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<v Speaker 1>Today, I want to tell you about a journey that

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<v Speaker 1>I've been on for most of my life. Ever since

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<v Speaker 1>I was a kid, I've heard tales of bigfoot and

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<v Speaker 1>wild men while spending time with my friends and family.

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<v Speaker 1>As I grew older and read more about the paranormal,

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<v Speaker 1>my interest in encryptids and other things strange only deepened.

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<v Speaker 1>That's why I'm so excited to share with you what

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<v Speaker 1>I've personally become involved with the Untold Radio Network. The

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<v Speaker 1>Untold Radio Network is a live streaming podcast network that

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<v Speaker 1>airs a new show every day across all podcast platforms, YouTube,

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<v Speaker 1>and more. They have eight different shows on all sorts

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<v Speaker 1>of exciting topics such as bigfoot, cryptids, UFOs, aliens, and

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<v Speaker 1>much more. I even have my own show called Weird Encounters,

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<v Speaker 1>where I talk about all things strange. This is more

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<v Speaker 1>than just a podcast network. It's a community that allows

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<v Speaker 1>me to meet so many amazing people who share their

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<v Speaker 1>stories and experiences with strange. If you're interested in hearing

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<v Speaker 1>more of these stories and learning more about the paranormal

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<v Speaker 1>and encryptids, make sure you check out the Untold Radio

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<v Speaker 1>Network for all kinds of exciting shows. It's free to subscribe.

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<v Speaker 1>So what are you waiting for visit www dot untold

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<v Speaker 1>radionetwork dot com Today.

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<v Speaker 2>Hey everybody, this is Left Striving Yes, yes, I know

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<v Speaker 2>aka Survivor Man, and you're listening to Brian on Sasquatch Audisy.

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<v Speaker 1>Hey there and welcome back to Sasquatch Odyssey. Thank you

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<v Speaker 1>so much for being with us for the show. It

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<v Speaker 1>is Sunday. I hope you're having a great weekend. We

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<v Speaker 1>have an amazing show lined up for you. But as

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<v Speaker 1>I always want to start by inviting you. If you've

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<v Speaker 1>had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show,

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<v Speaker 1>shoot me an email and get me at Brian at

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<v Speaker 1>Paranormal World Productions dot com. Can head over to the website,

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<v Speaker 1>check it out, become a memory there and help support

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<v Speaker 1>the show. As you know, last week we passed our

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<v Speaker 1>five hundredth episode on the show, so I started looking

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<v Speaker 1>back into the archives and wanted to remaster some of

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<v Speaker 1>the interviews that I've done the show, and I went

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<v Speaker 1>back to episode forty five that originally aired in July

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<v Speaker 1>of twenty twenty one. It is Jeff Harding from Pine

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<v Speaker 1>Island Research. He came on and shared one of the

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<v Speaker 1>most amazing experiences I'd ever heard, and then we had

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<v Speaker 1>a fantastic conversation about some of his techniques that he

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<v Speaker 1>uses while he's doing his research and some of the

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<v Speaker 1>results that he had gotten. So what you're about to

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<v Speaker 1>hear is the remastered version where I've went in and

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<v Speaker 1>improved the IDEO. I've taken out all the unnecessary bits,

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<v Speaker 1>and what you're left with is one fantastic encounter story

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<v Speaker 1>and one amazing interview. We're definitely gonna have to get

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<v Speaker 1>Jeff back on for another round and talk about what

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<v Speaker 1>kind of research he's doing and what's going on in

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<v Speaker 1>his research area here in twenty twenty four. But for now,

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<v Speaker 1>I know you guys are ready to get into it.

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<v Speaker 1>Jeff's on the line, he's ready to go. All it's

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<v Speaker 1>left for you to do is sit back, relax, and

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<v Speaker 1>enjoy the show. All right, folks, I want to welcome

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<v Speaker 1>Jeff to the show. Jeff comes to us from South Dakota.

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<v Speaker 1>He had an encounter up in Manitoba, Canada with a

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<v Speaker 1>big foot some years ago. Welcome to the show.

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<v Speaker 3>Jeff. Hey, thanks, are you fabulous man?

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<v Speaker 1>I appreciate you taking time to come on the show

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<v Speaker 1>and know that you had an encounter some years back.

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<v Speaker 1>Why don't you take us back to where you were,

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<v Speaker 1>what you were doing, and what happened here in your encounter.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I grew up the son of a hunting guide

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<v Speaker 3>here in South Dakota and northern Minnesota. I didn't know

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<v Speaker 3>anybody who'd ever had an encounter before. When I graduated

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<v Speaker 3>from high school, I joined the Army. I wasn't going

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<v Speaker 3>to be leaving until the end of July. That last

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<v Speaker 3>week and May and one of my good friends high

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<v Speaker 3>school invited me to go with him and his younger

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<v Speaker 3>brother who was fourteen, his dad, two of his uncles,

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<v Speaker 3>and several of his cousins who were all in their

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<v Speaker 3>upper twenties, so we were the youngest on the group.

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<v Speaker 3>Where this happened was on Granville Lake as part of

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<v Speaker 3>the Churchill Reservoir System. It's about one hundred and ten

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<v Speaker 3>miles north of Flinthlon Flynt Swan's right on that Saskatchewan

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<v Speaker 3>Manitoba border, so we were twenty twenty five miles east

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<v Speaker 3>on the Manitoba side of the border. We drove up there.

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<v Speaker 3>It was a long guy from where we lived. It

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<v Speaker 3>was a couple of days just driving to get there.

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<v Speaker 3>The last sixty seventy mile was like diving on a

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<v Speaker 3>tank trail. It was really remote where we went. We

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<v Speaker 3>knew these guides up there that Paul's dad had worked

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<v Speaker 3>with before. There were three guides that were native to

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<v Speaker 3>the area. They lived at this place here, so they

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<v Speaker 3>were hunting guides on fishing guides. We had sixteen foot

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<v Speaker 3>aluminum boats with twenty twenty five horse tiller motors. We

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<v Speaker 3>were going to be up there fishing for eight days.

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<v Speaker 3>The first few days, me and Paul, my buddy, and

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<v Speaker 3>his younger brother, the three of us since we had

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<v Speaker 3>all grew up in the outdoors. Our parents are cup

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<v Speaker 3>boat with us being on our own in the outdoor,

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<v Speaker 3>so the three of us were in a boat by ourselves.

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<v Speaker 3>The first three days. We'd go out and fish in

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<v Speaker 3>the morning and they come back mid afternoon for a

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<v Speaker 3>little while, and we'd go out in the evening before supper.

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<v Speaker 3>While we were fishing. On that fourth day, Paul's brother

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<v Speaker 3>had to take a leak, and he's one of these

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<v Speaker 3>guys that can't go out of a boat. So we

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<v Speaker 3>pulled up on the shore of this little island. It

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<v Speaker 3>was probably about I would say, maybe thirty acres in size,

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<v Speaker 3>heavily wooded. It was a rise. There's a gravelly beach

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<v Speaker 3>around the edge that we were on. The beach is

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<v Speaker 3>about twenty creet wide to the edge of the tree line.

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<v Speaker 3>We pulled the boat up on the shore and I

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<v Speaker 3>walked over to what appeared to be a game trail.

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<v Speaker 3>It was about maybe four or five foot wide, and

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<v Speaker 3>it had rained that morning off and on. It was

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<v Speaker 3>pretty cool out the first week in June. It was

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<v Speaker 3>cold up there, especially in the mornings, and then by

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<v Speaker 3>the afternoon would be seventy degrees. But I'm looking up

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<v Speaker 3>at this game trail and it rose steeply. When you

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<v Speaker 3>looked up with the birch pine and poppers, it was

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<v Speaker 3>like a corridor that you could see about fifteen twenty feet.

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<v Speaker 3>Because of that dense cover, you couldn't see it further.

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<v Speaker 3>It was intriguing to me because I grew up hunting.

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<v Speaker 3>Most of my hunting was elk and deer and things

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<v Speaker 3>like that. But I'd been deep in the back country

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<v Speaker 3>with my dad and other hunting guides before, so I

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<v Speaker 3>really was afraid to walk up the trail. I guess

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<v Speaker 3>I started walking up. It was steek. I'd say it

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<v Speaker 3>was like a thirty degree incline. Just with tennis shoes on,

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<v Speaker 3>it was hard to walk up, slipping on this greasy, high,

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<v Speaker 3>neatly mud packed down the trail. I told those guys,

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<v Speaker 3>I was gonna walk up here quick. I'd be right back.

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<v Speaker 3>I walked up, probably about twenty yards up this thing.

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<v Speaker 3>It took me a little bit of time to get

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<v Speaker 3>up it, because you'd walk five feet, slide a foot

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<v Speaker 3>or two back, and then get your footing again. While

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<v Speaker 3>I was walking up, I heard a really loud, cracking snap,

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<v Speaker 3>and I really wasn't sure what carved that. It was still,

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<v Speaker 3>we had no wind at all out to that day.

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<v Speaker 3>The water was smooth as glass, and I thought, because

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<v Speaker 3>I figured there's got to be a bear here, and

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<v Speaker 3>I didn't want to walk up on a bear that

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<v Speaker 3>time of year that may have come. So I just

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<v Speaker 3>stood still, and it came from my web side. I'm

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<v Speaker 3>looking into the trees, and I'm confident that I'm going

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<v Speaker 3>to see movement of what made this sound because it

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<v Speaker 3>was closed. It felt like this thick pop and crack

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<v Speaker 3>sound was close to me, within thirty yards probably. I'm

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<v Speaker 3>looking to the left and stood there for almost two

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<v Speaker 3>bold that scanning waiting to see a black bear. I

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<v Speaker 3>turned my back and looked down the trail at the beach.

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<v Speaker 3>I can't see the beach. I'd to only see about

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<v Speaker 3>ten to fifteen yards through this heavily forested trail, and

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<v Speaker 3>because of stuff overhanging in the incline, you just can't

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<v Speaker 3>see forward that bar. So I'm looking down the decline

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<v Speaker 3>at the beach and I can't see the edge of

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<v Speaker 3>that gravel. I was looking downward, and as I turned

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<v Speaker 3>back up the trail, I'm staring at the knees of

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<v Speaker 3>something standing right in front of me, like fifteen feet

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<v Speaker 3>in front of me. What was standing in front of

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<v Speaker 3>me was in elevation, was probably three foot higher in

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<v Speaker 3>elevation than I was. Because of the rise of the trail.

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<v Speaker 3>I've seen the knees and it looked like I was

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<v Speaker 3>looking at maybe the lower area of a black bear

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<v Speaker 3>that's standing on its hind leggies. I just about freaked out,

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<v Speaker 3>but I thought so still, And as I looked up

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<v Speaker 3>at the waist level, I seen two huge hands cradling

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<v Speaker 3>underneath holding about a five to six foot section of

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<v Speaker 3>birch tree trunk that had about a six inch diameter

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<v Speaker 3>to it. So it wasn't light, and on one end

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<v Speaker 3>there was a giant like a five gallon bucket size

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<v Speaker 3>the root system with dirt. As I'm looking up for

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<v Speaker 3>it's like standing under a basketball rim trying to look

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<v Speaker 3>straight up at it right. And as I rise up

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<v Speaker 3>and look, as soon as I seen its face, was

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<v Speaker 3>making eye contact with it. It took this birch tree

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<v Speaker 3>that it was holding at its waist level and through it.

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<v Speaker 3>The only way I can describe it is if you

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<v Speaker 3>were to bounce past a basketball to me, how you're

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<v Speaker 3>not winding your hand behind your body, You're just from

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<v Speaker 3>your chest forward or you're waist forward pushing the ball later.

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<v Speaker 3>That's how it shook this birch trunk at me and

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<v Speaker 3>hit it downward so that it hit me at waste level.

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<v Speaker 3>I'll tell you what. It launched me completely off of

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<v Speaker 3>my beat. I flew backwards, landed on my back. Now

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<v Speaker 3>this branch is diagonally cross, my chest is under my

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<v Speaker 3>right arm, and my west legs wrapped around and I'm

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<v Speaker 3>sliding down this mud trail. As I'm looking back up,

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<v Speaker 3>I could see its legs still. I watched it jump

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<v Speaker 3>up and down twice as I'm falling down this trail.

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<v Speaker 3>I could feel the ground, the percussion of these two

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<v Speaker 3>stumps on the ground. The only way I could describe

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<v Speaker 3>it was if I walked up behind you and patted

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<v Speaker 3>you on your back. I could feel the ground that way.

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<v Speaker 3>As I was sliding down, I could feel it. It

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<v Speaker 3>never screamed or made any noise as I slip down.

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<v Speaker 3>I ended up at the edge of the gravel at

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<v Speaker 3>Obomba's Hill. I had twisted my left ankle pretty badly.

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<v Speaker 3>When I scurried up to my feet, I couldn't put

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<v Speaker 3>my weight on my left foot. I'm yelling at Paul

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<v Speaker 3>and his brother getting the boat, getting the boat. They

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<v Speaker 3>start panicking because I think they had heard the snap too.

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<v Speaker 3>I think they thought that I was attacked by a bear.

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<v Speaker 3>Jamie ran to the boat at fourteen years old. He's

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<v Speaker 3>just in a panic mode and he gets in the

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<v Speaker 3>boat and Paul grabs the nose of the boat and

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<v Speaker 3>pushes it out into the water. I'm walking backwards across

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<v Speaker 3>this gravel beach. I don't want to take my eyes

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<v Speaker 3>off that game trail. I really felt like what I

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<v Speaker 3>had just seen, if I turned my back to it

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<v Speaker 3>can come flying out and tackle me. I walked backwards,

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<v Speaker 3>just limping on my leg I get to the water

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<v Speaker 3>about a foot and half. He flopped myself over the

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<v Speaker 3>gun well of the boat. I'm sitting in the middle seat.

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<v Speaker 3>Jamie's back there trying to get this outboard and started,

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<v Speaker 3>and it's not starting. Paul had been driving the boat

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<v Speaker 3>for three days. Jamie never operated an outboard motor in

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<v Speaker 3>his life. I don't know if he didn't pump up

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<v Speaker 3>the ball or used the joke. He's pulled this thing

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<v Speaker 3>fifty times and it's not starting. He's probably got it flooded.

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<v Speaker 3>At this point, Paul's freaking out. Jamie is frantically looking

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<v Speaker 3>back at the motor. I'm sitting there looking at the

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<v Speaker 3>game trailer because I can't take my eyes off it,

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<v Speaker 3>but my body I can't say what I want to say.

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00:12:32.080 --> 00:12:35.759
<v Speaker 3>Maybe that's shock or the adrenaline dump of what happened.

219
00:12:36.279 --> 00:12:39.039
<v Speaker 3>I just kept looking at my mouth taking and open,

220
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<v Speaker 3>trying to process what I'd just seen. When I got

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<v Speaker 3>back on the beach, I'm standing there immediately trying to

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<v Speaker 3>justify what had just happened. Some people that grew up

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<v Speaker 3>with that reference of hearing stories or having relatives at

224
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<v Speaker 3>head encounters. Maybe in that position, they'd look at this

225
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<v Speaker 3>and say, Wow, I just saw a big fleet. But

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<v Speaker 3>I didn't have that. I didn't have that history. So

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<v Speaker 3>I'm going through a checklist of what I know. It wasn't.

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<v Speaker 3>I'm telling myself it wasn't a black bear. It was

229
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<v Speaker 3>the brown bear. It wasn't a motion. The more I

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<v Speaker 3>can't come up with an explanation, the more I started

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<v Speaker 3>to panic. Finally, Paul had told Jamie. He said, you're

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<v Speaker 3>not going to get that thing started. Let me get

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<v Speaker 3>in the boat. I started yelling at Paul, just get

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<v Speaker 3>in the boat, Just get in the boat. So Paul

235
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<v Speaker 3>jumps in the boat and switches spots as Jamie and

236
00:13:26.120 --> 00:13:29.120
<v Speaker 3>he starts pulling it. He's not having much luck. I

237
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<v Speaker 3>looked down the shoreline from us, about seventy to eighty

238
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<v Speaker 3>yards away. I see a black bear come running out

239
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<v Speaker 3>of the tree line. It runs down onto the beach.

240
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<v Speaker 3>It's not even looking at us. It's walking our direction

241
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<v Speaker 3>once it gets to the beach, but it's not looking

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<v Speaker 3>at us. This thing's going to look up and see

243
00:13:51.000 --> 00:13:53.399
<v Speaker 3>us here and stop and go the other way. But

244
00:13:53.879 --> 00:13:56.559
<v Speaker 3>it just would not take its eyes off this tree line.

245
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<v Speaker 3>It's walking towards us with its head ninety degrees rest,

246
00:14:00.360 --> 00:14:03.600
<v Speaker 3>staring at the tree line like something had startled it

247
00:14:03.639 --> 00:14:05.840
<v Speaker 3>and scared it out of this tree line. That's when

248
00:14:05.879 --> 00:14:08.759
<v Speaker 3>I realized maybe this thing was getting by the same thing.

249
00:14:08.840 --> 00:14:11.240
<v Speaker 3>And it kept walking in our direction, and finally it

250
00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:13.679
<v Speaker 3>looks up and sees us, and when it sees us,

251
00:14:14.080 --> 00:14:17.559
<v Speaker 3>it starts picking up its pace. It just was odd

252
00:14:17.679 --> 00:14:19.600
<v Speaker 3>some of this said. When I comment on this, it's

253
00:14:19.639 --> 00:14:22.840
<v Speaker 3>in retrospect. It's not what I was thinking at the moment.

254
00:14:23.039 --> 00:14:26.000
<v Speaker 3>In retrospect, I feel like this bear saw us and

255
00:14:26.080 --> 00:14:29.559
<v Speaker 3>felt relieved, but it was making its way towards us.

256
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<v Speaker 3>And Paul Junger brother was literally crying. He had tears

257
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<v Speaker 3>in his eyes. He was freaking out, kept saying what happened,

258
00:14:36.279 --> 00:14:39.159
<v Speaker 3>what happened, what happened. I felt like, until we're out

259
00:14:39.159 --> 00:14:42.039
<v Speaker 3>of here here, I didn't feel safe. The boat's only

260
00:14:42.080 --> 00:14:44.840
<v Speaker 3>twenty feet on the edge of the beach. We're not

261
00:14:45.120 --> 00:14:47.960
<v Speaker 3>blowing anywhere. There's no wind that we can't get a

262
00:14:48.000 --> 00:14:51.480
<v Speaker 3>motor started. Now that we got this bear getting closer,

263
00:14:52.080 --> 00:14:54.240
<v Speaker 3>so I told Jamie, I said, we had caught some

264
00:14:54.399 --> 00:14:57.440
<v Speaker 3>northern four or five pound northern pike that morning that

265
00:14:57.480 --> 00:15:00.000
<v Speaker 3>we had on a stringer. I told Jami, I should

266
00:15:00.320 --> 00:15:03.120
<v Speaker 3>get world fish off the string or hurry up. Jamie

267
00:15:03.159 --> 00:15:05.679
<v Speaker 3>grabbed the stringer and got a fish off, threw it

268
00:15:05.759 --> 00:15:08.960
<v Speaker 3>up on the shore. Enough bear walked right up. He's

269
00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:11.440
<v Speaker 3>only twenty five feet from the front of our boat.

270
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<v Speaker 3>That's probably two years old, and it reaches down. That's

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00:15:14.879 --> 00:15:17.799
<v Speaker 3>why I realized it's missing. It's right paw. It's not

272
00:15:17.879 --> 00:15:20.200
<v Speaker 3>a recent injury. It looks like maybe it was caught

273
00:15:20.200 --> 00:15:22.399
<v Speaker 3>in a trap at some point. Right at the wrist.

274
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<v Speaker 3>It grabs this fairsh pinches it against its wrist, lifts

275
00:15:27.480 --> 00:15:29.679
<v Speaker 3>it up and bites the head off and stairs back.

276
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<v Speaker 3>Looked at the trees as it chomps his head three

277
00:15:32.799 --> 00:15:36.200
<v Speaker 3>or four times and swallows it. It drops that finish

278
00:15:36.240 --> 00:15:38.799
<v Speaker 3>and takes off in a sprint. I didn't even know

279
00:15:38.919 --> 00:15:42.000
<v Speaker 3>bear could move that sass back in the direction that

280
00:15:42.080 --> 00:15:44.600
<v Speaker 3>it came from, like it was getting out of it.

281
00:15:45.159 --> 00:15:47.879
<v Speaker 3>Paul gets his motor started. I should get out of here.

282
00:15:47.919 --> 00:15:50.639
<v Speaker 3>We got to get out of here, because whatever made

283
00:15:50.639 --> 00:15:53.759
<v Speaker 3>the bear runaway was what had thrown this log at

284
00:15:53.799 --> 00:15:56.519
<v Speaker 3>me on this trail. I just knew that it was

285
00:15:56.559 --> 00:16:00.879
<v Speaker 3>still here, so we backed the boat up reversed just

286
00:16:01.120 --> 00:16:04.279
<v Speaker 3>backing away from the island. We back out till we're

287
00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:08.879
<v Speaker 3>about eighty two one hundred yards out. As we're watching

288
00:16:08.919 --> 00:16:12.360
<v Speaker 3>the shore, we watched this thing through the log. We

289
00:16:12.440 --> 00:16:15.840
<v Speaker 3>watched the big foot walk right out onto the beach

290
00:16:16.600 --> 00:16:21.159
<v Speaker 3>and probably three strides that covered the treeline to the

291
00:16:21.200 --> 00:16:24.360
<v Speaker 3>water's edge. When I say it bent over and picked

292
00:16:24.440 --> 00:16:26.919
<v Speaker 3>up a stish, I don't mean like me or you would.

293
00:16:27.000 --> 00:16:28.879
<v Speaker 3>If I was to pick something like that up, I'd

294
00:16:28.879 --> 00:16:31.519
<v Speaker 3>pop down on one knee almost to grab it, and

295
00:16:31.559 --> 00:16:34.879
<v Speaker 3>then you get yourself up. This thing just tilted its

296
00:16:34.879 --> 00:16:38.360
<v Speaker 3>shoulders at forty five degrees and lowered itself down like

297
00:16:38.399 --> 00:16:42.279
<v Speaker 3>an elevator, grabbed it in its right hand, and just

298
00:16:42.279 --> 00:16:45.279
<v Speaker 3>stood straight back up and held it right in front

299
00:16:45.279 --> 00:16:49.799
<v Speaker 3>of its chest. It's just staring at us for ten seconds,

300
00:16:49.879 --> 00:16:52.519
<v Speaker 3>just staring at the boat. Even though we were eighty

301
00:16:52.559 --> 00:16:57.759
<v Speaker 3>two hundred yards away. It was mostly cloudy, It wasn't

302
00:16:57.960 --> 00:17:01.879
<v Speaker 3>direct sunlight anywhere. There wasn't glare you can see the

303
00:17:02.279 --> 00:17:06.440
<v Speaker 3>Claire's day. Especially after just watching this bear for three minutes,

304
00:17:06.960 --> 00:17:10.039
<v Speaker 3>we knew that we weren't looking at a bear. It

305
00:17:10.079 --> 00:17:13.480
<v Speaker 3>stared at us after about ten fifteen seconds, turned around

306
00:17:13.519 --> 00:17:16.079
<v Speaker 3>with a fish and walked right back into the tree.

307
00:17:16.880 --> 00:17:19.519
<v Speaker 3>The whole time that this thing, from the moment it

308
00:17:19.599 --> 00:17:21.519
<v Speaker 3>walked out from the trees on the beach through a

309
00:17:21.559 --> 00:17:25.440
<v Speaker 3>moment I walked away. Paul and Jamie are just yelling,

310
00:17:25.640 --> 00:17:28.480
<v Speaker 3>what is that? What is that? What is that? I

311
00:17:28.640 --> 00:17:31.000
<v Speaker 3>just felt like I was frozen in shock. I never

312
00:17:31.079 --> 00:17:34.599
<v Speaker 3>said a word. I'm just watching, Holy crap, this is

313
00:17:34.720 --> 00:17:39.000
<v Speaker 3>what through the logger. I didn't just imagine that I

314
00:17:39.079 --> 00:17:42.359
<v Speaker 3>was attacked by them. It was about nine nine and

315
00:17:42.359 --> 00:17:45.720
<v Speaker 3>a half foot tall. It wasn't standing on the beach.

316
00:17:45.759 --> 00:17:49.640
<v Speaker 3>It was going to open, so I couldn't really gauge

317
00:17:50.119 --> 00:17:53.720
<v Speaker 3>its height by much, but I could tell that it

318
00:17:53.759 --> 00:17:56.640
<v Speaker 3>was extremely tall, and by what I was standing in

319
00:17:56.680 --> 00:18:00.079
<v Speaker 3>front of on the trail, even considering the incline and

320
00:18:00.200 --> 00:18:02.599
<v Speaker 3>it was on above me, it was pulled something that

321
00:18:02.640 --> 00:18:05.000
<v Speaker 3>when I looked up and seated and look as soon

322
00:18:05.000 --> 00:18:07.599
<v Speaker 3>as I saw it space. I got to see its

323
00:18:07.599 --> 00:18:13.240
<v Speaker 3>space for about half a second before through that log

324
00:18:13.279 --> 00:18:15.799
<v Speaker 3>and hit me at waist level. We sat in the

325
00:18:15.839 --> 00:18:21.359
<v Speaker 3>boat and kept backing away further and further. Paul said,

326
00:18:21.440 --> 00:18:23.200
<v Speaker 3>is that what was on the trail that made the

327
00:18:23.279 --> 00:18:26.519
<v Speaker 3>sound That's when I told them what happened. This thing

328
00:18:26.559 --> 00:18:28.319
<v Speaker 3>threw a log at me, hit me in the hip.

329
00:18:28.400 --> 00:18:31.839
<v Speaker 3>My ankle twisted, and as I'm telling them that, I'm thinking,

330
00:18:31.960 --> 00:18:34.680
<v Speaker 3>my ankle really doesn't hurt right now. I took my

331
00:18:34.799 --> 00:18:37.440
<v Speaker 3>shoe off, pulled my sock off, was looking at it.

332
00:18:38.000 --> 00:18:40.400
<v Speaker 3>I didn't really have any pain in my ankle at all.

333
00:18:40.759 --> 00:18:42.960
<v Speaker 3>This thing hurt so bad I couldn't put half my

334
00:18:43.039 --> 00:18:45.759
<v Speaker 3>weight on it. I had trouble pulling myself over the

335
00:18:45.839 --> 00:18:49.440
<v Speaker 3>edge of the boat because of how much it was hurting.

336
00:18:50.039 --> 00:18:52.319
<v Speaker 3>I told him what happened. I told him how I'd

337
00:18:52.359 --> 00:18:55.240
<v Speaker 3>injured my ankle. Paul said, I knew your ankle was

338
00:18:55.319 --> 00:18:58.359
<v Speaker 3>hurt because you couldn't walk. He said, I kept thinking

339
00:18:58.359 --> 00:19:00.359
<v Speaker 3>you were going to fall over. I was whold the

340
00:19:00.359 --> 00:19:03.519
<v Speaker 3>front of the boat, yelling. Yet you grew up, and

341
00:19:03.559 --> 00:19:05.960
<v Speaker 3>he said, I couldn't figure out why you weren't moving back,

342
00:19:05.960 --> 00:19:07.720
<v Speaker 3>and I could tell you were limping and you were

343
00:19:08.240 --> 00:19:11.480
<v Speaker 3>walking backwards and sideways. I said, I twisted my ankle

344
00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:14.160
<v Speaker 3>when I fell down. As we're in the boat, we're

345
00:19:14.200 --> 00:19:17.160
<v Speaker 3>talking about what had happened, what we just saw. We

346
00:19:17.200 --> 00:19:20.799
<v Speaker 3>all came to the conclusion that we had seen a

347
00:19:20.839 --> 00:19:24.319
<v Speaker 3>bigfoot just after I had went through the whole verbal

348
00:19:24.440 --> 00:19:28.559
<v Speaker 3>checklist with them again, I know that wasn't a bear.

349
00:19:28.720 --> 00:19:32.160
<v Speaker 3>I know what wasn't standing in front of me. When

350
00:19:32.160 --> 00:19:35.000
<v Speaker 3>it walked on the beach. It was confirmation that I

351
00:19:35.039 --> 00:19:38.759
<v Speaker 3>didn't imagine this thing. I saw it from ten fifteen

352
00:19:38.799 --> 00:19:42.640
<v Speaker 3>feet away. So at this point, Jamie is tears in

353
00:19:42.680 --> 00:19:47.359
<v Speaker 3>his eyes, out loud. He's whimpering and crying. He's scared,

354
00:19:47.640 --> 00:19:51.079
<v Speaker 3>really scared, even though we're not in any danger in

355
00:19:51.119 --> 00:19:55.079
<v Speaker 3>the boat. He just could not get over what we'd

356
00:19:55.200 --> 00:19:58.599
<v Speaker 3>just seen, what had happened. My friend Paul all through

357
00:19:58.680 --> 00:20:00.960
<v Speaker 3>high school, he was happy to lucky. He had a

358
00:20:01.039 --> 00:20:04.279
<v Speaker 3>joke for everything. He's always laughing at them for him

359
00:20:04.319 --> 00:20:07.079
<v Speaker 3>to just be quiet. He just doesn't know what to say.

360
00:20:07.359 --> 00:20:09.359
<v Speaker 3>The whole time is just I can't believe this. I

361
00:20:09.400 --> 00:20:11.519
<v Speaker 3>can't believe this is happening. I can't believe we just

362
00:20:11.559 --> 00:20:14.440
<v Speaker 3>saw that. So we started talking about let's go back.

363
00:20:14.599 --> 00:20:18.440
<v Speaker 3>We were quite a ways away from this guide camp. Understand,

364
00:20:18.519 --> 00:20:21.400
<v Speaker 3>this is so remote. We haven't seen another boat all day.

365
00:20:21.799 --> 00:20:25.000
<v Speaker 3>Even in the three days, we hadn't seen another boat

366
00:20:25.039 --> 00:20:27.519
<v Speaker 3>other than the guys we met from his family that

367
00:20:27.559 --> 00:20:29.880
<v Speaker 3>went with us. So I said, let's go back to

368
00:20:29.960 --> 00:20:32.039
<v Speaker 3>the guide camp. Paul said, we got to figure out

369
00:20:32.079 --> 00:20:36.000
<v Speaker 3>what we're doing to tell everybody. I said, we're just

370
00:20:36.039 --> 00:20:38.359
<v Speaker 3>going to go tell your dad. He said, no, they're

371
00:20:38.359 --> 00:20:40.119
<v Speaker 3>not going to believe us, Jeff. They're just going to

372
00:20:40.319 --> 00:20:43.160
<v Speaker 3>back like we're all in fine. I said, is the

373
00:20:43.160 --> 00:20:46.359
<v Speaker 3>son of a hunting guide? Myself? I felt if my

374
00:20:46.480 --> 00:20:49.519
<v Speaker 3>dad was here, maybe I could tell him about what happened.

375
00:20:49.920 --> 00:20:51.759
<v Speaker 3>But the more we fat in the boat, the more

376
00:20:51.799 --> 00:20:55.119
<v Speaker 3>it decurred to me that I don't know, it seems

377
00:20:55.160 --> 00:20:59.000
<v Speaker 3>like a good idea up front, but how long would

378
00:20:59.000 --> 00:21:00.960
<v Speaker 3>I have to live for him to look at me

379
00:21:01.400 --> 00:21:05.640
<v Speaker 3>and just wonder if I'm crazy? You know? And I

380
00:21:05.759 --> 00:21:09.119
<v Speaker 3>just couldn't figure out how he would look at me

381
00:21:09.200 --> 00:21:12.880
<v Speaker 3>and give me the same credibility even as his son.

382
00:21:13.359 --> 00:21:15.839
<v Speaker 3>I started to get where Paul was coming from, where

383
00:21:15.839 --> 00:21:18.079
<v Speaker 3>he was feeling like everybody's I ma in front of him.

384
00:21:18.160 --> 00:21:19.880
<v Speaker 3>All of his older cousins are going to look at

385
00:21:19.920 --> 00:21:23.519
<v Speaker 3>us think we're idiots. So when we eventually got back

386
00:21:23.559 --> 00:21:27.160
<v Speaker 3>to the dock, actually we stopped and we fished for

387
00:21:27.240 --> 00:21:30.960
<v Speaker 3>another hour or two. We were just trying to put

388
00:21:30.960 --> 00:21:34.559
<v Speaker 3>off having to go back and be around somebody that

389
00:21:34.599 --> 00:21:37.319
<v Speaker 3>we felt like we'd have to tell it to. As

390
00:21:37.359 --> 00:21:39.240
<v Speaker 3>we were fishing for a couple hours, we came to

391
00:21:39.319 --> 00:21:41.799
<v Speaker 3>an agreement, the three of us that we were just

392
00:21:41.880 --> 00:21:46.440
<v Speaker 3>gonna not tell me. But when we went back, understanding

393
00:21:46.480 --> 00:21:49.880
<v Speaker 3>we're the youngest of the party. Every day midday when

394
00:21:49.920 --> 00:21:52.359
<v Speaker 3>we'd go back, we're the ones that are jumping out

395
00:21:52.359 --> 00:21:55.240
<v Speaker 3>of the boat telling the war stories about we caught this,

396
00:21:55.440 --> 00:21:57.599
<v Speaker 3>we caught that we did. We get out of the

397
00:21:57.640 --> 00:21:59.960
<v Speaker 3>boat and we're standing on the dock and we're just quiet,

398
00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:03.000
<v Speaker 3>and everybody else is talking about they did that morning.

399
00:22:03.559 --> 00:22:06.279
<v Speaker 3>I'm a pretty talkative guy. I didn't say a word

400
00:22:06.440 --> 00:22:10.200
<v Speaker 3>for the ten minutes we stood there around everybody. These

401
00:22:10.519 --> 00:22:13.920
<v Speaker 3>three guides were out there too. As everybody walked away

402
00:22:13.920 --> 00:22:16.519
<v Speaker 3>from the dock, one of the guides was staring at me.

403
00:22:16.640 --> 00:22:18.759
<v Speaker 3>I didn't really know him that well. I'd met him

404
00:22:18.799 --> 00:22:21.680
<v Speaker 3>and had little conversations with them while we were there

405
00:22:21.720 --> 00:22:24.599
<v Speaker 3>for the first few days. But he walked up to

406
00:22:24.680 --> 00:22:28.000
<v Speaker 3>me and said, are you okay. It just seemed like

407
00:22:28.039 --> 00:22:30.319
<v Speaker 3>a strange question because I didn't feel like I was

408
00:22:30.400 --> 00:22:33.720
<v Speaker 3>giving off any vibe that I was injured or heard

409
00:22:33.839 --> 00:22:36.319
<v Speaker 3>or anything, and I said, why do you ask me?

410
00:22:36.359 --> 00:22:38.680
<v Speaker 3>He says, you just seem like you're stressed out or

411
00:22:38.720 --> 00:22:42.039
<v Speaker 3>and shocked right now. So I told him something happened

412
00:22:42.039 --> 00:22:45.279
<v Speaker 3>to us this morning, and I'm still trying to process

413
00:22:45.319 --> 00:22:47.799
<v Speaker 3>this in my head. And he goes, did you see

414
00:22:47.799 --> 00:22:50.720
<v Speaker 3>something that you're having a hard time with or did

415
00:22:50.759 --> 00:22:53.880
<v Speaker 3>you witness something I did on a game trail on

416
00:22:53.960 --> 00:22:55.880
<v Speaker 3>a little aisle and we were way up on the

417
00:22:55.920 --> 00:22:59.160
<v Speaker 3>north end of the lake. I didn't tell him what happened.

418
00:22:59.200 --> 00:23:02.319
<v Speaker 3>I just said I had experience out there that I'm

419
00:23:02.319 --> 00:23:05.359
<v Speaker 3>having a hard time figuring out. He said, I would

420
00:23:05.400 --> 00:23:08.720
<v Speaker 3>like to show you something. He walks me over by

421
00:23:08.759 --> 00:23:12.000
<v Speaker 3>this boat house, like a shed that looked like it

422
00:23:12.079 --> 00:23:15.200
<v Speaker 3>was about one hundred years old. Behind this thing, there's

423
00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:18.640
<v Speaker 3>a sixteen foot aluminum boat lying upside down in the

424
00:23:18.680 --> 00:23:22.079
<v Speaker 3>dirt with a tarp over it. He pulls the tarp

425
00:23:22.160 --> 00:23:24.920
<v Speaker 3>off and the whole starboard side of this thing is

426
00:23:25.039 --> 00:23:27.640
<v Speaker 3>caved in. The whole side of the boat looks like

427
00:23:27.839 --> 00:23:31.440
<v Speaker 3>you hit it with a car. I said, what happened there?

428
00:23:31.480 --> 00:23:33.839
<v Speaker 3>And he says, I was guiding a moose hunter. My

429
00:23:34.359 --> 00:23:37.519
<v Speaker 3>client had shot a moose on the shore of a

430
00:23:37.559 --> 00:23:40.079
<v Speaker 3>little island on the north end of the lake. Now

431
00:23:40.119 --> 00:23:44.640
<v Speaker 3>there's about ten or twelve islands on this lake, Okay,

432
00:23:44.640 --> 00:23:46.559
<v Speaker 3>He say, I was on an island. It's not like

433
00:23:46.599 --> 00:23:48.799
<v Speaker 3>a lot of lakes where there's only one or two islands.

434
00:23:48.839 --> 00:23:52.839
<v Speaker 3>There's a lot of islands. He says. After he shot it,

435
00:23:52.960 --> 00:23:55.440
<v Speaker 3>we took pictures with it. It was lying where twenty

436
00:23:55.559 --> 00:23:57.720
<v Speaker 3>thirty feet in the water dead. It was right on

437
00:23:57.880 --> 00:23:59.720
<v Speaker 3>the edge of the tree line. He had brought the

438
00:23:59.720 --> 00:24:02.559
<v Speaker 3>client back to the camp, and he went back to

439
00:24:02.759 --> 00:24:06.559
<v Speaker 3>skin it and quarter it out himself. While he was there,

440
00:24:07.200 --> 00:24:11.519
<v Speaker 3>he said he had an experience and was attacked the

441
00:24:11.720 --> 00:24:14.160
<v Speaker 3>skin that's loose, and said, I had one of the

442
00:24:14.240 --> 00:24:16.720
<v Speaker 3>hind quarters of the bus in the boat, and I

443
00:24:16.839 --> 00:24:19.960
<v Speaker 3>was working on the other quarters of the boat, and

444
00:24:20.000 --> 00:24:23.279
<v Speaker 3>this thing ran up and caved in the side of

445
00:24:23.319 --> 00:24:28.039
<v Speaker 3>the boat. Just started kneeing it with its knees and

446
00:24:28.759 --> 00:24:32.079
<v Speaker 3>destroyed their boat. The crinkled Reynolds wrap on that side

447
00:24:32.680 --> 00:24:35.759
<v Speaker 3>and grabbed that hindquarter, threw it over its shoulder and

448
00:24:35.799 --> 00:24:39.119
<v Speaker 3>walked away. And I said, what did you do? He says.

449
00:24:39.200 --> 00:24:42.960
<v Speaker 3>I called my other two guides and told them that

450
00:24:43.039 --> 00:24:47.599
<v Speaker 3>I needed their help. They came out in two separate boats.

451
00:24:47.920 --> 00:24:49.960
<v Speaker 3>He said he was waiting for them. He said, I

452
00:24:50.000 --> 00:24:54.079
<v Speaker 3>intended to tell them what happened, but when they got there,

453
00:24:54.200 --> 00:24:59.640
<v Speaker 3>he told them that a cow moose had charged the

454
00:24:59.680 --> 00:25:03.680
<v Speaker 3>boat and just caved it in, which typically is what

455
00:25:03.720 --> 00:25:06.559
<v Speaker 3>a cow moose would do if you shot a non

456
00:25:06.680 --> 00:25:10.240
<v Speaker 3>legal bull. I would suppose because moose stayed with the

457
00:25:10.319 --> 00:25:13.759
<v Speaker 3>cow for three years before they leave, those cows are

458
00:25:13.880 --> 00:25:17.640
<v Speaker 3>very protected. But this was a mature moose's five six

459
00:25:17.720 --> 00:25:20.799
<v Speaker 3>year old moose that they shot. He said, I don't

460
00:25:20.920 --> 00:25:23.799
<v Speaker 3>know if they believe me. When they were packing the

461
00:25:23.880 --> 00:25:26.279
<v Speaker 3>meat into one of their boats, they realized I was

462
00:25:26.359 --> 00:25:31.279
<v Speaker 3>missing be hindquarter. Eventually they started asking me questions about

463
00:25:31.319 --> 00:25:33.960
<v Speaker 3>what really happened. I said, did you tell him? And

464
00:25:34.000 --> 00:25:35.839
<v Speaker 3>he says, I'm going to tell you what He says.

465
00:25:36.519 --> 00:25:38.680
<v Speaker 3>There isn't going to be much good that's ever going

466
00:25:38.759 --> 00:25:41.200
<v Speaker 3>to come from sharing what happened if something like this

467
00:25:41.400 --> 00:25:45.680
<v Speaker 3>happened to you, because even people who are close to you,

468
00:25:46.319 --> 00:25:48.799
<v Speaker 3>unless they have had an experience, they aren't going to

469
00:25:48.880 --> 00:25:51.799
<v Speaker 3>get it right. As much as they want to believe you,

470
00:25:51.920 --> 00:25:55.319
<v Speaker 3>he says, I don't think people can process this. So

471
00:25:55.599 --> 00:25:58.400
<v Speaker 3>my advice you would be tried to enjoy your next

472
00:25:58.400 --> 00:26:01.680
<v Speaker 3>four days. I looked down at my shirt and seen

473
00:26:01.759 --> 00:26:04.839
<v Speaker 3>I had blood on the bottom of my shirt by

474
00:26:04.880 --> 00:26:08.880
<v Speaker 3>my left hip. He said, are you injured? I said,

475
00:26:09.079 --> 00:26:12.119
<v Speaker 3>I had trained my ankle really bad, but it doesn't

476
00:26:12.200 --> 00:26:15.759
<v Speaker 3>hurt anymore. He said, we're bleeding. That's when I looked down.

477
00:26:15.920 --> 00:26:18.599
<v Speaker 3>I was wearing sweatpants. I pulled them down and could

478
00:26:18.720 --> 00:26:22.599
<v Speaker 3>see that my left hip was great mouth the size

479
00:26:22.599 --> 00:26:25.680
<v Speaker 3>of your handprint. It was just straight down my hip

480
00:26:25.720 --> 00:26:28.119
<v Speaker 3>where this log had hit me. When I lifted up

481
00:26:28.160 --> 00:26:30.640
<v Speaker 3>my shirt, it looked like Mike Tyson punched me in

482
00:26:30.640 --> 00:26:33.759
<v Speaker 3>the stomach twice. The left and right sides of my

483
00:26:34.279 --> 00:26:38.640
<v Speaker 3>abdominal were already turn black and blue. He says, do

484
00:26:38.799 --> 00:26:41.240
<v Speaker 3>you think something is broken? I said no. He checked

485
00:26:41.240 --> 00:26:43.400
<v Speaker 3>me out well bit and said, I think you're going

486
00:26:43.440 --> 00:26:46.519
<v Speaker 3>to be okay. I told him what was standing in

487
00:26:46.519 --> 00:26:48.480
<v Speaker 3>front of me, threw a log at me and hit me.

488
00:26:49.319 --> 00:26:52.559
<v Speaker 3>He didn't have a doubt in his mind. I was

489
00:26:53.519 --> 00:26:57.680
<v Speaker 3>reluctant to tell him that detail. He said, what island

490
00:26:57.759 --> 00:27:01.359
<v Speaker 3>did this happen on? On the map we had, there

491
00:27:01.440 --> 00:27:04.359
<v Speaker 3>was a larger island to the east. On the map,

492
00:27:04.480 --> 00:27:09.200
<v Speaker 3>it said the name of that island? It said Patten Island.

493
00:27:09.880 --> 00:27:12.079
<v Speaker 3>The little one on this map that we had in

494
00:27:12.079 --> 00:27:15.480
<v Speaker 3>our boat doesn't have a name, So I just told

495
00:27:15.559 --> 00:27:18.640
<v Speaker 3>him it was on Patten Island, thinking at least he'd

496
00:27:18.880 --> 00:27:21.559
<v Speaker 3>understand where we were on the lake. He looked at

497
00:27:21.559 --> 00:27:23.680
<v Speaker 3>me and said, yeah, my expansion is near there, but

498
00:27:23.759 --> 00:27:26.400
<v Speaker 3>it was on the island west of Patten Island. That's

499
00:27:26.640 --> 00:27:28.920
<v Speaker 3>my heart just saw that one, he said, I this

500
00:27:29.039 --> 00:27:32.119
<v Speaker 3>could be the exact same thing that did this to

501
00:27:32.200 --> 00:27:35.119
<v Speaker 3>the boat that's in front of me. I never told

502
00:27:35.200 --> 00:27:37.480
<v Speaker 3>Paul that I had talked to the guide or about

503
00:27:37.519 --> 00:27:40.640
<v Speaker 3>the conversation I had with the guide. We just tried

504
00:27:40.680 --> 00:27:43.799
<v Speaker 3>to finish out our next few days of fishing. Eventually

505
00:27:43.839 --> 00:27:47.319
<v Speaker 3>went home and I went into the Army. I worked

506
00:27:47.359 --> 00:27:50.559
<v Speaker 3>hard at not trying to come up with more answers,

507
00:27:51.200 --> 00:27:54.359
<v Speaker 3>just to go dumb to the whole encounter. Paul's family

508
00:27:55.000 --> 00:27:59.000
<v Speaker 3>owns a business that I go into about once a year.

509
00:27:59.079 --> 00:28:01.920
<v Speaker 3>I'll pop in there and see Paul. Even to this day,

510
00:28:02.000 --> 00:28:04.519
<v Speaker 3>I'm fifty three years old. The last few years I've

511
00:28:04.559 --> 00:28:06.920
<v Speaker 3>seen it, I remember about three years ago I said,

512
00:28:06.920 --> 00:28:09.960
<v Speaker 3>no one, do you remember that fishing trip that we

513
00:28:09.960 --> 00:28:12.319
<v Speaker 3>were on in Canada? And he says, yeah, and I says,

514
00:28:12.920 --> 00:28:15.599
<v Speaker 3>you ever think about that much? And he says, I

515
00:28:15.759 --> 00:28:19.039
<v Speaker 3>do my best to never think about that. That's when

516
00:28:19.079 --> 00:28:22.519
<v Speaker 3>I realized he probably never did tell his dad or

517
00:28:22.559 --> 00:28:24.920
<v Speaker 3>anybody else about it. When I asked him about it.

518
00:28:25.000 --> 00:28:28.039
<v Speaker 3>His mom was working there, one of his uncles works

519
00:28:28.079 --> 00:28:30.640
<v Speaker 3>for the business. He was on the other side of

520
00:28:30.680 --> 00:28:33.799
<v Speaker 3>the business. You can just tell Paul just did not

521
00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:36.200
<v Speaker 3>want to talk about it. Yeah, I think that happens

522
00:28:36.200 --> 00:28:38.880
<v Speaker 3>to a lot of people. I think they have those encounters.

523
00:28:38.920 --> 00:28:40.039
<v Speaker 3>You go one of two ways.

524
00:28:40.079 --> 00:28:44.839
<v Speaker 1>It either spurs you on to find answers you eventually

525
00:28:44.880 --> 00:28:45.799
<v Speaker 1>share your story.

526
00:28:45.960 --> 00:28:46.720
<v Speaker 3>Or there are.

527
00:28:46.559 --> 00:28:50.160
<v Speaker 1>Probably hundreds, if not thousands of these sidings and encounters

528
00:28:50.160 --> 00:28:54.039
<v Speaker 1>that happened around the country that we never hear about,

529
00:28:54.279 --> 00:28:56.799
<v Speaker 1>that people take to their grave because they don't want

530
00:28:56.799 --> 00:28:59.519
<v Speaker 1>the ridicule factor. I think that it's a very unfortunate

531
00:28:59.559 --> 00:29:02.079
<v Speaker 1>part of what happens during these encounters.

532
00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:06.200
<v Speaker 3>Well, it changes you because it changes the way that

533
00:29:06.279 --> 00:29:09.240
<v Speaker 3>you view the environment you're in. Whether I've got my

534
00:29:09.400 --> 00:29:13.880
<v Speaker 3>family and we're camping at a campground that's not really

535
00:29:13.920 --> 00:29:17.480
<v Speaker 3>that remote, when I'm walking down the high trail or

536
00:29:17.519 --> 00:29:23.359
<v Speaker 3>in a boat looking at a storeline view, you're surrounding differently. Now,

537
00:29:23.799 --> 00:29:26.759
<v Speaker 3>even when I'm deep in the bad country, if I'm

538
00:29:27.200 --> 00:29:30.640
<v Speaker 3>el cutting in Wyoming or something like where you're way

539
00:29:30.839 --> 00:29:34.559
<v Speaker 3>off the grid, you walk around with the sense that

540
00:29:34.880 --> 00:29:39.119
<v Speaker 3>this environment that I'm in it's different. This isn't something

541
00:29:39.160 --> 00:29:43.039
<v Speaker 3>I imagine. This isn't something that I've just read about.

542
00:29:43.599 --> 00:29:46.079
<v Speaker 3>In the last few years. I've found some groups on

543
00:29:46.160 --> 00:29:50.240
<v Speaker 3>Facebook that I've read different encounters. What there's almost the

544
00:29:50.279 --> 00:29:55.240
<v Speaker 3>whole BFR library reading about encounters. These people that have

545
00:29:56.240 --> 00:29:59.640
<v Speaker 3>these encounters, they know what they saw. A lot of

546
00:29:59.680 --> 00:30:02.240
<v Speaker 3>them a little sketchy because they see it come a

547
00:30:02.319 --> 00:30:05.799
<v Speaker 3>distance or whatever. But these people that have found themselves,

548
00:30:05.880 --> 00:30:09.599
<v Speaker 3>like I were year, fifteen feet away from something that

549
00:30:09.640 --> 00:30:14.079
<v Speaker 3>you've never seen before. You can't go out into the

550
00:30:14.359 --> 00:30:18.519
<v Speaker 3>woods or anywhere without seeing the environment around you so

551
00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:19.519
<v Speaker 3>much differently.

552
00:30:19.640 --> 00:30:22.200
<v Speaker 1>Now, Yeah, don't want to go back to your siding.

553
00:30:22.279 --> 00:30:24.400
<v Speaker 1>Can you describe what the face looked like? Was it

554
00:30:24.480 --> 00:30:26.920
<v Speaker 1>more human? Was it more ape like? Can you give

555
00:30:26.960 --> 00:30:28.160
<v Speaker 1>us some description about that.

556
00:30:28.720 --> 00:30:31.359
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, going back to when I was looking down at

557
00:30:31.400 --> 00:30:33.720
<v Speaker 3>the beach, when I turned around and realize this to

558
00:30:33.839 --> 00:30:36.480
<v Speaker 3>stand on the trail in front of me. One of

559
00:30:36.519 --> 00:30:39.039
<v Speaker 3>the things when I look back at this. That was

560
00:30:39.279 --> 00:30:44.279
<v Speaker 3>really surprising to me was just how stealthy it had

561
00:30:44.359 --> 00:30:48.359
<v Speaker 3>to have been. I was searching that area, whether it

562
00:30:48.440 --> 00:30:51.759
<v Speaker 3>was behind a pile of trees or a bunch of

563
00:30:51.799 --> 00:30:54.559
<v Speaker 3>cedar scrubs, that weren't far off for it to place

564
00:30:54.640 --> 00:30:56.720
<v Speaker 3>itself on the trail right in front of me. You

565
00:30:56.759 --> 00:31:02.400
<v Speaker 3>didn't hear a thing. It was just deafening how quiet

566
00:31:02.440 --> 00:31:05.720
<v Speaker 3>it was. When I looked up the phenei's face, Even

567
00:31:05.759 --> 00:31:08.440
<v Speaker 3>though it was just for a moment, it was like

568
00:31:08.519 --> 00:31:13.079
<v Speaker 3>a snapshot that was ingrained there. I can still see it.

569
00:31:13.079 --> 00:31:17.200
<v Speaker 3>Its skin around its eyes and nose was very dark.

570
00:31:18.200 --> 00:31:21.759
<v Speaker 3>The hair that was on it was a dark chocolatey colored,

571
00:31:22.119 --> 00:31:26.559
<v Speaker 3>almost an auburn hue to it. Its nose wasn't really

572
00:31:26.680 --> 00:31:30.319
<v Speaker 3>flattened out like you would think an ape would be

573
00:31:30.519 --> 00:31:34.640
<v Speaker 3>with gigantic nostrils. It was upward turned on the bottom.

574
00:31:35.279 --> 00:31:40.240
<v Speaker 3>It wasn't like tea spoon sized nostrils flaring out. It

575
00:31:40.279 --> 00:31:44.000
<v Speaker 3>looked like it had human elements to its nose and

576
00:31:44.119 --> 00:31:49.319
<v Speaker 3>even its eyes. Was interesting because its mouth, the top

577
00:31:49.359 --> 00:31:51.839
<v Speaker 3>lip was very tight to its teeth. If you were

578
00:31:51.839 --> 00:31:55.240
<v Speaker 3>the grand really big right now, how tight your lip

579
00:31:55.279 --> 00:31:59.680
<v Speaker 3>as to your teeth? Top whep looked straight as an arrow,

580
00:32:00.680 --> 00:32:04.640
<v Speaker 3>but its bottom lip was curved open, sagging down like

581
00:32:04.680 --> 00:32:07.880
<v Speaker 3>if yaw was half open, and its bottom lip was

582
00:32:08.039 --> 00:32:11.720
<v Speaker 3>hanging board almost like. I told a research buddy of

583
00:32:11.720 --> 00:32:14.680
<v Speaker 3>mine that it looked like when a bear is trying

584
00:32:14.720 --> 00:32:17.279
<v Speaker 3>to wind you. They throw their lip open a little bit,

585
00:32:17.440 --> 00:32:19.759
<v Speaker 3>like they're trying to scoop air up to their nose.

586
00:32:20.440 --> 00:32:24.960
<v Speaker 3>Its mouth hung open as it looked at me. It

587
00:32:25.000 --> 00:32:28.480
<v Speaker 3>didn't have an aggressive look. It didn't look like something

588
00:32:28.519 --> 00:32:32.680
<v Speaker 3>that would be attacking you. But it definitely didn't appreciate

589
00:32:32.799 --> 00:32:36.000
<v Speaker 3>that I had made that eye contact with it, because

590
00:32:36.039 --> 00:32:39.599
<v Speaker 3>I didn't stand there for a moment as I looked

591
00:32:39.680 --> 00:32:42.519
<v Speaker 3>up its body. As soon as my eyes laying outside

592
00:32:42.559 --> 00:32:45.559
<v Speaker 3>the bloom, it went off. I don't know why. It

593
00:32:45.599 --> 00:32:49.640
<v Speaker 3>didn't make vocalizations, and you hear people say, oh, it

594
00:32:49.839 --> 00:32:53.319
<v Speaker 3>yelled at me, or it whooped at me, or whatever.

595
00:32:54.000 --> 00:32:56.680
<v Speaker 3>The only audible thing I heard from it was as

596
00:32:56.720 --> 00:32:59.920
<v Speaker 3>it throw this log, it was like, oh, like that,

597
00:33:00.440 --> 00:33:04.200
<v Speaker 3>like it was exhaling hard as it just cost this

598
00:33:04.400 --> 00:33:08.240
<v Speaker 3>log downward at my waist. As far as the characteristics,

599
00:33:08.279 --> 00:33:10.720
<v Speaker 3>I can remember, and I often remember when it was

600
00:33:10.759 --> 00:33:14.079
<v Speaker 3>on the beach as it held its arm out to

601
00:33:14.200 --> 00:33:16.599
<v Speaker 3>its side. When it went down to pick this fish up.

602
00:33:17.359 --> 00:33:19.960
<v Speaker 3>You can see the hair hang down off its arm.

603
00:33:20.039 --> 00:33:23.000
<v Speaker 3>It looks like when you see leather coats that have

604
00:33:23.279 --> 00:33:26.599
<v Speaker 3>fringe that hang off of them from the seventies and eighties.

605
00:33:27.279 --> 00:33:30.920
<v Speaker 3>Its hair just hung down. It had been eight inches

606
00:33:31.039 --> 00:33:33.799
<v Speaker 3>or longer, just as it draped off of its arm.

607
00:33:34.519 --> 00:33:37.880
<v Speaker 3>But there was one area where it looked madded There

608
00:33:37.880 --> 00:33:41.000
<v Speaker 3>were areas on its legs that looked madded down. Their

609
00:33:41.119 --> 00:33:43.640
<v Speaker 3>hair didn't look it was a flowing look to it.

610
00:33:43.759 --> 00:33:45.440
<v Speaker 3>The only thing I can think is it was so

611
00:33:45.599 --> 00:33:47.839
<v Speaker 3>wet and it had been raining. Maybe parts of its

612
00:33:47.920 --> 00:33:50.599
<v Speaker 3>fur was wet matted down because of that.

613
00:33:51.119 --> 00:33:53.559
<v Speaker 1>Could you give any estimation on the weight of this thing?

614
00:33:53.599 --> 00:33:55.880
<v Speaker 1>Because that's one of the things that when I talked

615
00:33:55.920 --> 00:34:00.000
<v Speaker 1>to people that have had pretty decent close up encounters,

616
00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:01.359
<v Speaker 1>that's one of the things that they say is you

617
00:34:01.720 --> 00:34:05.640
<v Speaker 1>just can't fathom something nine feet tall or eight and

618
00:34:05.680 --> 00:34:08.239
<v Speaker 1>a half nine feet tall. It is huge, but you

619
00:34:08.360 --> 00:34:11.039
<v Speaker 1>just can't describe the girth. Do you have any idea

620
00:34:11.079 --> 00:34:12.519
<v Speaker 1>on how much this thing might have weighed.

621
00:34:13.039 --> 00:34:15.800
<v Speaker 3>What really bothers me is that I didn't look at

622
00:34:15.880 --> 00:34:18.639
<v Speaker 3>its feet when I turned around and was looking at

623
00:34:18.719 --> 00:34:21.639
<v Speaker 3>eye level. I seen it right at the knees. Of course,

624
00:34:21.880 --> 00:34:24.320
<v Speaker 3>my reaction or that would be to want to look

625
00:34:24.400 --> 00:34:26.320
<v Speaker 3>up and see what it is, not look down and

626
00:34:26.360 --> 00:34:29.199
<v Speaker 3>see what the treat looked like. As I seen that

627
00:34:29.320 --> 00:34:31.880
<v Speaker 3>knee level. When I looked up, what I can remember

628
00:34:32.519 --> 00:34:37.079
<v Speaker 3>vividly is that its fies were like the diameter of

629
00:34:37.119 --> 00:34:41.800
<v Speaker 3>a five gallon bucket. Its thighs were so frea conveyed.

630
00:34:41.880 --> 00:34:45.000
<v Speaker 3>That's the first thing that when I started checking off

631
00:34:45.199 --> 00:34:48.639
<v Speaker 3>was it? This? Was it that? As I'm like sliding

632
00:34:48.679 --> 00:34:50.719
<v Speaker 3>down the trail and on the beach, I just knew

633
00:34:50.719 --> 00:34:55.239
<v Speaker 3>immediately that because the girth of it, by this thing

634
00:34:55.440 --> 00:34:59.559
<v Speaker 3>was gigantic, its fr was bigger than my waist. As

635
00:34:59.599 --> 00:35:02.480
<v Speaker 3>I looked upward, the width it is that it's hit

636
00:35:03.119 --> 00:35:05.199
<v Speaker 3>all the way through as the midsection all the way

637
00:35:05.239 --> 00:35:09.199
<v Speaker 3>to its shoulders. There is no hour glass to it,

638
00:35:09.400 --> 00:35:14.719
<v Speaker 3>just like extremely wide. As I'm looking up its body

639
00:35:14.920 --> 00:35:19.000
<v Speaker 3>mastimation for weight. I'm not a big brown bear hunter.

640
00:35:19.280 --> 00:35:22.199
<v Speaker 3>I haven't shot an eight or nine foot to Drizzly

641
00:35:22.280 --> 00:35:24.280
<v Speaker 3>or Ben in front of one and said, oh, I

642
00:35:24.360 --> 00:35:28.440
<v Speaker 3>know that weighs nine hundred pounds or eleven hundred pounds

643
00:35:28.440 --> 00:35:30.599
<v Speaker 3>I don't really have a lot to draw off of that,

644
00:35:31.360 --> 00:35:34.119
<v Speaker 3>but I can tell you that because of its side

645
00:35:34.199 --> 00:35:35.920
<v Speaker 3>that you told me that the thing was over a

646
00:35:36.000 --> 00:35:39.679
<v Speaker 3>thousand pounds. If that was over another i'd bet older. Yeah.

647
00:35:39.679 --> 00:35:42.320
<v Speaker 1>That's one of the things that it has always fascinated me,

648
00:35:42.440 --> 00:35:44.039
<v Speaker 1>is the weight and.

649
00:35:43.920 --> 00:35:46.239
<v Speaker 3>The mass of these things.

650
00:35:46.440 --> 00:35:48.840
<v Speaker 1>I talked to Ken Walker from the Big Four documentary

651
00:35:48.920 --> 00:35:51.960
<v Speaker 1>last night, and Ken was talking about doing his estimation

652
00:35:52.239 --> 00:35:55.800
<v Speaker 1>of weight and height from the Patterson Gimlin film. He

653
00:35:55.880 --> 00:36:00.320
<v Speaker 1>was talking about how large Patty was in the and

654
00:36:00.400 --> 00:36:03.320
<v Speaker 1>she's twenty eight inches wide at the waist. He literally

655
00:36:03.360 --> 00:36:05.400
<v Speaker 1>was on the phone with me last night measuring himself.

656
00:36:05.440 --> 00:36:09.559
<v Speaker 1>He's fifteen inches wide, so she's huge. Yeah, he estimated

657
00:36:09.599 --> 00:36:12.239
<v Speaker 1>the weight at more like twelve to fourteen hundred pounds

658
00:36:12.559 --> 00:36:14.840
<v Speaker 1>because of that and the muscle mass. I always like

659
00:36:14.920 --> 00:36:18.719
<v Speaker 1>to ask that question. Your encounter is fascinating because as

660
00:36:18.719 --> 00:36:22.000
<v Speaker 1>many encounter stories as I've taken, I've never talked to

661
00:36:22.039 --> 00:36:28.119
<v Speaker 1>anybody who's had such an aggressive encounter where you were

662
00:36:28.159 --> 00:36:31.360
<v Speaker 1>actually injured. This thing literally threw something at you and

663
00:36:31.480 --> 00:36:35.079
<v Speaker 1>hit you from ten to fifteen feet away. In retrospect,

664
00:36:35.119 --> 00:36:37.920
<v Speaker 1>I know it's obviously speculation do you think it was

665
00:36:37.960 --> 00:36:40.400
<v Speaker 1>the eye contact that you made that pissed this thing

666
00:36:40.480 --> 00:36:43.400
<v Speaker 1>off to the point where it threw this log or

667
00:36:43.400 --> 00:36:45.559
<v Speaker 1>do you think it was more of a reactionary thing.

668
00:36:45.760 --> 00:36:47.800
<v Speaker 1>What is your thoughts on the aggressive behavior.

669
00:36:47.920 --> 00:36:50.400
<v Speaker 3>Yeah, I had about thirty four years to try to

670
00:36:50.480 --> 00:36:53.840
<v Speaker 3>analyze that. I have quite often trying to figure out

671
00:36:54.400 --> 00:36:57.480
<v Speaker 3>what did I do to end up in that position.

672
00:36:58.760 --> 00:37:01.880
<v Speaker 3>Part of what I come up with, there's some research

673
00:37:01.920 --> 00:37:04.599
<v Speaker 3>I've been doing out in the field myself now the

674
00:37:04.639 --> 00:37:09.679
<v Speaker 3>last few years, is that the interesting element to it

675
00:37:09.880 --> 00:37:13.440
<v Speaker 3>that I think really contributed to its reaction to me

676
00:37:14.599 --> 00:37:17.039
<v Speaker 3>was that it was on an island. I think that

677
00:37:17.119 --> 00:37:20.519
<v Speaker 3>really plays a factor here, because I think there's a

678
00:37:20.559 --> 00:37:22.840
<v Speaker 3>good chance that had that's been the shore of the

679
00:37:22.880 --> 00:37:27.159
<v Speaker 3>main land, this thing simply would have retreated back into

680
00:37:27.320 --> 00:37:31.599
<v Speaker 3>the wilderness and never had a compensation. But for whatever reason,

681
00:37:31.639 --> 00:37:34.559
<v Speaker 3>whether it uses this island as a hunting ground or

682
00:37:34.599 --> 00:37:37.920
<v Speaker 3>whether it ties to habitate there all the time, it

683
00:37:38.320 --> 00:37:40.199
<v Speaker 3>not like it had a lot of places it could

684
00:37:40.280 --> 00:37:43.280
<v Speaker 3>run to. It's a fairly small island, like I say,

685
00:37:43.360 --> 00:37:46.760
<v Speaker 3>thirty acres. If you wind up, poor guys at fifty

686
00:37:46.840 --> 00:37:50.360
<v Speaker 3>sixty feet apart and just did a deer drive from

687
00:37:50.360 --> 00:37:52.800
<v Speaker 3>one end of it to the other. What would it do.

688
00:37:52.880 --> 00:37:55.960
<v Speaker 3>It couldn't go anywhere. It's going to end up on

689
00:37:56.000 --> 00:37:59.199
<v Speaker 3>the far and shoreline to whether it's able to swim

690
00:37:59.280 --> 00:38:02.800
<v Speaker 3>or whatnot. It's going to be vulnerable because of how

691
00:38:02.840 --> 00:38:07.360
<v Speaker 3>small this island was, So that fight or flight type

692
00:38:08.199 --> 00:38:11.719
<v Speaker 3>choice that it has to make. I think more often

693
00:38:11.760 --> 00:38:15.639
<v Speaker 3>than not, Bigfoot will make the flight choice rather than

694
00:38:15.679 --> 00:38:18.480
<v Speaker 3>the fight choice. If that's a viable option, I believe

695
00:38:18.480 --> 00:38:21.840
<v Speaker 3>they'll always choose that, not even let you know it

696
00:38:21.880 --> 00:38:25.400
<v Speaker 3>was there until you leave. If you don't leave, then

697
00:38:25.400 --> 00:38:28.480
<v Speaker 3>maybe it will audibly try to scare you away. I

698
00:38:28.519 --> 00:38:31.039
<v Speaker 3>think when it had a choice, that it could audibly

699
00:38:31.280 --> 00:38:34.159
<v Speaker 3>either try to taste me away that way, or it

700
00:38:34.239 --> 00:38:37.519
<v Speaker 3>could simply just make it self seen. Right, So it

701
00:38:37.639 --> 00:38:39.360
<v Speaker 3>stepped out on the trail, and it's hold in this

702
00:38:39.519 --> 00:38:42.239
<v Speaker 3>log probably felt like I'd run away at that point.

703
00:38:42.400 --> 00:38:45.119
<v Speaker 3>I didn't. I just stood there and shocked. I think

704
00:38:45.159 --> 00:38:48.119
<v Speaker 3>when I made eye contact with it, it just instinctively

705
00:38:48.320 --> 00:38:50.079
<v Speaker 3>threw the log at me. I think that's why it

706
00:38:50.199 --> 00:38:52.400
<v Speaker 3>was holding the log. I'm going to throw this if

707
00:38:52.440 --> 00:38:55.559
<v Speaker 3>I have to, because the truth is, when I walked

708
00:38:55.599 --> 00:38:58.800
<v Speaker 3>up that trail, at any time. It could have just

709
00:38:58.920 --> 00:39:01.039
<v Speaker 3>swung that log out track me right in the side

710
00:39:01.039 --> 00:39:02.679
<v Speaker 3>of her head and I wouldn't have seen it coming.

711
00:39:03.239 --> 00:39:05.639
<v Speaker 3>It didn't do that. It stood in front of me,

712
00:39:05.760 --> 00:39:08.960
<v Speaker 3>like giving me a chance to retreat before it actually

713
00:39:09.000 --> 00:39:12.199
<v Speaker 3>threw this log. So I think some of that is

714
00:39:13.039 --> 00:39:15.800
<v Speaker 3>I don't think I did anything to trigger it or

715
00:39:15.880 --> 00:39:18.159
<v Speaker 3>piss it off, so to speak, other than just that

716
00:39:18.440 --> 00:39:21.559
<v Speaker 3>I was there and I wasn't leaving. It felt like

717
00:39:21.719 --> 00:39:25.599
<v Speaker 3>it didn't have anywhere to retreat too, because the island's

718
00:39:25.639 --> 00:39:26.360
<v Speaker 3>fairly small.

719
00:39:26.880 --> 00:39:30.239
<v Speaker 1>I guess that makes sense. That's pure animalistic behavior. If

720
00:39:30.239 --> 00:39:32.559
<v Speaker 1>you corner an animal and it doesn't feel like it

721
00:39:32.599 --> 00:39:34.760
<v Speaker 1>has much of a choice other than to fight rather

722
00:39:34.800 --> 00:39:37.800
<v Speaker 1>than take flight, that's what it's going to do, clearly.

723
00:39:37.840 --> 00:39:40.360
<v Speaker 1>And I think these things are definitely animals, and I

724
00:39:40.360 --> 00:39:42.199
<v Speaker 1>think they're definitely apex predators.

725
00:39:42.280 --> 00:39:45.159
<v Speaker 3>When you look at all the encounters that are either

726
00:39:45.280 --> 00:39:48.679
<v Speaker 3>low and befro citling like that, You've got let's say

727
00:39:48.719 --> 00:39:52.599
<v Speaker 3>thirty five hundred encounters that are recorded over the years.

728
00:39:52.880 --> 00:39:55.519
<v Speaker 3>A percentage of them are Class A encounters, a large

729
00:39:55.559 --> 00:39:59.840
<v Speaker 3>percentage of them. But yet those are people that were

730
00:40:00.159 --> 00:40:02.840
<v Speaker 3>whatever they were standing in front of it chose to

731
00:40:02.920 --> 00:40:07.119
<v Speaker 3>make itself known that it's there, or it was a

732
00:40:07.159 --> 00:40:09.920
<v Speaker 3>situation like mine where it didn't have any choice what

733
00:40:10.039 --> 00:40:12.440
<v Speaker 3>to make itself known because of the size of where

734
00:40:12.480 --> 00:40:16.000
<v Speaker 3>it was, or maybe if it's standing behind a building

735
00:40:16.039 --> 00:40:18.360
<v Speaker 3>and can't get out from behind that building and you're

736
00:40:18.360 --> 00:40:21.280
<v Speaker 3>looking across somebody's yard and then you see it run away,

737
00:40:21.320 --> 00:40:23.840
<v Speaker 3>it didn't have any choice. If it stayed there, it

738
00:40:24.079 --> 00:40:26.639
<v Speaker 3>was vulnerable. A lot of these encounters are based on

739
00:40:26.679 --> 00:40:29.320
<v Speaker 3>the fact that it was caught in an area where

740
00:40:29.360 --> 00:40:31.559
<v Speaker 3>it's going to get seen, or it had no choice

741
00:40:31.639 --> 00:40:36.199
<v Speaker 3>but to be seen. But when you think about if

742
00:40:36.199 --> 00:40:40.000
<v Speaker 3>it's main goal is to be elusive and not be seen,

743
00:40:40.719 --> 00:40:43.000
<v Speaker 3>it's always going to choose to do that. It makes

744
00:40:43.000 --> 00:40:46.920
<v Speaker 3>you wonder. Out of thirty five hundred encounters, there's got

745
00:40:46.920 --> 00:40:52.760
<v Speaker 3>to be thirty five thousand encounters or more. Were probably

746
00:40:52.800 --> 00:40:55.559
<v Speaker 3>over three hundred and fifty thousand times where there's been

747
00:40:55.559 --> 00:40:59.800
<v Speaker 3>a bigfoot standing by somebody and it chose flight instead

748
00:40:59.840 --> 00:41:01.800
<v Speaker 3>of fight, and it just backed the way and these

749
00:41:01.800 --> 00:41:04.679
<v Speaker 3>people never knew it was there. People are hiking in

750
00:41:04.719 --> 00:41:09.920
<v Speaker 3>the woods all over Canada and the northwest, and now

751
00:41:10.039 --> 00:41:14.119
<v Speaker 3>for Midwest and the northeast, and everybody's always out in

752
00:41:14.159 --> 00:41:18.840
<v Speaker 3>the wilderness doing something every weekend. There's millions of people

753
00:41:18.880 --> 00:41:21.679
<v Speaker 3>out in the woods. Why wouldn't you have sightings every weekend?

754
00:41:21.760 --> 00:41:25.639
<v Speaker 3>Because nine hundred and ninety nine out of a thousand times,

755
00:41:25.840 --> 00:41:28.119
<v Speaker 3>Jesus is simply back away. And I'll let you know

756
00:41:28.199 --> 00:41:30.360
<v Speaker 3>it was even there. It near, you were there, You

757
00:41:30.400 --> 00:41:33.840
<v Speaker 3>had no fluid, it was there. It sees rare occasions

758
00:41:33.840 --> 00:41:37.199
<v Speaker 3>where you find yourself, where it finds itself, where it

759
00:41:37.239 --> 00:41:38.320
<v Speaker 3>doesn't have a choice.

760
00:41:38.719 --> 00:41:42.639
<v Speaker 1>I know after your sighting you've started to do some research.

761
00:41:42.679 --> 00:41:45.320
<v Speaker 1>Why don't you talk about what type of research you're

762
00:41:45.320 --> 00:41:47.320
<v Speaker 1>conducting now? What are some of the things that you're

763
00:41:47.360 --> 00:41:48.760
<v Speaker 1>doing and finding.

764
00:41:48.920 --> 00:41:52.599
<v Speaker 3>The business that I have. Once I hit fifty years old,

765
00:41:52.639 --> 00:41:55.320
<v Speaker 3>I've grown my business to a point where I could

766
00:41:55.320 --> 00:41:57.880
<v Speaker 3>start stepping back and taking a little bit of time away.

767
00:41:58.440 --> 00:42:01.159
<v Speaker 3>We had gotten a lake home up in northern Minnesota.

768
00:42:01.920 --> 00:42:05.239
<v Speaker 3>I've always vacationed up in that area with my family

769
00:42:05.280 --> 00:42:08.960
<v Speaker 3>ever since I was young. I loved that park Rapids,

770
00:42:09.159 --> 00:42:14.400
<v Speaker 3>the midge Walker Castlake type area of northern Minnesota. So

771
00:42:14.679 --> 00:42:18.840
<v Speaker 3>got away come up there and started really being out

772
00:42:18.920 --> 00:42:22.920
<v Speaker 3>in that atmosphere more out in the woods, seeing a

773
00:42:22.960 --> 00:42:27.119
<v Speaker 3>lot more bear and being around that even met a

774
00:42:27.159 --> 00:42:30.599
<v Speaker 3>few people who were into the research of this, and

775
00:42:30.639 --> 00:42:34.360
<v Speaker 3>that's when I started finding groups on Facebook trying to

776
00:42:35.400 --> 00:42:39.480
<v Speaker 3>I guess it was a renewed interest in trying to

777
00:42:39.599 --> 00:42:43.480
<v Speaker 3>learn more about what I had encountered that day. I

778
00:42:43.480 --> 00:42:45.559
<v Speaker 3>think at fifty years old, it was like, I don't

779
00:42:45.599 --> 00:42:48.079
<v Speaker 3>give a trap anymore. For a long time, I just

780
00:42:48.079 --> 00:42:51.639
<v Speaker 3>felt like, man, if people, business clients and stuff. If

781
00:42:51.639 --> 00:42:54.599
<v Speaker 3>I tried to tell even friends that I hun't with

782
00:42:54.760 --> 00:42:57.840
<v Speaker 3>or fish with, I can't tell anybody this story, right

783
00:42:57.880 --> 00:43:00.760
<v Speaker 3>because I can't share this encounter people. They got to

784
00:43:00.840 --> 00:43:03.360
<v Speaker 3>just they're never gonna look at me the same. But

785
00:43:03.559 --> 00:43:06.920
<v Speaker 3>aty I just started feeling like, you know what, there's

786
00:43:06.960 --> 00:43:11.159
<v Speaker 3>got to be hundreds of thousands of people that have

787
00:43:11.360 --> 00:43:15.119
<v Speaker 3>had some sort of an experience and they're all feeling

788
00:43:15.159 --> 00:43:17.719
<v Speaker 3>the same way. I feel like I can't tell anybody.

789
00:43:18.199 --> 00:43:20.920
<v Speaker 3>So that really drove me to want to do the research,

790
00:43:21.159 --> 00:43:24.280
<v Speaker 3>get into the research and try to figure out stuff.

791
00:43:24.320 --> 00:43:27.400
<v Speaker 3>So that I just think it's stupid that if somebody

792
00:43:27.440 --> 00:43:29.639
<v Speaker 3>had an encounter when they're eighteen years old, they got

793
00:43:29.679 --> 00:43:33.159
<v Speaker 3>to live their whole life carrying that burden around of

794
00:43:34.039 --> 00:43:36.679
<v Speaker 3>feeling like they need to tell somebody about what happened

795
00:43:36.719 --> 00:43:38.719
<v Speaker 3>to them, and yet they're fearful of doing it, so

796
00:43:38.800 --> 00:43:42.360
<v Speaker 3>they don't. It is a big burden. It's really hard

797
00:43:42.480 --> 00:43:45.639
<v Speaker 3>to do, and I think it's really a lot harder

798
00:43:45.679 --> 00:43:48.679
<v Speaker 3>for some people than it is for others. Maybe some

799
00:43:48.719 --> 00:43:50.719
<v Speaker 3>people are good at just I'm going to bury it

800
00:43:50.800 --> 00:43:53.000
<v Speaker 3>and never think about it again. I just had a

801
00:43:53.039 --> 00:43:55.639
<v Speaker 3>hard time doing that. My goal was, if I'm going

802
00:43:55.719 --> 00:43:57.599
<v Speaker 3>to get involved in research, I want to do some

803
00:43:57.760 --> 00:44:02.239
<v Speaker 3>type of research that advances the science to help blueprint

804
00:44:02.559 --> 00:44:05.760
<v Speaker 3>what this thing is so that people don't have to

805
00:44:05.840 --> 00:44:10.239
<v Speaker 3>feel so scared to tell somebody if they hadn't experienced.

806
00:44:10.599 --> 00:44:13.320
<v Speaker 3>So I met Doug Hichak. He's been on your show.

807
00:44:14.079 --> 00:44:16.840
<v Speaker 3>He's one of the first people I shared my encounter

808
00:44:17.000 --> 00:44:20.400
<v Speaker 3>with un sol what happened. He was just there's so

809
00:44:20.480 --> 00:44:23.840
<v Speaker 3>many different elements that make my encounter different than a

810
00:44:23.840 --> 00:44:27.039
<v Speaker 3>lot of them that year. About that he was fascinated

811
00:44:27.079 --> 00:44:29.800
<v Speaker 3>by and he started talking to me about it. There's

812
00:44:29.840 --> 00:44:32.760
<v Speaker 3>a lot of encounters that are happening here in northern Minnesota.

813
00:44:32.960 --> 00:44:35.440
<v Speaker 3>Him and his son do a lot of research. So

814
00:44:36.320 --> 00:44:40.119
<v Speaker 3>we started talking. First of all, I love the kayak

815
00:44:40.559 --> 00:44:42.760
<v Speaker 3>in the winter, i'd do a lot of snowmobiling. So

816
00:44:42.800 --> 00:44:46.039
<v Speaker 3>I was snowmobiling in some really remote areas in that

817
00:44:46.159 --> 00:44:48.880
<v Speaker 3>area of northern Minnesota that I have the lake home at.

818
00:44:49.119 --> 00:44:52.639
<v Speaker 3>It's a touristy deal where every little town ends up

819
00:44:52.840 --> 00:44:55.639
<v Speaker 3>having a festival every summer, and there's homes all over

820
00:44:55.679 --> 00:44:58.639
<v Speaker 3>these lakes that maybe aren't year round homes for people.

821
00:44:58.719 --> 00:45:02.639
<v Speaker 3>From May through September, it's like spring break in a

822
00:45:02.639 --> 00:45:05.840
<v Speaker 3>lot of areas. What I was looking for is remote

823
00:45:05.880 --> 00:45:09.679
<v Speaker 3>areas were even in July, there's not going to be

824
00:45:09.719 --> 00:45:12.599
<v Speaker 3>anybody here. So I started kayaking some of the more

825
00:45:12.639 --> 00:45:15.559
<v Speaker 3>remote rivers. A lot of lakes in that area are

826
00:45:15.679 --> 00:45:20.480
<v Speaker 3>cheened together by rivers. I started kayaking those are started snowmbiling.

827
00:45:20.519 --> 00:45:24.199
<v Speaker 3>On the last winter, I found what I thought was

828
00:45:24.280 --> 00:45:28.320
<v Speaker 3>an interesting meadow on a river that was so remote

829
00:45:28.800 --> 00:45:32.440
<v Speaker 3>it was surrounded by big pine poppers and birch trees.

830
00:45:33.079 --> 00:45:35.639
<v Speaker 3>I made a list of two or three different areas

831
00:45:35.719 --> 00:45:38.119
<v Speaker 3>like that that I wanted to go back and try

832
00:45:38.760 --> 00:45:42.320
<v Speaker 3>what I call some low tech research. I had this

833
00:45:42.480 --> 00:45:45.599
<v Speaker 3>idea that if you were going to try to research

834
00:45:45.719 --> 00:45:51.199
<v Speaker 3>this creature, that its biggest vulnerability is its own curiosity.

835
00:45:51.800 --> 00:45:54.719
<v Speaker 3>I really felt that way. There's things that sometimes it's

836
00:45:54.800 --> 00:45:57.320
<v Speaker 3>just so curious about it can't help but make itself

837
00:45:57.360 --> 00:45:59.800
<v Speaker 3>a little bit vulnerable. That's what I was in the

838
00:46:00.119 --> 00:46:03.280
<v Speaker 3>art with so this spring. It takes me two hours

839
00:46:03.320 --> 00:46:06.239
<v Speaker 3>to kayak back into some of these areas, but I

840
00:46:06.280 --> 00:46:08.719
<v Speaker 3>went out in the middle of them. I had a

841
00:46:08.760 --> 00:46:11.840
<v Speaker 3>big red rubber ball, the kind you buy for two

842
00:46:11.880 --> 00:46:14.559
<v Speaker 3>bucks at Walmart. I went out into this meadow and

843
00:46:14.599 --> 00:46:17.800
<v Speaker 3>I was throwing this ball up and down. I'd laugh

844
00:46:17.840 --> 00:46:20.320
<v Speaker 3>at the ball, I'd kick it and run over and

845
00:46:20.360 --> 00:46:22.960
<v Speaker 3>pick it up and laugh at it. And I did

846
00:46:22.960 --> 00:46:26.280
<v Speaker 3>this for about a half an hour. I set the

847
00:46:26.320 --> 00:46:29.320
<v Speaker 3>ball in the middle in the draft, and I walked

848
00:46:29.320 --> 00:46:31.639
<v Speaker 3>about three quarters of a mile out of there back

849
00:46:31.679 --> 00:46:34.719
<v Speaker 3>to the river where my kayak was, and I left.

850
00:46:35.000 --> 00:46:37.880
<v Speaker 3>I went back the next morning and the ball had

851
00:46:37.920 --> 00:46:41.039
<v Speaker 3>been moved. I knew that if a bear couldn't move it,

852
00:46:41.159 --> 00:46:43.280
<v Speaker 3>because it would pop it. And this is just a

853
00:46:43.400 --> 00:46:47.599
<v Speaker 3>light rubber ball. It was glossy smooth. There was some

854
00:46:47.800 --> 00:46:51.599
<v Speaker 3>smears on it. It had been moved about sixty seventy

855
00:46:51.679 --> 00:46:54.719
<v Speaker 3>yards across this meadow. This meadow was about the size

856
00:46:54.760 --> 00:46:57.440
<v Speaker 3>of a football field, so I thought this was interesting.

857
00:46:58.360 --> 00:47:00.599
<v Speaker 3>I had done that in a couple if it metals.

858
00:47:00.639 --> 00:47:03.199
<v Speaker 3>This is the first one on my list that it hit.

859
00:47:03.280 --> 00:47:05.719
<v Speaker 3>I'd actually got something moving, and I knew it wasn't

860
00:47:05.719 --> 00:47:08.440
<v Speaker 3>a human. I am so far out in Manila nowhere

861
00:47:08.480 --> 00:47:11.639
<v Speaker 3>there's I'm five miles from the nearest gravel road, so

862
00:47:12.480 --> 00:47:15.079
<v Speaker 3>I started concerning that would be the area that I

863
00:47:15.119 --> 00:47:18.679
<v Speaker 3>wanted to research. The next time I took the ball,

864
00:47:18.920 --> 00:47:22.039
<v Speaker 3>I had put someone in square of Alcrotamas, about a

865
00:47:22.039 --> 00:47:24.639
<v Speaker 3>half dozen of them. I went out and played with

866
00:47:24.719 --> 00:47:27.880
<v Speaker 3>the ball again for about forty five minutes. I left

867
00:47:27.880 --> 00:47:30.239
<v Speaker 3>it right in the meadow, went back to my kayak,

868
00:47:30.280 --> 00:47:32.760
<v Speaker 3>and I kayak out of there. Now, the first time

869
00:47:32.800 --> 00:47:34.800
<v Speaker 3>I showed up on a Thursday, about ten in the

870
00:47:34.840 --> 00:47:36.840
<v Speaker 3>morning is when I left the ball. I went back

871
00:47:36.880 --> 00:47:39.840
<v Speaker 3>on a Friday morning at about the same time to

872
00:47:39.880 --> 00:47:43.920
<v Speaker 3>pick it up. So I'm gonna start doing this every

873
00:47:43.960 --> 00:47:47.440
<v Speaker 3>Thursday and pick it up every Friday. Because if it

874
00:47:47.480 --> 00:47:50.119
<v Speaker 3>doesn't live in that area, so to speak, if this

875
00:47:50.280 --> 00:47:53.840
<v Speaker 3>is an area that hunts and at forges in, maybe

876
00:47:53.920 --> 00:47:56.719
<v Speaker 3>I could become part of its routine. Like wherever it

877
00:47:56.800 --> 00:47:59.800
<v Speaker 3>is twenty miles the way ten miles away. Maybe it

878
00:47:59.920 --> 00:48:02.079
<v Speaker 3>was to get to where every Thursday, hit nose, go

879
00:48:02.159 --> 00:48:05.000
<v Speaker 3>to that metal that balls. So I started doing that.

880
00:48:05.360 --> 00:48:08.440
<v Speaker 3>The second time I didn't get moved. I thought about

881
00:48:08.719 --> 00:48:11.880
<v Speaker 3>not putting out that metals again, but I did. The

882
00:48:11.920 --> 00:48:13.960
<v Speaker 3>third time I went back had been moved again. I

883
00:48:14.039 --> 00:48:16.519
<v Speaker 3>was looking at the levelco tabs and I realized that

884
00:48:16.599 --> 00:48:21.000
<v Speaker 3>I had two hares that were caught in these vehical tabs.

885
00:48:21.480 --> 00:48:23.679
<v Speaker 3>One of them was about eight inches long and one

886
00:48:23.760 --> 00:48:26.119
<v Speaker 3>one was about nine and a half inch as long.

887
00:48:26.880 --> 00:48:32.840
<v Speaker 3>Very silky, very fine, light colored. They seemed to change colors.

888
00:48:32.920 --> 00:48:35.239
<v Speaker 3>It looked clear in one section of it, and it

889
00:48:35.440 --> 00:48:38.599
<v Speaker 3>looked a little bit more brown in the section, and

890
00:48:38.760 --> 00:48:41.920
<v Speaker 3>the blondish looked. It was really weird. I put these

891
00:48:41.920 --> 00:48:46.199
<v Speaker 3>in a plastic bag. When the ziplock went home, talked

892
00:48:46.239 --> 00:48:49.679
<v Speaker 3>to Doug Hijacks and I was emailing him. We were

893
00:48:49.679 --> 00:48:51.920
<v Speaker 3>talking a messenger on Facebook and I told them why

894
00:48:51.960 --> 00:48:54.320
<v Speaker 3>I fought these hairs put them in a plastic bag.

895
00:48:54.360 --> 00:48:55.880
<v Speaker 3>He says, Dude, you got to put them in a

896
00:48:55.920 --> 00:48:59.920
<v Speaker 3>paper envelope, store them in paper, not plastic. You gotta

897
00:49:00.400 --> 00:49:03.480
<v Speaker 3>keep the DNA right on them and so that we

898
00:49:03.519 --> 00:49:07.320
<v Speaker 3>can test them. So I started carrying envelopes with me,

899
00:49:07.719 --> 00:49:11.079
<v Speaker 3>rubber gloves. He was telling me about some other things

900
00:49:11.119 --> 00:49:14.559
<v Speaker 3>that he had been having success with peanut butter jars,

901
00:49:15.079 --> 00:49:16.679
<v Speaker 3>and I said, okay, so I should put a jar

902
00:49:16.719 --> 00:49:19.360
<v Speaker 3>of peanut butter out there and just leave it there.

903
00:49:19.400 --> 00:49:22.360
<v Speaker 3>And he said yeah. I said, with the lid off,

904
00:49:22.400 --> 00:49:26.079
<v Speaker 3>and he says, no, these things love to unscrew lids

905
00:49:26.079 --> 00:49:29.159
<v Speaker 3>and screw them back on. I was like, what he does,

906
00:49:29.320 --> 00:49:33.159
<v Speaker 3>trust me, just try it. So the third trip out,

907
00:49:33.239 --> 00:49:35.719
<v Speaker 3>I put the ball out with the jar of peanut butter,

908
00:49:35.760 --> 00:49:38.639
<v Speaker 3>with the lid screwed on. Went back the next morning

909
00:49:38.639 --> 00:49:41.519
<v Speaker 3>on a Friday morning, the ball had been't move the

910
00:49:41.519 --> 00:49:44.079
<v Speaker 3>peanut butter jars laying there, the lids off of it,

911
00:49:44.559 --> 00:49:47.239
<v Speaker 3>the lid wasn't screwed back on it. But this jar

912
00:49:47.360 --> 00:49:50.639
<v Speaker 3>was empty. It looked like you had just made the

913
00:49:50.760 --> 00:49:54.880
<v Speaker 3>jar an hour ago. It was so clean. There wasn't

914
00:49:55.000 --> 00:49:57.800
<v Speaker 3>any peanut butter residue. It like you ran it through

915
00:49:57.800 --> 00:50:00.559
<v Speaker 3>a dishwashing. I was really excited. I did a whole

916
00:50:00.559 --> 00:50:04.400
<v Speaker 3>two hour trip kayaking out of there, bringing the ball

917
00:50:04.440 --> 00:50:07.800
<v Speaker 3>home and an empty peanut butter jar jar. I get home,

918
00:50:07.880 --> 00:50:12.119
<v Speaker 3>I called Doug and I said the jar was empty,

919
00:50:12.159 --> 00:50:15.280
<v Speaker 3>and he says, it looked like it went through a dishwasher.

920
00:50:15.320 --> 00:50:17.760
<v Speaker 3>I'm like, how did you know that? He said, that's

921
00:50:17.760 --> 00:50:20.800
<v Speaker 3>what ours look like when we find them. If they

922
00:50:20.880 --> 00:50:26.280
<v Speaker 3>get open, they're usually clean. I thought, yeah, that's exactly

923
00:50:26.320 --> 00:50:29.760
<v Speaker 3>what happened. So when I started talking to Doug about

924
00:50:29.800 --> 00:50:32.440
<v Speaker 3>this research, I said, look, I don't want to try

925
00:50:32.519 --> 00:50:36.079
<v Speaker 3>to photograph it. I don't want to try to trail camera.

926
00:50:36.239 --> 00:50:40.440
<v Speaker 3>I just think that's a low success, high tech strategy

927
00:50:40.559 --> 00:50:44.760
<v Speaker 3>that just doesn't produce. Whether it's senses ir, whether it's

928
00:50:44.840 --> 00:50:48.480
<v Speaker 3>sensor's motion detections, I don't know. You look at how

929
00:50:48.519 --> 00:50:50.519
<v Speaker 3>many game cams are out there, and we just don't

930
00:50:50.519 --> 00:50:53.599
<v Speaker 3>get real good footage. So I said, I don't want

931
00:50:53.599 --> 00:50:56.719
<v Speaker 3>to bring technology in this. He started preaching them me

932
00:50:56.760 --> 00:51:01.280
<v Speaker 3>and mentoring me on what hasn't worked. That kind of

933
00:51:01.320 --> 00:51:04.440
<v Speaker 3>guided my vision for this research. If I hasn't keep

934
00:51:04.440 --> 00:51:07.519
<v Speaker 3>doing this that I want to focus not on what

935
00:51:07.760 --> 00:51:12.239
<v Speaker 3>works but it doesn't work, try to eliminate those elements.

936
00:51:12.559 --> 00:51:15.400
<v Speaker 3>Because you can go out in an area and scream

937
00:51:15.519 --> 00:51:18.840
<v Speaker 3>or whoop and get a whoop back, let's say, and

938
00:51:18.880 --> 00:51:23.000
<v Speaker 3>that's cool. It's a great experience, right, But I feel

939
00:51:23.039 --> 00:51:26.079
<v Speaker 3>like I've already had a great experience it doesn't really

940
00:51:26.480 --> 00:51:29.400
<v Speaker 3>advance the science. The only thing that's going to advance

941
00:51:29.440 --> 00:51:32.280
<v Speaker 3>the science is DNA. We've got to do something to

942
00:51:32.320 --> 00:51:35.920
<v Speaker 3>get DNA. If I'm going to leverage this things curiosity

943
00:51:36.000 --> 00:51:39.079
<v Speaker 3>to try to collect DNA, I've got to make it

944
00:51:39.119 --> 00:51:44.559
<v Speaker 3>appear that I'm visiting this area, I'm leaving things. I'm

945
00:51:44.599 --> 00:51:48.159
<v Speaker 3>giving it a twenty four hour window to explore whatever

946
00:51:48.199 --> 00:51:51.800
<v Speaker 3>I leave on its own terms. It feels like it's

947
00:51:51.840 --> 00:51:55.239
<v Speaker 3>in control and it knows that I'm going to come

948
00:51:55.280 --> 00:51:58.320
<v Speaker 3>back in twenty four hours, because that's the routine I'm setting.

949
00:51:58.800 --> 00:52:01.199
<v Speaker 3>I don't look at the tree line, I don't call

950
00:52:01.280 --> 00:52:03.880
<v Speaker 3>out to it. I just picked the stuff up and wait.

951
00:52:04.440 --> 00:52:06.840
<v Speaker 3>The next week, on Thursday, I go put stuff out.

952
00:52:06.880 --> 00:52:10.920
<v Speaker 3>And now each week I've been integrating a new element

953
00:52:11.320 --> 00:52:13.920
<v Speaker 3>into what I leave. I've been doing this for a

954
00:52:13.920 --> 00:52:17.559
<v Speaker 3>total of fifteen weeks. Now. There's only four times that

955
00:52:17.679 --> 00:52:21.360
<v Speaker 3>the ball hasn't been moved or something that I leave

956
00:52:21.480 --> 00:52:24.199
<v Speaker 3>hasn't been moved. So I know I've become part of this.

957
00:52:24.679 --> 00:52:26.920
<v Speaker 3>Whether it's one, whether it's a group of them, I

958
00:52:26.960 --> 00:52:30.079
<v Speaker 3>know I'm part of its routine. But I've had some

959
00:52:30.199 --> 00:52:34.440
<v Speaker 3>crazy stuff happen over this time. So I guess as

960
00:52:34.480 --> 00:52:37.559
<v Speaker 3>I'm talking to Doug. One of the interesting things that happened.

961
00:52:37.559 --> 00:52:41.320
<v Speaker 3>He started talking about when he was studying bears. He

962
00:52:41.440 --> 00:52:45.239
<v Speaker 3>was the first one the video bears giving birth and hibernating,

963
00:52:45.280 --> 00:52:47.519
<v Speaker 3>and so he had planted all these cameras in a

964
00:52:47.559 --> 00:52:51.800
<v Speaker 3>hibernation dam and things like that. He said, it's scientifically

965
00:52:51.880 --> 00:52:57.599
<v Speaker 3>proven that caribou see in ub vision. He said, I

966
00:52:57.719 --> 00:53:02.360
<v Speaker 3>feel like bears do too. As I've had the reactions

967
00:53:02.440 --> 00:53:08.159
<v Speaker 3>to UV, fluorescent colors really different. They seem to prefer

968
00:53:08.400 --> 00:53:12.679
<v Speaker 3>fluorescent blue. If there's something in our research that's blue,

969
00:53:12.920 --> 00:53:15.880
<v Speaker 3>it moves it, it destroys it, it chews on it.

970
00:53:15.880 --> 00:53:19.079
<v Speaker 3>It sees that so much easier. Now, what's funny is

971
00:53:19.159 --> 00:53:23.719
<v Speaker 3>my business it involves UV and black white technology. So

972
00:53:23.920 --> 00:53:26.519
<v Speaker 3>I told you, guys, said, actually I'm the UV expert.

973
00:53:26.679 --> 00:53:29.840
<v Speaker 3>You what I told them what my business was and

974
00:53:29.880 --> 00:53:32.760
<v Speaker 3>how we worked with this in my experience with it.

975
00:53:33.239 --> 00:53:36.760
<v Speaker 3>He said, what's your chances of this happening? That you

976
00:53:37.119 --> 00:53:40.639
<v Speaker 3>know about this technology? And I just have this theory

977
00:53:40.760 --> 00:53:46.199
<v Speaker 3>that maybe if bars and UV, maybe Bigfoot season UV.

978
00:53:46.559 --> 00:53:50.360
<v Speaker 3>I said, What you don't understand is when you say UV,

979
00:53:50.599 --> 00:53:54.760
<v Speaker 3>what you're talking about isn't just fluorescent colors. Every game

980
00:53:54.880 --> 00:53:59.639
<v Speaker 3>camera that's made that that has a hard, durable plastic

981
00:54:00.320 --> 00:54:04.119
<v Speaker 3>that's made to resist being chewed on or damage has

982
00:54:04.159 --> 00:54:07.920
<v Speaker 3>a UV element in that coating on the plastic that

983
00:54:08.039 --> 00:54:11.880
<v Speaker 3>makes it that durable. The acurlic resin that they use

984
00:54:11.960 --> 00:54:15.519
<v Speaker 3>in those plastics to make them hard has a UV

985
00:54:15.719 --> 00:54:19.039
<v Speaker 3>element to it. Every camera lens that's ever been made,

986
00:54:19.119 --> 00:54:22.559
<v Speaker 3>whether it's a game camera or a professional video camera,

987
00:54:23.199 --> 00:54:26.840
<v Speaker 3>has a UV coding on the lens. You got to

988
00:54:26.880 --> 00:54:29.440
<v Speaker 3>imagine this, Brian. If you can see in your v

989
00:54:30.320 --> 00:54:33.599
<v Speaker 3>when you look out in a tree line and there's

990
00:54:33.639 --> 00:54:37.239
<v Speaker 3>a game camera that'll trut's say, one hundred yards away,

991
00:54:38.159 --> 00:54:41.039
<v Speaker 3>that lens is going to stand out to you as

992
00:54:41.079 --> 00:54:43.400
<v Speaker 3>if it was flor ess and orange and me and

993
00:54:43.480 --> 00:54:45.800
<v Speaker 3>you were looking at it. It's just going to have

994
00:54:46.000 --> 00:54:51.239
<v Speaker 3>a vivid surface to it. It could be that the

995
00:54:51.320 --> 00:54:55.960
<v Speaker 3>plastic of a peanut butter, John or the lenses in

996
00:54:56.000 --> 00:54:59.360
<v Speaker 3>the eyeglasses that you wear might be giving off a

997
00:54:59.519 --> 00:55:02.800
<v Speaker 3>UV look to it. I think he was onto something

998
00:55:02.840 --> 00:55:06.199
<v Speaker 3>with that, so I started incorporating that into the things

999
00:55:06.239 --> 00:55:09.039
<v Speaker 3>that I leave out there. What I started doing is

1000
00:55:09.360 --> 00:55:13.840
<v Speaker 3>I take a game camera painted the whole thing fluorescent blue.

1001
00:55:14.320 --> 00:55:16.599
<v Speaker 3>I don't put batteries in it and power it up.

1002
00:55:17.280 --> 00:55:19.320
<v Speaker 3>I just leave it lay out there in the field,

1003
00:55:19.559 --> 00:55:22.760
<v Speaker 3>not too far away from the ball, just on the ground.

1004
00:55:23.360 --> 00:55:26.480
<v Speaker 3>I'm trying to get used to that blue color and

1005
00:55:26.519 --> 00:55:29.280
<v Speaker 3>seeing a game camera and not being afraid of it.

1006
00:55:29.760 --> 00:55:32.119
<v Speaker 3>I'll go out and it'll be picked up and carried

1007
00:55:32.159 --> 00:55:36.119
<v Speaker 3>five yards and dropped. Something's moved it. I've strapped him

1008
00:55:36.159 --> 00:55:39.679
<v Speaker 3>on trees before, with peanut butter in front of it,

1009
00:55:39.760 --> 00:55:44.360
<v Speaker 3>so that it knew there was a reward. Anytime it

1010
00:55:44.400 --> 00:55:47.800
<v Speaker 3>sees blue now in anything that I leave, it knows

1011
00:55:47.800 --> 00:55:51.440
<v Speaker 3>there's something there that's good. So I'll strap a fluorescent

1012
00:55:51.599 --> 00:55:55.079
<v Speaker 3>blue game camera to a tree. Then what I've started

1013
00:55:55.119 --> 00:55:59.159
<v Speaker 3>doing now is I take little baby food jars that

1014
00:55:59.400 --> 00:56:01.199
<v Speaker 3>the label or ripped off of it. I've got two

1015
00:56:01.239 --> 00:56:03.480
<v Speaker 3>teenage boys, and when they were younger, they had a

1016
00:56:03.559 --> 00:56:07.239
<v Speaker 3>rock tumbler. They would tumble rocks until they looked really

1017
00:56:07.320 --> 00:56:10.519
<v Speaker 3>shiny and pretty. I'd take a rock and put it

1018
00:56:10.519 --> 00:56:12.400
<v Speaker 3>in a baby food jar and screw the lid on

1019
00:56:12.480 --> 00:56:15.119
<v Speaker 3>and leave it out there now in front of these

1020
00:56:15.199 --> 00:56:17.920
<v Speaker 3>blue game cameras that are strapped to trees, but they

1021
00:56:17.960 --> 00:56:20.639
<v Speaker 3>have no batteries in them. They'll go out and they'll

1022
00:56:20.639 --> 00:56:24.000
<v Speaker 3>open up with baby food jar and take it. I've

1023
00:56:24.000 --> 00:56:26.119
<v Speaker 3>had it be where I leave my kayak on the

1024
00:56:26.199 --> 00:56:28.800
<v Speaker 3>shore and when I walk in. This last time I

1025
00:56:28.840 --> 00:56:32.599
<v Speaker 3>was there, I walked into the area, spent forty five

1026
00:56:32.599 --> 00:56:35.119
<v Speaker 3>minutes playing with the ball, leave the ball, put the

1027
00:56:35.159 --> 00:56:38.920
<v Speaker 3>game cameras back out with no batteries, and I'm I've

1028
00:56:38.960 --> 00:56:43.440
<v Speaker 3>tied fluorescent blue flagging tape to one of the trees

1029
00:56:43.480 --> 00:56:46.440
<v Speaker 3>and smeared peanut butter on the trunk of it. I'm

1030
00:56:46.440 --> 00:56:49.360
<v Speaker 3>just trying to make them comfortable with this fluorescent blue color.

1031
00:56:49.599 --> 00:56:52.679
<v Speaker 3>It means there's something good and not something bad. I'm

1032
00:56:52.679 --> 00:56:55.440
<v Speaker 3>never calling out to it. I'm never trying to interact

1033
00:56:55.480 --> 00:56:57.960
<v Speaker 3>with it. There was one time when I was walking

1034
00:56:58.000 --> 00:57:01.840
<v Speaker 3>out of the area about three trips ago, where on

1035
00:57:01.880 --> 00:57:05.320
<v Speaker 3>my path that I walk out of I found a bobber.

1036
00:57:05.920 --> 00:57:09.519
<v Speaker 3>It was a fishing bobber that was that orange and

1037
00:57:09.800 --> 00:57:13.440
<v Speaker 3>it's a plastic one. It's small, but it's like that

1038
00:57:13.599 --> 00:57:18.800
<v Speaker 3>fluorescent sharp truse color on top, that yellowy looking glowy

1039
00:57:18.920 --> 00:57:22.920
<v Speaker 3>color that was like fluorescent orange on the bottom. And

1040
00:57:22.960 --> 00:57:25.119
<v Speaker 3>it was laying right in the past that I walked,

1041
00:57:25.679 --> 00:57:28.639
<v Speaker 3>I picked it up, stuck it in my pocket, put

1042
00:57:28.679 --> 00:57:32.360
<v Speaker 3>the stuff there, and then got my kayaking left. I

1043
00:57:32.400 --> 00:57:34.400
<v Speaker 3>was telling Doug about it, and Doug said, did you

1044
00:57:34.480 --> 00:57:38.000
<v Speaker 3>leave something backwark? And I said, no, dude, they'll get

1045
00:57:38.000 --> 00:57:40.239
<v Speaker 3>offended if you take a gift they leave for you

1046
00:57:40.239 --> 00:57:42.800
<v Speaker 3>and you don't leave one. You know, Doug's been my

1047
00:57:42.880 --> 00:57:45.000
<v Speaker 3>mentor to this, because you know, I was an idiot

1048
00:57:45.000 --> 00:57:47.800
<v Speaker 3>when a kid. I did no experience, right. So now

1049
00:57:47.800 --> 00:57:52.559
<v Speaker 3>I have a little plastic or glass vial. I fill

1050
00:57:52.599 --> 00:57:54.800
<v Speaker 3>them with water and put a little bit of glitter

1051
00:57:54.920 --> 00:57:57.440
<v Speaker 3>in and put a cap on the vial and you

1052
00:57:57.519 --> 00:58:00.400
<v Speaker 3>shake it up. It looks like a little snowflobe. I

1053
00:58:00.480 --> 00:58:03.360
<v Speaker 3>do that with blue glitter. I keep three or four

1054
00:58:03.400 --> 00:58:05.920
<v Speaker 3>of them in my pocket all the time when I'm

1055
00:58:05.920 --> 00:58:08.880
<v Speaker 3>out there. When I see something, I feel like, yeah,

1056
00:58:08.960 --> 00:58:12.039
<v Speaker 3>maybe this is something that left for me. I'll pick

1057
00:58:12.079 --> 00:58:15.199
<v Speaker 3>it up and leave a little violet glitter there. When

1058
00:58:15.199 --> 00:58:18.840
<v Speaker 3>I go back, it's gone, that vial's gone, because last

1059
00:58:18.840 --> 00:58:23.039
<v Speaker 3>time I went in last week, I went in Thursday morning,

1060
00:58:23.599 --> 00:58:26.159
<v Speaker 3>there was two big logs that were laying across the

1061
00:58:26.239 --> 00:58:29.679
<v Speaker 3>three quarter mile trail that I hiked back into this area.

1062
00:58:30.440 --> 00:58:34.039
<v Speaker 3>Once I pulled my kayakup on the beach. The logs

1063
00:58:34.599 --> 00:58:37.480
<v Speaker 3>had been moved off of the trail. One of them

1064
00:58:37.519 --> 00:58:41.039
<v Speaker 3>I had to step over every time. One of them

1065
00:58:41.679 --> 00:58:44.159
<v Speaker 3>was a birch tree that had fallen down across the

1066
00:58:44.199 --> 00:58:47.239
<v Speaker 3>trail and was propped up against another tree, so I

1067
00:58:47.320 --> 00:58:50.119
<v Speaker 3>would walk off the trail and walk around it. Both

1068
00:58:50.159 --> 00:58:52.760
<v Speaker 3>of them had been moved, so they're laying parallel to

1069
00:58:52.840 --> 00:58:55.079
<v Speaker 3>the edge of the trail now, like something was trying

1070
00:58:55.119 --> 00:58:57.320
<v Speaker 3>to make it easier for me to get in there.

1071
00:58:57.800 --> 00:59:01.800
<v Speaker 3>I went in, played with the ball, left the ball hung.

1072
00:59:01.840 --> 00:59:04.320
<v Speaker 3>The game cams put up some flags, they put out

1073
00:59:04.360 --> 00:59:07.440
<v Speaker 3>the peanut. But each week I start adding something different

1074
00:59:07.480 --> 00:59:10.960
<v Speaker 3>than I'm doing. When I walk out, I get to

1075
00:59:11.000 --> 00:59:14.679
<v Speaker 3>my kayak and my paddle. I don't know if you're

1076
00:59:14.719 --> 00:59:17.920
<v Speaker 3>familiar with kayak palles, but my paddle had been Something

1077
00:59:18.000 --> 00:59:23.039
<v Speaker 3>depressed the plunger button and sowed my paddle into two pieces.

1078
00:59:23.639 --> 00:59:26.760
<v Speaker 3>One was leaning against the edge of the kayak with

1079
00:59:26.880 --> 00:59:30.679
<v Speaker 3>the blade down in the gravel. The other end was

1080
00:59:30.760 --> 00:59:33.199
<v Speaker 3>leaning up in the air, and the other section of

1081
00:59:33.239 --> 00:59:36.159
<v Speaker 3>it the blade was down in the floor of the

1082
00:59:36.239 --> 00:59:39.000
<v Speaker 3>kayak and it was leading up against the seat. I'm

1083
00:59:39.039 --> 00:59:41.440
<v Speaker 3>looking at where I pulled up at trying to see

1084
00:59:41.480 --> 00:59:45.360
<v Speaker 3>as a short footprints here or what. I couldn't see

1085
00:59:45.400 --> 00:59:49.840
<v Speaker 3>any footprints, just because it was it's like river rockets.

1086
00:59:50.039 --> 00:59:53.239
<v Speaker 3>It's not fine gravel or something that would depression. But

1087
00:59:53.360 --> 00:59:57.079
<v Speaker 3>I've seen an area on the beach down the down

1088
00:59:57.199 --> 00:59:59.679
<v Speaker 3>river for me a little bit. That's where I'm gonna

1089
00:59:59.679 --> 01:00:04.000
<v Speaker 3>start eaching it now, just to see if that happened. Then. Also,

1090
01:00:04.159 --> 01:00:07.320
<v Speaker 3>my life jacket, I leave it lay unbuckled. When I

1091
01:00:07.320 --> 01:00:09.320
<v Speaker 3>take it off, I leave it lay in the seat.

1092
01:00:09.599 --> 01:00:12.719
<v Speaker 3>My life jacket was laying on the nose of my kayak.

1093
01:00:13.400 --> 01:00:15.400
<v Speaker 3>There's a bungee cord on the front of my cack.

1094
01:00:15.480 --> 01:00:18.760
<v Speaker 3>Something had picked up the life jacket, snap the three

1095
01:00:18.840 --> 01:00:22.880
<v Speaker 3>buckles closed on it, and slid it underneath the bungee

1096
01:00:22.880 --> 01:00:25.519
<v Speaker 3>cord of the kayak. I'm telling you, I don't care

1097
01:00:25.559 --> 01:00:29.159
<v Speaker 3>if it's a Saturday or midnight on a Monday. We

1098
01:00:29.239 --> 01:00:31.280
<v Speaker 3>can sit on that river and you will not see

1099
01:00:31.280 --> 01:00:35.000
<v Speaker 3>somebody come past it. This is so remote that I'm

1100
01:00:35.039 --> 01:00:37.440
<v Speaker 3>not saying there are people that could be out there.

1101
01:00:38.639 --> 01:00:41.440
<v Speaker 3>My goal throughout this research was not to try to

1102
01:00:41.480 --> 01:00:45.320
<v Speaker 3>communicate with it, just go out and do my things.

1103
01:00:46.039 --> 01:00:50.119
<v Speaker 3>In the course of the velcro tabs. I've collected now

1104
01:00:50.199 --> 01:00:54.719
<v Speaker 3>to this date, eleven hair samples over fourteen weeks. A

1105
01:00:54.760 --> 01:00:57.559
<v Speaker 3>lot of times I don't have any. Sometimes I have

1106
01:00:58.119 --> 01:01:02.039
<v Speaker 3>two or three, but I've got eleven total. I've also

1107
01:01:03.039 --> 01:01:07.440
<v Speaker 3>have what Doug refers to as thebum smears. When they

1108
01:01:07.480 --> 01:01:10.559
<v Speaker 3>touch something in their skin, that waxy coat on their skin.

1109
01:01:10.760 --> 01:01:14.480
<v Speaker 3>Just like we have an oil in our skin, they

1110
01:01:14.559 --> 01:01:19.039
<v Speaker 3>have a more thicker waxy substance. It's probably protective of

1111
01:01:19.079 --> 01:01:22.480
<v Speaker 3>their skin, helps protect it when they touch something, or

1112
01:01:22.480 --> 01:01:24.400
<v Speaker 3>if they were to touch it their nose to a

1113
01:01:24.480 --> 01:01:29.599
<v Speaker 3>glass window, it would leave a waxy smudge. I've started

1114
01:01:29.679 --> 01:01:34.920
<v Speaker 3>leaving a ten inch piece of black Plexi glass leaning

1115
01:01:34.960 --> 01:01:38.360
<v Speaker 3>against a tree with the peanut butter under the Plexi glass.

1116
01:01:38.400 --> 01:01:41.000
<v Speaker 3>You're thinking rat will pick the Plexi glass up and

1117
01:01:41.039 --> 01:01:44.960
<v Speaker 3>move it, maybe and leave a fingerprint, because every time

1118
01:01:45.000 --> 01:01:48.880
<v Speaker 3>it touches the ball, if it leaves fingerprints, I can't

1119
01:01:48.920 --> 01:01:52.800
<v Speaker 3>see those fingerprints. What happens is they turn into smears.

1120
01:01:52.920 --> 01:01:55.800
<v Speaker 3>I think it takes the ball and holds it under

1121
01:01:55.840 --> 01:01:58.840
<v Speaker 3>one arm, or it walks around with it, or it's

1122
01:01:59.000 --> 01:02:02.119
<v Speaker 3>kicking it to the ground like it's mimicking what I'm doing.

1123
01:02:02.280 --> 01:02:06.320
<v Speaker 3>I just can't get a clear fingerprint that shows normal

1124
01:02:06.400 --> 01:02:09.800
<v Speaker 3>ridges and things like that. But I'm trying, and every

1125
01:02:09.840 --> 01:02:13.639
<v Speaker 3>time I have any type of a Seabum IQ tippe,

1126
01:02:13.639 --> 01:02:16.400
<v Speaker 3>it put my rubber gloves on Q tippet and put

1127
01:02:16.440 --> 01:02:21.239
<v Speaker 3>it in an envelope. So I've got eleven hair samples

1128
01:02:21.280 --> 01:02:25.239
<v Speaker 3>and seven Sebum swear samples. And my idea was, I'm

1129
01:02:25.280 --> 01:02:28.480
<v Speaker 3>just gonna keep doing this and try to just be

1130
01:02:28.559 --> 01:02:34.079
<v Speaker 3>disciplined enough to just keep trying this low tech, noncommunicative

1131
01:02:34.159 --> 01:02:37.199
<v Speaker 3>from my end research where all I'm doing is just

1132
01:02:37.280 --> 01:02:40.119
<v Speaker 3>collecting from it. It doesn't realize it, but I'm just

1133
01:02:40.199 --> 01:02:42.920
<v Speaker 3>collecting these samples, right. I want to get to a

1134
01:02:42.920 --> 01:02:45.039
<v Speaker 3>point where I have to end it culminates to where

1135
01:02:46.000 --> 01:02:48.760
<v Speaker 3>there will be a high tech ending to it. One

1136
01:02:48.800 --> 01:02:50.840
<v Speaker 3>day when I go out there, I'm gonna put batteries

1137
01:02:50.880 --> 01:02:54.880
<v Speaker 3>and all the game cameras. I'm gonna leave voice recorders

1138
01:02:55.039 --> 01:02:57.360
<v Speaker 3>instead of a red ball. Me and Doug are working

1139
01:02:57.400 --> 01:03:01.280
<v Speaker 3>on designing a ball that has three hundred and sixty

1140
01:03:01.320 --> 01:03:07.360
<v Speaker 3>degree camera embedded into the ball that can remain powered overnight.

1141
01:03:08.039 --> 01:03:10.679
<v Speaker 3>What I'm trying to achieve is, if you look at

1142
01:03:10.719 --> 01:03:15.760
<v Speaker 3>the Patterson Gilan film footage, what's really spectacular about that

1143
01:03:15.880 --> 01:03:20.239
<v Speaker 3>isn't the footage. It's the fact that they combined more

1144
01:03:20.320 --> 01:03:25.880
<v Speaker 3>than one Holy Grail type element to what they discovered

1145
01:03:25.880 --> 01:03:31.119
<v Speaker 3>that day. They had footprints with the footage. Whether it's

1146
01:03:31.159 --> 01:03:34.559
<v Speaker 3>a footprint, whether it's a video footage or a still picture,

1147
01:03:35.079 --> 01:03:39.320
<v Speaker 3>whether it's a vocal recording, or whether it's a DNA sample.

1148
01:03:40.000 --> 01:03:44.000
<v Speaker 3>Those four different things that you could possibly gain from

1149
01:03:44.039 --> 01:03:48.159
<v Speaker 3>an encounter, they had two of them, with footprints and

1150
01:03:48.400 --> 01:03:53.000
<v Speaker 3>film footage. That's what makes that so spectacular. Almost every

1151
01:03:53.039 --> 01:03:56.800
<v Speaker 3>other scientific data that's been collected has only been one

1152
01:03:56.840 --> 01:04:01.440
<v Speaker 3>of those. Right if you're subscribed to the outstanding experienced

1153
01:04:01.639 --> 01:04:05.039
<v Speaker 3>research that he did. He's got what he claimed to

1154
01:04:05.079 --> 01:04:09.440
<v Speaker 3>be the footage and the still pictures combined with footprints

1155
01:04:09.480 --> 01:04:12.199
<v Speaker 3>and things like that. It'd be one thing if at

1156
01:04:12.239 --> 01:04:14.239
<v Speaker 3>the end of the summer I had a catalog of

1157
01:04:14.360 --> 01:04:19.559
<v Speaker 3>eleven hair samples, seven sevum smear samples. We're going to

1158
01:04:19.639 --> 01:04:23.679
<v Speaker 3>go pay to have these analyzed. What the goal is

1159
01:04:24.719 --> 01:04:28.679
<v Speaker 3>not to have a lab analyze it and say it's

1160
01:04:28.800 --> 01:04:33.360
<v Speaker 3>an unknown primate and they just keep looking there. Eventually

1161
01:04:33.400 --> 01:04:37.320
<v Speaker 3>we have to establish a database. It's not something we

1162
01:04:37.400 --> 01:04:40.280
<v Speaker 3>know about, but sample one matches sample to it, and

1163
01:04:40.320 --> 01:04:43.920
<v Speaker 3>sample one and two matches sample seventeen. Eventually we're going

1164
01:04:43.960 --> 01:04:47.920
<v Speaker 3>to establish a collection of DNA as SEMy it's coming

1165
01:04:47.920 --> 01:04:50.960
<v Speaker 3>from the same creature where they match each other. They

1166
01:04:51.039 --> 01:04:53.639
<v Speaker 3>might not match what you consider to be part of

1167
01:04:53.679 --> 01:04:57.719
<v Speaker 3>your library of known primates, but these do match each other.

1168
01:04:58.320 --> 01:05:02.000
<v Speaker 3>I'm not a scientist, I'm not a doctor, I don't

1169
01:05:02.039 --> 01:05:05.599
<v Speaker 3>have a degree, and I'm just a citizen researcher, a

1170
01:05:05.599 --> 01:05:10.079
<v Speaker 3>citizen scientist, as Doug would explain, But he's adamant about

1171
01:05:10.760 --> 01:05:16.159
<v Speaker 3>developing a DNA library that if you could collect ten

1172
01:05:16.239 --> 01:05:21.239
<v Speaker 3>samples from ten different creatures, you would have undeniable proofs

1173
01:05:21.280 --> 01:05:25.199
<v Speaker 3>that you have something there. But it's not just something

1174
01:05:25.840 --> 01:05:28.320
<v Speaker 3>that's not a known primate at that point, you know

1175
01:05:28.360 --> 01:05:28.840
<v Speaker 3>what I mean.

1176
01:05:29.760 --> 01:05:31.639
<v Speaker 1>That's one of the things that I love the most

1177
01:05:31.639 --> 01:05:35.079
<v Speaker 1>about Doug Hihcheck is he thinks outside the box. He

1178
01:05:35.199 --> 01:05:38.960
<v Speaker 1>looks at things from a completely different lens most of

1179
01:05:39.000 --> 01:05:40.679
<v Speaker 1>the time. I think some of the things that you're

1180
01:05:40.679 --> 01:05:42.880
<v Speaker 1>doing are fascinating. I hope you stay in touch with

1181
01:05:42.960 --> 01:05:45.599
<v Speaker 1>us and share some of the things that you guys find.

1182
01:05:45.760 --> 01:05:48.159
<v Speaker 1>One of the guys here in North Carolina recently got

1183
01:05:48.199 --> 01:05:50.599
<v Speaker 1>some hair samples, and I reached out to Doug and

1184
01:05:50.599 --> 01:05:52.679
<v Speaker 1>he put me in contact with somebody that hopefully we're

1185
01:05:52.679 --> 01:05:54.320
<v Speaker 1>going to be able to send those twos. Please stay

1186
01:05:54.360 --> 01:05:56.679
<v Speaker 1>in touch with us any evidence that you guys get

1187
01:05:56.760 --> 01:05:58.599
<v Speaker 1>and any discoveries that you guys make.

1188
01:05:58.639 --> 01:06:00.920
<v Speaker 3>I hope you'll come back on the show and share

1189
01:06:00.960 --> 01:06:04.440
<v Speaker 3>with us for sure. Yeah. Over the weekend here Doug

1190
01:06:04.559 --> 01:06:08.320
<v Speaker 3>was speaking up in Deluze, Minnesota at a conference. Said,

1191
01:06:08.480 --> 01:06:11.199
<v Speaker 3>you don't believe what just happened. He said, I'm standing

1192
01:06:11.239 --> 01:06:13.960
<v Speaker 3>at a booth talking to somebody. First of all, Bran,

1193
01:06:14.039 --> 01:06:17.760
<v Speaker 3>I've never really been into the para normal, the parapsychic

1194
01:06:17.880 --> 01:06:21.400
<v Speaker 3>type part of Bakefoot. I get that there's a lot

1195
01:06:21.519 --> 01:06:24.920
<v Speaker 3>out there, but I've been general minded on the research

1196
01:06:25.480 --> 01:06:28.440
<v Speaker 3>that I'm doing and Doug's doing. But he had this

1197
01:06:28.559 --> 01:06:32.639
<v Speaker 3>lady come up hand him a six inch long, fluffy,

1198
01:06:33.519 --> 01:06:38.639
<v Speaker 3>ruscient blue state colored feathern She said, I don't know why,

1199
01:06:39.320 --> 01:06:43.079
<v Speaker 3>I'm a paranormal expert, and I've felt compelled that I

1200
01:06:43.159 --> 01:06:45.480
<v Speaker 3>need to give this to you and you'll know what

1201
01:06:45.639 --> 01:06:48.039
<v Speaker 3>to do with it. Doug sent me the picture of

1202
01:06:48.039 --> 01:06:49.800
<v Speaker 3>it and told me what had just happened. I said,

1203
01:06:49.800 --> 01:06:53.039
<v Speaker 3>you need to mail that what's great is that Doug

1204
01:06:53.159 --> 01:06:57.000
<v Speaker 3>is a person that he really radamant about people like

1205
01:06:57.079 --> 01:06:59.719
<v Speaker 3>myself or anybody else. She's trying to go out and

1206
01:06:59.760 --> 01:07:03.440
<v Speaker 3>have the experience that he's there for them. If you

1207
01:07:03.519 --> 01:07:05.800
<v Speaker 3>have questions, say what should I do with this, how

1208
01:07:05.800 --> 01:07:08.159
<v Speaker 3>should I react to this? Or this happened to me?

1209
01:07:08.400 --> 01:07:11.119
<v Speaker 3>He wants to get involved. He wants to help you

1210
01:07:11.280 --> 01:07:15.280
<v Speaker 3>get a sample, and he's very approachable. You can find

1211
01:07:15.320 --> 01:07:17.719
<v Speaker 3>him on Facebook, send him a message, he says, that's

1212
01:07:17.760 --> 01:07:20.320
<v Speaker 3>why I have a Facebook account so people can find me.

1213
01:07:20.960 --> 01:07:23.960
<v Speaker 3>Everybody who's trying to do something like this should have

1214
01:07:24.000 --> 01:07:27.159
<v Speaker 3>a mentor and not just go at it like it's

1215
01:07:27.320 --> 01:07:30.400
<v Speaker 3>killing snakes. Should take a balance of process and shrow

1216
01:07:30.480 --> 01:07:33.079
<v Speaker 3>it down and figure out what's the best way to

1217
01:07:33.159 --> 01:07:37.000
<v Speaker 3>get a result considering the environment that I'm doing this,

1218
01:07:37.199 --> 01:07:40.519
<v Speaker 3>and I'm hoping that more people can learn that from

1219
01:07:40.599 --> 01:07:42.800
<v Speaker 3>what I'm doing. I'm not saying I'm doing something right

1220
01:07:42.880 --> 01:07:44.719
<v Speaker 3>or I'm doing it wrong. I know that I'm doing

1221
01:07:44.760 --> 01:07:47.760
<v Speaker 3>it different than most soccer That's awesome.

1222
01:07:47.760 --> 01:07:50.000
<v Speaker 1>I think that you've got one of the best mentors

1223
01:07:50.000 --> 01:07:50.599
<v Speaker 1>in the business.

1224
01:07:50.599 --> 01:07:52.039
<v Speaker 3>Agaichek. He's one of the best.

1225
01:07:52.159 --> 01:07:54.760
<v Speaker 1>He's never failed to answer a text from me or

1226
01:07:54.800 --> 01:07:58.320
<v Speaker 1>a phone call or a Facebook message. He's always been

1227
01:07:58.360 --> 01:08:01.599
<v Speaker 1>there and he's always had great ideas. He'll be the

1228
01:08:01.599 --> 01:08:03.760
<v Speaker 1>first admit I may be wrong, but this is what

1229
01:08:03.840 --> 01:08:06.280
<v Speaker 1>I think about it. We go from there. I can't

1230
01:08:06.280 --> 01:08:08.119
<v Speaker 1>thank you enough for coming on the show and sharing.

1231
01:08:08.159 --> 01:08:09.440
<v Speaker 1>We'll definitely have to have you back.

1232
01:08:09.880 --> 01:08:10.920
<v Speaker 3>Yeah. I look forward to.

1233
01:08:12.360 --> 01:08:20.239
<v Speaker 4>They say you don't gotta go home, but you can't stay.

1234
01:08:22.000 --> 01:08:49.279
<v Speaker 4>I don't want to be world out that try this

1235
01:08:49.800 --> 01:08:57.720
<v Speaker 4>job that chid everything back the joy for me, joy,

1236
01:08:57.840 --> 01:09:31.239
<v Speaker 4>staying right, come right away, side, standstill, start, stays, stays,

1237
01:09:32.359 --> 01:10:04.359
<v Speaker 4>stay inside, stay stay, state still sus the pass, unstate

1238
01:10:04.600 --> 01:10:15.119
<v Speaker 4>plays ands stets pass used past insis
