Speaker 1: Big Food and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo.
Speaker 2: These guys are your favorites, so like say subscribe and
raid it, lip Stary and me.
Speaker 1: The greatest go on yesterday and listening watching lim always
keep its watching. And now you're hosts Cliff Berrickman and
James Bubo Fay Bobo Clifford, how you doing, sir?
Speaker 3: Good? Back good? How are you doing?
Speaker 2: Oh I'm tired, but generally good. But there's been some
great Bigfoot stuff. I'll tell you about that in the
member episode. Like there was a sighting last week, there
was a track find just a few days before by
a police officer on his property, and we can talk
about those events in the member section. So uh yeah, yeah,
there's a lot going on. Man loves so got new
displays going on in the Bigfoot Museum in the NABC
there and like what oh we well we we have
a partnership now with a Bigfoot mapping project. We have
a touchscreen interactive Kiosk featuring their interactive Sightings map where
people can come in because we get visitors from all
over the country literally all over the world really, but
all over the country all the time. And you know,
people from Texas and Utah and Kentucky or wherever come
in and they say, are there sasquatches where I live?
And they go, Wolbard you live, and oh yeah, this
and this and this. But now we have an actual
map so they can zoom in and look at particular
sighting reports and read them and do all that sort
of stuff. Just putting on the finishing touches of that
right now. I made the little sign for it or
whatever the instructions. But it's a beautiful sea display mount
and everything. And yeah, when I get a picture, when
I get everything done, when the signs are done printed
being printed later in the week, I'll send a picture
to the guy who runs a big foot mapping project
and let him see that. So I'm excited about that.
Got some new stuff. We have a biography wall now
that features so far just four biographies Sanderson, Krantz, Meldrum,
and John Green. So that's kind of new stuff. I
just made a display and turned it in for printing
on Saturday. About the Dwayne Freeman photographs, not the movies,
so that his dad got you know, his dad film
Sasquatches twice. The stills, Yeah, the stills, because very few
people know about that apparently and some and at least
one of those is actually a really good picture. The
ones a little less so. But that first one or
that one too, would be the last, second, last one,
I guess the fourth one. I think there's five total. Yeah,
so that and I've been delving into that a little
bit more. Paul Freeman himself said that when all that
event was happening and Dwayne was snapping photographs, Paul said
that he had an eight millimeter movie camera with him
and started trying to film something. But he doesn't think,
like according to his recorded interview, he doesn't think. He
didn't think that anything turned out on the footage. But
I said, well, I think and I never saw any
of this, So I called Michael. Michael, they dude, what's
up with that? He goes, I don't know what's up
with that? You know, there is some footage there. There
is some eight millimeters stuff around here, like I haven't
my dad's stuff. Maybe I should get that developed. I go, yeah,
maybe you should. How interesting would that be?
Speaker 3: Jesus?
Speaker 2: Yeah, So I'm tracking down little bits and pieces in
the Meldrum collection as well, And you know, I found
another photograph of a Paul Freeman. It's actually part of
a newspaper article after he filmed that sasquatch in the
middle of April of nineteen ninety two months before he
got his d Duck footage. If he has a really
lousy piece of footage of a sasquatch that was taken
over by Green Peak, and there's a picture of the
camera he used, which is the same camera at d
Duck Springs, And we don't know what model camera that
was because it was sold in the garage sale a
couple of years later. So I'm trying to track down
that information. God, there's just so much going on all
the time.
Speaker 3: Pull up for fifteen dollars or something. Well, who knows?
Speaker 2: Who knows Michael, And Michael says that he thinks it
was sold in a garage sale, but he doesn't even
know that for a fact, So we know, we don't know.
There's a lot about the Freeman stuff we don't know still,
but between Michael and I and my occasional contact with Dwayne,
you know, we'll try to figure out best we can.
But God, so much going on, so much going on,
and that's just a tip of the iceberg. So we'll
save that for the member section, you know, so our
our members can hear about that, of course at the
episode that comes out every Thursday. And if you want
to be a member, if you're not a member yet,
you maybe you want to be a member five bucks
a month. You get every single episode, including this one,
completely advertisement free, and you get the here cool stuff
that you that the regular folks don't get to hear
an extra whole episode a week.
Speaker 3: So I'm getting a lot of a lot of great
feedback on the last few episodes, Like people are like, man,
you guys been on five the last three four episodes.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, we have that great guests, fantastic guests lately.
Speaker 3: I listened to Chris Spencer three times already and I'm like,
I got a whole list of questions for him again. Nice?
Speaker 2: Nice, So three three more times? So you listen four
times when we recorded it and three more times after that.
Speaker 3: Uh nice, We've proud's got a bunch of questions for
us today.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's our March Q and A today, something I
look forward to every month. I love doing these episodes
because it's a nice way to interact with our listeners.
All the questions are submitted by our listeners.
Speaker 1: Yep, we got a good blend of written questions and voicemail,
so I'll just alternate back and forth. So here is
your first voicemail.
Speaker 4: Hey, Cliff, Bobo, Matt. My name's Colin. I'm from Tulsa, Oklahoma.
Longtime fan. I grew up as a kid watching finding Bigfoot.
I never believed in bigfoot until I had my own
siding of one in Southeast Oklahoma in September of twenty
twenty four, and that caused me to change my whole
college direction from computer engineering to wildlife biology, which leads
me to my current question. Do you believe it is
safe in today's atmosphere for a wildlife biologist to be
open about believing in sasquatch and pursuing the proof of
its existence to the wider scientific community, or do you
believe this is something that for my career I should
keep under wraps.
Speaker 3: Thank you. That's a good one. I mean, because Meldrum
seem to think that it kind of still hurt people.
I talked him a couple of years ago. He still
thought it, like, yeah, you don't want to be like
super vocal about because it's not going to open doors
for you really so, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: He would always recommend if people wanted to pursue the
sasquatch thing professionally in academia, you go into a parallel
subject like you did, of course, wildlife biology, and then
just kind of keep that interest on the back burner,
so to speak. In today's climate, I don't think you
need to hide it as much as maybe in the
nineteen seventies eighties, But I think I don't think you
should make it a central focus at least until a
tenure somewhere.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 2: But if you're going to be an academic and teach
at a university, make sure you get tenure before you
go full throttle on that one. But I don't think
that it does any harm because at the end of
the day, you know, at the end of the day,
you're a wildlife biologist and you're out there doing the
grunt work, going out and collecting the data, hike into
this spot, put markers down, documenting this and that, doing
your notes, you know, all the stuff that wildlife biologists
actually do. Keep that your main focus, and then keep
the sasquatch.
Speaker 3: Thing as.
Speaker 2: Just keep it in mind while you're out there and
do the same thing apply the same techniques to whatever
you find of sasquatch sign. I think that's probably the
best way to go. And at the end of the day,
when people say, well, why do you believe all that,
you can say, well, I saw one. What am I
supposed to do with that?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 2: I actually saw one? How could I ignore this?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 2: Nico is kind of the same way. He's an amateur
paleontologist to some degree, and he works with museums and
all this other stuff, and he's been asked to speak
to like, you know, various museums and stuff about his
paleontology educational efforts, you know, and that sort of thing,
and the Bigfoot thing always comes up. The academics seem
to be fairly interested in this as a as a
general rule, fairly interested in it. The older ones less
so because they're they're old people. But it's all right.
They're retiring, they're dying, they're going away, you know, all
us old people are in the young bloods that came
in thanks to shows like Finding Bigfoot. A lot of
these young people, like yourself, Colin, have a interest in this.
So I think it's much less toxic now than it
was in the past and your defense just like Nico's defense,
Like when people say, well, how could you possibly believe
all this with all the you know, all this nonsense
out there, and Nico just says, well, I saw one,
and again, what am I supposed to do with that?
It's you can always go back to what doctor Meldrum
said when he was looking at the five points trackway.
It's like, well, it's kind of my responsibility to look
into stuff like this, but for professional reasons, you should
keep your other work at the forefront and do this,
do the bigfoot thing because you enjoy it, and you know,
on the side, and eventually, when these things are proven
to be a real species of animal, then you can
come out and say, well, you know, I've been doing
this work all along on the side. My main focus
has been Canadian geese or whatever you're into, you know,
but I've been doing this other work using these same
techniques and applying my education to this as well. And
then hopefully your work can be added to the knowledge base,
the data set, so to speak, of the sasquatch stuff
at a later date, you know, because you have an
advantage on a lot of these other biologists that you've
actually seen one, so there's no question. So I would
run with it like that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would tend to agree with that. I think
a lot of it depends on your temperament too. You know,
if you're a fairly disagree with person and you don't
necessarily need everyone to agree with you, I think you'll
do just fine because all that stuff will just bounce
right off your skin. You know, if people go, well,
I don't think those things exist, and I think what
you saw was just a bear, or oh I think
you were half asleep and dreaming or whatever the case
may be. So it really just depends on like how
much headaches you want to sign up for or if
it's not a headache at all, pursuing it. But I
do think cliffs Point is great in that, you know,
if you're well established, I think that will help tremendously
because being able to say, like, well, I established myself
and then I pursued this, whether or not it's the
chicken or the egg, you know, will help tremendously.
Speaker 3: And there's there's a ton of people, there's a ton
of PhDs and masks, guys with masters or women with
masters that they are totally into it and there's a
like informal groups. You know, there's a lot of PhDs
in the field, you know, communicate with each other and
they just kind of they don't they don't hide it
up like you know, like some secret organization you know,
with some kind of initiation. Right, it's just it's just
an informal group of people and with scientic credentials that
you know, it's all stay intention and when when the
you know, when something comes out of North Carolina State whatever, uh,
their study, then it's that's that's what's gonna pop to
the forefront. Yeah.
Speaker 2: So at the bottom line, Colin, just keep pursuing it,
do whatever you need to do to make a living,
you know, and but keep the Bigfoot thing on the side,
and definitely apply your skill set to the sasquatch question
to see what you learn, to see what you learn
because you have a particular skill set here going through
school for a wildlife biology that we desperately need in
the bigfoot world. You know, we need fewer psychics and
more biologists in the bigfoot world. Frankly, stay tuned for
more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo. Will be
right back after these messages.
Speaker 1: And here's your first written submission.
Speaker 2: Go ahead, bobo.
Speaker 3: Hey, she don't have my glass?
Speaker 2: Do you want me to do it?
Speaker 3: No? I got, I got. Let me just turn up
my brightness on my screen.
Speaker 2: Let me turn up my brightness in my brain.
Speaker 5: Me.
Speaker 3: Harvey Flannagan fascinated by the Eric Shifton expedition and the
snow print photos he captured in to the nineteen fifties.
But I've never heard much analysis to this topic. I'd
love to hear the team's thoughts on this as well
as how some of the tracks seem to be bunny
hop was side by side foot placements for an extended
length and if similar bunny hop prints have been found elsewhere, Well,
there's been bunny hop prints found or foxes whatever all
I mean, all over the world. Like, yeah, there's been
a lot of that's I've seen a lot of photos
of supposed Yetie tracks or Sasquat's track. There's a lot
of photos of that. There's that one bear over there,
it's Haleix like big toe. Actually as it goes through
like puberty, it actually rotates back up well down more
because when they're young, they're like a real of boreal
bear species. They're up in trees a lot, and their
foot mythology is actually more like kind of like an ape,
you know what, the like where our thumbs up high
on the eight thumbs down. That's kind of how their
paws set up their digits.
Speaker 2: Well, I'm looking at the photographs right now, and there
is some straddle to them. I'm want to point that out.
This whole idea that Sasquatch prints are always in a
tight rope walk is way overblown, way overblown, very very
exaggerated by the Bigfoot community and frankly used by the
bigfoot community to validate their own footprints and snow even
though most of the time these snowprints are actually actually
animals hopping through the woods. I've seen this done many
many times, like, oh, look that there's no straddle here,
blah blah blah. This is clearly a big footprint and
it's actually just something like a fox or a deer
jumping through the snow. But the shipt in photographs, even
though the prints are rather blown out, there is some
straddle to the left and right, as there always is
in Sasquatch prints. Even the PG stuff that's on from
the second reel, there's a little clip out there you
can see a little bit of straddle the Freeman stuff again.
Once there's always some level of straddle, just a little bit,
but there's always something. If it is exactly in a
straight line through snow, it's probably something else. So I
want to put that out there first, because that's a
huge misconception in the bigfoot world. I talked to Meldreum
at length about this. There's always some level of straddle,
And of course straddle is you know, if you draw
a line down the center of the trackway, how far
to the left or right the footprints the feet fall
and make the footprints. That's what straddle is, just to
define it or whatever. But if it is in a
direct straight line, I think bunny hop is a very
appropriate term for it, because it's most likely an animal
hopping through the snow. But in the shift in photographs
that's not the case. Most of the prints in the shipton,
by the way, photographs are blown out either through melting
or sublimation or something like that to that effect. But
that one really nice one is there that, you know,
the one of the weird toes and all that sort
of stuff.
Speaker 3: Who did the recreation of that like the that like
resin casting made of it like or like well, you know,
it's like a three D image of they made like
basically like a footprint cast without without the actual casting
in the snow, just from the photos who did that.
Speaker 2: The Shipton photographs, because there's another one of the mcneelee
Cronin footprints that Meldrum did. There is a replica of
the Shipton foot of what the foot shape could be
shown in Krantz's book, and it says here I'm looking
at it right now. It says a Nepalese craftsman made
this of what the foot should have looked like from
the Shipton photograph in nineteen fifty one, and the original
was given to the Brooklyn Children's Museum, where this copy
was made through the courtesy of Michael Kohne. I have
two duplicates of that in the Meldrum collection, because the
Meldrum collection, of course is you know, the Krantz stuff
ended up with Meldrum for the most part, not all
of it, but most of it, or a lot of
it did. So I have two copies of that particular print,
and there's also some other sculpts that I think Meldrm did.
Meldrum was an extraordinarily talent artists. Most people don't realize that.
But he could draw. He sketched all the time in
his notebooks, mostly anatomical things. He's really in the tradition
of the old naturalists from the nineteenth century. He would
draw things and footprints. He would draw his interpretation of feet,
he would draw jaws, he would draw bones, you know, footbones,
and he would draw all these things. And he actually
sculpted as well. He made two replicas of or he
made a replica of what the Yetti footprint or the
Yetty foot might have looked like based on the nineteen
seventy three I think McNeely cronin footprints, and I think
he did another one of the ship. I think it's him.
Speaker 3: It was I just remembered it was him because he
gave me one.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, yeah, it's the same color clay. I have
the original clay sculpts, of course, as well as the
molds made from them. I think it was him on
the Shipton photographs, but again I haven't found record of
that yet. But there's a lot of things in there
that I haven't found record of yet, and to look
for a specific thing in the Meldrum collection is just nuts.
It's like, yeah, I don't even notice. Like it's like
looking for a particular fish in the ocean, like a
certain fish that you a friend of your name Ralph
or something, Ralph the fish.
Speaker 3: It's like looking for a strut of DNA and an
unknown specimen.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's insane. It's insane. But every once in a while
I stumble across something and I go, oh, shoot, this
is amazing.
Speaker 6: I gotta go.
Speaker 2: I got to book put this in a place where
I can find it again. But did we answer the
question or do we just start? Did we get off
on topic? Either way, I'm okay with it, but I.
Speaker 1: Think you answered it. I would recommend I think it
was Daniel C. Taylor who wrote a fairly skeptical book
about the Eddy. But I think it was Daniel C.
Taylor who pointed out the features that Bobo mentioned that
they spend a certain amount of their development living arboreally,
and so they're the large toe can jut out to
the side and kind of give the impression of almost
an ape like foot. I don't know that that is
a solve for the shift in photographs. But that's definitely
a resource worth looking into. I mean, he sort of
arrives at the conclusion that they're all in this identified
bear signings and tracks, which obviously we don't agree with.
But to answer Lee's question about you know, how much
analysis has been done, that'd be a good place to look.
In addition to the Sasquatch and YETI oriented resources that
you mentioned.
Speaker 3: I think it is a YETI. I don't think it's
a bear, just because it didn't do like bear like things,
like the way it crossed that snow field, and then
we're dropped down. There's no way, like you need something
I could climb, like a bear wouldn't go down where
the traction engine went down that into that crevice, you
know that ravine down into there.
Speaker 2: And any analysis Meltrium has on the feet I have
not gotten to yet. His YETI files are extensive. He
was clearly getting ready to write some stuff for one
of his two or three books that he was working on.
But if there's a I know, there's an entire file
inside the Yetti file of footprints. You know, some of
the stuff I had never been seen before. But again
I've not gotten to that point. Now yet where I
can sit down and read for enjoyment in the mildrom collection.
I just haven't gotten to it YETI yeah, oh yeah, yeah,
better YETI yeah, better way to say it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Well that is a good segue into your next voicemail.
Speaker 7: Hello guys, this is Matthew in Eastern Oklahoma. Thank you
so much. I love you guys. You're the best. My
question relates to doctor Meldrum. I know has been some time,
and first condolences. I know you guys are dear friends
with him and family. You probably consider yourselves family, and
I know it's a great loss. Many of us knew
of him, listened to all of his content, but weren't
truly as close as you guys were. So condolences as
you have to go through all that. And my question
again is related to doctor Meldron. What's something now that
he's passed away that you've learned, whether it's some epiphany,
whether it's something more tangible having to go through his belongings,
just some what's something that you've learned about him, or
about Bigfoot or about the phenomenon after he's passed away.
I think that's a beautiful thing about people that leave
us legacies.
Speaker 6: We continue to.
Speaker 3: Learn from them well after they're gone.
Speaker 7: And again, condolences, appreciate you guys.
Speaker 3: Bye bye.
Speaker 2: Well, I think I just said that. The thing that
the first thing that pops to my mind is what
I just went said, is that doctor Meldrim was an
amazing artist. I had no idea but going through his
notebooks and you know, I've got one on the floor
actually right next to me here in some of his
earlier work when he's looking at I think jawbones of
various monkey species in South America, and he would just
draw these jawbones and they're just gorgeous, beautiful drawings. He
spent a lot of time with a pencil in his hand,
you know, basically in his scientific work, like I said,
kind of along the same tradition as the nineteenth century
naturalist did. He would sketch things out and whatever. And
it goes beyond that as well. I'm assuming, but it
just in case I'm incorrect. I'm assuming most people know
the story the nineteen ninety six footprints, which is the
thirtieth anniversary, by the way, this year of the nineteen
ninety six foot prints, the five point trackway, and how
one in that trackway. One of the prints was kind
of angled at about forty five degree angle. And it
was several months later when Jeff was spending time on
the beach. In his book, he said on a beach
in Oregon. But I found notes that indicator that suggests
at least it might have been on a beach of
a lake in Montana. So that's kind of up in
the air right now. But where he was examining his
own footprints and as well as those of his children
while they played, and he casts several of them, and
he was seeing he's examining the gates and whatever, and
that forty five degree angle he saw in the Sasquatch trackway,
he replicated by looking over his shoulder on the beach,
and you know, so you do experiments like that. But
I found drawings of those trackways that were made out of,
you know, pieces of paper taped together that when it
fully extended, are like twelve feet long, and with appropriate spacings.
The footprints aren't full size, but he would have all
the measurements. He had the length of the foot and
the step length, and then the stride length, and then
the angles of the toe angle out from the midpoint
of the straddle, and he would spend a lot of
time with pencil and paper, and I think that's just
super cool and fascinating, whereas most people nowadays, I imagine,
probably do it on computer. Jeff was old school, you know,
he came up before the fancy software and all that
sort of stuff, and he has certainly adapted to it.
He used that stuff, but a lot of his work
was with pencil and paper. When I got the collection
home and started going through it and slowly started organizing it,
which of course I'm still not done with. Of course,
one of the first things that came to mind as
far as using any of his work for the museum.
It wasn't initially, oh I'm gonna here's a footprint I'm
going to display or something like that. You know, the
most natural exhibit, that first thing the spring to my mind,
at least most naturally, is the art of doctor Meldrum,
which I think would be a really cool display and
it would give and most importantly, it would give a
different facet to doctor Meldrum to the general public than
what they were used to, because you know, we knew
doctor Meldrum on a different level than most civilians, do
you know. I knew he was a star Trek fan
and and science fiction nerd in general, and he loved
boy Scouts and like things like that, you know, like
little tidbits about him or everybody else just sees him
as the foot doctor, so to speak, you know, the
Bigfoot professor, you know, but I would love to give
the public a glimpse into this other level of doctor Meldrum.
And I think his art is a wonderful avenue for that.
So that's the thing that jumps to my mind first
at least. Yeah, And of course I guess the second
thing would be his true level of nerdiness with bigfoot stuff,
you know, like his book collection was exquisite. I didn't
get his books. I Laurie, his wife, got those, because
there more meaningful to her. So we talked about them
and I pointed out the most valuable ones and whatever
else and you know, stuff you know, autographed by Sanderson
and stuff like that. You know, like that level of
nerdiness I think is pretty cool. And he was definitely
you know, he was definitely one of us, like Yaba Kaba, Hey,
he was you know, he was definitely one of us
as far as like the the lifers in nerdiness in
bigfoot Land, you know, like like hard back covers of
you know, Roger Patterson's book, and you know, and he
has several other copies, but like he had that one too,
and that just shows yeah, oh yeah, yeah, yeah, he's
definitely a.
Speaker 3: Nerd, just like you knows.
Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't think so, not that I
know of, but I mean maybe you did. I don't.
I don't know when Sanderson died. I thought it was
in the seventies or something. Sanderson died in seventy three. Okay,
there you go, There you go anyway. So that's the
first thing that jumps to my mind, Matthew. So I
hope that helps a little bit. Stay tuned for more
Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo. Will be right
back after these messages.
Speaker 1: And you're keeping with the meldn theme. Here's the next
written question for you there, Cliff.
Speaker 2: Okay, this one's from a one Melchor or melcoor Melcore.
I hope it's Melcor because I'm a Tolkien fan, although
it's not spelled the same. I just finished watching the
newest episode of Expedition Files. I never heard of that
a featuring the Patterson Gimlin film and the late great
doctor Jeff Meldrum. Do any of you know if his
interview in the episode was his last or clipped from
another previous show, And have you all seen his stabilized
footage of the film. I've been listening to the podcast
since episode one came up. The great work and as always,
keep it squatchy the episode of Expedition Files. Is that
a TV show or what is that?
Speaker 3: Matt?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 3: I think, well, I know his last big interview was
with some guy that was like just got into big Foot,
like I was just doing it, like like listening to
the different mysteries. That guy got like a big interview
with Jeff right right before we passed.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there was a YouTube channel called Backcountry Manifesto, and
I don't know if it was just mystery oriented or
just all sorts of like outdoors, backcountry sort of things.
But yeah, I would imagine any of those YouTube or
podcast interviews closest to Jess passing would be the most recent,
because something like a television series, you know, there's a
long turnaround time from the time they film until the
time that's released. So let me see if I can
find that expedition files show.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: When I was actually out in Pocatello, I was staying
with my friend Brandon Tennant, who runs Sasquatchprints dot com,
who is also the exclusive way you can get Bigfoot
and Beyond t shirts. So if you go to sasquatchprints
dot com and go to you know, the Bigfoot and
Beyond stuff, you can get T shirts of our podcast
that everybody should wear because they're first of all, they
look great on you. They augment your eyes, they're slimming,
they make you look super great. They you know, they
take forty pounds off you. Anyway, making all that up,
I don't know if any that's true, but I'd like
to think it's true. Ayway, Yeah, go to Sasquatchprince dot
com and get T shirts, but be put to me
on anyway. I was staying at Brandon's house and he
was watching some YouTube thing and a recent I knew
it was recent because Jeff was very gray and its
video came up of doctor and what they I think
they claimed it to be doctor meltwm's last interview, and
it was in late July or early August, and he
died on September ninth, so it might have been his
last interview, and he was wearing this this peach colored shirt.
So to my knowledge, that's his last interview, but I
don't know, I don't know. There could have been another
one in there.
Speaker 1: It looks like Expedition Files is a Discovery Channel series
hosted by Josh Gates. So yeah, i'd imagine there's quite
a bit of turnaround time, you know, if that was
filmed months prior weeks or month, but usually months, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was. It was a YouTube It was a
YouTube guy that it was like a one man band,
like a one guy like he shoots and edits and
hosts the whole thing. He got like a lot of
timing with Jeff. I remember I saw I was like
Jeff last movie. I was like, damn it. We were
supposed to be getting interview with Jeff like any week.
Then that guy got it, not us, and he got
like the guy got like hours of Belgium interview.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's always generous at this time, that's for sure.
And he liked to talk about this stuff too. You know,
he's always up for a good conversation.
Speaker 1: I think if you that question, one and here's your
next voicemail.
Speaker 8: Hi guys, my name is David from the San Francisco
Bay area in California, and I'm addicted to your podcast,
I think because of the whole good cop bad cop thing. Anyway,
I was wondering if you had a favorite term of
venery for bigfoots or maybe you can invent a new one.
And that's it and no cliff besides the term troop.
Speaker 6: So what say you, two officers?
Speaker 3: I miss the one of the key word is that?
Speaker 6: What do you say about the he said the term
of vinery?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I'm getting that. The question is what is
the collective noun for a sasquatch? Just like a gaggle
of geese, a murder of crows, an ostentation of peacock's
So what is it for a sasquatch?
Speaker 3: I've heard this before. I've heard this question before. I
can't remember what people said.
Speaker 1: We get this question often. But you know, my question,
which we'll return to later, is like, which one of
you is the good cop and which one's the bad cop?
Speaker 3: Bad cop? I'm the cool guy. Let you take your
beers and go home.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel like if I told Boo like Hey man,
I'm just in a hurry'd be like, all right, be safe,
and you'd let me go.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I vote to call them a Patterson of Bigfoot, A.
Speaker 3: Patterson of Bigfoot. Yep.
Speaker 1: I think we should call it a Glenn because you know,
Glenn Thomas. That might be like the most famous like
family unit siding or an an ousman of squatches. Yes,
because you know Patterson only saw in film the one,
so you'd have to pull his sore core reference that
has multi, that has plural.
Speaker 2: Now, I think if we need, if we're going to
do it, we need to go to the beginning. It's
got to be a crew of Bigfoot.
Speaker 6: That is pretty good.
Speaker 2: It is good because crew Jerry Crewe that is you know,
it's already a name for plural anything.
Speaker 6: And Albert of Apes.
Speaker 3: I mean, I think Austin is the most appropriate. That
crew makes sense overall.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think crew is the MVP here.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think for Bigfoot, I think if you're using sasquatch,
then we need to probably do a tip of the
hat to the native side of things a little bit
and maybe consult a few folks and see what they
feel about it. But if you're saying bigfoot the American word.
Why not go back to the.
Speaker 3: Source and called the crew bigfoot And I think this
should be a mob with yaoys or something. I was
thinking mob, but as negative connotations.
Speaker 1: I've often joked about the very first time that because
I think we talked about on the Tribute to Bob
Saget episode that you know, Cliff was very much in
like teacher mode out there before I got to know
him personally, and myself and Walt film on if a
few of us were up on this hillside and heard
some response vocalization because people down a camp, we're generating calls,
and you know, Derek had Bob out on the trail
and we're like, we heard something, and Cliff was like,
do you have your recorder running over the radio And
we were like, no, actually we didn't. And he was like,
and you call yourself researchers, And that one kind of stung.
So I do think Cliff would have given me a
ticket for that, a citation for not having.
Speaker 6: My cru quarter running.
Speaker 1: So we'll leave it to David to tell us who
he thinks is good cop and bad cop.
Speaker 6: So what am I?
Speaker 1: I guess I'm just the like the deputy the ride along.
I'm the civilian ride along. I'm just here observing.
Speaker 3: You're the commissioner or the whatever the head do to
the police commission.
Speaker 6: I'm just dispatching.
Speaker 2: Well, I would like to throw a bobo of boogers
in there.
Speaker 3: I like that.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I like that quite a lot.
Speaker 2: Bobo of boogers.
Speaker 3: That's awesome.
Speaker 2: Oh, it works on so many levels now that i'm
thinking of it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So hopefully that gives you some options to work
with their David and so here is the next written
submission for the Bobes.
Speaker 3: John Jackson. Hi, guys, I love this show and I've
listened to every single episode, some multiple times. What would
be more disappointed to you? A A bigfoot is one
hunderent proven as a living species the day after you
pass away. B bigfoot is one hundersup proven as a massive,
elaborate host the day before you pass away. Thanks and
looking forward to your answers. Keep it squashy, I'm.
Speaker 1: Going hey all the way I'm going B. I would
be way more disappointed the day before I pass away
to learn that I'd wasted all that time. So I
would much rather they be proven real, even if it's
even if I don't get to see it then the inverse.
Speaker 3: So I said, hey, big foot is proven as a
living species the day after you pass. I'dnother have that than.
Speaker 6: Oh you would say, which would be more disappointing. So
that's why I understood.
Speaker 3: Yet, Oh, oh you're right, Yeah, yeah, B B for sure.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it'd have to be B of course. And either
way your dad's who cares you get to know already? Yeah,
So yeah, that's the one. It's one of many great
things about death is that, oh you get to know
some stuff, or I would assume. So we've talked about
that before in the podcast. That's what I'm hoping for.
At least we'll see. But you know, once you're done,
you're done, so it probably doesn't matter anymore.
Speaker 1: I think in a perfect metaphysical realm, it would be
like when you complete a video game and it gives
you all your stats and you get to see like
a sort of like a spreadsheet of like, you know,
the number of times you've been within ten yards, twenty yards,
fifty yards, you know, et cetera, the number of times
the sasquatch has seen you, and you could just see
all those numbers, maybe like pie charts and bar grafts,
et cetera.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you get to revel in your own failures. In
other words, and you get a grade. Yeah, you blew
it here, You blew it here. If you would have
turned around right there, you could have seen one.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 6: I'm hoping for like a D plus at least.
Speaker 2: Yeah, talk about disappointment.
Speaker 1: And this voice is a question that comes up often.
I think the last time we discussed it in depth
was on a members episode.
Speaker 6: So the main listenership has not heard this. So here's
a voicemail for you.
Speaker 5: Hey, Fellas Matt here from Santa Maria, California. I'm turning
sixty this year, so I'm planning a pilgrimage to the
Patterson Gamblin film site in June. In my initial research,
I keep hearing about a Finding Bigfoot episode about Bluff Creek.
I seem to think that this one was pulled because
of licensing issues. So my question here, is that episode
available anywhere or where do you think I might be
able to find it? Thank you?
Speaker 3: I don't know you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know if it's in rotation or not,
because and I believe we don't know anything because we're
not on that. You know, we're not behind the scenes
like that, but I believe it's not out there on
streaming because streaming didn't really exist when they worked out
the licensing agreement with the Patterson family. Well that's right, yeah,
because it wasn't really a thing because that was one
of the earlier episodes. That was season two, I believe,
and so I was twenty twelve, I think when they
were filming it or something, and at that point streaming
hadn't really taken over the world yet. So they made
up then. And the Patterson lawyers are very very savvy,
you know. They account for almost everything DVD's commercials that
like the full length broadcast, the web stuff or whatever
it is, which isn't streaming. It's different. Still, they account
for almost everything. I remember one of the producers kind
of complaining to me a little bit about how savvy
their lawyers were. Not that the producer had much. They
weren't in negotiations or anything like that, but apparently it
was frustrating, I guess for the Animal Planet lawyers to
work with them to some level, because they were so
good at what they were doing and more powers to
the Patterson's. Honestly, I'm on their side on this one,
but that's probably why because streaming didn't exist, and there
would have been a separate carve out in the actual
contract for streaming on you know, Discovery Plus or wherever
you get your streaming stuff. Probably why. But then again,
with maybe that means they every once in a while
they run it on cable or something. Your best bet
is find some one of our you know, diehard fans
that have them all on a DVR somewhere and ask
them for it, or that they can share it somehow.
I don't know how that works, but maybe that's the
best way to see it.
Speaker 3: And thank you for that.
Speaker 1: That question does come up a lot, so I'm glad
it made it to this side of the show.
Speaker 6: And so there's the next written question for you, Cliff.
Speaker 2: Okay, this one is from Alex Walton, bow Hey, Cliff, Bobo,
and Matt. What's y'all's favorite Sasquatch documentary and or movie?
Thank you?
Speaker 3: Hmm.
Speaker 2: I am prone towards Sasquatch Odyssey because it's a deep
dive in an all four of the quote unquote horsemen
and it's a very rare thing to see, like behind
the scenes in that sort of way with these these
guys with their guard down and whatever else. I think
I enjoy that one because of all the horsemen, I
met two out of the four, so I have owned
my own experiences with them. Of course, John Green and
Peter Burn. I would have loved to have met Krantz.
I mean, he's a lot of the reason I'm doing
this today, honestly, and de Hinden would have been interesting
as well. So that's probably my favorite. Yeah, I can't
think of another one that I enjoyed quite as much
as that one.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I have to go. I still I still go
with Boggie Creek, Legend of Boggie Creek, especially the four
K restored one. But for documentaries, yeah, i'd have to
say what Cliff's saying that that's that's pretty spectacular. But
there's a lot there's a there's been a lot of
good stuff that's come out the last couple of years.
There's a lot of there's a lot of stuff coming out,
Like there's there's some really good Like I just saw
documentary a couple it was probably a couple months ago
now that I'd never heard of, and I was like, like,
learn stuff from it. I was like like, well, this
is really good. I gotta figure out what that was.
But yeah, there's there's some good there's some good stuff
still coming out with It's not like we always talking
about this old stuff, but there's some good stuff too.
Speaker 1: Yeah, like Small Town Monsters does a lot of great stuff,
there is good new stuff. But in terms of favorites, man,
it's a toss up for me between the Mysterious Monsters,
Bigfoot Man or Beast, and Bigfoot Man Beast, those three
old school classics where you can see a lot of
the old witnesses, And I would throw in that BBC
documentary that's available online now, the very first one from
sixty eight with Patterson and John Apier and Ivan Sanderson.
Speaker 6: Man, it's just I just love that old stuff.
Speaker 1: That's I know we've talked about before, like the golden
era of Sasquatch media.
Speaker 3: I didn't know the name of that one, pure That's
why I didn't say that. I didn't mention that one.
That's yeah, that's that BBC one from sixty eight is awesome.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll put links to all those in the show notes.
And that BBC one is called Bigfoot America's Abominal Snowman,
and that's a great one. It was so cool when
that finally made it online, because I think it was
twenty twenty one. I remember I was in Colorado when
that came out on the internet, but I've been hearing
about it like forever, but I didn't I hardly knew
anyone who'd ever seen it. So now that it's online,
it's I've probably watched it like five times.
Speaker 2: I love your other choice, man or a beast, Now
screw that man beast.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's two.
Speaker 6: You know, there's man or beast and man beasts, so
you don't even have to pick and chee.
Speaker 2: It's a false choice. It's a false choice. Man or
beast doesn't matter, yes to both.
Speaker 6: Isn't one or both of those of Ron Olson film?
Speaker 2: I think it is, Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: One of them has like s he tifting with John
Green at the Ruby Creek site and that snippet of
Albert Ausman. I think that's the Ron Olson one because
I always wondered because the snippet of Albert Ousman is
like a minute long, maybe a minute and a half,
and I always thought, man, if all that footage exists
in some archive, that could be digitized if like there's
a full interview with each of those people along with
out takes, like that would be so cool to see,
you know.
Speaker 3: Would.
Speaker 2: I have yet to succeed in getting nailing down Ron
Olson for an interview, although he said he would when
I met him in person, but he is rather elusive
as far as his at the museum.
Speaker 3: Oh he came in the museum.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like I was, I was homeworking.
I was doing books or something, you know, like economic books,
not like writing books. But I was at home doing
something on the computer. And then I got a text, Hey,
somebody's in the museum named Ron Olson. I went like, what,
holy crap, And so I dropped everything and said, whatever
it takes, do not let him leave, you know. So
and I ran down as soon as I could get there.
And I came in and I saw the dude, and
you must be Ron Olsen. He goes, yeah, I'm clip
I owned this place. And he goes, oh, nice to
meet you, boo. I said, I can't believe and I'm
talking to you and I'm so excited, and you know,
I was fanboying a bit, and he goes, why, you know,
I can't believe anybody would want to talk to me,
And he said, are you kidding? Are you kidding? You
are so drenched in Bigfoot history and I'd love to
speak to you about and his sons were there, and
I said, let me let me buy you lunch, your
sons can come out, let me talk to you, and
he goes, oh, yeah, sure, here's my number. And but
I've had a very difficult time geting nailing him down
and speaking to him for any length of time. So
but I've been sucked trying like he's on this ever
growing list of insanely famous, historically important bigfooters that I'm
trying to reach out and nail down for an interview.
So stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff
and Bobo. Will be right back after these messages.
Speaker 1: So I'll save their last voicemail for lascense. Is kind
of a fun off topic question, So here's the final
written submission for you, bobs.
Speaker 3: Carissa h I'm always intrigued by stories of sasquatch in
the suburbs or cities. Have you ever personally found a footprint, handprint,
or other evidence in the populated area. But I'm totally
fascinated by those stories. Tickets you never know which ones
are for real or not. But yeah, I mean that
is interesting. And I've never found a footprint thing inside
a city, like a city city or anything like that.
Speaker 1: Now, I bet either some verbs that you've been in
and found some or at least maybe heard some stuff.
Speaker 3: I guess there's no I mean, I know there's people
that live like in suburbs that like back up to
like big tracks of forest lands and stuff that I've
heard stuff, but I'm so I mean, I was always,
you know, kind of skeptical about the audio reports and
now more than ever skeptical of those. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I just meant like if you had heard something in
any of those areas. I guess it depends on what
we consider to be a suburban area. But I mean, obviously,
like the suburbs, the suburban areas of Seattle, of Portland,
like a lot of those are butted right up against
squatch habitat and there's lots of things that happen out there.
So well, we didn't really hear anything in Oklahoma, but
we did follow up on that siding in that Oklahoma
episode of Finding Bigfoot that was within the city limits.
Speaker 6: Of Oklahoma City and what is to fire?
Speaker 3: What's the you know, I'm gonna look up technical definition
of rural versus.
Speaker 1: I just kind of consider that, like in the greater
metro area or like touching the greater metro area is
usually considered a suburb of that city, so it's not
just a standalone town or village or whatever, but it's
close enough to a city center that that's like, Oh,
you live in a suburb of Seattle, Dallas, Portland, you
know whatever.
Speaker 6: I mean.
Speaker 3: But it appears like you're talking like are you counting
like ten and twenty acre or a lot parcels like
on the edge of town, like suburbs or like what
let's see. I mean, there's are sparsely populated countryside locations
with low housing density. I just wondering how Denist has
to be off and featuring farms and the developed lands.
Suburban areas are moderately dense residential or mixed use communities
on the outskirts of cities, offering closer access to retail services. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I don't know. I've heard reports from right outside the suburbs.
But and one I know of one housing development that
was built and there were tree breaks happening there that
seemed very out of place, accompanied sometimes by vocalizations. So
most of the time the Sasquatches just haven't gotten used
to the fact that the people have taken over land
and they keep showing up sometimes like that one muddy
footprint across the cul de Sac that we invested in
North Carolina. Yeah, yeah, that's a big one. But again
that's pretty rural. So I think that the definition of
suburb versus rural.
Speaker 3: It's too I just looked that up as two hundred
and fifty people are fewer per square miles rural.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, well, I mean I've done some footprint investigations
right outside of Troutdale, which is definitely suburban. But where
I was wasn't suburban. I was on the Sandy River,
which you know, that's the border. Basically I passed that.
It's all rural one hundred percent, so not quite suburban.
But yeah, the suburban parts the hard part because not
only you know, we're not going to take a census
and figure that out or anything like that that like
population density, but they don't tend to wander down paved streets,
you know. Yeah, And when I think suburbia is where
I grew up in Long Beach, California. You know, Studebaker
and Wardload Like, to me, that's suburbia. So maybe maybe
I'm just hung up on that definition.
Speaker 1: But well, hopefully that answers Carisa's question. And so here
is your final voicemail.
Speaker 9: Hey it's Bigfoot. Choose Frank from Illinois here again. Yes,
I should have steered my last question about dungeons and
dragons more toward Cliff. Sorry about that. So I wanted
to make this question more general for all of you
and less nerdy because it's about the rock group Kiss.
I remember an episode of Finding Bigfoot where Bobo said
that he talked to a witness at a military base,
and the witness didn't fully appreciate when Bobo told him
that he was a colonel in the Kiss Army. Anyway,
let's say if Gene Simmons and Paul Stanley called and
offered all of you a chance to join the band
and be in full costume and makeup for just one gig,
but they did not want you to have the costume
or makeup of a sasquatch. My question is what other
character would each of you pick or would you turn
down the offer. Hopefully I redeem myself with this question.
Keep up the great work and keep it squatching.
Speaker 2: I would do the gig mostly to play music and
it's funny. If I had to dress up, yeah, I
don't know. If I had to dress up, I would
wear a costume of myself, but four inches taller, like
Change Simmons. Yeah, yes, the same thing, right. No, I
don't know. I don't know. As far as costumes, that'd
be a hard one. I'd let my wife do my
makeup because she's always asking me to to put her
crazy makeup and stuff on me. No, not like you know,
lipstick or anything, but you know that her gore makeup
and all that sort of jazz. You know that just
goes a squatch, they said. I think he specifically said
you couldn't. He said, we weren't allowed to be the squatch.
There's always caveats with these hypotheticals amongst our listeners.
Speaker 3: Not goes a squatch.
Speaker 2: Okay, our hypothetical listeners.
Speaker 3: What would be my character? Shoot, I never thought about that.
Speaker 2: What would your instrument be? Let alone character? It'd have
to be tuba, it would have to be but it
spits flames.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly now you got it through it. Now we're
talking a fire breathing or a fire exhaling tuba. That'd
be maybe dressed up like a total like nerd, like
a metal nerd.
Speaker 1: I would just have to since the makeup is a
prerequisite and it's got to be black and white. I'm
going to go with my fandom for the Lee family
and pay homage to Bobo's high school alumni, Brandon Lee
and the Crow.
Speaker 3: I'd go as a Let's see, I'd go as a.
I go as a or is there.
Speaker 6: Like a D in parentheses in front of it? Since
you're playing a tuba a dork?
Speaker 3: Uh? Now I got rid of the nerd part. It'll
be cool. It'll be a cool tube of playing.
Speaker 2: Or a dork.
Speaker 3: Poor Frank.
Speaker 6: I'm not a huge Kiss fan.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm not a huge Kiss fan either.
Speaker 3: Honestly, as of the Kiss Army when I was like ten,
I think I quit by the time I was twelve.
Speaker 2: Disarmed discharge. Oh there you go, great mind sync alike.
And then that's too.
Speaker 1: I think it was from a members episode that we
talked about this. But wasn't that your first concert?
Speaker 3: Yeah? It was as like an eleven year old or whatever.
It was quite the It made quite an impression. Yeah,
just like blown away. Like there was tons of people
dressed up like those like you know, dressed up like
kiss arm you guys were all dressed up and stuff.
It was.
Speaker 6: It was a trip that's wild.
Speaker 2: We did give the military discount to somebody who had
an extraordinary amount of kiss regalia on one time at
the museum.
Speaker 3: Was it mountainous?
Speaker 2: No, No, it wasn't. No, he's gone, he's like back,
he's somewhere in Indiana or something. Yeah, there you go
one of those I states.
Speaker 3: Yeah, the last place mark like that's that's like the
most bumber places to lived. It would be like an
Ice I guess Indiana. There's parts of Indiana that aren't
too bad.
Speaker 2: Oh, Indiana's super squatchy down south.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, South Indiana that'd be bearable.
Speaker 2: It is the squatchiest of the Ice States by far.
Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1: You think it's squashier than southern Illinois.
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, yeah, definitely heard more reports.
Speaker 6: I got to go up there.
Speaker 1: That's not too far from me, southern Indiana, so and
I have not been squashing there. So maybe that's a
twenty twenty six trip.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a lot of stuff comes out of there.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I've seen cast I know long term witnesses there.
There's a ton of stuff right close to the river. Yeah. Yeah,
it's really good. And I think we talked about that
on one of the podcasts here is that we kind
of at least Boboon I agree that it's probably the
least like the most underrated Bigfoot state is Indiana.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so that for a long, long while, I was
surprised to you when I kept getting those reports, like
when the show started, like I just heard so much
from Indiana. It's like I still get stuff from Indiana.
Speaker 2: Yes, mostly southern. There's some stuff in central as well.
But the morgam and Roe State Forest has a lot
of earth National for I think a state for US
I don't remember, but morgam and Row I remember that part.
But southern Indiana. It is where it's at. Man, the
closer to the river the better.
Speaker 3: It's really Yeah, right right on the rear.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that is.
Speaker 6: Fairly close to me. So I'm going to make a
trip up there this year.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's definitely worth a look around.
Speaker 3: So I guess that's it. Nothing else, Matt.
Speaker 1: That is the last of the submissions for the March
twenty sixth Q and A episode. But we do have
plenty from the pigeons, and we have stuff to catch
up on because I've been in the field, Cliffman in
the field investigating reports. Bobo has been active. So shall
we roll over to that side?
Speaker 3: Yeah, so roll over there, all right, folks. Thanks for
joining us here on Big Fitting Beyond hit like hit Share.
We appreciate you, guys, and thanks for tuning in until
next week, y'all. Keep it squatchy.
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Bigfoot NBA.
If you liked what you heard, please rate and review
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