WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:03.319 It's being converted on the fly, So every moment that 2 00:00:03.359 --> 00:00:06.519 it's in use, it's being converted. It's like nineteen eighty four. 3 00:00:06.599 --> 00:00:11.400 It's a relentless totalitarian conversion that never stops. You want 4 00:00:11.400 --> 00:00:14.720 to imagine the future, Imagine a USB two cable into 5 00:00:14.720 --> 00:00:17.519 a USB three cable, stamping on a human face forever. 6 00:00:18.160 --> 00:00:23.239 Ask not what your country can do for you, Ask 7 00:00:23.359 --> 00:00:25.239 what you can do for your country. 8 00:00:25.960 --> 00:00:29.760 Mister gorbucha, Tear down this wall. 9 00:00:31.359 --> 00:00:34.000 It's the Ricochet Podcast with Steven Hayward and Charles C. W. 10 00:00:34.240 --> 00:00:37.799 Cook James Lillax. Today we talked to Jerry Baker, editor 11 00:00:37.840 --> 00:00:40.840 at large of the Wall Street Journal. So let's podcast. 12 00:00:41.119 --> 00:00:45.679 Mister Greed, take your seat. Take your seat, sir, take 13 00:00:45.719 --> 00:00:52.200 your seat. Finding that members continue to engage in wilful 14 00:00:52.399 --> 00:00:55.119 and concert a disruption or proper decorum, the chair now 15 00:00:55.200 --> 00:01:00.719 directs is startant at arms to restore order. We'll move 16 00:01:00.799 --> 00:01:02.000 this gentleman from the table. 17 00:01:05.239 --> 00:01:08.799 Well become everybody. This is the Rickchhepe Podcast, number seven 18 00:01:08.879 --> 00:01:12.120 hundred and thirty one in James lilloxs in Minneapolis. Beautiful 19 00:01:12.159 --> 00:01:14.959 crisp day. We got about ten inches of snow. Yeah, 20 00:01:15.000 --> 00:01:17.480 we can take it. It's March. I'm joined by Stephen 21 00:01:17.480 --> 00:01:20.319 Hayward and Charles C. W. Cook. Who are I believe 22 00:01:20.400 --> 00:01:24.079 in respective poles of the country, Florida and California. And 23 00:01:25.079 --> 00:01:28.280 where to start with this week? Every day it seems 24 00:01:28.319 --> 00:01:31.640 to be something, and then we forget that we did. 25 00:01:31.680 --> 00:01:36.040 We annext Greenland last week? I don't know what a 26 00:01:36.480 --> 00:01:39.680 swirling constellation of stars around your head like somebody in 27 00:01:39.719 --> 00:01:42.000 a cartoon who's been whacked on the nug and with 28 00:01:42.040 --> 00:01:44.719 a frying pan. So what to begin? What do you, guys, 29 00:01:45.079 --> 00:01:48.159 what stands out at the end of this contentious week 30 00:01:48.280 --> 00:01:51.319 as the most important issue to you or the one 31 00:01:51.400 --> 00:01:54.040 perhaps that flew under the radar, That will that will 32 00:01:54.040 --> 00:01:56.359 be something we're talking about in a little bit now. 33 00:01:57.280 --> 00:01:59.840 Could it be the Supreme Court decision that appeared to 34 00:02:00.040 --> 00:02:04.120 slam the knuckles of Doge Stephen Charlie. 35 00:02:03.560 --> 00:02:05.760 Well, I'm not quite sure it did that. It's a 36 00:02:05.760 --> 00:02:09.800 little bit it's a little bit obscure and maybe technical 37 00:02:09.800 --> 00:02:12.080 and narrow. I think actually the biggest story of the 38 00:02:12.120 --> 00:02:16.039 week is still unfolding today Friday, as we're talking. First 39 00:02:16.039 --> 00:02:18.960 two days ago we had the news that Gavin Newsom 40 00:02:19.159 --> 00:02:21.599 is now a podcaster by the way. I predict he's 41 00:02:21.639 --> 00:02:24.199 going to do as well at podcasting as Mario Cuomo 42 00:02:24.280 --> 00:02:26.879 did a talk radio thirty years ago, and I thought 43 00:02:26.879 --> 00:02:28.840 he'd be the ride, he'd be the rival for Rush, 44 00:02:28.840 --> 00:02:31.159 and he was just boring as good beat. But what 45 00:02:31.280 --> 00:02:34.680 the news was that a newsom suddenly sounded like a 46 00:02:35.479 --> 00:02:39.199 Republican's interest. I'm against boys and women's sports, I don't 47 00:02:39.280 --> 00:02:43.240 want to use l tinks, and defunding the police was idiotic. 48 00:02:43.520 --> 00:02:46.479 So this is clearly someone gearing up to run for president. 49 00:02:46.639 --> 00:02:48.719 But then it's followed up by the news that after 50 00:02:48.800 --> 00:02:52.919 Senate Democrats voted unanimously to block the Republican bill to 51 00:02:53.039 --> 00:02:58.120 ban trans women from women's sports, suddenly they're changing your tune. 52 00:02:58.280 --> 00:03:00.960 And now they're out with a new proposal. Well, let's 53 00:03:01.039 --> 00:03:03.879 let the states decide, you know, sort of the their 54 00:03:03.919 --> 00:03:06.360 equivalent of the Dobbs decision on abortion, I suppose you 55 00:03:06.400 --> 00:03:08.919 might say, and I think you're seeing the weakening here 56 00:03:09.000 --> 00:03:11.319 on some of these cultural issues on the left because 57 00:03:11.319 --> 00:03:14.680 it realizes they're getting killed on this and so anyway, 58 00:03:14.719 --> 00:03:16.639 I think that's the sleeper story that's going to grow, 59 00:03:16.680 --> 00:03:19.080 and it's going to cause great divisions inside a democratic 60 00:03:19.080 --> 00:03:20.520 coalition interesting. 61 00:03:20.560 --> 00:03:23.159 Well, yes, watching new some molt and shed his skin 62 00:03:23.319 --> 00:03:26.159 is interesting. But then there are some people who say, well, 63 00:03:26.199 --> 00:03:28.080 I'm looking at this bill here they're talking about boys 64 00:03:28.080 --> 00:03:29.400 and women's sports. I don't like it. But on the 65 00:03:29.439 --> 00:03:31.439 other hand, I looked at my IRA the other day too, 66 00:03:31.479 --> 00:03:35.000 and I really don't like that. Ah. 67 00:03:35.120 --> 00:03:37.560 Yeah, and it seems to be getting worse. If you 68 00:03:37.599 --> 00:03:40.879 look at the stock market right now, it's worse than 69 00:03:40.919 --> 00:03:43.520 it was this morning, and that in turn is worse 70 00:03:43.520 --> 00:03:47.439 than it was yesterday. It was okay twelve days ago. 71 00:03:48.560 --> 00:03:50.120 It seems to me, James, and I don't know if 72 00:03:50.159 --> 00:03:52.159 you think this is maybe a conspiracy theory or me 73 00:03:52.199 --> 00:03:54.919 putting pieces together that doesn't belong. But do you think 74 00:03:54.919 --> 00:03:57.319 this might have to do with the tariffs? I think 75 00:03:57.479 --> 00:03:59.080 it might, yeah. 76 00:03:58.840 --> 00:04:00.520 And you know, as somebody who is on the cusp 77 00:04:00.560 --> 00:04:03.280 of retirement, and you know, I generally don't check those things. 78 00:04:03.280 --> 00:04:05.479 They go up, they go down, you know whatever. We 79 00:04:05.680 --> 00:04:09.599 you know, I don't like it, and I especially don't 80 00:04:09.639 --> 00:04:11.120 like it because it seems to be what we call 81 00:04:11.159 --> 00:04:15.360 an unforced error own goal. I was not in the mood, 82 00:04:15.400 --> 00:04:18.319 particularly for a trade war with Canada. And while Canada 83 00:04:18.439 --> 00:04:22.480 may indeed have an onerous terrace on American milk. It's 84 00:04:22.519 --> 00:04:25.079 just it's not it's not really up there. Now. I 85 00:04:25.160 --> 00:04:27.519 understand the long term reasoning is to do this to 86 00:04:27.519 --> 00:04:30.160 bring back, you know, manufacturing in the country, and we 87 00:04:30.240 --> 00:04:31.759 have to go through short term pain and then in 88 00:04:31.759 --> 00:04:33.680 five years it'll all be better because we'll have more 89 00:04:34.199 --> 00:04:37.839 industries than businesses. Here. One of the major car companies 90 00:04:37.839 --> 00:04:40.319 announced that they're going to start building some stuff in America. Again, 91 00:04:40.360 --> 00:04:43.040 I get that, I get that, But I hate tariffs. 92 00:04:43.120 --> 00:04:46.519 I just do. I just I just do. And maybe 93 00:04:46.519 --> 00:04:49.680 it's because I associate them, you know, with a smooth 94 00:04:49.759 --> 00:04:52.800 end or holly and think that didn't work, and maybe 95 00:04:52.800 --> 00:04:57.199 this doesn't work now. So yeah, the Mexican tariffs have 96 00:04:57.199 --> 00:04:59.480 been abated for a month, though, have they not they 97 00:04:59.560 --> 00:05:02.360 not decide to step away from those for a while. 98 00:05:02.879 --> 00:05:07.759 Well, they're showing as tariffs you see, they're introduced well 99 00:05:07.759 --> 00:05:10.360 because they both exist and don't exist, and they're both 100 00:05:10.360 --> 00:05:12.560 good and bad because when they're introduced, there's all these 101 00:05:12.600 --> 00:05:14.120 reasons that we need them. We need to be more 102 00:05:14.160 --> 00:05:16.680 like America in the eighteen nineties when we were apparently rich. 103 00:05:16.759 --> 00:05:19.920 We need to be like William McKinley. We need to 104 00:05:20.079 --> 00:05:23.879 protect industry and create jobs and potentially even get rid 105 00:05:23.879 --> 00:05:24.680 of the income tax. 106 00:05:24.680 --> 00:05:25.680 And that's just terrific. 107 00:05:25.720 --> 00:05:27.480 And that's why tariffs are so good and the most 108 00:05:27.519 --> 00:05:29.360 beautiful word in the English language. 109 00:05:29.000 --> 00:05:29.879 And we all love them. 110 00:05:30.319 --> 00:05:33.879 Also, they're so horrible that if you threaten people with them, 111 00:05:33.920 --> 00:05:35.480 then you get things that you want. So we don't 112 00:05:35.480 --> 00:05:37.199 really want tariffs. What we want is to threaten tarifs 113 00:05:37.199 --> 00:05:39.240 and then not do them, because obviously we wouldn't do tariffs. 114 00:05:39.399 --> 00:05:42.399 Trump actually did this yesterday, James. He actually said yesterday 115 00:05:42.439 --> 00:05:44.480 when he was announcing that he might give some tariff 116 00:05:44.480 --> 00:05:47.920 relief that he was going to rescind some of the 117 00:05:47.959 --> 00:05:51.519 tariffs to protect American industries from them. But you put 118 00:05:51.560 --> 00:05:55.959 them on, so he's both the provider and the taker. 119 00:05:56.639 --> 00:05:59.120 Yeah, I mean, I think the embarrassing irony hearers that 120 00:05:59.160 --> 00:06:02.639 if you go back to twenty sixteen, Trump was most 121 00:06:02.920 --> 00:06:06.639 prominently talking about tariffs to save American auto industry jobs 122 00:06:06.639 --> 00:06:09.800 and save auto factories in America, and those are the 123 00:06:09.800 --> 00:06:12.839 first tariffs are that sector that he relaxed within hours 124 00:06:12.839 --> 00:06:15.199 of imposing them because I think someone pointed out to 125 00:06:15.240 --> 00:06:18.279 him that the supply chain for automobile manufacturing in parts 126 00:06:18.319 --> 00:06:21.920 is more complicated, and it's not so simple. I still 127 00:06:22.000 --> 00:06:24.879 wonder if, well, an old word comes back to me, James. 128 00:06:24.920 --> 00:06:27.319 You'll remember from the seventies we were going to fight 129 00:06:27.360 --> 00:06:31.399 inflation by jaw boning, remember jaw boning, and that meant 130 00:06:31.480 --> 00:06:33.519 we'll talk about it a lot. And what shame people 131 00:06:33.560 --> 00:06:35.240 in the lowering the price of eggs? I don't know, 132 00:06:35.720 --> 00:06:38.600 but I do wonder sometimes, and Charlie put his finger 133 00:06:38.600 --> 00:06:41.279 on it right here, just now, how much Trump really 134 00:06:41.319 --> 00:06:46.879 believes in tariffs and how much this is Trump's typical supercharged, 135 00:06:46.959 --> 00:06:51.720 exaggerated rhetoric in service of trying to be jaw boning 136 00:06:51.759 --> 00:06:55.879 on steroids. And you know, look all presidents of going back. 137 00:06:56.199 --> 00:06:59.600 You know, Reagan put up with some tariffs under politically 138 00:07:00.319 --> 00:07:01.680 circumstances that were difficult. 139 00:07:01.680 --> 00:07:02.319 He kind of had to. 140 00:07:02.839 --> 00:07:05.439 But you know, a Bush put on tariffs to protect steel, 141 00:07:05.560 --> 00:07:08.279 so did Biden. Well, there are aluminum tariffs. We've had 142 00:07:08.319 --> 00:07:11.560 tariffs on Canadian softwood lumber on and off over the years. 143 00:07:11.639 --> 00:07:14.759 I don't keep up with it, but so I don't know. 144 00:07:14.839 --> 00:07:17.720 I'd like to think that, in my optimistic moments, that 145 00:07:17.879 --> 00:07:20.959 Trump has got a serious game here, and he's playing 146 00:07:20.959 --> 00:07:22.879 it the way he does everything else, and maybe it 147 00:07:22.920 --> 00:07:25.240 will get some results. But at some point paper are 148 00:07:25.240 --> 00:07:28.279 going to figure this out, as we have suggested before. 149 00:07:29.480 --> 00:07:31.959 Well, those were individual tariffs. I mean, there are targeted, 150 00:07:32.000 --> 00:07:33.879 specific cares. We've been doing that stuff, this sort of 151 00:07:34.160 --> 00:07:36.759 broad brush stuff. If it was just talk, there'd be 152 00:07:36.800 --> 00:07:40.800 one thing. But he did them, so that's another. And 153 00:07:41.120 --> 00:07:45.120 if he backs off from this, because I'm wondering what 154 00:07:45.120 --> 00:07:47.720 would make him back off of it, if anything, because 155 00:07:47.959 --> 00:07:52.360 everything the wins that you've had, all of the rhetorical, philosophical, 156 00:07:53.600 --> 00:07:57.680 symbolic wins that Doze has been racking up by saying, look, America, 157 00:07:58.120 --> 00:08:01.439 you there, you guy, you who paid five thousand dollars 158 00:08:01.480 --> 00:08:04.879 in taxes last year. Actually what we did is that 159 00:08:04.920 --> 00:08:08.839 your entire tax payment for the last twenty years has 160 00:08:08.879 --> 00:08:11.600 been going to one L pack of farmer in Peru. 161 00:08:13.680 --> 00:08:16.279 I mean, and again, we no longer need to make 162 00:08:16.399 --> 00:08:20.240 up absurd examples of spending like this, because that's where 163 00:08:20.279 --> 00:08:22.319 it was. I think it was ninety thousand dollars for 164 00:08:22.319 --> 00:08:25.600 an L pack of farming in Peru. So somebody looks 165 00:08:25.600 --> 00:08:28.759 at that and says, well, exactly, how is that supposed 166 00:08:28.800 --> 00:08:31.639 to work for me. Then I am driving around on 167 00:08:31.759 --> 00:08:36.000 roads that are pothold, there's miscreants and lolling about in 168 00:08:36.000 --> 00:08:38.240 my park that isn't clear, et cetera. I mean, we 169 00:08:38.279 --> 00:08:41.440 know these are all complex state, local issues, but people 170 00:08:41.480 --> 00:08:43.200 just basically get the idea, I'm paying a lot of 171 00:08:43.240 --> 00:08:48.000 money for taxes, and if we lived in an absolute, utopian, 172 00:08:48.080 --> 00:08:51.440 clean paradise like Tomorrowland in the movie, yeah, throw a 173 00:08:51.440 --> 00:08:53.840 couple of nickels at the guy in Peru. But we don't. 174 00:08:54.039 --> 00:08:57.279 And why so that's a win because I think that 175 00:08:57.440 --> 00:09:00.960 then as nonpartisan, I think people actually the middle get that. 176 00:09:01.679 --> 00:09:04.519 But when all of a sudden you have shuddering economic 177 00:09:04.519 --> 00:09:06.840 contraction because of something that was put on that nobody 178 00:09:06.919 --> 00:09:09.840 really really really was voting for. I wonder at what 179 00:09:09.879 --> 00:09:11.759 point Trump looks at this and says, I'm going to 180 00:09:11.799 --> 00:09:14.320 cut bait and cut my losses and back off of this. 181 00:09:14.559 --> 00:09:18.399 I don't know if he has it in him or 182 00:09:18.399 --> 00:09:21.120 if he's just gonna be bullheaded about it and keep 183 00:09:21.159 --> 00:09:21.759 going forward. 184 00:09:21.919 --> 00:09:24.720 Charles, I think he definitely has it in him, because 185 00:09:24.720 --> 00:09:27.879 he keeps rescinding them when the stock market goes down. Look, 186 00:09:27.919 --> 00:09:31.120 this is a real risk. So let's look at this 187 00:09:31.279 --> 00:09:36.039 both from the perspective of somebody who might hate Trump 188 00:09:36.440 --> 00:09:39.480 and from the perspective of somebody who really likes Trump. 189 00:09:39.519 --> 00:09:44.000 I think the argument against this course of action is 190 00:09:44.240 --> 00:09:47.799 applicable from both sides. If you hate Trump, you look 191 00:09:47.840 --> 00:09:49.799 at this and you say, well, he's doing tariffs. Theyre stupid. 192 00:09:49.840 --> 00:09:51.720 He's a stupid person and he's being stupid, and. 193 00:09:51.759 --> 00:09:52.200 I hate him. 194 00:09:52.240 --> 00:10:00.000 Okay, fine, If you like him, you don't want this problem, 195 00:10:00.039 --> 00:10:02.480 and it's become a problem to overshadow all of the 196 00:10:02.519 --> 00:10:05.559 other things that you want him to do, because the 197 00:10:05.600 --> 00:10:08.080 maxim that it's the economy stupid is still true. It's 198 00:10:08.080 --> 00:10:11.240 the primary reason that he won the election. He won 199 00:10:11.279 --> 00:10:15.360 the election because Joe Biden and his party made inflation 200 00:10:15.480 --> 00:10:17.720 a great deal worse in twenty twenty one by pumping 201 00:10:17.720 --> 00:10:19.559 a whole bunch of money into the economy that the 202 00:10:19.559 --> 00:10:26.360 economy did not need and creating the worst inflationary environment 203 00:10:26.360 --> 00:10:29.120 in forty years, and then saying it's not happening, and 204 00:10:29.120 --> 00:10:31.639 then saying it's transitory, and then saying, well, maybe it 205 00:10:31.679 --> 00:10:33.799 is happening, but it's not too bad, and then this 206 00:10:33.879 --> 00:10:35.679 is the worst part of all, passing a bill called 207 00:10:35.720 --> 00:10:38.279 the Inflation Reduction Act that had literally nothing to do 208 00:10:38.720 --> 00:10:41.960 with inflation. Well, look at Trump's policies right now, many 209 00:10:41.960 --> 00:10:44.000 of which I like. But look at what he wants 210 00:10:44.039 --> 00:10:46.080 to do in the next six months. He wants to 211 00:10:46.120 --> 00:10:49.320 expand the tax cuts from twenty seventeen, including no tips 212 00:10:49.360 --> 00:10:52.879 on taxes on tips, no taxes on overtime, no taxes 213 00:10:52.919 --> 00:10:56.399 on social security benefits. Best sent. The Treasury Secretary said 214 00:10:56.399 --> 00:10:58.120 two days ago that their aim is to bring interest 215 00:10:58.200 --> 00:11:01.799 rates down, and he's imposed tariffs supposedly twenty five percent 216 00:11:01.840 --> 00:11:04.799 on everything from Canada and Mexico. At least that's the aim. 217 00:11:05.360 --> 00:11:08.080 All of those things are inflationary, and inflation hasn't gone. 218 00:11:08.840 --> 00:11:11.720 People won't put up with it. Most people aren't ideological 219 00:11:11.759 --> 00:11:13.840 like we are. Most people don't follow politics like we do. 220 00:11:14.559 --> 00:11:18.200 They're gonna say, ah, wait, everything's expensive. I don't want 221 00:11:18.200 --> 00:11:20.360 things to be expensive. And when that happens, you don't 222 00:11:20.399 --> 00:11:22.120 get to do all of the rest of the stuff 223 00:11:22.159 --> 00:11:26.480 that I like, all the reform of the executive branch 224 00:11:26.840 --> 00:11:31.120 and the destruction of DEI and some of the foreign policy, 225 00:11:31.159 --> 00:11:34.360 not all of it. But I think this is a 226 00:11:34.519 --> 00:11:38.039 real risk for him that he is taking and not 227 00:11:38.159 --> 00:11:40.799 just again from the perspective of people who don't like him, 228 00:11:40.799 --> 00:11:42.720 who are going to say that anyway, but for the 229 00:11:42.759 --> 00:11:44.279 people who do like him. 230 00:11:44.679 --> 00:11:47.600 Agreed. Although we can have this argument about taxing social 231 00:11:47.639 --> 00:11:50.519 security another day perhaps, but I agree with you. And 232 00:11:50.559 --> 00:11:52.360 if inflation doesn't go down, then people are going to 233 00:11:52.360 --> 00:11:54.440 scratch their heads and wonder why. Now, you know, inflation 234 00:11:54.559 --> 00:11:56.759 is one of those things where you know it's hard 235 00:11:56.759 --> 00:11:58.840 to find a sweet spot for it. But your metabolism 236 00:11:58.879 --> 00:12:03.159 is different. Your metabolism. If your metabolism is working properly, 237 00:12:03.279 --> 00:12:06.240 you will feel that benefit in every aspect of your life. 238 00:12:06.320 --> 00:12:08.240 Now I found a valuable tool. It helps gives me 239 00:12:08.360 --> 00:12:10.759 insights it to create a healthy metabolism for my body. 240 00:12:10.799 --> 00:12:14.759 And it is called Lumen. Lumen is the world's first 241 00:12:14.799 --> 00:12:19.240 handheld metabolic coach. It's a device. It's a beautiful device too, 242 00:12:19.519 --> 00:12:22.799 and it measures your metabolism through your breath and on 243 00:12:22.879 --> 00:12:24.720 the app it lets you know if you're burning fat 244 00:12:24.799 --> 00:12:26.960 or carbs, and it gives you tailored guidance to improve 245 00:12:26.960 --> 00:12:29.679 your nutrition, your workouts, your sleep, and even stress management. 246 00:12:29.679 --> 00:12:31.919 It's pretty cool. You blow into it, you watch the app, 247 00:12:31.960 --> 00:12:33.519 you send it the little ball and you figure out 248 00:12:33.559 --> 00:12:35.799 what's going on. All you got to do is breathe 249 00:12:35.840 --> 00:12:37.879 into the Lumen first thing in the morning, and you'll 250 00:12:37.919 --> 00:12:40.639 know what's going on with your metabolism, whether you're burning 251 00:12:40.679 --> 00:12:44.840 mostly fats or carbs. And then what do you get, well, 252 00:12:45.240 --> 00:12:48.720 a personalized nutrition plan for that day based on your measurements. 253 00:12:48.720 --> 00:12:51.200 And I love it because you know, I love carbs, 254 00:12:51.360 --> 00:12:52.720 but I don't have a lot of them, and I 255 00:12:52.879 --> 00:12:54.840 like to know exactly what I get. This says you 256 00:12:54.879 --> 00:12:58.600 can have x many carbs. Whoa great find me what's on. 257 00:12:59.159 --> 00:13:01.480 You can also breathe into before and after workouts and meals. 258 00:13:01.519 --> 00:13:04.320 You know exactly what's going in your body real time, 259 00:13:04.519 --> 00:13:06.120 and Luhman will give you tips to keep you on 260 00:13:06.159 --> 00:13:09.440 top of your health game as well. Like I said, 261 00:13:09.639 --> 00:13:11.320 not only do I love this thing, I just love 262 00:13:11.360 --> 00:13:13.320 the look of it, the sleek feel of it. It's 263 00:13:13.360 --> 00:13:16.320 a it's a good piece of machinery, and I love 264 00:13:16.360 --> 00:13:19.279 getting that little program every day that tells me what 265 00:13:19.360 --> 00:13:21.639 I can have, what I should have, and it's it's 266 00:13:21.679 --> 00:13:24.279 just helped me keep my weight exactly where I want. 267 00:13:24.480 --> 00:13:26.320 So take the next step to improving your health and 268 00:13:26.360 --> 00:13:29.279 go to Lumen dot me slash Ricochet to get twenty 269 00:13:29.320 --> 00:13:32.480 percent off your lumen. That's lu me n dot m 270 00:13:32.879 --> 00:13:35.679 slash Ricochet for twenty percent off your purchase. You'll love 271 00:13:35.720 --> 00:13:37.919 this thing. And thank you Luhmann for sponsoring this the 272 00:13:38.000 --> 00:13:41.480 Ricochet podcast. And now we welcome to the podcast. Gerard 273 00:13:41.519 --> 00:13:44.200 Baker the editor at large at the Wall Street Journal, 274 00:13:44.360 --> 00:13:48.120 and you'll also find his weekly Free Expressions column every Tuesday. There. 275 00:13:48.120 --> 00:13:50.559 He hosts podcasts but the same name, along with the 276 00:13:50.559 --> 00:13:54.919 interview series w SJ at Large with Jerry Baker on 277 00:13:55.080 --> 00:13:56.080 Fox Business. 278 00:13:56.399 --> 00:13:59.240 Welcome, Thank you very much indeed for having me. It 279 00:13:59.279 --> 00:14:00.720 might be my first time. What's my first time for 280 00:14:00.720 --> 00:14:02.679 a while anyway, I think I think we've done this before, 281 00:14:02.679 --> 00:14:05.840 but back in the back in the ancient days of 282 00:14:05.879 --> 00:14:08.159 the Puts, the Biden administration. 283 00:14:08.159 --> 00:14:09.799 That would be a long time. You know, we've been 284 00:14:09.799 --> 00:14:12.480 doing this forever. This is podcast number seven thousand, seven 285 00:14:12.759 --> 00:14:14.320 and forty two, so you know, we may have had 286 00:14:14.360 --> 00:14:16.039 you back in the two thousands or something like that. 287 00:14:16.840 --> 00:14:19.639 So here we are. You know, we're halfway through the 288 00:14:19.799 --> 00:14:22.519 hundred days and you get a little tired of the 289 00:14:22.559 --> 00:14:25.320 one hundred days thing. But it's hard to shake. I 290 00:14:25.320 --> 00:14:29.360 guess it's inevitable. Trump has packed more into the first 291 00:14:29.399 --> 00:14:31.080 half of the hundred days, I think than I can 292 00:14:31.120 --> 00:14:34.039 imagine a lot. And it's this baffling welter. It's like 293 00:14:34.080 --> 00:14:36.519 standing in for behind a jet engine into which somebody 294 00:14:36.600 --> 00:14:40.960 has fed feathers and tacks and it's just it's really, so, 295 00:14:41.840 --> 00:14:43.559 what's your impression so far? 296 00:14:45.039 --> 00:14:49.080 Yeah, it's the uh, the everything everywhere, all at once 297 00:14:50.600 --> 00:14:53.720 to approach to governing. And by the way, there's obviously 298 00:14:54.000 --> 00:14:56.360 there's there's method in that, right, there's I mean that 299 00:14:56.360 --> 00:14:59.080 that that's done very deliberately. I remember reading an interview 300 00:14:59.080 --> 00:15:00.960 with Steve Bannon years go, I think in the early 301 00:15:01.039 --> 00:15:04.000 days the first Trump administration, where he said, you know, 302 00:15:04.120 --> 00:15:05.720 part of part of the purpose of this is a 303 00:15:05.879 --> 00:15:09.840 obviously to give a to project an image of activity 304 00:15:10.320 --> 00:15:14.159 and momentum and all of that, but also frankly, just 305 00:15:14.159 --> 00:15:17.200 to sort of overwhelm the media and political opponents. I mean, 306 00:15:17.240 --> 00:15:19.000 you know, you you at one minute, you're talking about 307 00:15:19.120 --> 00:15:22.360 Matt Gates being nominated for something, and everybody's, oh, throwing 308 00:15:22.360 --> 00:15:24.320 their arms up about that and so and then the 309 00:15:24.320 --> 00:15:26.080 next thing, we're talking about Telsea Gabbitt, and so we've 310 00:15:26.120 --> 00:15:28.240 forgotten about maca you know. So you know, there's no 311 00:15:28.360 --> 00:15:31.440 question it's a you know, and again everything from executive 312 00:15:31.559 --> 00:15:36.279 orders on everything from you know, immigration to you know, 313 00:15:36.320 --> 00:15:40.759 the administrative state to tariffs, and goodness knows what else. 314 00:15:40.799 --> 00:15:41.000 I mean. 315 00:15:41.679 --> 00:15:45.279 So you don't have time, the media don't have time 316 00:15:45.320 --> 00:15:49.440 to digest and interpret and critique and all of those 317 00:15:49.480 --> 00:15:52.279 things that you would normally do. So so part of 318 00:15:52.320 --> 00:15:54.000 it is so and that's you know, you can't you 319 00:15:54.000 --> 00:15:55.960 can only stand back and look at that and say, wow, 320 00:15:55.960 --> 00:15:59.120 that's kind of impressive management as well as impressive sort 321 00:15:59.159 --> 00:16:04.559 of energy. Look, I think I do think maybe this 322 00:16:04.759 --> 00:16:09.919 was the week in which, you know, maybe maybe maybe 323 00:16:09.960 --> 00:16:12.759 the we saw some of the kind of downsides of 324 00:16:12.799 --> 00:16:18.720 the frenetic pace the I mean, first of all, the tariffs, right, 325 00:16:18.799 --> 00:16:20.840 I mean, are just a disaster. Let's be completely honest 326 00:16:20.840 --> 00:16:23.600 about it. They're not only a disaster in themselves intrinsically, 327 00:16:23.639 --> 00:16:27.600 I'm a believer tariffs generally do nothing but harm. But 328 00:16:27.600 --> 00:16:30.279 but but the the back and forth, and you know, 329 00:16:30.320 --> 00:16:32.519 the desultry way in which Trump is you know, yes, 330 00:16:32.559 --> 00:16:34.759 they're on one day, they're not the next, and you 331 00:16:34.759 --> 00:16:36.840 can see the reaction of the financial markets. Nobody likes 332 00:16:36.919 --> 00:16:40.559 that and and so that's you know that that that's uh, 333 00:16:40.759 --> 00:16:44.600 maybe a sign of the you know, this this extraordinary, 334 00:16:45.240 --> 00:16:48.720 this this train hitting the buffers. You've had the you know, 335 00:16:48.759 --> 00:16:51.120 I think more worrying signs about the economy with jobs 336 00:16:51.159 --> 00:16:53.159 numbers weren't too bad today, but I think that's also 337 00:16:53.759 --> 00:16:57.600 going to kind of punch some holes in this, uh, 338 00:16:58.200 --> 00:17:00.840 in this performance. And and of course, you know, losing 339 00:17:00.840 --> 00:17:02.679 the case at the Supreme Court, or at least sort 340 00:17:02.720 --> 00:17:04.400 of temporarily as I understand it, losing the case of 341 00:17:04.440 --> 00:17:10.279 the Supreme Court on the on again in another administrative 342 00:17:10.319 --> 00:17:12.640 state case. So it feels a little bit as though. 343 00:17:13.079 --> 00:17:14.839 And then and then, by the way, you know, the 344 00:17:15.559 --> 00:17:18.200 European what this I mean Europe at the moment, in 345 00:17:18.240 --> 00:17:25.359 this extraordinary revolutionary kind of temper that there is in us, 346 00:17:26.119 --> 00:17:29.599 you know, European relations, I think that is also perhaps 347 00:17:29.599 --> 00:17:32.160 a sign that things are not going quite quite as 348 00:17:32.160 --> 00:17:35.039 smoothly as planned. So look, I think there's you know, 349 00:17:35.119 --> 00:17:38.720 it's it's been a it's been a highly productive, incredibly 350 00:17:38.720 --> 00:17:42.160 productive start from the executive side. We've got to see 351 00:17:42.519 --> 00:17:46.279 obviously where any of the legislative process goes. That that's 352 00:17:46.319 --> 00:17:49.759 you know, there's especially the big the big beautiful bill 353 00:17:50.480 --> 00:17:52.519 and other stuff. But I just think we're starting to 354 00:17:52.599 --> 00:17:55.599 see for the first time this week. I wouldn't say 355 00:17:55.640 --> 00:17:57.400 go as far as to say the wheels coming off, 356 00:17:57.839 --> 00:18:02.680 but the you know this, when you do, when you 357 00:18:02.720 --> 00:18:07.960 start out with this kind of blizzard, then stuff is 358 00:18:08.000 --> 00:18:10.799 going to start to stuff is going to start to, 359 00:18:11.759 --> 00:18:13.359 you know, to fall fall by the wayside. And I 360 00:18:13.359 --> 00:18:14.240 think we're starting to see that. 361 00:18:14.680 --> 00:18:20.160 Jerry, it's Steve Hayward out in California. And so, by 362 00:18:20.160 --> 00:18:22.279 the way, you know, my Tuesday morning starts reading your 363 00:18:22.279 --> 00:18:24.759 column in the Journal. Actually, my mornings start with reading 364 00:18:24.759 --> 00:18:26.440 all the daily columnists. And I wish you could get 365 00:18:26.480 --> 00:18:32.440 Dan Henninger to unretire and come back on Thursdays. But anyway, look, 366 00:18:33.519 --> 00:18:35.680 ask you about the European scene. Since you're over there. 367 00:18:37.279 --> 00:18:39.559 I've been planning out the theme lately with people that 368 00:18:40.680 --> 00:18:44.759 just as Trump is attempting to overthrow the Wilsonian legacy 369 00:18:44.839 --> 00:18:48.119 Woodrow Wilson's legacy of the administrative state at home, he 370 00:18:48.240 --> 00:18:53.400 is also trying to undo the Wilsonian legacy in foreign policy. 371 00:18:53.440 --> 00:18:56.039 In other words, the Wilsonian internationalism that has been the 372 00:18:56.079 --> 00:18:58.759 consensus of you with both parties at least since the 373 00:18:58.839 --> 00:19:00.920 end of World War two, if out in certain ways 374 00:19:00.920 --> 00:19:04.519 before all that, And I think I'm sympathetic to that 375 00:19:04.559 --> 00:19:06.480 project in some ways. That would take a long time 376 00:19:06.519 --> 00:19:08.440 to go through, But I don't think there's any way 377 00:19:08.480 --> 00:19:10.880 that that could be accomplished without some kind of big bang, 378 00:19:10.960 --> 00:19:14.160 without something that would be wrenching. I mean, I thought 379 00:19:14.200 --> 00:19:16.440 I was writing actually when Obama was president, that he 380 00:19:16.519 --> 00:19:19.960 had the opportunity if he wanted to reset sort of 381 00:19:19.960 --> 00:19:23.079 American European relations and the NATO strategy and so forth, 382 00:19:23.119 --> 00:19:25.240 but he really had no interest in that. And so 383 00:19:25.359 --> 00:19:28.200 of course Trump's going to be bumbling, But I think 384 00:19:28.240 --> 00:19:31.799 there is potentially an upside here. Am I too optimistic? 385 00:19:31.880 --> 00:19:34.960 What am I missing? Are Europeans so thoroughly alarmed and 386 00:19:35.000 --> 00:19:37.279 panicky that this was an ill advised idea? 387 00:19:37.799 --> 00:19:40.759 Yeah, So I'm here in Europe wading through the waiting, 388 00:19:40.799 --> 00:19:44.559 through the through the broken eggs of the of the 389 00:19:44.559 --> 00:19:47.079 the president Trump is in the process of making. I 390 00:19:47.119 --> 00:19:49.880 don't disagree with you that, Jim, I think. I mean, 391 00:19:49.920 --> 00:19:53.000 I think I think, you know, fundamentally, one of the 392 00:19:53.000 --> 00:19:55.039 things that I found really interesting this week, and it 393 00:19:55.079 --> 00:19:56.240 got a lot of attention to got a lot of 394 00:19:56.279 --> 00:19:59.119 negative attention when Trump gave I think he was in 395 00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:00.720 the Oval Office and he was talking, you know, in 396 00:20:01.240 --> 00:20:03.400 doing that strange thing that he does where he kind 397 00:20:03.400 --> 00:20:05.559 of holds a kind of a rolling in comptue press 398 00:20:05.559 --> 00:20:08.119 conference while he's signing those executive orders. He was talking 399 00:20:08.160 --> 00:20:10.279 and a topic he got onto the subject of Japan 400 00:20:10.359 --> 00:20:14.440 and the Japan Security Pact that the US has with Japan, 401 00:20:14.440 --> 00:20:15.880