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Speaker 1: I think that's kind of goes against like it's not attractive,

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it's not going to help bring people into your ideology.

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Speaker 2: That's about optics. I didn't ask you about optics. I

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said specifically, do you do you reject all collective groupings

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or identities?

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Speaker 1: I think within every group there is definitely not cohesiveness.

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So from top to bottom people do not cohesively.

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Speaker 3: Agree on everythingation.

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Speaker 2: So all collective identity site for example, being a man,

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is that a collective identity that you that you have.

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Speaker 1: No, because that's just like a foundational reality, Like you

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don't have.

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Speaker 2: To say so a collective identity can't be a collective identity,

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can't include a foundational reality like biologically a male.

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Speaker 3: No, it doesn't like you're a male. It doesn't matter

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where you.

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Speaker 2: Are, So that's not part of your identity being a male.

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Speaker 1: Well, you're you're looking at as a postmodernist ideology of identifying.

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Speaker 2: So nothing to do with has nothing to do with postmodernism.

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I'm asking you from an ancient and medieval perspective in

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terms of metaphysics, is that a collective ontological reality?

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Speaker 3: It's a reality because that's the.

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Speaker 2: Way you are, and it doesn't it's not your identity.

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You're not You're not either a male or female.

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Speaker 1: Referring to identity, it's referring to say, this is my identity.

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Speaker 2: You don't think that part of your identity is being

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a male. I am a man, and it's not part

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of your identity.

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Speaker 4: I think.

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Speaker 2: Do you think that postmodernists invented the concept of identity?

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Speaker 5: No?

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Speaker 3: So when people refer to identity in maternity.

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Speaker 2: About ancient philosophy, so I don't. I don't know what

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you're talking about. You're saying that biological being a male

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biologically has nothing to do with your identity. That's how

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stupid libertarianism is.

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Speaker 3: No, first of all, not a libertarian.

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Speaker 2: Okay, whatever atomized individual you said that you believe in

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totally individual rights versus any collective right.

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Speaker 1: I I don't think being collectivist is going to end

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up in a good way, and it can end up.

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Speaker 2: I asked you a metaphysical idea about being part of

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a group, an ontological reality, masculine male identity. You don't

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think that that's a real thing.

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Speaker 1: I already said that it's a real thing. I already

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can see the point that being a man.

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Speaker 2: You said, it's not your identity. And now you're saying

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it is, which one is it?

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Speaker 1: No?

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Speaker 2: Which one is it?

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Speaker 1: We're talking we're talking past each other because I thought

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you were coming from a postmodernist perspective, and that's my fault.

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You're coming from an anthem you're coming from an anthological perspective.

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Speaker 2: No, I'm not coming from a classical philosophy perspective that

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being a male is part of what marks you out

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like Aristotle.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that that's anthological.

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Speaker 2: No, it's a metaphysical question about whether or not there

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are collective identities that are real, Like being a male.

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Speaker 1: Metaphysical is going to like supernatural, that's that's going beyond

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just reality.

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Speaker 3: It does you're talking about. You're talking about on the

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philosophical level. A man is a man. It doesn't matter.

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Speaker 2: You have no idea what you're talking about. You have

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no idea what you're talking about. We're moving on, So

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all right, goodbye, exactly whatever, eveng G whatever it is.

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This is what you get with these sort of like

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atomized individual agnostic libertarian types. They have no idea what

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they're talking about, and you start talking about like they

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don't realize the implications of saying that they don't accept

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any collective groupings or identities. Oh like male, like being

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a biological male. That's a metaphysical reality that is part

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of your identity obviously.

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Speaker 6: Well I don't believe in identity politics. Yeah, okay, good job,

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then you're not a male even ge Bill of unmute.

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Speaker 5: Oh hey, Jay, I'm altos as well. So it's not debate.

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Speaker 7: But I just wanted to ask you like a question,

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you know, like who's the thing going on.

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Speaker 5: With the Greek and the most copage shock. Can you

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like explain like what's actually.

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Speaker 8: Happening from your perspective and what should people do on

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like opposing sides of like the spectrum.

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Speaker 2: Already done multiple podcasts on this five six years ago.

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You can go back and watch those podcasts. Do you

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want to come back and have the discussion or did

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you want to just act like there's no such thing

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as collective identities? Get on mute you have to unmute Patrick, Yeah, no.

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Speaker 3: Like I said, just look at it up real quick.

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Speaker 1: Now, the physical is the full phil study of fundamental reality.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so it doesn't it's not necessarily supernat so it's

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not necessarily supernatural.

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Speaker 1: Male or female is fundamental reality period.

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Speaker 9: There's no fun.

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Speaker 2: You have no idea what you're talking about. No, it's

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not you don't have no idea what you're talking about.

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Speaker 1: Once you start getting to the philosophy of male and female,

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you lost the court.

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Speaker 2: I've lost the court. You don't think I can ask

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the question about the ontological status of what male is,

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what a female? I'm asking the metaphysical ontological status of

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what a male is. That's a metaphysical question.

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Speaker 3: You're saying the identity of a male or a female.

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You're not talking about what they are.

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Speaker 2: You're talking about how I'm saying that. Obviously part of

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your identity that picks you out and makes you up

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is what species are you? And are you male or female?

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It's that simple.

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Speaker 3: That's not a philosophical question.

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Speaker 2: Yes it is.

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Speaker 4: It is scientific. It's not philosophical.

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Speaker 2: You don't know what you're talking about. You don't even

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understand that the science assumes philosophy. You're giggling. You have

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no idea what you're talking about. Let me show my

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fifty IQ. Sam literally just looked it up on Google,

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and he's gonna argue with me. I haven't had a

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philosophy one on one class. I looked it up on Google.

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I'm ready to debate you on philosophy. Sam, I'm mute, Sam,

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I'm mute. Okay, don't ASDGF, so it's open for him.

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I'm tired of the same people always calling in, so

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please let's get some new callers. Does no one else disagree?

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They don't have any legitimate arguments, and don't try to

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argue with me. If you've never had a philosophy class,

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you're just gonna embarrass yourself with this arrogance. Call in

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right there, the ben guy in the chat, if he

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doesn't come to debate, then boot this guy. Hello, what's up?

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Speaker 4: Hey?

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Speaker 10: I just first off, I just want to say thank

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you for these live streams that you do.

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Speaker 4: Helps a lot just trying to learn.

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Speaker 10: And my main question was if I was looking into Orthodoxy,

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how do I know which church? Because I just look

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on my Google maps and I see a whole bunch

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of different Like let me, for example, politic.

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Speaker 2: You want to look for a canonical Orthodox church, so

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that would mean like churches that are part of mainline

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jurisdictions like ro Corps, Serbs, Romanians, Antiochians. I would look

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at those first. Jonathan nothing happened to the X space

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is literally right there. What do you mean we're on

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the X space right now? Call in if you disagree.

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What's up?

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Speaker 3: It was Jay?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, yes, flying pyramids.

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Speaker 4: It's got a quick question regarding some pool.

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Speaker 11: I haven't researched it much, but why did he make

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an animal sacrifice?

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Speaker 2: Are you talking about when he went to the temple

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with Timothy? What are you talking about?

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Speaker 4: Yeah? I think that's what happened.

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Speaker 2: That's a transition period when Paul in that specific case,

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saw that the results of not following the temple specifications

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would have been worse than had he done it. And

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the end of the Old Testament Temple administration is not

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absolutely official until seventy eight. So if you read the

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Book of Hebrews, when it talks about the Old administration

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being like a scroll being rolled up and being done away,

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that's referring to what happens in seventy eight when Titus

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Vespasian came in and destroyed the temple. That's what Jesus

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predicted in Luke twenty one, in Matthew twenty four, and

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the all of it course, and so seventy eighty is

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very crucial. This is part of partial preterism, but that's

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the official end of the Old Testament. Everything happening in

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the Book of Acts until seventy eighty is what we

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call the transition period. So there's going to be some

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flexibility and some anomalies that occur during that period, like

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circumcising of Timothy and so forth, until the definitive removal

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of the Temple, which is the sign that the temple

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administration is completely done, and Jesus predicted that very clearly

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in Luke twenty one.

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Speaker 11: Okay, cool, and then I've got one more question. I

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was raised in sort of Pentecostal and Baptist churches, but

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I'm inquiring into Orthodoxy the moment just because of the

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sort of apostolic status. For me, there's nothing that really

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ties Protestantism to the Early Church.

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Speaker 4: So that's what I'm searching at a moment. What reading

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do you recommend I do? There any books I can

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start with.

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Speaker 2: I would start with something like John Mayandorf's book Orthodox Church.

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Speaker 5: Uh.

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Speaker 2: Then I would move on to something like you know,

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on the Incarnation by sant Anthonas just to give you

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an introduction to the Church fathers, and then I would

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read something like my indorse Byzantine theology and then move

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on to something like Lasky's mystical theology Eastern Church. Nick,

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what's up, Nick? It's been a wild day. This has

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been a an atypical day. We got a boom or neocon,

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we got a agnostic libertarian, we got a Mormon. I mean,

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this has been a wild day. This was exactly what

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needed to happen today. What's up? I mute?

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Speaker 5: Nick.

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Speaker 12: Yeah, I guess I'm gonna try and have a debate

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in favor of atheism. So, first of all, what do

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you agree with like the parsimon principles.

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Speaker 4: That's unless your worldview.

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Speaker 2: Go down, I agree with you. I didn't hear principle,

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but what Parsimoni principle go ahead?

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 12: So, basically, the way I understand it is if unless

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your set of beliefs explains the world around you, and

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you know the variability around responses and the world around

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you better than another model, then it is you know,

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logical to it is rational to just reduce to the

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simple model that explains explains the world. So so basically

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it's like, okay, what comes razor? Like what like as

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an atheist is like a religious person. What what exactly

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does your world view does your set of beliefs explain

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that I, as a as an atheist, wouldn't be able

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to well.

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Speaker 2: The the theists worldview explains how knowledge is possible at all,

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and the atheists worldview makes knowledge impossible at all.

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Speaker 4: Could you elaborate on that?

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Speaker 2: Yes, the theistic worldview provides the possibility of grounding knowledge. Universals,

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mathematical entities, logical categories, et cetera, the preconditions of knowledge.

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All of those are grounded in a theistic worldview, where

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there's the metaphysics that those things are possible and knowledge

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is therefore possible, Whereas an atheistic worldview, due to the

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infinitude of the human mind, the inexplicability of the human mind,

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the irrationality of the external world, et cetera, make the

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possibility of justifying grounding knowledge impossible.

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Speaker 12: So you're saying that's basically a theistic person he can

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grow on his kind of knowledge, whereas an aphist cannons.

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But don't you see the case that maybe an aphist

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is just like just you know, has the humility to

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kind of accept him being not.

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Speaker 2: Able to claiming that you have the ability as not

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has nothing to do with justifying your knowledge claims.

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Speaker 12: M hm, well all right, no justifications like them.

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Speaker 4: The way I see is if we have.

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Speaker 12: Like any given state and it is justified if it

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is true, and it's just like a question.

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Speaker 4: Again, knowledge can only exist if.

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Speaker 12: You have like a definition, like some kind of a

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metaphysics here, you have like a definition of truth for right,

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so you can assign truth to any given statement. And

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I don't think that it is necessary to be to

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be to believe in the God or you know, to

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be seistic to co a a definition of truth for example,

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like you could.

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Speaker 2: Know you're missing the point. So you can say that

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God isn't necessary to have a quote definition of truth.

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But how do we know that that's the case. What's

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the justification for that assertion?

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Speaker 12: Well, because like humans like we can have a conversation

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here and obviously we understand each other and it's not

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any coincidence, right, so there are certain laws.

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Speaker 2: Okay, but what yeah, I agree, but what's the justu Okay,

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what's the explanation of the justification for those laws of

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thought and meaning that make conversations possible. That's the precisely

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the question what's the account for that?

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Speaker 12: Well, maybe he's grounded in in I.

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Speaker 4: Mean, I don't know ground I don't know.

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Speaker 2: How would evolution a process of constantly moving flux and

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change ground something immaterial and invariant.

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Speaker 12: Well, because the immaterial in the invariant And I guess

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by that do you mean logic and like other?

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Speaker 2: Well, the principles are meaning what can the kind.

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Speaker 4: Of just like finish my sentences place? It's like intertwined

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view the material.

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Speaker 2: So that you're just asserting metaphysics. How do you know that?

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What's the justification? But you're just asserting things? Justify these claims?

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Speaker 4: Well, that's that's that's just an observation. So the way

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I see it.

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Speaker 2: However, so I it's an assertion. So you said maybe

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the immaterial is bound up with an entangled with the material.

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How okay, So God does it all? Are you going

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to accept that?

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Speaker 5: All right?

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Speaker 2: So what's the justification for that?

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Speaker 12: So if you define God, if you define define God.

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Speaker 2: As like, don't change the subject, tell me the justification

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for your assertion functional stop changing the subject? What's a

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justification for your assertion?

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Speaker 12: My assertion that immaterial things emerge from materials?

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Speaker 4: Yes? Yeah, well, imagine an observation. So for example, we.

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Speaker 2: Are like, it's an assertion, it's not even it's not

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even an observation. You don't observe that, you're just asserting things.

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Speaker 4: Well, just let me finish.

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Speaker 3: So I can't.

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Speaker 12: I can give you an example and you can't say

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what's wrong about it?

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Speaker 2: Well, how is giving an example going to justify the assertion?

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Speaker 4: Can you repeat us, I didn't hear it.

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Speaker 2: Even if you give me an example, how will that

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justify the assertion being true? How do you know that

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that's true, that immaterial emerges from the matter from the material.

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Speaker 4: Because I observe, observe is constant.

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Speaker 2: Oh so that's a circle. No, No, you don't. You

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think you see things happening, But how do you know

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that that's the meaning of what's happening?

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Speaker 12: Because the world it's either I'm a thing or I

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am not always prefer the time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's a fallacy that has nothing to do

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with whether it's true or false.

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Speaker 13: Sorry, we're moving on. This is ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: That one guy, what's up? So we're never going to

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get an answer to the question. I just I don't

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have the time or the patience today to deal with

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the constant assert assert assert never answering the question of

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justifying the assertions. What's up, I'm mute that one guy,

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I'm mute that one guy. I'm mute, I'm mute. What's up?

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You have to turn your mic on men dead earth theory?

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What's up? Man? We got we still got a thousand live.

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Welcome everybody, if you want to call in. What's up?

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Speaker 3: Uh?

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Speaker 14: I think you moved down to Yeah, yeah, it looks

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like I got it. So, Hi, Jay, I really just

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sort of had a question. I'm not necessarily personally in

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the position to debate, but it's sort of along I

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don't know, gnostic lines, but just to get to the point,

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I was talking to my brother and he came. He

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brought up just the idea that, like the term he says,

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he makes the case that that the Christian God in

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like entirely is based on like two like Samerian deities

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or something like that.

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Speaker 15: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And I'm just kind of like wondering in my head.

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Speaker 14: It seems like it should be easy, like I used

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to actually believe kind of like that to refute it.

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Speaker 2: Well, the first question is like why should we think

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that there is this on what basis because something is

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supposedly older, well, just because something is older, let's say,

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for the sake of argument, the Canaanite Pantheon, the recordings

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of the Canaanite Pantheon are, let's say, for the sake

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of argument, older than the you know, the Torah. That

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wouldn't prove that it's that it's true, nor that the

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Torah borrowed from that. That's just that's simply a non sequitor.

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But beyond that, I mean, there are very noticeable differences

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between the God presented in Genesis and what we see

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in the Canaanite pantheon or in the you know, Babylonian Marduke,

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you know what Tima, all that kind of stuff, Like,

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there's very For example, if you read I'm not a

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huge fan of William Craig, but Willam Lane Craig has

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actually a really good book on this topic, which is

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called Creation x Nilo, And in that book he actually

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contrasts the surrounding Near Middle Eastern pagan religions to the

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type of God revealed in the Torah, and it's vastly different.

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So what a lot of these groups or arguments do

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The Gnostics, the Zeitgeist type people. They will take superficial

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similarities and then leap to the conclusion that the Bible

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ripped it off, or the Bible has a real secret

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religion which is this gnostic thing, none of which is trip.

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It's all just non sequitors.

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Speaker 14: Right oh yeah, And I'm it's like there's some that

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are easier for me when people try to equate, like

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Christ to the horrors.

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Speaker 5: Myth and stiff.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly right, But yeah.

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Speaker 3: I definitely appreciate.

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Speaker 14: Did you say the book was Creation x Nilo.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it's William Lane Craig, who I would typically not recommend,

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except this is really a good book, and he argues

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precisely this point that you can't really equate the deity

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in the Torah to the god surrounding the nation state

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of Israel.

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Speaker 3: Right.

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Speaker 14: Oh yeah, And that totally makes sense when you say it.

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And so if I just at the time, I couldn't,

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I didn't know what to say.

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Speaker 5: I did say.

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Speaker 14: That that doesn't prove that they're even necessarily talking about

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the same.

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Speaker 4: Thing, just because they were using similar languages or whatever.

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Speaker 3: But I'll let you get to it.

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Speaker 2: No, it's okay. But again, and beyond that, the superficial

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similarity stuff. Craig makes multiple arguments here about the ways

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in which there are fundamental, significant, metaphysical theological differences in

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the type of deity that's presented in the Bible versus

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the surrounding cultures of Israel.

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Speaker 15: They're they're there.

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Speaker 2: It's kind of like the way that that like evolutionary

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theory proponent. Evolution theory proponents will say something like, oh, well, look,

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how you know it's ninety plus percent similarity between a

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human and a lizard. Therefore we all have the same

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uh you know, wherefore were almost pretty much the same.

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We're basically just big lizards. Well, that few percentile difference

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is enough of a difference to have the difference between

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a human and a lizard, you see. So just because

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there's overlap does not necessarily mean that the difference is

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not massive. You see. And by that line of argumentation,

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all deities are the same deity because they all share

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something in common. Well, how do we know what the

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lowest common denominator of things in common is? Whereby we

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then have the same reference, we don't. It's a not

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It doesn't follow because if I have the same reference

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and the same even the same intention. Right. You can

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demonstrate this. It's demonstrated in the Garabee paper theistic fallacies.

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For example, even if I have the same rapt and

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intention and terms and names, we can have totally different reference.

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For example, I say there's a million dollars worth of

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goal buried in the basement, in a basement in the

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Promised Land. And I tell you this, and we both

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understand the meaning of the word promised land. We both

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understand the golds in the basement. We're We're both intending

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to mean the same thing. The reference are the same,

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the context is the same. And so you say, I'm

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on it, Jay, I'm flying over to Israel right now.

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I'm digging around wherever I think it might be. I'm God,

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I want to go. I want to know where to

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go at. I'm an uproot that tree, I want that goal.

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Speaker 3: Give me to go.

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Speaker 2: You like a leprechaun in the ghetto. Oh but wait

401
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a minute. You see when I said the goal is

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in a basement of the Promised Land. I the Christian

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bookstore down the road called Promised Land, and I buried

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my million dollars of gold in their basement. This is

405
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illustrating the silliness of the whole premise and argumentation of

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natural theology, which operates on these word concept fallacies and

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ambiguities of intentional contexts and epistemic settings. And it demonstrates

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that even if we have the same intended reference, that

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doesn't necessarily mean that we're going to get to it

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because we're using the same terms, the same words, but

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we have totally different reference. And what that shows is

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that you can have this ambiguity of the real reference

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even if the intention is to have the same reference.

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My buddy over there, he intended to actually get gold

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in the promise Land, and I intended for him to

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understand gold is in the promise Land. But the ambiguity

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of terminology in various contexts demonstrates this problem when it

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comes to both natural theology and the mistake that people

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do the Zeitgeist shit, like all that Zeitgei's they're doing

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the exact same thing. They are saying. All of the

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theologies of the world, all the comparative religion texts tell

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us that there is this deity and it's outside of

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time and space, or maybe it's even in time. There's

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this deity and it's called God. Therefore it's all referring

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to the same thing. I mean, the dollar bill is

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literally like natural theology. It's Masonic natural thing. I'm not joking.

427
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When you get the dollar bill out, that stupid ass

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fake fiat dollar bill, it says in God we trust

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what God? Oh well, we all know that God refers

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to the same God, does it? What do you mean

431
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how makes sense of that? So I'm illustrating the point

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that the Zeitgei's gnostic worldview the perennialist worldview, which is

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actually addressed at the very beginning of the Garibie paper.

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He says to the Thomist, Wait a minute, why should

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we assume that the lowest common denominator supposedly obvious, self

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evident attributes of the monad? Why should we assume that

437
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that takes us in the Tomaist and then Roman Catholic direction.

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Why wouldn't it lead us to perennialism. And so he

439
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actually presents an argument I think from Mark Sedgwick, one

440
00:25:42,839 --> 00:25:49,079
of the famous perennialists, and he says, to uh, who's

441
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the Boomer Thomas guy that's used in that paper. I

442
00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:56,960
forget his name, the famous Thomas that supposedly is orthodox.

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FDA's met him anyway. He says, wait a minute, Bloomer

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Thomas Man, why wouldn't we choose perennialism If the lowest

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common denominator is this list of eight ten attributes? Why

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wouldn't we then conclude that perennialism versus and not tomism

447
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and all that. Why isn't it a perennialist world view?

448
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They can never answer that, And in fact, Vatican two

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garbage theology odd to lead to perennialism. It pretty much

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is or to Masonic gibber jabber deism might as well

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be all.

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Speaker 15: Those Greg, Hello, can you hear me?

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Speaker 2: What's up? Greg?

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Speaker 1: Hi? Jay?

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Speaker 5: Thanks for having me on.

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Speaker 9: So I wanted to go back to the atheist guy

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because I have a question.

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Speaker 5: Is it right that you said that.

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Speaker 9: From the atheist perspective, you can't know anything?

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Speaker 4: Is that right?

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Speaker 2: Said? You can't justify the knowledge.

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Speaker 5: You can't justify any knowledge.

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Speaker 9: So what do you think about the idea that you

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can justify knowledge just based on the idea that you

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know that material things exist, and then you can.

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Speaker 2: Make you already you already begged the question based on

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the already the questions. You already begged the question because

468
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:25,039
the question is about how is knowledge possible? And then

469
00:27:25,039 --> 00:27:27,519
your answer was, well, we know blah blah blah. The

470
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question is how do you know at all?

471
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:30,240
Speaker 3: Yeah?

472
00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:33,160
Speaker 9: So what I would say is that knowledge is possible

473
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:36,799
because the existence of material things.

474
00:27:36,839 --> 00:27:40,119
Speaker 2: That's a knowledge claim. That's a knowledge claim. That's a

475
00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:49,839
knowledge claim. Okay, how do you justify knowledge claims? Knowledge claim?

476
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:50,000
Speaker 10: Ye?

477
00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:52,480
Speaker 9: So you justified the existence of material things.

478
00:27:52,720 --> 00:28:02,559
Speaker 2: No knowledge. I didn't ask you how you justify material things.

479
00:28:02,839 --> 00:28:05,319
I asked you how you justify the possibility of knowledge

480
00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:08,680
at all? What is the criterion for knowledge?

481
00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:09,680
Speaker 16: Yeah?

482
00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:13,400
Speaker 9: The criterion for knowledge is the basis of being able

483
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:15,160
to justify that knowledge in some way.

484
00:28:15,279 --> 00:28:16,319
Speaker 3: Let me give you an example.

485
00:28:16,319 --> 00:28:20,319
Speaker 2: Now, so now you're deflecting. That's not answering. Do are

486
00:28:20,319 --> 00:28:22,839
you familiar with the criterion problem?

487
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:23,680
Speaker 5: Somewhat?

488
00:28:23,839 --> 00:28:25,519
Speaker 4: I mean, okay, would you explain it?

489
00:28:25,599 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 2: Right? So the criterion problem is if I claim to

490
00:28:28,759 --> 00:28:31,599
have knowledge at all, the problem is that that relies

491
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:35,279
on some criteria of knowledge. But if I go towards

492
00:28:35,319 --> 00:28:37,960
trying to show a criterion of knowledge first before I

493
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:41,599
have knowledge claims, that is also a knowledge claim. So

494
00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:46,119
there's a problem here in this atheistic approach to epistemology,

495
00:28:46,319 --> 00:28:49,480
known as the criterion problem, where there's no real way

496
00:28:49,519 --> 00:28:52,359
out of this box, you see.

497
00:28:54,279 --> 00:28:58,079
Speaker 9: Okay, Well, so, okay, just to give you an example

498
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:02,839
what I was thinking. Right, So we have like knowledge

499
00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:05,319
of genetics, for example, and you could say, well, how

500
00:29:05,359 --> 00:29:07,240
do you come to that knowledge of gen x? Well,

501
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:10,240
you do experiments with plants, like what greg Or Mendel

502
00:29:10,279 --> 00:29:10,599
did with.

503
00:29:10,799 --> 00:29:12,599
Speaker 2: Missing the whole point. None of that has anything to

504
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:15,839
do with justification of knowledge and epistemology. Just asserting that

505
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:20,880
you have observation and facts and data from scientific observation

506
00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:24,480
has nothing to do with epistemic questions of how knowledge

507
00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:26,960
is possible. It just begs the question a million times over.

508
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:30,000
But I do thank you for your questions. So yeah,

509
00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:34,359
thank you, Alex. What's up?

510
00:29:41,039 --> 00:29:41,240
Speaker 4: Hey?

511
00:29:41,279 --> 00:29:41,480
Speaker 1: What so?

512
00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:41,720
Speaker 4: Ja?

513
00:29:42,079 --> 00:29:43,759
Speaker 2: Hey?

514
00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:48,559
Speaker 8: I have a question concerning the transcendental argument. I've already

515
00:29:48,559 --> 00:29:50,279
watched a lot of your stuff. I love what you do.

516
00:29:50,319 --> 00:29:53,240
I'm an orthodox Christian by the way. Okay, but I

517
00:29:53,359 --> 00:29:55,839
just have a question concerning the problem of induction, and

518
00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:57,880
I also want to ask a question afterwards.

519
00:29:57,440 --> 00:29:59,079
Speaker 4: About your Meta Narratives book.

520
00:29:59,240 --> 00:30:05,400
Speaker 8: Okay, So the problem of induction concerning creation x Nilo miracles,

521
00:30:05,599 --> 00:30:09,279
you know, God intervening in reality. How would Orthodox go

522
00:30:09,319 --> 00:30:14,200
about answering something concerning that, Like, for example, whenever Nebukinezer

523
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:16,200
went to put in the three friends of Daniel in

524
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,559
the furnace and they survived by all means of like

525
00:30:19,640 --> 00:30:23,160
naturalist induction, you'd say they would have died. But from

526
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,079
a north Duck's point of view, I'm assuming it would

527
00:30:25,079 --> 00:30:27,720
be something along the lines of you have to just

528
00:30:27,839 --> 00:30:32,319
take God into account as a variable when inducing something.

529
00:30:32,559 --> 00:30:35,400
Speaker 2: Well, like the principle of induction is just the sort

530
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:39,200
of normal programming and functioning of the world. It doesn't

531
00:30:39,240 --> 00:30:41,960
have anything to do with like whether God can do

532
00:30:42,039 --> 00:30:44,880
what he wants in a miraculous way, because God is

533
00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:47,079
the one that's set up the logic and the structure

534
00:30:47,119 --> 00:30:50,160
of induction. So there's nothing that limits God because God

535
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:52,599
is the one who created the structure of the world

536
00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:54,559
as it is, so he can do anything he wants.

537
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:58,440
Speaker 8: Okay, okay, And his unchanging nature is why we have

538
00:30:58,519 --> 00:31:01,359
the ability to have you know, constancy in the world.

539
00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 2: Well, not only that, but also like you know, the

540
00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:07,720
Covenant with Noah. He says that day and night will continue.

541
00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:10,279
The seasons will continue until the end of the world. Right,

542
00:31:10,319 --> 00:31:14,000
So I mean beyond just the character of God, we

543
00:31:14,119 --> 00:31:18,160
also have the promise in the covenants that would then

544
00:31:18,279 --> 00:31:21,160
be by extension a basis for the principle the regularity

545
00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:21,640
of nature.

546
00:31:23,079 --> 00:31:24,039
Speaker 4: Okay, I appreciate it.

547
00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:26,839
Speaker 8: And concerning your metanarratives book, I know you go into

548
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:29,440
depth on like the logoi and everything, because I've watched

549
00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:30,200
a lot of your debts.

550
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 2: Well, I mean, actually I don't in that book. I

551
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:36,200
don't argue so much about the theology of the Logi.

552
00:31:36,319 --> 00:31:39,519
It's more so like trying to utilize some of those

553
00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:43,400
arguments for apologetic purposes in that book. So it's not

554
00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:48,359
strictly speaking, like trying to explain to you Maximus's theology

555
00:31:48,359 --> 00:31:52,519
of the Trinity. I'm just pulling into kind of apologetic

556
00:31:52,559 --> 00:31:56,000
discourse or metaphysics discourses, principles of the Logi.

557
00:31:57,039 --> 00:31:57,759
Speaker 4: Okay, okay.

558
00:31:57,839 --> 00:32:00,720
Speaker 8: So I understand a lot of like the epistemic, you know,

559
00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:04,000
reasoning and everything in the apologetics, but I would like

560
00:32:04,079 --> 00:32:07,319
to know all of the Orthodox perspectives on like how

561
00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:10,400
we explain all the different transcendentals. Is there like a

562
00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:13,160
localized place or book that you would recommend for them.

563
00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:16,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean you'd have to start reading Saint Maximus himself.

564
00:32:16,279 --> 00:32:19,440
I mean the ambiguoa. Those are unfortunately pretty expensive. You know,

565
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:23,759
there's two volumes that cover that. But if you want

566
00:32:23,759 --> 00:32:26,839
a cheaper approach, the Little Saint Ladimir Seminary Press. That's

567
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:31,359
the Little Blue Saint Maximus book. It has the whole

568
00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:36,359
translation of Ambiguous seven, which is one of the direct

569
00:32:36,559 --> 00:32:42,319
most extensive ambigua about the Logi. So I would say

570
00:32:42,359 --> 00:32:47,119
read that one and then also it's like Ambiguous twenty

571
00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:49,079
two goes into a lot of depth about this, but

572
00:32:49,960 --> 00:32:53,960
that's the shortcut version. Also, Florofsky has a really good

573
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:57,640
paper on the Logi. It's let me see if I

574
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:01,839
can pull it up. So the Saint Vladimir's Seminy Seminary

575
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:05,480
book is called I always forget the name because this

576
00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:07,480
the name of this one is very similar to a

577
00:33:07,519 --> 00:33:11,759
Larsternbird book that I always getting mixed up. It's called

578
00:33:11,799 --> 00:33:15,160
On the Cosmic Mystery of Jesus. That's the SVS book

579
00:33:15,759 --> 00:33:18,359
that has I don't even I think it's abridged, but

580
00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:21,200
it's a large portion of Ambiguous seven. Isn't that book

581
00:33:21,799 --> 00:33:37,440
and then the Fluorovsky paper on the Logi is called

582
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:43,000
creation and creaturehood.

583
00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:44,960
Speaker 4: Okay, I appreciate it.

584
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:47,039
Speaker 5: So Saint Maximus and I suppose.

585
00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:49,240
Speaker 8: With Saint Jonathan Mascus also be some of the go

586
00:33:49,319 --> 00:33:54,160
to people for the main transcendental and metaphysical Orthodox perspective.

587
00:33:54,319 --> 00:33:57,359
Speaker 2: Well, I mean fount of knowledge would be Saint John

588
00:33:57,400 --> 00:34:01,799
Damascus says, usage of and kind of introductory textbook to

589
00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:06,240
define all of the philosophical terms. But they in the

590
00:34:06,279 --> 00:34:09,159
Middle Ages, in the ancient like, they weren't thinking in

591
00:34:09,239 --> 00:34:12,360
terms of transcental categories. That's more of a post and

592
00:34:13,119 --> 00:34:15,800
that's more of a post Enlightenment way of thinking and talking.

593
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:21,119
So it would be relevant to read a fount of

594
00:34:21,159 --> 00:34:25,920
knowledge to get the basic terminological stuff. Maybe the next

595
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:27,880
book I would read after that would be something like

596
00:34:28,199 --> 00:34:31,519
Arslaw Pelicon's book on the Cappa doceans and their philosophy,

597
00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:33,719
that would also relate to this, because he goes into

598
00:34:33,760 --> 00:34:36,719
the one of the many, He goes into universals logie

599
00:34:37,559 --> 00:34:40,000
and how the Cappa dotionans all utilize these ideas and

600
00:34:40,039 --> 00:34:43,119
these tools, and that is called the metamorphosis of natural

601
00:34:43,159 --> 00:34:50,639
theology in Cappu doceans. I think by Yaroslav Pelicon b Elik.

602
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:52,320
Speaker 4: Gotcha.

603
00:34:52,599 --> 00:35:03,840
Speaker 2: I appreciate it, man, yep, really good questions, Taylor, but

604
00:35:04,039 --> 00:35:06,519
it's a dude. T t A y l e R.

605
00:35:06,599 --> 00:35:15,159
Taylor with a T A y Go ahead, what's up? Man?

606
00:35:19,079 --> 00:35:22,000
Ad aaki all the people haters in the chat? If

607
00:35:22,039 --> 00:35:25,960
you don't call in, we've eventually boot you because we

608
00:35:26,039 --> 00:35:29,000
don't really tolerate people just spamming and gibber jabbering in

609
00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:32,000
the chat all day long. This is not a platform

610
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:33,760
in a place for you to spam the chat with

611
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:37,599
whatever your dumb cult is. Taylor, what's up? Gotta unmute man,

612
00:35:39,199 --> 00:35:41,519
last chance? T A y l e R Taylor, unmute

613
00:35:41,599 --> 00:35:47,280
or not all right? Moving on, joe Ed, joe Ed

614
00:35:52,639 --> 00:35:54,880
starting to get a headache. Don't have to what's up?

615
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:55,119
Speaker 4: Man?

616
00:35:58,639 --> 00:36:00,719
Speaker 16: Sou uh uh?

617
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:04,039
Speaker 2: Oriental Orthodox I can barely hear you.

618
00:36:04,079 --> 00:36:08,800
Speaker 16: May I'll try again a little later.

619
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:11,039
Speaker 2: Go ahead, ask your question, what's up?

620
00:36:13,119 --> 00:36:15,599
Speaker 16: Eastern Oriental Orthodox?

621
00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:16,159
Speaker 5: I'm sorry?

622
00:36:16,159 --> 00:36:19,840
Speaker 16: Oriental Orthodox Christians. They notice things can get pretty heated

623
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:23,079
pretty quick when they call in, or even when I'm

624
00:36:23,079 --> 00:36:25,599
part of a discord where things gonna be heated a

625
00:36:25,599 --> 00:36:31,559
lot there. I'm just curious oh, agreed, yes, for one

626
00:36:31,639 --> 00:36:32,239
hundred percent.

627
00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:35,840
Speaker 17: But I was able to squeeze in the exchange where

628
00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:38,239
it didn't get crazy for like three minutes, and they

629
00:36:38,239 --> 00:36:41,480
were going back and forth, and I was just curious,

630
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:46,679
what is Things get pretty deep when I see that here,

631
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:49,800
those exchanges, and I can't really follow all the time.

632
00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:55,239
Speaker 2: But what's so really in terms of we're doing we're

633
00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:57,679
doing a multiple lecture series on my channel. I can't

634
00:36:57,679 --> 00:36:59,360
hear you, man, it's just way too loud, like we're

635
00:36:59,360 --> 00:37:02,039
doing multiple lecture series on the channel. You guys. Look,

636
00:37:03,199 --> 00:37:05,320
I'm not faulting the guy for calling and asked a question,

637
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:08,920
is fine, but this is why we're doing the lecture series.

638
00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:14,440
So you'll have to go and just watch the series. Guys.

639
00:37:14,639 --> 00:37:17,840
We've done two of these so far right Part two

640
00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:20,480
Refuting Oriental Orthodoxy Part two right here. So it's going

641
00:37:20,559 --> 00:37:24,440
to be basically a college lecture course on this. So

642
00:37:24,599 --> 00:37:28,480
if you have those questions, watch the course. Ferg what's

643
00:37:28,519 --> 00:37:43,880
up man, Fergie fur Delicious, what's up? I'm mute. No

644
00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:46,559
one has used X before. No one understands how this works.

645
00:37:46,599 --> 00:37:49,360
After how many years you have to turn your permissions on?

646
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:59,360
Man Layton Jensen, what's up Mandu was driving in a

647
00:37:59,400 --> 00:37:59,960
dang hurricane?

648
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 4: Do the Church Fathers teach tag.

649
00:38:04,559 --> 00:38:09,800
Speaker 2: Yes and no, yes and no. So for example, in

650
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:13,880
the introduction page of On a Fount of Knowledge by

651
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:16,920
John Damascus, he makes a transcendental type of argument, which

652
00:38:16,960 --> 00:38:20,079
we find in Aristotle, I think Metaphysics book four or five,

653
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:25,400
which is an indirect transcendental argument. That's the first version

654
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:29,320
of that. You could say that in against heresies or

655
00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:33,280
even an adgentees affinaceous makes presuppositional critiques of the other

656
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:36,440
world views. But we don't see a full on presentation

657
00:38:36,519 --> 00:38:39,760
of the transcendental argument for God until much later. But

658
00:38:40,440 --> 00:38:42,079
what does that have to do with whether the argument

659
00:38:42,119 --> 00:38:44,000
is sound or not. It's a version of a genetic fallacy.

660
00:38:44,000 --> 00:38:45,719
Do the Church Fathers talk about calculus?

661
00:38:47,519 --> 00:38:48,800
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I understand.

662
00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:55,800
Speaker 18: So what if someone says knowledge, I mean, logic is

663
00:38:56,079 --> 00:38:57,400
purely material.

664
00:38:57,519 --> 00:38:58,079
Speaker 4: What happens?

665
00:38:58,119 --> 00:38:58,320
Speaker 5: Then?

666
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:02,320
Speaker 2: I mean, it's a its face absurd statement. How could

667
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:06,840
logic be matter? It's fool, It's stupid on its face.

668
00:39:07,000 --> 00:39:09,599
Speaker 18: If they define it to all we know of logic

669
00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:12,119
is the chemical reactions happening in our brains.

670
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:15,960
Speaker 2: Okay, how would that explain something in material and invariant.

671
00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:19,000
Speaker 4: So what makes it immaterial and invariant?

672
00:39:19,039 --> 00:39:21,320
Speaker 2: Why does it happening the nature of something? Because it

673
00:39:21,559 --> 00:39:25,480
because matter is always in flux. For logic to be

674
00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:29,119
to be lawlike means that it does not influx. So

675
00:39:29,159 --> 00:39:33,039
how would equating it to something that is constantly changing

676
00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:36,760
or in motion? How would that make it lawlike? It's

677
00:39:36,800 --> 00:39:38,679
no longer lawlike if it's matter.

678
00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:43,800
Speaker 18: So we can't follow logic as a rule unless it

679
00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:45,840
is completely stationary.

680
00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:50,000
Speaker 2: No, I'm just saying, but that, by definition of what

681
00:39:50,119 --> 00:39:53,480
it is, if it's to be, for example, universal, it

682
00:39:53,519 --> 00:39:57,039
cannot be equated to anything localized, like matter or a

683
00:39:57,079 --> 00:40:01,360
specific collection of atoms or molecule. Furthermore, how do you

684
00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:03,679
know that or how would you prove or demonstrate that

685
00:40:03,880 --> 00:40:06,920
logic is equated to this or that molecule. It's it's

686
00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:07,920
foolish on his face.

687
00:40:12,239 --> 00:40:12,599
Speaker 4: Mm hmm.

688
00:40:14,199 --> 00:40:16,599
Speaker 7: Okay, well that's that's where I end.

689
00:40:17,199 --> 00:40:18,960
Speaker 2: Sure you know that was a great questions. Appreciate it.

690
00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:22,239
Thank you, Laton Golden. You want to try again?

691
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:33,239
Speaker 5: Any how's it going?

692
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:35,239
Speaker 3: Sorry?

693
00:40:35,239 --> 00:40:36,480
Speaker 4: So I think just a.

694
00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:39,800
Speaker 19: Note here when you when you with me as a speaker,

695
00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:41,840
I didn't hear you anything, so I think there and

696
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:44,559
sometimes when I when people join, I don't hear anything

697
00:40:44,639 --> 00:40:46,519
for like the first few seconds of the conversation.

698
00:40:46,599 --> 00:40:49,280
Speaker 5: So I don't know if that's how people are mistaken.

699
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:52,039
Speaker 15: When they don't unimmute, Okay, just not I.

700
00:40:52,199 --> 00:40:55,400
Speaker 19: I uh so, I wanted to ask you about perennialism,

701
00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:57,079
and you brought it, brought it up a little bit earlier.

702
00:40:57,280 --> 00:40:59,519
Speaker 5: Is that relevant to the to the topics?

703
00:40:59,679 --> 00:40:59,960
Speaker 3: Sure?

704
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:04,760
Speaker 19: So, I'm kind of interested in perennialism. I think there's

705
00:41:05,079 --> 00:41:09,840
some interesting, like you know, notions to it, particularly if

706
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:15,519
you first approach it from a like a religious standpoint.

707
00:41:15,760 --> 00:41:17,800
You know, if you approach it from Christianity as like

708
00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:22,000
the framework for your perennialist view, and then what you

709
00:41:22,000 --> 00:41:25,320
would do is look at other things that happen throughout

710
00:41:25,679 --> 00:41:28,360
other religions and see if there's anything that's that's comparable.

711
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:31,159
Speaker 2: Why would you approach perennialism from a Christian vantage point?

712
00:41:31,239 --> 00:41:35,280
I mean, in other words, you're already utilizing unjustified presuppositions

713
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:38,119
and assumptions that and by the way, Christianity is not

714
00:41:38,519 --> 00:41:41,119
compatible with perennialism, so it doesn't make any sense.

715
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:41,639
Speaker 15: To go that route.

716
00:41:42,039 --> 00:41:44,280
Speaker 2: How do you know what the skeletal true religion.

717
00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:47,280
Speaker 5: Is anyway, Yeah, you wouldn't. It would have to be

718
00:41:47,800 --> 00:41:48,599
like something based.

719
00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:52,199
Speaker 19: So I've always used like Christianity as the example, which

720
00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:53,960
is what I would go with. I would say that

721
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:57,000
the evidence that's been presented so far for the religion

722
00:41:57,159 --> 00:41:59,880
makes it a fairly strong candidate for being the true religion.

723
00:42:00,159 --> 00:42:02,960
And then you'd look at something else and say, well, Okay,

724
00:42:03,360 --> 00:42:04,199
this event happened.

725
00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:05,960
Speaker 5: If this event happened, then.

726
00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:08,639
Speaker 19: It was likely because God caused it to happen. But

727
00:42:08,679 --> 00:42:12,079
I wouldn't say that other gods are equivalent. But you know,

728
00:42:12,119 --> 00:42:14,920
if a miracle is described in another culture, another history,

729
00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:17,679
or another religion, then you could attribute that to God.

730
00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:20,679
Speaker 2: Well, but that wouldn't mean that perennialism is true because

731
00:42:20,719 --> 00:42:23,119
perennialism is premised on the idea that there is a

732
00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:29,199
higher metaphysical superstructure, which is the skeletal original religion of

733
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:32,079
which all the other religions are kind of like versions

734
00:42:32,119 --> 00:42:35,760
or denominations. And so that's empathetical to the claims of Christianity.

735
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:39,679
So how what you just described that could be described

736
00:42:39,679 --> 00:42:44,280
by just Christian theology, That wouldn't assessitate perennialism, gotcha.

737
00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:46,440
Speaker 5: So okay, I see what you're saying.

738
00:42:46,679 --> 00:42:50,480
Speaker 19: So it wouldn't necessarily be that, Like if you were

739
00:42:50,480 --> 00:42:53,679
to assert something like other religions when they perceive miracles

740
00:42:53,679 --> 00:42:58,000
done by what they attribute to a deity, they're like

741
00:42:58,199 --> 00:43:02,519
taking that claim and attributing it to God in the Christian.

742
00:43:02,199 --> 00:43:05,440
Speaker 5: Sense, would not be perennialism. That would be Christian theology.

743
00:43:05,440 --> 00:43:09,960
Speaker 2: Basically, Yeah, that's compatible even within a traditional Christian framework.

744
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:15,239
But again the basic premise of perennialism is that metaphysics

745
00:43:15,280 --> 00:43:18,880
as a discipline can demonstrate and show to us that

746
00:43:18,960 --> 00:43:25,159
there is an ancient, primal, superstructor structure skeletal religion of

747
00:43:25,199 --> 00:43:29,719
which all of today's religions are essentially denominations, and that's

748
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:32,800
not compatible with Christian Well, I.

749
00:43:32,719 --> 00:43:35,039
Speaker 19: Guess see what that would entail is that like other

750
00:43:35,119 --> 00:43:39,000
gods are somehow valid or or parts of.

751
00:43:38,960 --> 00:43:43,679
Speaker 2: This superstructured Well, it's again just it's got a lot

752
00:43:43,679 --> 00:43:46,360
of assumptions going on, one of which is, how do

753
00:43:46,400 --> 00:43:50,320
you know or what is this supposed science of metaphysics

754
00:43:50,519 --> 00:43:55,119
that's going to tell us what the superstructural religion is. Secondly,

755
00:43:57,480 --> 00:44:02,320
it's not going to make sense with religions like say Christianity,

756
00:44:02,639 --> 00:44:06,239
which make exclusive as claims to not be one denomination

757
00:44:06,320 --> 00:44:07,519
amongst many world religions.

758
00:44:07,719 --> 00:44:09,880
Speaker 5: You see, yeah, I see what you're saying.

759
00:44:10,000 --> 00:44:12,440
Speaker 2: Okay, So then it becomes very it becomes very ad

760
00:44:12,440 --> 00:44:16,119
hoc and arbitrary as to what the perennialists pick and

761
00:44:16,239 --> 00:44:20,400
choose as the high brow, sophisticated elements of the religions.

762
00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:22,480
That's the very So it's like I remember, always bring

763
00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:24,599
this up with the perennialists. I'm like, okay, So I

764
00:44:24,679 --> 00:44:27,360
go and I read Julius Evla in the Metaphysics of Sex,

765
00:44:27,599 --> 00:44:30,760
and Eblis says that, oh, Crowley's butt sex is part

766
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:34,719
of the ancient traditional religion. Why oh, well, because it's

767
00:44:34,719 --> 00:44:37,440
like esoteric and it's like high brow, what real is it?

768
00:44:37,559 --> 00:44:39,480
Or is it just degenerous that you see? So it's

769
00:44:39,519 --> 00:44:43,480
to like arbitrary. But but you see, but you see,

770
00:44:43,599 --> 00:44:46,280
Ebl is not of true p and the true perennalists

771
00:44:46,280 --> 00:44:49,159
are over here in this cult with it just becomes

772
00:44:49,199 --> 00:44:52,880
all this arbitrary nonsense just exactly. Yeah.

773
00:44:52,920 --> 00:44:55,079
Speaker 19: Yeah, awesome, we thanks man, I appreciate it.

774
00:44:55,119 --> 00:44:57,400
Speaker 2: Absolutely great questions. Yeah, I appreciate that, and we haven't

775
00:44:57,400 --> 00:45:00,760
had anybody really asking perennialism, ques is it a long time?

776
00:45:00,800 --> 00:45:04,000
So I appreciate that unmute dude, what's up? That's a

777
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:08,920
good name. It's just unmute, but so unmute.

778
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:11,719
Speaker 3: I have some.

779
00:45:11,800 --> 00:45:16,880
Speaker 5: Questions about Calvinism. I wanting to know what your response.

780
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:18,679
Speaker 20: Would be to like the person that say, all that

781
00:45:18,679 --> 00:45:20,800
the Father has given to me, none will fall.

782
00:45:20,679 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 2: Away, well included amongst the collective group. Let me rephrase

783
00:45:30,039 --> 00:45:34,400
that in the in the ultimate sense, in terms of

784
00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:38,840
God's foreknowledge, God knows everybody who will be saved, and

785
00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:42,480
those ultimately in the aschaeological sense, are in Christ and

786
00:45:42,519 --> 00:45:45,079
will not be lost. But we also have many, many

787
00:45:45,079 --> 00:45:47,719
texts that tell us that there are those who are

788
00:45:47,719 --> 00:45:50,360
have tasted the heavenly gift, have been washed in the

789
00:45:50,760 --> 00:45:56,199
waters of regeneration, you know, who have a new life

790
00:45:56,239 --> 00:45:58,920
has sprung up from in them, and yet they withered

791
00:45:58,960 --> 00:46:01,760
and died due to the of the world. We have

792
00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:04,360
all of this terminology in the New Testament also about

793
00:46:04,360 --> 00:46:07,400
being part of the Covenant and then being cut out.

794
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:12,440
And so this is what led the Calvinist position to

795
00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:16,920
eventually formulate the visible invisible Church. Doctrine. So in other words,

796
00:46:17,119 --> 00:46:19,119
you then go through all the passages of the New

797
00:46:19,119 --> 00:46:21,800
Testament the Bible to pick out Oh, well, this one's

798
00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:24,519
Jesus talking to the elect when he says, all those

799
00:46:24,599 --> 00:46:27,840
you know, the none that the Father's given me will

800
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:29,920
be lost. Oh but these other pastors over here. This

801
00:46:29,960 --> 00:46:32,440
is on the visible Church, which is all full of heresies,

802
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:34,679
and it's falling apart, and it's a big mess. But

803
00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:36,920
the problem is that when you read, for example, Ephesians,

804
00:46:37,199 --> 00:46:38,960
and this is I think one of the strongest defeaters

805
00:46:39,119 --> 00:46:42,559
of Calvinism. When Paul wrote his letter to the Ephesians,

806
00:46:42,760 --> 00:46:47,239
he specifically addresses it to the visible church at Ephesus,

807
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:49,880
where Timothy is the bishop that he appointed. He says,

808
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:51,960
I laid hands on you, Timothy, and Ephesus, you are

809
00:46:52,280 --> 00:46:55,639
the bishop of Ephesus. Paul does not write that letter

810
00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:58,639
to the elect or to the invisible church. It is

811
00:46:58,679 --> 00:47:04,320
written to the visible bishopric church at Ephesus, whom he

812
00:47:04,400 --> 00:47:10,280
calls the predestined. So even predestination from Paul's epistles is

813
00:47:10,440 --> 00:47:14,480
in Christ or is crystological. And so what Calvinists do

814
00:47:14,639 --> 00:47:17,519
is that they reverse all of this everything in theology

815
00:47:17,519 --> 00:47:21,079
begins with the divine decree. They don't even start with

816
00:47:21,119 --> 00:47:25,679
trinity tynany theology. It begins with soteriology and the Divine decree.

817
00:47:25,760 --> 00:47:30,679
And that's all backwards from orthodox Christology, the Christology I

818
00:47:30,679 --> 00:47:32,679
think of the New Testament and the Church Fathers, which

819
00:47:32,679 --> 00:47:35,840
begins with the Trinity and Christology. And so for us,

820
00:47:35,880 --> 00:47:38,800
predestination is seen through the lens of Christology. It is

821
00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:41,000
not seen first and foremost as the divine decree.

822
00:47:41,920 --> 00:47:44,599
Speaker 20: So would you say everyone's elect, but just those who

823
00:47:45,679 --> 00:47:48,800
like don't follow God they fall away.

824
00:47:48,840 --> 00:47:53,000
Speaker 2: Basically, I don't think we have to say everyone is elect.

825
00:47:53,039 --> 00:47:57,400
I think that the again, to use Paul's Christological imagery

826
00:47:57,400 --> 00:48:01,599
and Ephesians, the church is the and he actually he

827
00:48:01,639 --> 00:48:02,920
actually calls the visits.

828
00:48:02,800 --> 00:48:06,159
Speaker 5: The church itself, not the people or no.

829
00:48:06,039 --> 00:48:10,159
Speaker 2: The visible church at Ephesus. All of those baptized into

830
00:48:10,199 --> 00:48:14,360
Christ in water baptism, not some mystical unknown baptism in

831
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:18,079
water baptism, are called the elect the predestinate.

832
00:48:18,280 --> 00:48:23,159
Speaker 20: Okay, And so so God gives people to the Father

833
00:48:23,360 --> 00:48:26,639
like so like you said, like everything's from the Father

834
00:48:26,800 --> 00:48:28,000
of the Son and through the Spirit.

835
00:48:28,119 --> 00:48:30,199
Speaker 2: So you said, God gives everything to the Father you

836
00:48:30,199 --> 00:48:31,639
mean the Father gives everything to the son.

837
00:48:32,840 --> 00:48:34,719
Speaker 20: Yes, so does that, and so then that would just

838
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:37,719
include the people coming to God too.

839
00:48:40,679 --> 00:48:45,960
Speaker 2: Well, the Father gives the entire universe to the son everything, okay,

840
00:48:46,159 --> 00:48:52,280
but specifically his body is the visible institutional church, which

841
00:48:52,320 --> 00:48:55,480
is all of the collective elect people. But in the

842
00:48:55,639 --> 00:49:00,800
eschatological sense, ultimately only those who persevere are are ultimately

843
00:49:00,840 --> 00:49:01,360
the elect.

844
00:49:02,320 --> 00:49:08,000
Speaker 20: Okay, And have another question, So about the about you

845
00:49:08,079 --> 00:49:12,400
saying Christ would have to be predetermined, a predetermined person.

846
00:49:12,639 --> 00:49:16,559
Speaker 2: Right, So Augustin Augustine, for example, when he speaks of predestination,

847
00:49:16,719 --> 00:49:21,519
because he has that more you know, decree minded approach

848
00:49:21,559 --> 00:49:24,039
to predestination, more of a he's not a Calvinist, but

849
00:49:24,079 --> 00:49:27,440
he has more of a predestinarian, unconditionally elect type of view.

850
00:49:28,360 --> 00:49:31,559
He has to then say that Christ in time and

851
00:49:31,599 --> 00:49:35,840
space is a predestined, predetermined man. And the problem with

852
00:49:35,880 --> 00:49:38,760
that is that very closely can be an historian.

853
00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:42,599
Speaker 5: Are you cut out for a second.

854
00:49:42,639 --> 00:49:43,960
Speaker 16: I didn't hear that other part.

855
00:49:43,840 --> 00:49:46,760
Speaker 2: To call Christ a predestined man, as if the divine

856
00:49:46,800 --> 00:49:50,280
decree is what is motivating and moving the actions of

857
00:49:50,360 --> 00:49:54,559
Christ in time and space implies, I'm not saying Augustine

858
00:49:54,599 --> 00:49:57,400
is an historian, but it can imply an historian type

859
00:49:57,400 --> 00:50:01,719
of Christology because it is no longer the second person

860
00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:04,960
in time and space, moving and acting in synergy with

861
00:50:05,239 --> 00:50:07,880
his human nature, human will, and human energy. It is

862
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:12,920
a divine decree which predestines and predetermines what a human

863
00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:17,360
man a human subject. I mean that's stories.

864
00:50:17,920 --> 00:50:20,559
Speaker 20: Don't tell them to say that Jesus had free will too,

865
00:50:21,360 --> 00:50:25,559
but is human will. He couldn't assume a human will.

866
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:25,880
Speaker 3: If he like.

867
00:50:27,159 --> 00:50:30,760
Speaker 2: I'm not taking issue with what Calvinists claim in terms

868
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:33,840
of trying to maintain a semblance of free will and

869
00:50:33,880 --> 00:50:37,239
two wills in Christ or any of that. But part

870
00:50:37,280 --> 00:50:39,519
of the two wills in Christ doctrine is the teaching

871
00:50:39,559 --> 00:50:43,239
of the six Econmenical Council that Christ also possesses two energies,

872
00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:46,159
and that means that there is at all times in

873
00:50:46,239 --> 00:50:49,639
Christ a synergy between the human will and the divine will.

874
00:50:49,880 --> 00:50:52,840
Calvinists do not believe in synergy at all times because

875
00:50:52,880 --> 00:50:57,440
they are mono energists monarchists. They believe in salvation, there

876
00:50:57,519 --> 00:51:00,920
is a supplanting of the human human will buy the

877
00:51:00,920 --> 00:51:04,519
divine will to make you a convert to regenerate you

878
00:51:04,559 --> 00:51:08,199
in that spiritual mystical sense. So no, Calvinists do not

879
00:51:08,360 --> 00:51:11,559
affirm that is proper to human nature to always have

880
00:51:11,639 --> 00:51:15,159
a free will and a free human energy that synergizes

881
00:51:15,199 --> 00:51:18,800
with the divine will. They reject synergism at all times,

882
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:22,800
and they believe in monogism, which by extension would be

883
00:51:22,840 --> 00:51:26,920
the monothelite position that Maximus disputes with at the six

884
00:51:26,960 --> 00:51:27,960
second Medical Council.

885
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:32,119
Speaker 15: Okay, thanks, yes, great questions, appreciate those.

886
00:51:36,559 --> 00:51:38,920
Speaker 2: We are going to continue. I'm having a lot of fun.

887
00:51:39,000 --> 00:51:42,159
I am going to Jamie unfortunately has the flu, so

888
00:51:42,239 --> 00:51:44,440
you guys can pray for her. She's got sick, so

889
00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:47,039
she's not able to be on coffee duty for me,

890
00:51:47,239 --> 00:51:49,519
so I have to make my own copies, which is fine,

891
00:51:50,000 --> 00:51:53,559
but that means I need to tell you about a

892
00:51:53,599 --> 00:52:02,159
support excuse me, our patrons, ours, and I'll read a

893
00:52:02,159 --> 00:52:03,559
couple super chats and then we'll talk about that, and

894
00:52:03,599 --> 00:52:05,840
then we'll come back to we got still quite a

895
00:52:05,840 --> 00:52:09,559
few people in line here in the chat. We've still

896
00:52:09,599 --> 00:52:12,239
got ten people in line. Well, so don't go anywhere

897
00:52:12,280 --> 00:52:13,800
if you've been waiting in line. I'm going to be

898
00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:15,440
right back. But I got to make some coffee because

899
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:17,880
I'm start to get a headache. Jony h ten dollars

900
00:52:17,880 --> 00:52:24,039
fifty seven cents. Jay, would you teach somebody to address

901
00:52:25,159 --> 00:52:27,840
how would you teach somebody's dress? Moral critiques in the Bible,

902
00:52:29,079 --> 00:52:32,719
for example, there was slavery. God commanded the wiping out

903
00:52:32,880 --> 00:52:39,199
of Amalakites Canaanites. This comes up in all of the

904
00:52:39,199 --> 00:52:42,719
big atheist debates. Can you expand on God doing this?

905
00:52:43,079 --> 00:52:43,280
Speaker 3: Now?

906
00:52:43,519 --> 00:52:46,400
Speaker 2: So we just addressed this in a two hour livestream

907
00:52:46,440 --> 00:52:49,639
with Kotel if you want to go watch our Deconstructing

908
00:52:49,719 --> 00:52:55,559
Christianity talks. We dealt extensively with most of those objections.

909
00:52:56,079 --> 00:53:00,239
And I'm not trying to deflect. It's just that it's

910
00:53:00,239 --> 00:53:02,280
like one of those things that's been addressed probably one

911
00:53:02,320 --> 00:53:04,840
hundred times, and so I'm not trying to be rude.

912
00:53:04,880 --> 00:53:08,280
It's just we literally just did a two hour live

913
00:53:08,320 --> 00:53:11,440
stream on that, and so it's right here.

914
00:53:13,159 --> 00:53:25,719
Speaker 13: Let's see where do we do that? Am I scrolling

915
00:53:25,760 --> 00:53:26,199
past it?

916
00:53:26,440 --> 00:53:28,559
Speaker 2: We did one on my channel and one on his channel.

917
00:53:28,599 --> 00:53:29,239
Where's it up?

918
00:53:30,760 --> 00:53:30,840
Speaker 4: Oh?

919
00:53:30,920 --> 00:53:34,840
Speaker 2: Here it is right Deconstructing My Christianity Jay Dyer in

920
00:53:34,920 --> 00:53:38,760
Church of the Eternal Logos I think we did the

921
00:53:38,800 --> 00:53:44,840
part two on his channel addressing these specific type of argument,

922
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:47,320
so you might watch that one and then go watch it.

923
00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:50,400
I forget which one we did what, but that addresses

924
00:53:50,440 --> 00:53:53,840
that issue there, Joni, Big Boss ten dollars? Have you

925
00:53:53,880 --> 00:53:58,599
seen people hyped up to fight the cartels and they're

926
00:53:58,679 --> 00:54:01,880
using clips from the movie to ignoring the part of

927
00:54:01,880 --> 00:54:04,800
the movie where it shows that the only fight that

928
00:54:04,880 --> 00:54:07,920
happens is under we only fight the ones that are

929
00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:11,039
not under us control. That's funny. Socario is, of course

930
00:54:11,360 --> 00:54:13,719
a great movie classic when it comes to this kind

931
00:54:13,719 --> 00:54:16,840
of stuff. If you don't know, it's Benicio del Toro

932
00:54:16,960 --> 00:54:20,000
and Emily Blunt, I think. And the whole idea is

933
00:54:20,039 --> 00:54:23,239
that CIA has certain deals with certain cartels, and so

934
00:54:23,320 --> 00:54:26,000
the cartels that they quote go after are the ones

935
00:54:26,039 --> 00:54:30,400
that are not in league with CIA. So that's funny

936
00:54:30,400 --> 00:54:33,599
that people are using that clips. Well, that's missing the

937
00:54:33,719 --> 00:54:37,000
entire point of the movie, but it is interesting to see.

938
00:54:37,159 --> 00:54:39,159
I don't know if you guys saw the Trump statements

939
00:54:39,159 --> 00:54:41,159
the last couple of days, and it's like, you know.

940
00:54:41,440 --> 00:54:44,719
Speaker 21: We're gonna start a committee, we're gonna have going after

941
00:54:44,800 --> 00:54:48,599
all the cartels. We're gonna go after them all big time,

942
00:54:48,760 --> 00:54:51,599
going after cartels. I'm gonna get rid of the Department

943
00:54:51,639 --> 00:54:56,360
of Education wholesale. It's gonna go back to the States

944
00:54:56,400 --> 00:54:57,519
the way really should.

945
00:54:57,239 --> 00:54:58,119
Speaker 2: Have been the whole time.

946
00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:00,679
Speaker 21: Really, if you're thinking about it, have you ever heard

947
00:55:00,679 --> 00:55:01,480
of this scotched?

948
00:55:03,079 --> 00:55:05,639
Speaker 2: I mean, every day is Trump's like putting out all

949
00:55:05,679 --> 00:55:09,639
of these great sounding things. Let's pray that it really

950
00:55:09,679 --> 00:55:14,760
does come to fruition. Oh, I got to go to

951
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:16,719
the bathroom, excuse me, and I got to make coffee.

952
00:55:17,000 --> 00:55:19,000
I'm peeing. Don't worry, it's not going to be three hours,

953
00:55:19,280 --> 00:55:21,159
so I will not be sitting on the toilet for

954
00:55:21,199 --> 00:55:25,159
the next forty five minutes. All of that illness has passed,

955
00:55:26,159 --> 00:55:30,320
if you were wondering. I was extremely sick for about

956
00:55:30,559 --> 00:55:34,199
probably about twelve days, and thankfully that left. I don't

957
00:55:34,239 --> 00:55:35,719
know what the heck that was. They said it was

958
00:55:35,719 --> 00:55:39,320
a viral infection, and as you can see, I think

959
00:55:39,360 --> 00:55:43,119
I did lose about maybe eight ten pounds. But the

960
00:55:43,119 --> 00:55:45,679
good news is that that's not what Jamie has. So

961
00:55:45,960 --> 00:55:50,519
Jamie just has like normal kind of flu. She has

962
00:55:50,559 --> 00:55:52,800
nothing to do with the stomach. Whatever I had was

963
00:55:52,880 --> 00:55:57,840
all stomach related, and it was legit insane. It was

964
00:55:57,880 --> 00:56:01,159
the most sick I've ever been. I would not wish

965
00:56:01,199 --> 00:56:06,440
that on anybody, and mainly because it was like, imagine,

966
00:56:06,559 --> 00:56:11,800
for maybe three days you literally have to every hour

967
00:56:13,239 --> 00:56:17,920
go to the bathroom, like all throughout the night. It

968
00:56:18,000 --> 00:56:21,760
felt like some kind of get MO Guantanamo Bay torture

969
00:56:21,760 --> 00:56:24,280
where they're like making me go to the bathroom every hour,

970
00:56:24,360 --> 00:56:27,719
and it's just like, can I not catch like three

971
00:56:27,760 --> 00:56:30,400
hours of sleep without getting up? It's just it was awful.

972
00:56:30,599 --> 00:56:34,320
It was the It was the worst. And that's why

973
00:56:34,360 --> 00:56:37,039
I didn't do the Brohemian Grove event. I was looking

974
00:56:37,079 --> 00:56:38,400
forward to that. We're gonna have a lot of fun

975
00:56:38,440 --> 00:56:41,880
doing that. It wasn't gonna be just cringe corps. We

976
00:56:41,880 --> 00:56:44,320
were gonna do like pot live podcasts and you know,

977
00:56:44,440 --> 00:56:49,719
joking around, and I mean this all kicked in when

978
00:56:49,800 --> 00:56:53,480
I got there. It was crazy, like we went drove

979
00:56:53,519 --> 00:56:57,280
over to Tampa or no around Orlando, excuse me, and

980
00:56:57,320 --> 00:56:59,320
we went to this barbecue place. I had like two

981
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:02,400
bites of bar I was like, uh, I was already sick,

982
00:57:02,440 --> 00:57:08,840
so it wasn't the barbecue. But man, I mean there's

983
00:57:09,039 --> 00:57:12,280
some kind of stomach thing going around. If you if

984
00:57:12,280 --> 00:57:15,320
you get this, you will know it was the worst.

985
00:57:15,880 --> 00:57:19,119
But maybe because I have like weak, weak gut issues,

986
00:57:19,159 --> 00:57:21,000
Like maybe maybe it was ten times worse for me

987
00:57:21,119 --> 00:57:23,760
because I have you know, weak gut or something. But

988
00:57:24,039 --> 00:57:31,320
man or man, it was just it was insane. The

989
00:57:31,360 --> 00:57:34,119
worst thing was just not being able to get like

990
00:57:34,280 --> 00:57:36,760
more than like a couple hours of sleep. That was

991
00:57:36,800 --> 00:57:40,599
the worst part. Anyway, nobody wants to hear about that.

992
00:57:43,679 --> 00:57:45,719
I guess it kind of is relevant though, because it's like,

993
00:57:46,440 --> 00:57:48,679
what the heck was this? You know what I mean?

994
00:57:48,760 --> 00:57:52,440
Like if it's a viral infection supposedly was what the

995
00:57:52,480 --> 00:57:56,360
doctor said, like, then that must be going around and

996
00:57:56,400 --> 00:57:58,760
if man, if that was like if a lot of

997
00:57:58,760 --> 00:58:00,639
people got what I got, and I would shut the

998
00:58:00,639 --> 00:58:02,639
country down. I mean I'm not literally saying that there's

999
00:58:02,639 --> 00:58:06,039
a conspiracy to do a new you know, coof part two,

1000
00:58:06,719 --> 00:58:09,320
but good grief, dude, Like if you got this damn

1001
00:58:09,440 --> 00:58:12,960
gut AIDS or like you know, bubble guts it bobbla

1002
00:58:13,039 --> 00:58:16,320
that I had, I could see that shutting the country

1003
00:58:16,320 --> 00:58:19,360
down because like nobody can run anything, and all of

1004
00:58:19,400 --> 00:58:23,000
the sewage plants would be like bursting over exploding with diarrhea.

1005
00:58:23,239 --> 00:58:26,679
It'd be crazy. The country was shut down from damn diarrhea, dude,

1006
00:58:26,960 --> 00:58:31,400
bubble guts would be it would be the bubble gut

1007
00:58:32,039 --> 00:58:35,840
apocalypse of the country. We wouldn't be able to function.

1008
00:58:37,039 --> 00:58:40,039
All the water sewage plants were shut down right.

1009
00:58:39,960 --> 00:58:46,400
Speaker 22: Away, and then the the Russians and the Chinese whuld

1010
00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:49,639
come in and just like that Boomer neocon they called

1011
00:58:49,679 --> 00:58:52,440
in a minute ago, right, he would be vindicated because

1012
00:58:52,440 --> 00:58:54,039
he'd be like, yes, finally.

1013
00:58:55,199 --> 00:58:57,639
Speaker 2: Proof the Russians are going to take over the world.

1014
00:58:57,960 --> 00:59:00,559
KGB is going to the KGB is given us bubble

1015
00:59:00,599 --> 00:59:06,840
guts to bring in koof Part two Quasi Monkey two

1016
00:59:06,880 --> 00:59:09,760
dollars twenty two cents. In Washington, d C. There really

1017
00:59:09,840 --> 00:59:13,880
is full is a really full on Masonic architecture. Yeah,

1018
00:59:13,920 --> 00:59:16,000
like you didn't know this. Not trying to be mean,

1019
00:59:16,079 --> 00:59:19,880
I'm just saying, like, bro, you didn't know that Washington.

1020
00:59:20,119 --> 00:59:27,480
This is like conspiracy one on one dog Jamie has done.

1021
00:59:28,599 --> 00:59:31,840
She actually just recently did a talk on her rockfin

1022
00:59:32,760 --> 00:59:36,320
not from a conspiracy book, from a mainline history book, Okay,

1023
00:59:37,000 --> 00:59:40,599
on the Masonic architecture of Washington.

1024
00:59:40,360 --> 00:59:40,559
Speaker 5: D C.

1025
00:59:40,800 --> 00:59:44,480
Speaker 2: So this isn't even it's not even like a conspiracy theory.

1026
00:59:44,519 --> 00:59:48,000
Now there's a bunch of idiot conspiracy people who read

1027
00:59:48,039 --> 00:59:51,960
all kinds of gibberish nonsense into this. But no, this

1028
00:59:52,079 --> 00:59:59,480
is absolutely legit. And that's because they have like giant

1029
00:59:59,519 --> 01:00:01,960
Masonic monuments everywhere. If you've been to DC, I mean

1030
01:00:02,000 --> 01:00:08,719
there's Masonic stuff everywhere, like Masonic Temple, you know, the

1031
01:00:08,719 --> 01:00:13,559
the giant Masonic memorial right there to George Washington. This

1032
01:00:13,599 --> 01:00:16,639
is it. So here's the book Jamie read, Secret Architecture

1033
01:00:16,679 --> 01:00:19,960
of the Nation's Capital. It's not a conspiracy book. She's

1034
01:00:20,000 --> 01:00:24,840
a mainline history architecture book. So she just did a

1035
01:00:24,880 --> 01:00:27,239
talk on this book. By the way, I was proud

1036
01:00:27,280 --> 01:00:29,239
of her. She read like a five hundred page book

1037
01:00:29,280 --> 01:00:33,639
on this architecture. It's crazy. So when Jamie takes her chalk,

1038
01:00:34,280 --> 01:00:37,920
she becomes a machine, a reading machine. Very proud of her.

1039
01:00:39,400 --> 01:00:43,480
So yeah, absolutely, you bet it's Masonic. Raphael one Dollar,

1040
01:00:43,519 --> 01:00:47,039
could you explain your idea of ether? How does it

1041
01:00:47,079 --> 01:00:51,079
work as a connection to mind and matter? Yeah, I

1042
01:00:51,079 --> 01:00:52,719
mean I wrote about I wrote stuff on that like

1043
01:00:52,760 --> 01:00:54,800
ten years ago, when I was a lot more speculative

1044
01:00:54,800 --> 01:00:58,239
in my views. I'm definitely open to the possibility of ether.

1045
01:00:58,480 --> 01:01:02,119
As an element or some you know, subtle matter or

1046
01:01:02,280 --> 01:01:05,960
or the makeup of the noetic realm. I guess that's possible,

1047
01:01:07,039 --> 01:01:11,320
but I don't really have any arguments as to, you know,

1048
01:01:11,360 --> 01:01:13,480
like to like strictly prove that or whatever. I just

1049
01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:17,199
think it's very plausible, and so some of the essays,

1050
01:01:17,239 --> 01:01:19,079
like in the Metainaritius book, I think I talked about

1051
01:01:19,079 --> 01:01:20,920
ether and a couple of those. I caught him out

1052
01:01:20,920 --> 01:01:24,079
five dollars. I had a Protestant comment on one of

1053
01:01:24,079 --> 01:01:29,440
my videos about megachurches. They say, I'm dumb because he

1054
01:01:29,519 --> 01:01:32,280
studied church history and he wants to know why Orthodox

1055
01:01:32,320 --> 01:01:37,159
don't believe in laying on of hands. Excuse me, Like,

1056
01:01:37,480 --> 01:01:39,719
of course we do. What are you talking about? Like literally,

1057
01:01:39,800 --> 01:01:43,679
the laying on of hands occurs to ordain anyone in

1058
01:01:43,760 --> 01:01:48,519
the Orthodox clergy, so we do. Now, we don't believe

1059
01:01:48,559 --> 01:01:51,760
in it like he does, because he probably has some

1060
01:01:51,840 --> 01:01:55,159
goofy prozes an idea that like everybody has the power

1061
01:01:55,239 --> 01:01:58,159
to do charismatic gibb or jibb or whatever he thinks

1062
01:01:59,159 --> 01:02:03,880
Orthodox churches. As an Orthodox priest do believe in exorcism.

1063
01:02:04,000 --> 01:02:05,559
I thought you would find that funny. Yes, I do.

1064
01:02:05,679 --> 01:02:09,199
By the way, I mean, Orthodox churches do anointing for

1065
01:02:09,239 --> 01:02:15,199
the sick. So I remember hearing a remember when time

1066
01:02:15,280 --> 01:02:18,079
was as I was hearing a charismatic talk. I had

1067
01:02:18,119 --> 01:02:19,440
a brief phase for like a year of being a

1068
01:02:19,480 --> 01:02:21,719
charismatic when I was like nineteen, right, I was at

1069
01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:24,800
some charismatic church one time, maybe Assemblies of God. I

1070
01:02:24,800 --> 01:02:27,840
forget what, and I remember the preacher was talking about

1071
01:02:27,840 --> 01:02:31,159
how you know, the Book of James, the New Testament

1072
01:02:31,159 --> 01:02:34,320
talks about an anointing with oil, and no churches do

1073
01:02:34,440 --> 01:02:38,960
this except certain charismatic churches. And I remember, I think

1074
01:02:38,960 --> 01:02:40,760
that's pretty interesting. Yeah, the Baptist I go to the

1075
01:02:40,760 --> 01:02:45,920
Baptist church. Nobody gets annointed with oil. I'm trying to

1076
01:02:45,920 --> 01:02:49,639
think about. I mean, I guess Catholics kind of do

1077
01:02:49,760 --> 01:02:57,159
this with Christmation or confirmation, but I don't. Again, I

1078
01:02:57,239 --> 01:03:00,880
may just be misremembering my trad novus or days, so

1079
01:03:01,639 --> 01:03:03,519
you can correct me if I'm wrong about this. It's

1080
01:03:03,559 --> 01:03:07,440
been many years, but I don't think Roman Catholics do

1081
01:03:08,920 --> 01:03:12,360
anointing of the sick. Maybe I'm wrong, Maybe they do,

1082
01:03:12,400 --> 01:03:15,000
and I just don't remember. But I remember thinking as

1083
01:03:15,039 --> 01:03:17,159
a charismatic, like, oh yeah, that's a good argument. How

1084
01:03:17,159 --> 01:03:20,000
come nobody else does this? But then, of course orthodox

1085
01:03:20,159 --> 01:03:22,480
you fall D five dollars. Thank you so much, Lambda

1086
01:03:22,760 --> 01:03:26,760
three five. If you lived in Europe, would you move

1087
01:03:26,760 --> 01:03:31,079
away somewhere safe because of a Third World War? Bro

1088
01:03:31,360 --> 01:03:34,559
I've only been to Italy once and the UK once,

1089
01:03:34,719 --> 01:03:38,119
so I don't really know what it's like living in Europe.

1090
01:03:38,119 --> 01:03:40,840
I know FDA lived in Europe for a while, lived

1091
01:03:40,880 --> 01:03:46,920
in Ireland. Falcons have no issue with the Third World War.

1092
01:03:47,000 --> 01:03:49,639
I don't know what that means. Falcons to my football teams.

1093
01:03:50,400 --> 01:03:52,199
If you're in America here the Falcons, it's like a

1094
01:03:52,199 --> 01:03:54,280
football team or something. I don't know. I loved your

1095
01:03:54,280 --> 01:03:56,199
interview that you did with Britney Selner. Oh, thank you

1096
01:03:56,199 --> 01:04:01,599
appreciate that. Yeah, she's you should ask them because her

1097
01:04:01,880 --> 01:04:05,559
husband Martin and her you know, they are active in

1098
01:04:06,119 --> 01:04:10,360
conservative politics in Austria and they would be a much

1099
01:04:10,400 --> 01:04:14,239
better person to ask about, like whether it's worth staying

1100
01:04:14,239 --> 01:04:17,079
in Europe or not. But you know, I don't know.

1101
01:04:17,119 --> 01:04:20,840
I can say friend ninety nine two to one, whatever

1102
01:04:20,840 --> 01:04:22,920
happened to Ruche? I hope he's good. Yeah, I haven't

1103
01:04:22,920 --> 01:04:24,639
heard from Rush in probably a couple of years. I

1104
01:04:24,719 --> 01:04:27,760
think I texted him maybe two two and a half

1105
01:04:27,840 --> 01:04:33,920
years ago, and I'm assuming that he probably just chose to,

1106
01:04:35,320 --> 01:04:39,800
you know, live a quiet parish life, which is totally cool.

1107
01:04:39,840 --> 01:04:44,280
He probably felt like, uh, you know, social media stuff.

1108
01:04:44,280 --> 01:04:47,119
Maybe it was too much of a temptation or you

1109
01:04:47,119 --> 01:04:50,320
know whatever, it could be anything like that. I imagine I

1110
01:04:50,320 --> 01:04:52,239
haven't heard anything bad, but I don't know what's what

1111
01:04:52,280 --> 01:04:54,840
he's been up to. He kind of seemed to want

1112
01:04:54,880 --> 01:04:57,960
to be off the grid. But of course, you know,

1113
01:04:58,000 --> 01:04:59,400
if he if he wanted to reach out, he coul

1114
01:04:59,400 --> 01:05:00,880
always reach out to me. If he don't know if

1115
01:05:00,880 --> 01:05:02,960
he sees any of these podcasts, probably doesn't. He probably

1116
01:05:03,000 --> 01:05:05,559
just stays off the internet. But that would be my guess.

1117
01:05:05,639 --> 01:05:07,199
But I'm sure I haven't heard anything bad, so I

1118
01:05:07,280 --> 01:05:11,840
assume he's still just living quiet parishal life. Matthew fifty dollars,

1119
01:05:12,159 --> 01:05:16,199
Thank you, Jay. Two quick questions. Can you explain the

1120
01:05:16,199 --> 01:05:18,639
merit of the saints and why we as Orthodox rejected? Yeah,

1121
01:05:18,639 --> 01:05:21,199
actually we uh, we had a conversation about this the

1122
01:05:21,239 --> 01:05:25,320
other night with a bunch of our Orthodox buds after

1123
01:05:25,360 --> 01:05:28,760
the Icon conference FDA. Was there a lot of Roman

1124
01:05:28,760 --> 01:05:32,079
Catholics don't know that this is actually part of their dogma. Right,

1125
01:05:32,880 --> 01:05:37,039
it's not really stressed or emphasized nowadays by you know,

1126
01:05:37,079 --> 01:05:41,519
the Vatican superstructure. Trads are still kind of into it

1127
01:05:41,559 --> 01:05:45,920
because they're interested in plenary indulgences and obtaining indulgences by

1128
01:05:45,920 --> 01:05:50,519
this or that devotion or whatever. But so so, strictly speaking,

1129
01:05:50,679 --> 01:05:54,360
indulgences has to do with the temporal debts that are

1130
01:05:54,360 --> 01:05:58,400
accrued from our sins. So in the Roman Catholic system,

1131
01:05:58,559 --> 01:06:00,920
they're they're going to argue that, well, in the early Church,

1132
01:06:01,000 --> 01:06:04,559
there were these canonical penalties that if you committed this

1133
01:06:04,599 --> 01:06:08,519
with that sin, you would be banned from coming to

1134
01:06:08,960 --> 01:06:12,559
the Eucharist. So, for example, you cheated on your wife.

1135
01:06:12,599 --> 01:06:15,639
In the fourth century, it was pretty common that a

1136
01:06:15,679 --> 01:06:18,880
bishop would say you're not going to commune for five years,

1137
01:06:19,119 --> 01:06:22,559
seven years, something like this. Right, so serious sin, you're

1138
01:06:22,599 --> 01:06:26,480
banned from the chalice for X amount of years. At

1139
01:06:26,519 --> 01:06:30,519
that time, what would happen is that if people showed

1140
01:06:30,719 --> 01:06:33,760
visible signs of repentance, maybe they're on their knees outside

1141
01:06:33,760 --> 01:06:36,039
the church for the entire liturgy for a couple of

1142
01:06:36,119 --> 01:06:39,320
years or something like this. Pretty intense stuff. The bishop

1143
01:06:39,360 --> 01:06:43,719
could commute the sentence of you being banned from the chalice.

1144
01:06:44,400 --> 01:06:48,159
So you have a temporal debt you see of say

1145
01:06:48,239 --> 01:06:51,280
seven years that you can't come to the chalice. The bishop,

1146
01:06:51,320 --> 01:06:53,679
because he has the office of the keys, has the

1147
01:06:53,719 --> 01:06:58,440
ability to remit the temporal debt. So in the Roman

1148
01:06:58,440 --> 01:07:01,599
Catholic system, remember that every in a cruise both a

1149
01:07:01,599 --> 01:07:06,159
temporal and an eternal punishment. Mortal sends a crew an

1150
01:07:06,199 --> 01:07:10,239
eternal damnation punishment. So for example, you cheat on your wife,

1151
01:07:10,440 --> 01:07:13,280
you go to confession. In the Roman Catholic system, the

1152
01:07:13,320 --> 01:07:18,320
priest absolves you of the eternal debt. However, the priest

1153
01:07:18,360 --> 01:07:22,159
will prescribe for you a penance, and the penance is

1154
01:07:22,199 --> 01:07:26,239
intended to pay the temporal debt that you've accrued. Right,

1155
01:07:26,840 --> 01:07:28,800
and the Roman Catholics will say, well, look, in the

1156
01:07:28,800 --> 01:07:32,920
case of David, David cheated with Bathsheba, had his friend

1157
01:07:33,039 --> 01:07:37,760
Uriah essentially killed, and when David repented, God forgave him,

1158
01:07:38,280 --> 01:07:41,239
but the child would die, and so there was still

1159
01:07:41,280 --> 01:07:45,320
an outstanding temporal debt. Now, I think there as Orthodox

1160
01:07:45,360 --> 01:07:48,639
we could agree that there's temporal chastisements or something like this,

1161
01:07:49,119 --> 01:07:53,639
but we don't really obsess over this bizarre Ledger system

1162
01:07:53,800 --> 01:07:57,239
of debts, and it's like really weird tum Woodick type stuff.

1163
01:07:57,639 --> 01:08:00,960
And Rome totally went with this right. So eventually, by

1164
01:08:00,960 --> 01:08:06,280
the Middle Ages you get very elaborate systems of the debts,

1165
01:08:06,599 --> 01:08:12,199
and the pope has the authority to grant various indulgences

1166
01:08:12,800 --> 01:08:18,119
which pay the temporal debt should you complete these devotions. So,

1167
01:08:18,159 --> 01:08:20,319
for example, if you go to Rome, you will see

1168
01:08:20,920 --> 01:08:24,680
pretty much still in a lot of holy sites and places.

1169
01:08:25,560 --> 01:08:29,159
If you pray on your knees the Via dolrosa or

1170
01:08:29,159 --> 01:08:33,640
whatever at the Pious eleventh chapel, you get a plenary indulgence.

1171
01:08:34,279 --> 01:08:37,800
And so some pope, I don't know, Pious the twelfth

1172
01:08:38,199 --> 01:08:41,920
granted a plenary indulgence of praying the entire Via dolerosa

1173
01:08:41,960 --> 01:08:46,359
on your knees. Other devotions, however, you'll notice in track

1174
01:08:46,439 --> 01:08:51,600
Catholicism usually have some specific days, right the pope has

1175
01:08:51,760 --> 01:08:56,520
granted if you pray this litany you get a five

1176
01:08:56,560 --> 01:09:00,399
hundred day indulgence. And what that means is that if

1177
01:09:00,479 --> 01:09:04,560
you've sent a bunch and you've accrued ten thousand days

1178
01:09:04,600 --> 01:09:07,079
in purgatory as a temporal debt on top of your

1179
01:09:07,079 --> 01:09:07,880
eternal debts.

1180
01:09:08,239 --> 01:09:08,840
Speaker 4: If you go to.

1181
01:09:08,800 --> 01:09:13,640
Speaker 2: Confession and you confess and the eternal debts are forgiven you,

1182
01:09:13,720 --> 01:09:15,760
so you're not damned. If you were to die at

1183
01:09:15,760 --> 01:09:18,319
that moment, you would have a ten thousand day debt

1184
01:09:18,319 --> 01:09:20,920
to pay in purgatory. You see, this is how insane

1185
01:09:20,960 --> 01:09:23,800
the stupid system. Literally, this is how they think. And

1186
01:09:23,840 --> 01:09:26,039
you wonder why they're insane spurgs, Well, this is why

1187
01:09:26,760 --> 01:09:30,600
this is their system. Now it gets even more ridiculous

1188
01:09:31,279 --> 01:09:35,399
because in the Roman Galley system, the saints, in many

1189
01:09:35,439 --> 01:09:40,119
of them, didn't just live exemplary lives to where they

1190
01:09:40,359 --> 01:09:42,920
made the cut to get into heaven. They went above

1191
01:09:42,920 --> 01:09:46,000
and beyond the call of duty such that they contribute

1192
01:09:46,079 --> 01:09:49,359
to the merits of the saints. Now, the Roman Catholicist

1193
01:09:49,359 --> 01:09:51,279
will say, oh, but it's still all by grace, you see.

1194
01:09:51,319 --> 01:09:57,840
So they're gonna still say, oh, the caveat is it's gray. Still,

1195
01:09:57,920 --> 01:09:59,840
that's the merits of the saints. But the saints can

1196
01:09:59,880 --> 01:10:02,119
go above and beyond the duties such that there is

1197
01:10:02,159 --> 01:10:05,319
this vast treasury of the merits of the saints, the

1198
01:10:05,359 --> 01:10:09,680
works of super irrigation, it's called, and those can be

1199
01:10:09,720 --> 01:10:12,319
applied to you out of the treasury of the merits,

1200
01:10:13,000 --> 01:10:14,920
and the Pope, because he has office of the Keys,

1201
01:10:15,359 --> 01:10:17,800
has the ability to apply the treasury of the merits.

1202
01:10:17,800 --> 01:10:21,560
Now again, this is really only pretty much applying to

1203
01:10:21,720 --> 01:10:26,000
the temporal debts, So you can't like use the treasury

1204
01:10:26,039 --> 01:10:28,119
of the merits of the saints to like tap into that.

1205
01:10:28,159 --> 01:10:31,760
Oh if I give, you know, if I write a

1206
01:10:31,840 --> 01:10:35,359
check to Francis for five thousand dollars, this is going

1207
01:10:35,439 --> 01:10:37,800
to get me out of my eternal damnation in my

1208
01:10:37,840 --> 01:10:41,359
ten thousand days of purgatory. Right, it doesn't work like that,

1209
01:10:41,640 --> 01:10:44,880
and every Roman Catholic will be a very snarky know

1210
01:10:45,000 --> 01:10:47,640
it all to correct you if you think that. But

1211
01:10:47,760 --> 01:10:50,600
the absurdity of this is still there because it's like,

1212
01:10:50,640 --> 01:10:52,600
so wait a minute, So I go to confession and

1213
01:10:52,640 --> 01:10:55,720
I'm forgiven of the eternal damnation debts that I owe,

1214
01:10:56,439 --> 01:11:00,680
but there is this tabulation of fourteen teen thousand, four

1215
01:11:00,720 --> 01:11:03,199
hundred and thirty two days. Literally, I mean, we don't know.

1216
01:11:03,359 --> 01:11:05,039
This is the other absurdity that you don't actually know

1217
01:11:05,079 --> 01:11:08,039
what you owe, sort of like the Monty Python skit

1218
01:11:08,079 --> 01:11:10,399
of the Spanish inquisition, Right, they don't know what you're

1219
01:11:10,439 --> 01:11:16,399
being charged with and inquisited about but you are a criminal, right,

1220
01:11:16,439 --> 01:11:18,079
so you don't know how many days. It could be

1221
01:11:18,079 --> 01:11:20,800
one hundred and forty two thousand days in purgatory. It

1222
01:11:20,840 --> 01:11:24,119
could be seven hundred and thirty three thousand days in purgatory.

1223
01:11:25,720 --> 01:11:28,960
It could be four hundred and forty four days of

1224
01:11:29,000 --> 01:11:33,479
you being you know, frozen and burned for that. I mean,

1225
01:11:33,479 --> 01:11:39,439
it's just so preposterous. God is paid by you burning

1226
01:11:39,520 --> 01:11:44,079
in a spiritual created fire for the temporal debts. I mean,

1227
01:11:44,079 --> 01:11:46,279
no wonder people in this would leave this and become

1228
01:11:46,319 --> 01:11:49,000
ath if this is like atheism factory one ozer. This

1229
01:11:49,079 --> 01:11:53,640
is like early this is like ancient Megachurch atheism right here.

1230
01:11:53,720 --> 01:11:58,960
It's just so preposterous. And this is traditional Catholicism now

1231
01:11:59,119 --> 01:12:04,479
Today's Vatican and being very liberalized and Protestantized, they don't

1232
01:12:04,520 --> 01:12:07,279
talk about a lot of this because they know it's stupid.

1233
01:12:07,880 --> 01:12:12,319
It's preposterous. It's clown church to think this way. It's

1234
01:12:12,359 --> 01:12:19,319
the most absurd spurgatism five thousand Talmudic bean counting. I mean,

1235
01:12:19,560 --> 01:12:23,600
the tradcats who do this stuff, they go beyond the rabbis.

1236
01:12:23,840 --> 01:12:26,479
They're worse than the rabbis that they're always fussing about

1237
01:12:27,159 --> 01:12:29,039
this is how bad the tradcats are. This is so

1238
01:12:29,119 --> 01:12:33,399
stupid it is. Are you there? Do you want to

1239
01:12:33,439 --> 01:12:33,840
say something?

1240
01:12:35,319 --> 01:12:36,319
Speaker 4: What was the term?

1241
01:12:36,800 --> 01:12:37,399
Speaker 15: Came up with?

1242
01:12:40,800 --> 01:12:44,359
Speaker 7: Super abundant papist bitcoin for sale? You guys need to

1243
01:12:44,359 --> 01:12:45,359
invest right now?

1244
01:12:46,119 --> 01:12:48,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's funny. I did a song about that, like

1245
01:12:48,920 --> 01:12:50,760
bitcoin in Heaven and how do I tap into the

1246
01:12:50,760 --> 01:12:53,119
bitcoin treasury in heaven? Like the do the Saints have

1247
01:12:53,119 --> 01:12:55,800
a bitcoin treasury of merits and heaven? Exactly?

1248
01:12:56,399 --> 01:13:00,880
Speaker 7: We've got Jeremy Bentham Hedonic bigcoin for you. We have

1249
01:13:01,760 --> 01:13:12,359
qu on Coin, we have papus ethereal super abundant bitcoin. Yeah,

1250
01:13:11,760 --> 01:13:17,840
we got it all, all all heretical bitcoin for sale right.

1251
01:13:20,039 --> 01:13:24,880
Speaker 2: Exactly. Now you think I'm joking, I'm not. You can

1252
01:13:24,920 --> 01:13:27,840
go look up in Roman Catholic theology what they mean

1253
01:13:27,880 --> 01:13:31,640
by works of super irrigation and this is the going

1254
01:13:31,680 --> 01:13:34,479
above and beyond the treasury or the call of duty.

1255
01:13:35,119 --> 01:13:37,760
And uh, this becomes a basis for the idea of

1256
01:13:37,800 --> 01:13:40,039
the treasury of merits of the Saints. And then because

1257
01:13:40,039 --> 01:13:41,800
the Pope has the keys, he can, as we said,

1258
01:13:41,840 --> 01:13:46,000
apply this to anybody who does these this. This is

1259
01:13:46,039 --> 01:13:49,520
so stupid. I can't believe people buy into this.

1260
01:13:49,760 --> 01:13:52,000
Speaker 15: It's so proposed how it's all formula.

1261
01:13:52,239 --> 01:13:54,159
Speaker 2: It's all mechanical formulaic.

1262
01:13:54,319 --> 01:13:56,000
Speaker 15: It's like balance the equation.

1263
01:13:56,680 --> 01:14:00,000
Speaker 7: And because when I was asking the Roman Catholic bishop

1264
01:14:00,119 --> 01:14:03,359
up here about I think the students were but it

1265
01:14:03,399 --> 01:14:08,439
was interesting your response that, oh, well, you know your

1266
01:14:08,479 --> 01:14:11,439
sins are forgiven, but the equation.

1267
01:14:11,199 --> 01:14:12,960
Speaker 15: Has to be balanced out in purgatory.

1268
01:14:14,479 --> 01:14:15,479
Speaker 5: I'm like, this is great.

1269
01:14:16,359 --> 01:14:18,800
Speaker 7: I think the analogy was your neighbor forgives you for

1270
01:14:18,840 --> 01:14:21,279
breaking the window, but now you've got to pay for

1271
01:14:21,359 --> 01:14:24,079
it and make it right. So there's like some type

1272
01:14:24,119 --> 01:14:27,119
of cosmic formula that you have to enter in the

1273
01:14:27,199 --> 01:14:29,359
right numbers and everything has to be balanced out.

1274
01:14:31,520 --> 01:14:32,760
Speaker 15: Odd, isn't it.

1275
01:14:34,199 --> 01:14:35,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was just trying to look for in the

1276
01:14:35,840 --> 01:14:40,560
Catholic encyclopedia with their discussion of now note you'll see

1277
01:14:40,560 --> 01:14:43,079
that they do not various sections of Denzinger. So this

1278
01:14:43,159 --> 01:14:45,600
is part of Catholic dogma. This is not like I

1279
01:14:45,640 --> 01:14:47,119
don't have to believe it. I don't have to believe

1280
01:14:47,119 --> 01:14:49,159
that I'm a Catholic, and I don't have to believe it.

1281
01:14:49,239 --> 01:14:51,760
Yes you do. Now maybe if you're a Novisorio Catholic,

1282
01:14:51,800 --> 01:14:54,000
you believe whatever you want. But if you're a traditional Catholic,

1283
01:14:54,079 --> 01:14:57,560
you do have to believe in the works of super irrigation,

1284
01:14:57,760 --> 01:14:59,119
the merits of the same. In other words, if you

1285
01:14:59,159 --> 01:15:02,680
deny this, you'll be denying the idea of the merits

1286
01:15:02,680 --> 01:15:06,840
of the saints, basically the teachings of Trent, because the

1287
01:15:07,199 --> 01:15:11,359
Reformers objected to these things. You see, this is I'm

1288
01:15:11,399 --> 01:15:13,640
not saying that Martin Luther's right about everything, but Martin

1289
01:15:13,720 --> 01:15:17,239
Luther is objecting to this idea, and so his answer

1290
01:15:17,359 --> 01:15:20,279
running to the opposite extreme of you know, solo fid

1291
01:15:20,279 --> 01:15:23,680
a justification by faith alone is an opposite extreme. But

1292
01:15:23,760 --> 01:15:27,279
what he's objecting to is itself just completely stupid. This

1293
01:15:27,399 --> 01:15:30,800
is crazy, and I think everybody can kind of sense this.

1294
01:15:31,439 --> 01:15:33,279
I mean, just look at the way Jesus talks about

1295
01:15:33,319 --> 01:15:37,720
how the Pharisees treat religion. Is this not exactly what

1296
01:15:37,880 --> 01:15:40,239
the Roman Catholics are doing with this stupid treasury of

1297
01:15:40,279 --> 01:15:42,359
merits and works of I mean, as obvious it is anyway.

1298
01:15:42,840 --> 01:15:49,720
So Orthodoxy does not see the relationship between the believer

1299
01:15:50,079 --> 01:15:55,399
and Christ as this talmudic being being counting type of thing.

1300
01:15:55,920 --> 01:15:59,359
We see it as a relationship, as a relationship of

1301
01:15:59,399 --> 01:16:03,720
love and what relationship of love between God and man

1302
01:16:03,800 --> 01:16:06,239
or between man and spouse, right, the analogy of the

1303
01:16:06,319 --> 01:16:09,920
church and Christ as a bride would would imagine treating

1304
01:16:09,920 --> 01:16:12,479
your wife like this, and we would. There's a lot

1305
01:16:12,479 --> 01:16:14,359
a lot of spergs out there that would actually do this,

1306
01:16:14,560 --> 01:16:17,399
like keep a ledger of what my wife owes me

1307
01:16:17,439 --> 01:16:20,920
four hundred and thirty two thousand good works and actions

1308
01:16:20,920 --> 01:16:23,640
of service this week, because I have tabulated it all

1309
01:16:23,800 --> 01:16:29,039
and uh she it's like just crazy crazy, But that's

1310
01:16:29,039 --> 01:16:32,880
how these people think, like they actually think, like I'm

1311
01:16:32,880 --> 01:16:36,880
going to keep a tabulation of like wife duties that

1312
01:16:36,960 --> 01:16:40,840
she owes me four hundred and thirty two service actions.

1313
01:16:41,479 --> 01:16:44,119
I mean you see how you see how for a relationship,

1314
01:16:44,159 --> 01:16:47,399
How dumb that is, how just it's just not it's

1315
01:16:47,840 --> 01:16:51,840
it's unnatural and it's inhuman. It's like the way robots think.

1316
01:16:52,319 --> 01:16:55,359
And this is why Spurgs love track Catholicism because it's

1317
01:16:55,359 --> 01:17:00,560
a perfect religion for like robot kids, little roboboys who

1318
01:17:00,600 --> 01:17:06,119
think that the world is a giant algorithm or something. Anyway,

1319
01:17:06,960 --> 01:17:10,079
do we consider code, yeah, exactly.

1320
01:17:10,399 --> 01:17:12,640
Speaker 15: Do we consider flow chart?

1321
01:17:12,920 --> 01:17:15,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, with a flow chart. There's that great meme that

1322
01:17:15,359 --> 01:17:17,399
somebody made a long time ago about making fun of

1323
01:17:17,399 --> 01:17:20,800
track Catholicism, like it's a Dungeons and Dungeons role playing

1324
01:17:20,800 --> 01:17:23,680
game with all these like crazy, like a giant chart.

1325
01:17:23,720 --> 01:17:25,039
It was a great meme. I can never find it.

1326
01:17:25,039 --> 01:17:29,000
But do we consider that those are non orthodox to

1327
01:17:29,119 --> 01:17:32,880
have faith? Well, we don't judge individuals, but we do

1328
01:17:32,920 --> 01:17:36,600
speak of their confessions in general as being heterodox. Right,

1329
01:17:36,640 --> 01:17:40,239
so we would say, oh, that charismatic churches or beliefs

1330
01:17:40,279 --> 01:17:44,640
systems are not even properly speaking, churches, their parachurches, their sects.

1331
01:17:45,479 --> 01:17:48,359
They may have some things right, and we certainly can't

1332
01:17:48,399 --> 01:17:50,399
say that the Holy Spirit has no relationship or no

1333
01:17:50,520 --> 01:17:52,760
work in those people, but we can't say that they

1334
01:17:52,840 --> 01:17:54,840
are part of the church or that they have the faith.

1335
01:17:55,239 --> 01:17:57,239
If God has the means, and he does. God has

1336
01:17:57,279 --> 01:18:01,279
the means by which he can unite people in non

1337
01:18:01,359 --> 01:18:03,520
normal ways to the Body of Christ, which is the

1338
01:18:03,600 --> 01:18:06,159
Orthodox Church. He can do that, but we're not told

1339
01:18:06,199 --> 01:18:08,319
how he does that or when he does that, and

1340
01:18:08,359 --> 01:18:12,640
we can't de facto say, which would be the accumunous mistake. Oh, well,

1341
01:18:12,680 --> 01:18:14,560
they're all Christians too, and they're all part of the church.

1342
01:18:15,039 --> 01:18:19,640
That would be a violation of orthodox ecclesiology. Mom's world

1343
01:18:19,920 --> 01:18:23,840
should have been e Mom's world. Five dollars? Here's bitcoin?

1344
01:18:24,640 --> 01:18:29,239
Should I buy bitcoin or Funko pops? Hmm, tough investment

1345
01:18:29,760 --> 01:18:33,319
decision making their sit I'm gonna go ahead and say

1346
01:18:33,359 --> 01:18:39,359
that the currency of the future number one garbage pail kids,

1347
01:18:39,600 --> 01:18:44,479
number two Funko pops. So bitcoin going to zero, Funko

1348
01:18:44,560 --> 01:18:48,000
Pops taking over the world. That's a joke, by the way,

1349
01:18:48,119 --> 01:18:52,560
for somebody believes me, Joseph, five dollars. Is it true

1350
01:18:52,560 --> 01:18:55,079
that bitcoin is a bad investment because there's a finite

1351
01:18:55,159 --> 01:18:58,359
amount of it? No, that's precisely what you want in

1352
01:18:58,479 --> 01:19:04,680
terms of an asset. Every monetary system requires it to

1353
01:19:04,800 --> 01:19:08,119
be in some way rare, because if something is ever

1354
01:19:08,279 --> 01:19:12,680
present everywhere, it has no value. Right, So sand sand

1355
01:19:12,720 --> 01:19:15,800
is not a very good money system because there anybody

1356
01:19:15,840 --> 01:19:18,920
can go get sand. Gold worked for a very long

1357
01:19:18,960 --> 01:19:23,880
time because gold is fairly rare. What about quantum computing

1358
01:19:23,920 --> 01:19:27,000
breaking the encryption? This is all in the realm of

1359
01:19:27,319 --> 01:19:30,920
theoretical stuff. And you can go watch many videos by

1360
01:19:31,000 --> 01:19:36,119
bitcoin experts responding to the quantum computing objection. This is

1361
01:19:36,159 --> 01:19:38,199
all sci fi stuff. We don't even know if this

1362
01:19:38,239 --> 01:19:42,760
can really ever occur, and presumably also the encryption can

1363
01:19:42,880 --> 01:19:47,279
evolve and get better as computing gets better. So no,

1364
01:19:47,399 --> 01:19:49,880
I don't necessarily think that that would happen. By the way,

1365
01:19:49,920 --> 01:19:54,520
if quantum computing breaks bitcoin encryption, we got much much

1366
01:19:54,560 --> 01:19:58,680
bigger problems than Bitcoin. I mean, that's essentially going to

1367
01:19:58,720 --> 01:20:02,000
mean that, like all the ICBMs or I mean, the

1368
01:20:02,039 --> 01:20:04,560
whole world is going to collapse if that happens. It's

1369
01:20:04,600 --> 01:20:07,279
not going to be just a monetary problem. Why do

1370
01:20:07,399 --> 01:20:09,920
people say this, Well, people say this because it's called fud.

1371
01:20:10,319 --> 01:20:13,199
Fud is fear and certainty and doubt. And if you've

1372
01:20:13,199 --> 01:20:16,119
been into crypto for many years or even to the

1373
01:20:16,119 --> 01:20:20,079
earlier days of bitcoin, you'll notice that the same fud

1374
01:20:20,439 --> 01:20:24,680
has recycled since the beginning of bitcoin. And what are

1375
01:20:24,680 --> 01:20:27,840
the fuds that we always hear? The government will ban it,

1376
01:20:27,840 --> 01:20:30,359
it uses too much energy and it's bad for the environment.

1377
01:20:31,000 --> 01:20:34,000
Quantum computing will crack it and will be destroyed. Bitcoin's

1378
01:20:34,039 --> 01:20:36,119
going to zero because of the Ponzi scheme and a scam.

1379
01:20:36,119 --> 01:20:40,199
It's not best on anything real. China is going to

1380
01:20:40,279 --> 01:20:44,399
destroy and take over bitcoin. What else is the fud?

1381
01:20:45,239 --> 01:20:47,880
There's some secret thing that the n sake and CI

1382
01:20:48,039 --> 01:20:53,239
created it. They really want bitcoin because it's a phase

1383
01:20:53,279 --> 01:20:56,680
before the CBDC. All of these are really stupid arguments,

1384
01:20:56,720 --> 01:20:59,520
and I've heard almost all of them since I first

1385
01:20:59,720 --> 01:21:03,119
so in twenty fifteen, when I was first exposed to bitcoin,

1386
01:21:03,279 --> 01:21:07,479
I heard these dumb arguments and fell for them, I thought,

1387
01:21:07,720 --> 01:21:10,199
and I even wrote an article back in twenty fifteen

1388
01:21:10,520 --> 01:21:16,039
against bitcoin because I just assumed, with my default conspiracy setting,

1389
01:21:16,479 --> 01:21:18,720
oh this has to be blah blah blah blah blah,

1390
01:21:18,800 --> 01:21:21,000
and I utilize a lot of these dumb arguments. That

1391
01:21:21,840 --> 01:21:26,279
is just the normy fud going around now. Strictly speaking, yes,

1392
01:21:26,359 --> 01:21:28,840
this is a genetic fallacy. But just for the sake

1393
01:21:28,880 --> 01:21:34,239
of practicality, who has been saying all of this this fud?

1394
01:21:34,680 --> 01:21:39,000
Oh the establishment? Bill Gates pushes all this stuff. Hillary

1395
01:21:39,039 --> 01:21:42,760
pushes all this We just saw no Yevol Harari like

1396
01:21:42,760 --> 01:21:43,600
a month ago.

1397
01:21:43,640 --> 01:21:48,720
Speaker 23: Bitcoin is a currency based on distrust. We don't need

1398
01:21:49,399 --> 01:21:54,039
we need a currency based around trust and control.

1399
01:21:55,159 --> 01:21:58,840
Speaker 2: Literally, you've got no Yevol Harari saying hates bitcoin. Literally,

1400
01:21:58,840 --> 01:22:01,199
Bill Gates is, I don't really wish be a cooin.

1401
01:22:01,239 --> 01:22:03,119
Hotn't be an invented at all. I wish you would

1402
01:22:03,119 --> 01:22:06,319
go back and get a coin. I mean, it's not

1403
01:22:06,479 --> 01:22:10,680
rocket science. Not everything is six hundred and sixty six

1404
01:22:10,720 --> 01:22:14,800
dimensional chess. Guys. The biggest mistake a lot of people

1405
01:22:14,800 --> 01:22:18,319
in our sphere make is overthinking and over analyzing and

1406
01:22:18,399 --> 01:22:24,399
over conspiracy theorizing. Yes there's conspiracies, Yes there's geopolitical machinations,

1407
01:22:24,439 --> 01:22:29,079
and foreign countries do espionage. Yeah, of course, But for

1408
01:22:29,159 --> 01:22:32,119
so long I've seen people in the conspiracy fere sphere

1409
01:22:32,600 --> 01:22:36,760
make dumb mistakes over and over and over. Because everything

1410
01:22:36,840 --> 01:22:39,439
is now a conspiracy. Everything is part of the over

1411
01:22:39,520 --> 01:22:41,199
It's a game within a game within a game. With again,

1412
01:22:41,239 --> 01:22:43,359
they're all everything's a conspiracy. They're trying to trick you.

1413
01:22:45,520 --> 01:22:47,520
And this is just simply not true. It's not reality.

1414
01:22:47,600 --> 01:22:52,640
Not everything is planned and gained by a super cabal.

1415
01:22:54,319 --> 01:22:58,640
Not everything is faking gray. It's just dumb. It's also

1416
01:22:58,680 --> 01:23:01,439
two forms of fallacies the way, which we've covered many times.

1417
01:23:01,920 --> 01:23:05,399
It is the gambler's fallacy in the Texas sharpshooter fallacy.

1418
01:23:05,640 --> 01:23:16,600
Those two fallacies are omnipresent in the conspiracy sphere. Just

1419
01:23:16,680 --> 01:23:20,000
because something happened in the past does not mean that

1420
01:23:20,039 --> 01:23:23,840
this new event is part of that. It may be,

1421
01:23:25,159 --> 01:23:27,680
but you understand that that's a fallacy to assume that

1422
01:23:28,000 --> 01:23:32,680
because event occurred after other events and there's similar patterns,

1423
01:23:32,840 --> 01:23:37,680
therefore necessarily this new event is those other events. It

1424
01:23:37,720 --> 01:23:44,039
may be or it may not be. Just because Michael

1425
01:23:44,119 --> 01:23:47,760
Saylor is involved in crafting some paper in the nineties

1426
01:23:48,039 --> 01:23:53,560
at MIT about a digital dollar, it does not follow

1427
01:23:53,640 --> 01:23:56,479
from that that Bitcoin is that and is a creation

1428
01:23:56,680 --> 01:24:00,319
of the CIA, because guess what, Bitcoin is not a

1429
01:24:00,359 --> 01:24:03,920
digital dollar. And I'm not dissing my friend who is.

1430
01:24:04,880 --> 01:24:06,880
I don't at all fault him because we all have

1431
01:24:07,039 --> 01:24:09,640
heard and I fell for a lot of these flood

1432
01:24:09,760 --> 01:24:14,520
arguments years ago. But then when I figured out that's

1433
01:24:14,520 --> 01:24:19,359
a false equivalence. Bitcoin is not a digital dollar. It

1434
01:24:19,399 --> 01:24:23,399
has some similarities as an electronic currency, but it is

1435
01:24:23,439 --> 01:24:27,600
not a digital dollar. The dollar is fiat, and Bitcoin

1436
01:24:27,720 --> 01:24:31,319
is not a fiat digital dollar. It is a hard

1437
01:24:31,399 --> 01:24:35,319
asset based in mathematics and the value of the network.

1438
01:24:35,680 --> 01:24:38,119
And if you don't think networks have value, then why

1439
01:24:38,119 --> 01:24:43,159
do you think Facebook is valued at its value? I mean,

1440
01:24:43,159 --> 01:24:46,479
what is Facebook worth? Like some outrageous create I'm not

1441
01:24:46,479 --> 01:24:49,159
saying Facebook's good. I'm just saying you don't think networks

1442
01:24:49,159 --> 01:24:52,119
have value. This is so stupid. Even Peter Schiff still

1443
01:24:52,159 --> 01:24:55,000
still says this bitcoin is not worth anything because it's

1444
01:24:55,039 --> 01:24:58,560
not grounded in anything. It's abstract. You don't think a

1445
01:24:58,600 --> 01:25:04,119
global network of foul of computer nodes is valuable? Is

1446
01:25:04,359 --> 01:25:11,800
Twitter valuable? Is Facebook valuable? Is Facebook physical? This is

1447
01:25:11,800 --> 01:25:12,600
how boomers think.

1448
01:25:13,039 --> 01:25:15,680
Speaker 23: It ain't physical, It ain't got no value.

1449
01:25:15,920 --> 01:25:19,119
Speaker 2: Do you have Apple stock? Well, Apple got computers, Yeah,

1450
01:25:19,159 --> 01:25:28,520
but what about Facebook? Oh and it's so weird too,

1451
01:25:28,600 --> 01:25:34,359
because even dollars like people have apps that they have

1452
01:25:34,520 --> 01:25:37,399
their bank on, they have their boomers have their bank app,

1453
01:25:38,439 --> 01:25:43,159
and they're fine with doing banking apping on their phone.

1454
01:25:43,840 --> 01:25:47,159
There's no exchange of physical dollars. And they're over here

1455
01:25:47,199 --> 01:25:53,720
saying it ain't physical, it ain't tied to nothing. Look, yeah,

1456
01:25:53,720 --> 01:25:55,960
but your bank app is not even physical anymore and

1457
01:25:55,960 --> 01:26:00,159
tied to anything. I just somebody ask for money on

1458
01:26:00,239 --> 01:26:02,560
Zel the other day and I sent them. It was like,

1459
01:26:02,600 --> 01:26:08,119
there's no actual physical transference. It's from one app bank

1460
01:26:08,279 --> 01:26:13,319
to another app bank whatever. Now there might have been

1461
01:26:13,359 --> 01:26:17,239
some actual eventual transference, like electronically through the Swift system

1462
01:26:17,319 --> 01:26:19,399
or whatever. I understand that, but I'm saying that for

1463
01:26:19,439 --> 01:26:23,000
all intents and purposes, in our phone to phone interactions,

1464
01:26:23,760 --> 01:26:26,720
there's no physical transition of anything. I mean, the phone

1465
01:26:26,760 --> 01:26:29,720
is physical. But you know what I'm saying. So this

1466
01:26:29,840 --> 01:26:33,359
is very bizarre that like these really low tier arguments,

1467
01:26:34,720 --> 01:26:38,359
as literally bitcoin hits almost one hundred thousand dollars and

1468
01:26:38,399 --> 01:26:44,520
people are still recycling, parroting, and chirping the mainstream media

1469
01:26:44,600 --> 01:26:47,560
arguments from ten years ago. Guess what the mainstream media

1470
01:26:47,680 --> 01:26:49,399
lied to you about everything else, and they're lying to

1471
01:26:49,399 --> 01:26:54,239
you about bitcoin two, because haven't they told you? Yeah, exactly,

1472
01:26:54,279 --> 01:26:56,920
how about how they told you? For the mainstream media

1473
01:26:56,920 --> 01:26:59,119
have told you since the beginning, the bitcoin is a

1474
01:26:59,159 --> 01:27:01,760
scam going to zero. And every one of these horrible

1475
01:27:01,880 --> 01:27:07,199
boomer economic experts, whether it's Warren Buffett or the worst

1476
01:27:07,199 --> 01:27:09,960
of all is that Dan Paygna Dude or Cramer, all

1477
01:27:09,960 --> 01:27:12,520
of those people are like the worst and everything they've

1478
01:27:12,520 --> 01:27:15,560
said is wrong, and people still believe these people even

1479
01:27:15,600 --> 01:27:19,920
though they've been immaculately wrong for ten years. Anyway, go ahead,

1480
01:27:20,319 --> 01:27:21,840
if you had something.

1481
01:27:21,520 --> 01:27:23,880
Speaker 7: Well, I thought it was funny that so if you

1482
01:27:23,920 --> 01:27:31,279
were a materialist and critiquing bitcoin because it's not tangible.

1483
01:27:31,319 --> 01:27:33,640
Speaker 15: Wouldn't that be self defeating because everything's material?

1484
01:27:34,880 --> 01:27:38,720
Speaker 2: That's an interesting Could we make a mathematical argument from

1485
01:27:38,720 --> 01:27:41,960
bitcoin against atheism? Maybe you could. It's just that would

1486
01:27:41,960 --> 01:27:44,319
be an interesting Joe's I actually did a podcast a

1487
01:27:44,359 --> 01:27:47,800
few years ago where I said bitcoin is like neoplatonic money.

1488
01:27:48,079 --> 01:27:50,319
I was making an argument that it's like that. Joe's

1489
01:27:50,359 --> 01:27:52,720
the five dollars? Is it? Excuse me? The rest of

1490
01:27:52,720 --> 01:27:56,119
his question was, I don't invest in bitcoin because people

1491
01:27:56,159 --> 01:27:59,000
say all these bad things about it. Well, if you're

1492
01:27:59,000 --> 01:28:01,119
going to go with what all the people and the

1493
01:28:01,159 --> 01:28:03,760
normies say, do they have a very good track record

1494
01:28:03,800 --> 01:28:06,840
in the past ten years? What's the normy track record?

1495
01:28:06,880 --> 01:28:10,720
Just we don't forget logic and all of the abstract

1496
01:28:10,760 --> 01:28:15,359
philosophical arguments. Do Normies have been wrong on everything? So

1497
01:28:15,439 --> 01:28:17,960
why are you going to listen to normies on economic advice?

1498
01:28:19,000 --> 01:28:19,159
Speaker 1: Ah?

1499
01:28:19,199 --> 01:28:21,560
Speaker 2: By the way, I'm not I am not an economic advisor.

1500
01:28:22,199 --> 01:28:26,560
Johann Vanderschut, John Vandershoot five dollars? What were Roman Catholics

1501
01:28:26,560 --> 01:28:28,720
taught that made them believe that it was all the

1502
01:28:28,720 --> 01:28:31,760
other patriarchs that left the church and it wasn't Rome

1503
01:28:31,880 --> 01:28:34,439
leaving the church. Why would they say that, Well, that's

1504
01:28:34,439 --> 01:28:36,560
a great question, and I think the answer is that

1505
01:28:36,640 --> 01:28:41,439
precisely when we get to the ninth, tenth, and eleventh centuries,

1506
01:28:41,920 --> 01:28:44,560
as even the Roman Catholic scholars have pretty much admitted now,

1507
01:28:44,560 --> 01:28:50,359
the Unionate scholars and even Kongar Dvornik Sasinski was Roman

1508
01:28:50,399 --> 01:28:53,159
Catholic before becoming Orthodox, they've all pretty much said, Look,

1509
01:28:53,800 --> 01:28:57,239
those centuries are the key pivot centuries, because that's where

1510
01:28:57,239 --> 01:29:00,279
we get the growing reforms, That's where we get it's

1511
01:29:00,319 --> 01:29:05,439
almost a century of German nepotism, state installed popes. Did

1512
01:29:05,479 --> 01:29:08,600
you hear me? All you Roman Catholics who think that

1513
01:29:08,760 --> 01:29:11,560
orthodoxy of csero papism, were you not aware of the

1514
01:29:11,720 --> 01:29:16,479
entire century where German kings installed popes? Hello? Is that

1515
01:29:16,800 --> 01:29:20,520
cesero or papalocerism? No, they just ignore all that. They

1516
01:29:20,520 --> 01:29:23,159
don't even know about that. So in those key centuries

1517
01:29:23,479 --> 01:29:25,560
is when you have the rise and prominence of certain

1518
01:29:25,560 --> 01:29:29,560
forgeries about the papacy. You have right around that time

1519
01:29:29,720 --> 01:29:32,800
the Dictatus pape. A couple of centuries later you get

1520
01:29:33,000 --> 01:29:36,319
unimsanktem all of which are premised on this idea that

1521
01:29:36,920 --> 01:29:40,520
everything is centered around the Bishop of Rome. So even

1522
01:29:40,560 --> 01:29:46,960
though ironically, as Sashensky's book admits, by I think, I

1523
01:29:47,039 --> 01:29:52,239
want to say, what is it? Maybe the eight eight hundreds.

1524
01:29:52,600 --> 01:29:57,199
Eventually Rome at the seventh that Geminical Council and later

1525
01:29:57,720 --> 01:30:00,319
Rome for a while accepts pentharchy. Did you know that

1526
01:30:00,800 --> 01:30:04,680
they had no problem with the ecumenical councils talking about

1527
01:30:04,680 --> 01:30:08,560
pentarchy and that although the Bishop of Rome might have

1528
01:30:08,760 --> 01:30:12,880
a primary place amongst that pentarchy, he still must operate

1529
01:30:13,920 --> 01:30:17,880
together in a sonoda way with the pentarchy and by extension,

1530
01:30:17,880 --> 01:30:22,159
with the other bishops. But by the time we get

1531
01:30:22,199 --> 01:30:26,439
two centuries nine, ten to eleven, that idea is gone.

1532
01:30:26,600 --> 01:30:30,079
You get Schizm ten fifty four. Then you get the

1533
01:30:30,159 --> 01:30:35,199
Gregorian reforms, and this is unanimously admitted to be even

1534
01:30:35,239 --> 01:30:40,000
in the Alexandria Document of the Vatican. This is the

1535
01:30:40,039 --> 01:30:45,079
shift period when the Franco Latin papal Church develops down

1536
01:30:45,119 --> 01:30:48,239
its own line of the papal autocracy, and that just

1537
01:30:48,279 --> 01:30:50,800
further evolves until you get to Vatican One. But even

1538
01:30:50,840 --> 01:30:54,439
in the West, it's still not manifesting as the Vatican

1539
01:30:54,479 --> 01:30:56,960
One view yet, because you have at the Council of

1540
01:30:56,960 --> 01:31:04,199
Constance three rival and what decides this I counsel, Hello,

1541
01:31:04,479 --> 01:31:08,760
Roman Catholics, that's not Vatican one. And I've talked to

1542
01:31:08,800 --> 01:31:10,600
this I can't tell him that. Traads, I've talked to them.

1543
01:31:10,640 --> 01:31:13,479
They just brushed that. They just handwave this. Oh well yeah,

1544
01:31:13,479 --> 01:31:16,359
but uh that's what they had to do, what they

1545
01:31:16,399 --> 01:31:18,960
had to do. I thought Vatican one is the case,

1546
01:31:20,159 --> 01:31:23,399
and then they'll just shift up the They'll just move

1547
01:31:23,439 --> 01:31:26,920
the goalpost and say, oh well, but it evolved. Okay,

1548
01:31:26,920 --> 01:31:29,520
So it evolved or was it always the case? It

1549
01:31:29,600 --> 01:31:32,079
was the Vatican one view true at the time of constance.

1550
01:31:32,359 --> 01:31:35,560
When an ecumenical council decides who the fake popes are

1551
01:31:35,600 --> 01:31:38,359
and who the real pope is, this is like, this

1552
01:31:38,680 --> 01:31:41,000
should be so obvious to these people that this is

1553
01:31:41,039 --> 01:31:49,760
a ridiculous system. Anyway, Noah of Art one dollar, rather

1554
01:31:49,800 --> 01:31:52,239
than comparing Christ to Joseph Smith, why didn't you just

1555
01:31:52,239 --> 01:31:55,279
bring up Luke sixteen sixteen Bro? I was about to,

1556
01:31:55,720 --> 01:31:57,600
but I don't know that guy did not give me

1557
01:31:57,640 --> 01:32:00,479
the impression that that was going to go anywhere. And

1558
01:32:00,560 --> 01:32:02,840
if you saw the previous debate, what I had, what

1559
01:32:02,960 --> 01:32:06,079
I had with another Mormon, the whole debate was over

1560
01:32:06,119 --> 01:32:13,560
Luke sixteen sixteen. I think that would have been more effective. Well,

1561
01:32:13,640 --> 01:32:17,760
I thank you for your one dollar super chat to

1562
01:32:17,800 --> 01:32:20,720
tell me what is the most effective way to debate.

1563
01:32:20,800 --> 01:32:23,880
But I sensed that it wasn't even worth going there.

1564
01:32:24,000 --> 01:32:26,159
But as you could if you remember, if you were watching,

1565
01:32:26,600 --> 01:32:28,920
I had Luke sixteen sixteen pulled up on the screen

1566
01:32:29,119 --> 01:32:32,720
when that guy came back. But I don't think that

1567
01:32:32,720 --> 01:32:36,399
that guy was even listening to anything I said. And

1568
01:32:36,520 --> 01:32:39,359
so at a certain point, if you've done enough debates,

1569
01:32:39,680 --> 01:32:41,800
you get a sense for the spirit of the person

1570
01:32:41,840 --> 01:32:44,560
that you're talking to. That guy wouldn't shut up. He

1571
01:32:44,640 --> 01:32:47,039
kept talking and yapping every time I try to say something.

1572
01:32:48,000 --> 01:32:51,520
He was not listening to what I was saying, and

1573
01:32:51,560 --> 01:32:54,800
he actually shifted, he actually changed his position. So rather

1574
01:32:54,840 --> 01:32:57,079
than going into the texts, I think it was actually

1575
01:32:57,479 --> 01:32:59,840
a pretty devastating point. I'm not sure it's trying too

1576
01:32:59,880 --> 01:33:02,159
my horn, but I'm saying, look, if he started the

1577
01:33:02,199 --> 01:33:06,720
debate by saying, Joseph Smith is not mandating that you

1578
01:33:06,800 --> 01:33:10,000
believe the extra sections of Genesis fifty that he added.

1579
01:33:10,399 --> 01:33:13,319
It's just kind of him being creative with saying, hey,

1580
01:33:13,399 --> 01:33:17,680
maybe I'm predicted in Genesis and then by the later

1581
01:33:17,720 --> 01:33:20,800
stage of the debate he says, well, maybe Genesis is

1582
01:33:20,800 --> 01:33:23,960
predicting Joseph Smith. That's changing your argument and changing the

1583
01:33:23,960 --> 01:33:27,560
goalpost once you've been nailed down on the critique of

1584
01:33:27,560 --> 01:33:29,840
the first position. You can't do that in a debate

1585
01:33:30,920 --> 01:33:33,720
like that's obviously a violation of the rules. You can't

1586
01:33:33,720 --> 01:33:35,399
just change your position in the middle of the debate,

1587
01:33:36,199 --> 01:33:38,359
and he obviously did that, and everybody in the chat,

1588
01:33:38,359 --> 01:33:42,159
I think could see that. Jrd on ten dollars. I

1589
01:33:42,199 --> 01:33:45,319
attended Oca Perish in a state that's very liberal. The

1590
01:33:45,359 --> 01:33:49,840
first liturgy I attended, the bishop spent an hour spoken

1591
01:33:49,880 --> 01:33:57,359
about sympathy. Excuse me, spent an Hour's wait, the bishop

1592
01:33:57,399 --> 01:34:02,000
spent an hour speaking against sympathy for modernism or humanism.

1593
01:34:02,920 --> 01:34:05,880
So it really depends on the actual local clergy. Yeah,

1594
01:34:05,880 --> 01:34:08,600
then that's what I told that guy. So it's good

1595
01:34:08,640 --> 01:34:12,399
to hear that perhaps at least some of the clergy

1596
01:34:12,520 --> 01:34:17,359
are vocally at least anti Ecumenists. But you have to

1597
01:34:17,439 --> 01:34:19,640
keep in mind too that unfortunately we're in an era

1598
01:34:19,720 --> 01:34:24,159
where even if a cleric is vocally saying the right things,

1599
01:34:25,359 --> 01:34:27,159
we have a lot of naive people who don't know

1600
01:34:27,199 --> 01:34:31,279
what bureaucracy does and how bureaucracy operates. And I'm not

1601
01:34:31,319 --> 01:34:34,800
accusing anybody specifically. I'm just saying that you will learn this,

1602
01:34:35,640 --> 01:34:39,680
which is it's called double speak. A lot of bureaucrats

1603
01:34:39,680 --> 01:34:44,600
and people in positions of power, shocker, will say one

1604
01:34:44,640 --> 01:34:48,760
thing and do another. I know that that sounds crazy,

1605
01:34:48,800 --> 01:34:53,600
but even clerics can vocally say good things while they

1606
01:34:53,640 --> 01:34:55,720
do something else. You're going to learn that if you're

1607
01:34:55,720 --> 01:35:01,760
new to all this mean gene five dollars, chef them up, bro,

1608
01:35:02,000 --> 01:35:04,079
cook these cults. Okay, this is back when we're talking

1609
01:35:04,079 --> 01:35:07,439
the Mormon dude, no of our one dollar. When you

1610
01:35:07,520 --> 01:35:09,680
were talking to that guy or the talks guy about circumcision,

1611
01:35:09,720 --> 01:35:11,840
could you not say that the reason for circumcision was

1612
01:35:11,880 --> 01:35:14,960
to distinguish Israel from other nations. Well, again, circumcision begins

1613
01:35:14,960 --> 01:35:18,920
with Abraham. So it's a tribal national covenant, and yes,

1614
01:35:18,960 --> 01:35:22,520
that's obviously part of it. The other reason that it's

1615
01:35:22,560 --> 01:35:26,840
now baptism is that it is not other than what

1616
01:35:26,920 --> 01:35:29,600
is required of knowing, there's no need for that distinction. Yeah,

1617
01:35:29,680 --> 01:35:32,239
so it's the covenant is expanded beyond the nation state,

1618
01:35:32,279 --> 01:35:33,640
which is the very point I made to that guy

1619
01:35:33,880 --> 01:35:36,479
me and Gene five dollars Boomer core. This is when

1620
01:35:36,520 --> 01:35:40,319
the Neokon boomer called in anonymous ten dollars jay, I said,

1621
01:35:40,680 --> 01:35:46,399
someone said that God suffers. Wait, God, I heard someone

1622
01:35:46,479 --> 01:35:50,319
say God suffers the most, being that he has to

1623
01:35:50,359 --> 01:35:56,800
watch his creation see all cruelty killing and rejecting him.

1624
01:35:57,199 --> 01:36:01,640
But God can't suffer. Does sperience need desire? Can you

1625
01:36:01,640 --> 01:36:02,520
help me understand?

1626
01:36:03,000 --> 01:36:03,119
Speaker 20: Well?

1627
01:36:03,159 --> 01:36:07,119
Speaker 2: The Bible is written in what we call anthropomorphic language,

1628
01:36:07,159 --> 01:36:11,560
so it utilizes human terms and concepts that are created

1629
01:36:12,039 --> 01:36:15,640
to tell us about the uncreated. So it is true

1630
01:36:15,680 --> 01:36:19,119
and correct to say that God does not experience the passions.

1631
01:36:19,439 --> 01:36:19,560
Speaker 1: Right.

1632
01:36:19,600 --> 01:36:21,640
Speaker 2: Scripture says God is not like a man, that he

1633
01:36:22,119 --> 01:36:26,359
changes or fluctuates or whatever. We know this in Christology too,

1634
01:36:26,479 --> 01:36:29,239
that the six Secum Medical Council teaches that Christ doesn't

1635
01:36:29,239 --> 01:36:32,199
possess a gnomic will, and he doesn't possess a will

1636
01:36:32,199 --> 01:36:35,600
because he's not a created hypostasis. He's a divine hypostasis

1637
01:36:35,720 --> 01:36:39,600
with human nature. And so the mystery, though of the

1638
01:36:39,600 --> 01:36:43,279
incarnation is precisely that the divine person of the word

1639
01:36:43,800 --> 01:36:48,039
really did become incarnate and really did undergo human things

1640
01:36:48,079 --> 01:36:51,199
in a human way as a divine subject. So while

1641
01:36:51,199 --> 01:36:54,279
the divine nature is impassable, the son of God really

1642
01:36:54,279 --> 01:36:57,279
did step into human nature, and he really does love us.

1643
01:36:57,640 --> 01:37:02,399
There really is a divine energy of love, and it

1644
01:37:02,439 --> 01:37:05,640
really does interact with us. But we don't say that

1645
01:37:05,720 --> 01:37:10,359
God in his nature is changeable, or that in the

1646
01:37:10,399 --> 01:37:14,319
incarnation that the divinity died, right, the divine nature didn't die.

1647
01:37:14,600 --> 01:37:17,920
The death was experienced by the divine subject of the

1648
01:37:17,960 --> 01:37:21,479
word undergoing the severance of his human soul from his

1649
01:37:21,560 --> 01:37:24,720
human body. And so that protects the impassability of God.

1650
01:37:25,239 --> 01:37:27,239
And at the same time, in the Orthodox way also

1651
01:37:27,840 --> 01:37:31,199
it is really and truly one of the Holy Trinity

1652
01:37:31,399 --> 01:37:38,920
undergoing a crucifixion. But that refused Monophicites, by the way,

1653
01:37:38,920 --> 01:37:42,560
because if the Monophysite conclusion is true and Christ is

1654
01:37:42,560 --> 01:37:44,760
at terti and quid, then you do have to say

1655
01:37:44,800 --> 01:37:49,520
that the Divinity underwent, the Divinity itself died, and that

1656
01:37:49,520 --> 01:37:51,680
would actually, like Muslims, would actually have a good argument

1657
01:37:51,680 --> 01:37:54,880
against like the Monophysites. MKG fifty dollars. I'm sorry that

1658
01:37:54,920 --> 01:37:57,640
I couldn't be more prepared to discuss the topic. Well,

1659
01:37:57,680 --> 01:38:00,079
I wasn't trying to hurt your feelings. It's just that

1660
01:38:00,199 --> 01:38:04,000
in order to cover this issue of what has been

1661
01:38:04,000 --> 01:38:07,199
fulfilled in the Old Testament, like circumcision and elements of

1662
01:38:07,199 --> 01:38:10,560
the ceremonial law, it's very necessary and fundamental that you

1663
01:38:10,560 --> 01:38:14,119
read books like Hebrew Hebrews. My main concern is how

1664
01:38:14,119 --> 01:38:17,720
the Church discriminates between what continues and what doesn't. Well. Again,

1665
01:38:18,319 --> 01:38:22,640
the principle of typology and fulfillment can only be ascertained

1666
01:38:22,720 --> 01:38:26,720
when you are grounded in the whole texts. So if

1667
01:38:26,720 --> 01:38:29,279
you haven't read Hebrews, you're not going to be able

1668
01:38:29,319 --> 01:38:32,520
to know some of the key arguments about our hermeneutic

1669
01:38:32,640 --> 01:38:35,359
of the Old Testament. And that's precisely what's presented in

1670
01:38:35,399 --> 01:38:37,439
the Book of Hebrews. So that's why I directed you

1671
01:38:37,479 --> 01:38:43,560
to that. I would like to continue discussion in the future. Yeah, absolutely, MKG.

1672
01:38:43,680 --> 01:38:45,920
And again anything I said to you is not to

1673
01:38:46,000 --> 01:38:50,159
hurt you, but literally to tell you absolutely on this topic,

1674
01:38:50,359 --> 01:38:53,199
must read the Book of Hebrews. Thirty four JDN ten dollars.

1675
01:38:53,560 --> 01:38:57,520
I need more screaming street vendors. Actually, when FDA was here,

1676
01:38:57,880 --> 01:39:04,439
we were walking downtown and there was a Protestant evangelical megaphone.

1677
01:39:04,920 --> 01:39:06,800
You're all going to help kind of dude out there.

1678
01:39:08,119 --> 01:39:10,279
We just did not have the energy to go.

1679
01:39:10,640 --> 01:39:11,199
Speaker 5: We didn't.

1680
01:39:11,680 --> 01:39:14,159
Speaker 3: It was it was tempting, wasn't it were like should.

1681
01:39:13,880 --> 01:39:14,760
Speaker 15: We go over Yeah?

1682
01:39:14,800 --> 01:39:17,279
Speaker 2: We talked about like filming it, you know, like walking

1683
01:39:17,319 --> 01:39:19,319
over there and trying to but I just I didn't

1684
01:39:19,319 --> 01:39:20,119
have the energy for it.

1685
01:39:20,239 --> 01:39:22,520
Speaker 24: And did you see the lady behind us was like

1686
01:39:23,880 --> 01:39:26,600
she was like totally for us doing that that And

1687
01:39:26,680 --> 01:39:30,399
she was like, can you imagine like trying to convert

1688
01:39:30,439 --> 01:39:32,560
people like that guy? She said, and made some funny

1689
01:39:32,560 --> 01:39:35,920
comment behind us.

1690
01:39:37,079 --> 01:39:40,479
Speaker 2: Antonio's five dollars. Okay, thank you so much, he says,

1691
01:39:40,560 --> 01:39:43,680
a private message there. Appreciate that. Hang your Head Tom

1692
01:39:43,720 --> 01:39:46,199
Dilly one hundred and fifty dollars. Whoa, But we got

1693
01:39:46,199 --> 01:39:49,399
the biggest fat of super Chat tonight from Hang your Head,

1694
01:39:49,439 --> 01:39:50,399
Tom Dilly, he wins.

1695
01:39:50,560 --> 01:39:52,279
Speaker 15: That's a great song, by the way.

1696
01:39:52,840 --> 01:39:56,039
Speaker 2: He says, I've been listening since twenty twenty one. I

1697
01:39:56,159 --> 01:40:00,640
was a Protestant pastor with degrees and biblical studies. This

1698
01:40:00,720 --> 01:40:02,960
led me, i think he's saying, to become a progressive

1699
01:40:03,039 --> 01:40:07,079
lib Your work with others was instrumental in helping me

1700
01:40:07,720 --> 01:40:11,720
find my ability into thinking about orthodoxy and philosophy and beyond.

1701
01:40:12,920 --> 01:40:14,960
Keep going, my man. Thanks, Well, hey, that's great. I

1702
01:40:15,000 --> 01:40:18,479
don't think it seems probably I would say that's probably

1703
01:40:18,520 --> 01:40:22,279
pretty rare, and of course God that's God's grace absolutely,

1704
01:40:22,359 --> 01:40:26,239
but probably pretty rare for somebody to be a liberal

1705
01:40:26,359 --> 01:40:30,880
Christian progressivist pastor who would become Orthodox, father, he can.

1706
01:40:30,920 --> 01:40:31,920
Have you heard of this very much?

1707
01:40:34,039 --> 01:40:34,520
Speaker 15: Sorry?

1708
01:40:34,359 --> 01:40:39,279
Speaker 2: Say, somebody who like had biblical studies degrees and became

1709
01:40:39,359 --> 01:40:43,560
like a liberal progressive Protestant pastor to become Orthodox. What

1710
01:40:43,800 --> 01:40:44,800
have you heard of that very much?

1711
01:40:46,800 --> 01:40:48,039
Speaker 4: Oh? That's interesting.

1712
01:40:48,800 --> 01:40:49,119
Speaker 16: I don't know.

1713
01:40:49,159 --> 01:40:51,600
Speaker 2: If I have like you, I would just beg you,

1714
01:40:51,640 --> 01:40:55,399
Tom Dooley, please don't bring the liberal progressivism and orthodoxy

1715
01:40:55,640 --> 01:40:59,359
like yeah, that's the worst thing that I'm not accusing you,

1716
01:40:59,399 --> 01:41:03,600
but like the worst thing that converts to quantum carbon dating.

1717
01:41:03,600 --> 01:41:05,520
There we go. Three dollars. Did you see the Dan

1718
01:41:05,560 --> 01:41:08,520
Belsarian interview with Heere's Morgan? Yes, well I saw the clip,

1719
01:41:08,920 --> 01:41:12,640
so that is, obviously I think going viral. I think

1720
01:41:12,720 --> 01:41:15,720
most people by now are probably pretty maybe not in

1721
01:41:15,720 --> 01:41:18,000
the normy world, which I'm sure that clip is reaching

1722
01:41:18,039 --> 01:41:22,119
the normy world where they're discussing Obviously, what the Talmud

1723
01:41:22,159 --> 01:41:24,960
says about Jesus and Mary. I learned about that in

1724
01:41:25,000 --> 01:41:28,239
two thousand and six, so I've known since two thousand

1725
01:41:28,239 --> 01:41:32,039
and six what things the Talmut speculates and basically what

1726
01:41:32,079 --> 01:41:33,960
it is. It's like, you know, the way the Talmut is,

1727
01:41:33,960 --> 01:41:37,279
it's like all these rabbis in the commentaries debating this

1728
01:41:37,479 --> 01:41:40,039
or that text, and so you'll have some statement and

1729
01:41:40,079 --> 01:41:43,279
then you get like fifty rabbis in their various debates

1730
01:41:43,319 --> 01:41:44,880
and opinions. So if you bring this up to like

1731
01:41:44,960 --> 01:41:47,600
rabinical Jew, they're going to say, oh, this is just

1732
01:41:47,680 --> 01:41:53,239
the rabbis debating. Okay, well, but still like, obviously we're

1733
01:41:53,279 --> 01:41:57,439
not supposed to say what the Talmud says about Jesus

1734
01:41:57,439 --> 01:42:02,000
and Mary because that's not very appropriate applicable to today's

1735
01:42:02,079 --> 01:42:08,560
normy speak. Right, So I guess it's good to see, uh,

1736
01:42:08,600 --> 01:42:12,199
this stuff being discussed and to see that kind of

1737
01:42:12,239 --> 01:42:14,600
thing being out there, because more and more more the

1738
01:42:14,640 --> 01:42:16,600
Norman world doesn't know any of this stuff obviously, right.

1739
01:42:16,720 --> 01:42:21,000
The problem is that Dan Bazarian is there with Tate's

1740
01:42:21,000 --> 01:42:24,600
and all these other people pushing Islam. So I don't

1741
01:42:24,640 --> 01:42:28,159
want to see people seeing all of that stuff being

1742
01:42:28,199 --> 01:42:31,439
talked about and then them thinking and that's just happening,

1743
01:42:31,520 --> 01:42:35,319
especially many young people. Then they're like funneled into Islam

1744
01:42:35,359 --> 01:42:39,039
because they think Islam is based and it's not. It's

1745
01:42:39,079 --> 01:42:42,680
just and and one of these young podcaster guys is

1746
01:42:42,720 --> 01:42:46,399
like twenty, you know, he called into Sam schmun the

1747
01:42:46,439 --> 01:42:48,840
other night, right. He's like, oh, I've been watching Tate

1748
01:42:49,000 --> 01:42:52,279
and Bazari and all these dudes, and like Islam's bay

1749
01:42:52,479 --> 01:42:54,920
bays and trad dude, and then like you have to

1750
01:42:56,319 --> 01:43:00,199
like work through all this bull crap. No, it's not. Yeah,

1751
01:43:00,920 --> 01:43:03,319
Islam is not tried and base. It's a crazy cult

1752
01:43:05,720 --> 01:43:08,640
ed faith. Before fortune five dollars. I tried to call in.

1753
01:43:08,680 --> 01:43:12,439
It would not let me on your space seemingly your

1754
01:43:12,479 --> 01:43:13,279
space alone.

1755
01:43:14,279 --> 01:43:14,720
Speaker 23: I don't know.

1756
01:43:14,840 --> 01:43:18,159
Speaker 2: I wasn't banned. I didn't ban anybody. I did boot

1757
01:43:18,199 --> 01:43:19,840
the Mormon dude. The only person I booted today was

1758
01:43:19,840 --> 01:43:21,600
a Mormon dude. I want to ask you about the

1759
01:43:22,000 --> 01:43:27,079
kingdom Keys kingdom, Keys kingdom. I don't know what that means.

1760
01:43:27,119 --> 01:43:30,840
You mean just that in the In our view, the

1761
01:43:31,039 --> 01:43:42,119
idea is that the Christ promised to the apostles the power,

1762
01:43:42,239 --> 01:43:46,159
ability and authority to govern the Church through what we

1763
01:43:46,239 --> 01:43:48,800
call the office of the Keys, or the exercising of

1764
01:43:48,840 --> 01:43:52,960
the bishopric, the episcopate. So that includes things like the sacraments,

1765
01:43:53,880 --> 01:43:57,279
you know, having a jurisdiction over which a bishop has authority,

1766
01:43:58,359 --> 01:44:01,920
you know, being involved in make church rules and laws,

1767
01:44:02,000 --> 01:44:06,439
canlaw in the synods, and so forth, preaching the Gospel.

1768
01:44:06,640 --> 01:44:09,359
These are all elements of the exercise of the Keys.

1769
01:44:10,680 --> 01:44:14,560
So that's the Orthodox view. Jesus doesn't just give that

1770
01:44:14,560 --> 01:44:17,079
to Peter. He first says it to Peter, and then

1771
01:44:17,079 --> 01:44:19,239
in Matthew eighteen he says it to the entire college

1772
01:44:19,239 --> 01:44:20,920
of the apostles of the exact same thing that he

1773
01:44:20,920 --> 01:44:23,680
says to Peter. So in the Orthodox view, we don't

1774
01:44:23,720 --> 01:44:26,479
see that as like just given to Peter and only

1775
01:44:26,560 --> 01:44:31,159
had by bishops in commune with Peter in Rome. We

1776
01:44:31,239 --> 01:44:36,039
see that as a collegial reality. And so I'm not

1777
01:44:36,039 --> 01:44:39,560
sure what you mean about that the keys supersede, Paul.

1778
01:44:39,640 --> 01:44:42,159
I don't know what that means. Nick, twenty five dollars.

1779
01:44:42,199 --> 01:44:44,720
I'm here for your theology and not twenty eighteen level

1780
01:44:44,760 --> 01:44:48,239
bitcoin platitudes. Well you don't have to be here, so

1781
01:44:48,479 --> 01:44:52,720
thank you for the superchat. But I see this as

1782
01:44:52,760 --> 01:44:57,399
a massive vindication of all of the hate and opposition

1783
01:44:57,520 --> 01:45:00,239
that I've gotten from people like yourself who don't like

1784
01:45:00,279 --> 01:45:04,000
bitcoin or or butt hurt that they missed out. So

1785
01:45:05,000 --> 01:45:06,760
you don't have to be here on this channel if

1786
01:45:06,760 --> 01:45:10,439
you don't want bitcoin platitudes. Ben one dollar. Hey, can

1787
01:45:10,479 --> 01:45:14,960
you let me talk about the LDS Church. I'm a member, Ben.

1788
01:45:15,039 --> 01:45:16,560
Let's see, so let me see if there's a Bin.

1789
01:45:16,680 --> 01:45:22,600
Is there a Ben in the chat? Yeah? Yes, okay, Ben,

1790
01:45:22,680 --> 01:45:26,319
we will go to you. I'm gonna let you hear

1791
01:45:26,399 --> 01:45:29,319
a brief message from the sponsor. I'm going to go

1792
01:45:29,439 --> 01:45:31,800
T T in the little girls room and I'm going

1793
01:45:31,840 --> 01:45:34,800
to make a coffee, so we will be right back.

1794
01:45:35,159 --> 01:45:36,680
I think I've gotten to all the super chats, so

1795
01:45:36,800 --> 01:45:40,319
say we've got one more super chat. Lavid Dinch sad

1796
01:45:40,359 --> 01:45:42,920
of David Lynch one dollar fifty three. How do people

1797
01:45:43,920 --> 01:45:47,920
who are very young invest in bitcoin since they missed

1798
01:45:47,960 --> 01:45:51,439
the train? Well, I believe, and I can't tell you

1799
01:45:51,479 --> 01:45:53,600
what to do, but again, just to make this really quick, like,

1800
01:45:53,640 --> 01:45:56,000
I believe that bitcoin will really be kind of the

1801
01:45:56,039 --> 01:45:59,800
reserve currency of the future. We've already seen, you know,

1802
01:46:00,279 --> 01:46:04,399
being megapro Bitcoin now RFK Junior helping Trump to go

1803
01:46:04,479 --> 01:46:08,760
in that direction. Microsoft is now having their board members

1804
01:46:09,239 --> 01:46:11,720
and they give me their shareholders vote on whether Microsoft

1805
01:46:11,800 --> 01:46:14,600
wants to hold bitcoin on the balance sheet. You've got

1806
01:46:14,640 --> 01:46:17,880
other corporations moving into it. The big hedge funds are

1807
01:46:17,920 --> 01:46:20,439
already buying into it. So we're already in the phase

1808
01:46:20,520 --> 01:46:24,239
now where all that era of the government's going to

1809
01:46:24,319 --> 01:46:28,199
ban bitcoin. We're past that. It's already achieved institutional acceptance

1810
01:46:28,199 --> 01:46:32,279
and adoption, so it's not going to work to ban

1811
01:46:32,399 --> 01:46:35,239
it that. We're past that phase that was the danger

1812
01:46:35,359 --> 01:46:39,439
of like five years ago. So that being the case,

1813
01:46:40,159 --> 01:46:43,479
this is why as nation states, and we're already at

1814
01:46:43,520 --> 01:46:46,239
the phase where nation states are adopting it. We've got

1815
01:46:46,520 --> 01:46:51,000
three nation states now openly discussing and adopting it. That

1816
01:46:51,039 --> 01:46:55,079
will only continue most likely in my view. So the

1817
01:46:55,159 --> 01:46:58,399
question isn't am I too late for bitcoin? The question is,

1818
01:47:00,479 --> 01:47:03,920
I mean, will we see a the next if we

1819
01:47:04,000 --> 01:47:07,359
have a crash, if the crashes fall, the next one

1820
01:47:07,439 --> 01:47:09,840
will have another crash. But if the crash, the next

1821
01:47:09,840 --> 01:47:12,079
crash whenever that is maybe June July August, when if

1822
01:47:12,079 --> 01:47:15,079
it follows the previous cycles, the crash will be to

1823
01:47:15,119 --> 01:47:18,319
the sixty K level, because most crashes are the peak

1824
01:47:18,359 --> 01:47:20,760
of the previous cycle. And if you don't know this stuff,

1825
01:47:20,800 --> 01:47:24,399
you need to learn about the bitcoin four your cycle. Uh,

1826
01:47:24,439 --> 01:47:27,119
you need to learn about the holvings. And a lot

1827
01:47:27,119 --> 01:47:29,479
of this is like actually just basic market stuff, right.

1828
01:47:30,039 --> 01:47:33,119
The stock market has a cycle to it. Markets have cycles.

1829
01:47:33,600 --> 01:47:36,880
Crypto bitcoin also has cycles, So you need to go

1830
01:47:36,960 --> 01:47:41,720
learn that stuff. If if you're at the level of

1831
01:47:42,000 --> 01:47:45,399
working class guy, young guy wanting to get into it.

1832
01:47:45,720 --> 01:47:47,600
The best thing that people do. I can't tell you

1833
01:47:47,640 --> 01:47:50,640
what to do. It's called dollar cost averaging. Look up

1834
01:47:50,720 --> 01:47:53,920
DCA and figure out for you what the best way

1835
01:47:54,000 --> 01:47:56,000
to DCA is. If you do choose to do that,

1836
01:47:56,000 --> 01:47:57,039
I can't tell you what to do. I'm not a

1837
01:47:57,119 --> 01:48:02,600
roaster financial advisor. But I believe that we will only

1838
01:48:02,640 --> 01:48:07,960
continue to see large scale adoption of more corporations. It's

1839
01:48:08,000 --> 01:48:11,279
only a matter of time before Apple and the other

1840
01:48:11,319 --> 01:48:17,680
big Amazon, other big corporations are openly into bitcoin. Other

1841
01:48:17,800 --> 01:48:22,840
nation states will begin to have reserves. You understand, Trump

1842
01:48:23,399 --> 01:48:28,119
and Senator Loomis are talking about having a strategic national

1843
01:48:28,199 --> 01:48:30,920
reserve a bitcoin. Now, whether you think that's good or bad,

1844
01:48:31,479 --> 01:48:35,159
that's going to blow up the price. Okay, so we're

1845
01:48:35,199 --> 01:48:37,880
going to one hundred, one hundred and fifty two hundred

1846
01:48:38,319 --> 01:48:40,600
maybe even the cycle. In other words, we could see

1847
01:48:40,600 --> 01:48:43,399
two hundred k bitcoin this cycle. Now that's gonna be

1848
01:48:43,439 --> 01:48:47,520
probably the top, and so it will come back down

1849
01:48:48,479 --> 01:48:50,800
the crash if it has a mega crash, which it

1850
01:48:50,880 --> 01:48:54,239
usually does. We usually do see a big crash after

1851
01:48:54,479 --> 01:48:57,399
the blowoff top as it's called. It may crash down

1852
01:48:57,399 --> 01:49:01,319
to sixteen to ninety. I will say this, I don't

1853
01:49:01,359 --> 01:49:03,920
think we'll ever see fifty thousand dollars bitcoin again. I

1854
01:49:03,960 --> 01:49:09,199
really don't, because we're past all those phases. That means,

1855
01:49:09,279 --> 01:49:11,199
in my view, if you look up, if you're not

1856
01:49:11,199 --> 01:49:13,079
familiar with this, you need to be familiar with Plan B.

1857
01:49:13,760 --> 01:49:16,159
You need to be familiar with the stock to flow chart.

1858
01:49:16,359 --> 01:49:19,319
This is all bitcoin basics. Everybody should be If you

1859
01:49:19,319 --> 01:49:21,079
followed me for a long time, you should be familiar

1860
01:49:21,119 --> 01:49:25,560
with these things. Plan B Stock to flow. Stock to

1861
01:49:25,560 --> 01:49:32,600
flow gives you Plan b's model based around the previous

1862
01:49:32,640 --> 01:49:35,479
cycles and the previous halvings. Every bitcoin cycle is based

1863
01:49:35,520 --> 01:49:38,119
around the four year halving cycle. If you're not familiar

1864
01:49:38,159 --> 01:49:40,159
with that, you need to go learn all these things

1865
01:49:40,840 --> 01:49:43,399
and as you can see going back to the inception

1866
01:49:43,439 --> 01:49:47,560
of bitcoin in twenty ten, it has followed the metrics

1867
01:49:47,600 --> 01:49:51,560
of Plan b's model pretty close. Right, it's a little

1868
01:49:51,560 --> 01:49:51,840
behind