1 00:00:01,120 --> 00:00:04,160 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Mind Over Murder podcast. 2 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:07,280 Speaker 2: My name is Bill Thomas. 3 00:00:07,799 --> 00:00:11,679 Speaker 3: I'm a writer, consulting, producer, and now podcaster. I am 4 00:00:11,880 --> 00:00:14,439 now trying to use my experience as the brother of 5 00:00:14,480 --> 00:00:17,399 a murder victim to help other victims of violent crime. 6 00:00:17,679 --> 00:00:20,719 I'm working on a book on the unsolved Colonial Parkway murders, 7 00:00:20,879 --> 00:00:23,600 and I'm the co administrator of the Colonial Parkway Murders 8 00:00:23,640 --> 00:00:25,519 Facebook group together with Kristin Dilly. 9 00:00:26,079 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 4: My name is Kristin Dilly. 10 00:00:27,519 --> 00:00:31,199 Speaker 5: I'm a writer, a researcher, a teacher, and a victim's advocate, 11 00:00:31,359 --> 00:00:34,719 as well as the social media manager and co administrator 12 00:00:34,799 --> 00:00:37,799 for the Colonial Parkway Murders Facebook page with my partner 13 00:00:37,840 --> 00:01:18,480 in crime, Bill Thomas. 14 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:23,560 Speaker 6: Welcome to a special edition of Mind Over Murder. I'm 15 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:24,719 Kristin Dilly. 16 00:01:24,519 --> 00:01:25,519 Speaker 2: And I'm Bill Thomas. 17 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:30,480 Speaker 6: You're covering the breaking news in the Colonial Parkway Murders case. 18 00:01:30,719 --> 00:01:34,480 In a press conference on Friday November fourteenth, Virginia State 19 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:37,319 Police confirmed that they have linked the nineteen eighty eight 20 00:01:37,439 --> 00:01:41,439 murder of Laurie Ann Powell in Gloucester, Virginia to serial 21 00:01:41,519 --> 00:01:45,840 killer Alan Wade Wilmer Senior via DNA. This comes two 22 00:01:45,879 --> 00:01:48,400 years after Wilmer was linked to the murders of Robin 23 00:01:48,519 --> 00:01:51,879 Edwards and David Nobling on Ragged Island in nineteen eighty 24 00:01:51,879 --> 00:01:55,799 seven and Teresa Lynn Spa Howell in Hampton in nineteen 25 00:01:55,879 --> 00:01:59,599 eighty nine. This now connects Lori Ann Powell's murder, which 26 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:03,079 we have can persistently referred to as Parkway adjacent to 27 00:02:03,319 --> 00:02:05,079 the Colonial Parkway murders. 28 00:02:05,599 --> 00:02:07,400 Speaker 4: This is huge news for us. 29 00:02:07,439 --> 00:02:10,599 Speaker 6: Bill, how did you feel when you got that phone call. 30 00:02:10,639 --> 00:02:16,080 Speaker 3: It's exciting and we're thrilled to have good news for 31 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:20,919 the Powell family, Lorianne's family, and the Compton family. Her 32 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:24,520 mom remarried at a later point. I don't know that 33 00:02:24,599 --> 00:02:28,240 I've ever spoken to Lorianne's sister, but I have spoken 34 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:31,199 to her parents, who are very nice people. It's just 35 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:34,680 wonderful to see an outcome like this. I hope people 36 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:37,879 can understand that for us to call this good news 37 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:42,400 when you've been waiting for answers for thirty seven years, 38 00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:48,599 getting those answers is probably quite satisfying something you've been 39 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:51,319 seeking for decades. None of this is going to bring 40 00:02:51,439 --> 00:02:54,000 Lorianne back, or any of our loved ones who've been 41 00:02:54,039 --> 00:02:57,680 taken in the Colonial Parkway murders, but we're all seeking answers. 42 00:02:58,039 --> 00:03:01,520 It makes me happy, really for the Powell family and 43 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:04,520 the Compton family that they finally have the answers they've 44 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:05,159 been seeking. 45 00:03:05,560 --> 00:03:06,439 Speaker 2: At least for. 46 00:03:06,439 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 3: Those of us that struggle at night to get to 47 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:11,439 sleep wondering what happened to our loved ones, at least 48 00:03:11,479 --> 00:03:15,280 they know. I was so struck by how beautiful a 49 00:03:15,319 --> 00:03:18,879 young woman she was. And now Kristen's put together a 50 00:03:18,919 --> 00:03:22,719 new photo array of our ten victims, four of whom 51 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:25,759 have been confirmed as part of the Colonial Parkway murders now, 52 00:03:26,199 --> 00:03:29,039 and I think there'll be more to come. It's very 53 00:03:29,039 --> 00:03:32,439 hard not to look at those bright young people and 54 00:03:32,479 --> 00:03:35,159 not have your heartbreak a little bit. But I'm trying 55 00:03:35,159 --> 00:03:39,319 to balance that feeling with the positive feeling about the 56 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:42,039 fact that the Virginia State Police is working this case 57 00:03:42,319 --> 00:03:44,759 and solving these murders. I have to give them a 58 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:46,479 lot of credit for the work they're doing. 59 00:03:47,120 --> 00:03:48,759 Speaker 4: That's a great place to start. 60 00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:52,199 Speaker 6: We want to give mad props to the Virginia State 61 00:03:52,199 --> 00:03:54,319 Police for the incredible work that they are. 62 00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 4: Doing on this. 63 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:58,639 Speaker 6: They really have not given up. Yes, it's been a 64 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:03,639 long two years since Wilmer was first identified as the 65 00:04:03,719 --> 00:04:08,080 killer of Robin, David and Terry, but they have worked 66 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:12,199 it doggedly. We would love to see the FBI put 67 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:16,600 that kind of dogged persistence into the cases that are 68 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:20,000 under their purview. At the press conference today, which we'll 69 00:04:20,000 --> 00:04:22,759 get into in a little bit, the VSP said that 70 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:25,759 they are still actively working in the case, and they 71 00:04:25,839 --> 00:04:30,160 said several times they are still actively seeking tips and 72 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:33,920 leads and information from the public with regard to Alan 73 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:38,360 Wade Wilmer. They are clearly looking into him for more cases. 74 00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:41,959 I'm guessing, just a guess, but I think it's probably 75 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:44,399 pretty educated one that the next one that's going to 76 00:04:44,399 --> 00:04:47,279 be linked to him is Brian Pettenger. They look like 77 00:04:47,319 --> 00:04:51,199 they are actively working in these cases. So props all 78 00:04:51,240 --> 00:04:56,519 the way around to Virginia State Police, Hampton PD, Suffolk PD. 79 00:04:56,600 --> 00:04:58,600 Speaker 4: They indicated they are working with them too. 80 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:03,360 Speaker 6: I love White like everybody who has jumped in and said, hey, 81 00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:06,480 we want to keep working these cases. Props to you 82 00:05:06,519 --> 00:05:10,040 guys in law enforcement. Thank you, thank you. You saw 83 00:05:10,079 --> 00:05:14,480 today how happy the members of Lorian's family are to 84 00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:18,160 have that. Everybody wants to use that term closure, but 85 00:05:18,199 --> 00:05:20,800 we know closure doesn't work here. They are happy to 86 00:05:20,879 --> 00:05:24,319 have those answers, and so mad props to VSP. You 87 00:05:24,319 --> 00:05:27,160 guys are out there doing great work. Thank you keep going. 88 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:30,600 Speaker 3: Interestingly, they avoided the use of the word closure as 89 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:32,720 far as I could hear. Yes, we'll talk about that 90 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:36,439 in a second. They used resolution a couple of times, 91 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:40,519 and that's actually a good choice of language. There's no 92 00:05:40,920 --> 00:05:43,639 justice in any of this because in a perfect world, 93 00:05:43,720 --> 00:05:46,879 Alan Woodwilmer would be behind bars now and he's not. 94 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:52,000 I think resolution is probably a good choice. One of 95 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:55,040 the many things we learned today was that DNA Labs 96 00:05:55,079 --> 00:05:59,360 International was the responsible lab. This is an independent lab 97 00:05:59,399 --> 00:06:02,480 down in Florida. I know those folks. They do some 98 00:06:02,639 --> 00:06:06,240 very good work. They never said two years ago who 99 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:10,000 did the work on the Robin Edwards, David Nobling and 100 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:14,000 Terry Howell Murders. I guessed at the time that it 101 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:17,000 was DNA Labs International. They do work for lots of 102 00:06:17,000 --> 00:06:20,279 different law enforcement agencies around the country. I wasn't sure 103 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:23,120 back then two years ago who did that work. But 104 00:06:23,519 --> 00:06:26,199 this time around, very early on in the press conference, 105 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:29,879 they announced that DNA Labs International of Florida did the work. 106 00:06:29,920 --> 00:06:32,800 And again, like you're saying, Kristen, props to them. They're 107 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:35,680 doing some great work. They were able to take what 108 00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:39,279 I'm sure was a very challenging DNA sample from Lorient 109 00:06:39,399 --> 00:06:42,920 Powell's rape kit. Again something we learned. We didn't know 110 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:46,560 that she'd been sexually assaulted. They confirmed I didn't as well. 111 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:50,720 They were able to get a working DNA profile and 112 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:53,720 once again linked to Alan Wade Wilmer Senior. 113 00:06:54,319 --> 00:06:56,279 Speaker 6: Because I know that we are going to have people 114 00:06:56,399 --> 00:06:59,639 who are listening to the podcast for the first time 115 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:03,079 because of their interest in Lori Anne's case, Let's do 116 00:07:03,199 --> 00:07:08,079 a brief review and recap of the history behind Alan 117 00:07:08,199 --> 00:07:11,240 Wade Wilmer Senior's involvement in the case, and then we'll 118 00:07:11,279 --> 00:07:14,199 continue to talk a little bit about Lari Anne and 119 00:07:14,600 --> 00:07:17,680 the questions that Bill and I now have as a 120 00:07:17,720 --> 00:07:21,240 result of this new information, things that we've been thinking 121 00:07:21,279 --> 00:07:24,120 over the last couple of days' ideas we've been spitballing 122 00:07:24,720 --> 00:07:28,639 because so many people have asked on our social media paages. 123 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:31,720 We will do a discussion about other cases that we 124 00:07:31,879 --> 00:07:34,759 think Wilmer might be involved in, and we hope if 125 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:38,279 any of the law enforcement agencies are currently listening to 126 00:07:38,319 --> 00:07:40,360 this we do know the FBI tunes in from time 127 00:07:40,399 --> 00:07:43,040 to time. Hello to the analysts out there. We are 128 00:07:43,079 --> 00:07:45,879 hoping that this might be something exper discussion. 129 00:07:46,560 --> 00:07:49,519 Speaker 3: One thing for new listeners, you don't have to listen 130 00:07:49,560 --> 00:07:52,079 to every episode of Mind Over Murder if you're just 131 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:54,839 interested in the Colonial Parkway murders. But if you go 132 00:07:54,959 --> 00:07:56,600 back and take a look, and we have over five 133 00:07:56,680 --> 00:08:00,360 hundred episodes, now some of are bonus episodes, which are 134 00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:05,439 repeat episodes. There's at least three hundred brand new episodes. 135 00:08:05,879 --> 00:08:07,959 But if you go and look at the list, you 136 00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:11,759 can scroll down and we clearly market when we're talking 137 00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:14,800 about the Colonial Parkway murders. So if you want to 138 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:18,240 go back and listen to earlier episodes, which you're welcome to, 139 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:21,560 just look for the episodes where we talk about Colonial 140 00:08:21,639 --> 00:08:24,199 Parkway murders. And there's also from time to time we'll 141 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:27,959 do us and ask us anything in the Colonial Parkway murders, 142 00:08:27,959 --> 00:08:31,040 and that's typically a format where Kristin will ask questions 143 00:08:31,040 --> 00:08:33,120 and tea up and we'll do our best and for 144 00:08:33,200 --> 00:08:35,279 the two of us to answer them. You don't have 145 00:08:35,320 --> 00:08:39,080 to listen to every episode we've ever recorded, as much 146 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:43,559 as we'd appreciate that. Before we jump into more specifics, 147 00:08:43,679 --> 00:08:47,279 I do have to include a rant. Here, go right ahead. 148 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:52,120 You just heard us have a lot of great things 149 00:08:52,159 --> 00:08:54,440 to say about the work that the Virginia State Police 150 00:08:54,559 --> 00:08:57,440 are doing. But I have to bring this up. In 151 00:08:57,519 --> 00:09:00,639 my previous life, I was a senior level marketing and 152 00:09:00,679 --> 00:09:05,720 communications and public relations guy, so I ran a lot 153 00:09:05,759 --> 00:09:10,399 of press conferences. I was sometimes the on camera spokesperson 154 00:09:10,600 --> 00:09:14,240 for the organizations that I worked for, like ASKAP, so 155 00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:17,240 I know how press conferences are run. And these Virginia 156 00:09:17,240 --> 00:09:21,120 State Police press conferences are terrible, and it's so frustrating. 157 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:24,159 I don't know if it's deliberate. At this point, they're 158 00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:28,879 doing the public a disservice. It's so basic to have 159 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:31,720 a person at the front of the room answering questions. 160 00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:36,159 If you cannot hear the questions that are being asked, 161 00:09:36,279 --> 00:09:39,039 and this is not the first time they've done this, 162 00:09:39,639 --> 00:09:43,120 if we cannot hear the questions, then it is very 163 00:09:43,159 --> 00:09:47,519 difficult to discern from the answers what the question was. 164 00:09:48,279 --> 00:09:51,279 And some of these questions is these are complicated cases. 165 00:09:51,639 --> 00:09:55,080 There's a lot of nuance, a lot of detail. But 166 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:58,399 if we can't hear what the reporters are asking. Were lost. 167 00:09:59,159 --> 00:10:01,519 I was so frustrat created. At one point, while the 168 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:04,759 press conference was unfolding, I actually fired up. I have 169 00:10:04,759 --> 00:10:07,200 a very elaborate stereo system in this room. He used 170 00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:09,000 to work in the music business, and one of my 171 00:10:09,039 --> 00:10:12,759 two max is connected to the stereo. Even with the 172 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:17,120 stereo turned all the way up through these big, fancy speakers, 173 00:10:17,159 --> 00:10:21,720 I could sometimes barely hear what the questions were. Typically, 174 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:24,679 Captain Ribel was doing most of the answering. You could 175 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:26,919 clearly hear what his answers were, but you weren't one 176 00:10:27,000 --> 00:10:29,759 hundred percent sure what question he was being asked. And 177 00:10:29,799 --> 00:10:32,360 then sometimes he'd say, oh, that's true, and you're like, 178 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:35,840 what is true? They have to do better. Look if 179 00:10:35,840 --> 00:10:38,559 I have to drive down to Virginia and run this 180 00:10:38,600 --> 00:10:43,240 press contract for them. Typically what we would do is 181 00:10:43,279 --> 00:10:46,519 we would have two microphones in the room on stands, 182 00:10:46,639 --> 00:10:49,360 and the reporters would get up ask the question so 183 00:10:49,399 --> 00:10:52,759 you could hear them. They were nice and loud. Alternatively, 184 00:10:53,039 --> 00:10:55,960 someone walks around with a wireless mic, the reporter sticks 185 00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:57,679 his or her hand up in the air and they 186 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:00,159 go over and they the person often would say, I'm 187 00:11:00,200 --> 00:11:02,840 Kristin Dilly from someone to asked the question and then 188 00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:06,840 finally failing all of that. And again, remember I was 189 00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:08,960 the guy at the front of the room answering the questions. 190 00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:12,120 Speaker 2: A lot of the time. You repeat the question if 191 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:12,480 you can't. 192 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:15,799 Speaker 3: If someone says what color socks was the victim wearing, 193 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:17,480 the person at the front of the room says, the 194 00:11:17,559 --> 00:11:20,559 question was what color socks was the victim wearing? And 195 00:11:20,639 --> 00:11:24,679 the answer is blue. But they didn't do any of 196 00:11:24,720 --> 00:11:29,399 those things, and it just makes for a very frustrating experience. 197 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:32,159 I was following the press conference live and we will 198 00:11:32,200 --> 00:11:35,120 continue to put up links to the press conference because 199 00:11:35,159 --> 00:11:38,159 it is worth watching. But damn, they have to do 200 00:11:38,200 --> 00:11:41,759 a better job. Virginias Police has done this at least twice, 201 00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:45,360 and the FBI did it last year when they announced 202 00:11:45,399 --> 00:11:49,039 the solve of the Julie Williams Lolly Winan's case. If 203 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:51,559 you can't hear the questions, you're only hearing half of 204 00:11:51,639 --> 00:11:52,320 the conversation. 205 00:11:52,840 --> 00:11:53,759 Speaker 4: That is very true. 206 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:56,279 Speaker 6: So to the VSP if you don't want Bill Thomas 207 00:11:56,320 --> 00:11:59,240 to come down there and do it himself. 208 00:11:58,879 --> 00:11:59,840 Speaker 2: I'll do it for free. 209 00:12:00,039 --> 00:12:00,799 Speaker 4: I'm serious. 210 00:12:01,440 --> 00:12:03,159 Speaker 2: This isn't that hard. 211 00:12:03,919 --> 00:12:07,480 Speaker 3: It's not hard to put together a simple setup to 212 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:11,360 have a good, clear, understandable press conference. 213 00:12:11,799 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 4: Hey, we do it at our live events all the time. 214 00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:15,919 Speaker 3: Yeah, as a matter of fact. When we do as 215 00:12:15,919 --> 00:12:18,480 a matter of fact, our podcast live event, we have 216 00:12:18,519 --> 00:12:20,720 a microphone and we ask people to step up to 217 00:12:20,759 --> 00:12:23,120 the microphone and what was the weather like on the 218 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:25,120 day of the murder. You can hear the question and 219 00:12:25,159 --> 00:12:26,879 we provide the answer as best we can. 220 00:12:27,200 --> 00:12:28,320 Speaker 4: No, I definitely agree with you. 221 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:30,879 Speaker 6: I was not able to watch it live, unfortunately, because 222 00:12:30,879 --> 00:12:32,720 I was in the middle of teaching a class of 223 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:37,240 high school kiddos how to read, write, and speak appropriately the. 224 00:12:37,279 --> 00:12:38,559 Speaker 2: How to do a press conference too. 225 00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:41,120 Speaker 6: I should teach them how to do a press conference exactly. 226 00:12:41,399 --> 00:12:44,159 We are actually working on oral presentations. And I will 227 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:46,120 tell you I do have a lot of hope from 228 00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:49,399 my current group of kids because they have been quite good. Yes, 229 00:12:49,679 --> 00:12:52,360 some of them occasionally will mumble or whatever, but I 230 00:12:52,519 --> 00:12:55,639 have had a group of kids who have written out 231 00:12:55,720 --> 00:12:59,840 thorough note cards and really, yeah, I've been really proud 232 00:12:59,840 --> 00:13:02,279 of this group of kids so far. And maybe a 233 00:13:02,279 --> 00:13:05,080 handful of them will listen to this because they're a 234 00:13:05,159 --> 00:13:07,279 little jazzed about the idea that their teacher has a 235 00:13:07,320 --> 00:13:09,720 true crime podcast. Maybe some of them will hear that 236 00:13:09,759 --> 00:13:11,679 I am proud of them in the work that they're doing. 237 00:13:12,279 --> 00:13:13,919 Speaker 2: I home, I am. 238 00:13:14,080 --> 00:13:16,639 Speaker 6: Let it be said, let it be known. Let's do 239 00:13:16,759 --> 00:13:18,960 a recap of what we know so far. So for 240 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:21,600 anybody who is not familiar with the case but is 241 00:13:21,639 --> 00:13:25,559 coming in out of an interest into the Lori Ann 242 00:13:25,759 --> 00:13:29,240 Powell murder, then we'll go ahead and catch you up 243 00:13:29,240 --> 00:13:30,720 on where we are with Wilmer. 244 00:13:31,159 --> 00:13:33,440 Speaker 4: This first started two years ago. 245 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:37,799 Speaker 6: On January eighth, twenty twenty four, the VSP and the 246 00:13:37,879 --> 00:13:40,879 FBI held a joint press conference in which they announced 247 00:13:40,879 --> 00:13:45,120 that Alan Wade Wilmer, Senior, sixty three, of Lancaster County, Virginia, 248 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:49,679 had been connected via DNA to the murders of Robin Edwards, 249 00:13:50,159 --> 00:13:54,840 David Nobling, and Teresa Howell. This marked the first significant 250 00:13:54,879 --> 00:13:59,240 break in this case in its then thirty seven year history. 251 00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:03,399 Died in his home in twenty seventeen, without ever having 252 00:14:03,440 --> 00:14:06,159 been convicted of a felony in the state of Virginia. 253 00:14:06,879 --> 00:14:10,120 Speaker 3: For everyone's benefit, because this question came up today, he 254 00:14:10,200 --> 00:14:14,240 died of natural causes at home. He had heart disease 255 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:17,639 and other issues. He was found dead in his bed. 256 00:14:18,279 --> 00:14:18,519 Speaker 4: Good. 257 00:14:18,559 --> 00:14:20,519 Speaker 6: I'm glad that you clarified that, because we have had 258 00:14:20,519 --> 00:14:22,879 people ask us a number of times like what did 259 00:14:22,919 --> 00:14:26,919 he die of? Because Wilmer died without ever having been 260 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:30,039 convicted of a felony in the state of Virginia, his 261 00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:34,440 DNA was not placed in the CODIS system. That is 262 00:14:34,519 --> 00:14:39,240 because the rules governing DNA entry into COTIS states that 263 00:14:39,519 --> 00:14:43,600 only the DNA of people convicted of felonies can be 264 00:14:43,799 --> 00:14:47,519 entered into the database. That is why his DNA is 265 00:14:47,559 --> 00:14:50,720 not in the system at this time. His DNA can 266 00:14:50,799 --> 00:14:54,399 be used for one to one case comparisons, which is 267 00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:58,919 how he was linked to Robin, David Terry and now Laurie, 268 00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:02,080 but he is not in the larger database, and we 269 00:15:02,159 --> 00:15:05,799 want to address that particular loophole a little bit later 270 00:15:05,879 --> 00:15:09,879 in this podcast and in subsequent podcasts. The break in 271 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:13,240 the case in January twenty twenty four was the first 272 00:15:13,279 --> 00:15:17,720 time a single homicide victim, Teresa Howell, was connected to 273 00:15:17,799 --> 00:15:23,000 the Colonial Parkway murders series. Today's presser about Larian Powell 274 00:15:23,399 --> 00:15:26,919 marks the second individual to be linked into this series 275 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:30,720 of double homicides, known collectively as the Colonial Parkway murders. 276 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:35,279 Speaker 3: Another question that came up today repeatedly was why these 277 00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:38,559 murders called the Colonial Parkway murders when none of the 278 00:15:38,639 --> 00:15:42,080 murders we're talking about today happened on the Colonial Parkway. 279 00:15:42,639 --> 00:15:47,039 People are correct, The name was created by local media 280 00:15:47,279 --> 00:15:51,759 in Virginia. Kathy Thomas and Rebecca Dowski and Keith Colin 281 00:15:51,840 --> 00:15:55,879 Cassandra Haley who went missing. Those cases are local to 282 00:15:56,120 --> 00:15:59,639 the Colonial Parkway, and with the Thomas Dowski murders being 283 00:15:59,679 --> 00:16:02,879 the first fir in the series, local media began referring 284 00:16:03,000 --> 00:16:05,840 to these murders as they unfolded from nineteen eighty six 285 00:16:05,919 --> 00:16:09,519 to nineteen eighty nine as the Colonial Parkway Murders. People 286 00:16:09,519 --> 00:16:12,840 were throwing questions at us today, like why are these 287 00:16:12,919 --> 00:16:15,840 called the Colonial Parkway murders. None of this has anything 288 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:18,039 to do with the Colonial Parkway. All we can say 289 00:16:18,159 --> 00:16:21,320 is we didn't make up the name. We just stuck 290 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:23,759 with it because that's the name that people know these 291 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:24,480 cases by. 292 00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:27,200 Speaker 6: Although I think at some point now we are going 293 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:31,440 to have to broaden our definition of what this case 294 00:16:31,559 --> 00:16:35,440 might alternatively be called, assuming the media doesn't come up 295 00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:36,679 with something else for it. 296 00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:39,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'll be damned if they're called the Wilmer murders, though, 297 00:16:39,639 --> 00:16:43,759 because let's stay focused on victims for now, we're still 298 00:16:43,799 --> 00:16:46,960 calling them the Colonial Parkway murders because people around the 299 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:49,159 world know this case by that name. 300 00:16:49,559 --> 00:16:53,279 Speaker 6: So continuing our recap, Alan Wade Wilmer Senior has now 301 00:16:53,320 --> 00:16:57,559 been linked via DNA to four homicides, Robin Edwards and 302 00:16:57,639 --> 00:17:02,240 David Nobling, Teresa Howell, and Laurien Powell. He has been 303 00:17:02,399 --> 00:17:08,279 circubstantially linked to the disappearances of Keith Call and Cassandra Haley, 304 00:17:08,519 --> 00:17:11,880 and was at one time considered the number one suspect 305 00:17:12,079 --> 00:17:16,359 in their disappearances and probable murders. He was given two 306 00:17:16,519 --> 00:17:20,559 polygraphs in reference to that case, but the FBI failed 307 00:17:20,599 --> 00:17:24,920 to follow up on him as a suspect after those polygraphs. 308 00:17:25,599 --> 00:17:26,920 Speaker 4: As a result of that. 309 00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:31,400 Speaker 6: Teresa Ann Howell was murdered in July of nineteen eighty nine, 310 00:17:31,480 --> 00:17:34,640 and I fully assert that is because the FBI did 311 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:39,039 not follow up appropriately. I have to agree, Okay, when 312 00:17:39,079 --> 00:17:43,079 we first heard that Lori Ann's murder had been forensically 313 00:17:43,079 --> 00:17:46,279 linked to Wilmer, Bill and I went into overdrive and 314 00:17:46,359 --> 00:17:49,440 started spitballing ideas off of each other because this is 315 00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:51,880 what we do. And for anybody who doesn't know how 316 00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:55,119 long we've been working together, we've been working together ten years. 317 00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:57,000 Speaker 4: This is what we do all the time. 318 00:17:57,519 --> 00:18:00,920 Speaker 6: At some point or another, just about every we will 319 00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:03,599 call or text or whatever to each other and say, hey, 320 00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:04,920 have you thought about this? 321 00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:08,440 Speaker 2: Yes, we're pathetic, we admit it. 322 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:13,200 Speaker 6: I think we're dedicated. I think we're detail oriented. I 323 00:18:13,240 --> 00:18:14,559 think that we're resilient. 324 00:18:15,039 --> 00:18:17,200 Speaker 2: And our moms are proud of us. 325 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:19,799 Speaker 6: And our moms are proud of us, yes, exactly, and 326 00:18:19,839 --> 00:18:22,640 our partners are proud of us too. Based on that 327 00:18:22,799 --> 00:18:26,000 confirmation that Wilmer is the killer of luri Ann Powell, 328 00:18:26,279 --> 00:18:29,880 that does mean we have to broaden our understanding of 329 00:18:29,960 --> 00:18:32,359 what we know about the case. And it means that 330 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:36,240 we have new questions and also new theories and new 331 00:18:36,279 --> 00:18:40,920 information to consider. Again, because I think about this a lot, 332 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:44,319 even when I'm at work. I took five minutes during 333 00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:47,240 my lunch hour the other day in between classes, and 334 00:18:47,279 --> 00:18:50,839 I dashed off some bullet points to Bill, just things 335 00:18:50,839 --> 00:18:53,359 that I was thinking about Laurie's case. And we're going 336 00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:55,240 to go ahead and share those with you now. And 337 00:18:55,319 --> 00:18:58,000 Bill is going to chime in and give his thoughts 338 00:18:58,079 --> 00:19:01,240 as well. Now that we know that Wilmer is connected 339 00:19:01,279 --> 00:19:05,119 to Lauri and Powell, we do have confirmation that Wilmer 340 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:08,559 was hunting in Gloucester. We know that he was doctor 341 00:19:08,559 --> 00:19:11,440 at Marine Is over there. That has been stated as such, 342 00:19:11,480 --> 00:19:14,559 it was stated today during the press conferences. We also 343 00:19:14,640 --> 00:19:17,200 know that he frequented a store which we are not 344 00:19:17,359 --> 00:19:19,640 going to name so that we can allow them their 345 00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:23,160 privacy that makes them sells nautical line. So we know 346 00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:27,319 that Wilmer was in Gloucester at various times. This confirms it. 347 00:19:27,759 --> 00:19:31,079 Speaker 3: Now this marine supply house, and we've spoken to the 348 00:19:31,119 --> 00:19:33,880 owners of the marine supply house. They told us a 349 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:36,759 couple of things which shocked us. This is last year now. 350 00:19:37,039 --> 00:19:40,640 One is that both Alan Wade Wilmer, Senior and his 351 00:19:40,839 --> 00:19:46,759 older brother, William Keith Wilmer were customers of this marine 352 00:19:46,799 --> 00:19:51,680 supply house. Interestingly, they told us that no one from 353 00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:55,480 the FBI or the Virginia State Police has ever visited them, 354 00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:59,960 even though Kathy and Becky were murdered using nautical law. 355 00:20:00,759 --> 00:20:04,160 I have to express some disappointment that Kristin Dilly and 356 00:20:04,160 --> 00:20:06,480 Bill Thomas are the only people that have ever reached 357 00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:09,880 out to this marine supply house, particularly since rope was 358 00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:14,400 used in the first two murders. The current president of 359 00:20:14,440 --> 00:20:17,079 the company, it's a family owned business. He went back 360 00:20:17,079 --> 00:20:20,000 and checked with his father and uncle who worked there 361 00:20:20,039 --> 00:20:24,079 for decades, and he reconfirmed no one from the eighties 362 00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:27,119 on forward when these murders started to that day that 363 00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:29,720 I spoke to him last year, has ever spoken to 364 00:20:29,799 --> 00:20:32,960 them about this. And this is yet another just small 365 00:20:33,160 --> 00:20:37,960 but disappointing facet to the investigation. We're not investigators, as 366 00:20:38,039 --> 00:20:40,480 Kristin likes to say, and we're not. I don't know 367 00:20:40,480 --> 00:20:43,480 why two podcasters, one of them the brother of the 368 00:20:43,559 --> 00:20:46,960 murder victims, take it upon themselves to check these things 369 00:20:46,960 --> 00:20:50,839 out when our investigative partners aren't doing it. We now 370 00:20:50,920 --> 00:20:53,680 need to adjust our thinking in terms of Wilmer that 371 00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:56,519 his hunting grounds, if you want to call them, that 372 00:20:56,759 --> 00:20:59,759 are broader than we might have thought at one time. 373 00:21:00,079 --> 00:21:04,279 He's on the Gloucester side, now the York River, because 374 00:21:04,319 --> 00:21:08,519 that's where we believe Lorian Powell might have encountered him. 375 00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:12,559 Speaker 6: We know that Lorian pell was last seen with her 376 00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:13,799 boyfriend Chris Cutler. 377 00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:16,599 Speaker 4: They had a fight. She asked to get out of. 378 00:21:16,559 --> 00:21:20,400 Speaker 6: His truck and he left her on the side of 379 00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:23,960 the road at her request and she started walking. He 380 00:21:24,599 --> 00:21:27,799 then turned around forty minutes later and came back for her, 381 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:31,200 but did not find her. So that means in that 382 00:21:31,440 --> 00:21:36,240 forty minutes, Wilmer came across Lorianne, took her into his truck. 383 00:21:36,279 --> 00:21:37,920 Speaker 4: Maybe he offered to give her a ride. 384 00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:41,359 Speaker 6: Maybe he did not offer and forced her in at 385 00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:42,480 if for gunpoint. 386 00:21:42,599 --> 00:21:45,000 Speaker 4: But in that forty minute. 387 00:21:44,680 --> 00:21:48,480 Speaker 6: Window is when Alan Wayne Wilmer, Senior came upon her. 388 00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:52,680 I'm guessing she was probably a victim of opportunity. I 389 00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:56,079 don't necessarily believe that he was following her, although that 390 00:21:56,200 --> 00:21:59,400 is something that someone mentioned on our Facebook page. My 391 00:21:59,559 --> 00:22:03,960 theory Wilmer is that he was always hunting and looking 392 00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:07,480 for opportunities and he just took advantage when he saw 393 00:22:07,519 --> 00:22:11,319 someone that he could grab without repercussions. And when I 394 00:22:11,359 --> 00:22:15,519 say without repercussions, I mean without danger to him. Obviously 395 00:22:15,559 --> 00:22:18,480 it had far reaching repercussions. 396 00:22:17,799 --> 00:22:20,359 Speaker 3: From what we've been told. Lori Anne was walking along 397 00:22:20,519 --> 00:22:24,359 Route six fourteen in the direction of Route seventeen, which 398 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,839 is the road that goes across the Coleman Bridge from 399 00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:29,519 the Gloucester side to the New York County side. She 400 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:33,079 was headed likely in the direction of a Little Sue, 401 00:22:33,759 --> 00:22:36,359 which is like a seven to eleven. Is that a 402 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:40,240 fair convenient conveniences? And this is also a place that 403 00:22:40,519 --> 00:22:44,880 was known as a hangout for Ron Little, whose name 404 00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:47,799 comes up frequently in connection with the Colonial Parkray murders 405 00:22:47,839 --> 00:22:52,039 and other people that we associate with Liberty Security. We 406 00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:55,279 can't lose sight of the fact that Lorian Powell had 407 00:22:55,519 --> 00:22:58,359 worked at Liberty Security. You're going to be hearing more 408 00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:01,440 and more about Liberty Security yet, we think in the 409 00:23:01,519 --> 00:23:04,519 coming months, because there just seems to be this recurring 410 00:23:05,079 --> 00:23:09,839 nexus around this small security company based in Gloucester, just 411 00:23:09,880 --> 00:23:12,799 a couple of miles away from where Lori and Powell 412 00:23:12,839 --> 00:23:16,240 was last seen. You're listening to Mindover Murder. We'll be 413 00:23:16,319 --> 00:23:22,519 right back after this word from our sponsors. We're back 414 00:23:22,519 --> 00:23:23,799 here at Mindover Murder. 415 00:23:24,839 --> 00:23:29,119 Speaker 6: We know that Laurie and Powell was found dumped in 416 00:23:29,279 --> 00:23:33,000 the water that would be in the James River off 417 00:23:33,039 --> 00:23:36,200 of what's called Craney Island. And Craney Island is actually 418 00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:38,319 owned by the US Navy and it has an area 419 00:23:38,359 --> 00:23:40,240 called the Dredged Material Area. 420 00:23:40,799 --> 00:23:46,039 Speaker 4: It is adjacent to the six sixty. 421 00:23:45,799 --> 00:23:50,240 Speaker 6: Four monitor mayor Maca Memorial Bridge Tunnel Beltway, and if 422 00:23:50,279 --> 00:23:53,200 you take a look at the map that we will 423 00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:57,279 put up a little bit later on our social media pages, 424 00:23:57,599 --> 00:24:01,880 it is in a fairly busy area, but it is 425 00:24:02,200 --> 00:24:07,640 outside of Portsmith, which is very different from where Brian 426 00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:11,839 Puttinger was found and then Robin Edwards and David Knoblane. 427 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:14,559 So we will put a little image of that a 428 00:24:14,599 --> 00:24:17,079 little bit later to show you where Crany Island is. 429 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:20,279 For anybody who doesn't know she was dumped in the water, 430 00:24:20,599 --> 00:24:25,400 we have long questioned how Wilmer was dumping his victims 431 00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:28,400 in water. Was he taking them on the boat after 432 00:24:28,519 --> 00:24:32,200 grabbing her and killing her? Was he driving around with 433 00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:35,440 her body in the pickup truck. We don't really know, 434 00:24:35,759 --> 00:24:38,319 but I am guessing the boat would probably be easier, 435 00:24:38,559 --> 00:24:41,000 especially if it has a hold where you would be 436 00:24:41,240 --> 00:24:44,519 keeping your catch from the day's fishing or oystering. So 437 00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:47,880 we still don't know how Wilmer is approaching his victims 438 00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:50,920 and transporting his victims. That I am assuming, because she 439 00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:53,759 was dumped in the water, I have to assume that 440 00:24:53,759 --> 00:24:56,079 at some point or another she was on that boat. 441 00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:57,720 And the name of the boat by the way for 442 00:24:57,720 --> 00:24:59,759 anybody who may have missed it at the press conference 443 00:24:59,799 --> 00:25:04,799 is Denny Wade and it was a handcrafted wooden huled boat. 444 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:07,839 And another thing that we were thinking about the other day, 445 00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:11,240 because this is what we do, is the cause of 446 00:25:11,319 --> 00:25:15,319 death in all of these different cases. We know that 447 00:25:15,519 --> 00:25:19,519 David Noblin and Robin Edwards were shot. We know that 448 00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:22,200 Terry Howell was strangled, and now we have learned that 449 00:25:22,279 --> 00:25:25,880 Larry and Powell was stabbed multiple times in the back 450 00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:30,160 and neck. He is varying the weapons that he's using. 451 00:25:30,839 --> 00:25:34,079 We don't know if that is a forensic countermeasure. We 452 00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:37,440 don't know if he's experimenting with weapons to see what 453 00:25:37,519 --> 00:25:40,440 works better for him or what he likes better. If 454 00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:44,119 it turns out that he's connected to Kathy Thomas and 455 00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:47,839 Rebecca Dowski, we know that they were strangled before their 456 00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:51,000 throats were cut. If it turns out that he's connected 457 00:25:51,039 --> 00:25:54,079 to Brian Pettenger was a victim of blunt Forth's trauma. 458 00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:55,880 There was a gash across the back of his head 459 00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:59,440 and his hands were bound. It is very interesting to 460 00:25:59,559 --> 00:26:02,559 look at the different types of causes of death here. 461 00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:05,400 And of course, the one thing that we really don't 462 00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:08,079 have a good handle on is cause of death for 463 00:26:08,519 --> 00:26:11,319 Keith Collin Cassandra Haley, and that's because their bodies have 464 00:26:11,400 --> 00:26:12,599 not been found yet. 465 00:26:12,759 --> 00:26:16,079 Speaker 3: From our many conversations with our friends who were FBI 466 00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:19,279 trained profilers, one of the things they've said to us 467 00:26:19,400 --> 00:26:23,039 is they said the kind of traditional viewpoint of serial 468 00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:26,319 killers like Wilmer was that they like to kill in 469 00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:29,119 a certain way and in a certain pattern. And what 470 00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:31,880 the profilers are telling us these days, in the last 471 00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:34,880 couple of years, is that they have scrapped a lot 472 00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:37,759 of those viewpoints because they're saying they mix it up, 473 00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:43,039 they try different things. They may be experimenting. To use 474 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:47,279 Kristen's word, can't lock into this couple was shot, this 475 00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:50,559 person was strangled. All of these people, for example, four 476 00:26:50,599 --> 00:26:53,279 people so far have already been linked to Wilmer, and 477 00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:56,240 even just this group of four people and now including 478 00:26:56,319 --> 00:27:01,079 Lorian Powell, we've got multiple ways of injuring and killing people, 479 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:04,559 all being used by the same offender. It's possible there 480 00:27:04,559 --> 00:27:08,599 are accomplices involved, but Wilmer's DNA is the through link here, 481 00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:12,000 and that's how we're proving that Alan Wade Wilmer, Senior 482 00:27:12,119 --> 00:27:14,799 is the killer, as Kristen says, he's using all these 483 00:27:14,839 --> 00:27:15,480 different methods. 484 00:27:16,079 --> 00:27:19,039 Speaker 6: One thing that we learned today at the press conference, 485 00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:22,359 and we're pretty sure this is courtesy of a question 486 00:27:22,480 --> 00:27:23,400 by Andy Fox. 487 00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:26,359 Speaker 4: But I couldn't hear very well as there was that 488 00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:27,960 the same microphone. 489 00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:28,640 Speaker 2: No one could. 490 00:27:29,519 --> 00:27:31,359 Speaker 4: But I do feel like this was probably an Andy 491 00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:32,039 Fox question. 492 00:27:32,519 --> 00:27:35,240 Speaker 6: He asked what was the source of the DNA for 493 00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:38,119 Laurie and Powell, and it was revealed that it was 494 00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:41,440 from a rape kit from Lurie Ann Powell. So now 495 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:46,039 with the four people who Wilmer is confirmed via DNA 496 00:27:46,079 --> 00:27:49,680 to have murdered, we have three women who were sexually assaulted, 497 00:27:50,079 --> 00:27:55,000 Robin Edwards, Larry and Powell, and Terry Howell. This does, 498 00:27:55,079 --> 00:27:58,880 of course bring up the interesting question if it turns 499 00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:03,079 out that Wilmer is responsible for Kathy Thomas and Rebecca Dowski, 500 00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:05,680 how in the world will they prove it, Considering that 501 00:28:05,759 --> 00:28:08,720 the FBI destroyed their rape kits as medical waste. 502 00:28:09,240 --> 00:28:10,240 Speaker 2: Don't get me started. 503 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:14,200 Speaker 6: We've also considered the fact that this definitively proves that 504 00:28:14,319 --> 00:28:19,599 Alan Wade Wilmer Senior was hunting both couples and individuals. 505 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:22,920 Speaker 4: Larie Anne was on her own. Terry Howell was on 506 00:28:22,960 --> 00:28:23,400 her own. 507 00:28:23,759 --> 00:28:26,440 Speaker 6: If he's responsible for Brian Puttinger, and I really do 508 00:28:26,559 --> 00:28:28,759 think he is, Brian was on his own. 509 00:28:29,279 --> 00:28:30,440 Speaker 4: We again have to. 510 00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:36,240 Speaker 6: Ask ourselves questions about Wilmer's predilections. Was he just hunting 511 00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:42,039 who was available? Was he opportunistic? Was he always looking 512 00:28:42,079 --> 00:28:45,160 for couples, but when he couldn't get them, he grabbed 513 00:28:45,200 --> 00:28:48,759 individuals or vice versa. Was he hunting couples because that's 514 00:28:48,799 --> 00:28:51,880 more of a challenge. Was he hunting couples with other 515 00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:54,799 people and individuals on his own? It brings up a 516 00:28:54,799 --> 00:28:59,200 lot of questions about additional possible accomplices, so many things 517 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:02,599 that just that one question brings up for us. And 518 00:29:02,680 --> 00:29:05,960 I'm very interested to talk to our profiler friends and 519 00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:07,279 see what they make of this. 520 00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:10,720 Speaker 3: We were talking about this earlier. One of the things 521 00:29:10,759 --> 00:29:12,839 I said to Kristen was a lot of things I 522 00:29:13,079 --> 00:29:16,559 thought about the Colonial Parkway murders have been upended by 523 00:29:16,599 --> 00:29:20,160 this news about Lori Anne Powell, this information that you 524 00:29:20,359 --> 00:29:23,799 just went through, Kristen. We really have to rethink this. 525 00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:27,480 And this is why I believe very strongly that the 526 00:29:27,599 --> 00:29:31,400 Virginia State Police, FBI, and other agencies need to be 527 00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:36,920 looking at unsolved murders throughout Virginia, Yes, and Maryland and 528 00:29:37,039 --> 00:29:41,279 North Carolina. I have heard some stories about Wilmer making 529 00:29:41,319 --> 00:29:44,839 his way into Maryland. We'll talk about that later, perhaps 530 00:29:45,279 --> 00:29:49,839 being engaged in rape murder cases in Maryland. We also 531 00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:53,839 have some cases that we're aware of in North Carolina 532 00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:57,599 that we think may involve Alan Wade Wilmer, Senior. It's 533 00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:01,319 imperative these agencies start core co ordinating because I think 534 00:30:01,359 --> 00:30:05,480 wilmert could be good for who knows, dozens of murders. 535 00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:08,319 Speaker 6: Just based on and this is Bill Thomas and Kristin 536 00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:11,880 Dilly looking into cold cases around the area. Just based 537 00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:16,480 on that, we've got sixteen potential victims. He was as 538 00:30:16,559 --> 00:30:19,880 people who said online he was truly a monster. We 539 00:30:20,039 --> 00:30:22,680 just don't know. So I highly agree with you Bill. 540 00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:29,240 It is imperative that everybody North Carolina, Maryland, everybody across Virginia, 541 00:30:29,359 --> 00:30:31,839 especially Tidwater that has cold cases. 542 00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:33,920 Speaker 4: We know that it's not just couples. 543 00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:37,559 Speaker 6: Now it's time to start pulling out those cold case files, 544 00:30:37,599 --> 00:30:40,359 get your cold case unit up and active, and start 545 00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:43,160 trying to figure out could Wilmer be good for any 546 00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:43,559 of these? 547 00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,759 Speaker 2: Talk to us about the confirmed murders so far. 548 00:30:47,599 --> 00:30:48,839 Speaker 4: The timeline is interesting. 549 00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:50,839 Speaker 6: One of the things that I need to do when 550 00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:53,000 I am doing work on the case is I need 551 00:30:53,039 --> 00:30:55,359 to have a timeline laid out for me, and so 552 00:30:55,519 --> 00:30:59,079 I make lists on legal pads I don't have. I 553 00:30:59,119 --> 00:31:01,599 don't have one of the weird murder walls yet with 554 00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:04,240 the red string and all of that. If I had 555 00:31:04,319 --> 00:31:06,880 room in my house, I might, but I don't have 556 00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:09,680 an office. I really want your office with all of 557 00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:12,440 your bookshelves and everything like that, because Bill's got an 558 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:16,400 absolutely gorgeous home office. You guys, he's got a full library. Yeah, 559 00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:18,119 you're looking around like you don't know what kind of 560 00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:18,920 space you have. 561 00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:20,440 Speaker 4: Your space is gorgeous. 562 00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:22,240 Speaker 2: No, we're very lucky, thank you. 563 00:31:22,799 --> 00:31:25,519 Speaker 6: So I don't have a murder wall yet, but I 564 00:31:25,559 --> 00:31:28,200 do have a lot of legal paths which have a 565 00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:29,880 lot of the same things on it. And the thing 566 00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:32,680 that is interesting so far to me, we're starting to 567 00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:36,440 get this confirmation based on dates that Wilmer seemed to 568 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:38,920 be in the midst of a murder spree. Here, let's 569 00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:42,720 break this down a little bit for just confirmed Wilmer murders. 570 00:31:43,359 --> 00:31:47,200 Robin Edwards and David Nabeln were murdered September nineteen eighty 571 00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:50,839 seven on Ragged Island, so I love White County. Six 572 00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:54,759 months later, March ninth, nineteen eighty eight, Lariyan Powell goes 573 00:31:54,799 --> 00:31:59,240 missing from Gloucester, and that is only three weeks before 574 00:31:59,279 --> 00:32:02,359 the disappearance of Keith Colin Cassandra Haley on April tenth. 575 00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:06,400 Laurie's body was found two weeks later, in April of 576 00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:10,039 nineteen eighty eight, one week before Keith and Cassandra disappeared. 577 00:32:10,599 --> 00:32:14,240 Keith and Sandra disappear. And remember Wilmer is the number 578 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:17,960 one suspect in that case right from the beginning, from 579 00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:18,960 the beginning, from. 580 00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:21,799 Speaker 3: Four days after Keith and Sandy died, the FBI was 581 00:32:21,839 --> 00:32:23,160 looking hard at him. 582 00:32:23,519 --> 00:32:27,079 Speaker 6: And then fifteen months later, in July of nineteen eighty nine, 583 00:32:27,519 --> 00:32:30,079 Terry Howell is murdered in Hampton, Virginia. 584 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:32,319 Speaker 4: Look at that timeline, you guys. 585 00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:35,440 Speaker 6: That is September eighty seven to July of eighty nine, 586 00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:39,200 and that is four dead bodies, six if you count 587 00:32:39,319 --> 00:32:41,200 Keith and Sandra. 588 00:32:41,039 --> 00:32:42,599 Speaker 2: And all the women were raped. 589 00:32:43,319 --> 00:32:45,960 Speaker 6: If you add Brian Pettinger in there as well, and 590 00:32:46,079 --> 00:32:52,119 he does bookend, he disappeared after Robin and David and 591 00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:55,799 before Laurie Anne. If you add Brian Pettinger in there, 592 00:32:55,839 --> 00:32:59,680 then boy, you're pulling that timeline even more. I would 593 00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:03,480 be very, very curious to know from anybody who remembers 594 00:33:03,519 --> 00:33:08,000 Wilmer what was his state of mind and his activity 595 00:33:08,319 --> 00:33:12,039 in eighty seven, eighty eight and eighty nine. Did he 596 00:33:12,119 --> 00:33:16,039 seem extra excited? Is something that would have riled him 597 00:33:16,119 --> 00:33:18,519 up and thrilled him? Was he loving this thrill? We 598 00:33:18,559 --> 00:33:22,400 don't know anything about Wilmer in terms of personality, but 599 00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:25,039 I would be very interested to know what was his 600 00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:29,279 affect during this time. In our live event at the 601 00:33:29,359 --> 00:33:32,599 Yorktown Library in May of twenty twenty four, we offered 602 00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:36,400 our analysis on cases that we thought might be connected 603 00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:40,079 to Wilmer. We mentioned, of course, the Parkway adjacent cases 604 00:33:40,119 --> 00:33:41,960 of Brian Pattinger and Lourienn Powell. 605 00:33:42,079 --> 00:33:43,640 Speaker 4: Now, of course, Laurienne has. 606 00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:46,920 Speaker 6: Been definitively tied to Wilmer. We also mentioned a series 607 00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:50,480 of murders in Lancaster County, the two remaining double homicides 608 00:33:50,480 --> 00:33:54,119 and the Colonial Parkway murders, a series of single homicides 609 00:33:54,119 --> 00:33:57,079 of women in Chesapeake, and two homicides of women. 610 00:33:56,880 --> 00:33:57,839 Speaker 4: In North Carolina. 611 00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:01,279 Speaker 6: We're going to run down those cases right now and 612 00:34:01,359 --> 00:34:04,200 evaluate them in light of what we have learned about 613 00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:07,119 Wilmer's involvement in the murder of Lurienn Powell. 614 00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:11,519 Speaker 3: You mentioned a figure of sixteen people that we've put 615 00:34:11,559 --> 00:34:15,119 together just from our list. I think if law enforcement 616 00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:17,800 from the Tri state area is working together, there may 617 00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:21,320 be a number of additional people that should be at 618 00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:25,519 least checked out, and if there's DNA evidence in those cases, 619 00:34:25,559 --> 00:34:28,320 they should be cross referenced against Wilmer's DNA. 620 00:34:29,039 --> 00:34:32,440 Speaker 6: So in our May thirteenth, twenty twenty four live event, 621 00:34:32,719 --> 00:34:37,159 we posited that Wilmer might be involved in the cases 622 00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:41,920 of Dale and Charlotte Rogers in Lancaster, Virginia, Mary Harding 623 00:34:42,119 --> 00:34:46,480 in Lancaster, Virginia, Kathy Thomas and Rebecca Dowski, Brian Pattinger, 624 00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:51,199 Blinda Ann Ashbourne, Donna cannedy Anna, Marie Phelpson, Daniel Lauer, 625 00:34:51,599 --> 00:34:55,360 Amber Lungren, and Peggy Lammers. Today it was confirmed that 626 00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:59,519 he's involved in Lurienn Powell's murder. Let's very quickly just 627 00:34:59,719 --> 00:35:02,880 go back over these cases. For anybody who's not familiar, 628 00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:06,119 then we would love to know at the conclusion of 629 00:35:06,159 --> 00:35:09,679 this episode, what are y'all's thoughts Do you believe that 630 00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:12,239 Wilmer may be involved in these We've heard from a 631 00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:15,159 number of people who think that he's probably. 632 00:35:15,199 --> 00:35:17,079 Speaker 4: Involved in the Mary Harding case. 633 00:35:17,639 --> 00:35:20,039 Speaker 6: There are plenty of people who believe that he also 634 00:35:20,119 --> 00:35:23,400 was responsible for Kathy and Rebecca, as well as Anna 635 00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:26,599 Maria and Daniel Lauer. So once we've gone over and 636 00:35:26,639 --> 00:35:29,559 presented you the evidence, you all be the jury and 637 00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:32,039 please let us know your thoughts. We would love to know, 638 00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:35,920 especially for those of you in Lancaster County who may 639 00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:39,119 have known or worked with any of these victims. Please 640 00:35:39,199 --> 00:35:41,360 do you reach out to the Virginia State Police or 641 00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:44,400 the FBI and offer any information that you can. 642 00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:45,559 Speaker 4: That is very important. 643 00:35:46,079 --> 00:35:48,639 Speaker 6: The other cases that we think Wilmer might be involved 644 00:35:48,679 --> 00:35:54,360 in are these Daleen, Charlotte Rogers, and Mary Harding Lancaster, Virginia. 645 00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:57,480 So Daleen Charlotte Rodgers were murdered in their home in 646 00:35:57,559 --> 00:36:01,159 February of nineteen seventy six. The cause of death was 647 00:36:01,199 --> 00:36:03,960 a shotgun blast to the back of the head. There 648 00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:07,039 were no signs of forced entry. The victims were next 649 00:36:07,039 --> 00:36:10,360 door neighbors of Gary Lankford, who would feature in another 650 00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:13,360 perplexing case in Henraiko County, which is the murder of 651 00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:16,519 Olivia Thorndey. And we have had people online say that 652 00:36:16,760 --> 00:36:20,159 they thought maybe Wilmer was responsible for Olivia too. We 653 00:36:20,199 --> 00:36:23,719 haven't had any time to discuss or evaluate that one 654 00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:24,400 way or the other. 655 00:36:25,119 --> 00:36:28,280 Speaker 3: In some of these cases in Lancaster County, people have 656 00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:31,760 also talked to us, and these are often knowledgeable people 657 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:34,480 in law enforcement as well, who have talked about the 658 00:36:34,519 --> 00:36:39,320 fact that William Keith Wilmer, Alan Wade, Wilmer's older brother, 659 00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:43,000 is also suspected in some of these cases, and he 660 00:36:43,079 --> 00:36:47,880 died in April twenty twenty five. In some of these cases, 661 00:36:48,079 --> 00:36:51,840 particularly those in Lancaster County, there's a potential involvement from 662 00:36:52,079 --> 00:36:53,760 Allan to older brother Keith. 663 00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:57,480 Speaker 6: Next many people have wondered whether Alan could be involved 664 00:36:57,519 --> 00:37:00,639 in this murder along with his brother Keith. Mary Harding 665 00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:04,360 twenty four went missing on August twenty third, nineteen eighty five. 666 00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:07,880 She was taken from her home. Her children were left 667 00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:10,519 alone in the house. Dinner was on the table, comet, 668 00:37:10,599 --> 00:37:13,360 the bathroom cleaner was in the sink, the cat's litter 669 00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:15,960 tary was spilled in the yard. Mary's flip flops were 670 00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:18,920 found outside, one in the driveway, the other in the 671 00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:21,519 back of the house. Mary was found four days later 672 00:37:21,599 --> 00:37:24,559 on August twenty seventh in the Rappahannock River. She was 673 00:37:24,559 --> 00:37:26,440 found with a rope around her neck tied to a 674 00:37:26,519 --> 00:37:27,639 chain in a cinderblock. 675 00:37:28,119 --> 00:37:30,760 Speaker 3: One of the odd details that jumps out here is 676 00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:34,960 that Mary Harding went by Mary Keyser Harding or Mayne, 677 00:37:35,360 --> 00:37:39,960 worked with Keith Wilmer's wife at the Lancaster Bank, and 678 00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:44,280 these two young married women were very good friends. It 679 00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:49,320 seems like a very odd coincidence that Keith and Alan 680 00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:53,920 knew Mary Keyser Harding very well. Heath Wilmer, by the way, 681 00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:59,119 was banned from the bank's premises, first the inside of 682 00:37:59,159 --> 00:38:02,239 the bank and then all even the parking lot of 683 00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:06,639 the bank because he would continually sexually harass women coming 684 00:38:06,679 --> 00:38:09,880 and going while he sat outside in his vehicle waiting 685 00:38:09,880 --> 00:38:14,079 to pick his wife up after work. So this very odd, dysfunctional, 686 00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:20,440 misogynistic behavior towards women made him stand out as a creeper. 687 00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:23,159 Speaker 6: Next, do we move on to incident ie in the 688 00:38:23,159 --> 00:38:26,039 Colonial Parkway murders, That is, the murder of twenty seven 689 00:38:26,119 --> 00:38:29,360 year old Kathy Thomas and twenty year old Rebecca Dowski. 690 00:38:29,559 --> 00:38:32,440 They were murdered in October of nineteen eighty six. They 691 00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:35,199 were found in Kathy's Honda Civic at the Cheeta Metics 692 00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:36,880 overlook on the Colonial Parkway. 693 00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:38,079 Speaker 4: This was not the. 694 00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:41,440 Speaker 6: Primary crime scene, The primary was elsewhere. They were found 695 00:38:41,480 --> 00:38:44,400 in the way way back of Kathy's Honda Civic. They 696 00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:47,800 had been strangled and their throats were cut as well. 697 00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:51,960 Speaker 3: Another odd detail in Kathy and Becky's murder is that 698 00:38:52,079 --> 00:38:56,440 whoever killed them doused the inside and outside of Kathy's 699 00:38:56,440 --> 00:39:00,760 Honda and the bodies with diesel fuel. In the early going, 700 00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:04,039 they sometimes said kerosene, but later on they seem to 701 00:39:04,079 --> 00:39:06,880 settle on calling it diesel fuel. And they made what 702 00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:09,400 I think is a clumsy attempt to set the car 703 00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:11,519 on fire. And this is one of those things that 704 00:39:11,599 --> 00:39:13,920 always stuck out for me, which is how does somebody 705 00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:18,000 have access to diesel fuel which many boats run on, 706 00:39:18,199 --> 00:39:22,840 but doesn't really fully understand the ignition properties of diesel fuel. 707 00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:25,400 They made an attempt to set the diesel fuel a 708 00:39:25,519 --> 00:39:29,679 light using matches which won't typically work. You might be 709 00:39:29,679 --> 00:39:32,400 able to get diesel fuel going with a very hot 710 00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:35,599 like newspaper torch or something like that. It won't light 711 00:39:35,639 --> 00:39:38,119 with a match like gasoline will go up like that. 712 00:39:38,559 --> 00:39:42,639 Diesel fuel has a much higher ignition point and won't light. 713 00:39:42,559 --> 00:39:43,159 Speaker 2: With a match. 714 00:39:43,239 --> 00:39:45,679 Speaker 3: So it's just one of those very odd details about 715 00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:47,199 Kathy and Becky's crime scene. 716 00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:51,559 Speaker 6: The next is Brian Craig Pattinger twenty five. He went 717 00:39:51,639 --> 00:39:55,559 missing from Hampton on December fourth, nineteen eighty seven, that is, 718 00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:59,679 three months after Robin and David were murdered on Ragged Island. 719 00:40:00,079 --> 00:40:03,840 He was found in Chuktuck Creek in February of nineteen 720 00:40:03,920 --> 00:40:07,320 eighty eight. Next is a case that we have heard 721 00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:10,400 of but we don't have a lot of information about, 722 00:40:10,519 --> 00:40:14,079 and that is Belinda Anne Ashburn thirty three. We have 723 00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:17,760 very little information on her murder. I don't have a 724 00:40:17,800 --> 00:40:22,000 current investigative agency for her, but her homicide was one 725 00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:25,920 that the group f Fact Family and Friends Against Crime Today, 726 00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:28,880 which was founded by the Call family, was looking into 727 00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:32,559 when it was first founded after the initial start of 728 00:40:32,559 --> 00:40:35,800 the Colonial Parkway murders. Blinda Ann Ashburn was found just 729 00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:39,639 over the North Carolina state line in Kurtuck County. She 730 00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:42,760 was stabbed to death and dumped in the water. And 731 00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:45,239 given what we have just learned about Lariy and Powell, 732 00:40:45,480 --> 00:40:48,039 I think it's important that we take a look at 733 00:40:48,039 --> 00:40:52,079 Belinda Anne Ashburn. Next, we have Colonial Parkway murders incident 734 00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:56,000 for Anna Maria Phelps and Daniel Lower. Daniel and Anna 735 00:40:56,039 --> 00:40:59,280 Maria were driving from Amelia County to Virginia Beach to 736 00:40:59,320 --> 00:41:02,760 move in with Anne Marie's boyfriend, Daniel's brother. In late 737 00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:05,920 August of nineteen eighty nine, Daniels car was found at 738 00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:08,599 the New Kent County Rest area, heading westbound, the. 739 00:41:08,599 --> 00:41:10,119 Speaker 4: Opposite of where they should have been going. 740 00:41:10,519 --> 00:41:12,679 Speaker 6: Their bodies were not found until six weeks later on 741 00:41:12,719 --> 00:41:15,400 the property of a private hunt club in u Kent County. 742 00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:18,480 Many people have asked, we do not know if Wilmer 743 00:41:18,599 --> 00:41:21,519 was a member of that hunt club. It was mentioned 744 00:41:21,519 --> 00:41:23,800 at the press conference today he was a member of 745 00:41:24,039 --> 00:41:26,519 a hunt club, but we do not know if it 746 00:41:26,559 --> 00:41:29,320 was that one. If anybody can find that information, please 747 00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:29,800 let us know. 748 00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:34,639 Speaker 3: Wilmer was an avid hunter fisherman. Of course, he made 749 00:41:34,639 --> 00:41:38,360 his living on the water. He was also a crack 750 00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:43,480 shot and he won prizes for his archery prowess, so 751 00:41:43,519 --> 00:41:46,960 it's possible that Wilmer may have gone to this hunt 752 00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:50,599 club as a guest, perhaps to compete in one of 753 00:41:50,639 --> 00:41:54,760 these open competitions turkey shoots they sometimes call them up 754 00:41:54,760 --> 00:41:57,920 this way, things like that, where there are prizes, And 755 00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:01,760 it's possible that will who would have passed by this 756 00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:04,760 area going back and forth between his home base in 757 00:42:04,840 --> 00:42:09,880 Lancaster County and the Peninsula down near Gloucester, etc. Where 758 00:42:09,920 --> 00:42:14,039 he often fished, that he would have passed directly past 759 00:42:14,199 --> 00:42:17,840 this hunt club on Interstate sixty four, so he may 760 00:42:17,840 --> 00:42:21,480 have had some exposure to this hunt club off the interstate. 761 00:42:22,079 --> 00:42:22,280 Speaker 4: Now. 762 00:42:22,320 --> 00:42:26,079 Speaker 6: There's also a wide array of unsolved homicides in Chesapeake, Virginia, 763 00:42:26,159 --> 00:42:28,920 which you can see if you look at the Chesapeake 764 00:42:28,960 --> 00:42:32,320 Cold Case Database, which is available online. The earliest of 765 00:42:32,360 --> 00:42:36,159 those unsolved cases took place in nineteen sixty six. Some 766 00:42:36,199 --> 00:42:40,320 of those homicides are very likely attributable to Elton Manninged Jackson. 767 00:42:40,519 --> 00:42:42,840 He is a serial killer who was hunting gay men 768 00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:45,320 in and around the Tidewater area from eighty seven to 769 00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:49,079 ninety six. He killed largely by strangulation, So some of 770 00:42:49,079 --> 00:42:52,480 those may be attributable to Jackson, but those are certainly 771 00:42:52,519 --> 00:42:55,239 not by any means all of the unsolved cases. There 772 00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:56,840 is a string of women who were killed in the 773 00:42:56,920 --> 00:42:59,760 late eighties in Chesapeake, all of whom are listed in 774 00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:02,639 the Cold Case Homicide database, so we would urge law 775 00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:05,519 enforcement to look at those cases a second time to 776 00:43:05,559 --> 00:43:07,840 see if there's any possible connection to Wilmer. 777 00:43:08,400 --> 00:43:11,079 Speaker 4: The one victim that I do think should. 778 00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:13,679 Speaker 6: Very definitely be taken a look at is Donna Canaday, 779 00:43:13,840 --> 00:43:14,760 age twenty two. 780 00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:15,400 Speaker 4: Now. 781 00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:17,719 Speaker 6: Donna was found shot and killed in a ditch near 782 00:43:17,719 --> 00:43:21,480 the Chesapeake Regional Airport on October eighteenth, nineteen eighty nine. 783 00:43:22,000 --> 00:43:23,920 The front and back doors of her rental house were 784 00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:27,239 standing open. Person keys were missing, but her shoes were 785 00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:30,039 by the front door. Money was left in plain sight. 786 00:43:30,159 --> 00:43:33,159 There was no sign of struggle. Robbery was not considered 787 00:43:33,159 --> 00:43:36,960 a motive, she was not sexually assaulted. I still think 788 00:43:37,079 --> 00:43:38,960 it is one of those things that Wilmer ought to 789 00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:42,360 be looked at for. The final murder victim that we 790 00:43:42,440 --> 00:43:45,800 think should be investigated for potential involvement with Wilmer is 791 00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:48,800 a case that happened in nineteen ninety seven. It is 792 00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:52,199 the case of Amber Lundgren age twenty, who was last 793 00:43:52,199 --> 00:43:56,440 seen outside of Barcode in Asheville, North Carolina. She was 794 00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:59,719 found several hours later in a ditch, stabbed to death, 795 00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:03,280 with defensive wounds on her arms and hands. The reason 796 00:44:03,320 --> 00:44:05,920 that we think she should be looked at for potential 797 00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:08,800 involvement with Wilmer is that the suspect and truck sketches 798 00:44:08,800 --> 00:44:13,000 that were released later looks strikingly similar to Wilmer and 799 00:44:13,079 --> 00:44:16,639 his truck, right down to the metal toolbox. We do 800 00:44:16,760 --> 00:44:19,920 think that there are cases, even past the eighties and 801 00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:22,559 well into the nineties, that Wilmer should be looked at for. 802 00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:25,920 We have much more to talk about when it comes 803 00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:29,840 to Lorien Powell. We also have a number of questions 804 00:44:29,920 --> 00:44:32,519 that people have written in on our social media pages 805 00:44:32,559 --> 00:44:35,000 to ask us that we would like to address. So 806 00:44:35,079 --> 00:44:38,039 we will close this episode for now, but we will 807 00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:41,320 soon drop another one answering as many of your questions 808 00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:42,440 as we possibly can. 809 00:44:42,880 --> 00:44:46,239 Speaker 4: In the meantime, If you have any information. 810 00:44:45,960 --> 00:44:51,199 Speaker 6: Relating to Alan Wade Wilmer Senior, his whereabouts, or his associates, 811 00:44:51,679 --> 00:44:55,960 you can report information in the following locations. You can 812 00:44:55,960 --> 00:44:59,440 call the FBI with tips at one eight hundred call FBI, 813 00:44:59,719 --> 00:45:02,880 or you you can email www dot. 814 00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:04,559 Speaker 4: Tips dot FBI dot gov. 815 00:45:05,039 --> 00:45:07,360 Speaker 6: If you have tips for the Virginia State Police, you 816 00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:13,679 should email them questions at VSP dot Virginia dot gov. 817 00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:16,760 If you have questions for us, please comment on our 818 00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:20,400 social media pages, but please do not send investigative tips 819 00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:22,719 to us. Those do need to go to the VSP. 820 00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:25,480 Thank you so much for listening to this episode of 821 00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:28,079 Mindover Murder. We'll see you next time. 822 00:45:37,280 --> 00:45:41,239 Speaker 1: Mindover Murder is a production of Absolute Zero and Another 823 00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:42,360 Dog Productions. 824 00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:46,239 Speaker 3: Our executive producers are Bill Thomas and Kristindilley. 825 00:45:46,559 --> 00:45:48,920 Speaker 1: Our logo art is by Pamela Arnoit. 826 00:45:49,639 --> 00:45:51,679 Speaker 2: Our theme music is by Kevin McCloud. 827 00:45:52,239 --> 00:45:56,280 Speaker 1: Mindover Murder is distributed in partnership with Coral Space Media. 828 00:45:56,920 --> 00:46:00,000 Speaker 3: You can follow us on Facebook, Twitter, or Instagram. 829 00:46:00,280 --> 00:46:02,880 Speaker 1: You can also follow our page on the Colonial Parkway 830 00:46:02,960 --> 00:46:04,760 Murders on Facebook. 831 00:46:04,559 --> 00:46:07,559 Speaker 3: And finally, you can follow Bill Thomas on Twitter at 832 00:46:07,599 --> 00:46:09,239 Bill Thomas five six. 833 00:46:09,719 --> 00:46:12,639 Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to mind Over Murder.