WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.120 --> 00:00:04.360 There are countless movies made in in concert and consultation 2 00:00:04.480 --> 00:00:06.719 with the CIA for many decades. There's a lot of 3 00:00:06.759 --> 00:00:08.800 different levels to this, you know. You can look at 4 00:00:08.839 --> 00:00:12.000 for example, Ian Fleming himself. The character of Bond was 5 00:00:12.119 --> 00:00:14.839 used as a Cold War symbol and as a form 6 00:00:14.839 --> 00:00:17.679 of Cold War propaganda, and so when Fleming was writing 7 00:00:17.719 --> 00:00:20.120 his stories, he was basing a lot of the Bond 8 00:00:20.199 --> 00:00:23.000 novels on real operations that he had been involved in, 9 00:00:23.039 --> 00:00:25.960 like Operation a Golden Eye, which was an anti Franco 10 00:00:26.600 --> 00:00:30.359 of anti fascist operation. You have Operation Mincemeat which he 11 00:00:30.440 --> 00:00:32.560 was involved in, which they've made films based on that. 12 00:00:32.679 --> 00:00:35.960 So YouTube a X it is at Jay Dyer and Caleb. 13 00:00:35.960 --> 00:00:37.640 I don't if you're going to throw all three books 14 00:00:37.719 --> 00:00:40.280 up there or just the most recent one. I don't 15 00:00:40.280 --> 00:00:42.320 know how Jay has time to do comedy. He's been 16 00:00:42.359 --> 00:00:45.880 writing so many damn books and doing so much work 17 00:00:45.920 --> 00:00:49.479 in his own educational training. Jay, welcome to the program. 18 00:00:49.640 --> 00:00:51.520 Thank you, doctor Drew. Glad to be here with you. 19 00:00:53.679 --> 00:00:55.359 I seriously, I don't know how you have time for 20 00:00:55.399 --> 00:00:57.880 comedy with all the writing and all the training you've 21 00:00:57.880 --> 00:01:01.000 been doing. But I'm glad you're here doing all of it. 22 00:01:01.320 --> 00:01:01.679 Thank you. 23 00:01:02.880 --> 00:01:05.319 Yeah, well, you know, that was not something that I 24 00:01:05.359 --> 00:01:07.959 really thought I would end up doing. But I think 25 00:01:08.000 --> 00:01:10.159 the way that media works now, you kind of do 26 00:01:10.280 --> 00:01:12.879 your own thing, and then the more of your personality 27 00:01:12.920 --> 00:01:15.519 that comes forth, you just kind of roll with it. 28 00:01:15.560 --> 00:01:17.400 And so I ended up kind of falling. 29 00:01:17.120 --> 00:01:19.920 In line with a lot of the comedian podcasts and 30 00:01:19.959 --> 00:01:22.239 doing shows with them and enjoying it quite a bit. 31 00:01:22.319 --> 00:01:24.560 And so I ended up writing for Sam Hi the 32 00:01:24.640 --> 00:01:28.200 last year for his show. So it's been a roller 33 00:01:28.200 --> 00:01:30.120 coaster ride. It's a lot of fun, but also like 34 00:01:30.200 --> 00:01:32.519 doing you know, the educational stuff. On the other hand 35 00:01:32.519 --> 00:01:32.920 as well. 36 00:01:34.959 --> 00:01:39.079 Sam is another bright guy, and that is not lightlifting 37 00:01:39.159 --> 00:01:43.760 writing for Sam, I assume. But let's talk about Sam 38 00:01:43.840 --> 00:01:49.120 is a really smart guy. Let's talk about Hollywood and 39 00:01:49.319 --> 00:01:53.640 the concerns and observations you have as somebody trained in 40 00:01:53.680 --> 00:01:57.000 certain kinds of psychology to how people are manipula. Well, 41 00:01:57.079 --> 00:02:02.200 let's talk about that first. Are you worried about as 42 00:02:02.280 --> 00:02:06.439 I am. I'll turn over my cards. The behavior of crowds. 43 00:02:06.879 --> 00:02:10.280 I feel like we have been a tendency to mob 44 00:02:10.400 --> 00:02:14.719 action that emerges periodically in history, whether you start with 45 00:02:14.759 --> 00:02:19.240 seventeen ninety France or you know, nineteen thirty two Germany, 46 00:02:19.280 --> 00:02:21.680 whatever it is, we're in one again. It feels like 47 00:02:22.080 --> 00:02:27.000 and there's lots of true believers flying around engendering chaos. 48 00:02:28.039 --> 00:02:29.879 Is this what's happening? Are you concerned about that? 49 00:02:31.759 --> 00:02:36.560 Yes? You know, you say chaos, chaos for chaos, and 50 00:02:37.159 --> 00:02:40.479 don't you know it's just chaos. Depends on what you mean, though, 51 00:02:41.639 --> 00:02:42.319 I couldn't help me. 52 00:02:42.400 --> 00:02:44.759 I thought you were going to go I thought you 53 00:02:44.800 --> 00:02:49.039 were going to go into maximwell smart, so. 54 00:02:49.000 --> 00:02:50.960 I had to go straight Jordan Peters. The word chaos 55 00:02:50.960 --> 00:02:53.919 triggers Peterson in my head. But you know, like you 56 00:02:54.039 --> 00:02:56.759 actually I studied the French Revolution pretty in depth as 57 00:02:56.759 --> 00:02:59.280 well when I was an undergrad and a professor who 58 00:02:59.319 --> 00:03:01.840 was a specialist in that. And you're right, I think 59 00:03:01.840 --> 00:03:05.719 to make the parallels between mob psychology, which was really 60 00:03:05.840 --> 00:03:11.919 kind of I guess a modern thought getting collated, I 61 00:03:11.960 --> 00:03:15.080 guess you could say, with socialism and communism and Marxism. 62 00:03:15.120 --> 00:03:18.560 But I just covered a book on my channel a 63 00:03:18.599 --> 00:03:22.000 few months ago by a He was an Allied psychologist 64 00:03:22.479 --> 00:03:23.560 during the time of World War Two. 65 00:03:23.599 --> 00:03:24.360 His name is Juice Mr. 66 00:03:24.439 --> 00:03:28.599 Lou and he wrote a book about mob psychology many 67 00:03:28.639 --> 00:03:32.360 many decades before, you know, doctor Malone talked about massformation, 68 00:03:32.439 --> 00:03:34.840 psychosis and this kind of stuff, and he said that 69 00:03:34.879 --> 00:03:37.560 he noticed that the socialist movements had really perfected this 70 00:03:37.680 --> 00:03:40.400 technique and quite a few chapters in that book that 71 00:03:40.439 --> 00:03:43.879 were applicable to Hollywood and the way Hollywood kind of 72 00:03:43.919 --> 00:03:47.879 forms attitudes and creates culture. Culture creationists so that we 73 00:03:47.879 --> 00:03:50.599 talk about a lot on my channel, but also kind. 74 00:03:50.520 --> 00:03:52.360 Of predicting what social media would do. 75 00:03:52.400 --> 00:03:56.680 And then when you get this sort of melding of fame, internet, fame, 76 00:03:56.800 --> 00:04:00.919 social media with the idea of Hollywood and influencers kind 77 00:04:00.960 --> 00:04:03.000 of being the new A listers and this kind of stuff, 78 00:04:03.319 --> 00:04:06.879 it's a very toxic, dangerous mix. But it's also something 79 00:04:06.879 --> 00:04:10.439 that social engineers have studied to perfect in order to 80 00:04:10.520 --> 00:04:11.800 kind of control society. 81 00:04:14.319 --> 00:04:17.560 And do you are you seeing evidence of that kind 82 00:04:17.600 --> 00:04:20.920 of premeditated activity from Hollywood? 83 00:04:23.120 --> 00:04:25.839 Yeah, you know, one of the things that I focused 84 00:04:25.879 --> 00:04:28.800 on in my grad work, and I ended up just 85 00:04:28.879 --> 00:04:31.120 kind of putting that work into more of a popular 86 00:04:31.240 --> 00:04:34.600 readable book rather than something that was you know, academic 87 00:04:34.600 --> 00:04:36.759 that nobody's ever going to read, you know, this master's 88 00:04:36.800 --> 00:04:37.759 thesis or anything like that. 89 00:04:37.800 --> 00:04:39.240 It's just going to sit there on a shelf. 90 00:04:39.519 --> 00:04:41.439 I thought, why not take this information and kind of 91 00:04:41.439 --> 00:04:44.680 make it accessible and readable. And I think everybody's probably 92 00:04:44.720 --> 00:04:47.879 familiar with the way Hollywood uses product placement. You know, 93 00:04:47.920 --> 00:04:51.079 that's a classic style of getting people to purchase a 94 00:04:51.079 --> 00:04:53.639 product because James Bond was associated with it or. 95 00:04:53.639 --> 00:04:54.279 Something like that. 96 00:04:54.360 --> 00:04:57.120 But it gets a little more nefarious as you get 97 00:04:57.160 --> 00:05:00.199 deeper into subliminals. I think everybody's sort of that kind 98 00:05:00.240 --> 00:05:04.199 of stuff. But beyond that, there's also war propaganda. There 99 00:05:04.199 --> 00:05:08.800 are countless movies made in in concert and consultation with 100 00:05:08.920 --> 00:05:11.600 the CIA from many decades. That was something that was 101 00:05:11.639 --> 00:05:14.199 done a long time ago, more on the down low, 102 00:05:14.800 --> 00:05:17.319 from the nineteen forties, even back to the nineteen twenties. 103 00:05:17.319 --> 00:05:19.959 Howard Hughes, you know, he would make war propaganda films. 104 00:05:20.959 --> 00:05:23.920 The OSS would work with Hollywood to make certain screenplays 105 00:05:23.920 --> 00:05:28.160 and films, and even a less actors have been famous spies. 106 00:05:28.160 --> 00:05:34.079 All over the place. Yeah, it was in those films, exactly. Absolutely. 107 00:05:34.480 --> 00:05:38.399 Jimmy Stewart was an FBI produced movies. You have people 108 00:05:38.480 --> 00:05:42.000 like Julia Child, the famous chef TV chef. She was 109 00:05:42.040 --> 00:05:45.199 actually an OSS operative, which people don't know that before 110 00:05:45.240 --> 00:05:48.879 she was a chef. But yeah, well you know, in 111 00:05:48.920 --> 00:05:51.120 the third book, actually it did a whole chapter just 112 00:05:51.199 --> 00:05:54.360 on this because it was so fascinating to see all 113 00:05:54.399 --> 00:05:57.079 these people that people didn't know about. Sterling Hayden. He 114 00:05:57.240 --> 00:06:00.759 was an operative for the OSS. John Ford made films 115 00:06:00.800 --> 00:06:02.800 in concert with the OSS. And then as you get 116 00:06:02.879 --> 00:06:06.120 up into the seventies and eighties, same thing going on there, 117 00:06:06.279 --> 00:06:09.399 even to the point of, you know, Ben Affleck recently 118 00:06:09.560 --> 00:06:11.959 was touting the CIA and how glad he was to 119 00:06:12.120 --> 00:06:14.759 work with him to make films like Argo. You have 120 00:06:14.839 --> 00:06:18.040 films like Zero Dark thirty all being made openly with 121 00:06:18.120 --> 00:06:20.759 the CIA. So what used to be kind of a secretive, 122 00:06:20.879 --> 00:06:23.680 you know, behind closed doors things, is now kind of an. 123 00:06:23.519 --> 00:06:28.399 Open ster hates Sterly holloways Wennie the Pooh, who was 124 00:06:28.439 --> 00:06:29.319 Sterly Hayden. 125 00:06:30.639 --> 00:06:32.199 Well, he was one of the A listers back in 126 00:06:32.240 --> 00:06:36.360 the forties, very very prominent, kind of you know up 127 00:06:36.399 --> 00:06:39.439 there with like Humphrey Boguard and Cary Grant and Carry Grant. 128 00:06:39.439 --> 00:06:40.759 By the way, it was a spy too, he would 129 00:06:40.759 --> 00:06:42.399 he would spy for us. 130 00:06:42.800 --> 00:06:44.920 So I want to I want to I want to 131 00:06:44.920 --> 00:06:47.759 push back a little bit and say because I've been 132 00:06:47.800 --> 00:06:51.160 around all this stuff too for a long time, and 133 00:06:51.600 --> 00:06:56.600 whenever somebody's producing anything for media consumption, they just they 134 00:06:56.839 --> 00:07:00.480 they get kind of captured by what works. They kind 135 00:07:00.519 --> 00:07:02.839 of ab tests a lot, and then what works, they 136 00:07:02.879 --> 00:07:06.079 go and they launch into it, and then they builds momentum. 137 00:07:06.319 --> 00:07:10.439 So it's rarely, in my experience, premeditated. And the same 138 00:07:10.480 --> 00:07:13.800 thing with the CIA involvement. They get the CIA in 139 00:07:13.839 --> 00:07:16.120 and the FBI and and the military and to tell 140 00:07:16.199 --> 00:07:17.759 us how it really happens, to give us the dal 141 00:07:18.040 --> 00:07:20.279 we want this to be authentic, and then they don't 142 00:07:20.360 --> 00:07:24.079 understand that with that authenticity comes a bunch of subliminal 143 00:07:24.120 --> 00:07:27.720 messages that the CIA make sure they put into their films. 144 00:07:27.839 --> 00:07:30.800 So in a way, they're just useful idiots. 145 00:07:32.519 --> 00:07:35.759 Yeah, I mean, I don't want to be overly, you know, simplistic, 146 00:07:35.839 --> 00:07:38.279 as if it's all or nothing, as if everyone's part 147 00:07:38.279 --> 00:07:40.879 of a grand conspiracy. I certainly don't believe that. I 148 00:07:40.920 --> 00:07:43.439 think there's a lot of different levels to this. But 149 00:07:43.600 --> 00:07:45.519 you know, there's a lot of things on record that 150 00:07:45.560 --> 00:07:48.959 have come out, things that were declassified the National Archives, 151 00:07:49.040 --> 00:07:51.439 things like that that I've covered in the third book. 152 00:07:51.480 --> 00:07:53.720 But you know, you can look at, for example, Ian 153 00:07:53.759 --> 00:07:57.000 Fleming himself. What I focused on in my grad work 154 00:07:57.240 --> 00:08:00.000 was the way that the character of Bond was used 155 00:08:00.279 --> 00:08:02.720 as a Cold War symbol and as a form of 156 00:08:02.759 --> 00:08:06.680 Cold War propaganda. And so when Fleming was writing his stories, 157 00:08:06.920 --> 00:08:09.079 he was basing a lot of the Bond novels on 158 00:08:09.360 --> 00:08:11.839 real operations that he had been involved in, like Operation 159 00:08:12.399 --> 00:08:15.879 a Golden Eye, which was an anti Franco of anti 160 00:08:16.079 --> 00:08:20.000 fascist operation. You have Operation Mincemeat which he was involved in, 161 00:08:20.000 --> 00:08:22.680 which they've made films based on that. So there's different 162 00:08:22.720 --> 00:08:25.240 levels to this, but there's also that level of propaganda 163 00:08:25.279 --> 00:08:27.000 which I think most people can kind of connect with, 164 00:08:27.079 --> 00:08:28.120 and a lot of times. 165 00:08:27.879 --> 00:08:29.399 That's the big blockbusters. 166 00:08:29.639 --> 00:08:33.720 Usually blockbusters have a decent amount of propaganda inserted into them, 167 00:08:34.440 --> 00:08:37.399 but like you said, you know, it's not every director 168 00:08:37.519 --> 00:08:39.919 or every person being you know in some some kind 169 00:08:39.960 --> 00:08:41.559 of agent or something like that, and so I think. 170 00:08:41.480 --> 00:08:43.159 It's more sparse than that. 171 00:08:43.279 --> 00:08:47.480 But you know, Edward Burneese said that Hollywood is the 172 00:08:47.519 --> 00:08:50.200 greatest engine of propaganda the world has ever seen, and 173 00:08:50.440 --> 00:08:54.000 he put that in his famous book Propaganda. So they've 174 00:08:54.039 --> 00:08:56.000 known this for a long time, and it's just a 175 00:08:56.039 --> 00:08:58.759 tool that I think has been utilized and are often, 176 00:08:59.399 --> 00:09:02.960 but it's not, you know, something that always is making 177 00:09:03.000 --> 00:09:04.000 everybody an agent or something. 178 00:09:04.159 --> 00:09:08.600 No, listen, you look no further than how COVID. You 179 00:09:08.639 --> 00:09:11.159 know how the news media and the various outlets were 180 00:09:11.200 --> 00:09:14.120 used during COVID, and then then they marched on into 181 00:09:14.120 --> 00:09:16.879 the social media world and tried to manipulate that and 182 00:09:17.279 --> 00:09:20.240 now this, thank god, some pushback, but it's it all 183 00:09:20.279 --> 00:09:23.799 seems like business as usual to me. And they get 184 00:09:23.840 --> 00:09:29.799 compliance by various meats, paying people off, mustling them, you know, 185 00:09:29.919 --> 00:09:32.879 sort of inserting stuff, you know, without their knowledge into it. 186 00:09:33.080 --> 00:09:36.480 But it be that as it may. I want I 187 00:09:36.559 --> 00:09:40.200 want to ask two things, what are the differences amongst 188 00:09:40.200 --> 00:09:42.679 the three books? Why did you need to write three? 189 00:09:42.879 --> 00:09:44.720 And what am I going to learn from each? And 190 00:09:44.720 --> 00:09:46.759 then I want to go back to the Juice Borloo 191 00:09:47.000 --> 00:09:49.600 and the Madness of Crowds. So let's talk about your 192 00:09:49.600 --> 00:09:50.159 books first. 193 00:09:51.720 --> 00:09:52.240 Yeah, thank you. 194 00:09:52.279 --> 00:09:55.919 So the first book was something that came about that 195 00:09:56.000 --> 00:09:57.320 I didn't expect it to be a book. 196 00:09:57.399 --> 00:09:59.559 So I've been writing a lot of essays and. 197 00:10:01.080 --> 00:10:04.919 Excuse me, treatments of film from a more of an 198 00:10:04.919 --> 00:10:07.639 academic perspective, or if you take a college class. You'll 199 00:10:07.840 --> 00:10:10.519 you'll do what's called a close reading, where you kind 200 00:10:10.519 --> 00:10:14.840 of read Dostievsky or somebody like that at different levels 201 00:10:14.840 --> 00:10:17.879 and try to decode it and pick out the symbolism 202 00:10:17.919 --> 00:10:20.679 and the meaning. And so I sort of started writing 203 00:10:20.720 --> 00:10:23.639 movie analyses in the same way. Eventually a publisher reached 204 00:10:23.639 --> 00:10:25.639 out and said, hey, you should do it. You should 205 00:10:25.639 --> 00:10:28.600 do a book with the style of analysis that you do. 206 00:10:29.559 --> 00:10:31.519 That's really the first one, which mainly focused on the 207 00:10:31.519 --> 00:10:35.799 big director, So I focused on Kubrick. I focused on Hitchcock, Spielberg, 208 00:10:36.240 --> 00:10:39.200 a lot of the big names and their blockbusters and. 209 00:10:39.080 --> 00:10:41.559 What was good and what was bad. It's not all 210 00:10:41.600 --> 00:10:42.240 a critique. 211 00:10:42.279 --> 00:10:45.080 It's just sort of an analysis of the way that 212 00:10:45.240 --> 00:10:48.799 symbols are used in film to program us, both on 213 00:10:48.840 --> 00:10:50.720 a conscious and in a subconscious level. 214 00:10:50.799 --> 00:10:52.159 So it's a lot of different things. 215 00:10:52.200 --> 00:10:55.080 There's you know, Carl Jung style union analysis comes into 216 00:10:55.080 --> 00:10:59.039 it at times, propaganda, the history behind this or that film, 217 00:10:59.080 --> 00:11:01.720 and relationship to Ucia consultation or whatever. 218 00:11:02.080 --> 00:11:03.399 So it's a lot of different things. 219 00:11:03.679 --> 00:11:07.399 The second film focused thematically on different topics within a 220 00:11:07.440 --> 00:11:10.240 bunch of different films. So I talked about the relationship 221 00:11:10.240 --> 00:11:14.080 of Hollywood to organize crime, what's real and what's not 222 00:11:14.120 --> 00:11:17.000 real between various mob movies, and how you know, we 223 00:11:17.080 --> 00:11:20.320 kind of were sold the picture of the villain being 224 00:11:20.360 --> 00:11:22.600 the good guy through a lot of mafia movies, and 225 00:11:23.159 --> 00:11:25.080 so now we kind of look to the you know, 226 00:11:25.159 --> 00:11:27.000 Tony Soprano is the good guy, and that kind of 227 00:11:27.000 --> 00:11:29.200 stuff's a lot of inversion when it comes to morals 228 00:11:29.200 --> 00:11:33.519 and ethics. And then in the third book, because I'd 229 00:11:33.519 --> 00:11:35.759 had so many people say over the years, hey, you 230 00:11:35.799 --> 00:11:38.200 never did this movie. You never did Christopher Nolan movies, 231 00:11:38.240 --> 00:11:39.519 you never did Marvel movies. 232 00:11:39.919 --> 00:11:41.519 I'm not a huge Marvel fan. 233 00:11:41.399 --> 00:11:44.679 But I decided that, well, they're the biggest blockbusters the 234 00:11:44.759 --> 00:11:47.480 last twenty years. So if I say the blockbusters are 235 00:11:47.480 --> 00:11:49.440 a lot of propaganda, I guess I should cover them. 236 00:11:49.480 --> 00:11:53.559 So first eighty pages is Christopher Nolan and Union archetypes 237 00:11:53.639 --> 00:11:57.879 and Marvel analysis. I have a really extensive sixty page, 238 00:11:58.399 --> 00:12:02.240 seventy page critique of feminist some in Hollywood and how 239 00:12:02.240 --> 00:12:04.759 there's a sort of a presentation that women are all 240 00:12:04.799 --> 00:12:07.399 now supposed to be what men typically are, which I 241 00:12:07.440 --> 00:12:13.679 think is kind of an intentional, subversive, subversive approach to storytelling. 242 00:12:14.440 --> 00:12:16.720 And then I get into fun stuff. There's comedic stuff. 243 00:12:16.720 --> 00:12:18.519 There's b movies that we cover that I thought were 244 00:12:18.600 --> 00:12:21.200 kind of funny. And then I get into relationship between 245 00:12:21.200 --> 00:12:25.679 CIA in Hollywood and how Hollywood is presented in times 246 00:12:25.679 --> 00:12:29.639 in apocalypse films, which I think is fascinating because Hollywood's 247 00:12:29.679 --> 00:12:32.159 kind of dying. It's on its own little apocalypse, and 248 00:12:32.200 --> 00:12:35.840 then it's turning into this other thing of influencers and 249 00:12:35.960 --> 00:12:40.080 you know game basically gaming is kind of taking over unfortunately. 250 00:12:40.120 --> 00:12:50.639 But yeah, so lightlifting, like decoding Dostyevsky. So's there sounds 251 00:12:51.039 --> 00:12:54.000 sounds mind evangel just I just trying to read Dostoevsky's 252 00:12:54.159 --> 00:12:55.600 and penetrate it as hard enough. 253 00:12:57.840 --> 00:13:01.840 So well, it's not that hard. Fascinating example, I just 254 00:13:01.879 --> 00:13:03.440 thought of an example. It's not as bad as. 255 00:13:03.360 --> 00:13:06.080 Suf It's not that hard, well. 256 00:13:07.559 --> 00:13:08.960 At all, challenge. 257 00:13:10.480 --> 00:13:14.799 Yeah, but it all sounds very fascinating and worth. I mean, 258 00:13:14.799 --> 00:13:17.759 it's sort of historically significant. I'm glad you're putting it 259 00:13:17.799 --> 00:13:20.639 down for the record because when people do look back 260 00:13:20.679 --> 00:13:23.720 at this time, film is one of these things that 261 00:13:23.840 --> 00:13:25.559 is you know, I look at it all as just 262 00:13:25.679 --> 00:13:29.799 these technologies that come along, and you know, but before 263 00:13:29.840 --> 00:13:33.399 there was stage and then stage lights, and then there 264 00:13:33.240 --> 00:13:36.279 were then there was amplification, and then this celluloid thing 265 00:13:36.320 --> 00:13:39.559 comes along, and then this television thing comes along, and 266 00:13:39.559 --> 00:13:44.080 then vinyl records, and these are all technologies that get 267 00:13:44.240 --> 00:13:50.440 exploited in massive ways by people that produce content for 268 00:13:50.519 --> 00:13:55.000 these things. What I find really interesting is they always 269 00:13:55.159 --> 00:13:58.759 tend to go towards it's it's sort of performers that 270 00:13:58.879 --> 00:14:01.759 kind of use it, uh to it to put their 271 00:14:01.799 --> 00:14:05.799 material out far and wide, and then it gets hidden 272 00:14:06.120 --> 00:14:10.200 or sort of protected under the sheath of art. It's art, 273 00:14:10.639 --> 00:14:13.240 don't you understand? It's art, But it really to me 274 00:14:13.440 --> 00:14:15.960 just looks like, yeah, there's artists involved, but it's it's 275 00:14:15.960 --> 00:14:18.919 a commercial enterprise to taking advantage of a new technology, 276 00:14:19.120 --> 00:14:21.200 and then the computer and then the social media and 277 00:14:21.279 --> 00:14:22.720 here we are down the road. 278 00:14:24.799 --> 00:14:25.039 Yeah. 279 00:14:25.120 --> 00:14:28.399 I think the artists are kind of like products, uh 280 00:14:28.679 --> 00:14:32.200 and they do, you know, sell what's on. 281 00:14:32.200 --> 00:14:36.639 My bed, but but they hide behind it. Oh, something's 282 00:14:36.679 --> 00:14:39.799 in your bed and somebody says something on there, so 283 00:14:39.799 --> 00:14:41.000 so I don't know, I don't see. 284 00:14:40.799 --> 00:14:45.679 It out on the bed. It's a dead body back there, 285 00:14:45.799 --> 00:14:47.120 so I guess. 286 00:14:46.919 --> 00:14:49.240 Yeah, it's it's uh we'll put you on the Travel 287 00:14:49.320 --> 00:14:52.799 channel as some sort of phantom flying around. I can't 288 00:14:52.840 --> 00:14:56.399 quite see it. Oh good, all right? Uh and and 289 00:14:56.720 --> 00:14:59.840 but I I really think they they use art as 290 00:14:59.840 --> 00:15:02.720 a as a veil to do whatever they want to do. 291 00:15:03.159 --> 00:15:05.279 So you can't you can't. You know, it's it's it's 292 00:15:05.360 --> 00:15:08.120 I'm creating art. It's pretty art. You can't criticize it, 293 00:15:08.240 --> 00:15:12.000 all right, you don't understand. No, they're creating a commercial enterprise. 294 00:15:12.600 --> 00:15:16.399 But let me go back to Juice More Loop because 295 00:15:16.440 --> 00:15:19.120 I I, and I'm sure you're aware of there's a 296 00:15:19.360 --> 00:15:23.960 there's a elaborate sort of cartoon online that goes through 297 00:15:23.960 --> 00:15:28.279 all of Juice More Lou's theories. Right, you've seen that? 298 00:15:28.480 --> 00:15:29.080 Have you seen that? 299 00:15:29.720 --> 00:15:33.000 No, it's very good, it's very good. Yeah. 300 00:15:33.480 --> 00:15:36.519 Oh well, well, there's somebody that did a whole sort 301 00:15:36.519 --> 00:15:40.080 of it's not really juicemr Loo for dummies, but it 302 00:15:40.480 --> 00:15:43.120 is sort of that, and it has a whole visual 303 00:15:43.159 --> 00:15:45.559 attached to it if somebody sort of sketching things out 304 00:15:45.639 --> 00:15:48.559 as his theories are presented. It's very good. It's very good. 305 00:15:48.919 --> 00:15:50.879 I recommend it. Just look up go to YouTube, look 306 00:15:50.919 --> 00:15:54.720 up Juice mor Loop. But it sent me I guess 307 00:15:54.799 --> 00:15:58.399 I was. I already had read Extraordinary Popular Delusions and 308 00:15:58.480 --> 00:16:01.960 the Madness of Crowds. It sent me back to read 309 00:16:02.080 --> 00:16:06.120 Lebon's The Crowd again, and then I got downstream to 310 00:16:06.200 --> 00:16:09.159 a book called The True Believer, which I find is 311 00:16:09.200 --> 00:16:12.440 one of the most fascinating because I think, I think 312 00:16:12.440 --> 00:16:15.279 you'll agree with me that these mass formations or whatever 313 00:16:15.279 --> 00:16:17.279 you want to call them, have about ten or twenty 314 00:16:17.279 --> 00:16:19.600 percent of the crowd that is true believer. They're they're 315 00:16:19.639 --> 00:16:22.080 really bought into this stuff, and they're the ones that 316 00:16:22.440 --> 00:16:25.279 propagate some of these things. And this I think the 317 00:16:25.320 --> 00:16:28.759 guy was like a it's like an engineer or something. 318 00:16:28.799 --> 00:16:31.440 He was not trained in psychology, was not trained in anything. 319 00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:34.559 He just wrote down his observations of the behavior of crowds. 320 00:16:34.879 --> 00:16:37.519 And man, I think he just nails The True Believer. 321 00:16:37.559 --> 00:16:39.519 He just nails it and nails it and nails it. 322 00:16:40.440 --> 00:16:42.679 I recommend it most highly. I've read it like three 323 00:16:42.720 --> 00:16:46.159 times now. But what are your thoughts on this this 324 00:16:46.279 --> 00:16:49.200 construct and why is it coming up again? And you know, 325 00:16:49.200 --> 00:16:51.799 why did why did the left grab on to it 326 00:16:51.919 --> 00:16:55.240 so hard? Since the Jacobins give me your thoughts. 327 00:16:56.200 --> 00:16:59.039 Yeah, I think that it's been perfected from the vantage 328 00:16:59.039 --> 00:17:03.200 point of social engineering and you know, steering and controlling 329 00:17:03.240 --> 00:17:07.400 the crowd. And this is again what Walter Lippmann wrote 330 00:17:07.400 --> 00:17:09.160 about when he talked about public opinion. 331 00:17:09.240 --> 00:17:10.880 Coming out of the Tavistock Institute. 332 00:17:10.960 --> 00:17:13.720 He figured out that you could really steer the masses 333 00:17:13.799 --> 00:17:16.920 by giving them the impression that, well, if you're not 334 00:17:17.119 --> 00:17:20.599 in with the end group with the high percentage of well, 335 00:17:20.640 --> 00:17:23.160 the majority of the public supports the war, you don't 336 00:17:23.160 --> 00:17:24.839 want to be seen as an outsider. So they were 337 00:17:24.880 --> 00:17:27.200 really figuring this stuff out back in the nineteen twenties, 338 00:17:27.240 --> 00:17:30.960 and then they perfected that technique with what we have today. 339 00:17:31.039 --> 00:17:33.319 And of course, you know, after the koof as I 340 00:17:33.359 --> 00:17:35.720 call it, from twenty to twenty to twenty twenty two, 341 00:17:36.559 --> 00:17:42.200 they were using, as Harvard admitted, Harvard style psychological warfare techniques. 342 00:17:42.200 --> 00:17:44.839 The Canadian government admitted they were using psyops to really 343 00:17:44.880 --> 00:17:48.640 get everybody on board with the mass formation psychosis. So 344 00:17:48.680 --> 00:17:51.720 I think that they've applied these techniques to the way 345 00:17:51.759 --> 00:17:55.240 that a listers and celebrities had that type of power, 346 00:17:55.359 --> 00:17:58.079 you know, decades ago, and now it's the influencer. Now 347 00:17:58.079 --> 00:18:01.720 it's the you know, the social media person that's taking 348 00:18:01.759 --> 00:18:03.839 that role on and I think we've seen a lot 349 00:18:03.880 --> 00:18:07.839 of phony, fake you know, the social media people that 350 00:18:08.160 --> 00:18:11.839 push whatever the establishment wants. Sometimes these people are boosting 351 00:18:11.920 --> 00:18:13.920 in the algorithm. So that's where we are now. Is 352 00:18:14.000 --> 00:18:17.319 just the new instantiation of the same tricks and tactics. 353 00:18:18.880 --> 00:18:21.200 What's the antidote? What do we have to do here? 354 00:18:21.480 --> 00:18:23.880 I feel like raising awareness of it, calling it out, 355 00:18:24.039 --> 00:18:27.559 mocking it work small is better than anything. What do 356 00:18:27.599 --> 00:18:32.160 we do comedy or into comedy now? Maybe maybe more imitations, 357 00:18:32.200 --> 00:18:35.519 more and more impersonations. We just a love life? 358 00:18:35.920 --> 00:18:38.920 Is this Doctor Drew and the love line just probably 359 00:18:38.960 --> 00:18:41.720 the best, probably the best love line on right now. 360 00:18:41.880 --> 00:18:44.440 We're going to make sex great again, Doctor Drew, You 361 00:18:44.480 --> 00:18:47.200 and I together probably going to make it great probably. 362 00:18:49.039 --> 00:18:49.200 Yeah. 363 00:18:49.240 --> 00:18:52.839 I mean, I think ridicule is a really powerful tool 364 00:18:53.039 --> 00:18:55.319 for mocking these types of things. 365 00:18:55.519 --> 00:18:57.440 You know, when you go back to. 366 00:18:57.240 --> 00:18:59.640 Ten years ago, one of the reasons that they really 367 00:18:59.640 --> 00:19:02.079 had to institute a lot of the censorship online was 368 00:19:02.119 --> 00:19:07.599 that the left was becoming so sensitive when when they 369 00:19:07.599 --> 00:19:09.240 were being made fun of that they just had to 370 00:19:09.279 --> 00:19:12.319 shut down memes, They had to shut down anything that 371 00:19:12.440 --> 00:19:16.359 was perceived as mocking them because it's quote hurtful. Of course, 372 00:19:16.519 --> 00:19:20.039 again that's very subjective in terms of what's hurtful in 373 00:19:20.079 --> 00:19:23.079 regard to free speech, and there's already laws in place 374 00:19:23.119 --> 00:19:26.240 for that, so they had to really I think clamp down. 375 00:19:26.880 --> 00:19:29.480 We saw that as well with the COVID mandates and 376 00:19:29.759 --> 00:19:33.440 doctor doctor Fauci. It's all gunstantly getting. You know, could 377 00:19:33.480 --> 00:19:37.720 take to I am sayad sayatzayats. 378 00:19:36.519 --> 00:19:39.440 And then everybody just made fun of Fauci. There was 379 00:19:39.440 --> 00:19:41.240 a remember when they said that he was the sexiest 380 00:19:41.279 --> 00:19:41.799 man alive. 381 00:19:41.880 --> 00:19:44.559 I mean, it's like what he's like Actually, they. 382 00:19:44.440 --> 00:19:47.119 Were putting out a poll He's the sexiest man alive, 383 00:19:47.119 --> 00:19:50.240 and it's like people just made fun of this, and uh, 384 00:19:50.720 --> 00:19:54.640 I think that was a huge, you know, blow to 385 00:19:54.720 --> 00:19:56.799 the system. And so that was also why they needed 386 00:19:56.799 --> 00:20:00.119 the you know, Twitter files collusion between government and in 387 00:20:00.160 --> 00:20:02.480 big tech to shut this stuff down because they know 388 00:20:02.519 --> 00:20:04.799 the comedians are the tip of the spear when it 389 00:20:04.799 --> 00:20:07.920 comes to moving the Overton window back towards rationality. 390 00:20:09.839 --> 00:20:11.920 Well, they were absent during COVID. That was that was 391 00:20:11.960 --> 00:20:13.319 one of the things I kept saying. If you're looking 392 00:20:13.319 --> 00:20:14.920 at old the streams around, I was like, where are 393 00:20:14.920 --> 00:20:20.839 the comedians. What happened here? Corolla never sin Yeah, I know. 394 00:20:20.960 --> 00:20:23.079 I Corolla kept saying, you're a bunch of postings, You're 395 00:20:23.079 --> 00:20:25.200 a bunch of shoot what are you doing? If we stopped, 396 00:20:25.359 --> 00:20:28.279 we stop following you, this thing would end tomorrow. Uh. 397 00:20:28.319 --> 00:20:30.519 And he's been the same ever since and was the 398 00:20:30.559 --> 00:20:34.759 same before, trust me. But it's very interesting, and we 399 00:20:34.799 --> 00:20:37.920 live in a time where we have to, you know, 400 00:20:38.160 --> 00:20:42.920 because persuasion works, even when you know somebody is hypnotizing 401 00:20:42.920 --> 00:20:45.599