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<v Speaker 1>I like Madonna as much as the next guy. Don't

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<v Speaker 1>get me wrong. This might be the Is this the

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<v Speaker 1>first Madonna track we've ever played in the history of

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<v Speaker 1>the show. I'm not sure we've had a single other

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<v Speaker 1>Madonna track.

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<v Speaker 2>That might be a good question. You might be right

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<v Speaker 2>on them.

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<v Speaker 1>I know why you're doing it because our guys hopping on.

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<v Speaker 1>Guy Holliday a long time college football coach, friend of

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<v Speaker 1>the show. But it's been a number of years. Guy,

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<v Speaker 1>how are you, sir? How you been been too long?

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<v Speaker 3>I'm doing great. It's been a long time. How are

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<v Speaker 3>you doing.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm well, let's just get a life update. Of course,

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<v Speaker 1>we know you from your time in our state, both

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<v Speaker 1>with Brigham Young and the University of Utah. Is a

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<v Speaker 1>high level coach. What what's coach Holiday.

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<v Speaker 2>Up to these days?

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<v Speaker 3>Well, I opened up a training facility in Phoenix twenty

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<v Speaker 3>six thousand square feet and we train athletes all the

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<v Speaker 3>way from eight years old up to several professional players.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh good for you.

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<v Speaker 1>So, I guess, as they say, when you actually become

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<v Speaker 1>a coach and you do it a high level, it's hard

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<v Speaker 1>to quit that life. Is that something you always want

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<v Speaker 1>to do? To continue to develop young people and teach

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<v Speaker 1>them about both football and life.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, you know, I did, I do, I still do.

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<v Speaker 3>I had an opportunity to get back into the college games,

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<v Speaker 3>several opportunities that just you know, and that and that game.

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<v Speaker 3>It's all about who you work with, and then it's

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<v Speaker 3>it's uh, it's maddening. Right now. I'm having a hard

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<v Speaker 3>time wrapping my head around exactly all that goes on

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<v Speaker 3>in college football world.

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<v Speaker 1>And there's a lot that's going on in the college

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<v Speaker 1>football world. Coach, and I do want to get your

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<v Speaker 1>take on as much of as we can over the

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<v Speaker 1>minutes that we have with you. And I want to

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<v Speaker 1>start with the news that a guy you know really

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<v Speaker 1>well in Kyle Whittingham, will be back on the sidelines

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<v Speaker 1>for the University of Utah for a year twenty one.

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<v Speaker 1>A lot of rumors about whether or not coach Wit

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<v Speaker 1>would set aside as you know guy, but he has

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<v Speaker 1>decided to come back.

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<v Speaker 2>What do you make of coach went back on the sideline.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, I still have Wit and I probably talked once

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<v Speaker 3>a month, so it wasn't it wasn't a surprise to me.

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<v Speaker 3>I think if you know coach and know his personality,

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<v Speaker 3>I think, you know, and I obviously he didn't tell

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<v Speaker 3>me this or I didn't hear this from anybody, but

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<v Speaker 3>watching that, I watched him here at the Arizona State,

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<v Speaker 3>got a chance to spend some time with him when

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<v Speaker 3>he was here. And man, when I watched the BYU game,

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<v Speaker 3>and you know, to turnout of the game, I never,

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<v Speaker 3>for once start Kyle Whittingham wouldn't retire. And then watching

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<v Speaker 3>even the Colorado game, the double reverse for the touchdown

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<v Speaker 3>and the closing minutes. So there's no way which wanted

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<v Speaker 3>to go out like this. You know, I just know

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<v Speaker 3>him the competitor, the fearst competitor he is, and I

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<v Speaker 3>just he's accomplished too much to let his last year

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<v Speaker 3>and legacy be affected by that, in my opinion.

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<v Speaker 1>And I'm with you there, and you know a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of people last offseason, Guy kind of surmised that if

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<v Speaker 1>Utah football had the year that we all thought that

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<v Speaker 1>they were going to have. I certainly did, and they

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<v Speaker 1>certainly did too, maybe that would be enough for Kyle

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<v Speaker 1>to hand the program over to Morgan. But of course

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<v Speaker 1>it didn't work out this year the way any of

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<v Speaker 1>us thought that Losing the streak is something we haven't

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<v Speaker 1>seen around here in a long long time. So I

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<v Speaker 1>would be remiss if I didn't take the opportunity to

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<v Speaker 1>have you on the show to ask you. You know,

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<v Speaker 1>of course there are the injuries number one to your quarterback,

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<v Speaker 1>which you can't have. But what do you make of

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<v Speaker 1>a season this year in the Big twelve for Utah

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<v Speaker 1>football that not many people, if anybody, guys saw coming?

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<v Speaker 3>Wow, things that happened. I think, you know, I've been

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<v Speaker 3>in locker rooms as a player and as a coach,

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<v Speaker 3>and I think one of one of the tough things

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<v Speaker 3>about managing the whole pay to play situation and whatever

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<v Speaker 3>you want to call it, revenue reimbursement, I could care less,

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<v Speaker 3>but I think one of the toughest things about that

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<v Speaker 3>is when players are getting paid and they aren't performing,

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<v Speaker 3>whether it's injury, whether it's they aren't holding up there

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<v Speaker 3>into the bargain and other players, you know, and even

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<v Speaker 3>in the NFL, you can sense this. When when you

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<v Speaker 3>aren't holding up your in it affects the locker room.

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<v Speaker 3>And so I do think Cam getting injured affected their

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<v Speaker 3>locker room. I think, you know, there's other players who

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<v Speaker 3>were connected to Cam who were dependent on Cam, because

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<v Speaker 3>today kids with so many people in their ear every

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<v Speaker 3>time something like that happens. Yes, it affects the team,

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<v Speaker 3>but now it's affecting them individually, you know, as far

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<v Speaker 3>as having the ability as everybody is saying to get

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<v Speaker 3>the bag or you know whatever, whatever those things are.

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<v Speaker 3>Now it's affecting. It's affecting the programs on deeper levels.

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<v Speaker 3>And then when you factor in you know, yeah, the

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<v Speaker 3>transfer portal is great. I mean, we can go back

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<v Speaker 3>and forth about is it positive, is it negatives, that's irrelevant.

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<v Speaker 3>It's how you manage it. And so at this point

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<v Speaker 3>you got to make sure it's not just a print.

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<v Speaker 3>It's about getting right people in because talent will cause

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<v Speaker 3>an overlook of a fact that include team chemistry, work ethic,

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<v Speaker 3>and things of that nature that affect team chemistry, and

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<v Speaker 3>just the over attitude of the player because now you're

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<v Speaker 3>looking at players strictly for that monetary value, and when

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<v Speaker 3>you're looking at monetary value, you're looking strictly at their output,

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<v Speaker 3>and so that affects your team chemistry. And I think

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<v Speaker 3>all of those things play play the role. And I

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<v Speaker 3>think Cam getting hurt, I think when you now in

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<v Speaker 3>the middle of it. I think the team, you know,

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<v Speaker 3>went down the same path like the fans. Oh no,

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<v Speaker 3>here we go again, and that that takes this toll.

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<v Speaker 3>And now that you have the media and easily able

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<v Speaker 3>to communicate with players, and players read social media consistently

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<v Speaker 3>for the most part, all of those things bleed out

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<v Speaker 3>into your program. And and you know, let's let's be honest.

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<v Speaker 3>Utah's mantra was one of the reasons why I embraced

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<v Speaker 3>it so much. We don't become you, you become us.

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<v Speaker 3>It was, in my opinion, built the same way that

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<v Speaker 3>the squad, well, my school, we sc it was built

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<v Speaker 3>that way on toughness. And you know, it's just hard

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<v Speaker 3>to maintain that and develop players. When the moment you

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<v Speaker 3>develop a player, you got to pay to keep them.

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<v Speaker 3>So all of those things are going to play a part.

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<v Speaker 3>And let's be honest. Now, you got to be able

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<v Speaker 3>to manage a roster that turns over thirty percent every year.

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<v Speaker 3>Every year, you got to be able to manage that

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<v Speaker 3>and it may turnover as much as forty to fifty percent.

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<v Speaker 3>And no other level of sports do you encounter that,

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<v Speaker 3>not even the NFL. Are you turning your roster thirty

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<v Speaker 3>to forty percent.

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<v Speaker 1>Every year, and it can't be sustained. Guy, it can't.

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<v Speaker 1>And it's not the coach's fault. It's not the player's fault,

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<v Speaker 1>it's not the administrator's fault. The blame is squarely on

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<v Speaker 1>the NCAA who was thrown out of the Supreme Court

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<v Speaker 1>four years ago and was told that they are a

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<v Speaker 1>serial anti trust violator and they had to figure out

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<v Speaker 1>a new model, and they just never did. But this

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<v Speaker 1>is what we're left with, Guy, This model now, where

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<v Speaker 1>the transfer portal is open during the season, it can't last.

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<v Speaker 1>This is an unsustainable model where, to your point, you

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<v Speaker 1>have to rebuild every year. In pro sports, the tough

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<v Speaker 1>reality of a rebuild will manifest itself. But if you're

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<v Speaker 1>doing your business right, that's once every decade or something.

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<v Speaker 1>In college sports, in college football, it's being rebuilt every

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<v Speaker 1>single year. Do you foresee any other route other than

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<v Speaker 1>simply leaning into the pro model where players sign contract,

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<v Speaker 1>they unionize, they collectively bargain, and therefore they sign multi

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<v Speaker 1>year deals so they stay on campus and they get

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<v Speaker 1>paid as if their employees. I know that school administrators

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<v Speaker 1>don't want that, but it feels like coaches and players

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<v Speaker 1>would kind of welcome it because it leads to it

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<v Speaker 1>provides some guidance and some guardrails.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't see another way. I just don't know how

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<v Speaker 3>you do it. I just I think something has to

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<v Speaker 3>be done, and I think you're right on point. But

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<v Speaker 3>then you have to collectively bargain. Then you have to

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<v Speaker 3>declare them what they are. At this point, they are professionals.

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<v Speaker 3>You can't tell me any different. When you receive money

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<v Speaker 3>to play, you're a professional athlete. I think we all

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<v Speaker 3>will agree with that, and so, yeah, I do I

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<v Speaker 3>see another way. I don't. You can't go on like this.

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<v Speaker 3>You can't just randomly have there's no salary cap. So

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<v Speaker 3>let's be honest right now. If you're an SEC, you're

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<v Speaker 3>at a huge advantage with revenue sharing because your television

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<v Speaker 3>contract is bigger than everybody else's, so your revenue stream

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<v Speaker 3>is higher. And so those are the things that I

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<v Speaker 3>don't think the looked at. I know everybody begged for

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<v Speaker 3>the college football playoffs, and I think that's great, But

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<v Speaker 3>now you guys, we're looking at a team playing January twentieth,

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<v Speaker 3>and now we're going to turn around and ask those

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<v Speaker 3>kids to be ready for springball come March and have

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<v Speaker 3>more contact. Well, I played the game, so I know

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<v Speaker 3>your body only has with so many hits in it,

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<v Speaker 3>and I had thirteen surgeries, and so I know what

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<v Speaker 3>your body eventually breaks down. No, I don't think what

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<v Speaker 3>we're doing is sustainable, but you have to manage it

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<v Speaker 3>as is. You can't sit around and cry about it.

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<v Speaker 3>You got to understand that, Okay, I'm losing forty percent

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<v Speaker 3>of my team. I've got to be well versed in

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<v Speaker 3>the portal and who's coming out so that I know

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<v Speaker 3>who's going to replace XYZ with equal or better than talent.

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<v Speaker 3>That's the critical part. And and he has to have

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<v Speaker 3>character and be able to mess into a team. And

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<v Speaker 3>then I have to sit back and look at and say,

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<v Speaker 3>next year, I may be looking for this player all

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<v Speaker 3>over again.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah not Yeah, it's simply just yeah, guy, it's not sustainable.

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<v Speaker 1>It can't last like this and the NCUBA. It's amazing, really, guy,

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<v Speaker 1>it's the power of college football that the sports and

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<v Speaker 1>the product continues to receive the love and attention that

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<v Speaker 1>it does when the business has been so poorly run.

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<v Speaker 2>Because part of leadership is seeing around corners.

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<v Speaker 1>What the NCAA has shown is that they cannot do that,

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<v Speaker 1>so therefore they react when they realize something is broken,

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<v Speaker 1>And this time around, what they're realizing is broken is

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<v Speaker 1>leaving the transfer portal open during the actual season. Can

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<v Speaker 1>you imagine guy being a coach for one of the

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<v Speaker 1>twelve teams left playing for the National Championship, trying to

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<v Speaker 1>practice to prepare for the CFP, and dealing with players

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<v Speaker 1>while you're still in the middle of trying to win

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<v Speaker 1>a national championship, dealing with players telling you they're leaving

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<v Speaker 1>when there are games left to be played. This basic

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<v Speaker 1>fundamental thing has to change as soon as possible.

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<v Speaker 3>Yes, no question. Can you imagine being Penn State right

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<v Speaker 3>now and your number two quarterback is gone. He's gone.

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<v Speaker 3>He's got to do what's best for him. I get that,

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<v Speaker 3>And people say, oh, you got to do what's best

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<v Speaker 3>for the team. Oh no, hell, that's being gone. Like

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<v Speaker 3>we're out of our minds. We need to stop living

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<v Speaker 3>in this fantasy land of nineteen eighty four eighty three.

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<v Speaker 3>When I was in college and you were like, I'm

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<v Speaker 3>gonna do what's best for the team, I wouldn't win

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<v Speaker 3>the National championship. All that's out the window. Right now,

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<v Speaker 3>and the whole focus is I'm going to take care

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<v Speaker 3>of me and my family, and the only chance that

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<v Speaker 3>I have is to be on the field so I

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<v Speaker 3>can get more money. And no I can imagine in

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<v Speaker 3>January practicing and then coming off of that field preparing

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<v Speaker 3>for a college football playoff game, knowing what's the state,

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<v Speaker 3>and have to go right in and look at portal

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<v Speaker 3>films because that's what they got to do. So and

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<v Speaker 3>then they have to be because you cannot be unprepared

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<v Speaker 3>and not be able to fill that position. And let's

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<v Speaker 3>be honest, you can't bring a kid in in August

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<v Speaker 3>and think he's going to be up to speed on

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<v Speaker 3>your particularly offense. Like I don't think people realize how

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<v Speaker 3>difficult that is. When when Witch said we need to

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<v Speaker 3>pay a a plug and play offense, I don't think

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<v Speaker 3>people understand what that means. It means Andy Luvewood's offense

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<v Speaker 3>was the West Coast offense. I grew up in it.

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<v Speaker 3>Love it. It is so technical, It is so detailed

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<v Speaker 3>that any mistake can throw off the details. And you

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<v Speaker 3>know in the past game you any mistake in that

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<v Speaker 3>can really just screw up the whole play. Well, now

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<v Speaker 3>you have to be more simplistic because your turnover pieces

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<v Speaker 3>are high. Just saying, if you don't get that kid

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<v Speaker 3>in there by the spring, you better get Sometimes your

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<v Speaker 3>best players are going to be showing up July first,

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<v Speaker 3>and that sucker better be up to speed to play

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<v Speaker 3>or you're out looking for a job. That's the reality

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<v Speaker 3>of it. That's the cold reality of it. So if

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<v Speaker 3>your system takes time to learn, and if you look

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<v Speaker 3>in the NFL and people pro teams that run the

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<v Speaker 3>West Coast system, it takes you time. You look at

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<v Speaker 3>worthy with the Kansas City Chiefs, the receiver, it's going

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<v Speaker 3>to take him a minute to where that speed actually

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<v Speaker 3>matters because he's got to study that offense is not

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<v Speaker 3>like so sid implistic. You can walk in and look

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<v Speaker 3>at the book one time a week. No, you got

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<v Speaker 3>to study that book every day, every single day. And

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<v Speaker 3>if you can't get an NFL player to do it

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<v Speaker 3>and up the speed when they have nothing else to do,

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<v Speaker 3>there's no way you can get a college kid to

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<v Speaker 3>do it.

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<v Speaker 1>Let me move over and we are catching up with

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<v Speaker 1>Guy Holliday, longtime college football coach, played in the NFL,

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<v Speaker 1>played college football back in the day, spent time with

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<v Speaker 1>both Utah and BYU on their staff, and you referenced

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<v Speaker 1>Andy Ludwig, who hopefully and should always be remembered for

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<v Speaker 1>what a phenomenal job he did while he was here.

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<v Speaker 1>And I don't know, guy, it feels like the offensive

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<v Speaker 1>coordinator is always the dude who falls on the sort.

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<v Speaker 1>Just feels like he's the guy that takes the brunt

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<v Speaker 1>of the stuff. But Andy, of course exits the program.

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<v Speaker 1>Jason Beck has now been hired as the offensive coordinator.

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<v Speaker 1>I'd be curious to get your take on Utah's new wellc.

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<v Speaker 3>I love him, I worked with him. I watched him

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<v Speaker 3>take Tannermingham at BYU, who and Kristin Stewart both times

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<v Speaker 3>Taysom Hill got hurt. I think at that time we

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<v Speaker 3>were five and zero when Taysom went down the first

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<v Speaker 3>year and he brought Kristin Stewart on walk on, completely

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<v Speaker 3>changed offense. And that was the year we played University

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<v Speaker 3>of Utah in the bowl game, and I think everybody

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<v Speaker 3>remembers that was a shootout. Yeah, it took an amazing

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<v Speaker 3>comeback to make it a close game. But after when

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<v Speaker 3>Jason Beck left by U, Tanne Mangam was never the

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<v Speaker 3>same player. And that speaks volumes about him. He took

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<v Speaker 3>Christen Stewart a walk on that first year and made

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<v Speaker 3>him a player. A walk on made him a player.

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<v Speaker 3>What I know about Jason is he's super he's super smart,

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<v Speaker 3>super intellectual, and his ability to communicate with a quarterback

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<v Speaker 3>is exceptional. It's exceptional in my opinion. He went to Virginia,

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<v Speaker 3>they took a transfer quarterback, he became a player, went

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<v Speaker 3>to Syracuse, made a quarterback a player. What's the first

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<v Speaker 3>thing he does at University of Mexico makes that kid

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<v Speaker 3>a player? Okay, that speaks volumes about him. We can

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<v Speaker 3>go on play calling ability and all that. Let me

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<v Speaker 3>tell you something. Play calling is great when everything is equal,

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<v Speaker 3>but in college football it comes down to players. The

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<v Speaker 3>best players will win games. The best players will win games.

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<v Speaker 3>And I think they've done a really good job hitting

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<v Speaker 3>the road recruiting, and they hired one hell of recruiter

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<v Speaker 3>in marky Atawaia. I'm telling you that guy can recruit.

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<v Speaker 3>I was with him. I love him. He's like a

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<v Speaker 3>brother to me, and I think he'll do a hell

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<v Speaker 3>of a job. And if a kid gets out of

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<v Speaker 3>Hawaii and nothing, come to Utah and Low has done

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<v Speaker 3>a fabulous job. But as much as I love Lewis Poll,

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<v Speaker 3>he is no marquee at the WII and Hawaii, I

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<v Speaker 3>can tell you that. And that guy's a living legend there.

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<v Speaker 2>Very interesting stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and you know obviously that pipeline is something that

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<v Speaker 1>both Utah and by you and other schools too have

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<v Speaker 1>capitalized on talent. Let me ask you about Jason's quarterback

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<v Speaker 1>who is transferring to Utah coach, and that of course

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<v Speaker 1>is Devin Dampier. And Isaac Wilson announces that he will

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<v Speaker 1>be back on campus too. I don't know what the

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<v Speaker 1>status is of Isaac's health, you have the knee injury,

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<v Speaker 1>but I would imagine the idea is to have those

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<v Speaker 1>two battle it out and maybe some other additions to

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<v Speaker 1>that room as well. But what do you know about

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<v Speaker 1>Devin Dampier and what do you make about the potential

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<v Speaker 1>of what the Utah quarterback position could look like this

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<v Speaker 1>upcoming season.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, he's from here in Arizona and Phoenix, so I

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<v Speaker 3>know a little bit more about him. Let me tell

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<v Speaker 3>you about before we go down, Kyle Whittingham will always

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<v Speaker 3>believe and he made me a firm believer in you

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<v Speaker 3>need a mobile a quarterback that can hurt you with

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<v Speaker 3>his legs. We know Dan Pierre can do that, and

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<v Speaker 3>that's critical. And if you think about it, Tyler Huntley

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<v Speaker 3>hurts you with his legs. Cam Rising when healthy, he

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<v Speaker 3>hurts you with his legs. If you google and look

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<v Speaker 3>at the majority of deep balls completed and deep passes,

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<v Speaker 3>it is mainly done by extending the play because that's

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<v Speaker 3>when coverage breaks down. Okay, So I think that's critical.

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<v Speaker 3>I think Isaac Wilson will prosper under Jason Beck because

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<v Speaker 3>Jason will reach him. Make it simple, and you're going

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<v Speaker 3>to have an offense that does what the kid can do.

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<v Speaker 3>He is a spread offense guy. Sometimes we all get

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<v Speaker 3>caught up and what the you know what this recruits

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<v Speaker 3>rated and so on and so forth. That's irrelevant. If

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<v Speaker 3>he doesn't fit your scheme, you know, that's all irrelevant.

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<v Speaker 3>So I think he fits the scheme and I would

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<v Speaker 3>would not be surprised to see them excel on offense.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, that's some real exciting stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>Last thing, guys, since I set you loose, because I

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<v Speaker 1>have not spoken to you since the announcement was made

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<v Speaker 1>that Morgan Scally once again has been installed as the

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<v Speaker 1>coach in waiting. He had that moniker once upon a

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<v Speaker 1>time and it was taken from him and he was

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<v Speaker 1>asked to do some things and I can't speak to

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<v Speaker 1>that process.

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<v Speaker 2>I was not a part of it.

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<v Speaker 1>Apparently he did what he needed to do and receive

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<v Speaker 1>that promise back. So whenever Guy Kyle has done it

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<v Speaker 1>will be Morgan. Just wanted to get your take on

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<v Speaker 1>that before we set you loose on this Wednesday.

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<v Speaker 3>Morgan's very intellectual, very good defensive mind. We all know

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<v Speaker 3>I think the key and Morgan Morgan is one of

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<v Speaker 3>the smartest people I know. You know the key is

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<v Speaker 3>going to be and he's learning from a great head coach.

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<v Speaker 3>How does he handle all the responsibilities of being the

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<v Speaker 3>head coach because it's not simple anymore, you know. And

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<v Speaker 3>a defensive coordinator and a very good one for so long,

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<v Speaker 3>and now you're adding in you got to handle so

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<v Speaker 3>much more as a head coach, especially with the portal,

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<v Speaker 3>and you got to re recruit your players every year.

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<v Speaker 3>He's going to have to make adjustments to that. Because

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<v Speaker 3>Morgan is a he's a grinder. Now he's a great

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<v Speaker 3>human being and understands people, and so it'll just be held.

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<v Speaker 3>He's got to hold the standard. As Witch says, the

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<v Speaker 3>standard is the standard, and Morgan won't have a problem

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<v Speaker 3>in doing that. And he's just got to figure out

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<v Speaker 3>how to manage the responsibility of college head coach, which

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<v Speaker 3>is so much different than NFL head coach NFL head coach.

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<v Speaker 3>How many of them as staying on the sideline with

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<v Speaker 3>the place she call him plays man, that's hard to

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<v Speaker 3>do in college football. You don't see very many of

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<v Speaker 3>them doing it because they have so many other responsibilities.

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<v Speaker 1>Well, guy, I appreciate the time we miss you up here.

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<v Speaker 1>You're always one of my favorite interviews. If you ever

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<v Speaker 1>want to hop on the show for any reason, please

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<v Speaker 1>reach out and we'll probably bug you again in not

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<v Speaker 1>too long. Okay, Happy holidays, serve you well, Okay.

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<v Speaker 3>I appreciate you all. You all have a happy Holidays,

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<v Speaker 3>Merry Christmas, Happy New Years. I always love Utah, man,

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<v Speaker 3>it's a great place, all right.

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<v Speaker 1>The great guy Holiday spent a number of years with

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<v Speaker 1>both Brigham Young and the University of Utah coaching wide receivers.

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<v Speaker 1>He has now settled down in Arizona, where he continues

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<v Speaker 1>to work with and develop young high school players to

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<v Speaker 1>try to help them go on to college college football.

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<v Speaker 1>Do appreciate guys time, truly. He was kind of like Sharif.

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<v Speaker 1>Anytime he spoke, he wanted to listen to what he

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<v Speaker 1>had to say. He is on Twitter on social media.

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<v Speaker 1>You can get him at Eagle eight eight me Oh Chiladay,

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<v Speaker 1>My god,