Speaker 1: Hello friends, and welcome back to the rabbit Hole. I'm
your host Stanny, and today we have the pleasure of
having doctor Aaron Hartman on the podcast. He is a
triple Board certified physician who worked in the Air Force
as just a regular doctor, but the diagnosis that his
daughter had led to surgeries that him and his wife
did not want to consent to, which led him down
the path of functional medicine. Functional medicine, unlike the traditional
healthcare system, is patient centered, science based approach that identifies
and treats the root cause of disease rather than just
the symptoms. They really look at like the whole person
instead of just take this medication and get on your way.
We cover so many topics in this episode. If you
have a question, I might have.
Speaker 2: Asked doctor Aaron for the answer.
Speaker 1: Hi, doctor Aaron, thank you so much for joining us
on the rabbit Hole. I am really excited to hear
your story because I feel like so many people's stories
start out the way that your story does, with like
a sick family member in the medical industry, like wanting
to just like throw pharmaceuticals at it, or like surgery,
and most people kind of end up at the end
of the day with like an I don't know what's
wrong with you, like take more medicine, and so will
you tell us tell us your story, your daughter story.
Speaker 3: My story. You know, it's a little different, little same
to what you're talking about. I was in the military,
traditional doctor, academic, you know, doing all the usual things.
And what gotten me off the being path, so to speak.
Down the rabbit hole is literally down by this point
in time, about fifty brazilion rabbit holes.
Speaker 2: Yes, it was.
Speaker 3: We brought our future daughter into a home and my wife,
A is a occupational therapist that works with kids with
special needs, very complicated kids, and we brought her in
our home and she has a diagnosis of throat palsy.
But how she got that was her birth mother did
crystal meth the entire pregnancy. She stroked before she was born,
and she was born functionally blind, so pretty pretty poor prognosis.
And the GI doctors like, hey, by the way, she's
also small. It's called failure to thrive. So let's put
a feeding tube in her belly, put a plastic plastic
tube in there, and just pour sugar water called formula
into rebelly and that will fix the problem, she'll gain
some weight. Problem solved, right, But we had higher goals.
My wife was like, everything's gonna be okay, she's gonna
be fine, and so that My response was, well, why
would I put a feeding tube in her? Because part
of learning how's talk is chewing and swalling, Like literally
chewing and swallowing is how kids learn to talk. You
develop motor skills.
Speaker 2: I did not know that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like, well, that's one of the reasons why
it's important to feed kids the right food, not just
stuck on bottles and stufffects oral motor development and one
of the ways you learn how to wall because you
first start crawling, right, and if you have a plastic
tube coming out of your belly, well then you that's
going to affect motor neuron development. So we said no,
and the result was that the GI doctor report us
to Child Protective Services for medical neglect because we refused
to put that tube in there. And it was kind
of weird because they came out investigated us. I was
a captain in the military, medical doctor. My wife's a
occupational therapist. We were in the system. I was in
the Air Force.
Speaker 2: Okay, in the Navy.
Speaker 3: Oh cool, and this is that mcdeal air Force Space
actually syncomso com as. I ran that clinic for a bit,
but and so got investigated and then everything worked out okay.
But it was like the system really didn't like it
when you said no, when you get pushback. I just
started to started making my wheels turn like that's kind
of weird. Like I got investigated. I'm not a criminal,
like you know. And six months later though, this was
like when the weight of the world came out my
shoulders and I had to make a change. Was my
wife actually, in her research, found a growth chart for
kids with cyril palsy and my daughter was in the middle.
She was normal, and so the expert, yeah, the expert
didn't know. The expert didn't know that she was fine,
that she was in the middle. They had the wrong information,
the wrong data, and they recommend the wrong procedure, which
was a feeding tube. And if we went do with
that procedure, one procedure leads to another, leads to another,
and these kind of these kind of kids and put
things in perspective, and it's turning twenty now, she's getting ready.
She's gonna be my first child that leaves the home
actually in April, and she's had zero surgical procedures to date.
Typical kid her age has had thirteen so thirteen series, yeah,
versus zero. And so when I realized that she was
normal for her growth, like the expert didn't know, and
all of a sudden, like what else do they not know?
What else are they getting wrong? And who's going to
figure that out? And so that got me getting up,
you know, at that point time I had to be
at base at you know, my job started seven in
the morning, so I was again at four to read
the research to learn stuff, and that supercharged my learning.
Probably in the next three years. I learned what someone
typically learns in seven or eight because I was just reading, reading, reading,
but that that rabbit hole that went down. But it
was like you Wizard of Oz, right, Yeah, the worlds
and the black and white world is actually color. You
learn about functional neurology and gene based nutritional therapy and
a whole boast of other stuff, and it opened my
eyes to like what options there were, but ultimately changed
my entire practice of medicine and what I do now.
And now I see people with complicated cases that have
been the average person I see right now, has been
the five to seven different doctors before they come to me,
and I connect the dots of all the things they've
overlooked to figure out. This was your mold, this was
your line, this was your pots, this is your hypermobility,
you know, whatever the thing is that these other places
just overlooked. And that's, unfortunately, happens pretty commonly in our
current healthcare situation.
Speaker 1: Right that's and yeah, you're right, Unfortunately that's what's happening.
And I feel like a lot of people don't look
at it the way you do is like we don't
have to do this, And a lot of people are.
Speaker 2: Scared that they will be reported.
Speaker 1: They're like, I can't say no because firstly, they're the expert,
they're supposed to know everything. And secondly, like if I
do say no, I'll be reported because I'm trying to
advocate for my child, like there's got to be a
different option, and.
Speaker 3: Maybe you're my wife and that thing in the special
needs world that happens all the time. My wife was
dealing with a lot of these complicated cases. They were
going to Children's Boston Mass General, and there's situations where
we would go up there with these rare diagnoses, A
well meaning physician would say, this is weird. You're a
Munchausen's by proxy, which means mom's making it up. The
mom's faking it hurting the kid to get attention, and
they lose a kid for a month or two or three.
So I knew that happened, and so in this case,
I'm like, yeahkay, this is not what's going on. But
it does happen. It's not unheard of, and it's really
bad because it happens typically to people with rare diagnoses,
unheard diagnoses that the system doesn't recognize. And so obviously
the mom's crazy, the parents are crazy, got a lot
of mecal gas line happens. It ultimately kids are hurt.
And so yeah, that's one of the many things I've
kind of learned in my medical journey.
Speaker 1: Well, we hear that a lot, And I wasn't gonna
ask this question this early, but I'm gonna jump in
since we're here. We hear that a lot when it
comes to vaccines, and I know, like personally, I have
had a lot of looks and like, I mean, they
don't some of them say it outright, but most people
are like, Oh, you're not gonna vaccinate your children, or
like my son had strapped throat.
Speaker 2: We need to go get antibiotics.
Speaker 1: So they're like, oh, like he's not vaccinated, Like like
I'm some weird person.
Speaker 2: But I'm like, I don't, like, will you talk about vaccines? Yeah?
Will you?
Speaker 1: Because I know, like I have opinions about it, and
so I went here from a medical.
Speaker 3: Professional, I'd be happy. I'd love to talk to vaccines
about you. I'm a very I put things in perspective.
I'm assistant clinical professor at the local medical school. I
ran a research company for fifteen years, publishing landset some
very science based So let's have a conversation.
Speaker 1: Yes, please, because I feel like there's a lot of misinformation.
There's people that believe like vaccines are totally bad, there's
other people that believe vaccines are totally good, and there's
a lot of people in the middle. And so especially
with COVID, like people started actually asking questions about them.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so if you just take a ten thousand foot view,
you know. And when I was doing my pediatric intensive
care unit, I'm during my internship year two thousand at
the Mecal College of Virginia super busy, one of the
top universities on the East Coast. So on the East coast,
it's a really busy, busy place. And so I did
not see piatric meningitis the entire time I was there.
And doctor Malauri, who was the head she'd been there
for She's like, yeah, we used to see ten to
twenty cases a month. We don't see it anymore because
of the hib and prevnor vaccine. Yeah, people minergize, most minerodized.
Used to be hibben prevenan are we've been called pertussis
used to kill kids. Don't see that anymore. So those
are vaccines and these things are still in the environment
right then, you so there's some things we still need
to do. Then there's the whole thing with rotavirus vaccine,
which gave kids into sussaption and it didn't really pan out.
The whole hepatized beef thing almost was fascinating because you
get it from sexual prostitutes and I be drugs, so like,
why do you need it at birth? And actually it
was interesting because we were on the first senters to
do some of the research in MCV. With this, the
kids would actually get the vaccine when they're born and
get a fever, yeah, one hundred one fever, which newborns
are not supposed to get, and so the kid would
then get blood cultures done, spinal tap done, staying in
the hospital for three to four yeah, because fever and
an infant is assumed to be horrible because they don't
get fevers. Right, it was just the vaccine. So then
what happened is that we started doing well, actually, we'll
give it to the kid right before they go home,
because it's that way. They get the fever at home
and the mom won't even though right, well, I know,
I'm just I'm not I know, I'm actually not making
this up. This is the way it was. But why
why were we doing that at the Mecal College of
Virginia Because many of the mothers there had drug use
of issues. They weren't going to come back to the hospital.
Their kids wouldn't be seen the system for eight nine years,
So let's play it safe. You know, that's not where
most kids are born and where most moms are at.
So why are we taking the exception and generalizing that
to the population. You know, So I think you know,
when you think about vaccines, and the HPV vaccine. Another
great example of a vaccine. You know, it was a
great book, The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lax. It's on
my reading list of my website. Great book about if
you ever heard of her name, the Heila Jean. She
died of circle cancer in nineteen fifth d The most
common calls of death in women in their forties was
cervical cancer. Right, yeah, that went away. Why did circle
cancer go away because of the HPV vaccine or because
of the pap It was a pap smear is what
eradicated that, you know? And so all of a sudden,
like do you know there's maybe two thousand deaths of
servial cancer, all horrible in the United States every year.
I've never had a patient in mind that from cervial cancer.
Why because the PAP smear so all of a sudden,
Is the HPV vaccine like mission critical for young women? Right,
especially since it's known to calls be related with syncope
and pots. And there's actually a gene test you can
do that can test the susceptibility for people young women
to getting this. Do the pediatricians get this, they'ren mandate it.
Do they get it? The answers no, So you know,
is the HPV vaccine mission critical. Well, we have pap smears,
and are you checking these young ladies and guys for
this h L A, d R, d Q gene that
thing that actually makes them more like you get the
side effect. The answers no, Then why are you gonna
mandate that? So there are ones we should mandate. Hampathize
B vaccine. You know, maybe you get it when you
go to college. Maybe you get it. It used to
be you'd get it if you're going to going to healthcare,
you're gonna work in the jail, you're gonna work a place.
We might get needle sticks, right, But to give it
to the entire population, it's probably a little overkill, especially
since liver cancer and hepatias in our country that this
kind are not that big of a deal. Big deal
in Asia, a big deal in Sub Sahara, Africa, not
a big deal in Virginia.
Speaker 1: What about the MMR vaccine, because I know that one
has a lot of controversy around it.
Speaker 3: Then mem me measles momps rebella is they are a
big deal. You know, if you're pregnant and you get
measles or momps. You can have massive birth effects in
your child. So and so should a child get that vaccine?
It's still an environment you know, measles? You know? Is
I think part of the conversation is we do these
bazillions of vaccines and we pick one out, Like kids
probably would not have an issue with MMR vaccine if
they didn't get thirty other vaccines, right, you know, the
chicken pox vaccines is another live virus. You know, I
got chicken pox, Like maybe you do that when you're
four to six? Do you need a chicken pox vaccine
when you're twelve months old or when you're eighteen months old?
And chicken pox is one of those weird things kind
of sort of like polio. If you get it younger,
it's less severe than when you get older. So why
are we putting it super young? Just kind of the
way we're doing it. So I feel like there should
be a conversation about this. And oh, by the way,
if your kids botom D levels are okay, if they're
nutrient levels are good, if you get a clean diet,
what are their risk for some of these things as well?
It's gonna be less And so we kind of forget
that a lot of these illnesses, these plagues of the
past came up in situations when people have when nutrient
deficiencies were rampant, when people will typically malnourished. And so
there's there's great examples. Actually in my body, if I
mentioned this in my book, I may or may not.
Actually I do kase shans disase. There was a great
example here to go, things popping in my head right, No,
a viraly induced heart issue in China, cardiomopathy induced by
a virus. And so the United States was the process
of working on a vaccine with China. Come to find
out there's a mineral deficiency in this whole region that
was affecting tens of millions of people. They gave them
the deficient nutrient, and all of a sudden, the viraly
induced heart failure went away. So how often does that happening?
The answers, it's more often than we like to think.
So there are some vaccines we should definitely look at,
getting him prevnar. There's some ones we should definitely think
about putting off h I'm sorry, hepatize speed. And there's
some ones that are kind of like polio is a
bad thing. Is there any endemic polio in the United States. No,
it is active right now in Pakistan up gas kant stance.
If an area was a lot refugees from that part
of the world, you should get it. But my patients
in rural Virginia who want to put it off for
a year or two, why not?
Speaker 1: I was gonna ask that, Like, so if people are
going to they still want to vaccinate, but they're not
necessarily want to vaccinate and get six shots at their
two years old appointment. Is it okay to put off
these vaccines like years?
Speaker 2: How many years.
Speaker 3: Someone depends on which we are you talking about. Some
of them you can put off till high school for
sexual activity like the hypotas be vaccine. Some of you
put off a couple of years. You know that the
chicken pox won, Like, oh, I had chicken pox. Everybody
used to get.
Speaker 2: Chicken pox back in the day, chicken pox parties.
Speaker 3: My wife actually when she was a kid, got chicken
pox and her she was sent to all the houses
and were neighbor to give all the kids chicken pox. Right, yeah,
so literally, so maybe you do that later on, you know,
the reality unfortunately, because most people have the chicken pox
backs it's super rare now to get chicken pox, so
you're probably gonna want to get from my son. For example,
we were going to Disney World and he was eight,
and it's kind of like me, a lot of people
around in the world Disney, I don't want to deal
with an eight year old kid with a fever and
feeling krddy. Let's just give him the vaccine, you know,
But does he need it when he's like twelve months old?
Maybe not.
Speaker 1: I have I think everybody has a lot of these
questions because it's very it's it's just our world right now,
especially with COVID. But you talked a little bit about nutrition,
and I wanted to get into like how nutrition is
affecting health in general and why it's completely overlooked by
like the medical industrial complex.
Speaker 3: You know, eighty percent of heart disease and seven percent
of most cancers can be prevented by diet and lifestyle alone. Wow,
just can.
Speaker 2: You say that again?
Speaker 1: Wait say that again for emphasis eighty.
Speaker 3: It's in the book. Eighty percent of heart disease and
seventy percent of most cancers can be prevented by dieting
lifestyle alone. Now we can spend hours talking what this means.
But the basic gist is healthy diet, real food, healthy
lifestyle eliminates eighty percent of the number one killer and
seventy percent of the number two killer. So how can nutrition,
lifestyle stuff not be a part of our healthcare system?
How can I not be reimbursed? How can I don't know?
It's just the way the system is, you know, I
mean I do know. Our system is in acute care system.
You know, if you were to have you know, if
you were to have acute stroke, I want to be
here in the United States within two in Richmond, Virginia.
Within two hours, I'll be getting a clopbluster at Johnson
Will's Hospital, my local community hospital right here, good old
fashioned Saint Francis Medical Center. They'll be stinting my heart
to clear up my block guardy in an hour and
a half. For two hours. That doesn't happen anywhere else
in the world. You want to be here if you
have a complex medical issue, you've got an all immune issue,
crop fatigue, postconcussive syndrome, you're in the military, gulfer syndrome,
you know whatever. Then all of a sudden, we were
horrible because these are things that require complex, multidisciplinary, multiple
levels of expertise, and our system is very broken up
into solids of specialties. And so it's great if you've
got that niche A or the peak ish you need
nee replacement. I mean they're doing the replacements here in Virginia.
Now you get to look a little spinal. They don't
do general It's like amazing. Now, yeah, but what if
you have crock arthritis, You've got ligament issues, you keep
on tearing stuff, you probably have some nutritional issues, you
probably might have hypermobility. Let's deal with that. And that's
where our system is not that good at I was.
Speaker 1: Gonna ask about that because like we have some of
the best medical in the world, right, Like people from
all over the world will come here for like crazy procedures.
But then also it feels like we're almost like the
sickest country in the world.
Speaker 3: Those are two different things that can be true at
the same time. And that's I think where you get confused.
People like, well, either we're the best in the world
or the worst in the world. It's like, well, you
can be the best in the world at procedures in
high tech and still super crazy sick to the people
and that they're not mutually exclusive. I remember this was
like fifteen years ago and the University of Miami was
one of the first places in the world to do
heart five replacement through your arm. They cathorize it, change
the valve, loud wow. And the head of the healthcare
system in Canada that point in time left their country
flew to Miami because they couldn't do it in Canada
to get it here in the United States. Now it's commonplace.
Now I can go to my local Chipphamon Ecal Center here,
which is a big heart center with an HCA and
get that done. It's a routine procedure nowt here. We're
really good at that stuff. What we're not good at
is But at the same time, we have more chemicals
in our food system than any country in the world.
There are you know, black to satan round up. It's controversial, right,
it's band in Europe. It's not all out in Canada yet.
It's you know, we're removing patroleum based This is where
you can't make this stuff up. We're removing patroleum based
dies from our food system, and people are up in arms.
You can't get that stuff in Europe. I was right,
my wife and I we're in Italy and I was
looking at some eminems and opened the bag up and
they eminims were as pretty as our eminem's. They were
kind of these ugly colors I looked at. It's like
natural beat juice, your beats. It's like they were using
natural stuff for the colors and they weren't as pretty.
Speaker 1: My kids get mad about it because I'll buy the
stuff that has like the beats and like the natural colors,
and they're like, these aren't fun, and I'm like, but
they're so they're the same thing. They're so much better
for you.
Speaker 3: It's just and so that's I think that's we have
these two worlds living together where they have all these
special interests. You know, the whole low fat thing. Literally
the food pyramid changed a week ago when when we're
recording this and it said fat fats are back, and
people for in my world, I've been using fats to
treat brain issues for twenty years. When I see autistic kids,
for example, and kids with pandas and pans and my clinic,
most of them have low cholesterol two load it's like
less than one forty, which is a marker for brain issues,
Like why do we have fat deficiency in our country
because we demonized it and so now it's at the
top and people are all in uprage, and that was
not going on in France. When that's not going on
in Italy, they don't say low fat over there. It's
it's really that information for almost fifty years, chemicals in
the environment, high forctos, current soup and everything genetically my
five foods, and on top of that you throw vaccines
or whatever, and it's like we're forty percent of Americans
are obese. That's crazy.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was going to ask about like the obest
because we do see like we're all eating the same
foods as we've always eaten, right, as we've always eaten
as relative I guess, but like Craft macaronim when I
was a kid is so different than Kraft macaroni and
cheese now, or like bread back then. Bread now it's
completely different. Like I'll make bread from scratch at home
because I don't want to buy it at the store,
but it goes bad in like three or four days
because there's no preservatives in it. And so what do
people do if they want to start living a healthier lifestyle.
But life is expensive.
Speaker 3: That's you have to start low hanging fruit. What can
you change now, you know, maybe start sourcing things a
little better, you know, for example, you know in my book,
you know, I have a food sourcing god for across
the country. So now where you're at you can kind
of find things. So for example, salmon, if you want
real wild called salmon, the best price point is actually Costco. Yeah,
you can get a big bag of it bulk. If
you want real raw cheese, European cheese costs guasies. Big
blocks you get block for like fifteen blocks, a huge
thing they Wegman's. That same block is like it's like
fifteen bucks a sing wle thing. If you have kids,
they're gon't to go through a lot of stuff, and
so you have there's there's ways to do it. But
also as a kid, when I was growing up, we
had a garden, we grew stuff, my dad hunted, you know,
we cut corners and other things. We a lot of
our clothes were hand me downs or from the local
thrift store. So it's like what do you value And
if you value nice clothes, nice watches, nice car, you know,
I don't know then you're gonna pay for that stuff.
If you don't value your health, you're not gonna pay
for it. It's really interesting how in our country, but
most of the world spends about thirty to forty percent
of the disposal income, up to sixty percent in poorer
countries on food. The United States were like at that
ten to twelve percent mark. We spend way less on
food in our country than most places in the world.
And part of that, interesting enough, is the Farm Bill.
There's a big subsidy for grain, for corn, sore rice,
and the result of this is that things that eat
that stuff are cheap as well, cows, chickens, eggs. It's
all of a sudden, let me have a food system
where things that are fed genically modified, pesticide ridden foods
are price suppressed. So all of a sudden, eating the
local organic stuff, it's not that it's expensive, it's just
that everything else is government sponsored food. And so when
you start think about like that, do you want to
eat nothing but government, government subsidized food. It just doesn't
sound right, does it. But that's kind of what our
current ecosystem has created. So and I've got resources in
my book to kind of help people navigate that. But
I feel like just conceptually realizing the reason food is
cheap is because it's government subsidized food.
Speaker 1: I've been really advocating for my listeners to go and
find like local farms. And I know it's really hard
when you live in a city to find like a
local farm. But farms aren't that far outside of your city.
If you take an hour drive, you might find one.
But I actually just did a whole episode on raw milk,
because I mean, we drink raw milk here. I would
love your opinions on raw milk.
Speaker 3: Raw milk. Oh my gosh, that is legal. That is
illegal and rigid Virginia. It's not illegal, it's illegal my state.
You know. We So we got my son. He had
horrible eggs in asthma. He was six months old, and
within six months his ego is gone. The year is
asthma is gone. The first thing my wife did is
start making homemade formula for him, and the base for
that was raw milk. I know, horrible, We're horrible parents.
You know it's bad. You know, raw milk is amazing.
It's like if you take raw milk and put it
on your countertop, the natural bacterial enzymes will actually naturally
ferment it. You know, curds and whay. You know little
miss Muffetts, and I don't turpet eat tough eating her
curds and way right, that was just milk separating naturally.
If you set it out for three days, and what happens.
Whay comes out the courage turned into the stuff you
filter with cheese cloth, put some salt. That's cork. That's
a German cheese. Like milk is a super food that
actually will turn into other things and self digests and
it ferments into these amazing things if you take it
and you make what an oral mix. Whatter an oil
do not mix naturally. If you take them and make
them mix, you change food chemistry. If you alter pasteurize
the milk to two hundred and eighty five degrees flash
heat it right, you will change the protein structure and
actually make the milk tasting and other proteins inflammatory, and
you destore those enzymes in there. So the milk story
is very much like the bread story. Like raw milk
and ultra pasteurized homogenized milk with her common bround growth
hormone and about fifty milligram equivalents of anti box in it.
It's not the same as the raw milk from my
farmer twenty men's down the road. And it's really interesting.
You know, there's a thing called Sea fifteen. If you
heard Sea fifteen's, that's so unfamiliar to you at all.
Sea fifteen Okay, you like this. Your listeners will love
this if they like rabbit holes and conspiracy theories. So
about a third of the country is deficient in sea fifteen. Okay, okay,
And see it's fifteen deficiency and dolphins associated with dolphin dementia.
Speaker 2: Oh wow.
Speaker 3: It was actually discovered by vets, dolphin vets, and they
realized they fed dolphins back of a diet, the regular diet,
the dolphins wouldn't get dementia. And significant Americans have this
efficiency in this this saturated fat. The source of it
from it in our diet is actually fermenting animal's milk,
so the cream basically, so all of a sudden, all
of your raw milk, your cheese, and all in all
similar PROCs butter ghee. Well, what if we removed from
our diet from for the last fifty years fat, so
we actually induced this essential saturated fat deficiency in our
population from from this thing, from our recommendations, and where
would we have gotten that historically? Milk butter, So milk
is interesting. Yeah, it's it's it's it's interesting, it's in
So I mean some people can't digest it, Yes, some
people of lactose deficiency. Yes, certain ethnicies don't digest it.
And yes, as you get older, you tend to not
digest it quite as well. These are all true, true,
These are all true, true and true. But it doesn't
mean from minted foods aren't still ridiculously healthy for you.
And it doesn't mean that things like butter and gee
aren't still ridiculously healthy for you. So we finally have
removed the We've been demonizing fat for all these years,
and now the government has finally recognized, Hey, we have
a fat deficiency syndrome in our country and nutrient deficiency
syndrome and we need to fix that.
Speaker 1: That's interesting because yeah, I did this episode and I
was like, my son had ezema, he had chronic dip
rash and like his whole first year and we kept
we lived in Colorado at the time. We were looking
for raw milk, but we just couldn't find it. We
were on a wait list for like two years because
everybody wanted it, and so when we got here, we
switched into raw milk, and he has not had a
divrash since, like cleared him up. And I was like,
there's no coincidence here that raw milks cleared him up.
Speaker 3: It's raw milk and ultra pastorized milk are not the
same species. They might both be white, but it's not
the same thing. Just like bread. You know my bread,
your bread as well. It's the iron coin or whatever
grain you use, salt water, and then the culture the
bread that has bread and mulci foers in it, that
has bread conditioners in it, that's been typically fermented for
three hours, not traditionally fermented for twenty four to forty hours,
but doesn't use a polyculture that uses a sarcumices sobca
culture that was emitted in lighteen hundreds called bewers yeast.
There's so many things that go into that that make
bread what is today. It's not what it was two three,
four thousand years ago. And so when you say bread
good bad, it's you're you're talking about two different species
of things.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I could see that. So you talked about environmental
factors a little bit ago, jumped over it, but I
want to go back. Because the people that are gardening,
that are bringing their food out of the garden like
they have all these even if they have like cows
or pigs or whatever, and the kit they're eating the
grass like they should be. What do we do about
kim trails and how that is affecting our food?
Speaker 3: You want to do the best you can do, so
you know, in this world you're not gonna perfect. We
literally have information from polar bears in the North Pole
having pesticides in their fat. Where do they get the stuff?
It's from stuff in the water, and then it gets
in the fish and then they eat the fish. Right,
So there's really no place you can go where you're
gonna it's gonna be pristine. So it's about minimizing exposure.
And human body is amazing. I mean, I'm amazed that
any of us are alive. When you start studying it
and you learn that the eight thousand plus cymicals that
are producing our country, we've studied maybe two thousand of
them to date for safety, So the vast majority of
we have no idea if they're safe. Or not right,
and so it's just about minimize exposure. And part of
the way your body was amazingly made was if you
get the right nutrition, if you get the right antioxids,
you can accuse viamin C, for example, as a protectant
against pesticides. There's an interesting case in the book I
was reading recently about It was about four kids, those
two older kids and I'm sorry, it's two older kids
and a younger kid. And they were out and like
in Kentucky somewhere, and a plane came over the top
and they got they weren't supposed to be there and
got hit with They were dusted with I forget what
the chemical was. So some pesticide and the two older
kids cover. The younger kid went to the hospital. The
young kid got ivy viamin C. One of the older
kids got iv vimin c. The older kid didn't. The
young kid was fine. The other the other adult guy
boy was like, here's okay. The one that didn't get
av viamin C died a couple of days later. Like
the I, v viamin C was able to block the
oxidative stress, the inflammation, the toxic effects from the pesticide
and you can just from having acquiate baymen seen on
our diets, you can actually help a miliorate some of
the negative impacts from lead, mercury, arsenook, all these kind
of things. So just something appropriate nutrients in your diet,
minimizing the exposures can actually have a big impact for
all these things. And that's kind of you know, my
dad wasn't living on a farm where as a kid
they used our stick and the chicken feet. He actually
used d DT in his house as a spray to
kill bugs. Yeah, he's eighty eight this year, you know,
but he ate deer they caught. They went hunting, and
they had they had their own stuff they raised, like
the only stuff he ate as a kid. Grew up
with stuff they caught called grew or killed themselves. And
so it's a different world where he was eating real
food and literally had DDT spray in his house and
used our stick for chickens. And he was eighty eight
and still trucking along.
Speaker 1: What do you think about like worms and like people
like doing these parasite cleanses and stuff that don't seem
to be acceptable, right, Like the animals get parasites. How
come we are told when getting parasites.
Speaker 3: We do have parasites. You know, a third of the
world's population has a parasite of some sort. In Virginia,
in southwestern Virginia, parasites are endemic. And if you talk
to Venarians, they're like, if you have a pet in
your house, if you have a dollar cat in your house,
you have our crack parasite exposure. The bigger question is
all are parasite all? Are all parasites bad?
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a good question.
Speaker 3: There there are some there's some literature suggests that the
parasites actually help educate your immune system to lower risk
for allergies. For example, So if you look at sub
the countries that are endemic in parent with parasites, okay,
you don't see inflamed robo disease, you don't see crones,
you don't see all immunity. You know, there is this
interesting population experiment with the with the iron not the
iron with the Berlin Wall. When it got pulled down,
you had some parts of scann Nava. One part was Russian,
one part was Western and so the Eastern Europe or
eastern Germany or the Russian part they were still very living,
like almost like forty years earlier. Everybody parasites dirt everywhere,
low asthma, low eczema, you know, low immunity, the cleaner areas.
They're having lots of issues. So the question is are
parasites like a lot of things in environment, are they
connext for immune system? For some literature suggests that, but
if you have chronically he got, you have toxins in
the environment, might you lose tolerance to those parasites and
might they cause issues? Yeah, and we're seeing a lot
of this toxin induced loss of tolerance called tilt syndrome,
where chemicals environment make us more pronent allergies, ezema, asthma.
It's really interesting if you look at hay fever speaking
endemic in Europe with the industrial evolution. It wasn't until
we saw you saw lots of cold burning, lots of
small in Europe that people's populations started getting hay fever.
It used to be hay fever used to be the
farmers got hay favorite, right, And so so parasites is
not a yes no thing. And I've done some with
some of my work with patients, had patients, some ultistic
kids that actually ordered special pin worm based parasites from
Duke Okay that we used to help treat some of
their all immune issues. So it's not a parasite. It's
all about parasites, all good. But another part of that
another rabbit trails. When you go to third world countries,
people will have paras because of malnutrition. They will have
parasite overgrowth. And with with malnutrition, they'll have issues. And
I've actually had patient, a bad kid actually in the
mission hospital and Honduras die from that. He was actually
coughing up parasites. But if you talk with your farmers
about Calvin, they were like, you know, all the cows
have parasites. It's just all we do is control the number.
And so it's more complicated than everybody needs to parasite clans.
But for some people, you know, and I checked for
parasites routinely. It's a part, it's a standard part of
the things I do. For some people, it's a big
part of what they need to do for their health.
But like many nuanced things, it's not all bad, all good.
Speaker 1: The devil's in the details, right, But like so if
this is a detailed question, if somebody does a parasite clans,
but they have animals living in their house, right, so
they're likely, I mean, from what you're saying, they're gonna
get parasites. Back, is it is it fine to do
the parasite clans because then you'll get those parasites again
and they'll be like assuming what they should.
Speaker 3: Well, what is a parasite clanse? And typically it's things
like clove ardemesia black want extract. It's usually these herbal
things that also are anti inflammatories. They also control yeast
strap staff over growth in your gut. They also have
these things called polyphenols, which are chemicals that feed certain bacteria.
They also tend to help improve libertytoxification, and bile production.
So the question is is the parasite clans just a
parasite clanse? Okay, the answer is no, it's not just
a paracyclone. It's also resetting your gut microbiome. It's also
anti inflammatory. It's also helping your livery detoxify. So what
is you know, what's the big therapeutic result is that
the paracyclons are all the other stuff that's doing. I
think for that they would be a great conversation to debate,
but it's just doing more than just the paracyclons, because
when I get people prescription medications for ambig dysentery or
antamba histolytica or whatever other you know, pen worm, whatever,
it's very specific for that, it's not doing this other.
When I get people world prescription anti parasix, they're not
having the same anti flammatory detox response with a a
nature pathic or a traditional aervatic paracyclon. So they're not
when I even talking about the same thing, when I
talk about medical versus a herbal paracyclons, that makes sense.
Speaker 1: I want to know why so many doctors and so
we're having this debate right now in the world, I think,
or from my perspective because I live in this like bubble,
I think of conspiracy theories where we have like the
functional health which is getting very popular. We have traditional health,
which is paid for by insurance. So why are so
many doctors that are traditional, right like traditional for us,
like Western medicine, that they just look at the symptom,
they throw medication at it. Why are they not looking
at the whole person the way functional health does.
Speaker 3: I mean, the reason there's conspiracy theories is there's a
grain of truth to them. The question is, once you
go on the rabbit hole, where you come out, is
that truth? There's that totally off base. And now that's
why I think having conversations is great, and everything's kind
of complicated when you kind of get to it, but
the ultimate answers should be basic and simple for us
to apply to it. So I think the simple answer
here is you give what you pay for. And so
when you come see a in my old practice, I
would see six people an hour, So that's like every
ten minutes I'm seeing someone. You come in, you come
check in the front desk. Insurance says, I have to
screen you for depression. I have to screen you for
your vaccines if you had them. I have to verify
who you are even if you become in my practice
for twenty years after look at your ID and verify
that grandma's grandma, she's had and changed. You know that
takes up fifteen twenty minutes. You finally get back to
see me, after doing all the things we're mandated to do,
I've got five seven minutes with you and you come
and talk to me about all your headaches and your rashes,
and I'm like, oh, here's a migraine medication to hear's
some topical steroids. How your kid's doing. We'll see you later.
That's your five minutes, right right. You get what you
pay for if you go to a functional minded you know,
I do my intake. It's like a two and a
half hour process reviewing your history. I'm spending pin an
hour viewing the labs. Totally different experience. We're looking at
totally different things. And that's where I think of the
difficulty is with our current system. It pays for procedures,
it pays for volume, It doesn't pay cognitively. It doesn't
pay for your doctor to sit and think, to process
and say what why are you having these rashes? Why
is your son having this butt rash? What's this fatty
acid level? What's his vioomin D status? As he had
a guts to analysis? Like like that is going to
take me extra time. And I remember when I my
old practice might order labs on people. It's like, okay,
I've got literally at the end of the day, I'm
o review labs for thirty or forty people. I have
thirty to forty five seconds per person if I want
to go home and see my family. So I can't,
So I wouldn't order a lot of fancy tests. Refer
to in your crinologist, refer to cardiologies, refer to specialists,
because there's not time in the system. And so I
think we're getting part part of this is that you
get what the system is designed for, and you get
what you paid for. People that want to pay are
wanting to pay government rates and government and improve insurance
for personalizing and ventialized care. It just doesn't make sense.
You have government improven insurance through corporations. Lewis Common nominator
rates go down every year, but yet you want this
high level individualized personal's care. It's like it's not gonna
work like that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just think the system's broken. Unfortunately, that's a
short answer, Yeah, because like.
Speaker 3: I mean, is the thing? Is the system broken or
is it working as designed? You know, it's very much
similar to the system my grandfather. You can get a bronchi,
should go to the doctor. They check you in, they listen
to your lungs, this is your acute issue, here's your
anna bach and you go home and that you know,
how's that different than what happens today? Minus the things
I mentioned. It's about the same where system is working
the same. This AI world, where literally you can have
access to the mass of the world's information, a healthier
system is still working the same way as it was
half a century ago, and they have people like me
starting practices. We're trying to do things differently with AI
and I fused practices using you know, functional mess and labs.
I've got three boards of vacation, so I'm looking at
a bunch of different databases. I'm in multiple groups around
the world with different doctors doing really cool stuff. If
you want access to that, that's not going to be
a five minute.
Speaker 1: Visit, you know, right, Yeah, we go. I go to
a functional medicine clinic here because I just got sick
of being sick, Like you know, cause, like you'll go
to the doctor and you're like, I don't feel good
and they're like, well take this medication.
Speaker 2: You're like, well, the medication made.
Speaker 1: Me feel worse, and they're like, well, I just give
it a few like months to kick in, and then
when it does kick in, now you have all these
weird side effects. They're like, well, take this medication, take
that medication. Finally, I'm like, okay, here's the deal. Like
I'm having more side effects than what was wrong with
me to begin with. I don't even want to take
all these things.
Speaker 2: I'll just deal with the issue.
Speaker 3: Sure, what you know, go down a little rabbit hole.
Thirty percent of all drugs are mitochondrial toxic unts. So
basically means thirty percent of drugs can actually mess you
up if you don't watch the side effects. That's that's
the first the first thing. The second thing is a
pointing to the current literature. It's possible that medical error
is the third most common cause of death in our country.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 3: So all of a sudden, it's like, we have this
system that's volume in versus out, that's not contemplative, that
doesn't look at the whole person, and we have problems.
We're gonna have medical air, we have issues. So I
think you have to ed what I'm trying to use,
educate people from the bottom up. And I'm not waiting
for the government to make decisions. I'm not waiting, you know,
twenty three years for the government to say home and
replace some therapy is okay, which they did remember, or
to say fats back, which it took half a century
to that happened last week. You know, you have to
make your own path, and ultimately, you know, you vote
with your money. And if people are demanding better healthcare
and they're voting that way with their votes and with
their money, the system will change slowly, but it will change.
And that's why I feel like we're starting to see
now people voted differently, whether you like it or not,
a year ago, and we're seeing those changes and many
of them, like you know, fats are back. Can you
know patrollum based does around of the food we're questioning
floord in the drinking water, Like I think these are
good things for health.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember what my question was.
Speaker 1: Okay, well it's more like a statement. I would like
you to talk about the gut microbiome because it's the
second brain, right, and we have this depression and anxiety
epidemic in our country, and I'm wondering if it's because
we're so malnutritious nutrit wow, mauntnourished.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 3: So you've got the gut, you got the lining, the
wall of your gut, which is where eighty percent of
the immune system is, and you've got this ecosystem that
creates seventy five percent of all neurotransmitters, serotonin fifty percent
of dopamine, and your gut they have the bacteria. You
have this metabolic engine of these bacteria that produce vioamin k,
that produce b viomins, that produce ut rate, short chain
fatty acids. And we're just now learning how important it
is if you have an autoimmune disease. For example, by definition,
you have to have four things. One's leaky gut, the
ones of crock infection, and for many people that crock
infection is abnormal growth of bacteri in your gid track.
You know, genetically speaking, humans have like maybe twenty three
thousand genes plus or minus. There's a million genes in
the bacteria that are in an on your body, ninety
nine percent of which you're in your gid track. So
all of a sudden, your gut becomes this place where
you develop tollge to the environment everything you breathe and eat.
Your immune system and your gut with the bacteria says ignore, ignore, ignore, ignore, ignore,
and you want them to ignore it. Yeah, nine nine
point nine percent of what immune system is supposed to
do is ignore dust. Mites, ignored dust, ignore pollen. Ignore
my thiroated ignore my my joints, right. But when it
becomes dysfunctional, that's when you get inflammation and a bunch
of other things. So the gut microbiome is a metadlock
engine produces nutribes for me for our body. But it's
exquisitely here, we'll hear it, you know, let's go down
the beat hath here round up glac of state God's
patent as a blocker for the chicken mate pathway. It's
fine for humans to take because we don't have that
that enzyme that path may in our body, but bacteria do.
Oh oh, you can't. There, that's the dot you just connected. There,
it actually affected back to in your gut.
Speaker 2: You need what you need.
Speaker 3: But but that's not that's that's not all. That's not
all over. Ninety percent of round up is actually a
petroleum distillate patrolum distillates. You know, when I got grease
on my hand while I was a kid, I didn't
know any better. I would use a patrolum distillate kerosene
to clean off or spirits to clean off the paint
from my hand. Yeah, that's what's in that's in something
like that in round up. So now you have these
distillates that you're getting your body that dissolve the mucus
in your gut all of a sudden. Now there's a
biological plausibility for why one chemical roundup could have multiple
different native impacts on your health, irrespective of whether they're
directly affecting you because of the back to in your gut.
Speaker 1: And that's just like you said, one example, like how
many examples out there?
Speaker 2: Like the people don't even know about it. Oh my gosh,
this is so good. I'm loving this conversation.
Speaker 1: And then I also wanted to bring up the maternal
more more mortality rate in our country.
Speaker 2: Because I feel like.
Speaker 1: We have, like we discussed, we have a fantastic healthcare system,
except we're killing mothers at a crazy rate.
Speaker 3: See, I'm not up to date with that number. What's
the current number right now in our country? Let me
pulled up because when you you might have to educate
me here what you're because my brain is going to
fifteen places right now with that, whether.
Speaker 1: Let's go ahead, Paternal deaths they decrease in twenty thirteen
from eighteen or twenty twenty three, excuse me, eighteen point
six per one hundred thousand live births and too from
twenty two point three, so it went from twenty two
to eighteen and twenty twenty three. But eighteen out of
every one hundred thousand mothers are dying.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's not as bad as it used.
Speaker 2: To be, right, that's good.
Speaker 3: A corner women used to die. Probably, how being babies
is risky business, yes, and it was. It was routinely
you'd see a grave size, you know, a husband and
two wives, you know grave, and it's like the husband
with the husbands would bury the wives. And you see
some small little baby graves. They very baby bury babies
as well. You're part of the whole issue with life
expectancy has been skewed historically because you take a bunch
of zeros ones and twos and a bunch of twenties
and eighteens from from the moms, all of a sudden,
it makes life expeccing look like we're dying super young.
I have this paper I've got in my desktop. I
was looking at the life expecancy in the United Kingdom
and the seventeen hundreds and males pasted adolescents, so it
was ignoring kids and babies was ignoring women those.
Speaker 2: Just because they were dying really fast.
Speaker 3: But in seventeen hundreds and the United Kingdom life expecancy
was seventy two to seventy three and a male if
you made it to adolescens, well now it's like eighty
two eighty three, So literally an a box and surgery
added maybe ten years. Yeah, that's not super impressive if
you think about it. Well, why you where we get
these numbers of the average age was thirty in the
first century, It's because so many people died in childbirth,
and so many babies died before they did twelve. I
think the bigger story here, and this might be what
you're referring to, is why would you so many sea
sections in our country? Why is it some states like
half of the deliveries are about the sea section, and
you go to Ireland and it's like five percent.
Speaker 1: I do want to get to that, but I want
to go back to this question. I'm not trying to
I'm not trying to be off. But so this question
was specifically compared to other countries, So like the United
States were having eighteen per one hundred thousand, where's like
Norway has zero, so Zil has one point two. Australia
has less than five, Japan has less than five, the
UK has five and a half.
Speaker 2: Canada has eight.
Speaker 1: So we have at least ten more compared to Canada. Yes,
I do want to get into these sections.
Speaker 3: Though, well I would, well like, what's a big driver
for that? You know, you have to look at nutrition.
Women's publicists are getting smaller. Interesting, it's it's very our
facial features are changing. Actually, wes Today Price, if you
ever heard of wester Day Price, he was actually a
dentist to went around the world in the forties and fifties.
He found that nutrition would change facial features, change risk
for certain diseases. But one of the things that does
is your facial features will change in public size will
change over generations of mount nutrition. Yeah, and so the
question becomes, okay, what this is? Where the devil's in
the details? Okay, So which is it? Babies that aren't
making it out? Is it babies that are having their
head crushed by four SIPs? Is it moms are needing
sea sections? Because each of those are potentially of different calls. Right,
if your mom who has a small lower jawl, who's mountainnursed,
you have a small pelvis and all of a sudden's
hard to put a baby through that. You have to
get sea section, and their healthcare system itself is like, hey,
I got golf game going on here, whatnot? You know,
it's kind of long, Let's go on and schedule your
sea section, right versus other places are like, you know,
they're not doing that in Ireland, They're not doing that
in these other countries. And then there's the whole thing
with the infant mortality issues, which goes into infections and
things like that. So I think when you look at
a number like that, I'm like, Okay, the questions I'm
asking going to ask, are is it okay? Is it
the maternal morbidity? Is it directly related to sea sections?
Is a directly the delivery process itself. There's so many things,
you know I just mentioned we have kind of sort
of wrong that can be adding to that. It's not
gonna be as simple. You know, a final opaduraals are
worse than they are in Canada or whatever. It's gonna
it's got thing to be more nuanced, if that makes sense.
Speaker 1: Yeah, talk about babies that like vaginal birthday babies versus
sea section babies because there is a difference in their
gut bicro biomes and like how they develop over time.
Speaker 3: Right, So it's their nature is infinitely complex. It is
so cool. You can't make this stuff up. So the
last trimester of pregnancy, a mother will switch your boy
switches the kind of back to you in your vagina
to prevotella, the more provatella dominant. What happens in the
baby's born the first swallow is actually a gulp of
vaginal fluid, and whatever it's in the vagina strap staff
yeast or prevotella or Bedford bactor, whatever's there, will actually
be the first thing that actually starts populating the baby's
jat track. And then the baby gets coated in the
vaginal fluid and then baby's like there, So what do
we do in our country? See action you bought past?
That baby comes out. You wash the baby down, scrub
them down, soap and water. You know, now we're getting smarter.
We're actually okay, we're not gonna bavee the baby for
a day. Right, We're gonna let the bacteris sit there.
If the baby's a sea section, we're gonna take a
sponge from the mom's the really high level birthing centers
are doing this here in the United States now. They'll
take a swab of cotten four about fours swab your
vaginal area and then stick the baby's nose and rub
the baby down with it to try to populate the
baby with mom's bacteria. Because if you don't what happens
the baby, it's populated with the skin back to here
from the surgeon, which is totally different, and that you know,
sea section babies are more prone for asthma, exema, autimmune issues.
And then breastfeeding, you know, the first seven days the
class drum, every baby's born with leaky gut. I don't know, Okay, yeah,
they're all born thinking gut in the class drum has
lots of ig g immun globbians that actually seal that
gut up in the first week. Well, if you see
section and go bottle feed and get that's what happens.
You don't get the right back to your and this
leaky got takes longer to heal up. And if you're
using really bad formula, maybe it doesn't ever quite heal up.
So the natural process is so complicated, so beautiful and
so like cool, but also if you dev eight from that,
you can relate result in a lot of issues.
Speaker 1: So if a mother is having a baby that's not
at one of the like there they had a c section,
but they're not at one of the hospitals that would
swab like you know and put it all over the baby.
Speaker 2: Can a mother do that? And like, how is it
still helpful?
Speaker 1: Like three hours later, four hours later, like six hours later, whenever,
like they're back in there like mom baby unit, right,
and they're just with their baby and they're like, hey, husband, like.
Speaker 2: Help me out here. Like I know that sounds weird
and gross, but like.
Speaker 3: It is weird and gross, but you know the natural
way is the baby's slimmy for a day and you
bathe it a day or two later. So nothing's weirder
and grosser than that. Nothing's or and grosser than what's
supposed to happen, right, right, So you know that's you.
I'll see kids with exama asthma, IBS algae issues when
they're tooish, and you know, it's interesting how you can
still work on them. You know, usually they have fatty
ass deficiencies when I do their gut tests, and usually
it's a wreck. So we fix their gut. Usually they
have other you know, they enviodm D levels are almost
always low. So I've had really good success with helping
these kids later on. So it's not hopeless. There is hope.
You can do things about it. That's what your mom's
out there. Don't beat yourself up. You don't know what
you don't know. And the fact that you're listening this
to hear this, and you want to make a difference.
You can hire percent change your director of your child.
I wouldn't focus on I should have done, I should
have done, I should have done, because I feel like
that's where people get stuck. There's so many things you
can do. And I think about my kids when I
got them, the situations they went through, and they're all
thriving now, and they all came from pretty crazy situations,
so it's it's pretty it's still possible. I don't know
if I mentioned I forget what I say when I
say how, but my daughter's situation, my other daughter situation,
in my sun situation, they all came from pretty crazy
places and they're all thriving right now.
Speaker 2: So you adopted all three of them?
Speaker 3: Adopted all three?
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, you brought up vitamin D deficiency a couple
of times, and so I wanted to know if you
would get into that a little bit because we've seen it.
Speaker 2: We see it in children, we see it as adults.
Speaker 1: What do we do about vitamin D besides like just
taking a settlement, which is an option.
Speaker 3: You know, food sources for vitamin D are co liver, oral,
or you can meat and liver. So that's where you get
it from, mainly in your diet, So eat those things.
So are you going to do that? Most people are
going to do that. The caveat to that is a
thirty percent of meat consumption in the United States before
nineteen fifty was organ meat. So we actually used to
eat this stuff. We can we can eat it again.
We can eat it again. But as far as getting
from the sun, people will say, I'm just gonna get
from the sun. The problem with that theory is that
in order to make enough vitamin D on your skin
when the sun hits it, you need to have sea
bumb like layer of fat on your skin. And part
of the way your body makes viman D is u
v radiation hits you know, v B particularly hits your
skin hits this fat molecule breaks down da da da dad.
But you start format in your skin. If you wash
off the natural fats from your skin, you won't make
as much viman D. So who takes a shirt out
every day with soap and water, The answer is most people.
So you're automatically to diminish your body's ability to make
bo D in your skin. And so all of a sudden, like, well,
how do you fix that? Well, don't shower and run aroundside,
put your shirt, your clothes off, or take a supplement.
You know, I've there's so many patients I've seen white skin,
fair skin, black skin, brown skin or whatever, and bomin
D deficiencies are everywhere. But there's one person I've seen
with skin and color who had normal viomin D levels.
And I know him because here's my son. And he
would not take a single supplement. Also wouldn't shower and
ran around so that all the time as a kid,
and his D levels were amazing, And I was like, look,
I know, here's the stage of life when showers were like,
you know, once a week maybe kind of thing, and
in his room and he smelt like it. He's growing,
he's growing out of that stage. He's fifteen, grown out
in stage in life, but it's amazing. Like so the
question becomes, okay, are you gonna go? You know we
should work outside well even but then but then, well,
you put something lotion on, you put clothing on, you
block the sun, you block v B that burns and
makes it so now you're just getting the A exposure.
So all of a sudden, you're still not gonna make
the same amount of BOTTOM and D. So really, in
today's modern culture, unless you eat organ meat, calver orl
or don't bathe regularly, you probably need to supplement.
Speaker 2: Interesting, I didn't know that.
Speaker 3: To that, I'm sorry. Make sure the D has at
least K two m K seven in it because for
D to do it and to do and need to
come with the other fat syble vinomins. That's just a
little caveat. I don't right have people supplement D. I
don't just do d' to D with the other fat
syble viamins.
Speaker 2: So what do you think about sunscreen?
Speaker 3: Then? I have a love hate relationship with sunscreen. I'm
fifty two and not put it on because I don't
want to burn, because I don't want all kinds of
stuff but a lot of skin skin greens, sunscreens are toxic.
Look at the chemicals in them. You know, you're putting
different daily eates different you have. It feels nice and soft, smoky,
probably has these things called dailates, which are neuro indocrine disruptors.
I tend to use just a metal basising titanium type ones.
But the best thing is just covering your skin, you know.
So what I do these days is just I got
south my long sleeved and it's actually kind of popping
that wearing. There's like there's photoprotective clothing with the hat
that's actually hi the way to go, and just putting
sunscreen basically on your face because sunscreens themselves, the really
good wines are expensive. You gotta put them over all
of your body. And do you apply and ounce, you know,
every hour to your body when the outside the answers
most people don't, you know, So it's the smart thing
is to use clothing. And aside to that, I did
a lot of dermatology churning at USF back in the day,
and it's interesting if you look at these melanoima maps
with melanoma incidents, and it exploded in the seventies, in
late seventies early eighties when we started using more sunscreens.
So there's a question on you know, just sunscreens prevent
they actually might using them might actually increase melima risk
because you make let's findin d and you get more
uva radiation exposure.
Speaker 1: So that's a very nuanced Also, if it's like, because
your skin is not used to seeing the sun because
we're wearing sunscreen, like, then when it does see the sun, like,
does your skin start to have like a almost like
an adverse reaction.
Speaker 3: Well that one hundred percent. That's the reason why people
have a lot of issues in the spring because they've
been clothed data and they also grow out for four
hours and they burn like crazy, or get these autommune
you can get the actually photos sensitivity reactions. We're skin
the vessels. It's actually a type of basculie where vessels
breaking stuff because your skin's not used to it. So
historically we'd be outside in the sun all the time, right,
there was no sting indoors things, So we do have
some things that are induced. So in the spring, myself
and my kids will like go out for an hour.
We slowly introduce ourselves back to the sun so we
don't burn. But the biggest concern with your skin is
actually burned blistering burns. That's when you really ramp up
your wrists for melanoma or other skin cancer. So great
exposure is helpful and covering is probably best.
Speaker 1: So getting a little bit red is okay as long
as it's not blistering.
Speaker 3: Correct yet, that's actually called a minimal earthema dose, and
if you get a full body of that, you make
about twenty thousand units of bymand. So I try to do.
Speaker 1: That with my son's I'm like, okay, we're gonna go outside.
As soon as they start to look red, I'm like, okay,
now we can go inside.
Speaker 2: We can cover up. We put on some sunscreen, like.
Speaker 1: I don't completely take out the sunscreen, but I'm very
like hush, like just I don't slather them in sunscreen either,
because I don't know.
Speaker 3: I go back and forth when I do that. Kind
Why I do is I take my shirt off and
get my twenty minutes, like you do, not put my
shirt on and my hat on, so I get my
exposure like my twenty minutes. I'm I'm pale, complexed, my son, says, pasty.
He has beautiful browns, he has beautiful brown skin. He
turns this beautiful chocolate color. I'm so it gets these
beautiful highlights. I'm super jealous. But he he doesn't have
to worry about He don't have to worry about. He
turns chocolate and his hair gets light and he just
looked super cool in the summertime.
Speaker 2: Doctor, Aaron, what is the name of your book?
Speaker 3: It's Incurable from Hopeless Diagnosis to Defying All Odds.
Speaker 1: And I will link that in the show notes. Do
you have a website you want me to link as well?
Speaker 3: Yeah, Incurable book dot com and then Aaron Hartman ind
dot com.
Speaker 2: Perfect. Thank you so much.
Speaker 1: I feel like we learned a lot today. I asked
you some crazy questions, so we.
Speaker 3: Went all over the place. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I figure, since I have you, I should ask as
many questions as I could come up with.
Speaker 2: And I tried.
Speaker 3: So is your show with this is your thing? I'm
along for the ride.
Speaker 2: Well, I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: Until next week, my friends, stay skeptical and we will
see you all then.
Speaker 2: Hey friends.
Speaker 1: The rabbit Hole is an independent podcast, written, hosted, and
produced by me Danny Mercy Special thanks to Lindsey for
research and writing. If you love the podcast, please leave
us a five star rating and review wherever you're listening.
Follow us on social media at Rabbit dot Hole podcast,
and visit our website at Stayskeptical dot com for everything else.