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Are you 23 00:00:53.079 --> 00:00:53.880 feeling lucky? 24 00:00:54.200 --> 00:00:54.280 No? 25 00:00:54.359 --> 00:00:57.960 Purchase necessary void We're prohibited by Law eighteen plus. Terms 26 00:00:57.960 --> 00:01:00.320 and conditions apply. See website for d Town. 27 00:01:08.400 --> 00:01:11.840 You are now listening to True Murder, the most shocking 28 00:01:11.920 --> 00:01:14.959 killers in true crime history and the authors that have 29 00:01:15.040 --> 00:01:22.319 written about him Gasey Bundy, Dahmer, The Nightstalker BTK Every 30 00:01:22.359 --> 00:01:26.040 week another fascinating author talking about the most shocking and 31 00:01:26.120 --> 00:01:30.599 infamous killers in true crime history. True Murder with your host, 32 00:01:31.040 --> 00:01:33.519 journalist and author Dan Zupansky. 33 00:01:42.760 --> 00:01:47.519 Good evening. Summertime in Florida, tourists flocked to the subtropical 34 00:01:47.560 --> 00:01:51.959 paradise for its beautiful beaches, abundant sunshine, and the magical 35 00:01:51.959 --> 00:01:55.120 allure of Disney World. For one midwestman mother and her 36 00:01:55.120 --> 00:01:58.599 two teenage daughters, a trip to the Sunshine State seemed 37 00:01:58.680 --> 00:02:01.640 like a dream vacation, but the promise of a sunset 38 00:02:01.680 --> 00:02:04.879 cruise by a friendly stranger turned that dream into a 39 00:02:04.920 --> 00:02:08.080 deadly nightmare. This is the true story of that tragic 40 00:02:08.199 --> 00:02:11.560 encounter and the hunt for the Sunset Killer, a modern 41 00:02:11.639 --> 00:02:12.919 day American Monster. 42 00:02:13.199 --> 00:02:13.639 The book for. 43 00:02:13.719 --> 00:02:16.879 Featuring this evening is American Monster, The Search for the 44 00:02:16.919 --> 00:02:19.879 Sunset Killer with my special guest, journalist and author and 45 00:02:20.000 --> 00:02:23.080 attorney JT. Hunter, welcome back to the program, and thank 46 00:02:23.080 --> 00:02:25.280 you very much for this interview. JT. Hunter. 47 00:02:25.479 --> 00:02:27.719 Thanks Dan Grief to be back here again talking with you. 48 00:02:28.000 --> 00:02:32.360 Thank you so much for this congratulations on this new book. Incredible. 49 00:02:32.520 --> 00:02:35.039 Let's go to as you do right in the very 50 00:02:35.039 --> 00:02:38.639 beginning of your book and your prologue, we go to Tamarack, Florida, 51 00:02:39.000 --> 00:02:42.360 and please find a woman nude on the street, or 52 00:02:42.360 --> 00:02:45.800 if someone finds a woman nude on the street positioned, 53 00:02:46.000 --> 00:02:51.599 she's identified as Ebalis Bergeriice, a student at Broward Community College. 54 00:02:51.759 --> 00:02:55.560 What is the condition of the body and some of 55 00:02:55.599 --> 00:02:58.719 the circumstances that they find this woman that day? 56 00:02:58.840 --> 00:03:01.439 Yeah, this was in nineteen ninety. This was a few 57 00:03:01.520 --> 00:03:05.719 days after Thanksgiving, November twenty seventh, nineteen ninety. A couple 58 00:03:06.240 --> 00:03:09.840 guys that had been out in their weekly bowling league 59 00:03:09.919 --> 00:03:13.840 were driving back home in a residential neighborhood. You know, 60 00:03:13.879 --> 00:03:17.199 it's kind of a typical middle class neighborhood. And as 61 00:03:17.280 --> 00:03:22.039 they made a turn at night here, their headlights illuminated 62 00:03:22.319 --> 00:03:25.479 something laying in the road up ahead of them. And 63 00:03:25.520 --> 00:03:27.599 when they got a little bit closer, they saw that 64 00:03:27.719 --> 00:03:31.759 it was a woman and she was laying in the street. 65 00:03:32.120 --> 00:03:34.520 They stopped, jumped out of the car, went over and 66 00:03:34.599 --> 00:03:38.280 got closer, and she looked to not be alive anymore. 67 00:03:38.319 --> 00:03:42.680 And the body looked as if it had been positioned 68 00:03:42.680 --> 00:03:48.120 there on purpose, such that rather than you know, just 69 00:03:48.199 --> 00:03:51.639 kind of haphazardly being tossed out of a car or something, 70 00:03:51.680 --> 00:03:54.840 the body had been been propped so that it was 71 00:03:54.879 --> 00:03:57.159 in kind of a you know, a doggy style position 72 00:03:57.439 --> 00:04:00.560 at the head down and the the buttocks up, and 73 00:04:01.000 --> 00:04:04.159 you know, appeared to have some uprasions and some marketing 74 00:04:04.319 --> 00:04:07.319 vindicating that, you know, foul play had had occurred for sure. 75 00:04:08.000 --> 00:04:13.919 What did authorities find out about heavy Virgicallease and what 76 00:04:14.400 --> 00:04:17.439 where she was working? In details of how she met 77 00:04:17.439 --> 00:04:19.120 her fate, well Evie. 78 00:04:19.199 --> 00:04:21.600 She she was known as ev to her friends. She 79 00:04:21.759 --> 00:04:26.639 had been working her normal job at the Sawgress Mills mall, 80 00:04:27.279 --> 00:04:31.199 which was in the nearby city of Sunrise, Florida, and 81 00:04:32.079 --> 00:04:36.120 she had as usual closed the store that she worked 82 00:04:36.120 --> 00:04:40.519 at and apparently had walked out to the mall parking 83 00:04:40.560 --> 00:04:43.240 lot with one of her co workers, as it again 84 00:04:43.360 --> 00:04:46.959 was kind of her typical routine, and when she got 85 00:04:47.000 --> 00:04:50.079 to the parking lot there at the mall, her she 86 00:04:50.319 --> 00:04:54.279 saw that her car's tires had been slashed. Two of 87 00:04:54.319 --> 00:04:57.000 the tires on her car had been had been slashed, 88 00:04:58.040 --> 00:05:00.680 so both the tires were flats. You know, she was 89 00:05:00.720 --> 00:05:06.639 stuck there, and by this time her coworker had walked 90 00:05:06.639 --> 00:05:09.319 off to her own car and had had left, so 91 00:05:09.480 --> 00:05:13.600 Evie was there by herself. And at some point shortly 92 00:05:13.639 --> 00:05:18.519 thereafter she was taken from the parking lot by an 93 00:05:18.600 --> 00:05:21.720 unknown person. And that was the night of November twenty six. 94 00:05:21.959 --> 00:05:24.600 You know, it was probably about ten thirty, almost eleven 95 00:05:24.639 --> 00:05:26.800 o'clock at night at that point. And then her body 96 00:05:26.839 --> 00:05:29.319 was discovered the next night. 97 00:05:30.639 --> 00:05:33.759 And police also found that there was another attempt at 98 00:05:33.759 --> 00:05:36.560 that same parking lot, but that woman had called her 99 00:05:36.920 --> 00:05:39.399 husband and her husband had picked her up. But the 100 00:05:39.480 --> 00:05:43.000 intentional flattening of the tires in that parking lot didn't they. 101 00:05:43.240 --> 00:05:46.120 Yeah, exactly, there had been the same sort of situation 102 00:05:46.199 --> 00:05:51.000 had occurred to another young woman's vehicle as well, and 103 00:05:51.079 --> 00:05:54.920 you know that woman was similar to the ev and 104 00:05:55.000 --> 00:05:57.680 you know in age and body type and those sort 105 00:05:57.720 --> 00:05:58.920 of characteristics. 106 00:05:59.639 --> 00:06:01.439 Yes, when you say at the time, you write that 107 00:06:01.519 --> 00:06:04.560 there was no suspect DNA at that time. They did 108 00:06:04.600 --> 00:06:08.000 a reenactment on television but there was no real response. 109 00:06:08.639 --> 00:06:11.839 Everybody's just summed it up. What a tragic loss with 110 00:06:11.959 --> 00:06:17.560 an angelic woman, angelic girl. You go to the in 111 00:06:17.600 --> 00:06:20.519 the book right away, you introduced the Sunshine State and 112 00:06:20.560 --> 00:06:23.160 you talk about the three major cities of Tampa, Clearwater, 113 00:06:23.240 --> 00:06:26.160 in Saint Petersburg in it being the second largest metro 114 00:06:26.240 --> 00:06:28.759 area in Florida, has a lot of water, over four 115 00:06:28.839 --> 00:06:32.199 hundred square miles of water. And we go to June fourth, 116 00:06:32.319 --> 00:06:36.079 nineteen eighty nine, and three bodies are found by three 117 00:06:36.079 --> 00:06:39.759 different voters. Tell us the condition of the bodies and 118 00:06:39.839 --> 00:06:44.399 what the Coastguard finds after these voters tell them about 119 00:06:44.480 --> 00:06:47.680 these bodies, what's the condition, what do they find? 120 00:06:48.160 --> 00:06:52.560 So about six or seven months before the incident with 121 00:06:52.920 --> 00:06:58.120 Evie in Sunrise, as you said, in June of eighty nine, 122 00:06:59.319 --> 00:07:04.800 there was there were some boaters out in Tampa Bay 123 00:07:04.839 --> 00:07:08.000 there in the Tampa Bay area, and on this particular 124 00:07:08.639 --> 00:07:13.480 day they came across some gruesome discoveries. Three bodies ended 125 00:07:13.560 --> 00:07:15.639 up being found in the bay. The first one was 126 00:07:15.639 --> 00:07:18.199 found about nine o'clock in the morning, nine nine thirty 127 00:07:18.240 --> 00:07:21.959 in the morning, a you know, a boater was coming 128 00:07:22.000 --> 00:07:24.800 back from a trip and he saw something in the 129 00:07:24.839 --> 00:07:27.720 water floating ahead, and he got closer to it, he 130 00:07:27.720 --> 00:07:30.920 saw that it was it was the human body floating 131 00:07:31.000 --> 00:07:33.639 face down in the water. He of course called for 132 00:07:33.720 --> 00:07:39.160 help and the coastguard was dispatched to the site and 133 00:07:39.480 --> 00:07:44.800 they ended up pulling a very decomposed floated body from 134 00:07:44.839 --> 00:07:47.920 the water. It was a white female, you know, about 135 00:07:47.959 --> 00:07:51.959 one hundred pounds, and she was nude from the from 136 00:07:51.959 --> 00:07:54.680 the waist down. She just had a T shirt on basically, 137 00:07:55.120 --> 00:08:00.839 and her her hands were bound with rope anchor anchor 138 00:08:00.959 --> 00:08:04.160 type rope, and her ankles were also bound as well, 139 00:08:04.680 --> 00:08:09.639 and she had some pieces of great duct tape on 140 00:08:09.639 --> 00:08:13.120 her chin, apparently having you know, been fin gagged with 141 00:08:13.160 --> 00:08:15.720 the duct tape and having having slid down during the 142 00:08:15.759 --> 00:08:20.560 decomposition process. And the coast guard officer that that found 143 00:08:21.000 --> 00:08:25.639 this individual described it as as really being a really 144 00:08:25.639 --> 00:08:29.000 gruesome thing to see and described as the horrible look 145 00:08:29.040 --> 00:08:32.159 on her face that she had, you know, that was 146 00:08:32.159 --> 00:08:36.279 frozen there in death, you know, indicative that she had 147 00:08:36.279 --> 00:08:44.039 this really terrifying experience. And shortly after that first body 148 00:08:44.080 --> 00:08:47.879 was found, not even maybe half an hour an hour later, 149 00:08:49.399 --> 00:08:52.240 another voter came across another body, a different part of 150 00:08:52.240 --> 00:08:58.480 the day a couple miles away, and this was another female, 151 00:08:59.120 --> 00:09:05.440 same sort of condition, bloated, decomposed, hands and ankles, bound 152 00:09:06.039 --> 00:09:12.240 with this rope material and again again duct tape as well. 153 00:09:13.879 --> 00:09:18.399 And a significant thing about these these two bodies as well, 154 00:09:18.559 --> 00:09:22.840 was that they had been they had been tied to 155 00:09:24.480 --> 00:09:28.440 what turned out to be these concrete blocks, like these 156 00:09:28.480 --> 00:09:31.559 home construction cbs kind of cinder blocks. They had been 157 00:09:31.600 --> 00:09:36.159 tied to these blocks to weigh them down. They didn't 158 00:09:36.519 --> 00:09:40.639 discover that with the first body because the block wing 159 00:09:40.679 --> 00:09:43.480 the first body down was was stuck underwater. Somehow. They 160 00:09:43.519 --> 00:09:46.320 couldn't they couldn't get it dislodged no matter how hard 161 00:09:46.360 --> 00:09:48.799 they tried, so they ended up having to just cut 162 00:09:48.799 --> 00:09:51.879 the rope, and you know, later attempts to try to 163 00:09:51.919 --> 00:09:56.519 find that that that block were unsuccessful as well by divers. 164 00:09:56.559 --> 00:09:59.720 But but with the second body, they were dated in fact, 165 00:10:01.000 --> 00:10:04.559 have the concree body block attached to the rope. When 166 00:10:04.600 --> 00:10:06.480 they retrieved the body, they were able to bring that up. 167 00:10:06.519 --> 00:10:13.519 So so that was a common characteristic as well. So 168 00:10:13.559 --> 00:10:16.360 that was the two bodies. And then you know, half 169 00:10:16.360 --> 00:10:18.919 an hour maybe half an hour later or less from 170 00:10:18.960 --> 00:10:23.080 the second body, a third body was reported, and you know, 171 00:10:23.120 --> 00:10:26.200 again the co start with despatched, the sin and pain 172 00:10:26.320 --> 00:10:32.200 sort of situation. Another another female, another white female, another 173 00:10:32.320 --> 00:10:39.720 floated decomposed body, hands and ankles, bounds, gagged, uh, concrete block, 174 00:10:40.120 --> 00:10:42.879 every everything the same as well. So really a really 175 00:10:43.679 --> 00:10:48.240 really gruesome discovery of these three bloated bodies floating out 176 00:10:48.279 --> 00:10:50.399 here in Tampa Bay on it, you know, and otherwise 177 00:10:50.399 --> 00:10:51.519 it's really nice summer day. 178 00:10:53.519 --> 00:10:55.639 You're right that because that they were in the water, 179 00:10:55.799 --> 00:10:59.879 any hair fibers, fingerprints, semen, or any other trace evidences 180 00:11:00.159 --> 00:11:05.200 washed away. And so the effort to identify victims, they 181 00:11:05.519 --> 00:11:10.919 have a press conference, they display the jewelry found, and 182 00:11:10.960 --> 00:11:15.240 then they have the medical examiner do the autopsy. What's 183 00:11:15.279 --> 00:11:20.440 the what's his result? And then how do they what 184 00:11:20.480 --> 00:11:23.240 do they what can they tell and what can't they 185 00:11:23.279 --> 00:11:29.039 tell about what happened before or after death concerning these 186 00:11:29.080 --> 00:11:31.200 three bodies, three people. 187 00:11:32.919 --> 00:11:36.159 Exactly as you said, because the bodies have been in 188 00:11:36.159 --> 00:11:40.039 the water for so long, the you know, the the 189 00:11:40.080 --> 00:11:45.919 water emotion of the water had washed away any sort 190 00:11:45.960 --> 00:11:49.919 of you know, forensic evidence that typically might be found 191 00:11:49.919 --> 00:11:55.039 at a crime s team. So it made it you know, 192 00:11:55.200 --> 00:11:57.399 much more difficult case was just from the get go 193 00:11:57.519 --> 00:11:59.960 for the for the police, as far as that goes. 194 00:12:00.120 --> 00:12:04.279 Was in the medical examiner, you know, found the cause 195 00:12:04.320 --> 00:12:08.639 of death the stain for each of these three victims. 196 00:12:09.799 --> 00:12:13.159 To fix you up for all three of them. And 197 00:12:13.200 --> 00:12:15.159 of course, you know, drowning is a form of that. 198 00:12:16.159 --> 00:12:18.039 But the bodies had been in the water for such 199 00:12:18.080 --> 00:12:23.120 a long period of time, which the medical examiner estimated 200 00:12:23.200 --> 00:12:25.320 they had been in the water two to three days 201 00:12:25.840 --> 00:12:31.039 before they were found. It was it couldn't be, you know, 202 00:12:31.159 --> 00:12:35.799 determined definitively that drowning was the actual cause of death 203 00:12:36.000 --> 00:12:44.960 versus strangulation as the cause of death. So that sort 204 00:12:45.039 --> 00:12:49.399 of circumstances of how they died kind of had to 205 00:12:49.399 --> 00:12:51.600 be pieced together a little bit later on as the 206 00:12:51.600 --> 00:12:53.559 investigation went forward. 207 00:12:55.639 --> 00:12:58.759 In the investigation, that moves forward four days after the 208 00:12:58.799 --> 00:13:02.519 body's found, you right, if there's the first lead. This 209 00:13:02.639 --> 00:13:06.480 is June eighth, they made at a day's in noticed 210 00:13:06.519 --> 00:13:09.279 the beds not slept in for about a week and 211 00:13:09.399 --> 00:13:13.000 nothing used like the towels. So and she had read 212 00:13:13.000 --> 00:13:17.320 about the three bodies in the newspaper and told her manager, 213 00:13:17.440 --> 00:13:23.320 So from that, what do police determine about these bodies, 214 00:13:23.679 --> 00:13:24.559 these people found. 215 00:13:26.879 --> 00:13:27.080 Yeah. 216 00:13:27.200 --> 00:13:30.639 So so several days after the bodies were found, you know, 217 00:13:30.840 --> 00:13:33.120 police really didn't have anything to go on. They still 218 00:13:33.159 --> 00:13:37.480 had these unidentified bodies, uh, you know, Jane one, Jane two, 219 00:13:37.639 --> 00:13:41.120 Jane Doe three. No leads at all had no idea 220 00:13:41.159 --> 00:13:45.679 who these people were. But then, but then several days later, 221 00:13:45.759 --> 00:13:49.120 on the on the eighth of June, a made as 222 00:13:49.159 --> 00:13:51.559 you said, at at a hotel at a day's in 223 00:13:53.440 --> 00:13:55.519 off of the Court and Cambil Causeway there in the 224 00:13:55.559 --> 00:14:01.559 Tampa Bay area. You know, noticed this one particular room 225 00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:04.000 at the hotel there hadn't been it didn't seem like 226 00:14:04.000 --> 00:14:07.240 it had been used for quite some time. That you know, 227 00:14:07.279 --> 00:14:10.679 the people that had had taken the room had had 228 00:14:10.759 --> 00:14:14.120 checked in. Obviously their belongings were there in the room, 229 00:14:16.159 --> 00:14:21.559 but the beds didn't appear to have been used. And 230 00:14:21.679 --> 00:14:24.399 you know, the whole time they in the subsequent few 231 00:14:24.480 --> 00:14:28.279 days and the room appearance hadn't really changed in those 232 00:14:28.360 --> 00:14:32.159 those days those days as well. So finally, at this point, 233 00:14:32.320 --> 00:14:35.600 this this particular maid who had you know, read something 234 00:14:35.879 --> 00:14:38.559 in the newspaper about the bodies being found, three bodies 235 00:14:38.559 --> 00:14:43.919 being found, as you mentioned, you know, got suspicious, rightfully so, 236 00:14:44.279 --> 00:14:47.840 and reported it to the general manager of the hotel there, 237 00:14:47.879 --> 00:14:50.080 who who you know, checked out the room himself and 238 00:14:50.120 --> 00:14:54.360 then notified the police. And the police were you know, 239 00:14:54.399 --> 00:14:58.919 showed up to the scene obviously and came to the 240 00:14:59.039 --> 00:15:00.960 can to the room there and and checked it out. 241 00:15:00.960 --> 00:15:07.159 And they were able to determine obviously from the hotel 242 00:15:07.240 --> 00:15:11.279 registry who the room had been rented out to, and 243 00:15:11.320 --> 00:15:14.039 it turned out it was rented out to a mother 244 00:15:14.159 --> 00:15:19.480 and her two teenage daughters from Ohio and their names 245 00:15:19.480 --> 00:15:23.240 were with Joan Rogers was the mother. She was thirty 246 00:15:23.320 --> 00:15:28.159 six years old, and her teenage daughters, Michelle who was 247 00:15:28.279 --> 00:15:33.240 seventeen and Christy Rogers who was fourteen at the time. 248 00:15:33.799 --> 00:15:37.480 So these three women had had taken the room, had 249 00:15:37.559 --> 00:15:41.279 checked in. You know, there was all sorts of you know, 250 00:15:41.320 --> 00:15:44.440 their their suitcases were in the room there, there are 251 00:15:44.480 --> 00:15:49.519 all their other belongings were in there as well. Camera 252 00:15:49.600 --> 00:15:54.679 film was in there, both both undeveloped film. Undeveloped camera 253 00:15:54.679 --> 00:15:56.840 film was in there, both you know, used in an 254 00:15:56.919 --> 00:16:02.559 unused film which you know a little bit later the 255 00:16:02.559 --> 00:16:06.320 police developed the film that they found in there, and 256 00:16:06.360 --> 00:16:09.480 that kind of helps with the investigation as well from 257 00:16:09.559 --> 00:16:12.399 but certainly being able to identify who the victims were 258 00:16:12.639 --> 00:16:14.879 was you know, a big, a big moment at the 259 00:16:14.919 --> 00:16:18.759 investigation because prior to this, you know, the police that 260 00:16:18.879 --> 00:16:22.039 really had no idea who these people were. So this, 261 00:16:22.039 --> 00:16:24.960 this finally gave them their first break in the case. 262 00:16:27.159 --> 00:16:31.480 You talk about this family, this the Rogers family, and 263 00:16:31.480 --> 00:16:34.039 they're from a little place called Wilshire, Ohio, and they 264 00:16:34.440 --> 00:16:36.960 lived on a small farm. You say, the population was 265 00:16:37.000 --> 00:16:41.200 five hundred and Jones Joanne as they called her, but 266 00:16:41.320 --> 00:16:45.600 Jones husband was Hal Rogers, and tell us about this 267 00:16:45.720 --> 00:16:48.440 trip because this was a big deal for this family 268 00:16:48.600 --> 00:16:52.200 and how was scheduled to go, but he could tell 269 00:16:52.279 --> 00:16:55.279 us about this dream vacation for this little family. 270 00:16:57.120 --> 00:17:00.440 Yeah, you know, as you said, the Rogers family, they 271 00:17:00.440 --> 00:17:04.400 were from this really small, very rural area in Ohio 272 00:17:04.519 --> 00:17:09.960 there and you know, actually I could really get a 273 00:17:10.039 --> 00:17:13.799 get a feel for it because you know, growing up, 274 00:17:13.839 --> 00:17:16.680 I used to go up every summer. Basically I used 275 00:17:16.680 --> 00:17:19.160 to go up to my grandparents' house in very rural 276 00:17:20.079 --> 00:17:23.599 area of Missouri and again a very very small town, 277 00:17:23.720 --> 00:17:25.759 very similar, so I could really get a sense of 278 00:17:25.799 --> 00:17:28.680 what it would have been like for this family. You know, 279 00:17:28.720 --> 00:17:32.279 growing up there. But they were from this this area 280 00:17:32.720 --> 00:17:37.440 everybody knows everybody by name, that sort of thing, and 281 00:17:38.359 --> 00:17:41.200 they didn't really travel much. In fact that the girls 282 00:17:41.240 --> 00:17:44.160 had never been out of state on a trip before, 283 00:17:44.200 --> 00:17:47.640 on a vacation before ever, So this was really a 284 00:17:47.640 --> 00:17:51.559 big deal for them to be making this trip. And 285 00:17:51.799 --> 00:17:53.519 you know, of all the places they could have gone to, 286 00:17:54.400 --> 00:17:56.440 h they decided, you know, to go down to Florida, 287 00:17:57.839 --> 00:17:59.960 you know, for for a lot of reasons and including 288 00:18:00.279 --> 00:18:03.839 you know, the the amusement parks. You know, Disney World 289 00:18:03.920 --> 00:18:06.880 of course is this big draw, that sort of thing. 290 00:18:06.960 --> 00:18:12.599 So so they planned this this vacation and you know, 291 00:18:12.640 --> 00:18:17.079 it was really meant to be kind of an escape 292 00:18:17.240 --> 00:18:22.519 for them, especially for Michelle. She had some some problems there. 293 00:18:24.039 --> 00:18:28.480 The preceding couple of years, she had suffered sexual abuse 294 00:18:29.079 --> 00:18:32.519 at the hands of her uncle, who actually lived on 295 00:18:32.559 --> 00:18:37.960 the same pharmison. He had started abusing her, sexually abusing 296 00:18:38.000 --> 00:18:41.720 her when she was fifteen and it continued, you know, 297 00:18:41.839 --> 00:18:46.240 over a period of the year or two. So so 298 00:18:46.279 --> 00:18:49.279 the staycation, you know, a big part of it was 299 00:18:50.319 --> 00:18:52.680 to get her away from that whole scene, you know, 300 00:18:52.839 --> 00:18:57.920 having to deal with, right that traumatic experience, having to 301 00:18:57.960 --> 00:19:00.440 deal with the police talking to them afterwards, that sort 302 00:19:00.440 --> 00:19:04.400 of thing. So they planned this vacation. As you said, 303 00:19:04.680 --> 00:19:09.160 the father, Hal Rogers wasn't able to go. He had 304 00:19:09.160 --> 00:19:11.480 to he basically he had to stay back and take 305 00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:14.160 care of the farm that they had there. You know, 306 00:19:14.240 --> 00:19:18.000 they had various crops planted that needed to be tended to. 307 00:19:19.319 --> 00:19:21.960 They were behind on that because of the rains and 308 00:19:22.000 --> 00:19:24.640 things that particular year. And then also they had you know, 309 00:19:24.680 --> 00:19:28.119 they had dairy gattle there as well, so they someone 310 00:19:28.160 --> 00:19:30.000 had to be there to take care of those as well. 311 00:19:30.079 --> 00:19:33.039 So he stayed behind. But he didn't want to you know, 312 00:19:33.680 --> 00:19:35.839 party through for and ruin a vacation so to speak. 313 00:19:35.920 --> 00:19:38.279 So he you know, he encouraged his wife and daughters 314 00:19:38.319 --> 00:19:40.319 to go ahead and go on the trip and have fun. 315 00:19:41.240 --> 00:19:43.759 So they left, and you know, it was it was 316 00:19:43.799 --> 00:19:48.640 planned to be you know, a good, a good over 317 00:19:48.680 --> 00:19:53.240 a week vacation. They had lined up and they they 318 00:19:53.319 --> 00:19:57.519 left on May twenty six. When they left Ohio, they 319 00:19:57.599 --> 00:20:02.279 drove down and you know, stopped at various places on 320 00:20:02.359 --> 00:20:05.680 the way, went to you know, went to jack and Mille, 321 00:20:05.720 --> 00:20:10.279 went to the zoo there, went to Silver Springs when 322 00:20:10.480 --> 00:20:13.519 you know, the famous glass bottom boat rides, Silver Springs, 323 00:20:13.680 --> 00:20:18.200 went to Kennedy Space Center, all that stuff, and then 324 00:20:18.240 --> 00:20:21.519 made their way to Orlando and stayed in Orlando for 325 00:20:21.599 --> 00:20:25.720 several days. You know, went to Sea World, went to 326 00:20:26.400 --> 00:20:29.519 Magic Kingdom, went to Epcot Center, all that kind of stuff, 327 00:20:30.519 --> 00:20:33.759 and then you know, towards the end of the trip, 328 00:20:34.079 --> 00:20:36.519 they made their way over to the Bay Area and 329 00:20:36.960 --> 00:20:40.160 that's when they got over there. They drove over to 330 00:20:40.359 --> 00:20:43.279 the Bay Area on June first, which was about a 331 00:20:43.319 --> 00:20:45.519 week into there in their vacation at this. 332 00:20:45.480 --> 00:20:52.000 Point m hmm. Now back to hol Rogers and he 333 00:20:52.119 --> 00:20:55.680 finds out about on the same day that he expects 334 00:20:55.680 --> 00:20:58.599 his family back, he finds out from police that they're 335 00:20:58.640 --> 00:21:02.680 dead and they've been murder and June thirteenth, there's a funeral. 336 00:21:02.920 --> 00:21:07.680 And you had mentioned that John Rogers had lived on 337 00:21:07.720 --> 00:21:10.240 the property, had been co owner of the farm and 338 00:21:10.359 --> 00:21:13.279 lived on the trailer and had abused and raped Michelle 339 00:21:13.319 --> 00:21:20.160 for eighteen months over a two year period several times. 340 00:21:18.200 --> 00:21:22.720 And so he had bought hell, had bought his brother 341 00:21:22.759 --> 00:21:25.960 out of the property, and his brother had traveled to 342 00:21:26.640 --> 00:21:32.240 Florida on a vacation prior to how Rogers family traveling, 343 00:21:32.799 --> 00:21:36.000 So there's some tell us about the funeral and just 344 00:21:36.039 --> 00:21:41.839 some of the observations that they find about how Rogers. 345 00:21:43.160 --> 00:21:46.960 Well, yeah, the funeral, you know, it was attended by 346 00:21:48.000 --> 00:21:50.640 a lot of family, a lot of friends you know, 347 00:21:50.720 --> 00:21:52.559 showed up for it. There was you know, about three 348 00:21:52.599 --> 00:21:56.440 hundred people showed up for this funeral in mid June, 349 00:21:57.359 --> 00:22:01.880 you know, at the church there in in the area, 350 00:22:02.000 --> 00:22:05.599 you know, kind of this kind of this Gothic style church. 351 00:22:06.920 --> 00:22:12.640 And you know, of course there was a lot of 352 00:22:13.319 --> 00:22:15.480 a lot of sadness, a lot of emotion. A lot 353 00:22:15.480 --> 00:22:21.160 of Michelle and Christie's friends were crying throughout, and you know, 354 00:22:21.240 --> 00:22:27.119 as you would expect. But you know, how how didn't 355 00:22:27.160 --> 00:22:31.000 show a lot of emotion. You know, based on everything 356 00:22:31.000 --> 00:22:33.599 I found out about him, he you know, he tended 357 00:22:33.599 --> 00:22:37.920 to kind of keep his emotions inside, didn't really show 358 00:22:37.960 --> 00:22:40.920 his emotion much. And and you know that kind of 359 00:22:41.039 --> 00:22:47.519 came across with some people as as as odd you know, 360 00:22:47.559 --> 00:22:51.519 that that he wasn't reacting like you know, they thought 361 00:22:51.599 --> 00:22:53.920 maybe a father who had just lost his wife and 362 00:22:54.599 --> 00:22:58.119 only two children should be reacting, and it, you know, 363 00:22:58.279 --> 00:23:02.519 just struck them as as as strange. So so you know, 364 00:23:02.599 --> 00:23:06.680 there were some suspicions arose from that, like, well, you know, 365 00:23:06.799 --> 00:23:10.720 did did how have anything to do with his family's murder? 366 00:23:11.519 --> 00:23:11.680 Right? 367 00:23:11.799 --> 00:23:14.960 You know, was he somehow involved with this, especially because 368 00:23:15.200 --> 00:23:19.839 of what happened with Michelle and his brother who had 369 00:23:19.839 --> 00:23:22.200 you know, we already talked about, had had raped her 370 00:23:22.359 --> 00:23:26.480 for a while there, and you know how had actually 371 00:23:27.000 --> 00:23:28.960 posted the bail for his brother to get him out 372 00:23:28.960 --> 00:23:31.839 on the rape charge, which was also very very strange. 373 00:23:33.279 --> 00:23:35.680 You know, he later explained his reasoning for doing it, 374 00:23:35.720 --> 00:23:40.599 but but certainly, you know, it would seem odd that 375 00:23:40.680 --> 00:23:43.240 a father would post the bail of the rapists of 376 00:23:43.359 --> 00:23:48.119 his daughter, right, so that only you know, kind of 377 00:23:48.160 --> 00:23:52.240 fed this kind of suspicion that was that was arising, 378 00:23:52.319 --> 00:23:55.039 you know, around and around it how and and you know, 379 00:23:56.000 --> 00:23:57.640 did he or did he not have something to do 380 00:23:57.720 --> 00:23:59.240 with with the murder of his family? 381 00:23:59.559 --> 00:24:05.039 And I just that investigators, despite their procedures, by September, 382 00:24:05.279 --> 00:24:08.640 the Saint Petersburg Police Department to spend their task force 383 00:24:08.759 --> 00:24:13.240 investigating the case. Well, they take twenty four detectives to 384 00:24:13.319 --> 00:24:18.039 two detectives. But in October, you say, something happens in 385 00:24:18.079 --> 00:24:23.680 this case. Regarding it, Detective James Cappell tell us what happens, 386 00:24:23.680 --> 00:24:25.160 what he sees, what he realizes. 387 00:24:27.519 --> 00:24:31.559 Yeah, so this particular detective, he had just been reviewing 388 00:24:31.880 --> 00:24:35.039 this publication that you know, at the monthly publication put 389 00:24:35.079 --> 00:24:39.160 out by the Florida Department of Law Enforcement FDL, and 390 00:24:39.799 --> 00:24:42.640 he was just reading through there and he came across 391 00:24:42.039 --> 00:24:50.640 a notice about a rate that had occurred in Madera Beach, 392 00:24:51.000 --> 00:24:53.200 which was which is, you know, it's pretty close, it's 393 00:24:53.240 --> 00:24:56.799 about twelve miles away from the Bay area, in the 394 00:24:56.799 --> 00:24:59.960 Tampa Bay Area, and he read about this particular rate 395 00:25:00.119 --> 00:25:04.079 that had happened on May fifteenth of that year of 396 00:25:04.160 --> 00:25:07.440 nineteen eighty nine, so you know, we're talking about just 397 00:25:07.480 --> 00:25:10.799 a couple of weeks before these three bodies were profound 398 00:25:11.319 --> 00:25:15.359 floating out there in the water. And so he read 399 00:25:15.359 --> 00:25:18.319 about this rape and it had it had supposedly it 400 00:25:18.440 --> 00:25:25.000 occurred on a boat got on the water, and you know, 401 00:25:25.039 --> 00:25:27.319