker 1: You know, look, I think Jordan Walker. I don't think
Speaker 1: Saint Louis is doing that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, probably not, but I.
Speaker 1: Don't think Saint Louis is doing that. I think he's
Speaker 1: kind of too important for their right line up. It's
Speaker 1: too bad.
Speaker 2: A lot of this comes down to the information we
Speaker 2: can't have, which is like, how much do the actual
Speaker 2: the teams believe in these guys?
Speaker 3: Right? Right?
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, Let's go to the Guardians, who have
Speaker 1: lost you said five in a row. Yeah, they are
Speaker 1: two and a half back of the White Sox. They
Speaker 1: are minus eighteen on the season in run differential, three
Speaker 1: and seven in their last ten.
Speaker 3: Demoted Daniel Schnemanto the minor league since the last time
Speaker 3: we brought up Daniel.
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not ignoring the note as in our
Speaker 1: Doctor that says swept by the quote unquote fraudulent raise. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I will note two things. I'm going to play both
Speaker 1: sides of this fence. The Guardians are not a reason
Speaker 1: that the Rays are no longer fraudulent. Sure, but if
Speaker 1: the Guardians had won anything in this series, I would
Speaker 1: have used it to call the Yes, of course I'm
Speaker 1: playing both sides, so I come out on top. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they they absolutely should. The Guardians aren't good.
Speaker 2: So I hear it's not a good team. Here's one
Speaker 2: for you. I don't know if you have the base
Speaker 2: fends page open Chase the latter that's the highest. I
Speaker 2: don't has Chased the lotter has the highest ops plus
Speaker 2: on the team at one twenty four. Nice little season. Yeah,
Speaker 2: who is second?
Speaker 1: We've had it open before.
Speaker 3: I'm looking left? Is it?
Speaker 1: Is it a regular? Yeah?
Speaker 3: I mean sorry, he is? He is on on He
Speaker 3: is on the top as the leader in his position.
Speaker 3: Is it?
Speaker 1: Is it? Literally? Brian Rokio? No, no, oh, okay, I
Speaker 1: thought that that would be funny.
Speaker 3: It would be there's a lot of there's a lot
Speaker 3: of players on this team. It would be funny funny.
Speaker 1: That's true. It's not Kwan obviously.
Speaker 3: I mean even Kyle Winzardo would be funny at this point.
Speaker 1: It's definitely not. Oh, no, is it? He wouldn't be
Speaker 1: the top guy? Is it Patrick Bailey?
Speaker 2: Is that Patrick Bailey is not the top guy?
Speaker 3: No, Although he is hitting better than he has a
Speaker 3: better ops plus than four regulars. In the Guardians.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I knew he hadn't been as bad for the
Speaker 2: ninety ops plus, Like, that's fine if Patrick.
Speaker 3: Hoskins, No, but they had a bunch of I mean, like,
Speaker 3: it's definitely not Reece Hoskins.
Speaker 1: He's one of the ones below, so he's been so bad.
Speaker 1: Bazana started out, Okay, I'm guessing it's not it's still
Speaker 1: okay on helmart Tina started out, Okay, I.
Speaker 2: Don't almost every except one.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well three, but che your credit. I don't think
Speaker 3: you knew there's fielding?
Speaker 1: What position am I missing? What positions am I?
Speaker 3: So you've already got the position?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Is it just then?
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, say one thirteen O ps plus Craig, Wow,
Speaker 2: okay better.
Speaker 1: Than I thought.
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, I was.
Speaker 1: Assuming second place was going to be like one O
Speaker 1: two Okay, okay, all right, Yeah, I don't know what.
Speaker 1: I don't think beating the Guardians.
Speaker 2: I don't know what to do with the Guardians other
Speaker 2: than they're just gonna.
Speaker 3: He's just still like we haven't talked about him in
Speaker 3: a while, Still still just brown along in the two
Speaker 3: five nine.
Speaker 2: Kate Smith continue like, is Kate Smith the most underrated
Speaker 2: reliever in baseball could.
Speaker 1: Thing maybe maybe.
Speaker 3: Given then maybe all thirteen yeah, still maybe maybe.
Speaker 2: I feel like he's one that, like fantasy players all
Speaker 2: know they're closer.
Speaker 1: Right, Sevin Williams looked like he was in the middle
Speaker 1: of break up, missing a ton of bats, but up
Speaker 1: to a three, seven eight.
Speaker 4: I just.
Speaker 1: No, I did not know. Plon was.
Speaker 3: Like he flopped. He flipped with steaming like yesterday.
Speaker 2: This is the team that could really use Tyrone Taylor.
Speaker 3: You could.
Speaker 1: No, they can't. They're not good enough to be worth
Speaker 1: acquiring Tyrone Tailor.
Speaker 2: I mean, they're exactly good enough to be worth Taylor.
Speaker 3: I think they're not.
Speaker 2: They're not gonna make I mean, I think because possible
Speaker 2: they make a move for a Tyrone Taylor level player.
Speaker 2: I'm not saying they're going to be they're the Guardians,
Speaker 2: but I think it is possible that they trade for
Speaker 2: Tyrone Taylor. Not Louise but possibly Tyrone Taylor.
Speaker 3: Jake McCarthy would look good at.
Speaker 2: Like I said, I got at the Al Central whatever.
Speaker 1: The Phillies. The Phillies also salvage might like the Mariners
Speaker 1: salvage game in their series against the Yankees three and six.
Speaker 1: Since the break to be fair, you.
Speaker 3: Know, I guess they they they lost two or three
Speaker 3: to the minutes, but they also played the Dodgers. I mean,
Speaker 3: they played the Dodgers and Yankees and they you know,
Speaker 3: lost both.
Speaker 2: They had been kind of scuffling a little bit before
Speaker 2: the break too. Yeah, they like it looked like I
Speaker 2: don't know, maybe three weeks ago or when I think
Speaker 2: we did a segment on it, like it it seemed theoretical.
Speaker 2: It seemed and I say likely, but it seemed very
Speaker 2: possible they were going to like catch like by now they.
Speaker 1: Were they were hot and the Braves were not, and
Speaker 1: they were I don't know four and a half at
Speaker 1: one point and less than opposite directions, and it looked like, yeah,
Speaker 1: this is.
Speaker 2: The Braves had no pitching.
Speaker 3: And and then since then the Braves have gone eight
Speaker 3: and three, and six of those wins have been by
Speaker 3: one run. Yeah, just you know, itch.
Speaker 1: Happens, and the Phillies losses have felt they had the
Speaker 1: Dodgers double play.
Speaker 2: I mean they were, they were two games back going
Speaker 2: into the break. Two they are now five and a half. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: they were. They were between like two and three for
Speaker 2: most of the beginning of July.
Speaker 1: Here's what I'm gonna say. I'm not ready to call
Speaker 1: this division. Sure, I think five and a half approaching
Speaker 1: August is substantial. I'm not super sold on Atlanta. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think they they have another swoon in them. I
Speaker 1: think the Phillies have another like competence streak.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I will say they play. They have a
Speaker 2: four game series against the Braves. Looks like Labor Day weekend.
Speaker 1: That's fun.
Speaker 2: Before that, they play the Marlins, the Orioles, the Nats,
Speaker 2: the Blue Jays, the Cardinals, the Twins, the Marlins, the Cardinals,
Speaker 2: the Mariners, the Angels, and the Diamondbacks.
Speaker 1: That's which team is.
Speaker 2: That's the schedule for the rest of them month.
Speaker 3: A lot of men in there, and technically they have
Speaker 3: it's time to bring up the remaining schedule strength. They
Speaker 3: have the eighth hardest schedule. The Braves have the fifth
Speaker 3: hardest schedule remaining.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's, like you said, a lot of mid But well, the.
Speaker 2: Other question is there September, what are the post.
Speaker 1: Deadline Nationals going to look like? The Nationals can hand
Speaker 1: you now.
Speaker 2: I mean, look, they have seven they also like the
Speaker 2: last week of the season, they play the Brewers and
Speaker 2: the Rays. Who might already be locked into a spot
Speaker 2: by then. But that's part of the reason their schedule
Speaker 2: is probably as hard as the addition to the seven
Speaker 2: games with Atlanta.
Speaker 3: The Diamondbacks can hand you all every two games exactly.
Speaker 1: Well, but but you know what I mean, right, Like
Speaker 1: there's there's a game.
Speaker 2: It depends on when you catch them.
Speaker 1: The Cardinals and the Nationals are too competent, sure middle
Speaker 1: of the pack teams that it wouldn't shock anyone if
Speaker 1: they they scratch out a win or a series win
Speaker 1: against against the Phillies.
Speaker 2: If they think about this, Phillies teams like, but.
Speaker 1: Those are two teams that could be on the cell
Speaker 1: and they probably won't do hard cells or whatever, but
Speaker 1: enough that by the time the Phillies get to two
Speaker 1: series with them or whatever. I think you mentioned the
Speaker 1: Cardinals twice in there, Yeah, like the Cardinals twice, like
Speaker 1: that they could be quite large favorites. Now you still
Speaker 1: have to execute, and.
Speaker 2: The Phillies will be buying conversely, right right, But like, like,
Speaker 2: here's the thing about the Phillies. This is not a
Speaker 2: good team. Like the more I look at it.
Speaker 3: Like.
Speaker 1: It's it's the pitching is pretty good.
Speaker 2: Pitching is pretty good. Like for all the off season,
Speaker 2: you know, star a discourse about Brightce Harper. He's basically
Speaker 2: having the same season he had last year, which is fine,
Speaker 2: but also not you know, not really the third banana season.
Speaker 2: They need the first banana season. He really should be
Speaker 2: the first banana. Crey Turner is not having the third
Speaker 2: banana season.
Speaker 3: So yeah, you can accept.
Speaker 2: Yeah, sure that's problem.
Speaker 3: Like yeah, all those all those Alec Boem, Bryan Spice
Speaker 3: and stock guys who you know, you just never roll
Speaker 3: adye to find out if their ops is going to
Speaker 3: be an eighty or one hundred.
Speaker 2: They're obviously they're getting an all star season out of
Speaker 2: Brandon Marsh. He actually also has not been like down
Speaker 2: to Yeah, he has not been that good.
Speaker 1: Derek Hill has been a savior for them somehow putting it,
Speaker 1: I suppose he plays a competent center field and he's.
Speaker 2: Five hundred plugging somehow that does not seem right. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's not gonna.
Speaker 1: Lie, guys. He has in twenty nine games, one and
Speaker 1: a half our war. Yeah, like that is a safer Yeah, sure,
Speaker 1: fair enough.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just look, the pitching is very good.
Speaker 1: They could use.
Speaker 2: They could use a actual spot starter starter. I mean
Speaker 2: and Emerson, they could Uncock. I don't know, you're trading
Speaker 2: back and again we're having the same conversations we have
Speaker 2: about the Philly all the time. You know, Stotton Bohm
Speaker 2: haven't really worked out, you know, every button basically that
Speaker 2: Sambrowski pushed this offseason, right like, they resigned real Mudo.
Speaker 2: He has not been good. They committed to keep playing
Speaker 2: Bowen Stott. They have not been good at least Garcia right, like,
Speaker 2: we're gonna make Justin Crawford the center fielder not working
Speaker 2: out like they're all like kind of in predictable ways.
Speaker 1: And they've also been hurt by some of the role
Speaker 1: player guys that I like, I think generally speaking, like
Speaker 1: Edmundo Sosa is a short side platoon Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: multi position guy is a great little piece. He's been awful.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Like, I don't again, I think this team
Speaker 2: should be good enough to make the playoffs with this pitching,
Speaker 2: and obviously they're gonna supplement coming yeah again, like literally
Speaker 2: you go out and trade for Luis Robert to play
Speaker 2: center field, like.
Speaker 1: Right, they will for I don't know that he will
Speaker 1: help them enough.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean it's just like again, the floor here
Speaker 2: is so low, right, Like he like he's a much
Speaker 2: better defensive center fielder than Justin Crawford. And I believe
Speaker 2: he can beat like two fifty five three h four
Speaker 2: three forty the rest of the way.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he should be able to. Yeah, he has runs
Speaker 1: where he does not he j does not.
Speaker 2: But like I think it's a realistic Like yeah, I
Speaker 2: think I.
Speaker 1: Don't remember who it was. It might have been you
Speaker 1: guys talking about Like Yo, you guys talked about Patrick
Speaker 1: mentioned like just they needed to hand Balton get Baltimore
Speaker 1: out of things in trade for tailor work. But like
Speaker 1: that's the that's the kind of guy that they could
Speaker 1: really use. And no one who roots for Philly wants
Speaker 1: to hear that, right, But he is reducts.
Speaker 2: Right, there's some like there's some royals energy with these obps,
Speaker 2: so getting more.
Speaker 1: And that's the thing is that even if Taylor Ward
Speaker 1: isn't going to hit for power, which.
Speaker 2: You just just bat him lead off and let shore
Speaker 2: Burn Harper hit behind him when he walks right like
Speaker 2: you get.
Speaker 1: But that's the thing. But also like he's not he'll
Speaker 1: be cheap in terms of the prospects, probably if if
Speaker 1: the Orioles would trade him. But you know, he costs money,
Speaker 1: lose Robert costs money.
Speaker 2: So I don't know, and they care less about adding
Speaker 2: the money than anything else, Like they don't really have
Speaker 2: the prospects of trade.
Speaker 1: Care less, but they're up in I I don't have
Speaker 1: their cots page open, but like they're up there. So
Speaker 1: like every petition of money is yeah, Now, should they
Speaker 1: use that to their advantage and just pay some money? Yeah, definitely,
Speaker 1: especially if it means that they don't have to hollow
Speaker 1: out already, you know, not teeming farm system. I guess
Speaker 1: one way to put it on that note, Why don't
Speaker 1: we take a break and we'll be back with the
Speaker 1: vast majority of the show. Welcome back to episode five
Speaker 1: hundred and sixty six of five and five. We're on
Speaker 1: segment two. We've referenced it a lot already. There was
Speaker 1: a meeting of the thoughts. Patrick, I don't know. I
Speaker 1: just went on the headline.
Speaker 3: No, that's fine, like the there are there was no
Speaker 3: way any headline that's gonna be good for this, this
Speaker 3: combination of names. Yep, yeah, I don't like this straight.
Speaker 1: Okay, so we've said it, but but just for Connolly
Speaker 1: Early goes from Boston to Washington for Curtis Mead. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we we had some disagreement in our group chat when
Speaker 1: this happened.
Speaker 2: Well, like I don't I do want to put you
Speaker 2: in a hole, but I'm just saying I don't like
Speaker 2: this trade, and I still like it more than I
Speaker 2: think ninety nine percent of the people I've talked.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So just to set the stage, I was at
Speaker 2: a concert on Saturday night Joslie Plett. She is touring
Speaker 2: the West Coast. Now, definitely go check them out.
Speaker 3: I don't have any bands a concert on Saturday night, Like, yes,
Speaker 3: that's more rememorativity than I'm remembering like five years.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Josie Platt and Crouch Eye there just theydially is
Speaker 2: a really good album. It got like it's a local act,
Speaker 2: but they just got like MPR's like best Music of
Speaker 2: the Week, best New music or whatever. A really good
Speaker 2: live show too. So if you're on the West Coast
Speaker 2: or in the western two time zones, check them out.
Speaker 2: They're touring I think starting later this week. And the
Speaker 2: my phone was buzzing a lot. I tried to take
Speaker 2: it out at a concert, like during like the set
Speaker 2: or whatever, but some sort of guitar switch was going on.
Speaker 2: So I just looked at it, and if people telling
Speaker 2: me thoughts on this trade, I'm.
Speaker 3: Like, oh god, right now, well it's it's the week.
Speaker 2: Like yeah, it's like or like this is a really
Speaker 2: weird one. I'm like, what the hell happened? I assumed
Speaker 2: I had assumed it was a Mets thing because generally
Speaker 2: when I get text about then, I opened it up
Speaker 2: and like, I just like looked at it. It's like
Speaker 2: kind only early for Curtis bad and I just responded back,
Speaker 2: I met a concert, but what the fuck? And I
Speaker 2: from my phone away watch the rest of the show.
Speaker 2: I was leaving, I'm like, I'm out of the concert. Still,
Speaker 2: what the fuck?
Speaker 1: So this is a challenge trade, yes, guys, without it's
Speaker 1: challenging me much track record, yes, but what there is
Speaker 1: generally good better more recently for Mead than for if
Speaker 1: you care about it currently hurt, we should, yes, mention.
Speaker 2: If you care about such things at this point in time,
Speaker 2: both were very highly regarded prospects at various points. At
Speaker 2: various points, Mead is obviously, I don't think it's that
Speaker 2: much older than early, but was uh you know, he
Speaker 2: was a he was an i FA out of Australia,
Speaker 2: not even like a high school pick.
Speaker 1: So he's been.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think Early is around that age. But
Speaker 2: Early was like a college draft d A and Mead
Speaker 2: was obviously you know, playing in the prosas okay, So yeah,
Speaker 2: Mead was a prospect long before or meet it exhausted
Speaker 2: as prospect eligibility, long before he had options. Yes, but
Speaker 2: if you care about such things, they're both highly regarded prospects.
Speaker 2: Jared mentioned this on our show. I will say it
Speaker 2: against I agree with it, Like we would not rank
Speaker 2: Meat as highly now I think we have. It was
Speaker 2: like get a weird point in time where we were
Speaker 2: really kind of probably over indexing directionality of contact mm hmm,
Speaker 2: because he's very good at pulling and lifting the ball,
Speaker 2: especially this year, and that might be a credit to
Speaker 2: the Nationals. Obvious they've got some of that out of
Speaker 2: Abrams as well. I don't like.
Speaker 1: When when Mead was at his peak, you thought this
Speaker 1: would not you specifically, but one would have thought this
Speaker 1: guy can just hit. This was like this is what
Speaker 1: it would look like. Our hitter hitters hit era right
Speaker 1: hitters are going to hit and he looked like a
Speaker 1: hitter yep, with enough pop that with the amount of
Speaker 1: hitting he did, would would make could play up a
Speaker 1: little bit. That that was the cell on meat at
Speaker 1: the time.
Speaker 2: And Jarrett made this point on the on the pot
Speaker 2: as well that like he never he never actually got
Speaker 2: playing time, right, this is the first time he's actually
Speaker 2: gotten like extended playing time, and just never you never
Speaker 2: earned it. But like also for a prospect that good,
Speaker 2: you'd think that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, just let him, yeah, let him adjust now he
Speaker 1: looked bad.
Speaker 2: Not to sugarcoat it, yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but yeah, I don't know. It's it's interesting because
Speaker 1: Early's rise has been so quick and Needs has been
Speaker 1: such a slow burn, Like if it is quick, but
Speaker 1: also he's been such a slow burn over time. I
Speaker 1: just think, I look at this deal and I I
Speaker 1: love seeing Curtis Need breakout. Right. Generally he's at his
Speaker 1: more recent vintage, not the most recent, I guess it
Speaker 1: has been. He can stand at a bunch of positions
Speaker 1: and be bad at most.
Speaker 2: Of them, probably find at first.
Speaker 1: But probably find at first. But I'm at the well,
Speaker 1: well I meant the other ones, and he's a short
Speaker 1: side platoon masher now this year he has been certainly
Speaker 1: much more than that. He's hit right. He's just as
Speaker 1: well as lefties, I mean, not quite as well, but
Speaker 1: he's a little bit a little bit less right on right.
Speaker 1: Plenty of value there. I'm less sure that that part
Speaker 1: is not small sample. I'm not trying to say the
Speaker 1: breakout isn't real, but you get these weird same size
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 2: I had, Right, he might be significantly better again major
Speaker 2: league right is and he handles velocity fine, But you know,
Speaker 2: maybe he's just an average hitter against righties, right, yeah,
Speaker 2: like you can play him against.
Speaker 1: It might even be below average and still playing right
Speaker 1: because he's so good against like I think, you know
Speaker 1: I had. My dad asked me recently, like, oh, what
Speaker 1: months you do to be good against lefties now? And
Speaker 1: I was like, probably nothing, right, Like, it's probably just
Speaker 1: some some small outcome based stuff. Now right on right
Speaker 1: is bigger.
Speaker 2: And more right than left asia.
Speaker 1: Yep, right, it's but we're still talking what one hundred
Speaker 1: and eighty plate appearances around that one hundred eighty two
Speaker 1: hundred plate appearances for me right on right this year.
Speaker 1: I just don't know. I'm not trying to say it's
Speaker 1: not it might be real.
Speaker 2: I said that I'm a little skeptical, I said about
Speaker 2: the Mets draft, but like I'm going to start using
Speaker 2: it as a you know, one of my my go
Speaker 2: to maxims. I guess we're going with U. You better
Speaker 2: be right. He's one of those trades where you better
Speaker 2: be right.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well, and Patrick, you wrote you wrote this t A
Speaker 1: and I think that actually captures a lot of where
Speaker 1: you land because you talk about the Gnats can miss
Speaker 1: you know, early Early's hurt.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and right, early can miss the season and you
Speaker 2: can go under the knife tomorrow.
Speaker 1: Right, And that was kind of like you basically say that, Patrick, Right,
Speaker 1: like if the Knats missed a year and a half
Speaker 1: of early, like they can still come out ahead.
Speaker 3: Three years left. It's yeah, I don't like this trade
Speaker 3: for Boston because it's like you can't not think about
Speaker 3: those three years, right, Yes, this makes Boston a better
Speaker 3: team today.
Speaker 2: I mean, they get three we should they get this?
Speaker 2: Isn't they get three years of me too? It's like
Speaker 2: they don't get right, I.
Speaker 1: Don't know three years.
Speaker 3: The problem is like, yes, this team is full of
Speaker 3: the type of players need is I basically I wrote
Speaker 3: that this year they knock Anthony Siegler out of the lineup,
Speaker 3: which is not even their biggest problem in next year. Yeah,
Speaker 3: I know, you know, he's a ninety five DRC guy
Speaker 3: I think in general, but like you know, he is not.
Speaker 3: Like there's a few players on that team that are
Speaker 3: not ninety five DRC guys. And then they'll still move,
Speaker 3: They'll get zach Nator or something like.
Speaker 2: They'll they'll find other things that's just be up next
Speaker 2: year too.
Speaker 3: This is the sort of investment you make in solving
Speaker 3: your biggest problem, right when you're trading Connolly early.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: That's the reason I don't like this trade, but apparently
Speaker 2: like it more than everyone else, is that if you
Speaker 2: made Connolly early available, you could do better than this.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, and like well, probably.
Speaker 2: Still getting infielder with some control right right.
Speaker 3: The next year needs probably best fit is to dislodge
Speaker 3: Masatake Yoshida from DH, and like, sure, he's probably an
Speaker 3: upgrade there, but not that much of one.
Speaker 1: Shouldn't You shouldn't be paying Connolly early for for a
Speaker 1: d for maybe better.
Speaker 3: Than your maybe better than your set of DH when
Speaker 3: you already have you seated, which you know, admittedly she
Speaker 3: is not great, and.
Speaker 1: I know you also don't You also shouldn't be having
Speaker 1: your sheet to be your DH right Like there, this
Speaker 1: is like solving a problem with another problem. But like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I I think from all the people
Speaker 1: I've talked to, nobody loves this deal for the Red Sox,
Speaker 1: but nobody dislikes Curtis me This is it about like
Speaker 1: you did a bat. Yeah, it's not like you acquired
Speaker 1: someone people don't like or as if he I mean,
Speaker 1: like there are questions.
Speaker 3: There are questions, more than more than usual for a
Speaker 3: position player being traded for also.
Speaker 1: The context of the guy. It's it's less even about
Speaker 1: the guy and his questions than the context of you're now.
Speaker 2: They say the pace.
Speaker 1: They don't want to They don't want to dislodge Durban,
Speaker 1: and they probably.
Speaker 3: Shouldn't because Mead's arm is almost as as his range
Speaker 3: and you know why. Yeah, but playing.
Speaker 1: Curtis Meat at the second base is a bad idea. Yeah,
Speaker 1: trading for Curtis Mead is not a bad idea. Playing
Speaker 1: Curtis Meat at second is a bad idea.
Speaker 3: But with the roster, that's where they have to play it, Like,
Speaker 3: that's the that's the context in which they made the trade, right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just they they solved for like we need
Speaker 1: a right handed bat. Yeah, but they did it in
Speaker 1: the worst way possible for their roster construction, which again,
Speaker 1: like we were going on close to two full years
Speaker 1: of looking at this team and saying, there are a
Speaker 1: lot of really good pieces. The pieces that they have
Speaker 1: all stack up on the same positions, and they're not
Speaker 1: solving for second base and they're not solving for for whatever,
Speaker 1: and and it's the same situation.
Speaker 3: But when I was researching Need, the thing that really
Speaker 3: stuck out to me when I'm looking through his numbers
Speaker 3: with two strikes on him, Need is hitting two, sixteen, three,
Speaker 3: twenty four to four to one this year.
Speaker 2: I think that is what wow wow about me.
Speaker 3: Above me the average. And he is not like like
Speaker 3: he's not bad.
Speaker 2: It's a good contact guy.
Speaker 3: He's a goodun he's a good contact He is not
Speaker 3: the kind of guy who was like, oh, once I
Speaker 3: get two strikes, I just play and play, you know,
Speaker 3: Like I just I feel like that number is going
Speaker 3: and he's intentionally getting to two strikes because he's just
Speaker 3: sitting on everything. Now he's and it's not like he's
Speaker 3: said waiting a time just because he wants to walk.
Speaker 3: He's not a Vogel box situation. He wants that pitch
Speaker 3: he can poll, and he's gonna sit there and wait
Speaker 3: for that pitch he can poll. I'm not sure he's
Speaker 3: always gonna get it, especially with you know, he's getting
Speaker 3: better against right handers. He's hitting better, and its right handers,
Speaker 3: especially with breaking pitches that are not going to the
Speaker 3: place where he wants to pull, like those pictures are
Speaker 3: going away.
Speaker 1: It's a little of the It's Weird approach, which was
Speaker 1: he literally was like, I'm looking for a pitch in
Speaker 1: this zone and if it's not that, I don't swing
Speaker 1: at it. I don't care. If it's in the zone,
Speaker 1: I don't care. If it's out of the zone. I'm
Speaker 1: looking for one thing, and if I don't get it,
Speaker 1: I'm not swinging.
Speaker 3: And you can be a mistake, picture a mistake hitter
Speaker 3: and succeed. I'm not sure he is going to get
Speaker 3: as many mistakes as he has gotten.
Speaker 2: He also does not have Paul Konerko's power.
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, right, No, he's he's gotta be like it's
Speaker 1: funny because he's he's in many ways like a very
Speaker 1: modern hitter in terms of like you said, he puts
Speaker 1: the ball in the air and on the pull side, but.
Speaker 2: He's not like a lot of times those guys will
Speaker 2: create a swing plane that does sell out for some
Speaker 2: swing and miss in the zone on those pitches to
Speaker 2: maximize damage. Right, But his own contact rate's like ninety,
Speaker 2: he's not like he's still And I do wonder if
Speaker 2: some of that is then created, like some of this,
Speaker 2: because it's only three hundred plate appearances. It's just that
Speaker 2: at ball luck, like absolutely nineteen nineties Boris McCracken batted
Speaker 2: ball luck. And again, that doesn't mean he's not a
Speaker 2: good hitter, like a major legue quality hitter. It just
Speaker 2: means he's not this guy on ops plus.
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, I it's it'll be interesting. Maybe he just
Speaker 3: has a really great piecet way.
Speaker 2: Maybe like it's again, maybe he is a prospect. He
Speaker 2: was doing a lot of these same things as a
Speaker 2: prospect when we liked him. Like, it's not him, he's
Speaker 2: only twenty five, Like it's not it's the first extended
Speaker 2: run he's gotten. The Red Sox could get something here
Speaker 2: and still lose this trade, right, Like that's the other
Speaker 2: part of it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it is. It's he's exactly a ninety on Zcon.
Speaker 2: I mean, like it is phenomenal if you're the Nats,
Speaker 2: like you're making this trade a hundred times out of
Speaker 2: one hundred.
Speaker 1: Well that's that's the other part of this, And I
Speaker 1: don't know that it's fair. Yeah, but the other part
Speaker 1: of this is they traded Boston Smith for this guy
Speaker 1: a few months ago.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but also just the shape.
Speaker 1: You know, I posted on this, I said congratulations to
Speaker 1: Paul Tivoni on the most audacious one red paper clip.
Speaker 1: Yeah iteration yet people can look up one red p Yeah.
Speaker 2: But like I suspect that might, like I suspect the
Speaker 2: already of our listeners just know what that is at
Speaker 2: the top of their here gonna guess. But a little
Speaker 2: bit of self selection.
Speaker 1: There, Boston Smith. Nobody knows now, Boston Smith is hitting
Speaker 1: to be yeah, to be fair, but like for Curtis
Speaker 1: Mead and then traded Curtis meat for Connolly.
Speaker 2: Early and look early, I don't want to say they
Speaker 2: got an ace here, right.
Speaker 3: Like this isn't the Christmas Yeah.
Speaker 2: He's he's got elbow inflammation currently, like particularly.
Speaker 1: Behind his elbow. It's like he's probably a.
Speaker 2: Three and a halfpy ra guy broadly speaking, and like
Speaker 2: they don't like they don't have that in there. Ironically,
Speaker 2: they traded one of them to the Red Sox previously
Speaker 2: and Jake Bennett, but they don't like have that guy
Speaker 2: in their system really right, Like a lot of their
Speaker 2: pitching is hurt. Pitching prospects are hurt.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: One of the things you brought up, And again, I
Speaker 1: don't want to give the impression that you're way in
Speaker 1: on Boston side or whatever is that you know early
Speaker 1: is more load the mid nineties. Yeah, he his fastball
Speaker 1: shape is not great. The secondaries are good, but.
Speaker 2: Like he's a pitched versification guy, and it's again it's working.
Speaker 2: I think it'll work just fine, But I do think
Speaker 2: there's there and he has elbow inflammation.
Speaker 1: The club that has gotten the season that they've gotten
Speaker 1: so far out of Foster Griffin and and has gotten
Speaker 1: the kind of upward trajectory that they've gotten on a
Speaker 1: number of guys seems well positioned to potentially take advantage
Speaker 1: of that. Now. Look, Boston also extremely good at, especially
Speaker 1: seemingly left handed. Yeah, pitching development. So it's not exactly
Speaker 1: like a major upgrade in that sense. But you know
Speaker 1: these these are also the same a lot of the
Speaker 1: same people. Yeah, yeah, and literally is the same from
Speaker 1: Boston's development.
Speaker 2: I'm sure Pelatavoni is very very familiar with Connley early,
Speaker 2: who was in the draft room when they drafted him,
Speaker 2: Like exactly, yeah, all.
Speaker 1: Right, anything, el Patrick, do you have any last word
Speaker 1: on this?
Speaker 3: I want the next train to be better?
Speaker 1: This is this is the.
Speaker 2: Other thing like you you mentioned Emerson hand confirmation when
Speaker 2: there you go.
Speaker 3: Please know what, I don't want to do another one
Speaker 3: of these. I don't want an this is what we're
Speaker 3: going to get. I know what's what we're going to get.
Speaker 3: I know we're going to get a.
Speaker 1: Ton of This is weird. It's not necessarily that or whatever,
Speaker 1: but it's weird. This same kind of weird ship we're
Speaker 1: gonna say.
Speaker 2: I think this is also an out and sort of
Speaker 2: an effect of just teams valuing prospects more than even
Speaker 2: like even though.
Speaker 1: Graduated number three face what their prospect he was.
Speaker 2: It's very much like there could be anything in that box.
Speaker 2: It could even be kind of early.
Speaker 3: Right before I give you this gift, I'm going to
Speaker 3: let you look in a small hole like he get
Speaker 3: it first, It wasn't there.
Speaker 1: One of the one of the British game shows had
Speaker 1: like what's in the like you have to like, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know that's what is Jimmy Carr.
Speaker 2: Jimmy Carr persis, Yeah, it's the what is it? The
Speaker 2: banana in the box? I don't Knowmber what.
Speaker 1: There was there was one with the will they lie
Speaker 1: about what's in it?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 1: They say what the game?
Speaker 3: It's very like a famous.
Speaker 2: It's a very like you can find on YouTube. It's
Speaker 2: a very very funny segment. Yeah, tennes really good watching.
Speaker 2: It's really good.
Speaker 1: It's really good. Let's go to our third segment, rumor
Speaker 1: has it Well? We talked about whether you know the
Speaker 1: Red so well. We talked about the Red Sox needing
Speaker 1: a short stop.
Speaker 2: They still want to short stop, the need more now
Speaker 2: the Angels might need to consider trading zach Netto, and
Speaker 2: we talked about how the Red Sox should be in
Speaker 2: on zach Netto.
Speaker 1: Turns out all those things are coming to.
Speaker 2: The They might want to arrange your shortstop than zach Netto,
Speaker 2: given her they're playing at second.
Speaker 1: But we got well just play durban off.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, just move everybody over over.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this make I mean, look, this would make sense.
Speaker 1: You know who they Angels might have wanted kind of early,
Speaker 1: probably would have.
Speaker 2: It does seem like it sounds like John Mazzeliak might
Speaker 2: just be the GM.
Speaker 1: Now his is the GM going forward?
Speaker 3: Like oh really he's actually behaving like it?
Speaker 2: Well, no, there's likewords, it's like I might just stay. Yeah,
Speaker 2: basically I wonder if he's just like talking like if
Speaker 2: you never deal with art. Yeah, I guess you just
Speaker 2: keep you're doing that. I'm just gonna keep showing up
Speaker 2: to work.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you start getting used to it. You're like, Okay,
Speaker 3: the commute. I'm getting used to the commute. I figured
Speaker 3: out where he talks about how how it.
Speaker 1: Was nice out there.
Speaker 2: I heard already retire age, So you're an Orange County
Speaker 2: like that, you're basically retired.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Look, I I think they probably should look at
Speaker 1: trading that out. It doesn't say anything good about the
Speaker 1: state of the franchise, but either does anything else, sure,
Speaker 1: especially like if if you're trading debts En Sriano.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's the might and net Like I like
Speaker 2: Zach Nato a lot, always have that hit tool is
Speaker 2: kind of on a knife sedge?
Speaker 1: Is there anyone else who would go after Ned?
Speaker 2: None of the contenders really have the Yankees, I guess,
Speaker 2: mm hmm hmm, there's not. Like most of these contenders
Speaker 2: don't need a shortstop or are not moving on from
Speaker 2: their shorts, Like I think, is zach netto better? Thank
Speaker 2: Cooper Pratt almost assuredly, but like we're Pratts on that extenion.
Speaker 2: He's gonna play shortstop for them for a bit, right, yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean like the Braves, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: they like they have the pieces now to go get
Speaker 2: Zack nat out too.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm.
Speaker 2: They would have to, They would have to empty the
Speaker 2: top of their farm sot him to do it, but
Speaker 2: they have.
Speaker 1: The users to do it. How much control doesn't that three?
Speaker 2: I think?
Speaker 1: After this season, Yeah, so it's going to be a
Speaker 1: pretty pen.
Speaker 2: Like it's probably gonna be Hartman and South the scene, right,
Speaker 2: Like it's like they're going to want to slam dunk
Speaker 2: top one under one prospects back one that's probably.
Speaker 1: There and I think that's right for three years.
Speaker 2: Very good choice, very good player, even with his like
Speaker 2: flaws such as they are.
Speaker 1: Nothing nothing, He's not going to be elite or anything
Speaker 1: like that. But it's like he's like a.
Speaker 2: First division regular at Chorts.
Speaker 1: Yeah right, exactly. The headline names for this deadline, I mean,
Speaker 1: one with a bullet is Ark's School.
Speaker 5: Sure.
Speaker 1: I don't know if the Tigers are trading terrek'school or
Speaker 1: not they are, the Tigers don't know.
Speaker 2: The Tigers don't know. They're taking calls apparently, which is
Speaker 2: taking you have to.
Speaker 1: But also work in case you need to move fast.
Speaker 2: They had a nice little soft part of the schedule
Speaker 2: here and they lost to or three to the Royals
Speaker 2: to start it out, like yeah, three seriously to the death.
Speaker 1: Three and a half back with four teams between them
Speaker 1: and the Guardians for the last.
Speaker 2: Still I think they are better, I mean take it
Speaker 2: down to the wire.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you do have to take this down to
Speaker 1: the one.
Speaker 2: Look, they play the Orioles now, who are one of
Speaker 2: the teams ahead of them.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 2: So there's that, and that will probably give you some
Speaker 2: clarity and like, look, if you you can start talk
Speaker 2: getting serious about this Sunday afternoon, if you want to
Speaker 2: after you Loo's again, like you can take the decision
Speaker 2: point down to these next two series. I think I
Speaker 2: think that's right, because look, you're there, given where they are,
Speaker 2: and do like their playoff odds are going to bounce
Speaker 2: around a little bit this week.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think so that we saw a report that
Speaker 1: some interesting teams are going to be in on school.
Speaker 1: We heard about Milwaukee, when we heard about Tampa. I'm
Speaker 1: maybe more skeptical on Tampa in the sense that loves
Speaker 1: to say.
Speaker 2: They love but they are like they had to deal
Speaker 2: with harper as or rental before.
Speaker 1: The one is the one that the ownership. I think
Speaker 1: Astro he was traded to, had a deal for that.
Speaker 1: Mike had a deal to Houston and ownership the learners said.
Speaker 2: No, there there, they are around I'm not saying around term.
Speaker 1: But they also love to let you know they do.
Speaker 1: You know we it's it's very much like we were
Speaker 1: also in.
Speaker 2: A five minutes after the deadline goes back.
Speaker 1: Okay, okay, right, yeah, they always and look there's credibility because.
Speaker 2: They make a lot of weird traits well and they
Speaker 2: have pieces.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know, I was reading if they and
Speaker 1: was like and was like, they make they make or
Speaker 1: try to make big moves. They got Nelson Cruz, they
Speaker 1: tried to get show I was like, those are not
Speaker 1: the same thing.
Speaker 2: Look, if they made the o'gillan available, like he could
Speaker 2: very easily beat any other package out there. Okay, I
Speaker 2: don't know that they would make the o'gillan available. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I think that should necessarily, But.
Speaker 1: That's the thing is that they I don't think they're
Speaker 1: gonna want to take the the future loss right on
Speaker 1: that in terms of of like what the model says about,
Speaker 1: there is.
Speaker 2: A lot of value in winning that division and getting
Speaker 2: the buye. Right, there's that, and they're the Yankees are
Speaker 2: red on their heels and that gives them, you know,
Speaker 2: then you go into the playoffs all of a sudden,
Speaker 2: Nick Martinez is your fourth starter instead of your third starter, right,
Speaker 2: and you've got you know, Rasmussen and well you Hope Planahan. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean they're never always healthy, but like that's the
Speaker 2: plan right School himself has been you have.
Speaker 1: If you have scooball, McClanahan and Rasmusen.
Speaker 2: That's that's yes, that's force.
Speaker 1: And and I think it's similar for Milwaukee. Milwaukee to
Speaker 1: me has a little more credibility on some of these swings. Right,
Speaker 1: we've seen them. It wasn't a deadline. But we've seen
Speaker 1: them acquire Christian.
Speaker 2: Yelichy we got to mention Cczabathia, which is now like
Speaker 2: seventeen years ago.
Speaker 1: Well okay, but they've done it, right, but Christian yelich Yeah, right,
Speaker 1: like they've taken this they it's it wasn't prospects, but
Speaker 1: they they went and got Lorenzo can right like they
Speaker 1: have done these.
Speaker 2: Kinds and again it's very short term money. They have
Speaker 2: a very deep farm system, right.
Speaker 1: That's that's made part of it to me is that
Speaker 1: they really have so much depth to potentially work with.
Speaker 1: They and if you can roll out Terrek Scuoble and
Speaker 1: Jacob Mazerowski in a playoff series, that is I will
Speaker 1: tell you I first read this stuff, like I first
Speaker 1: read Milwaukee's interest in this, and I thought, okay, sure,
Speaker 1: like they do their homework on everybody.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you're look if you were at Milwaukee.
Speaker 1: But but I I the thought, the intrusive thought of
Speaker 1: of Trek's school and Jacob Miseraski in a playoff series
Speaker 1: is Wow.
Speaker 2: This team has been generically good for ten years, has
Speaker 2: like nothing to show for it. At some point you
Speaker 2: gotta like, we're gonna try to fucking win the World
Speaker 2: Series this year, right at some.
Speaker 1: Point, so let me let me ask you. They'll put
Speaker 1: you on the spot. Yeah, but Milwaukee has I have
Speaker 1: the best system baseball something like that.
Speaker 2: I certainly again I have. Okay, I'm just starting to
Speaker 2: do off season with stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like sorry, I was just kind of gut feel
Speaker 1: all right.
Speaker 2: Top five, I'm a little I'm a little lower on
Speaker 2: someone like there are people that like Bishop Letson more
Speaker 2: than me. There's a couple of guys in that system
Speaker 2: like people like more than I do.
Speaker 1: Okay, So so let's say top five, they have a
Speaker 1: lot of pieces nearish the major league level, which is
Speaker 1: going to be attractive to Detroit. What what does a
Speaker 1: potential package that would interest Detroit look like?
Speaker 2: See, it's like Monday is not going to be available.
Speaker 1: In this No, it's not made. I think it's Logan Henderson. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like I don't think I think Paena is too
Speaker 2: much too Frankly, although I wouldn't be given the amount
Speaker 2: of infielders they have, I could see like maybe you
Speaker 2: do the this like the Dodgers outfielder equivalent, Like maybe
Speaker 2: you trade Mike schroeder Z I your hope for something
Speaker 2: that looks like less than present prospect value, just because
Speaker 2: you have so many outfits like you need to. I
Speaker 2: think Andrew Fisher would interest the Tigers. He's already end up.
Speaker 2: The contact rate scares the fuck out of me, but
Speaker 2: you know, he they need a third baseman. He can
Speaker 2: probably play there. He's hit thirty home runs already this season.
Speaker 2: Like the pole power is real. Like if you did
Speaker 2: Fisher in a couple of interesting arms and maybe Logan Henderson,
Speaker 2: you trade off the major league roster and you Loger Henson,
Speaker 2: Fisher and somebody else like an interesting Maybe it's Bishop Letson,
Speaker 2: it's one of their prep arms in the last couple
Speaker 2: of years, because the Tigers have done some interesting stuff
Speaker 2: on pitcher pitching dev recently. Or they might want to
Speaker 2: get their hands on one of those sort of metric
Speaker 2: darlings from.
Speaker 1: The Brewers, Raylan Payin.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean I would. I'm not huge on
Speaker 2: Braylen Payne, but I could see. Yeah. I'm just like
Speaker 2: he's fine. I'm just not He's.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I was just you know, I was looking at
Speaker 1: some of our top prospects from the last season. I
Speaker 1: know a bunch of changed, but he's got a ninety
Speaker 1: sixty oh and he's been very as a nineteen year old.
Speaker 2: Yeah right, I would Yeah again. I I think part
Speaker 2: of the problem is, like what what does Schooble end
Speaker 2: up going for? Like there has not been a rental
Speaker 2: ace trade in a while, so I don't like, obviously
Speaker 2: the Tigers need to beat the what the thirtieth overall
Speaker 2: pick in the draft or thereabouts. They'll do that easily.
Speaker 2: There are a number of guys that you could get
Speaker 2: that would beat that. But this trade specifically, there's the
Speaker 2: added e fact that you know they're going to be
Speaker 2: giving up implied playoff odds yeap when they make this trade.
Speaker 1: Too.
Speaker 2: There's all the fact that if they make this trade,
Speaker 2: I think you got to immediate, Like if you decide late,
Speaker 2: you've also got to probably ship labor Torres and Casey
Speaker 2: Eyes out immediately as well.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I don't think you can just trade Schooble. I think
Speaker 2: that's right, and there'll be interesting both of them obviously.
Speaker 1: Yeah, trade Casey the Phillies thing, yeah.
Speaker 2: God yeah, but just like what does and the thing
Speaker 2: is like you need more so than I think with
Speaker 2: some other trades. We're gonna see the deadline, and partly
Speaker 2: because it's Terrek Schouoble. You though, he's a rental. You're
Speaker 2: gonna have to get somebody back to sell to your fans, right,
Speaker 2: There's got to be a name they know or can
Speaker 2: easily look up and be like, we got that, And
Speaker 2: maybe that's Logan Henderson, right. Maybe it's maybe because Logan
Speaker 2: Henderson is a you. I like Logan Henderson. He's not
Speaker 2: Terig Scouable, but like you a face, yes, likenm but
Speaker 2: like you know, he is major league ready. He's in
Speaker 2: the majors literally right now. Probably they keep sending him
Speaker 2: back for I think he started for the recently though,
Speaker 2: So it's do you want that, do you? Or do
Speaker 2: you want a team that comes to the top prospect.
Speaker 2: You can say, you can point to any number of prospect.
Speaker 2: Let's say this guy is number twenty two on the
Speaker 2: pipeline or whatever if they never sighted us and I
Speaker 2: think they're required to site pipeline. But I mean like that,
Speaker 2: that's like the more traditional cell trade here. I'm very
Speaker 2: curious to see what if he gets traded, what he
Speaker 2: actually goes for, just to kind of an idea what
Speaker 2: the market is for this kind of I mean, we
Speaker 2: might not see another picture like this hit the deadline
Speaker 2: as a rental for another decade. But yeah, I mean.
Speaker 1: There's also they probably not gonna do it because they
Speaker 1: just called him up and he has a contract. But
Speaker 1: there's Luis Lara right.
Speaker 2: Like I could see I got honestly him flipping Lara
Speaker 2: a prot too and taking advantage of the you know,
Speaker 2: the built in surplus fague of the contract. Lara has
Speaker 2: been like Pratt hasn't been great. Lara has been fine
Speaker 2: for he's something. Yeah, I mean, look at he does
Speaker 2: that with that defense, and they're they're not playing him
Speaker 2: every day. They're platuning him a little bit because they
Speaker 2: platuned they saw a platoon everybody there.
Speaker 1: He's hitting three hundred or a four hundred on base. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's doing very well. It's not a ton of playing games.
Speaker 1: But like, yeah, I also just well just doing a
Speaker 1: little a little pr being the company man. Uh some
Speaker 1: Milwaukee names that that probably won't get traded in a
Speaker 1: deal like this, but you can read about on our
Speaker 1: electronic pages.
Speaker 3: J D.
Speaker 1: Thompson mm HM in our in our ten pack that
Speaker 1: is up on the site today and Blake Burke was
Speaker 1: the hitter of the weekend in the minor league.
Speaker 2: But they just have interesting guys, interesting guys.
Speaker 1: That's that's kind of sitting.
Speaker 2: For power this year now, that is healthy ish Again,
Speaker 2: I don't like it. I don't think Andrew. If you
Speaker 2: think Andrew Fisher's contact rate is bad, like they have type,
Speaker 2: like the birds have types obviously themselves.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Mark, I think Marco, I don't know how to
Speaker 1: say it.
Speaker 2: I like him a lot.
Speaker 1: He's interesting. I don't think the Tigers are going for
Speaker 1: another catch.
Speaker 2: He's also dhing more than he's catching right now, something
Speaker 2: they definitely is a way for saying, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: All right. Uh. Mason Miller also one of the headline
Speaker 1: names yeah. Also on our electronic pages today, Dan Epstein
Speaker 1: wrote about Mason Miller and his pursuit of potentially the
Speaker 1: lowest fifth season. He's chasing Craig kimberrel on there. You
Speaker 1: know the Padres in my head should absolutely trade Mason Miller.
Speaker 2: Seems to change every day games out of a play playoffs,
Speaker 2: The reporting every day seems to change on whether they
Speaker 2: are interested in trading Mason Miller or not, which I
Speaker 2: mean is fair if you're just calling a paydir prowler
Speaker 2: every day, you're probably getting a different answer.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Yeah, it's It's funny because the the the Padres
Speaker 3: play the Rockies and Giants the week before the deadline
Speaker 3: and then play for either playoff teams or playoff contender
Speaker 3: teams directly after the deadline, so they could be in
Speaker 3: a playoff spot and then and then just not Yeah,
Speaker 3: whatever it is.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't really have much more to you know,
Speaker 1: we talked about Miller last time. I will say I
Speaker 1: had to hear from from friend of the pod. Cassen
Speaker 1: noted White Sox fan that Mason Miller would be a
Speaker 1: multi year play for the White Sox, which is which
Speaker 1: is fine. I just think that the cost is going
Speaker 1: to be a lot for a release.
Speaker 2: I mean, it's a multi year play for the White
Speaker 2: Sox that he has years of control, but like the
Speaker 2: White Sox might just not be good next year.
Speaker 1: That's kind of right.
Speaker 3: And it's always gonna be hard trading Miller because the
Speaker 3: pott and this, it doesn't it's some cost fallacy, but
Speaker 3: the Potters paid so much familiar that when the return
Speaker 3: for Miller dons that end up comparing, it's gonna look bad.
Speaker 2: And it's gonna be it's not even gonna be not compared.
Speaker 2: It's not gonna within the contract off. He has a
Speaker 2: year less control, right right, it should be, it's going
Speaker 2: to be.
Speaker 3: It will bring attention to the fact that the Potters
Speaker 3: did not make you said that year.
Speaker 1: Sure, right, Yeah, I mean it's they they did this
Speaker 1: with Lon Soto.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the White Sox should trade for Mason Miller and
Speaker 2: stretch out Grant Taylor, but they would probably just put
Speaker 2: it in the bullpen too.
Speaker 1: Maybe they could start both of them.
Speaker 2: Jeff Y Sure, I know.
Speaker 1: We talked to about Hancock being available. Foster Griffin is
Speaker 1: drawing widespread attention in Washington. Sure, yeah, yeah, I imagine
Speaker 1: they'll be willing to trade. Why they're not out of it, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't think. I don't think they're gonna have tricked themselves. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it is the way I will put this, And I
Speaker 1: don't think it's a white flag situation.
Speaker 2: They should not trade him to the Phillies because in
Speaker 2: that stadium it might not go well for him.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, if the Phillies should not have that much interesting, yeah, he.
Speaker 2: Should, like he could be low key a raised guy.
Speaker 2: I can absolutely the raise like I mean talking to
Speaker 2: themselves into Foster Griffin as their Game three playoffs starter.
Speaker 1: Arizona is interested in an extension with Gabrielle Moreno.
Speaker 2: Sure, Okay, I don't like. Is Gabrielle Moreno good the
Speaker 2: most contentious threat in the history of forums, et cetera,
Speaker 2: et cetera.
Speaker 1: Yeah he is this year. Yeah, he's he's got seventy
Speaker 1: nine games this year, which he had ninety seven the
Speaker 1: year before. So he's playing a lot. He's having a
Speaker 1: phenomenal year. Yeah.
Speaker 2: And look he's he's legitimately improved his defense a lot too.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I guess I would say if I were Arizona,
Speaker 1: I really wish I would have signed him to an
Speaker 1: extension last year, last two years. Yeah. Yeah, not not
Speaker 1: off the because and it's and it's not really doubting
Speaker 1: his talent. I worry about the you know, just availability.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, he only has two seasons left now too
Speaker 2: of control past this one.
Speaker 1: So it does. And he's twenty six and a catcher,
Speaker 1: so the question is now he's athletic. Yep, they thought
Speaker 1: to play somewhere else.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the Jays were trying to do that when it
Speaker 2: was a prospect there because of how the question.
Speaker 1: To me is is how much? How many years are
Speaker 1: you buying?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 2: I mean, look, if you're if you might.
Speaker 1: Just be happy to have Gabriel Marino twenty eight season
Speaker 1: and yeah, and I.
Speaker 2: Think if you give him like good luck, probably I
Speaker 2: think you could give him like five, it's probably fine,
Speaker 2: mm hmm, like that Gus's thirty one and he's five,
Speaker 2: but that's a five turtle basically. But if you have
Speaker 2: him under control for this, yeah, and I think, like, look,
Speaker 2: because he's like, there's just he will be a very
Speaker 2: young catcher when he hits free agency, but like not
Speaker 2: very young, but he'll be young relative to like what
Speaker 2: you get for pre catchers.
Speaker 1: And nowhere into because he's barely on the field.
Speaker 2: Well, it's getting hurt. There's just a ceiling for these
Speaker 2: catcher contracts. Like if he plays it out and he's
Speaker 2: really good the next two years, which are both big ifts,
Speaker 2: like maybe he'll get maybe he'll get the JT real
Speaker 2: mode O deeal.
Speaker 1: But if you're if I'm if I'm one of these teams,
Speaker 1: that's a risk I'm willing to take. If he plays
Speaker 1: it out and it's really good the next two years,
Speaker 1: then I'm I'm found.
Speaker 2: It fine, but is that of Yeah? But is that
Speaker 2: a risk he wants to take? I guess it's there
Speaker 2: if he can get five and I don't know, he
Speaker 2: gets five and seventy right now from their five and sixty,
Speaker 2: do you just take it?
Speaker 1: Is it worth it for there's maybe five sixty that's
Speaker 1: that's pretty reasonable. Yeah, I don't know, but that.
Speaker 2: Seems light for Yeah, I don't like. But he else
Speaker 2: have done this for this one? Yeah?
Speaker 1: No, ye, but but he is above average. He hasn't
Speaker 1: done this, but he's.
Speaker 2: Been he's been above average. Yeah, so I And a
Speaker 2: lot of this to me looks like, without digging into
Speaker 2: it too close, looks like, you know, bad at ball stuff.
Speaker 1: But sure, sure, let's go to our first segment. We're
Speaker 1: gonna go around the horn. We'll try and be quick
Speaker 1: about it. Lance mccullor's acquired uh and d FA yep
Speaker 1: as as.
Speaker 2: We talked about, they paid four million dollars for Colton.
Speaker 1: Gordon Tanner, Colton Gordon whoever he is, yeah, uh, Colton
Speaker 1: Bryce Gordon. Ah, yes, he was the price here so
Speaker 1: to speak.
Speaker 3: You didn't even you know, he only threw four two
Speaker 3: thirds innings with the Rowers.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I think I watched some of them. He
Speaker 2: pitched in the series and there.
Speaker 1: You go, Jose Yourkiti acquired by the White Sox.
Speaker 3: Sure was yeah, I want.
Speaker 1: To I want to go back.
Speaker 2: I can just go to the next one.
Speaker 1: Fine, I didn't say, well, no. The only thing I
Speaker 1: will say on this is I said all leading up
Speaker 1: to this, this is gonna be a weird deadline. We're
Speaker 1: gonna see some weird trades like like the the Early
Speaker 1: and Mead One, and we're gonna see teams say here's
Speaker 1: some trash, and maybe that trash gonna be slightly less
Speaker 1: trash for us. That's what this is. Yeah, yeah, right,
Speaker 1: I agree. Shane Langleiers has torn his meniscus, possibly out
Speaker 1: for the season. I think it depends on whether he
Speaker 1: gets surgery for it, I guess. And and what I
Speaker 1: some of some of these been this uh tears aren't
Speaker 1: necessarily that long term a rehab.
Speaker 2: I mean, if you're Francisco Alvarez, you just come back
Speaker 2: from these things in like two weeks, but exactly.
Speaker 1: But but also if you're saying langladers during this season
Speaker 1: for the.
Speaker 2: Ages, yeah, you're not gonna and if you're the ages.
Speaker 1: Why would you push?
Speaker 2: Do you really want to come back for like one
Speaker 2: hundred and five degree Labor Day weekend game?
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just that grament. He is also Patrick. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna go to you on this one. Dallas.
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's not pitched this year.
Speaker 2: If you told me he hadn't pitched his twenty twenty two,
Speaker 2: I believe you. Probably.
Speaker 1: I just like who called whom? Yeah, yeah, yeah, get
Speaker 1: f him.
Speaker 3: He's thirty eight, like he hasn't been good in a decade, and.
Speaker 1: He's just good kid.
Speaker 2: They're probably about to go back to school. You want
Speaker 2: to get to the house a little bit. Fine, camp's over.
Speaker 1: You got to pick up a projects, right.
Speaker 3: He's doing the Clemens thing where it's like, you know,
Speaker 3: I just gotta keep myself, you know, keep myself ready
Speaker 3: and you don't need me for the You don't need
Speaker 3: me for April, you need me for October, which I
Speaker 3: don't think that, but that was the mentality, you know. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 3: kind of believe in.
Speaker 2: Yourself, Josh, Like you know, it hits some of those
Speaker 2: buffets in Vegas before they all close down.
Speaker 1: Josh Young lands on the I l it was bound
Speaker 1: to happen yeah, it happened. It's honestly, it's a big
Speaker 1: problem for Texas.
Speaker 3: It is.
Speaker 2: Josh Smith is now healthy.
Speaker 1: Yeah he.
Speaker 2: Is back for Josh.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Okay, Cody Bellinger to the I l be uh.
Speaker 2: Spencer Jones is back, but it's gonna be a lot
Speaker 2: of trank.
Speaker 1: Grisham honestly, and Trent Grisham has recovered from a really
Speaker 1: rough start.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean he's still he is essentially Transgressiam.
Speaker 1: Sure, but I'm just I yeah, fine, one Soto strains
Speaker 1: his calf. And if the Mets season wasn't dead already
Speaker 1: and it was, don't worry, boy, it's extra dead now.
Speaker 1: No comment from Jeffrey Well, I mean, what's to say
Speaker 1: it's not good? Uha is back, Yeah, good, good for Atlanta.
Speaker 2: For Atlanta, we'll see if you can stay on the
Speaker 2: field for the rest of the season, which would be
Speaker 2: helpful for them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we we have some slow newsweek we do.
Speaker 2: It wasn't quite enough for a whole you did.
Speaker 1: I didn't even so you didn't even put the thing
Speaker 1: that I said needed to be in here, which was
Speaker 1: speaking of the Mets. Zach Thornton has changed the spelling
Speaker 1: of his name from z.
Speaker 2: A C H to z A C Yeah, he said,
Speaker 2: no one ever asked. Like well, he like.
Speaker 1: Said, no one ever asked. And then he also said,
Speaker 1: I don't really know why the H needs to be there,
Speaker 1: and like because it's part of Zachary.
Speaker 2: I mean, like, I guess it doesn't doesn't.
Speaker 3: Like you could you could tear out a lot of
Speaker 3: owels by that same logic. Yeah, they're just in between
Speaker 3: the concepts.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, and every app would tell you, yeah, we understand,
Speaker 1: we're going.
Speaker 2: We're going Welsh mode.
Speaker 1: The app of Zach would just be z C K.
Speaker 1: I think, yeah, yeah, yeah, So he is now one
Speaker 1: of you know, he and Zach Allen are now brothers
Speaker 1: in Zach. He and Zach Britain are brothers in changing
Speaker 1: the spelling of the right. Zach Britton went to c K,
Speaker 1: this is about efficiency for Zach Thornton. Yes, I gotta
Speaker 1: tell you, I just z A C.
Speaker 2: It's it's it's like it's very zoomor it's fine. You
Speaker 2: don't have to understand it.
Speaker 3: Uh.
Speaker 1: The Richmond Flying Squirrels had had fireworks and and fire yeah,
Speaker 1: like on the life should have I believe friend of
Speaker 1: the podcast, Zach Kreser speaking of Zach's was it was
Speaker 1: in present? Was present for this game? I should say,
Speaker 1: so I am.
Speaker 2: I am both with the sheer number of minor league
Speaker 2: fireworks nights night, every Friday home sometimes Thursday and Saturday
Speaker 2: too for some of the Yeah, I'm surprised it hasn't
Speaker 2: happened more often, but also I feel like it shouldn't
Speaker 2: happen because you should have people that know what they're
Speaker 2: doing with fireworks.
Speaker 1: I would. I would also tell you normally they do.
Speaker 1: Having having spent a summer at a very generic, arguably
Speaker 1: low end like minor League. I was at Potomac, which
Speaker 1: no longer exists anymore, and like every Friday home game,
Speaker 1: they would do fireworks, and honestly, they were like nice,
Speaker 1: it was a nice little fireworks show. And and they
Speaker 1: seem to know what they're doing. So I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't I don't know what happened, but I encourage
Speaker 1: people to go seek out the video. And lastly, this
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say for four words that I don't understand. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this means nothing to me. Everyone. Yeah, but I'm going
Speaker 1: to read the teleprompter. So doctor Robbie bobble headlines.
Speaker 2: So the the Pittsburgh Pirates did a given.
Speaker 1: I have not watched O now now I am gave away.
Speaker 2: A doctor Robbie bobblehead on Saturday, I think. And the
Speaker 2: line for it before gates open stretched across the bridge.
Speaker 3: Wow.
Speaker 2: Yeah, people like people.
Speaker 1: Like Wiley, absolutely likable guy.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that takes us to our game, and it
Speaker 3: takes us roight Am continues our bibblehead theme. Uh so
Speaker 3: this game is a reader submitted listen always say reader submitted.
Speaker 1: I don't know why I read this site too.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know it's a listener submitted game by Joel Fowler.
Speaker 3: Thank you, Joel. What is where you're going to do
Speaker 3: some prices? Right? Is about some bubbleheaded prices?
Speaker 1: eBay?
Speaker 3: I assume, I assume. Let's see the whole There are
Speaker 3: no no these are on These are all on store
Speaker 3: dot bobblehead haul dot com. Sure which is if I
Speaker 3: click on one of these? Is this the Hall of Fame?
Speaker 3: It is the Bubblehead Hall of Fame? Okay, you can
Speaker 3: buy This is not the Hall of Fame, bubble This
Speaker 3: is the Bobblehead Hall of Fame. Where is the Bobblehead
Speaker 3: Hall of Fame located? You might wonder. I will to
Speaker 3: wonder that as well. It is founded in twenty fourteen
Speaker 3: in Milwaukee, Wisconsin.
Speaker 1: Makes sense, it's producing some guys.
Speaker 3: No, it's a store. This is one of those new
Speaker 3: it's just a store.
Speaker 2: I'm just saying every store and exit through the gift shop.
Speaker 1: You could convince me the Bobblehead Hall of Fame was
Speaker 1: like some guys finished basement. Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Stores become the source for bibblehead collectors. We have for
Speaker 3: bubble head products produced by the National Bobblehead Hall of
Speaker 3: Fame and musing Foco fun Co. But Royal Bobbles they don't.
Speaker 1: Sell their It's funk Go Bobblehead they too.
Speaker 3: I'm sure why not. I mean it's it's like it
Speaker 3: distorts the.
Speaker 1: I don't understand the whole photo.
Speaker 2: All these limited edition runs, two of like fifty of
Speaker 2: some guy that called up here.
Speaker 1: This is gonna be wrong, this is gonna be rough.
Speaker 3: Okay, So let's go ahead, get started. Of course, the
Speaker 3: word in the score are you playing? No? I I
Speaker 3: opened it to make sure everything. No, I didn't know
Speaker 3: if he if he he did, he did hide it,
Speaker 3: but I had opened it to so sorry. All right,
Speaker 3: So we're gonna start with a Kyle Wright Atlanta Braves
Speaker 3: twenty game winner twenty game winner club MLB Baseball bobblehead.
Speaker 3: How much do you think it costs?
Speaker 1: I should I? This is not I need like a
Speaker 1: baseline like I have.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm going to get right now on the Kyle right.
Speaker 3: I will tell that as a baseline, the average of
Speaker 3: most of these, not all of them, the average, the
Speaker 3: average for your standard twelve inch bobbleheads are about eighty bucks.
Speaker 2: That's what I would have guessed.
Speaker 1: So I'm going to tell you my price point was
Speaker 1: way lower.
Speaker 2: I will say sixty five, because sixty five, Craig.
Speaker 1: Kyle, you don't know how badly I want to say,
Speaker 1: like fifteen bucks, like and not imagine someone partying even
Speaker 1: for a store. I'm I'm gonna say fifty. I'm gonna
Speaker 1: be wrong, and I'm just I cannot.
Speaker 3: Okay uh A show Hey Otani An Aaron Judge Los
Speaker 3: Angeles Dodgers New York Yankees Home World Series eighteen inch
Speaker 3: Dual Battle MLB Baseball bobblehead that's too.
Speaker 2: Big is a very eighteen inch, very big bottle, and
Speaker 2: I will open it up and describe it to you
Speaker 2: a little bit.
Speaker 3: The two of them are facing each other. They are
Speaker 3: on a base that is an entire stadium. It says
Speaker 3: Base of the Titans or Bash of the Titans.
Speaker 2: It's not are like five to seven inches?
Speaker 1: Yes, the average price for the twelve inch didn't you? Yes?
Speaker 3: The twelve inch? Well, I'm guessing twelve. I guess whatever
Speaker 3: is that?
Speaker 2: Craig is like furiously doing I have a right now.
Speaker 3: I'm not good at enough.
Speaker 2: I would say one hundred and fifty dollars.
Speaker 3: Okay, one hundred and fifty dollars.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say two hundred and fifty.
Speaker 3: Dollars, two hundred and fifty dollars.
Speaker 1: I have also, Also, I have no fucking idea.
Speaker 3: Here we go. This is one I could have gone.
Speaker 3: A Mariner moose Seattle Mariners twenty twenty three MLB All
Speaker 3: Star Big Ticket eighteen inch.
Speaker 2: Bobblehead eighteen inch moose bobble.
Speaker 3: Yeah, my boy, looking at this the moose is I mean,
Speaker 3: it's from the All Star Game. Also, this moose is
Speaker 3: highly bowl Winkle coded. It looks more like Bowinkle than
Speaker 3: the Mariner moose usually looks like. For the kids at home.
Speaker 3: Bowlinkle was a cartoon fifty years before you were born.
Speaker 3: A smile on.
Speaker 2: This is one hundred dollars.
Speaker 3: One hundred dollars.
Speaker 2: I feel like the mascots are usually less.
Speaker 1: This is killing me. This, this is killing me.
Speaker 2: Craig. You don't have to spend as much time on
Speaker 2: it as you are. You're doing it to yourself.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know. I'm gonna say one hundred and twenty five.
Speaker 3: One hundred and twenty five. Okay, all right, next one.
Speaker 1: I'm so lost to you guys.
Speaker 3: And Austin Jackson Cleveland Indians catch bobblehead. I don't know
Speaker 3: what year this is from. I don't remember when Austin
Speaker 3: Jackson played for the Cleveland for the ball club. I
Speaker 3: do not remember. Oh okay, I have to remember twenty
Speaker 3: catch now because it happened. I believe it was against
Speaker 3: the Red Sox. I do remember this catch. He fell
Speaker 3: over the wall into the U into the dugout for this.
Speaker 3: It was on August Firs.
Speaker 2: Davis ones like these. I think.
Speaker 3: It comes with a wall attached. How what size it is?
Speaker 3: A normal sized one?
Speaker 2: Okay, fifty five dollars, fifty five dollars.
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna go with the average.
Speaker 2: Weston Jackson.
Speaker 1: I have no idea. You know you're right. You're right.
Speaker 1: There's a bad call.
Speaker 2: I guess you can't be that far off. Theoretically it
Speaker 2: could be more.
Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, Next one, the missus met New York
Speaker 3: Mets birthday and will be baseball bobblehead. She is, uh,
Speaker 3: it's it's a.
Speaker 2: Fairly she's coming out of a cake like Marilyn Monroe.
Speaker 3: No, she's sitting on a couch throne with golden balloons
Speaker 3: around her and a sparkly bow and a crown a
Speaker 3: tr I.
Speaker 2: Guess said it was eighteen inches.
Speaker 3: She does not look right.
Speaker 2: Wow, you would think you can take.
Speaker 3: This is enormous. I will tell you when they're not.
Speaker 3: I think the rest of them are normal size. Okay,
Speaker 3: seventy I will I will show a picture of this
Speaker 3: in the chat.
Speaker 2: Boll are weird about missus Matt. I'm gonna say seven.
Speaker 3: People are weird about missus Matt. How much did you say?
Speaker 2: Seventy five?
Speaker 1: Look, I'm there's no internal consistency anyway. I was trying
Speaker 1: to keep a notepad so I could have some internal consistency,
Speaker 1: and I've lost it. I mean, so I think I'm
Speaker 1: gonna say think I will.
Speaker 2: You know what the actual problem is here with this
Speaker 2: because it's a bobblehead. The proportions are wrong because they
Speaker 2: she's a huge baseball head. Normally it looks really like
Speaker 2: you're shrinking the head. Yeah, it's like a normal bobblehead.
Speaker 2: The person's head is back. Yeah, that's what's throwing you off.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it is throwing you offfty bucks, all right. Next one,
Speaker 3: a ben Zoe brist Eureka High School bobblehead.
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, what.
Speaker 2: Is that? That's where he went down?
Speaker 3: It is sure, sure from Usaka High School. They made
Speaker 3: a bobblehead commemorating that he was the star of his
Speaker 3: high school baseball.
Speaker 1: Okay, so is this from the high school? I'm why
Speaker 1: it's in the bobblehead Hall of Fame.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm assuming this is when they made themselves because
Speaker 3: they thought it would sell.
Speaker 2: Is he from like Wisconsin? I don't think he is.
Speaker 3: I don't. Yeah, there's a lot of Erika high schools
Speaker 3: out there.
Speaker 2: Said one hundred dollars. It's weird. Wow, it's rare and weird.
Speaker 2: I don't know why people, I don't why I bobbleheads
Speaker 2: on people.
Speaker 1: Bobbleheads thirty five dollars.
Speaker 3: Thirty five dollars. Okay, we're gonna do that.
Speaker 1: You've never seen someone do this bad as a game
Speaker 1: and at a game, And and that includes my performance
Speaker 1: from a couple of pods ago that I got contacted
Speaker 1: by multiple people about.
Speaker 3: We're gonna do two more.
Speaker 1: I think how many more are there?
Speaker 3: And there's there's more than two. Next one is an
Speaker 3: Alec Manoa Toronto Blue Jays game breaker bobblehead. I don't
Speaker 3: know what game breaker means. It's just Alec Manoa standing there. Yeah, well,
Speaker 3: and it's what. Yeah, he's here. He's just saying, he's
Speaker 3: just getting there. He's looking at I would say, yeah,
Speaker 3: it's got the glove up, he's getting he's happy, he's whatever,
Speaker 3: the call is, the catcher, he is satisfied with whatever,
Speaker 3: he's whatever.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, he's he's like. They just like, yeah, that's
Speaker 2: very nice. It's got like the Nathan Fielder. The catcher
Speaker 2: is just out of frame.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm just sixty ft out of frame. Yeah, I'm
Speaker 3: gonna do thirty five dollars again, thirty five dollars. All right,
Speaker 3: Jeff thirty.
Speaker 1: Five dollars says this is utterly worthless to me. That's
Speaker 1: what I mean.
Speaker 3: He had that good year with the Blue Chase, haven't
Speaker 3: she said?
Speaker 2: Seventy bucks?
Speaker 1: But this isn't like what it costs like a peak price, right,
Speaker 1: this is like the peak Now.
Speaker 2: I think it's like half as much as.
Speaker 3: On the store at the moment.
Speaker 1: But yeah, well, I look, I did bad on Austin Jackson.
Speaker 3: Sure, all right, and the last one, and uh, what
Speaker 3: a what a good one? Man on it's a doctor
Speaker 3: Fauci Washington Nationals. For first, here's your picture. He is,
Speaker 3: in fact wearing a mask. He appears to be pitching
Speaker 3: at a plate that is forty or fifty feet off
Speaker 3: the ground.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, he is.
Speaker 3: He is looking up into the right of where he
Speaker 3: is purportedly aiming. It's a weird that's a weird one.
Speaker 1: I cannot imagine money exchange.
Speaker 2: I will, I will, I will pull a krag and
Speaker 2: go exactly with the average and say eighty.
Speaker 1: Dollars eighty bucks, all right, Craig, Honestly, I might just
Speaker 1: have to say the same thing. I have no idea.
Speaker 1: I cannot imagine money being exchange for this.
Speaker 3: Okay, all right, yeah, all right, okay, So we're gonna
Speaker 3: stop there, and Craig is the winner?
Speaker 1: What is it? Just and Judge?
Speaker 3: That was the big one.
Speaker 1: That's the all the want I felt remotely okay about.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you were you were the closest on uh one
Speaker 3: of the people just front. So we'll start with the
Speaker 3: Kyle right when that was seventy so Jeff was very
Speaker 3: close to sixty five. Uh, the Shan the Tommy Judge
Speaker 3: one was one thousand dollars. So Craig, you've got one
Speaker 3: hundred point of damage there.
Speaker 2: I mean, when you think about it, it's basically on
Speaker 2: a table in your living room. It's basically like, you.
Speaker 3: Know, yeah, that is a conversation piece. Very upsetting to
Speaker 3: me is that the moose is eight hundred dollars. Whoa
Speaker 3: eight hundred dollars?
Speaker 1: I I you know, so I felt bad about that,
Speaker 1: but I also like where I really felt.
Speaker 2: I by twenty five bucks, I said one hundred.
Speaker 1: Yeah it was was, I said, miss one hundred twenty
Speaker 1: five and then I said, missus Matt nothing but like
Speaker 1: I thought, the All Star Game, miss of it is
Speaker 1: like some reason eight hundred.
Speaker 4: Imagine imagine having eight hundred dollars and being like instead
Speaker 4: of having this, I'd rather have this plastic.
Speaker 2: It doesn't even look like particularly, it does not look
Speaker 2: like off brand. It does not look like this is
Speaker 2: like I don't know, I don't think jay Ward Productions
Speaker 2: could sustain a lawsuit here, But it's.
Speaker 1: What is this pose he's doing? Yeah? Yeah, he's like, like,
Speaker 1: what's going on with the shoulder hip separation going on
Speaker 1: in this? From this? And like he's insane.
Speaker 2: They really needed to like color the moose's feet too, because.
Speaker 1: I will post like what is the post? He's got
Speaker 1: a glove on his left hand. Has he just thrown
Speaker 1: a pitch? What's happened?
Speaker 3: No, he's strutting. What am I look strutting? And he's like,
Speaker 3: oh hey.
Speaker 2: The proportions he already for a maskoything. It also like
Speaker 2: one of the like nineteenth century gloves they like there's
Speaker 2: no like articulation or design on the glove.
Speaker 3: No, it is it looks like he did It looks
Speaker 3: like he was born with one on the actually look like.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't take eight hundred cents for.
Speaker 2: This, Okay, I guess he doesn't have like like like
Speaker 2: different colored hooves.
Speaker 3: Yeah, which is weird, but.
Speaker 2: It still looks it makes it look weird. When you're
Speaker 2: just like, I got his feet like splay up like that.
Speaker 3: If you guys, at least not if you're listening to
Speaker 3: this at home and you need to see what this
Speaker 3: looks like, join the discord, will I will.
Speaker 2: I'm not entirely sure which direction the theaters posts are
Speaker 2: going either, which is very discount Look at.
Speaker 1: His waist they're going. Yeah, I agree, Well, I was
Speaker 1: very disoriented at but they already.
Speaker 2: They both wearing shorts.
Speaker 1: Why is he wearing shorts? Is short? I guess he is.
Speaker 1: He's not a glove on. Why is he wearing the.
Speaker 2: Thoughts were those shorts? Remember in the seventies.
Speaker 3: This is the Mariners.
Speaker 2: I also, like, I was concerned until I saw the
Speaker 2: belt that he was like Donald Duck in it. Like,
Speaker 2: I gotta go back to the feet for a second,
Speaker 2: because it like looks like hooves or regular feet.
Speaker 1: No, Like he's just.
Speaker 3: Standing like he's.
Speaker 2: Got a heel down and he's kind of up on
Speaker 2: his toes.
Speaker 3: He's on one knee, the other one he's trying to
Speaker 3: put his weight on a snapped ankle.
Speaker 1: One heel is extremely I mean, like your foot shouldn't
Speaker 1: bend like that.
Speaker 5: Yeah, eight hundred dollars, eight hundred dollars, eight American dollars.
Speaker 5: I just like, think of the number of people you
Speaker 5: could feed.
Speaker 1: I think if you if you buy that and put
Speaker 1: that on your end, on the end of your table
Speaker 1: and with a price tag. Now you've got a conversation starter.
Speaker 3: All right, Yeah, moving on, moving on. So Craig took
Speaker 3: on that one by twenty five bucks. Austin Jackson's catch
Speaker 3: is only forty dollars, So Jeff wins that one. But
Speaker 3: you know you lost forty on.
Speaker 1: That right, Okay, that's fine.
Speaker 3: That was a delta twenty five against you. Would you
Speaker 3: just you gave back your moose winnings? Okay, but it
Speaker 3: didn't matter because going up one hundred on the on
Speaker 3: the ati, I think was all that was the difference.
Speaker 3: Missus Mitt was eighty, so Jeff was very close. Seventy five.
Speaker 3: Craig said, fifty the ben Zoe Brist jersey, this one.
Speaker 1: I thought this one might might kill me.
Speaker 3: Twenty five dollars.
Speaker 1: Oh oh, I made it back.
Speaker 3: It makes one. Yeah, you made it back on that
Speaker 3: one easily. Also, like if you're selling a ben Zoebrist
Speaker 3: high school bobble head for twenty five dollars. Why did
Speaker 3: you make a ben Zoe brist High School at that's right,
Speaker 3: I don't know the Alec Minoan. You guys almost perfectly
Speaker 3: split the difference. It was fifty two, so Craig was
Speaker 3: seventeen hundred, jeff Jeffrey was eighteen over. Okay, so good job.
Speaker 1: Tying on that.
Speaker 3: And then finally the doctor fauci one is forty bucks,
Speaker 3: so you guys were both over by right. We bet
Speaker 3: you two. So congratulations to Craig. As a wow. You
Speaker 3: have to go out and buy one of those. You
Speaker 3: can just do it right now, and you need to
Speaker 3: put it on your next time you do like some
Speaker 3: next send me to TV next time, I will be
Speaker 3: network has you on? You need to have the you
Speaker 3: need to have the moose in the background.
Speaker 1: I can't just wait. I cannot afford the moose. If
Speaker 1: it was like eighty bucks as a gag gift, I might,
Speaker 1: I might. I don't. I would be really unhappy, but
Speaker 1: I would be happy about the gag. I eight hundred,
Speaker 1: My god, if I.
Speaker 3: Saw that in the threat store for eight I would
Speaker 3: I don't get it.
Speaker 1: I don't, I really don't. I would not want I
Speaker 1: would not pay eight. Yeah, I mean I say I
Speaker 1: would not. I just said I might do it, but
Speaker 1: like only as a gag. I mean you could buy
Speaker 1: it for eight tell people, Jeff, Jeff No.
Speaker 2: I told her was eight hundred dollars. In her response was, no,
Speaker 2: one has that much money, not.
Speaker 1: For that eight people.
Speaker 3: Eight people have that much money and they have enough
Speaker 3: money to buy eight hundred of them.
Speaker 1: All right, Well, thank you very much, thank you for
Speaker 1: the game.
Speaker 3: Thank you to both of you for participating in it
Speaker 3: because you were obligated too.
Speaker 1: And thank you to our listeners for joining us on
Speaker 1: another episode of five and Dive brought to you by
Speaker 1: the Baseball Perspectives podcast Network. You can get a tough
Speaker 1: show at five and Dive at Baseball perspectives dot com.
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