Speaker 1: This is Adam Spiegelan, the host of my second favorite
Speaker 1: movie podcast called Proudly Resent at Proudly Resents dot com.
Speaker 1: And you are listening to my favorite the number one,
Speaker 1: the Rejection Booth. Mike puts so much work into it.
Speaker 1: If you listen to my show, I put no work
Speaker 1: into it. Enjoy the rest of the show, you lucky
Speaker 1: son of a gun.
Speaker 2: Come on, come you tato.
Speaker 3: You read so here?
Speaker 2: Hey, folks, welome to a special episode of The Projection Booth.
Speaker 2: I'm your host, Mike White. On this episode, I am
Speaker 2: talking with Lyle Zanka. He's the director of assets and
Speaker 2: Technology over at G Kids, along with cultural critic Dan Chindell.
Speaker 2: All about Angel's Egg. It is a nineteen eighty five
Speaker 2: anime film from director Memoro Oshi, and it is touring
Speaker 2: the country currently in a new restoration opening at a
Speaker 2: lot of theaters wide, and it will be coming to
Speaker 2: four K blu Ray pretty soon as well, so keep
Speaker 2: an eye out for that. Thank you so much for listening,
Speaker 2: and I hope you enjoy this interview.
Speaker 4: Lyle.
Speaker 2: I want to start with you if I could then
Speaker 2: tell me a little bit more about you and your
Speaker 2: role at G Kids.
Speaker 3: Over G Kids I'm basically and charge of all of
Speaker 3: our technical and what we call post production, basically handling
Speaker 3: the internal lab services as we.
Speaker 2: Like to call them.
Speaker 3: For all of our distribution. There is something we do
Speaker 3: in house which I think is a little bit unique
Speaker 3: to us, but I basically oversee that, which can range
Speaker 3: from simply taking things we get from Japan, localizing them
Speaker 3: and distribute them to doing brand new four K uprises
Speaker 3: and things like that. We do quite a lot over here.
Speaker 2: I mean it sounds like with this Angel Sag brand
Speaker 2: it was a little bit of both, right, They restored
Speaker 2: it in Japan and then do you localize to hear.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so the restoration was done entirely in Japan with
Speaker 3: the trektors overseeing it, but here our main role in
Speaker 3: that whole process was to localize it, which includes a
Speaker 3: brand new, never before done the English dub of the film,
Speaker 3: which you know, despite its seventy something lines of dialogue,
Speaker 3: was something we felt was really important for us to
Speaker 3: do to get as many eyes on this film as possible,
Speaker 3: and as part of that dub, we also replicated what
Speaker 3: they did in Japan as this will be in Adobe Cinema.
Speaker 3: We did like Adobe Atmos mix of that doves as well.
Speaker 3: There's parody there between Japan and the US.
Speaker 2: Do you know from your Japanese counterparts how the print
Speaker 2: looked when they started the restoration of this.
Speaker 3: I don't have a ton of insight into exactly what
Speaker 3: that looked like. We're in the process right now of
Speaker 3: actually going through some quite a lot of interview footage
Speaker 3: that they had recorded between either music director or a
Speaker 3: mono himself having some discussions about what that process looked like.
Speaker 3: One of our localization managers here was actually explained to
Speaker 3: me she speaks Japanese as I don't, but she was
Speaker 3: watching that through before we've had it subtitled. I was
Speaker 3: doing a little bit of explaining about what that process
Speaker 3: looked like, and it sounded very interesting. But from what
Speaker 3: she said, it sounded like they almost had to go
Speaker 3: back and take everything apart and remake some things. I think,
Speaker 3: especially with the music, I think there was a lot
Speaker 3: of work involved in having to recreate that to modern
Speaker 3: quality standards. But having seen the print and done the
Speaker 3: Dolby Vision QC of those DCPs and everything, it looks
Speaker 3: absolutely incredible.
Speaker 2: When was the first time you actually saw Angel sag
Speaker 2: and what did you think.
Speaker 3: In its entirety. The first time I saw it was
Speaker 3: when we acquired it as g Kids. I've been aware
Speaker 3: of its existence for quite a long time. I think
Speaker 3: it's had a long infamous history as something very famous
Speaker 3: on things like Tumblr that people just loved the aesthetic
Speaker 3: of I would post online without ever having really seen it,
Speaker 3: considering it didn't really have a release outside of the
Speaker 3: United States, but as a big fan of a Mono
Speaker 3: and his artwork as one of my favorite artists ever
Speaker 3: since I joined Kids a little over five years ago,
Speaker 3: I was like, we have to acquire this film. I
Speaker 3: felt very lucky that they chose to do a four
Speaker 3: K restoration of this and that we were able to
Speaker 3: acquire it and give it the real attention it deserves
Speaker 3: and get it in front of as many people as possible,
Speaker 3: and especially in doing this Dolby Cinema released to me
Speaker 3: was really exciting.
Speaker 2: And then, yeah, same question for you.
Speaker 4: So I first saw Angel's Egg in college, and the
Speaker 4: way I saw it was the same way but I
Speaker 4: saw most anime at that time, which is fat I
Speaker 4: went to one of many pirate sites that existed where
Speaker 4: you could easily stream films like that. I could not
Speaker 4: tell you how I first heard of it, especially back
Speaker 4: in those days. I say as if it was a
Speaker 4: bat long ago. But it is remarkable, like how in
Speaker 4: a relatively short amount of time, like the mainstreaming of
Speaker 4: anime has made it much more accessible and like much
Speaker 4: more broadly recognized, and like to me, Bad Landscape is
Speaker 4: like almost completely changed from when I was younger. It
Speaker 4: was much more niche and everyone learned about different titles,
Speaker 4: different shows, different movies, certain ways. I might have learned
Speaker 4: about angel ZGG for first sign from like reading about
Speaker 4: it on TV tropes and thinking that sounds interesting, and
Speaker 4: that's how it was passed along for most of the
Speaker 4: forty years that's been since it came out, because it
Speaker 4: didn't get, as we know, a proper release in the States,
Speaker 4: but because there's always been a very dedicated audience for
Speaker 4: anime in the States, there's always been a robust bootleg market.
Speaker 4: So it started out with like bootlegs, and then with
Speaker 4: the Internet as that became more sophisticated, you could see
Speaker 4: it by a stream or via torrents. And I guess
Speaker 4: that another thing that has changed is that in more
Speaker 4: recent years, like people lost for recipes for how to
Speaker 4: Torent properly. But yeah, now we've it's finally available to
Speaker 4: see an allegitimate manner, and I still haven't been able
Speaker 4: to catch it on big screen. There was a few
Speaker 4: years ago much Valiehood screening at Japan Society here in
Speaker 4: New York, which a'mno is actually present for which I
Speaker 4: would have been incredible, but I was out of town
Speaker 4: when it happened. So I'm really thrilled that this is
Speaker 4: happening and that so many more people can now not
Speaker 4: just discover Angel's Egg, but also see it in a
Speaker 4: non bootleg form in crisp sound and video.
Speaker 2: What's kind of your relationship with this film?
Speaker 4: It's interesting I was changed over time. When I saw it,
Speaker 4: I was like nineteen or twenty, so a lot of
Speaker 4: the symbolism just went over my head and I just
Speaker 4: had the wow, Dan, that's crazy reaction to it, which
Speaker 4: I think is a big part of its reputation too.
Speaker 4: It's one of the more notorious Wow this movie is
Speaker 4: so weird and so inscrutable, what does it mean? It
Speaker 4: has that kind of reputation and that's definitely how I
Speaker 4: reacted to it when I was much younger, But then
Speaker 4: as I've come back to it over years. It I
Speaker 4: couldn't say for sure, but oh, I have the explanation
Speaker 4: for Angel Egg. What means absolutely you know, it's obvious, no,
Speaker 4: but it does certain thinkings resonate for me, especially that
Speaker 4: when I saw it in college, I was going to
Speaker 4: a Christian college. I was raised Christian, I was Christian
Speaker 4: at the time, and then since then I now agnostic.
Speaker 4: And so going back to Angel's Egg with that amount
Speaker 4: of religious symbolism in it, I am changing my own
Speaker 4: perspective on faith. Has been really interesting. It's definitely led
Speaker 4: to and resonating with me more.
Speaker 3: Hopefully you'll be in a little bit of luck because
Speaker 3: I was at that Japan Society screening that Amano was
Speaker 3: at and it was recorded, and we are hoping to
Speaker 3: actually put that together into a nice Blu Ray bonus feature,
Speaker 3: so hopefully you'll get to experience that one day.
Speaker 2: That's awesome. What is the next steps with this? Now
Speaker 2: that the restoration is done, Now that the dub has
Speaker 2: been done, the upmost is complete. Where are you going
Speaker 2: from there with this? Lyle?
Speaker 3: Once our theatrical run, we have some special'll be screenings
Speaker 3: in advance, and then our wider release I think the
Speaker 3: week after, and then from there, I think the next
Speaker 3: step will be its streaming debut on HBO Max, which
Speaker 3: I think is really exciting, which is part of a
Speaker 3: larger deal that we've done with them to release like
Speaker 3: lots of different movies. And then after that, as soon
Speaker 3: as we can get it to market, we'll have a
Speaker 3: couple different skews of Blu rays coming out for people
Speaker 3: to purchase, and I think once I've got that in
Speaker 3: my hands, I'll feel like the cycle is complete in that,
Speaker 3: like my desire to acquire this film and get it
Speaker 3: in front of people, having a physical product I think
Speaker 3: will be really exciting.
Speaker 2: Is there a normal process for you when it comes
Speaker 2: to some of these releases that you're doing, or is
Speaker 2: it always a little bit different and you just have
Speaker 2: to roll with punches.
Speaker 3: Every film is different every release. We try to give
Speaker 3: it the attention it deserves, release it in a way
Speaker 3: that makes sense for what it is. But I think
Speaker 3: one of the things we always think is extremely important
Speaker 3: is giving films a really good deserve theatrical release. There's
Speaker 3: very few instances where we acquire a film and it
Speaker 3: goes direct to streaming or anything. Like that, so I
Speaker 3: think at its core that's something that Ji Kids has
Speaker 3: always believed in. It is giving films a proper theatrical
Speaker 3: release and physical releases as well, but usually given our
Speaker 3: relationship with Japan, it's usually theatrical comes first so we
Speaker 3: can release it as close to when they are as possible,
Speaker 3: and then the process of creating a Blu ray can
Speaker 3: take quite a while, so we'll try to get that
Speaker 3: out as soon as we can.
Speaker 2: We can take some time now. Daniel mentioned his reading
Speaker 2: out of the film, and I want to get back
Speaker 2: into that definitely. But what's your take on it? When
Speaker 2: you see this is what's your worst shock test when
Speaker 2: it comes to Angels Egg.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think what I first saw it, I agree
Speaker 3: with what Daniel was saying, is that you see it
Speaker 3: and you're just like wow. That was something I really
Speaker 3: don't know what to make of that There's so much
Speaker 3: symbolism and imagery going on. But having watched it half
Speaker 3: a dozen times or more in the last six months,
Speaker 3: just during the process of getting this ready for release,
Speaker 3: I think my views on it have did quite a lot.
Speaker 3: But I do think it's one of those films where
Speaker 3: you can take almost anything you want from it. Like
Speaker 3: Daniel was saying, I think a lot of people take
Speaker 3: the interpretation of the loss of faith based I think
Speaker 3: partially on some things that Oshe himself has maybe said
Speaker 3: in the past, but I think also just the dichotomy
Speaker 3: between the two main characters, how different they are and
Speaker 3: how differently they see the world, I think is a
Speaker 3: really you can almost apply that to a lot of
Speaker 3: different things in life and see it that way. But
Speaker 3: when I look at the film, I do see it.
Speaker 3: It's like this back and forth between the two main characters,
Speaker 3: where the one has a lot of hope for the
Speaker 3: future and the one is very skeptical and cynical and
Speaker 3: would rather know the truth than just blindly hope that
Speaker 3: things will get better or this egg will hatch to
Speaker 3: something beautiful. He'd rather just learn the truth now. And
Speaker 3: I think that's really interesting, and I think you can
Speaker 3: take away what's beautiful about the film is that you
Speaker 3: can really just take from it something unique. Almost every
Speaker 3: time I see it, I find something new that I
Speaker 3: can apply it to.
Speaker 4: It is a very dialectical film, pulling equally from like
Speaker 4: Beckett and Tarkovsky, with these just two characters, And yeah,
Speaker 4: I think that the evolving perception and evolving reaction to
Speaker 4: it fits into that dialogue film itself, especially if it's good,
Speaker 4: will resonate in different ways, and then its continued exhibition
Speaker 4: and dispersion creates new dialogue over time. And with a
Speaker 4: film as rich in symbolism and as open ter interpretation
Speaker 4: as this, that means that there's a lot different avenues
Speaker 4: for conversation.
Speaker 3: What leads to a lot of its history and its
Speaker 3: long term but small scale fame amongst the specific communities.
Speaker 3: Is just like how hard it was to get the
Speaker 3: fact that even in Japan when this film was released,
Speaker 3: it was really straight to home video. I know, oh
Speaker 3: she has talked about in the past it prevented him
Speaker 3: from getting any work because it was so poorly received.
Speaker 3: So seeing it come back around forty years later and
Speaker 3: having all this interest around it, having so many people
Speaker 3: discussing it wanting to see it, it permitted at New
Speaker 3: York Film Festival, and I think the audience reaction to
Speaker 3: that was really positive. People had a lot of great
Speaker 3: things to say, were really intrigued by it. So to
Speaker 3: see that basic one eighty of this direct to home
Speaker 3: video Japanese release of a film it involved two of
Speaker 3: the like profound creators in Oshi and Mono, just like
Speaker 3: collaborating on something like this to see it like come
Speaker 3: full circle and get a proper theatrical release in Japan,
Speaker 3: get a proper theatrical release here in the US, it'll
Speaker 3: get true home video Blu ray release, It'll go on
Speaker 3: streaming like it's really getting I feel like it's moment
Speaker 3: that it really deserved. But so many people only knew
Speaker 3: about it because they either heard about it and had
Speaker 3: to torrent it, or they saw random gifts on Tumblr
Speaker 3: that just people really liked the aesthetic of it, but
Speaker 3: really did know the full story of the film. I'm
Speaker 3: really happy to see where it's come.
Speaker 2: How much of the dubbing process were you a part of?
Speaker 3: Our localization manager really oversees that, and we do work
Speaker 3: with a studio call NAIV who did the dub. They
Speaker 3: do a lot of our dubs in terms of my involvement,
Speaker 3: and that was really just making sure they had the
Speaker 3: assets they needed, making sure they do the specs, making
Speaker 3: sure they were making the Dolby atmost versions so we
Speaker 3: could have parody, but really creatively because of my own
Speaker 3: interest in the film and my own passion for it.
Speaker 3: I was having the person managing our dubs need the
Speaker 3: casting selects and options and things. I gave a little
Speaker 3: bit of feedback and read through the dub script and
Speaker 3: gave some feedback just because I felt passionate about it.
Speaker 3: But it's not my traditional role. I just wanted to
Speaker 3: involve myself as much as I could.
Speaker 2: Dan when you saw this, did you see it? Subtitle dubbed?
Speaker 4: Part of the restition of bootlegging anime is the restridition
Speaker 4: of fan subs. I think that someone could do a
Speaker 4: really interesting study in translation through comparing different versions of
Speaker 4: fan subs over the years, especially with also official subs,
Speaker 4: because anime fans, I don't know if you might have noticed,
Speaker 4: but they're very opinionated on many subjects, and especially on
Speaker 4: copper translation. That was actually one of the earliest ways
Speaker 4: that I was introduced to translation philosophy without even thinking
Speaker 4: about or being conscious of. It was the different ways
Speaker 4: that different fan translators with subtitle things. You get the
Speaker 4: ones that are more literal, the ones that are trying
Speaker 4: to be more poetic, the ones that think, oh out
Speaker 4: of the translate this part because it's well known, like
Speaker 4: how honorifics work or whatever. And yeah, every stream of
Speaker 4: an anime on the English language website would have of
Speaker 4: course come with the fan translated subs, and often they
Speaker 4: would insurge themselves into the credit sequences, just so you
Speaker 4: know who to properly pay tribute to for helping making
Speaker 4: that accessible to you.
Speaker 2: As what a freelance culture writer in Brooklyn, what do
Speaker 2: you working out.
Speaker 4: Of these days? I write about a lot of things,
Speaker 4: not just film able it is mostly what I cover,
Speaker 4: but also I've written about art, theater, television, video games.
Speaker 4: I recently was part of a really wonderful retrospective of
Speaker 4: Hideo Kojima's video games for the website Reverse Shots, covering
Speaker 4: the deaf stranding games for them. Continuing the theme of like
Speaker 4: Japanese films, I'm writing about the upcoming not it's been
Speaker 4: out in Japan, but like it's coming out here and
Speaker 4: stay soon Kokuho, which is notable because it has become
Speaker 4: the second highest grossing live action Japanese film at the
Speaker 4: Japanese box office and has actually led to a resurgence
Speaker 4: in the interest in kabuki in Japan. So it's very
Speaker 4: interesting stuff going on.
Speaker 2: And Lole, I know that, you know, the road of
Speaker 2: Angels Zega is not over by any means. But I
Speaker 2: don't imagine you are a one project at a time
Speaker 2: type of person. What else are you working out of
Speaker 2: these days?
Speaker 3: We're working on definitely a lot of different things. I
Speaker 3: think most notably, we have a couple of films coming
Speaker 3: out very shortly great segue, but Cocoho is another film
Speaker 3: that we're actually really seeing as Jikids delves into a
Speaker 3: little bit more of the live action space. So Cocoho is,
Speaker 3: you know, as Daniel was saying, like a really popular
Speaker 3: film in Japan, so we're trying to give it as
Speaker 3: much attention here in the States as we possibly can.
Speaker 3: It's a really beautiful film, so that's really exciting. And
Speaker 3: we've got another film believe just came out in theaters
Speaker 3: but called Little Omily or The Character of Rain, which
Speaker 3: is another really beautiful film. It's actually like a French
Speaker 3: Japanese co production. Really another beautiful film. But yeah, I mean,
Speaker 3: we've got probably twenty plus movies in the works at
Speaker 3: any given time, so Angels is definitely far from the
Speaker 3: only thing we're working on.
Speaker 2: I look forward to hearing what the next one is
Speaker 2: because it's always a tree talking with you guys. I
Speaker 2: love what kids is up to. So thank you so
Speaker 2: much for your time today. Gentlemen, this is fantastic.
Speaker 3: Thank you very much.
Speaker 4: Yep, thanks again for having me on