WEBVTT

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<v Speaker 2>Hire.

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<v Speaker 1>Less than an hour away from kickoff. We have the

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<v Speaker 1>college Football National Championship game on our radio station between

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<v Speaker 1>Ohio States and Notre Dame. Let's bring in our next guest,

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<v Speaker 1>because I've misbehaved with the clock and I hate to

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<v Speaker 1>keep him waiting. Pleasure to spend some time with Rick

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<v Speaker 1>new Heisel last week here in Park City, and Rick

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<v Speaker 1>joins us now on a Monday, Rick, Happy Monday, sir,

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<v Speaker 1>How are you?

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<v Speaker 2>I am fantastic Spence. How you doing man? And that

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<v Speaker 2>was that song that you brought me back with? Is

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<v Speaker 2>that just trying to explain to the listeners how old

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<v Speaker 2>I am? What the heck you're doing?

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<v Speaker 1>You know, I hate to blame my producer, but Porter

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<v Speaker 1>decided to play it must just been the California Ties.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a wonderful song, Rick, is it not.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a great song. It was written in the sixties,

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<v Speaker 2>performed in the sixties, and so am I a video

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<v Speaker 2>product of the sixties. So there you have it?

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, fair enough? Well, I wanted to bring some of

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<v Speaker 1>the because I thought it was so fascinating listening to

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<v Speaker 1>you discuss the future of college football last week during

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<v Speaker 1>the daunt List Capital event that we did, and people

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<v Speaker 1>really enjoyed what you had to say, and I actually

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<v Speaker 1>it kind of gave me some hope, so I wanted

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<v Speaker 1>to bring that conversation on air. We're, of course, in

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<v Speaker 1>Salt Lake City, where the home of the University of

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<v Speaker 1>Utah Brigham Young plays their college ball about forty forty

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<v Speaker 1>five miles away. In the hypothetical I kind of posed

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<v Speaker 1>to you. I indicated it felt like we're headed towards

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<v Speaker 1>a pro model, and you kind of pushed back a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit on that, and I thought your answer was

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<v Speaker 1>well thought out and very well articulated. So for our listeners,

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<v Speaker 1>who of course didn't have a chance to hear it,

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<v Speaker 1>the Rick new heisil take on the future of college

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<v Speaker 1>football and specifically where you think Utah and BYU could

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<v Speaker 1>fit in well.

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<v Speaker 2>Currently, if you subscribe to the theory that, as the

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<v Speaker 2>old man said to his son one day, the answers money, Now,

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<v Speaker 2>what was the question. If you subscribe to that theory,

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<v Speaker 2>then we are headed to super late and that is

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<v Speaker 2>going to be incredibly successful. And there's going to be

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit of a kind of a gumball rally

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<v Speaker 2>as to which teams make the field and how big

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<v Speaker 2>the field. Actually, is is it the SEC and the

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<v Speaker 2>Big ten? Are they going to take some you know,

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<v Speaker 2>folks from the Big twelve and the ACC that are

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<v Speaker 2>currently positioned well? And really, if you choose to do that,

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<v Speaker 2>which the big money people might very well and the

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<v Speaker 2>television executives might very well, you're basically just saying it's

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<v Speaker 2>it's all a product of timing, right, Stanford ten years

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<v Speaker 2>ago would have been in the Big ten, but ten

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<v Speaker 2>ten years later after they didn't, you know, keep up

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<v Speaker 2>with the Joneses with admissions, they're now in the ACC.

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<v Speaker 2>Utah given their amazing rise from Mount West to Pac

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<v Speaker 2>twelve now to the Big twelve. And I know it

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<v Speaker 2>was an off year for the Utes given the injuries,

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<v Speaker 2>but Utah could very well be on the right side

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<v Speaker 2>of the line, as could be why you've given a

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<v Speaker 2>ten win season. So these are things, But why would

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<v Speaker 2>we do that? Why would we limit the amount of

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<v Speaker 2>opportunities that were providing young people? Remembering that only three

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<v Speaker 2>percent of these kids and that's a high number, are

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<v Speaker 2>going to get a chance to play professionally, So why

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<v Speaker 2>would we do that? Why would we limit educational opportunities?

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<v Speaker 2>I would offer that we can keep everybody. There's currently

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<v Speaker 2>one hundred and thirty three teams in Division one. We

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<v Speaker 2>can keep everybody. What we have to do is make

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<v Speaker 2>the smaller leagues, those who aren't as attractive as television attractive.

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<v Speaker 2>And the way you do that is you borrow the

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<v Speaker 2>European soccer model of promotion relegation, So you get these

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<v Speaker 2>smaller conferences able to win their way into the big conferences,

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<v Speaker 2>and the big conference seller dwellers who are just raking

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<v Speaker 2>money off the top, they have to go to the

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<v Speaker 2>other leagues and earn their way back. And I think

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<v Speaker 2>we'll get a competitive model. We'll have way more popular

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<v Speaker 2>television inventory, and my fingers across, that'll be the choice

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<v Speaker 2>because that will keep as many scholarships as is possible,

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<v Speaker 2>which is exactly what the whole enterprise was created for.

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<v Speaker 1>And I love your anecdote about you being a walk

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<v Speaker 1>on ultimately needing to kind of maintain the space for

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<v Speaker 1>people to have the same experience you did. Right.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Rick Kuhuisel doesn't exist in the future. I mean

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<v Speaker 2>he doesn't get to play at UCLA. He can find

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<v Speaker 2>his way to Division two and so forth, but to

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<v Speaker 2>get a chance to run out on the field and

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<v Speaker 2>see that rose in the center of it, and to

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<v Speaker 2>be the MVP of a Rose Bowl doesn't happen. That's

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<v Speaker 2>not fair. There are guys out there that deserve that chance,

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<v Speaker 2>that have worked their tails off, and I got my

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<v Speaker 2>fingers crossed that we'll do the right thing. And the leaders,

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<v Speaker 2>more importantly, the leaders of college football who are going

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<v Speaker 2>to be offered extravagant sums of money, will be willing

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<v Speaker 2>to say, listen, let's push a little of that back

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<v Speaker 2>in the table and remember who this is really for.

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<v Speaker 1>So perhaps the role of private equity and venture capitalist

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<v Speaker 1>funds in college football isn't as topical or interesting to

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<v Speaker 1>certain listeners as it is to me. But I find

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<v Speaker 1>it fascinating that we could be moving into a space, Rick,

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<v Speaker 1>as you know, where college football teams at some point

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<v Speaker 1>and we're seeing a little bit because college football teams

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<v Speaker 1>have general managers, some of them have cap experts and

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<v Speaker 1>a ton of lawyers to make sure they're following the rules,

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<v Speaker 1>but ownership structures could potentially eventually look like the NFL.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you feel like that's also becoming closer and closer

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<v Speaker 1>to a reality.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, in certainly the Big Twelve where Utah resides and

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<v Speaker 2>also the ACC it's a reality because their face right

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<v Speaker 2>between the eyes with this proposition of the House settlement,

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<v Speaker 2>which is going to cost them some measure of twenty

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<v Speaker 2>million dollars a year annually to pay their players. That's

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<v Speaker 2>just going to happen. And if it doesn't happen, it's

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<v Speaker 2>even worse news because we're going to lose that lawsuit.

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<v Speaker 2>That number will be exponentially high higher and will lose programs. Again,

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<v Speaker 2>the goal for me is preserve all the programs. So

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<v Speaker 2>what has to happen is we have to keep looking

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<v Speaker 2>at how we're going to provide the resources for the enterprise.

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<v Speaker 2>We didn't look in the future. We kept breaking off

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<v Speaker 2>the table, even though the golden goose was even getting

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<v Speaker 2>more golden and fatter. And at the end of the day,

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<v Speaker 2>now the Supreme Court has realized that these are employees,

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<v Speaker 2>These kids are working hard, and they're not getting enough

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<v Speaker 2>of the proceeds. So now that they're going to we've

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<v Speaker 2>got a restructure, and in restructuring, I hope that private

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<v Speaker 2>equity will be included. That doesn't make it bad, that

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<v Speaker 2>doesn't make it professional. It just means that we're borrowing

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<v Speaker 2>some money for a good return that will make this

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<v Speaker 2>all make sense. And again, if you don't think of

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<v Speaker 2>this through the eyes of how much am I going

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<v Speaker 2>to make, but how many scholarships I'm going to retain?

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<v Speaker 2>And I know that sounds Pollyanna will be better off

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<v Speaker 2>for it.

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<v Speaker 1>I wanted to move over to a conversation you and

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<v Speaker 1>I had about the Pac twelve because when we got

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<v Speaker 1>on the phone, you were good enough to give me

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<v Speaker 1>some time. We discussed you know what I perceived to

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<v Speaker 1>be and look, I know it's yesterday's news, but I

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<v Speaker 1>don't get a chance in view you on the show

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<v Speaker 1>very often. And I'm still sad about it because as

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<v Speaker 1>a student at the University of Utah in the late nineties,

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<v Speaker 1>I understand how the past twelve changed, not just the

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<v Speaker 1>athletic department but the school that I attended, and when

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<v Speaker 1>it collapsed, I just I was pretty bummed out. And

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<v Speaker 1>it's a new day, it's a new world Utahs on

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<v Speaker 1>the the Big twelve. But you have kind of a

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<v Speaker 1>little bit of a different take, and I don't want

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<v Speaker 1>to speak for you, but potentially George Klaoff cough kind

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<v Speaker 1>of falling on the sword and maybe a bit of

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<v Speaker 1>an unfair way. Is that a fair way to to

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<v Speaker 1>kind of articulate your your sentiment.

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<v Speaker 2>I think it's too easy to point at the commissioners

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<v Speaker 2>Larry Scott and George Klayoff Cooff as the villains here.

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<v Speaker 2>Maybe they made some four decisions, and retrospectively, I think

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<v Speaker 2>they would both agree that they have. But at the

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<v Speaker 2>end of the day, it was the president's of the

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<v Speaker 2>PAC twelve that overvalued their worth, that overvalued what television

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<v Speaker 2>was going to pay for them. The time zone on

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<v Speaker 2>the West Coast isn't as valuable as the time zone

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<v Speaker 2>on the East Coast, and because of it, they kept saying, well,

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<v Speaker 2>we're worth the same as the Big ten, going back

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<v Speaker 2>to the days when you know, the PAC twelve would

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<v Speaker 2>kind of dominate the Rose Bull and how in the

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<v Speaker 2>world are we going to take less money than the

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<v Speaker 2>Big ten. They turned down a deal just the year

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<v Speaker 2>previous that would have been the equal of the Big twelve,

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<v Speaker 2>and did so because of their ego. And I think

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<v Speaker 2>therein lies the problem, not really an educated understanding of

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<v Speaker 2>what the economics were in television, and the presidents need

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<v Speaker 2>to be held accountable for that.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, before we get to tonight and that will

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<v Speaker 1>be where we end. I wonder what the Rick new

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<v Speaker 1>heisill take is on the new expanded twelve team CFP

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<v Speaker 1>now that we're about to see it culminate with its

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<v Speaker 1>final game tonight.

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<v Speaker 2>I love it. I love that we've shared the wealth

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<v Speaker 2>in terms of opportunity. I love that Boise State was

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<v Speaker 2>in it. Never mind that they didn't win. They played

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<v Speaker 2>a big time game if they don't turn the ball over,

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<v Speaker 2>and how many football games can we say that about.

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<v Speaker 2>I love that SMU in year one, taking no money

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<v Speaker 2>from the ACC for television, got in. They proved that,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, it's exciting for fall can be played by

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<v Speaker 2>teams that were in the last year or in a

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<v Speaker 2>group of five. That's wonderful stuff. Indiana is a wonderful story.

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<v Speaker 2>We talk all the time about the Cinderellas of college

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<v Speaker 2>basketball and what makes the college basketball tournament so fun.

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<v Speaker 2>That's exactly what we see. And when the scores were

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<v Speaker 2>an insighted everybody said, well, it's we were wrong to

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<v Speaker 2>do it. Look at the NFL playoffs in Week one.

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<v Speaker 2>They were one sided except for the Commander Tampa game.

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<v Speaker 2>It's just the way it is. It doesn't always turn

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<v Speaker 2>out to be, you know, a final minute finish, but

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<v Speaker 2>at the end of the day, it was fantastic. It

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<v Speaker 2>will absolutely keep the parody and recruiting from sea to

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<v Speaker 2>shining sea. People will know they can get to the

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<v Speaker 2>playoffs from any portion of the country and that's great

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<v Speaker 2>news for the game of college football.

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<v Speaker 1>So we move over to tonight with two blue bloods

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<v Speaker 1>and I'm sure the power Brokerson.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm here in Atlanta. I'm here in Atlanta, and you know,

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<v Speaker 2>my mom and dad are from the Midwest. Their names

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<v Speaker 2>are Dick and Jane. I was this close to be

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<v Speaker 2>a named spot, but I am in with a bunch

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<v Speaker 2>of Dick and James from all over the Midwest. They

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<v Speaker 2>brought the Midwestern weather to Atlanta. It's about twenty five degrees.

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<v Speaker 2>They were having the time of their life. It's like

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<v Speaker 2>I'm watching a group of people that are at the

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<v Speaker 2>Elks Club having Friday night fish rye. It is the

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<v Speaker 2>greatest thing. And I am enjoying these two brands getting

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<v Speaker 2>ready to go to battle.

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<v Speaker 1>I love it. Do you have a feel for which

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<v Speaker 1>fan base will be better represented tonight.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm going to guess Ohio State's going to be probably

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<v Speaker 2>sixty forty in the majority. A lot of red jerseys

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<v Speaker 2>around here, a lot of excitement about their first national

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<v Speaker 2>championship since twenty fourteen. They have the opportunity to be

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<v Speaker 2>the first in the CFP to win the championship and

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<v Speaker 2>the first in the twelve team format to win the championship,

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<v Speaker 2>which is wonderful. Notre Dame's trying to get their first

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<v Speaker 2>championship since nineteen eighty eight when Doctor lou was their coach.

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<v Speaker 2>Who'll see if they can get that done. If they

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<v Speaker 2>can get the game to the fourth quarter, they're in it.

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<v Speaker 2>But I'm picking the Buckeye.

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<v Speaker 1>All right, my friend, will since you're there and you're busy,

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<v Speaker 1>we will set you loose and I will say a

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<v Speaker 1>very big thank you for not just your time today

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<v Speaker 1>but your participation last week. It was fun to see you, Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>it was a blast.

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<v Speaker 2>Your dad was a blast as well. Please giving my

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<v Speaker 2>best and college football fans enjoy the evening. It's a

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<v Speaker 2>great night for the game. The game always delivered.

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<v Speaker 1>Yes, it does. The great Rick new Heisel played high

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<v Speaker 1>level quarterback when he was playing his college ball at UCLA.

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<v Speaker 1>Spent a little bit of time in the pros as well,

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<v Speaker 1>probably better known as a coach at a very high

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<v Speaker 1>level where he won a Rose Bowl. Spent time coaching

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<v Speaker 1>at Colorado, spent time coaching at you dub where he

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<v Speaker 1>won his Rose Bowl. Was with the Ravens for three years,

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<v Speaker 1>then took over at UCLA, and now he's doing the

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<v Speaker 1>broadcast thing with CBS. So we appreciate his time. And

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<v Speaker 1>we have the College Football National Championship coming your way

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<v Speaker 1>in about forty minutes from right now, so stay tuned.