Speaker 1: Channa nine first one to weather orcast. It is going
Speaker 1: to be a cloudy day to day. A few flurries
Speaker 1: are possible. Hid twenty four down to three degrees overnight
Speaker 1: with clouds sunny tomorrow. Actually the clouds are moving out overnight,
Speaker 1: sunny skys tomorrow with the I have twenty two clouds
Speaker 1: return Thursday night dropping to five degrees and a high
Speaker 1: thirty On Friday, clouds and snow backed maybe one to
Speaker 1: even four inches twenty Right now, time for a traffic update.
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Speaker 2: Better news on southbound seventy five. They cleared the accident
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Speaker 2: coming up next for the first time in twenty twenty five,
Speaker 2: a gentleman who's going to help us celebrate National Bubble
Speaker 2: Bath Day. So go ahead, grab your phone, click the
Speaker 2: iHeartRadio app, and sit back and relax and listen to
Speaker 2: our own mister Bubble. The Judges next Chuck Ingram on
Speaker 2: fifty five krs the talk station.
Speaker 1: Hey thirty three, if you give out Pierce Talk Station,
Speaker 1: I'm not accusing him, your honor, but I just want
Speaker 1: to let you know marijuana is legal in the state
Speaker 1: of Ohio. So maybe that answers the question how he
Speaker 1: came up with that one? No idea?
Speaker 3: How about this? Some thing's never changed it?
Speaker 1: Well? Yeah, starting the year, starting the year off on
Speaker 1: a consistent note. Wow, all right, well anyhow, welcome back
Speaker 1: in a happy new year. I cannot how many years
Speaker 1: have we been at this year, Honor. It's just time
Speaker 1: flies by so quickly. But it's been like a decade,
Speaker 1: hasn't it.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, it does seem that way.
Speaker 1: My dear friend, always makes the week more special to
Speaker 1: have you on the show. So I can't thank you
Speaker 1: enough for spending time with my listeners and me every
Speaker 1: Wednesday at this time. And of course I'm you know,
Speaker 1: I'm in a great position here to get the advance
Speaker 1: copy of your column coming out tonight at midnight. Killing
Speaker 1: the Constitution at Gitmo. We've talked about GITTMO quite a
Speaker 1: few times and the trampling on constitutional rights and the
Speaker 1: idea that torturing people is of course inappropriate, and all
Speaker 1: the whys and warforce. But as I understand, the administration
Speaker 1: released eleven of the GITMO detainees after twenty years of incarceration.
Speaker 1: They got like fifteen left, including college Sheik Muhammad. Were
Speaker 1: these the ones that are still there? Were they the
Speaker 1: ones that were subject to that plea deal they pulled
Speaker 1: the plug on last minute?
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, and the plea deal. This is interesting, Brian.
Speaker 3: You'll appreciate it as an attorney, and people generallyamiliar with
Speaker 3: the system will Normally, these plea deals are instigated by
Speaker 3: the defendants because they want to reduce their exposure to
Speaker 3: jail time or in this case, they want to avoid
Speaker 3: the death penalty. This plea deal was instigated by the prosecutors.
Speaker 3: This is the second full team of prosecutor. Prosecutors rotate
Speaker 3: in and out. That's the problem with the military at tribunals.
Speaker 3: Military assignments change every three or four years. There was
Speaker 3: no human being in the College Sheik Muhammad case today
Speaker 3: who was in it when it was started except for
Speaker 3: a couple of the defense lawyers and College Sheik Muhammad
Speaker 3: himself were on Judge number five and complete change of
Speaker 3: prosecutorial team number two. The judges rotate through every four years.
Speaker 3: The prosecutors rotate in and out. The prosecutorial team is huge.
Speaker 3: Full disclosure. I was consulted by the or. I consulted
Speaker 3: the first prosecutorial team because the general, the chief prosecutor,
Speaker 3: Mark Martin's, was and is a friend of mine, and
Speaker 3: we spent the day discussing their civil liberties issues. I
Speaker 3: was in a room with ten other people. None of
Speaker 3: those people is in the case today. Okay, so you've
Speaker 3: got a completely different set of prosecutors. They look at
Speaker 3: the evidence of torture and say, A, we can't defend
Speaker 3: this or we will lose our licenses to practice law. B.
Speaker 3: Therefore we're not going to use any evidence obtained from
Speaker 3: the torture. Therefore, C we're going to initiate settlement negotiations.
Speaker 3: They do it. The judge says, fine. The judges Judge
Speaker 3: number five in order for him to try the case.
Speaker 3: He has to read hang on to your chair, forty
Speaker 3: thousand pages of documents and transcripts accumulated by Judges one
Speaker 3: through four. Buddy has an interest in settling this. They
Speaker 3: agreed away settlement which takes the death penalty off the table,
Speaker 3: which takes Florence, Colorado, America Supermax two hundred and fifty
Speaker 3: feet below the service of the Earth off the table,
Speaker 3: which requires a guilty plea under Oath standard and federal court,
Speaker 3: but at which the judge, the prosecutors, and lawyers for
Speaker 3: the victims can interrogate College Sheik Muhammad, and if he
Speaker 3: doesn't answer truthfully, he can be prosecuted for perjury. That
Speaker 3: plea deal is signed off on by the judge, the
Speaker 3: prosecutors of the defense, attorneys, the defendant himself, and the
Speaker 3: General in the Pentagon in charge of all of these prosecutions,
Speaker 3: herself a former chief of the Military Court of Appeals.
Speaker 3: When Lloyd Austin, the Separatary of Defense, finds out about this,
Speaker 3: and I'm not going to go along with it. I
Speaker 3: want them exposed to the death penalty. He then orders
Speaker 3: the military prosecutors who instigated the settlement, who crafted the
Speaker 3: settlement to who got the judge to accept it, to
Speaker 3: ask the judge to change his mind. Judge said, sorry,
Speaker 3: this is a contract. It's a deal. It's reduced to writing.
Speaker 3: Everybody signed it. That was appealed to the Military Court
Speaker 3: of Appeals last week. The Military Court of Appeals upheld
Speaker 3: the plea agreement. Next week that plea will take place.
Speaker 3: So that's where we are now. It involves two other people.
Speaker 3: And by the way, they get a much nicer place
Speaker 3: to live at Gittmo. Nobody would want to live at Gitmo,
Speaker 3: but it's a hell of a lot nicer than two
Speaker 3: hundred and fifty feet below the surface of the earth
Speaker 3: in Florence, Colorado.
Speaker 1: Well, I guess that has to be viewed. I mean
Speaker 1: by I think a rational reasonable person as a good outcome,
Speaker 1: because well, in.
Speaker 3: A good outcome because of the image done to the
Speaker 3: judicial system or the creation of this Devil's island, and
Speaker 3: by the torture. If College Sheik Muhammad had not been tortured,
Speaker 3: and if the prosecutors didn't have this problem of torture
Speaker 3: about which I've written extensively, and you and I have
Speaker 3: spoken extensively, and if this were just a simple prosecution
Speaker 3: in the Southern District of New York. He would either
Speaker 3: have been executed by now or in Florence, Colorado for
Speaker 3: the rest of us life, or acquitted and sent home.
Speaker 3: He wouldn't have been on trial for twenty years and
Speaker 3: on Judge number five.
Speaker 1: And that actually is amazing. And I presume that the
Speaker 1: new batch of prosecutors that come in for the fourth
Speaker 1: time or however many also would have had to go
Speaker 1: through forty thousand pages of transcripts and evidence and information, yes,
Speaker 1: in order for them to come to the scripts.
Speaker 3: That's correct. You mentioned the eleven people that Biden let
Speaker 3: go under cover of darkness. I don't blame him for
Speaker 3: doing undercover darkness. They were there for twenty years. They
Speaker 3: were all tortured. None of them was charged with a
Speaker 3: single offense.
Speaker 1: And see that's what I was.
Speaker 3: Incarcerated, confined, tortured in jail for twenty years, not charged
Speaker 3: with a crime, not prosecuted. This is America. It shouldn't
Speaker 3: be happening to anyone.
Speaker 1: I agree with you wholeheartedly on that. I mean, it's
Speaker 1: one of those there but for the grace of God
Speaker 1: go I I mean, we locked up Japanese citizens in
Speaker 1: the United States and internment camps back of World War Two.
Speaker 1: I still can't believe that happened, but it's a historical fact.
Speaker 1: So you really do have to take this very seriously,
Speaker 1: regardless of how you feel about any of the guys
Speaker 1: that got let go. But in terms of let's just
Speaker 1: focus real quickly on colleague shik Muhammad. Do you have
Speaker 1: any concept of what evidence would remain that would be
Speaker 1: able to be presented to the jury once you pull
Speaker 1: out the torture testimony, the stuff that would be inadmissible
Speaker 1: in any court of law in the United States. Is
Speaker 1: there still efficient evidence of criminality, such as you could
Speaker 1: get proof beyond a reasonable doubt that the guy was
Speaker 1: guilty of something worthy of incarceration or possibly even the
Speaker 1: death penalty.
Speaker 3: You know, it's hard to say. Because so many people
Speaker 3: have been tortured in this case, including the witnesses that
Speaker 3: the government has cut deals with preparing to testify against him.
Speaker 3: There must be some evidence. The problem is, here's what
Speaker 3: the prosecutors told the judge when they said, not only
Speaker 3: can we not defend torture, but we're concerned about the
Speaker 3: reaction around the world when the world learns what the
Speaker 3: American government did to him, because once we introduce any
Speaker 3: evidence involving or arguably derived from torture, he can then
Speaker 3: put his psychiatrists on the stand, who will testify to
Speaker 3: what the government did to them. They tortured him one
Speaker 3: hundred and eighty three times that we know of. Some
Speaker 3: of the records and most of the videotapes were destroyed
Speaker 3: by the CIA, so it is difficult to say. This
Speaker 3: is why you'd have to read the forty thousand pages
Speaker 3: to decide which evidence was derived from torture and which
Speaker 3: evidence was not. Well, and I know that that decision
Speaker 3: has even been made yet by any of the four judges,
Speaker 3: and it certainly hasn't been made by this new judge, who,
Speaker 3: as far as I know, hasn't read the forty thousand
Speaker 3: pages yet.
Speaker 1: Well, And since College shig Muhammad as well as the
Speaker 1: others are represented by counsel, I feel fairly confident by
Speaker 1: them being willing to enter into this plea deal that
Speaker 1: they do believe there is sufficient presentable evidence that their
Speaker 1: client could get convicted, so this is a better deal.
Speaker 1: Maybe that's why they made the recommendation, but we're all
Speaker 1: left to speculate at this point. But in so far
Speaker 1: as the other guys that were released under cover of darkness,
Speaker 1: no charges ever brought against them, even after being incarcerated
Speaker 1: twenty years. I would imagine they didn't have sufficient evidence
Speaker 1: of criminality in those cases.
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, you know, I've been harshly critical of George W. Bush,
Speaker 3: and I'm unrelenting the whole concept of let's go to Cuba.
Speaker 3: The federal laws don't apply, the Constitution doesn't amply, and
Speaker 3: best of all, this pesky federal judges can interfere with you.
Speaker 3: Five out of five cases the Supreme Court said no, no, no, no,
Speaker 3: and no right. Federal laws apply, the Constitution applies, and
Speaker 3: federal courts have jurisdiction. Oh, let's create our own system.
Speaker 3: Military men will vote in favor of execution immediately, and
Speaker 3: they won't be offended by torture. Well, and the one
Speaker 3: jury trial, one jury trial that occurred there, the military
Speaker 3: men on the jury were so repulsed by the torture
Speaker 3: they voted unanimously to convict and then voted eight to
Speaker 3: one for clemency. Well, well, that's the mess that Bushed
Speaker 3: and company created. God forbid any of this should become
Speaker 3: a precedent. Seven hundred and eighty prisoners. At its height
Speaker 3: five hundred million dollars a year to operate. There's now
Speaker 3: fifteen prisoners remaining and the thousand guards.
Speaker 1: My word, Judge Ennapolitana spelling it out like it is
Speaker 1: got it's do we have.
Speaker 3: To start the new year with this?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Why not? You know, the topics haven't exactly been enlightening
Speaker 1: or fun or uplifting and so far as the conversations
Speaker 1: have been having during the week anyhow, so can you
Speaker 1: continue with me? But you got to talk about it.
Speaker 1: People need to be aware of this. It's extremely important
Speaker 1: and I'm glad you have the bone, the wherewithal in
Speaker 1: the backbone to bring this to the American people's attention.
Speaker 1: It's important, all right, New year, new judging freedom. Who's
Speaker 1: on today?
Speaker 3: Kyle LANs Alone, Aaron Monte, Phil Geraldi, the Secrets Sir,
Speaker 3: the CIA agent who told George W. Bush personally in
Speaker 3: the Oval office that Saddam Hussein did not have weapons
Speaker 3: of mass instruction and Bush threw him out. And Professor
Speaker 3: Jeffrey Sachs, a leading light of peace whose speech at
Speaker 3: the Oxford Union in Great Britain shortly before Christmas was
Speaker 3: just posted on truth social buy Donald Trump.
Speaker 1: Donald Trump. Well, at least we got Trump to post
Speaker 1: things like that, and we've got you to talk to
Speaker 1: every Wednesday. Looking forward to next Wednesday. Already you're on
Speaker 1: our best of health and thanks again.
Speaker 3: Make sure Joe takes his bubble bath.
Speaker 1: I will definitely do that. Thank you, Joe, both of them.
Speaker 1: It's National bubble bath Day. Who know, we'll all get
Speaker 1: in the top. Take care man, we'll talk next Wednesday.
Speaker 1: Best of health. It's eight forty six at fifty five
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