Speaker 1: Broadcasting from Studio A here at proven Winners Color Choice Shrubs.
Speaker 1: It's time for the Gardening Simplified Show with Stacey, Hervella me,
Speaker 1: Rick weisst and our engineer and producer Adrianna Robinson Stacy.
Speaker 1: Today's topic plants that like to move and plants that
Speaker 1: don't like to move. And I've been thinking about this
Speaker 1: and I need to share with you that I'm not
Speaker 1: so sure I've ever found a plant that I don't
Speaker 1: want to move. Wow.
Speaker 2: If that's a good thing or a bad thing.
Speaker 1: I know I'm not saying it's a good thing, but
Speaker 1: you know, rejuvenation is a good thing. For years when
Speaker 1: I ran my business, I always had a small bottle
Speaker 1: of Tabasco sauce on the ledge because Tabasco sauce always
Speaker 1: was a good reminder for me that just adding a
Speaker 1: little bit to a dish can change the whole dish.
Speaker 2: Right, That's very true. Yeah.
Speaker 3: I think that it's important for people to understand that
Speaker 3: moving plants is a normal thing to do as a gardener.
Speaker 3: You know, I think there's this kind of myth or
Speaker 3: belief out there that gardeners, especially people who have many
Speaker 3: years of experience like you and I get it right
Speaker 3: the first time, and newsflash, we do not even maybe
Speaker 3: we do when we change our mind and it doesn't
Speaker 3: feel so right anymore. It's not like multiple choice tests.
Speaker 3: There is an open ended essay exam and so yeah,
Speaker 3: you have the opportunity to for most things. There are
Speaker 3: certainly exceptions, but you do have the opportunity to change
Speaker 3: your mind and move the majority of different types of plants.
Speaker 1: Thank you for saying that. I appreciate that because that
Speaker 1: gives me permission, and what I'm trying to do is
Speaker 1: give folks permission to do it. Also because you reach
Speaker 1: a point, of course with some plants where you need
Speaker 1: you just simply need to move them. They're too close
Speaker 1: to the house, or you're sick of them in that location,
Speaker 1: they're getting too big or whatever. I think the key
Speaker 1: is recognizing, number one, you can do this. I mean,
Speaker 1: they move houses, for crying out, true, If they move houses,
Speaker 1: you can move some plants and take a shot at it.
Speaker 1: I think the key from my experience, Stacy, is don't
Speaker 1: do it during prime time, that is for sure, and
Speaker 1: that means for both the individual and the plants. So
Speaker 1: as an individual, don't go out there and move plants
Speaker 1: when it's sunny and it's beautiful outside. Do it when
Speaker 1: it's overcast, kind of drizzly, not real nice to be outside.
Speaker 1: And the same applies to plants. Don't move them when
Speaker 1: they're in their prime, move them during their.
Speaker 3: Off season, yeah, the dormant season. So I think this
Speaker 3: is great timing. We did another show back in October
Speaker 3: called bus to Move that was more about how to move,
Speaker 3: and now we're going to talk about specifically plants that
Speaker 3: want to be or that can be moved, and those
Speaker 3: that maybe are a little more resentful of being moved.
Speaker 3: But the overall thing, the reason we're doing this is
Speaker 3: because we are coming up on a perfect time for
Speaker 3: moving plants when they are dormant. And of course the
Speaker 3: ground is not frozen and covered with two or three
Speaker 3: feet of snow as it is at the moment. So
Speaker 3: perhaps in another you know, six weeks or so here
Speaker 3: in Michigan, we're getting into prime plant moving time when
Speaker 3: those plants are dormant. Is a great time to move
Speaker 3: things that you have been thinking about switching around.
Speaker 1: Exactly, And you know, I guess I think about moving plants.
Speaker 1: You know, I remember clearly sitting on a Chase Lounge
Speaker 1: in Las Vegas, sipping on an adult beverage and watching
Speaker 1: them move trees and large plants from the old desert
Speaker 1: into the wind resort. They were moving some of these
Speaker 1: plants with helicopters.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 1: And the same applies an interview I did back in
Speaker 1: twenty ten with individuals who were restoring the tree that
Speaker 1: survived the collapse of the Twin Times in New York
Speaker 1: and bringing that tree back to life and then moving
Speaker 1: that tree to the Memorial Plaza where it stands today.
Speaker 1: My point is, Stacey, the attitude I take is where
Speaker 1: there's a will, there's a way.
Speaker 3: For the average person, some of those things may be
Speaker 3: a little out of reach. It's not beat around the
Speaker 3: bush here.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 3: Moving trees, I think is one place, especially if they're
Speaker 3: more mature trees like the ones that you just described,
Speaker 3: is an area where it is possible, but the expense
Speaker 3: and effort may not be worth it. And certainly you
Speaker 3: can find online amazing stories of you know, huge oak
Speaker 3: trees being relocated, and those are all very very interesting
Speaker 3: to see. But you know, overall, unless something has you know,
Speaker 3: huge historical or esthetic value, it's not easy to do
Speaker 3: for mature trees, but almost anything else, even young trees,
Speaker 3: you know. But I think, as with everything else in horticulture,
Speaker 3: the key is to have realistic expectations about what happens
Speaker 3: after you move something. An interesting situation from my own
Speaker 3: garden where several years ago I bought two pawpaw seedlings,
Speaker 3: so papa are a native edible papaw, and planted them
Speaker 3: in my garden and they're fairly slow growing. But it
Speaker 3: soon became obvious that the way that we had positioned
Speaker 3: them was not right, so I moved one of them
Speaker 3: about a year after I planted. Now, poppas are trees
Speaker 3: with a tap root, so this is something that you
Speaker 3: need to look for. I'm sure we're going to be
Speaker 3: going there later. If a plant has a tap root,
Speaker 3: so think a little bit like a carrot, you know,
Speaker 3: deep root like that, rather than a large spread out
Speaker 3: root system. They tend to not take to transplanting quite
Speaker 3: as well, and Papa's are one of those. So I
Speaker 3: dug my hole, I moved the tree, and it is
Speaker 3: pretty much fine now, But for about two or three
Speaker 3: years it was pretty surprising to see how two of
Speaker 3: the same plants planted at the exact same time. One
Speaker 3: of them was so severely set back from this movie,
Speaker 3: so it probably took about two years for it to recover.
Speaker 3: That first year after I moved it, it didn't grow
Speaker 3: hardly at all.
Speaker 2: On top.
Speaker 3: It was alive, it leafed out, it was okay, but
Speaker 3: it was like, whoa, I am recovering.
Speaker 2: I'm not growing.
Speaker 3: I just need to take a year off and then
Speaker 3: almost like resetting, you know, sleep creep leap. It was
Speaker 3: a sleep year for that first year, it was a
Speaker 3: creep year for the second year, and then by the
Speaker 3: third year. Now they're almost back together. But you do
Speaker 3: have to understand that even though we do freely move
Speaker 3: plants around, there is a little bit of a plant
Speaker 3: penalty there to pay.
Speaker 1: Oh, I agree, And when I say I haven't met
Speaker 1: a plant I don't want to move, I do say
Speaker 1: that tongue in cheek. I've done some pretty crazy things
Speaker 1: in my life. But your point is well taken. We're
Speaker 1: primarily talking here about perennials and shrubs, not necessarily trees
Speaker 1: and stacy. A couple of examples rhododendrons. You know, people
Speaker 1: have said to me, well, you can't move a big,
Speaker 1: beautiful rhododendron. Well, you can. The root system is it's
Speaker 1: not a it's a smaller root system proportionately to the plant,
Speaker 1: and you can stump it, you can cut it back,
Speaker 1: maybe sacrifice the flowers for one year. Another example would
Speaker 1: be p and ees. People have always said to me,
Speaker 1: while P and e's are a perennial that doesn't like
Speaker 1: to move, and I'm like, I've moved them almost any
Speaker 1: time of the year and had success. Sure, you don't
Speaker 1: want to plant them too deep or too high, because
Speaker 1: you're going to have problems with blooming. But again, where
Speaker 1: there's a will, there's a.
Speaker 3: Way, And you know, I think it's important to question
Speaker 3: some of that quote unquote conventional wisdom about things like
Speaker 3: moving p and e s or even clematists. I mean,
Speaker 3: you need to do your research and understand perhaps why
Speaker 3: those beliefs are in place. And I think the one
Speaker 3: for penis is primarily because when they're move people do
Speaker 3: often plant them too deep. It's very easy to plant
Speaker 3: them too deeply, and we've answered that question in mailbag
Speaker 3: a couple of different times.
Speaker 2: But you know, do your research.
Speaker 3: If someone says, oh, you can't possibly move this, think
Speaker 3: about the reasons why, you know, think about why are
Speaker 3: they saying that in the I'm sure people say you
Speaker 3: can't transplant a popa either, And I wouldn't say it
Speaker 3: was the most well advised thing that I've ever done.
Speaker 3: But you know, that's the other thing about being a
Speaker 3: gardener is you if you're willing to take on those risks,
Speaker 3: risk your investment in the plant, risk your investment in
Speaker 3: that time and effort, then you know that's that's your decision.
Speaker 1: And are you glad you did it?
Speaker 2: Stay, I'm very glad I did it, very much so.
Speaker 1: And that's the point. So, I mean, you know, again,
Speaker 1: some things just don't want to move. I'm standing on
Speaker 1: my deck looking at my patio furniture. I'm saying, you
Speaker 1: guys got to move, and they're like, no, we're good.
Speaker 1: We're gonna sit this one up. Bad dad joke. But
Speaker 1: getting back to the taparate thing that you were diving into.
Speaker 1: So if you think about some perennials like baptisia, or
Speaker 1: you've talked often about the roots on clematis yep, yep,
Speaker 1: the heart leaf brunera, or coral bells foamy bells. What
Speaker 1: about our high biscus, like our summarific high biscus.
Speaker 3: Well, I just moved a lot of summarific Hibiscus ampaptesia
Speaker 3: at the end of fall last year, so I am,
Speaker 3: you know. And it is easier for us to move
Speaker 3: things living in a sandy soil than people who have
Speaker 3: clay soil, because it's a lot easier to expose those
Speaker 3: roots and to get more of the roots. But I
Speaker 3: am eager to see what might be happening with those pronouns.
Speaker 3: I have every confidence that they're alive. I'm not worried
Speaker 3: about that. But whether or not I'll see flowers this year,
Speaker 3: and if so, how many will be to be determined.
Speaker 3: So stay tuned for the update this June and August.
Speaker 1: That's very interesting. You know. My general rule of thumb
Speaker 1: is if it's a clumping plant and divides easily, it
Speaker 1: moves pretty easily. If it's a single stem, even lavender
Speaker 1: that acts like a woody plant single stem more difficult
Speaker 1: than let's say, daylilies or hostas. Yeah, so you know again,
Speaker 1: and if you have a s situation where it simply
Speaker 1: has to go and you're facing just eliminating the plant,
Speaker 1: why not at least give it a shot. It's great
Speaker 1: exercise and fresh air.
Speaker 2: And you learn something.
Speaker 3: And that's what gardening is all about, is, you know,
Speaker 3: taking an educated approach to what you need to need
Speaker 3: or want to do, making the right decision, acting on it,
Speaker 3: and then seeing what happens.
Speaker 1: Well, let's see how Stacey ties it in and plants
Speaker 1: on trial. That's coming up next here on the Gardening
Speaker 1: Simplified Show.
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Speaker 3: proven Winner's Color Choice dot com. Greetings gardening friends, and
Speaker 3: welcome back to the Gardening Simplified Show, where the order
Speaker 3: of the day is plants that like to or can
Speaker 3: be moved, and plants that maybe are a little bit
Speaker 3: more resentful of being moved. And Rick, I can't believe
Speaker 3: you went the whole first segment without your famous saying
Speaker 3: that your plants have been moved so often they're eligible
Speaker 3: for Frequent Flyer miles.
Speaker 1: Yes, or I just bent over and split my plants
Speaker 1: now I.
Speaker 3: Have to ask you something. It wasn't all that long
Speaker 3: ago that you moved from a house where you had
Speaker 3: lived in garden for many years to a new home.
Speaker 3: And when you did that, did you move any plants?
Speaker 1: Yes?
Speaker 2: I do, how many? Like roughly, I'm going.
Speaker 1: To say probably about twenty.
Speaker 3: Oh wow, that's pretty impressive. And was it shrubs, perennials, a.
Speaker 1: Mix primarily perennials and grasses? No surprise.
Speaker 2: Oh, you were brave enough to dig up a grass.
Speaker 2: That's uh.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, you know with grasses, they're readily
Speaker 1: they're pretty easy to divide and move as far as
Speaker 1: they're being willing to do so. It's whether or not
Speaker 1: the individual wants to go through the grief. Right.
Speaker 2: Absolutely.
Speaker 3: There was a condo down the street from me, and
Speaker 3: last summer I saw some guy trying to dig out
Speaker 3: some ornamental grasses from the front yard and he caught
Speaker 3: my eye as I was walking by, and I said, oh,
Speaker 3: tough job, good luck. Went back the next day nothing
Speaker 3: had been moved.
Speaker 2: He gave up on the whole thing.
Speaker 1: I believe it.
Speaker 3: So, if you're listening, mister, I understand. But anyway, it
Speaker 3: is great that we can move plants, and I have
Speaker 3: often moved plants. And when I moved, I ended I
Speaker 3: was moving in July, and it wasn't the ideal time
Speaker 3: to move plants. But I wasn't going to just leave
Speaker 3: them my rental and not have them at my house,
Speaker 3: So I moved a bunch of stuff too.
Speaker 1: This past summer. You know, you tore out the entire lawn,
Speaker 1: you had to move some plants too, right.
Speaker 3: I didn't have to move too much at the beginning
Speaker 3: of the project. I saved all the moving really for
Speaker 3: the fall, Okay, because by the time the whole line
Speaker 3: project got sorted out, I just said, you know what,
Speaker 3: it's getting too close to hot weather. So I didn't
Speaker 3: move that much then. But I spent every single free
Speaker 3: weekend in September and October moving plants. So I'm also
Speaker 3: very experienced, and that really is one of the great
Speaker 3: things about perennials and shrubs. Now, as we said, you
Speaker 3: can't really successfully move more mature trees, you can try.
Speaker 3: We had a question in mailbag not too long ago
Speaker 3: about someone who had a little Japanese maple that was
Speaker 3: really struggling. We advise them to move that, and we
Speaker 3: also advise someone in the last episode to dig up
Speaker 3: their gink go that was getting girdling. So you know,
Speaker 3: within maybe a couple of years of being planned in
Speaker 3: one two to three years, if you get a kind
Speaker 3: of a smaller plant, a smaller tree, you can typically
Speaker 3: get away with it.
Speaker 1: But if you're going to do that plan ahead, I
Speaker 1: still think taking a spade cutting into the roots a
Speaker 1: month or two before moving it, trying develop some hair
Speaker 1: roots will help.
Speaker 2: If you can do that.
Speaker 3: If you can do it, I mean, if if you
Speaker 3: thought of doing it in time, is really the main thing.
Speaker 3: So it's great that we can move things. But just
Speaker 3: because you can move plants that and most plants are
Speaker 3: very adaptable to being moved, doesn't necessary mean that you should.
Speaker 3: Because as I said, there is a little bit of
Speaker 3: a plant penalty to pay. It does set things back,
Speaker 3: and how much it sets something back can be based
Speaker 3: on a lot of different factors and the reaction can
Speaker 3: be different. So a plant might not flower for a
Speaker 3: few years, it might grow very little. It might you know,
Speaker 3: kind of just sitting there and sulking whatever other features
Speaker 3: you're growing it for. You just might not see that,
Speaker 3: you know, in its full effect. For a couple of years,
Speaker 3: and some plants that people say don't like to be
Speaker 3: moved really just don't ever recover from it. You know.
Speaker 3: There's certainly some plants that just they'll never really get
Speaker 3: back to where they were, and you're better off just
Speaker 3: starting with something that was grown a container and you
Speaker 3: can put into your yard. But in all of my
Speaker 3: years of helping gardeners with gardening questions, I would have
Speaker 3: to say that the plant that I have been asked
Speaker 3: the most frequently about whether it can be moved is
Speaker 3: big leaf hyde hydrange of macrophilla. That makes sense, Yeah,
Speaker 3: So I think it's for a couple of reasons. Number one,
Speaker 3: because hydrange of macrophilla or big leaf hydrangea, is the
Speaker 3: type of plant that is highly sensitive to its spot.
Speaker 1: Uh.
Speaker 3: You know, where you plant a big leaf hydrangea, especially
Speaker 3: if you live in a cooler climate, can make or
Speaker 3: break your experience. You can have a great experience and
Speaker 3: feel like you are a rockstar gardener, or you can
Speaker 3: have a terrible experience and feel like you have You know,
Speaker 3: you're never gonna have success growing a plant again. It
Speaker 3: really needs to be in kind of the right spot. Again,
Speaker 3: because it has its flower buds for the following summer
Speaker 3: all winter. It's important that it is kind of more
Speaker 3: protected in these colder climates so that it's not getting
Speaker 3: you know, huge blasts of cold air, heavy loads of ice,
Speaker 3: all of that kind of stuff. So it's got that
Speaker 3: site sensitivity.
Speaker 2: Number two.
Speaker 3: I think it's a plant that when a shrub, it
Speaker 3: is a shrub, it is a true woody shrub. But
Speaker 3: I think when most people look at it, they got so,
Speaker 3: you know, what that looks like a plant that could
Speaker 3: probably be moved. Sure, it kind of looks like a
Speaker 3: perennial clumpy, Yeah, look clumpy, And so people maybe have
Speaker 3: the sense that looks like something I could move, compared
Speaker 3: to something that maybe is really really large or you know,
Speaker 3: has a trunk and it resembles more of a tree.
Speaker 3: And the third one goes back to what we were
Speaker 3: saying a few weeks ago about dwarf Elberta spruce, which
Speaker 3: is that when people get their hydrange of Macrophilla at
Speaker 3: the store, they're like, oh, look at this cute little thing,
Speaker 3: And especially older varieties of big leaf Hydrangea can easily
Speaker 3: get to be five feet tall and wide, and it
Speaker 3: can be very difficult to believe that this cute little
Speaker 3: one gallon blooming hydrangea that your you know, darling child
Speaker 3: got you from Mother's Day or whatever, is going to
Speaker 3: grow into a five foot by five foot shrup.
Speaker 1: I'm with you here. I've seen it, been there, done that,
Speaker 1: you know. I can't believe if I look back, the
Speaker 1: number of people I've suggested move a macrophilla hydrangea because
Speaker 1: it's on the west or south facing of their home
Speaker 1: and their struggling. Yeah, so it's easy to say, well,
Speaker 1: you need to move that plant. But I agree with you.
Speaker 1: I think that because it has this clumping nature, people
Speaker 1: are willing to give it a shot.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: And it does have a shallow fibrous root system, and
Speaker 3: it is very easy and amenable to moving. And if
Speaker 3: you have one that hasn't been doing well and you
Speaker 3: do want to move it, this coming March, when the
Speaker 3: ground is finally workable again and the plant is dormant,
Speaker 3: would be a perfect time to go ahead and do that,
Speaker 3: or to replace it with a higher performing, proven winners
Speaker 3: hydrange Just saying like let's stance Skyview or Letstance can do.
Speaker 3: But those aren't today's plant on trial. No, today's plant
Speaker 3: on trial is a hydrange of Macrophylla that is so
Speaker 3: small you won't have to worry that it's going to
Speaker 3: need to be moved. Oh I love this And this
Speaker 3: plant is we bit grumpy big leaf hydrangea, so you
Speaker 3: can guess by the name we bit that it is small.
Speaker 3: It reaches two feet tall and about two and a
Speaker 3: half feet wide, So that's a perfect size for you know,
Speaker 3: landscaping around a condo or an apartment or other small space.
Speaker 3: Very easy to incorporate in things like flower beds and
Speaker 3: perennial gardens. And you know, just one that's not going
Speaker 3: to outgrow its space or overgrow your dining room windows,
Speaker 3: because I feel like that's what most people do with
Speaker 3: big leaf hydrangeas, right plant them in front of their
Speaker 3: front windows. Think it's going to be great, and the
Speaker 3: next thing you know, they're five feet tall and they
Speaker 3: can't see out their windows. So wee bit grumpy small.
Speaker 3: And you might be wondering about the grumpy part of
Speaker 3: its name. It is not because it is a difficult
Speaker 3: to grow big leaf hydrangea. It most certainly is not
Speaker 3: just as easy to grow as any other proven winter's
Speaker 3: color choice big leaf hydrangea. But I like to tell
Speaker 3: the story of its name, because it's kind of a
Speaker 3: funny story. So when we get plants in for our trials,
Speaker 3: whatever that trial group is, it gets a working name. Right,
Speaker 3: we're humans trialing these plants. So even though it would
Speaker 3: be probably more objective to give it a number, no
Speaker 3: one remembers numbers. I mean, you know, they need like
Speaker 3: some sort of name, so they have. Our R and
Speaker 3: D team has used everything from like planets, dog breeds,
Speaker 3: different things like this, and those become the working names.
Speaker 3: So with its particular Hydrangea Macrophila trial, there were seven
Speaker 3: plants and they were named for the seven Dwarfs as
Speaker 3: their working names from the Snowed and the Seven Dwarf story.
Speaker 3: And when the trial was complete, we Grumpy was not
Speaker 3: wee bit grumpy at the time. It was just Grumpy
Speaker 3: was the last plant standing. And we loved the color.
Speaker 3: So it had this like beautiful, moody, dark purple flowers
Speaker 3: on it, and it was one of those things that
Speaker 3: every time someone looked at the tag to say, oh,
Speaker 3: you know, hey, which plant is this and they saw Grumpy,
Speaker 3: they got a little kick out of it, you know,
Speaker 3: they kind of chuckled. And so when it came time
Speaker 3: to name the plant. You know, we're like thinking about
Speaker 3: all these you know, conventional plant names like oh, beautiful
Speaker 3: and pretty and magically, you know, all of these kinds
Speaker 3: of names, and we're like, let's just go with grumpy.
Speaker 3: And what I love about the name is it's still
Speaker 3: making people laugh when they see it. So because everyone
Speaker 3: knows someone who's like a wee bit grumpy, right, we
Speaker 3: can all be a wee bit grumpy now, and then
Speaker 3: maybe it's because of winter, maybe it's because your hydrange
Speaker 3: is not blooming. Wee bit grumpy can solve all of that.
Speaker 3: So it's a great small space HYDRANGEA perfect for someone
Speaker 3: who maybe is a little bit grumpy. And I love
Speaker 3: the flowers on this. In acidic soils, instead of being
Speaker 3: that traditional blue, it turns a deep kind of marbled violet.
Speaker 3: And a lot of people think that that purple color
Speaker 3: comes from sort of the perfect pH but actually it's
Speaker 3: more genetic. So this is one of those hydrangs that
Speaker 3: will turn more purple than blue. If it's in alkaline's
Speaker 3: neutral soils, it will be a beautiful pink. And you know,
Speaker 3: other than that, it's just as easy to grow as
Speaker 3: any other big leaf Hydrangea heart Ese zones five to nine.
Speaker 3: It is not a reblooming hydrangea, so that's kind of
Speaker 3: you know, the reblooming hydrangeas tend to be larger because
Speaker 3: they have to put on a lot of new growth
Speaker 3: in order to actually reblue, so they tend to be
Speaker 3: a little bit bigger, not as large as the older varieties,
Speaker 3: but larger than the we bit series. So if you
Speaker 3: absolutely need a small, tidy hydrangea that you will never
Speaker 3: want to or have to prone, that you'll never have
Speaker 3: to move, we Bit Grumpy is the perfect choice for you.
Speaker 1: Our show last week spacing, Yes, plant's perfect, perfect, don't
Speaker 1: have to worry about spacing, and you know looks amazing
Speaker 1: in the summer.
Speaker 3: So we Bit Grumpy. Look for it at your local
Speaker 3: garden center this spring. You can find a retailer at
Speaker 3: Proven Winners Color Choice dot com, or find out more
Speaker 3: about Webit Grumpy Hydrangea at our show notes at Gardeningsimplified
Speaker 3: on Air dot com. We're gonna take a little break.
Speaker 3: When we come back, We're opening up the mailbags.
Speaker 2: Stay tuned.
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Speaker 3: better landscape starts with a better Shrub of Experts tests
Speaker 3: and evaluates all of our flowering shrubs and evergreens for
Speaker 3: eight to ten years to ensure they outperform what's already
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Speaker 3: your home and express your personal style, look for Proven
Speaker 3: Winner's Shrubs in the distinctive white container at your local
Speaker 3: garden center or learn more at Proven Winner's Color Choice
Speaker 3: dot com. Creating's gardening friends and welcome back to the
Speaker 3: Gardening Simplified Show, where it is our pleasure now to
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Speaker 3: a little early, maybe you're having trouble remembering what was
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Speaker 3: have a question, please do reach out to us at
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Speaker 2: Happy to help you.
Speaker 3: And of course if you you know, not every question
Speaker 3: is easy to answer on air, because you know, sometimes
Speaker 3: you need pictures. Sometimes it's just a little too complicated
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Speaker 3: but from a real gardener who cares about your success.
Speaker 3: So if you need an answer sooner, not sure we're
Speaker 3: gonna get to your question, please do you reach out
Speaker 3: to us there as well?
Speaker 2: What do we have this week?
Speaker 1: Well, Stacey, you looked at some pictures from Steve and Mary.
Speaker 1: Something attacked our red crape myrtle. Will it survive or
Speaker 1: do we need to remove it and plant a new
Speaker 1: one this spring? They're saying it was beautiful this past summer.
Speaker 3: Yes, So if you are on YouTube, you're seeing the
Speaker 3: pictures that Steve and Mary shared with us. If you
Speaker 3: are listening to us on radio or podcast, check it
Speaker 3: out at Gardening Simplified on air dot com. And uh,
Speaker 3: the something that attacked the crape myrtle here was human?
Speaker 2: Uh really?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: I have one hundred Did you see it?
Speaker 1: Did you not?
Speaker 3: Okay, didn't get a chance because iring to you. All right,
Speaker 3: here's the thing. Let me paint the picture for you.
Speaker 3: So it's a crpe myrtle in a container and it
Speaker 3: has pretty thick lower branches, you know, definitely like thicker
Speaker 3: than a finger or at least finger thickness, if not
Speaker 3: a little bit bigger, and the branches are cut at
Speaker 3: a very tidy angle and strewn all over the ground.
Speaker 3: Now it would be we do have a video actually,
Speaker 3: and we will link to it in the description on
Speaker 3: YouTube or in the show notes of trying to tell
Speaker 3: the difference between rabbit damage and deer damage. So, first
Speaker 3: of all, CRP myrtles are fairly deer resistant, so I
Speaker 3: wouldn't have expected a deer in the first place. But
Speaker 3: deer also have a very tell tale type of damage.
Speaker 3: When they chomp something, they don't just make a neat
Speaker 3: little cut and it goes away. They tear, they dig
Speaker 3: their teeth in, and they rip, and so typically what
Speaker 3: you have, especially with shrubs, is a very kind of ragged,
Speaker 3: jagged edge that's left after the deer hit it. And
Speaker 3: you can see that these are very neat. Now, rabbits,
Speaker 3: on the other hand, have those nice sharp front teeth
Speaker 3: and they make very tidy cuts at a very distinctive angle.
Speaker 3: These could potentially be mistaken for rabbit cuts except for
Speaker 3: two things. Number One, those branches are about the thickness
Speaker 3: of a finger and rabbits tend to go for much
Speaker 3: finer growth because I mean, their teeth are only so
Speaker 3: big and their mouths are only so big, so they
Speaker 3: tend to go for thinner, finer growth, or just girdle
Speaker 3: the bark on the outside to get to that giant,
Speaker 3: nice juicy cambium below the bark. Plus, as I said,
Speaker 3: this plant isn't a container. And I have seen rabbits
Speaker 3: jump into containers before, but it's not common, and I
Speaker 3: don't think that those hots. Yes, well, so actually I
Speaker 3: had a rabbit nest in one of my containers, yeah,
Speaker 3: because it was like in spring and kind had stuff
Speaker 3: grouped together and it was like perfect hiding. And I
Speaker 3: found the nests because you can always tell a rabbit
Speaker 3: escus has like a big wad of fur kind of
Speaker 3: plugging the entrance, and so I knew immediately what it was.
Speaker 2: And I was like, but there's no way.
Speaker 3: So every night we sat out there until we finally
Speaker 3: saw mama rabbit come up and just whoop leap right
Speaker 3: up into the containers.
Speaker 2: That was pretty amazing.
Speaker 3: So anyway, rabbits can do crazy things, but that's a
Speaker 3: good one. When I like to her picture Stephen Mary
Speaker 3: there's no question this is human damage. So someone because
Speaker 3: the other thing about a rabbit human damage. I'm not
Speaker 3: saying they noded. I'm saying they they brought pruners. They
Speaker 3: brought pruners and they cut this. Because the other thing
Speaker 3: is you can see in the pictures that the portions
Speaker 3: that were detached are just sprinkled all over the ground.
Speaker 3: And a rabbit doesn't just bite things just for the
Speaker 3: fun of it. It bites things off to eat them.
Speaker 3: And I have no idea. Well, actually I have a
Speaker 3: couple of theories. Okay, so one theory is a well
Speaker 3: intentioned landscaper who might have been doing some sort of
Speaker 3: fall clean up at your house. I hear of plenty
Speaker 3: well intentioned offspring who you know, come back from college
Speaker 3: and say I'm gonna help mom and dad out and
Speaker 3: cut everything back. That happens with big leaf hydranges a lot.
Speaker 3: I can't tell you how many people have told me
Speaker 3: that a well intentioned kid was home from college and
Speaker 3: cut back their big leaf hydranges. Or I don't know, Stephen, Mary,
Speaker 3: maybe you need to ask each other. I don't know,
Speaker 3: all right, but this is definitely pruneer damage. But the
Speaker 3: good news is that it will almost certainly be fine
Speaker 3: crate myrtle in the South. In fact, there is a
Speaker 3: widespread movement known jokingly as crape murder because so many
Speaker 3: people cut their crpe myrtles back just out of convention,
Speaker 3: even though they are generally much better left unpruned. So
Speaker 3: crate myrtles can easily withstand heavy pruning like this and
Speaker 3: come back. And if you are in a cold climate,
Speaker 3: crape myrtles can actually come back from the roots. And
Speaker 3: because they bloom on new wood, they'll go on to
Speaker 3: flower as usual, okay, later in the season. So I
Speaker 3: think it'll be fine. I think you're gonna have to
Speaker 3: think long and hard about how these branches came to
Speaker 3: be detached and who was walking around your yard. But
Speaker 3: I think your plant will be fine. If you live
Speaker 3: in a cold climate, don't give up on it too early.
Speaker 3: If it did die back to the ground because of
Speaker 3: this extremely cold winter that we are having here in Michigan,
Speaker 3: give it plenty of time. Give it, you know, several
Speaker 3: weeks into spring to see if that new growth is
Speaker 3: going to come from the base, and most likely I
Speaker 3: think it will.
Speaker 1: I think you handled that really well, and I'm so
Speaker 1: glad that you handled that question.
Speaker 2: Well.
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, I love being a plant detective,
Speaker 3: and of course, but you know, I in my many
Speaker 3: years of playing plant detective, I've learned to pick up
Speaker 3: on certain clues like deer.
Speaker 2: And rabbit damage.
Speaker 3: And this is pretty much unequivocally pruned by humans.
Speaker 1: And you're so right. The deer damage is telltale. Right
Speaker 1: now here in West Michigan, we've got a lot of
Speaker 1: snow and I have some yuccas, big yucca plants that
Speaker 1: stick up through the snow. The deer have just ravaged them.
Speaker 1: Generally they'll leave yuccas alone, but they're hungry. And I
Speaker 1: mean the leaves are just shredded.
Speaker 2: Oh, just torn, Yeah, because they're so hungry, right.
Speaker 1: They're so hungry. Yeah, so pretty sloppy, all right, Gail
Speaker 1: writes to us, I need help with the problem of
Speaker 1: moss taking over the grass in my backyard. I live
Speaker 1: in northern New Jerseys on seven A. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of shade. The yard is south facing and the area
Speaker 1: is about seventy five by fifty feet. Love your podcast,
Speaker 1: Thanks well, Gail. I think the important thing here to note,
Speaker 1: Stacey is that plants have roots. Moss does not ye
Speaker 1: the maw, and same thing with grass. Grass has roots,
Speaker 1: moss does not. If the moss is growing better than
Speaker 1: the grass, then that leads me to believe that the
Speaker 1: environmental conditions in that area, it's not just shade. Usually
Speaker 1: it's soil compaction. So raise the deck on the lawn,
Speaker 1: moward to give the grass a competitive edge. Get yourself
Speaker 1: a core air rader, air rate the lawn. I you know,
Speaker 1: obviously I haven't seen pictures, I haven't been on Gail's lawn,
Speaker 1: but I can almost guarantee you that that lawn is
Speaker 1: probably compacted. And Gale's also saying shade, so maybe there's
Speaker 1: a lot of trees, a lot of tree roots, and
Speaker 1: so there you go. I mean, moss does not grow
Speaker 1: on a rolling stone.
Speaker 3: No, And you know, the irony of moss that I
Speaker 3: have found in my career is that everybody who wants
Speaker 3: moss can't grow it, yes, and the people who don't
Speaker 3: want moss can't get rid of it. I mean, moss
Speaker 3: is sort of nature's cover, I guess. And if moss,
Speaker 3: and there's so many different types of moss, you know,
Speaker 3: we talk about moss as sort of this monolith, but
Speaker 3: there are literally hundreds, if not thousands, of different species
Speaker 3: of moss out there, and there are some that are
Speaker 3: adapted to dry, sandy conditions like we have out here
Speaker 3: in West Michigan, even though most people associate them, of
Speaker 3: course with shade. But you'll find moss in the desert.
Speaker 3: There's moss growing just about every condition across the world,
Speaker 3: and the specific moss that grows in your area is
Speaker 3: specifically adapted to those conditions. So the fact is that
Speaker 3: if you have it, it's because conditions are right for
Speaker 3: it to grow. And even though I think you gave
Speaker 3: great advice on trying to give the grass a competitive advantage,
Speaker 3: if it really is that shady, the grass is probably
Speaker 3: never going to get a leg up on the moss.
Speaker 3: It's just unlikely to happen shady and compected. And like
Speaker 3: you said, the tree roots, you know, the moss can
Speaker 3: certainly sew itself between the tree roots and soil moisture too,
Speaker 3: So if you really have a nice blanket of moss going,
Speaker 3: it's very often because there's enough moisture for it to
Speaker 3: be maintained that way. So, Gail, I hope you're not
Speaker 3: gonna hate me for saying this, but my advice is
Speaker 3: to learn to love the moss, you know, and embrace
Speaker 3: the moss.
Speaker 2: Because there's a lot of people who would love.
Speaker 3: To have what you have and can't. So unless you're
Speaker 3: going to make major changes to the conditions that are
Speaker 3: enabling this moss to grow, which is to say, the shade,
Speaker 3: perhaps the soil, compaction, moisture, all of those things, the
Speaker 3: moss is going to grow. So I would say, get
Speaker 3: yourself some beautiful poetic rocks, get a path through that moss,
Speaker 3: and build yourself a beautiful, peaceful zen like moss.
Speaker 1: Garden stacy my experience in my career, as grass grows
Speaker 1: best where you wish it would amen to that right
Speaker 1: and as far as moss too, I remember putting moss
Speaker 1: and buttermilk in a blender in my garage and painting
Speaker 1: porous and overnight the cats came along and licked it all.
Speaker 1: Just a total failure, so I couldn't get it to grow.
Speaker 3: So, yeah, it's a conundrum, Gale. But unless you're gonna
Speaker 3: take those trees down, I think that the moss, you
Speaker 3: need to just embrace the fact that the moss is
Speaker 3: a lush, beautiful green carpet that doesn't need mooing, So
Speaker 3: we're going to take a little break. When we come back,
Speaker 3: we're talking more about moving plants, so please stay tuned.
Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to the Gardening Simplified Podcast, brought to
Speaker 3: you by Proven Winners Color Choice Shrubs. Our award winning
Speaker 3: flowering shrubs and evergreens are trialed and tested by experts
Speaker 3: with your success in mind. Learn more at Proven Winners
Speaker 3: color Choice dot com.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Gardening Simplified Show. We're talking about
Speaker 1: some plants that like to move, and some plants that don't,
Speaker 1: and some that are well, maybe just a wee bit grumpy, right, Stacey, Yes,
Speaker 1: And I had a little poem here that I wrote
Speaker 1: my rule of thumb on moving plants. If it's a clump,
Speaker 1: make the jump. If it's a trunk, it's no slam dunk.
Speaker 1: If a stump, don't be a grump. If an annual,
Speaker 1: you don't need a manual. And that's kind of how
Speaker 1: I apply it. And I wanted to ask you, Stacy,
Speaker 1: you and I both love baptisia. Have you moved some
Speaker 1: baptisia plants and what's your experience?
Speaker 3: Would that I have moved Baptisia plants? It is not fun.
Speaker 3: It is not easy. And I say this as someone
Speaker 3: who dug them from very sandy soil cannot even imagine
Speaker 3: trying to dig them in a clay soil. But the
Speaker 3: main thing is, you know, Baptizia is a very drought
Speaker 3: tolerant plant, and that's one of the things that it's
Speaker 3: known for and one of the reasons that I personally
Speaker 3: love it. But generally speaking, the more drought tolerant a
Speaker 3: plant is, the more that indicates that it has a
Speaker 3: very extensive root system to find water, you know, maybe
Speaker 3: a little bit deeper or wider than other plants do.
Speaker 3: So it has a much deeper root system than other perennials,
Speaker 3: and it does put out a tap root as well
Speaker 3: as these really kind of gnarly roots all over the place.
Speaker 3: So it's hard, but it can be done. I've done
Speaker 3: it many times. And yeah, I mean this year I
Speaker 3: probably moved oh gosh, nine.
Speaker 2: Baptisias that I had around my yard.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 3: And I was prepared for the worst because when I
Speaker 3: originally moved them to the location I just moved them
Speaker 3: from because you know, frequent flyer miles. Yeah, change our mind.
Speaker 3: We re envisioned the space, the first time I dug
Speaker 3: them was very hard. It was less hard this time,
Speaker 3: even though they've been performing really really well. But I'm
Speaker 3: hoping that this is it because I just want to
Speaker 3: give them a chance to grow and do their thing.
Speaker 3: But I would say it probably took them a good
Speaker 3: three years to fully recover and start growing into that big, beautiful,
Speaker 3: rounded shape, but they still flowered pretty well in the interim.
Speaker 1: I like your comment about drought tolerance as it pertains
Speaker 1: to the plant's root system and moving again. Living near
Speaker 1: the beach here in Lake Michigan, we have a lot
Speaker 1: of oak trees and they're notorious for a tap root, right,
Speaker 1: And so you have other plants too that can be notorious.
Speaker 1: I'm thinking Joe Pieweed Goat's beard along with the baptizea
Speaker 1: any of these plants. It can be tougher. But the
Speaker 1: point I've tried to make today is even though it's tough,
Speaker 1: it may be worth it, and it doesn't mean it
Speaker 1: can't be done well.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And it also just means again to have realistic
Speaker 3: expectations when you put the effort in, and you know,
Speaker 3: also don't just write it off right away and say, okay, well,
Speaker 3: you know this is clearly not coming back because it
Speaker 3: has been set back, so it needs a little extra TLC.
Speaker 3: And I think that's another super crucial part of moving
Speaker 3: plants is you're going to need to keep an eye
Speaker 3: on them, and you're going to need to watch them,
Speaker 3: make sure that don't get too much or too little water.
Speaker 3: You're just going to need to keep an eye and
Speaker 3: make sure that they don't get animal damage. They should
Speaker 3: not experience any further setbacks after they've been moved, so
Speaker 3: you need to do your best to protect them and
Speaker 3: make sure that that environment that they have, especially for
Speaker 3: that first year or two, basically treat them like a
Speaker 3: brand new planting sure where you're monitoring them closely and
Speaker 3: just trying to give them the best start at recovery
Speaker 3: rather than getting established, because now they're getting re established.
Speaker 1: And I don't want to just slide over the fact too,
Speaker 1: that some folks may say, well, Rick, you're giving us
Speaker 1: permission to move these plants. Easy for you to say,
Speaker 1: it's hard work. It can be in some of these plants,
Speaker 1: it's very very hard work. I remember a couple of
Speaker 1: years ago, I ran the Chicago Marathon and I crossed
Speaker 1: the finish line and you start to recover and you're hydrating.
Speaker 1: It's a twenty six point two mile race. You cross
Speaker 1: the finish line. And I was thinking to myself, I
Speaker 1: did this for a metal and a T shirt because
Speaker 1: that's basically what you.
Speaker 3: Get, right, Yeah, we up bragging rights. Well, I mean,
Speaker 3: but that's something.
Speaker 1: The point here is that when you dig up a planet,
Speaker 1: it's really hard to do in your yard, but you
Speaker 1: move it to the perfect location. Now you've got something
Speaker 1: there that you can enjoy for a long time. And
Speaker 1: they've been moving plants throughout the ages. We're gonna put
Speaker 1: a link at the website. Our website is Gardening Simplified
Speaker 1: on air dot com, and we'll put a link there.
Speaker 1: I thought it was interesting this past fall when I
Speaker 1: visited the Arnold Arboretum and I was reading about Wardian cases.
Speaker 1: So it's named after Nathaniel Bagshaw Ward, a London physician
Speaker 1: with a keen interest in the natural world. The whole
Speaker 1: point here is that they developed these boxes that are
Speaker 1: like miniature greenhouses, and that's how they move plants. They
Speaker 1: couldn't send them obviously on an airplane. In the seventeen hundreds, right,
Speaker 1: sixteen hundreds, eighteen hundreds whatever, and so these plants were
Speaker 1: subjected to wide variations in temperature on a boat, as
Speaker 1: you know, they traveled to wherever they're going, from China
Speaker 1: to London. And he basically was successful in building these
Speaker 1: boxes where they could move a new plant species. Now
Speaker 1: that said obviously, Stacy. In the process, they also moved
Speaker 1: some pests and some pathogens, yes, that were not native
Speaker 1: to the area where they were moving. But that's all
Speaker 1: a part of history. So I think it's a fascinating story.
Speaker 1: And we'll put the link there from Harvard University and
Speaker 1: the Arnold Arboretum. Okay, Stacy, are you tired of winter
Speaker 1: and ready for spring? I know the.
Speaker 2: Answer, yes, Sam, thank you very much.
Speaker 1: So forcing branches ooh great idea. Yeah, and I wanted
Speaker 1: to ask you a question. So just going out and
Speaker 1: clipping some dormant branches, putting them in a vase indoors
Speaker 1: to enjoy the spring blooms. I listed some plants like Forcythia,
Speaker 1: mock orange quints, maybe even father Gia, witch, hazel, service berry,
Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera, and forcing these blooms indoors into color.
Speaker 1: There's a plant that I absolutely love, a proven winner's
Speaker 1: color choice shrub and it's called show Off Forcythya. This
Speaker 1: plant is amazing folks. And in working at the greenhouse,
Speaker 1: helping out at the greenhouse, I'm amazed at the popularity
Speaker 1: of Forcythia. Everybody comes in asking for You would think
Speaker 1: that this is a run of the mill plant and
Speaker 1: it's ubiquitous, but everybody asked for it, and then you
Speaker 1: take the game and you move it to the next level.
Speaker 2: Would show off, Yeah, show off is you know.
Speaker 3: I remember when I first got the job here, I
Speaker 3: was like, why do we offer for Scythia? Like Forcythia
Speaker 3: there are a dime a dozen and my boss Tim
Speaker 3: would at the time was like, oh, let me show
Speaker 3: you why. And you know, these are plants that set
Speaker 3: far more flower buds on the stem and so much
Speaker 3: so that they look like a column of yellow. So
Speaker 3: it's not just like a little bit here and there.
Speaker 3: It becomes a beautiful, dense column. So you just get
Speaker 3: so much more impact than a conventional variety. And that's
Speaker 3: really what we're looking for. But as far as forcing
Speaker 3: branches go, at Forsythia is a great choice. But I
Speaker 3: would encourage everybody to just play around. I mean It's
Speaker 3: such a fun way to try to get through the
Speaker 3: rest of the season here and do something interesting. It
Speaker 3: doesn't even have to flower. Just having some plants inside
Speaker 3: and fresh green growth makes a huge difference. I actually
Speaker 3: have some right now. And this is kind of funny.
Speaker 3: So when we had our company Christmas party just about
Speaker 3: a week before Christmas, we had deck graded the tables
Speaker 3: with some red twig dogwood branches, Arctic firebred red twig dogwood.
Speaker 3: So we were cleaning up afterwards and I just took
Speaker 3: a handful home to have, you know, on the table
Speaker 3: during the holidays. But I put them in a nice
Speaker 3: silver vase and they are flowering now and looking absolutely
Speaker 3: gorgeous with foliage coming out. And it's just been such
Speaker 3: a cool process to watch them going from this very wintery,
Speaker 3: you know experience to growing and flowering and looking green
Speaker 3: and wonderful, and just that like little flicker of hope
Speaker 3: that you get to see fresh green growth in your
Speaker 3: house from your plants. It makes a huge, huge difference.
Speaker 1: Oh, it is fantastic. And Stacy, you're an individual who
Speaker 1: got me very excited about Illuminati Tower mockhorn.
Speaker 3: Oh.
Speaker 2: I love those.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that plant in my landscape is sensational. And again
Speaker 1: years ago in the seventies and eighties, I remember mock
Speaker 1: orange in the in the garden Center and it really
Speaker 1: wasn't much. It was a rangy plant. Really wasn't all
Speaker 1: that exciting. Illuminati like the show off. For Cynthia blooms
Speaker 1: all along the stem. Do you think I'd have success
Speaker 1: in forcing that? Inside?
Speaker 2: I mean, not to be a downer, but no.
Speaker 1: Okay, That's why I'm asking, And.
Speaker 3: The reason is that when it comes to forcing these branches,
Speaker 3: basically the earlier in spring they flower, the better your
Speaker 3: success of getting flowers out of them.
Speaker 2: Indoors will be.
Speaker 3: And the mock oranges don't really bloom for us here
Speaker 3: in Michigan usually like the first two weeks of June,
Speaker 3: so that's pushing it a little bit late. So I
Speaker 3: would say anything that's going to be blooming more in
Speaker 3: like the April time frame is going to be your
Speaker 3: best bet. So for Cynthia is a great choice. Quince
Speaker 3: is Yeah, Quin's forces quite well. Our double takes do
Speaker 3: flower a little bit later than the more conventional single varieties,
Speaker 3: and also they tend to flower more on their second
Speaker 3: year wood, so you have thicker stems and not kind
Speaker 3: of that more you know, swoopy, elegant look that a
Speaker 3: lot of people look for enforcing branches. But yeah, the
Speaker 3: earlier at flowers, the more success you're gonna have indoors.
Speaker 3: I have some winter honeysuckle, which I think I mentioned
Speaker 3: a few weeks ago. Lenisra fragrantisima. Not a very popular plant,
Speaker 3: but it blooms very very early, late winter early spring
Speaker 3: smells just like fruit loop cereal. And actually, just yesterday
Speaker 3: and I got home, I said to myself, I need
Speaker 3: to cut some of those and bring them in and
Speaker 3: get that amazing fragrance indoors. But it's always worth trying.
Speaker 3: And the cool thing about the illuminatis again, you're going
Speaker 3: to get that really cool sort of rugged corrugated foliage
Speaker 3: coming out. It's still something to look at. So it's
Speaker 3: totally worth just experimenting and seeing what comes out. Because
Speaker 3: you know, shrubs can take a little bit of pruning.
Speaker 3: It doesn't matter if you take off three, four or
Speaker 3: five small branches to do this. We're not talking about
Speaker 3: like major pruning.
Speaker 1: Yeah. All right, well, I don't know about you. I'm inspired.
Speaker 1: I'm ready to move into spring.
Speaker 3: Let's do it all right, I mean none that it's
Speaker 3: our choice, but we can. Will it sooner maybe?
Speaker 1: Okay, meteorological spring, which is a tough word to say,
Speaker 1: but I tackled it all right.
Speaker 3: Well, next episode it starts, so we're ready for it.
Speaker 3: We hope you are too. So thank you Rick, thank
Speaker 3: you Adriana, and thanks so much to all of you
Speaker 3: for listening. We truly appreciate it and hope you have
Speaker 3: a wonderful weekend.