Speaker 1: What Up? What Up? What Up? What Up? Everybody? Welcome
to another episode of Let's Ask Paul, the podcast where
you can ask me Paul Abernathy anything you want on
the National Electrical Code and of course all things electrically related.
Thanks for joining us on the podcast. Hopefully this is
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well today's episode, I did have a question that came
in and I wanted to address it in this question.
It's about a change that's coming or they heard that
there's a change coming to the twenty twenty six edition
of the National Electrical Code and they wanted to know
how we'll impact them. So I'll read it and of
course then we'll dig deep into it and elaborate on
it because it is a change that will impact you,
even if you're in the twenty seventeen or twenty twenty,
it's going to impact you in a sense that it's
going to do something that you don't really have to
do anything, but it's going to fix itself in case
you run into that random issue with an inspector who
makes a statement because they don't understand and listings. But
you're gonna be covered. And that's what we're going to
talk about today. So here's what it says. It says, Hey, Paul,
love the podcast. I love joining you every morning on
coffee Hour. I have a question. I'm hearing through the
grapevine that in the twenty twenty sixth edition of the
National Electrical Code that the fasteners i e. Staples, straps,
hangars are going to be required to be listed where
they've never been required to be listed before. Is this true?
Or am I hearing rumors like the old TikTok rumors
that I know you hate. Thanks? What does he say here? Oh?
He says, thank you for all you do for the industry,
and I look forward to hearing your reply. All right,
so great, I thank you for that. That was also
done from over at Paul Abernathy dot com where you
can submit things to, and I will start out by
you know, people always say, Paul, you're very long win
and so if you ever thought of doing an executive summary, okay,
so I'm going to do one right now. My executive
summary is you are one hundred percent correct that they
are going to be moving to require listing for staples,
straps and hangars moving forward in the twenty twenty six
edition of the National Electrical Code. Now that's going to
be in the dot two, which is going to be
now where we go to listings for different wiring methods.
So it's going to tell you different things. So for
my example today, I'll just make it easy for us.
We will look at non metallic sheath cable Article three
thirty four. Well, look at that, because that's the one
I feel that impacts the most people because we're so
used to using staples, and you know, you get staples
you simply. You know, I teach apprentices, actually believe it
or not, I would teach them how to drive a staple,
because there's a misconception about like they have to drive
the freaking stables staples so tight to you know, to
basically almost embed the cable into the wood. And that's
not how you drive a staple. I tell students all
the time, you know, drive it until it barely touches
the cable, or just shy of touching the cable. It's
perfectly fine. All it's there to do is hold it
in place, right, so you know, keep it in the
in the middle of the framing member, that type of scenario. Right. Okay,
So we're going to see a change in the twenty
twenty sixth edition of the National Electrical Code. It's nothing
so much that you electricians have to worry about. This
really has the manufacturers scrambling, and the manufacturers are scrambling
because staples, straps, hangars have never been required to be
listed before as far as the National Electrical Code, although
there is a UL standard out there regarding it, and
that UL standard is twenty two thirty nine and it
has been around for quite a long time. The name
of that standard is the Standard for Safety for Hardware
for the Support of Conduit, Tubing and Cable and that
was actually introduced nearly twenty years ago, so it's not
something new. But as far as the National Electrical Code
was concerned, as far as manufacturers who made those securing
and supporting components that hardware like staples and straps, they
never had to go through that evaluation. So now all
of the manufacturers of staples, straps, and hangars are going
to be going through evaluation and trying to get their
products evaluated before the twenty twenty six NEC is published
and if they're after the publisher, typically it's a little
bit of a lag time before any states adopted. Usually
like Massachusetts is the first. You know, I lie the
area of NFPA if you will, But they'll get it
and then states will start to adopt it. Next they'll
come will probably be like Texas and whatnot. So the
manufacturers realize that under the twenty twenty six code, if
they don't have a listed strap, staple or hanger, then
they will not be able to have a compliant electrical
install because it requires that they be listed splices, listed straps,
listed hangers, right, And they're like, okay, well we have
to rapidly get our products evaluated. Well, that's great for
the third party, the nrtls like the ul and ETL,
Innertech and all these other If they actually evaluate to
twenty two thirty nine, then they're like, bring it to me, baby,
Bring it to me, you know, because the fastening folks
never had to go through this before unless they did
it voluntarily. Now they do, and so that's where you're
going to see the scramble now as far as the
electricians concerned, if you're in the twenty seventeen, say in Tennessee,
some of those areas that are still lingering behind, Hey, Tennessee,
wake up, come on, or other states that are lingering behind.
It doesn't matter whether it's twenty seventeen, twenty twenty, twenty
twenty three. Currently in those editions of the NEC, it's
not a requirement for the fasteners like staples, straps, and
hangars to be listed. Now they may be identified for
specific application, and that's what they've been getting away with,
but they're not listed. But there was nothing in the
e NEEC that required them to be listed. And many
people confused the part of the code where it's said
that the cable and the fittings have to be listed,
and so they would say, well, I consider the strap
or the staple to be a fitting. Well, we use
that as inspecters as a way to impose that. But
the reality is, if that would be me telling you
you can't use any staples in a a dwelling, for example,
because I think that there need to be listed well
moving forward in the twenty twenty six edition, they will be,
and by manufacturers doing this, you're not going to have
to worry about it regardless of a previous edition of
the NEEC when it comes to any of that argument,
because obviously the products that you're going to buy are
going to be listed moving forward in that date. So
twenty twenty six is going to requirement. So that's the
manufacturers are all racing to get that done, right. Okay,
So but what I wanted to kind of show you
a little bit, or at least I would talk about
it is what does it say? And we'll talk about
the two significant ones that I think is three thirty
four for non metallic sheet cable and then of course
MC cable because that's pound for pound. There's probably more
of that product installed per foot that we have to
worry about. And yes, there's a lot of raceways out there,
and yes it you know, the rules are still going
to apply, uh to for example, EMT, because if you
go look at EMT, it's gonna pretty much say the
same type of thing, if you will. Right, it's basically
the listing and so associated fittings, factory elbows, em t
all that that type of stuff. But it's not going
to say it in the same language as it is
for the nonmatology cable and for like something like an
MC cable. Right, it's just gonna say it differently. Right.
So that's the that's the thing that we want to
talk about and point out. So let's do that first.
Let's look at three thirty four in the twenty twenty
sixth edition of the NEC And we can do that
because you can go in and look at it at
the second draft stage, and of course we've been through
the nitmams. They're done and all that type of stuff,
and so we can go look at it. So first
thing we want to look at is that dot two. Okay,
So three thirty four dot two is going to be
the listing requirement section. Now it's not dot six anymore.
It's going to be dot two. And what it says
here is it says listing. Now. One of the things
that I will tell you is that everything goes through
what we call a public input and then the community
people get to look at it and see what was
done whatever the code Panel accepted, and then of course
it goes back out for publication, and then other people
will submit things to it and say, well I disagree
with this or that, and some did send in some
public comments that says, you know what, I don't believe
staples need to be listed. What's any different A Staple's
a staple. I mean, you're not going to do anything
different to it. So is a listed staple going to
be any different than an unlisted staple? And only difference
is somebody manufacturer is going to have to pay a
bunch of money to get their product listed now, and
it's exact same product. It's exact same thing. Okay, So anyway,
so let's kind of look at what you're going to
see in your twenty twenty six edition of the NEEC.
It's going to say listing requirements. It says the following
items shall be listed and identified. So it's not only
to be listed for use with in this case, non
metallic sheaf cable, but it also has to make sure
that there's identifications or an identifier that's for use with
a non metallic sheaf cable. Number one obviously listed and
labeled type NM an NMC cable. And by the way,
I don't believe anybody makes the NMC anymore. It would
be the non it would be UF that would take
the place of an NMC. So three Article three forty
we follow those rules typically, and they're going to kick
you back to three thirty four for installations. So nm
cable NMC obviously has to be listed. Next it says
cable ties, staples, straps, and hangars. So now, previously cable
ties did need to be listed, okay, but you know,
for securing and supporting. But here it's just now adding straps,
it's adding staples, and it's adding hangers. All these now
have to be listed. So that means that the manufacturers
are going to have to submit their products for evaluation
under UL twenty two to thirty nine, which has again
been around for nearly two decades, and they're going to
have to pay. And what that is also going to
mean at the price of those little things that you
see laying all over the floor that your apprentices and
your helpers don't seem to care a lot about, but you,
as an owner go around and say, pick up that staple,
pick up that wire nut. Okay, so at the end
of the day, staples are lobbled to increase in cost.
And you're probably thinking, I don't care, it's not that
much of an increase. But if manufacturers have to get
evaluations done and they're gonna pay, and I can tell
you in the wiring cable industry, we pay per the
foot of the use of a third party mark. It's
not a one time fee. For example, we pay per
use of foot and are selected in RTL that we choose.
Same thing's gonna happen. Are the manufacturers of staples gonna
have to pay per five hundred staples or per staple
or per box or per I don't know how that's
gonna go, but it means that the manufacturers of these
fasteners are going to now maybe not even changed what
they do. They're not gonna change anything on their staple,
but they're going to now have to have it evaluated
and they're gonna pay more money for it for that evaluation.
And what does that do? That means the cost of
your products are going to go up as well, okay,
and you're gonna have to carry that over to your customer.
And then lastly, it says the NM and NMC cable
fittings used for connecting cable to boxes, cabinets or other equipment. Again,
so those are the actual fittings that are going to
do like a connector or whatnot that's going to transition
the cable assembly to the actual box or cabinet right
or other piece of equipment. That's a fitting. So that's
got to be listed and again evaluated for use with
the cable. That type of thing. We have to make
sure clamping it down doesn't damage it compress it. But again,
you can't fix stupid. So you can take a staple
in an unlisted staple versus a listed staple, it's still
going to be the same staple, and it still could
be driven too far and it still could cause a problem. Now,
I did not like the substantiation that was submitted by
the gentleman that submitted it because I believe that he
has a vested interest in his public input. So I
don't kind of like that. But at the end of
the day, he makes a statement that it's going to
make the staple safer, and I don't know how in
the world that would make the staples safer. I really don't.
But at the end of the day, it is going
to drive up the cost of staples. Right, So keep
you know, always keep that in mind. Now when it
comes to the next one, which is also and we're
just choosing two for this podcast, is the MC cable
metal clad cable, right, And it says basically the exact
same thing. It tells you that the MC cable shall
be listed identified, which already was requirement for the MC cable,
and that would go the same for the fittings that
transition from the cable into a box or cabinet. That
did not change. But what they added was that the
cable ties, staples, straps, and hangars, okay, are to be
listed and actually identified for their application. Now, I think
all of the straps and staples and things like that
probably were well at identified by the manufacturer. Obviously, you
buy a box of non metallic sheath cable staples on
the side, it talks about non metallic sheath cable, talks
about the numbered cables that the staple can hold, all
those type of things, depending on the staples link that
you get. I think they probably already do all this stuff.
They just never were forced to have to go meet
Uil twenty two thirty nine. Now some of them may
have done it voluntarily. They just didn't need to print
it on anything because there's you know, there's no requirement,
and you can't say that it's you know, you listed
unless it's evaluated to be a truthful statement. All right,
So what's the point. You're not gonna put the money
in it if you don't have to do it well.
Starting in twenty twenty six, you are going to have
to do it right. So keeping those things in mind
that we're seeing the expansion of that. And again, I'm
not sure I like the Code Panel's statement, but at
the end of the day, it is what it is.
I don't know that the manufacturers, like I said, of
staples and straps, are going to change anything, and I
would expect them to pass the requirements of twenty two
thirty nine unless they're just grossly designed differently. And I
don't know what would be different. I really don't. Is
it the staple with the little insulator in it's going
to be better than the staple without. I know people
love different ones and hate them, but at the end
of the day, it's still a freaking staple. Could say, Okay,
So anyway, we'll see how that pans out. For you
that are in an earlier cycle. You're not gonna have
to worry about it because when this happens, you're just
automatically going to have listed fasteners like that. You're gonna
have listed staples, straps and hangars. You're just gonna have
it that type of thing, all right. So hopefully that
explains that out a little bit. That's what you got
coming for the twenty twenty six when it comes to that,
So get ready for it. But guess what, Just sit back,
relax because you know what I can promise you the
manufacturer of those staples, straps and hangers are scrambling right
now to get their products for evaluation before the twenty
twenty six comes. So there's no blip in the road, right,
no bubble that they got to worry about. Makes sense,
all right, folks. All right, that's it. That's all I
got on this episode. Hope to catch you next time.
Thanks for joining me. Remember if you have any questions
that you want to submit over at Paul Abernathy dot com,
please do so, and I'm more than happy to answer
them either in an email or if selected on an
upcoming podcast just like today's take care, God bless oh,
don't think