Speaker 1: They think they do the the the the the.
Speaker 2: The the the the the.
Speaker 1: The the the the the then they take them.
Speaker 2: The the the the the the the the the the
the the the the the the the the the the
the the the the the the the the the.
Speaker 3: The the.
Speaker 2: The the the.
Speaker 4: The the the the the the.
Speaker 2: The the the the the the the the the the
the the the the the.
Speaker 5: The the the the.
Speaker 6: The all right, we're back for another open forum debate,
and the reason for today's open form is if we
had some interesting exchanges once again on X As you
can imagine. Basically, there was a statement that Daniel Kikachu,
who have already debated, wants to do the debate together
with I don't know who, presumably Jake, I'm not sure,
and Muhammed hit Job will not do it, so he
bowed out.
Speaker 3: I will have.
Speaker 6: Hanged this over to Jake and Hikikachu. I don't know
why he can't defend his position. I think isn't he
does any brag about memorizing the Quran or something, so
it seems like he would be able to debate it.
I don't know, maybe he doesn't do debates. I haven't
kept up, but we've already debated Daniel and Jake. I mean,
if that's what we have to end up doing, that's fine.
Of course Sam has already agreed to it, so they're
like Sam is running. So Daniel puts up a tweet
saying that everyone will run or excuse me, that Sam
will run and that I will run, even though I've
already debated both him and Jake. Of the comments in
the comments section of Modern Day Debate, which is like
thousands of comments that Daniel lost. But we're scared. I'm scared.
We're both scared. We're running, We're we're canceling. That's what
Daniel claims. Let me find Daniel's tweet here, because I mean,
they're like, there's such gas letters. They don't even like,
they're like, you made this up. The Sam slow backed
out of two debates. It's weird. He wets himself when
he hears my name. I think Jay Dyer one which
is not me, some other that's some black dude. And
Sam told Myron that they would not debate me and
Jake because it would be an instant loss. Now Daniel
knows he's just saying this for attention, because we all
know what the comments say. Underneath the modern day debate
channels debate that I had with Daniel, and they're ninety
nine percent laughing at Daniel. So they play these games
and they gaslight everybody as if they've dominated in every debate.
It's the same thing that the Romanchalvics do. Ready to
do this exact same thing. Even if the comments are
ninety nine percent that Daniel was demolished, the Muslims go
and cheer that they won the debate. And it's the
same with the Jake debate. Everybody's making fun of Jake,
getting it mad and yelling and gibbering and shaking like
he's got Parkinson's. And then they're all like, he won,
he wanted a bit, he wanted a.
Speaker 2: Bit he want'.
Speaker 6: That's my remix. That's the remix of it right there. Anyway,
we're gonna goead and open it up because there's not
much time because the entire world will be watching Elon
Musk and Donald Trump. I don't know if you guys
ever heard of them. Are you all familiar with those two?
Have you heard of Trump or Musquet? Many of you
probably have not. They will be interviewing here soon, so
we might as well get started, because I'm sure everybody
will be watching that instead. Andrew Meyer is in the mix.
Uh oh uh oh oh oh.
Speaker 2: Oh.
Speaker 6: I was hoping the Muslims would come. They're always so
loud and talking so much hot air bravado hutspa I
believe is the technical term, and it's so hard to
get them to come debate anyway. It's open for him.
That means the topics are listed as Islam, Catholicism, Protestantism, Arianism,
Hebrew Roots, et cetera. If a Jewish person would like
to debate, they can also call in a debate. It's
open for him. Just keep your topics to those topics.
That means that if you call in to ask me
about your favorite poetry reading, your whatever box wine you've
had as a wine mom, I'm not interested, don't care.
If you want to talk about basic FAQs, that's not
for tonight. I'm not doing faus. That happens all the time.
You can go find all your FAQs elsewhere the topics
are listed. If you want to talk about potential debates
with sneak O the circles of Tate hit Job who
has declined the debate, that's also a topic as well. Andrew,
what's up, Jay?
Speaker 3: Hey man, I literally just debated Daniel on modern day debate. Oh,
I don't know that I did a screen.
Speaker 7: Share of my document because I was reading off my
sources and such, and you know, I always thinking that
I would even be able to screen shair.
Speaker 2: I didn't know I could do that.
Speaker 7: So my document was called how Pikachu Debate because I
saw you call him Daniel, how Pikachu?
Speaker 6: So wait, what did you two debate?
Speaker 3: Oh, we were.
Speaker 2: Discussing the Talmud.
Speaker 7: He was telling people that the Talmud gives Jews license
to rape anybody they want.
Speaker 3: And yeah, that was a very educational bait for Daniel
and a lot of his viewers.
Speaker 6: Well, no matter how you debate with Daniel and Muslims,
they will immediately declare that you lost and they will
clip everything with twenty second clips. So it seems to
be really just kind of a means to clipping twenty
second clips is really what it ends up being.
Speaker 7: I will say, you know, some of the people, like
the first major comment on the YouTube that got likes,
it's a guy with the Kaba the Islamic rock saying
Andrew the Jew completely cooked. And another comment was like
I followed Daniel. I love Daniel, but like Andrew creamed
and crammed him, is what the guy said.
Speaker 3: So some of them are honest.
Speaker 2: Some of them are honest because it was it was
pretty much a shutout.
Speaker 6: Okay, well, I'm going over here. We'll look at the comments.
Anything you want to leave us with, people can go
check out your debate. I'm interested to watch that.
Speaker 7: Yeah, the Mohammed jab the guy said that it's worse
to be a Christian than a homosex and in his religion,
homosexuals deserve death.
Speaker 3: So that's a pretty nasty.
Speaker 2: Thing to say.
Speaker 3: And I think anybody like that.
Speaker 7: Not paying attention to those type of statements, Like I
think everybody that believes in God, there is an alliance
that can be made in the world.
Speaker 3: But we have to sort out things like that.
Speaker 2: First.
Speaker 3: You got to be aware of who you're talking to.
Speaker 7: Somebody thinks that you're worse than someone that deserves death,
you got to be aware of that.
Speaker 6: So is this the debate, the one that's titled is
the Torah's treatment of non Jews? Ethical?
Speaker 7: Is that it?
Speaker 2: That's it?
Speaker 6: Okay? Yeah, well, thank you Andrew I'll check that out.
Speaker 3: Is it your religion, bro?
Speaker 8: Thank you?
Speaker 6: That is a debate we don't see often. Now, we
did have a Jewish individual debate the other day. He
and I were debating the passages in the Torah and
the prophets. So the accusation that I never debate anyone
who's Jewish is not true. We just don't simply have
We simply don't have that many Jews at calling to debate.
But we had one last week and it went on
for I don't know, thirty forty five minutes. So it's
just simply not true. I'm typically open to debating anybody
if they're sane. I don't debate like totally crazy wacko
people unless they're really entertaining than we do. So this
looks like an interesting debate. I would be interested to
see how this went down. Let's look at Let's see
what the reactions are, because I want to I want
to look really quickly at the We'll look at the
reactions between the debate that I had, not the Torah,
the Talmud, modern day debate, blah blah blah, Daniel Hikikachu.
So let's see a lot of Muslims Daniel's entertaining Daniel
one pleasant conversation Aqem Elijah on at least Jews don't
force their beliefs on each other. Well, this is a
difference that I think a lot of people don't take
into account because people are always saying, why don't you
debate more Jews. Jews are not really proselytizers, so their
faith is not centered on making as many converts. So
that's one reason why there's not a lot of Jewish debates.
All Daniel does is Gish gallop. I don't like either religion.
Daniel is a pdf all right, so we'll check that
one out. If I've ever seen him Muslim versus Jewish debate,
I've never ever seen that, So that's that will be
interesting to see. Now, let's see the comments between me
and Daniel, because those are quite a hoot. Never mind,
we don't have time for that. You can go read
those comments on your own if you want to, because
they're they're a hoot. Let's see, Zerky police be upon me.
You got on mute bro, all right, we lost we
lost him. Sam Shamun. Is he in that you're saying
he's in the quay? Let me see I don't see
him on here. How are you saying Sam wants to join?
Sam can join in on the Twitter? Is he not
use Twitter? If he wants to hop in, he can?
I don't care. Okay, I know I see your comments,
but I don't have a I have to switch it
over to tell Sam to join through the Twitter space,
and I'll have him on if he hops on the
Twitter space. But I've already set up this stream to
where my display is this and it's not collab cam.
I might could turn on collab cam.
Speaker 3: I don't know.
Speaker 6: Let me see. Let's see if Sam can join through
Twitter space first, that would be the easiest, and then
if he can't, I'll try to see if I can
change the window capture to collab cam. I Mike can
do that in the middle of a stream. I don't
know if I've tried that before. So, but the easiest
thing would be if Sam can just join the Twitter space.
He messages me on Skype, I can't play the If
I play Sam's message, it'll shut down the Twitter space.
So the easiest thing is if he just joins up.
Let's see Cody, I'm.
Speaker 3: Hello Jay, Hey, how's it going, brother? What's up, man,
not much, man, thank you so much for having me on.
Speaker 9: I just wanted to talk about Protestantism and I wanted
to just bring up what do you what do you
think about the one Bible verse that says that wherever
more than one and gather something like that, then I
shall be there too. A lot of Protestants used that
to justify the idea that the church felt a way
and that there was need for reformation.
Speaker 2: What do you think about that?
Speaker 6: Well, this actually goes back to the Jewish tradition because
Jews had this idea that you need a certain number
of people there to have what's the term that he's
a minion or something like that, like a group to
make up a community. I forget the exact number that
they had as their idea, but the principle is true.
But it still doesn't mean that there's not an appointed
place for worship to occur. Does that make sense? Okay,
So Sam's here, Sam, if you want to join, and
you're welcome to Let's see if I can invite him
to come on.
Speaker 2: Gotcha? Okay, thank you, Jay, I appreciate you.
Speaker 6: Yeah. I mean, in other words, you can't like take
one verse kind of in exclusion to the rest of
the verses. So the same principle could be true, like
you know, with let's say we gather together, you know,
somebody's house to do prayers. Is God in our midst Sure,
but that doesn't mean that, oh well, then we don't
need the you know, weekly liturgical worship of the church,
like that would be a false either or because the
rest of the passages after that, you know, as we
get into the New Testament, Jesus explains that the church
is established around the bishops. So you see what I'm saying, Like,
the principle is true and it is also it's like
John four where Jesus says that worship will no longer
just be in Jerusalem when the Messiah. Now the messiahs comed,
he says to the woman in the well, worship will
be done to the Father all over the world. Right,
does that make sense?
Speaker 2: Gotcha?
Speaker 6: Okay? So in other words, the rest of the passage
will also informed this. It's not a denial of the
place for liturgical worship, like I mean, Jesus doesn't mention
the Lord's Supper in that passage, right, So when we
conclude from that, oh well, I guess the Lord's sawper
is not necessary because this verse doesn't mention that. It
just says get together and pray.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 9: Yeah, I feel like a lot of Protestants take an
engine run a mile with it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3: I'm a little starstruck being here with you and Sam
as well, So anybody hear me.
Speaker 6: Yeah, what's up?
Speaker 5: Sam?
Speaker 2: Hey?
Speaker 3: Brother, what's up?
Speaker 10: Yeah?
Speaker 3: I was told you're calling out the Muslim so I
wanted to come. Sure and you for that segment because
I'm also live streaming. But what's going on? Muslim's buddy
talk to me, Jake.
Speaker 6: Yeah, we got to open for him here. I don't
know how many Muslims are in the space. It's always
kind of a random thing as to who shows up.
I've invited multiple Muslims to come today. I don't know
if they will. Let's see if we got a Muslim here.
Speaker 3: Yeah, because I want to set the record.
Speaker 6: Sweep because I know, yeah, please do you and me.
Speaker 3: I know, I gotta be careful what I say because
I got two strikes on YouTube and Daniel how key
could you is responsible for the first one. So if
I get a third one and the next ninety days,
my account will be Dolle. So I got to be
careful what I say because I'm on YouTube now because
they just told me your life for the set the
record straight. I have the receipts Donnie for standing for truth.
I reached out to him, and I even have the
receipts for modern day debate, a platform I will never
work with because he turned out to be dishonest. But
I challenge Daniel Hakikachu and I got the receipts, I
got the emails and Donnie can confirm. I challenge Daniel
Hakikachu to debate me on four topics. One topic was
Muhammed's view of the Bible, and I'm gonna explain why
I always start with that. Second topic would be the
Krawn is it filled with contradictions and errors? Third topic,
we would discuss whether the Trinity is fond and scripture.
Fourth topic, whether Stamp teaches pure monetism. So this is
my challenge. Now, I understand that Daniel is not the
sharpest tool in the shed, and I hope the Muslims
are hearing this because I would love to learn him
to show up now and put me in my place,
because he claims I'm running. He comes back and accepts
three and then he wants to debate about the authenticity
of scriptures. Now, Jay, you're a master of logic. I'm
not I try to stay with scripture. I'm not that
good in logic. If I challenge you to debate me
Mohammed's view of the Bible and then you come back
and propose a topic the authenticity of the Christian scriptures?
Am I missing something here?
Speaker 2: Am I like?
Speaker 3: Is there a disconnect? Because if I'm debating you Mohammed's
view the Bible to show you that Mohammad taught that
the Bible is uncrumpt, but then you want to then
debate me again on the authenticity of scriptures, that means
either this man didn't get it or he wants to
do jihad against Muhammad. Because once I established that Muhammad
taught that the Bible's uncrrupt, he cannot attack the Bible
if he's going to stay I'm listener. Now, am I
missing something here? Help me with logic? J I'm not
that sure.
Speaker 6: Well, I wouldn't call even say I'm an expert in logic,
but I mean I know enough basic principles of you know,
fallacies that there's certain things that they won't. We know
that they're not going to debate you on anything textual.
They'll only debate what they think is a safe space. So,
for example, Jake, Jake's never going to debate anything textual,
nothing to do with anything revelation in scripture or anything
like that. He would they admittedly would not do well there.
So Jake's only interested in quote metaphysics. But I don't
even think Jake understands metaphysics very well based on what
we debated. Now, another thing I want to touch on
to Sam is that people were misunderstanding all the Muslims
today on Twitter because Myron's tweet ended up getting like
six hundred thousand views, and that they misunderstood that. They
thought that you were only calling out sneak O and Uthman.
You were offering one on one debates with all the
people that you called out, and you agreed to a
two versus two with me as well.
Speaker 3: Yes, let me set that straight, Jape. It's something he
put a video mocking me about my analogies for the Trinity. Now,
I promise Jake, and I hope he's listening. I promise
Jake that I wouldn't attack him personally. Because Jake, it's public.
He has MS, so I want to extend grace to
him and pray for him that God will use that
to bring him to the truth, and that because he's young,
MS is not something to laugh at. So I promised him, Look,
I'm not going to make it personal with you. We're
going to keep it professional. Well, he did a video,
brought up a clip mocking me about my Trinitian analogies,
and you know how it is being Middle Eastern Assyrian
hot blooded. May God constrain me so I don't send
him my anger. I said, Okay, Jake, I'm going to
I'll call you out. You and I got a debate,
Mono Imano. You and I are going to debate. I'm
going to contact Donnie for Standing for Truth. He's one
of the most fair moderators on the planet standing for truth,
and I'm going to be doing a live stream where
I'm going to call you out first. Now, I guess
that part they didn't put on Twitter, but it's on
my YouTube and rumble. I'm challenging tobate me Mohammed's view
of the Bible, and then whether the Bible teaches a
trinity and whether Slam teaches pure monotheism, but we have
to start with the foundational one Mohammed's view the Bible.
I contact them, he goes Okay. Then in that video,
I said that I doubt Jake will have the courage
to debate me on that. He can then bring Daniel
Hakikachu to join him on these three topics, and I'll
do those two against me, and I go call my bluff,
and I'm challenging Sneiko and Uthman and Muhammad to debate
me on these three. That's something different from you and I.
I agree to join you, and it can be anyone
on the planet. Let him bring shiverer Ali, I will
join you on fresh and fit I will follow your
lead to debate any of them. So now that it's clear,
stop the lies, Muslims, stop risk representing the facts. So Jay,
you let me know if anyone accepts. I know you're
already school Daniel Hakakachu and you already owned Jay. And
I saw that Muhammada Joab wants to run. But if
Muhammed a Job wants to bring Daniel, I don't mind him.
And Daniel, you and I, but you set the perimeters right.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think they said yeah, go ahead, Yes.
Speaker 11: Sim I just don't see the issue. For I am Muslim,
so I'm biased.
Speaker 5: But you are not accepting a two on two on
modern day debates, which is pretty much the debate platform.
Speaker 3: That's actually a lie. Have you seen my emails when
I publish them or you're gonna lie like a good takiast?
Did you see the emails? Why did I make and.
Speaker 11: I didn't even make a statement.
Speaker 3: No, because you said modern day debate, I actually agree
to modern day debate to debate Danie hock Chu and
I propose the four topics.
Speaker 5: I'm not talking about what happened in the past. I'm
talking about this two v two that is being presented now.
Speaker 6: Why would we do it on lot of the debate?
Why would we do that on modern day debate when
that's already going to be on myrons?
Speaker 3: Yeah, and let me let me correct you. Maybe you
didn't listen to the first ten times after Modern Day
Debate proved that he's not a man of integrity, I
won't go on his channel now if they want to
do it too on two Fresh and Fit? Right, Yeah,
what's wrong with fresh and Fit? Okay? I mean that
seems that seems you know that seems in your world
kissing of Blackstone seems like monotheism. We don't care what
it seems to you.
Speaker 12: Get them onto on fresh and fit, amazing manner, dude,
I guess no much better matters than Muhammed whom mount
a nine year old and had you do muta and
had your captive women Blackstone young men.
Speaker 3: Anyway, Jay, you'll let me know when the Pagans are
bold enough to step up to the plate and debate
you and I. Yeah, and if you need me to
come back if they join, just let me know on Skype.
I'll join you because I just wanted to set the
record straight because I'm on a livestream. But I will
interrupted become if they come up.
Speaker 6: And if you want me to join it, yeah, Well,
I mean there's we got Muslims coming in if they
want to debate.
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, if they want to, yeah, but are they
gonna do it or they're gonna start whining and making excuses? So, Jay,
I wanted to talk to you.
Speaker 6: If that's okay, Well why can't you don't want to
talk to both of us? I'll bring another Muslim up.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean I guess this would this topic would
kind of not be for Sam Shampoo running from s Man.
Speaker 3: Now you almost from Landing. Yeah, man, I'm running from Blackstone. Hey, hey,
click this up?
Speaker 13: Hey, why did you run away from SnO Park?
Speaker 14: It was three of you guys.
Speaker 3: It was the crook David would come on. I know
my people, I know, come on, why did you run away?
Speaker 13: Your brother?
Speaker 3: Tell you? Let me lick the Blackstone become a poor
collegies listening. I respect you, man, I'm sorry. I was
trying to in front of you run away, but everybody
else you your profit didn't run away. Why do you
like to run away and call Muslims out? Like Muhammed
who didn't do it from the front, but he went behind.
I wore her dress? What about your wife?
Speaker 2: I heard about your wife? What about you?
Speaker 6: So if we're gonna do it, how is he running?
How is he running? If we're gonna do it? This guy,
this guy is ridiculous.
Speaker 3: He ran away from.
Speaker 2: J J.
Speaker 5: So I kind of wanted to ask you some questions
that would you know, benefit the audience. And you know,
I'm here with sincerity because like I've like I view
you as somebody that's like relatively intellectual.
Speaker 6: Like what's get to the question. What's the question?
Speaker 5: Yeah, so I'm trying. I'm trying to understand.
Speaker 3: So if you have three persons.
Speaker 5: With one nature, which is divine, and you have three
persons with one nature, which is you know, human, how
is that not three gods? The same way it is
it three humans?
Speaker 6: Because it's an analogy, and all analogies break down at
certain points. The point precisely at which the analogy breaks
down is that the three persons are not separate beings,
like three humans are separate beings. So the analogy is
just between the relationship of nature to person, not three
separate beings. So in the same way you understand that
as a Muslim, you believe the same thing about the attributes.
Speaker 5: Just one second, just before we get into that, I
kind of want to understand your view more so, is
the being.
Speaker 3: Numerically identical?
Speaker 5: Meaning object one and object two have every single thing
about them the same?
Speaker 6: No, or, I'll say, wouldn't be distinct persons.
Speaker 3: So the the being is not numerically identical to God.
Speaker 6: You don't understand that something can be similar and different
in different ways. They don't have to all. It's not
an either or. That's what an analogy is. So you're
confusing the analogy as if everything in the created aspect
that's an analogy to what we're talking about, has to
match up one to one, and it's not that way.
Speaker 3: I don't I don't see what created has to do
with this.
Speaker 6: Though you said three human beings, those are creatures.
Speaker 11: No, no, no, no, I asked you about God and
the same being.
Speaker 6: Yeah, but your original question was an analogy to three
human beings and three divine persons. That's an analogy. Do
you understand what let's let's rewind. Do you know what
analogy is? First of all?
Speaker 11: Yeah, sure, what it's comparing things to show the.
Speaker 6: Same point or but there's also what is it a
one to one.
Speaker 3: And an analogy should be one to one?
Speaker 6: No, that's not an analogy. Okay, so you don't even
know basic grammar, so there.
Speaker 5: So there isn't a way to represent with like you know,
a sound analogy what you're trying.
Speaker 6: To So there's unifical predication, equivocal predication, and there's an
analogical predication. So what you said is that there's a
one to one, right, that's not analogy. That's different.
Speaker 5: No, that's that's that's regarding numerical identity, right, I asked you,
is God numerically identical to the being?
Speaker 2: The one being?
Speaker 6: The word being is just like the word God. It
can pick out different things. It's a generic term. It's
not a proper noun. Okay. And that's your mistake is
that you think that it only picks out one thing.
But even in your own theology, it picks out different
things things because you think Allah has attributes and you
think that, and let me, I can just ask you
if you think the attributes are possessed a sayety.
Speaker 3: And I have a question for him about that. Hopefully
you can define.
Speaker 5: So I'm still ask about my own theological schools. So
I don't really have a response. What I'm responding to, Jake.
Speaker 3: Let me ask you a question to see your consistency.
I know you want to run it's okay.
Speaker 11: So how is saying that I don't have asked the question.
Speaker 5: I don't have enough knowledge regarding my own geological spending.
Speaker 3: You don't have enough knowledge of Jay's theological tradition.
Speaker 11: But what you hear, that's why I'm asking him questions.
Speaker 3: No, you're not asking questions to learn because every time
he tries to explain it. See, this is the problem, Jay.
They just want to talk over people. So the coward
doesn't want to defend his own politicism, pretending to know Sham,
I was having a good conversation with Jay. You're literally like, Jay,
are you having a good conversation I'm having You're having.
Speaker 6: Like, Well, the conversation is. Look, I mean you're you're
confusing analogical predication with unifical predication. So unifical means in
the same sense. So if I said that the threeeness
of human beings is identical to the threness of divine persons,
that would be unifical predication. That's a one to one.
An Analogy is when there's aspects of it that are
similar and aspects that are not similar. Hence analogy. Yes,
do you understand that, But do you understand that you
do the same thing in Islam when you talk about
Allah having similarities to creatures, even though your Kuran says
in forty two that there's no similarities between alline creatures.
You do the same thing.
Speaker 3: Understand that, Yeah, but he's committing chirk. By the way,
let me explain to you how he's committing shirk. God Sam,
You're you're why he's committing shirk. Why Jay, if he's
on your team, man, good luck on the deba. Yeah, okay, Jay,
let me explain to you as they try to tell
cover because that's what they do. They try to dominate
and bully. That's what narcissts do. In the Koran. Just
try and talk to j Well, you'd be not smart.
Chapter forty two, verse eleven. Chapter one, twelve four says
there's nothing comparable to a law. A form of shirk
is when you try to liken Allah to creatures. And
this is what you've been trying to hammer to him,
that when he used the analogy of three human beings
and somehow derived from that that the Trinity is identical.
Because you kept saying that analogy means there's similarities and differences.
He's now likening God to creation, which is a form
of shirk in Islamic theology. But he wouldn't know that
because memory pleaded ignorance.
Speaker 5: About amazing argument, Sam, amazing Okay, Now tell me about
the Koran?
Speaker 3: Is it uncreated or created?
Speaker 15: Yo?
Speaker 2: Ja?
Speaker 6: I mean, is there anything we're not going to answer that?
What about the Quran that I can talk to you,
is it uncreator created?
Speaker 3: I'm not. I'm not here to debate Islam.
Speaker 6: Here you are, I'm talking about you. You're going attorney
in the question, of course you are.
Speaker 3: I'm trying, dude, That's that's it. I'm I don't want
to talk creative.
Speaker 6: Well, what's wrong with Okay? Well do you want me
to ask you Sam's question about? How about? I just
asked you Sam's question?
Speaker 16: Then?
Speaker 13: I mean, yeah, good, I'm really not interested in that, right?
Speaker 2: Why not?
Speaker 6: I mean it's the same principle. Is all a one
or many?
Speaker 3: So Jay asked for ask on my behalf, you'll be
my agent. Shelley is the creator, uncreator See if he's
gonna answer this.
Speaker 6: Is this is so silly. He's right here. You can
hear what Sam saying. Come on, man, what what do
you think?
Speaker 8: Yeah?
Speaker 3: All right?
Speaker 2: Do you have someone else?
Speaker 6: Because he's doctor. Let's see what doctor?
Speaker 3: Oh he's this guy's a peace I like this guy?
Speaker 2: Is he here? Yeah?
Speaker 3: Look, I just want you gotta send me your notes.
I was still still getting this together, but I had
a comment for r J.
Speaker 17: So, r J, you you just you can't go attacking
their theology when you don't have your own together.
Speaker 3: I love you, man, You'll just hit a critical like if.
Speaker 17: You if you believe that God's attributes are uncreated, eternal.
Speaker 18: And they're not identical to God and they're not other
than God.
Speaker 17: You can't go attacking a Trinitarian for believing something very
similar about his divine persons.
Speaker 3: You can't do that, doctor Kelliam. Just so my audience
know who you are, doctor Khalil, and Danny. He is
an Ismaili, an Islamic philosopher. He actually debated Jake on
the incoherence of Toheed. This man is brilliant and I'm
not saying it to say it. He is. I'm waiting
for your notes and it would be an honor if
you feel that I'm good enough to have you to
bring you on, because I know David had brought you
on because as in Ismaili, you actually believe that Christ
was crucified, did die, but as soul is alive? Am
I correct?
Speaker 2: Yes?
Speaker 17: Yes, okay, we're not the only ones who believe that
there are there Muslims historically minority will have you too.
Speaker 3: You have my contact face because I reached out to
you for your notes. If you ever want to come
on and talk about your Ismayliism, your view of God
that it's nothing like the Athities and you have problems
with it. And if you want to talk about that,
the crowd does not categorically deny that Christ was killed
by a crucifixion, it'd be an honor for me to bring.
Speaker 2: You on an interview.
Speaker 6: Well, everyone should also watch Jake's debate with doctor Khalil too.
I'll watch that many times.
Speaker 19: So that was a great debate, ye, speaking of debate
in the spirit off a friendly discourse and not not
at homing.
Speaker 17: And I responded to your guised debate challenge, and I've
offered a three on three debate between three of you
and three of my people, again in a friendly academic spirit.
Speaker 18: It's in a tweet.
Speaker 17: And I've also proposed, because you guys don't know much
about our position and we don't know so much about yours,
so I've also proposed.
Speaker 18: That bally, do we debate again in a proper way.
Speaker 17: But I also have proposed a before the debate, long
before the debate, a public discovery session.
Speaker 18: Where we would meet online and then we just.
Speaker 17: Have like an open Q and A with each other
out Okay, what is your position on this? What is
your position on that?
Speaker 18: I don't expect you to answer this right now, but
is doctor, that's no problem.
Speaker 3: It's fine.
Speaker 6: I'm open to anything. Like I'm always open to that
kind of stuff. I'm open.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I all for just one thing. Member of my
specialty fortee. Just so there in my background is scriptural exegesus.
The philosophical whiz would be Jay. So if I do discussions,
I prefer to make a textual based so I would
well be more than happy. Do you bring into others.
Jay's got me with him, he can bring someone else.
Speaker 2: Let's do this.
Speaker 17: So but yes, I understand that I don't know lich
debate because you guys have been proposing like three four topics.
I can't keep tracks. So I just responded to trinity
like your trinity model versus a Neil or Neil platonic
heat model. We can again think about it. We're happy
to discuss the specifics of what it would can what
it would cover, whether we just philosophy metaphysics, or whether
it be scripture and metaphysics, and we can we can
talk about that.
Speaker 18: But it's just it's an open.
Speaker 20: Call and it would be a debate in the technical sense,
but it won't be a debate in this popular sense
where everyone just you know, we're just trying to like
score points like WWE or something like.
Speaker 18: We're not interested in that. What we're interested in.
Speaker 17: It is sort of like a proper exchange of each
Each group's position is very clear, the arguments for and against.
And if you want an idea of what I'm talking about,
I've debated, and I put this in quotes. You know,
I've debated David Would a couple of times, right, yes,
And I've debated Joshua Side right also, And this is
what I have in mind. So, yeah, we have different views,
and I'm not going to pretend I have the same
view as you and vice versa. But you know, it
would be a proper sort of academic more of an
academic debate, like you know, when we see I'm sure
you've seen Christian philosophers debate each other on YouTube.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 17: Pretty, they're pretty nice to each other. They're civil, nobody
insults the other person's mother or whatever it is.
Speaker 3: By way, just for the record, I was challenging the dies. Oh,
I understand that, I understand.
Speaker 18: I totally see it. I know what you guys are doing.
And I'm not a part of that industry.
Speaker 17: Exactly my agenda and from my colleaguesist we occasionally will
involve ourselves on this because we want to raise the discourse.
And frankly, we're tired of a marginal Celerfie theology, you know,
because celo fees are marginal, like their theology is marginal.
This is not even the majority of studies. But we're
sort of tired of this sort of like dominating the airwaves.
Speaker 18: It sort of becomes old.
Speaker 17: I mean, Jay already j beat Jake's celopism. I beat
Jake's celifism. It's just getting old now.
Speaker 3: They just keep yeah and both person beat it too.
Speaker 18: So how many losses are these guys going to take?
Speaker 17: I think it's time for this, the more intellectually grounded
and philosophically.
Speaker 18: Sophisticated positions to dialogue. And this is even what some
academics have said.
Speaker 17: They've said that, look, if the dialogue partner of Christianity
was this spiritual philosophical Islam, you know, everything would be
quite different.
Speaker 18: And I think that's true.
Speaker 3: I agree with you, doctor, and I want people to
know you are not among these diies. You are respectful.
I'm not just saying to say that I've seen your work.
You are professional.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 17: The irony of what you're saying is that the term
dae as a title was invented by the Ismileys.
Speaker 3: Wow historical your language.
Speaker 17: Yeah, Dawa and die as formal titles of people at activity.
Speaker 18: This is an ismili invention.
Speaker 17: Nobody Smiley's called themselves dies and did die off our
dialogs different, but yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm sorry that they hijacked that term. But I
want people to know this man is a professional Islamic philosopher.
Watch his discussions. Very perfect. Fact my first introduction to you.
Speaker 21: You may not know this.
Speaker 3: Years ago you had a symposium on Christology. You were
representing a Smailism shiver Aali the sunny position, and he
had Tony Costa, and you had a Catholic representing the
Protestant Catholic view of Jesus Christ.
Speaker 6: Do you remember that?
Speaker 22: I remember it very well.
Speaker 18: The video is still on my discussion.
Speaker 3: It was excellent. That's kind of professional dialogue in debate,
superb because you gave your position, Shaver gave his position,
Tony Costa gave his position, and I forget the Catholic
man's name, but it was four perspectives on Jesus superb correct.
So my hat's off too. You are professional and you
are a gentleman.
Speaker 18: Thank you.
Speaker 2: I appreciate that.
Speaker 3: The offers there.
Speaker 18: Again, we take your time. We're happy to discuss specifics
at a later time. We're in no rush, so if
this doesn't happen for months, it's not a problem. But
we're just putting it out there.
Speaker 3: You got so, Jay, it's in your court. If you
ever want me to join in this discussion, I'll do
the technical stuff. I'm here to do that because you're
the philosopher. I'm the textual guy that's saying that. I'm great,
but you know what I mean.
Speaker 6: Sure, yeah, I appreciate that, Doctor Klow, appreciate that. Sam.
You guys are welcome to I'm happy to say something
up down the road for sure.
Speaker 3: Now, brother Jay, if you don't have any Muslims want
to debate us.
Speaker 6: Oh, there's all. There's a whole crew of Muslims.
Speaker 3: But are they gonna talk or they're gonna insult in custom?
Speaker 6: Let's say who's next. Let's say who's next? Right, go ahead, Hassan,
there here we go, gonna. I'm mute. Man, All we go, Hassan,
I'm mute.
Speaker 3: If you want to talk as getting ready for the
attack and so it's guys.
Speaker 6: Get ready, Hassan Shibley, un mute if you want to talk.
Speaker 3: Man, By the way, for those on my channels, I
don't want you to confuse it with Sonny Islam. In fact,
doctor Kott is more qualified to speak of his branch
of Islam. It comes out of the Shiat tradition solism, right,
and so sadly they've been persecuted by Sonny muscle. So
this is a group that's been targeted and persecuted by
Sunny Muslims. So he's not like these Sunney I don't
know what to turn. I don't want to use you
anymore because it's from them.
Speaker 12: They were persecuted and harassed by the larger Sudney community.
Speaker 3: So I thank God for him because he puts them
in their place philosophically, textually.
Speaker 6: But go ahead, hows on, I'm mute. Do you want
to talk? All right, we'll move on. If you're not
going to.
Speaker 3: Talk, everyone, okay, we're on YouTube, man.
Speaker 6: Go Stott, what's up? I'm mute. Stott. You want to talk,
I'm mute.
Speaker 2: Man, oh salamlekum.
Speaker 3: Can you hear me?
Speaker 2: Mm hm, ok.
Speaker 6: Yeah, we can hear you.
Speaker 2: Man.
Speaker 23: To preface, I'm not a Muslim, I have perennials gleanings,
but I would like to ask your opinion on goofy tradition,
particularly the doctrine of debt we should or unity of
being a sort of atheist metaphysic put for it by I.
Speaker 6: Just did a talk. I did a talk on that
the other day. Go ahead, no, no, I just.
Speaker 3: Wanted to say, so people know what he's talking about,
Islamic panantheism. I but go ahead, yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 23: The core idea is that everything that exists is a reflection.
Speaker 3: Of God's essence.
Speaker 6: Right, that's a neo Patonic idea.
Speaker 23: Well, it's derived from Neoplatonism. They had a great deal
of influence on the Arabic world at that time.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 3: That's why you should talk to doctor Khadid and Danny
because that's what's his position is.
Speaker 6: Right, Okay, yeah, I would critique it by the traditional
critiques of neoplatonism, and many of the Church fathers actually
combated neoplatonism in various forms. So there's quite a few
of those basal critiques that affinaceous critiques it. In fact,
the Cappadocians argue that Neoplatonism is really the root of
most of the chrystological and trinitarian errors. There's a great
essay written by an Orthodox theologian, how Eunomius's position relies
on Neoplatonism. Let mess if I can find it.
Speaker 23: Well, I'm shocked to hear that, because my existing notions
of Eastern Orthodoxy were like through you know, Pseudodonysis and
the like, who are greatly influenced by apathetic theology, which
is in turn derived from Platinis and such.
Speaker 6: Well, I mean, the fact that there's overlap at times
does not mean that ultimately that theology is derived from
that are based on that. In fact, Basil argues probably
more than any of them, against neoplatonism. I see, Okay,
and the paper I would recommend to you, Let me
see if I can find it. Let's see. I think
it's called something like Unomius's reliance on Platinus. Let me
see if I can find it. It's a really good
paper to make this point. It's got It's written by
a guy with the gigantic Greek, crazy Greek name. Let
me see, it's at Academia dot edu. So let me
go over there and search.
Speaker 2: H h h, dang it.
Speaker 6: What is the name of that paper? Let me think
for a.
Speaker 23: Second here, Well, while you're occupied, I don't mean to
bombard you with questions, but what do you make of
the traditional school?
Speaker 2: I'm sure you're familiar with, say.
Speaker 23: Seraph and rose and such, but what do you think
of that specific branch of perennial philosophy and a shoe
on coomber swelling and the like.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I have a shelf of their works back here
behind me. I had an interest in that in my twenties.
I read a few of their books. But no, I
think Orthodox Christianity is incompatible with with traditionalism printialism, although
I did just do a lecture on it the other day,
by the way, see.
Speaker 8: You know, yes, m.
Speaker 6: Let me look some more and I'll try to find
that paper and link it underneath this. Did you want
to say something else, doctor KLi, dang it, that's not it?
Speaker 2: So that was it?
Speaker 6: So that it's in our discord server. I know we
have the paper. I just can't find the public link
to it and I've read it three times. I can't
remember that Greek day's name though. All right, tell you what,
let me look really quick in the discord server in
the PDF bank and I can find it. Okay, here
we go, here we go. Here it is. The paper
is called Plotinus and Unomius, a parallel theology of three hypostases.
That's it.
Speaker 18: I just cited that paper two weeks ago out of coal.
Speaker 17: Yeah, because I was trying to tell them that, okay
and Platinus that you know me and theology is very
similar to us.
Speaker 18: And somebody was like, no, it's not, and I was like, yes,
it is, and then I cited the paper.
Speaker 6: Yeah, here's the paper. I finally found it. If you're
looking for it right there, it is, and it's in
the chat there, and then I'll try to put it
underneath this chat later on. Did you want to say
something else, doctor Koli.
Speaker 18: Yeah, just on this dropic of apple Fasis.
Speaker 17: But is it not the case that in Orthodoxy, like
your position on the divine essence, like is apple Fasis correct?
Speaker 6: That's why we have the energies doctrine, because in the essence,
we don't know the energies come down to us, as
Basil says.
Speaker 18: But when when you say God is God essence plus
energies or God is just essence.
Speaker 6: Energies are actions of God. So they're not composed, they're
not composite parts. They're actions that God does or their attributes.
Speaker 18: Sorry, the energies are actions or attributes both.
Speaker 17: Okay, but then you know the son is the like
dacheries and like they'll say openly because Ali says that, oh,
the term allow referras to the essence and the attributes together.
Speaker 18: So for you like the term God, does it only
refer to the essence?
Speaker 6: No, it picks out any of those things. God picks
out the word. God can pick out person, it can
pick out essence, or it can pick out energy, attribute operation.
Speaker 18: Does a pickout Does it ever pick out like like
several of these things. It picks them all out but
all at the same time? Or is it sort of
just Sometimes essence sometimes.
Speaker 6: Mean well, I mean depending upon the context or the
debate that's being had. For example, when pallet Must debates
with the Roman Catholics, it's typically you know, he's talking
about it as an the word God as an energy
or the work because God, if it refers to existence.
The cappa Docians often say as an energy. Uh if
it's picking out the divine essence even though we don't
know it. And then it's picking out the essence, So
it's it just depends on the context. There's no like
one one to one only referring to this idea of
what the word god is. In fact, that's why we're
always pointing out that in scripture it's even a rough
it's it's even used of humans and angels. They're called
gods at times.
Speaker 17: In your theology, is the do the deride? Essence is concrete, right,
but it's not just abstract.
Speaker 2: Uh.
Speaker 6: Yes, it only exists in the mode of the person's
that have that essence. So it doesn't exist in any
kind of higher abstract platonic idea or form or realm.
So the essence only exists in the mode of the
person of the Father and the son and the spirit.
It doesn't exist like above them. They don't participate in it.
It exists in them. As the word that we use
is in hypostatic, in the mode of and we would
say the same thing for example of human nature as
an analogy human nature, it doesn't exist in the abstract
like in a platonic form, it exists in the mode
of each individual person or hypostasis that possesses that human nature.
But we think there is a distinction between nature and person.
Speaker 3: Is a real distinction, Yeah, we.
Speaker 6: Don't think distinctions entail composition or division.
Speaker 18: Nobody's a real distinction or is it just like a
mental distinc No.
Speaker 6: It's a real distinction because for example, we don't believe
you can participate in God's essence, but we believe that
grace is a participation in God's energies.
Speaker 17: And the energies there is attribute and energy just like
two turns for the same Or are some of these
energies that attributes.
Speaker 6: And some of them act well, It depends on Again,
it depends on what the context is. For example, the
action of God creating the world is a unique action
at one point, and so God is not continually creating
another world, at least as far as we know of
other things. Like for example, in John seventeen, Jesus says
that he came to give us a share in God's glory.
So we would say God's glory is an uncreated energy
that we really participate in. But it's distinct from the
action of creating the world.
Speaker 18: Okay, so some of these energies are like temporal, No.
Speaker 6: The energy is the energies themselves are not temporal, but
they have a once once, a one point in time reference,
you could say. So, for example, in Genesis, has God
wrested from his works? And so when Palamas has debate
with the Latins, the debate ends up hinging on at
one point, what does it mean for God to rest
from creating? Well, Palamus argues that it means that God
didn't have to keep creating. It wasn't an emanation. It
was a decision that he did by will at one
point at one time. And God can do many things.
He doesn't have to just do one thing at all times.
Speaker 18: Okay, cool, thank you.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 6: I mean, if we have an open colloquium or whatever,
I'm happy to you know, answer or explain any of
those kinds of questions. Did you want to come back
and speak. I forget what your name was, rd RJD.
You know what up?
Speaker 2: Man?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 11: Yeah, I just a quick response to Khalil.
Speaker 5: Can you explain how asking somebody what their position is
is attacking their beliefs?
Speaker 2: Well?
Speaker 6: I think he's saying that you came on to debate,
and so it's a debate form debate.
Speaker 3: I literally just want to know what you believe.
Speaker 6: Well, but it's listed as a debate, so typically people
that pop in, we assume it's a debate.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 5: I thought that was referring to, like just saying that
you're going to have a debate to sneako takee.
Speaker 6: Oh no, no, no, say I opened this up for
everybody to call it debate typically.
Speaker 5: Okay, So yeah, Khalil, I'm not here to attack anyone's
belief I'm here to understand their beliefs, which is exactly
why I did not want to defend my view of
Islam because I don't even know if I'm an eschery
or an ethery.
Speaker 11: So how could I defend something that I don't even
have a position on it?
Speaker 6: Okay, anything else you want to say?
Speaker 2: No, I just yeah, that was it.
Speaker 6: Appreciate it, dude, Tack Blue, what's up?
Speaker 2: Man? Hi?
Speaker 3: How are you doing?
Speaker 6: What's up?
Speaker 21: Man?
Speaker 6: Yeah? Sam can come back if he wants. Two people
in the chat are saying that he left. I mean
I thought he was just busy doing another stream. He
can come back every once, So I don't care.
Speaker 2: I am in a park, so there's gonna be some noise.
Speaker 3: If that don't minds you, You sound good to me,
to go ahead.
Speaker 2: Okay. So my first Christian is.
Speaker 3: I don't understand how Jesus fulfills the law.
Speaker 2: What does it mean?
Speaker 6: Well, I mean I would say there's a couple of
senses to what it means. In one sense, it's a
reference to his own divinity, and so by being the
son of God, he can't do evil, He does no wrong.
He's a perfect being. And so by being the divine
son of God, every action that he does is virtuous.
Every action that he does is righteous and according to
the law. Because we believe that Jesus gave the law.
We believe that the burning bush in Exodus three, if
you compare that to Exodus twenty three, that's actually Jesus.
We think that he is the second person that God
had present in the burning bush. He even makes this
argument to the Phariseason John five through nine. So that's
our position on how he's just as a virtue of
being divine person a kind of living embodiment of the Torah.
He is the living embodiment of the divine word. He
is the divine word, and so when he's incarnate or
when he's often in the Old Testament, he just by
virtue of his divinity quote, fulfills the law. However, in
the sense of like the ceremonies that God gave. So
if you think about in the Torah, when Moses is
given the ceremonies of how to do the levitical law
with the temple, the altar, and the priesthood, the sacrifice,
the bronze, see where they would do the washings, all
that animal sacrifice stuff, or like the Passover and Exodus,
those are all fulfilled in the death, burial, and resurrection
of Christ. So in the sense of fulfilling the levitical
law in the ceremonies, we think Christ fulfills those by
his death, uryal resurrection. He's the Pascal Lamb, He's the
fulfillment of Pentecost, all of those rituals and feast days
that the Jews had, we believe that that's all pointing
to what Christ would do. And so a lot of
the New Testament is devoted, for example, to explaining Christ's
fulfillment of those levitical laws and ceremonies, particularly like the
whole book of Hebrews is dedicated just to this. Even
the Sabbath is fulfilled, we think in the rest that
Christ did when he died. So when he died on
Good Friday, that's a fulfillment of the Sabbath rest. And
then he rises to an eighth day resurrection, that's a
fulfillment of the eternal Sabbath. So in other words, every
one of those levitical ceremonial things, we think Christ for
the most part fulfilled in his lifetime and in his
death rown resurrection, and then in the establishment of the Church.
So that's why we think Old Testament Israel is a
type of the New Testament Church that exists throughout the world.
Speaker 2: But I still don't understand it.
Speaker 24: So are you saying that because he was perfect and
he gave the law that in a sense he can choose, uh,
and it in some way.
Speaker 6: Well, it's not ended, in the sense that the moral meaning,
even behind the ceremonial laws, continues on. For example, if
you read Paul's epistoles, he'll say stuff like, uh, you know,
when it says not to sew to garments onto the
sense two patches onto a garment or not to sow
two seeds in a field. He says, that's a spiritual
principle that still continues on. So the Old Testament, for example,
unclean animals, those were for us symbolic of vices and
the demonics. So we avoid the unclean animals in the
spiritual sense of avoiding the vices. So for us, even
the ceremonial laws continue on in their spiritual meaning. They're
just not continued on in their literal sense of everybody
in the world having to submit to levitical ceremonies. Because
if you know Judaism, you know that Jews don't believe
that the law was made for everybody. It's not made
for the whole world. It's only made for Jews. And yeah,
so in our view agrees with that, and we say
that if Judaism was going to spread to the whole world,
and that's what we think Orthodoxtricianity is, it's the true
Judaism for the whole world, not rabbinical Judaism distinct, then
it has to adopt certain things that allow it to
spread to the whole world. And we think that Christ
absolutely decided upon that because he has that authority as
the divine Son of God. And this is partly the
logic of the reasoning of the Jerusalem Council in Acts
fifteen is that they realize that if this is going
to be Judaism for the whole world, then we might
want to look to a covenant where people were made
righteous before Abraham or before Moses. How has anyone made
righteous before Abraham or Moses. Well, let's look to Noah.
And that's why Acts fifteen specifically goes to the gentile
Noah to say, if Noah could be righteous before God,
then we ought not expect anything more for the gentiles
converting than what was expected of Noah. And that's the
whole of Acts fifteen.
Speaker 24: Because just think that it's just all about the law,
and they don't, right, I think before it And my
other question is one argument I've seen that shaped which
man said, is that if Jesus has two like he
has a human part and divine essence when he died,
where did the human Did the human and the divine separate?
Speaker 6: Right? So yeah, this is covered in John Damascus Book three.
If you go all the way down to the last
part of on the Orthodox Faith, the book three of
John Damascus, he gives a whole exposition of our position
on this in a very brief three or four paragraphs.
I highly recommend it for those who want to just
read a few paragraphs. But in short, we believe that no,
the divine person of the Sun was never separated from
the human nature because he's a divine person, so he's
he possesses his omniscience as a divine person. He descended
in the soul with the human soul that he assumed
into Hades. We believe Hades is a realm of the dead.
So when Christ descended into Hades as the divine person
to that human soul that he assumed, the human soul
is separated from the human body. But Christ is the
divine person, divine subject, so there's not a human person.
It's a divine person with the human soul. And he
went into the realm of the dead to Hades to
preach the Gospel to the dead and then to raise
those people in the resurrection. And that's what we think
is that's why Peter says that he preached to the
spirits in Hades.
Speaker 24: And finally, if you don't mind, yeah, it's a cushion
of both is I think on the website drew for
Judaism that they explained to ascendence, you are made a
priest forever by the other of Melchisedek. Right, that's Melchisidic.
It's just a title of a king. So when you
say you, like the son of David, are going to
be a priest priest forever and the order of Melchisidic
is like you're going to be an administrator by the
like of a rifle king.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 6: I mean, Jews have all kinds of explanations to try
to get around passages that would make the Messiah prophet,
priest and king, and particularly with a person of Christ.
So I don't doubt they have all kinds of ways
to try to say that the Messiah when he comes,
will be like David and a descendative David, and that
he won't actually have a priesthood. Well, we think he
actually has a priesthood because the argument of Paul in
Hebrew seven about this passage is that Christ's priesthood is
superior to the ironic because Abraham in whose loins was
his descendant Levi and Aaron, right that he that he
gave allbeisments to Malchisedek. So Malchisedek is superior. So of
course a Jew would want to downplay this passage because
this means that the Ironic priesthood is inferior to the Melchizedekian.
But the whole argument of Hebrew seven is that christ
priesthood is superior to the ironic.
Speaker 24: But in a way, what the Jew will say is
that those statements are made after like the Jews at
the time, they didn't have this whole thing about Melchizedeic
and everything.
Speaker 2: They're going to point to passages.
Speaker 24: Like when the Peter didn't understand why Jesus had to die.
They're going to say that the Messiah at this time
wasn't understood to be a sacrifice.
Speaker 6: No, but that's not true. That's why the Jews have
to That's why the Talmudic position is that there's two Messiahs,
Messiah ben Joseph and Messiah ben David. One of them dies.
Speaker 11: Uh.
Speaker 2: Is that the majority statement.
Speaker 6: It's the Talmudic rabbinical teaching, all right, I mean, I
mean reform Jews won't believe that, but if they're Orthodox
or Rabbinic Jews they will, all right. So, yeah, those
are great questions, great questions. Appreciate that. Shout out to
John pro what's up man, and then we'll go to
Hamsa next. How you doing, dude, looks like I was
having a hard time connecting. If you want to pop out,
pop back in, I'll go back to you John. Let's
see hams up. What's up?
Speaker 3: Hi?
Speaker 21: Bro?
Speaker 2: Is my voice clear?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Uh So.
Speaker 15: I was watching the sub Chamon's life yesterday and he
was given analogies about the trilogy, and one of the
analogies he gave is the car analogy.
Speaker 2: And this analogy is saying that that, for example, the
trilogy is like a car.
Speaker 15: A car has parts, and this part the engine, the wheel,
I don't know, and these parts are like the Son.
Speaker 2: Jesus and Jesus, the Holy spirits, and the Father. But
for me, this is a heresy.
Speaker 15: This is a partialism because when you see the car
has engine and has will and has so on.
Speaker 6: I understand part. I understand created things are composite. God
is not composite. We all believe that. So he's just
making an analogy between something could be one and many
at the same time, just like you believe about the attributes.
Speaker 15: Yeah, but the engine is not the car, but Jesus
is God. So the persons mean the essence in the
trinity is the nature being God. But the essence in
the car analogy must be also the car.
Speaker 2: But the engine is not the car, the wheel is.
Speaker 8: Not the car.
Speaker 6: Well, he's just making it right. So the analogy breaks
down at the point you're talking about. But it's only
an analogy to one and many, not to parts.
Speaker 15: I mean, gee, for me, this car analogy is for
the for the trinity is flawed.
Speaker 6: I mean, let me give an example. If it's the
same principle. Okay, the number three, right, the Arabic number three?
Speaker 2: Yeah, turn out, so it's a tree.
Speaker 6: Okay, is that one or is it three?
Speaker 2: The essence is being a number.
Speaker 6: But if you not, my essence is just just just three,
is it? Is it one thing or three things?
Speaker 15: Is the one thing?
Speaker 6: Of course, but it's also three.
Speaker 2: Yeah, but the essence is being a number. But if
you do, but you cannot, you can.
Speaker 6: See you're you're getting confused. Your confusing the mataphestic lesson.
You're confusing the it's a limited analogy that's only referring
to numerics. It's not talking about essences.
Speaker 15: Let's stick with this example. So you said it's three
one thing. Okay, So if you if we give this
example as the trilogy.
Speaker 2: So the three is like.
Speaker 6: Three, not a tree. Three.
Speaker 2: Yes, three, I mean three, the number three, not the
three of course.
Speaker 15: So the number three, if we compare it to the trilogy,
is the god head.
Speaker 2: The tree is the god Head.
Speaker 15: And if we separate the three, we have one one one.
One is not the tree, but in the trinity, Jesus
is God.
Speaker 3: Mm hmm.
Speaker 2: So this is also flowed analogy. I don't understand it.
Speaker 6: Explain to me how it's flowed analogy. I'm listening to you.
Speaker 2: Okay, what explain it. I'll give you just one minute.
Speaker 15: So in your example, we have three, it's three one thing.
Speaker 2: Of course, it's the one thing. But what is there
is the number tree.
Speaker 6: So this is where you're making a mistake. You're going
into essences. The only thing that we're saying is is
an analogy is the numerics nothing to do with essences. Okay.
It's just pointing out that something can be three and
one at the same time and it doesn't involve a contradiction.
That's all we're saying. That's okay.
Speaker 2: A quick question a quick question. G what are the
parts of three? Who has one? One? One? Yeah?
Speaker 6: No, no, no, you're missing the point the number. Look,
I can make the same analogy to attributes. Okay, is
all of ninety nine parts?
Speaker 2: These are names?
Speaker 3: What?
Speaker 15: Well, the attribution of being all powerful is not We
don't say all powerful.
Speaker 2: This attribution of being all powerful is good.
Speaker 15: No.
Speaker 6: Wait, so all of his attributes, all all of us
attributes are Do they possess a saiety?
Speaker 15: No, that's that's his nature is one means of being good.
Speaker 6: Okay, I know that, But I'm talking about the attributes.
So do the attributes have a dependence relationship on Allah's essence?
Speaker 2: They are? They are Allah, They are Allah.
Speaker 15: You cannot say the attribution for being know all knowledgeable
is good. We don't all say that. But you say
Jesus is good. The Holy Spiritch is good.
Speaker 3: So the hold on.
Speaker 6: So wait a minute. So now you're so you're admitting
that the attributes are dependent.
Speaker 15: I don't listen to anything.
Speaker 2: Let's sick with you.
Speaker 6: It was that not the argument you just made.
Speaker 2: No, No, let's stick with your example. It's very easy.
Speaker 6: So you don't want to talk about the attributes because
it's the same problem. You don't see that.
Speaker 15: No, your example was very easy and simple for all
the people that are here.
Speaker 2: Okay, let's stick with it.
Speaker 6: You see, the example is just talking about something being
one and many. You don't understand that something could be
one in many. You know, does all I have many attributes?
Speaker 2: Just get you one minutes?
Speaker 3: Can you let me just say so?
Speaker 6: You won't? You guys are so like emotional You just
spit out stuff without listenings.
Speaker 2: Come on, one minute?
Speaker 6: Is all a one in many? Is all one in many?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 2: My god, he's allah when you okay?
Speaker 6: So are they really different?
Speaker 3: Look?
Speaker 6: Is there a depend you understanding? This is a debate
in your own Akida's right? This is there's a dep
there's a debate. There's not a debate between different aquida's
about the attributes.
Speaker 2: So you the one to me? So you just okay,
you speak because.
Speaker 6: You're just spitting out stuff without even listening to what
I'm saying? Is that even a debate? Do they debate
the dependence relationship? So you want so you want to
answer these basic questions?
Speaker 2: What do you know?
Speaker 6: Are Come on? Do the different akitas debate? Do the
different Akita's debate the relationship. Why are you saying my name?
Every time somebody starts spitting out my name? We know
that's the point at which they're losing the whole discussion.
Speaker 2: I have many many points.
Speaker 6: Do yours school's debate the relationship between Allah essence and
his attributes and dependence relationships?
Speaker 2: So he won't.
Speaker 6: So he won't answer because the car analogy is only
talking about the one in the miny? Do you know
what the one the mini is? Do you know what
the one the mini is? Agree with the So he
won't even talk. So this is how silly these people are.
It's like talking to children. They think that an analogy
has to be one to one correspondence. Like the first
guy they came on here didn't even know what he
thought an analogy was unifical predication. They don't understand the
difference between basic grammar terms. They don't understand. Go ahead, man,
what's up?
Speaker 2: Umah?
Speaker 3: Did you there?
Speaker 6: Yep?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Let me let me correct these Muslims who can't represent
anything anyone says. Now when I say Muslims, I'm talking
about the suny Muslims. I don't want to put the
silent undoney.
Speaker 5: And the same.
Speaker 6: He's he left, it's all, it's all soon he's in here.
Speaker 3: Yeah. But I just want to clarify everyone, go watch
the clip. I never said the carnalogy is the trinity.
What I said was in context. Let me just explain
for the people. See, this is why Muslims sinning. Muslims,
you really make us despise religion because you can't be honest.
This is why I treat you the way you do.
Proverbs twenty six, verse five, answer full according to his folly.
Let's he become wise in his own mind.
Speaker 2: So this is why I do it.
Speaker 3: But look at the difference with Kinda than Danny. Now,
in that analogy, I never said the car is analogus trinity.
That's a lie I said in Creation. I have the clip,
it's there on YouTube, and you guys want to lie.
I said, in Creation we see complex unity. It's all around, agreed.
Speaker 6: Complex Yeah, we've made I've made that same analogy. I
agree with it.
Speaker 3: Okay, So that's all one of us. That was all
the analogy was. Like in Creation you see complexity, diversity
and unity, composite complex unity. If that's true of the
finite temporal realm, why would we think that God his
being would be any less complex.
Speaker 2: That.
Speaker 6: That's all I said, right, And that's an analogy which
we have our you as well, which is just simply that.
To put this in philosophical terms for those who don't know,
this is called the problem of the one in the many.
Something can be one and many at the same time.
That doesn't necessarily mean that it's composite. Muslims believe typically
that there's a dependence relationship between between Allah and his attributes,
and between the attributes and the other attributes. They only
exist independence upon one another in all his essence.
Speaker 3: Hey, I'm jake, God bless you.
Speaker 2: Man.
Speaker 3: You're more patient than me. I don't know how you
handle them, because you see why I lost my hair.
I'm looking at I said, I can't handle this. But anyway,
I'm here, brother.
Speaker 6: If you got any Muslims ring them up, no, there's
a million of them in here, So let's go.
Speaker 3: I bet you're gonna show what's up.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you're here.
Speaker 3: I don't hear him.
Speaker 6: He's raising his hand and he's not talking.
Speaker 3: I'm mute, yep, okay, fantastic. We had some connection issues.
Speaker 25: That's all right.
Speaker 2: We're Muslim.
Speaker 3: We want to let you know that.
Speaker 2: We believe.
Speaker 3: The Holy Or is the final testament of God. Okay,
we know that you're okay, Okay, that's fine.
Speaker 26: So we believe in the Torah, we believe in the
in Kiel, the Gospels, we believe in the Bibles.
Speaker 6: So but but you don't because because the Quran actually
confirms the prior revelation.
Speaker 25: I just want to ask him, trying to say, we
have to believe in the prior books.
Speaker 3: Can I ask you a question about one second? Let
me finish my sentence. Let me finish my sentence at least.
I don't want to answer. They want to preach, but
go ahead. No, I don't want to preach. I was
talking for you. You don't have no idea. The middle
of speaking, you can ask me question what you believe.
So what I was saying was, yeah, so you're very rude,
very rude. No no, no, no, my profect.
Speaker 11: Right.
Speaker 3: They want to preach. Okay, I'm not preaching.
Speaker 6: No, we know your position here, So do you talking?
Speaker 11: I was talking, but you interrupted me.
Speaker 3: You're very immoral, That's what I'm gonna say. Anyway, Well,
I'll try to don't talk about manners when you follow
Mohammed because I'll show you his son.
Speaker 2: But he is the best profet.
Speaker 6: Do not do not, do not, do not, do not
do not.
Speaker 3: Do you want want profect? Okay, good, get to your point.
Do not demonize my profect. My friend it was he
thought he was even possessed. He said, no, no, you are.
You are a very fine that's that's in your tradition.
Did you not want to do thought he was even?
You met that guy so I can talk on it.
Speaker 6: We don't need a sermon. So if you have an
argument for how you believe the Torah, which, by the way,
the Koran says that the Torah is not corrupt, right.
Speaker 3: Right, I was going to say, okay, anything that I'm
telling you, yes, I have better than you and your prophet.
I'm not talking to you some No, he brought me
up here.
Speaker 2: I'm with him.
Speaker 3: Whether you're like no, no, no, no, I'm talking to
I'm talking to Jay the host answer me.
Speaker 6: This is so, this is so ridiculous. They will talk
to me and they won't talk to you, Like if
you're not going to talk to Sam and then don't
don't even come on. There's no point in talking through
another person. Tanji, what's up?
Speaker 3: You know why jay right? They want to pick it
up because they know they can't get away with lying
about the Koran and the deeds.
Speaker 6: You know the deeds as well too. I'm mute, man,
what's up? Tanji? I agree? Tanji? Un mute? Uh huh,
what's up?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm not Muslim, but I've heard you.
Speaker 27: You never got to finish it, but I hear you
start of this critique or you ask if the attributes
have a sayety.
Speaker 6: Right, because it depends on how they're going to answer it,
because they try to argue that if you think that
there's distinctions, and for example, they'll say, does the sun
possess a sayety? If he doesn't possess the power to cause,
then he's diminished and he's less in their subordination. And
then they'll turn around and say that the attributes have
a dependence relationship upon Allah's essence and upon one another.
So that's a double standard. That's the whole reason I
asked them that question. But they never even get to
the point of answering it.
Speaker 2: They don't believe in the absolute devinde simplicity, right.
Speaker 6: It just depends on which Muslim you're talking to, because
Khalil does. But most of the Sonnies will try to
argue for some kind of distinction between Allah and his attributes,
which is the whole point of why they get stuck
on this question. That's why I asked it.
Speaker 27: What do you think like the strongest critique against uh
like strict monotheism, unitarian God is There's.
Speaker 6: A lot of different critiques. I mean, if you want
to first of all, if they claim to be consistent
with the Bible, they're already shooting themselves in the foot
because the Bible doesn't teach their generic unitarianism, it teaches trinitarianism.
So that's why they have to immediately say once we
start going to all these passages of whether the Theophanies
and the Trinity throughout the Old Testament. By the way,
that's why they immediately say corrupt, but book is corrupt.
Book is corrupt, and then we point then we point
out that their own book does not say the book
is corrupt, and then they then they lose their mind.
So that's that's how every discussion goes.
Speaker 27: Do you have a video where you like critique mostly
just this unitarian guy.
Speaker 3: By the way, to add to what Jay said. You'll
be shocked for me to say this. This is why
if we do set up a discussion what's had it
and Danny and the other two, You'll be shocked at
me saying this. The Krawn does not teach pure unitarianism,
pure forms to heat. The crime actually posits more than
one deity. This is why I've always challenged Muslims debate
me on whether the Koran teaches pure monotheism. So that's
another problem with the Muslim claim. They'll tell you it
teaches in the term they came up with this towheat
right to unify absolutely won and yet the chron doesn't
teach it. And this is why I've challenged Muslims, says,
this is your bread and butter. Challenge me, does your Quran? Now,
not everyone follows the Sunni Adith like Kali and Danny.
He's not a Sunni. He doesn't really care what Buhati
Muslim says, So with him, I would stick with the Koran,
and even from there I would demonstrate the Koran does
not teach an absolute pure form of unitarianism.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 3: But with the Sunnys it's even worse because they go
with the churn in the sunnight, and yet they don't
take me up on it. Why is that because I'm
such a meani? That's why, Jay, because I'm not nice?
Speaker 6: Good right. And we should also point out too, as
I made the point in my open aning statement to
Daniel Hokikichu in that debate, the Jews for the most
part were not unified in their unitarianism. So Jews were
not unitarian. They taught multiple different views. They had a
quote fluid view of the fact that God believed that,
they believe that God had multiple powers, multiple hypostasies, and
modern Rabbis also are admitting this in many cases. So
this idea that there's this pure unitarianism that existed in
the Torah and in the Injeel, that's all made up.
That's all blogny.
Speaker 27: Do you have a stream or a video on YouTube?
Were you critique thisly in depth?
Speaker 6: I mean, yeah, tons of them. I don't know specifically,
I mean, but I mean we've been just go watch
my you know, Trinity the Old Testament. Sam's done, Trinity
in the Old Testament talks. All of that will get
into that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And also if you want to see a critique
of what the Crown teaches about unity. If you go
to my YouTube channel, put in craw on trinity. I
actually argue for a form of chronic trinitarianism, which is
a counterfeit, but nonetheless it's there, so you can do them.
Look at That's why I'm asking Wilims here, refute me,
Prove I'm lying, Prove that I'm misinterpreting the Crown. Come,
it's here, book, bread and butter, to heat. Let's see
if someone will take us up on the challenge.
Speaker 6: Go ahead, Hamza, what's up, Hamsa? I'm trying to add you.
Do you want to talk or not? You're the one
critiquing Sam's car analogy, so we're at.
Speaker 2: It.
Speaker 6: Won't let me add him?
Speaker 3: So that's good. Now. I wonder if any because I
have I want them to address their so called to heat.
Let's see if anyone will do it. Let's see anyone.
Speaker 2: Else he left.
Speaker 6: He won't do it. Wonderful, wonder why you left?
Speaker 3: I wonder, Beauty Jay, I'm not as sharp dressed as
you and nice as you.
Speaker 6: Jail, what's up?
Speaker 2: Hey?
Speaker 3: I was real I was trying to ask about right now.
Speaker 26: I'm more like in between of agnostic and trying to
find my way into Christianity. But I came across your
channelent scene like your orthodox Christian came across Sam as
well independently.
Speaker 2: Muh.
Speaker 26: I was being to ask like based off of because
I had to discussed with my uncle because he's an
ordained pastor at a Baptist church about solo and scriptur.
Speaker 3: Doct and.
Speaker 26: How do you how could I like conveyed, It's like
not really because I kind of came across that it
wasn't really making sense.
Speaker 3: But I don't know how to explain how those doctrines
don't make sense. He said, there's no Protestant thinking about
this doctrine.
Speaker 6: Well, go watch my debate with uh Dale the Protestants,
Me and doctor Bo Branson against Dale and his Protestant buddy.
That whole debate will answer a lot of those questions
if you're looking for a sol scripture of debate. Let's see,
do we have any Muslims that want to come on
the debate?
Speaker 3: By the way, since this is Jay's channel and he
wants engage a variet of issues, I want to engage
the Muslims. So Muslims come up and challenge us.
Speaker 6: Yeah, we're going to get first place to Muslims exactly.
Speaker 2: Yes.
Speaker 3: Yeah. And then when he wants to continue to discuss
with Catholics Protestants, God bless him, you know. But with me,
I want to stick the Muslims. The reason why is
because I don't want to add any bad blood between
Orthodox and Catholic. I love them both. So I'm Jay's
favorite heretic.
Speaker 6: I haven't called you heretic.
Speaker 3: I called myself that. Sorry, someone else calls me that.
Speaker 6: Jayl Vanni. Do you want to talk? We're asking for
Muslims who want to come to go ahead.
Speaker 8: Hey, First of all, let me just say that I
am very impressed. I was brought up as a Pentacles.
I grew up and then it started Bronx New York,
and I just wanted to ask one simple question.
Speaker 3: I watched one of your videos earlier.
Speaker 2: Today when you said that Jesus.
Speaker 6: Can me or Sam Sam.
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, you said that Jesus can via the seed
of David.
Speaker 14: Okay, but hold on, and then I are telling me
hold on, yeah please.
Speaker 3: So I know that Jesus came to the Virgin Mary
via the Holy Spirit. So do you want to answer
you now? So in Romans, one three, when Paul tells
you Jesus of the seed of David according to the
flesh Romans one three, two Timothy two eight, where Paul
says that Jesus is of the seed of David according
to my Gospel two Timothy two eight, Romans one to three,
or in Revelation twenty two sixteen, where Jesus says, I
am the root and offspring of David. Do you want
me to go on and show you that the Bible
says he's of the seed of David. Let me repeat
the verses again for you Romans one to three. Christ
the seed of David according to the flesh tewod Timothy two,
verse eight, that Jesus the seed of David according to
My Gospel Revelation twenty two sixteen, Jesus speaking, I am
the root and offspring of David. And then in Acts two,
I hope you're listening to the verses twenty four to
thirty two. We are told there, specifically in Acts two thirty,
that God had shown David that from his loins, from
his physical lineage, he would raise up the Christ. So
the Bible says he's of the seed of David. So
where's the problem.
Speaker 6: Probably that the.
Speaker 3: Good to know?
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, the Bible says that he can.
Speaker 3: He admits, Yeah, even says that you're that Jay. He's
got a problem with the Bible.
Speaker 6: He goes, Yeah, I mean the Dividic Covenant right requires
that the Messiah by of the seat of David two
Samuel seven. So what are you talking about?
Speaker 2: Yeah, so he didn't come through the via the Holy Spirit?
Who said he didn't? He did? Yeah?
Speaker 3: Who said he didn't? Think a little deeply? You think
that Jesus can only be the seat of David from
a man, not from his mother.
Speaker 6: His human nature is from Mary. So that's how.
Speaker 3: All right?
Speaker 6: That in my case?
Speaker 3: Thank you.
Speaker 6: Rest your case by admitting our point. Okay, good job. R.
Speaker 2: D J.
Speaker 6: Wants to come back. What's up, man? You gotta argument
this time?
Speaker 3: I don't know he is? I don't remember?
Speaker 24: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Could I can I one on one?
Speaker 2: Sam? Real quick? Sure?
Speaker 3: If you don't want to beat me up?
Speaker 2: What is it?
Speaker 3: I don't know who is it? Was he here earlier?
Speaker 6: Yeah?
Speaker 13: Yeah? So Sam, is it true that Yahweh ordered an
army to murder babies?
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, it's so true that Allah and chapter two,
verse two forty six fifty and chapter five of your
front twenty twenty six a law order that Musa and
he said slaughter babies. It's also true. Show me, show me,
show me. Read the verse. Read the verse. Read stop parking,
take it easy, five twenty to twenty six. There your
law set that told Musa to tell the Israelites to
enter into the Promised Land Canaan. But they were afraid
because of the giants. That means your Allah confirms he
said Joshua into the land, the slaughter cattle and babies.
Where does it where does it say that in the
verse to murder babies? Okay? So where does it say
in the Kuran five six, that's that war that was
carried out against the Amlakites. What's from Allah? Does it
say it there?
Speaker 13: So you're you're you're changing the topic from the world discussion.
Speaker 6: No, he brought up. They brought up the very thing
from your book. Dude, I got it on the screen.
Speaker 3: He's okay, read read the verse and let me know
you want to murder some.
Speaker 13: Babies in that verse because he is the murder of
babies in that verse, you guys.
Speaker 3: Or know the context is showed me, show me show
me the word babies.
Speaker 6: Okay, so this here we go with the word expectation,
which is not even you don't even hold to that.
Speaker 3: Okay, well still, look, let me ask you another thing,
exactly exactly way your Michael, y'all, what instantly said to
murder being Allah flooded the people of Noah? Did he
drown babies? That's God doing that, not in or drown babies.
Speaker 6: Oh that's God doing it, not an army doing it. Okay, yeah,
good art, Get on another question, Yeah exactly, that's not
That's how I see you, guys.
Speaker 3: Let me ask you another questions when answer he murder babies?
Yes or no? Are there are there baby? When Allah
pelted Sodom and go mora with in the word kill
babies in the verse that you quoted, Are there babies?
Speaker 2: Yes or no?
Speaker 3: I want to see if you're honest, Sam, chapter Live
Christianity will teach you to lie.
Speaker 6: You understand that the verse is about the death of babies.
You don't understand that so an army is ordered to
murder babies in that your own, your own God drowned
babies in the flood.
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, that's God doing it. That's okay.
Speaker 6: Exactly. So what's the difference.
Speaker 13: Yeah, there's a there's a difference, and it's what forcing
another human to murder babies?
Speaker 3: That's that's ford to decide, not humans. Notice he said
the God decided, So Allah.
Speaker 13: Decided that Mussa, he did not decide to murder babies.
Speaker 3: That's yahweh Allah, you're Satan.
Speaker 13: Yeah, Where where's the word babies in the burden?
Speaker 6: This is Muslim?
Speaker 2: There sam.
Speaker 3: The god that ordering an army to murder is where
is the word law chafon mama? Chathon ordered Musa to
enter the promised then to kill them. It doesn't say
don't kill babies. Where does the verse say that, don't
shift the burden?
Speaker 6: Well, he's coming. They always do this. They come up
with these arbitrary standards, and they say, well, but the
verse doesn't say this word. Where's trinity in the Bible?
Where's in the Bible?
Speaker 3: See that's the thing. This is why they want to
talk to you about me, because I know these arguments
and turn against them. But you guys heard him admit
that his Allah was the one who drawn babies at
the time of No, that's okay. If my Olah murders
baby as long as humans.
Speaker 2: Don't do it.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's that silly. Well, this is the same point
when I asked Azra Rashid, he said that women's private
parts are nasty and God could never be near them.
And I said, well, who created them?
Speaker 17: You know what you do it?
Speaker 3: Next time, Jay, you know what you do? What when
they say that about the private part? Says this is
chapter sixty six, verse twelve. Now the Muslims are ashamed
of this translation, but I'm going to give you a
translation from a Muslim. Well, I don't know I can share.
I'll send it to you on Skype. It says about
Mary Mediam vint Imaran. Now, guys, this is not the
real Mary, so don't be offended. This is not the
real Mary. It says she guarded senate for Jaha. Ask
any Arabic reading Christian, the word fuage means private part.
She guarded her private part and we blew into her
private parts. So Allah loves to blow into women's private parts.
Speaker 6: Yeah, but and I mean this is there's multiple examples.
I've got it pulled up on the screen. It's making
your point there. I agree. But what I'm saying is
that I mean, if if God creates these things, like,
obviously they can't be inherently unclean. That's kind of silly exactly.
Speaker 3: But that's my point.
Speaker 2: Jay.
Speaker 3: If they have a problem with God becoming human and
coming out of the holy concent crated woman, a blessed virgin,
then that means they must have a problem with their
God blowing into a woman's private.
Speaker 6: Thing exactly, the JJ blower. And it's on the screen,
by the way. Yep, So here we have another chrome.
What's up there?
Speaker 2: We go?
Speaker 6: I'm mute, Chrome, you have to unmute to speak. I
wasn't expecting ego sistem.
Speaker 9: I was listening to your Fabian and Milner conspiracy video
the second part.
Speaker 2: Yes, really very interesting question, not religious?
Speaker 3: How old?
Speaker 2: Like when was the book that you're referencing with all
its truths? What was before that was? Like? When was
that made?
Speaker 6: What are you talking about?
Speaker 2: Like, so you guys are referencing sorry this.
Speaker 6: Parble do so I'm not trying to be like that
is this on the topic. We're not talking about conspiracy
stuff today.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I know, I'm just saying that. That's the kind
of first full video of yours I watched.
Speaker 6: Okay, yeah, yeah, I talked about Islam being a tool
in the UK and the U. What about it?
Speaker 3: Sure, Yeah, I'm not that's not I wasn't making to
jump into it in that way.
Speaker 2: I'm just saying I don't follow any these books. I
haven't read any of them. I don't really know anything.
Speaker 6: Okay, So what's the question.
Speaker 2: When the book? Is there a book that you follow
that you think has like the master information?
Speaker 6: I mean, I don't know there's any one book that
has master information. I mean I listed many books. The
book that you're talking about is this book Milner Fabian
Conspiracy by Ratio, and that he's basing a lot of
his information on the book Tragian Hope, which is a
gigantic geopolitical text that I've lectured through. So you may
be asking about Tragian Hope. MKG, what's up?
Speaker 3: Muslims come up, guys?
Speaker 6: Come on, yeah, I mean, there's one hundred and thirteen
fourteen people here. We got another nine hundred online. So
where's all the Muslims at.
Speaker 3: I happened too, I bought a nine hundred on mind.
Speaker 6: Okay, And Muslims come on in here. You got here's
the link to the stream to the spaces.
Speaker 3: You're not going to get this offen. This brother is
busy and I'm busy for me to be here. Come on,
Muslims moving my place? Come on? Ye go ahead, Yeah,
not a Muslim.
Speaker 16: But regarding the huge job issue, I think that what's
happening here, it's pretty funny. They know that they don't
want to do anything that's non They want to basically
throw the Salafies at you and just put you away
like they don't want to deal with you guys, because
it's just it's so frustrating to see what's happening. I
think Sam the snow offense to you, but I don't
think he.
Speaker 3: Y'all will do it if you're there.
Speaker 6: I think Jaya, he's already, he's already declined.
Speaker 3: What do you mean? Yeah, no, I think Myron can
get him to come. But it's you, young man. This
is recorded. Actually we haven't recorded. Uh Mohammed jab said
he'll only debate me if I agreed to fight him
in a mixed martial arts No, I'm not lying. We've
got to record it. He goes, he'll only debate me
if I agree to fight him in a professional well
not professional, he's amateur. But in a mixed martial arts service.
So I said, Okay, tell you what, here, three debates.
We'll do the three debates, and I promise you after
the debates, I'll train to knock your teeth out in
a MMA contest. Because he thinks this, hears me, he goes, no,
We're going to do the fight first, then the debates.
I'm not lying, Jay, we have recorded.
Speaker 6: I believe.
Speaker 16: Yeah, there's a lot of lines going on here. The
reason I brought that up, I know you rejected it.
But this thing is evolving because people are pushing back.
They don't want Jake on Myron's being very attentive to
this because he's very attentive on Twitter or ex whatever.
So this thing is evolving. Nothing's fixed. Anything could change,
that's my belief anyway, So the two v two could
turn into a one v one. It could be Daniel,
it could switch, that's my opinion.
Speaker 6: Well, I'm not going to have the same debate one
on one with Daniel that I've already had one.
Speaker 3: I'll do that. I want him, okay, But one thing,
why would Muslims not want Jay Dyer, who has become
known as an orthodoxygitarian philosopher, extraordinary and me known for
my knowledge of Ala. I'm not trying to boast and
take us and then squash us in order to vindicate us.
Speaker 2: Not because you.
Speaker 16: Guys are on the offensive. Every other Christian debate, there's
always the defensive. It's always defending the Trinity, defending you know, Christianity,
defending what's in the Old Testament. It's never offensive, it's
never is there any continuity with the.
Speaker 3: Right you saw when they attacked the Old Testament. I
just go to the crowd to show that, according to Krawn,
all ordered these wars in the Old Testament.
Speaker 16: Yeah, so they're not used to this, and I think
it's just a demeanor thing. They want the more traditional
and that's why when.
Speaker 3: You watch like Jay and Shabi Ali.
Speaker 16: Shaver Ali is in this very you know two five
kind of demeanor of like oh, cordial back and forth
and Jays just hitting him with everything. Is like Jay Jay,
if you if you, if you don't mind that, please
just wait, I'm going you know, like he's just stammering,
he can't handle it. I think that's part of it.
And what makes me really mad is that Mohammed head job.
That's his style. That's what he did to David Wood.
He was filibustering and dish galloping on that stage. I
don't know how many years ago.
Speaker 3: See, this is why might like he could give it,
but he can't take it. This is very short. This
is why my brother, I know their mindset and I'm
willing to stoop in the mud and stuff them in
their mud because I'm willing to go there and treat
them accordingly.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 3: So this is probably why he doesn't want to be
because he knows he won't get away with rhetoric with me,
Sam and Jay.
Speaker 16: I don't know how close here are with James, but
I'm based on the video that Daniel put out.
Speaker 3: It seemed pretty straightforward. So James lying like, yes, brother,
what straightforward? He said that he changed the dates like
if you did you watch, my brother, You're gonna make
me want to hang myself with my shoes. Did you watch?
When I published the email on my YouTube channel comnic
post because James reached out to me and I said,
here are the four topics. He came back and said
Daniel Hakikachu accepted. I go great, I'm ready. Then he
comes back and tells me here's what Danny wants to debate.
So he confused me. I said, wait, I thought you
said he accepted these four debates. No, he wants to
debate these three with those three. And I said, now, James,
and the emails are there, dude, I got the receipts.
I said, I want to understand, because here's where I
don't understand.
Speaker 2: And I said it to Jay.
Speaker 3: So I'm going to waste my time and breath again
on this coward because now he can call out my bluff.
I said, Daniel, let's do the debates. Now, who's running?
I said, debate me? Muhammads do the Bible? Why do
I do that? See what I did to that Muslim.
If I show them that Muhammad confirmed the Bible, they
can't attack the Bible anymore because they're going to bury
their profit. But if they agree with Muhammad the Bible
is not corrupted, then that still buries Mohammad because he
contradicts the Bible down what they do.
Speaker 16: I just want to make one last point and that
I'll get out of your ears.
Speaker 2: Well yeah, I know, But.
Speaker 16: One thing I really want to emphasize here is that
I feel there's a momentum. There's a big snowball happening here,
that's continuously rolling.
Speaker 3: I don't want us to lose this, That's what I'm saying.
Whether whether who pulls out pulls in.
Speaker 6: Doesn't matter, we've already said.
Speaker 3: But I think that's very clear that I think and
me as we speak, we appreciate you.
Speaker 6: We've already agreed to whoever we don't.
Speaker 16: So basically, I'm saying that for the last I've seen
this the last five seven months, people are super chatting,
fresh and fit people are super super chatting sneaker.
Speaker 3: Why aren't you having jay On? Why actually having sam On?
Why actually having jay On?
Speaker 16: When they're ignoring, they're acting like they're they're not reading
these things.
Speaker 3: It's very strange.
Speaker 16: So I'm just saying that the people are wanting this,
and I just even if can I give you because you.
Speaker 3: Seem like really hurt and can I come and hug you?
Speaker 16: I mean, I want to see this, I really want
to see this, and I don't want don't want this.
Speaker 3: Can I get in a word before you? I mean,
you coming off to so you deserve it because you
keep wanting can I know on your side? But okay, okayorry, okay,
why don't you hit the door and make sure it's
it's you on the way out.
Speaker 6: All right, we have I think we have a Muslim here. Uh,
let's see.
Speaker 3: If you know that guy's address. I want to go
give him a little hug and maybe buddy bike.
Speaker 6: Sounded like you want to, Zach, Zach Riah, what's up?
Speaker 2: Man?
Speaker 6: We had a Muslim? He dropped off Muslims if you
like to come on, and.
Speaker 3: Uh, Jay's got other topics he wants to get to,
so come almost ms put me in by place so
I can leave him to his sessions.
Speaker 6: Zach Ryan, what's up?
Speaker 28: Yes, sir, I just want to briefly say Sam schmou
and I just heard about you today and hear that
and uh yeah no, I I mean we need more
of you kicking Muslims asses because they really can't seem
to handle how articulate you are. And and just there
is not enough content and out there where articulate Christians
are refuting Islam. So I'm going to get out of here,
but I just want to say you remember, I want
to see more of Jay and you freaking Mike. I
don't care who you're debating anytime.
Speaker 3: J knows I'm here I got his back, not that
he needs me at any time, but I remember this.
I remember that seeing in the radio ice here, We're
going to kick your ass all the way back to
Bagdad like that.
Speaker 6: What's up, Doc Holliday, what's up man? I'm youute, my joy?
Speaker 15: Hi Sam?
Speaker 2: I just got like two short questions if I can.
The best question is in relation to Hell.
Speaker 21: You know he's letting me friends all colleagues that come
on spices, I multodox Christian. But in relation to the
Holy Trinity, saying would they like follow the case principle?
A good enough example when I questioned the Holy Trinity.
If a person steps out said and says, the sun
shining the little Jesus cross is the sun. The sun
provide us energy, warmth, and light. But the sun is
still one right, good initial example.
Speaker 3: And the second let me comment on that. You gave
an example that was used even in early Christian fathers
with Jay would know more than me. But that example
actually is derived from Hebrews one three. What do I
mean if you look at the word Hebrew and Hebrews
one three, there's a word apple gosma. Excuse me for
butchering the Greek apple Gosma says, he is the radiance
of God's glory, radiance the outshining of God's glory. So
that imagery, that imagery itself evokes the image of the sun,
let's say, and then the rays of the sun. So
there the Lord is depicted as the rays, the radiance
of the sun. So that would be an apt analogy.
But you're gonna have to keep stressing an analogy is
not identical to God because those.
Speaker 6: You get the point, Yeah, and I got heures one
pulled up here for those that are curious, we want
to see those texts there. And then we got a
Muslim here, Muslim. He's just conveniently named Muslim. Makes it easier.
Speaker 3: Watcher's gonna attack. I'm mute, all ready for the attack.
Speaker 6: Let's go, you got I'm mute Muslim?
Speaker 3: Hello?
Speaker 2: Yeah, hello, hello, hello, yes, yes, hello, yes, that's before
we sold.
Speaker 22: Like, I just want to say, I have a lot
I have a lot of cool pick friends.
Speaker 3: Okay, go ahead, Okay, let's see I would just like.
Speaker 2: We have now both the name of.
Speaker 6: Okay, how do you stead are going to prove the
torres corrupted? Here we go?
Speaker 3: Oh you can't you please hold on listen to me.
Please don't make the mistake. Are you listening you want
to talk about? Please don't make the mistake of misquoting
from a bus. Are you gonna make.
Speaker 2: This set up? Wait?
Speaker 3: You're gonna give me who.
Speaker 12: And Ben?
Speaker 3: Are you gonna give me somewhere?
Speaker 2: No love?
Speaker 3: Can you hear me?
Speaker 6: Can you hear me?
Speaker 3: Now? Elbodi? What centuries of the body? No?
Speaker 2: Man?
Speaker 3: I said, who oh Albani? You mean the twentieth century? Set?
Speaker 2: What?
Speaker 3: I well, I'm going the way Ja. If you don't
know he's appealing Albanie. Can let me explain to Jay
who you're quoting. Dude, Okay, it's.
Speaker 6: Hard to hear what's being said.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, he's referring to chef Albani. He was an
Albanian chef of the twentieth century.
Speaker 2: So that's the head.
Speaker 3: He is going to quote you from some guy from
the twentieth century. Remember that before I know?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's funny. Get to that da before the time
for night prayer and then you're going to have to
go to sleep and then flush out saying that if
you're not in the morning.
Speaker 22: But yeah, I'm going to Okay, what's that good? I'm
I'm going to yes, yes.
Speaker 5: And I'm the American Norman and Abbie Berta and Abbi call.
Speaker 3: One.
Speaker 5: Have this is a hood?
Speaker 3: Okay translate, okay, one. We had a talk in private
translated guy, because I give you from your pa.
Speaker 25: If you are going to I want to already.
Speaker 3: Can you translate, buddy before the rapture?
Speaker 6: Come on, we don't need you to read the whole
Arabic thing. Just make the argument translated.
Speaker 22: Guy, be patient.
Speaker 3: Yeah. It also great when he was with go ahead translated.
Speaker 6: If you're going to come on, dude, stop?
Speaker 3: Does this guy translate this year? Is he waiting for?
Can you translate? To the point that the pones of
Israel rut a book and left the Yeah, you just
embarrassed yourself, did you?
Speaker 15: Guys?
Speaker 2: Hear it?
Speaker 3: Let me let me? Can I address your headeth that
now it's gonna to bury you. I'm going to do
your jeniza. Guys that you hear what he said? The
sons of Israel wrote a book. Can I address you?
Or you want to keep reciting Kuran by Barkil? The
Sons of Israel left the book, wrote a book, left
the Torah. Now number one, that's the sons of Israel.
But I know you're not too bright. The Toro is
also in the hands of the Christians and they didn't
change it. So even if I agree with you, even
if I agree with your perversion of that hadif even
if I agree, all you're proving is that some Jews
corrupt the Torah. But the Toro is also with the Christians,
and your prophet didn't say the Christians corrupted the Torah,
so this tour is still preserved. Secondly, he didn't say
they changed the Torah. He said they left the Torah
for another book. How can they leave the Torah if
they don't know what the Torah is? Genius?
Speaker 6: Yeah, I've heard you make that argument too, on another
h on another argument that you have with somebody else.
Do you want to make your second point?
Speaker 3: Yeah, the genius tell me, how can they abandoned the
tour if they didn't have it? I'm you, Okay, I
don't know why I left.
Speaker 6: How did they leave the tour if they didn't have it?
Speaker 3: Okay?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Can I get any reading?
Speaker 3: Can you answer the read the rest of the you know,
I know was insomnia, But can you I'll when when
you go and get me when you when you read.
Speaker 2: And you.
Speaker 6: Out of your nose, are you going to answer how
they left at it? They didn't have it or not?
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, as a certain they didn't have it. Oh
they lost it? Yeah it, Oh they did, that's why.
And soon I'm not going to use a Albani against you.
You mentioned Albani right soon in a number forty four
thirty four, and I'll get you the link, j.
Speaker 12: Son.
Speaker 3: Can I wish the point you want to again? Let
me finish the point. And soon a classified as hassan
by Albani. Your prophets said to the Jews, bring me
the torah. They brought the torah. He put it on
the cushion. There torah, and he said, I believe in
you and him who sent you. How did they if
they brought the torah to your profit? This only is dying. No,
it's I'm gonna no, no, no, I'm gonna get the idea.
Don't let him run stop presiding, Koran. We heard you.
Take it easy. Let me get you there, Jake, you're
gonna change your position. It's happens. It's yeah. I hold
on a bit t.
Speaker 6: Send you the link you can sent on Skype. I
got skype up.
Speaker 12: Okay, oh, I don't.
Speaker 3: Want to hear you recite.
Speaker 2: Let's let us bring.
Speaker 3: Let's bring the because you said they lost it. I
think the only thing you was lost is the brainsails
from kissing the black stone. Because here it says they
had it.
Speaker 6: I got it pulled up. I have it pulled up.
Speaker 3: Can you read jay? Can you read it?
Speaker 6: From a group of Jews came and invited the Messenger
of a So he visited them in their school. They
said him, one of our men has committed for nication
with a woman, so pronounced judgment upon them. They placed
a cushion for the Messenger of Allah, who sat on
it and said, bring the Torah. It was then brought.
He then withdrew the cushion beneath him and placed the
Torah on it, saying, I believe THEE and in him
who revealed the Then he said, bring me one who
has learned among you. The young man was brought. The
transmitter then miss mentioned the rest of this tradition of stoning,
similar to the one transmitted about my league from Nafi.
Speaker 3: What's the great there?
Speaker 15: What is it?
Speaker 3: What is the great hawsan? That means good? Now did
you hear him, Jay, because then you can engage in logically.
He said, they lost the Tora, right, that's what he said.
What what torah then did they bring? If it was lost?
Now you can engage them logically. Go ahead, I'll just okay.
And is the only one who know you're lying? Yes,
that's a lie. Ja, let me l Josie, you're a liar?
Can I make my point? L Josie said that there
was a group of Ulama that cited this headdeth as
proof that the Torah has not been changed? Why are
you lying? Let me get you that article?
Speaker 6: Yeah, I was about to Yeah this your answering isla article?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Did you get fam?
Speaker 2: You have it?
Speaker 6: Is it the one about the Bible's not being corrupted?
Speaker 2: That one?
Speaker 3: This one is one specific. I'll get you. Okay, this guy,
can I make them people see why you are Let
me explain to that. The guy just lied, he said,
El Albani is the only one who said Hassan. But Jane,
did you hear earlier? Who did he quote Ellbani?
Speaker 9: Right?
Speaker 3: But now all of a sudden, Al Albani is not
good enough when it says it's Hassan. But now notice
his lie. He said, it's only al Albani. You're lying
because it paying Josiah said. Other Muslim scholars accepted this,
headef as good and use it as proof that Torah
has not been corrupted. So let me get the article
because we don't want to hear you. Let me get
the article. Wait so people can see you're a liar.
Just one second, one second, buddy. See this is why
they don't want me to be with you, because they'll
see what happens. Now here, Jay, the article right here,
it's been paying El jos And for the people who
don't know, because I don't think this guy's going to
tell you. It's been paying El Josiah was the student
of Ibn tay Me, Ibbin tay Me. Uh why because
the cellafie those anthropomorphists believe that Ibn Tamy is one
of their greatest scholars and it's two premier students. It
been paying El Josia and it been k now Jay,
as you open it, remember he just said, only al
Albani accepted this. IDE's right.
Speaker 6: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Now I can't see your screen, but you're goodness, okay,
where do I see your screen? Here?
Speaker 6: On YouTube?
Speaker 3: Oh? You're on YouTube. Okay, I'm sorry, man, I didn't know.
Let me go to YouTube channel. But on the screen,
do you see that part says Abu da would Yeah.
Speaker 6: Let me make you see it. Let me make it
to where everybody can see it here.
Speaker 3: And you'll see Abudhou. Now for the context here, I
been famous saying there's a group of scholars that said
that the Tora has never been corrupted.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you know.
Speaker 3: He mentions, let me tell the people, because the Muslim
is going to know who these are. He mentions Imam
el Bukhari El Bukhari, the collector of the Hadiza Bukhari.
He's one of those that Iban Pam says, believe that
none of the books of a law can be corrupted.
The tour on the Gospel have never been corrupted. Right,
And then he quotes abudo this headith. What does it
say if you can read it?
Speaker 6: A group of Jewish people invited the Messenger of Allah
to the house. When they came, they asked him, oh,
Abu Kasim, one of our men committed anulture with a woman.
What is your judgment against him? So they placed a
pillow and asked the Messenger of Allah to set on it.
The messenger of all oppursuit to say, bring me the torah.
When they brought it, he removed the pillow from underneath
him and placed the tour on it and said, I
believe in you and the one who revealed you. And
then he said, bring me one of you who have
the most knowledge. They brought him a young man who
to the story of the stony.
Speaker 3: And then I'll notice what it says right after that?
What did they say?
Speaker 6: The scholar said, if the tora was corrupted, he would
not have placed it on the pillow, and he would
not have said I believed in you and the one
who revealed you.
Speaker 3: Did you catch that?
Speaker 2: Jay?
Speaker 6: Yep?
Speaker 3: Scholars plural who accepted this narration as authenticness prove that
the tour is not corrupt. Why is he lying?
Speaker 6: Well, it seems to change based on what they need
at the time. The argument seemed to change based on
what they need to do at the time.
Speaker 3: So you lied now now unless he has a better argument,
your arguments are pathetic and weak, like yourn.
Speaker 2: So is he there?
Speaker 6: Do you want to come back and speak?
Speaker 3: Yeah, So don't play anymore. He left because you're going
to embarrass all on his messenger. See the whole your
entire religion is weak, Dave, not just your ideas. Any
other Muslim want to come and put me in my
place now if you haven't no one else let me.
Don't want you want me to wrap it up for you, brother, because.
Speaker 15: I don't know.
Speaker 6: Well, we got a couple more people. See if there's
uscis go ahead.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm sorry, I'm Muslim, but I did just have
a couple of questions for I Sam related to a topic.
Yess the topic.
Speaker 6: Is Islam with Sam right now, so you can ask
me those questions about that stuff later. Witness, did you
want to talk to Go ahead?
Speaker 3: Just want to make sure it. Jay's here to discuss
and debate with Catholics the difference Bee, they worth took Catholic.
I'm here to help him with Islam, so keep.
Speaker 2: It on his slam.
Speaker 6: Go ahead. I'm mute, Witness. Do you want to U mute? Witness?
Last chance? I'm mute. We're moving on.
Speaker 29: Yeah, No, I was just wanting to understand what gentleman
was saying as far as Islam goes, like, what his
position was.
Speaker 3: The Muslim the guy that came up right now a
couple minutes ago. Yeah, okay. He was trying to say,
there are hadiths, hadith are narrations attributed Mohammed. That's Momma
said that Torah has corrupted. It's not uncorrupt, and he
quoted a haditha actually backfired because the haditha that he
cited he said that the children of Israel wrote a
book and abandoned the Torah. Notice he didn't say they
corupted a Torah. They replaced the Torah and followed a
book that they wrote. In his mind, that means the
Torah has been corrupted. That was his argument right from
from minunderstanding. I have no religious.
Speaker 29: I practiced and study all religious I practiced is I
believe Prophet Mohammad pieces on him, said that.
Speaker 3: It's the grammar that was.
Speaker 2: Torah is.
Speaker 3: Not listening. You said, you don't you practice origins. Then
he said, Prophet Muhammad saladdressing me upon him, why are
you praying for him?
Speaker 2: Are you there?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Because you said can you talk to soul religions?
But you said, Prophet Mohammed Salary, you can keep interrupting
me because I don't because you just like you just
pray for Mohammed. So you're a Muslim, right, I pray
for everybody. So Mohammad fulfilled God. Are you Christian or
are you Jewish? What are you?
Speaker 29: Because Mohammad, prophet Muhammad, was the only human beings that
actually fulfill the Covenant that's in the Torah.
Speaker 6: Okay, well, that's ignorance of the Torah to it has
been corrupt. Where's the proof of that. Where's the proof
of that? Where's your proof of that? Where's your proof
of that? Where's your proof of it? Saying it's true
is not argument? Where's your proof of that?
Speaker 3: Okay? So you follow Prophet Mohammad, Salad dressing be upon him.
You follow Mohammads you know I'm not going to follow him.
Speaker 6: You said, he said, yes.
Speaker 3: Said Abraham.
Speaker 29: Abraham's religion is come from to the DoD dodgeball.
Speaker 3: Player, stop dodging. Do you follow Mohammed?
Speaker 22: Yes or no?
Speaker 3: Problem? Then your prophets said the Bible is uncrupt. You
said it's been changed. So that means you said, Momma
is a liar and he's in the pitovel. So make
up your mind.
Speaker 2: No, I'm not saying that.
Speaker 3: I'm saying that to Torah and all the Christian Bibles.
They've had definitely, especially going back to the Torah.
Speaker 2: Are.
Speaker 3: Does the does the Koran say that it's all corrupted?
Speaker 6: Where's your argument for that prefix? So you're just shouting,
no argument, no idea.
Speaker 3: What they're uttering is actually.
Speaker 2: Quantum physics.
Speaker 6: Quantum physics.
Speaker 3: If you're going to be the person, this is a
world prophet.
Speaker 6: This, This guy's insane. He's talking about quantum physics. We're
moving on. Did you want to say something again? Muslim
in your back? What's up?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 6: Your hot deth the hard death guy's back, what's up?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm you Yeah. Address even Thames saying you're a.
Speaker 6: Liar because you don't let him reply. That's why you
just yap and you try to just read the hadith
NonStop in the Koran. We want to we want your
replies to the arguments.
Speaker 3: Yep, the argument. Even Thilliams said that a group of
scholars accepted sound and use it as proof that the
tour has not changed. So give me another argument that
the tour has changed. I did have a yeah, let me.
Speaker 6: Okay, No, we gonna understand what you're saying. Man, Prince,
what's up? I'm you.
Speaker 2: Hi?
Speaker 3: This is Princess Hannah, daughter of the Chosen People.
Speaker 6: Okay, you have you have an argument or listen. The
topics are Islam. You're not Muslim, right, I'm not Muslim?
But okay, well the argument is about Islam, not Jewish
suss Keith, what's up, Keith?
Speaker 3: I don't know. That sounds like the must.
Speaker 6: All right, all right, he can't connect. We'll try somebody else. Seth,
what's up? We're not looking for uh uh Lutherans, so
I'm not trying to be rude to you, Seth, but
it's not Lutheran hour. Uh email, what's up? Email? Go ahead? Email?
Speaker 3: All right, come bye, guys, Come on, Muslims.
Speaker 6: They can't. They're having a hard time connectings. So I'm
gonna I'm moving on. Let's see. I don't know. Sometimes
if they're on cell phone, it's just hard for them
to connect to Twitter space. What's up?
Speaker 3: Man?
Speaker 6: Go ahead, I'm mute. Gott I'm mute, man, Seth, I'm mute.
Speaker 3: That isn't that doesn't even sound like I'm a But anyway,
most of them are come on, are you?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Is it Twitter aracking up because of the Trump or something?
Speaker 6: It could be Yeah, it could be that. Johnny do
you want to try again? What's up?
Speaker 3: Oah?
Speaker 2: Hello?
Speaker 30: Oh, I wanted to ask as well about I was
watching a video on sam where he was talking about
the muta muta.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I wanted to ask if.
Speaker 26: They're like evidence of that, like yes, it didn't lead
to like more conquests against Christians nations.
Speaker 3: Mutah, this is the problem. You're going to have. The
largest branch of Islam are Sunni Muslims, and in Sunni
Islamic tradition, that's let me explain what zoji mutah is
for people don't know. It's pleasure marriages. Let me explain
for everyone, because you have an idea, but many people
don't know what it is. In the Sunni tradition and
the shi On tradition, they both agree. They both agree
on this. The Muhammad allowed his jihadis because they're at war,
and I got to keep it because I got to
be careful what I say on YouTube. Man, Lord haveing channel.
So yeah, they couldn't control their passions. They wanted to
be intimate, but their wives weren't there. So Muhammad said,
go find you a woman. Go find you a woman,
marry her for up to three days, and then you
can divorce her and pay her for her services. Sunni
Muslims admit Muhammad did this, they say, but then it
was abrogated, canceled out, so that Muhammad abrogated it, and
Sunni Wilslim say, you can't do that anymore. The Shia
say no, it was never abrogated because they don't follow
the Sunny tradition. They have their own traditions. So as
you and I speak today, there are Shia Muslim I
have a clip actually on my YouTube channel, three young
Shia men admitting that this form of marriage, which is
not marriage. You tell a woman, hey, I want to
marry you for three days. When I'm done, I'll pay
you for your services. We don't call that marriage dewey,
we call it something else. You can you can find
plenty of them in Las Vegas. Right coming to the issue.
Speaker 25: The Shia say no, it's still part of Islam, and.
Speaker 3: They go around. I actually know this for a fact.
They will try to find a woman I had. She
had tell me this on palatalk years ago, that he
had met some woman and he was in the UK,
that it read to this form of marriage. He goes,
I'm gonna go do mutah marriage so she al Muslims
do it. The sonny say, no, it's forbidden, but the
sonny have a different form of the same thing called monia.
But yeah, So to answer your question, Muhammad allowed it
at the beginning, but then the sonny say he canceled
it in his lifetime. Did she all say, you never canceled?
Speaker 26: So, because I also was very safe a lot of
the like morality of Islam, I feel like I started
to look into it once, like my friends started converting
to it because in my city, I'm from Baltimore, it's
a lot.
Speaker 3: Of people converting to Islam against Baltimore.
Speaker 26: And Philly, and they would telling me like, it's so
morally sound, and I'm starting to see it's really.
Speaker 2: Not at all.
Speaker 26: When I my friend he went to Gail and he
told me a lot of people was converting to Islam
just for protection because they were very like even vicious
in there.
Speaker 3: And I was even saying, like some of the morality
uh uh mesh as well with.
Speaker 26: Like criminality, like people who are already criminals, they don't
have to change.
Speaker 3: You can extort Christians and Jews to their knowledge.
Speaker 26: I do like and I wanted to see like with
like the Jiza tags and the Demi text.
Speaker 3: If Jay doesn't mind, I'll answer your question. I'll do
so much tomorrow, God willing, because people want me to
explain what's happening in the UK Chapter nine twenty nine
of the Crime. According to the Muslim sources, one of
the last chapters of not the last chapter that Muhammad composed,
is chapter nine called the Tobadah Chapter of Repentance champion
chapter of Annulman, where Mohammad told the Pagans, any covenants
we have, I will terminate, or with those who didn't
war against them, I will allow the covenants between us
to remain intact until the stipulated period. But afterwards, you idolators,
you'll either convert to Slam or be killed. Now that's
the pagan idolators. But then he targeted a second group.
The second group called people of the book. The Arabic
terms Ahl kitab people of the book means Jews and
Christians because the recognizes Jews and Christians were given scripture
from a law Supanawakaada. They think Allah is the god
of the Bible anyway, So with them, with them, they
have three options. Chapter nine, verse twenty nine says this.
This is exactly the context. Now Muhammad has masked a
large military force. He has enough manpower. He has enough
military might to now spread Aslam offensively. Offensive Yeah, meaning
goal and take over lands of people who will never
threaten Muslims.
Speaker 6: With sam which vers did you say, I've got the Koran?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Man, needlass And I'm going to break this down
as you saying it too. Yeah. I'll just quote it
from memory because I can't, Man, I need glasses. Brother. Eventually, anyway,
ninety twenty nine says, fight those who believe not in
a law nor the last day. Now, let's break it
down for you. Fight those who believe not in law
or nor the last day. Meaning if you don't believe
a law of Islam is God, nor do you believe
in the last day as prescribed by Islam, then Muslims
are to fight you. It says, fight those who believe
not in a law nor the last day, nor prohibit
forbid what all in his messenger have prohibited, nor follow
the religion of truth, even if they're from the people
of the book, until they pay the Jesi and feel
themselves subdued. That word subdued means humiliated, disgrace, degraded, debased.
Now notice the reasons why Muslims are to fight people.
If I tell you, do you forget what Muhammad forbids like,
for example, do you refrain from eating swine? No, that's
grounds to fight you. Wow, this is the yeah that says,
nor forbid what a Lah or his messenger not, or
I'm sorry Allah and his messenger have forbidden. Now, notice
there's a partnership. It's not what Allah has, it's what
Allah and his messenger have forbidden. Also another reason to
fight you. If I say, hey, Islam teaches at the
Last Day. I don't want to believe the one, but
I wanted to show you how evil this religion is,
how immoral and grotesque is Islam says, at the Last Day,
if you're a good Muslim, you good Muslim, you'll enter
Jenda paradise and you'll be given a pavilion of hoodie's
alain or are they maidens of pleasure? Wide eyed? And
the Koran says they have firm breasts Chapter seventy vers
three through the Koran says that their breasts are firm.
Speaker 26: In other words, no saggy plus and this is verree.
Speaker 3: Chapter seventy eight, verse thirty three. You can read thirty
one to thirty three, and you will be spending all
eternity deflowering them all eternity.
Speaker 18: Yeah, yeah, this is it is where did get the
cause of a virgins?
Speaker 26: They haven't so before they so regular mainstream is slum
beliefs in it as well.
Speaker 3: Well, it's in the Qur'an. They may so valorize it,
spiritualize it. But the plane reading is these are maidens
of pleasure. And by the way, what's interesting the word
who is where you get your modern English word from?
Speaker 2: I don't know what.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, horry, you get it right. But anyway, Yeah,
but now here's the thing. Now, if I say to you, hey,
do you believe in that last day? Do you believe
that you'll enter paradise with eternal erections deflowering virgins forever
and ever and they'll go back being virginal again. If
you say no, that sounds like Playboy mansion on steroids
or with hormone, then that's wounds to fight you. But
if you're a Jew or a Christian, you're giving this
option become Muslim or you pay jiz summation as a
sign that we've subjugated you, humiliated you, and brought you
under the hedge of many of Islam. Or we fight
and to the victor goes as spoils.
Speaker 26: Okay, So with the jizia tags in history, like, is
there like any like uh? Leaders of Islamic Califfe's day.
Speaker 3: All throughout that's unconducted Muslim.
Speaker 2: Part of it.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, all of them. They told me he was
the most just. He was known for his chivalry, chivalry,
lea chivalry or whatever the hell they called it. There
a bunch of stuff. Brother, Have you ever ran into
Well you haven't. You have some mob bosses. There are
some decent human beings. They're loved by the community. They
feed the the hungry and take care of the homeless.
But there's still a moai. You have to pay them protection.
If not, then they'll end up slaughtery right, So you're
paying them to you from them, right, Yeah, Well that's
how it is. It's a mafiosa. It's like a gang.
Well yeah, this my boss was really sweet, all right,
but he's still a my boss and if you don't,
he'll kill you.
Speaker 6: Tell you what's up? Did you have a Muslim related issue? Question? Debate.
Speaker 2: Yes, I have a question or.
Speaker 3: Cheology of what's the difference between is I'm a.
Speaker 28: Gunning the Christian goal because our friend, he usually perverted
to big Wall and me have a conversation.
Speaker 3: Or talk about the debates Christians and debases.
Speaker 19: I yeah, all they argue, well, we both believe in.
Speaker 6: The same I was like, right, well that's not obviously
not Drew. So the key is here, as Muslims do
not believe in the Trinity. Muslims don't believe that Allah
has any sons. Jesus is the son of God. Jesus
came to make us sons of God. So clearly two
different gods. Jesus said, God is his father, so that's
not the God of Islam, who has no sons. So
that's the key difference. No trinity and no deed of Christ,
no saving work of Christ, no death or resurrection of Christ.
It saves you. That's the key difference. Yep, excellent, Parker,
what's up. We're looking for Muslims who want to It's
not I'm not mad at that guy for asking question,
but it's we're looking for Islamic arguments. Parker, what's up?
Speaker 3: But hey, guys, how you doing wonderful.
Speaker 31: Hey, real quick, I wanted to first follow me kind
of you know, induce myself real quick, huge fan. Been
following you for a while, but I love that you're,
you know, out there preaching the truth against uh, this,
this religion.
Speaker 17: I have a question.
Speaker 31: I've been engaged with Muslims for quite a while here
now on on spaces, and obviously I'm not as well
versed in the Quran as as you have been.
Speaker 3: How do you I'm sorry I didn't hear you all
all the what say it again?
Speaker 31: I said, I'm not as well versed in the Koran
as as you are, obviously, but I had a question,
because we get we get this a lot. Is it
wrong for me to say when a Muslim says, you know, hey,
we believe in you know, we believe.
Speaker 3: In that Jesus is coming back to judge us.
Speaker 31: Right to my understanding, if a Muslim is trying to
make friends with someone who is actively committing shook, right,
like that's the.
Speaker 3: Number one, that's like the most unforgivable sin in Islam.
Speaker 31: Yes, So if they're doing that, does that not make them,
according to Islam, a bad Muslim?
Speaker 3: That's part number one, Part number Two.
Speaker 19: How far af.
Speaker 3: Fetched is it to call Islam a pagan religion?
Speaker 31: Because I in my beliefs, you know, as a Christian,
I look at what they practice, I look at what
they do.
Speaker 3: There's this some rituals they do, you.
Speaker 31: Know, they remind me of kind of what the profits
of bail were doing in the Old Testament when Ezekiel was,
you know, calling down fire, they were slicing their heads.
Speaker 6: That's right.
Speaker 31: I'm sorry, Eligi, I'm sorry, I got I got my
problems to me saying yes, you know, the the uh,
the paganistic you know, uh rituals that I see in Islam.
I cannot help, you know, worshiping the rock, the rocket
that's supposedly gonna forgive them with their sins. Why are
we not as Christians able to call out Islam as
a pagan religion?
Speaker 3: And why are we scared to do it?
Speaker 18: And I don't know, I know, I know.
Speaker 2: Oh I know.
Speaker 31: And that's why I love watching your videos, brother, I
really do appreciate it.
Speaker 3: Again, I'm mute out, but I'll let you take the
poor I'm sorry if you want to add anything before
I do, or whatever you want to do.
Speaker 6: I mean, I mean this is I don't have any problem.
You know, you're the expert subject matter expert here. What
are they? What are some of the reasons why you
would call Islam pagan?
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, well, number one, my fundamental problem with Islam
is the fact that what you said earlier, the God
of Islam is not the God of the scriptures, not
the God of the Church, the Trian God. So that's
the most obvious, glaring contradiction. It claims to be the
same God that sent the prophets of the Bible, sent
Jesus and as followers, and it's not so that right
there is a deal breaker for me. All of the
kron is not the God of the Hebrew Scriptures, not
the God of New test Now. I'm actually more consistent
than some Christians. I actually don't think that the God
of Rabbinic Judaism is the God of the Bible. I'm
actually more consistent than some Christians will say that Allah
is a pagan deity. Whereas the Jews, Rabbinic Jews, I'm
not talking about the Jews that are not religious who
don't know any better. Like Tovia's singer, well.
Speaker 25: His God is my God.
Speaker 3: No Tovias singer worships the false God. Rabbinic Judaism is
a perversion of Gnostisism them you name it combined. Now
with that said, so that's the number one major fundamental difference.
Their God is not my God. Secondly, it's not it'steeped
in paganism. It comes out of paganism. If I go
with the Muslim sources, and I accept that the Muslim
sources give me some historical facts regarding the situation of Muhammad,
because you have revisionists who say, well, the moment of
later tradition is not the Muhammad of the seventh century
and that's all forgeries. All right, Well, if you take
that position, fine, But if I take Muslim sources seriously,
the Muslim sources admit that the Kaba was the shrine
for Hubang or Hubble. I don't want to belabor the point.
I want to be sensitive to your time. So let
me know when you want to wind in down Hubble
or Hubog. This isn't the Muslim sources. You'll find in
Ebneskaki and Sunni Muslims know this. They know I'm not lying. Hubble. Now,
Hubal was called the Lord of Mecca. He was the
lord of the Kaba, and the Muslim sources say that
Muhammad's own family, his tribe, the christ tribe, right his
own clan, worshiped Hubble and prayed to Hubble or Hubal.
Hubble was the chief deity. Now we have a problem.
If anyone knows about anything about paganism, and Jay would know.
Usually when you have a shrine, a shrine is built
to one of the gods.
Speaker 2: I don't know.
Speaker 3: You can correct me on the j Are you aware
of any shrine built by Pagans for two gods at
the same time where that so, Usually a shrine will
be built for Zeus or Diana, but not both. That
doesn't mean they didn't honor the other gods. But this shrine,
this temple is dedicated to Zeuz. Well, the Muslim sources
say the Kaba was built for Hubble Hubal Hubal was
a moon deity. This is all from Muslim sources. I'm
not making I've documented it from Muslim sources as well
as Islamic scholars.
Speaker 6: Today.
Speaker 3: Hubble was the moon deity because the chief god Hubble
would have a planet identified with him. This is how
the Pagans work. Fertility gods and goddesses as well as
astral worship, and the planets would be associated with one
of the gods or goddesses. So the moon god was
considered the male deity. Why sorry, I don't want to
bore you guys with the details, but I'm going to
show you where I'm going with this. The word for
moon in arab is Almara almar is a masculine noun.
Because they are patriarchal society, the chief god has to
be a male deity. So the moon was identified with
Hubal Hubble, that was his planet, his sign, so he
was the moon god. Now why is that interesting? Because
the Muslim sources say that the idol of Hubble was
imported from the Moabites. It was actually imported by an
Arab name Ahmer Ebin Luei or Luei. He actually went
to the levant Syria area Jordan, and he picked up
the idol worshiped by the Moabites, and he brought it
to Arabia cordium of Muslim sources, and he made Hubble
the chief god. Now, if anyone knows their history, the
chief god of the Mobites was Bail Baal. This is
why many scholars believe the word who Bal is an
Arab sized bastardization of the word ha baal he Brew.
The bail or is actually Arabic vet he is bail.
So Islam is centered in bail worship. Bah al worship.
It stems from Badalism. It is a form of bail worship.
And if we read the Bible, one of the names
of Satan is Belyle. One of his names is Balzibub.
That's what our word tells us. So it's is centered
in paganism, and it's centered and bow worship, and ball
is identified with Lucifer or Satan.
Speaker 31: I never knew that connection. That is it's wild because
you know, like I said, just kind of what I've seen.
I made the connection with bail, but I never knew
that there was that physical connection from these cultures.
Speaker 6: That is shocking.
Speaker 3: And by the way, let me add sort of how
do we know it's pagan The Muslims will tell you
that the Pagans would run around the kaba, circumambulate the
kaba to off counterc clockwise seven times. They admit this.
They also admit that the Pagans would run between the
two hills sef On Morua seven times, and they would
throw seven stones. That this is Muslim sources. Now here's
what's interesting. As I've documented from Muslim sources, I didn't
make this up. At that time, the Arabs thought there
were seven planets, Sun and Moon and five others, and
each planet represented a deity. So they ran around the
shrine seven times in honor for each god and goddess.
That's why they did it seven times. So that's also paganism,
because the Muslims now have adopted that pagan practice. They
run around the Kappa seven times, they run between the
two hills, suffer the mantowas seven times, they throw seven
stones at But you asked them why, they said, well,
Ishmael and Abraham were the ones who instituted these rights
of pilgrimage. There is absolutely no shred of pre Islamic textual, historical,
archaeological evidence none that Abraham Ishmael ever went to Arabia
and built a shrine there. But the evidence is clear
the Pagans did do these things for the seven planetary deities.
You don't get more pagan than that, especially kissing the Blackstone.
Speaker 6: Now do we have any Muslims that want to call
it so this is not Christian time, it was not
Protestant time. Zeke, thank you for that, Sam, Actually I
didn't know a lot of that.
Speaker 3: I'll send you articles later on Skype.
Speaker 6: What's up, Zeke? I'm mute, Zeke. You want to talk,
I'm mute. Faithful you want to come up?
Speaker 32: Yeah, yeah, I just I just chimed in on this
space real quick, and I'm no Muslim scholar, but damn
you speak one one word of truth in ninety nine bullshit?
Speaker 2: Right, nobody?
Speaker 32: Look, look, look, look, I don't care what little.
Speaker 6: Psy of your Okay, where's it wrong? What's your argument?
Speaker 32: We worship the creator, point blank period, The one who
made us is who Muslims worship?
Speaker 3: Really call it?
Speaker 2: You want to call it bs and try to go around.
Speaker 32: In circles and do this and say that Muslims worship
whoever made us?
Speaker 2: How simple?
Speaker 3: Jesus simple?
Speaker 2: Is that argument?
Speaker 3: Okay? Well let me answer you. You want to engage me.
Jesus made you, so you worship Jesus. We don't believe
in Jesus is God? No, so then that means my
God is not your God.
Speaker 32: Well, because you decided to believe that a human being
is God, let me tell you if the Qur'an never
showed up.
Speaker 3: If the Qur'an never showed up.
Speaker 33: And said that much more Jesus is not God, then
maybe we could fall under that and say, hey, you know,
based on the Bibles, we can't believe that Jesus is God.
Speaker 3: But even though the Bible never.
Speaker 6: Says that, actually, you know it says that in every
chapter of John, are you where of that?
Speaker 3: Yeah? I want to just you want to preach, You
can preach, but I want to gage you. Now. You said,
I believe human is God. But according to your prophet,
your God is a beardless, truly haired youth who wears
a red garment.
Speaker 2: We don't where where did you find that in the Koran? Oh?
Speaker 25: You want to just go with the Koran, so you
don't follow tell me in the Koran the Quran. The
Koran is the text, the Quran is the is the
word of text.
Speaker 2: Or not?
Speaker 3: Why can't you answer the question?
Speaker 2: Do you follow krown a own or the give give
me Kuran?
Speaker 25: I told you I'm not a scholar.
Speaker 6: I can't sid It doesn't matter whether your scholar or not.
What do you follow?
Speaker 25: I want you to tell me in the Kuran?
Speaker 12: Where does God tell you that he has this red
roban and curly hair and all this nonsense.
Speaker 3: Can I now bury you in your argument, because if
you want to go with the Koran, how do you
justify the kron? How do you know the Koran was
given through Mohammed? Where does the Koran show you that
the entire one hundred fourteen chapters were sent from a
law and only one hundred fourteen chapters and they're recited
by Muhammad? Prove that from the Koran?
Speaker 2: He tells us that in the Koran?
Speaker 3: Where does the kron tell you one hundred fourteen chapters
make up the Koran and they were transmitted through Muhammed?
Speaker 25: The Quran tells us that that a law spoke and
he did profitable.
Speaker 6: Where does tell you specifically.
Speaker 3: That Muhammad never spoke? Or at the times you Mohammad
mentioned in the Koran?
Speaker 2: Not that many times? Actually?
Speaker 3: Okay, so four times apart from those four references, how
do you know and all the other times where the
name of Muhammad does not appear?
Speaker 32: You do you do realize that just this Mohammad, You
do realize that Prophet Muhammad was the one narrating this Koran?
Speaker 2: Right?
Speaker 6: So how do you know what is the justification for that?
How do you know that?
Speaker 3: Have you, guys even read the Koran? Can you answer
the question?
Speaker 2: Have you ever read the Koran? Or you just talking?
Speaker 3: Yes? Whenever I go to the toilet, I use the
Koran and if I run law question, I'll talk.
Speaker 2: For shame on you.
Speaker 6: You can you answer the question?
Speaker 2: Listen to this, Listen to this.
Speaker 3: This is very simple.
Speaker 6: So you can't answer. So you can't answer it. You
can't ask it.
Speaker 25: I can't answer.
Speaker 6: You can't know that.
Speaker 2: You guys have your mindset on something that you.
Speaker 6: Can't answer, right, So there's no answer exactly. He just
wants to talk. Go ahead. The next one, we got
another Musland. What's up? Go ahead? Have you even read
have you even read Bubin? Have you even read babe?
Speaker 3: Exactly? I don't worry when I whenever I'm bored, I
go to the toilet and I read the go ahead
translation of my user as toilet paper. Sorry, Muslims, assume me.
Speaker 2: I know you're upset.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you're up? Go ahead? Oh wife?
Speaker 18: Yeah, guys, how are Yeah?
Speaker 6: What's up?
Speaker 15: Yes?
Speaker 6: Mom?
Speaker 34: I haven't seen anyone that hell more than you, no
more than Mohammed the.
Speaker 3: Stoley King pagans to me. You know, I don't listen
to you because you call me ja doesn't know what
you call me? Job means I'm making right jehead like
you're probably it wasn't he ignorant? He was a numi right? Yeah,
you mean doesn't mean hell No, that means he's he's uneducated.
So today we call people are educated jah hell meaning idrant.
So the company I'm like today today? Can you get
today's today?
Speaker 2: The key?
Speaker 3: This man? Why didn't you pray for India? Okay? What's
your objection? I'm not from India, bro Okay, where are
you from? I love your Actually pray for India? Okay,
God Pakistan even better? But was in Pakistan part of
India and you Muslim stole it like you saw most
of the lands of the Yeah, you you want to talk.
Speaker 6: You have an argument?
Speaker 3: Yeah? If it isn't the argument like I will present it.
Speaker 32: Yeah, he's homin on from the Okay, what's your argument?
Speaker 3: He's a that hormone against humanity. Get to the point. Okay,
if you just stop the argument, not protect me. You've
been making it herman against me hill? Okay, what's your
if I would make a good hominem. Then I would
quote you.
Speaker 6: I know you could. We know what's your argument?
Speaker 2: When she took seven is just big?
Speaker 6: Yeah, they're really good argument.
Speaker 3: You might like this, what, Muhamma, do you write the
pony seven inch poonty? They took the stones from man?
I like this? You like to write the rony pony?
Speaker 5: Man?
Speaker 2: Why you're like this?
Speaker 3: Jay? Why are you doing it to me?
Speaker 1: Man?
Speaker 6: They took the stones from anyone? Does anyone saying Temple
of Doom?
Speaker 3: Yeah, they're hurting my feelings. I'm about to lose leep tonight.
Speaker 6: Know what's up? They took shivalinga.
Speaker 15: Like this?
Speaker 5: Man?
Speaker 3: You're sure now she blandly?
Speaker 2: You're very weary.
Speaker 3: Don't do my landry.
Speaker 6: T G what's up? Man?
Speaker 3: Hello?
Speaker 14: Yeah, yes, sir, Hello, I'm gonna collect to be in
your life today. It's some months, like a few months.
I'm listening to Shams Sam Sam salmons. Okay, yeah, sorry,
I'm Muslim and the price God. Now it's six years
and I given baptized by the Church. And because I
have very hard experiences in Islam, because my father was
Sunni and my mother was Shere, I have pretty much
experiences in being lost in Islam and gone to the
autist and seek for truth and after that finding finding Jesus.
It's very sweet for me to share with you some
other contradictions which you didn't mention. Sam as your as
your as my teachers like to remind notified something fight too,
can I what was it? Sorry for my bad English,
but I would like to notify some other contradiction.
Speaker 3: Which let me say that your English is better than
all Arabic.
Speaker 14: So thank you very much for the first you you
told the guys before me, which Allah is not our God. Yes,
as you told yes about our God. And I made
a post about that which in the Old Testament and
New Testament, God rebins himself and names himself to Moses, Moses,
Abraham and other people who ask who are asking their
name as Yahua. And as we know, God is not
affected by time. And from here he was able to
tell them, my name is Yahoa, but you shall.
Speaker 3: Call my name as Alah.
Speaker 14: So yeah, if our God was all Llah, so he
would tell this to other people in before in past
in Old Testament, my name is Yahoa, but you shall
call my name as Allah or something else. But he
specifically told them my name is yohoa, and you shall
call my name forever and ever by this name. So
this is a sign which you can.
Speaker 3: I give you some pushbacks so you use better arguments
because I know how they're going to respond.
Speaker 2: I am not arguing you.
Speaker 3: I know I'm trying to help you. Your argument is
not to help you, try to help you. You're young.
I know you think these are good arguments. But because
I've dealt the Muslims, I know how they're going to respond.
So the word yahoa, that's in the Hebrew Old Testament.
Speaker 6: Right, go ahead. I muted him.
Speaker 3: I muted his go ahead, yeah, yeah, So that's in
the Hebrew Testament because I'm trying to let you know
how they're going to respond, so you can be like
a chess player several moves in advance ahead of them.
So the word yeahoa is in the Hebrewal Testament.
Speaker 6: Right, I muted at him. Go ahead, you there, Sam,
you can go ahead. I muted that guy because he
was kept talking.
Speaker 3: I'm sorry, I didn't know. I thought you said you.
Speaker 6: Unmuted him, So no, no, I'm muted at him so
you could talk because he kept talking.
Speaker 3: Okay, here's the point for everyone. Yes, we know that
in the Old Testament, the name that God gave is
what they call the tetragrammaton. Some pronounce it yeahweah yeahaa.
The only problem is the sharp Muslim will tell you, well,
in the New Testament, Greek New Testament, because this is
run brought up against me and other Christians, will say,
when the Greek New Testament cites passages that have the
divine name, they'll use the word katie us Greek for Lord.
Speaker 2: Okay.
Speaker 3: Now, in the Orthodox Church, the Eastern Orthodox Church, the
official Old Testament, and Jay knows this better than me,
is the septigen translation of the seventy the Greek translation
of the Old Testament. Well, in the Greek translation of
the Old Testament, you don't find a form of the
divine name. In the Greek. It's gid use the word
well like they're asked me in way Kutias kutiss All right,
Gidi use Lord, meaning that a sharp Muslim if he's sharp,
which you're rarely find sharp Muslims. Shabali is sharp. I
got to give them credit because he studies liberal critical
scholarship so well. In the New Testament, they use the
word Lord in place of yahweh Gidi use in place
of yahweh. Well, in Arabic kron it uses it up
the Arabic word for lord in place of yahwei. So
this is how they're going to catch you. So I
know people think this is a good argument. I'm not
saying it's bad. But you're gonna have to finesse it, fine,
tune it to be prepared for that objection. You don't
want to embarrass yourselves. You want to give the best
arguments possible. So I muslimill tell you if you are
okay with the Greek New Testament using the Greek word
lord as a synonym substitute for yahweh, can you use
meaning lord? Then that's what Allah does in the Crown.
He uses it all Lord for Yahweh. Bad argument, but
nonetheless you got to be prepared for that. That's all
I wanted to say.
Speaker 6: Thank you. Let's say next up, do you have any
more Muslims? I don't see many muslim looking. Let me
see here. Let's see this guy two witness? What's up?
Sounds like a total witness?
Speaker 2: Hello?
Speaker 6: Yeah, hi j what's up you me? Yeah?
Speaker 2: Awesome? So my name is Andrew Samuel Posemon.
Speaker 3: I just wanted to make the funerals.
Speaker 10: First of all, one of your speakers talked about the
fact that why we call Jesus as moon if you
read geness is one, verse sixteen, or if you read
Matthew four, verse sixteen, or Isaiah nine, I.
Speaker 3: Think verse four.
Speaker 34: Uh, that you can see that we are talking about
our lovely look is lamp. Lamp as the only light
that rules over the darkness.
Speaker 10: Of the earth or the Abbees or Apron or Bagua
or Malcot.
Speaker 3: And that's why, in fust for this.
Speaker 6: I can't understand what you're saying. I'm sorry.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I guess he's a Persian who's maybe a convert,
but yeah, he said that we call Jesus more. Does
anyone call Jesus that means sly?
Speaker 6: What's up?
Speaker 4: Hey, guys, I just wanted to look him forth and
helping Christians in general just push forward and be able
to tools to combat because I've had trouble in the
past with Muslims.
Speaker 3: Strength express my path and you know, watching you and
learning from you has really helped. So thank you and sorry,
I'm out of Muslim.
Speaker 6: Too, I appreciate that.
Speaker 2: Sorry for God.
Speaker 3: Please, So Jay, if you have no muscles. Brother, I'll
let you get to you. Maybe you want to discuss
with Protestants and Catholics. I'll let you be.
Speaker 6: I'm probably gonna call it a night. I mean, I
thank you for coming on. I appreciate it. I've been going.
We've been going for uh yeah, about three hours, so
I appreciate that.
Speaker 3: Sam, thank you anytime. Brother, I got you back. When
it comes to Slim set up that two for two brother.
Speaker 6: Yeah, we're just waiting on who they want, all right, brother, brother,
thank you you too.
Speaker 2: Man.
Speaker 6: Everybody that's Sam Shumun you can call him over on
Shimunian channel on YouTube. I'll link his channel here in
a little bit. Let's see we get some super chats.
I want to remind everybody that we have a show sponsor,
which is Chalk dot com, c cho q dot com,
Helward at to chalk dot com. Right now, use go
to J fifty to get fifty excuse me, J forty
four life you forty four percent off those great products
over there at Chalk Neo Gypsy three dollars. Does the
Orthodox Sam baptismal regeneration to be immediate? Yes? Why do
we people struggle after baptism because we are battling the passions.
Noah M. I bought bitcoin in the recent recent dip.
Do you think it'll dip again the election? I have
no idea. I think there's any there's no way to
predict what's gonna happen with bitcoin. Regive it. Six thirty eight.
I'm still blocked. I don't remember why or what what
are you talking about? Blocked on YouTube or Twitter? I'm
not sure. Thank you, Jay and all the Orthodox friends.
I recommended that Sam Schumann contact you. Thank you appreciate that.
Regive itch again. Five dollars. Sam was asking for an
Orthodox scholar tell them under Sam Philly oquay Orthodox Catholic issues.
Uh yeah, I'm always open to have that discussion. Also,
doctor Branton is really good. Play up play at twenty dollars.
Come on, Jay, we need at least one or two
yo mama jokes in a debate. I'll have to sit
and write some good yo mama jokes. Farrella. The second,
five dollars, Thank you so much, hut. Five dollars. Here's
a cup of coffee for a Sam cool. Thank you,
Verrel the second, there's a missing talk on your Yeah,
I move I removed that talk for various reasons, but
thank you for that super chat. A cup of coffee
twenty dollars. Thank you, Jay, I appreciate your work. I
found orthodoxy through three or four years ago through you.
Collab with Sam is great. Yeah, he's always welcome to
hop on. He drops the knowledge bombs. You should team
up in the future and make a great duo Dad
show a ten dollars. Would you be open to discussing
and debating with Warren McGrew? He does idle killer. He's
an open theist. He espouses a lot of EO doctrines. Well,
I mean it doesn't like you don't get to do
like half of them. And open theism is a denial
of divine omissions. So he says that Christ that could
have sinned. Paul says that it was impossible for God
to lie. Christ is a divine person, So no, it's
not possible for Jesus to do evil. You would only
think that if you didn't think that he was a
divine person. If you thought that he was if you
were an Aran or a Nestorian, there was only a
way you would think that Jesus could sin. Thank you
guys for all of that. If you want to get
my books, you can go to my website Jaysnelsons dot
com and in the shop you can find the text
signed copies in the shop and yeah fun wild Night.
Didn't expect Sammy Shaw