Speaker 1: Hello, everyone, Welcome back to a new episode of the
Speaker 1: Poker Go Podcast. My name is Donny Peters. Tim is back. Finally,
Speaker 1: Tim Duckworth is in in the I don't know what
Speaker 1: do you call it the shotguns? I don't know whatever.
Speaker 2: I'm in the flesh.
Speaker 1: You really are in the flesh, because I mean not
Speaker 1: that we do a video podcast, but you are sitting
Speaker 1: there with no shirt on, which is weird. But whatever,
Speaker 1: here's the deal. We have a lot of things to
Speaker 1: talk about. I don't know if we're going to get
Speaker 1: to them all because we only have about thirty minutes
Speaker 1: before I have to go jumping in another meeting. But
Speaker 1: I want to kick this one off. It's not on
Speaker 1: the rundown with a family pot, so play the damn jingle,
Speaker 1: all right, So listen, this isn't necessarily a family pot
Speaker 1: I mean it kind of is. I'm I'm making it
Speaker 1: like that because I had to take my kids to
Speaker 1: the doctor. Listen these f in doctors. Okay, my appointment
Speaker 1: is scheduled for nine o'clock. I show up at eight
Speaker 1: forty five because I like to be early and whatever.
Speaker 1: The door isn't even unlocked. What the f okay problem?
Speaker 1: Number one, like, it's nine o'clock. Can we figure this out?
Speaker 1: You think people should be open at seven o'clock? Like,
Speaker 1: this is not We don't have time to nine o'clock.
Speaker 1: Nine o'clock. The door is unlocked. What are we doing here?
Speaker 1: Second of all, okay, I get in there. I gotta
Speaker 1: do whatever. The lady's like, she's like, I need your
Speaker 1: insurance card and your ID. I'm like, I don't have
Speaker 1: my insurance card. She's like, well, new policy, we can't
Speaker 1: see you. I'm like, it's the same insurance card it's
Speaker 1: been for the last three years. Okay, Like, how is
Speaker 1: this hard? Isn't it on file? She's giving me the
Speaker 1: run around. I'm like okay, I'm like whatever, I'll bring
Speaker 1: it next time, Like, can you just figure this out?
Speaker 1: It's the same one. So then we have that issue.
Speaker 1: Then they finally get me in there. I get back
Speaker 1: there at nine to ten. I wait untill nine forty
Speaker 1: eight to see the freaking doctor. This shit is unbelievable, man, unbelievable.
Speaker 1: The kids are screaming their heads off, like I can't
Speaker 1: feed the youngest one because he needs to take shots today.
Speaker 1: Because this is one year check up. It's just a
Speaker 1: freaking disaster. Can people just be on time and when
Speaker 1: your door is locked? Okay? And I'm standing outside of
Speaker 1: the door with me and another guy. It was me
Speaker 1: and another guy. He's got his son, I got my
Speaker 1: two kids. We are the only people there, the only
Speaker 1: people there. Okay, So you have two appointments. Why does
Speaker 1: it take forty eight minutes to see me? Why that
Speaker 1: is unreal? And I'm pissed and I'm hot, I haven't
Speaker 1: had my coffee. I gotta do this podcast. The whole
Speaker 1: day is screwed up. I'm so f and mad. It's unbelievable.
Speaker 1: It's unbelievable, Tim, unbelievable. Okay, let's talk about actual stuff
Speaker 1: on today's show. Okay, on today's show, w has to
Speaker 1: Be got sold for half a billion dollars, five hundred
Speaker 1: million dollars. Got to get our thoughts on laptop eight
Speaker 1: because Tim and I haven't been on these airways together
Speaker 1: since the WSOP WSP Paradise is back. We got Scott
Speaker 1: seever winning Player of the Year. We got Patrick Antonius
Speaker 1: in the Hall of Fame. We got to hit on
Speaker 1: the PGT leaderboard because we are getting into the second
Speaker 1: half of the season, pretty pretty pretty soon, Tim's going
Speaker 1: to be on a jet over to Cyprus, and that
Speaker 1: is where a super high rollable, super high rollable series,
Speaker 1: whatever we're calling it, is taking off again. I don't
Speaker 1: know if we're going to get to all these topics today.
Speaker 1: If we don't get to any, we'll try and hit
Speaker 1: on them at a future show.
Speaker 2: Of course.
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Speaker 1: Stormac's Earning crypto is easy, all right. First things first,
Speaker 1: the big news that dropped on August. First, the WSP
Speaker 1: is sold. The brand gets sold for five hundred million dollars.
Speaker 1: So the parent company of GG Poker, which is listed
Speaker 1: as ns US Group, which people have told us is
Speaker 1: pronounced answers. Which chance people keep saying that to me.
Speaker 1: Multiple people have all said that to me. It's pronounced answers,
Speaker 1: So I don't know. I'm just gonna say Ensis because
Speaker 1: that's what it looks like to me, you know, just
Speaker 1: like you say WOSOP, I'm going to say Ensis. So
Speaker 1: the wosop got sold to Ensis. So Ensis Group is
Speaker 1: it's the parent company of GG Poker, So this is
Speaker 1: essentially GG Poker buying the WSP. They acquired the the
Speaker 1: WSP for five hundred million dollars. To first two hundred
Speaker 1: and fifty million of that is going to be cold
Speaker 1: hard cash, baby, and then the the next two hundred
Speaker 1: and fifty million is due. I think it's due within
Speaker 1: five years in a note or whatever, So that will
Speaker 1: be to come. If you guys want to flashback twenty years.
Speaker 1: Caesar's originally purchased the ws AP in two thousand and four.
Speaker 1: That was when Caesar's was still or previously known as
Speaker 1: Hare's Entertainment. They moved it from Benion's Horseshoe over to
Speaker 1: the Rio, and that's when you know it came in
Speaker 1: all of our lives. You know, all the people Tim
Speaker 1: and I who are in poker these days. That's pretty
Speaker 1: much when we remember it, you know, we remember it
Speaker 1: at the Rio and growing from there. Just some keynotes
Speaker 1: from the press release that was sent out again on
Speaker 1: August first, so you know, just under two weeks ago,
Speaker 1: says Caesars has secured the right from ENSIS to continue
Speaker 1: hosting ws AP's flagship live tournament series at its Las
Speaker 1: Vegas casinos for the next twenty years. So for anyone
Speaker 1: freaking out, oh my god, the divasipy is gonna move,
Speaker 1: that tells us right there, it's staying in Vegas for
Speaker 1: twenty years. And then it says Caesar's Digital will also
Speaker 1: receive a license from ENSIS to continue operating it's recently
Speaker 1: upgraded WSP online real money poker business in Nevada, New Jersey, Michigan,
Speaker 1: and Pennsylvania for the foreseeable future. I guess first question
Speaker 1: for you, were you surprised when this news had dropped,
Speaker 1: because let me preface that by saying that we had
Speaker 1: heard this for a while, right this was possibly coming
Speaker 1: down the pipeline. It had been in the works for
Speaker 1: a long time.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: At times that you know, we had been told like
Speaker 1: it's a done deal. Other times it's like it's probably
Speaker 1: not going to happen. So it was kind of all
Speaker 1: over the place, but it kind of dropped on us,
Speaker 1: I would say, out of the blue a little bit.
Speaker 1: So were you surprised that it was announced?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Surprising two ways. Firstly, the date seems as a little
Speaker 3: weird August. First, why not do it during the World
Speaker 3: Series or do it you know, it just seems like
Speaker 3: a dead dead time, you know, a week after the
Speaker 3: World Series has ended. I was surprised because, like you said,
Speaker 3: we've heard oh it's done, it's not done. We're nowhere near,
Speaker 3: We're nearly there, and the most recent thing we had
Speaker 3: heard was you know, we weren't close. So that was
Speaker 3: a little bit of a surprise to me.
Speaker 2: Definitely.
Speaker 1: It's been almost two weeks, as I said, since that
Speaker 1: news was dropped. You know, what are your initial thoughts
Speaker 1: just I mean anything empty canvas? Tell me what you
Speaker 1: tell me what you're thinking or what you have been
Speaker 1: thinking for two weeks. Uh.
Speaker 3: I'm hoping it's good for the WSP brand. Now when
Speaker 3: I'm saying that, I'm talking about more online qualifiers. Obviously
Speaker 3: Gigpoker is doing a lot already, but now that they're
Speaker 3: legitimately invested. Maybe we see an influx in online qualifiers,
Speaker 3: not just the main event, but throughout the whole series.
Speaker 3: I'm wondering what this brings for the online client down
Speaker 3: the road. I know there's some stuff still, some contracts
Speaker 3: still involved with I believe Triple eight for WSP dot com.
Speaker 3: But you know, that could be very interesting to see
Speaker 3: how that develops from outside of things. Who knows, We'll
Speaker 3: see what happens with how they want to handle production,
Speaker 3: how they want to handle streaming, et cetera. But I
Speaker 3: think just for WSP, I think for the players, you know,
Speaker 3: the greater public, I think this is probably a pretty
Speaker 3: good thing.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would agree. I think overall it's going to
Speaker 1: be a good thing for the w SP brand. I
Speaker 1: think it's a good thing for w CP dot com
Speaker 1: online poker, and I also think it's a good thing
Speaker 1: for online poker in general as it pertains to the
Speaker 1: United States. I mean, we know what GG poker has
Speaker 1: done in the rest of world market and how big
Speaker 1: they've grown, and how you know, incredible their product is.
Speaker 1: You know, from a user experience standpoint, the series that
Speaker 1: they put on all the time. You know, they obviously
Speaker 1: have the the online bracelet events. They have big circuit events,
Speaker 1: all that sort of stuff. They have GG millions, et cetera,
Speaker 1: et cetera. So I think it's going to take a
Speaker 1: little bit of time for the online stuff to get
Speaker 1: into the US, but I think it's coming. You know,
Speaker 1: I think that this was if I'm going to steal
Speaker 1: a line from Nick Jones of Poker Fuse slash Poker
Speaker 1: Industry Pro, who is as tapped into this stuff as
Speaker 1: anyone in the industry. You can follow him on Twitter
Speaker 1: at at poker pro Jones. He said, this isn't the
Speaker 1: first step. This is the step to gig getting the
Speaker 1: into the US, and what that means is listen GG poker.
Speaker 1: They they've tried, I think at times, I think I
Speaker 1: believe to get some licenses in the various states, but
Speaker 1: haven't worked out. Haven't really been able to get any
Speaker 1: licenses or anything like that. This solves all of that.
Speaker 1: You can call it a work around whatever you want
Speaker 1: to do. But because they acquire the WSOP brand, and
Speaker 1: then because they then licensed wsp dot com back to
Speaker 1: Caesar's Digital to then operate it, that's like their de
Speaker 1: facto lif They're latching on to Caesar's and wysip this way. Now,
Speaker 1: you brought up the eighty eight deal, which through all
Speaker 1: the reporting that I've seen, I think it's twenty twenty
Speaker 1: six when that's over with. So I would assume that
Speaker 1: when twenty twenty six happens, that contract would end, GG
Speaker 1: poker would come in. This gives GG poker to kind
Speaker 1: of ramp things up. They can get any sort of
Speaker 1: manufacturer or or platform licenses that they need to, which
Speaker 1: they've already done in a couple of states. I think
Speaker 1: Pennsylvania and Michigan. They're on the books for those. So
Speaker 1: like that stuff I think is eventually coming. So in
Speaker 1: the interim, you know, the upgraded dissip dot com software
Speaker 1: that a lot of us are playing right now here
Speaker 1: in the States is is good. You know, it's it's
Speaker 1: better than it was, for sure. But I think it's
Speaker 1: kind of that in between, and I think, well, eventually
Speaker 1: we'll get more of a GG poker product. I know
Speaker 1: that GG poker representatives have said that they're essentially and
Speaker 1: I'm you know, I'm kind of paraphrasing this, but you know,
Speaker 1: taking the bull by the horns in terms of the
Speaker 1: US market, that the current operators here aren't really doing
Speaker 1: what needs to be done to push online poker in
Speaker 1: the way that it needs to go. And GG Poker
Speaker 1: seems like they really want to do that. They really
Speaker 1: want to push for legislation, get this thing opened up
Speaker 1: in new states, maybe lobby to have the shared liquidity
Speaker 1: among states, have that grow as well. So it seems
Speaker 1: like all signs are pointing to very positive results from this.
Speaker 1: It's just a matter of when it all comes down
Speaker 1: and then as it pertains to the live WSIP, I
Speaker 1: don't I don't really know what's going to happen.
Speaker 3: I don't think you'd change the actual WSP that much, right, Look,
Speaker 3: and I think we'll see a crazy different schedule. I
Speaker 3: don't think we'll see these dramatic changes. I feel like
Speaker 3: we may see more stuff internationally, you know, like we
Speaker 3: added Paradise, maybe we add now the gg's involved and
Speaker 3: it is based in you know, Korea slash Canada.
Speaker 2: May see some more.
Speaker 3: You know, circuit events encountera We may see you know,
Speaker 3: WSOP Macaw, WSOP Asia Pacific could come back, like, we
Speaker 3: may see some more alliterations of the brand outside of
Speaker 3: the USA.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but don't you think that like in the States,
Speaker 1: the flagship WSP we're talking about in the summer those
Speaker 1: seven weeks, you know, like in my opinion, that needs
Speaker 1: to be modernized. Like how I mean, I don't know,
Speaker 1: It's it's very like I think even though they have
Speaker 1: like quote unquote modernized some things, like let's say the
Speaker 1: Bravo sign ups, you know, like even that is pretty janky.
Speaker 1: I mean, like it's pretty like now, Like what I'm
Speaker 1: saying is like, can we get the WSP plus app
Speaker 1: in here?
Speaker 3: Didn't I see something on Twitter this week that that's
Speaker 3: coming for next year.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've seen and I've heard that. But like that's
Speaker 1: all well and good, but like we also know how
Speaker 1: Nevada regulators can be, Like like, so, is that is
Speaker 1: that gonna get hung up somewhere the regulation or is
Speaker 1: this deal then allow that to get pushed through much faster?
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm just asking those questions. I would
Speaker 1: love to have that that wasb plus app here live
Speaker 1: in Nevada. That would be great, you know, And then
Speaker 1: what does that do for like Bravo being involved and
Speaker 1: how they're all tied into everything through the tournament sign ups,
Speaker 1: through the registration through through all that sort of stuff.
Speaker 2: Exactly.
Speaker 1: It's like what we don't know the ins and outs
Speaker 1: of all of that sort of stuff. So I think
Speaker 1: eventually all of this stuff is coming, you know, to
Speaker 1: the live arena, just as it is coming to the
Speaker 1: online arena. It's just a matter of when is it coming? Right?
Speaker 1: You know, like is it going to be better? Like
Speaker 1: is the WSP going to look more like PCA look
Speaker 1: used to look down in the Bahamas?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 1: Are they going to really ramp up the branding all
Speaker 1: that sort of stuff now that GG poker is involved
Speaker 1: and you know, they're certainly, at least from my view,
Speaker 1: seem to be much more willing to spend on marketing
Speaker 1: and promotion and aesthetics and all that sort of stuff.
Speaker 1: So is that all coming? You know, they've obviously been
Speaker 1: involved as a sponsor. Recently they've done an event that
Speaker 1: you know, the flip and go right. Are we going
Speaker 1: to see more GG poker type of events? You know,
Speaker 1: not that they're like complete gimmicks, but like I don't know,
Speaker 1: stuff that they take from their online world and then
Speaker 1: put it in. Do we see more mystery bounties stuff
Speaker 1: like that? You know, Like because Obviously, mystery bownties are
Speaker 1: a big thing and online. Do we see more of them?
Speaker 1: Given the success of the million dollar bounty at the
Speaker 1: WSP do we see a couple more of them? I
Speaker 1: don't know, you know, these are all questions. I think overall,
Speaker 1: it's going to be a good thing and we'll see,
Speaker 1: you know, we'll see how it goes. But yeah, I
Speaker 1: think this is kind of like, this is obviously huge news, yes,
Speaker 1: you know, and it's it's massive, but there's still much
Speaker 1: more to come from it. So I think it's going
Speaker 1: to kind of be like a wait and see, we'll
Speaker 1: see if anything comes for twenty twenty five, and then
Speaker 1: going forward, I would assume that they're probably gonna announce
Speaker 1: things as they get as they come, you know, like
Speaker 1: if the WSP plus app gets approved or whatever. I
Speaker 1: think that would be a good announcement, you know. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's just you know, it's another news item to hit on.
Speaker 1: It's another thing that that you know, points everything in
Speaker 1: the in the right direction. So that's the big w
Speaker 1: CP sale. I mean, Caesar's made out pretty well with this.
Speaker 1: I feel like, I mean they bought it for I
Speaker 1: want to say, fifty million or something. I don't even
Speaker 1: know it was. I remember like talking to people about
Speaker 1: that sale that happened back in two thousand and four,
Speaker 1: and it was like the Douvaspy was thought of as
Speaker 1: like an afterthought in this deal for these other things.
Speaker 1: They end up keeping this this you know, this brand,
Speaker 1: the World Series of Poker, and they grow it to
Speaker 1: what it is, they're now able to flip it for
Speaker 1: five hundred million, and then not only that, they get
Speaker 1: to keep the flagship version, and you know, are they
Speaker 1: going to get raked from that? How is that all
Speaker 1: going to work out? Of course we're not privy to
Speaker 1: those details, but I'm assuming they're going to be able
Speaker 1: to generate some money. They're just not going to put
Speaker 1: the thing on for free, right, so they have to
Speaker 1: have some skin in the game. So I think all
Speaker 1: in all, they made out pretty darn good from this thing,
Speaker 1: and then we'll see what happens on the GG Poker
Speaker 1: side of things. I think it's all going to be
Speaker 1: positive at the end of the day. Yes, but we
Speaker 1: just don't know exactly how they're going to take it
Speaker 1: and implement it differently than what they have been because
Speaker 1: it's not like they haven't had access is kind of
Speaker 1: what I'm getting at. They've had basically the license to
Speaker 1: do whatever they wanted internationally. They've obviously had the online bracelets,
Speaker 1: online circuit stuff, you know, whatever it may be. So
Speaker 1: I'm curious to see what all comes of it. And yeah,
Speaker 1: really really really big news there the other big item
Speaker 1: coming out of the WSP laptop gate Buddy so Dominic
Speaker 1: Niche and Joe McKean, if you guys have been living
Speaker 1: under a rock, they appear to have been watching the
Speaker 1: stream while also running SIMS on a laptop on the
Speaker 1: final table rail to help Jonathan Tamayo, who went on
Speaker 1: to win the twenty twenty four at WSP Main event. Now,
Speaker 1: nothing to my knowledge happened during the final table. There
Speaker 1: was no complaints that I'm aware of. No tournament staff
Speaker 1: intervened at all to my knowledge. So first up, general thoughts.
Speaker 1: The word I think that a lot of people have
Speaker 1: been throwing around a lot greatly or wrongly is cheating.
Speaker 1: So was this cheating?
Speaker 3: Well, if you follow the Dictionary definition of cheating, yes,
Speaker 3: they were cheating because it's acting dishonestly or you know,
Speaker 3: unfairly to gain an advantage. They were definitely gaining an
Speaker 3: advantage by using whether it was gto, was it octupy, whatever,
Speaker 3: the product they were using to gain or learn was
Speaker 3: to gain advantage. So by the textbook definition of cheating, Yes, However,
Speaker 3: do I want to call them cheats? I don't know, man,
Speaker 3: because anyone at that final table could have done the
Speaker 3: same thing. It's been done throughout the whole World Series.
Speaker 3: There are videos that are on Twitter. There are photos
Speaker 3: of people using charts while sitting at a table with
Speaker 3: or without cards, And I think this kind of falls
Speaker 3: back on how do we police this? And not only
Speaker 3: how do we police the use of these aids, is
Speaker 3: who polices it? And I think that's the bigger the
Speaker 3: bigger issue here. Am I upset that Jonathan Tomato had
Speaker 3: people in his on his rail that we're helping him,
Speaker 3: you know, learn about the other players know because it's
Speaker 3: you're trying to win ten million dollars. So I don't
Speaker 3: think that's I don't really see a problem with that. Now,
Speaker 3: you know, the other players at the final table could
Speaker 3: have done the same thing. Just the fact that he
Speaker 3: did it, he was the only one doing it that
Speaker 3: we know of, and that he won, just makes it
Speaker 3: look worse. But yeah, I push that to the side
Speaker 3: and I want to focus more on what the rule
Speaker 3: should be and how should they be enforced, because I
Speaker 3: think that matters more than people, you know, trying to
Speaker 3: get better, because at the end of the day, this
Speaker 3: is their job, right you're trying to do You're trying
Speaker 3: to use something to be better at your job, just
Speaker 3: like you and me use maybe we use a particular
Speaker 3: email program or a particular remind is that to be
Speaker 3: more efficient in our job.
Speaker 2: This is a similar kind of thing. It just it's
Speaker 2: just looks a little different.
Speaker 1: Why this became such a big issue is because in
Speaker 1: this specific instance, this was the dibsip the DOVASIPY talked
Speaker 1: to the talk and they did not walk the walk.
Speaker 1: They made a big deal. Every single day there was
Speaker 1: an announcement if you're caught using any of these devices,
Speaker 1: any solvers, et cetera, you risk getting banned from the tournament,
Speaker 1: you know, disqualified, all that sort of stuff. There was
Speaker 1: a lot of talk about it. I mean, we had
Speaker 1: a call, what was it not before this series, but
Speaker 1: last series, you know, with a whole bunch of home meeting,
Speaker 1: tournament staff and WSB officials were involved there and like
Speaker 1: this was a big thing, right, And why it became
Speaker 1: an issue is because ultimately nothing was done and that
Speaker 1: like if you if you come out with a rule
Speaker 1: or you come out with something or whatever it may be,
Speaker 1: you need to be prepared to then in force said ruling. Right,
Speaker 1: That's where this became an issue because if they would
Speaker 1: have enforced it, fine, like right, I mean, then that
Speaker 1: we might be having a discussion like was the you know,
Speaker 1: was the was the penalty you know rightly or justly applied?
Speaker 1: Et cetera. On the other side of things, if you
Speaker 1: don't come out and quote unquote talk the talk, like
Speaker 1: make a big deal out of this every single day
Speaker 1: that if somebody uses this stuff they can get disqualified.
Speaker 1: Then this person uses it, well, then it's it's not
Speaker 1: a big issue. Yeah, you know it's it's or it
Speaker 1: might be a talking point, but it's not as big
Speaker 1: of an issue as it was. I think the problem
Speaker 1: that a lot of people have is that it was
Speaker 1: made to be this is something you cannot do. They
Speaker 1: did it, and there was no one there to police it.
Speaker 1: Like you said, now, I don't necessarily know how you
Speaker 1: police this. That's a whole nother question. Like the first
Speaker 1: thing that needs to be solved or put on the
Speaker 1: books or addressed is what is the rule?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 2: What is the rule?
Speaker 1: And can we put some something down? Right? Because you
Speaker 1: and I have seen the WSP rules every single year.
Speaker 1: It seems like they either never get updated or get
Speaker 1: changed incorrectly, or they're kind of all over the place,
Speaker 1: right Like I feel like last year they had a
Speaker 1: rule for this this year wasn't actually on the rules
Speaker 1: because they might have not updated it correctly, but they
Speaker 1: were still announcing something every morning. So it's very tricky there.
Speaker 1: So that's the first thing, get the rule down, whatever
Speaker 1: you want to say and how you want to act.
Speaker 1: The second part of that is, Okay, this is the rule,
Speaker 1: how do we enforce it? And listen, there's thousands of
Speaker 1: people at the w SIP every single day playing poker tournaments,
Speaker 1: and you don't have thousands of tournament staff. You just
Speaker 1: don't so And then on top of that, do the
Speaker 1: tournament staff even know what they're looking for? That if
Speaker 1: you if tim, if you walk by me and you say, oh, hey,
Speaker 1: what was that? And I had gto wizard up for example,
Speaker 1: or I had another solver up for example, and I
Speaker 1: quickly just close it, and you say, let me see
Speaker 1: your phone. I say, no, like, what what what are
Speaker 1: we gonna do?
Speaker 2: Like you know, if you just close the app, swap off, it's.
Speaker 1: I swipe up, I put my phone in my pocket.
Speaker 1: What are you gonna do physically take my phone? Okay,
Speaker 1: then I'm gonna sue you, like you know, so what
Speaker 1: are you gonna do? Are you gonna are you gonna
Speaker 1: disqualify me or issue a one round penalty based on
Speaker 1: the fact that you think you saw something when like
Speaker 1: it could have been my stock chart that has a
Speaker 1: lot of red and green lines on it that look
Speaker 1: similar like you know, and you and I know that
Speaker 1: like a lot of people don't even use the solvers.
Speaker 1: They have custom Google sheets, So who knows what you're
Speaker 1: looking for?
Speaker 3: I was gonna say that you can a just insert
Speaker 3: everything into a Google doc because you don't know what
Speaker 3: a Google doc looks like. That's simple, right, doesn't look
Speaker 3: like gto was it? The other part is happy if
Speaker 3: I'm playing against you. Right, let's say they're gonna enforce this,
Speaker 3: They're gonna give one round penalties automatic. I could just
Speaker 3: call the floor over and go, hey, flaw Donnie's using
Speaker 3: he was just using gto as a during his hand.
Speaker 3: You could have been on Instagram, but you can't prove otherwise.
Speaker 3: And what the floor is now is gonna give you
Speaker 3: one like all the penalty. So it's such a sticky
Speaker 3: it's gonna be such a sticky area. I think, I
Speaker 3: think I know how we sho could do the rule,
Speaker 3: but like it's going to be a slippery slope.
Speaker 1: Go ahead, what's your rule?
Speaker 3: I would firstly, just no phones while you're in a
Speaker 3: hand while you have live cards. I think that's very simple.
Speaker 1: Okay, that's a rule by the way, I know.
Speaker 2: But like we can make it more in one.
Speaker 1: Of the twenty dealers might say something to you because
Speaker 1: like oftentimes I'll be on my phone like between a
Speaker 1: hand and I'm usually I'm usually not doing anything other
Speaker 1: than I just write notes from like the pass hand
Speaker 1: that I played, and like, very very very seldom does
Speaker 1: a dealer say, sir, you get to put your phone
Speaker 1: down right or or they'll wait, they wait till the
Speaker 1: action gets on you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you could write that way too, or it's in.
Speaker 1: Front of me, but I might be on the button,
Speaker 1: so you know, a bunch of people have to act
Speaker 1: before me. By time it gets to me, I could
Speaker 1: be doing a lot of different stuff.
Speaker 3: So I would try and make that more enforcible, and
Speaker 3: then I would probably make a pretty strong rule that
Speaker 3: if you are caught, you know.
Speaker 2: That's the thing. Where do they want to draw the
Speaker 2: line on these aids?
Speaker 3: Are they okay with players using it in the right
Speaker 3: manner or they don't want them on property at all?
Speaker 3: Because I they're okay with your amusing it. So you
Speaker 3: should maybe say you should have the rule where you
Speaker 3: know you cannot be on like this, like name the apps.
Speaker 3: You know you can even use Google Ducks while sitting
Speaker 3: at the poke table, so if you want to use it,
Speaker 3: you have to step away. And if you step away,
Speaker 3: that means your hands dead. So it kind of satisfies
Speaker 3: two things. I don't know if that's enough. Like you said,
Speaker 3: we have to basically force the dealers to make sure
Speaker 3: people aren't on the phones. But you're right, when you're
Speaker 3: on the button and I'm setting a text, I'm going
Speaker 3: to send the text until it's on me.
Speaker 2: Is that okay? No?
Speaker 3: Probably not, But the dealer's got so much going on
Speaker 3: them they might not be able to police it. And
Speaker 3: it's also you probably need to educate a lot of
Speaker 3: the tds. You got to educate the tds. Okay, this
Speaker 3: is what a chart looks like. These are some of
Speaker 3: the different apps. Here are some screenshots. Put it in
Speaker 3: a little pdf that sits up on the TD podium,
Speaker 3: and and do your best to try and kind of
Speaker 3: police this.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean my I got two things to say.
Speaker 1: One is that like, well, I think probably that some
Speaker 1: sort of no phone policy or like you have to
Speaker 1: like the phone gets cut off or whatever has to happen,
Speaker 1: because for example, like I might just what if I
Speaker 1: just text somebody, Hey, I got fifteen big bonds on
Speaker 1: the button, can you give me the range? Now, I
Speaker 1: have a lot of really really fucking smart poker friends
Speaker 1: who might just be able to rip off the answer right,
Speaker 1: you know, or they can quickly run it for me
Speaker 1: and send me back the answer like that's that's a workaround,
Speaker 1: is what I'm saying. So like, but I'm just looking
Speaker 1: so if you see me just texting, like how you
Speaker 1: gonna know? Like so that that's where like the no
Speaker 1: phone thing would come into play. That tim is mentioning.
Speaker 1: The second thing that I would say is you know,
Speaker 1: on the enforcement, I might even like I might have
Speaker 1: people that were specifically enlisted to just look out for
Speaker 1: this stuff, and I would have them look like undercover cops.
Speaker 1: They would look like every other freaking poker player at
Speaker 1: the place, wearing a hoodie some shorts, just roaming around
Speaker 1: the tournament room day.
Speaker 2: Is around though, unless you have a media badge, like
Speaker 2: it would.
Speaker 1: Give them media badges.
Speaker 2: I don't know half the.
Speaker 1: Media that are there either, do you? We never know, right,
Speaker 1: Like that's I think that's like how you have to
Speaker 1: catch people like, you know, I mean a lot of
Speaker 1: people like they'll just like, oh, they'll look around, Okay,
Speaker 1: there's no TD in the vicinity. I'll just quickly check
Speaker 1: something boom like move on, you know. Like So yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it's very tricky. It is very tricky. So I'm
Speaker 1: not sure I have any sort of answers at this time.
Speaker 1: I think this is like, this is probably one of
Speaker 1: those things where I would just rather let somebody else
Speaker 1: try and make the answers and then I'll critique the
Speaker 1: answers afterwards. But yeah, I mean I don't It's it's
Speaker 1: gonna be hard. I I hate that, you know, coming
Speaker 1: out of the w SP. This was all that was
Speaker 1: talked about, and it was really overshadowing Jonathan Tomios's achievement
Speaker 1: because I don't think it gave him a big edge
Speaker 1: in the fact that, like he was like, this was
Speaker 1: like an it or break it for him, right, I
Speaker 1: mean I think I think it would have been a
Speaker 1: bigger edge, like if he were to have like a
Speaker 1: and I use this example when I talked to Matt
Speaker 1: Savage the other day, but like a Sean Deep, Like
Speaker 1: if I had Sean Deep in my corner and I
Speaker 1: was able to just go over to Sean and say, Hey, Sean,
Speaker 1: this is what's happening at the table, and Sean, being
Speaker 1: the tournament expert that he is, be like, Okay, this
Speaker 1: is how you're gonna adjust, this is what you're gonna do.
Speaker 1: This is what you're gonna do, versus you sticking a
Speaker 1: chart in my face and like me trying to be
Speaker 1: able to like memorize that chart and then put it
Speaker 1: into action right away. Like I I do a lot
Speaker 1: of study, and I try and review charts and solvers
Speaker 1: and all that sort of stuff and understand the theory,
Speaker 1: but I don't do it like thirty seconds between a
Speaker 1: hand I do it, like, you know, in a couple
Speaker 1: hours at night time to prepare for my plane. So like,
Speaker 1: I don't know if me looking at something in real
Speaker 1: time that sort of way would benefit me versus like
Speaker 1: if I was able to go over to somebody as
Speaker 1: good as Sean Deep and be like, hey, this is
Speaker 1: what's happening, this is what I'm seeing. How do I
Speaker 1: react in the moment, and he could just give me
Speaker 1: the answers right away I could instantly put into play.
Speaker 1: So then then then it brings up the question like
Speaker 1: do we outlock coaching in general? And so it's yeah,
Speaker 1: I know you're here, like you don't you don't know.
Speaker 1: It's it's really it's it's weird. I mean I also
Speaker 1: think that there's a bit of like people are getting
Speaker 1: too far ahead of themselves saying that like this is
Speaker 1: going to have a really big effect on getting new
Speaker 1: people into the game. I mean, I don't know, man,
Speaker 1: I mean there's there's always been you know, advantage play
Speaker 1: and cheating and this and that and the other thing,
Speaker 1: and the fields only seem like they're getting larger. So
Speaker 1: like it's like it's like, what what effect is this
Speaker 1: really going to have or like you know, hundreds, if
Speaker 1: not thousands of people going to just be like, no,
Speaker 1: I'm not playing because these guys might be using their solvers,
Speaker 1: like I.
Speaker 3: Can't change anything with the field. And I was like, oh,
Speaker 3: I don't know, maybe I'll not play the ten game
Speaker 3: an event to see because someone's going to rock up
Speaker 3: with you know, a computer and then happeny if you're
Speaker 3: playing online at the table with your laptop like this
Speaker 3: is wsp Evans added thirty Bracelet events to See Online
Speaker 3: could be forty next year, it could be fifty the
Speaker 3: year after if gg's involved. So it's something going to
Speaker 3: get something going to get worse. Maybe it's better just
Speaker 3: to accept it or welcome it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I don't really know any sort of answers here.
Speaker 1: Have there been any discussions with you, Like, I know
Speaker 1: you just went down to Texas, Like was it a
Speaker 1: discussion down there at all? Or I know you're always
Speaker 1: talking to the ARIA Poker staff over running who are
Speaker 1: running the PGT events, Like has this been brought up
Speaker 1: at all on your conversations? Like is there anything there?
Speaker 2: Nothing yet?
Speaker 3: I mean there's been some stuff on social you know,
Speaker 3: we take phones at the final tables for our events.
Speaker 3: We started doing it this year for the World Series
Speaker 3: for the first time. That's more just a production decision
Speaker 3: because we wanted to look.
Speaker 2: A bit better.
Speaker 3: But yeah, nothing, I don't think it's on us to
Speaker 3: kind of do anything about it. I think everyone has
Speaker 3: access equal access to all these tools, right, Like you
Speaker 3: said you can use gto was it.
Speaker 2: I could also use gto was it.
Speaker 3: You know, like it's it's not unfair that you can
Speaker 3: use it because I still have the same access as you.
Speaker 3: So I'm not really against against it, to be honest.
Speaker 3: But yeah, I guess we'll see. I guess we'll hopefully
Speaker 3: see what WSP want to say about everything.
Speaker 1: Yeah, a part of me also says that, you know,
Speaker 1: and I say a part of me because I'm not
Speaker 1: sure I'm totally sold on it, But like, should should
Speaker 1: they be addressing this? Should they have released a statement
Speaker 1: on it?
Speaker 3: You know, not that I don't think they need to
Speaker 3: address it until Europe WSP Europe, And I'm not sure
Speaker 3: if those rules follow under THEIRS or under King's Casino
Speaker 3: and then also then Paradise.
Speaker 1: But I'm saying like just even like, hey, we're aware
Speaker 1: that this is a situation. You know, it's something that
Speaker 1: we're going to be looking strongly at for for next
Speaker 1: year's World SERI as a poker, like blah blah blah,
Speaker 1: you know, like we don't want to take it. Like essentially,
Speaker 1: why I would why I would suggest doing this, And
Speaker 1: again I'm not totally sold on actually doing this. It
Speaker 1: was just thought that popped in my mind. But like
Speaker 1: trying to steer the conversation back to Tomayo winning the
Speaker 1: biggest event in the world, becoming world champion like that,
Speaker 1: like they should want the conversation to be that, Like
Speaker 1: how do you get the conversation back to be that,
Speaker 1: you know, like or maybe it's not a statement. Maybe
Speaker 1: it's just like some sort of media blitz involving Tomayo,
Speaker 1: like get him on a YouTube stream, get him out
Speaker 1: there like like whatever it is, like you know, do
Speaker 1: interviews for him, put him on the website. I don't know,
Speaker 1: but like try and get the conversation off of what
Speaker 1: was you know, for two weeks or three weeks or
Speaker 1: whatever laptop get'm I still see stuff now, like you know,
Speaker 1: so it's like try and get the conversation back over
Speaker 1: to like this crowning achievement in poker. So yeah, we've
Speaker 1: run out of time, unfortunately awesome, but what are we
Speaker 1: gonna do. We'll figure out what to do for these
Speaker 1: next bunch of topics. But it was good to get
Speaker 1: on the horn here with him pick his brain about
Speaker 1: at least the two biggest news items or topics discussion
Speaker 1: points that were coming out of the World Series of Poker.
Speaker 1: Tim is back in Vegas right now, but I think
Speaker 1: he's leaving soon right where.
Speaker 2: You Wednesday morning? So two days Wednesday morning, all right,
Speaker 2: we're trying to record tomorrow if you really want.
Speaker 1: I do really want to.
Speaker 3: I want to, and let's try and do it tomorrow,
Speaker 3: double back to back episodes for the for the people
Speaker 3: out there. I love that.
Speaker 1: I mean, we can space out the release states. So
Speaker 1: that's not that's not the end of the world there.
Speaker 1: But you know, just being able to find time to
Speaker 1: record is of course not the not the easiest thing
Speaker 1: to do when we're not just you know, shacked up
Speaker 1: at the horseshop and I can just say like, hey,
Speaker 1: let's go youss Yes.
Speaker 3: I.
Speaker 1: Bring Yes, I miss it, come on, it's the best.
Speaker 2: Yes.
Speaker 1: I always can't wait for it to come I'm always
Speaker 1: surprised that it's here as fast as it's here, and
Speaker 1: then I'm always like, damn, can we go back, Like
Speaker 1: even like day fifty. I know we're all burned out
Speaker 1: and we're ready to go home whatever, but it's like, no,
Speaker 1: I want to go back. Yeah, all right, that's going
Speaker 1: to do it for us. My name is Donny Peters,
Speaker 1: his name is Duckworth, and we'll talk to you guys later, So.
Speaker 3: Yeah, night.
Speaker 2: Jenny Express