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<v Speaker 1>This is Later with Lee Matthews the Lee Matthews Podcast.

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<v Speaker 1>More what you Hear Weekday Afternoon.

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<v Speaker 2>Is on the Drive. Admiral Bob Harward is retired as

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<v Speaker 2>a Navy seal admiral with four decades of war finding

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<v Speaker 2>experience including Bosnia, Panama, Somonia, Afghanistan, Iraqi, Ymmen and he

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<v Speaker 2>goes on and on, never lost a single man under

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<v Speaker 2>his command and that is commendable. He's written a new

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<v Speaker 2>book called The Gouge, How to be Smarter than the

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<v Speaker 2>situation you are in. Admiral Bob Harward, welcome. I wanted

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<v Speaker 2>to start with you. Growing up in Iran in the

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen seventies, a bit of a tumultuous time to be there.

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<v Speaker 2>What brought you to Iran?

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<v Speaker 3>Quite the contrary, it wasn't tumultuate. It was absolutely wonderful.

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<v Speaker 3>My father was a naval officer as well. I followed

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<v Speaker 3>in his footsteps and he was there advising and supporting

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<v Speaker 3>the Iranian Navy as we provided them ships and armor.

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<v Speaker 3>That so it was the retired naval officer involved in

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<v Speaker 3>the defense industry and Iran in the seventies was absolutely spectacular,

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<v Speaker 3>wonderful people, a wonderful country, great scheme, hunting, very western,

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<v Speaker 3>very modernized. So it was just an incredible country. And

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<v Speaker 3>unfortunately it's to come to an Islamic revolution that we're

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<v Speaker 3>still dealing with today, unfortunately.

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<v Speaker 2>So this was all prior to that downfall, but it

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<v Speaker 2>did pique my curiosity. Let's talk about the gouge, how

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<v Speaker 2>to be smarter than the situation you're in. Let's start

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<v Speaker 2>with that term, the gouge. What is its significance?

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<v Speaker 3>Great, it's a very infamous naval term and what most

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<v Speaker 3>people when they use it, they think about it. It's

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<v Speaker 3>the inside information what you really need to know. If

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<v Speaker 3>you were going in to take a test in college, Hey,

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<v Speaker 3>here's this stuff. You know he's going to ask about this.

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<v Speaker 3>This is what you need to be thinking about. Here's

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<v Speaker 3>even maybe the answers. But the real meaning of the

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<v Speaker 3>term is the culture that takes care of each other.

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<v Speaker 3>It's a term that originated in World War Two when

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<v Speaker 3>we were building ships around the a lot of ships

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<v Speaker 3>and manning them with crews, and we were lacking in

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<v Speaker 3>the experience in the cruise. So those experience members on

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<v Speaker 3>the ships went out out of their way to train

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<v Speaker 3>and educate the other members of the ship. Hey, here's

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<v Speaker 3>what you really need to know. Here's what you don't know.

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<v Speaker 3>Here's the information that's going to take care of you

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<v Speaker 3>and take care of the ship and keep us all alive.

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<v Speaker 3>And so that phrase was created in World War Two

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<v Speaker 3>that were used. But more important than the phrase itself

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<v Speaker 3>is that culture. That culture allows you to proactively take

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<v Speaker 3>care of each other, invest in each other. And we

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<v Speaker 3>all have that challenge on any business, the military, any

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<v Speaker 3>organization trying to accomplish a goal needs their people to

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<v Speaker 3>perform tasks or objectives to make it happen. And then business,

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<v Speaker 3>it's all related to profit, but just as important as

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<v Speaker 3>them achieving their goals is that process that allows them

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<v Speaker 3>to grow, mature and achieve their own personal goals. And

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<v Speaker 3>that what the gouge is really a description of that culture,

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<v Speaker 3>that leadership that allows you to take care of your

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<v Speaker 3>people at the same time they're taking care of the

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<v Speaker 3>business or the mission you're trying to accomplish. So the

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<v Speaker 3>gouge is that culture that permeates that throughout any organization.

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<v Speaker 2>Admiral Bob Harward US Navy retired a seal and admiral

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<v Speaker 2>in the Navy as well. The book is the gouge

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<v Speaker 2>how to be smarter than the situation you are in.

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<v Speaker 2>Admiral then, I have experienced this firsthand and a couple

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<v Speaker 2>of occasions in my own career, one coverage of a

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<v Speaker 2>deadly hurricane. I never and to this day harkened back

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<v Speaker 2>to the people I worked with in that chaotic situation.

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<v Speaker 2>But we were all in it together, and we were

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<v Speaker 2>all there to help each other in any way we could,

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<v Speaker 2>and I harkened back to it as some of the

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<v Speaker 2>best times in my entire career.

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<v Speaker 3>You and I liked ubber, God bless you. Same thing

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<v Speaker 3>I was in my navy career. I never thought I

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<v Speaker 3>was good to be good enough in any job, and

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<v Speaker 3>I had twenty eight different jobs as a naval author.

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<v Speaker 3>You did a year or two in every job, and

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<v Speaker 3>if you're good, they promotching you go on and keep

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<v Speaker 3>doing that. And every job I was successful not because

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<v Speaker 3>of me, but because all the people around me who

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<v Speaker 3>did supported me as I supported them. As a leader,

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<v Speaker 3>one of my biggest jobs was to make sure they

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<v Speaker 3>were successful and accomplishing the goals and tasks they needed

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<v Speaker 3>to do, and that help them grow. And look after

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<v Speaker 3>that year two I was gone. Someone else came in

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<v Speaker 3>that job as usually from those ranks, so it really

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<v Speaker 3>served a wide variety of goodness, positive influence. And just

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<v Speaker 3>like here that hurricane, you could have done that alone,

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<v Speaker 3>you have to do it with the team, and what

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<v Speaker 3>they learned from them was just as important as what

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<v Speaker 3>you learn from them. So it's a two way street.

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<v Speaker 3>And so setting that culture or that understanding and any

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<v Speaker 3>organization that is so important. And this like your story

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<v Speaker 3>on the hurricane, this book has stories that illustrate that

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<v Speaker 3>so help people grow and learn from those experiences to

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<v Speaker 3>establish those sort of cultures and approach as they work

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<v Speaker 3>with people.

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<v Speaker 2>The book is the Gouge, How to be smarter than

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<v Speaker 2>the situation you are in. Admiral Bob Harward is with us.

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<v Speaker 2>Are there some bullet points that you go through about

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<v Speaker 2>acquiring the gouge? Or is the gouge something you just

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<v Speaker 2>kind of fall into as I just described with hurricane

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<v Speaker 2>coverage or you in a battle situation.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, I'd say it's a lot of both. There's a

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<v Speaker 3>couple of stories in the book that and I never

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<v Speaker 3>had a master planner. Life just took me along the

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<v Speaker 3>way I call it. I call it fated. So I

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<v Speaker 3>think it's two ways, will deal you a hand, how

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<v Speaker 3>you how you deal with that hand is important, important,

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<v Speaker 3>And there are some principles and my purpose. I came

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<v Speaker 3>in with the purpose of serving my country and doing

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<v Speaker 3>whatever they asked me to do because I thought it

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<v Speaker 3>was important and that in itself added to the great

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<v Speaker 3>adventure of life. So purpose is important. Enjoy life, Enjoy

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<v Speaker 3>every moment. I was blessed because every day I got

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<v Speaker 3>to wake up, it was like Christmas. I couldn't wait

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<v Speaker 3>to get up and get into what I was doing

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<v Speaker 3>that day and how I could contribute. How I enjoyed

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<v Speaker 3>being with the people I work. So I think those

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<v Speaker 3>are all components as I talk about in the book.

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<v Speaker 3>But then again, as I'm one of the stories, I

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<v Speaker 3>indicates how plays a hand in all of our lives

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<v Speaker 3>as well, and you've got accept that and understand it.

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<v Speaker 3>And then finally, I think another important principle of believing

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<v Speaker 3>in yourself. We all have those times we doubt ourselves

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<v Speaker 3>to kind of have two voices in the mind at

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<v Speaker 3>any time, But believing at the end of the day

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<v Speaker 3>in yourself and what you do is important. So all

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<v Speaker 3>those kind of principles are clarified in the book.

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<v Speaker 2>The book is the Gouge How to be Smarter than

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<v Speaker 2>the situation you are in. Admiral Barb Harward I asked

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<v Speaker 2>about the significance of the term itself, because so many

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<v Speaker 2>military monodymonic devices mean something else, like fu bar and

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<v Speaker 2>so on. I wondered if there was a bit of

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<v Speaker 2>a more nefarious meaning to the letters of that word.

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<v Speaker 3>Now it's pretty it's the term the gouge son acroadym

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<v Speaker 3>And as they say, there's good gouge and there's bump gouge.

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<v Speaker 3>You know, sometimes someone's going to give the information they

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<v Speaker 3>think it's good. And I give a perfect example of it.

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<v Speaker 3>I was when I came into the Navy. When I

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<v Speaker 3>was commissioned on the Navalcademy, I wanted to be a

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<v Speaker 3>Navy seal. Unfortunately, it was the end of the Vietnam

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<v Speaker 3>War and the Navy was kind of getting rid of seals.

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<v Speaker 3>We had no real purpose supporting the navy. And my

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<v Speaker 3>father was a ship driver all his life, and so

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<v Speaker 3>I spent four years driving a ship from when I

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<v Speaker 3>had no transfer. Then I got accepted to go to

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<v Speaker 3>seal training and my father found out about it. He

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<v Speaker 3>called me and he thought he was giving me good

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<v Speaker 3>gouts because as he thought, there was no future in

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<v Speaker 3>the navy for seal. So he said to me, hey,

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<v Speaker 3>you know, I never did think it too great. I

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<v Speaker 3>just didn't think there's dumb there's no future in being

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<v Speaker 3>a seal. And there's one of those times where I

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<v Speaker 3>just contradicted him. I said, hey, Dad, I don't really

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<v Speaker 3>care about its future. I think this is something i'd

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<v Speaker 3>be good at and it's what I want to do.

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<v Speaker 3>So I did it. I was fortunate because the world changed,

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<v Speaker 3>and so what his good gouge was that time, from

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<v Speaker 3>his experience, his knowledge, he was giving me very good advice.

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<v Speaker 3>I just wasn't smart enough to realize it. And the

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<v Speaker 3>world with nine to elevens and others that made the

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<v Speaker 3>seal career very fruitful and productive. And alone, behold, I

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<v Speaker 3>became an agnal. Something he always thought I would be.

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<v Speaker 3>I never thought I would be. And that's kind of

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<v Speaker 3>the last story in the book, a story of faint.

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<v Speaker 3>But that's an example of gouge that he thought was

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<v Speaker 3>good gouge. It probably was, but it became bad gouge later,

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<v Speaker 3>or bum gouge as we say. So now the phrase

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<v Speaker 3>itself is well known in the Navy and the military term,

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<v Speaker 3>but the culture is more important than the phrase. How

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<v Speaker 3>about it.

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<v Speaker 2>Describes Admiral Bob how Harward, the gouge, how to be

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<v Speaker 2>smarter than the situation. You're in out everywhere. You get

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<v Speaker 2>books now, and we thank you for joining us.

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<v Speaker 3>Sarah, Thanks well, great to be with you.

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<v Speaker 1>Thanks for listening to Later with Lee Matthews, the Lee

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<v Speaker 1>Matthews Podcast, and remember to listen to The Drive Live

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<v Speaker 1>weekday afternoons from five to seven and iHeartMedia presentation