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Speaker 1: It's been one of the greatest times I've had in

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my many years of podcasting, sitting down and sharing conversations

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with those that have appeared on NBC's The Voice. But

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to find them, where are they? Well, they're now all

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in one location. Aro dot net, r r Oe dot net.

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Look for the podcast that voice. You doing good, Mark,

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I am this morning.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, thanks for having me on the program. I

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appreciate it.

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Speaker 1: Mark. There's a lot of people that want to talk

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with you. I cannot.

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Speaker 2: I'll bit you.

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Speaker 1: Your Google calendar is just through the roof right now.

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, I'm eighty years old. So it's nice

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to be wanted have to say. You see, it's nice

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to people give a darn about me. So that's I

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appreciate that, I really do.

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Speaker 1: Where do you gain the access to your courage as

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a journalist to be able to do something like this,

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because it feels like that over the past fifteen to

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twenty years, we've become the what my father used to

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say it all the time, don't be a know it all,

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just shut up, and it's like, okay, I will, But

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yet here you come with abusive power and I'm going, God,

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I want to be Mark, I want to have that

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courage that Marcas.

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Speaker 2: Well, that's very nice of you to say. I really

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appreciate it coming from you.

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Speaker 3: It all trails back to when I was first of

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all a public defender and then a criminal defense lawyer

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and trying almost all murder cases and so on and

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so forth. That way, I always have stood up for people.

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I've always been interested in justice. It's always been the

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trademark of anything I've done with regard to my books.

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And what I try to do with the books is

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makes people stop and think. I don't try to tell

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them that I know everything about the subject, and I

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haven't done that in abuse of power. But I try

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to provide them with primary sources, no speculation, and then

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let them make up their own mind in terms of

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what happens. And that has failed very well for me.

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The other thing that I have done is I never

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had any training as a long form writer. Probably the

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longest would have been when I filed briefs when I

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was the criminal defense lawyer. So what I've always tried

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to do is talk to the reader like I talked

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to jury's You know, my.

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Speaker 2: Language is not that flashy.

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Speaker 3: I just I'm not a great writer, but I try

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to talk to the reader and let them decide what's

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going on, and as far as any courage goes, I

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really attempt to do the best research that I possibly can.

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For instance, in the new book, one of the earmarks

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of it is this whole new material that I found

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about Robert Kennedy's assassination in sixty eight, and it always

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bugged me because I really didn't believe that Sir Han

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could have handled this all himself. And so I'm like you,

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I'm a curious guy, and so once you get that

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thread of something being wrong, you're going to follow up

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on it for sure.

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Speaker 1: When you talk about that, you want us to do

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our own thinking, my god, you must have been sitting

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next to me while I was moving through this book.

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Because I am that person. I will go to Google.

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I will go to chat GPT. I will because I mean,

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you plant the seed, and I feel like that you're saying, Okay,

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go for come back to me, go find out you know,

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and let's grow together here.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I do.

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Speaker 3: And you know it's interesting because I really got to

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get a lot of communications from readers, because when I

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do interviews like this one, I tell them get in

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touch with me because over the years, an awful lot

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of the clues that I've gotten, just like my guide

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guiding Light, Dorothy Kilgallen did.

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Speaker 2: When she was a.

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Speaker 3: You know, when she was a top reporter and journalist

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in New York City. She would look for these clues

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and everything. And then I look at those and I

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really go ahead and try to follow through and give

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the reader, you know, my opinion on things so that

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they can then follow through on that. And it's amazing

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because I guess I'll shine a little bit of light

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on what I've done. But for my presentations and interviews

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for the last four books, and I hope.

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Speaker 2: With this one.

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Speaker 3: There are more than fifteen million views up on YouTube,

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and I go ahead and I look at the comments

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from people. Some bash me, some tell me I'm crazy,

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Some of them this is that way or that way.

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But it doesn't matter, because I think our job is

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to ask questions and people I want to make sure

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I make this point. You know, people ask me about

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what the relevance is of looking into events that happened

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sixty years ago. Well, of course, the historical angle, and

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I try to dispute distortions of history all the time.

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But what happened back in the sixties is that people

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didn't ask the right questions. They just accepted j Edgar

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Hoover's Oswald alone conclusion. The moment that JFK died, they

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didn't ask any quit. Now, Dorothy Kilgallen was different because

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she did go ahead and do her own investigation. But

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for the most part, people like me, who at that

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time heard Hoover say it's Oswald, we never questioned any

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of that. So what I say to people today is,

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you know, you cannot trust the government. You cannot trust

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what they're telling us. You must you must go ahead

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and ask the questions. You must do your own research,

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because if you don't, then you don't have any reason

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to gripe. When things happen down the line that you

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feel like you should have done something about, you have

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to take action.

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Speaker 2: See Mark.

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Speaker 1: This book is such a tool in this modern age

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because there are some major things that have gone down

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just in the past six months where we need to

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be doing what you said, We need to be asking

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those questions. The problem is we keep asking them and

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keep bumping into the same clickbait, and that clickbait seems

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to be a warrior right now that wants to kick

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our butt.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it is.

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Speaker 3: And unfortunately, this whole new task Force on the declassification

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of government secrets that was convened by the president. Congresswoman

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Anna Pauline A. Luna is in charge. Jefferson Morley, a

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journalist who I don't have much respect for because unfortunately

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he just is stuck on the Oswald and CIA material

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and doesn't want to look at any alternatives. But what's

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happened there is I've let them know about all the

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evidence in the new book about Carlos Marcello's confession about

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JFK's death, and we can talk about that in a minute,

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about the Robert Kennedy shocking new evidence I have that

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clearly shows that Sir Hans Sir Han was not accountable

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for Robert Kennedy's death based on motive. And so I

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try to do that, but you run into these these

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I don't know what we call them in Washington, d C. Especially,

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who are just not interested in bringing out the truth.

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They want to they want to hold up the truth

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and not let us know what's going on that way,

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and it's very frustrating, as I'm sure it is for

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you when you feel like you've got uh, You've got

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the goods, you've got the information that can make people

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stop and think, and there's roadblocks back there that just

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won't let it get through.

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Speaker 1: Please do not move. There's more with Mark Shaw coming

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up next. Sirhan Sirhan, what side of the fans are

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you on the name of the book Abuse of Power?

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We are checking back in with Mark Shaw. I've never

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believed that Sirhan Sirhan was part of this, and the

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reason being this stretches all the way back to nineteen

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eighty five when I was doing research in libraries because

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I was putting together a radio show that was about

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it was about news events, and my program director sat

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down with me and said, I don't care what your

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opinion is, report the news on this show.

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Speaker 2: And it was.

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Speaker 1: But yet in my heart and in my research, I'm going,

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there's something wrong here, there's there's apps and then and

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then now, all these years later, Mark, you come in

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here and I'm going, God dang, where was Mark in

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nineteen eighty five.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Well, I wish i'd have I wish I'd gotten

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into this sooner. But after I'd written, you know, books

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that hopefully expose new material about the Marilyn Roe death

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and JFK then Dorothy Kilgallen. I started to think about

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how in the world this Carlos Marcello, who had the

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strongest motive to have set up the assassination of JFK

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based on his his hatred for Bobby Kennedy, who double

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crossed those mafioso who helped him win the nineteen sixty election.

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How can I figure all of that in of what

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I want to think about with regard to when I

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look into the Robert Kennedy assassination, and I know that

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you'd probably realize because it's in the book in nineteen

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eighty five or nineteen eighty six. I always get figured

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out which one it is. But Marcello was in a

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prison in a federal prison in Texas. He had been

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convicted of I think bribing a jur or whatever. The

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FBI put a sting operation together. They put a guy

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named Van Lanningham into his cell with him, and he

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went ahead then and TRANSCRI had a transistor radio with

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a recorder inside, and he recorded Carlos Marcelo saying, Yeah,

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I had the SOB killed. I'm glad I did. I'm

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so sorry I couldn't have done it myself. Now, that

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particular document I believe is the most important one ever

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exposed about the JFK assassination, but it has been covered

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up for so many years that it's interesting now because

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people say, Mark, you know, you've you've gone ahead and

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you've and you've really exposed all this. Where has it been?

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And I have to say to them, it's been out there,

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but nobody's paid attention to it. And it's the same

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situation then when you look at at Robert Kennedy, I'm

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sure you thought of this that with Robert Kennedy when

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he's about to become possibly the president of the United States,

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and you know that he knows you were the one

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that set up his brother for the kill, meaning Marcello,

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you cannot let him become president because the first thing

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he's going to do is go after you. So there's

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the motive. And what I did then is start to

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piece together what I believe is strong evidence connecting Marcello

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to Sir Hans Sirhan through one of Marcello's underlings, through

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evidence that I've found about mar about Sir Hans sir

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Han and him being in California, and him being what

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I would call the perfect patsy, just as Oswald was

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with regard to the jfk assassination and a very close

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friend of Dorothy Kilgallen's was when she was murdered. Because

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as you know, what the people of the underworld have

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always done, they decide that they want to silence somebody, Well,

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they're not going to do it themselves because that would

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subject them to investigations. So they come up with these patsy's,

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and they're people that can be compromised, like Oswald, like

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the man that did this with Dorothy Kilgallen, and also Boy,

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I hope people will realize in the new book that

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Sir Hans Sirhan was the perfect patsy here, and that's

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been the pattern that this Marcelo has used through the years.

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Speaker 1: So why has this never been taken as being a

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form of terrorism? I mean, if they're stepping in there

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to answer a call from Carlos, I mean, why is

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it not considered terrorism?

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Speaker 3: Well it should be, Yeah, it should be because unfortunately,

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you know, uh, these powerful people who abuse power, including

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for sure, you know who's in the shadow of all

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of this arrow is Jay Edgar Hoover. He was right

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there when Jack Kennedy died. He wasn't about to let

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anybody believe there was a conspiracy or a plot to

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kill the president at all. So what does he do

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right away? It's Oswald alone. And one of the people

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he was protecting was Marcello. Then, when Dorothy kill Gallan died,

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he's the one who orchestrated the compromise of this of

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this gentleman who was a confidant of Dorothy's, who she

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trusted with a lot of the information she was writing

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in her columns and everything else about the assassination, and

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and and and you know, caused him then to be

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able to say to Marcelo and his underlings, look, I

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can take care of this if you'll get me forgiven

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for all my gambling debts and things like that. I mean,

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these patsies are out there. And with Sir Han, I've

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been able to show that through a fresh interview that

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was done with a paddock captain at Santa Nita Racetrack

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in California, that he was right there when Sir Hans

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Sir Han, I think it was a couple of years

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before Robert Kennedy's death, and this little man walked in there,

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very placed placid man and said I need a job,

242
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and this paddock captain said to him, listen, all I

243
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have is a hot walker. It pays two hundred dollars

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a month. And the guy said, I will take it.

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And then you move on with that thread, and you

246
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look at one of Marcello's hunderlings who basically controlled all

247
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of the racketeering in LA and the racetracks, and you

248
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can go ahead and show that they looked at that

249
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and Marcello and this guy said, this is the perfect

250
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guy for us. And so what we have then is

251
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an eyewitness account just a few days I'm sorry, yeah,

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just a few days before RFK Junior RK was killed,

253
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where this man provides the account that he saw Sir

254
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Hans Sir Han in the accompaniment of two what he

255
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called ombres obviously underworld characters who had been thrown out

256
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of Santa Nita Racetrack. And here's Sir Han who's unemployed,

257
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wearing a brand new suit, with one guy on either

258
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side of.

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Speaker 2: Them of him.

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Speaker 3: And then just a few days later, RFK is killed

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and he what does he do? He said, when it's

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on the screen in l a television a photograph of

263
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Sir Han, the mugshot. It says, do you know who

264
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this man is? And so this this gentleman, then, who's

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whose credibility is beyond reproach, goes ahead and calls the

266
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authorities at Hollywood Park.

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Speaker 2: They let the.

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Speaker 3: FBI and the and the uh L A p D no,

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and he expects to be heard from them the next

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day so he can tell him all about Sir Han.

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And he's never contacted. And the kicker there then.

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Speaker 2: Is, as people will, we'll see when.

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Speaker 3: You're trying to connect the evidence in as to who's

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responsible what happened for the next year. This gentleman said,

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when he and his wife picked up their phone, they

276
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could tell it was tapped.

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Speaker 2: The click was on there.

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Speaker 3: So what I've tried to do is to take people

279
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on a journey with me in terms of how I've

280
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been able to go ahead and put the evidence together

281
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to show who's most what the most plausible accounts are

282
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for the deaths of JFK. Robert or Dorothy Kilgallen and

283
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now Robert Kennedy.

284
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Speaker 1: You know, the way that you build a story or

285
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put a book together. The one thing that you're really

286
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teaching a lot of people, especially me, is that just

287
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because it made the headlines and it's no longer on

288
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the front page, doesn't mean the story's over. Go to

289
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the beginning of the story. And that's what you're providing

290
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inside this book, abusive power, is that you're taking us back.

291
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We can't get into the present place of now without

292
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there being a story to get here. What is that story?

293
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And that's what you are showing us inside this book

294
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is that there was events before the big event that

295
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changed the world.

296
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Speaker 2: Yeah, and you had it.

297
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Speaker 3: You had it when you said before you didn't really

298
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buy the the Sir Hans, Sir Han orchestrating this his

299
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death of the man who was was that evening he

300
00:15:19,279 --> 00:15:23,039
was so happy he just won the California primary. Onto Chicago,

301
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he goes and everything. And what I said in the book,

302
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and it was one of my better writing, was that

303
00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:30,879
just as he was done with his speech, the long

304
00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:35,720
arm of Carlos Marcelo, who hated him more than JFK,

305
00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:42,440
reached out and grabbed, you know, grabbed Bobby Kennedy by

306
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the throat, and instead of a smile on his face,

307
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it was a look of death. So what you can

308
00:15:47,639 --> 00:15:50,440
do is, you know, you were right. I mean, just

309
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people need to use common sense about a lot of this.

310
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Let's take the Epstein case, if you don't mind, because

311
00:15:55,759 --> 00:15:59,240
this Task Force on Government Secrets, they were supposed to

312
00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:04,000
look into the JFK assassination, the Robert Kennedy assassination, Martin

313
00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:08,360
Luther King, and Jeffrey Epstein. They haven't gone forward with

314
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any of those incidents in the are important places in

315
00:16:12,679 --> 00:16:16,240
history to the point where any news is coming out.

316
00:16:16,559 --> 00:16:19,840
I mean with regard to the JFK assassination records that

317
00:16:19,919 --> 00:16:25,200
came out earlier this year, all they've been able to

318
00:16:25,240 --> 00:16:29,960
prove through that is that the CIA was conducting dirty tricks. Well,

319
00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:33,039
we've known that for sixty years. That's nothing new, and

320
00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:35,200
they haven't been able to go ahead and put any

321
00:16:35,879 --> 00:16:41,240
connection between the CIA, Oswald and JFK's death. I mean, unfortunately,

322
00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:43,399
as one of my colleagues said to me the other day,

323
00:16:43,799 --> 00:16:48,120
that task force, unfortunately is just political theater. They're just

324
00:16:48,200 --> 00:16:51,440
going through the motions. And I'm afraid that's what's going

325
00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:54,600
to happen now with the Epstein files. Because I will

326
00:16:54,639 --> 00:16:57,200
just say this right to you. The moment that I

327
00:16:57,240 --> 00:17:02,000
heard that Epstein hung himself amidst suicide. I would I would.

328
00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:06,240
I wasn't even possible to believe something like that. So

329
00:17:06,279 --> 00:17:08,640
what somebody has to do, just to give you an example,

330
00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:10,880
You've got to go all the way back then and

331
00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:14,960
look at the powerful people he was involved in, including

332
00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:17,759
it looks like the president and other people, and see

333
00:17:17,799 --> 00:17:19,240
who had the greatest motive.

334
00:17:19,519 --> 00:17:21,160
Speaker 2: And there's a lot of them out there, I think

335
00:17:23,279 --> 00:17:24,200
a lot of them out there.

336
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Speaker 3: And see who you believe had the strongest motive, and

337
00:17:27,079 --> 00:17:29,559
then start from there and go ahead and see who

338
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you can connect into that jail cell that would have

339
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gone ahead and have been able to orchestrate his supposed suicide.

340
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Speaker 2: Mark.

341
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Speaker 1: You know, people are going to grab this book Abusive Power,

342
00:17:40,599 --> 00:17:43,119
and they're going to instantly compare to where we are today,

343
00:17:43,160 --> 00:17:45,440
and they're going to see these three suicide attempts and

344
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or suicides with what went on with the before the

345
00:17:49,240 --> 00:17:52,119
presidential election, what went on with Charlie Kirk, what went

346
00:17:52,119 --> 00:17:55,039
on with United Healthcare. None of us believe that because

347
00:17:55,079 --> 00:17:58,799
all that information has disappeared mysteriously, and it's like, where's

348
00:17:58,799 --> 00:18:01,559
the team that's going to uncover this Mark. You're you're hired,

349
00:18:01,599 --> 00:18:03,039
We need you to write that next book.

350
00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:07,960
Speaker 3: Well, here's here's the word they use though, And this

351
00:18:07,759 --> 00:18:12,759
was said by Congresswoman Luna who I think has good

352
00:18:12,759 --> 00:18:16,319
intentions and has been waylaid by this jeff Jefferson Wood.

353
00:18:16,559 --> 00:18:21,319
She said, we are tired of all of the deceptions, untruths,

354
00:18:21,799 --> 00:18:24,759
all of these kinds of things with regard the JFK assassination.

355
00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:28,279
And this will be a task force that will deal

356
00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:33,160
and focus on transparency. That's the word they use, transparency,

357
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And it makes everybody believe, oh my goodness, this is

358
00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:39,480
so wonderful. We're going to find out exactly what happened.

359
00:18:39,519 --> 00:18:43,640
And then they just reverse themselves. And what happens, unfortunately,

360
00:18:44,359 --> 00:18:47,559
is that when people have a conclusion that they want,

361
00:18:47,599 --> 00:18:50,319
and this happens with a lot of journalists these days,

362
00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:53,400
then they get a sensational headline. Then they try to

363
00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:56,680
fit the evidence they have to that instead of going

364
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out going out and finding the evidence and figuring out

365
00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:01,759
if you've got that headline or not.

366
00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:05,079
Speaker 2: But in this world of fast breaking news.

367
00:19:04,839 --> 00:19:06,480
Speaker 3: And all of that, an awful lot of people are

368
00:19:06,519 --> 00:19:10,119
not interested in and they certainly certainly weren't interested back

369
00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:10,839
in the sixties.

370
00:19:11,559 --> 00:19:13,880
Speaker 1: Oh my god, there's so many different angles we can take.

371
00:19:13,880 --> 00:19:15,759
But if I if I forget this question, I'm going

372
00:19:15,799 --> 00:19:17,640
to step on my foot for the rest of my life.

373
00:19:17,799 --> 00:19:20,839
You you openly admit that the Warren Commission was corrupt,

374
00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:23,880
and of course where does my mind going that Gerald R.

375
00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:24,920
Speaker 2: Ford? Okay?

376
00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:28,119
Speaker 1: So what was he put in that position to continue

377
00:19:28,279 --> 00:19:30,640
hiding the Warren Commission's efforts.

378
00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:33,559
Speaker 3: Well, in the new book, you're going to see an

379
00:19:33,599 --> 00:19:35,680
abuse of power. You're going to see that I included

380
00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:38,799
uh and if these things sometimes are right out there

381
00:19:38,799 --> 00:19:41,680
that people could look at, go into the internet and

382
00:19:41,720 --> 00:19:46,920
there are accounts of lbj and and UH and uh

383
00:19:47,039 --> 00:19:50,720
Jaegger Hoover audio tapes of them talking about who they're

384
00:19:50,759 --> 00:19:54,359
going to put on the on the Warren Commission, and

385
00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:57,759
what they're trying to do is obviously find people who

386
00:19:57,839 --> 00:20:01,400
will go along with what they say, which was Oswald alone.

387
00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:04,519
And so what you do is you in fact, they

388
00:20:04,839 --> 00:20:08,240
talk about Jerry Ford in there, that he's not somebody

389
00:20:08,279 --> 00:20:10,400
smart enough that's going to cause him any problems. It's

390
00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:13,400
a guy who became president of the United States, Okay.

391
00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:16,960
And then there were only two problems that they had.

392
00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:19,559
One was Senator Richard Russell. The other one was Senator

393
00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:22,880
John Sherman Cooper, who Dorothy Kilgallen knew and found out

394
00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:25,480
all about the corruption from them, and they were a

395
00:20:25,559 --> 00:20:27,759
stick in the mud because they wouldn't go along with

396
00:20:27,799 --> 00:20:32,319
the final report of Oswald alone and everything. And so

397
00:20:33,359 --> 00:20:36,160
they had to go ahead and permit them, and just

398
00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:39,720
think about history being changed here because they permitted they

399
00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:42,759
said they would permit them a dissent and in the

400
00:20:42,799 --> 00:20:45,880
in the in the final report that said this, this

401
00:20:46,799 --> 00:20:48,960
silver bullet theory didn't make sense and all of that

402
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:53,720
they believed Lyndon Johnson, And of course when the report

403
00:20:53,759 --> 00:20:55,839
came out, it wasn't in there. I put those descents

404
00:20:55,839 --> 00:20:57,799
in the book because I want to see how people

405
00:20:57,839 --> 00:21:00,599
to see how history would have been changed if those

406
00:21:00,640 --> 00:21:02,920
descents would have been in there, because it would have

407
00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:05,240
made people stop and think. There probably would have been

408
00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:09,319
more investigation. But what you do is when you have

409
00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:15,319
people who are against what your theory is, they will

410
00:21:15,319 --> 00:21:18,039
go ahead and just ignore that theory and present whatever

411
00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:20,680
thing they want to do to make their point.

412
00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:23,359
Speaker 1: Who do you take this to today in the way

413
00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:25,880
of we don't have a DOJ, we don't have an FBI.

414
00:21:26,839 --> 00:21:29,240
Marjorie Taylor Green would be somebody that is starting to

415
00:21:29,279 --> 00:21:30,799
make a voice. But I don't know if that's somebody

416
00:21:30,839 --> 00:21:32,559
I trust yet. But I mean, who do you take

417
00:21:32,559 --> 00:21:35,400
this too. To really start making some.

418
00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:38,720
Speaker 3: Waves, it has to come from the American people who

419
00:21:38,759 --> 00:21:42,160
read books like mine and decide to go to Congress

420
00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:42,720
or whatever.

421
00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:43,319
Speaker 2: One thing.

422
00:21:43,359 --> 00:21:45,480
Speaker 3: I will tell you that with all the new evidence

423
00:21:45,519 --> 00:21:49,279
I have about sir Han not being accountable with regard

424
00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:53,440
to Robert Kennedy's death, I'm putting together a game plan

425
00:21:54,119 --> 00:21:57,400
with some attorneys who have been involved in sir Han's

426
00:21:57,559 --> 00:21:59,960
case for years, and we're going to take our evidence

427
00:22:01,240 --> 00:22:05,559
into the probably the LA District Attorney or the Attorney

428
00:22:05,599 --> 00:22:09,079
General in California or whatever it may be, and try

429
00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:12,279
to get a situation where this conviction of his can

430
00:22:12,319 --> 00:22:15,799
be set aside and this man released from prison because

431
00:22:15,799 --> 00:22:19,119
he's been there. He's eighty one years old, and this

432
00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:21,279
man should not be in prison for something that he

433
00:22:21,319 --> 00:22:22,720
did not do at all.

434
00:22:23,039 --> 00:22:23,440
Speaker 2: Wow.

435
00:22:24,079 --> 00:22:26,079
Speaker 1: So there's a photograph I would love to have of you,

436
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:29,200
And that photograph is you standing in the mirror holding

437
00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:31,359
this book up to the mirror, and behind you is

438
00:22:31,400 --> 00:22:34,160
everything that's taking place in the world today. Because this

439
00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:36,359
is an I this is an eye on where we've

440
00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:39,480
been and where we presently are, and in my heart

441
00:22:39,759 --> 00:22:40,839
it's all connected.

442
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:46,240
Speaker 3: Dude, Well it is, and it isn't that sad? I mean, yeah,

443
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:50,400
people deserve justice, whether it's somebody on the street corner

444
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:54,599
who gets mugged, or it's Robert Kennedy or jfk or

445
00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:59,200
Dorothy Kilgallen or even you know people today who deserve

446
00:22:59,279 --> 00:23:03,480
that kind of just I think that the politicians today

447
00:23:03,519 --> 00:23:05,599
and a lot of the law law enforcement people and

448
00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:09,559
all especially those in the new administration, forget that word.

449
00:23:10,079 --> 00:23:12,599
Speaker 2: They forget that people deserve justice.

450
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:14,480
Speaker 3: And I will fight as long as I can to

451
00:23:14,519 --> 00:23:18,279
try to get you know, the justice for them. But

452
00:23:19,039 --> 00:23:23,160
if people listening to your broadcast here get upset about this,

453
00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:25,559
then they need to contact their congressmen, or they need

454
00:23:25,599 --> 00:23:28,359
to send letters to the task Force or whatever, because

455
00:23:28,359 --> 00:23:31,160
they can make a difference. We don't think we can sometimes,

456
00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:33,119
but I'm telling you it can make a difference if

457
00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:33,799
they hear from you.

458
00:23:33,960 --> 00:23:35,640
Speaker 1: I would love to see the numbers of how many

459
00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:38,400
people who, in their heart all of these decades have

460
00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:42,279
always said, oh it's the coast in Austra, it's the mafia,

461
00:23:42,319 --> 00:23:43,880
and then all of a sudden, here comes your book

462
00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:46,200
and you're giving us Carlos right here in front of us.

463
00:23:46,359 --> 00:23:48,880
But now I have to sit here and wonder, all

464
00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:50,960
of a sudden in the past two to three months,

465
00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:53,759
what has happened. All of a sudden, the so called

466
00:23:53,799 --> 00:23:56,200
Italian families are back in the news because of the lottery.

467
00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:58,400
I'm going, wait, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa? Are they creating

468
00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:00,839
a smoke screen here because they're so something we should know,

469
00:24:01,039 --> 00:24:03,039
but we can't let them know because they're busy doing

470
00:24:03,079 --> 00:24:03,680
something else.

471
00:24:05,079 --> 00:24:07,839
Speaker 3: Yes, And and isn't it sad that now the whole

472
00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:12,000
gambling uh you know epidemic has hit the sports scene

473
00:24:12,319 --> 00:24:15,599
to where they're they're they're fixing card games, and they're

474
00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:19,240
fixing dice games, and they're fixing ball games and all

475
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:21,640
this kind of stuff. I mean, I was shocked when

476
00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:24,480
I saw some of the same names in there. Uh

477
00:24:24,799 --> 00:24:27,480
you know that we knew about years and years and

478
00:24:27,559 --> 00:24:31,160
years ago, the families and all of that, and they're

479
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:34,319
out there. We just they just haven't been as as

480
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:37,880
us as clear to people. But they're still out there.

481
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:40,240
And and the other thing that bothers me is that

482
00:24:40,319 --> 00:24:44,000
we are now in a situation where multimillionaires and billionaires

483
00:24:44,119 --> 00:24:48,599
are controlling Congress and controlling the presidency. And any time

484
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:52,000
you have those kinds of people, whether it's Musk or others,

485
00:24:52,400 --> 00:24:56,240
advising people and getting getting things done, and you give

486
00:24:56,279 --> 00:24:59,240
them that much money, you're going to expect favors. And

487
00:24:59,279 --> 00:25:02,119
that's what concerned me more than anything too about right now,

488
00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:04,920
because you know, you.

489
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:05,559
Speaker 2: Can just see it.

490
00:25:05,559 --> 00:25:08,079
Speaker 3: It's running rampant with regard to some of these people

491
00:25:08,079 --> 00:25:11,000
who are, you know, paying for things for the government,

492
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:14,279
and they're going to expect something in return, just exactly

493
00:25:14,440 --> 00:25:17,480
like the mafia does. I know. A long time ago,

494
00:25:17,799 --> 00:25:20,920
I was very tempted. Some mafio also got in touch

495
00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:24,039
with me because one of their members was charged with

496
00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:26,839
murder and they want me to represent the guy. And

497
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:29,279
I wanted to, but I knew if I did that,

498
00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:31,759
they would always be in control of me.

499
00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:35,559
Speaker 2: And that's what happens in Washington.

500
00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:38,160
Speaker 3: Now. We got to really watch as far as all

501
00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:43,680
these these wealthy people conducting our government instead of those

502
00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:44,960
that should be responsible.

503
00:25:45,440 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 1: I know you've got a billion people you have to

504
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:48,480
talk to today, but if I could have just one

505
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:49,200
more question and.

506
00:25:49,799 --> 00:25:52,079
Speaker 2: Take your time, I really enjoy this, Thanks for listening

507
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:52,400
to me.

508
00:25:52,519 --> 00:25:54,720
Speaker 1: Well, one of the things that you can't help but

509
00:25:54,759 --> 00:25:57,279
put focus on is the fact that why is it

510
00:25:57,440 --> 00:25:59,759
that we have evolved into this generation? Because you and

511
00:25:59,799 --> 00:26:02,759
I are both we're up there in age. I will

512
00:26:02,759 --> 00:26:04,920
always say I'm a seventeen year old, but history tells

513
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:07,680
me differently. But the thing is is that why is

514
00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:11,400
it that the elder generation seems to be in control

515
00:26:11,559 --> 00:26:14,119
of where we grow, where we're growing with history, when

516
00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:18,000
in the past my grandparents just faded away. It's almost

517
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,319
like we're stepping forward, going the hell, this is not

518
00:26:20,519 --> 00:26:22,799
going to happen on what little time or how many

519
00:26:22,799 --> 00:26:25,480
summers I've got left. We're going to make a voice

520
00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:27,880
today and we're going to grow forward.

521
00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,200
Speaker 2: We're well said, well said, and that is the state

522
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:32,759
of affairs.

523
00:26:32,799 --> 00:26:35,799
Speaker 3: Now. What I've been encouraged by with the books that

524
00:26:35,839 --> 00:26:40,079
I've written, including Hopefully a Abuse of Power and the

525
00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:42,119
Reporter Are doing too Much and those kind of books,

526
00:26:42,319 --> 00:26:44,440
is that young people get in touch with me. Yeah,

527
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:48,359
and they're upset about what's going on, and those voices

528
00:26:48,519 --> 00:26:51,880
need to be heard now. Unfortunately and awful, the a

529
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:55,200
lot of young people don't read books anymore. And their

530
00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:58,279
smartphone is stuck to their nose. But there are people

531
00:26:58,319 --> 00:27:00,720
out there who care, and I think they need to

532
00:27:01,920 --> 00:27:05,680
make their voices heard so that you know, because that's

533
00:27:05,839 --> 00:27:08,720
that's what didn't happen back in the sixties for sure,

534
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:13,240
and unfortunately we see that occurring now. So I just again,

535
00:27:13,319 --> 00:27:16,559
I'm encouraging people to read the book. Doesn't matter if

536
00:27:16,599 --> 00:27:18,640
you agree with me or not. Get in touch with me.

537
00:27:18,759 --> 00:27:21,160
My website's markshawbooks dot com.

538
00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:22,359
Speaker 2: My email is.

539
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:26,039
Speaker 3: Mshawi and at Yahoo and I answer every single email

540
00:27:26,079 --> 00:27:28,319
I get. Whether you like what I write or not,

541
00:27:28,519 --> 00:27:30,440
or you want to object to it, Please get in

542
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:32,519
touch with me because you can make a difference. And

543
00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:35,079
if I if you tell me something that I can

544
00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:38,640
forward to the politicians in New York or in Washington

545
00:27:38,799 --> 00:27:39,880
or whatever, I will do.

546
00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:42,799
Speaker 1: So I can't wait to talk with you again. I

547
00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:45,680
just love where your heart is. You are that next

548
00:27:45,759 --> 00:27:48,319
level of where journalism is supposed to be growing, and

549
00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:51,599
you're taking it there by being here with us, you

550
00:27:51,920 --> 00:27:54,759
physically see us, and that just blows me away.

551
00:27:55,759 --> 00:27:58,839
Speaker 3: Well, you're you're doing the world such a great service.

552
00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:02,759
Thanks for the pat on the back, But you're a megaphone. Okay,

553
00:28:02,759 --> 00:28:06,400
we're megaphones and you're doing I can tell with you

554
00:28:06,440 --> 00:28:08,519
that you're a man of the truth and you want

555
00:28:08,559 --> 00:28:10,720
to go ahead and spread that truth as much as

556
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:11,079
you can.

557
00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:13,279
Speaker 2: So I have great praise for you.

558
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:15,359
Speaker 3: I don't know you personally or anything, but if I

559
00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:17,599
ever get a chance to see you, I will shake

560
00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:20,720
your hand because you're making a difference with this, and

561
00:28:20,759 --> 00:28:23,960
you're encouraging people, and you're providing the facts and so

562
00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:26,680
on and so forth that way, and hopefully many of

563
00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:28,559
the people who listen to you are going to go

564
00:28:28,599 --> 00:28:29,440
out and make a difference.

565
00:28:29,559 --> 00:28:32,000
Speaker 1: Oh my god, please come back to this show anytime

566
00:28:32,039 --> 00:28:34,599
in the future. You are the man. And I don't

567
00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:36,200
mean that as being the boss that you know sends

568
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:38,640
out that email it says demand now. I mean that

569
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:40,640
that you truly are a leader here.

570
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:44,319
Speaker 3: Well, thanks for letting me tell my stories, and hopefully

571
00:28:44,319 --> 00:28:48,680
people through you and I and everything will get people

572
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:51,640
to take action because we need that for sure these days.

573
00:28:51,720 --> 00:28:53,319
Speaker 1: Will you be brilliant today? Ok?

574
00:28:53,519 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 3: Mark?

575
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:56,279
Speaker 2: All right, thanks so much, bless you and have a

576
00:28:56,279 --> 00:28:57,000
good Thanksgiving