WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.240 --> 00:00:03.839 Hey everybody, and welcome to the show. A quick note 2 00:00:04.000 --> 00:00:08.160 before we start. The site that we're going to be 3 00:00:08.320 --> 00:00:15.640 talking about is called slot Slayers plural slotslayers dot com, 4 00:00:16.359 --> 00:00:18.800 and we just wanted to make that clear because there 5 00:00:18.879 --> 00:00:24.280 is another site with a similar name, but not this one. Also, 6 00:00:24.399 --> 00:00:27.120 you can always reach me at life is a gamble 7 00:00:27.320 --> 00:00:31.760 pod at gmail dot com, or you can find me 8 00:00:31.879 --> 00:00:38.560 on Twitter at RWM one. Now here's the show. 9 00:00:39.240 --> 00:00:40.079 Good afternoon. 10 00:00:40.399 --> 00:00:42.920 You're listening to Gambling with an Edge. 11 00:00:43.079 --> 00:00:47.000 Now Here are your hosts, Bob Dancer and Richard Munchkin. 12 00:00:47.399 --> 00:00:49.640 Good afternoon, Welcome to Gambling with an Edge. 13 00:00:49.679 --> 00:00:52.079 I'm Bob Dancer and I'm Richard Munchkin. 14 00:00:52.640 --> 00:00:55.399 Today, our guest is Ben Rosenthal, who wrote the book 15 00:00:55.560 --> 00:00:59.920 Breaking the Slot Code and open the website slot slayer 16 00:01:00.560 --> 00:01:03.479 dot com. The purpose of the booking website is to 17 00:01:03.520 --> 00:01:06.959 teach you to be an advantage slot player, a company. 18 00:01:07.400 --> 00:01:10.400 Ben today is his publisher and frequent Gambling with an 19 00:01:10.480 --> 00:01:14.840 Edge guest Anthony Curtis. Gentlemen, welcome to Gambling with an Age. 20 00:01:15.200 --> 00:01:19.480 Thanks having yep, man, when did you begin gambling? And 21 00:01:19.719 --> 00:01:20.319 where was that? 22 00:01:21.480 --> 00:01:26.519 Yeah, so you're talking sickly flots obviously, right, Well, we're 23 00:01:26.519 --> 00:01:28.879 going to get to slots, but if you were gambling 24 00:01:28.920 --> 00:01:31.680 before that, we want to know that too. Oh sure, yeah, 25 00:01:31.719 --> 00:01:35.159 So since since middle school some sixth straight, I've been 26 00:01:35.200 --> 00:01:39.319 playing poker. That was my entry into gambling, and that 27 00:01:39.480 --> 00:01:43.079 kind of coincided with the whole Chris Moneymaker winning the 28 00:01:43.079 --> 00:01:45.920 main event in three and then the boom of the 29 00:01:46.040 --> 00:01:51.200 online uh poker. So that was kind of my entryway 30 00:01:51.280 --> 00:01:52.000 to gambling. 31 00:01:52.640 --> 00:01:54.640 And when did you get to slots? 32 00:01:55.000 --> 00:01:58.920 Slott was twenty nineteen was when my body was starting 33 00:01:58.959 --> 00:02:01.359 to show me the advantage. I mean, advantage flots had 34 00:02:01.400 --> 00:02:03.799 been around before then, but that was when I really 35 00:02:03.799 --> 00:02:04.959 started getting into them. 36 00:02:05.079 --> 00:02:10.039 Okay, most people who understand about advantage slots try to 37 00:02:10.120 --> 00:02:13.240 keep it secret to keep as many people out of 38 00:02:13.280 --> 00:02:17.719 it as possible. How did you decide to write this book? 39 00:02:18.919 --> 00:02:19.199 Yeah? 40 00:02:19.199 --> 00:02:21.919 I mean that was definitely when in the early days, 41 00:02:22.039 --> 00:02:24.639 kind of the wild weft days of if they had flots, 42 00:02:24.639 --> 00:02:27.639 it was a really frowned upon thing to tell people 43 00:02:27.680 --> 00:02:28.919 about them, because you. 44 00:02:29.080 --> 00:02:31.000 Just created work competition for yourself. 45 00:02:31.520 --> 00:02:34.759 These days, it's not as big a secret, so I 46 00:02:34.759 --> 00:02:38.240 felt I didn't feel as bad publishing a book and 47 00:02:38.400 --> 00:02:39.439 having a website go up. 48 00:02:39.919 --> 00:02:41.800 Yeah, let me jump let me let me jump in 49 00:02:41.800 --> 00:02:43.919 here on that real quick too. You know, when we 50 00:02:44.000 --> 00:02:47.039 published a Huntington Press, we know a lot of things 51 00:02:47.080 --> 00:02:49.680 we don't publish, and you know, we've known about this 52 00:02:49.759 --> 00:02:54.439 for quite a while. We waited and waited until enough 53 00:02:54.520 --> 00:02:57.400 information was out there that we didn't feel we were 54 00:02:57.919 --> 00:03:02.520 breaking any codes, not so to speak, by doing this. 55 00:03:03.000 --> 00:03:06.240 And Ben had actually put this book out. I was 56 00:03:06.719 --> 00:03:09.680 himself when we came across and said, well, this is 57 00:03:09.680 --> 00:03:12.080 the best thing we've seen, and we think we can 58 00:03:12.159 --> 00:03:13.840 make it better, and we think we can make it. 59 00:03:14.400 --> 00:03:16.280 So that's why we That's why we did it. You know, 60 00:03:16.280 --> 00:03:18.039 we really held up quite a while after. 61 00:03:19.599 --> 00:03:25.719 Yeah, I And there certainly has been many other site, 62 00:03:26.240 --> 00:03:29.960 many half a dozen at least sites talking about this 63 00:03:30.039 --> 00:03:34.319 for the last number of years. But Ben, were you 64 00:03:34.439 --> 00:03:37.800 playing profession for a living or was this like a 65 00:03:37.840 --> 00:03:39.120 part time gig for you? 66 00:03:39.680 --> 00:03:39.919 Bob? 67 00:03:40.000 --> 00:03:41.520 Initially it was and it still is. 68 00:03:41.560 --> 00:03:43.960 I got a bitch and poker my two main sources 69 00:03:43.960 --> 00:03:46.599 of income. And prior to that I did have a 70 00:03:46.639 --> 00:03:50.159 real job because I had a sports website. But I've 71 00:03:50.159 --> 00:03:52.919 been doing this now poker and slots for the last 72 00:03:52.960 --> 00:03:54.479 four years. Pretty much full. 73 00:03:54.280 --> 00:03:58.479 Time, and so you were not I mean, what was 74 00:03:59.159 --> 00:04:04.039 what was the ben of writing the book? What I mean, 75 00:04:04.680 --> 00:04:06.400 what was the upside? 76 00:04:07.039 --> 00:04:08.639 Well, I mean to make some money, I guess, but 77 00:04:10.199 --> 00:04:11.080 I didn't really, I don't know. 78 00:04:11.080 --> 00:04:13.639 I've been thinking about it for a while. I know 79 00:04:13.680 --> 00:04:16.000 there had been other content out there, machine Pro Club 80 00:04:16.040 --> 00:04:18.639 being the big one, some patreons which you sort of 81 00:04:18.639 --> 00:04:20.759 reference with the different sites out there. So I was like, 82 00:04:20.839 --> 00:04:22.360 let me see if I could do it, do it 83 00:04:22.360 --> 00:04:24.040 my way to do it better maybe, So that was 84 00:04:24.120 --> 00:04:26.399 kind of the reason for doing it. 85 00:04:27.879 --> 00:04:29.639 And are you still playing full time? 86 00:04:30.120 --> 00:04:32.040 That's choker, Yes. 87 00:04:32.720 --> 00:04:34.879 So how is your product different to what they have 88 00:04:34.959 --> 00:04:36.120 at Machine Pro Club? 89 00:04:37.040 --> 00:04:39.079 Yeah, well, see I don't have a membership to Machine 90 00:04:39.079 --> 00:04:42.360 Pro Club, but I've definitely seen enough of the free 91 00:04:42.399 --> 00:04:45.600 content out there, and I try to simplify mine as 92 00:04:45.639 --> 00:04:47.800 much as possible to an average person who might not 93 00:04:47.920 --> 00:04:50.920 be doing slots nearly as the extent I am. So 94 00:04:51.000 --> 00:04:53.720 I really tried to with videos, which is a thing 95 00:04:53.759 --> 00:04:56.480 that Machine Pro Club doesn't really incorporate too much, if 96 00:04:56.480 --> 00:04:58.959 at all. So I have a video breakdown for all 97 00:04:58.959 --> 00:05:01.120 these different games I cover, which is at this point 98 00:05:01.160 --> 00:05:04.439 over two hundred different slots, and like I said, I 99 00:05:04.480 --> 00:05:06.680 really just try to break it down. ABC is as 100 00:05:06.720 --> 00:05:08.920 simple as possible, so I can have my mom going 101 00:05:08.959 --> 00:05:11.800 to the casino and she'd have a chance of understanding 102 00:05:11.839 --> 00:05:12.279 the stuff. 103 00:05:13.480 --> 00:05:16.920 Well, when we when we considered that we might open 104 00:05:16.959 --> 00:05:20.600 the website, we subscribe, by we, I mean Huntington Press, 105 00:05:20.800 --> 00:05:23.240 LA's biggest advis are here. We subscribe to all of them, 106 00:05:23.800 --> 00:05:25.839 and we took a look at them and we said, look, 107 00:05:25.879 --> 00:05:27.720 if we can't do this better, we're not going. 108 00:05:27.560 --> 00:05:27.959 To do it. 109 00:05:28.279 --> 00:05:31.879 And like Ben said, they were out there in front 110 00:05:31.879 --> 00:05:37.040 of us, but they it's complicated and ours is basically 111 00:05:37.240 --> 00:05:40.040 all of our efforts were made towards dumbing it down, 112 00:05:40.319 --> 00:05:42.000 so you know, dumbing it down as much as we 113 00:05:42.040 --> 00:05:44.800 could so as many people could understand. But the main thing, 114 00:05:45.160 --> 00:05:47.279 the thing that tipped me on it was the videos. 115 00:05:47.800 --> 00:05:49.839 Like none of these places had videos. I mean every 116 00:05:49.839 --> 00:05:52.639 one of ours, every one of our games discussed, has 117 00:05:52.680 --> 00:05:56.720 a video with Ben doing the voiceover and explaining what's 118 00:05:56.759 --> 00:05:58.519 going on. And I mean you can read as many 119 00:05:58.560 --> 00:06:00.480 books as you want and look at things on the net, 120 00:06:00.480 --> 00:06:01.959 but there's nothing like seeing it in action. 121 00:06:02.439 --> 00:06:05.600 So that was I will I will say there is 122 00:06:05.800 --> 00:06:08.959 there is a newer Patreon Death Later or gaming. He 123 00:06:09.040 --> 00:06:11.720 does do a lot of videos, but that's a newer 124 00:06:11.920 --> 00:06:14.839 within the last year or so, and he doesn't have 125 00:06:14.920 --> 00:06:17.199 that many games yet. But I don't want to completely 126 00:06:17.199 --> 00:06:20.000 discount him. He has some good stuff as well. 127 00:06:20.199 --> 00:06:24.199 So I'm sure what people are thinking is how much 128 00:06:24.279 --> 00:06:27.399 is the site, how much is the subscription to the site, 129 00:06:27.480 --> 00:06:31.040 and how does that compare to the other sites that 130 00:06:31.160 --> 00:06:31.560 offer this. 131 00:06:33.519 --> 00:06:35.439 Well, we looked I'll talk about that because I was 132 00:06:35.439 --> 00:06:38.720 in charge of pricing, and we looked at all the others, 133 00:06:39.360 --> 00:06:42.399 and I actually came with, you know, my first he 134 00:06:42.959 --> 00:06:44.720 was come with a higher number. I'll explain what our 135 00:06:44.800 --> 00:06:47.319 numbers are in a minute. And I got talked out 136 00:06:47.319 --> 00:06:49.560 of it by Ben and others saying, look, you know, 137 00:06:49.720 --> 00:06:52.040 let's let's make it. Let's make it a little bit 138 00:06:52.040 --> 00:06:58.920 more accessible to the masses. So our prices actually come 139 00:06:59.000 --> 00:07:01.519 down are a little bit lower, not by a heck 140 00:07:01.519 --> 00:07:02.959 of a lot, but a little bit lower than the 141 00:07:03.000 --> 00:07:06.600 other major ones out there. We have three pricing tiers. 142 00:07:07.160 --> 00:07:11.000 One is thirty bucks a month, and so that you 143 00:07:11.040 --> 00:07:13.040 can just go month to month. It's recurring. What you 144 00:07:13.160 --> 00:07:15.319 get in it recurs until you stop at thirty bucks 145 00:07:15.360 --> 00:07:18.160 a month, so that's three you know, that's three sixty 146 00:07:18.199 --> 00:07:20.000 a year. If you want to go in for a 147 00:07:20.040 --> 00:07:22.240 full year, we do it seventies, so you get three 148 00:07:22.279 --> 00:07:24.839 months free and then we have a third which is 149 00:07:24.879 --> 00:07:27.279 one hundred dollars for a year, and that comes with 150 00:07:27.360 --> 00:07:29.959 everything but the videos. And you would go, whyou anybody 151 00:07:30.000 --> 00:07:32.720 do that? Well, we've got some things on there. You 152 00:07:32.720 --> 00:07:34.240 know what we go what do we call that? The 153 00:07:35.079 --> 00:07:37.160 instant strategies or condensed strategies? 154 00:07:37.240 --> 00:07:38.279 Correct, right, yep. 155 00:07:38.839 --> 00:07:41.000 And a lot of people like these condensed strategies we 156 00:07:41.079 --> 00:07:43.759 have and they're being added all the time. And some 157 00:07:43.800 --> 00:07:45.240 people go, I don't need to see the video. I 158 00:07:45.240 --> 00:07:47.000 already know how to play these, but I like hearing 159 00:07:47.079 --> 00:07:48.920 about these new games. So that's one hundred a year. 160 00:07:49.920 --> 00:07:53.000 The other thing we have is the uh semester words. 161 00:07:53.240 --> 00:07:54.920 And you know, I think that all of these places 162 00:07:54.920 --> 00:07:59.199 have message boards and that's a terrific collaborative thing. Bends 163 00:07:59.279 --> 00:08:02.920 on them, like religiously, I'm on there from time to time. 164 00:08:03.040 --> 00:08:05.720 Others are are, you know, putting their two cents in. 165 00:08:06.399 --> 00:08:08.839 And that's the whole package there, along with you know, 166 00:08:08.920 --> 00:08:10.680 some some blogs and things like that. 167 00:08:12.279 --> 00:08:15.519 And so when these new games come out, then are 168 00:08:15.560 --> 00:08:18.959 you a numbers guy or how do you get your 169 00:08:19.040 --> 00:08:22.920 numbers for what you think is the right place to play? 170 00:08:23.399 --> 00:08:25.800 Sure, well, when a when a new game comes out 171 00:08:25.800 --> 00:08:27.920 and I've never played it before, I can't post about it. 172 00:08:27.959 --> 00:08:30.079 I need to play it a good amount. I have 173 00:08:30.160 --> 00:08:32.799 some friends who do this professionally as well. I bounce 174 00:08:32.919 --> 00:08:34.919 numbers off and we kind of come up with what 175 00:08:34.960 --> 00:08:36.919 we think ballpark, what we think the numbers might be, 176 00:08:37.279 --> 00:08:39.120 and then with more of a sample, then I feel 177 00:08:39.159 --> 00:08:44.519 more comfortable providing some some uh some numbers on the site. 178 00:08:44.559 --> 00:08:46.200 But I don't when a new game comes out. I'm 179 00:08:46.240 --> 00:08:48.039 not automatically like, okay, I got to put this on 180 00:08:48.080 --> 00:08:49.919 the side. I needs to do some definitely a lot 181 00:08:49.919 --> 00:08:50.960 of trial and error first. 182 00:08:52.279 --> 00:08:54.600 I think you guys know this too, you know, Bob 183 00:08:54.639 --> 00:08:58.600 and Richard. These numbers get massaged as we go, you know, 184 00:08:58.639 --> 00:09:00.960 I mean, you talk to other people. The only way 185 00:09:01.000 --> 00:09:03.200 to really know is to have the par sheets and 186 00:09:03.360 --> 00:09:06.039 you know the information that you really can't get to. 187 00:09:07.039 --> 00:09:08.399 So this is the way it's got to be done. 188 00:09:08.440 --> 00:09:11.679 But it's a lot of collaborative work with people, bring 189 00:09:11.679 --> 00:09:13.639 in information. Go. Yeah, this is where we think it is, 190 00:09:14.080 --> 00:09:17.120 and then on the website it gets adjusted through conversation, 191 00:09:17.320 --> 00:09:19.759 and you know, we update the reviews and so forth 192 00:09:20.080 --> 00:09:22.960 as we get better at it. Any different game as 193 00:09:22.960 --> 00:09:28.440 it comes out, is what I mean. Sure, So our 194 00:09:28.720 --> 00:09:34.080 mutual friend Max Rubin, you know, his take on all 195 00:09:34.159 --> 00:09:39.120 this is that the casinos are known to overreact to things. 196 00:09:40.000 --> 00:09:42.279 And you know, a lot of. 197 00:09:42.240 --> 00:09:44.879 These sites, I don't think the casinos are even aware 198 00:09:44.919 --> 00:09:47.879 of them, or they discount them because they're too small 199 00:09:48.039 --> 00:09:51.519 or whatever. But coming from Huntington Press, I think you 200 00:09:51.600 --> 00:09:54.480 have a much bigger profile. Are you concerned at all 201 00:09:54.559 --> 00:09:57.000 about the casinos overreacting to this? 202 00:09:58.399 --> 00:09:59.080 Go ahead, mend. 203 00:10:00.039 --> 00:10:01.960 Yeah, I mean it could happen. If I'm being honest, 204 00:10:02.000 --> 00:10:04.039 I think it could happen. I don't think it would 205 00:10:04.080 --> 00:10:06.320 just be because of this. I mean, I think casinos 206 00:10:06.320 --> 00:10:08.519 are definitely any casino is going to be aware of 207 00:10:08.519 --> 00:10:10.960 advantage playt this point, even if they're not checking some 208 00:10:11.000 --> 00:10:14.080 small Patreon website, there's enough people doing it that it's 209 00:10:14.120 --> 00:10:16.840 on their radar. This maybe is this the tipping point. 210 00:10:16.879 --> 00:10:20.279 I don't know, but yeah, it's definitely on my mind. 211 00:10:20.320 --> 00:10:21.759 When I was doing this. In some of the wording, 212 00:10:21.840 --> 00:10:25.000 I try not to be as as aggressive as maybe 213 00:10:25.080 --> 00:10:26.200 I could be, but I try to. 214 00:10:26.480 --> 00:10:26.919 I try to. 215 00:10:27.679 --> 00:10:31.240 I do think about that. It is something I'm thinking about. 216 00:10:31.799 --> 00:10:33.360 Well, you know, Ben and I had a lot of 217 00:10:33.360 --> 00:10:36.960 discussions about this about what, you know, what should we 218 00:10:37.000 --> 00:10:38.559 say and what should we not say? What are the 219 00:10:38.600 --> 00:10:40.919 casinos going to do? You know, there comes to points 220 00:10:41.320 --> 00:10:44.240 where the information is out there and you know, we 221 00:10:44.320 --> 00:10:46.080 know they know about it wherever. You know, I said 222 00:10:46.120 --> 00:10:48.120 this earlier in the show. We're not giving anything up. 223 00:10:48.279 --> 00:10:50.639 But think back to black Check when card counting started, 224 00:10:50.840 --> 00:10:53.120 did everybody say, oh, we can't write about card counting 225 00:10:53.360 --> 00:10:55.919 because you know, then the casinos will do something. You know, 226 00:10:56.639 --> 00:10:58.639 what what are they going to do there? You know, 227 00:10:58.759 --> 00:11:01.840 I just wrote this in the lsbgess Advisor. The current issue. 228 00:11:01.879 --> 00:11:05.519 They're in a bit of a quandary because they make 229 00:11:05.559 --> 00:11:08.519 a lot of money on these games. These variable state 230 00:11:08.600 --> 00:11:11.600 games are fun, they're fun to play. The general public 231 00:11:11.679 --> 00:11:14.320 loves to play them. The casinos make their money no 232 00:11:14.399 --> 00:11:16.799 matter who hits the jackpot, they make the same amount 233 00:11:16.840 --> 00:11:20.039 of money. What they don't like is it anders players 234 00:11:20.120 --> 00:11:22.399 hitting the jackpot because they figure they're going to walk 235 00:11:22.440 --> 00:11:24.399 out with the money, which a lot of them do, 236 00:11:24.519 --> 00:11:25.879 and a lot of them don't. A lot of them 237 00:11:25.919 --> 00:11:28.320 have leaks and they go right to something else, but 238 00:11:29.200 --> 00:11:31.759 a number of them will. So that's what they're concerned about. 239 00:11:32.279 --> 00:11:34.919 Are they going to bite their own heads off and 240 00:11:34.960 --> 00:11:37.279 take these games out because they don't want certain winners? 241 00:11:37.480 --> 00:11:41.440 More likely they're going to react by ejecting people, no 242 00:11:41.600 --> 00:11:44.440 mailing people, taking countermeasures like that. I don't think they're 243 00:11:44.440 --> 00:11:47.080 going to take out the games. Yeah. 244 00:11:47.120 --> 00:11:50.519 I've been saying for years that, like nothing lasts forever, 245 00:11:51.159 --> 00:11:56.480 you know, this was going to happen eventually, and it did, 246 00:11:56.639 --> 00:12:02.159 and like and just like blackjack, you know, everything changes everything, 247 00:12:02.320 --> 00:12:05.600 it always changes, and the good players are going to 248 00:12:05.679 --> 00:12:08.919 adapt and still find a way to make money and 249 00:12:09.600 --> 00:12:12.480 other people maybe move on, which may not be a 250 00:12:12.519 --> 00:12:14.799 bad thing because it means less competition. 251 00:12:17.039 --> 00:12:21.440 Yeah, I think, Anthony, that's a good point. I meant 252 00:12:21.440 --> 00:12:23.840 to bring up a lot of these guys who are 253 00:12:23.840 --> 00:12:26.320 advantage players. There's you know, there's levels to this kind 254 00:12:26.320 --> 00:12:29.720 of thing. Some of these guys they'll spew their money 255 00:12:29.799 --> 00:12:33.159 elsewhere in the casino. They'll play crabs, they'll play they'll 256 00:12:33.200 --> 00:12:35.639 play blackjack poorly, They'll do all sorts of stuff. So 257 00:12:35.919 --> 00:12:37.480 a lot of these guys, even if they might know 258 00:12:37.480 --> 00:12:39.279 how to beat some of these machines, they don't know 259 00:12:39.279 --> 00:12:39.799 how to beat. 260 00:12:39.679 --> 00:12:40.120 All of them. 261 00:12:40.320 --> 00:12:41.759 They don't have the right numbers. 262 00:12:41.799 --> 00:12:43.440 A lot of times they know just enough to kind 263 00:12:43.440 --> 00:12:46.440 of spoil a play, but they don't have the perfect numbers, 264 00:12:46.480 --> 00:12:48.039 and they end up giving a lot of their money 265 00:12:48.159 --> 00:12:49.679 or all of it back to the casino anyway. And 266 00:12:50.240 --> 00:12:53.159 casinos are aware of this too, So, yeah, there's certain 267 00:12:53.240 --> 00:12:56.440 advantage players who don't have any leaks like that, But 268 00:12:56.559 --> 00:12:58.480 a lot of them do well. 269 00:12:58.759 --> 00:13:00.919 You don't play them in bed numbers. A lot of 270 00:13:00.919 --> 00:13:03.519 people they'll go, oh, it's close enough, I'm going to 271 00:13:03.559 --> 00:13:06.080 do it. You know, clost enough is not good enough, 272 00:13:06.200 --> 00:13:07.679 you know, it's it's got to be. It's gotta be 273 00:13:07.679 --> 00:13:10.200 writers close to writer as you can get it well. 274 00:13:10.240 --> 00:13:17.200 Also, a lot of the recreational players have learned that, gee, 275 00:13:17.240 --> 00:13:19.600 it's better to take the machine when it's in a 276 00:13:19.679 --> 00:13:22.840 higher number because they see people checking and things like that. 277 00:13:23.200 --> 00:13:25.720 They don't know what the number is, but you know, 278 00:13:25.759 --> 00:13:28.639 they're gonna take a higher number rather than a lower number. 279 00:13:28.840 --> 00:13:31.759 But if they can't find a positive game, they're still 280 00:13:31.759 --> 00:13:35.399 gonna play, you know, And and I see that happen 281 00:13:35.480 --> 00:13:36.159 all the time. 282 00:13:36.279 --> 00:13:39.519 Were percent. I agree with you that every every day 283 00:13:39.559 --> 00:13:39.960 I see that. 284 00:13:40.039 --> 00:13:42.320 I can see people who have half a clue or 285 00:13:42.360 --> 00:13:44.600 you know, I mean, anyone would know ten's better than nine. 286 00:13:44.840 --> 00:13:46.639 But I mean, if they don't find their number, they're 287 00:13:46.639 --> 00:13:48.480 gonna play it regardless, or they're gonna play it way 288 00:13:48.519 --> 00:13:48.799 too low. 289 00:13:48.799 --> 00:13:50.600 But yeah, that happens every day for sure. 290 00:13:51.159 --> 00:13:51.480 I think. 291 00:13:52.039 --> 00:13:56.519 I think the biggest problem, the biggest concern is perceived 292 00:13:56.600 --> 00:13:58.960 persistence what they call so a lot of people call 293 00:13:59.000 --> 00:14:02.440 it these games persistently games, and then you have what's 294 00:14:02.480 --> 00:14:06.080 perceived persistence, so it looks like it's building, it looks 295 00:14:06.120 --> 00:14:09.399 like you've got something. You know, a pig's ready to explode, 296 00:14:09.480 --> 00:14:11.440 or the drums are filling up with you know, they're 297 00:14:11.440 --> 00:14:14.879 about to overflow, and it has nothing to do with 298 00:14:15.120 --> 00:14:21.200 the the expectation, but it's perceived. And that's, honestly, is 299 00:14:21.240 --> 00:14:25.200 a big part of where the website comes in. Somebody 300 00:14:25.440 --> 00:14:27.000 we just had one the other day. Guy says, I 301 00:14:27.000 --> 00:14:29.440 play in Detroit and I love this game. I've been 302 00:14:29.480 --> 00:14:32.360 winning on it, and you know, where where should I? 303 00:14:32.360 --> 00:14:34.559 I don't see anything about it? And Ben rode back 304 00:14:34.600 --> 00:14:36.679 to me. He said, that's a perceived persistence game. You've 305 00:14:36.679 --> 00:14:39.879 been getting lucky. Stopped playing that game right away. And 306 00:14:40.039 --> 00:14:41.960 you know, as more of these come out, because they'll 307 00:14:42.000 --> 00:14:44.840 try to fool people with those, you need to know 308 00:14:44.879 --> 00:14:48.120 which ones to avoid. And that's a big positive of 309 00:14:48.159 --> 00:14:50.000 being a member of the website like this. 310 00:14:51.080 --> 00:14:54.039 You know. The other thing is we're for the Las 311 00:14:54.159 --> 00:15:00.120 Vegas Strip. The pros are actually good for the They 312 00:15:00.200 --> 00:15:04.200 will never believe this, but it's actually good for them 313 00:15:04.600 --> 00:15:09.519 to have pros because they're getting a lot of extra 314 00:15:09.639 --> 00:15:14.120 action that they wouldn't get at all. And it's one 315 00:15:14.200 --> 00:15:19.039 thing if you have regular players like a locals joint, 316 00:15:19.360 --> 00:15:22.279 but on the strip, they've decided to butcher the cow 317 00:15:22.519 --> 00:15:27.320 instead of milk it, so they have the worst rtps 318 00:15:27.399 --> 00:15:31.360 of anybody. They have triple and quadruple zero roulette, and 319 00:15:31.840 --> 00:15:34.159 they just want to rape whoever comes in the door. 320 00:15:34.720 --> 00:15:38.440 So they don't it doesn't matter to them that the 321 00:15:38.759 --> 00:15:44.000 bad player isn't winning that jackpot because they're just going 322 00:15:44.080 --> 00:15:46.840 to take all of that player's money anyway, and so 323 00:15:46.960 --> 00:15:49.679 anything that goes through the machine by a pro is 324 00:15:49.799 --> 00:15:51.120 added profit for them. 325 00:15:51.440 --> 00:15:54.080 It's what we've been talking about for the last year 326 00:15:54.080 --> 00:15:56.639 and a half the Vegas gouch, and I mean that's 327 00:15:56.639 --> 00:15:59.480 what's going on. The gouge is happening everywhere. Is happening 328 00:15:59.480 --> 00:16:02.440 with zor frees, is happening with parking fees. 329 00:16:02.639 --> 00:16:03.519 But it's also. 330 00:16:03.360 --> 00:16:05.679 Happening in the tightening of the games, and they want 331 00:16:05.759 --> 00:16:08.639 every single penny and they don't want anybody coming through 332 00:16:08.919 --> 00:16:10.679 and taking that money that they're not going to get 333 00:16:10.720 --> 00:16:12.919 you back at I think it's got to come to 334 00:16:13.000 --> 00:16:16.000 a point where somebody at top says, leave it alone. 335 00:16:16.120 --> 00:16:17.879 To a certain degree, you want to throw out the 336 00:16:17.879 --> 00:16:20.039 bad guys. Throw out the bad guys, but we're not 337 00:16:20.080 --> 00:16:22.320 gonna cut our heads off by getting rid of these 338 00:16:22.320 --> 00:16:23.000 great machines. 339 00:16:23.840 --> 00:16:26.279 I think. I don't think they'll take out the machines. 340 00:16:26.639 --> 00:16:29.919 Yeah, I think Vegas is kind of a special case too, 341 00:16:30.000 --> 00:16:32.919 as far as you have so many tourists to come 342 00:16:32.919 --> 00:16:35.759 in that you don't really need your regulars as much 343 00:16:35.799 --> 00:16:37.639 as you might if you're kind of like a smaller 344 00:16:37.639 --> 00:16:40.360 casino in the middle of nowhere, where it is maybe 345 00:16:40.399 --> 00:16:43.240 more problematic to have advantage players. In Vegas, you're going 346 00:16:43.279 --> 00:16:46.120 to have kind of a cycle of new people coming in. So, 347 00:16:46.600 --> 00:16:49.600 like you said, the advantage players are showing some huge 348 00:16:49.600 --> 00:16:51.679 betting numbers. These machines are getting four or five times 349 00:16:51.720 --> 00:16:54.720 as much action as some dust collector sitting in the corner. 350 00:16:54.759 --> 00:16:58.279 So I mean these by those metrics. It's definitely nice 351 00:16:58.279 --> 00:17:00.679 to have advantage players in Vegas. If you're looking at 352 00:17:00.720 --> 00:17:03.240 it like that, you know, I know we're talking. 353 00:17:03.440 --> 00:17:05.119 This is gambling with an edge and where you know, 354 00:17:05.200 --> 00:17:06.839 I know where We've got a lot of pros out 355 00:17:06.880 --> 00:17:09.079 there listening, going do I want to do this? I'm 356 00:17:09.079 --> 00:17:10.880 gonna make a I want to make a point about this. 357 00:17:11.920 --> 00:17:13.519 If you want to work hard, you can make a 358 00:17:13.559 --> 00:17:15.279 living at this. I know people who are doing it. 359 00:17:15.319 --> 00:17:17.000 Ben those people who are doing it. He's doing it. 360 00:17:17.960 --> 00:17:20.920 But what's really cool is that it's a good side 361 00:17:20.960 --> 00:17:24.079 gig man. It's like when you're walking through when you're 362 00:17:24.079 --> 00:17:26.839 just a regular player, you're walking around, you see one, 363 00:17:27.160 --> 00:17:30.119 you go play it. It happens all the time. Like 364 00:17:30.160 --> 00:17:32.720 when I'm out with my buddies, who before this knew 365 00:17:32.720 --> 00:17:34.799 more about it than me. They're like, here's a good one. 366 00:17:34.839 --> 00:17:36.640 You want to go partners. You know this one's got 367 00:17:36.680 --> 00:17:38.279 a lot of risk, this one's volatile. You want to 368 00:17:38.319 --> 00:17:39.799 go partners on this one. Or I'm going to play 369 00:17:39.839 --> 00:17:41.519 this one. I'll be done with this in five minutes 370 00:17:41.759 --> 00:17:44.039 and boom we're knocking off money. Same thing as playing 371 00:17:44.119 --> 00:17:47.200 Ultimate X. You find Ultimate X in every bar, you 372 00:17:47.240 --> 00:17:49.640 find the hangars. You know you've got if you've got 373 00:17:49.680 --> 00:17:52.400 a two times a two times Ultimate X hanger on 374 00:17:52.480 --> 00:17:54.240 a ten play, you got a four and a half 375 00:17:54.279 --> 00:17:57.880 percent edge just a single two timer. And so you're 376 00:17:57.920 --> 00:18:01.079 playing these games with gigantic edges and small but it 377 00:18:01.119 --> 00:18:03.400 adds you make money at the end of the year 378 00:18:03.440 --> 00:18:05.480 by the time it's done. And I'll add this one 379 00:18:05.519 --> 00:18:07.680 thing we did. I insisted we have this chapter on 380 00:18:07.759 --> 00:18:10.240 Ultimate X, even though it's not a slot machine, because 381 00:18:10.279 --> 00:18:15.319 nobody had published the proper strategy. Even Us Shackelford did one. 382 00:18:15.359 --> 00:18:18.200 He didn't quite understand it. He was too conservative. He'll 383 00:18:18.240 --> 00:18:20.279 fix that in the next book. But one of the 384 00:18:20.279 --> 00:18:22.960 twenty five chapters is proper play of Ultimate X. And 385 00:18:23.000 --> 00:18:26.359 I think being able to find these machines, you know, 386 00:18:26.440 --> 00:18:29.079 on a lark and go ooh, good, one man, I'm 387 00:18:29.079 --> 00:18:32.480 going to play that with positive expectation. It's strong. 388 00:18:34.160 --> 00:18:37.039 I think you're the player. You're describing Anthony as kind 389 00:18:37.039 --> 00:18:40.319 of the model. How I modeled how we modeled the website. 390 00:18:40.440 --> 00:18:42.960 It's this more casual player who's out at the casino, 391 00:18:43.279 --> 00:18:45.160 not someone who's necessarily going to be a full time 392 00:18:45.240 --> 00:18:47.079 or like I am. I mean, you certainly could be, 393 00:18:47.119 --> 00:18:48.440 you'd have to put in a lot of time. But 394 00:18:49.079 --> 00:18:52.039 this is the way the website's built and how it's 395 00:18:52.200 --> 00:18:53.720 with the with the videos and how to trying to 396 00:18:53.720 --> 00:18:56.759 simplify everything. It's far more of a casual person. Not 397 00:18:56.799 --> 00:18:59.119 to say someone who does this all the time. They 398 00:18:59.119 --> 00:19:00.559 could get a lot of use from as well. But 399 00:19:00.599 --> 00:19:02.200 that was kind of the person I had in mind 400 00:19:02.480 --> 00:19:05.400 when I was doing these different write ups and videos. 401 00:19:05.400 --> 00:19:08.440