1
00:00:05,240 --> 00:00:08,800
Speaker 1: What is up, Fellowsiko's I am Dana Valley coming at

2
00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:11,720
you with the one, the only, this certified man, fabulous

3
00:00:11,919 --> 00:00:15,919
co host of this very podcast, The Hardwoodknox that thea podcast,

4
00:00:16,359 --> 00:00:21,320
mister Grant Hughes, We have an exciting episode for you today.

5
00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:26,199
We are going to provide a screwed score for the

6
00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:31,600
NBA's most disappointing teams, disappointment being defined as relative to

7
00:00:31,679 --> 00:00:36,000
their expectations. I'm going to let Grant, though, take you

8
00:00:36,079 --> 00:00:38,439
through how we're going to approach it, because he came

9
00:00:38,520 --> 00:00:40,600
up with a fantastic acronym that we will throw on

10
00:00:40,640 --> 00:00:44,520
the screen. However, first, how the heck are you doing?

11
00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:47,679
Speaker 2: I'm doing really well. I'm very I want to get

12
00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:50,520
right into it, but I because I'm so excited that

13
00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:53,640
we did. We did come up with a proprietary metric.

14
00:00:54,119 --> 00:00:58,679
This is real. We crafted it. You say you're crediting me,

15
00:00:58,799 --> 00:01:03,320
but we collectively came up with an acronym. Sorry, with

16
00:01:03,359 --> 00:01:06,079
a with a rating with a score that just happens

17
00:01:06,079 --> 00:01:11,239
to be an acronym. Also, I didn't tell you this.

18
00:01:11,719 --> 00:01:14,519
I'm doing really well because you know how analog I

19
00:01:14,560 --> 00:01:16,799
am right, and I actually keep like a planner that

20
00:01:16,879 --> 00:01:20,400
I physically write on with ink. I finished an ink

21
00:01:20,439 --> 00:01:24,239
pen yesterday. I finished. Do you know what's more satisfying

22
00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:27,359
than finishing a whole ink pen? You know, over however

23
00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:30,519
many months, Dan, nothing, not a single thing.

24
00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:33,640
Speaker 1: Well, here's the thing. Did you have other ink pens

25
00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:35,840
at the ready? Because then that becomes an inconvenience If

26
00:01:35,879 --> 00:01:36,319
you did not.

27
00:01:36,359 --> 00:01:38,200
Speaker 2: I had to go find one here I'm holding up

28
00:01:38,280 --> 00:01:40,560
right now. So we've really gone to like an electric

29
00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:42,920
blue pen. This is not my favorite kind of pen.

30
00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:45,640
I have strong feelings on pens. I'm a ballpoint guy,

31
00:01:46,159 --> 00:01:49,920
and I prefer hotel room pens to all other pens.

32
00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:51,359
I don't know why.

33
00:01:51,560 --> 00:01:53,719
Speaker 1: Well, you know what, I kind of get that, because

34
00:01:53,719 --> 00:01:55,400
they're gonna want to make sure that you could sign

35
00:01:55,719 --> 00:01:57,319
for stuff there if you in so far as you

36
00:01:57,359 --> 00:01:58,760
just don't need to sign anything. I don't know that

37
00:01:58,799 --> 00:02:00,799
I've ever gone to a hotel room past half decade

38
00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:03,040
and look for an actual physical pen, to be honest

39
00:02:03,079 --> 00:02:05,840
with you. But when they open up the hardwood Knox

40
00:02:05,879 --> 00:02:08,520
Hall of Fame, that is one of the items the

41
00:02:09,000 --> 00:02:10,560
memorabilia that they're going to.

42
00:02:10,479 --> 00:02:16,240
Speaker 2: Hang expended pens. Yeah, that's great. So how how are

43
00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:19,439
you doing are you. Are you as excited about unveiling

44
00:02:19,479 --> 00:02:21,400
our proprietary metric as I am.

45
00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:24,520
Speaker 1: I'm excited, and let's let's unveil it on the screen

46
00:02:24,520 --> 00:02:27,240
for people watching. I am a little nervous, not nervous,

47
00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:28,840
but like, this is gonna be something you and I

48
00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:30,680
just have a ton of fun doing, and that it's

49
00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:32,080
invariably gonna make people mad.

50
00:02:32,599 --> 00:02:36,919
Speaker 2: It's okay, that's fine, so screwed score. As you said,

51
00:02:37,719 --> 00:02:41,599
we are discussing teams that have been disappointing, and we're

52
00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:45,960
essentially trying to look forward at like how screwed is

53
00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:50,360
this team? And within that discussion, we will you know, figure,

54
00:02:50,439 --> 00:02:53,360
we will we will hit on how many outs do

55
00:02:53,439 --> 00:02:55,800
they have? Like how dire are the circumstances, what is

56
00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:58,319
the reason that things are not going well? How likely

57
00:02:58,360 --> 00:02:59,800
are they to pull out of this? How might that

58
00:02:59,840 --> 00:03:02,439
have happened? Just sort of like, what's it look like

59
00:03:02,520 --> 00:03:07,759
going forward? How screwed are you? And screwed? Screwed is?

60
00:03:08,039 --> 00:03:10,919
Shit could really end? With extensive detonation?

61
00:03:11,319 --> 00:03:13,240
Speaker 1: You ruin your own acronym.

62
00:03:13,479 --> 00:03:17,240
Speaker 2: What did I say? Realistically? Damn it? Sorry? Shit could

63
00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:21,520
really end realistically and with extensive detonation. I really want

64
00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:23,199
to say. Really, I think that's because it's what we

65
00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:24,400
had first, and it stuck in.

66
00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:26,240
Speaker 1: My brain and you were the one that suggested we

67
00:03:26,680 --> 00:03:27,240
sub it out.

68
00:03:27,319 --> 00:03:29,560
Speaker 2: But yeah, I know, well you know I was still

69
00:03:29,599 --> 00:03:32,800
thinking about the pen. I think, so we will score

70
00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:35,520
this from one to ten. Coincidentally, we have ten teams

71
00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:38,159
to discuss. A score of ten, A screwed score of

72
00:03:38,159 --> 00:03:40,159
ten is very bad. That's as screwed as you can be.

73
00:03:40,280 --> 00:03:44,000
A screwed score of one not ideal, but relative to

74
00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:47,080
the other teams we'll discuss. That's that's that's solid. That's

75
00:03:47,080 --> 00:03:49,000
where you'd want to be if you're in this conversation.

76
00:03:49,240 --> 00:03:50,560
So you think we should get into.

77
00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:51,759
Speaker 1: It, yes, I am.

78
00:03:51,879 --> 00:03:52,000
Speaker 2: Well.

79
00:03:52,039 --> 00:03:54,080
Speaker 1: The only other thing I'll add is, I don't know

80
00:03:54,120 --> 00:03:56,479
how you look at this when you're evaluating, when you're

81
00:03:56,479 --> 00:03:58,599
talking about the outs or like even if it comes

82
00:03:58,599 --> 00:04:02,159
to doubling down different directions. I did try to kind

83
00:04:02,159 --> 00:04:05,560
of look at this over like a maximum of a

84
00:04:05,639 --> 00:04:08,400
three year maybe like further window to where it's like

85
00:04:08,439 --> 00:04:10,960
something like if you're really screwed, yeah, next season. But

86
00:04:11,039 --> 00:04:12,560
like for some of these teams that are more towards

87
00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:15,159
the bottom, I was trying to project a little further ahead,

88
00:04:15,159 --> 00:04:17,680
and I will say, for me personally, that's gotten so

89
00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:21,959
much harder because it feels like windows are just more

90
00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:25,519
fleeting or even shape shifting. Maybe they're not closing and opening,

91
00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:28,920
but they're just taking different forms now faster than ever.

92
00:04:28,959 --> 00:04:31,120
And so it makes like it felt like when we

93
00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:32,519
were talking about this, it felt like there was a

94
00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:34,959
clear top three for the most screwed. There was an

95
00:04:34,959 --> 00:04:37,519
easy inclusion, like to start for the least screwed, but

96
00:04:37,560 --> 00:04:40,160
then got everything in between. There could be like real

97
00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:43,240
debates and you're gonna agonize over like the minutia of

98
00:04:43,279 --> 00:04:43,600
it all.

99
00:04:44,279 --> 00:04:47,319
Speaker 2: Oh and last thing, we're not gonna so we cut

100
00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:50,720
it off at ten. Some teams that you might think

101
00:04:50,759 --> 00:04:53,759
are screwed just because they're really terrible, like they're not

102
00:04:53,839 --> 00:04:57,040
going to feature here because for a variety of reasons,

103
00:04:57,040 --> 00:04:59,399
one of which being like nobody expected anything out of

104
00:04:59,439 --> 00:05:02,079
them part of it, and the other part is like

105
00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:05,480
relatively speaking, they're pretty flexible, like kind of Blank's Lady,

106
00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:09,160
So like Washington won't be here, Charlotte's not here, Brooklyn's

107
00:05:09,199 --> 00:05:12,199
not here. Those are just rebuilders, like Utah's not here.

108
00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:14,759
They have a trillion picks like, those aren't the types

109
00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:17,079
of teams we're talking about being screwed. We're talking about

110
00:05:17,079 --> 00:05:19,680
ones that are I actually crossed the board really like

111
00:05:19,759 --> 00:05:23,519
further along in the you know, trying to win process,

112
00:05:23,639 --> 00:05:27,560
and things aren't going well and they're hamstrung by various

113
00:05:27,600 --> 00:05:29,279
things that we will get into, and you.

114
00:05:29,279 --> 00:05:32,439
Speaker 1: Could even Charlotte is the spoiler exclusion alert to where

115
00:05:32,439 --> 00:05:34,920
we talked about it a little bit because I expected

116
00:05:34,959 --> 00:05:36,680
more out of them. You can excuse some of it

117
00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:39,000
because of injuries, but it's very clear that they're just

118
00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:44,040
not close. However, if you sat here, if you had

119
00:05:44,079 --> 00:05:47,600
told me in September that Charlotte's going to be fourteenth

120
00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:50,639
in the Eastern Conference, that's not something that would have

121
00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:52,839
floored me. Now if I've sat here and told you

122
00:05:53,279 --> 00:05:56,600
that Philadelphia in April is going to be thirteenth in

123
00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:59,160
the Eastern Conference, that is something that would have absolutely

124
00:05:59,199 --> 00:06:00,959
I mean, I guess actually could have said, well, that

125
00:06:01,079 --> 00:06:04,800
means things went incredibly wrong. But because they were positioned

126
00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:08,560
like to try and actualize their best case outcome, where

127
00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:11,240
Charlotte still wasn't like if they were supposed to they

128
00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:13,879
were supposed to win more games, sure, but it was oh,

129
00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:16,240
maybe they'll compete for a play and the sixers. It's

130
00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:17,759
all relative to expectations.

131
00:06:17,839 --> 00:06:21,079
Speaker 2: Is basically, what if you had told your hypothetical self

132
00:06:21,079 --> 00:06:23,560
that Philly was thirteenth in the conference. Your other self

133
00:06:23,560 --> 00:06:25,160
would have said, sounds like they're screwed.

134
00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:27,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly what my other self would have said. And

135
00:06:27,879 --> 00:06:30,240
you know what, I would have also said, shit could

136
00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:32,480
realistically end with extensive detonation.

137
00:06:32,759 --> 00:06:35,120
Speaker 2: Then, so well said, we begin screwed.

138
00:06:35,160 --> 00:06:38,240
Speaker 1: Score of one. I will take it the Orlando Magic.

139
00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:41,079
I think you and I were disappointed that they didn't

140
00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:44,720
end up doing more over the offseason in general, injuries

141
00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:48,079
never really gave them a chance. This year, they're sitting

142
00:06:48,120 --> 00:06:51,519
eighth in the Eastern Conference, below five hundred. The defense

143
00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:54,279
can still be fantastic, but you're still kind of sitting

144
00:06:54,360 --> 00:06:57,800
here asking the same questions that you were before they

145
00:06:57,839 --> 00:07:00,519
even reached the playoffs last year. And it's okay for

146
00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:02,959
Paula Bankara was a killer in the playoffs last year.

147
00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:05,759
He's been on a better stretch recently. Is he going

148
00:07:05,759 --> 00:07:07,800
to be as efficient as you need him to be?

149
00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:10,439
And then it's kind of the same question with Franz Wagner.

150
00:07:10,439 --> 00:07:12,720
It's like, do these two higher end stars. Wagner was

151
00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:16,439
in the onset back of about MVP consideration. But will

152
00:07:16,480 --> 00:07:20,600
they ever be hyper efficient or high end efficient drivers

153
00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:23,480
of a higher end offense? And it's a it's an

154
00:07:23,519 --> 00:07:27,959
open question. What gives them cover is One, there's the injuries. Two,

155
00:07:28,000 --> 00:07:31,199
they're still relatively young. Three I will bang this drum

156
00:07:31,199 --> 00:07:33,920
to death. It's I view this. I know some people

157
00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:37,439
view bank. Caro specifically feels like he has more skeptics

158
00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:41,199
because he's considered a ball stopper. I need to see

159
00:07:41,240 --> 00:07:44,480
and he might favor more inefficient shots. I just want

160
00:07:44,519 --> 00:07:46,639
to see him with any sort of functional spacing the

161
00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:50,079
magic like their off ball gravity has never been good

162
00:07:50,839 --> 00:07:54,720
around him since he's under the league. At the same time, though,

163
00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:56,279
like they have to be on the slitt just because

164
00:07:56,279 --> 00:07:59,240
their disappointment. I will say they're not going to be

165
00:07:59,319 --> 00:08:04,480
prohibitive expensive until twenty twenty six, twenty seven, that's not

166
00:08:04,639 --> 00:08:07,279
far away. And also they could be a tax team

167
00:08:07,319 --> 00:08:09,839
next year. They probably won't be, but it's okay, Well,

168
00:08:09,879 --> 00:08:11,560
if you're trying to stay out of the tax, how

169
00:08:11,560 --> 00:08:14,920
do you get better? And so it's worth just considering. No,

170
00:08:14,959 --> 00:08:16,399
I don't think they were a blip. They have an

171
00:08:16,439 --> 00:08:19,759
excellent base in place, but the path forward for them

172
00:08:19,839 --> 00:08:22,680
is not just sort of as choose your own adventure

173
00:08:22,839 --> 00:08:24,040
as you might prefer it to be.

174
00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:27,680
Speaker 2: Yes, I agree by far the least screwed team here.

175
00:08:28,079 --> 00:08:30,240
They have all their own picks going forward. They've got

176
00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:32,759
one coming from Denver this year. They've got a twenty

177
00:08:32,799 --> 00:08:34,840
six first from you know, one of those worst stuffs

178
00:08:34,879 --> 00:08:38,000
from Phoenix or Washington in twenty Like they're in great

179
00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:40,799
shape pickwise. It really does just come down to like

180
00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:44,240
the build of the roster, Like how you don't love

181
00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:48,759
the idea of both Ben Heero and Franz Wagner being

182
00:08:48,799 --> 00:08:51,159
iffy three point shooters. Powell has been better lately, but

183
00:08:51,279 --> 00:08:54,120
like that complicates things. I do think if you want

184
00:08:54,120 --> 00:08:57,799
to be alarmist about it, it's now the personnel is

185
00:08:57,840 --> 00:08:59,639
one thing, and the injuries or another. But it's like,

186
00:09:00,080 --> 00:09:02,360
do you have faith that Jamal Mosley is a good

187
00:09:02,399 --> 00:09:06,080
offensive coach? I don't know, Like maybe maybe, like everybody

188
00:09:06,080 --> 00:09:08,600
makes this comparison, but like he's the Mark Jackson. They

189
00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:10,919
need their Steve Kerr eventually, and so like if you

190
00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:14,159
do change coaches, then you run the risk of like

191
00:09:14,200 --> 00:09:16,600
actually it just this. You know it wasn't him and

192
00:09:16,639 --> 00:09:18,960
it is just the build of the team. But you

193
00:09:18,960 --> 00:09:22,080
know the Orlando's in very good shape. It's just like

194
00:09:22,639 --> 00:09:25,639
there are concerns with like you've you've anchored yourself to

195
00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:28,000
these two guys that may or may not be ideal

196
00:09:28,039 --> 00:09:32,159
fits together, and the offense just continues to be a problem.

197
00:09:32,200 --> 00:09:34,399
And that's like always a little bit concerning when the

198
00:09:34,440 --> 00:09:37,440
same thing is the issue, you know, year after year.

199
00:09:38,159 --> 00:09:40,080
Speaker 1: And so now that I have it pulled up, they

200
00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:43,600
have never since Pallo entered the league. The teammate quality

201
00:09:43,639 --> 00:09:47,200
around him this season is in the first percentile grant

202
00:09:47,279 --> 00:09:49,879
of both three point and overall spot up efficiency, and

203
00:09:49,919 --> 00:09:52,919
it's never ranked higher than the forty first percentile since

204
00:09:52,919 --> 00:09:55,279
he's come into the league. And so I think that

205
00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:57,519
sort of not that it lends merit, but does it

206
00:09:57,559 --> 00:10:01,039
make you feel like there's a clear direction to travel,

207
00:10:01,080 --> 00:10:03,759
clear fixes to be made here? I think if you

208
00:10:03,759 --> 00:10:08,279
were to really be alarmist, would you have to settle on, well,

209
00:10:08,279 --> 00:10:10,960
what type of move do they need to because it

210
00:10:11,039 --> 00:10:13,399
takes a belief, a conviction in both Polo and Franz

211
00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:15,639
to say is this a difference between they need them

212
00:10:15,639 --> 00:10:18,320
just throwing names out a Lamello ball or is it

213
00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:20,279
just go out and getting Anthony Simons And you think

214
00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:22,679
that does enough to put them where they need to

215
00:10:22,720 --> 00:10:24,200
be or want to be even.

216
00:10:24,120 --> 00:10:26,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, And that's why they're not. That's why they rate

217
00:10:27,039 --> 00:10:30,840
so low here, which is good because like you could

218
00:10:30,879 --> 00:10:34,399
try one or the other and the cheaper less like

219
00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:37,600
full commit option might be enough, you know, especially if

220
00:10:37,639 --> 00:10:40,960
you price in like I assume Franz won't shoot under

221
00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:43,279
thirty percent a third year in a row from deep

222
00:10:43,320 --> 00:10:45,840
and I assume Paulo is just gonna get harder to guard,

223
00:10:45,919 --> 00:10:48,279
Like that seems realistic based on how things have gone.

224
00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:51,000
Speaker 1: And the other thing too, They control all of their

225
00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:53,720
first round picks, they have Denver's pick coming in this year,

226
00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:56,639
and there's not Is there a bad contract on the books?

227
00:10:56,840 --> 00:10:59,399
Does the sugs injury do anything to change your perception

228
00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:00,000
of his extension?

229
00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:03,440
Speaker 2: If it is bad, it's it's for reasons that are

230
00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:05,519
like kind of out of the team's control, because which

231
00:11:05,559 --> 00:11:07,720
would just be, oh my god, he's not gonna it's

232
00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:09,559
gonna be hard for him to like get right physically,

233
00:11:09,639 --> 00:11:11,879
but like as a player, he's worth the money they're

234
00:11:11,919 --> 00:11:14,440
paying him, assuming he can, you know, come back next year?

235
00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:15,440
One hundred percent.

236
00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:19,120
Speaker 1: I will say I would we love the Anthony Simons

237
00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:21,120
for this team. I wonder if they're going to figure

238
00:11:21,120 --> 00:11:23,799
out a way, like could they get involved in elite

239
00:11:23,840 --> 00:11:26,200
Beasley's free agency this summer would be like another perfect

240
00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:28,840
type of acquisition for them. But this needs to be

241
00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:31,159
you know what, I will up their screwed score over

242
00:11:31,200 --> 00:11:33,600
the summer if they do another what they did last offseason,

243
00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:36,200
where it was we get someone who doesn't really address

244
00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:37,279
our primary issue.

245
00:11:37,559 --> 00:11:39,039
Speaker 2: Yes, that would be an issue.

246
00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:40,799
Speaker 1: We did not mention this at the top, and I

247
00:11:40,799 --> 00:11:44,360
forgotten to start it. But we are working with timers,

248
00:11:44,440 --> 00:11:46,480
so we're gonna do a maximum of eight minutes or

249
00:11:46,519 --> 00:11:48,720
eight minutes and change per team. I think that's it

250
00:11:48,960 --> 00:11:51,039
on the Magic Are you ready to take us to

251
00:11:51,080 --> 00:11:51,639
our next team?

252
00:11:51,720 --> 00:11:54,000
Speaker 2: Let's do it all right? Coming in with a screwed

253
00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:54,759
score of two.

254
00:11:55,399 --> 00:11:55,519
Speaker 1: Uh.

255
00:11:55,600 --> 00:11:58,799
Speaker 2: The Minnesota Timberwolves. They're a good team. They're gonna be

256
00:11:58,840 --> 00:12:03,440
in the playoffs and maybe a situation really for tell

257
00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:06,279
me if you agree or disagree here, it's like you

258
00:12:06,320 --> 00:12:08,840
can only be so screwed if you have Anthony Edwards

259
00:12:09,039 --> 00:12:12,120
because he's on the shortest or short list of young

260
00:12:12,279 --> 00:12:17,399
cornerstone type players. This is really just about the financial picture.

261
00:12:18,559 --> 00:12:21,639
Like they've already made one trade, you know, moving off

262
00:12:21,679 --> 00:12:24,600
Cat for Randall, which which is I don't think now

263
00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:28,000
you can say was a basketball move. We've litigated this,

264
00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:32,159
you know, all season. It's an expensive team. They haven't

265
00:12:32,159 --> 00:12:34,879
been as good as they were last year. The offense

266
00:12:35,320 --> 00:12:37,480
is just like it feels like is having to do

267
00:12:38,120 --> 00:12:41,480
Can shooting toward forty percent on super high volume from three.

268
00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:43,759
He's having that that's just not the role I think

269
00:12:43,799 --> 00:12:46,159
you want him playing, so like he's being kind of

270
00:12:46,159 --> 00:12:50,519
suboptimally utilized. He's good enough to make it work. It's

271
00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:54,720
really just the money. It's the and the like they

272
00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:57,799
have now I think officially or however officially you want

273
00:12:57,799 --> 00:13:01,279
to call it, like have changed ownership. That that's a variable,

274
00:13:01,399 --> 00:13:03,759
Like it's hard to imagine ownership will be worse than

275
00:13:03,799 --> 00:13:07,480
Glenn Taylor, but you know, we don't know. So this

276
00:13:07,559 --> 00:13:11,600
is still a very low screwed score. But like they

277
00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:15,480
just it's hard to avoid the feeling of like there

278
00:13:15,559 --> 00:13:20,360
might be another step back and that's not super encouraging.

279
00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:23,960
Speaker 1: The two things that I harp on here, well, I

280
00:13:23,960 --> 00:13:26,000
guess it's three because they have a lack of ass

281
00:13:26,120 --> 00:13:28,720
you're moving players as your equity. At this point, they

282
00:13:28,759 --> 00:13:30,960
can trade one first round pick, it's detroits that they

283
00:13:31,000 --> 00:13:34,879
own this year, and then from there it's you mentioned

284
00:13:34,879 --> 00:13:36,320
the new ownership things. So I actually want to ask

285
00:13:36,320 --> 00:13:38,320
you a question about that. Do you think because we

286
00:13:38,360 --> 00:13:43,159
know Mark Lora and al Chrabriguez were apparently heavily involved

287
00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:46,720
in the hiring of Tim Connolly, do you think that

288
00:13:46,799 --> 00:13:49,919
means that this won't be a situation where we see

289
00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:52,720
new owner syndrome kick in because it feels like they've

290
00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:55,480
maybe had more of a significant say, or do you

291
00:13:55,519 --> 00:13:58,159
still kind of view it as that's absolutely a wild

292
00:13:58,159 --> 00:14:00,399
card because now they're going to take eighty percent or

293
00:14:00,399 --> 00:14:02,159
one hundred percent of control of the team, whatever it is,

294
00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:05,679
and they're absolutely gonna come in, maybe especially after all

295
00:14:05,759 --> 00:14:09,639
the Shenanigans, and try and leave their imprint on the franchise.

296
00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:14,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I think the fact that they were involved

297
00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:17,080
at least I don't know, maybe that just offsets the

298
00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:19,440
whole like he kind of signed like a he's like

299
00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:21,399
on a one plus one more or less, like he

300
00:14:21,399 --> 00:14:24,639
can just Connolly could just kind of opt out. I

301
00:14:24,759 --> 00:14:28,879
wonder if that was something he wanted, because like, well,

302
00:14:28,919 --> 00:14:30,799
if Glenn Taylor's back, I don't want to be like,

303
00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:32,879
maybe it's that, and then in that case, it's great.

304
00:14:32,919 --> 00:14:35,440
We got no issue with new ownership and the top

305
00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:40,120
executive like not being kind of aligned. I didn't even

306
00:14:40,159 --> 00:14:42,720
think about him though, as like a potential flight risk,

307
00:14:42,759 --> 00:14:46,480
because like what if he looks at the financial situation

308
00:14:46,759 --> 00:14:49,960
and the options ahead of the Wolves going forward and

309
00:14:50,039 --> 00:14:51,960
is like, I don't think this is it? You know,

310
00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:54,879
I want to go because another team would hire him immediately, right,

311
00:14:55,000 --> 00:14:56,960
like is it? Don't you think he's still probably is

312
00:14:57,039 --> 00:15:00,000
someone that's highly regarded enough that he could get another job.

313
00:15:00,240 --> 00:15:03,440
So like there's that aspect of it. But yeah, I

314
00:15:04,159 --> 00:15:07,600
would assume that he, he and new ownership will not

315
00:15:07,679 --> 00:15:09,960
have an issue and that if he does wind up leaving,

316
00:15:10,039 --> 00:15:13,399
it would be because he just maybe he gets a

317
00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:16,879
directive that like, hey, we're gonna, you know, try to

318
00:15:16,879 --> 00:15:18,840
be a little cheaper going forward, and you're gonna have

319
00:15:18,879 --> 00:15:22,440
to make another cat for Randall and the Vincenzo kind

320
00:15:22,440 --> 00:15:27,120
of deal. But I wouldn't worry too much about that

321
00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:28,840
side of it, do you.

322
00:15:28,799 --> 00:15:30,519
Speaker 1: But do you think it could manifest maybe in a

323
00:15:30,519 --> 00:15:33,799
way where they're applying pressure for him to make more

324
00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:36,519
of a where like wouldn't a perfect example be they

325
00:15:36,519 --> 00:15:38,320
were one of the teams that there was apparently mutual

326
00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:40,639
interest with Kevin Durant. I talked about this with the

327
00:15:40,679 --> 00:15:45,240
athletics s Bereheini the other day. Just would you give

328
00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:47,080
like do they give up too much to get where

329
00:15:47,120 --> 00:15:49,919
it's oh, yeah, we'll give you nas Read it opted

330
00:15:49,919 --> 00:15:51,480
in or something or opted in and they will give

331
00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:54,039
you nas Read and Jade McDaniels and that pick and

332
00:15:54,159 --> 00:15:56,279
Rob Dylan. Do you think that there's the potential for

333
00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:59,720
that or if you're keeping the same executive that windows

334
00:15:59,759 --> 00:16:02,919
down the risk of something like that happening substantially.

335
00:16:04,960 --> 00:16:08,480
Speaker 2: I don't know. It's it's hard for me to think

336
00:16:08,519 --> 00:16:10,679
of the package that would be, like, that's too much

337
00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:14,799
for Kevin Durant based on what they read realistically give up?

338
00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:18,200
So yeah, I don't. I don't know. If if I'm

339
00:16:18,240 --> 00:16:21,240
concerned about him being pressured to do something like that,

340
00:16:21,559 --> 00:16:23,799
I would say, actually, and again this is a low

341
00:16:23,879 --> 00:16:27,320
screwed score. I think it benefits them that, like there's

342
00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:29,039
just no free agent money out there and they've got

343
00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:31,480
several free agents that in other circumstances you'd be like, oh,

344
00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:33,879
that guy's gone, but like they might just be able

345
00:16:33,919 --> 00:16:37,320
to keep Read and gnaw and just have, you know,

346
00:16:37,799 --> 00:16:42,080
at reasonable numbers because like Brooklyn isn't going to pay them,

347
00:16:42,159 --> 00:16:43,639
and you know what I mean, Like I think there's

348
00:16:43,639 --> 00:16:46,799
a real they're in a they're in a fortunate situation

349
00:16:46,879 --> 00:16:48,879
because of the free agent landscape right now.

350
00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:51,159
Speaker 1: Well that was my other question, and it's so as

351
00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:53,840
of right now, if you penal in Randal and read

352
00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:57,519
to so Randall's player option is worth thirty point nine

353
00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:00,559
million and Reads is fifteen million, So that's about non

354
00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:03,879
tax payer mid level money. The Wolves are actually under

355
00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:07,079
the first apron with I think it's fourteen or fifteen players.

356
00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:10,440
No Niki Alexander Walker though, and so like that's I

357
00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:13,440
think it's a source of uncertainty that makes me uncomfortable

358
00:17:13,440 --> 00:17:16,799
because nos Reed, Julius Randall, and Nikkeile Alexander Walker can

359
00:17:16,839 --> 00:17:18,559
all be free agents, and at least one of them

360
00:17:18,599 --> 00:17:22,039
will be even if nos Reed and Julius Randall opt in,

361
00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:25,240
will this team pay what it's gonna take to keep

362
00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:27,359
nikkil Aus. It's not like they have a salary you

363
00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:29,559
point towards and say, well, then we'll just dump it

364
00:17:29,599 --> 00:17:31,839
because we don't want to be emmy aprons. You're not

365
00:17:31,880 --> 00:17:33,839
just gonna give like because Julius Randall's money if he

366
00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:36,799
opts in, is tough to move. On the flip side,

367
00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:39,519
Julie Randall's also been your second best offensive player this

368
00:17:39,599 --> 00:17:43,640
year pretty clearly, what is like, Like, I guess realistically,

369
00:17:43,640 --> 00:17:45,400
I'm asking you, like, what are the odds that all

370
00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:47,839
three of these guys are on the roster next year?

371
00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:51,000
And if they are, what was the collateral damage of that?

372
00:17:51,079 --> 00:17:54,519
Because decided to offload Mike Conley's money at that point,

373
00:17:54,559 --> 00:17:57,039
and we know that he's incredibly important when it comes

374
00:17:57,079 --> 00:17:59,480
to his passing in the locker room. He's not had

375
00:17:59,519 --> 00:18:01,599
as good of a year and he is playing less overall.

376
00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:04,960
But like, it's there's just so much. Yeah, we're not

377
00:18:05,039 --> 00:18:08,720
talking about their first like their top guy, but we

378
00:18:08,759 --> 00:18:10,720
are talking about like I think if you were to

379
00:18:10,759 --> 00:18:14,319
ask who's Minnesota's second best player, I don't know what

380
00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:16,559
the contentsus answer would be, but I think you'd get

381
00:18:16,599 --> 00:18:21,240
four different ones between Rudy Gobert, Jaden McDaniels, Randall, and

382
00:18:21,519 --> 00:18:24,119
Nasried maybe some Dante DiVincenzo sprinkled in there.

383
00:18:24,400 --> 00:18:29,079
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you know, it's it's not ideal when

384
00:18:29,680 --> 00:18:32,359
Randall who might Yeah, you're right, a lot of people

385
00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:35,559
would say he's certainly the second most important offensive player

386
00:18:35,599 --> 00:18:38,160
and and maybe as their second best player. It's not

387
00:18:38,240 --> 00:18:40,759
ideal when you're like, well, if he opted out, it

388
00:18:40,759 --> 00:18:42,960
wouldn't be the worst thing. You know, Like, that's not

389
00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:45,200
a great situation to be in because it just speaks

390
00:18:45,279 --> 00:18:48,960
to how like it touches on everything it touches on,

391
00:18:49,079 --> 00:18:52,240
Like the offense isn't great, the fits weird. This is

392
00:18:52,279 --> 00:18:56,480
me speaking as a very like non Randal believer, and

393
00:18:56,559 --> 00:18:58,880
like maybe that solves some of our problems if you'd like,

394
00:18:58,920 --> 00:19:00,880
I don't think he's opting out because I just don't

395
00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:03,519
know how he's gonna recoup that money. But yeah, that's

396
00:19:03,599 --> 00:19:06,960
illustrative of like there's a little screwedness when it's like

397
00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:09,359
you could have mixed feelings about your second best offensive

398
00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:11,920
player just leaving for nothing. That that's not a great

399
00:19:12,160 --> 00:19:13,160
situation to be in.

400
00:19:13,759 --> 00:19:16,480
Speaker 1: And I think Rudy Gobay are getting older, and then

401
00:19:16,759 --> 00:19:18,680
I think the other thing, this isn't a bad thing,

402
00:19:18,759 --> 00:19:21,960
but you need Rob Dillingham to pan out because that

403
00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:24,039
you know, there's screw scores already as low as it

404
00:19:24,039 --> 00:19:26,039
could be relative to disappointments. But that's a huge what

405
00:19:26,079 --> 00:19:27,960
they gave up to get him right and just what

406
00:19:28,039 --> 00:19:31,160
this team needs. He is so critical and so you

407
00:19:31,279 --> 00:19:33,359
need something more. I would say, you need more from

408
00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:36,359
him next seat, like this isn't Oh, let's check back

409
00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:38,599
in year four. More of the Wolves want to get

410
00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:41,160
and like they've had this is I've called them Grant

411
00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:44,480
the National TV Rajon Rondo of basketball teams because they

412
00:19:44,519 --> 00:19:46,960
just get up for the big ones. Yeah, we've seen

413
00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:49,519
them hit that pinnacle. But if they're gonna sustain it

414
00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:52,359
for more than just like games at a time, they

415
00:19:52,359 --> 00:19:54,319
need to hit on Dillingham and if they if he

416
00:19:54,359 --> 00:19:56,640
doesn't hit next maybe he still hits, but oh we

417
00:19:56,759 --> 00:19:59,440
have to push the timeline another year for it. I

418
00:19:59,440 --> 00:20:01,680
don't know the they're necessarily working with that type of

419
00:20:01,680 --> 00:20:03,319
open ended window necessarily.

420
00:20:03,359 --> 00:20:05,279
Speaker 2: I agree with that. I still believe in I think

421
00:20:05,319 --> 00:20:08,119
Dillingham's gonna be good. I think had he played more

422
00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:10,960
this year, we would even have like more amo to

423
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:12,279
say like he's gonna be fine.

424
00:20:12,519 --> 00:20:15,599
Speaker 1: So yeah, I was gonna to wrap it up, most

425
00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:17,920
likely of those three players not to be in Minnesota

426
00:20:18,000 --> 00:20:19,000
next year. Hmm.

427
00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:25,279
Speaker 2: I don't know. Is it just is it read like

428
00:20:25,400 --> 00:20:27,519
just because he might be the guy that most teams

429
00:20:27,519 --> 00:20:27,960
go after.

430
00:20:28,279 --> 00:20:31,640
Speaker 1: I feel like it's naw, just because Randall, if he

431
00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:33,880
ops in, you're not just gonna wash off that money

432
00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:36,319
and then Reid will opt out. Maybe you don't because

433
00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:38,599
if he opts out, you have to pay Reed and

434
00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:40,319
he's gonna command the type of money that I think

435
00:20:40,359 --> 00:20:43,920
other teams can't offer. Yeah, but nah, it's just well,

436
00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:45,720
if he gets the non tax PAYERAMID level from someone,

437
00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:47,839
that might be too and that will also be the

438
00:20:48,559 --> 00:20:50,640
m we're out of time, that will be sort of

439
00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:54,319
the index level. How financially motivated was the actual Julius

440
00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:57,519
Randall deal? Because if it's just they're trying to it's

441
00:20:57,519 --> 00:20:58,920
one thing between like trying to stay out of the

442
00:20:58,920 --> 00:21:01,200
second Apron. But if they're just cost like relative to

443
00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:04,359
their tax bill, that's a red flag. Yep. Our next

444
00:21:04,359 --> 00:21:08,000
team with a screw score of three, the Memphis Grizzlies,

445
00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:12,119
who I guess in terms of their record they could

446
00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:15,240
still technically win. Can they still win fifty games? Yeah?

447
00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:17,559
They would have to go six and five, six and

448
00:21:17,599 --> 00:21:19,720
one the rest of the way because they've played, Yeah,

449
00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:23,480
they've played seventy five games. I just I hit there

450
00:21:23,559 --> 00:21:25,200
under and I think they're gonna clear it. But when

451
00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:27,759
you look at the way that Taylor Jenkins left along

452
00:21:27,759 --> 00:21:32,119
with Nate Laroche and now they have us to Tumas

453
00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:34,559
Eastlow in there, I like, I don't know what this

454
00:21:34,759 --> 00:21:38,440
organization is necessarily thinking the Jahn Morant noise. Yes, we

455
00:21:38,559 --> 00:21:42,960
know it's speculation at this point, but like, if you

456
00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:45,319
don't go deep in the playoffs this year, you have

457
00:21:45,400 --> 00:21:47,799
to wonder, well, how far can Jock carry this offense?

458
00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:50,480
Worried about his availability issues? He does he just as

459
00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:52,359
we're recording this, he just hit a game winner over

460
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:54,960
Khalil Pigeon where I will.

461
00:21:54,839 --> 00:21:56,720
Speaker 2: Never call you a pigeon, Dan, I had to look up,

462
00:21:56,759 --> 00:21:57,519
like what's that mean?

463
00:21:57,880 --> 00:22:00,200
Speaker 1: I had to too, and I feel ashamed because it's

464
00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,640
a basketball It's like in the basketball vernacular, and I

465
00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:03,680
had no idea it's.

466
00:22:03,559 --> 00:22:06,480
Speaker 2: Also big in hockey. Apparently, little search revealed to me.

467
00:22:07,279 --> 00:22:09,640
Speaker 1: Pigeons also pretty big in New York City as well.

468
00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:15,559
It means bird, so oh so there's just their screw

469
00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:18,039
score can't get too high because they have all their

470
00:22:18,039 --> 00:22:21,079
own picks. They're deep, they have a bunch of interesting players,

471
00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:23,559
all of whom are unless you think that Jared Jackson

472
00:22:23,599 --> 00:22:25,720
Junior is going to turn down an extension, they're just

473
00:22:25,839 --> 00:22:28,880
under contract. But the concern starts to kick in where

474
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:31,240
it's not just is John Morant good enough to be

475
00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:33,319
the best player on a contender? It's is the big

476
00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:35,839
three of John Morant, Desmond Bane and Jared Jackson Junior

477
00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:38,640
good enough to reach that level? And how do you

478
00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:41,400
go about getting what you still need, which I think

479
00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:44,440
is still a more dynamic half court offensive player, preferably

480
00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:46,680
in the form of the wing, preferly who is certainly

481
00:22:46,720 --> 00:22:49,839
going to shoot threes. And I'm asking all these questions

482
00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:52,559
about their offense grant, because I don't trust it in

483
00:22:52,559 --> 00:22:55,880
the playoffs. It's their defense that is just absolutely imploded,

484
00:22:56,480 --> 00:22:59,000
and that ups the When you're dealing with the type

485
00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:01,839
of exit that you did with Taylor Jenkins, coupled with

486
00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:03,480
what we know happened over the off season where they

487
00:23:03,519 --> 00:23:06,799
gutted his coaching staff and put these assistants in place,

488
00:23:07,519 --> 00:23:10,559
it makes you wonder whether this team. We said this

489
00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:13,200
when he got fired. Does this team have their shit together?

490
00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:16,079
And what's the if they get bounced in the first round,

491
00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:18,720
Like they're a team. I don't know which team I

492
00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:21,680
would pick as Oh, the postseason is going to inform

493
00:23:21,759 --> 00:23:24,759
what they do this offseason more than any other squad.

494
00:23:24,839 --> 00:23:27,000
Like that might be Houston just because they're playing around

495
00:23:27,039 --> 00:23:29,640
with all those assets and young players. It could be Memphis.

496
00:23:30,039 --> 00:23:32,839
Speaker 2: Yeah, have you seen this is the most interesting, one

497
00:23:32,880 --> 00:23:36,480
of the more interesting elements of the whole Memphis situation

498
00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:41,240
to me, where you know, I forget who who's who's posted.

499
00:23:41,279 --> 00:23:44,759
It's been discussed several times about like where John Morant

500
00:23:44,799 --> 00:23:47,440
ranks as in points per play as a pick and

501
00:23:47,519 --> 00:23:50,759
roll ball handler just over his career, and essentially, like

502
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,839
the summation is like not high, Like he's not good

503
00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:57,880
as a pick and roll ball handler. And the much

504
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,559
of the reporting, you know, in the wake of the

505
00:24:00,599 --> 00:24:03,759
Taylor Jenkins firing was that like, John didn't really like

506
00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:06,839
this new offense that involved the fewest ball screens since

507
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:09,480
tracking was a thing, and he wanted to get back

508
00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:13,319
to more pick and roll stuff. And I so, does

509
00:24:13,359 --> 00:24:17,039
it strike you as potentially an issue when your main

510
00:24:17,079 --> 00:24:20,480
on ball guy wants to play a certain way and

511
00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:24,759
isn't good at it and doesn't like to play other ways. Like,

512
00:24:25,599 --> 00:24:28,119
you know, maybe that's just one of a half dozen

513
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:30,720
issues you'd want a flag in a season where the

514
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:33,680
team kind of quit on defense and the coaching situation

515
00:24:33,799 --> 00:24:37,640
got all messed up, and they've just not traded well

516
00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:40,960
generally speaking, like they get you know, what was the

517
00:24:41,039 --> 00:24:43,680
like decision tree from We always talk about this, like

518
00:24:44,079 --> 00:24:46,720
what it costs to get Marcus smart and what it

519
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:50,640
what you've netted from him, like the morant wanting to

520
00:24:50,759 --> 00:24:52,920
be a pick and roll guy and being bad at it,

521
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:54,920
Like you just file that in there. But that's like

522
00:24:54,960 --> 00:24:59,480
a that could be like a reason that this whole

523
00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:01,440
thing doesn't work if you just have a guy that

524
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:07,759
like is misjudging what his best qualities are and like

525
00:25:08,559 --> 00:25:11,200
and and you don't get the best out of him

526
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:13,720
when you're not letting him play that suboptimal way. Like

527
00:25:13,759 --> 00:25:17,680
that's just like a that's just a thorny like potential

528
00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:19,279
path to screwgdom.

529
00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:23,400
Speaker 1: To me, we need an aquahem for screweddom. It's too hard,

530
00:25:23,759 --> 00:25:25,680
I would agree with you. And also what I would

531
00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:28,240
say is the wife that they had him playing. Maybe

532
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:30,640
it's not what he wants to do now, but that style,

533
00:25:30,799 --> 00:25:32,160
I mean, I'm not even saying it was the right

534
00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:36,440
one that would have prolonged his career. It made sense, Yeah,

535
00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:38,799
it it made it more likely that he could be

536
00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:41,079
a star later into his career than he is right

537
00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:43,279
now because so much of what he does. I think

538
00:25:43,279 --> 00:25:46,000
he's a very cerebral playmaker. I want to make it clear,

539
00:25:46,519 --> 00:25:49,000
but this is just like, this is Derek Rose, this

540
00:25:49,079 --> 00:25:50,759
is Russell what like, you need to figure out ways

541
00:25:50,759 --> 00:25:53,000
if your athleticism is going to wane as you get older,

542
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:55,400
and this is not He's not been an iron man

543
00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:58,559
like Russell Westbrook has been. Like he's more he's close

544
00:25:58,599 --> 00:26:00,200
to the Derek Rose end of this spec or I

545
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:02,400
would think at this point of his career. And so

546
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:06,200
I understand when you're younger that it's what do they say,

547
00:26:06,319 --> 00:26:08,759
youth is wasted on the young because you're not going

548
00:26:08,839 --> 00:26:11,799
to have that necessary foresight. But like, that's where it

549
00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:15,079
kind of hurts you here, And I think let's even

550
00:26:15,079 --> 00:26:18,680
operate under the premise that, Okay, this is fine. Their

551
00:26:18,799 --> 00:26:23,480
path to getting better than this noticeably better, I don't

552
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:27,039
I don't see it in the sense of this is

553
00:26:27,079 --> 00:26:29,480
what they can do. Because you look at it and say, okay,

554
00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:32,960
you've maxed out John Morant, Desmond Bane and Jaron Jackson Junior.

555
00:26:33,039 --> 00:26:35,359
Like those guys are not so you need to believe

556
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:40,359
in Jalen Wells or Zach Edi or Gigi Jackson like.

557
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:42,880
So there is some upside on that. And then you say, well,

558
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:45,440
then they have their own picks they can except for

559
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:46,279
this year, and.

560
00:26:46,279 --> 00:26:49,240
Speaker 2: They've drafted well, like that's one thing. They've drafted really

561
00:26:49,279 --> 00:26:52,519
well for several years. That's why they're not that screwed.

562
00:26:52,559 --> 00:26:54,319
It's because they, like you said, they've got their picks

563
00:26:54,319 --> 00:26:56,519
and they tend to, you know, get a pretty good

564
00:26:56,519 --> 00:26:57,519
bang for buck on them.

565
00:26:57,839 --> 00:26:59,759
Speaker 1: But if you want to go you need to believe.

566
00:26:59,799 --> 00:27:02,400
I think if you want to remove them, make them

567
00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:04,519
even low. By the way, we don't screwed score of

568
00:27:04,559 --> 00:27:06,640
three out of ten, it is not that high. But

569
00:27:07,039 --> 00:27:09,519
if you want to move them lower, it's they don't.

570
00:27:09,799 --> 00:27:11,960
You have to believe in their ability to make a move, which,

571
00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:14,160
as you already mentioned, the front office hasn't. It's either

572
00:27:14,279 --> 00:27:16,799
hasn't traded well or has been reluctant to make trades.

573
00:27:17,039 --> 00:27:19,440
Looking at them missing out on Dorian Phinney Smith. But

574
00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:21,359
now you have to go about and say, does Dorian

575
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:23,519
Phinney Smith. I don't know that he was exactly what

576
00:27:23,559 --> 00:27:26,720
they needed, but does that type of player elevate them

577
00:27:26,759 --> 00:27:28,640
to the tier they want to be in? And if

578
00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:31,599
he doesn't, you have to start looking at more expensive guys.

579
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:34,640
And it gets a lot harder to acquire those guys

580
00:27:35,039 --> 00:27:37,759
because you don't have like you have these like nice

581
00:27:38,079 --> 00:27:41,400
small contracts on your books. But Brandon Clark is going

582
00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:43,160
to be their fourth highest paid player next season at

583
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:45,240
twelve and a half million dollars. Then you have John

584
00:27:45,319 --> 00:27:48,240
Conchar at fifth at six point two as of right now,

585
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:50,240
that could go up depending on who they add. That's

586
00:27:50,279 --> 00:27:52,839
like eighteen million. So what can you take back with

587
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:54,960
that and attach that? Who's the best player you're getting?

588
00:27:55,000 --> 00:27:57,599
If you wanted to get involved on a Kevin Durant

589
00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:00,160
or just a bigger name someone that becomes available, you're

590
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:02,880
gonna have to cob together a ton of contracts or

591
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:05,480
And that leads us back to wall are you knifing

592
00:28:05,519 --> 00:28:07,279
into your your big three?

593
00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:12,240
Speaker 2: And then like fundamentally it is the like would you

594
00:28:12,400 --> 00:28:15,400
other than Moran missing time and not not looking so

595
00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:19,440
good until recently, Like I think the big their best

596
00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:22,319
three players, like Jackson is playing like as well as

597
00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:24,640
you could realistically ever ask him to play, Like it's

598
00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:26,559
possible this is as good as he ever is and

599
00:28:26,559 --> 00:28:29,039
that's not a knock because he's awesome, right, I would

600
00:28:29,079 --> 00:28:30,880
say he could foul less, but I think at this

601
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:34,799
point that's just priced in. Like Baine, I guess could

602
00:28:34,799 --> 00:28:36,640
be a little bit, but like you know, what I'm

603
00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:38,880
getting at is like these three guys are like it's

604
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:41,519
kind of now like this is especially if you think

605
00:28:41,559 --> 00:28:43,799
Moran is not going to age well because the athleticism

606
00:28:43,799 --> 00:28:48,359
and the already like pretty pervasive durability stuff. Also, next

607
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:50,240
finger Guns is probably going to be a suspension. He

608
00:28:50,359 --> 00:28:52,559
just cut fine for can also.

609
00:28:52,359 --> 00:28:54,400
Speaker 1: See that he will not be allowed outside at recess

610
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:55,319
for an entire week.

611
00:28:55,960 --> 00:28:58,960
Speaker 2: I'm we almost made it through without talking about it.

612
00:28:59,000 --> 00:28:59,799
Oh they're so cool.

613
00:29:00,319 --> 00:29:02,319
Speaker 1: Did you ever stop? Do you ever have those moments

614
00:29:02,319 --> 00:29:06,640
where you stop and realize just how stupid our job is?

615
00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:09,279
Because there's there was a release a seventy five thousand

616
00:29:09,279 --> 00:29:13,680
dollars fine, and then finger Guns like that I know too, Like, well,

617
00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:15,480
it's just what we do for a living.

618
00:29:15,839 --> 00:29:17,759
Speaker 2: So let's talk about it. How much times on the

619
00:29:17,759 --> 00:29:18,240
tim or.

620
00:29:18,119 --> 00:29:19,960
Speaker 1: Do we have twenty eight seconds?

621
00:29:20,039 --> 00:29:23,400
Speaker 2: Okay? I I think like it's kind of dumb because

622
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:25,680
it's pretty harmless. But it's like read the room, man,

623
00:29:25,880 --> 00:29:28,720
Like you can't just like just be smarter about it,

624
00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:30,799
and like if you throw up a middle finger to

625
00:29:30,839 --> 00:29:32,880
the other bench, you're getting fined, or if you like

626
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:34,920
bounce the ball over your head. It's a tech, Like

627
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:37,599
we know the rules. Just follow the rules. Like it's

628
00:29:37,640 --> 00:29:41,240
I know they're stupid and arbitrary and it feels like paternalistic,

629
00:29:41,319 --> 00:29:43,519
but like, just just fall in line on this one.

630
00:29:43,559 --> 00:29:47,240
Speaker 1: You're not you're not fighting some higher power in right.

631
00:29:47,519 --> 00:29:50,279
This is Draymond complaining that he doesn't ye get the

632
00:29:50,279 --> 00:29:52,119
benefit of the doubt when it comes to flagrant calls.

633
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:55,160
It's like, yeah, no, shit, sure, every job's got dumb rules.

634
00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:56,400
Speaker 2: Just follow the dumb rules.

635
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:58,880
Speaker 1: Well, we're out of time, but you know you don't

636
00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:00,920
get to elaborate. I really want to ask this question

637
00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:04,039
who gets more in trade this summer if they were

638
00:30:04,039 --> 00:30:05,480
to be moved, Joah Moran or Trey Young.

639
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:13,720
Speaker 2: Oh man, I think I'll say I'm gonna say Trey

640
00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:14,759
how about that.

641
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:17,599
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say that too, even though he's less time

642
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:20,720
on his contract. But I think I think it's Tray.

643
00:30:20,799 --> 00:30:22,359
I think it should be Trey. I would, personally, if

644
00:30:22,359 --> 00:30:23,799
I was running a team, give up more for true.

645
00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:25,480
Who we on to next? Grant?

646
00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:28,559
Speaker 2: We are on to with a screwed score of four,

647
00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:31,160
the New Orleans Pelicans. This is where this is the

648
00:30:31,279 --> 00:30:33,920
range where it started to get tricky for us. We're

649
00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:36,680
gonna split some hairs, There's gonna be some differences of opinion.

650
00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:40,960
It's essentially there's the zion of it all is where

651
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:44,519
it starts right Like, it's just you are tethered. We've

652
00:30:44,519 --> 00:30:47,119
talked about this plenty. You're tethered to this guy that

653
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:48,839
you don't know if you can rely on him to

654
00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:51,839
stay healthy and stay in shape. Recent indications are like

655
00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:54,160
looking pretty good on that front, but we've been down

656
00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:57,039
that road before. I do think the reason now, in

657
00:30:57,079 --> 00:31:00,480
a lot of situations, this would be a higher score.

658
00:31:00,559 --> 00:31:03,640
But there's the protections priced in of the weight and

659
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:06,720
sort of like body fat and weight combo guarantees or

660
00:31:06,759 --> 00:31:11,200
non guarantees where worst case scenario, you can just get

661
00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:13,480
off of this contract if you need to like that's

662
00:31:13,559 --> 00:31:16,160
not in the discussion at this point because he looked

663
00:31:16,279 --> 00:31:20,519
very good. But there's that aspect of it. There's you've

664
00:31:20,519 --> 00:31:24,960
got the McCollum contract. There's just i mean, how long

665
00:31:25,039 --> 00:31:28,079
until we already have been discussing like Willie Green might

666
00:31:28,119 --> 00:31:29,799
be someone that is on the hot seat if you're

667
00:31:29,799 --> 00:31:33,000
putting together those kind of rankings. The small market of it,

668
00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:35,559
it's like it's been it's quietly been like a long

669
00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:39,000
time since this team sort of fashioned itself around Zion

670
00:31:39,079 --> 00:31:41,119
and the results overall have not been good and you

671
00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:43,400
just sort of get to an endpoint, you know, with

672
00:31:43,519 --> 00:31:45,960
before where you reach like we got to do something different.

673
00:31:47,279 --> 00:31:50,480
Still a pretty low score relatively speaking, but but like

674
00:31:50,519 --> 00:31:53,160
you can't deny that. First of all, this season was

675
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:56,799
a massive disappointment, and injuries were the main driver of that.

676
00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:00,680
But like, how many years are we gonna you know, say, well,

677
00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:02,599
we're not gonna have any health issues anymore, Like it

678
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:03,839
just keeps happening.

679
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:06,160
Speaker 1: And they're different. I mean, Minnesota probably doesn't have a

680
00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:08,559
ton of outs, but referencing the teams we talked about

681
00:32:08,599 --> 00:32:10,880
before them, but like this is kind of the territory

682
00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:13,440
where it's okay there's still a bunch of different avenues

683
00:32:13,799 --> 00:32:16,200
that New Orleans can travel down and it helps that. Okay,

684
00:32:16,400 --> 00:32:19,319
you mentioned the contract protections if Zion. If you ever

685
00:32:19,359 --> 00:32:22,079
get one season of seventy games of Zion, you might

686
00:32:22,119 --> 00:32:23,960
just have a top ten NBA player on your roster.

687
00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:26,319
Speaker 2: You're gonna have a top ten offense, that's for sure.

688
00:32:26,759 --> 00:32:30,079
Speaker 1: And I think look that the Jonta Murray Achilles injury

689
00:32:30,119 --> 00:32:35,160
that potentially submarines next season, but again the McComb contract

690
00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:37,920
that'll be expiring, you have Trey Murphy still be nice

691
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:39,680
if he played in sixty five games, which has only

692
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:42,640
done once in his career, and you do have I

693
00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:45,440
think they have more picks than people kind of understand

694
00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:48,599
because like the twenty twenty seven pick that they're sending

695
00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:52,319
to uh Atlanta as part of the de Jonta Murray trade,

696
00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:55,039
it's going to be the less favorable between their own

697
00:32:55,359 --> 00:32:57,599
and Milwaukee. So maybe you're giving up a good pick

698
00:32:57,799 --> 00:33:00,440
depending on what Milwaukee's like then, but you if you

699
00:33:00,519 --> 00:33:02,279
need to, is what I'm saying, like, you can just

700
00:33:02,279 --> 00:33:04,440
pivot into a full on rebuild. You could take this

701
00:33:04,559 --> 00:33:07,720
year's high end lottery pick, trade Zion and just move

702
00:33:07,759 --> 00:33:09,400
forward if that's what you want to do, not having

703
00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:12,279
to worry about sending out your draft pick elsewhere. But

704
00:33:12,279 --> 00:33:14,839
you also just have enough draft dethquity to wear you

705
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:18,359
start attaching first rounders to c J. McCollums expiring contract,

706
00:33:18,599 --> 00:33:21,400
what kind of conversations to those get you in and

707
00:33:21,519 --> 00:33:23,640
just to have Like they found Eve's Mecie, who's been

708
00:33:23,680 --> 00:33:26,119
really good this year. I still wish he did some

709
00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:28,599
of like the more traditional big man stuff on defense better.

710
00:33:28,799 --> 00:33:30,559
I've been really impressed with the way from what we

711
00:33:30,599 --> 00:33:33,599
saw before Zion was shut down. Was just like, oh,

712
00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:36,000
those two are learning to play together right too, And

713
00:33:36,039 --> 00:33:38,599
so like you have him Trey Murphy and then I

714
00:33:38,599 --> 00:33:41,839
guess a lot could be determined by where they land

715
00:33:41,839 --> 00:33:44,200
in this year's lottery. But unless they just tumble down,

716
00:33:44,799 --> 00:33:47,960
they're gonna have a top four, top five pick, Like

717
00:33:48,039 --> 00:33:49,559
who are they gonna take? That's gonna make you feel

718
00:33:49,599 --> 00:33:50,559
worse about it?

719
00:33:50,839 --> 00:33:53,359
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the thing. The upside is really there for

720
00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:56,119
this team, Like I mean, I even like I like

721
00:33:56,200 --> 00:33:58,319
Jordan Hawkins, like I think there still might be something

722
00:33:58,359 --> 00:34:00,519
there as like a seventh or eighth guy that adds

723
00:34:00,519 --> 00:34:03,440
a dimension they really need now it's eventually got to happen,

724
00:34:03,519 --> 00:34:05,240
and like, you know, it's only been two years, but

725
00:34:05,279 --> 00:34:06,720
it's like I think we were kind of banging the

726
00:34:06,799 --> 00:34:10,000
Jordan Hawkins drum like for this year. Yeah, a lot

727
00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:12,159
of talent. The Murray thing. I'm glad you mentioned it.

728
00:34:12,199 --> 00:34:14,039
I should have maybe even led with the Murray thing.

729
00:34:14,119 --> 00:34:16,800
How much of a bummer that is, you know, both

730
00:34:17,199 --> 00:34:19,199
just like for him personally and then for the makeup

731
00:34:19,239 --> 00:34:21,599
of the team, and then the financial stuff is he's

732
00:34:21,639 --> 00:34:23,960
gonna make you know, thirty one next year and thirty

733
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:27,039
three the year after that. It's and he's got a

734
00:34:27,039 --> 00:34:29,239
player option after that, which if things are going this

735
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:31,159
way with his health, like, you might pick that up

736
00:34:31,199 --> 00:34:35,159
in what twenty seven, twenty eight? If anything, I would

737
00:34:35,159 --> 00:34:37,280
move them to a lower screwed score. I wouldn't move

738
00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:39,280
them up because as we move forward, we are going

739
00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:43,480
to get into some pretty severely screwed situations.

740
00:34:43,639 --> 00:34:45,760
Speaker 1: I will say relative to the field, I don't really

741
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:47,840
think you'd want to move them up over any of

742
00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,519
the teams we're gonna talk about. But something that should

743
00:34:50,559 --> 00:34:53,679
also be caked in this is not an organization that's

744
00:34:53,679 --> 00:34:57,719
been They've made moves, but it's always felt like if

745
00:34:57,760 --> 00:35:00,280
not half measures, like three quarter, like there's no the

746
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:02,400
Jontay Murray is a purpose of I liked the deal.

747
00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:04,599
That was like a seventy five percent metal that wasn't

748
00:35:04,599 --> 00:35:07,199
the all in play. Yeah, we know they're never gonna

749
00:35:07,199 --> 00:35:10,039
pay the tax, and so they have. I think they're

750
00:35:10,079 --> 00:35:14,239
fifteen million dollars beneath the tax next year, and it's like,

751
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:16,760
all right, well that's gonna be a lot of that's

752
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:18,400
gonna be taken up as of right now with their

753
00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:21,360
first round pick. What are they willing to do thereafter?

754
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:21,880
Speaker 2: Right?

755
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:23,639
Speaker 1: Are they gonna try and get better or is it

756
00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:25,559
we don't know when Murray's gonna come back. We want to,

757
00:35:25,599 --> 00:35:28,320
we don't know what. So I think that's I think

758
00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:31,239
the uncertainty is the basis of that, like even more

759
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:33,400
so than the Murray injury. Yeah, sure that matters, but

760
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:35,840
that's more part of the macro uncertainty here to where

761
00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:39,159
it's point to anyone on this roster that you just, oh,

762
00:35:39,159 --> 00:35:41,360
I know what they're gonna be and do next season

763
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:44,239
and how much they're gonna play, and you you can't, Yeah,

764
00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:45,519
do you have anything else on them?

765
00:35:45,679 --> 00:35:46,000
Speaker 2: No?

766
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:48,360
Speaker 1: No, So we will restart the clock and get to

767
00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:53,400
our screw score five out of ten with the Philadelphia

768
00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:55,880
seventy six ers. This I think is gonna be a

769
00:35:55,920 --> 00:36:02,320
controversial one because Joel Embiid he's having the arthroscopic procedure

770
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:03,920
on his knee right that was just announced.

771
00:36:04,039 --> 00:36:04,280
Speaker 2: Yep.

772
00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:06,280
Speaker 1: And I don't know if you watched the doctor video

773
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:09,000
where I can't even remember his name, but he does

774
00:36:09,039 --> 00:36:11,920
these YouTube videos he responds to like the latest sports injuries.

775
00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:14,039
He's not treating him be but he mentioned, like this

776
00:36:14,119 --> 00:36:16,440
type of procedure, I'm just gonna expect and bed to

777
00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:19,239
feel better, but he's just gonna continue to deal with problems.

778
00:36:19,519 --> 00:36:22,480
And so shocker and Beat's health is a red flag. Yeah,

779
00:36:22,519 --> 00:36:24,360
they have another four years and two hundred and forty

780
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:27,400
eight point one million dollars of Joel Embiid on the books,

781
00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:31,599
the Paul George contract. You sign that knowing the out

782
00:36:31,679 --> 00:36:35,199
years are gonna be iffy. You didn't sign it thinking, okay,

783
00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:37,360
well the front year was bad and so is it

784
00:36:37,519 --> 00:36:39,559
just one of the worst deals in the league. Three years,

785
00:36:39,599 --> 00:36:42,119
one hundred sixty two million dollars left on it. I

786
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:45,960
understand that their worst case outcome is maybe worse than

787
00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:48,679
like the Pelicans' worst case outcome, but that's why they're

788
00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:51,880
behind the Sixers. It's worse, it's it's not as bad

789
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:55,239
as Phillies, but like Philly's best case outcome. Right now,

790
00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:58,159
they might get a top six pick in this year's draft,

791
00:36:58,159 --> 00:37:00,199
and let's just say they don't. Let's again let's play

792
00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:03,760
the pessimist's role here. You still have Tyrese Maxey. You

793
00:37:03,880 --> 00:37:06,480
found Jared McCain, and it's not like his injury is

794
00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:09,000
gonna be career altering. You've kind of on earth a

795
00:37:09,079 --> 00:37:12,360
den Bona. I just compared him to Robert Williams the

796
00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:14,800
Third but with Mitchell Robinson's passing, which is to say

797
00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:18,079
it does not exist like the passing you found him,

798
00:37:18,159 --> 00:37:20,360
you founded justin Edwards. You've shown that, like maybe you

799
00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:22,840
could look at where Maxie was drafted, Look where McCain

800
00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:24,920
was drafted, look at where you got like how you

801
00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:28,000
got a den Bona justin Edwards, like you have found

802
00:37:28,320 --> 00:37:31,920
players here, Quentin Grimes like mining value there. You could

803
00:37:31,920 --> 00:37:34,559
still be expensive, but you also have some assets in

804
00:37:34,599 --> 00:37:36,599
the clip, like yeah, you owe that pick to Brooklyn

805
00:37:36,639 --> 00:37:40,760
after the if the OKC one conveys, they're still outs

806
00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:43,480
here and even if joelleb never plays again, you're going

807
00:37:43,519 --> 00:37:46,639
to be hamstrung, but you still just have different avenues

808
00:37:46,679 --> 00:37:49,920
to explore. And because they're of anyone we're gonna talk

809
00:37:49,960 --> 00:37:52,880
about on this list, I think you can make the

810
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:56,760
case that there their highest range outcome, as likely as

811
00:37:56,760 --> 00:38:00,679
it might be, is better than anyone else, Like soda, right,

812
00:38:00,679 --> 00:38:02,800
we got to throw them in there. So I think

813
00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:04,760
that's why they kind of belong in the middle, because

814
00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:09,559
there's clearly a level of high screwdom here, but it's

815
00:38:09,599 --> 00:38:11,639
not I don't think it's People have kind of painted

816
00:38:11,639 --> 00:38:14,480
it as doom and gloom, and I don't think we're

817
00:38:14,519 --> 00:38:15,280
quite there yet.

818
00:38:15,599 --> 00:38:18,679
Speaker 2: I think that's right. I think the downside, you could argue,

819
00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:22,639
is as bad as almost any there's the top couple teams.

820
00:38:22,679 --> 00:38:25,239
It's like that they're gonna hit the downside, and so

821
00:38:25,519 --> 00:38:28,719
like that's we're talking hypothetically with the Sixers. But there

822
00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:30,840
is a scenario where you could make the case that

823
00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:33,159
Philly has the two worst contracts in the league. If

824
00:38:33,199 --> 00:38:35,679
Paul George is this injured and ineffective going forward and

825
00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:38,719
Embiid is never healthy, like that's just that's brutal. But

826
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:43,519
like you said, so let's you extinguish that obligation to Okay,

827
00:38:43,519 --> 00:38:45,519
see you have the Brooklyn one, but even the Brooklyn

828
00:38:45,559 --> 00:38:49,119
picks that you're owing are what top protected one through

829
00:38:49,119 --> 00:38:51,280
eight in twenty seven, one through eight, and twenty eight,

830
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:54,480
and then it becomes a second in twenty eight if

831
00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:57,199
not conveyed. So like you can still tank right like

832
00:38:57,280 --> 00:39:00,000
that that's still in play. We will get to situe

833
00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:02,199
where tanking will not help you, and that's when you're

834
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:05,639
getting much higher in the screwed score. So I agree,

835
00:39:05,639 --> 00:39:09,280
like the upside is there, the downside is there, Like,

836
00:39:09,679 --> 00:39:12,760
but look, you still have Tyres Maxy that they've Jared

837
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:15,480
McCain was a major find in the draft, like hopefully

838
00:39:15,519 --> 00:39:18,000
if he's fully healthy. That's just another like high end

839
00:39:18,079 --> 00:39:21,400
rotation guy that is young and cost controlled and all

840
00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:24,679
that good stuff. Like it's not quite like I like

841
00:39:24,719 --> 00:39:26,400
to think of it in terms of like what outs

842
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:29,239
do you have? Like the Sixers they don't have all

843
00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:31,679
the outs because like if the contracts of Georgian and

844
00:39:31,679 --> 00:39:34,360
Embiid look terrible, you're just not getting off those without

845
00:39:34,400 --> 00:39:36,159
paying some of the stuff you don't want to give

846
00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:38,400
up to do it. So that's a problem, Like their

847
00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:41,760
outs are fewer. They're not non existent though, because you

848
00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:46,239
can benefit from tanking if you gotta, and that almos

849
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:48,840
like the upside being like if what if embiid is

850
00:39:49,199 --> 00:39:52,639
eighty percent of MVPM bead and he can play sixty games,

851
00:39:52,639 --> 00:39:55,440
like you're a top four team in the East like that?

852
00:39:55,679 --> 00:39:58,280
You know, I think that's so that's just not something

853
00:39:58,320 --> 00:39:59,760
you could say about a lot of these other teams.

854
00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:01,679
This is this was one of the hardest ones for me,

855
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:03,800
But I think we landed about right just smack in

856
00:40:03,840 --> 00:40:07,519
the middle, acknowledging the two like extreme poles of it.

857
00:40:07,920 --> 00:40:10,079
Speaker 1: How do you like, how do you think the draft

858
00:40:10,159 --> 00:40:12,559
lottery has the potential to change this? Because if they

859
00:40:12,559 --> 00:40:14,199
don't get their pick would be one Let's say they

860
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:16,559
get their pick. Does that almost make the decision making

861
00:40:16,639 --> 00:40:18,719
process harder because it's what, should we be looking to

862
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:21,760
move this player to get immediate help? Can we fit

863
00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:24,320
whoever we draft and develop them in a way And

864
00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:27,519
it's okay, Well, we have like just three not huge

865
00:40:27,519 --> 00:40:31,280
guards on the roster and Maxi, McCain and Grimes now

866
00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:34,320
and it almost feels like not that they would get

867
00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:36,920
decision fatigued, but just like the uncertainty as to what

868
00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:39,239
direction they should even, like the push and pull of

869
00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:42,119
that feels like that's actually what matter. People just point

870
00:40:42,159 --> 00:40:44,920
to their cap sheet, how much money they Owembid and George. Sure,

871
00:40:45,039 --> 00:40:46,760
but it's kind of the push and pull of like, well,

872
00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:48,760
how do we juggle all of this to like how

873
00:40:48,760 --> 00:40:50,840
aggressive are we over the offseason? Do we just let

874
00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:53,039
it let it ride? It feels like that might be

875
00:40:53,079 --> 00:40:55,000
more of a determining factor than anything else.

876
00:40:55,119 --> 00:40:57,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a big one. I was just thinking too, Like,

877
00:40:58,239 --> 00:41:01,639
clearly they're acting as they want to. They want to

878
00:41:01,679 --> 00:41:03,480
pick in the top six, like they want to keep

879
00:41:03,559 --> 00:41:05,760
the pick this year. That's that's how they're playing.

880
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:07,280
Speaker 1: How do you know that?

881
00:41:07,559 --> 00:41:09,719
Speaker 2: Well, I don't know if you've been keeping up, damn,

882
00:41:09,800 --> 00:41:12,079
but like there's a lot of names that aren't household

883
00:41:12,239 --> 00:41:14,679
variety that have been playing for this section. But like

884
00:41:15,039 --> 00:41:18,119
is that I what if like what if you got

885
00:41:18,119 --> 00:41:21,760
these these obligations extinguished sooner? Like would that is there

886
00:41:21,800 --> 00:41:25,360
any Clearly they decided it's that's not the way to go.

887
00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:30,039
But if you're if you're trying to avoid being fully screwed,

888
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:33,480
might it be better to just convey that pick this year?

889
00:41:33,599 --> 00:41:36,280
I'm just asking I think I think I agree with

890
00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:39,239
what they did, but we haven't really discussed, like what

891
00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:41,360
what about the alternative of like what if you just

892
00:41:41,599 --> 00:41:44,679
what if it's seven, it goes to the thunder and

893
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:46,679
then you're just you're onto the Brooklyn thing, which I

894
00:41:46,679 --> 00:41:49,920
think it's at least two years after, so I guess

895
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:51,320
you're talking twenty seven.

896
00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:55,400
Speaker 1: So this is interesting if you talk it's like kind

897
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:59,440
of a similar dilemma with Miami. You're not set up

898
00:41:59,480 --> 00:42:01,599
to like they're not gonna tank again, so it's not

899
00:42:01,639 --> 00:42:03,320
the worst thing in the world, like it'll they'll have

900
00:42:03,320 --> 00:42:05,320
the ability to do it, but like, you tank this

901
00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:08,840
year because it's that window of opportunity because you shouldn't

902
00:42:08,840 --> 00:42:11,880
be like if Tyree's MAXI is healthier, you're not this

903
00:42:12,039 --> 00:42:13,000
bad this year.

904
00:42:13,039 --> 00:42:15,639
Speaker 2: Sure, yeah, they didn't really have a choice, but like, yeah,

905
00:42:15,679 --> 00:42:16,760
you're right, it's like you have.

906
00:42:16,840 --> 00:42:18,920
Speaker 1: You had to keep this year's pick, and if you

907
00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:21,000
wanted to convey it, fine, then you should have been

908
00:42:21,039 --> 00:42:23,000
more competitive there. But I don't view it as like

909
00:42:23,000 --> 00:42:25,719
a missed opportunity next year because you need to unless

910
00:42:25,719 --> 00:42:28,199
you're planning on stripping everything down, which that doesn't seem

911
00:42:28,199 --> 00:42:30,159
like it's an option, can and if it is an option,

912
00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:32,360
you know why, it's probably an option because they won

913
00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:35,800
the lottery pick. They decided that's the direction they want

914
00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:37,559
to go. Yeah, do you want to take us to

915
00:42:38,159 --> 00:42:39,480
our screwed score of six?

916
00:42:40,159 --> 00:42:42,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've got the heat here, which again I'm gonna

917
00:42:42,760 --> 00:42:45,199
talk up the reasons they may not be super screwed,

918
00:42:45,559 --> 00:42:51,000
good market, historically competitive franchise, great coach bam Adebayo down year,

919
00:42:51,039 --> 00:42:54,599
but still someone you definitely like, got all the playoff bonafides,

920
00:42:54,679 --> 00:42:57,360
is just like a really great player to be. Maybe

921
00:42:57,440 --> 00:42:59,440
you don't can't be the best player on a team

922
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:03,079
that wins a bunch playoff rounds, but he's close. They

923
00:43:03,159 --> 00:43:07,320
just have they've got similar draft obligations that there's a

924
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:11,519
scenario where they just won't be able to benefit from

925
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:15,119
like you know, the normal rebuild tanking stuff that that

926
00:43:15,199 --> 00:43:18,840
you could because I'm gonna get it here. So their

927
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:22,760
first goes to okay, see with top fourteen protection and

928
00:43:23,559 --> 00:43:25,360
where are we on that is that going? I can't

929
00:43:25,360 --> 00:43:26,039
even remember.

930
00:43:26,599 --> 00:43:28,599
Speaker 1: So they have to make the playoffs, which we don't

931
00:43:28,599 --> 00:43:30,719
know if they're gonna do yet because they're in the

932
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:33,400
play in so if they don't make it out of

933
00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:35,599
the play in that pick is not going to convey.

934
00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:39,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then you've also got your Charlotte obligations, which

935
00:43:40,000 --> 00:43:43,199
could make it so bottoming out is just not super helpful.

936
00:43:45,000 --> 00:43:47,000
Do we have them? And I think we talked about it.

937
00:43:47,039 --> 00:43:49,559
I think this is right. And it's just because like

938
00:43:50,280 --> 00:43:53,400
the way forward just seems tricky, like it's hard for

939
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:56,880
them to unless you really think Tyler Hero has another

940
00:43:56,960 --> 00:43:59,920
level to go, and that and that where is only

941
00:44:00,079 --> 00:44:02,519
going up? Where is no longer going to be a

942
00:44:02,519 --> 00:44:05,920
pigeon going into next year and beyond, I'm gonna start

943
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:08,000
calling people pigeons like a lot. I hope it's not.

944
00:44:08,239 --> 00:44:10,639
I hope there's not, like some urban dictionary definition I

945
00:44:10,679 --> 00:44:12,760
don't know about, actually really horrible.

946
00:44:13,679 --> 00:44:17,119
Speaker 1: Let me let me educate you on some pop culture. Okay, so,

947
00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:19,039
do you remember the song No Scrubs?

948
00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:19,639
Speaker 2: Sure?

949
00:44:20,119 --> 00:44:22,360
Speaker 1: Hat tip to a listener who I now remember the song,

950
00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:24,800
but they pointed it out or a follower one of

951
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:26,840
my followers on lu Sky pointed out that there was

952
00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:30,639
a response called pigeons no pigeons, which so I guess

953
00:44:30,679 --> 00:44:34,679
it could be a derogatory term to describe females and so,

954
00:44:35,320 --> 00:44:37,519
but no, scrubs was more popular. So I feel like

955
00:44:37,840 --> 00:44:40,000
we don't have to give pigeon like the credence as

956
00:44:40,079 --> 00:44:43,679
just sort of some type of uh sexualized term, but

957
00:44:43,719 --> 00:44:46,079
it is. It is out there as like an urban pigeon,

958
00:44:46,119 --> 00:44:47,800
So be careful who you're calling a pigeon.

959
00:44:48,039 --> 00:44:50,760
Speaker 2: I got it. It is, it is. It is a

960
00:44:50,800 --> 00:44:53,719
funny thing to call someone, though I do enjoy it.

961
00:44:53,719 --> 00:44:56,280
Speaker 1: I feel like, so if you like scoop past someone

962
00:44:56,320 --> 00:44:58,719
at the supermarket with flair, like maybe you call them

963
00:44:58,760 --> 00:45:01,360
the pigeon, like, oh, got it to the checkout line first?

964
00:45:01,719 --> 00:45:05,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely that or like I think, I

965
00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:07,199
think I would use it. This is the thing. It

966
00:45:07,239 --> 00:45:09,559
feels like because of the research we both did, it

967
00:45:09,559 --> 00:45:12,760
feels pretty sports specific. So other than you know, it's

968
00:45:12,800 --> 00:45:15,760
like someone that's just unskilled or like hangs around the

969
00:45:15,800 --> 00:45:18,079
basket and like benefits from other people. Is like a

970
00:45:18,719 --> 00:45:21,719
like scavenging a little bit, just like as birds go.

971
00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:24,000
Pigeons not high on the list. It's just like kind

972
00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:27,079
of calling someone lame. I guess, uh. But yeah, if

973
00:45:27,159 --> 00:45:29,639
kell if where is not that going forward, or if

974
00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:32,079
John Morant will just lay off and like leave Malone,

975
00:45:32,119 --> 00:45:33,679
he's a rookie. What do you want? You're gonna beat

976
00:45:33,719 --> 00:45:35,119
him in an ISO? Congratulations?

977
00:45:35,159 --> 00:45:36,320
Speaker 1: Where due to you? Damn?

978
00:45:36,920 --> 00:45:42,119
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah. I so to talk me up a little

979
00:45:42,119 --> 00:45:45,280
more on like why they're so screwed, because like it's

980
00:45:45,320 --> 00:45:48,519
not an optimal situation, but it's like it can't again,

981
00:45:49,119 --> 00:45:53,199
we're how many we're getting close to Like, okay, real problems,

982
00:45:53,239 --> 00:45:54,599
Miami's not quite there.

983
00:45:55,199 --> 00:45:58,320
Speaker 1: Here's so I think I can simplify it this way.

984
00:45:58,760 --> 00:46:03,440
They're the Sixers without the upside, Okay because there and okay,

985
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:06,639
they're more financially flexible. They're not slated to have cap

986
00:46:06,639 --> 00:46:09,039
space before twenty twenty six, so it's not happened in

987
00:46:09,039 --> 00:46:11,719
this summer. But what like after Tarry Rozier's deal comes

988
00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:13,800
off the books, Tyler here one year left on his deal.

989
00:46:14,039 --> 00:46:16,079
I don't think they have any bad money. You could

990
00:46:16,119 --> 00:46:18,199
say the Sixers have some bad money. But so we're

991
00:46:18,239 --> 00:46:22,079
just assuming in twenty twenty six one that free agency

992
00:46:22,159 --> 00:46:26,840
is gonna be cool again. Two. So there, they don't

993
00:46:26,880 --> 00:46:28,519
need Andrew Wiggins. I could just let them go. They're

994
00:46:28,559 --> 00:46:31,320
not planning on paying more money for him, Hawks or

995
00:46:31,400 --> 00:46:34,440
Nikola Jovich by that point. So like there's Okay, like

996
00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:36,079
you might have cat, what are you gonna do with it?

997
00:46:36,159 --> 00:46:39,920
And so you're just you don't have any extra assets.

998
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:41,920
And so if you convey your pick, let's say they

999
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:46,119
convey their pick this year, you still owe that pick

1000
00:46:46,159 --> 00:46:48,559
to Charlotte in twenty twenty seven with top two protection,

1001
00:46:48,880 --> 00:46:51,159
so you have if you wanted to tank, you could

1002
00:46:51,239 --> 00:46:53,199
do so for one year, but if you wanted to

1003
00:46:53,199 --> 00:46:55,719
go through the one year tanking route, it should have

1004
00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:58,320
been this one because then you say, all right, we're

1005
00:46:58,360 --> 00:46:59,840
gonna be back at it next year. We owe the

1006
00:47:00,039 --> 00:47:02,639
unprotected pick to OKC, and now that pick to Charlotte,

1007
00:47:02,639 --> 00:47:05,840
it's also unprotected. I think they probably, I think it

1008
00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:08,440
makes sense for them to convey and get it out

1009
00:47:08,440 --> 00:47:10,880
of the way just because like try to do it

1010
00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:13,519
at least because you don't want that. But then again,

1011
00:47:13,559 --> 00:47:17,039
it's like Charlotte's only top two protected, so it's I

1012
00:47:17,039 --> 00:47:18,800
don't know what the right answer would have been, but

1013
00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:21,119
you don't have all these extra trade assets. Even there,

1014
00:47:21,320 --> 00:47:23,400
they've been mentioned as a Kevin Durant team. I know

1015
00:47:23,440 --> 00:47:25,719
the Sons are gonna work with Kevin Durant on where

1016
00:47:25,719 --> 00:47:27,639
he wants to go. So I think you can reasonably

1017
00:47:27,679 --> 00:47:31,119
assume that there might be better offers out there than

1018
00:47:31,159 --> 00:47:35,639
the one they ultimately accept. But if you're Kevin Durant,

1019
00:47:35,679 --> 00:47:37,280
you're looking at the Heat, why do you want to

1020
00:47:37,320 --> 00:47:39,199
go there? Aside from living in Miami right now when

1021
00:47:39,199 --> 00:47:41,599
you're looking at the roster. And then two, if it

1022
00:47:41,639 --> 00:47:44,400
comes down to like who has the best or comparable offers,

1023
00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:46,559
it's not gonna be this team.

1024
00:47:46,719 --> 00:47:50,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think two to get into the extense, is

1025
00:47:50,599 --> 00:47:53,159
it extensive detonation or is the E and the D

1026
00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:56,119
of screwed? Like if if the Heat are in a

1027
00:47:56,159 --> 00:47:58,760
position where they are tanking for just that one year,

1028
00:47:59,400 --> 00:48:02,840
I would asume it also means you've traded Bam, right,

1029
00:48:02,920 --> 00:48:05,480
like because you're gonna keep an in prime BAM on

1030
00:48:05,559 --> 00:48:08,840
a tanking team like that. So I would say, like

1031
00:48:09,559 --> 00:48:12,119
the screwed potential, it could sort of be self inflicted

1032
00:48:12,159 --> 00:48:15,000
because if you're gonna go that route, it's not just

1033
00:48:15,119 --> 00:48:18,440
okay gap year, It's it's more of like a harder reset,

1034
00:48:18,519 --> 00:48:21,840
I would I would think, because although like even that's

1035
00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:24,519
hard because you're get the next year after that little window,

1036
00:48:24,519 --> 00:48:25,679
you're gonna owe that pick again.

1037
00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:27,880
Speaker 1: So like it would have to be a really to

1038
00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:30,079
Charlotte to get that pick back and other stuff.

1039
00:48:30,719 --> 00:48:32,239
Speaker 2: You've cracked it. That's what it is.

1040
00:48:32,639 --> 00:48:34,360
Speaker 1: And so it's just it's it comes back to what

1041
00:48:34,400 --> 00:48:38,800
you were focusing on. The outs here don't feel like

1042
00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:41,280
very extensive to use the word that's in screwed but

1043
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:44,480
like a acronymic because like, okay, they can't tank or

1044
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:48,519
rebuild readily. Sure can they get better readily? That's like

1045
00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:51,719
and where's you already mentioned like hero bam, they've probably

1046
00:48:51,719 --> 00:48:55,840
both topped out? Where's the upside? It's khalil ware and

1047
00:48:55,840 --> 00:48:57,840
that like do you think that homy Hawk is a

1048
00:48:57,880 --> 00:49:00,000
season been? Like at some point, Eric Spolsers, doesn't they

1049
00:49:00,119 --> 00:49:04,159
he exists? Apparently it's like quite the turn. So yeah,

1050
00:49:04,239 --> 00:49:06,280
it for me, it's just the lack of optionality to

1051
00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:08,480
where it's they almost just have to they have to

1052
00:49:08,519 --> 00:49:10,719
hope they get lucky on the trade market, I think.

1053
00:49:10,760 --> 00:49:13,360
And that's just when's the last time they actually got

1054
00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:16,880
lucky on the trade market? Is it the is it

1055
00:49:16,920 --> 00:49:18,079
the Jimmy Butler trade?

1056
00:49:18,559 --> 00:49:20,679
Speaker 2: I mean? And that was just like you right, yeah,

1057
00:49:20,719 --> 00:49:23,119
that was because it was well, that's how the heat

1058
00:49:23,159 --> 00:49:26,559
always you know, over the last decade plus, just position

1059
00:49:26,639 --> 00:49:29,719
themselves to like when the Jimmy Butler comes available, or

1060
00:49:29,760 --> 00:49:32,000
like going way back, when there's gonna be a massive

1061
00:49:32,039 --> 00:49:34,599
free agent class, they're like ready for it. That's just

1062
00:49:35,159 --> 00:49:37,480
the one. The free agent class thing might not happen

1063
00:49:37,559 --> 00:49:40,239
under this CBA like ever again. And then the like

1064
00:49:40,639 --> 00:49:44,000
you just can't count on the disgruntled superstar that wants

1065
00:49:44,039 --> 00:49:46,199
to go to a certain place like working his way loose.

1066
00:49:46,239 --> 00:49:48,480
That's not you know, that's not always going to be there.

1067
00:49:48,760 --> 00:49:50,559
Speaker 1: And by the way, if they end up with Kevin Durant,

1068
00:49:50,599 --> 00:49:52,880
I'm curious. Okay, so the soonest first round pick you

1069
00:49:52,920 --> 00:49:54,960
could trade is too as of right now is twenty

1070
00:49:55,119 --> 00:49:57,480
twenty nine. What have you given up to get Kevin

1071
00:49:57,519 --> 00:50:01,199
Durant would be my question? Yeah, next team with this

1072
00:50:01,440 --> 00:50:03,239
this is only I think we've only gone over on

1073
00:50:03,239 --> 00:50:06,039
one or two teams here with a screw score of seven.

1074
00:50:06,159 --> 00:50:09,519
I think this one's gonna be pretty controversial. And we're

1075
00:50:09,559 --> 00:50:13,440
obviously master clickbaitters here, which is why we put them there.

1076
00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:15,079
But this comes down to me. I think if you

1077
00:50:15,119 --> 00:50:19,239
look at their situation, they've got okay, the swap that

1078
00:50:19,639 --> 00:50:23,039
excuse me, the the pick that they owe to Atlanta,

1079
00:50:23,239 --> 00:50:24,760
like they could keep it if they want. It's top

1080
00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:27,400
twelve protected this year, might land there next year. I

1081
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:29,519
think it shrinks to what is it, top ten If

1082
00:50:29,559 --> 00:50:31,519
you really want to keep it, you could game it

1083
00:50:31,840 --> 00:50:35,639
to keep it. You did get the twenty thirty first

1084
00:50:35,719 --> 00:50:38,960
rounder from of Minnesota right in the Daron Fox trade,

1085
00:50:39,079 --> 00:50:42,440
the Spurs twenty twenty seven first round pick probably whatever

1086
00:50:42,480 --> 00:50:44,639
with one but Yama. But like my point is, you

1087
00:50:44,719 --> 00:50:48,000
have those assets. You have Keegan Murray, the Mantas bonus

1088
00:50:48,079 --> 00:50:51,760
is under contract. You have talented players on this team.

1089
00:50:52,079 --> 00:50:55,280
I will say there's even after trading Daron Fox, there's

1090
00:50:55,320 --> 00:50:57,920
no logical reason for them to have well, I shouldn't

1091
00:50:57,920 --> 00:51:00,440
say there's no logical reason they shouldn't be this high

1092
00:51:00,519 --> 00:51:06,079
on the screwed scale. This organization has the most incompetent

1093
00:51:06,119 --> 00:51:09,199
decision makers, and it starts and maybe even ends with

1094
00:51:09,360 --> 00:51:12,559
ownership and the VEC round a DVA, the vect de

1095
00:51:12,639 --> 00:51:15,440
Vladi DeVos is like linked to this organization. Again is

1096
00:51:15,639 --> 00:51:19,519
just flat out malpractice. And the other thing here is

1097
00:51:20,239 --> 00:51:23,039
take him out of the equation. I know some people

1098
00:51:23,079 --> 00:51:25,199
have taken the stance that they did well in the

1099
00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:30,519
Darn Fox trade quote unquote under the circumstances. You helped

1100
00:51:30,519 --> 00:51:33,360
forge those circumstances where you probably could have gotten more

1101
00:51:33,440 --> 00:51:36,719
at least had less pressure on you. And like in

1102
00:51:36,760 --> 00:51:40,239
a vacuum, you should have gotten more. Like the door,

1103
00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:42,199
I should say, you should have went a different direction.

1104
00:51:42,639 --> 00:51:45,679
And that's what also gives me major calls for pause

1105
00:51:45,679 --> 00:51:48,440
here is even if Sabonis, we know that's the other

1106
00:51:48,480 --> 00:51:51,760
part of the scrudiness here. They've tried to recreate like

1107
00:51:51,800 --> 00:51:55,519
they want to be Chicago Bulls West apparently, and Sabonis

1108
00:51:55,519 --> 00:51:57,159
I do think is better than Vouch, but he might

1109
00:51:57,159 --> 00:51:59,280
not want to be in Sacramento anymore. And if they

1110
00:51:59,360 --> 00:52:02,480
have to move Demontisi bonus, do you think that's gonna

1111
00:52:02,480 --> 00:52:05,599
be the wake up call to go through a rebuild. No,

1112
00:52:05,679 --> 00:52:07,840
because we just saw it in the darn Fox trade.

1113
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:10,440
And you don't get to say, well, he only wanted

1114
00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:12,599
to go to the Spurs Like No, like you could

1115
00:52:12,639 --> 00:52:15,559
have prioritized more. And I don't also want to hear

1116
00:52:15,840 --> 00:52:18,000
and like you got Zack Lavine, So if you remove him,

1117
00:52:18,000 --> 00:52:20,480
that's like two first round picks. If zach Lvine was

1118
00:52:20,480 --> 00:52:22,800
gonna get you. I think Zack Lvin has become underrated.

1119
00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:25,400
Let me be clear if you if if Zach Colvine

1120
00:52:25,440 --> 00:52:27,559
was gonna get two first round picks, the Chicago Bulls

1121
00:52:27,599 --> 00:52:30,360
would have traded for two first round picks. So I

1122
00:52:30,440 --> 00:52:34,199
have zero faith in the people in charge beginning with

1123
00:52:34,440 --> 00:52:36,360
the VEC. I don't even know how much control Monty

1124
00:52:36,400 --> 00:52:38,320
McNair has it this like who's the one calling the

1125
00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:39,079
shots anymore?

1126
00:52:39,119 --> 00:52:41,280
Speaker 2: All the reporting is that like Wes Wilcox was the

1127
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:43,280
guy that was on the phone, like and then that

1128
00:52:43,679 --> 00:52:45,519
part of the reason he was there was because they're like,

1129
00:52:45,519 --> 00:52:47,199
I don't know if we want MONI doing that part

1130
00:52:47,199 --> 00:52:51,320
of the rule. So like it's just sorry, you can finish.

1131
00:52:51,559 --> 00:52:53,159
I just have a couple of things.

1132
00:52:52,800 --> 00:52:55,599
Speaker 1: Like that's a red flag in itself, so I'm pretty

1133
00:52:55,679 --> 00:52:58,360
much done. It's just you can't even if they should

1134
00:52:58,440 --> 00:53:02,400
be set up to not be totally screwed, you don't

1135
00:53:02,440 --> 00:53:05,440
do you trust like this organization to like they're gonna

1136
00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:08,440
get lemons and just make a pilot dog shit somehow.

1137
00:53:08,519 --> 00:53:11,400
Like that's just that that's the trajectory of the King's

1138
00:53:11,440 --> 00:53:12,639
decision making tree.

1139
00:53:12,760 --> 00:53:17,719
Speaker 2: It's just at some point, like, okay, if you had

1140
00:53:17,719 --> 00:53:21,239
predicted the Kings had a high screwed score every year

1141
00:53:21,599 --> 00:53:26,119
for the last twenty you'd been wrong twice like once,

1142
00:53:26,679 --> 00:53:29,119
so like let's just check the track record on that one.

1143
00:53:29,159 --> 00:53:31,239
And the constant is ownership. It's not like rounda DV

1144
00:53:31,400 --> 00:53:35,119
is responsible for you know, the late two thousand's, uh

1145
00:53:35,159 --> 00:53:38,119
even the beginning of the twenty tens. But this is

1146
00:53:38,199 --> 00:53:40,840
just it's just a it's its ownership. Like I don't

1147
00:53:40,840 --> 00:53:44,800
even think we need to go much beyond that to

1148
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:48,760
say that the Kings are screwed, because it's so clear that,

1149
00:53:48,960 --> 00:53:53,519
like you can't create a culture or a level of

1150
00:53:53,639 --> 00:53:59,559
organizational stability that one keeps like one creates success on

1151
00:53:59,599 --> 00:54:02,199
the floor sustainably. You might have a blip, which they did.

1152
00:54:03,239 --> 00:54:07,960
And two, look at the guys that they've alienated most recently,

1153
00:54:08,159 --> 00:54:11,920
dearon Fox, not a malcontent like go along to get

1154
00:54:11,960 --> 00:54:15,800
along guy like just good dude, Demonsta Bonus works his

1155
00:54:15,880 --> 00:54:19,239
ass off like plays hurt good dude. And these are

1156
00:54:19,280 --> 00:54:24,039
the two guys now that your organizational like fuckery has alienated.

1157
00:54:24,320 --> 00:54:27,519
Like what happens if you just get like a normal

1158
00:54:27,599 --> 00:54:30,800
NBA player there that is a star that's like not

1159
00:54:31,639 --> 00:54:34,159
so tolerant for so long like these guys have been

1160
00:54:34,400 --> 00:54:37,440
like you just it's gonna be the revolving door of

1161
00:54:37,519 --> 00:54:42,039
Zach Lavine's and DeMar DeRozan's for eternity until ownership changes,

1162
00:54:42,199 --> 00:54:45,960
or until ownership just empowers a couple smart people and

1163
00:54:46,039 --> 00:54:48,719
gets all the extra voices out of the room and

1164
00:54:48,800 --> 00:54:51,760
there's a clarity of direction and everybody understands what the

1165
00:54:51,880 --> 00:54:55,079
org chart looks like, which nobody does right now based

1166
00:54:55,079 --> 00:54:59,239
on all the reporting. Like you just like you're just

1167
00:54:59,360 --> 00:55:01,920
your hands are tied behind your back, like until the

1168
00:55:02,360 --> 00:55:06,840
principal issue of how ownership is running. Also, by the way,

1169
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:10,320
the Kings have a great arena and a great fan base.

1170
00:55:10,440 --> 00:55:12,519
Oh yeah, like a lot of the business stuff has

1171
00:55:12,559 --> 00:55:13,280
been awesome.

1172
00:55:13,480 --> 00:55:15,960
Speaker 1: So like under a market in general, if you're a

1173
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:19,119
player Sacramentos in California.

1174
00:55:18,360 --> 00:55:21,360
Speaker 2: Credit I guess credit run a d'ive for fostering like

1175
00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:25,039
for doing well in those regards. But the basketball side

1176
00:55:25,079 --> 00:55:27,440
of it, it's just like how many times are we

1177
00:55:27,440 --> 00:55:30,159
going to run up against this wall? Like it's it's

1178
00:55:30,199 --> 00:55:33,440
insane to me. They built that, You built that. You

1179
00:55:33,639 --> 00:55:37,119
saw what Levine and DeRozan did in the Weaker Conference,

1180
00:55:37,119 --> 00:55:39,519
and we're like, let's do that. That sounds like a

1181
00:55:39,559 --> 00:55:43,599
great way to Like it's just ownership is the biggest

1182
00:55:43,599 --> 00:55:47,079
disadvantage here. And until that changes, whether it's a new owner,

1183
00:55:47,119 --> 00:55:50,079
which I don't think is ever gonna happen, or empowering

1184
00:55:50,079 --> 00:55:52,559
someone else to just be in charge of all this stuff,

1185
00:55:53,079 --> 00:55:55,000
you're screwed forever. Like that's just what it is.

1186
00:55:55,280 --> 00:55:58,480
Speaker 1: And look, it's problematic because something you said about like

1187
00:55:59,119 --> 00:56:01,360
ownership getting out of the way, I don't know that

1188
00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:03,760
I would argue that this should be their aspiration, but

1189
00:56:03,800 --> 00:56:06,239
it's a problem if you can even think about their

1190
00:56:06,440 --> 00:56:10,519
aspirational like their most aspirational scenario is this ownership regime,

1191
00:56:10,599 --> 00:56:14,320
like following the the blueprint of Whiny Neppo baby fuck

1192
00:56:14,360 --> 00:56:16,880
boy James Dolan of him getting out of the way

1193
00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:20,119
in New York. And that's not like you don't like, yeah, okay,

1194
00:56:20,119 --> 00:56:22,039
the Knicks are run kind of like a real franchise

1195
00:56:22,079 --> 00:56:24,440
now and I credit that to just and there's even

1196
00:56:24,480 --> 00:56:25,320
quite look could they.

1197
00:56:25,199 --> 00:56:27,719
Speaker 2: Put in charge, Look like they got real competent people.

1198
00:56:28,039 --> 00:56:30,760
Speaker 1: But it's just you don't ever want to aspire to

1199
00:56:31,119 --> 00:56:34,480
be right, It takes trajectory of things. So yeah, and

1200
00:56:34,519 --> 00:56:37,360
that's just and but to look at the product on

1201
00:56:37,400 --> 00:56:39,559
the court, I mean, like even the fandllying of Mike Brown,

1202
00:56:39,800 --> 00:56:42,320
Like the firing of Mike Brown. You need to figure

1203
00:56:42,320 --> 00:56:44,239
out the coaching stuff now and hit on that. But

1204
00:56:44,400 --> 00:56:48,000
let's just look at the personnel. What coach is coming

1205
00:56:48,039 --> 00:56:52,559
in and making these kings more than number six in

1206
00:56:52,639 --> 00:56:55,039
the West, and I think, how do you even get

1207
00:56:55,079 --> 00:56:57,519
to better than that? It's does Keith and Murray turn

1208
00:56:57,559 --> 00:57:00,800
into a superstar? Which, by the way, you're not set

1209
00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:02,480
up for him too, because he's always going to be

1210
00:57:02,480 --> 00:57:05,599
marginalized on offense by having all these other ball handlers

1211
00:57:05,639 --> 00:57:07,360
in front of him, And it's you could go out

1212
00:57:07,400 --> 00:57:10,320
and make a trade, but it's you need the guy

1213
00:57:10,679 --> 00:57:14,320
who can define your entire championship stock at this point,

1214
00:57:14,360 --> 00:57:17,360
because I like domos A Bonas more than you, although

1215
00:57:17,400 --> 00:57:19,159
you just you give him some pretty high praise. Now,

1216
00:57:19,159 --> 00:57:22,599
aggregators get that, get that out there, but they don't

1217
00:57:22,639 --> 00:57:25,920
have like who should be the number one. You were

1218
00:57:25,920 --> 00:57:28,760
trying to kind of offset it by saying, do Masa

1219
00:57:28,800 --> 00:57:31,599
Bonis and D'aron Fox are kind of second best player

1220
00:57:31,639 --> 00:57:33,519
on title guys, and we have two of them, and

1221
00:57:33,719 --> 00:57:36,079
that's how you approximate it. Okay, fine, you don't have

1222
00:57:36,239 --> 00:57:38,960
like Zach Lavine and demarrow like, that's not approximating it

1223
00:57:39,000 --> 00:57:39,719
in the same way.

1224
00:57:40,039 --> 00:57:42,360
Speaker 2: No, yeah, it's I mean, I don't know what if

1225
00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:44,440
we could put them higher, but that's not really in

1226
00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:46,920
the spirit of the exercise, because it's like they just

1227
00:57:46,960 --> 00:57:49,639
have one problem and it's it's a fundamental one. But

1228
00:57:49,760 --> 00:57:52,000
like the next teams we'll talk about have a lot

1229
00:57:52,039 --> 00:57:52,719
of problems.

1230
00:57:52,760 --> 00:57:57,000
Speaker 1: And I will say another harbinger of just how poorly

1231
00:57:57,119 --> 00:57:59,599
the kings are set up. I guess is it felt

1232
00:57:59,639 --> 00:58:01,599
like we talked about them for fifteen minutes and it's

1233
00:58:01,599 --> 00:58:03,840
been less than eight and a half. So we move

1234
00:58:03,880 --> 00:58:06,119
on under the time limit. Do you want to take

1235
00:58:06,199 --> 00:58:07,840
us to our screw score of number eight?

1236
00:58:08,079 --> 00:58:10,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, so we've got the bucks here at number eight.

1237
00:58:11,199 --> 00:58:12,800
I don't know how there's not a lot of like

1238
00:58:13,000 --> 00:58:15,840
new information to impart like this has just been kind

1239
00:58:15,880 --> 00:58:21,920
of the scenario start with. They've made several win now trades,

1240
00:58:21,960 --> 00:58:23,800
like what you know, sending out a bunch of picks

1241
00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:27,119
for Drew Holiday using Holiday and picks to get Damian

1242
00:58:27,159 --> 00:58:32,320
Lillard Brook. Lopez is inexplicably still very effective at his age,

1243
00:58:32,400 --> 00:58:34,440
and he's just fundamental to what they do. They may

1244
00:58:34,480 --> 00:58:37,760
lose him, he may decline immediate, Like the window for

1245
00:58:37,840 --> 00:58:41,599
him is pretty short. They've swapped out Middleton for Kuzma.

1246
00:58:41,679 --> 00:58:44,079
That's been I don't know, saved them some money, but

1247
00:58:44,159 --> 00:58:47,280
it's just not helping the bottom line. And you have

1248
00:58:47,599 --> 00:58:50,039
still Giannis is gonna finish third or fourth in MVP,

1249
00:58:51,039 --> 00:58:55,360
and you're you just like seem to be just losing hope,

1250
00:58:55,559 --> 00:58:58,199
you know, So if and when he asks out, then

1251
00:58:58,280 --> 00:59:01,559
that's the detonation we're talking about. It's just there aren't

1252
00:59:01,599 --> 00:59:06,559
a lot of like flexibility options pathways for the Bucks

1253
00:59:06,599 --> 00:59:09,320
to get better. And that's a huge problem when you

1254
00:59:09,360 --> 00:59:11,360
have a player as good as you're honest, playing as

1255
00:59:11,360 --> 00:59:14,920
well as he is right now, and having had him

1256
00:59:14,960 --> 00:59:17,840
more than once over the years, like as nicely as

1257
00:59:17,880 --> 00:59:20,400
you can and always in the offseason talk about like

1258
00:59:21,239 --> 00:59:24,679
I'm committed here, but we need to be making decisions

1259
00:59:24,679 --> 00:59:27,840
that allow us to win, and like just putting sort

1260
00:59:27,840 --> 00:59:30,760
of some conditional language on his loyalty, which like that's

1261
00:59:30,800 --> 00:59:33,360
not a knock, that's just if you're him, you have

1262
00:59:33,440 --> 00:59:36,840
to be thinking that way. So this is this is

1263
00:59:36,840 --> 00:59:39,880
a good team that doesn't have a great ceiling. I

1264
00:59:39,920 --> 00:59:45,840
don't think that's independent of Dame's injury or his deep

1265
00:59:45,880 --> 00:59:49,480
fan thormbosis affecting what happens in this postseason. But like,

1266
00:59:49,599 --> 00:59:51,639
this is a team that's been bounced early a couple times.

1267
00:59:51,679 --> 00:59:55,320
Granted injuries played a role, change coaches a couple times.

1268
00:59:55,320 --> 00:59:59,039
Like it's all just trending towards the blow up. It's

1269
00:59:59,039 --> 01:00:01,199
just it's a win, right, It's not an if, Like

1270
01:00:01,280 --> 01:00:02,960
that's how this ends at some point.

1271
01:00:03,159 --> 01:00:05,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, they've been able to I won't even say pull

1272
01:00:05,480 --> 01:00:07,440
rabbits out of their hat because they gave up like

1273
01:00:08,039 --> 01:00:10,039
real stuff, like giving up Jew Holiday to get Damien

1274
01:00:10,039 --> 01:00:11,639
Litler not an easy call if you're making the Drew

1275
01:00:11,679 --> 01:00:13,719
Holiday trade for a team in that market. I think

1276
01:00:13,960 --> 01:00:16,199
with Drew Holiday, like okay, how long will he be here?

1277
01:00:16,440 --> 01:00:18,559
The Giannis he did sign the extension, but at the

1278
01:00:18,559 --> 01:00:22,000
time it wasn't guaranteed. Those were risk You just kind

1279
01:00:22,039 --> 01:00:25,039
of run out of how do they make that next move?

1280
01:00:25,239 --> 01:00:28,280
And what's complicated? Still, we did talk about this previously

1281
01:00:28,320 --> 01:00:32,440
following the initial diagnosis of Dame's DVT. So as of

1282
01:00:32,519 --> 01:00:34,239
right now, you look at this team for next year

1283
01:00:34,320 --> 01:00:39,360
and they're about fifteen million outside of the tax. But

1284
01:00:39,840 --> 01:00:42,039
Brooklyn or excuse me, twenty three million outside of the

1285
01:00:42,079 --> 01:00:45,679
tax for next year. That's without brook Lopez on the books.

1286
01:00:46,079 --> 01:00:48,480
And even if you like, if you bring back brook Lopez,

1287
01:00:48,559 --> 01:00:50,639
my guess is he eats up most or all of

1288
01:00:50,679 --> 01:00:54,280
that room underneath the luxury tax. And then from there

1289
01:00:54,320 --> 01:00:57,039
it's two rotation players are free agents that you do

1290
01:00:57,119 --> 01:00:59,480
not have bird rights on and Gary Trent junior entorian

1291
01:00:59,559 --> 01:01:02,480
prints or do you just think, like, do Ryan Rollins

1292
01:01:02,559 --> 01:01:05,280
and aj Green replace them like kind of next guy

1293
01:01:05,440 --> 01:01:08,559
like positionally no, like Torrian Prince, that would be Kyle

1294
01:01:08,639 --> 01:01:12,679
Kuzma's job more so, and you I think you know.

1295
01:01:12,760 --> 01:01:14,679
Zach Low went on the Bill Simmons Pod and welcome

1296
01:01:14,719 --> 01:01:16,800
back zach Low. I've I can't tell you how much

1297
01:01:16,800 --> 01:01:19,239
I missed the low posts. Uh. Shout out to Hardwood

1298
01:01:19,239 --> 01:01:21,119
Knocks for getting me through. I hope that served as

1299
01:01:21,159 --> 01:01:23,719
a prophecy for a lot of other people. But he

1300
01:01:23,760 --> 01:01:25,960
had said something like he doesn't even feel Giannis as

1301
01:01:26,039 --> 01:01:27,920
much this year, even though the numbers are, And I

1302
01:01:28,000 --> 01:01:30,079
just kind of patently disagree with that. I don't agree

1303
01:01:30,159 --> 01:01:32,320
disagree with him often they need at the beginning of

1304
01:01:32,360 --> 01:01:34,559
the year. But I'm kind of just watching, like ever

1305
01:01:34,599 --> 01:01:38,199
since the Dame injury. He's just he's running the offense,

1306
01:01:38,280 --> 01:01:40,639
not just in transition, but like from the dead stops,

1307
01:01:40,960 --> 01:01:45,199
and it's kind of working. So having Giannis still be

1308
01:01:45,280 --> 01:01:47,920
y honest, I think gives me maybe more hope than

1309
01:01:47,960 --> 01:01:50,880
this screwed score would say. But it's gonna come back

1310
01:01:50,920 --> 01:01:54,320
to your words, the outs or the maneuverability. What is

1311
01:01:54,320 --> 01:01:56,280
that you can trade one first round pick this summer.

1312
01:01:56,480 --> 01:01:59,039
The contracts are the contracts, and you're also you know,

1313
01:01:59,119 --> 01:02:01,800
we mentioned the tax. What happens if Bobby Portis you

1314
01:02:01,800 --> 01:02:03,800
I don't think he's gonna decline his player option at

1315
01:02:03,840 --> 01:02:06,480
this point, but if he does, like you're not gonna

1316
01:02:06,480 --> 01:02:08,840
get Brook Lopez and Bobby Portis back for thirty five

1317
01:02:08,880 --> 01:02:11,400
million dollars combined. I would think it probably costs more

1318
01:02:11,599 --> 01:02:13,719
that maybe I'm wrong there, who knows, or you could

1319
01:02:13,719 --> 01:02:15,360
just lose Bobby Portis and that you're kind of in

1320
01:02:15,360 --> 01:02:18,880
the situation you're in right now. It's I'm with you

1321
01:02:18,920 --> 01:02:21,400
that it's a matter of if not when If I

1322
01:02:21,519 --> 01:02:24,960
told you though that Giannis is not like his future

1323
01:02:25,039 --> 01:02:27,079
is not going to be an issue this summer, He's

1324
01:02:27,119 --> 01:02:29,079
not gonna approach it, and wondering if he should ask

1325
01:02:29,119 --> 01:02:31,760
for a trade. Would this lower their screwed score for

1326
01:02:31,800 --> 01:02:33,199
you at all? Or is this you're kind of looking

1327
01:02:33,280 --> 01:02:35,280
at This thing is gonna come to a head by

1328
01:02:35,320 --> 01:02:38,280
twenty twenty seven, which is how by the way I

1329
01:02:38,920 --> 01:02:39,639
do view it.

1330
01:02:39,679 --> 01:02:42,440
Speaker 2: I agree with you. I think it's like I said,

1331
01:02:42,480 --> 01:02:44,679
I think it's a win, not an if. And like

1332
01:02:45,119 --> 01:02:48,800
I'm trying to think of the analogy. It's not quite like, oh,

1333
01:02:48,840 --> 01:02:51,360
the boat is springing has sprung a lot of leaks

1334
01:02:51,400 --> 01:02:53,800
over the years, and you are running out of fingers

1335
01:02:53,920 --> 01:02:57,400
or like to plug him or like it's almost just

1336
01:02:57,480 --> 01:02:59,800
like I just can't get there. So this was a

1337
01:03:00,039 --> 01:03:02,840
terrible line of thinking to go down. But it's just

1338
01:03:02,880 --> 01:03:07,400
like they've you talked about it. They've done, They've made

1339
01:03:07,480 --> 01:03:11,280
the hard decision, they've made the future mortgaging decisions at

1340
01:03:11,320 --> 01:03:13,960
every turn to try to like keep the they got

1341
01:03:13,960 --> 01:03:15,639
to and you know what, they want a title, so

1342
01:03:15,760 --> 01:03:19,599
like to some extent, it's like mission accomplished. It's hard

1343
01:03:19,599 --> 01:03:22,920
to stay that good in that market, and they've they've

1344
01:03:22,920 --> 01:03:25,559
tried really hard, and that's why they are where they

1345
01:03:25,559 --> 01:03:28,119
are where it's like they can trade the one pick,

1346
01:03:28,199 --> 01:03:31,360
Like you said, Guys like Bobby Portis, who are good players,

1347
01:03:31,519 --> 01:03:34,360
but like there's no scenario where Bobby Portis should be

1348
01:03:34,400 --> 01:03:36,800
this important and you should be thinking, like we can't

1349
01:03:36,800 --> 01:03:40,320
replace him like that, you know, that's where they are.

1350
01:03:40,400 --> 01:03:42,800
Where it's like if Torrian Prince leaves, like who who

1351
01:03:42,840 --> 01:03:44,920
was kicking the door down for Torrian Prince? Like last

1352
01:03:45,000 --> 01:03:47,920
in last so like and he matters and and that's

1353
01:03:47,960 --> 01:03:51,239
just what happens when you keep just you keep doing

1354
01:03:51,280 --> 01:03:53,920
the short term thing because you owe it to your superstar.

1355
01:03:54,239 --> 01:03:56,119
And I'm not even saying it's the wrong decision. I

1356
01:03:56,119 --> 01:04:00,880
think like, unlike a lot of teams generally speak, you

1357
01:04:00,920 --> 01:04:02,320
could quibble with the coach stuff.

1358
01:04:02,320 --> 01:04:06,039
Speaker 1: I guess, oh you should, I'm sorry, but not putting

1359
01:04:06,400 --> 01:04:08,000
And I know that that was probably the plan with

1360
01:04:08,119 --> 01:04:12,440
Terry Stotts not having a more offensively innovative coach Dame Giannis,

1361
01:04:12,559 --> 01:04:14,800
But like that's that I consider that a farce.

1362
01:04:14,960 --> 01:04:17,880
Speaker 2: But but would you agree they're distinct from some of

1363
01:04:17,920 --> 01:04:20,679
the other Certainly the next two teams we'll talk about

1364
01:04:20,679 --> 01:04:24,599
where it's like you made mistakes well and and that's

1365
01:04:24,639 --> 01:04:27,400
why you're in this position. The bucks like at almost

1366
01:04:27,400 --> 01:04:29,559
every turn, Like, yeah, I guess even the Dame thing.

1367
01:04:29,559 --> 01:04:32,280
It's like, I get it, that's justifiable. You needed someone

1368
01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:35,039
to finish games offensively, and like Holiday is not that guy,

1369
01:04:35,079 --> 01:04:36,760
and you're looking to you know what I mean, Like

1370
01:04:37,159 --> 01:04:39,840
this is just what happens when you win a title

1371
01:04:40,480 --> 01:04:42,920
and you just like keep pushing and keep trying to

1372
01:04:42,960 --> 01:04:45,920
stay there and you just pay that toll. Eventually you

1373
01:04:46,039 --> 01:04:48,719
run out of you can't pay anymore. Like you're just

1374
01:04:48,800 --> 01:04:51,000
in this position where the only way to go is

1375
01:04:51,719 --> 01:04:53,360
like a pretty significant reset.

1376
01:04:54,079 --> 01:04:56,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's I mean, I liken this when I

1377
01:04:56,440 --> 01:04:58,440
was this is like we did talk about the Bucks

1378
01:04:58,480 --> 01:05:00,840
with s I sort of liking it to what happened

1379
01:05:00,880 --> 01:05:03,079
to the Thunder after they were younger, of course, but

1380
01:05:03,159 --> 01:05:05,480
after they made the finals. Think about how like it

1381
01:05:05,559 --> 01:05:08,159
really comes back to injuries for me is think about

1382
01:05:08,159 --> 01:05:11,039
how many postseasons were ruined by like it was everyone

1383
01:05:11,079 --> 01:05:13,159
with Kevin Durant, Sergeerbaka, Russell Westbrook. It seem that they

1384
01:05:13,159 --> 01:05:15,400
were all taking turns of being hurt during the playoffs

1385
01:05:15,599 --> 01:05:18,159
and in the for the Milwaukee it's been you know,

1386
01:05:18,320 --> 01:05:20,440
if you think something's gonna happen this offseason, there's a

1387
01:05:20,519 --> 01:05:23,119
chance that we might not see Damian Loyd Orjannis attent

1388
01:05:23,199 --> 01:05:25,679
to Coople play in a single playoff game together, right

1389
01:05:25,880 --> 01:05:28,119
wild I know it's only two years, but that's a

1390
01:05:28,119 --> 01:05:30,760
really big deal because that is the entire just like point,

1391
01:05:31,039 --> 01:05:34,679
that was the goal and what do you do? Like

1392
01:05:34,760 --> 01:05:37,559
what is the like what is the true litmus test

1393
01:05:37,559 --> 01:05:38,920
for this team all the off season is if you

1394
01:05:38,920 --> 01:05:41,800
look at Brook Lopez's free agency as if he's shopping

1395
01:05:41,840 --> 01:05:44,199
around or if he leaves, like that could be just

1396
01:05:44,239 --> 01:05:46,119
the now in the because how are you supposed to

1397
01:05:46,320 --> 01:05:49,440
We're talking about maybe Torrian Prince days and like Gary

1398
01:05:49,480 --> 01:05:51,480
Trent Junior, like the shooting could probably at least be

1399
01:05:51,519 --> 01:05:55,800
replaced with AJ Green. You can't replace Brook Lopez. I

1400
01:05:55,840 --> 01:05:57,840
don't even think if you threw like, could you get

1401
01:05:57,920 --> 01:06:00,159
Al Horford for the non tax payerman level exception if

1402
01:06:00,159 --> 01:06:03,519
that's now available to you, And it's just Al Harford's great,

1403
01:06:03,559 --> 01:06:05,400
He's not the same level of just like the rim

1404
01:06:05,480 --> 01:06:08,800
protector that Bro. He's more he's better on the perimeter. Sure,

1405
01:06:08,920 --> 01:06:12,519
But so that's the that's the trend. That's the player

1406
01:06:12,559 --> 01:06:14,880
I guess that I'm watching more than anyone. He's a

1407
01:06:14,920 --> 01:06:17,840
free agent, and it's okay, it doesn't just matter if

1408
01:06:17,880 --> 01:06:20,280
he comes back, it matters that the number at which

1409
01:06:20,320 --> 01:06:23,039
he comes back for because that'll kind of define maybe

1410
01:06:23,039 --> 01:06:25,280
what they could do. And I mean, even if he

1411
01:06:25,360 --> 01:06:27,119
comes back, it's are they even gonna be willing at

1412
01:06:27,119 --> 01:06:29,800
this point to put they could trade their twenty thirty

1413
01:06:29,800 --> 01:06:32,599
one or twenty thirty two first round pick, knowing what

1414
01:06:32,639 --> 01:06:35,519
we're just saying, are you gonna even put either of

1415
01:06:35,519 --> 01:06:37,320
those on the table in trade discussions?

1416
01:06:37,519 --> 01:06:40,599
Speaker 2: I mean, the thing is like it's I'm not a

1417
01:06:40,599 --> 01:06:44,480
Bucks fan, so I can say this, but I imagine every

1418
01:06:44,559 --> 01:06:47,199
Bucks fan would disagree, and I would not begrudge him

1419
01:06:47,239 --> 01:06:50,039
for it. Like the best thing that could happen for

1420
01:06:50,079 --> 01:06:52,760
the Bucks like long mid and long term futures for

1421
01:06:52,800 --> 01:06:55,079
Giannis to say, like, hey, it's time you gotta trade me,

1422
01:06:55,480 --> 01:06:58,519
because then like he he is, you're out right, like

1423
01:06:58,840 --> 01:07:02,320
he's the way that you replenish your picks, the way

1424
01:07:02,360 --> 01:07:05,800
that you hit the rece like because again, like if

1425
01:07:05,880 --> 01:07:08,800
Lopez leaves or stays, like if he leaves, like you

1426
01:07:08,840 --> 01:07:10,639
probably just lose him for nothing, but like they don't

1427
01:07:10,679 --> 01:07:13,039
really have anybody else with like massively or even like

1428
01:07:13,480 --> 01:07:16,400
I don't know, debatably positive trade value. Certainly no one

1429
01:07:16,440 --> 01:07:18,400
that's that's gonna give you back stuff that makes it

1430
01:07:18,440 --> 01:07:20,960
so like all right, twenty twenty eight or so, like

1431
01:07:21,039 --> 01:07:22,960
here we go again. We're on the rise again. Like

1432
01:07:23,039 --> 01:07:25,719
I just and and if I'm a Bucks fan, I

1433
01:07:25,719 --> 01:07:28,639
think I just want Giannis to stay there forever. But

1434
01:07:28,880 --> 01:07:30,679
like I just don't know what kind of team you

1435
01:07:30,679 --> 01:07:32,880
can build around him. They've just run out, They've run

1436
01:07:32,920 --> 01:07:33,800
out of ways to do it.

1437
01:07:34,159 --> 01:07:36,920
Speaker 1: I unless you think his trade value is going to

1438
01:07:36,960 --> 01:07:39,320
crater over the next year, or you think that you

1439
01:07:39,360 --> 01:07:41,880
can get a good amount of value for Damian Lillard.

1440
01:07:41,880 --> 01:07:43,960
Now I almost think it's better off to hope it

1441
01:07:43,960 --> 01:07:47,119
defers for a year, just to just kind of ride out. Okay,

1442
01:07:47,119 --> 01:07:49,360
we're not sending out a crappy pick next year. Maybe

1443
01:07:49,400 --> 01:07:51,559
we hit lightning in a bottle. And because it's the

1444
01:07:51,599 --> 01:07:54,559
East aside from Boston and Cleveland right now, sure Bucks

1445
01:07:54,559 --> 01:07:56,320
are fully healthy. Yeah, you're gonna pick the Nicks or

1446
01:07:56,320 --> 01:07:58,480
the Pacers over them in a series, but outside the

1447
01:07:58,480 --> 01:08:00,719
realm of possibility though that they could win in Yeah,

1448
01:08:00,760 --> 01:08:02,239
we were out of time on the Bucks, though we

1449
01:08:02,280 --> 01:08:05,280
went over a little bit on them. Screwed score of nine.

1450
01:08:06,000 --> 01:08:08,119
This was nominated by you I'd initially had them in

1451
01:08:08,119 --> 01:08:10,719
that eight spot. You argued to bump them up, so

1452
01:08:10,719 --> 01:08:12,960
maybe I'll throw it to you here. But this goes

1453
01:08:13,039 --> 01:08:16,039
beyond I mean, the Luka Doncis trade certainly matters. And

1454
01:08:16,119 --> 01:08:18,600
by the way, to hearken back to the Kings, they're

1455
01:08:18,680 --> 01:08:21,239
lucky that the demands exists right now because they would,

1456
01:08:21,319 --> 01:08:22,920
like ron A Dive, would be in the running for

1457
01:08:22,960 --> 01:08:25,199
worst owner in the league if whatever's going on in

1458
01:08:25,239 --> 01:08:26,680
Dallas wasn't happening.

1459
01:08:26,600 --> 01:08:29,479
Speaker 2: Right So with now the track record isn't as long,

1460
01:08:29,680 --> 01:08:32,079
But the boy are there's some hits on it already

1461
01:08:32,079 --> 01:08:34,640
for ownership in Dallas as far as to what you're

1462
01:08:34,680 --> 01:08:38,199
talking about. So there's that threshold issue of like, oh god,

1463
01:08:38,319 --> 01:08:41,520
his ownership just like wildly incompetent. And if and if

1464
01:08:41,560 --> 01:08:44,960
ownership is not, are they empowering an executive in Nico

1465
01:08:45,000 --> 01:08:48,479
Harrison is just like, man, can we trust him to

1466
01:08:48,479 --> 01:08:51,359
make a deal? We could until the Luca deal, and

1467
01:08:51,399 --> 01:08:54,960
then now that just makes you doubt everything. But then

1468
01:08:56,560 --> 01:08:58,359
we're talking about things that are in their control, out

1469
01:08:58,399 --> 01:09:02,039
of their control Kyrier, Kyrier in towards ACL that's catastrophic

1470
01:09:02,079 --> 01:09:04,359
to a team that I don't even know what to

1471
01:09:04,399 --> 01:09:08,039
say about the professed timeline and how these players make

1472
01:09:08,079 --> 01:09:10,399
more sense in it than Luca did. But if you're

1473
01:09:10,439 --> 01:09:12,920
talking a three to four year window, irving at his age,

1474
01:09:12,960 --> 01:09:16,720
tearing his ACL, probably losing all of next year coming

1475
01:09:16,760 --> 01:09:20,479
back as what like a good starter, I'm sorry, Like

1476
01:09:20,640 --> 01:09:23,199
just as like given his age, given what happens with

1477
01:09:23,239 --> 01:09:26,279
that injury, Like is he an all star again? I

1478
01:09:26,319 --> 01:09:29,640
don't know, but he's like fun, he's critical to the

1479
01:09:29,680 --> 01:09:32,800
whole thing. Like, so you have that, you have Anthony Davis,

1480
01:09:32,840 --> 01:09:35,640
who has looked good when he's played. Durability is like,

1481
01:09:35,680 --> 01:09:38,159
I don't think durability concerns are going to go away

1482
01:09:38,680 --> 01:09:43,279
the older he gets. So that the pick situation not good.

1483
01:09:43,520 --> 01:09:46,840
They have none incoming. What can they trade? So they

1484
01:09:46,880 --> 01:09:52,319
owe twenty seven, they owe twenty eight, They don't control.

1485
01:09:51,840 --> 01:09:54,640
Speaker 1: They control this year's first round pick and next year's

1486
01:09:54,640 --> 01:09:57,119
first round pick, and then they do not control the

1487
01:09:57,119 --> 01:09:59,279
fate of their own first round pick again until twenty

1488
01:09:59,439 --> 01:09:59,840
thirty one.

1489
01:10:00,119 --> 01:10:04,359
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, twenty seven, twenty twenty Okay, so not like

1490
01:10:04,520 --> 01:10:08,199
but here's the thing, Okay, cool, Oh, they can tank

1491
01:10:08,279 --> 01:10:10,399
the next two years and there'll be like upside there.

1492
01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:14,000
You just got Anthony Davis because you're trying to win now, Like,

1493
01:10:14,039 --> 01:10:14,920
how does that.

1494
01:10:15,119 --> 01:10:17,720
Speaker 1: You can't tank this season? It's too late, it's just weights.

1495
01:10:17,840 --> 01:10:20,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, and you're yeah, right, you're competing somehow, You're still

1496
01:10:20,359 --> 01:10:22,479
in the plane mix. But that's got less to do

1497
01:10:22,520 --> 01:10:24,199
with how good you are and more to do with

1498
01:10:24,239 --> 01:10:27,359
how bad the rest of the West is. Like, this

1499
01:10:27,439 --> 01:10:32,920
is another situation, where is the way out? Trading Anthony Davis?

1500
01:10:32,960 --> 01:10:37,079
Like coldly, yeah, that is that is you're out? But man,

1501
01:10:37,119 --> 01:10:38,600
does that does that scream?

1502
01:10:38,760 --> 01:10:38,840
Speaker 1: Like?

1503
01:10:38,960 --> 01:10:41,520
Speaker 2: Okay, nobody has any idea what they're doing. If that,

1504
01:10:41,640 --> 01:10:43,920
if that's the move that saves you. So I don't know.

1505
01:10:43,920 --> 01:10:45,880
I'm sure I miss some things, but just I don't

1506
01:10:45,920 --> 01:10:48,800
know how you can be optimistic about anything with the

1507
01:10:48,840 --> 01:10:51,239
MAVs short term right now? No.

1508
01:10:51,319 --> 01:10:54,279
Speaker 1: I mean, look, it almost increases the likely Okay, you

1509
01:10:54,279 --> 01:10:57,119
can say, okay, they're deep at full strength. Think about

1510
01:10:57,119 --> 01:10:59,199
what the defense will look like if and when Derek

1511
01:10:59,239 --> 01:11:03,079
Lively and Anthony play together. Okay, great, but like next

1512
01:11:03,119 --> 01:11:05,319
season's at least a little bit compromised because of the

1513
01:11:05,359 --> 01:11:07,560
Irving injury, as you mentioned, and now it's well, they

1514
01:11:07,560 --> 01:11:09,479
probably still have enough. Like you look at the salaries

1515
01:11:09,479 --> 01:11:11,920
on their books. They do own some picks again, this

1516
01:11:12,039 --> 01:11:15,920
year's twenty six. They had that Lakers pick now in

1517
01:11:15,920 --> 01:11:19,039
twenty twenty seven, not twenty twenty nine though, couldn't get

1518
01:11:19,039 --> 01:11:22,000
that one in the Lugadachs trade for some reason. So like, yeah, okay,

1519
01:11:22,000 --> 01:11:24,520
you can put together the package, but doesn't that make

1520
01:11:24,600 --> 01:11:29,520
it more likely they indulge a borderline reckless move like

1521
01:11:29,600 --> 01:11:32,000
I would argue Kevin Durant on this team would be fun.

1522
01:11:32,119 --> 01:11:34,920
They can get to the money you've bought yourself. A

1523
01:11:35,560 --> 01:11:38,439
he's gonna be thirty seven in September. He's still spectacular.

1524
01:11:38,439 --> 01:11:42,079
But like you're trying to talk about like the next

1525
01:11:42,119 --> 01:11:44,560
three years, that doesn't seem very long. But if you're

1526
01:11:44,560 --> 01:11:47,479
adding Kevin Durant, like Kyrie Irving on an ACL injury,

1527
01:11:47,560 --> 01:11:51,640
Durant aged thirty seven, three years, So you're right, I

1528
01:11:51,680 --> 01:11:54,199
don't know. It's not that this team, I'll say they

1529
01:11:54,319 --> 01:11:56,279
it's not that they don't have outs, and you could

1530
01:11:56,399 --> 01:11:58,600
argue the extent of those outs because of where their

1531
01:11:58,640 --> 01:12:01,520
picks are going. It's not like, again, this isn't convenient.

1532
01:12:01,600 --> 01:12:03,560
Like with Phoenix. You look at Houston, it's like we

1533
01:12:03,600 --> 01:12:06,520
get control of three of our first round picks back

1534
01:12:06,600 --> 01:12:10,039
if we wanted to, or assuming up to three, I

1535
01:12:10,039 --> 01:12:12,279
should say you won't have that opportunity. But it's like

1536
01:12:12,319 --> 01:12:16,039
you sort of alluded to, they have outs, we just

1537
01:12:16,079 --> 01:12:19,239
don't believe that they're willing to explore them like. They

1538
01:12:19,279 --> 01:12:23,600
seem more likely to chase good money after bad now

1539
01:12:23,720 --> 01:12:26,199
because of the Lukadac's trading. But that's what they were

1540
01:12:26,199 --> 01:12:30,079
doing unprompted, was like throwing good money after bad, So

1541
01:12:30,439 --> 01:12:32,960
why would you ever. It's sort of an analog for

1542
01:12:33,000 --> 01:12:35,960
the Kings where we don't trust ownership. We don't trust

1543
01:12:35,960 --> 01:12:38,880
ownership or the front office to make the right decisions. Here,

1544
01:12:39,800 --> 01:12:42,720
I could see them being a little less screwed than

1545
01:12:43,239 --> 01:12:47,600
Milwaukee just because their best player right now, not neither

1546
01:12:47,640 --> 01:12:49,199
of their two best players are gonna go to them

1547
01:12:49,239 --> 01:12:50,920
and ask for out over the summer, I wouldn't think,

1548
01:12:50,960 --> 01:12:54,000
unless you believe Anthony Davis might like if that's a

1549
01:12:54,000 --> 01:12:57,439
possibility in Milwaukee, I could see a scenario in which

1550
01:12:57,760 --> 01:12:59,800
dam and door Giannis go to them like and if

1551
01:12:59,800 --> 01:13:02,319
one ask for out, the other is gonna probably ask

1552
01:13:02,319 --> 01:13:04,359
her out too. So that would be my argument to

1553
01:13:04,399 --> 01:13:07,560
have Milwaukee over them. But I also trust Milwaukee's decision

1554
01:13:07,560 --> 01:13:10,239
making process at this point way more than Dallas's.

1555
01:13:10,359 --> 01:13:13,039
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's it's just the top thing if it's

1556
01:13:13,039 --> 01:13:15,640
not owner. If you it's ownership, and then it's management,

1557
01:13:15,800 --> 01:13:19,159
and it's they're very much related. But it's like, yeah,

1558
01:13:19,279 --> 01:13:21,560
if you if you zoomed all the way out and

1559
01:13:21,600 --> 01:13:24,439
you pretended that nobody had any stakes in the current roster,

1560
01:13:25,039 --> 01:13:28,399
you would trade Anthony Davis the first second you could,

1561
01:13:28,640 --> 01:13:31,319
because that's the only way you say. I think, I think,

1562
01:13:31,359 --> 01:13:33,600
or at least if you're really trying to like reset things,

1563
01:13:33,600 --> 01:13:35,560
that's what you do, and that's it's hard for me

1564
01:13:35,600 --> 01:13:36,520
to imagine that happening.

1565
01:13:37,159 --> 01:13:39,000
Speaker 1: I stand corrected by the way they got the twenty

1566
01:13:39,000 --> 01:13:40,880
twenty nine first round pick from the Lakers, not the

1567
01:13:40,920 --> 01:13:42,560
twenty twenty seven, so that.

1568
01:13:42,640 --> 01:13:44,039
Speaker 2: Probably everybody knew what you meant.

1569
01:13:44,640 --> 01:13:46,760
Speaker 1: That's more valuable, I guess than twenty twenty seven. But

1570
01:13:46,800 --> 01:13:50,039
also it's tough to build those distant first round picks.

1571
01:13:50,119 --> 01:13:52,840
Is like the entire kit and kaboodle, and it's not like,

1572
01:13:52,920 --> 01:13:56,079
where's the unless you're trading Derek Lively, where's the blue

1573
01:13:56,159 --> 01:14:00,760
chip upside trade asset on this team? I don't see

1574
01:14:00,760 --> 01:14:03,039
one this next one grand screws score of ten. Would

1575
01:14:03,039 --> 01:14:05,439
you say it's arguable or I'd love.

1576
01:14:05,279 --> 01:14:09,199
Speaker 2: To hear the argument against it? Phoenix Suns screwed score

1577
01:14:09,239 --> 01:14:12,640
ten maxed out the screwed score, the screwed meter. It's

1578
01:14:12,720 --> 01:14:15,640
just actually right, that's what we should have done. We

1579
01:14:15,640 --> 01:14:17,600
should have jumped right from nine to eleven. It just

1580
01:14:17,600 --> 01:14:20,439
like put a graphic up there of like a broken thermometer,

1581
01:14:20,640 --> 01:14:22,800
like shooting out the top or like the needle, just

1582
01:14:22,840 --> 01:14:27,079
like pinging against the red line. I think I would

1583
01:14:27,079 --> 01:14:29,359
start again. This has kind of been the through line,

1584
01:14:29,399 --> 01:14:31,640
I guess, of all but Milwaukee here in the in

1585
01:14:31,680 --> 01:14:36,840
the most screwed teams. I just I mean, ownership is

1586
01:14:37,199 --> 01:14:41,640
saying we, like, who wants to see a re who

1587
01:14:41,960 --> 01:14:45,000
I'm paraphrasing now, who wants to see us act rationally

1588
01:14:45,119 --> 01:14:48,159
and acknowledge the rules and restrictions that govern every team

1589
01:14:48,159 --> 01:14:51,399
in the league? Like who wants that? Fans don't want that.

1590
01:14:51,840 --> 01:14:54,039
I mean, I don't want to speak for all fans,

1591
01:14:54,039 --> 01:14:57,279
but I think fans want to believe that their team

1592
01:14:57,359 --> 01:15:00,640
is being run like competently and like in a way

1593
01:15:00,680 --> 01:15:06,279
that acknowledges like how smart teams are built. And like

1594
01:15:06,319 --> 01:15:08,680
that there are rules here to be adhered to in penalties.

1595
01:15:08,960 --> 01:15:12,079
God knows that are in place to keep you from

1596
01:15:12,119 --> 01:15:15,680
doing dumb stuff. And just so, Phoenix just to me

1597
01:15:16,520 --> 01:15:20,199
feels like the team most disconnected from reality and that

1598
01:15:20,239 --> 01:15:27,239
puts them like farthest away from competency. That said, there

1599
01:15:27,279 --> 01:15:31,680
is no debate. Phoenix does have outs, Like specifically with Houston,

1600
01:15:31,760 --> 01:15:33,560
you go get your picks back, if that cost you

1601
01:15:33,600 --> 01:15:36,720
Devin Booker, if that cost you Kevin Durant, whatever, if

1602
01:15:36,720 --> 01:15:40,600
you trade one, you're almost definitely trading both. So like

1603
01:15:40,680 --> 01:15:42,720
you could see a scenario where the Suns get their

1604
01:15:42,760 --> 01:15:46,399
picks back, get other picks, and then are like, oh, okay,

1605
01:15:46,439 --> 01:15:48,199
well they're just kind of a middling team on the

1606
01:15:48,199 --> 01:15:50,479
way up. Now that the draft assets have been like

1607
01:15:50,560 --> 01:15:54,960
somewhat replenished. What about the way this team has been

1608
01:15:55,039 --> 01:15:57,479
run so far leads you to believe that that's like

1609
01:15:57,600 --> 01:16:01,039
even a discussion right now. That's the thing, whatever outs

1610
01:16:01,079 --> 01:16:05,159
there are, just ownership is saying we're not interested. So

1611
01:16:05,399 --> 01:16:07,560
I like, I don't know where to go from there.

1612
01:16:07,600 --> 01:16:10,439
Like we could just talk about the financial complications, we

1613
01:16:10,439 --> 01:16:13,279
could talk about how the core guys don't fit together.

1614
01:16:13,319 --> 01:16:15,560
We could talk about being like anchored to Bradley Beale

1615
01:16:15,560 --> 01:16:18,119
because you kept the no trade clause and he's in

1616
01:16:18,199 --> 01:16:21,239
charge still, but it is it's the main thing, is

1617
01:16:21,279 --> 01:16:24,720
the main thing, which is that ownership has acted like

1618
01:16:25,279 --> 01:16:29,520
beyond rashly from the jump and continues to seem like

1619
01:16:29,640 --> 01:16:30,479
that's the plan.

1620
01:16:31,239 --> 01:16:34,960
Speaker 1: It's yeah, and I think if you told me they

1621
01:16:34,960 --> 01:16:36,359
were gonna you shouldn't trust them to do this. I

1622
01:16:36,359 --> 01:16:40,279
know they proactively shopped Kevin Durant with Devin Booker specifically,

1623
01:16:40,279 --> 01:16:43,000
and he recently talked about how you're never gonna get

1624
01:16:43,000 --> 01:16:45,039
the same love as from the franchise that drafts. If

1625
01:16:45,079 --> 01:16:47,399
he wants to be there, that's on that's up to him,

1626
01:16:47,439 --> 01:16:49,920
But organizationally speaking, I think it would make more sense

1627
01:16:50,199 --> 01:16:52,960
to whether he wants to be there or not, moving

1628
01:16:53,039 --> 01:16:54,800
him would be what's in the best interests of the

1629
01:16:54,840 --> 01:16:57,520
future of your franchise. They're not. Even though we see

1630
01:16:57,560 --> 01:17:00,000
them proactively moving Kevin Durant, it doesn't seem like they

1631
01:17:00,079 --> 01:17:03,359
would be the instigators of a Devin Booker trade, and

1632
01:17:03,439 --> 01:17:06,319
so that's going to diminish the trust factor, and then

1633
01:17:06,359 --> 01:17:11,199
it's let's the out, could be okay, you're trading Kevin Durant.

1634
01:17:11,439 --> 01:17:13,560
You're not gonna get all your picks back if Houston's

1635
01:17:13,560 --> 01:17:17,560
getting involved, And what is the what is the way

1636
01:17:17,960 --> 01:17:20,560
in which you trade Kevin Durant and at least remain

1637
01:17:21,239 --> 01:17:23,319
or have a better year next year than you did

1638
01:17:23,319 --> 01:17:25,359
this season? Like, what is the return on even let's

1639
01:17:25,359 --> 01:17:27,720
say you win the trade or get a good return

1640
01:17:27,720 --> 01:17:29,800
for him, which, by the way, that's not a given

1641
01:17:29,880 --> 01:17:33,640
because this team has not won a single trade since

1642
01:17:33,760 --> 01:17:37,159
Matt Ishbia took over, except for the Royce O'Neil one

1643
01:17:37,239 --> 01:17:39,239
ended up being good, Like even the Grayson Allen one

1644
01:17:39,319 --> 01:17:41,560
has been a little whatever when you kind of trace

1645
01:17:41,600 --> 01:17:43,640
that back to everything in his season and the extension

1646
01:17:43,680 --> 01:17:46,720
they give him. So why do we trust that they're

1647
01:17:46,720 --> 01:17:49,840
gonna get like this great return for Kevin Durant, even

1648
01:17:49,880 --> 01:17:53,800
if they do like picks are like, I would be

1649
01:17:53,840 --> 01:17:55,680
shocked if they got the level of picks that then

1650
01:17:55,800 --> 01:17:57,920
allow them to turn around and trade for someone who

1651
01:17:57,960 --> 01:18:00,920
does optimize a win now window. And I'm certainly gonna

1652
01:18:00,920 --> 01:18:03,560
be surprised if they get a player instead of the picks,

1653
01:18:03,560 --> 01:18:06,079
Like just out of the Kevin Durant trade off rip,

1654
01:18:06,279 --> 01:18:08,399
I just don't like even the teams that are being

1655
01:18:08,439 --> 01:18:11,920
mentioned as the ones that had mutual interest. I guess

1656
01:18:12,000 --> 01:18:14,800
Houston's the best one. But how deep into their war

1657
01:18:14,920 --> 01:18:17,439
chest are they gonna like dig for a thirty seven

1658
01:18:17,479 --> 01:18:20,079
year old soon to be thirty seven year old Kevin Durant.

1659
01:18:20,119 --> 01:18:22,560
I know him and he Mayo Joker are tight. I

1660
01:18:22,600 --> 01:18:25,560
think Rockets fans underestimate and we'll see who's right who's wrong.

1661
01:18:25,720 --> 01:18:27,920
I think they underestimate how much the offense is gonna

1662
01:18:27,920 --> 01:18:30,680
struggle in a playoff setting. Durant fixes a lot of that,

1663
01:18:30,880 --> 01:18:33,520
but like, that's not that's a two year You make

1664
01:18:33,560 --> 01:18:35,960
that move for the next two years if that like

1665
01:18:36,000 --> 01:18:38,399
it's a year by year thing. That's what makes this

1666
01:18:38,479 --> 01:18:40,119
even tell is if you kind of throw the front

1667
01:18:40,159 --> 01:18:42,960
office of it all and matt Ishbia out of the equation.

1668
01:18:43,880 --> 01:18:46,479
Even if the Suns wanted to act like a proper organization,

1669
01:18:46,880 --> 01:18:48,640
you could actually make the case that what if Kalen

1670
01:18:48,680 --> 01:18:51,359
Green kills it or the Rockets kill in general, kill

1671
01:18:51,439 --> 01:18:54,039
in the conference finals and they're not giving you back

1672
01:18:54,079 --> 01:18:56,800
all your picks to get Devin Booker, that's the.

1673
01:18:56,760 --> 01:18:59,840
Speaker 2: Whole thing is it's like, Okay, the Suns, Devin Booker asked,

1674
01:18:59,840 --> 01:19:03,560
to be traded. I want to go to Houston or not,

1675
01:19:03,760 --> 01:19:07,159
but let's just to make it as favorable I don't know,

1676
01:19:07,159 --> 01:19:10,000
realistic as possible. So the Sons in Houston are gonna transact,

1677
01:19:10,039 --> 01:19:13,119
and Devin Booker is gonna be involved. I still think

1678
01:19:13,159 --> 01:19:17,239
Houston can just take the hardest line imaginable because like,

1679
01:19:17,760 --> 01:19:22,920
all right, so either you accept a pick package from

1680
01:19:23,039 --> 01:19:25,479
us involving your own picks that's like not gonna be

1681
01:19:25,520 --> 01:19:29,399
all of them, or we walk away. You're stuck with

1682
01:19:29,479 --> 01:19:32,680
Devin Booker, who now is like asked to be traded.

1683
01:19:32,960 --> 01:19:34,720
You got to go send him somewhere else that doesn't

1684
01:19:34,760 --> 01:19:38,039
get you your own picks. Like just even if even

1685
01:19:38,079 --> 01:19:41,039
if it's a Booker to Houston deal, the Sons are

1686
01:19:41,039 --> 01:19:43,880
gonna be have like zero leverage because the Rockets know

1687
01:19:43,960 --> 01:19:46,319
we got the thing you need, like you need this

1688
01:19:46,439 --> 01:19:48,840
if you're gonna have a lifeline to respectability at some

1689
01:19:48,960 --> 01:19:52,119
point in the next decade, like what, We're not gonna

1690
01:19:52,159 --> 01:19:54,520
We're gonna drive the hardest bargain you can imagine. And

1691
01:19:54,560 --> 01:19:56,359
because like what are you gonna do as the Suns

1692
01:19:56,359 --> 01:19:58,720
if if if the price is like we'll give you

1693
01:19:59,000 --> 01:20:02,119
one first and Matt salary for Devin Booker, it'll be yours,

1694
01:20:02,199 --> 01:20:05,439
your your first and it's like the Suns just have

1695
01:20:05,479 --> 01:20:08,520
to I mean usually teams aren't that unreasonable, but like

1696
01:20:08,680 --> 01:20:12,000
Houston could just turn the screws so hard and so like,

1697
01:20:12,119 --> 01:20:15,520
even if you're doing the thing we're saying you should do, Sons,

1698
01:20:15,960 --> 01:20:18,920
you've positioned yourself in a way that's like you're just

1699
01:20:18,960 --> 01:20:21,039
gonna get pennies on the dollar for what you should

1700
01:20:21,039 --> 01:20:22,359
have been able to do in a trade.

1701
01:20:22,760 --> 01:20:24,439
Speaker 1: And then you go like you could go through the

1702
01:20:24,439 --> 01:20:26,119
other teams that aren't Houston that were on that list

1703
01:20:26,119 --> 01:20:27,720
where it's like, well, what is Miami giving you that's

1704
01:20:27,720 --> 01:20:29,920
gonna make you feel good about your team immediately? What

1705
01:20:30,079 --> 01:20:32,680
is New York? Like? Are you that interested in Karl

1706
01:20:32,720 --> 01:20:36,000
Anthony Towns? What is the team that's semi interesting would be, oh,

1707
01:20:36,000 --> 01:20:37,800
I guess Golden State. If it was like a Jimmy

1708
01:20:37,840 --> 01:20:41,119
Butler for Katie Swap, perhaps uh. And then if you

1709
01:20:41,159 --> 01:20:43,359
could get I think there's really only one scenario where

1710
01:20:43,399 --> 01:20:46,079
if your Phoenix, that maybe you could feel a little

1711
01:20:46,079 --> 01:20:48,760
bit better about yourself relative to this season. Not even look,

1712
01:20:48,840 --> 01:20:51,279
your screw factor is still probably pretty high. But if

1713
01:20:51,319 --> 01:20:54,840
you traded Kevin Durant and you got Jade McDaniels and

1714
01:20:54,840 --> 01:20:57,560
then one of nas Reed or Rude Gobert. I think

1715
01:20:57,640 --> 01:21:00,640
that would set you up to be interesting year for sure.

1716
01:21:00,720 --> 01:21:03,880
Now how interesting I don't know. But the bigger question

1717
01:21:03,880 --> 01:21:07,279
would be, is Minnesota giving up two of those guys

1718
01:21:07,319 --> 01:21:11,520
to get Kevin Durant? I don't. I would probably say no,

1719
01:21:11,920 --> 01:21:13,239
but I don't. I honestly don't know.

1720
01:21:13,359 --> 01:21:16,119
Speaker 2: It's hard to say yeah, you know, they just they

1721
01:21:16,159 --> 01:21:18,359
don't have That's why they're That's why they have the

1722
01:21:18,399 --> 01:21:21,159
highest screwed scores. It's really hard to concoct scenarios where

1723
01:21:21,159 --> 01:21:22,840
it's like they cut the suns come out the other

1724
01:21:22,920 --> 01:21:26,239
side and it doesn't feel like they're still gonna be

1725
01:21:26,600 --> 01:21:29,039
in deep trouble through twenty thirty.

1726
01:21:29,199 --> 01:21:31,520
Speaker 1: There's one scenario it's I would forget about. I mean,

1727
01:21:31,520 --> 01:21:33,119
this year's pick, if they if it ends up being

1728
01:21:33,159 --> 01:21:35,199
like really high in the lottery, should they miss the

1729
01:21:35,319 --> 01:21:37,640
plan and not make it out? But like it's the

1730
01:21:38,119 --> 01:21:40,199
like getting a couple of the more distant picks back,

1731
01:21:40,239 --> 01:21:42,079
like if you get the two artis Houston have twenty

1732
01:21:42,119 --> 01:21:43,880
seven and twenty nine in addition to this year, I

1733
01:21:43,880 --> 01:21:47,239
think the control whatever it is, Like, would you argue

1734
01:21:47,279 --> 01:21:49,319
that it's bigger or is that even more problematic because

1735
01:21:49,319 --> 01:21:51,600
it's like, well, why are we doing this now? If

1736
01:21:51,720 --> 01:21:54,359
we're like there's still gonna be like gaps in when

1737
01:21:54,399 --> 01:21:57,479
we own our own first round pick, you could say

1738
01:21:57,520 --> 01:21:59,680
just the I think the one saving grace would be

1739
01:21:59,720 --> 01:22:02,159
what we they're not gonna do is can you get

1740
01:22:02,319 --> 01:22:06,279
all your picks back from Houston for Devin Booker? But

1741
01:22:06,279 --> 01:22:08,600
like he even that is sort of all right.

1742
01:22:09,119 --> 01:22:12,159
Speaker 2: And if you're Houston too, don't you think, like Devin

1743
01:22:12,159 --> 01:22:13,319
Booker is a really good player?

1744
01:22:13,439 --> 01:22:13,600
Speaker 1: Is he?

1745
01:22:14,399 --> 01:22:19,479
Speaker 2: It's top fifteen, top twenty probably, Like I think there's

1746
01:22:19,520 --> 01:22:23,720
a lot of other guys that you could target, Like

1747
01:22:23,840 --> 01:22:28,239
the Phoenix needs to transact with Houston. Houston does not

1748
01:22:28,359 --> 01:22:30,439
have to transact with Phoenix, Like it doesn't have to

1749
01:22:30,479 --> 01:22:34,079
be Booker for the Rockets, but like they the Sun's

1750
01:22:34,119 --> 01:22:36,520
got to deal with Houston. So it's just like it's

1751
01:22:36,560 --> 01:22:39,920
such an inequitable negotiating situation.

1752
01:22:39,640 --> 01:22:42,720
Speaker 1: And to the Suns it has to be like imminently palatable.

1753
01:22:42,760 --> 01:22:45,479
So okay, let's say you trade Devin Booker and if

1754
01:22:45,520 --> 01:22:47,479
you get this year's first round pick back which is

1755
01:22:47,520 --> 01:22:49,720
slated to be like what tenth or something. Now, all

1756
01:22:49,720 --> 01:22:52,119
of a sudden, you have no Devin Booker, not your

1757
01:22:52,119 --> 01:22:53,760
own first round pick. Next year as soon as you

1758
01:22:53,800 --> 01:22:55,960
can get would be twenty seven. After that, I could

1759
01:22:56,000 --> 01:22:57,520
see them be like, well, even if he has an

1760
01:22:57,520 --> 01:22:59,479
ass round, we want to be proactive. Why wouldn't we

1761
01:22:59,560 --> 01:23:03,039
just wait in other year? Yeah, they are the most screwed.

1762
01:23:03,039 --> 01:23:05,680
I think it's I think it's incontestable. I like, does

1763
01:23:05,760 --> 01:23:07,960
Dallas or Milwaukee have a case over them?

1764
01:23:08,119 --> 01:23:09,600
Speaker 2: No, it's got to be Phoenix.

1765
01:23:09,640 --> 01:23:14,199
Speaker 1: We get it. That was our screwed score rankings and

1766
01:23:14,199 --> 01:23:16,039
what a screwed stand for? Grant?

1767
01:23:16,159 --> 01:23:19,279
Speaker 2: Oh, you don't even have the graphic up. Shit could

1768
01:23:19,560 --> 01:23:24,560
realistically end with extensive detonation to get it.

1769
01:23:24,560 --> 01:23:27,159
Speaker 1: Got it? Remember that the screwed score it will return.

1770
01:23:27,199 --> 01:23:28,840
I think we need to make this. We enjoyed it,

1771
01:23:28,880 --> 01:23:30,279
so hopefully you enjoyed it as well.

1772
01:23:30,760 --> 01:23:33,199
Speaker 2: I'm all four acronyms. I think we should go forward

1773
01:23:33,239 --> 01:23:36,800
with any any set of rankings or or things like

1774
01:23:36,840 --> 01:23:38,600
that we come up with, needs an acronym.

1775
01:23:39,039 --> 01:23:40,399
Speaker 1: Are you ready to take us out of here?

1776
01:23:40,439 --> 01:23:43,760
Speaker 2: Sir? Thank you, yes, Dan, I am. Thanks everybody for listening.

1777
01:23:43,800 --> 01:23:47,359
For watching, please rate, review, subscribe Wherever you're listening to this.

1778
01:23:47,399 --> 01:23:49,119
If you're watching us on YouTube, leave us a comment.

1779
01:23:49,159 --> 01:23:51,000
Let us know what you think like these are. These

1780
01:23:51,000 --> 01:23:53,800
are debatable rankings.

1781
01:23:53,039 --> 01:23:55,600
Speaker 1: To say the least, your I mean, this is your latest.

1782
01:23:55,640 --> 01:23:56,640
It is metric.

1783
01:23:56,920 --> 01:24:00,920
Speaker 2: You're right, it's been vetted by several scientists and engineers,

1784
01:24:01,199 --> 01:24:03,359
so you know, argue with them, I guess, but you know,

1785
01:24:03,560 --> 01:24:05,880
leave a comment anyway. It helps you out room, join

1786
01:24:05,920 --> 01:24:08,119
our discord links for that on YouTube and podcast description.

1787
01:24:08,399 --> 01:24:10,880
I think that's going to cover it. Shouts to Frank milachinopologies.

1788
01:24:11,000 --> 01:24:11,520
Speaker 1: Jared Allen