WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:03.120 What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the 2 00:00:03.120 --> 00:00:06.200 Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're gonna get right back 3 00:00:06.240 --> 00:00:10.320 to the Leslie Groff transcript from her meeting with Congress. 4 00:00:11.240 --> 00:00:15.519 Mister Timmins is asking the questions question. Okay, so let's 5 00:00:15.519 --> 00:00:19.239 talk about flights and hotels. No, let's go to hair appointments. 6 00:00:19.920 --> 00:00:22.000 As part of your employment. Were you allowed to get 7 00:00:22.000 --> 00:00:25.079 your hair done at a fancy day spot, miss Groff? 8 00:00:25.239 --> 00:00:30.800 I did every so often, Timmins. Okay, is it fokai Groff? Yes, Timmins, 9 00:00:31.079 --> 00:00:33.240 but only two of the seven? Were three of the 10 00:00:33.280 --> 00:00:36.039 seven were allowed to get their hair appointments done without 11 00:00:36.039 --> 00:00:38.679 his specific approval. There's an email I can get it 12 00:00:38.719 --> 00:00:43.119 for you, Groff. Okay, Timmins. So why would do you 13 00:00:43.200 --> 00:00:46.119 have it? Why would you control whether his assistance got 14 00:00:46.159 --> 00:00:49.320 access to hair appointments? Groff? I didn't control one of 15 00:00:49.359 --> 00:00:52.880 his assistants. Timmins. There's an email with you and redacted, 16 00:00:53.200 --> 00:00:55.200 and you say in your email it says Jeffrey says 17 00:00:55.200 --> 00:00:58.119 that me and two of the seven survivors are authorized 18 00:00:58.159 --> 00:01:02.320 to make our own appointments. Is that not strange? Mister 19 00:01:02.359 --> 00:01:05.120 Wickham jumps in, sir, she wasn't even able to answer 20 00:01:05.159 --> 00:01:07.879 your last question, so you just have to let her 21 00:01:07.920 --> 00:01:11.319 answer the question. Please, Emmer. At this time, I would 22 00:01:11.359 --> 00:01:14.519 like to introduce what will be marked as majority Exhibit 23 00:01:14.599 --> 00:01:18.680 number eight. Mister Whitcomb. She's happy to answer your questions. 24 00:01:19.040 --> 00:01:22.599 You've got to let her finish respectively. Emmer will give 25 00:01:22.640 --> 00:01:25.840 you a moment to review the document. Timmins, So the 26 00:01:25.959 --> 00:01:29.400 king giveth and the King taketh away. So if you 27 00:01:29.439 --> 00:01:31.120 don't do what he says, if you don't act right, 28 00:01:31.159 --> 00:01:33.519 if you don't smile, if you don't cooperate with every 29 00:01:33.519 --> 00:01:36.760 single one of his requests, then you lose things. You 30 00:01:36.760 --> 00:01:39.280 could lose access to your computer or your phone, you 31 00:01:39.280 --> 00:01:42.680 could lose access to getting your hair appointments. It's just 32 00:01:42.719 --> 00:01:45.000 difficult that all of this was going on and that 33 00:01:45.120 --> 00:01:47.159 you were in the middle of it and you didn't 34 00:01:47.159 --> 00:01:51.640 see it. Backner see what the hair appointments. Timmins didn't 35 00:01:51.640 --> 00:01:53.599 see the way that he was using all these different 36 00:01:53.719 --> 00:01:57.200 levels of control to engage in sex trafficking. And the 37 00:01:57.200 --> 00:02:00.439 seven survivors as they entered your office who were going 38 00:02:00.480 --> 00:02:05.079 to be sexually assaulted Bocknerts, So I don't Timmins cuts 39 00:02:05.120 --> 00:02:07.959 them off. You didn't know until he got arrested, Grof. 40 00:02:08.039 --> 00:02:10.680 Everyone was very very happy. No one ever came to 41 00:02:10.719 --> 00:02:14.199 me and showed me any duress said that they were unhappy. 42 00:02:14.599 --> 00:02:17.120 From my perspective, it seemed like everyone was really happy 43 00:02:17.120 --> 00:02:19.479 to be there. No one ever said anything to me 44 00:02:19.840 --> 00:02:23.879 that they were unhappy or being abused. Question by Timmins. 45 00:02:24.039 --> 00:02:27.000 Did you ever suspect that the seven survivors were engaging 46 00:02:27.039 --> 00:02:32.199 in sexual activity with Jeffrey Epstein? Groff? No, Timmins, your 47 00:02:32.360 --> 00:02:35.560 job requires you to be very perceptive. What percent of 48 00:02:35.599 --> 00:02:39.439 these women entered your office, waited for however long, went 49 00:02:39.479 --> 00:02:42.840 back for however long, and left looking different than when 50 00:02:42.879 --> 00:02:46.319 they came in. Groff, I'm sorry about getting the haircut, 51 00:02:46.520 --> 00:02:49.840 or Timmins, you would notice if I had wet if 52 00:02:49.879 --> 00:02:51.520 I had wet hair, or if I had no hair, 53 00:02:51.719 --> 00:02:53.919 because I have no hair. But if you came into 54 00:02:53.919 --> 00:02:56.759 my office and went into somebody else's office and came 55 00:02:56.800 --> 00:02:59.280 out a half hour later with wet hair, I would go, 56 00:02:59.479 --> 00:03:02.240 what the hell do you happened? Graff? I didn't see 57 00:03:02.240 --> 00:03:06.319 anybody with wet hair. This was a professional office, professional area. 58 00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:10.280 I didn't see anything inappropriate. People went and got their 59 00:03:10.280 --> 00:03:14.479 haircut and would come back. Timmins. The seven survivors will 60 00:03:14.479 --> 00:03:17.960 testify eventually that about one third of the time they 61 00:03:17.960 --> 00:03:20.240 would go back, the assault was so bad that they 62 00:03:20.240 --> 00:03:23.080 would have to take a shower or clean off. So 63 00:03:23.120 --> 00:03:24.960 the fact that you never saw any of them leave 64 00:03:24.960 --> 00:03:28.919 with wet hair is somewhat surprising. Graf. I don't recall 65 00:03:28.960 --> 00:03:32.879 seeing anyone with wet hair leaving the office his home. Timmins, 66 00:03:33.039 --> 00:03:35.840 All right, let's talk about immigration. Are you aware that 67 00:03:35.879 --> 00:03:38.840 mister Epstein used immigration as a tool of control for 68 00:03:38.879 --> 00:03:42.919 the victims? Miss Groff? No, Timmins, did you ever engage 69 00:03:42.919 --> 00:03:47.159 in any effort to facilitate citizenship applications for any of 70 00:03:47.159 --> 00:03:50.560 the seven survivors? Miss Groff? The only thing that I 71 00:03:50.599 --> 00:03:54.199 did was help with travel, and that was per directed. 72 00:03:55.080 --> 00:03:57.280 And it seemed to me that anybody that was asked 73 00:03:57.319 --> 00:04:00.360 that I was booking for travel for wanted this to happen. 74 00:04:00.879 --> 00:04:02.560 There was no signs to me that they did not 75 00:04:02.639 --> 00:04:04.560 want to be there. No one said anything to me, 76 00:04:05.199 --> 00:04:09.039 mister Bauckner, and just for and just in all fairness, 77 00:04:09.199 --> 00:04:12.159 we don't know the identity of these seven survivors. She 78 00:04:12.879 --> 00:04:15.439 may be able to surmise, but we're kind of answering 79 00:04:15.560 --> 00:04:19.720 questions without knowing the identity Timmins redacted or redacted or 80 00:04:19.720 --> 00:04:23.800 redacted or redacted, redacted or redacted or redacted. I imagine you 81 00:04:23.839 --> 00:04:27.560 know who they are, Miss Groff. I recognize those names, Timmins. 82 00:04:28.439 --> 00:04:30.120 If we were to believe you that you had no 83 00:04:30.199 --> 00:04:32.639 knowledge of any of this, let's turn to those people 84 00:04:32.959 --> 00:04:36.079 that just had to have some Indke and Cohn were 85 00:04:36.120 --> 00:04:39.000 central to the money and the legal hula hoops it 86 00:04:39.040 --> 00:04:40.839 had to go through in order to pull this off. 87 00:04:41.160 --> 00:04:43.399 Do you think it's possible that would it surprise you 88 00:04:43.439 --> 00:04:46.399 to know that without their knowledge, Epstein and Endyke use 89 00:04:46.439 --> 00:04:50.720 their social security numbers of the seven survivors to create businesses, 90 00:04:50.920 --> 00:04:53.759 take out loans, and create lines of credit in an 91 00:04:53.800 --> 00:04:57.319 effort to trap them in a maze of financial insolvency. 92 00:04:57.759 --> 00:05:00.199 Miss Groff, I don't think that anybody did any thing 93 00:05:00.240 --> 00:05:04.160 wrong without mister Epstein's directive. He was very, very controlling. 94 00:05:04.639 --> 00:05:07.879 I don't know. I don't know about any of that question. 95 00:05:07.959 --> 00:05:09.959 But if he directed you, he directed you to schedule 96 00:05:10.000 --> 00:05:13.439 a massage with the twelve year old, you would say no, Graf, 97 00:05:13.480 --> 00:05:17.399 I would say no, absolutely, one hundred percent question. Okay, 98 00:05:17.399 --> 00:05:18.959 So if he directed in Dyke to pull a line 99 00:05:18.959 --> 00:05:21.639 of credit and create a business without the knowledge of 100 00:05:21.639 --> 00:05:24.199 one of his other alleged assistants, I mean, you have 101 00:05:24.279 --> 00:05:28.480 fiduciary obligations to the person you're engaging with. So it 102 00:05:28.519 --> 00:05:30.879 would actually be legal for someone to take out a 103 00:05:30.879 --> 00:05:33.360 line of credit or create a business, or take out 104 00:05:33.360 --> 00:05:35.800 a credit card in someone's name that is not the 105 00:05:35.839 --> 00:05:40.439 individual or is that just a gray area? Backner? Are 106 00:05:40.439 --> 00:05:43.199 you asking if she's aware if he was doing that, Timmins, 107 00:05:43.560 --> 00:05:46.120 is that something that he should not do? Graff? I 108 00:05:46.160 --> 00:05:48.959 think that, yeah, I don't think that. That's nothing that 109 00:05:49.000 --> 00:05:51.720 I know about. I'm unaware of any lines of credit 110 00:05:51.800 --> 00:05:54.600 or anything like that being taken out. You know, LLC's 111 00:05:54.680 --> 00:05:58.240 whatever you said, Timmins. Can you appreciate all of the 112 00:05:58.240 --> 00:06:00.920 different levels of control that he created to put these 113 00:06:00.959 --> 00:06:05.920 women into this situation? Groff? I didn't I knew gets 114 00:06:05.920 --> 00:06:08.639 cut off by Timmins. Do you understand now? Do you 115 00:06:08.720 --> 00:06:13.160 understand now, Groff? In hindsight, I can step back and 116 00:06:13.240 --> 00:06:15.240 I can see how that how that could have been 117 00:06:15.240 --> 00:06:17.439 wanted it to be like that. At the time, I 118 00:06:17.439 --> 00:06:20.600 thought it was things that these cut off by backner. 119 00:06:21.279 --> 00:06:23.839 He's asking you, now, do you see how he could 120 00:06:23.879 --> 00:06:26.720 have done that? Now, Graf, Yeah, I could see stepping 121 00:06:26.759 --> 00:06:29.639 back and seeing how, like you said, monitoring them, but 122 00:06:29.920 --> 00:06:33.720 not back then, not back then, Timmins. So I've talked 123 00:06:33.720 --> 00:06:36.120 to three of the victims, and every time their name 124 00:06:36.160 --> 00:06:38.720 is on an appointment with blank, they said about ninety 125 00:06:38.759 --> 00:06:42.600 eight percent they were sexually assaulted and raped and they 126 00:06:42.680 --> 00:06:45.480 felt trapped. And I guess you are to have us 127 00:06:45.519 --> 00:06:49.360 believe that that was completely oblivious to you. I don't 128 00:06:49.399 --> 00:06:52.839 have any more questions, thank you. Now, Miss Toland is 129 00:06:52.879 --> 00:06:56.319 asking questions, and just to turn back to Exhibit eight 130 00:06:56.439 --> 00:06:59.120 for a few more questions. This email is bait stamped 131 00:06:59.120 --> 00:07:02.879 EFTA zero two two four eight four to three zero. 132 00:07:03.600 --> 00:07:06.000 The bottom email appears to be an email written by 133 00:07:06.000 --> 00:07:10.120 you ms Groff to Jeffrey Epstein. Did you schedule hair 134 00:07:10.160 --> 00:07:13.959 appointments for women associated with mister Epstein at mister Fochaie 135 00:07:13.959 --> 00:07:18.439 Salon Answer yes. Question why were you the one scheduling them? 136 00:07:19.079 --> 00:07:22.000 Answer because I was mister Epstein's secretary and he would 137 00:07:22.040 --> 00:07:25.279 direct me to make appointments. Question and what was the 138 00:07:25.360 --> 00:07:30.360 arrangement between mister Fokai and mister Epstein for his hair appointments. Answer. 139 00:07:30.439 --> 00:07:32.759 I believe that mister Epstein had an account there, so 140 00:07:32.839 --> 00:07:35.639 whenever somebody went, the appointment would just be paid with 141 00:07:35.720 --> 00:07:39.439 their credit card on the account, Miss Brignac. And who 142 00:07:39.439 --> 00:07:43.680 are the women that were receiving haircuts? Miss Groff? Definitely 143 00:07:43.680 --> 00:07:46.319 the traveling assistance, but he could send other friends, I 144 00:07:46.319 --> 00:07:50.000 suppose at times. Question and in this email you state 145 00:07:50.279 --> 00:07:51.879 I want to make sure it's okay with you for 146 00:07:51.920 --> 00:07:54.759 the girls to make their own appointments at FACAI. Do 147 00:07:54.839 --> 00:07:58.079 they have your permission? Why did they need mister Epstein's 148 00:07:58.079 --> 00:08:01.439 permission to go? Answer? Because it was his money that 149 00:08:01.480 --> 00:08:04.959 they were using and Frederick Focai hair appointments are expensive. 150 00:08:05.759 --> 00:08:08.759 Question and why did mister Epstein We've heard from numerous 151 00:08:08.759 --> 00:08:12.439 people that mister Epstein dictated the style, color, everything about 152 00:08:12.439 --> 00:08:15.279 the haircut that they'd receive. Do you know why he 153 00:08:15.279 --> 00:08:18.800 would do that? Answer? I did not know at the time. 154 00:08:19.360 --> 00:08:21.800 Since we've been prepping for this testimony, I have learned 155 00:08:22.040 --> 00:08:24.240 that was something that he did, but I didn't know 156 00:08:24.279 --> 00:08:28.079 at the time. Question, And you're aware of any instances 157 00:08:28.160 --> 00:08:30.639 or did you any women came to you with any 158 00:08:30.639 --> 00:08:33.960 allegations about mister Fokai abusing a young woman or a girl. 159 00:08:34.240 --> 00:08:37.720 Answer no, mister Emmer, We've had another staff member join. 160 00:08:38.080 --> 00:08:42.120 Can he please identify himself for the record. Ryan Giachetti, 161 00:08:42.639 --> 00:08:47.679 chief counsel for Chairman Comer nice Italian name. Question did 162 00:08:47.759 --> 00:08:50.960 you ever schedule medical appointments for any women associated with 163 00:08:51.000 --> 00:08:55.600 mister Epstein? Answer? Not that I can recall offhand. Question. Now, 164 00:08:55.600 --> 00:08:58.519 I'm going to introduce majority exhibit number nine. This is 165 00:08:58.519 --> 00:09:02.120 a chain of emails between you Ms Groff and Jeffrey Epstein. 166 00:09:02.799 --> 00:09:06.919 The email is dated April seventh, twenty fourteen, and is 167 00:09:07.000 --> 00:09:11.120 bate stamped EFTA zero one nine two eight seven seven three, 168 00:09:12.279 --> 00:09:16.600 Miss Toland, I'll give you a moment to review the email. Question. 169 00:09:16.720 --> 00:09:18.679 So in the email, you're right at the top. One 170 00:09:18.759 --> 00:09:20.879 of the doctors Eva gave us could give a partial 171 00:09:20.879 --> 00:09:24.320 exam to redact to this Saturday, April twelfth. He said 172 00:09:24.360 --> 00:09:27.720 he could probably be available from one to four pm. 173 00:09:27.840 --> 00:09:31.440 And it continues on. Doctor Neil Voros says it's too 174 00:09:31.519 --> 00:09:33.799 much to do in one day for an entire exam. 175 00:09:34.320 --> 00:09:37.200 He's concerned that she speaks Polish as a first language. 176 00:09:37.919 --> 00:09:41.000 How fluent is redacted in English? I keep being asked this. 177 00:09:41.639 --> 00:09:44.200 It continues on, but that is probably all we need 178 00:09:44.240 --> 00:09:46.600 for the purpose of the question. Do you recall sending 179 00:09:46.600 --> 00:09:50.399 this email? Answer I do not recall that email. Question 180 00:09:50.480 --> 00:09:52.879 do you know the type of exam you were booking 181 00:09:53.120 --> 00:09:56.440 for what appears to be a Polish speaking woman? Answer? 182 00:09:56.679 --> 00:09:59.080 I believe she's taking some sort of written exam. I 183 00:09:59.120 --> 00:10:01.639 don't know to be a doctor or nurse. It's an 184 00:10:01.799 --> 00:10:05.879 exam that this person wants to take. Question Doctor Neil 185 00:10:05.960 --> 00:10:09.960 Voris is a registered clinical psychologist. Do you know if 186 00:10:09.960 --> 00:10:13.600 this was for any kind of psychological evaluation? Answer? Oh, 187 00:10:14.039 --> 00:10:17.200 I don't know. Question was mister Epstein paying for this 188 00:10:17.320 --> 00:10:20.320 test or appointment? Answer? I don't recall the email, so 189 00:10:20.360 --> 00:10:22.919 it's hard for me to say. Mister Epstein did pay 190 00:10:22.919 --> 00:10:24.919 for a lot of people to, you know, go to school. 191 00:10:25.639 --> 00:10:28.879 Question and do you know if this appointment was for 192 00:10:28.919 --> 00:10:32.559 the purpose of placing this woman on any kind of medication? Answer? 193 00:10:32.639 --> 00:10:36.360 I have no idea. Question And with scheduling medical appointments 194 00:10:36.519 --> 00:10:38.799 or anything of this kind common practice in your role 195 00:10:39.159 --> 00:10:43.960 as mister Epstein's secretary, Answer common practice? No question do 196 00:10:44.000 --> 00:10:46.759 you now frequently you might have scheduled appointments? Like this 197 00:10:47.000 --> 00:10:50.399 for other women. Answer, I don't recall ever, I don't 198 00:10:50.440 --> 00:10:54.600 ever recall making this appointment. I don't know, Brignac. You 199 00:10:54.759 --> 00:10:57.440 just testified that he paid for things frequently, like school. 200 00:10:57.919 --> 00:11:02.799 So is this a unique circumstance, Groff, A unique circumstance. Yeah, 201 00:11:02.879 --> 00:11:05.399 I don't recall this. She wants to go take an exam. 202 00:11:05.759 --> 00:11:07.879 I didn't know what kind of exam. But he paid 203 00:11:07.879 --> 00:11:11.080 for people to go to school, Brignac. But you never 204 00:11:11.159 --> 00:11:14.399 questioned why you'd be paying for this person's medical appointment, Groff, 205 00:11:14.600 --> 00:11:17.679 I didn't know it was a medical appointment. Tolan. Neil 206 00:11:17.759 --> 00:11:21.159 Voris is a registered psychologist who we understand him to be, 207 00:11:21.399 --> 00:11:24.240 so it appears that she's taking some kind of psychological 208 00:11:24.279 --> 00:11:27.759 evaluation or something of the sort. Graf, I don't know. 209 00:11:28.000 --> 00:11:30.480 I didn't know. I don't know what kind of doctor 210 00:11:30.519 --> 00:11:34.320 doctor neil Voris is. It was someone that Eva Jeffrey's friend, 211 00:11:34.320 --> 00:11:39.279 mister Epstein's friend, Brignac ms Groff. Can you explain what 212 00:11:39.320 --> 00:11:42.120 you meant? But he does not do this kind of 213 00:11:42.159 --> 00:11:44.840 testing in his clinic, Graf, I don't know. I don't know. 214 00:11:45.240 --> 00:11:47.279 I don't remember this, so I'm sorry. I wish I 215 00:11:47.279 --> 00:11:49.200 could tell you more, But really, I don't know what 216 00:11:49.279 --> 00:11:53.360 this is? Was she taking an exam? Backner? If your 217 00:11:53.399 --> 00:11:56.080 answer is you don't know, then that's your answer. Groff, 218 00:11:56.360 --> 00:11:59.320 I don't know. I don't know what this is. Question 219 00:11:59.639 --> 00:12:02.960 and this Eva? Are you referring to Eva Dubin? Answer? Yes, 220 00:12:03.320 --> 00:12:06.399 question and do you know her involvement? Did she ever 221 00:12:06.519 --> 00:12:10.440 conduct medical evaluations or did she organize medical appointments for 222 00:12:10.519 --> 00:12:14.720 women associated with Epstein? Answer? Not that I recall question. 223 00:12:15.480 --> 00:12:18.240 I think that's all the questions we have on this exhibit, 224 00:12:19.240 --> 00:12:21.840 just generally. Did you schedule any other kind of appointment 225 00:12:22.120 --> 00:12:26.039 for young women or girls associated with mister Epstein? Answer no? 226 00:12:27.200 --> 00:12:28.799 All right, folks, We're going to wrap up right here, 227 00:12:28.960 --> 00:12:30.919 and in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're 228 00:12:30.919 --> 00:12:33.200 going to pick up where we left off. All the 229 00:12:33.240 --> 00:12:36.799 information that goes with this episode can be found in 230 00:12:36.840 --> 00:12:39.960 the description box. What's up, everyone, and welcome to another 231 00:12:40.039 --> 00:12:43.679 episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going 232 00:12:43.720 --> 00:12:46.440 to pick up where he left off with Leslie Groff 233 00:12:46.879 --> 00:12:51.399 and her interview with Congress. Question and then just some 234 00:12:51.480 --> 00:12:53.840 brief questions. I know you were asked in the last hour, 235 00:12:54.159 --> 00:12:56.480 but some brief questions about your role and book and 236 00:12:56.559 --> 00:13:00.519 travel transportation in your role is mister Epstein' said secretary? 237 00:13:00.679 --> 00:13:04.679 Did you often book travel or transportation? Answer? I did 238 00:13:04.679 --> 00:13:07.480 after Sarah Kellen left. Prior to that, it was more 239 00:13:07.559 --> 00:13:10.840 Sarah or other people in the office. Question do you 240 00:13:10.879 --> 00:13:13.120 know what year that was? Answer? I want to say 241 00:13:13.159 --> 00:13:18.519 twenty thirteen, twenty twelve, something like that, when she was Brignac. 242 00:13:18.799 --> 00:13:22.279 Why did Sarah leave Miss Groff she got married. Question 243 00:13:22.360 --> 00:13:24.960 did you book flights as part of your job? Answer yes, 244 00:13:25.399 --> 00:13:29.039 question for mister Epstein answer there was a time when 245 00:13:29.039 --> 00:13:31.320 his plane wasn't working, so yes, I would book flights 246 00:13:31.360 --> 00:13:35.759 for him commercial through MX Centurion. Question did you book 247 00:13:35.799 --> 00:13:39.320 flights for any of his guests? Answer yes, question any 248 00:13:39.320 --> 00:13:43.120 of his friends? Answer it's possible. Question do you recall 249 00:13:43.200 --> 00:13:48.240 any specific instances where you did? Answer not offhand? Question 250 00:13:48.320 --> 00:13:51.039 did you book flights for Miss Maxwell? Answer I don't 251 00:13:51.039 --> 00:13:53.799 believe so. I think she always flew on his airplane. 252 00:13:54.519 --> 00:13:56.799 Question did you book flights for any other assistant of 253 00:13:56.919 --> 00:14:01.679 mister Epstein? Answer traveling assistance? Yes. Question did you plan 254 00:14:01.799 --> 00:14:05.759 travel for mister Epstein as well? Answer? What I schedule? 255 00:14:05.840 --> 00:14:10.399 His gets caught off question? Any itineraries book any activities, 256 00:14:10.480 --> 00:14:15.480 book appointments in a location he'd be traveling to answer yes. Question, 257 00:14:15.559 --> 00:14:18.159 And now we've already discussed how a majority of your 258 00:14:18.200 --> 00:14:23.000 tasks involved making calls, taking messages, communicating back and forth 259 00:14:23.039 --> 00:14:30.039 with mister Epstein, scheduling appointments. Is that all of fairer characterization? Answer? Yes. Question. 260 00:14:30.639 --> 00:14:32.720 I would now like to introduce what will be marked 261 00:14:32.720 --> 00:14:35.600 as majority Exhibit ten. This is FBI note from the 262 00:14:35.639 --> 00:14:38.919 Swarren statement that you gave to the FBI on September 263 00:14:38.960 --> 00:14:43.360 twenty fourth, twenty twenty one. It's BATES marked EFTA zero 264 00:14:43.440 --> 00:14:46.759 one two four six two one six. She's going to 265 00:14:46.840 --> 00:14:48.879 get that passed out and we'll give you some time 266 00:14:48.919 --> 00:14:51.840 to review. In the meantime, I'm just going to ask 267 00:14:51.879 --> 00:14:54.679 you some general questions about the interview, If that's okay. 268 00:14:55.480 --> 00:14:58.799 Answer sure. Question, So you were interviewed by the FBI 269 00:14:59.120 --> 00:15:02.039 on September twenty five, worth, twenty twenty one, related to 270 00:15:02.080 --> 00:15:07.440 the investigation into mister Epstein. Is that correct? Answer? Correct? Question? 271 00:15:08.240 --> 00:15:11.519 Why did you provide this testimony? Answer? I did so voluntarily. 272 00:15:12.200 --> 00:15:14.720 Question Were you interviewed by the FBI or any other 273 00:15:14.799 --> 00:15:18.960 law enforcement agency on any other occasion? Answer? No question. 274 00:15:19.039 --> 00:15:21.919 Did you provide any evidence, documents, or other material to 275 00:15:21.960 --> 00:15:28.039 the FBI? Answer? No, Backner, just so, Yeah, it's not 276 00:15:28.080 --> 00:15:31.720 a sworn statement, but it's her statement, Tolan. It's notes 277 00:15:31.759 --> 00:15:34.799 from her statement, but not sworn Backner. Yeah, it's just 278 00:15:34.840 --> 00:15:39.240 not sworn, Miss Tolan. Okay, thank you, question, and then 279 00:15:39.279 --> 00:15:42.000 we'll give you a second to review. Answer. Okay, you 280 00:15:42.000 --> 00:15:44.759 want me to read the whole entire thing. Question, You 281 00:15:44.759 --> 00:15:46.759 don't have to read it, if you remember, I have 282 00:15:46.840 --> 00:15:50.039 some specific questions that I can point you to answer, 283 00:15:50.480 --> 00:15:54.039 questions that you can guide me. Question Yeah, if you 284 00:15:54.080 --> 00:15:57.759 would like me to begin answer uh huh. Question. So 285 00:15:57.879 --> 00:16:01.039 on page two you state the man, mister Epstein, would 286 00:16:01.039 --> 00:16:03.120 give you a call list of who you were supposed 287 00:16:03.159 --> 00:16:06.759 to or of who he wanted to see and have 288 00:16:06.799 --> 00:16:10.799 appointments with. I think we've already discussed that in length. 289 00:16:11.360 --> 00:16:13.600 But you would receive that daily. Is that correct? And 290 00:16:13.639 --> 00:16:17.799 then make appointments accordingly? Answer yes. Question. On page two 291 00:16:18.240 --> 00:16:20.960 you mentioned that you were responsible for making all phone calls, 292 00:16:21.279 --> 00:16:25.279 including calling the chef and the driver. Is that accurate? Answer? Yes? 293 00:16:26.240 --> 00:16:29.240 Question what would you coordinate with each of them about? 294 00:16:29.759 --> 00:16:32.200 Answer the driver for when mister Epstein wanted to be 295 00:16:32.240 --> 00:16:34.440 picked up, and where he was supposed to be picked up, 296 00:16:34.879 --> 00:16:37.200 Give the driver an address for when he wanted to 297 00:16:37.279 --> 00:16:39.320 leave the house and be sure to be outside and 298 00:16:39.360 --> 00:16:42.360 ready to go. That type of thing. The chef would 299 00:16:42.399 --> 00:16:44.879 be if he wanted a chef to bring lunch over 300 00:16:44.960 --> 00:16:47.360 to the office, or it could be that he, you know, 301 00:16:47.679 --> 00:16:50.200 whatever he wanted for breakfast, lunch, or dinner, and just 302 00:16:50.279 --> 00:16:52.120 coordinate that with the chef to make sure that he's 303 00:16:52.159 --> 00:16:54.840 ready at the right time with whatever it is mister 304 00:16:54.879 --> 00:16:59.440 Epstein wanted to eat. Question and were those conversations happening daily? 305 00:16:59.759 --> 00:17:03.480 And sure? Oh yes? Question? And on page three you 306 00:17:03.600 --> 00:17:06.000 mentioned that you would coordinate with the pilots of mister 307 00:17:06.000 --> 00:17:10.599 Epstein's plane. Is that correct? Answer? Yes? Question what would 308 00:17:10.599 --> 00:17:14.640 you coordinate with the pilots about? Answer the time that 309 00:17:14.680 --> 00:17:16.880 he wanted to leave the day you wanted to leave, 310 00:17:17.119 --> 00:17:20.400 usually that would be that would be it. Question would 311 00:17:20.400 --> 00:17:22.960 you inform the pilots about guess mister Epstein was bringing 312 00:17:23.079 --> 00:17:26.000 on his plane? Answer yes, that could be possible to 313 00:17:26.559 --> 00:17:28.440 about who was going to be traveling on the flight. 314 00:17:29.160 --> 00:17:33.720 Question and were those frequent communications as well with the pilots? Answer? 315 00:17:33.839 --> 00:17:36.680 I mean yes, it would be whenever he was going 316 00:17:36.720 --> 00:17:40.480 to be traveling. Question and then on page three you 317 00:17:40.559 --> 00:17:44.000 also mentioned you'd coordinate or you would schedule business meetings 318 00:17:44.240 --> 00:17:49.160 architects and designers. Is that also correct? Answer? Yes, Question 319 00:17:49.559 --> 00:17:53.039 what would you coordinate with each of them about? Answer? Well, 320 00:17:53.119 --> 00:17:56.000 the business meetings, It was just all his associates that 321 00:17:56.039 --> 00:17:58.519 I would coordinate meetings with, be at his office or 322 00:17:58.559 --> 00:18:01.359 at his home. Architects are recall buying tickets for them 323 00:18:01.400 --> 00:18:05.519 to fly in. They would provide architectural plans. Mister Epstein 324 00:18:05.599 --> 00:18:08.119 never seemed to be satisfied with any of the architects 325 00:18:08.799 --> 00:18:11.359 and the designers. They would come and visit them. I 326 00:18:11.400 --> 00:18:14.359 would make appointments with them, possibly by the mirror, travel 327 00:18:14.480 --> 00:18:16.960 as well, and just coordinate phone calls with all these 328 00:18:16.960 --> 00:18:20.839 people as well. Question and just again, so the record's clear, 329 00:18:21.519 --> 00:18:25.640 we've talked about your role in scheduling business meetings a 330 00:18:25.640 --> 00:18:28.599 lot of different times. Today, is your testimony that you 331 00:18:28.640 --> 00:18:30.880 did not have any knowledge about the purpose of what 332 00:18:30.960 --> 00:18:34.240 went on in each of those meetings? Answer that is correct. 333 00:18:34.880 --> 00:18:40.519 Question you just scheduled. Answer merely scheduled. Correct. Brignac. In 334 00:18:40.559 --> 00:18:42.960 your opening statement, I believe you said something to the 335 00:18:42.960 --> 00:18:45.400 effect of you were thrust into the lives of the 336 00:18:45.480 --> 00:18:49.160 rich and famous. But your testimony is sounded like you 337 00:18:49.200 --> 00:18:51.640 were kept at an arm's length and that this was 338 00:18:51.799 --> 00:18:54.720 very humdrum work, not as exciting as you said it was. 339 00:18:55.240 --> 00:18:59.559 Can you help clarify my confusion, miss Groft? Sure, it 340 00:18:59.599 --> 00:19:01.480 was exciting just to know that you're talking to these 341 00:19:01.519 --> 00:19:06.200 people's offices. I was not friends, but it's more exciting 342 00:19:06.240 --> 00:19:08.160 than just speaking to, you know, the neighbor or the 343 00:19:08.200 --> 00:19:11.240 regular businessmen. They were all very important people. You know. 344 00:19:11.319 --> 00:19:14.200 It was exciting. Even though I had no real relationship 345 00:19:14.200 --> 00:19:16.519 with these people, it was still it was better than 346 00:19:16.559 --> 00:19:19.400 just working at your average accounting office and speaking to, 347 00:19:19.559 --> 00:19:22.359 you know, a bunch of accountants. Nothing wrong with accountants. 348 00:19:22.839 --> 00:19:26.720 I just mean these were movie producers, you know, record producers, businessmen, 349 00:19:27.000 --> 00:19:29.839 Wall Street businessmen, government people. You know. It was not 350 00:19:29.960 --> 00:19:34.480 normal poland. Question and you mentioned on page eight that 351 00:19:34.559 --> 00:19:36.720 mister Epstein would tell you to find a trader on 352 00:19:36.759 --> 00:19:40.559 a few occasions. Is that correct answer? I'm sorry page eight? 353 00:19:40.720 --> 00:19:45.279 Answer yeah? Question or answer? Okay, where are you question? 354 00:19:45.319 --> 00:19:47.200 It should be near the top of the page. You 355 00:19:47.240 --> 00:19:51.000 mentioned Epstein asking you to find a trader. Answer, Oh, 356 00:19:51.079 --> 00:19:53.400 I think this is about a certain incident. Just bear 357 00:19:53.440 --> 00:19:56.359 with me one second. Yeah, I recall one time mister 358 00:19:56.440 --> 00:19:58.960 Epstein wanted to make a trade and it was something 359 00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:02.400 if you know a about trading things, stocks move and 360 00:20:02.480 --> 00:20:05.279 every second matters, and I believe that I recall him 361 00:20:05.480 --> 00:20:07.960 calling and telling me to get this person on the phone. 362 00:20:08.599 --> 00:20:11.039 In my head, I was like, why is he not 363 00:20:11.079 --> 00:20:13.599 just calling the person if it's so important that it 364 00:20:13.640 --> 00:20:16.680 gets done, you know right away the stock's owing the move, 365 00:20:16.720 --> 00:20:18.839 and I felt I remember I had to find the 366 00:20:18.839 --> 00:20:21.960 phone number for the trader, and you know, that was it. 367 00:20:21.960 --> 00:20:24.000 It was just one of those incidents. Yeah, that was 368 00:20:24.039 --> 00:20:28.160 nerve wracking for me. Question just a one time occurrence. Answer. 369 00:20:28.720 --> 00:20:31.480 I definitely remember that one occurrence. I'm not saying I 370 00:20:31.519 --> 00:20:35.279 didn't connect them to a trader. Another time question and 371 00:20:35.319 --> 00:20:38.440 then a few quick questions. You mentioned it briefly about 372 00:20:38.480 --> 00:20:41.519 how exciting the work was. Did you enjoy working as 373 00:20:41.559 --> 00:20:46.359 an assistant or secretary apologies for mister Epstein. Answer. I 374 00:20:46.400 --> 00:20:49.920 did at the time, Miss Brignatt, Can you elaborate groth. 375 00:20:50.200 --> 00:20:53.599 It was exciting, it was challenging, It was super super busy. 376 00:20:54.440 --> 00:20:56.759 It was not like a regular a regular job as 377 00:20:56.759 --> 00:21:00.079 an assistant. It was just tear on fire, lots of commotion. 378 00:21:00.599 --> 00:21:03.480 People own islands and airplanes and homes in other parts 379 00:21:03.480 --> 00:21:06.200 of the world. It was exciting, just not like a 380 00:21:06.240 --> 00:21:10.440 regular job. Question and how did mister Epstein treat you 381 00:21:10.599 --> 00:21:12.759 or how did he treat you as a boss? Answer? 382 00:21:12.960 --> 00:21:15.759 As my boss, he was professional. He did not get 383 00:21:15.799 --> 00:21:17.799 close to me. If you asked him, I bet he 384 00:21:17.799 --> 00:21:20.279 would say that he didn't even know my husband's name 385 00:21:20.440 --> 00:21:22.880 or my son's name. It was not that kind of relationship. 386 00:21:23.559 --> 00:21:26.359 He would demand no mistakes. But I liked the challenge. 387 00:21:27.240 --> 00:21:29.240 I did get in trouble at times, but I also 388 00:21:29.279 --> 00:21:31.799 felt like I was good at coordinating and managing his 389 00:21:31.880 --> 00:21:35.440 phones and calling people and organizing his day, and I 390 00:21:35.480 --> 00:21:37.880 felt value from that. But we were not friends. We 391 00:21:37.960 --> 00:21:40.880 did not socialize. I did not see him outside of work, 392 00:21:41.079 --> 00:21:44.279 and it was all on purpose. Question and you mentioned 393 00:21:44.319 --> 00:21:46.720 it just then and in your opening statement as well, 394 00:21:46.960 --> 00:21:49.119 an instance where a mistake was made and he put 395 00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:51.440 you on probation. I believe you termed it. Can you 396 00:21:51.519 --> 00:21:55.400 explain what that was? Answer? So, yeah, they had told 397 00:21:55.400 --> 00:21:57.400 me that I should not socialize with anybody that he 398 00:21:57.400 --> 00:22:00.680 spoke to. They're friends for not my friends. I didn't 399 00:22:00.680 --> 00:22:02.880 get invited to a party and I went with my 400 00:22:02.960 --> 00:22:05.160 husband and he found out the next day. And I 401 00:22:05.279 --> 00:22:08.359