Speaker 1: Bill cunning into Great American. Of course, what happened October
Speaker 1: seventh of last year was an incredible moment, a terrible
Speaker 1: moment for the Jewish people and for the world, because
Speaker 1: more than a thousand Jews were killed, two hundred and
Speaker 1: fifty were taken hostage. As we sit here, there continues
Speaker 1: to be large number of hostages. We pray to God
Speaker 1: are alive, but likely not, but we'll see what happens.
Speaker 1: The peace talks continue and nauseam because Hamas does not
Speaker 1: one piece. Hamas wants war. And so when the Sinhwar
Speaker 1: and the other leaders of Hamas talk about the war
Speaker 1: and the civilian casualties, that is what Hamas wants are
Speaker 1: more Palestinian casualties because it fits their purpose. And for
Speaker 1: the one of the first books out on this is
Speaker 1: Seth Fronzman The October seventh War, and Seth Fronsman, I
Speaker 1: think you're in Jerusalem as I speak, and welcome to
Speaker 1: the Bill Cunningham Show. And first of all, can you
Speaker 1: tell the American people what happened on October the seventh
Speaker 1: and how the psyche and the security and the safety
Speaker 1: of Jews have been compromised, and how did it take place.
Speaker 1: Just give us the overview of what happened October the seventh.
Speaker 2: Sure, well, thank you so much for having me on. Basically,
Speaker 2: Hamas is an extremist Paris organization that has existed since
Speaker 2: the nineteen eighty and around two thousand and five, it
Speaker 2: was able to take over the Gaza Strip and by
Speaker 2: killing off its rivals, and then it turned after two
Speaker 2: thousand and five sixty seven, it turned the Gaza Strip
Speaker 2: basically into a fortress of terror. It built hundreds of
Speaker 2: miles of underground tunnels, and it trained around thirty thousand fighters.
Speaker 2: And what it did was it basically prepared a massive
Speaker 2: surprise attack on Israel. It took place, you know, last October,
Speaker 2: about ten ten months ago, and it did a surprise
Speaker 2: attack just like Pearl Harbor or nine to eleven. It
Speaker 2: sent thousands of men to attack this defence. There's a
Speaker 2: kind of security fence that goes around Gaza. It attacked
Speaker 2: around thirty places along the fence, thousands of guys riding
Speaker 2: motorcycles carrying AK forty sevens and the RPGs. It also
Speaker 2: used small drones to attack some of Israel's antennas and
Speaker 2: some of the technology, including they are basically kind of
Speaker 2: like Israel have these remote controlled machine guns that were
Speaker 2: on these powers around the Gaza strip and they neutralize
Speaker 2: otos and once the Hamas guys had gotten through the
Speaker 2: they basically each squad of Hamas members about thirty in
Speaker 2: each place, thirty to fifty. Their goal was to attack
Speaker 2: Israeli civilian communities and massacre the people that they came across,
Speaker 2: and then kidnapped some of the ones that survived. So
Speaker 2: each imagine thirty groups of men, you know, thirty tons
Speaker 2: ten and each of them attacking a small community or
Speaker 2: attacking civilians who were out riding bicycles or you know,
Speaker 2: out for a morning job. It was about six thirty
Speaker 2: in the morning, and they covered their approach by firing
Speaker 2: thousands of rockets so that most of the people would
Speaker 2: be hiding in their safers, in their communities or whatever
Speaker 2: they were taking cover, and they were able to overrun
Speaker 2: the Israeli troops. There were about five hundred to seven
Speaker 2: hundreds of road troops on the border. Most of those
Speaker 2: troops were overrun or they were coming under see each
Speaker 2: fighting it out, and that gave the Hamas about you know,
Speaker 2: five hours to commit this massacre up until Israel could
Speaker 2: basically bring in forces to bear that were able to
Speaker 2: push the hamas Teris back or neutralize them, or capture
Speaker 2: a few of them and plug all these gaps from
Speaker 2: the fence. And it then took another week kind of
Speaker 2: to even figure out how many people have been killed,
Speaker 2: because some of the bodies were burned, or they were
Speaker 2: or they were killed in different ways. So the then Israel,
Speaker 2: of course has been fighting ten months. Basically the guys
Speaker 2: are to try to defeat themass.
Speaker 1: Yes, you know, Seth. One of the phrases that came
Speaker 1: out of nine to eleven was the failure of imagination.
Speaker 1: And I was there, as you know, at last May.
Speaker 1: It was it was almost impossible. The Israeli people could
Speaker 1: not have imagined this is all taking place. I call
Speaker 1: it a failure of imagination. And so is that an
Speaker 1: apt phrase to use? Because no one in Israel thought
Speaker 1: this was possible. And the Kibbutza's are in southern Israel,
Speaker 1: they are little enclaves anywhere. For me, one hundred and
Speaker 1: maybe five thousand people more or less living in the
Speaker 1: desert and small groups and an idyllic setting. Well, why
Speaker 1: wasn't the idea of prepared for this. Can you answer
Speaker 1: that question?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think it's one of these things
Speaker 2: where you get used to an enemy. Hamas was an enemy.
Speaker 2: It was an organization, you know, sworn to destroyers or
Speaker 2: own killed Jewish people. But the common is that it
Speaker 2: had been there on the border controlling Gaza since as
Speaker 2: I said, around two thousand and five, two thousand and seven,
Speaker 2: So this was a known enemy. You know, think about
Speaker 2: it like the cartels in Mexico or something where you're
Speaker 2: used to having these enemies or dangerous people, but you
Speaker 2: become complacent sometimes. And I've been down on the Gaza
Speaker 2: border up covered every war there since two thousand and
Speaker 2: nine or so, and I remember driving along there or
Speaker 2: riding a bicycle whatever. I mean, you just you don't
Speaker 2: feel that there's you know, thirty thousand guys on the
Speaker 2: other side that are trained to kill you because you
Speaker 2: don't see them. And I think, you know, unfortunately, you know,
Speaker 2: Israel had an intelligence failure that the days meaning up
Speaker 2: to the attack and didn't have enough soldiers, and Israel
Speaker 2: had become complacent and it didn't have enough tanks on
Speaker 2: the border. There were only about a dozen tanks. There
Speaker 2: were only two combat helicopters that were on alert that morning,
Speaker 2: and they were actually in northern Israel because Israel was
Speaker 2: a played mortar fighting as Balla and Iran, right, So
Speaker 2: basically everything that could go wrong went wrong, and unfortunately
Speaker 2: complacency led to this massive massacre. And now everyone is
Speaker 2: trying to learn lessons from that and try to make
Speaker 2: it never happen again. But you mentioned nine to eleven.
Speaker 2: I mean we never I remember nine to eleven as well.
Speaker 2: We never imagined people would fly planes into the World
Speaker 2: Trade Center and the Pentagon at the same time, right,
Speaker 2: I mean we might have imagined one plane, might someone
Speaker 2: might do it with one plane, And I think Israel
Speaker 2: was a wedding for a small attack involving you know,
Speaker 2: a few hundred guys. It never imagined that the enemy
Speaker 2: could plan such a complex murderous operations. And now, of
Speaker 2: course we you know, I hopefully you will have never
Speaker 2: underestimated if enemies again. But it's just that's what happens
Speaker 2: sometimes when europe Perry's or security officials become a bit complacent.
Speaker 1: Seth frontsmen and jump ahead to today and after the
Speaker 1: Democratic Convention, there's this push to have a ceasefire and
Speaker 1: I make the analogy that I could not imagine Georgie Patten,
Speaker 1: General Patten was on the outskirts of Berlin in World
Speaker 1: War Two, and that somebody would want a cease fire
Speaker 1: leaving Adolf Hitler in charge of Berlin, acting as if
Speaker 1: he's going to change the stripes. Can you talk politically
Speaker 1: how much sense it would make for Israel and now
Speaker 1: to have a cease fire leaving Hamas in charge of Gaza.
Speaker 1: Isn't that just delaying the inevitable for the next attack
Speaker 1: and they tell you up front we're going to kill.
Speaker 1: What's gonna happen next will be much worse than October
Speaker 1: the seventh. And so why would Benjamin Netchinyahu agree to
Speaker 1: a peace treaty in which Hamas, with their hundreds of
Speaker 1: miles of tunnels and their complete control of Gaza and
Speaker 1: the fact they're given billions of dollars from nations all
Speaker 1: over the world that they use for military purposes, why
Speaker 1: would Israel after this allow Hamas to stay in charge
Speaker 1: of Gaza.
Speaker 2: Well, I think it's a perfect comparison. You may with
Speaker 2: the being there in nineteen forty four and deciding to
Speaker 2: kind of give the not be a feat fire. History
Speaker 2: shows you can never have if you have a vicious,
Speaker 2: genocidal enemy that doesn't play by the same rules as
Speaker 2: you and it's sworn to kill you exactly, you can't
Speaker 2: have a seat fire. It just prolongs the inevitable of
Speaker 2: another war. Now, I think that Israel could have a
Speaker 2: short term sease fire like it did back in November
Speaker 2: where there was a ten day fees fire in order
Speaker 2: to get some of the most vulnerable hostages out of Gaza.
Speaker 2: I think that you know, people want the hostages to
Speaker 2: be returned home. The other option is to try to
Speaker 2: free them in military attacks and rescue missions. That of
Speaker 2: course mean that may risk lies as well, but I
Speaker 2: think yeah U from me. Any kind of seat spire
Speaker 2: that leaves Hamas in power is rewarding not only Hamas,
Speaker 2: but let's remember it's also empowering those who back Kamas,
Speaker 2: including Iran and the other countries like Russia or shiner A,
Speaker 2: Turkey or tatar and others. So it's important to remember
Speaker 2: that any attempt to leave Hamas in power or let
Speaker 2: it feel that it can win, will embold in all
Speaker 2: of America's enemies and all of Israel's enemies, and they
Speaker 2: will take a lesson from that that they can get
Speaker 2: away with this and do it somewhere else. So that
Speaker 2: certainly would be a good reason not to allow Kamas
Speaker 2: any bruing space or any kind of long term inspire Seth.
Speaker 1: The head of the snake is Iran. They're the exporters
Speaker 1: of terror all around the world. Why doesn't I've been
Speaker 1: told by a US retired general that if we said
Speaker 1: to Israel, take out Iran not using nuclear means, there's
Speaker 1: three oil exporting ports that would be destroyed by Israeli
Speaker 1: air force and missiles. They'd be out of business economically.
Speaker 1: There's two or three dams in the country that provide
Speaker 1: all the drinking water. Take out the dams, eviscerate ten
Speaker 1: to fifteen power stations, and Iran suddenly they're back in
Speaker 1: the Middle Ages. Why doesn't I can imagine Iran would
Speaker 1: do it absolutely. What doesn't Israel take the military approach,
Speaker 1: not using nuclear weapons and destroy Iran, which is the
Speaker 1: head of the snake. Why don't they do it?
Speaker 2: Don't?
Speaker 1: Why Why doesn't Benjamin NETANYAHUO do that to end the war?
Speaker 2: I think in order for Israel to do that, it
Speaker 2: would want to have a coalition with other countries like
Speaker 2: the United States or Western allies. I don't think going alone,
Speaker 2: you know, that could lead Israel to be condemned. So
Speaker 2: I think Israel has to be very careful. Also, remember
Speaker 2: Israel is still fighting a war in Gaza, it has
Speaker 2: it has troops fighting guys every day against Sarah's. Israel
Speaker 2: is facing an onslaught from the Iranian back group has boot.
Speaker 2: So anyway, what argument could be made that we could
Speaker 2: go for the head of the snake. But I think
Speaker 2: that Israel has occurred to try to defeat the closer
Speaker 2: enemies first because they pose the big challenge. And Israel
Speaker 2: is hoping that Israel's western allies, like the United States,
Speaker 2: we'll be able to pick up some of the slack.
Speaker 2: And also you know, standing with Israel against the Iranian
Speaker 2: threats and things like that. So we have to see
Speaker 2: how the Iranian threat develops. You know, will Iran rushed
Speaker 2: to weaponize the nuclear program. That would be the redline
Speaker 2: I think for Israel, And so we have to see
Speaker 2: what Iran does next.
Speaker 1: When Iran has the capability of destroying Israel, it will
Speaker 1: do it because it's a culture of death, not of life. Russians, Chinese, Turks,
Speaker 1: they all want to live life. But the Islamic extremists
Speaker 1: in Iran and not the Iranian people, but the leaders
Speaker 1: do not want to that. They want to die because
Speaker 1: they think there's seventy two versions are in heaven. It's
Speaker 1: a culture of death. And lastly, I want I want
Speaker 1: to get to lastly, I want to get your reaction
Speaker 1: to this. I've read some stuff out of Europe that
Speaker 1: the goal of Hesbla and Hamas in Iran is to
Speaker 1: bleed Israel dry over time. The three great drivers of
Speaker 1: the Israeli economy are tourism, agricultural products, and high tech.
Speaker 1: I would imagine right now that those industries don't exist
Speaker 1: in any measurable amount. There's one hundred thousand Jews in
Speaker 1: northern Israel that's moved south to live with others. The
Speaker 1: economy's got to be on its back. Why wouldn't the
Speaker 1: forces of evil and Iran simply bleed Israel dry over
Speaker 1: the next three to five years, so they collapse economically,
Speaker 1: and then here comes the hordes of individuals around Israel
Speaker 1: to kill the Jews once again. Is that something that
Speaker 1: kind of marshals itself into your thinking that the long
Speaker 1: term just kill Israel indirectly when it can't do it directly.
Speaker 2: I think that's partly true. Ran does want to basically
Speaker 2: force Israel to endless wars of attrition on the borders,
Speaker 2: in which it's not in Israel's interest by to fight
Speaker 2: these long wars, whereas as Bulah and groups like the
Speaker 2: Huthis of groups in Iraq, they don't have anything to lose.
Speaker 2: They've already bankrupted their country, so it doesn't matter if
Speaker 2: them that the country becomes more bankrupt like a racer
Speaker 2: or lemanons. So that's definitely part of the running the strategy.
Speaker 2: I would say that in Israel, in terms of what's
Speaker 2: happened in israel'ms the economy. It's true that turns and
Speaker 2: is probably down ninety percent, but I think the high
Speaker 2: tech sector continues to thrive because high tech is exportable
Speaker 2: whether or not there's a war. And also remember that
Speaker 2: some of the high tech is used in Israel's defense systems.
Speaker 2: I mean, that's how Israel bill Ironville, and that's how Israel,
Speaker 2: you know, trained pilots to fly at thirty five. So
Speaker 2: the high tech actually is something that Israel exports and
Speaker 2: also works with US Defense Company. So there is a
Speaker 2: silver lining probably there in terms of the agriculture of yeah,
Speaker 2: there's has been very bad to the north. I think
Speaker 2: the agriculture is south, and what I've seen has rebounded impressively.
Speaker 2: So you know, Israel has always been under siege since
Speaker 2: it was founded in nineteen forty eight. It knows how
Speaker 2: to do this, but it's definitely not in Israel's interest
Speaker 2: to fight this war for the next numerous years. And
Speaker 2: Iran has to be stopped, and Iran supplies of whip
Speaker 2: and the groups like as well, it must be stopped.
Speaker 2: Or around Williams, you do exactly what you said. We
Speaker 2: just try to slowly believe.
Speaker 1: Israel, all right, Frensman, author of the October seventh War.
Speaker 1: I don't want to get into particulars of what these
Speaker 1: murderers did to women and babies. But the most despicable
Speaker 1: acts of human can commit against a mother who's pregnant
Speaker 1: was committed. Most are hyped up on drugs of one
Speaker 1: type or another. These thirty thousand fighters, and as we speak,
Speaker 1: there's about ten to fifteen thousand of Moss still alive
Speaker 1: wanting to fight the next war. This isn't ending it.
Speaker 1: It must be won. Israel must win this war by
Speaker 1: any means necessary, because its existence is at risk. Seth
Speaker 1: Fronzman the October seventh War. Thank you for coming on
Speaker 1: the Bill Cunningham Show. And Seth, you're a great American
Speaker 1: and thank you very much. Thank you, God bless you.
Speaker 1: Let's continue with more. I couldnt imagine a situation where
Speaker 1: Iran had the military power of Israel and they wouldn't
Speaker 1: use it. And Israel is the only country on Earth
Speaker 1: that is not permitted to win its wars. Don't Cunningham
Speaker 1: with you every afternoon on news radio seven hundred WLW