Speaker 1: Big Food and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. These guys
Speaker 1: are your favorites, so light say subscribe and raid.
Speaker 2: It five stock and me.
Speaker 1: Greatest con yesh today listening a watching, always keep its watching.
Speaker 2: And now you're hosts Cliff Berkman and James Bubo Fay.
Speaker 1: Hello Cliff, Hello Bobo. How are you doing today, sir?
Speaker 3: Pretty good? Pretty good?
Speaker 4: What's happening?
Speaker 1: Just uh, I don't know, work and stuff and you know,
Speaker 1: I just got back in town from Kentucky. I was
Speaker 1: at a cryptid con. Oh yeah, great event. I really
Speaker 1: enjoyed myself. A lot of good people out there. I
Speaker 1: saw Tom Shay. Tom Shay is of course a national
Speaker 1: treasure in every single way international pretty much pretty much.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: He passed on a couple of casts for the NABC.
Speaker 1: One is a gift to the NABC, which is a
Speaker 1: fantastic cast from Trimble County in twenty eighteen. The cast
Speaker 1: is from an individual named Goliath that we've been tracking
Speaker 1: over the last few years. There's some dramaticallypics on it
Speaker 1: that maybe came from the Sasquatch, maybe came from introduction
Speaker 1: or being tainted somehow, you know, like maybe Tom touched
Speaker 1: the foot print before his cast. Not really sure. I
Speaker 1: actually I'm working with a forensic expert who is an
Speaker 1: expert in dramaticlyphics and ballistics of all things, and he
Speaker 1: has some questions about the cast. So I was talking
Speaker 1: to Tom about that, and of course Tom has nothing
Speaker 1: to hide. He wants everybody to look at these things
Speaker 1: with a really close eye and just get to the
Speaker 1: bottom of everything, get to the truth of all this.
Speaker 1: So I was talking to Tom about this cast and
Speaker 1: about the concerns this one gentleman had. He's a police
Speaker 1: officer in Georgia. And Tom says, well, I'll tell you what,
Speaker 1: I'll just give you the cast for the NABC. I'll
Speaker 1: just donate the cast to you and then you can
Speaker 1: make a higher quality mold than what you have and
Speaker 1: then send it off to him. Which is really a
Speaker 1: fantastic thing and so generous and really speaks volumes to
Speaker 1: Tom Shay's character that he he just wants qualified people
Speaker 1: to closely examine the evidence and get to the truth.
Speaker 1: So I got that one back at home, and also
Speaker 1: while while he was bringing a cast, I specifically asked him,
Speaker 1: you know, now, there are two fantastic handprints that Tom
Speaker 1: cast in twenty sixteen, not that real big one that
Speaker 1: you got to hold in person. But there's these two
Speaker 1: other ones, right, and it's the same hand that the
Speaker 1: fingers are curled in one and protruding to the ground,
Speaker 1: and the other well, apparently there were there was a
Speaker 1: footprint associated with it. Tom sent me a photograph of
Speaker 1: the two hand casts and a footprint. I go, Tom,
Speaker 1: there's a footprint. He goes, yeah, I never told you that.
Speaker 1: I said, no, he never told me that. So well, hey,
Speaker 1: and so like a year goes by or eight months
Speaker 1: go by, and I figured out, I'm going to see
Speaker 1: Tom at Cryptidcon and I'm revamping my presentations for this
Speaker 1: coming season. I think I'm going to do something on handprints.
Speaker 1: I did something at handprints a number of years ago,
Speaker 1: but so many more have been uncovered since then, and
Speaker 1: so much new information has come out. I want to
Speaker 1: revisit that topic for this coming season, and you know
Speaker 1: of conferences. So anyway, I said, Tom, would you mind
Speaker 1: lending me that that footprint because I want to use
Speaker 1: it and see if there's any correlation hand size and
Speaker 1: foot size and all this other stuff. He goes, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: no problem. So I see Tom, and he goes, hey,
Speaker 1: I got that cast for you, And I unwrapped the
Speaker 1: bubble wrap and there's a half cast there. I go, Tom,
Speaker 1: this isn't the one you show me. He goes, oh, no,
Speaker 1: I couldn't find that one that I showed you. But
Speaker 1: this was also in the trackway. Huh, said Tom? There
Speaker 1: were two? There were two? What else are you hiding
Speaker 1: from me? You know, not that he's hiding anything, of course,
Speaker 1: but you know what I mean, it's like, oh my god.
Speaker 1: So that a really interesting half cast. And then there's
Speaker 1: still that other footprint that he's not quite sure where
Speaker 1: it is because he's got tubs of these things, right,
Speaker 1: He's been collecting these prints since the eighties. So you know,
Speaker 1: I can't hold it against them. I'm rather disorganized as well,
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Anyway, so the Crypto Con was great in that sort
Speaker 1: of way, and I don't know that that's pretty much it, really,
Speaker 1: although I did come home to a very very sick dog. Fortunately, Yeah,
Speaker 1: so she's not I mean, she's doing better now, but
Speaker 1: you know, I mean she understandably has separation anxiety issues
Speaker 1: and has a lot of baggage from you know, being
Speaker 1: tied to a tree in the woods alone as a puppy,
Speaker 1: and then you know, we stumbled upon her and saved
Speaker 1: her life basically. You know, so she's got some baggage,
Speaker 1: but then she's used to like Melissa being home when
Speaker 1: I'm gone, But this time Melissa came with me because
Speaker 1: she later drove out to Pittsburgh after the event to
Speaker 1: surprise her mother for her seventieth birthday party. So happy
Speaker 1: birthday to mom of course out there. Yeah. So, so
Speaker 1: she kind of freaked out while we're gone, got in
Speaker 1: the trash ate some stuff and then stopped eating anything.
Speaker 1: Then she wasn't pooping and all that other you know,
Speaker 1: dog issues and stuff. She's slowly rebounding and the stress
Speaker 1: is going away. I'm literally looking at her right now.
Speaker 1: So but yeah, things are getting better for her. But
Speaker 1: they don't like having a sick dog. You know how
Speaker 1: that is, Bubbs.
Speaker 4: Oh god, yeah, it's because you're like, talk to me,
Speaker 4: Talk to me, you know what's going on?
Speaker 1: Just tell me what's wrong. Yeah, but that's me, man.
Speaker 1: What's up with you?
Speaker 4: Getting ready for Bart to come up tomorrow.
Speaker 1: Night, tomorrow night, Thanksgiving Eve.
Speaker 4: Well, he's gonna he's gonna take off and then he'll
Speaker 4: probably won't get here until Friday morning, and then uh,
Speaker 4: we're gonna do our annual squatching and gambling football watching it.
Speaker 3: We'll be out.
Speaker 4: We're not gonna go too far out like, well, we'll
Speaker 4: have to keep it close where we can come in
Speaker 4: and watch games and be in internet range.
Speaker 1: So get his bets in. Well, very good. I wish
Speaker 1: you good luck on both counts, big footing and gambling.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Nice. Nice. He's just gonna go to the local spots basically, Yeah.
Speaker 3: Then we're gonna go.
Speaker 4: Polly Pizza has gotta he's got. He lives out out
Speaker 4: behind like like between Fieldbrook and Mckinneyville, come out in
Speaker 4: Mount's on those those coastal hills like just south of Trinidad,
Speaker 4: and I get a lot of reports out of there,
Speaker 4: and I've and I should spend more time there because
Speaker 4: it's so close, but I kind of it's just, uh,
Speaker 4: there's there's house. I mean, there's you know, there's a
Speaker 4: couple of thousand people live in that valley, and so
Speaker 4: I try to stay away from like anywhere likely it
Speaker 4: could be like overlap, like because there's so you can
Speaker 4: get so far out there around here, you know, like where.
Speaker 1: There's no houses at all.
Speaker 4: I try to go to those places, but there's reports
Speaker 4: coming consistently through there. So we're gonna check that out
Speaker 4: and see what we can find.
Speaker 1: Oh that's cool, you know. That reminded me of something
Speaker 1: that's super big. Aggrig aggravation. By the way, I was
Speaker 1: at the museum today. It's it's Wednesday tomorrow, Thanksgiving for
Speaker 1: the people listening, that's when we record these things. So
Speaker 1: I was at the museum today for a few hours
Speaker 1: or whatever. I only took a I only worked for
Speaker 1: a little over a half day because of my dog.
Speaker 1: Of course, I want to come and make sure she
Speaker 1: wasn't gonna crap all over the bottom floor of the
Speaker 1: house like she did when I was gone. And then uh,
Speaker 1: but so before I left, I like, well, oh, there's
Speaker 1: a message on the machine. I'm just gonna double check
Speaker 1: this or erase it if it's old. And it was
Speaker 1: a woman's voice. I'm not going to say the name
Speaker 1: or anything says yeah, my name is so and so,
Speaker 1: and uh, I don't know if this is the number
Speaker 1: I'm supposed to call. But I saw something and I
Speaker 1: don't mean it might have been a bigfoot and I
Speaker 1: got it on the video on my phone. A couple
Speaker 1: of us did, A couple of my friends, and is
Speaker 1: this the number for that? My name is so and so,
Speaker 1: and you can call me back my numbers five oh
Speaker 1: three click, and then it hung up. It hung up,
Speaker 1: and then of course, you know, I what and I
Speaker 1: fumbled back through the incoming calls. You know, on the
Speaker 1: store phone. This is the store's phone, and the number
Speaker 1: that came in at the time she called this was yesterday.
Speaker 1: By the way, the number she came at the time
Speaker 1: she called was a number form like six oh one
Speaker 1: area code or something like that. So I called back,
Speaker 1: and then I called Nico the manager, and said, oh yeah,
Speaker 1: that came that yesterday. I called her back to and anyway,
Speaker 1: that was yesterday. So somebody here in the Portland area,
Speaker 1: at least someone who has a Portland phone number. She
Speaker 1: and her friends apparently possibly saw a sasquatch. Release think
Speaker 1: they did, to the point where they called the Bigfoot
Speaker 1: Museum to tell them about it, and has video. So
Speaker 1: so that's making me pull my eyeballs out. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: might have been yesterday, might have been the day before.
Speaker 1: Oh man, as I rained that hard since I got home.
Speaker 1: There's probably prints in the ground because it's all soft
Speaker 1: and muddy and video. But man, such as the life
Speaker 1: of a big Footer. It's like, oh, Cliff, there's no
Speaker 1: Murphy's Laws, just a blah blah blah up here. There
Speaker 1: clearly is Murphy's Law guaranteed guaranteed. Yeah, anybody who says
Speaker 1: that hasn't been big footing very long. I think we
Speaker 1: got some good stuff caught up today. Fantastic. Yeah, of
Speaker 1: course are our guests today. And I may get the
Speaker 1: name wrong, Like, it's just so funny. I've known of
Speaker 1: these people and what seems like forever forever actually, and
Speaker 1: I've kind of known them emailed here and there and stuff,
Speaker 1: and then lo and behold once a year so they
Speaker 1: start wandering into the museum and I'm greeting them and
Speaker 1: they and I remember last year it was like, hey, Cliff,
Speaker 1: I'm so and so, oh my god, I know you are.
Speaker 1: And then this year the other half came in. I said, what,
Speaker 1: why haven't you been on our podcast yet? So yeah,
Speaker 1: I believe the name of the thing and correct me
Speaker 1: if I'm wrong. Of course. I think it's the Michigan
Speaker 1: Recording Project and the two folks that headed are so
Speaker 1: deeply involved they might as well head it are here
Speaker 1: with This is Jim and Stacy Flowers for our old
Speaker 1: for like old folks like you and I Bobs. That's
Speaker 1: a name out of the past, all right, So Jim
Speaker 1: and Stacy Flowers, welcome to Bigfoot and Beyond with me
Speaker 1: and that guy. Thank you nic here, Yeah, thank you
Speaker 1: so much for setting aside a little time. We made
Speaker 1: this arrangement a couple of weeks ago. I mean, Stacy
Speaker 1: was in the museum I think like last month or
Speaker 1: two months ago, I don't know, and Jim was in
Speaker 1: last year if I remember correctly, although I do have
Speaker 1: a pretty lastic sense of time. But how fortuitous to
Speaker 1: run across y'all, and now to have you on the
Speaker 1: podcast and your perfect guests, because I think that you're
Speaker 1: best known for the vocalizations that have been recorded off
Speaker 1: one particular property, although again I'm wrong about a lot
Speaker 1: of stuff, so maybe I'm wrong about that too.
Speaker 5: That's right, we've been on that property for since two
Speaker 5: thousand and five.
Speaker 1: Since two thousand and five, that seems like forever ago.
Speaker 1: But how long before that were you big footing?
Speaker 5: Oh? Well, me only a couple of years. Jim, he
Speaker 5: was actually eight when he had his probable sighting and
Speaker 5: started chasing reports and newspaper articles and that kind of thing.
Speaker 1: Eight years old, So, Jim, I wasn't even where you
Speaker 1: had a sighting. Why don't you tell us about that?
Speaker 1: To get us going here.
Speaker 6: Basically, my grandma lived on the edge of an apple
Speaker 6: orchard at Athens, Michigan. One day I was out playing
Speaker 6: in the yard, saw a huge thing walk through just
Speaker 6: the inside corner of the field and the orchard there.
Speaker 3: It just disappeared. Scared the hell out of me.
Speaker 6: I ran back inside and didn't go back out the
Speaker 6: rest of the day, probably about wasn't A week later,
Speaker 6: there was an article in the newspaper about another bigfoot
Speaker 6: sighting had a track find in the area, and I
Speaker 6: just kind of like, you know, my I was in
Speaker 6: mind put two and two together, and I just started
Speaker 6: reading everything I could and finding every newspaper article I could,
Speaker 6: and everything just kind of snowball from there.
Speaker 1: So how did you get back in? This is back
Speaker 1: in the day. I'm assuming that you know what you're like.
Speaker 1: I imagine you're about my age, and I turned fifty three
Speaker 1: next week, so I'm assuming that you're about my age, Coose.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm just a little bit older than you.
Speaker 5: Then.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so this is back back, pre internet and whatnot.
Speaker 1: So your only real sources of information were books, which
Speaker 1: I still advocate as being the primary source of information
Speaker 1: for all of our listeners, even beyond podcasts and television
Speaker 1: and stuff, and also newspaper articles. What did you do?
Speaker 1: Did you collect them and put them in a scrap
Speaker 1: book or something, or did you just read them and
Speaker 1: take notes or did you just read? What did you
Speaker 1: do it? Back then?
Speaker 3: At the time they had a scrap book?
Speaker 6: I cut them out and stuck them with tape on
Speaker 6: an old photograph book that my grandma had and just
Speaker 6: kept going from there. Unfortunately, she also thought that with
Speaker 6: the interest in Bigfoot, that I wanted everything from the
Speaker 6: National inquirer. So I had a scrap book full of
Speaker 6: everything from whoever had the Bigfoot's baby to the latest
Speaker 6: flavor of the week from the local newspaper, some of
Speaker 6: the national ones when they picked up the story.
Speaker 1: Well that's sweet, though, that's, however misguided that might be.
Speaker 1: That's very very sweet of her, you got to admit, So,
Speaker 1: do you still have this Footo album.
Speaker 3: I don't think I do.
Speaker 6: My mom may have it somewhere, But my grandma passed
Speaker 6: away several years ago when I was stationed in the
Speaker 6: maybe and a lot of her stuff that was there
Speaker 6: just kind of disappeared. The house she lived in and
Speaker 6: got sold. So even the apple orchard is now a
Speaker 6: small subdivision.
Speaker 1: Sure, sure they had they put up a parking lot,
Speaker 1: so to speak. Yeah, well, gosh, So so you started
Speaker 1: around eight Were you doing field investigations? Man like, did
Speaker 1: you ride your bike over like, you know, like a
Speaker 1: stranger thing sort of thing and I doing a field
Speaker 1: or it was just collecting information at that point at.
Speaker 3: That point, collecting information.
Speaker 6: I think I actually as well as I could investigated
Speaker 6: the first report, I was probably about thirteen.
Speaker 3: I don't remember the details of it.
Speaker 6: It was a local kid who thought he saw something
Speaker 6: in the words too, so we just kind of like
Speaker 6: compared notes and went from there.
Speaker 3: I don't even remember his name. It was so long ago.
Speaker 1: That's cool. That's really neat now, Stacy, Yeah, how did
Speaker 1: you get involved in this whole subject here?
Speaker 5: Well, my interest goes back to when I was eleven
Speaker 5: or twelve, way back to the mid seventies when it
Speaker 5: was all kind of first blew up. In the first place,
Speaker 5: there was a movie coming out in the theaters and
Speaker 5: I can't remember the name of it, may have been
Speaker 5: Sasquatched something or other, but there was a commercial would
Speaker 5: come on the television back in the day when you
Speaker 5: had to get up and change the antenna and the
Speaker 5: channel on your big console TV. And in the commercial
Speaker 5: it played this vocalization as long howl. And the first
Speaker 5: time I heard that, it freaked me out so bad.
Speaker 5: And I don't know why. I almost had like a
Speaker 5: physical visceral reaction to it, you know. So here's this
Speaker 5: kid getting scared of this commercial, and every time it
Speaker 5: would come on and have to get up and change
Speaker 5: a channel real quick before that sound would happen. And
Speaker 5: from then on, as a kid and growing up, Bigfoot
Speaker 5: was like my boogeyman. That was the thing I was
Speaker 5: afraid of in the dark. It was a thing that
Speaker 5: freaked me out when the family would go camping, you know,
Speaker 5: and I always just felt like something was out there,
Speaker 5: but I never really I kind of I didn't really
Speaker 5: lose interest, but there was nothing to keep my interest
Speaker 5: for a long long time, many years and when I
Speaker 5: first got online one day, I was thinking around just
Speaker 5: kind of learning how to use the internet and the
Speaker 5: computer and all of that, and I said, Hi, what
Speaker 5: if people are still talking about pickfoot? And I did
Speaker 5: a search, and god, you know, when all was out there,
Speaker 5: tons of stuff. This is. This is in the day
Speaker 5: when there were only like discussion forums and individual websites
Speaker 5: and things. And I was shocked by how many people
Speaker 5: were still talking about this and making claims. And the
Speaker 5: more I read the it sounded like there's maybe really
Speaker 5: something to this. And before I knew it, I was
Speaker 5: just hoping the subject. And so I spent a brief
Speaker 5: time in the BFRO back in two thousand and three,
Speaker 5: I believe, and then the group that we camp with
Speaker 5: got together in two thousand and four, the large group
Speaker 5: that got together that had met quote unquote met on
Speaker 5: the Bigfoot forums way back in its early days, and
Speaker 5: we had a weekend camping trip, and you know, people
Speaker 5: have similar mindsets kind of split off into different groups
Speaker 5: and things, and that led to us getting together and
Speaker 5: doing our thing, and then we started on this property
Speaker 5: in two thousand and five.
Speaker 1: Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo.
Speaker 1: We'll be right back after these messages. So three to
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Speaker 1: six months, like, what would you do in three to
Speaker 1: six months? I'm going to give me six months go
Speaker 1: squatching squad of course, of course, And how much do
Speaker 1: you think is going to get done during that time?
Speaker 1: In squatching you're going to see one in six months?
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Speaker 1: How did you find the property?
Speaker 5: Well, there was a BFO investigator named Casey Carnes who
Speaker 5: Paul Willison and I were you had you talked to him? Okay?
Speaker 5: So just Paul and I had talked to him each
Speaker 5: separately online a couple of times, and he was supposed
Speaker 5: to join us in our original spot one evening, and
Speaker 5: he was going to bring out a guy. He that
Speaker 5: got a guy I'm going to bring out. He's got
Speaker 5: some stories, He's got some things happening on his property.
Speaker 5: I'm going to bring him out with me and you
Speaker 5: guys can meet him and talk to him and stuff.
Speaker 5: So Casey Launda not coming because his mother was sick,
Speaker 5: but this guy with her, I should say, convoluted instructions
Speaker 5: and way back on dirt two tracks managed to find
Speaker 5: us after dark and the landowner he came out by himself,
Speaker 5: spent the night and we talked and talked and talked,
Speaker 5: and he liked us. We liked Tim, so he invited
Speaker 5: us out to the property and we went later that
Speaker 5: summer for the first time.
Speaker 1: So it was a BFR report basically, what now? What
Speaker 1: was in more? You know, have to tell me everything,
Speaker 1: of course, or we'dn't use your discretion because there are
Speaker 1: a couple of people listen to this. What was in
Speaker 1: that report? Was it just a siding, was a track
Speaker 1: fight or was it ongoing stuff? I mean, what how
Speaker 1: aware of the situation were you going into this?
Speaker 3: And I can answer that one because I've seen a
Speaker 3: newspaper article for it.
Speaker 5: Well, there was a newspaper article.
Speaker 6: There were actually two one days back to the seventies
Speaker 6: where basically his grandmother had a incident where it came
Speaker 6: through with ut giant footprints and was picking pea pods,
Speaker 6: and I guess the local paper came out and kind
Speaker 6: of investigated to the best of their ability, but didn't
Speaker 6: find anything. The other one was in the uh there
Speaker 6: was an incident where several boys I used to run
Speaker 6: a hant how he used to run a hot house,
Speaker 6: and several boys basically saw a bigfoot. So the local
Speaker 6: you know, kids, one tells the other, the next one
Speaker 6: tells the next one. Next week, all the newspapers out
Speaker 6: there with reporters or a reporter from the local paper
Speaker 6: doing interviews and checking out on the incident. And that
Speaker 6: showed up in the local paper. And I think that's
Speaker 6: basically what the BFR report was actually entailing when that
Speaker 6: came out too.
Speaker 5: But it turns out that Casey and this guy had
Speaker 5: known each other years before. Neither one was familiar with
Speaker 5: the other's interest in or background until this article came
Speaker 5: out in the newspaper with a reporter had promised he
Speaker 5: wouldn't use his family's name, and he did anyway, Casey
Speaker 5: happened to see the paper and called that guy and said, hey,
Speaker 5: guess what, So that you know the property being worked
Speaker 5: in investigated kind of came out.
Speaker 1: Of that two basically what they call Class C reports.
Speaker 1: It wasn't even a direct observation or anything. It was
Speaker 1: just like, hey, this is happening in this general area
Speaker 1: the property owner. Was he aware of this previous activity?
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, he's lived on or near the property. It's
Speaker 5: family property. But his awareness of these things goes back
Speaker 5: to the seventies.
Speaker 1: Also, And was that because of sightings or footprints or
Speaker 1: weird things or all of it, all of it. Okay, okay,
Speaker 1: how big of an area are we talking about, do
Speaker 1: you think? I mean, not just the property, I mean
Speaker 1: the property could be two acres and still have a
Speaker 1: ton of stuff going on. But how big it is
Speaker 1: this green belt or like pocket of woods that these
Speaker 1: things are frequenting.
Speaker 6: Well, well, some of us been sold off because we
Speaker 6: actually bought some of it. Six hundred acres at one point,
Speaker 6: maybe just a little bit more. But it's also basically
Speaker 6: right on the edge of the Manistee National Forest, within
Speaker 6: my easy walking distance.
Speaker 1: Now, what sort of things do you think, before we
Speaker 1: get into the vocalizations and your individual experiences, what sort
Speaker 1: of things does this particular property and the locality of
Speaker 1: where people are and where you're finding these things go on.
Speaker 1: What sort of things are here that you think might
Speaker 1: be drawing the Sasquatches in repeatedly.
Speaker 5: Well, it's right on a river, a very windy river
Speaker 5: that feeds into the most major river system I think
Speaker 5: in the state.
Speaker 3: Pretty much.
Speaker 5: Yeah, we're we're very close to the Muskegon River. That
Speaker 5: would probably be the big thing. There is a lot
Speaker 5: of farmland, but to the north and to the east
Speaker 5: of where we are specifically, there's just miles and miles
Speaker 5: and miles and miles.
Speaker 1: Of woods, Okay, and that farmland. What do they grow
Speaker 1: on it? Do you know? The most common crop? Is
Speaker 1: it corn? Or is it alfalfa?
Speaker 6: Or is it corn alfalfa? Oh varies because sty beams.
Speaker 6: It varies because of the when they do it, they
Speaker 6: rotate the cross for the nitrogen content.
Speaker 3: So it's not the same crop every year.
Speaker 6: Apparently I'm not a farmer, but I grew up in
Speaker 6: farm country and apparently that also nitrogen content and the
Speaker 6: soil or something.
Speaker 1: I was thinking because you said corn and then alfalfa
Speaker 1: of course, and so all of those things are deer magnets,
Speaker 1: which is what I was kind of thinking about, Like
Speaker 1: what's drawing in the prey species here? And maybe those
Speaker 1: farms have something to do with it.
Speaker 5: There's a lot of fruit trees natural like wild apple trees,
Speaker 5: a lot of berry bushes.
Speaker 6: Blackberries, raspberries, red raspberries, blueberries, mushrooms. Pretty much that in
Speaker 6: the river is a designated trout stream, So there's a
Speaker 6: huge bunch of food there, plus crayfish if you're if
Speaker 6: they're really wanted something that small or hard to eat.
Speaker 1: So when you first started investigating the property and its vicinity,
Speaker 1: what were some of the clues that you might have gotten,
Speaker 1: either things you heard or found or saw that kind
Speaker 1: of indicated you were on the right track and you
Speaker 1: found a good area.
Speaker 5: Honestly, the first time that I, well, Paul and I
Speaker 5: went first, and it was just a day trip and
Speaker 5: driving in, you know, you're looking at that north south
Speaker 5: road and there's there's houses and there's cabins and farmmen,
Speaker 5: and I'm thinking, okay, there is no way, but at
Speaker 5: least it's a nice day for a drive and a
Speaker 5: walk in the woods. So I wasn't expecting anything, and
Speaker 5: we really once we got back to the woods and
Speaker 5: I saw, you know, the actual layout of the land
Speaker 5: later land, it was like, Okay, we've got we've got
Speaker 5: nice water here, we've got tons of woods. I guess
Speaker 5: it's possible. And it was I think our first big
Speaker 5: overnight trip there that we got our one and only
Speaker 5: vocalization of that year, which wasn't convincing. You know, I
Speaker 5: think we were still leaning towards Okay, that's somebody messing
Speaker 5: around with us, and we kind of were for the
Speaker 5: first couple of years, not necessar necessarily thinking we were
Speaker 5: being hoaxed, but always keeping that thought in the forefront,
Speaker 5: just in case.
Speaker 1: How for a part of the homesteads spread in this area,
Speaker 1: is that everybody had like five acres or something or
Speaker 1: is it just ridiculous large because you mentioned six hundred
Speaker 1: acres a little while ago, Is that the standard?
Speaker 5: No, I don't think so. It just depends. There are
Speaker 5: some people who you know, have a house just sound
Speaker 5: like four or five acres. There's some farms that are
Speaker 5: hundreds of acres. There's dairy farms too, you know, cattle,
Speaker 5: and some of those are big.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 6: There's also a lot of seasonal cabins that aren't occupied
Speaker 6: year round. So for you know, five months out a year,
Speaker 6: nobody is there.
Speaker 1: Okay, so you start going onto this property a little bit.
Speaker 1: You hear a vocalization, but nothing you can take to
Speaker 1: the bank. It sounds like, but you've devoted so much
Speaker 1: of your time to this one location and it can't
Speaker 1: just be convenience. What really turned your head around is say, wow,
Speaker 1: we need to focus all of our efforts here. What
Speaker 1: was that.
Speaker 5: The first few years, the first couple of years we
Speaker 5: were there. You know, we didn't hear anything for the
Speaker 5: rest of that year. That was two thousand and five.
Speaker 5: In two thousand and six, we started hearing them much more.
Speaker 5: Six and seven, it was we could almost time it
Speaker 5: to within five minutes or so of about eleven thirty
Speaker 5: at night, we'd start hearing these screams from across the river.
Speaker 5: If they came a little bit earlier, they were coming
Speaker 5: from the south. If they came later, they were coming
Speaker 5: from the north. So good antos, you know, pattering this
Speaker 5: travel you know this north south travel route. They were
Speaker 5: taking the turning point for us where we were like, okay,
Speaker 5: this is the real deal. Was that our landowner had
Speaker 5: gotten a video clip and we went up one day
Speaker 5: just expecting to see a vague image of you know,
Speaker 5: a dark thing moving through the woods. We expect blurry
Speaker 5: and you know, completely inconclusive, and it blew our socks off.
Speaker 5: The video did the video did? He'd been our guy,
Speaker 5: and we've seen his boxes of videotapes. He his whole
Speaker 5: life has had video cameras and has gone out and
Speaker 5: just videotape wildlife, miscellaneous, frogs, deer, you know, everything, And
Speaker 5: he'd been out there sitting to the east of Directly
Speaker 5: to the east of where our camp site is is
Speaker 5: a field, and he was sitting at what we call
Speaker 5: the north Woods. He was sitting on the north wood
Speaker 5: line and a couple of cement blocks he had sitting
Speaker 5: out there, and he heard a couple of what he
Speaker 5: thought some pig storms. He thought it was a bear,
Speaker 5: and he turned the camera over that way, and in
Speaker 5: this video you could see a couple of pine trees
Speaker 5: and he's kind of panning back and forth, and you
Speaker 5: see what we thought were trunks. You see a couple
Speaker 5: of those trunks start moving and as you watch, this
Speaker 5: figure comes out from behind those trees and was walking north,
Speaker 5: drops down into like a little gully there. You can
Speaker 5: you're only seeing it maybe from what knees up. Maybe yeah,
Speaker 5: you could see the butt, but I don't think we could.
Speaker 5: I don't think we would really see the knees at
Speaker 5: that point anyway. And it was just like you know
Speaker 5: in the era, yeah, the Patterson film, where you can
Speaker 5: see like the muscle contraction, like in the Deltards, it's
Speaker 5: a shoulder swinging back, you know, you can see the
Speaker 5: muscle movement in the back. You could see that clearly, clearly,
Speaker 5: and it keeps going. It drops it down into this
Speaker 5: gully where you can't see it at all. So he
Speaker 5: takes off running further into the north woods, thinking if
Speaker 5: it's going to follow that gully. It sort of loops
Speaker 5: around to the right and comes out, excuse me, near
Speaker 5: a hunting blinds. It's been up there for years. That
Speaker 5: was up there for years. I don't think it's up
Speaker 5: there now. And yeah, and you see from a really
Speaker 5: long distance, not really long distance, but you just kind
Speaker 5: of very vaguely see some movement between the trees. And
Speaker 5: then it comes up back out of the gully near
Speaker 5: that hunting blind and takes off and continues moving right
Speaker 5: along the edge of that gully off to like the
Speaker 5: east northeast. And yeah, it was really like, even just
Speaker 5: thinking about it now, we were just we were just speechless,
Speaker 5: just speechless. I didn't realize we were watching. Jim had
Speaker 5: taken a knee on the floor. We'd gone, and he'd
Speaker 5: gone in the house. He had a big screen like
Speaker 5: projector TV in there. Had taken a knee on the floor,
Speaker 5: and I had a hand on his shoulder and I
Speaker 5: didn't realize I was squeezing his shoulder so hard just
Speaker 5: watching this. I yeah, it was. The video has since
Speaker 5: degraded to the point where you just can't see anything
Speaker 5: on it, which is sad.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was. I always advocate for the digitization of
Speaker 1: all magnetic tapes and v vhs is and all that stuff.
Speaker 1: And because that's exactly what happens, you play it and
Speaker 1: it just over time that wears a way.
Speaker 6: Showed him exactly how to do it, gave him the
Speaker 6: equipment to do it. But he is not what I
Speaker 6: would call the most technologically adept.
Speaker 3: He's even worse than I am.
Speaker 6: So the difference, I guess I don't tend to procrastinate
Speaker 6: as much as he does.
Speaker 1: But well, I often wonder how many good pieces of
Speaker 1: footage are out there that are going to start cascading
Speaker 1: upon us after discovery.
Speaker 5: There's got to be more. There have to be more.
Speaker 1: Oh, certainly, I would, I would think. So I've heard
Speaker 1: about some, I've just never seen it. So so you
Speaker 1: saw this, and you holy smoke star here. I've heard
Speaker 1: them a couple of times here. I don't know if
Speaker 1: you ever found any footprints or anything, but there there
Speaker 1: was enough indication at this location to start devoting some
Speaker 1: resources and time. Oh yeah, yeah, very good. And what
Speaker 1: was what what was the perhaps the procedure, what what
Speaker 1: became standard operating procedure for trying to work this property?
Speaker 1: What would you really focus on and how would it
Speaker 1: get done?
Speaker 5: Atually it has changed and now we're just in it
Speaker 5: to experience what we can experience. But initially when we're
Speaker 5: trying to get data, trying to get video, trying to
Speaker 5: you know, we've run the recorders from day one basically,
Speaker 5: but you know, some one of the guys or some
Speaker 5: of the guys would go out in the early evening
Speaker 5: and sit up in a tree, stand quietly and wait
Speaker 5: for things to happen.
Speaker 6: Going across the field where you guys are making noise
Speaker 6: and camp and sitting there by myself.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, there's that there.
Speaker 6: What else walking during the day, trying to find footprints
Speaker 6: and any piece of viable soil there is?
Speaker 3: We found some, but.
Speaker 5: It's we've had a lot.
Speaker 6: Touch uncastable because of the sand and.
Speaker 5: Everything else, or they've been in water.
Speaker 6: Or they've been in water. Found the one in the
Speaker 6: river bank. Tried to cast that that did not go well.
Speaker 3: Good God. Check for hair samples.
Speaker 6: There's a lot of barbed wire all over the place,
Speaker 6: so it's a constant to just walking down the fence
Speaker 6: line looking for where anything may have come through.
Speaker 3: I think we found deer, raccoons, squirrel.
Speaker 6: Bear, nothing that anybody thought to actually was worth collecting.
Speaker 5: Pet Gil, who used to be part of our group,
Speaker 5: did send one sample someplace one time and it turned
Speaker 5: out to be I think deer, wasn't it cow? Cattle?
Speaker 5: I think it was cow too. Yeah, So we didn't
Speaker 5: really have a routine necessarily at the time, pluse.
Speaker 6: Back then, I was pretty much working seven days a week.
Speaker 3: I do have a lot of it.
Speaker 1: Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo.
Speaker 1: Will be right back after these messages. Did either of
Speaker 1: you ever put eyes on one of these things while
Speaker 1: on the property?
Speaker 5: Yes, yes, yeah, Jim and I had gone up. There
Speaker 5: was another another brief video that one of his kids
Speaker 5: had taped his bottom his rabbit touch over but of
Speaker 5: one walking along the woodline east to west into the
Speaker 5: late afternoon sun. And I thought at first that's a
Speaker 5: mask because it looked so distorted and ridiculous and white
Speaker 5: and shiny, and then you see a blink. But after
Speaker 5: and we figured that distorted look was because of the
Speaker 5: sun reflecting off that oily skin. But after that, we
Speaker 5: spent some time going up and just sitting there's a
Speaker 5: large oak tree at the top of a hill the
Speaker 5: edge of the field, and just scanning, scanning that north
Speaker 5: woodline for hours. And there was one night that had
Speaker 5: vocals from across the river and from two different locations
Speaker 5: across the river, and we were hearing a bunch a
Speaker 5: bunch of sounds in the river, loud splashing, like little
Speaker 5: plunging noises, and then we got a couple of grunts
Speaker 5: and one came from the north, the other one came
Speaker 5: from the west down what we call lot And as
Speaker 5: Jim is looking. By this point, we've moved off the
Speaker 5: hill and towards the fire, which was down to just
Speaker 5: embers at that point, and Jim's looking down the slot
Speaker 5: with the night vision. He says, take a look at
Speaker 5: this and tell me if you see what I see.
Speaker 5: And I didn't do it because I was freaked out.
Speaker 5: This was a new thing. I would do it now,
Speaker 5: and I kicked myself from not looking now, but at
Speaker 5: that time this was a new thing and I was
Speaker 5: kind of scared. I didn't look but he well you
Speaker 5: can just write what you saw.
Speaker 3: Basically, it was.
Speaker 6: I guess like a imagine Shaquille O'Neil walking down a
Speaker 6: trail towards you, but he's actually bigger than he actually
Speaker 6: has with wider shoulders, and then as you see him,
Speaker 6: he just turns and basically walks quietly down a forty
Speaker 6: foot embankment and you're just sitting there, going.
Speaker 3: Somebody else, please look at this and make sure.
Speaker 5: I'm not crazy steep embankment.
Speaker 6: And at that point it was just like a recovered
Speaker 6: ran up to a look to see if I could
Speaker 6: still see it, and it was just gone. Whether there's
Speaker 6: a trail that runs kind of like north northeast to
Speaker 6: west southwesternly right along the river bank, so I'm assuming
Speaker 6: it went one direction or the other along the trail.
Speaker 5: Do you find prints, Well, yeah, yeah, we found lots
Speaker 5: and lots of tracks trackways. Again, they're in sand. Basically,
Speaker 5: you get a little detail here and there. The big
Speaker 5: giveaway that is the step length and the stride lengths.
Speaker 5: You know, you're getting fifty to fifty two inch steps.
Speaker 6: The thing is to a lot of that, you're not
Speaker 6: getting tracks on at the ground, so hard most of
Speaker 6: the time that even like a you know, four thousand
Speaker 6: pounds tractor doesn't even leave tread marks.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's either it's either compacted down so hard like that,
Speaker 5: or it's just sand and it fills back in. But uh,
Speaker 5: back to the visuals. The first well, my son and
Speaker 5: I had a night where we saw something at the
Speaker 5: edge of the field and he said to me, walk
Speaker 5: over this way with me to the cars. I got
Speaker 5: a pee, so I said, okay, I want to walk
Speaker 5: with you. And so he's around the corner. We trade places.
Speaker 5: I get around the corner and he said, Mom, look
Speaker 5: up there, so I think it is And it looked
Speaker 5: like a person standing there was, you know, sideways to
Speaker 5: us with a hoodie up and we used to have
Speaker 5: to go up to the top of the hill to
Speaker 5: get cell phone signal. And I said, no, that's just
Speaker 5: our landowner with the hoodie up. He's like, Mom, I
Speaker 5: don't think so that's way too big. I'm at this point,
Speaker 5: he's like nineteen years old in the size of a sasquatch.
Speaker 5: But my you know, mama bear thing is kicking in
Speaker 5: and I'm like, nope, keep calm, that's just our landowner
Speaker 5: making a phone call, there's no light or anything. So
Speaker 5: we go back to the fire, grab the night vision
Speaker 5: and walk back over there and our landowner, everybody's accounted for,
Speaker 5: and he comes walking from the opposite direction from the
Speaker 5: north Woods with Paul. Yeah, and whatever had been standing
Speaker 5: there was gone. But it was only Silawett that we saw.
Speaker 5: There was no detail whatsoever. The following year though, Fourth
Speaker 5: of July, that's one of our guys had literally in
Speaker 5: the headlights full on, no question about it, sighting. And
Speaker 5: it was fourth of July weekend, which is historically been
Speaker 5: a very very active weekend for us, and there were
Speaker 5: just vocal after vocal after focal after vocal, and we
Speaker 5: could hear the sound travels so well out there. We
Speaker 5: could hear a mile away at one of the cabins,
Speaker 5: somebody was having a party, and so Mike took his
Speaker 5: car out just to see where the party was so
Speaker 5: we would know. And on the way back in he
Speaker 5: turned a corner, came up over this little rise and
Speaker 5: crossing the east west road there, going from north to south,
Speaker 5: there was one right in the road, and when his
Speaker 5: headlights hit it, he had just enough time to register
Speaker 5: what it was and watch it finish crossing the road,
Speaker 5: and that was our first no question about it.
Speaker 1: Citing now you mentioned the sound quality of the area,
Speaker 1: like the I'm not even sure what to call it,
Speaker 1: but how how well sound travels in this particular area.
Speaker 1: But the vocalizations I've heard from you seem to be
Speaker 1: very very close, and not all of them, of course,
Speaker 1: not all of them, but some of them seem to
Speaker 1: be fairly close. Would you say the vast majority of
Speaker 1: vocalizations before we start listening to these are from a
Speaker 1: good distance or where you focus on the really close stuff,
Speaker 1: because you had a strategy that managed to make it
Speaker 1: work out.
Speaker 5: They most of the vocalizations come from right across the room.
Speaker 5: We're the campus at the top of a high river bank,
Speaker 5: and then most of the vocalizations come from across the river.
Speaker 5: We've gotten them from the north Woods and a lot
Speaker 5: of them from the south Woods too, but most of
Speaker 5: what we record is within I don't know quarter of.
Speaker 3: My own about that sounds why we're.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, I mean they come in close.
Speaker 1: Do you think they're reacting to your presence which is
Speaker 1: why they're vocalizing, or like, do they see you? You
Speaker 1: think across the river hear you perhaps, or do you
Speaker 1: think they're doing this activity anyway?
Speaker 3: I think we're in the way from where they want
Speaker 3: to go.
Speaker 1: It's a little perturbed with you guys.
Speaker 6: And that's always been my impression, at least because that
Speaker 6: trail there was before we started camping there. Basically that
Speaker 6: would be a trail the easy, you know, most direct
Speaker 6: route from coming across the river at wand of Shallows
Speaker 6: Points to get to the north Woods. And now we're
Speaker 6: there on occasion, so we're in the way.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I see, that's interesting. That's very interesting. Of course
Speaker 1: it's an assumption, and I realized that, but I mean,
Speaker 1: what else do we have at this point?
Speaker 3: Yeah, you don't.
Speaker 5: Yeah, said though, we haven't gotten really distant vocals in
Speaker 5: a long time, but we used to those early years.
Speaker 5: You know, we would hear them for what sounded like
Speaker 5: a mile away, you know, here and there so and
Speaker 5: in that case it wasn't because of us.
Speaker 6: No, I don't know if they're locator calls or what
Speaker 6: they are, but I saw them.
Speaker 3: Figured it out.
Speaker 6: It's been twenty years almost of the same location. I'm
Speaker 6: still trying to figure it out.
Speaker 1: So well, let's take a listen to a couple of
Speaker 1: these things I'm looking at. We have kind of limited time,
Speaker 1: and you have so many recordings. Our producer Matt Prutt,
Speaker 1: who's of course on the line with us, he's taken
Speaker 1: the opportunity to go and kind of weed them down
Speaker 1: to four four representative clips that great to share. And
Speaker 1: of course we're even running out of time here, so
Speaker 1: whatever we don't get to now, we'll bump that over
Speaker 1: to our members section and our members can hear the
Speaker 1: rest of the vocalizations. Okay, so why don't we start
Speaker 1: out with this lie two thousand and seven combo vocals.
Speaker 1: What you want to tell us what was going on
Speaker 1: when this happened here before we listen to it? Or
Speaker 1: should we just jump right into it?
Speaker 5: I go ahead and jump right into it.
Speaker 1: Okay, So we have a two different vocalizers or you
Speaker 1: think it's the same vocalizer.
Speaker 5: There, two different, two different And when I labeled at
Speaker 5: combo vocals, it was because it was the first time
Speaker 5: that we'd heard two different types at the same time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would say that the first one might be
Speaker 1: described as a whoop of some sort and the second one,
Speaker 1: what would you describe that as almost like a crow
Speaker 1: call or something I'm not sure.
Speaker 5: We've always called that the AE scream the awe scream.
Speaker 1: I gain that makes sense. That totally makes sense. And
Speaker 1: were there knocks in there as well? I couldn't. Is
Speaker 1: that trying something else?
Speaker 5: I don't remember. I think there may have been. But yeah,
Speaker 5: we'd put up a tree stand, put probably twenty five
Speaker 5: feet in a tree on our side of the river
Speaker 5: early in the year, like in April, to let it
Speaker 5: just kind of become part of the landscape there. And
Speaker 5: earlier in the year, Paul, who was in the tree
Speaker 5: stand that night, watched as Jim and I came back
Speaker 5: from the other side of the river. We'd gone over
Speaker 5: to sit in a ground blind and just see if
Speaker 5: anything happened by Nothing did, but Paul watched us through
Speaker 5: night vision come back through that section across the river.
Speaker 5: The night before this, Jim had been up there and
Speaker 5: five minutes after he got back down we got a
Speaker 5: whoop a turf from across the river. So this night
Speaker 5: this happened, that whoop the os scream, that's all we
Speaker 5: heard from camp. Paul came back and let us know
Speaker 5: that from where he was sitting right there, he could
Speaker 5: hear these kind of grunts and huffs and low, low sounds,
Speaker 5: and he could also hear something else doing a little
Speaker 5: bit further north on the river. But he also watched
Speaker 5: something he just described as dark and massive just kind
Speaker 5: of rise up and move off behind the trees right there,
Speaker 5: And it was right where Jim and I had walked.
Speaker 5: He had walked, watched us walk from that area and
Speaker 5: across the river. He said, it was just compared to us,
Speaker 5: just massive.
Speaker 1: Those are some cool vocalizations. And you think these are
Speaker 1: just a few hundred yards away or something.
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, just just across the river. The woops came
Speaker 5: yards Yeah, probably the oscreen. The roops were down closer
Speaker 5: to the river, so a little closer.
Speaker 1: I'm uh. There was such a high quality recording it.
Speaker 1: First of all, congratulations on that great job. But having
Speaker 1: done my fair share of sasquatch recordings over the years,
Speaker 1: I think Bubba would have to this with how good
Speaker 1: a quality recording you just played for us. It must
Speaker 1: have been phenomenal in person, because recordings pale in comparison
Speaker 1: to what you actually hear with your own ears.
Speaker 5: They do volume wise, yeah, they also pick up a
Speaker 5: lot of stuff that we don't hear with our own
Speaker 5: ears too.
Speaker 1: Ah, A good point. So how did that, like any
Speaker 1: did this activity that particular night in the two thousand
Speaker 1: and seven did it continue all night long? And because
Speaker 1: I know this is a small snippet of what you
Speaker 1: actually recorded, it was extraordinarily active night all night long?
Speaker 1: Or do they come and go and like it went
Speaker 1: dead after a while?
Speaker 5: It went dead after and typically most of the time
Speaker 5: that's what happens. It's kind of like, you know, they
Speaker 5: show their beds and then they take off and that's it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, four hours work for fifteen minutes of fun.
Speaker 3: Right, twenty years of work for like three hours.
Speaker 1: And a couple of sightings, right, time well spent.
Speaker 3: For me.
Speaker 6: The brightside is a kind of made me think that
Speaker 6: maybe they are real because I'd always.
Speaker 3: Wondered when I was a kid, I did I really
Speaker 3: see what I saw? It's like doing really existive.
Speaker 6: I've been wasting a lot of time, But when I
Speaker 6: saw the one now it's like, oh, hey, okay, it
Speaker 6: wasn't a waste of time. Just took thirty years for
Speaker 6: that to happen, but okay.
Speaker 1: Yeah thirty years. You have a few more thirty years
Speaker 1: left in you good stay tuned. For more Bigfoot and
Speaker 1: Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. We'll be right back after
Speaker 1: these messages. Well, why don't we go chronologically? Okay, and
Speaker 1: we can jump over to the next recording, which is
Speaker 1: labeled July two thousand and eight. Display Mister Matt Prue,
Speaker 1: why don't you queue that up for us?
Speaker 2: Oh?
Speaker 1: That was interesting. Clearly started out with a human like sound,
Speaker 1: but you know what sasquatches sound like big dudes in
Speaker 1: the woods, So I mean, that's not a concern for
Speaker 1: me necessarily. And then of course the coyotes jumped in,
Speaker 1: so our listeners, you know, clearly coyotes were present. And
Speaker 1: then at the end I caught some sort of like,
Speaker 1: oh like that kind of thing. Was that Do you
Speaker 1: feel that that was in response to the coyotes or
Speaker 1: was it a separate individual or what did you hear
Speaker 1: with your own years there?
Speaker 5: I no clue. I don't know what it was a response.
Speaker 5: That was the first time we ever heard that kind
Speaker 5: of sam what they kind of call now samurai chatter,
Speaker 5: And that was the first time you ever heard any
Speaker 5: of that.
Speaker 1: So what was the prequel, like, what was the set
Speaker 1: up the context of this particular vocalization what led to that.
Speaker 5: Let me see, I've gotten my notes. I've gotten my
Speaker 5: notes right here.
Speaker 1: You know what, By the way, there's nothing to be
Speaker 1: embarrassed about with that. You sound like I think that
Speaker 1: was a nervous laugh. But the best investigators take notes.
Speaker 1: In fact, everybody on the audience please take note of this,
Speaker 1: they are consulting their notes, which is the power of notes.
Speaker 1: You think you're never going to forget such a thing
Speaker 1: because it was such an earth moving sort of situation.
Speaker 1: When you encounter a sasquatch nonsense, you will forget. Everyone
Speaker 1: should take notes. So thank you very much for demonstrating that,
Speaker 1: even though it sounds like you're a little about it.
Speaker 6: So I'm just along for the ride.
Speaker 1: That's cool, nothing wrong with that.
Speaker 3: I keep up camp basically these days nice, excellent.
Speaker 5: So it was Fast of July weekend. Typically that's our
Speaker 5: big has been our biggest attendance weekend. Our two smaller
Speaker 5: kids we were always with us for the summer, so
Speaker 5: they were there every year. It's a holiday weekend. So
Speaker 5: our people who come from we had Pat and Joe
Speaker 5: who came from the Toronto area. We had Jeff and
Speaker 5: Diane Simon who drove up all the way from Indianapolis
Speaker 5: and for them it's like a seven hour drive and
Speaker 5: they were bringing their kids or kid at the time,
Speaker 5: so it was it was a It was a big
Speaker 5: group in camp. And earlier that night we had at
Speaker 5: twelve ten, we had had like some of those O
Speaker 5: screams across the river. I thought it was done and
Speaker 5: over with. Everybody went to bed about twelve forty five,
Speaker 5: but everybody was still awake when this started happening. And
Speaker 5: that's about Yeah, that's about the context of the whole thing.
Speaker 4: You know, did you guys ever do calls yourselves like
Speaker 4: to elicit or do you just record?
Speaker 5: We've tried a couple of times. It's it's been several
Speaker 5: years since we've even tried that and never really got
Speaker 5: a response to it. We found that every time we
Speaker 5: have responded ourselves, it cuts everything off short. We've tried
Speaker 5: a couple of times to have like me having the
Speaker 5: female voice answer, to see if we could start kind
Speaker 5: of training them to okay, to think, if I yell,
Speaker 5: somebody's going to talk back, so maybe they'll, you know,
Speaker 5: if we talk first, maybe we can get them to
Speaker 5: yell back at us. But you know, a couple of
Speaker 5: times we've done that and say, hey, you know talking
Speaker 5: softly soft female voice, hello, you know we hear you that.
Speaker 5: It just stops, it dead, just.
Speaker 1: Tracks, So you don't in general, if they're going off,
Speaker 1: you just stay quiet and enjoy it. There's no response
Speaker 1: on your part that does anything except for drives them away. Right. Yep,
Speaker 1: you said this was on July fourth. It wouldn't happen
Speaker 1: to be the same July fourth that sighting that you
Speaker 1: mentioned occurred on, would it?
Speaker 5: Let me see the citing Mike's from the car? Yes, yeah,
Speaker 5: which two thousand and nine, so it was the following.
Speaker 1: Year, following year. Okay, And do you you said that
Speaker 1: July fourth is a really good day, like that's the
Speaker 1: best time? Proud Like does it peak at that time
Speaker 1: of year? And if so, is it? Are they do?
Speaker 1: They seem to be present at all times a year.
Speaker 5: We're all that we don't know. Our activity has always
Speaker 5: followed like a bell curve. It starts in the spring,
Speaker 5: sometimes early spring, It ramps up in the middle of
Speaker 5: the summer, and then it starts dying back down again.
Speaker 5: We have heard them into November, I believe.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I right about the start of hunting season because
Speaker 6: we don't really go up there during hunting season.
Speaker 3: No, there's too many rednecks, too many gone right.
Speaker 5: As soon as soon as especially like gun season starts,
Speaker 5: it it just stops, It just stops. There was one
Speaker 5: person who lived across there's a road, that Northwest road
Speaker 5: or that North South road. One person who lived across
Speaker 5: the road claims to have watched one and I don't
Speaker 5: know what time of the year it was, but it
Speaker 5: was snowy walk up his sideyard and across the road
Speaker 5: going like towards the river. But we've never seen or
Speaker 5: heard anything. We're not up there as much either, But
Speaker 5: even the landowner doesn't really see or hear much of anything.
Speaker 4: Is it a topic of conversation amongst the residents that area,
Speaker 4: Like did they see each other at the market?
Speaker 3: Goes? You hear that last night? That kind of stuff
Speaker 3: that I don't know.
Speaker 5: But there's a couple of people, the residents are aware.
Speaker 5: Some of them will talk about it. Some of them,
Speaker 5: you know, we've never talked to.
Speaker 6: So there's the one kid that actually lives across said
Speaker 6: he saw the wine because he found the frinch in
Speaker 6: the snow.
Speaker 5: That's all I was just talking about.
Speaker 3: Oh that's the same person.
Speaker 1: Okay, well, you know what I wanted to know, the
Speaker 1: year round activity, because you've been working this spot, what
Speaker 1: twenty years or more and more or right around twenty years,
Speaker 1: and that quantity of data is of value. I know
Speaker 1: that out where I am. And it also it seems
Speaker 1: in Kentucky and in the in Washington at a location,
Speaker 1: and even in California at another location. The data that's coming
Speaker 1: in strongly indicates that they don't move very far. And
Speaker 1: I'm curious if that's in all areas of the country
Speaker 1: or if it's just the areas that I happen to
Speaker 1: be involved with slightly, because the data seems squarely in
Speaker 1: the corner of these things. More or less they put
Speaker 1: in a particular area. Now people say, oh, well, then
Speaker 1: you put cameras up in that area. The areas like
Speaker 1: ten miles by ten miles or more, you know. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's huge at the end of the day, but not
Speaker 1: really that big for a large terrestrial animal to be
Speaker 1: moving around in a fairly localized sort of place. And
Speaker 1: of course, this is based on very little data because
Speaker 1: of all the quote unquote researchers out there, there's not
Speaker 1: a lot of data coming in. Honestly, there's a lot
Speaker 1: of stories and I heard knocks and Grandma's holler, that
Speaker 1: kind of stuff, but there's not a lot of actual
Speaker 1: data and information and documentation coming in. So we don't
Speaker 1: really know yet. But it sounds like you've been collecting
Speaker 1: good notes for quite a long time. It might be
Speaker 1: really interesting to check into that. I mean, obviously, sightings
Speaker 1: and activity in general will peak at certain times a year,
Speaker 1: but you also have to include the human factor. You
Speaker 1: said so yourself, we don't really go out there that
Speaker 1: time here there's a big human factor involved. But I'd
Speaker 1: be very interesting. I would be very interested to learn
Speaker 1: about some of the seasonal behavior in that sort of way,
Speaker 1: or if there's any evidence like footprints that might be
Speaker 1: attributable to a certain individual in the area in the
Speaker 1: snow or something like that. What's your gut feeling or
Speaker 1: what is the data in your area point to Do
Speaker 1: these things move very far?
Speaker 5: I don't think so. I don't think so, And we theorize,
Speaker 5: of course, we don't know for sure about Our best
Speaker 5: guess is that there are a lot of seater swamps
Speaker 5: the area, and we think they've probably moved deep into
Speaker 5: those cedar swamps.
Speaker 1: Literally, that was my next question is like wintertime, how
Speaker 1: many cedar swamps are in the vicinity? Literally? Yeah, because
Speaker 1: cedar swamps I think are the key to this thing.
Speaker 3: There's also the what the heck's name of it by
Speaker 3: Houghton Lake, Oh, dead Streams Street swamp.
Speaker 6: There that's basically right in the middle of the state
Speaker 6: over there as your head towards like gray Lean Air
Speaker 6: Base and stuff. And except for an occasional military patrol,
Speaker 6: there's really not much it goes on out there, especially
Speaker 6: in the winter. It's I mean, I figured for a
Speaker 6: Sasquatch it's only like less than fifty miles away, so
Speaker 6: they could probably make.
Speaker 3: That in a day.
Speaker 1: But if there's some in your neck of the wood,
Speaker 1: they wouldn't have to go anywhere.
Speaker 3: Yeah, they wouldn't.
Speaker 6: I don't just some of the walks I've taken around
Speaker 6: the area, and there's there's a great area to the
Speaker 6: south of us that's I mean, there aren't any even
Speaker 6: really any houses there. They could hide there easily. But
Speaker 6: even getting back there, we went for a walk, me
Speaker 6: and other friend of ours went for a walk.
Speaker 3: Was it last yeah, last year or maybe even earlier.
Speaker 3: This year. My memory is so bad. If I didn't
Speaker 3: remember things, I forget things.
Speaker 6: We trailbaves here there for probably about three miles, but
Speaker 6: it took us like six hours to do it. So
Speaker 6: anything that got back in there, you're not going to
Speaker 6: find it if it doesn't want to be found.
Speaker 1: And of course, the winners of Michigan or legendary you know,
Speaker 1: I mean there's they're ridiculous. I can't imagine why anyone
Speaker 1: lives there. Nothing personal, of course, I mean you're much
Speaker 1: hardier folk than me.
Speaker 3: It's a snowlishing.
Speaker 1: I mean five ten feet of snow. Imagine on occasions.
Speaker 1: You know, Moneymaker once told me that he found the
Speaker 1: spot that he felt that the sasquatch had dug through
Speaker 1: the snow down to the ground level and was using
Speaker 1: that to just increase the temperature a few degrees for
Speaker 1: its own use. Of course, I think I might have
Speaker 1: mentioned to you, maybe in the museum or maybe blabbing
Speaker 1: about it on the podcast. I think Cedar swamps for
Speaker 1: a big key to their survival during the wintertime. Do
Speaker 1: you have any idea what these local Sasquatches in your
Speaker 1: area are doing to accommodate themselves during.
Speaker 6: The winter I think they're using vacated bear dams or
Speaker 6: sometimes even maybe coyote dems if they want to dig
Speaker 6: down a little bit farther, because I've actually stuck my
Speaker 6: head into a couple of bear dems and some of
Speaker 6: them are have maybe ten feet back and.
Speaker 3: Eight feet high.
Speaker 6: Wow, that one that's on the river bank that you're
Speaker 6: not supposed to know that we.
Speaker 3: Stuck our heads in.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean you could easily stand up in there,
Speaker 6: if you squat down. I mean you could actually sleep
Speaker 6: in there. I mean there's nothing in there, not even
Speaker 6: the bear, which is probably a good thing.
Speaker 1: But that's really interesting because everybody's heard, of course about
Speaker 1: the Olympic Project nest site, and most people are aware
Speaker 1: that there was a second nest site found just a
Speaker 1: ridge or over from the initial nest site. And I
Speaker 1: was privy to that location just probably a week or
Speaker 1: two after it was found. And what we determined by
Speaker 1: our onside investigation is that that particular sasquatch, and we're
Speaker 1: confident it was a sasquatch, by the way, was repurposing
Speaker 1: a bear den that was underneath the log. All the
Speaker 1: all the nesting material was piled out in front of
Speaker 1: this little hole, and I say little, it was probably
Speaker 1: about two and a half maybe three feet wide or
Speaker 1: something like that. And inside whatever it was brought the
Speaker 1: nesting material inside there as well and was digging out
Speaker 1: the hole to make it larger. We retrieved a couple
Speaker 1: bare hair, I believe, from from the nesting material. Well
Speaker 1: inside the inside the den area, there were scrapes on
Speaker 1: the wall inside this this little den was underneath a log,
Speaker 1: a fairly large log, so it kind of dug it.
Speaker 1: A bear apparently had dug out this small den, but
Speaker 1: a sasquatch came along later and was repurposing it. And
Speaker 1: of course some people out there, if we have I
Speaker 1: hope we have skeptical listeners. I always welcome skeptics as
Speaker 1: long as they're they're polite and kind of ask good
Speaker 1: questions and not just jerks, but our skeptics out there
Speaker 1: might be saying, well, how do you know this this
Speaker 1: wasn't a bear thing like bears brought in all this
Speaker 1: nesting material. Well, there's a couple of reasons. Number one
Speaker 1: is outside the hole that was the initial bear den.
Speaker 1: I interpreted the area as having been dug out because
Speaker 1: there was a pile of dirt outside. It's a few
Speaker 1: feet outside like tailings basically, so something was going scooping
Speaker 1: up dirt and piling it out in front of the
Speaker 1: hole to make it larger. And in that pile of
Speaker 1: dirt and the tailings or whatever you want to call
Speaker 1: it was a hand print, not a paw print, but
Speaker 1: a hand print. And then we've also in the area.
Speaker 1: Todd Hale was there, Shane Corson was there. After a
Speaker 1: period of time had gone by and we were confident
Speaker 1: that the sasquatch was not going to be returning to
Speaker 1: the location. We didn't want to disturb any behaviors or
Speaker 1: for it and whils. We didn't want to lose any
Speaker 1: opportunities of knowing where one was going, of course, But
Speaker 1: after we were confident that the thing wasn't going to
Speaker 1: come back anymore, we started collecting some of the nesting
Speaker 1: material and that trip yielded three footprint casts that I
Speaker 1: personally took and one I think two actually two of
Speaker 1: those casts. The footprints were underneath the nesting material, which
Speaker 1: of course gives us a time period, a timeline here.
Speaker 1: Those footprints were laid down before the nesting material was
Speaker 1: put down there. So with those clues I'm confident enough
Speaker 1: to say that that was a Sasquatch situation, and it
Speaker 1: seems to me it was actually repurposing a bare den.
Speaker 1: So you bringing that up is really really interesting to me.
Speaker 1: So much has been going on, and apparently it's going
Speaker 1: on to this present day as well, or pretty close
Speaker 1: to this prison day I guess, I mean, or here
Speaker 1: with us now. You don't know what's going on there.
Speaker 1: But having said that, we're kind of running out of
Speaker 1: time on the initial podcast, I thought we're going to
Speaker 1: jump in the vocalizations and mostly talk about that, but
Speaker 1: there was so much more information to share. So would
Speaker 1: you mind sticking around for our members section and we
Speaker 1: can listen to the last few vocalization recordings that we
Speaker 1: can and learn a little bit more about the situation
Speaker 1: and bring it up to the present day.
Speaker 5: Yes, sure, that.
Speaker 1: Would be fantastic. I would really really appreciate that. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: people listening out there, there's gonna be more over our
Speaker 1: member section. I think it's released every Thursday, if remember right,
Speaker 1: five bucks a month if you want to join us,
Speaker 1: it's great, I mean that's what I hear at least,
Speaker 1: So Bob, do you have anything else to add? Before
Speaker 1: we split and do the member stuff. No, all right,
Speaker 1: very good, then why don't you dig us out of here? Then?
Speaker 8: Jivin Stacy, thanks a lot for coming on the show
Speaker 8: with us today and I appreciate you're going to stick
Speaker 8: around for the members section and tell all you out
Speaker 8: there listening, thank you for joining us, and until next time, y'all,
Speaker 8: keep it squatchy.
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