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Speaker 1: the show. Welcome Friends Podcasts podcast show Jacky and Brian.
Speaker 1: They're talking about the group back.
Speaker 2: I guess are you ready for the truth? I believe
Speaker 2: comic book heroes walk the air. I believe you have a
Speaker 2: lot of those individuals. It's all right. It could be
Speaker 2: free David. That's this part.
Speaker 1: It would be like a comic book.
Speaker 2: That is winning. It's time for someone like you, Unbreakable.
Speaker 2: Welcome to a movie film commentary track. My name is
Speaker 2: Zachi Hassan, and here is the David Dunn to my
Speaker 2: Elijah Price, Brian Hall.
Speaker 1: Hey, how's it going, Zachie?
Speaker 2: Brian when he woke up this morning, was the sadness gone?
Speaker 1: Yes, because I knew I was going to be recording
Speaker 1: with you, because I think that's my purpose.
Speaker 2: Just stay out of the water and you'll be fine.
Speaker 1: That's right, that's right.
Speaker 2: We are here to watch and talk through two thousands Unbreakable.
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is when you brought this up, I was like,
Speaker 1: of course, Unbreakable. I love Unbreakable. This is just one
Speaker 1: of those obvious ones. I can't believe we haven't done yet.
Speaker 2: This is a fun one in the sense that it's
Speaker 2: it's been interesting to watch over the last quarter century
Speaker 2: as its reputation has grown.
Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, I mean that was an interesting part of
Speaker 1: this for me because I do remember. I'll talk about
Speaker 1: it a little bit more, but I remember liking this, right,
Speaker 1: off the bat. But even the same night, people within
Speaker 1: my friend group were split on it. And I saw it.
Speaker 1: You say, oh, and we'll talk about that experience. By
Speaker 1: the way, that was incredible. But I saw that this
Speaker 1: had a cinema score of c as like early cow
Speaker 1: all right. I don't know. I only remember how I
Speaker 1: felt about it, maybe because it was less of an
Speaker 1: Internet age than we're living in now, where I know, yeah,
Speaker 1: what everybody thinks about everything. But this is gonna be
Speaker 1: fun to get into.
Speaker 2: I agree. So there is just the one cut of Unbreakable,
Speaker 2: which makes this conversation a little bit easier. So we're
Speaker 2: gonna get started on this now. Worth mentioning that that
Speaker 2: they have Disney has added a little disclaimer at the
Speaker 2: top that says this film contains tobacco depictions. I think
Speaker 2: that's right.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I have.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And so just for the sake if you're trying
Speaker 2: to time it up, that's the version that we're watching.
Speaker 2: So there there's like a it's like a six second
Speaker 2: thing at the start there. In case your version does
Speaker 2: not have that, just just bear that in mind. Yep,
Speaker 2: there you go.
Speaker 1: Oh, hold on, I have to light up just before
Speaker 1: we record it soothes me, your regular don Draper over there.
Speaker 2: Uh so, uh we going ready to do this? Ready,
Speaker 2: all right, so we will hit play on three one
Speaker 2: two three play and here you go one two three play.
Speaker 1: Contains tobacco depictions. November twenty second, two thousand, when Touchstone
Speaker 1: Pictures was still releasing movies.
Speaker 2: Well, well, this, this movie very much came out in
Speaker 2: the warm afterglow of the Sixth Sense. Yes, just over
Speaker 2: a year prior.
Speaker 1: Very very quick, isn't it, I mean very fast?
Speaker 2: Turned around? Yeah, well, he had started writing the script
Speaker 2: for this while making the Sixth Sense.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I saw. He wrote this as a spec script,
Speaker 1: and he wound up making five million dollars for the
Speaker 1: script and five million dollars to direct it.
Speaker 2: Not too shabby considering he was. He was not even
Speaker 2: thirty at that time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right, twenty nine years old.
Speaker 2: Now. I have to say I felt very targeted by
Speaker 2: this intro thing right here with the text. What do
Speaker 2: you mean about the evils of comic books? Oh?
Speaker 1: Is that is that how you took it?
Speaker 2: I was kind of like, I don't like where this
Speaker 2: is headed. Oh you know, it's funny.
Speaker 1: I took it as a little bit of a No. Seriously,
Speaker 1: this is like big business, and despite how you feel
Speaker 1: about what's coming up, you know, comic books are legit,
Speaker 1: They've been around for a long time, they're you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, almost.
Speaker 2: Like that if that's what you thought at the beginning,
Speaker 2: Definitely by the end, when when the comic book Nerd
Speaker 2: turns out to be the raving psychopath.
Speaker 1: That's so funny. Do you actually is that kind of
Speaker 1: how you view this A.
Speaker 2: Little bit, not so much. I was only kind of
Speaker 2: joking about the beginning, but I definitely remember at the
Speaker 2: end being like, all right, oh guys. I mean there's
Speaker 2: like lots of people who read comics who you know,
Speaker 2: they're fine.
Speaker 1: That is really funny. I guess I never thought of
Speaker 1: it that way. But you know, this is this is
Speaker 1: such an interesting film, isn't it. I mean, there's so
Speaker 1: much to talk about, but like this is. As I
Speaker 1: was watching it, I was thinking, this movie is in
Speaker 1: the year two thousand, ahead of its time, and ironically
Speaker 1: also could have only been made in this time.
Speaker 2: I was I had that exact putt well touching it right.
Speaker 1: This is a movie that should come out right now
Speaker 1: because we are now so steeped in comic book movies
Speaker 1: and culture and whatever that this movie could be I think,
Speaker 1: you know, appreciated by way more people if it were
Speaker 1: to come out now. But they don't make movies like
Speaker 1: this any sort. So yeah, but you know, there was
Speaker 1: a lot of talk about when I was doing research
Speaker 1: on this, about the marketing and uh yeah, yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: and and a lot of I guess coming from Disney
Speaker 1: or whoever, the marketing people, they kind of wanted to
Speaker 1: obscure the fact that this was a comic book movie.
Speaker 2: Actually real, real quick, Brian, before he leaves the stage,
Speaker 2: I did want to Amon Walker, who plays the doctor here.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, he's just up until recently, he was a
Speaker 2: regular on Chicago Fire.
Speaker 1: Oh okay, and you know he's.
Speaker 2: Kind of kind of the grizzled, the veteran. You know.
Speaker 1: Oh that's so funny because he looks so young.
Speaker 2: Here he's a young buckstrap right here. Anyway, he's great.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's a very it's a small part, but
Speaker 1: it's impactful, and it's it's kind of horrifying, you know,
Speaker 1: knowing that this talk about.
Speaker 2: The worst nightmare any new parent could could experience.
Speaker 1: You know, Yeah, this one's just giving birth in a
Speaker 1: department store, and then the baby's arms and legs are broken,
Speaker 1: and and then it's just like fades the Black m
Speaker 1: Night Shemalin Presents. You're like, oh, okay, so this that's
Speaker 1: that's what we're for. And this is kind of a
Speaker 1: you know, serious melancholy movie. Yeah, you know, this isn't
Speaker 1: really a romp, which is kind of interesting. And you
Speaker 1: know this movie too, and this is something I remembered,
Speaker 1: and I was wondering if I would be distracted by
Speaker 1: it or still enamored with it as I was in
Speaker 1: two thousand. But this is a very deliberately paced.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, even more so than The Sixth Sense, Yes,
Speaker 2: which is also deliberately paced.
Speaker 1: But this is very I mean it's a slow burn,
Speaker 1: and there are a lot of movies that are slow burns,
Speaker 1: but I mean, this is a movie that has takes
Speaker 1: that last several minutes. And this, I mean, this is
Speaker 1: a prime example what we're looking at here where we
Speaker 1: see Bruce Willis as David Dunn on the train and
Speaker 1: we go through this whole little short film of he
Speaker 1: seems like kind of a sad person. Yeah, and he's
Speaker 1: wearing this wedding ring and then this cute woman sits
Speaker 1: next to him and he tries to strike up a conversation.
Speaker 1: He goes a little too far, oversteps kind of flirting
Speaker 1: with her, and she decides to leave. Oh, but he
Speaker 1: takes off his wedding ring to have this conversation. Yeah,
Speaker 1: oversteps a little bit. She's uncomfortable, she leaves, he puts
Speaker 1: the ring back on. But the way they do it,
Speaker 1: it's not just I mean, you could imagine that in
Speaker 1: a regular sort of film, but I mean, what we're
Speaker 1: looking at here is the camera is positioned in the
Speaker 1: seats in front of them on this train, and we're
Speaker 1: peaking like we're almost like eavesdropping on this moment right
Speaker 1: as the camera sort of is just looking through the
Speaker 1: cracks of the two seats, going slowly moving back and
Speaker 1: forth and back and forth, picking up on them during
Speaker 1: this moment. It's I remember at the time this was.
Speaker 1: You know, there are certain movies I think when you're
Speaker 1: becoming a sinophile, or you start making your own movies
Speaker 1: and going to film school, or you know, with your
Speaker 1: video camera in your backyard or your phone now, and
Speaker 1: there are things that you see that just spark something
Speaker 1: inside of you and then you start trying to do
Speaker 1: that kind of thing. I remember this.
Speaker 2: Movie was a huge influence on me.
Speaker 1: I did this short film at college, and I remember
Speaker 1: there's a moment where these people are slowly figuring something
Speaker 1: out in a restaurant, and I was like, because I
Speaker 1: had this movie in my mind, it was like the
Speaker 1: camera started like at the entrance of the restaurant and
Speaker 1: it's like a waiter walks in front, and then it
Speaker 1: goes over like a menu and a slowly reaching the
Speaker 1: people as they hit their realization. And I know it
Speaker 1: was because of this. Yeah, the style of this film.
Speaker 2: That's really something. This is such an uncomfortable scene to watch.
Speaker 1: It really is.
Speaker 2: You do sort of a cringe on his behalf you
Speaker 2: a mm hmmm hm.
Speaker 1: And she's good too. The whole well, I guess, I
Speaker 1: guess switch seats. But this is I hadn't seen this
Speaker 1: in a while, and if there were certain things that
Speaker 1: I remember from this, this is actually one of those,
Speaker 1: like moments him taking off the ring then him putting
Speaker 1: the ring back on.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it is a terrific performance by Bruce Willis.
Speaker 1: Yes, and Samuel Jackson. I mean, this is just talk
Speaker 1: about like a gift this script for the both of them,
Speaker 1: you know, for both them.
Speaker 2: And it is funny because we began this year with
Speaker 2: our commentary track for Diehard with a Vengeance, and they're
Speaker 2: playing such different versions of themselves in that, you know,
Speaker 2: mm hmm, yeah, you talk about their their respective range
Speaker 2: as actors. You know.
Speaker 1: I was thinking too, Pulp Fiction wasn't even ten years
Speaker 1: before this, that's right, maybe like six or something, and
Speaker 1: Pulp Fiction was ninety four.
Speaker 2: Diehard was ninety five and this is two thousand. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I hadn't realized how often they had been on
Speaker 1: screen together.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and especially once you factor in glass.
Speaker 1: Yep yep, which.
Speaker 2: Their final, their final pairing.
Speaker 1: It turns out, you know, this was making me want
Speaker 1: to revisit that Yeah, And I was like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: I just remember not really enjoying my time with that one.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So just in preparation for this, I didn't have time
Speaker 1: to watch it. So I was like, all right, I'll
Speaker 1: watch a recap. So I went on YouTube and I
Speaker 1: saw one that was nine minutes. I was like hmmmm,
Speaker 1: And then I saw one that was two minutes, and
Speaker 1: I was like, bingo, Yeah, I'd be curious to watch
Speaker 1: it again now that my expectations are set. Sure, still
Speaker 1: don't know that I would love it, but now that
Speaker 1: I know what it is, and having, you know.
Speaker 2: Just watched this fresh, i'd be kind of curious.
Speaker 1: Yeah, But anyway, so this, I mean, I was a
Speaker 1: huge fan of The Sixth Sense. I mean, it's it's
Speaker 1: worth noting again we both are. And that was one
Speaker 1: of those movies where, now before the movie comes out,
Speaker 1: you would be seeing on like social media or news
Speaker 1: articles or whatever, like you won't believe the ending of
Speaker 1: the Sixth Sense, right, you know, so you're you're walking
Speaker 1: in knowing there's some sort of twist awaiting you. But
Speaker 1: I think we both went in not knowing that there
Speaker 1: was a twist, and so it was just one of
Speaker 1: the most mind blowing, unexpected and satisfying film moments, you know,
Speaker 1: that we had had in a long long time. So
Speaker 1: then when you you know that this this guy who
Speaker 1: you don't know who he is, and night Shyamalan is
Speaker 1: coming out with a new movie, and then I remember
Speaker 1: the trailer was the scene we're going to see in
Speaker 1: a minute where he's at the hospital and it's a
Speaker 1: doctor basically saying you know you or You're involved in
Speaker 1: this train accident and every single person died except you.
Speaker 1: There's not a scratch on you. And it's like from
Speaker 1: the guy who brought you the sixth Sense, You're like, well,
Speaker 1: come on, like sign me up. You know, like huge
Speaker 1: anticipation for this.
Speaker 2: And that gets to Obviously Disney leaned hard into the
Speaker 2: sixth sense of it all in order to sell the movie,
Speaker 2: and I guess that got them a decent opening weekend,
Speaker 2: even though you know, the movie itself did not perform
Speaker 2: at that level. You know, it's just a different movie.
Speaker 2: But Shyamalan has talked about how I mean he wanted
Speaker 2: to I mean, this was his superhero movie, and essentially
Speaker 2: he was told, you can't say superhero right, you get right.
Speaker 2: None of the stuff that would allow you to, you know,
Speaker 2: the stuff you had put in a trailer was available
Speaker 2: to them. And I really think that some of that
Speaker 2: expectation setting would have been very helpful. And I also,
Speaker 2: you know, Quentin Tarantino has talked about about how, I mean,
Speaker 2: for him, this is one of his favorite movies, you know,
Speaker 2: from from the time he started directing to now is
Speaker 2: from like ninety two to now, and he he made
Speaker 2: a great point, and he's like, it's a movie. What
Speaker 2: if Superman was real? But he doesn't know he's Superman?
Speaker 1: Right right?
Speaker 2: What a great pitch? Yeah right, yeah uh, And so
Speaker 2: that I do feel like they kind of handicap themselves
Speaker 2: a little bit.
Speaker 1: It's it's it's tough because I loved not knowing, like
Speaker 1: the discovery for me and abilities, like, what a what
Speaker 1: a gift to be able to step into a movie
Speaker 1: like this that is going to become the perfect thing
Speaker 1: that I will find enjoyable and delightful. And I get
Speaker 1: that discovery, you know. But for a lot of people,
Speaker 1: I think they were unprepared, you know, to what you're saying,
Speaker 1: And so it might have been helpful to at least
Speaker 1: tease that little bit. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: sounds like the marketing they were trying to lean more
Speaker 1: into the sort of supernatural thriller sort of thing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: hide the fact that this had anything to do with
Speaker 1: comic books.
Speaker 2: It's from the guy who made six Cents. It stars
Speaker 2: the guy from six Cents. Yeah, if they could have
Speaker 2: called it the seventh sense, they would have, right, right, Yeah, probably,
Speaker 2: this whole sequence is so terrific, though the way you've
Speaker 2: got Willis in in the background. He's framed perfectly, and
Speaker 2: the scene is just playing out like you said, in
Speaker 2: this long shot. And meanwhile in the foreground, we've got
Speaker 2: this guy and we see or this person, I should say,
Speaker 2: and we see him bleed out. Yes, I mean, just
Speaker 2: just look at that right there. Yep, as the blood
Speaker 2: stain dis grows and goes. That's how masterfully executed, you know.
Speaker 1: I mean truly, this is I think sixth sense. This
Speaker 1: and Signs are Shyamalan at the height of his powers. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, where he he can be a little showy
Speaker 1: or whatever you want to call it, but like, when
Speaker 1: he does it correctly, it works. Yeah, you know, it
Speaker 1: makes you feel exactly what he wants you to feel.
Speaker 1: And then he's done some other films where he's pushed
Speaker 1: that a little too hard, maybe been a little too
Speaker 1: confident or brazen, or not listen to other people's ideas
Speaker 1: or thoughts or pinions on what he's doing, and then
Speaker 1: it does become like, okay, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: It does start to feel a little bit more showy
Speaker 1: than the perfect way to tell the story you want
Speaker 1: to tell. But this movie, so yeah, I went into
Speaker 1: this remembering that it was a very deliberately paced film
Speaker 1: in its shot lengths and its editing and its performances
Speaker 1: even I mean, everyone talks very slow and low, and
Speaker 1: I was wondering if that would hold up or if
Speaker 1: I would find that a little bit like, oh yeah,
Speaker 1: I kind of remember he went for this, but otherwise
Speaker 1: I enjoy it. But I found myself thinking it was
Speaker 1: perfectly calibrated.
Speaker 2: I agree. I think the long takes really allow you
Speaker 2: to appreciate the nuances of the performances. And you know,
Speaker 2: I'm a big fan of when you've got a conversation
Speaker 2: see or whatever and we're able to see both both
Speaker 2: players or you know, the players involved within the frame. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you get to see their real reactions, real time reactions,
Speaker 2: without the intrusion of the edit. And so I think
Speaker 2: that's something that that Shyamalan does here, and he does
Speaker 2: it to a far greater degree here than he did
Speaker 2: in The Six Suns, and it's it is very enjoyable. Now,
Speaker 2: I have not revisited Signs in a while, so I
Speaker 2: can't remember if he utilized a similar technique here, but
Speaker 2: it's very effectively executed in this film, you know, So
Speaker 2: I'm curious. I'm curious to see how much of that
Speaker 2: he puts into science.
Speaker 1: If anything, Signs isn't as lingering as this movie is,
Speaker 1: but it is still his very much, which his voice,
Speaker 1: the voice we see in this movie. But I think he,
Speaker 1: like I said, I mean, he knew what he was doing.
Speaker 1: He was so on fire in that moment, and he
Speaker 1: knew that what exactly what he's doing in this wouldn't
Speaker 1: have worked for science. Signs needs to be a little
Speaker 1: bit snappier, a little bit more humor pepper throughout, but
Speaker 1: it still does feel very much like it's from the
Speaker 1: same filmmaker.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: Another thing, too, is what I remember about this movie.
Speaker 1: I want to comment on what we just saw. I
Speaker 1: was like, whoa, that is some fish eye again. My
Speaker 1: memory of this is him realizing he has more strength
Speaker 1: than he realizes, and him and his boy putting you know,
Speaker 1: all the weights on, and you know, of course his
Speaker 1: mission at the end when he goes and tries to
Speaker 1: stop that janitor and whatever. But what I had forgotten
Speaker 1: about was, I mean, kind of what the movie's really about.
Speaker 1: And it's themes I feel like resonated with me even
Speaker 1: more as an adult and a big part of it is,
Speaker 1: you know, an adult relationship deteriorating. That's very different than
Speaker 1: like a teenage relationship falling apart. And like everything that
Speaker 1: you know Bruce Willis and Robin Wright are doing, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's just so grounded and realistic. And like you said,
Speaker 1: there's there's an amazing moment where they're talking together through
Speaker 1: a doorway and and it's this two shot and you
Speaker 1: get to watch both of them just existing with one
Speaker 1: another for a while.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1: And so there's there's that, which is a lot of
Speaker 1: what this movie is about. Oh, and why I wanted
Speaker 1: to call what I wanted to call out was in
Speaker 1: the hospital where you see the boy try to put
Speaker 1: their hands together, to all the hands and as soon
Speaker 1: as he turns around and they start walking, they let go.
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, my heart. And then it's also
Speaker 1: about feeling blah, you know, at a certain age and
Speaker 1: you can't pinpoint why. And I was reading Shyamalan said
Speaker 1: about this and the tone that he was trying to
Speaker 1: strike while writing a quote unquote superhero movie. Well, no,
Speaker 1: not quote unquote. He said, time I wrote a scene
Speaker 1: that was two comic bushes comic bookish I yanked it out.
Speaker 1: It became much more about that unexplainable feeling of grayness
Speaker 1: when you wake up in the morning, that feeling of
Speaker 1: somberness when you're not fitting in which to some extent
Speaker 1: I was struggling with at the time. It became about
Speaker 1: being out of sync, and so I kind of watched
Speaker 1: it with a different sort of you know eyes, you know,
Speaker 1: forty five year old eyes versus my twenty year old
Speaker 1: eyes when I first saw this, Jeez, when you put
Speaker 1: it like that, good lord, Yeah, I had just turned
Speaker 1: twenty one when this movie came out. Okay, yeah, what
Speaker 1: an exciting time, though. I mean so much as written
Speaker 1: about the year nineteen ninety nine possibly being one of
Speaker 1: the best years in cinema ever, and it's because there
Speaker 1: were so many interesting and innovative movies that were released
Speaker 1: by major studios, right, you know, and then I think
Speaker 1: this is we're still doing it when you get a
Speaker 1: movie like this.
Speaker 2: Well, and definitely when you situate this on the continuum
Speaker 2: of superhero movies, I think that too, is very interesting
Speaker 2: because it arrives just a year after The Matrix, which
Speaker 2: I consider that a superhero origin story. Sure, right, and
Speaker 2: it's just after It's it's mere months after the first
Speaker 2: X Men, which, if you want to point to a
Speaker 2: play like I mean, granted, Blade came out two years earlier,
Speaker 2: but let's be honest, it was X Men that kickstarted
Speaker 2: the whole Marvel movie thing for sure. And so it's
Speaker 2: this pivot, you know what I mean. So Unbreakable exists
Speaker 2: in within that prior era, even as it just came
Speaker 2: out just after the beginning of the new era. Does
Speaker 2: that make sense? Huh? Yeah, you know, because because from
Speaker 2: X Men to now, you know, the superhero paradigm has
Speaker 2: completely shifted, and yet this movie is just five years
Speaker 2: before Bamman begins.
Speaker 1: And thinking about that with James Newton Howard.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, right, And clearly Christopher Nolan is is I
Speaker 2: have to believe he took inspiration from the grounded nature
Speaker 2: of this story when he was telling his superhero story.
Speaker 1: For sure, or at least I have to imagine he
Speaker 1: was really delighted by this movie. Yeah, this feels very
Speaker 1: much in his arena. Yeah, this is just fun script stuff.
Speaker 1: You know, where he gets the card on his windshield,
Speaker 1: he doesn't know who it's from. Where, just asks this,
Speaker 1: you know, he survives this impossible thing, this where a
Speaker 1: train crash where everyone's died, and then he gets a
Speaker 1: card from he doesn't know who that just says, have
Speaker 1: you ever had? Have you ever been sick? What a
Speaker 1: curious question, you know, And so then him going to
Speaker 1: work and being the way that he does it is like,
Speaker 1: oh have I ever how many sick days have I taken?
Speaker 1: Just like that's his interesting way of trying to deduce that.
Speaker 1: And then to have his boss show up like, fine,
Speaker 1: you'll get a raise, Like I get what you're saying,
Speaker 1: you haven't taken a sick day? Like what a more
Speaker 1: interesting way to get that across, but that he's never
Speaker 1: been sick, because then we get to see him at
Speaker 1: work and we learn what his life is like at
Speaker 1: work because we get to meet his boss. Also, it's
Speaker 1: very clever stuff. Yeah, this stuff. So we know they're
Speaker 1: in separate rooms, him and his wife.
Speaker 2: That's what I love, right, They're in the same frame
Speaker 2: but in different rooms.
Speaker 1: Yes, that's great. Yeah, and just you know there's an
Speaker 1: unease here, there's an unease with them period. But he
Speaker 1: needs to ask her a question that only she could
Speaker 1: answer for him. And you see a little bit of
Speaker 1: a you know, not in a connection, but what you know,
Speaker 1: familiarity that only like a husband and wife could could have,
Speaker 1: you know, like a slight a mild barrier comes down
Speaker 1: in this moment, right, because she's like, why, that's an
Speaker 1: interesting question. I don't know. I guess I don't know
Speaker 1: how to answer that question. It's just I don't know.
Speaker 2: This movie is so much more textured than I remember.
Speaker 2: That's really true. Yeah, but I mean I think it's
Speaker 2: reflective of just a quarter century of living, which I
Speaker 2: think you and I have had, you know, until you're
Speaker 2: able to be like, oh, okay, I see I see
Speaker 2: where where he's coming from. I mean, I know what
Speaker 2: it's like to not be sick a day in your
Speaker 2: life and lift every weight in the house.
Speaker 1: I mean, I get it.
Speaker 2: Me and David Dunn, we're not that sim dissimilar, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, it's also it's almost infuriating knowing that he
Speaker 1: was twenty nine when he did this.
Speaker 2: I was thinking about that and I was like, you know,
Speaker 2: we heard those those Spielberg comparisons back then, and you
Speaker 2: realize why, right, because Spielberg was what seven when he
Speaker 2: made Jaws, right, right, And Shyamalan was twenty eight when
Speaker 2: he made six cents, so you know, there was sort
Speaker 2: of a wonder can aspect to it.
Speaker 1: That's literally the word on my lips. Yep. Yeah, was
Speaker 1: that when Signs was coming out that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was. It was I believe it was Newsweek,
Speaker 2: Oh news Okay that had him on the cover and
Speaker 2: said the next Spielberg. And I remember seeing that being
Speaker 2: like ooh.
Speaker 1: Me too, Like no, I'm excited about this guy also,
Speaker 1: but I thought I read somewhere that he actually reached
Speaker 1: out to Spielberg.
Speaker 2: And was like that was not my idea, and Spielberg's like, yeah,
Speaker 2: whatever and hangs up on him.
Speaker 1: He's like, yeah whatever. Do you remember the picture.
Speaker 2: Spielberg being the guy on Reddit who's like talking shit
Speaker 2: about him? He's he's like bugs Bunny and that Daffy
Speaker 2: Duck cartoon. You know, ain't I Astinka? That's hilarious. Notice
Speaker 2: how many shots in this film do through the reflection exposition.
Speaker 1: I was just going to bring that up.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because even his birth is I was gonna say,
Speaker 2: like the birth scene is, or the post birth I
Speaker 2: should say, it's fantastic because the whole you'd think you're
Speaker 2: seeing what actually is. But it's a reflection, and of
Speaker 2: course it's always Elijah and and you know he's a
Speaker 2: distorted reflection of David.
Speaker 1: Right, yep.
Speaker 2: It's good stuff, yeah, yep.
Speaker 1: And I mean all this stuff too, is just so.
Speaker 2: Potent, you know.
Speaker 1: It was it was putting a lump in my chest
Speaker 1: or a lump in my throat last night, just this
Speaker 1: poor boy. And there's that scene. There's a bunch of
Speaker 1: deleted scenes from this movie. Do you remember the one
Speaker 1: where he tries to go on that ride at the fair? Oh,
Speaker 1: oh my god, it's harrowing, I know, because he wants
Speaker 1: to ride this ride, and so he takes these stuffed
Speaker 1: animals and in the very deliberate fashion you know that
Speaker 1: this movie is shot, It just slowly like follows his
Speaker 1: process of like, well, if I put these stuffed animals here,
Speaker 1: and if I put my coat over this, you know,
Speaker 1: protection bar, like I should be okay. And then as
Speaker 1: the ride, oh, it's that you know, what do you
Speaker 1: call it, like a centrifuge or something like the ride
Speaker 1: that spins so the gravity forces you against the wall
Speaker 1: and then slowly the stuffed animals come loose, and you're like, oh, no,
Speaker 1: I know, and he's gonna get injured, and it's oh,
Speaker 1: it's it's incredible filmmaking.
Speaker 2: But it did they cut it? I'm actually I mean.
Speaker 1: That scene with him falling down the stairs is that
Speaker 1: it's hard enough exactly. I don't know if I could.
Speaker 2: Take to them much much less seeing a little kid
Speaker 2: go through it, exactly.
Speaker 1: But just this whole conceit is so sweet, Like she
Speaker 1: buys in this gift, but like puts it on a
Speaker 1: bench so he'll get out of the house to go
Speaker 1: get it.
Speaker 2: And well, I'm just gonna put this out there. Maybe
Speaker 2: she could have got him a pack of baseball card
Speaker 2: or something and avoided a lot of this shit.
Speaker 1: That's hilarious.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm just saying mom bears some responsibility. I'm gonna say,
Speaker 2: like thirty percent of everything. You know.
Speaker 1: That would be kind of funny if there was a
Speaker 1: scene and she was like, so, what did you think
Speaker 1: of the story, and he goes, well, I think you know,
Speaker 1: they treat the bad guy in this comic unfair. I mean,
Speaker 1: maybe he's got a point. I mean, maybe, you know,
Speaker 1: And then she's like, oh, okay, there are two shots
Speaker 1: in this movie that do find kind of obnoxious. This
Speaker 1: is one of them. I gotta be I gotta be fair.
Speaker 2: So it's the camera turning turning.
Speaker 1: With the com I just don't see the point of
Speaker 1: it other than it being sort of complicated and showy.
Speaker 1: But but I you know, as we know, I'm a
Speaker 1: huge Shamalan apologist, and so I stick up for him
Speaker 1: and gush over him a lot. So I will call
Speaker 1: out that shot. And there's another shot.
Speaker 2: That kind of annoys me later that I will call out.
Speaker 1: But otherwise a plus.
Speaker 2: Well, the idea is he he has an upside down worldview,
Speaker 2: and so the movie is putting us in his headspace
Speaker 2: where somehow what's upside down looks normal. All right, that's yeah.
Speaker 1: Good, that's pretty good.
Speaker 2: Do you really believe that, No, that's coming up with
Speaker 2: something I was gonna say that. Actually I'll buy that
Speaker 2: and I'll go with it. You know. Well, here's another reflection,
Speaker 2: so this scene here, yes, now, now, I have many thoughts.
Speaker 2: First of all, I don't I think Elijah's response is
Speaker 2: the correct one. Uh if if, even if he's a
Speaker 2: little bit you know, brusque with with the customer. Right. However, well, well,
Speaker 2: I mean this is not that's not something you put
Speaker 2: up in a in a kid's room. Come on, now,
Speaker 2: right I would I would have handled it more delicately.
Speaker 2: But my point is is what kind of stupid ass
Speaker 2: dad goes into a fine art gallery? This is I mean,
Speaker 2: he's again he's right, no, lie, just right. This isn't
Speaker 2: kids r us you know, you know it's a fine
Speaker 2: art gallery. And he'll be like, oh, I want to
Speaker 2: put this in my four year old Jeb to name
Speaker 2: your son Jeb. Come on, now, you.
Speaker 1: Know what's funny. I do remember like getting it, you know,
Speaker 1: when I first saw it, But last night I was
Speaker 1: sort of like, well, what if that was like, you know,
Speaker 1: super like Action Comics number one or whatever. Like this
Speaker 1: guy is a huge comic book fan, and he wants
Speaker 1: or like a star imagine like a Star Wars original
Speaker 1: poster or something from nineteen seventy seven that costs ten
Speaker 1: thousand dollars or something. But it's like he wants his
Speaker 1: son to grow up loving Star Wars like he does,
Speaker 1: and maybe he has the means, and so that's his
Speaker 1: way of you know, I'm gonna put this. This is
Speaker 1: the beginning. This is the beginning of a journey. I
Speaker 1: want to share with my son. That's actually how I
Speaker 1: looked at it, and I was like, oh, I gotta
Speaker 1: feel bad for this.
Speaker 2: Okay, let me let me put this. You've been in
Speaker 2: my cave, Yes, you've seen the things I have in
Speaker 2: my cave. Now do I want my kids to be
Speaker 2: into that stuff? Absolutely? Do you think I should put
Speaker 2: any one of the things in my cave in the
Speaker 2: room where my baby sleeps.
Speaker 1: I mean he don't know. Yeah, I'm truly. I mean,
Speaker 1: like one of the I can imagine, like a Chewbacca
Speaker 1: or something, just to sort of get them endeared.
Speaker 2: Well, sure, but that's but that's my point. Something you
Speaker 2: get from Walmart, not from you know, a high end gallery.
Speaker 1: Don't get me wrong. I mean I this isn't something
Speaker 1: I would do. But let me put it this way.
Speaker 1: And why I actually kind of like this scene now
Speaker 1: they think about it is I do actually feel a
Speaker 1: little bit bad for the guy because you know, he
Speaker 1: doesn't he's not like he's an idiot, Brian. I mean,
Speaker 1: he seems sincere about what he wants to do. That's
Speaker 1: a sincere decision. However, I do like that it helps
Speaker 1: us understand Elijah in the way that he would never
Speaker 1: like diminish. Anything that he sees is so valuable, those
Speaker 1: cans aren't good enough for him, and so he's happy
Speaker 1: to rudely say good day, sir.
Speaker 2: I think what they should have that guy, the guy
Speaker 2: should have. He should have been like wearing a starter
Speaker 2: jacket and like snapping gum. And that's why I hear you,
Speaker 2: I hear you got that dork shit here.
Speaker 1: I mean that's kind of yeah. Actually that's what they
Speaker 1: needed to do that maybe lean into that a little
Speaker 1: bit more. And by the way, I don't actually even
Speaker 1: think I never thought about this scene as much as
Speaker 1: we're talking about it right now. But I did have
Speaker 1: a feeling last night that I kind of felt bad
Speaker 1: for him because I was like, well, maybe he wants
Speaker 1: to share this thing that he's passionate about with his kid.
Speaker 2: He should My kid's a dork. He likes this dork
Speaker 2: stuff for you is a dork store, right, he should
Speaker 2: have They should have like really leaned into that.
Speaker 1: And if he was a really wealthy person and he
Speaker 1: doesn't know the difference between high end dork stuff and
Speaker 1: stuff he could get at Walmart, like you're saying, that's right,
Speaker 1: that look, we just fixed it.
Speaker 2: Night call us.
Speaker 1: So you know another thing. I mean, this is gonna
Speaker 1: sound kind of obvious, but when I saw this in
Speaker 1: two thousand, I was admiring all the framing and the
Speaker 1: camera work, but I wasn't thinking as much about how
Speaker 1: this is framed like a comic book. So much of
Speaker 1: this movie, the framing is like panels in a comic book,
Speaker 1: and I just didn't think about it. But now I
Speaker 1: think it's more obvious to me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know what's interesting is that that, certainly thematically,
Speaker 2: you see echoes of something like Watchmen, right, you know, Watchmen.
Speaker 2: You know, the character of night Owl and Watchmen is
Speaker 2: dealing with this malaise of you know, trying to find purpose,
Speaker 2: very very much in the vein of David Dunn. And
Speaker 2: watching this movie it makes me think, man, you wonder
Speaker 2: what somebody like Shyamalan could have done or would do
Speaker 2: with something like Watchmen. Sure, you know, yeah, because obviously
Speaker 2: they went in kind of a different direction. I won't
Speaker 2: say anything about the person who made that movie. He's
Speaker 2: got a different approach.
Speaker 1: That's funny. Yeah, you know, I haven't watched that in
Speaker 1: a while, speaking.
Speaker 2: Of I mean, I enjoyed it. I remember enjoying it
Speaker 2: for me too.
Speaker 1: I mean it, frankly, i'd never read the comic before.
Speaker 1: It brought me to the comic, which I really enjoyed.
Speaker 2: Nice.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I do love the relationship, by the way that
Speaker 1: between David and his son in this movie. You know,
Speaker 1: like the way that the son really, i mean clearly
Speaker 1: loves his dad, but the way that he like looks
Speaker 1: up to him like a superhero throughout this movie. And
Speaker 1: there's that great shot where he's David's reading the newspaper
Speaker 1: and he lowers it and his boys just wrapped around
Speaker 1: his chest, and the son so badly wants to believe
Speaker 1: that his dad is this personal I just says he.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I think that's a really interesting angle, and I think
Speaker 1: Spencer treat Clark does a really good job.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well we talked about this before. I mean, he
Speaker 2: was in Gladiator a few months before this, so he
Speaker 2: had a pretty good two thousand.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's looking up to a lot of male father
Speaker 1: figure types in the Remember he really took the Maximus.
Speaker 2: Fill in that niche Yeah.
Speaker 1: And then if people will remember in the movie Glass,
Speaker 1: his son kind of becomes the guy in the chair.
Speaker 2: For him, that's right. Yeah. The continuing Adventures of David Dunn.
Speaker 2: He has a name, don't They call him something like
Speaker 2: the Watcher?
Speaker 1: Oh I forget, Yeah, I don't remember, but they do
Speaker 1: give him sort of a superhero name.
Speaker 2: It is weird to think of Glass and realize that
Speaker 2: that was probably like the last, or if not the last,
Speaker 2: one of the last like performances where Bruce Willis was
Speaker 2: fully present.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I mean, recording this in twenty twenty five,
Speaker 1: it's really difficult to think about.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I just saw an interview with his
Speaker 2: wife who said he's he's nonverbal at this point, which
Speaker 2: is really heartbreaking, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I thought I read something somewhere well, I mean,
Speaker 1: nonverbal and also just doesn't remember that he had a
Speaker 1: film career.
Speaker 2: Man, that's really I mean, it's this is one of
Speaker 2: those things where just unfortunately, as we get older, we
Speaker 2: have to reckon with so many of our childhood icons,
Speaker 2: lifelong icons just going away. But unfortunately, you know, I
Speaker 2: think with Bruce Willis, in addition to that, it's the
Speaker 2: fact that this illness means that he's already gone kind
Speaker 2: of you know, in a lot of ways. I don't
Speaker 2: know if that makes sense.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, yeah, but I mean, like you said, I
Speaker 1: mean a childhood icon. I mean so many. He made
Speaker 1: an impact in a lot of people's lives through the entertainment.
Speaker 1: He was a part of you know.
Speaker 2: Well, and and you know, you realize that his association
Speaker 2: with Shyamalan happened at a really or tune time, you know,
Speaker 2: where he was transitioning into being more than just an
Speaker 2: action icon, you know.
Speaker 1: And didn't he do that out of a contractual obligation?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1: How wild one of his defining roles. I mean, it
Speaker 1: just worked in everyone's best interest. The way that that
Speaker 1: came together, it's amazing. It's the Chekhov's gun checkofs guy.
Speaker 1: I was I was reading a lot about this movie
Speaker 1: in preparation, and someone was just like the checkouts gun moment.
Speaker 1: It's like, literally, he just takes the gun, looks at it,
Speaker 1: and puts it back.
Speaker 2: He should look, he should look right up to camera.
Speaker 2: Everybody got that right.
Speaker 1: It works though, because he's looking in that area for something,
Speaker 1: and it works. I like this shot, by the way,
Speaker 1: from above in the closets frequently well.
Speaker 2: It reminds me of the john Ford moment in the Fablements.
Speaker 2: Right if the horizon at is at the looks good.
Speaker 2: If horizon at the bottom, it looks If it's horis
Speaker 2: in the middle, it looks like shit, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean this this movie just filled
Speaker 1: with interesting photography.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I think to the point you made about
Speaker 2: it feeling like comic book panels that I'll be honest,
Speaker 2: I hadn't even clocked that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's pretty bang on in this. I
Speaker 1: love this shot that low half the frame filled with.
Speaker 2: Whenever you dirty the frame a little bit, right, it
Speaker 2: looks the shot just it's just instinctively more interesting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's just so much to look at, and there's
Speaker 1: not much to look at, but it's also his face
Speaker 1: is obscured by the folder, so we know he's engrossed
Speaker 1: in it.
Speaker 2: Just good.
Speaker 1: I just feel like this is my common complaint, and
Speaker 1: I I'm not exactly right, because we see tons of
Speaker 1: interesting movies these days still, but it just feels like
Speaker 1: it was more common in big popular movies to see interesting,
Speaker 1: dynamic stuff like this. That's right, you know, Yeah, like
Speaker 1: the moments like this, this like really probably as a
Speaker 1: twenty year old, I was just like, oh, that's nice.
Speaker 1: His wife wants to hang out again, but like, this
Speaker 1: is a really well written, well performed scene. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: her being like, if you want to ask me out sometime,
Speaker 1: you can do that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean there's there's this there's this sadness when
Speaker 2: you see a couple that they clearly have love for
Speaker 2: each other mm hm, but whatever spark they had seems
Speaker 2: to have have faded away, and so it's kind of like,
Speaker 2: what are we trying to keep alive here? You know?
Speaker 2: I mean there is a sadness there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a golf, a real palpable golf. But because
Speaker 1: these are such great performances captured so well, you can
Speaker 1: sense the thread, the reason they feel something for one another,
Speaker 1: and just seeing them try to repair this in her
Speaker 1: performance here is just so amazing. Everything she's going through.
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously she's experienced a lot of hurt, but
Speaker 1: then she thought she might have lost him forever, and
Speaker 1: now she's just saying, hey, you know, if you want
Speaker 1: to ask me out again some time, maybe do that.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's just I don't know, it's just so rich and
Speaker 1: I feel very mature for someone in their twenties to
Speaker 1: write and to direct like this.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, very sophisticated. This role originally went to Julianne Moore,
Speaker 2: which I can imagine. Yeah, oh easily, I wouldn't.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't change. I like Robin Wright a lot in
Speaker 1: this movie, so I'm happy it's well.
Speaker 2: Julianne Moore dipped to do Hannibal, which you can understand
Speaker 2: from her perspective because she gets to be the lead,
Speaker 2: you know. But but that being said, I mean, I
Speaker 2: don't think anybody has particularly good feelings about that movie. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so I think I think Robin Wright did okay. In fact,
Speaker 2: probably the most dated thing about this movie is the
Speaker 2: fact that she's credited is Robin Right, Penn.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that's right.
Speaker 2: There's a little stick pin in time right there.
Speaker 1: Actually, I had to stop myself from saying Penn when
Speaker 1: I said her name earlier, because I'm so used to that.
Speaker 2: Oh how funny, I even right Pen? Yeah, see look
Speaker 2: at this shot. I love this, you know, so observational
Speaker 2: through the gate.
Speaker 1: It's funny, you know, him trying to sincerely reach out
Speaker 1: to him again, then throwing his own joke back at him.
Speaker 2: Give me your credit card? Yeah, now, did you go
Speaker 2: into this expecting a twist? Ending?
Speaker 1: I wish I could remember. I don't remember. I really don't.
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously by signs I did, sure, because that
Speaker 1: had become his thing. I mean, even Elijah's mom.
Speaker 2: Sort of like little I heard there's a twist ending
Speaker 2: in this one.
Speaker 1: Yeah, about the comic book he's looking at?
Speaker 2: Did you.
Speaker 1: Not that?
Speaker 2: I remember? However, I definitely figured out that Elijah was
Speaker 2: the bad guy.
Speaker 1: Mmm.
Speaker 2: I mean not like at this point, but but definitely
Speaker 2: by the end before the reveal, Right, I remember leaning
Speaker 2: to my cousin who I went with, and I was like,
Speaker 2: he's the villain. No.
Speaker 1: See, it's funny because I'm I'm sure I was surprised,
Speaker 1: but watching it now, I feel like it's almost hard
Speaker 1: not Yeah, how would you not clock that? I mean
Speaker 1: even just the way he's dressed.
Speaker 2: I was about to say, he's wearing like a super
Speaker 2: villain costume. Yes, yeah, And you know what's funny is that, like.
Speaker 1: You kin't.
Speaker 2: On the one level, You're like, why would he want
Speaker 2: to fashion himself as a villain. He's like a comic
Speaker 2: book guy, Like, wouldn't you want to be a hero? Right, Like, like,
Speaker 2: if you're a comic book nerd, you're you'd be like, no,
Speaker 2: I'm you know, I'm the hero of my story. Why
Speaker 2: does he want to be a villain? Right? But look
Speaker 2: at it through his lens. His act of heroism is
Speaker 2: he had to do all that in order to give
Speaker 2: the world this hero. Right.
Speaker 1: If not for him, David doesn't become a hero, which
Speaker 1: is typically how villains think, right, right, Like their perspective
Speaker 1: is they're coming from some sort of understandable place, right.
Speaker 1: And then the other thing is, if you go to
Speaker 1: comic Con or whatever, I would say, you see more
Speaker 1: people dressed up like villains than than heroes because it's
Speaker 1: more fun, it's more flamboyant, you know, yeah, sure, how
Speaker 1: many how many Heath Ledger jokers do you see? You know,
Speaker 1: that's that's a really good point. That's a great point. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, I just I don't know this, you know,
Speaker 1: it's funny. I had this thought because I just recently
Speaker 1: read the book The Man Who Heard Voices, which is
Speaker 1: basically following him night Shyamalan as he's making Lady in
Speaker 1: the Water Lady in the Water, and he talks about
Speaker 1: that being his bedtime story, and it really is in
Speaker 1: a way, because it does feel like he's making it
Speaker 1: up as he goes, and by the end you're sort
Speaker 1: of like, I don't know where, you know, like and
Speaker 1: then the end, you know. But I was like this,
Speaker 1: there's something about this movie that I really love that
Speaker 1: almost feels kind of like a bedtime story. It's if
Speaker 1: you were to like say this movie back to someone,
Speaker 1: it's very simple, you know. It's it's I don't know,
Speaker 1: you know. There's this guy and then he works a
Speaker 1: security guard and sometimes he gets these instincts like I
Speaker 1: think that guy's a gun with a silver thing and
Speaker 1: a black handle, and so the guy follows him and
Speaker 1: it turns out he did. Like it feels like a story,
Speaker 1: you could. It does kind of feel bedtime story in
Speaker 1: that way, right, yeah. And then it's just so simple.
Speaker 2: But it's so this shot by the real quickly, what
Speaker 2: a beautiful shot right here?
Speaker 1: Oh gorgeous.
Speaker 2: So many times again, it's like two people in the shot.
Speaker 2: It's framed in this interesting way. They're standing in this
Speaker 2: kind of a doorway thing, and and we're not even
Speaker 2: we're not cutting in at any point mm hmmm. We're
Speaker 2: just letting the performance happen, you know. And anyway, I
Speaker 2: wanted to clock that before before we moved on. Sorry,
Speaker 2: go ahead, no.
Speaker 1: And you're just adding to my point where it's like
Speaker 1: it is really simple on paper, but it's the performances.
Speaker 1: It's the commitment from the filmmakers, from the performers, from
Speaker 1: whatever that make this feel.
Speaker 2: So.
Speaker 1: I mean, this is kind of a silly idea, honestly,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, but like it's it's executed
Speaker 1: with such gravitas and like sincerity that you just get
Speaker 1: swept up and invested in it. And I think that
Speaker 1: see cinema score from the ending and why my friend
Speaker 1: hated it. I'll never forget my friend Adrian back in
Speaker 1: the year two thousand. We walked out half of us
Speaker 1: really loving it, and she was. She was literally telling
Speaker 1: people on line for the next showing not to go,
Speaker 1: and we were no kidding. I remember picking her.
Speaker 2: Up and be like, no, stop, stop, Like how funny.
Speaker 1: But I think it's because the movie trips at the
Speaker 1: end and interesting, this is a this is a tightrope,
Speaker 1: like you're telling a story that is inherently kind of
Speaker 1: could possibly be seen as silly, but you're doing it
Speaker 1: so well and so convincingly and so sincere. And then
Speaker 1: they accidentally kind of trip at the end, at the
Speaker 1: very very end, the very very end. And I think
Speaker 1: for me, and I was watching the Ebert and Roper
Speaker 1: review last night. Ebert, it's like, well, the ending kind
Speaker 1: of but like, oh man, this is a great movie.
Speaker 1: And that's how I felt. I was like, you know,
Speaker 1: I don't care, like I get it. That was a
Speaker 1: great experience. But for some people that trip might have
Speaker 1: been like wait, wait, wait, wait, wait wait, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean? And then I think that's yeah, this
Speaker 1: is one of the most harrowing scenes I can write this.
Speaker 2: This is harrowing enough. We didn't need that theme park.
Speaker 1: Yes, So Dunn has said that he had a vision
Speaker 1: of the person in the camouflage coat having a specific
Speaker 1: type of gun, and of course Glass wants to know.
Speaker 1: Elijah'll come alt Elijah out of respect, Elijah, don't be
Speaker 1: like the kids. I was just watching his cane. But
Speaker 1: Elijah has to know because this will prove his theory.
Speaker 1: He's gone through so much. He sacrificed almost five hundred
Speaker 1: people to find out if this guy is the guy
Speaker 1: he believes him to be. So he has to know
Speaker 1: if that guy has the gun. But he's got to
Speaker 1: go down all these stairs very quickly, and his bones
Speaker 1: are like glass and watching him try to hurry and
Speaker 1: his feet slip, and the way that it's filmed and edited,
Speaker 1: and then that shot, that twisting shot with the glass
Speaker 1: cane smashing on the ground, h incredible.
Speaker 2: Now I have to ask why on earth would one
Speaker 2: have a glass cane? What possible practical application is there
Speaker 2: for that?
Speaker 1: Because it would make excellent symbolism. It just the right moment,
Speaker 1: which I read that that was Samuel L. Jackson's idea,
Speaker 1: the glass kane. Yeah, all right, well then you got
Speaker 1: to go with sam Yeah, purple lightsaber, glass kane. You listen,
Speaker 1: he's a man who has his predilections. Yeah, yeah, I
Speaker 1: do love though. Also how from the start again is
Speaker 1: grounded as this is the world that we're living in here.
Speaker 2: Well, by the way, I love how this is the
Speaker 2: guy that that reporter was talking about, right, yes, the
Speaker 2: agent on the agent excuse me, yeah, yep. But the
Speaker 2: other thing where uh you know, when Joseph goes to David.
Speaker 2: First of all, their dialogue is just playing out fully
Speaker 2: in the background, which I love and I love the
Speaker 2: rack focus here, but he's like, do you know how
Speaker 2: your what your mother would say, if she knew I
Speaker 2: saw you playing football, right, I was seeing it like, yeah,
Speaker 2: she's a physical therapist, so she deals with this ship
Speaker 2: like all the time. Yep, you know yep.
Speaker 1: I had forgotten about that component of it, that him
Speaker 1: faking the injury, and they probably wouldn't have been together
Speaker 1: if he had continued playing full's right, So that was
Speaker 1: an opportunity for him.
Speaker 2: I loved the little thing though, of Joseph being like, yeah, no,
Speaker 2: I'll help you work out. He's like, no, you don't, No,
Speaker 2: I'm heppy. I'm helping my dad work out.
Speaker 1: It's cute.
Speaker 2: So sweet.
Speaker 1: Yeah, these these If you had asked me about this
Speaker 1: movie before I rewatched it last night, I would have
Speaker 1: been like, oh, it's great and told you certain things
Speaker 1: about it. But I just feel like, well, this scene,
Speaker 1: which is great, but I just I came away from
Speaker 1: it appreciating it even more because I just had forgotten
Speaker 1: how great the characters and their relationships to each other.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm, Like the father son thing, the husband and
Speaker 1: the wife thing. I just that was the stuff I
Speaker 1: hadn't remembered as well.
Speaker 2: See the loading up the weights the barbells is like
Speaker 2: one of those memories that stayed with me about this
Speaker 2: movie since the first time I saw it, you know,
Speaker 2: totally very distinctive.
Speaker 1: Yep, I love Yeah, even like the way that's framed
Speaker 1: off screen. I think you could have beaten up Bruce
Speaker 1: Lee just asking all these questions because Elijah incepted the
Speaker 1: idea into his brain and now he can't get it out.
Speaker 2: The boy. But there's a naturalism slash unnaturalism that Shyamalan
Speaker 2: constantly bounces between in all of his scripts. Totally right.
Speaker 2: It diff like the one thing you can't say about
Speaker 2: a Shamalan's script is that it was punched out by Ai. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 2: because there's something so so esoteric about how he how
Speaker 2: he has his characters internet, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1: It's it's so true and sometimes it really works and
Speaker 1: sometimes it really stands out.
Speaker 2: Sometimes it's what no from the happening that's I think.
Speaker 2: I think when you the metaphor used for a tightrope,
Speaker 2: that could just as easily apply to Schamalan's career. Yeah,
Speaker 2: Like for these first three movies he was able to
Speaker 2: to stay on the right side of that tightrope. But
Speaker 2: then once you trip, you really trip, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, the Village it was like he had already pulled
Speaker 1: one too many punches, and this was a punch that
Speaker 1: was just a little too asking, a little too much.
Speaker 2: The water. To me, the village is that sketch from
Speaker 2: the Ben Stiller show Bad Twist ending theater remind me,
Speaker 2: it's just again, it's like twist, twist, twist, like one
Speaker 2: too many twists. And that's that's what makes you know,
Speaker 2: that's what's funny. Yeah, and and that that's my recollection
Speaker 2: of the Village.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm.
Speaker 2: I didn't even watch The Lady in the Water.
Speaker 1: Oh, it's it's not great, unfortunately.
Speaker 2: I would say from the Village on. I've I've definitely
Speaker 2: not seen every Shamalan movie. I know you have. You're
Speaker 2: you're like Ride or Die.
Speaker 1: I'm a Rider Die. Yeah, even when I don't like it,
Speaker 1: I'm there opening day for the next one.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, I mean I I've seen the visit. I've
Speaker 2: seen Glass and but and Trap.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: And we had a fun conversation about that about a
Speaker 2: year ago.
Speaker 1: Yeah. He have you seen Split?
Speaker 2: I did not see Split.
Speaker 1: Have you seen the ending of Split?
Speaker 2: On YouTube? I saw the ending of Split. Yeah, Okay,
Speaker 2: that's the only part of Split. I've seen.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think this might be the shot that annoys me,
Speaker 1: where the camera is sticking with the weights and going
Speaker 1: up and down into his face, Like, I don't see
Speaker 1: the need for this. I don't want to talk over
Speaker 1: it so I can listen to you watch it.
Speaker 2: Is that right? Yeah, yeah, that's right.
Speaker 1: I just I don't I was like, all right, all right,
Speaker 1: but I mean if you were like starting to lose
Speaker 1: your day, I'd be like, maybe we can like forego this.
Speaker 1: But all that aside, the tone and the pacing and
Speaker 1: the score and the performances in the scene are so fun.
Speaker 1: It's like this little twinkly magical sort of thing between
Speaker 1: a father and his son. You know, the son truly
Speaker 1: believing his dad as a superhero and just keeps tacking
Speaker 1: on more weight. Even this shot too, like this is cute,
Speaker 1: the son leaning over into his dad's perspective, Like, dude,
Speaker 1: it's very very nice.
Speaker 2: This is I mean the score, right, we alluded to
Speaker 2: James Ehoward. It's the I mean, it works very well
Speaker 2: with the film, but it also works as its own
Speaker 2: experience because the motifs are so strong. Yep, I love
Speaker 2: the sort of the heroic theme you know, oh it's
Speaker 2: so good.
Speaker 1: This, this and sixth sense. I had those scores and
Speaker 1: just like listen to them like regular music in my
Speaker 1: dorm room. It is it's weird that James Newton Howard
Speaker 1: doesn't get talked about the same way like you're John
Speaker 1: Williams and his or your Jery you know, like you're
Speaker 1: James Horner. Is that you know, like, yeah, he should
Speaker 1: be one of those names that comes up with like
Speaker 1: the five or six or seven people you talk about
Speaker 1: right like that.
Speaker 2: That is weird to me because he's he's been like
Speaker 2: so consistently good.
Speaker 1: Completely. I completely agree that. By the way, that is
Speaker 1: such an incredible I mean, I would like to think
Speaker 1: that was in the script. But David realizing he's stronger
Speaker 1: than he ever knew. Hard cut. There's Elijah broken in bed.
Speaker 1: He's the opposite. Oh wrenches my heart, but he's on
Speaker 1: his way like I actually I paused it. And the
Speaker 1: shot when he falls down the stairs and he sees
Speaker 1: Elijah sees that that man does have the gun that
Speaker 1: David envisioned, right I I. And it's filmed up side
Speaker 1: down or Elijah's upside down on the stairs and you
Speaker 1: see his head upside down.
Speaker 2: I pause.
Speaker 1: I was like, I have to know what Samuel Jackson
Speaker 1: is doing. What's the expression he makes during this? And
Speaker 1: it is a very like he's probably like shutting down
Speaker 1: because of the pain, but there is just the slightest
Speaker 1: of satisfaction and this almost becomes kind of uncomfortable. Now
Speaker 1: he's getting he's getting into David's life here, but it's
Speaker 1: just by chance, right I you know, I mean I
Speaker 1: don't Yeah, I guess it would be difficult. The way
Speaker 1: I thought of it last night was he tried to
Speaker 1: maybe worm his way to her specifically, but I don't
Speaker 1: know how one would do that. Yeah, But obviously he
Speaker 1: has a lot of questions for her now, like he's
Speaker 1: not getting what he needs out of David, so he's like,
Speaker 1: all right, gotta gotta talk to his wife.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: You know, I didn't know this, but I was reading
Speaker 1: the Osteogenesis imperfecta, you know, the disease that he has, yeah,
Speaker 1: which makes his bones less dense and fragile. I didn't know.
Speaker 2: But there's.
Speaker 1: This Australian celebrity, Quinton Kenahan, Okay, and he's the guy
Speaker 1: we see in Mad Max Fury Road. He's a little
Speaker 1: person and he's in that chair and he's talking into
Speaker 1: like a megaphone or whatever. Oh yea, so he has
Speaker 1: he has that. Yeah, I didn't know that. Oh my gosh,
Speaker 1: can't imagine. It's an easy life.
Speaker 2: But I didn't know it was a real thing. I
Speaker 2: thought it was just made up for the movie.
Speaker 1: So did I I was, I didn't know, so I
Speaker 1: looked it up.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I don't know a lot about him other
Speaker 1: than what I've read because he was in Mad Max
Speaker 1: and whatever. But apparently, I mean, people can write in
Speaker 1: and correct me or or add to this. But in
Speaker 1: Australia he's he's a bit of a celebrity over there.
Speaker 2: Okay, So but how common is this illness that I
Speaker 2: don't know? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, So now we're learning the car You know, it's funny.
Speaker 1: I there's the car accident component in this, and there's
Speaker 1: also a car accident in signs. And there's also the
Speaker 1: water component, water being like a threatening thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, in both. I was thinking of the water aspect.
Speaker 1: It was making me like, oh, he's kind of got
Speaker 1: like these hooks in his brain?
Speaker 2: Is this the shemalin Shemalan came?
Speaker 1: So at what point did we know what he looked
Speaker 1: like and it'd start going, oh.
Speaker 2: I recognize I. I clocked him in the sixth sense
Speaker 2: because he's the doctor, right, And I didn't realize it
Speaker 2: was him, but I reckon. I was like, oh, Indian guy,
Speaker 2: because like that's what happens when you're a brown person.
Speaker 2: You're like, oh that sure, sure, And then I saw
Speaker 2: him in an interview I was like, oh, okay, that's him,
Speaker 2: and so by this time I knew it was him.
Speaker 1: You know, I have a feeling I kind of have
Speaker 1: a memory of knowing that, yeah, this is good, So
Speaker 1: this is like him.
Speaker 2: I like it too.
Speaker 1: I had forgotten this because I remember that David can
Speaker 1: get these visions when he touches people and he so
Speaker 1: then I was kind of thinking like, well, how does
Speaker 1: he not? And this feels like something you'd be very
Speaker 1: aware of. But he with the first time it happens
Speaker 1: with the man with the gun. He's telling Elijah it's
Speaker 1: just like a feelings and Elijah says something about sharpening it,
Speaker 1: and I had forgotten about that component of it, like, oh,
Speaker 1: so this is something that if he works on it,
Speaker 1: it will become stronger, which.
Speaker 2: It'll be more than just a feeling.
Speaker 1: It'll be a vision, yeah, which he's now starting to have, right,
Speaker 1: because I don't think he even sees anything more with
Speaker 1: that mother and the boy, but he it's more heightened
Speaker 1: than the slightly imperceptible vision of the gun he had earlier.
Speaker 1: And then eventually it'll be come with the drug dealer.
Speaker 1: He can actually see that's right.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I think you know the Shyamalan thing. It's
Speaker 1: funny because it became like escalating like his roles, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean, Like it was that's really it.
Speaker 2: We've joked about this before, but I'm sorry, father.
Speaker 1: That'xt the what I always think of in science.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I remember watching that. I remember I saw
Speaker 2: an early screening of that with Sean and I remember
Speaker 2: just being like, oh, dude, like why would you give
Speaker 2: yourself such an important role in this movie?
Speaker 1: Yes, we were explaining so much that's happening in the movie,
Speaker 1: like this is like it's like whatever, I'll go with it. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I always do find it funny though, when you're watching
Speaker 1: I'm trying to think of other examples, but when the
Speaker 1: director is in the film and you're watching the actor
Speaker 1: you've been following the whole time, talking that character because
Speaker 1: I always think it's weird. It's like, oh when nailed cut,
Speaker 1: like that person is telling the main guy what to do,
Speaker 1: right Otherwise, Like, I just find that it's a funny real.
Speaker 2: World thing that gets into my head when I see
Speaker 2: stuff like this. See well, it's as we're recording this,
Speaker 2: I literally just watched Do the Right Thing like an
Speaker 2: hour ago. Oh in my class, right, and that that
Speaker 2: is a situation where Spike Lee gave himself the lead role.
Speaker 2: Yeah right, right right, And you know, the seams show
Speaker 2: a little bit because he's not a professional actor, But
Speaker 2: I think it works in the context of that movie
Speaker 2: because the movie itself is kind of spunky and you know,
Speaker 2: you know, unrefined, you know, and so his his lack
Speaker 2: of experience kind of works for that character, you know.
Speaker 2: And so so I'm I'm like the most generous reading,
Speaker 2: like maybe Shyamalan was trying to do a Spike Lee
Speaker 2: as mooky situation.
Speaker 1: You know, Oh, that's interest sting. I didn't even think
Speaker 1: of it that way. For some reason, I'm thinking of
Speaker 1: that line from pulp fiction to Samuel Jackson where he's like,
Speaker 1: you know, personality goes a long way and it's like,
Speaker 1: you know, maybe there's something too where it's like maybe
Speaker 1: he's not super refined, but he's got a lot of personality.
Speaker 1: Personality goes a long way.
Speaker 2: I mean, I Spike definitely and do the right thing.
Speaker 2: That's what.
Speaker 1: Yeah, sorry, I was talking about Spike Lee.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Although it's funny because you talk about pulp fiction,
Speaker 2: and I would say one of the worst parts of
Speaker 2: that movie is Quentin's role in the as the the
Speaker 2: N word saying guy, oh my gosh.
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, I know. I mean, I'll say it
Speaker 1: like sort of vacillates for me. Like there's some things
Speaker 1: he does in there that I do find kind of amusing,
Speaker 1: you know, And it's like what does he look like Jimmy.
Speaker 2: Or what they look like? Dorks? Look like a couple
Speaker 2: of dorks.
Speaker 1: Like that's kind of funny. And then the coffee thing too,
Speaker 1: like you know, I buy the coffee. You know my wife,
Speaker 1: I know my coffee's good.
Speaker 2: We're talking about Tarantino and and you know, there's a
Speaker 2: video that I saw where he's talking about this movie
Speaker 2: and he's like Unbreakable by m Night Shamalama ding dong
Speaker 2: h And I'm like, I don't know, man, that seems
Speaker 2: kind of racist to me. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I had actually not long ago, someone I said something
Speaker 1: about Shyamalan and they said that, and I was like.
Speaker 2: Hmm, right, Like, I mean, I don't know if he's
Speaker 2: okay with it, but I am like, it's I'm like,
Speaker 2: what you're saying not not your friend, but Quentin. I'm like,
Speaker 2: what you're saying is more complicated than his actual name.
Speaker 1: Yes, I know, I know. It feels a little dismissive, right,
Speaker 1: you know, kind of like it felt odd to me
Speaker 1: to have Tarantino saying that about, you know, a colleague basically, yeah, exactly,
Speaker 1: a colleague. Yeah, appear, Yeah, it feels I don't know,
Speaker 1: like again, let's stipulate maybe they know each other and
Speaker 1: it's hilarious between them. Yeah.
Speaker 2: If I were to guess, I would say that Shyamalan,
Speaker 2: as an Indian kid growing up in Philadelphia, probably heard
Speaker 2: that shit all the time time when he was in
Speaker 2: junior high in high.
Speaker 1: School, right, right, That's that's my guess, right well, and
Speaker 1: even I mean, that's that's part of his story, right,
Speaker 1: I mean, night was something that he added himself because
Speaker 1: it was a little easier for people to say and
Speaker 1: he kind of adopted that for himself, So you have
Speaker 1: to imagine that comes from some sort of experience where
Speaker 1: people aren't saying his name correctly and right. But yeah, man,
Speaker 1: don't love it, and I also don't love everything Garantino
Speaker 1: doesn't pulp fiction.
Speaker 2: Or says I should say, We're gonna have to come
Speaker 2: back and talk through that movie.
Speaker 1: Oh man, I watched like the last thirty minutes, if
Speaker 1: the last thirty minutes of that movie on TV.
Speaker 2: That's it. That's what I'm Oh, yeah, absolutely thinging the diner. Dude,
Speaker 2: give me, give me Sam Jackson sitting across a table
Speaker 2: from Tim Roth for days. Oh.
Speaker 1: I was actually thinking, I've probably seen this movie like
Speaker 1: ten times something like that all the way through. But
Speaker 1: that scene I'm sure I've seen at least twenty times.
Speaker 1: Like I always stop on it. It is just mesmerizing.
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, and that's I mean, it's the same thing
Speaker 2: here right again. When you have great performers with interesting
Speaker 2: dialogue to say, just turn the camera on and let
Speaker 2: them do their thing.
Speaker 1: Mm hmmmm hmm.
Speaker 2: I do like the sorry real quick, the authenticity of
Speaker 2: of just shooting in Philadelphia. It reminds me of rocky
Speaker 2: you know, m yeah, very you know, these just lived
Speaker 2: in streets. It's it's it's not showy, but it feels
Speaker 2: it feels real. You know, this house, I feel like
Speaker 2: I've been in this house, you know. I mean I've
Speaker 2: been with Philadelphia, but this feels like a house that
Speaker 2: we've we visited, you know, many times. Totally Oh this
Speaker 2: right here, this scene.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was gonna talk about something else, but I
Speaker 1: was like, nope, can't hit.
Speaker 2: Pause on that. So this see, So you got Joe's
Speaker 2: if who's holding Chekhov's gun and he's like, well you're
Speaker 2: a superhero dad, so I'm about to shoot you.
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, so good.
Speaker 2: Well what I love is a couple of things, right,
Speaker 2: the way that plays out in just one shot, right, yes,
Speaker 2: But the fact that David is not like I'm not
Speaker 2: super you idiot, or you're gonna kill me. He's like
Speaker 2: he's trying to not tear down the kid's illusion while
Speaker 2: still making clear, hey don't shoot me, you know, And
Speaker 2: that's a trick. And actually I was reading that this
Speaker 2: is inspired by a real thing that happened to George Reeves.
Speaker 1: Oh really that yeah, well, you know actor who played Superman.
Speaker 2: Who played Superman. I think has alluded to a little
Speaker 2: bit in Hollywood Land. I haven't seen that movie, but
Speaker 2: you know, kids would be like, oh, Superman, let me
Speaker 2: shoot you and so at some show or whatever where
Speaker 2: he showed up, because he would show up in costume,
Speaker 2: and back then, apparently it was a lot easier for
Speaker 2: kids to get a hold of guns, just like well,
Speaker 2: I guess that has changed actually, But basically he's like, hey,
Speaker 2: you know, if you shoot and it bounced off me,
Speaker 2: somebody else could get hurt, right, And the kid puts
Speaker 2: down the gun. You know, wow, can you imagine?
Speaker 1: No, I mean this scene. So I remembered this scene,
Speaker 1: like if you asked me to list five sixteensmths movie.
Speaker 1: I remember this. But rewatching this last night, I was like,
Speaker 1: this is making my like I am clenching. This is
Speaker 1: so uncomfortable and like like a couple steps into like
Speaker 1: an idea that is so realistic and so dangerous and
Speaker 1: so uncomfortable that it's making me really really uncomfortable to
Speaker 1: watch it, but in a good way.
Speaker 2: Right, But I didn't see that was our first cut
Speaker 2: right there?
Speaker 1: Yes, right, I didn't remember the whole escalation with the
Speaker 1: boy and his belief and his dad. So he hears
Speaker 1: this story from Elijah and then we see him, you know,
Speaker 1: hugging his dad reading the paper later and then he's
Speaker 1: just like, you know, you know, maybe we try these weights,
Speaker 1: and he's like, well, it could hurt me. He's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: but let's just try. And then he's like, well, I
Speaker 1: want to be like you at school. So I was
Speaker 1: trying to defense like but the dad keeps, you know,
Speaker 1: kind of turning him down with this idea. So eventually
Speaker 1: it's like, I'm going to prove it to you, dad,
Speaker 1: and you know, I'm going to point this gun at you.
Speaker 1: I love there's this funny line too, and the MILLI
Speaker 1: He's like, I'll only shoot you once.
Speaker 2: It's like, in a kid's head, that makes all the
Speaker 2: sense in the world.
Speaker 1: But I was reading Spencer Tree Clark talking about it.
Speaker 1: There's an oral History in Entertainment Weekly several years ago.
Speaker 1: It's really good and I recommend it. But he was
Speaker 1: talking about that scene. So this is quoting Clark. He says,
Speaker 1: there's that scene in the kitchen where I'm holding the
Speaker 1: gun up to Bruce Willis. It's a four minute scene
Speaker 1: all in one take, and we filmed it nine times.
Speaker 1: It was so taxing on all of us, and not
Speaker 1: just because it was an emotional scene. Eduardo Sierra, who
Speaker 1: is our cinematographer, with sweating bullets, and then Shyamalan picks
Speaker 1: up on that and he goes the camera operator at
Speaker 1: one point walked off the set because I was like, no,
Speaker 1: you have to pan here with his line here, and
Speaker 1: he goes, you're anticipating here. You have to listen to
Speaker 1: the actors, and he says the guy stormed off and
Speaker 1: was like, I'm sorry. Oh, so Shaman was like, I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: come back, and Shaman was saying I felt like the
Speaker 1: world was going to come to an end if he
Speaker 1: didn't move at this point or didn't slow down at
Speaker 1: that point. I remember feeling like, I don't know if
Speaker 1: I can do the entire shoot like this. Wow, And
Speaker 1: I mean, can you imagine working with see This is
Speaker 1: something reminds me about making movies when I was a kid,
Speaker 1: because and I'm sure you could speak to this too.
Speaker 1: You were the one holding the camera. You were doing
Speaker 1: exactly what you wanted. And so when I got older
Speaker 1: and realized that that's not how filmmaking worked, Like you
Speaker 1: hire a director of photography, you have camera operators. I
Speaker 1: remember thinking, oh, that'd be so frustrating because I would
Speaker 1: know exactly what I want. But I have to trust
Speaker 1: that a chain of command is going to lead to
Speaker 1: this one person doing exactly what's in my brain. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and it sounds like that's exactly what was happening here.
Speaker 1: Shamlan knew exactly when he wanted the camera to move.
Speaker 1: It was all intuition and instinct in his brain, and
Speaker 1: he was frustrated that this other human being didn't have
Speaker 1: the precise intuition and instinct that he had.
Speaker 2: And real quick, I should say, these these six comics
Speaker 2: that we see right in the foreground here, yes, I
Speaker 2: have every single one of those. Do you really I know,
Speaker 2: I know exactly what comics those are.
Speaker 1: Oh that's great.
Speaker 2: Do they like themes?
Speaker 1: Do they have anything to do possibly with a story.
Speaker 2: Or is it I mean only in a very broad sense, right,
Speaker 2: I mean, it's just just in that they are superhero
Speaker 2: stuff and you got you got it because it's Daredevil,
Speaker 2: Spider Man and Punisher, HM and and all Marvel stuff.
Speaker 2: So that that itself is very interesting that this movie
Speaker 2: center is on like made up. Well, they're all made up,
Speaker 2: but like made up for the movie characters.
Speaker 1: Right, They never say Batman or Super.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but the only comics we see are Marvel. So
Speaker 2: I wonder if that was some kind of a agreement, like, fine,
Speaker 2: we'll let you use our comics, but you have to
Speaker 2: only use our comics kind of thing.
Speaker 1: Oh, that makes sense because there was a an action
Speaker 1: comics looking thing at the beginning.
Speaker 2: It was active comics exactly.
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, that makes sense.
Speaker 2: So we we talked past the the shamal On cameo
Speaker 2: and I wanted to mention you know that that character
Speaker 2: ends up being a runner through this whole trilogy because
Speaker 2: we see him again. We see him again in in Split,
Speaker 2: but we also see him in Glass where and he
Speaker 2: recognizes David and he's like, hey, I remember you. You
Speaker 2: used to work at that stadium, and you know I
Speaker 2: turned my life around after meeting you.
Speaker 1: I don't even remember.
Speaker 2: That that part I did remember. Now this part hurts
Speaker 2: me where he just like actively stopping the guy from
Speaker 2: taking him out of the store, and meanwhile, these comics
Speaker 2: are just getting wrecked and.
Speaker 1: I was thinking about them rolling over them.
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, so this is Elijah's angst because
Speaker 2: David in fact nearly died, yes, the pool accident. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so so he's this is him throwing a tantrum over
Speaker 2: that realization. Basically is it the pool?
Speaker 1: And he also heard about the car accident, right, and
Speaker 1: he he doesn't know the truth yet, right, that he
Speaker 1: faked that.
Speaker 2: Yes, but I think this is in reference to the pool.
Speaker 2: I think, okay, yeah, because yeah, that was like he'd
Speaker 2: forgotten about that. David had forgotten about that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I forgot because yeah, we were talking through it,
Speaker 1: but he went and confronted David confronted Elijah at the shop.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's like, hey, my son tried to kill me,
Speaker 2: so knocked that shot.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, just going. I was just thinking about we
Speaker 1: got a little brief scene where the David and his
Speaker 1: wife are going to go out to dinner and then
Speaker 1: telling the kid, and I was just thinking, like, man,
Speaker 1: that kid got off pretty uh for literally talking a
Speaker 1: handgun and pointing it at his dad. Yeah that was
Speaker 1: I like that shot though, by the way too, with
Speaker 1: the low angle with the wheelchair getting pushed through, and.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah that's great.
Speaker 1: Sorry, yeah gohead.
Speaker 2: No, I was saying, doesn't this kind of remind you
Speaker 2: of the six sends a little bit of the restaurant
Speaker 2: in there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, totally same vibe. I wonder if it is, I
Speaker 1: don't know.
Speaker 2: Very similar.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but this is sweet. I agree seeing them reconnect.
Speaker 2: She's a Prince fan. That's a good thing.
Speaker 1: That's right, good, good music taste, Robin Wright. You know,
Speaker 1: it's so funny because I think, of of course, Jenny
Speaker 1: from Forrest Gump and House are.
Speaker 2: Aka one of the worst people in movie history.
Speaker 1: All right, So you know, I was literally I don't
Speaker 1: know why, Oh, because it's playing in theaters this month
Speaker 1: and I want to go see it. And I was
Speaker 1: just thinking about that movie, and I was thinking, we
Speaker 1: need to do a commentary, and I was thinking, if
Speaker 1: we did, I would have to be prepared for the
Speaker 1: Jenny conversation, and not just not because of you, but
Speaker 1: just because she is so some would say polarizing. I
Speaker 1: would say a prism, and I should say I got
Speaker 1: there way before the world, because I.
Speaker 2: Remember watching that on home video in ninety four or
Speaker 2: five whenever I saw it on BHS, and I was like, man,
Speaker 2: she's awful, and it's hard for me because I love
Speaker 2: Robin Wright. I think she's incredibly sexy, you know, I've
Speaker 2: loved her since Princess Bride, you know. Yeah, so I
Speaker 2: understand where forrests coming from. But I'm also like, god,
Speaker 2: she is the worst.
Speaker 1: Okay to be continued, I have a I have a
Speaker 1: take on her, and it's a little more generous.
Speaker 2: I'm looking forward to hearing it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, but that you actually mentioned it. But I
Speaker 1: was gonna say the movie I always forget is Princess Bride,
Speaker 1: And not because I forget the movie, but I don't
Speaker 1: think of it like, oh, that's the same person. That's Jenny,
Speaker 1: that's yeah House of Cars, like she just I know
Speaker 1: she's much younger in that, but I just I always
Speaker 1: forget that. That's that's Robin right, Yeah, I mean that
Speaker 1: was like a thing that was a thing until it
Speaker 1: wasn't anymore.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, Kevin Spacey, sure, it's almost like it collapsed,
Speaker 2: like a like you know, you know, something that collapses.
Speaker 2: I don't know, I'm sure the phrase will come to me.
Speaker 1: Sorry, what were you saying?
Speaker 2: No, I love that Robin Wright has never stopped working,
Speaker 2: you know, and she's you know, she's just a consistently
Speaker 2: good performer and and you know, to to whatever extent
Speaker 2: I mean, I think this character, you know, I mean,
Speaker 2: she doesn't get a ton to do, but I think
Speaker 2: what she gets.
Speaker 1: To do matters. I agree, I agree. I think again
Speaker 1: this viewing, I appreciated her in this movie more than
Speaker 1: I think I ever have, realizing how much she's bringing.
Speaker 1: Even though she doesn't get a ton to do, she's
Speaker 1: bringing a lot.
Speaker 2: Like I remember being disappointed that she wasn't in class
Speaker 2: and that they killed off her character in between. I
Speaker 2: wasn't a fan of that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember that too, I do remember that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: this babysitter is kind of funny. Yeah, it's like, you know,
Speaker 1: she finds out through the answering machine that they might
Speaker 1: be moving. She's like, yeah, so thanks for telling me.
Speaker 1: And then she walks outside it's raining. She's like, oh great,
Speaker 1: so funny. What a funny, little memorable thing. You know,
Speaker 1: So you give the actress something to do. You know
Speaker 1: something else I wanted to bring up real quick because
Speaker 1: we've been talking about this in our regular episodes. So
Speaker 1: this movie had a budget of seventy five million. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it made under one hundred million in the US only
Speaker 1: ninety five million.
Speaker 2: Remember that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Worldwide, about two hundred and forty eight million. And
Speaker 1: what we've been talking about is, you know people who
Speaker 1: compare movies by their box office and say, basically, this
Speaker 1: movie won because it made this much at the box office,
Speaker 1: or this movie lost because it only made this at
Speaker 1: the box office. But what we were saying recently was, yeah,
Speaker 1: but movies have long, long, long lives after box office,
Speaker 1: and it's funny that if we're going to look at
Speaker 1: that as some sort of worth for a film, it's
Speaker 1: interesting that we're just looking at one brief moment in
Speaker 1: time for that film that's right right the box office.
Speaker 1: So I looked it up and Unbreakable so world you know,
Speaker 1: under hundred million US two hundred and forty eight million worldwide,
Speaker 1: made one hundred and twenty three million on home video amazing, Right,
Speaker 1: So that's way more than it made in the US alone, Right,
Speaker 1: So it's just value whatever you want to call it, earning.
Speaker 1: It doesn't end when the box office ends. It continues
Speaker 1: and it can be even more right after life, and
Speaker 1: so it's it's global. Theatrical home video puts it almost
Speaker 1: closer to four hundred million, amazing, which is well crazy.
Speaker 2: This is something that Shamalan talked about where the movie
Speaker 2: came and you know, it came and went and it
Speaker 2: did whatever it did, but it really like this. You know,
Speaker 2: this was at the peak of DVDs.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm, yeah, yeah, yeah right, and they and they.
Speaker 2: Put out, you know, a pretty pretty loaded special edition
Speaker 2: disc and I remember that. Yeah. It came in like
Speaker 2: a digit pack you folded open and there was like
Speaker 2: I remember there were like little little lobby cards painted
Speaker 2: by Alex Ross.
Speaker 1: Oh I don't remember that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it was. It was a pretty sweet deal,
Speaker 2: I remember, And that was probably two thousand and one,
Speaker 2: I'm guessing. And regardless, I mean it, it just it.
Speaker 2: It had a very healthy home video afterlife, to the
Speaker 2: point where, you know, he talked about this before how
Speaker 2: he meant this as the first of a trilogy and
Speaker 2: you know, this was Act one or whatever, and the
Speaker 2: movie's performance didn't really warrant a sequel and so you
Speaker 2: just forgot about it. But he said that just he
Speaker 2: was constantly asked about whether there was going to be
Speaker 2: an Unbreakable sequel.
Speaker 1: I remember that that would come up a lot with him.
Speaker 2: The funny thing, though, is is I always felt that
Speaker 2: the movie was fine as is, like it didn't need
Speaker 2: a follow up, and this is completely separate from what
Speaker 2: I think about Glass. But I'm just like, in general,
Speaker 2: I'm like I, you know, I almost thought it worked
Speaker 2: better as just as a one and done.
Speaker 1: I kind of agree because I remember always thinking, well,
Speaker 1: where do you go from here? It can only like
Speaker 1: betray the groundedness that you set up. Yeah, and this,
Speaker 1: because then it will just have to get a little
Speaker 1: crazier or something like this.
Speaker 2: This sequence, No, no, I just like this on its own, yeah, right,
Speaker 2: And I like the sequence on its own, by the Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's good. The music in this whole scene is terrific,
Speaker 2: by the way, but yeah, the well, and I guess
Speaker 2: we'll be able to thread back to this when we
Speaker 2: get to the ending. But I think this film's ending
Speaker 2: is almost an admission, like, well, this is how it
Speaker 2: would play out in real life, Like yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: Right, right, right right, you know.
Speaker 2: So, and again I want to say that that's completely
Speaker 2: separate from what I thought of Glass, which I like you,
Speaker 2: I have not revisited it since it came out, but
Speaker 2: I remember being being underwhelmed by it when I did
Speaker 2: see it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it almost felt My memory of it was it
Speaker 1: was a lot of people sitting in a room just
Speaker 1: sort of talking. You know, there's like a psychiatrist and
Speaker 1: three people in a chair. Just I was like, this
Speaker 1: is not what I imagined. And then basically everyone's dead
Speaker 1: by the end, and I was like, that's right, what
Speaker 1: are you doing? Sorry spoiler, but sorry guys truly if
Speaker 1: you guys haven't seen it. But I am a little
Speaker 1: curious to go back and see if I'll be a
Speaker 1: little more Yeah, if I can try to get on
Speaker 1: its wavelength now that.
Speaker 2: I know we've done a six years of living in
Speaker 2: the interim, see if that's a change.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and that and then and just revisiting this and
Speaker 1: liking it so much, I'm in the universe, so I
Speaker 1: may as well, you know, go back for Yeah.
Speaker 2: Well, Shyamalan talked about how initially the the the Kevin
Speaker 2: Crumb character from Split was supposed to be the villain
Speaker 2: in this interesting which and he said, very different, very different,
Speaker 2: he he he took out like twenty pages from this
Speaker 2: and just put them in Split.
Speaker 1: Fascinating.
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: By the way, this I don't even want to call
Speaker 1: it dreams flashback. I guess films really really effectively, like
Speaker 1: like so brilliant that you're not even thinking about how
Speaker 1: brilliant it is, Like it does feel slightly dreamlike. You've
Speaker 1: got these two actors who do kind of resemble our
Speaker 1: main actors enough, but they're obscured perfectly, right, so you
Speaker 1: just hear their voices, which I think is tweaked Bruce Willis,
Speaker 1: that's right. But yeah, but it's also you're not distracted
Speaker 1: by any of that either, you know, it's just it's
Speaker 1: very effective, and we're finally getting to see the thing
Speaker 1: that they've alluded to a couple times throughout this movie,
Speaker 1: this car accident that was a big moment in their lives,
Speaker 1: and we got to see the superhuman strength.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 1: And by the way, this when it slows down here
Speaker 1: and we see this actor's face, I mean, come on, man,
Speaker 1: he like right, he does look like he give you
Speaker 1: Bruce Willis's son amazing. And that's a woner to get
Speaker 1: all that perfectly. I wonder how many takes a head
Speaker 1: to do.
Speaker 2: By the way, so the comic book that Elijah was
Speaker 2: looking at that was like his light bulb moment. It's
Speaker 2: called Sentry Man, and I kind of love that. And
Speaker 2: this is not intentional, it couldn't have been, but the
Speaker 2: characters David and the Sentry are very similar, like Marvel Centry, right,
Speaker 2: because you know we saw the Sentry and Thunderbolts, right.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah.
Speaker 2: In the in the comic books, he's a little different, right.
Speaker 2: He's a guy who who was a superhero. He was,
Speaker 2: but he's he he he has through through various shenanigans.
Speaker 2: He has that's been erased from his memory. So he
Speaker 2: goes through life just moros and feeling like there's something missing.
Speaker 2: And it's the fact that he's a superhero. You know. Again,
Speaker 2: that's just a weird coincidence because they couldn't have planned that.
Speaker 2: But interesting, this this sequence is one of the best
Speaker 2: in the movie. I love the kind of you know,
Speaker 2: the sort of crucifixion pose that he he puts on,
Speaker 2: you know. Yeah, but just the music is so great.
Speaker 1: So it's lit incredibly, the tone is incredible. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1: The use of color, Yeah, I was thinking about it earlier.
Speaker 1: I mean, how perfect a superhero whose weakness is water.
Speaker 1: His uniform is a trench coat, yep, or a raincoat.
Speaker 1: A raincoat. Yeah, you know red.
Speaker 2: Shamalan loves his red and I remember that from the
Speaker 2: sixth sense. I also like, you know, he he's getting
Speaker 2: inklings of all these people's evil, but he has to decide,
Speaker 2: like what's the what do I intervene in? You know?
Speaker 1: Yep? Yep. Well, and also those things are kind of
Speaker 1: over with, but then he kind of catches something that's
Speaker 1: still active, right right right, But this is this is
Speaker 1: see and this is what is interesting about Yeah.
Speaker 2: I like this.
Speaker 1: I mean even just that slow the reframing and the
Speaker 1: push in and seeing his arms go out like this,
Speaker 1: and even you know, as a hero figure, the look
Speaker 1: of that sort of the cloak like look of that
Speaker 1: rain jacket and everything it just does. Look it cuts
Speaker 1: a striking figure, doesn't it.
Speaker 2: Oh it's great. I mean in this, in this you know,
Speaker 2: grounded world, that's his superhero costume.
Speaker 1: Yep, it's perfect.
Speaker 2: This movie is so ahead of its time.
Speaker 1: So I wish everyone could have like seen it the
Speaker 1: way that they would look at it now, because I
Speaker 1: think it would have been even more beloved. But see, now,
Speaker 1: this is what's interesting is because now that he's going
Speaker 1: to become a superhero in this very very grounded movie,
Speaker 1: well what kind of things is he going to encounter?
Speaker 1: And all this stuff is really really unpleasant, Like this
Speaker 1: is real world evil.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know this here this sexual assault.
Speaker 1: Thing, and then the and then what we get to.
Speaker 1: That's the thing that I remember. You know obviously the
Speaker 1: people who are being held captive at their house. It's
Speaker 1: really upsetting. But but that's why it works, you know.
Speaker 1: That's that's what this movie is, right. You know. It's
Speaker 1: not someone who's just gonna like try to make mess
Speaker 1: with a switch track and have two trains go and
Speaker 1: collide into one another, you know what I mean, Like,
Speaker 1: it's this is like really really disturbing crap.
Speaker 2: I remember around this time. I mean this is when
Speaker 2: I was at Columbia and one of one of my
Speaker 2: loglines or pitches was like a quote unquote realistic superhero story.
Speaker 1: And and I.
Speaker 2: Remember the weekend after this came out, a friend of
Speaker 2: mine's like, hey, Zachy, they made your movie.
Speaker 1: I was like, I know, son of a, how unnerving
Speaker 1: is that with the guy opening the door.
Speaker 2: And oh, dude, like it. I remember it creeped me
Speaker 2: out twenty five years ago and then watching it watching
Speaker 2: the movie again, I was dreading that part. Isn't that weird? Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, but that's it. It's like you can that's a
Speaker 1: nightmare that you can imagine, you know, like happening. And
Speaker 1: I mean, now, I you know I always talk about
Speaker 1: I know we're both like this, but I just one
Speaker 1: of my favorite things is just fantasy in the real world,
Speaker 1: you know, And that's what this is.
Speaker 2: Like.
Speaker 1: It's just a slightly elevated fantastical sort of thing but
Speaker 1: in a very real world. It never betrays the groundedness
Speaker 1: of real life in this It just introduces these interesting
Speaker 1: fantastical elements to it. But this is great. I mean,
Speaker 1: like I was saying, great use of color.
Speaker 2: You got that woman in the red and it's a
Speaker 2: guy in the orange here, the Orange Man as he's
Speaker 2: known on the soundtrack. Oh. Really interesting.
Speaker 1: Oh something else I thought was really cool that Shyamalan
Speaker 1: talked about it's a great shot right there. Oh so great.
Speaker 1: And then the flair Yeah you were saying no, no, no,
Speaker 1: just when he had like a full fee behind how
Speaker 1: to film his visions And this is quoting him, he says,
Speaker 1: my theory was to shoot his visions from a security
Speaker 1: camera angle to evoke a feeling that you're catching wrongdoing inadvertently.
Speaker 1: There's something about that angle that we associate our terrors with.
Speaker 2: That was like interesting yeah, kind of.
Speaker 1: You know, if it was just sort of like a
Speaker 1: handheld sort of thing and seeing that guy moving around
Speaker 1: the house, you know, it could be terrifying in a
Speaker 1: certain way. But just seeing that high angle thing that
Speaker 1: looks like it could be from like a security camera.
Speaker 2: And the speed is there's like a jitter.
Speaker 1: Yeah right, Yeah, there's just something Yeah, like we're watching
Speaker 1: something that was captured that we shouldn't be looking at.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's perfect right there. Yes, Bruce with the shadow
Speaker 2: over his eyes. I mean that's like a quintessential superhero look.
Speaker 1: Right, yep, like a Batman or something.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so what I mentioned before, I mean I remember
Speaker 2: the DVD set that came with those those painted cards.
Speaker 2: It was you know, it was Bruce willistre imagine that,
Speaker 2: but painted by Alex Ross.
Speaker 1: Right. See that's the thing, because now that I'm more
Speaker 1: familiar with Alex Ross, I'm eager to look those up
Speaker 1: and see them.
Speaker 2: Yeah, let's see if I can find them. This whole
Speaker 2: sequence to pretty brilliantly played out, where again we get
Speaker 2: these long takes but also no music. You know this,
Speaker 2: and then you know the fight that that happens in
Speaker 2: a little bit. I really you appreciate it even more
Speaker 2: now just how completely you know, it avoids the tropiness
Speaker 2: of like some choreographed thing or whatever. There's there's just
Speaker 2: a raw brutality to it, which is more reflective of.
Speaker 1: Like what it would likely be, right Oh yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: the fight, Yeah absolutely, and even just the deliberateness, the patience.
Speaker 1: You did not have to speed things up or make
Speaker 1: interesting angles to captivate us here, we're already captain because
Speaker 1: I mean, this is such a great long shot here
Speaker 1: of him walking through this house, because it's like we
Speaker 1: do feel like we're standing in a place we don't
Speaker 1: understand that they're watching him walk through a house he
Speaker 1: doesn't know, like we were getting that. It's evoked here.
Speaker 1: Oh this stuff too, like this, the shadows, and I
Speaker 1: mean this, this is why I'll show I don't care
Speaker 1: what he makes. I'll just always show up. Because at
Speaker 1: the very least I'm hoping for another one of these. No, no, no,
Speaker 1: At most i'm hoping for another of these. But at
Speaker 1: least I'm hoping that there's at least one moment that
Speaker 1: touches this, and if it does, I am happy. Have
Speaker 1: you gotten that with his recent you know, yeah, I
Speaker 1: would say, at least there's been moments. I think it's
Speaker 1: interesting how his tone has kind of changed over the years.
Speaker 1: I mean, they do feel a little more intentionally campy.
Speaker 2: Sure, Trap, certainly trap.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, but he like cabin in the I
Speaker 1: always say it wrong, not at the cab and in
Speaker 1: the woods.
Speaker 2: That's not knock at the cabin, right, yeah, I confuse
Speaker 2: it with the other one. Isn't it a knock at
Speaker 2: the cabin?
Speaker 1: I think so, But I actually thought that was one
Speaker 1: of his best in recent years. It's just I mean,
Speaker 1: it's an unpleasant movie, unfortunately, but it's really the cabin,
Speaker 1: by the way, not at the cabin, but it's it's him.
Speaker 1: His gifts are on display in that movie telling that story.
Speaker 2: Mm hmm.
Speaker 1: So this, yeah, this imagery like kids tied up to
Speaker 1: it's really upsetting, but it feels like it belongs in
Speaker 1: this movie, and and it's very satisfying seeing him conquer
Speaker 1: what feels like a real life monster.
Speaker 2: Right right, yeah, Well that's exactly it. I think the
Speaker 2: that's the ironic thing. I mean, the mission statement of
Speaker 2: this movie cannot be more clear. And yet that was
Speaker 2: something that that Disney was basically like, sh sure don't
Speaker 2: talk about what the movie's actually about.
Speaker 1: Right, See. I even love this with the drapes.
Speaker 2: Oh, it's great.
Speaker 1: I mean I could imagine someone getting tripping over this
Speaker 1: and being like this feels a little too I don't know,
Speaker 1: forced or something, or someone in love with what they're doing.
Speaker 1: But like I'm like, yeah, but it works.
Speaker 2: No, No, for this, it absolutely works. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I mean we've got these billowing drapes in the wind
Speaker 1: and they part to reveal what's in the room behind
Speaker 1: them to tell us what we need to know. We
Speaker 1: see David entering, then the drapes cover him. Then the
Speaker 1: drapes open on the other side, and we see this
Speaker 1: woman tied to a radiator and say, oh gosh, this
Speaker 1: is horrifying. That smash cut to the guy ugh and again,
Speaker 1: I mean, we're watching a superhero moment. We're watching super
Speaker 1: or Kryptonite get shoved in Superman's face, but it's filmed differently.
Speaker 1: What I love is that the weakness totally makes sense too, right,
Speaker 1: Like he's got such dense bones that of course he
Speaker 1: would drown.
Speaker 2: Hmm. Like it's it's a logical weakness, you know what
Speaker 2: I mean.
Speaker 1: I didn't even think about that oh, I see the
Speaker 1: pictures you sent me.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so cool, isn't it neat? Yeah? I got it.
Speaker 1: This did make me oh, no, go ahead, go ahead, no, no,
Speaker 1: go ahead, no this no, please, we should talk about
Speaker 1: this at a hand.
Speaker 2: It's it's it's freaking terrifying that that overhead shot of
Speaker 2: him with on the water with the tarp. I mean,
Speaker 2: that's like that's nightmare sauce right there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's nightmare sauce for us. Yeah, exactly on that
Speaker 1: tarp on top of the pool. And then yeah, the
Speaker 1: way that it shows each like it's slowly slipping over
Speaker 1: the edge of the pool, so it's going into the
Speaker 1: water and enveloping him and bringing him to the bottom,
Speaker 1: and that'd be scary for us. But then knowing that
Speaker 1: he has an extra hard time in water, I mean,
Speaker 1: this should be the end. But then of course we
Speaker 1: get the pole going through the wall because he untied
Speaker 1: those kids and the kids get him out.
Speaker 2: There's there's the line earlier in the movie where Elia
Speaker 2: just says like, oh, it's it's your kryptonite, and that
Speaker 2: just it made me think of the in Superman The
Speaker 2: New Superman where they got that one there. It's like
Speaker 2: the Lex Luthor's talking to the talking the round table,
Speaker 2: and one guy's like, what's that? What's his kryptonite? It's
Speaker 2: called kryptonite. That made me laugh.
Speaker 1: It's so funny because as horrifying as his whole sequence is,
Speaker 1: there is like a feeling of levity in this moment
Speaker 1: seeing the two kids just sort of standing side by side.
Speaker 2: Here, I was wonder about that. I'm like, why aren't they?
Speaker 1: Like?
Speaker 2: Why are they? What was the direction there? You know what?
Speaker 1: For me, this ties into the comic book framing. Watch this,
Speaker 1: like how he stands, then we get his boots planted
Speaker 1: in the ground in the cape, and then the two
Speaker 1: kids looking at him like he's a damn hero.
Speaker 2: So you think that's Bruce Willis or is that a
Speaker 2: body double?
Speaker 1: That is a fantastic question. If he got out of
Speaker 1: the pool in that same shot, which I think he
Speaker 1: probably about a double, just a guess with this, good lord,
Speaker 1: it's like, see so.
Speaker 2: This here now think about the the the prevised, choreographed
Speaker 2: version of this fight, yes versus just raw brutality one shot? Yes,
Speaker 2: you know, and I love that he's got him in
Speaker 2: a hold that is in fact unbreakable.
Speaker 1: Oh very good. But just the way that he's even
Speaker 1: like lifting him off the ground, but he just he
Speaker 1: won't be moving like Yeah, it's I wonder how many
Speaker 1: times they had to do this. And the way that
Speaker 1: whenever he bumps into the wall, he's wall denting the
Speaker 1: dry wall.
Speaker 2: I think that's Bruce Willis being flung around like I.
Speaker 1: Do not I was even thinking because it feels like
Speaker 1: it must be a little bit of a lighter person
Speaker 1: for that guy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's true.
Speaker 1: But yeah, but the music. I can hear the music
Speaker 1: right now because I've heard this score so much and
Speaker 1: it's so just after what we've been through for the
Speaker 1: past ten minutes.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's so cathartic. Well, and I just I mean,
Speaker 2: I gotta be honest, probably one of my favorite superhero
Speaker 2: themes of all time. Yeah, you know, it's such a
Speaker 2: simple motif, but there's so many different orchestrations of it. Yeah,
Speaker 2: this track the Orange Man. I must have listened to this,
Speaker 2: I don't even know how many times.
Speaker 1: Yep, yeah, same, that's how we found each other.
Speaker 2: I know, right this this soundtrack was like my writing music.
Speaker 2: I remember that I used to put it on because
Speaker 2: this again, this is when I was at Columbia, and
Speaker 2: I was like writing, you know, i'd have a script
Speaker 2: or something end to turn in or whatever.
Speaker 1: Yep, I would. I'd put it in things that I made.
Speaker 1: And oh yeah, yeah, I mean I have to call
Speaker 1: out the mom just I can feel myself getting emotional
Speaker 1: seeing the mom fall over. Yeah, and I hate it,
Speaker 1: but I also feel like it fits.
Speaker 2: It's truthful.
Speaker 1: It's truthful.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And then of course this is so sweet. I was
Speaker 1: reading about this. I was curious about this. So he
Speaker 1: he has this moment with his wife and she was like,
Speaker 1: when did you know that we might not work out?
Speaker 1: And he tells a story about well, I had a
Speaker 1: nightmare and I didn't wake you to tell you. And
Speaker 1: so then after this horrifying thing, you know, he takes
Speaker 1: her out of the room the separate room, brings her
Speaker 1: up to his room, says he, honey, I had a nightmare.
Speaker 1: Ah lovely. And I was wondering because him carrying her,
Speaker 1: there's a little bit of a floating quality to it.
Speaker 1: And I do wonder if you know, she was on
Speaker 1: some sort of cable or something.
Speaker 2: I was thinking, but it's like like a rig of
Speaker 2: some kind.
Speaker 1: It wasn't It was just no no, no, I'm guessing
Speaker 1: the same thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I love it.
Speaker 1: It's really lovely and it's a it's a very stylized shot,
Speaker 1: but it's a very effective one.
Speaker 2: See. I think what she should have said is like,
Speaker 2: well now I'm awake now, so thanks for ruining my
Speaker 2: sleep as well. That would have been more truthful.
Speaker 1: That's really funny. Yeah, I had some note here. I
Speaker 1: can't find it, but I was reading that. Yeah, it
Speaker 1: took like eleven hours to shoot that. It was so complicated.
Speaker 2: Good lord, just ticking her up the stairs.
Speaker 1: Yeah, goodness, Yeah, it is not crazy. Oh yeah, this
Speaker 1: is him from that Oral History says that was incredibly
Speaker 1: difficult shot, which I remember it took us forever to accomplish.
Speaker 2: I think it was eleven hours. Is Shyamalan saying that, Yeah,
Speaker 2: good lord crazy. I wonder if Willis was regretting agreeing
Speaker 2: to be in this movie.
Speaker 1: Of course, this is a sweet moment, you know, Well,
Speaker 1: it's nice that he gets to see Oh I didn't
Speaker 1: even notice that they're touching. That's been a wife there,
Speaker 1: which they wouldn't at the beginning. But then this is
Speaker 1: a nice moment between him and his son. The son
Speaker 1: finally gets the payoff, you know, of believing his dad
Speaker 1: is superhuman?
Speaker 2: See would be what would be funny is like as
Speaker 2: they make eye contact and Bruce Willis is kind of
Speaker 2: like like gives him the smile and then and then
Speaker 2: Joseph like holds up the gun like eh, and He's
Speaker 2: just like no, and he has to put the gun
Speaker 2: down again.
Speaker 1: And by the way, why why are you carrying that?
Speaker 1: Do you have that in your pajama pants?
Speaker 2: Man?
Speaker 1: By the way, something of I remember this from originally
Speaker 1: seeing this him the boy untwisting the orange juice and
Speaker 1: see this, I was like, I think this is the
Speaker 1: fastest anyone moves in this entire movie. I remember it
Speaker 1: alway kind of stood out to because everything is so
Speaker 1: deliberately paced, and that felt like the first natural more
Speaker 1: quickly paid.
Speaker 2: That's because you had a Tropicana rep who was on
Speaker 2: set who was like, you do not make people think,
Speaker 2: are you know? Bottle cap is hard to take off?
Speaker 1: That's right, that's right, but this is great. Yeah, him
Speaker 1: sliding the paper over.
Speaker 2: So yeah, check out that ship right there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I gets to see that. But it's so cute,
Speaker 1: you know, the Sunles said, like you He's like but
Speaker 1: then he's like, don't I thought this was kind of
Speaker 1: funny where he's just like, don't tell your mother. I
Speaker 1: was like, you know, it's like you guys are just
Speaker 1: kind of repairing a sort of thing.
Speaker 2: I never already. This is a massive secret from her.
Speaker 2: Now like their their their whole.
Speaker 1: Relationship began with like something he was keeping from her
Speaker 1: with the car accident and the football career, and now
Speaker 1: like they've repaired things and he's got a new secrets.
Speaker 1: But I mean, yeah, we talk about Bruce Willis's performance,
Speaker 1: and I mean the kid here, the kid, yeah, but
Speaker 1: just that that look, the little pleading look, but also
Speaker 1: sort of I don't know, a sweetness they're sharing right here.
Speaker 2: See. I liked him in this. I like Spencer treat Cary.
Speaker 2: I think I said before in Gladiator I found him
Speaker 2: slightly annoying because I got a little bit of Mike
Speaker 2: Myers as Simon vibe from him. Are you the Spaniard?
Speaker 2: Are you? Are you?
Speaker 1: And he's like when he's like playing with that sword
Speaker 1: as he's talking, Yeah, you know, that's so funny.
Speaker 2: I think it was right about here where I was like, oh, so,
Speaker 2: Elijah's like definitely the villain then, because his mom like
Speaker 2: not just what she says, but the way she says it.
Speaker 2: There's really two villains.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I wish I could remember how
Speaker 1: I felt, but last night I do remember thinking when
Speaker 1: she said that, it feels pretty obvious.
Speaker 2: It's really on the nose. The other villain is in
Speaker 2: a wheelchair.
Speaker 1: Perhaps I imagine his office is filled with the blueprints.
Speaker 2: He may have a purple trench code. Possibly, I'm just
Speaker 2: giving her British accent.
Speaker 1: A cane made out of unusual material for a cane.
Speaker 2: By the way, so we've talked to the whole movie,
Speaker 2: So David Dunn, is itself such a great reference to
Speaker 2: comic book lore where you have a superhero alter egos
Speaker 2: with alliterative names Peter such as Clark Kent, Peter Parker,
Speaker 2: Read Richards, Matt Murdoch, Bruce Banner. We can keep going,
Speaker 2: but kind of the subtle thing, you know. I like that.
Speaker 1: I think that's where I first learned that was watching
Speaker 1: the behind the scenes stuff on the DVD. Hash I'm
Speaker 1: funny talking about it. Yeah, that's really fun like first
Speaker 1: clocked it, like I'll be darned.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was something that like when they made the
Speaker 2: Incredible Hawk television show in the seventies. Kenneth Johnson, who
Speaker 2: created that, was the reason that he renamed instead of
Speaker 2: Bruce Banner, it was David Banner mm because he didn't
Speaker 2: like how comic book names were alliterative and he didn't
Speaker 2: want the show to be very comic book.
Speaker 1: Ye oh, funny, although I.
Speaker 2: Think people would have clocked the comic book aspect by
Speaker 2: the fact that he turns into a big green anker.
Speaker 1: That's kind of funny. But you know what, Kenneth Johnson
Speaker 1: went on to direct Short Circuit too, So I trust
Speaker 1: well that.
Speaker 2: Is Hey, you know what, he's a good man. I've
Speaker 2: interviewed him.
Speaker 1: I remember, I remember you sent me the clip of
Speaker 1: him talking about short circuit.
Speaker 2: Yeh yeh, I said, my friend Brian loves short circuit too.
Speaker 2: Can you tell a short circuit two story? And he
Speaker 2: more than happily obliged dreams. Do you love this? Here?
Speaker 2: He's like, I think this is where we shake hands,
Speaker 2: like this is like now he knows like you're to
Speaker 2: touch that. Now I have to tell you my role
Speaker 2: in this.
Speaker 1: You know, yep, it's great, you know, and so this
Speaker 1: and this is horrifying the security cam pov here. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and see I can see people still going along with this.
Speaker 1: I'm talking about general audiences and going.
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, the the jitteriness as he walks out of
Speaker 2: the frame.
Speaker 1: And yeah, yeah, the speed ramping or whatever you were saying. No,
Speaker 1: but then it just suddenly does this freeze frame and
Speaker 1: puts text on the screen like yeah, and then David
Speaker 1: called the Cops and Lies Now and Insane Asylum directed
Speaker 1: by him night Shyam Lane and I really do feel
Speaker 1: like you were walking such a delicate walk, and that
Speaker 1: might have been the thing that that threw off so
Speaker 1: many people, because otherwise I could still see people tracking
Speaker 1: with this, and you know, if they had been on
Speaker 1: the ride so far.
Speaker 2: So I watched this with my daughter last night and
Speaker 2: it gets to that part at the end and it
Speaker 2: has that text, and she goes, so, so this is
Speaker 2: all real and and I, oh, right, Like she thought
Speaker 2: it was like a documentary.
Speaker 1: You know, that's funny because usually that, yeah, that happens
Speaker 1: at the end of like biopics exactly.
Speaker 2: So I said, no, it's just made up, and she goes,
Speaker 2: that's weird. I was like, Yeah, a lot of people
Speaker 2: felt that I do.
Speaker 1: Always actually kind of find it weird when they do
Speaker 1: that in fictional fictional.
Speaker 2: Yeah, they did there with three Kings if you remember,
Speaker 2: actually they'll but that worked for me. So I don't know,
Speaker 2: but that because the whole tone is in that vein.
Speaker 1: That's true. That's true. But apparently early previews of the
Speaker 1: movie and some in France and certain other places, they
Speaker 1: didn't have the text.
Speaker 2: It would have been better without it, I think, so,
Speaker 2: for sure it would have been better without it.
Speaker 1: But I can understand.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 1: I would kind of like to see the original ending.
Speaker 1: What I read was basically what happens, and you can
Speaker 1: look this up online. Actually I have it right here.
Speaker 2: This is real quick. Yeah, you know, there's something about
Speaker 2: the way Bruce willis, the way he goes Jesus Christ,
Speaker 2: the way he says that. It's like the subtle thing,
Speaker 2: but it's it's there's something so honest about his delivery
Speaker 2: of that. Yeah, that is right here, just the way
Speaker 2: it's like it's like he's struggling to get the words
Speaker 2: out right, and it's so perfectly encompasses the scope of
Speaker 2: the betrayal. He must be feeling, right, you know, it's
Speaker 2: a little thing. But I've always that's always just the
Speaker 2: way he the way he plays this moment is fantastic.
Speaker 1: Because it's not big exactly. Yeah, I'm not a mistake
Speaker 1: you say that. I remember you saying this, like I
Speaker 1: associate this line with you for some reason.
Speaker 2: I don't know why. It was the kids. Well, I've
Speaker 2: said before with reference to don Old Trump at the
Speaker 2: twenty eleven White House Correspondence dinner where Obama was like
Speaker 2: dunking on him. You remember that, right, And I was like,
Speaker 2: that was his mister Glass moment, right right, right right,
Speaker 2: He's like they called me mister Glass. But like and
Speaker 2: and here we are, fourteen years later, still dealing with
Speaker 2: that shit.
Speaker 1: But this, this is what I'm talking about, Like, you
Speaker 1: have that moment, like you're saying, like he's Bruce Willison
Speaker 1: is doing like a real, understated, realistic reaction to this,
Speaker 1: and him walking away and then suddenly freeze frame. David
Speaker 1: Done called the cops later, and you're like, whoa, whoa.
Speaker 1: It's like it's a jarring.
Speaker 2: Scene to me. Well, here, okay, I first of all
Speaker 2: worth mentioning that last shot of Elijah smiling. That's like
Speaker 2: the first time in the whole movie. He smiles, Yeah,
Speaker 2: because now he understands Now he knows his purpose, right, Yeah,
Speaker 2: I think the movie would have worked better without the
Speaker 2: text Elijah Price is now in a insane asylum or
Speaker 2: whatever it says. But I think the polarizing reaction would
Speaker 2: have been no matter what I think.
Speaker 1: So no one I think, because there's no button at
Speaker 1: the end or anything. And I just want to read
Speaker 1: this real quickly, just because I have it. I thought
Speaker 1: this was interesting. So this is from a draft. I'm
Speaker 1: not saying this is the shooting draft. I don't know
Speaker 1: for sure, but basically, after Elijah said his thing, it says,
Speaker 1: David looks like he stopped breathing. As he backs up
Speaker 1: in the store, Customers step between him and Elijah. Elijah
Speaker 1: becomes obscured and then blocked from view an exterior street.
Speaker 1: David emerges from the store slowly. He braces himself against
Speaker 1: a parked car, and then keeps on walking in a
Speaker 1: nightmarish days. We pull back as David done blends in
Speaker 1: with dozens and dozens of ordinary people walking on ordinary
Speaker 1: street in an ordinary city. Fade to black, like there's
Speaker 1: just a little bit more time to let the thing
Speaker 1: I'm not saying that that would have made everybody like
Speaker 1: love it, but it just happens really abruptly.
Speaker 2: I feel, Okay, well, a couple points. I think fundamentally,
Speaker 2: the problem with the ending, no matter whether the one
Speaker 2: you just read or the one in the movie, is
Speaker 2: it doesn't really give us a moment of catharsis.
Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying, Yes, exactly, no matter what.
Speaker 2: And the other problem and and really the problem is
Speaker 2: a bit because because the Catharis is Elijah's, right, He's
Speaker 2: the one who has this release of emotion, and fundamentally
Speaker 2: we're not gonna right. The other problem, and this is
Speaker 2: not an unbreakable problem, it's a sixth sense problem, is
Speaker 2: that the sixth sense just happened to have the greatest
Speaker 2: twist of all time. And so people went into this
Speaker 2: one being like, oh, give me more of that. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And and that's that's the essential, you know what I mean,
Speaker 2: Like like he he he hit a home run and
Speaker 2: so the next time, you know, he only got on base. Yeah,
Speaker 2: That's that's how people perceived it, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And it's too bad because again I can live
Speaker 1: with it because I love this movie as a whole, Right,
Speaker 1: but I can totally see where that that is, this
Speaker 1: little hiccup at the end unfortunately after such like a
Speaker 1: really really strong.
Speaker 2: And I don't know what he could have done to
Speaker 2: address that. I just think I think that the nature
Speaker 2: of the story was such that, like, you know, unless
Speaker 2: you yeah, I don't know, you know, I think the
Speaker 2: way it's structured, there's nothing. I was like, maybe if
Speaker 2: you find a way to end it on the emotional
Speaker 2: high point of David reconciling with his wife or whatever,
Speaker 2: but you still got to do the Elijah reveal, and
Speaker 2: you can't do that before totally well.
Speaker 1: You know what's interesting too is Nina Jacobson, who's the
Speaker 1: president of production at Disney at the time. She was saying,
Speaker 1: this is again from the Oral History, which I highly
Speaker 1: recommend if you're a fan of this movie. It's Entertainment Weekly.
Speaker 1: She said, this is a quote I remember conversations about
Speaker 1: the ending. The hero walking away from the villain always
Speaker 1: troubled me, and so I wonder if that's another thing
Speaker 1: with the text where it's like, well, David did something
Speaker 1: about it, because if he did, just you know, he's
Speaker 1: basically talking to this terrorist and then just kind of
Speaker 1: whoa man, I can't believe it and it just walks away.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: That wouldn't feel quite right either.
Speaker 2: Well, so this, this is the thing going back to
Speaker 2: what I was saying before, Like, in real life it
Speaker 2: would be you that's what happened. What would happen. You'd
Speaker 2: go to the cops be like, hey, that guy's a
Speaker 2: terrorist and then they would arrest him. That's like what
Speaker 2: would happen in real life. M Right. So based on
Speaker 2: the grounded ethos of the film, it's consistent with that.
Speaker 2: The problem is we reflexively audiences are conditioned to want
Speaker 2: that moment where the hero defeats the villain. Right, So
Speaker 2: this is what this gets to what I've said to
Speaker 2: you before. You always have that scene in movies where
Speaker 2: the hero is about to beat the bad guy and
Speaker 2: then it's like, no, you're not worth it, and then
Speaker 2: the bad guy does something that forces the hero to
Speaker 2: kill them. Yeah, so that you get to have your
Speaker 2: cake and eat it too, man.
Speaker 1: So what how what is I don't know, a little
Speaker 1: button or catharsis we get because I again I like,
Speaker 1: I don't mind the down ending.
Speaker 2: No, I kind of like it.
Speaker 1: Actually, yeah, it's just the yeah, that little.
Speaker 2: I mean, it is amusing to me that your friend
Speaker 2: Opening Night had such a visceral reaction.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, it was a big react. Well it said, yeah,
Speaker 1: she was literally telling people not to go. I'll never
Speaker 1: forget that. That was so funny.
Speaker 2: But like, what was the size of your group?
Speaker 1: Something like four people maybe?
Speaker 2: Okay? So was it like fifty to fifty? Man?
Speaker 1: I wish I could remember, because she's the thing I
Speaker 1: remember most, but I would be willing to about. We
Speaker 1: were mostly like in favor. I loved it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, see, I remember seeing it Opening Night and I
Speaker 2: liked it. I definitely liked it, but I didn't love it.
Speaker 2: And then the more I got to revisit it, the
Speaker 2: more I grew to appreciate all the things that happened
Speaker 2: in it. You know, I remember because this was Fall
Speaker 2: of two thousand, right, so fall of O one? Was
Speaker 2: it all one? Yeah? It must have been. I had
Speaker 2: a suspense thriller class at Colombia and the professor showed it,
Speaker 2: and so I got to re experience it. I was like, oh, man,
Speaker 2: you know this really works. And then I remember shortly
Speaker 2: after that, I went and bought the DVD and I
Speaker 2: watched it a bunch of times, and so it was
Speaker 2: definitely it was like again, I I came out of
Speaker 2: theater having liked it a lot, but I definitely remember
Speaker 2: being like, well, it's not as good as the sixth sense,
Speaker 2: you know, sure, And it took me a little bit
Speaker 2: to be like, oh, it's doing something totally different, you know. Yeah, yeah, man,
Speaker 2: I mean what can imagine trying to follow up the
Speaker 2: sixth cents? That's that's what I'm saying, right, I mean,
Speaker 2: it's it's that's a tough that's a tough situation to
Speaker 2: be in, you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean but you you said it perfectly already.
Speaker 1: But that movie has the perfect when the reveal happens,
Speaker 1: it has the most perfect swell of all time, you know,
Speaker 1: and and helping us understand what happened, and then he
Speaker 1: also gets a goodbye, you know. Yeah, it's like.
Speaker 2: It's it's it contains the Catharsis within it along with
Speaker 2: the shock of I mean, everything works, you know, and
Speaker 2: you know, I I I think that's the mistake he made.
Speaker 2: It was trying to become twist ending guy, right, you know,
Speaker 2: but I again, I don't know how you do Unbreakable
Speaker 2: without the twist you have to have the twist. It
Speaker 2: is kind of essential. I like it.
Speaker 1: I like the twist. I like the so that that's
Speaker 1: the villain was was here's the villain all along and
Speaker 1: he was rooting this person out and that sucks. That's
Speaker 1: kind yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but hey, let us know your thoughts on Unbreakable
Speaker 2: or let us know your thoughts on our thoughts on Unbreakable.
Speaker 2: You can email us at Movie Film Podcast dot gmail
Speaker 2: dot com. You can also hit like on our Facebook
Speaker 2: page Facebook dot com slash movie Film Podcast and message
Speaker 2: us there. As always, please go to Apple Podcasts and
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Speaker 1: If you head over to patreon dot com slash moviefilm
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Speaker 2: There we go, and if you're looking for me online,
Speaker 2: you can find me on social media at Zachi's corner.
Speaker 2: That's the Akis Corner. You can also find my reviews
Speaker 2: and writing at the San Francisco Chronicle and also at
Speaker 2: IGN and The Rap What About You, Brian, You can.
Speaker 1: Find episodes I've written of Puppy Dog Pals and Young
Speaker 1: Jedi Adventures streaming on Disney.
Speaker 2: Plus and with that on behalf of my partner Brian Holm.
Speaker 2: My name is Zachi asand this has been our movie
Speaker 2: film commentary track four Unbreakable. We'll catch you next time.
Speaker 2: Thanks folks,