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<v Speaker 1>You're listening to KFI AM sixty on demand.

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<v Speaker 2>Joshua, Welcome to the Jesus Christ Show.

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<v Speaker 1>My lord, Hello, I have been a student of yours

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<v Speaker 1>for forty years, and I have one question for you.

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<v Speaker 3>There's one thing that challenges my pay and that is

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<v Speaker 3>the suffering of the innocent.

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<v Speaker 4>Okay, well, that that weighs on a lot of people, obviously,

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<v Speaker 4>But tooth academically, it's it's easier to look at and

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<v Speaker 4>I know that when you're going through pain, or when

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<v Speaker 4>you see a child dying or something like this, that

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<v Speaker 4>it becomes a whole different question with emotions involved.

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<v Speaker 2>But if you're looking.

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<v Speaker 4>Strictly, strictly with scripture, there is no one innocent. For one,

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<v Speaker 4>there's no such thing as an innocent. Scripture says that

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<v Speaker 4>all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God.

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<v Speaker 5>All.

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<v Speaker 4>It doesn't say everyone except this group or everyone that

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<v Speaker 4>group now innocent by human standards. Becomes kind of contest

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<v Speaker 4>of well, I'm not as bad as that person, so

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<v Speaker 4>it stops being innocent, and it's it, it starts being

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<v Speaker 4>well less guilty than the last person. Now, having said that,

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<v Speaker 4>that's theologically and academically looking at you know what innocence is. Uh,

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<v Speaker 4>And there's oftentimes and you may have heard this on

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<v Speaker 4>the program that if you go and you listen to

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<v Speaker 4>the program, you'll hear people call up and say, well,

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<v Speaker 4>this happened to me, and why bad things keep happening

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<v Speaker 4>to me? And you spend enough time and you start

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<v Speaker 4>to unravel them, and.

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<v Speaker 2>You'll see where.

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<v Speaker 4>Where you play a larger part and the things that

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<v Speaker 4>go on in your life than you think. Now everybody

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<v Speaker 4>blames God, but really you you sit there and drink

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<v Speaker 4>broken glass and then complain to God that you have

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<v Speaker 4>blood in your stool, there's an issue. It's really Uh,

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<v Speaker 4>it's really about the things that you do in your

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<v Speaker 4>life as well as being in a world with others

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<v Speaker 4>that do wrong. So you can, for instance, be a

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<v Speaker 4>wonderful driver and you know, play by the rules, and

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<v Speaker 4>someone else can drink and t bone you when you're

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<v Speaker 4>in an intersection and cause harm or death. So what

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<v Speaker 4>you do in this life reflects on others as well. Now,

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<v Speaker 4>all of those things are really by human standards. When

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<v Speaker 4>people say, well it's not fair or how can bad

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<v Speaker 4>things happen? Well, really, the concept of bad is defined

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<v Speaker 4>by what has to be defined outside of just what

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<v Speaker 4>your desire of good and bad is, because it has

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<v Speaker 4>to be bigger than that. There are some people that

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<v Speaker 4>think that it's okay to harm children. Well, it's not

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<v Speaker 4>okay to harm children. Why because God says it's not

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<v Speaker 4>okay to harm children. And there needs to be a

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<v Speaker 4>transcendent law giver that's above all those things to begin with,

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<v Speaker 4>from what you can even judge what good and bad is.

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<v Speaker 4>So these standards that you're using, in one sense, are

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<v Speaker 4>God's standards. You're saying this is right or this is wrong,

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<v Speaker 4>and the bad things are happening. But also God says

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<v Speaker 4>that there are times where there are things in your

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<v Speaker 4>life that you may think are bad. There's a lot

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<v Speaker 4>of things that come with pain in life. The hedonistic

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<v Speaker 4>belief system was that that which felt good was good

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<v Speaker 4>and that which felt bad was bad. But you know

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<v Speaker 4>in this world that not everything that feels bad is

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<v Speaker 4>bad and not everything that feels good is good. So

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<v Speaker 4>you start looking at the standard differently and how it

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<v Speaker 4>plays a part in your life. You know, the sweat

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<v Speaker 4>of your brow when you're working could be tiresome or painful,

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<v Speaker 4>but it's productive and helpful.

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<v Speaker 2>Saying if you work out.

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<v Speaker 4>When you work out, you're actually tearing your muscles apart

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<v Speaker 4>and letting them grow back together. It feels like destruction.

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<v Speaker 4>And there's all kinds of things in your life that

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<v Speaker 4>don't feel good or may seem bad that aren't. Now

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<v Speaker 4>when truly horrible things happen, everyone looks at the person

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<v Speaker 4>that they perceive to be innocent and says, this person

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<v Speaker 4>didn't deserve it. However, you need to look at the

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<v Speaker 4>other person that's causing it or the other things that

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<v Speaker 4>are going on, to see what decisions were made there

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<v Speaker 4>in inflicting that on someone else. If everyone went by

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<v Speaker 4>the will of God, there wouldn't be any of those.

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<v Speaker 4>Sure there would be hurricanes, there would be earthquakes and

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<v Speaker 4>things like that, but those still have ecological purpose on

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<v Speaker 4>this earth. What doesn't have ecological purpose is creating higher towers,

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<v Speaker 4>or living closer together, or all kinds of things that

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<v Speaker 4>actually cause problems and not just necessarily natural disasters. So

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<v Speaker 4>really it's about understanding that this is not the best world,

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<v Speaker 4>but the best way to the best possible world, which

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<v Speaker 4>is Heaven. Terry, Welcome to the Jesus Christ Show.

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<v Speaker 5>Good morning, Hi. I have a life situation going on

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<v Speaker 5>right now, what's going on? I have a sixty five

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<v Speaker 5>year old sister who's been alcoholics since were teenagers. She

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<v Speaker 5>married mid thirties to an alcoholic. He's now mid seventies,

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<v Speaker 5>just getting out of detox today. Actually, they had twin

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<v Speaker 5>girls who are now twenty eight. Both of them are alcoholics.

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<v Speaker 5>Oh boy, they're also down and out. Okay, my husband

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<v Speaker 5>and I just hear a little history. Took these girls

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<v Speaker 5>in when they were three. These guys got them back

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<v Speaker 5>when they were ten, so that was just holy help. Anyway,

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<v Speaker 5>my sister's on her deathbed now and the girls, of course,

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<v Speaker 5>are devastated, and she's my rock. I mean, it's just far.

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<v Speaker 5>But my question to you is you are all forgiving? Correct?

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<v Speaker 5>Do you take her to heaven? And my other question

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<v Speaker 5>is these girls, one of them can't walk and refusing

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<v Speaker 5>all medical treatment and I mean we even got her

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<v Speaker 5>into the ear with the doctor. Bottom line, she refused

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<v Speaker 5>any test. So I feel completely helpless with them. So

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<v Speaker 5>between those two questions, maybe you can help me.

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<v Speaker 4>Wow, well, there's a lot going on there. That is

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<v Speaker 4>the death depending death of your sister involved. Is the

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<v Speaker 4>alcohol involved in that?

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<v Speaker 1>Oh yes?

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<v Speaker 5>Completely? Heart attack? Several struggles. Now she's just emaciated completely well,

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<v Speaker 5>a wheelchair bound for the last three years, but drank

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<v Speaker 5>until the day she went. As far as I.

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<v Speaker 4>Know, as far as forgiveness, God forgives all, but only

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<v Speaker 4>reconciles with those that reconcile with God. So there is

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<v Speaker 4>a difference between forgiveness and reconciliation. You can forgive somebody,

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<v Speaker 4>but it doesn't mean you reconcile. You can forgive something

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<v Speaker 4>that does somebody something horrible to you, doesn't mean you

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<v Speaker 4>let them back into your home. Forgiveness is for you,

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<v Speaker 4>not for the person you're forgiving.

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<v Speaker 3>So in.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, human human case, in God's case, God forgives

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<v Speaker 4>because it's righteous and just to those that ask.

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<v Speaker 2>So when it comes to.

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<v Speaker 4>Her, you know final place is she going to be

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<v Speaker 4>in heaven? That depends on where her heart is and

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<v Speaker 4>if she's received me in her life. And it's not

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<v Speaker 4>if you're asking, does somebody in the state of sin.

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<v Speaker 2>Not go to heaven?

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<v Speaker 4>Well, everybody is in a state of some kind of

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<v Speaker 4>sin when they die, So it's a matter of where

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<v Speaker 4>they are in their life and their heart specifically, not

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<v Speaker 4>just the circumstances or the things they've brought on and

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<v Speaker 4>God judges those things in context, and it's not some

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<v Speaker 4>sort of, you know, some sort of gray scale where

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<v Speaker 4>it's like, I'm sorry, if you just rank you know,

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<v Speaker 4>this much less you'd get in. It's not about that.

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<v Speaker 4>It's about where someone's heart is and have they received

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<v Speaker 4>And in this particular case, when it comes to addiction,

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<v Speaker 4>it's not the traditional act of rebellion where somebody can

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<v Speaker 4>stop and doesn't. This is something that has a foothold.

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<v Speaker 4>It's given the enemy a foothold. So first and foremost

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<v Speaker 4>you have to not you have to trust God for that.

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<v Speaker 4>Continue to pray, pray with her, to be available to her,

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<v Speaker 4>and to ask her outright if you'd like and say,

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<v Speaker 4>you know, where's your heart with God? If you'd like

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<v Speaker 4>to get her better equipped for that. As far as

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<v Speaker 4>the children are concerned, if they're in a state where

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<v Speaker 4>everyone in their life, in their immediate family is in

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<v Speaker 4>this state of you know, disrepair, completely falling apart due

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<v Speaker 4>to alcohol, and they still don't see a need for it,

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<v Speaker 4>they're going to be a tough nut to crack to

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<v Speaker 4>try and get them to see their need for help.

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<v Speaker 4>The best thing you can do in times like that

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<v Speaker 4>is just not be a negative support, and that is

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<v Speaker 4>somebody who just in your desire to show love to

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<v Speaker 4>family members or loved ones when they're going through things.

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<v Speaker 2>Sometimes people do the wrong things.

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<v Speaker 4>They give them money when they shouldn't be giving them money,

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<v Speaker 4>or sometimes even giving them shelter when they don't need shelter,

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<v Speaker 4>because really they're just using it as a place of

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<v Speaker 4>stops in between doing what they're doing. So it becomes

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<v Speaker 4>difficult for you to weed out terry and to kind

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<v Speaker 4>of filter as to what is the best thing to

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<v Speaker 4>do and how you can help them, but never do

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<v Speaker 4>anything that would perpetuate their illness or somehow.

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<v Speaker 2>Continue them down that path.

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<v Speaker 4>You have to do things that are going to keep

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<v Speaker 4>them away or direct them away from those things, and that's.

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<v Speaker 2>Going to be difficult. Sherry, Welcome to the Jesus Christ Show. Hi,

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<v Speaker 2>Jesus Hi.

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<v Speaker 3>I have a question about the practice of shamanism. Is

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<v Speaker 3>that mutually exclusive to Christianity.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, Shamanism and Christianity in their purest forms not mix.

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<v Speaker 4>And unfortunately a lot of times people adhere to certain

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<v Speaker 4>things and then they become Christians and well they're new Christians,

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<v Speaker 4>they kind of continue to do everything they were doing anyways,

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<v Speaker 4>but call themselves Christians, and so throughout the centuries, actually

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<v Speaker 4>this has taken place and created whole new belief systems

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<v Speaker 4>because people kind of were either forced to be Christians

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<v Speaker 4>or socially were Christians or whatever, and they adapt all

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<v Speaker 4>these other things. Well, the Shamanism takes many different forms,

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<v Speaker 4>way too many for us to actually get into any

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<v Speaker 4>real detail on the program, but they adhere to some

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<v Speaker 4>things that absolutely would be Christian healing. You know, doing

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<v Speaker 4>spiritual healings is not opposed to Christianity or vice versa.

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<v Speaker 4>Shamans believe they can communicate with the spirit world Christians

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<v Speaker 4>can pray to God. So there might be similarities where

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<v Speaker 4>people would go, Oh, they don't really contradict. The shaman

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<v Speaker 4>believes in the supernatural, believes all these things. But they

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<v Speaker 4>also deal with images of animals, dealing with omens and

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<v Speaker 4>spirit guides and all these things. They deal with trances,

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<v Speaker 4>putting people into trances for all kinds of reasons, or

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<v Speaker 4>these vision quest type things that would completely contradict stuff

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<v Speaker 4>that takes place in scripture or what scripture calls you

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<v Speaker 4>to do. Is there some reason this pops up in

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<v Speaker 4>your life?

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<v Speaker 3>Well, I'm an anthropology student and I have an interest

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<v Speaker 3>in shamanism, and as far as trances go, I'm also

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<v Speaker 3>a massage therapist, and so I'm really interested in the

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<v Speaker 3>healing arts, the healing aspects of shamanism. And when I

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<v Speaker 3>think when people when you give massages, it induces a

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<v Speaker 3>trans white state for a somatic therapy.

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<v Speaker 4>Okay, you're you're kind of stretching, because one could be

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<v Speaker 4>an actual physiological response to what's going on and where

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<v Speaker 4>shamanism is talking specifically, and sometimes even using drugs or

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<v Speaker 4>what Scripture refers to as sorcery translates from the word

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<v Speaker 4>pharmacia in the Greek. It actually means it's where you

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<v Speaker 4>get the word pharmacy. Now, a lot of the sorcery

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<v Speaker 4>or those types of vision quest things in Scripture were

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<v Speaker 4>provoked by the use of drugs and stimulants, different than

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<v Speaker 4>a physical reaction to being put in a RESTful state.

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<v Speaker 4>Because Scripture also talks about proper meditation as well. So

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<v Speaker 4>there's times of meditation, or there's times with connecting with

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<v Speaker 4>God or spiritual things, fasting, prayer, all these things. Okay,

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<v Speaker 4>I'll put to you this way. For the lack of time,

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<v Speaker 4>is that there's going to be similarities in things, but

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<v Speaker 4>it doesn't make them compatible. For instance, in logic, they

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<v Speaker 4>call this category informal logical fallacies when things don't mix

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<v Speaker 4>right logically. For instance, all cops carry guns. Does that

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<v Speaker 4>mean that everyone that carries a gun is a cop.

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<v Speaker 2>No. So, although there's going.

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<v Speaker 4>To be similarities between Shamanism and Christianity, and there are

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<v Speaker 4>spiritual aspects to the both of them, and there's good things,

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<v Speaker 4>and there's healing, there's things like that, they aren't really compatible.

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<v Speaker 4>There are similarities and in part of the quests and

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<v Speaker 4>some of the attributes, but they ultimately in their truest form,

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<v Speaker 4>do not mix. One is going to be watered down

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<v Speaker 4>or changed completely for you to be able to interchange them.

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<v Speaker 4>Shamanism is I think it's wonderful that you're studying it,

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<v Speaker 4>and as an anthropology student, I think it's a fascinating study.

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<v Speaker 4>But it as far as melding completely with Christianity or

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<v Speaker 4>your Christianity, it doesn't work that way. And I know

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<v Speaker 4>that in this takes place a lot in school. This

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<v Speaker 4>is one of the important things about going to college,

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<v Speaker 4>and going to school is exciting diffferent parts of your

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<v Speaker 4>interests and curiosities. But what ends up happening is if

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<v Speaker 4>something becomes sexy or interesting and people try and cram

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<v Speaker 4>it into their belief system, and that doesn't always work.

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<v Speaker 2>There are some things, like.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, that you could practice that wouldn't cause a problem,

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<v Speaker 4>but something like this in its truest form, absolutely would. Flora,

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<v Speaker 4>Welcome to the Jesus Christ Show.

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<v Speaker 6>Hi, good morning, Hi.

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<v Speaker 2>How can I help you?

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<v Speaker 5>I have a.

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<v Speaker 6>Dilemma with a family situation. I have a nineteen year

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<v Speaker 6>old who has a friend that I'm not very I

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<v Speaker 6>don't want to be judgmental, but I don't feel he's

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<v Speaker 6>a good influence on my son, and it situation is

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<v Speaker 6>getting awkward.

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<v Speaker 4>Okay, well tell me about the kid.

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<v Speaker 2>Why don't you like the kid?

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<v Speaker 6>Okay, about twenty three years old. He's been incarcerated twice.

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<v Speaker 6>I'm not sure what the first time was for, but

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<v Speaker 6>I know the second time was for stealing a car. Okay,

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<v Speaker 6>that's no, it's not And I just don't I just

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<v Speaker 6>don't think he's a good influence on my son. I

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<v Speaker 6>think he he is trouble. But if the situation got

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<v Speaker 6>awkward because yesterday we were out and my step son

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<v Speaker 6>invited him over while we were gone, and he knows

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<v Speaker 6>he's not supposed to have friends over were out. So

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<v Speaker 6>this young man was outside our home talking to him

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<v Speaker 6>when we arrived, and so I immediately told him that,

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<v Speaker 6>you know, he needed to tell his ask his friend

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<v Speaker 6>to leave. And so my husband was kind of upset

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<v Speaker 6>with me because I guess he was in there.

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<v Speaker 5>That I was.

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<v Speaker 6>So I said it openly and his he feels that

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<v Speaker 6>I should give this kid a chance, and I don't.

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<v Speaker 6>And I don't know at what point do you say, Okay,

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<v Speaker 6>this person is not good, I don't want them around,

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<v Speaker 6>or we need to give you know, as Christians, we

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<v Speaker 6>need to not be judgmental and see, you know, if

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<v Speaker 6>this kid's going to change. So that's my dilemma. I

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<v Speaker 6>don't know how to handle it. I don't know. I

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<v Speaker 6>don't know what to do.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, it's interesting, you there's a judicial system where

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<v Speaker 4>people are incarcerated from time to time, and the frustration

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<v Speaker 4>is that people do their time and they're supposed to

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<v Speaker 4>be let out and the system is supposed to say

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<v Speaker 4>that they're ready to come back into society, but no

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<v Speaker 4>one seems to want to let them do So, Okay,

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<v Speaker 4>and I get that. I get the reasons why, because

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<v Speaker 4>this system's faulty, and all too often the system puts

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<v Speaker 4>people back on the street because they don't have space.

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<v Speaker 2>Or what have you.

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<v Speaker 4>I would be curious as to why he was in

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<v Speaker 4>jail the first time, and I would say that it's

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<v Speaker 4>completely legitimate for you to bring this boy over to

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<v Speaker 4>your home and sit him down with your son and

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<v Speaker 4>your husband and say, you know what, I acted kind

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<v Speaker 4>of short with you the other day, and I wanted

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<v Speaker 4>to explain myself. I would like to know more about

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<v Speaker 4>your situation, because all I know is this, and I

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<v Speaker 4>think that's why I reacted that way. And you're a

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<v Speaker 4>friend of my sons, and I want you guys to

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<v Speaker 4>be able to have a relationship and friendship and all

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<v Speaker 4>of that stuff. But this is my home and this

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<v Speaker 4>is my child, and I'm concerned as to why you

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<v Speaker 4>were in the first time and what you think you

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<v Speaker 4>learned from both of these trips to jail, and if

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<v Speaker 4>I can have your word that you're not going to

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<v Speaker 4>bring that stuff around my home and at least it

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<v Speaker 4>gives you an opportunity. I know it sounds like a

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<v Speaker 4>corny Brady Bunch moment, but but parents will do all

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<v Speaker 4>kinds of heavy duty lifting outside of the situation, but

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<v Speaker 4>nothing that is uncomfortable inside. So instead of going, okay,

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<v Speaker 4>and we're going to chain down our son, take away

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<v Speaker 4>his phone, do all these things so he now he's

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<v Speaker 4>in prison so that he can't have contact, it's face

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<v Speaker 4>it and then see if you get a reading, an

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<v Speaker 4>honest reading, not just of wow, it's scary because the

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<v Speaker 4>guy's been to jail because nobody was an angel. Now,

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<v Speaker 4>I'm not saying everybody had to steal a car and

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<v Speaker 4>that's not, you know, a great thing to have done. However,

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<v Speaker 4>I do know people who have stolen cars in their

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<v Speaker 4>youth and are perfectly wonderful people that you would invite

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<v Speaker 4>to your home. Okay, so I think that your initial

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<v Speaker 4>reaction is a wonderful one, one of protection for your home.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm curious as to why your husband is your husband

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<v Speaker 4>pretty relaxed about the situation.

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<v Speaker 6>Well, I kind of feel that that that is another

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<v Speaker 6>underlying family issue. I kind of feel like he's comfortable

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<v Speaker 6>with letting me be the bad guy, and he sits

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<v Speaker 6>back and.

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<v Speaker 4>Allows me.

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<v Speaker 6>You know, he he doesn't like conflict, so especially you

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<v Speaker 6>see if that's the dilemma with blended families. Also, he

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<v Speaker 6>doesn't like to have conflict with my step son because

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<v Speaker 6>he's always he's always uh holding that guilt that he

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<v Speaker 6>doesn't want to alienate him because he didn't really he

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<v Speaker 6>wasn't with his son, he didn't really raise him. So

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<v Speaker 6>now that they have a relationship, as you know, he's older,

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<v Speaker 6>but the guilt is always there. So he does not

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<v Speaker 6>like to have conflict with him. And and I honestly,

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<v Speaker 6>I think then he he wants to avoid it, so

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<v Speaker 6>he allows me to be.

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<v Speaker 4>The Well, technically, technically you're the parent, and so that's

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<v Speaker 4>a whole different layer of you know, confusion and frustration.

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<v Speaker 4>So technically you are the disciplinarian in this context. Also,

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<v Speaker 4>just to shed a little light on how males work,

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<v Speaker 4>and a lot of women don't understand this, is that

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<v Speaker 4>men women fight differently than men. Women fight emotionally, and

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<v Speaker 4>if you're honest with yourself, you know that that women

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<v Speaker 4>will fight emotionally with one another.

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<v Speaker 6>I have to agree that I do my I'm right

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<v Speaker 6>off the cuff, I'm you know exactly where I'm coming

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<v Speaker 6>from exactly.

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<v Speaker 4>And that's that's it's a wonderful trait actually, and men

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<v Speaker 4>tend to learn at a very young age that the

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<v Speaker 4>slightest thing can get go to fisticuffs or a physical

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<v Speaker 4>altercation immediately as young boys. They learn that young girls

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<v Speaker 4>won't sit there necessarily pull hair and go through all

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<v Speaker 4>that stuff on the playground, but boys will scrap and

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<v Speaker 4>throw things and punch each other in the face at

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<v Speaker 4>a very young age. And so a lot of men

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<v Speaker 4>come across to their wives sometimes as being laxadaisical, or

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<v Speaker 4>lazy or too relaxed about certain situations, whereas a lot

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<v Speaker 4>of men know they're just kind of balancing it saying,

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<v Speaker 4>you know what, I have a first gear and I

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<v Speaker 4>have a sixth gear, and I will go from zero

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<v Speaker 4>point one into a physical altercation because that's the world

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<v Speaker 4>that I was taught as a boy. That always, no

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<v Speaker 4>matter what, even if you try and rationalize it and go, well,

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<v Speaker 4>you know what and be diplomatic, boys will throw punches.

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<v Speaker 4>And that doesn't happen in most cases to women. And

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<v Speaker 4>so a lot of times women don't understand that, and

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<v Speaker 4>they'll go they'll run up to somebody in a public

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<v Speaker 4>situation start yelling, and the man's like, honey, honey, stand down,

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<v Speaker 4>stand down. Because the man, because a woman's going, no

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<v Speaker 4>one's gonna sit, you know, haul off and punch me.

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<v Speaker 4>And it's good that you don't think that the world

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<v Speaker 4>shouldn't be that way, but the guy is going. You

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<v Speaker 4>know what, this can go from you being upset because

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<v Speaker 4>someone pushed you to an all out brawl with police

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<v Speaker 4>involved in one second once a man gets involved. So

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<v Speaker 4>sometimes men tend to be a little too relaxed because

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<v Speaker 4>of the fear and concern the way they were brought up.

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<v Speaker 4>Always things can go from zero to sixty because now

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<v Speaker 4>when men get involved, now it becomes a pride issue

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<v Speaker 4>and you know, testecular fortitude comes in and you know,

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<v Speaker 4>are you saying that I'm a wimp and all this

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<v Speaker 4>stuff and it gets blown out of proportion. So sometimes

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<v Speaker 4>that affects it. But really truth is, he didn't raise

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<v Speaker 4>the boy, but you are the parent in this circumstance,

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<v Speaker 4>and what you say goes now. He needs to support

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<v Speaker 4>you as your husband to give you the strength and

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<v Speaker 4>the tools you need. So in this case, I think

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<v Speaker 4>confronting the situation head on and being reasonable with this

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<v Speaker 4>twenty something year old and saying, you.

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<v Speaker 2>Know, you come in my house.

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<v Speaker 4>I have fears and concerns, and you've got to understand that,

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<v Speaker 4>and he'll probably probably will go yeah, absolutely, So I

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<v Speaker 4>just want to know who you are, and you know

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<v Speaker 4>how long? If have they known each other all of

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<v Speaker 4>these things and asked that said, okay, well, you know,

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<v Speaker 4>we'd be happy to have you around in this context.

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<v Speaker 4>But if I hear anything, I'm going to put an

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<v Speaker 4>end to it. And not because I'm trying to be

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<v Speaker 4>the lord of all, but because I care very much

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<v Speaker 4>about my son. And learn about his parents if you can,

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<v Speaker 4>and as much as you can, and make decisions based

403
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<v Speaker 4>on the whole pick. Sure, I know it's scary proposition,

404
00:24:03.680 --> 00:24:07.160
<v Speaker 4>but know all the information first and then make a

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<v Speaker 4>decision as to what you're going to do. Jim, Welcome

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<v Speaker 4>to the Jesus Christ Show.

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<v Speaker 1>Someone has committed just toy, Someone has committed a mortal

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<v Speaker 1>sin like suicide.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay.

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<v Speaker 1>Does that mean that like it's pointless to even pray

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<v Speaker 1>for them in hell? Or if they did commit a

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<v Speaker 1>mortal sin, maybe like one second before they passed away

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<v Speaker 1>they repented. Does that make any difference? Is it there

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<v Speaker 1>gone forever and it's no point even thinking about them?

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<v Speaker 1>What are your thoughts?

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<v Speaker 4>Well, you have to kind of argue depending on where

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<v Speaker 4>you're standing. Protestants would have a different point of view

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<v Speaker 4>than Catholics most certainly, so there's doctrine involved as well.

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<v Speaker 4>But I would say this that there is no reason

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<v Speaker 4>to think that there is not something very intimate going

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<v Speaker 4>on between man and God that in what you would

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<v Speaker 4>call a second could be an eternity outside of this world,

423
00:25:09.119 --> 00:25:13.799
<v Speaker 4>and everyone gets a proper opportunity to accept or reject God.

424
00:25:13.799 --> 00:25:16.119
<v Speaker 4>It's not based on ignorance. It's either you accept or

425
00:25:16.119 --> 00:25:20.319
<v Speaker 4>you reject knowingly. And when it comes to suicide, it's

426
00:25:20.319 --> 00:25:22.960
<v Speaker 4>one of those very ugly things because it's the last

427
00:25:23.079 --> 00:25:27.599
<v Speaker 4>act of freedom that abolishes all other acts of freedom.

428
00:25:27.880 --> 00:25:32.839
<v Speaker 4>It's a well, it's a crime. It's a crime against

429
00:25:32.880 --> 00:25:36.279
<v Speaker 4>the gift of God, most certainly. Now, this is not

430
00:25:36.359 --> 00:25:39.680
<v Speaker 4>to belittle the pain of people that contemplate as many

431
00:25:39.759 --> 00:25:43.960
<v Speaker 4>many do, or to belittle the pains that go on

432
00:25:44.279 --> 00:25:46.839
<v Speaker 4>in the world that make people frustrated or want to

433
00:25:46.920 --> 00:25:52.559
<v Speaker 4>leave this planet. But what it is is to look

434
00:25:52.640 --> 00:25:56.559
<v Speaker 4>at this act and see that there is nothing Sadly,

435
00:25:56.799 --> 00:26:00.559
<v Speaker 4>many people think of suicide because they're trying to themselves

436
00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:04.759
<v Speaker 4>of pain, but really suicide doesn't end pain. It merely

437
00:26:04.759 --> 00:26:08.119
<v Speaker 4>pushes it off to the people that are living. And

438
00:26:08.359 --> 00:26:11.000
<v Speaker 4>so there's no way to eradicate that you work through pain,

439
00:26:11.160 --> 00:26:13.640
<v Speaker 4>you don't. There's no way to really eradicate it in

440
00:26:13.680 --> 00:26:15.720
<v Speaker 4>that sense, which is said.

441
00:26:16.839 --> 00:26:20.039
<v Speaker 1>What about purgatory with someone like that, go to purgatory

442
00:26:20.160 --> 00:26:23.400
<v Speaker 1>or I know, I think that's more of a Catholic doctrina.

443
00:26:23.599 --> 00:26:25.079
<v Speaker 2>Most certainly purgatory.

444
00:26:25.519 --> 00:26:29.400
<v Speaker 1>But do most faiths in Christian in the Christian religion

445
00:26:30.799 --> 00:26:33.720
<v Speaker 1>believe in purgatory or is it just something that was

446
00:26:33.799 --> 00:26:34.720
<v Speaker 1>established out of.

447
00:26:36.440 --> 00:26:38.640
<v Speaker 2>From theologians purgatory.

448
00:26:38.799 --> 00:26:42.200
<v Speaker 4>Purgatory is a sticky one because there are different belief systems,

449
00:26:42.279 --> 00:26:44.720
<v Speaker 4>most certainly, and there are things that maybe the Protestants

450
00:26:44.720 --> 00:26:47.960
<v Speaker 4>would say, yes, I believe that there's this period here,

451
00:26:48.000 --> 00:26:50.920
<v Speaker 4>whereas Catholics might say, no, it's a it's a literal

452
00:26:50.960 --> 00:26:56.359
<v Speaker 4>place going through the purification process. The problem with many

453
00:26:56.400 --> 00:27:00.640
<v Speaker 4>of these views is that it adds an asterisk to

454
00:27:00.799 --> 00:27:05.000
<v Speaker 4>the death on the cross, so it's well, is there,

455
00:27:05.599 --> 00:27:08.559
<v Speaker 4>what's the payment? And one of the things I said

456
00:27:08.599 --> 00:27:11.359
<v Speaker 4>at the very very end on the cross is to

457
00:27:11.400 --> 00:27:15.920
<v Speaker 4>tell usty and through you know, contortions of translation and

458
00:27:16.039 --> 00:27:21.000
<v Speaker 4>understanding of the term it gets translated into the end,

459
00:27:21.240 --> 00:27:24.680
<v Speaker 4>it is finished, paid in full, all these different things,

460
00:27:24.680 --> 00:27:29.839
<v Speaker 4>but ultimately it sounds vinal. So there are many that

461
00:27:29.920 --> 00:27:32.880
<v Speaker 4>wrestle with that concept. And there are some concepts of

462
00:27:32.960 --> 00:27:36.559
<v Speaker 4>purgatory that are kind of with a small p that

463
00:27:36.720 --> 00:27:39.400
<v Speaker 4>may fit into scripture, and there are others that may not.

464
00:27:40.160 --> 00:27:42.720
<v Speaker 4>Outside of that, I want you to think about your

465
00:27:43.640 --> 00:27:47.160
<v Speaker 4>main question and that as if someone commits this sin

466
00:27:47.200 --> 00:27:50.440
<v Speaker 4>of suicide, and this suicide is self murder, can one

467
00:27:50.480 --> 00:27:55.160
<v Speaker 4>still pray for them? And one would have to go

468
00:27:55.200 --> 00:27:58.319
<v Speaker 4>to scripture and see that Scripture says that it's appointed

469
00:27:58.319 --> 00:28:01.240
<v Speaker 4>for man to die once and then the judgment, So

470
00:28:02.440 --> 00:28:06.880
<v Speaker 4>really to be praying for them is at the point

471
00:28:06.920 --> 00:28:09.319
<v Speaker 4>of where they're being judged, is really an act of

472
00:28:11.119 --> 00:28:14.079
<v Speaker 4>individual preference. Then it is something in scripture that says

473
00:28:14.319 --> 00:28:16.799
<v Speaker 4>this is what you should be doing. You should always

474
00:28:16.880 --> 00:28:19.759
<v Speaker 4>trust God and know Jim that God has a plan

475
00:28:19.759 --> 00:28:23.759
<v Speaker 4>that you could not even fathom, and that anyone who

476
00:28:23.880 --> 00:28:28.680
<v Speaker 4>has the opportunity to receive will make that choice with

477
00:28:28.759 --> 00:28:30.799
<v Speaker 4>the best of who they are, and God knows that.

478
00:28:31.680 --> 00:28:34.440
<v Speaker 4>And there are things that could take place in the moments.

479
00:28:34.519 --> 00:28:37.599
<v Speaker 4>One of the reason why many in the Christian faith

480
00:28:38.200 --> 00:28:42.079
<v Speaker 4>in different denominations feel that suicide is the unpardonable sin

481
00:28:43.279 --> 00:28:46.440
<v Speaker 4>is because there's no way to repent from it, there's

482
00:28:46.480 --> 00:28:50.039
<v Speaker 4>no way to turn away from that. But you could

483
00:28:50.119 --> 00:28:51.319
<v Speaker 4>argue that about murder too.

484
00:28:51.319 --> 00:28:52.400
<v Speaker 2>You can't. Can't.

485
00:28:52.480 --> 00:28:55.759
<v Speaker 4>You could stop murdering, but you can't unmurder somebody that

486
00:28:55.759 --> 00:28:59.720
<v Speaker 4>you murdered. So I think that there's there is room

487
00:28:59.759 --> 00:29:04.319
<v Speaker 4>for argument that in those moments what seem like seconds,

488
00:29:05.359 --> 00:29:08.799
<v Speaker 4>as somebody passes, even by their own hand, that God

489
00:29:08.880 --> 00:29:12.599
<v Speaker 4>is in communication with them, and that during that process

490
00:29:12.799 --> 00:29:17.839
<v Speaker 4>God can absolutely reach out and to be with that individual.

491
00:29:18.960 --> 00:29:22.559
<v Speaker 4>Having said that, I will state over and over the

492
00:29:22.599 --> 00:29:29.039
<v Speaker 4>obvious on this program that suicide is obviously frowned upon

493
00:29:30.480 --> 00:29:31.319
<v Speaker 4>by God.

494
00:29:33.039 --> 00:29:33.480
<v Speaker 6>It is.

495
00:29:35.079 --> 00:29:39.680
<v Speaker 4>An ugly, the ugliest returning of a gift that you

496
00:29:39.680 --> 00:29:44.279
<v Speaker 4>could possibly imagine or conjure, and to look on in

497
00:29:44.319 --> 00:29:49.759
<v Speaker 4>the face and say thank you, no, thank you, can

498
00:29:49.799 --> 00:29:55.440
<v Speaker 4>be a horrible and ugly act of rebellion. And as

499
00:29:55.640 --> 00:29:59.960
<v Speaker 4>this show has had the pleasure of coming across people

500
00:30:00.119 --> 00:30:04.039
<v Speaker 4>who have once thought those things and now we'll write

501
00:30:05.240 --> 00:30:08.240
<v Speaker 4>emails and keep in contact, that they're no longer in

502
00:30:08.240 --> 00:30:10.799
<v Speaker 4>that state. And we say here over and over again

503
00:30:10.839 --> 00:30:14.759
<v Speaker 4>that we call them life circum circumstances, because they do change.

504
00:30:16.079 --> 00:30:18.920
<v Speaker 4>Is that often those things do change. And as we

505
00:30:19.000 --> 00:30:21.960
<v Speaker 4>say over and over that if you don't wait for

506
00:30:22.000 --> 00:30:24.920
<v Speaker 4>the end of the movie, you don't get the happy ending.

507
00:30:27.599 --> 00:30:29.400
<v Speaker 4>Love one another to day, go out and be kind

508
00:30:29.440 --> 00:30:31.759
<v Speaker 4>to each other, and remember, although we only have this

509
00:30:31.799 --> 00:30:35.519
<v Speaker 4>little time together each Sunday. More importantly than all the

510
00:30:35.559 --> 00:30:37.519
<v Speaker 4>craziness these words.

511
00:30:37.839 --> 00:30:38.440
<v Speaker 2>I Am with You

512
00:30:39.920 --> 00:30:43.920
<v Speaker 1>Always, KF I am six forty on demand
