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Speaker 1: Well off of a weekend that has seen gal Ye

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five win a flyweight impressive main event in a WBC

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interim title. We're ready to recap that. We've got some news,

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We've got some exit texcellent nostalgie. We have no more

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Thanksgiving leftovers. It is the Fight Breaks Your Night Recap podcast.

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Hello there, welcome in. I'm a somewhat capable host, TJ. Reeves.

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I'm gonna tell you up front, my man Dan Rayphield

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was re enacting planes, trains and automobiles with John Candy,

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Steve Martin his family. I'm just glad you're back and

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in one piece, all right, full disclosure. You were traveling

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back from being in Albany, New York with the snow.

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I've got buccaneer football all Sunday afternoon and Sunday night,

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so we are kind of finding a time to do this.

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I'm glad you're all right because when last I talked

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to you in the middle of the night, you were

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still waiting on an airplane. You got back home on Sunday.

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So now here we are, and I'm glad we can

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recap my friend a.

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Speaker 2: Mere seven hour flightfully now, I'm actually as a season

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traveler learned a long time ago whatever happens at airports,

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you can't control it. So there's no reason ever start

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to yell and scream and get all that. You just

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got to roll it because no matter what you do,

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you have no control. So you get more flies with Tony.

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Just shit your ass down, wait for your flight. But

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the thing about last night that was so aggravating. If

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they just said, you know, your flight's supposed to leave

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at three thirty in the afternoon, but it's now delayed

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for four hours, You're like, ah fuck, and you just

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go and you know, watch a game, get a drink

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and have some lunch, do whatever. This was like fifty

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texts of your flights delayed for fifteen minutes an hour

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back and for just NonStop, and we didn't know if

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the flight's gonna be able to get there to uh.

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Speaker 1: There was critical There was one critical part of you

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getting back to Virginia. You had to have an airplane.

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And for the longest time there wasn't a plane. And

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then there was a plane.

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Speaker 2: There was a plane, but that plane was the one

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that was mechanically injured and put it take us.

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Speaker 3: So we had and then it.

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Speaker 2: Turned out our plane that was sitting on the ground

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and Washington seat to come get us and Albady. That

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plane had a mechanical issue, and because did Thanksgiving, they

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didn't have extra planes laying around because they're all being You.

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Speaker 1: Did not end up in a back of a truck

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with the pigs like in planes, trains and automobiles with John.

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Speaker 2: So right at a moment that I'm my wife and

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I have decided we're gonna do what some other folks

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had already done. We're gonna just say screw it, and

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we're gonna delay our flight rebook on the five thirty

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am on Sunday. They want to put us up in

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the hotel. We didn't want to do it, but whatever.

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As we're doing it, we got the word that the

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plane in Washington had taken off and was coming to

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pick us up in Albany with the rest of our

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cope pair, and so we waited and ultimately we got home.

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Speaker 3: Okay, God, with all the details. Whatever you did get.

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Speaker 1: Home, you got at least five to seventeen minutes of sleep.

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You're now with me. We're making it work. Thank you

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for finding us off Thanksgiving weekend one month ago. It's

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already December, one month to go here in the year,

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plenty to still talk about. Follow subscribe on the podcast feed.

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All right, we're recapping coming off the weekend. We've got

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some news, we've got some nostalgia. The most prominent fight,

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obviously is galia Phi's Kao victory over Sonny Edwards in

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the match Room de Zone main event WBC Flyweight interim title.

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All Right, your thoughts, because we saw something that's fascinating

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in boxing, where you have all the inside piped up stuff.

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I know it's a lot more prominent in other sports,

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but in boxing, the in between rounds microphone often picks

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up things and has for decades, and it picked up

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Sonny Edwards saying I don't want to be here after

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the second round. That was striking, and eventually gallia Phi

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stopped him. A right, your thoughts in the recap mode

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on what we saw.

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Speaker 2: Well, the one good thing if there's such a thing

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about having a seven hour delay in the Albany International Airport,

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which is what I did yesterday because we were flying

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I had gone to see my mother and my sister

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and her team, is that while we're sitting there, I

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actually able to watch that main event live on my

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phone because our when we you know, tell folks what

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we do, was when we were originally fighting out how

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were we going to do this? Our original thought was

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I'm going to supposed to be home at you know,

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six seven o'clock in the evening on Saturday, that I

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would watch the fight and then we could do the

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ricas I can't I watch the fight, so that's right,

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and we would do it like sometime late Saturday night.

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Obviously that didn't happen. We're doing it Sunday in the

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late morning. Anyway, I was able to sit at the

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gate and watch the actual fight, so I did see that,

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and I was I have two divergent thoughts. One is damn,

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galalia Phi look really good. But the other one is damn,

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Sonny Edwards is totally finished. So I think the story

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of the fight and I'm not going to diminish galia

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Phi and galaia Pi. This is obviously a very good boxer,

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no doubt about it. He's an Olympic gold medalist and

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now he's undefeated still as a professional. He turned pro

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at a later age, so they've moved him on the

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very fast track and they put him them with Sonny

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Edwards in his ninth professional fight. That's a that's a

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heavy lift, but it's not. So I don't want to

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diminish the FI victory because he didn't know what was

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going to be in front of him. He went and

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trained and did his thing. And remember they had tons

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and tons of amateur sparring rounds. As we detailed prior

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to the fight, Edwards had defeated him in an amateur

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fight some ten years ago or nine years ago. So

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as good as he looked, and this is a career propelling,

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career launching victor, and by getting the WBC's interim flyway title,

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it positions him and he talked about having no problem

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making the trip to Japan to become the challenger at

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some point for the very outstanding WBC flyweight champion who

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had moved up from a long ragn as the junior

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flyweight champion as Ken shiro Taji, who was, you know,

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an outstanding fighter and a very exciting fighter for that matter.

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So all that's good about what I just mentioned you

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about you FI, But I really believe the story of

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the fight is not so much that as really how

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done Sonny Edwards is from everything from him saying what

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he said that you just mentioned in between the rounds

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which I saw and was and I got to tell you, TJ.

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In my basically entire life of watching box and I've

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never heard that type of a comment from a fighter.

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Speaker 1: Especially the second round, right, I mean in the second round.

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Speaker 2: Right, They may think that he wasn't like in the

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second round, he's not taking a beating yet or anything

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like that. Ultimately, he did take a beating in my opinion.

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But if you didn't want to be there, you know

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that the thought was in his mind in the camp

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because he came out and he said that whether he

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had won or lost on Saturday, that that was going

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to be his last fight, which usually tells you a

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guy has already got one foot in retirement. Anyway, it

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almost tant him out to fraud, like I'm gonna go

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collect my check, and I'm sure it was paid very handsomely,

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but he didn't put forth the type of effort or

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have it in him to do what he typically does.

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So I don't know if that's a good thing. But

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the bottom line, though, is the fight's going to be

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I believe more remembered for what you talked about Sonny's

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saying after the second round and being completely done at

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least mentally if not physically, then it will be for

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you if I to get the props for beating a

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prime Sonny.

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Speaker 3: Edwards, which would be a really big deal.

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Speaker 1: And we should mention he fought on. But do we

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put some onus on the corner here too? That if

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the guy is saying I don't want to be there

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and he's taking punches, what do you come on that?

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Speaker 3: Real quick?

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Speaker 2: They know him better than we do, so I'm not

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going to indict the corner. This was not like he's

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if he's taking a beating, that's one thing, right, But

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you know, a lot of being in the corner, it's

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not just about what your man's doing physically, it's what's

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he doing mentally, And so sometimes you gotta you gotta,

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you know, in the in horse race parlance, you got

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to go to the whip.

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Speaker 3: So I get that. I'm not gonna fault the corner.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I thought that they did a good job

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trying to trying to to pump him up. I mean,

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if you hear the trainer talking about, you know, it's

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only the second round, we get you know, so we

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had a bad round. Don't give up. I mean, they're

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not gonna pull the plug. This this is not a

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four round. This is high stakes, you know, world title,

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interim at stake, a lot of money, a lot of

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people your career, So I can't fault them. If he

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was taking a beating, that'd be a different story. Ultimately

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he was, and the referee I thought made a very

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good stoppage. They're in round number six when he was

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just having punches rained down on him from your fire.

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But Sonny Edwards, I think it's now as we look back,

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see and I'll go to our bet Us show.

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Speaker 3: We were handicapping the fight. We both picked Sonny Edwards

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to win.

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Speaker 1: But I know I picked pick you five, but I

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had the wrong outcome. I had the decision.

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Speaker 2: I picked Edwards, and I said, very specifically with trepidation, Yes.

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And part of my analysis and part of the things

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I was talking about was even though Sonny got a

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win in June against Adrian Kyrie, who was a former

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champion at one hundred eight pounds, who had come up

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to fight him at one hundred and twelve pounds, it

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turned out to be a little bit of a of

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a sloppier kind of. He won a technical decision, but

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Sonny won basically every round of the fight. One judge

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did have it a shutout. The other judges, you know,

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gave Kuriella you know, a couple of rounds. So that

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was his most recent effort, and it was like it

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was okay performance, nothing spectacular, but it was certainly not

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like terrible. But I still couldn't shake what had occurred

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in the previous fight, which was in December of last year,

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so just about you know, fifty weeks ago or so

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from now, that he got absolutely pummeled, broken down, destroyed

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and obliterated by Bam Rodriguez in their like in their

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flyweight unification fight where he got stopped in the ninth round.

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He took such a hallacious beating in that fight that

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I just wondered at in the small weight classes. And

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at twenty eight, you're not old, but he'd had a

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lot of rounds, a lot of fights, He's been with

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a lot of good guys. He just wondered, doesn't take

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that toll, yep. And I think now looking at what

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happened in the FI fight, we know the answer. And

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I'm gonna tell you, right now, DJ I swear to God.

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Round three, I think it was. I said to myself, man,

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I made the wrong pick because he's done, he has nothing,

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and you could just see this coming. And to me,

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it wasn't a matter of is he gonna go the

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distance or is he gonna get stopped? Is he gonna

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come back and win? To me, this was about what

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I'm thinking in the third round as I'm watching sitting

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in the airport, that it's not if if I's gonna win,

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it is he gonna stop him inside the first half

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of the fight. And it turned out he did stop

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him in six rounds. And so I thought, uh, you know,

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in my back and my Monday morning quarterback had on boyd,

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did I misanalyzed that one? I thought that the old

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that the I thought that Sonny, with his box ability

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and he a fis relative inexperience as a professional against

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absolute nobody's relative to what Sonny has been fighting, that

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Sonny to be able to say it was gonna be

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easy by no means, don't get me wrong, this guy's

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in the Olympic gold medals for a reason. That Sonny

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would find a way to pick and poke and get

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seven rounds, you know what I mean, even though he

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was fighting in Galla's hometown in Birmingham, England, it was

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not meant to be. And then Sonny, you know, announced

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his retirement after the fight. I kind of feel like

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it's probably gonna stick base and everything we saw, but

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you know, you do never know. I always say this,

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and it's not just about Sonny Edwards, It's about any fighter.

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I've heard say this through my entire time of following boxing.

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I never especially as becoming a reporter, Never ever do

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I put that much serious stock and what the man

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says in the ring thirty seconds after fights over that.

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I like to see them have the ability to take

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a few days, a few weeks, even a few months

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whatever to decompress and really evaluate what they're career path

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that has talked to their friends, their family, their handlers,

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their trainer, their mom, their coach, whatever, and figure out

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what they want to do. And in case of Sony,

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given the mentality that he spoke about not wanting to

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even be there in the second round, thinking he's going

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to retire even before the fight, seeing how bad a

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beating he took against Bam, one would think that this

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is probably gonna stick. And if it does, listen Sonny Edwards.

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You know, he made some really terrible, boring fights. Let's

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not lionize him, but he was a hell of a

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boxer and he did score some superb victories as a

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flyway champion. There's no doubt about that. He looked very

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good in some of those fights. You have to give

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him credit for that type of what he did in

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those events. I mean, he was a BONIFI world champion

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and he was a big talker. He talked a lot

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of shit and people, you know, either loved him or

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hate him. He was a very polarizing figure from that

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same point. His victory in twenty twenty one when he

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first won the IBF Flyway title against Maruti Antalani from

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South Africa is one of the most underrated wins boxing

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in a long time because people don't know I Falani,

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but he's a hell of a fighter. Gave a prime

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no Needo don air I league handle. I mean, and

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he was a multi time champ from South Africa with

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a great record and a lot of experience. That was

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a that was a really really great win for Sonny Edwards.

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Get a hell of a career, you know, and I

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think though he's going to have a future if he's

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gonna want to stick to a commentating. We've seen him

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on his own. You know, he does have good insights

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into the x's and o's as well as the mentality.

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Uh and and he does have people that enjoy or

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or not enjoy, but listen anyway of what he's got

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to say about the sports. So all I can say

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is tip of the hat to Sonny. And I'm looking

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forward to seeing more from Gala. You'll find me because

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I mean, he's thirty one, he's uh, you know, he's

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now got this interim DELT and he's gonna be willing,

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ready and able. I believe if I any of the

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top fly weights out there.

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Speaker 1: It'll be the thing. And let's see how quickly he

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gets a more prominent shot. He certainly deserves it. And

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by the way, shout out to Yafi and his brother

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because our colleague David Payne we had on the podcast

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last week, just by chance, was in a Birmingham, England

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mall area that has a fet etc. And just happened

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upon them and he wasn't gonna bother them or say anything,

291
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but he's like, my god, Gallia Pi is standing right

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next to me ordering pizza, literally ordering pizza. So David

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put the photo on social media said they could not

294
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have been more cordial. This was on Friday night before

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the fight. So I said, now, David, you're the good

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luck charm. Your fi's gotta have pizza with you before

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the next fight after it gets the TK.

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Speaker 3: I mean, David might be making the trip to Japan

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for some sushi before.

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Speaker 1: Could be sushi and pizza if need be, So shout

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out there, and that leads us to news next. Hey,

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when I left you on the bet Us show to

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go have like a leftover turkey and mayonnaise sandwich, I

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thought we were getting Boots Ennis and Virgil Ortiz, and

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apparently almost everybody associated with the fight potentially in February,

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thought we're getting Boots Ennis Virgil Ortiz on this read

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season card. Except on Saturday. I'm looking at social media

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and Jaron Innis is saying hold up, hold up, not

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not done yet, not happening, and even mentioned it would

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be at welterweight, which even I knew that's not happening.

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All right, Dan, what happened from the time that we

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left each other that you tried to leave from the

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airport that I came to Charlotte.

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Speaker 3: What happened here with this?

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Speaker 1: And is it completely dead or are we negotiating a little?

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What's up?

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think at this point anyway, for February

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twenty second, on that massive read season card, it it

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seems like it's dead. So I broke this story reported extensively.

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There's a very detailed piece about everything that went down

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on my fight Friction Unite substack.

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Speaker 1: Why are you not subscribing public? Why are you not

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on the newsletter? I already knew that. I already read

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that go.

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Speaker 2: Very very good teas there. Listen, virgel Ortis, let's talk

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about in for one second, we'll fight anybody. There's there's

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a handful of guys through the years that you know

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when they'll say, well, I'll fight anybody, anytime, anywhere.

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Speaker 3: They're gonna do it.

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Speaker 2: Just pay me the right money, tell me where to

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show up, and let's get it on. And in today's

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current climate of boxers, I believe rgel Ortiz is one

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of those guys. He's literally you asked his handlers at

334
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Golden Boy, ask his manager Rick Mrgingan whenever they bring

335
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him an opponent. He's never turned it down good, bad,

336
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or indifferent. It just does not turn the guys down.

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He was, he took he was willing to fight Tim

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Zoo obviously back in August. It can happen because of

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Tim's scalps, you know, the problem with the scalp. He then,

340
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you know, he thought Boat Shook in a great fight.

341
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That was a risky fight, no problem anyway. The point is,

342
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here's a guy that's willing, ready and able to fight whoever, whenever,

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no problem. But Boots Ennis is not that guy. Apparently,

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because anybody who thought so, they're making this match for

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this card. Obviously, Turkey al Shek has to sign off

346
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on it, you know, because he's the one bank rolling it.

347
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He wanted to fight very interesting matchup, and by all

348
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accounts it's at least from Golden Boys perspective, that's his

349
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promoter that it's going to be Boots Ennis coming up

350
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from one hundred and forty seven to one hundred and

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fifty four to fight or tease for his WBC intern

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delt which he won from Bowachtrup back in August. And Boots,

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by the way, who had just fought a couple of

354
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weeks ago in the rematch with Karen Chikazi, and it

355
00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:06,919
did not look very good, even though he won very handily,

356
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sat there in the ring after the fight and stated,

357
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very specifically, it might be time to move up to

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one hundred fifty four, where I'm gonna be at my best,

359
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but I'm gonna have more power. You know, this was

360
00:16:16,679 --> 00:16:19,039
I didn't I'm paraphrasing what he said. I didn't maybe

361
00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:21,799
look that good or feel that good. And then not

362
00:16:22,279 --> 00:16:24,639
a couple of minutes later, in that same innering interview,

363
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you have match Room Boxing promoter Eddie Hearn saying to

364
00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:31,440
Chris Mannix on the broadcast, you know, all week long,

365
00:16:31,879 --> 00:16:34,200
I thought Boots looked a little tight at one forty seven.

366
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After this performance, it might be time to go up

367
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to one fifty four. It's hard to do when you

368
00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:40,759
have a title, but if it's affecting your performance, you

369
00:16:40,879 --> 00:16:43,799
need to do it again. Paraphrasing, but that's what he said.

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Everybody knows that if there's going to be a fight

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between Boots and Ortiz, it's gonna be at one fifty four.

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If forget about what I just said to you, about

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the comments that that Boots and his team made in

374
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the wake of their recent fight, Virgil Ortiz is, he's

375
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never going to see one hundred and forty seven pounds, right,

376
00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:04,839
And unless you're living under a fucking rock where you're

377
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a fucking idiot, or you're purposely nefariously you know, misdirecting,

378
00:17:11,680 --> 00:17:13,559
or filled with fake news, or however you want to

379
00:17:13,599 --> 00:17:14,000
phrase it.

380
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Speaker 3: The notion.

381
00:17:15,559 --> 00:17:18,480
Speaker 2: And I put this on my social media yesterday because

382
00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:22,119
I'm so pissed off about the nonsense that Virgil Ortiz

383
00:17:22,240 --> 00:17:24,319
was gonna come down to one hundred and forty seven

384
00:17:24,359 --> 00:17:27,880
pounds to fight this man is absolutely ridiculous. If you

385
00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:30,000
go back and take a look at Virginal Ortiz's record.

386
00:17:30,279 --> 00:17:33,640
In August twenty twenty two, he fought Michael mckinson in

387
00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:36,119
a one hundred and forty seven pound fight. Now, he

388
00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:39,960
had his health problems related to his blood disorder, but

389
00:17:40,119 --> 00:17:42,480
the last time he tried to make one hundred and

390
00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:45,039
forty seven pounds was over a year ago when the

391
00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:47,319
fight between him and a Manta Stanionis, which is a

392
00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:52,119
mandatory fight for the WBA title, and Stanionis was no problem.

393
00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:52,720
Speaker 1: He was good to go.

394
00:17:53,039 --> 00:17:55,559
Speaker 2: But Virgil Ortiz in a couple of days before the fight,

395
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passed out during his weight cut, wound up in the

396
00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:01,960
hospital and the fight got camed. And after that fight

397
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he went up tow one hundred and fifty four pounds.

398
00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:06,279
He's looking and by the way, that cost him because

399
00:18:06,319 --> 00:18:08,160
of all the back and forth with the Stanionis fight,

400
00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:11,359
the combination of that happening plus the blood situation. He

401
00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:13,720
didn't fight for the entire year of twenty twenty three

402
00:18:14,319 --> 00:18:16,119
and when he passed out in the fight, I canceled.

403
00:18:16,200 --> 00:18:18,640
He and his opponent in Stanionis. They both lost out

404
00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:20,680
on seven figure payday Is. You don't get that money back.

405
00:18:21,200 --> 00:18:24,640
So twenty twenty four dawns and a new Virgil Ortiz

406
00:18:24,839 --> 00:18:30,480
widely publicized, widely discussed, widely scene. He's at one hundred

407
00:18:30,519 --> 00:18:32,640
fifty four pounds and he scores three wins. He knocks

408
00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:34,799
out Frederick Blowston in round one. He knocks out Thomas

409
00:18:34,839 --> 00:18:37,079
the war mate in round one. He has the war

410
00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:39,319
with saray Bochuk. He goes the distance for the first

411
00:18:39,319 --> 00:18:42,079
time in his career. Tremendous fight, and he is willing

412
00:18:42,119 --> 00:18:45,000
to fight Tim Zoo. It gets postponed or called off,

413
00:18:45,279 --> 00:18:47,039
not because of him, because of the injury to Zoo,

414
00:18:47,279 --> 00:18:49,880
willing to fight whoever boots and it says the guy,

415
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I'll do the fight, no problem. How they could send

416
00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:56,079
Now I'm gonna get into a little of the minutia here,

417
00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:59,519
so I'm reporting this out. It comes to as I'm

418
00:18:59,599 --> 00:19:01,599
doing talking to people who are involved in the event,

419
00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:05,160
they're trying to tidy up the paperwork. It's not a

420
00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:09,000
long form contract, but Queensberry Promotions, Frank Warren's company, which

421
00:19:09,039 --> 00:19:11,720
are the official promoters of the event. Even though they

422
00:19:11,759 --> 00:19:13,880
don't promote Boots and even though they don't promote Ortis,

423
00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:16,960
they're still coordinating all the doubt agreements, all the contracts,

424
00:19:17,039 --> 00:19:19,359
right because they're the they're like the clearing outs. They're

425
00:19:19,400 --> 00:19:22,640
doing the event. Plus they obviously have Daniel Dubois in

426
00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:25,079
the main event and other guys on the show, so

427
00:19:25,319 --> 00:19:29,680
their their side is responsible not for negotiating the agreements necessarily,

428
00:19:29,759 --> 00:19:31,200
but just getting all the paper.

429
00:19:31,920 --> 00:19:34,799
Speaker 1: It underare it contractually happens.

430
00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:38,119
Speaker 2: They're doing this on behalf of basically Turkey and the

431
00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:41,079
Saudi folks, so instead of like and I guess they

432
00:19:41,079 --> 00:19:44,640
would eventually sign the longer doubt agreement, but you also

433
00:19:44,759 --> 00:19:47,400
can send out like a one pager. They call it

434
00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:49,240
the term sheet, you know, which is just the basics.

435
00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:51,880
Here's the date, here's the location, here's the way, here's

436
00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:54,400
the title, if there is one, here's the here's the money,

437
00:19:54,759 --> 00:19:56,359
you know, here's you know, whatever it might be. How

438
00:19:56,400 --> 00:19:59,240
many plane tickets, how many hotel rooms that just the

439
00:19:59,680 --> 00:20:03,400
base take basic stuff for the fight? That term sheet

440
00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:06,440
went from Queensberry again, this is what I am told

441
00:20:06,759 --> 00:20:10,960
from Queensberry to Golden Boy. Now Queensberry is not the

442
00:20:11,039 --> 00:20:13,279
ones that decided what to put in it. They were

443
00:20:13,359 --> 00:20:16,160
told by those who negotiated, here's the terms for this,

444
00:20:16,279 --> 00:20:17,920
and that's what they put in the sheet. And so

445
00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:21,279
in that sheet, everything was perfect, except it's set one

446
00:20:21,359 --> 00:20:24,079
hundred and forty seven pounds. The virgil Ortis.

447
00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:25,759
Speaker 3: Side flagged that, and we're like, hey, everything is good,

448
00:20:25,799 --> 00:20:27,599
but this is not a forty seven pound fight. This

449
00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:29,720
is the one fifty four pound fight. I don't know

450
00:20:29,759 --> 00:20:31,200
what this is doing in there now.

451
00:20:31,599 --> 00:20:34,880
Speaker 2: Who put that forty seven clause in there? I don't

452
00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:37,680
know If that was the Saudi's I can't I don't

453
00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:39,599
know if it's Eddie Hearn said, it's not their side.

454
00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:41,720
He messaged me he said it wasn't us that put

455
00:20:41,759 --> 00:20:45,720
the forty seven interesting. But my perspective to Eddie and

456
00:20:45,799 --> 00:20:48,519
to Boots end his team was Okay, even if that's

457
00:20:48,599 --> 00:20:52,200
the case, you know it's not one forty seven. You

458
00:20:52,359 --> 00:20:54,880
know they're not going to sign that. Maybe you say, oh, guys,

459
00:20:55,039 --> 00:20:57,359
you kind of fuck this up because it ain't gonna

460
00:20:57,359 --> 00:21:00,200
happen if it says one forty seven. And so when

461
00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:02,000
you see it at one forty seven, you know there's

462
00:21:02,039 --> 00:21:05,079
a problem. I don't know, you know, you know there's

463
00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:07,160
a problem there. And so at the end of the day,

464
00:21:08,039 --> 00:21:09,440
they're not going to go to one forty seven to

465
00:21:09,519 --> 00:21:11,359
fight Boots Ennis, and Boots is now saying, oh, I'm

466
00:21:11,359 --> 00:21:12,480
going to decide what I want to do.

467
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Speaker 3: Blah blah, blah, blah blah.

468
00:21:14,079 --> 00:21:16,559
Speaker 1: All I know is the one thing that struck me

469
00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:21,000
is is this about money? Is this because he's not

470
00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:23,400
getting enough money? And this is what you're using as

471
00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:24,200
the reason.

472
00:21:24,559 --> 00:21:25,480
Speaker 3: This was agreed to.

473
00:21:25,519 --> 00:21:27,000
Speaker 2: Boots is saying I don't even know about the fight,

474
00:21:27,079 --> 00:21:29,599
which I look, he's a twenty nine year old man.

475
00:21:29,720 --> 00:21:31,400
What the fuck is your problem? You should know about

476
00:21:31,440 --> 00:21:33,519
your own career. So Eddie her knew about the fight

477
00:21:33,559 --> 00:21:36,200
and negotiated the terms Boots. Ennis's father, from what I

478
00:21:36,279 --> 00:21:38,559
am told in detail, was involved in new about the

479
00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:41,000
terms and he is obviously the guiding force behind his

480
00:21:41,079 --> 00:21:43,880
son's career. So no, that's this is not a money thing.

481
00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:45,440
This is a lot of other stuff. But the other

482
00:21:45,519 --> 00:21:48,480
thing that really irritates me is that they make it

483
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:51,160
like like, oh, we can just think about it. We

484
00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:52,480
don't know what we want to do. Dude, you said

485
00:21:52,519 --> 00:21:54,000
two weeks ago you want to go to fifty four.

486
00:21:54,319 --> 00:21:56,319
You got a top notch opponent for a big fight

487
00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:58,480
for your biggest payday by a lot, and by the way,

488
00:21:58,680 --> 00:22:02,839
just to tidy up up. Immediately, everybody on the Saudist

489
00:22:02,839 --> 00:22:06,640
side went and discussed the possibility of having Sebastian Fondora,

490
00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:10,119
who was the actual WBC champion and the WBO champion,

491
00:22:10,359 --> 00:22:12,519
to step in and take his place, and that would

492
00:22:12,519 --> 00:22:17,160
have been another big time fight. Also, Virgil Artist said no,

493
00:22:17,319 --> 00:22:19,279
probably we'll do it. The Golden Boy people were fine

494
00:22:19,319 --> 00:22:21,960
with that. Sam Soon Lukwitz, who is the promoter of

495
00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:25,799
Sebastian Fundora, and there's boats from him in my piece

496
00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:28,200
that I that I just mentioned before about how we

497
00:22:28,319 --> 00:22:29,920
have other plans will work out. We all know what

498
00:22:30,000 --> 00:22:31,519
that is it's the Arrow Spence fight, even though he

499
00:22:31,559 --> 00:22:33,519
didn't say that, but they said we're not going to

500
00:22:33,559 --> 00:22:35,359
be fighting him, not because they're ducking him. They've got

501
00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:37,720
this opportunity in front of them for Spence, it's already

502
00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:40,440
apparently negotiated to some extent down the road, and they're

503
00:22:40,480 --> 00:22:42,480
not going to do it. So now they got to

504
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:44,240
find a new opponent for Ortiz or he won't fight

505
00:22:44,319 --> 00:22:46,720
that day. But Boots Ennis looks terrible because I'm going

506
00:22:46,799 --> 00:22:48,920
to tell you right now, flat out, and I like Bootsennis.

507
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:51,440
I've interviewed him many times. He's a fun fighter to watch.

508
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:55,559
He's obviously very talented. He's drawn a big crowd in Philadelphia, TJ.

509
00:22:55,799 --> 00:22:58,720
In twenty five years almost of covering boxing. I I

510
00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:01,759
have a hard time in the in the recesses of

511
00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:04,160
my memory of all the times that we've seen ups

512
00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:05,799
and downs of guys who would fight or would fight,

513
00:23:06,559 --> 00:23:09,680
of finding a guy that's a that's a bigger, outright duck.

514
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:12,599
Because even if he didn't know about it, like he claims,

515
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:16,200
which I don't believe, you still had the opportunity to say,

516
00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:17,839
you know what, okay, let's do it. Your father and

517
00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:20,319
your promoter negotiated the terms and they're they're to have

518
00:23:20,519 --> 00:23:22,680
you know, they're looking out for you. I believe, uh,

519
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:25,480
take the fight, go put yourself.

520
00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:28,799
Speaker 1: But apparently he's not going to unless this gets reversed,

521
00:23:28,839 --> 00:23:30,160
which from your tone.

522
00:23:30,319 --> 00:23:33,359
Speaker 3: Not happened. Not happened, all right.

523
00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:37,319
Speaker 1: So something you had been talking about on Thursday night

524
00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:39,559
into Friday's podcast and also on the bet Us show

525
00:23:40,079 --> 00:23:42,799
is you were hearing March first, March first for Gervanta

526
00:23:43,079 --> 00:23:47,400
Davis and Lamont Roach. It is now confirmed. Update us

527
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:52,279
on where. And also you've also learned about Jose Valenzuela

528
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:55,039
being part of this card, making a title defense. Elaborate

529
00:23:55,119 --> 00:23:57,200
more Big Dan Well.

530
00:23:57,240 --> 00:23:58,920
Speaker 2: The fact that they're gonna fight on March first, and

531
00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:01,359
I don't think is come is a big surprise to anybody. Look,

532
00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:03,200
if you go back, it was supposed to originally be

533
00:24:03,519 --> 00:24:05,799
Tank Davis against Lamar Roach. They were talking about doing

534
00:24:05,839 --> 00:24:10,400
it December fourteenth in Houston, Texas, a place that Tank

535
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:12,720
Davis wanted to fight in. I know, and I'm on

536
00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:15,960
the same bandwagon here with so many other people that

537
00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:18,240
I've heard from about this matchup, whether they like to

538
00:24:18,319 --> 00:24:21,119
fight or they don't like to fight. The reality is

539
00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:24,799
Tank Davis against Lamont Roach should be in the Washington

540
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:27,880
DC area. Lamont Roach is from Washington, d C. Tank

541
00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:30,240
Davis is from Baltimore, which is nearby, and he has

542
00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:33,480
a huge fan following in Washington. Roach has a fan

543
00:24:33,559 --> 00:24:35,680
following Washington, also obviously not as big as Tanks. The

544
00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:39,680
point is, though, that's a big time Washington DC fight,

545
00:24:39,799 --> 00:24:43,000
and I've thought to myself, if Tank Davis could do

546
00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:46,839
a fight against Hector Luis Garcia in which he set

547
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:49,920
the all time record for gate for the Capitol One

548
00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:52,920
Arena more than five million dollars for ticket sales at

549
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:55,359
an arena that is what twenty five to thirty years

550
00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:57,920
old that has hosted everything you could think of in

551
00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:00,680
terms of big time sports and concerts. Arena for the

552
00:25:00,799 --> 00:25:05,039
Washington Wizards and also for the Washington Capitals, they broke

553
00:25:05,079 --> 00:25:07,240
the record from many years ago of a Rolling Stones concert,

554
00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:09,400
and that was with Hector Lewis Carci, who was not

555
00:25:09,519 --> 00:25:12,759
known at all by the Washington c boxing fans. Now,

556
00:25:12,799 --> 00:25:15,400
you put Tank Davis back in that same arena and

557
00:25:15,480 --> 00:25:17,839
you match him up with a Washington fighter who's a

558
00:25:17,839 --> 00:25:19,640
world champion, even though he's gonna be moving up one

559
00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:21,799
way class who's got his own fan base. I mean,

560
00:25:21,839 --> 00:25:24,319
he drew like four or five thousand to his first

561
00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:27,359
title defense that took place in Washington, d C. Anyway,

562
00:25:27,799 --> 00:25:29,880
it's not going to be in Washington, d C. It's

563
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:31,519
gonna be in Brooklyn, New York, at the Bark Play Center,

564
00:25:31,559 --> 00:25:33,319
which is an outstanding arena, and they've had plenty of

565
00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:35,880
big time fights there. I've covered probably some fifty fights

566
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:39,160
in that arena thereabouts forty fights in that arena, and.

567
00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:41,319
Speaker 1: Tank knocked out Roly Romero in that arena.

568
00:25:41,799 --> 00:25:43,839
Speaker 2: Well, but here's a he knocked out more than just

569
00:25:43,960 --> 00:25:46,599
Roller Romero in that arena. This was going to be, well,

570
00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:48,960
he's gonna be making a sixth defense when he fights

571
00:25:49,000 --> 00:25:52,240
to fight against Roach. But the fact is, it's not

572
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:54,960
like he's unfamiliar to the to the New York folks

573
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,880
in terms of fighting in that particular venue. He fought

574
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:01,079
there a few other times. He had what I think

575
00:26:01,119 --> 00:26:02,720
some might even say one of his biggest wins of

576
00:26:02,759 --> 00:26:04,319
his career there when he won his first world title

577
00:26:04,559 --> 00:26:06,759
at one hundred and thirty pounds. He stopped the then

578
00:26:06,839 --> 00:26:09,720
undefeated one hundred and thirty pounds IBF champion Jose Pedraza

579
00:26:09,759 --> 00:26:10,400
in Barkley Center.

580
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:11,480
Speaker 3: I was ringside for that fight.

581
00:26:11,799 --> 00:26:16,240
Speaker 2: He blitzed Jesus Quaar when he won the vacant junior

582
00:26:16,319 --> 00:26:19,200
lightweight WBA belt in that arena in twenty eighteen. Then

583
00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:21,079
he knocked out roly Ramire as you mentioned, that was

584
00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:24,440
a lightweight title bout of his belt in twenty twenty two.

585
00:26:24,839 --> 00:26:26,720
Lamont Roach his box there only one time. This is

586
00:26:26,759 --> 00:26:29,480
way back in his like fifth professional fight when he

587
00:26:29,559 --> 00:26:32,519
was just a young prospect. But anyway, they'll put it

588
00:26:32,599 --> 00:26:35,759
on in Barclay Center. I have to imagine a plenty

589
00:26:35,799 --> 00:26:37,880
of the Baltimore faithful will make that trek up, and

590
00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:41,759
Washington will make that trek up. I ninety five to

591
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:44,599
go check out that fight. There's been a lot of people,

592
00:26:44,599 --> 00:26:48,839
by the way, TJ that hate the fight. Some are like, yeah,

593
00:26:48,880 --> 00:26:51,519
it's okay, and I get the people are disappointed that

594
00:26:51,599 --> 00:26:53,880
And I just say this, I mean number one, when

595
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:56,880
people go on my social media timeline they say it's garbage,

596
00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:00,559
it's trash. You're being a little over more, a little

597
00:27:00,559 --> 00:27:01,759
bit over melodramatic.

598
00:27:01,839 --> 00:27:03,440
Speaker 3: It is not garbage. It is not trash.

599
00:27:03,559 --> 00:27:07,359
Speaker 2: Lamont Roach is an excellent boxer, a top notch amateur,

600
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:12,279
a guy that has experience in the professional ranks, had

601
00:27:12,359 --> 00:27:15,200
had a you know, fought Tank Davis in the amateurs,

602
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,079
one of the best fighters in recent years come out

603
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:20,240
of Washington, DC. Has a world title. He lost to

604
00:27:20,319 --> 00:27:23,000
Jammel Herring. Yeah, he lost a mandatory fight in a

605
00:27:23,079 --> 00:27:26,240
decision that was competitive against Jamuel Herring. Like what five

606
00:27:26,319 --> 00:27:28,599
years ago, I mean, we're gonna We're gonna murder the

607
00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:30,440
guy over one loss from a long time ago that

608
00:27:30,559 --> 00:27:32,960
was still a halfway decent performance. I mean, give me

609
00:27:33,039 --> 00:27:35,920
a break now. I'm not gonna sit here and endorse

610
00:27:36,039 --> 00:27:38,039
this and say I think this is the greatest matchup

611
00:27:38,079 --> 00:27:38,839
since sliced Bread.

612
00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:40,880
Speaker 3: But this is the fight.

613
00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:44,720
Speaker 2: Remember, Hank was supposed to fight Lomachenko in this spot.

614
00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:46,440
That would have been at the end of this year,

615
00:27:46,759 --> 00:27:49,319
but Loma decided he was laying off and wasn't sure

616
00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:51,640
what he wanted to do. After many years of Loma

617
00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:53,920
having tried to get Tank in the ring, Loman decided

618
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:55,400
to take a little break after he won the IBF

619
00:27:55,480 --> 00:27:57,880
title and kind of left Tank Holden back. Remember those

620
00:27:57,920 --> 00:27:59,720
tides that PBC and Top Rank were right on the

621
00:27:59,839 --> 00:28:02,119
verge of a deal didn't happen. So now you start

622
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:04,839
to look around, and I'm not saying that Lamont Roach

623
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:07,680
is a perfect opponent to fight, but I hardly think

624
00:28:07,720 --> 00:28:11,359
it's trash. I hardly think it's garbage. And so they're

625
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:13,400
gonna go to a fine arena, one of the best

626
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:16,839
boxing facilities and busiest boxing facilities in recent years, although

627
00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:19,240
not in the last couple of years, to Barclay Center.

628
00:28:19,279 --> 00:28:22,160
Now you mentioned about the undercard fight. Obviously they're gonna

629
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,920
have to put on some solid stuff for that show,

630
00:28:26,240 --> 00:28:27,640
and so one of the fights that's going to be

631
00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:29,400
on the card, which I guess will be the co feature,

632
00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:31,559
but I'm not positive in that position because I haven't

633
00:28:31,839 --> 00:28:33,319
I have not, I don't have reporting on what the

634
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:36,319
remainder of that undercard is going to be, although I

635
00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:38,359
am told actually probably we'll see, but not on the

636
00:28:38,759 --> 00:28:40,720
co feature and perhaps not even the main card. Maybe

637
00:28:40,799 --> 00:28:44,480
on the on the preliminary card, the excellent middleweight up

638
00:28:44,519 --> 00:28:48,160
and comer Elijah Garcia, but in any event, Jose Valenzuela,

639
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:51,400
who had a title victory to kine this WBA title

640
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:54,359
at one hundred and forty pounds against Pitbull Cruise that

641
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:56,640
took place back on the read season Los Angeles cart

642
00:28:56,640 --> 00:29:00,160
in August. He will make his first defense against Garry

643
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:02,799
Antoine Russell, another Washington DC fighter who will be fighting

644
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:05,960
in New York City. Uh, and that will be the matchup.

645
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:07,680
I mean, that's that's a pretty good matchup if you

646
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:11,359
ask me. Now in terms of Gary Antoine Russell, Olympic fighter, undefeated,

647
00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:16,319
was a guy coming off of his first defeat, which

648
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:19,160
was the loss that he took against Alberto Pueo when

649
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:22,000
he fought him for the WBA belt. He was now

650
00:29:22,039 --> 00:29:25,359
in position once Pueo fought the mandatory against sand Or

651
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:28,039
Martin to get the winner in a mandatory WBA fight,

652
00:29:28,079 --> 00:29:31,519
but he obviously got offered the opportunity to fight or

653
00:29:31,640 --> 00:29:33,880
I'm sorry for the WBC title. He got offered this

654
00:29:34,039 --> 00:29:36,440
ability to fight for the WBA title, so he was

655
00:29:36,599 --> 00:29:38,799
took that rather than waiting to see what happens in

656
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:43,319
the WBC belt between Martin, uh, you know and uh

657
00:29:43,759 --> 00:29:45,880
in that fight, because that was supposed to be had

658
00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:52,279
Tank fought in December, Sander Martin against against Pueo was

659
00:29:52,319 --> 00:29:53,559
going to be on that undercard.

660
00:29:54,119 --> 00:29:56,559
Speaker 3: So nonetheless, Uh, he'll fight for this title. I mean

661
00:29:56,599 --> 00:29:57,680
that's a that's a pretty good matchup.

662
00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:00,160
Speaker 2: I mean Gary Antoin Russell despite the fact that he's

663
00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:03,400
been so dramatically inactive, just like unfortunately his older brother

664
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:07,359
Gary Junior was, but he's still he's an excellent fighter.

665
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:09,960
And uh and Valenzuela is a is a good young

666
00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:12,680
fighter also, so this is a this is a good matchup.

667
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:14,640
I mean, is it gonna be Valezuela, you know, with

668
00:30:14,759 --> 00:30:17,880
that confidence of a title and some more activity and

669
00:30:18,079 --> 00:30:20,240
obviously he's got good skills and he's he's a he's

670
00:30:20,279 --> 00:30:22,720
a real tenacious type of fighter, or is it is

671
00:30:22,759 --> 00:30:24,839
it Russell, who's obviously a good puncher, comes from.

672
00:30:24,680 --> 00:30:27,279
Speaker 3: That great boxing heritage. He was an Olympian. I mean it.

673
00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:29,880
Speaker 2: This is a good, good young guys matchup so to speak.

674
00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:32,160
I mean, both guys in their twenties. But it's time

675
00:30:32,200 --> 00:30:34,000
for Gary Russell to get off and then fight real

676
00:30:34,039 --> 00:30:36,119
guys at this point. I mean he really hasn't unfortunately,

677
00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:38,279
but this is gonna be a good proving fight for

678
00:30:38,359 --> 00:30:39,000
both of these guys.

679
00:30:39,839 --> 00:30:42,480
Speaker 1: Right again. That is in March, so good stuff on that.

680
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:45,559
One more news item as well here on the pod,

681
00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:48,880
and that is the IBF and our guy Martin Bucoley.

682
00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:51,240
We've been wondering when we would see him again after

683
00:30:51,319 --> 00:30:55,119
that demolition of Jared Anderson in August. We have an

684
00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:58,960
update on this now they've they've ordered Is this gonna happen?

685
00:30:59,039 --> 00:31:01,200
We don't know for sure, but they've ordered him to

686
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:02,400
fight FAA Jagba.

687
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:03,039
Speaker 3: Correct.

688
00:31:03,119 --> 00:31:05,119
Speaker 1: So tell me more about the timeline here of what

689
00:31:05,599 --> 00:31:06,160
has to happen.

690
00:31:06,599 --> 00:31:08,200
Speaker 2: Well, if they end up doing if they end up

691
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,240
actually fighting, it would be to determine the mandatory challenger

692
00:31:11,519 --> 00:31:14,279
for the IBF title, which is currently held by Daniel Dubis. Obviously,

693
00:31:14,359 --> 00:31:17,440
Daniel Dua is going to be fighting in February against

694
00:31:17,519 --> 00:31:19,920
Joseph Parker and not announced yet, but that's the plan

695
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:21,759
for the main event for that Read Season card. So

696
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,640
the winner, if this fight occurs, would be mandatory for

697
00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:28,079
the guy who wins between Dui and Joe Parker.

698
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:29,680
Speaker 3: Now, the question is will it happen?

699
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:32,640
Speaker 2: So, Bacoli and I've gotten so many people on my

700
00:31:32,759 --> 00:31:34,799
social media ask me where is Martin beccauley.

701
00:31:34,839 --> 00:31:37,279
Speaker 3: Why isn't he on this mega card with Read Season.

702
00:31:37,319 --> 00:31:39,200
Speaker 2: He's obviously an intriguing fighter, He's got a lot of

703
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:41,480
punching power, He's a very big man coming off the

704
00:31:41,519 --> 00:31:44,920
absolute demolition of Jared Anderson that took place also on

705
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:48,400
that August cart in Los Angeles, and there was some conversation,

706
00:31:48,519 --> 00:31:50,759
maybe we'd fight Jang in an eliminator in one of

707
00:31:50,799 --> 00:31:53,359
the other organizations. Jang is going to be fighting your

708
00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:56,440
boy at g Caveo on that card coming up in February.

709
00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:57,960
People were sort of like, well, where's Baccoli.

710
00:31:58,039 --> 00:31:58,160
Speaker 1: Now.

711
00:31:59,359 --> 00:32:01,160
Speaker 2: My underst standing is that there is a lot of

712
00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:03,880
back and forth and maybe Bocoli may have priced them

713
00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:06,359
aside of that particular fight, But in any event, the

714
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:09,240
IBF had a Jagua Mbacouli very high up in the rankings.

715
00:32:09,599 --> 00:32:11,799
And the reason why I have confidence more so than

716
00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:16,160
your average IBF order of an eliminator type fight, is

717
00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:20,519
because according to the IBF, both Bacoli and a Jagua

718
00:32:21,640 --> 00:32:24,359
hold the IBF in writing that they are interested in

719
00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:26,519
pursuing this fight and that's why they ordered it, because

720
00:32:26,519 --> 00:32:28,640
they were the two leading available guys in the rankings,

721
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:31,480
so their teams and those fighters have shown an interest

722
00:32:31,519 --> 00:32:34,599
to make the match. So that means you have a

723
00:32:34,759 --> 00:32:37,680
Jaga who's with top rank, you have Bikoli who was

724
00:32:37,799 --> 00:32:42,039
with boxer, but also with gold Star, and so they're

725
00:32:42,079 --> 00:32:43,640
going to try to guess put this fight together. But

726
00:32:43,759 --> 00:32:46,279
of course, if they don't make a deal, like fights

727
00:32:46,279 --> 00:32:48,319
that are mandatory or mandated matches, they go to a

728
00:32:48,359 --> 00:32:51,599
purse spit and they have until December eleventh to make

729
00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:53,359
a deal. If they don't make a deal, it'll go

730
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:56,319
to a persp Now it seems like an interesting enough

731
00:32:56,359 --> 00:32:59,920
heavyweight type fight with stakes available that maybe Turkey Elsh,

732
00:33:00,119 --> 00:33:01,920
who's done so many of the bigger heavyweight fights over

733
00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:04,319
the last you know year or so, could have interest

734
00:33:04,359 --> 00:33:06,160
in this fight. Butacoley looked really good in his last

735
00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:08,599
three out of appearance. A Jagua has yet to fight

736
00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:10,319
on that car, but he's shown himself to be a good,

737
00:33:10,359 --> 00:33:12,920
solid contendor just as the one loss also an Olympian,

738
00:33:13,039 --> 00:33:15,079
He's got a lot of pedigree to him. So this

739
00:33:15,279 --> 00:33:18,119
is this is a match up between guys with good

740
00:33:18,240 --> 00:33:22,240
power or big men. H I hope this fight happens.

741
00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:25,880
I mean, anytime you can take you know, heavyweights that

742
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:29,440
can end the fight with one shot, you want to

743
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:30,799
see them in the ring with each other, whatever the

744
00:33:30,839 --> 00:33:32,759
matchups are. And so I'm not gonna sit here and say, okay,

745
00:33:32,799 --> 00:33:35,079
if I was making my list of my top ten

746
00:33:35,119 --> 00:33:37,519
favorite heavyweight fights we could think about in boxing that

747
00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:40,359
somehow this is on my list. But when it was

748
00:33:40,599 --> 00:33:42,119
said to me, oh, you know, this is a pretty

749
00:33:42,119 --> 00:33:44,559
good fight. I want to see Bacoli again after that performance.

750
00:33:44,599 --> 00:33:47,279
And you know, Frankly a jagula. You know, he's he's

751
00:33:47,319 --> 00:33:49,160
come along too. He's had some ups and downs, but he's,

752
00:33:49,279 --> 00:33:51,000
like I said, just got the one loss. And he's

753
00:33:51,039 --> 00:33:52,440
a hard guy to fight too because he's got so

754
00:33:52,519 --> 00:33:53,599
much size and reach and pat.

755
00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:56,519
Speaker 1: I'll just interject, but Coley is a legitimate threat as

756
00:33:56,559 --> 00:33:58,519
a contender after what you saw him due to Anderson.

757
00:33:58,599 --> 00:34:00,880
So let's see. But as you liked say, devil in

758
00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:04,400
the details, and it's not done yet, so who knows?

759
00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:04,799
Who knows?

760
00:34:04,839 --> 00:34:06,920
Speaker 2: Well, it's not even They just ordered the negotiation, so

761
00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:08,320
they got to get to the table and see if

762
00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:09,519
they can get it done. I mean, but it's so

763
00:34:10,159 --> 00:34:14,119
but I get in the pantheon of hopes. I mean,

764
00:34:14,199 --> 00:34:16,559
I don't see why this would be so crazy to make.

765
00:34:16,639 --> 00:34:19,280
There's a lot at Steak neither. It's not like, guys,

766
00:34:19,679 --> 00:34:22,960
they're gonna avoid the title eliminator, but somehow they're gonna

767
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:25,719
get a world title shot without the eliminator. We know

768
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:28,000
the belts are held up right now. Fiery Hustik are

769
00:34:28,039 --> 00:34:30,360
doing their business with three of the titles. Dubai and

770
00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:31,960
Parker are going to be doing their business for the

771
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:33,880
title that would be at stake in this fight if

772
00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:36,400
they were you know, the eliminator for that belt. So

773
00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:38,239
hopefully they can get it on. They're not These are

774
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:40,400
not young guys, you know, they're in their thirties. One guys,

775
00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:43,239
thirty one, guys thirty two. You know, fighters fight and

776
00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:44,559
they can make good money on a fight like this.

777
00:34:44,639 --> 00:34:47,639
Speaker 1: I believe Nacola looks older than that, but who knows.

778
00:34:47,760 --> 00:34:49,880
Who knows what the ahe stuff? All right, let's get

779
00:34:49,880 --> 00:34:54,519
to the nostalgia and this was actually November nostalgia from Saturday,

780
00:34:54,559 --> 00:34:57,599
November the thirtieth, and it was forty five years ago,

781
00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:00,960
Big Dan Sugar, Ray Leonard fighting on a card that

782
00:35:01,079 --> 00:35:05,519
was a doubleheader with Marvin Hagler on the Undercard Network

783
00:35:05,639 --> 00:35:09,159
TV for Hagler, Vito and a Fermo. You talk about

784
00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:12,440
robbery's peeps, this was a robbery that Hagler didn't get

785
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:13,920
the decision. It was a draw. And then the main

786
00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:18,320
event is Leonard and Wilfred Benitez, where Sugar Ray Leonard

787
00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:22,920
wins the WBC Welterweight Championship in a tremendous fight of

788
00:35:23,039 --> 00:35:26,360
fifteenth round TKO. I still remember as a little tej

789
00:35:26,639 --> 00:35:30,440
watching this with the how would co Sell on the call?

790
00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:33,239
We talked about co Sell back on Friday forty five

791
00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:35,360
years ago. Give me more nostalgia on all of this.

792
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:38,880
Speaker 2: Could you imagine if there was a card of Sugar

793
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:41,320
Ray Leonard, who was a great up and coming star

794
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:44,920
at that point, Olympic gold medalist, future of the sport,

795
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:50,000
taken on a massively respected superb and undefeated world champion

796
00:35:50,039 --> 00:35:54,239
in Wilfrid Benitez for the WBC welterweight title Caesars Palace

797
00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:57,159
in Las Vegas. You've got Marvelus Marvin Hagler on the

798
00:35:57,280 --> 00:36:00,840
undercard challenging Vido antifermo For in the first fight for

799
00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:04,840
the undispeit of middleway title, and it's on free network television. Today,

800
00:36:05,199 --> 00:36:07,119
this would be like a ninety dollars pay per view

801
00:36:07,199 --> 00:36:10,679
hidden behind some the Zone paywall or ESPN Plus payroll

802
00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:11,000
or whatever.

803
00:36:11,559 --> 00:36:11,840
Speaker 1: I mean.

804
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:14,199
Speaker 2: It just was a different world back then, and that's

805
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:17,719
why boxing was so big because the network supported it,

806
00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:21,360
paid big license fees. The fighters made great money. The

807
00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:24,400
fights were, you know, top guys fighting top guys. And

808
00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:27,000
by the way, not all on Saturday nights. This was

809
00:36:27,039 --> 00:36:30,119
a weeknight fight that had occurred on but Ray Leonard,

810
00:36:30,599 --> 00:36:34,159
I must say, if you take a look at this

811
00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:36,360
was forty five years ago, let's say the last fifty

812
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:40,440
years like a big time matchup in a big win,

813
00:36:40,960 --> 00:36:42,920
like you want to talk about a guy's best win

814
00:36:43,159 --> 00:36:45,920
or his tremendous win. One of the reasons Leonard is

815
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:48,119
so revered is because he's got a whole bunch of big,

816
00:36:48,239 --> 00:36:50,840
great wins, and Benitaz is absolutely one of them. A

817
00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:52,960
lot of people look at Benitaz. You know, we talk

818
00:36:53,000 --> 00:36:57,400
all the time about the the four Kings of Leonard

819
00:36:57,480 --> 00:37:00,440
and Hagler and Tommy Hearns and Roberto Durant. A lot

820
00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:02,679
of people say it really should be fine because Benitas

821
00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:04,440
was like the fifth one. Now, he didn't fight all

822
00:37:04,559 --> 00:37:06,920
the other guys, but he did fight Leonard, and he

823
00:37:07,039 --> 00:37:09,800
did fight you know, Tommy Hearns or whatever. But he

824
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:12,400
never fought Hagler obviously. But the point is Benitas is

825
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:15,440
a great fighter. Also in a hall of famer, and

826
00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:17,599
this was sugar nn Leonard stepping up. Remember this is

827
00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:20,199
nineteen seventy nine. He's like barely three years removed if that,

828
00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:23,440
from the Olympics. I mean, he was not a young

829
00:37:23,559 --> 00:37:25,880
fighter from this, and he was a young fighter in age,

830
00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:28,119
but also in terms of professional experience, this was not

831
00:37:28,639 --> 00:37:30,400
This was not like we looked back down, say, yeah,

832
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:32,360
of course Ray Leonard won the fight because he's Ray Leonard.

833
00:37:32,559 --> 00:37:34,880
Speaker 3: But you know, back then we didn't.

834
00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:37,360
Speaker 2: He wasn't Ray Leonard that he became to be known yet,

835
00:37:37,400 --> 00:37:39,559
you know what I'm saying, Like he had to prove himself.

836
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:42,320
Now he was twenty five and oh going into the fight.

837
00:37:43,639 --> 00:37:46,800
I mean, but he he had not fought anybody on

838
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:48,519
the level yet of a wolf. For Benitas, who was,

839
00:37:48,599 --> 00:37:51,639
like I said, a legit, like upper tier Hall of

840
00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:52,880
Fame caliber type fighter.

841
00:37:53,079 --> 00:37:54,079
Speaker 3: He had had some good wins.

842
00:37:54,119 --> 00:37:56,559
Speaker 2: He had beat Andy Price in his previous fight in

843
00:37:56,639 --> 00:37:58,599
a first round knockout, which was a big deal on

844
00:37:58,800 --> 00:38:02,960
national television. Also, but you know, Pete ran Zani or whatever,

845
00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:05,760
he didn't have like the big names. He really took

846
00:38:05,800 --> 00:38:08,119
a big jump up when he fought Benitez, and it

847
00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:12,719
was a good, solid competitive fight, very close to a

848
00:38:12,800 --> 00:38:15,159
lot of people, perhaps slightly wider on a couple of

849
00:38:15,199 --> 00:38:20,079
the scorecards. Ray Leonard won emphatically put him away in

850
00:38:20,199 --> 00:38:22,639
the fifteenth round. And the thing about it is this

851
00:38:22,880 --> 00:38:24,480
started a run. So if you take a look at

852
00:38:24,519 --> 00:38:26,119
Sugar Ray Leonard, we talked about him as one of

853
00:38:26,119 --> 00:38:28,840
the greats of all time, you know, top ten fighters

854
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:31,079
in the history of the sport to most people. Anyway,

855
00:38:32,079 --> 00:38:35,079
from November of nineteen seventy nine when he beats Benitez,

856
00:38:35,519 --> 00:38:38,519
he goes on a run before the retirement because of

857
00:38:38,559 --> 00:38:41,320
the eye injury. This say is again in two years,

858
00:38:41,639 --> 00:38:46,360
so from November seventy nine to September eighty one, so

859
00:38:46,480 --> 00:38:50,159
it's a little less than two full years. He fights Benitez,

860
00:38:50,840 --> 00:38:53,519
takes a defense against Davy Boy Green, but then he

861
00:38:53,599 --> 00:38:57,559
goes Duran Duran, a defense against Larry Bonds, jumps up

862
00:38:57,599 --> 00:39:00,360
to fifty four to fight Ayu Coloule, wins title in

863
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:03,239
that weight class, has the long awaited showdown with Tommy

864
00:39:03,280 --> 00:39:05,679
hearns and stops him in round fourteen, and then he

865
00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:08,880
has obviously the retirement for uh well, he has one

866
00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:11,559
defense against Finch and then comes to retirement. My point

867
00:39:11,639 --> 00:39:14,599
is in that two years, the things that Ray Leonard

868
00:39:14,639 --> 00:39:18,320
did fight Benitez, Duran twice, klule and hearns. I mean,

869
00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:21,039
guys don't do that anymore. You know, we go back

870
00:39:21,079 --> 00:39:23,639
to what we talked about earlier. You know, Boots Enna,

871
00:39:23,679 --> 00:39:25,320
should he type Virgil Ortiz?

872
00:39:25,360 --> 00:39:25,480
Speaker 1: Now?

873
00:39:25,559 --> 00:39:27,199
Speaker 3: Can he jump up? Is it too much?

874
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:28,639
Speaker 2: Could he take a tune up fight to it? Blah

875
00:39:28,679 --> 00:39:32,760
blah blah. Fuck that sugar and Leonard is like the antithesis.

876
00:39:33,079 --> 00:39:35,480
This is give me one big name after another. I mean,

877
00:39:35,559 --> 00:39:38,119
and jumping ahead. You know when he came back after

878
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:39,519
three and a half years out of the ring, and

879
00:39:39,559 --> 00:39:41,559
he thought Marvin Hagler jumping up two week classes for

880
00:39:41,599 --> 00:39:43,920
the middleweight title, like nobody said I'd do a tune

881
00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:45,280
up fight. I mean, they thought he was gonna get

882
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:47,400
murdered in the fight. But he ended up showing everybody

883
00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:50,280
in winning the fight. But the Benitez fight, that's a

884
00:39:50,639 --> 00:39:54,760
big of a town, four pound, big time win as

885
00:39:54,840 --> 00:39:59,480
you could possibly ask for in boxing history. It was surprising,

886
00:39:59,519 --> 00:40:01,440
actually what I when I was when I've read around

887
00:40:01,639 --> 00:40:04,079
read up on this fight. Leonard actually went into the

888
00:40:04,159 --> 00:40:06,880
dow as a slight favorite in the match, but nonetheless

889
00:40:07,480 --> 00:40:09,599
he got the job done, and it was quite impressive.

890
00:40:09,599 --> 00:40:11,960
I mean, it's a it's a it was.

891
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:14,239
Speaker 1: A huge I was a huge Sugar Ray litter fan

892
00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:15,920
coming off the Olympics as a little guy, and this

893
00:40:16,039 --> 00:40:18,079
made me an even bigger one. And I've often said

894
00:40:18,119 --> 00:40:20,320
to you that next year when Duran beat him, I

895
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:22,159
had a tear in my eye as ten year old

896
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:24,760
TJ because you just thought nobody can beat Sugar Ray

897
00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:28,000
Leonard because you had seen these kind of fights. So

898
00:40:28,159 --> 00:40:31,039
what a night for him? And again say something about Hagler,

899
00:40:31,079 --> 00:40:34,639
who was forever like in the shadow of the massive payday,

900
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:37,559
including on this night where he's on the undercard making

901
00:40:37,599 --> 00:40:40,440
a fraction of what Leonard made and then being robbed

902
00:40:40,480 --> 00:40:41,079
of the title.

903
00:40:42,039 --> 00:40:44,000
Speaker 2: I mean, a lot of people refer to this fight

904
00:40:44,119 --> 00:40:46,880
between Sugar between Uh Hagler and at the furnam of

905
00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:50,719
the first fight that they had as a tremendously massive robbery.

906
00:40:51,840 --> 00:40:54,320
I thought that Marvin Hagler won the fight, but I've

907
00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:56,400
never thought it was like the most outrageous thing I

908
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:56,760
ever saw.

909
00:40:56,800 --> 00:40:57,559
Speaker 3: And a matter of fact, if you.

910
00:40:57,599 --> 00:41:00,119
Speaker 2: Go back and watch the broadcast, there was not a

911
00:41:00,119 --> 00:41:02,280
lot of outrage from Howard Cosell who. By the way,

912
00:41:02,360 --> 00:41:05,519
Howard Cossel certainly could have outrage when he asked, I

913
00:41:05,559 --> 00:41:08,239
mean there's no doubt about that. Well again, I'm not

914
00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:09,280
saying that he didn't win the fight.

915
00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:09,559
Speaker 3: I didn't.

916
00:41:09,559 --> 00:41:11,039
Speaker 2: I don't think it goes down to the pantheon of

917
00:41:11,079 --> 00:41:13,519
the worst robberies in the history of the world. Unfortunately

918
00:41:13,559 --> 00:41:17,280
for Hagler, after he got the draw for the undisputed title,

919
00:41:17,320 --> 00:41:18,920
he had to wait for a little while. He fought

920
00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:21,559
several more times. It was almost another year until he

921
00:41:21,639 --> 00:41:24,039
got the shot again. In the meantime, Anton Fermo had

922
00:41:24,119 --> 00:41:26,840
lost the title to Alan Minter, but Marvin stayed busy,

923
00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:28,800
you know in the day's age, like TJ always talks

924
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:32,199
about activity. Baby, Yeah, he draws. He draws with Anti

925
00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:36,280
Fermo in November. He's back in February, he's back in April,

926
00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:38,920
he's back in May. He scores it, wins.

927
00:41:39,519 --> 00:41:41,760
Speaker 1: You listen in peeps. He fought three more times in

928
00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,760
less than six months after losing a title fight in November.

929
00:41:44,679 --> 00:41:46,519
Speaker 2: Right, So he fights in May of nineteen eighty and

930
00:41:46,599 --> 00:41:48,760
then it was in September, you know, a few months

931
00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:51,440
after that May fight where he fights Alan Minter in England.

932
00:41:51,519 --> 00:41:54,079
Famously and knocks him out, blood's him, beats him up

933
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:55,840
and stops him in the third round to win the

934
00:41:55,920 --> 00:41:59,119
undispuited title. In the British fans or lunatics start throwing

935
00:41:59,119 --> 00:42:01,559
the beer bottles into into the crowd, but the anti

936
00:42:01,599 --> 00:42:06,559
Fermo draw really, you know, Marvin Hagler, if you talk

937
00:42:06,559 --> 00:42:08,079
about a guy that always fell to get a chip

938
00:42:08,119 --> 00:42:10,320
on his shoulder, the draw in that fight is one

939
00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:11,760
of the things that put that chip on his shoulder

940
00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:14,320
because he felt like he had been robbed. Anthon Furmer

941
00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:18,559
was making his first title defense, but it was really

942
00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:21,599
unfortunately it was massively overshadowed by what Sugar Ray Leonard

943
00:42:21,599 --> 00:42:23,960
had done in the main event. But it just goes

944
00:42:24,039 --> 00:42:27,360
to show you because Marvin Hagler and Sugar Ray Leonard

945
00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:30,559
finally did fight in nineteen eighty seven, but they were

946
00:42:30,960 --> 00:42:35,039
already sort of like driving towards one another, even though

947
00:42:35,119 --> 00:42:37,840
Ray had just won the welterweight title on this particular

948
00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:42,320
show in nineteen seventy nine. So it was the notion

949
00:42:42,440 --> 00:42:45,000
that Ray Leonard and Hagler would someday fight like it

950
00:42:45,159 --> 00:42:47,199
was around for a long time, and by having them

951
00:42:47,239 --> 00:42:49,320
on the same card where they were both in big

952
00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:52,079
time title fights on the National Network television show like this.

953
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:53,599
Speaker 3: That was sort of like the start of like.

954
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:55,199
Speaker 2: You know what, down the road, we're going to see

955
00:42:55,239 --> 00:42:58,400
the welterweight champion Leonard maybe someday against one of the

956
00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:00,920
great middleweight who had yet to win the title. But

957
00:43:01,039 --> 00:43:03,239
maybe they fight each other someday. That's where the it was,

958
00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:05,039
like the seed was planned that I.

959
00:43:05,079 --> 00:43:09,559
Speaker 1: Believe fourty five years ago on Saturday, November thirtieth of

960
00:43:09,599 --> 00:43:13,760
seventy nine. I advanced eleven more years to December second

961
00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:18,159
of two thousand, that's twenty four years ago Monday, as

962
00:43:18,199 --> 00:43:21,039
we released the podcast Felix Trinidad, we talked about him

963
00:43:21,039 --> 00:43:24,199
a lot on these nostalgia pieces that we do. Ends

964
00:43:24,280 --> 00:43:27,599
up defeating Fernando Vargas to unify two of the junior

965
00:43:27,639 --> 00:43:31,440
middleweight championships. Rayfield says on the sheet, the greatest junior

966
00:43:31,480 --> 00:43:34,679
middleweight title fight ever. Some might argue, I don't choose

967
00:43:34,719 --> 00:43:37,039
to argue with you, but some might argue that you

968
00:43:37,119 --> 00:43:37,440
were there.

969
00:43:37,519 --> 00:43:39,480
Speaker 3: You were there, Well, hold on you, what tell me

970
00:43:39,559 --> 00:43:40,280
the fight that's better.

971
00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:42,519
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm just saying some would argue, maybe

972
00:43:42,519 --> 00:43:44,960
there's another junior middleweight title fight somewhere along the line

973
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:45,360
that's better.

974
00:43:45,440 --> 00:43:47,239
Speaker 3: But you're saying that, I'm hard press that.

975
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:50,880
Speaker 1: You're saying it's this one. You were there in Las Vegas.

976
00:43:51,079 --> 00:43:53,800
Why for Tito Trinidad over Fernando Argists.

977
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:55,960
Speaker 2: This was a really big time fight. This was like,

978
00:43:56,960 --> 00:43:59,159
you know, I remember Larry Merchant, my dear pal, who

979
00:43:59,159 --> 00:44:01,760
would call this fight on HBO, would talk about, you know,

980
00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:05,079
if you could order fights off like a menu, you know,

981
00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:07,480
and you had your choice of fighters in Columne, and

982
00:44:07,599 --> 00:44:09,840
choices of Kiers and Columbe, and you saw Trinidad and

983
00:44:09,960 --> 00:44:12,559
Vargas at the stages of their careers, you'd be definitely

984
00:44:12,599 --> 00:44:14,800
having that at the top of your wont list, you know,

985
00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:16,360
if you could order fights off of the menu.

986
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:19,679
Speaker 3: This was a big time fight for me.

987
00:44:19,800 --> 00:44:22,719
Speaker 2: It was a special fight because I had covered Lennox

988
00:44:22,800 --> 00:44:25,800
Lewis against David Tua in Las Vegas at the Mandala

989
00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:28,400
Bay a month earlier, with that, which was my first

990
00:44:28,599 --> 00:44:30,480
assignment to go to Las Vegas to cover fight. This

991
00:44:30,599 --> 00:44:32,199
was my second assignment to go to Las Vegas to

992
00:44:32,239 --> 00:44:35,119
cover fight Trinidad versus Marcus. I obviously got a great

993
00:44:35,119 --> 00:44:38,159
one and turned out to be way better than the pilot.

994
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:40,239
Speaker 1: Is not bad for the opening two title fights for

995
00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:41,239
Big Dan to go cover.

996
00:44:41,880 --> 00:44:43,320
Speaker 2: What I was gonna say is Lewis too as a

997
00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:45,840
fight was kind of a steaming pile of dogshit. It

998
00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:48,039
was a wonderful performance from Lewis, but not an exciting

999
00:44:48,039 --> 00:44:49,679
fight in any way, shape or form. This was a

1000
00:44:49,719 --> 00:44:51,360
whole different ballgame. This was one of the still the

1001
00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:54,679
greatest fights I've ever covered. I mean, you add Mexico

1002
00:44:54,880 --> 00:44:57,840
in terms of Fernando as the Mexican American, very proud

1003
00:44:57,920 --> 00:45:02,840
of his heritage, machismo fighter, the United States Olympian had

1004
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:05,280
looked great on the way up and been destroying everybody,

1005
00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:08,199
had scored a very big win against ike Quarte and

1006
00:45:08,320 --> 00:45:10,440
had looked strong in his you know, several of his

1007
00:45:10,519 --> 00:45:12,519
fights leading up to this fight. He had had a

1008
00:45:12,599 --> 00:45:16,199
win over a Winkie right close. Some stay controversial, but nonetheless,

1009
00:45:16,599 --> 00:45:19,199
you know, in back to back wins he had beaten

1010
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:20,760
Winky Wright, who was in the Hall of Fame. And

1011
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:24,639
ike Quarte was a massive, respected former welterweight champion who

1012
00:45:24,679 --> 00:45:26,599
had given Oscar deal le Hoye everything you could handle.

1013
00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:29,199
He then made a mandatory defense. Trinidad had made a

1014
00:45:29,239 --> 00:45:31,480
mandatory defense, and then they were on the collision course

1015
00:45:31,519 --> 00:45:34,480
to fight each other. This was Don King promoting Tito,

1016
00:45:34,639 --> 00:45:37,480
this was Main Events promoting Fernando, and they they really

1017
00:45:37,639 --> 00:45:40,559
put together one of the most explosive and exciting fights.

1018
00:45:40,599 --> 00:45:41,920
I guess the kind of fight when it was made

1019
00:45:42,000 --> 00:45:45,039
TJ where every single person that had any knowledge of

1020
00:45:45,079 --> 00:45:48,119
that boxing would literally say, zero chance is not a

1021
00:45:48,159 --> 00:45:50,639
great fight, just based on the way that the fighters

1022
00:45:50,639 --> 00:45:53,639
spot and this their intensity level, and it delivered. It

1023
00:45:53,760 --> 00:45:57,559
delivered everything you could possibly want. Vargas was knocked down

1024
00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:00,119
twice in the first round, however, and so in the

1025
00:46:00,199 --> 00:46:03,760
first opening seconds of the fight, I remember literally sitting

1026
00:46:03,800 --> 00:46:06,480
there in ringside in my press seat, and he gets

1027
00:46:06,559 --> 00:46:09,079
dropped by a patent that Tito Trinidad left hook, like

1028
00:46:09,239 --> 00:46:11,559
almost right out of the first bell, and you're like,

1029
00:46:11,639 --> 00:46:14,239
oh my god. He shakes it off and he gets up,

1030
00:46:14,599 --> 00:46:16,719
and then like in three seconds later he's down again

1031
00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:19,159
from another hook, and you're like, this fight's gonna fucking

1032
00:46:19,199 --> 00:46:20,960
be over in the first run. After all the months

1033
00:46:20,960 --> 00:46:25,199
of hype and excitement and and and everybody talking about

1034
00:46:25,239 --> 00:46:26,639
all the different things that are gonna be going on

1035
00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:28,719
in this fight, You're like fuck, this fight's gonna be over,

1036
00:46:28,800 --> 00:46:33,039
and like literally like a minute to Tito Trinidad was

1037
00:46:33,079 --> 00:46:33,880
trying to get Vargas.

1038
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:34,840
Speaker 3: But the Vargas is credit.

1039
00:46:34,960 --> 00:46:36,920
Speaker 2: He got up, he stayed in the fight, he got

1040
00:46:36,960 --> 00:46:40,199
a shit together, and he ended up getting back into it.

1041
00:46:40,239 --> 00:46:42,559
He knocked Tito Trinidad down in the fourth round, which

1042
00:46:42,840 --> 00:46:45,000
got him one of those points back. Yep, it was

1043
00:46:45,079 --> 00:46:46,440
a little bit of a dirty fight at times. There

1044
00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:49,320
were some low blows. Tito Trinidad with a very perfectly

1045
00:46:49,400 --> 00:46:54,079
time low blow, which which I think changed the fight

1046
00:46:54,119 --> 00:46:56,320
a little bit because it really did some damage to

1047
00:46:57,519 --> 00:47:00,559
to Vargas. But they fought their hearts out. This was

1048
00:47:00,639 --> 00:47:01,960
a battle to the end.

1049
00:47:02,440 --> 00:47:02,559
Speaker 1: You know.

1050
00:47:02,679 --> 00:47:05,440
Speaker 2: It always felt like Trinidad was gonna eventually win, but

1051
00:47:05,599 --> 00:47:07,760
Vargas was always like just a step behind, but he

1052
00:47:07,840 --> 00:47:10,719
was still still going after him, still landing shots. He

1053
00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:13,960
was a powerful puncher, young, with enthusiasm and exuberance, had

1054
00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:17,199
never lost, and Trinidad was, you know, not the old fighter,

1055
00:47:17,239 --> 00:47:19,800
but he was the more experienced guy. Just everything you

1056
00:47:19,880 --> 00:47:23,199
could possibly want. They get to the twelfth round. Oh

1057
00:47:23,199 --> 00:47:24,800
and by the way, both guys end up having the

1058
00:47:24,880 --> 00:47:26,760
points deducted because of the low blows. There was, Like

1059
00:47:26,800 --> 00:47:28,920
I said, there were some dirty elements.

1060
00:47:28,559 --> 00:47:28,960
Speaker 3: To the fight.

1061
00:47:31,039 --> 00:47:33,880
Speaker 2: But going into the twelfth round, you know, Ken Trinidad

1062
00:47:34,199 --> 00:47:36,639
finally get him out of there. Ken Vargus survived. Vargus

1063
00:47:36,719 --> 00:47:39,760
obviously gonna lose, you know, probably a somewhat close decision.

1064
00:47:39,800 --> 00:47:43,079
The cards were kind of close at that time. But Trinidad,

1065
00:47:43,119 --> 00:47:45,920
as he's known to do, what's the old saying, TJ,

1066
00:47:46,039 --> 00:47:50,519
he closed the show and he absolutely destroyed Felix Trinette

1067
00:47:50,519 --> 00:47:52,360
in the in the last round, I felt like Jane eighty,

1068
00:47:52,400 --> 00:47:55,800
who was the referee in this fight, let Vargas take

1069
00:47:55,880 --> 00:47:58,159
one too many knockdowns in the last round should have

1070
00:47:58,199 --> 00:48:01,000
been stopped. I believe very strongly at least one knockdown

1071
00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:03,039
before it was over. But what a fabulous fight. A

1072
00:48:03,079 --> 00:48:05,000
lot of people will tell you at ruined Vargas. He

1073
00:48:05,159 --> 00:48:07,480
was very young at that time, and he took unnecessary

1074
00:48:07,519 --> 00:48:10,400
punishment in the second or the last couple of rounds

1075
00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:13,239
in that fight. He wanted it, He made big money

1076
00:48:13,280 --> 00:48:15,280
in the fight, his team wanted it. So you Ca'm

1077
00:48:15,320 --> 00:48:19,119
not gonna second guess it. But phenomenal, phenomenal fight.

1078
00:48:19,039 --> 00:48:21,440
Speaker 1: And we say one more time, these are the types

1079
00:48:21,480 --> 00:48:23,199
of fights. This is where the money was. That's why

1080
00:48:23,239 --> 00:48:25,000
you want to make these fights. And you got a

1081
00:48:25,039 --> 00:48:26,440
great one that night.

1082
00:48:26,639 --> 00:48:27,840
Speaker 3: A big HBO pay per view.

1083
00:48:27,840 --> 00:48:30,400
Speaker 2: I mean, I've been in a lot of press rooms,

1084
00:48:30,400 --> 00:48:32,599
a lot of media centers in my day, and when

1085
00:48:32,639 --> 00:48:35,039
I tell you, the excitement level all week in that

1086
00:48:35,119 --> 00:48:37,159
press room, people could not wait.

1087
00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:39,000
Speaker 3: The press guys could not wait for that fight.

1088
00:48:39,119 --> 00:48:41,559
Speaker 2: Don king you know, doing this thing walking around and

1089
00:48:41,679 --> 00:48:45,599
shotting up the fight, and the again, the the the

1090
00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:48,599
excitement level among the fans in press for this match.

1091
00:48:48,920 --> 00:48:52,039
There was so much joy that this was happening. Uh,

1092
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:56,440
and they delivered everything you could possibly have wanted twenty.

1093
00:48:56,199 --> 00:48:59,280
Speaker 1: Four years ago Monday for Tito Trinidad the Hall of

1094
00:48:59,360 --> 00:49:00,800
Famer to get had.

1095
00:49:00,880 --> 00:49:03,920
Speaker 2: By the way, one thing that that was the culmination

1096
00:49:04,119 --> 00:49:05,760
of a week that I was in Las Vegas, where

1097
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:08,920
I believe I covered five boxing events in like four days,

1098
00:49:09,159 --> 00:49:11,280
and then on the day after this fight, attended my

1099
00:49:11,480 --> 00:49:14,880
sister in law's wedding at the Venetian, So there had

1100
00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:16,800
been a don king cart at a hotel.

1101
00:49:17,039 --> 00:49:18,599
Speaker 1: I'm not going to pin you down on whether the

1102
00:49:18,639 --> 00:49:20,880
fights were more important and a more special place in

1103
00:49:20,920 --> 00:49:22,280
your heart than your sister's wedding. I don't want to

1104
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:24,079
get you in trouble on a Sunday night, but you know.

1105
00:49:24,199 --> 00:49:26,119
Speaker 2: My sister had it all that week, my sister in

1106
00:49:26,199 --> 00:49:28,239
law to PostScript, it is now divorced from that man

1107
00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:33,400
and remarried. So but the thing is the week there

1108
00:49:33,519 --> 00:49:35,440
is a don king card like I'm one of the

1109
00:49:35,480 --> 00:49:39,280
old satellite services, like on the Wednesday night, maybe there

1110
00:49:39,519 --> 00:49:43,159
was a on Friday night. The night before the fight,

1111
00:49:43,360 --> 00:49:45,920
HBO did a boxing after Dark card that I covered

1112
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:48,960
that had a main event of Bernard Hopkins defending the

1113
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:51,400
Middleway title in his first fight with Antoine Eckles and

1114
00:49:51,559 --> 00:49:54,360
Marco Antoniobrera also on that card in the title defense.

1115
00:49:54,880 --> 00:49:58,079
And then that same night there was a card that

1116
00:49:58,159 --> 00:49:59,920
I covered part of it. I was at the MG

1117
00:50:00,719 --> 00:50:02,760
or at the Mando Light Day rather in a ballroom

1118
00:50:02,800 --> 00:50:04,920
where they had a Friday night fights card where I

1119
00:50:05,119 --> 00:50:07,159
changed my pick as I was a guest on the air,

1120
00:50:07,519 --> 00:50:09,880
changed my pick that I picked Trinidad at all all

1121
00:50:10,440 --> 00:50:12,480
through the promotion. But I had spent time with Vargas

1122
00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:14,880
at the gym during fight week and got bamboozled and

1123
00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:17,440
ended up changing my pick to Vargas and then the

1124
00:50:17,559 --> 00:50:20,079
day after before we went to the wedding. This is

1125
00:50:20,119 --> 00:50:22,119
back when Top Ranks used to do the early afternoon

1126
00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:25,840
Eastern time cards on the old when they had Univision

1127
00:50:26,119 --> 00:50:28,360
doing shows once a week, and I went to a

1128
00:50:28,440 --> 00:50:30,199
card at the plaza Es Central and watched the young

1129
00:50:30,280 --> 00:50:33,480
prospect Buolio Diaz, who I picked as my prospect of

1130
00:50:33,559 --> 00:50:35,239
the year, the first time I picked the prospect of

1131
00:50:35,239 --> 00:50:36,840
the year. So I was covered all these fights, but

1132
00:50:36,920 --> 00:50:40,360
the culmination, the big massive fight of the weekend, obviously

1133
00:50:40,559 --> 00:50:42,360
was we were all out there for this mega pay

1134
00:50:42,360 --> 00:50:45,360
per view card between Tito Trinidad and Fernando Vargus. I mean,

1135
00:50:45,400 --> 00:50:47,480
as unforgettable as it gets in terms of the main event.

1136
00:50:47,639 --> 00:50:49,280
And by the way, I just say one other thing,

1137
00:50:49,639 --> 00:50:51,599
one of the great joys of my career is the

1138
00:50:51,679 --> 00:50:54,599
fact that on this undercard I got to cover a

1139
00:50:54,679 --> 00:50:56,320
Riccardo Lopez fight, who was one of my all time

1140
00:50:56,320 --> 00:50:58,440
favorite fighters. He was the at that time he was

1141
00:50:58,559 --> 00:51:00,800
a junior a flyway champion, but he made his bones

1142
00:51:01,039 --> 00:51:03,760
as the very long time strawway champ. This was the

1143
00:51:03,840 --> 00:51:05,800
second to last fight of his career. I got to

1144
00:51:05,880 --> 00:51:07,320
cover his last two fights. It was a joy to

1145
00:51:07,360 --> 00:51:09,199
see Ricardo Lopez in person, up.

1146
00:51:09,119 --> 00:51:12,280
Speaker 1: Close nostalgia on top of the nostalgia including a wedding,

1147
00:51:12,679 --> 00:51:14,800
not your wedding and not out a Vegas chapel being

1148
00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:17,079
performed by Elvis. We just throw that out there as

1149
00:51:17,119 --> 00:51:22,119
we come off Thanksgiving weekend. Listen, we have made this happen.

1150
00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:24,800
I'm glad that you're back. I'm glad that you're safe.

1151
00:51:24,840 --> 00:51:28,719
And again I am working buccaneer of football with the

1152
00:51:28,960 --> 00:51:32,039
Carolina Panthers. You'll know how my Sunday afternoon and evening

1153
00:51:32,079 --> 00:51:35,199
when according to that result. But we talked to Sweet

1154
00:51:35,239 --> 00:51:37,440
Science here going into the weekend with the preview pod

1155
00:51:37,480 --> 00:51:39,880
and this is the recap pod. Other than that, let's

1156
00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:44,320
get ready for the rematch week of Navarate Baldez two

1157
00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:47,559
and everything else it's gonna unfold later this week. It's December,

1158
00:51:47,880 --> 00:51:51,599
my friend also at the calendar, it's December Espinosa Ramirez too,

1159
00:51:51,639 --> 00:51:54,360
al So that's on that arcard. We look forward to

1160
00:51:54,400 --> 00:51:56,400
that later on in the week. For now, we are

1161
00:51:56,440 --> 00:51:58,000
good at Big Dan. Have a good week. Thank you

1162
00:51:58,400 --> 00:52:02,519
there is Dan. Rafael TJ Reeves again follow subscribe on

1163
00:52:02,719 --> 00:52:05,760
the Big Fight Weekend podcast Meat on Apple Streaker, Spotify.

1164
00:52:06,079 --> 00:52:08,239
We are good for now. For the Fight, Preach Unit

1165
00:52:08,320 --> 00:52:10,400
Recap podcast, m