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<v Speaker 1>Okay, we are alive. How does William Ramsey. Welcome to

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<v Speaker 1>William Ramsey Investigates on today's show have a very special guest,

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<v Speaker 1>returning guest. His name is hands Shaan's last name is

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<v Speaker 1>spelled sh a and t z. And this will be

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<v Speaker 1>our third show. We've done a show about just about

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<v Speaker 1>two months ago. We covered his book, which I highly recommend.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a new book. It's titled The Wives of Heart

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<v Speaker 1>Modern Day Reimagining of the Scopes Monkey Trial. And then

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<v Speaker 1>we also did a part one. This will be a

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<v Speaker 1>part two and it's been titled on this talk which

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<v Speaker 1>you will see the presentation and the slides if you're

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<v Speaker 1>watching this on Rock Fann, Rumble or X. It's titled

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<v Speaker 1>Einstein Relativity in Modern Physics and just kind of I

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<v Speaker 1>think we covered a number of topics in the last

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<v Speaker 1>one Relativity. We talked about this some of these slides,

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<v Speaker 1>the theory of relativity. I can't say I'm a physics

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<v Speaker 1>expert by any stretch of the imagination, but that's why

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<v Speaker 1>he's here. But we talked about kind of kind of

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<v Speaker 1>goes into the politicization of a lot of stuff. Everything

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<v Speaker 1>seems to be political anyway. These days. We talked about

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<v Speaker 1>Einstein coming to America, the eclipse of nineteen nineteen, kind

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<v Speaker 1>of the foundations of gerald general relativity, and also there's

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<v Speaker 1>a lot to talk about and some interesting questions. I

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<v Speaker 1>remember from our conversation that we add in May about

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<v Speaker 1>how it's interesting that Einstein wasn't invited onto the Manhattan

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<v Speaker 1>I'm sorry. Hans has also two websites. Let me see.

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<v Speaker 1>Like we have his substack which is at athers are.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a E. T. H. E. R Czar dot substack

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<v Speaker 1>dot com. You can see all this information on there.

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<v Speaker 1>And then also there is athersr dot com, which is

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<v Speaker 1>his website. You'll see his fiction books here too, The

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<v Speaker 1>Hidden True Truth one call mentor Kenholders said the best

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<v Speaker 1>science fiction techno thriller since whatever Neil Stevenston. Stephenston's last

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<v Speaker 1>book was, so you can check those out. And he

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<v Speaker 1>also goes into ultra wide I think one of his

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<v Speaker 1>books was The Art and Science of Ultra wide Band Antennas.

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<v Speaker 1>Pretty technical stuff, but you can see some of his

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<v Speaker 1>books on Amazon. But hopefully we'll get the technical stuff

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<v Speaker 1>figured out. Welcome everybody, hoping you're having a late an

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<v Speaker 1>okay time considering world events, pretty strange days. Indeed, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>we talked about this last time of the last show

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<v Speaker 1>we did was April twenty second, twenty twenty five. No,

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<v Speaker 1>that was the first one we did, The Wiser Heart,

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<v Speaker 1>and then May twenty first. It's the first part of this.

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<v Speaker 1>The Zionis clash was inevitable. I mean, this is present

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<v Speaker 1>stuff like Zionism. He was one resulting from differences and standards.

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<v Speaker 1>The Easterners, like many Russian Jews in this country, don't

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<v Speaker 1>know what honesty is, and we simply won't entrust our

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<v Speaker 1>money to them. Whitesman does not know what honesty is,

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<v Speaker 1>but weekly yields to his numerous Russian associates. That's the split.

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<v Speaker 1>Einstein to Frankfurter, a Jewish weakness, always and eagerly to

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<v Speaker 1>try to keep the gentiles in good humor. Establishment Jewish

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<v Speaker 1>press motivated to focus on Einstein to distract from Zionis.

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<v Speaker 1>So Zionist Organization of America sided with Weitzman. Hello, welcome back.

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<v Speaker 2>I can finally hear you.

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<v Speaker 1>It's not your fault. There's something going on with Streamyard.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know what it is. It's not stable. It's

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<v Speaker 1>not stable.

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<v Speaker 2>Everything was going fine, and then it just all the

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<v Speaker 2>sounds stopped.

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<v Speaker 1>The last show did that exact same thing to me,

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<v Speaker 1>Like literally mid show, I had to have a buddy

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<v Speaker 1>of mine read like host it. He was my guest,

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<v Speaker 1>and he flipped into others. So that's not your fault. Anyway.

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<v Speaker 1>I was just kind of reading through these slides we went,

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<v Speaker 1>I did a long background again, and we're back to

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<v Speaker 1>Einstein comes to America. So I kind of just read

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<v Speaker 1>this and just showed that there was a kind of

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<v Speaker 1>propaganda or pr campaign about him, and then moved on

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<v Speaker 1>to this once. So if you're ready, we can just

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<v Speaker 1>take it from here. If that's okay, sure, I'll take

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<v Speaker 1>it from here and i'll edit it. I'll edit this

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<v Speaker 1>for the listeners on the live stream, I'll edit it

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<v Speaker 1>out and put out the full audio with that five

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<v Speaker 1>minutes missing. I could have restopped. I could have stopped

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<v Speaker 1>the stream, but it would have been a real difficulty

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<v Speaker 1>to reset it back up and redo it. So I

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<v Speaker 1>apologize to everybody I've had problems with stream yard. If

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<v Speaker 1>you listen to my show regularly, you'll know I'm just

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<v Speaker 1>having a real, a real hard time. So anyway, Han's

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<v Speaker 1>welcome back. So I apologized for that well, thank you again.

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<v Speaker 2>I appreciate the opportunity to speak with you and with

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<v Speaker 2>your audience. Where we left off last time, we were

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<v Speaker 2>talking about Einstein's unprecedented publicity on his trip to America

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<v Speaker 2>and some of the factors behind it. One of those

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<v Speaker 2>factors was rivalry among various groups within the American Jewish community.

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<v Speaker 2>There were newly arrived Eastern European and Russian Jews who

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<v Speaker 2>were on board with the Zionist program. That Einstein was

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<v Speaker 2>there raising funds with heim Weitzmann, the head of the

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<v Speaker 2>World Zionist Organization, ultimately the first President of Israel, and

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<v Speaker 2>they were not looked upon with favor by some in

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<v Speaker 2>the establishment American Jewish community, and that ironically led to

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<v Speaker 2>more publicity for Einstein because the establishment Jewish press emphasized

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<v Speaker 2>the Einstein aspect of the tour by way of distracting

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<v Speaker 2>from the Zionist fundraising. Got so next, let's go. And

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<v Speaker 2>you know, that was no doubt frustrating for the American

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<v Speaker 2>establishment Jewish community, but Einstein was also a frustration for

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<v Speaker 2>heim Weitzman and the Zionist organization. Einstein's friend Blumenfelt warned

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<v Speaker 2>Weisman before the trip that Einstein was not really a Zionist,

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<v Speaker 2>intended to say things that perhaps he shouldn't. He also

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<v Speaker 2>argued that the Zionists should work harder to make peace

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<v Speaker 2>with their Arab neighbors, and Weisman in turn said that

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<v Speaker 2>Einstein was a prima donnin about to lose her voice.

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<v Speaker 2>The tension continued when Israel had its war for independence

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<v Speaker 2>in nineteen forty eight, Einstein signed on a letter criticizing Herout,

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<v Speaker 2>which is a right wing political party that ended up

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<v Speaker 2>being absorbed into the Laikud party. But ultimately, I guess

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<v Speaker 2>there were no hard feelings because a few years later

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<v Speaker 2>he was offered the position of President of Israel, which

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<v Speaker 2>he declined. Next. So, just summarizing what Einstein the facts

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<v Speaker 2>around Einstein's publicity tour in America, it was clearly a

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<v Speaker 2>kind of events and circumstances publicity campaign where we got

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<v Speaker 2>to see, you know, the huge crowds that came out

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<v Speaker 2>to see Weismann and the Zionist Party, but were interpreted

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<v Speaker 2>as crowds for Einstein. But you know, even though you

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<v Speaker 2>know there was the massive crowds, Einstein really contributed to

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<v Speaker 2>that through his charisma, his appeal. He made a favorable

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<v Speaker 2>impression on reporters and the alignment with the Zeitgeist. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>the notion that relativity proved that truths were no longer

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<v Speaker 2>absolute contributed to the cultural acceptance of relativity theory. Well,

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<v Speaker 2>this brings us to an interesting question that needs to

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<v Speaker 2>be tackled with some sensitivity. But it's a very important

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<v Speaker 2>topic for understanding than narrative underlying the history of science,

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<v Speaker 2>and of course had very significant influence on world history.

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<v Speaker 2>And that's the conflict between Jewish physicists and the advocates

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<v Speaker 2>of what was called Deutsche physics or German physics in

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<v Speaker 2>the Weimar years and then after the Nazis took over.

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<v Speaker 2>And it's also important to look at what was going

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<v Speaker 2>on and try to set aside our modern day sensibilities,

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<v Speaker 2>because people at the time had views that we today,

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<v Speaker 2>with our modern perspectives, would regard as being blatantly racist

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<v Speaker 2>and anti Semitic. In fact, one very prominent German physicist

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<v Speaker 2>declared that Jews are a group of people unto themselves,

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<v Speaker 2>that their Jewishness is visible in their physical appearance, that

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<v Speaker 2>they noticed their Jewish heritage and their intellectual works, and

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<v Speaker 2>they have the same way of thinking and a feeling

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<v Speaker 2>now that physicist. The next slide was Albert Einstein himself

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<v Speaker 2>in a pamphlet on anti Semitism that he published in

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen eighteen. Next, so, if we want to ask what

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<v Speaker 2>Jewish physics is and see just analyze for a moment

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<v Speaker 2>Einstein's argument that there is such a thing and that

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<v Speaker 2>it's of significance. One of the first ways we could

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<v Speaker 2>approach it is to speculate that, well, perhaps Jewish physics

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<v Speaker 2>is just what you get when Jewish physicists do physics

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<v Speaker 2>for relativity. It's hard to advance that because it was

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<v Speaker 2>clearly a mix of Jews and non Jews who contributed relativity.

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<v Speaker 2>Now Einstein certainly had the leading voice in what became

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<v Speaker 2>the modern theory of relativity, it was definitely a mixture.

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<v Speaker 2>And even if we look at quantum mechanics, while Neils Borr,

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<v Speaker 2>who was one of the pioneers, had a Jewish mother,

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<v Speaker 2>if we go to the next slide, Berner Heisenberg really

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<v Speaker 2>was the founder of the new theory. According to Einstein's

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<v Speaker 2>friend Max Born Now, he was in a youth group,

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<v Speaker 2>the White Knights, that got absorbed into the Hitler youth.

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<v Speaker 2>Heisenberg contributed or participated in one of the paramilitary organizations

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<v Speaker 2>that helped overthrow the Bavarian Socialist Republic, and he was

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<v Speaker 2>trusted enough to be head of the German atomic weapons

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<v Speaker 2>development program, so it's hard to make a case for

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<v Speaker 2>him as being a Jewish physicist. Next, and also, Heisenberg

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<v Speaker 2>wasn't alone in creating quantum mechanics. Now, some have criticized

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<v Speaker 2>quantum mechanics as the quintessential sort of Jewish science, formalistic

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<v Speaker 2>removed from observation, entirely concerned with symbol manipulation, but it

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<v Speaker 2>was completed by Einstein's Jewish friend Max Born, and by

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<v Speaker 2>Pasqual Jordan. Fact that his contribution was so significant, Einstein

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<v Speaker 2>proposed that Heisenberg, Born, and Jordan should share a Nobel

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<v Speaker 2>prize for their contributions. But Pascal Jordan, at the same

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<v Speaker 2>time he was working on quantum mechanics, was actually contributing

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<v Speaker 2>to nationalist magazines in by Our Germany like Blutenboten, Blood

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<v Speaker 2>and Soil under a pseudonym and writing relatively extreme nationalist

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<v Speaker 2>or right wing essays next, So clearly it was a

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<v Speaker 2>mix of Jewish and non Jewish contributors responsible for quantum mechanics.

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<v Speaker 2>So to uphold the argument that anyone who supported quantum

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<v Speaker 2>mechanics had to be Jewish. Heisenberg's opponents coined the term

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<v Speaker 2>a white Jew to describe someone who may not be

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<v Speaker 2>ethnically or racially Jewish, but was upholding Jewish ideas like

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<v Speaker 2>quantum mechanics was supposed to be. Now. Ironically, Heisenberg's mother

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<v Speaker 2>was also friends with the mother of Heinrich Himmler, who

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<v Speaker 2>was the head of the Gestapo, and Heisenberg's mom got

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<v Speaker 2>together with Himmler's mom and persuaded her to talk to

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<v Speaker 2>her son Heinrich about getting his people to lay off

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<v Speaker 2>her son, and was successful in that. After Himmler did

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<v Speaker 2>his own investigation, he concluded, I believe Heisenberg is a

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<v Speaker 2>decent person, and we cannot afford to lose or kill

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<v Speaker 2>this man, who is relatively young and can educate a

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<v Speaker 2>new generation next.

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<v Speaker 1>Now.

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<v Speaker 2>These attitudes that Einstein had were shared by many of

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<v Speaker 2>his non Jewish colleagues, like for instance, Somerfeld wrote to Lorentz,

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<v Speaker 2>who came up with the Lorentz transforms that are key

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<v Speaker 2>to relativity, and Somerfeld wrote that as ingenious as Einstein's

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<v Speaker 2>approach to special relativity is it seems to me there's

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<v Speaker 2>something almost unhealthy in their non constructive and non visualizable dynamic.

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<v Speaker 2>An Englishman would hardly have put forth such a theory.

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<v Speaker 2>Perhaps what is expressed here is the conceptually abstract nature

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<v Speaker 2>of the semit I hope you'll be able to breathe

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<v Speaker 2>some life into this ingenious conceptual framework. Now this was

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<v Speaker 2>clearly not meant in a derogatory fashion. In fact, Summerfeld

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<v Speaker 2>wrote to Vine a year earlier that he had now

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<v Speaker 2>studied Einstein, who impresses me greatly, so Somemmrfeld also did

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<v Speaker 2>the first class in relativity in Germany, as well as

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<v Speaker 2>the first course on Boor's quantum mechanics, so he was

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<v Speaker 2>on board with the physics, just objected to some of

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<v Speaker 2>the esthetic aspects of it. Next now, Einstein wrote privately

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<v Speaker 2>to Borr, I'm confident that Jewish physics is not to

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<v Speaker 2>be killed in the middle of World War two, and

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<v Speaker 2>Born wrote back, I've always appreciated your good Jewish physics.

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<v Speaker 2>But it's evident from what Born wrote that he had

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<v Speaker 2>a relatively narrow view of what constituted Jewish physics, that

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<v Speaker 2>it was trying to get hold of the laws of

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<v Speaker 2>nature by thinking alone engaging in thought experiments.

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<v Speaker 1>Next.

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<v Speaker 2>Next, Now, Einstein himself had a somewhat loose association between

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<v Speaker 2>fact or experiment in theory. In nineteen nineteen, he was

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<v Speaker 2>asked what his reaction would have been if the eclipse

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<v Speaker 2>had disproved general relativity, and Einstein's reaction was to say, well,

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<v Speaker 2>then I would feel sorry for the Good Lord, because

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<v Speaker 2>the theory is correct anyway. In a debate with Nernst,

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<v Speaker 2>on the other hand, Nerdst spoke of a certain causal relationship,

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<v Speaker 2>and Einstein remarked, I don't think this relationship holds good.

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<v Speaker 2>But my esteemed colleague replied, Nernst, it is justice relationship

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<v Speaker 2>upon which yourself quite recently insisted in a lecture. To

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<v Speaker 2>his amazement, Einstein replied, how can I help it if

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<v Speaker 2>the Good Lord will not ratify what I maintained in

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<v Speaker 2>my lecture. So there is a sense in which Einstein's

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<v Speaker 2>approach to physics involved word games, a disconnection between experiment

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<v Speaker 2>and theory. Next, So it's important to understand that what

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<v Speaker 2>was so revolutionary and caused such controversy about relativity was

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<v Speaker 2>Einstein's adaptation of Mack's positivism. This idea that we should

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<v Speaker 2>look only at what the observer sees, and not worry

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<v Speaker 2>about mechanisms or processes or an ether or anything else

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<v Speaker 2>that might be going on to give rise to this.

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<v Speaker 2>So that's why in special relativity Einstein reduced it to

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<v Speaker 2>two principles. The speed of light appears constant to all observers,

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<v Speaker 2>and the laws of physics are the same in all

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<v Speaker 2>inertial reference frames. Well, when Heisenberg came to Berlin to

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<v Speaker 2>present one of his first lectures on quantum mechanics, Einstein

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<v Speaker 2>invited Heisenberg home, and Heisenberg wrote about this in his

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<v Speaker 2>book Physics and Beyond in nightteen seventy years after Einstein's death.

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<v Speaker 2>But the way Heisenberg described it, Einstein was very disturbed

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<v Speaker 2>by the fact that in Heisenberg's quantum mechanics there was

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<v Speaker 2>no such thing as an electron path or a trajectory,

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<v Speaker 2>and Heisenberg quoted Einstein back to Einstein arguing that we

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<v Speaker 2>should focus just on the observables, that we're not measuring

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<v Speaker 2>the path or only measuring where it ends up. That

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<v Speaker 2>bothered Einstein, and according to Heisenberg, he replied, perhaps I

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<v Speaker 2>did use such a philosophy earlier, and also wrote it,

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<v Speaker 2>but it is all nonsense, just the same. Next, So

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<v Speaker 2>if you look at who really influenced Einstein, it's clear.

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<v Speaker 2>In his early career Mack was one of the primary

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<v Speaker 2>influences that physics is all about observables and we don't

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<v Speaker 2>imagine fundamental physical causes like the ether Mack. But Einstein

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<v Speaker 2>was also deeply influenced by a Dutch philosopher and scientist

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<v Speaker 2>of Portuguese Jewish extraction, Spinoza, who argued that there were

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<v Speaker 2>deep causal connections between everything in reality, even if they

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<v Speaker 2>weren't obvious. So Mack, for his part, even in his

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<v Speaker 2>old age, commented that he accepted relativity just as little

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<v Speaker 2>as he accepted the existence of Adams. At that time,

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<v Speaker 2>Einstein argued that his mode of thinking was much closer

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<v Speaker 2>to positivism than it was later on, that his departure

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<v Speaker 2>came only when he developed general relativity around nineteen fifteen

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<v Speaker 2>or so. Next, let's go to the next slide. So

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<v Speaker 2>the question is is there only one kind of physics?

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<v Speaker 2>And many people who tackle this question and look at

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<v Speaker 2>whether there's such a thing as Jewish physics default to

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<v Speaker 2>the answer that there is no such thing as Jewish physics.

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<v Speaker 2>Because really there's just physics. But even one of the

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<v Speaker 2>scholars I found making that argument acknowledged one's cultural mil

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<v Speaker 2>You may contribute to one's approach and the way one

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<v Speaker 2>approaches problem seeking and answering questions. So it's worthwhile to

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<v Speaker 2>step back and consider other approaches to physics, and three

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<v Speaker 2>that I want to identify and highlight here are an

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<v Speaker 2>English approach, a French or continental approach, and then the

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<v Speaker 2>German nature philosophy approach. Now, the English approach to physics

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<v Speaker 2>has long involved a focus on mechanisms and models. I

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<v Speaker 2>already mentioned. Somemrfeld said an Englishman would never have put

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<v Speaker 2>forth a theory with non constructive and non visualizable dogmatics

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<v Speaker 2>like special relativity. Wilhelm Wein wrote to Ernest Rutherford that

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<v Speaker 2>relativity theory something new Anglo Saxons will never understand because

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<v Speaker 2>it requires a genuine German feeling for abstract speculation. Now

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<v Speaker 2>we can trace English physics all the way back to

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<v Speaker 2>the thirteenth century. I mean one of the first English

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<v Speaker 2>physicists was Robert gross Test who did fundamental work in

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<v Speaker 2>optics and the experimental method. His student, Roger Bacon, was

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<v Speaker 2>one of the first experimental scientists and laid out the

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<v Speaker 2>principles of induction that were taken up by Francis Bacon

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<v Speaker 2>and others later. Of course, Isaac Newton was the quintessential

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<v Speaker 2>English physicist, leading to the view of a clockwork universe.

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<v Speaker 2>Michael Faraday and James Clerk Maxwell applied that in electrodynamics,

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<v Speaker 2>coming up with the concept of fields pervading space, and

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<v Speaker 2>Oliver Heaviside and Heinrich Kurtz brought that to fruition with

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<v Speaker 2>their work in electromagnetics. And of course, ironically the physicist

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<v Speaker 2>responsible for putting the capstone on the English physics program

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<v Speaker 2>was Heinrich Hurtz, who was not only German but also

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<v Speaker 2>half Jewish, so clearly being English is not necessarily a

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<v Speaker 2>requirement for practicing English physics. Next, at the same time,

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<v Speaker 2>there was also a French or continental approach to physics

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<v Speaker 2>that looked more at mathematical models and abstraction for gathering

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<v Speaker 2>deeper knowledge. You can look at Pierre Louis Moperty, for instance,

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<v Speaker 2>who generalized Newtonian dynamics with the principle of least action

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<v Speaker 2>or low pital, who thought Newton's laws were a priori

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<v Speaker 2>deductions of pure thought and the lagrange. You declared he

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<v Speaker 2>had no use for figures and diagrams, only exact algebraic expressions.

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<v Speaker 2>And this is what I talked about last time, the

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<v Speaker 2>notion of a platonic or deductive approach to physics. The

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<v Speaker 2>French Continental School liked physics to be kind of like

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<v Speaker 2>Euclidean geometry. We have a few well described, well defined,

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<v Speaker 2>well accepted axioms, and we deduce from those axioms the

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<v Speaker 2>physical laws. Of course, that was very much, very similar

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<v Speaker 2>to what Einstein did with special relativity. Next, but now

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<v Speaker 2>we get to German physics, and one of the key

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<v Speaker 2>intellectual figures of German culture is Johann GeTe. He was

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<v Speaker 2>not only a scientist but also a philosopher and poet.

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<v Speaker 2>Some people call him the German Shakespeare. He wrote a

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<v Speaker 2>very famous play. Of course, the concept had been tackled

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<v Speaker 2>by other people, but he had his own version of

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<v Speaker 2>the play Faust, the famous play in which a scholar

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<v Speaker 2>sells his soul to the devil in order to achieve

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<v Speaker 2>knowledge and worldly gain. And one thing in that play

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<v Speaker 2>caught Heisenberg's attention, and he quoted a long passage from

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<v Speaker 2>which i'll just give you a small snippet where Mephistopheles

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<v Speaker 2>is counseling faust I counsel you, my dear young friend,

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<v Speaker 2>A course of logic to attend your mind will then

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<v Speaker 2>be so well braced in Spanish boots, so tightly laced,

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<v Speaker 2>that henceforth, by discretion taught will creep along the path

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<v Speaker 2>of thought, and not with all the winds that blow

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<v Speaker 2>go willow wisping to and fro. So that illusion of

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<v Speaker 2>the Spanish boots. The infamous torture device that the Inquisition

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<v Speaker 2>would clamp around the legs and feet of people to

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<v Speaker 2>crush them and extract a confession, is described by Geta

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<v Speaker 2>as imposing these bounds on reason. Of course, Gota's view

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<v Speaker 2>was that you shouldn't tightly lace the Spanish boots, that

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<v Speaker 2>you should allow your reason free realm and be willing

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<v Speaker 2>to entertain paradoxical and potentially contradictory ideas. And ironically, I

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<v Speaker 2>found that exact same phrase about not lacing the spirit

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<v Speaker 2>in Spanish boots in the writings of nerdst when he

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<v Speaker 2>was arguing back long before quantum mechanics was argued to

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<v Speaker 2>have made this happen, that reality had to be a

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<v Speaker 2>causal and we shouldn't lace our thoughts in Spanish boots

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<v Speaker 2>by demanding causality. So this was clearly a key concept

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<v Speaker 2>that the German physics community was thinking of.

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<v Speaker 1>Next, right, so the Spanish boots are like an iron

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<v Speaker 1>maiden for your feet. Right, So it's like that's the picture.

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<v Speaker 1>There is the spiked steel put around. So that's it

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<v Speaker 1>for people who just have audio. Right. Right.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, now, what we talked last time a little bit

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<v Speaker 2>about the beginning of the controversy on relativity leading up

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<v Speaker 2>to Einstein's visit to America, and that had a really

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<v Speaker 2>devastating effect not only on Einstein but also on his critics.

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<v Speaker 2>Einstein dismissed his critics as ignorant or anti Semitic in

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<v Speaker 2>a famous New York Times interview upon coming to America

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<v Speaker 2>and elsewhere, and that really became a self fulfilling prophecy.

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<v Speaker 1>Next, interesting, so.

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<v Speaker 2>I want to go back and talk a little bit

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<v Speaker 2>about some of his leading critics. One was Philip Leonard.

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<v Speaker 2>I mentioned him a little bit earlier. Leonard's mentor was

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<v Speaker 2>the German Jewish physicist Heinrich Hertz, and Leonard actually spent

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<v Speaker 2>a good year or so working on the proofs of

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<v Speaker 2>Hertz's book after his death and making sure that his

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<v Speaker 2>mentor's last book came out correctly. He had a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of respect for Hertz and later in life described what

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<v Speaker 2>a great scientist he thought Hurtz was, despite the fact

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<v Speaker 2>that he was half Jewish. He assisted Renken on his

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<v Speaker 2>pioneering work developing X rays and was not happy that

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<v Speaker 2>Renkin did not give him credit. He claimed JJ Thompson,

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<v Speaker 2>a British physicist and plagiarized him. But nevertheless, through his

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<v Speaker 2>diligent experimental work, he won the nineteen oh five Nobel

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<v Speaker 2>Prize for his work on cathode rays and for identifying

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<v Speaker 2>and measuring the photoelectric effect that was the same physical

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<v Speaker 2>phenomenon that Einstein got his Nobel Prize for ultimately, but

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<v Speaker 2>for providing a theoretical explanation of it. He was outstanding lecturer.

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<v Speaker 2>Even Einstein's girlfriend, who became his wife, wrote a letter

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<v Speaker 2>to Einstein while attending lectures from Leonard and extolling what

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<v Speaker 2>a wonderful lecturer he was. He's put as much time

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<v Speaker 2>into setting up experimental demonstrations for his students as he

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<v Speaker 2>did for his own research, and he carried on a

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<v Speaker 2>cordial of course respondents with Einstein. After Einstein's paper on

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<v Speaker 2>the photo electric effect came out, they exchanged a number

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<v Speaker 2>of letters and had a very you know, he didn't

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<v Speaker 2>agree with Einstein's interpretation, but they had a cordial correspondence.

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<v Speaker 2>But the events of World War One were really the

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<v Speaker 2>turning point for Leonard. Leonard blamed England for setting France

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<v Speaker 2>and Russia against Germany and World War One. And that's

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<v Speaker 2>not without some justification. The British and forced a very

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<v Speaker 2>strict and devastating blockade on Germany. In fact, they continued

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<v Speaker 2>that even after the war ended, until the final Treaty

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<v Speaker 2>of Versailles was signed. Lots of Germans experienced privation and

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<v Speaker 2>even starvation. Leonard's own son, Werner, died in nineteen twenty

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<v Speaker 2>two from the side effects of that long malnutrition that

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<v Speaker 2>he suffered during the war years. In fact, Max Borne

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00:27:00.039 --> 00:27:06.480
<v Speaker 2>commented a mutual colleague Caro Runge in Gertingen was emaciated

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<v Speaker 2>in a letter to Einstein and very angry about the fact. Well.

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<v Speaker 2>In addition to his personal tragedy of losing his son,

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<v Speaker 2>Leonard also became bankrupted by the hyperinflation. He like a

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<v Speaker 2>good German patriot, invested all of his money and his

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<v Speaker 2>Nobel Prize winnings in German war bonds, and those got

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<v Speaker 2>inflated away into nothing, and he was insulted by Einstein.

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<v Speaker 2>Next So, in nineteen twenty two, Einstein's Zionist friend Blumenfelt

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<v Speaker 2>was good friends with a German Jewish financier, Walter Rathanow,

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00:27:51.839 --> 00:27:54.680
<v Speaker 2>and three of them would get together in Rathenau's apartment

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00:27:54.759 --> 00:27:59.160
<v Speaker 2>and talk. At that time, blumen tried to persuade Rathenow

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00:27:59.240 --> 00:28:01.480
<v Speaker 2>that it was wrong for a Jew to presume to

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00:28:01.599 --> 00:28:06.119
<v Speaker 2>run the foreign affairs of another people, but Rathanou felt

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<v Speaker 2>that he needed to be to show that Jews could

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<v Speaker 2>be good Germans and could could serve the German nation,

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<v Speaker 2>and as a result he ended up accepting the position

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<v Speaker 2>of Foreign Minister in one of the Weimar Republic governments.

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<v Speaker 2>In February nineteen twenty two, Rathanau supported the Versailles Treaty.

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<v Speaker 2>He signed the Treaty of Rapallo with the Soviet Union,

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<v Speaker 2>which angered a lot of the nationalists in Germany, and

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<v Speaker 2>as a result he ended up being assassinated in June

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen twenty two. Now, that event got Leonard into trouble

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<v Speaker 2>because Leonard held Rathanou responsible for the hyperinflation that had

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<v Speaker 2>wiped him out and was just beginning to take off,

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<v Speaker 2>but had already had devastating consequences, so he refused to

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<v Speaker 2>lower the flag of his institute to half mass on

416
00:29:00.839 --> 00:29:03.920
<v Speaker 2>the day of mourning that had been set aside. A

417
00:29:04.079 --> 00:29:07.000
<v Speaker 2>communist mob broke into the building, dragged him out, and

418
00:29:07.119 --> 00:29:09.640
<v Speaker 2>almost threw him in a river. It became something of

419
00:29:10.079 --> 00:29:13.559
<v Speaker 2>a cause celeb and we can point to this incident

420
00:29:13.599 --> 00:29:19.440
<v Speaker 2>where clearly, from then on out he had very strong

421
00:29:19.440 --> 00:29:24.279
<v Speaker 2>political feelings and a very strong grudge against Einstein and

422
00:29:24.720 --> 00:29:28.680
<v Speaker 2>the various Weimar governments in particular. Einstein, for his part,

423
00:29:28.759 --> 00:29:33.920
<v Speaker 2>at this time, fled Berlin and went to Kiel on

424
00:29:34.000 --> 00:29:36.799
<v Speaker 2>the Baltic where he had been working with a company

425
00:29:36.799 --> 00:29:42.559
<v Speaker 2>called Anschutz and had developed some technology for their gyro compasses.

426
00:29:43.359 --> 00:29:47.119
<v Speaker 2>In fact, Einstein Einstein earned royalties on his patents up

427
00:29:47.200 --> 00:29:50.680
<v Speaker 2>until just before World War Two, and all of the

428
00:29:50.759 --> 00:29:54.079
<v Speaker 2>German naval vessels, including the U boats that were attacking

429
00:29:54.599 --> 00:29:58.440
<v Speaker 2>Allied commerce, they used these gyro compasses that included some

430
00:29:58.480 --> 00:30:01.759
<v Speaker 2>of the intellectual property that was developed by Albert Einstein.

431
00:30:02.359 --> 00:30:08.960
<v Speaker 2>I never knew that, so Leonard in the wake of

432
00:30:09.000 --> 00:30:12.880
<v Speaker 2>what happened to him upon that assassination, added a word

433
00:30:12.920 --> 00:30:17.000
<v Speaker 2>of a not admonishment to German natural scientists to his

434
00:30:17.200 --> 00:30:22.960
<v Speaker 2>pre existing more academic criticism of relativity. He pointed out

435
00:30:23.079 --> 00:30:26.000
<v Speaker 2>or argued that there was a well known Jewish characteristic

436
00:30:26.319 --> 00:30:30.200
<v Speaker 2>of shifting from factual problems to the field of personal quarrel,

437
00:30:30.559 --> 00:30:33.839
<v Speaker 2>and he called for the cultivation of a sound German spirit.

438
00:30:34.720 --> 00:30:37.680
<v Speaker 2>He handed out these flyers at a major nineteen twenty

439
00:30:37.680 --> 00:30:41.079
<v Speaker 2>two physics convention, and they weren't well received. That Heisenberg

440
00:30:41.359 --> 00:30:46.119
<v Speaker 2>was in the audience there and commented how tragic he

441
00:30:46.160 --> 00:30:50.640
<v Speaker 2>thought it was to see Leonard engaging in these semitic

442
00:30:50.680 --> 00:30:54.680
<v Speaker 2>attacks on Einstein in particular and Jewish physics in general.

443
00:30:55.799 --> 00:30:59.880
<v Speaker 2>When Einstein did get his award for the Nobel Prize

444
00:30:59.880 --> 00:31:04.960
<v Speaker 2>in Physics, Leonard not only protested in private, but publicized

445
00:31:05.039 --> 00:31:10.200
<v Speaker 2>his objections in the newspaper, which was a great breach

446
00:31:10.240 --> 00:31:15.039
<v Speaker 2>of decorum. Now, the other anti relativist who was one

447
00:31:15.039 --> 00:31:18.079
<v Speaker 2>of Einstein's great foes and a proponent of the Deutsche

448
00:31:18.079 --> 00:31:23.680
<v Speaker 2>Physics was Johannes Stark. In nineteen oh seven, he solicited

449
00:31:23.680 --> 00:31:26.519
<v Speaker 2>Einstein to write an article for the journal that he

450
00:31:26.640 --> 00:31:31.400
<v Speaker 2>was editor of and he worked on the light quantum hypothesis,

451
00:31:31.440 --> 00:31:36.039
<v Speaker 2>which is one of the key ideas in Einstein's paper

452
00:31:36.079 --> 00:31:39.759
<v Speaker 2>on the photoelectric effect. In fact, he contributed. Stark contributed

453
00:31:39.799 --> 00:31:42.720
<v Speaker 2>so much that Lorentz referred to it as the Einstein

454
00:31:42.839 --> 00:31:48.000
<v Speaker 2>Stark hypothesis. About that time he offered Einstein. Stark offered

455
00:31:48.039 --> 00:31:52.319
<v Speaker 2>Einstein an academic post, but Einstein had already made other

456
00:31:52.480 --> 00:31:57.400
<v Speaker 2>arrangements to go work somewhere else and declined the offer.

457
00:31:58.240 --> 00:32:02.559
<v Speaker 2>Now they got off on the wrong foot when Einstein.

458
00:32:04.160 --> 00:32:09.079
<v Speaker 2>In Stark's view, Einstein failed to properly acknowledge his contributions

459
00:32:09.440 --> 00:32:13.960
<v Speaker 2>and didn't quote him, which is didn't cite him as

460
00:32:14.559 --> 00:32:19.599
<v Speaker 2>a predecessor in his physical work. Nevertheless, Stark did get

461
00:32:19.720 --> 00:32:29.119
<v Speaker 2>the Nobel Prize in nineteen nineteen. Now, Stark started into

462
00:32:29.480 --> 00:32:34.400
<v Speaker 2>the controversy in physics, taking the side of experimentalists against

463
00:32:34.920 --> 00:32:39.000
<v Speaker 2>the theoreticians who were dominating the field. He argued that

464
00:32:40.200 --> 00:32:45.960
<v Speaker 2>equated the emphasis on theoretical physics with this abstract, degenerate

465
00:32:46.079 --> 00:32:49.519
<v Speaker 2>form of theoretical physics. Now, that got answered by Maxi

466
00:32:49.559 --> 00:32:53.160
<v Speaker 2>Van Lowe, who pointed out at the time experimental physics

467
00:32:53.240 --> 00:32:56.279
<v Speaker 2>was expensive and that's why there was so much theoretical

468
00:32:56.319 --> 00:33:03.440
<v Speaker 2>physics going on a revolt of the experimentalists against the

469
00:33:03.440 --> 00:33:10.000
<v Speaker 2>theorists in German physics societies, but ultimately got outmaneuvered by

470
00:33:10.039 --> 00:33:13.599
<v Speaker 2>Wilhelm Bean, who ended up taking over and kind of

471
00:33:13.640 --> 00:33:17.920
<v Speaker 2>shunting him aside. In nineteen twenty seven. Leonard wanted to

472
00:33:17.960 --> 00:33:22.279
<v Speaker 2>retire and appoint Stark as his successor, but Leonard's colleagues

473
00:33:22.319 --> 00:33:26.880
<v Speaker 2>rebelled and blocked star disappointment, so the anti relativists really

474
00:33:26.880 --> 00:33:29.960
<v Speaker 2>weren't able to get much significant traction in the physics

475
00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:37.200
<v Speaker 2>community until the Nazis took power, but they declared themselves

476
00:33:37.319 --> 00:33:42.559
<v Speaker 2>for the Nazis. In the wake of the Beer Hall Push,

477
00:33:42.599 --> 00:33:49.240
<v Speaker 2>Stark said kind of flamboyantly that as the National Socialist

478
00:33:49.279 --> 00:33:52.920
<v Speaker 2>Party entered their struggle for power, he closed the doors

479
00:33:52.920 --> 00:33:55.799
<v Speaker 2>of his physical laboratory and stepped into the ranks of

480
00:33:55.839 --> 00:34:01.880
<v Speaker 2>the fighters behind Adolf Hitler. Now, the Beer Hall Push

481
00:34:02.319 --> 00:34:07.440
<v Speaker 2>was an attempt in Munich to take over the government there.

482
00:34:07.480 --> 00:34:10.199
<v Speaker 2>That was in November nineteen twenty three. Of course, it failed,

483
00:34:10.719 --> 00:34:14.480
<v Speaker 2>and in nineteen twenty four General Ludendorf and Adolf Hitler,

484
00:34:14.480 --> 00:34:18.320
<v Speaker 2>who were the ringleaders, went on trial. At the time

485
00:34:18.360 --> 00:34:25.400
<v Speaker 2>that trial started, Leonard wrote a manifesto that Stark signed onto.

486
00:34:26.559 --> 00:34:33.519
<v Speaker 2>The manifesto argued that the spirit of restless clarity, which

487
00:34:33.639 --> 00:34:37.440
<v Speaker 2>hates every work of compromise because it's untruthful, it's the

488
00:34:37.480 --> 00:34:40.559
<v Speaker 2>same spirit that we see in the great researchers of

489
00:34:40.599 --> 00:34:44.519
<v Speaker 2>the past, like Galileo, Kepler, Newton, and Faraday, and we

490
00:34:44.599 --> 00:34:47.880
<v Speaker 2>admire and revere it in the same manner as Hitler

491
00:34:47.880 --> 00:34:51.119
<v Speaker 2>and Ludendorf and their comrades. Maybe one of the first

492
00:34:51.119 --> 00:34:57.199
<v Speaker 2>times someone compared Hitler to Faraday, Galileo, Newton, and Kepler,

493
00:34:57.880 --> 00:35:03.199
<v Speaker 2>but that was really the a big turning point for

494
00:35:03.400 --> 00:35:07.360
<v Speaker 2>Stark and for Leonard, placing themselves firmly in the Nazi camp.

495
00:35:08.880 --> 00:35:12.400
<v Speaker 1>Next right, and then there's like Adolf Hidler saying it's

496
00:35:12.440 --> 00:35:14.960
<v Speaker 1>Hebrews a poisoning and all that other stuff. Right, So

497
00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:18.679
<v Speaker 1>it's like in the context, it's like these guys are jocking.

498
00:35:18.719 --> 00:35:21.639
<v Speaker 1>But it's interesting because it was it's not just physics,

499
00:35:21.639 --> 00:35:24.320
<v Speaker 1>it's it's the entire culture, like the movement against the

500
00:35:24.360 --> 00:35:27.440
<v Speaker 1>Frankfurt School. So this is also can be seen in

501
00:35:27.480 --> 00:35:30.800
<v Speaker 1>the context of that. And it's also kind of how

502
00:35:30.960 --> 00:35:35.000
<v Speaker 1>ethnicity and maybe culture influences what should be kind of

503
00:35:35.000 --> 00:35:37.880
<v Speaker 1>a cold, dispassionate science. And I think it's a lot

504
00:35:37.880 --> 00:35:40.400
<v Speaker 1>of that politicization we've seen in the US recently too,

505
00:35:40.440 --> 00:35:44.159
<v Speaker 1>a lot of politics influencing what isn't.

506
00:35:43.960 --> 00:35:47.519
<v Speaker 2>It Now we're focusing just on the physics aspect of it,

507
00:35:47.559 --> 00:35:50.519
<v Speaker 2>but of course there's there's a lot a lot going

508
00:35:50.559 --> 00:35:52.719
<v Speaker 2>on in the broader culture and buy our Germany than

509
00:35:52.880 --> 00:35:59.960
<v Speaker 2>just the squabble between Einstein and his Nazi physics critics

510
00:36:00.000 --> 00:36:08.400
<v Speaker 2>exactly well, they really ultimately were not terribly successful. Leonard

511
00:36:08.440 --> 00:36:11.679
<v Speaker 2>by that time had pretty much retired. He wrote a

512
00:36:11.760 --> 00:36:14.360
<v Speaker 2>book Great Men of Science, and he wrote a four

513
00:36:14.440 --> 00:36:20.880
<v Speaker 2>volume science textbook, Deutsche physic Stark had some initial success

514
00:36:20.920 --> 00:36:26.119
<v Speaker 2>when the Nazis came to power, getting academic bureaucratic positions

515
00:36:26.119 --> 00:36:29.679
<v Speaker 2>in the government, and was very heavy handed. He met

516
00:36:29.719 --> 00:36:33.559
<v Speaker 2>with some academicians and told them if they weren't willing

517
00:36:33.559 --> 00:36:36.159
<v Speaker 2>to get on board with his program, he would use force.

518
00:36:37.559 --> 00:36:39.960
<v Speaker 2>He was not well appreciated in the community. In fact,

519
00:36:39.960 --> 00:36:42.599
<v Speaker 2>in nineteen thirty six he was denied elevation to the

520
00:36:42.599 --> 00:36:46.360
<v Speaker 2>Prussian Academy of Sciences because pretty much every other physicist

521
00:36:46.440 --> 00:36:49.239
<v Speaker 2>or a vast majority of physicists did not appreciate him,

522
00:36:49.719 --> 00:36:53.199
<v Speaker 2>and he tried to destroy Heisenberg, as we mentioned earlier,

523
00:36:53.239 --> 00:36:57.440
<v Speaker 2>but Heisenberg's mother managed to quash that. So he did

524
00:36:57.480 --> 00:37:02.760
<v Speaker 2>manage to keep Heisenberg from succeeding summer Fell. But ultimately

525
00:37:02.800 --> 00:37:07.159
<v Speaker 2>the anti relativists weren't terribly successful, except in so far

526
00:37:07.519 --> 00:37:11.519
<v Speaker 2>as they were part of the broader movement that forced

527
00:37:11.880 --> 00:37:15.400
<v Speaker 2>many prominent Jewish scientists to leave Germany. One of their

528
00:37:15.440 --> 00:37:18.199
<v Speaker 2>colleagues commented, it's fortunate that Leonard and Stark are no

529
00:37:18.280 --> 00:37:21.679
<v Speaker 2>longer young. If they still had their youthful alam, they

530
00:37:21.719 --> 00:37:27.079
<v Speaker 2>would command what should be taught as physics. So, of course,

531
00:37:27.119 --> 00:37:31.239
<v Speaker 2>the broader context of what happened. In December nineteen thirty two,

532
00:37:31.239 --> 00:37:34.599
<v Speaker 2>Einstein went for a trip to Pasadena in America, and

533
00:37:34.639 --> 00:37:37.360
<v Speaker 2>he would never come home again because in January nineteen

534
00:37:37.400 --> 00:37:41.840
<v Speaker 2>twenty three, Hitler became Chancellor. The next month, in February,

535
00:37:41.920 --> 00:37:46.360
<v Speaker 2>the Reichstag burned down, giving Hitler and his Nazi government

536
00:37:46.800 --> 00:37:52.440
<v Speaker 2>the excuse to expand their powers. In May nineteen thirty three,

537
00:37:52.440 --> 00:37:55.639
<v Speaker 2>over fifty thousand books were burned under the direction of

538
00:37:55.679 --> 00:38:00.800
<v Speaker 2>the propaganda director Paul Joseph Goebbels. Jews were hired from

539
00:38:00.840 --> 00:38:06.440
<v Speaker 2>their academic posts. Easily a quarter of all physicists who

540
00:38:06.440 --> 00:38:11.880
<v Speaker 2>were Jewish got fired, even people who were very prominent

541
00:38:11.880 --> 00:38:16.599
<v Speaker 2>businists like Max Bourne or Fritz Haber. Fritz Haber is

542
00:38:16.599 --> 00:38:21.320
<v Speaker 2>a particularly tragic case. He was a thoroughly assimilated German Jew.

543
00:38:21.679 --> 00:38:25.719
<v Speaker 2>He had converted to Protestantism in his youth. He was

544
00:38:26.079 --> 00:38:31.440
<v Speaker 2>the physicist responsible for developing the haber Bosch process, which

545
00:38:31.480 --> 00:38:38.280
<v Speaker 2>synthesized nitrogen out of air, creating fertilizer and literally creating

546
00:38:38.360 --> 00:38:42.960
<v Speaker 2>bread from air. Now that same technology that made fertilizer

547
00:38:43.039 --> 00:38:47.239
<v Speaker 2>also made the nitrates that were needed to make explosives.

548
00:38:47.639 --> 00:38:51.719
<v Speaker 2>So his science was critical not only in feeding Germans

549
00:38:51.800 --> 00:38:56.280
<v Speaker 2>during World War One, but in providing them a source

550
00:38:56.320 --> 00:38:59.400
<v Speaker 2>of nitrates for explosives when they were under a blockade

551
00:38:59.400 --> 00:39:03.039
<v Speaker 2>and they could not access the foreign sources of guano,

552
00:39:03.599 --> 00:39:07.960
<v Speaker 2>bird and bat deposits that they would normally use. And

553
00:39:08.039 --> 00:39:12.280
<v Speaker 2>yet he also was forced into an exile.

554
00:39:12.679 --> 00:39:14.519
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, he was a real loyalist, Like he was one

555
00:39:14.559 --> 00:39:18.679
<v Speaker 1>hundred percent German loyalist. He namtive loyalist. And I think

556
00:39:18.719 --> 00:39:22.679
<v Speaker 1>he revolutionized really agricultural worldwide, right, not just Germany.

557
00:39:22.840 --> 00:39:25.800
<v Speaker 2>Oh, absolutely, that process is a large part of what

558
00:39:25.880 --> 00:39:29.000
<v Speaker 2>keeps people fed today, and we have Haber to thank

559
00:39:29.079 --> 00:39:32.800
<v Speaker 2>for it. And the Nazis were not terribly.

560
00:39:32.480 --> 00:39:36.400
<v Speaker 1>Grateful, No, not at all. They should have been. Yeah.

561
00:39:36.639 --> 00:39:40.480
<v Speaker 2>Now, one final note. We talked about Einstein's personal life

562
00:39:40.599 --> 00:39:45.440
<v Speaker 2>a bit and how abusive he was to his first

563
00:39:45.480 --> 00:39:49.519
<v Speaker 2>wife before divorcing her and having an affair with his

564
00:39:49.599 --> 00:39:54.599
<v Speaker 2>first cousin and then marrying her. Now he had two sons,

565
00:39:54.639 --> 00:39:58.840
<v Speaker 2>Hans Albert, who grew up to be a very well

566
00:39:58.880 --> 00:40:06.000
<v Speaker 2>respected professor of engineering. His other son, Edward, was diagnosed

567
00:40:06.039 --> 00:40:11.480
<v Speaker 2>as being schizophrenic and institutionalized. And on the eve of

568
00:40:11.960 --> 00:40:16.400
<v Speaker 2>World War Two, Einstein was busy trying to help Jews

569
00:40:16.519 --> 00:40:20.239
<v Speaker 2>escape Europe, writing letters of recommendation, trying to get them

570
00:40:20.239 --> 00:40:23.440
<v Speaker 2>permission and visas to get out. He said he ran

571
00:40:23.519 --> 00:40:27.320
<v Speaker 2>a little refugee office from his cluttered lawyer desk, helping

572
00:40:27.559 --> 00:40:32.639
<v Speaker 2>Jews escape Europe. He got a letter from his ex wife, Malava,

573
00:40:32.800 --> 00:40:36.960
<v Speaker 2>seeking his help. Now she was a Serbian Orthodox Christian

574
00:40:37.000 --> 00:40:41.039
<v Speaker 2>living in Switzerland. Even if the Nazis had annexed Switzerland

575
00:40:41.079 --> 00:40:44.599
<v Speaker 2>like they did Austria, she'd probably been okay. But their

576
00:40:44.679 --> 00:40:51.800
<v Speaker 2>half Jewish son, Edward, who was institutionalized in a mental institution.

577
00:40:52.000 --> 00:40:54.519
<v Speaker 2>I mean, if the Nazis had taken power, it would

578
00:40:54.519 --> 00:40:56.519
<v Speaker 2>have been all over for him. He would have never

579
00:40:56.559 --> 00:40:59.079
<v Speaker 2>made it to a concentration camp, because often the Nazis

580
00:40:59.079 --> 00:41:04.159
<v Speaker 2>would just show mental patience out of hand. And yet

581
00:41:04.159 --> 00:41:08.760
<v Speaker 2>despite that, Einstein, as far as is known, never never replied.

582
00:41:09.199 --> 00:41:13.119
<v Speaker 2>He wrote to paul Aarinfest something I mentioned last time,

583
00:41:13.480 --> 00:41:17.239
<v Speaker 2>that in Einstein's view, valuable persons should not be sacrificed

584
00:41:17.280 --> 00:41:21.400
<v Speaker 2>to helpless or to hopeless causes, and that held true

585
00:41:21.480 --> 00:41:25.679
<v Speaker 2>even when it was his own son that was the cause.

586
00:41:26.000 --> 00:41:29.199
<v Speaker 2>He wrote, his other son, Hans Albert, if I had

587
00:41:29.239 --> 00:41:36.320
<v Speaker 2>been informed apparently of a potential genetic mental issue in

588
00:41:36.360 --> 00:41:40.199
<v Speaker 2>Malava's family, Edouard would never have been born, and of

589
00:41:40.199 --> 00:41:44.119
<v Speaker 2>course conceivable necessarily that would have meant Hans Albert wouldn't

590
00:41:44.119 --> 00:41:48.440
<v Speaker 2>have been born. Also, So Einstein had a very troubled

591
00:41:48.480 --> 00:41:54.000
<v Speaker 2>relationship with his family and was not the wise and

592
00:41:54.119 --> 00:41:58.800
<v Speaker 2>sainted figure that he was publicized to be.

593
00:42:03.920 --> 00:42:06.079
<v Speaker 1>He's become kind of like a figure, almost kind of

594
00:42:06.159 --> 00:42:10.320
<v Speaker 1>like Marilyn Monroe or Elvis in this kind of promotion

595
00:42:10.519 --> 00:42:12.519
<v Speaker 1>and him riding on his bike and his tongue out

596
00:42:12.599 --> 00:42:14.079
<v Speaker 1>and humanitarian.

597
00:42:14.159 --> 00:42:18.480
<v Speaker 2>But yeah, I think I mentioned that last time that

598
00:42:19.800 --> 00:42:24.480
<v Speaker 2>the Hebrew University in Jerusalem that has the rights to

599
00:42:24.519 --> 00:42:28.920
<v Speaker 2>his likeness has earned something like a quarter billion dollars

600
00:42:29.280 --> 00:42:33.639
<v Speaker 2>from licensing the Einstein image, everything from you know, the

601
00:42:33.960 --> 00:42:41.800
<v Speaker 2>little Einstein's to anytime his face has appeared there. They're

602
00:42:41.800 --> 00:42:43.960
<v Speaker 2>demanding their cut for licensing his image.

603
00:42:44.079 --> 00:42:47.199
<v Speaker 1>Wow, amazing, he's worth more And since he's passed away

604
00:42:47.280 --> 00:42:50.159
<v Speaker 1>than in life or should have been could have been.

605
00:42:51.679 --> 00:42:56.719
<v Speaker 2>So the the the upshot of all this was a bitter,

606
00:42:57.000 --> 00:43:01.400
<v Speaker 2>obviously very bitter polarization in physics. On the one hand,

607
00:43:01.480 --> 00:43:07.280
<v Speaker 2>you had German physicists like Ernst Gherk, who acknowledged anyone

608
00:43:07.320 --> 00:43:10.360
<v Speaker 2>who criticizes Einsteins either called an anti Semite or someone

609
00:43:10.360 --> 00:43:13.199
<v Speaker 2>who's too stupid to grasp the theory of relativity, or both.

610
00:43:14.320 --> 00:43:17.840
<v Speaker 2>And on the side of the German physicists like Leonard.

611
00:43:18.960 --> 00:43:22.400
<v Speaker 2>Leonard was arguing by the mid nineteen thirties that natural

612
00:43:22.480 --> 00:43:26.400
<v Speaker 2>science is of completely Aryan origin and Germans must today

613
00:43:26.519 --> 00:43:30.719
<v Speaker 2>find their own way out into the unknown, and that

614
00:43:31.159 --> 00:43:35.400
<v Speaker 2>polarization made it very difficult for people to look at

615
00:43:35.519 --> 00:43:40.639
<v Speaker 2>relativity objectively. Another physicist, Ara Houston, writing in his Treatise

616
00:43:40.639 --> 00:43:43.760
<v Speaker 2>on Light in nineteen thirty eight, commented, relativity is now

617
00:43:43.800 --> 00:43:46.679
<v Speaker 2>accepted as a faith, and it is inadvisable to devote

618
00:43:46.719 --> 00:43:53.599
<v Speaker 2>attention to its paradoxical aspects. Now it's kind of interesting

619
00:43:54.039 --> 00:43:58.719
<v Speaker 2>seeing the fates of the anti relativists after World War One. Now,

620
00:43:58.800 --> 00:44:01.079
<v Speaker 2>Leonard by that point was in his eighties and was

621
00:44:01.079 --> 00:44:04.840
<v Speaker 2>so frail that they didn't even bother putting him on trial.

622
00:44:05.519 --> 00:44:07.719
<v Speaker 2>Stark was a bit younger and was sentenced to six

623
00:44:07.760 --> 00:44:10.920
<v Speaker 2>years in prison, but he ended up having that sentence

624
00:44:10.920 --> 00:44:13.800
<v Speaker 2>commuted to a thousand marque fine. One of the really

625
00:44:13.800 --> 00:44:17.360
<v Speaker 2>interesting cases was Paul Wayland. I remember he was the

626
00:44:17.840 --> 00:44:24.519
<v Speaker 2>guy who started the working Group of German Scientists for

627
00:44:24.679 --> 00:44:27.960
<v Speaker 2>Pure Science that somehow came up with a large amount

628
00:44:28.000 --> 00:44:30.880
<v Speaker 2>of money to hire physicists and rent the Berlin Philharmonic.

629
00:44:30.920 --> 00:44:32.920
<v Speaker 2>And no one really knows who was pulling his strings

630
00:44:33.000 --> 00:44:37.159
<v Speaker 2>or giving him his money. He led a long career

631
00:44:37.519 --> 00:44:44.960
<v Speaker 2>of Cohn artistry and grifting across Europe and even South America,

632
00:44:45.400 --> 00:44:47.360
<v Speaker 2>and on the eve of World War Two he came

633
00:44:47.480 --> 00:44:51.199
<v Speaker 2>home to Germany, and when he entered the country, the

634
00:44:51.239 --> 00:44:54.000
<v Speaker 2>Germans threw him in Dacau, so he ended up spending

635
00:44:54.039 --> 00:44:58.239
<v Speaker 2>World War Two in concentration camps. After the war, he

636
00:44:58.800 --> 00:45:03.920
<v Speaker 2>awarded himself a doctorate, called himself Doctor Wayland, and emigrated

637
00:45:03.920 --> 00:45:06.320
<v Speaker 2>to the US. And one of the final things he

638
00:45:06.360 --> 00:45:10.199
<v Speaker 2>did was try to persuade the FBI that he had

639
00:45:10.599 --> 00:45:14.159
<v Speaker 2>a secret information about Einstein being a communist, resulting in

640
00:45:14.239 --> 00:45:19.719
<v Speaker 2>a rather large investigation, which is now available publicly through

641
00:45:19.719 --> 00:45:26.480
<v Speaker 2>freedom of information. Now, World War Two was, of course

642
00:45:26.719 --> 00:45:31.280
<v Speaker 2>part of the foundational narrative that even today the guides

643
00:45:31.360 --> 00:45:35.000
<v Speaker 2>how we think about America. I really like the quote

644
00:45:35.039 --> 00:45:38.719
<v Speaker 2>by the comedian Norm MacDonald who said, you know, it

645
00:45:38.760 --> 00:45:40.760
<v Speaker 2>says here in the history book that luckily the good

646
00:45:40.800 --> 00:45:43.559
<v Speaker 2>guys have won every single time. What are the odds?

647
00:45:44.559 --> 00:45:48.880
<v Speaker 2>It's that narrative of the victor's writing the history that

648
00:45:49.599 --> 00:45:54.760
<v Speaker 2>still governs US today and justice. World War two and

649
00:45:54.840 --> 00:45:57.559
<v Speaker 2>its events are important to our understanding of the broader

650
00:45:58.199 --> 00:46:00.639
<v Speaker 2>politics and culture of the US and the rest of

651
00:46:00.679 --> 00:46:05.679
<v Speaker 2>the world. That debate between Jewish versus Deutsche physics informs

652
00:46:05.760 --> 00:46:12.880
<v Speaker 2>modern physics, the interpretations of present day relativity and quantum mechanics.

653
00:46:12.880 --> 00:46:18.239
<v Speaker 2>Though that debate and all of the dramatic effects it

654
00:46:18.239 --> 00:46:21.559
<v Speaker 2>had in the personal lives of the participants kind of

655
00:46:21.639 --> 00:46:25.960
<v Speaker 2>overshadows the actual philosophic ideas that are at the root

656
00:46:26.199 --> 00:46:30.000
<v Speaker 2>of relativity and quantum mechanics, and it boils down to

657
00:46:31.320 --> 00:46:35.480
<v Speaker 2>primarily being not really Jewish ideas at all, but rather

658
00:46:36.079 --> 00:46:41.559
<v Speaker 2>the positivism of the Austrian German physicist Ernst Mack and

659
00:46:42.199 --> 00:46:52.280
<v Speaker 2>Gerta's nature philosophy as channeled through mephistophiles in his play Faust.

660
00:46:53.199 --> 00:46:56.360
<v Speaker 2>So we don't need to belabor the point. But Einstein

661
00:46:56.400 --> 00:47:00.519
<v Speaker 2>didn't really live up to the hero caricature. He had

662
00:47:00.880 --> 00:47:05.639
<v Speaker 2>a lot of personal weaknesses. He tended to answer dialectic

663
00:47:05.719 --> 00:47:10.760
<v Speaker 2>with rhetoric, dismissing criticisms as being antisemitic or ignorant without

664
00:47:10.800 --> 00:47:13.719
<v Speaker 2>actually engaging with him. He was very jealous of his

665
00:47:13.760 --> 00:47:18.079
<v Speaker 2>own priority while being very careless recognizing the contributions and

666
00:47:18.119 --> 00:47:25.760
<v Speaker 2>priority of others. Now, it was kind of interesting to

667
00:47:25.800 --> 00:47:31.440
<v Speaker 2>me to see how this more realistic, if less complimentary

668
00:47:31.519 --> 00:47:36.039
<v Speaker 2>picture of Einstein is really beginning to enter the mainstream

669
00:47:36.119 --> 00:47:39.559
<v Speaker 2>of physics today. Just a few years ago of the

670
00:47:39.559 --> 00:47:43.159
<v Speaker 2>science writer Paul Helper wrote in an essay in Physics Today,

671
00:47:43.239 --> 00:47:48.559
<v Speaker 2>which is the mainstream magazine for practicing physicists. He wrote

672
00:47:48.559 --> 00:47:51.280
<v Speaker 2>the relationship between Einstein and the press is a case

673
00:47:51.519 --> 00:47:54.639
<v Speaker 2>in which a scientist's fame triumphed over the substance of

674
00:47:54.639 --> 00:47:59.480
<v Speaker 2>his work. I mean, Einstein's fame was so hyperbolic, not

675
00:47:59.480 --> 00:48:02.280
<v Speaker 2>even einste time quite live up to the reputation that

676
00:48:02.320 --> 00:48:05.199
<v Speaker 2>the press tried to make for him. And Einstein acknowledged that.

677
00:48:05.239 --> 00:48:08.480
<v Speaker 2>He commented he had been given a publicity value which

678
00:48:08.519 --> 00:48:12.079
<v Speaker 2>he did not earn, and that was not necessarily a

679
00:48:12.119 --> 00:48:15.800
<v Speaker 2>good thing. He also commented that the newspapers have mentioned

680
00:48:15.800 --> 00:48:19.239
<v Speaker 2>my name too often, thus mobilizing the rabble against me,

681
00:48:19.440 --> 00:48:25.440
<v Speaker 2>in a letter to Max Plot. Now one anecdote really

682
00:48:25.559 --> 00:48:30.440
<v Speaker 2>drove home to me the importance of the whole Einstein

683
00:48:31.360 --> 00:48:35.639
<v Speaker 2>narrative in physics. I've already mentioned how quarter billion dollars

684
00:48:35.800 --> 00:48:41.400
<v Speaker 2>has been earned licensing Einstein's legacy. But not long ago

685
00:48:41.440 --> 00:48:44.280
<v Speaker 2>I came across this kind of obscure account by the

686
00:48:44.280 --> 00:48:49.559
<v Speaker 2>physicist Freeman Dyson, writing the forward of the New Quotable Einstein.

687
00:48:50.480 --> 00:48:55.559
<v Speaker 2>Dyson in December nineteen eighty one was walking around the

688
00:48:55.559 --> 00:49:00.199
<v Speaker 2>Princeton University campus around Christmas. Most everyone was gone on

689
00:49:01.079 --> 00:49:03.559
<v Speaker 2>it was a dark and rainy night, he said, And

690
00:49:03.599 --> 00:49:07.920
<v Speaker 2>then a military truck pulled up to the Institute there

691
00:49:08.199 --> 00:49:13.159
<v Speaker 2>in Princeton. Israeli soldiers jumped out of the truck and

692
00:49:13.280 --> 00:49:17.159
<v Speaker 2>went inside and started bringing boxes down and loading up

693
00:49:17.440 --> 00:49:20.360
<v Speaker 2>the truck, and then you know, when they were done,

694
00:49:20.400 --> 00:49:22.679
<v Speaker 2>they climbed on board the truck and drove away. And

695
00:49:22.719 --> 00:49:28.360
<v Speaker 2>that was Einstein's papers and the archive being removed from

696
00:49:28.519 --> 00:49:33.519
<v Speaker 2>the Institute for Advanced Studies in Princeton at being transported

697
00:49:33.559 --> 00:49:38.360
<v Speaker 2>to their current resting place at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem.

698
00:49:38.639 --> 00:49:42.840
<v Speaker 2>And that that would be a military and Israeli military operation, apparently,

699
00:49:42.880 --> 00:49:45.960
<v Speaker 2>if we're to take Dyson's word for it to do

700
00:49:46.000 --> 00:49:51.679
<v Speaker 2>that kind of shows the geopolitical significance of Einstein and

701
00:49:52.400 --> 00:49:53.480
<v Speaker 2>Einstein's legacy.

702
00:49:53.880 --> 00:49:57.639
<v Speaker 1>It wouldn't be the first Israeli military operation on the

703
00:49:57.719 --> 00:50:00.679
<v Speaker 1>US soil, for sure, That's not part of our discussion.

704
00:50:00.719 --> 00:50:08.119
<v Speaker 2>But so really, I've said a lot of negative things

705
00:50:08.119 --> 00:50:11.239
<v Speaker 2>about Einstein, but I want to close by pointing out

706
00:50:11.320 --> 00:50:15.280
<v Speaker 2>that his personal story does have something of a redemption arc.

707
00:50:16.559 --> 00:50:20.079
<v Speaker 2>He pioneered the concept of focusing on observables in his

708
00:50:20.239 --> 00:50:25.239
<v Speaker 2>theory of special relativity, but he came to reject that

709
00:50:25.320 --> 00:50:28.760
<v Speaker 2>approach when he saw it applied to quantum mechanics, you're

710
00:50:28.800 --> 00:50:32.199
<v Speaker 2>telling Heisenberg, Perhaps I did use such a philosophy and

711
00:50:32.199 --> 00:50:35.159
<v Speaker 2>also wrote it, but it's nonsense all the same. His

712
00:50:35.960 --> 00:50:41.760
<v Speaker 2>appreciation and adherence to Spinoza's idea of reality being connected

713
00:50:42.079 --> 00:50:45.559
<v Speaker 2>and causal is what led him to say that God

714
00:50:45.599 --> 00:50:48.320
<v Speaker 2>does not play dice with the universe, and he pointed

715
00:50:48.320 --> 00:50:52.400
<v Speaker 2>away to the resolution of quantum paradoxes in what ended

716
00:50:52.480 --> 00:50:56.400
<v Speaker 2>up being his most cited and perhaps most influential paper

717
00:50:56.719 --> 00:50:59.559
<v Speaker 2>in the long run, not anything he did on relativity

718
00:50:59.639 --> 00:51:02.119
<v Speaker 2>or the photo electric effect, but rather the paper he

719
00:51:02.159 --> 00:51:05.159
<v Speaker 2>did with Podolski and Rosen, the E. P. R. Paper

720
00:51:05.480 --> 00:51:09.559
<v Speaker 2>that argues quantum mechanics is not a complete theory without

721
00:51:09.599 --> 00:51:13.880
<v Speaker 2>possibly having additional hidden variables. So I think it's it's

722
00:51:14.000 --> 00:51:17.920
<v Speaker 2>interesting to uh you just take a moment in a

723
00:51:17.960 --> 00:51:22.480
<v Speaker 2>moment and acknowledge his his despite his flaws and defects,

724
00:51:22.840 --> 00:51:27.920
<v Speaker 2>how he may ultimately have ended up rejecting some of

725
00:51:27.960 --> 00:51:30.159
<v Speaker 2>the worst errors of modern physics and pointing the way

726
00:51:30.199 --> 00:51:30.760
<v Speaker 2>to a solution.

727
00:51:31.920 --> 00:51:32.400
<v Speaker 1>Interesting.

728
00:51:35.360 --> 00:51:38.639
<v Speaker 2>So uh, this is uh, you know, our discussion here

729
00:51:38.639 --> 00:51:42.199
<v Speaker 2>today is excerpted from a number of articles I've published

730
00:51:42.239 --> 00:51:47.119
<v Speaker 2>on my fields and energy substack. That's it ETHERSR dot

731
00:51:47.599 --> 00:51:51.199
<v Speaker 2>substack dot com, A E T H E R c

732
00:51:51.360 --> 00:51:53.360
<v Speaker 2>z A R dot com.

733
00:51:54.599 --> 00:51:56.000
<v Speaker 1>I have a let me see if I can pull that

734
00:51:56.159 --> 00:52:06.119
<v Speaker 1>up sure screen present here it is right here there

735
00:52:06.280 --> 00:52:09.360
<v Speaker 1>is so there's your sub stack and then also your

736
00:52:09.440 --> 00:52:14.000
<v Speaker 1>website too, which is although also athersar dot com right right,

737
00:52:14.239 --> 00:52:16.519
<v Speaker 1>and you can be contacted through that. I think this

738
00:52:16.639 --> 00:52:19.400
<v Speaker 1>whole discussion is interesting because I think you can tie

739
00:52:19.440 --> 00:52:23.360
<v Speaker 1>it to current events where there's a lot of ethnicity involved,

740
00:52:23.400 --> 00:52:27.159
<v Speaker 1>and there's a lot of ethnic sensitivities in today, whatever

741
00:52:27.239 --> 00:52:30.920
<v Speaker 1>it could be. It's not just Jewish white people or

742
00:52:30.960 --> 00:52:34.760
<v Speaker 1>whatever it is. It's just there's always some friction and

743
00:52:34.840 --> 00:52:37.079
<v Speaker 1>competition too. I think in a lot of ideas, like

744
00:52:37.199 --> 00:52:40.920
<v Speaker 1>maybe just like maybe celebrities compete against each other sometimes

745
00:52:41.000 --> 00:52:45.639
<v Speaker 1>for the public publicity. Intellectuals and academics do the same thing,

746
00:52:45.920 --> 00:52:50.639
<v Speaker 1>and some people may not understand that or realize it,

747
00:52:50.679 --> 00:52:55.480
<v Speaker 1>but sometimes they're very vicious fights and personals. I think

748
00:52:55.519 --> 00:52:58.360
<v Speaker 1>a Kissinger I will always remember this famous quote by

749
00:52:58.440 --> 00:53:03.400
<v Speaker 1>Kissinger is like fights are always the most the worst.

750
00:53:03.440 --> 00:53:06.199
<v Speaker 1>I can't remember robate him, but because there's so little

751
00:53:06.199 --> 00:53:08.639
<v Speaker 1>at stake or something like that, it kind of comes

752
00:53:08.679 --> 00:53:12.199
<v Speaker 1>to mind. And then Also the celebrity, you think, also

753
00:53:12.360 --> 00:53:15.519
<v Speaker 1>distorts the actual work, and it's easier for people to

754
00:53:15.599 --> 00:53:18.679
<v Speaker 1>kind of astalt personalities and actually go into the details

755
00:53:18.679 --> 00:53:23.159
<v Speaker 1>and sift through actual you know, the hard digging and

756
00:53:23.159 --> 00:53:26.280
<v Speaker 1>figuring out what people's work are in context of other

757
00:53:26.840 --> 00:53:32.760
<v Speaker 1>academicians or other physicists' ideas, and it extrapolates over everything.

758
00:53:32.800 --> 00:53:37.079
<v Speaker 1>So it's it's really is it? This is a current issue?

759
00:53:37.119 --> 00:53:38.679
<v Speaker 1>Like how important is that?

760
00:53:39.119 --> 00:53:43.440
<v Speaker 2>It was very interesting to me to see how Einstein

761
00:53:44.000 --> 00:53:50.119
<v Speaker 2>had very negative views about the Israeli War for independence

762
00:53:50.119 --> 00:53:54.000
<v Speaker 2>and thought that the Zionists were too harsh. I mean,

763
00:53:54.000 --> 00:53:56.960
<v Speaker 2>he was an advocate of the two state solutions. He

764
00:53:57.039 --> 00:54:01.119
<v Speaker 2>thought that jew should live in peace in Palestine with

765
00:54:01.199 --> 00:54:07.840
<v Speaker 2>the Palestinians, and the views that he expressed, particularly comparing

766
00:54:07.880 --> 00:54:13.039
<v Speaker 2>the Herout Party, which of course became the Benjamin Yahu's

767
00:54:13.119 --> 00:54:18.239
<v Speaker 2>Likud party, he was comparing them to fascists and Nazis,

768
00:54:19.119 --> 00:54:25.000
<v Speaker 2>and today that would be kind of a scorched earth offense,

769
00:54:25.119 --> 00:54:27.800
<v Speaker 2>but you know, back in the day that was you know,

770
00:54:27.840 --> 00:54:31.000
<v Speaker 2>he was forgiven and actually offered the presidency of Israel

771
00:54:31.079 --> 00:54:39.159
<v Speaker 2>just a few years later, so it's.

772
00:54:36.599 --> 00:54:38.280
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, there's a lot going on. I mean, it's it

773
00:54:38.360 --> 00:54:42.639
<v Speaker 1>is interesting context. It's kind of like jockeying elbowing, and

774
00:54:42.719 --> 00:54:46.880
<v Speaker 1>also you know the impression about people that they haven't

775
00:54:46.920 --> 00:54:50.880
<v Speaker 1>but he's still he's still seeing like his legacy, aside

776
00:54:50.920 --> 00:54:54.559
<v Speaker 1>from his kind of like public image, his legacy as

777
00:54:54.599 --> 00:54:57.920
<v Speaker 1>a real physicist is is legitimate. I mean, do you

778
00:54:57.960 --> 00:54:58.480
<v Speaker 1>agree with that?

779
00:54:59.840 --> 00:55:02.679
<v Speaker 2>I do? I mean, certainly, well, I highlight a lot

780
00:55:02.719 --> 00:55:08.159
<v Speaker 2>of the issues with his work with the you know,

781
00:55:08.159 --> 00:55:13.239
<v Speaker 2>he left himself open to accusations of plagiarism by not

782
00:55:13.400 --> 00:55:18.239
<v Speaker 2>citing his sources. I think one of the areas he

783
00:55:18.320 --> 00:55:21.159
<v Speaker 2>probably gets more credit than he deserves is in the

784
00:55:21.159 --> 00:55:25.199
<v Speaker 2>whole E equals MC squared idea, which was one of

785
00:55:25.199 --> 00:55:29.800
<v Speaker 2>his papers but had a lot of predecessors, and in fact,

786
00:55:29.840 --> 00:55:32.280
<v Speaker 2>Einstein wasn't the one who ultimately came up with the

787
00:55:33.400 --> 00:55:39.559
<v Speaker 2>general proof of that concept, but he did have very

788
00:55:40.840 --> 00:55:44.400
<v Speaker 2>creative work that he did on the photoelectric effect. In fact,

789
00:55:44.440 --> 00:55:47.079
<v Speaker 2>I think that was the one paper he never got

790
00:55:47.119 --> 00:55:52.119
<v Speaker 2>any accusations of plagiarism on. And we can take issue

791
00:55:52.119 --> 00:55:55.599
<v Speaker 2>with his approach to special relativity for his emphasis on

792
00:55:56.480 --> 00:56:01.239
<v Speaker 2>observables instead of on underlying mechanisms. But you know, I

793
00:56:01.280 --> 00:56:08.079
<v Speaker 2>think people like Oppenheimer and Born himself, and Rutherford, who

794
00:56:08.119 --> 00:56:14.199
<v Speaker 2>pointed out that you know, it's an esthetic appreciation of

795
00:56:14.280 --> 00:56:20.079
<v Speaker 2>the approach. The approach works. You might not appreciate the

796
00:56:20.079 --> 00:56:23.039
<v Speaker 2>way it's formed or the approach he took, but you

797
00:56:23.079 --> 00:56:26.400
<v Speaker 2>can use it to do science. But what I would

798
00:56:27.159 --> 00:56:30.559
<v Speaker 2>advise is not to focus on it to the exclusion

799
00:56:30.559 --> 00:56:34.960
<v Speaker 2>of all alternate approaches. There are many ways to do physics,

800
00:56:35.519 --> 00:56:38.679
<v Speaker 2>and you really do need to have a balance of

801
00:56:38.880 --> 00:56:43.480
<v Speaker 2>the kind of deductive coming up with physics from Axiom's

802
00:56:44.480 --> 00:56:50.039
<v Speaker 2>approach that Einstein pioneered in his earlier life, and the

803
00:56:50.239 --> 00:56:53.000
<v Speaker 2>more inductive, Well, let's look at what's going on with

804
00:56:53.239 --> 00:56:56.920
<v Speaker 2>quantum mechanics and try to figure out the hidden variables

805
00:56:56.960 --> 00:56:59.840
<v Speaker 2>from the problems that we're seeing with it.

806
00:57:00.719 --> 00:57:03.440
<v Speaker 1>Right, So, some of these things are not really as

807
00:57:03.559 --> 00:57:07.559
<v Speaker 1>much arguments over content as much as style. Would you

808
00:57:07.639 --> 00:57:10.800
<v Speaker 1>agree with their aesthetics? Style could be synonymous with US ducks.

809
00:57:10.840 --> 00:57:15.159
<v Speaker 2>Maybe a lot of it is style. I mean, part

810
00:57:15.239 --> 00:57:20.039
<v Speaker 2>of the issue is when you are approaching physics from

811
00:57:20.079 --> 00:57:22.679
<v Speaker 2>this deductive point of view, it's very easy to work

812
00:57:22.719 --> 00:57:30.800
<v Speaker 2>yourself into a sterile system of thought that is focusing

813
00:57:30.840 --> 00:57:33.480
<v Speaker 2>on just coming up with ever more elaborate models to

814
00:57:35.719 --> 00:57:40.039
<v Speaker 2>approach the data instead of stepping back and trying to

815
00:57:40.039 --> 00:57:44.360
<v Speaker 2>come up with alternate models and alternate explanations on an

816
00:57:44.400 --> 00:57:45.239
<v Speaker 2>inductive basis.

817
00:57:45.639 --> 00:57:48.880
<v Speaker 1>Gotcha, great, Thanks so much for your presentation. Thanks so

818
00:57:48.920 --> 00:57:51.320
<v Speaker 1>much for your time. This was part two of Einstein

819
00:57:51.400 --> 00:57:55.280
<v Speaker 1>Relativity and Modern Physics. And check out or other shows

820
00:57:55.760 --> 00:57:58.519
<v Speaker 1>that I've done with on Sean's the first one I

821
00:57:58.559 --> 00:58:00.360
<v Speaker 1>did in May and then the Wise of Heart Modern

822
00:58:00.400 --> 00:58:03.559
<v Speaker 1>Day Reimagining of the Scopes. Muggy draw now put links

823
00:58:03.599 --> 00:58:07.119
<v Speaker 1>to his website and to his substack in the show notes,

824
00:58:07.159 --> 00:58:10.840
<v Speaker 1>so check those out as well. Go subscribe. Hans Schantz

825
00:58:11.039 --> 00:58:13.760
<v Speaker 1>s C H A N t Z. And again we

826
00:58:13.800 --> 00:58:17.000
<v Speaker 1>talked about Einstein relativity in modern physics. Thanks so much

827
00:58:17.039 --> 00:58:19.920
<v Speaker 1>for your time. Oh, thank you. There have
