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Speaker 1: Hey much as we'll be on the winning team. Hello

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and welcome Jay, and thank you so much for joining

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us once again on Legalized freedom dot Com.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Greg. It's pleasure to be back.

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Speaker 1: Okay, Jay, Today we're doing part three of our little

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interview series discussing your book Esoteric Hollywood Sex Cults and

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Symbols in Film, And of course we've been getting into

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a lot of other related things that you didn't necessarily

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cover in the book. Do recommend people hop back and

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listen to the first two installments, which the links to

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which can be found on the web page for this

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particular section. So with that in mind, we're going to

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go straight in to continue our chat. All the preamble

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stuff that about your book, et cetera, et cetera can

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be found either in one of the other interviews or

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at the end of this one. So now two things

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that we threaten to talk about last two occasions. Where

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first movie was Zardols from nineteen seventy four. That's a

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film by director John Burman and star Sean Connery, of

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all people, not long after he actually finished up his

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second stint as James Bond. Now Berman is perhaps better known,

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I guess One of his best known films is probably

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Deliverance with Burt Reynolds and John Voight and the other

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guy whose name I can't remember, the fat Dude, and.

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Speaker 2: A very wholesome family film.

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Speaker 1: It is, Yeah, no, and also excalib.

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Speaker 2: When I say when I say family, I mean that

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in a very extreme sense.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'd like to keep it in the family.

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And so, yeah, people haven't seen Deliverance that they really

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do need to do that. It's still actually has not.

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We're not here Destiny to talk about that, but for

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me that that film still has the power to shock.

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Even though I've watched it quite a few times, you

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know that there's definitely something about it that's so you.

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Speaker 2: Can go about thirty minutes from where I am and

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find people living in conditions fairly close to that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, or you could not do that. You could just

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stay in town and lock your doors.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but we were talking about the Mullet people. But yeah,

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we were talking the first episode, and yeah, it gets

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worse than just the Mullets. I mean, the South has

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a lot of great points to it, but there really

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are still some of those you know, very destitute backwoods

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times people.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, wrong, turn type stuff. M HM and Excalibur is

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another one of John Berman's films that's his Arthurian, his

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take on the Arthurian legend, which I always think.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it's interesting, it's very gnostic.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it is. Rather it is rather, But I say,

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I wanted really to talk about zar Doors because this

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fits in with some of the themes that we picked

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up last time, last two times, specifically talking about science

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fiction distilly is, you know, visions of the future. Also

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things being laid out in decades gone by that would

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very much tie in with things that have happened since,

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particularly in the realms of technology, science and society, and

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things that look a lot closer to happening than they

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did back and movies such as this kind of laid

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them out. So Zardos is an interesting film. I mean

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visually I find it quite ravishing. Really, there's just so

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many points of interest, so many scenes and sections that

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he just kind of go wow, you know, look at that.

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Particularly at the time. It's one of those things where

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I can't quite imagine what it would be like going

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to the movies to see that for the first time.

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Speaker 2: My underwear shaken not starred.

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Speaker 1: Hey, listen, you gotta love Sean Connery, haven't you. Really.

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He's one of those actors that he hasn't got any

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other accents.

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Speaker 2: You know, I'm not the only one, and I'm in

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my underwear.

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Speaker 1: Appreciate it. I'm not quite sure how he got interacting.

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I know he used to be a milkman. He seems

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to be a guy that's kind of can act up

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to a point, if you see what I mean. But

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he's never he's never bravely taken on.

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Speaker 2: That's a good question. I hadn't thought about that, but yeah,

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and he wasn't, you know, originally the choice for Bond.

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That was a lot of other people that were in

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the running first, and you know, Patrick McGowan and people

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like that. But yeah, yeah, I don't. I don't really

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know a lot about his background.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, Patrick mcgooin, who well, by the way, in case,

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I don't know what you call them or if you

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ever had milkman in the US, but basically it's kind

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of dayed out now, but for many years in Britain

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you would often get your milk delivered to your door

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right by a dairy company and they just drove around

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in these little electric trucks. Delivering milk. It seems bizarre, no, but.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they had the US had that like in the

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fifties and sixties, and I think it kind of died

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out by the seventies.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well Sean Connery used to do that. But anyway,

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the point about his accent is no matter what film

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he's in, it's the same, isn't it. Highlander Scottish accents.

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Speaker 2: That's a good point.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, hunt for Red October Scottish accent.

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Speaker 2: Well, I was just on a podcast and we were

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talking about this the other day, and we were it

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was funny because it's like all of those big time

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A listers that reach a certain level, you know, they

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pretty much just play themselves over and over, and some

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of them even joke about it, like like Jack Nicholson,

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you know, he just always plays Jack Nicholson.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: Al Pacino was always al Pacino. Robert and Narrow is

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always Robert in Niro.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, there's a there's a little comedy show here

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that ran for a few years called Stella Street here

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in the UK. It's a cult thing. Almost no one's

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ever heard of it, but it involves a lot of

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movie stars who all live together on the same Street,

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and it's it's totally unlikely because it's a mixture of

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Hollywood people. I mean, Jack Nicholson lives there, Al Pacino

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lives there, Joe Peshi lives there, but even Michael Kane

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lives there, Roger Murr lives there, and they're all they're

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all next door neighbors. And on the shop on the corner,

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the seven eleven is run by Mick and Keith from

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the Rolling Stones, and it's.

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Speaker 2: Just it's a great idea. I don't know why that

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didn't work.

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Speaker 1: It's as well, it's just I just think it was

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just too too weird for people. But anyway that they

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take the piss out of Jack Nicholson in that one,

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because he keeps getting these new rules and he's always

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trying out for them, you know, see what the other

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guys on the street think of it. At one point

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he actually gets a job as a Scottish detective, you know,

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detective based up in Glasgow Capital or not Captain Tucker

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in Scotland. And at one point and he's saying to

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like he say, He's saying to whoever it is, Dustin Hoffman,

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He's trying and saying, I've just taken on a role

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as a hard nosed cop from Glascow. That's the voice

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he's gonna do, you know, let me let me.

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Speaker 2: I gotta do my jack.

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Speaker 1: Well, yeah, yeah, please do if you could, if you

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could say, hey, do your jack and try saying that

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you're a hard nursed cop from Glasgow.

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Speaker 2: A right, let me do my jack line first, and

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then I'll try that line. I gotta warm up.

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Speaker 1: Okay.

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Speaker 2: Well, my wife Wendy's a confirmed horror film fanatic. Was

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that any good?

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Speaker 1: That's pretty good? Better than I can do for sure.

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Speaker 2: And so what's the line, I'm a hard.

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Speaker 1: Nursed cop from Glasgow.

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Speaker 2: Well, I am a hard nosed cop from Glasgow.

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Speaker 1: Perfect, So anyway Connory Connory, Yeah, So it's like Scottish

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accent all away, and he's star of Zardal's Fizzardoza mckello,

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which is not really how he sounds, but that's if

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you take it to an extreme Scottish accent, that's what

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you end up with. Zardals. I'm going to get you

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to give listeners your take on that movie in just

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a second. But it's interesting for a number of reasons,

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not only because Connery was playing something clearly that he

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had no need to do. I'm not quite sure what

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appealed to him about the idea, but he went with

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it anyway. And after the success of Deliverance, it seems

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to me that director John Berman was basically given Kurt

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Blanche by the studio to say, Okay, that was a

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big success. You can just do some insane project that

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you've been ad up your sleeve for a while.

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Speaker 2: Well, the tagline is funny, it's beyond nineteen eighty four,

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beyond two thousand and one, It's beyond love and death.

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So you get the Nietzschean themes of two thousand and

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one that are pretty overt with you know, the Wagner

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piece that Kuber played, and then the idea, you know,

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Bowman kind of transcending limitations of time and space, which

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was my analysis of two thousand and one, and here

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we're trying to go for something even beyond that, and

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you know it's going to have the dystopian themes, as

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the tagline says, with nineteen eighty four, but you know

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what everyone remembers as Sean Connery and underwear. But the

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odd thing is that there this movie is really deep.

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I mean, it's got a lot of symbolism. It's just

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packed with all these Masonic and esoteric themes. And I

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think the first thing that comes to mind in regard

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to what you said is Sean Connery seems to have

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a penchant for roles related to Masonry. Now I don't

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know for certain what his you know, Like I said,

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I don't know his background. I don't know a whole

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lot about him personally, but you know, he chose the

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man who would be king, I think probably because of

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that Masonic theme where he plays this con man basically

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who's you know, portraying himself as the reincarnation of Alexander

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the Great. And this is to fool a whole bunch

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of these sort of primitive people, and Himalayas are somewhere,

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and by extension, you know, Michael Kaine's there and they're

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they're both going to live as kings, you know, in

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a more primitive existence and so forth, and this it

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doesn't work, and then they get basically run out of

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the the village and h But it's very very Masonic.

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And of course Kipling's story would have all that Masonic

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imagery and thematic elements for a reason, because I'm sure

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he was you know, tied into that, and in my view,

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you know, there's a lot of scholarship that's been done

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on masonry as kind of the outpost of the British

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Empire that that the the lodges kind of function as

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these networks for you know, spying on people and transferring

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secrets and so anywhere that the Empire would extend, you

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would have you know, the British lodge system set up.

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So that's kind of what I think is in the

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movie with men who would be king, and so you'll

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see Connery a lot of times taking those kinds of

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roles and he's very much in a Masonic role here.

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You know, there's a memorable image from the movie where

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he finds that magic ring. It's kind of like a

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a futuristic ring version of the Eye Watch where he

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can you know, have access to basically the Internet is

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what he's accessing here in the movie. But you know

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it displays this image of an eye on his head,

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you know, this all seeing eye on the on his

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third eye. So yeah, again this is this movie is

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replete with all this kind of stuff. But what we

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have is a future dystopia with these roving bands of

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tribes we see at the beginning, and it's very bizarre.

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As you said, they they talk about their guns as

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if they're phallic. I'm not sure why that part is

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in there. I think I may have left that the

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analysis because I didn't really understand what they were getting at.

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But basically, they're they're breeding is controlled, and there's this

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immortal class of persons who flies around in these giant

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heads and they present themselves as gods and so zed.

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The The Sean Connery character sort of figures out that

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this is a scam and he kills one of the

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quote immortals and then rides back to the compound or

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the Elysian fields, where these immortals live in this very apathetic,

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very blase existence where they don't care about anything and

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everything is because they don't have any pain or sorrow

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or you know that they have every pleasure at their fingertips.

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And what happens is that Sean Connery, as this savage

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you know, kind of invades their eden, their xt state,

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and causes an uproar. He basically fosters a revolution somewhat inadvertently,

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and you know, you would think with a typical kind

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of dystopian film that it would be, Oh, you know,

237
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they cause the revolution and they overthrow the dystopian rulers

238
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and then you know, the good guys are in power.

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But that's not where this film goes. It goes into

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a very very bizarre direction. And then what you learn

241
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I'm going to go ahead and spoil it if you haven't

242
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seen the movie, is that the name of the film

243
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is based on the fact that he rediscovers books because

244
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the elite in this movie have hoarded all the knowledge.

245
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They have basically a giant pyramid that's a big ai

246
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system that allows them not just to control their environment

247
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and the kind of super smart city, they can also

248
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reincarnate or resurrect. So they've they've mastered every possible secret

249
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of nature and you know, it's a lot and have immortality,

250
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but they've learned that immortality in this film's presentation, at least,

251
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you know, it leaves you empty. Once you've had all

252
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the pleasures, there's there's nothing else left for you. So

253
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Zed starts the revolution, and what happens is that it

254
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is in a way successful, and some of the gods

255
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kind of join him in the revolution. They end up

256
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all killing each other. So this again The Nietzschean theme

257
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is very prominent here because I think, you know, Nietzsche

258
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would say things like, the elite, you have these cycles

259
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in history. It's a very cyclical presentation in this film

260
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Eternal Return and so forth. And the reason that the

261
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power structures collapse is because they insulate themselves from the

262
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rest of the world. You know that we've all heard

263
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this about elites throughout history with you know, Chinese emperors

264
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couldn't walk on the ground. They would have people carry

265
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them around on poles and stilts, and they would bind

266
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the women's feet because women and weren't supposed to walk

267
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around the elite, you know, women weren't supposed to walk

268
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all this weird stuff that they come up with. And

269
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what happens is when you get really insular like that

270
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and there's all this incest and inbreeding, you know, like

271
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amongst the British elite, you end up detached. And Nietzsche

272
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argues that that detachment from the real world actually ends

273
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up being the destruction of the elite, which is an

274
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interesting thesis, and I think that's kind of what's going

275
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on here in Borman's film, because the revolution is successful,

276
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but instead of adopting you know, the technology of immortality.

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They kind of destroy it, they get rid of it,

278
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and you're left at the end of film with this

279
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kind of oral buro scenario of the you know, the

280
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snake eating its own tail, because Z and his wife

281
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are kind of halfway pictured as Adam and Eve, and

282
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so you're kind of left with the idea, oh, maybe

283
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this is you know, just the whole cycle of all

284
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of the history of mankind being represented, and you know,

285
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maybe and maybe what I'm not saying this is absolutely true,

286
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but I'm saying that the film is kind of proposing

287
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the thesis of you know, maybe we think about elites

288
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gaining you know, transhumanist abilities and all this kind of stuff,

289
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and then and then maybe one day it collapses and

290
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then it all just starts over again and we're right

291
00:15:26,799 --> 00:15:28,399
back to Adam and Eve. And so I thought that

292
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was kind of interesting. That was a that was kind

293
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of the message of the New Battlestar Galactica if you

294
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saw that, if you saw the the end of the series,

295
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was that, you know, you're thinking the whole time that

296
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this is going on in the future, and then you realize, oh,

297
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this is actually starts the end of the series. Is

298
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Adam and Eve more or less, so, you know, alternate

299
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theories of origins that kind of ties in the Greek mythology,

300
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you know, the mists of the gods. That was my

301
00:15:55,600 --> 00:15:58,639
take on Zardas. What about you, well, I.

302
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Speaker 1: Mean, I think you pretty much sum up most of

303
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my thoughts. But the general take away from me elites

304
00:16:03,799 --> 00:16:06,840
will become detached from reality and this will be their destruction.

305
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And that mirrored other dystopian sci fi that I had

306
00:16:09,679 --> 00:16:12,039
watched and read, and then I started to see that,

307
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you know, in the real world, you know, looking at

308
00:16:14,159 --> 00:16:17,440
developments and technology they're actually happening, and then looking back

309
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to some of this predictive sci fi. And I think

310
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you mentioned the word transhumanism. I think that's very much

311
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where we're headed. And I think for me that Zed

312
00:16:26,519 --> 00:16:28,879
in Zardo's it's a little bit like sort John the

313
00:16:28,919 --> 00:16:32,080
Savage type character and breeding New World. Yeah, it's kind

314
00:16:32,080 --> 00:16:35,159
of you see in Zardo's the react they kind of

315
00:16:35,159 --> 00:16:37,559
the fascination that they have with Zed this character and

316
00:16:37,639 --> 00:16:40,679
put it it's the animal nature of man that they

317
00:16:40,759 --> 00:16:41,799
have left behind.

318
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Speaker 2: That that's a good point, right.

319
00:16:43,120 --> 00:16:45,480
Speaker 1: The elite in the Tabernacle have and they're fascinated by

320
00:16:45,519 --> 00:16:49,240
his vitality and by his violence. I mean, you know,

321
00:16:49,279 --> 00:16:51,600
they're kind of shocked, you know, they they've become so

322
00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:54,840
detached from, as you say, the real world are basic

323
00:16:54,960 --> 00:16:59,639
nature that the idea of like killing someone, fucking someone

324
00:16:59,879 --> 00:17:03,480
or or you know, or eating something or you know,

325
00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:05,480
taking a shit or whatever. It's all just kind of

326
00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:07,680
you know, but it's kind of strange for them. It's

327
00:17:07,720 --> 00:17:10,039
come running almost full circle, and they're like, oh my god.

328
00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:12,799
You know, for me, it was kind of about balance

329
00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:15,839
because it's like you saw the world that the brutals

330
00:17:15,839 --> 00:17:19,039
as they're called in Zardo's living. It's this post apocalyptic

331
00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:23,079
kind of wasteland. Yeah, but so's social class that he's

332
00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:26,799
part of is a classic middle of a hierarchy type thing,

333
00:17:26,920 --> 00:17:30,079
like an enforcer kind of rule, not really like police,

334
00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:32,039
but they kind of sit between the elite and the

335
00:17:33,039 --> 00:17:35,039
masses at the bottom of the pyramid, and that we

336
00:17:35,119 --> 00:17:38,200
see that very much in our society. So they're almost

337
00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:42,200
slightly privileged. Zed's kind of exterminator class. You see the

338
00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:43,799
way some of the brutals live and it's not a

339
00:17:43,799 --> 00:17:45,400
lot of fun, But then you see the way the

340
00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:48,279
elites live, and you kind of think, well, in some

341
00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:51,519
ways Zed and his cohorts kind of have it good,

342
00:17:51,759 --> 00:17:55,000
and for me things get worse. Things are already bad

343
00:17:55,039 --> 00:17:57,720
for the brutals, things are get worse for the elite.

344
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And it's actually Zed in this kind of like in

345
00:18:00,599 --> 00:18:03,839
his moments of nosis kind of coming to understanding. He

346
00:18:03,960 --> 00:18:07,119
gains in power throughout the film, and you can see

347
00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:09,599
him kind of like taking control. So the end, as

348
00:18:09,599 --> 00:18:11,519
you say, which is kind of like almost as Adam

349
00:18:11,559 --> 00:18:13,799
and Eve type wrap it up and start again thing.

350
00:18:14,279 --> 00:18:15,839
You can read that any way you want. You can

351
00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:17,519
read it as like, oh, here we go again. But

352
00:18:17,559 --> 00:18:19,680
for me it was kind of like, well, it's another

353
00:18:19,839 --> 00:18:22,359
chance we don't you know, the future isn't written yet.

354
00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:24,359
At the end of it, I kind of thought, yeah,

355
00:18:24,400 --> 00:18:26,640
you know, well done from Zand.

356
00:18:26,839 --> 00:18:29,480
Speaker 2: That's a good point. Yeah. And I forgot to mention

357
00:18:29,599 --> 00:18:33,599
too that the Tzard Eyes, of course Wizard of Oz

358
00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:36,480
is what you realize it's based on, because he finds

359
00:18:36,519 --> 00:18:39,039
that book that was kind of hidden away or forgotten,

360
00:18:40,079 --> 00:18:42,319
and you know, he's kind of figuring out language and

361
00:18:42,680 --> 00:18:48,200
he realizes that the elite basically just mastered technology, you know,

362
00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:53,240
gnosis or knowledge. That's why they're flying around in heads,

363
00:18:53,559 --> 00:18:56,599
because where's the source of knowledge. It's the head. That's

364
00:18:56,599 --> 00:18:58,000
actually a thing that comes up in a lot of

365
00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:01,400
films too, by the way, with like very Baron von Munchausen.

366
00:19:01,440 --> 00:19:04,799
There's that planet where you know, Robin Williams's head is

367
00:19:04,839 --> 00:19:07,440
just floating around and he has no understanding of the body.

368
00:19:07,519 --> 00:19:09,400
And that's that's kind of what you're getting at that

369
00:19:09,960 --> 00:19:12,839
the bodily desires have kind of been discarded because the

370
00:19:12,880 --> 00:19:16,680
elite perspective was that the body was the problem and

371
00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:18,640
we've got to transcend that and if we can just

372
00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:22,799
transcend that, will we'll be free, will be if you know,

373
00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:26,519
we won't have those problems anymore. But they've forgotten and

374
00:19:27,319 --> 00:19:31,799
as you said, they're mystified by his brutal nature. And

375
00:19:31,839 --> 00:19:34,480
then that's why you get these guys who are kind

376
00:19:34,519 --> 00:19:37,200
of like that that one guy, he's got the head dress.

377
00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:40,039
They look like a sphinx, which is interesting because so

378
00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:43,279
they have this kind of Egyptian aesthetic to them where

379
00:19:43,279 --> 00:19:49,640
they literally look like, you know, the sphinx statue, and

380
00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:53,440
it harkens back to you know, Egyptology, and that's why

381
00:19:53,440 --> 00:19:58,039
they're tabernacle. The Ai thing is this big pyramid, And

382
00:19:59,079 --> 00:20:03,519
the irony you said is that I think part of

383
00:20:03,559 --> 00:20:07,920
it is showing that the class warfare doesn't really get

384
00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:10,319
you what you want, because it's all predicated on the

385
00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:13,319
idea of, oh, if I can rise up in the ranks,

386
00:20:13,319 --> 00:20:16,519
if I can overthrow the people above me, if I

387
00:20:16,559 --> 00:20:19,240
could just have access to what they've got, then I'll

388
00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:21,279
be happy. And then what you find out is that

389
00:20:21,759 --> 00:20:24,799
every time you, you know, if you've got a million dollars,

390
00:20:24,799 --> 00:20:27,359
and then you attain a billion dollars, you basically just

391
00:20:28,599 --> 00:20:32,599
inherit a whole other level of problems. So you're right

392
00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:36,400
in many ways, Z's middle class I guess you could

393
00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:39,680
say middle to lower class existence actually had a lot

394
00:20:39,680 --> 00:20:43,640
of positives, and there are a lot of negatives that

395
00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:45,720
would have come along with him trying to kind of

396
00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:49,519
move into the status of the elite, and it just

397
00:20:49,559 --> 00:20:52,799
doesn't work. And I'm not necessarily trying to say that

398
00:20:52,839 --> 00:20:55,640
everything about class systems or class systems is good. I'm

399
00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:59,279
just saying that that's kind of an interesting argument you

400
00:20:59,279 --> 00:21:02,880
could make from the is that, you know, do we

401
00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:06,160
really get anything better when the revolutions come? And I

402
00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:09,160
think if you look at something like the French Revolution. No,

403
00:21:09,319 --> 00:21:11,680
I don't think so, just real quick in adendum, and

404
00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:14,559
it's on my mind because we covered it in the

405
00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:17,319
show that I did. We did an episode on Christopher

406
00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:21,119
Nolan's Batman trilogy, which has its pros and its cons,

407
00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:23,480
but one of the interesting themes at the end of

408
00:21:24,279 --> 00:21:28,480
the trilogy was that when Bain tries to initiate his revolution,

409
00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:32,400
and you can look at Bain as kind of the

410
00:21:32,519 --> 00:21:37,480
anarcho syndicalist character, the the nightmare that arises out of

411
00:21:37,480 --> 00:21:39,359
the you know, far East. You know, we don't know,

412
00:21:39,440 --> 00:21:42,200
we don't understand this guy, and he's got a thing

413
00:21:42,279 --> 00:21:46,960
on his face that makes them dog very weird. And

414
00:21:46,440 --> 00:21:49,920
he institutes his revolution and it ends up worse. And

415
00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:52,720
then you have this imagery with you know, Killian Murphy

416
00:21:52,839 --> 00:21:55,359
is sitting atop this giant stack of books and he's

417
00:21:55,400 --> 00:22:00,039
basically deciding who's loses their head and who doesn't. And

418
00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:02,839
you know, it's very Robespierre. It looks just like you know,

419
00:22:02,960 --> 00:22:06,799
Rosepeer's Committee for Public Safety sitting there kind of just

420
00:22:07,319 --> 00:22:11,359
lopping off heads. And so that the Baine Revolution, you know,

421
00:22:11,839 --> 00:22:17,160
doesn't do anything positive. It basically ruins everything and and

422
00:22:17,200 --> 00:22:19,759
Gotham ends up in a worse state than they were before,

423
00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:23,880
which is a curious message for you know, a big blockbuster,

424
00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:27,640
and I think you're kind of getting a similar idea.

425
00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:30,079
I think you could argue here with with you know,

426
00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:33,759
Z's revolution. In a way, I guess it it's positive

427
00:22:34,400 --> 00:22:36,720
because what does that do well? It basically just goes

428
00:22:36,759 --> 00:22:40,920
back to kind of a you know, an earthy, living

429
00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:43,640
in nature kind of existence. You know, he's living in

430
00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:46,440
a cave and they basically just accept death. Yeah.

431
00:22:46,599 --> 00:22:49,319
Speaker 1: I'm not entirely sure of director John Burman's motives and

432
00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:51,400
making the film, but certainly what you could take away

433
00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:54,200
from it the message we've been talking about. It's interesting

434
00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:56,400
that we get so much stuff fed to a snow

435
00:22:56,440 --> 00:23:00,839
coming down from above, and let's remind people if they

436
00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:03,200
even if they haven't listened to the first two parts

437
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:04,920
that we did a lot of what you're talking about

438
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:06,359
in the book is just what the title of the

439
00:23:06,359 --> 00:23:09,000
book says. You're looking at, you know, symbolism and these

440
00:23:09,079 --> 00:23:12,759
hidden meanings and what agendas might be being furthered by this.

441
00:23:13,279 --> 00:23:15,960
You look at the connections between the CIA and Hollywood

442
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:18,559
and propaganda. So we're talking about messages coming to us

443
00:23:18,599 --> 00:23:22,880
here witting, unwittingly, or deliberately. But my point is we

444
00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:27,480
get so many messages these days about elites, about transhumanism,

445
00:23:27,559 --> 00:23:30,839
about the development of technology, about the Bill Gates and

446
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:33,119
the Elon Musks of this world, and about how this

447
00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:34,079
reminded me.

448
00:23:34,079 --> 00:23:36,119
Speaker 2: I just want to make one quick point for sure,

449
00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:38,519
to get sure is that they have a breakaway civilization.

450
00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:40,799
I forget about that. Yeah, that the elites in the

451
00:23:40,799 --> 00:23:43,319
film The Immortals have this It's like a hidden behind

452
00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:46,480
a hologram you and this giant sort of invisible force

453
00:23:46,519 --> 00:23:51,279
field type thing that wards out all the savages for

454
00:23:51,359 --> 00:23:55,680
their Elysian fields. And then that's interesting because, as you mentioned,

455
00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:57,720
Bill Geyser made me think of it, and Elon Musk,

456
00:23:57,759 --> 00:24:00,319
you know, these are the guys who talk about literally

457
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:01,920
creating a breakaway civilization.

458
00:24:02,799 --> 00:24:05,079
Speaker 1: Yeah. But all the while, a lot of the stuff

459
00:24:05,079 --> 00:24:06,640
that's coming down to us is that this is going

460
00:24:06,720 --> 00:24:08,200
to be a good thing and we're all going to

461
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:09,440
get to take part as well.

462
00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:11,359
Speaker 2: Oh yeah right, yeah.

463
00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:14,039
Speaker 1: But strangely, and a lot of the films that kind

464
00:24:14,039 --> 00:24:16,319
of on one level look like pure propaganda. I mean,

465
00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:18,559
a lot of people have probably seen the relatively recent

466
00:24:18,599 --> 00:24:22,279
film Elysium. The message, the message really, no matter what

467
00:24:22,359 --> 00:24:24,799
the intention of the director is or the writers, the

468
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:27,839
message is kind of like that, exactly the same wizardos

469
00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:31,480
that elites will end up becoming detached from reality and

470
00:24:31,519 --> 00:24:33,640
it'll just they'll destroy themselves. So it's like, no matter

471
00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:36,640
what the benefits are of all this this technical utopian stuff,

472
00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:38,519
it kind of ends up in a bad place. And

473
00:24:38,599 --> 00:24:41,319
that was a common message in dystill being sci fi

474
00:24:41,319 --> 00:24:43,799
in the seventies, but even today when when they try

475
00:24:43,839 --> 00:24:46,599
and spin something that we're all, oh, yes, I can't

476
00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:48,519
wait to dump my body, you know, and I can't

477
00:24:48,519 --> 00:24:50,200
wait till like my brain is, you know, in a

478
00:24:50,319 --> 00:24:52,319
jar of pickling vinegar or whatever. You know, I just

479
00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:54,119
want to know. I want to live for a thousand years,

480
00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:56,799
ten thousand years. Why not? You know that these stories

481
00:24:56,799 --> 00:24:59,720
of films, the books, whatever it happens to be, they

482
00:24:59,799 --> 00:25:02,440
end not kind of giving the same message, which it

483
00:25:02,519 --> 00:25:05,079
ultimately is negative. But yet and all that, the the

484
00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,480
barrage of this stuff continues a pace, doesn't it, really,

485
00:25:08,519 --> 00:25:12,559
Because whether it's Ted Talks or whether it's endless propaganda

486
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:16,039
about saving the environment or whatever it happens to be,

487
00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:17,759
you know through all these you know, like all the

488
00:25:17,839 --> 00:25:21,359
latest technology, driverless cars, on and on and on. This

489
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:25,759
is incessant, but it never seems to the propaganda never

490
00:25:25,799 --> 00:25:30,079
seems to at a deep level anyway completely satisfy people

491
00:25:30,519 --> 00:25:33,359
or completely do away with their concerns. And I think that,

492
00:25:33,599 --> 00:25:37,680
as you saw in Zardal's there's a visceral animal part

493
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:41,160
of our nature that we never completely lose touch with,

494
00:25:41,319 --> 00:25:43,559
and I think we do so at our peril because

495
00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:46,200
like you and I are not running around, you know,

496
00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:48,079
having to fight with our bare hands every day to

497
00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:50,039
defend ourselves. We're not having to kill with their bare

498
00:25:50,079 --> 00:25:52,400
hands in order to eat. We're not having to secure

499
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:55,839
a mate by doing by killing and you know, clubbing

500
00:25:55,839 --> 00:25:58,960
another guy over the head and taking his woman or whatever.

501
00:25:59,759 --> 00:26:02,200
But there's still a point you can get where you

502
00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:04,960
become detached from any of that stuff and you lose

503
00:26:05,519 --> 00:26:08,200
a lot of what it is to be human. For me,

504
00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:11,240
my gut instinct is that something that's really that must

505
00:26:11,279 --> 00:26:13,400
not be allowed to happen. And I know that that

506
00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:16,000
I had gotten into arguments and discussions with people are

507
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:17,440
just saying, oh, you know, why on earth would you

508
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:19,400
want to hold onto this if we could have the

509
00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:23,039
following and maybe I'll be proven wrong, but something in me,

510
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:27,519
the transhumanist agenda taken as a whole, just generically what

511
00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:31,119
it basically is about. To me, this must be resisted

512
00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:33,400
with every favor of my being. That's my instinct.

513
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:38,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean the message of the film is that

514
00:26:39,039 --> 00:26:43,440
you can't really get away from human nature and that

515
00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:47,519
you know that includes all those faculties and passions that

516
00:26:47,599 --> 00:26:53,680
you listed there and more and propensities and drives, and

517
00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:56,559
there's a kind of dialectical tension at work here that

518
00:26:57,359 --> 00:27:01,720
you know, are we going to see the body is

519
00:27:01,839 --> 00:27:04,920
bad in a kind of Plato neopolatonic sense, something that

520
00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:09,960
we need to flee from, to download our minds into

521
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:12,599
some sort of central AI grid, which I don't think

522
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:14,160
is ever going to happen. I think that's a bunch

523
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:20,000
of nonsense and a that's the scam of transhumanism because

524
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:23,279
it's all predicated on naturalistic materialism, you know, the idea

525
00:27:23,319 --> 00:27:26,240
that you don't actually have a soul or a spirit

526
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:28,279
or a pecul or a noose, and that it's just

527
00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:31,039
basically all just the chemical reactions. And so you'll actually

528
00:27:31,079 --> 00:27:34,039
see the transhumanists like you mentioned the Ted Talks, and

529
00:27:34,079 --> 00:27:36,079
if you watch any of these big billionaires that are

530
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:39,799
into transhumanism, and some of them are actually transgenders, and

531
00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:41,720
they try to I'm not joking, they try to create

532
00:27:41,759 --> 00:27:49,200
these bots that they think are copies of their lovers.

533
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:51,160
I forget the name of this one. It's like there's

534
00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:55,759
there's like a black woman bought that this transgender billionaire

535
00:27:55,759 --> 00:27:58,839
has tried to create. And the argument is that, oh,

536
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:02,720
it actually is my black woman lover because it has

537
00:28:02,759 --> 00:28:05,640
her voice and she has recorded a lot of her

538
00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:08,920
life and memories, and so therefore it's her. And that's

539
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:13,640
again all based on this ridiculous naturalistic presubsition that see

540
00:28:14,079 --> 00:28:17,039
that you're just the chemical reactions that you know occur

541
00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:19,599
in your brain. There's nothing more. And so I guess

542
00:28:19,599 --> 00:28:23,359
by extension, if that's the case, then you know, if

543
00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:27,480
you're playing a YouTube video of me talking about Bill Cosby,

544
00:28:28,039 --> 00:28:32,960
then that's the same as me, yes, which is really stupid,

545
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:34,920
but I mean that's literally what they try to push.

546
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:37,000
And I've seen Ted Talk people try to push that

547
00:28:37,039 --> 00:28:37,480
same thing.

548
00:28:37,799 --> 00:28:39,920
Speaker 1: But I've got into heated discussions with people of this.

549
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,720
I'm talking about technical utopians eagerly quite often without actually

550
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:45,920
any expert knowledge in the area. But you know, they've

551
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:48,160
read a lot of articles, watched a lot of Ted talks.

552
00:28:48,839 --> 00:28:52,720
They're passionate about that some of these transhumanist ideas should

553
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:56,119
come to pass. They'd be a good thing. Initially, More importantly,

554
00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:58,000
they think it can be done. It's just a matter

555
00:28:58,039 --> 00:28:59,839
of time. Everything's just a matter of time. Look how

556
00:29:00,279 --> 00:29:03,640
we've come, they say, you know, and I'll say them, okay,

557
00:29:03,720 --> 00:29:05,680
you know, we're joining to the end of our discussion,

558
00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:07,920
or actually I'm just bored now, so I'm going to

559
00:29:08,039 --> 00:29:09,799
end it. But I'll say something like, okay, okay, okay,

560
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:11,039
let's just cut to the chase.

561
00:29:11,079 --> 00:29:11,240
Speaker 2: Here.

562
00:29:11,559 --> 00:29:13,039
Speaker 1: Make a bet with me. Now, if we're going to

563
00:29:13,079 --> 00:29:14,720
make a meaningful bet, we've got to have a sort

564
00:29:14,759 --> 00:29:16,839
of a time frame, and we've got to have something

565
00:29:17,079 --> 00:29:19,920
easily measurable. If it's like a horse race, you bet

566
00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:21,559
on the horse. Either the horse wins the race or

567
00:29:21,559 --> 00:29:23,720
it doesn't. If it's a photo finish, they sort it out.

568
00:29:23,759 --> 00:29:26,400
That's fine. But they make a decision. So I'll say

569
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:29,400
something like, let's choose one of these developments you're talking about,

570
00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:32,440
and Elon Musk saying that about twenty thirty, it will

571
00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:35,079
be darn ray. Kurtzfeiler said, by twenty thirty, this will happen.

572
00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:38,160
Elon Musk says, yeah, that's doable. Blah blah. Set a

573
00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:39,480
date with me. Now we're gonna have to wait a

574
00:29:39,519 --> 00:29:41,960
few year. Set a date with me, and you tell

575
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:44,319
me the amount, and you're going to say, this could

576
00:29:44,319 --> 00:29:46,400
be done and this will happen. Tell me how much

577
00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:48,880
money you want a stake, and I'll go for it,

578
00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:51,599
because it's a question. The question you have to ask

579
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:54,039
yourself if you're betting on this is how much can

580
00:29:54,079 --> 00:29:56,720
I afford to lose? Because that's how confident I am.

581
00:29:56,759 --> 00:29:58,799
And do you know what, maybe people have just thought

582
00:29:58,799 --> 00:30:02,440
I wasn't serious. People get quite defensive, they get quite angry,

583
00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:05,119
and they will not even consider entering into a bet

584
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:06,759
with me. I've said, we can do a contract if

585
00:30:06,759 --> 00:30:08,440
you want, we can get this witness, we can make

586
00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:11,279
this legal, we make it enforceable law. And then well

587
00:30:11,319 --> 00:30:13,079
that doesn't work, I say, okay, let's just take it

588
00:30:13,119 --> 00:30:15,480
down and notes. Let's say something that you're convinced is

589
00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:17,240
going to be happening in the next five years, and

590
00:30:17,319 --> 00:30:20,599
let's have an amount of money that's substantial, but it's

591
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:23,960
not going to ruin us tenos well that works whatever,

592
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:25,799
you know, and they will not go for it, and

593
00:30:25,799 --> 00:30:28,720
they get really angry if I try and say, give

594
00:30:28,759 --> 00:30:31,880
me something, give me this, because it's measurable, it's actionable,

595
00:30:32,119 --> 00:30:35,480
and if you're so confident, what's the problem exactly?

596
00:30:35,559 --> 00:30:37,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, I mean, I don't think we have to

597
00:30:37,200 --> 00:30:41,440
be a luddite or a total transhumanist. It's a false dichotomy.

598
00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:45,039
I think if you look at the last few Builderberg

599
00:30:45,119 --> 00:30:49,640
meetings and you know the heads of Google and people

600
00:30:49,640 --> 00:30:52,319
from Apple, and what they're talking about is coming. They

601
00:30:53,079 --> 00:30:56,559
really want to push the body mod and modifications and

602
00:30:56,599 --> 00:31:00,240
all that kind of stuff in terms of the tech realm.

603
00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:03,680
And you know, Regina Dugan, who was formerly at DARPA

604
00:31:03,799 --> 00:31:06,200
now at Google, was at Builderberg Google last year, I

605
00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:09,079
think talking about this, and and you know that I

606
00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:10,880
watch is kind of a step in that direction. Now.

607
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:13,279
I I'm not saying anything wrong with an eyewatch, obviously

608
00:31:13,279 --> 00:31:15,279
it's that would be stupid. But what I'm saying is

609
00:31:15,319 --> 00:31:18,519
that they're going to, I think, to try to find

610
00:31:18,559 --> 00:31:22,000
ways to integrate this into the actual body of the

611
00:31:22,079 --> 00:31:25,440
human and that is the predicted programming that we've been

612
00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:28,279
seeing for so long, all the way back to Ship,

613
00:31:28,319 --> 00:31:30,880
all the way back to probably Logan's run. I mean,

614
00:31:31,119 --> 00:31:33,559
you know there's that scene where he kind of sitting

615
00:31:33,599 --> 00:31:36,000
in that chair and they're doing some kind of like

616
00:31:36,039 --> 00:31:38,920
mind control thing on him, and then you know, you

617
00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:41,400
think about the Matrix and jacking in and I just

618
00:31:41,440 --> 00:31:44,400
saw a Ghost in the Shell recently, and that has

619
00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:47,039
the same theme. Actually that came out before the Matrix

620
00:31:47,079 --> 00:31:52,079
in its cartoon form, uh, And that's all based on

621
00:31:52,559 --> 00:31:54,480
all the exact same stuff. And I was kind of

622
00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:57,680
blown away actually at the level of transhumanism that was

623
00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:01,039
in Ghost in the Shell wasn't as successful, I don't

624
00:32:01,039 --> 00:32:03,400
think as they hoped it would be. But when you

625
00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:06,440
watch that movie, and again it's a mediocre movie, but

626
00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:10,200
Scarlet Johansson really has this penchant, I guess for these

627
00:32:10,240 --> 00:32:15,200
transhumanist movies like Lucy where she's you know, turned into

628
00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:19,119
some sort of cyborg goddess of some kind. But it's

629
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:22,880
a scam because if you here's a funny thing. Even

630
00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:26,000
Ray Kurtzwell, I heard him do a talk where he

631
00:32:26,119 --> 00:32:31,000
was saying, actually a lot of people who think about

632
00:32:31,039 --> 00:32:34,240
transhumanism or the like the idea of downloading your mind

633
00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:37,400
to a computer. He's like, that might happen one day

634
00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:41,079
millennia away. But he's like, if you think about it,

635
00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:43,720
this was a I couldn't believe you said this. He said,

636
00:32:43,759 --> 00:32:51,799
the human body is actually a very proficient machine. And

637
00:32:51,839 --> 00:32:54,640
he said, you know what, actually, if we were to

638
00:32:55,839 --> 00:33:01,720
try to really initiate transhumanist he's like, it's not going

639
00:33:01,799 --> 00:33:05,640
to be where you put your brain into some hard drive.

640
00:33:05,759 --> 00:33:09,599
It's more like, how can we enhance the existing system

641
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:11,799
or create a copy of the existing system, And that

642
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:15,119
kind of I was like, oh wow, So what's ironic here?

643
00:33:15,799 --> 00:33:18,920
Is that the idea. I'm not joking about this, you

644
00:33:18,920 --> 00:33:21,440
can this is a theory I have. I think that

645
00:33:21,519 --> 00:33:28,279
a lot of the transhumanist elite that they actually kind

646
00:33:28,279 --> 00:33:31,839
of want to mimic Christianity. Believe it or not, you say, well,

647
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:34,359
that's crazy. They hate Christianity, think it's a joke. Well,

648
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:36,880
I think on the surface they do. But when you

649
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:39,240
see Ray Kirtsvell say stuff like that, like, oh, actually,

650
00:33:39,279 --> 00:33:41,640
the human body is a really good machine for what

651
00:33:42,279 --> 00:33:45,440
it for what it does, and maybe we should actually

652
00:33:45,759 --> 00:33:49,039
construct some kind of machine like that. And then and

653
00:33:49,079 --> 00:33:53,599
then you watch Avengers Age of Ultron and the Paul

654
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:55,920
Bettany character. I don't remember what that. I'm not a

655
00:33:55,920 --> 00:34:00,880
big superhero person now that I'm an adult. All the

656
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,079
all the guys in America are like still into this,

657
00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:05,519
you know, comic book shit when they're like forty, it's

658
00:34:05,559 --> 00:34:08,360
kind of ridiculous. But that Paul Bettany character is some

659
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:11,559
kind of I forget his name, like the Mystery I

660
00:34:11,599 --> 00:34:13,679
think it's his name or something stupid like that. But

661
00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:20,400
he is a like a resurrected kind of body. It's

662
00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:23,159
like he's a he's the he is the transhumanist character

663
00:34:23,199 --> 00:34:25,880
in the film, and he's like, you know, he's he's

664
00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:29,840
got a body that has all these capabilities beyond you know,

665
00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:32,960
whatever the former human body had or whatever. And that's

666
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:34,960
actually what Ray Kurzwell says. He's like, he's like, yeah,

667
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:37,800
we need to just fix the existing system and turn

668
00:34:38,159 --> 00:34:40,320
it into something. He's like, because look, if you think

669
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:44,159
about it, you know, the human mind is constructed such

670
00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:48,440
that it it has a focus on one thing at

671
00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:51,400
one time, Like you know, if you're looking at I'm

672
00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:53,679
looking at a Mad magazine cover right now in my

673
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:57,159
in my living room, like I'm not looking at the

674
00:34:57,199 --> 00:34:59,639
backyard at the same time. And he's making the argument

675
00:34:59,719 --> 00:35:03,119
that you can only really focus on one thing at

676
00:35:03,119 --> 00:35:05,800
one time. He's like, so, there's not really a way

677
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:11,840
for the human person simply because it is a finite

678
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:18,000
subject to have like ten different vantage points. You know,

679
00:35:18,039 --> 00:35:21,639
we're not going to have a bug eye that allows

680
00:35:21,719 --> 00:35:24,840
us to see, you know, like a fly does, like

681
00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:27,239
like Jeff Goldblum in the Fly or so where he

682
00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,320
can see you know, twenty different or a thousand. However

683
00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:34,119
many eyes bugs have, you know, a thousand different vantage

684
00:35:34,159 --> 00:35:38,360
points or whatever. He's like, that's that's very extremely complex,

685
00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:41,480
and it would be very difficult to you know, rewire

686
00:35:41,599 --> 00:35:47,639
the human brain to try to incorporate something even as

687
00:35:47,639 --> 00:35:52,199
simple as you know, the different vantage points that a

688
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:55,599
bug has something like that. So and when you think

689
00:35:55,599 --> 00:35:58,519
about that and you think, oh, yeah, actually that makes

690
00:35:58,519 --> 00:36:00,719
a lot of sense. And so you know, if there

691
00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:02,880
was going to be some kind of transhumanism that they're

692
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:06,360
probably going to try to shoot for something along the

693
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:09,159
lines of a mimicked version of Christianity, believe it or not,

694
00:36:09,199 --> 00:36:11,800
where you have a resurrection and if you know, if

695
00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:14,559
you read the Gospel of John I'm not saying this

696
00:36:14,599 --> 00:36:16,360
is true. I'm saying this is I could see how

697
00:36:16,360 --> 00:36:18,440
they would look at it this way, like, oh, you know,

698
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:20,480
you see Jesus at the end of the Gospel of John,

699
00:36:20,519 --> 00:36:24,119
and he's in his same body, but it's resurrected. It's

700
00:36:24,599 --> 00:36:27,199
it's not bound by time and space, it's not mortal.

701
00:36:27,880 --> 00:36:31,000
It has all these properties and characteristics that it's able

702
00:36:31,079 --> 00:36:36,679
to do things that it wasn't doing before the resurrection. Now, obviously,

703
00:36:36,679 --> 00:36:38,480
again I'm not saying they believe in Christianity. I just

704
00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:40,039
wonder if they don't have like a kind of a

705
00:36:41,159 --> 00:36:46,199
covert gnostic alteration of, Hey, why don't we take the

706
00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:49,960
mythology of Christianity and maybe turn it into you know,

707
00:36:50,000 --> 00:36:53,119
like a technological version and you know, something like out

708
00:36:53,159 --> 00:36:55,320
of Avengers, Age of Ultron. I mean, that's kind of wacky.

709
00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:56,440
I'm out there speculating.

710
00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:58,880
Speaker 1: But you mentioned Loucan's Roun there, and we're going to

711
00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:01,400
turn to talk about that. But just before I move

712
00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:03,960
on there, you also mentioned lod Eites earlier on and

713
00:37:04,000 --> 00:37:06,519
how that's a false dichotomy between being a Loodite and

714
00:37:06,559 --> 00:37:10,239
being some kind of techno utopian transhumanist, and this is

715
00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:13,039
a theme that comes up some dystopian sci fi. The

716
00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:17,760
transhumanists run the risk of a backlash, a backlash that

717
00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:22,639
actually superficially the likes of you and I might say, well,

718
00:37:22,719 --> 00:37:25,559
you know saw that coming, you had that coming, you

719
00:37:25,679 --> 00:37:28,840
deserve it. But these things quite often go too far,

720
00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:29,960
don't they overshoot?

721
00:37:30,280 --> 00:37:32,800
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, yeah. One quick point they reminded me too,

722
00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:35,880
I meant to say earlier, was these are the people

723
00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:40,039
who are total lying psychopaths. I mean, look at all

724
00:37:40,039 --> 00:37:42,800
of the false flags, look at all of the scams

725
00:37:43,079 --> 00:37:48,440
psyops that they do constantly. How on earth do you

726
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:51,039
think that they're going to tell you the truth when

727
00:37:51,039 --> 00:37:53,480
it comes to techno utopianism.

728
00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:59,119
Speaker 1: They're lying, Yeah, exactly. And my worry is not that

729
00:37:59,199 --> 00:38:01,840
I worry much, but my concern, I guess, would be that,

730
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:04,039
you know, we could get into a situation at some

731
00:38:04,079 --> 00:38:07,360
point down the line where and we've seen this locally,

732
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:09,239
but you know, on a more global scale, is it

733
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:12,880
because some kind of backlash that actually will everybody will

734
00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:15,119
suffer from, no matter what their point of view. And

735
00:38:15,159 --> 00:38:17,800
you and I might be sitting if we live that long,

736
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:20,760
observing this and going, oh man, this is not good.

737
00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:23,000
You know it could have negative effects for us, simply

738
00:38:23,039 --> 00:38:26,920
because it's a reaction that turns into an overreaction, I guess,

739
00:38:27,159 --> 00:38:31,280
to the imposition of this technocratic so called utopia on

740
00:38:31,320 --> 00:38:32,960
the rest of us. I'm thinking one of the most

741
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:36,639
striking stories in amongst the driverless cars kind of crashing

742
00:38:36,679 --> 00:38:41,039
themselves was people. I think it was in San Francisco.

743
00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,000
I don't know if there's one incident. I think it's

744
00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:46,599
probably multiple incidents, but people on the streets wearing Google

745
00:38:46,679 --> 00:38:51,480
glass being attacked because they were wearing Google glass. The

746
00:38:51,599 --> 00:38:54,360
attackers I don't remember. I didn't read any stories in detail,

747
00:38:54,400 --> 00:38:56,559
but there are some kind of motivation. These were not

748
00:38:56,719 --> 00:38:59,119
random attacks, and I suspect.

749
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:00,440
Speaker 2: Yes, I do remember that. That's a good point.

750
00:39:00,559 --> 00:39:03,280
Speaker 1: I think there's something probably quite visceral in that you

751
00:39:03,360 --> 00:39:06,119
may even talk to some of the people who undertook

752
00:39:06,119 --> 00:39:08,320
these attacks and they might not even really nestly be

753
00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:10,920
able to articulate a very clear reason why they did

754
00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:12,719
what they did. I mean, I am, you know, grasping

755
00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:13,480
at strolls here.

756
00:39:13,719 --> 00:39:16,840
Speaker 2: No, no, do you remember Surrogates the Bruce Willis movie.

757
00:39:17,239 --> 00:39:19,280
Speaker 1: I haven't seen it, but I know what it's about.

758
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:24,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, Well, there's that very thing what you're talking about,

759
00:39:24,159 --> 00:39:26,360
because it's near it's a near future thing, and you

760
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:30,639
basically the plot is that you live in this little

761
00:39:31,119 --> 00:39:35,440
where you spend your days in this kind of pod

762
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,840
or something where where you're just kind of laying in

763
00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:42,519
the pod, and your surrogate, which is like this copy

764
00:39:42,639 --> 00:39:45,239
version of you, you know, goes out and does its

765
00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:50,480
daily activities, which is an interesting idea. But in the

766
00:39:50,519 --> 00:39:55,079
movie there's that there's a giant backlash of protests and

767
00:39:55,159 --> 00:40:01,320
activists and people who are opposing transhimitism. That's literally what's

768
00:40:01,360 --> 00:40:04,519
going on in the movie. So you you maybe I

769
00:40:04,599 --> 00:40:06,800
think you're onto something there that, yeah, we might have

770
00:40:06,840 --> 00:40:11,639
a kind of societal breakdown where the you know, people

771
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:15,880
try to initiate a Butlerrian jahad like in the Doone novels.

772
00:40:16,119 --> 00:40:18,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, and funny enough, I was suddenly reminded of a

773
00:40:18,519 --> 00:40:21,599
line popped into my head. They made themselves God, and

774
00:40:21,679 --> 00:40:23,800
now God has forsaken us, and I thought that's John

775
00:40:23,840 --> 00:40:26,119
Berm and then I realized it's actually an it's actually

776
00:40:26,159 --> 00:40:33,159
an excalibur. Interesting, yes, it's the peasants basically not not

777
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:35,000
using that as a derography term, you know, but it's

778
00:40:35,039 --> 00:40:37,800
the people who live on cabbage soup and work the land.

779
00:40:38,239 --> 00:40:40,519
It's a tough existence for them in the dark ages,

780
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:44,000
and they're lashing out against the real Knights, who they

781
00:40:44,159 --> 00:40:48,480
seen have become aloof and detached from reality. And they're

782
00:40:48,519 --> 00:40:51,480
an elite living up there in Camelot and their shiny

783
00:40:51,559 --> 00:40:54,679
armor and their round table and their shiny swords, and

784
00:40:54,719 --> 00:40:56,559
they're living in their own little you.

785
00:40:56,440 --> 00:40:59,079
Speaker 2: Know, metal metal and metal and tech.

786
00:40:59,519 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, basically they've been they've got they've got high

787
00:41:03,039 --> 00:41:04,480
tech compared to the rest of them. And I just

788
00:41:04,519 --> 00:41:08,039
remember one of the as that they undergo their downfall

789
00:41:08,159 --> 00:41:11,760
before their ultimate recovery. That's one of the peasants lashes out.

790
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:14,800
It's I think it's at at Lancelot just talking about

791
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:16,960
the grill mats that they made themselves God, and like

792
00:41:17,079 --> 00:41:20,159
God has forsaken this society. The whole world for them

793
00:41:20,199 --> 00:41:22,400
has just got a whole lot darker as a result

794
00:41:22,440 --> 00:41:25,280
of what they see as the mishandling as the uh

795
00:41:25,679 --> 00:41:27,920
you know that the evil science of the g real Knights.

796
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:31,000
Speaker 2: Well, I just look at these social justice warrior slugs

797
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:33,639
that can't do anything, which is like the younger generations,

798
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:36,320
I mean when I compared to my my dad and granddad,

799
00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:37,960
I can't do any of the ship they could do,

800
00:41:38,039 --> 00:41:40,960
you know, like they could. My dad could build a

801
00:41:41,119 --> 00:41:44,239
car from scratch, he did that one time, and he's

802
00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:47,440
built houses and all kinds of you know, manly endeavors.

803
00:41:48,119 --> 00:41:48,320
Speaker 1: Uh.

804
00:41:48,360 --> 00:41:52,119
Speaker 2: And I turned out more of a bookish dude, which

805
00:41:52,199 --> 00:41:54,559
not necessarily bad per se, but you know, I don't

806
00:41:54,599 --> 00:41:57,800
have a lot of those skills that that my dad

807
00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:00,519
and granddad had. And it's even worse as you get

808
00:42:00,559 --> 00:42:04,800
down to the millennials, who are basically just I think,

809
00:42:04,880 --> 00:42:08,119
engineered to be obsessed with the tech stuff. And they're

810
00:42:08,159 --> 00:42:09,280
the ones that are going to be you know, they're

811
00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:11,320
being raised by iPads. You know, little kids now are

812
00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:13,039
being raised by iPads, and so I think they're going

813
00:42:13,079 --> 00:42:18,920
to be very primed for the acceptance of whatever the

814
00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:22,079
next phases of bodily modification and stuff like that. And

815
00:42:22,159 --> 00:42:24,760
you mentioned the driverless cars. I don't mean to change subject,

816
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:27,119
but it just reminded me. I couldn't believe I watched

817
00:42:27,119 --> 00:42:32,280
that stupid Arnold Schwarzenegger movie Sixth Day, I think not

818
00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:34,880
too long ago, and that came out in two thousand

819
00:42:35,199 --> 00:42:37,920
and it begins with Google driverless cars.

820
00:42:38,360 --> 00:42:40,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean you've got a driverless car until recall,

821
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:42,920
don't you it's got a little guy in the front

822
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:43,880
who kind of talks to you.

823
00:42:43,920 --> 00:42:45,199
Speaker 2: But that's not a it's a good point.

824
00:42:45,280 --> 00:42:51,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, your comment, they're about emasculation and younger generations in tech.

825
00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:54,920
You've actually read my mind oddly enough, you know, at

826
00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:57,320
a time when apparently we can't do that yet. That's

827
00:42:57,360 --> 00:42:58,280
what I was going to turn too.

828
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:00,840
Speaker 2: Well, you're just assuming that I haven't been modified to

829
00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:01,679
read minds.

830
00:43:02,000 --> 00:43:04,159
Speaker 1: I am assuming that, you know, silly may Yeah.

831
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:07,719
Speaker 2: You're just assuming that I'm not a darker black opp project.

832
00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:10,159
Speaker 1: Yeah. Actually, semi your bank details, I owe you ten

833
00:43:10,159 --> 00:43:10,760
thousand boxs.

834
00:43:10,800 --> 00:43:11,400
Speaker 2: Sorry about that.

835
00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:15,239
Speaker 1: I'll get that transferred over immediately. But that's a theme

836
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:17,199
that I really want to turn to. But we did

837
00:43:17,199 --> 00:43:20,000
say we get to Logan's Run and this is replete

838
00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:23,920
with motifs and the sort of themes we've been talking about,

839
00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:26,000
and then you actually deal with it in your book

840
00:43:26,639 --> 00:43:30,199
section are technocratic dystopia unveiled? Now, Logan's Run's quite well

841
00:43:30,199 --> 00:43:33,199
known film is from nineteen seventy six, and as we've

842
00:43:33,199 --> 00:43:36,400
mentioned before, this was really the sort of halcyon days

843
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:38,760
of dystopian sci fi in many ways. We had roller Ball,

844
00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:42,400
which we talked about in the previous installment, Soilent Green

845
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:45,000
t h X one one three eight, which is George

846
00:43:45,079 --> 00:43:48,679
Lucas' first film, developed from a project he first did

847
00:43:48,719 --> 00:43:51,559
when he was a film student, a fairly a lesser

848
00:43:51,599 --> 00:43:54,159
known film starting all over Red called z PG or

849
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:55,599
Zero Population.

850
00:43:55,199 --> 00:43:57,519
Speaker 2: Growth, Zero Population Yeah, yeah, exactly.

851
00:43:57,599 --> 00:44:00,760
Speaker 1: And Logan's Run set in the twenty third century where

852
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:04,280
pleasure rules in a synthetic society. That was the byline.

853
00:44:04,599 --> 00:44:07,199
It's got a lot in common at the later phone

854
00:44:07,199 --> 00:44:10,360
called The Island with Ian McGregor. It was very similar

855
00:44:10,400 --> 00:44:14,440
in many ways. So now Logan's Run was a feast

856
00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:16,519
for you to get your teeth into really in writing,

857
00:44:17,119 --> 00:44:19,480
not least the population control, which I suppose is a

858
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:22,119
central theme. But it's a smart city as well, isn't it.

859
00:44:22,159 --> 00:44:25,360
So just just just cherry pick a few of your

860
00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:28,199
favorite aspects of Logan's Run then and just set there

861
00:44:28,280 --> 00:44:28,440
was a.

862
00:44:29,039 --> 00:44:30,719
Speaker 2: Well, you know, it's weird about a lot of the

863
00:44:30,800 --> 00:44:33,599
dystopian stories is that it's almost like they all have

864
00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:39,800
two or three elements that are likely to be true

865
00:44:39,880 --> 00:44:43,280
that the other stories don't have. So what you don't

866
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:49,760
have in maybe well no, I guess you could argue

867
00:44:49,760 --> 00:44:54,440
that you do have population control in Zardas. But you know,

868
00:44:54,519 --> 00:44:57,400
at times you'll see things in some of these kinds

869
00:44:57,440 --> 00:45:00,440
of stories that you don't see in others. But yeah,

870
00:45:01,239 --> 00:45:05,480
this has a very strong euthanasia theme, right, So everybody

871
00:45:05,599 --> 00:45:11,519
has this very easy existence in the big plastic ai

872
00:45:11,800 --> 00:45:17,079
smart city and you are deleted, you know. You what's

873
00:45:17,159 --> 00:45:19,400
and what's weird about it is that once again it's

874
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:22,199
a kind of religious manipulation like we saw in Zardas, right,

875
00:45:22,280 --> 00:45:25,760
which was this faux religion that's kind of the noble

876
00:45:25,840 --> 00:45:30,480
lie of Plato that's foisted upon the tech utopia. And

877
00:45:30,480 --> 00:45:33,039
then when you reach a certain age of what was

878
00:45:33,079 --> 00:45:37,840
a thirty or thirty three, you you you're insiderated. But

879
00:45:38,360 --> 00:45:42,440
they've turned it into this happy floating ritual where you

880
00:45:42,519 --> 00:45:46,199
kind of dance around and float away and you float

881
00:45:46,239 --> 00:45:50,079
into the furnace or something. And which is funny because

882
00:45:50,119 --> 00:45:53,639
that again, this is very platonic. It's very much the

883
00:45:53,639 --> 00:45:55,679
the idea that you know, Plato said, oh well, the

884
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:59,400
the ideal republic, which all the utopias are all based

885
00:45:59,440 --> 00:46:02,360
on the idea public of Plato. Well, they've got to

886
00:46:02,480 --> 00:46:05,559
have the noble life, fake religion, because you know, you're

887
00:46:05,559 --> 00:46:09,719
never going to have all of the society being philosopher kings.

888
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:14,119
And you know, the philosopher king understands that men have

889
00:46:14,159 --> 00:46:16,760
to be governed. And you got to have the rigid hierarchy,

890
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:19,599
and you've got to have the you got to lie

891
00:46:19,639 --> 00:46:21,920
to the masses because you know they're just too stupid,

892
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:25,400
and you got to keep them their population under control,

893
00:46:25,559 --> 00:46:29,840
like like the Wildlife Authority you know, controls the deer

894
00:46:29,840 --> 00:46:32,360
population here in Tennessee, for example, because there'll be too

895
00:46:32,360 --> 00:46:35,559
many of them. Uh. And you know, so that you

896
00:46:35,599 --> 00:46:39,000
have all those Malthusia and Eugenics themes, and then what

897
00:46:39,159 --> 00:46:44,920
happens is you got the the Promethean character of Logan five,

898
00:46:46,079 --> 00:46:50,159
who the Michael Yorke character who finally figures out that

899
00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:55,159
not everything in his Edenic existence is what it appears

900
00:46:55,199 --> 00:46:57,239
to be. And that's of course always one of the

901
00:46:57,239 --> 00:46:59,719
great themes of the Dystopian stories, and I think why

902
00:46:59,760 --> 00:47:03,079
they resonates so well with all of us living in

903
00:47:03,079 --> 00:47:06,039
the age that we live in now, especially with the

904
00:47:06,119 --> 00:47:08,000
awareness of the new world order and all that we

905
00:47:08,400 --> 00:47:11,960
realized that, you know, we have not been told what

906
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:14,679
is true. We've been told all this Bologne, and we

907
00:47:14,719 --> 00:47:17,719
live in the synthetic society. And you know, as the

908
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:22,960
great philosopher Jean Baldrizard predicted in his book Simulacround Simulation,

909
00:47:24,840 --> 00:47:29,119
we are almost entering into a point where it's beyond synthetic.

910
00:47:29,239 --> 00:47:31,519
It's like a synthetic version of the synthetic.

911
00:47:31,679 --> 00:47:31,840
Speaker 1: You know.

912
00:47:31,840 --> 00:47:35,920
Speaker 2: I was amazed, for example, when I watched the last

913
00:47:36,119 --> 00:47:39,960
Jurassic Park reboot, and there was so many I did

914
00:47:39,960 --> 00:47:41,800
analysis of that, and one of the things that stood

915
00:47:41,800 --> 00:47:47,679
out that was very bizarre was that you have people

916
00:47:47,800 --> 00:47:57,239
in a synthetic environment watching synthetic people or synthetic dinosaurs

917
00:47:58,480 --> 00:48:00,559
in a control Like a large part of that movie

918
00:48:00,599 --> 00:48:04,039
is in the control room of Jurassic Park, and the

919
00:48:04,519 --> 00:48:08,119
people are watching synthetic images on their screens of synthetic

920
00:48:08,199 --> 00:48:12,079
things in this synthetic park. And then it gets even

921
00:48:12,119 --> 00:48:15,239
more meta because we're in the movie theater watching all

922
00:48:15,320 --> 00:48:18,679
of this syntheticness. Now I may have mentioned that before,

923
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:20,599
but that just always blows my mind when when this

924
00:48:20,679 --> 00:48:23,840
synthetic topic comes up and I think about how like

925
00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:27,599
these gamers, right like these very popular YouTube channels of

926
00:48:27,679 --> 00:48:31,559
gamers who sit there people are watching people play a

927
00:48:31,639 --> 00:48:35,320
video game, and it just blows my mind. And then

928
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:38,719
you know, there are some channels where it's like people

929
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:42,280
watching people watching a video game going. I mean, it's

930
00:48:42,320 --> 00:48:46,000
it's just like madness. But so we're getting into these

931
00:48:46,079 --> 00:48:51,239
kind of infinite removals, you know, of meta of synthetic

932
00:48:52,599 --> 00:48:55,440
dystopia here in our reality that I don't even think

933
00:48:55,480 --> 00:48:57,360
these people could have could have come up with. But

934
00:48:58,199 --> 00:48:59,920
and again, all of that's kind of hinted at here

935
00:48:59,920 --> 00:49:05,400
in Logan's run. Another interesting element is governing the people

936
00:49:06,159 --> 00:49:10,199
in the dystopia through their base desires, right hedonism rules

937
00:49:10,280 --> 00:49:15,199
you have like these, you basically go home and you

938
00:49:15,239 --> 00:49:18,519
tell the computer what you want. The computer produces the

939
00:49:19,599 --> 00:49:21,639
like a Holow deck on Star Trek or something like that,

940
00:49:21,719 --> 00:49:26,000
Like you get the synthetic babe or whatever. And like

941
00:49:26,039 --> 00:49:28,519
you said, yeah, it's very much like The Island, I think.

942
00:49:28,599 --> 00:49:32,199
I think Michael Bay and he kind of blended a

943
00:49:32,199 --> 00:49:37,400
whole bunch of the dystopias together. I mean, I actually

944
00:49:37,400 --> 00:49:39,360
think The Island is a decent movie. If you go

945
00:49:39,400 --> 00:49:41,039
back and watch it, it's not as bad as you

946
00:49:41,039 --> 00:49:44,480
would think, coming from Michael Bay. But but yeah, it

947
00:49:44,559 --> 00:49:46,079
is kind of like just a cut and paste of

948
00:49:46,119 --> 00:49:54,280
all the dystopias. So there's all this I guess we

949
00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:56,960
should mention other you know, the symbolism too, of like

950
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:02,199
the lotus. So there's this I lotus crystal, which is

951
00:50:02,199 --> 00:50:08,400
this Buddhist Hindu imagery and in those traditions, interesting that

952
00:50:08,519 --> 00:50:11,679
it references the heart and the passion. So the lotus

953
00:50:11,760 --> 00:50:15,199
is a reference to the flower of life, which if

954
00:50:15,239 --> 00:50:19,079
we think about like sacred geometry and Pythagoreanism and Platonic mysticism,

955
00:50:19,119 --> 00:50:23,440
the flower of life signifies the ecosphere, the biosphere as

956
00:50:23,440 --> 00:50:27,320
a whole, and this gets into the platonic solids and

957
00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:32,159
how in Pythagoreanism everything's kind of built upon itself up

958
00:50:32,199 --> 00:50:38,840
into you know, second, third, fourth dimension reality. And the

959
00:50:38,880 --> 00:50:41,360
reason I say that is that again we're back to Platonism,

960
00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:45,000
and that's a I think direct conscious referencing of all

961
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:48,719
these Platonic ideas. And you say, well, Platonism isn't Buddhism. Actually,

962
00:50:48,719 --> 00:50:53,239
there's a lot of similarities between ancient Hindu ideas and

963
00:50:53,239 --> 00:50:56,599
Buddhist ideas and Platonism, and people have written many books

964
00:50:56,599 --> 00:50:58,920
on that. I cite one of those books in my analysis.

965
00:50:59,639 --> 00:51:01,840
And really what we're just talking about sacred geometry here,

966
00:51:02,360 --> 00:51:06,320
and that is mastering the secrets of sacred geometry. This

967
00:51:06,360 --> 00:51:08,400
is what Plato talks about the republic. That's how you

968
00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:13,960
construct the utopia. Literally, now I'm not saying it's a

969
00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:16,480
real utopia. I'm just saying that that's how it's viewed

970
00:51:16,559 --> 00:51:19,880
in the mystic texts, is that you master these things.

971
00:51:20,199 --> 00:51:22,400
You know, Plato says that the philosopher king has to

972
00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:25,800
go off for like twenty years and study math. Like

973
00:51:25,840 --> 00:51:28,239
you go for twenty years and you study geometry, math,

974
00:51:28,880 --> 00:51:31,239
master all that, and then you've got to come back

975
00:51:31,519 --> 00:51:34,719
and master the art or ruling men. And that's the

976
00:51:34,760 --> 00:51:37,639
true philosopher king, right, So it's not just you know,

977
00:51:38,039 --> 00:51:41,840
meditating on a mountain. For Plato, it's a little more pragmatic.

978
00:51:41,880 --> 00:51:45,239
You've got to actually come back and use that nosis

979
00:51:45,239 --> 00:51:49,679
and wisdom that you supposedly have obtained to rule the

980
00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:55,079
city state. And that's everything that we're saying here in

981
00:51:56,800 --> 00:51:59,599
Logan's run. And there's also Crolean elements too. I think

982
00:51:59,599 --> 00:52:07,400
you've got this kind of new aon where death has

983
00:52:07,519 --> 00:52:13,360
been accepted as this kind of necessary part of existence

984
00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:17,119
and of the regime. The regime just has to to

985
00:52:17,239 --> 00:52:20,360
kill people, supposedly because you know, we got to keep

986
00:52:21,000 --> 00:52:23,880
balance in the population for the ecosphere and all this

987
00:52:23,920 --> 00:52:27,840
kind of stuff inside the the bubble Doome city, which

988
00:52:27,840 --> 00:52:29,840
by the way, is very Disney. You know. You look

989
00:52:29,880 --> 00:52:32,239
at the kind of silly little models and artwork that

990
00:52:32,239 --> 00:52:35,039
was used for the movie and it looks almost exactly

991
00:52:35,119 --> 00:52:39,360
like Epcot, and you say, well, what's the connection there?

992
00:52:39,400 --> 00:52:41,360
And we have mentioned this on the first talk. I

993
00:52:41,360 --> 00:52:44,519
can't remember, but it's come up a few times. The

994
00:52:44,559 --> 00:52:48,320
Pentagon was directly involved with big corporations like the Semens

995
00:52:48,320 --> 00:52:53,199
Corporation in designing Epcot and it's it was called the

996
00:52:53,239 --> 00:52:56,639
City of Tomorrow, so believe it or not, Epcot Center

997
00:52:56,679 --> 00:52:59,679
and Disney. I'm not joking. This is one hundreercent truth.

998
00:52:59,760 --> 00:53:06,760
That was predictive programming, planning, conditioning people to accept the

999
00:53:06,840 --> 00:53:10,480
coming smart cities. They knew back then there would be

1000
00:53:10,519 --> 00:53:14,039
smart cities, there would be all this reorganization, you know,

1001
00:53:14,119 --> 00:53:16,639
under the kind of Agenda twenty one Model of Cities

1002
00:53:16,679 --> 00:53:19,519
and a New City's Initiative and all this kind of

1003
00:53:19,559 --> 00:53:23,519
stuff Target cities. I'm not joking about that, by the way, Yeah,

1004
00:53:23,559 --> 00:53:24,440
you mentioned that before.

1005
00:53:24,519 --> 00:53:25,559
Speaker 1: That's hilarious.

1006
00:53:26,039 --> 00:53:30,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's all real. The Clinton initiative is very closely

1007
00:53:30,199 --> 00:53:33,440
connected to the Target Cities initiative. You can't make this

1008
00:53:33,480 --> 00:53:33,920
stuff up.

1009
00:53:34,719 --> 00:53:36,599
Speaker 1: I mean you look at the look at the Zeitgeist

1010
00:53:36,880 --> 00:53:38,280
movement specifically.

1011
00:53:38,480 --> 00:53:39,639
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that's a great example.

1012
00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:42,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean you look at their city drawings and

1013
00:53:42,360 --> 00:53:44,159
a lot of their a lot of their plans, you know,

1014
00:53:44,199 --> 00:53:46,360
which are kind of like the sort of thing that

1015
00:53:46,400 --> 00:53:49,000
you see in artists impression when there's a new development

1016
00:53:49,079 --> 00:53:51,960
going up somewhere but it's not ready yet. So rather

1017
00:53:51,960 --> 00:53:54,079
than put the blueprints up, which is really boring and

1018
00:53:54,119 --> 00:53:57,440
nobody can understand them, an artist does an impression of

1019
00:53:57,480 --> 00:54:00,519
what the finished building or development will look like up

1020
00:54:00,559 --> 00:54:02,519
it goes. So these are in that sort of style

1021
00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:06,639
Zeitgeist's movements there kind of vision of future cities and

1022
00:54:06,679 --> 00:54:08,960
what's what's that that just looks like something of a

1023
00:54:09,039 --> 00:54:13,159
set from Lubin's Run or any of these other dystopian

1024
00:54:13,239 --> 00:54:16,360
sci fi or you know, I remember looking at rewatching

1025
00:54:17,000 --> 00:54:20,920
Clockwork Orange and just going, oh, it's the Zeitgeist streets

1026
00:54:20,960 --> 00:54:25,320
and plazas and stuff, except that, oh, here, we have here,

1027
00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:27,360
we have so called real life. Here, we have the

1028
00:54:27,440 --> 00:54:30,599
you know, the ugliness of the animal kicking its jackboot

1029
00:54:30,639 --> 00:54:33,000
into all of this. What word does this kind of

1030
00:54:33,000 --> 00:54:36,960
resolution come. It's when some of the characters reconnect with nature,

1031
00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:40,280
you know, outside of the dome city. That's very much

1032
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:43,519
the theme in t X one one three year. Oh yeah,

1033
00:54:43,559 --> 00:54:46,760
they finally get finally get above ground and reconnect with nature.

1034
00:54:47,079 --> 00:54:49,880
Speaker 2: Oh this is that's that's great, that's this is the

1035
00:54:49,920 --> 00:54:55,239
algory the cave theme that is constant in dystopian stories.

1036
00:54:55,239 --> 00:54:59,119
So THHX total algory the cave where they emerge and

1037
00:54:59,119 --> 00:55:01,519
they see the sun. Right, they've never seen a sunset

1038
00:55:02,039 --> 00:55:04,800
or sunrise whatever it is, you know, with the James

1039
00:55:04,840 --> 00:55:07,159
coll Or Robert of All character comes out and he

1040
00:55:07,159 --> 00:55:10,599
sees the sun. And then there's another movie that's actually

1041
00:55:10,639 --> 00:55:13,320
a pretty good kids movie, believe it or not, with

1042
00:55:13,679 --> 00:55:18,039
Soorcia Ronan and Bill Murray called City of Ember. And

1043
00:55:18,159 --> 00:55:24,039
it's a very well done dystopian movie for for kids.

1044
00:55:24,679 --> 00:55:27,840
And in that film, they're all underground. It's a future dystopia.

1045
00:55:28,079 --> 00:55:30,599
And you know that, I don't think I'm spoiling it

1046
00:55:30,639 --> 00:55:32,119
for anybody by saying that. You know, the end of

1047
00:55:32,119 --> 00:55:34,400
the film is that the whole civilization was based on

1048
00:55:34,480 --> 00:55:39,280
Why and Sorsia Ronan and whoever the male lead guy was,

1049
00:55:39,360 --> 00:55:43,480
they exit the city. And what the irony in that

1050
00:55:43,519 --> 00:55:48,719
one was that the Bill Murray plays a great sort

1051
00:55:48,760 --> 00:55:54,519
of dissolute, corrupted president of the of the civilization or

1052
00:55:54,559 --> 00:55:56,880
whatever he is, the mayor, that's what he's the mayor,

1053
00:55:57,360 --> 00:55:59,960
uh and and he doesn't even remember the real story,

1054
00:56:00,360 --> 00:56:03,760
so he actually believes the bullshit. And that's the irony

1055
00:56:03,800 --> 00:56:06,800
of sometimes of the dystopias is that, you know, maybe

1056
00:56:06,800 --> 00:56:09,920
in the earliest days in these fictional presentations, we have

1057
00:56:09,960 --> 00:56:12,880
the idea that you know, the leaders thought, oh, it's

1058
00:56:12,960 --> 00:56:14,679
going to be for the best if we create the

1059
00:56:14,719 --> 00:56:17,719
giant y for the civilization, and then like five hundred

1060
00:56:17,760 --> 00:56:21,199
years later, they've forgotten that. So they actually believe that,

1061
00:56:21,719 --> 00:56:24,079
you know, oh, you can't step outside the dome city

1062
00:56:24,199 --> 00:56:27,400
because the error is toxic. You know, there's there's nuke

1063
00:56:28,119 --> 00:56:31,760
nuke dust and radiation and which is all made up.

1064
00:56:31,800 --> 00:56:33,760
And you know that that was a great theme in

1065
00:56:34,519 --> 00:56:36,119
City of Member. So if you haven't seen that, I

1066
00:56:36,320 --> 00:56:38,840
actually recommend it's pretty good films.

1067
00:56:39,960 --> 00:56:41,960
Speaker 1: Sorry, I was I cut across you there. I didn't

1068
00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:43,599
mean to do that, but that's okay.

1069
00:56:43,639 --> 00:56:46,639
Speaker 2: They have that. It has that platonic algoryth that came

1070
00:56:46,960 --> 00:56:51,519
cave theme, which again it's always present in these dystopian stories,

1071
00:56:51,559 --> 00:56:54,159
and consciously I mean that again, that just proves my

1072
00:56:54,239 --> 00:56:56,800
thesis that you know, it's all really goes back to

1073
00:56:57,039 --> 00:56:58,039
the pledge of public.

1074
00:56:58,559 --> 00:57:01,199
Speaker 1: Well, there's another book novel I read. I don't think

1075
00:57:01,239 --> 00:57:03,079
it's ever been turned into a movie. It's called The

1076
00:57:03,119 --> 00:57:06,519
Penultimate Truth and it might be a Philip K. Dick book.

1077
00:57:06,559 --> 00:57:09,000
I just can't remember, but it's exactly the same theme.

1078
00:57:09,039 --> 00:57:11,079
I think you'd enjoy it. It's about you can't go

1079
00:57:11,119 --> 00:57:14,400
above ground, it's poisoned, but it's not. But of course

1080
00:57:14,400 --> 00:57:16,679
that goes right back to the machine stops, doesn't it?

1081
00:57:16,679 --> 00:57:17,440
E M Forrester.

1082
00:57:18,039 --> 00:57:19,280
Speaker 2: Let's not forget snow Piercer.

1083
00:57:19,719 --> 00:57:21,800
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, exactly, because that you.

1084
00:57:21,800 --> 00:57:23,559
Speaker 2: Know, they can't go outside the train. But that was

1085
00:57:23,599 --> 00:57:23,880
all a.

1086
00:57:23,840 --> 00:57:28,719
Speaker 1: Lie, exactly. But the whole all this kind of reconnecting

1087
00:57:28,719 --> 00:57:32,639
with nature but also the animal nature of man. I

1088
00:57:32,719 --> 00:57:36,320
use the term advisedly in this, you know, emancipated emancipated

1089
00:57:36,320 --> 00:57:39,360
age kind of sticking its over in you know, jutting

1090
00:57:39,599 --> 00:57:42,559
phallically kind of thrusting into the situation and kind of

1091
00:57:42,639 --> 00:57:45,960
ruining everything for the technocrats. I mean that's you see

1092
00:57:45,960 --> 00:57:48,039
that in a way in Blade Run or Don't You

1093
00:57:48,079 --> 00:57:52,119
a classic dystopian film, because not necessarily in a good way,

1094
00:57:52,159 --> 00:57:55,199
but you've got i mean, the central characters like a

1095
00:57:55,239 --> 00:57:58,239
heavy drinker to the point of being an alcoholic. Everything's

1096
00:57:58,280 --> 00:58:01,039
really grimy, the weather suck. Because there's so many things

1097
00:58:01,119 --> 00:58:04,119
about the future in that film that kind of kind

1098
00:58:04,119 --> 00:58:06,079
of where you thought, yeah, this was all really shiny

1099
00:58:06,079 --> 00:58:08,000
and brilliant, wasn't it when it was kind of new,

1100
00:58:08,079 --> 00:58:09,840
And now it's all just kind of gone the way

1101
00:58:09,920 --> 00:58:12,320
all tech does. It kind of rusts and seizes up,

1102
00:58:12,440 --> 00:58:13,960
it has it has scum on it.

1103
00:58:14,039 --> 00:58:17,880
Speaker 2: And there's actually not a huge, huge fan of Ann Rand,

1104
00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:20,199
but she actually has a pretty good short story with

1105
00:58:20,320 --> 00:58:23,800
that same theme too. Anthem Anthem is a good An

1106
00:58:23,960 --> 00:58:25,800
Ran short story with that same theme too.

1107
00:58:26,480 --> 00:58:28,679
Speaker 1: Well, just a thought that suddenly occurred to me, just

1108
00:58:28,719 --> 00:58:32,559
based on something you said a minute ago about Philosopher Kings.

1109
00:58:32,599 --> 00:58:35,599
And this is just a general reflection, but it kind

1110
00:58:35,599 --> 00:58:38,760
of as a continuation in a thought process of you know,

1111
00:58:38,880 --> 00:58:41,239
some of the some of the things that we've discussed,

1112
00:58:41,440 --> 00:58:44,199
you know, the the themes of the you know, technology

1113
00:58:44,559 --> 00:58:47,920
versus the primitive and the kind of spectrum between the two.

1114
00:58:47,960 --> 00:58:51,360
And isn't it interesting what a difference there is, particularly

1115
00:58:51,360 --> 00:58:54,000
brought out in movies, What a difference there is in

1116
00:58:54,239 --> 00:58:58,920
leadership that arises from so called from the bottom and

1117
00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:02,800
that which is generally imposed from the top. That's that's

1118
00:59:02,840 --> 00:59:04,239
the thing that comes up in a lot of movies.

1119
00:59:04,280 --> 00:59:05,960
And you see that. I mean, the first one that

1120
00:59:06,000 --> 00:59:09,440
came to mind was Gladiator. This using example that a

1121
00:59:09,440 --> 00:59:14,000
lot of people know. You've got Russell Crue's character Maximus,

1122
00:59:14,239 --> 00:59:18,760
a very strong, capable, smart leader as he turns out

1123
00:59:18,800 --> 00:59:22,079
to be, but he's come up from the ranks, and

1124
00:59:22,119 --> 00:59:24,039
so he's a bit like a sergeant in the army

1125
00:59:24,039 --> 00:59:25,119
in a way, do you know what I mean? Or

1126
00:59:25,440 --> 00:59:28,000
the guy that the men look up to because he's

1127
00:59:28,039 --> 00:59:29,039
done what they've done.

1128
00:59:29,280 --> 00:59:31,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, he actually has you know, courage and virtue. And

1129
00:59:32,000 --> 00:59:36,079
then you know, Combadus, is this totally degenerate a feat

1130
00:59:36,480 --> 00:59:36,639
you know?

1131
00:59:37,960 --> 00:59:40,679
Speaker 1: Yeah? Absolutely, And this is what I I The thought

1132
00:59:40,719 --> 00:59:42,840
first occurred to me when we were talking about Sean

1133
00:59:42,880 --> 00:59:45,559
Connery playing Zed and Zardal's you know, the role that

1134
00:59:45,599 --> 00:59:48,760
he has and how he's you know, yes, he's taken

1135
00:59:48,920 --> 00:59:51,800
on the role of an exterminator, but it doesn't you know,

1136
00:59:51,920 --> 00:59:55,480
you kind of is a man of character a few

1137
00:59:55,519 --> 00:59:58,679
words in the in that movie, but you kind of

1138
00:59:58,719 --> 01:00:00,920
have a you can kind of him, you see what

1139
01:00:00,920 --> 01:00:02,960
I mean, whereas you've just got nothing but contempt for

1140
01:00:03,039 --> 01:00:06,519
these pro wretches, contempt and petty. And in the army,

1141
01:00:06,519 --> 01:00:08,519
I suppose you get the guys. I don't know what

1142
01:00:08,559 --> 01:00:10,800
it's like in the US Army, but in the British Army,

1143
01:00:10,800 --> 01:00:13,480
you get the guys that go to Sandringham wherever it is,

1144
01:00:13,480 --> 01:00:15,760
you know, to officers school, and that you know, they've

1145
01:00:15,760 --> 01:00:18,280
never been in the rank and file, never been in

1146
01:00:18,320 --> 01:00:21,679
the infantry, and their combat experience may be very limited,

1147
01:00:21,719 --> 01:00:23,519
a bit like the guy in Aliens. Do you remember

1148
01:00:23,559 --> 01:00:27,440
the guy the military guy who's like parachuted in ye.

1149
01:00:28,559 --> 01:00:30,840
Speaker 2: Yeah. And then you know the Hudson and Hicks and

1150
01:00:30,880 --> 01:00:34,880
all those guys are seasoned and they can't stand that

1151
01:00:34,920 --> 01:00:37,800
guy being over over them because he has had he

1152
01:00:37,840 --> 01:00:39,199
has no experience.

1153
01:00:39,360 --> 01:00:42,800
Speaker 1: And when does that guy the characters again can't remember

1154
01:00:42,840 --> 01:00:46,079
his name as such, but You've got that slimy cretn

1155
01:00:46,119 --> 01:00:49,360
from the company who obviously gets stamped out like the

1156
01:00:49,400 --> 01:00:54,239
cockroops that he is. Yeah, but when the military guy

1157
01:00:54,280 --> 01:00:57,039
who has been parachuted in to like take control sort

1158
01:00:57,079 --> 01:00:59,480
of speak, when does he begin When do we begin

1159
01:00:59,559 --> 01:01:03,360
to kind of of see something coming through that looks

1160
01:01:03,400 --> 01:01:07,400
like courage. It's when he's up against it, but it

1161
01:01:07,480 --> 01:01:09,840
shows that he kind of has that within him when

1162
01:01:09,840 --> 01:01:14,519
he sacrifices himself with you know that the the the girl,

1163
01:01:14,719 --> 01:01:17,480
the female soldier, you know, and he's kind of only

1164
01:01:17,519 --> 01:01:20,639
then only that's only in that human situation. Only when

1165
01:01:20,679 --> 01:01:24,000
he's forced to actually act does he find really some

1166
01:01:24,159 --> 01:01:26,599
kind of courage, whereas Burke is just you know, as

1167
01:01:26,719 --> 01:01:28,360
a slime ball from beginning to end.

1168
01:01:28,400 --> 01:01:32,119
Speaker 2: So, you know, Ripley, Ripley, you know, I really thought

1169
01:01:32,159 --> 01:01:34,559
better of you. I thought better for you. Ripley. You

1170
01:01:34,559 --> 01:01:39,599
know we could be wealthy, Ripley don't. I don't do

1171
01:01:39,639 --> 01:01:41,920
a great Paul Riser. But he has that very you know,

1172
01:01:42,000 --> 01:01:43,400
kind of New York Jewish accent.

1173
01:01:44,199 --> 01:01:46,920
Speaker 1: He's got a very punishable head. I will say, yeah,

1174
01:01:47,519 --> 01:01:49,960
but yeah, you're gonna slaze your way out of this one.

1175
01:01:50,079 --> 01:01:52,079
Burke's going to nail you.

1176
01:01:52,079 --> 01:01:56,039
Speaker 2: To the wall. Came over man, game over.

1177
01:01:56,519 --> 01:01:57,800
Speaker 1: He died recently, didn't he?

1178
01:01:58,280 --> 01:02:01,559
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, the actor tact. Yeah.

1179
01:02:01,679 --> 01:02:03,039
Speaker 1: One of the thing that I want to turn to.

1180
01:02:03,639 --> 01:02:08,639
I mentioned this just earlier, is this idea of emasculation

1181
01:02:08,960 --> 01:02:10,599
and kind of like where we're headed in terms of

1182
01:02:10,639 --> 01:02:12,599
technology in the real world. And of course a lot

1183
01:02:12,599 --> 01:02:15,159
of what we're talking about spills over into this in

1184
01:02:15,239 --> 01:02:19,960
terms of propaganda and predictive programming, you know sometimes and

1185
01:02:20,039 --> 01:02:21,880
I'm reading quite a lot about this at the minute.

1186
01:02:21,920 --> 01:02:24,719
You know, the effect that this technology is having on

1187
01:02:25,119 --> 01:02:28,119
younger people, but also older generation as well. I mean

1188
01:02:28,159 --> 01:02:30,199
people of our age, people who are old enough to

1189
01:02:30,239 --> 01:02:31,960
be our parents, you know, maybe the people who are

1190
01:02:31,960 --> 01:02:36,480
our parents. And it's you know, the digital natives versus

1191
01:02:36,599 --> 01:02:39,079
digital immigrants. I think the word is. You know that

1192
01:02:39,119 --> 01:02:41,719
you and I are probably to some extent digital immigrants,

1193
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:45,199
because we probably have always known personal computers, but we

1194
01:02:45,320 --> 01:02:48,920
haven't always known smartphones and the Internet and everything else.

1195
01:02:49,320 --> 01:02:51,920
Digital natives being those kids or young people that have

1196
01:02:52,000 --> 01:02:55,119
been born into this. And we're seeing some negative effects here,

1197
01:02:55,519 --> 01:02:58,960
and yet we're not here to discuss the positives. Okay,

1198
01:02:59,119 --> 01:03:01,280
we're not here to dig some of the positives. You

1199
01:03:01,320 --> 01:03:04,360
and I are talking with technology, we're talking over the Internet.

1200
01:03:04,559 --> 01:03:07,800
It's amazing technology. I wouldn't want to be without it,

1201
01:03:07,840 --> 01:03:10,320
even though I think we might be someday, maybe in

1202
01:03:10,320 --> 01:03:13,119
a couple hundred years time. But you see so much

1203
01:03:13,199 --> 01:03:17,440
apathy and so much vitality being drained away from a

1204
01:03:17,480 --> 01:03:20,039
certain type of person who get immeshed in technology and

1205
01:03:20,039 --> 01:03:22,320
I'm obsessed with it, and they live through it to

1206
01:03:22,360 --> 01:03:26,519
the point where sometimes their never mind, their minds atrophying,

1207
01:03:26,599 --> 01:03:28,639
sometimes their bodies waste away. I don't know if you've

1208
01:03:28,679 --> 01:03:31,679
read anything about that. In particular, there's a class of

1209
01:03:32,920 --> 01:03:36,239
young person in Japan, there's a name for them that

1210
01:03:36,239 --> 01:03:38,400
I can't quite remember, who basically live with their parents

1211
01:03:38,440 --> 01:03:42,159
and spend all their time in one room. And I've

1212
01:03:42,159 --> 01:03:45,239
read a story recently about a number of kids who

1213
01:03:45,280 --> 01:03:48,199
have died as a result of going on three, four

1214
01:03:48,320 --> 01:03:51,079
or five day gaming marathons during work. They did not

1215
01:03:51,159 --> 01:03:54,480
eat and did not sleep. And this passion, this sense

1216
01:03:54,519 --> 01:03:59,119
of purpose, dry fire, desire, these things that seem to

1217
01:03:59,719 --> 01:04:02,880
historically have driven us on as a species, good and all,

1218
01:04:02,960 --> 01:04:04,719
but anything that we've achieved it you can look back

1219
01:04:04,760 --> 01:04:07,639
and say, Wow, it's been that. I'm also reading a

1220
01:04:07,679 --> 01:04:11,239
lot of articles in general about well, the first ones

1221
01:04:11,280 --> 01:04:13,519
I read, we're along the lines of what's happening to men?

1222
01:04:14,199 --> 01:04:15,920
You know, where are they? You know this young women

1223
01:04:16,079 --> 01:04:18,679
just sort of saying you've got these like gaming, slack

1224
01:04:18,800 --> 01:04:22,760
job to kine of phrase, pencil nets, slugs, this is

1225
01:04:22,760 --> 01:04:25,440
the next generation of these, our future husbands and fathers.

1226
01:04:25,519 --> 01:04:27,639
But I also start to read these sorts of things

1227
01:04:27,679 --> 01:04:30,119
now about young women, you know, and why would the

1228
01:04:30,119 --> 01:04:32,360
effects really be any differently, just affect you know, the

1229
01:04:32,400 --> 01:04:36,039
different genders somewhat differently because the genders are different, but

1230
01:04:36,039 --> 01:04:37,719
it's the same basic phenomenon.

1231
01:04:38,280 --> 01:04:40,480
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, here in the US, like if you scroll

1232
01:04:40,559 --> 01:04:45,400
through like the dating websites, if somebody is single, you know,

1233
01:04:45,440 --> 01:04:48,519
you're looking through these profiles and what you tend to see.

1234
01:04:48,599 --> 01:04:50,199
You can learn a lot from that. By the way

1235
01:04:50,239 --> 01:04:53,840
of the culture, You'll see all of these girls now

1236
01:04:53,960 --> 01:04:56,880
that are obsessed with weightlifting. I'm not joking. This is

1237
01:04:57,239 --> 01:05:01,800
a huge trend. And not just being fit but or toned,

1238
01:05:01,880 --> 01:05:04,039
which you know that makes that's fine with me, but

1239
01:05:04,760 --> 01:05:09,320
actually wanting to get buff, literally like really stout buff.

1240
01:05:09,360 --> 01:05:13,480
You know, you've got girls going into UFC fighting. You know,

1241
01:05:13,519 --> 01:05:16,559
you've got women. The argument is now they need to

1242
01:05:16,599 --> 01:05:19,480
be in special forces and on the front lines. And

1243
01:05:19,679 --> 01:05:26,119
simultaneously for the men, the programming is, like you said,

1244
01:05:26,480 --> 01:05:30,000
enter into the what Max Kaiser called a long time ago,

1245
01:05:30,119 --> 01:05:34,280
the virtual gulag, you know, the synthetic video game realm.

1246
01:05:34,840 --> 01:05:39,440
So it's this total reversal of the norms, and it's

1247
01:05:39,480 --> 01:05:42,719
absolutely by design, and it's a I don't think we

1248
01:05:42,840 --> 01:05:47,159
have to look a whole lot further than just the depopulation.

1249
01:05:47,280 --> 01:05:49,159
I mean, the whole goal of all that is just

1250
01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:52,000
I mean there's probably other experiments too, you know, more

1251
01:05:53,159 --> 01:05:56,360
specific localized experiments of you know, what what can we

1252
01:05:56,400 --> 01:05:59,239
do with you know, what happens to somebody who plays

1253
01:05:59,280 --> 01:06:02,480
video games, you know, for five days straight? What's the

1254
01:06:02,480 --> 01:06:05,159
effects of I'm sure that government's done experiments of that

1255
01:06:05,320 --> 01:06:08,840
of that nature. But overall the plan is really just

1256
01:06:09,159 --> 01:06:11,639
to mess people up so they don't reproduce. I think

1257
01:06:11,679 --> 01:06:15,199
that's I think it's pretty that pretty simple in that regard.

1258
01:06:15,239 --> 01:06:18,239
And you know, we've mentioned many times Aldus Tuxley and

1259
01:06:19,400 --> 01:06:21,880
WIT's in Brand New World, but being Bertrand Russell says

1260
01:06:21,880 --> 01:06:25,360
this very clearly too in the scientific outlook and impacted

1261
01:06:25,400 --> 01:06:31,639
science on society. That the goal would be to really

1262
01:06:31,639 --> 01:06:33,840
just mess people up. I mean, it's just pretty much

1263
01:06:33,880 --> 01:06:34,360
that simple.

1264
01:06:35,079 --> 01:06:37,599
Speaker 1: Yeah. I did an interview recently with a psychologist who

1265
01:06:37,599 --> 01:06:39,320
deals with a lot of young people who are having

1266
01:06:39,360 --> 01:06:43,760
problem relationships with technology. You know, they're usually referred by

1267
01:06:43,760 --> 01:06:46,480
their parents because it's destroying their lives, and in some

1268
01:06:46,519 --> 01:06:49,920
cases it turns out that the parents are actually falling

1269
01:06:49,960 --> 01:06:51,519
down into that trap as well, and it makes the

1270
01:06:51,519 --> 01:06:54,639
whole situation worse. But she related an interesting littl anic

1271
01:06:54,679 --> 01:06:57,000
dope to me father of a child who had been

1272
01:06:57,320 --> 01:06:59,320
referred to her. And the father was talking to her

1273
01:06:59,440 --> 01:07:01,280
just when the kid wasn't around, and it was just

1274
01:07:01,719 --> 01:07:03,440
in person or on the phone or something, and he

1275
01:07:03,519 --> 01:07:06,199
was saying, yeah, you know, I remember they kind of

1276
01:07:06,239 --> 01:07:08,000
had a bit of a little bit of a party

1277
01:07:08,000 --> 01:07:10,440
over at the house. Not not kids old enough to

1278
01:07:10,440 --> 01:07:12,119
be smoking and drinking and stuff, you know, they were

1279
01:07:12,119 --> 01:07:14,360
just doing what slightly younger kids, but they were they

1280
01:07:14,360 --> 01:07:16,199
were teenage kids being the point you know that they

1281
01:07:16,199 --> 01:07:20,000
were they passed puberty. And he said, also, I just

1282
01:07:20,000 --> 01:07:21,719
went down to the basement, you know, because we have

1283
01:07:21,760 --> 01:07:24,280
it turned into a kind of a den, and you

1284
01:07:24,320 --> 01:07:26,119
know there was the guys and the girls, you know,

1285
01:07:26,360 --> 01:07:29,239
my son and all his friends and some some girlfriends

1286
01:07:29,280 --> 01:07:32,320
I you know, female friends, not Nestley girlfriends in dating

1287
01:07:32,400 --> 01:07:34,280
or anything like that. And he said there were there

1288
01:07:34,280 --> 01:07:36,320
were going to throw cushions and stuff on the floor,

1289
01:07:36,360 --> 01:07:38,480
and they were all kind of like lying there and

1290
01:07:38,559 --> 01:07:40,320
kind of just chatting and doing stuff. And they were

1291
01:07:40,320 --> 01:07:42,440
something that were kind of draped over each other. And

1292
01:07:42,480 --> 01:07:44,400
he was kind of, you know, just looking on Okay,

1293
01:07:44,440 --> 01:07:46,519
you know, there there's my son with the girl dripped over,

1294
01:07:46,679 --> 01:07:48,199
and there's one of the other lads and this kind

1295
01:07:48,239 --> 01:07:51,119
of girl lying with him, so you know, doing anything,

1296
01:07:51,159 --> 01:07:52,880
not doing any harm, but there they are. You know,

1297
01:07:52,920 --> 01:07:55,320
it's just blah blah blah. And he thought and he

1298
01:07:55,360 --> 01:07:58,280
said to this psychologist, he said, man, I couldn't have

1299
01:07:58,280 --> 01:08:00,719
done that without getting aroused when I would that age.

1300
01:08:01,559 --> 01:08:04,480
But he said, they were all just lying there like

1301
01:08:04,840 --> 01:08:09,599
exactly like the immortals and Zartles. You know, that's my

1302
01:08:09,719 --> 01:08:13,159
free is not his, but you know that's what it was.

1303
01:08:13,639 --> 01:08:17,239
Speaker 2: That's funny. Yeah. The well, I think there's totally a

1304
01:08:17,439 --> 01:08:21,319
drop in testosterone and the spurm counts have dropped and

1305
01:08:22,000 --> 01:08:24,600
all kinds of crazy stuff like that that's you know,

1306
01:08:24,920 --> 01:08:27,239
appears to be confirmed and I don't doubt it in

1307
01:08:27,720 --> 01:08:30,600
even mainstream news. So yeah, I think it's all by design.

1308
01:08:30,680 --> 01:08:33,520
You look at Ecoscience by John P. Holder and the

1309
01:08:34,119 --> 01:08:37,079
quote sciences are that Obama appointed. He wrote back in

1310
01:08:37,159 --> 01:08:42,720
the late seventies, that big fat book with Paul Erlick

1311
01:08:42,760 --> 01:08:47,680
and other Malthusian global warming guy that you know that

1312
01:08:48,439 --> 01:08:51,760
you could do all this through you know, chemicals in

1313
01:08:51,800 --> 01:08:55,960
the environment, chemicals in the water, you know, inoculations, vaccines,

1314
01:08:56,039 --> 01:08:59,840
all that, and you know, again, this is just it's

1315
01:08:59,880 --> 01:09:02,840
just the restating of what Bert and Russell said so

1316
01:09:02,880 --> 01:09:05,960
many years ago, one hundred years ago. And I mean,

1317
01:09:05,960 --> 01:09:09,560
I'm not trying to be base. It's just it's really

1318
01:09:09,600 --> 01:09:11,479
is that simple. You know, we can do all the

1319
01:09:11,479 --> 01:09:15,720
analysis and trying to plumb the depths of all this stuff.

1320
01:09:15,800 --> 01:09:18,359
But that's really the big plan in my view.

1321
01:09:18,840 --> 01:09:21,840
Speaker 1: A not thing that you mentioned quite early on, but Superhero,

1322
01:09:21,840 --> 01:09:23,600
which when you know, your comment was just that I'm

1323
01:09:23,640 --> 01:09:25,399
not really a big superhero movie yet, you know, I

1324
01:09:25,439 --> 01:09:28,079
don't necessarily know a lot about it, blah blah blah,

1325
01:09:28,119 --> 01:09:31,920
and then you're you know, but mentioning about guys in

1326
01:09:31,960 --> 01:09:34,880
their twenties, thirties, forties, whatever, just being like really into

1327
01:09:34,920 --> 01:09:35,840
the superhero thing.

1328
01:09:36,119 --> 01:09:38,640
Speaker 2: But no, no, no, this is this is a huge thing. Man.

1329
01:09:38,680 --> 01:09:40,880
It's it's hard. I mean, have you been to I'm

1330
01:09:40,960 --> 01:09:43,159
not quizzing you, I'm just wondering, have you been to

1331
01:09:43,159 --> 01:09:47,079
the US? Have you seen like there are the I mean,

1332
01:09:47,079 --> 01:09:48,880
I'm sure this is true of the Western world and

1333
01:09:48,960 --> 01:09:52,520
probably other areas as well, like Japan or something especially,

1334
01:09:52,600 --> 01:09:55,479
but there are these giant conventions and they just get

1335
01:09:55,520 --> 01:09:57,439
bigger and bigger and bigger every year, and they pop

1336
01:09:57,520 --> 01:10:00,359
up in every city and it's like not just I mean,

1337
01:10:00,399 --> 01:10:01,720
when I was a kid, there used to be comic

1338
01:10:01,720 --> 01:10:05,079
book conventions at maybe a few cities, and the San

1339
01:10:05,119 --> 01:10:07,399
Diego Comic con is very famous. I went to that

1340
01:10:07,479 --> 01:10:08,960
when I was a kid. No, it's neat, you know,

1341
01:10:09,079 --> 01:10:14,479
Spider Man, Batman. But now it has become this gigantic

1342
01:10:14,600 --> 01:10:17,560
industry and the big I'm not joking. Look this up.

1343
01:10:17,600 --> 01:10:22,600
The A listers can even make more money by convention

1344
01:10:22,920 --> 01:10:28,560
appearances than they do in their films. Chris Evans, the

1345
01:10:28,560 --> 01:10:32,039
guy who's Captain America, he can make more at one

1346
01:10:32,119 --> 01:10:35,079
convention than he does, you know, in the whole I'm

1347
01:10:35,079 --> 01:10:39,039
not joking, look that up. It's crazy. And so it's

1348
01:10:39,359 --> 01:10:46,960
it's just this whole other realm of the cosplay theme.

1349
01:10:47,319 --> 01:10:49,520
That's that's kind of taking on a new life of

1350
01:10:49,560 --> 01:10:52,199
its own. I've been speculating with some of my friends

1351
01:10:52,239 --> 01:10:55,840
that I think what they might even do in the future,

1352
01:10:55,880 --> 01:10:59,600
I'm not joking, but but so we think about, oh,

1353
01:10:59,600 --> 01:11:02,279
it's going to Logan's run. There's gonna be you know,

1354
01:11:02,439 --> 01:11:06,520
like a big plastic city, smart city. No, no, no,

1355
01:11:07,159 --> 01:11:08,840
here's what I think they're gonna do. I think they

1356
01:11:08,880 --> 01:11:13,319
will actually create, like, imagine a whole state or a

1357
01:11:13,359 --> 01:11:18,039
whole region that is Avatar World. Imagine a whole land

1358
01:11:18,159 --> 01:11:21,000
that is Harry Potter Land, and you can literally go

1359
01:11:21,079 --> 01:11:23,640
immerse yourself in that world. Now, it'll be totally a

1360
01:11:23,720 --> 01:11:26,159
sy op, totally mind control. By the way, this is

1361
01:11:26,199 --> 01:11:29,279
don't steal this. This is my idea for a sci

1362
01:11:29,319 --> 01:11:33,079
fi dystopia. Of course, you know you can if you

1363
01:11:33,079 --> 01:11:35,920
write a dystopian story that way, you can't use Avatar

1364
01:11:36,000 --> 01:11:39,319
or anything like that. You get sued. But I think

1365
01:11:39,359 --> 01:11:41,439
that I think that's what they're gonna do. And Disney

1366
01:11:41,600 --> 01:11:45,520
was the test bed for this. So I don't think

1367
01:11:45,560 --> 01:11:47,960
it'll totally all be virtual. I think you'll have I mean,

1368
01:11:48,000 --> 01:11:49,800
I think we're a long way away from people totally

1369
01:11:49,840 --> 01:11:52,760
living inside the matrix. But you know, we're going to

1370
01:11:52,840 --> 01:11:57,520
continue to see these big DARP Pentagon style projects where

1371
01:11:57,520 --> 01:12:04,600
they create, you know, entire areas. I mean, I'm amazed.

1372
01:12:04,640 --> 01:12:09,119
For example, at disney in down in Florida, which I've

1373
01:12:09,159 --> 01:12:10,840
been a few times in my life. Last time i

1374
01:12:10,840 --> 01:12:14,239
went was about five years ago. And so when I

1375
01:12:14,319 --> 01:12:16,680
was a kid, you would go to Disneyland and there

1376
01:12:16,680 --> 01:12:20,119
would be the Magic Kingdom, which was kind of the

1377
01:12:20,159 --> 01:12:23,279
central theme park, and then they added there was Epcot

1378
01:12:23,359 --> 01:12:26,159
Magic Kingdom that was kind of it maybe a few

1379
01:12:26,199 --> 01:12:30,920
beaches and resorts or something. Now when you go there

1380
01:12:31,000 --> 01:12:35,720
are whole worlds, Like you go to Harry Potter World,

1381
01:12:36,199 --> 01:12:40,840
you go to you know, they're opening Avatar World now,

1382
01:12:41,640 --> 01:12:46,439
so entire parks are expanding based on Avatar, Harry Potter.

1383
01:12:46,720 --> 01:12:48,039
It just kind of blew me out. I was like,

1384
01:12:48,159 --> 01:12:54,479
I cannot believe this is insane. So it's almost like Vegas,

1385
01:12:54,800 --> 01:12:58,760
you know what Vegas is for adults. It's gonna I

1386
01:12:58,760 --> 01:13:02,079
think it's going to merge into something like Disney World,

1387
01:13:02,119 --> 01:13:04,880
and the dystopia that we're gonna see is going to

1388
01:13:04,920 --> 01:13:07,960
be something just mind boggling like that.

1389
01:13:08,760 --> 01:13:11,600
Speaker 1: I've got nothing against the superhero concept. I used to

1390
01:13:11,640 --> 01:13:14,600
read not very much, but I used to read Marvel

1391
01:13:15,079 --> 01:13:17,640
annuals when I was a kid. But I kind of

1392
01:13:18,279 --> 01:13:20,640
preferred some of the lesser known superheroes. Like there was

1393
01:13:20,680 --> 01:13:23,119
one guy there was made of Stone, and there was

1394
01:13:23,159 --> 01:13:25,479
another guy that was like Iceman or wherever he used

1395
01:13:25,520 --> 01:13:28,720
to silver Surfer, I don't remember what they helped. Some

1396
01:13:28,800 --> 01:13:30,840
of the lesser known, you know, of the of the

1397
01:13:30,880 --> 01:13:33,479
pantheon were interesting to me. But when you get guys

1398
01:13:33,479 --> 01:13:36,119
that are like your age or my age, and they're

1399
01:13:36,199 --> 01:13:39,199
kind of like on a weekend, you know, kind of

1400
01:13:39,239 --> 01:13:41,319
kissing their kids and their wife and then say, you know,

1401
01:13:41,359 --> 01:13:42,920
for they I don't know if there is such a

1402
01:13:42,920 --> 01:13:44,800
man as astro Man, but they're kind of putting on

1403
01:13:44,840 --> 01:13:46,920
a fucking cape and going off the weekend. I am

1404
01:13:46,960 --> 01:13:48,840
astro Man, and this kind of.

1405
01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:51,319
Speaker 2: Wonder Now, this is becoming people's identities, and that's because

1406
01:13:51,359 --> 01:13:57,039
they've lost their traditional heritage and identities. So they're derascinated

1407
01:13:57,119 --> 01:14:01,079
and they're just kind of floating and so in consumerist culture.

1408
01:14:01,239 --> 01:14:04,840
Just like you can buy a new gender quote unquote,

1409
01:14:04,920 --> 01:14:08,920
people are buying and purchasing new identities based on you know,

1410
01:14:09,000 --> 01:14:13,439
these these fictional worlds, these imaginal worlds. Uh. And absolutely

1411
01:14:13,640 --> 01:14:15,960
that's been that's been designed and engineered. And all you

1412
01:14:16,000 --> 01:14:18,880
have to do to to note that that's true is

1413
01:14:18,880 --> 01:14:21,800
study the history of Disney World and Disneyland. Well, have

1414
01:14:21,880 --> 01:14:23,960
you been to have you been to Epcot? By chance?

1415
01:14:24,079 --> 01:14:25,840
Speaker 1: No? No? I when you went to the States once

1416
01:14:25,880 --> 01:14:28,640
and it was New York only I didn't get outside

1417
01:14:28,720 --> 01:14:29,079
New York.

1418
01:14:29,159 --> 01:14:32,800
Speaker 2: So it's it's something to see just because it will

1419
01:14:32,840 --> 01:14:35,880
really blow your mind. And then you know, and I

1420
01:14:36,159 --> 01:14:38,920
was hipped to all of the you know, conspiracy stuff

1421
01:14:38,920 --> 01:14:41,560
the last time that I went to to Disney and Florida,

1422
01:14:42,359 --> 01:14:44,079
and I did it kind of as a project to

1423
01:14:44,239 --> 01:14:46,279
observe it, and it was mind blowing. I mean, you

1424
01:14:46,279 --> 01:14:51,800
you the for example, when you go through Epcot, which

1425
01:14:51,840 --> 01:14:54,079
is not that great of a ride, it's kind of goofy,

1426
01:14:54,199 --> 01:14:56,680
but you you just you know, I'm talking about the

1427
01:14:56,680 --> 01:14:59,600
Big golf Ball, right, that's Epcot Center. So you ride

1428
01:14:59,840 --> 01:15:03,000
this roller coaster that just kind of circles around inside

1429
01:15:03,039 --> 01:15:06,960
the Big Ball I'm not making this up. You can

1430
01:15:07,039 --> 01:15:10,319
I think people have, you know, posted their videos of

1431
01:15:10,359 --> 01:15:12,840
it on YouTube. You can go watch people writing EPCOT.

1432
01:15:13,600 --> 01:15:17,960
So you go through the story is a mythology, and

1433
01:15:18,000 --> 01:15:21,840
it's the history of mankind inside EPCOT. And so you're like, oh,

1434
01:15:22,039 --> 01:15:25,520
here you are as the Darwinian Apes, and then you

1435
01:15:25,560 --> 01:15:28,800
grew up into these ancient civilizations and so you're writing

1436
01:15:28,800 --> 01:15:32,520
through the animatronic Egyptian Land and you're going through I'm

1437
01:15:32,560 --> 01:15:34,840
not joking, you're going through ancient China Land. And so

1438
01:15:34,920 --> 01:15:37,640
then at the end of it, I'm at a loss

1439
01:15:37,640 --> 01:15:41,399
for words just because it stupid. So the last part

1440
01:15:41,399 --> 01:15:44,840
of it is like if you've moved up into the

1441
01:15:44,880 --> 01:15:47,840
present day of mankind and it's like, where are we

1442
01:15:47,880 --> 01:15:51,239
going into the future? Right, because EPCOT is all about futurism.

1443
01:15:51,720 --> 01:15:56,239
And the very last second to last thing that you

1444
01:15:56,319 --> 01:16:01,359
see is a nerd in his basement creating a computer.

1445
01:16:01,439 --> 01:16:03,279
And it's like this little Bill Gates. It's like a

1446
01:16:03,279 --> 01:16:08,119
little animatronic Bill Gates guy at in his garage working

1447
01:16:08,159 --> 01:16:11,960
on a computer. Uh, and it's you know, and then

1448
01:16:12,000 --> 01:16:15,640
and then EPCOT, the little module that you're writing in.

1449
01:16:15,920 --> 01:16:20,800
Then you go into the matrix that's how it ends. Wow. Yeah,

1450
01:16:20,960 --> 01:16:22,319
now you say, well, what's the point of that? So

1451
01:16:22,399 --> 01:16:25,319
what who cares? That's a stupid ride. No, No, EPCOT

1452
01:16:25,520 --> 01:16:30,319
is an indoctrination center. The whole thing is the entire project,

1453
01:16:30,359 --> 01:16:34,680
the whole It's all created by the Pentagon. That's why

1454
01:16:35,720 --> 01:16:39,079
Walt Disney was doing all of that propaganda. He was

1455
01:16:39,079 --> 01:16:41,720
making all his propaganda movies. He was involved in the

1456
01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:46,600
Laurel Canyon stuff. Uh. You know, go back to Daffy Duck.

1457
01:16:47,000 --> 01:16:50,520
Uh telling you to join the military and pay your taxes.

1458
01:16:51,119 --> 01:16:54,119
That's all. That's all propaganda. And so it's been linked

1459
01:16:54,159 --> 01:16:55,840
to the Pentagon the entire time.

1460
01:16:56,560 --> 01:16:56,680
Speaker 1: Uh.

1461
01:16:57,319 --> 01:16:59,159
Speaker 2: By the way, Disney is its own city state. Do

1462
01:16:59,239 --> 01:17:00,600
you know that it's like the Vatican?

1463
01:17:01,159 --> 01:17:04,359
Speaker 1: The Vatican. Wow, it's like like DC. I suppose as

1464
01:17:04,359 --> 01:17:06,840
well to some extent, you know, like it's Did you.

1465
01:17:06,800 --> 01:17:09,359
Speaker 2: Know that it has its own laws and constitutions. No?

1466
01:17:09,439 --> 01:17:10,880
Speaker 1: I didn't know that. But why am I?

1467
01:17:10,880 --> 01:17:13,640
Speaker 2: People? People do not believe that. I swear to you

1468
01:17:13,680 --> 01:17:14,760
that's true. Go look it up.

1469
01:17:15,920 --> 01:17:19,239
Speaker 1: Well, Well, you know utopian sorry, dystopian sci fi that

1470
01:17:19,279 --> 01:17:22,520
we've been discussing. One of the common themes is that

1471
01:17:22,720 --> 01:17:27,279
the idea of distractions, isn't it. It's all amusements, isn't it,

1472
01:17:27,319 --> 01:17:30,000
Things to just kind of do instead of instead of

1473
01:17:30,039 --> 01:17:31,920
real life. It's kind of things to keep you busy.

1474
01:17:32,159 --> 01:17:35,119
And it's like, oh, that's wonderful. Listen. Wonderful that you know, and.

1475
01:17:35,359 --> 01:17:38,479
Speaker 2: Wow, yeah, this so Roger Waters song Amusing Ourselves to

1476
01:17:38,560 --> 01:17:41,720
Death based on based on the Norman Mailer book or something.

1477
01:17:41,800 --> 01:17:43,880
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, again, very very ahead of its time, that

1478
01:17:43,920 --> 01:17:47,520
book actually so. And this is why my comment about

1479
01:17:47,600 --> 01:17:51,600
dystopia is, this is why I have never had any

1480
01:17:51,880 --> 01:17:55,079
time for theme parks. I've never had any interest in it. Now,

1481
01:17:55,279 --> 01:17:56,960
somebody wants to get up and going to Merry Go

1482
01:17:57,119 --> 01:17:59,159
Round or maybe going a roller coaster, there's kind of

1483
01:17:59,199 --> 01:18:01,279
a you know, there's a best throw there. Maybe not

1484
01:18:01,319 --> 01:18:03,600
only a Merry Go Round, but on the roller coaster

1485
01:18:03,640 --> 01:18:06,079
it can be quite a physical experience. So I get that.

1486
01:18:06,119 --> 01:18:07,920
I can see now. To me, it just looks like

1487
01:18:07,920 --> 01:18:09,520
an accident waiting to happen. So you're not going to

1488
01:18:09,600 --> 01:18:11,600
get me up in one of those. But in general,

1489
01:18:11,720 --> 01:18:14,560
what you described about Epcot whatever, I'm like, why are

1490
01:18:14,600 --> 01:18:18,279
we doing this? And I've been to some interactive museums

1491
01:18:18,319 --> 01:18:20,800
and stuff. That I found interesting. It depends where it's

1492
01:18:20,800 --> 01:18:22,399
pitched in what the level is, isn't it you know,

1493
01:18:22,439 --> 01:18:24,560
But in general, what we would call a theme park

1494
01:18:24,600 --> 01:18:28,159
to me is like why am I here? Okay, we'll

1495
01:18:28,159 --> 01:18:30,319
get a hot dog and then we'll go okay, because

1496
01:18:30,359 --> 01:18:32,439
I just don't want to be here. It's always felt

1497
01:18:32,439 --> 01:18:35,119
to be like one massive distraction, especially when they try

1498
01:18:35,119 --> 01:18:37,399
to recreate things. You know, the whole idea of going

1499
01:18:37,439 --> 01:18:39,760
to the middle of a landlocked contrary and oh they've

1500
01:18:39,760 --> 01:18:42,520
created a They've created a beach, so god forbid you

1501
01:18:42,560 --> 01:18:44,199
go to the beach. You don't have to go to

1502
01:18:44,199 --> 01:18:47,239
the beach anymore. You can go to beach World. Yes, exactly,

1503
01:18:47,920 --> 01:18:51,640
completely enclosed, you know, sort of climatically controlled, three hundred

1504
01:18:51,680 --> 01:18:53,520
and sixty five day a year experience.

1505
01:18:53,600 --> 01:18:53,800
Speaker 2: You know.

1506
01:18:54,000 --> 01:18:57,279
Speaker 1: Beaches are so yesterday. Welcome to you know, ultra beach

1507
01:18:57,399 --> 01:18:58,199
or whatever it happens to be.

1508
01:18:58,399 --> 01:19:01,920
Speaker 2: That was kind of inn the last Terry Gilliam movies,

1509
01:19:02,520 --> 01:19:08,319
Z Zero. The I have mixed views on it has

1510
01:19:08,399 --> 01:19:11,399
some interesting insights, and you know, he's always very good

1511
01:19:11,399 --> 01:19:14,960
with cinematography, but I don't know, it's kind of to me,

1512
01:19:15,000 --> 01:19:18,439
it ended kind of nihilistic, but I'll tell you the

1513
01:19:18,479 --> 01:19:23,279
movie to watch for this point is the independent film

1514
01:19:23,279 --> 01:19:26,039
that came out four or five years ago called tomorrow Land,

1515
01:19:26,159 --> 01:19:29,199
Escape from tomorrow Land, or Escape from Tomorrow I forget

1516
01:19:29,199 --> 01:19:32,479
the name of it exactly, but are you familiar with that.

1517
01:19:33,119 --> 01:19:34,800
Speaker 1: I am not to know what you're Oh, this is.

1518
01:19:34,800 --> 01:19:36,800
Speaker 2: A brilliant film. You got to watch this, you will

1519
01:19:36,840 --> 01:19:39,560
love this. So it's all shot in black and white.

1520
01:19:39,760 --> 01:19:44,079
And the selling point marketing point, which there's no way

1521
01:19:44,119 --> 01:19:46,119
this could be true. But the marketing point was that

1522
01:19:46,199 --> 01:19:50,640
supposedly the filmmakers snuck into Disney and filmed the entire

1523
01:19:50,720 --> 01:19:54,560
thing in the theme part without Disney knowing. Now, there's

1524
01:19:54,600 --> 01:19:59,479
no way that that's true because the Disney has, like

1525
01:19:59,680 --> 01:20:03,319
it's the whole theme park is a smart city under surveillance,

1526
01:20:03,399 --> 01:20:07,119
so there's like you have to scan biometrics to get in. Like,

1527
01:20:07,720 --> 01:20:10,319
there's no way they did that. But that was a

1528
01:20:10,359 --> 01:20:12,600
selling marketing point, which is I guess kind of clever.

1529
01:20:12,720 --> 01:20:15,960
But this film and I did do an analysis of

1530
01:20:16,039 --> 01:20:19,199
a long time ago, but this was overlooked. People didn't

1531
01:20:19,560 --> 01:20:21,760
I guess didn't see it. Maybe didn't have as big

1532
01:20:21,760 --> 01:20:24,720
a marketing as you would think, but very very deep,

1533
01:20:24,920 --> 01:20:30,960
very esoteric, very dark themes in this it's a dystopian

1534
01:20:31,039 --> 01:20:34,199
kind of story actually, but it shows all of the

1535
01:20:34,199 --> 01:20:38,079
stuff that I'm talking about in the movie. Now. It's

1536
01:20:38,159 --> 01:20:42,840
curious because what I'm suggesting is that it would seem

1537
01:20:42,880 --> 01:20:46,319
Disney was behind the film if they allowed I mean,

1538
01:20:46,560 --> 01:20:48,960
you know all that goes into shooting a film. There's

1539
01:20:48,960 --> 01:20:51,600
no way they did this without Disney knowing inside the

1540
01:20:51,640 --> 01:20:56,479
freaking theme park. But so if Disney was involved covertly,

1541
01:20:57,560 --> 01:21:00,880
then you are about to have your mind blown about

1542
01:21:01,680 --> 01:21:03,800
revelation of the method when you watch this movie.

1543
01:21:04,000 --> 01:21:06,680
Speaker 1: No, that's that's just I think moved to the top

1544
01:21:06,720 --> 01:21:09,880
of my watch list. To follow up on something that

1545
01:21:09,920 --> 01:21:14,479
you mentioned in one of the previous installments of this series.

1546
01:21:15,359 --> 01:21:17,239
You mentioned that, you know, there were laughable idea of

1547
01:21:17,439 --> 01:21:20,239
whole states being given over to particular themes. You said, like,

1548
01:21:20,279 --> 01:21:22,600
you know, laughed at the idea of Harry potter Land,

1549
01:21:23,079 --> 01:21:25,359
And I immediately thought, well, you know, west World, what

1550
01:21:25,479 --> 01:21:28,840
happens exactly. West World's a new thing on TV. But

1551
01:21:29,079 --> 01:21:30,840
I'm thinking back which I haven't seen yet, but you

1552
01:21:30,880 --> 01:21:32,600
can tell us about that in the second But going

1553
01:21:32,640 --> 01:21:34,600
back to the original movie of West World, based on

1554
01:21:34,640 --> 01:21:37,159
a Michael Crichton's story. What you've got there is a

1555
01:21:37,239 --> 01:21:41,600
grown men going to just regressing into like, you know,

1556
01:21:41,720 --> 01:21:46,000
pre pubacent boyhood, going to this wild West theme park

1557
01:21:46,399 --> 01:21:49,640
with the latest tech where they can pretend to be cowboys,

1558
01:21:49,920 --> 01:21:52,880
and not only pretend to be cowboys, badass cowboys that

1559
01:21:52,960 --> 01:21:55,680
get the girl, drink the bourbon, and get the gundawn

1560
01:21:55,760 --> 01:22:00,479
the bad guy. These weak saplings couldn't fight the way

1561
01:22:00,479 --> 01:22:02,840
out of a wet paper bag, but they can. They

1562
01:22:02,840 --> 01:22:05,159
can all be Clint Eastwood for the weekend. You know,

1563
01:22:05,920 --> 01:22:09,680
And what is that if not that immersive virtual you know,

1564
01:22:09,760 --> 01:22:13,239
not virtual reality, but that immersive experience of giving yourself.

1565
01:22:13,359 --> 01:22:16,039
It's it's beyond the fan convention, isn't it is? It

1566
01:22:16,119 --> 01:22:17,640
just turns into No.

1567
01:22:17,640 --> 01:22:20,720
Speaker 2: That's exactly right. And Michael Crichton has it to where,

1568
01:22:21,000 --> 01:22:24,399
you know, in the story, it's it's rich people who

1569
01:22:24,439 --> 01:22:27,319
can pay, you know, these exorbitant amounts. And I'm just

1570
01:22:27,359 --> 01:22:29,479
saying it would be funny if you extended that to

1571
01:22:29,520 --> 01:22:31,680
be like, oh no, no, you're actually going to like

1572
01:22:31,800 --> 01:22:36,159
Tennessee will become Harry potter Land. I'm joking, but uh,

1573
01:22:36,359 --> 01:22:39,199
but yeah, no, I did do an analysis of Westworld,

1574
01:22:39,239 --> 01:22:42,880
and I watched it and k Jonathan Nolan was the

1575
01:22:42,920 --> 01:22:47,319
writer and then JJ Abrams directed it, and Jonathan Nolan

1576
01:22:47,359 --> 01:22:49,840
being Christopher Nolan's brother, and so you're gonna get a

1577
01:22:49,880 --> 01:22:52,920
lot of the Nolan themes of the Maze, which always

1578
01:22:52,960 --> 01:22:56,399
comes up in Christopher Nolan stuff. Uh, and so there

1579
01:22:56,439 --> 01:23:01,319
were interesting elements to it. But I I was it

1580
01:23:01,359 --> 01:23:05,239
was underwhelming for me. I expected more. I thought it

1581
01:23:05,239 --> 01:23:08,439
would would give us more than kind of. I mean,

1582
01:23:08,520 --> 01:23:11,159
they did diverge a little bit and introduce, you know,

1583
01:23:11,439 --> 01:23:17,640
new ideas building on the Crichton story, but I just

1584
01:23:17,920 --> 01:23:21,880
I felt like it's still it just lacked something, something

1585
01:23:21,960 --> 01:23:24,520
was missing. It was it was a little too predictable.

1586
01:23:24,600 --> 01:23:26,720
Everybody kind of everybody that I know that watched it

1587
01:23:26,800 --> 01:23:28,479
kind of figured it out, like right away what was

1588
01:23:28,520 --> 01:23:31,279
going on, what the what the plot was. I don't

1589
01:23:31,319 --> 01:23:33,680
mean that it's a synthetic city. Everybody knows that, but

1590
01:23:33,960 --> 01:23:37,880
I mean the inter story plot of why the characters

1591
01:23:37,880 --> 01:23:40,840
are doing what they're doing. But it does have the

1592
01:23:40,960 --> 01:23:43,520
very point that you're talking about. It's the prediction of

1593
01:23:44,760 --> 01:23:51,319
the elites in this in this story, immersing themselves in

1594
01:23:51,319 --> 01:23:53,199
the synthetic world because they're the only ones that have

1595
01:23:53,279 --> 01:23:56,199
the money, you know, to be involved in this, and

1596
01:23:56,239 --> 01:24:02,880
then the synthetic world kind of breaks out. It's encasement,

1597
01:24:03,720 --> 01:24:05,439
and you know, that's what we're kind of left with

1598
01:24:05,560 --> 01:24:07,039
is you know, where are we going to go next

1599
01:24:07,079 --> 01:24:10,079
next season? You know, are the the bots actually going

1600
01:24:10,119 --> 01:24:12,479
to like take over the world? You know, this kind

1601
01:24:12,520 --> 01:24:13,279
of stuff.

1602
01:24:13,399 --> 01:24:15,439
Speaker 1: Further to what we were talking about, this theme of

1603
01:24:15,439 --> 01:24:19,199
emasculation in general, and say, this is not just affecting men,

1604
01:24:19,239 --> 01:24:23,319
it's affecting all human beings to some extent, particularly those

1605
01:24:23,319 --> 01:24:25,840
who are like losing themselves and losing their bodies and

1606
01:24:25,920 --> 01:24:30,520
their minds. Is there any link I wonder between this

1607
01:24:30,680 --> 01:24:34,239
demonization on the one hand, the other holding up with

1608
01:24:34,279 --> 01:24:37,720
this superhero character, but on the other hand, a demonization

1609
01:24:38,039 --> 01:24:41,439
of manhood or womanhood in the real world. You know,

1610
01:24:41,479 --> 01:24:44,239
it's almost like, yeah, you get screen superhero, but you

1611
01:24:44,279 --> 01:24:46,800
can't be a superhero. You can't as a father, as

1612
01:24:46,840 --> 01:24:50,600
a husband, or as a wife or mother or grandmother

1613
01:24:50,800 --> 01:24:52,840
or son or you know, you can't attee in that

1614
01:24:52,920 --> 01:24:55,199
in your real life. You know, you've got to be

1615
01:24:55,520 --> 01:24:58,680
pathetic and weak and the rest of it. And you

1616
01:24:58,680 --> 01:25:01,439
you know, be told what to do and to go along,

1617
01:25:01,479 --> 01:25:04,479
to get along, and is there any connection between that?

1618
01:25:04,560 --> 01:25:07,079
And then you look at people like Bill Gates and

1619
01:25:07,479 --> 01:25:10,760
now look again, not every I'm not saying everybody's got

1620
01:25:10,760 --> 01:25:13,479
to be a particular type of individual in body or

1621
01:25:13,520 --> 01:25:16,880
in mind, but for the purposes of our discussion, I'm

1622
01:25:16,880 --> 01:25:19,960
just looking at parallels. And you look at someone like

1623
01:25:20,039 --> 01:25:24,359
that who's physically deeply unimpressive, and then you look you

1624
01:25:24,359 --> 01:25:26,600
think of Wizard of Oz and the story there and

1625
01:25:26,640 --> 01:25:29,319
what's revealed to us in the end, you know, behind

1626
01:25:29,319 --> 01:25:32,159
the curtain. And then you think of someone like David Rockefeller,

1627
01:25:32,479 --> 01:25:35,279
for example, who he recently bought it, didn't he And

1628
01:25:35,800 --> 01:25:39,319
that's sort of like, you know, what a decrepit old demon?

1629
01:25:40,000 --> 01:25:42,760
I mean, you know, what could could a man aspire

1630
01:25:42,840 --> 01:25:45,960
to be anything less? If you see what I mean?

1631
01:25:46,439 --> 01:25:49,199
And so I'm just wondering about interesting parallels there, about

1632
01:25:49,199 --> 01:25:51,239
the messages that were handled about what it is to

1633
01:25:51,279 --> 01:25:52,760
be a man, what it is to be a woman,

1634
01:25:53,239 --> 01:25:56,119
you know, regardless of your sexuality and the future.

1635
01:25:56,159 --> 01:25:59,279
Speaker 2: You know. Yeah, well, there were very strong feminist themes

1636
01:25:59,520 --> 01:26:03,880
in West world this this go around, And that's not

1637
01:26:03,960 --> 01:26:07,239
my interpretation. That's pretty pretty obvious and you know, other

1638
01:26:07,439 --> 01:26:10,960
critics that we're writing on it, we're championing the feminist themes.

1639
01:26:12,239 --> 01:26:16,960
So basically, there's not really any good male characters in

1640
01:26:17,000 --> 01:26:22,399
the film. Maybe the black guy who's the Arnold character.

1641
01:26:22,399 --> 01:26:24,479
I forget the actor's name, but I guess you could

1642
01:26:24,479 --> 01:26:27,239
already he's kind of a good guy, but then you

1643
01:26:27,279 --> 01:26:30,239
realize that he's not a guy. So a little bit

1644
01:26:30,279 --> 01:26:34,840
of a spoiler there, But the message there, of course

1645
01:26:35,039 --> 01:26:37,439
is another one of the themes that we've seen throughout

1646
01:26:37,479 --> 01:26:40,760
many of these transhumanist films is that the bots are

1647
01:26:40,800 --> 01:26:44,800
humanized and the humans are roboticized. So humans are robotic,

1648
01:26:44,840 --> 01:26:48,520
they're totally driven by evil. Oh but don't worry, because

1649
01:26:48,800 --> 01:26:52,479
there's a bright future of the bots, and they are

1650
01:26:52,920 --> 01:26:58,039
compassionate and strong and virtuous and all of these all

1651
01:26:58,119 --> 01:27:02,279
these selling point it's basically of transhumanism that you see

1652
01:27:02,319 --> 01:27:05,960
in movies like AI. You know, where the Haley Joel

1653
01:27:06,000 --> 01:27:13,039
osmic character is has the empathy and the humane characteristics,

1654
01:27:13,039 --> 01:27:15,600
and then the humans in that movie are for the

1655
01:27:15,600 --> 01:27:18,880
most part all shit has totally and that's by design too.

1656
01:27:18,920 --> 01:27:22,520
I think that's that's all part of the inversion, really

1657
01:27:22,600 --> 01:27:24,560
is what this is all about that we've been talking

1658
01:27:24,560 --> 01:27:27,720
about with you know, the virchant Russell's quotes and whatnot.

1659
01:27:29,119 --> 01:27:32,439
So yes, I think you're onto something there with the

1660
01:27:32,479 --> 01:27:37,600
idea of I think you're right. So what I said earlier,

1661
01:27:37,640 --> 01:27:40,800
you could you could argue that women are being masculinized,

1662
01:27:40,880 --> 01:27:44,640
men are being feminized in the real world. But as

1663
01:27:44,720 --> 01:27:48,520
long as a big portion of your time is and

1664
01:27:48,760 --> 01:27:53,039
attention and focus and energy is directed to the synthetic world,

1665
01:27:53,600 --> 01:27:56,079
then the elites are happy. I think that's the main point.

1666
01:27:56,600 --> 01:27:59,720
Speaker 1: We could discuss this all day really, But and as

1667
01:27:59,720 --> 01:28:03,319
we begin to bring things for close this time around

1668
01:28:03,720 --> 01:28:06,560
to what extent this is a theme that came out

1669
01:28:06,560 --> 01:28:09,039
in your book also, do you think that kind of

1670
01:28:09,039 --> 01:28:11,119
a coming to the surface of a lot of these

1671
01:28:11,199 --> 01:28:15,960
themes and people coming to an understanding of some of

1672
01:28:15,960 --> 01:28:18,800
what they're being presented with and how that's working. There

1673
01:28:18,840 --> 01:28:22,039
seem to be two divergent trends. One is people kind

1674
01:28:22,079 --> 01:28:24,119
of waking up to some of these ideas that we're

1675
01:28:24,119 --> 01:28:27,680
talking about, and other people getting further and further lost

1676
01:28:28,640 --> 01:28:31,079
in this kind of like matrix. So how do you

1677
01:28:31,119 --> 01:28:34,039
read that situation? What do you feel negative about, what

1678
01:28:34,079 --> 01:28:35,159
do you feel positive about?

1679
01:28:35,199 --> 01:28:38,840
Speaker 2: You know. Well, the positive side is I said for

1680
01:28:38,920 --> 01:28:43,319
a long time, I think precisely, yes, the establishment the

1681
01:28:43,359 --> 01:28:46,279
system might master technology, and we can think about it

1682
01:28:46,319 --> 01:28:50,439
like the Death Star, you know, but it's kind of

1683
01:28:50,560 --> 01:28:56,279
like the rebellion in Star Wars consistently says to the Empire.

1684
01:28:57,439 --> 01:28:59,840
You know. I think that Darth Vader even says, you know,

1685
01:29:00,000 --> 01:29:02,920
don't put too much trust in this, this technological terror

1686
01:29:02,920 --> 01:29:07,439
that you've created, because human humanity in the world, the

1687
01:29:07,520 --> 01:29:11,800
universe is more than matter and techne their their spirit,

1688
01:29:12,279 --> 01:29:15,279
which I think has precedence over those things. And so yes,

1689
01:29:15,359 --> 01:29:19,520
even though they might master mind control and these different tactics,

1690
01:29:19,600 --> 01:29:23,760
the good the good takeaway from Logan's run and from

1691
01:29:23,880 --> 01:29:29,760
Zardas is that the elite systems usually collapse in on themselves.

1692
01:29:29,920 --> 01:29:32,199
And you can see that in all the attempts throughout

1693
01:29:32,239 --> 01:29:36,880
history at trying to create these unrealistic utopias, is that

1694
01:29:36,920 --> 01:29:39,359
they eventually collapse. And so yeah, you might have to

1695
01:29:39,399 --> 01:29:44,520
go through a period of of of the dystopia, you know,

1696
01:29:44,560 --> 01:29:47,920
the dark period, but they they don't work because of

1697
01:29:47,960 --> 01:29:51,159
the fact that they're self destructive. And so anytime you

1698
01:29:51,199 --> 01:29:55,760
get these systems that turn on humanity itself, and the

1699
01:29:55,800 --> 01:30:00,239
problem for the elite is that they too are humans.

1700
01:30:00,079 --> 01:30:04,279
It's a self destructive cancer, and cancer eats away at

1701
01:30:04,319 --> 01:30:06,880
all of them. You know, they might put all these

1702
01:30:08,840 --> 01:30:11,520
they might attack all of us with this stuff, but

1703
01:30:12,039 --> 01:30:15,640
you can't totally immunize yourself from it. And that's what

1704
01:30:15,680 --> 01:30:18,479
we saw that the elites trying to do in both

1705
01:30:18,600 --> 01:30:22,560
Zardas and Logan's Run to an extent, but it doesn't work.

1706
01:30:22,720 --> 01:30:25,520
So I think that because it's built on a faulty

1707
01:30:25,520 --> 01:30:29,720
anthropology and a faulty worldview, ultimately it's not going to work.

1708
01:30:30,279 --> 01:30:32,680
Speaker 1: No, I think a lot of the techno utopianism is

1709
01:30:32,720 --> 01:30:38,039
really which you can put the Zeitgeist movement into that category.

1710
01:30:38,600 --> 01:30:42,560
I think it's not unlike in many ways the twenty

1711
01:30:42,600 --> 01:30:45,720
twelve idea, you know, the idea of a shifting consciousness

1712
01:30:45,760 --> 01:30:49,319
and that we're going to ascend or be raptured or

1713
01:30:49,319 --> 01:30:51,640
whatever it happens to be. The idea it's this sort

1714
01:30:51,680 --> 01:30:54,880
of magical process that's going to allow us to side

1715
01:30:54,920 --> 01:30:57,640
step difficult problems, you know, a bit like going to

1716
01:30:57,760 --> 01:31:01,920
adulthood from childhood, having to go through teenage years when

1717
01:31:01,920 --> 01:31:03,319
you have to kind of learn.

1718
01:31:04,520 --> 01:31:08,680
Speaker 2: Limitations are a good thing. And there's no way to

1719
01:31:08,800 --> 01:31:11,439
ever get rid of all limitations. And really that whole

1720
01:31:11,439 --> 01:31:14,359
project is built on that presubposition. That's actually what aldis

1721
01:31:14,399 --> 01:31:16,840
Texley says that he says the enemies of the future

1722
01:31:17,399 --> 01:31:19,720
will be people who in any way and in any

1723
01:31:19,760 --> 01:31:23,479
sense believe in limitations and exclusions. So that's why you're

1724
01:31:23,479 --> 01:31:26,000
seeing the attack on language, the idea of oh we

1725
01:31:26,079 --> 01:31:29,720
have sixty genders now, oh, words don't mean what they mean.

1726
01:31:31,000 --> 01:31:33,359
All of that. There's just no way that can work.

1727
01:31:33,439 --> 01:31:35,399
I mean, it might cause some havoc, it might cause

1728
01:31:35,439 --> 01:31:39,000
destabilization and wreck a lot of things for a long time,

1729
01:31:39,840 --> 01:31:42,199
but it's just so fundamentally out of a chord with

1730
01:31:42,880 --> 01:31:45,560
the actual world in which we live that you know,

1731
01:31:45,600 --> 01:31:49,960
you can only sustain synthetic systems for so long before

1732
01:31:50,039 --> 01:31:54,640
they have the internal problem of breakdown. And I don't

1733
01:31:54,680 --> 01:31:56,720
think that they'll ever overcome that. It doesn't matter how

1734
01:31:56,720 --> 01:32:00,279
many bots that you create to program other bots, you're

1735
01:32:00,319 --> 01:32:03,039
never going to escape the natural world.

1736
01:32:03,399 --> 01:32:06,680
Speaker 1: Well, whatever progress they make with virtual reality. To be honest,

1737
01:32:06,800 --> 01:32:09,439
I think that your movies are a great metaphor for this,

1738
01:32:09,560 --> 01:32:13,199
that you know, the screen is bleeding into so called

1739
01:32:13,239 --> 01:32:15,119
real life so much now that you can see a

1740
01:32:15,119 --> 01:32:17,199
lot of individuals that we've referred to who have actually

1741
01:32:17,279 --> 01:32:19,920
kind of lost track of what is what. You know,

1742
01:32:19,960 --> 01:32:21,920
people who are going maybe going to show up for

1743
01:32:22,039 --> 01:32:25,880
work on a target, let's just say, or Walmart. They're

1744
01:32:25,880 --> 01:32:28,319
going to turn up on Monday morning dressed is astro man,

1745
01:32:28,840 --> 01:32:32,479
and they're they're going to walk in and somebody's going

1746
01:32:32,520 --> 01:32:34,840
to go, oh, hi, Jim, you know, what's with the

1747
01:32:35,079 --> 01:32:37,359
what's with the tights and the cape and the and

1748
01:32:37,439 --> 01:32:40,720
the goggles? You know, I am astro man. Yeah, well Jim,

1749
01:32:40,800 --> 01:32:42,880
that's fine, do that in your lunch, char but could

1750
01:32:42,880 --> 01:32:45,279
you get to your station please? No astro man. You

1751
01:32:45,319 --> 01:32:48,199
know when it gets hauled away in the you know,

1752
01:32:48,319 --> 01:32:51,479
to the rubber room. So but I just think that

1753
01:32:51,479 --> 01:32:54,079
that's an increasing trend that we're going to say it's

1754
01:32:54,079 --> 01:32:56,399
going to be an interesting ride because it works both ways.

1755
01:32:56,399 --> 01:32:58,960
Is and it you know, you get stuff, real world stuff,

1756
01:32:58,960 --> 01:33:01,960
it gets turned into movie, you know, it becomes a

1757
01:33:02,000 --> 01:33:05,319
suit called reality TV. I think is a brilliant manifestation

1758
01:33:05,399 --> 01:33:07,640
of this. It's kind of like I'm going to tune

1759
01:33:07,680 --> 01:33:11,600
into the TV for some real reality because the reality,

1760
01:33:12,079 --> 01:33:14,720
the real reality I've got I don't really want so

1761
01:33:14,840 --> 01:33:18,880
let's really really get the real thing on the TV exactly.

1762
01:33:19,000 --> 01:33:21,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you're right, and uh, I mean they're

1763
01:33:21,720 --> 01:33:24,520
gonna keep pushing the limits. But again, you know, it's

1764
01:33:24,640 --> 01:33:27,399
you just can't. You can't force the entire biosphere into

1765
01:33:27,479 --> 01:33:31,279
something that is anti biosphere. And when we look at

1766
01:33:31,760 --> 01:33:34,319
similar projects in the past that have attempted to do

1767
01:33:34,359 --> 01:33:37,720
this kind of stuff, like Bolshevism or Stalinism are great

1768
01:33:37,720 --> 01:33:42,079
examples of trying to impose an ideal that is totally

1769
01:33:42,119 --> 01:33:46,279
mismatched with the real world. It just collapses. And the

1770
01:33:46,560 --> 01:33:51,079
the the Jacques Frescoes and the Saint Simon's uh, and

1771
01:33:51,199 --> 01:33:54,000
the Zeitgeis the types that you're talking about who are

1772
01:33:54,039 --> 01:33:59,000
really kind of at the core of the this this ideology. Uh,

1773
01:33:59,439 --> 01:34:01,520
it's just it's not going to work. I mean, and

1774
01:34:01,560 --> 01:34:06,239
again it's because they arrogantly think they understand everything about

1775
01:34:06,399 --> 01:34:11,840
humanity because they've mastered some technological thing. This is not true.

1776
01:34:11,960 --> 01:34:15,960
I mean, humans are humans, and human persons transcend nature.

1777
01:34:16,119 --> 01:34:19,119
I believe that's part of the theology that I adhere to,

1778
01:34:20,039 --> 01:34:23,079
and so that informs my worldview, and that's the vantage

1779
01:34:23,119 --> 01:34:26,119
point from which I think I can accurately critique and

1780
01:34:27,119 --> 01:34:30,359
argue against the idea that you can engineer Man into

1781
01:34:30,399 --> 01:34:31,520
being something other than Man.

1782
01:34:32,399 --> 01:34:35,920
Speaker 1: Well, to borrow Freeze from Mad Max or either going

1783
01:34:35,960 --> 01:34:39,319
to crash or we're going to crash through So stick

1784
01:34:39,319 --> 01:34:42,279
around to find out which it's going to be. Today, Jay,

1785
01:34:42,399 --> 01:34:46,840
we've been talking about your book Esoteric Hollywood Sex Cults

1786
01:34:46,880 --> 01:34:49,279
and Symbols in Film that's published not so long ago,

1787
01:34:49,399 --> 01:34:50,640
that's available everywhere.

1788
01:34:50,800 --> 01:34:52,520
Speaker 2: If you would please get it, Please get it from

1789
01:34:52,560 --> 01:34:53,439
me at my website.

1790
01:34:53,520 --> 01:34:55,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, tell folks about that, and also just tell

1791
01:34:55,720 --> 01:34:57,840
them you've just shot a TV show that's in the

1792
01:34:57,920 --> 01:35:00,640
can for a broadcast and not too just so, yeah,

1793
01:35:00,640 --> 01:35:02,920
share your web details and tell folks about the TV show.

1794
01:35:03,439 --> 01:35:06,520
Speaker 2: Yeah. So the book can be obtained from me whether

1795
01:35:06,600 --> 01:35:09,600
you're in the US or well actually anywhere in the world.

1796
01:35:09,600 --> 01:35:12,600
I have a outside of the US PayPal that you

1797
01:35:12,600 --> 01:35:14,720
can do too. And yeah, it's a little bit pricey,

1798
01:35:14,760 --> 01:35:16,960
but it helps the author. You know, if you can

1799
01:35:17,000 --> 01:35:21,159
get it directly from me, not through Amazon. Amazon undercuts

1800
01:35:21,159 --> 01:35:25,000
author is pretty bad and they're process and that's why

1801
01:35:25,079 --> 01:35:28,159
they offer it so cheap. But so you can get

1802
01:35:28,199 --> 01:35:30,000
the book there and I do sign the copies, and

1803
01:35:30,000 --> 01:35:33,640
then you can also get access to my archives where

1804
01:35:33,640 --> 01:35:36,680
I have a lot of interviews and talks and podcasts

1805
01:35:36,680 --> 01:35:39,479
and lectures. The second half that you pay for. The

1806
01:35:39,600 --> 01:35:42,680
first half's always free. And then you know probably a

1807
01:35:42,760 --> 01:35:45,800
thousand or so posts and articles at the website, big

1808
01:35:45,920 --> 01:35:48,239
vast archive that you can dive into that's all free.

1809
01:35:48,800 --> 01:35:55,319
And yeah, we just shot seventeen episodes, very high production quality.

1810
01:35:56,000 --> 01:36:00,079
I'm very impressed with what the production company had there

1811
01:36:00,159 --> 01:36:03,640
and how it all turned out. It all went well,

1812
01:36:03,680 --> 01:36:08,119
went pretty smooth, And it'll be basically a Cisco and

1813
01:36:08,159 --> 01:36:11,439
Ebert style show of me and Jay Weiedner of Kubrick's

1814
01:36:11,439 --> 01:36:14,840
Odyssey in Room two thirty seven Fame, going back and

1815
01:36:14,920 --> 01:36:19,119
forth kind of debating and critiquing and analyzing film from

1816
01:36:19,840 --> 01:36:21,920
the kind of vanished point that you that you and

1817
01:36:21,960 --> 01:36:25,359
I've been doing it right. So not the bland ciscl Ebert,

1818
01:36:25,479 --> 01:36:27,399
you know this is good, this is bad. They were

1819
01:36:27,399 --> 01:36:29,840
good actors, they were bad actors of view from the

1820
01:36:29,840 --> 01:36:33,560
symbology side of things. And that's why I think it's

1821
01:36:33,600 --> 01:36:37,159
going to be really high quality, not like anything else

1822
01:36:37,199 --> 01:36:42,079
that's out there in TV and media, and I think

1823
01:36:42,119 --> 01:36:45,399
it'll be a couple of months before it's done in

1824
01:36:45,439 --> 01:36:49,199
the post production, and then it'll be available on streaming

1825
01:36:49,239 --> 01:36:52,600
on the Gaya network Guya TV, which is available on

1826
01:36:52,640 --> 01:36:59,000
Amazon Prime, Roku, Apple TV, and in the US at

1827
01:36:59,119 --> 01:37:01,840
least it will also be available on a lot of

1828
01:37:02,880 --> 01:37:07,039
cable and satellite so through like Exfinity Cable in the

1829
01:37:07,119 --> 01:37:10,359
US and things like that. So yeah, I'm looking forward

1830
01:37:10,359 --> 01:37:12,079
to that. I think it's going to do really well,

1831
01:37:12,479 --> 01:37:15,800
and if it does good ratings wise, they will order

1832
01:37:15,880 --> 01:37:17,239
up another twenty two episodes.

1833
01:37:18,119 --> 01:37:21,119
Speaker 1: Wonderful. Well, look forward to that. In the meantime, Jay,

1834
01:37:21,119 --> 01:37:23,560
thank you so much for joining us on Legalized freedom

1835
01:37:23,600 --> 01:37:24,640
dot com.

1836
01:37:24,680 --> 01:37:26,039
Speaker 2: Always a pleasure. Thank you, Greg,