1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,359 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Deep Dive, the show where we take 2 00:00:02,359 --> 00:00:08,880 these incredibly tangled stories, stories that are politically charged, socially unsettling. 3 00:00:08,359 --> 00:00:10,279 Speaker 2: And we really try to pull them apart. We pull 4 00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:12,320 on the threads to show you exactly what matters. 5 00:00:12,599 --> 00:00:15,800 Speaker 1: And today we are wrestling with a story that, I mean, 6 00:00:15,839 --> 00:00:19,600 it really defines that intersection of wealth, power, and just 7 00:00:20,480 --> 00:00:21,879 profound moral failure. 8 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:25,000 Speaker 2: We are talking, of course, about the relentless and still 9 00:00:25,079 --> 00:00:27,640 unfolding saga of Jeffrey Epstein. 10 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:30,760 Speaker 1: You know, this is a story that's just defined by paradox. 11 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:34,600 For years, this same core question just keeps coming. 12 00:00:34,439 --> 00:00:38,840 Speaker 2: Up, which is, how how did a convicted sex offender, 13 00:00:39,119 --> 00:00:41,920 someone who should have been a complete pariah. 14 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:42,840 Speaker 1: Right instantly ostracized? 15 00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:46,240 Speaker 2: How did he acquire and then maintain such staggering influence, 16 00:00:46,520 --> 00:00:51,039 such wealth, and this proximity to the global elite. 17 00:00:51,079 --> 00:00:53,240 Speaker 1: And maybe the even bigger question is why the power 18 00:00:53,280 --> 00:00:55,439 structure seemed to protect him, you know, even after his 19 00:00:55,479 --> 00:00:56,039 first conviction. 20 00:00:56,479 --> 00:00:58,479 Speaker 2: That is our mission for you today. We are going 21 00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:02,719 to track the political drama, this whole saga that led 22 00:01:02,759 --> 00:01:06,959 to the let's call it grudging release of these critical documents. 23 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:11,239 Speaker 1: It's a real case study in congressional revolt and a 24 00:01:11,319 --> 00:01:12,959 complete presidential reversal. 25 00:01:13,159 --> 00:01:16,599 Speaker 2: We are diving deep into these shocking ethical revelations that 26 00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:19,159 have already come out, things that have just crippled high 27 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:20,319 profile figures. 28 00:01:20,079 --> 00:01:22,599 Speaker 1: People like Larry Summer, Stacey Plaski exactly. 29 00:01:22,879 --> 00:01:25,959 Speaker 2: And then we're going to confront the really deep seated rumors, 30 00:01:26,280 --> 00:01:30,920 the idea that Epstein's true power base wasn't just financial 31 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:33,760 or predatory, but that it was rooted in something much 32 00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:38,959 bigger geopolitical influence, the really unsettling possibility that he was 33 00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:41,920 functioning as a kind of high level foreign agent. 34 00:01:42,159 --> 00:01:45,239 Speaker 1: And to do this, we're drawing from some really solid sources. 35 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:48,840 There's a lot of extensive political reporting that details those 36 00:01:48,920 --> 00:01:49,719 legislative fights. 37 00:01:49,719 --> 00:01:52,400 Speaker 2: We're also looking at detailed analysis of the emails that 38 00:01:52,439 --> 00:01:56,319 have just been released, all what twenty thousand plus pages 39 00:01:56,359 --> 00:01:56,840 of them. 40 00:01:56,719 --> 00:01:59,239 Speaker 1: Yeah, a huge trove of correspondence. And then there's some 41 00:01:59,319 --> 00:02:03,439 crucial expert commentary we're leaning on. Specifically, we're trying to 42 00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:06,480 link the legal and intelligence angles. So for that we're 43 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:10,400 using insights from a former FBI counter intelligence officer, Eric O'Neil. 44 00:02:10,479 --> 00:02:11,719 Speaker 2: Okay, that's a heavy hitter. 45 00:02:11,759 --> 00:02:15,280 Speaker 1: And we're pairing that with the really meticulous investigative reporting 46 00:02:15,319 --> 00:02:18,840 of Ryan Gram. His work at dropsite has been laser 47 00:02:18,879 --> 00:02:24,879 focused on the geopolitical and financial dimensions of this whole network. 48 00:02:25,080 --> 00:02:27,319 Speaker 2: Okay, so let's get into it. Let's unpack this whole thing. 49 00:02:27,360 --> 00:02:30,080 We have to start with the immediate political drum. The 50 00:02:30,120 --> 00:02:34,800 centerpiece is President Trump signing the Epstein Files Transparency Act. 51 00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:37,159 Speaker 1: A bill that was signed only after months and months 52 00:02:37,159 --> 00:02:38,800 of his administration opposing it. 53 00:02:39,199 --> 00:02:41,639 Speaker 2: So, for you, the learner, the biggest question now is 54 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:45,400 whether this sudden pivot, this move towards transparency is just 55 00:02:45,439 --> 00:02:46,280 a political game. 56 00:02:46,479 --> 00:02:49,439 Speaker 1: Is it designed to fail a dud, you know, because 57 00:02:49,439 --> 00:02:50,080 of heavy. 58 00:02:49,800 --> 00:02:53,319 Speaker 2: Redaction, or represent a genuine turning point. Is this the 59 00:02:53,439 --> 00:02:56,639 moment that will finally expose the full horrifying depth of 60 00:02:56,680 --> 00:02:59,360 the network? Yeah, that protected Jeffrey Epstein for so long. 61 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:03,360 Journey to get that signature was it was just pure 62 00:03:03,520 --> 00:03:05,080 political trench warfare? Oh? 63 00:03:05,159 --> 00:03:08,439 Speaker 1: Absolutely. President Trump pulled what the source material rightly calls 64 00:03:08,479 --> 00:03:10,199 a dramatic abault face. 65 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:12,000 Speaker 2: He signed a bill he had fought tooth and nail 66 00:03:12,039 --> 00:03:12,560 for months. 67 00:03:12,879 --> 00:03:16,319 Speaker 1: And let's be clear, this wasn't some sudden change of heart. 68 00:03:16,520 --> 00:03:19,599 Speaker 2: This was him surrendering he was giving in to what's 69 00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:24,879 described as immense political pressure and maybe more importantly, an 70 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:27,159 internal Republican party revolt. 71 00:03:27,199 --> 00:03:30,360 Speaker 1: The velocity of that shift is what's so fascinating. The 72 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:33,479 pressure was just building and building to a breaking point. 73 00:03:33,560 --> 00:03:35,639 Speaker 2: So the House was expected to pass the bill right 74 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:39,840 with near unanimous support after Trump finally backed down. 75 00:03:39,759 --> 00:03:42,120 Speaker 1: But even that was filled with tension. The vote actually 76 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:43,360 got delayed by. 77 00:03:43,240 --> 00:03:44,159 Speaker 2: A single holdout. 78 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:47,319 Speaker 1: A single holdout Republican Representative Clay Higgins. 79 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 2: Clay Higgins is not exactly a figure known for his 80 00:03:50,759 --> 00:03:54,879 let's say, legislative nuance, which made his holdout even more 81 00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:57,400 damaging for the Republican leadership politically speaking. 82 00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:01,919 Speaker 1: Right, the source material cites his his prior controversial history, 83 00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:04,199 supporting some of the most outlandish of. 84 00:04:04,199 --> 00:04:08,439 Speaker 2: Trump's claims, including that deeply xenophobic social media post about 85 00:04:08,439 --> 00:04:09,240 Haitian immigrants. 86 00:04:09,319 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, where he described them as and this is a 87 00:04:11,159 --> 00:04:13,199 quote wild eating pets, voodoo. 88 00:04:13,400 --> 00:04:16,240 Speaker 2: So this is the guy holding up a transparency bill exactly. 89 00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:19,160 Speaker 1: The optics were just terrible. You have the entire body, 90 00:04:19,319 --> 00:04:22,480 led by Republicans trying to pass this bill, and one 91 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:26,199 of the most controversial, you know, fringe members is the 92 00:04:26,199 --> 00:04:27,800 only thing standing in the way. 93 00:04:27,759 --> 00:04:30,399 Speaker 2: Which puts the speaker, Mike Johnson, in a tough. 94 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:32,959 Speaker 1: Spot, a very tough spot. When he finally did get 95 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:36,040 on board, it was, as the source describes it, a 96 00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:38,000 grudging yes vote. 97 00:04:38,079 --> 00:04:40,800 Speaker 2: He was visibly playing defense completely. 98 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:43,839 Speaker 1: He went out of his way to try and you know, 99 00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:47,680 absolve the president, arguing, quote, really, Donald Trump has nothing 100 00:04:47,720 --> 00:04:48,279 to worry about. 101 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:50,600 Speaker 2: And his argument was basically just deflection. 102 00:04:50,759 --> 00:04:53,639 Speaker 1: Wasn't it pure deflection? He said the Biden Justice Department 103 00:04:53,720 --> 00:04:57,560 had the files for four years, and that no prominent Democrat, 104 00:04:57,959 --> 00:05:01,360 not Hicking Jeffreys, not Rikana, had push the issue until now. 105 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:04,879 Speaker 2: The subtext being if there was anything truly explosive in there, 106 00:05:04,920 --> 00:05:08,079 the Democrats would have already used it, so Trump must be innocent. 107 00:05:08,279 --> 00:05:11,519 Speaker 1: It's a calculated attempt at what you might call political immunization, 108 00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:14,920 but it immediately brings up the obvious question of timing. 109 00:05:15,040 --> 00:05:17,959 Speaker 2: If the administration really had nothing to hide. 110 00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:21,000 Speaker 1: Then why the long, concerted effort to delay the bill 111 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:22,360 for months and months. 112 00:05:22,439 --> 00:05:25,399 Speaker 2: That's the real problem, isn't it. Reuter's reported that the 113 00:05:25,439 --> 00:05:30,519 White House was quietly lobbying senators to slow walk their vote. 114 00:05:30,199 --> 00:05:33,480 Speaker 1: At the same time the President was publicly demanding transparency. 115 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:36,480 Speaker 2: You just can't have it both ways. And that kind 116 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:39,879 of manipulation, that game with the legislative calendar, it just 117 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:42,439 fueled this deep public skepticism. 118 00:05:42,519 --> 00:05:45,480 Speaker 1: And that skepticism wasn't just coming from the opposition party. 119 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:45,800 Speaker 2: No. 120 00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:49,720 Speaker 1: Former Vice President Kamala Harris really highlighted the absurdity of 121 00:05:49,759 --> 00:05:52,639 it all. She pointed out the contradiction, saying, all of 122 00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:54,879 a sudden, he was saying he'll wait to see what 123 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:57,040 Congress does since when it. 124 00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:00,000 Speaker 2: Just shows how transparent the political game was to everyone 125 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:01,000 one who is paying attention. 126 00:06:01,199 --> 00:06:04,639 Speaker 1: And the timeline details they really reveal the administration's calculation. 127 00:06:04,879 --> 00:06:07,839 Speaker 2: So Trump finally signs the bill that starts a thirty 128 00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:10,439 day clock for the Justice Department to release the files. 129 00:06:10,519 --> 00:06:12,279 Speaker 1: And where does that thirty day clock land? 130 00:06:12,639 --> 00:06:14,040 Speaker 2: Less than a week before Christmas? 131 00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:18,439 Speaker 1: That specific holiday timing is I mean, it's absolutely strategic. 132 00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:19,759 You can't convince me otherwise. 133 00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:22,120 Speaker 2: It's a classic political okay, classic. 134 00:06:22,319 --> 00:06:26,879 Speaker 1: You release potentially devastating information in that dead zone between 135 00:06:26,959 --> 00:06:28,399 Christmas and New Year's. 136 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:31,360 Speaker 2: The media's focus is scattered. People are preoccupied with. 137 00:06:31,319 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 1: Holidays, The news cycle slows to a crawl. The goal 138 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:40,399 is clearly to minimize the coverage, minimize public attention, you 139 00:06:40,439 --> 00:06:43,680 basically bury the story in tinsel and eggnog. 140 00:06:43,959 --> 00:06:46,600 Speaker 2: And it's just fascinating to watch how that pressure plays 141 00:06:46,639 --> 00:06:49,959 out in real time. When reporters actually pressed Trump on it, 142 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:52,720 on why he dragged his feet if he was so innocent, 143 00:06:52,879 --> 00:06:56,959 he got incredibly defensive, aggressively, so he started resorting to 144 00:06:56,959 --> 00:07:01,040 personal attacks, calling one journalist a terrible porter and a 145 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:01,959 terrible person. 146 00:07:02,079 --> 00:07:05,879 Speaker 1: His defensiveness was just palpable. He claimed vindication, saying he 147 00:07:05,959 --> 00:07:08,399 realized Epskin was a sick pervert and threw him out 148 00:07:08,399 --> 00:07:09,519 of his club many years ago. 149 00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:13,040 Speaker 2: But that defense, it just crumbles under the slightest bit 150 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:16,839 of scrutiny. It leads these two massive unanswered questions just 151 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:18,079 hanging there in the air. 152 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:19,399 Speaker 1: Okay, what's the first one. 153 00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 2: The first is the moral question, and it's the most 154 00:07:21,519 --> 00:07:24,959 obvious one. If you knew Epstein was a sick pervert, 155 00:07:25,639 --> 00:07:27,240 why did you just throw him out of your. 156 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:30,360 Speaker 1: Club instead of reporting him to the authorities like. 157 00:07:30,439 --> 00:07:33,839 Speaker 2: Any responsible citizen would do. And the second is the 158 00:07:33,879 --> 00:07:34,879 political question. 159 00:07:35,079 --> 00:07:38,079 Speaker 1: If you genuinely had nothing to hide. 160 00:07:37,879 --> 00:07:40,240 Speaker 2: Why wait for Congress in the Department of Justice to 161 00:07:40,240 --> 00:07:43,279 force your hand, why not just order the immediate, unredacted 162 00:07:43,319 --> 00:07:44,240 release of everything. 163 00:07:44,839 --> 00:07:48,120 Speaker 1: The implication, which is pretty much impossible to ignore, is 164 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:50,480 that he was trying to buy time, the time for 165 00:07:50,519 --> 00:07:54,759 what for the DOJ to redact anything sensitive before the 166 00:07:54,759 --> 00:07:58,879 political firestorm could really hit. And that suspicion, it's not 167 00:07:58,920 --> 00:08:01,439 just in the media. It's deeply rooted in the electorate. 168 00:08:01,759 --> 00:08:03,399 The polling data confirms it. 169 00:08:03,759 --> 00:08:06,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, we look at a yugav poll that asked voters 170 00:08:06,360 --> 00:08:09,279 directly if they believe Donald Trump was involved in crimes 171 00:08:09,279 --> 00:08:11,399 allegedly committed by Jeffrey Epstein. 172 00:08:11,000 --> 00:08:13,600 Speaker 1: And the numbers were, what. 173 00:08:14,199 --> 00:08:16,959 Speaker 2: A stunning forty six percent of all voters said yes, 174 00:08:17,079 --> 00:08:19,680 forty six percent compared to just twenty nine percent who 175 00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:20,040 said no. 176 00:08:20,439 --> 00:08:23,560 Speaker 1: And this is where that political pressure becomes truly internal. 177 00:08:23,680 --> 00:08:25,639 This isn't just a partisan issue, is it not? 178 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:29,199 Speaker 2: At all? That forty six percent includes nine percent of 179 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:32,720 self identified Republicans who hold that same suspicion. 180 00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:34,000 Speaker 1: Nine percent of his own party. 181 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 2: That level of internal distrust, combined with you know, the 182 00:08:39,399 --> 00:08:43,159 general public distaste for the long government shutdown that happened 183 00:08:43,240 --> 00:08:46,000 right before this, Yeah, that's what forced the president's hand. 184 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:49,120 Speaker 1: And that's what resulted in that dramatic about face. 185 00:08:49,279 --> 00:08:52,919 Speaker 2: The political cost of looking like you're protecting Epstein finally 186 00:08:52,919 --> 00:08:56,399 outweighed the risk of releasing the albeit redacted documents. 187 00:08:56,639 --> 00:08:58,879 Speaker 1: So the act a sign the clock is ticking and 188 00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:01,759 the first major relief uses of correspondence start to drop 189 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:04,200 over twenty thousand pages of emails. 190 00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:06,759 Speaker 2: And he immediately delivered the shocks everyone was expecting. We're 191 00:09:06,759 --> 00:09:11,919 talking about figures of immense mainstream political and well intellectual prestige, 192 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:12,279 and the. 193 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 1: First big name to just crash and burn was Larry Summers. 194 00:09:15,639 --> 00:09:18,399 Speaker 2: Yeah. What stands out about Summers, you know, the former 195 00:09:18,480 --> 00:09:22,679 US Treasury Secretary and influential economic advisor to President Obama, 196 00:09:22,879 --> 00:09:26,759 is the sheer duration and timing of his relationship with Epstein. 197 00:09:26,879 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 1: He kept in contact, which the sources describe as congenial, 198 00:09:30,559 --> 00:09:32,919 well into twenty nineteen, right up until the. 199 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:34,600 Speaker 2: Day Epstein was finally arrested. 200 00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:38,559 Speaker 1: It's just it defies belief, it really does. 201 00:09:38,879 --> 00:09:41,480 Speaker 2: This isn't just some old contact from the past. This 202 00:09:41,519 --> 00:09:44,480 is years after Epstein's conviction, years after he was a 203 00:09:44,519 --> 00:09:46,519 known branded sex offender. 204 00:09:46,279 --> 00:09:49,399 Speaker 1: And the content of their exchanges was just it was 205 00:09:49,440 --> 00:09:50,240 truly toxic. 206 00:09:50,399 --> 00:09:54,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, the released emails detailed some highly inappropriate contact about 207 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:55,399 Summer's personal life. 208 00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:59,279 Speaker 1: Specifically, he was discussing his attempts to and I'm quoting Bed, 209 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:00,720 a younger woman at Harvard. 210 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:03,480 Speaker 2: And to be clear, Summers was a mentor figure to 211 00:10:03,519 --> 00:10:06,120 this woman at the university. He wasn't her direct teacher. 212 00:10:06,159 --> 00:10:07,679 But the power dynamic. 213 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:10,320 Speaker 1: Is the power dynamic is the whole issue. The ethical 214 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:13,480 breach here isn't just maintaining contact with a convicted predator. 215 00:10:13,799 --> 00:10:17,480 It's seeking his advice and discussing this deeply problematic pursuit 216 00:10:17,559 --> 00:10:19,639 involving a subordinate figure at. 217 00:10:19,559 --> 00:10:23,960 Speaker 2: An institution where Summers wielded massive, massive power. He's an 218 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:25,799 institutional titan at Harvard. 219 00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:28,679 Speaker 1: So to use Epstein as a sounding board or even 220 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:33,039 a confidant for pursuing a mentee, it just shows a 221 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:37,399 profound lapse in judgment, an alarming disregard for the very 222 00:10:37,519 --> 00:10:39,639 norms that are supposed to protect students. 223 00:10:39,919 --> 00:10:42,919 Speaker 2: Well. The fallout from it shows that even Somers understood 224 00:10:42,919 --> 00:10:44,080 the scale of his error. 225 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:47,360 Speaker 1: He had to He released a statement calling the association 226 00:10:47,639 --> 00:10:49,519 a major error of judgment. 227 00:10:49,600 --> 00:10:52,080 Speaker 2: He immediately stepped aside from his teaching duties at Harvard, 228 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:55,559 which then launched its own internal investigation. 229 00:10:55,039 --> 00:10:56,840 Speaker 1: And he resigned from the board of Open AI. 230 00:10:57,039 --> 00:11:00,799 Speaker 2: That's a very quick, very comprehensive retreat from public life. 231 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:04,679 Speaker 1: It suggests a preemptive damage control measure, doesn't it. He knew, 232 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:07,639 as the sources say, that there's even more on the. 233 00:11:07,600 --> 00:11:10,159 Speaker 2: Way, so he was cutting ties before the next shoe 234 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:10,720 could drop. 235 00:11:10,919 --> 00:11:13,840 Speaker 1: And if you compare his timeline to other figures, like 236 00:11:14,000 --> 00:11:15,840 say Prince Andrew. 237 00:11:15,519 --> 00:11:17,879 Speaker 2: Who cut contact a decade and a half. 238 00:11:17,720 --> 00:11:22,159 Speaker 1: Earlier, right Summer's insistence on maintaining that communication right up 239 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:25,399 to the final arrest, it makes his association look so 240 00:11:25,639 --> 00:11:27,759 much more deliberate, so much more continuous. 241 00:11:28,120 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 2: It really speaks to a deep sense of entitlement among 242 00:11:30,840 --> 00:11:32,399 certain members of the elite, doesn't it. 243 00:11:32,399 --> 00:11:35,159 Speaker 1: It does the idea that the rules apply to everyone 244 00:11:35,159 --> 00:11:38,519 else but not to them, and that Epstein, regardless of 245 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:40,440 his past, was somehow still useful. 246 00:11:40,679 --> 00:11:43,600 Speaker 2: And that idea of utility brings us to the next revelation, 247 00:11:44,080 --> 00:11:48,399 which is arguably even more politically brazen. Stacey Plaski, the 248 00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:53,000 non voting Democratic delegate for the US Virgin Islands, her 249 00:11:53,039 --> 00:11:57,480 relationship with Epstein. It wasn't sexual, but it was profoundly financial. 250 00:11:57,080 --> 00:11:59,159 Speaker 1: And decades long, largely. 251 00:11:58,879 --> 00:12:02,080 Speaker 2: Because Epstein owned an Eye Island and her constituency. 252 00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:04,519 Speaker 1: That relationship really defined their whole connection. He was her 253 00:12:04,519 --> 00:12:08,240 local representative, so Epstein donated to her campaign and she 254 00:12:08,399 --> 00:12:10,279 represented his interests, and. 255 00:12:10,240 --> 00:12:13,399 Speaker 2: The victims quite understandably saw this as facilitation. 256 00:12:13,679 --> 00:12:17,919 Speaker 1: Yeah. The sources detail a previous and unsuccessful lawsuit where 257 00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:22,559 victim's alleged Plasket facilitated Epstein in his ongoing sex trafficking 258 00:12:22,600 --> 00:12:27,320 operation we by ensuring he received preferential treatment and unfettered, 259 00:12:27,440 --> 00:12:31,440 unmonitored freedom while he was living in the Virgin Islands. 260 00:12:30,759 --> 00:12:35,279 Speaker 2: And the release emails they gave us a clear, undeniable 261 00:12:35,320 --> 00:12:39,080 picture of just how transactional their connection was. 262 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:43,879 Speaker 1: In twenty eighteen, Plasket personally emailed the convicted sex offender. 263 00:12:43,759 --> 00:12:46,039 Speaker 2: Asking for campaign contributions. 264 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:49,120 Speaker 1: Explicitly writing I would be grateful for his support and 265 00:12:49,159 --> 00:12:51,600 the support of those that he made direct to assist me. 266 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:54,840 Speaker 2: It's a direct request for money and connections from a 267 00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:58,200 person everyone knew should be completely radioactive, and that's bad enough. 268 00:12:58,559 --> 00:13:02,919 Speaker 1: But the most stunning revelation the real puppet master moment. 269 00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:05,759 Speaker 2: Came from that twenty nineteen incident during a congressional hearing. 270 00:13:05,559 --> 00:13:08,799 Speaker 1: The Michael Cohen hearing, Trump's former fixer. 271 00:13:08,519 --> 00:13:11,200 Speaker 2: Describe that moment for us because it really highlights how 272 00:13:11,200 --> 00:13:15,399 Epstein was actively trying to manipulate legislative action from the sidelines. 273 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:18,480 Speaker 1: Okay, so Epstein is watching the hearing on television, and 274 00:13:18,519 --> 00:13:22,080 he's simultaneously texting Plaskett, who is sitting right there in Congress. 275 00:13:22,279 --> 00:13:22,600 Speaker 2: Wow. 276 00:13:22,639 --> 00:13:25,919 Speaker 1: He starts with just pure personal flattery. You look good, great, 277 00:13:26,039 --> 00:13:29,039 great dress, you know, softening her up right, and then 278 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:32,679 he moves straight into legislative direction. He texts her that 279 00:13:32,759 --> 00:13:36,240 Cohen had brought up Rona, Keeper of the Secrets. 280 00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:38,720 Speaker 2: And Plasket's reply is the key here. It shows her 281 00:13:38,759 --> 00:13:41,960 panic and her readiness to just comply immediately, even though 282 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:44,159 she has no idea what he's talking about exactly. 283 00:13:44,480 --> 00:13:47,519 Speaker 1: She replies Rona quick, I'm up next? Is that an acronym? 284 00:13:47,639 --> 00:13:51,279 Speaker 2: She's asking for clarification while literally waiting for her turn 285 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:51,759 to speak. 286 00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:55,200 Speaker 1: Epstein clarifies that's his assistant, So. 287 00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:58,639 Speaker 2: She takes a question, rushes to the microphone and immediately 288 00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:04,320 asks about miss Rona. She mistakenly believes Rona is a 289 00:14:04,399 --> 00:14:04,919 last name. 290 00:14:05,080 --> 00:14:09,159 Speaker 1: She was referring to Ronograph, Trump's executive assistant, but she 291 00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:12,519 was just guessing at the context, the political absurdity of it, 292 00:14:12,879 --> 00:14:16,600 reading a script provided by a convicted sex offender without 293 00:14:16,600 --> 00:14:18,600 even understanding the subject matter. 294 00:14:19,279 --> 00:14:23,200 Speaker 2: It's immense and Epsty's reply after she did it good work. 295 00:14:23,360 --> 00:14:25,720 She was operating as a literal conduit for him. 296 00:14:25,639 --> 00:14:28,559 Speaker 1: And her defense, which the sources labeled the excuse for 297 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:32,039 the ages was that she quote believed that Jeffrey Epstein 298 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:34,480 had information and I was going to get information to 299 00:14:34,519 --> 00:14:35,200 get at the truth. 300 00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 2: Then she just dismisses the whole thing early. 301 00:14:37,200 --> 00:14:38,919 Speaker 1: That's what this whole Epstein thing is about. It's about 302 00:14:38,919 --> 00:14:39,639 moving forward. 303 00:14:39,879 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 2: That kind of flippant dismissal, the idea that we should 304 00:14:42,879 --> 00:14:45,840 just move forward after she was caught taking questions from 305 00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:50,519 a criminal operator. That's what breeds such extreme public cynicism. 306 00:14:50,960 --> 00:14:54,120 Speaker 1: It exposed a fundamental truth about Washington culture, didn't it. 307 00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:58,559 That campaign contributions buy you access, they buy you favors, 308 00:14:58,840 --> 00:14:59,240 and they. 309 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:02,159 Speaker 2: Can even buy you manipulation of the legislative process. 310 00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:05,720 Speaker 1: And the political hypocrisy from her colleagues that followed was 311 00:15:05,799 --> 00:15:09,600 immediate and uh highly corrosive. 312 00:15:09,759 --> 00:15:13,120 Speaker 2: Democrats like Hakeen Jeffries and Jamie Raskin, who had spent 313 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:16,399 years using Trump's connections to Epstein as a political. 314 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:19,600 Speaker 1: Hammer, suddenly went silent. When they were confronted with Plasket's actions. 315 00:15:19,759 --> 00:15:24,120 Speaker 2: Jeffries completely refused to address her directly. Instead, he deflected. 316 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:27,919 Speaker 1: He started praising the work of Representative Massy of Rocanna, 317 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:31,720 but most importantly the survivors. He strategically hid behind the 318 00:15:31,759 --> 00:15:33,159 survivor to avoid. 319 00:15:32,799 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 2: Holding his own party member accountable. 320 00:15:34,799 --> 00:15:37,960 Speaker 1: And Raskin's response was maybe even more damaging in terms 321 00:15:37,960 --> 00:15:39,679 of just minimizing the ethics of it. What did you 322 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:42,320 say when asked about the ethical breach? He just dismissed 323 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:45,799 it entirely. He said, where's the ethical transgression? He's just 324 00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:48,679 a constituent. He'd paid his debt to society. 325 00:15:48,360 --> 00:15:52,960 Speaker 2: Which completely ignores the profound difference between a normal constituent 326 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:57,519 interaction and having a highly compromised figure feed you specific 327 00:15:57,879 --> 00:16:00,399 unverified questions during a high profile hearing. 328 00:16:00,519 --> 00:16:03,279 Speaker 1: And the source material is really clear on this point. 329 00:16:03,399 --> 00:16:07,840 This institutional refusal to hold your own side accountable, it 330 00:16:07,919 --> 00:16:12,120 feeds that dangerous public perception that both sides are as 331 00:16:12,159 --> 00:16:12,600 bad as. 332 00:16:12,519 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 2: Each other and that they are all in on it. 333 00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:18,000 Speaker 1: That narrative whether it's true or not, is precisely what 334 00:16:18,159 --> 00:16:21,080 Donald Trump is counting on to mitigate his own exposure. 335 00:16:21,399 --> 00:16:24,360 Speaker 2: It shifts the blame from one person's criminal connections to 336 00:16:24,440 --> 00:16:28,840 an entire system's generalized corruption. Okay, so the files are coming, 337 00:16:29,039 --> 00:16:31,440 But the big question that one everyone is asking is 338 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:33,960 how much are we actually going to get to see 339 00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:37,799 the timing of President Trump's executive order? You know, launching 340 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:41,480 a new investigation into prominent Democrats like Bill Clinton and Larry. 341 00:16:41,279 --> 00:16:44,080 Speaker 1: Summers less than a week before he signed the Transparency Act. 342 00:16:44,279 --> 00:16:47,519 Speaker 2: It looks so calculated. Was this a tactical move to 343 00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:49,279 create a loophole for redaction? 344 00:16:49,799 --> 00:16:53,840 Speaker 1: Well, according to Eric O'Neil, the former FBI counterintelligence expert 345 00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:56,960 we mentioned, the answer is yes, absolutely. 346 00:16:57,039 --> 00:16:58,559 Speaker 2: He says this is standard procedure. 347 00:16:58,679 --> 00:17:02,720 Speaker 1: He emphasizes that the ongoing investigation loophole is standard operating 348 00:17:02,799 --> 00:17:05,599 procedure in law enforcement, and it's always the most potent 349 00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:06,119 tool for. 350 00:17:06,079 --> 00:17:10,599 Speaker 2: Reaction, and the legal rationale behind that protection is pretty powerful, 351 00:17:10,680 --> 00:17:12,640 even if it is politically frustrating for us. 352 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:15,440 Speaker 1: It's a core principle of due process right. You can't 353 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:20,240 release information related to an active, ongoing investigation because doing 354 00:17:20,279 --> 00:17:26,000 so risks unfairly identifying, punishing, or destroying the reputation of 355 00:17:26,000 --> 00:17:29,720 individuals who might ultimately be found innocent before they're ever 356 00:17:29,759 --> 00:17:30,640 formally indicted. 357 00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:34,359 Speaker 2: O'Neill stresses that an investigation has to pursue both innocence 358 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:35,559 and guilt right. 359 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:39,240 Speaker 1: So by launching new investigations into prominent democrats, the DOJ 360 00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:42,279 and the FBI now have a legitimate legal basis to 361 00:17:42,359 --> 00:17:45,200 redact all correspondence related to those people. 362 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:47,119 Speaker 2: Regardless of what that correspondence actually says. 363 00:17:47,359 --> 00:17:50,640 Speaker 1: It all just gets covered under the umbrella of ongoing 364 00:17:50,680 --> 00:17:54,519 investigative goals. It will simply, as he puts it, not 365 00:17:54,799 --> 00:17:57,839 be part of the Epstein files information that is produced 366 00:17:57,880 --> 00:17:59,039 in the next thirty days. 367 00:17:59,240 --> 00:18:02,079 Speaker 2: So O'Neil's and analysis is here is key. He thinks 368 00:18:02,160 --> 00:18:05,400 the success of the act really hinges on how many 369 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:08,440 redactions fall unto this specific category exactly. 370 00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:11,240 Speaker 1: He says, a positive sign would be if the DOJ 371 00:18:11,519 --> 00:18:15,359 is redacting information related to dozens of people, because that 372 00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:18,000 means they are actively being investigated in. A negative sign 373 00:18:18,079 --> 00:18:20,880 would be if they release the files with no open 374 00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:25,319 investigation redactions. That would signal that they aren't pursuing anybody seriously. 375 00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:27,799 Speaker 2: And that potential lack of action is exactly what previous 376 00:18:27,799 --> 00:18:30,960 claims suggested, right like from former Agpambondi. 377 00:18:31,079 --> 00:18:33,079 Speaker 1: Yeah, when she said there was no there there and 378 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:35,440 no actionable information or client list. 379 00:18:35,799 --> 00:18:39,480 Speaker 2: So the sudden shift to launching investigations now months later, 380 00:18:40,079 --> 00:18:43,200 it certainly invites suspicion that this is just a delaying tactic. 381 00:18:43,559 --> 00:18:46,920 Speaker 1: The DOJ is caught in a really impossible political bind here. 382 00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:51,400 They have to demonstrate action to appease Congress and the public. 383 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:54,079 Speaker 2: Well at the same time using legal defenses to protect 384 00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:56,680 the integrity of any legitimate investigation they might have. 385 00:18:56,839 --> 00:19:00,400 Speaker 1: O'Neil outlined five key areas. He calls them the five 386 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:05,400 legal shields that the DOJ is either obligated or allowed 387 00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:09,640 to use for redaction even under this new Mandatory Disclosure Act. 388 00:19:09,759 --> 00:19:11,880 Speaker 2: Okay, let's walk through those shields, starting again with the 389 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:12,359 first one. 390 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:16,480 Speaker 1: One ongoing investigations. We've covered this, but the Act requires 391 00:19:16,519 --> 00:19:20,039 that this specific redaction must be incredibly narrow. 392 00:19:20,160 --> 00:19:23,359 Speaker 2: And crucially, the DOJ has to report why they are 393 00:19:23,359 --> 00:19:24,720 withholding it right. 394 00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:27,279 Speaker 1: A public report that will give us the first real 395 00:19:27,319 --> 00:19:30,279 window into the scope and targets of their current inquiries, 396 00:19:30,599 --> 00:19:32,039 but without revealing any names. 397 00:19:32,119 --> 00:19:35,160 Speaker 2: Okay. The second shield is one that absolutely has to 398 00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:37,440 be prioritized, no matter what the political pressure is. 399 00:19:37,559 --> 00:19:41,720 Speaker 1: Two victim's identities. This is the most important ethical and 400 00:19:41,799 --> 00:19:45,279 legal shield. Any information that could possibly identify a victim 401 00:19:45,319 --> 00:19:45,839 will be. 402 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:47,160 Speaker 2: Scrubbed, as it should be. 403 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:50,440 Speaker 1: The individuals who suffered this abuse have to be protected, 404 00:19:50,799 --> 00:19:52,680 and they must retain the right to decide if they 405 00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:55,680 want to come forward on their own terms. This shield 406 00:19:55,720 --> 00:19:59,200 is non negotiable. It's essential to prevent any further trauma. 407 00:19:59,319 --> 00:20:02,319 Speaker 2: What about the people who cooperate with the FBI. You 408 00:20:02,319 --> 00:20:04,759 have to protect the ability of law enforcement to get. 409 00:20:04,559 --> 00:20:09,200 Speaker 1: Witnesses, right, that's shield number three, cooperating witnesses informants. If 410 00:20:09,240 --> 00:20:12,559 someone was, say a small fish, who committed a minor 411 00:20:12,599 --> 00:20:15,680 crime and is now cooperating with the DOJ or FBI 412 00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:17,599 to catch the big fish. 413 00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:19,359 Speaker 2: Their identity has to be redacted, has. 414 00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:22,319 Speaker 1: To be to ensure their safety and their continued usefulness. 415 00:20:22,599 --> 00:20:26,119 They'll likely be referenced generically something like confidential informant one. 416 00:20:26,359 --> 00:20:28,400 Speaker 2: It's standard prosecutorial strategy. 417 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:31,680 Speaker 1: Right, You sacrifice the ability to prosecute a minor crime 418 00:20:31,759 --> 00:20:33,799 in order to secure a major conviction. 419 00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:36,960 Speaker 2: Okay, so then we get into the more procedural protections, 420 00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:39,400 starting with the judicial process itself right. 421 00:20:39,519 --> 00:20:45,359 Speaker 1: Four grand jury material, testimony deliberations, any specific information used 422 00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:48,960 to secure indictments. All of that is typically protected from. 423 00:20:48,759 --> 00:20:50,559 Speaker 2: Disclosure, and the reason for that the. 424 00:20:50,519 --> 00:20:54,000 Speaker 1: Grand jury process is meant to be secret to protect 425 00:20:54,000 --> 00:20:56,920 the innocent and ensure the integrity of the whole process. 426 00:20:57,440 --> 00:20:59,480 We will not get to see how the grand jury 427 00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:01,559 decided which charges to pursue. 428 00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:04,599 Speaker 2: And finally, there's the internal bureaucracy of the agencies. 429 00:21:04,720 --> 00:21:10,039 Speaker 1: Five internal DOJFBI deliberations. This is often called the sausage 430 00:21:10,079 --> 00:21:10,920 making process. 431 00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:14,759 Speaker 2: How they decided what to pursue, what intelligence to prioritize, 432 00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:16,200 what resources were. 433 00:21:16,079 --> 00:21:19,720 Speaker 1: Allocated exactly, and this is protected by attorney client privilege, 434 00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:23,000 especially if they were clever enough to involve their general 435 00:21:23,039 --> 00:21:26,440 counsel in those high level communications. This will likely be 436 00:21:26,559 --> 00:21:29,279 a very large category of redactions. 437 00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:31,279 Speaker 2: And it will prevent us from understanding the true depth 438 00:21:31,359 --> 00:21:35,400 of any institutional cover up or lack thereof. Precisely so, 439 00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:38,079 the thirty day clock is ticking. What does Eric O'Neil, 440 00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:41,359 as a former insider, actually believe about the feasibility of 441 00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:42,599 them meeting this deadline? 442 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:45,599 Speaker 1: He's highly skeptical. O'Neill notes that, having been on the 443 00:21:45,599 --> 00:21:49,160 government side doing these kinds of massive sensitive redactions, thirty 444 00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:51,200 days is a virtually impossible. 445 00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:52,480 Speaker 2: Timeframe, so he expects delays. 446 00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:56,039 Speaker 1: He fully expects the DOJ will ask for and likely 447 00:21:56,079 --> 00:21:59,240 be granted more time. The public really needs to be 448 00:21:59,319 --> 00:22:00,799 prepared for that, and. 449 00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:05,279 Speaker 2: Once the eventually redacted files released, the fight for the 450 00:22:05,279 --> 00:22:06,880 rest of the information just begins. 451 00:22:07,079 --> 00:22:09,920 Speaker 1: Right that's when it really kicks off. The Act requires 452 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:13,519 the DOJ to explain why they withheld information within fifteen 453 00:22:13,599 --> 00:22:14,960 days after the files. 454 00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:16,799 Speaker 2: Are released, and what does that explanation look like. 455 00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:20,440 Speaker 1: It'll be entirely legal and procedural. They won't provide names, 456 00:22:20,599 --> 00:22:24,680 but they will use broad brush categories to explain which 457 00:22:24,799 --> 00:22:28,880 legal rule like ongoing investigation or victim Protection Rule six 458 00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:31,599 y was used for each batch of redactions. 459 00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:34,240 Speaker 2: But that detailed legal justification is the key. 460 00:22:34,599 --> 00:22:37,680 Speaker 1: It's the key because it allows outside experts like O'Neil 461 00:22:37,759 --> 00:22:40,160 to read between the lines and get a deeper sense 462 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,279 of what is being protected and why, and. 463 00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:46,200 Speaker 2: Then Congress and the public can unleash the hounds exactly. 464 00:22:46,279 --> 00:22:50,359 Speaker 1: Congressional committees will immediately demand to see all redacted material 465 00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:52,839 in a closed session. That's what the legal term in 466 00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:53,759 camera means. 467 00:22:53,799 --> 00:22:55,279 Speaker 2: It's not about filming, No. 468 00:22:55,279 --> 00:22:58,119 Speaker 1: It means the documents are shown privately to the committee 469 00:22:58,240 --> 00:23:01,839 under strict security clearance, away from the public eye, so 470 00:23:02,079 --> 00:23:05,240 Congress can determine if the DOJ actually followed the letter. 471 00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:05,720 Speaker 2: Of the law. Yeah. 472 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:08,920 Speaker 1: At the same time, outside victim advocacy groups and special 473 00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:13,440 interest organizations will file Freedom of Information Act FOIA requests 474 00:23:13,759 --> 00:23:16,880 and they'll likely launch lawsuits demanding the release of the 475 00:23:16,920 --> 00:23:17,799 rest of the information. 476 00:23:18,359 --> 00:23:21,839 Speaker 2: So the Act begins the process, But the transparency fight, 477 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:26,000 it's really just getting started. Okay. Now, let's shift to 478 00:23:26,039 --> 00:23:29,599 the most explosive and frankly, the most persistent question in 479 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:33,880 this whole saga. How did Epstein secure and then sustain 480 00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:37,079 this seemingly limitless power and wealth. 481 00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:39,920 Speaker 1: This is where the speculation often centers on the theory 482 00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:42,319 that he was an agent of Israel or Masad. 483 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:45,119 Speaker 2: It's a compelling narrative, isn't it, because it offers a 484 00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:48,200 neat explanation for the unexplained wealth and protection he seemed 485 00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:48,440 to have. 486 00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:52,440 Speaker 1: It does. However, former FBI agent Eric O'Neil, he really 487 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:55,200 dismisses the idea of him being a formal card carrying 488 00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:59,240 massad agent as speculation, a conspiracy theory, and his reasoning, 489 00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:02,160 he states, there is nothing that proves that in the 490 00:24:02,200 --> 00:24:05,079 thirty thousand plus pages of evidence that have been released 491 00:24:05,079 --> 00:24:08,440 so far. O'Neill's take is that he was simply a 492 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:11,440 really bad guy with a lot of money who people 493 00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:12,799 in power wanted to be around. 494 00:24:13,279 --> 00:24:15,680 Speaker 2: But the lack of evidence in the release documents doesn't 495 00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:19,359 necessarily mean he's innocent of that charge, right right. O'Neil 496 00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:23,839 himself offered a pretty crucial caveat about national security redactions. 497 00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:28,079 Speaker 1: Oh. Absolutely, The massive glaring caveat is that if Epstein 498 00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:32,640 was involved in any kind of espionage, foreign counterintelligence, or 499 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:35,359 operations related to national security. 500 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:38,039 Speaker 2: That information is a slam dunk, easy to redact and 501 00:24:38,079 --> 00:24:39,920 remove category of information. Right. 502 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:41,960 Speaker 1: O'Neil acknowledges that if he was a spy, we would 503 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:44,319 never ever see it disclosed in these public documents. 504 00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:47,759 Speaker 2: So if the counterintelligence experts are skeptical, where does the 505 00:24:47,799 --> 00:24:51,079 factual evidence of foreign government connections actually come from? 506 00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:53,759 Speaker 1: This is where the investigative reporting that emerged from that 507 00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,559 RANI and hacking group Hondola becomes so. 508 00:24:56,599 --> 00:24:58,319 Speaker 2: Critical the Hondli emails. 509 00:24:58,559 --> 00:25:04,880 Speaker 1: Yes, those emails detailed a strange, deeply transactional relationship between 510 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:08,799 Epstein and the former Israeli Prime Minister Ehud. 511 00:25:08,440 --> 00:25:12,079 Speaker 2: Barock, and these documents clearly showed Epstein was acting as 512 00:25:12,079 --> 00:25:13,920 an intermediary for Barack. 513 00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:18,559 Speaker 1: Quietly facilitating Barack's lucrative post government career as a salesman 514 00:25:18,599 --> 00:25:20,839 of Israeli security services around the globe. 515 00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:22,640 Speaker 2: We're not just talking about consulting work. 516 00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:25,440 Speaker 1: Here, no, No, he was operating at a strategic global 517 00:25:25,519 --> 00:25:29,559 level a broker for defense and surveillance technology. The sources 518 00:25:29,559 --> 00:25:33,440 cite some highly specific examples of this global broker. For instance, 519 00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:36,839 the deal in codey wir Right, Epstein broker a lucrative 520 00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:40,240 security deal between Israeli interests and that West African nation, 521 00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:43,480 and it essentially amounted to selling them the blueprints and 522 00:25:43,559 --> 00:25:45,920 technology for a surveillance state that's. 523 00:25:45,839 --> 00:25:51,960 Speaker 2: Highly sophisticated, sensitive technology being deployed in a really complex geopolitical. 524 00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:53,599 Speaker 1: Environment, all facilitated by Jeffrey Epstein. 525 00:25:53,680 --> 00:25:55,839 Speaker 2: And his reach wasn't just limited to Africa. 526 00:25:56,319 --> 00:25:59,519 Speaker 1: No, they also struck security deals and created extra business 527 00:25:59,519 --> 00:26:03,519 opportunity in Mongolia, which just shows Epstein's wide reaching network 528 00:26:03,559 --> 00:26:07,119 into Asia. He was providing global access to governments that 529 00:26:07,160 --> 00:26:09,960 were desperate for defense and surveillance capabilities. 530 00:26:10,079 --> 00:26:14,440 Speaker 2: He even dabbled in some alternative high stakes diplomacy he did. 531 00:26:14,759 --> 00:26:18,799 Speaker 1: The documents reveal Epstein organizing a back channel meeting between 532 00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:21,839 Ahud Barak and Russian President Vladimir. 533 00:26:21,400 --> 00:26:23,160 Speaker 2: Putin and the goal of that meeting. 534 00:26:23,039 --> 00:26:26,240 Speaker 1: To try and encourage Russia to end the conflict in Syria. 535 00:26:26,319 --> 00:26:30,359 This shows him operating completely outside of traditional diplomatic channels 536 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:33,759 trying to influence global conflicts. That's a role that far 537 00:26:33,839 --> 00:26:36,160 exceeds just being a high net worth playboy. 538 00:26:36,559 --> 00:26:40,640 Speaker 2: And his proximity to Israeli intelligence interests. Yeah, it couldn't 539 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:44,000 be any closer. He housed a senior Israeli intelligence officer 540 00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:45,200 in his Manhattan. 541 00:26:44,759 --> 00:26:46,359 Speaker 1: Apartment on and off for years. 542 00:26:46,519 --> 00:26:50,480 Speaker 2: That level of access suggests an operational usefulness, whether or 543 00:26:50,519 --> 00:26:52,319 not he held a formal spy designation. 544 00:26:52,759 --> 00:26:55,279 Speaker 1: And this brings us to Ryan Grimm, the investigative reporter 545 00:26:55,319 --> 00:26:57,720 from dropsite. He offers what I think is the most 546 00:26:57,759 --> 00:27:01,319 compelling framework for understanding Epstein's ultimate power. 547 00:27:01,559 --> 00:27:02,240 Speaker 2: What's his take? 548 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:05,759 Speaker 1: Grimm argues that asking if Epstein worked for Masad or 549 00:27:05,799 --> 00:27:08,079 the Cia is actually the wrong. 550 00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:11,400 Speaker 2: Question because it inverts the power dynamics at play exactly. 551 00:27:11,799 --> 00:27:16,599 Speaker 1: Grimm suggests Epstein was operating within a supernational global elite, 552 00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:18,559 the Davos men and women. 553 00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:22,039 Speaker 2: And their ultimate allegiance isn't to the US or Israel 554 00:27:22,279 --> 00:27:23,960 or any single nation state. 555 00:27:24,039 --> 00:27:27,720 Speaker 1: But to this global power set itself, competing for influence 556 00:27:27,759 --> 00:27:30,960 within it. And Epstein was at the absolute epicenter of 557 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:31,839 this group. 558 00:27:31,839 --> 00:27:35,279 Speaker 2: And the implication of that is terrifying. Instead of an 559 00:27:35,279 --> 00:27:37,200 elite working for intelligence. 560 00:27:36,759 --> 00:27:40,920 Speaker 1: Agencies, Grim suggests intelligence agencies often work for these elites, 561 00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:44,559 serving the interests in the competing factions within that global 562 00:27:44,559 --> 00:27:45,359 power structure. 563 00:27:45,839 --> 00:27:50,119 Speaker 2: So Epstein, the ultimate connector and facilitator, was positioned above them, 564 00:27:50,279 --> 00:27:51,079 not beneath them. 565 00:27:51,279 --> 00:27:54,079 Speaker 1: And Grimm's conclusion is that this framework does answer that 566 00:27:54,160 --> 00:27:56,519 ultimate question of his value and his wealth. 567 00:27:56,559 --> 00:27:58,359 Speaker 2: It wasn't primarily about blackmail, right. 568 00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:00,880 Speaker 1: Blackmail was certainly a tool in the tool, but he 569 00:28:00,960 --> 00:28:05,599 was valuable because he was a constant connector delivering deals, money, power, 570 00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:08,960 and access in these incredibly complex global operations. 571 00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:12,759 Speaker 2: His specific, highly technical expertise was crucial here. 572 00:28:12,839 --> 00:28:16,680 Speaker 1: Absolutely, he understood how to move immense sums of money 573 00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:20,000 without a trace. He had a deep command of global 574 00:28:20,079 --> 00:28:24,079 tax and money laundering policy. This was essential for figures 575 00:28:24,079 --> 00:28:28,720 involved in high level warlord activity, mining magnets, and weapons companies. 576 00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:32,440 Speaker 2: The shocking conclusion, then, as Grim articulates, it, is that 577 00:28:32,519 --> 00:28:35,000 in many of these cases, the elites didn't need to 578 00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:36,400 be blackmailed to be drawn in. 579 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,240 Speaker 1: They wanted to use Epstein as the connector to make 580 00:28:39,279 --> 00:28:44,160 incredibly complex, shady shady deals come together. In places like 581 00:28:44,200 --> 00:28:47,599 Cote de War Mongolia, Nigeria, the UAE. 582 00:28:47,359 --> 00:28:51,599 Speaker 2: Epstein was the untraceable, non ideological conduit who could deliver 583 00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:53,000 on any promise. 584 00:28:52,799 --> 00:28:55,319 Speaker 1: And that access became his ultimate currency. 585 00:28:55,519 --> 00:28:58,119 Speaker 2: So given the gravity and the specific nature of this 586 00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:02,440 documented evidence about geopolitical fixing about proximity to high level 587 00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:05,839 foreign intelligence, why do the sources note this profound media 588 00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:06,960 blackout in the US. 589 00:29:07,119 --> 00:29:10,599 Speaker 1: It is a striking phenomenon. Most mainstream American media outlets 590 00:29:10,599 --> 00:29:13,759 have focused intensely on the salacious sex trafficking aspect the 591 00:29:13,799 --> 00:29:15,359 celebrity connections. 592 00:29:15,079 --> 00:29:17,759 Speaker 2: But they've imposed with the source calls a near media 593 00:29:17,799 --> 00:29:21,720 blackout on the Israel and broader foreign agent allegations. 594 00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:25,079 Speaker 1: Reason Magazine is cited as a rare exception that actually 595 00:29:25,119 --> 00:29:27,400 covered the complexity of the Hondola emails, and this. 596 00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:31,240 Speaker 2: Blackout has real world political consequences, doesn't it. It creates 597 00:29:31,240 --> 00:29:33,079 this information imbalance. 598 00:29:32,799 --> 00:29:36,400 Speaker 1: A huge one. The sources highlighted the absurdity of it 599 00:29:36,519 --> 00:29:40,640 when Representative Marjorie Taylor Green alluded to the geopolitical reporting 600 00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:42,960 during a hostile CNN interview. 601 00:29:42,839 --> 00:29:45,960 Speaker 2: Right Because CNN hadn't covered the content of the emails, 602 00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:49,319 the deals the intelligence officer living in his apartment. 603 00:29:49,680 --> 00:29:53,680 Speaker 1: She sounded, She sounded completely crazy to their viewers, even 604 00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:57,319 though the factual correspondence was publicly available. It allowed the 605 00:29:57,319 --> 00:30:01,440 network to just dismiss the complex document intelligence aspect as 606 00:30:01,519 --> 00:30:02,880 pure conspiracy theory. 607 00:30:03,039 --> 00:30:05,720 Speaker 2: So if we connect the public cynicism that was generated 608 00:30:05,759 --> 00:30:09,480 by this whole slow walk transparency fight right and the 609 00:30:09,559 --> 00:30:11,960 clear exposure of elite ethical. 610 00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:14,599 Speaker 1: Corruption, we can see how this controversy really affected the 611 00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:16,240 American political landscape. 612 00:30:16,319 --> 00:30:19,839 Speaker 2: The controversy combined with that long government shut down right 613 00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:23,519 before it, it created an atmosphere that was for Donald 614 00:30:23,519 --> 00:30:25,079 Trump and the Republican Party not. 615 00:30:25,119 --> 00:30:27,279 Speaker 1: Making for particularly happy reading. 616 00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:30,119 Speaker 2: No, the polling data released in the wake of these 617 00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:33,480 crises showed a significant slide in Trump's approval rating. 618 00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:37,079 Speaker 1: Writer Sipso's had him at just thirty eight percent. Marist 619 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:39,519 and Fox News had him at forty to forty one. 620 00:30:39,759 --> 00:30:43,759 Speaker 2: We're talking about historical loads. One ABC poll compared it 621 00:30:43,799 --> 00:30:47,359 to Harry S. Truman in nineteen fifty two. Kind of levels. Wow, 622 00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:50,680 his average approval rating was dangerously close to dropping below 623 00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:54,400 forty percent, a floor he very rarely breached in his 624 00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:54,920 first term. 625 00:30:55,599 --> 00:30:58,880 Speaker 1: And the specific reasons for that disapproval are really relevant. 626 00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:00,920 It wasn't just generalolitical fatigue. 627 00:31:01,119 --> 00:31:03,640 Speaker 2: No, if you look at the issues, only twenty six 628 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:06,920 percent of Americans approved of his job managing the cost 629 00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:07,319 of living. 630 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:11,319 Speaker 1: A staggering sixty five percent disapproved, and that includes one 631 00:31:11,359 --> 00:31:16,200 in three Republicans. That economic dissatisfaction is a powerful undercurrent 632 00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:17,160 of vulnerability. 633 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:20,200 Speaker 2: But the Epstein case itself served as a direct torpedo 634 00:31:20,279 --> 00:31:21,200 to his credibility. 635 00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:24,880 Speaker 1: Only twenty percent of Americans approved of how Trump handled 636 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:27,680 the Epstein case. That's a massive rejection. 637 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:32,720 Speaker 2: But look deeper at the distrust. A staggering seventy percent 638 00:31:32,839 --> 00:31:37,000 of all respondents believe the Trump administration is hiding information 639 00:31:37,519 --> 00:31:38,920 about Epstein's. 640 00:31:38,359 --> 00:31:39,960 Speaker 1: Clients seventy percent. 641 00:31:40,039 --> 00:31:43,119 Speaker 2: And this is the critical number. That seventy percent includes 642 00:31:43,279 --> 00:31:45,920 sixty percent of Republicans who share that suspicion. 643 00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:49,400 Speaker 1: So this isn't just partisan opposition. This is the core 644 00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:52,759 of his own base doubting the transparency and motives of 645 00:31:52,799 --> 00:31:54,279 his administration, and. 646 00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:57,680 Speaker 2: That internal erosion of trust is what fueled the pressure 647 00:31:57,720 --> 00:31:59,839 that forced his hand on the Transparency Act. 648 00:32:00,079 --> 00:32:03,680 Speaker 1: That internal erosion also translated into a tangible loss of 649 00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:06,599 political command, which led to that major revolt we talked 650 00:32:06,599 --> 00:32:07,240 about earlier. 651 00:32:07,359 --> 00:32:10,240 Speaker 2: Over one hundred Republicans were prepared to defy him on 652 00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:12,920 the Epstein Files Act, forcing his ultimate concession. 653 00:32:13,119 --> 00:32:15,279 Speaker 1: And you combine that with the Supreme Court turning against 654 00:32:15,279 --> 00:32:18,480 his tariffs and organized resistance in the Indiana State House 655 00:32:18,559 --> 00:32:22,799 against his pressure to Jerrymander, it signifies a clear change 656 00:32:22,799 --> 00:32:23,799 in the party dynamic. 657 00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:26,720 Speaker 2: The sources also pointed to a moment that was described 658 00:32:26,759 --> 00:32:27,880 as something that has not. 659 00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:29,839 Speaker 1: Happened before Marjorie Taylor Green. 660 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:32,680 Speaker 2: She stood up to Trump on a key legislative point 661 00:32:32,839 --> 00:32:34,319 and he was forced to back. 662 00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:37,559 Speaker 1: Down, which signals a breakdown in the previously absolute party 663 00:32:37,599 --> 00:32:41,400 loyalty he could command. He's showing a vulnerability. 664 00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:45,039 Speaker 2: To pressure, and this changing political dynamic has major implications 665 00:32:45,079 --> 00:32:48,079 for the midterm outlook, particularly when it comes to the 666 00:32:48,079 --> 00:32:49,960 Republican strategy of jerrymandering. 667 00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:52,720 Speaker 1: Right, and for the general audience, we should probably clarify 668 00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:55,160 what the source is called demi mandering. 669 00:32:55,599 --> 00:32:59,200 Speaker 2: Yes, this is a technical detail, but it has huge consequences. 670 00:32:59,480 --> 00:33:04,079 Explain strategy behind spreading Republican voters so thinly across districts. 671 00:33:04,279 --> 00:33:07,599 Speaker 1: The goal of this modern jerrymandering strategy is to get 672 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:10,960 the maximum number of seats, not to have massive margins 673 00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:11,480 of victory. 674 00:33:11,839 --> 00:33:14,680 Speaker 2: So instead of packing Republicans into a few districts they 675 00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:17,640 win with seventy five percent of the vote, which wastes 676 00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:19,039 thousands of votes. 677 00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:21,640 Speaker 1: They spread them out. They aim to win many more seats, 678 00:33:21,839 --> 00:33:25,240 but with much narrower margins, maybe fifty five or fifty 679 00:33:25,279 --> 00:33:25,799 four percent. 680 00:33:26,119 --> 00:33:28,839 Speaker 2: This strategy is brilliant for maximizing your seats in a 681 00:33:28,839 --> 00:33:30,240 good year, but it leads. 682 00:33:30,119 --> 00:33:32,920 Speaker 1: Them acutely vulnerable to a uniform swing. 683 00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:37,039 Speaker 2: Exactly if the swing against the Republicans continues, and it's 684 00:33:37,039 --> 00:33:40,759 fueled by issues like cost of living, political fatigue, the 685 00:33:40,799 --> 00:33:42,960 cynicism from the Epstein scandal. 686 00:33:42,759 --> 00:33:46,799 Speaker 1: Then those thinly spread jerrymandered seats can flip very very quickly. 687 00:33:47,119 --> 00:33:50,200 The source analysis suggests that if that swing continues, especially 688 00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:53,359 among crucial demographic groups like Latinos. 689 00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:57,279 Speaker 2: Those five jerrymandered seats could suddenly become Democrat seats, creating 690 00:33:57,279 --> 00:33:59,200 a significant landslide risk for them. 691 00:33:59,359 --> 00:34:02,160 Speaker 1: And this political fallout measured in both pulling lows and 692 00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:05,480 a tangible loss of command over his party. It really 693 00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:09,320 frames the Epstein controversy not just as a moral failure. 694 00:34:09,119 --> 00:34:12,039 Speaker 2: But as a critical turning point, one that accelerated the 695 00:34:12,039 --> 00:34:16,000 shifting power dynamics within American politics, the pushback against Trump, 696 00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:20,039 Republicans refusing orders on cherrymandering, the revolt on the Epstein files. 697 00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:23,639 It makes this a defining moment of his current political chapter. 698 00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:27,880 Speaker 1: So today we have navigated the maze of the Epstein files. 699 00:34:28,320 --> 00:34:31,679 We've tracked the legislative journey from a congressional revolt to 700 00:34:31,760 --> 00:34:33,519 a grudging presidential signature. 701 00:34:33,639 --> 00:34:37,480 Speaker 2: We've exposed the shocking ethical lapses of the elite people 702 00:34:37,519 --> 00:34:38,719 like Summers in Plasket. 703 00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:42,880 Speaker 1: We've analyzed the legal mindfield of redactions, and we've delved 704 00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:46,760 deep into that international web of influence that really defined 705 00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:49,519 Epstein's true power as a geopolitical broker. 706 00:34:49,639 --> 00:34:52,480 Speaker 2: And the ultimate takeaway here is that the documents, even 707 00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:55,800 when they're sanitized, they force us to look beyond the 708 00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:58,079 simple narrative of just a sex offender. 709 00:34:58,199 --> 00:35:01,719 Speaker 1: They strongly suggest that Epstein operated as a dabos man, 710 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,719 a high level broker for a new form of supernational 711 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:05,519 elite power. 712 00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:10,000 Speaker 2: His value was in connecting defense contracts, creating diplomatic back channels, 713 00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:13,400 and moving untraceable money for powerful global players. 714 00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:16,199 Speaker 1: And the true currency of this new elite. It's not 715 00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:19,599 based on political ideology or morality. It's based on pure 716 00:35:19,920 --> 00:35:20,960 leveraged access. 717 00:35:21,039 --> 00:35:24,039 Speaker 2: And if we connect this back to that core enduring mystery, 718 00:35:24,559 --> 00:35:28,000 the ultimate question of his influence and protection, it raises 719 00:35:28,039 --> 00:35:30,400 a chilling but really important question for you, the learner, 720 00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:30,920 to consider. 721 00:35:31,119 --> 00:35:34,280 Speaker 1: The evidence suggests Epstein was so valuable as a broker 722 00:35:34,679 --> 00:35:38,440 delivering power and money that many powerful people were willingly 723 00:35:38,559 --> 00:35:41,920 using him for these dark connections. Blackmail may have been 724 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:43,559 secondary to his utility. 725 00:35:44,079 --> 00:35:47,239 Speaker 2: So if the global elite were willingly utilizing a man 726 00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:50,559 like Epstein as their essential connector, what does that say 727 00:35:50,599 --> 00:35:53,480 about the true nature of global governance and the allegiances 728 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:56,440 of those the very top who operate outside the constraints 729 00:35:56,440 --> 00:35:57,679 of traditional nation states.