Speaker 1: Caalaroga Shark Media. Good morning, I'm Reed Carter. Friday, December
Speaker 1: twenty sixth, twenty twenty five, twenty nine years ago today,
Speaker 1: John Ramsey found his daughter's body in the basement of
Speaker 1: their Boulder home. John Beney Patricia Ramsey, six years old,
Speaker 1: strangled and beaten on Christmas night. Over the past two days,
Speaker 1: we've covered the murder, the botched investigation, the umbrella of
Speaker 1: suspicion that descended on the Ramsey family, the evidence pointing
Speaker 1: inside the house and out, the grand jury that voted
Speaker 1: to indict, and the da who refused to sign. Today,
Speaker 1: what happened next and where we are now. Two thousand
Speaker 1: and six, John Mark Carr, an American teacher living in Thailand,
Speaker 1: contacted a journalism professor in Colorado. Said he'd been with
Speaker 1: John Benney when she died, confessed to her murder. He
Speaker 1: was arrested in Bangkok, extra to the United States. Media
Speaker 1: went berserk. Then his DNA came back didn't match his
Speaker 1: ex wife said he was in Alabama on Christmas nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety six, fifteen hundred miles from Boulder. Carr was released
Speaker 1: another dead end that same year, Patsy Ramsey died ovarian cancer.
Speaker 1: She'd fought it since nineteen ninety three when into remission
Speaker 1: watched it come back. She was forty nine years old,
Speaker 1: buried in Marietta, Georgia, next to John Benay, still under
Speaker 1: that umbrella of suspicion. Two thousand and eight, New District
Speaker 1: Attorney Mary Lacey issued an unprecedented letter based on updated
Speaker 1: DNA analysis showing the same unknown male profile on John
Speaker 1: Bennet's underwear and long John's. Lacey publicly exonerated John Patsy
Speaker 1: and Burke Ramsey. No innocent person should have to endure
Speaker 1: such an extensive trial in the court of public opinion.
Speaker 1: Many prosecutors criticized the letter, said you can't exonerate someone
Speaker 1: who was never charged, said the DNA evidence wasn't that conclusive,
Speaker 1: but for John Ramsey it was vindication. Twenty twenty four
Speaker 1: to twenty twenty five, a Netflix documentary reignited interest. John
Speaker 1: Ramsey appeared at Crime Con twenty twenty five in Denver,
Speaker 1: pushing for new DNA testing. The Colorado Bureau of Investigation
Speaker 1: is currently testing dozens of items, some retested with new technology,
Speaker 1: some never tested at all. Alex Hunter, the DA who
Speaker 1: refused to sign the indictment. Died last month at age
Speaker 1: eighty nine. Witnesses are dying, Evidence is degrading, Time is
Speaker 1: running out, but John Ramsey, now eighty one years old,
Speaker 1: still believes the case can be solved. Still believes familial
Speaker 1: genealogy DNA testing, the technology that caught the Golden State killer,
Speaker 1: could identify John Bennet's murderer. I'm read Carter, this is
Speaker 1: celebrity trials today. Twenty five nine years without justice. The
Speaker 1: search for John Beney's killer continues. Part three of three.
Speaker 1: August two thousand and six, ten years after John Bennet's death.
Speaker 1: A bizarre twist that gave America false hope. John Mark
Speaker 1: Carr was a forty one year old American living in Thailand.
Speaker 1: Former teacher history of sexual interest in young girls, had
Speaker 1: been exchanging emails with a journalism professor named Michael Tracy,
Speaker 1: who was investigating the Ramsey case. In those emails, Carr
Speaker 1: made claims. Said he'd been communicating with Patsy Ramsey before
Speaker 1: her death, said he knew things about the murder that
Speaker 1: weren't public, said he was there when John Benay died.
Speaker 1: Thy police arrested him in Bangkok on August sixteenth, two
Speaker 1: thousand and six. At his press conference, Carr told reporters,
Speaker 1: I loved John Beney and she died accidentally. The media exploded.
Speaker 1: After a decade of Noah arrests, Finally a suspect, a confession,
Speaker 1: someone to blame. Bolder authorities flew to Thailand brought Carr
Speaker 1: back to the United States on a commercial flight, first class,
Speaker 1: champagne and prawns, a surreal journey that became its own
Speaker 1: news story, but the case fell apart immediately. Carr said
Speaker 1: he'd drugged John Bennet. The autopsy showed no drugs in
Speaker 1: her system. Carr said he'd been with her for hours.
Speaker 1: His timeline didn't match the evidence. Carr said, details that
Speaker 1: were already public nothing only the killer would know, and
Speaker 1: his DNA didn't match the unknown male profile from John
Speaker 1: Benet's underwear. The evidence that might identify the real killer
Speaker 1: excluded John Mark Carr completely. His ex wife, Laura came Forward,
Speaker 1: said she was certain Carr was with her in Alabama
Speaker 1: on Christmas night in nineteen ninety six, fifteen hundred miles
Speaker 1: from Boulder. She had no reason to protect him. He
Speaker 1: was her ex husband. She despised him, but the alibi held.
Speaker 1: Within two weeks, prosecutors declined to file charges. Car was released,
Speaker 1: returned to obscurity, another dead end in a case full
Speaker 1: of them. But the car fiasco did have one significant consequence.
Speaker 1: It exposed how desperate everyone was for answers, police, prosecutors, media, public.
Speaker 1: After ten years, any confession seemed credible, any suspect seemed viable.
Speaker 1: The case had become an obsession, and it showed how
Speaker 1: little progress had been made. A decade after John Bennet's murder,
Speaker 1: Bolder police had no viable suspects, The investigation had stalled,
Speaker 1: the evidence was aging, witnesses were harder to find. The
Speaker 1: case that should have been solved in weeks had become
Speaker 1: America's most famous cold case. June twenty fourth, two thousand
Speaker 1: and six, two months before John Mark Carr's arrest, Patsy
Speaker 1: Ramsey died. She'd been battling ovarian cancer since nineteen ninety three,
Speaker 1: three years before John Benney was born, went into remission,
Speaker 1: watched the disease return, fought it for thirteen years. Patsy
Speaker 1: Ramsey was forty nine years old when she died. She'd
Speaker 1: spent the last decade of her life, defending herself, fighting
Speaker 1: the accusation that she'd killed her daughter, giving interviews, writing
Speaker 1: a book, living under that umbrella of suspicion, She never
Speaker 1: got to see her name cleared, died still suspected of
Speaker 1: murdering her child. Patsy was buried at Saint James Episcopal
Speaker 1: Cemetery in Marietta, Georgia. Same cemetery as John Beney, same
Speaker 1: cemetery as John's daughter Elizabeth, who died in that car
Speaker 1: accident in nineteen ninety two. Three graves in a row,
Speaker 1: a family destroyed by tragedy. John Ramsey remarried in twenty eleven.
Speaker 1: His second wife, jan has supported his ongoing fight for justice,
Speaker 1: but he told reporters that Patsy's death just weeks before
Speaker 1: the car arrest was cruelly ironic. She didn't get to
Speaker 1: see any resolution. Two years after Patsy's death came the
Speaker 1: moment John had been waiting for. July ninth, two thousand
Speaker 1: and eight, New Boulder District Attorney Mary Lacy issued a
Speaker 1: letter to John Ramsey. Based on advanced DNA testing, she
Speaker 1: was publicly clearing the Ramsey family. Here's what the new
Speaker 1: testing found using touch DNA technology that didn't exist. In
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety six, scientists analyzed the waistband of John Bennet's
Speaker 1: Long Johns, the pajama bottoms she was wearing when she died.
Speaker 1: They found DNA, same unknown male profile that was in
Speaker 1: her underwear, same person, two separate locations on her clothing,
Speaker 1: same DNA, and it didn't match any Ramsey family member.
Speaker 1: Lacy's letter was unprecedented to the extent that we may
Speaker 1: have contributed in any way to the public perception that
Speaker 1: you might have been involved in this crime. I am
Speaker 1: deeply sorry. No innocent person should have to endure such
Speaker 1: an extensive trial in the court of public opinion. She apologized.
Speaker 1: On behalf of law enforcement acknowledged the family had been
Speaker 1: wrongly suspected, said the DNA evidence pointed to an unexplained
Speaker 1: third party. Critics were furious. Former prosecutors called it overreach,
Speaker 1: said Lacy couldn't exonerate someone who was never charged, said
Speaker 1: the DNA could be contamination factory workers, handlers, people who
Speaker 1: touched the clothing before John Benney wore it. Current Boulder
Speaker 1: DA Michael Doherty has been more cautious whether it is
Speaker 1: DNA or other evidence, more is needed to solve this murder,
Speaker 1: he said in a recent statement. In every one of
Speaker 1: our successfully prosecuted cases, it was the evidence that proved
Speaker 1: the defendant guilty. The exoneration didn't close the case, didn't
Speaker 1: identify the killer, didn't bring justice. But for John Ramsey,
Speaker 1: it was official acknowledgment of what he'd said for twelve years.
Speaker 1: His family didn't do it. Someone else killed John Benney.
Speaker 1: Now he just needs to find out who. We'll be
Speaker 1: right back with. Where the case stands today, new DNA testing,
Speaker 1: dying witnesses, and a father's final push for answers. Welcome
Speaker 1: back to celebrity trials. I'm Red Carter. Let me tell
Speaker 1: you where the John Beney Ramsey case stands today, twenty
Speaker 1: nine years after her murder. November twenty twenty four, Netflix
Speaker 1: released Cold Case Who Killed John Beney Ramsey, a three
Speaker 1: part documentary featuring John Ramsey and his son John Andrew.
Speaker 1: Pushing for new DNA testing, the documentary alleged Boulder police
Speaker 1: made mistakes during the investigation and we're holding but not
Speaker 1: pursuing key evidence. Boulder Police pushed back. Chief Stephen Redfern
Speaker 1: released a video statement the assertion that there is viable
Speaker 1: evidence and leads we are not pursuing to include DNA
Speaker 1: testing is completely false. The department says they've conducted new
Speaker 1: interviews in the past year, reinterviewed individuals based on tips,
Speaker 1: collected new evidence, and tested and retested other evidence with
Speaker 1: new DNA technology. Submitted items to the Colorado Bureau of Investigation.
Speaker 1: John Ramsey met with Chief Redfern in twenty twenty five,
Speaker 1: learned that dozens of items are currently being tested at CBI.
Speaker 1: Some are being retested with technology that didn't exist in
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety six. Others were collected from the basement crime
Speaker 1: scene but never tested at all. It's been a slow march,
Speaker 1: but they're progressing. John Andrew Ramsey told reporters after the meeting.
Speaker 1: Here's the problem with the DNA evidence. It's a mixture.
Speaker 1: The profile found in John Benet's underwear is mixed with
Speaker 1: her blood and at least two other people's DNA. Current
Speaker 1: technology can't fully separate a fifty to fifty mixture. Former
Speaker 1: Denver DA Mitch Morrissey, who worked on the case as
Speaker 1: a DNA expert, says the technology might not be ready yet.
Speaker 1: If you're talking about the DNA in the little girl's underwear.
Speaker 1: It's a fifty to fifty mixture. We are not at
Speaker 1: a stage with sequencing to be able to do a
Speaker 1: fifty to fifty mixture, but technology is advancing rapidly. Familial
Speaker 1: genealogy DNA testing, the technique that identified the Golden State
Speaker 1: killer in twenty eighteen, could potentially work if investigators can
Speaker 1: develop a clean profile, upload it to a genealogy database,
Speaker 1: find relatives of the unknown male, build a family tree
Speaker 1: that leads to the killer. John Ramsey believes they're close,
Speaker 1: told reporters he thinks twenty twenty five could be the
Speaker 1: year if they will do the DNA testing and use
Speaker 1: the genealogy reset search tool. I think there's better than
Speaker 1: a fifty to fifty chance we can solve it, but
Speaker 1: the clock is ticking. Alex Hunter, the DA who refused
Speaker 1: to sign the indictment, died last month at eighty nine.
Speaker 1: Detective Tom Haney, who interrogated Patsy Ramsey, died in August
Speaker 1: at seventy seven. A neighbor who heard what was described
Speaker 1: as John Bennet's blood curdling death scream died last year.
Speaker 1: Witnesses are dying memories are fading. Evidence is degrading. Every
Speaker 1: year that passes makes prosecution harder, even if they identify
Speaker 1: a suspect. Lou Smid's daughter, Cindy, now leads a private
Speaker 1: investigative team continuing her father's work using his detailed spreadsheet
Speaker 1: of suspects. They've eliminated roughly twenty five people through DNA testing,
Speaker 1: Still searching for a match. John Ramsey, now eighty one,
Speaker 1: has his daughter's picture on his phone's lock screen, Still
Speaker 1: thinks about her every day, still pushing for answers. In
Speaker 1: my mind, she's still my six year old little girl,
Speaker 1: he told reporters. It's going to change my kid's lives,
Speaker 1: my grandchildren's lives. They need this cloud, this question, this
Speaker 1: chapter closed. Will it ever be solved? Bolder police say
Speaker 1: they remain committed. DA Doherty says they've successfully prosecuted other
Speaker 1: cold case homicides. New DNA technology advances every year, but
Speaker 1: twenty nine years is a long time, and justice delayed
Speaker 1: is often justice denied. Why does John Benney Ramsay's case
Speaker 1: still captivate us nearly three decades later? Partly it's the
Speaker 1: horror a child murdered in her own home on Christmas Night,
Speaker 1: the most innocent victim imaginable on the most sacred day
Speaker 1: of the year. It violated every assumption about safety, family,
Speaker 1: and the sanctity of childhood. Partly, it's the mystery. Two
Speaker 1: completely plausible theories the family did it, an intruder did it,
Speaker 1: and evidence supporting both. We're drawn to puzzles we can't solve.
Speaker 1: Jean Bennet is the ultimate unsolved puzzle. Partly it's the
Speaker 1: system failures, bolder police who bungled the investigation from minute one,
Speaker 1: a crime scene contaminated before it was documented, a grand
Speaker 1: jury that voted to indict but was overruled, a case
Speaker 1: that should have been solved in weeks that remains open
Speaker 1: nearly thirty years later. And partly it's the cultural moment
Speaker 1: John Benet represented the child Beauty pageant videos made America uncomfortable.
Speaker 1: They raised questions about how we sexualized children, how we
Speaker 1: exploit their innocence, how we put them on display. Those
Speaker 1: pageant images became the lasting visual of the case. Not
Speaker 1: John Bennet as a normal six year old riding bikes,
Speaker 1: playing with friends, being a kid, but John Benet in
Speaker 1: full makeup, styled hair, elaborate costumes, a tiny adult, a
Speaker 1: child playing dress up in a world that wasn't age appropriate.
Speaker 1: Did that attention attract her killer? Was she targeted because
Speaker 1: of her visibility. We'll probably never know, but the pageant
Speaker 1: imagery shaped how America perceived the case and the Ramsey
Speaker 1: family twenty nine years later, the child beauty pageant industry continues.
Speaker 1: Thousands of little girls compete every year. Parents enter them,
Speaker 1: coach them, dress them up. The ethics haven't changed, The
Speaker 1: debate never ends. John Benet Patricia Ramsey was born August sixth,
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety died December twenty fifth, nineteen ninety six, six
Speaker 1: years old. She should be thirty five today, should have
Speaker 1: graduated high school and college, maybe married, maybe had children
Speaker 1: of her own, Maybe followed her mother into pageants or
Speaker 1: rejected them entirely and found her own path. We'll never
Speaker 1: know who she would have become. Her mother, Patsy, died
Speaker 1: in two thousand and six, still suspected of her murder.
Speaker 1: Her father, John is eighty one, still fighting for ans answers.
Speaker 1: Her brother, Burke, who was nine when she died, has
Speaker 1: largely stayed out of the public eye. Someone killed John
Speaker 1: Benet Ramsey on Christmas Night, nineteen ninety six, someone strangled
Speaker 1: a six year old girl in her own basement while
Speaker 1: her family slept upstairs. Someone has known the truth for
Speaker 1: twenty nine years. The case remains open. Bolder police say
Speaker 1: they're still investigating. New DNA testing is underway. Technology that
Speaker 1: didn't exist in nineteen ninety six might finally identify the
Speaker 1: unknown male whose DNA was found on John Benet's body.
Speaker 1: Will we ever know who killed her? John Ramsey believes
Speaker 1: we will. Bolder police say they remain committed. The families
Speaker 1: of victims never stop hoping. But justice delayed twenty nine
Speaker 1: years may be justice denied forever. The killer, if still alive,
Speaker 1: is twenty nine years older. Witnesses are dying, Evidence is degrading,
Speaker 1: Memories are fading. John Beney Ramsey deserved better, deserved a
Speaker 1: competent investigation, deserved a trial, deserved justice. Instead, she got
Speaker 1: a botched crime scene, a media circus, and nearly three
Speaker 1: decades of unanswered questions. Someone has to say her name,
Speaker 1: Someone has to remember she was a person, a six
Speaker 1: year old girl who loved Christmas, loved performing, loved her family.
Speaker 1: Not just a case file, not just a mystery, A
Speaker 1: child who should be alive today. Rest in peace. John
Speaker 1: Beney Patricia Ramsey August sixth, nineteen ninety to December twenty fifth,
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety six. Twenty nine years without justice, But we
Speaker 1: haven't forgotten you. We never will. I'm read Carter. This
Speaker 1: concludes our John Beney Ramsey Special. Tomorrow we continue Twelve
Speaker 1: Crimes of Christmas with another classic case. America can't forget.
Speaker 1: This is Celebrity Trials