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Speaker 1: Hi am, Welcome to the NBA Podcast.

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Speaker 2: My name is Morton Jensen, and first and foremost, I

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would like to apologize.

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Speaker 1: For my absence.

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Speaker 2: I moved across the country, so I haven't had a

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hell of a lot of time to podcast these last

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couple of weeks. So forgive, forgive my my my moving around,

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and I'm glad to be back. And of course when

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I'm back like this, I have to bring on someone special.

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That's stanfa Valley off the Hardwood Nooks Knocks podcast, and

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today we are going to be discussing the most confusing

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teams in the NBA, because like that's the thing with

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Dan and I. We figure out things where we can

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just list a bunch of players and teams and we

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can just go to town on them. That came out wrong,

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but you know what I mean. Welcome to the show,

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Dan fa Valley, how.

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Speaker 3: Are you doing more? Thank you for having me. As always,

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I'm doing well. Man.

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Speaker 2: Like obviously, moving sucks because it always sucks, like the

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whole process. It's nice to get to where you want

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to go, but like the whole thing and packing up

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one house and packing out and like it's just such

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a hassle because you know, you just know you can

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have this vision of like, oh, after two weeks of

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having moved in, there are not gonna be any boxes left.

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You just know you're lying to yourself. You're gonna have

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boxes for the first six months. Like there's always gonna

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be like that one or two that's gonna be left

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in like some corner. Like you don't want to touch it,

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your spouse doesn't want to touch it, because none of

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you know where the hell things are going, and it's

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just gonna stand there and it's gonna test your marriage.

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Speaker 1: You just know that's how it's gonna work out.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and for you specifically. The past two times I've moved,

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it's been within a half an hour of where I

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was living previously. Moving across the country, I have to

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imagine is fucking wild. So I do not envy use.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, no, that that's and it's like that's the thing

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because now you also have to like school change, like

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job change, there's a whole bunch of things going in

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with this, so huge, but like also super excited to

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start on something new. Honestly, just like I I've lived

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in Copenhagen all my life, so trying something else is

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gonna be exciting, Like I I can't front like basically

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just having this idea of you've always been in the

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same place that bores me.

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Speaker 1: It really ports me, and I'm coming up.

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Speaker 2: I'm pushing on forty Dan, like come on, I had

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to try something new before.

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Speaker 3: Forty Yeah, and what better time than to move across

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the country during the smack dab in the middle of

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the NBA regular season.

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Speaker 1: Huh right that was so smart on my behalf. So smart. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well you've been in the business, lawel. I planned

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my wedding around the NBA schedule, Like that's how, that's

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how it works. We don't. I don't deserve kudos for it.

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That's just matter of I'm sure other people do that

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with whatever their jobs are. But you plan a move

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in the middle, in the middle of the NBA Cup

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to what I mean more to yeah, I know the

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one thing the NBA Playoffs, Like, yeah, move during that.

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We've been there, seeing that we're going about the NBA

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Cup more.

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Speaker 2: Look, I honestly, I was just trying to avoid free agency.

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That's that's like, that's my busy time, like.

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Speaker 3: The draft and free agency, which is interesting because it

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sucks now free agency is always busy in the lead up,

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and then everyone's left sort of bag holding when they

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thought there was gonna be all this content and all

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these big moves to react to, and there's just there's

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not anymore, at least not on the same frequency scale.

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Speaker 2: No, And honestly, the one thing that I really miss

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in the free agency game, you know, it's it's the surprises.

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Like the last time I was genuinely surprised that was

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when Voge came with the whole DeMarcus Cousins has signed

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with the Golden State Warriors tweet that was that's for

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some reason, that's the one that sticks out like that

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was the last time where I was like, oh, this

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is crazy, this is like free agency Flaanapalooza, and everything

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else since then has just gone down.

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Speaker 3: I don't know when the last time I was really

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floored by, oh this player signed for that or ended

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up there was, But I will say most recently the

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Karl Anthony Towns trade. The timing shocked me. I did

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not like that was not so you understood the name,

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the destination like that stuff had been in the ether,

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but the actual timing of it all it shook me.

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I was like, what the hell, what the hell's happening here?

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Especially I was I had taken an edible at the time,

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and I was just praying that I wasn't gonna be

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one of the people called in to do like immediate

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reactions for it. I couldn't even do an immediate reaction

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Pod Grant and I waited. I was like, dance high,

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he is what was going on right now?

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Speaker 1: No, I will agree with that.

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Speaker 2: I think for me, I was just basically expecting Raindall

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to get traded because there was no way I could

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see that whole you know, lineup makes sense.

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Speaker 3: Doing it right as you're going into training camp knowing

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that whatever you're gonna do is not gonna like it's

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gonna disrupt your trade. Like the timing really just it

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seems like the NBA is good for at least one

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of those WTF transactions. For whatever reason the WTFNS exists,

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it does seel like we get at least one of

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those every mid season and every summer.

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Speaker 2: Still, Yeah, we just need a very entertaining trade deadline

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to make up for the fact that we don't have

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free agency really anymore.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, but I really do believe based off things that

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have just been said off the record that teams still

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don't really know how to navigate the collective bargaining agreement

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right now. And I think the trade parameters specifically coupled

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with trying to figure out like, well, how punitive are

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these aprons actually and worrying about frozen draft picks and

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figuring out those rules, I really do believe I'm normally

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I want to make it clear, I'm normally an optimist

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when it comes to the trade deadline. I always predict chaos.

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I think there's gonna be more behind the scenes chaos

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than actual just people thought last year's trade deadline was

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going to be a let down. I'll be happy if

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we get as active a trade deadline this year.

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Speaker 2: I have to be, you know, the sour puss every

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single day when you know, Danish listeners and Danish NBA

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fans sent me like fourteen trades.

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Speaker 1: Like hey, Mark, how about this?

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Speaker 2: And it includes like six all stars and I'm just like, oh, honey,

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I don't.

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Speaker 1: Even know where to begin.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, oh honey, baby, sweetie pumpkin, this is I'm so sorry.

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Like and some of them are even like really well

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thought out, like it's not they're not bad traits. It's

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like it solves like four teams, So like there's some

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person that's been sitting there for like a couple hours,

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like coming up with a great, great trade, and I'm

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just like, you know, two of those teams probably don't

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even understand like the predicament and financially, like it's just

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not gonna happen.

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Speaker 1: I'm so sorry.

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Speaker 3: Look, I reached the point for years and years. I

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have my own spreadsheet of like do these trades work?

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This CBA shot that entire thing to hell, and it's

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thank god the spo track trade machine exists right at

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tip Pete Smith because even I've done trade stuff for

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Bleacher Report lately. I think one even published where like

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I just didn't I included an extra player and a

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team that couldn't aggregate, and this was over the off season.

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And now it's just I've even seen on sites where

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it's like x trades that could totally happen right now

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and then they're just illegal in the actual So go

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to this po Track NBA trade machine. It is a lifeline,

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whether you're just I'm not talking about just for us,

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Like if you wanna the basis of any trade would

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be Hey, can this actually happen even if you're just

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hypothesizing it? And thank God for this pow track trade

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machine right now, that's all I have to say.

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Speaker 2: I'm super glad you're calling its bo track because I

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did so too, and I learned that it's actually spot rack, which.

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Speaker 3: Is Keith corrects me every time I had him on

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the show, and I feel terrible that I forget after

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every time he corrects me.

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Speaker 2: I just ignore Keith on that one, because I think

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spow track sounds better.

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Speaker 3: A spot rack just doesn't roll off the tongue, is fun. Right,

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Maybe I'm addicted to saying spo too. That might be it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they should just add coach spo track. There we go.

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Speaker 1: That'd be awesome.

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Speaker 2: By the way, we're talking about trades, and that's actually

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a little bit of a teaser for the next episode.

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Like we're doing these double episodes. We've done them a

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couple of months in a row. We're probably gonna keep

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doing them for a while, just so everyone is kind

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of clued into the fact that we're doing this. So

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the next episode we're gonna do is about teams that

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are more.

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Speaker 1: Or less dictate.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, right, we're gonna dictate the trade deadline hopefully, hopefully,

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so we get some action and that's gonna be in

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both our feeds too. But that's where you're gonna play

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the host. That's how we're doing things right now.

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Speaker 3: I love you doing a terrible job playing the host

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for your own subject matter. Then by what's going on?

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Speaker 1: I know, I know.

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Speaker 2: Well, then let's get back on track. Most confusing teams,

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and Dan, we broke it down. So I had the West,

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you had the East, and we're basically looking at teams

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that we have a hard time, you know, getting a

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real idea about, despite the fact that we're like twenty

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five games into the season. Like we we watch these

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teams on a regular basis, and even though we do,

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we look at them and we kind of go.

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Speaker 1: What are they are?

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Speaker 2: We sure we know who they are? So Dan, your

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first up who we're going with here?

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Speaker 3: Mort I'm gonna start with a team that was not

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confusing me in the slightest until they got so injured

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that I'm just fascinated to see what their direction ends

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up being. That's the Orlando Magic one. They're confusing as

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hell team because both of their star players, Palo Bancaro

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and Franza Wagner, Which is the last time I will

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say it like that. You told me to try it.

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I gave it a shot. Ye, the bleaque injuries and

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then I don't remember who tweeted this, but I said

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or skied in it. I saw that the last NBA

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player to deal with an oblique injury was Cole Anthony

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of the Orlando Magic. Something. First of all, that's confusing

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the hell out of me. We got it. There needs

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to be an investigation done even to what's happening to

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the core of these players' bodies by being on the Magic.

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But now I look at them as a team and

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theoretically they've condn't used me a few times over because

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as soon as Palo went down at the time, he

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was probably in my top five MVP ballot. We're talking

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about four games or whatever. It is so not a

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big deal, and I was just like, they're done, it's over.

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Then Franz comes out. He's playing exceptionally well, averaging like

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twenty seven points offices per one hundred possessions to his

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teammates without Palo, just absurd. Above average offense when he's

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playing without Palo also absurd. Yeah, yeah, Now, he goes down.

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And it's just initially before they lost Palo and then

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it took I thought, all right, they're done, they need

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to make a trade. Oh, they don't need to make

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a trade, but they're gonna be good enough with or

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without Palo to then still go kind of make a

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trade at the deadline. They felt the quintessential one player

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away team or left alone? Were they the third best

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team in the Eastern Conference squad, whereas you have the

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Celtics and the Cavs and there's still teams that are

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vying for that position. Now I'm just again, I understand

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the identity of this team, what they were doing before

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these injuries, and to their credit, they have taken more

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threes as a share of their shots this year. They

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just aren't going in. I don't know what to expect

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from their offense moving forward. Also right down to the

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fact that what do they do, mister Moore after their

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with their first game without Palo and Franz. They win.

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That's the other thing too. This team is gritty as hell,

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They're fascinating as hell. The defense is absolutely hell fire,

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just to continue using the hell word. But I also

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and maybe I'm overthinking this Pallo. As we're recording this,

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the latest update was there's still no timetable for his return.

242
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So he'd been out this long without a timetable. What

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does that mean for Franz? And then if you're the Magic,

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how do you juggle the weight of immediacy when you

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know that you might only have one or none of

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your star players for more than half the year At

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that point, I don't because I look at this team,

248
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I look at their assets, I look at their timeline. Yeah,

249
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they can do nothing and view this as we'll be

250
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scrappy as hell, we'll see if we can make some

251
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noise in the playoffs and everybody gets healthy. But it's

252
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also all right, You've now paid two of these dudes

253
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in Suggs and Wagner. Their deals are going to kick

254
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in next year. Palo's coming right down the pipeline, and

255
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you know what you need. The way they lost in

256
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the playoffs last year, it was predictable. Their struggles this

257
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year without Palo also predictable. And now it's just, well,

258
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does it ring hollow to say this team should still

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consider itself a serious threat when again, it's not just

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the fact that both Palo and Fronds are down is

261
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that we really just don't have a hold on even

262
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when one of them is going to come back.

263
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Speaker 2: I mean, look, so in a way we can say

264
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they're confusing because we don't know who they are going

265
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to be without them, But at the same time, I

266
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think their situation necessary I don't think their situation.

267
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Speaker 1: Necessarily is confusing.

268
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Speaker 2: It's like your two best players like just went down

269
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with the same injury, and like the leap from you know,

270
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Paolo and Franz to Jalen Sucks at least from an

271
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offensive perspective, is significant.

272
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Speaker 3: Like would you say that a leap Would you say

273
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that a leap to jug.

274
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Speaker 2: I would say that is that is that is quite

275
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the leap to the point where I'm like, I don't

276
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really know who's going to be the focal point at

277
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the offense moving forward here, because like I actually really

278
00:13:20,519 --> 00:13:23,879
like Jalen Suggs, but even though he shot like thirty

279
00:13:23,919 --> 00:13:29,120
nine percent from three last year, I wasn't necessarily sold

280
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on that being you know, a a a sign of

281
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what's to come, Like I always want a couple more

282
00:13:36,759 --> 00:13:39,240
years to buy into a player shooting.

283
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Speaker 1: We've seen this year that shooting has.

284
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Speaker 2: Gone down from the outside Now granted, some of that

285
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is also Paolo going out after five games, So you

286
00:13:48,799 --> 00:13:51,840
don't have that guy who just draws every single double

287
00:13:51,879 --> 00:13:55,399
team that he can, meaning, yeah, who's the ball guy

288
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on this right exactly and right now there isn't anyone

289
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like I think go.

290
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Speaker 3: Goo Batadze would beg to differ, but please carry out. Yeah,

291
00:14:03,720 --> 00:14:06,440
what did he have like in the twenty one I

292
00:14:06,440 --> 00:14:10,399
think the other night and some threes? Good for him?

293
00:14:10,440 --> 00:14:11,919
In that game he was I think four of ten.

294
00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:15,600
Speaker 2: But I honestly think you kind of said it. I

295
00:14:15,639 --> 00:14:19,000
would lean into let's see what happens. But this is

296
00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:22,879
where I'm still a little upset at the KCP signing

297
00:14:22,919 --> 00:14:26,720
because I just don't think they spent their money wisely.

298
00:14:26,759 --> 00:14:29,559
They had Jet Howards, who they drafted eleventh overall, just

299
00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:32,279
kind of winning in the wings, and like, here is

300
00:14:32,320 --> 00:14:35,360
a thirty one year old you're kind of just signing to,

301
00:14:35,919 --> 00:14:38,279
you know, cock block his minutes where I'm like, Wow,

302
00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:41,080
why wouldn't you want to give him a chance when

303
00:14:41,120 --> 00:14:43,320
you drafted him in the lottery? Right, So I was like,

304
00:14:43,919 --> 00:14:45,879
that didn't make a lot of sense to me. At

305
00:14:45,879 --> 00:14:49,519
the same time, I still think they could use a

306
00:14:49,639 --> 00:14:52,600
real point guard. I know that that's a drum that

307
00:14:52,639 --> 00:14:56,519
Magic fans are tired of hearing, and I apologize, but

308
00:14:56,679 --> 00:14:59,879
I just because Magic fans are tired of hearing that criticism,

309
00:15:00,240 --> 00:15:02,960
I don't think it's less important. I don't think it

310
00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:05,720
makes it less true. They do need someone who can

311
00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:08,919
run the show. I Jalen Sucks is at best a compo.

312
00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:12,759
Anthony Black is a project that's like a project with

313
00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:15,519
you know, some upside at the very least, but like

314
00:15:15,519 --> 00:15:18,000
they don't have that guy who you can give the

315
00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:20,799
ball to, who can handle the offense and say, look,

316
00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:23,200
I'm gonna make a play, I'm gonna make a decision.

317
00:15:23,279 --> 00:15:26,639
I'm constantly going to break down defenses and make sure

318
00:15:26,679 --> 00:15:28,440
we get to that point where we need to go.

319
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Speaker 1: That guy isn't there.

320
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Speaker 2: So it's gonna be fascinating as well to see who

321
00:15:33,279 --> 00:15:35,679
comes out of this. As you know, the best player

322
00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:40,759
moving forward is that is Gogopizatse. Then good on him,

323
00:15:40,919 --> 00:15:43,679
and then we're gonna probably have to ask, you know,

324
00:15:43,799 --> 00:15:46,320
some major questions about Wendell Carter Junior's future.

325
00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:50,279
Speaker 3: There does the calculus for them though, change it all

326
00:15:50,399 --> 00:15:53,080
when because I've kind of pushed back it does feel

327
00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:56,279
like they still need an offensive organizer excuse me in

328
00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:59,440
a vacuum. But if you're gonna have one of paloer Fronds,

329
00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:03,639
does it make your trade scope more particular in the

330
00:16:03,679 --> 00:16:05,240
sense or even if you don't want to view it

331
00:16:05,240 --> 00:16:07,480
through the prism of a trade just saying this is

332
00:16:07,519 --> 00:16:09,399
what we need, but it's more particular to where you

333
00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:13,440
want someone who is closer to a combo guard because

334
00:16:13,480 --> 00:16:15,840
you don't want to take the ball out of Franz

335
00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:19,159
or Palo's hands too much, and so rather than I've

336
00:16:19,159 --> 00:16:20,759
seen a lot of people link them to will look

337
00:16:20,759 --> 00:16:23,600
at dearon Fox's situation in Sacramento. Is that someone whose

338
00:16:23,679 --> 00:16:25,960
name could pop up, he'd be a great fit in Orlando.

339
00:16:26,399 --> 00:16:27,840
I don't have a doubt he'd be a good fit,

340
00:16:28,080 --> 00:16:30,720
But like I also think that someone along the lines

341
00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:34,120
of a Anthony Simons is a name that gets thrown

342
00:16:34,120 --> 00:16:37,120
around a lot. Can you rescue whatever's happening with Terry

343
00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:40,480
Rozier in Miami? They could even be an interesting Tyler

344
00:16:40,519 --> 00:16:43,000
hero team if Miami ever decided to sell It feels

345
00:16:43,039 --> 00:16:46,600
like they could go after a player in that vein

346
00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:50,279
who kind of okay. It helps alleviate the burden our

347
00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:52,600
offense is facing in the interim without one or both

348
00:16:52,639 --> 00:16:54,840
of Franz and Palo. But then this isn't going to

349
00:16:54,919 --> 00:16:58,080
necessarily disrupt too much of what's happening when we have

350
00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:01,600
both of those available. In fact, it should better optimize

351
00:17:01,639 --> 00:17:04,680
our offense for the playoffs in the aggregate. However you

352
00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:06,880
would like to frame it, well.

353
00:17:06,759 --> 00:17:09,640
Speaker 2: I mean, look, so the situation they should be looking

354
00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:12,480
more is basically the situation that the Spurs have right

355
00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:15,920
now with Chris Paul right. Like, Chris obviously is their

356
00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:19,599
point guard, but if you watch them play, you'll notice

357
00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:22,400
that he's not necessarily the guy handling the ball. Eighty

358
00:17:22,440 --> 00:17:24,359
eighty five percent of the time right that the ball

359
00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:26,720
goes through their hands of Wemby, it goes through Stefan Castle,

360
00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:29,559
it goes through Devin Mussalva, and he's healthy like and

361
00:17:29,599 --> 00:17:32,759
he's sort of this break last in case of emergency

362
00:17:32,799 --> 00:17:35,799
point guard. Now where hey, look, if we are in

363
00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:38,759
a slump, if we need something, if we if we

364
00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:42,920
need you know, the your high caliber of point guard experience,

365
00:17:43,519 --> 00:17:44,559
we can go to you.

366
00:17:44,559 --> 00:17:45,359
Speaker 1: You are an option.

367
00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:48,480
Speaker 2: And I think that's the type of player they need,

368
00:17:48,559 --> 00:17:50,720
not you know, everyone needs a Chris Paul, Like I'm

369
00:17:50,720 --> 00:17:54,480
not saying Chris Paul specifically, but someone who can play

370
00:17:54,519 --> 00:17:58,359
off of those two without necessarily dominating the ball. But

371
00:17:58,519 --> 00:18:01,880
if you go into an offensive, then you can hand

372
00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:04,440
the ball to that guy and he could just say, hey, yeah,

373
00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:07,000
I got this. Like a guy who I think would

374
00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:09,920
fit that bill. Unfortunately he's you know, he's not gonna

375
00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:13,039
be available. That's Tyas Jones, Like Tyas Jones's gonna be

376
00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:13,680
that guy for them.

377
00:18:14,039 --> 00:18:15,640
Speaker 3: Do you know this guy might not be available either.

378
00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:18,519
But the actual perfect acquisition for Orlando I still think

379
00:18:18,599 --> 00:18:22,359
is Kobe White is love it. Yeah, that's the trade

380
00:18:22,400 --> 00:18:24,720
where it's okay, it's gonna cost you assets, but he

381
00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:26,119
makes a small not it's not gonna cost you at

382
00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:31,279
nearly everything. And oh he comes in full strength, half strength,

383
00:18:31,279 --> 00:18:33,720
where every roster's at. You got to take the magic

384
00:18:33,799 --> 00:18:35,759
way more seriously than you are in this moment.

385
00:18:36,200 --> 00:18:38,880
Speaker 1: Hell, there's another bulls guard that would make sense there, and.

386
00:18:38,880 --> 00:18:39,599
Speaker 3: That's that money.

387
00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:39,960
Speaker 1: Though.

388
00:18:40,799 --> 00:18:42,440
Speaker 3: Oh I thought you were gonna say Zach Lavin, who

389
00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:44,000
would also make sense in Orlando.

390
00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:46,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, no, no, If we're talking about a guy

391
00:18:46,519 --> 00:18:48,000
who can come in and handle the ball and make

392
00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:49,799
place as well, like I would assume it would make

393
00:18:49,839 --> 00:18:53,880
sense there like a big guard. Defensively, he's he's very solid,

394
00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:55,839
has been since he came into the league.

395
00:18:56,119 --> 00:18:57,839
Speaker 1: You know, the three point shooting is.

396
00:18:57,799 --> 00:18:59,400
Speaker 2: A little bit up and down, but we can see

397
00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:01,640
the same amount ecacle magically right.

398
00:19:01,640 --> 00:19:03,839
Speaker 3: Now right, And that's sort of the other thing is

399
00:19:03,839 --> 00:19:06,119
I think anyone who they get on the ball off

400
00:19:06,160 --> 00:19:08,039
the ball, like you need to know that they're a

401
00:19:08,119 --> 00:19:10,759
capslock shooter. And so I couldn't throw a Dessulu in there,

402
00:19:10,799 --> 00:19:12,759
even Fox when he has like the step back going

403
00:19:12,799 --> 00:19:15,079
and can score from the mid range. I want someone

404
00:19:15,119 --> 00:19:17,640
who i'd rather if you're gonna make the ultra home

405
00:19:17,720 --> 00:19:20,279
run trade, which I think that would be a weird

406
00:19:20,839 --> 00:19:22,960
route to go objectively for the magic you have to

407
00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:24,599
figure out a way to straddle the in between now

408
00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:27,680
post injuries, LaMelo ball would be like the home run

409
00:19:27,720 --> 00:19:31,039
absolute home run name rather than someone who's gonna be

410
00:19:31,079 --> 00:19:31,920
an up and down shooter.

411
00:19:32,039 --> 00:19:35,200
Speaker 2: To me anyway, Oh see, that's the perfect situation because

412
00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:37,839
I'm not as high on LaMelo as a lot of people.

413
00:19:37,839 --> 00:19:42,400
But didn't that him in that situation specifically where he

414
00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:45,200
wouldn't have you know, carte blanche to just go out

415
00:19:45,279 --> 00:19:47,799
and jack up forty foot threes whenever he wants to.

416
00:19:47,920 --> 00:19:49,880
Where there's like a higher key that's going to have

417
00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:53,319
to be established, where he will have to streamline his

418
00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:54,279
own shop profile.

419
00:19:54,559 --> 00:19:56,039
Speaker 1: I would love that.

420
00:19:56,039 --> 00:19:57,880
Speaker 2: That's a great call, Like would you have to you

421
00:19:57,920 --> 00:19:59,720
would have to give up something, of course.

422
00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:01,960
Speaker 3: So to wrap on them, I just want to make

423
00:20:02,000 --> 00:20:03,759
it clear. I wanted to talk about the Frond's injury

424
00:20:03,799 --> 00:20:06,519
because I had him. We did our quarter season awards.

425
00:20:06,519 --> 00:20:09,799
He was fourth on my MVP ballot more and I

426
00:20:09,799 --> 00:20:13,680
think he deserved to be there. And I separate value

427
00:20:13,720 --> 00:20:15,799
from like all MBA because it's like value, I think

428
00:20:15,839 --> 00:20:17,440
you speak to more of them. Well where would this

429
00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:21,599
team be without them? Type deal? But regardless, huge loss,

430
00:20:21,759 --> 00:20:24,400
and I still find the magic more compelling than I

431
00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:26,880
thought I was going to following the Palo Bank Caro

432
00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:30,240
injuries specifically, but now it's I think they have a

433
00:20:30,240 --> 00:20:32,480
lot of I don't know if they're tough for just

434
00:20:32,599 --> 00:20:35,279
interesting decisions to make or calls to make or things

435
00:20:35,319 --> 00:20:38,200
to explore now that your two best players are absent.

436
00:20:38,799 --> 00:20:42,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I agree they because of all the things

437
00:20:43,279 --> 00:20:50,599
outlined absolutely confusing. Yeah, I have one that and it's

438
00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,519
weird to call them confusion confusing when they're sixteen and

439
00:20:53,599 --> 00:20:57,640
eight in the West. The Houston Rockets are confusing to me, ooh,

440
00:20:57,759 --> 00:21:00,519
because here's the thing. Oh yeah, no, so here's the thing.

441
00:21:00,519 --> 00:21:03,079
They are winning off of bench defense, right I'm in

442
00:21:03,160 --> 00:21:06,680
Thompson Tari Easton that have won them a ton of games.

443
00:21:07,279 --> 00:21:11,759
Like It's to the point where I'm asking myself, what

444
00:21:11,880 --> 00:21:14,799
about that starting lineup? How much how much juice does

445
00:21:14,839 --> 00:21:19,400
that really have? Because you have Fred van Leet van Leads,

446
00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:23,079
who's you know, a sub forty percent shooter from the field,

447
00:21:23,079 --> 00:21:25,200
not just from range, from like from the field. The

448
00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:26,960
same with Jalen Green, and both of them are in

449
00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:29,240
like the forty two percent range from three.

450
00:21:29,319 --> 00:21:29,839
Speaker 1: So, like the.

451
00:21:29,799 --> 00:21:34,440
Speaker 2: Efficiency from either it's just not there. I think that's

452
00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:36,880
fair to say Dylan Brooks as well, like forty two

453
00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:40,559
percent from from the field not necessarily a high efficiency player.

454
00:21:40,599 --> 00:21:46,160
So you have your starting Rimmer trio are not necessarily

455
00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:52,079
major offensive boosters in terms of like maximizing your offensive efficiency.

456
00:21:52,160 --> 00:21:55,920
If you can't really count on those guys to produce

457
00:21:55,960 --> 00:21:59,000
at the at the level that they'll need to, what

458
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:03,000
exactly is the ceiling of this team into you know,

459
00:22:03,039 --> 00:22:05,160
going into the rest of the season. I do have

460
00:22:05,200 --> 00:22:07,920
some questions about that. Like, don't get me wrong, I

461
00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:11,160
love the fact that Tar Easton and Amen Thompson you know,

462
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:13,640
are killing it from the bench and winning them games

463
00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:14,519
because of their play.

464
00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:17,960
Speaker 1: But I do think there are legitimate.

465
00:22:17,519 --> 00:22:21,920
Speaker 2: Question marks about you know, their their starting lineup and

466
00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:24,480
how they're they're shooting, and how they're producing. Like hell,

467
00:22:24,519 --> 00:22:27,400
we can even throw Jabarie Smith in there also not

468
00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:30,240
necessarily a high efficiency score.

469
00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:32,960
Speaker 1: They have some issues despite their.

470
00:22:32,799 --> 00:22:36,160
Speaker 3: Record, they're yeah, they have issues, but also like that's

471
00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:38,200
starting lineup I think is like a plus eight per

472
00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:40,279
one hundred on the season, and to your point, they're

473
00:22:40,319 --> 00:22:43,799
getting it all done with defense. I'm curious everyone seems

474
00:22:43,799 --> 00:22:45,319
to view them. I mean, by the way, they could

475
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,119
just pull this lever. I don't know if this does

476
00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:49,559
the rest of their rotation, but you insert Amen and

477
00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:52,400
Thompson for Jail and Green and that resulting lineup. Yeah,

478
00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:55,119
even though spatially it feels like it should be worse.

479
00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:59,160
They're just steamrolling opponents right now. I think that's the

480
00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:01,480
that's something that people are already calling for, and I

481
00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:04,680
don't think that's gonna be quieted. I do think because

482
00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:07,480
of the assets they have, because some of their young guys,

483
00:23:07,519 --> 00:23:10,000
I mean, shang Gud and Jail and Green already got extended,

484
00:23:10,039 --> 00:23:12,359
and you're gonna have to talk about Tari Easton and

485
00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:15,240
Jabari Smith Junior leading into this summer. I think people

486
00:23:15,279 --> 00:23:18,839
have pegged them rightfuly so as a big time trade candidate,

487
00:23:19,079 --> 00:23:22,440
I've kind of looked at that and said, the extensions

488
00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:24,519
for Shang Gun and Jail and Green specifically proved to me.

489
00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:27,519
Any decisions happening over the offseason if it's gonna be major,

490
00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:30,240
So I'm I want to know your opinion. My thought

491
00:23:30,279 --> 00:23:33,519
for them has been, if you can judge technically because

492
00:23:33,519 --> 00:23:37,039
you have read Shepherd, the answer long term might already

493
00:23:37,039 --> 00:23:39,640
be on the roster. But what if it I ve

494
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:41,880
bee one of their biggest offensive problems I would say

495
00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:44,519
as not having the floor open enough to wear. Okay,

496
00:23:44,559 --> 00:23:46,799
these guys are missing shots. They're not necessarily getting the

497
00:23:46,839 --> 00:23:49,359
highest quality of perimeter looks. And for someone like Green

498
00:23:49,759 --> 00:23:51,599
or van Fleet or even look at the space with

499
00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,279
which Jabari Smith Junior and al Pray Shangun have to

500
00:23:54,279 --> 00:23:56,440
work with, what if you could just open the floor

501
00:23:56,799 --> 00:23:59,240
with someone who's gonna fly around or at least stretch

502
00:23:59,319 --> 00:24:02,920
defenses and so rather than people and I'm not looping

503
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:05,279
you into this saying they need to go get another

504
00:24:05,359 --> 00:24:07,319
type of point guard or just they need to consolidate

505
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:10,440
and get a mega offensive upgrade if you added and

506
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:13,279
just to shoot. Like I've mentioned his name a few times,

507
00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:15,680
Rockets fans don't love it if you just turn two

508
00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:20,400
of your I think Landale and excuse me, there's Jeff Green,

509
00:24:20,440 --> 00:24:23,200
There's Landale. Who's the other whatever contract? Oh they have,

510
00:24:23,279 --> 00:24:25,960
but they have these whatever contracts. You can just trade

511
00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:29,359
two of them for Duncan Robinson. And if you kind

512
00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:31,599
of insert him into some of these lineups, I think

513
00:24:31,599 --> 00:24:34,279
the floor opens up for everybody else inside the arc.

514
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:39,200
And that could, I would argue, optimize or further weaponize

515
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:43,000
an offense that look even to date like they're eleventh

516
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:45,359
in points per possession. This is not You look at

517
00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:47,079
a bunch of other teams and what do we say,

518
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:49,720
rank in the top ten of offense and defense. They're

519
00:24:49,799 --> 00:24:53,880
second in defense, eleventh in offense. They have their their

520
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:55,559
case to just leave it alone. It's fine, but I

521
00:24:55,640 --> 00:24:58,279
recognize I have had the same questions as you have

522
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:00,680
in the sense of even looking at their net rating

523
00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:03,440
against top ten top ten teams this year, I think

524
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:06,839
they ranked fifth in net rating against top ten teams.

525
00:25:07,079 --> 00:25:09,240
That's great, but over the course of a playoff series,

526
00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:12,039
I will say, it does feel like their offense seems

527
00:25:12,039 --> 00:25:14,400
a bit solvable, right, No.

528
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:16,920
Speaker 2: It does, and I think some of that that's got

529
00:25:17,039 --> 00:25:19,960
lost in all this is the fact that we're talking

530
00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:23,759
about like Amen Thompson and Tarry Easan as defenders coming

531
00:25:23,799 --> 00:25:26,880
off the bench, as I you know outlined earlier, but

532
00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:30,480
both of them are also scoring like eleven twelve points

533
00:25:30,519 --> 00:25:32,759
per game. They're getting an offensive boost from those guys.

534
00:25:34,519 --> 00:25:37,920
That matters, Like you need to have those offensive producers.

535
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:39,680
But if you don't have the floor spacing, if you

536
00:25:39,720 --> 00:25:42,799
don't have the high efficiency player rolling around out there,

537
00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:46,000
I think your call is right on. Like Duncan Robinson

538
00:25:46,039 --> 00:25:49,480
would be so fun to watch there because the way

539
00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:51,119
that he moves off the ball. I don't think a

540
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:53,680
lot of people really appreciate just how much effort he

541
00:25:53,759 --> 00:25:58,559
puts in to making himself open, Like he forces defenses

542
00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:03,839
out of whack constantly, like constantly. That would open a

543
00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:06,240
lot of fun driving lanes a lot of fun like

544
00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:10,440
backdoor opportunities, like I'm in Thompson would feast next to

545
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:11,799
a guy like Robinson.

546
00:26:12,359 --> 00:26:14,240
Speaker 3: Yeah, the contract I was forgetting is like you have

547
00:26:14,319 --> 00:26:17,559
Tate and Landale and they're basically expiring. So if the

548
00:26:17,559 --> 00:26:19,880
Heat want to get off Robinson his money for whatever reason,

549
00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:22,000
like do you attach them seconds? I like that deal,

550
00:26:22,039 --> 00:26:24,799
but I will I think when you're looking at the playoffs,

551
00:26:24,799 --> 00:26:27,200
because that's look, the Rockets are good, they're contending for

552
00:26:27,279 --> 00:26:29,359
one of the top spots in the West. You have

553
00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:31,720
to look at Okay, what's the playoff liability of what

554
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:33,599
they're doing at both ends of the floor. The defense

555
00:26:33,920 --> 00:26:36,160
eleven of ten. No, No, it's like zero questions. The

556
00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:38,279
offense you're doing a lot of your stuff is like

557
00:26:38,279 --> 00:26:42,079
predicated on getting in transition, and a lot of that

558
00:26:42,440 --> 00:26:45,839
against select opponents will go away in the playoffs. And

559
00:26:45,839 --> 00:26:48,880
so they're twenty fourth and half court offense and they're

560
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:51,359
gonna be even worse. Like when you get to that position,

561
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,559
they're still I think they're first in offensive rebounding in

562
00:26:54,599 --> 00:26:55,880
the half court. So like if you're gonna have to

563
00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:57,920
filter that stuff out of the equation, like their first

564
00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:01,400
shot offense is just not very very good relatively. I

565
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:04,119
think you could argue that it's bordering on tragic statistically.

566
00:27:04,599 --> 00:27:07,079
And that's something that I think. I don't I don't

567
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:08,960
say they need to go out and get the player

568
00:27:09,279 --> 00:27:12,000
who improves their like needs to be I guess, a

569
00:27:12,039 --> 00:27:14,519
primary option for their first shot offense, but I would

570
00:27:14,599 --> 00:27:17,000
like to see them get someone who opens up all

571
00:27:17,079 --> 00:27:19,759
their other options for that first shot half court offense.

572
00:27:20,759 --> 00:27:23,279
Speaker 2: No, and look, that's not a heart cell for me either,

573
00:27:23,519 --> 00:27:25,920
like you said earlier, in terms of like you're not

574
00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:29,200
looping me in with you know, going out and consolidating.

575
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:32,119
I've been against consolidating for a while for these guys

576
00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:35,000
because the names they were bringing up were guys in

577
00:27:35,079 --> 00:27:37,559
like their mid thirties. I don't think that's the way

578
00:27:37,599 --> 00:27:40,599
to go about this. Like you have to somewhat stay

579
00:27:41,160 --> 00:27:44,160
true to the timeline to a certain extent. I know

580
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:46,400
that it's not always like you can get guys who

581
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:50,319
are you know, between twenty four and twenty five, I guess,

582
00:27:50,319 --> 00:27:54,759
and then continue that route. But going after Jimmy Butler,

583
00:27:54,759 --> 00:27:57,920
for example, at age forty five going on forty six

584
00:27:58,000 --> 00:27:59,279
next year, like that.

585
00:27:59,079 --> 00:28:01,720
Speaker 3: There's no there's like two players over the age of

586
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,160
thirty five. I would listen to a case for and

587
00:28:04,279 --> 00:28:06,480
it's Steph Curry and Kevin Durant just because of what

588
00:28:06,559 --> 00:28:08,720
those two are on offense, and beyond that, it's and

589
00:28:08,759 --> 00:28:10,559
it seems like they are thinking along the same lines

590
00:28:10,559 --> 00:28:13,119
because more all the picks that they've I mean one,

591
00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:15,240
they've decided we're just going to co opt Phoenix's future,

592
00:28:15,279 --> 00:28:17,799
which I believe is smart. But they have all these

593
00:28:17,839 --> 00:28:20,640
distant first it's very much optionality where they they're gonna

594
00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:22,839
have to make some decisions because they can't fit all

595
00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:24,680
these guys in the roster moving forward. But I don't

596
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:27,559
even think they were Maybe we'll see some movement this summer,

597
00:28:27,599 --> 00:28:30,000
but like the way they've structured themselves with assets, this

598
00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:32,480
was never a team that I thought viewed itself as well.

599
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:34,359
We have to consolidate right now.

600
00:28:35,799 --> 00:28:38,799
Speaker 2: It's super interesting, though, because I understand the appeal, Like

601
00:28:38,839 --> 00:28:40,839
you're looking at a guy like Cam Witmore as well,

602
00:28:40,839 --> 00:28:43,160
who hasn't played a whole lot this year, but he

603
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:45,839
was super intriguing last year. You want to get some

604
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:48,039
of those guys more minutes, like Reach Sheppard is also

605
00:28:48,039 --> 00:28:51,160
only playing like eleven minutes per game, Like I understand

606
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:55,279
why why fans and pundits are like, hey, don't you

607
00:28:55,319 --> 00:28:58,240
want to see more of insert player X here? But

608
00:28:58,359 --> 00:29:01,200
like if you're six and Nate, you also have to

609
00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:04,119
say somewhat true to the current core I guess, but

610
00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:06,759
like I'm still confused though, Like that's what I was.

611
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:10,839
I like watching them, watching them play, like I do

612
00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:12,720
think they have some Jews, but it feels like they're

613
00:29:12,839 --> 00:29:15,640
very Orlando magic Is from last year, where if they

614
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:19,000
make make it to the playoffs, it's gonna take like

615
00:29:19,119 --> 00:29:23,039
what a game two at most if they're up against

616
00:29:23,079 --> 00:29:25,799
a very competent team to.

617
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,920
Speaker 1: Just figure out their offense in its entirety.

618
00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:31,079
Speaker 3: But you did outline another problem, which might be why

619
00:29:31,079 --> 00:29:33,559
they're confusing. I haven't considered them confusing because I just

620
00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:38,039
I think they're great. But you've sold me effectively, is

621
00:29:38,839 --> 00:29:40,839
who are you getting? You're mentioning these are guys that

622
00:29:40,880 --> 00:29:43,359
are not getting a ton of minutes and read Shepherd

623
00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:46,000
and cam whitmore. Who are you Like you're saying stay

624
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:47,480
true to the current corpus, Like, well, then who do

625
00:29:47,519 --> 00:29:50,000
you trade for that would also be good enough to

626
00:29:50,039 --> 00:29:53,000
deserve minutes? And then you're eventually gonna rip those away

627
00:29:53,039 --> 00:29:55,279
from who. I mean, these answer are just like yelling green,

628
00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:57,759
let's let's just strip those minutes down, baby. But like

629
00:29:57,799 --> 00:30:01,000
that's also a complication here where it's okay, yeah, you

630
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:02,799
want to stay true to what you're doing, but whoever

631
00:30:02,799 --> 00:30:04,880
you train for, if you're giving up players who aren't

632
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:08,480
really playing or aren't integral, you got five minutes from somewhere.

633
00:30:09,039 --> 00:30:12,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true. That is true, And ultimately that's what

634
00:30:12,759 --> 00:30:14,799
I think makes them confusing. Like, don't get me wrong,

635
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:18,799
Like Rockets fans should not take this as a point

636
00:30:18,839 --> 00:30:21,440
of criticism because they have been fun to watch and

637
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:24,759
they're winning and they're playing an exciting brand of ball.

638
00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:27,240
Speaker 1: But it's tough to me to look.

639
00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:31,160
Speaker 2: At this roster and go, oh yeah, like Western Conference finals.

640
00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:32,559
Speaker 1: Baby, I'm not there.

641
00:30:32,599 --> 00:30:35,000
Speaker 2: I don't think they're gonna make like, you know, a

642
00:30:35,079 --> 00:30:39,000
Trey Young Hawks run in twenty twenty one anytime soon.

643
00:30:39,359 --> 00:30:43,079
Speaker 1: Okay, Dan, So who is next on your list of

644
00:30:43,359 --> 00:30:45,359
most confusing teams in the NBA.

645
00:30:46,359 --> 00:30:49,279
Speaker 3: I'm going to go with a team that doesn't seem

646
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:53,039
to understand the plot of this season, and that is

647
00:30:53,079 --> 00:30:56,559
the Chicago Bulls, who are sitting tenth as we record

648
00:30:56,599 --> 00:30:59,680
this in the Eastern Conference. They won entirely too many

649
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:02,319
games for where they should be headed, more games than

650
00:31:02,359 --> 00:31:05,440
I think people would be expected. They have the gall

651
00:31:05,799 --> 00:31:08,720
to be way more watchable than I was ever predicting

652
00:31:08,759 --> 00:31:12,799
this season. They play fast, they play free. Zach Lavine

653
00:31:12,799 --> 00:31:15,279
has been an absolute joy this season. Nikola Vucevich is

654
00:31:15,319 --> 00:31:17,640
not making any sense because he's hitting all these shots.

655
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:21,680
Kobe White remains a delight. Josh Getty's first team all

656
00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:25,680
empty calories numbers. That's really fun to see. I look

657
00:31:25,839 --> 00:31:28,279
the Bulls have been. They've been way more entertain Their

658
00:31:28,319 --> 00:31:30,440
defense sucks. It's also been cool to see Lonzo Ball

659
00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:35,759
actually on the court. Their defense sucks. I don't understand,

660
00:31:36,079 --> 00:31:39,599
like what is going on here because this might spill

661
00:31:39,599 --> 00:31:41,519
into some of the trade talk will eventually do, so

662
00:31:41,519 --> 00:31:42,960
I don't want to harp too much on the trade

663
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:47,680
stuff of it all. The organization apparently like is not

664
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:50,000
getting a ton of good offers for zach, Lavine and

665
00:31:50,039 --> 00:31:52,759
Vouch at this point, and that kind of underscores what

666
00:31:52,799 --> 00:31:55,039
we already knew that the offers for these guys were

667
00:31:55,039 --> 00:31:57,359
never gonna get a lot better, and so why are

668
00:31:57,400 --> 00:31:58,960
they still on this team, or why are they still

669
00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:02,359
playing so many minutes? What is your direction? And again

670
00:32:02,720 --> 00:32:04,640
this is not oh, you don't watch the Bulls if

671
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:06,720
you think they suck. I don't think they suck. And

672
00:32:06,799 --> 00:32:10,480
that's the problem. This team needs to suck like it

673
00:32:10,519 --> 00:32:13,920
needs it doesn't. Their direction sucks. It's incoherent, and they

674
00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:16,279
continue to confuse me because if you look at the

675
00:32:16,319 --> 00:32:18,640
way they've played this year and right, these are all

676
00:32:18,680 --> 00:32:22,200
good harbingers. But because you have guys on the contracts,

677
00:32:22,240 --> 00:32:25,000
you do unless you were looking to move Kobe White,

678
00:32:25,039 --> 00:32:27,640
which I could argue that still should be in consideration

679
00:32:27,799 --> 00:32:29,440
just because of the contract he's on. Do you want

680
00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:31,119
to pay him Megan dollars when you're not gonna be

681
00:32:31,119 --> 00:32:33,400
good enough? But I'm throwing that out of the equation.

682
00:32:34,119 --> 00:32:36,240
Like the zach Lavine and Kolovucevic I for off, they

683
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:39,599
don't play another second this season, their trade value to

684
00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:43,119
me isn't really gonna change, and so it's time to

685
00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:45,880
really lean into this skin rather than are you gonna

686
00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:49,960
continue to chase spots nine through twelve in the East.

687
00:32:50,119 --> 00:32:54,720
And I do think what's happening too is they're sacrificing

688
00:32:54,759 --> 00:32:58,079
some like valuable time here because they're just Eastern Conference

689
00:32:58,079 --> 00:33:00,480
teams and teams in the NBA that are so much

690
00:33:00,519 --> 00:33:03,799
worse when you look at Washington specifically in the East.

691
00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:06,119
New Orleans has been a disaster this year. The Jazz

692
00:33:06,160 --> 00:33:10,079
are determined not to win any basketball games. This team

693
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,440
should be in contention for just like a bottom five record,

694
00:33:14,160 --> 00:33:17,359
flat out, and yes, that is still possible. But at

695
00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:20,000
the same time, it's all right, you're we're getting to

696
00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:23,359
a point where trade season's about the kickoff. Do you

697
00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:25,720
understand what the plot of this season is supposed to

698
00:33:25,759 --> 00:33:28,640
be from them? And I say, this is just I

699
00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:30,799
also would argue I didn't expect them to be in

700
00:33:30,799 --> 00:33:32,920
this predicament. If they didn't make you could have given

701
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,000
me this exact rotational pattern that they have right now,

702
00:33:36,359 --> 00:33:38,119
and I would have predicted that the Bulls are far

703
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:39,759
worse than they actually are. And so that is a

704
00:33:39,799 --> 00:33:42,359
credit to the players, to the coaching staff for sure. Again,

705
00:33:42,359 --> 00:33:44,599
they've been pretty entertaining on the offensive end this year,

706
00:33:44,839 --> 00:33:46,480
but I also feel like what they're doing right now

707
00:33:46,559 --> 00:33:48,759
is potentially problematic for their long term future.

708
00:33:49,759 --> 00:33:54,880
Speaker 2: You basically just spoil the entire article that I wrote

709
00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:57,279
about them over at jahou a couple months ago, because

710
00:33:57,319 --> 00:33:59,599
that was basically it. You just summed it up in

711
00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:03,720
like two three minute blurb. That's exactly the point they

712
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:08,280
I commend them for actually changing their shot profile, because

713
00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:10,599
I don't want to be one of those people I've

714
00:34:10,639 --> 00:34:12,519
been harping on this for years that they had one

715
00:34:12,519 --> 00:34:15,320
of the league's worst shot profiles. Then when they go

716
00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:18,239
out and actually change it, I do think it deserves

717
00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:24,760
some level of note of compliment, really because finally you

718
00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:28,000
do something that's that's the right thing to do, but

719
00:34:28,119 --> 00:34:34,400
the timing of which is so utterly confusing, so weird,

720
00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:36,920
which is just the perfect way, Like this should really

721
00:34:36,920 --> 00:34:41,719
be just the Chicago Bulls episode because it makes no sense.

722
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:44,559
Nothing makes sense here, Like this is the year they

723
00:34:44,599 --> 00:34:47,239
should bottom out for Cooper Flag, they refuse to bottom

724
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:49,960
out for Wemby and like it.

725
00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:51,639
Speaker 1: It just it.

726
00:34:51,639 --> 00:34:55,960
Speaker 2: It's almost bewildering at this point why they persist in

727
00:34:56,039 --> 00:34:59,559
this idea that hey, look, trying to make it in

728
00:34:59,599 --> 00:35:03,159
to the PL tournament beats going out and actually getting

729
00:35:03,159 --> 00:35:06,679
a chance at a real time superstar, Like I know

730
00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:08,800
there are no assurances in the draft. Don't get me wrong,

731
00:35:08,840 --> 00:35:11,440
I'm not saying that you know, you know you're gonna

732
00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:13,800
win number one. But like the twenty twenty five draft,

733
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:17,960
let's just be real about this. Everyone worth listening to

734
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:20,199
her saying, oh, yeah, the draft is back, baby, this

735
00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:23,480
is going to be a sick, thick year, Like it's

736
00:35:23,519 --> 00:35:26,199
going to be a lot of All stars in this draft.

737
00:35:26,519 --> 00:35:27,480
Speaker 1: And the Bulls are like.

738
00:35:28,079 --> 00:35:32,360
Speaker 2: Nope, and they even, oh, this year's pick to the

739
00:35:32,360 --> 00:35:35,559
Spurs at least if it falls outside the top ten.

740
00:35:36,519 --> 00:35:40,119
So like, could you imagine that they get the eleventh

741
00:35:40,440 --> 00:35:44,280
and they have to fork that thing over and the

742
00:35:44,360 --> 00:35:47,639
Spurs just gets an All Star at that point, like

743
00:35:48,760 --> 00:35:50,639
it's so and then like they should have learned their

744
00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:55,760
lesson because remember when they traded for Booch ultimately that

745
00:35:55,880 --> 00:36:00,800
the Magic get for him Franz Wagner like the Jet

746
00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:01,440
Howard too.

747
00:36:01,639 --> 00:36:05,800
Speaker 1: I mean, it's they just don't learn from their mistakes.

748
00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 3: You know. What is also confusing is what do you

749
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:13,760
think that they're doing wrong specifically when you look at

750
00:36:13,800 --> 00:36:15,960
who like the roster as because we could say trade

751
00:36:16,039 --> 00:36:18,000
like the zach Lavine if you have an offer for

752
00:36:18,079 --> 00:36:21,039
zack Lavine that doesn't entail ruining your books or costing

753
00:36:21,079 --> 00:36:24,599
you picks. Ditto, for vouch, just do it because that

754
00:36:24,639 --> 00:36:28,159
feels like or stop playing them. That will be politically

755
00:36:28,199 --> 00:36:31,400
disastrous and I can't imagine either be happy about it. Right,

756
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:34,079
that almost feels like because they've done like we know

757
00:36:34,159 --> 00:36:35,920
a lot more about Maybe it took them too long

758
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:38,079
to get to Modus buzzellis this year, like who didn't

759
00:36:38,079 --> 00:36:39,960
play that much during the first fifteen games or whatever,

760
00:36:40,119 --> 00:36:42,119
but now we have more information on him I've had.

761
00:36:42,280 --> 00:36:44,599
I never would have guessed that I had Julian Phillips

762
00:36:44,599 --> 00:36:47,760
moments that were actually encouraging this season. So they are like,

763
00:36:48,199 --> 00:36:51,960
we've seen stuff from a team that is somewhat acting

764
00:36:52,239 --> 00:36:56,199
like it's in this interim period, but not enough. And

765
00:36:56,239 --> 00:36:57,760
I don't know who to I mean like, you're playing

766
00:36:58,119 --> 00:37:00,800
like Josh Giddy and Patrick Williams play and they're statistically

767
00:37:01,159 --> 00:37:04,039
yes they can. Josh Getty specifically will have good numbers,

768
00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:07,239
but his on court time, like that's been damaging to

769
00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:10,639
wins and that's good. Didn't play Patrick Williams more up

770
00:37:10,679 --> 00:37:12,960
that offensive usage, baby, let's see I want to see

771
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:15,719
more Patrick Williams ISOs. Let's time this guy operate over

772
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:19,199
ball screens, running pick and rolls. But that's Also what

773
00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:21,679
makes them confusing to me is do you think that

774
00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:26,480
moving or like, because I guess what I'm getting at

775
00:37:26,559 --> 00:37:29,480
is it feels like the most effective way for them

776
00:37:29,519 --> 00:37:32,000
to get where we believe they need to be is

777
00:37:32,039 --> 00:37:34,400
to make the call that we know they're not ready

778
00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:36,519
to make and say, well, it's not just a matter

779
00:37:36,559 --> 00:37:39,440
of moving Zachlvine and Vooch, it's Kobe White. It's time

780
00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:41,800
to capitalize on that. Like it's That's what I'm waiting for.

781
00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:44,039
Is the tough decision of because even when it got

782
00:37:44,079 --> 00:37:47,119
to Caruso and DeRozan, it was just, well, DeRozan's a

783
00:37:47,119 --> 00:37:49,199
free agent, that's a sign and trade. The decision was

784
00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:51,719
almost kind of made for you, but not really, and

785
00:37:51,800 --> 00:37:54,320
Cruso was very anti climactic the way that ended. He

786
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:57,000
didn't get any picks for get out in front of

787
00:37:57,079 --> 00:37:58,760
Now you've had you have zach Levine and Voots to

788
00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:03,599
points where I would say they have definitely been degraded

789
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:06,599
as trade assets on their current contracts, regardless of how

790
00:38:06,599 --> 00:38:09,800
well they're playing, and don't get to that point with

791
00:38:09,880 --> 00:38:11,840
someone else where it's Kobe White. I don't think his

792
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:13,519
trade value is ever going to be higher than it

793
00:38:13,559 --> 00:38:16,480
is now. Honestly, it's probably been lower since the summer,

794
00:38:16,559 --> 00:38:18,679
just because he has less time left on one of

795
00:38:18,719 --> 00:38:20,639
the biggest deals in the one of the best deals,

796
00:38:20,679 --> 00:38:23,199
excuse me, in the league. And I understand that he's

797
00:38:23,239 --> 00:38:24,800
young enough to be part of the next phase of

798
00:38:24,800 --> 00:38:27,440
their plan. You got to map out what the next

799
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:29,199
phase of that plan is for me before you sell

800
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:31,480
me on keeping this player, who I think is more

801
00:38:31,599 --> 00:38:34,639
valuable to you and where you should be going as

802
00:38:34,639 --> 00:38:36,440
a trade asset. And I think that is probably the

803
00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,760
most unpopular Bulls opinion I would have relative to Chicago fans,

804
00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:43,360
And I think that's fine, But like I just yet

805
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:49,360
to see this team make decisions that point toward a singular,

806
00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:53,679
coherent vision for beyond the moment, and they're still right

807
00:38:53,719 --> 00:38:56,320
now there Again, maybe they were expecting to be worse.

808
00:38:56,320 --> 00:38:58,000
We saw this with the Jazz a couple of years ago,

809
00:38:58,320 --> 00:39:00,920
two straight seasons of just being better than they expected.

810
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:03,360
I get it, But like the Bulls' margin for error

811
00:39:03,920 --> 00:39:06,400
isn't what the Jazz have because they didn't get here

812
00:39:07,039 --> 00:39:09,920
by trading a bunch of big names and getting a

813
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:11,639
ton of draft picks the way that the Jazz.

814
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:13,840
Speaker 1: Right fully agree.

815
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:17,400
Speaker 2: I wrote about this in September, because, like you, I've

816
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:19,960
been I've been voicing the Kobe Kobe White thing for

817
00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:23,639
a while now, much to the frustration of Bulls fans,

818
00:39:24,719 --> 00:39:25,519
which I get.

819
00:39:25,519 --> 00:39:27,679
Speaker 3: I don't want to be the person that's your team

820
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:30,079
needs to trade all of their good players. Yeah, but

821
00:39:30,159 --> 00:39:32,440
like the Bulls who kind of put themselves in maybe

822
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:34,480
it's just all right, don't trade Kobe White, but like,

823
00:39:34,559 --> 00:39:37,840
let's you really need to steer into this skid somehow,

824
00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:41,000
and it's Zach Levine and vouch are kind of used

825
00:39:41,000 --> 00:39:43,079
as the two biggest billboards for where they are, and

826
00:39:43,079 --> 00:39:46,559
they've been two of their three best players this season.

827
00:39:47,159 --> 00:39:49,679
But like, I don't even know, maybe that will do

828
00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:52,000
enough damage if it's just hey, not really playing those

829
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:54,559
guys or moving them. Okay, do that and then see

830
00:39:54,559 --> 00:39:58,199
where to still be here where? And it's I guess

831
00:39:58,239 --> 00:40:00,320
it would be different even too if it well, those

832
00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:02,800
guys really aren't playing a ton of minutes. Zach Colvine's

833
00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:05,440
at thirty three plus for the season, Nicole Vucevic is

834
00:40:05,440 --> 00:40:07,800
at Granted they don't just have bigs at all, but

835
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:10,960
he's almost at thirty two minutes per game, so it

836
00:40:11,519 --> 00:40:14,960
doesn't feel like this team understands what it I won't

837
00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:17,039
even say it has a plan and it's backfired. I

838
00:40:17,079 --> 00:40:19,320
don't think they even understand what they're supposed to be

839
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:20,320
doing at the moment. Right.

840
00:40:20,679 --> 00:40:23,880
Speaker 2: No, And so that is basically the consensus as well,

841
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:28,599
which is like a tourist Carnishovis and Mark Eversley that

842
00:40:28,679 --> 00:40:32,239
they have some serious shortcomings in understanding how to take

843
00:40:32,239 --> 00:40:38,199
advantage of certain situations. The Kobe White thing. Like again

844
00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:42,280
I wrote about this in September. I understand their predicament

845
00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:44,440
because of the one hundred and forty percent extension limit,

846
00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:48,159
and to some extent, I also sympathize with the Bulls because,

847
00:40:48,639 --> 00:40:52,760
let's be real, the one hundred and forty percent extension limit,

848
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:56,159
which which raised from one to twenty in the recent CPA,

849
00:40:56,920 --> 00:41:01,679
is penalizing teams for Nick cootiating. Well, like that's the

850
00:41:01,719 --> 00:41:03,719
one thing the Bulls have done extremely well, Like they

851
00:41:03,800 --> 00:41:07,519
got you know, Kobe White back. What was that deal?

852
00:41:07,719 --> 00:41:11,559
Three years forty six That's yeah, that's exceptional value. I

853
00:41:11,679 --> 00:41:15,599
would assum of three years twenty one million also exceptional value.

854
00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:19,360
Like even the Jalen Smith contract this year, what which

855
00:41:19,559 --> 00:41:23,360
was I think three years twenty eight right now?

856
00:41:23,559 --> 00:41:26,280
Speaker 1: Was it twenty eight? Somewhere along those lines.

857
00:41:26,079 --> 00:41:28,320
Speaker 3: It was three twenty seven, I think, although to be fair,

858
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:31,239
that apped them and then made the entire DeMar to

859
00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:34,280
Rosen of it all more difficult though.

860
00:41:34,480 --> 00:41:37,199
Speaker 2: Right, But even even though I'm just talking about like

861
00:41:37,599 --> 00:41:39,480
the value, they know how to get bang for the

862
00:41:39,480 --> 00:41:43,079
buck in terms of like contractual assets. So it is

863
00:41:43,199 --> 00:41:46,320
hard to like point the finger at the bulls and say, well, look,

864
00:41:46,800 --> 00:41:49,280
you're dumb because you've got Kobe White back on a

865
00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:52,960
great deal, Like the league shouldn't penalize teams for getting

866
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:55,480
guys back on good deals, Like it's a dumb thing.

867
00:41:55,599 --> 00:41:59,480
And I asked Mark Tatum this somewhat recently, and he

868
00:41:59,599 --> 00:42:02,480
was like, well, we're we haven't had that conversation yet,

869
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:04,960
but we're gonna We're gonna review it and we'll see

870
00:42:05,239 --> 00:42:07,320
down the line about the one hundred and forty percent rule.

871
00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:09,599
But like the fact of the matter remains, the one

872
00:42:09,679 --> 00:42:11,920
hundred and forty percent limit is in place.

873
00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:13,199
Speaker 1: You can't extend Kobe.

874
00:42:12,920 --> 00:42:15,119
Speaker 2: White because why would he ever agree to that. You

875
00:42:15,159 --> 00:42:19,000
haven't made yourself attractive enough for Kobe to sit there

876
00:42:19,039 --> 00:42:21,199
in free agency in twenty twenty six and go, oh

877
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:23,280
my god, I love the Bulls. You're so competitive. You

878
00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:25,679
really I can really win here. No, he's gonna fucking leave.

879
00:42:25,719 --> 00:42:27,639
That's gonna happen. Listen real about it.

880
00:42:27,800 --> 00:42:30,480
Speaker 3: You have to, I would argue, yes, But also, if

881
00:42:30,480 --> 00:42:32,559
they're willing to pay him, we might just stay. They're

882
00:42:32,559 --> 00:42:33,920
gonna the free agency market.

883
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:36,920
Speaker 2: Yes, this that there is that. I know that they

884
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:39,440
can pay him. But here's the thing, You're still risking

885
00:42:39,519 --> 00:42:43,039
him going into unrestricted free agency. That's kind of your point. Yeah,

886
00:42:43,079 --> 00:42:46,320
like you can't necessarily bang on the fact that you

887
00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:49,239
are that you're able to contain him. That's the thing.

888
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:52,559
You have to risk it. And if he then leaves,

889
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:55,440
you get nothing in return for him. You just you

890
00:42:55,519 --> 00:42:59,039
don't get Jack in return. So the trait that I

891
00:42:59,079 --> 00:43:01,119
came up with, I don't know if I ever mentioned

892
00:43:01,119 --> 00:43:03,679
this to you, I probably have. It's a Spurs trade.

893
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:07,079
I'm sending both him and Io to the Spurs. Did

894
00:43:07,159 --> 00:43:07,440
I ever?

895
00:43:08,079 --> 00:43:09,239
Speaker 3: No? I don't think No.

896
00:43:09,880 --> 00:43:13,519
Speaker 2: All right, Sat Collins and Malchi Brandam goes back. That's

897
00:43:13,599 --> 00:43:17,679
just the contractual stuff. Okay, the Bulls get their full

898
00:43:17,719 --> 00:43:20,559
control of their pick back twenty twenty five this year,

899
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:24,760
So like they have it, even if they finish eleventh

900
00:43:24,800 --> 00:43:28,159
or twelve, it's theirs, and then they get the unprotected

901
00:43:28,199 --> 00:43:31,639
Hawks pick in twenty twenty seven via the Spurs.

902
00:43:32,119 --> 00:43:35,199
Speaker 3: I wonder if that's enough, just because you can.

903
00:43:35,119 --> 00:43:35,679
Speaker 1: Ask for more.

904
00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:37,719
Speaker 2: Like Jason patt Say said the same thing to me

905
00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:39,719
when I when I pitched him this, like he said,

906
00:43:39,760 --> 00:43:41,119
you can you can probably ask for more.

907
00:43:41,400 --> 00:43:45,280
Speaker 1: That's fine. But like as a raw parameter, I don't

908
00:43:45,280 --> 00:43:46,360
hate that construct.

909
00:43:47,000 --> 00:43:48,639
Speaker 3: No, I don't. I don't hate it either. I think

910
00:43:48,679 --> 00:43:51,320
you would probably because the thing about getting control back

911
00:43:51,360 --> 00:43:53,559
of your own pick this year is that if you are,

912
00:43:54,320 --> 00:43:57,079
if you're trading Kobe White, like, you don't have to

913
00:43:57,079 --> 00:43:59,920
worry about that pick conveying. So I don't know what

914
00:44:00,039 --> 00:44:01,800
type of and if you don't want it to convey,

915
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:04,159
let's be honest, you can make sure it doesn't convey

916
00:44:04,199 --> 00:44:06,920
without regaining control of it. So, and I guess what

917
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:07,159
is it?

918
00:44:07,320 --> 00:44:09,880
Speaker 1: You can worry about it. If Nikola Vusovich keeps shooting

919
00:44:09,920 --> 00:44:11,199
fifty from the.

920
00:44:11,119 --> 00:44:13,800
Speaker 3: Field, come on, you can control that though by not

921
00:44:13,840 --> 00:44:17,840
playing him or playing him less or treating him so.

922
00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:22,599
But yeah, I mean Kobe White or San Antonio Orlando,

923
00:44:22,639 --> 00:44:24,199
you can get a bunch of teams where he makes

924
00:44:24,639 --> 00:44:27,280
a ton of sense. I just don't know if the

925
00:44:27,320 --> 00:44:29,960
Bulls are thinking in those terms. I don't even know

926
00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:31,920
if they're thinking in those terms. Enough with Zach Lavine

927
00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:34,360
and Nikolovuvich, which probably good time to get to your

928
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:37,800
next team, but that really just spotlights the problem here.

929
00:44:39,239 --> 00:44:40,039
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're not wrong.

930
00:44:40,079 --> 00:44:41,880
Speaker 2: I mean, look, we can we can go so long

931
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:44,960
on this team because I think we can also agree

932
00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:47,599
like Dan, that this has to be the most confusing

933
00:44:47,599 --> 00:44:50,280
team in the NBA, Like of all the teams that

934
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:52,199
we're talking about, they have to be a top.

935
00:44:52,760 --> 00:44:55,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that they're They're close to it. I

936
00:44:55,000 --> 00:44:57,360
think you could probably make some like confusing cases for

937
00:44:57,440 --> 00:44:59,480
good teams where it's kind of like, well why are

938
00:44:59,519 --> 00:45:02,000
the Clippers this good? Like be pleasantly confused, but in

939
00:45:02,119 --> 00:45:06,880
terms of just like just immeasurable confusion, Yeah, they're They're

940
00:45:06,920 --> 00:45:08,280
definitely topping the charts there.

941
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:12,320
Speaker 2: Well, thank you for that segue. I really appreciate it

942
00:45:12,360 --> 00:45:15,840
because we are going to Los Angeles Clippers that that

943
00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:18,239
actually was the next team on my list, So thank

944
00:45:18,239 --> 00:45:22,079
you for that. I look, I'm just confused at how

945
00:45:22,519 --> 00:45:23,360
they keep winning.

946
00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:24,119
Speaker 1: I'm impressed.

947
00:45:24,239 --> 00:45:27,159
Speaker 2: Don't get me wrong, I'm very impressed, but I'm also confused,

948
00:45:27,159 --> 00:45:30,480
and I'm wondering if the clock is ticking on this

949
00:45:30,559 --> 00:45:34,920
because they are fourteen and eleven in the Western Conference,

950
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:38,760
with James Harden shooting under or heating under thirty eight

951
00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:42,519
percent of his shots this year, which is like, if

952
00:45:42,559 --> 00:45:45,960
I told you that before the season, just knowing well

953
00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:49,039
that Kawhi wasn't gonna play and James Harden was going

954
00:45:49,079 --> 00:45:51,320
to hit like thirty seven point nine percent of his

955
00:45:51,320 --> 00:45:54,360
his shots twenty four games into the season, you would

956
00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:56,119
have told me that they would have been right in

957
00:45:56,119 --> 00:45:59,880
the line for Cooper flag. We're not there, man, We're not.

958
00:46:00,119 --> 00:46:03,800
They're winning. I mean I saw them at the Intuit

959
00:46:03,840 --> 00:46:06,599
Dome come back and pete the Spurs after being down

960
00:46:07,079 --> 00:46:10,679
forty to fourteen in the first quarter. Like they have

961
00:46:10,760 --> 00:46:13,599
some fight, They have some gusto. Like I'm still confused

962
00:46:13,599 --> 00:46:16,480
about their ceiling, but I'm also just confused, is how

963
00:46:16,519 --> 00:46:18,039
do they keep getting away with this?

964
00:46:19,280 --> 00:46:22,440
Speaker 3: The look we kind of just discussed when we were

965
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:24,519
doing awards because we were talking about Chris Dunn for

966
00:46:24,559 --> 00:46:28,519
all Defense sort of relitigated their decision to let Paul

967
00:46:28,559 --> 00:46:31,960
George walk, and then the machinations that allowed you Primarily

968
00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:34,599
you brought back Nick Patoom, you bring in Chris Dunn,

969
00:46:34,599 --> 00:46:36,480
you bring in Derek Jones Junior. The defense of this

970
00:46:36,559 --> 00:46:40,119
team is just ferocious, and I think you probably could

971
00:46:40,159 --> 00:46:43,320
have predicted most of that. The things that stand out

972
00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:47,519
there for me specifically would be, Okay, how are they

973
00:46:47,559 --> 00:46:50,440
this small? They have one guy who's taller than six

974
00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:53,440
' eight who's a heavy used rotation player, that's if

975
00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:57,320
he's a zoobots and yet they're what first in defense

976
00:46:57,360 --> 00:47:01,079
of rebounding despite so they're second now behind Golden State,

977
00:47:01,480 --> 00:47:04,840
So that's something that stood out. And then offensively, Norman

978
00:47:04,880 --> 00:47:07,639
Powell just looking like a viable number two option, upping

979
00:47:07,719 --> 00:47:11,360
his self creation, getting downhill more. Still not facilitating a time.

980
00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:15,159
That's fine, but his efficiency is intact beside the excuse me,

981
00:47:15,199 --> 00:47:19,639
in spite of this just demonstrative, demonstrable excuse me, uptick.

982
00:47:19,639 --> 00:47:23,199
I can't talk while I'm sick, apparently uptick in volume.

983
00:47:23,599 --> 00:47:26,719
So they have confused me as well. But you know

984
00:47:26,760 --> 00:47:28,719
where the confusion kind of stems from now is that

985
00:47:28,760 --> 00:47:31,039
you thought they were kind of just trapped in no

986
00:47:31,119 --> 00:47:32,840
man's land because you mentioned they should be first in

987
00:47:32,880 --> 00:47:36,119
line for Cooper flag. Doesn't fucking matter. Oklahoma City would

988
00:47:36,159 --> 00:47:37,239
be first in mine for Cooper flag.

989
00:47:37,239 --> 00:47:40,960
Speaker 2: If the Clippers that's true, that you know, that is

990
00:47:41,119 --> 00:47:42,719
very for a point, but you know what I meant though,

991
00:47:42,760 --> 00:47:43,360
like I was just.

992
00:47:45,239 --> 00:47:45,800
Speaker 1: In the league.

993
00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:48,400
Speaker 3: But that that makes them, This makes them more confusing

994
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:50,760
because it's it seems like they were kind of just

995
00:47:50,760 --> 00:47:53,360
gonna eat their medicine and either tear it down anyway

996
00:47:53,440 --> 00:47:55,719
or just hover near the bottom of the middle of

997
00:47:55,760 --> 00:47:58,079
the league. And now it's, well, they haven't had Kawhi

998
00:47:58,119 --> 00:48:00,679
play yet, and if you come back, if he's even

999
00:48:00,679 --> 00:48:04,159
playing twenty minutes a game, that is huge for your offense,

1000
00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:07,159
the load that it takes off James Harden's shoulders. But

1001
00:48:07,199 --> 00:48:10,000
then they're also confusing because did you ever expect me

1002
00:48:10,039 --> 00:48:13,280
to ask you this question? More is should the twenty

1003
00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:17,360
twenty five Los Angeles Clippers view themselves as aggressive buyers

1004
00:48:17,400 --> 00:48:20,039
at the deadline because they are, like they're still in

1005
00:48:20,079 --> 00:48:23,039
this window, like they have Kawhi and a roster. You

1006
00:48:23,039 --> 00:48:25,559
don't own your picks anyway, You're good enough to hover

1007
00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:30,039
without Kawhi Leonard, without a good offense around the fringes

1008
00:48:30,239 --> 00:48:35,239
of the Western Conference playoff discussion, shouldn't you hashtag go

1009
00:48:35,719 --> 00:48:37,679
for it? Whatever that looks like. But then you could

1010
00:48:37,679 --> 00:48:40,119
also make the case of, well, how much better who's

1011
00:48:40,159 --> 00:48:42,360
the best player they can acquire by putting a twenty

1012
00:48:42,400 --> 00:48:45,480
thirty or twenty thirty one first round pick on the table.

1013
00:48:45,679 --> 00:48:47,760
They answer that question is I don't fucking know, but

1014
00:48:47,840 --> 00:48:49,960
this team is good enough at this point for us

1015
00:48:49,960 --> 00:48:52,760
to consider the possibility.

1016
00:48:53,440 --> 00:48:56,679
Speaker 2: He said, like, what do you use as a trade

1017
00:48:56,760 --> 00:48:58,079
chip in the salar matchup chip?

1018
00:48:58,119 --> 00:49:01,519
Speaker 3: Though you have PJ Tucker flow around in there, you

1019
00:49:01,559 --> 00:49:02,880
can't trade Zubos and.

1020
00:49:03,480 --> 00:49:06,559
Speaker 2: No, but like PJ is like eleven and a half million,

1021
00:49:06,599 --> 00:49:09,320
I'm talking about like a big name, like if we're

1022
00:49:09,360 --> 00:49:12,239
talking about Cyclobean or someone of that ILK.

1023
00:49:12,760 --> 00:49:14,960
Speaker 3: So they can't do that trade anymore unless you're gonna

1024
00:49:14,960 --> 00:49:17,239
get rid of Norman Powell, who I just has turned

1025
00:49:17,280 --> 00:49:19,440
has gone from I think people were kind of net

1026
00:49:19,480 --> 00:49:21,840
negative on his contract, and now it looks like, oh, no,

1027
00:49:21,880 --> 00:49:25,480
you can't. You can't move that guy. Why would you ever? Uh?

1028
00:49:25,679 --> 00:49:28,920
I mean, they can consolidate, which helps their case. So

1029
00:49:29,639 --> 00:49:31,840
I mean I thought I proposed this. I don't mean

1030
00:49:31,880 --> 00:49:34,760
to like harp on Kobe White, Kenny Beacham of Kenny

1031
00:49:34,760 --> 00:49:37,159
for Real, who was a Bulls fan, hated it, Kobe

1032
00:49:37,159 --> 00:49:40,159
White and like that twenty thirty one first, and then

1033
00:49:40,239 --> 00:49:42,400
you include a swap in twenty thirty Does that get

1034
00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:46,960
you Kobe White? Use PJ. Tucker and small salary X

1035
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:50,880
for that? That's probably My guess is that's not enough

1036
00:49:50,920 --> 00:49:54,119
because you can even include Terrence Man instead of PJ. Tucker.

1037
00:49:54,159 --> 00:49:56,079
But my guess is Chicago's.

1038
00:49:55,639 --> 00:49:59,480
Speaker 1: Front office on Terrence Man? How dare you well?

1039
00:49:59,519 --> 00:50:02,119
Speaker 3: The problem with what the situation the Clippers are in, though,

1040
00:50:02,440 --> 00:50:07,159
is any primary trade appeal that they send out will

1041
00:50:07,199 --> 00:50:10,480
not convey for approximately eternity. And if you're a front

1042
00:50:10,519 --> 00:50:13,960
office unless you're OKC or maybe Houston at this point

1043
00:50:14,239 --> 00:50:18,679
where you just have unflappable job stability, it's tough to

1044
00:50:18,719 --> 00:50:21,519
sell that to ownership to your fan base of we're

1045
00:50:21,559 --> 00:50:24,239
taking back salary filler in a twenty thirty one or

1046
00:50:24,239 --> 00:50:26,960
twenty thirty first round pick to give up this guy

1047
00:50:27,000 --> 00:50:31,320
who's good, but like they could get could they get

1048
00:50:31,360 --> 00:50:34,360
Dennis Shrewder without having to give up a first round pick? Outright?

1049
00:50:34,440 --> 00:50:36,880
Like can you get the money to work there? Maybe not?

1050
00:50:37,039 --> 00:50:40,000
But like those are imagine making that type of an upgrade.

1051
00:50:40,000 --> 00:50:42,039
It doesn't have to be a fringe star type. If

1052
00:50:42,079 --> 00:50:45,519
you put Dennis Schreuder on this team, their offense is

1053
00:50:45,519 --> 00:50:47,239
gonna hum more for sure.

1054
00:50:48,159 --> 00:50:49,760
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't see why you could. And he's

1055
00:50:49,760 --> 00:50:51,719
a free agent after this summer, but.

1056
00:50:51,760 --> 00:50:54,800
Speaker 3: I'm sure Brooklyn might you know, if the offer is

1057
00:50:55,239 --> 00:50:57,159
I probably would give up Man for Dennis Shrud. I'm

1058
00:50:57,159 --> 00:50:59,079
not gonna lie. So maybe Brooklyn looks at Man as

1059
00:50:59,119 --> 00:51:01,360
just more monitor that contract move forward. You could still

1060
00:51:01,360 --> 00:51:04,280
defend really well when he's healthy. But like if you

1061
00:51:04,280 --> 00:51:06,119
could do Man in seconds for and I don't know

1062
00:51:06,199 --> 00:51:07,519
what the money is on that one, you might have

1063
00:51:07,639 --> 00:51:10,519
include another small salary maybe, But like could Brooklyn say, well,

1064
00:51:10,519 --> 00:51:12,639
we're gonna get better seconds from someone else because the

1065
00:51:12,679 --> 00:51:16,239
Clippers aren't exactually flush with like draft picks in general.

1066
00:51:17,840 --> 00:51:21,000
Speaker 2: No, like the draft capital is always going to be

1067
00:51:21,039 --> 00:51:24,559
limiting to them because they just gave up everything for

1068
00:51:24,639 --> 00:51:27,880
a while there. I don't know the answer to that.

1069
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:29,960
It's a really good one though, Like if they want

1070
00:51:29,960 --> 00:51:35,159
to be buyers, I guess I guess the question for

1071
00:51:35,239 --> 00:51:39,039
me is, even if they were buyers, one, what type

1072
00:51:39,079 --> 00:51:43,320
of player can they bring in that truly moves the needle. Secondarily,

1073
00:51:44,559 --> 00:51:46,280
you know what would their ceiling be?

1074
00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:49,320
Speaker 1: Like? Genuinely it's tough.

1075
00:51:49,360 --> 00:51:52,079
Speaker 3: Well, it's tough without seeing what Kawhi looks like or

1076
00:51:52,119 --> 00:51:54,639
even we kind of we've seen this movie too many

1077
00:51:54,679 --> 00:52:00,440
times before. Yeah, but like that that would be a

1078
00:52:00,519 --> 00:52:02,559
reason for them to be hesitant or to wait. Is

1079
00:52:02,559 --> 00:52:04,159
that it sounds like Kawhi is supposed to come back

1080
00:52:04,159 --> 00:52:06,880
before Christmas, So can you get a sample with him

1081
00:52:06,880 --> 00:52:09,400
and then you'll have a better idea of well, what

1082
00:52:09,440 --> 00:52:11,559
do we need most and then how much will that

1083
00:52:11,639 --> 00:52:14,159
do for us? But it's also tough. Kawhi could be

1084
00:52:14,199 --> 00:52:16,159
playing right now, look like an All NBA player. Again,

1085
00:52:16,199 --> 00:52:18,480
it's still tough to make that call because can you

1086
00:52:18,519 --> 00:52:21,280
count on his body holding up into the playoffs? We

1087
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:24,599
just have this recurring track record, whether he's load managed,

1088
00:52:24,599 --> 00:52:26,679
whether he's just playing more that he is not going

1089
00:52:26,679 --> 00:52:29,119
to remain healthy for that long And so I think

1090
00:52:29,159 --> 00:52:32,840
that adds another dimension of confusion to this situation.

1091
00:52:33,440 --> 00:52:35,840
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, Like here's the thing when I hear something

1092
00:52:35,880 --> 00:52:38,400
like that with with Kawhi, where people are like, oh,

1093
00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:41,000
he's gonna be back at you know, a B and

1094
00:52:41,039 --> 00:52:44,519
C kind of date. My next follow up is, sure,

1095
00:52:44,599 --> 00:52:47,159
that's great, when is he gonna go out again? That

1096
00:52:47,320 --> 00:52:49,840
that's where we are, and that's that's tough, and it's

1097
00:52:49,880 --> 00:52:52,760
it's harsh to like ask that question, but that's that

1098
00:52:52,960 --> 00:52:56,079
has to be the assumption. Look, I'm also at that

1099
00:52:56,119 --> 00:53:00,920
point with Philly, for example, where I just cannot recently,

1100
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:03,599
you know, I can't have reasonable expectation with them in

1101
00:53:03,639 --> 00:53:06,719
a playoff context. With Empat because he's just never healthy

1102
00:53:06,719 --> 00:53:10,360
for the playoffs. I'm at this point now where I

1103
00:53:10,440 --> 00:53:14,119
can't go in as an optimist anymore. So that their situation,

1104
00:53:14,239 --> 00:53:16,800
like they'll have to prove to me and everyone else

1105
00:53:16,880 --> 00:53:19,639
that yeah, we actually can stay healthy in the playoffs,

1106
00:53:19,960 --> 00:53:22,320
Like they'll have to show me once at least once

1107
00:53:22,440 --> 00:53:25,840
for me to buy into that idea once more. And

1108
00:53:25,880 --> 00:53:28,679
for Kawhy now it's just like he's so good, he's

1109
00:53:28,719 --> 00:53:30,920
so good when he's fully healthy, Like I'm not gonna

1110
00:53:31,199 --> 00:53:34,679
stit here and act like he's not. But even if

1111
00:53:34,719 --> 00:53:38,199
he does come back, we're one we're not sure that

1112
00:53:38,280 --> 00:53:41,239
he can stay healthy too. We're absolutely not sure if

1113
00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:43,159
he can stay healthy for the playoffs, which is an

1114
00:53:43,280 --> 00:53:46,320
entirely different beast and so much deeper into the season.

1115
00:53:47,119 --> 00:53:47,719
Speaker 1: It's just.

1116
00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:51,599
Speaker 2: I don't want to go as far as saying maybe

1117
00:53:51,599 --> 00:53:53,920
the contract, the contract that you could ship out is

1118
00:53:54,000 --> 00:53:57,280
ka why, because like, come on, he's he's your seiling

1119
00:53:57,360 --> 00:54:02,480
racer after all, right, Like yeah, yeah, I just can't

1120
00:54:02,480 --> 00:54:04,599
rely on I mean at this point, like even if

1121
00:54:04,599 --> 00:54:08,480
I go out and act like a buyer, I can't

1122
00:54:08,719 --> 00:54:11,639
bank on him coming back and giving me the production

1123
00:54:11,840 --> 00:54:13,159
and the minutes that I need to.

1124
00:54:13,360 --> 00:54:13,719
Speaker 1: I just can.

1125
00:54:13,840 --> 00:54:17,559
Speaker 3: I think the plus there though, is that they're a

1126
00:54:17,639 --> 00:54:21,199
more pleasant degree of confusing than we ever would have

1127
00:54:21,199 --> 00:54:21,760
expected them.

1128
00:54:23,519 --> 00:54:26,599
Speaker 2: That's a good way of bracing it, all right, Dan,

1129
00:54:26,719 --> 00:54:29,320
we have a couple of teams on the list still,

1130
00:54:29,440 --> 00:54:30,559
So who are you going with?

1131
00:54:30,840 --> 00:54:33,000
Speaker 1: And you're still in the Eastern Conference.

1132
00:54:33,760 --> 00:54:35,400
Speaker 3: I'm trying to now because I have too many picks

1133
00:54:35,440 --> 00:54:37,599
for my final two teams, but I am pretty dead

1134
00:54:37,639 --> 00:54:40,840
set on We need to talk about the Atlanta Hawks,

1135
00:54:41,400 --> 00:54:44,920
who this season they've dealt with some injuries. Trey Young

1136
00:54:44,960 --> 00:54:46,920
has not been the best version of himself as a scorer.

1137
00:54:46,920 --> 00:54:49,559
He's still a transcendent passer twelve point two assist per

1138
00:54:49,559 --> 00:54:52,360
game or whatever. He is that this year, What is

1139
00:54:52,400 --> 00:54:55,960
going on in Atlanta where the defense has outperformed the

1140
00:54:56,079 --> 00:55:00,119
offense for over their last fourteen games, which is so

1141
00:55:00,159 --> 00:55:03,079
ever since they beat the Celtics, they are eleventh in

1142
00:55:03,159 --> 00:55:07,639
points allowed per possession. They're actually getting burned from three

1143
00:55:07,960 --> 00:55:10,559
during that stretch. Though you look at it and you

1144
00:55:10,679 --> 00:55:12,920
understand some of it, where Clin Cappella is still just

1145
00:55:12,960 --> 00:55:16,360
really he's a really solid rim protector. Everyone wants them

1146
00:55:16,400 --> 00:55:18,679
to get rid of him and usher in the onyaka

1147
00:55:18,800 --> 00:55:20,760
conglu era, and there might be an argument for that

1148
00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:23,760
with Capella going a free agency. He helps you end possessions,

1149
00:55:23,760 --> 00:55:26,280
he still helps you protect the paint. Those have been

1150
00:55:26,360 --> 00:55:29,159
vital to both to their defense. The fact that you

1151
00:55:29,360 --> 00:55:34,039
have a Dyson Daniels now who's just the consummate disruptor

1152
00:55:34,360 --> 00:55:35,920
and the things that he can do. This team can

1153
00:55:35,960 --> 00:55:38,920
generate turnovers now in ways that it could not before

1154
00:55:38,960 --> 00:55:41,920
with the previous personnel. You've also had this trickle down

1155
00:55:41,960 --> 00:55:43,960
effect with the way you're structuring your rotation where if

1156
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:46,639
he plays in enough games, DeAndre Hunter might just win

1157
00:55:46,679 --> 00:55:50,039
six Man of the Year at this point. So I

1158
00:55:50,159 --> 00:55:52,760
look at them and they're another team where it's not

1159
00:55:52,800 --> 00:55:55,360
similar to the Clippers, but like their draft pick is

1160
00:55:55,360 --> 00:55:57,719
going to San Antonio this year, and yet we all

1161
00:55:57,800 --> 00:55:59,960
kind of had them build for they're gonna win, Like

1162
00:56:00,280 --> 00:56:03,800
if they really try, like thirty three to thirty seven games,

1163
00:56:04,639 --> 00:56:09,440
is it time more to recalibrate how good Atlanta can be?

1164
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:13,000
And if so, is that another team where it's well,

1165
00:56:13,079 --> 00:56:15,440
could they do something that's spicier than we would have

1166
00:56:15,519 --> 00:56:18,639
thought around the true because the offense for this team

1167
00:56:18,679 --> 00:56:21,159
has been disappointing, But when you consider the time that

1168
00:56:21,559 --> 00:56:24,800
DeAndre Hunter missed, how many shots that Trey Young has missed,

1169
00:56:24,920 --> 00:56:27,599
how much time bog Dog Bodanovic has missed, you kind

1170
00:56:27,599 --> 00:56:29,880
of look at it and say, all right, maybe we

1171
00:56:29,960 --> 00:56:33,480
are waiting for the defensive performance to change a little bit,

1172
00:56:33,599 --> 00:56:35,960
but this team isn't gonna hover around the bottom ten

1173
00:56:36,480 --> 00:56:38,679
of offense forever. And like kind of looming in the

1174
00:56:38,679 --> 00:56:42,000
backdrop the Trey Young list, like when he's not on

1175
00:56:42,039 --> 00:56:45,280
the floor, there's still a disaster. Overall, they're like minus

1176
00:56:45,280 --> 00:56:48,360
five point five net rating, but like when Jalen Johnson's

1177
00:56:48,400 --> 00:56:51,159
on the court during that time, there are more comfortable

1178
00:56:51,199 --> 00:56:54,760
minus two point three and the offense is still overall

1179
00:56:54,840 --> 00:56:57,239
dog shit. But just like he's given you enough. I

1180
00:56:57,320 --> 00:56:58,960
never thought he was gonna be this player. I want

1181
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:01,360
to make that clear. He's given you what I call

1182
00:57:01,920 --> 00:57:04,000
and maybe other people call it like more dead stop

1183
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:06,280
playmaking than where it's not. No, this guy needs to

1184
00:57:06,280 --> 00:57:08,239
get the ball in movement like he will just set

1185
00:57:08,320 --> 00:57:12,719
up shit. Now, I am the word I used I

1186
00:57:12,760 --> 00:57:14,880
was asked to when I was describing every NBA team

1187
00:57:14,880 --> 00:57:17,679
in one word at bleacher Report. I used mysterious for

1188
00:57:17,719 --> 00:57:21,159
them because I still can't figure out what they're ceiling

1189
00:57:21,599 --> 00:57:23,960
or even the purpose of this season needs to be

1190
00:57:24,079 --> 00:57:25,679
for them. And then finally, just because I want to

1191
00:57:25,679 --> 00:57:28,920
mention him, I think Zacharysiche when you look at his

1192
00:57:29,039 --> 00:57:31,559
usage offense, can be all over the place. He moves

1193
00:57:31,599 --> 00:57:34,159
well off the ball gets out in transition. We've seen

1194
00:57:34,239 --> 00:57:36,840
some games and even like extended stretches where if the

1195
00:57:36,840 --> 00:57:39,280
three ball is falling, I think he's already like he

1196
00:57:39,360 --> 00:57:42,360
kind of gets it on defense too. Right now, I've

1197
00:57:42,400 --> 00:57:45,199
been mostly impressed with what I've seen from him, even

1198
00:57:45,639 --> 00:57:48,199
you're probably expecting more from a number one overall pick

1199
00:57:48,519 --> 00:57:51,760
on balance, but relative to that draft class, like I

1200
00:57:51,800 --> 00:57:54,480
think he's like they're not closing games with him, They're

1201
00:57:54,519 --> 00:57:56,920
more inclined to do that with DeAndre Hunter. This seems

1202
00:57:56,920 --> 00:57:59,039
like kind of deep. They could still use another backup

1203
00:57:59,039 --> 00:58:02,000
playmaker because that's not really Kobe Buffkins thing. And yet

1204
00:58:02,320 --> 00:58:05,760
you have Dyson Daniels, you have Jalen Johnson, you have Bogdanovic.

1205
00:58:06,400 --> 00:58:10,000
They're mysterious, they're fascinating, they're confusing the whole nine more.

1206
00:58:10,679 --> 00:58:14,159
Speaker 2: Yep, It's it's super interesting in terms of whether or

1207
00:58:14,199 --> 00:58:16,360
not they should be buyers as well, because that's that's

1208
00:58:16,400 --> 00:58:19,559
been one of the things that the Hawks fan base

1209
00:58:19,599 --> 00:58:22,960
has talked about a ton Because Jalen Johnsonish who you

1210
00:58:23,000 --> 00:58:25,880
brought up. His extension is going to kick in next year,

1211
00:58:26,119 --> 00:58:29,639
so like he's gonna earn twenty five and a half

1212
00:58:29,880 --> 00:58:33,239
million more on his year to year salary than he

1213
00:58:33,360 --> 00:58:36,159
does this year. So if you go out and like

1214
00:58:36,719 --> 00:58:40,280
shop Larry Nance or a Klint coppelis expiring contract, sure

1215
00:58:40,360 --> 00:58:42,800
you could do that. And if you get long term

1216
00:58:42,800 --> 00:58:46,119
contracts in for those guys, their bill is going to

1217
00:58:46,159 --> 00:58:51,360
be pretty hefty already next year. And if they're just

1218
00:58:51,480 --> 00:58:55,280
lulling around, you know, five hundred, can you really justify

1219
00:58:55,400 --> 00:58:58,559
making that type of buying move at this deadline? This

1220
00:58:59,039 --> 00:59:02,360
to me feel like they're more of a let's make

1221
00:59:02,400 --> 00:59:04,079
a big move in this summer type of team.

1222
00:59:04,320 --> 00:59:06,519
Speaker 3: But can I ask you a question? You know why?

1223
00:59:06,519 --> 00:59:08,920
They also confused me because I think even with the Clippers,

1224
00:59:09,000 --> 00:59:11,039
with all these other teams we talked about me in Chicago,

1225
00:59:11,079 --> 00:59:14,079
it was just stripped this motherfucker down already. But what

1226
00:59:14,199 --> 00:59:16,280
is it that you want the Hawks to trade for?

1227
00:59:18,159 --> 00:59:20,000
I don't know that you can isolate. I think you

1228
00:59:20,039 --> 00:59:22,519
get to an uncomfortable situation where it you have to

1229
00:59:22,679 --> 00:59:25,760
upgrade on what is already kind of a rock solid

1230
00:59:25,840 --> 00:59:28,480
infrastructure in place where it's well there, we want to

1231
00:59:28,559 --> 00:59:30,840
upgrade the big man spot and at like the minutes

1232
00:59:30,960 --> 00:59:33,760
and it's well, good luck from a Kungo and Capella

1233
00:59:33,800 --> 00:59:35,880
and Larry NaNs Junior floating there, and then Jalen Johnson

1234
00:59:35,920 --> 00:59:37,840
of course is up front. I'm talking more about the

1235
00:59:37,880 --> 00:59:40,360
center position, or it's you're not going to go all

1236
00:59:40,400 --> 00:59:43,079
in on a backup playmaker, like when you asked tra Young,

1237
00:59:43,159 --> 00:59:44,360
that's not gonna be something you do.

1238
00:59:45,000 --> 00:59:45,559
Speaker 1: You're right.

1239
00:59:45,719 --> 00:59:48,880
Speaker 2: It was the center position, if anything, right Because as

1240
00:59:48,960 --> 00:59:51,039
much as I love on Yakou Kolobo and I've been

1241
00:59:51,039 --> 00:59:54,000
banging that drum too that he should start, I will

1242
00:59:54,039 --> 00:59:56,960
say this brat Rowland, who does locked on Hawks. He

1243
00:59:57,079 --> 01:00:02,440
did convince me that, look, Yek is great, but he's

1244
01:00:02,480 --> 01:00:03,360
just too damn short.

1245
01:00:03,719 --> 01:00:04,280
Speaker 1: Like the league.

1246
01:00:04,480 --> 01:00:07,719
Speaker 2: The size advantage in the league now is just size

1247
01:00:07,800 --> 01:00:11,239
is coming back. It's made a comeback on y k

1248
01:00:11,400 --> 01:00:13,800
is six ' eight, Like he's so good at what

1249
01:00:13,840 --> 01:00:17,719
he does, he's just not a starting center because of

1250
01:00:17,719 --> 01:00:20,599
that size. Like I've really had to come to Jesus

1251
01:00:20,599 --> 01:00:23,440
moment with him because i've for two years I was like,

1252
01:00:23,920 --> 01:00:27,519
start him. I don't care start him because he's too

1253
01:00:27,519 --> 01:00:31,400
good not to. But I'm getting it down, Like I'm

1254
01:00:31,480 --> 01:00:34,679
getting why that's not happening. So it would have to

1255
01:00:34,760 --> 01:00:37,679
be the center position. Like you said, who do you

1256
01:00:37,760 --> 01:00:42,199
go for there? Who's available? Who is one legitimate upgrade

1257
01:00:42,239 --> 01:00:44,440
for the long term, who fits the timeline, like who

1258
01:00:44,519 --> 01:00:46,840
can build something sustainable with his team?

1259
01:00:47,280 --> 01:00:48,719
Speaker 1: I don't know the answer to that.

1260
01:00:49,159 --> 01:00:53,760
Speaker 2: Two even if you do identify the right player, is

1261
01:00:53,800 --> 01:00:56,719
that player one available and two at what price point?

1262
01:00:56,920 --> 01:00:57,119
Speaker 1: Right?

1263
01:00:58,239 --> 01:01:01,159
Speaker 2: It's I don't think we should factor in the fact

1264
01:01:01,280 --> 01:01:03,920
anymore that they don't have their own pick because it's

1265
01:01:03,920 --> 01:01:07,320
a sun cost like we I think optics they will

1266
01:01:07,360 --> 01:01:11,199
be shitty regardless, Like if if the Spurs win Cooper

1267
01:01:11,280 --> 01:01:15,000
Flag with Atlanta's pick, yeah, it's gonna suck.

1268
01:01:15,320 --> 01:01:18,199
Speaker 1: But like there's they have no control over that situation.

1269
01:01:18,440 --> 01:01:22,360
Speaker 2: So eventually we just have to focus on them and

1270
01:01:22,400 --> 01:01:25,039
their process. And I don't know whether they should just

1271
01:01:25,159 --> 01:01:26,920
lean into the youth for the rest of the year

1272
01:01:26,960 --> 01:01:29,400
and just say, look, screw it, we're just gonna play

1273
01:01:29,400 --> 01:01:32,840
the young guys, develop them a ton, and then going

1274
01:01:32,880 --> 01:01:35,800
to next year more ready to compete, or if you

1275
01:01:35,840 --> 01:01:37,079
should prioritize winning.

1276
01:01:37,800 --> 01:01:40,719
Speaker 3: I don't. Here's my thing is who are they not playing?

1277
01:01:40,719 --> 01:01:43,480
Of the I think like you're zacharyche is playing over

1278
01:01:43,519 --> 01:01:45,599
twenty five minutes a game, Dyson Daniels is playing over

1279
01:01:45,639 --> 01:01:48,519
thirty four minutes a game. Jalen Johnson leads them in

1280
01:01:48,599 --> 01:01:50,760
minutes per game. They're I think they're the way they're

1281
01:01:50,800 --> 01:01:54,239
doling out minutes, like they're basically have this like perfect

1282
01:01:54,239 --> 01:01:57,199
split between Capella and a Kungu up front. I think

1283
01:01:57,239 --> 01:01:59,920
that's why they're confusing to me, is that I I

1284
01:02:00,159 --> 01:02:02,039
understand you have to use that pick as at something costs,

1285
01:02:02,039 --> 01:02:03,440
and I guess you could just say we're gonna stand

1286
01:02:03,480 --> 01:02:05,760
pat make sure that we're not sending them a great pick,

1287
01:02:06,039 --> 01:02:08,159
but I would have told you before the season and

1288
01:02:08,360 --> 01:02:11,639
clearly incorrectly, that they are more likely to tear it

1289
01:02:11,679 --> 01:02:13,400
down than be in the conversation of is this a

1290
01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:15,960
team that should be making upgrades? And I know that

1291
01:02:16,000 --> 01:02:19,320
they just got waxed by Denver, But like I'm kind

1292
01:02:19,320 --> 01:02:21,800
of in the latter camp of they either need to

1293
01:02:21,800 --> 01:02:23,639
do nothing or can they make it? Doesn't have to

1294
01:02:23,639 --> 01:02:26,519
be a huge upgrade. But do you reunite with Dennis

1295
01:02:26,519 --> 01:02:28,360
Shrewder as a backup point card? I you can figure

1296
01:02:28,360 --> 01:02:29,679
out the way to make the math work there without

1297
01:02:29,719 --> 01:02:32,280
giving up a ton of draft equity? Does that help you?

1298
01:02:32,800 --> 01:02:34,800
That's why they've confused me, and I'm wondering. I also,

1299
01:02:34,880 --> 01:02:36,360
I of course want to know if the defense is

1300
01:02:36,400 --> 01:02:39,079
stuff is sustainable. I know that Trey Young has been

1301
01:02:39,079 --> 01:02:41,800
trying harder for two years. He's still bad, Like that's

1302
01:02:41,840 --> 01:02:44,960
just you talk about size. He's small and slight, like

1303
01:02:45,000 --> 01:02:47,559
that's just the inherent downside to him. But this team

1304
01:02:47,639 --> 01:02:50,519
is They're another one who I find pleasantly confusing.

1305
01:02:51,079 --> 01:02:53,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, no, I agree. And DeAndre Hunter. I haven't

1306
01:02:53,840 --> 01:02:57,400
spoken enough about him on this pod this year. He's

1307
01:02:57,440 --> 01:03:00,920
been He's been so much better. It seems like he's

1308
01:03:00,960 --> 01:03:03,400
figuring stuff out. Like I know it's only a fourteen

1309
01:03:03,440 --> 01:03:06,119
game of sample size, but like he's cut out the

1310
01:03:06,159 --> 01:03:10,079
fat of his shot profile. He's far more assertive this

1311
01:03:10,159 --> 01:03:13,199
year than he's ever been before. He feels like he's

1312
01:03:13,199 --> 01:03:15,840
gotten the green light to an extent he's never had before.

1313
01:03:15,880 --> 01:03:19,280
And he's like, Okay, fine, I love that, Like, give

1314
01:03:19,440 --> 01:03:23,079
give it to me. I if there's you know this

1315
01:03:23,199 --> 01:03:26,079
Harrison Barnes pivot, that's the player I compared into. And

1316
01:03:26,199 --> 01:03:30,400
just in terms of this shot profile, that's interesting moving

1317
01:03:30,400 --> 01:03:33,000
forward to like that that's not something we should just

1318
01:03:33,079 --> 01:03:33,760
kind of dismiss.

1319
01:03:34,679 --> 01:03:36,599
Speaker 3: That's interesting. I feel like there's still room for him

1320
01:03:36,599 --> 01:03:39,440
to kind of like trim fat out of his shot profile,

1321
01:03:39,480 --> 01:03:39,920
Like yeah.

1322
01:03:39,840 --> 01:03:41,599
Speaker 1: Still no, no, no, but he's on the right way,

1323
01:03:41,760 --> 01:03:42,719
Like he's on the right path.

1324
01:03:43,719 --> 01:03:45,679
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean the look. I can't argue with anything

1325
01:03:45,719 --> 01:03:48,920
he's done offensively this year. So I think it's it's

1326
01:03:48,960 --> 01:03:51,199
definitely a positive indicator that when you kind of look

1327
01:03:51,199 --> 01:03:53,320
at it does feel like he's making even if you're

1328
01:03:53,440 --> 01:03:55,440
gonna see him take mid range jumpers, it just feels

1329
01:03:55,440 --> 01:03:58,599
objectively like those decisions and shots are coming off quicker,

1330
01:03:58,679 --> 01:04:01,119
so he is I think once he plays in more games,

1331
01:04:01,159 --> 01:04:03,239
unless they decide that, hey, this is someone who needs

1332
01:04:03,239 --> 01:04:05,840
to be a starter, which I mean, he's been good

1333
01:04:05,920 --> 01:04:08,119
enough to have that conversation. He'll be in the sixth

1334
01:04:08,119 --> 01:04:10,280
Man of the Year running for sure. But they've been

1335
01:04:11,039 --> 01:04:13,800
they I did not look and I say, we need

1336
01:04:13,800 --> 01:04:16,239
to couch all this with the fact that it's not

1337
01:04:16,320 --> 01:04:19,320
like they're fifteen games over five hundred. They're thirteen and twelve.

1338
01:04:19,719 --> 01:04:22,599
But this is a team that I thought was like,

1339
01:04:22,960 --> 01:04:25,639
they're seventh in the East, which I guess is maybe

1340
01:04:25,639 --> 01:04:28,239
where it's weird because they're probably where you would expect

1341
01:04:28,280 --> 01:04:29,559
them to be. You would have said, the Hawks are

1342
01:04:29,599 --> 01:04:32,920
gonna finish anywhere between seven and thirteen, right or seven

1343
01:04:32,920 --> 01:04:36,119
and ten, seven and eleven, And yet they're here, and

1344
01:04:36,159 --> 01:04:38,320
they're not here in the same way I would have

1345
01:04:38,360 --> 01:04:39,559
expected them to get here.

1346
01:04:40,000 --> 01:04:40,199
Speaker 1: Right.

1347
01:04:41,559 --> 01:04:45,280
Speaker 2: No, I agree, it's it's been it's been an odd

1348
01:04:45,360 --> 01:04:48,440
year for them. But I do think pleasantly surprised. That's

1349
01:04:48,440 --> 01:04:52,039
probably the category I fall into. GET can also, like

1350
01:04:52,159 --> 01:04:54,719
you and I did the league pass rankings, as we

1351
01:04:54,760 --> 01:04:58,159
do every single year, they've funked their fun to watch

1352
01:04:58,440 --> 01:05:01,519
that counts as a plus my book, like Jalen Johnson

1353
01:05:01,639 --> 01:05:04,840
objectively is one of my Like he's just he's so

1354
01:05:04,920 --> 01:05:07,480
fun to watch and I can't I don't think I've

1355
01:05:07,519 --> 01:05:10,400
seen a single person so far a go oh yeah,

1356
01:05:10,440 --> 01:05:14,039
I'm not entertained by watching him play like six ' nine,

1357
01:05:14,360 --> 01:05:18,159
super long innitiate. The offense has decided to take a

1358
01:05:18,159 --> 01:05:20,400
little bit more shots this year, which is like, yes,

1359
01:05:20,559 --> 01:05:24,880
love it, Like more of that, please, secondary playmaker. I

1360
01:05:24,920 --> 01:05:28,760
don't think he's done either in developing at all. I

1361
01:05:28,800 --> 01:05:31,159
think there could be another leap coming next year. Like

1362
01:05:31,239 --> 01:05:34,039
I I am interested to see where this team goes.

1363
01:05:35,039 --> 01:05:37,519
Speaker 3: Yeah, there there. I guess this is like a combination

1364
01:05:37,599 --> 01:05:39,079
of fascinating and confusing.

1365
01:05:39,599 --> 01:05:44,039
Speaker 2: Yeah, another team that's I think confusing at least to

1366
01:05:44,079 --> 01:05:44,599
some extent.

1367
01:05:45,519 --> 01:05:46,840
Speaker 1: No, that's the Denver Nuggets.

1368
01:05:47,920 --> 01:05:52,280
Speaker 2: Nikola Jokich is playing MVP caliber basketball, and it feels

1369
01:05:52,280 --> 01:05:57,320
like we're watching a man like single handedly going up

1370
01:05:57,320 --> 01:06:00,079
against an opponent every single night, Like I'm just not

1371
01:06:00,280 --> 01:06:04,119
counting in everyone else around him, like Jamal Murray is.

1372
01:06:04,599 --> 01:06:09,559
That situation is getting concerning. In all caps, I'm super

1373
01:06:09,599 --> 01:06:12,960
impressed by Michael Porter Junior, Like he's played all twenty

1374
01:06:13,039 --> 01:06:14,960
two games this year. He played eighty one out of

1375
01:06:14,960 --> 01:06:18,480
eighty two last year. Is he durable all of a sudden,

1376
01:06:18,519 --> 01:06:20,920
because that kind of changes the math on this team.

1377
01:06:20,760 --> 01:06:25,400
Speaker 3: As well, not on defense. Hele apparent, right right, That's

1378
01:06:25,719 --> 01:06:27,639
that's part of the conversation too.

1379
01:06:28,000 --> 01:06:30,760
Speaker 2: I love what Christian Brown has done. Like I wrote

1380
01:06:30,800 --> 01:06:33,000
an article about him early in the season where he

1381
01:06:33,039 --> 01:06:35,199
was hitting those fifty seven percent from the field. I

1382
01:06:35,239 --> 01:06:39,000
was like, well, surely this is not sustainable. And now

1383
01:06:39,039 --> 01:06:41,440
we're twenty two games since the season, he's still hitting

1384
01:06:41,440 --> 01:06:43,880
fifty seven percent of his shot. So he's basically saying, hey,

1385
01:06:43,960 --> 01:06:46,480
shut up moret you know, don't don't write that kind of.

1386
01:06:46,400 --> 01:06:47,119
Speaker 1: Bullshit about me.

1387
01:06:47,719 --> 01:06:50,679
Speaker 2: He's he's doing well, Like there are a lot of

1388
01:06:50,679 --> 01:06:55,519
these components that are doing so well. And despite those elements,

1389
01:06:56,159 --> 01:06:59,719
you're looking at Jokich and you're just sensing the drop

1390
01:06:59,760 --> 01:07:03,599
off between him and the next man up is so stark.

1391
01:07:04,280 --> 01:07:06,840
You never feel as though the guys that I just

1392
01:07:06,960 --> 01:07:14,000
mentioned are anything but like bystanders, it's I don't understand

1393
01:07:14,039 --> 01:07:17,360
what's going on, Like when Jokicic doesn't play, I don't

1394
01:07:17,360 --> 01:07:19,400
have the numbers in front of me, but basically they

1395
01:07:19,400 --> 01:07:22,039
turn into the Leak's worst offense when he is on

1396
01:07:22,079 --> 01:07:25,239
the court is the league's best. It's I even think

1397
01:07:25,280 --> 01:07:29,280
it's the net rating two. It's such a preposterous season.

1398
01:07:29,519 --> 01:07:31,880
I just don't know what to make of it. Are

1399
01:07:31,880 --> 01:07:34,400
they Are they good enough to the point where if

1400
01:07:34,400 --> 01:07:37,760
they just get into the playoffs? Nope, Yo Kicic can

1401
01:07:37,880 --> 01:07:41,280
just Jokich his way to like at Western Conference final spot.

1402
01:07:41,360 --> 01:07:41,840
Speaker 1: I don't know.

1403
01:07:44,079 --> 01:07:46,559
Speaker 3: Here's the thing. And so just to back up you,

1404
01:07:46,639 --> 01:07:48,800
because this is a number that everybody should be tracking

1405
01:07:48,880 --> 01:07:51,159
right now. But I'll get their thirty one point two

1406
01:07:51,159 --> 01:07:55,320
points better per one hundred possession with Nicole Jokicic than

1407
01:07:55,880 --> 01:07:58,239
that is second in the league only to Christian Brown,

1408
01:07:58,719 --> 01:08:01,119
who plays a good amount of minutes with Nikola Jokic,

1409
01:08:01,360 --> 01:08:04,920
and that kind of helps. This team does confuse me

1410
01:08:05,039 --> 01:08:08,960
because I think when even you point to here's why

1411
01:08:08,960 --> 01:08:12,079
they're confusing, is that there's probably no one we like to,

1412
01:08:12,159 --> 01:08:14,119
especially when you cover the entire league, is to try

1413
01:08:14,159 --> 01:08:18,000
and boil things down, distill them down to these one

1414
01:08:18,079 --> 01:08:21,079
or two factors. And I don't know that you could

1415
01:08:21,159 --> 01:08:23,199
do that with Denver Nuggets, because it feels like a

1416
01:08:23,279 --> 01:08:28,279
series of bad decisions that have led them here, and

1417
01:08:28,319 --> 01:08:31,119
it's forget about the Bruce Brown stuff from a couple

1418
01:08:31,119 --> 01:08:33,199
of years ago. They couldn't keep him, but by losing

1419
01:08:33,239 --> 01:08:36,600
both him and Kentavius called well, Pope, your fit across

1420
01:08:36,640 --> 01:08:39,960
the roster is less intuitive. This isn't about anymore that, oh,

1421
01:08:40,000 --> 01:08:43,159
can Peyton Watson and Christian Brown be good? It's about

1422
01:08:43,600 --> 01:08:47,359
are you getting the same two way squeeze from a

1423
01:08:47,439 --> 01:08:51,039
team environment out of all of your guys And the

1424
01:08:51,079 --> 01:08:53,520
answer is no, and then you've also wasted if you

1425
01:08:53,560 --> 01:08:56,279
wanted to go like let's use KCP as an example.

1426
01:08:56,479 --> 01:09:00,479
He has not been good in Orlando offensively. Yes, here's

1427
01:09:00,520 --> 01:09:03,840
the thing about him though, compared to Christian Brown and

1428
01:09:03,880 --> 01:09:07,800
Peyton Watson, he can blend two different offensive roles. And

1429
01:09:07,840 --> 01:09:09,319
I know that Christian Brown's done a little bit more

1430
01:09:09,319 --> 01:09:12,079
ball handling this year. But what is Peyton Watson If

1431
01:09:12,079 --> 01:09:14,079
he's not going to be in transition, they're probably using

1432
01:09:14,159 --> 01:09:16,600
him more as a stationary shooter. What is Christian Brown

1433
01:09:16,640 --> 01:09:18,000
in the half court If he doesn't have the ball,

1434
01:09:18,199 --> 01:09:21,239
he's going to cut. KCP did all that stuff while

1435
01:09:21,279 --> 01:09:24,800
also scoring jumpers or taking jumpers in motion. So you

1436
01:09:24,960 --> 01:09:29,199
now you're losing just these elements there and the resources

1437
01:09:29,640 --> 01:09:33,159
which were few to their credit, that you had to

1438
01:09:33,239 --> 01:09:36,920
improve your team. You have whiffed on them in ways

1439
01:09:37,359 --> 01:09:41,439
that it's not just that you whift it's the predictability

1440
01:09:41,680 --> 01:09:46,159
behind said whiffs. Who thought signing Reggie Jackson with the

1441
01:09:46,199 --> 01:09:47,920
mini mid level and giving him a player option was

1442
01:09:47,960 --> 01:09:51,640
a good idea at the time. Literally nobody who thought

1443
01:09:51,680 --> 01:09:53,800
the same thing about doing that with Dario Sharan, who

1444
01:09:53,840 --> 01:09:56,560
you probably could have gotten for the minimum. Nobody thought

1445
01:09:56,600 --> 01:09:58,359
that Russell WESTBKH.

1446
01:09:59,600 --> 01:10:02,199
Speaker 2: I have to own up to that one. I believed

1447
01:10:02,239 --> 01:10:04,680
in that. I believed in that acquisition, I really did,

1448
01:10:04,760 --> 01:10:07,640
and I am. I am paying for it right now.

1449
01:10:07,640 --> 01:10:09,600
Speaker 3: Here's the other thing, though, is that you then what

1450
01:10:09,680 --> 01:10:11,880
you also did though, and this just speaks to I

1451
01:10:11,920 --> 01:10:14,279
think it makes it harder to build your rotations when

1452
01:10:14,319 --> 01:10:17,039
the talent is less of an intuitive fit together or

1453
01:10:17,159 --> 01:10:20,840
checks as many boxes as it can. Because even put simply,

1454
01:10:20,840 --> 01:10:23,359
we're not their six in offense, that's not technically the problem,

1455
01:10:23,600 --> 01:10:26,640
but their shot profile is just No one's beginning to

1456
01:10:26,720 --> 01:10:29,920
replace the three point volume or threat level you got

1457
01:10:30,239 --> 01:10:33,840
from KCP. But what you also did you exacerbated that

1458
01:10:33,960 --> 01:10:36,880
issue by bringing in both Russell Westbrook and Dario sarch

1459
01:10:36,960 --> 01:10:40,039
So even if both of those names look good in

1460
01:10:40,039 --> 01:10:43,680
a nutshell, you created a circumstance where, well, if they're

1461
01:10:43,680 --> 01:10:47,960
gonna play together, that's not gonna look great. And then okay,

1462
01:10:48,000 --> 01:10:50,399
we could stagger them, but that's going to have a

1463
01:10:50,439 --> 01:10:53,199
direct influence on how you build out the rest of

1464
01:10:53,239 --> 01:10:56,920
your rotation. And so then you combine that with whatever

1465
01:10:57,000 --> 01:10:59,279
is going on with Jamal Murray, who I think the

1466
01:10:59,359 --> 01:11:01,920
terrible way to put it is he is one of

1467
01:11:01,960 --> 01:11:05,479
the most turbulent roller coasters in the NBA. But like,

1468
01:11:05,560 --> 01:11:07,760
this is just someone what is the last fifteen games,

1469
01:11:07,760 --> 01:11:10,640
some thirty two percent from three, Like that's supposed to

1470
01:11:10,680 --> 01:11:14,159
be that should probably be your best three point Michael

1471
01:11:14,199 --> 01:11:16,319
Porter Junior, of course, but like your second best floor

1472
01:11:16,319 --> 01:11:18,840
spacer right now. No, like your second best floor spacer

1473
01:11:18,920 --> 01:11:22,680
is Nikoliokic because he decided to up his own volume

1474
01:11:22,680 --> 01:11:24,439
from three. Although that's come down a little bit, I

1475
01:11:24,439 --> 01:11:26,720
think since he's returned from a three game absence.

1476
01:11:26,920 --> 01:11:29,680
Speaker 2: Right he's only he's only at a measly fifty point

1477
01:11:29,760 --> 01:11:31,079
six percent from three this year.

1478
01:11:31,159 --> 01:11:32,680
Speaker 3: Now, what are his attempts up to? Though I haven't

1479
01:11:32,680 --> 01:11:35,359
even look he was at like over five at point yeah, so.

1480
01:11:35,399 --> 01:11:37,359
Speaker 2: Four point four, and now he's he's become a little

1481
01:11:37,359 --> 01:11:38,680
bit more modest taking them.

1482
01:11:38,960 --> 01:11:42,359
Speaker 3: And who cares, that's not his job. So they've I

1483
01:11:42,359 --> 01:11:44,960
think that's where they've really missed the mark is that

1484
01:11:45,119 --> 01:11:47,159
I think you could say, let's just say you had

1485
01:11:47,239 --> 01:11:50,920
kept KCP and it's just that makes your rotation easier

1486
01:11:50,920 --> 01:11:53,680
to build out, your staggering patterns easier to build out.

1487
01:11:53,760 --> 01:11:58,960
Now you've created this problem where nikoliokicch is logging more

1488
01:11:59,039 --> 01:12:01,560
minutes than ever, more dependent on him than ever. And

1489
01:12:01,640 --> 01:12:04,039
yes he's an iron man. But this is why I

1490
01:12:04,319 --> 01:12:06,960
said a quick no, I was being like a snarky

1491
01:12:07,000 --> 01:12:10,359
a hole, but it's true. It's not just get into

1492
01:12:10,399 --> 01:12:12,680
the playoffs this team, because to just get into the

1493
01:12:12,720 --> 01:12:16,760
playoffs is going to run Nikola Jokic into the ground.

1494
01:12:17,319 --> 01:12:21,960
It looks like, and that is like, that's not great.

1495
01:12:22,039 --> 01:12:26,000
And so I don't know, they're confusing because so many

1496
01:12:26,000 --> 01:12:29,720
of their mistakes they were just seen in real time.

1497
01:12:30,359 --> 01:12:33,840
Letting let's do this in a vacuum, let's throw everything

1498
01:12:33,920 --> 01:12:36,199
else out. That really wasn't a choice. Or you could say, well,

1499
01:12:36,199 --> 01:12:38,439
at least they used the miniml e all these other teams.

1500
01:12:38,439 --> 01:12:42,720
Didn't you let KCP walk for nothing? That was one

1501
01:12:42,720 --> 01:12:46,039
of your six most important players last season and you

1502
01:12:46,159 --> 01:12:50,199
let him go for nothing. That is bad asset management.

1503
01:12:50,720 --> 01:12:54,000
It is terrible. We're now seeing reporting that they weren't

1504
01:12:54,000 --> 01:12:55,960
open to sign and trade scenarios and then they kind

1505
01:12:55,960 --> 01:12:58,239
of were it at the last minute, but weren't really. And

1506
01:12:58,239 --> 01:12:59,960
so I don't know if Calvin Booth has been hand

1507
01:13:00,079 --> 01:13:01,960
cuffed at all by ownership because of what they're willing

1508
01:13:01,960 --> 01:13:04,680
to pay for this team. But it's there's not one problem.

1509
01:13:04,720 --> 01:13:07,119
Everyone wants to distill down to the one problem.

1510
01:13:07,239 --> 01:13:08,159
Speaker 1: This is like a.

1511
01:13:08,119 --> 01:13:12,760
Speaker 3: Two year degradation of what looked like a very sustainable

1512
01:13:13,199 --> 01:13:15,800
championship corps and it's disappointing as hell because they have

1513
01:13:15,840 --> 01:13:18,359
one of the ten best basketball players of all time

1514
01:13:18,720 --> 01:13:20,840
on their roster in his prime right now.

1515
01:13:21,479 --> 01:13:24,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I don't think personally the KCP was worth

1516
01:13:24,159 --> 01:13:25,880
the contract, but I do agree with you that they

1517
01:13:25,880 --> 01:13:27,920
should have gotten something out of it at the very

1518
01:13:28,039 --> 01:13:31,239
least of losing him for nothing, because you can't go

1519
01:13:31,359 --> 01:13:35,199
back to back years of loosing essential wings in the

1520
01:13:35,239 --> 01:13:38,119
manners that they did after winning a championship and then

1521
01:13:38,199 --> 01:13:40,239
expect Oh yeah, we're fine.

1522
01:13:40,800 --> 01:13:42,239
Speaker 1: So I agree with that perspective.

1523
01:13:43,439 --> 01:13:47,000
Speaker 2: Now I do think this, I think internally this is

1524
01:13:47,079 --> 01:13:49,319
this is my thesist, Like I could be wrong. I

1525
01:13:49,399 --> 01:13:52,119
think the way that they're looking at it is one

1526
01:13:52,159 --> 01:13:56,079
step back this that being this year, two steps forward

1527
01:13:56,239 --> 01:14:01,079
next year, because you're kind of Forcingian Brown, Peyton watching

1528
01:14:01,159 --> 01:14:05,560
Julian Strawther into these fairly big roles and for them

1529
01:14:05,600 --> 01:14:09,399
to come back significantly better next year. What makes that

1530
01:14:09,479 --> 01:14:12,399
peel so hard to swallow, and this is where I

1531
01:14:12,720 --> 01:14:16,800
empathize and sympathize with Nuggets fans, is that you're spending

1532
01:14:17,039 --> 01:14:21,520
arguably the best, you know season of Yo Kids twenty

1533
01:14:21,600 --> 01:14:23,960
nine season that's always like one of you know, the

1534
01:14:24,359 --> 01:14:28,119
best superstar seasons you have out there. You're wasting that

1535
01:14:28,720 --> 01:14:33,640
on a hey, let's take one step back season. I

1536
01:14:33,680 --> 01:14:35,800
don't think you can allow yourself to do that with you.

1537
01:14:35,880 --> 01:14:39,720
Speaker 3: Well, it doesn't and isn't that especially true when this

1538
01:14:39,920 --> 01:14:42,399
one step back because you look at the guys they're

1539
01:14:42,439 --> 01:14:44,239
quote unquote doing this for By the way, I don't

1540
01:14:44,279 --> 01:14:46,760
think Christian Brown and Peyton Watson are the issue. Yeah,

1541
01:14:46,760 --> 01:14:49,760
where there's nights what was the game that they dropped

1542
01:14:50,039 --> 01:14:51,720
was that to before the Atlanta Hawks went, I was

1543
01:14:51,760 --> 01:14:53,399
already trolling it. Why am I forgetting it? But like

1544
01:14:53,399 --> 01:14:57,840
you watched back with the Wizards game, just deciding not

1545
01:14:57,920 --> 01:15:00,359
to really play defense and putting up zero resistant there,

1546
01:15:00,399 --> 01:15:03,920
like that's weird, But those aren't the problems. It's and

1547
01:15:04,000 --> 01:15:06,279
this one maybe it was tougher to predict. But you

1548
01:15:06,319 --> 01:15:09,960
can't play this sustainability card or you know, two years,

1549
01:15:09,960 --> 01:15:11,920
because really, I mean last year they were fine, So

1550
01:15:11,960 --> 01:15:13,880
it's one year, take a step back to take take

1551
01:15:13,920 --> 01:15:16,439
two steps forward. Can you guarantee you're taking two steps

1552
01:15:16,479 --> 01:15:18,800
forward when none of this is in service of finding

1553
01:15:19,159 --> 01:15:20,880
the second best player on a title team.

1554
01:15:22,880 --> 01:15:23,640
Speaker 1: That's a good question.

1555
01:15:27,119 --> 01:15:30,319
Speaker 3: So is the miscalculation that they thought Jamal Murray was

1556
01:15:30,359 --> 01:15:33,079
and could continue to be that player. And that's a

1557
01:15:33,159 --> 01:15:37,479
little bit more understandable just because, yes, Jamal Murray's always

1558
01:15:37,479 --> 01:15:39,119
been a roller coaster, but he has hit some of it,

1559
01:15:39,199 --> 01:15:41,119
not just in Nugget's history, He's had some of the

1560
01:15:41,159 --> 01:15:43,279
biggest playoff performances in NBA history.

1561
01:15:44,039 --> 01:15:46,479
Speaker 2: I think it was already pretty clear when he had

1562
01:15:46,479 --> 01:15:51,119
the ACL tear that there were skepticisms about how like

1563
01:15:51,119 --> 01:15:54,479
he was already balld top before that, and then you

1564
01:15:54,520 --> 01:15:56,760
know how many players have we not seen come back

1565
01:15:56,760 --> 01:16:01,720
from ACL tears or Achilles tears and and have these

1566
01:16:01,880 --> 01:16:06,199
while you know, varying outputs and games. So I think

1567
01:16:06,279 --> 01:16:09,079
that was always a fear for them to actually win

1568
01:16:09,159 --> 01:16:12,479
the championship after the ACL snare was always something that

1569
01:16:12,600 --> 01:16:16,039
was like CW, like a big you know, at least

1570
01:16:16,079 --> 01:16:19,279
they got one kind of moment. I do have a

1571
01:16:19,359 --> 01:16:21,560
question to you about that though, just in the Jamal

1572
01:16:21,640 --> 01:16:26,479
Murray specifically, if he wasn't playing with yo Kisch, if

1573
01:16:26,520 --> 01:16:30,600
he was signing elsewhere instead of signing that extension, Like,

1574
01:16:30,920 --> 01:16:33,079
what would that have looked like right now?

1575
01:16:33,680 --> 01:16:36,239
Speaker 3: I don't I don't know, because look, we have a

1576
01:16:36,359 --> 01:16:39,359
years long we have a career long track record of

1577
01:16:39,399 --> 01:16:43,960
the minutes he plays without Nakole Yoaku's mostly sucking. Yeah,

1578
01:16:44,000 --> 01:16:48,800
And I just like it's that's a tough question. I

1579
01:16:48,840 --> 01:16:50,960
don't think they could have made any other decision other

1580
01:16:51,000 --> 01:16:53,199
than to extend him, just because what are you going

1581
01:16:53,239 --> 01:16:59,760
to do? You got into that situation, So it's just yeah,

1582
01:17:00,119 --> 01:17:02,800
it's so that's such a tough question. I don't know

1583
01:17:02,800 --> 01:17:04,319
what he would be independent. I think you could make

1584
01:17:04,359 --> 01:17:07,600
that names for almost anyone on this roster, but they've

1585
01:17:07,600 --> 01:17:13,600
definitely been less built to withstand even like the slightest

1586
01:17:13,640 --> 01:17:15,880
like the Aaron Gordon injury or Aaron Gordon not being

1587
01:17:15,920 --> 01:17:19,560
on defense what he was last year. Basically, uh, it's

1588
01:17:20,079 --> 01:17:23,000
it's really tough for them to try to figure all

1589
01:17:23,039 --> 01:17:25,560
this out. And my fob up question here would be

1590
01:17:25,560 --> 01:17:27,119
cause I don't know, Like, there's no they don't have

1591
01:17:27,159 --> 01:17:29,840
second round picks to trade right now. There's also what

1592
01:17:29,960 --> 01:17:32,800
is like DeAndre Jordan just still gets minutes over Zeke Nagy.

1593
01:17:32,840 --> 01:17:35,640
How I defended the Zeke nag extension where it was

1594
01:17:35,680 --> 01:17:38,199
signed by saying, having a mid level contract that you

1595
01:17:38,239 --> 01:17:40,880
can flip will have value. But now you've just reached

1596
01:17:40,880 --> 01:17:43,039
the point where you're gonna need to include assets to

1597
01:17:43,119 --> 01:17:45,239
get that deal off, and like just you can't even

1598
01:17:45,239 --> 01:17:48,680
see the floor over age eighty seven? DeAndre Jordan? What

1599
01:17:48,840 --> 01:17:52,840
is going on here? How bad would the and they're

1600
01:17:52,880 --> 01:17:55,439
over five hundred. They're in the top half of the

1601
01:17:55,479 --> 01:17:58,079
league of both offense and defense sixth and offense fourteenth.

1602
01:17:58,079 --> 01:18:01,920
The defense is there at any point? Could do you

1603
01:18:01,960 --> 01:18:04,319
think they'll be bad enough to where Nicole Jokic's MVP

1604
01:18:04,479 --> 01:18:07,239
case becomes compromised, Like what is the Someone asked me

1605
01:18:07,279 --> 01:18:08,640
this the other day and I didn't have a good answer.

1606
01:18:08,720 --> 01:18:11,000
I said, if they're ever not sixth in the West,

1607
01:18:11,039 --> 01:18:13,239
that feels kind of arbitrary. But that just like the

1608
01:18:13,239 --> 01:18:18,079
benchmark where if they're going to tumble past that, that

1609
01:18:18,159 --> 01:18:21,199
would really hurt his MVP case. I don't I don't

1610
01:18:21,199 --> 01:18:22,119
have a good answer though.

1611
01:18:22,399 --> 01:18:24,960
Speaker 2: I don't think I have a good answer, but like

1612
01:18:25,000 --> 01:18:27,520
I do have an answer, and that is yes, absolutely, Look,

1613
01:18:27,520 --> 01:18:28,680
here's the thing we've seen.

1614
01:18:29,560 --> 01:18:31,640
Speaker 1: We've seen so many valid.

1615
01:18:31,479 --> 01:18:35,399
Speaker 2: MVP candidates down you know, in history not win it

1616
01:18:35,439 --> 01:18:40,880
because of win loss records. So like, yeah, absolutely that

1617
01:18:40,880 --> 01:18:46,840
that's always been historically tied to the award, probably minus

1618
01:18:46,880 --> 01:18:50,279
Westbrook because like the Oscar Robertson thing with him in

1619
01:18:50,319 --> 01:18:54,000
the triple double. So and like even though Yoke himself

1620
01:18:54,039 --> 01:18:56,239
is averaging a triple double right now, it's more of

1621
01:18:56,319 --> 01:18:58,760
a you know, it's it's it's not that impressive anymore

1622
01:18:58,760 --> 01:19:03,000
because Rust did like four years uh so, so he's

1623
01:19:03,000 --> 01:19:06,439
not gonna get that same you know, the same luxury,

1624
01:19:06,960 --> 01:19:09,800
so to speak. But yeah, I absolutely think that's gonna happen.

1625
01:19:09,840 --> 01:19:13,159
Effect I would be shocked if it didn't, even though

1626
01:19:13,199 --> 01:19:14,680
he is the best player in basketball.

1627
01:19:14,720 --> 01:19:16,039
Speaker 1: But that's again, that is.

1628
01:19:16,039 --> 01:19:18,880
Speaker 2: That the NBA loves this, Dan, you know this like

1629
01:19:19,520 --> 01:19:23,760
this is gonna have fans debating this for a year

1630
01:19:23,840 --> 01:19:26,520
or thumblin if you stop winning it. So the NBA

1631
01:19:26,600 --> 01:19:29,399
is like, yes, we love this. Now that the award

1632
01:19:29,479 --> 01:19:31,680
is going to go to someone else, and I I

1633
01:19:31,720 --> 01:19:33,960
have no idea who's even like the front runner if

1634
01:19:34,000 --> 01:19:36,720
it's not Jokic, is Anthony Davis.

1635
01:19:36,359 --> 01:19:39,720
Speaker 3: But they probably Shaye or Tatum I would think would

1636
01:19:39,720 --> 01:19:41,520
slide into spot.

1637
01:19:42,039 --> 01:19:45,399
Speaker 1: Oh she okay, but like Ta that's oh, that's.

1638
01:19:45,199 --> 01:19:47,319
Speaker 3: Not I think that's unfair. I think that's unfair.

1639
01:19:47,520 --> 01:19:49,520
Speaker 1: Such a stretch you think.

1640
01:19:49,359 --> 01:19:52,479
Speaker 3: So, I will say, disturbing.

1641
01:19:52,039 --> 01:19:55,560
Speaker 2: About such a big level below Yokic, though, like such

1642
01:19:55,560 --> 01:19:56,279
a big level.

1643
01:19:56,119 --> 01:19:59,159
Speaker 3: Below that's the most disturbing part about this team is

1644
01:19:59,279 --> 01:20:03,840
I'm al racing people proposing trades. I don't think moving

1645
01:20:03,880 --> 01:20:06,159
Michael Porter Junior ain't gonna solve anything for this team,

1646
01:20:06,199 --> 01:20:07,840
is my point. And I don't even think you could

1647
01:20:07,840 --> 01:20:09,119
if you want to step out of your way with

1648
01:20:09,199 --> 01:20:11,880
contracts using some of the young guys. That's not it's

1649
01:20:11,880 --> 01:20:14,640
not a one player thing. This is a year's This

1650
01:20:14,720 --> 01:20:16,600
is a two I think it's it's more than two

1651
01:20:16,640 --> 01:20:18,239
offseasons worth because we got to go back to the

1652
01:20:18,319 --> 01:20:21,800
Zignaugi extension. But this is a multiple year's worth of

1653
01:20:21,920 --> 01:20:25,279
missteps to end at this point, and they treated this.

1654
01:20:25,520 --> 01:20:29,199
I understand the desire to want to be sustainable rather

1655
01:20:29,239 --> 01:20:34,560
than maximize a very finite window. You missed like you didn't.

1656
01:20:34,640 --> 01:20:37,000
You didn't extend anything. You're not threatening to close it

1657
01:20:37,119 --> 01:20:40,199
before And this again, they don't suck, they're just not

1658
01:20:40,319 --> 01:20:42,760
as good as a team with the best player in

1659
01:20:42,800 --> 01:20:44,439
basketball on the heart of his prime should be.

1660
01:20:45,520 --> 01:20:48,359
Speaker 2: I will say this, if there's a Michael Porter junior

1661
01:20:48,399 --> 01:20:54,560
trade out there along with Sigdashi, it's Saclabee Levine next

1662
01:20:54,560 --> 01:20:56,680
to Yokich would be just perverse.

1663
01:20:57,199 --> 01:20:58,159
Speaker 1: It would be perverse.

1664
01:20:58,399 --> 01:21:02,800
Speaker 3: I just don't know, like and then the Jamal Murray

1665
01:21:02,800 --> 01:21:04,359
of it all, I guess at that point it's because

1666
01:21:04,399 --> 01:21:09,279
you're not like, you're already sixth in offense, what is that?

1667
01:21:09,319 --> 01:21:11,199
Speaker 2: And then you move up you you probably move up

1668
01:21:11,239 --> 01:21:15,439
substantially because he's such a good score. He is so

1669
01:21:15,680 --> 01:21:18,479
and he's so dangerous off the ball. He gives you

1670
01:21:18,600 --> 01:21:22,720
the three point shooting that they sorely need the sort

1671
01:21:22,760 --> 01:21:24,479
of gives you the slashing. He gives you, he gets

1672
01:21:24,479 --> 01:21:25,479
you to the pre pro line.

1673
01:21:25,840 --> 01:21:30,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, there, he's an upgrade, but like at that point,

1674
01:21:30,960 --> 01:21:34,359
you're substituting Michael Porter Junior is giving you three point volume,

1675
01:21:34,600 --> 01:21:36,439
so you're kind of almost like maybe getting a little

1676
01:21:36,439 --> 01:21:37,800
bit more out of Zach Lvine. And there's the off

1677
01:21:37,800 --> 01:21:39,760
the dribble element for sure in the fall Drone. I

1678
01:21:39,840 --> 01:21:42,560
totally get it, but like that's all the ship Jamal Murray.

1679
01:21:42,399 --> 01:21:44,720
Speaker 1: Is supposed to be, do you. I know, but he's

1680
01:21:44,760 --> 01:21:47,199
not doing it, and like I know, look I get it.

1681
01:21:47,439 --> 01:21:49,680
Speaker 2: And and if I'm the Nuggets, I'm not saying that

1682
01:21:49,680 --> 01:21:53,039
the Syclovine trade is like gonna catapult myself into the championship.

1683
01:21:53,439 --> 01:21:55,399
But I do think if there's, if there is a

1684
01:21:55,479 --> 01:22:00,600
trade out there that would be intriguing, that's probably the one.

1685
01:22:00,840 --> 01:22:02,720
Speaker 3: It was the only move because you're not gonna I mean,

1686
01:22:02,720 --> 01:22:05,640
you just extended. You have the Aaron Gordon Jamal Murray extension,

1687
01:22:05,680 --> 01:22:07,439
so you can't move them. I don't think they didn't.

1688
01:22:07,880 --> 01:22:11,800
And then after that it's okay, these other guys have value,

1689
01:22:11,800 --> 01:22:14,640
Brown Watson, but they make nothing, So it's not gonna

1690
01:22:14,640 --> 01:22:17,880
be fixed via trade. I think the Nuggets, it's really

1691
01:22:17,960 --> 01:22:22,119
the Jamal Murray played better button like that? And does

1692
01:22:22,159 --> 01:22:27,199
that button exist anymore? Is the question? Did I oversimplify it?

1693
01:22:27,800 --> 01:22:27,960
Speaker 1: No?

1694
01:22:28,000 --> 01:22:30,199
Speaker 2: I think you needed to simplify it like that because

1695
01:22:30,199 --> 01:22:35,880
you're right, and and I guess the broader question really is,

1696
01:22:37,239 --> 01:22:39,000
what the hell does this team look like?

1697
01:22:39,199 --> 01:22:41,920
Speaker 1: If Jamal was back to Jamal? Are like? Are they

1698
01:22:42,000 --> 01:22:44,319
competing for number one in the in the West? Like?

1699
01:22:44,319 --> 01:22:46,960
What are we? I don't know the answer to that.

1700
01:22:47,159 --> 01:22:49,640
Speaker 3: They probably would be, which is scary. I mean, you

1701
01:22:49,680 --> 01:22:51,720
still have the whole bench of it all thing. It

1702
01:22:51,720 --> 01:22:52,560
would still be an.

1703
01:22:52,439 --> 01:22:58,600
Speaker 1: Issue, right man, No, it's tough.

1704
01:22:59,560 --> 01:23:03,359
Speaker 2: Might say, they are definitely confusing, all right, Dan, we

1705
01:23:03,399 --> 01:23:05,680
need to wrap up with the last two teams.

1706
01:23:05,680 --> 01:23:06,680
Speaker 1: So who you got?

1707
01:23:07,279 --> 01:23:09,319
Speaker 3: I would you knew? I was billowing in the wind

1708
01:23:09,520 --> 01:23:11,800
on my selection here to the point where I changed

1709
01:23:11,840 --> 01:23:15,199
it again. I was thinking about the Bucks. But I

1710
01:23:15,199 --> 01:23:16,880
think that we're kind of starting to understand that, No,

1711
01:23:16,960 --> 01:23:18,720
they weren't as bad as they were, and if the

1712
01:23:18,720 --> 01:23:20,479
offense is gonna catch up, can some of the defense

1713
01:23:20,479 --> 01:23:23,039
have proven to be sustainable. I'm more hopeful for them,

1714
01:23:23,199 --> 01:23:24,359
And I also feel like, I don't know if you're

1715
01:23:24,399 --> 01:23:26,520
the same. I've talked about them way too much because

1716
01:23:26,520 --> 01:23:27,960
of what happened in the early part of the season.

1717
01:23:29,039 --> 01:23:31,199
It was between the Pacers or Miami, and I'm starting

1718
01:23:31,239 --> 01:23:34,399
to just realize there's something going on with Indiana. But

1719
01:23:34,439 --> 01:23:37,119
it's also when you look at that team, you probably

1720
01:23:37,159 --> 01:23:40,359
could have sussed this out that, Okay, if Tyre's Haliburt

1721
01:23:40,399 --> 01:23:42,560
wasn't gonna be Tyre's Haliburton, if they were gonna gravitate

1722
01:23:42,640 --> 01:23:45,600
so far away from Tyre's Haliburt and being the center

1723
01:23:45,640 --> 01:23:48,560
of everything, they might always just look not so great,

1724
01:23:48,600 --> 01:23:50,560
and that the defense would continue to be not so great,

1725
01:23:50,600 --> 01:23:52,720
and that if Miles Turner regressed, the defense would be

1726
01:23:52,720 --> 01:23:55,239
even worse than not so great. So I'm going to

1727
01:23:55,279 --> 01:24:01,600
Miami here more. I'm honestly asking you, what are the

1728
01:24:01,680 --> 01:24:05,079
Miami Heat. I was ready to pencil them in for dead,

1729
01:24:05,279 --> 01:24:08,079
and look, you can still look. You could still convince

1730
01:24:08,119 --> 01:24:10,399
me that that's the route to go. But they're another

1731
01:24:10,439 --> 01:24:15,000
team where they pick up that win over I think

1732
01:24:14,960 --> 01:24:19,000
it was Minnesota on November tenth, and since then they're

1733
01:24:19,079 --> 01:24:21,600
nine to five. They have a top ten offense and

1734
01:24:21,680 --> 01:24:26,760
defense and just like Terry Rozier still isn't playing all

1735
01:24:26,800 --> 01:24:29,399
that well. But okay, Bamada Bayo, we know what he

1736
01:24:29,439 --> 01:24:31,840
is on defense, and the offense feels like it's starting

1737
01:24:31,840 --> 01:24:34,119
to tick up a little bit for him. And Tyler

1738
01:24:34,119 --> 01:24:38,039
hero has been mostly magnificent and we're seeing, okay, not

1739
01:24:38,199 --> 01:24:41,640
vintage Jimmy Butler, but you knock Jimmy Butler down like

1740
01:24:42,039 --> 01:24:44,439
he's still figuring it out when he's going to be available.

1741
01:24:45,000 --> 01:24:47,840
I don't and like and then yet you look at

1742
01:24:47,880 --> 01:24:52,520
this stretch moret and the only player with like the

1743
01:24:52,560 --> 01:24:55,439
main players with positive point differentials per game during this

1744
01:24:55,520 --> 01:25:01,039
stretch are bam Ada Baio just barely and then Hayward Heismith.

1745
01:25:01,039 --> 01:25:03,039
It's like kind of their main guys. Otherwise you're getting

1746
01:25:03,039 --> 01:25:06,640
into the Duncan Robinson, the Alec Burks of it all.

1747
01:25:07,000 --> 01:25:11,119
I don't know what to make of Miami other than

1748
01:25:11,800 --> 01:25:15,760
I don't trust them to do anything but date right everything.

1749
01:25:15,800 --> 01:25:16,199
Speaker 1: I say.

1750
01:25:17,680 --> 01:25:20,359
Speaker 2: So, if we agree that the Bulls were the most

1751
01:25:20,359 --> 01:25:24,319
confusing teams from like a direction perspective, the heat has

1752
01:25:24,399 --> 01:25:27,239
to be they have to be the most confusing team

1753
01:25:27,319 --> 01:25:30,279
from like an on court perspective. I think this year

1754
01:25:30,880 --> 01:25:34,800
I can't get a proper read on them at all. Like, again,

1755
01:25:34,960 --> 01:25:37,039
it's one of those situations like if you told me

1756
01:25:37,199 --> 01:25:40,199
before the season that Bam and Aebayo would be shooting,

1757
01:25:40,560 --> 01:25:42,840
you know, the way that he's shooting over the course

1758
01:25:42,880 --> 01:25:43,520
of the full season.

1759
01:25:43,560 --> 01:25:45,760
Speaker 1: I know he's been better of late, but like if you.

1760
01:25:45,760 --> 01:25:48,479
Speaker 2: Told me twenty two games into the season he'd be,

1761
01:25:49,000 --> 01:25:51,439
you know, sup forty five percent from the field, you know,

1762
01:25:51,520 --> 01:25:53,880
he wouldn't be all that efficient.

1763
01:25:53,960 --> 01:25:56,520
Speaker 1: I'd be like, oh, like they're in trouble.

1764
01:25:59,079 --> 01:26:01,680
Speaker 2: Jimmy is Jimmy. He'll figure stuff out. Like he's just

1765
01:26:01,720 --> 01:26:04,960
pacing himself through the regular seas done.

1766
01:26:05,600 --> 01:26:07,119
Speaker 3: I do think, to his credit, there was a point

1767
01:26:07,159 --> 01:26:08,640
where he was like kind of only flipping the fourth

1768
01:26:08,720 --> 01:26:10,800
quarter switch to start the year, and I think he's

1769
01:26:10,800 --> 01:26:13,920
starting to understand that it's not going to fly as much.

1770
01:26:14,119 --> 01:26:16,199
Speaker 2: But I feel like I say that every year though.

1771
01:26:16,279 --> 01:26:18,279
I feel like that's the thing that we well, if not,

1772
01:26:18,399 --> 01:26:20,680
if not every year, every other year, I feel like

1773
01:26:20,720 --> 01:26:23,199
we say that where it's like, Jimmy, come on, you

1774
01:26:23,560 --> 01:26:26,560
can't wait, like you have to play over the course

1775
01:26:26,560 --> 01:26:30,800
of the full game, like you have to participate again,

1776
01:26:30,960 --> 01:26:33,159
this is this is Miami being Miami. I'm not going

1777
01:26:33,199 --> 01:26:35,680
to lean into the whole, you know, heat culture thing

1778
01:26:35,720 --> 01:26:38,119
because I think it's bs like every team works hard

1779
01:26:38,159 --> 01:26:40,000
living You're not the only team in the NBA that

1780
01:26:40,039 --> 01:26:45,680
works hard. That's stupid. But they just have I think

1781
01:26:45,720 --> 01:26:48,760
it's cohesion. It's the word I was looking for. I mean,

1782
01:26:48,800 --> 01:26:52,000
this roster has been together, these guys have been together

1783
01:26:52,039 --> 01:26:54,680
for a while. They kind of know their way around

1784
01:26:54,680 --> 01:26:57,880
each other, they know their games. Coach bo is still around,

1785
01:26:57,880 --> 01:27:00,600
he's been there forever and now I feel as still

1786
01:27:00,680 --> 01:27:02,960
they They're like one of the few teams that can

1787
01:27:03,079 --> 01:27:07,359
lean in on the experience level and roll off. You know,

1788
01:27:07,560 --> 01:27:10,439
a ton of gwins in a row where even though

1789
01:27:10,479 --> 01:27:13,760
they've come out and look really ports begin the year,

1790
01:27:14,479 --> 01:27:17,600
they sort of ramp themselves up in some level of

1791
01:27:18,000 --> 01:27:20,359
like a new baseline more or less, and saying, Okay,

1792
01:27:20,720 --> 01:27:23,640
we might have been below that baseline before, now we're here.

1793
01:27:23,720 --> 01:27:26,359
That's our new that's our new floor. And then we

1794
01:27:26,439 --> 01:27:29,359
start off like this. It's it's kind of impressive because

1795
01:27:29,399 --> 01:27:32,039
a lot of teams, when they have a rough start,

1796
01:27:32,199 --> 01:27:35,000
they kind of say, oh, okay, well we've seen our

1797
01:27:35,000 --> 01:27:38,039
worst and that's really bad. That heat can sort of

1798
01:27:38,279 --> 01:27:43,359
identify and like close chapters, I feel like and say, Okay,

1799
01:27:43,520 --> 01:27:47,359
we were shitty for like ten games. Now we've rolled

1800
01:27:47,399 --> 01:27:49,239
off a couple of games in a row where we've

1801
01:27:49,279 --> 01:27:51,960
been looking pretty good. That's our new starting point, Like

1802
01:27:52,039 --> 01:27:54,920
that's where that's our new I'm.

1803
01:27:54,600 --> 01:27:56,920
Speaker 3: Wondering how much helps to It feels like they've kind

1804
01:27:56,920 --> 01:27:59,159
of they've dispensed with and I know availability as part

1805
01:27:59,199 --> 01:28:00,960
of this, but it's okay. We're gonna start Kevin Lover

1806
01:28:01,079 --> 01:28:03,319
Nikole Yovitch next to bam Adebayo. We're gonna have Duncan

1807
01:28:03,399 --> 01:28:06,800
Robbinson with Haywood high Smith and Tyler hero On Jimmy Butler.

1808
01:28:06,800 --> 01:28:09,520
When we're all healthy. That lineup is killing opponents. And

1809
01:28:09,560 --> 01:28:12,279
it took them until like the second half of November

1810
01:28:12,319 --> 01:28:14,760
to get to that lineup, and so you definitely figure

1811
01:28:14,760 --> 01:28:17,199
out some stuff there they've gotten. I mean, look, I think, hey,

1812
01:28:17,239 --> 01:28:20,159
what Heigh Smith's been fine, pel Larson that he's injured

1813
01:28:20,199 --> 01:28:21,800
right now, but like that is not a name. I

1814
01:28:21,880 --> 01:28:23,840
was intrigued by him. We talked about him on the Miami.

1815
01:28:23,920 --> 01:28:26,920
He looked ahead like he's played real minutes for them,

1816
01:28:26,960 --> 01:28:28,960
not necessarily something that you would have ticketed him for

1817
01:28:29,520 --> 01:28:32,000
at the beginning of the year. I don't I think

1818
01:28:32,039 --> 01:28:34,479
what my issue is and I don't know. I haven't

1819
01:28:34,479 --> 01:28:38,760
seen enough personally progression from jim hawkas on the offensive end,

1820
01:28:39,239 --> 01:28:42,479
like counting on too much of that from him, I think,

1821
01:28:42,760 --> 01:28:44,960
And this is now becoming a repetitive point for me,

1822
01:28:45,000 --> 01:28:46,760
so I don't even want to say it. I think

1823
01:28:46,800 --> 01:28:49,359
I still am officially at the point though, even though

1824
01:28:49,359 --> 01:28:51,800
they have these better vitals and we're seeing some things

1825
01:28:51,800 --> 01:28:54,720
turn around for them. Do you agree with the thought

1826
01:28:54,840 --> 01:28:57,880
process behind it being if Miami wants to be where

1827
01:28:57,880 --> 01:29:02,239
Miami aspires to be in this moment, they need a

1828
01:29:02,239 --> 01:29:06,239
new best player, Like do you view Jimmy Butler or

1829
01:29:06,279 --> 01:29:10,199
bam Adebayo as capable of either one being the best

1830
01:29:10,199 --> 01:29:12,439
player player, not I don't even say a title winner,

1831
01:29:12,479 --> 01:29:15,119
but a contender. Or do you think that between them,

1832
01:29:15,520 --> 01:29:19,760
they like the sum of the parts between them amounts

1833
01:29:19,760 --> 01:29:23,439
to even a fringe contender, because yes, I'm yeah, you do, Okay,

1834
01:29:23,520 --> 01:29:25,279
I struggle to get there now.

1835
01:29:25,640 --> 01:29:27,319
Speaker 1: It's look, Jimmy Butler has.

1836
01:29:27,199 --> 01:29:30,079
Speaker 2: Proven us all wrong so many times that I feel

1837
01:29:30,079 --> 01:29:32,560
as though if I'm sitting here and saying I don't.

1838
01:29:32,600 --> 01:29:35,199
I don't think he can get there anymore. I'm just

1839
01:29:35,239 --> 01:29:38,479
setting myself up. I'm setting myself up. He's that good,

1840
01:29:38,520 --> 01:29:42,199
And like we know what you know Jimmy Butler can

1841
01:29:42,279 --> 01:29:42,880
be when.

1842
01:29:42,720 --> 01:29:44,439
Speaker 1: He is at his best.

1843
01:29:44,520 --> 01:29:47,399
Speaker 2: He is the absolute best ceiling racer in the league

1844
01:29:47,399 --> 01:29:51,600
when he's on, and nothing in his game to me

1845
01:29:51,800 --> 01:29:55,439
indicates that he can't get back to that level, like

1846
01:29:55,840 --> 01:29:57,199
unless his body fails him.

1847
01:29:57,239 --> 01:29:58,520
Speaker 1: But that those are things that I.

1848
01:29:58,560 --> 01:30:02,239
Speaker 2: Just I can't that, Like I'm not on the Heat's

1849
01:30:02,279 --> 01:30:05,520
medical staff. I'm not on there, Like I don't know,

1850
01:30:05,760 --> 01:30:07,560
I have no idea what his body looks like. But

1851
01:30:07,640 --> 01:30:10,119
what I do know is that he's out there. If

1852
01:30:10,159 --> 01:30:12,600
he's feeling good, if he's feeling healthy, he can step

1853
01:30:12,680 --> 01:30:14,840
up to that level. He's done it repeatedly over the

1854
01:30:14,880 --> 01:30:16,319
course of the last few years when.

1855
01:30:16,239 --> 01:30:17,319
Speaker 1: We counted him out.

1856
01:30:17,600 --> 01:30:21,199
Speaker 2: So why what argument do I even have to say, No,

1857
01:30:21,279 --> 01:30:22,880
he can't get there anymore, like.

1858
01:30:23,399 --> 01:30:24,800
Speaker 1: Age, I guess.

1859
01:30:24,840 --> 01:30:27,359
Speaker 2: But like we've said the same thing about Lebron before,

1860
01:30:27,399 --> 01:30:29,720
We've said the same thing about Kevin Durand before, and

1861
01:30:29,760 --> 01:30:32,399
we've been kicked in the mouth whenever we've set that.

1862
01:30:32,600 --> 01:30:35,720
So I'm just gonna basically say, no, I'm not gonna

1863
01:30:35,760 --> 01:30:37,399
question Jimmy Butler to be that guy.

1864
01:30:37,479 --> 01:30:39,439
Speaker 3: Then what is it? Quickly, what do you view it

1865
01:30:39,479 --> 01:30:41,680
as what this team needs? And I'm sure, look, the

1866
01:30:41,760 --> 01:30:44,359
Terry rezierve of it all has definitely complicated that, because

1867
01:30:44,800 --> 01:30:47,319
now you want someone who's supposed to be what Terry

1868
01:30:47,359 --> 01:30:50,279
Rozier was to you. But it still feels like, even then,

1869
01:30:51,119 --> 01:30:56,479
this roster seems one significant rotation player short. And again,

1870
01:30:56,479 --> 01:30:58,720
maybe I'm just waiting too much of what we saw

1871
01:30:59,079 --> 01:31:01,880
earlier in the season, whether it was all this awkwardness,

1872
01:31:01,880 --> 01:31:03,279
but I even look at the rotation and some of

1873
01:31:03,319 --> 01:31:06,079
the guys that've turned me around again, the players that

1874
01:31:06,119 --> 01:31:09,119
have been performing well for them, and it just feels

1875
01:31:09,159 --> 01:31:13,720
like there's something significant missing here and I can't pinpoint

1876
01:31:13,760 --> 01:31:15,760
it other than to say, like the route to go

1877
01:31:15,800 --> 01:31:18,800
would be well, they need like another kind of shot

1878
01:31:18,880 --> 01:31:21,960
creator with size who won't submarine the defense, which is

1879
01:31:22,039 --> 01:31:23,680
just like such a hot hand need.

1880
01:31:24,239 --> 01:31:27,920
Speaker 2: Well, they need speed too, that's the thing. Yeah, it's

1881
01:31:27,960 --> 01:31:30,399
an older team. It's a slow team. You know, it's

1882
01:31:30,439 --> 01:31:32,560
a seemed that loves to operate in the half court.

1883
01:31:32,640 --> 01:31:35,760
They're not running a lot, They're not a quick team.

1884
01:31:36,439 --> 01:31:39,720
I think I think they were hoping to change shot

1885
01:31:39,760 --> 01:31:42,640
with Harry Rosher because Roshir can't be a rocket. At

1886
01:31:42,680 --> 01:31:45,680
times he hasn't been. I wonder if that's part of

1887
01:31:45,720 --> 01:31:49,079
the issue is when when Roshir got traded there, he

1888
01:31:49,239 --> 01:31:51,479
kind of said, Okay, look, I'm going to try to

1889
01:31:51,560 --> 01:31:55,239
learn Miami Heat basketball instead of being you know, that

1890
01:31:55,279 --> 01:31:59,079
firecracker he used to be in Charlotte for example, Like

1891
01:31:59,239 --> 01:32:02,000
I've been just appointing to see him like scale back

1892
01:32:02,079 --> 01:32:04,239
and only take you know, nine or ten shots per

1893
01:32:04,279 --> 01:32:06,880
game or whatever the number is, Like he has to

1894
01:32:06,920 --> 01:32:08,640
take more. He has to like when he gets a

1895
01:32:08,680 --> 01:32:11,920
defensive rebound, he has to just fly down the floor,

1896
01:32:12,279 --> 01:32:14,439
and he's not. He's looking at Spoe half the time.

1897
01:32:14,600 --> 01:32:16,359
This team wants to play it a little bit too

1898
01:32:16,439 --> 01:32:20,840
slowly for my liking. Yeah, so they if it's I

1899
01:32:20,840 --> 01:32:23,800
don't know if it's an internal fix or if they

1900
01:32:23,840 --> 01:32:27,359
need external help to come in, like in terms of

1901
01:32:27,399 --> 01:32:29,840
like a trade or an acquisition, someone who can come

1902
01:32:29,880 --> 01:32:31,920
in and basically say, yeah, we need to rush this

1903
01:32:31,960 --> 01:32:34,880
thing through. But they need more speed, Like Tyler Hero

1904
01:32:35,079 --> 01:32:38,880
is the only one right now who I feel pushes

1905
01:32:39,720 --> 01:32:43,800
the buttons like just forces the issue on this team,

1906
01:32:43,840 --> 01:32:46,640
like even Jimmy, who, well Jimmy will do it occasionally,

1907
01:32:46,640 --> 01:32:49,159
but like also he's he's pacing himself.

1908
01:32:49,199 --> 01:32:50,199
Speaker 1: Let's just be real about it.

1909
01:32:50,359 --> 01:32:53,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, but yeah, you look at this and they're dead

1910
01:32:53,359 --> 01:32:57,279
last in average offensive possession time after grabbing a defensive rebound,

1911
01:32:57,359 --> 01:32:59,279
So there needs to be I don't know if they

1912
01:32:59,279 --> 01:33:01,920
have the personnel to that. I guess you mentioned Tyler hero,

1913
01:33:02,319 --> 01:33:04,840
there's bam Atebayo, the idea of Terry Roseier. I mean,

1914
01:33:04,840 --> 01:33:08,239
Butler's capable of pushing more, and don't I don't know

1915
01:33:08,279 --> 01:33:10,359
why you look at this personnel as Miami and you're

1916
01:33:10,359 --> 01:33:12,800
not playing faster. Not that I think they're clearly not

1917
01:33:12,920 --> 01:33:16,359
super duper athletic, but when you look at there are

1918
01:33:16,399 --> 01:33:19,680
spacing limitations. When Terry Rozier is shooting like this, when

1919
01:33:19,760 --> 01:33:22,520
bam is just not like he's never been a floor spacer.

1920
01:33:22,840 --> 01:33:24,600
But and when Jimmy Butler is not going to be

1921
01:33:24,600 --> 01:33:27,000
a willing three point shooter, why wouldn't there be more

1922
01:33:27,039 --> 01:33:29,479
of an urgency to go up against defenses that haven't

1923
01:33:29,520 --> 01:33:31,479
been set. So a good call out by you on

1924
01:33:31,520 --> 01:33:32,039
the speed thing.

1925
01:33:32,399 --> 01:33:36,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's ironic the most athletic player isn't really playing.

1926
01:33:38,520 --> 01:33:39,159
Speaker 1: Llle aware.

1927
01:33:40,000 --> 01:33:42,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, but how I guess I did think

1928
01:33:42,920 --> 01:33:44,239
that they were going to play him next to bam

1929
01:33:44,279 --> 01:33:45,920
Aton at some point this year, so that might be

1930
01:33:45,960 --> 01:33:48,119
a slightly of a big deal. They're just a team

1931
01:33:48,159 --> 01:33:51,279
where yeah, they're kind of an asset no man's land too,

1932
01:33:51,399 --> 01:33:53,279
because now you're at a point where I think a

1933
01:33:53,279 --> 01:33:55,680
lot of people came to view Tyler Hero as filler salary.

1934
01:33:55,800 --> 01:33:58,439
I never quite got there, but now he's become He's

1935
01:33:58,439 --> 01:34:00,600
been indispensable this year. We could just say it. Where

1936
01:34:00,600 --> 01:34:03,199
would they be without Tyler Hero right now?

1937
01:34:03,279 --> 01:34:04,920
Speaker 2: I had never bought into the fact that he was

1938
01:34:04,960 --> 01:34:07,319
filler's salary either. I do think there was a point

1939
01:34:07,319 --> 01:34:09,920
in time where it was fair to wonder what was

1940
01:34:09,920 --> 01:34:12,520
the ultimate potential in him? And now he's showing us

1941
01:34:12,520 --> 01:34:14,479
that we shouldn't have doubted him, which they loved that,

1942
01:34:14,520 --> 01:34:14,920
by the way.

1943
01:34:14,960 --> 01:34:15,720
Speaker 1: I always love that.

1944
01:34:16,079 --> 01:34:18,079
Speaker 3: Yeah, and look, Cooper Morehead had pointed this out too.

1945
01:34:18,079 --> 01:34:19,920
I think even the bigger term of events was when

1946
01:34:19,960 --> 01:34:21,840
he was kind of going through that rough patch and

1947
01:34:21,880 --> 01:34:25,079
his shot profile still wasn't reverting back to where it was.

1948
01:34:25,479 --> 01:34:28,359
That was a big deal because Tyler Hero's shot profile.

1949
01:34:28,520 --> 01:34:31,399
It's a stark change. It's not something that's got here gradually.

1950
01:34:31,439 --> 01:34:33,720
It's almost like we talk about Jimmy flipping a switch.

1951
01:34:34,000 --> 01:34:37,720
He just flipped the shot profile switch this year. And

1952
01:34:37,760 --> 01:34:39,399
the fact that it's holding, I think is a really

1953
01:34:39,399 --> 01:34:41,520
big deal. And I think that's why I got harder

1954
01:34:41,560 --> 01:34:43,680
to envision this is who do we view as sort

1955
01:34:43,720 --> 01:34:47,920
of the poster child for incremental improvement, Probably a Jalen

1956
01:34:48,000 --> 01:34:52,680
Brown or someone along those lines. Tyler Heroes. God just

1957
01:34:52,720 --> 01:34:55,920
like just got here, like just reworked his shot profile.

1958
01:34:56,319 --> 01:34:57,720
All the credit in the world to him, I just

1959
01:34:57,720 --> 01:34:59,680
don't know. I think it means a ton to this team.

1960
01:35:00,199 --> 01:35:02,359
I'm just when you don't have a ton of trade assets,

1961
01:35:02,720 --> 01:35:04,560
because you now, like what if Terrors you're worth on

1962
01:35:04,600 --> 01:35:06,279
the trade market? Not much, and you gave up a

1963
01:35:06,319 --> 01:35:08,239
pick to get him. You don't have a ton of

1964
01:35:08,239 --> 01:35:10,960
first rounders to trade. And we also can't really pinpoint

1965
01:35:11,279 --> 01:35:13,399
a specific of all the players that are gonna become

1966
01:35:13,439 --> 01:35:16,640
available on the trade market. Yeah, Kobe White might look

1967
01:35:16,680 --> 01:35:18,800
good here, like how are you getting Like, what are

1968
01:35:18,800 --> 01:35:20,680
you do? You have enough assets to go out and

1969
01:35:20,680 --> 01:35:22,199
get him? And they are just players who are gonna

1970
01:35:22,199 --> 01:35:24,520
wind up giving up at this point is their most

1971
01:35:24,880 --> 01:35:28,840
expendable salary filler. I do believe people will probably assume

1972
01:35:28,840 --> 01:35:32,640
it's Duncan Robinson. Has it become Terror's here just because

1973
01:35:32,640 --> 01:35:36,399
of the emergence of this new version of Tyler Hero.

1974
01:35:37,720 --> 01:35:39,920
Speaker 1: How much is guaranteed on his steal next year?

1975
01:35:40,199 --> 01:35:43,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's I'm sorry, it's not partially guaranteed. It's

1976
01:35:43,960 --> 01:35:47,520
like fully guaranteed. It's basically ninety of the contract or

1977
01:35:47,560 --> 01:35:48,760
some weird number me.

1978
01:35:49,079 --> 01:35:51,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, see I see it here. Well, okay, so basically

1979
01:35:51,840 --> 01:35:53,840
it's a two year contract or a year and a

1980
01:35:53,920 --> 01:35:57,760
half roughly. I mean see, that's always the tricky part,

1981
01:35:57,840 --> 01:36:00,239
right like in a filler contract if you have another year,

1982
01:36:00,279 --> 01:36:02,600
because if this is the version of Terao Sheer you're

1983
01:36:02,600 --> 01:36:04,520
going to get, are you really willing to pay him,

1984
01:36:04,640 --> 01:36:08,760
you know, twenty six point five whatever million next year?

1985
01:36:08,840 --> 01:36:10,920
Speaker 1: I'm not really sure about that.

1986
01:36:11,960 --> 01:36:14,640
Speaker 2: But again, it does feel like Miami does have a

1987
01:36:14,680 --> 01:36:17,359
tendency to handcuff certain players who they get in.

1988
01:36:17,920 --> 01:36:19,119
Speaker 1: I wonder why that is.

1989
01:36:19,399 --> 01:36:22,239
Speaker 2: It's remember when I'm gonna take you way back and

1990
01:36:22,279 --> 01:36:24,159
I'm going to show my age here. But remember when

1991
01:36:24,239 --> 01:36:27,800
Richard Jefferson was playing for the Spurs. He basically said.

1992
01:36:27,800 --> 01:36:29,880
Speaker 3: I'm so young. I don't even know who that player is.

1993
01:36:31,359 --> 01:36:34,640
Speaker 2: He basically said, it's gonna take a year, if not

1994
01:36:34,760 --> 01:36:38,479
to to adjust to Pop in the Spurs system.

1995
01:36:39,039 --> 01:36:40,560
Speaker 1: It feels like that has.

1996
01:36:40,439 --> 01:36:43,720
Speaker 2: Become like the Heat story now, where it just takes

1997
01:36:43,760 --> 01:36:47,319
guys so long if they're coming from outside organizations where

1998
01:36:47,359 --> 01:36:49,960
they've been for a while, to like get acclimated to

1999
01:36:50,039 --> 01:36:54,000
how they're playing here. I'm not saying you should change

2000
01:36:54,039 --> 01:36:56,239
head coach because Spoe's brilliant. I don't want to go

2001
01:36:56,319 --> 01:36:58,479
that route, but I do think they need to look

2002
01:36:58,520 --> 01:37:01,720
themselves in the mirror and figure out how can we

2003
01:37:01,720 --> 01:37:04,119
streamline this process a little bit better for a guy

2004
01:37:04,199 --> 01:37:06,359
that we trade for. Because if we are going out

2005
01:37:06,399 --> 01:37:10,479
there and fork over draft picks for guys who we

2006
01:37:10,520 --> 01:37:13,960
want to help us win right now, and we torpedo

2007
01:37:14,039 --> 01:37:17,439
their own value, we torpedo their own productivity, what the

2008
01:37:17,479 --> 01:37:20,000
hell are we even achieving? I think that's a legitimate

2009
01:37:20,039 --> 01:37:22,279
question they have to ask themselves. All right, Dan, let's

2010
01:37:22,319 --> 01:37:26,720
close it up with the Sacramento Kings. From my perspective,

2011
01:37:26,880 --> 01:37:28,479
I think they're confusing.

2012
01:37:29,800 --> 01:37:30,119
Speaker 3: Well.

2013
01:37:30,399 --> 01:37:33,199
Speaker 1: I mean, there's such a sophistic Yeah.

2014
01:37:33,279 --> 01:37:38,199
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, So there's I want to break it into

2015
01:37:38,239 --> 01:37:42,399
two tiers because there's the obvious concern that DeMar came

2016
01:37:42,479 --> 01:37:45,039
in takes a lot of like mid rain shots that

2017
01:37:45,159 --> 01:37:47,920
hurt their spacing. Like that's one of the obvious things

2018
01:37:47,920 --> 01:37:52,399
that we knew about. What we what we probably didn't

2019
01:37:52,479 --> 01:37:58,079
foresee was keik and Murray hitting twenty nine percent of

2020
01:37:58,159 --> 01:38:01,399
shots from from deep to per overall, sitting at just

2021
01:38:01,479 --> 01:38:04,039
twelve points per game, and seeing him take this back

2022
01:38:04,119 --> 01:38:08,039
seat to like dMar tod'aron Fox as the bonus. Like

2023
01:38:08,159 --> 01:38:10,520
I think all of us kind of assumed that DeMar

2024
01:38:11,520 --> 01:38:15,840
would not be perhaps as trigger happy as he's been

2025
01:38:16,079 --> 01:38:20,920
in Sacramento, and that Keigan would find ways more than

2026
01:38:20,920 --> 01:38:25,439
he's done so far to get himself involved offensively. Before

2027
01:38:25,680 --> 01:38:28,840
I give you the word, I will say this reddit

2028
01:38:28,960 --> 01:38:33,079
to Keigan Murray for becoming their best defender, also improving

2029
01:38:33,119 --> 01:38:35,960
his rebounding to the extent that he does that he did.

2030
01:38:36,319 --> 01:38:39,439
I really love to see that improvement on his side.

2031
01:38:39,720 --> 01:38:42,199
But like the offense, for him, that was always his

2032
01:38:43,000 --> 01:38:45,439
number one skill and it's probably going to be his

2033
01:38:45,560 --> 01:38:47,640
number one skill for the rest of his career. But

2034
01:38:47,760 --> 01:38:51,079
at some point the Kings have to lean into it.

2035
01:38:51,439 --> 01:38:55,479
Like they let him play this sort of complimentary role

2036
01:38:55,560 --> 01:38:58,439
for two damn long, It's time for them to empower

2037
01:38:59,000 --> 01:38:59,640
Egan Murray.

2038
01:39:00,119 --> 01:39:02,039
Speaker 3: I just how do you do that with the Because

2039
01:39:02,079 --> 01:39:05,239
I'm I agree with you that I'm still I'm not

2040
01:39:05,319 --> 01:39:08,119
shocked that he's been marginalized to some extent on offense,

2041
01:39:08,239 --> 01:39:11,039
but you definitely didn't expect him to shoot this poorly

2042
01:39:11,359 --> 01:39:14,399
to start the year. I don't like, how are you

2043
01:39:14,439 --> 01:39:18,600
supposed to unlock Keegan Murray with the current infrastructure that

2044
01:39:18,640 --> 01:39:20,079
you have. It's not just you have him the League

2045
01:39:20,119 --> 01:39:22,880
Monk two in addition to Marta Rosen and Domas Bonis

2046
01:39:22,920 --> 01:39:26,560
and Daron Fox. And another thing that's happening here which

2047
01:39:26,600 --> 01:39:29,159
I do think does speak to the importance of Keegan

2048
01:39:29,239 --> 01:39:32,520
Murray is that Sacramento is losing the three point value

2049
01:39:32,520 --> 01:39:35,760
by essentially three makes per one hundred possessions, which I

2050
01:39:35,800 --> 01:39:38,960
think given how poorly Keegan Murray and Kevin Herder have

2051
01:39:39,239 --> 01:39:42,039
both shot to start the year, coupled with the shots

2052
01:39:42,079 --> 01:39:44,399
you know Demarta Rosen wants to take and the shots

2053
01:39:44,439 --> 01:39:47,920
you know that Domantobonis does not take in super high volume,

2054
01:39:48,319 --> 01:39:50,760
A minus nine per one hundred possessions is not nothing,

2055
01:39:51,239 --> 01:39:53,000
but I would expect it to have been worse if

2056
01:39:53,079 --> 01:39:56,640
you laid out this criteria for me. I like, I

2057
01:39:56,960 --> 01:40:00,000
they're confusing as well to me because I don't necessary

2058
01:40:00,039 --> 01:40:02,800
really know what your solve is going to be. You

2059
01:40:02,800 --> 01:40:05,119
could definitely tell with the way that Mike Brown is

2060
01:40:05,479 --> 01:40:07,479
rolling out some of his lineups that even he's trying

2061
01:40:07,479 --> 01:40:09,720
to figure some of it out. But when you get

2062
01:40:09,760 --> 01:40:13,760
into if you're trying to spotlight problems, like this team

2063
01:40:13,840 --> 01:40:17,680
is seventh on offense, their thirteenth on defense, they have

2064
01:40:18,079 --> 01:40:21,119
like the biggest discrepancy between their win differential and then

2065
01:40:21,119 --> 01:40:24,840
their actual point differential. And that'll come back to all right, well,

2066
01:40:24,880 --> 01:40:27,640
look at how much time this team is spent in

2067
01:40:27,680 --> 01:40:31,159
the clutch, and it's it's the most, it's the second

2068
01:40:31,159 --> 01:40:34,000
most in the NBA behind the Charlotte Hornets. And now

2069
01:40:34,000 --> 01:40:36,479
they are now five and nine in those situations. And

2070
01:40:36,479 --> 01:40:40,159
so I found myself thinking, are they kind of just well,

2071
01:40:40,159 --> 01:40:43,520
his performance is for maybe not Herder normalizes because he's

2072
01:40:43,520 --> 01:40:47,039
actually been pretty bad ever since the twenty twenty three playoffs,

2073
01:40:47,119 --> 01:40:49,239
at least not the Kevin Herder that you thought you

2074
01:40:49,279 --> 01:40:52,479
were getting but as Keig and Murray's performance normalizes, maybe

2075
01:40:52,479 --> 01:40:54,640
you string together for more availability, Like we know DeMar

2076
01:40:55,079 --> 01:40:57,000
had missed some time. Is it's just a matter of

2077
01:40:57,079 --> 01:40:59,680
if other possessions had gone the Kings his way that

2078
01:40:59,720 --> 01:41:02,000
we're talking about, like they're not even on this list

2079
01:41:02,319 --> 01:41:03,800
for us. Or do you view this as more of

2080
01:41:03,800 --> 01:41:06,199
a wholesale issue where it's, oh, no, this team, this

2081
01:41:06,239 --> 01:41:08,199
team belongs here and it's not. You know, I've done

2082
01:41:08,199 --> 01:41:10,439
a lot about in terms of how can I upgrade

2083
01:41:10,800 --> 01:41:13,439
the secondary front court rotation, like get me Larry Nance

2084
01:41:13,520 --> 01:41:15,640
Junior on this team, or get me Dorian Phinney Smith

2085
01:41:16,039 --> 01:41:17,880
on this team. Do you think that the issues are

2086
01:41:18,920 --> 01:41:20,199
bleaker than that?

2087
01:41:21,840 --> 01:41:23,640
Speaker 1: I will say this.

2088
01:41:24,640 --> 01:41:27,520
Speaker 2: I think their issues are they tried to split the

2089
01:41:27,560 --> 01:41:31,399
difference and tried to be better defensively while sacrificing some

2090
01:41:31,479 --> 01:41:34,199
offense instead of leaning into one side of the ball.

2091
01:41:34,239 --> 01:41:36,920
We saw two years ago how dynamic they were when

2092
01:41:36,920 --> 01:41:40,640
they chose a direction. Then they started saying, oh, okay,

2093
01:41:40,680 --> 01:41:43,199
look we didn't you know, we had a tough seven

2094
01:41:43,279 --> 01:41:45,640
game series loss to go stayed in the playoffs.

2095
01:41:45,880 --> 01:41:46,800
Speaker 1: Let's build on this.

2096
01:41:46,880 --> 01:41:48,720
Speaker 2: They went from the number one offense in the league

2097
01:41:48,720 --> 01:41:51,000
to the thirteenth best offense in the league because they

2098
01:41:51,039 --> 01:41:53,680
kind of said, oh, we also want to compete defensively,

2099
01:41:54,279 --> 01:41:55,279
they gave up their edge.

2100
01:41:55,359 --> 01:41:58,560
Speaker 1: Dan. That was the problem for me. You sometimes just

2101
01:41:58,640 --> 01:42:01,760
have to lean into who you are are. This team

2102
01:42:02,319 --> 01:42:04,800
is trying to have it both ways when they don't

2103
01:42:04,800 --> 01:42:07,279
have the roster to do so. It's the same problem

2104
01:42:07,319 --> 01:42:09,640
the Lakers are facing with having a bunch of one

2105
01:42:09,680 --> 01:42:14,439
way guys on their roster. You cannot, as.

2106
01:42:14,279 --> 01:42:18,640
Speaker 2: An NBA organization, if you found your niche, pivot away

2107
01:42:18,680 --> 01:42:20,800
from that and just assume things are going to fall

2108
01:42:20,840 --> 01:42:22,920
into place. And I think that's what the Kings did.

2109
01:42:23,359 --> 01:42:26,840
They are talking about defense way more than they've done

2110
01:42:26,840 --> 01:42:31,159
in the recent years, where I'm like, guys, at best,

2111
01:42:31,640 --> 01:42:34,520
you're gonna make a modest defensive improvement and it's going

2112
01:42:34,600 --> 01:42:38,239
to cost you potentially the number one offense in the league,

2113
01:42:38,600 --> 01:42:41,479
which could win you more games. That's where I see

2114
01:42:41,520 --> 01:42:46,399
the biggest challenge being here. It's like an internal direction

2115
01:42:46,640 --> 01:42:50,000
and an internal compass, if you will, that's just been

2116
01:42:50,159 --> 01:42:52,680
out of whack. So we can sit here and talk

2117
01:42:52,720 --> 01:42:59,039
about whether this necessitates moves, whether there are greater issues

2118
01:42:59,039 --> 01:43:02,760
at hand. I think this is an organizational change that

2119
01:43:02,840 --> 01:43:05,960
should not have happened. Lean into the number, lean into

2120
01:43:06,000 --> 01:43:07,600
the offense. This was who you were.

2121
01:43:07,920 --> 01:43:11,319
Speaker 3: They're seven, though, like what I know they're they're in

2122
01:43:11,399 --> 01:43:14,840
transition less compared to last season. I think they're twenty

2123
01:43:14,880 --> 01:43:17,680
second in transition frequency, which I mean just any team

2124
01:43:17,720 --> 01:43:19,279
that has the Aaron Fox and is in the bottom

2125
01:43:19,279 --> 01:43:22,159
ten of transition frequency is just gonna feel super weird

2126
01:43:22,159 --> 01:43:25,119
to me. But like it's not when you look at

2127
01:43:25,119 --> 01:43:27,880
like sort of the actual frequency with which they're spinning

2128
01:43:27,920 --> 01:43:30,399
in it hasn't dropped off a ton. So I mean,

2129
01:43:30,479 --> 01:43:33,359
as of right now when we're recording this on Monday night,

2130
01:43:33,399 --> 01:43:35,760
in advance of games that are going to be happening,

2131
01:43:36,039 --> 01:43:39,039
fourteen point four percent of their plays come in transition.

2132
01:43:39,119 --> 01:43:42,199
That's down from sixteen percent last year. So it's the

2133
01:43:42,199 --> 01:43:46,159
difference between wing excuse me, ranking fifth and twenty second,

2134
01:43:46,439 --> 01:43:49,720
But it's not like this huge decline. And that's why

2135
01:43:49,720 --> 01:43:51,800
I'm sort of wondering. And I still think that this

2136
01:43:52,159 --> 01:43:56,119
makes your point that I find them intensely confusing, is

2137
01:43:56,159 --> 01:43:59,680
that it feels like this isn't a oh they need

2138
01:43:59,720 --> 01:44:02,319
to make a big trade. I don't know if necessarily

2139
01:44:02,319 --> 01:44:04,399
if you want to get into schematically like, have they

2140
01:44:04,479 --> 01:44:06,439
skewed too far towards trying to play both ends of

2141
01:44:06,439 --> 01:44:09,000
the floor. I think that's fair, But I keep coming

2142
01:44:09,039 --> 01:44:10,399
back to you, I don't necessarily want to be a

2143
01:44:10,439 --> 01:44:13,760
purveyor of optimism for a team that's this confusing, But like,

2144
01:44:13,840 --> 01:44:16,000
it just feels as if they get a couple of

2145
01:44:16,079 --> 01:44:18,319
different breaks, they're gonna be a much better team. And

2146
01:44:18,359 --> 01:44:22,479
we're having a different discussion. I think the mega concern

2147
01:44:22,600 --> 01:44:25,640
to me personally would come from, are they one not

2148
01:44:25,680 --> 01:44:27,800
going to do anything to deepen their rotation at the deadline.

2149
01:44:27,800 --> 01:44:30,880
I'm talking about like finding a seventh eighth man whatever,

2150
01:44:30,920 --> 01:44:33,319
they absolutely need to do that, and names I mentioned

2151
01:44:33,399 --> 01:44:35,279
like thrown out already should be on the radar. Or

2152
01:44:35,319 --> 01:44:37,680
do you think that this is just Keegan Murray in

2153
01:44:37,760 --> 01:44:41,720
this larger, offensive, hierarchical system. Is this now his default,

2154
01:44:41,760 --> 01:44:44,000
because then that is a problem.

2155
01:44:43,680 --> 01:44:46,359
Speaker 1: Right, that's a major issue if that's this is his default.

2156
01:44:46,399 --> 01:44:48,199
Speaker 2: And by the way, they're going to get better when

2157
01:44:48,199 --> 01:44:49,359
Devin Carter comes back.

2158
01:44:50,039 --> 01:44:50,560
Speaker 1: I know he's a.

2159
01:44:50,560 --> 01:44:53,600
Speaker 3: Rookie, he's not playing. There's just even if it comes back,

2160
01:44:53,600 --> 01:44:56,600
they're not relying on a rookie. I would be I saw.

2161
01:44:56,680 --> 01:44:58,159
I know a lot of fans were kind of thought

2162
01:44:58,159 --> 01:44:59,960
that he could play. I just I don't see it

2163
01:45:00,319 --> 01:45:01,000
me personally.

2164
01:45:01,479 --> 01:45:03,600
Speaker 2: Well, we'll we'll find out, Like if he's not gonna

2165
01:45:03,600 --> 01:45:05,439
play this year, the next year, they're gonna have an

2166
01:45:05,439 --> 01:45:08,880
automatic upgrade right there, because I do think that he

2167
01:45:08,920 --> 01:45:12,000
could be another rotation piece that you alluded to. But no, look,

2168
01:45:12,159 --> 01:45:14,119
we can boil this down to Keithan Murray. I think

2169
01:45:14,119 --> 01:45:17,399
that is fair. They have not been able to utilize

2170
01:45:17,439 --> 01:45:21,319
him the right way. I will also say this isn't

2171
01:45:21,359 --> 01:45:24,359
exclusively at the feet of Mike Brown and the coaching staff.

2172
01:45:24,600 --> 01:45:27,199
Keigan himself has had a little bit too much Patrick

2173
01:45:27,239 --> 01:45:31,079
Williams in him this year when just it comes to

2174
01:45:31,239 --> 01:45:34,680
like that sounded wrong, Oh my god, not what I meant.

2175
01:45:35,000 --> 01:45:36,840
Speaker 3: It's sounding wrong on a bunch of different levels.

2176
01:45:36,840 --> 01:45:38,640
Speaker 1: Actually, so it really did.

2177
01:45:38,680 --> 01:45:40,720
Speaker 2: But you know what I mean though, the passiveness, the

2178
01:45:40,800 --> 01:45:44,520
fact that he's standing there, he's really he's basically passing

2179
01:45:44,600 --> 01:45:47,960
up on open shots occasionally like he has to be

2180
01:45:48,119 --> 01:45:48,840
more aggressive.

2181
01:45:48,880 --> 01:45:52,840
Speaker 1: He here's the thing. He is a six.

2182
01:45:52,880 --> 01:45:56,960
Speaker 2: Eight two twenty five forward, who's nimble, who's got on

2183
01:45:57,079 --> 01:46:00,119
ball skills, who's got off ball skills. He should be

2184
01:46:00,199 --> 01:46:03,359
your best pluck and play player on the entire team,

2185
01:46:03,840 --> 01:46:07,600
Yet he is not being utilized. You're forcing the ball

2186
01:46:07,680 --> 01:46:11,319
through guys who you have to structure the offense around

2187
01:46:11,359 --> 01:46:15,560
and a very odd way to optimize their own capabilities.

2188
01:46:15,840 --> 01:46:18,600
Whereas the guy who's the most seamless fit of them

2189
01:46:18,600 --> 01:46:22,079
all and the guy you should be basically seeking out

2190
01:46:22,079 --> 01:46:27,600
shots for, is getting broadly ignored. That's not great. That's

2191
01:46:27,640 --> 01:46:30,159
on him, it's on the coaching staff, it's on everyone.

2192
01:46:30,560 --> 01:46:31,399
Speaker 1: I'm hoping.

2193
01:46:31,960 --> 01:46:34,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think what's also been I would say an

2194
01:46:34,680 --> 01:46:38,640
unintended consequence of the way that they're set up, because

2195
01:46:38,680 --> 01:46:42,279
I think in the half court, defenses are just going

2196
01:46:42,319 --> 01:46:45,600
to be inherently less concerned about certain guys or if

2197
01:46:45,640 --> 01:46:48,079
you're gonna be okay, you have tacticians from the mid range,

2198
01:46:48,079 --> 01:46:50,720
awesome teams will mostly live with. That is how much

2199
01:46:50,960 --> 01:46:54,279
harder it seems like Keegan worry Keegan Murray needs to

2200
01:46:54,359 --> 01:46:56,600
work for his shots to war like there's no when

2201
01:46:56,600 --> 01:46:58,680
you look at what this roster needs and just relative

2202
01:46:58,720 --> 01:47:01,479
to the personnel, why is he taking fewer three pointers

2203
01:47:01,479 --> 01:47:03,479
per one hundred posessions than he was last season? There

2204
01:47:03,520 --> 01:47:06,720
is no explainable reason. But when you watch, it's, well,

2205
01:47:06,720 --> 01:47:08,920
he's not gonna beat like, this can't be someone who's

2206
01:47:08,920 --> 01:47:11,640
just getting catch and shoot opportunities because the way that

2207
01:47:11,680 --> 01:47:14,159
the Kings are built in the half court. Yeah, in transition,

2208
01:47:14,239 --> 01:47:17,079
different story for sure. But he's out in transition a

2209
01:47:17,079 --> 01:47:19,039
little bit more this season than he was last season,

2210
01:47:19,079 --> 01:47:22,199
as the Kings' overall transition frequency declines, and so in

2211
01:47:22,239 --> 01:47:24,520
the half court he almost has to work harder for

2212
01:47:24,560 --> 01:47:27,239
his shots because he doesn't have the same room with

2213
01:47:27,319 --> 01:47:29,119
which to work that he did when they have fewer

2214
01:47:29,159 --> 01:47:32,560
stars or just a different type of offensive setup. But

2215
01:47:32,600 --> 01:47:34,159
it also just feels weird to say this about a

2216
01:47:34,159 --> 01:47:36,359
team at ranked sixth in points scored per possession? Is

2217
01:47:36,560 --> 01:47:40,479
I think this relays back to why they're probably confusing though.

2218
01:47:40,560 --> 01:47:43,760
Speaker 2: Yeah it is, because I honestly I don't give two

2219
01:47:43,840 --> 01:47:48,000
shits about their current offensive ranking of seventh, because when

2220
01:47:48,000 --> 01:47:51,199
you look at the three point shot, for example, like

2221
01:47:51,239 --> 01:47:55,560
they're twenty first inefficiency, they're twenty fourth in attempts. Their

2222
01:47:55,600 --> 01:47:58,399
affective field coal percentage, they're twelfth in the league. Like,

2223
01:47:58,439 --> 01:48:01,840
it's just there's so many avenues that can improve upon

2224
01:48:02,239 --> 01:48:05,279
where there is a pathway here for them to actually

2225
01:48:05,319 --> 01:48:08,319
have the best freaking offense in the league. It's right there.

2226
01:48:08,640 --> 01:48:11,119
It's just a matter of making the parts work. Maybe

2227
01:48:11,159 --> 01:48:12,399
we're looking at and make.

2228
01:48:12,359 --> 01:48:14,479
Speaker 3: The parts work though with the parts that are there,

2229
01:48:14,560 --> 01:48:16,680
because it sounds like to me what you're saying, and

2230
01:48:16,720 --> 01:48:19,560
please correct me if I'm wrong, is that Damar Derosen

2231
01:48:20,199 --> 01:48:22,119
should not be on this team then, because I don't

2232
01:48:22,119 --> 01:48:25,319
know how you're gonna fundamentally rework your offense unless you're saying, no,

2233
01:48:25,359 --> 01:48:28,079
they need to stagger the hell out of their stars.

2234
01:48:28,159 --> 01:48:31,520
Speaker 2: What I'm saying, Okay, yes, that is absolutely what I'm saying. Well,

2235
01:48:31,560 --> 01:48:34,119
I'm saying two things. I'm saying that for sure, stagger

2236
01:48:34,319 --> 01:48:38,640
is the best way forward too. I also think about communication.

2237
01:48:39,279 --> 01:48:42,640
One thing we know about DeMar though, is he's not

2238
01:48:43,039 --> 01:48:46,359
a guy who is unwilling to listen to coaches and

2239
01:48:46,439 --> 01:48:50,520
listen to input. I think that this is a question of,

2240
01:48:52,119 --> 01:48:55,079
you know, wires being crossed in terms of expectation level,

2241
01:48:55,640 --> 01:48:58,279
Like you have to sit Tamar down. Perhaps it's the

2242
01:48:58,319 --> 01:49:02,560
All Star break, preferably sooner, but like and ask him, look,

2243
01:49:02,600 --> 01:49:05,199
would you be willing to take a step back for

2244
01:49:05,319 --> 01:49:08,479
the betterment of the team, Like you're thirty five, We're

2245
01:49:08,520 --> 01:49:10,800
still gonna feature you. You're still gonna play at the

2246
01:49:10,920 --> 01:49:13,119
end of games because we know you're a tough shot maker.

2247
01:49:13,319 --> 01:49:15,359
We still want you to facilitate. You're still gonna have

2248
01:49:15,399 --> 01:49:17,840
the ball in your hands a ton, but we're not

2249
01:49:18,159 --> 01:49:21,319
looking for you to take you know, those off angle,

2250
01:49:22,239 --> 01:49:26,880
turn around sixteen foot shots. Like He's a phenomenal playmaker,

2251
01:49:27,319 --> 01:49:30,840
and it feels like he hasn't really been able to

2252
01:49:30,920 --> 01:49:33,960
explore that a whole lot during his stay here in Sacramento.

2253
01:49:34,279 --> 01:49:35,680
Speaker 1: Perhaps they could sell him.

2254
01:49:35,840 --> 01:49:39,600
Speaker 2: Look, KEI can is the key here for you to

2255
01:49:39,800 --> 01:49:44,520
make a significant playoff run? Like, Lord knows he didn't

2256
01:49:44,520 --> 01:49:47,800
have that in Chicago. Perhaps that is.

2257
01:49:49,199 --> 01:49:50,760
Speaker 1: The play I almost wonder.

2258
01:49:51,239 --> 01:49:53,399
Speaker 3: I guess I just haven't noticed the same playmaking Stough.

2259
01:49:53,439 --> 01:49:55,560
There's obviously a drop and assists per minute, but you

2260
01:49:55,600 --> 01:49:57,640
would almost expect that. But do you have to play

2261
01:49:57,720 --> 01:50:00,840
him fewer minutes because Dak give you more optionality on

2262
01:50:00,880 --> 01:50:03,000
who you can play away from the ball, whereas Damar, like,

2263
01:50:03,079 --> 01:50:06,239
you can't really do a ton of that and have

2264
01:50:06,359 --> 01:50:09,520
him be most effective. So I that's interesting. So the

2265
01:50:09,520 --> 01:50:12,880
conversation could almost be you're playing fewer minutes will probably

2266
01:50:12,880 --> 01:50:15,000
still have you close, but like you need to lean

2267
01:50:15,000 --> 01:50:18,760
into more of just these more intuitive lineups than when

2268
01:50:18,840 --> 01:50:21,199
there's some lineups that are gonna have more talent, but

2269
01:50:21,239 --> 01:50:24,000
they can also be redundant on the offensive end at times.

2270
01:50:24,560 --> 01:50:28,079
Right that that team's confusing as hell.

2271
01:50:28,199 --> 01:50:31,439
Speaker 2: You're not gonna catch fight for me, right, super confusing.

2272
01:50:31,800 --> 01:50:34,319
I'm not really sure how you fix it. I will

2273
01:50:34,319 --> 01:50:37,000
say this, and credit to everyone who's been saying this,

2274
01:50:37,960 --> 01:50:40,279
they got the wrong bull over the course of the

2275
01:50:40,720 --> 01:50:43,560
of the summer. It wasn't Demard Rosa that they should

2276
01:50:43,560 --> 01:50:44,000
have gone for.

2277
01:50:45,359 --> 01:50:47,079
Speaker 3: They wanted Caruso. That's the one that you want to.

2278
01:50:47,079 --> 01:50:49,840
Speaker 2: See get well, then they would have lean into defense

2279
01:50:49,840 --> 01:50:52,640
that we couldn't have that. No, obviously, Levin Levine instead

2280
01:50:52,640 --> 01:50:54,720
of Demard Rosan on this team would have been.

2281
01:50:55,560 --> 01:50:58,039
Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess if you were gonna go the look

2282
01:50:58,039 --> 01:51:04,600
can you could do Tomorrow and Malik Munk for Aclavie there, Oh.

2283
01:51:04,399 --> 01:51:09,000
Speaker 1: My god, poor Tomorrow. That would be awful.

2284
01:51:08,960 --> 01:51:09,720
Speaker 3: Man, thank you?

2285
01:51:10,000 --> 01:51:14,199
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, that was a trip. That was the trip?

2286
01:51:14,319 --> 01:51:14,760
All right?

2287
01:51:14,920 --> 01:51:19,920
Speaker 2: So wait am I just yeah, well, let's just.

2288
01:51:18,520 --> 01:51:21,560
Speaker 3: Just wrap this up, right, Yeah, you could close whatever

2289
01:51:22,039 --> 01:51:22,399
I'm going.

2290
01:51:22,399 --> 01:51:25,479
Speaker 1: To close, Dan for Valley.

2291
01:51:25,560 --> 01:51:28,079
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for joining me on this, you know,

2292
01:51:28,199 --> 01:51:31,439
the the most confusing teams in the NBA tour that

2293
01:51:31,479 --> 01:51:34,159
we've just been on. Uh you know you' and I

2294
01:51:34,359 --> 01:51:37,239
be back for another episode where we're looking at a

2295
01:51:37,279 --> 01:51:39,960
lot of trades. We'll be recording that in the coming days,

2296
01:51:39,960 --> 01:51:42,960
but this is out first. You're obviously the co host

2297
01:51:42,960 --> 01:51:45,079
along with Grand Hughes at the Heartwood Knocks.

2298
01:51:45,600 --> 01:51:47,600
Speaker 1: Tell the good people listening in where they can find

2299
01:51:47,600 --> 01:51:48,279
your works.

2300
01:51:48,359 --> 01:51:50,479
Speaker 3: You already said it hard one knocks well exactly as

2301
01:51:50,520 --> 01:51:54,000
it sounds. Come check us out, great man.

2302
01:51:54,479 --> 01:51:56,520
Speaker 1: Everyone who listened in, thank you for doing so. And

2303
01:51:56,640 --> 01:51:59,960
until we talk again, stay safe and enjoy yourself.

2304
01:52:00,039 --> 01:52:00,479
Speaker 2: Want